Teaching a Roper

[PTS]

I would like a standard way to teach a groundy how to rope properly to keep from hurting the climber or breaking the rope. On a controlled descend limb once tipped. I have tried to explain this to some of the new guys and feel like I am banging my head against the wall. :bang:

Hopefully someone has a way of getting the point across.

 

[Redbull]

Tie them up by their ankles and drop them on a pulley. Do it the first time letting the rope run like you should. Then let them do it with the rope locked off. They'll get the idea.

 

[KentuckySawyer]

Tie them up by their ankles and drop them on a pulley. Do it the first time letting the rope run like you should. Then let them do it with the rope locked off. They'll get the idea.

That might do it.

 

[PTS]

Munter hitch

after posting this I ran down to the shop and met one of my ropers there to try something new. We set up the same scenario and instead of using our home made metal the rope around it (can't think of the name) THINGY to lower stuff, we tied up using a munter hitch. I went up in the boom with a chunk of log and dropped it, and he actually thought it was easier to do that then the THINGY. He is one of my best ropers so I guess if he likes that better we may switch. It would have been nice to know that before spending the money on the THINGY

 

[skwerl]

port-a-wrap?

 

[PTS]

Yeah or THINGY works

 

[Redbull]

The problem with the Munter is it's inability to handle heavy loads unlike the Port-A-Wrap.Also, if your ropeman sets the rope into the biner wrong, it can lock itself and shock load the rope. It will work for light loads, but be careful. To make using the PAW easier to use, I had drawn diagrams on the PAW itself reminding me how to set it up. I've lowered some big wood on it with just one hand. Wouldn't mind having a GRCS, but it's not needed in my business right now.
PS
Did you try my method with your ropeman?

 

[PTS]

No he is one of the good ones.

I think that weight might be part of his frustration. I generally take small bites not by choice but because of the size of trees around here. After coming back from down south, I feel like these trees are all babies. I can lower a whole limb and probably do it without wrapping just using the ropers weight and lower it down. It would in many cases be easier but we don't for safety reasons. I can see definitely see how they could screw up the Munter.

you know sometimes you have to wonder who helps some of them get dressed in the morning?

 

[Redbull]

My wife helps me, unless the kids beat her to it.

 

[Redbull]

The PAW is IMO more forgiving to newbies and those less attentive to detail, than a Munter would be. It's good for your guys to know how to use both.

 

[pbtree]

Tie them up by their ankles and drop them on a pulley. Do it the first time letting the rope run like you should. Then let them do it with the rope locked off. They'll get the idea.

 

[clearance]

You can wrap it from where you are at in the tree and have the groundsman hold it or lower it. If you have concerns about the rope breaking then you are exceeding safe working load limits and risking your safety. Safety first, what is wrong with just hammering it down? Safe is best, when in doubt about if it is to big or not, let gravity do its work.

 

[Redbull]

Some customers actually pay more for low impact removals.

 

[skwerl]

Whenever I'm required to work with a new rope man for more than 1-2 cuts, I usually go through my typical spiel about his responsibilities. The ropeman's top three priorities are, in order:
1) The climber's safety. Make sure the limb is going to clear the climber and don't fling him out of the tree like a booger off a stick.
2) Property damage. Slow down or stop the limb before it hits the roof of the house (or whatever obstacle which required the limb be roped).
3) Make your own job easier. Lay the limb down oriented towards the chipper so the crew can move it out of the landing zone. Get the rope untied and back it to the climber for the next cut.

 

[PTS]

Whenever I'm required to work with a new rope man for more than 1-2 cuts, I usually go through my typical spiel about his responsibilities. The ropeman's top three priorities are, in order:
1) The climber's safety. Make sure the limb is going to clear the climber and don't fling him out of the tree like a booger off a stick.
2) Property damage. Slow down or stop the limb before it hits the roof of the house (or whatever obstacle which required the limb be roped).
3) Make your own job easier. Lay the limb down oriented towards the chipper so the crew can move it out of the landing zone. Get the rope untied and back it to the climber for the next cut.

That is great advise, I use something very similar, but my frustration is in teaching them to let it run a little prior to pulling it to a stop. I've had a share of close calls because of the stupid people and I wish I had a way to get it through their heads on how it is supposed to work.

 

[Redbull]

I'm tellin ya, my method will work. First time, guaranteed!

 

[Redbull]

Seriously though, set up a similar situation, rigging it off your bucket and let them see the difference between letting it run and not letting it run.

 

[skwerl]

PTS- I've never worked with a porta wrap, nobody around here would be able to identify one if they saw it. Years of 'taking wraps' (around the tree trunk) is my only experience. With that in mind, I will make sure the ropeman knows how big of a piece I'm taking. I will coach him to 'take a wrap' or 'take a half wrap'. Then I try to consistently make each cut the same weight, and I'll communicate if a piece is larger or smaller so the ropeman isn't caught unexpected by the load. I make the ropeman look and see how big the piece is, showing him where I'll make the cut. If he doesn't have enough wraps for a big piece, I'll make sure he takes another wrap before I start cutting. People are not used to identifying individual limbs in trees, most won't see anything but a big blob above 35'. I force the ropeman to look at exactly what I'm cutting.

I also scream at him if he locks down a big chunk of wood and tries to hurt me. I'll let him know that he didn't let it get past me and could have injured me. He's failing at his #1 priority.

 

[Kneejerk Bombas]

Whenever I'm required to work with a new rope man for more than 1-2 cuts, I usually go through my typical spiel about his responsibilities. The ropeman's top three priorities are, in order:
1) The climber's safety. Make sure the limb is going to clear the climber and don't fling him out of the tree like a booger off a stick.
2) Property damage. Slow down or stop the limb before it hits the roof of the house (or whatever obstacle which required the limb be roped).
3) Make your own job easier. Lay the limb down oriented towards the chipper so the crew can move it out of the landing zone. Get the rope untied and back it to the climber for the next cut.

Good job. You've taken a complicated job and reduced it to its simplest form.
Can I quote you?

 

[skwerl]

Of course, Mike. I'm just passing along what others have passed to me. The verbage might change but the basic priority list is still the same.