# Felling direction



## scotchguy (Sep 16, 2005)

Hi Guys,

I'm taking down a large pine on our property, 45" diameter at chainsaw height. It is not in danger of falling on the house but there are some branches on smaller, more delicate trees, that may get smashed as this thing comes down.

Now, I always fell a tree in the natural direction because I appreciate the weight involved and the all-pervasive nature of gravity.

However, my dad is much more of an optimist than me, and a lot more reckless. On more than one occasion when I was not present, he has had a tree move and trap his saw in the felling cut. This was followed by some desperately funny antics climbing an unstable tree to get a wire rope and a cable puller attached.

Anyway, back to this big pine. It is almost straight, but it clearly "wants" to go in one particular direction. My dad recons he can make it go the other way using felling wedges. So my question to you guys is about the proper use and purpose of felling wedges. Are they intended to move a tree against the natural felling direction or are they just for nudging a dead straight tree away from your felling cut.

Thanks in advance.


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## Oregon Engineer (Sep 16, 2005)

I've used falling wedges to move the top of a leaning tree 20'+ so I could fall it against it's natural lean. 

Your tree is 45" in diameter. 
1) How tall is it??
2) How far do you need to move the top of the tree before it will fall in the direction you want?

Given your answers to #1 and #2 and the diameter of the tree, it is a simple calcuation to determine how thick the wedges need to be to tip the tree over!! If the required thickness is more than that of two wedges combined, then it gets a bit more risky. If it is less than two wedges then it is a normal procedure.


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## smokechase II (Sep 17, 2005)

Wedging can be complicated. But it sounds like you *may* have a simple situation. 
Assuming everything else is copasetic. Some very important keys:
AAA) Make a plumb bob device, string with weight or something like that, and look your tree over very carefully from at least two different places that are at right angles to each other while you're 50' away from the base or so. Now place yourself directly under or directly behind the trees perceived lean then replumb. If all your senses then tell you that you are in line with its intended fall. You now know where it wants to go.
Remember that many conifer trees have two leans, (hardwoods approach infinity); your twisted pine could easily have that, so consider that 'usually' the highest lean has the greatest effect, (longest lever arm).
But don't forget about wind, limb weight on one side, rotten wood where you are cutting, root pull etc., affecting the direction of fall also.
Now; cut the face and start the back cut on your 40" + stem.
1) Establish your wedges before you actually need them, but not so soon that your chain cuts and/or removes them. 
2) Think of your wedge as insurance; do not drive a wedge hard into the back cut on insurance wedge early on. Just tap it reasonably snug. 
3) Watch the "People do stupid things" commercial with the guy dropping the tree on his car and think, maybe I'll just spend a couple bucks and have a local established bonded professional do the cutting and the wedging.
4) Focus really hard on not cutting off your holding wood, like the guy above, particularly on the 'corners'. Corners are on either side of the back cut as you get close to finishing. If you're dropping a tree away from its natural lean and you cut off the holding wood on one side, expect the tree to spin and hit your house/car/buddy/you.
5) If you're falling your tree away from its intended lean, make your holding wood uneven with more on the side you need to pull your tree towards. If you have good solid wood to work with, this will usually have a greater influence on tree fall direction than wedges. (Trivia: Maintaining an even back cut into a 40" + stem when you're cutting with a 24 inch bar does require skill).
6) Wedges can be used to push a tree in a desired direction. I just thought it important to emphasize the holding wood part of this equation as it seems many starting out have overconfidence in wedges and need to focus on holding wood. So now go ahead and drive those wedges.
7) By the way, it can actually be safer to finish your falling event by tapping it over with wedges. Escape from the primary danger area is easier with an axe, than a saw. But don't pound your wedges incredibly hard when they are not going anywhere. Hard on them and you.
8) Note; your escape is to a place where you can hide from limbs being thrown back at you or worse, but you're also ready to exit to either side. I know of one instance where a learning faller was crushed to death over 70 feet from the stump when he cut off holding wood, the tree spun and he just ran. Glance back repeatedly and make sure you and the tree are parting company.
Take some photos.


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## Ryan Willock (Sep 17, 2005)

My logging crew uses wedges daily, they are a staple of life for us. My timber cutter had to wedge over a really bad leaner yesterday.


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## scotchguy (Sep 19, 2005)

*Thanks! ... but the height?*

Thanks for the information, especially the long post by SmokechaseII. Good points for me to remember are the relationship between the height of the tree and the amount the top has to move PLUS the advice about keepking the corners in the felling cut.

I'm really bad at estimating the height of a tree. I'm always amazed at how much smaller they look once they are on the ground. I know how to calculate the height using a ruler held out at arms length plus the cosine of the angle etc ... the way I learned in high school geometry. However, I'd be interested to know the "rule of thumb" that does not involve paper, pencil and an electronic calculator.

I'm going to save this information because I broke my foot this weekend and it will be at least 6 weeks till I can tackle this job. And yes, I'll take some photos.

Thanks again.


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## Oregon Engineer (Sep 19, 2005)

Easy rule of thumb for determining the height of a tree and it only takes your hand, eye, and a stick. 

1) Get a small diameter stick about 2 1/2 ft long. 
2) Extend your arm out with your hand at eye level and the stick in your hand pointing straight up. 
3) Aim your extended arm directly at the tree to be measured. 
4) Rotate the stick back until it contacts the side of your head directly next to your eye. Move the stick in your hand until the tip of the stick is flush with your eye. (don't poke yourself) 
5) Raise the stick up vertical with your arm extended and your hand at eye level. (this should create a 45 degree sighting angle)
6) Look at the top of the stick
7) Move forwards or backwards until the top of the tree is lined up with the top of the stick. 
8) Once they are lined up then move backwards the additional height your eye is above the ground. This is where the top of the tree will hit.

Remember you want to create a 45 degree angle from your eye to the top of the stick so keep your extended hand at eye level and the stick vertical, (check that the top of the stick comes back to your eye, adjust if necessary).


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## belgian (Sep 19, 2005)

smokechase II, good that you mention "rotten wood" to look out for.
I've been learning a lot on this forum last months, and have taken such expertise into the field yesterday. I was to take down an old 18' cherry tree down for firewood. It had quite some lean to it, but the direction I wanted it to fall was only some degrees out. When I made my backcut, while using a wedge, the tree already fell while my holding wood snapped before I knew it.
Turned out that the mattering part of the backcut was really rotten, not visible from the outside.

No big hazard done (had to repair the fence a bit), but sure was a good lesson for me.

No way I will take down a tree myself with some major risk to it for the surrounding area.


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## scotchguy (Sep 19, 2005)

Brilliant! It's like a do-it-yourself sextant! Indeed, any 45 degree angle can be used for sighting purposes.

I'm going to hobble out and try it right now.


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## smokechase II (Sep 19, 2005)

Belgian:
The two standard methods of determining rot, when it is not obvious externally; {You don't have to see the rot, an external fruiting body, (conk), from some fungus may be the clue.} 
1) Slap the trunk of the tree hard with your falling axe. There will be a hollow sound on those trees that have rotted out and a somewhat hollow sound (it’s different than solid wood anyway), on those trees that are in the process of rotting close to the cambium. This will vary on different species etc. The axe will also feel different on the rebound. I wouldn't be an especially good judge on a cherry tree for instance. Never cut one. Just be aware that this is knowledge to acquire.
2) Bore into the tree vertically, (also at a right angle to the intended fall you are planning-if possible), and note the chips or sawdust. If say, you start with good chips on your bore and 4 inches in it becomes sawdust. You now know that there is rot and at least part of the picture of that trees difficulties. {Of course, boring straight in is a bad idea-kick back powerfully. One has to start with an angle of at least at 45 degrees and gradually straighten}. Boring is a great tool in your chest, several other scenarios where boring proves its worth}.
There may well be an experienced cutter that has worked with Cherry trees locally and is aware of something like, "When they get that age and look a bit sickly, I always suspect _____ rot." I don't know this, of course, but it aint a bad idea to hang around experience if they're a decent teacher.
All the Best and I enjoyed seeing a nice person and great athlete like Kim Clijsters win her first major.

Oregon Engineer:
I wonder if there is something I could put on my falling axe to help me be accurate on the 45 degree angle.
I've done this before primitively. Steeped way back, at a right angle to intended fall, and held up my axe matching the height of the tree by moving it back and forth. Then laid it vertically while it was the same distance from my eyes with one end at the stump/ground. The other end of the axe then points to where the top will hit. This is accurate, but requires too much hiking to be realistic, (to get the right spot). Gonna try your way. Your way should work better except on a heavy leaner, (angle messed with some).


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## belgian (Sep 20, 2005)

*right again*

Smokechaser II,

you were on the spot again. This tree had indeed a big fruity mushroom on its side, so that should have rung a bell with me. 
Thanks for your help.

funny that you mention Kim Clijsters. Her home town Bree is only 20 miles from my place. We are really fond of her.
Thanks again.
Roland


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## crimplene (Sep 20, 2005)

The other things I was taught to do if you suspect rot is: 

1. Make all your cuts higher up the trunk

2. Leave a larger hinge.

If you're paying attentiion  when you make your back cut you can often see if there's rot by the quality of the chip coming out.

Also for some species, e.g. willow, you can assume that there *will* be rot


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## scotchguy (Sep 20, 2005)

Hi Crimplene,

Is that Lewes in Sussex? If so, I just booked a hotel for 5 November.

For you Americans, this is like 4 July when we celebrate the event 400 years ago when some catolic guy (Guy Fox) was burned-at-the-stake for getting caught trying to blow up parliament by packing the basement with blasting powder. We don't use real catholics these days!

Check it out:

http://www.lewesbonfirecouncil.org.uk/


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## geofore (Sep 20, 2005)

*axes*



smokechase II said:


> Belgian:
> The two standard methods of determining rot, when it is not obvious externally; {You don't have to see the rot, an external fruiting body, (conk), from some fungus may be the clue.}
> 1) Slap the trunk of the tree hard with your falling axe. There will be a hollow sound on those trees that have rotted out and a somewhat hollow sound (it’s different than solid wood anyway), on those trees that are in the process of rotting close to the cambium. This will vary on different species etc. The axe will also feel different on the rebound. I wouldn't be an especially good judge on a cherry tree for instance. Never cut one. Just be aware that this is knowledge to acquire.
> 2) Bore into the tree vertically, (also at a right angle to the intended fall you are planning-if possible), and note the chips or sawdust. If say, you start with good chips on your bore and 4 inches in it becomes sawdust. You now know that there is rot and at least part of the picture of that trees difficulties. {Of course, boring straight in is a bad idea-kick back powerfully. One has to start with an angle of at least at 45 degrees and gradually straighten}. Boring is a great tool in your chest, several other scenarios where boring proves its worth}.
> ...


You buy what is called a Canadian axe and the bottom of the handle is cut to 45*. At least mine was.


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## smokechase II (Sep 20, 2005)

I'm amazed how much I'm learning at this site. Stuff I certainly hadn't thought of.
Some of those axes are around here too. Thanks


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## crimplene (Sep 20, 2005)

Indeed it is! Nov 5th in Lewes is organized mayhem...lots of fireworks, bonfires, parades, marching bands, burning barrels etc oh and people dressed up as the pope. Goes on all night. Lots of the local villages have bonfire societies so Bonfire night goes on all month somewhere or other


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## scotchguy (Sep 20, 2005)

*Let's get this all straight!*

There seems to be some missunderstanding going on here.

I have therefore prepared a step-by-step illustrated guide just so everybody is on the same wavelength.

1 You get hold of any old bit of paper.

2 You fold it as if you were back in junior school and was making a square.

3 Keeping the bottom level, you sight up the 45 degree angle till you see the top of the tree.

4 You add on the height of your eye above the ground, and mark the spot with a bit of wood.

At this point, don't forget to batter the stem with your axe to check for rot, unless its a willow, in which case be sure you have made your last will and attended confession.

5 Finally, you make the felling cut and .....RUN LIKE HELL!


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## gumneck (Sep 20, 2005)

So where did it hit in relation to your mark ? ....Be honest.


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## scotchguy (Sep 20, 2005)

My saw's still trapped in the felling cut ... those blasted wedges ... I'll stick to the wire rope in future!


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## smokechase II (Sep 21, 2005)

I cannot be for certain. But is scotchguy flipping us all the bird in photo 3 above?
Tis a sad day.


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## Oregon Engineer (Sep 22, 2005)

Ya, that's European humor all right, subtle but stinging.


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## Oregon Engineer (Sep 27, 2005)

Come on Scotchguy,

I was poking fun and hoping you would pipe in and explain it wasn't intentional.

How's your foot doing?


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## smokechase II (Sep 27, 2005)

Oregon Engineer:
You wrote intentional but did you mean to say international?


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## Oregon Engineer (Sep 28, 2005)

I assume the picture was not intended to offend anyone, so it wasn't intentional (not on purpose). Though I do see the humor in international.


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## scotchguy (Sep 30, 2005)

Hi Guys,

No, no offence intended or taken about the picture joke. I see what you mean about picuter 3 though.  

I've enjoyed this thread. My best laugh was Gumneck's name ... I've climbed a few pines that left me feeling like resinneck. Anybody know how to get it off?

Thanks, my foot's a lot better. However, I have been distracted by my wife having a kidney stone removed. It's a hell of a painful thing and the operation involves having a camera inserted up your urethra. Too much detail, so I'll stop there, except to say she is recoving and things should be OK.

It's very depressing to see the number of old folks clinging onto life in the hospital. A bit of a waste of money if you ask me and I hope that when my time comes I still have the sense to go out to sleep in the woods on a cold night.


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## Timberjackboy (Sep 30, 2005)

crimplene said:


> Indeed it is! Nov 5th in Lewes is organized mayhem...lots of fireworks, bonfires, parades, marching bands, burning barrels etc oh and people dressed up as the pope. Goes on all night. Lots of the local villages have bonfire societies so Bonfire night goes on all month somewhere or other




I learned about Guy Fox day through the book return Of The Native


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## geofore (Sep 30, 2005)

*wedges*



scotchguy said:


> My saw's still trapped in the felling cut ... those blasted wedges ... I'll stick to the wire rope in future!


Bauhaus over near Frankfurt has the forged aluminium wedges by Oregon made in Germany. Nice and light to work with and they hold up better than the plastic ones and not as hard on the chain if you ding the wedge as the iron ones.


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## Oregon Engineer (Oct 5, 2005)

geofore said:


> Bauhaus over near Frankfurt has the forged aluminium wedges by Oregon made in Germany.



Do they actually have an OREGON logo on the wedges?


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## geofore (Oct 6, 2005)

*Oregon logo*

Yes, they have the OREGON logo on the sticker, not stamped in. Blount GmbH, Oregon Cutting Systems Division, Postfach 1146-71112 Gartringen. They are stamped Ox Head Germany Alu forged Safety Wedges. Ochsenkopf SL 2000. They should work well to tip trees over.


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## gumneck (Oct 6, 2005)

scotchguy said:


> Hi Guys,
> 
> No, no offence intended or taken about the picture joke. I see what you mean about picuter 3 though.
> 
> ...



Gumneck is a place....some believe its a state of mind. Scotchguy, search vineyard pics on the site and see if you can get into a piece of Gumneck.

Have a good one.


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## BlueRidgeMark (Oct 12, 2005)

scotchguy said:


> There seems to be some missunderstanding going on here......
> 
> 5 Finally, you make the felling cut and .....RUN LIKE HELL!




Scotchguy, that picture shows that you've broken one of the most important rules of wood cutting! 

*Use a big enough saw!*


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## scotchguy (Nov 8, 2005)

*...Crimplene ... off topic*



crimplene said:


> Indeed it is! Nov 5th in Lewes is organized mayhem...lots of fireworks, bonfires, parades, marching bands, burning barrels etc oh and people dressed up as the pope. Goes on all night. Lots of the local villages have bonfire societies so Bonfire night goes on all month somewhere or other




Just got back ... you are damed right, its mayhem. I used to live in Boston so we joined the Comerial Square society for the night because of their connection with the north american indians:

http://www.lewesbonfirecouncil.org.uk/societies/commercial/index.html

Check out the photos. The guy dressed as the pope in picture 2 looks unhappy becuase when he gets to the fire site he's put up on a stage and the whole mad crowd throws fire crackers and abuse at him for about an hour (photo 3). :angry2:


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## scotchguy (Nov 8, 2005)

where are the blasted photos?


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## belgian (Nov 8, 2005)

These pics make me think about the famous KK clan pictures I saw in films. Or is it just me...


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## scotchguy (Nov 8, 2005)

KKK ... certainly not. There is nothing sinister about it now. Practically nobody in Britain goes to church anymore and the celebrations are totally secular with catholics and protestants joining in. It's 400 years ago and both sides gave as good as they got, each burning martyrs. Read the web site ... its all about a celebration of independence. Lots of people get drunk and everybody enjoys themselves.


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## belgian (Nov 8, 2005)

scotchguy said:


> Lots of people get drunk and everybody enjoys themselves.



Ok, just joking. I know KKK has no business in Scotland.
Sounds fun.


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