# Joining the world of csm



## gr8scott72 (Sep 2, 2009)

Well, I did it. Today I put in an order with Bailey's for a Chainsaw Mill. Got the 30" Alaskan. Also ordered a 60" bar for my 394xp for a project I have coming up.

It's actually a pretty cool story.

This guy gets ahold of me because someone told him I have a big chainsaw. (394) This guy wants to make tables out of an old red oak that fell in the Greenwood cemetary in downtown Jackson MS. It's probably about 200 years old, the tree that is, and the cemetary is about the same. He is opening a restaurant also in downtown Jackson MS and is all about the history of Jackson.

Anyways, he had already contacted the city cemetary manager and told him that we would get rid of the wood for him. 

Oh, this is a 5' diameter red oak that had 1 piece that was still over 12' long. It blew over in a large storm a while back. Even made the news.

So, the manager is glad that someone actually wants it and said it was ours.

The restaurant owner got me the money to order the chainsaw mill and other equipment that I didn't have. (Gave me a check for $1,000 and I get to keep the equipment when done but have to slab up the wood for him. Someone else will actually be making the tables from the slabs.) I ordered some stuff that next night from Bailey's.

He calls me that next morning and asked, frantically, if I had already ordered anything. I said that I had and asked why he was asking.

He said that the city had hauled off the log.

Apparently, one of the local news stations ran a story about how run down the cemetary had gotten and that it even had dead trees just laying there. Guess that was too much pressure for the cemetary manager and he went ahead and got rid of it. Maybe a call from the mayor?

I called and canceled the order and the restaurant guy said he was going to go look in the dump that next afternoon. He called me back and said that he thought that he had found them. I went and looked at them the next morning and told him that it was indeed the log although now it was only 6' long.

I took 3 of the 5 pieces home that day with a little help from this:











































I went back the next day and picked up the other 2 pieces in my dump trailer.

Now today, I reordered the stuff from Bailey's as I'm very sure nobody is going to be moving those logs out of my front yard.

The guy is going to try to get the news crew to come film me milling some of it so they can do a follow up story about how the big historic tree was saved from the city dump.

More to come as I get busy.


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## BobL (Sep 2, 2009)

gr8scott72 said:


> I went and looked at them the next morning and told him that it was indeed the log although now it was only 6' long.



Dang! Dontcha just hate it when the do that.

Last year a fella rings me up, "I have a 48" log here you can have", "Great" I reply " . . but I better come have a look at it first". Turns out it was only 4' long!!!!


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## mtngun (Sep 2, 2009)

Nice score, Scott. I'm way jealous.

Your restaurant buddy does understand that the milled boards will have to dry before they can be made into tables ? Meanwhile, slap some sealer on those log ends.

Welcome to the elite milling club.

I'm looking forward to receiving my widescreen monitor so I can read these posts with imbedded 1024 pixel images without scrolling each and every line of text. :deadhorse:


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## gr8scott72 (Sep 3, 2009)

mtngun said:


> Nice score, Scott. I'm way jealous.
> 
> Your restaurant buddy does understand that the milled boards will have to dry before they can be made into tables ? Meanwhile, slap some sealer on those log ends.



The inverstor that he has, has a friend with a kiln to help speed things up.



mtngun said:


> Welcome to the elite milling club.



Thanks, very excited. I already have some other very sweet looking red oak logs ready to be milled. I was able to get one log that was 8.5'. The rest had to be chunked down pretty small as there wasn't much room between the shed, fence, and the other shed on that job. They are still between 3' and 4'.























mtngun said:


> I'm looking forward to receiving my widescreen monitor so I can read these posts with imbedded 1024 pixel images without scrolling each and every line of text. :deadhorse:



lol

24" widescreen here. 

Do you have a mouse scroll wheel? If so, you can hold Ctrl and roll the wheel down and it resizes the whole IE screen smaller. Shows the percentage in the lower right corner.

Edit: I guess you can just click the pull down menu if you don't have a scroll wheel.


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## excess650 (Sep 3, 2009)

The 30" MKIII will allow you to cut up to 29" wide at the max. Rails are available seperately, so you can get the longer ones when you discover that the 30" wasn't quite enough for the bigger logs. You'll need a bar 4"-6"longer than the nominal mill width.

I've cut some white oak and red elm up to 30" wide, and was limited by the 36" bar I have for my 36" MKIII. Truthfully, the 36" MKIII is about as large as I would want to use by myself.

A Granberg Mini Mill will make your task easier. Make a top cut with the Alaskan, then square the sides with the Mini Mill down to a manageable width without having to roll the log. This also eliminates bark, knots, and other obstacles.

I have some walnut to do here in the near future, and the butt log was 32"x42" across the stump when I cut it down. It'll take some judicious cuts with the Alaskan and Mini Mill prior to putting the pieces on the bandmill.

Don't forget to retune that 394 (richer and more oil) so as to not sieze when milling.


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## oldsaw (Sep 3, 2009)

You needed to order the 36" mill with a 42" bar. Other than that, have at it. One the pieces are dry, they can put two together to make tabletops if they want wider. 

Aggiewoodbutcher has a great post on how to do butterflies should they be interested.

A lot of CSM info on this site and plenty of guys to help

Mark


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## gr8scott72 (Sep 3, 2009)

oldsaw said:


> You needed to order the 36" mill with a 42" bar. Other than that, have at it. One the pieces are dry, they can put two together to make tabletops if they want wider.
> 
> Aggiewoodbutcher has a great post on how to do butterflies should they be interested.
> 
> ...



I ordered the 30" because I have a 32" bar for my 394 already. I plan on getting longer rails to be able to use the 60" bar I ordered.


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## gr8scott72 (Sep 3, 2009)

excess650 said:


> The 30" MKIII will allow you to cut up to 29" wide at the max. Rails are available seperately, so you can get the longer ones when you discover that the 30" wasn't quite enough for the bigger logs. You'll need a bar 4"-6"longer than the nominal mill width.
> 
> I've cut some white oak and red elm up to 30" wide, and was limited by the 36" bar I have for my 36" MKIII. Truthfully, the 36" MKIII is about as large as I would want to use by myself.
> 
> ...



I ordered the mini mill at the same time.

Order was $844.94!!!


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## mtngun (Sep 3, 2009)

gr8scott72 said:


> Do you have a mouse scroll wheel? If so, you can hold Ctrl and roll the wheel down and it resizes the whole IE screen smaller. Shows the percentage in the lower right corner.



Good tip !!! It works on Firefox, to, and beats scrolling !!! Thanks.


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## irishcountry (Sep 3, 2009)

Now that is a cool story!! Sweet score look FWD to seeing the pics and nice logs you got there!!


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## gr8scott72 (Sep 15, 2009)

Well, I got my stuff in Friday. Got to play around with it for awhile on Saturday before the rain got here. I then set up under the carport which was a good thing as it's been raining here alot recently. (Raining while I type.) Another good thing about the carport is being able to run a fan and keep those fumes off of me. I might have to change mix. That Stihl Ultra is good stuff but it will flat out choke you.

I ran about 1 gallon of mix thru the 394 on Saturday.

I didn't take any pictures as all I've done so far is slab a couple of the smaller red oak pieces that I had. I also don't have the long rails for the mill yet. I looked all over town and nobody had it, could order it, or knew where to get it. I finally just called Bailey's up and asked if they sold the rain seperatly. They do. Didn't like the price but oh well. $80 later, 56" rails are on the way.

I also just reordered some 105 drive link ripping chain. I ordered some the first time but mistakenly ordered for my 20" bar (72 drive links) instead of my 32" bar.

(Anybody need a couple of 72 drive link loops of ripping chain?)

All the stuff I did today and on Saturday was with some Stihl RSC full comp chain on the 32" bar as both pieces were too big for the 20" bar without taking the dawgs off my saw which I don't really want to do right now.

I used almost another gallon of mix today.

Oh, I got my 5 gallons of end sealer yesterday from Bailey's and plan on coating all the pieces I have in the morning. (Weather permitting.)

Gonna keep practicing with the small pieces untill the longer rails get here which will probably be Monday.

Can't wait to mount up that pretty new Woodsman Pro 60" bar and start slabbing up these huge pieces.

I'll try to get some pictures tomorrow as it is always more fun to read about if there's pretty pictures to go along with it.


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## woodsrunner (Sep 15, 2009)

FUN ain't it?

Scott


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## gr8scott72 (Sep 15, 2009)

woodsrunner said:


> FUN ain't it?
> 
> Scott



Several of the things in my life that are very hard work are very fun to me.

I'm tired.


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## BobL (Sep 15, 2009)

gr8scott72 said:


> Can't wait to mount up that pretty new Woodsman Pro 60" bar and start slabbing up these huge pieces.



How's your bar sag?


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## gr8scott72 (Sep 16, 2009)

BobL said:


> How's your bar sag?



Haven't really looked at it. Only used the 32". The 60" Woodsman Pro seems very solid though.


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## LAndrews (Sep 16, 2009)

gr8scott72 said:


> That Stihl Ultra is good stuff but it will flat out choke you.



Not like I want to get into a one-upping thing or whatever - but I promise it's a lot less nasty than castor fumes. A lot of time I'll wear a respirator to keep from having to breathe that crap. 

Glad to see another guy just going for it.


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## BobL (Sep 16, 2009)

Any chainsaw mill that has a forward/RHS pointing exhaust is not very user friendly.

In this picture you can see the standard forward facing exhaust (black) causes bounce back of the exhaust from the top of the log towards the operator or the operators legs. Because I lean on the wrap handle with my legs I find using a forward exhausted saw makes my chaps go all greasy and I also get a headache






Exhausts that face away from the log and operator (eg the grey exhaust) are far friendlier to use especially if the operator can get the wind behind them. This is one of the benefits of the older style saws like the 076. Newer saws like the 660/880 really benefit from a good muffler mod that do this as well.


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## excess650 (Sep 16, 2009)

gr8scott72 said:


> I ordered the mini mill at the same time.
> 
> Order was $844.94!!!



OUCH! :jawdrop:Those long WoodlandPro bars are pricey!


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## gr8scott72 (Sep 16, 2009)

excess650 said:


> OUCH! :jawdrop:Those long WoodlandPro bars are pricey!



That was the whole order. The WoodlandPro bar was $369 iirc.


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## woodsrunner (Sep 16, 2009)

gr8scott72 said:


> Several of the things in my life that are very hard work are very fun to me.
> 
> I'm tired.



I took a week of vacation last week. I spent the whole week with a chainsaw in my hand running ahead of an 850G dozer while we were building roads thru our timberland. That was my week of vacation. It was FUN! (Everyone here is kinda crazy you know. Everyone.:hmm3grin2orange

Scott


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## gr8scott72 (Sep 24, 2009)

I got my long mill rails in yesterday. I was milling a small piece so I finished that log then I started putting the 60" bar on the CS and the long rails on the mill. Got it all together and wouldn't you know, it started raining. Guess I'll start on these big logs in the morning.

Here's the 60" bar. You can see the extra oiler and additional hole in the end of the bar if you look close.










These were the other two logs that I got that day with the dump trailer.


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## BobL (Sep 25, 2009)

I assume A is the oil hole and C is their preferred bar end holder. This is a real pity because it means losing 6" or 10% of your cutting bar length compared with other possibilities. Even just moving the oil behind the bar end holder bolt hole would be better.






If you look in the milling sticky you can see ways of rejigging the outboard clamp to gain most of that lost bar length back. Also the oil does not need to come out through an oil hole on the bar, it can just drop onto the chain bar interface and it lubricates just as well.


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## Kicker_92 (Sep 25, 2009)

Bob, I think "C" is just the rivet to hold the sprocket tip on.

Nice bar! What type of chain are you planning on using for those stumps? Any plans for cleaning out the grit before cutting them?


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## gr8scott72 (Sep 25, 2009)

Kicker_92 said:


> Bob, I think "C" is just the rivet to hold the sprocket tip on.
> 
> Nice bar! What type of chain are you planning on using for those stumps? Any plans for cleaning out the grit before cutting them?



You are correct. C is the rivit to hold the end on.

The wood is actually very clean. I'm using the ripping chain from Bailey's.


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## mtngun (Sep 25, 2009)

BobL said:


> Also the oil does not need to come out through an oil hole on the bar, it can just drop onto the chain bar interface and it lubricates just as well.



Scott, it is spilt milk now, since you have already drilled the bar, but in the future, I'd do as BobL suggested and dribble auxilary oil onto the bar nose, rather than using the oil fitting supplied by Granberg. 

The Granberg fitting is prone to plug up with saw dust during all-day milling sessions, plus it has to be moved whenever you flip the bar. Mine would plug up all the time so I got tired of it and switched to a dribble oiler.

The dribble oiler does not need to be precisely placed, because gravity and vibration will distribute the oil to the chain. As long as oil dribbles anywhere on the nose, it'll get the job done.

Impressive saw, by the way.


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## gr8scott72 (Sep 25, 2009)

mtngun said:


> Scott, it is spilt milk now, since you have already drilled the bar, but in the future, I'd do as BobL suggested and dribble auxilary oil onto the bar nose, rather than using the oil fitting supplied by Granberg.
> 
> The Granberg fitting is prone to plug up with saw dust during all-day milling sessions, plus it has to be moved whenever you flip the bar. Mine would plug up all the time so I got tired of it and switched to a dribble oiler.
> 
> ...



Well, live and learn.


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## gr8scott72 (Sep 25, 2009)

FIrst attemp on a big log. Not as hard as I imagined. The wood is smoother than the picture would indicate. Funny what shows up in a picture.


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## mtngun (Sep 25, 2009)

Beautiful grain ! ! ! I'm way jealous.


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## BobL (Sep 25, 2009)

I agree grain looks great!  

Pour some water on the slab and that will highlight the grain even more - BTW you will NEVER see it those colours again ever.

The stripes across slabs like in your photo can be caused by many things, like the mill jamming up against the side of the log, or even just the operator pausing to add wedges, or reposition their feet, or their hands on the mill. Another cause is lumps and bumps on the surface the mill rails are riding on and is why I always use log rails (Another good reason to use rails is described below)

Assuming the log rail surface is clean and smooth, to further help reduce these stripes the operator needs to run the mill as smoothly as possible down the log. Adding wheels to the mill helps reduce the mill bogging down on the side of the log. I try to continually keep a constant pressure on the saw by leaning on the saw/mill with my hip/legs/knee whenever I want to move my arms. If the log is on a slope then better still, lock the throttle and let it keep cutting. I even preposition wedges and a hammer along the top of the log between the log rails and I do not stop to add wedges - I lock the throttle, lean on the saw with my leg and keep mill while I add wedges. However, wide logs are a problem. If you do need to stop resist the urge to slam the saw WOT back into the cut and instead accelerate the saw smoothly back into the cut.


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## gr8scott72 (Sep 25, 2009)

BobL said:


> I agree grain looks great!
> 
> Pour some water on the slab and that will highlight the grain even more - BTW you will NEVER see it those colours again ever.
> 
> ...




Good post.

I did realize that they were probably caused by not being smooth and I tried (and succeeded) to be smoother on the following cuts.

It is hard with a big bar to ease back into the cut as the saw is either bogging and not turning or spinning full speed.

Got lots more pictures. Coming right up!!


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## gr8scott72 (Sep 25, 2009)




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## gr8scott72 (Sep 25, 2009)




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## dpscott (Sep 25, 2009)

*---*

Thats SWEET.


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## mdavlee (Sep 25, 2009)

Very nice work.


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## BobL (Sep 25, 2009)

Great wood and great pics Scot! 
The sawdust sure seems to be pouring nicely out of the saw!

If your saw is bogging down on the side of the log, wheels on the inboard side of the mill will improve this quite a bit - if you want to know more do a search for my nick and "wheels".
Another quick and dirty improvement for standard Granberg style mill is this simple mod made from a bit of pipe.





I realise this might sound critical but I really do want to help improve your productivity.

I used to use my arms and back (and still sometimes do) but now even just looking at these and similar pics give me a back/shoulder ache 








I can see straight away your arms are too wide apart and you are bending over too far. You are probably young enough not too notice too much but if you want to feel better at the end of a milling day there are much better stances that you can take.

Whenever I can I take up the stance shown in these pics. 








My arms do little or no pushing - they just guide the mill. The saw should self feed but if there is any pushing it's done by my leg/hip/knee in contact with the top of the wrap handle on the saw.
A more upright stance like this is only possible with more upright handles. One can always slip a cable tie over the throttle and move their left arm up to the wrap handle. This closes the operator's arms and gets them more upright.

When the log is too/big high I lock my arms straight and lean my 260 lb onto the saw like this.





Anyway - this is just my observation - I still like seeing any milling pics so please keep posting - they're great pics.

Cheers


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## Andrew96 (Sep 26, 2009)

Scot...looks like you had fun and produced some outstanding results. 
BobL, nice review of the ergonomics of milling. Do you use your unistrut on the top of every cut? Is it just to produce a good finish/straight slab.


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## BobL (Sep 26, 2009)

Andrew96 said:


> BobL, nice review of the ergonomics of milling. Do you use your unistrut on the top of every cut? Is it just to produce a good finish/straight slab.



Usually I do use the unistrut, for a whole lot of reasons

1) I can start the mill on the rails so I don't have to carry a running mill.
2) It's much easier to start and exit a cut on rails
3) I let the power head cool off while sitting on the rails at the end of the cut
4) My mill rails are HDPE lined so friction between the mill rails and unistrut is less than direct onto the rough sawn surface
5) I can correct any minor twisting (thread)

Using my rails limits me to about a 1.5" cut so if I want to mill thinner boards I do have a 3/4" set of rails but I usually go rail-less!


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## Andrew96 (Sep 27, 2009)

BobL...just when I thought I had a good system in mind...you give me 5 good points and another thread to read. Great Ideas...I too have an angle gauge just like yours...of course..never thought about using it like you did. 
I hate to hijack the thread (sorry scot)...but it looks like your unistrut is bolted to the angle plate at the butt of the log...but you use bolts (I assume ground with points on the end) to position the angle plate at the correct height/twist. With both ends of your unistrut held like this..you could jam the bolts into the end of the log and you are good to go. I have been screwing them into the log end..though that requires another tool on site(screw driver..or cordless drill). Does your system work fine for your long/wide cuts and vibration? Have you changed to something else? On some photos I see wing nuts holding your unistrut together.....others nuts. Did you change for vibration issues?


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## BobL (Sep 27, 2009)

Andrew96 said:


> Great Ideas...I too have an angle gauge just like yours...of course..never thought about using it like you did.


Cheers Andrew.

I now use the angle finder a little differently than shown in those pics. It is really important to have a side vertical face of the gauge hard up against the side of the unistrut when measuring the horizontal angle or else it will not be accurately measuring the log rail / slab twist. Like this picture below. AS long as your reference is the side of the rail it will be accurate.








> ...but it looks like your unistrut is bolted to the angle plate at the butt of the log...but you use bolts (I assume ground with points on the end to position the angle plate at the correct height/twist. With both ends of your unistrut held like this you could jam the bolts into the end of the log and you are good to go.


Correct



> I have been screwing them into the log end..though that requires another tool on site(screw driver..or cordless drill).


I do use screws but generally only in situations like this to get the first flat surface. After the first full length flat surface in obtained then I lay the log rails onto the cut surface of the log and support the unistrut with wedges if needed. 
In this case below I cut about 4 slabs before reverting to just the log rails. The green painted two-stand thingo that is screwed to the end of the log is made from C section and has a height adjustable cross rail that can be bolted level and firmly into place to support the unistrut log rails in awkward situations like these.




and this




Once a flat parallel surface is achieved I only use the pointy 5/16" bolts on the ends to hold the log rails in place.



> Does your system work fine for your long/wide cuts and vibration?


The unistrut log rails work best with maximum support underneath them - like the first pic I posted above. If I have to span more than about 3 ft, I either provide added support where I can or wear the fact that slab is going to be non parallel and correct the problem on the next cut.



> Have you changed to something else? On some photos I see wing nuts holding your unistrut together.....others nuts. Did you change for vibration issues?


The best example of my current set up is the first pic above. Dome nuts are used to lock the 3/8 all-thread separators to the unistrut on the inboard side of the log rails. Wingnuts are used on the all-thread separators on the outboard side because the unistrut separation depends on the log width. I also use wingnuts to lock the pointed 5/16 bolts onto the angle iron endplates.

There are of course many other ways of doing this - I guess you have to try thing out for your self and see what works for you.


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