Production line fire wood

[SRT-Tech]

well, as much as i would like to produce firewood in the amounts you guys do, the simple reality is i live in an apartment building, and can only store wood in my truck, nowhere else. Not making a profit yet, but not on the state dole either. Doing what i like, the money will come later, when imove eventually. Averaging between 2 & 4 loads a week in the truck, about a 1/4 of a cord at a time, sometimes a 1/2 cord depending on wood species. Keeps me in fuel, beer, and i have customer that makes a gallon of venison stew for me every week. My overhead is low (free wood), and i keep the equipment costs down by keeping it simple: chaisaw, splitting maul, gas can, oil can. tarp, rope.

 

[SRT-Tech]

dang double posts

 

[B-Edwards]

Yes Ekka , i do sell the logs that are good for lumber. Alot of the trees we take down have problems , decay and so on. Sometimes the logs are worth more for firewood than lumber. I think firewood to be profitable needs to be as close to a 1 man show as you can get it. Proccessor may very well be the way to go . I may well get out of the tree business before long and concentrate on this avenue. There is a huge labor problem where i live , but back to firewood. Yes your a smart ass Ekka but I've read enough of your post's to say your my kinda smart ass. Thanks for the replies

 

[Ekka]

Hey SRT-Tech

Any chance you can find a guy who has some space in a property (industrial or rural) to run ya wood out of? Look around and do a sweetheart deal. You need storage, drying and splitting space no?

Around here there's some ole farms and stuff with plenty of room for say a 30' x 30' spot, just sling the owner a case a week etc ... I have a few spots I dump the wood for nicks and the ole timers billot it up for fence posts or split it for firewood.

I focus on cutt'm down, now if you had a little spot I knew of I'd be dumping it there for ya.

You can have more than one spot too! Start looking.

 

[CUCV]

I usually have a few cord of wood stacked at the beginning of each season. I load it into my trailer using a conveyor. Once loaded I level out the load and take note for future reference. I stacked a cord at a customers house recently that I had eyeballed and it came out to 131 ft^2. The extra 3 ft^2 was well worth the savings in time. I highly recomend a conveyor it saves me so much time splitting and loading.
Also don't knock stacking for customers, they pay extremely well for it. For so many of them it can take their whole Saturday to stack, and that is worth a ton to them.
Selling wood green has never been profitable enough for me, so I only sell seasoned.

 

[cutngo]

prod. line firewood

some suggestions-

I DO NOT stack wood anymore-ever A 185 cub. ft loose pile of wood is equivalent to 1 cord of stacked wood-128 cub ft-I have a 7X14.5 trailer to deliver wood with-2 cords a time-never stacked-best time saving advice there is

Sell full cord minimums on deliveries, and look for those 2 cord plus deliveries, even if you have to take a hit of 20-40 bucks. This year I started offering 2 cords to most cust. at a lower price, and about 1/2 take it-so much easier at the end of the day to drop 1 load

Buy wood-even at $50 a cord, you can triple your money, and they already did the work of downing and cleaning-purchasing gives you a whole new realm of people to work with and ALOT more wood

When splitting wood, I do maul work on the easy stuff and pile up the stuff that fights and run it through the splitter-hey and if your tired, just run the splitter all day

Get a big saw! I run a 385-getting a 395 tomorrow!
Good luck and keep that back from breaking!

 

[Firewood Guy USA]

Did you know ........... !

I have a 12K dump trailer that I use to deliver my firewood. What I did was to stack the first cord nice and tight. Then I loaded it into the trailer. So I saw how full the trailer was with a solid cord and after that I just fill by sight. I also put a statement on my delivery ticket that says that I gaurantee that they get the quantity of wood they've ordered. I've delivered 200 cord in the last three years and I've only had one customer complain. Seems he stacked his 3 cord VERY tight and thought he was shorted. So I loaded up half a cord and delivered it, no questions asked.

As for loading... I do it by hand mostly. One of the complaints that I heard from people was that the big firewood dealers had lots of junk (bark, scraps, dirt, stones) in their loads. And I believe thats because they use a big loader to scoop up the wood from their drying piles. So when I started, I stacked the wood into the loader on my tractor and dumped that in the trailer. Many customers commented how clean the wood delivery was. Lately I just back the trailer right up to the pile with the tailgate open, and I get up into the pile and throw it into the trailer. Seems to take less time and gives me a little (much needed) exercise.

I dont know if you know it or not, But in the State of Maine, you can sell firewood by the "stacked measurement" or the "loose thrown measurement".

 

[MIspecial]

I think the whole idea is to be fair to the customer so you can keep them as a customer. Sure weights and measures has to spell it out in leagal terms. We all know how much a face cord is and homeowners seems to like that amout. Not really that much but they don't want a "huge" pile of wood to store. So they call and we bring more. We are not selling prescription drugs that have to be counted out exactly. Give the guy a break.

 

[ciscoguy01]

Interjection

One thing I will interject here is selling firewood is still one of the few jobs where when dealing with the majority of customers is done on a handshake. No contracts, no paperwork, just an honest amount for an honest dollar. When it comes to laws governing the selling of wood how do they apply to most of us? I'd be willing to bet my teeth that not a single person in the forum or anywhere else has ever reported every single block of wood sold to the IRS. That being said, should state official decide to get involved with their laws, we'd all be in a lot of trouble I'm sure. Most of us do it on the side, it's sidework to make a little extra cash or to supplement our incomes in hard times. We're not lazy, we're working our a55e5 off to earn a little extra money or stop from giving those ba5tar45 in washington more of our money for their gas pricing or fuel oil or whatever they can think of taxing us next on. For the people that do it on a daily basis just to put food on the table, my hats are off to you. WE are a dying breed. Between the tree huggers, the hikers, the lawyers and the politicians they'd save every tree so they could sell more fuel then give us welfare or let us starve. Point of all this is that it's an honest business. If the dude has measured out 1 cord several times and knows approximately how much it takes up on his trailer there's nothing wrong with that as long as the customer knows. When you go in for a cup of coffee in the morning and a storeowner pockets the dollar, do you call the IRS on him for not putting it in the register? I doubt it. Next time your reading your laws off, think about how many times you've driven over 55 or 65 on the interstate, maybe your doing 66, but it's still breaking the law and if an officer wants to write you on it, he can. They do it to people that are scumbags around here all the time. The only reason it hasn't gotten to be more of a big deal in most states is the lawyers and politicians probably figure we're broke and they can't make any money off us. Just think about it dude, that's all I'm saying. In most every profession out there, there are a ton of scumbags, that's a very rare case in the wood industry. Good honest hardworking folks is usually what comes to mind when you think about a logger. What do you think of when a politician or a lawyer comes into play???
Who writes those laws anyways???

 

[sloth9669]

..........

Amen

 

[Firewood Guy USA]

You Loose ............

One thing I will interject here is selling firewood is still one of the few jobs where when dealing with the majority of customers is done on a handshake. No contracts, no paperwork, just an honest amount for an honest dollar. When it comes to laws governing the selling of wood how do they apply to most of us? I'd be willing to bet my teeth that not a single person in the forum or anywhere else has ever reported every single block of wood sold to the IRS. That being said, should state official decide to get involved with their laws, we'd all be in a lot of trouble I'm sure. Most of us do it on the side, it's sidework to make a little extra cash or to supplement our incomes in hard times. We're not lazy, we're working our a55e5 off to earn a little extra money or stop from giving those ba5tar45 in washington more of our money for their gas pricing or fuel oil or whatever they can think of taxing us next on. For the people that do it on a daily basis just to put food on the table, my hats are off to you. WE are a dying breed. Between the tree huggers, the hikers, the lawyers and the politicians they'd save every tree so they could sell more fuel then give us welfare or let us starve. Point of all this is that it's an honest business. If the dude has measured out 1 cord several times and knows approximately how much it takes up on his trailer there's nothing wrong with that as long as the customer knows. When you go in for a cup of coffee in the morning and a storeowner pockets the dollar, do you call the IRS on him for not putting it in the register? I doubt it. Next time your reading your laws off, think about how many times you've driven over 55 or 65 on the interstate, maybe your doing 66, but it's still breaking the law and if an officer wants to write you on it, he can. They do it to people that are scumbags around here all the time. The only reason it hasn't gotten to be more of a big deal in most states is the lawyers and politicians probably figure we're broke and they can't make any money off us. Just think about it dude, that's all I'm saying. In most every profession out there, there are a ton of scumbags, that's a very rare case in the wood industry. Good honest hardworking folks is usually what comes to mind when you think about a logger. What do you think of when a politician or a lawyer comes into play???
Who writes those laws anyways???

You Loose, We report all purchases as well as reporting all outgoing sales. Thats the only way to get an accurate net profit at years end. I dont mind in paying my fair share in taxes from profits earned.

 

[Maxgussam]

Well, I don't sell firewood, but have bought some. I'll tell you right now that I would much rather do buisness with a man like Ciscoguy, than with someone like thefirewood guy.
I like the style of a deal done with a handshake, and I'll bet that the cords that I would get from him would have extra, just to make sure I (the customer) was happy.

 

[STIHLSamantha]

slightly offended

i understand that there are laws in regards to the exchange of sales of products...but there are many times when people over look them because there are other factors involved. For example...you decide that you are going to buy a used car from someone for your teenager....the individual asks $1000 for the car and then when you go to pay him the guy tacks on another $70 dollars for the 7% sales tax because he has to report his sale to the IRS....does this happen? I have never seen anyone do that because they are reporting the 1000 dollars they made for selling their old car that they owned. For those of us that have our steady jobs that pay our taxes for us, we do no tend to worry about the 5 or 10 cord that we might sell to friends or people in our community because we felt like getting some exercise and using our saws for a bit in the woods....if you cut and use your own wood and you have a little left over and sell it to someone just to cover the chains and amount of gas you may have used, it is a little bit better of a deal for them and we are not out of anything for our time and efforts...the only people i could see this angering would be people who sell wood for a living and rely on every cord to bring their bread home....in regards to cisco and I, there are a lot of needy people in our area who would have to buy their wood for $100 dollars a face cord cut and split (sometimes unsplit) and do it the "legal" way paying tax on the wood so the logger can report his sales to the IRS...or they can reach out to people who are cutting on their own land for some exercise and fun and pay them enough for the gas and chains and still buy their kids christmas presents that winter....your legal preaching is not falling on deaf ears, but at the same time it is not impressing anyone of us that likes to help people out....i hope that you are not one of the hypocritical people that doesn't follow his own words, because you certainly seemed like a nice guy, very informative and supportive of other topics in this forum....i dont like seeing anyone bash anyone on a friendly community like this....your opinions are taken, but don't force them on people in an ill manner...thanks...

 

[SRT-Tech]

Well, I don't sell firewood, but have bought some. I'll tell you right now that I would much rather do buisness with a man like Ciscoguy, than with someone like thefirewood guy.
I like the style of a deal done with a handshake, and I'll bet that the cords that I would get from him would have extra, just to make sure I (the customer) was happy.

 

[logbutcher]

When The Girls Fight

They're mixing it up guys. Come watch. And, I'm LOST, LOOSE, and LOSING.opcorn:
Do what the HELL you want. Pay what you want.
Report what you want. It's America You served, I served, it was my duty. SO F WHAT. Want a medal ?
BTW: That's BS about the guy not paying the IRS. It's marketing and one of those Urban Myths. Try it. Really look it up. It is unfortunately law. Some of those so-called tax evaders are in the big house, have paid some big $$$ fines.
We here in Paradise agree some with all of you. And for c____ sakes:
LIGHTEN UP.:spam: It's chainsaws, wood, heavy gear, PPE, big trees, mills, ....the fun stuff.
MERRY CHRISTMAS

 

[Firewood Guy USA]

So really what your saying here is if a kid mows a yard, he should be reporting it right? According to law he should. Oh yea, and I'll bet you've never gone over the speed limit. But now your actually saying you agree with it. That's pathetic. Hence my point, it's a side job for some people. If you'd actually say that every stick of wood you've ever delivered or had someone pick up has been sold with a contract and receipt and that you've paid taxes on it I'd say your full of crap dude. Dont' start saying garbage about this country. When were you in the military bro? I served. Don't get patriotic about stuff like that with me. Your probably one of those pablem puking liberals that want to sit and cry about other coutries starting trouble, then when they do you'd rather give'em more money than stomp a mudhole in their A55. I love this country bro. People like you have already started to degrade it. You believe in the tax system so much, why don't you move over to russia where they do the same thing. FYI I pay close to $40,000/yr in taxes dude. As if that's not enough. I think I've made my contributions. When was the last time you donated anything to people in need or a charity? Or if you did I'd be willing to bet it was for a tax write off. Pathetic dude, that's all I'm gonna say.

On a side note, did you know that there are NO laws stating that you HAVE to pay federal taxes? I'll bet you didn't. Although I do and so do most others. When push comes to pull NOONE has to pay federal taxes if they don't want to. You think different, find it. If you do a google search, you'll find a guy that beats it and has not paid any federal taxes in over 10yrs as there is NO laws governing.

loose  /lus/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[loos] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation adjective, loos‧er, loos‧est, adverb, verb loosed, loos‧ing.

–adjective 1. free or released from fastening or attachment: a loose end.
2. free from anything that binds or restrains; unfettered: loose cats prowling around in alleyways at night.

lose  /luz/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[looz] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation verb, lost, los‧ing.

–verb (used with object) 1. to come to be without (something in one's possession or care), through accident, theft, etc., so that there is little or no prospect of recovery: I'm sure I've merely misplaced my hat, not lost it.
2. to fail inadvertently to retain (something) in such a way that it cannot be immediately recovered: I just lost a dime under this sofa.

Learn the language before you start trying to ridicule someone...

Ciscoguy01, I think your orginal subject was that "not everyone reports all their firewood sales.............. and you bet your teeth on it...... etc, etc." Here in NH, its mandatory for all firewood dealers to submit a sales slip for any and all sales of fuelwood. This add is published in our newspapers under the firewood section in most all NH newspapers;
" N.H. DEPT. OF AGRICULTURE WEIGHTS & MEASURES LAW REQUIRES: that cordwood (fire wood) must: 1. Be sold by the cord or fraction of a cord; 2. Contain 128 cubic feet per cord when stacked; 3. Be accompanied by sales slip stating the amount of wood sold & the price. "
Published In: The Union Leader
on 11/24/2006
As to sales taxes, NH doesn't have a sales tax and firewood is an exempt commodity from sales tax in and around the bordering states of NH and other states we deliver to.
True, we never know who we are selling to, It could be a sting operation or maybe a set up. So we don't take any chances. Thats why everthing that goes out of our yard in invoiced and reported.
I know you re-applied in reporting lawn mowing income, don't have to pay federal taxes, someting to do with Russia, Liberals and speed limits. Now really, what does that have to do with "reporting income" in your orginal post ???

 

[Firewood Guy USA]

Question ??

i understand that there are laws in regards to the exchange of sales of products...but there are many times when people over look them because there are other factors involved. For example...you decide that you are going to buy a used car from someone for your teenager....the individual asks $1000 for the car and then when you go to pay him the guy tacks on another $70 dollars for the 7% sales tax because he has to report his sale to the IRS....does this happen? I have never seen anyone do that because they are reporting the 1000 dollars they made for selling their old car that they owned. For those of us that have our steady jobs that pay our taxes for us, we do no tend to worry about the 5 or 10 cord that we might sell to friends or people in our community because we felt like getting some exercise and using our saws for a bit in the woods....if you cut and use your own wood and you have a little left over and sell it to someone just to cover the chains and amount of gas you may have used, it is a little bit better of a deal for them and we are not out of anything for our time and efforts...the only people i could see this angering would be people who sell wood for a living and rely on every cord to bring their bread home....in regards to cisco and I, there are a lot of needy people in our area who would have to buy their wood for $100 dollars a face cord cut and split (sometimes unsplit) and do it the "legal" way paying tax on the wood so the logger can report his sales to the IRS...or they can reach out to people who are cutting on their own land for some exercise and fun and pay them enough for the gas and chains and still buy their kids christmas presents that winter....your legal preaching is not falling on deaf ears, but at the same time it is not impressing anyone of us that likes to help people out....i hope that you are not one of the hypocritical people that doesn't follow his own words, because you certainly seemed like a nice guy, very informative and supportive of other topics in this forum....i dont like seeing anyone bash anyone on a friendly community like this....your opinions are taken, but don't force them on people in an ill manner...thanks...

Hi Stihlsamantha, I was just wondering. I know there is alot of needy people or low income people throughout the US and the world. Here in this part of the region, we have state aid called fuel assistance programs for the low income people. What this does, is an allotment or state aid for low income people who qualify for state aid in purchasing heating fuel, whether its firewood, lng, propane, coal and etc for heating purposes throughout the winter season. I would say about 8 to 10% of my sales are delivered to the low income which recieves fuel assistance program. Though, I'm reimbursed by the state which usually takes about 6 to 8 weeks. I guess my question is, don't NY'ers and or other states have these same "fuel assistance" programs as we do ??
Oops ! You also mentioned that " the only people who would be agering.... is people who sell wood for a living". I failed to mention that I'm only a partime firewood dealer. My firewood business is only a hobby to me. So, I'm really not angry with anyone. If anyone is angry with me, well ! so let it be.

 

[STIHLSamantha]

yeah, we do have a program called HEAP... here is a website you can check out...ask you can see, it isn't all that much....i'm glad that maine has a good program, i wish NY did....

http://www.otda.state.ny.us/otda/heap/default.htm

this is the information in which NY is given about that....it's nice to see someone else who helps out low income families...if we don't all stick together, who do we have to turn to ya know? I know that low income families were not the main topic of the point you were trying to make...someone such as yourself that follows the rules "to the book" are hard to find and it is easy for others like us that don't agree to offend someone who follows the guidelines so strictly....kudos for being a little more law consciencious than the rest of us...however, since the government doesn't always help the little guy out...even those that follow the laws, we are more than willing to ablige and do what we feel is right....you've got to extend that hand...sometimes it's the only way...thank you for your concern though...:biggrinbounce2:

 

[MS-310]

how crap this is getting kinda mean....:angry2:

 

[STIHLSamantha]

i agree...i am sorry for offending anyone if i had....no meaness was intended here....