# First time haulin' in the pickup



## Whitespider (Mar 14, 2013)

Because of wind that came after recent wet, heavy snows the town has a lot of trees and branches down. The wife called me at work yesterday because a "big branch" had fallen at my MIL's house and took the power line with it, she asked me to drive by and see if I "wanted" the wood. Being I'm a wood-snob, I figured it would be some crap Box Elder or some such and she just needed someone to clean it up on the cheap (by-the-way, I'm not complaining about helping-out the 73-year-old MIL).

So I drive by... and it's a huge ash tree, crotched about 6-7 feet up, and half the tree is on the ground... I figure it will make something just under/over a half cord of firewood (and I always seem to guesstimate wrong). I called the wife back and told her I'd take care of it as soon as I could get my pickup in there (right now there's around 16-20 inches of snow in her yard). Well, couple hours later she calls back... seems the MIL had a "neighborhood friend/handyman" planning to clean up the mess, she just needed to know if I wanted the "wood". So as I understand it, the brush and junk is all cleaned up, the large branches have been cut to manageable lengths, and all I need to do is go load it up.

Believe it or not... this will be the first time my pickup has ever hauled a single stick of firewood.


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## Jredsjeep (Mar 14, 2013)

you cant beat that with a broken ash stick!

got lucky like that about a month ago, got offered a tree guys trimmings for free. i came with the whole chainsaw gear and hand splitting tools in tow. turns out he had cut it all to length and put it in one nice pile by the curb for me. drive up load and go, can't beat it!


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## hanniedog (Mar 14, 2013)

Spidy I think that calls for suspension of your man card for having a truck that never hauled firewood.


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## Blazin (Mar 14, 2013)

Don't do it, it's a setup :msp_mellow:


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## farmer steve (Mar 14, 2013)

hanniedog said:


> Spidy I think that calls for suspension of your man card for having a truck that never hauled firewood.



yeah,i even put 3 pieces of f/w in the 250 and drove around the pole building just to say it hauled f/w. wouldn't wanna lose my man card.


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## Deleted member 83629 (Mar 14, 2013)

load it down flex those leaf springs but remember it ain't loaded till the bumper is dragging the ground


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## sunfish (Mar 14, 2013)

A pickup ain't worth a chit if ya don't haul wood in it...


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## greendohn (Mar 14, 2013)

You must be living right, Spidey.


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## Sandhill Crane (Mar 14, 2013)

Must be one of those 'suit and tie' pickups, in the suburbs. You might want to leave the wood in the truck awhile, unload it when it is seasoned.


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## turnkey4099 (Mar 14, 2013)

Sandhill Crane said:


> Must be one of those 'suit and tie' pickups, in the suburbs. You might want to leave the wood in the truck awhile, unload it when it is seasoned.



Yah, I call them P**** wagons. Had a co-worker who was always worried about scratching his bed, wouldn't haul anything. He even pointed out that my new (10 year old F15) had some scractches in the bed. He knew I used mine as a 'workign truck'. He also wanted to trade trucks so he could "haul stuff". Kicked tires for a couple months and showed up with a brand new one, gussied up, all the extras and a SHORT BED but it shore did look "cute".

Harry K


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## Whitespider (Mar 14, 2013)

Sandhill Crane said:


> *Must be one of those 'suit and tie' pickups, in the suburbs.*



Naw, I don't live in no suburb... don't live anywhere near a "community".
It's a beat-up, rusty, '94 F150, 4x4, regular cab, long box that's been well worked and hauled its share of "stuff".
I've just never had need to haul firewood with it... I cut all mine right on the property and use the little tractor with trailer to haul it out'a the woodlot.
If this was anyone but my MIL I'd pass on it... don't see the sense in burning gas to retrieve firewood from town when I have all I need right at the homestead.


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## Mac88 (Mar 14, 2013)

You can borrow my FB. It hauls wood and other stuff just fine. It's a little dirty at the moment. I spun the rears pretty good unloading a big oak off the trailer. There's a lot of mud still packed under the bed.


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## stihl023/5 (Mar 14, 2013)

Whitespider said:


> Naw, I don't live in no suburb... don't live anywhere near a "community".
> It's a beat-up, rusty, '94 F150, 4x4, regular cab, long box that's been well worked and hauled its share of "stuff".
> I've just never had need to haul firewood with it... I cut all mine right on the property and use the little tractor with trailer to haul it out'a the woodlot.
> If this was anyone but my MIL I'd pass on it... don't see the sense in burning gas to retrieve firewood from town when I have all I need right at the homestead.



Never hauled wood!:msp_scared: 4X4 lock it in and get the wood 16" is nothin!


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## stihly dan (Mar 14, 2013)

A winter of change spidey? 1st you admit about the wood shed, now hauling wood. Let me be the 1st to welcome you to our world, planet earth. Sorry had to do the last with your avatar.


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## naturelover (Mar 14, 2013)

Hmm, after hauling a small load of wood in the Ranger, it's now in the garage awaiting spring shackles and possibly a hanger. Weekend project I suppose. 


Sent from my iPhone 5 using Tapatalk


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## Dusty Rhodes (Mar 15, 2013)

What else would you use a truck for but hauling wood? I never contemplated having one for anything else. In fact it is how I justified needing one. 
The wood widow agreed, she was tired of me using the back seat of her Camry for picking up stray splits along the highway


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## Whitespider (Mar 15, 2013)

Dusty Rhodes said:


> *What else would you use a truck for but hauling wood?*



Ahhhh yes... but... that sort'a depends on where ya' live.
Mine has hauled dirt, rock, gravel, various construction materials, all sorts of ***, large quantities of gasoline, furniture, appliances (wood-fired and others), a dozen kegs of beer at a time, small boats, motorcycles, ATV's, and I can't remember what else. And at least a couple times a year (more often during some years) the 4-wheel drive is needed just to get out of the yard through the snow.

Out here, whether he burns wood or not, a man without a 4x4 pickup is like a cowboy without a horse... pretty much worthless.


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## Dusty Rhodes (Mar 16, 2013)

Out here, whether he burns wood or not, a man without a 4x4 pickup is like a cowboy without a horse... pretty much worthless.[/QUOTE]

I can relate to that here in PA. Seems like everyone in PA has a Pickup. But it is different too. Aside from what the local farmers have, most of the pickups around here are glorified SUV's. Pretty things, all spruced up with Crew cabs or cargo lids and short little beds. They dont haul nothing in them, just their kids and the dog. And they would not think of running it into the woods, could get a scratch on it from a twig or something. Would never think of throwing a hunk of wood into the bed as it could get a dent in it. Strangest thing. Why they bought a truck really puzzles me. Kind of a status thing I guess. I bought a used 2001 Chevy 2500 HD, regular cab with a full sized bed. Had to look for months to find one. I wanted to haul wood not people. I am sure I will be hauling more than wood in mine. So far no one has asked me to move any furniture or anything like that, but I am sure the day will come. Brother borrows it for hauling hay for his horse so it does see some use for other than wood duty. And I hope to really break it in this spring to haul some manure for the garden and the fruit trees. Figure if I leave a little of the manure laying in the back of the bed of the truck, less people may want to borrow it to haul their furniture in it.


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## Whitespider (Mar 16, 2013)

Oh yeah, we’ve got our share of the Yuppies driving ‘em here also; and it seems like more of ‘em moving in all the time… or maybe we’re breeding them? Four doors and a short box used only to haul gas for the grass-cutter… a little 1-gallon container, and you can be sure they’ve put a towel under it just in case. They’ve got all sorts of “stuff” bolted and screwed to them… running boards, mud flaps, bug deflectors, fog lights, visors, chrome tail gate caps, tonneau covers, fancy wheels, custom paint striping and graphics, and horror-of-all-horrors… custom license plates. With the first dusting of snow in the fall every one of ‘em is out driving around with the front axle engaged… yaaaaa-hoooooo! 

It’s flat embarrassing… and what’s worse, they’re proud of those… those… those… … what the heck do ya’ call ‘em… Frankenstein Trucks? Some even put trailer hitches on ‘em just so they can have a custom receiver plug… ahhhggggggg, I wanna’ puke.

Oh, and don’t forget the silly-something hanging from the rear view mirror and the custom screen graphic in the sliding back glass…

I think we should neuter them all before they reproduce


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## Whitespider (Mar 16, 2013)

stihl023/5 said:


> *Never hauled wood!*:msp_scared: *4X4 lock it in and get the wood 16" is nothin!*



Some years ago an old farmer gave me a really good piece of advice...
As a high school kid on summer break I was working for him to pick up a little cash. We were driving out to check the cattle and slipping around a bit in the mud. I asked him why he didn't put the truck in 4-wheel drive, and he answered with...
"_Sonny boy, ya' don't put it in 4-wheel drive *before* ya' get stuck... 'cause if'n ya' do, you'll end up walkin' home._"

I've never forgotten that.


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## Bushmans (Mar 16, 2013)

Well it might be a 4 door short bed but don't tell it that it's worthless cuz it doesn't know any better.
I like the 4 door for hauling the family while pulling the camper and also for sticking all my gear inside because the back is too loaded up with wood to fit the gear. Sometimes you have to compromise. I've hauled firewood, topsoil, mulch, lumber and lets not forget the huge loads of muddy boulders i dug up from a farmer's ditch to build my retaining wall. I put airbags in the back springs so I could hold a little more! My old ride (88 chevy) decided to retire!
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## Whitespider (Mar 16, 2013)

Last summer the 5-year-old (then a 4-year-old) got a hold of a rattle-can of orange paint and did a bit of custom paint work for me... sort'a adds character, don't ya think?


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## stihl023/5 (Mar 16, 2013)

Nice Ford!


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## philoshop (Mar 16, 2013)

I'm definitely down a man card or two right off the bat. Mini-van:msp_scared: '01 Chrysler Town & Country bought in '08.

In my own defense though, it's a 3/4 ton frame with good tires and springs and it'll haul stuff or pull the trailer when I need it to. The rear seats came out the day I got it, but I really like my heated leather front seats on a cold morning.:msp_biggrin:

After 35 or so years in construction, it was starting to beat me up just getting tools in and out of the old 150 all day. Bad knees and an arthritic hip. Now the basic tools for electrical, plumbing, carpentry, etc find their own place on the back floor and their easy for me to get to. Kind of a small rolling shop.

That first move to a mini-van, about ten years ago, was painful to say the least. But since I was already starting to suffer from Middle-Aged-Man disease (the one where you become invisible to younger women), I made the leap and haven't looked back. On the other hand a guy down the road has a nice-looking older Ford one-ton, dually flatbed I'm kinda lookin' at. Need to get those man cards back and all. But I cut mostly in my own back yard and the kubota takes care of that. The wood trailer wasn't even registered last year.

Thanks for starting the post Whitespider. I guess I've been looking for a way to confess my sins. Please don't ban me from the brotherhood.


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## Dusty Rhodes (Mar 16, 2013)

Pulled up to the gas pump the other week after hauling in a load of locust. Guy pulls in next to me and before he gets out of his new truck, out from underneath the rocker panels low and behold a step bumper descends and locks into place on the drivers side. Freaked me out. Kind O like my grandsons Transformers or something. I says to the guy, Wow, thats different. He says yea, there cool Huh? But then he says he's gonna take em off, they have no safety features on them and he could accidentally retract them and could pinch somebodies foot if it got caught in there on the way back up. Says theres a newer version out with a sensing thing a ma jigger that if it hits resistance on the way back up they will reverse. Are you kidding me! Not to pinch anybodies nerves(no pun intended) that have electronically descending step side bumpers, but I am thinking, buddy, you've got more money than brains. Now, now, Dusty, I think to myself, I have to remember, I am a dinosaur in my thinking and soon to be extinct What a world.


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## philoshop (Mar 16, 2013)

I call 'em yuppytrucks. As in, "yup honey, let's go antiqueing and we'll take my truck".


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## Steve NW WI (Mar 16, 2013)

Ever since about $3 a gallon, my truck doesn't move unless it's workin. Well, unless it's pullin the boat, but the truck's still workin, even if I ain't!

Spidey - what ya got for tires on that thing. I'm looking for a new set, and the Wild Country MTs I always liked are NLA, and their newest mud tire looks pretty girly IMO.


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## Jakers (Mar 16, 2013)

Steve NW WI said:


> Ever since about $3 a gallon, my truck doesn't move unless it's workin. Well, unless it's pullin the boat, but the truck's still workin, even if I ain't!
> 
> Spidey - what ya got for tires on that thing. I'm looking for a new set, and the Wild Country MTs I always liked are NLA, and their newest mud tire looks pretty girly IMO.



them look like old school bias tires. most likely a 7.50x15 or so. depressing pricing out new tires aint it steve


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## Jakers (Mar 16, 2013)

Whitespider said:


>



slap some chains on her and she will be unstopable


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## ppkgmsy (Mar 16, 2013)

"Now, now, Dusty, I think to myself, I have to remember, I am a dinosaur in my thinking and soon to be extinct What a world."

As a buddy of mine puts it, "We're Briggs & Stratton men in a Microsoft world."


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## naturelover (Mar 16, 2013)

Fords sure do like to rust though.... 

My little weekend spring hanger job just got a little tougher, may have to add a plate behind it. 

Only got 111k miles on it, but the frame sure don't look like it.

Least on the older F-150's, you could bolt in a half frame. Not so on the Rangers... 

So, don't look like the Ranger is ever gonna be hauling much wood.


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## Steve NW WI (Mar 16, 2013)

Jakers said:


> them look like old school bias tires. most likely a 7.50x15 or so. depressing pricing out new tires aint it steve



Yup, almost hate to put $700 in tires on a $1000 pickup, but I can always swap em to the next one unless I get something fancy with the 17 or 18" rims.

I ran a set of the aforementioned Wild Countrys on a 76, 82, and 87 Chevs before I wore the tires out. The 76 got rearended by a milk truck, the other two just rusted away above the tires. Still miss that 76, but not the 8 MPG outta full time 4x4 and a built 406.


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## beerman6 (Mar 16, 2013)

I'll confess, my 01 3/4 ton Ram has a short box,but it's had enough firewood dropped in it that OHSA made me put stickers on it warning that children may drown in the water that it holds in the dents...


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## Whitespider (Mar 17, 2013)

Steve NW WI said:


> *Spidey - what ya got for tires on that thing*





Jakers said:


> *them look like old school bias tires. most likely a 7.50x15 or so*


*Jakers* has it correct, they’re old school bias ply tires, ya’ just can’t beat ‘em for raw traction in mud and snow.
*Cooper Courser Traction 7.00x15*’s
The sad thing is, Cooper don’t offer them any more, they quit making them a couple years after I bought mine. Last time I looked around I couldn’t find any 15-inch, bias ply, traction lug tires… so I try and be reasonably careful not to destroy one.


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## ajr (Mar 17, 2013)

I havnt bought a new set of tires in over 5 years we have a local guy that has used and blem tires you can get a decent set of 265 75 16 tires 70% tread for $100 also tractor car tires. Never had any problems

Sent from my HTC Hero S using Tapatalk 2


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## zogger (Mar 17, 2013)

Steve NW WI said:


> Yup, almost hate to put $700 in tires on a $1000 pickup, but I can always swap em to the next one unless I get something fancy with the 17 or 18" rims.
> 
> I ran a set of the aforementioned Wild Countrys on a 76, 82, and 87 Chevs before I wore the tires out. The 76 got rearended by a milk truck, the other two just rusted away above the tires. Still miss that 76, but not the 8 MPG outta full time 4x4 and a built 406.



I have some nice ones now, but they are on a roller I bought to either try to get it running or use it as the basis of a rebuild with my other truck as a component parts truck , both mid 80s diesel chevies. Ha! I just got the first one, the 1/2 ton, cranked with an outboard tank sitting on the roof, it needs all new lines, lift pump, etc. Leaks and sucks air all over...IP was functional enough I drove it to town a couple weeks back twice, but then it sucked air again...made it back close to home and used the deutz tow truck and a chain the rest of the way...

The newer roller one is a 3/4 ton in pretty good visible shape, has dual shocks all around, lotsa springs.....it sure sems nice and strong just looking at it..that is a 4 speed... 37 inch goodyear oz militaries, full set of 5, near almost brand new perfect. Ill call them, 4 at 95%, the spare at 100%. Like I paid used prices for the tires, and got the matching nice wheels and the rest of the truck for free. Also grabbed a set, from another place, of four matched mud wheels and some super swampers with some sort of visible tread, those are 33s. Most likely put tubes in them maybe, dunno yet, two hold air good, the other two..meh.


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## brenndatomu (Mar 17, 2013)

Whitespider said:


> *Jakers* has it correct, they’re old school bias ply tires, ya’ just can’t beat ‘em for raw traction in mud and snow.
> *Cooper Courser Traction 7.00x15*’s
> The sad thing is, Cooper don’t offer them any more, they quit making them a couple years after I bought mine. Last time I looked around I couldn’t find any 15-inch, bias ply, traction lug tires… so I try and be reasonably careful not to destroy one.



Man, you can have them things! Back in high school I had a 1980 F150 stepside 4x4, it had bias ply mudders on it, and front steering linkage was a lil loose. I could hardly keep that thing in my lane on the highway, it was scary! I bought a set of Wild Country MT radials for it, I kid you not, I thought the tire shop had given me a different truck back! It would run straight down the road with no hands on the wheel! I Really liked those tires, no more bias tires for me...


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## Whitespider (Mar 17, 2013)

brenndatomu said:


> *Man, you can have them things! Back in high school I had a 1980 F150 stepside 4x4, it had bias ply mudders on it, and front steering linkage was a lil loose. I could hardly keep that thing in my lane on the highway, it was scary!*



You have to set the front end up differently with bias ply tires... a bit more caster with a bit less camber and toe-in, then they drive just fine. The idea is to get the footprint flat on the ground because bias ply sidewalls won't flex and roll like radial tires do. The front end alignment specs for near any vehicle built in the last 50-years is assuming radial tires... throw them specs in the trash if'n ya' run bias ply tires. Running old school tires, ya' need need to set your your front end up old school... if you don't have the means to do it yourself, you'll need to find someone from the old school... Good Luck With That!!!


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## Blazin (Mar 17, 2013)

Tires, blah blah blah...You put any wood in that wheelbarrow yet? Pics?


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## Whitespider (Mar 17, 2013)

*L-O-L*
Yeah, the boy and I went into town and retrieved the blow-down ash from the MIL's yard today... sorry, didn't think about pics.


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## Blazin (Mar 17, 2013)

Whitespider said:


> *L-O-L*
> Yeah, the boy and I went into town and retrieved the blow-down ash from the MIL's yard today... sorry, didn't think about pics.



Oh poop!


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## beerman6 (Mar 17, 2013)

for a good time put radials on the rear and bias-ply on the front


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## naturelover (Mar 17, 2013)

The Ranger has some 31-10.50's on it now, the best tires I've had on it so far. Do really well in the mud and snow, and aren't too loud on the hardtop either for being a pretty aggressive AT tire.







Don't know how well they will last though, but am liking them so far.


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## Steve NW WI (Mar 18, 2013)

I shoulda known anyone with a hate for the EPA and all things modern would have trouble with them newfangled radial thingies on a truck too. There ain't enough money in the world to make me go back to bias tires.



zogger said:


> I have some nice ones now, but they are on a roller I bought to either try to get it running or use it as the basis of a rebuild with my other truck as a component parts truck , both mid 80s diesel chevies. Ha! I just got the first one, the 1/2 ton, cranked with an outboard tank sitting on the roof, it needs all new lines, lift pump, etc. Leaks and sucks air all over...IP was functional enough I drove it to town a couple weeks back twice, but then it sucked air again...made it back close to home and used the deutz tow truck and a chain the rest of the way...
> 
> The newer roller one is a 3/4 ton in pretty good visible shape, has dual shocks all around, lotsa springs.....it sure sems nice and strong just looking at it..that is a 4 speed... 37 inch goodyear oz militaries, full set of 5, near almost brand new perfect. Ill call them, 4 at 95%, the spare at 100%. Like I paid used prices for the tires, and got the matching nice wheels and the rest of the truck for free. Also grabbed a set, from another place, of four matched mud wheels and some super swampers with some sort of visible tread, those are 33s. Most likely put tubes in them maybe, dunno yet, two hold air good, the other two..meh.



37s will last forever and a day under a 6.2. There ain't enough power there to turn em, without a set of 5.13 gears under it, you'll be as cranky as Spidey with a fuel injected chainsaw trying to get it to pull anything, Sell em to a mud bogger and buy you a set of 30x9.50 or 265-75 16s. It'll make a much nicer truck out of it.


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## Whitespider (Mar 18, 2013)

Steve NW WI said:


> *I shoulda known anyone with a hate for the EPA and all things modern would have trouble with them newfangled radial thingies on a truck too. There ain't enough money in the world to make me go back to bias tires.*



There ya' go thinkin' again 
I have radials on everything else, and I even have a set of 31x11.50 Cooper Discoverers on aluminum rims for the pickup (my summertime street tires)... but from September on into May I run tires with real traction. During Fall, Winter and Spring that truck spends way more time doing off-road chores than on-road... and over half the time it is on-road, it's on muddy/gravel/rocky county roads and/or snow. There ain't no sense in running (relatively) soft-rubber radials for the gravel, rock and fields to tear up (you ever seen a frozen corn stalk puncture a radial? I have, more than once), and there ain't any loss of "drive-ability/ride-ability" running bias on them roads... besides, radials suck when it comes to real traction (but I'm sure someone who has never run a traction-lug bias tire will argue with me and tell me what great traction they get with their wonder-radials).


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## Whitespider (Mar 18, 2013)

*L-O-L*
I had to go all the way back to 2004 (the pre-rust days, L-O-L) to find one...
But see, here's a pic of it wearing the fair-weather shoes.


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## ajr (Mar 18, 2013)

100% true about them bias ply tires and traction many times my dads 77 chevy would walk right through a mess and the 93 chevy with radials would get stuck. But you wouldnt want to take that truck down the highway @70 mph.

Sent from my HTC Hero S using Tapatalk 2


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## hanniedog (Mar 18, 2013)

Was prepared to lift your man card suspension but you produced no picture of said truck loaded. So in keeping with AS tradition no pics it never happened.


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## Whitespider (Mar 18, 2013)

ajr said:


> *100% true about them bias ply tires and traction many times my dads 77 chevy would walk right through a mess and the 93 chevy with radials would get stuck.*



*L-O-L* It's usually during hunting season when my bias ply tire advantage is most noticeable. While the other guys are locked in 4-wheel drive, spinning tires, slipping sideways, and making rooster tails of sod/mud/water/snow I drive around them without slipping a tire... _and that's without the 4-wheel drive engaged!_

But hey, somebody has to be there to pull them out... right?


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## Whitespider (Mar 18, 2013)

hanniedog said:


> *Was prepared to lift your man card suspension but you produced no picture of said truck loaded. So in keeping with AS tradition no pics it never happened.*



My bad... my bad...


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## Jredsjeep (Mar 18, 2013)

i have not run them but have heard good things about these bias tires
STA Super Traxion Light Truck Bias Ply Tires

there are a few guys on some other forums who are also big fans of bias, one owns a tire shop. he hauls heavy with horses all the time and just plain refuses to put radials on. i have actually met the guy, very old school but knowledgeable guy.


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## Whitespider (Mar 18, 2013)

Jredsjeep said:


> *i have not run them but have heard good things about these bias tires
> there are a few guys on some other forums who are also big fans of bias, one owns a tire shop*



Wow! Thanks for the link *Jredsjeep*, I was wondering where my next set would come from.

I worked in automotive and light truck for over 20-years at our family owned Ford dealership... most of those years as the parts and service manager.
We sold tires for a good share of that time, and I agree with that "tire shop owner"... radial tires are for cars and street pickups, they don't belong on an off-road or working truck. Probably the most common issue with radials is separated and/or broken belts when subjected to heavy loads, "pulling" stress or impact (such rocks and stumps when off-road). The second most common is sidewall punctures from sticks, corn stalks, and whatnot. Nothin' will make you more mad than having a pencil diameter stick destroy a $225 radial by passing through the sidewall...


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## Jredsjeep (Mar 18, 2013)

i have been thinking of switching myself but am going to let the radials wear out first, i am not made of money. i have a 94 Ford Crew 4x4 diesel that hauls wood and general stuff regularly and sometimes gets taken into the woods. I have actually had 2 radial sidewalls fail on me with my current tires, one was my fault i backed to near a beam and cought an edge. it really didnt take much but when it blew it created a crater in the ground and showered me with grass and dirt since i had my window down. sure scared the kids some! the second one broke a band and blew out on me going down the highway unloaded. not fun but at least it happened in the rear so it could be controlled. now i have miss matched wear tires.

according to my old school buddy, the only reason we are going to radails for trucks is that it is far cheaper to make them. for a real hauling truck or off road durability they suck. bias rules for a working rig, they also last far longer in both tread wear and sitting in general.

i have to admitt i am a little worried going to bias, my truck can sit sometimes and i am worried about permanent flat spots or i might not like the performance. i have never run them before. its good to hear you can correct the steering to handle better that eases things a bit.


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## Steve NW WI (Mar 18, 2013)

If the bias tires really offered better traction and load carrying capabilities, you'd still see em on heavy trucks and farm tractors.


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## ajr (Mar 18, 2013)

Bias ply tractor tires are way better for traction and as far as big truck if its highway use you do not want bias ply. I think alot of the problem with radial tires as far as traction is the squattyness(dont know if thats a word) of them. Jmo

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## Whitespider (Mar 18, 2013)

Steve NW WI said:


> *If the bias tires really offered better traction and load carrying capabilities, you'd still see em on heavy trucks and farm tractors.*



That’s just so wrong…

On hard surfaces (such as pavements and hard packed earth) the radial tire does offer better traction (to a point) because as the sidewall flexes the footprint remains flat and the contact area with the ground increases… but who needs more traction on pavement?? Even on loose, dry surfaces (such as sand or dry, loose farm ground) this may be an advantage (depending) because a wider footprint helps keep the tire on top. But the biggest advantage is that the radial tire doesn’t tear up near as much ground, sod and whatnot. Another advantage is the softer, more comfortable ride and less vibration transferred to the vehicle… but at the expense of less heavy-load stability (i.e., more side-to-side sway).

But when it gets wet and muddy, snowy, or even just wet grass… that’s when the *traction-lug* bias ply will outperform the radial every time. As the side wall flexes on a bias ply it actually lifts the center of the tread, forcing the outer lugs in a pinching-like action into the ground. If you drive traction-lug bias ply across your yard they’re gonna’ leave tracks unless it ain’t rained in over a month… they will tear up some real-estate if you’re not careful. In mud and snow, less is more; less tread surface in contact with wet and slop means it’s less likely to ride up on top and spin, rather it digs in grabbing anything available to increase traction… like the paddles on a paddleboat. And they won’t load up with mud either, they self clean so the lugs are always grabbing new earth. If you look at properly inflated traction-lug bias ply tires sitting on a hard surface the outer lugs will be just barely touching, or even actually elevated off the surface when not under load.

As far as load carrying ability… that’s a function of the tire construction, and either bias ply or radial can be constructed to handle equal loads. Large over-the-road trucks hauling heavy loads at high speed will be better served with radial tires because of less heat build-up. But smaller working trucks (such as farm and construction site pickups), hauling variable loads, at lower speeds, on varying and uneven surfaces and conditions will find the bias ply to work much better overall… greater stability and traction with less chance of sidewall punctures or belt damage from impact.

I could go on… but what’s the point, you’re obviously in the camp that believes the radial tire is the best thing since sliced bread for all situations and conditions… and I’ll just continue to drive circles around you in the mud, snow and any other slop you can think of. Nothing in this world has ever been best served with a “one-size-fits-all” way of thinking… tire construction included.


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## ajr (Mar 18, 2013)

What he said X2

Sent from my HTC Hero S using Tapatalk 2


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## naturelover (Mar 18, 2013)

The ones on the Ranger seem to have very little flex in them, though I think they are a 6 ply. Sidewalls do have some flex, but don't know that it would ever be enough to make much of a difference. 

Do believe they are wider than a bias ply, which could make a difference, especially in snow. Course even that has its limits, had the Ranger in so deep before the tires were pretty much lifted off the road, needless to say I hung her pretty well that time.. :jester:

Will say that after I put those AT's on, I was coming home on a snowy day and the road was covered in snow. Several people had already found the ditch. Well, I locked it in 4wd and on up the hill I went, nary slipped a wheel.

Got into some mud a few days later, so flipped the switch. Hit the mudhole and about got stuck up. 4wd wasn't working at all, dang vacu-lok hubs weren't kicking in. I would have never believed I would have made it up that snowy hill in 2wd, but it did.

And in my experience, if one waits until they're slipping or stuck before locking it in, its usually too late.

And if they ain't cleaning themselves out, you ain't spinnin' 'em fast enough.


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## Steve NW WI (Mar 19, 2013)

Whitespider said:


> That’s just so wrong…
> 
> I could go on… but what’s the point, you’re obviously in the camp that believes the radial tire is the best thing since sliced bread for all situations and conditions… and I’ll just continue to drive circles around you in the mud, snow and any other slop you can think of. Nothing in this world has ever been best served with a “one-size-fits-all” way of thinking… tire construction included.



I'm gonna let you have your biased (pun fully intended) opinion on this one. All I'm gonna say is that any time I've been stuck, be it radial or bias ply tires, traction hasn't been the issue. Lack of ground clearance (be it 6" in a car or 2' or better on a tractor) was what stopped forward progress. Ain't but two things that will help that: A taller tire, and hope we hit solid ground before we bottom out even deeper in, or a wider one that will float over it. Therefore, I'll continue to think that my "inferior" radials have "enough" traction.

PS - Spidey, if you decide you need a custom user title, might I suggest "That 70s Show" for ya?


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## Whitespider (Mar 19, 2013)

naturelover said:


> *And in my experience, if one waits until they're slipping or stuck before locking it in, its usually too late.
> And if they ain't cleaning themselves out, you ain't spinnin' 'em fast enough.*



If they're spinnin', the one thing you surely ain't got is traction.

I see that all the time, guys try to compensate for lack of traction with momentum... lock-it-in and go balls-to-the-wall. That's fine *if* you make it through (or over), but if you don't make it you're just that much deeper in the soup when it all comes to a stop. It can be especially bad in thick muck or deep, hard-pack/drifted snow because the tires will ride up on top until momentum is lost, then they break through, dig and leave the axles laying on top... with the tires suspended above any sort of available traction.

I tend to go at it a bit differently... I walk it in slow, in 2-wheel drive, trying not to slip a tire. When, and if, forward progress halts and the rear wheels begin to slip, that's when I "lock-it-in" and *back up!* Now I have the opportunity to reevaluate what's ahead of me... I've stuck 'em to the rocker panels before, I hate walking, and I hate shoveling even more. If I do decide to continue forward, I still walk it in slow, and as soon as the wheels start to slip I stop and *back up!* Reevaluate again! When working through deep snow this allows the axle housings to keep pushing snow out of the way and tires remain on a solid traction surface... it don't make for fast travel, but it's a damn sight better than walking! Working through thick, deep, mucky mud this gives me several opportunities to gauge just how deep it is... 'cause if it's bottomless, there ain't any combination of 4x4 and tires that will pull you through it. You *might* get lucky and momentum will carry you over it, but on the return trip you *might* not be so lucky... I don't believe in luck much, I believe a man makes his own luck.

If your tires are spinnin', you ain't got traction... if you ain't got traction, you're gonna' get stuck... four spinnin' wheels just mean you're gonna be that much more stuck when it happens!


addendum: Oh... and by-the-way, don't try the "walk-it-in-slow" technique with your silly wide-footprint radial tires, they'll just walk up on top and when you try and back up they'll just sink... and then you walk :bang: Best off just keepin' those street tires on the street.


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## Whitespider (Mar 19, 2013)

Jredsjeep said:


> *i have been thinking of switching myself...
> i have to admitt i am a little worried going to bias, my truck can sit sometimes and i am worried about permanent flat spots or i might not like the performance.*



*Jredsjeep*, I've been thinking about your post and how to best respond to it...
There are definite disadvantages to running bias ply tires on dry pavements... and that's why I run radial A/T type tires during the mid-summer months. If you drive dry pavement for any distance you'll probably be disappointed with bias ply tires... my truck rarely goes more than 6-8 miles on dry pavement (to town and back) during winter. But dirt, gravel, crushed rock and sand roads are not pavement.

I found this article on an off-road web site that really does a good job of explaining the differences and advantages/disadvantages of both tire types... along with the different construction materials. If you read it I think you'll see the bias ply *is clearly* the better *off-pavement* and snow tire... but, depending on the amount of time your truck spends on dry pavement, bias ply may not necessarily be the right tire for you. When reading it, and forming your decision, don't make light of the fact I run a radial A/T type during fair weather... and that's when my pavement driving is probably still less than 30% of the total.

http://www.off-road.com/trucks-4x4/tech/technical-article-19432.html#comparison


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## Deleted member 83629 (Mar 19, 2013)

this is what i run on my trucks these tires will go were radials will not in my neck of the woods https://www.universaltire.com/truck-and-military/truck/750-16-sta-super-traxion.html

here is the fine selection of bias mud/steer tires from size 14-20 any truck can run these tires but caution some of the tires are tube type.
https://www.universaltire.com/truck-and-military/truck.html


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## Steve NW WI (Mar 19, 2013)

jakewells said:


> this is what i run on my trucks these tires will go were radials will not in my neck of the woods https://www.universaltire.com/truck-and-military/truck/750-16-sta-super-traxion.html
> 
> here is the fine selection of bias mud/steer tires from size 14-20 any truck can run these tires but caution some of the tires are tube type.
> https://www.universaltire.com/truck-and-military/truck.html



Holy crap - $253 for a 9.00x16, $271 if ya want tubeless, and still only load range D?


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## Deleted member 83629 (Mar 19, 2013)

my old Chevy calls for load range D tires and the ford calls for C but i just run d tires on it i get around 35,000 miles out of the tires.
they will rot off before wearing out.


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## Jredsjeep (Mar 19, 2013)

Thanks for posting that, I might stick with the radials then. I do use my truck off road to get wood and around the property but my truck is on the road %95+ of the time. That and its all highway to work, about 20 miles. My truck does not ride bad with 1 ton leaf springs all around but I would prefer not to make it worse.

To bad I can't try a set for a few weeks to see how I like them. Another thing not mentioned in the article is that they are supposed to be more stable with a load reducing under steer with the heavier side walls. I know I had more than I would have liked towing a camper last year. Not uncontrollable but it could have been better, and yeas I had good tire pressure.

Maybe I need to invest in some better tires next time around.


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## Whitespider (Mar 19, 2013)

Jredsjeep said:


> *I might stick with the radials then. ...my truck is on the road %95+ of the time. That and its all highway to work, about 20 miles.
> ...reducing under steer with the heavier side walls. I know I had more than I would have liked towing a camper last year.
> Maybe I need to invest in some better tires next time around.*



Yeah... with that much pavement and highway driving (95%) you'd be a very unhappy camper with bias ply tires.

Now about the problems when pulling the camper... different tires may help some, but quite often that "under steer" feel can be traced down to the wrong type hitch setup and/or trailer tongue-to-hitch relationship. What sort of hitch are you using?


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## Jakers (Mar 19, 2013)

Steve NW WI said:


> Holy crap - $253 for a 9.00x16, $271 if ya want tubeless, and still only load range D?



if you go to the STA website Bias Ply Tires for light trucks - STA Superlug Bias Ply it says they are 14PR for the tubless ones and 8 for the tube type


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## Jakers (Mar 19, 2013)

P.S. This is better than any mix oil thread hands down


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## Blazin (Mar 19, 2013)

5 pages and no pics? Put some ####ing wood in that golf cart would ya...and take a pic for the love of God


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## Whitespider (Mar 19, 2013)

Blazin said:


> *Put some ####ing wood in that golf cart would ya...and take a pic for the love of God*



*Well are you happy now!!??!!*
That there is even one of the sticks from the MIL's house!!!


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## brenndatomu (Mar 19, 2013)

^^^Ya might wanna touch up your chain. Looks like she's pullin hard right!^^^


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## Whitespider (Mar 19, 2013)

Ummmm........
Somebody's saw might be pulling, but it weren't me doin' the cuttin'... I just did the haulin'.


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## Deleted member 83629 (Mar 19, 2013)

dang that truck is rusty but it is a good one makes the best air conditioning in the summer


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## naturelover (Mar 19, 2013)

Whitespider said:


> If they're spinnin', the one thing you surely ain't got is traction.
> 
> I see that all the time, guys try to compensate for lack of traction with momentum... lock-it-in and go balls-to-the-wall. That's fine *if* you make it through (or over), but if you don't make it you're just that much deeper in the soup when it all comes to a stop. It can be especially bad in thick muck or deep, hard-pack/drifted snow because the tires will ride up on top until momentum is lost, then they break through, dig and leave the axles laying on top... with the tires suspended above any sort of available traction.
> 
> ...



Well there's your problem, you're backing up!!!!! Lol

Really, I've got in more trouble backing up than anything, especially in snow. its dang near impossible if there is any side slope, especially in a pickup. You will not stay in your tracks, even in deep ones backing downhill. Slapping on chains is about the only thing that will help that, and that's not a given.

Technique, throttle control and being able to "read" the lines through mud will matter much more than radial or bias ply. That does include easing into the mud to get a feel for it. Do that all the time. 

Once you commit to the mud though, gotta go for it. Easing through it is a sure way to get stuck, imo. The only way the tires will clean themselves is if they are turning fast enough. Balls to the wall can get you stuck too, but can't ease into it either. Momentum is the key, lose it and you've lost the battle. 

I've gotten it wrong though, and have had the tow rope hooked to me a "couple" times. Comes with the territory I suppose, some days, ya gotta walk.


Sent from my iPhone 5 using Tapatalk


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## strangersfaces (Mar 19, 2013)

I see you had the high priced help riding shotgun...




Good looking boy...


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## Blazin (Mar 20, 2013)

I hope that young'n has had a tetanus shot if he gets to playing around the truck, just sayin... :msp_w00t:


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## Whitespider (Mar 20, 2013)

naturelover said:


> *Really, I've got in more trouble backing up than anything, especially in snow. its dang near impossible if there is any side slope, especially in a pickup.*


That’s because you’re running the wrong tire.



> * Slapping on chains is about the only thing that will help that, and that's not a given.*


That’s because you’re running the wrong tire.



> *Once you commit to the mud though, gotta go for it. Easing through it is a sure way to get stuck, imo.*


That’s because you’re running the wrong tire.



> * The only way the tires will clean themselves is if they are turning fast enough.*


That’s because you’re running the wrong tire.



> * Momentum is the key, lose it and you've lost the battle.*


That’s because you’re running the wrong tire.



> *I've gotten it wrong… had the tow rope hooked to me a "couple" times.*


That’s because you’re running the wrong tire… and trying to do more with them than they are designed to do.

Radial All-Terrain (A/T) tires are not Off-Road tires; they are street tires with a little extra tread in case there’s some snow on the road or you need to drive across wet grass. Bias Ply Traction-Lug tires get all their traction from the side lugs, the center tread does virtually nothing (except on pavement). The lugs are self cleaning… as the tire comes in contact with ground any mud/snow in them is forced out the side so the lugs are _always and constantly_ pulling against new earth/snow. (There are some Traction-Lug radials, but they don’t work the same because of the radial sidewall “bulge”).

Radial All-Terrain (A/T) tires ride up on top of “stuff” and the treads load up, that’s why you have trouble backing up, why you spin the wheels, and why you use momentum to compensate for lack of traction. “Momentum” is not your friend running Bias Ply Traction-Lug tires, they are narrow and have stiff sidewalls, they do not ride up on top of “stuff”… they cut in and pull. Spinning the wheels is the one thing you _absolutely *do not* want to do_ running Bias Ply Traction-Lug tires… they’ll dig a hole to China faster than you can blink. A slow and easy slip will sometimes be the ticket… but if you put your foot-in-it, you’ll be buried to your door handles in two seconds.

I stopped running Radial All-Terrain (A/T) tires and switched to Bias Ply Traction-Lug for 8-9 months of the year _because of all the things you are saying!_. Since then, the only time I’ve had a “_tow rope hooked to me_” is when I’m pulling some else out!


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## Whitespider (Mar 20, 2013)

Blazin said:


> *I hope that young'n has had a tetanus shot if he gets to playing around the truck, just sayin...* :msp_w00t:



That rust is pretty typical of vehicles that spend a lot of time on our crushed limestone roads here in Iowa. The limestone dust gets packed up into every nook-N-cranny, often mixed with calcium chloride (or other ice melting chemicals), and then draws moisture from the air... never drys completely out. Vehicles literally rot from the inside-out.

One of my fuel tanks rotted through a couple years ago... and now the other one started dripping when it's over half full. Looks like I'll be pulling the box off this spring and replacing both tanks... which will give me a chance to plate some of the "swiss-cheese" starting along the frame rails. Even the engine oil pan is lookin' a bit ugly. I figure another 4-5 years and the rust will have finally taken its toll... and off to the salvage yard she'll have to go... it's sort'a sad really, that truck only has 68,000 miles on it. I don't have a clue what to replace it with... nothing made in the last 25-years or so excites me much, just too much unnecessary stuff on them that's bound to "go wrong" the way I use 'em.


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## Blazin (Mar 20, 2013)

Whitespider said:


> That rust is pretty typical of vehicles that spend a lot of time on our crushed limestone roads here in Iowa. The limestone dust gets packed up into every nook-N-cranny, often mixed with calcium chloride (or other ice melting chemicals), and then draws moisture from the air... never drys completely out. Vehicles literally rot from the inside-out.
> 
> One of my fuel tanks rotted through a couple years ago... and now the other one started dripping when it's over half full. Looks like I'll be pulling the box off this spring and replacing both tanks... which will give me a chance to plate some of the "swiss-cheese" starting along the frame rails. Even the engine oil pan is lookin' a bit ugly. I figure another 4-5 years and the rust will have finally taken its toll... and off to the salvage yard she'll have to go... it's sort'a sad really, that truck only has 68,000 miles on it. I don't have a clue what to replace it with... nothing made in the last 25-years or so excites me much, just too much unnecessary stuff on them that's bound to "go wrong" the way I use 'em.



I hear that, the freakin road salt they use here destroys a vehicle way to quick! Just for the record, my back bumper makes yours look like new


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## brenndatomu (Mar 20, 2013)

Steve NW WI said:


> I'm gonna let you have your biased (pun fully intended) opinion on this one. All I'm gonna say is that any time I've been stuck, be it radial or bias ply tires, traction hasn't been the issue. Lack of ground clearance (be it 6" in a car or 2' or better on a tractor) was what stopped forward progress. Ain't but two things that will help that: A taller tire, and hope we hit solid ground before we bottom out even deeper in, or a wider one that will float over it. Therefore, I'll continue to think that my "inferior" radials have "enough" traction.
> 
> PS - Spidey, if you decide you need a custom user title, *might I suggest "That 70s Show" for ya?*





Whitespider said:


> That rust is pretty typical of vehicles that spend a lot of time on our crushed limestone roads here in Iowa. The limestone dust gets packed up into every nook-N-cranny, often mixed with calcium chloride (or other ice melting chemicals), and then draws moisture from the air... never drys completely out. Vehicles literally rot from the inside-out.
> 
> One of my fuel tanks rotted through a couple years ago... and now the other one started dripping when it's over half full. Looks like I'll be pulling the box off this spring and replacing both tanks... which will give me a chance to plate some of the "swiss-cheese" starting along the frame rails. Even the engine oil pan is lookin' a bit ugly. I figure another 4-5 years and the rust will have finally taken its toll... and off to the salvage yard she'll have to go... it's sort'a sad really, that truck only has 68,000 miles on it. I don't have a clue what to replace it with... *nothing made in the last 25-years or so excites me much*, just too much unnecessary stuff on them that's bound to "go wrong" the way I use 'em.



Go down south, find ya a nice clean '78-'79 F150 

That's what I've done the last couple vehicles. High mileage but rust free....:msp_thumbup: I can fix the mechanicals, but once the rust worms move in...:msp_thumbdn:


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## Whitespider (Mar 20, 2013)

brenndatomu said:


> *Go down south, find ya a nice clean '78-'79 F150*



I've owned or driven a bunch so it's hard to remember exact details, but...
The best truck I ever had was 1976 or 1977 (??) F250 4x4... that thing was a friggin' tank!
If I remember correctly it had the 360/390 class V8 in it (that might make it a '76, don't remember for sure?) with a Motorcraft 4-BBL carb... and it sucked gas like a tank!


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## brenndatomu (Mar 20, 2013)

A neighbor farmer I worked for back in high school had a mid '70s F250 "high boy" with a 360 or 390, (don't remember which) & a 4 spd. It was set up as a spray truck, that thing would almost climb a tree! 'Course, it did have bias ply digger tires on it... and here I thought it was just a bad-to-the-bone-truck all these years!


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## Whitespider (Mar 20, 2013)

That old '76-'77 F250 of mine had bias ply traction-lug tires on it (I think that was standard equipment on HD 4x4's at the time).
It also had a locking front axle... and it would climb a tree!


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## Jredsjeep (Mar 20, 2013)

my poser shot, and i thought my bed was rusted out! i plan on fighting the cancer bug this spring by pulling the bed sandblasting the frame and more, then welding in new patch panals.

i have already replaced both tanks from rust holes.

as far as the hitch i know it was not set up right but it was not my camper, i have a regular reciever in the back but the little 18 ft camper did not sit high enough for the truck. the whole camper was pointed upward in the front a few degrees. i was not investing in a new drop hitch for borrowing it once.

my tires are a bit oversized, i like the look but i did not pick them out. i traded my stock steel rims and stock tires for these alloy wheels with tires a few years back. the next tires i get will be a little smaller and narrow to cut through more. even with my front solid axle and diesel i can spin in the yard in 4x4 with these tires floating on top of stuff if its a little wet out.


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## Whitespider (Mar 20, 2013)

Jredsjeep said:


> *my poser shot, and i thought my bed was rusted out!*



Man, those running board things you have on there wouldn't last a week for me... they'd get hooked on something, ripped off, run over, and shreaded the first time I was off the road.


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## brenndatomu (Mar 20, 2013)

Whitespider said:


> That old '76-'77 F250 of mine had bias ply traction-lug tires on it (I think that was standard equipment on HD 4x4's at the time).
> It also had a locking front axle... *and it would climb a tree!*



and you probably personally verified this, huh?!


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## Jredsjeep (Mar 20, 2013)

i was going to pull them off the when i first got the truck, i am actaully not a huge fan of them, they have slid over a decent amount of things and have been repainted several times. it was when i saw my then 18 month old be able to climb in the truck himself that i let them stay. he is now 7 and i got a 3 yr and 2 month old so i think they will stay a while longer yet if i can keep them from rusting out.


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## Whitespider (Mar 20, 2013)

Funny story about running boards (well… it’s funny now)…

Back in 2001-’02 I traded a 1988 Bronco for the current pickup… It had running boards on it, and OE type tires mounted to the OE polished aluminum wheels. I was gonna’ take the running boards off the day I drove it home, but the wife wanted me to leave them on because it was easier for her to climb in and out. Man… we argued about those boards for two days, and I kept telling her they were a mistake.

Anyway, we’d had the truck about a week when I stuck the little tractor pulling a load of fire pit wood out’a the woodlot. I walked up to the house, grabbed the recovery strap and told the wife to drive the pickup down to the south end and pull me out. She hooked the passenger-side running board on a stump, tore it off the truck, ran over it with the spinning right rear, destroying both the tire *and wheel*!

Well… that pretty much ended the argument over running boards!
All I could do was shake my head... weren’t no sense in saying, “_I told ya’ so_”… the look on her face was enough.


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## Steve NW WI (Mar 20, 2013)

Spidey, I'll agree on one thing with ya, heck, maybe 2, I'm feeling generous today:

All Terrain tires, ain't all terrain. Most of em are fair to horsepoop off road, but as long as Joe Big City sees "All Terrain" in white letters on the side, he knows he's got an off road machine. Mud tires are much better in most situations (ice being the exception, needs more biting edges to work well on ice), but yuppies don't like the tire noise that comes with em. Too hard to hear the cheesy cat-back dual exhaust (that will rot off in 5 years) over the tire howl going down the road.

#2 - salt sucks. (Sadly, the newer trucks neither of us really care for are doing a lot better job at holding up to it than the classics ever did)


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## Whitespider (Mar 20, 2013)

Steve NW WI said:


> *Mud tires are much better in most situations (ice being the exception... )...*



Many times I've thought how cool it would be to have a button on my dash... push it and the steel studs extend from the tires, push it again and they retract back into the tires. Now that there would be a worthwhile gadget I'd be more than willing to pay for!


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## Steve NW WI (Mar 20, 2013)

Only the mail lady can get away with studs up here any more. Been a long time since I've seen a studded tire around here. I do have a set of chains that'll fit the Chevy, just for insurance. Only put em on once, just for a test fit. Better to have em and not need em than to need em and not have em I say.


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## brenndatomu (Mar 20, 2013)

Still legal in Ohio, Nov 1 - Apr 15. A few people run 'em around here, not much need anymore, not really. Just south of the snow belt here, so winter is not so scary...
Surprised they are illegal for the average Joe in WI!
Edit: Studs, that is...


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## brenndatomu (Mar 20, 2013)

Whitespider said:


> Many times I've thought how cool it would be to have a button on my dash... push it and the steel studs extend from the tires, push it again and they retract back into the tires. Now that there would be a worthwhile gadget I'd be more than willing to pay for!



Might hafta grab yur wallet spidey... do an online search for "retractable stud tires" 

I'd post a link but someone threatened to wack my winky with a strip of studded tire tread :msp_scared: the last time I posted a non sponsor link!


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## Whitespider (Mar 20, 2013)

Naw… I don’t think those tires ever materialized… but I remember the hoopla over them.

Around 2007 there was a company developing an extendable/retractable stud tire using a secondary air chamber. Really… I’m not kidding… just push the button I was talking about. One problem (as I remember) was it used the air already in the tire to expand the secondary chamber and extend the studs, but retracting them required expelling the air… which left the tire low on air pressure. The name of the company was Q Tire, and they were promising the product by late 2008 – early 2009… then the website, and the company, just disappeared from the face of the earth. I never did hear if any of those tires actually hit the roadways or not…

Studs are still legal here in Iowa from November 1 to April 1.
Interestingly, both Minnesota and Wisconsin have outlawed them (except for certain government and emergency vehicles). Although both states allow non-residents to leave them on if just passing through… i.e., I don’t have to take them off when I drive up to the Mayo Clinic or Cabelas shopping. Minnesota and Wisconsin are notorious for “black ice” on their roadways, yet they choose to hamstring their residents???


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## H 2 H (Mar 20, 2013)

Just made a trade to get a new fire wood truck

View attachment 285793


1985 Ford F 250 with a 460

Former sprint car owners truck used to tow his sprint car to the track (5 miles back and forth) 

2 cords of wood and a Earthquake chain saw :msp_smile:


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## ShaneLogs (Mar 20, 2013)

There ya go! Sounds like a good score. I love Ash. I always roam around looking for downed Ash trees!


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## Blazin (Mar 20, 2013)

This whole thread is bull####, I wanna see a bumper draggin with a truck load of wood


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## timberland ts (Mar 20, 2013)

I think everyone in the state of vt runs studded tires. I have chains for my one ton, skidsteer,bucket truck,and mule. Come in handy. Its only a load if its over the cab!


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## Whitespider (Mar 20, 2013)

Steve NW WI said:


> *Spidey - what ya got for tires on that thing. I'm looking for a new set, and the Wild Country MTs I always liked are NLA...*



OK, since your stuck on radial off-road tires :msp_tongue:
It seems I remember from somewhere that Wild Country tires were made by Cooper Tire Company... or at least they were at one time. Personally I like Cooper tires, they hold up the best of any (on average) running our crushed limestone roads. I checked out the Cooper website and found their newest M/T (?) tire, the Discoverer STT... and I was less than impressed...

CooperTiresConsumer - Discoverer STT<span class='trademark'>™</span>






Then I also remembered that Cooper also markets tires under the Mastercraft name.
I checked out the latest Mastercraft M/T tire, the Courser M/T... I like the looks of it better.
Maybe this one can replace your beloved :hmm3grin2orange: Wild Country M/T. Anyway, just a thought...

CooperMastercraft - Courser MT


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## naturelover (Mar 20, 2013)

Whitespider said:


> That’s because you’re running the wrong tire.
> 
> 
> That’s because you’re running the wrong tire.
> ...



So every time you gotten stuck, its been because of radial tires?

I don't doubt the traction lugs are better than AT tires, two different uses.

Will a radial tire, same size, same tread pattern, same inflation pressure on the same vehicle, be significantly handicapped against a bias ply tire?

I could be wrong. I have NOT ran a bias ply tire, but most of the times I've been stuck its because a bad decision on my part.

Other times because of pride.... :msp_tongue:

I would say that I might try some bias plys on the Ranger next time, but I don't know that the frame will outlast the AT's that's on it now... 

Will say momentum is also key for hill climbing. Even just a slip can be disastrous.

Speaking of, how about rock climbing? Would the softness of a radial be better than stiffness of a bias ply?

As for the backing in the snow, I have backed downhill in the snow and never slipped a tire. The tires would NOT stay in the tracks I had made going up the hill, they dug themselves out of the ruts and into the deep stuff.

That wasn't a factor of the tire, but of the weight distribution of the pickup.

Same thing can happen going forward too. I was out a couple weekends ago in some snow and following along in the tracks that others had made. Unfortunately, they had been made with full size pickups and were wider than the Ranger. I was all over the freaking road, even though the pavement was showing through the tracks, just couldn't stay in them.

Was fun indeed, but it was in a remote area, and I didn't want to get stuck, so I found a place where the sun had melted the snow enough for me to turn around. In my younger years, I wouldn't have done that. Made a good decision that time and avoided getting stuck.

As said, I would run bias ply tires if it is a significant improvement over the same radial tire. But is it really THAT much different? 

The AT's above do a pretty good job for what they are. Seem to be a good alternative to a full on mud tire. They ride pretty well on the hardtop and do well off-road and in the snow. They aren't mud tires though, and as with any tire, do have their limitations.

The best things one can have when off-roading or in snow isn't tires, but chains, and a strong winch....

A chainsaw can help too with a well placed log in a mudhole, or for building a big fire for your night stay in the woods.. 

I will say it is pouring the snow as I type.... I like snow.


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## DSS (Mar 20, 2013)

I've been plowing snow for 22 years I think, and driving on snow covered and ice coated roads for longer than that, and I've never heard as much bull#### as I have reading this thread. I'm glad I had my boots on. 

Carry on, I'm outta here.


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## naturelover (Mar 20, 2013)

Aww, ya at least gotta answer bias ply or radial DSS!! :jester:

ETA: We need a poll me thinks...


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## Whitespider (Mar 20, 2013)

OK… this will be fun. First let me quote myself from page 3 of this thread…
“_I'm sure someone who has never run a traction-lug bias tire will argue with me and tell me what great traction they get with their wonder-radials._”
I believe we have that “someone”.



naturelover said:


> *So every time you gotten stuck, its been because of radial tires?*


No… every time I’ve gotten stuck it was because I was asking the tires to do more than what they were designed to do.



> *Will a radial tire, same size, same tread pattern, same inflation pressure on the same vehicle, be significantly handicapped against a bias ply tire?*


First of all, because of construction differences, you can’t use the same tread pattern on radial and bias tires.
Second, because of construction differences, the two can’t be the exact same size… assuming height is the same, the radial *must* be wider than the bias, no way around it.
Third, even if you could make them the same size with the same tread pattern, because of construction differences, it would be impossible to run them at the same inflation pressures without destroying one or the other… it-is-what-it-is.
Your above comparison is an impossibility… a fantasy… the question can not be answered. You are trying to make an apple-to-apple comparison by using an apple and an orange for the example.



> *Will say momentum is also key for hill climbing. Even just a slip can be disastrous.
> Speaking of, how about rock climbing? Would the softness of a radial be better than stiffness of a bias ply?*


Hill climbing is a form of extreme competition where the whole idea is to push the machine (including the tires) to the brink of failure… that’s not anything near what we’re talking about here.
A bias tire has a “stiffer” sidewall than a radial, but the outer rubber (the tread) of a bias ply tire is typically softer and “stickier” than that of a radial. Rock climbing takes tire abuse to the extreme, well past the sidewall limits of most radial tires… bias ply tires are the choice of serious rock climbers.



> *As for the backing in the snow, I have backed downhill in the snow and never slipped a tire. The tires would NOT stay in the tracks I had made going up the hill, they dug themselves out of the ruts and into the deep stuff.
> That wasn't a factor of the tire, but of the weight distribution of the pickup.*


No… that was a factor of the tire you’re running.
When you drove up the hill your tires did not make tracks *in* the snow, they made tracks *on* the snow. Rather than cut down through the snow they rode up on top and packed it down… basically making a raised hard-pack. When you tried backing down the hill on (not in) those tracks your tires were simply sliding off the raised areas you had created. A good traction-lug bias ply would have cut through to solid ground on the way up, and would have almost followed those tracks without you steering when you backed down them.



> *…following along in the tracks that others had made. Unfortunately, they had been made with full size pickups and were wider than the Ranger. I was all over the freaking road…*


Same reason as above… your radial A/T street tires were _sliding_ sideways off the raised hard-pack.



> *As said, I would run bias ply tires if it is a significant improvement over the same radial tire. But is it really THAT much different?*


Yes… there really is THAT much difference. But in your case you wouldn’t need to go to a bias ply to gain a ton of improvement… just swapping those radial A/T street tires for a radial off-road tire, like an M/T or even M/S would make so much difference you’d be wondering why you ever bought A/T’s in the first place.



> *The AT's above do a pretty good job for what they are. Seem to be a good alternative to a full on mud tire. They ride pretty well on the hardtop and do well off-road and in the snow.*


Radial A/T’s ain’t an alternative…. most ain’t even a compromise. They are not an off-road tire, and they were never intended as an off-road tire… they ain’t even advertised as an off-road tire. They are designed to handle difficult *road* conditions and look “cool” on Cowboy Cadillac’s and fancy SUV’s.
Like I said, I have a set of A/T’s for my truck that I run during mid-summer… they’re my summer street tire.


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## Whitespider (Mar 20, 2013)

DSS said:


> *I've been plowing snow for 22 years I think, and driving on snow covered and ice coated roads for longer than that, and I've never heard as much bull#### as I have reading this thread. I'm glad I had my boots on.
> 
> Carry on, I'm outta here.*



Don't get confused... we ain't talking about plowing snow (which I do with plain-jane transport tread tires) or driving on roads. We're talking about driving the wood-hauling pickup off-road to get firewood... don't ya' know.


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## Steve NW WI (Mar 21, 2013)

DSS said:


> I've been plowing snow for 22 years I think, and driving on snow covered and ice coated roads for longer than that, and I've never heard as much bull#### as I have reading this thread. I'm glad I had my boots on.
> 
> Carry on, I'm outta here.



Hey DSS - I gotta know two things:

What kinda tires does that big yeller snow plow of yours have? (I'm bettin radial, probably Michelins)

Has it spent any time "off road" 

(Pics might help Spidey with a visual)


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## Jredsjeep (Mar 21, 2013)

DSS said:


> I've been plowing snow for 22 years I think, and driving on snow covered and ice coated roads for longer than that, and I've never heard as much bull#### as I have reading this thread. I'm glad I had my boots on.
> 
> Carry on, I'm outta here.



so i have to ask iffen you come back, in all those years have you run a good set of both radial and bias tires?


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## cmsmoke (Mar 21, 2013)

Whitespider said:


> Don't get confused... we ain't talking about plowing snow (which I do with plain-jane transport tread tires) or driving on roads. We're talking about driving the wood-hauling pickup off-road to get firewood... don't ya' know.



Hold everything...isn't this the first time you hauled wood in your truck?


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## Whitespider (Mar 21, 2013)

cmsmoke said:


> *Hold everything...isn't this the first time you hauled wood in your truck?*



YEAH! And I did it with bias ply tires!
Nothing exploded, nothing caught on fire, I didn't get stuck in the MIL's yard, I didn't slide in the ditch, I didn't lose control and bounce through peoples yards, the world didn't come to an end, and life was generally good here despite that traumatic ordeal... even the 5-year-old survived!


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## cmsmoke (Mar 21, 2013)

That is alot of experience...Did you sleep at a Holiday Inn Express again?


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## Whitespider (Mar 21, 2013)

cmsmoke said:


> *That is alot of experience...Did you sleep at a Holiday Inn Express again?*



You're reading a bit more into it than there is (have we been here before?).
It's the first time _this_ truck has hauled firewood... it certainly ain't the only time I've hauled firewood in a pickup.
Heck, I was helping dad and granddad cut and haul firewood in pickups as far back as the mid-60's... on bias ply tires. I remember the first time dad used a pickup with radial tires to cut firewood (remember, he was a car dealer)... early '80's... we got stuck and had to unload the darn thing.


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## cmsmoke (Mar 21, 2013)

Been where?...It's all there in black and white. Keep backpedaling.


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## Blazin (Mar 21, 2013)

Did I mention I like tater tots? opcorn:


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## Whitespider (Mar 21, 2013)

cmsmoke said:


> *Been where?...It's all there in black and white. Keep backpedaling.*



It's black and yellow on my screen...
And I just went back and looked at all my posts in this thread...
I can't find where I even so much as suggested I've never hauled firewood in a pickup (before this).
I guess you'll haf'ta show me where this "backpedaling" thing is coming from ???


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## Blazin (Mar 21, 2013)

Weather checked all season radials is how I roll 












BFG Commercial traction radials, hauls wood and pushes snow like a M'fer 






Gripper D bias ply caps that take 5 ton to make them round again, radials when these finally wear out.....


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## Arbonaut (Mar 21, 2013)

This is not the first time I hauled wood in my truck. Today was the first time with a new tailgate, though. Haha. Smashing tailgates since 1971.


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## Blazin (Mar 21, 2013)

Arbonaut said:


> This is not the first time I hauled wood in my truck. Today was the first time with a new tailgate, though. Haha. Smashing tailgates since 1971.



LMAO


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## Steve NW WI (Mar 21, 2013)

Arbonaut said:


> This is not the first time I hauled wood in my truck. Today was the first time with a new tailgate, though. Haha. Smashing tailgates since 1971.



Having a tailgate is your first problem.

Blazin, how's this for ya, sorry the bumper ain't draggin, it's a Chev after all, complete with radials:


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## Steve NW WI (Mar 21, 2013)

Ahh, a close up of said useless radial tire. Dang, that pic's gettin old, still got the tires, but that tailpipe's long gone:


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## Whitespider (Mar 21, 2013)

Arbonaut said:


> *Smashing tailgates since 1971.*



Now that there is funny!


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## Gologit (Mar 21, 2013)

Radials...for when you're _serious_ about hauling wood.


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## Blazin (Mar 21, 2013)

Steve NW WI said:


> Having a tailgate is your first problem.
> 
> Blazin, how's this for ya, sorry the bumper ain't draggin, it's a Chev after all, complete with radials:


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## Steve NW WI (Mar 21, 2013)

Gologit said:


> Radials...for when you're _serious_ about hauling wood.



Bob - they didn't take that thing OFF ROAD to get that wood, did they? How many dozers did it take to get them back on the road? Do dozers run bias or radial tracks?

I better quit - I'll wind up having to ban myself.


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## Gologit (Mar 21, 2013)

Steve NW WI said:


> Bob - they didn't take that thing OFF ROAD to get that wood, did they? How many dozers did it take to get them back on the road? Do dozers run bias or radial tracks?
> 
> I better quit - I'll wind up having to ban myself.



Define "off road"....:msp_rolleyes: There was about twenty miles of unpaved logging road, some 15% grades, some "get it right the first time or else" switchbacks....but other than that it wasn't bad at all.

No dozers...we save those for the _bad_ roads.

And back to radials...the drive tires and the trailer tires are all recaps. Some of them have been capped several times. Does that answer how well radial sidewalls hold up to severe conditions?

Also, that load of cedar was just a little overweight. Just a little.


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## Whitespider (Mar 21, 2013)

*WOW!*
Lookin' at all these pictures of radial tires and I'm thinkin' I see pattern...
So I go check out some pages on the "_Wood Hauler picture Thread_" to confirm...
Why is it all these radials workin' in mud or snow have their tread partially, or fully, loaded up?
And just how does that help with traction?





This one here is classic... don't ya think?








Ya know what?? All the bias ply tires I see workin' in mud or snow look like this...











Yup... pretty sure I'm seein' a definite pattern...


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## Blazin (Mar 21, 2013)

Bias ply tires are mud and snow resistant?


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## Steve NW WI (Mar 21, 2013)

whitespider said:


> Ya know what?? All the bias ply tires I see workin' in mud or snow look like this...
> 
> 
> 
> ...




So am I, neither of the two duallys you posted pics of have moved recently. Go take the Ford for a lap around the yard, park it, and take a pic.

The 70s called. They want you back.


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## Steve NW WI (Mar 21, 2013)

Been a while, Spidey must be stuck in the yard. Hope he gets out before I get home from work tonight.


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## Whitespider (Mar 21, 2013)

MAN!!! You guys are brutal!
I can't drive around the yard and take pictures right now... I'm at work (and I've actually been working).


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## Big_Al (Mar 21, 2013)

Throw my 2 cents in, just reading thru the article posted re difference in tires, sounds like the only category the bias tires have an advantage is in severe off road conditions. Comparison part of article below.




The shock absorbing flexible sidewall of the radial allows the tire to conform to irregularities, _important for off-roading_. Combined with the flat tread area, _radials have excellent traction_. They also respond to airing down very well. The stiffer construction of bias ply and belted bias ply tires inhibit the tire from conforming and makes the contact patch smaller. However, the flatter tread and distributed load in the belted version does improve its traction

For more moderate off-roading, the choice is not clear. A case can be made for either design. While the radial has the aforementioned disadvantages, the radial's flexibility gives it a smoother ride. It also conforms to irregularities, and with the belt, distributes the load evenly for excellent traction. They also air down well for a larger footprint for floatation.

Similarly, we already pointed out the benefits of the bias ply off-road. However, they suffer from a stiff sidewall resulting in a rough ride. They do not conform to irregularities or distribute the load as well. The _smaller contact area reduces traction_. Airing down has less effect on the contact area. A belted design helps in the traction but not much else.


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## Arbonaut (Mar 21, 2013)

W250 Dodge





Same tires and size on My Chevy 4x4. These are Load rating E and I think they are Coopers. Best tire I've found for goin' back in them fields.





Wild Country. Hahahaha. Is that like George Jones? Haha. I think so.


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## brenndatomu (Mar 21, 2013)

Steve NW WI said:


> So am I, neither of the two duallys you posted pics of have moved recently. Go take the Ford for a lap around the yard, park it, and take a pic.
> 
> The 70s called. They want you back.



Ahhh, the 70s...back when they still knew how to build a proper wood burner! :hmm3grin2orange:


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## Arbonaut (Mar 21, 2013)

Steve NW WI said:


> The 70s called. They want you back.



Dang Steve, with all due respect, can I use that one in my signature? Hahaha. Good one. I wish the seventies wanted me back.


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## Whitespider (Mar 21, 2013)

Brutal... *Brutal...* *Brutal!!*


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## Blazin (Mar 21, 2013)

brenndatomu said:


> Ahhh, the 70s...back when they still knew how to build a proper wood burner! :hmm3grin2orange:



Eh, that's a toss up....the 80's short skirts did leave an impression too


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## brenndatomu (Mar 21, 2013)

Blazin said:


> Eh, that's a toss up....the 80's short skirts did leave an impression too



Yeah, and if ya's wanted to impress one of those short skirts buy doing a long smoky burnout with your mustang, a nice set of bias plys on the back, definitely the way to go!


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## brenndatomu (Mar 21, 2013)

Whitespider said:


> Brutal... *Brutal...* *Brutal!!*



And you love it!!! otstir:


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## tbow388 (Mar 21, 2013)

*PPPfffttttt*

All you guys and your tire talk. Man up and run on the rim!!!!!:msp_smile:


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## Blazin (Mar 21, 2013)

brenndatomu said:


> Yeah, and if ya's wanted to impress one of those short skirts buy doing a long smoky burnout with your mustang, a nice set of bias plys on the back, definitely the way to go!



No, mustang... T'was just a '84 big block K20 with bias ply 36" ground hawgs, holy smoke show.....and amazingly enough they never loaded up with blacktop


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## Whitespider (Mar 21, 2013)

Big_Al said:


> *Throw my 2 cents in, just reading thru the article posted re difference in tires, sounds like the only category the bias tires have an advantage is in severe off road conditions.*



But ya' forgot the most important paragraph *Big_Al*...



> For severe off-road driving, *the bias ply is a stronger tire*. The nylon sidewalls resist abrasions more than the polyester. More importantly, the bias construction tolerates twisting and bending from rocks and roots. Since the sidewall is as strong as the rest of the body, it can take lateral loads from rocks and roots without splitting. *They can survive abuse that would destroy a radial*. The radial's sidewall plies don't reinforce each other, making them very vulnerable to splitting from twisting, bending, and side loads. The weak sidewalls can also bulge out quite far, exposing them to danger. *The bias ply can use extremely aggressive treads for excellent traction. Sidewall tread blocks can help protect the sidewall further and to add traction to climb out of ruts and up rocks*.


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## Blazin (Mar 21, 2013)

A lot of reading going on here, you guys got any pictures?


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## Whitespider (Mar 21, 2013)

I'll tell ya' what *Blazin*,
I need to move some more wood in the house tomorrow.
Rather than the little tractor and trailer I'll use the truck... and take a picture just for you!!! 

(Is it OK if I get the tires in the shot also???)


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## Blazin (Mar 21, 2013)

Whitespider said:


> I'll tell ya' what *Blazin*,
> I need to move some more wood in the house tomorrow.
> Rather than the little tractor and trailer I'll use the truck... and take a picture just for you!!!



Bout time, and don't hose the tires before you take the pic..


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## brenndatomu (Mar 21, 2013)

tbow388 said:


> All you guys and your tire talk. Man up and run on the rim!!!!!:msp_smile:



Heck yah brotha! And none of those fancy pants new fangled 22" aluminuminum rims either, go 15" steel or go home!!!   :yoyo:


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## Big_Al (Mar 21, 2013)

I noted the extreme off road advantage they mentioned but didn't look like anyone here was doing any thing very extreme.


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## Steve NW WI (Mar 22, 2013)

Pic of DSS' aforementioned snow plow rig. Courtesy of the Good Morning Check In thread. Note the radial tires. Hope it works OK off road.


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## Blazin (Mar 22, 2013)

Steve NW WI said:


> Pic of DSS' aforementioned snow plow rig. Courtesy of the Good Morning Check In thread. Note the radial tires. Hope it works OK off road.



They gotta be radials, the snow is stuck to em


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## Dale (Mar 22, 2013)

strangersfaces said:


> I see you had the high priced help riding shotgun...
> 
> 
> 
> ...



If I had to hazard a guess, I'd say the lad has a good lookin mom. :redface:


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## Arbonaut (Mar 22, 2013)




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## Steve NW WI (Mar 22, 2013)

Arbonaut said:


> Wild Country. Hahahaha. Is that like George Jones? Haha. I think so.



Side lugs on a radial tire? Oh my! I thought they only came on them high traction bias tires! (Wild Country is more like Hank Jr./Justin Moore than ole George BTW)



Arbonaut said:


> Dang Steve, with all due respect, can I use that one in my signature? Hahaha. Good one. I wish the seventies wanted me back.



Feel free! Although the front fenders on the Chev say you're in the 80s.


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## Steve NW WI (Mar 22, 2013)

PS - I'm certain those automatic hubs are NOT Spidey approved.


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## Blazin (Mar 22, 2013)

Steve NW WI said:


> PS - I'm certain those automatic hubs are NOT Spidey approved.



Them auto hubs ain't approved by me either, lockouts all the way here when there's a choice. My 85 K20 yard rig did have them, now it's sportin full time plugs


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## Arbonaut (Mar 22, 2013)

Steve NW WI said:


> Side lugs on a radial tire? Oh my! I thought they only came on them high traction bias tires! (Wild Country is more like Hank Jr./Justin Moore than ole George BTW)
> Check.
> 
> 
> ...


It's a 1983 barn find with 33,000 actual miles. K2500



Steve NW WI said:


> PS - I'm certain those automatic hubs are NOT Spidey approved.


Look closer at the Dodge ones, I dunno if Dodge is Spidy approve or not. Don't matter, just point it'll go.


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## Blazin (Mar 22, 2013)

Arbonaut said:


> It's a 1983 barn find with 33,000 actual miles. K2500



You suck! :msp_w00t: I'm looking for one of them early 80's unmolested and not rotted to crap K20's, just can't bring myself to buy one of them new car/trucks.


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## Arbonaut (Mar 22, 2013)

Blazin said:


> You suck! :msp_w00t: I'm looking for one of them early 80's unmolested and not rotted to crap K20's, just can't bring myself to buy one of them new car/trucks.



Er, yeah K20. It was the find of a lifetime. The old boy was an electrician with health issues. He bought it new up in Quincy Illinois. I went to school with his daughter, the guys used to get her to fly out the Mcdonald's parking lot and jump snow drift in it. So them miles are deceptive, you can't hurt 'em though they were built right. Corporate axles, 350/350. I'm working on a OBD1 Winnebago 350 EFI for it since it sat 12 years in a heated lumberyard barn, I want to freshen up some thang on the old four-bolt. You know showin' the old girl some luv..


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## Whitespider (Mar 22, 2013)

Steve NW WI said:


> *PS - I'm certain those automatic hubs are NOT Spidey approved.*



Ya' got that right... I swapped mine out the day I brought it home!!

*OK boys, it's the moment of truth.*

I looked for the deepest snow on the place and found it in my "logging" road that runs along the west edge of the woodlot... it sort'a drifts in there. Half way down the road I rolled to a stop and took the picture. I see the left rear picked up a tad bit of snow just as it rolled to a stop, but the rest of the tire(s) self-cleaned... INCLUDING THE CENTER TREAD!











I finished my trip through the woodlot and turned into the field looking for mud. All I could find was a bit just before I turned into the yard. I didn't stop and take pictures because it wasn't all that spectacular. The ground was froze solid under it so the mud was only about 2-inches deep... besides, I didn't feel like loading my boots with mud. Anyway, you can see the tires didn't pick up any of that mud... INCLUDING THE CENTER TREAD!











Funniest thing... as I came across the yard ice to park it the rear end slipped a little sideways. I looked down... and guess what? _*I hadn't put it in 4-wheel drive!*_ I'd just assumed it was still in 4x4 mode from getting the wood at the MIL's. Didn't matter one wit, I never slipped a tire until I hit the ice anyway... try that with your radials (in 2-wheel drive). Heck you're even welcome to run in the tracks I left ya'! :msp_tongue:

*Blazin*, man, I'm gonna haft'a break my promise to ya', I can't use the truck to bring wood up to the house. We've had a bit of sun and combined with the warmth around the foundation the area I'd need to back into is a mud hole. No, I ain't worried about getting stuck... I don't wanna' tear the yard all to heck.


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## Arbonaut (Mar 22, 2013)

She gets lockouts, too. 

I was 12 when this ol' girl was made. I distinctly remember the old fart's objection over the way ever thing was being made. Now we are the old fart. And the way something was made in 1983 was not as bad as we was told.


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## chucker (Mar 22, 2013)

Arbonaut said:


> She gets lockouts, too.
> 
> I was 12 when this ol' girl was made. I distinctly remember the old fart's objection over the way ever thing was being made. Now we are the old fart. And the way something was made in 1983 was not as bad as we was told.



lol this is true to all young/old farts as time creeps up on us all... give the "NEW JUNK" a few decades and the '"NEW JUNK"
just became the best that was ever produced??? produced, till the next new piece of "FUTURE JUNK"... LOL JUST LIKE MY OLD/NEW PIECE OF JUNK 1990 FORD F-150 WITH AUTO LOCKING HUBS....


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## stihl sawing (Mar 22, 2013)

No auto hubs on the ford, but the dodge has them. never been a problem but it is a dodge.lol You guys need to come down south to buy older trucks. we don't have fender rot from all the salt you guys get.

88 ford






2000 ram


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## stihl023/5 (Mar 22, 2013)

S.S. I need to come down and go shopping!


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## Whitespider (Mar 22, 2013)

This is the best I could do for ya' *Blazin*... hope it eases the picture withdrawals a bit


I tried some radial snow tires once on an 1985 LTD (because it had radials on it), even had 'em studded... worthless crap. Took 'em off and put real snow tires on the rear... real bias ply snow tires (and didn't stud them). But I found a use for those radials, I put 'em on the little trailer... they load-up with snow and mud, then roll over the top so the little tractor don't need to pull as hard. At least they're good for something.
















If I don't load the trailer too much those silly radials will pretty much roll right over the top of sloppy mud.






Just gotta' love how those silly street tires load up and become slicks!
Good thing a trailer don't need traction... huh?


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## stihl sawing (Mar 22, 2013)

stihl023/5 said:


> S.S. I need to come down and go shopping!


Come on down, plenty of old trucks to buy, I just put antique tags on the ford this year. They have to be 25 years old to do it. Don't ever have to buy tags for it again. Wish the dodge could get them.lol


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## Blazin (Mar 22, 2013)

Whitespider said:


> This is the best I could do for ya' *Blazin*... hope it eases the picture withdrawals a bit
> 
> 
> I tried some radial snow tires once on an 1985 LTD (because it had radials on it), even had 'em studded... worthless crap. Took 'em off and put real snow tires on the rear... real bias ply snow tires (and didn't stud them). But I found a use for those radials, I put 'em on the little trailer... they load-up with snow and mud, then roll over the top so the little tractor don't need to pull as hard. At least they're good for something.
> ...



That's it, I'm puttin bias ply tires on everything!!!! 

BTW, does that F150 have a 3/4 cam in it?


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## Whitespider (Mar 22, 2013)

Blazin said:


> *BTW, does that F150 have a 3/4 cam in it?*



Naw... no cam, it's a stock 351.
It does have the towing package though... which gives it the heavier suspension, axles, transmission, transfer case and makes it sit a bit higher... it's sort'a, kind'a, the LD version of the F250. At times it's a bit of a challenge to get drive-line parts for it because of the 351/4x4/towing package... some parts stores don't even list the thing and tell *me* that *I'm wrong!* Good thing I worked/owned (well, dad owned it) a Ford store for over 20 years or I'd be totally confused finding parts for it. Heck, I've even had Ford Dealerships tell me the thing don't exist :msp_rolleyes:

Just too bad it's rusting away.


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## Blazin (Mar 22, 2013)

Whitespider said:


> Naw... no cam, it's a stock 351.
> It does have the towing package though... which gives it the heavier suspension, axles, transmission, transfer case and makes it sit a bit higher... it's sort'a, kind'a, the LD version of the F250. At times it's a bit of a challenge to get drive-line parts for it because of the 351/4x4/towing package... some parts stores don't even list the thing and tell *me* that *I'm wrong!* Good thing worked/owned (well, dad owned it) a Ford store for over 20 years or I'd be totally confused finding parts for it. Heck, I've even had Ford Dealerships tell me the thing don't exist :msp_rolleyes:
> 
> Just too bad it's rusting away.



No 3/4 cam just what I thought, now the tires make sense


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## Arbonaut (Mar 22, 2013)

Whitespider said:


> At times it's a bit of a challenge to get drive-line parts for it because of the 351/4x4/towing package... some parts stores don't even list the thing and tell *me* that *I'm wrong!* Good thing worked/owned (well, dad owned it) a Ford store for over 20 years or I'd be totally confused finding parts for it. *Heck, I've even had Ford Dealerships tell me the thing don't exist *:msp_rolleyes:
> 
> Just too bad it's rusting away.



Maybe they don't believe since it can pull in and out of there without leaving any tracks.


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## Whitespider (Mar 22, 2013)

opcorn:
That's it? Nothing more?
You guys disappoint me.


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## Steve NW WI (Mar 22, 2013)

From today Yup time for new skins before next winter. Rt Rr takes a beating when I relive my younger days.


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## Bushmans (Mar 22, 2013)

Enough already! If your chests are that puffed out over tires than a wheelbarrow full of wood won't hurt a bit! 
Get haulin' by whatever means neccesary!

ps. I drove a Ford for many years in the snow plow business. Tall, skinny 18 inch tires can plow some snow. Nuff said!
Don't drive 'em anymore cuz they are too much $. Don't miss changing out u-joints and axle joints but in the end they were money makers. 1987-1995. RIP


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## Whitespider (Mar 22, 2013)

Steve NW WI said:


> *From today Yup time for new skins before next winter.*



Awwwww.... c'mon man.
You're the guy that told me to drive around the yard and take pictures... I did better than that, lots better.

You can show me anything you want... but I'm seriously guaranteeing you won't be able to follow me where I go.
Man, I'll drive circles around you... traction *is* all about the tire and nothing else (well, to a point).

This ain't my first dance.


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## Whitespider (Mar 22, 2013)

opcorn:
I'm gonna' wait for a real rebuttal.


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## Arbonaut (Mar 22, 2013)




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## Arbonaut (Mar 22, 2013)

opcorn:


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## Arbonaut (Mar 22, 2013)

opcorn:


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## Whitespider (Mar 22, 2013)

OK... you've got me on that one....
(But it ain't about the tire)


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## Arbonaut (Mar 22, 2013)

Dang the Jonsered Iron Horse was a thread killer. I was just screwin' around guys. WTH is everybody bowling tonight?


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## stihly dan (Mar 22, 2013)

Ok spidey, bias ply on a limited slip axle, or radials on a locking rear end. If it's the tire's, who wins?


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## Steve NW WI (Mar 23, 2013)

Whitespider said:


> Awwwww.... c'mon man.
> You're the guy that told me to drive around the yard and take pictures... I did better than that, lots better.
> 
> You can show me anything you want... but I'm seriously guaranteeing you won't be able to follow me where I go.
> ...



So my cell pics weren't the best. Sue me.

I'm busy tomorrow, might go play in the snow Sunday and get better pics. I think you're just gonna have to come on up here and show me how it's done.

You can take an Iowan to knowledge, but it ain't gonna make him any smarter than he was in 1978.


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## Whitespider (Mar 23, 2013)

stihly dan said:


> *Ok spidey, bias ply on a limited slip axle, or radials on a locking rear end. If it's the tire's, who wins?*



That's like the old fable about the tortoise and the hare.
The hole-shot likely goes to the the locker, but it's finishing that counts.


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## bowtechmadman (Mar 23, 2013)

I feel like I just seriously wasted a great deal of time...not nearly enough pictures!!! Speaking of bias ply I use to love the old Firestone Town and Country snow tires. They helped my ranger 4x4 make some full size 4x4 pickups feel bad.


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## farmer steve (Mar 23, 2013)

bowtechmadman said:


> I feel like I just seriously wasted a great deal of time...not nearly enough pictures!!! Speaking of bias ply I use to love the old Firestone Town and Country snow tires. They helped my ranger 4x4 make some full size 4x4 pickups feel bad.



speaking of bias ply tires in the snow, there only as good as the chains ya put on them.oke:


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## Whitespider (Mar 23, 2013)

bowtechmadman said:


> *Speaking of bias ply... They helped my ranger 4x4 make some full size 4x4 pickups feel bad.*



I'll tell ya' what really makes 'em feel bad...
When they're standing knee deep in the slop, hands on their hips, staring at their wide-azz, loaded-up radials and you drive up next to 'em, roll the window down, toss the recovery strap out, and say, "_hook me up dude, I'll have ya' out'a there in no-time flat._" Then, just to add insult-to-injury, you drive a circle around 'em getting into position


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## naturelover (Mar 23, 2013)

Will say that I was mistaken on the half frame part on the Ranger.

It does split underneath the cab.... Just noticed that last night taking the shocks off.


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## Blazin (Mar 23, 2013)

Whitespider said:


> opcorn:
> I'm gonna' wait for a real rebuttal.



Rebuttal  Put some wood in your truck cornholer, isn't that why you started this thread? 

Load it, and show us all how them tires work 












Complimentary 6 ply radial tire shot, yeah 50 psi she squats a touch but there's probably as much weight on there with what that F150 weighs with them self clean'n tires 







Notice the radial rubber here, no loading of the tread


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## Whitespider (Mar 23, 2013)

Now, that there is a *real* rebuttal !!!


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## Blazin (Mar 24, 2013)

Put any wood in yer truck yet, or you still using the garden tractor so you don't wear out those precious bias ply tires?


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## Whitespider (Mar 24, 2013)

*Blazin*,
You are forcing me to admit to one very big disadvantage of bias traction-lug tires... they will tear the snot out of soft ground. We've (finally) had a bit of sun and a few days above freezing... some of the yard has the snow gone and the top inch or so pretty soft in those areas, the gravel driveway is a swamp. Unless I want my yard looking like a steel-track bulldozer did donuts in it...

So there you have it... my excuse :redface:


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## naturelover (Mar 29, 2013)

Well, got the Ranger plated up and ready to go.

Couldn't get to where I wanted to for the mud or the deeper snow, but did what I could.

My useless street radials... :msp_razz:





















Some spots it packed with some snow, some spots it didn't.. :msp_confused:






Short video.





Don't seem totally useless, I thought they did a good job, considering these are AT tires. Yea, they loaded up a little, but never to the point that there was no treads sticking out and it always left tracks behind the tires.

I didn't get stuck anywhere either...


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## Blazin (Mar 29, 2013)

^^^^^


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## cjcocn (Jan 23, 2014)




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## stihl sawing (Jan 23, 2014)

Drag slicks rock.


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## Whitespider (Jan 23, 2014)

Oh good... we're bringin' back one of more favorite threads


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## Locust Cutter (Feb 2, 2014)

Whitespider said:


> Some years ago an old farmer gave me a really good piece of advice...
> As a high school kid on summer break I was working for him to pick up a little cash. We were driving out to check the cattle and slipping around a bit in the mud. I asked him why he didn't put the truck in 4-wheel drive, and he answered with...
> "_Sonny boy, ya' don't put it in 4-wheel drive *before* ya' get stuck... 'cause if'n ya' do, you'll end up walkin' home._"
> 
> I've never forgotten that.



I was told as a kid, by a family friend and rancher that 4x4 was designed to get you out of what 2x4 got you into... Same difference.


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## ttyR2 (Feb 2, 2014)

Folks asked me why in the heck I got a dually when looking for a diesel F-350. I just point at it when it's heaped with wood and it's not even on the overloads yet.


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## Locust Cutter (Feb 3, 2014)

naturelover said:


> The Ranger has some 31-10.50's on it now, the best tires I've had on it so far. Do really well in the mud and snow, and aren't too loud on the hardtop either for being a pretty aggressive AT tire.
> 
> 
> 
> ...




I had these tires on my old 2x4 Toyota before I sold it. They worked GREAT off-road and in the mud. It never got stuck, although that might have been do to avoiding obviously bad scenarios... 





They did remarkably ell for radials in the mud and rocks, didn't chip easily and had fantastic tread-wear. They WERE damn squirrely for the first 200 miles but after that they were great. I WILL be putting these on my '02 F-350 dually. I would love to have some nasty meats for the pastures I retrieve wood from, but with having to drive a fair bit on road and highly prefering the stability of radials, these have been the best compromise I've found so far. Especially for the price point, well under BFG T/A KO's...


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