The "Not So Pro" discussion thread...of course Pros are welcome!

[catbuster]

They’re not too hard to run. If you can run your hoe and your skidder with any proficiency you’ll pick it up pretty quick. The problem with dozers is that their control patters are all over the place. Old Case dozers are weird, you steer between your legs. I’d just get good at what you have.

Is that a 6 or a real old 7? It says Cat on the side, and it’s definitely a Cat hood, just not sure on the model.

 

[northmanlogging]

It's a 6, 8u.

Been driving a couple modern cats recently with much simpler controls. But this ones not to bad, be better once the steer brake is hooked back up and the clutch issues sorted

Be real nice to have a hydrostatic drive and a hydraulic 6 way... but beggars etc

 

[rwoods]

...
Be real nice to have a hydrostatic drive and a hydraulic 6 way... but beggars etc

That day will come. And you will like it, except maybe when you have to sort out the electronics.

My dozer experience is very limited - just pushing and piling top soil and overburden, but the day I climbed in a Deere 700 with hydrostatics I won’t soon forget - wow the difference with both tracks churning while turning.

Ron

 

[catbuster]

I like hystats for finish work in smaller dozers like a 5 or a low track 6. They get hot real fast in a bigger dozer (John Deere, anyone?) when you’re hogging dirt slot dozing or dragging something heavy. Maybe it’s just because I learned on an 850 Case and powershift Cats. Not to mention the newer Cat cabs are just a nicer place to be than their competitors.

There’s something to be said for laying out your pushing and thinking several steps ahead when all you have is a dozer working. Admittedly, in the woods the Cats are more for dragging logs, unsticking stuff and building roads. There’s still something to be said for how a lot of people can run equipment but very few can operate.

 

[northmanlogging]

I like hystats for finish work in smaller dozers like a 5 or a low track 6. They get hot real fast in a bigger dozer (John Deere, anyone?) when you’re hogging dirt slot dozing or dragging something heavy. Maybe it’s just because I learned on an 850 Case and powershift Cats. Not to mention the newer Cat cabs are just a nicer place to be than their competitors.

There’s something to be said for laying out your pushing and thinking several steps ahead when all you have is a dozer working. Admittedly, in the woods the Cats are more for dragging logs, unsticking stuff and building roads. There’s still something to be said for how a lot of people can run equipment but very few can operate.

I hesitate to call myself and operator... I can run a bunch of different equipment, but whether I'm efficient is debatable, whether I know what the hell I'm supposed to be doing is also debatable... end of the day though, I can make a decent road and level a stump patch, and thats about all I need to do... for now...

In a pinch I could probably dig a foundation, and maybe even do some underground pipe work... but it wouldn't be fast or pretty

 

[catbuster]

Underground piping sucks. Cutting grades (critical for sewer/drainage), big rocks, existing stuff (ductile iron water that gets off kilter and loses the mechanical flange connection especially.)

Basements are hard to make money on... At least residential.

By the way, blue shale is hard.

 

[catbuster]

One other thing, I think I’ve about had it with Caterpillar’s excavators. I’ve been in 325/329s, 330/336s for years with the 345/349 (now 352) and they’ve been the backbone of any forestry and construction project but dammit man their new stuff is ugly and complicated. And, it’s getting really heavy compared to the competition.

They used to be the brute force choice, and back in the day of the C and D series they would eat other machines alive production digging and lift things other machines couldn’t even touch at the cost of fuel, but they don’t really do it anymore. Then the E series came about, and the F series, and they were okay. These new ones... I’ll be looking at Deere/Hitachi and Link-Belt, to lease next season.

Maybe I’m just a luddite.

 

[northmanlogging]

One other thing, I think I’ve about had it with Caterpillar’s excavators. I’ve been in 325/329s, 330/336s for years with the 345/349 (now 352) and they’ve been the backbone of any forestry and construction project but dammit man their new stuff is ugly and complicated. And, it’s getting really heavy compared to the competition.

They used to be the brute force choice, and back in the day of the C and D series they would eat other machines alive production digging and lift things other machines couldn’t even touch at the cost of fuel, but they don’t really do it anymore. Then the E series came about, and the F series, and they were okay. These new ones... I’ll be looking at Deere/Hitachi and Link-Belt, to lease next season.

Maybe I’m just a luddite.

I like my machines used. I'm not as concerned about paint, and some other sucker took the depreciation hit.

However, our lovely local Deere/hitachi Stealership, have lost all sense of reality and need to get donkey punched at a the sodomy rodeo.
$800.00 for cylinder packing kit for my excavator, just one cylinder (wut 7 O-rings and a couple spacers?)
$5000. for the starter in the skidder (NAPA had one for $180)
These are also the phallus heads that sent me a clutch plate instead of a pressure plate, charged $700 for it, and then wouldn't refund it when it was the wrong damn part.

Haven't had the pleasure of dealing with Cat, but the IHC/Case guys are pretty ok, New Holland, Kubota, etc all seem reasonable.

 

[RandyMac]

 

[Skeans]

I like my machines used. I'm not as concerned about paint, and some other sucker took the depreciation hit.

However, our lovely local Deere/hitachi Stealership, have lost all sense of reality and need to get donkey punched at a the sodomy rodeo.
$800.00 for cylinder packing kit for my excavator, just one cylinder (wut 7 O-rings and a couple spacers?)
$5000. for the starter in the skidder (NAPA had one for $180)
These are also the phallus heads that sent me a clutch plate instead of a pressure plate, charged $700 for it, and then wouldn't refund it when it was the wrong damn part.

Haven't had the pleasure of dealing with Cat, but the IHC/Case guys are pretty ok, New Holland, Kubota, etc all seem reasonable.

5k for a starter? You mean 500? The packing kits can be expensive yes same with other parts but they also have to make a cut after Deere does as well.


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[catbuster]

JD Parts are expensive in comparison to Cat/Case/Link-Belt here too.

I lease big equipment up in PA for nine months. It makes money and then doesn’t sit on my dime from December to February. I’d love to have PNW winters but in PA it just gets colder and colder and everything freezes up regardless of elevation. We can work year-round in KY and I hold on to gear there. Plowing snow isn’t lucrative enough to hold on to equipment, and getting it up to the sites where trucks can’t go is pretty much a waste of time.

 

[northmanlogging]

5k for a starter? You mean 500? The packing kits can be expensive yes same with other parts but they also have to make a cut after Deere does as well.


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Packing kits online or at any hydraulic shop average $100, And I mean 5k for a starter

I haven't bought parts from them since the clutch fiasco, 3 years ago

 

[Skeans]

Packing kits online or at any hydraulic shop average $100, And I mean 5k for a starter

I haven't bought parts from them since the clutch fiasco, 3 years ago

If it’s your steering cylinder the packing kit through Deere one is 55 the other is 80, the starter was 500. Some of the part guys can be interesting but the Deere parts site can be a great tool to have at your disposal.

https://partscatalog.deere.com/jdrc/navigation/equipment/79017

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[Skeans]

JD Parts are expensive in comparison to Cat/Case/Link-Belt here too.

I lease big equipment up in PA for nine months. It makes money and then doesn’t sit on my dime from December to February. I’d love to have PNW winters but in PA it just gets colder and colder and everything freezes up regardless of elevation. We can work year-round in KY and I hold on to gear there. Plowing snow isn’t lucrative enough to hold on to equipment, and getting it up to the sites where trucks can’t go is pretty much a waste of time.

We really saw prices of the Fabtek stuff go up after Cat bought out Blount it’s too bad they got a hold of some of those other companies now that equipment will no longer be available.


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[catbuster]

We really saw prices of the Fabtek stuff go up after Cat bought out Blount it’s too bad they got a hold of some of those other companies now that equipment will no longer be available.


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I know, I’m surprised Cat didn’t see an anti-trust lawsuit with the buyout of O&K/Terex mining, EMD, parts of Navistar, all the forestry purchases, MaK marine engines, etc back ~2012 when they bought all that stuff and started those joint ventures. It seems like it’s working out OK. A lot of the stuff they bought out was in trouble, so I’m not surprised they raised prices and cut some lines. Not that it makes anyone’s life easier, but I’m not surprised it happened.

 

[northmanlogging]

If it’s your steering cylinder the packing kit through Deere one is 55 the other is 80, the starter was 500. Some of the part guys can be interesting but the Deere parts site can be a great tool to have at your disposal.

https://partscatalog.deere.com/jdrc/navigation/equipment/79017

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unfortunately, they send me direct to my local dealer, I can not order Deere branded parts at deere.com without going through the local stealer, so it doesn't matter what your prices are, its a matter of what they think they should be.

I do use the online thing to look up common fail part #s then hand those off to my dude at NAPA, where he can usually get me a much much better price.

 

[northmanlogging]

I didn't even consider them for the skidder steer cylinder, I knew it was going to be expensive because the rod was scarred up, it was $700 to weld, grind and rechrome, I'm sure the Stealership would have charged at least double that, and taken a week longer.

 

[Skeans]

I didn't even consider them for the skidder steer cylinder, I knew it was going to be expensive because the rod was scarred up, it was $700 to weld, grind and rechrome, I'm sure the Stealership would have charged at least double that, and taken a week longer.

When we ran that Fabtek head it was 100% Deere cylinders I could get them cheaper through Deere then I could have them made. Seems like just the rod was 400 for that cylinder, moral of the story is they can surprise you from time to time.

Are you dealing with Pape? If so which location?


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[northmanlogging]

eh maybe, but when I mention 440a their eyes glaze over...

moral of the story is, they done burned this bridge, and I will happily spend my money elsewhere. Seems that they give deals to some of the more "established operators" but try and rob from the little guys, which is ******** anyway you look at it.

Ebay, and several other aftermarket parts houses have nearly anything I will ever need, including decals so they can have their cake, I'll have mine, and when I want a new machine (read when hell freezes over) I'll go somewhere, anywhere else.

Ironically I've gotten to run a Cat 320 over the last couple days, and other then being in pretty rough shape and wanting grease... I really like it. Offered the guy $5 dollars and a trade for my hitachi...

 

[catbuster]

eh maybe, but when I mention 440a their eyes glaze over...

moral of the story is, they done burned this bridge, and I will happily spend my money elsewhere. Seems that they give deals to some of the more "established operators" but try and rob from the little guys, which is ******** anyway you look at it.

Ironically I've gotten to run a Cat 320 over the last couple days, and other then being in pretty rough shape and wanting grease... I really like it. Offered the guy $5 dollars and a trade for my hitachi...

Whayne Cat is the same way. They don’t give a damn about the little guy.

If that 320 isn’t at least a B-2 model run the hell away. The C and D series are way better, and I’d much rather have an older Hitachi over an old Cat.