# becoming a logger



## redneck logger (Jul 15, 2008)

:greenchainsaw: i live in minnesota and im thinking about going into forestry and become a logger i was wondering about pay and the stuff i can expect from day to day and if its really worth doing.


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## forestryworks (Jul 15, 2008)

it's worth doing if you absolute love that kind of work 
and love your job (rigging, loader op., faller, etc.)

get a forestry tech or a 4yr. forestry degree
take a few courses and learn to operate a fellerbuncher
or loader or yarder or woods machines of the like

you don't need a degree to log but you do need something
to fall back on


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## slowp (Jul 16, 2008)

It isn't hunting or fishing or hiking. You have work where the timber is--not at all like a park. I hear the company guys talking about a shortage of young guys taking up logging, well, it isn't the best of things to do wage wise and security wise. Take right now, if we don't get any rain, we'll go into a shut down. Think of it as an *unpaid* vacation. Then in the winter, we had so much snow here and the market tanked--more time off *unpaid*.
Wages are what they were in the 1980s. At the same time they're saying they can't find young guys to start out, they're cautious about hiring newbies because of potential accidents. Not easy to get started unless you know someone in the business.


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## Nailsbeats (Jul 16, 2008)

Is it really worth doing? Depends how bad you want it. That's different for everybody.

Will you make great money and have all the benefits and security? No.


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## mile9socounty (Jul 16, 2008)

If the job I'm hunting for. Thats the next job on my list. I've got to keep the family roots somewhere in the forest. Yes I have thought it over many times at night. I like working in the woods. One way or another, I'm going to stay out there until it puts me under. Ain't no building going to keep me trapped up.

Kenny


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## Nailsbeats (Jul 17, 2008)

Yes, get a degree and log because you want to, not because you have to.


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## redneck logger (Jul 18, 2008)

i want to do it because its what i love but just dont know how to get started in it. i know not many young guys go in it around here its a dieing job. have any tips?


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## redlaker (Jul 19, 2008)

get a trade! I dont know about getting a job in logging these days, it seems there is barely enough jobs for the people that are in it already


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## toddstreeservic (Jul 19, 2008)

redneck logger said:


> i want to do it because its what i love but just dont know how to get started in it. i know not many young guys go in it around here its a dieing job. have any tips?



Go talk to loggers. Thats where I would start. Find a logger, buy him a beer, and talk to him. Repeat. Before long you will find one that will take you under their wing and teach you the trade. 

-Pay sucks.
-dangerous.
-hard work.
+ work outside
+get to use cool tools (chainsaw, skidder etc)
+rewarding work


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## forestryworks (Jul 19, 2008)

redneck logger said:


> i want to do it because its what i love but just dont know how to get started in it. i know not many young guys go in it around here its a dieing job. have any tips?



and you gotta go where the timber is...

there's plenty of companies in the rocky mountains looking
for hard workers to help with the beetle kill salvage


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## Gologit (Jul 19, 2008)

forestryworks said:


> and you gotta go where the timber is...
> 
> there's plenty of companies in the rocky mountains looking
> for hard workers to help with the beetle kill salvage



Yup...if you really want to go logging the Left Coast is where it's at. There's been some good advice given you so far. There isn't any real job security, the money isn't great, the work can be damn hard, and you're looked down on my the majority of society. You get dirty, you get sore, you get banged up, and that's just on the good days. 

If these things don't bother you, then give it a try. Be ready to start at the bottom...literally at the bottom if you're on a rigging crew. If you start out on the landing chasing or bumping knots (or both) I hope you like to move at a trot all day. There's little logging outfits all over the Sierras and finding a job isn't hard. Keeping the job is a different story. And sometimes even having a job for very long is hard to do. Things slow down, the market changes, the logger gets in on different ground and doesn't need as many people...and there goes your job.

But, if you can tough it out for a couple of seasons, and if you're a good hard worker, if you're right there ready to go every morning and you pull your share of the load all day and don't whine....the word will get out about you. If you're good, the boss will keep you longer than he should. When he does have to let you go he'll probably have a good idea where you should look for another job. He might even loan you out to other loggers he knows just so maybe he can get you back when he needs you.

So...try it. If you don't try it you might spend the rest of your life wishing you had. And if you wind up deciding it's not for you...what the hell, you're young and you can go do something else.


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## forestryworks (Jul 19, 2008)

Gologit said:


> Yup...if you really want to go logging the Left Coast is where it's at. There's been some good advice given you so far. There isn't any real job security, the money isn't great, the work can be damn hard, and you're looked down on my the majority of society. You get dirty, you get sore, you get banged up, and that's just on the good days.
> 
> If these things don't bother you, then give it a try. Be ready to start at the bottom...literally at the bottom if you're on a rigging crew. If you start out on the landing chasing or bumping knots (or both) I hope you like to move at a trot all day. There's little logging outfits all over the Sierras and finding a job isn't hard. Keeping the job is a different story. And sometimes even having a job for very long is hard to do. Things slow down, the market changes, the logger gets in on different ground and doesn't need as many people...and there goes your job.
> 
> ...



+ 1 on what bob said

it's more a way of life than an actual job
but then again there's no other job like it
and you owe it to yourself to try it


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## Burvol (Jul 19, 2008)

I'm here to say that it's a lifestyle more than anything. It gets inside you, and becomes who you are after a while. I love it, never had a job that I could get up at 2:30 or 3:00 A.M. and enjoy doing...There's no better place to spend a summer than in the timber out here. The late fall rains and cold winters (until shutdown) are another story, but I still love it. I think Grit or being a able to grind it out are how I would describe it. You might screw up and become a logger!


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## Philobite (Jul 19, 2008)

*Here's an idea*

Redneck Logger,

How about this idea: Get a degree or choose work so that you can work your way into a seasonal job. I know several teachers who worked and got good benefits for the school year, and got into contractor carpentry during their free months in the summers. They about doubled their income, yet they were cushioned from the ups and downs of being a full-time carpenter.

So if you became, say, a teacher, you could save up and purchase 100 acres of timberland, and get a used loader and used D6 or D7 CAT or a used skidder, and manage your timberlands during the summer. Maybe you have a relative who could limb and set chokers for you for some summer pay. That's what my older brother does for me. He's a biology and science teacher at a private school and works for two months with me in our redwoods during summer.

100 acres of good timberland should keep you going for several years before it needs a rest, and you can roll some of the profits into another timberland purchase and come back to the first one in 5 years. 200 acres of good land and you'll be set with enough logging for any personal appetite. The nice thing about this approach is you don't absolutely have to log every year, so if you need to take a break, or if prices dip, or you get sick or hurt, you're not out your main income or insurance. You can let the forest sit and accrue growth value around 7% a year. Just set up your purchase of the land so that you don't absolutely need the timber income to make the payments.

You may even luck out and marry a girl that loves the outdoors and would be happy to be in a cozy cabin or nice trailer in the forest with you during the logging season. Ideally, build your home there... the commute to work is a stroll out to the ATV.


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## redneck logger (Jul 19, 2008)

the thing is i dont want to go to the west coast i want to stay in minnesota ya know lol


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## redlaker (Jul 20, 2008)

so when you say "logger" what exactly do you mean?

are you talking about running buncher or skidder? because I can't imagine there is alot of hand felling in minnesota.. somebody correct me if I'm wrong


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## hammerlogging (Jul 20, 2008)

In MN, unless you're serving the unconventional markets- small woodlot owners with multiple stewardship objectives, yes, likely you mean CTL or fellerbuncher/skidder outfits pulpwood. Which is ok, its logging too. As said before, meet some loggers. Good help is hard to find anywhere so if you are thoughtful, easy on equipment, and reliable, you'll survive on crews once ou get your foot in the door. Think about what your vision/goals is in regards to what type of logging you want to be doing. So, if you want to check it out, go walk up to some loggers, tell em you want a job. Someone will recognize talent and ambition and give you a try. Its a strange work to enjoy but we all seem to so, good luck.


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## chevytaHOE5674 (Jul 20, 2008)

Yeah MN logging will most likely not be hand felling so learn to run equiptment. Times are hard up in the area though, my girlfriends logging father of 35+ years just lost his job a few weeks because one of the most profitable logging outfits in Michigans UP and Northern Wisconsin cut from 4 crews down to 1. Luckly he is able to work nights running a feller buncher. Good luck it is touch times in the Northern Midwest right now.


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## GASoline71 (Jul 20, 2008)

A word of advice... stay in school... you don't just walk out in the woods one day and say, "Ya know... I think I'll be a logger."

Gary


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## redlaker (Jul 22, 2008)

no disrespect to the people that run the bunchers, skidders, limbers, slashers, loaders, processors, forwarders.... I know alot of people that work in the bush, but not many of those people would call themselves a logger, more than likely they would say bushworker, or operator.... when I hear the word "logger" I don't picture an 18 year old kid in an air conditioned cab, moving joysticks and pushing buttons and rocking out to the latest tunes on the Ipod. 

I picture someone on their own, with a chainsaw, a can of gas, an axe and some wedges, falling big timber. kinda like sturdy danny mcgee on the old raisin bran commercial... 

I guess I must be old fashioned


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## chevytaHOE5674 (Jul 22, 2008)

redlaker said:


> I guess I must be old fashioned



Around these parts there is little to no hand felling. Felling only the occasional danger tree most of the time. Cutting from equiptment is faster, quicker,safer, and about the only way to turn an ok profit in these hard times. Everybody i know here that runs a feller buncher, or CTL processor calls themselves a logger.


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## redlaker (Jul 22, 2008)

its the same here, I was just talking about the term logger. it means different things to different people, and is used differently in other parts of the world. I think my friends that work in the bush might say they are a logger if they were trying to explain what they do to a city person.. 

here you would be hard pressed to even find a chainsaw on a logging site if you needed one. johnny chainsaw just cant compete with diesel engines and hydraulics when it comes to (relatively) flat ground and small trees.


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## hammerlogging (Jul 22, 2008)

I know some loggers (dudes who pull wood) that wouldn't want me (cutter) to call myself a logger- can be sensitive.


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## chevytaHOE5674 (Jul 22, 2008)

redlaker said:


> when it comes to flat ground and small trees.



They use tracked equiptment on steep ground on 30+" hardwoods here. Not tall trees like out west but still huge heavy trees.

Edit: Around here if you work in the woods cutting trees, you can call yourself a logger.


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## redlaker (Jul 22, 2008)

chevytaHOE5674 said:


> They use tracked equiptment on steep ground on 30+" hardwoods here. Not tall trees like out west but still huge heavy trees.



I am aware of that, but I was just talking about where I live. and there aren't any processor/forwarder operations around here, its been tried but just didnt pan out I guess

but as the trees get bigger and slopes get steeper then the chainsaw becomes the only option. 

though I have seen some levelling bunchers and kmc track skidders in the west that were pretty impressive on some steep ground

its funny how many different interpretations of the word logger there is. I had no idea


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## Zackman1801 (Jul 24, 2008)

atleast to me a logger is anyone who cuts, falls, operates logging equiptment (except for the truckers) and deals with the trees after they are out of the woods. although alot of people around here do all of them at the same time. 1 man operations who fell, cut, operate machines, and then deal with scaling and processing to send to the mill. ive even seen some who drive the trucks to the mill too.


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## hammerlogging (Jul 25, 2008)

I agree, and thats cool, just putting the concept out there. I know some of the truckers like to grouped in with us as well, and if that makes them feel cooler, fine. Lots of them worked the woods in the past anyhow.


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## Zackman1801 (Jul 25, 2008)

yeah i know quite a few guys who either got hurt and decided to drive truck or just got to be too old to work out there and decided to stay in the industry by driving trucks. then there are also people who try it for a few years decide its not for them but want to drive truck, but not serious like long road trips and opt for this option.


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## hansol04 (Jul 26, 2008)

Hey there,

I was sort of wondering the same thing as the orginal poster. I'm a young guy (22) in British Columbia, and have been working as a carpenter and as a hunting guide from aug-dec. That being said, I've been looking at getting into the guiding more seriously, and looking at doing some sort of "outdoors" type work for the rest of the year.

I was looking at maybe tree-climbing or "logging" or line-cutting ("logging" to me means running around the bush with a stihl/husky and cork boots). Is this a viable option, or does the logging season and hunting season (namely the fall months) coincide too much? Does a young guy have to take specific courses and such to get on a crew, or can he just show up with a good attitude and a saw, and somebody will teach him? (Of course assuming he isn't a POS and what not.)

Thanks very much guys. I know I most likely sound like a naive idiot, but figured it was worth a shot. Thanks very much -Cameron

(mods, if you feel this is a hijack, feel free to move it)


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## redwood logger (Jul 27, 2008)

*(Logger)*

In my opinion, if you are involved in any job from building the road in to the job, all the way to the trucking it to the mill, then you can call yourself A Logger. That being said there is one exception, If you are just out there logging because it pays well and all you care about is when quiting time is, then you are not a Logger, you are a cull. A real Logger does his job the best he can and loves doing it!


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## redwood logger (Jul 27, 2008)

*Getting started*

Around these parts the only college class you might want to take before you go logging is Spanish. Most of the rigging men around here came from south of the border. They still raise their kids right down there. They have good work ethic and male pride. By that I mean they want to be a man and do a mans job. Not live with your parents and work at Starbucks until you are 30. They are doing these jobs because the young people from around here cant handle it. 
As far as the chainsaw thing goes, you have to work your way up to that. They don't hand you a saw on your first day and let you go cutting. First you need to prove yourself as a good rigging man before anyone will give you a shot at cutting. The same goes for running the equipment.


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