# How much wind is too much?



## JShaw (Nov 14, 2007)

Climbed and took down a 40' Blue Spruce the other day in a 25mph wind with 35mph gusts (according to the weather report). I was pretty freaked but got through it. So my question is; how much wind is too much wind?


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## TimberMcPherson (Nov 14, 2007)

once the gusts get over 70mph we start looking at packing up, today was 90mph (live in a windy city) with showers so got some welding done. Depends on the job alot of the time, some jobs it can be a real help. Hedge trimming jobs can be done really fast as the cuttings dissappear like magic


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## TDunk (Nov 14, 2007)

Around here and for my personal taste, it wouldn't bother me to take down a 40' spuce tree on a windy day. Now if it was a 110' spuce leaning over a house, I'd prolly jump to another job until the wind dyes down. A couple weeks ago i took down some big (36" to 40") dead hemlock tree at a couple well locations. I had my notch cut, wedges in, just about ready to let it go and the wind gusted, snapped the hinge and almost took out 6 oil storage tanks. You can look at it two ways, if the tree was alive maybe the hinge wouldn't have snapped or the wind was strong enough to snap it off anyway.


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## Night Owle (Nov 14, 2007)

*Wind as A distraction...*

I'm not sure You can throw up A MPH number,for Me it's how much is this
Wind keeping Me from paying attention to what I'm doing.
I'll admit I've "hurried" the job along and taken short cuts.
You know cutting lager pieces , not rigging down and such..
If the wind is so much than it cuts in to My safety margin
I'll come back another day.
This work is tough enough without the high wind days. 

Be Safe..... 

Night Owle....


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## woodchux (Nov 14, 2007)

I use 20mph as my limit.


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## John Paul Sanborn (Nov 14, 2007)

I would say 35-40 mph for me, but I do not like it.

Some qualifiers are how it is gusting, direction, precipitation, temp...overcast, 25 mph @ 25* blowing up your pantleg puts a damper on motivation.


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## Stihlboy088 (Nov 14, 2007)

i get skiddish when it's 25mph when i'm working. for rec climbing bring it on, i love that feeling.


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## beastmaster (Nov 14, 2007)

I've climbed healthy pines in 50 mph winds and it was fun. But I get real nervous up in eucalyptus trees and palms when the wind is over 25 mph, then there is those scary gusts that sneak up on ya. I think there are many variables, is the tree safe, can you safely do the work. The sail effect of a tree even in a light wind can influence where it or part of it will go. Some trees are more prone to snapping in a stiff wind. The good thing is most the clean up blows a way(but where does it go?) If its to windy,take the day off. Be safe.


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## (WLL) (Nov 14, 2007)

*great ?*

i have herd the trees can begin to fail at 30mph sustained on our local weather channel. it seems I'm usually doing removals on problem trees and failure is greatly increased with strong wind. i think there is many variations with the trees(size,type,health,location,season,snow,ice,rain)and all must be factored in. my advise is to be versatile, as there are many things to do in tree management., so if the wind is to much stay on the ground and outa the woods and do something other then climb. if this is not a option at your job then stay home or get another job. there is a difference between crazy and stupid so use your head,learn all u can,be versatile and keep the options open. be safe climb high and live again to climb another day.


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## (WLL) (Nov 14, 2007)

*70mph+ im in the basement*



TimberMcPherson said:


> once the gusts get over 70mph we start looking at packing up, today was 90mph (live in a windy city) with showers so got some welding done. Depends on the job alot of the time, some jobs it can be a real help.



:jawdrop: :jawdrop: :jawdrop: :jawdrop: :jawdrop: 
with an avatar like that,well i'd be climbing too with 70+mph 


i!NOT!i

Hedge trimming jobs can be done really fast as the cuttings dissappear like magic... lol


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## tree md (Nov 14, 2007)

I don't really have a set wind speed for when I will not do a job, I just go by my own judgment on each individual job. Pine boughs can sail like a hang glider in the wind. I will take them down in moderate winds but I will lower every branch to keep them from sailing into a house or anything. I was dropping the top of a medium sized pine onetime in high winds and the wind tried to blow the top back on me. I had cut my notch and was making my back cut when a big gust of wind blew the top back and pinched my saw. I let go of the saw and pushed with both hands to keep it from coming over on me. As soon as the gust of wind subsided the top hinged over and dropped perfectly. It was a tense moment to say the least. Where I live now it is windy the majority of the time so I have to work in it. It's a pain to work in and makes things like limb walking very difficult at times but I have gotten used to working in moderate winds. I try to work around the shop or run estimates on really windy days.


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## oldirty (Nov 14, 2007)

Night Owle said:


> I'm not sure You can throw up A MPH number,for Me it's how much is this
> Wind keeping Me from paying attention to what I'm doing.
> I'll admit I've "hurried" the job along and taken short cuts.
> You know cutting lager pieces , not rigging down and such..
> ...



i second this statement.

i dont mind "some" windthrow in fact i kinda like the feeling it gives ya. but if i am up there swaying around and i end up worry more about the wood than i am my next cut i usually find my way to the ground. i dont do koala bear impersonations very well.




oldirty


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## Sunrise Guy (Nov 14, 2007)

Over 20mph, constant, and I'll have to think real hard about the situation at hand.


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## ropensaddle (Nov 14, 2007)

Funny thing is usually the live trees are the ones that fail in wind
in the leaf period. I have seen many dead tree left standing while
live ones were blown over as leaf catches more wind and weight is 
greater. Many factors go in to failing how wet being the biggest
short of wind speed! Saturated ground can cause many trees to fail 
that would otherwise be ok I don't try to do the impossible on windy
days.


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## Adkpk (Nov 14, 2007)

Good posting on this thread. 
I like the wind while I'm climbing too. A little.
I was rec climbing a white pine and telling the gf I felt like a puppet as the wind pulled the rope one way then the next. I reset to go up to the next portion of the tree, the portion above the canopy. I was using my lanyard on the other trunk, of which there was three at this point, to pull myself away from one trunk and avert branches when I thought if one trunk broke off I would be split in two. I panicked and descended 15' back to my resting place. Took 5 and went back up to set a throw line at 70' and take a couple of pics. Wind is definitely disorientating. Still trying to get to the top of that pine.


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## treesquirrel (Nov 14, 2007)

If wind is working in a direction adverse to my work then I will wait.

Tree canopies are like parachutes and catch a lot of air. I do not play those odds if have the choice.


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## oldirty (Nov 14, 2007)

Adrpk said:


> "when I thought if one trunk broke off " *
> 
> Still trying to get to the top of that pine.




*(dont be doing this to yourself man. it'll only freak you out. ) 

keep going man you'll get there. 



oldirty


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## da new feller (Nov 15, 2007)

*i found this works pretty good.....*

i'm in western wa. and was removing some hazards near a house along the hood canal. the trees were in a bunch so we started with the one furthest from the house. when we got to the last 2, the wind went from breezy to pretty uncomfortable sustained. we watched these 2 blow one way then out of the blue the wind switched directions. i figured with my luck if i left them till the next day they would have took out the house seeing how the first trees felled provided some protection from the elements. so i opened the gate on the side of the house and nosed my truck right up to the fence. i was probably less than 25' from the tree, but on the wrong side of it to do anything. there was a doug fir towards the back of the yard so i put a pulley on that and another pulley on the neighbors tree behind the fence. the 120' cable that i always pack around but never use made it from the tree in question through the pulley on the neighbors tree and over to the other pulley, had to use a come-along to pull up the slack to feed the cable threw the pulley. ran the winch, warn model 8274, cable up to the other cable and slowly took out the slack . then slowly started to draw the tree until it stopped moving with the wind. it was quite a sight to see all the other trees blowing violently in the wind except for that one, it looked like it was in paradise standing straight up with what looked to be a calm breeze lightly touching the branches. we left the hinge wider than normal. climbed in the truck grabbed the winch remote and felled that tree right between the shed and the garden. hooked up to the last tree and placed right on top of it. given the circumsatances, it looked like i knew what the hell i was doing. at any rate, i find myself using that winch quite often know. a matter of fact, since then i've put a choker about halfway up trees and winched them down, pulling the root ball loose from the ground and leaving the tree about 3-4' off the ground for some of the graviest limbing / buck'n i've ever done.

jon


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## TimberMcPherson (Nov 15, 2007)

I was dismantling a pine two weeks ago in 60-70mph winds, but it was nerve wrecking. (should have called it a day really but was feeling adventurous)
I was doing a downward cut on a limb that was a foot in diameter. I was half way through when the saw jammed up, the wind was pushing the limb upwards which was trapping the saw! The tree was a twin trunk and the movement of them, even where the trunks were 3 foot in diameter was a little scary. Such a relief when you get the last bit of green off, coz then its all stable and just a bombing run.

I was contract climbing for a guy in really high wind, we were about 3 blocks from the sea and I found sand on my truck at the end of the day.


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## Adkpk (Nov 15, 2007)

treesquirrel said:


> If wind is working in a direction adverse to my work then I will wait.
> 
> Tree canopies are like parachutes and catch a lot of air. I do not play those odds if have the choice.




The top of this 110' pine would be blowing (which is 40' above the canopy) when the leaves of the canopy would be still and vis a versa. Colder winds pulling warmer air out of the woods. The pine never moved at the same time as the trees of the canopy. The air from the woods was not strong enough to move the middle of the pine but made the canopy move violently. Just an interesting observation. I would say the ground wind was 20 mph and the upper winds a little more but it was definitely a day of dropping temps.





oldirty said:


> *(dont be doing this to yourself man. it'll only freak you out. )
> 
> keep going man you'll get there.
> 
> ...



Thanks, dirty for the encouragement. I laughed at myself once I descended.


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## moray (Nov 15, 2007)

Adrpk said:


> ... when I thought if *one trunk broke off *I would be split in two...



Adrpk, I thought you had climbed that sucker months ago... By the way, if you were only tied into one trunk, and it split off, you would still be in a heap of trouble. Probably preferable to being ripped in two, though.



Adrpk said:


> ... Took 5 and went back up to *set a throw line at 70'* ...Still trying to get to the top of that pine.



You love that throw line more than that tree! Leave your false crotch up there and you don't have to repeat all that work each time you climb. I just retreived one from my neighbor's big pine that I put up there two months ago. I had to climb up and get it (a good chance to try out my new SRT line). And no, it wasn't all ratty from three species of squirrels chewing on it--it was perfect.

As to the wind, a moderate wind is very nice. But a lot of the trees around here have weak wood and a strong squirrelly wind will send me to the ground. I remember being up about 85 ft with a friend in a 100-ft. hemlock. There was a neighboring hemlock of the same size about 20 feet away. The wind was strong and squirrelly that day, and we watched the top of the other tree come within 6 or 7 feet at times, or move out 30 or 35 feet away. That was a ride!


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## Adkpk (Nov 15, 2007)

moray said:


> And no, it wasn't all ratty from three species of squirrels chewing on it--it was perfect.



Sounds like you got lucky!


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## Blinky (Nov 16, 2007)

I like working in wind and like most of the other folks... it just depends on lots of factors when I might come down or not go up in the first place.

Topping in wind is risky though... I've tried to time notching and backcutting between gusts and been pretty lucky but it could definitely go wrong if the wind is blowing the wrong way. Swirling and microbursts are potential complications too.

I was holding the rope when a 25' Tupelo stem (bare stem, no foliage) broke out on a climber with only a notch because of wind... he notched it with his rope still tied up high and had just pulled the rope down to reset it when the piece broke. Wildest ride I've ever seen in person, both gaffs came out and he shook like a rag doll for 3 or 4 oscillations. The wind was enough to sway the whole tree and the swaying harmonics combined with a little gust are what broke it off.


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## reachtreeservi (Nov 16, 2007)

I don't work in much wind at all. If I look up and see major movement 2/3 up the tree, I call it a day. All my jobs are always right over something or tight up against a house. The risks aren't worth it to me. I always need to do other things like bid jobs, work on taxes, maintain equipment, go to the saw shop, etc...

All that stuff never gets done if the jobs are coming in and the weathers good. 

I'd much rather lose a day cutting and take care of other necessaries , than have to put a claim in on my insurance.


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## tree md (Mar 23, 2009)

Weather advisory for my area today:


URGENT - WEATHER MESSAGE
NATIONAL WEATHER SERVICE TULSA OK
514 AM CDT MON MAR 23 2009

...IT WILL BE WINDY TODAY IN EASTERN OKLAHOMA AND WEST CENTRAL
AND NORTHWEST ARKANSAS...

.A POWERFUL STORM SYSTEM MOVING OUT OF THE CENTRAL ROCKIES THIS
MORNING WILL CAUSE SIGNIFICANT WINDS FOR MUCH OF THE PLAINS TODAY.
ARZ001-002-010-011-019-020-029-OKZ049-053>076-231815-
/O.NEW.KTSA.WI.Y.0007.090323T1500Z-090324T0300Z/
BENTON-CARROLL-WASHINGTON AR-MADISON-CRAWFORD-FRANKLIN-SEBASTIAN-
PUSHMATAHA-CHOCTAW-OSAGE-WASHINGTON OK-NOWATA-CRAIG-OTTAWA-PAWNEE-
TULSA-ROGERS-MAYES-DELAWARE-CREEK-OKFUSKEE-OKMULGEE-WAGONER-
CHEROKEE-ADAIR-MUSKOGEE-MCINTOSH-SEQUOYAH-PITTSBURG-HASKELL-
LATIMER-LE FLORE-
INCLUDING THE CITIES OF...ROGERS...BENTONVILLE...BERRYVILLE...
EUREKA SPRINGS...FAYETTEVILLE...SPRINGDALE...HUNTSVILLE...
VAN BUREN...OZARK...CHARLESTON...FORT SMITH...ANTLERS...CLAYTON...
HUGO...PAWHUSKA...BARTLESVILLE...NOWATA...VINITA...MIAMI...
PAWNEE...TULSA...CLAREMORE...PRYOR...JAY...BRISTOW...OKEMAH...
OKMULGEE...WAGONER...TAHLEQUAH...STILWELL...MUSKOGEE...EUFAULA...
SALLISAW...MCALESTER...STIGLER...WILBURTON...POTEAU
514 AM CDT MON MAR 23 2009
...WIND ADVISORY IN EFFECT FROM 10 AM THIS MORNING TO 10 PM CDT
THIS EVENING...

THE NATIONAL WEATHER SERVICE IN TULSA HAS ISSUED A WIND
ADVISORY...WHICH IS IN EFFECT FROM 10 AM THIS MORNING TO 10 PM
CDT THIS EVENING.

SOUTH WINDS WILL INCREASE TODAY...REACHING SUSTAINED SPEEDS OF
20 TO 25 MILES AN HOUR. OCCASIONAL WIND GUSTS OF 40 TO 45 MILES
AN HOUR ARE LIKELY FROM LATE MORNING INTO EARLY EVENING. ISOLATED
WIND GUST COULD REACH AS HIGH AS 50 MILES AN HOUR. ELEVATED AND
OPEN LOCATIONS WILL BE MOST VULNERABLE TO THESE HIGH WINDS.

PRECAUTIONARY/PREPAREDNESS ACTIONS...

A WIND ADVISORY MEANS THAT WIND GUSTS OF 40 MPH ARE EXPECTED.
WINDS OF THIS MAGNITUDE CAN MAKE DRIVING DIFFICULT...ESPECIALLY
FOR HIGH PROFILE VEHICLES.

LOOSE OR LIGHTWEIGHT OBJECTS CAN BECOME AIRBORNE IN WINDS IN EXCESS
OF 40 MILES AN HOUR. OUTDOOR CONSTRUCTION PROJECTS MAY BE IMPACTED.

USE CAUTION.

Looks like I'll be taking care of some banking business today as well as visiting the saw shop. I've got one bid to do as well.

Took a large Pin Oak down last week in 30 MPH gusts. It was over the house and a shop so I roped more limbs than I normally would with less wind. I will climb in high winds but when the gusts get up to 40-50 I'll set it out.


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## Blakesmaster (Mar 23, 2009)

tree md said:


> It was over the house and a shop so I roped more limbs than I normally would with less wind. QUOTE]
> 
> Today was windy as heck, don't know the numbers but I had to do exactly like you. The bucket got the first 65 feet of this buck ten spruce roped down but I had to climb and rope every other branch out in the wind and cold. PITA on spruces.


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## joesawer (Mar 25, 2009)

Well some of you guys have crossed the line from bravery to stupidity. 
I have worked under contracts that stated all climbing must stop at 30mph wind gusts. I have never seen a climber make it to actual 30 mph. I have held the wind speed meter and read 25 mph gusts, at that point flags are horizontal, dust is blowing, and you have to hold your hard hat on your head.
I saw a crane job, removing large dead pines, shut down at less than 30mph. Because the pieces kept blowing into the crane boom.


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## Rickytree (Mar 25, 2009)

TimberMcPherson said:


> once the gusts get over 70mph we start looking at packing up, today was 90mph (live in a windy city) with showers so got some welding done. Depends on the job alot of the time, some jobs it can be a real help. Hedge trimming jobs can be done really fast as the cuttings dissappear like magic



Are we talkin miles per hour or kilometers? 90 miles is almost hard to stand in No? Not sure what the weather is like there but makes me glad to live in Good Old Can a da!


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## Raymond (Mar 25, 2009)

Kinda depends on what the job is. But if I'd have to put a number on it I'd say 30-40 mph.


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## forestryworks (Mar 25, 2009)

15mph or more, i quit.

residential falling and trimming for sure.

out in the woods - depends on the sight.

but rarely do i go out when the winds are 15mph or more. to me it just makes the job that much more work.


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## Raymond (Mar 25, 2009)

Ricky I think we have a little bull####ing on the 70mph winds but I could be wrong...NOT!


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## Rickytree (Mar 25, 2009)

Raymond said:


> Ricky I think we have a little bull####ing on the 70mph winds but I could be wrong...NOT!



Well maybe not cuz I've climbed in 55 or 60 mph and the roping was tricky cuz the landing was 10 feet over from my rigging point. Funny thing is the saw dust still went right into my face.:hmm3grin2orange:


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## Raymond (Mar 25, 2009)

Rickytree said:


> Well maybe not cuz I've climbed in 55 or 60 mph and the roping was tricky cuz the landing was 10 feet over from my rigging point. Funny thing is the saw dust still went right into my face.:hmm3grin2orange:


I could say I've done gusts up to 50-60 at one time or another I guess.

The one day that comes to mind, limbs coming down were not only missing my customers yard but flying over the neighbors yard even, going into the next yard.


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## Rickytree (Mar 25, 2009)

Raymond said:


> I could say I've done gusts up to 50-60 at one time or another I guess.
> 
> The one day that comes to mind, limbs coming down were not only missing my customers yard but flying over the neighbors yard even, going into the next yard.



Perfect! No longer your problem! Storm damage is a killer!


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## Raymond (Mar 25, 2009)

Rickytree said:


> Perfect! No longer your problem! Storm damage is a killer!








We went and got'em all out.


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## tree md (Mar 25, 2009)

The key word is gusts. 

This is Oklahoma. 15 MPH sustained winds is the norm a lot of the time. You just got to time your cuts in between the gusts. It's a PITA but if you let the wind stop you here you wouldn't work very many days. Also has a lot to do with the tree and the job. A weakened or dead tree is a no go in high winds. I'll do a nice healthy oak in the wind any day though. As with hunting, I prefer little very little wind when I work.


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## treeclimber101 (Mar 25, 2009)

You guys are crazy, working in 50 mph winds, if the wind blows out my cigarette I'm making dust clouds with my back wheels, better yet if the roof is creaking in the morning before work ,I'll be watching Maury Povich at ten. You know that theres always tomorrow and there are no tree jobs that I know of that were never completed because of weather.


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## Rickytree (Mar 25, 2009)

treeclimber101 said:


> You guys are crazy, working in 50 mph winds, if the wind blows out my cigarette I'm making dust clouds with my back wheels, better yet if the roof is creaking in the morning before work ,I'll be watching Maury Povich at ten. You know that theres always tomorrow and there are no tree jobs that I know of that were never completed because of weather.



cable up here I can watch Maury at 10 then a different one at 11!


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## Rickytree (Mar 25, 2009)

Raymond said:


> We went and got'em all out.



Your a good man! I would have 2. Grab 2 leave the rest!:hmm3grin2orange:


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## treeclimber101 (Mar 25, 2009)

I think the biggest issue with wind is communicating with the people on the ground, walkie talkies suck ,and screaming gets old....


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## slinger (Mar 25, 2009)

Red flag warning is when I quit cuttin and go set trusses on a building


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## Mikecutstrees (Mar 25, 2009)

I agree it depends on the tree. On a solid tree especially without leaves not much bothers me. I was up in a big sugar maple this winter and the wind was blowing 20-30mph. The problem was the wind was following me. Everywhere I cut it seemed the wind was blowing the chips in my face. At one point after getting sick of eyeballs full of saw chips I just closed my eyes for a second or two while sawing. Not safe I know, but I was tired of the chips. The space between my eye ball and my glasses actaully got packed with chips. I had to sweep it out. yuck...... Mike


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## Rickytree (Mar 25, 2009)

Mikecutstrees said:


> I agree it depends on the tree. On a solid tree especially without leaves not much bothers me. I was up in a big sugar maple this winter and the wind was blowing 20-30mph. The problem was the wind was following me. Everywhere I cut it seemed the wind was blowing the chips in my face. At one point after getting sick of eyeballs full of saw chips I just closed my eyes for a second or two while sawing. Not safe I know, but I was tired of the chips. The space between my eye ball and my glasses actaully got packed with chips. I had to sweep it out. yuck...... Mike



Mother Nature is against you! Yoou left her in bed with saying good bye! Kidding, nice website! Took me about 20 seconds to catch on to the menu though.


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## treejon (Mar 25, 2009)

I took an 80ft spruce down 2 weeks ago in 30 mph sustained and 45-50 mph gusts. What it comes down to is how much and when. Mine was next to a house of a very nervous client. I'd have rather not been up there, but that was the situation. Healthy tree, just nerve racking to look at. When I got down, it was like I'd been on lake erie all day.


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## Rftreeman (Mar 25, 2009)

I'm with the others, can't really put out an mph that I'll stop working, I've work pre and post hurricanes and during sever thunder storms and the wind blew pretty dang fast and hard during those times, it was pretty fun being in a tree and swaying around in the wind.


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## ntsarborist (Mar 26, 2009)

it also has alot to do with if im climbing or if im using the bucket truck. if i think it safe to work than we work if i think that the wind is to strong where its not safe then we will not work. also what spieces of tree and how tall, leaves or no leaves, tempurature, dead or alive, what there is that is being work around(houses, sheds, powerlines), rain, snow. theres many factors that go into accounting for. just use self judgement. 

have a good day


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## TreeTopKid (Mar 26, 2009)

I don't mind gusts but sustained wind anything over 30mph is a big fat NO! I hate it when the wind blows and the tree rocks over and just sits there leaning while your bowels loosen up. That's not good man! Just think of the loading on that tree.

How long it can hold up? Did it just groan? Hope it sits back soon, are good examples of things not to be saying to yourself in a tree.


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## arbadacarba (Mar 26, 2009)

Its not just the wind, but the temperature too. During the growing season you can get away with a lot more than during the winter when the wood can become very brittle. The rule of thumb up here is 25mph or less if the wind is working with you, but in the winter you really have to watch out for the barbers at that speed . 

I once had to cut some alder in February in gusts up to 80mph to keep them from coming down on a water tank. Twenty three years later it still scares the:censored: out of me thinking about it - those suckers were doing fifty foot barbers all by themselves. I sure as heck wouldn't have done it on a contract!


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## jefflovstrom (Mar 26, 2009)

Man, This wind thing made me forget something.
Jeff


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## forestryworks (Mar 26, 2009)

joesawer said:


> Well some of you guys have crossed the line from bravery to stupidity.
> I have worked under contracts that stated all climbing must stop at 30mph wind gusts. I have never seen a climber make it to actual 30 mph. I have held the wind speed meter and read 25 mph gusts, at that point flags are horizontal, dust is blowing, and you have to hold your hard hat on your head.
> I saw a crane job, removing large dead pines, shut down at less than 30mph. Because the pieces kept blowing into the crane boom.



:agree2:


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## arborworks1 (Mar 26, 2009)

Yeah 50 mph starts ripping tree branches off. No thanks, its not always windy, that tree will still be there on a calm day.


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