Stihl 021 teardown, with pics, and questions...

[windthrown]

Ive had a 021 for a while and just put an 023L together. I think impulse and fuel line and maybe one screw carb is a bit of a drag. They arent pro saws but I think for homeowner not loaning it out it will do well with what your doing.

You have an L model 023? The Euro model one with the plugged up muffler so it runs super quiet (and gutless?). I have seen some odd-ball 1123 saws out there. My 025/250 hybrid is yet another one.

I had a 210 once, and I left it with my ex when I moved out. I actually super-glued a broken flywheel fin on that thing, and it is still holding up! The impulse line was key in getting that thing to run right.

 

[Rookie1]

Yes I do. I bought it from Andre,he named it Stealth Saw. I like my 021 and use it to cut alot of pallets,shipping crates and trees that arent too large. I feel the 023L is on par with it and like running it cause it quieter.I feel it doesnt draw as much attention. Here is the thread I did on the buildup. http://www.arboristsite.com/showthread.php?t=82076&highlight=023l

 

[wrooster]

Your compression tester has a LONG auto hose on it, and you are probably going to read low using that (unless you have a release valve down by the threaded end of the tester). There have been a lot of chat about that on several threads on AS over the years. Your engine may be better than you think.

The compression tester shown in my photos has a schrader valve located right at the spark plug threads. So it *should* be giving me a good reading.

May want new crank seals while you are in there.

Already looking into those. The generic equivalent ones are seemingly inexpensive online, but for the shipping costs!

Sprocket is beyond shot.

Yes, that is an understatement.

Flywheel with no key is shot

The flywheel (and key) are actually in pretty good shape.

Definately get the picco 3/8 low profile B&C. .325 is too fat a kerf and a 210 will not drive that.

My thinking as well. I have to go out to the garage and get the B&C, I really don't recall if it was a 14" or 16". I think a 16" B&C is a lot to spin for a 021, of course if you are only cutting softwoods or trimming it may not be a problem and the greater length provides a bit more reach.

Overall with shipping, I would say that $100+ is a lot to put into a 210.

$100 was my mental limit. I think I could less the outlay of coin a bit by getting just the rings vs the piston-N-rings kit, but again I'm all the way in there already.

Thanks for the input,
Jim / Wrooster

 

[ironman_gq]

if the piston isnt scored and the skirts havent started to collapse then a ring set should be just fine. Measure the piston at the skirt to see if they have started to squeeze in more than a couple thousandth's of an inch, any more and its shot otherwise a new piston is just wasted money.

 

[Dan_IN_MN]

Just to be sure, you could check your compression tester on another running saw. When you pulled the starter rope, did it pull over easier than before? Is your clutch bearing in need of replacement? I see you have one on your pre-order.

 

[windthrown]

$100 was my mental limit. I think I could less the outlay of coin a bit by getting just the rings vs the piston-N-rings kit, but again I'm all the way in there already.

Thanks for the input,
Jim / Wrooster

No problem. Another idea is to off the 210 parts on Ebay for $100+, and buy that 250 for sale on the trading post here on AS for $175. You would get a 250 in the deal for about the price of fixing the 210.

The rim thing is weird. I got a picco rim for my 250 from a Stihl shop, but the Oregon drum has the smaller splines than the rim has. There are 2 sizes of rim drives on those. The rim was set up for the .325 on the 250 when I bought it. I flipped it to picco, after getting the saw pinched in a lot of cuts using .325. The cuts are faster with the narrow kerf. I tried to find NK .325 bars and chains for it about a year ago, but they do not exist. You can put a 6 or 7 pin/sprocket rim on a 250, but on the 210 stick with 6 pin. B****y's does not have a 6 pin rim in picco, and the 7 pin ones cost a forking fortune! ($13???). I know what you mean about shipping from B****y's too. 'Cept the Stihl dealers here want extra for parts that are ordered now... sux sux sux.

 

[wrooster]

Bottom end pics, piston looks in good shape as does the cylinder wall... although I found it next to impossible to take a good picture of the latter.

ps:
Thanks you AS guys for mentioning that the roller bearings at the connecting rod big end are not captive! Now I just need to figure out a clever way of keeping the rod centered on the journal so I can get the old rings off and the new ones on.

Jim / Wrooster

 

[wrooster]

ps:

The compression tester shown in my photos has a schrader valve located right at the spark plug threads.

 

[windthrown]

Looking good. Actually, that piston and rings look too good to be bad. ??? Your compression tester looks like the right one to have though.

I know what you mean about pix of the jug. Hard to even eyeball it for scoring. You need a ring flash for that kind of photography. That also looks too good to be bad though???

Contrast your piston to one I pulled from a 250 a few weeks ago that I bought for parts. Seriously scored, the rings were scored, and the jug was grooved. Worst I have seen in a saw. I sold the rod and crank and kept the jug as a momento. That saw still started... ran like :censored: though.

All you need are rings. Also buff off the carbon on the piston crown. Careful putting the rings on. They are brittle. I never had problems with the bearings falling out. Maybe wrap it with aluminum wire?

 

[wrooster]

Hang with me here, a couple of more questions:

1) how much side-to-side (angular) play should the connecting rod have with respect to the roller bearings?

2) based on what you see above, should i touch the main bearings and/or seals? rotation is smooth, no sign of race galling or ball damage.

3) is the ignition coil assembly waterproof? i would like to take the bottom pan "carcass" out back and use some engine cleaner and/or simple green and give it a good bath. do i need to take the ignition coil assy off first?

4) i *don't* need a piston ring compressor for this type motor, correct? (i.e. there is sufficient taper at the jug)

5) what is the best way to ensure the chain oil pump and the chain oil passageways are clear of debris?

6) bottom end reassembly: scrape the sealant off, clean with mineral spirits, apply Dirko or Yamabond, and close up the clamshell?

thanks for all your help!

Jim / Wrooster

 

[wrooster]

oh and one more thing:

NO ONE HAS SUGGESTED PORTING IT YET !?!?!??!?!

you guys are slowing down... :wave:

Jim / Wrooster

 

[Sawdustmaker]

haven't you read that brad said he would never port another clamshell....

these guys always do whatever he says...

.... just kidding..... ROTFLMAO!!

 

[Rookie1]

Ive thought about getting a 025 or 250 and messing with the ports. You cant raise compression easily or change timing. But you could widen the exhaust port. I dont think youll hear much from the regulars on porting this style engine.

 

[HimWill]

Most of your questions were answered in post #9.

 

[HimWill]

Here are some pics of an 021 that had a crank bearing spacer fail.The pitting on top of the piston is where it ate the spacer and spit it out.Also,here is how the T-shirt strip works to keep the connecting rod centered.

 

[wrooster]

Most of your questions were answered in post #9.

You are correct, my bad -- it was late and I was typing as things came to mind.

Jim / Wrooster

 

[HimWill]

Your parts look really good,piston rings and seals should do it.This one of mine however needed the works,piston,rings,bearings and seals.

 

[wrooster]

Your parts look really good,piston rings and seals should do it.

That is what I am thinking as well.

I'l get an order in this evening via a couple of places, and while I'm awaiting delivery of the bits and pieces I will get the chassis grunge all cleaned up.

Last question: should I touch the cylinder wall? There is no scoring, no ring lip, and nothing that raises my eyebrow. (note: I do not have a ball hone)

Jim / Wrooster

 

[HimWill]

Brake cleaner does a fair job of removing the carbon,as does kerosene or diesel,whatever's handy.Wash out the case per Lakes method: 25% purple cleaner sprayed on,let soak a bit and hose it off.Repeat till clean.Air dry or blow dry.Don't let those roller bearings get loose(there are 14 of them).Make sure the impulse is clear,on these with the failed spacer,one of them was clogged with metal dust.You should not have that problem,but check it anyway.I wouldn't bother the cylinder unless you can feel something rough,I doubt there's anything that needs attention.
By case,I meant all the plastic parts,not the cylinder.

 

[HimWill]

Not trying to hijack the thread,but here is a pic of both styles of crankshafts used in the 021's.The one on the left is the new style(carried on in the 210's I think).Two counterweights,dog-bone connecting rod(caged rollers on both ends,looks the same coming or going) and pressed together.The connecting rod and crank are one unit,you could replace the wrist pin bearing but that's all.The older style on the right,has a forged crank,single counterweight,uncaged rod bearings and is fully servicable.
I like the old style,but that's just me.

Both of these engines had the clutch-side bearing spacer fail,ruining the piston.Is this a common failure for this series?