check out MSNBC undercover HOMEWRECKERS program. A very interesting look at low quality and crooked contracters. I watched through the eyes of a tree care company owner and how I do buisness. One pair of "tree climbers" got busted showing up for work unlicensed, uninsured, stoned and they even brought some pot with them. How would a task force like this impact your world? I deal with the guys who know nothing about tree work but still do it, guys who claim to know about tree work but don't and even some folks who appear legit (even certified!) but will do questionable work nonetheless. Watch it if you get the chance.
unethical contractors
- Thread starter zeke
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Happening everywhere, we all complain about this!! Homeowners get what they deserve this might be cruel but c`mon, they want the lowest price, dont care about what the men get paid, most dont care about cert`s & in some cases dont even check for insurance!!
right now xmas is upon us & Homeowners want cheap!!!! so they can by another game sys., ipod, big tv, cell phone, etc.. in my area the guys with the pickup trucks & saws are making a killing!!! I got a few calls over the weekend from HO`s who had guys like this take their trees down & leave all the debris & now they want me to bid for cleanup!!
limbs criss crossed, broken spears embedded in the ground, a complete mess!! no reputable company will give em the price they are looking for, when I ask why did you have it done this way, same reply...it was cheaper!!
they have their buddies come in cut up the firewood & leave all else, looks like a logging operation in their front yard!! they think the cleanup is cheaper when done like this!!
gotta love it, "I thought it would only be a $100 or so" my reply; Maam it will cost me $100 in fuel!! you cant RENT the equip to do for that, call the hacks that left this mess being they told you such & have them do it for $100 have a merry xmas!! what about this mess? put some lights on it!! happy holidays maam!
LXT...........
right now xmas is upon us & Homeowners want cheap!!!! so they can by another game sys., ipod, big tv, cell phone, etc.. in my area the guys with the pickup trucks & saws are making a killing!!! I got a few calls over the weekend from HO`s who had guys like this take their trees down & leave all the debris & now they want me to bid for cleanup!!
limbs criss crossed, broken spears embedded in the ground, a complete mess!! no reputable company will give em the price they are looking for, when I ask why did you have it done this way, same reply...it was cheaper!!
they have their buddies come in cut up the firewood & leave all else, looks like a logging operation in their front yard!! they think the cleanup is cheaper when done like this!!
gotta love it, "I thought it would only be a $100 or so" my reply; Maam it will cost me $100 in fuel!! you cant RENT the equip to do for that, call the hacks that left this mess being they told you such & have them do it for $100 have a merry xmas!! what about this mess? put some lights on it!! happy holidays maam!
LXT...........
hornett22
Addicted to ArboristSite
LXT, i like your style.
they have really gotten cheap around here.i don't know if i can keep doing this.hopefully the low ballers go out of business soon.
i had one guy annoyed because i wouldn't knock $200 off if he gave me cash instead of a check.i told him i doesn't cost me $200 to drive to the bank.then after we did the job he tried it again.i even saved his stupid evergreen bushes under the tree which i told him would probably not make it.what an ******.
they have really gotten cheap around here.i don't know if i can keep doing this.hopefully the low ballers go out of business soon.
i had one guy annoyed because i wouldn't knock $200 off if he gave me cash instead of a check.i told him i doesn't cost me $200 to drive to the bank.then after we did the job he tried it again.i even saved his stupid evergreen bushes under the tree which i told him would probably not make it.what an ******.
mckeetree
Addicted to ArboristSite
I just lost another bid to a pack of renegade illegal aliens that are running loose here. They did the job with axes. Who is going to step up and stop this crap? That is who I will vote for.
reachtreeservi
Addicted to ArboristSite
I lost a job to another " tree company "
Drove by the address the next day and see 3 illegals with a pickup full of cut up two by fours . They were nailing them for steps up the side of the tree!!!
I had to stay and watch, I was mesmerized. I'd never seen anything like this.
They got to the top, crawled out on the limbs, leg locked them and started cutting. No saddles, ropes, no nothing !
They cut about 4 fairly large limbs and then stuck the saw. It was a small homelite. They didn't have a backup saw so they called it a day.
I almost :censored: myself sitting in my truck across the street.
I wanted to go back the next day , but I haven't found the time yet.
Drove by the address the next day and see 3 illegals with a pickup full of cut up two by fours . They were nailing them for steps up the side of the tree!!!
I had to stay and watch, I was mesmerized. I'd never seen anything like this.
They got to the top, crawled out on the limbs, leg locked them and started cutting. No saddles, ropes, no nothing !
They cut about 4 fairly large limbs and then stuck the saw. It was a small homelite. They didn't have a backup saw so they called it a day.
I almost :censored: myself sitting in my truck across the street.
I wanted to go back the next day , but I haven't found the time yet.
I try to stop and watch any tree work I can, I like to know who is doing what so that I have actual knowledge of a companies quality. I have seen branches ripped off instead of cut, spiking live trees, misunderstood DC pruning which of course just becomes topping and the homeowner picking up branches below the bucket operator and behind the chipper while the work was still being done and this is by a CA. (And all on the same job) I have seen a crew with an open bucket, no safety gear and allowing a 12 yr old kid to fly the bucket on the job site, and you should have seen the actual work. I try very hard to keep my company above this type of client, if someone wants the cheap o, they know right off that isn't't me. I do not mind competition, as long as we are all working within the same parameters. Watching these guys gave me a great line, "Do you want your tree company to be lucky, or good?" I hope all who are striving for the best succeed and slowly we can educate the public as to what is the good, the bad and the ugly in tree care. Climb safe.
reachtreeservi
Addicted to ArboristSite
Great tag line : "Do you want your tree company to be lucky, or good?"
Do you feel lucky today punk ? ..... Well do you ?
Canyonbc
Addicted to ArboristSite
Well something i have learned...and i hope it holds true, i think it will....i have learned most of it from this site.
The legit companies which i think most if not all of us strive to be....will last and the others of stories that you guys are talking about.
Sad on many levels.
People get hurt.
Trees get hurt/killed.
And more.
To do the job right, be safe, be legit, cost money alot of money.
The legit companies which i think most if not all of us strive to be....will last and the others of stories that you guys are talking about.
Sad on many levels.
People get hurt.
Trees get hurt/killed.
And more.
To do the job right, be safe, be legit, cost money alot of money.
MS TreeMonkey
ArboristSite Member
Sorry you lost the job, but that painted a hilarious picture!!!:hmm3grin2orange:
Canyonbc
Addicted to ArboristSite
Sadly...i have seen way to much of it growing up in San Diego...and even now in Northern California.
reachtreeservi
Addicted to ArboristSite
canyonbc, do you mind if I quote you in my sig line? Truer words were never spoken !
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Canyonbc
Addicted to ArboristSite
Ya that is competely fine with me.
Sunrise Guy
Addicted to ArboristSite
Wow! I like that 2x4 idea! I'm going to HD right now to buy me a mess of 'em---LOL!
LOL, I saw similar over the summer, a local contractor that I gave a bid to felt others & I were too high!! so his Illegals throw up the ladders, tennis shoes & a trusty poulan & begin the dismantling process!!
house drops on the ground after the first cut, 13.2 kv making wonderful sounds!! utility clears the services for em, they continue this job took 3 months & was the joke among us local services, they dug out the stump with a backhoe(large s. maple) the guy had a moat in his front yard when done.
are illegals paid this cheap that my price was still higher after taking them 3 months? not to mention they were approached by neighbors wanting bids!! go figure!! this is the very reason I often think about another line of work, I love my job, business & men but competing with this is impossible if you wish to run legit!! The Tree business is becoming many`s playing field, many who know nothing that is!! Its driving the wages down to a point of not being worth it, not everywhere but its coming!!!
LXT...............
house drops on the ground after the first cut, 13.2 kv making wonderful sounds!! utility clears the services for em, they continue this job took 3 months & was the joke among us local services, they dug out the stump with a backhoe(large s. maple) the guy had a moat in his front yard when done.
are illegals paid this cheap that my price was still higher after taking them 3 months? not to mention they were approached by neighbors wanting bids!! go figure!! this is the very reason I often think about another line of work, I love my job, business & men but competing with this is impossible if you wish to run legit!! The Tree business is becoming many`s playing field, many who know nothing that is!! Its driving the wages down to a point of not being worth it, not everywhere but its coming!!!
LXT...............
ASD
Addicted to ArboristSite
dam i should tell our guys to slooooow down we show up at 8am and gone by 330 pm maybe if we took a week to do a 1 day job we would get More bis 
LOL 
LOL Canyonbc
Addicted to ArboristSite
Canyonbc
Addicted to ArboristSite
Wait one more...that i fine to hold very true.
"You get what you pay for"
LXT your story proves that to hold true.
"You get what you pay for"
LXT your story proves that to hold true.
treeman82
Addicted to ArboristSite
I've spent my day building holiday cards for the good customers I have... when I was almost finished an associate of mine calls. He's got little - no insurance, but is busy working at an apartment complex. Needed some info on a few "big austrian" pines. I'm not into doing commercial work, but at least I have proper coverage if I ever wanted to.
Now as far as money goes... I gave a price to some people up the street that I cut the grass for... about 25 or so red maples... good sized trees. They MAY want to take down a 30"+ DBH elm too. Chips and wood stay, but it's a LOT of work, seeing as how they want the chips spread out, and the logs cut up. I told them $7,000 with the stump grinding. They got another price of $3,000 supposedly. $1500 per day for a crew of 8? truck / chipper / etc. Really can't do much when somebody is coming in for that.
Did a job this spring, gave a price of $5,000 for 3 silver maples. Guy had another price of $3,000 supposedly... it was a referral from a happy customer, and I needed the work. Did the job, but what a mistake.
A local lumber yard went out of business this spring. They had about 5 locations, all went out or were sold. The owner was interviewed for an article while the process of cleaning house was going on... he said that he didn't blame Lowes or Home Depot for the fact that his stores couldn't do it anymore. He said that the problem is the consumer... that they'll go to Home Depot or Lowes for thousands of dollars in wood, cabinets, or other supplies... but when they forget some stupid little part... they'll come to him rather than go back to the big store.
I'd given a price to a guy last year down county for a whole bunch of trees... a BIG tulip, a few walnuts, ash, spruce, and a maple or two. Everything went, stumps stayed. Told the guy $12,000... a good price. I drove by a few weeks ago, the trees are still there. If I had offered to do it for $5,000 MAYBE I would have got the job.
Now as far as money goes... I gave a price to some people up the street that I cut the grass for... about 25 or so red maples... good sized trees. They MAY want to take down a 30"+ DBH elm too. Chips and wood stay, but it's a LOT of work, seeing as how they want the chips spread out, and the logs cut up. I told them $7,000 with the stump grinding. They got another price of $3,000 supposedly. $1500 per day for a crew of 8? truck / chipper / etc. Really can't do much when somebody is coming in for that.
Did a job this spring, gave a price of $5,000 for 3 silver maples. Guy had another price of $3,000 supposedly... it was a referral from a happy customer, and I needed the work. Did the job, but what a mistake.
A local lumber yard went out of business this spring. They had about 5 locations, all went out or were sold. The owner was interviewed for an article while the process of cleaning house was going on... he said that he didn't blame Lowes or Home Depot for the fact that his stores couldn't do it anymore. He said that the problem is the consumer... that they'll go to Home Depot or Lowes for thousands of dollars in wood, cabinets, or other supplies... but when they forget some stupid little part... they'll come to him rather than go back to the big store.
I'd given a price to a guy last year down county for a whole bunch of trees... a BIG tulip, a few walnuts, ash, spruce, and a maple or two. Everything went, stumps stayed. Told the guy $12,000... a good price. I drove by a few weeks ago, the trees are still there. If I had offered to do it for $5,000 MAYBE I would have got the job.
This happens all the time. The only good thing is that even though we do quality insured, etc etc work we still get the business we need to keep going.
My biggest problem is not having a crane, I will always get underbid on removals by someone else with a crane and a lot of grunt workers. sling it, cut it, dump it, and watch the ground workers, 8 and hour clean it up.
You just have to keep humping along doing as many estimates as you can to stay in the game. Luckily I am booked solid through February at this point. Good word of mouth goes a long way.
Stay sharp.....
My biggest problem is not having a crane, I will always get underbid on removals by someone else with a crane and a lot of grunt workers. sling it, cut it, dump it, and watch the ground workers, 8 and hour clean it up.
You just have to keep humping along doing as many estimates as you can to stay in the game. Luckily I am booked solid through February at this point. Good word of mouth goes a long way.
Stay sharp.....
fireman
ArboristSite Operative
Lxt you are right it is almost impossible to compete with the illegals.the homeowners could care less as long as the tree is down.I went out to bid a clear cut told the customer $3000 an acre which was dense with under brush min tree was 24inc diam he said i was way over he had bid for $1500.00 an acre.told acrage was 5.I thought I was ceap at 3.I bid a 70ft red oak by power lines complete removal for 1200 told me i was crazy had bid for 300 hundred.I asked if the company was insured and that he was liable if anything happened to the lines and the tree guy if he didnt have insurance couldnt care less.That is what we are dealing with if anyone is legit insurance work comp equipment cost of fuel there is no way these guys r legit.keep strong do good work and word of mouth is stronger than advertising stay safe.
