# auto feed problems



## kano

Hi, I decided to upgrade the auto feed unit on my chipper to one with reverse mode, I chose to put in an 'Autofeed Plus' unit ,it is working good except when it is programed to reverse the hydraulic hoses tense up and the rollers do not reverse. Everything works fine manualy, I live in a small town and no one here really knows any thing about chippers, I have attached a drawing of the hydraulic system (minus the winch and lift/crush) I drew it myself so it isnt perfect. If anyone has any ideas please let me know thanks Kano.


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## ArborquipSP

I work for a bandit dealer so this may not help you on your Woodsman. But from your picture sol A and B look like they only stop the return flow or pressure flow going to motor.Witch would cause the hoses to flex because they are under pressure. In bandits normal auto feed they dump the pressure (back to tank) when autofeed is on untill engine reaches it high setting in the tach. For the reversing of the motors they use a soiloid shifted reversing valve witch reverses the a & b outlets of the feed control valve when the autofeed tach reaches its low rpm setting. I am not at work now but I can get you some diagrams to show what I am talking about.

Scott Phelps


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## kano

*autofeed*

Thanks Scott any information is good, It is a Woodsman 2018 the auto feed that was in it was the start stop kind, so I am not to sure what solenoid (b) does, however solenoid (a) does stop the feed when revs drop, But heres the twist if you wire solenoid (b) to stop feed it does so but you can hear some pressure in the hydraulic pump, where is solenoid (a) does not seem to have this sound, which seems a good thing to me but I know trees not hydraulics


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## ArborquipSP

Here is bandit hyd. system with options. I don't know anything about woodsman chippers but the solenoid b looks like it just stops the flow. In bandits diagram the reversing valve is a solenoid shifted valve that swaps the ports when pulled witch puts the fluid to the opposite ports on the motors so they go reverse and the auto feed dump valve just returns fluid back to the tank when the engine is not at full throttle. Did you buy the reversing kit from woodsman? 
I hope this helps some


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## kano

thanks mate, I got the 'AutoFeed Plus' unit through the manufacturer not Woodsman, I will take your diagram in to the (only) hydraulic shop here and see what they can come up with, thanks for your advice and have a good new year


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## ArborquipSP

Which manufacturer did you get it from? The one that makes the tach? Electronic solutions of Harrison? I thought they only made the tachs. not the hydraulic parts.

Scott


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## kano

The Autofeed was from Electronic Solutions of Harrison, but that is all I have replaced the rest of the system was already there


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## ArborquipSP

So what you replaced was the autofeed tach not installed the solenoids and valves. Correct? Is the tach programed correctly?
Here is a link to there manual for the tach. your type setting may be set wrong.

http://www.radioremote.com/AFP_MANUAL07.pdf


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## russ44

*auto feed problems 2*

I have a Bandit 200 series chipper that is reading 00000 on the auto-feed control. I can get the in-feed wheels to start rolling by bypassing the auto-feed option. This has worked for awhile, but recently I get no response. Sometimes if I flip the switch to the winch and then back it will work. I called Bandit and got a complicated answer. Is there a fix I can do myself?

Thanks


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## kano

I have programed it both ways but setting type 1 stops the feed when upto high revs and feeds at low revs, so setting type 0 seems to be the right one, The old auto feed was a completly different system thats why I was wondering if I might have to add or change something in the hyraulics to suit the new one,


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## ArborquipSP

What brand was the old autofeed tach. LOR , ESI or IEC , Meritron ? Have you called woodsman? I know if it was a ESI they take away the ground to make solenoids stop working and everyone else take away the power to make them stop. On our bandits we have to swap wires to Change from a ESI to any other Tach.

Scott


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## ArborquipSP

russ44 said:


> I have a Bandit 200 series chipper that is reading 00000 on the auto-feed control. I can get the in-feed wheels to start rolling by bypassing the auto-feed option. This has worked for awhile, but recently I get no response. Sometimes if I flip the switch to the winch and then back it will work. I called Bandit and got a complicated answer. Is there a fix I can do myself?
> 
> Thanks



How old is your chipper? Do you know what Brand autofeed tach you have? 
when 0's are being displayed is the engine running. if it is the pick up may not be working it could be a few different types depending on the engine model. What engine is on you machine? if it is a gas engine like a ford the pickup wire will most likely be on the ign. coil - terminal. if it is a Cat, Cummins or John Deere it will be a Mag pickup or a wire going to the alt. 
If it is a mag pickup (looks like a threaded rod with 2 wires coming out if it).






Most of the time they are screwed into the bell housing and they are adjustable so yours may need to be adjusted closer to the flywheel ring gear teeth.





If you want to adjust it there should be a jam nut on the threaded rod you will need to loosen and turn the screw in until it touches the ring gear and back it out 1/4-1/2 turn ( should be around .050" of a in.) you may have to adjust it a few times until it works. DO NOT GET IT TO CLOSE TO THE RING GEAR AND START ENGINE YOU WILL GRIND THE END OF THE PICK UP AND IT WILL BE BAD. You may want to remove the pick up and make sure the end is clean.

If it is a john deere engine the mag pickup may also be in the timing cover of the engine on the injection pump side. 

If you have you ser# of you machine Bandit should be able to get you the model and settings for the tach.

Scott


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## kano

ArborquipSP said:


> What brand was the old autofeed tach. LOR , ESI or IEC , Meritron ? Have you called woodsman? I know if it was a ESI they take away the ground to make solenoids stop working and everyone else take away the power to make them stop. On our bandits we have to swap wires to Change from a ESI to any other Tach.
> 
> Scott



Hi Scott, the old unit was a LOR model F-267 it is a non adjustable unit seperate to the tach, it has mag pickup wire in, earth wire in, postive wire in, and solenoid wire out, it it had solenoid out wire split and was wired to both solenoids (a) and (b), Both solenoids are earthed to the chassis


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## russ44

*autofeed problems*

Scott,

Thank you for your help. The chipper is an '05 with a Caterpillar engine. The information about the mag pickup is what I got from Bandit. The pictures help to make the whole process clearer. I will look at the chipper tomorrow and see if I can fix it.

Thnx

russ


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## ArborquipSP

kano said:


> Hi Scott, the old unit was a LOR model F-267 it is a non adjustable unit seperate to the tach, it has mag pickup wire in, earth wire in, postive wire in, and solenoid wire out, it it had solenoid out wire split and was wired to both solenoids (a) and (b), Both solenoids are earthed to the chassis



Did your machine have auto feed with reverse (when engine bogs down it stops forward feed and reverses the feed) before or did it just have autofeed (where it stops feeding when the engine bogs down). Or am I thinking you have autofeed with reverse because that is what the tach papers say it can do?

Second question do sol. A & B need to be powered up for you to manually run the machine? Because sol. A looks like a dump valve that should only need power when autofeed is on and engine is at idle so the fluid can return back to the tank. Sol. B may need power for the feed system to work if it is a normally closed valve ? I am assuming the sol. valves A is normally closed so fluid cant flow through it until power is put to the wire and B is normally open until power is put to the wire then it stops flow through the valve. 

That means to me your autofeed does not have reverse and only dumps the fluid when the engine is below the low setting in the tach. This also makes sense because you said the wires were joined together on your old setup. Are they joined together still? or did you hook one up to the brown reverse wire? Did you try hooking both wires to the dump wire at the tach ? If I had to guess that is how it should be wired so A&B get power from the same wire and it should be like it was with your old setup. For the tach program it will have to be the dump only no reverse type.

If you were trying to add the reversing feature to your machine the tach does not do that it is just programed to work with 2 separate valves at the same time. You most likely can add the reverse to your machine but it will take some hydraulic parts to work with your new tach. The place that sold you the tach may not have known your setup and asked you if your machine has 2 valves (most machines with reverse have 2 valves) and said that you can have reverse. But that is not the case in my opinion being a bandit dealer employee I dont know woodsman machines at all but am very familiar with hydraulics and the set up in your drawing does not look like it has the reverse feature.

Scott


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## ArborquipSP

russ44 said:


> Scott,
> 
> Thank you for your help. The chipper is an '05 with a Caterpillar engine. The information about the mag pickup is what I got from Bandit. The pictures help to make the whole process clearer. I will look at the chipper tomorrow and see if I can fix it.
> 
> Thnx
> 
> russ




If I was a betting man I would guess you tach is a ESI with 5 LED lights at the top of it and 3 bottons on it. If it is the case the tach may be bad. I know that manufacturer has had problems with the tach reprograming itself. if it is a ESI you can run a test on it I believe there is a test button on it you push and hold the botton then turn the key on and write down every thing the desplay says (some of the numbers are codes for the factory that make it) at the end it will say test ok the tach probibly wont work even though is says it tests fine. Does it read the correct hours on it or is it like 7777 those are also codes for the factory. after you get that info call bandit at 1-800-952-0178 and talk to anybody in the autofeed dept (Kail Homes or Dave Fetzner) are both good. there most likly is no warranty on the tach anymore but they may give you the phone # for ESI and he (Larry I think) maybe able to help you out. 

Scott


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## russ44

ArborquipSP said:


> If I was a betting man I would guess you tach is a ESI with 5 LED lights at the top of it and 3 bottons on it. If it is the case the tach may be bad. I know that manufacturer has had problems with the tach reprograming itself. if it is a ESI you can run a test on it I believe there is a test button on it you push and hold the botton then turn the key on and write down every thing the desplay says (some of the numbers are codes for the factory that make it) at the end it will say test ok the tach probibly wont work even though is says it tests fine. Does it read the correct hours on it or is it like 7777 those are also codes for the factory. after you get that info call bandit at 1-800-952-0178 and talk to anybody in the autofeed dept (Kail Homes or Dave Fetzner) are both good. there most likly is no warranty on the tach anymore but they may give you the phone # for ESI and he (Larry I think) maybe able to help you out.
> 
> Scott




You bet right. I checked the alt wiring and it seems fine. I looked through the Cat manual and I am just realizing now that I should have looked through the auto feed manual to find where the mag pickup is. Will that tell me where the mag pickup is? The hours are still counting and it is still chipping (once I turn the auto feed off).

Thanks
russ


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## ArborquipSP

The mag pickup on a cat is screwed in to the bell housing. if it is a turbocharged engine it may be hidden behind one of the turbo intake pipes. It will be somewhere on the perimiter of the housing. This may not be your problem though. the tach you have has been know to have issues. the only one that have not are the newest version of it.

Scott


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## AutoFeed-Remote

*Free training video for original Auto-Feed Plus(R) by ESOH*

Hello, 

We have a new training video for programming our original Auto-Feed Plus(R). and how the magnetic pickup and alternator signal relates to the control. 

Take a look by using the link below and let me know what you think. They are very basic and straightforward. However, we know what we are doing, the point is did we help you better understand the product, its use and operation?

The link below is a YouTube site, our user ID is YourOnLineTraining

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rPYSC_ZYq_g&feature=channel_page

We are new to this site and forum posting. I look forward to getting to know everyone. 

Janet


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## russ44

*auto feed remote*

Janet, Thanks for the link to Youtube. It gave me a better idea of what the mag pickup does, but for the last few weeks I have been getting RPM readings.
So I have let it slide. We did have a few times when the chipper would not start. I am not sure if that is a related problem or not.
I am going to watch the video again and see if can find the mag pickup.

Thanks

Russ


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