Split Tail Question

[NickfromWI]

The tress cord i'd make a tad longer, too.

I read a long time ago in a non-tree book that when using knots where there is a tail end hanging out (as opposed to mid-line knots) that one should follow a 4:1 rule. That means for a 1 inch rope, there should be at least a 4 inch tail coming out of the knot. In your case, at LEAST two inches. In the knots that I tie, 6:1 or 8:1 is more often used.

But who's to say I'm right. A person could live their whole life climbing with a 1:1 ratio and be alright.

I know that the fisherpersons termination knot especially likes to creep for a little bit until it gets really tightened down. A 6:1 will quickly automatically become a 4:1 that no longer requires re tightening.

That being said, how often do you retie the knot holding the snap hook?

And while we're on the topic, did you say that picture was not a split-tail set up.

It is, isn't it?

love
nick

 

[MasterBlaster]

Originally posted by netree
Butch, wouldn't you even like to at least TRY a setup like that?

Sure, why not. I'm easy to get along with. Can ya rig it up with one hand?

 

[NickfromWI]

Originally posted by MasterBlaster
Sure, why not. I'm easy to get along with. Can ya rig it up with one hand?

Put down the cigarette, Butch!

Once you get off the ground, two handed operation is not necessary.

love
nick

 

[MasterBlaster]

Apples and oranges, bro.

 

[NeTree]

Nick,

Thanks for the input on the knots. BTW, YOU tied them. I'll see if I can get some more tail out of themm but I've never had a problem. But hey, if it makes it safer, it's worth it.

Yes.. it is, I suppose... but I consider a "split-tail" system to consist of a seperate piece of rope used for your hitch in place of using the tail of your line; hence, the tail is "split" up.

In a tress-cord system, the cord exists for the sole purpose of tying advanced friction hitches that simply can't be tied with the tail of your line, hence necessetating a seperate piece of rope by default.

We're probably both right to some extent.

oh, and the fisherman's knot on the snap hook can't be untied- it's blind-stiched with .008 stainless wire.

 

[rahtreelimbs]

Butch, what is the need for being able to tie one-handed?


I supposed that if you were using the old-school method of using the tail of your rope and not a split-tail then the need for one-handed tying becomes more apparent. Am I right on this?

 

[NeTree]

Originally posted by MasterBlaster
Sure, why not. I'm easy to get along with. Can ya rig it up with one hand?

Butch, in a sense I have to do most things with one hand. I have only 50 percent use of my left hand.

 

[NeTree]

The beauty of this type of system is that you only have to tie your hitch once on most trees. If you need to re-direct, simply unclip the snap hook, pull up some slack the the Distel, thro over the limb you need to tie into, and pull the slack back out; one handed.

 

[NeTree]

Originally posted by netree
Butch, in a sense I have to do most things with one hand. I have only 50 percent use of my left hand.

Which, BTW, is why the hitch is on the right when most people use it on their left, from what I've seen.

 

[rahtreelimbs]

Originally posted by netree
The beauty of this type of system is that you only have to tie your hitch once on most trees. If you need to re-direct, simply unclip the snap hook, pull up some slack the the Distel, thro over the limb you need to tie into, and pull the slack back out; one handed.

That is exactly why I can't see the need to be able to tie your hitch one-handed.

 

[NeTree]

But... tying a Distel 1-handed is easier anyways. I do it all the time; including unclipping the biner and micro-pulley.

 

[okietreedude1]

Erik,

the knots in your hitch cord were tied by me, not nick. sometimes i do get them a tad short but I try to get an inch out there.

as for the term 'split tail' I consider what you do there a split tail system. the tail is the friction device whether its the same rope or different. since the tail in your case is not attached to the same piece as your climb line, it is 'split'. Or at least thats the way I see it.

 

[NeTree]

But Mike...


I didn't make the tress cord. And the knot on the climbing line is secure.


Read above.

 

[John Stewart]

Bad Habit Mikey!

You should untie after every climb and inspect that hitch!
Also it is not good for rope to remain tied over long periods of time because it does have a memory!
Or are you saying you untie it every time you climb!
Later
John

 

[NeTree]

Cool... we'll just blame Dave.


Seriously though, I haven't had one unravel yet. So, I'll play with it when I get the chance, but I'm not petrified worried, either.

 

[NeTree]

Originally posted by Mike Maas
you need at least a triple fishermans knot to keep the slippery high modules core from slipping out,

It can't.

 

[Stumper]

John, What Eric is doing with a permanent knot with stitching is fine. You are correct that rope should not be left tied for long periods and then untied/retied in a different location. I tie my climbing line with a buntline hitchw/footlong tail with a half hitch back up using up the bulk of the tail. That hitch gets untied at the end of every climbing session and I swap ends on the rope every few climbs to keep wear even. As usual Mike is the one advocating stupidly dangerous practices (like two hand climbing saw use).

 

[John Stewart]

Come on Mike your saddle is not a peice of rope that rubs all day long against another piece of rope!
Any piece of gear that moves or rubs for safety shoud be checked daily!
And actually I do check my saddle after each climb!
It's your arse Mike but I think it is important!
Later
John

 

[NeTree]

Originally posted by Mike Maas
Why? It does in testing.

Because it's whipped and dipped.

 

[Stumper]

Originally posted by netree
Because it's whipped and dipped.

Hey, why haven't we done that to Mike?