# Help with the cold and my hands



## Spotted Owl (Dec 10, 2009)

Anyone have any good ideas how to deal with the cold? For us(not for many of you) we have have been cold. In the last few days my hands have just been aching with the cold. I went out this morning 3*, slight breeze to feed the stock and my hands hurt something fierce. I use wool gloves that are heated by the stove before going out so there nice and warm but not hot. That lasts about to the barn. Tried mittens but that didn't work had to take them off to get some of the chores done self explanitory there. By the time I'm done and back in the house I have to use hot water to get them moving again. I pull my fingers inside the main glove when not working so they are close to each other. Color is good, they are cold to the touch not bad though but the knuckles just don't seem to want to work. The wrist is trouble also but nothing like my knuckles. I try to keep them moving by making a fist and opening back up, slow then fast then slow again back and forth. Works for a while then it just gets slower no matter how hard I am trying to keep it going. Their not frozen they just don't want to work worth spit.

I have been is some damn nasty cold before and never had this before. This is new and I can say I don't like it one bit.

I would very much appreciate any thoughts you may have.



Owl


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## M.R. (Dec 10, 2009)

Silk gloves or liners inside of........
polar fleece or poly-prop. or wool.....
then into the oversize outers.


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## yooper (Dec 10, 2009)

dont wear fingered Gloves when very cold wear mittens, (chopper type) with a liner and fingered glove inside. (in case ya have to take them off) I use the cheep stretchy cotton gloves in side of mine or the fancy white ones (The fagot Michael Jackson ones) Hard to get used to working with choppers on but when fingers are warm ya get used to it, hell I climb with them all the time when it gets below 0.


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## dingeryote (Dec 10, 2009)

Owl,

You on BP meds? They raise hell with the fingers and feet in the cold.

All ya really can do is insulate the return lines to the pump to keep the blood warmer before it heads back to the extremities.

Cover your neck, insulated boots, insulated hat that covers the back of your head, long skivvies, etc. 

A little trick I learned in the corps, is "Wristovers".

Cut the top 4-5 inches off of a pair of wool socks and slide 'em on the wrists so they just cover to the base of your palm.
There's LOTS of blood vessels right near the surface in that area, bleeding heat to the air instead of getting it to your fingers, and gloves just don't cover the area well.

If you have run the saws a lot over many years, you might also have some nerve and tissue damage. Ya gotta just insulate and cuss with that one or have the doc go to cutting.

Also, Circulatory issues can pop up outta nowhere, and affect a guy just as you describe. If you have any kin that have had circulatory problems, make sure to talk at the Doc about it. My wife has an issue that has her hands freezing cold if it's 50 degrees out and working with her hands, and if it's colder, she gets the painfull joints as well.

When you go to warming the hands back up with water, be carefull about it.
Any warmer than tepid and you risk nerve damage. It's better to just stick your hands in your armpits, or if the family pooch dosn't mind, his armpits.

Hope this helps.
It's not cold yet here, but I'll be cussing with ya here in a few days.

Stay safe!
Dingeryote


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## Hddnis (Dec 10, 2009)

I've got just a few pairs of gloves sitting around from me trying to learn to keep my fingers warm.

All I learned is there is a reason for heated handles on saws. lol

Each fall I buy a few boxes of the hand warmers from Costco. I tuck them in my gloves when it's real cold and it works really well. Usually I put them against the palm, but sometimes in the back.

Mittens work the best, the kind with the tip you can move out of the way, that lets you do the detail work.

A coat with really long sleeves that you can almost pull your hands back up into can seem clumsy, but is faster than the mittens and works well if the wind isn't too bad.



Mr. HE


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## dingeryote (Dec 10, 2009)

yooper said:


> dont wear fingered Gloves when very cold wear mittens, (chopper type) with a liner and fingered glove inside. (in case ya have to take them off) I use the cheep stretchy cotton gloves in side of mine or the fancy white ones (The fagot Michael Jackson ones) Hard to get used to working with choppers on but when fingers are warm ya get used to it, hell I climb with them all the time when it gets below 0.



Yooper,

Try the Mil-surp polypro glove inserts sometime.
They don't look like anything that would be worth a ####, but darn if they don't work better than the old wool glove inserts, and dry out as fast as you can sweat 'em wet.

If ya ever find a pair of Nokia Choppers somewhere up there, SNAG 'em!!!
Heck, snag two pair and holler at me.
You can sand Oak with the finish on them, and they don't get wet and freeze.
Just a booger to find anymore.

Stay safe!
Dingeryote


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## peterupnorth (Dec 10, 2009)

Being somewhat used to having week long cold spells in the -60F range, I know about the pain in fingers, feet and other appendages...
There are jobs like laying under a vehicle to fix something, ie. not much movement where one just has to get back in to warm up. Then there are other things like getting firewood involving more exercise/movement where one seems to cross the threshold and after a period of time things do warm up and you can be good for a long time. I call it short term adaptation. This "adaptation" will not happen though by going back inside to warm up. I find it just gets even worse when going back out. 
Yes, lowering of blood pressure is an issue. Definitely keep the head warm.

We just try to look at the positive side and think of all the bad bugs (viruses included) that are being killed off.
By the way, spit does freeze before hitting the ground at -55.
....and none of us is getting any younger!


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## gwiley (Dec 10, 2009)

A few things I have discovered (after living in Wisconsin for a few years):

- snowmobile gloves are righteous! The good ones are waterproof, have a mitten style space for 3 fingers, a separate space for the pointer and thumb - perfect for holding the saw. (only downside is - no kevlar)

- silk glove liners rock (just don't buy the pink ones)

- keep your body core temp up - amazing what a difference that makes to your extremities

- never underestimate the value of the chemical hand warmers - cheap and amazingly warm


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## slowp (Dec 10, 2009)

For those of us in the PNW, Choppers are those heavy duty leather mittens, usually worn over a pair of lightweight winter gloves.

I like the mittens with the built in fingerless gloves. The warmest are insulated with thinsulite. They have mitten ends that you can fold over the back of your hands and it attaches with velcro so it isn't flopping about. Fleece insulated with thinsulite seems to be the warmest. They come in a ragg wool style also. 

Are you wearing a warm hat?


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## Gologit (Dec 10, 2009)

dingeryote said:


> Also, Circulatory issues can pop up outta nowhere, and affect a guy just as you describe. If you have any kin that have had circulatory problems, make sure to talk at the Doc about it.
> 
> When you go to warming the hands back up with water, be carefull about it.
> Any warmer than tepid and you risk nerve damage.



Good advice. Sudden onset circulatory problems can be a warning sign. I found that out the hard way. Go see your doctor and get checked out. Otherwise you're just treating the symptoms of something that may be more serious than you know.

And this has been a great thread. Even though Slowp doesn't believe it ever gets cold in California, it really does. Think Donner Party. I've picked up some good information here on keeping the hands warm and I thank all who posted.


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## bitzer (Dec 10, 2009)

Like the others mentioned, light gloves inside of choppers. Hand warmers on your palm, throw them in your boots to, if you need too. Also its tough in winter because its hard to be thirsty when its cold, but stay hydrated. Circulation will be better. Think layers and layers everywhere. Its -20 right now with the wind chill here, fun stuff!


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## Spotted Owl (Dec 10, 2009)

Good info here thank you. No BP meds, pressure runs low though by it's self averages around 102/65. I know that doesn't help anything. I will try some different mittens types and the liners. The wrist covers are something I never thought of and will surely try that out. Lots of good stuff. I try to stay with wool cause it's so wet normally around here and wool works well in the wet also.

Thanks much.


Owl


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## GNAR13 (Dec 10, 2009)

i know you get plenty of exercise in the woods, but keeping up the cardio helps with circulation, thus warmer hands and feet


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## southsoundtree (Dec 10, 2009)

Bundle up before going outside and move around/ exercise a little to increase blood flow, stay very well hydrated (dehydrated thickens blood), cover all exposed areas. Hopefully its nothing medical. I've started the day with a synthetic shirt, fleece pullover, and two hoodies, insulated boots, and a hat with ear flaps. I start out warm, and delayer/ relayer as needed throughout the day. We aren't acclimated to this weather.

Avoid/ reduce caffeine/ nicotine as they constrict your blood vessels. Caffeine is a diuretic, making it harder to stay well hydrated. 

Are your lips dry/ tight? Nasal passages dry? Its in part the dehydration of this cold, dry air. If you're exercising/ working and breathing more, then you lose more water in your breath.


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## dingeryote (Dec 10, 2009)

Spotted Owl said:


> Good info here thank you. No BP meds, pressure runs low though by it's self averages around 102/65. I know that doesn't help anything. I will try some different mittens types and the liners. The wrist covers are something I never thought of and will surely try that out. Lots of good stuff. I try to stay with wool cause it's so wet normally around here and wool works well in the wet also.
> 
> Thanks much.
> 
> ...



Owl,

I picked up a few as well. Thanks for starting this one!

Ya like wool eh? LOL!!!! http://www.redflannels.com/
Best flannel long Johns made.

Not so good for frothing up a sweat, Polypropelene(Polypro) is best for that as it insulates as well as wool when wet, and dosn't hold the water as bad as wool.

But for chores and general grumbling around they are hard to beat, and don't melt in the dryer.

The constant extra layer to start with is something ya get used to, and saves time for just running out to shovel real quick or whatever.

In Polypro, it's hard to beat the Duofold Mid weights for GP, and the Lightweight for heading out to cut or work hard.

I gotta feeling this ain't gonna be the only cold blast to hit us this year.
It's been too long and we are overdue.

Stay safe!
Dingeryote


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## Jacob J. (Dec 11, 2009)

Wool gloves are good, but you need something that's going to block the wind or airflow through the porous wool. I have some Columbia nylon shells that are really thin and flexible I wear over wool liners. 

I suspect you're dealing with capillary damage from years and years of running saw. The old time saw operators accumulated a lot of scar tissue in the fine capillaries in the hands which is a contributor to 'white knuckle' disease along with the corresponding nerve damage.


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## Jacob J. (Dec 11, 2009)

Spotted Owl said:


> This is new and I can say I don't like it one bit.
> Owl



So much for global warming...


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## little possum (Dec 11, 2009)

I do not get to experience the extremely cold temps like yall do, but I am a big fan of Hot Hands. I know it is wasted money everytime I open a pack, so I just eat cereal for breakfast. LOL. 
I duck hunt so I am out in the cold most of the time for 3 months outta the year. I like them in the palm of my hands but sometimes I will put them on my wrist. Like dingeryote said. The nerves are pretty important. Also like to stuff them in my socks sometimes. 

So what do the Mil-surplus gloves look like that yall are recommending?

This thread is very valuable, I can learn something from people that get to experince actual cold. The coldest it got here last year was 12 degrees I think, and for some reason I was out chasin ducks on the almost frozen river.

Stay warm, and safe out there.


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## slowp (Dec 11, 2009)

I think I'm going in shopping this weekend, and I'll look at a store for what I have in mind. PM me your size and I'll see if any are still there. I'm thinking of some wool gloves lined with thinsulite. I've got a pair buried somewhere in my work pickup along with other assorted gloves.

I'm one of the lucky ones. If I'm moving, I'm warm.


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## char (Dec 11, 2009)

Your feet and hands are the first place your body pulls blood from when your core gets cold. The first step is to make sure your core (chest/thighs/head) are insulated well. Layers covered by a windproof outer shell. 

Don't be so insulated that you sweat when active. If you sweat, you will get waay colder. 

I prefer leather gloves so if you can get your hands on some insulated KINCO's they are the way to go. Snoseal them and you are set. The advice about insulating your wrists is spot on. Waterproof gloves are the only way to go. As soon as you get wool or a synthetic wet they get much colder. Yes, they still insulate, but not nearly as well. 

Chemical handwarmers are worth the money as well. If you aren't out for very long you can throw some uncooked beans in a little baggie and microwave them for some short term warmth.


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## bullbuck (Dec 11, 2009)

when its really cold here,i break out my snowmobile gauntlet style gloves made by arctiva,you can find em on ebay,but you have to buy the high dollar pairs,they are setup for ripping through cold air at speed so when you are not moving they are more than adequate,but you are gonna have a little trouble threading a nut on a bolt,but for hanging on to handlebars they are great


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## tramp bushler (Dec 13, 2009)

*Cold hands Huh???*

Digger Yote had alot of good info . Obviously Peterupnorth KNOWS COLD .. I have a pretty good knowledge base in it also ...... I have a thing now where I have to breath thru fleece face masks to warm up the air in my lungs ... I,m working as hard and fast as I do in the summer , which means I,m breathing real hard . You ain,t sposed to do that @ - 30 .... I get like a cold weather asthma . It is like I frostbit the top of my throat . seriously ..... The way to keep your hands warm is keep your body VERY WARM !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! It,s -20 right now . I have been working all week in -5 thru -20 ... I go thru 3 face masks ain 6 hrs . I totally saturate all my layers and they are that way till I get in the truck. .. Keeping spare dry fleece cloths in the crummy/ firewood delivery truck is potentially a matter of life and death for me .... When the face screen on my hard hat system gets so iced up I can,t see thru it I have to thaw it out on the muffler of the saw . Today my face screen froze to my face mask , while I was limbing and bucking ..... It happens real regular ..... I sweat ALOT , but if you are dehydrated , you are flirting with all kinds of disaster ... I don,t go to work if it,s colder than -35 . As I work alone , the potential for loosing body parts is very real .... Polyester fleece , with wicking snug fitting long johns ... SERIOUSLY warm boots . I wear 100 below Sorels or Bunny Boots .. 4 layers work good ..... Sometimes , if it gets real cold , you will just have to change what and or how you do things .... It,s not necessarily bad , but it is different ..... The only access to my timber sale is a frozen winter seismic line trail . If it warms up I,m out business ........ CANADA GOOSE tm ( makers of the worlds warmest arctic parkas ) has a saying , " theres no such thing as cold ,just improper gear "


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## tramp bushler (Dec 13, 2009)

If you can stand them , insulated coveralls over your other layers helps .. If it,s windy where you are , the first thing you need to do is keep the wind out !!!!


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## Justsaws (Dec 16, 2009)

Spotted Owl, I suggest that you try a pair of disposable nitrile gloves under what you would normally consider to be your typical cold weather work glove. If you can find some that cover your wrist and half way up your forearm that would be best. Definitely protect the wrist from open air exposure. 

Plastic shopping bags between the socks and boots also.

If the skin on your hands is severely cracked and dry you should address that ASAP to prevent further nerve and tissue damage.


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## logbutcher (Dec 21, 2009)

ALL of the above on gear, especially liners under mittens, keeping the core and head warm.

One other thing from cold weather training ( e.g. Camp Drum, Mt Washington )and too many winter mistakes : eat carbohydrates. You use close to 300 calories/hours cutting hard; they need replacing. Munch all the time in the cold. The "energy bars such as Cliff have plenty of carbos and calories to keep the core going. GORP, any chocolate, and a thermos of hot chocolate help ( NO coffee ). 

You'll find that your body will also adapt to cold after awhile: what seems cold at 10F after a few days working then 20F feels warm. Don't depend on those chemical warmers or running inside all the time.

Don't let your extremities get to pint of non-feeling; it's harder to get the blood flowing. Take "shake breaks" from grabbing the saw or other gear by shaking your arms and legs up and down BEFORE they get too cold.

And good buddies will give you their stomach to warm frozen hands ----deadly serious.


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## M.R. (Dec 21, 2009)

logbutcher said:


> ALL of the above on gear, especially liners under mittens, keeping the core and head warm.
> 
> One other thing from cold weather training ( e.g. Camp Drum, Mt Washington )and too many winter mistakes : eat carbohydrates. You use close to 300 calories/hours cutting hard; they need replacing. Munch all the time in the cold. The "energy bars such as Cliff have plenty of carbos and calories to keep the core going. GORP, any chocolate, and a thermos of hot chocolate help ( NO coffee ).
> 
> ...




Isn't that where those Warm in the Winter & Shady in the Summer.... ones come in to hummm......play?


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## treemandan (Dec 21, 2009)

Do 50 jumping jacks either before you head out or when you first get out. Get that blood pumping and keep it pumping.


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## Spotted Owl (Dec 21, 2009)

logbutcher said:


> And good buddies will give you their stomach to warm frozen hands ----deadly serious.




Ya. Errr. Ummm. Perhaps not. 

Maybe in the great NE, but definately not in the PNW.

I have no buddies that good to me, however for the Mrs and only the Mrs I will be her buddy.


I can say one thing. I have been using the wrist covers and even though it has warmed up tremendously it still helps a great deal in the rainy wind we now have. I do use the nitril gloves when it's wet out that helps a lot also. I found some old silk liners from when I was in S&R years ago. I will give them a shot when the cold comes back. Got a tip about heavy weight welders gloves also, gonna give that one a try too. 

Keep the thoughts and ideas coming I know O am getting a lot of good ideas here. Everyone can benefit from this some time in their lives. Everyone gets cold sooner or later.

Thanks guys



Owl


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## M.R. (Dec 21, 2009)

"slight breeze to feed the stock and my hands hurt something fierce"


When I'm breaking bales to feed, rather than unglove.

I'll use another haystring/twine instead of digging a knife out & saw/cut the strings at 90° a couple back & forth pulls & the friction cuts thru right quick.


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## Spotted Owl (Dec 21, 2009)

I did do the string saw and still do when I can. We got hay this year that is so tight I can't get my fingers under the strings. Every bale was bucked and stacked with hooks. That was a long trip way tougher than just grabbing and throwing. The neighbor showed me that same trick a few years back. He would be by checking the mail when it was feeding time and would watch. He must have gotten tired of watching me blow into my hands and one day he said hey try this. Zip zip and that bale was open and ready. Step on the strings and toss it out. I would have gone the rest of my life doing it the other way. 

My boy came up with an idea and it works well in the barn or out the back of the pickup. He bent one of the inside tines of the fork back just a hair and then took the angle grinder and file to it and put a good edge on it. Slide that tine under the string and it pops right off. Step on the string while you are feeding and pick it up when you are done.

We got more calves this year so there is more feeding to do and in the other field there is no barn or wind break, just out in the open. That's when the cold was/is really getting to me. The cows go up into the trees and brush to get out of the wind weather (be darned if they will go near a built shelter of any kind) but the feeding still happens right in the middle of everything. 

Got the welding gloves this afternoon. When the cold sets in good they will be used for sure. Right now mid thirties/low forties is bad enough for heavy gloves for the time it takes. Low twenties down into the singles and those babies will be getting a work out. hopefully it won't get colder than the single here on the wet side of the mountains. Thanks for that idea.


Owl


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## tramp bushler (Dec 22, 2009)

Welders Gloves ????? .... You guys down south sure are funny sometimes .......


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## Uncle John (Dec 22, 2009)

To be safe get a checkup. Make sure your arteries aren't partially clogged.


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## tramp bushler (Dec 22, 2009)

Why don,t you guys have a chetty , big knife or small ax on a belt to break open bales .. Thats what I used to use ... The same belt has a pistol and anything else necessary on it ...... Welders gloves ???? I,ve lived in the cold my entire life and I,ve Never seen anyone wear Welders gloves to keep warm with .... A good hat , You don,t wear a cowboy hat do you ??? Please tell me you don,t wear one of those things  . Put a down vest under your coat and your hands will stay alot warmer , Welders gloves


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## M.R. (Dec 22, 2009)

Maybe with the shorter days, these or along this type might shed a little light. The orginal op also Bar-B-Q's & has lots of thorny plants in that web foot country. 
With the silk liners they will handle quite a bit of cold {short-durations], & a bit oversized they come on/off fairly easy/quickly. 

http://cgi.ebay.com/TILLMAN-945-LAR...emQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item518cc39964


You guys up in the North country deal with the extreme/severe cold & know how to deal with it on a daily bases, more so than us from the banana belt. 
Nothing more miserable than being horseback with cold feet, then hands.

Any thoughts on these?

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=280434341591&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT

Knew a pipe line welder that's still up there, one of his favorite sayings was...
'Prudhoe Pumps & Valdez Sucks' -recon' this still holds true?

On edit: Cowboys Hats....rarely/seldom wear one & if you do just might ask.....
'What Sqaw Humper did you get that hat off of!'


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## tramp bushler (Dec 23, 2009)

It has to or the state will go broke , now that everyone wants to worship the earth and not have any mineing here ......We got the resources tho . The us govt wants to use our nat. resources as collateral on loans to the world bank , and they will bring in slave labor to extract them ..... Sorry , just an out burst from a timber beast clinging to his God , guns , and power saws ...........I wish Washington DC would keep their own change .!!!! 
. buy the trigger finger mitts , they are kind of funny , but will work down to 10 below or so , if the rest of your body is kept very warm ............. You keep your trigger finger in the mitt till you need to squeeze something , then put it back in the mitt `again . But it saves you having to take the whole thing off to turn a key , or shoot a coyote ..


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## logbutcher (Dec 23, 2009)

You thought I was kidding about the "buddy stomach warming" . No way. If any of you outside of serious winter like Alberta or Alaska or Maine or Minnesota or Quebec want to know cold, you got to adapt, learn the tools for keeping safe; not necessarily comfortable. But for most of us Up North, we'd rather deal with cold than bugs, moldy armpits, those swamp vipers you have.
When you're out there without any place to get artificially warm-- truck, house, chemical warmers, big bonfire--it's you that have to keep the extremities safe. And yes, when with your squad, buddy, platoon, any group, in serious winter you keep an eye on each other. Foregt the macho homo stuff. For most of us cutting solo, as the norm, use the skills to keep safe. Most of you may never get outside in winter for more than a few hours, or far from a heated building or vehicle.

Know:

1. Food, hot drinks.

2. Wilderness skills to know the signs of frostbite, hypothermia AND how to treat--especially yourself.

3. Gear.

4. Use buddies for help---no macho in below zero. 

and,

5. When you get cold, or can't feel your hands or feet, know HOW to get warm without running to the truck or house. Recognise fear in your crew. It can be frightening the first time---I know from seeing reactions from banana belt troops in the cold for the first time with no place to go to get warmed up. 

Out. JMNSHO


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## Spotted Owl (Dec 23, 2009)

logbutcher said:


> You thought I was kidding about the "buddy stomach warming" . No way.
> 
> 
> 4. Use buddies for help---no macho in below zero.
> ...




I know your not kidding. Just thought I'd rib ya a bit. When things get that bad you do what has to be done. Your right there is no macho when things need to be happening for life or limb because of anything especially the cold. We used to get a new batch of kids every year for S&R. One of the first raining sessions was to go to the local frozen food warehouse and have the training meeting on the freezer. -10 is what that freezer was kept at. They were all given a list of what to have and what to expect. We would do that for several weeks then do our outdoor training up on the mountain in the winter. Out over night/nights. Drop off with a map compass and the packs. Bushwack your way back to base. Knowing your team was a huge key to everyones well being. 


Cowboy hats. Never. Wool watch caps sometimes heavier wool sock hats and ball caps. Around here you can't wear a cowboy hat unless you also have a satalite dish on your brand new Garth Brooks belt and unscuffed boots. Yup welders gloves for sure. Anything that can help the shock of going from the 40's and rain to the singles and decent wind overnight is gladly welcome here. 

Talked to the doc and he did what ever he did and I got a clean bill from him. Said the our normal easing into cold is no problem but the big jump we had probably was cause I have normal blood pressure of 102/65. I guess that hinders people in cold and the extremities can get in bad shape fast. 

Like I said before I've been in some damn nasty cold and this was a first thats why I was asking. I will take all of this and make things happen. 


Well almost all of it. Things will have to get pretty dire for me to use the stomach warming techniqueoke:. 


Have a great Christmas everyone


Owl


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## Gologit (Dec 23, 2009)

Spotted Owl said:


> Talked to the doc and he did what ever he did and I got a clean bill from him. Said the our normal easing into cold is no problem but the big jump we had probably was cause I have normal blood pressure of 102/65. I guess that hinders people in cold and the extremities can get in bad shape fast.
> 
> Like I said before I've been in some damn nasty cold and this was a first thats why I was asking. I will take all of this and make things happen.
> 
> ...



That's great news. I'm glad everything is okay.


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## treemandan (Dec 23, 2009)

If no one has mentioned neoprene fishing gloves? I had a pair ( 20 bucks) and the finger tips could fold over on the thumb and forfinger to aid with dexterity


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## tramp bushler (Dec 24, 2009)

:biggrinbounce2::hmm3grin2orange::fart::kilt:.
.
. Thats good .. .. If you have any coyotes where you have your livestock , use a 223 or something else small and aesy on pelts , (if they arn,t mangy ) and shoot a few , skin and tan the hides and find someone to make you a mushers hat .... Nothing in this world as warm as fur . Nothing ... 1/2" of beaver fur is warmer than 2" of prime goose down ...... And thats pretty warm ....... often I will pull my beaver hat off and stick my hands in it and warm them up ....... Most mornings I have to warm my hands up on the muffler on my saw a few times ..
.
Once I get whindinoner good the warm blood gets to my hands and often I need to pull my gloves off while limbing and buckin ...


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## logbutcher (Dec 24, 2009)

Spotted Owl said:


> I know your not kidding. Just thought I'd rib ya a bit. When things get that bad you do what has to be done. Your right there is no macho when things need to be happening for life or limb because of anything especially the cold. We used to get a new batch of kids every year for S&R. One of the first raining sessions was to go to the local frozen food warehouse and have the training meeting on the freezer. -10 is what that freezer was kept at. They were all given a list of what to have and what to expect. We would do that for several weeks then do our outdoor training up on the mountain in the winter. Out over night/nights. Drop off with a map compass and the packs. Bushwack your way back to base. Knowing your team was a huge key to everyones well being.
> 
> 
> Cowboy hats. Never. Wool watch caps sometimes heavier wool sock hats and ball caps. Around here you can't wear a cowboy hat unless you also have a satalite dish on your brand new Garth Brooks belt and unscuffed boots. Yup welders gloves for sure. Anything that can help the shock of going from the 40's and rain to the singles and decent wind overnight is gladly welcome here.
> ...



Ribbing accepted.....but you gotta try it sometime. That "buddy" could be your wife. 

MERRY CHRISTMAS TO ALL !!!


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## slowp (Dec 24, 2009)

logbutcher said:


> Ribbing accepted.....but you gotta try it sometime. That "buddy" could be your wife.
> 
> MERRY CHRISTMAS TO ALL !!!



Just thinking of cold hands on the tummy makes me cringe for the tummy bearer. When one is ticklish, it just would be kinda bad.


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## tramp bushler (Dec 25, 2009)

slowp , you don,t know what cold hands really are . last winter in Prudhoe I frosted 3 fingers on my left hand ... I was changing teeth on a 345 Cat frost bucket . From the time I was ok to them starting to turn into something you would find in the freezer section was 2 minutes .... It is usually cumulative ... . I had got oil on my gloves doing an oil change on a light plant or 966 or something .....then we decided to change some bucket teeth ... I should have taken a 10 minute break of so , it was 50 below ........ Log butcher isn,t talking about cold hands , but ones soon on their way to changeing for the rest of someones life .... My head is one of my best hand warmers .. I put my hands on my head under my hat ............But @ -50 . Most peopke left outside will be dead in an hour unless they have arctic gear on ....


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## tramp bushler (Dec 25, 2009)

And I don,t mean 50 below wind chill . That isn,t nearly as cold .. Say its 25 below and the wind is blowing 25 mph .........


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## logbutcher (Dec 25, 2009)

Add some to tramp. You or your guys can get scared sh$$less when their hands or feet can't be felt. Panic is not far off. No joke when you're out there. Forget the "wind chill" hype: just think protection, how to get the blood flowing, and how to prevent frostbite. When it gets into the sibgles and I'm going to be out for the day I carry a small thermos of hot chocolate, candy, GORP, any kind of high calorie, high carb munchie. 

We'd use the M&M trick to check on people: when one looks kind of dazed or acting funny, throw an M&M ( preferably red ). If the M%M can't be caught or is ignored, you have a problem. One of the early signs of hypothermia is slow reaction time. Can't do this in banana belts. :jawdrop:

Guess we don't need the freezer thing here .....yet. What happens if the door gets locked shut ?


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## bullbuck (Dec 25, 2009)

good advice tramp,and log butcher,i for one being a lifelong avid snowmobiler realize how quickly things can turn ugly on you,i know nothing of arctic cold,but i have been exposed to average cold for long amounts of time,i got to where i could not feel my feet at all once not even pain,i lost all balance and was no longer really walking basically just stumbling,not a good feeling


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## tramp bushler (Dec 25, 2009)

Bull buck , you were close ... It is best to not get in a situation like that ....


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## 056 kid (Dec 26, 2009)

Pour alittle gas & alittle oil on a pile of sticks and start youa fire, I used to have them all the time when on north slopes that where a long drag to the landing, where oak juice freezes on the stump before getting to the ground..


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## aokpops (Dec 26, 2009)

High Spotted Owl . if you was raised around cold weather an this just started . would be a little concerned . here is what I had good luck with .keep ting warm when it is cold .do a lot of exercise.you mention warming gloves up first . found this never work.s if anything get your gloves an boots cold first .if you are in pretty good shape . try little bare foot in the snow get your bare hands in there too . don,t do this for hour.s . just a few minutes . read about good hydration on here that is imported to. you can really dry up an not realize it . stay away form hot drinks if your outside . most will think this guy is a nut . worked outside for about 25 years


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## bullbuck (Dec 26, 2009)

056 kid said:


> Pour alittle gas & alittle oil on a pile of sticks and start youa fire, I used to have them all the time when on north slopes that where a long drag to the landing, where oak juice freezes on the stump before getting to the ground..



i used to allow my landing men to have fires in the winter,but i had to stop it,because when there was something to be done you could always find them glued to the fire,i could get more out of them when they had to move to stay warm


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## gwiley (Dec 26, 2009)

*damaged toes from the army*

I went through basic training at Ft. Jackson in January of 1988 and we wore our thin leather combat boots for everything except 4am PT. I think this was where I lost feeling in the edges of my big toes permanently from cold exposure. To this day the outside edge of each big toe has no feeling. Having spent my whole life in Florida before going to training didn't help.

Long term exposure to the cold can have permanent consequences. Cold is another one of those things we either respect or pay the price for disrespecting.


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## tramp bushler (Dec 26, 2009)

gwiley . the guy who made you do thart should be gutted slowly , left live and drug thru the streets till dead .. All the way up the line !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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## gwiley (Dec 26, 2009)

tramp bushler said:


> gwiley . the guy who made you do thart should be gutted slowly , left live and drug thru the streets till dead .. All the way up the line !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!



Hehe, thanks for the sympathy! We had 3 DIs in basic, one from hawaii, one who was an ex-Marine and the other a little 5' tall lady who was a nuclear tornado! It sure feels like they tortured us a lot, but on the other hand I credit them with totally changing the way I handle life (for the better). I guess I don't mind a few minor injuries in exchange for them teaching me to set my own destiny.


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## tramp bushler (Dec 26, 2009)

I got cranked till I tore some stuff in my shoulder ..he would put his foot on my shoulders while he screamed and made me do pushups at me and us ........
and alot of pretty horrible things ................. One of the reason I love killing predators so much I spose ..


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## gwiley (Dec 26, 2009)

tramp bushler said:


> I got cranked till I tore some stuff in my shoulder ..he would put his foot on my shoulders while he screamed and made me do pushups at me and us ........
> and alot of pretty horrible things ................. One of the reason I love killing predators so much I spose ..



I remember that too! They would have 1 soldier sit on your shoulders with his feet hooked around your thighs while you did pushups - B R U T A L! I don't know how my shoulders held together with that stuff going on. Or maybe it was just that we were in the pushup position and the guy on top did situps - tough to recall now. EIther way I remember our arms and shoulders would always give out before the DI was happy.


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## Mr. Woods (Dec 27, 2009)

*tight muscles*

Hey Owl,
Bit of a different angle here. When your muscles are tight they constrict blood flow hence less warmth to extremeties. Make sure your shoulders and arms are well loose and relaxed. That is a relative thing, different with each individual. Perhaps over the years you are tightening up and the flow is lessening. That can be reversed with stretching and massage. (have a hot bath and then stretch) Also contrast bathing can exerecise your blood vessels and is excellent for forearm ailments like tendonitis.

Contrast bathing is soaking your body part in warm/hot water for 1-2 mins and then soaking in ice water(very cold) for 15-30 seconds. Repeat 3 times. The warm water causes your tissues to swell with blood (trying to cool the area) and the cold water causes your tissues to contract (preserving heat) thereby causing a rinsing effect in the tissues. Also exercises the veins.

Feel free to pm any questions.


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## ak4195 (Dec 30, 2009)

I'll take a different tack,i suspect cold isnt your problem,just aggravates it.
When its cold out I like to wear Refrigiwear insulated gloves,cheap and good.Poly liners underneath,change out liners and gloves with sweat.
They make a style with silicone(or maybe ruber) dipped palms too,you can do everything but twist in a new plug as far as dexterity goes.
Heading to the slope on 1/5,been a VERY lean winter so far.

ak4195


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## tramp bushler (Dec 30, 2009)

Ya , those ReFridgewear leather gloves are awesome . I was amazed by how warm they are ... They make my hands look like the Michelin Man , only in gray with black wrists , and they are too hot for most stuff if it,s above 0 much . But until they get soaked with oil they are seriously warm .... Arctic Fire and Safety also has them with their logo on them ....... Glad you are on your way north ... Who do you work for there .??


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## ak4195 (Dec 30, 2009)

The callout was from AIC,something about driving sheet piling,Ill know more in a couple of hrs.
I was TOLD it wasnt a large spread,so guess I could be stuck in the shop,just glad to get to work.The lifting of weight restrictions here in south central is a lifetime away it seems.
Orientation either today or tomorrow,will have to check out Arctic fire n safety,thnx for tip.Suspect gearing up could run a good $800-$1k

ak4195


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## tramp bushler (Dec 30, 2009)

AIC has the gloves and safety gear ,vests hard hats ..Tell Risto you need gloves . He,s the safety guy . Well one of them ... Same with eye protection ect ... They will try to be cheap with it ...Thats who I work for up there .. There are a number of Safety Joes at AIC Prudhoe ..... Mike Waddell is the head safety man . Their hard hat liners leave alot to be desired , so it,s best to go to Brooks Range store , or get some @ Army Navy on 4th in Anch. AIC gets a 10 -20 % discount there ,so tell the people at the counter you are going to work for AIC .. They also give a discount to the unions so If you have a dispatch or even your card you can get the discount .... I think 6th ave Outfitters does also ......AIH does too . They have those gloves .. But AIC has those gloves in Prudhoe ... The safety gear gets bid into EVERY JOB THEY BID !!!!! It doesn,t cost them a cent !!!!!!!!!!!!!!ALOT cheaper for the oil companies than a frozen / amputated finger !!!


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## tramp bushler (Dec 30, 2009)

The best cheapest parka is the 40 below down parka at Army&Navy on 4th . Get it big ... Nothing wrong with Carharts Arctic EXTREME .BUT DON,T GET THE COTTON .GET THE CORDURA .. I prefer the Jacket with the attached Hood as Carhart snap on hoods REALLY SUCK BIG TIME . The Coat has a storm velcro flap tho .so if you can sew on your hood and put a good ruff on i,t it is ok ..... Brooks Range Store is no more expensive on somethings than Anch . or Fairbanks . But on somethings they are REAL expensive .....I buy my Arctic insulated Carharts @ Brooks Range any more .. saves me having to pack them ....Are you a pilebuck? Mechanic ?Laborer ?


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## tramp bushler (Dec 30, 2009)

If you don,t need the FRC , Korbana gear , don,t spend the money on it ...


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## slowp (Dec 30, 2009)

tramp bushler said:


> slowp , you don,t know what cold hands really are . last winter in Prudhoe I frosted 3 fingers on my left hand ... I was changing teeth on a 345 Cat frost bucket . From the time I was ok to them starting to turn into something you would find in the freezer section was 2 minutes .... It is usually cumulative ... . I had got oil on my gloves doing an oil change on a light plant or 966 or something .....then we decided to change some bucket teeth ... I should have taken a 10 minute break of so , it was 50 below ........ Log butcher isn,t talking about cold hands , but ones soon on their way to changeing for the rest of someones life .... My head is one of my best hand warmers .. I put my hands on my head under my hat ............But @ -50 . Most peopke left outside will be dead in an hour unless they have arctic gear on ....



Well, I'd still squeal if I was the tummy donor. Just thinking about it. Some people are extremely ticklish...:monkey: Not saying that I am...

I have a little bit of experience with cold. But only to -30 with no wind. Back in da liddle house in da Methow Valley, where da shower drain froze up at -10 but den thawed ok at -9. And in da Nort country of Wisconsin, where I tink I froze my tear duct because it has been runny ever since I took da dog for a walk in -20 somting and my eye kinda froze shut. 

Used to ski in da old days ven da boots were leather. Ve skied until our feet were numb, den went in and tried not to notice da pain when dey warmed up.

Yah, now dey got dose plastic ski boots wid da insulation. Wimps. 

By the way, I like my Dalbellos. But dey don't fit so good on da hands.


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## gwiley (Dec 30, 2009)

I remember walking to work northwest of Chicago on morning at -20 to -30degF. COuldn't wear my glasses for obvious reasons and my eyes kept freezing shut. They would tear up because of the cold and wind then when I blinked they would get stuck, had to use my fingers to pry them open. That was an awesome experience for someone who grew up in Florida!


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## ak4195 (Dec 30, 2009)

tramp bushler said:


> The best cheapest parka is the 40 below down parka at Army&Navy on 4th . Get it big ... Nothing wrong with Carharts Arctic EXTREME .BUT DON,T GET THE COTTON .GET THE CORDURA .. I prefer the Jacket with the attached Hood as Carhart snap on hoods REALLY SUCK BIG TIME . The Coat has a storm velcro flap tho .so if you can sew on your hood and put a good ruff on i,t it is ok ..... Brooks Range Store is no more expensive on somethings than Anch . or Fairbanks . But on somethings they are REAL expensive .....I buy my Arctic insulated Carharts @ Brooks Range any more .. saves me having to pack them ....Are you a pilebuck? Mechanic ?Laborer ?



Picked up a set of arctic bibs and coat here in wasilla,will get at least one more pair of bibs too.I just dont think they are enough,but I have no winter experience north of Fairbanks.
Waisted some dough on more refrigiwear gloves,thnx for the info on AIC,will take them back.
Bought a small job box for my tools,$560 day,nother $300-$400 or so to go.
Pee test tomorrow in Anch,will buy my boots downtown,was thinking of Lacrosse,hate to tear up my black bunny boots.But Im all ears,didnt hear anything good about the Baffins,which is a shame.
Im an apprentice Service Oiler,didnt think I was going to get any dispatches this winter.In fact i was going to attend the "Pimp my Resume" class at the job center,till I was saved by a phone call.The job is supposed to last till April,somewhere around Kuparic for BP staying in the OCC camp,or something like that.
Would you suggest a mini DVD player or is that stuff piped in,I was a commercial fisherman for over 20 yrs so I know the value of some end of day wind down time.
I love the Copper River valley btw,have a family cabin on the Gulkana @ Sourdough.

stay safe
ak4195


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## tramp bushler (Dec 31, 2009)

If you already got a pair I would take them with you , But don,t tell them you have gloves . Put the reciept in one tie them together and put them in your go to work gear bag .. Mine holds 4,000 cubic inches and I pretty much keep it full .... You need spares . Put your name on everything they give you with a marker pen ... It goes home with you .. If you buy any tools at NAPA. / Brooks Range Supply ,You need to keep the reciept and have it w/you when you come home ....... Sometimes security will check a tool as lots of stuff disappears even up there .... I will give 1 tip that may save your carrer ... 5 MPH IN THE YARD ..... Don,t cross a pad unless the foreman of that shift gives you permission NO #### < IT IS BETTER TO SIT AND WAIT . Crossing a pad without BPs permission can get you dead if there is a gas leak or fired if the BP guy is in any kind of a mood .... Prudhoe is kind of like being on a military base .....same goes for Conoco Phillips ..... They are WAY REDNECK ABOUT THEIR PROCEDURES BEING FOLLOWED .... and 8-10 grand a month take home is worth doing it their way .... Don,t even think about getting a drop oil , anti freeze or other fluid on the ice or snow .. Prudhoe is the most ANAL place for any oil spills there is .. I mean , 1 ounce .... DUCK PONDS /DUCK PONDS/ DUCK PONDS ....... When close outs start I may be up there .. , It will be good to meet someone else on A. S . 10 mph at Peak Base Camp . And it,s a big yard .. Don,t worry , you get paid by the hour ... Rosy the fueler is cool and a very good fueler ..For us dirt guys the fueler is real important ...


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## tramp bushler (Dec 31, 2009)

I forgot , if your gloves get soaked with oil they will freeze your hands . .Thats 1 reason you need spares .... AIC has alot of real good hands that work for them .........Be real nice to the gals in the office !!!!!! They control your coming and going .. .. Oh and the place is over the top anal about sanitizing your hands .. just do it . I use Bag Balm and food service gloves at night twice a week minimum ... slather my hands down with Bag Balm , put on the gloves and go to bed . ... It really helps out .... Most of the other stuff doesn,t work too good .. They usually have it at Brooks Range store .. .. An MP3 player is a must ... I hate public music as I usually hate what someone else likes ... Put in the ear buds . Crank up your tunes and go ahead on er .. If you have to ride in a crummy or bus It will really help your mood . Hopefully you will have a opposite shift room mate . Same shift room mates suck ..even if they are a good guy it still sucks ..... Fleece face masks .. Real important . Have a couple / few . they get snotted up pretty good .Oh and last but not least .. about half the people who work for AIC Prudhoe . are named MIKE . seriously . Please tell me your not named Mike ..


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## catbuster (Dec 31, 2009)

Carhart coat w/ sevral layers underneath, insulated bibs w/long-johns, 600 gram minimum thinsulateboots and really thick socks. Then insulated gloves. for you head, Wear a ski mask/tobbaggan, I wear a tobbaggan so the nieghors don't think my name is jason and put a hood over it. then you'll be REAL toasty.


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## slowp (Dec 31, 2009)

Gotta revert to the right accent.

Youse guys know what da serious cross country skiers use on der faces? Da skiers who ski in da Berkerbiener--Cable WI to Hayward, through da woods in chilly winter, swear by Mary Kay Ballerina Foot Balm. Yup. Dats what it is called. Smells better dan Bag Balm. Prettier container. 

I used some on the last Book Across The Bay event I did. I think the temperature was 11 above that night. It seemed to help keep the face from freezing. Although that "race" was warmer than the year's before. 

No Berkerbiener for me!


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## bullbuck (Dec 31, 2009)

turtle fur makes a real nice baclava designed for fitting nicely under your helmet, hardhat,hat,etc.it is a real nice product,thin breathable and wads up to the size of a hankie when it is not in use,any local motorcycle shop can order it for you through parts unlimited


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## tramp bushler (Jan 1, 2010)

Had my hair freeze to the suspension of my hard hat yesterday .That was my 2n sled load when I had got done most of the cutting for the day Have to take my balaclava off as I get too hot .. . Face mask was freezing to my beard ....... The jacket I wore all day was becoming solid on the outside , A fila downhill ski jacket that mas PolorGaurd insulation .I got it at a thrift shop for a couple bucks and have been wearing for 3 winters now .. It,s too warm for Southeast . but good for here and it,s real flexable .. It was around 20 below F all day ....Had to melt the ice out of the face screen a half dozen times on the muffler of the Solo ... ... Had a good day , but the rewind on the Solo broke right after I started the saw to buck the last 2 short logs up , and it was odd , sometimes the starter handle will sit sideways in it,s pocket on the starter cover , it tends to bug me so I will flip it 90 degrees so it sits in line like it,s supposed to ... When I did that , it fell over sideways and the rope payed out .... I had to wad it up and hold it in my left hand while I bucked up my last logs ... I,ll tear into it today and see what happened .....


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## ak4195 (Jan 1, 2010)

*Nikaitchuq ....*

Well got most of the big ticket items out of the way,just have to pick up an xtra set of bibs,n balaclava's.
Did the "turn your head and cough" yesterday and shipped off my tools,now its pretty much time to sort and lay everything out.Stuff it in a bag,pull it out downsize and stuff it in again.
Took the GF and dawgs up to Hatcher Pass last night for a new years full moon snow shoe,it was actually fairly warm up there surprisingly,cept for the stiff breeze it was probably in the mid teens.
I guess the job is for ENI,big italian national oil company

Are you clearing land or harvesting firewood,or both?
Back in the day my running partner @ UAF(xtra curricular activities) was Bob Murray from Kenny Lake.One of my former shipmates as far as I know still lives @ Willow Lake.
Did you ever figure out how to reduce the air flow on the Solo?

ak


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## tramp bushler (Jan 1, 2010)

*what is Nit a chuq*

Salvage logging beattle killed spruce @ 166 mile ,down toward Lost Cabin Lake ....State timber sale.. Cool on the snowshoeing !!!! My wife likes recreational snow shoeing also .... What kind of bibs and parka ??? Yhe ENI job .. good deal it is going ... 
.
I guess it is Nik ait chuq , what is it ???


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## ak4195 (Jan 2, 2010)

tramp bushler said:


> Salvage logging beattle killed spruce @ 166 mile ,down toward Lost Cabin Lake ....State timber sale.. Cool on the snowshoeing !!!! My wife likes recreational snow shoeing also .... What kind of bibs and parka ??? Yhe ENI job .. good deal it is going ...
> .
> I guess it is Nik ait chuq , what is it ???




Sounds like its a big production site,will be tied in with kuparuk for pipeline transfer.Guess Ill know more very soon,ran into a friend last night who works for ASRC for the last few yrs.
Echo'd your thoughts on gear,sounds like I may not have had to buy everything here as well.Oh well,I hate showing up like a greenhorn.
Now onto more important things like:do I need to bring my own tobasco sauce?
ak4195


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## tramp bushler (Jan 2, 2010)

Some real expensive restraunts in town have better food than the general run of Prudhhoe Bay ... But as a rule you always leave alot fatter than when you go ... ALWAYS BRING TWO BIG LUNCHES TO WORK .. If you don,t get caught in a White out you throw the one away that you didn,t eat ... Seldom do you get caught out , but it only takes freezing to death one time ya know ... food keeps you warm ..................


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## Brmorgan (Jan 3, 2010)

This is a great thread; lots of info and products for me to check out. I'm always looking for ways to keep warm since I have four fingertips that I've shortened up over the years and they get cold very easily. Add to that that I have naturally low BP and my extremities don't stay warm if I'm not really moving around a lot; meanwhile my torso can be absolutely burning up inside. I hate it. I love working around -5-10°C if I can keep moving, but beyond that my fingers start aching after a while and they aren't quick to warm back up.


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## tramp bushler (Jan 3, 2010)

It was 25 below 0 F today when I went to work . All I wore on my hands was a pair of insulated leather palm nylon back gloves ...I have about 28years running a saw for a living , and I only had to warm my hands on the muffler twice .... But I had the rest of my body very well insulated and half the time I was breathing thru a fleece face mask .. 3 of them actually as they would ice up and freeze to my beard ......Plus I am sick with a major cold so I was feverish / then chilled .. Got my day in tho ,, made 200 . Bein sick I was very thankful I did that well !!!


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## ithica (Jan 5, 2010)

I have these hunting mittens that flip open underneath is a glove, there is also a zippered pocket on the mitten half where I put hot packs inside, I use them for everything , never had cold hands, and trust me it gets colder than witches tit up here in Northern Ontario. Not the same brand as the picture but the same style , if these don't work well you can always shove your hands down your pants haha !


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## ak4195 (Jan 6, 2010)

its been around -8 here since I got here,sposed to chilly on down later in the week,glad I brought the heavy duties....


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## tramp bushler (Jan 7, 2010)

Ak; hows it goin there ... Did you need a refresher on your NSTC card ???? I got an e mail from the Laborers that there was a mandatory class or something I needed to take on my NSTC card .... ?????????????????????? How big is the job @ ENI ?????? The phone started ringing here with wood orders so I,ve been totally busy all week and it is looking like into next week .....Hopefully for a while to come .....


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## tramp bushler (Jan 7, 2010)

Sorry all , I guess we digressed from Owl,s cold lunch hooks ...... Owl; how are your hands doing any way ????????? It is the warmest here it has been for at least a month , 8 above 0.. It,s a heat wave ,,,,call Al Gore !!!!!! :jester::jester::censored: I was wearing regular leather gloves for part of today .Have had a brand new pair laying on the seat of the truck for over a month ... Didn,t even need a face mask today .. But my flip down face screen stilled iced up .But I only had to thaw it out on the muffler one time today .......It snowed and so the roads got slick .........


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## slowp (Jan 10, 2010)

Here's the event where I found out about Ballerina Foot Balm on da face.
I did this ski thing both winters I was there. If youse wait till the crowd has gone ahead, (have a beer or something stronger) the ice tilts and you can ski downhill to Washburn.


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## treedog54 (Jan 23, 2010)

*Choppers*



yooper said:


> dont wear fingered Gloves when very cold wear mittens, (chopper type) with a liner and fingered glove inside. (in case ya have to take them off) I use the cheep stretchy cotton gloves in side of mine or the fancy white ones (The fagot Michael Jackson ones) Hard to get used to working with choppers on but when fingers are warm ya get used to it, hell I climb with them all the time when it gets below 0.



Heck,when we worked together I thought ya looked Cute in dem M. jacksons Knowin your such a fan and all.The mans right, leather choppers I use ragg wool liners which have a thinsulate liner in them.


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## cpr (Jan 30, 2010)

Don't know if anyone mentioned this method or not, but it works for me. I wear cheapie latex surgical gloves as a base, then Boss assembly grip nitrile palm gloves, plus heavy thinsulate gloves over that. Works great. If I have to work outside (day job as carpenter) I'll ditch the heavy outer gloves if I have to for something requiring finer dexterity. Out sawing and such, though, my hands will sweat right down to 5 degrees so long as I keep moving.


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## [email protected] (Jan 31, 2010)

Owl, or anyone else,

A trick I've used often is to swing my arms either in a circle, or forward and back no higher than the shoulder so as to increase the "drive" of warm blood to the fingertips. Kinda using centrifugal force to help increase blood pressure and flow. For me the effects are almost instant warmth.

I like to climb ice in the winter and sometimes with your hands above your head gripping your axes, your fingers freeze to where they seem to scream. Half a minute of swinging your arms seems to work.

slowp, in my house my lower back is often used by my daughters/wife to warm their feet. I snivel, but they seem to quite like it. Apparently I am quite warm. Not sure if they like the comfort of my back or tormenting me with their little frozen feet.


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