Just to show I ‘practice what I preach’: different file guides for different diameter files / different pitch chains.
Philbert
Philbert
Sharpening file size
- Thread starter averagejoe084
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Best way to eliminate all these tools is my eyeball. Guesstimate until you get good at it. 5/32 will sharpen any chain. Spent a whole day with those files only on 3/8RS and 404LX. Depth of the cutters sharpening didn't matter. Getting 1/5 above the top plate to set the hook angle correctly on 404 cutters produce the same chip as larger files cutting lower and using more of the tooth area.
Depth gauges I've always done by sight with a straightedge or my file across the top.
I normally don't ever use any filing guides.
When I remember to bring my kit, I love the little Husqvarna guides you pictured. I have never tried the Stihl filing guide, 'cause I don't need any more sharpening guides. It might be great, but I don't need any more than I have.
Now I've never done any testing at all of your suggestion, but a smaller file will NOT sharpen as much of the "cheek" on a cutter as the larger file will. We all know that the cheek plate needs to be sharp as well as the top, and that the gullet size needs to be adequate for the flow of the chips.
I'd suggest that you can sharpen all chains with the smaller file, but they might perform a bit better with the properly sized file. On top of that, the larger file probably has slightly larger teeth, it certainly has a bit larger surface area, and will probably sharpen that big tooth a little faster and easier.
The only depth gauges worth having are the Husky progressive ones.
I tried a file holder once. After about two or three teeth, I put it away. And then later I gave it away.
In a pinch, you can sharpen almost any chain with almost any round file. Maybe not optimally, but pretty decently to get you by in the woods.
Those husky roller guides are excellent as a training tool.
Just my opinion, of course..
I tried a file holder once. After about two or three teeth, I put it away. And then later I gave it away.
In a pinch, you can sharpen almost any chain with almost any round file. Maybe not optimally, but pretty decently to get you by in the woods.
Those husky roller guides are excellent as a training tool.
Just my opinion, of course..
The cheek height does not matter. The thickness of the tooth at the top does and the angle. The tooth will cut just the same but may not move chip as fast. You are taking a 0.030 slice off or less of the wood and severing the fibers just the same on the side plate regardless of the height of said sideplate.
Before you bash it try it.
I was wondering about how that worked (or as it turns out doesn't work), thanks for clarifying
Fine if you have the experience, not something I'd recommend to many people in the OP's position
I'm not bashing. Sounds to me like it would work.
That being said, I think it is remarkable that none of the manufacturers mirror your suggestions.
‘Different strokes, for different folks’!
I’ve often said, ‘Lots of ways to sharpen: everyone has to find something that works for them.’
If someone is happy with their method, and their results: great.
The various jigs, fixtures, guides, etc., help some people get uniform, consistent cutters.
Some guys can do this free-hand. Some consider a guide as a ‘training tool’. Some don’t care, as long as it is ‘good enough’
Philbert
I’ve often said, ‘Lots of ways to sharpen: everyone has to find something that works for them.’
If someone is happy with their method, and their results: great.
The various jigs, fixtures, guides, etc., help some people get uniform, consistent cutters.
Some guys can do this free-hand. Some consider a guide as a ‘training tool’. Some don’t care, as long as it is ‘good enough’
Philbert
Philbert has some good info about file guides.
Files guides are Ok when first starting out but the file guides have lots of limitations that are not mentioned in the book(they will actually dull a chain very easy and grasshoppers are not aware of so they just keep filing and filing and burning wood and ruining good chains
The Oregon file guide will actually dull dull a chain if the raker is too high due to the tooth being worn back causing the file to ride too high on the tooth. (make sure the rakers are at the correct depth BEFORE using the oregon file guide. The guide starts getting too high and dulling the tooth when the tooth is at about 50% worn (this is not mentioned anywhere in the file guide user info from Oregon) Also YOU WILL FIND that the Oregon file guides are not one size fits all. They are different part numbers for the different size files.
Placing a 5/32 file in a 7/32 file guide and vice versa is not a good thing. (and the Oregon file guides are not marked or labeled as such. (and one size does not fit all) A good crutch for when first starting out to sharpen a chain is too have a new chain of the same type so as to look at the teeth on the new chain to compare and get an idea of what you want to accomplish when sharpening the old chain.
I did not want to confuse the OP too much is why I simply stated that if a chain does not cut good after you sharpen it, do not go back and do the same sharpening procedure again, You are doing something wrong.
Files guides are Ok when first starting out but the file guides have lots of limitations that are not mentioned in the book(they will actually dull a chain very easy and grasshoppers are not aware of so they just keep filing and filing and burning wood and ruining good chains
The Oregon file guide will actually dull dull a chain if the raker is too high due to the tooth being worn back causing the file to ride too high on the tooth. (make sure the rakers are at the correct depth BEFORE using the oregon file guide. The guide starts getting too high and dulling the tooth when the tooth is at about 50% worn (this is not mentioned anywhere in the file guide user info from Oregon) Also YOU WILL FIND that the Oregon file guides are not one size fits all. They are different part numbers for the different size files.
Placing a 5/32 file in a 7/32 file guide and vice versa is not a good thing. (and the Oregon file guides are not marked or labeled as such. (and one size does not fit all) A good crutch for when first starting out to sharpen a chain is too have a new chain of the same type so as to look at the teeth on the new chain to compare and get an idea of what you want to accomplish when sharpening the old chain.
I did not want to confuse the OP too much is why I simply stated that if a chain does not cut good after you sharpen it, do not go back and do the same sharpening procedure again, You are doing something wrong.
It wasn't a suggestion. It was a day with one file size nothing more.
Step away from the
️
2-1 is good to keep handy if you have novice sharpening chain repeatedly in poor cutting conditions or bucking muddy logs. Takes anyone using it about the same amount of time to sharpen a loop.
Interesting point on using the basic file guide on a cutter with a depth gauge really out of whack. I can see where it would raise the file up into the cutting bevel.
But, depth gauges are normally set off the leading edge of the top plate, so setting them before sharpening also poses some issues.
Holding the guide flat on the top plate (not touching the depth gauge) would provide a more consistent result. It’s how I used to do it, before reading the directions!
When I get a chain really out if whack I usually reset it with a grinder. STIHL actually recommends this in some of their manuals, after a number of ‘manual sharpenings’.
I checked all my Oregon, Stihl, and ‘no-brand’ file holders of this style. Every one had the file size stamped in it. I added the label tape markings (seen in Post 22, above), because they are hard to read in low light conditions.
I assume that a ‘universal’ file guide would nut be marked.
Philbert
But, depth gauges are normally set off the leading edge of the top plate, so setting them before sharpening also poses some issues.
Holding the guide flat on the top plate (not touching the depth gauge) would provide a more consistent result. It’s how I used to do it, before reading the directions!
When I get a chain really out if whack I usually reset it with a grinder. STIHL actually recommends this in some of their manuals, after a number of ‘manual sharpenings’.
I checked all my Oregon, Stihl, and ‘no-brand’ file holders of this style. Every one had the file size stamped in it. I added the label tape markings (seen in Post 22, above), because they are hard to read in low light conditions.
I assume that a ‘universal’ file guide would nut be marked.
Philbert
I have used the 2-in-1 and gotten OK results. On another site, a lot of people complain that it sets their depth gauges too low.
Some say they only install the middle file every 3rd sharpening or so.
I wonder if some people put a lot of downward pressure on it, and others more rearward pressure?
If you know what a sharp cutter looks like, you should be able to get there in a number of ways. A smaller file can be moved around quite a bit.
Some people assume that the file / grinder / guide / etc. is responsible for the shape of the finished cutter. No. It’s the person using the tool.
Philbert
Hermio
Addicted to ArboristSite
Don't buy the Stihl version. It is actually made by Pferd. But if you buy the same thing under the Pferd name, you will save about $10. I guess orange plastic costs more than blue.
Pushing down on the 2 in 1 was the only way for me to get any depth gauge cutting after half the tooth is gone. It makes sense those pushing down hard on newer cutters will have an aggressive chain. When the cutters reach their end if life the depth gauges are way too high on my chains.
Must be a different technique with users.
I did buy the authentic Stihl tool for regular 3/8 and 3/8lp. Used a 325 one once.
This is the number 1 sin I have encountered in my years of chain sharpening, people expecting the tool to give them perfect results all on its own with their input being moving the file to and fro. Very few from my experience actually want to look and see what they are doing with a file or file guide, they just expect the file to make the chain sharp, few know about self feeding chain, more know about dogging in and forcing the chain to grind away at the wood.
SteveSr
Addicted to ArboristSite
Now that's interesting! I have always used them level and not noticed any issues. Which manufacturer's instructions tell you to rest the guide on the depth gauge?
