Working the 460 (How hard can it be modded)

[Highclimber OR]

36" on a 046 is just fine. It's all about personal preference. you won't know till you try.

 

[SawTroll]

... Im running the dual port muffler now. It runs the 32" bar okay... .....

Are the chains on the 32" skip or full comp (regular chain). ?

If it runs OK with 32" and full comp, it surely will with 36" and skip.

 

[IchWarriorMkII]

Its full skip, semi chisel.

Im going to file the chain up (been cutting on the factory grind till now) and see how a sharp chain runs...

When I get the bar buried and sweeping through some decent wood, its just sooo slooooooow

 

[SawTroll]

Its full skip, semi chisel.

Im going to file the chain up (been cutting on the factory grind till now) and see how a sharp chain runs...

When I get the bar buried and sweeping through some decent wood, its just sooo slooooooow

Sounds like the chain could be really dull.

Try to touch up the chain every 1 or 2 tanks, that way it will never get really dull, unless you hit something hard or abrasive.

Also bring spare chains, just in case.......

 

[timberwolf]

Im curious, does anyone have any idea on how much power a saw loses when it climbs to higher alititude? I'm a mile higher than where my saw came from, (At 6,000 ft and higher).

Moving from sea level to 6000% feet your looking at a theyroetical HP drop of about 25-30% depending on temperature and humidity. Roughly 4 to 5% a 1000 feet

 

[IchWarriorMkII]

Sounds like the chain could be really dull.

Try to touch up the chain every 1 or 2 tanks, that way it will never get really dull, unless you hit something hard or abrasive.

Also bring spare chains, just in case.......

Thats like sharpening the chain every round I could out of this trunk...

Damn thats a lot of filing!




25% drop in power is significant... I need to fly out to the coast and see what a saw can run like with some 02 in the air.

 

[blis]

Sounds like the chain could be really dull.

Try to touch up the chain every 1 or 2 tanks, that way it will never get really dull, unless you hit something hard or abrasive.

Also bring spare chains, just in case.......

same here, touch up for every tank or two and whenever chain feels dull, keeps the chain quite sharp...

 

[tek9tim]

Its full skip, semi chisel.

When I get the bar buried and sweeping through some decent wood, its just sooo slooooooow

Get full skip full chisel. If you're burying a 32" bar on a powerhead that size at the elevation you're at, you might as well do the saw a favor and put the most effecient chain you can on there. Sharp chisel on that saw won't be slow.

 

[1953greg]

ich

"Is it feasible to make the 460 drive a 36" bar with a BB kit and some port work, or is one honestly better served with a larger saw?[/QUOTE]

ditch the semi chisel chain. replace it w/ round chisel skip or semi skip, keep it sharp, and watch the chips fly!!!

i have both the bb 460 and standard bore 460. both moderately woods modded dual port by me. just cant get the compression (165lbs) out of the bb, as i can the standard bore (195lbs), even w/ .018 squish. maybe someone else can but i cant. bottom line is bb is no stronger than the standard bore.

keep the round chisel skip or semi skip chain sharp and w/ the dualport muff i think u wil b satisfied. if not then thats enough reason for a whs II 460 or an 066/660 (i know where either can be bought).

do the simple things first.

let us know the outcome

 

[RiverRat2]

Yo Ich,,,,

Thats like sharpening the chain every round I could out of this trunk...

Damn thats a lot of filing!




25% drop in power is significant... I need to fly out to the coast and see what a saw can run like with some 02 in the air.

Remember if you are cutting Rotted wood it is almost as bad as hitting the dirt with your chain,,,, wood is organic material and when it rots it is returning back to dirt,,,,hence requires more sharpening,,,,,, :monkey: :deadhorse:

 

[Lakeside53]

..sooo.. in crappy dirty wood stay with semi-chisel SKIP.... like RMF, and take a box of files with you..

 

[tek9tim]

Remember if you are cutting Rotted wood it is almost as bad as hitting the dirt with your chain,,,, wood is organic material and when it rots it is returning back to dirt,,,,hence requires more sharpening,,,,,, :monkey: :deadhorse:

Well, yeah, but the abrasive part of dirt is the mineral (rock) content, whereas the "dirt" made when a tree breaks down (while still standing) would be entirely organic, except for the incidental bits stuck in the bark of all trees. Being a guy that cuts a LOT of rotten wood while cutting fireline, my chain'll stay sharp until I actually jam it into the ground.

 

[ShoerFast]

A huge item to consider is the attitude!

On a normal day at 6000 feet above sea level, just for a say, say temperature is 85 deg. and a 50 deg dew point, an out of the box MS-460 , rated at 6HP will have 4.6 HP, or a tad more pull then an MS-361 .

On that same day, an MS-660 (out of the box stock) rated at 7.0 HP will only have 5.4 HP , or real close to an MS-441's rated HP

Granted that good port work, V-stacks and a free-flow exhaust can pick up a lot more power, but take that saw into the mountains and it gets worst, take a slightly modded MS-660 , for a say, say 7.7HP standing flat-footed at sea level, do some cutting in the mountains, say 9000 feet mid summer at 90 degrees, and say a thunderstorm prone day with say 85 degree dew-point. That 7.7HP 660 will only have about 5HP, IOW, would not have the pull as an out-of-the-box MS-440 . (5.4HP)

That same day, side by side from that 660 at 9000' that 440 is only pulling a little more then an MS-260, or about 3.5HP .

 

[RiverRat2]

Unfortunately We have been stuck with alot of 2yr old downed treework

Well, yeah, but the abrasive part of dirt is the mineral (rock) content, whereas the "dirt" made when a tree breaks down (while still standing) would be entirely organic, except for the incidental bits stuck in the bark of all trees. Being a guy that cuts a LOT of rotten wood while cutting fireline, my chain'll stay sharp until I actually jam it into the ground.

from two hurricanes clearing and stump removal lately and i just know I have to sharpen quite a bit more when dealing with the rotted stuff,,, it seems to help if ya can debark it a bit cause that black crap looks like dirt to me under the bark and its He_ _ on flat top chisel specially if ya running Skip or Semi.......... JMHO

River

 

[windthrown]

460/36

I had a project/rebuild 046 that I put Baileys BB kit on. Never actually got a chance to use it, but the guy I sold it to said it handles a 36" bar no issues.

I wouldnt think a stock 460 would hesitate in cottonwood with a 36".

Well, I could get the 460 to hesitate in fir with a 20 inch bar on it when I ~really~ cranked on it. I think about any saw can be bogged down, especially pulling through 36 inch wood. I would get the Stihl Canada 2 port muffler and retune the carb. Add what, 10% more power? Or as the GasMan says, just try it with the 36 inch bar stock. If it bogs, then go with the dual port muffler. Might be easier to try in that order. 36 inch bars are not cheap though. My wallet flynched buying a 24 inch.

Or just get a 660? That will definately drive a 36 inch bar. Warning: Chainsaw drift in effect. The phenomena known to casue would-be chainsaw buyers to upgrade saws to the higher level, no matter what they are looking for.

 

[windthrown]

RM chains

..sooo.. in crappy dirty wood stay with semi-chisel SKIP.... like RMF, and take a box of files with you..

I use RM in slash pile firewood recovery (50% of what I cut here). Or even RM2 in really crappy dirty and rotten stuff to use them up. I still have 2 20" RM2 loops left, and I use them like my rock skis. Or for when my girlfriend cuts to lessen kickbutt. RM seems to deal with the dirt better. I have not tried RMF though.

 

[IchWarriorMkII]

A huge item to consider is the attitude!

On a normal day at 6000 feet above sea level, just for a say, say temperature is 85 deg. and a 50 deg dew point, an out of the box MS-460 , rated at 6HP will have 4.6 HP, or a tad more pull then an MS-361 .

On that same day, an MS-660 (out of the box stock) rated at 7.0 HP will only have 5.4 HP , or real close to an MS-441's rated HP

Granted that good port work, V-stacks and a free-flow exhaust can pick up a lot more power, but take that saw into the mountains and it gets worst, take a slightly modded MS-660 , for a say, say 7.7HP standing flat-footed at sea level, do some cutting in the mountains, say 9000 feet mid summer at 90 degrees, and say a thunderstorm prone day with say 85 degree dew-point. That 7.7HP 660 will only have about 5HP, IOW, would not have the pull as an out-of-the-box MS-440 . (5.4HP)

That same day, side by side from that 660 at 9000' that 440 is only pulling a little more then an MS-260, or about 3.5HP .

Man thats a harsh set of numbers.

Does anyone else here have hands on effect with as severe altitude changes?

Maybe Ill keep my 32" bar and get my saws Stage II'd...

 

[GASoline71]

Buy an 066/660... I think Jeff has one of those too...

Gary

 

[IchWarriorMkII]

Maybe he will trade me straight across for his 460 back

 

[fishhuntcutwood]

Buy an 066/660... I think Jeff has one of those too...

Gary

Maybe he will trade me straight across for his 460 back

Keep dreaming!