# tracked loader vs skid loader vs compact tractor



## Butterz (Feb 15, 2014)

Tracked loader vs skid steer vs compact tractor - What do you guys use for residential tree work? I'm in the market, and I am leaning towards the john deere 4120 compact tractor for the following reasons: turf friendly, fast travel speed on roads, good loading capacity, and with ag tires it is better in the snow than a tracked loader. I do like the idea of a skid though because you can really beat on them without killing them...they are just so destructive on lawns...any way around this?

Thanks guys!


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## treeclimber101 (Feb 15, 2014)

You will find a lot of good in both .... I run a skid steer and mini . I have worked with guys who run tractors and they love them. Hard to say


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## kyle goddard (Feb 15, 2014)

This is how we ride., plywood and ramps fit in tall box to the right.


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## Butterz (Feb 15, 2014)

right on! treeclimber101 - what kind of skid do you have, and how does it handle on turf?


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## treeclimber101 (Feb 15, 2014)

I have a standard gas powered mini and a bobcat 7753 skid loader which I only use on jobs that lets just say the turf isn't a high priority


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## Butterz (Feb 15, 2014)

^^^that's a sweet setup you have there dude


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## treeclimber101 (Feb 15, 2014)

Butterz said:


> ^^^that's a sweet setup you have there dude


Thanks man


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## 2treeornot2tree (Feb 15, 2014)

Bobcat makes a skid loader that is all wheel steer. 

I have a cat 236 with rubber over the tire tracks I use some times. I just put down ground mats where I need to turn so as to not tear up the grass. I also have a dingo that I use most of the time. 

Around here if you tell the customer that you can do it cheaper with causing some turf damage they are all for it.

Sent from my SCH-I605 using Tapatalk


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## andrew (Feb 15, 2014)

There are alot variables to consider. My first question would be do you have plywood and mats? If you do and dont mind taking the time to put them down I would most certainly lean towards a skid steer for the lift capacity and ability to dump into taller trucks and also the variety of attachments. Compact tractors are light and manuverable and pretty easy on lawns if you have turf tires. But if you get into bigger wood you will have have issues with lift capacity. You will run into issues with gates and fences with either machine since they are large. Like metioned above we also have a dingo with forks that we use on the majority of jobs.We have all three types of machines but if your doing alot of residental work start with a mini skid like a dingo or vermeer. These little machines are amazing and go just out anywhere you can walk.


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## sgreanbeans (Feb 16, 2014)

I have had all variations of this. What I found, that works for me is a smaller skidloader. Kinda, a happy middle place.


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## VA-Sawyer (Feb 16, 2014)

I use a 753 skid steer. I also have experience with a T300 and the little walk behind Bobcat ( MT50?).
I have found that a careful driver can do a lot to avoid turf damage in a skid steer. It is my first choice if terrain and access are not factors.
The larger tracked Bobcats are more stable on slopes.
The walk behind mini track was very slow. There were times I felt we could move the wood faster by hand. (Faster, NOT easier.) I think part of the problem with the walk behind was the weight of the grapple itself.


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## cory nicols (Feb 16, 2014)

Butterz said:


> Tracked loader vs skid steer vs compact tractor - What do you guys use for residential tree work? I'm in the market, and I am leaning towards the john deere 4120 compact tractor for the following reasons: turf friendly, fast travel speed on roads, good loading capacity, and with ag tires it is better in the snow than a tracked loader. I do like the idea of a skid though because you can really beat on them without killing them...they are just so destructive on lawns...any way around this?
> 
> Thanks guys!


I use a swinger loader 2000 and it works great. I know it's not on your list but consider looking into articulating loaders if you have not already. Size does not seem to be a big concern considering what your looking for and they lift high with next to zero yard damage. Your work environment will really dictate the best choice from your list.


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## gorman (Feb 16, 2014)

I run a 70hp asv. I love it up until the point I have to turn. Straight in, straight back does nothing to the lawns. If I turn I set up a pivot pad with plywood. Additionally I put a mat where the lawn meets the road or whatever. There is usually damage at that point too. 

If you have the budget, whatever u buy get a rotating grapple (branch manager, Ryan's grapple etc). It will be well worth your investment. I wasted 3k on a grapple bucket first.


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## PassionForTrees (Feb 16, 2014)

I have been using a 40 Hp Compact Tractor loader back hoe for over 15 years now, extra wide turf tires and lots of common sense knowing when your absolutely going to need mats and when you can get away from them. Some people are just Skid Steer guys and some Tractor guys period. Get what you like to run and then be efficient with it! I like the tractor option also due to the back hoe and so many different implements, root rake grapple, Forks , bucket, Auger with various bits, york rake, 3point hitch with a 2 inch receiver ect.. and you can to on and on all on the same machine!


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## rtsims (Feb 17, 2014)

2tree and 101: are the dingo and mini's in general adequate for loading rounds/ logs into a dump trailer? Just wondering if they have the lift height and room infront of the machine to load over the side. Im sure you can use ramps and load from the back but that seems like it would be hard to fill a trailer that way.


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## Butterz (Feb 17, 2014)

Thanks for all the feedback guys, I really appreciate it!


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## treeman75 (Feb 17, 2014)

rtsims said:


> 2tree and 101: are the dingo and mini's in general adequate for loading rounds/ logs into a dump trailer? Just wondering if they have the lift height and room infront of the machine to load over the side. Im sure you can use ramps and load from the back but that seems like it would be hard to fill a trailer that way.


That was one of the most important things for me when I was looking for a mini, the lift height. The vermeer and ditchwitch have the highest reach out of the mini's and they are both the same. I bought a vermeer s650tx and a 14' PJ dump trailer and it works good, I can lift logs over the side to load.


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## rtsims (Feb 17, 2014)

treeman75 said:


> That was one of the most important things for me when I was looking for a mini, the lift height. The vermeer and ditchwitch have the highest reach out of the mini's and they are both the same. I bought a vermeer s650tx and a 14' PJ dump trailer and it works good, I can lift logs over the side to load.



Nice. looking to get into one this year, trying not to finance. Whats the price tag on that machine? Do you guys use a grapple?
I also have a 7x14' PJ dump and I want something that will fill it. Tires of spending a full day after a takedown loading wood by hand and breaking our backs.


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## treeman75 (Feb 17, 2014)

The price will be 4k to 20k depending on unit and hours. Take your time and do your homework and shop around there are deals out there you just have to find them and be ready to buy when you find one. I use a branch manager grapple and think its the best for minis, also have a little bucket grapple for stumps and stuff. I highly recommend a mini it will change your life for ever! Even if you have to finance part of it just do it, you wont be sorry. We havent dragged brush or loaded logs by hand in four years. If mine blew up today I would be at vermeer buying another the next day! I wont do tree work without one again!


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## treeman75 (Feb 17, 2014)

I have alot of pics of mine working but there in my other computer and its not hooked up right now. If you search old threads on minis you will see some.


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## Toddppm (Feb 17, 2014)

kyle goddard said:


> This is how we ride., plywood and ramps fit in tall box to the right.



Is that a NPR, NQR, NRR?? What body do you have on it? I've had an NQR for a long time and looking at getting another or the NRR sometime soon hopefully.


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## lxt (Feb 17, 2014)

I bought this Guy & with the non skid shoes you can pretty much drive on grass & not do alot of damage, It goes through a 4ft gate & does things a wheeled loader couldnt dream of........oh & with the beer holder you can quench your thirst on those hot days


LXT.....


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## lxt (Feb 17, 2014)

of course I hear that a steiner is a wonderful machine for tree work........LOL


LXT.....


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## NCTREE (Feb 17, 2014)

lxt said:


> View attachment 334116
> 
> 
> I bought this Guy & with the non skid shoes you can pretty much drive on grass & not do alot of damage, It goes through a 4ft gate & does things a wheeled loader couldnt dream of........oh & with the beer holder you can quench your thirst on those hot days
> ...


what did you steal that from the local coal mine?


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## flushcut (Feb 17, 2014)

Not a PJ dump trailer but still a 14'er with my s800 


rtsims said:


> Nice. looking to get into one this year, trying not to finance. Whats the price tag on that machine? Do you guys use a grapple?
> I also have a 7x14' PJ dump and I want something that will fill it. Tires of spending a full day after a takedown loading wood by hand and breaking our backs.


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## kyle goddard (Feb 17, 2014)

Toddppm said:


> Is that a NPR, NQR, NRR?? What body do you have on it? I've had an NQR for a long time and looking at getting another or the NRR sometime soon hopefully.


Im not sure. Ill find out tomorrow unless Brian comes across this thread


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## pro94lt (Feb 17, 2014)

If you go with a compact tractor hydrostatic transmission is a must.


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## treeman75 (Feb 17, 2014)

flushcut said:


> View attachment 334125
> Not a PJ dump trailer but still a 14'er with my s800


Have you ran a s650tx? If so does the 800 have alot more power and whats the difference? Maybe next year I might trade or sell my 650 and step up to the 800.


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## MackenzieTree (Feb 17, 2014)

they make skid steers with articulating wheels and turf tires, bobcat a300 is one of them


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## treeclimber101 (Feb 17, 2014)

rtsims said:


> 2tree and 101: are the dingo and mini's in general adequate for loading rounds/ logs into a dump trailer? Just wondering if they have the lift height and room infront of the machine to load over the side. Im sure you can use ramps and load from the back but that seems like it would be hard to fill a trailer that way.


I can load pieces up to 950lbs and to load a dump trailer I can dump over the sides of that


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## climbhightree (Feb 17, 2014)

Toddppm said:


> Is that a NPR, NQR, NRR?? What body do you have on it? I've had an NQR for a long time and looking at getting another or the NRR sometime soon hopefully.



It is a NQR with a diesel engine. I love the cab over, and love the platform for the mini. But I do miss the 4x4 and the power of my old F450. If I had to do it over again, I would have went with a bigger engine...I think even the NRR has the same engine as a NPR. I had seen a few with bigger engines, more horsepower, but they are hard to find. The NRR would handle the the weight better, suspension wise. I dont think I am over weight with the NQR, never got it weighed. But I know the constant weight of mini etc is hard on the front shocks, I used to bounce...now we get jarred.

The truck I wish I would have went with is the cab over gmc t7500, or something similar to it. Not sure I would have fit in my garage then.

All in all, I am happy with the truck and I am not looking to get rid of it anytime soon.


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## gorman (Feb 17, 2014)

Same engine. Larger rear end. 
They don't make the six cylinder on this side if the pond anymore. You have to buy used.


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## climbhightree (Feb 17, 2014)

Time lapse video of BMG and Vermeer 650tx

 Time lapse of dragging some brush

 Time lapse of moving wood


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## climbhightree (Feb 17, 2014)

gorman said:


> Same engine. Larger rear end.
> They don't make the six cylinder on this side if the pond anymore. You have to buy used.



Ya, the cab over design didnt really fly over here at first. All the companies pretty much stopped making them here. But it now seems like they are everywhere, and it is hard to find good used ones.


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## gorman (Feb 17, 2014)

climbhightree said:


> Ya, the cab over design didnt really fly over here at first. All the companies pretty much stopped making them here. But it now seems like they are everywhere, and it is hard to find good used ones.



I picked up a six cylinder UD right before they skipped town from North America. Parts and service are still solid from the Mack dealer in my state. I wish they had a 4x4 available over here. 

They engine and drivetrain are just soooooo accessible with a cab over dump. Service is a breeze.


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## teamtree (Feb 17, 2014)

pro94lt said:


> If you go with a compact tractor hydrostatic transmission is a must.



I would try the Shuttle Shift....you will get more power out of it than one with a hydro.....the hydro are a nice convenience but the why pay to lose power.


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## Locust Cutter (Feb 17, 2014)

teamtree said:


> I would try the Shuttle Shift....you will get more power out of it than one with a hydro.....the hydro are a nice convenience but the why pay to lose power.


Not to mention a clutch (although a PIT to change having to split the unit) is a lo cheaper to do than replacing a hyd pump. A frend bought a BX25 Kubota and for a baby tractor it's pretty handy and useful. I was plenty surprised at what it can lift (although it's still easy to find the limits if you're used to a 60-75hp tractor), it is a hyd unit as is very convenient for loader work, but if I was buying it it would be a shuttle shift. 

I have been think about getting a NPR eventually for deliveries though as it seems like the mileage and maneuverability would be huge pluses when driving in town. A dump bed would be even better. 
To the OP if you're having to go through a lot of residential gates a mini might be your best friend. If not, either a segmented, , tractor or articulated wheel skid-steer would likely be better choices than a true skid-steer.


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## gorman (Feb 17, 2014)

I would opt for a mini if I never had to deal with 24" wood


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## Butterz (Feb 18, 2014)

Looks like I'm probably going to go with a john deere 320D or 320E skid. I really like my JD dealer here. Going with the full heat/ac cab option. Good advice from you guys about laying down plywood in the turn zone of the skid!


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## pro94lt (Feb 18, 2014)

I just got through splitting my kubota. Not very fun


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## Toddppm (Feb 18, 2014)

climbhightree said:


> It is a NQR with a diesel engine. I love the cab over, and love the platform for the mini. But I do miss the 4x4 and the power of my old F450. If I had to do it over again, I would have went with a bigger engine...I think even the NRR has the same engine as a NPR. I had seen a few with bigger engines, more horsepower, but they are hard to find. The NRR would handle the the weight better, suspension wise. I dont think I am over weight with the NQR, never got it weighed. But I know the constant weight of mini etc is hard on the front shocks, I used to bounce...now we get jarred.
> 
> The truck I wish I would have went with is the cab over gmc t7500, or something similar to it. Not sure I would have fit in my garage then.
> 
> All in all, I am happy with the truck and I am not looking to get rid of it anytime soon.




Yeah they are not powerhouses for sure but they get it done. Mine is a 175 HP, newer ones have a little more power probably not too much different. Have any pictures of the chip dump on it? Who made the body? 
I wasn't trying to buy it from you , haha. But.....if you're ever thinking about selling..... I've been watching for used ones but will probably go new, just not sure I want to buy a used one not knowing the history.


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## climbhightree (Feb 18, 2014)

Toddppm said:


> Yeah they are not powerhouses for sure but they get it done. Mine is a 175 HP, newer ones have a little more power probably not too much different. Have any pictures of the chip dump on it? Who made the body?
> I wasn't trying to buy it from you , haha. But.....if you're ever thinking about selling..... I've been watching for used ones but will probably go new, just not sure I want to buy a used one not knowing the history.








The dump part is from 2 trucks ago, I keep moving it from truck to truck (an old abortech that my former boss got new). This will be the last truck it will be on, thinking of replacing the dump (with aluminum, i think). I had the platform, and plywood box custom made...eventually I will get bi-fold ramps welded on both sides of the platform.

Wasnt looking to sell, or saying you were buying. Was just saying I am happy with what I got, even though Id probably do it differently if I could.


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## flushcut (Feb 18, 2014)

treeman75 said:


> Have you ran a s650tx? If so does the 800 have alot more power and whats the difference? Maybe next year I might trade or sell my 650 and step up to the 800.


I have not run a s650, but the s800 is a very capable machine. Here is a 22' 14"er.


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## flushcut (Feb 18, 2014)




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## flushcut (Feb 18, 2014)

Ok maybe one more 
Loading over the side of my dump trailer 76" if I remember right.


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## old_soul (Feb 18, 2014)

Butterz said:


> Looks like I'm probably going to go with a john deere 320D or 320E skid. I really like my JD dealer here. Going with the full heat/ac cab option. Good advice from you guys about laying down plywood in the turn zone of the skid!



Can't go wrong with that. Best $ I ever spent was to buy the skid loader to load logs off the job site. If needed, grass can be replaced much easier than my back. I think a 320 is similar in size to the 773. You will find so many other jobs to do with it too.......

I looked at tractors too, the toys they call tractors these days are just big lawn mowers. Too light for any real work.

Good luck with your purchase.


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## Butterz (Feb 18, 2014)

old_soul said:


> Can't go wrong with that. Best $ I ever spent was to buy the skid loader to load logs off the job site. If needed, grass can be replaced much easier than my back. I think a 320 is similar in size to the 773. You will find so many other jobs to do with it too.......
> 
> I looked at tractors too, the toys they call tractors these days are just big lawn mowers. Too light for any real work.
> 
> Good luck with your purchase.



Cool man, that's good encouragement right there  Ya, I'm really excited, the dealer is in the process of finding me one right now with my specifications. 0% financing for 48 months, and I will be able to swing the monthly payments.


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## Toddppm (Feb 18, 2014)

climbhightree said:


> The dump part is from 2 trucks ago, I keep moving it from truck to truck (an old abortech that my former boss got new). This will be the last truck it will be on, thinking of replacing the dump (with aluminum, i think). I had the platform, and plywood box custom made...eventually I will get bi-fold ramps welded on both sides of the platform.
> 
> Wasnt looking to sell, or saying you were buying. Was just saying I am happy with what I got, even though Id probably do it differently if I could.




Looks like it fits that truck pretty well. I thought those bodies would be too wide to work on the Izusus, maybe it's because that's the shorter box it's narrower?. Nice set up.


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## climbhightree (Feb 18, 2014)

Toddppm said:


> Looks like it fits that truck pretty well. I thought those bodies would be too wide to work on the Izusus, maybe it's because that's the shorter box it's narrower?. Nice set up.



Umm, why would it be to wide? You got me concerned now...I just had it switched at a local shop. The box is only 8' wide and 9' long...so less then some box trucks. But it does extend past the side walls of the tires by maybe around 6" on each side. I've wondered if there was a way I could widen the axle some.


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## Toddppm (Feb 18, 2014)

No real reason, just from looking at different truck bodies I thought most chip bodies are pretty wide. These just seem to have a more narrow frame than Fords/Chevys etc. I'll have to measure my dump body and see, I don't think it's quite 8ft. wide overall. I had it built when I bought the truck a long time ago.


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## lxt (Feb 20, 2014)

NCTREE said:


> what did you steal that from the local coal mine?


 
LOL, No a customer bought 2 of em & his wife wasnt happy so he sold it to me, I was contracted to dig a basement under a house which had none, I took off the ROPs & what a job that was!!!! money was great & the work I have gotten since is nice, itll do alot more than what it looks like it could & hey im making money & having fun.

LXT


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## NCTREE (Feb 20, 2014)

Here's a T300 in action carrying a 6500lbs oak log.


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## gorman (Feb 20, 2014)

That's a heavy log! It's also a heavy machine to tow around. Gotta be doing those big removals for that baby to pay off.


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## lxt (Feb 23, 2014)

6500lb log.........thats a lil over the 50% tip point uh?, Nice machine! I couldnt get that into any of the jobs I do though, be nice on some of the clear cut work but thats rare, much nicer than having to cut n load a log that big, you need a tri axle to haul the wood out from that job if thats just one log?

LXT..


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## treeclimber101 (Feb 23, 2014)

Nice wood !


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## Dillweed (Feb 23, 2014)

cory nicols said:


> I use a swinger loader 2000 and it works great. I know it's not on your list but consider looking into articulating loaders if you have not already. Size does not seem to be a big concern considering what your looking for and they lift high with next to zero yard damage. Your work environment will really dictate the best choice from your list.



Cory is right with the articulating loader. They reign supreme for tree work. No turf damage and great lifting capacity. The Bobcat A770 is the cadillac. The effortless joystick control allows you to pick up a car and race around the yard with it while you sip lemonade from the cup holder and enjoy the cold A/C blasting in your face listening to your ipod.


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## ATH (Feb 23, 2014)

Dillweed said:


> .....The Bobcat A770 is the cadillac. The effortless joystick control allows you to pick up a car and race around the yard with it while you sip lemonade from the cup holder and enjoy the cold A/C blasting in your face listening to your ipod.


Sounds like a sweet machine. I looked it up...looks like you make a good comparison, it fits right in.....about half of the Cadillac models can be had for less than an A770. Ouch.


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## sgreanbeans (Feb 24, 2014)

I had a Bobcat T250, was doing a back yard reno, was way down, probably 150yds from the road,I spun hard to run a load up and hooked some old stump that was hidden under the thatch. It had this perfect little lip on it and I popped the track right off. Man oh man! Trying to do that on a slope, in mud, was no fun. Popped the bleeder to release the pressure and got hit in the face with grease. Then trying to get the thing up high enough to get it back on.......... I switched to back to wheels. I do miss the capabilities of a track machine.


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## climbhightree (Feb 28, 2014)

I got a gopro last night, so I thought it only fitting to have the first video being of the mini...definitely one of the best purchases I've made. Saves the body, and saves a lot of work.

Just a quick video showing it lifting a 889 lbs log...roughly


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## treeman75 (Feb 28, 2014)

climbhightree said:


> I got a gopro last night, so I thought it only fitting to have the first video being of the mini...definitely one of the best purchases I've made. Saves the body, and saves a lot of work.
> 
> Just a quick video showing it lifting a 889 lbs log...roughly



No sound?


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## climbhightree (Feb 28, 2014)

Nah muted it, and didn't add any cover music. All about the mini and grapple. 

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I537 using Tapatalk


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## flushcut (Mar 2, 2014)

This is a 12'x 22" spruce log still under the tipping capacity of the 800tx held while heeled.


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## climbhightree (Mar 2, 2014)

Plus a sweatshirt  

But 800tx won't fit on my truck, or through a standard gate. Otherwise, I would have probably went that route. 

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I537 using Tapatalk


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## flushcut (Mar 2, 2014)

Actually that's plastic bag the HO tied around a chunk of metal from a grown in plant hanger bracket. Yes the 800 is wider but for me it is perfect. From the looks of it the 800 is much stronger than the 650 but in the end it's still better than lifting wood by hand.


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## climbhightree (Mar 2, 2014)

Stronger and better track design (drive wheel off the ground). 

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I537 using Tapatalk


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## gtrees (Mar 2, 2014)

treeman75 said:


> That was one of the most important things for me when I was looking for a mini, the lift height. The vermeer and ditchwitch have the highest reach out of the mini's and they are both the same. I bought a vermeer s650tx and a 14' PJ dump trailer and it works good, I can lift logs over the side to load.


If you don't mind me asking. What do you have your trailer gvw at? What do you pull it with?


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## treeman75 (Mar 2, 2014)

gtrees said:


> If you don't mind me asking. What do you have your trailer gvw at? What do you pull it with?


14k on the trailer and I have a 2010 2500 ram with the cummins. Before the dodge I had a 04 chevy 2500 with the 6.0.


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## PassionForTrees (Mar 8, 2014)

For me, I can get a lot of Wood and Branches to the chipper with ease. I am a Tractor Man. I know your usually a skid steer guy or a tractor guy! My Compact Backhoe loader gets the job done! I love it!


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## Wolfking42084 (Mar 19, 2014)

I have a tracked skid steer, but I probably take my mini excavator on 90% on the jobs that I need a machine on. In most parts of the US, this wouldn't make sense, but here in the mtns, it's great. Most wood is over the bank of a driveway, or on a severe slope all together. I'm almost to the point that I would rather have a mini track loader for neighborhood jobs.


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## Toddppm (Mar 19, 2014)

PassionForTrees said:


> For me, I can get a lot of Wood and Branches to the chipper with ease. I am a Tractor Man. I know your usually a skid steer guy or a tractor guy! My Compact Backhoe loader gets the job done! I love it!



What model Yanmar is that? How much will it lift?


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## PassionForTrees (Mar 19, 2014)

Toddppm said:


> What model Yanmar is that? How much will it lift?


Todd its a YANMAR CBL 40. It lifts 2800lbs all the way up and a little more 1/4 way up. So far whatever goes in grapple gets lifted and moved. Great for so many things even piled firewood to grab a big grapple bucket load n dump in trucks for deliveries. Having Backhoe is icing on cake but serves great for counter weight.


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## Toddppm (Mar 19, 2014)

Just looked it up, that's a pretty impressive machine for it's size. I could definitely use a backhoe in our work and at home.


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## familytreeman (May 11, 2014)

Swinger 2000 ag any day 

way easier to mount / unmount machine vs climb in and out of bobcat

great on lawns


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