# why not clamp the sprocket



## bigjohn1895 (Feb 28, 2011)

hey all 
ive been thinking about this for the last week 
what can you hurt if you clamp the Alaskan to the sprocket 
at the tip of the bar? it seems that as long as its on the ribits 
that it wont be able the pinch the sprocket 
any one tried it? 
if so what happend ?


----------



## mtngun (Feb 28, 2011)

The rivits may be slightly proud of the bar, or they may be flush with the bar.

I've never tried it, but I see no reason you could not clamp on the sprocket as long as the contact area was confined to the 1" disc in the center of the sprocket. This would require modifying the Granberg's clamping pad.


----------



## northwest coast (Feb 28, 2011)

the clamps on my mill are about 2/3 as long as the width of the bar so even over the rivets on the tip it would be pinching the sprocket. before i took the dogs off my saw i had that problem, i just had to ease up the tension on the clamp so it still held the mill while letting my chain spin. i didn't feel very good about it though, i promptly removed the dogs. try it if you want, or if it is just for the occasional big log you should be alright, as long as you can spin the chain with your hand but the mill doesn't slip then fly at 'er. am i rambling ?


----------



## mtngun (Feb 28, 2011)

The reason I never pursued clamping to the sprocket is I wanted to be able to swap chains without removing the bar from the mill.


----------



## bigjohn1895 (Mar 1, 2011)

the only reson i want to do it is for the ocational cut 
and most my cuts are short any how 

now i have a new question what if i take the post off the sproket side 
to make wider cuts kinda like the small log mill is there a way the get the stalbility back im using the mill to cut ovals at a 60 degree angle to carve signs and make tables so the cuts are 1-3 feet


----------



## northwest coast (Mar 1, 2011)

and have one side unsupported ? i think thats a bad idea, the saw tip usually tends to dive downwards and the stability of the mill prevents this. you will end up wedging your saw in and it will become a frustrating struggle. 

am i understanding your question ?


----------



## BobL (Mar 1, 2011)

mtngun said:


> The reason I never pursued clamping to the sprocket is I wanted to be able to swap chains without removing the bar from the mill.


 
The bar nose can still be clamped and the chain removed while the saw is on the mill by removing just part of the clamps although that is a bit redundant. One reason clamped noses are required is on mills that attach directly to a saw's bar bolts. If the bar nose is bolted to the mill and the mill is attached to the saws bar bolts, tensioning the chain becomes a PITA as the outboard mill cross bar has to be loosened to tighten the chain. If a bar nose clamp is used it can be loosened and then the chain tension adjusted and then the clamp locked in place.

On my small mill the clamp comes apart and the chain comes off the nose in the traditional manner, towards the clutch side. On the two bigger mills the chain is popped off the bar at the nose an rotated away from the clutch and goes up over and around the saw.

Clear as mud - yep it's hard to describe but it does work.


----------



## john taliaferro (Mar 2, 2011)

mtngun said:


> The rivits may be slightly proud of the bar, or they may be flush with the bar.
> 
> I've never tried it, but I see no reason you could not clamp on the sprocket as long as the contact area was confined to the 1" disc in the center of the sprocket. This would require modifying the Granberg's clamping pad.


 I drilled mine back from the sprocket a ways in the solid part of the tip might have lost some with but i am using 1/4 20 button head bolts glued and torqued in to the clamp pad . saw comes off ,or chain in a very few moments .makes working on the saw or storing things easier . Does leave the 88 hanging out on the springy bar but i think i can make a plate like Bobs that mounts from bar bolts to bar and mill with slotted holes to bring saw back more solid .


----------



## 820wards (Mar 2, 2011)

BobL said:


> The bar nose can still be clamped and the chain removed while the saw is on the mill by removing just part of the clamps although that is a bit redundant. One reason clamped noses are required is on mills that attach directly to a saw's bar bolts. If the bar nose is bolted to the mill and the mill is attached to the saws bar bolts, tensioning the chain becomes a PITA as the outboard mill cross bar has to be loosened to tighten the chain. If a bar nose clamp is used it can be loosened and then the chain tension adjusted and then the clamp locked in place.
> 
> On my small mill the clamp comes apart and the chain comes off the nose in the traditional manner, towards the clutch side. On the two bigger mills the chain is popped off the bar at the nose an rotated away from the clutch and goes up over and around the saw.
> 
> Clear as mud - yep it's hard to describe but it does work.


 
Clamping the bar at the very end would make me nervous if it ever came loose. Through bolting it at the nose would be the safest/best ticket for me. Just my .05 cents worth...


On my mill originally, I just clamped the bar at both ends. When it came to taking the chain off as BobL put it, it was a "PITA". So I copied BobL's mill and drilled/tapped the pinch pads on the mill frame and then drilled the bar for bolts. Now the bar stays connected to the mill frame. I still retained the side guides for when I'm milling, but having the bar bolted to the frame just makes it easier to remove or adjust the chain, everything stays together. I did add a brace at the top of my mill because the additional weight added by the large fuel tank and oil bottle allowed the bar to flex, and adding the brace eliminated the flexing.

jerry-

Here is a picture of the bolt at the mill head end. You can see how the bolt is holding the bar to upper side of the mill pinch pad. I then replace the lower half of the guide with the two bolts, it also keeps the bolt from ever coming loose while milling.







Here is a picture of the nose bolt.






And the bracket that connects the top of the thickness tube to the mill head that has the tanks mounted to it. It is slotted so it will slid when making chain removal and adjustments.


----------



## BobL (Mar 2, 2011)

820wards said:


> Clamping the bar at the very end would make me nervous if it ever came loose.


 
It depends what the attachment mechanism is on the inboard end. If the mill is attached to both bar bolts on the inboard side then unlike a conventional alaskan the bar cannot rotate into the clamping bolts and a light clamp to hold the nose steady is all that is required. Several times on the BIL mill I have completely forgotten to fully tighten the nose clamp and nothing happened - I just kept milling, felt the bar was a bit sloppy and stop tightened the clamp up and carried on.

One time the clamp was really loose and this is what happened.




You can see how much the clamping bolt was loose ie it was really loose and nothing was holding the nose. If this has been a conventional mill the chain would have been toast. This also shows the benefit of having an ally mill.


----------



## mtngun (Mar 2, 2011)

820edwards, I'm curious why you are still using the clamps even though the bar is bolted to the frame. Don't the clamps get in the way when it's time to swap chains ?


----------



## 820wards (Mar 2, 2011)

mtngun said:


> 820edwards, I'm curious why you are still using the clamps even though the bar is bolted to the frame. Don't the clamps get in the way when it's time to swap chains ?


 
Mtngun,

I have a wooden stand that I use to put the mill on when I mill. The bottom guides/bolt heads act a feet for the mill to stand on. I can take the bottom guide off in less that five minutes.

BobL,

I did have the nose clamp bolts I had forgotten to tighten and when I started milling caught it before the chain hit one of the clamping bolts. That is why I drilling my bar.

Just came in from the shop from sealing all the ends of the hardwood I milled on Sunday. After lunch I'm planning to make a picture frame cutting jig. Cheers!

jerry-


----------



## BobL (Mar 2, 2011)

820wards said:


> I have a wooden stand that I use to put the mill on when I mill. The bottom guides/bolt heads act a feet for the mill to stand on. I can take the bottom guide off in less that five minutes. -




Instead of just bolting the bar to the mill why not bolt right thru the lower clamp and bar and then remove the original clamp bolts. The lower part of the clamp will now act as a foot but it will be still be easy enough to remove the chain without undoing 4 more bolts.




Almost any conventional alaskan mill could be adapted this way.


----------



## 820wards (Mar 2, 2011)

BobL said:


> Instead of just bolting the bar to the mill why not bolt right thru the lower clamp and bar and then remove the original clamp bolts. The lower part of the clamp will now act as a foot but it will be still be easy enough to remove the chain without undoing 4 more bolts.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
BobL,

That's what I did. I drilled and tapped the upper clamping pad to accept a 3/8" x 16 bolt. I think anyone with an alaskan mill could just drill and pat there mills.

jerry-


----------



## BobL (Mar 3, 2011)

820wards said:


> BobL,
> 
> That's what I did. I drilled and tapped the upper clamping pad to accept a 3/8" x 16 bolt. I think anyone with an alaskan mill could just drill and pat there mills.
> 
> jerry-


 
Not quite - my design has no clamp bolts either side of the bar. The bolt goes thru the lower clamp, the the bar and then into the upper clamp.

It would look something like this on your Mill.




For reference here is your setup





No bolts would need to be undone to replace the chain, and the lower half of the clamp is still attached to act as feet if required.


----------



## bigjohn1895 (Mar 3, 2011)

*hmmm*

so im gathering that the only reason not to clamp it at the sprocket is 
that it will have to be loose and could take out the chain if i slips 
i only need to do this for a few short cuts so im going to try it out 
and hopfuly afther this order goes out i can get a bigger saw and bar


----------



## 820wards (Mar 3, 2011)

BobL said:


> Not quite - my design has no clamp bolts either side of the bar. The bolt goes thru the lower clamp, the the bar and then into the upper clamp.
> 
> It would look something like this on your Mill.
> 
> ...


 
Ahhh... The wonders of Photoshop!

Correct, I would not have to take anything off if I removed the lower guide. I like the extra guide at the bottom so it will move along the log as I mill, and also to act as a stand. My mill is a bit top heavy and I don't like laying it on it's side when I'm not milling. It stands very nicely on the bolt heads.

jerry-


----------

