The Best Climbing Line

[TheTreeSpyder]

Quite an Analysis

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TheTreeSpyder wrote on 06-27-2003 09:31 PM:
i'm still wondering if you were saying not to use Fly on natural crotches?

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I've tried my best to avoid it. Since the fly rope has such smaller strands, wear in natural crotches seems to be faster than a good hefty 12 or 16 strand (Blue Streak, ArborPlex). The dirt embedded in the rope seems to affect hitch handling more than in standard arbo ropes also.
The Fly is an excellent rope, but it is like a high performance item. The perameters for maximum performance are rather narrow compared to 16 strand. Like driving a hot rod on the street. Keep it clean, use a low friction false crotch and high performance hitch. It's like hopping out of your old Honda hatchback and driving a BMW 7-series.

New England claims it is almost a static rope, but I disagree. almost as much stretch as other arbo ropes. Closest I've found to a static rope is climbing on XTC rope- no give whatsoever. Fly has a lot of bounce at 50-60 feet.
__________________
RockyJ
aka Brian

 

[John Paul Sanborn]

Smaller strands, butmore of them. So to speak.

It's what, 26 strand or something like that.+

 

[jwiener]

Has anyone used the lockjack and pantin on the fly? How does it work out?

 

[dbeck]

hey nick, black max is a bailey's product, no? I have been curious about black max 'cause it is inexpensive and 16 strand. Anybody elsae use this line?
I've been using a sherrill line for weekend work. Maybe 15 climbs tops and it has been wearing twice as fast as anything I've ever used. That's my experience.
I live approx 5 mile from Devil's Lake...never tree climbed there, but it does have some super nice oaks to play in.

 

[John Paul Sanborn]

I love going to Devils Lake in the warmer parts of winter, no one is there and it is just so quiet. Even in the more rural areas around the city you are near enough a road to hear a Jake Brake and enough population for powertools and nail guns to be heard in the distance.

I used Daves balckmax a few times, I did not mind it for a second rope, a little limper then the white blue stuff I would use it for carbapple ropes and the like.

 

[NickfromWI]

Blackmax

The stuff JPS is talking about is the same rope I saw. Dave has the blackmax. He said it's going on it's third year, but if you looked at it, you'd think it was almost new!

Now, you say the sherrill rope is "wearing" twice as fast. Wear is a good thing on climbing lines...in a manner of speaking. That fuzzyness that good ropes acquire provided that tiny bit of friction to make holding the rope (your hands and the knots) a bit easier. This is acceptable and in my opinion, desired.

Dave's blackmax did not do this well. Look at that sherrill rope that you have. Maybe it's wearing in a good way:alien:

love
nick

ps- i'm staying away from devils lake for a little while. with the 4th of july around the corner, i'm sure there are TONS of people around. not peaceful at all.

 

[Tom Dunlap]

Hubert sent me a black cam clutch for my LJ to use with the Fly. This one was designed for the 11mm Edelrid rope available in Europe. I think it works just fine. Hubert, being the perfectionist, is working on a different cam clutch for the Fly.

The Pantin works just fine. I haven't used Fly with other tools but I assume they will work just fine. This weekend I'm going to use my Gri-Gri in place of the LJ.

Tom

 

[tjk]

I've spent the better part of my 20's at Devils Lake ( some of the oldest exposed stone in the world.) The weekend of sept. 13 a bunch of tree climbers will be climbing there. Camping at green valley big group camp site. last year was alot of fun.

 

[dbeck]

I do agree w/ nick on the wear being good in that it does let you grip the rope better, esp. when srt. On a new rope, gripping w/ your foot can be slippery.
Comparing blue streak to the sherrill rope. The wear on the BS evolves slower than the Sherrill. W/ that in mind, I expect that the Sherrill rope will be in it's "prime" wear condition for a shorter period of time. Make sense? If the wear shows faster, I feel the rope will wear out faster also.

 

[TheTreeSpyder]

Good thought i'd say, but the manufacture might be ahead of that too?

i think Nick dropped a jewel, the fuzzies more like the natural fibre. Prolly not as strong and stiff, so not having the full tendency.

The locking hairy stiff fibres of manilla, jute lines of old performed the function of more grip and interlocking inside knots for muche more security, less slipping, so less impacting to set knots tighter and scaledly impact test them too, the bights then stayed slightly larger, compounded by the lines having to be about 2x as thick new, even more to allow sometimes for long term; perhaps making some knots stronger i think i read.

For this reason of slippery shrinking rubber band, many knots and high regarded knowledge at the changing of the guard to slippery synthetics had to be changed and dropped. The fuzz gives ya some grip, also minutely inside the knots, surfaces who's mating is set according to the load, by the load itself.

Also lending more credence to TDS to avoid that slip and setting, heating in friction and choke in the micro machine we call a knot. i add Inspect (to TDS), especially in reused double bowline w/tie off to clip karab hitched loads, or lifeline through the day.

That is part of my symmetrical/ easy on the eye/ checkable quality i seek, that i've read partially the reason for mountaineer/rescue disciplines to use the family of 8; from which i partially stole my comparison of a family of 'Clove', in tree stuff. As a possible family to overlearn, to avail instantly recognizable, memorable, matching with sligh alteration, checckable family of form to trained eye, as a possible strategy of 1st level learning. As i see over 1/2 dozen fit, kinda covering all needs at that level, save stopper knots that flow from one another. Once taught the form a clove 1|1, half of one a hitch, drop leg down to muenter; reset to clove, self trap for constrictor, reset, 1|2 utility rolling hitch, 2|2 tautline, 3|1 grab both legs to start the distel forms, 1|4 and drop top ring down stack makes a Knut, clove to line itself makes buntline shrinking eye. Stopper all single leg, non self trapping forms. i think you could climb, on any line, having 2 advanced hitches (1 even self tending), basic universal starting hitch refrenceable and not needing a tail, rig, throw line make emergency hose clamp, have half hitch to clove for straighter dragging, throw in slipped clove, slipped constrictor, self trapping-quick release muenter etc. with quicker reference if catching on to pattern, and table for desired knot in head. Maybe, 20 years later in some other life, some where else, what's a distel...not sure clove family............ooooooooo yeah 3|1! is this right, has clove family formation, 3|1 maybe crib sheet has grab both ends too written. If one has the mind and sees they are practicing all knots each time they tie any of the set, becoming more profficient and familiar with all at once.

Okay done, didn't get that part all out when Tom brought up before!!

-:alien:

 

[tjk]

I know this sounds funny, but I and several other climbers prefer a new rope with alot of wax for our climbing lines ( we often use an acsending line for entry). The lower the surface friction the better for me the rope drags thru the tree much better and is easier to work with,you do not have to pull rope up to get some where it just follows. down fall you must wear those sticky gloves. Reduce friction= reduced wieght=easier day.

 

[TheTreeSpyder]

That sounds interesting; i would think the friction hitch would 'tack' too much?

 

[tjk]

currently using 5/16 stable braid with what I think is the Knut and it performs well.

 

[geofore]

ropes

Mine is Blue Streak, every rope has a place in history and now the new ones are coming on like computers a new one, better, faster, does more faster than you can wear them out. Back in the haydays of the Erie Canal the US was making about 41,000,000 tons of hemp rope (smokable plant stuff), then we got into Manilla made from banana leaves (not smokable) but then they didn't outlaw bananas either. Now we have these synthetics and I like them but never expect to be able to try them all. Haven't had time to wear out a coil of the Blue Streak yet but working on it feverishly.

 

[John Paul Sanborn]

Tod, how much are you getting the Stable Braid ofr, is it Samthane coatted?

I'm using the uncoated and my only complaint is that it will herniate easily when brand new.

BTW, I told Bryan Kotwica you are posting for a position, incase you did not get my MSG. Don't know if he wants full time, but Horrigan sold out to Davey's and BK is not too thrilled.

 

[tjk]

jps, yes it has the coating I get about 30 climbing days out of it. I do take it off the rope every tree. I did get your message.Keep the weekend of Sept. 13 open for rock climbing and camping at Devils Lake. a bunch or arbors will be there.

 

[TREETX]

Who is your supplier of choice for the coated SB??

 

[tjk]

1 error, its 3/8" not 5/16" I'm getting it from Alexander Equipment. JPS can post it for everyone. I find the performance of this cord is very high. Its not going to last as long as high heat cords but the cost is minimual.

 

[John Paul Sanborn]

Originally posted by tjk
jps, yes it has the coating I get about 30 climbing days out of it. I do take it off the rope every tree.

1 error, its 3/8" not 5/16" I'm getting it from Alexander Equipment. JPS can post it for everyone. I find the performance of this cord is very high. Its not going to last as long as high heat cords but the cost is minimual.

I got to Alexander for most of my regular climbing needs too, I work their both at trade shows on a trade basis.

The number I have for them is 603-663-1400. Ask for Jake or Liam (LEE-am).


Keep the weekend of Sept. 13 open for rock climbing and camping at Devils Lake. a bunch or arbors will be there.

I'll try to make it this year. I went up there last year on the climbing day, but it started to rain as soon as i got out of my truck

 

[Eric Kunik]

I do alot of climbing with 5/8" xtc some people think thats crazy but its easy for me to grip without gloves.