price per hour felling

[Dirtscooter5]

I have been felling trees for a guy along the Missouri river to open up a guys view. I am not very good at bidding so I think working by the hour maybe best. I am not a pro but own several saws and know my way around the woods decent. What is a good price per hour for felling trees. he is paying me 30 an hour right now.

 

[SliverPicker]

You are more than 10X as likely to die felling trees than you are being a cop in the USA. Price yourself accordingly.

Whether or not you can do the necessary rate of production also needs to be considered.

 

[bnmc98]

are you an independent contractor?
Who gets the wood?
Is it going to the mill?
How long of a job is it, how big of a job?
Your equipment and transportation?

these questions might help with figuring it out.

 

[catbuster]

Is it thirty dollars per hour and you're charging him back his running costs? USFS pays Class C fallers 31-38 dollars per hour and supplies gear.

Charge in the fifties, make a nice profit. You're the business. You set the price. The consumer chooses to pay it or not. If not, there are plenty of consumers who will.

 

[northmanlogging]

I'm guessing your not insured, bonded, licensed or well much of anything yes?

In that case 30 is more then ample.

You start paying insurance, get a bond, biz licence, and opt to pay your own L+I then your going to want to thinking on doubling that.

Don't forget fuel, parts, etc.

 

[bnmc98]

Is it thirty dollars per hour and you're charging him back his running costs? USFS pays Class C fallers 31-38 dollars per hour and supplies gear.

Charge in the fifties, make a nice profit. You're the business. You set the price. The consumer chooses to pay it or not. If not, there are plenty of consumers who will.

Really? You would pay someone who is not a pro faller (who knows the experience he has, he didn't say) over $50 an hour to cut your wood?

What if he gets his saw stuck, and then the other in the first tree, or has 25 hang ups? Time is ticking.... besides, getting the tree cut is only part of the game, getting them cut so they can get them out, speed and efficiency, log quality.

nothing sucks worse than a game of pick up sticks at the end of a day.

And, C fallers are gov paid if I am not mistaken. That's not real world IMO.

I'm not trying to bash your answer... just saying there is a lot more to take in consideration here.


Honestly, $30 per hr is real good for being green IMO.

 

[treeslayer2003]

You are more than 10X as likely to die felling trees than you are being a cop in the USA. Price yourself accordingly.

Whether or not you can do the necessary rate of production also needs to be considered.

really? hmmm....really never think about that.

 

[catbuster]

Really? You would pay someone who is not a pro faller (who knows the experience he has, he didn't say) over $50 an hour to cut your wood?

What if he gets his saw stuck, and then the other in the first tree, or has 25 hang ups? Time is ticking.... besides, getting the tree cut is only part of the game, getting them cut so they can get them out, speed and efficiency, log quality.

nothing sucks worse than a game of pick up sticks at the end of a day.

And, C fallers are gov paid if I am not mistaken. That's not real world IMO.

I'm not trying to bash your answer... just saying there is a lot more to take in consideration here.


Honestly, $30 per hr is real good for being green IMO.

As a former USFS faller and current red carded contractor, I can say that toting an MS440 with 28" bar and another 50 lbs of gear on a fireline is real world, and harder than any timber operation where no one is fighting smoke, heat and burning, hazard trees.

And money is money. And if the guy charges 30 per hour, by time he pays for equipment and fuel he's looking at half that. Which is 15 bucks and hour. Can anybody really live off that? The answer is no. Add another 15 to that and all of a sudden you're looking at a decent paycheck.

If the guy is totally green why would you hire him? And if he messed up, I would send the guy packing and hire a person to fix the problem. Picking up the sticks isn't a faller's problem. If said faller does a poor job the stick pickers won't hire the faller back. Business licensing and insurance are cheap, and all of a sudden your costs are mostly people and equipment in business. I don't think 45 is too much, at all. Chainsaws are expensive tools to maintain and repair.

This just what I think as a mid-sized contractor who has hired many subcontractor timber cutters and has been through all this before.

 

[SliverPicker]

really? hmmm....really never think about that.

In 2014 cops died at a rate of 1.56 per 100,000. Loggers died at a rate of 104 per 100,000. Most cops die in traffic accidents. Almost half of those traffic deaths are from not wearing a seatbelt.

 

[Dirtscooter5]

It is just purely for making his view of the river better. fell them. buck them up a little and call it good. most of them are junk trees anyway. we may cut some fire wood out of them on our own time but that's it. Like I said I am no expert but have some knowledge. I am a full time farmer, mow grass on the side and pick up some tree cutting jobs for people. Sounds like 30 an hour is pretty close then. I am not insured for tree cutting but am insured for mowing. If I do much more felling I may think about getting insured.

 

[Dirtscooter5]

catbuster I like your opinion. I can charge a dollar a min for mowing grass and that is a lot less dangerous then tree work. we were cutting between the county road and the katy trail not much room for error. had about 40 mile an hour wind gusts. everything fell well except one tree got hung. used my lewis winch to pull it the rest of the way down.

 

[bnmc98]

As a former USFS faller and current red carded contractor, I can say that toting an MS440 with 28" bar and another 50 lbs of gear on a fireline is real world, and harder than any timber operation where no one is fighting smoke, heat and burning, hazard trees.

And money is money. And if the guy charges 30 per hour, by time he pays for equipment and fuel he's looking at half that. Which is 15 bucks and hour. Can anybody really live off that? The answer is no. Add another 15 to that and all of a sudden you're looking at a decent paycheck.

If the guy is totally green why would you hire him? And if he messed up, I would send the guy packing and hire a person to fix the problem. Picking up the sticks isn't a faller's problem. If said faller does a poor job the stick pickers won't hire the faller back. Business licensing and insurance are cheap, and all of a sudden your costs are mostly people and equipment in business. I don't think 45 is too much, at all. Chainsaws are expensive tools to maintain and repair.

This just what I think as a mid-sized contractor who has hired many subcontractor timber cutters and has been through all this before.

You have some interesting perspectives, and you are entitled to them. I won't get into a spitting match with you. My perspective is different than yours on a number of things. its what I do for a living, and I do not spend half my pay on equipment and fuel. Chainsaws are very cheap to run and purchase compared to other industries and equipment.

Picking up sticks is everything fwiw. You don't plan your lay and you cost the hiring agent $. It is your problem....

Your pay will be what the market will bear or you will not work. end of story.

A land owner that may have some extra cash could be a good deal for someone who is learning. Going to a gypo and saying I have no experience and I will charge you 45 an hour around here will get you some good laughs I think. Maybe not where you are though.

I have personally had USFS training and did falling and saw work and even went on a few fires to cut. Whole different ball game than production logging. I found out I didn't know my butt from a hole in the ground. Got an education real quick. Just my experience, but I was not a C faller, just a class B. I did watch a few C fallers, but back then they were also hiring pro's to come in and do a lot of cutting too.

But... this does not sound like production logging, so... There may be not much applicable from logging. And its difficult to say what to charge, cause its not the same.

.... I still think 30 an hr is fair for a side job, but the guy might be more generous, never know till you ask. Good for experience, none the less.

 

[Dirtscooter5]

I def agree I prolly don't know my butt from a hole in the ground either when it comes to felling. I would love to learn more and get better at it. Since I farm full time I guess I figure the only way to learn was to do jobs and learn hands on. Its not my lively hood just fun and makes some extra cash on the side.

 

[bnmc98]

Sounds like a good deal.. win win.

and, just to clarify because I think catbuster took it the wrong way. I do not think wildland firefighters are not the real deal. I said the pay is not real world. I have experienced the whole sitting at base camp collecting hazard pay and overtime along with 200 BIA workers while a handful of smokejumpers fight a few lightning strikes that got a little out of hand in a wilderness area full of rock and marsh, there was so much water there that the smokejumpers had to wear full wool even facemasks because of the mosquitos. The fire name was the mosquito complex, but because it was not contained we all got perks as far as pay. I remember listening to the radio dispatch say they would fly up shrimp cocktail to them in a chopper.... I kid you not. We would throw hundreds of resources away after a fire like that that never got used... straight to the dump.
I am just saying that there is a difference between gov money, trying to spend budget and business money where the owner is trying to keep as much as they can, and not get rid of it. different philosophies, different demands.

 

[treeslayer2003]

this is all fine and dandy banter..........my only concern is that dirtscooter should stay safe. idk what style is popular there in MO, around here every one jumps. no one knows any better. now that i know better, i am afraid for folks that they may get hurt.
it would be nice if scooter could get at least a little training from some one who knows what they are doing. thats a tall order as some places there ain't any body who knows that they are skirting death all day.

 

[SliverPicker]

really? hmmm....really never think about that.

In 2013 11.1 cops per 100,000 died at work. Less than half of those where murdered.

In 2013 127.8 loggers per 100,000 died at work. I wonder how many were murdered?

That's more than 11X the risk of death if you are a logger vs. being a cop.

 

[Dirtscooter5]

I mean I am 26 years old and have been around and cut wood since I was big enough to run a little homelite. My parents burned wood as their only heat source and now wood heat is all me and my wife have in our house also. while im not a pro logger its not my first day with a chain saw in my hands. What do you mean by everyone jumps tree slayer?

 

[treeslayer2003]

stump jump, slick stump........it means to cut the tree completely off with no face or hinge. study the falling picks here and pay attention to how the face cuts meet exactly with no over kerf either way. make your faces nice and open and your cuts accurate.
i'm not calling you dumb or any thing. i jumped timber for 20 years for a living.......i was fast and lucky for 20 years.

 

[Dirtscooter5]

I see right on, I notch almost everthing I cut unless its really small. I am sure its far from perfect though, so I will def be looking at more felling pics and ideas on here

 

[Dirtscooter5]

Mindy this has been brought up already on this thread, I appreciate the info. farming is also a very dangerous career. I saved my bosses life last march as a tillage tool fell on him and he was crushed like a tin can. I realize the danger in everything I do but don't plan to quit because I love farming and tree cutting. Driving a car is also very dangerous but I don't plan to quit that either.