# ROMBO Fire Saw Accident



## smokechase II (Mar 2, 2008)

This is a report from a tree falling injury report last fire season.

FYI:

http://www.wildlandfire.com/docs/2008/lessons-learn/rombo-sawaccident-fla.pdf

I would suggest that the 3" high backcut was an inch too high and additionally if one wanted to address potential kickback that there would be no substitute for a Humboldt here. 

The high stump was safer and appropriate but the escape across the back was not.

It looks like an incomplete size up was a primary error but the snag that did the damage may have been just loosened by vibration. Without any direct contact with the tree being fell or obstacles that were hit by it.

So:

Do a great size up,
Have a great escape, even if it means cutting on the other side.
Use that escape route.
Keep your head on a swivel.

*******************

Told you that story to tell you this one.

The common practice of dropping one tree on trees/snags should be discouraged, particularly on fires.

Adding to the fuel ladder among other reasons to avoid it.


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## 2dogs (Mar 2, 2008)

Thanks for the link.


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## joesawer (Mar 3, 2008)

They sure make a simple thing complicated.


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## smokechase II (Mar 3, 2008)

*Yep*

This was only an injury report.


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## John Paul Sanborn (Mar 3, 2008)

joesawer said:


> They sure make a simple thing complicated.



I think what they are getting at is that experience and confidence can breed complacency. Also, one can be an experienced faller with individual trees, but getting into an overgrown thicket of deadwood can lead to problems.

A safe operating culture requires a method that all follow and can easily pass on. 

Here is a vid on the Sim Limb training they wer talking about.

http://www.fs.fed.us/fire/safety/council/newsletters/may06/may06.html


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## 046 (Mar 3, 2008)

what great info!!!

sim limb instructor claims 90% of faller injuries results from overhead hazards. 

if this 90% number correct?


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## joesawer (Mar 3, 2008)

046 said:


> what great info!!!
> 
> sim limb instructor claims 90% of faller injuries results from overhead hazards.
> 
> if this 90% number correct?



How much of the tree is over the fallers head?


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## Haywire Haywood (Mar 3, 2008)

Did I read that right that he did a kerf face instead of a normal face? I thought a kerf face was a big no-no.

I know I know... Haywire is typing again... must be amateur hour.

Ian


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## smokechase II (Mar 4, 2008)

*Vertical Situational Awareness*

It takes an unobstructed object less than 2 seconds to fall 50 feet and it is going 40 miles per hour when it hits.

It gains speed as it continues to fall. (Let's drop the terminal velocity discussion with the distances involved here.)


*********************


The lookout thing for a faller sounds like a safety item.
Many managers without practical field experience have a tendency to go with the lookout.


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## joesawer (Mar 4, 2008)

Is it going 40 mph at the butt or at the top?
I believe that the taller a tree is, the faster the top moves.


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## smokechase II (Mar 5, 2008)

*Speed*

From a height of 50 feet.

When it reaches the ground.

An unobstructed (meaning not only does the limb or top not hit anything, but it has very littler air resistance, I.e. few needles etc), object.

*It gains speed as it continues to fall.* 

**************

So yes, an unobstructed object will be moving faster from a greater height.

Up until it reaches terminal velocity. Then its speed will remain (relatively) constant.


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## rmihalek (Mar 5, 2008)

Here's a quote from the report:

"The sawyer was about 3 to 4 feet away (from the stump) and about 45% towards the rear, on the opposite side as the escape route."

The injury report could have ended after this sentence instead of proceeding for another 7 pages.


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## John Paul Sanborn (Mar 5, 2008)

It really looks like a "lessons Learned" lesson plan outline.

Yeah, we can say he was felling a tree, did not clear the fall path, and had a snag flip back at him.

But they try to answer as many different question as possible, so that there is a set amount of time used in the class. Also, many people do not know enough to ask a lot of the questions posed.

Going through reports like these, you end up slogging through to find one little nugget that you can use. As time goes on, the nuggets get fewer and farther between.


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