Stihl 031???

[sedanman]

Plastic has the ability to deform and return to it's original shape. That's why it's called plastic (look up the definition) Most plastics can take more abuse in this fashon than cast aluminum or magnesium. Cast aluminum will bend in one direction but break when bending back al la dirtbike clutch and brake levers. I am glad there are plastic parts on my saws. I even switched to a plastic handlebar on my 026, the MS-361 came with one.

 

[Fish]

But will they last as long as the older models?

 

[Mange]

Put away a used 372xp for 50 years, and the see how much you get for your dollars.
I am willing to bet the plastic and rubber parts could use some attension by then.

 

[stihltech]

plastic

Now let's get this right, it is SPACE AGE POLYMER!
Yes, I believe the handle bar will outlast the metal. My handle bar sales have dropped to nothing on those models. Stihl tried them on 046 and 066. Pissed the swa operators off that they could not break them, they hacksawed them in two. (OK, Ben Crago story, for those of us that know him.)
Fuel tanks, yes, better also. Warp rather than break, but then again, if you hook the skidder to it to pull it out when pinched, it will break.
We all thought the 056 was the ultimate logging saw around here. The 064 came out with less power, but when they figured out it would do the same work with less weight, the 056 sales dried up. The 044 was a little too samll, but when 046 came out, the 066 sales went dowm, save for the Amish, but lately they are buying them.
Lighter may not mean stronger, but do you want to go back to 051's for a daily logging saw?
If so, I have an 075 in the shop right now for sale.

 

[Fish]

But will the saw last longer?

 

[sedanman]

I have a telephone in my house from 1964, it's plastic and still holding up fine. I have NEVER seen platic rust. I have a Jonsered 49SP that is junk because someone left fuel in the tank too long and it ATE A HOLE in the magnesium. I have never seen that happen to a plastic tank. A good quality 'pro' saw is a mix of materials each chosen as the best for its application, mag cases for strength, plastic tanks and handles for weight and corosion resistance. 50 years from now most of our saws will be unserviceable becasue we won't be able to get rubber parts like intake boots or fuel lines, not because the plastic handles on our saws have faded in the sun.

 

[sedanman]

BTW, If something is built super tough and is so heavy that no one uses it, does it matter how long it lasts? I have customers that buy a new string trimmer ever year and toss the old one becuase they have used it more than 40 hours a week and it is totally shot form continuous hard use, do they whine? NO becuase the machine paid for itself in the first week and all else was profit. Pro saws are meant to be used hard for a given perioid of time and replaced with a new one long before the issue of whether it had a plastic or magnesium fuel tank becomes an issue, Most of us here have pro saws that are NOT put to the use they were built for. If a tree guy has an 066 it will not get the same use a faller would put it to. Rich Hoffman has more saws than some tree companies I know of, he works his saws on the weekends, he has a 'normal' indoor job the rest of the time, he will NEVER wear out a saw. Gypo crushes more saws than he'll wear out. I could go the rest of my life with only 1 saw and get by just fine (not that I would, mind you).

 

[Fish]

Still, the question stands.
Will the new saw last as long?
Under daily pro use, then the answer is no.
Under hypothetical examples geared toward favoring plastics, well maybe.
The hole in the magnesium, was it old gas, or water?
I have never seen magnesium rust either

 

[woodshop]

50 years from now most of our saws will be unserviceable becasue we won't be able to get rubber parts like intake boots or fuel lines, not because the plastic handles on our saws have faded in the sun.

...interesting, makes me want to buy up spares of all those rubber parts, coating them in silicone, stuffing them in baggies and sticking them in a cool dark corner somewhere?

I have come over to the plastic side of the isle myself over time. My old XL was built like a tank, I ran over it with a skidder once and it just pushed it down into the mud and bent the bar, very little damage. But sure was heavy compared to a saw today with same or more power. I like less weight when carrying them around the woods all day... yes I'm getting soft... thats OK.

Dave

 

[woodshop]

I have never seen magnesium rust either

Magnesium oxidizes just like aluminum or any other metal (except gold).

 

[sedanman]

Fish. Understand the concept of horsepower hours. An engine of a given displacement may make a certain amout of horsepower for a given number of hours turning at a particular rpm and generating a quantity of heat. Double the power and the number of hours the engiene will live goes down, the rpm has to go up for the same displacement engine to produce more power, in most cases this generates more heat. A small block Chevy will go a few hundred thousand miles in grandmas car, less than a thousand in a Nascar car, only a few passes with a dose of nitro and a blower in a jr. fueler. You simply cannot compare an old slow revving all metal saw to a modern high revving one and get an equal comparison. Built two saws that are identical other than the materials that the gas tank and handles are made of and test each until they fail and then you have something to compare. It is pointless to argue if todays saws will last longer than those of different material because no one is building them any other way.

 

[Justin Garrison]

I have old 2stoke lawn boy mowers with magnesium mower decks and yes they corrode to nothing if you dont clean the grass of and sit them a few years there will be nothing left. But i would rather have that than a plastic mower deck. Just because something is unarguably better dosen't mean everyone will use it. When every one New York to La is driving hydrogen cars, Will you still be running gas? I dont think a gas tank could have older gas in it than my 031, It was like the Shenandoah caverns, but it cleaned up and the metal is unparched!

 

[Justin Garrison]

Thank you fish I won the auction and will promptly pay you! My ebay name is redz72. Thanks again.

 

[Fish]

Sorry it went higher.

Horsepower hours? Comparing the 028 to what? 500 to 1000 rpm difference?
Yes plastic is lighter, so it is better?
I understand simple concepts, but which saw would last longer under the same conditions, an 028 or an ms270/280?

 

[sedanman]

Is a rock better than a feather? Depends on whether or not you're a bird. Makes as much sense as arguing whether plastic is better than aluminum or reeds better than piston ports. Saws are being built a particular way now, either accept it or don't but there's no point beating the subject to death.

 

[Fish]

You are the one getting upset and beating it to death.
You must take it a little easier if someone disagrees with you.

Considering we were not really disagreeing on much of anything.
I just believe that side by side, an 028 would give you longer service than
a newer Stihl model of equal power. Also I have noticed a difference in
Stihl's chain quality, but that would not fit into your beating the "plastic"
thing to death. In fact, I don't remember ever saying anthing about plastic.

 

[lonewolf1969]

New guy on here .I found this site while looking for a coil for my 25yr old 031av.Could any of you guys tell me how to ck a coil and also how to ck a flywheel. My saw guy put a used coil on my saw and it ran about 10min with the used coil he and then wouldnt fire. This has got me thinking if the old coil quit after25yr why would the coil he put on work and then just quit in 10min of running Thank for any help

 

[tree monkey]

fish your jumping the gun. how can you say the new ms 280 won't last as long as an 028 ? it's still new to the market. i've sold a load of 280's with only miner problems. only time will tell the real story. look me up in 20 years and we can talk about it then.

later

 

[Justin Garrison]

Fish is just relying on the way the market seems to be going. They make things cheaper so people will replace them more especially applinces, refridgerators, my pop pop has a westinghouse refridgerator that has been running for more than 50 years and counting. Lets see that with todays refridgerators. the new 280s are nicer than my 290 but I would never compare my 290 with an 028super.

 

[Justin Garrison]

Just got one rebuilding the 031. Didnt actualy buy new piston/cylinder just cleaned massive carbon build up from top of piston cylinder 1 ring was stuck cleaned out ring slot now is free. scotch brited piston to clean it up a little oiled and reassembled. showing around 150lbs of compression. I think I did good never checked it before tune up. Just waiting for fish to send the parts to let this baby rip.