# Firewood Processors



## thejdman04 (Dec 10, 2008)

I am new to this site, and very new to firewood processors. I have been cutting and selling firewood for about 7 years now. My firewood business started out, something I would do on the weekends to fill up my spare time, I would cut it and split it, pile it and then sell it the next year. I got laid off a few years back and have grown my firewood business, to a fairly decent size. Currently I am using a "big box store" 30ton splitter. I split it, put it in my skid steer and then pile it with the skid steer. I have no clue about firewood processors. There are probably 20 big firewood producers in my area, and only one has a firewood processor. I stopped and talked to him about his, and he swears by Hudson. Suprisingly he is about the only one in the area that has a firewood processor. Seems everyone else uses man power and a conventional spilitter. I typically sell about 300 face cords per year, and every year I run out of firewood. I know there is a substancial initial investment, but I think in the long run it would pay off. Anyone ever use one? Anything to look for, and look out for? Do they work as well as they claim to? Thanks for any insight.


----------



## shamusturbo (Dec 10, 2008)

*Same Question.....*

I too am in the same boat. I have already sold 100 full cords (300 faces). My brother and I do it all by hand and our customer base is still expanding. There was a guy up the street who I out sold handily and he sold a 3 year old "Fuelwood" brand processor for over $70k a few months back. The thing ate logs alive and had a 30ft conveyor that spit it out the other side. The Hundson product seems like it would be slower than my brother and I doing wood by hand at roughly 2 or 3 cords and hour. Have you looked at any others? I have looked around and I love the looks of the Canadian made Cord King but it too looks quite pricey especially if you cant feed it wood continuously.


----------



## cord arrow (Dec 10, 2008)

> my brother and I doing wood by hand at roughly 2 or 3 cords and hour.



Good God...I wouldn't want to meet you two in a dark alley...


----------



## thejdman04 (Dec 10, 2008)

By the time I cut the tree down, get the logs to the splitter split them and pile it, I am taking about 2 hours to do a face cord. I maybe am slow, I dont have the best splitter,(its almost brand new but not very fast), I just think there has to be a better way. Like I said theres quite a few big big firewood "producers" if you will that dont have firewood processors and I can figure out why, dont they work as well as advertised etc. Anyone tried to make their own? Anyone have plans for one?


----------



## STLfirewood (Dec 10, 2008)

You just need to get a super splitter. I have one and they are great. 

Scott


----------



## fourfivefour (Dec 10, 2008)

Check out Youtube. Do a search for log splitter or wood processor, there are several videos..................454


----------



## KindlingKing (Dec 10, 2008)

You might get by with a Timberwolf TW-6 or TW-7 as an interim solution. They have a great website if you want to check out their equipment. Cost to buy new will be between $8k and $10k but I am told they are worth it. You can produce a lot of firewood on one of these machines, at least until you are ready for a full processor (much larger buy-in cost). Timberwolf makes those too. Best of luck with the decision.


----------



## KRS (Dec 10, 2008)

cord arrow said:


> Good God...I wouldn't want to meet you two in a dark alley...



Ya, no kiddin' :kilt: :kilt:


----------



## Biker Dude (Dec 10, 2008)

fourfivefour said:


> Check out Youtube. Do a search for log splitter or wood processor, there are several videos..................454


My favorite is the Woodbine but there is another one that shears the logs instead of cutting them which is also very impressive.


----------



## medic977 (Dec 11, 2008)

I actually bought one again this year. About 7 years ago or so I was very big into the firewood business, had me a tw-5 complete with 4 way, log lift and actually went upto the Timberwolf fctory and bought the table grate, was a great addition for not only saving your back but also significantly cut down on time. With the obstinate way I get with an idea in my head, I started to do a ton of research on the processors and with the help of Timberwolf, I actually located a pro mx and picked it up for about 28k if I remember correctly, had already bought a conveyor that was made locally to use with the splitter, just relocated it over to the processor. When I got the processor, it has the Perkins on it, came with both the 6 and 8 way, live deck, etc. Man I got to tell you, that thing would truly hump some wood out, and fun to run, I mean effective lol. The problem I ran into was supplying it regularly, kept running out of material so I liquidated it with the conveyor for around 20k, took a bit of a beating but better than losing the shirt in the divorce. I had also purchased a Kubota articulating loader rs420 full cab wit heat, bought a grapple for it which i still have, but found that the pallet forks were much faster in keeping it loaded. With a guy in the loader and one running the processor, could do between 4 and 5 cords an hour, that top roller is absolutely amazing, it will forward logs itself to the saw if something were to happen to the feed trough chain, miss that machine.

Now this year, got the itch again, bought another tw-5 same set up right out of the dealer, then in the process of researching the processors, I came across the woodbine. Well, here is my experience so far with the woodbine. I bought a PTO model as I traded the articulating Kubota in for a tractor last spring, TN55D, more than enough power to run it, and I had it trailer mounted with the idea that it would be as simple to set up and break down as the timberwolf was, not the case. All together the processor mounted on the trailer, and the 24' hydraulic conveyor (part of the package with the processor w/o additional cost) with the financing comes to about 42k. Now, the woodbine is standard with an 8 way, 35 ton splitter, 30inch saw with 404 and the conveyor - nice addition with no additional cost as mentioned above. Now, my supply this year was all logged in 8/07 and with the exception of the red oak, nice and dry. So here we go. Overall I believe the design has some great points, ie: spring loaded log stop for length of cut, wide hopper for multi block splitting, pieces drop right into the conveyor which has a gap about 15' up roughly 2 inches to allow for the pieces of bark etc to drop out and not into the finished product, the unit has a walk way all the way to the pto pump so if need be you can make relief cuts to the logs if they get hung up. The live deck is 2 strand, logs move to the feed trough, the log stops are not high enough (my opinion) on the out side of the feed trough, actually had a big old cherry log come off the unit onto me, and thought it crushed my leg, but minor addition, with some simple welding to change that. The attachments to the feed trough conveyor are cut pieces of c channel stock not the formed hooks as the tw have, and they tend to snap off at the weld. The biggest problem I have had, and resulted in the unit actually being at a local fabrication shop right now is the wedge. The initial wedge totally self destructed, one wing snapped off at the weld, and another tore off. I called Chris and he provided me with another one for the time being/ I picked that one up, and it was so tight the pieces that came out fired out like a bullet. THe end reslt of that was the toe plate bending - 1" steel, cracks on both sides of the splitter 4x4 box tubing, and the c channel guides not only mushrooming but breaking off. Have had issues with the hydraulic tank leaking and some of the connections as well. The connections leaking were simple fixes, couple pipe wrenches, the hydraulic tank I made a make shift gasket out of an inner tube and that seemed to resolve the issue or atleast significantly reduce it.

All in all, it is a good machine, and with the cost of the processor and the conveyor coming to about 42k with financing, a whole lot easier to swallow than the tw's. which even a pro HD by itself is roughly 70k than add a conveyor for about 14k and your out lay is humongous. For the most part Chris has told me he builds the units himself, except contracts some of it out to outside fabricators - the wedges and hydraulic tanks are actually examples. He includes things like a seat, and the ability to walk done the unit as standard, a seat for example on the tw is like an 800.00 option. 
I am particularly fond of the spring loaded log stop, it makes it much easier and faster to maintain precise sizes. Chris has stood right behind the product, each time a wedge issue arose, he backed it right up with ah new one. I am not sure what the unit will produce hourly, as I processed and deliver per load this year, but with a pto until I haven;t found that the speed is 4 plus and hour as the sales man told me, but lets face it, that is a lot of production at 4 plus an hour. The last time I talked to Chris, he was changing the design of the wedge a bit, in attempt to eliminate the problem I dealt with. As mentioned above, all in all I think it is a good machine, I lie alot of the design features he has included and thought of. Unfortunately he has the same issues the rest of us do finding effective, reliable, productive subs. I don;t know for sure, but I tend to believe that though he has sold alot of machines, I may be the one that has really worked it hard, 100 cords in about 2 months, so I uncovered alot of the problems that most probably haven;t had. 

Overall, the cost and production, from the research I did including the expo's I think it is one of the best built units on the market, well designed and comfortable to use.


----------



## thejdman04 (Dec 11, 2008)

medic977 said:


> I actually bought one again this year. About 7 years ago or so I was very big into the firewood business, had me a tw-5 complete with 4 way, log lift and actually went upto the Timberwolf fctory and bought the table grate, was a great addition for not only saving your back but also significantly cut down on time. With the obstinate way I get with an idea in my head, I started to do a ton of research on the processors and with the help of Timberwolf, I actually located a pro mx and picked it up for about 28k if I remember correctly, had already bought a conveyor that was made locally to use with the splitter, just relocated it over to the processor. When I got the processor, it has the Perkins on it, came with both the 6 and 8 way, live deck, etc. Man I got to tell you, that thing would truly hump some wood out, and fun to run, I mean effective lol. The problem I ran into was supplying it regularly, kept running out of material so I liquidated it with the conveyor for around 20k, took a bit of a beating but better than losing the shirt in the divorce. I had also purchased a Kubota articulating loader rs420 full cab wit heat, bought a grapple for it which i still have, but found that the pallet forks were much faster in keeping it loaded. With a guy in the loader and one running the processor, could do between 4 and 5 cords an hour, that top roller is absolutely amazing, it will forward logs itself to the saw if something were to happen to the feed trough chain, miss that machine.
> 
> Now this year, got the itch again, bought another tw-5 same set up right out of the dealer, then in the process of researching the processors, I came across the woodbine. Well, here is my experience so far with the woodbine. I bought a PTO model as I traded the articulating Kubota in for a tractor last spring, TN55D, more than enough power to run it, and I had it trailer mounted with the idea that it would be as simple to set up and break down as the timberwolf was, not the case. All together the processor mounted on the trailer, and the 24' hydraulic conveyor (part of the package with the processor w/o additional cost) with the financing comes to about 42k. Now, the woodbine is standard with an 8 way, 35 ton splitter, 30inch saw with 404 and the conveyor - nice addition with no additional cost as mentioned above. Now, my supply this year was all logged in 8/07 and with the exception of the red oak, nice and dry. So here we go. Overall I believe the design has some great points, ie: spring loaded log stop for length of cut, wide hopper for multi block splitting, pieces drop right into the conveyor which has a gap about 15' up roughly 2 inches to allow for the pieces of bark etc to drop out and not into the finished product, the unit has a walk way all the way to the pto pump so if need be you can make relief cuts to the logs if they get hung up. The live deck is 2 strand, logs move to the feed trough, the log stops are not high enough (my opinion) on the out side of the feed trough, actually had a big old cherry log come off the unit onto me, and thought it crushed my leg, but minor addition, with some simple welding to change that. The attachments to the feed trough conveyor are cut pieces of c channel stock not the formed hooks as the tw have, and they tend to snap off at the weld. The biggest problem I have had, and resulted in the unit actually being at a local fabrication shop right now is the wedge. The initial wedge totally self destructed, one wing snapped off at the weld, and another tore off. I called Chris and he provided me with another one for the time being/ I picked that one up, and it was so tight the pieces that came out fired out like a bullet. THe end reslt of that was the toe plate bending - 1" steel, cracks on both sides of the splitter 4x4 box tubing, and the c channel guides not only mushrooming but breaking off. Have had issues with the hydraulic tank leaking and some of the connections as well. The connections leaking were simple fixes, couple pipe wrenches, the hydraulic tank I made a make shift gasket out of an inner tube and that seemed to resolve the issue or atleast significantly reduce it.
> 
> ...



Thanks for all your comments. Thanks for this comment too, this is what I was looking for. Every machine will break, and without product support the machine isnt worth anything


----------



## thejdman04 (Dec 11, 2008)

STLfirewood said:


> You just need to get a super splitter. I have one and they are great.
> 
> Scott



The wedge on the "super splitter" seems short. I get some logs that are 48". I flip my splitter I got now vertically, and even the wedge and backstop on that are short enough that I usually have to split it, turn it split it etc quite a few times before I can get the wood to split. Some of the stuff I split is pretty wet and stringy, I just dont know if the wedge on that machine is tall enough to split big logs that are stringy.


----------



## blackdiesel (Dec 11, 2008)

to me, what i've seen of it, the hudson eqpt. is equivelent of the "Wild Thing" lol

if your seriously looking into a processor MAKE SURE you have LOTS AND LOTS of long, slick logs that are between 10-18 inches around. dont buy one thinking that a logger will bring you "all the logs you can handle" because they LIE. I've delt with 3 or 4 and its the same story every single time. and if you dont have a set of scales to weigh the truck, the loads will keep getting shorter and shorter....

Anyways point is, if you dont have the logs, machinery to handle the logs, or a place to take a whole bunch of wood, then a processor is worthless.


oh and in realistic time, i can only cut just short of 2 cords per hour with my timberwolf..... 

To be honest with ya, you just need to hire them two guys on here that can cut 3 cords by hand in one hour :jawdrop: that would be more profitable


----------



## dnf0929 (Dec 11, 2008)

I used the analogy of a hot dog cart vs. a restaurant. Do I want to be financially tied to the firewood business where it becomes something I absolutely have to do to keep up with the loan payments or do I want to make some money doing something I enjoy. Granted the amount I can make with a small pickup, saw and splitter is limited and a with a processor it might be higher but the for me at this point didn't seem worth the risks given all the things I considered.

Employees: Do I want any? How much do you pay? Under the table or on the books? SS, Medicare, Workers Comp? What if they get hurt?

Logs: Can I find a reliable source? Will costs go up that I can pass on?

Equipment: I don't have another business like construction or landscaping where I have a skid steer/tractor/dump truck. Is a firewood business alone enough to justify these purchases?

Insurance, fuel costs, maintenance and parts. Demand for and price of the product.

Right now the money I have invested (a little over 3k for my Super Split) can be recouped by what I save in heating costs in a couple of years and the rest is gravy. Most importantly I get a lot of enjoyment cutting, splitting, stacking, burning and discussing firewood.

Good luck no matter what you do!


----------



## shamusturbo (Dec 11, 2008)

*Thanks for the input!*

Thanks for the suggestions on processors Medic! Im not sure if it would be profitable for me to have such a financial obligation to one yet. I think Im going with the Timberwolf TW-5 and add a six way wedge. 

KRS and Cord Arrow----My borther is a 16 year old junior in high school who lives for football and is actually bigger than I. He is 6'3 and right around 250 lbs. I am a sophomore in College and I am an inch shorter and 10 pounds lighter. Along with that he is a red head and can have quite a temper sometimes which he takes out on wood which is fantastic for business!!! We get the logs delivered from a local logger that is more than generous to us.---Assuming 4 saws (MS 361-440-460-660) are sharp and the weather is nice we can handle around three cords an hour. Its probably more towards 1 cord each in the winter. He runs a 37 ton 4-way Northern Star splitter and I run a homemade 4-way splitter I built for a little under $900.----wood has paid for my college tuition, the splitters, a truck for the both of us, and pocket money continously.


----------



## medic977 (Dec 11, 2008)

You are most definitely welcome.

I absolutely love the timber wolf products, I am considering going to the packaged end of the business as well, I have been able to locate a couple of retail areas, and one of them is just up the road from me, and directly on the way to Vt. so may just give that a shot. I was considering trading the 5 I bought this year up to a 7, they offer a fantastic box wedge system that would be exceptional for the packaged end of the market. 

With regard to the processors, I just don;t think as I mentioned that you could beat a timberwolf, but it sure is a ton of money to lay out, but I am really hooked on that top roller system, but with the cost and the unbelievable wait to get one in, when I found the woodbine, I was sold, and Chris (designer, builder and fabricator) has really been great. As you mentioned all things will break, but again as you said service is paramount. When I first started to run into problems, he called me right away, talked me through some of them, as simple as adjusting the pressure on the pump he uses for the bar and chain oil, to offering to ship me a new wedge when it first went hay wire, or I could come over and pick it up. He builds them about an hour or so from me so over I went. He has the parts he uses to build them in stock, even the chains, for a ton less than I could buy locally, Oregon 404 96 dl for $20.00. I think if I had an independent power plant on it, it would do better, and if I was isolated to just poles, but some loggers will as mentioned tell you one thing and then deliver another.


----------



## wdchuck (Dec 11, 2008)

Medic, 4cords an hour?, ....4 full cords per hour, from log to split for homeowners, regardless of log diameter? that is a tough pill to swallow. 

I operate a Multitek processor, 20+yrs old, and 1cord/45min is average to good, considering the logs are varied in diameter, and straight to crooked as a boomerang. 8"dia to 30" dia, oak, locust, elm(@#$), doesn't matter, an 8way splitter just leaves many pieces too large once the log exceeds 14" dia. 

If I were shopping for a processor, I'd pay money to see a manufactured setup that does 4cords/hr. 

Large log produces large splits, they need to be fed back through the splitting process, that takes time to keep the fingers attached to their original hands. 

4cords/hr, even if they were telephone poles, I can't imagine that rate of production, and I run a $100k+ machine.

Maybe we don't know what we are doing, but 20+yrs of two generations should have the bugs worked out.

Medic, not trying to be a naysayer, it's just hard to picture that kind of production rate.


----------



## medic977 (Dec 11, 2008)

From a review site: 

Re: Fire Wood Processor
The best all around firewood processer is the Hakki from finland. Hudson sells it. The smallest one is about 15k, but can process about 4 cords/ hour.

It is tractor mounted or needs a power unit of 25 hp.

Additionally they manufacture their own but are somewhat slower but have their own power plant.

Check these out. IT will be hard to build one for less than 10K.
__________________


----------



## medic977 (Dec 11, 2008)

Reviews on the cord king also rate that at over 50 cords per day


----------



## medic977 (Dec 11, 2008)

Blockbuster is rated at 3-4 an hour. There is no need for this to become an argument, or implications of falsity, but possibly you are looking at perfection of product and not usability. There are multiple units on the market now that can handle 4 cord an hour, hell mine is supposedly able to do that, which I don;t see ever happening.


----------



## ms310 (Dec 11, 2008)

:agree2:


cord arrow said:


> Good God...I wouldn't want to meet you two in a dark alley...


:agree2: +1


----------



## blackdiesel (Dec 11, 2008)

wdchuck said:


> Medic, 4cords an hour?, ....4 full cords per hour, from log to split for homeowners, regardless of log diameter? that is a tough pill to swallow.
> 
> I operate a Multitek processor, 20+yrs old, and 1cord/45min is average to good, considering the logs are varied in diameter, and straight to crooked as a boomerang. 8"dia to 30" dia, oak, locust, elm(@#$), doesn't matter, an 8way splitter just leaves many pieces too large once the log exceeds 14" dia.
> 
> ...




finally, some one on here that is knowledgeable and knows his machine!


----------



## thejdman04 (Dec 11, 2008)

blackdiesel said:


> finally, some one on here that is knowledgeable and knows his machine!



I have the wood, and the support machinery(way to haul it away or pile it and a skid steer with forks and grapple. Guess I need to find a good used one, that maybe the real challenge.


----------



## STLfirewood (Dec 11, 2008)

thejdman04 said:


> The wedge on the "super splitter" seems short. I get some logs that are 48". I flip my splitter I got now vertically, and even the wedge and backstop on that are short enough that I usually have to split it, turn it split it etc quite a few times before I can get the wood to split. Some of the stuff I split is pretty wet and stringy, I just dont know if the wedge on that machine is tall enough to split big logs that are stringy.



Keep the machine you have now for 1/4ing the big stuff and then use the SS for the 1/4ed pieces. I have split 30" Elm with my SS. It will do the big stuff but it does slow it down. Remember your going after production. When I com to a tough one I toss it to the side. Why waste a bunch of time on a tough block when I can split 4-5 regular blocks in that time. That old saying sometimes you have to step over a nickle to get a dollar come to mind. I work them up later.

Scott


----------



## blackdiesel (Dec 11, 2008)

thejdman04 said:


> I have the wood, and the support machinery(way to haul it away or pile it and a skid steer with forks and grapple. Guess I need to find a good used one, that maybe the real challenge.



that can be tough. i found mine locally for cheap. the guy was going through a divorce and made him an offer. i had to do some work to it (hydraulic saw, much bigger pump) so it wasnt all fun and games, but now it works good. 

look through my previous posts, i posted a link to a video of my machine.


----------



## wdchuck (Dec 11, 2008)

thejdman04 said:


> I have the wood, and the support machinery(way to haul it away or pile it and a skid steer with forks and grapple. Guess I need to find a good used one, that maybe the real challenge.



I am aware of a tree guy that also has a processor, monster of a machine actually, might be able to hook you up. Was on his property once, and it looked portable, let me know where you are in northern Illinois.


----------



## wdchuck (Dec 11, 2008)

I've never seen any other processor in action firsthand, so my experience is limited, that said, it limits the credibility of my comments.

Just to fair to those who have experience with other and more equipment.


----------



## drmiller100 (Dec 11, 2008)

i'm thinking of selling kits you can weld together yourself.

i'm currently working on a web site to include full specifications, except for the hydraulics. 
The hydraulics I would sell.

Target price is 10k for a complete system built that you pick up, or 5k for the hydraulics and all moving parts.

pics can be seen at

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bAckm2YdLEQ


----------



## LAH (Dec 12, 2008)

Enjoyed that video. Bet that coat gets hot. HEE HEE


----------



## LEES WOODC (Dec 12, 2008)

medic977 said:


> You are most definitely welcome.
> 
> I absolutely love the timber wolf products, I am considering going to the packaged end of the business as well, I have been able to locate a couple of retail areas, and one of them is just up the road from me, and directly on the way to Vt. so may just give that a shot. I was considering trading the 5 I bought this year up to a 7, they offer a fantastic box wedge system that would be exceptional for the packaged end of the market.
> 
> With regard to the processors, I just don;t think as I mentioned that you could beat a timberwolf, but it sure is a ton of money to lay out, but I am really hooked on that top roller system, but with the cost and the unbelievable wait to get one in, when I found the woodbine, I was sold, and Chris (designer, builder and fabricator) has really been great. As you mentioned all things will break, but again as you said service is paramount. When I first started to run into problems, he called me right away, talked me through some of them, as simple as adjusting the pressure on the pump he uses for the bar and chain oil, to offering to ship me a new wedge when it first went hay wire, or I could come over and pick it up. He builds them about an hour or so from me so over I went. He has the parts he uses to build them in stock, even the chains, for a ton less than I could buy locally, Oregon 404 96 dl for $20.00. I think if I had an independent power plant on it, it would do better, and if I was isolated to just poles, but some loggers will as mentioned tell you one thing and then deliver another.



Before investing any $ into a packaged wood business you might want to check with USDA. I thought I remember reading about regulations that require all packaged wood being sold as retail needed to be kiln dried. Just a heads up!


----------



## thejdman04 (Dec 13, 2008)

I guess the question is now, can I afford a processor. I guess I am thinking aloud, but was wondering what you guys think about having a processor come in and split my wood. For you guys that have processors, would you process somones wood at your location? At their location? For how much? Per hour? Per cord? At first I was thinking about hauling the wood to their location, and then hauling the finished product out of their location but that seems like much more work then somone bringing a processor to my location. I have ths support equipment(way of getting the wood away from the processor(and a way to load the table). I would hate to pay somone by the hour, and keep track of hours, if they are unhonest, if they are slow, for whatever reason they are slow because their machine is having problems. I would rather have a fixed number xx per face cord processed, but depending on log diameter species etc would dictate time it takes to process a cord. I want it to be fair for both sides. I want to make money, and I understand a processor is a large investment, and up keep on one of them isnt real cheap either. Any thoughts? Anyone else out there ever done some "custom processing"? Rates? Firewood around here is only going for 80-120 on the very high end a face cord (1/3 cord) so I just dont know if I can make that large of an investment, unless I found a decent used one. I figure though, if a processor can do 3 cords and hour and I need about 400 face cords, that would only be a little over a weeks work if somone brought a machine in.


----------



## abohac (Dec 13, 2008)

dnf0929 said:


> I used the analogy of a hot dog cart vs. a restaurant. Do I want to be financially tied to the firewood business where it becomes something I absolutely have to do to keep up with the loan payments or do I want to make some money doing something I enjoy. Granted the amount I can make with a small pickup, saw and splitter is limited and a with a processor it might be higher but the for me at this point didn't seem worth the risks given all the things I considered.
> 
> Employees: Do I want any? How much do you pay? Under the table or on the books? SS, Medicare, Workers Comp? What if they get hurt?
> 
> ...


You took the words right out of my mouth!


----------



## blackdiesel (Dec 13, 2008)

Don't plan on 3 cord per hour. without a cord king it won't happen. If someone wanted me to come cut up their wood (and had that much) I would do it for around 20 bucks per face cord. for sure if they would keep it loaded for me. but that's just me and wood only sales for 150 per real cord here. I would forsure look into that if I were you.


----------



## thejdman04 (Dec 13, 2008)

blackdiesel said:


> Don't plan on 3 cord per hour. without a cord king it won't happen. If someone wanted me to come cut up their wood (and had that much) I would do it for around 20 bucks per face cord. for sure if they would keep it loaded for me. but that's just me and wood only sales for 150 per real cord here. I would forsure look into that if I were you.


Well even if it were only 2 cords per hour, 400 face cords wouldnt be or take somone with a processor that long. If I could get somone to process it for 20 a face, I have some labor, fuel etc involved, with the skidsteer and keeping wood away from the machine, but I feel I could easily get it "made" for 35 a face cord, if I only paid 20 per face to the processor. If I got it made for 35 a face and sold it for 80 I would be very happy. I would have no problem keeping a processor loaded, my bob cat with forks or a grapple should be able to keep the table fed, no problem. I also have either a 24ft tandem dump goosneck trailer to haul the wood from the processor, or if he had a conveyor and could pile it and move the processor back every so often to make a row, that wouldnt be a problem either. I would be very happy to pay 20 a face, and not have to do much physical labor. Its not that Im being lazy, but when you only have 1 person and you are trying to do 400 face cords a year with a box store spiltter, it just seems that there has to be a better way.


----------



## MIspecial (Dec 13, 2008)

multitek 3040xp2
http://multitekinc.com/app/inventoryapp/new_equipment_and_parts/inventory_view/2-3-26-1.html

Wow thats a machine and with the circular saw looks like is a fast one too. You would have to have a large demand to justify the cost, I bet.


----------



## whiting-5 (Dec 13, 2008)

after watching that impressive video !!! an old saying from my dad came to mind( son it takes money to make money!!! ) and another one that i just rememberd ( son theres a right tool for every job ) but we dont own any of those now get over there and grab the bucket of tools we do have...


----------



## blackdiesel (Dec 13, 2008)

thejdman04 said:


> Well even if it were only 2 cords per hour, 400 face cords wouldnt be or take somone with a processor that long. If I could get somone to process it for 20 a face, I have some labor, fuel etc involved, with the skidsteer and keeping wood away from the machine, but I feel I could easily get it "made" for 35 a face cord, if I only paid 20 per face to the processor. If I got it made for 35 a face and sold it for 80 I would be very happy. I would have no problem keeping a processor loaded, my bob cat with forks or a grapple should be able to keep the table fed, no problem. I also have either a 24ft tandem dump goosneck trailer to haul the wood from the processor, or if he had a conveyor and could pile it and move the processor back every so often to make a row, that wouldnt be a problem either. I would be very happy to pay 20 a face, and not have to do much physical labor. Its not that Im being lazy, but when you only have 1 person and you are trying to do 400 face cords a year with a box store spiltter, it just seems that there has to be a better way.



you keep wood on the deck, crap cleaned out from underneith the conveyor, and fuel in the tank and i'd come cut GOOD wood for 60 bucks a cord. you'd need to furnish labor to stack the wood, so its fair for both parties. and dont expect anybody to cut 400 rick in a week. 20 rick a day would be busting a nut and thats only if something dosnt break down. to those that say "i can do 20 rick in a day by hand" i say have at it. and those that say "i could cut 50 rick a day with a processor" i say try it. 

anyways, point is your looking at atleast 3 weeks in real world time, if you could find someone with a high quality machine that hasnt been beaten and abused. and this is given if you have good weather.


----------



## STLfirewood (Dec 13, 2008)

How are you going to get your logs that cheap. $45 a cord is what you are planning on spending. It's about $75-$90 a cord to have good logs dropped here. Maybe it's just higher here. I have thought about a processor also. It came down to a money factor for me. I can buy wood for $105 a true cord here. It's not worth buying a processor and having logs brought in. I did talk to a guy with a cord king that live 120miles away. He said he would come and work it for me if I had the logs ready to go. I think we were going to be around $100-$125 an hour range. That was also when diesel was around $4.70 a gallon. The numbers just didn't work for me right now. If I loose my supplier then I will look closer at that option. I really think you should look at te super splitter. That and a conveyor you could do 6-7 cord of wood a day splitting. And that is splitting small. That's a lot of work though.

Scott


----------



## drmiller100 (Dec 13, 2008)

wow.
we were doing 10 full cord a day, and that was with us bucking the 42 foot logs in half, and loading them onto the table ourselves. Granted, those are 9 hour days, and things had to not break a whole lot, and I couldn't be delivering on those days.

so, as I understand it, a face cord is one third of a cord? so you'd be paying me 60 a cord to process?

400 face cords is 133 full cords. so, that comes out to 7,000 bucks????

I'd sell you the processor I had in the video for that price.


----------



## Mr. Firewood (Dec 14, 2008)

drmiller100 said:


> I'd sell you the processor I had in the video for that price.



I will admit that contraption does get the job done and not too bad of a price

If I were to buy any processor right now I would have a Palax imported, they are completely electric and do <16" and thats most of what I work with.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hhmKBDIAXd0&feature=related


----------



## wdchuck (Dec 14, 2008)

MIspecial said:


> multitek 3040xp2
> http://multitekinc.com/app/inventoryapp/new_equipment_and_parts/inventory_view/2-3-26-1.html
> 
> Wow thats a machine and with the circular saw looks like is a fast one too. You would have to have a large demand to justify the cost, I bet.



The circle blade looks wicked, lots of mass and inertia. I'll stick to the bar/chain setup, more control over it. 
That sure is pretty though, all nice and clean, not much has changed from the one I run to the new ones, based on the picture. Except for the guarding, kind of difficult to run big splits back through. 

Maybe that's where the big production numbers come from, all the big splits just keep going up the conveyor, that would add up fast from a volume standpoint, but the customer with an indoor stove would be unhappy.


----------



## thejdman04 (Dec 14, 2008)

blackdiesel said:


> you keep wood on the deck, crap cleaned out from underneith the conveyor, and fuel in the tank and i'd come cut GOOD wood for 60 bucks a cord. you'd need to furnish labor to stack the wood, so its fair for both parties. and dont expect anybody to cut 400 rick in a week. 20 rick a day would be busting a nut and thats only if something dosnt break down. to those that say "i can do 20 rick in a day by hand" i say have at it. and those that say "i could cut 50 rick a day with a processor" i say try it.
> 
> anyways, point is your looking at atleast 3 weeks in real world time, if you could find someone with a high quality machine that hasnt been beaten and abused. and this is given if you have good weather.


60 a cord, with me paying for fuel , I could handle that. The lowest a cord goes for around here is 225. Granted Id have fuel to pay for, time, labor, and delivery costs, getting the wood and limbing it but I still think I could put 100 a cord in my pocket after all my costs.


STLfirewood said:


> How are you going to get your logs that cheap. $45 a cord is what you are planning on spending. It's about $75-$90 a cord to have good logs dropped here. Maybe it's just higher here. I have thought about a processor also. It came down to a money factor for me. I can buy wood for $105 a true cord here. It's not worth buying a processor and having logs brought in. I did talk to a guy with a cord king that live 120miles away. He said he would come and work it for me if I had the logs ready to go. I think we were going to be around $100-$125 an hour range. That was also when diesel was around $4.70 a gallon. The numbers just didn't work for me right now. If I loose my supplier then I will look closer at that option. I really think you should look at te super splitter. That and a conveyor you could do 6-7 cord of wood a day splitting. And that is splitting small. That's a lot of work though.
> 
> Scott


Around here logs are FREE especially if you go get them. MANY MANY piles of logs around here for the taking. There are many subdivisions that are going up in the area. They just take a cat and make a big pile of trees. All I have to do is go with my skid steer pull them out of the pile, limb them there( they will burn the limbs etc) load the logs in my dump trailer and away I go. Some of the wood is junk, some of it is covered in dirt etc, but there is A LOT of it that is good wood you top it out and limb it and its ready to go. They put a pipe line through again they took a cat and if there were trees or mini forests (ie patches of trees) they bulldozed it. The local municpalities around here cut trees down on easements, run the limbs through a chipper and leave the logs. The logs then by an indepenent contractor they pay, get loaded up into a dump trailer and get hauled to the garbage dump to be disposed of. I could have those logs too. They have to haul them 40 miles away and pay to dispose of them, and I would take them for free. I know I could if I had a quicker faster way to process the stuff I could be up to my ears in wood. Granted its not free, I have to go get it, limb it (except for what would come frmo the city, that is limbed), but the problem is, me getting it processed and split, that is the glitch in my system at this point. Granted I dont get the wood for free, I have my time, fuel in the skid steer, truck and wear and tear on the truck and trailer, but I know its much less then 75 a cord.


----------



## LAH (Dec 14, 2008)

wdchuck said:


> The circle blade looks wicked, lots of mass and inertia. I'll stick to the bar/chain setup, more control over it.
> That sure is pretty though, all nice and clean, not much has changed from the one I run to the new ones, based on the picture. Except for the guarding, kind of difficult to run big splits back through.
> 
> Maybe that's where the big production numbers come from, all the big splits just keep going up the conveyor, that would add up fast from a volume standpoint, but the customer with an indoor stove would be unhappy.




Very unhappy.


----------



## savageactor7 (Dec 14, 2008)

TreeCo said:


> Great looking processor!
> 
> Your self returning ram/valve set up is ingenious. I'm going to give mine a try with some pulleys and cords.



Ditto... very clever props to you.


----------



## Moss Man (Dec 14, 2008)

drmiller100 said:


> i'm thinking of selling kits you can weld together yourself.
> 
> i'm currently working on a web site to include full specifications, except for the hydraulics.
> The hydraulics I would sell.
> ...



Nice set up. The only thing I would question is the splitter ram traveling to the wedge automatically? People do slip and make mistakes and that ram isn't gonna know the difference between wood and a human limb.


----------



## drmiller100 (Dec 14, 2008)

Lots and lots of things dangerous about cutting firewood.
The chain doesn't care whether it cuts flesh or wood.
The tractor doesn't care if it drops logs on the table or someone's head.
The engine gets hot and burns flesh.

One safety thing EVERYONE should do. Get in the habit of ONLY holding wood on the round part, never on the flats on the ends. We "kid" each other, but it costs 10 bucks on my job to get caught with your hands on the ends of the wood anywhere near the splitter. And anyone can catch you and collect the money.

If your hands are never on the ends, they aren't as likely to get pinched.

I will also say my saw is a LOT safer then free handing like we all used to do. The chop saw setup holds all the weight, confines it a narrow place, and you don't get near as tired or forgetful.


----------



## Zodiac45 (Dec 14, 2008)

thejdman04 said:


> Around here logs are FREE especially if you go get them. MANY MANY piles of logs around here for the taking. There are many subdivisions that are going up in the area. They just take a cat and make a big pile of trees. All I have to do is go with my skid steer pull them out of the pile, limb them there( they will burn the limbs etc) load the logs in my dump trailer and away I go. Some of the wood is junk, some of it is covered in dirt etc, but there is A LOT of it that is good wood you top it out and limb it and its ready to go. They put a pipe line through again they took a cat and if there were trees or mini forests (ie patches of trees) they bulldozed it. The local municpalities around here cut trees down on easements, run the limbs through a chipper and leave the logs. The logs then by an indepenent contractor they pay, get loaded up into a dump trailer and get hauled to the garbage dump to be disposed of. I could have those logs too. They have to haul them 40 miles away and pay to dispose of them, and I would take them for free. I know I could if I had a quicker faster way to process the stuff I could be up to my ears in wood. Granted its not free, I have to go get it, limb it (except for what would come frmo the city, that is limbed), but the problem is, me getting it processed and split, that is the glitch in my system at this point. Granted I dont get the wood for free, I have my time, fuel in the skid steer, truck and wear and tear on the truck and trailer, but I know its much less then 75 a cord.



Well, that may be possible for a while but I sure wouldn't hang my hat on that source of wood as primary. First off, it will be time consuming, 2nd, you'll have too take it all no doubt and not cherry pick the logs. 3rd, people want hardwood firewood of good quality for the $225 price you've stated, not mixed with possible softwood. Around here loggers deliver "firewood" logs in very specific sizes and varieties due too processor needs. Good Luck.


----------



## Moss Man (Dec 14, 2008)

drmiller100 said:


> Lots and lots of things dangerous about cutting firewood.
> The chain doesn't care whether it cuts flesh or wood.
> The tractor doesn't care if it drops logs on the table or someone's head.
> The engine gets hot and burns flesh.
> ...




Perhaps you took what I was saying in the wrong way, I know all the dangers of firewood processing very well and I still have all my limbs and fingers.

All I was trying to convey was that I have never seen a manned splitter with the ram going to the wedge automatically, I challange you to show me a commercial splitter that does so. Unmanned splitters can be fully automated, no one is there to be in its way.


----------



## drmiller100 (Dec 14, 2008)

Moss Man said:


> Perhaps you took what I was saying in the wrong way, I know all the dangers of firewood processing very well and I still have all my limbs and fingers.
> 
> All I was trying to convey was that I have never seen a manned splitter with the ram going to the wedge automatically, I challange you to show me a commercial splitter that does so. Unmanned splitters can be fully automated, no one is there to be in its way.



Hmmmm. 

So what you are saying is you think my splitter is more dangerous BECAUSE of the autocycle????

Interesting.

The right hand starts the Splitter moving, so the right hand cannot be hurt. there is only two inches of "slack" between the log and the splitter, the splitter engages the log in under one second of start.

So my assumption would be you are worried about someone sticking their left hand between the knife and the log, or the log and the foot.

With the right hand to start the cycle, the left hand cannot reach the knife. It is too far away.

So the fear must be someone would set the log in place, then take their left hand, and put it on the far right side of the log, then hit the start lever, and then not be smart enough to immediately push the lever the other way.


----------



## thejdman04 (Dec 14, 2008)

Zodiac45 said:


> Well, that may be possible for a while but I sure wouldn't hang my hat on that source of wood as primary. First off, it will be time consuming, 2nd, you'll have too take it all no doubt and not cherry pick the logs. 3rd, people want hardwood firewood of good quality for the $225 price you've stated, not mixed with possible softwood. Around here loggers deliver "firewood" logs in very specific sizes and varieties due too processor needs. Good Luck.


 I have been getting my wood for about 5 years this way, mainly from guys wanting tree lines thinned, and subdivisions going up. Most of the time I get in there before the trees are bulldozed, and I take what I want, once and awhile I get in on the tail end of things and get there after the logs are piled. Maybe I have just gotton very lucky so far, but I have never had to take everything. Whether the trees are standing and I take what I want or they are already in a pile I have always (so far, and hopefully my luck will hang in there) just taken what I want, limbed it and pushed the limbs and branches back up into a pile. What ever I dont take is almost always burned or burried. They are happy not to burn/bury so much. I am very careful when I pick trees not to pick soft woods. I just go in with my skid steer pull out what logs I like/want, limb them, put the logs in my dump trailer and push the brush back up into the pile.


----------



## wdchuck (Dec 14, 2008)

Now you just have to start getting paid to clear the whole lot, and leave the stump removal and grading to the next contractor. 

The low quality trees could just be ground up for mulch, to be sold to whomever for $22/yard. Have a tub grinder service come in for a day and you'll have plenty of inventory to sell, provided you have a place to store it. 

It's a situation that does make people money.


----------



## thejdman04 (Dec 14, 2008)

wdchuck said:


> Now you just have to start getting paid to clear the whole lot, and leave the stump removal and grading to the next contractor.
> 
> The low quality trees could just be ground up for mulch, to be sold to whomever for $22/yard. Have a tub grinder service come in for a day and you'll have plenty of inventory to sell, provided you have a place to store it.
> 
> It's a situation that does make people money.



Unfortunatly, untreated mulch around here you cant give away. The park district in this area has PLENTY of mulch to GIVE AWAY, they will gladly load it for you too They pickup yard waste, and after storms go around w/a loader and dump truck picking up sticks and tree limbs and they have a small tub they grind it with. They ALWAYS have a huge pile, free, they load. I have tried selling that stuff (ie people who want cheap mulch etc), and people want either dark brown or red etc mulch. I was trying to sell it at 10 bucks a yard, enough to cover my time and fuel (esp if most peole wanted 5-10 yards at most) and never could sell any of it. A guy I know works for the park district and said a few people will come and get pickup loads, a few come and get a few garbage bags of it, but not many.


----------



## LAH (Dec 15, 2008)

Moss Man said:


> All I was trying to convey was that I have never seen a manned splitter with the ram going to the wedge automatically, I challange you to show me a commercial splitter that does so. Unmanned splitters can be fully automated, no one is there to be in its way.



Not sure what you mean by "fully automated"? I will say my TW-7 has the auto cycle feature. Once you pull the lever it travels to the wedge & returns without the operator doing anything else.


----------



## wdchuck (Dec 15, 2008)

thejdman04 said:


> Unfortunatly, untreated mulch around here you cant give away. The park district in this area has PLENTY of mulch to GIVE AWAY, they will gladly load it for you too They pickup yard waste, and after storms go around w/a loader and dump truck picking up sticks and tree limbs and they have a small tub they grind it with. They ALWAYS have a huge pile, free, they load. I have tried selling that stuff (ie people who want cheap mulch etc), and people want either dark brown or red etc mulch. I was trying to sell it at 10 bucks a yard, enough to cover my time and fuel (esp if most peole wanted 5-10 yards at most) and never could sell any of it. A guy I know works for the park district and said a few people will come and get pickup loads, a few come and get a few garbage bags of it, but not many.



Treat it brown during the grinding/shredding phase, that's the time.


----------



## Moss Man (Dec 15, 2008)

LAH said:


> Not sure what you mean by "fully automated"? I will say my TW-7 has the auto cycle feature. Once you pull the lever it travels to the wedge & returns without the operator doing anything else.




My apologies to drmiller100 then. Just doesn't seem safe to me, most splitters I have seen have the detent on the return cycle only.


----------



## thejdman04 (Dec 15, 2008)

wdchuck said:


> Treat it brown during the grinding/shredding phase, that's the time.



What does the dye cost? Do most grinders charge per hr? Per yard mulched? I have a small 6" chipper, never had or thought of ahving one come in.


----------



## Zodiac45 (Dec 15, 2008)

Moss Man said:


> My apologies to drmiller100 then. Just doesn't seem safe to me, most splitters I have seen have the detent on the return cycle only.



I agree with you Moss. I've never seen it either (on the upswing.) Not saying it's any more dangerous per se. I'm sure it's faster no doubt.


----------



## Zodiac45 (Dec 15, 2008)

thejdman04 said:


> I have been getting my wood for about 5 years this way, mainly from guys wanting tree lines thinned, and subdivisions going up. Most of the time I get in there before the trees are bulldozed, and I take what I want, once and awhile I get in on the tail end of things and get there after the logs are piled. Maybe I have just gotton very lucky so far, but I have never had to take everything. Whether the trees are standing and I take what I want or they are already in a pile I have always (so far, and hopefully my luck will hang in there) just taken what I want, limbed it and pushed the limbs and branches back up into a pile. What ever I dont take is almost always burned or burried. They are happy not to burn/bury so much. I am very careful when I pick trees not to pick soft woods. I just go in with my skid steer pull out what logs I like/want, limb them, put the logs in my dump trailer and push the brush back up into the pile.



That's a good situation for you then. My only point was that as soon as people start seeing you as "player" in the firewood bizz, you might find that "free" supply a little harder too get. Best of luck.


----------



## thejdman04 (Dec 15, 2008)

Zodiac45 said:


> That's a good situation for you then. My only point was that as soon as people start seeing you as "player" in the firewood bizz, you might find that "free" supply a little harder too get. Best of luck.



I know what you meant, no offense taken at all. People are happy not to have to clear as much or not have as big of a pile to burn as more and more every day they get tighter and tighter on big big brush piles like taht (people complain of the smell and smoke) so so far its worked out well for me. How long will it last??????? So far unless I can find a decent used machine I think the best option for me is to try to find somone with a processor and have them come in and do the work for me, If i can find somone to do it.


----------



## LAH (Dec 15, 2008)

Moss Man said:


> My apologies to drmiller100 then. Just doesn't seem safe to me, most splitters I have seen have the detent on the return cycle only.



If memory serves, the TW-7 has an 8 second cycle time. Normally I lay the round on the rail and pull both levers. The levers lock and the ram moves to the wedge and returns while I reach for another round. Dangerous....................yes. But so are a lot of things. 

Jeff Cooper who carried his 1911 Colt cocked and locked was approached once by a hippy type who asked him: Man do you know your piece is cocked man. Cooper replied: Yes. The young man said: Isn't that dangerous man? Cooper answered: Yes.


----------



## thejdman04 (Dec 16, 2008)

And it starts again next year, there has got to be a better way to split 400 face cords
The "big pile" is all I have left for this year, about 40 face cords, way short of what I should have left for this time of year.


----------



## thejdman04 (Dec 16, 2008)

Heres what it all gets split with


----------



## STLfirewood (Dec 16, 2008)

thejdman04 said:


> Heres what it all gets split with



That would be like beating your head on a wall. You should really check into a Super Splitter for the cost. You wont be sorry. If you want to sell it in a year or 2 because you want a processor you'll get a good return. I buy wood from a guy to resell he has a Super Splitter and runs 1200+ face cord through it a year. He has a Hanaki (sp) processor just sittle there because he likes the Super Splitter better.

Scott


----------



## dnf0929 (Dec 16, 2008)

:agree2: 

I just used my Super Split for the first time today. You owe it to yourself to find somebody with one and go check it out. It'll be worth the trip and there's a good chance you'll be ordering one shortly thereafter.


----------



## maplemeister (Dec 16, 2008)

dnf0929 said:


> :agree2:
> 
> I just used my Super Split for the first time today. You owe it to yourself to find somebody with one and go check it out. It'll be worth the trip and there's a good chance you'll be ordering one shortly thereafter.



Hi Dan:

Congrats on the new supersplit. Would love to hear how long it takes you in real world time to do a full chord 4x4x8', with this new machine, assuming that you all-ready have the blocks ready to go. Also wanted to let you know that your earlier post with the Hot Dog Cart vs's Restaurant analogy really 
resonated with me as that is exactly the way I feel about getting my feet into the business also. Well stated. 

Maplemeister:  :agree2: :agree2: :agree2:


----------

