Why did my splitter puke oil??????

[sundance]

Don't forget it has to cycle through the cylinder as well. Still a short trip though.

Doesn't go through the cylinder unless you operate the lever. Also doesn't cycle through the cylinder, either goes in or goes out.

 

[lknchoppers]

Funny how when you loan somebody something it never comes back the same. I stopped loaning my stuff out long ago. I will help them and use my equipment now.

 

[Wood Doctor]

Milky oil means water in the oil. Doesn't take much water

In addition, the combination of air and/or water contaminating the hydraulic oil will reduce the force that the cylinder piston can exert on the log. I've seen studies showing that a couple of quarts of such contamination in a 4-gallon system can cost you three or more tons of force and slow down the cycle as well.

 

[JeffHK454]

An air leak in the suction side of the pump will cause the fluid to all most immediately foam and erupt from the tank vent. I had it happen, it looked like a 2 liter bottle of root beer erupting that had been shaken before opening.
After cleaning up the mess on the splitter and driveway. I tightened the hose clamps on the suction hose and the foaming stopped.

Yep..been here myself.

 

[Wood Doctor]

Yep..been here myself.

Question here is simply, "Will tightening that hose clamp solve all the problems already caused by the air leak to the system?"

I doubt it. Several engineers have told me that the filter (if any) has to be replaced and it's also best to completely change out all of the hydraulic oil. Otherwise, this splitter will never reach its rated tonnage force or cycle time. What says the forum?

 

[JeffHK454]

Question here is simply, "Will tightening that hose clamp solve all the problems already caused by the air leak to the system?"

I doubt it. Several engineers have told me that the filter (if any) has to be replaced and it's also best to completely change out all of the hydraulic oil. Otherwise, this splitter will never reach its rated tonnage force or cycle time. What says the forum?

You lost me at "engineers"

A system can recover from aeration without replacing oil ..the damage that aeration can do to pumps might force you to change the fluid though.

 

[cantoo]

Wood Doctor, the oil will eventually settle down no need to change anything when air is the only issue. Now if it's water then you will have to change everything out including filter.

 

[ChoppyChoppy]

Funny how when you loan somebody something it never comes back the same. I stopped loaning my stuff out long ago. I will help them and use my equipment now.

Usually when I loan stuff out it comes back full of fuel, washed, and stuff that was "meh, I'll fix it one day" fixed.

 

[NSMaple1]

I ran a tree digger for 30 years down washboard gravel and dirt roads day in and day out. Not once did the 150+ gallons of oil foam up dew to agitation.
No way it should foam dew to agitation from driving down a bumpy road. Not gonna happen. So scratch that off the list.

I could see it happen, depending on how it is vented, for one. Mine has a standpipe, with a dipstick on a cap, and a vent hole thingie in the cap. I could see oil sloshing up & down in the standpipe, moving air in & out of the vent as it does it. And mixing it with the oil.

Curious on what we find out here - if we do hear back on a cause.

 

[sb47]

I could see it happen, depending on how it is vented, for one. Mine has a standpipe, with a dipstick on a cap, and a vent hole thingie in the cap. I could see oil sloshing up & down in the standpipe, moving air in & out of the vent as it does it. And mixing it with the oil.

Curious on what we find out here - if we do hear back on a cause.

The vent tube/hole should have nothing to do with air foaming up the oil. Hydraulic machines have been running around on rough roads for decades with no issues of foaming oil. A tree digger has 14 hydraulic cylinders that operate the machine. Thats a lot of cylinders and a lot of oil, never once did I ever have a oil foaming issue or a water in oil issue. This is down south in an environment thats is very high in humidity. 90% or higher in the summer. Most of the time you could dig a tree in less then 5 min, so run times were low. Still other times in drought conditions, I spent 2 hours trying to hammer out a tree, where the heat was 100+ and I ran the hydraulic's for hours. No heat issues ether. The oil tank is built into the 500 gallon water tank that we used for lubrication on the spades when digging trees. The water tank kept the oil tank cool until I ran low on water. But no foaming issues what so ever.

 

[Wood Doctor]

You lost me at "engineers"

A system can recover from aeration without replacing oil ..the damage that aeration can do to pumps might force you to change the fluid though.

I assumed water contamination or something else besides just air. That assumption might have been too powerful. If the foaming goes away and splitting power and cycle time resumes to normal, I'd leave it alone.

 

[Greaser007]

Well Guys, _ _ _ my splitter began pushing hydraulic fluid out of my tank vent yesterday ! Omg
And I found this thread just this evening. No water in my fluid, and have been checking my levels often. I am running a Predator 6.5hp engine with single-stage pump rated for "I think" 10-horse. But, I have successfully split 14-chords of Gray Pine ( digger pine ). It has been working good, but if I get a hard piece of wood it will sometimes stall the engine. The feel of the control began getting "spongy" as if it was taking time to build pressure, and then boom, the piece of wood would Pop and split, and jump forward with force. but not the ram, as it was steady. Hmm
Question:
I don't know how to properly check the inlet hose for an Air-Leak. Nor is the inlet hose or fittings dripping
And I am not so sure of if I may have a faulty control valve causing the oil to get aeriated and belch out the hyd fluid tank.
Note, the fluid was creamy looking from being aeriated ( I suspect ). In the mornings the fluid is clear after settling over-night.
When I stopped the engine and then worked the control, it hissed as if I could hear fluid passing through under pressure.
Would this be caused somehow by heat or just the air ?
thanks,
Len
P.S.
I am new here, but found this site a few years back, when servicing my Husky 2100 CD chainsaw, and the information I learned here in the forums was Most Helpful. ha _ _ _ so I joined last week. I have owned this 2100 since 1984, and used it just last week for some large (in my book) 36-inch Digger Pine butts. Tough stuff wow, but when the chain is sharp, that 2100 pulls wood, and feels Good.

 

[lknchoppers]

If you have a filter maybe it's getting clogged.

 

[Greaser007]

lnkchoppers:
I do have a spin-on inline filter on the return-line.
If the filter is clogged would that be enough to cause the "aeration" without seeping out around the filter gasket ?

thanks for the suggestion too !

I will attach a photo later today too showing the setup.

 

[lknchoppers]

lnkchoppers:
I do have a spin-on inline filter on the return-line.
If the filter is clogged would that be enough to cause the "aeration" without seeping out around the filter gasket ?

thanks for the suggestion too !

I will attach a photo later today too showing the setup.

I'm not sure but a spin on filter should be an easy thing to try.

 

[kevin j]

could be a suction line leak inside the tank if the suction hose goes into a pipe from the top of the tank or could be the pump shaft seal sucking air.

 

[Greaser007]

If the photos load here are a couple of shots of the splitter, and the spin-on filter is just off of the control valve on the return line.
A friend of mine who retired from 35-years with John Deere suggested the Control Valve being worn, which may allow fluid to go more that one direction. hmm
Nor have I ever had a control apart.

The photo of that big tree-digger is inspiring for digging up Olive trees.

 

[lknchoppers]

I like your splitter. Cool homemade splitter. If it's running good and splitting good, you may have to watch it & wait until it gets worse and starts leaking somewhere.

 

[Greaser007]

Kind of a cool story behind this splitter:
Way back several decades, my dad's hunting buddy called me and asked if I might "fix" his wood splitter. I had a nice Linde 225 mig-master and being young and full of energy I told him to being it over. The tooth kept breaking off of the beam. Come to find out, the Tooth was just welded to the top of the I-beam. I told him I would make a new Tooth which would be one-piece down into the web of the I-beam. He then said "hang on to the splitter and you can use it, and when I need it I will come get it. Well, I split big pine ( Ponderosa 48-inch stuff - ugh ) for probably 5-years (6-chords per year), and gave it back to him when I moved to Fortuna, California, on the Pacific Coast up near Eureka area in 1998. Then, when the buddy passed away, I was talking to his son and asked if he still had his dad's old splitter. He said "I wore it out years ago, and Yes you may have it." That was 4-years ago, and just 2017 I replaced the engine with a Harbor-Freight 6.5 hp engine. I used it all last season and probably split 8-chords between me and my son.
Just in the last 4-weeks I have split almost 7-chords, and just 2-days ago, the hydraulic control was feeling spongy, and belched fluid out the tank vent after splitting 8 hard pieces, where it should have normally pushed through.
I may be in for a general "tear-down" to inspect each component. My first thought currently is that maybe I should start with removing the shut-off valve at the bottom of the fluid tank in the inlet hose to the pump. There may be a "submerged" piece of something blocking or restricting the flow of fluid out of the tank ahead of the valve ? more later ……… and the curse is - it's Friday, and I will be dwelling on this all weekend.
What was odd, was the fluid 'hissing' when I moved the control lever after the engine was shut-off. And, with the lever moved to either forward or reverse, was when the fluid would hiss, and at the same time it would belch aerated fluid out the tank vent. uhuh.

 

[rarefish383]

The vent tube/hole should have nothing to do with air foaming up the oil. Hydraulic machines have been running around on rough roads for decades with no issues of foaming oil. A tree digger has 14 hydraulic cylinders that operate the machine. Thats a lot of cylinders and a lot of oil, never once did I ever have a oil foaming issue or a water in oil issue. This is down south in an environment thats is very high in humidity. 90% or higher in the summer. Most of the time you could dig a tree in less then 5 min, so run times were low. Still other times in drought conditions, I spent 2 hours trying to hammer out a tree, where the heat was 100+ and I ran the hydraulic's for hours. No heat issues ether. The oil tank is built into the 500 gallon water tank that we used for lubrication on the spades when digging trees. The water tank kept the oil tank cool until I ran low on water. But no foaming issues what so ever.

Now that you mention your tree spade, it made me think of our old Vermeer Model 10 stump grinder. It was almost 8 feet wide, you could see both tires in the mirrors of the 12 foot stake body we pulled it with. No suspension, and we lived on a dirt road. I would fly with that thing on the back. Half the time only one tire was on the road, and it never got agitated enough to foam. Our little Vermeer 630 would bounce all over the road too, and never a problem. Like your spade, these were commercial machines that saw that use every working day year round.