Oregon Square Ground Chain.

[Zodiac45]

I just happened to look at the chain that came with the 460 I recently bought off fleabay. It appears to be a brand new 25" Oregon Square Ground. I've been wanting to try square ground for some time but have been too chicken to try any. Once you start using Stihl RSC it is hard to find a reason to switch. Now I find I have a loop to try.

So this stuff hates dirty even worse than full chisel?

Do most shops know what this stuff is? And more importantly how to sharpen it?

If I happen to like this stuff what Oregon chain is it?

Neb, Here's what you do. (If you have a regular round wheel grinder). Use it till it dulls, then resharpen it on the grinder the first time and you'll turn it into round chisel chain like LG or RS. After that you can use standard files etc..

 

[B_Turner]

Neb, Here's what you do. (If you have a regular round wheel grinder). Use it till it dulls, then resharpen it on the grinder the first time and you'll turn it into round chisel chain like LG or RS. After that you can use standard files etc..

I know several folks that generally buy square loops and then resharpen them round. Sometimes the square ground is cheaper for some reason the same chain in round.

If you know someone with a square grinder then just for fun have them resharpen a couple loops after you use them a bit. Then you'll see what the fuss is about, as they don't really come sharp off the reel.

Stihl is the sharpest brand off the reel IMO, but it still cuts noticeably better after resharpening. Partly because the cutting edge gets cleaned up after all that assembly, and also I think it was Crofter that pointed out that most grinders put slightly more acute angle on the side cutter which makes them cut a bit faster as well.

Something that I started doing only about six months ago is using my 510 (round grinder) to completely clean the gullets on square. A quick touch of the round wheel in the gullet removes all extra material. I set the grinder to around 20 degrees and adjust the pawl so the wheel does not contact the cutter and then it only takes about a minute to clean even a long chain. I believe I can tell the difference with the gullet completely cleaned, especially noodling.

So the chain now looks from the side like it's round ground with no visible step from the bottom of the square wheel. It is so quick and easy and better that I don't know whey I screwed with files cleaning the gullets for so long.

 

[Austin1]

This is a bit of a thread Hi Jack:hmm3grin2orange: But I would like to see some .325 square ground chain. I don't have a grinder and did see a post on here were someone did make some out of round ground chain. I even tried to hand file one once. Needless to say I gave up after five minutes on one tooth trying to file it square.

 

[B_Turner]

This is a bit of a thread Hi Jack:hmm3grin2orange: But I would like to see some .325 square ground chain. I don't have a grinder and did see a post on here were someone did make some out of round ground chain. I even tried to hand file one once. Needless to say I gave up after five minutes on one tooth trying to file it square.

For a number of years I used to run .325 (semi chisel) on a couple small saws (including my mse 220) but I am finding they cut better with full comp square 3/8 with the depth gauges fairly high (green wood) even though the 3/8 has a wider cutter.

With the 3/8 square the chain is enough sharper that not only do the saws cut faster, but now I can sharpen all my chains (except SC of course) with my square grinder which saves me trouble. My 5100 now cuts like an animal, and even my 220 likes it better than the .325.

 

[Crofter]

This is a bit of a thread Hi Jack:hmm3grin2orange: But I would like to see some .325 square ground chain. I don't have a grinder and did see a post on here were someone did make some out of round ground chain. I even tried to hand file one once. Needless to say I gave up after five minutes on one tooth trying to file it square.

I have handfiled Stihl .325 to square. You have to get into the side straps a fair bit to get enough down angle or you wind up with too acute a top plate cutting edge angle. The shorter toothed Oregon was even worse. The Tri. style file would not work, only the flat chisel bit file and it was tight. It cut all right but is not very practical.

 

[Austin1]

I have handfiled Stihl .325 to square. You have to get into the side straps a fair bit to get enough down angle or you wind up with too acute a top plate cutting edge angle. The shorter toothed Oregon was even worse. The Tri. style file would not work, only the flat chisel bit file and it was tight. It cut all right but is not very practical.

Yes I tried it on some Woodsman Chain and you are right I was getting at the strap's pretty good. It just took so long!lol

 

[Crofter]

Frank in what year were these Oregon chains breaking?


Willard

Apparently 7 or 8 years ago. Maybe for only a short while after Oregon changed from the flat top cutter to the tilted top that they now have. I have a couple of the old style chains but I dont know when they made the change. Problem is chain reels can pop up that have been discontinued for a while. The dealer I spoke of is now working away from here fixing murdercycles. Our woods operations are flat bottomed out here!

 

[chainsawaddict]

Yep, goofy file work's good. Easy to use in the field. In my opinion it's the easiest sq file to learn with (It's what I learned on anyway).

Andy

What's the "goofy file?" Ive ordered a couple double bevels to practice with from baileys, how are they different?

 

[Crofter]

What's the "goofy file?" Ive ordered a couple double bevels to practice with from baileys, how are they different?

Here is a picture of a round filed chisel chain touched up with a few strokes of a goofy file. It mainly removes the material from the inside of the cutter corner which is what really wastes a lot of energy simultaneously trying to lift and side cast the severed chip. A chip from square filed chain has less fibre crush.

Next is a pic of a goofy file and last a pic of the goofy file compared to a flat chisel bit file. The goofy is round on the edge. The chisel bit file has to be kept at precise rotation to effect the proper side cutter hook; the goofy cuts a crescent shape into the side cutter more like on a round filed chain so is not as critical. You just have to keep the intersection of the files round edge and flat side right at the intersection of the top and side cutter of the tooth.

 

[Austin1]

For a number of years I used to run .325 (semi chisel) on a couple small saws (including my mse 220) but I am finding they cut better with full comp square 3/8 with the depth gauges fairly high (green wood) even though the 3/8 has a wider cutter.

With the 3/8 square the chain is enough sharper that not only do the saws cut faster, but now I can sharpen all my chains (except SC of course) with my square grinder which saves me trouble. My 5100 now cuts like an animal, and even my 220 likes it better than the .325.

Thanks! I am going to try that on my 2152. I will take the 15'' bar off the 2159 and put a small spline 3/8th rim on the 2152 Should pull it no Problem. My Solo and 295 To be honest I don't think would pull a 3/8 chain that's why I was looking for some .325 for those two but the 50cc Jred should pull a 3/8 through soft wood.
I have been doing allot of playing around with my two poulans switching bars and chain and I am finding that 3/8 low pro gives up nothing to .325,unless I am in bigger wood then I love the .325 skip chain but it is all round ground.
But it is fun to just play with the saw's and see what works and doesn't work.

 

[teacherman]

Yep, goofy file work's good. Easy to use in the field. In my opinion it's the easiest sq file to learn with (It's what I learned on anyway).

Andy

Whut is a goofy file? If it is a list of goofies, I am likely in it.:biggrinbounce2: LOL

If it is used to sharpen square cut chain, then I NEED one! I never herd of it before.:monkey:

 

[HolmenTree]

Apparently 7 or 8 years ago. Maybe for only a short while after Oregon changed from the flat top cutter to the tilted top that they now have. I have a couple of the old style chains but I dont know when they made the change. Problem is chain reels can pop up that have been discontinued for a while. The dealer I spoke of is now working away from here fixing murdercycles. Our woods operations are flat bottomed out here!

Back in the early 1980s when oregon came out with the LG chain and the radial port sprocket ,they had some breakage problems in cold weather conditions, thats why our logging camp tested them in the winter for them.

I'm a little behind times for the last 10 years or so on Oregon sawchain but what is this flat top to tilted top cutter change?

 

[Crofter]

Back in the early 1980s when oregon came out with the LG chain and the radial port sprocket ,they had some breakage problems in cold weather conditions, thats why our logging camp tested them in the winter for them.

I'm a little behind times for the last 10 years or so on Oregon sawchain but what is this flat top to tilted top cutter change?

The flat top cutters have the top plate surface square to the bar. I believe that now they are angled about ten degrees down at the tip of the cutter. Carleton is still flat top. Stihl is roughly the same as Oregon. I dont know when Oregon changed. I have two of the Flat topped Oregon chains that Dave Neiger dropped off to me. He might know the history. I was cutting pipe, not wood at that period. I asked one ex cutter about the breakage and he said it was after they changed and was guessing about 8 years ago. I thought there might be more chime in on this. Could be only people who were running their rakers too low had problems. Seems to me I remember discussion on here four or five years ago and someone said they had lowered the nickel in the alloy but that is pure hearsay as far as I am concerned. Anyways I dont think anyone is presently having that problem. It just comes up time to time that Oregon is a bit softer than some other chain; dont know whether that applies to the new Lx chains or not. If there was a problem it could have been limited to certain production runs too. I hit a bit of hard chain on a reel that was noticeable because you could not file the rakers on one side. The rest of the reel was ok. Just quality control on the heat treat for a part of the run maybe.

 

[1953greg]

Whut is a goofy file? If it is a list of goofies, I am likely in it.:biggrinbounce2: LOL

If it is used to sharpen square cut chain, then I NEED one! I never herd of it before.:monkey:

its similar to the doubel beveled chisel files but the edge is round instead of doubel beveled. baileys has had them and im 99% sure they are in the 2008 or 07 catalog which is at my office and i am at home. they are not on their website.

i have tried the 3 cornered chisel. i can only use it w/ a file guide which was exceedingly difficult but it sure did rip!!!

here is a website that has them but they are only sold by the dozen, 60bux, but baileys sold/sells them singles.

http://www.chainsawsculptors.com/save_edge/index.htm

 

[Oregon Engineer]

Big Neb

From the picture it appears to be either 72CL or 72CLX. They are the same chain basically, just with thicker material in the 72CLX cutters and tie straps and a little wider kerf.

Shops on the West Coast are most likely to be familiar with them and able to grind them for you.

Oregon Engineer

>>>Do most shops know what this stuff is? And more importantly how to sharpen it?

If I happen to like this stuff what Oregon chain is it?<<<

 

[B_Turner]

Big Neb

From the picture it appears to be either 72CL or 72CLX. They are the same chain basically, just with thicker material in the 72CLX cutters and tie straps and a little wider kerf.

Shops on the West Coast are most likely to be familiar with them and able to grind them for you.

Oregon Engineer

>>>Do most shops know what this stuff is? And more importantly how to sharpen it?

If I happen to like this stuff what Oregon chain is it?<<<

I've own/tried both the CL and CLX and it seems to me another difference is the CLX cutter is a bit more durable. I could be wrong, as neither is what I usually run.

My favorite dealer kind of pushes the CLX for long bar applications when the sawyer doesn't want to run .404 (wide cutter for 3/8) , but so far I am still happiest with Stihl 3/8.

 

[Oregon Engineer]

Sure, the CLX is more durable, it is made from thicker material for that exact reason. It provides a wider kerf that is more suitable to the longer bars too.

Oregon Engineer


>>>I've own/tried both the CL and CLX and it seems to me another difference is the CLX cutter is a bit more durable. I could be wrong, as neither is what I usually run.

My favorite dealer kind of pushes the CLX for long bar applications when the sawyer doesn't want to run .404 (wide cutter for 3/8) , but so far I am still happiest with Stihl 3/8.<<<<<

 

[HolmenTree]

When I worked for Stihl Canada in 1989 the factories in Germany and Switzerland sent us some chain to get tested in the winter at logging operations in northern Alberta.[5 to 7 years earlier I tested Oregon's first LG sawchain, their first radial rim sprocket and their first powermatch bars]. I had my hands on Stihl's very first 33RS chain with the sloped depth gauges,all 33RS up to this date had the safety link on the side strap directly in front of the cutters depth gauge. Hans Peter Stihl himself told me to my face that the sloped side strap was only an optical illusion to make it look like safety chain. Oregon had already made the 72,73,75LG over 5 years earlier and Hans wanted to get the new RS onto the market. Some of the test chain had a low profile 3/8 chasis with the full size 33RS cutters on it. Exactly how I for years earlier built competition sawchain with the old Oregon 77 LG lightweight chasis with fullsize 72 LP cutters on it, excellent chip clearance.Stihl also at the time made a chain comparable to the 77LG.
Stihl and Oregon chain was always like mixing apples and oranges.Stihl had a thicker cutter, .063 reducing down to .050 on the 33RS drive links, Oregon .058 down to .050 on the 72LG. Oregon started coloring their cutters blue in the late 1980s ,Stihl had already done for years .Many years before Oregon colored their old 1/2" chisel chain blue. Now today I see Oregon is making the heavier CLX chain . Such a competitive market. But you know all this competition is great for the industry, we will always have a superior product. Now I gotta get back to my modified competition chain with 75 AL cutters, 75 LG chasis with StabL-Link rudder drive links for my Yamaha hotsaw. This chain will be very stable in the kerf. [ the # 1 reason Oregon designed these drive links in the first place.]

 

[Oregon Engineer]

When I worked for Stihl Canada in 1989 the factories in Germany and Switzerland sent us some chain to get tested in the winter at logging operations in northern Alberta.[5 to 7 years earlier I tested Oregon's first LG sawchain, their first radial rim sprocket and their first powermatch bars]. I had my hands on Stihl's very first 33RS chain with the sloped depth gauges,all 33RS up to this date had the safety link on the side strap directly in front of the cutters depth gauge. Hans Peter Stihl himself told me to my face that the sloped side strap was only an optical illusion to make it look like safety chain. Oregon had already made the 72,73,75LG over 5 years earlier and Hans wanted to get the new RS onto the market. Some of the test chain had a low profile 3/8 chasis with the full size 33RS cutters on it. Exactly how I for years earlier built competition sawchain with the old Oregon 77 LG lightweight chasis with fullsize 72 LP cutters on it, excellent chip clearance.Stihl also at the time made a chain comparable to the 77LG.
Stihl and Oregon chain was always like mixing apples and oranges.Stihl had a thicker cutter, .063 reducing down to .050 on the 33RS drive links, Oregon .058 down to .050 on the 72LG. Oregon started coloring their cutters blue in the late 1980s ,Stihl had already done for years .Many years before Oregon colored their old 1/2" chisel chain blue. Now today I see Oregon is making the heavier CLX chain . Such a competitive market. But you know all this competition is great for the industry, we will always have a superior product. Now I gotta get back to my modified competition chain with 75 AL cutters, 75 LG chasis with StabL-Link rudder drive links for my Yamaha hotsaw. This chain will be very stable in the kerf. [ the # 1 reason Oregon designed these drive links in the first place.]

HolmenTree
You obviously have been around awhile.
I remember a lot of this stuff too from back then.
What Oregon Field Test engineer were you working with?

Oregon Engineer

 

[HolmenTree]

HolmenTree
You obviously have been around awhile.
I remember a lot of this stuff too from back then.
What Oregon Field Test engineer were you working with?

Oregon Engineer

Gary Walrath. I liked Gary .He reminded me of Kenny Rodgers ha ha .He got me seriously involved in the hot saws.Even visited Gary and his family at his acreage in West Linn Oregon back in the summer of 1984.Took in a competition with him at Estacata.Years earlier Gary held land speed records on motorcycles, very interesting man.