Using a Pole Saw In The Tree?

[UrbanLogger]

I work for a reputable tree service in S.E. Wisconsin, and quite a number of my coworkers like to use a pole saw while they are climbing (for pruning). I can’t stand it – the owner even harps on me for not using them. They (my coworkers) are always making horrible cuts, leaving stubs, or causing tears when the branches fall, plus they have no control over the descent of the cut piece. They argue that a tree service can’t be productive, or profitable with out them - that there IS NO WAY to be efficent with out using a pole saw. I prefer to climb/limb walk to make my cuts (which are 99.9% better than their pole saw cuts), and I seem to do so in no more time than they take to use a pole saw. What’s your opinion?

I know that there will always be that one cut you just can’t get to, that you need a pole saw for, but to use one for 75% of your cuts…that’s just lazy, poor quality IMO. I know a few guys from other tree services that aren’t allowed to use pole saws in the tree unless they NEED one.

 

[tomtrees58]

that's part of the biz wen your 100+ feet up over power lines you will love them to tom treesopcorn:

 

[treeseer]

Depends on the tree. I like climbing and using a handsaw but I also like reaching with a pole. Do your crewmates use a pole pruner too?

see attached from June ArbNews for 1 view; waiting on pdf

 

[UrbanLogger]

They don't use pole pruners that often.
What they usually do is use a 28' extension ladder to access the canopy, use their pole saw to advance their climbing line into the tree (as often as needed to reach the desired tie in point) then hang in the center of the area they are pruning, and proceed to use their pole saw to make all of their cuts outside of an arms reach away, then move on to the next area. In the case of multiple climbers in a tree, if I am climbing with one of then I can cover the same amount of ground in the same time, as it takes them to use a pole saw. One half of the tree has nice professional cuts, and the other looks like the homeowner was up their on a ladder hacking away. Some of then might as well not even take a hand saw with them, that’s how much they rely on a pole saw.

 

[John Paul Sanborn]

Sounds like your style and level of professionalism does not coincide with your employers. If he does not mind a bunch of stubs and tears then you need to find a different place to work.

Who do you work for?

 

[treeseer]

They don't use pole pruners that often.
What they usually do is use a 28' extension ladder to access the canopy, use their pole saw to advance their climbing line into the tree (as often as needed to reach the desired tie in point) then hang in the center of the area they are pruning, and proceed to use their pole saw to make all of their cuts outside of an arms reach away, then move on to the next area. In the case of multiple climbers in a tree, if I am climbing with one of then I can cover the same amount of ground in the same time, as it takes them to use a pole saw. One half of the tree has nice professional cuts, and the other looks like the homeowner was up their on a ladder hacking away. Some of then might as well not even take a hand saw with them, that’s how much they rely on a pole saw.

Well that sounds like my default oldschool access style, but imo there's no excuse not to swing around and limbwalk and get good upclose access if you can, and use a pole when you can't.

Best reason to use poles is to reach smaller cuts in the right place instead of taking too much off. Best reason not to is to learn to climb well, without the pole as a crutch.

It depends on the tree--getting stuck in one way of pruning with one tool makes no sense. Here's the pdf fwiw. Keeping the scabbard clipped to the saddle works nice.

 

[JeffL]

Yeah, thats going a bit far. I'll use it up at the tops where there isnt anything sizeable to walk on or stand on. Or out on the ends of limbs that I dont trust will support my weight. We've all caught hell for poor cuts, be it handsaw, polesaw, chainsaw, mostly due to inexperience mostly in my personal case, but now every cut is a conscious effort, has been for awhile.

Another name I've heard them called is "chicken sticks", for the guys afraid to do some limb walking.

:greenchainsaw:

 

[tree MDS]

You still need a pole - ya just gotta know how too use it. Especially in pruning big trees.

 

[Tree Machine]

I work for a reputable tree service in S.E. Wisconsin, and quite a number of my coworkers like to use a pole saw while they are climbing (for pruning). I can’t stand it – the owner even harps on me for not using them. They (my coworkers) are always making horrible cuts, leaving stubs, or causing tears when the branches fall, plus they have no control over the descent of the cut piece. They argue that a tree service can’t be productive, or profitable with out them - that there IS NO WAY to be efficent with out using a pole saw. I prefer to climb/limb walk to make my cuts (which are 99.9% better than their pole saw cuts), and I seem to do so in no more time than they take to use a pole saw. What’s your opinion?

I'm definitely with you for all the reasons listed, including that the motions needed to use a pole saw are quick to fatigue you. In the time it takes to make a cut with a pole saw, a decent climber can usually get to the point and be in better position to get to other nearby cuts with the hand saw. Face it, we use pole tools to reach places we can't, or don't want to go. The longer the extension, the more difficult the cut, point blank.

I like using the pole saw while on the ground to cut off dead stubs on pines or hemlocks, where I have to weigh the time spent gearing up for the climb against just grabbing the pole saw. Almost always, though I feel I could have done it faster climbing, and I can't pole saw higher than the limited reach of the saw. On live limbs, it is so easy and common to get an underside peel. Doing an underside kerf or notch is difficult at best, usually futile. I do try to use the pole saw wherever I think it will make life easier, but it's so easy to create substandard cuts. I have a Hayate, a Hyuachi, both exceptional pole saws, but the more I use them, the less I want to use them. They DO have their place, and I do rely on them but I have to say, that place is not up in the tree.

Have you tried making cuts on branches less than two inches in diameter that are not right up against the trunk? Like stuff out over power lines? Or stuff pointing directly away from you or to a 30 degree arc either side of that? You can't cut stuff that moves when you try to saw it. A pole saw's use is very limiting. If you can't climb out to that stuff, the only other alternative is a pole pruner, and climb to everything else bigger. A powerful bull lopper (2" jaw capacity) will do tips, smaller deadwood, and reset ropes with ease. I want the pole saw to be that tool of desire, I really want it to work, but it tends to make work more work than it needs to be and unless you're directly 90 degrees to the desired optimum cut angle, you will leave weird angled stubs every time. That's not an opinion. Some climbers just don't care. We don't live in an ideal world.

The best you can do is take a stand and do your best work. Don't lower your standards to the low standards of a company or you may fall into the 'good enough' mindset where it's about a paycheck, not caring for trees. That'll assure you weak paychecks and dissatisfied customers. Bright future, mmmmm. Lead by good example and prove yourself through productivity and quality.

You're destined to be your own boss. Keep you standards high, don't pick up bad work habits from the don'tgivvafuchs. Quality-driven climbers may be the minority, we need you.

 

[jomoco]

Well that sounds like my default oldschool access style, but imo there's no excuse not to swing around and limbwalk and get good upclose access if you can, and use a pole when you can't.

Best reason to use poles is to reach smaller cuts in the right place instead of taking too much off. Best reason not to is to learn to climb well, without the pole as a crutch.

It depends on the tree--getting stuck in one way of pruning with one tool makes no sense. Here's the pdf fwiw. Keeping the scabbard clipped to the saddle works nice.

+1 Treeseer

I took tremendous pride in never needing or using a friggin polesaw for a decade before I climbed down off my high horse and admitted that certain species and situations call for them.

And I do know one particular climbing cert arb that does ultra fine class 1 work with them almost exclusively for big buck high end clients in La Jolla.

This guy changes his pole saw blade twice a day!

Has arms like arnie and drives a flawless black mercedes 500 sedan to give his estimates.

I have a complete set of polesaw, pruner and extensions rusting in my truck, but I do use them once in a blue moon. I like getting righ on top of my work with a razor sharp handsaw to this very day.

jomoco

 

[treeseer]

Good old Racine--St. Cat's HS was a great place to be in the mid-60's; those nuns worked our minds and it was good!

motions needed to use a pole saw are quick to fatigue you.

TM I can't believe you're saying this, knowing your strength. I'll chalk your fatigue up to poor ergonomics and lack of using those muscle groups. The rest of your post ain't bad but I think the tree'd rather try to seal a 4 2" rips than one 5" collar cut.

Uh oh now Murph is gonna launch; I'm runnin for cover....

 

[ATH]

......I think the tree'd rather try to seal a 4 2" rips than one 5" collar cut.....

let's just assume the 2" diameter branches only tear one inch - so that makes 4 cuts at 2"x3" (6sq inches each) for a total of 24 square inches of exposed wood. A 5" circle has 19.6 square inches of exposed wood -- and that says nothing for the physiology of how a tree heals.

I'm not saying I don't use a pole saw in the tree, but I try hard not to bring it up. I also recognize that once it is up there, I get lazy and start using it on branches I'd easily climb out to if the pole was on the ground...

My bottom line: it has its place in the tree, but if I had to put a number on it, I'd say less than 10% of all cuts in any given week of climbing.

I get the most use out of my pole saw on the ground for trees "too small" to climb (as in it is not worth getting geared up, etc... to cut 5 branches), but too big to reach from the ground. MUCH better control of the saw and the quality of cut when I can start it at one point, move to the other side to finish it, then make a final cut to remove the stub. It still leaves more tears than I'd like.. Maybe 1 in 15 of the cuts made have some minor tears while 1 in 50 has what I call an ugly tear. I have not had an "unacceptable" tear from the pole saw yet - maybe that is because I am more cautious and hesitant to make those boarderline cuts with the pole.

 

[PurdueJoe]

I've worked for bosses on both sides of this debate. The side against said that if you need a pole saw instead of climbing to cut it then its so small its not worth cutting. The side for said that all that climbing was a waste of time when you can stay in one spot and make all the same cuts. Granted the boss who hated pole saws was in his 30's and the other was in his 50's so I have a feeling I will like them a lot more once I gain some years too.

 

[Tree Machine]

those nuns worked our minds and it was good!

TM I can't believe you're saying this, knowing your strength. I'll chalk your fatigue up to poor ergonomics and lack of using those muscle groups.

Nuns working your minds? I'd like to see a picture of that!

 

[Tree Machine]

Couldn't resist.

 

[TreeTopKid]

Yeah, thats going a bit far. I'll use it up at the tops where there isnt anything sizeable to walk on or stand on. Or out on the ends of limbs that I dont trust will support my weight. We've all caught hell for poor cuts, be it handsaw, polesaw, chainsaw, mostly due to inexperience mostly in my personal case, but now every cut is a conscious effort, has been for awhile.

Another name I've heard them called is "chicken sticks", for the guys afraid to do some limb walking.

:greenchainsaw:

Good name for my colleagues pole saw!

 

[TreeTopKid]

Nuns working your minds? I'd like to see a picture of that!

I love working for nuns! Where was this taken? Reminds of Poor Clares.

 

[jomoco]

Good name for my colleagues pole saw!

Cinched nylon loops of varying sizes can make for awful handy stirrups to place your foot into, to get that impossible branch.

Dual TIP's/redirects are way cool too, to access the seemingly impossible.

jomoco

 

[jomoco]

Love those climbing shoes!

jomoco

 

[Tree Machine]

The story on that picture resides in a thread here at Arboristsite, from like 5 years ago. It was a food thread. Search keyword 'curry' 'God' or 'holy crap!"

Now back to pole saws.