# What do you think about lettering my truck this way



## TKO-KID (Jan 9, 2009)

What do you all think of this idea on lettering my truck.

I will paint it of course and try to get a new door for the back cabinet, if I can't get one I guess I will just drill holes and Mount I peice of Plywood and paint it white, but I do not know yet.

Any ideas greatly appreciated.

so if you have an idea and want to post it let me know, I am posting one picture that has no writing other then the phone number. SO you can put itin paint if you want to.

Thanks for any idea in advance


----------



## pdqdl (Jan 9, 2009)

*I think you'll do fine with that*

Don't do yourself the disservice of putting good lettering on a rusty truck. 

Paint the truck first.


----------



## treeman82 (Jan 9, 2009)

Dare I ask what you intend to use that truck for, other than a lawn ornament?


----------



## arbor pro (Jan 9, 2009)

Don't pay any attention to these snobs.  If that truck is all you can afford right now, that's fine - just do a good job repairing/painting it so that it looks professional. If you have a shop to work in, you can make that rusty beater look pretty good with a few hundred bucks in professional primer and paint. Just take your time and do a good job fixing rust spots, dents, etc first. Like pdqdl said, no use in putting nice lettering on a cruddy looking truck but, fix the truck up right and you might have yourself a nice inexpensive start-up unit there until you can afford something bigger/better.

As for the name and slogan, I was thinking something like 'For tree care DUNN right', call DUNN RIGHT Tree Service...

As for paint color - go simple industrial white. Easy to put any color lettering on and best resale value down the road. Use vinyl lettering, not paint, so the letters can be easily removed with a heat gun should you decide to sell it down the road.

As for lettering - K.I.S.S. Keep it simple stupid. Big and simple lettering. Too much text and your truck won't be as noticable by passers-by. Just your company name, logo, contact number and very brief description of services. Don't try to include too much text.

Good luck.


----------



## TKO-KID (Jan 9, 2009)

thanks arbor pro for the only real answer so far.

as for the truck it gets the job done. Because I actually know how to climb but it helps a lot in the dead tree's that I will not climb it also helps to get up to the lowest branch on the larger tree's so I do not have to waste time roping up.


Also this gets me in the backyards that you can't get into with a bucket if needed unless you have a 75+ footer and can go over the house.

It also helps when they are growing through the power lines I can cut on one side of the lines and then the other so I do not drop on the lines or risk eletrocuting myself.

We have already started sanding down the doors today and hope to get the primer on today but we will see.


So any other ideas on the lettering?


----------



## TKO-KID (Jan 9, 2009)

also forgot 

We can not change the name of the company we have been in business for 5 years and our name is already recognized( it is ok if you are jealous that our slogan is catchy and people remember it.

people actually say they called because they saw our truck, flyer, website,or yard sign and that the slogan stuck in their head.

I also just looked in the first post and it clear says that I will paint it first.

The rust is not actually in the metal, just in the paint it kind of looks like the old owners painted it with house paint.


----------



## pdqdl (Jan 9, 2009)

I read it, but sometimes people don't always get done what they had planned. 

Myself included. 




That reminds me... I still need to paint my truck and add some lettering. It's only been 4 years, so I'm still on schedule. 

I'll get that done next week...


----------



## John Paul Sanborn (Jan 9, 2009)

> As for lettering - K.I.S.S. Keep it simple stupid. Big and simple lettering. Too much text and your truck won't be as noticable by passers-by. Just your company name, logo, contact number and very brief description of services. Don't try to include too much text.



Good advise, name and number is all you need, so the drive by can get it when they want to call.

Font should be large enough so that the neighbors can read it across the street.

Maybe the URL under the name the rest is good as an after thought. Maybe as a bumper sign, you want the truck as your main advertising, so the phone number is more important than anything else


----------



## tree MDS (Jan 9, 2009)

treeman82 said:


> Dare I ask what you intend to use that truck for, other than a lawn ornament?



Don't forget changing light bulbs...hanging x-mas lights...cleaning gutters...shearing hedges..

I'm sorry but, is this for real?? Its like the other guy with the fifty footer that he picked up for six grand! I mean if your that desperate wouldn't it make sense to REALLY learn to climb instead?? And before you even say anything, yes I know you cant climb for s#1t! How? because no self respecting climber would be seen with that piece!

"oh my God, look what they've Dunn to that tree!" lol


----------



## tomtrees58 (Jan 9, 2009)

tree MDS said:


> Don't forget changing light bulbs...hanging x-mas lights...cleaning gutters...shearing hedges..
> 
> I'm sorry but, is this for real?? Its like the other guy with the fifty footer that he picked up for six grand! that's not four tree work climb first tom trees


----------



## pdqdl (Jan 9, 2009)

That's not nice, MDS.

There is a place in every market for a lot more than super-pro climbers. And even if you are a super-pro climber, you still can't use that skill to trim a 20' tall hedge. Or hang christmas tree lights.

And I can't tell you how many times I have been asked to just raise some ratty old over grown tree, and that machine is just about perfect for that kind of work. Sure, you can do most of that work with a pole pruner. Or climb. But not as quickly.

So don't be so negative, ok?


----------



## arbor pro (Jan 9, 2009)

Some of you climbers who seem to have a grudge against guys who use aerial lifts apparently don't seem to understand that not everyone's work environment is the same. I've been doing professional tree care for 24 years and am a mighty poor climber. There, I said it. 95% of the work I do can be accessed from either an aerial lift or from the ground. 1 in 20 trees I work on requires that I climb or use a ladder with safety harness and lanyard. I don't need to climb very often so I tend to get out-of-practice at it. Frankly, I could care less if any of you full-time climbers think less of me for it. I have made a lot of money over the years at what I do without the need to be an expert climber. I climb when it's necessary. For everything else, this aging guy prefers to use an aerial lift to save on his crappy knees. I don't sacrifice quality of service simply because I access a branch via a machine vs my own power. If a branch can't get reached via my lift, I climb. If I can reach it with the lift, the heck with climbing! Get off your high horses already.


----------



## CentaurG2 (Jan 9, 2009)

We all had to start somewhere. If you haven’t done so already, check with both your insurance company and the state inspection service where you intend to get the truck inspected as to what lettering they consider appropriate. They may require a certain letter size and placement. State inspection on vehicles over 12K in my state are a nightmare! Also make sure to get your lift inspected and certified. Good luck with your new business venture!!


----------



## tree MDS (Jan 9, 2009)

pdqdl said:


> That's not nice, MDS.
> 
> There is a place in every market for a lot more than super-pro climbers. And even if you are a super-pro climber, you still can't use that skill to trim a 20' tall hedge. Or hang christmas tree lights.
> 
> ...



Yeah, I suppose that was a little harsh. I apologize in retrospect. Sorry AS.

Personally however, if I saw that thing pulling up to work on my tree, I would be a little apprehensive to say the least - and not because of the lack of a paintjob. Like tom said: not for treework.


----------



## arbor pro (Jan 9, 2009)

TreeCo said:


> Not to mention he's talking about trimming about power lines with what looks like an uninsulated and/or untested truck. Likely he has no business around power lines to begin with.



Now that's a legitimte statement. I was thinking the same thing. If he's going to be do work around power lines, he needs to have both the training and the correct equipment in order to do it safely. That kind of advice, however, can be offered in a constructive manner without bashing the guy for the appearance of his truck. Go take your afternoon nap already ya grumps...


----------



## TKO-KID (Jan 9, 2009)

For the guys who actually work and don't sit on Arborsite all day bashing.

here is an updated pic of the truck as we have been working on it today.


Also we don't go out and bid trimming on electric line but if a removal is being done that a branch or two goes out through the lines we can get it a few feet out from the lines so that when we cut it off it doesn't fall and take out the lines. Mostly they are just telephone lines, I do not know if everywhere is the same but here the electric lines are much higher then the phone and cable so 95% of the time they are just telephone or cable lines and I am sure has hell not climbing out on a 1-2 inch thick branch trying to cut it off. 

Looking a little better.

Will post more as it comes along.


----------



## TKO-KID (Jan 9, 2009)

I will also mention again for the guys who just see the lawn service and immediately think they know everything about me.


I have already work as a tree climber years ago for another tree service in the area. So I have experience climbing and am decent at it not great but not great. I guess I am not really a bad climber but I take my time and work at my own pace no reason to price a job so low that I have to rush the job and danger myself and anyone around me. 

But the bucket as arbor pro said will save me a lot of time on smaller trees so I can do alot of the work from the bucket. We work in a highly residential area, so trees are very near homes in many occasions so if I can get out near the end of limbs and trim them back so as not to rub the roof of a house or drop it in their pool or on their shed I am taking it.

There is no way I am like hey I have a bucket I am going to try and trim a 100 foot pin oak from it.

I would say 90% of the trees we get called for are under 60 foot tall.

The ones that are bigger people usually don't have the money to remove or trim or do have the money and don't want to spend it.

Thanks again for those who actually look at the whole picture and see how life really is.

I hope for the grumpies with to much time on your hand that 2009 is a better year for you and you will have enough work to keep you busy(which hopefully will make you happier) because of more money which makes life a little easier when you don't have to worry about the bills.

Not to mention if you are busy working you will have less time available to sit on Arborsite all day looking for things to bash.


----------



## tree MDS (Jan 9, 2009)

As far as all this "everybody has to start somewhere" sympathy goes...

Whats wrong with a basic Weaver saddle and a 120' hank of Arborplex? Surely much safer than something designed for tinkering with cable wires.
If you try climbing and dont like it - treework is probably not for you should be your next logical thought. Not: well, I'll just get the biggest bucket I can afford, then treework will be easy..heck anyone can do it! Heck, with my low overhead I should be able to do smaller trees and still get some of that good tree service bling!!

When I was learning you climbed, the bucket was for the forman, unless the tree was real bad a$$. Nobody should start out in a bucket unless its utility work IMHO. I love this new school/kinder gentler treeworkin mentality - too much for you that climbing?? thats alright, here's a binky, take my hand and I'll gently and kindly lead you to the bucket - being sure not to raise my voice too loud, as I know you'll quit (or break something on me latter).

I know I was a little harsh a few posts back, was that any better??


----------



## John D (Jan 9, 2009)

TKO,the lettering will be great once you finish up the truck. I cannot believe the amount of crap the members are giving you here.First they tell you to piant it,after they never bothered to read your post before replying,then they whine about the truck,and what it is,and can't do,now they are telling you where you have business being in relation to powerlines.All you asked was for some feedback on the lettering! Talk about off topic.I hope your competent enough to paint this truck on your own,you may need to start another thread so the vulchers can come tear you up on how you do it,and if your able to paint it next to the power lines.LOL.


----------



## arbor pro (Jan 9, 2009)

tree MDS said:


> As far as all this "everybody has to start somewhere" sympathy goes...
> 
> Whats wrong with a basic Weaver saddle and a 120' hank of Arborplex? Surely much safer than something designed for tinkering with cable wires.
> If you try climbing and dont like it - treework is probably not for you should be your next logical thought. Not: well, I'll just get the biggest bucket I can afford, then treework will be easy..heck anyone can do it! Heck, with my low overhead I should be able to do smaller trees and still get some of that good tree service bling!!
> ...



You sir, are one of the individuals whom I was referring to in my earlier post who obviously thinks that your way is the only way to do tree work. You think that, because you started out by climbing, that that's the only way a newcomer should learn. It's your way or no way.

Well, you sir, are completely full of it and of yourself. I started out with an older bucket truck and about the same climbing experience as TKD KID claims to have. My equipment was old but worked well and I took pride in trying to make it look as good as possible. Over time, with low overhead, I built my company and it was a great success until I decided to scale down for personal reasons and go part-time with it. If the equipment works properly and if the operator knows what he is doing with it, who are you to tell him that he has to be a top-notch climber in order to be successful in this trade? Maybe climbing is a necessity in some areas of the world but, it sure isn't where I live. All of the tree services use bucket trucks. Very very few of them ever climb. THEY DON'T NEED TO!

Your advice is not helful to this guy. Go find another thread to grump about in. Grrrrrr - now you've got me all grumpy and needing a nap! good thing it's friday.


----------



## tree MDS (Jan 9, 2009)

I was just trying to keep it real, thats all. Sometimes I tell it like it is, thats just me. If you guys want to tell him thats a sweet truck for treework, thats fine. Thats just not my opinion, thats all.

Arbor pro, for your information most professionals will admit that you cannot properly prune trees from a bucket truck anyways.


----------



## TreeTopKid (Jan 9, 2009)

That's right! I've been to several marketing seminars and one of the key things in advertising (especially magazine or book format) is to have minimal information with a lot of clear space around your logo, and contact details.

I used this advice immediately for a yellow pages campaign (same company as Yellow Book) and as soon as the books were out I was snowed under with work.:agree2:


----------



## arbor pro (Jan 9, 2009)

tree MDS said:


> I was just trying to keep it real, thats all. Sometimes I tell it like it is, thats just me. If you guys want to tell him thats a sweet truck for treework, thats fine. Thats just not my opinion, thats all.



It's not a sweet truck for tree work. It is what it is. I'm sure that if he could afford more, he would. He didn't ask anyone if this truck would work. He asked about lettering on it. Didn't you read his initial post?

[/QUOTE]Arbor pro, for your information most professionals will admit that you cannot properly prune trees from a bucket truck anyways.[/QUOTE]

"most professionals"? Are these experts from your area of the world, mine or TKO KID's? Have you ever done tree work in our regions of the world or are you again assuming that just because YOU 'can't properly prune trees from a bucket truck' in your area of the world that we can't do it in ours?

I'm a certified professional arborist and landscape architect. I'm not a hack just because I prefer to use a machine to help me get the job done. Who really gives a fart whether you climb, use a bucket truck or fly like tinkerbell to get a pruning job done so long as the job gets done properly? Isn't that all that really matters? 

So, are you one of 'those expert tree guys' who says that no respectable arborist can properly do tree work without a brush chipper? I don't get some of you guys who claim that heavy equipment isn't necessary for working within the tree; yet, you can't live without it on the ground.  

To me, who cares how you clean up the mess so long as you do the job right and leave the customer happy.

I said it before and I'll say it once more before logging off for the weekend - some of you guys need to get off of your high horses and stop thinking tree work revolves only around those of you who live within a certain area of the world. Trees are everywhere - all kinds of shapes and sizes and locations. No one approach suits everyone or everything. Don't bash guys on this site just for having an opinion different than yours.

(P.s - I'm not bashing TreeMDS, I'm defending the guys that he's bashing. There's a difference).

Have a good weekend everybody. It's time to go scoop the driveway (new snow) and have some fun with the kidos.


----------



## ASEMASTER (Jan 9, 2009)

*some pride*

If you show some pride in the truck you arirve in, the first thought of the customer is that you will take some pride in the work that you do for them.
Paint it what ever color you would like then letter it in a contrasting color to be seen clearly , think of some saftey colors on the boom at least. the paint job doesn't need to be real smooth as if for show but done in some type of detail, and do the rims!


----------



## treeman82 (Jan 9, 2009)

tree MDS said:


> I love this new school/kinder gentler treeworkin mentality - too much for you that climbing?? thats alright, here's a binky, take my hand and I'll gently and kindly lead you to the bucket - being sure not to raise my voice too loud, as I know you'll quit (or break something on me latter).



ROFLMFAO  

That's wonderful! I really dislike all these bucket babies who flat out can't climb. "I'm gonna start a tree company. I can't climb, so I'll just buy a bucket, or hire somebody else to do all the dangerous work." WTF are you gonna get with a bucket that can't even get up 45 feet? I've used a 50 footer a couple of times, and the thing isn't good for much.


----------



## tree MDS (Jan 9, 2009)

treeman82 said:


> ROFLMFAO
> 
> That's wonderful! I really dislike all these bucket babies who flat out can't climb. "I'm gonna start a tree company. I can't climb, so I'll just buy a bucket, or hire somebody else to do all the dangerous work." WTF are you gonna get with a bucket that can't even get up 45 feet? I've used a 50 footer a couple of times, and the thing isn't good for much.



As I said, just tryin to keep it real, lol. The above mentality is what I was really "bashing" in the first place - not TKO personally. It really does get tiring after awhile this everyone's a treeguy just add bucket truck mentality. 

It takes more than an $800 truck to start a tree buisiness, even less really, just a job doing it for a real tree service for awhile. But everyone seems to want to avoid that step like the plauge for some reason :monkey:


----------



## TKO-KID (Jan 9, 2009)

Here is another idea on placing my lettering

Thanks for the replies


----------



## TKO-KID (Jan 9, 2009)

By the way I wonder who this is?


----------



## lxt (Jan 9, 2009)

Tree mds, I know what you are saying as well I understand arborpro!

the thing that does bother me is watching a new guy (tree service) start up with equipment that has pretty much been put outta service by the utility whos auctioned it off in the first place.

as long as he doesnt take on work he cant handle, however I have heard that said many times only to be called in for the butchered up all I could reach hatrack that I have to either make look nice or remove!

It is a new world of tree trimmers I`ll say that, kid just be smart, do only what you can handle, as for the lawn service thing you were talking about...I see this alot too, If you had "tree" exp. as you say then why chose lawns? if lawns are your bread & butter then surely you could of bought better unless that work line isnt going to well!

either way, dont get in over your head....your Reputation will be ruined & thats the most important thing for a biz.....good luck!

BTW, lettering will look fine, boom will be too short & truck needs some TLC


LXT...........


----------



## ozzy42 (Jan 9, 2009)

TKO-KID said:


> What do you all think of this idea on lettering my truck.
> 
> I will paint it of course and try to get a new door for the back cabinet, if I can't get one I guess I will just drill holes and Mount I peice of Plywood and paint it white, but I do not know yet.
> 
> ...



It's not a full on tree service truck,but can still be handy for small to med. trees,especially in tight spots.There is a guy here that has one like yours and a hi ranger also.Can't allways get the big one to the tree.You use what you got,i say.

Other guys are right about keeping it simple.Name and #, vinyl letters are great and cheap
You could even improve the looks just with a brush,and roller.
Please do yourself a favor and replace,or at least cover the door on the bed.


----------



## TKO-KID (Jan 9, 2009)

Why Lawn. Well because I did not start this business. My other half did she cut lawns around here neighborhood for a few years before we met. 

Then we met at a place we both worked nights at. After awhile of us being together I started to over cutting them. She insisted on paying me but I didn't mind. We decide that there was no use just cutting a few lawns. So we started to grow it into a business.

we started getting into tree's because a lot of our customers needed tree work over the years and would ask us who to use and we could never find anyone we could recommend. They where either not legal,didn't have insurance,unreliable,or the weirdest one wanted to run our credit so that we could refer people to them. 

We didn't want any money, or anything for it. We just wanted to know that our customers tree was being taken care of by a responsible company that would not rip them off or destroy their property.

After many referals not working out and tons not having the insurance they said they had.

we decide we would start taking care of them for them.

At first we put out ads to hire an experienced climber(that could pass a drug test) Never found one and starting pay was $25 an hour. For the few who showed up that had real experience we offered the lowest one $29 and the highest $36 an hour to start.

Guess what out of 6 that we even thought of hiring 5 didn't pass the drug test and the one who did never showed up for work.

So eventually I finally decided it would get back in the tree even though I did not want to, because at my last job doing trees there was a chainsaw injury of another employee and I had decided no more for me.

But after a while dealing with all the unreliable,unproffesional services, and or workers out there I realised that the accident at my last tree employer wasn't because everyone gets injured it was because proper safety measures where not followed and we pretty much where discouraged from the because of the added time safety caused( I am sure some of you who worked for tree services know what I mean) It took me a little while but I told myself it would not be like that if I was in charge which I am in our business. So I make sure we have all safety gear and if it isn't worn you get written up. One guy still doesn't follow all the safety guidelines and somewhat refuses(he is 19 and think he knows everything(he also thinks it is uncool to where safety equipment) So he gets written up a lot for that. He also loses his bi weekly bonus every time he gets paid. for some dumb reason he would rather look cool then make 100+ more dollars every two weeks.

doesn't bother me that much because when he tries something that would be really unsafe like not wearing a hard hat when under the tree while i am cutting above I scream at him and he puts it on. he is a great worker just the typical stupid kid raised from helicopter parents. By the way It also means that I pay out $250 or more less every month.


He also can not use a saw unless I am on the ground because of his typical safety gear attitude.

Anything I missed 

So if any of you have some lame excuse still as to why you should be able to cut down trees and not me let hear it. 

By the way that is me in my avatar and I have been told I hit like a truck by other fighters who have got in the ring with me either at a bout, or in the gym sparring. 

So if you really feel like you are that much more of a man then me. You can always ask where the gym is and come by for a few light rounds and show me how much more of a man you are.



Thanks again to all the real tree services responding with helpful criticism. It is greatly appreciated. 

This will also be the last time I respond with the whole reason we got into tree's. Or why we got into lawns first so if you need to be reminded feel free to come back to the post for a refresher as much as you want/need.


Good luck this year to everybody


----------



## TKO-KID (Jan 9, 2009)

ozzy42 said:


> It's not a full on tree service truck,but can still be handy for small to med. trees,especially in tight spots.There is a guy here that has one like yours and a hi ranger also.Can't allways get the big one to the tree.You use what you got,i say.
> 
> Other guys are right about keeping it simple.Name and #, vinyl letters are great and cheap
> You could even improve the looks just with a brush,and roller.
> Please do yourself a favor and replace,or at least cover the door on the bed.



Yeah we use vinyl lettering on all of vehicles, We have our own 48" inch vinyl plotter so we do it all in house. Much cheaper when you have multiple things to vinyl. plus for yard signs here most companies want $40+ per sign and the amount we use would cost a small fortune for things that get stolen or thrown away a lot.

yeah we definetely will be doing something with the rear cabinet just not sure what yet.

I am not sure if you can tell or not but the back passenger side had been backed into something at one time, by the previous owner. So we are not sure that the original type door will fit. I was thinking of finding some 1/4 inch sheet/plate of metal to weld into place.

Any ideas on what we could use their would be greatly appreciated.


----------



## treemandan (Jan 9, 2009)

TKO-KID said:


> Why Lawn. Well because I did not start this business. My other half did she cut lawns around here neighborhood for a few years before we met.
> 
> Then we met at a place we both worked nights at. After awhile of us being together I started to over cutting them. She insisted on paying me but I didn't mind. We decide that there was no use just cutting a few lawns. So we started to grow it into a business.
> 
> ...



Ok! FINE! Just paint the truck first and about that drug test - I thought a high score was good.
How high does that boom go? What year is the truck?


----------



## Jimmychips (Jan 9, 2009)

*Bring it on*

Not bashing, not taking sides, just throwing my two cents in. I support my family and the families of my employees by doing dangerous, risky, technical and hard work. The only way we can support all of these people is by being one of the most expensive around. The only way I can be one of the most expensive is by doing an excellent job EVERY time. Excellent job starts with a professional phone call, followed with a professional visit (in a clean truck, clean shaven, uniform, ect.) If we are awarded the job, we show up in clean trucks, everyone in uniform, newer equipment, no leaks on the driveway, no, "sorry about the fence", clear and professional comunications throughout the workday ("Clear?", "All clear"), ect. Our clean-up goal is to make it look like we were never there except the missing tree(s). Yada, Yada, Yada.

Showing up to the job in that piece of crap will not help to grow your business.


----------



## TKO-KID (Jan 9, 2009)

it is only a 28 footer. 

It is a 77 F350. Nice thing is being so old it is easier to work on.


----------



## Jimmychips (Jan 9, 2009)

*One more thing*

All of the tree guys I know are pretty BA mutha F ers. I would not make it a habit of picking fights with them


----------



## buzz sawyer (Jan 9, 2009)

TKO-KID said:


> it is only a 28 footer.
> 
> It is a 77 F350. Nice thing is being so old it is easier to work on.



You ought to paint "Branch Office" on the bucket.


----------



## TKO-KID (Jan 9, 2009)

buzz sawyer said:


> You ought to paint "Branch Office" on the bucket.



I like that.


----------



## Mikecutstrees (Jan 9, 2009)

I say if it works for you and you can be professional with it then it's cool. Best of luck to you TKO. Paint it nice and do quality work and you will do fine. Oh and don't leak any oil on the driveways..... Mike


----------



## Rftreeman (Jan 9, 2009)

first you need to paint the truck and make it look as good as possible then I think the lettering will be fine as you showed in the second picture but I'd switch the web address to the bottom boom or the sides of the hood and move the company name and number to the top.

I can think of a 100 places where that little truck would have been very useful for tree work.......





tree MDS said:


> Arbor pro, for your information most professionals will admit that you cannot properly prune trees from a bucket truck anyways.


what makes you feel this way??????


and it's not hard to do tree work and lawn work as one.


----------



## lxt (Jan 9, 2009)

My, my...lots of attitude.....I like it!! 

as far as your avatar goes & that being you.............good for you! 

I went to the gloves too & won!!......I use to hit like the Hulk on a bad day!! guess what?.........always someone tougher!!, one should be careful their big mouth doesnt write a check their but cant cash.

other than that good luck, be safe & take care your other half loves you!


LXT............


----------



## KodiakKen (Jan 9, 2009)

*Hey Tko*

My cousin started out in a dodge pickup running his ars off. can't say that it looked that bad but he had one truck and now..holy hell..I couldn't tell you what he has. Has anyone here looked at the local utility( telephone, power, gas, and water) company trucks. I work for a local phone company and we are not allotted time or products to wash and clean our trucks. For the first 3 years I had customers comment on my service van..How crappy it looked..the front bumper was held on with lashing wire..wtf..but all in all.. I did the best job I could do..I looked each and every customer in the eye...I shook the hands of the people that weren't in too much of a hurry... Do good work for a good price and everyone is happy. The most important thing is..Can you sleep at night? If you can and run old equipment and cut customers a better deal because of it. My hat is off to you. I would rather cut my rate and run a job for a less fortunate person than have some rich pants mo-fo give me the runaround after the job is done. I found that the less fortunate people are the only ones that give you all that you give them. Best of Luck.


----------



## treemandan (Jan 9, 2009)

tree MDS said:


> Don't forget changing light bulbs...hanging x-mas lights...cleaning gutters...shearing hedges..
> 
> I'm sorry but, is this for real?? Its like the other guy with the fifty footer that he picked up for six grand! I mean if your that desperate wouldn't it make sense to REALLY learn to climb instead?? And before you even say anything, yes I know you cant climb for s#1t! How? because no self respecting climber would be seen with that piece!
> 
> "oh my God, look what they've Dunn to that tree!" lol









Yeah, that's vintage. 400 dollar chevy. sure I put the rocker panels on and rebuilt the stuff that makes it go. ( It did go real nice), I never painted the junk yard drivers door, it was brown.


----------



## treemandan (Jan 9, 2009)

I gotts get the pic blown up so you can see the saw blade. Hell, I put one on the ford.


----------



## TKO-KID (Jan 9, 2009)

lxt said:


> My, my...lots of attitude.....I like it!!
> 
> as far as your avatar goes & that being you.............good for you!
> 
> ...



safety is always my number one priority. I have two very important reasons for being safe. and then of course my other half aint to bad of a reason either, But now shes is more like a quarter of me. I still love her and all but I don't think I could love anyone as much as them.


I definetly know there is always someone tougher I grew up a good portion of my child hood in childrens homes. But that part of my life definetaly took me near the top of the heap as far as toughness goes.


----------



## treemandan (Jan 9, 2009)

TKO-KID said:


> safety is always my number one priority. I have two very important reasons for being safe. and then of course my other half aint to bad of a reason either, But now shes is more like a quarter of me. I still love her and all but I don't think I could love anyone as much as them.
> 
> 
> I definetly know there is always someone tougher I grew up a good portion of my child hood in childrens homes. But that part of my life definetaly took me near the top of the heap as far as toughness goes.



that's good. Stay on top of the safety stuff, tons of guys around here have old trucks, they are the best. You paint a tree truck with a brush and in a week you can't tell cause of the dust and mold growing out of it, on it and in it.


----------



## oldirty (Jan 9, 2009)

perfect for doing hegdes. maybe shaping ornamental tree's with it but if you are going after takedowns with that thing.....


cmon.


the thing would be in the way the whole time.

do you get yourself up to the first branch and then have the helper drive out the way?


----------



## woodchux (Jan 9, 2009)

If i were you i would not put any information on the truck at all. Not all advertising is Good advertising. Run the truck incognito, make some money with it pruning hedges, and topping bradford pears etc. Save a little money from every job you get and put it towards a more appropriate and Safer truck. The sooner the better....


----------



## Slvrmple72 (Jan 9, 2009)

John Paul Sanborn said:


> Good advise, name and number is all you need, so the drive by can get it when they want to call.
> 
> Font should be large enough so that the neighbors can read it across the street.
> 
> Maybe the URL under the name the rest is good as an after thought. Maybe as a bumper sign, you want the truck as your main advertising, so the phone number is more important than anything else



+1  go make more money with that bucket!


----------



## TKO-KID (Jan 9, 2009)

it is not like this is the truck I will be driving to estimates.

I usually drive this one sometimes one of the other two, or the SUV.

I would like to get one that is like this one that is logo'ed for the tree service but what I have now works fine.


----------



## TimberMcPherson (Jan 10, 2009)

Jimmychips said:


> Not bashing, not taking sides, just throwing my two cents in. I support my family and the families of my employees by doing dangerous, risky, technical and hard work. The only way we can support all of these people is by being one of the most expensive around. The only way I can be one of the most expensive is by doing an excellent job EVERY time. Excellent job starts with a professional phone call, followed with a professional visit (in a clean truck, clean shaven, uniform, ect.) If we are awarded the job, we show up in clean trucks, everyone in uniform, newer equipment, no leaks on the driveway, no, "sorry about the fence", clear and professional comunications throughout the workday ("Clear?", "All clear"), ect. Our clean-up goal is to make it look like we were never there except the missing tree(s). Yada, Yada, Yada.
> 
> Showing up to the job in that piece of crap will not help to grow your business.




Not showing up to a job at all or showing up with no equipment would be worse. Come on, we all have to start somewhere with something. 

Hes starting small and cheap, getting a foot in and working up from there. In the current climate buying all new gear could sink him, and being the more expensive company could be your downfall. Who knows. Most of us do dangerous, risky, technical and hard work with good gear and uniforms, we dont all have to charge the most to do it either.


----------



## John D (Jan 10, 2009)

With the economy the way it is,his old truck makes sense.A lot of the reason this country is in trouble is because too many ppl buy beyond there means to repay. What good is a new bucket truck if you cant afford to pay for it.


----------



## mckeetree (Jan 10, 2009)

I got in on this late but the thought of that little old cable TV unit pulling up to do a take down is too much. What is that thing? A 3/4 ton?


----------



## Treetom (Jan 10, 2009)

Don't forget to put your phone number and logo/company name on the back of the truck. You'd be suprised how many people notice that, especially if you make a driving error. A good paint job would really make your signs pop. And keep it simple, too much info and potential clients will miss the important parts, like phone number and business name. But, if you store your equipment in a high-visibility area, a little more info may work in your favor, you've actually got a little billboard, there, 2kid.


----------



## John Paul Sanborn (Jan 10, 2009)

mckeetree said:


> I got in on this late but the thought of that little old cable TV unit pulling up to do a take down is too much. What is that thing? A 3/4 ton?



I know a couple of guys running small buckets for ease in getting the big wood down in tight backyards.


----------



## Wolfking42084 (Jan 10, 2009)

Everyone on here has tools that are not new and some that are that don't even look like it. Like treemandan said, an hour into every job, that thing will look like a pile of saw dust. I have a 02' zr2 that i drive everyday to bid in and a 03' ford super duty dump that is my chip truck. Just cause they are 7 or 8 years old does that mean their not nice, no way. The super duty still only has 20,000 miles and just like everything i own, i take care of it. Make the bucket truck look great and no client will care what year it is. I'm sure most people on here clean their equipment, make themselves look neat, and tuck in their shirt tail. Being professional is the way that i've found to get called back again and to be refered again. Also, one thing i have seen before that i really like is to do the spray on bed lining on areas of the truck that have the possiblilty of getting hit with fallen branches. good luck


----------



## mckeetree (Jan 10, 2009)

John Paul Sanborn said:


> I know a couple of guys running small buckets for ease in getting the big wood down in tight backyards.



You know though when you get right down to it there is somebody, somewhere trying to do something with anything. I bet somebody, somewhere, sometime in 2008 tried to grind a stump with an eggbeater.


----------



## ozzy42 (Jan 10, 2009)

John D said:


> With the economy the way it is,his old truck makes sense.A lot of the reason this country is in trouble is because too many ppl buy beyond there means to repay. What good is a new bucket truck if you cant afford to pay for it.


You got that right.ther are some guys around here with 200k in equipment,cant get 15-20 hrs of work to use it .Now they are what they always claimed to hate :

dirty low ballers


----------



## ozzy42 (Jan 10, 2009)

mckeetree said:


> You know though when you get right down to it there is somebody, somewhere trying to do something with anything. I bet somebody, somewhere, sometime in 2008 tried to grind a stump with an eggbeater.



:agree2:

How did you know what i was doing?It would've worked if the carbide teeth woul have stayed on.


----------



## Rftreeman (Jan 10, 2009)

I think his truck will be fine after it's painted...........

the difference between those who have shiny brand new trucks with payments and the people who have old shiny trucks is, the ones with the old shiny trucks have more money at the end of the month................HATERS


----------



## tree MDS (Jan 10, 2009)

Rftreeman said:


> I think his truck will be fine after it's painted...........
> 
> the difference between those who have shiny brand new trucks with payments and the people who have old shiny trucks is, the ones with the old shiny trucks have more money at the end of the month................HATERS



Ever heard this one: "now lets put some lipstick on this pig"? lol.


----------



## Rftreeman (Jan 10, 2009)

tree MDS said:


> Ever head this one: "now lets put some lipstick on this pig"? lol.


is that like putting lipstick on a pitbull.........


----------



## TKO-KID (Jan 10, 2009)

update on the truck

will post more later


----------



## thejdman04 (Jan 10, 2009)

I like the lettering and logo, like stated above, if I could, Id paint the truck first before you eltter it.


----------



## capetrees (Jan 10, 2009)

I like the truck. Gotta be real bada$$ if it's made it this long! Try to letter the sides of the utility box too, the big doors. Never mind the folks who have nothing for equipment but ropes and hopes. You keep doing what you're doing and upgrade later.


----------



## John Paul Sanborn (Jan 11, 2009)

I think the URL part confuses a lot of old folk. Have the name in large letters, then the URL under it on the door or something, most net savvy people will remember that Dunn Tree's URL is Dunntree.com IMO the WWW is superfluous, most browsers do not need it, same as the http://##!!*!)#

I like the font on the phone, maybe have the name right before the phone so it is all in one size.

As for the punny copy on the truck, I have a buddy Terry Russ, Russ's Tree Service. I run a few estimates for him. One lady had spent a while trying to get a hold of him, but he is not "in the book". 

Funny, I've seen it there???

he did work near by and she saw the "Trees Are Russ!" logo and thought that was the name of the company, even though Russ's Tree Service is in big letters on the door.


----------



## STLfirewood (Jan 11, 2009)

mckeetree said:


> You know though when you get right down to it there is somebody, somewhere trying to do something with anything. I bet somebody, somewhere, sometime in 2008 tried to grind a stump with an eggbeater.



Eggbeaters don't work that great but you should see what I can do with a Kithen Aid 4 1/2 quart.  


Scott


----------



## TKO-KID (Jan 11, 2009)

here is a little update


----------



## masterarbor (Jan 11, 2009)

tree MDS said:


> Don't forget changing light bulbs...hanging x-mas lights...cleaning gutters...shearing hedges..
> 
> I'm sorry but, is this for real?? Its like the other guy with the fifty footer that he picked up for six grand! I mean if your that desperate wouldn't it make sense to REALLY learn to climb instead?? And before you even say anything, yes I know you cant climb for s#1t! How? because no self respecting climber would be seen with that piece!
> 
> "oh my God, look what they've Dunn to that tree!" lol



thats cold


----------



## masterarbor (Jan 11, 2009)

John Paul Sanborn said:


> I think the URL part confuses a lot of old folk. Have the name in large letters, then the URL under it on the door or something, most net savvy people will remember that Dunn Tree's URL is Dunntree.com IMO the WWW is superfluous, most browsers do not need it, same as the http://##!!*!)#
> 
> I like the font on the phone, maybe have the name right before the phone so it is all in one size.
> 
> ...



A couple of times a year a customer will write a check out to Masterarbor instead of my company name.


----------



## TKO-KID (Jan 12, 2009)

another update.



I think we may go a little bigger on the door later. But for now I will just leave them like this and see how it goes.

I was worried if I went bigger I would have to put it in that bend of the door right below the door handle.


----------



## TKO-KID (Jan 12, 2009)

forgot the pic................


----------



## Rftreeman (Jan 12, 2009)

the decal looks good but did you paint it with a spray can?


----------



## TKO-KID (Jan 12, 2009)

Rftreeman said:


> the decal looks good but did you paint it with a spray can?



didn't paint it except in the few spots where the metal was showing.

I just sanded all the rust off.

Thats what I was saying in the first post it looks/looked like they just painted it with house paint before, and the top layers of the paint was rusted somehow but not rusted through to the metal.

Maybe someone on here may know why but I don't

It doesn't look to bad for right now, till I have time to tape it up and prime and paint it.


Since we own our own vinyl cutter it costs me just a few cents to print the logo. So know loss when I need to take it off.


----------



## TimberMcPherson (Jan 12, 2009)

TKO-KID said:


> didn't paint it except in the few spots where the metal was showing.
> 
> I just sanded all the rust off.
> 
> ...




My guess the problem with the rust is that when it was painted either 
a) the rust wasnt properly busted prior
b) paint wasnt applied right (wrong temp, incorrect thickness or nozzle or gunning distance, incompatable products, incorrect curing times, wrong product etc)
c) you wagon deep down doenst like being white, is trying to bust out.

Im not much of a painter, but have made MANY mistakes.


----------



## mckeetree (Jan 12, 2009)

Right now it looks like paint it is on the lights, the door handles, the emblems, everything.


----------



## arbor pro (Jan 12, 2009)

When I was defending the use of this truck earlier, i was under the impression that the entire truck was going to be getting some body work and a new paint job. With body work and a good paint job, it could look professional.

As it is now, it does not look professional. Not at all. Looks just like some kids spraypainted it with cans in a hurry.

Sorry, TKO-KID, but that's the honest truth. I don't have a problem with the truck itself but, you need to put a lot more elbow grease into that truck before you let the public see it. You have some dings to straighten and fill and you need to buy a professional sprayer and give it a few coats of industrial white paint.

Your door logo is ok but needs to be bigger so it fills the door. As it is though, the nice logo just makes the truck look worse. I'd leave it off until you get the truck fixed up better.

Sorry to rain on your parade but, when I was earlier defending your decision to use this truck, I was under the impression that you were going to put some real work into it. It needs a lot more. Don't get in such a hurry to put it into service. Do the work right.


----------



## Greenleaf (Jan 12, 2009)

I had to bump in here. TKo-kid you are preaching that you are all about safety and doing a good job etc. Then I scroll through your website only to find pictures like this one.....learn how to use a chainsaw and how to fall trees before calling yourself a tree service! That stump is the mark of a hack! Everyone has to start somewhere....but you are on route to starting out killing someone taking down trees in this manner!


----------



## TKO-KID (Jan 12, 2009)

Greenleaf said:


> I had to bumb in here. TKo-kid you are preaching that you are all about safety and doing a good job etc. Then I scroll through your website only to find pictures like this one.....learn how to use a chainsaw and how to fall trees before calling yourself a tree service! That stump is the mark of a hack! Everyone has to start somewhere....but you are on route to starting out killing someone taking down trees in this manner!



That is how I was tought at the service I worked at. Whenever you are close to something you don't want the chance of the tree falling on.


The tree went exactly where I wanted it to on the dime.

So I guess I am a hack because I did it the way I know how and end result no damage.

By the way when we got done with cutting the tree down and loading it up, we cut stump flat to the ground and it was ground out later.

So I guess the 3 -4 hours it was still up looking like that everyone in town saw it and now won't use us.

Get over yourself.


----------



## Greenleaf (Jan 12, 2009)

Ignorance will catch up to you. If you are truly committed to being a professional you'd take the time to have a qualified person train you or your employees properly. Until then you are getting by on pure luck, not skill.


----------



## TKO-KID (Jan 12, 2009)

mckeetree said:


> Right now it looks like paint it is on the lights, the door handles, the emblems, everything.



the door handles and emblem where already painted over. the right side marker I did hit, Because I did not have time to take everything off and sand it down to metal.

Like I said we are using it this week for a tree that is almsot entirely dead and there is no way I am climbing a tree that has the possibility of one of the limbs going while I am in it.

I did use a sprayer and my air compressor. Like I said I only sprayed the places that had bare metal or spots of rust I couldn't get sand it out without more time put in. And I don't have time to sand it all the way down,primer and tape it up. I while see if I can find a pic of my old cutlass that I painted.I am not sure if I have any pics though since it was stolen a few years back and they messed it up pretty good.

so I somewhat have an idea on how to paint., and no I am probably not gonna go to all the trouble of pulling out the dent on the front fender. That would be a huge waste of time on an old work truck. We have nicer trucks for the estimates. This is a work truck it will drive from our property to the job and back to the property. Thats it. Not all over town.



Oh yeah I just thought I would post some pictures of our property. It's almost 7 acres inside a highly urbanized area. So take a guess at how much that cost. But we will never make it and will be living with our parents the rest of our life.

By the way that property is paid in full we have no payments on it and cost more then most will make in 1-2 seasons. 

Bash all you want we don't care. and no I will not go out and waste my money on brand new trucks that I do not have a use for so you guys can say I am professional. Like another person said all I need is rope saw saddle and some rigging blocks and I can do 90% of what others do with the $100,000+ dollars truck.

Because as I said before I actually know how to climb.

So get bash me all you want I am already ten steps ahead of most and I have a good idea most of your trucks look worse then mine, because I have yet to so hardly any pics on here whenever people ask to see pics of your trucks and the way that a lot of you talk like you are high and mighty if you had nice trucks they would be posted everywhere. So you could show off how superior you are.


By the way I am just under 30 years old and have done more then a lot of people will do in there whole life. In many cases you can put 2-3 peoples lives together and I have done more.


Oh yeah almost forgot you are all welcome. It is because of people like me that you all can live in the sheltered little life you livein and believe that the only things that matter in life are you and your shiny new second mortgages(your trucks).

No need to thank me! Just thank everyone you see that has fought for your right to be an @$$


----------



## TKO-KID (Jan 12, 2009)

since we are going to our website and looking at stump cuts.

Look at that the stump is cut flat and it went where I wanted, But nothing was in the way of getting hit. Oh No Another Hack Job.

So i guess because I cut that one flat and used my wedges when felling that I must be the greatest tree cutter ever. 

Again get over yourself and don't pic and choose which pic to show, if there is another pic that looks just fine.

Well I wish I had all the time in the world to sit on here and talk about how I am a legend in my own mind like most on here. But I actually have a business to run. So even though it is winter I still have work to do, even if it is less then in the season. 

If you would like I can give you a play by play of what a day in the life of a business owner is like. 

Later and thanks to the few who have lives and don't just sit on Arborsite all day becuase they can't get any work.


----------



## arbor pro (Jan 12, 2009)

KID,

You're starting to dig youself into a hole with some of your comments. I was defending you before but now, not so sure. Your truck needs to be fixed up better (dents and paint fixed) before you put it to use. It looks very unprofessional - even for an "old work truck". Old trucks can look very professional if they look nice. I respect guys with older equipment that looks nice. Old stuff that looks like crud; however, deserves no respect - neither from the general public nor from members of this forum. You're wasting your breath defending that truck as it is to this group. Fix it up, re-post some photos and then, ask our opinion. Until then, don't ask for input if you aren't willing to take some constructive criticism. Granted, some of these guys have no clue what constructive criticism is but some of us do. We have given you helpful pointers and you apparently don't care that we are trying to help your business.

As for the photos on your website. Anyone can cut down a tree with nothing around it. Your photos don't show anything much in regards to why a customer should hire you vs any other joe saw owner. If you climb, get some photos of you climbing. When you get your truck fixed up, get some photos of it in use. If you rig, get some photos of rigging branches down. Photos of an incorrect back cut and a tree laying over a sidewalk are not overly impressive though and might actually have a negative connotation to them. I think your website would be better without them.

P.S. - take a breath, take this all in and calm down. The big bold print implies that you are getting rather pi$$ed off at the world. There's still some good advice on this forum for you to benefit from if you want to.


----------



## Rftreeman (Jan 12, 2009)

TKO.......that truck looks like crap with that paint job, what that says to me as a customer is that you might do my tree work like you did that truck, halfazzed, I have an old truck also and it looked about like yours when I got it but I spent the money to have it painted and replaced missing parts to make it look presentable and that's what you need to do, I was under the impression that it would be painted right, not a scratch and shoot spot shot, get the thing painted right rather you do it or pay someone.

this was the day I drove it home and it never saw a jobsite in that condition

http://s237.photobucket.com/albums/ff295/savagenomore/?action=view&current=oldtruck.jpg

just to show after some paint and other stuff

http://s237.photobucket.com/albums/...n=view&current=picsfromreformat1-19-08129.jpg


----------



## DKdeOhio (Jan 12, 2009)

*my 1.5 cents...*

Hey TKO - 
Have you considered a chipper / dumpbed truck combo? You may get more money's worth than the bucket truck. Getting the tree down is only half of the battle....
Also - be careful with posting 'names' on your pictures (jpg.) on your website. On some of the pics, you have the file saved with the HO's last name, and an address visible in the picture. You had better have written permission for those images posted online...
I would focus on your pics of you (or whoever) in the PPE, that is a good selling point. And stumps cut more 'flush' for your 'after shots.' 
Finally - agree with above posters. Just relax, everyone has their opinions. Be careful with offering 'golden glove' competitions in the street - like posted earlier, some of these guys ain't right in the head...I can remember when a dude was talking sh!t to old dirty, and olddirty called his bluff - that other dude doesn't post here, anymore, lol....
Best of luck, man. You don't need the expensive equip if you do the job right. And if you did serve, I certainly tip my stocking cap to you.


----------



## TKO-KID (Jan 12, 2009)

arbor pro said:


> KID,
> 
> You're starting to dig youself into a hole with some of your comments. I was defending you before but now, not so sure. Your truck needs to be fixed up better (dents and paint fixed) before you put it to use. It looks very unprofessional - even for an "old work truck". Old trucks can look very professional if they look nice. I respect guys with older equipment that looks nice. Old stuff that looks like crud; however, deserves no respect - neither from the general public nor from members of this forum. You're wasting your breath defending that truck as it is to this group. Fix it up, re-post some photos and then, ask our opinion. Until then, don't ask for input if you aren't willing to take some constructive criticism. Granted, some of these guys have no clue what constructive criticism is but some of us do. We have given you helpful pointers and you apparently don't care that we are trying to help your business.
> 
> ...



Sorry arbor pro if it sounds like I am pissed it is just large because if you can tell by a good amount of the posts most don't read the whole posts before responding at all.


----------



## arbor pro (Jan 12, 2009)

TKO-KID said:


> Sorry arbor pro if it sounds like I am pissed it is just large because if you can tell by a good amount of the posts most don't read the whole posts before responding at all.



True.


----------



## TKO-KID (Jan 12, 2009)

DKdeOhio said:


> Hey TKO -
> Have you considered a chipper / dumpbed truck combo? You may get more money's worth than the bucket truck. Getting the tree down is only half of the battle....
> Also - be careful with posting 'names' on your pictures (jpg.) on your website. On some of the pics, you have the file saved with the HO's last name, and an address visible in the picture. You had better have written permission for those images posted online...
> I would focus on your pics of you (or whoever) in the PPE, that is a good selling point. And stumps cut more 'flush' for your 'after shots.'
> ...



We have thought of the bucket truck dump chipper, all in one but, as it is we don't have to pay to dump because we own the business property so at this time it works out best when we just show up with 2 or 3 different truck and trailers load it all up and dump, since there is already 2-3 guys on the job. it works out fine.

i understand the pics thing and I have 1 or 2 pics with me climbing on there I think but we don't always remember to bring the camera, or do and the batteries die or just get busy and don't remember to take pics.

I will not post anymore pics or updates for everyone even when I get time in about to weeks to pull it in to the shed at the property and paint it correctly. If you all remember all the thread was asking was how the lettering design looks.

I also feel that even if the truck needs some work you should never do any work in a vehicle with out your name on it because that is a loss of potential customers that live on the street. We have almost never did a tree where a neighbor didn't call or come ask us for an estimate. I prefer if they call because they always want you to climb down out of the tree. And even though I can climb since I do not do it every single day it can be very exhuasting going up and down to talk to someone.

By the way around here most people do not care at all what your truck looks like just your work.

The newest truck we have is a 97 dodge and it still looks better then alot of the competition.


So thank you again for all the input you guys are right and I will never amount to anything, so I might as well shoot myself now.

Later. I do wish one day you guys wake up and realise life is to short to lie to yourself about what you really have and to get so caught up in that lie that you tear into everyone elses stuff( that they never clamied was the greatest in the first place).


breathe deep and relax you all will live a lot longer if you aren't always stressed or worried about outside appearance and what everyone else thinks.


----------



## TKO-KID (Jan 12, 2009)

DKdeOhio said:


> Hey TKO -
> Have you considered a chipper / dumpbed truck combo? You may get more money's worth than the bucket truck. Getting the tree down is only half of the battle....
> Also - be careful with posting 'names' on your pictures (jpg.) on your website. On some of the pics, you have the file saved with the HO's last name, and an address visible in the picture. You had better have written permission for those images posted online...
> I would focus on your pics of you (or whoever) in the PPE, that is a good selling point. And stumps cut more 'flush' for your 'after shots.'
> ...



If you could point out the pictures with the homeowners names It would be greatly appreciated. I could not find the pictures anywhere.

Thanks in advance


----------



## (WLL) (Jan 12, 2009)

*jack of all trades master of none!!*



Greenleaf said:


> I had to bump in here. TKo-kid you are preaching that you are all about safety and doing a good job etc. Then I scroll through your website only to find pictures like this one.....learn how to use a chainsaw and how to fall trees before calling yourself a tree service! That stump is the mark of a hack! Everyone has to start somewhere....but you are on route to starting out killing someone taking down trees in this manner!


 when i saw your work i just cant hold back!!! just fill all them holes with bondo and spray bomb her what a joke man, iv seen nicer chit in the junkyard!!!. that truck is almost useless in the tree biz. i have taller ladders than that. you aint nothing but a inexperienced grass cutter. go post your crap on ************ tree men have pride and common cents. you prolly cant provide insurance on your vehicles so i doubt you have any for doing the tree work you post up looks like you just bought a few sawz and call your self a tree company. jack of all trades master of none


----------



## ozzy42 (Jan 12, 2009)

Greenleaf said:


> I had to bump in here. TKo-kid you are preaching that you are all about safety and doing a good job etc. Then I scroll through your website only to find pictures like this one.....learn how to use a chainsaw and how to fall trees before calling yourself a tree service! That stump is the mark of a hack! Everyone has to start somewhere....but you are on route to starting out killing someone taking down trees in this manner!


TKO ,i'm with you on the payed off equipment ,allready posted that.
I think what Greenleaf was pointing out though about the stump cut had nothing to do with it not being flush cut yet.
He's talking about the type of cut used to fell the tree;Not propper,not safe..
He is correct.You will get bitten cutting stuff that way.


----------



## (WLL) (Jan 12, 2009)

sorry to be an azzhole but this industry has had enough black eyes


----------



## Rftreeman (Jan 12, 2009)

(WLL) said:


> you aint nothing but a inexperienced grass cutter. go post your crap on ************


hey, watch it now, I cut grass too and post on that site.....................but I do have 20 years tree experience and I'm just busting you ballz for fun.........lol


----------



## (WLL) (Jan 12, 2009)

Rftreeman said:


> hey, watch it now, I cut grass too and post on that site.....................but I do have 20 years tree experience and I'm just busting you ballz for fun.........lol


no suprise there *R*eal*F*attreemanafter 20 years *tree cutting* i like to think you have a clue, its a shame you dont.


----------



## (WLL) (Jan 12, 2009)

Rftreeman said:


> I'm just busting you ballz for fun.........lol


:stupid: your barkin up the wrong tree big boy!!! show me what ya got.


----------



## Rftreeman (Jan 12, 2009)

(WLL) said:


> [/B] i like to think you have a clue, its a shame you dont.


as to what?


I was cutting when you was still in diapers........lol


----------



## Rftreeman (Jan 12, 2009)

(WLL) said:


> no suprise there *R*eal*F*attreeman


don't think because I'm fat I can't chase you up that tree and throw you out..........lol I did lose five pounds...


----------



## (WLL) (Jan 12, 2009)

Rftreeman said:


> I did lose five pounds...


gravy must have poured from the knee!


----------



## (WLL) (Jan 12, 2009)

im gonna turn and walk away


----------



## Rftreeman (Jan 12, 2009)

(WLL) said:


> im gonna turn and walk away


best decision you've made all day.........


----------



## TKO-KID (Jan 12, 2009)

(WLL) said:


> when i saw your work i just cant hold back!!! just fill all them holes with bondo and spray bomb her what a joke man, iv seen nicer chit in the junkyard!!!. that truck is almost useless in the tree biz. i have taller ladders than that. you aint nothing but a inexperienced grass cutter. go post your crap on ************ tree men have pride and common cents. you prolly cant provide insurance on your vehicles so i doubt you have any for doing the tree work you post up looks like you just bought a few sawz and call your self a tree company. jack of all trades master of none



you are retarded.

I bet we have more insurance then you, and guess what we are a registered business who pays taxes. by the way go look at the pics of our property. Yeah I know it is nice. That property is business owned property not just land at my house in the country. Take a look and see what an Acre of land goes for in St. Louis County, MO. And guess what we have almost seven and it payed off.

Sucks for you.

BY the way you can not be a certified pesticide applicator in the state of Missouri without proper insurance. Well check out kelly solutions I am on there. 

Ignore list


----------



## (WLL) (Jan 12, 2009)

TKO-KID said:


> you are retarded.
> 
> I bet we have more insurance then you, and guess what we are a registered business who pays taxes. by the way go look at the pics of our property. Yeah I know it is nice. That property is business owned property not just land at my house in the country. Take a look and see what an Acre of land goes for in St. Louis County, MO. And guess what we have almost seven and it payed off.
> 
> ...


I'm sorry, i took one look at your *tree truck* and dam near fell off my stoop:jawdrop: i like the truck ,its just the boom is so short!!by the time your finished getting that truck inspected and presentable you could have bought a good 55+ft bucket truck. i just feel like you are going to spend more on the truck/rag than its worth. did you get the truck for freeanyhow I'm sorry for posting ignorant B.S.:chatter:,and i hope the truck works out for you and the biz.


----------



## (WLL) (Jan 12, 2009)

Rftreeman said:


> don't think because I'm fat I can't chase you up that tree and throw you out..........lol I did lose five pounds...


there'd be gravy fer miles..."n" bacon fer dayz :smoking:


----------



## Rftreeman (Jan 12, 2009)

(WLL) said:


> there'd be gravy fer miles..."n" bacon fer dayz: smoking:


yeah, maybe all that gravy & bacon will break your fall after I toss you out on your azz


----------



## teamtree (Jan 12, 2009)

You have to love all these engaging conversations on this site.


----------



## Lumberjacked (Jan 12, 2009)

TKO I am ALL for starting from nothing and not using the nicest equipment and like you I am a "kid" in this industry with only a few trucks and a few employees. As, I am sure you did, I read all the post when I started at 17 about how.... "you NEED to work for someone for 5 years" "You cant safely cut trees down with little experience"...and all that other happy stuff. But I started with nothing, listened to these "old" guys (no offense guys haha) and now I have an extremely successful business. But unlike you I think I may have had a more open mind toward what they said. 

A: Your truck minus the paint job, looks utterly unsafe! Can you even buy parts for that bucket anymore? I have no room to say any more as I dont have a bucket but I can tell you that my Geckos and my saddle are worth as much as that truck...scary? yes!

B: Your pics on your website lead most here to conclude nothing but, you have no idea what you are doing. The Oak in that pic? granted it is a take down...what were you thinking? If you fell it like that, you will be digging out 3 foot pieces of all those stubs and backfilling all the holes. no?

That spruce...why wouldn't you just climb it? 25 minutes tops! and 35mins raking and loading logs. Instead you have 25mins with a ladder/rope and 60mins raking the entire length of the tree. 

C: Safety! Looking at that pic on your site...It looks like you and your guys should be drinking Pina Coladas not using chainsaws. Tee shirts, shorts and sneakers? I remember reading somewhere on the 100th something page of this thread that you are a safety stickler...

You can think and do as you please, I would only ask you take what criticism these professionals say with a grain of salt. Just remember that most of them of them have been where you and I are and have learned from their mistakes. Good luck man!


----------



## (WLL) (Jan 12, 2009)

Lumberjacked said:


> TKO I am ALL for starting from nothing and not using the nicest equipment and like you I am a "kid" in this industry with only a few trucks and a few employees. As, I am sure you did, I read all the post when I started at 17 about how.... "you NEED to work for someone for 5 years" "You cant safely cut trees down with little experience"...and all that other happy stuff. But I started with nothing, listened to these "old" guys (no offense guys haha) and now I have an extremely successful business. But unlike you I think I may have had a more open mind toward what they said.
> 
> A: Your truck minus the paint job, looks utterly unsafe! Can you even buy parts for that bucket anymore? I have no room to say any more as I dont have a bucket but I can tell you that my Geckos and my saddle are worth as much as that truck...scary? yes!
> 
> ...


good stuff man. well said


----------



## deevo (Jan 12, 2009)

Lumberjacked said:


> TKO I am ALL for starting from nothing and not using the nicest equipment and like you I am a "kid" in this industry with only a few trucks and a few employees. As, I am sure you did, I read all the post when I started at 17 about how.... "you NEED to work for someone for 5 years" "You cant safely cut trees down with little experience"...and all that other happy stuff. But I started with nothing, listened to these "old" guys (no offense guys haha) and now I have an extremely successful business. But unlike you I think I may have had a more open mind toward what they said.
> 
> A: Your truck minus the paint job, looks utterly unsafe! Can you even buy parts for that bucket anymore? I have no room to say any more as I dont have a bucket but I can tell you that my Geckos and my saddle are worth as much as that truck...scary? yes!
> 
> ...



Well said, but you forgot the stump pic with the hmmm hmmm angled back cut. TKO ,don't back cut like that, its not proper and may come back to bite you one day! Other then that thats all and good luck! Not trying to knock you either as this is why I'm on this site to learn from others, but there's yours for today.


----------



## TKO-KID (Jan 12, 2009)

Lumberjacked said:


> TKO I am ALL for starting from nothing and not using the nicest equipment and like you I am a "kid" in this industry with only a few trucks and a few employees. As, I am sure you did, I read all the post when I started at 17 about how.... "you NEED to work for someone for 5 years" "You cant safely cut trees down with little experience"...and all that other happy stuff. But I started with nothing, listened to these "old" guys (no offense guys haha) and now I have an extremely successful business. But unlike you I think I may have had a more open mind toward what they said.
> 
> A: Your truck minus the paint job, looks utterly unsafe! Can you even buy parts for that bucket anymore? I have no room to say any more as I dont have a bucket but I can tell you that my Geckos and my saddle are worth as much as that truck...scary? yes!
> 
> ...



Thanks for writing actually that spruce got loaded onto a flatbed full length minus the few feet I cut off the top so it wouldn't hang off the back.

Someone wanted to dump a few loads at our property so I told them no problem, But you have to take this with it.

They didn't have a problem.

i left the oak looking as terrible as I could, to encourage them to finish paying their balance, I will get more pics when we go back to finish after all payment are made(in March( we gave them a payment plan) I even left a few full length branches on the backside of the tree I am not sure if you can see it in the pic. 

So far all the payments have been coming in on time now that they realize that we are leaving it standing till we get all of our money. Yes I know it is kind of unprofessional( but we don't work for free).

So far everything I have needed for the bucket I have been able to get. Even a new bucket so far the best price we have gotten for the bucket is $850.00 So we are checking into a few more places before buying one.

Speaking of buckets anyone know what happened to the replacement buckets for sale on ebay that where from the $200-500 range depending on size and features?


----------



## TKO-KID (Jan 12, 2009)

deevo said:


> Well said, but you forgot the stump pic with the hmmm hmmm angled back cut. TKO ,don't back cut like that, its not proper and may come back to bite you one day! Other then that thats all and good luck! Not trying to knock you either as this is why I'm on this site to learn from others, but there's yours for today.



i don't back cut like that on every tree. just that one and one other if you look at the few other pics I have they where all cut what you all call the correct way.

For me it has just worked better if I have the possibility of it going the wrong way if I make the back cut at an angle. So far it has gone exactly where I wanted it to with little or no assistance.


----------



## woodchux (Jan 12, 2009)

TKO-KID said:


> i don't back cut like that on every tree. just that one and one other if you look at the few other pics I have they where all cut what you all call the correct way.
> 
> For me it has just worked better if I have the possibility of it going the wrong way if I make the back cut at an angle. So far it has gone exactly where I wanted it to with little or no assistance.



If you use an angled cut like that and the tree does set back, wedges will be less effective than in a flat cut.


----------



## TreeTopKid (Jan 12, 2009)

woodchux said:


> If you use an angled cut like that and the tree does set back, wedges will be less effective than in a flat cut.



Exactly. A tree will sit surprisingly well on a correctly cut hinge. I'm sure the narrow edge at the bottom of the cut would break up as you tried to knock the wedge in.


----------



## ozzy42 (Jan 12, 2009)

woodchux said:


> If you use an angled cut like that and the tree does set back, wedges will be less effective than in a flat cut.



Not only that,if the tree was not going forward as planned,and you started hammering on a wedge with an angled cut like that ,the force of the wedge would act to force the trunk inthe forward direction ,but not the top of the tree,possibly causing the trunk to jump off the stump,again probably in the forward dir.and then the trunk in the rearward dir.Do you see the problem there?
Anybody out there doubt me on this possible scenerio?
So there you kinda have it in a nut shell.
Yes ,it's bugging a few of us .Not because it's ugly,or different,but because it'sWRONG,AND IT'S DANGEROUS.


----------



## deevo (Jan 12, 2009)

ozzy42 said:


> Yes ,it's bugging a few of us .Not because it's ugly,or different,but because it'sWRONG,AND IT'S DANGEROUS.



Exactly!


----------



## jefflovstrom (Jan 12, 2009)

(WLL) said:


> when i saw your work i just cant hold back!!! just fill all them holes with bondo and spray bomb her what a joke man, iv seen nicer chit in the junkyard!!!. that truck is almost useless in the tree biz. i have taller ladders than that. you aint nothing but a inexperienced grass cutter. go post your crap on ************ tree men have pride and common cents. you prolly cant provide insurance on your vehicles so i doubt you have any for doing the tree work you post up looks like you just bought a few sawz and call your self a tree company. jack of all trades master of none



:yourock:


----------



## jefflovstrom (Jan 12, 2009)

TKO-KID said:


> you are retarded.
> 
> I bet we have more insurance then you, and guess what we are a registered business who pays taxes. by the way go look at the pics of our property. Yeah I know it is nice. That property is business owned property not just land at my house in the country. Take a look and see what an Acre of land goes for in St. Louis County, MO. And guess what we have almost seven and it payed off.
> 
> ...



You wanna bet with me?!
Jeff Lovstrom
www.urbantreecare.com


----------



## (WLL) (Jan 12, 2009)

jefflovstrom said:


> You wanna bet with me?!
> Jeff Lovstrom
> www.urbantreecare.com


ill see too yer bet and double it:hmm3grin2orange:




just kidding,i dont gamble


----------



## jefflovstrom (Jan 12, 2009)

teamtree said:


> You have to love all these engaging conversations on this site.



WOW!, This has been a really good read! I am almost to the end! Can;t wait.
Jeff


----------



## TKO-KID (Jan 12, 2009)

jefflovstrom said:


> You wanna bet with me?!
> Jeff Lovstrom
> www.urbantreecare.com



You also don't spend 90% off your life on here either do you. But the ones who have 8million posts and never leave the computer to go get jobs do.

If you look at the post it was directed to the same person/persons that are doing all the bashing, But thanks for not reading the entire post and joining in.


----------



## jefflovstrom (Jan 12, 2009)

Lumberjacked said:


> TKO I am ALL for starting from nothing and not using the nicest equipment and like you I am a "kid" in this industry with only a few trucks and a few employees. As, I am sure you did, I read all the post when I started at 17 about how.... "you NEED to work for someone for 5 years" "You cant safely cut trees down with little experience"...and all that other happy stuff. But I started with nothing, listened to these "old" guys (no offense guys haha) and now I have an extremely successful business. But unlike you I think I may have had a more open mind toward what they said.
> 
> A: Your truck minus the paint job, looks utterly unsafe! Can you even buy parts for that bucket anymore? I have no room to say any more as I dont have a bucket but I can tell you that my Geckos and my saddle are worth as much as that truck...scary? yes!
> 
> ...



Hear,Hear, Almost to the end of this thread- like a soap opera ending.
Jeff Lovstron
Good Read!


----------



## jefflovstrom (Jan 12, 2009)

TKO-KID said:


> You also don't spend 90% off your life on here either do you. But the ones who have 8million posts and never leave the computer to go get jobs do.
> 
> If you look at the post it was directed to the same person/persons that are doing all the bashing, But thanks for not reading the entire post and joining in.



OK TKO- Listen to a guy that started climbing when Jimmy Carter was President. Your heart is in the right place, but you screwed up when you realized it and "posted it" and felt good and you really handled yourself diplomaticly but you need to understand the reach of experience you are addressing. This is not the Jerry Springer show and for you to suggest that OUR participation on this or any other site as compatible to a lazy azz that post all day is showing your idnorance and dis-respect for those of us who have earned the time to answer "YOUR POST"===Buy-BY== the way way , Where are the "outriggers" , "chock blocks"
Jeff Lovstrom


----------



## Blakesmaster (Jan 12, 2009)

jefflovstrom said:


> OK TKO- Listen to a guy that started climbing when Jimmy Carter was President. Your heart is in the right place, but you screwed up when you realized it and "posted it" and felt good and you really handled yourself diplomaticly but you need to understand the reach of experience you are addressing. This is not the Jerry Springer show and for you to suggest that OUR participation on this or any other site as compatible to a lazy azz that post all day is showing your idnorance and dis-respect for those of us who have earned the time to answer "YOUR POST"===Buy-BY== the way way , Where are the "outriggers" , "chock blocks"
> Jeff Lovstrom



You don't need outriggers for 28 feet. Heck, I can get that high on a pogo stick.


----------



## TKO-KID (Jan 12, 2009)

jefflovstrom said:


> OK TKO- Listen to a guy that started climbing when Jimmy Carter was President. Your heart is in the right place, but you screwed up when you realized it and "posted it" and felt good and you really handled yourself diplomaticly but you need to understand the reach of experience you are addressing. This is not the Jerry Springer show and for you to suggest that OUR participation on this or any other site as compatible to a lazy azz that post all day is showing your idnorance and dis-respect for those of us who have earned the time to answer "YOUR POST"===Buy-BY== the way way , Where are the "outriggers" , "chock blocks"
> Jeff Lovstrom



you can kind of see them in the pic of the sweetgum with me in the tree.

like I said before we don't always have the camera with us, or the batteries die, or just get busy and forget to take some more. We don't usually take the time to get up close pictures of our rigging gear, because customers don't really know what it is or care.

All they care about is 1: Insurance,2rice,3 job gets done with no damage and a good clean up is done,4: appearance of workers,

Not necessarily in that order or if all four are met.

Thanks again Jeff


----------



## (WLL) (Jan 12, 2009)

TreeCo said:


> I wish you guys would stop knocking that truck....
> 
> 
> 
> ......you know with a little spring work he could get 28ft. 6in.!


:fer once :agree2: with you


----------



## (WLL) (Jan 12, 2009)

SSSSHHHHH........ quiet TKO,i think i here a knock!


----------



## John Paul Sanborn (Jan 12, 2009)

TreeCo said:


> I wish you guys would stop knocking that truck....
> 
> 
> 
> ......you know with a little spring work he could get 28ft. 6in.!



Watch out, I'm going to have to report you for attacking another member


----------



## (WLL) (Jan 13, 2009)

John Paul Sanborn said:


> Watch out, I'm going to have to report you for attacking another member


good luck, he will just edit your report


----------



## arbor pro (Jan 13, 2009)

TKO-KID said:


> i left the oak looking as terrible as I could, to encourage them to finish paying their balance, I will get more pics when we go back to finish after all payment are made(in March( we gave them a payment plan) I even left a few full length branches on the backside of the tree I am not sure if you can see it in the pic.
> 
> So far all the payments have been coming in on time now that they realize that we are leaving it standing till we get all of our money. Yes I know it is kind of unprofessional( but we don't work for free).



"kind of unprofessional"? Either you do a job right or you don't do it at all. It's something called 'ethics'. Leaving a tree hacked up like that while you wait for payment makes it look like you intended to just top it and leave it. So, what is your plan if they don't pay? Just leave that horrible stump of a tree standing and let it resprout into a horrible looking hazzard tree? 

Quite apparently, you have no problem operating "kind of unprofessional" equipment, you have no problem using "kind of unprofessional" cutting techniques and, from what you just said in the above quote, you have no problem conducting business in a "kind of unprofessional" manner. Your "kind of unprofessional" attitude is the 'black eye' of tree care that AS members have been referring to. 

This thread started out with you asking what other listers thought about the lettering on your truck. It quickly evolved into a discussion about business marketing and management, safe working practices, proper work technique and business ethics. 130 posts worth of critical business advice for free. Don't waste it.


----------



## mckeetree (Jan 13, 2009)

arbor pro said:


> "kind of unprofessional"? I'm through defending you. You're a hack. Have at 'em boys...



Exactly.


----------



## arbor pro (Jan 13, 2009)

mckeetree said:


> Exactly.



Please see my previous post. I edited it but not before mckeetree could quote the original. I felt it lacked the constructive criticism that I've been preaching about.


----------



## TKO-KID (Jan 13, 2009)

I don't care what you think, there payment was due that day and they didn't have it, when they said they would. So we stopped working maybe you don't pay your employee's anything but we do pay ours and the labor cost ads up quick especially when you haven't received all the money you are owed.

I am not in the business of giving credit out.


----------



## tree MDS (Jan 13, 2009)

(WLL) said:


> when i saw your work i just cant hold back!!! just fill all them holes with bondo and spray bomb her what a joke man, iv seen nicer chit in the junkyard!!!. that truck is almost useless in the tree biz. i have taller ladders than that. you aint nothing but a inexperienced grass cutter. go post your crap on ************ tree men have pride and common cents. you prolly cant provide insurance on your vehicles so i doubt you have any for doing the tree work you post up looks like you just bought a few sawz and call your self a tree company. jack of all trades master of none



+1 stick to weed whacking. I saw this from the beginning of this thread - what a joke. Just what we need some arrogant lawn jockey with an old cable truck reminiscent of Cooter's wrecker, lol.


----------



## arbor pro (Jan 13, 2009)

TKO-KID said:


> I am not in the business of giving credit out.



You aren't expected to work for free but, you are now liable should that tree resprout weak branches due to your 'topping' job and one of those branches break off and hit someone or something. It could easily be proven in court that your improper pruning/removal practices were detrimental to the tree's health. It doesn't matter if you left the tree because you didn't get paid when you expected to. You left the tree in a hazzardous condition. You should have gotten paid up front if you were worried about it. Once you start a removal, you finish a removal. Leaving as is doesn't fly in court should someone get hurt.

Do you have a contract for the work? If so, all you have to do is finish the job and submit it to small claims. You'll likely get paid before it goes to court but, if not, you'll get a judgement against them and a lien on their property. Eventually, you'll get paid and you won't have a liability hanging over your head.

Not getting paid is the risk you run when you're in business for yourself. It's part of the game. Use contracts, get payments up front when you feel the need and go talk to the customer to work something out when payment is not made on time. By the way, why aren't they paying?


----------



## mckeetree (Jan 13, 2009)

tree MDS said:


> +1 stick to weed whacking. I saw this from the beginning of this thread - what a joke. Just what we need some arrogant lawn jockey with an old cable truck reminiscent of Cooter's wrecker, lol.



That's funny. That could not have been said any better.


----------



## TKO-KID (Jan 13, 2009)

arbor pro said:


> You aren't expected to work for free but, you are now liable should that tree resprout weak branches due to your 'topping' job and one of those branches break off and hit someone or something. It could easily be proven in court that your improper pruning/removal practices were detrimental to the tree's health. It doesn't matter if you left the tree because you didn't get paid when you expected to. You left the tree in a hazzardous condition. You should have gotten paid up front if you were worried about it. Once you start a removal, you finish a removal. Leaving as is doesn't fly in court should someone get hurt.
> 
> Do you have a contract for the work? If so, all you have to do is finish the job and submit it to small claims. You'll likely get paid before it goes to court but, if not, you'll get a judgement against them and a lien on their property. Eventually, you'll get paid and you won't have a liability hanging over your head.
> 
> Not getting paid is the risk you run when you're in business for yourself. It's part of the game. Use contracts, get payments up front when you feel the need and go talk to the customer to work something out when payment is not made on time. By the way, why aren't they paying?



leins do not get you paid unless they try and sell, and then if their realtor knows the game well enough the can get past the lean by just paying the administrative fees of the court.

small claims does absolutely nothing, except waste your time, the collection agency only help if they care about their credit and most peopl who won't pay don't care.

Like I said before they did not have the money,so we stopped working got it to a safe height did as enough clean up to make it look somewhat presentable.so they are now on a payment plan when the last payment comes in on march 15th the rest of the tree will be removed stump and all.

Thanks for playing.

I am done with this thread now so have fun talking to yourselves.

Thanks for all who responded with legitimate complaints/suggestions/questions.


For the others I again wish you a better year and may something light a fire under you to help you get out there and reach for the stars and market yourself and your company everyday. So you can get to the point where you do not have to get up in the tree's yourself anymore.

Good luck


----------



## teamtree (Jan 13, 2009)

TKO-KID said:


> Thanks for writing actually that spruce got loaded onto a flatbed full length minus the few feet I cut off the top so it wouldn't hang off the back.
> 
> Someone wanted to dump a few loads at our property so I told them no problem, But you have to take this with it.
> 
> ...



I tried to help you out and tell you to just let this thread die but now I need to say something in regards to leaving the tree as is due to non payment. If you started the job with no check then you should have finished it...period....you are acting like a hack. Finish the job and collect. Why did you start it without payment? How long did it actually take to get to that point? If I ever worked an hour and had to stop because of non-payment then I would quit the business. That is a 2-hour job...tops...with stump....you could not float a $500 job? Getting back to the idea that you started without payment, was the terms due upon topping it but not finishing the job? Have you heard of working capital? Don't get me wrong, I like to get paid when I finish the job but sometimes you have to float the work. Do you have commercial accounts? I am sure they are not cutting a check as soon as you finish.


----------



## squad143 (Jan 13, 2009)

opcorn:


----------



## jefflovstrom (Jan 13, 2009)

teamtree said:


> I tried to help you out and tell you to just let this thread die but now I need to say something in regards to leaving the tree as is due to non payment. If you started the job with no check then you should have finished it...period....you are acting like a hack. Finish the job and collect. Why did you start it without payment? How long did it actually take to get to that point? If I ever worked an hour and had to stop because of non-payment then I would quit the business. That is a 2-hour job...tops...with stump....you could not float a $500 job? Getting back to the idea that you started without payment, was the terms due upon topping it but not finishing the job? Have you heard of working capital? Don't get me wrong, I like to get paid when I finish the job but sometimes you have to float the work. Do you have commercial accounts? I am sure they are not cutting a check as soon as you finish.



FINALLY!--Thank-you Teamtree!.
Jeff Lovstrom


----------



## oldirty (Jan 13, 2009)

tree MDS said:


> +1 stick to weed whacking. I saw this from the beginning of this thread - what a joke. Just what we need some arrogant lawn jockey with an old cable truck reminiscent of Cooter's wrecker, lol.



lol





TKO-KID said:


> So you can get to the point where you do not have to get up in the tree's yourself anymore.



not even close to the reason why i play this game tko. i plan on getting dirty for the long haul. 

if you dont even want to be in the tree why you in the biz?


----------



## jefflovstrom (Jan 13, 2009)

Every hour my guys work is paid !! It is not their problem that the customer has a check thingy!! You sound like a greedy guy. You take on a job and the only way to get paid is if the client pays you first!????!!Your type is the type I love to Bid against! Don't do the job if you cannot support the cost-
Jeff Lovstrom


----------



## John Paul Sanborn (Jan 14, 2009)

jefflovstrom said:


> Every hour my guys work is paid !!



As it should be. The things some scumbag employers will do. There was one company that would say that when in the truck between jobs, they were on an unpaid break!

If company requires employees to be somewhere at a certain time, then that is when the clock legally starts.

This thread blew up, so I just thought i would start something else.


----------



## teamtree (Jan 14, 2009)

JPS I wish I had a $.025 for every hour I paid my guys for windshield time over the last 10 years. I figured that on average my employees only have to work 5 hours per day...actual work the rest is travel or shop time....but mostly travel to/from jobs.


----------



## Greenleaf (Jan 14, 2009)

John Paul Sanborn said:


> As it should be. The things some scumbag employers will do. There was one company that would say that when in the truck between jobs, they were on an unpaid break!
> 
> If company requires employees to be somewhere at a certain time, then that is when the clock legally starts.
> 
> This thread blew up, so I just thought i would start something else.



I sub contracted to a large company last winter while I was slow. Only lasted a week, as they pulled this same BS. Be at the shop at 7 and back at the shop at 5. If you were not the 'official' driver of the day than you would be docked an hour off your pay! The shop is the marshalling point, as far as I'm concerned an employees day starts at the time you tell them to show up somewhere. The day I pulled the pin the truck I was issued broke down and I had to sit around and wait for someone to come and get me, they then told me that I was off the clock from the time I was sitting. ADIOS. They paid their top climbers less than I pay my top ground guy and then wonder why they have a revolving door of employees.

Ce la Vie I learned how I would never treat good people who work with me from this experience.


----------



## ozzy42 (Jan 14, 2009)

John Paul Sanborn said:


> As it should be. The things some scumbag employers will do. There was one company that would say that when in the truck between jobs, they were on an unpaid break!
> 
> If company requires employees to be somewhere at a certain time, then that is when the clock legally starts.
> 
> This thread blew up, so I just thought i would start something else.


 I agree with you on that.The only exception being seat time to and from the first,and last stop of the day IF,you are their transportation to and from work,especially if it is out of your way.You shouldn't have to pay them for the privilege of doing them a favor.
I have actually had a few that wanted to start on the clock when I started knocking on their door in the morning. I Don't think so.


----------



## Blakesmaster (Jan 14, 2009)

ozzy42 said:


> I agree with you on that.The only exception being seat time to and from the first,and last stop of the day IF,you are their transportation to and from work,especially if it is out of your way.You shouldn't have to pay them for the privilege of doing them a favor.
> I have actually had a few that wanted to start on the clock when I started knocking on their door in the morning. I Don't think so.



You should actually be docking them pay for that.


----------



## Ed Roland (Jan 14, 2009)

arbor pro said:


> As for lettering - K.I.S.S. Keep it simple stupid. Big and simple lettering. Too much text and your truck won't be as noticable by passers-by. Just your company name, logo, contact number and very brief description of services. Don't try to include too much text.
> 
> Good luck.


 
After leaving Bartlett this is the truck i started with. 1988 chevy 1 ton single with 65,000 miles. Picked it up for $3,500 in Roanoke VA @ a car lot last day of month in a rainstorm. I installed the dump mechanism myself for about $1100. $1,500 bought the old chuck and duck to tow behind. simple. 
Performing exceptional work generates business. Word o mouth kept me as busy as i wanted. 

Ahh the good ole days.


----------



## (WLL) (Jan 14, 2009)

woodweasel said:


> After leaving Bartlett this is the truck i started with. 1988 chevy 1 ton single with 65,000 miles. Picked it up for $3,500 in Roanoke VA @ a car lot last day of month in a rainstorm. I installed the dump mechanism myself for about $1100. $1,500 bought the old chuck and duck to tow behind. simple.
> Performing exceptional work generates business. Word o mouth kept me as busy as i wanted.
> 
> Ahh the good ole days.


nice truck man


----------



## oldirty (Jan 14, 2009)

(WLL) said:


> nice truck man



probably one of the better starter trucks ive seen man. nice for sure. she still in the fleet?


----------



## Ed Roland (Jan 14, 2009)

No, sir. I sold both the truck and the chipper on e-bay when I promised the new boss I would not compete as a weekend warrier.

My next truck will be a 1970 something un-insulated linesman truck with boxes and a 27' boom. We can dream, eh?

Just kiddin TKO, you go get em tiger.


----------



## tree MDS (Jan 14, 2009)

woodweasel said:


> No, sir. I sold both the truck and the chipper on e-bay when I promised the new boss I would not compete as a weekend warrier.
> 
> My next truck will be a 1970 something un-insulated linesman truck with boxes and a 27' boom. We can dream, eh?
> 
> Just kiddin TKO, you go get em tiger.



I havent got anything against weekend warriors as long as they are ready for warfare, if you get my drift??

That was a nice starting rig for sure though.


----------



## chevytaHOE5674 (Jan 14, 2009)

woodweasel said:


>



Nice truck, if only it was 4x4 it would be Perfect.


----------



## STLfirewood (Jan 14, 2009)

tree MDS said:


> I havent got anything against weekend warriors as long as they are ready for warfare, if you get my drift??



Not really please explain.

Scott


----------



## (WLL) (Jan 14, 2009)

STLfirewood said:


> Not really please explain.
> 
> Scott


its just too complex fer a partime wood cutter ta understand


----------



## Ed Roland (Jan 14, 2009)

I added a few goodies...

rear overload shocks






Tinted windows (Columbia, SC)






New hitch with all new hardware including chains. Never take chances towing a chipper!!! Families are @ RISK.






Steering stabilizer. She could be testy with a load on our #@$% road system. New tires, allignment and you can see the new chains. 






and... a shot of ole Bessy: before a fresh coat o paint and stickers. I pressure washed the worst off to find the Bartlett yellow.






A couple of very fine tools.


----------



## STLfirewood (Jan 14, 2009)

(WLL) said:


> its just too complex fer a partime wood cutter ta understand



Thanks is that your nice way of calling me dumb  

Scott


----------



## chevytaHOE5674 (Jan 14, 2009)

Nice lookin truck. If that was 4x4 I would want it parked in the driveway right now. Well that and the fact its winter and very little to no tree work gets down this time of year up here.


----------



## Ed Roland (Jan 14, 2009)

interior: new stereo, speakers, flashing light module with yellow bulbs in all 4 corners, sat. radio, first aid kit, extinguisher, reference, man. Ton of reference. o yeah, dont forgett your felco #2.


----------



## (WLL) (Jan 14, 2009)

STLfirewood said:


> Thanks is that your nice way of calling me dumb
> 
> Scott


no bud, im not calling you dumb. bidding jobs is like war and many times it seams you are waiting in line to drop you bid.this whole page is tree car specialists except you. im saying you cant understand what he means by warfare cause professional tree care its not your gig


----------



## STLfirewood (Jan 14, 2009)

(WLL) said:


> no bud, im not calling you dumb. bidding jobs is like war and many times it seams you are waiting in line to drop you bid.this whole page is tree car specialists except you. im saying you cant understand what he means by warfare cause professional tree care its not your gig



I understand I do some tree work also. I don't do any pruning on tree though mainly just removals. I don't know how to trim a tree the proper way so I don't do it. Your right I'm not a pro but my saw says I am . I have been in the bidding wars before I'm sure not as much as you guys but you have to start somewhere. After I read a few books and maybe take some classes then I might check into more advanced tree work. But for now I'll stick to clearing jobs and removals. 


Scott


----------



## BC WetCoast (Jan 14, 2009)

For those talking about being docked for driving time, that is a labour code violation here. You may want to check your state labour regulations.

As for TKO's truck. 
I was silently defending you at the beginning as I have seen some pretty rough looking Davey and Asplundh trucks over the years. However, after seeing your attempt at body work and painting, it's time to step your game up, man. I was just in Cuba for a week. You truck would fit right in. Right year, right condition.


----------



## chevytaHOE5674 (Jan 14, 2009)

BC WetCoast said:


> As for TKO's truck.
> I was silently defending you at the beginning as I have seen some pretty rough looking Davey and Asplundh trucks over the years.



Personally I think if the truck was restored it would be better than most anything you can buy new. 

I have a buddy who's work trucks are all restored 70's fords and they are some of the best looking company trucks around.


----------



## (WLL) (Jan 15, 2009)

chevytaHOE5674 said:


> Personally I think if the truck was restored it would be better than most anything you can buy new.
> 
> I have a buddy who's work trucks are all restored 70's fords and they are some of the best looking company trucks around.


:agree2: id love to have a street rod like old school restored 1 ton dump.


----------



## chevytaHOE5674 (Jan 15, 2009)

(WLL) said:


> :agree2: id love to have a street rod like old school restored 1 ton dump.



Haha but you have to paint the chipper to match. A restored/ modded 70's 1 ton with a chipper to match in tow would be bada$$.


Edit: better yet would be a 1 1/4 ton 50's flat bed.

Like this http://www.michellesfords.com/f-600.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/1103/Michael212/56 Ford F-500/56_F-500_001.jpg


----------



## (WLL) (Jan 15, 2009)

chevytaHOE5674 said:


> Haha but you have to paint the chipper to match. A restored/ modded 70's 1 ton with a chipper to match in tow would be bada$$.
> 
> 
> Edit: better yet would be a 1 1/4 ton 50's chevy flat bed.


crome old school craigers all the way round with staind hard wood sides. yeah the chipper wood be a new morbark painted ta mach with crome stack. bling bling


----------



## (WLL) (Jan 15, 2009)

id like to start with somthing like this


----------



## ozzy42 (Jan 15, 2009)

chevytaHOE5674 said:


> Nice truck, if only it was 4x4 it would be Perfect.



Nice lil truck .
It looks like an elec pump on right side behind cab. With no bed overhang past the hinge point on the bed,is it hard to dump with a maxed out load?
Not trying to put down your tk in any way.I like it ,andI like the long tool boxes.Did you build the bed your self?


----------



## Ed Roland (Jan 15, 2009)

No i bought it with the flat bed and brand spankin new boxes. Because i installed one of those aftermarket dumps it was less than ideal. These kits are fine for light farm use but it did not lift anywhere near its claims. 
I found the ladder rack for sale on side of the road.
Now im wishing i would have kept her.


----------



## tree MDS (Jan 15, 2009)

*old trucks*



chevytaHOE5674 said:


> Personally I think if the truck was restored it would be better than most anything you can buy new.
> 
> I have a buddy who's work trucks are all restored 70's fords and they are some of the best looking company trucks around.



I currently am running an old school 88 gmc one ton dump 4x4 mason body dump. Its been a good old truck. I rebuilt the cab a couple years ago and have generally put a small fortune into it over the years - still beats payments though.

Looks like I'm probably gonna buy another one, this one is an 85 chevy, basically the same truck as above. Its pretty damn rough but it can be saved and I can do body work, welding and painting a little. My dad had a body shop/was a mechanic (amongst other things) so I learned quite a bit growing up. The nice thing will be having two basically identical trucks to work on sinse if you can work on one the other is the same. Also I can grab up old parts trucks cheap and save or have parts rebuilt and waiting.

Diesels are sure nice though, I'll have to wait until I pay off the bucket and chipper.


----------



## chevytaHOE5674 (Jan 15, 2009)

tree MDS said:


> Diesels are sure nice though, I'll have to wait until I pay off the bucket and chipper.



Find yourself a wrecked and rolled over duramax and buy it up. Spend some time swapping and you'll have the latest diesel power in a classic body style.


----------



## tree MDS (Jan 15, 2009)

chevytaHOE5674 said:


> Find yourself a wrecked and rolled over duramax and buy it up. Spend some time swapping and you'll have the latest diesel power in a classic body style.



Nice thought but a little out of my skill set. Actually I'm running a Jasper 350 with the RV cam for towing, that cam is such a difference I would have never believed the way it pulls compared to the old motor.

One of those 500 ci plus crate motors with the right cam would probably be pretty sweet though - and a nice flowmaster exhaust... now we're talkin my style: "old school with a bite", lol.


----------



## chevytaHOE5674 (Jan 15, 2009)

tree MDS said:


> One of those 500 ci plus crate motors with the right cam would probably be pretty sweet though - and a nice flowmaster exhaust... now we're talkin my style: "old school with a bite", lol.



Gm makes a 572ci crate motor, 620 horsepower.....:greenchainsaw: 

Find a truck with a factory big block and the 572 would bolt right in......


----------



## tree MDS (Jan 15, 2009)

chevytaHOE5674 said:


> Gm makes a 572ci crate motor, 620 horsepower.....:greenchainsaw:
> 
> Find a truck with a factory big block and the 572 would bolt right in......



Yeah, I wasnt sure of the size, thanks HOE. I've often wondered how one of those big dogs would fair against a super duty?? any thoughts?

Too bad the economy probably wont afford me such dreams for a while


----------



## (WLL) (Jan 15, 2009)

chevytaHOE5674 said:


> Gm makes a 572ci crate motor, 620 horsepower.....:greenchainsaw:
> 
> Find a truck with a factory big block and the 572 would bolt right in......


its more easy said than done. you will need many things. a built up trans,custom oil pan&trans pan, huge elect fuel pump, the list goes on and on. and risk braking many parts is very high. the motor you talk about is for a drag race'n. id rather use a purpose built 350 a better idea woul be a cummings swap


----------



## chevytaHOE5674 (Jan 15, 2009)

(WLL) said:


> its more easy said than done. you will need many things. a built up trans,custom oil pan&trans pan, huge elect fuel pump, the list goes on and on. and risk braking many parts is very high. the motor you talk about is for a drag race'n. id rather use a purpose built 350



I know a guy with a 572 in his DD/ offroad truck. Running it in front of a stock sm465 4 speed. He is running an oil pan off the original 454 (its a simple sheet metal unit with internal baffles and extra capacity). He is just running an electric inline fuel pump on a returnless fuel setup. If you can afford the motor then the simple mods to drop it in are easy.

Ooo yeah i build trucks/cars in my spare time.


----------



## tree MDS (Jan 15, 2009)

chevytaHOE5674 said:


> I know a guy with a 572 in his DD/ offroad truck. Running it in front of a stock sm465 4 speed. He is running an oil pan off the original 454 (its a simple sheet metal unit with internal baffles and extra capacity). He is just running an electric inline fuel pump on a returnless fuel setup. If you can afford the motor then the simple mods to drop it in are easy.
> 
> Ooo yeah i build trucks/cars in my spare time.



I think alot of it would be having the right cam - that and generally trying not to do dually burnouts, lol. Those trannys and rearends are pretty damn strong as long as you can drive. As for putting it in, all you really need is a parts truck for all the pulleys, mounts etc., bell housing could be stock as well, small block would work. A 454 with a decent cam and more compression than wimpy stock 454's come with and a good towing cam would probably be a little more realistic however...just not as much fun.


----------



## chevytaHOE5674 (Jan 15, 2009)

A 454 with a decent RV cam and the heads to match is really a good combination. Will tow just about anything you want.

Realistically a 350 built for towing, and a truck with the gears for towing will tow most tree gear around without much issue. A chipper and a load of chips isn't that heavy. I've towed a lot with my 1/2 ton chevy and it keeps coming back for more.


----------



## arbor pro (Jan 15, 2009)

I used to own six '78 and '79 chevy 3/4 and 1-tons in my tree care and landscaping business (except for the bucket and chip trucks which were F700s or F800s with 361 gassers or cat diesels in them). I wasn't much of a mechanic back then (still not much of one) but, didn't need to be when it came to maintaining the 350s and 454s. I remember having a local body shop put all new fenders, doors, hoods and rocker panels on three of the pickups and repaint them all for a cost of only $1500 each (chassis only). The great part was, if a fender got wrecked and had to be replaced, it could be done for a few hundred bucks, not a few thousand like it would cost with one of today's newer trucks.

I did use one of the 1-tons with a 350 as a chip truck for awhile. It easily handled an 11-yard chip box and whisper chipper. I even towed my 1800 vermeer a few times. Handled it fine. Filled up fast though.


----------



## squad143 (Jan 15, 2009)

TKO-KID said:


> I am done with this thread now so have fun talking to yourselves.



Just noticed;
42 posts of having fun and talking to ourselves.


----------



## Philbert (Jan 21, 2009)

TKO-KID said:


> What do you all think of this idea on lettering my truck.



A few years back a neighbor had a large tree removed by 'someone he knew in the business'.

The guy showed up in a pretty nice bucket truck with 'Binford' lettered in the perfect font and color across the length of his boom.

Guy knew what he was doing and had a sense of humor.

Philbert


----------



## treemandan (Jan 22, 2009)

Binford makes a lot of high quality tools.


----------



## deevo (Jan 28, 2009)

I see its for sale now....anyone going for it?


----------



## TKO-KID (Jan 29, 2009)

deevo said:


> I see its for sale now....anyone going for it?



It had been for sale before I lettered it.

I was going to get rid of it, because it wasn't used much. But then a few jobs came up that it was perfect for.

again reading before posting does wonders


----------



## deevo (Jan 29, 2009)

TKO-KID said:


> It had been for sale before I lettered it.
> 
> I was going to get rid of it, because it wasn't used much. But then a few jobs came up that it was perfect for.
> 
> again reading before posting does wonders



My apologies! I look in there all the time and didn't see it in there before! Must of been because of the paint job Good luck with the sale


----------



## TKO-KID (Jan 29, 2009)

deevo said:


> My apologies! I look in there all the time and didn't see it in there before! Must of been because of the paint job Good luck with the sale



thanks deevo. It isn't really for sale I just put it up there because it was there.
It isn't for sale anywhere else. Just if someone came along off here. I would let it go. Because again after those few jobs i had a use for it. I don't see any in the very near future I will need it for. 

Because Just as I said before I know how to climb and if I am not worried about the tree supporting me. Then I have no problem using a throw line and then climbing up or using ladder to get into the canopy and then climbing around from there.


----------



## Chris Francis (Mar 22, 2015)

How did he figure out the customer could not pay in the middle of the job, unless he asked for full payment before finished? Perhaps they saw the quality of work and decided that was not who needed to be working on their trees.


----------



## acer-kid (Mar 27, 2015)

This thread is six years old.


----------



## TC262 (Apr 3, 2015)

Wished the pics worked on old threads like this


----------

