# Are Loggers Making 3 Times More Money Now That Lumbers Prices Have Tripled?



## under_the_hill (Mar 11, 2021)

I've been watching lumber prices over the past year and I'm trying to figure out where the price increases are coming from. Some people say that Covid restrictions made mills run at lower capacity, especially the places the pressure treat lumber. Others have said that mills are simply holding back inventory to keep prices high and make money. Dollar inflation was another explanation I heard.

What are loggers seeing over the past year? Are you getting paid 3 times as much for logs now that lumber is 3 times as expensive? Are mills running at capacity again?


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## northmanlogging (Mar 12, 2021)

well... get a cup of coffee and try to keep up lol 

politics hooped us around here, the export market is all but gone, this is a direct result of former pres trumps trade war with china, over the summer prices nearly hit the lowest I've seen since I started logging. Several mills closed outright. One mill had had a fire and was temporarily shut down anyway, Covid didn't help them much, they are up and running again but at reduced capacity. Point being that without a strong export market, domestic timber gets flooded so prices are still down some, except cedar, cedar is going bananas. As it is, prices are still low, with the demand being what it is we can easily keep the mills slam full until the export market opens up again, which frankly isn't likely anytime soon as China is now buying wood from Russia, and Australia. Though there is still a Japan market and Korean market, its not nearly as robust as the china market was. Note: I try to avoid politics here as much as possible, however these are simple facts, If you don't believe me spend a couple hours listening to the local log buyers complain about it. 

Most of the mills here are churning out wood as fast as they can, but also, logging and forestry products where considered essential, so we all kept right on working through the shut downs. Which in the end may of bit us a little bit, cause the log yards are full, and its the end of winter... 

Several of the very large timber producers the SP's, and Weyco's shut down for a few months, which helped bring log prices back to something more like normal. 

Couple of other things to consider, many Canadian mills are or were shut down on account of a general strike, so a lot of the wood they would of cut, has been diverted here, also keeping our log prices low. A lot of building projects were put on hold during the summer months of 2020, because of Covid, partly because permitting was a nightmare with county/city agencies being furloughed, partly because of the general lock downs, so now all them projects are finally starting to catch up, been an awful lot of framing going on in the winter months around here, and I ass-u-me around the country. this puts abnormal strain on the shipping/trucking side of timber markets, lumber yards generally stock up during the summer months, but now they are running low, and trucking in winter is a PITA to begin with, couple that with an overall lack of CDL drivers... well its just simple logistics. And you have all the homeowners, that are finally at home long enough to think about improvement projects and getting around to building that deck and rebuilding the fence, which is really driving the demand hard at the moment. Not to mention all the new projects that would normally start about now anyway, also all the damage from hurricanes, ice storms etc etc etc has been worse then normal over 2020 so folks have to rebuild too. 

Last but not least, and likely the main reason for lumber being expensive, too many mills have closed over the years, and simply can not keep up with the current housing boom, they got logs, but they simply don't have the production capacity. Much like ammo, Federal/CCI etc are running 24hrs a day 7 days a week, and its simply not enough to keep up.


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## under_the_hill (Mar 13, 2021)

northmanlogging said:


> well... get a cup of coffee and try to keep up lol
> 
> politics hooped us around here, the export market is all but gone, this is a direct result of former pres trumps trade war with china, over the summer prices nearly hit the lowest I've seen since I started logging. Several mills closed outright. One mill had had a fire and was temporarily shut down anyway, Covid didn't help them much, they are up and running again but at reduced capacity. Point being that without a strong export market, domestic timber gets flooded so prices are still down some, except cedar, cedar is going bananas. As it is, prices are still low, with the demand being what it is we can easily keep the mills slam full until the export market opens up again, which frankly isn't likely anytime soon as China is now buying wood from Russia, and Australia. Though there is still a Japan market and Korean market, its not nearly as robust as the china market was. Note: I try to avoid politics here as much as possible, however these are simple facts, If you don't believe me spend a couple hours listening to the local log buyers complain about it.
> 
> ...


Thank you, great information.

I can understand that starting a new ammo manufacturing plant would be full of red tape, but what stops people from starting new lumber mills? Do you think new mills will pop up with prices this high?


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## slowp (Mar 13, 2021)

Would the fire salvage be helping the glut go on a bit? Forests in W. Oregon burned last year.


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## northmanlogging (Mar 13, 2021)

under_the_hill said:


> Thank you, great information.
> 
> I can understand that starting a new ammo manufacturing plant would be full of red tape, but what stops people from starting new lumber mills? Do you think new mills will pop up with prices this high?


more or less the same problems, machinery is expensive, all the old stuff has been scrapped or sold over seas.

not to mention all the good locations are office buildings now


slowp said:


> Would the fire salvage be helping the glut go on a bit? Forests in W. Oregon burned last year.


that is true. at least as far as what is being allowed to get salvaged

a lot of the Aus stuff is fire salvage as well.


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## 2dogs (Mar 14, 2021)

Around these parts log prices (redwood) are very low due to fire salvage. Black logs matter. Much of the land that burned was owned by the timber companies so those are logged first. 

If you haven't been effected yet in your area diesel prices have gone up greatly. Road diesel is pushing $4.00/ gallon.


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## slowp (Mar 15, 2021)

You should see the sad little Ponderosa Pine that is being salvaged here. It's from a poor site, but got fried, so it is going down the road. Then, from a fire several years ago, I am seeing blued pine recently cut and decked. I wonder what the profit margin is on these? 

I look at this with skepticism after working in a Doug-fir happy tree/good logging area for so long.


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## northmanlogging (Mar 16, 2021)

slowp said:


> You should see the sad little Ponderosa Pine that is being salvaged here. It's from a poor site, but got fried, so it is going down the road. Then, from a fire several years ago, I am seeing blued pine recently cut and decked. I wonder what the profit margin is on these?
> 
> I look at this with skepticism after working in a Doug-fir happy tree/good logging area for so long.


Ick?

Not many will even buy pine at the moment, maybe some mills over your way, but they pay less then cotton weeds for pine over here. Cotton weeds being subsistence logging only, covers fuel and mortgage, and a few bills but little else.


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## slowp (Mar 16, 2021)

northmanlogging said:


> Ick?
> 
> Not many will even buy pine at the moment, maybe some mills over your way, but they pay less then cotton weeds for pine over here. Cotton weeds being subsistence logging only, covers fuel and mortgage, and a few bills but little else.


There are some one guy milling operations scattered about. They might be doing some custom work, but I can only guess cuz I don't know. I do ride my bike past one little milling operation. Maybe I should slow down and try to see what is in his deck.

I did buy some Vaagen Bros. softwood chips to scatter around my blueberry plants. The chips smell good. Vaagens have a mill in Collville and used to have a mill in Republic. Now all that is left in Republic are concrete slabs.


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## ElevatorGuy (Mar 16, 2021)

The prices for p.t. Lumber is insane. I’m getting ready to tear down a deck. I’ll replace it with a concrete patio.


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## homemade (Mar 16, 2021)

under_the_hill said:


> Thank you, great information.
> 
> I can understand that starting a new ammo manufacturing plant would be full of red tape, but what stops people from starting new lumber mills? Do you think new mills will pop up with prices this high?



No only is the equipment and location hard to come by, the time a plant does get built, skilled workers to run it, and input/output of product, the market usually will stabilize before the plant will be profitable. Then there will be a lull in housing or timber regs will slow cutting..... and the new timber mill will close because the old one that was always chugging along, will be all they need to keep up with supply and demand. 

Some problems can’t be solved by throwing money at it, just need time. You can’t get the corn ready to be harvested by planting more corn. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## northmanlogging (Mar 17, 2021)

homemade said:


> No only is the equipment and location hard to come by, the time a plant does get built, skilled workers to run it, and input/output of product, the market usually will stabilize before the plant will be profitable. Then there will be a lull in housing or timber regs will slow cutting..... and the new timber mill will close because the old one that was always chugging along, will be all they need to keep up with supply and demand.
> 
> Some problems can’t be solved by throwing money at it, just need time. You can’t get the corn ready to be harvested by planting more corn.
> 
> ...


Facts. 

There are several mills around here, that started out as one man and a portable mill, not even all that long ago, that now have most of a proper mill going, shipping wood all over the country etc

It is possible to work up slowly and fill a demand, and there will always be a demand for wood products. I just takes some ambition and a game plan for the long run. 

One of those former portable mills, is currently expanding, adding an oversize saw, they currently have 2 saws running more or less full time, with a rotary debarker, green chain, kiln, chip storage, 2 log loaders, several of their own delivery trucks. and would probably have more shifts if they could find reliable help. I've been told they recently bought out a local lumber store chain, so not only do they mill the wood, they then sell it retail all over the state. 

Sadly one of my favorite mills ended up closing a couple years ago, 2 brothers built it from scratch, literally, and was a great mill to send logs, but the brothers retired, and the dude they sold it too (for a song BTW) had a habit of not paying the loggers. So we all stopped sending wood to him. Towards the end he started calling even small timers like me and begging for logs... But can't send logs if you ain't going to send a check...

In the local papers he blamed the local homeless mission for "thefts and break ins" etc. Reality is the prick wouldn't pay anyone.

I still occasionally see one of the brothers helping fix stuff at some of the smaller mills around. Seems like retirement isn't any fun for him, as its usually an extended BS session while little to no actual progress is made until after he leaves... or maybe its me?

Most of the equipment was auctioned off, and you can still see some of it in use, like a custom chain saw mill for splitting oversize logs (12' bar on it powered by a 20hp? electric motor) thing is wicked cool, or the custom built chipper hopper... cool stuff


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## softdown (May 21, 2021)

The huge sawmills are cleaning up right now - think GP and Weyerhauser etc. The retail stores make a little more since they add maybe 25% to $6 instead of $2.50. 

The suppliers are receiving less than they used to after inflation is accounted for. Once again - the money trickles up.


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## Tree Feller (Jun 4, 2021)

Over 3 billion dollars of the USA lumber industry is due to exports of China. During the pandemic and other reasons, China cut back on importing our lumber/ trees. That one of the main reasons!


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## Ripandsplit (Jun 5, 2021)

Well a lot of fellas round here making good money out of saw grade logs mainly local tho, not sure how exports is going tho I can say not as good as it was. Has been rumblings of another big chipper getting put in to but I believe it won't accept logs off small contractors , which leaves me to ponder who is buying the chip ? Export again perhaps . We shall see I suppose


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## softdown (Jun 5, 2021)

Tree Feller said:


> Over 3 billion dollars of the USA lumber industry is due to exports of China. During the pandemic and other reasons, China cut back on importing our lumber/ trees. That one of the main reasons!


Decreased demand from China should lower prices. The increased demand from new homes and home improvement frenzy had increased prices.
Supply and demand. Econ 101


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## ElevatorGuy (Jun 5, 2021)

ElevatorGuy said:


> The prices for p.t. Lumber is insane. I’m getting ready to tear down a deck. I’ll replace it with a concrete patio.


I did it, 10x14 deck gone. 12x26 patio done, screw the lumber guys (whoever is responsible for the price gouging)


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## northmanlogging (Jun 6, 2021)

Tree Feller said:


> Over 3 billion dollars of the USA lumber industry is due to exports of China. During the pandemic and other reasons, China cut back on importing our lumber/ trees. That one of the main reasons!





softdown said:


> Decreased demand from China should lower prices. The increased demand from new homes and home improvement frenzy had increased prices.
> Supply and demand. Econ 101


China cut timber imports in July/Aug of 2019, months before Covid 19 was even known about. 

They did so in retaliation to #45's "easily winnable trade war"

China then began buying wood from Australia, and Russia, mostly Russia, should I remind you that Covid only became a problem in FEB of 2020. 

Should I mention that at least 2 mills shut their doors around here because of this? Not to mention horrible log prices, and loads off laid of employees at the mills that did manage to stay afloat, only to then get hammered by Covid. 

Please try not to make **** up. (you're "other reasons" has one person to blame. it sits squarely in his lap)

Also, so far China hasn't really started buying wood from the US again, and likely never will. They are buying a little, but nothing like before Aug 2019. 

Just one more thing... Not only did china stop buying wood, they sent 2 ships (entire ******* Cargo ships) back without paying for them, both from one exporter, I know this cause the checks they were sending to me bounced, it took months to sort it out, and they are one of the mills that shut down over it.


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## softdown (Jun 6, 2021)

Has anything good come out of China? From a guy who took a huge hit due to Chinese druwall in his house. Their manufacturing pride is among the lowest.


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## northmanlogging (Jun 6, 2021)

softdown said:


> Has anything good come out of China? From a guy who took a huge hit due to Chinese druwall in his house. Their manufacturing pride is among the lowest.


Lithium ION batteries, LED lights, Chow Mein, Harbor Freight, A **** LOAD OF EXPORT MONEY for the US. An intercontinental rail road, Affordable tools, 1/2 the parts for a Harley Davidson. Affordable solar panels. A thriving scrap iron market. 

Its on the consumer as to how much they want to spend, the fact that the market is currently flooded with cheap junk only proves that the final consumer doesn't care about quality, only function or more often form. China is merely profiting on our own poor choices, start demanding better quality and I'm sure that China, much like Japan in the 60's will respond with better products. Vote with your money etc.


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## softdown (Jun 6, 2021)

northmanlogging said:


> Lithium ION batteries, LED lights, Chow Mein, Harbor Freight, A **** LOAD OF EXPORT MONEY for the US. An intercontinental rail road, Affordable tools, 1/2 the parts for a Harley Davidson. Affordable solar panels. A thriving scrap iron market.
> 
> Its on the consumer as to how much they want to spend, the fact that the market is currently flooded with cheap junk only proves that the final consumer doesn't care about quality, only function or more often form. China is merely profiting on our own poor choices, start demanding better quality and I'm sure that China, much like Japan in the 60's will respond with better products. Vote with your money etc.


Half those benefits prove my point. Stop blaming the innocent kids, our government steered the nation into this abyss, i mean mess.

We had a leader doing something about it. Same group threw him under the buss.


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## northmanlogging (Jun 6, 2021)

softdown said:


> Half those benefits prove my point. Stop blaming the innocent kids, our government steered the nation into this abyss, i mean mess.
> 
> We had a leader doing something about it. Same group threw him under the buss.


You clearly have no concept of how any of this works do you? Just keep repeating what someone else has told you was wrong, don't look into it for yourself, kinda guy that takes a car to the shop and goes ahead and has the axles replaced cause the brakes were bad, but the mechanic said etc etc etc.


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## Tree Feller (Jun 7, 2021)

northmanlogging said:


> China cut timber imports in July/Aug of 2019, months before Covid 19 was even known about.
> 
> They did so in retaliation to #45's "easily winnable trade war"
> 
> ...


I did not make anything up! China slowed down on importing our lumber regardless of the reason!


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## northmanlogging (Jun 7, 2021)

Tree Feller said:


> I did not make anything up! China slowed down on importing our lumber regardless of the reason!


You made the assertion it was due to Covid. "among other reasons" 

I feel its important to note that Covid was 6-7 months AFTER china stopped buying timber from the US, and there is only one reason, not the plural, just one moron game show host with a bone to pick. Thinking inter economy trade deals are the same thing as swindling college students out of tuition money.


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## Piotr Pakula (Jun 8, 2021)

If they only have their own wood and find a buyer ;-)


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## gyp69 (Jun 8, 2021)

northmanlogging said:


> You clearly have no concept of how any of this works do you? Just keep repeating what someone else has told you was wrong, don't look into it for yourself, kinda guy that takes a car to the shop and goes ahead and has the axles replaced cause the brakes were bad, but the mechanic said etc etc etc.





northmanlogging said:


> You made the assertion it was due to Covid. "among other reasons"
> 
> I feel its important to note that Covid was 6-7 months AFTER china stopped buying timber from the US, and there is only one reason, not the plural, just one moron game show host with a bone to pick. Thinking inter economy trade deals are the same thing as swindling college students out of tuition money.


If only that bad orange man had behaved more like Hunter,James & Joe & just got in bed with them that would have been great! The fact is every American should have a bone to pick with China. Sawmills,loggers & farmers were most definitely hurt by tariffs but a lot of them were still up for the fight, I saw more than one harvesting crew in Montana flying Trump flags on Combines & grain trucks. I personally was a couple weeks away from flying to Alaska before I got a call & was told to hold off. But we will never have a chance to even the playing field again, if people only knew how China has control over us,they steal and cheat to no end, they even control our pharmaceuticals they control 90% of the raw ingredients of our medications. Our politicians have put us in a ditch we will never overcome, but I’m sure kamalatoe will stand up to them and the guy who likes to hold and fondle little girls & doesn’t have the strength to walk up steps without being blown over by the wind.Now you can write a long winded essay about how stupid I am and show off your superior intellect.


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## northmanlogging (Jun 8, 2021)

gyp69 said:


> If only that bad orange man had behaved more like Hunter,James & Joe & just got in bed with them that would have been great! The fact is every American should have a bone to pick with China. Sawmills,loggers & farmers were most definitely hurt by tariffs but a lot of them were still up for the fight, I saw more than one harvesting crew in Montana flying Trump flags on Combines & grain trucks. I personally was a couple weeks away from flying to Alaska before I got a call & was told to hold off. But we will never have a chance to even the playing field again, if people only knew how China has control over us,they steal and cheat to no end, they even control our pharmaceuticals they control 90% of the raw ingredients of our medications. Our politicians have put us in a ditch we will never overcome, but I’m sure kamalatoe will stand up to them and the guy who likes to hold and fondle little girls & doesn’t have the strength to walk up steps without being blown over by the wind.Now you can write a long winded essay about how stupid I am and show off your superior intellect.


I would, but I don't believe you would listen. Dude had 4 years to at least pretend like he gave a ****, instead of playin golf 3 days a week, padding ivanka's bank accounts and swindling the likes of you, and countless other folks that feel believe conmen are here to help you.


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## Tree Feller (Jun 8, 2021)

northmanlogging said:


> I would, but I don't believe you would listen. Dude had 4 years to at least pretend like he gave a ****, instead of playin golf 3 days a week, padding ivanka's bank accounts and swindling the likes of you, and countless other folks that feel believe conmen are here to help you.


Did you just describe Obama!!!??


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## gyp69 (Jun 9, 2021)

northmanlogging said:


> I would, but I don't believe you would listen. Dude had 4 years to at least pretend like he gave a ****, instead of playin golf 3 days a week, padding ivanka's bank accounts and swindling the likes of you, and countless other folks that feel believe conmen are here to help you.


Swindle the likes of me? LOL I sure felt swindled paying less for fuel, gas, groceries etc.You and your ilk believe everyone who supported Trump are a bunch of uninformed rubes. First Trump didn’t take a salary, he actually did work hard on behalf of the working American he didn’t play golf three times a week. I didn’t vote for Trump the first time but couldn’t wait to vote for him the second time! I didn’t care for Trumps bragging & other character traits, didn’t agree with him on some things,but talk about a guy that was treated unfairly by lying people like msnbc, cnn etc with their 98% negative coverage compared to Obama & Biden kid glove coverage and questions,what flavor ice cream do you have Joe? Holdovers from the Obama administration leaking lies to their fellow comrades, fake inquiries I could go on and on. The Trump family lost money while he was in office. Unlike Joe sending his crackhead son to China and the Ukraine for big paydays! How bout Maxine Waters telling people if you see someone who works for Trump at the grocery store or at a gas station to get in their face and tell them they are not welcome wtf! You are right about one thing I’m not really interested in anything you have to say but do respect your right to say it.


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## northmanlogging (Jun 9, 2021)

gyp69 said:


> Swindle the likes of me? LOL I sure felt swindled paying less for fuel, gas, groceries etc.You and your ilk believe everyone who supported Trump are a bunch of uninformed rubes. First Trump didn’t take a salary, he actually did work hard on behalf of the working American he didn’t play golf three times a week. I didn’t vote for Trump the first time but couldn’t wait to vote for him the second time! I didn’t care for Trumps bragging & other character traits, didn’t agree with him on some things,but talk about a guy that was treated unfairly by lying people like msnbc, cnn etc with their 98% negative coverage compared to Obama & Biden kid glove coverage and questions,what flavor ice cream do you have Joe? Holdovers from the Obama administration leaking lies to their fellow comrades, fake inquiries I could go on and on. The Trump family lost money while he was in office. Unlike Joe sending his crackhead son to China and the Ukraine for big paydays! How bout Maxine Waters telling people if you see someone who works for Trump at the grocery store or at a gas station to get in their face and tell them they are not welcome wtf! You are right about one thing I’m not really interested in anything you have to say but do respect your right to say it.


Your biases are showing.

Do some due diligence and prove any of these claims.


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## gyp69 (Jun 9, 2021)

I could say the same to you, how much padding did he do for Ivankas bank account etc etc? Who would you have preferred to run the country? I most definitely feel swindled by Al Gore, John Kerry all these Global warming elites! Let me rephrase (feel) with am being swindled!


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## softdown (Jun 9, 2021)

northmanlogging said:


> You clearly have no concept of how any of this works do you? Just keep repeating what someone else has told you was wrong, don't look into it for yourself, kinda guy that takes a car to the shop and goes ahead and has the axles replaced cause the brakes were bad, but the mechanic said etc etc etc.


The real issue is that i know exactly how this works. Econ and Int Relations major as well as reading a couple thousands books. Books written before the Rise and Reign of Ingsoc. Prior to the purge of Truth and Common Sense. Prior to the Rise and Reign of pointy headed academians completely void of the faintest remnant of common sense or applied history.


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## northmanlogging (Jun 9, 2021)

Common sense isn't very common. 

I believe that far to many people do not remember things well or clearly, so its pretty easy to make them believe anything you want, simply by leaving a few words out, changing the context slightly, then poof, you've gaslit 33% of an entire country, who then goes forth spewing the same nonsense and getting upset when someone points out their fallacies. Like a child scolded for doing something wrong, will lash out in anger rather then correct the mistake. 

Worse though, is an unwillingness for rational people to correct those that are wrong (because its rude don't you know... and read that part about the kid reacting in anger)


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## northmanlogging (Jun 9, 2021)

gyp69 said:


> I could say the same to you, how much padding did he do for Ivankas bank account etc etc? Who would you have preferred to run the country? I most definitely feel swindled by Al Gore, John Kerry all these Global warming elites! Let me rephrase (feel) with am being swindled!


Annd we have avoiding the truth for $500 alex...
This only works if you do your own due diligence. Look the beasty in the eye then tell me how ******* good he is.


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## gyp69 (Jun 10, 2021)

gyp69 said:


> This coming from a guy who throws insults and personal attacks in nearly every rebuttal lol. Go back & read your posts look in the mirror & look at that guy staring back at you and say (because it’s rude don’t you know...and the part about the kid reacting in anger) I have no mistake to correct, & I’m sure not angry.


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## Husky Man (Jun 10, 2021)

northmanlogging said:


> Annd we have avoiding the truth for $500 alex...
> This only works if you do your own due diligence. Look the beasty in the eye then tell me how ******* good he is.


Do you Really Believe that our country is Better off with Kamela in the White House, than we would have been, if Trump had been given the Win that he Legitimately had?

But I suppose that you do believe the Big Lie that Biden actually won the Election.

In just what regards do you really think that you are any better off than you would have been under Trump?

Doug


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## Gologit (Jun 10, 2021)

I sure hate to see this. I signed in to see what logging prices were doing but all I found was a bunch of grown men bickering like children.
It reminds me why I don't do social media, including this place, much anymore.


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## gyp69 (Jun 10, 2021)

Gologit said:


> I sure hate to see this. I signed in to see what logging prices were doing but all I found was a bunch of grown men bickering like children.
> It reminds me why I don't do social media, including this place, much anymore.


I don’t do social media either, sometimes you just respond to something you don’t agree with and the next thing you know this happens. I will shut up!


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## Husky Man (Jun 10, 2021)

Gologit said:


> I sure hate to see this. I signed in to see what logging prices were doing but all I found was a bunch of grown men bickering like children.
> It reminds me why I don't do social media, including this place, much anymore.


I Totally Understand that the industry and Politics are intertwined, there is no avoiding that. Someone else, uhm, cough, made it a LOT more Political than it had to be, and myself and others, weren’t going to sit by and let that go unanswered, and by our silence essentially say that the Lie was Truth 

Doug


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## Husky Man (Jun 10, 2021)

gyp69 said:


> I don’t do social media either, sometimes you just respond to something you don’t agree with and the next thing you know this happens. I will shut up!


Don’t be afraid to Speak the TRUTH, even though the cancel culture will try to bully you into silence 

Doug


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## frank_ (Jun 10, 2021)

ha ha


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## Husky Man (Jun 10, 2021)

frank_ said:


> ha ha
> 
> View attachment 911590


And yet, here you are replying in the thread.

Hmmm, does that make you wonder about yourself???

Maybe it Should 


Doug


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## northmanlogging (Jun 10, 2021)

ya all speak of truth, while bandying about hearsay...


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## Husky Man (Jun 10, 2021)

northmanlogging said:


> ya all speak of truth, while bandying about hearsay...


Spoken by the unbiased pillar of Virtue 

If there is nothing to see, why are the Dems fighting so hard to keep anyone from looking ???

Speaking of looking, there were multiple tally locations that they wouldn’t let anyone but Dems watch what was going on, but hey there couldn’t have been anything Unusual happening there, now could there have been?????

Doug


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## northmanlogging (Jun 11, 2021)

Husky Man said:


> Spoken by the unbiased pillar of Virtue
> 
> If there is nothing to see, why are the Dems fighting so hard to keep anyone from looking ???
> 
> ...


Ok, now your just making **** up or repeating some crap you heard some other moron say.

I'm done here, you keep deflecting rather then educate yourself, or worse pulling the "what about shizz" usually with some easily disproven allegation.

Keep blaming the Dems and probably immigrants for all your woes, rather then look at the root cause.

IF you still believe after MONTHS of recounts, and lawsuits that the ellection was stolen, you're simply too ****ing dumb to even try to educate.


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## slowp (Jun 16, 2021)

Whilst in travel mode listening to the radio, I heard a report that lumber prices may have peaked. Should you want prices to come down, get vaccinated. If mill workers stay well, lumber is produced, and for everybody to stay well, vaccination is necessary. Simple.

Now waiting for the anti-vax trolls to appear and post their nonsense.


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## gyp69 (Jun 19, 2021)

Awesome! I got vaccinated the first chance I got.I am glad lumber prices will come down because of people getting vaccinated, is this going to work for fuel & gasoline & steel as well?


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## softdown (Jun 19, 2021)

northmanlogging said:


> Ok, now your just making **** up or repeating some crap you heard some other moron say.
> 
> I'm done here, you keep deflecting rather then educate yourself, or worse pulling the "what about shizz" usually with some easily disproven allegation.
> 
> ...


Could you be more arrogant? That would be something to behold. You sound more like an MSNBC/CNN script writer than a logger.


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## softdown (Jun 19, 2021)

gyp69 said:


> Awesome! I got vaccinated the first chance I got.I am glad lumber prices will come down because of people getting vaccinated, is this going to work for fuel & gasoline & steel as well?


I suspect fuel will continue to rise at rapid rates, steel at current rates - I have not studied steel pricing history to be fair. 

You think lumber prices tumbled because of vaccinations? They were skyrocketing until now - vaccinations started some time ago.


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## gyp69 (Jun 19, 2021)

My attempt at sarcasm, of course lumber prices have nothing to do with vaccinations, nor do the other things we have discussed.


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## slowp (Jun 19, 2021)

How about thinking before typing a "reply"? If you read the item put out by Hampton, and think a bit and you've got to believe that Covid is real, you will realize that lumber production decreased or came to a halt because mills shut down due to Covid. Remember? Meanwhile, folks staying home, because of Covid started remodeling and building, and using.......lumber.

The virus hasn't gone away. In fact, it is predicted that the India variant will cause problems this fall for the unvaccinated. If the next variant runs rampant because so many potential virus hosts did not get vaccinated, history will repeat. Shortages will happen again. So, maybe you might could be proactive and get vaccinated if you care about such things. Maybe it won't be so bad because so many of us did get vaccinated. Time will tell.


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## slowp (Jun 19, 2021)

softdown said:


> I suspect fuel will continue to rise at rapid rates, steel at current rates - I have not studied steel pricing history to be fair.
> 
> You think lumber prices tumbled because of vaccinations? They were skyrocketing until now - vaccinations started some time ago.


Of course. Lumber just automatically spits out of a mill and goes immediately to the magical store. Don't need them trucks to haul it! In my state, which makes a bit of lumber (don't move here) the vaccination process has been ongoing--everybody did not show up at once to get a shot. Plus, prices have not "tumbled". They have peaked. How about reading a bit more slowly and carefully?


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## slowp (Jun 19, 2021)

softdown said:


> Could you be more arrogant? That would be something to behold. You sound more like an MSNBC/CNN script writer than a logger.


How does a logger sound? Show us.


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## northmanlogging (Jun 19, 2021)

slowp said:


> How does a logger sound? Show us.


most sound like ignorant hill Billy's, but then most are just hired labor that leave the thinkin stuff to someone else.

or maybe I'm just being mean/honest


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## slowp (Jun 20, 2021)

northmanlogging said:


> most sound like ignorant hill Billy's, but then most are just hired labor that leave the thinkin stuff to someone else.
> 
> or maybe I'm just being mean/honest


Now you are stereotyping. I've had some good, short (cuz it was work after all) conversations in the woods. A memorable one was with a hooktender talking about how we must embrace the weather if we work in the woods. It was one of those fine and miserable days when folks tend to not show up.


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## northmanlogging (Jun 20, 2021)

slowp said:


> Now you are stereotyping. I've had some good, short (cuz it was work after all) conversations in the woods. A memorable one was with a hooktender talking about how we must embrace the weather if we work in the woods. It was one of those fine and miserable days when folks tend to not show up.


Oh I willingly admit that many a logger can be way smarter then they look. But they still sound like ignorant hill billies... 

However, many that I have met in the last year especially, have not been the sharpest knives in the drawer. Seems buying a self loader you get to meet the lowest rungs on the ladder of intelligence, folks that will tell you with a straight face they've been at this for 30 years, but can't build a road, can't stack a log pile, can't buck to the correct lengths, can't fall timber without breaking more then 50%, expect me to make a load out of 20 short logs and 2 long logs, expect me to sort out a pile of pulp, limbs, fire wood, rotten junk and mud for the 12 decent saw logs at the bottom, that haven't been bucked and are in fact still tree length...

Most of the "loggers" I grew up with, and have met since then, were just that, hired labor that only know how to solve problems by headbutting it or swearing at it until someone else points them in the right direction. Hel most people in general are only good at 1 maybe two things, and if they are lucky they can make money doing it, unfortunately it makes many of these folks feel like they know more then they do. Which compounds when they step outside their knowledge base and get schooled by someone that does, they don't like it, then react with anger. Its called prideful arrogance.


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## slowp (Jun 20, 2021)

northmanlogging said:


> Oh I willingly admit that many a logger can be way smarter then they look. But they still sound like ignorant hill billies...
> 
> However, many that I have met in the last year especially, have not been the sharpest knives in the drawer. Seems buying a self loader you get to meet the lowest rungs on the ladder of intelligence, folks that will tell you with a straight face they've been at this for 30 years, but can't build a road, can't stack a log pile, can't buck to the correct lengths, can't fall timber without breaking more then 50%, expect me to make a load out of 20 short logs and 2 long logs, expect me to sort out a pile of pulp, limbs, fire wood, rotten junk and mud for the 12 decent saw logs at the bottom, that haven't been bucked and are in fact still tree length...
> 
> Most of the "loggers" I grew up with, and have met since then, were just that, hired labor that only know how to solve problems by headbutting it or swearing at it until someone else points them in the right direction. Hel most people in general are only good at 1 maybe two things, and if they are lucky they can make money doing it, unfortunately it makes many of these folks feel like they know more then they do. Which compounds when they step outside their knowledge base and get schooled by someone that does, they don't like it, then react with anger. Its called prideful arrogance.


Sounds like you might be dealing with some people who are on this forum....as in I have a very valuable black walnut tree?


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## northmanlogging (Jun 21, 2021)

slowp said:


> S


I have no idea what you are talking about... nothin but the best around these parts...


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## softdown (Jun 30, 2021)

$15.24 for a stud locally.


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## softdown (Jun 30, 2021)

More than tripled!


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## slowp (Jul 7, 2021)

Another good article on lumber prices. 

https://www.vice.com/en/article/88n...pB1mN255sB55M5-lVC2n_nRBp2S-xfflKceOOz3mVw6ac


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## Kodiakmac (Aug 18, 2021)

Local fellow is paying $650 CAD per MBF ($515 USD) for white cedar logs. That's up from $550 CAD ($435 USD) in January 2021 and $500 CAD ($395 USD) in 2019.


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## northmanlogging (Aug 19, 2021)

Kodiakmac said:


> Local fellow is paying $650 CAD per MBF ($515 USD) for white cedar logs. That's up from $550 CAD ($435 USD) in January 2021 and $500 CAD ($395 USD) in 2019.


uh... You don't want to know what they are paying for Red Cedar out here, strong competition between BC and WA mills... Not much domestic cedar available, and the BC stuff is getting political pressure... But as pertains to original post, prices are still lower then they should be, and not the highest I've ever seen either.


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## clemsonfor (Aug 19, 2021)

Loggers aren't making any more. There making less. The cost of fuel is up and less truck drivers also make production harder.

I'm a Forester and untill a few months ago the price on the stump for southern pine for me was up about 10% , what I received from Tim we buyers. The last sale I'd say it was up 15%-20% over pre Corona prices. The kills are making all the money, screwing us all including the customers.


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