Smallest setup to mill 32" log?

[Blue42]

FWIW, Chestnut Oak is a White Oak and quite rot resistant. Makes nice lumber.

Thanks. It definitely smells good and it's pretty hard. I was chopping in it a few weeks back in the heart wood and I am fairly sure I actually saw a spark.
Nobody online sells any slabs of it, and searches pull up exactly one table made from it. One. But I'm sure going to use it. The tree itself was awesome. Had a branch split off it, that was really another tree in its own right, that grew way, way out over the steep hill it was perched on the edge of. Like the tree didn't worry about gravity at all. I know now that chestnut oaks always do that. They put a big secondary trunk out to the side about ten feet up.
Dang. Wish that tree was still standing.

 

[Blue42]

I was watching some safety things, among them, a guy on here with a lot of experience doing some simple bucking and getting a real good scare with the saw kicking back and hitting his chaps. I have a question for you guys. Is running an Alaskan Mill safer than general cutting? I'm assuming it is. If not, no way I would go right out and buy a big saw with almost no experience. I don't plan to use the saw for anything but milling. Too dangerous in my mind.
I read BobL's personal risk assessment list in the milling 101 sticky and he lists nothing about saws kicking back or chains whipping out and hitting you. Basically no dangers listed having to do with the saw cutting you or bashing you. That makes me feel better.
I have a healthy fear of this stuff and if milling isn't safer than general use, I would probably forget about the whole deal.

 

[rarefish383]

If you found a saw you like go for it. My cousin gave me an old Homelite C5 he got at an auction for a dollar. It was a good runner, so I gave it to one of my buddy’s that wanted to try milling. He bought a 30 inch bar and chain for it on eBay. No one recommends a C5 for milling. But he mills with it all the time. He keeps a sharp chain on it and lets it cut at its own speed. If you put 200 ponds of pushing on a dull 880 or 3120, you can burn them up too. You can definitely use a small for the job saw if you use common sense and go slow. I picked up a Homelite Super 1050 at an auction for $150 and mill with it with a 36” bar and 404 chain. My main milling saw is a 660.

 

[rarefish383]

Don’t know who’s video you saw, so I’m not bashing it. I’m retired from a fourth generation tree service. I’ve been here for about ten years and have seen guys come just like you, to learn. In 2-3 years they are super pros, giving advice to rookies that is just stupid dangerous. I don’t give advice on take downs because I don’t know the persons skill level with their equipment, the type and condition of their equipment.

I think milling is pretty safe. I let a friend run my 660 in a cut and it flat out scared him to death. So I may be wrong. Make sure you use guide rails that overlap the log on both ends. Gives you a place to rest the saw while you start it and get it revved up to enter the log, and a place to let it idle down as you exit the log. The only way I see of getting hurt is trying to get a mill started in a log with no guide rails. You are trying to get a heavy wide open saw started in the hardest cut to get started. I just use a 2X8 screwed to the log with deck screws. Make sure they are not so long they stick down into the cut.

 

[Blue42]

Thanks Joe. Do you use rails for each cut, or just the first cut? Someone I was reading about used them for every cut.

 

[Husky Man]

Thanks Joe. Do you use rails for each cut, or just the first cut? Someone I was reading about used them for every cut.

Blue, I just went out and Maxed out my 36" Granberg Mill, with the Bar Clamp Brackets set to the very end of the rails, I measured 33.5" between the inside faces of the bar clamps.

I measured on one of my .404 Bars, I wouldn't clamp the sprocket end of the bar any closer than 2.5" from the end of the bar(Not measuring the Chain)

Better make SURE that your "36 Inch Bar" Really is 36", Both my Oregon Power Match and my Husqvarna Branded Bar(which I Believe is produced by Oregon) both measure 34.5" from saw face(NOT counting Dawgs) to the bar tip when mounted on my 3120XP, 395XP and 390XP saws, you can recoup a couple inches, by removing your Dawgs, but you are going to lose an inch at the powerhead end, due to the bar clamp.

So in theory, a 36" mill WILL handle your 32" Log, BUT, it won't give you much leeway for bumps, bulges or knots.

An unintended consequence is also that you WON'T be ABLE to Seesaw much, which is a GOOD thing.

While milling you don't want to seesaw the bar, it can leave marks in your cut, Many/Most Guys (and Gals too ) mill with the bar at an angle, not exactly perpendicular to the center line of the cut. Pick an angle that you are comfortable with, and try to maintain it throughout the cut. With your mill that close to capacity, you won't get a lot of angle on your bar, but IMO, keeping the angle consistent is as, if not more important, than the angle itself, just do what is the most comfortable for you, that you can manage, and stay as consistent as you can.

I don't think that I have ever seen a discussion here about whether it is better to lead with the bar end, or the powerhead end, I tend to lead with the bar end of the mill ahead of the powerhead in the cut, but if leading with the powerhead end is more Comfortable for YOU, try that. As you gain experience, you will undoubtedly will find different ways than how you started, that yield better results and are more comfortable for you, so long as you stay SAFE, don't be afraid to try doing things differently, that is how you LEARN.

When I decided to get into Milling, I didn't stick a toe in the water, I did a Swan Dive from the High Board, I bought 48", 36" Mills, as well as their "Small Log Mill" which only clamps at the powerhead end, and is rated to 24" Bar IIRC, and the "Mini Mill", which is typically used for edging, which I have been very Happy with so far.

I also bought Granberg's "EZ Rails" a 9' set and 2 5' sets, plus the connector kits to mill longer beams with.

I use the EZ Rails on all my cuts, maybe with practice, I would get better, but I was getting "Dive" and the ends of my cuts weren't on "Plane" with the middle of the cuts.

An advantage to the EZ Rails is that they are made out of the same material as the Mill frames, so the 5" EZ Rails could also be used to convert your 36" Mill into a 60" Mill, by swapping the parts over, all you would need to buy, is the 60" Round Handle, and it is strongly suggested to buy at least one more End Bracket set for the middle of the mill, to stiffen it up more. Granberg has an Excellent Customer Service Dept. and all the parts are Easily Available from them. I have found Granberg's products to be well Built and Designed, and of High Quality. There are Chinese knock offs, but I have never compared them, so I won't comment on those, other than to remind you of the old saying, you get what you pay for, and set your expectations accordingly

Good Luck with this project, and don't be surprised if you get Hooked, and are back for another "Fix"


Doug

 

[abbott295]

Rails on every cut or not is up to you. If you don't, and you happen to make a wavy cut, you can be repeating the waves every time; if you use the rails, set-up takes longer, you have to watch where you place screws, especially if f you are changing the thickness of the cut, but you have a place to help get started and get out the other end. Kind of depends what you want.

If you can find a log or two that you don't care so much about (and maybe not so large) to practice and learn on before you get into the big one, there's nothing wrong with that.

 

[Husky Man]

Blue, I also forgot to add, that as too milling being Safer?

ANYTHING between you and the chain will add safety, so while you can still manage to hurt yourself, that Mill frame sure can't hurt, keeping you and a moving chain separated.

The Number 1 cause of Kickback, is getting the "No Zone", the top quarter end of the Bar Nose in contact with something, while Milling with the Frame Mills, your bar nose os Guarded, so that hazard is avoided. The Granberg "Small Log Mill" doesn't have the nose guard, so that should be kept in consideration, if you ever use one of those, but for this project, the small log mill wouldn't be an option, at least if used as designed/directed.

As always SAFETY, needs to be a concern when using any chainsaw, if you are competent with a Free saw, cutting firewood, you should be just fine, using a CSM (Chain Saw Mill) as with any saw, if you aren't SURE about anything, STOP and ***** what you are doing, If it is SAFE, and if not, HOW/or CAN, you do it safely.


Doug

 

[andy]

It’s my opinion that user familiarity and comfort in use is the number 1 contributor to safety.

Myself as an example.
I started using saws as a teen slowly gratuating from jigsaws then bandsaws and tablesaws to band-mill and chainsaw...
Understand the dynamics of the blade and or chain/cutters and where the operator belongs.
Asking questions is good. Identifying why you should know is better.

Op, you’re starting off right asking questions.
Here you’ll get lots of opinions with answers (maybe fish is touching on this).
Basic saw skills are available from some excellent books.
Maybe asking for book/lesson recommendations would be a next step. (Rather Better than ....learning from a forum).

 

[Blue42]

Thank you gentlemen. The feedback is helpful.

Husky Man, if the bar actually can end up shorter, that pushed me towards a 42". Right now I'm divided between a 36" and a 42". I understand it's better to run less bar unless you need it. And I will probably only ever need 42" one time. But I would rather not have to spend hours whacking at the log to make a 36" bar fit. I've already spent many frustrating weekends messing with this log and I'm ready to get it done.

I'm planning on using an aluminum ladder. And hoping I can get a good way to screw it down well. The hardware store should have some brackets that fit over the rungs pretty well. I figure there should be less chance of the rails not being parallel to each other with a ladder. I'm a little reluctant to drill holes into each slab to use rails for each cut. But

 

[Skeans]

Blue, I also forgot to add, that as too milling being Safer?

ANYTHING between you and the chain will add safety, so while you can still manage to hurt yourself, that Mill frame sure can't hurt, keeping you and a moving chain separated.

The Number 1 cause of Kickback, is getting the "No Zone", the top quarter end of the Bar Nose in contact with something, while Milling with the Frame Mills, your bar nose os Guarded, so that hazard is avoided. The Granberg "Small Log Mill" doesn't have the nose guard, so that should be kept in consideration, if you ever use one of those, but for this project, the small log mill wouldn't be an option, at least if used as designed/directed.

As always SAFETY, needs to be a concern when using any chainsaw, if you are competent with a Free saw, cutting firewood, you should be just fine, using a CSM (Chain Saw Mill) as with any saw, if you aren't SURE about anything, STOP and ***** what you are doing, If it is SAFE, and if not, HOW/or CAN, you do it safely.


Doug

Kickback wouldn’t be my main worry when milling bow chain shot where you’re exposed to the chain more.


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[Skeans]

Thank you gentlemen. The feedback is helpful.

Husky Man, if the bar actually can end up shorter, that pushed me towards a 42". Right now I'm divided between a 36" and a 42". I understand it's better to run less bar unless you need it. And I will probably only ever need 42" one time. But I would rather not have to spend hours whacking at the log to make a 36" bar fit. I've already spent many frustrating weekends messing with this log and I'm ready to get it done.

I'm planning on using an aluminum ladder. And hoping I can get a good way to screw it down well. The hardware store should have some brackets that fit over the rungs pretty well. I figure there should be less chance of the rails not being parallel to each other with a ladder. I'm a little reluctant to drill holes into each slab to use rails for each cut. But

Have you ran a 42 before? It’s not a light bar to throw around coming from a falling background I’d be more willing to run a 36 over a 42 any day.


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[Husky Man]

Thank you gentlemen. The feedback is helpful.

Husky Man, if the bar actually can end up shorter, that pushed me towards a 42". Right now I'm divided between a 36" and a 42". I understand it's better to run less bar unless you need it. And I will probably only ever need 42" one time. But I would rather not have to spend hours whacking at the log to make a 36" bar fit. I've already spent many frustrating weekends messing with this log and I'm ready to get it done.

I'm planning on using an aluminum ladder. And hoping I can get a good way to screw it down well. The hardware store should have some brackets that fit over the rungs pretty well. I figure there should be less chance of the rails not being parallel to each other with a ladder. I'm a little reluctant to drill holes into each slab to use rails for each cut. But

Blue, if you are making Tables (I forget what your end use is) remember that there is a Top and a Bottom to tables, use the side with the screw holes for the bottom.

Another option is to determine what the finished length needs to be for your project, then cut your logs to be milled enough longer to be able to screw your ladder down near the ends, then cut off the material with the screw holes in them.

If you just want a 36" bar, you may be able to get away with milling down to your mills limit, roll your log over, and mill down to your limit from the other direction, it is possible that will leave you with a center section thin enough to use as is, just depends on how much over the capacity of your mill the log is, something to think about/try


Doug

 

[andy]

Blue, if you are making Tables (I forget what your end use is) remember that there is a Top and a Bottom to tables, use the side with the screw holes for the bottom.

Another option is to determine what the finished length needs to be for your project, then cut your logs to be milled enough longer to be able to screw your ladder down near the ends, then cut off the material with the screw holes in them.

If you just want a 36" bar, you may be able to get away with milling down to your mills limit, roll your log over, and mill down to your limit from the other direction, it is possible that will leave you with a center section thin enough to use as is, just depends on how much over the capacity of your mill the log is, something to think about/try


Doug

I’ve always found screwing the rails only on the ends caused vibration to turn into rail wobble.. (ladder in my case)
At least a couple screws through the middle of a 10’ run are needed to hold things still.
Maybe using a plank of 2x instead of a ladder eliminates that..
Screw holes can disappear quickly if you need them to.
I make a “toothpick” out of same wood and fill screws holes with them.... comes out appearing as a pin knot.
Of course some pieces this would stand out but others it blends into the natural appearance of the piece just fine.

 

[Husky Man]

Have you ran a 42 before? It’s not a light bar to throw around coming from a falling background I’d be more willing to run a 36 over a 42 any day.


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Hi Skeans, Blue42 is trying to max out a 36" CSM and a 36" B&C may leave him a little short

He had asked about the potential for kickback while milling, and you're right in most milling situations, Kickback is a rather minor concern.

Even on my 3120XP, the 36" B&C Balances very Nicely, the 44" B&C are Rather Nose Heavy, but manageable, not something that I would want to carry around a timber cut all day
You wouldn't likely be carrying a 3120 around all day falling, but on a smaller saw, even with the lighter saw weight, I imagine the greater nose heavy off balance would be even more noticeable

Haven't happened into the same threads in awhile, How Ya Been? CoVid19 affecting you and your work much?


Doug

 

[Skeans]

Hi Skeans, Blue42 is trying to max out a 36" CSM and a 36" B&C may leave him a little short

He had asked about the potential for kickback while milling, and you're right in most milling situations, Kickback is a rather minor concern.

Even on my 3120XP, the 36" B&C Balances very Nicely, the 44" B&C are Rather Nose Heavy, but manageable, not something that I would want to carry around a timber cut all day
You wouldn't likely be carrying a 3120 around all day falling, but on a smaller saw, even with the lighter saw weight, I imagine the greater nose heavy off balance would be even more noticeable

Haven't happened into the same threads in awhile, How Ya Been? CoVid19 affecting you and your work much?


Doug

Nose heavy is normally a good thing or just a slight tip down especially when limbing and bucking. A 3120 yeah you can carry all day there’s a few guys that do carry them daily, I never have nor do I think I would need to with the size of wood we cut.

We’re doing ok getting ready to start on some stuff back at home after we got released early from our contract Friday afternoon. How’s stuff on the east side of the metro?


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[Blue42]

Have you ran a 42 before? It’s not a light bar to throw around coming from a falling background I’d be more willing to run a 36 over a 42 any day.
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I have never used a 42" but this saw will only be for milling. Scares me using something this big free hand.

Blue, if you are making Tables (I forget what your end use is) remember that there is a Top and a Bottom to tables, use the side with the screw holes for the bottom.
Another option is to determine what the finished length needs to be for your project, then cut your logs to be milled enough longer to be able to screw your ladder down near the ends, then cut off the material with the screw holes in them.
If you just want a 36" bar, you may be able to get away with milling down to your mills limit, roll your log over, and mill down to your limit from the other direction, it is possible that will leave you with a center section thin enough to use as is, just depends on how much over the capacity of your mill the log is, something to think about/try
Doug

Good point Doug. Just mill the extra width off.
Gentlemen, I've been hacking on this tree for so long, trying to rive it, trying to make a 4' hand pit saw for it (which didn't work; ground the teeth too far apart--not enough teeth per inch probably, and darned hard to keep the cut going straight anyway), trying to pull it up the hill, trying to get the bark off, and generally just staring at it on the side of this steep hill trying to think of what to do and how to do it...man, being able to just rip a piece off it in a few minutes..that's something I don't even think of.

 

[Blue42]

Hey, on a related topic, I only see any 36" bars in .063 gauge. And a lot of people recommend Bailey's ripping chain, so I went to buy some of that, and a bar. However, Bailey's apparently doesn't have any ripping chain that's .063 gauge. Only have .05. Unless they put the wrong description on this one--33RC115. I'm guessing the RC is for ripping chain, but the description says it's chisel.
Granberg does have .063 gauge rip chain, but the site says they're on lock down in California and can't send any orders out.

Any advice or an alternate source would be appreciated.

 

[Skeans]

I have never used a 42" but this saw will only be for milling. Scares me using something this big free hand.


Good point Doug. Just mill the extra width off.
Gentlemen, I've been hacking on this tree for so long, trying to rive it, trying to make a 4' hand pit saw for it (which didn't work; ground the teeth too far apart--not enough teeth per inch probably, and darned hard to keep the cut going straight anyway), trying to pull it up the hill, trying to get the bark off, and generally just staring at it on the side of this steep hill trying to think of what to do and how to do it...man, being able to just rip a piece off it in a few minutes..that's something I don't even think of.

Running a 42 isn’t too bad anything over 50 gets to be interesting that’s when you want to carry 2 saws with you.

That’s a 42 on a 395 they work real good together as far as milling the only milling I’ve done is free hand for springboards.

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[Husky Man]

Hi Skeans, So far we're doing Okay,No Family or friends sick yet

I'm still working, my dedicated account produces Polyurethane Foam, they haven't been notified to shut down yet, that I know of.

Another of our accounts is a Big Communications Company, Cable, Internet, Cell services so I don't think that they will get shut down, I was in Medford this past Monday and Tuesday covering for a sick driver (Flu, Thankfully) and I am expecting to go back Tuesday afternoon for Wed-Fri this coming week, so far I am Busy, but my Wife is a Hair Styllist, and has her own Salon in Welches, OR and she is hearing that Monday it is likely she will be ordered to close down, so she is taking appointments this weekend, but she usually doesn't work weekends.

Fortunately, we are pretty well stocked up, and haven't had to go to the stores too much, but they have been insane around here, Dayum, even the Winter Hawks refused to go into Costco, In FULL GEAR, even with Hockey Sticks, they said something about being "Tough, But NOT Stupid"

I imagine that it does get "Interesting" over 50", I have a 60" Bar, I eventually want to mill Table Tops, that will let me mill up to about 52-54" wide, that thing is a BEAST to handle, at least in a CSM, the mill and guide rails are supporting the saw, I can't imagine actually using a bar that size in falling.

Stay Healthy,
Doug