# Does my silver maple have a disease?



## Peter S (May 31, 2007)

Hi, I have noticed this year that my mature silver maple has less leaves than previous years and am wondering if it may have a disease. One side of the tree (north west side which is more exposed to sun) has some bare limbs and others with leaves only on the tips. The south side seems to be filling in more normally. There is no sign of fungus. There is a bit of moss on the trunk of the north side. Some leaves at ground level have small bumps which I am guessing could be galls or maybe aphids. Two years ago I lost a mature elm tree about 50 feet from this tree so I am concerned that perhaps a disease or bug has spread to it. Has anyone had a similar situation and do I need to be concerned? Will try to attach a photo tomorrow. Thanks!


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## Peter S (Jun 1, 2007)

*Maple photos*

Some photos...


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## BonsaiJedi (Jun 1, 2007)

The thingys on the leaves are caused by little mites that make galls...not a tree health issue and not likely the cause of your tree's decline.

The way the tree goes into the ground is, however, quite suspicious...a silver maple that size should have a substantial root flare sticking out above the soil...your looks a little too much like a chubby telephone pole. I would recommend removing the sod and soil around the base to inspect for stem girdling roots (roots that have grown thick enough around the trunk that they are choking out the roots). If you end up finding a nice defined root flare under there then we can look at other causes but definitely check that out first. Your tree's canopy looks like a good candidate for this problem.


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## Peter S (Jun 3, 2007)

*roots...*

Thankyou for responding BonsaiJedi. I tried to dig around the trunk to see what the roots look like. It was very difficult to get the shovel any more than half an inch into the ground without hitting a root. I removed the top layer of grass to reveal a network of roots, which I am attaching photos of. Not sure if this is a good sign or bad sign. Any ideas? Thanks,

Peter


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## treevet (Jun 3, 2007)

Peter S said:


> Thankyou for responding BonsaiJedi. I tried to dig around the trunk to see what the roots look like. It was very difficult to get the shovel any more than half an inch into the ground without hitting a root. I removed the top layer of grass to reveal a network of roots, which I am attaching photos of. Not sure if this is a good sign or bad sign. Any ideas? Thanks,
> 
> Peter



Girdling roots. You may find more. You may also have developed verticillium wilt. Take a chunk out of these roots so they don t fuse back together and if you find more you may want to partially sever them if they are large and complete disconnecting them over a couple of years to lessen the shock. If the tree has v. wilt it will not improve and you will know what to do with it as there is no cure.


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## treeseer (Jun 3, 2007)

Yes get those girdling roots pruned, but don't injure the trunk. job 1 is to scrape all the dirt away from the flare then 1 by 1 sever and remove the roots that circle the trunk. It's a pain but it can be done. I would not worry much about overdoing it; if you have doubts post a new pic after you've done a few.

Re vert wilt, a lot of folks report holding this disease at bay and seeing improvement in the trees with good care and proper chemical.

Attached is an article from City Trees magazine. Not he best but hey they do not pay.


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## Peter S (Jun 3, 2007)

*how do i identify the girdling roots?*

I meant to upload a closeup photo in my last posting but it wouldn't let me upload a second picture. In fact even trying now, it says uploading file please wait (for the past hour). So I will have to try again tomorrow.

Thanks for the input treevet. When you say take a chunk out, how much are you talking about? Since the ground is very solid on all sides of the tree, which side would be best... the side with the thinning branches? Also are you talking about roots the size of my arm that I would need a chainsaw for or smaller ones the size of a finger or less? How do I know I am cutting the right roots, they all look the same to me! 

I tried doing some homework on what girdling roots are, but this web site :

http://grounds-mag.com/mag/grounds_maintenance_identify_treat_girdling/

says girdling roots are not found on silver maples. What's up with that?

Thanks,

Peter


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## ATH (Jun 3, 2007)

Never heard "no girdling roots on silver maple"???

Just remember there are no such thing as "root girdling roots". Overlapping/crossing roots will graft with each other in time. (But I do think some flow is restricted for a relatively short time.)

The problem is stem girdling roots. So the roots that you need to worry about are the ones girdling the stem of the tree.

Minnesota has a great site on stem girdling roots: http://www.extension.umn.edu/distribution/naturalresources/DD7501.html


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## treevet (Jun 4, 2007)

Peter S said:


> I meant to upload a closeup photo in my last posting but it wouldn't let me upload a second picture. In fact even trying now, it says uploading file please wait (for the past hour). So I will have to try again tomorrow.
> 
> Thanks for the input treevet. When you say take a chunk out, how much are you talking about? Since the ground is very solid on all sides of the tree, which side would be best... the side with the thinning branches? Also are you talking about roots the size of my arm that I would need a chainsaw for or smaller ones the size of a finger or less? How do I know I am cutting the right roots, they all look the same to me!
> 
> ...




Roots girdling or constricting the lower stem or butress roots or root flare (transition area from stem to roots) will be fairly obvious as you carefully remove soil anyway that does not damage remaining bark and cell tissue. The best tool is not a chainsaw but a sharp chisel and mallet. Sometimes they may even make an audible snap upon breaking from the pressure. If roots are larger than say 3 fingers I usually take a chunk out and do the rest the next season if there are many of them. They are often caused by growing in a plastic containter and when they hit the side they encircle the root ball. They don t cause any trouble until the stem gets to the dia that the circling roots exist. The side the roots cut in don t necessarily match up w the canopy that is failing. But more often they do.


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## Ed Roland (Jun 8, 2007)

@ the Bartlett lab, few years back, we cut a girdling root on a mature Norway maple appx. 1/3 the diameter of the trunk to study processes as the tree declined. The crown above the girdling root was, as you can imagine, flagging something fierce.
We expected the tree to fail considering the size of the root we removed but has bounce back and is now thriving.


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## Peter S (Jun 11, 2007)

*Are these girdling roots?*

Thanks everyone for replying.

I spent a few hours on the weekend uncovering the roots around my tree. Attached are a few photos of what I found. How many roots would be causing damage and need to be removed? Only ones touching the trunk?

Peter


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## Ax-man (Jun 11, 2007)

Good thread, good pics, I didn't think Silver Maple would be prone to decline from girdling roots like the other Maples like Sugar and Norway Maple. 

Peter, your in for some work, kudo's to you, you have to have the patience of a saint to do this much root pruning by hand. I don't have a high opinion of Silver Maples as it is but if your willing to try and see if you can bring this tree back to good health my hat is off to you.

I see alot of this sort of thing only from the operator station of a stump grinder, this is just the tip of the iceberg, good luck. 

Larry


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## Peter S (Jul 19, 2007)

*girdling roots cut off... i hope*

Thank-you for replying. I also called a professional arborist to come over and look at the tree, and he agreed it could be girdling roots. Shortly after your post I spent a weekend cutting away roots that appeared to be strangling the tree, including one 3 inches in diameter. Attached is a photo for those interested in what is left behind. Since then, we have had very little rain so the tree has not changed signifcantly. I am hoping that next spring will reveal the benefits of my attempts to save the tree, if so I will post a photo for anyone looking for a solution to similar symptoms. Thanks again,

Peter


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## jrparbor04 (Jul 20, 2007)

that is a lot of sgr's,,,and looks as the tree is too deep in the ground,,,no root flare is being shown,,,good job on the work off uncovering the roots not to damage the trunk


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## treeseer (Jul 20, 2007)

jrparbor04 said:


> that is a lot of sgr's,,,and looks as the tree is too deep in the ground,,,no root flare is being shown,,,good job on the work off uncovering the roots not to damage the trunk


but the remaining roots are pretty scraped up, not that it makes much difference. i pruned sgr's on a bunch of maples 5 yers ago and the trees have hardly grown since. there were a lot left and the owner did not want to pay more.

now he has big bushes.


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## jrparbor04 (Jul 23, 2007)

sgr's are a trees worst enemy,,,i believe,,,worse than a insect or a fungal problem,,,,only a matter of time without proper maintenance


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