Tuning advanced friction hitches.

[SteveBullman]

i tried the knut but didnt like it as much as the v.t.
maybe i didnt give it enough of a chance though.

 

[jason j ladue]

i appreciate the tech speak, but i guess i have a hard time believing it could really make that much difference in the overall results of my work/make the job any easier. i am open-minded about adjusting my setup, but it seems doubtful that iwill ever switch from the blake's.(i'll stop talking for a second now while the laughter dies down. i can probly continue over the ridcule.)
i do wanna learn to foot lock. srt seems very interesting to me- the use of ascerders and such. is there any video out there or even a high-quality series of photos that might be of some instucional value

 

[SteveBullman]

jason, it really is worth giving the v.t a try as it does make life easier! honest!
and assuming you have a micro pulley somewhere in your kit its gonna cost you the measly sum of about $2 for a piece of 8mm cord. whatcha got to lose

 

[jason j ladue]

jason, it really is worth giving the v.t a try as it does make life easier! honest!
and assuming you have a micro pulley somewhere in your kit its gonna cost you the measly sum of about $2 for a piece of 8mm cord. whatcha got to lose

i know stephen. i will try the v.t. or the knut (i'm leaning toward the latter. i like the looks of it). in fact i have actually been practicing tying them both. just waiting for the right scenario to try them in. so who can tell me a little about the footlocking stuff. is that a valuable skill to posess? where can i learn more about it. i have read descriptions of the technique(s) involved, but i need a visual...

 

[Lumberjack]

Jason, I would recommend a pantin and not worry with FLing. Also check out the past threads on SRT, if needed I am sure me, Tom, and others will go through it again.

Today all I tried was a distel, 40".

Notes on 40" Distel on 5/16":
It doesnt take up slack nearly as easy as a VT, but its action is alot shorter than the VT. I like it on my lanyard.

I didnt get much a chance to test it today, the work I did didnt take much climing.

Testing will continue Might do a little testing tomorrow afternoon if I feel like it.

 

[SteveBullman]

here ya go jason, check out these vids... hope you have cable

http://translate.google.com/transla...e|en&hl=en&ie=ISO-8859-1&prev=/language_tools

 

[KentuckySawyer]

I personally prefer footlocking to the use of gizmos. I had the FLing technique down long before someone let me borrow their pantin. I used it for the first 10 ft then took it off to footlock the other 40. To each his own.

I did switch from the Blake's to the Distel hitch and love it. What are the benefits of the VT hitch? Does it not bind up? What does VT stand for?

 

[SteveBullman]

vt stands for valdotain.
i used the knut but didnt find it anywhere near as good as the vt. ive never once had the vt lock on me or slip. people like other knots like the disteland knut over the vt for these reasons i think.......and i personally think that those who prefer the knut and distel over the vt probably just havent struck on a perfect hitch/cord combination. i was quite lucky i think, on my second cord i purchased worked perfect.
thats just my theory though

 

[Lumberjack]

The only downside I have found to the Distel is it is much harder to advance than the VT. However its short action makes it a natural for my lanyard.

 

[jason j ladue]

thanks bullman! those are some inspiring video...

 

[jamie]

distels

tried a 4/1 distel tied with 9mm tenex on some xtc and arbormaster, was nice at first but its been getting progressivly stickier especially in the wet. when i retie the hitch it gets better but then reterns to its sticky state.

i dont know if i have decended to quickly a few times and fried the hitch.

i have noticed it more when the rope is fully loaded.

any thoughts?


jamie

 

[SteveBullman]

maybe its the tenex jamie. i tried that stuff when i first started using the v.t and although i liked it i found it acted just as you described, specially when it got a little wet. get down to your local marine supplier and buy some marlow 8mm poly double braid. works a treat and its a tenth the price of tenex

 

[Kneejerk Bombas]

What people fail to understand is the VT is not just a different hitch. It is a complete system.

1. First you open your rope bag, and inside is your rope flaked in, from the tail up to the working end. At that end there is a rope snap, tied with a double fisherman's knot or girth hitched to a spliced eye. About six feet from the end is a carabiner, a fair lead, and the VT already tied.
The advantages are the rope was not coiled, you won't get twisting as you descend, and the system is ready to go.

2. Reach into the bag and clip the carabiner to your saddle. What you now have is a duplicate to your lanyard.
As you ascend the tree, you can alternate between the lanyard and climbing line, so you are always secured.

3. Once you are at the top, install the cambium saver and start working down.
If you need to go back up, you now have several options. Say you are 3/4 of the way down and you need to go back up, just have your ground man pull on the tail of your rope as you scoot up the tree. The fair lead will push the hitch up as you go. If you fall, it will lock off immediately.
Say your ground man is busy and you want to go back up twenty feet, tie a knot in your tail and clip your saw on. Now just climb up the saw will pull the slack. If you get to a point where you cant climb back up because there aren't any limbs, just grab the rope above your hitch and pull.
Another method is to just foot lock the tail of the climbing rope, the hitch advances itself.
4. You're on the ground. Leave the hitch in place on your saddle, disconnect the snap and install cambium saver removal device(s). Now bend over your rope bag, which now contains whatever rope you didn't pull out during the climb, and start going hand over hand putting the rope back in the bag.
The rope will be tailing through your fair lead and hitch.
Once it's all flaked back in, about twenty seconds, reattach the rope snap and close up the bag, it's ready for the next climb.

 

[Stumper]

Mike, That is almost perfect but since leaving a knot in a rope for long periods is known to induce "set" in the outer fibers of the bends that can then cause a loss of strength when untied and retied (the act of which may place those fibers at different locations), and since some climbers do not climb on any regular basis, it is better to leave the snap or 'biner loose and attach it at the beginning of each climb.

 

[Kneejerk Bombas]

I wouldn't worry too much about that, because the knot is only tied hand tight, it really doesn't get snug until you put your weight on it.
But hey, it makes no difference to me, other than you might forget to attach it before going up and then have to attach it while your standing in the tree, or worse yet, have your rope pull out and fall to the ground.

 

[NickfromWI]

The crystalyne is a double braid with a vectran core. Super strong, yes, but you still have a cover of polyester, so you can't burn on it more than once!

Similar to ultratech in the sense that you're paying a lot of money for cordage that will never touch your climbing line.

love
nick

 

[jamie]

ok

mike thats how my system lives, always tied, i should undo the knots but well i cant be arsed really, keep a check on them....flame me please.

was going to try the adline proclimber stock, but i will get round to that.

will get to a sailing shop and see what they have.

what the specs for rope used at work? does it just have to be rated to a certain strength? does it have to conform to BS / EN standards for strength or for purpose?

i really cant remember the fine print, i know what i climb conforms though.

jamie

 

[Lumberjack]

Time for an update.

What I have found, cut and dried.

The distel belongs on the lanyard.
The VT belongs on the climbing line.

I am going to play with making the VT as short as possible, however I dont think that rocky's 4:1 VT will be well suited.

The only drawback to the VT is its difference in length from collapsed to loaded means you loose some progress. I am going to find a way to minimize that.

The ditzel is much harder to advance but its action is much shorter. Also it can lock up and be a PITA as compared to the VT.

 

[Kneejerk Bombas]

Here's a vt movie.

 

[begleytree]

The ditzel is much harder to advance but its action is much shorter. Also it can lock up and be a PITA as compared to the VT.

Lumberjack, trade that distel on your lanyard for a schwabish and see what you think. I dropped the distel for the same reason on my lanyard.

-Ralph