Woods furnace choices

[brenndatomu]

Something else you can help me understand... why with the others Ashley, Clayton, Hotblast, Englander all have very high BTU output but the Big Jack is far less for more money?

Those BTU ratings are almost useless...I think they pull them out of their ears. Its the same with woodstoves too. Firebox size means as much as anything...but it gets more complicated with furnaces because some models have better heat exchangers than others. That's the only difference between a Big Jack and a Super Jack...the SJ has a secondary heat exchanger, the BJ doesn't.
It can take a lot of research to land on the right wood furnace for your home...but I think you are headed in the right direction.
Too big is better than too small. "Too big" you can build smaller fires, or less of them, but with "too small" there is not much can be done other than run the oil/gas/electric heat (or freeze)

 

[brenndatomu]

FYI any furnace that will actually do a good job on that size house will have more than just two 8" supply ducts...most (like the HeatPro) use a plenum, and then you can adapt your pipe(s) to that...you may need to upsize or go with (2) 8" pipes to each zone...depending on how far and/or complicated the runs are.

 

[Nickatnite]

Those BTU ratings are almost useless...I think they pull them out of their ears. Its the same with woodstoves too. Firebox size means as much as anything...but it gets more complicated with furnaces because some models have better heat exchangers than others. That's the only difference between a Big Jack and a Super Jack...the SJ has a secondary heat exchanger, the BJ doesn't.
It can take a lot of research to land on the right wood furnace for your home...but I think you are headed in the right direction.
Too big is better than too small. "Too big" you can build smaller fires, or less of them, but with "too small" there is not much can be done other than run the oil/gas/electric heat (or freeze)

Well isn't that a bugger!! the EPA rules shutdown Yukon manufacturing until they can fall into compliance. They are only selling stove parts to those grandfathered.

 

[brenndatomu]

Well isn't that a bugger!! the EPA rules shutdown Yukon manufacturing until they can fall into compliance. They are only selling stove parts to those grandfathered.

They're still selling to Canada...and working on getting the multifuel Husky furnace to pass the 2020 EPA emissions limits...they were going to certify to the 2017 limits, but then decided it was so much work/expense, lets do this once and be done...sounds like excuses to me...they couldn't have made that decision 2 years ago and then be ready to go with the new model(s) in 2017? IDK...I was waiting to see how much it was going to cost to update my Husky with the new clean burn firebox (supposed to retrofit) but if the right deal comes along on the right unit, I may just swap out and be done.

 

[Nickatnite]

They're still selling to Canada...and working on getting the multifuel Husky furnace to pass the 2020 EPA emissions limits...they were going to certify to the 2017 limits, but then decided it was so much work/expense, lets do this once and be done...sounds like excuses to me...they couldn't have made that decision 2 years ago and then be ready to go with the new model(s) in 2017? IDK...I was waiting to see how much it was going to cost to update my Husky with the new clean burn firebox (supposed to retrofit) but if the right deal comes along on the right unit, I may just swap out and be done.

Yeah the whole thing is now a bit disappointing to me... has taken an option away. I think I will be tapping out as a potential customer, once they have met the EPA regs someone has to pony up for all of the R&D and re-tooling. That someone is the consumer! Nice brisk day over here in N.H, my Englander is going full bore today.

 

[Mustang71]

What stove, furnace if you wish would you recommend for 3000 sq ft?

I can't. This is the only wood furnace I've had. I have twin blowers and put a plenum on top of it with 4 8 inch ducts and 2 6 inch ducts coming off it and tied them into my duct work along with back draft dampers.

For my next one whenever that is I may look for something more efficient. I' not a fan of Napoleon natural gas fire places or natural gas furnaces so Napoleon won' be an option.

 

[Nickatnite]

The Max Caddy/Drolet HeatPro is my recommmendation...the HeatPro being the most bang for the buck there.
The Kuuma is by far the best furnace on the list, but also the most expensive.
The Ashley is an unproven new model by a copy cat cut rate manufacturer.
Napoleon has very little feedback from furnace owners, the little bit that is out there is mostly bad.
The Big Jack is too small, you want a SuperJack, but they are no longer available to the USA (new) so that would be a used purchase only...and they are not the cleanest burners either.
The Clayton, no...just no. Just because it is made from the heaviest gauge metal does no mean it is built the best...much better off with a Yukon. (the Clayton is made by the same company as the Ashley, USSC)

I am still debating what furnace to go with for next season, I need a day off of work to go to the nearest Max Caddy dealer so I can see it and ask questions. I am still looking at the Clayton 1802G, what is it that you do not like about it?

I see that I would need a plenum take-off manufacture for it, I found this on amazon (https://www.amazon.com/Plenum-Ceili...=2025&creative=165953&creativeASIN=B00B064BZ8) and was wondering your thoughts. Do you think I could make this work? I would remove the 18" 3rd dimension, cover the hole then re-cut for an 8" round take-off.

Clayton installation page 12:https://www.homedepot.com/catalog/pdfImages/c4/c461543a-42f6-4649-a1bf-d4f484b94b59.pdf

 

[brenndatomu]

I am still debating what furnace to go with for next season, I need a day off of work to go to the nearest Max Caddy dealer so I can see it and ask questions. I am still looking at the Clayton 1802G, what is it that you do not like about it?

I see that I would need a plenum take-off manufacture for it, I found this on amazon (https://www.amazon.com/Plenum-Ceili...=2025&creative=165953&creativeASIN=B00B064BZ8) and was wondering your thoughts. Do you think I could make this work? I would remove the 18" 3rd dimension, cover the hole then re-cut for an 8" round take-off.

Clayton installation page 12:https://www.homedepot.com/catalog/pdfImages/c4/c461543a-42f6-4649-a1bf-d4f484b94b59.pdf

Its a coal furnace...anything designed to burn coal will eat you out of house and home when burning wood in it...totally different types of fireboxes (wood and coal that is) and plug the chimney in the process...unless you run it hard and reload every 4 hours.
That, and its a USSC product...not known for top quality products...or great customer service.

 

[JRHAWK9]

The Max Caddy/Drolet HeatPro is my recommmendation...the HeatPro being the most bang for the buck there.
The Kuuma is by far the best furnace on the list, but also the most expensive.

The Kuuma is not really -that- much more than the Caddy/Max Caddy. Caddy is $4K and Max Caddy is $4.5K. VF100 is $5,295. It was, I believe, $4,800, when I bought mine.

 

[Nickatnite]

The Kuuma is not really -that- much more than the Caddy/Max Caddy. Caddy is $4K and Max Caddy is $4.5K. VF100 is $5,295. It was, I believe, $4,800, when I bought mine.

I made some calls to a few local dealers of the Max Caddy. I was quoted $4,300.00 for the furnace and another $1,500.00 for the blower. I was like "Huh?". what good is the damn furnace without it? I am currently using a 28-3500 that I paid $1,200.00 over five years ago and it has worked well enough. Yes it cooks through the wood but that is the enjoyable part for me cutting, splitting and stacking. I am just going to replace it with the more efficiant 28-4000 for $1,500.00. I could by four of them if they each last five plus years at the same cost as the Max. At fifty one the finish line is fast approching so...

 

[laynes69]

I made some calls to a few local dealers of the Max Caddy. I was quoted $4,300.00 for the furnace and another $1,500.00 for the blower. I was like "Huh?". what good is the damn furnace without it? I am currently using a 28-3500 that I paid $1,200.00 over five years ago and it has worked well enough. Yes it cooks through the wood but that is the enjoyable part for me cutting, splitting and stacking. I am just going to replace it with the more efficiant 28-4000 for $1,500.00. I could by four of them if they each last five plus years at the same cost as the Max. At fifty one the finish line is fast approching so...

You can buy a caddy line furnace, or there's one made by Usstove called the golden eagle 7700 that's much less. I'm not going to say Caddy makes a bad line of furnaces, but the golden eagle I looked at was better built. You can buy a caddy style furnace and install without the blower in series, which will require no backdraft dampers in the duct system. It's a simple and effective installation if the furnace requires. The golden eagle I looked at was 2200 due to slight cabinet damage, but they retail around 2800 w/o the blower.

 

[Mustang71]

This is the reason I have a daka furnace. 900 dollars gets me decent heat. I can get a Lennox slp98 for 1600 or so and use minimal propane. 5000 for a wood furnace that' crazy. We charge 2000 to install a 80 percent efficint natural gas furnace who in the right mind would pay that much for a not very efficient wood furnace.

 

[JRHAWK9]

This is the reason I have a daka furnace. 900 dollars gets me decent heat. I can get a Lennox slp98 for 1600 or so and use minimal propane. 5000 for a wood furnace that' crazy. We charge 2000 to install a 80 percent efficint natural gas furnace who in the right mind would pay that much for a not very efficient wood furnace.

We have a 92% eff LP furnace (2000 era) and used to average 1,300 gallons of LP a year (sampled over 5 years) keeping the house at 68° and the basement unheated. We have an LP furnace, drier and water heater. Drier and water heater consumed about 300 gallons a year at the most. This leaves about 1,000+ gallons a year to heat the house. This 1,000 gallons at 92% efficiency supplied ~ 84,180,000 BTU's over the heating season. Convert those BTU's into lbs of wood assuming 80% wood furnace efficiency (which the Kumma tested out as being), and you are looking at 16,200lbs of firewood needed to produce the same BTU's as a 1,000 gallons of LP in a 92% efficient furnace......keeping the house at 68° and the basement unheated. Convert to lbs of red oak.....~4.4 cords.

Now we have a Kuuma wood furnace and I weigh all wood I burn and also have a minute timer on my LP furnace in order to keep track of how much the LP furnace runs. I log everything in a spreadsheet, this allows me to compute/track all sorts of things. I burn between 14,600 and 18,250 pounds (4 to 5 cords of red oak) a year while keeping the house 72°-75° while completely heating the basement AND heating our DHW in winter. I can tell you for a fact, before the wood furnace, we would have used LOTS more than 1,000 gallons of LP if we tried to keep the house at 72° while also trying to heat the basement. Last winter we used 15,115 lbs of wood and 115 gallons of LP (includes what little the LP furnace ran, DHW and drier).

According to my numbers, my wood furnace is making better use of the wood then my LP furnace was making of the LP.

I have a buddy who installed a Daka (Menard's special) the same time I installed my Kuuma. No thank you.....goes through wood like crazy, burns dirty and requires one to constantly monitor their chimney. Because the Kuuma is computer controlled, it's ALWAYS burning optimally, is pretty much smokeless and doesn't require yearly chimney sweeps because it burns the majority of the gasses instead of sending them up the chimney to condense and form creosote. Like with almost everything these days, you get what you pay for. Everything these days is getting cheaper and cheaper. It's hard to find anything quality anymore. When I find it, I don't mind paying for it.

More about the company...a company of SIX employees.
http://www.timberjay.com/stories/poised-for-growth,13580
http://www.duluthnewstribune.com/news/4329352-iron-range-wood-furnace-factory-needs-room-grow

 

[Nickatnite]

We have a 92% eff LP furnace (2000 era) and used to average 1,300 gallons of LP a year (sampled over 5 years) keeping the house at 68° and the basement unheated. We have an LP furnace, drier and water heater. Drier and water heater consumed about 300 gallons a year at the most. This leaves about 1,000+ gallons a year to heat the house. This 1,000 gallons at 92% efficiency supplied ~ 84,180,000 BTU's over the heating season. Convert those BTU's into lbs of wood assuming 80% wood furnace efficiency (which the Kumma tested out as being), and you are looking at 16,200lbs of firewood needed to produce the same BTU's as a 1,000 gallons of LP in a 92% efficient furnace......keeping the house at 68° and the basement unheated. Convert to lbs of red oak.....~4.4 cords.

Now we have a Kuuma wood furnace and I weigh all wood I burn and also have a minute timer on my LP furnace in order to keep track of how much the LP furnace runs. I log everything in a spreadsheet, this allows me to compute/track all sorts of things. I burn between 14,600 and 18,250 pounds (4 to 5 cords of red oak) a year while keeping the house 72°-75° while completely heating the basement AND heating our DHW in winter. I can tell you for a fact, before the wood furnace, we would have used LOTS more than 1,000 gallons of LP if we tried to keep the house at 72° while also trying to heat the basement. Last winter we used 15,115 lbs of wood and 115 gallons of LP (includes what little the LP furnace ran, DHW and drier).

According to my numbers, my wood furnace is making better use of the wood then my LP furnace was making of the LP.

I have a buddy who installed a Daka (Menard's special) the same time I installed my Kuuma. No thank you.....goes through wood like crazy, burns dirty and requires one to constantly monitor their chimney. Because the Kuuma is computer controlled, it's ALWAYS burning optimally, is pretty much smokeless and doesn't require yearly chimney sweeps because it burns the majority of the gasses instead of sending them up the chimney to condense and form creosote. Like with almost everything these days, you get what you pay for. Everything these days is getting cheaper and cheaper. It's hard to find anything quality anymore. When I find it, I don't mind paying for it.

More about the company...a company of SIX employees.
http://www.timberjay.com/stories/poised-for-growth,13580
http://www.duluthnewstribune.com/news/4329352-iron-range-wood-furnace-factory-needs-room-grow

Don't like it! "Then there was one" These new standards could potentially put every manufacture out of business but Lammpa which could then lend to the U-Ass Gubment getting total control of that industry. Greedy little Lammpa millennial grandchildren or what ever triple X label after them could ask whatever price for their product.

 

[Mustang71]

We have a 92% eff LP furnace (2000 era) and used to average 1,300 gallons of LP a year (sampled over 5 years) keeping the house at 68° and the basement unheated. We have an LP furnace, drier and water heater. Drier and water heater consumed about 300 gallons a year at the most. This leaves about 1,000+ gallons a year to heat the house. This 1,000 gallons at 92% efficiency supplied ~ 84,180,000 BTU's over the heating season. Convert those BTU's into lbs of wood assuming 80% wood furnace efficiency (which the Kumma tested out as being), and you are looking at 16,200lbs of firewood needed to produce the same BTU's as a 1,000 gallons of LP in a 92% efficient furnace......keeping the house at 68° and the basement unheated. Convert to lbs of red oak.....~4.4 cords.

Now we have a Kuuma wood furnace and I weigh all wood I burn and also have a minute timer on my LP furnace in order to keep track of how much the LP furnace runs. I log everything in a spreadsheet, this allows me to compute/track all sorts of things. I burn between 14,600 and 18,250 pounds (4 to 5 cords of red oak) a year while keeping the house 72°-75° while completely heating the basement AND heating our DHW in winter. I can tell you for a fact, before the wood furnace, we would have used LOTS more than 1,000 gallons of LP if we tried to keep the house at 72° while also trying to heat the basement. Last winter we used 15,115 lbs of wood and 115 gallons of LP (includes what little the LP furnace ran, DHW and drier).

According to my numbers, my wood furnace is making better use of the wood then my LP furnace was making of the LP.

I have a buddy who installed a Daka (Menard's special) the same time I installed my Kuuma. No thank you.....goes through wood like crazy, burns dirty and requires one to constantly monitor their chimney. Because the Kuuma is computer controlled, it's ALWAYS burning optimally, is pretty much smokeless and doesn't require yearly chimney sweeps because it burns the majority of the gasses instead of sending them up the chimney to condense and form creosote. Like with almost everything these days, you get what you pay for. Everything these days is getting cheaper and cheaper. It's hard to find anything quality anymore. When I find it, I don't mind paying for it.

More about the company...a company of SIX employees.
http://www.timberjay.com/stories/poised-for-growth,13580
http://www.duluthnewstribune.com/news/4329352-iron-range-wood-furnace-factory-needs-room-grow

I have a Lennox elite 92 percent furnace and use less than 500 gallons of propane a year and burn around or less than 3 chord of whatever wood i cut. My house is 1700sqft and built in 75.

 

[NSMaple1]

Don't like it! "Then there was one" These new standards could potentially put every manufacture out of business but Lammpa which could then lend to the U-Ass Gubment getting total control of that industry. Greedy little Lammpa millennial grandchildren or what ever triple X label after them could ask whatever price for their product.

Now that's just silly.

If other manufacturers can't build to standards but a small 6 person family based outfit can - that doesn't say much for the capabilities of the other manufacturers, and is certainly no reason to show hate to the small guys that can do it.

 

[JRHAWK9]

Now that's just silly.

If other manufacturers can't build to standards but a small 6 person family based outfit can - that doesn't say much for the capabilities of the other manufacturers, and is certainly no reason to show hate to the small guys that can do it.

exactly. I almost fell off my chair laughing at nickatnite's post...lmao

 

[JRHAWK9]

I have a Lennox elite 92 percent furnace and use less than 500 gallons of propane a year and burn around or less than 3 chord of whatever wood i cut. My house is 1700sqft and built in 75.

Ours is a log cabin style, completely open with loft. Not a very efficient design to heat, no attic and only about 18" separates the inside ceiling from the outside roof. Not a whole lot of room for insulation. Heat loss calcs state heat load to be between 55,000-65,000 BTU's/hr keeping the house 70° while 0° outside. 32x42 footprint. Heating ~3,300 SF including the basement and loft. There's about 30,000CF of volume to heat.

 

[Mustang71]

Ours is a log cabin style, completely open with loft. Not a very efficient design to heat, no attic and only about 18" separates the inside ceiling from the outside roof. Not a whole lot of room for insulation. Heat loss calcs state heat load to be between 55,000-65,000 BTU's/hr keeping the house 70° while 0° outside. 32x42 footprint. Heating ~3,300 SF including the basement and loft. There's about 30,000CF of volume to heat.

That explains it. It would take me many years to recover the price of a hi tech wood furnace. Mine saves me a tank of propane or about 600$ a year and allows me to be nice and warm when I'm home. I guess it all depends on your heating needs. If I were to heat with wood only then maybe if spend a bit more money on a furnace.

 

[Nickatnite]

exactly. I almost fell off my chair laughing at nickatnite's post...lmao

Well, due to my poor grammar I came off as bashing an entrepreneur so let me state my point a little different. I do not begrudge anyone that can bring a product or service to market that one needs or can use. My angst is toward the U-Ass Gubmnet for setting such a tight standard that can be un-achivable or unreasonable either the manufacture or end user for various reasons. Driving all but one manufacture out of the business can create a multitude of unintended or intend consequences, believe it or not not all Americans are independently wealthy for many social and economic reasons. The furnace Lammpa is marketing is only available to a limited market and I get the fact that they took a risk and engineered something and should be compensated for it through pricing. I am simply saying that some of us can only afford what we can afford and sometimes you have to settle for something that is just a little less than adequate but suits the need.