# Case Bearing Installation



## Mastermind (Nov 19, 2013)

We have a big box of crap here that a local feller is hoping to get some more use out of. This sort of stuff is about all that we see locally, and the main reason we do very little local work.













Between these two carcasses Jon will try to build a runner.....


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## Mastermind (Nov 19, 2013)

One saw dismantled...





And one to go....





Well that ain't good.


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## Mastermind (Nov 19, 2013)

Thank God for ultrasonic cleaning tanks.


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## kyle1! (Nov 19, 2013)

How much will this trip to the dentist cost?


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## Mastermind (Nov 19, 2013)

OK, now that all the parts are cleaned, inspected, and laid out, it's time to start reassembling. 









Our local guy is hoping to use this saw as a backup for one that ain't quite this worn out. What we have done is clean all the parts, then checked the bearing cages for cracks, and the crank for wear. Believe it or not, these parts seem to be in good condition.


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## Mastermind (Nov 19, 2013)

kyle1! said:


> How much will this trip to the dentist cost?



150.00


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## Trx250r180 (Nov 19, 2013)

me likes the angled finned jug and the early flywheel ,it's just a diamond in the rough


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## sefh3 (Nov 19, 2013)

Are the cranks known to break or was it operator error?


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## Mastermind (Nov 19, 2013)

Now Jon is heating the PTO side at the bar pad first. He'll get it hot enough that the bearing will just drop in. How long you have to heat it, and how hot, is just something Jon has learned for doing a **** load of saws. 





In this picture you can see that he's installed the oil pump on the case. This is actually a junk pump that he keeps just for this reason. The oil pump is used to locate the depth of the bearing in the bore. When the case half is hot enough, the bearing just slides in against it. 





Like this.....













No hammering or pressing is needed.


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## Mastermind (Nov 19, 2013)

Trx250r180 said:


> me likes the angled finned jug and the early flywheel ,it's just a diamond in the rough



Good eye my friend.....



sefh3 said:


> I'm assuming it's an 046 or 066 your building? Are the cranks known to break or was it operator error?



The broken crank is from a 10mm 044. It probably had a million BF on the saw.


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## sefh3 (Nov 19, 2013)

I tried to edit that but I got caught up looking at your pictures. I see the cylinder in the first picture.


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## Mastermind (Nov 19, 2013)

After a few minutes, the bearing will soak enough heat out of the case to allow the crankshaft to slide in. Again, no hammers, or special tools needed. 





Now he heats the flywheel side....









While it is cooking, he got the gasket on the PTO side, and is ready for the flywheel side to just slide on. We use Loctite 518 here too. I hate leaks on anything......it's cheap insurance. 





Making damn sure it's hot enough.





Drops the bearing....





After a few minutes, the heat from the case half soaks into the bearing, and the halves just slide together.


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## sefh3 (Nov 19, 2013)

Are you using both the loctite and the gasket? How does it compair to Dirko?


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## sunfish (Nov 19, 2013)

Looks like you are makin chicken salad out of chicken chit! 

Good work man!


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## supertrooper (Nov 19, 2013)

Outstanding! Looks much easier than the other ways I have seen it done. Gonna make my life easier when Im putting my 036 back together! You sir are very much appreciated!!


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## milkman (Nov 19, 2013)

And who says you can't make a silk purse........


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## MnSam (Nov 19, 2013)

I can't believe someone would ask you to work on such a decrepit saw .


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## Steve NW WI (Nov 19, 2013)

Nice write up Randy. I'm just curious the reason for heating indirectly, why not just point the heat gun at the bearing race?

If you'd care to, I bet a lot of guys would like an IR temp gun reading on the case when it's ready.


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## nmurph (Nov 19, 2013)

I use my stove (have used a heat gun a few times) set to 250°F. That temps seems to let the bearings on most saws drop right in. I used to use 225° and it would take a few taps with the soft-blow hammer to seat them.


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## Trx250r180 (Nov 19, 2013)

Steve NW WI said:


> Nice write up Randy. I'm just curious the reason for heating indirectly, why not just point the heat gun at the bearing race?
> 
> If you'd care to, I bet a lot of guys would like an IR temp gun reading on the case when it's ready.



for some reason Randy cant log on ,i just got an email from him


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## Trx250r180 (Nov 19, 2013)

I can't even get AS to load......

The connection has timed out

The server at www.arboristsite.com is taking too long to respond.


i think Randy got Banned again


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## nmurph (Nov 19, 2013)

No problemos here.


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## Trx250r180 (Nov 19, 2013)

wonder why Randy got sent to time out ? was he doing something wrong ?


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## Steve NW WI (Nov 19, 2013)

Trx250r180 said:


> for some reason Randy cant log on ,i just got an email from him



Sent Randy a PM at the other place, hopefully he'll get back to me with what's going on, and I'll post it in Support for him. Seems some others are having trouble today as well.


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## Trx250r180 (Nov 19, 2013)

Steve NW WI said:


> Sent Randy a PM at the other place, hopefully he'll get back to me with what's going on, and I'll post it in Support for him. Seems some others are having trouble today as well.



Thanks Steve


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## les-or-more (Nov 19, 2013)

Steve NW WI said:


> Sent Randy a PM at the other place, hopefully he'll get back to me with what's going on, and I'll post it in Support for him. Seems some others are having trouble today as well.


He got the same as a bunch of us Steve, those goofy error messages when making a post then the computer can't connect to AS.


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## svk (Nov 19, 2013)

This is very cool, always like to see something that was once junk resurrected into a running machine.


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## spindrift7mm (Nov 19, 2013)

This is like TV, get to the good part " TO BE CONTINUED"


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## ptjeep (Nov 19, 2013)

Seems like Randy mentioned before that by heating the bar pad area first, the case half heated up quicker. I guess its because its more solid than the rest of the case.


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## les-or-more (Nov 19, 2013)

spindrift7mm said:


> This is like TV, get to the good part " TO BE CONTINUED"


With any luck they will have people back on line soon, they think they know what the problem is, then Randy can finish the build.


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## Mastermind (Nov 19, 2013)

Heating the bar pad first because it has more mass than the thinner areas. That helps the whole part expand as a unit. 

I don't have an IR gun Steve......

Oh, Jen got me back in, somehow my IP addy got blocked out of the server. 

My last pic anyway. 





Questions?


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## big t double (Nov 19, 2013)

is this a flat rate type job? 150 seems cheap for the amount of time spent...I gotta assume this takes a min of 2 to 2-1/2 hrs. cool thread, thanks for sharing


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## Mastermind (Nov 19, 2013)

You are welcome to pay more. 

It's only worth so much to revive an old saw.....

We do very few that are that ugly, but we split several a week for rebuilds.


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## redfin (Nov 19, 2013)

Do you do any kind of prep to the case halves before loctite? When I put transfer case halves together I like to scuff the mating surface with a red scotchbrite.

What size sonic tank do you have? I have told santa I have been a good boy for years trying to get one.


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## Mastermind (Nov 19, 2013)

We sand them with a straight edge and 180 grit.....







Our tank is a two liter unit, and will take a case half fully submerged.


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## big t double (Nov 19, 2013)

Mastermind said:


> You are welcome to pay more.
> 
> It's only worth so much to revive an old saw.....
> 
> We do very few that are that ugly, but we split several a week for rebuilds.


 
hahaha...fair enough, and I meant no disrespect...I just wondered...just seems like a bit of time involved for an inexpensive price...I like your style sir.


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## towingace (Nov 19, 2013)

I really appreciate threads like this. That's what "brings us back" to this site.

I tried to give a "like" and a "useful" on the same post but it appears you can only choose one....somebody please correct me if I'm mistaken.


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## towingace (Nov 19, 2013)

Mastermind said:


> You are welcome to pay more.
> 
> It's only worth so much to revive an old saw.....
> 
> We do very few that are that ugly, but we split several a week for rebuilds.



Now, THAT"S what I like to hear! It's not ALL about the money. That's easy for me to say because I do this as a hobby. I also don't take anything away from the saw shop, actually, some of my projects come from the there. He gives me a "buddy deal" on saws that would otherwise just lay in that big wooden box with the rest of the "dead" saws because it costs too much to fix them.


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## Mastermind (Nov 19, 2013)

Well "we" are just me and my son-in-law......in a small shop behind the house.


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## HittinSteel (Nov 19, 2013)

Nice write up and pics Randy. Thanks for sharing some knowledge.


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## gr8mac (Nov 19, 2013)

sefh3 said:


> Are you using both the loctite and the gasket? How does it compair to Dirko?



Would be interested in your thoughts on this as well.


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## Mastermind (Nov 19, 2013)

Sorry, missed that one. We use both sealer and a gasket......just because. 

I like the Loctite 518 better than any sealer I have used. I never hardens unless it's in the absence of air, *and* is compressed into an area that is less than .030". That means that when I use it as a base sealant, it won't squeeze out into the transfer and harden there, partially blocking those passages. Instead, it will wash out, only hardening in the joint between the jug and case.


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## Trx250r180 (Nov 19, 2013)

well wheres the video ? you have had all day on this thing


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## Mastermind (Nov 19, 2013)

What video?


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## Trx250r180 (Nov 19, 2013)

how else we gonna know that box of parts runs when your done opcorn:


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## Mastermind (Nov 19, 2013)

Just take my word for it. It's been running for a few days now.


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## Mastermind (Nov 19, 2013)

You can trust me, I don't work for the gubermint.


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## les-or-more (Nov 19, 2013)

Mastermind said:


> Just take my word for it. It's been running for a few days now.


Man that is a big gas tank.


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## Mastermind (Nov 19, 2013)

LMAO......

And they said humor was dead on AS.


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## Trx250r180 (Nov 19, 2013)




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## Mastermind (Nov 19, 2013)

Welp, the cryin never stopped.


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## ncsawguy (Nov 19, 2013)

well I hope the box I sent you didn't look like that. id be embarrassed.


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## Mastermind (Nov 19, 2013)

Your saw is a beauty queen compared to this old war horse.


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## ncsawguy (Nov 19, 2013)

thanks that's what I was looking for. the handle should be here this week and ill pass it on. with the new clutch, drum. thanks but I got lucky with my stuff. the parts guy said he had more. maybe one day he will let me look.


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## thomas1 (Nov 19, 2013)

Looks are overrated.


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## Mastermind (Nov 19, 2013)

thomas1 said:


> Looks are overrated.



Says the guy with the world's ugliest 084.


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## glock37 (Nov 19, 2013)

Randy you make it look so easy !

I've done a few but it took me a hell of a lot longer

You know we could have made that thing look really pretty with a little gray white powder !


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## ncsawguy (Nov 19, 2013)

not in this case. lol. mine might not look good but I know the Internals will be like new. plus a little, cant wait,


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## thomas1 (Nov 19, 2013)

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder.


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## glock37 (Nov 19, 2013)

they run better when there pretty !


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## ncsawguy (Nov 19, 2013)

I want my stuff to run good and look good. I like to keep stuff clean. I believe it will. thanks to the builder. I like how he did the bearings. does fine work.


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## glock37 (Nov 19, 2013)

you mean like this clean


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## Mastermind (Nov 19, 2013)

You let that TN hack work on that nice saw?


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## glock37 (Nov 19, 2013)

That saw tore my back up for a month cutting wood for camp

I think that tenn. hack did a awesome job


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## Mastermind (Nov 19, 2013)

Now if it's too much saw for you........I'll take her of your hands. ;-))


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## glock37 (Nov 19, 2013)

I enjoyed getting my butt kicked

by one off your beasts

I can take it


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## DexterDay (Nov 19, 2013)

Always nice to see how the real pros do it 

Very nice thread Randy. Love the detail you put in them.


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## PogoInTheWoods (Nov 20, 2013)

Thanks for taking the time, Randy. The ones I've done were with a toaster oven, but I've since acquired a heat gun (same one as yours) and may give it a try next time around. I must say, I've never had the crank and case half just slip into place as you indicate is how it works for you and am wondering if you might care to elaborate on your method for pulling that off. I've always been reluctant to apply any heat to the bearings aside from what is absorbed from the case during installation for fear of causing cage deformity (depending on the bearing style, of course). I've always needed to draw the case halves onto the crank with extra long case bolts to get it started before buttoning it up with the regular bolts.

And about the seal installation....someone asked if you would share a tip or two on that subject as well? I know it sounds like a simple operation, but there are a few times I wish I had a tutorial on at least the crank side of an old 066. (Took me three attempts to get it where I think is basically the correct depth and having it actually seal effectively in the bore and around the crank without that extra stub on the flywheel rubbing up against it.)

The PTO side was the typical deep-well socket/washer approach to get a nice flush fit with a little Dirko on the O.D. for sealant and a little red grease on the crank and I.D. to keep the inner lip from curling.


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## PogoInTheWoods (Nov 20, 2013)

DexterDay said:


> Always nice to see how the real pros do it
> 
> Very nice thread Randy. Love the detail you put in them.



+1


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## Yukon Stihl (Nov 20, 2013)

MnSam said:


> I can't believe someone would ask you to work on such a decrepit saw .


Ugly girls need love too


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## Agrarian (Nov 20, 2013)

Excellent tutorial for us budding hobbyists! 

Ever do this on Husky 254's / 262's? Any special tips for the same procedure?


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## Mastermind (Nov 20, 2013)

I can't remember splitting a 262....probably have though. We do them all about the same way.

Pogo, maybe your just not getting it hot enough? Every now and then we'll have to tap something, or pull it up.

Next time we get into a rebuild, we'll snap some more pics, and do something on seal installation.


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## exSW (Nov 20, 2013)

glock37 said:


> View attachment 319143
> you mean like this clean


 Hey I got to run that saw.Now I want one.


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## glock37 (Nov 20, 2013)

Yukon Stihl said:


> Ugly girls need love too



There only ugly if you can see them ! girls that is !


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## Mastermind (Nov 20, 2013)

At least they ain't snackie sized.....


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## angelo c (Nov 20, 2013)

Just leaving a bread crumb....


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## jeremyc (Nov 21, 2013)

Is ill have to give this a try on my next rebuild. I struggled with the 066 red light that I just finished. Tried to heat them up in a toaster oven but really didn't get it hot enough I guess. ..... Need to buy a blown up saw to practice on ! 
Thanks for showing how it's done for guys like me that are newbies to this stuff.


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## Mastermind (Nov 21, 2013)

If any of you guys get into something and need some help......

I'll do my best to share what little I've learned.......just give us a shout.


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## firefighterwolf (Nov 21, 2013)

Agrarian said:


> Excellent tutorial for us budding hobbyists!
> 
> Ever do this on Husky 254's / 262's? Any special tips for the same procedure?



Same procedure. The only thing is on earlier 254's, including 154's, the oil drive gear is brass and pressed onto the crankshaft behind the oil pump. Husky made/makes a tool to remove and install. I don't know if it can be done without the tool. The gear needs to be removed prior to splitting the case and re-installed after the crankshaft has been pulled back into place. I've done a few, the last was about 3 or 4 years ago.

Later (254XP, 257, 261, 262XP) models had the plastic oil drive gears driven by the clutch drum.

I'd imagine Sawtroll would know the finer details of this.


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## Mastermind (Nov 21, 2013)

I have that tool, had to get it for a seal change on a 262.......forgot all about those saws being built like that....


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## atlarge54 (Nov 21, 2013)

Mastermind said:


> If any of you guys get into something and need some help......
> 
> I'll do my best to share what little I've learned.......just give us a shout.


 
I've been having an abnormally difficult time peeling bananas lately. Is there a new variety on the market?


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## Mastermind (Nov 22, 2013)

Oh yeah......you haven't seen the new, thin skinned variety?

They're all over the forums.


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## lmbrman (Nov 22, 2013)

Thanks for a great thread Randy !

-dave


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## angelo c (Nov 22, 2013)

Randy, does the stihl oiler have to be model specific to each model or can one dummy be used to set different series saw case bearings.


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## a. palmer jr. (Nov 22, 2013)

Mastermind said:


> One saw dismantled...
> The only thing I hate about basket cases is that there are usually some screws and other parts missing. I'm not crazy about scavenger hunts..
> 
> 
> ...


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## Metals406 (Nov 23, 2013)

Great thread Randy!


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## jughead500 (Dec 10, 2013)

Well I just installed a set of bearins in an ms260.the sasquatch way.on a wood stove.lol


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## Mastermind (Dec 10, 2013)

jughead500 said:


> Well I just installed a set of bearins in an ms260.the sasquatch way.on a wood stove.lol



That works just fine......heat is heat.


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## jughead500 (Dec 10, 2013)

Kept a close eye on it so that I wouldnt ruin the av bushins.they can take a lot of heat.the pto side just dropped in but the flywheel side stopped within 1/8th inch of going in flush.tried to peck it in right fast but just wasnt fast enough.I'll press it out and try again.


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## albert (Dec 10, 2013)

Why not just press it the last bit instead of pressing it out? You gota press on the inner race to remove it, but press on the outer to install it.


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## Mastermind (Dec 10, 2013)

Drive it on in.


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## Rusty Barlow (Dec 10, 2013)

albert said:


> Why not just press it the last bit instead of pressing it out? You gota press on the inner race to remove it, but press on the outer to install it.


He may be onto something. Press out = force on inner race = not ideal. Press in = force on outer race = OK.
Dern samel "chimp" Jackson beat me to it.
As did albert. Why doesn't the 2nd 1/2 of his post show in the post, but does when I quoted him.


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## Henry-krinkle (Dec 22, 2013)

Randy great thread! I'm in the middle of rebuilding a ms361 and I have a stupid question. At what part of the build do I put the crank seals in? When the case is hot? Or press them in?


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## Agrarian (Dec 22, 2013)

firefighterwolf said:


> Same procedure. The only thing is on earlier 254's, including 154's, the oil drive gear is brass and pressed onto the crankshaft behind the oil pump. Husky made/makes a tool to remove and install. I don't know if it can be done without the tool. The gear needs to be removed prior to splitting the case and re-installed after the crankshaft has been pulled back into place. I've done a few, the last was about 3 or 4 years ago.
> 
> Later (254XP, 257, 261, 262XP) models had the plastic oil drive gears driven by the clutch drum.



I believe there is a post on here somewhere that shows how a 3/4" iron pipe coupler will thread onto that gear nicely. Then you can use a regular gear puller to yank on the coupler - pulls them off slick. Once it is off, I convert the saw to use the newer plastic gear with the different clutch drum. That way it no longer pumps oil when idling and its a fairly cheap upgrade.


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## indiansprings (Dec 22, 2013)

Great thread Randy,we use that same heat gun I'll have to try the loctite, just have dirko in the shop.


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## Ndigity26 (Dec 22, 2013)

Mastermind said:


> We have a big box of crap here that a local feller is hoping to get some more use out of. This sort of stuff is about all that we see locally, and the main reason we do very little local work.
> 
> 
> 
> ...




To me it would seem with all the work that needs to go into these parts to make anything useful, (unless done by ones self) it would simply not be cost effective to pay a professional such as your self to do it. To me it would seem better to buy a new and or find a good used saw?


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## Mastermind (Dec 22, 2013)

Sorry if anyone had questions for me. I just "found" this thread again. I never got any notifications or alerts. The forum's issues are really getting under my skin. If anyone needs to contact me use my email.


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## Ndigity26 (Dec 22, 2013)

Mastermind said:


> Sorry if anyone had questions for me. I just "found" this thread again. I never got any notifications or alerts. The forum's issues are really getting under my skin. If anyone needs to contact me use my email.




with all them saws coming in you should be able to spring for a new compruta No?


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## clemsonfor (Dec 22, 2013)

Nice thread. Thanks for taking the time to share your knowledge and skill. 

Sent from my C5155 using Tapatalk


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## griffonks (Jan 2, 2014)

Agrarian said:


> I believe there is a post on here somewhere that shows how a 3/4" iron pipe coupler will thread onto that gear nicely. Then you can use a regular gear puller to yank on the coupler - pulls them off slick. Once it is off, I convert the saw to use the newer plastic gear with the different clutch drum. That way it no longer pumps oil when idling and its a fairly cheap upgrade.



Thank you Agrarian, you saved me a bunch of frustration with this post. I used a 1/2 inch black pipe floor flange. It loosely screwed on to my 262's brass worm gear. Then I pulled it off with a harmonic balancer puller. Two 1/4 inch carriage bolts thru the pipe flange's floor mount holes nutted to the puller. Pop goes the weasel.


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## whitedogone (Jan 2, 2014)

"Now Jon is heating the PTO side at the bar pad first."

Why there? why not at the bearing area?

must read post first.....kick self in azz


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## Adirondackstihl (Jan 2, 2014)

whitedogone said:


> "Now Jon is heating the PTO side at the bar pad first."
> 
> Why there? why not at the bearing area?
> 
> must read post first.....kick self in azz


There is more mass in that area. If you tried to heat the bearing race 1st, the bar pad will act as a heat sink and pull heat away from the intended area.


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## Agrarian (Jan 2, 2014)

griffonks said:


> Thank you Agrarian, you saved me a bunch of frustration with this post. I used a 1/2 inch black pipe floor flange. It loosely screwed on to my 262's brass worm gear. Then I pulled it off with a harmonic balancer puller. Two 1/4 inch carriage bolts thru the pipe flange's floor mount holes nutted to the puller. Pop goes the weasel.



I won't take credit but glad to help with what I learned here. Guess I remembered the iron pipe size wrong though - sorry about that. Great alternate approach with the floor flange. As I remember now, I had to grind the coupler so that the gear puller had a flat surface to grab on to.


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## griffonks (Jan 3, 2014)

Agrarian said:


> I won't take credit but glad to help with what I learned here. Guess I remembered the iron pipe size wrong though - sorry about that. Great alternate approach with the floor flange. As I remember now, I had to grind the coupler so that the gear puller had a flat surface to grab on to.



Just knowing that black pipe fittings would fit saved me from frustration. I bought a coupler first and broke a cheap two jaw gear puller on it then I went back for the flange. Luckily the hardware store is 5 minutes from my shop. Too bad it took me an hour to find my harmonic puller.

Cold and snow Saturday, so I'm gonna try the heat gun on a 262 reassembly that's getting bearings. The crankshaft and bearings are in the freezer. I spent too much on this saw.

Went to NAPA for skf bearings and they started to charge me $47 for a pair. When I told them I would go to the Husqvarna dealer for the bearings NAPA dropped the price to $30. Gotta live haggling!


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## griffonks (Jan 3, 2014)

griffonks said:


> Just knowing that black pipe fittings would fit saved me from frustration. I bought a coupler first and broke a cheap two jaw gear puller on it then I went back for the flange. Luckily the hardware store is 5 minutes from my shop. Too bad it took me an hour to find my harmonic puller.
> 
> Cold and snow Saturday, so I'm gonna try the heat gun on a 262 reassembly that's getting bearings. The crankshaft and bearings are in the freezer. I spent too much on this saw.
> 
> Went to NAPA for skf bearings and they started to charge me $47 for a pair. When I told them I would go to the Husqvarna dealer for the bearings NAPA dropped the price to $30. Gotta love haggling!


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## pioneerguy600 (Jan 3, 2014)

griffonks said:


> Just knowing that black pipe fittings would fit saved me from frustration. I bought a coupler first and broke a cheap two jaw gear puller on it then I went back for the flange. Luckily the hardware store is 5 minutes from my shop. Too bad it took me an hour to find my harmonic puller.
> 
> Cold and snow Saturday, so I'm gonna try the heat gun on a 262 reassembly that's getting bearings. The crankshaft and bearings are in the freezer. I spent too much on this saw.
> 
> Went to NAPA for skf bearings and they started to charge me $47 for a pair. When I told them I would go to the Husqvarna dealer for the bearings NAPA dropped the price to $30. Gotta live haggling!


 
Napa is still making $20. off your purchase. Do you have an industrial bearing and seal distributor in your local area? Motion bearing charges around $5. for C3 rated chainsaw bearings.


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## komatsuvarna (Jan 3, 2014)

Do you ever reuse the crank bearings after a bottom end split, Randy?
On the huskys its a no brainer to put new bearings in IMO. Those damn Stihl pto side bearings is a different story they cost so much...
Im rebuilding a 064 for myself. The bearings have plastic cages and still had the inner shield till i popped them out. Its a high hour saw, but the bearings feel and sound smooth as silk. Im debating on reusing them.....


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## angelo c (Jan 3, 2014)

pioneerguy600 said:


> Napa is still making $20. off your purchase. Do you have an industrial bearing and seal distributor in your local area? Motion bearing charges around $5. for C3 rated chainsaw bearings.



Jerry, 
Any chance of a PN for those "motion" bearings. I have a buddy that works for motion industries and out of curiosity I'm gonna price them from him.
A


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## Jacob J. (Jan 3, 2014)

komatsuvarna said:


> Do you ever reuse the crank bearings after a bottom end split, Randy?
> On the huskys its a no brainer to put new bearings in IMO. Those damn Stihl pto side bearings is a different story they cost so much...
> Im rebuilding a 064 for myself. The bearings have plastic cages and still had the inner shield till i popped them out. Its a high hour saw, but the bearings feel and sound smooth as silk. Im debating on reusing them.....



I can't answer for Randy, but I rarely ever re-use any bearings, even when it's the $55 proprietary PTO side bearing for 066/660. It's just not worth it. I'm doing my 084 soon and I'll be shelling out $65 for the PTO side bearing on that one...


angelo c said:


> Jerry,
> Any chance of a PN for those "motion" bearings. I have a buddy that works for motion industries and out of curiosity I'm gonna price them from him.
> A


 If you go into any bearing house and ask for a 6203 bearing that's C-3 rated, they'll provide you with what Jerry is referring to. They might ask if you want shielded or unshielded, or rubber sealed.


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## angelo c (Jan 3, 2014)

Thanks JJ, 
I actually have a National Bearing warehouse close and I have a "motion" ind guy...so I'll see if either has a better price?


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## pioneerguy600 (Jan 3, 2014)

I see JJ got back to answer before I did, course he got it right , those 6203 bearings are very common and don`t cost anywhere near what is being paid for them through secondary distributors. I realize they need to make a profit on what they sell but I would rather go to the folks that mostly only handle bearings.


----------



## Jacob J. (Jan 3, 2014)

pioneerguy600 said:


> I see JJ got back to answer before I did, course he got it right , those 6203 bearings are very common and don`t cost anywhere near what is being paid for them through secondary distributors. I realize they need to make a profit on what they sell but I would rather go to the folks that mostly only handle bearings.



I bought a lot of 100 NIB Nachi 6203 bearings recently from a national bearing house- $1.75 each delivered. Made in Japan, not Taiwan, Indonesia, or Turkey...


----------



## Adirondackstihl (Jan 3, 2014)

Jacob J. said:


> I bought a lot of 100 NIB Nachi 6203 bearings recently from a national bearing house- $1.75 each delivered. Made in Japan, not Taiwan, Indonesia, or Turkey...


Wanna send me 4-5 those bearings.....lol


----------



## pioneerguy600 (Jan 3, 2014)

Jacob J. said:


> I bought a lot of 100 NIB Nachi 6203 bearings recently from a national bearing house- $1.75 each delivered. Made in Japan, not Taiwan, Indonesia, or Turkey...



The bigger the ,lot size, the better the price. Those Niachi bearings are holding up fine in many of the saws I have built using them, quality seems first rate.


----------



## Jacob J. (Jan 3, 2014)

Adirondackstihl said:


> Wanna send me 4-5 those bearings.....lol



I can do that.


pioneerguy600 said:


> The bigger the ,lot size, the better the price. Those Niachi bearings are holding up fine in many of the saws I have built using them, quality seems first rate.



These days I prefer Nachi or SNR. I use SKF if I can't find the former brands. SNR in the odd sizes (6003, 7004) are the smoothest rolling bearings out of the box I've ever seen. I've gotten more service life in my own saws with the Nachi bearings in 6202 and 6203 than any other.


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## komatsuvarna (Jan 3, 2014)

I guess I'll quit being a tight ass and just buy the new pto bearing from stihl. I do hate to build a saw off used bearings, but I hate giving 60.00 for a darn bearing that should cost 5.00!


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## pioneerguy600 (Jan 3, 2014)

Stihl has had a hold on those proprietary bearings for a long while but the Chineese are now making them and they don`t care about Stihl `s proprietary properties, they are out there on the market and show up on eBay sometimes.


----------



## komatsuvarna (Jan 3, 2014)

pioneerguy600 said:


> Stihl has had a hold on those proprietary bearings for a long while but the Chineese are now making them and they don`t care about Stihl `s proprietary properties, they are out there on the market and show up on eBay sometimes.



I found a set, I'm kinda scared of them.....
I told myself I'd rather have used OEM bearings than new China bearings, but I guess I'll just bite the bullet and pay the $$$.


----------



## Trx250r180 (Jan 3, 2014)

you guys should just buy ceramic bearings .................. opcorn:


----------



## Jacob J. (Jan 3, 2014)

komatsuvarna said:


> I found a set, I'm kinda scared of them.....
> I told myself I'd rather have used OEM bearings than new China bearings, but I guess I'll just bite the bullet and pay the $$$.



Pass on the Chinamen bearings...used OEM is better than bearings assembled by schoolchildren.


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## Mastermind (Jan 3, 2014)

I have reused bearings.......but only after careful cleaning and inspection.....


----------



## pioneerguy600 (Jan 3, 2014)

Jacob J. said:


> Pass on the Chinamen bearings...used OEM is better than bearings assembled by schoolchildren.


All the machinery and parts coming from China right now are a crap shoot but some will prove out over time if they are good or not. I have been in on installs where the bearings are supporting 40 tons on either end of the shaft using China made bearings and have been in service 6 years now, at the time of install all the other machinists and mechanics working with me said they would be lucky to make a year. Previously we had changed the bearings on this piece of equipment every 2-3 years and they would cost 3-4 times the cost of the China bearings.
Now I won`t recommend using China made bearings in chainsaws, I don`t have enough hours on a 046 I put them in yet to give a recommend on them. They did seem well enough made to give them a try in one of my own saws. You see, I always like to experiment on my own equipment and run it for an extended amount of time before giving out a recommendation.


----------



## komatsuvarna (Jan 3, 2014)

Mastermind said:


> I have reused bearings.......but only after careful cleaning and inspection.....



After a closer look, I can feel the wear on these when I ''rock'' the center back and forward.
No use building a nice saw around a worn out bottom. I'll just order the bearing from Stihl and be done.


----------



## griffonks (Jan 3, 2014)

pioneerguy600 said:


> Napa is still making $20. off your purchase. Do you have an industrial bearing and seal distributor in your local area? Motion bearing charges around $5. for C3 rated chainsaw bearings.



Yes, there's a bearing supplier in Denver, Brown's or Brownell's, I have limited time to spend though.

I'm spending all my free day time in flood recovery. My farm and bass fishery got shredded, 400 tractor dumper loads of fill to rebuild the washed out dikes, berms and roads.

The saw was going to Mastermind, but I need every saw I can get a hold of for clearing debris on the 60 acres of creek bottom and slough.

Trying to cut a lane in to a jungle of small junk trees so we can get a trailer in to begin loading debris.

I have friends to help, but they are sawless.....


----------



## angelo c (Jan 3, 2014)

Jacob J. said:


> I bought a lot of 100 NIB Nachi 6203 bearings recently from a national bearing house- $1.75 each delivered. Made in Japan, not Taiwan, Indonesia, or Turkey...




Darn it...I got price cut before I ever started my business enterprise...and here I was thinkin I was gonna be "duck dynasty" rich !!!!!


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## angelo c (Jan 3, 2014)

griffonks said:


> Yes, there's a bearing supplier in Denver, Brown's or Brownell's, I have limited time to spend though.
> 
> I'm spending all my free day time in flood recovery. My farm and bass fishery got shredded, 400 tractor dumper loads of fill to rebuild the washed out dikes, berms and roads.
> 
> ...



sorry to hear about your misfortune.


----------



## stubnail67 (Jan 3, 2014)

Mastermind said:


> Now Jon is heating the PTO side at the bar pad first. He'll get it hot enough that the bearing will just drop in. How long you have to heat it, and how hot, is just something Jon has learned for doing a **** load of saws. ever try putting the bearing in the freezer for ten or so minutes?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## stubnail67 (Jan 3, 2014)

dont see my reply LOL.... have you ever tried to put the bearing into a freezer?


----------



## Trx250r180 (Jan 3, 2014)

whats the difference of reusing a main bearing vs a rod bearing ,they are both used and have the same hours on them ?


----------



## Jacob J. (Jan 3, 2014)

Trx250r180 said:


> whats the difference of reusing a main bearing vs a rod bearing ,they are both used and have the same hours on them ?



They are constructed differently and take different loads during operation of a chainsaw (and many other types of equipment.)


----------



## pioneerguy600 (Jan 3, 2014)

griffonks said:


> Yes, there's a bearing supplier in Denver, Brown's or Brownell's, I have limited time to spend though.
> 
> I'm spending all my free day time in flood recovery. My farm and bass fishery got shredded, 400 tractor dumper loads of fill to rebuild the washed out dikes, berms and roads.
> 
> ...



Sometimes you just have to bite the bullet when in a bind like yours and pay off shelf prices. My builds are planned well in advance but then again I have oodles of saws hanging around.


----------



## angelo c (Jan 3, 2014)

Trx250r180 said:


> whats the difference of reusing a main bearing vs a rod bearing ,they are both used and have the same hours on them ?




...and the Rod Bearings can't be replaced (unless you replace the crank too) as easily as the case bearings. but i get your point.


----------



## angelo c (Jan 3, 2014)

JJ what do the 6202 bearings fit ?


----------



## Jacob J. (Jan 3, 2014)

angelo c said:


> JJ what do the 6202 bearings fit ?



6202 is the common size for many 50-70cc saws...except for the proprietary PTO bearings in 024/026/MS-260/034/036/MS-361/044/046/MS-440/MS-460...


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## Eccentric (Jan 3, 2014)

angelo c said:


> JJ what do the 6202 bearings fit ?



Husqvarna 61-272XP series is one.


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## angelo c (Jan 3, 2014)

Jacob J. said:


> 6202 is the common size for many 50-70cc saws...except for the proprietary PTO bearings in 024/026/MS-260/034/036/MS-361/044/046/MS-440/MS-460...



Thanks JJ, 
What size fit the 460 ? In SNF ? My buddy said he would grab a handful off the shelf for me.


----------



## angelo c (Jan 3, 2014)

I have a pair of 6202 sitting for a rebuild that i think were for a 440 or a 460 ..??


----------



## nmurph (Jan 3, 2014)

6202 are in 346/357/372 just to name a few.


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## jughead500 (Jan 3, 2014)

I thought i was having trouble with the MS260 Flywheel side bearing not going in enough but found yesterday after pressing it back out that the replacement bearing i got was at least 1/8" thicker than the Original.brand is niachi from japan.anyone else found this problem?


----------



## nmurph (Jan 3, 2014)

It sounds like you got the wrong bearing. The numbers on the bearing tell the dimensions.


----------



## Jacob J. (Jan 3, 2014)

angelo c said:


> I have a pair of 6202 sitting for a rebuild that i think were for a 440 or a 460 ..??



A 6202 would fit the flywheel side of a 440 or 460, but not the PTO (clutch) side. 



jughead500 said:


> I thought i was having trouble with the MS260 Flywheel side bearing not going in enough but found yesterday after pressing it back out that the replacement bearing i got was at least 1/8" thicker than the Original.brand is niachi from japan.anyone else found this problem?



6002 is the usual generic size for the 024/026/MS-260 but you have to be careful. Most manufacturers make a regular 6002 that's 11mm wide and the stock bearing is 10mm wide. But, they also make a 6002D that's 13mm wide and it sounds like that's what you have.


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## fin460 (Jan 4, 2014)

I need to be taking notes.


----------



## pioneerguy600 (Jan 4, 2014)

One thing I will suggest for you fellows out there installing bearings. You should get yourself a digital caliper and familiarize yourself with how to measure a bearing for size. You might get the right bearing from a real bearing house distributor but several times I have been handed a bearing in a clear plastic wrap and was told it was what I was looking for, good thing I can read a caliper. Its saved me many times from doing a job more than once. Usually a bearing is measured by giving the inside diameter /shaft diameter first, then the outer race diameter followed by the width of the outer bearing race. This would look like 25 mm X 55mm X 10mm for a theoritical bearing.


----------



## sefh3 (Jan 4, 2014)

pioneerguy600 said:


> One thing I will suggest for you fellows out there installing bearings. You should get yourself a digital caliper and familiarize yourself with how to measure a bearing for size. You might get the right bearing from a real bearing house distributor but several times I have been handed a bearing in a clear plastic wrap and was told it was what I was looking for, good thing I can read a caliper. Its saved me many times from doing a job more than once. Usually a bearing is measured by giving the inside diameter /shaft diameter first, then the outer race diameter followed by the width of the outer bearing race. This would look like 25 mm X 55mm X 10mm for a theoritical bearing.



Jerry that is great information and always good to know. I have learned to write down 25mm ID 55mm OD and 10mm thick and hand that to the parts guy.


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## pioneerguy600 (Jan 4, 2014)

sefh3 said:


> m
> Jerry that is great information and always good to know. I have learned to write down 25mm ID 55mm OD and 10m thick and hand that to the parts guy.


 That is very good info also Scott, just add another m after the 10m thick.
With it written down that way there are no if`s and butt`s about what you want. I just go to the counter where I get my stuff and rattle off the bearing number and the dimensions and get what I am looking for, 90% of the time they get it right but a few times I got a bearing a mm to wide , not what I asked for so now I get them to measure it right there at the counter. Most of the staff there know me and don`t think it strange that I ask them to measure it, a new face once in a while has asked,What don`t you trust me?? ....LOL


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## angelo c (Jan 4, 2014)

fin460 said:


> I need to be taking notes.




Yes we do as we all know just how quickly this whole site goes kapooeee sometimes?...


----------



## sefh3 (Jan 4, 2014)

pioneerguy600 said:


> That is very good info also Scott, just add another m after the 10m thick.
> With it written down that way there are no if`s and butt`s about what you want. I just go to the counter where I get my stuff and rattle off the bearing number and the dimensions and get what I am looking for, 90% of the time they get it right but a few times I got a bearing a mm to wide , not what I asked for so now I get them to measure it right there at the counter. Most of the staff there know me and don`t think it strange that I ask them to measure it, a new face once in a while has asked,What don`t you trust me?? ....LOL



The other "m" is at the top of the post. Don't ask my how it go there.


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## big t double (Jan 8, 2014)

i just split the case on an 064 tonight and figured this would be a good thread to reference for pointers/tips…it is…but i have a question…do you have a preferred/recommended way of removing the bearings from the case? I'm a little scared to clap the case out by beating them with a hammer and socket crooked…my aims never been the straightest haha….ive done it on 200t's but never a larger case saw….i wonder if you'll get an email or alert?? oh well...


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## pioneerguy600 (Jan 8, 2014)

big t double said:


> i just split the case on an 064 tonight and figured this would be a good thread to reference for pointers/tips…it is…but i have a question…do you have a preferred/recommended way of removing the bearings from the case? I'm a little scared to clap the case out by beating them with a hammer and socket crooked…my aims never been the straightest haha….ive done it on 200t's but never a larger case saw….i wonder if you'll get an email or alert?? oh well...



If you heat the case with a torch, don`t get the flame close enough to burn the paint but get the case hot quickly, then slam it down hard on the benchtop gasket side downward the bearing will pop out on its own.


----------



## pioneerguy600 (Jan 8, 2014)

sefh3 said:


> The other "m" is at the top of the post. Don't ask my how it go there.



Ok,...I fixed that for you Scott.


----------



## sefh3 (Jan 8, 2014)

pioneerguy600 said:


> If you heat the case with a torch, don`t get the flame close enough to burn the paint but get the case hot quickly, then slam it down hard on the benchtop gasket side downward the bearing will pop out on its own.



I use a heat gun. Its safer I feel and easier on the case. After I warm it up I place the case on a bench vise and tap the bearing out. New bearing goes in the same way.


----------



## sefh3 (Jan 8, 2014)

pioneerguy600 said:


> Ok,...I fixed that for you Scott.



Thanks for the fix!!!


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## PogoInTheWoods (Jan 9, 2014)

I use an arbor press and an appropriately sized socket to remove bearings with the case moderately heated before hand.

A word of advice when using a socket with a press...make sure it isn't a tapered socket. I learned the hard way on an 066 case when the bearing popped loose under enough pressure for the socket to get driven into the seal bore (small flywheel side) far enough to actually ruin that case half. Yeah. That sucked.


----------



## sefh3 (Jan 9, 2014)

I use a press and heat. I did the heat and workbench vise prior to getting a press.


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## Mastermind (Jan 10, 2014)

Nice thread......I wish emails still worked like they once did.


----------



## Eccentric (Jan 10, 2014)

Mastermind said:


> Nice thread......I wish emails still worked like they once did.



Try posting in the site support section. I'll bet Claudio fixes you right up.


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## Mastermind (Jan 10, 2014)

My friend Aaron. 

That comment hurt my fragile heart. 

Randy


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## sefh3 (Jan 10, 2014)

Eccentric said:


> Try posting in the site support section. I'll bet Claudio fixes you right up.



Ouch!!!!!


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## Mastermind (Jan 10, 2014)

Troooof


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## big t double (Jan 10, 2014)

Is there a masterminded method of removing the bearings from the case?


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## Jacob J. (Jan 10, 2014)

That Aaron, he can sure be a baritone at times.


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## Mastermind (Jan 10, 2014)

I drive them out with a hammer.


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## whitedogone (Jan 10, 2014)

Mastermind said:


> I drive them out with a hammer.


 
I hate it when ya'll get all teckncal an stuff


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## Mastermind (Jan 10, 2014)

Yeah, if a hammer can't fix it......then it must be an electrical issue.


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## angelo c (Jan 10, 2014)

big t double said:


> Is there a masterminded method of removing the bearings from the case?


yes. first you call Claudio...then you call Randy...then conference the two together.....wait a few seconds for the sparks to fly and things really get heated up good. make sure you aim the conversation toward (the base of the case or the mounts) the email notification system and add something towards the "sponsor" policy. rinse, lather repeat....that should make your bearings fall out.


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## big t double (Jan 10, 2014)

Oh my


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## Mastermind (Jan 10, 2014)

Glad to see someone has been paying attention.


----------



## whitedogone (Jan 10, 2014)

Just ran across a vid of the mastermind case bearing removal process. Them boys are hiding a lot we all don't see here on AS.


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## angelo c (Jan 10, 2014)

just stirrin the pot brother....


and watchin and learnin too.....someday I wanna get my "grinders degree" !!!!!


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## angelo c (Jan 10, 2014)

whitedogone said:


> Just ran across a vid of the mastermind case bearing removal process. Them boys are hiding a lot we all don't see here on AS.




dude thats messed up...Randy told me his accent was from the South Bronx...why he lie to me ?... he from south east asia ...he no goo man !!!!


----------



## whitedogone (Jan 10, 2014)

luv you long time


----------



## buzz sawyer (Jan 10, 2014)

whitedogone said:


> Just ran across a vid of the mastermind case bearing removal process. Them boys are hiding a lot we all don't see here on AS.




私は、あなたがこの素晴らしいツールを使用して非常に迅速にベアリングを取り除くことができると思いますが、あなたはそれでベアリングを取り付けるときに注意する必要があります。


----------



## whitedogone (Jan 10, 2014)

buzz sawyer said:


> 난 당신이 훌륭한 도구를 사용하여 매우 빠르게 베어링을 제거 할 수 있다고 생각하지만 당신은 그것으로 베어링을 설치할 때주의해야합니다.


 LMAO


----------



## buzz sawyer (Jan 10, 2014)

Sorry , had to edit, wrong language.


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## ChoppyChoppy (Dec 14, 2014)

What is "decrepit" about that? I work on saws often that make those look brand new. As far as bearing fitting, I stick the case on teh wood stove. We have a rack on it for drying gloves, heating lunch/parts, etc. haha Do the same for pistons to get the wrist pin in real easy.

It's not super fussy on the temp, 300-400 won't harm anything metal.


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## jbighump (Dec 14, 2014)

Just another use for the wood stove....


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## jughead500 (Dec 14, 2014)

You all act like the wood stove was invented in the 21st century. Bearing installation was so last year.:****you:


----------



## jughead500 (Dec 14, 2014)

jughead500 said:


> You all act like the wood stove was invented in the 21st century. Bearing installation was so last year.:****you:


the finger smiley is censored.


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## Mastermind (Dec 14, 2014)

:farkyou:


----------



## Mastermind (Dec 14, 2014)

Mastermind said:


> :farkyou:



Don't even work.......this place is broked.


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## weimedog (Dec 15, 2014)

Heat differential approach to removing and replacing bearings has been around since there have been metal things to stuff bearings into. Need around a 250 degree difference plus or minus a little for Husqvarna cases.... Put the bearings in the freezer and use a hot plate, a wood stove, a variety of heat sources to make it easy to control the temperature of the cases. A toaster oven. All work. Used to heat cases for dirt bikes to 300 degrees. That's more than you need. But the ALL STEEL bearings would drop right in or out depending on the direction you are going. Those "nylon" caged bearings make me nervous so I don't use them even if they are OEM...... but thanks again to "Randy" for shedding a little light on the subject yet again...


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## Stihl Ohioan (Dec 15, 2014)

Thanks for this great info . I am getting ready to rebuild a ms 440 and am going to try the oil pump trick for the depth setting .


----------



## PogoInTheWoods (Dec 15, 2014)

Stihl Ohioan said:


> Thanks for this great info . I am getting ready to rebuild a ms 440 and am going to try the oil pump trick for the depth setting .



No 'trick' about it. That's how it's supposed to be done.

​


----------



## sunfish (Dec 15, 2014)

Neal told me to heat the case halves, but I didn't, used a big hammer. Did put the bearings in the freezer. All worked well, but will heat the case next time...


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## weimedog (Dec 15, 2014)

I like heating the entire case vs. locally heating things. Ovens do that. Toaster ovens are good enough. That's what I use when I'm not fooling around for "farmer jones" video's using "back woods" tools to fix saws. (used a wood stove and a lazer thermometer to keep track of the temps for chits & grins in one) Works for Husqvarna's...but don't need to use an oil pump! Does it respond well to heat???

When done right, the bearings drop right in with no interference. Works with setting cranks in those bearings as well. Just don't waste time.... as soon as the temps begin to even out due to heat transfer from the warm things to cooler things.... they "bite" and now force is required defeating the purpose.


----------



## Adirondackstihl (Dec 15, 2014)

MAPP works for me.
Keep the bearings cold.
The last 4 bearings Ive installed have literally dropped right into place


----------



## griffonks (Dec 15, 2014)

I use a heat gun, an ir thermometer and frozen bearings. I have used an oven and it works fine, it's just that the odor in the kitchen is a bit different.... I have an ms360 and a ms440 coming up for case splitting/rebuilding.


----------



## blsnelling (Dec 15, 2014)

I heat the case with a torch, careful to not burn the paint. I keep the flame moving, making about 10 passes around the bearing pocket. The bearing usually just falls in. I don't freeze the bearings either.


----------



## fatboycowen (Dec 15, 2014)

I'm getting ready to re-do my 385, which needs the OE sealed bearing on one side. It has a non-metallic cage (nothing i can do about it), plus the seal. Do i have to worry about the heat transfer from the case half damaging that bearing? What about the seal? Or, is 250 not hot enough to do damage? 

This thread is awesome, btw.


----------



## blsnelling (Dec 15, 2014)

I hit it with compressed air as soon as I drop the bearing in. I can't imagine enough hear transferring to damage the bearing and seal. It probable gets hotter during normal operation.


----------



## fatboycowen (Dec 15, 2014)

Sweet. I'll give that a shot. Thank you.


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## PogoInTheWoods (Dec 15, 2014)

The bearings and race itself will absorb the heat and the seal and cage will be fine....at 250~275 degrees.

My tool of choice for heating is a toaster oven. The entire case half expands and contracts in uniform fashion instead of just stressing out locally at the bearing location. May not matter one way or another, but I have a handle on the 'relative' temperature recommended in the shop manual that way vs. just heating up the bearing seat/bore with a torch or heat gun and maybe putting undue stress on what is already a pretty stressful area of a chainsaw.


----------



## fatboycowen (Dec 15, 2014)

magnesium and aluminum have a very high thermal conductivity. That means if you heat one part, it will quickly transfer to other parts of the case. 
Steel is much lower.


----------



## dgeesaman (Jan 2, 2015)

pioneerguy600 said:


> Napa is still making $20. off your purchase. Do you have an industrial bearing and seal distributor in your local area? Motion bearing charges around $5. for C3 rated chainsaw bearings.



Today I paid 6.89 ea for 6202 C3 from SKF.

I agree with the Nachi being good quality, and the vast majority of chinese, romanian, or unmarked bearings being junk. NSK, NTN, Koyo, Nachi, SKF, FAG, Timken, are all very good. If you can read off the bearing code from the existing bearing, the local industrial bearing supplier can usually match it well. Personally I do not pay more for OEM bearings when they are simply metric standard bearings - and I only re-use bearings when I don't care much about long term life.

David


----------



## glock37 (Nov 15, 2015)

I just wanted to say thanks to Randy for showing us how to install bearings

Just got done installing bearings in a MS 880 that had a bad rusted clutch side bearing

Heated case halves just like the thread both bearings dropped right in and only had to smack crank one time to free up once bolted tight

Mike


----------



## glock37 (Nov 15, 2015)

This is what i started with 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Mastermind (Nov 15, 2015)

You are doing a lot of those big saws these day Mike. Many dealers I know have never even seen one. That puts you in the upper percentile.


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## glock37 (Nov 15, 2015)

I only do what the dealer doesnt have the time too do 

Thanks 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Definitive Dave (Nov 15, 2015)

crazy oil seal!!


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## glock37 (Nov 15, 2015)

I never seen a oil wear thru there how no idea the flange was still in bearing 

You think because bearing was rusted ?


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## Metals406 (Nov 15, 2015)

These can be found everywhere, for those wanting a reliable, cheap temperature indicator.
http://www.amazon.com/Tempil-Tempilstik-Temperature-Indicators-tempilstik/dp/B0013KVRI0


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## Jacob J. (Nov 15, 2015)

Metals406 said:


> These can be found everywhere, for those wanting a reliable, cheap temperature indicator.
> http://www.amazon.com/Tempil-Tempilstik-Temperature-Indicators-tempilstik/dp/B0013KVRI0



Is that like a mood ring?


----------



## Metals406 (Nov 15, 2015)

Jacob J. said:


> Is that like a mood ring?


Anal suppository


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## Mastermind (Nov 15, 2015)

Oh My. 

Pics........FFS man.


----------



## fin460 (Nov 16, 2015)

This is the thread that got me over my fears of splitting a case, Thanks Randy for the great knowledge you share.


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## Mastermind (Nov 16, 2015)

fin460 said:


> This is the thread that got me over my fears of splitting a case, Thanks Randy for the great knowledge you share.



Hell man, everything I know about saws I learned from y'all.


----------



## husqORbust (Oct 19, 2019)

big t double said:


> is this a flat rate type job? 150 seems cheap for the amount of time spent...I gotta assume this takes a min of 2 to 2-1/2 hrs. cool thread, thanks for sharing





Mastermind said:


> You are welcome to pay more.
> 
> It's only worth so much to revive an old saw.....
> 
> We do very few that are that ugly, but we split several a week for rebuilds.



Flat rate in a way... this type of work is probably "cored and used or charged accordingly".

I bet Mastermind and his Guy(Randy and his Son In Law, but I wont pretend like I know them... "Randy" just gets thrown around lots on this site) can hammer a pro saw apart and back together in record times.

$150 price might seem cheap to us but I cant imagine it being all that difficult OR time consuming if you know what you're doing. Its all tricks of the trade. As an ex driveshaft builder and engine building apprentice, there are so many tips and tricks to be learned to make a job go FAST and PERFECT it'd make ones head spin.

It's threads like these though that spill the beans...Combined with what I already know mechanically, I am going to take what this thread has shown me and rebuild a pro saw.

It will take me many more hours than Randy and Jon can get it done, but with these tricks of the trade being handed out for free I should be able to get it done without grenading anything.

Thanks Mastermind!


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## weimedog (Oct 19, 2019)

While there certainly are a few true "craftsman/artisans" out there worth every penny while building amazing saws, nothing to do with a single cylinder two stroke on soft metal cases is rocket science. I'm just a hobby type as many who visit places like this. I do bearings for my saws and for my very small set of customers. ( Can't/Won't take on any more than I have ) Even so, seems like splitting cases and replacing bearings & seals is a weekly event any more.

It's a mix of heat differential and pressure. Less heat difference between bearings and cases means more pressure or trauma to put those bearings in. Or More heat difference is less pressure. Of course the "upper" limit on the heat has to do with the materials exposed to the heat. Simple as that. How you get that mix is dependent on the tools at your disposal. Did a video years ago using a wood stove, made fun of the "red neck" approach or extreme field conditions but made the point it's about physics.....many ways to skin this cat.

I use one of three things...a turkey roaster, a hot plate, or a heat gun. Key to for me is nylon vs steel, stuff still on the cases or bare cases, is it my hobby saw or customer saw, it's the mix of those factors defines approach and temperature 4 me.....SO beginning of this first video, or end of the second covers the "least traumatic approach" assuming bare cases and a higher temp.

I guess the only caveat for me is when installing nylon caged vs. steel cages. Not really "scientific" and I'm not even certain is matters, just what I do. But when installing the nylon's; I chill the nylon caged bearings and keep the case temps in the 275 plus a bit but under 300, then chill the assembly really quickly after installation where as with the steels, I leave the bearings room temp and heat the cases to somewhere in the 300 plus range. Temps don't bother them as much and having less "tapping" or pressure with the higher temps as shown in these video's is less stressful on everything involved. SO showed lower temps with a heat gun with a little tapping. Not optimal but not enough to hurt anything either, do this if all the chain brake stuff is still on, a quick and dirty approach. And also show the higher temps with steel caged where you literally can drop them in.

Done some derivative of this set of approaches since the 1970's with motorcycle cases as well, pretty much anything with a press fit or interference fit bearing in Aluminum or Magnesium.

For those who need visualization, While these video's are really about 372's and the many versions, they also covers replacing bearings. The first minute or so in the first video...then just ignore the rest and jump to minute 20 the second one and ignore the rest.



jump to minute 20 on this video


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## husqORbust (Oct 19, 2019)

weimedog said:


> While there certainly are a few true "craftsman/artisans" out there worth every penny while building amazing saws, nothing to do with a single cylinder two stroke on soft metal cases is rocket science. I'm just a hobby type as many who visit places like this. I do bearings for my saws and for my very small set of customers. ( Can't/Won't take on any more than I have ) Even so, seems like splitting cases and replacing bearings & seals is a weekly event any more.
> 
> It's a mix of heat differential and pressure. Less heat difference between bearings and cases means more pressure or trauma to put those bearings in. Or More heat difference is less pressure. Of course the "upper" limit on the heat has to do with the materials exposed to the heat. Simple as that. How you get that mix is dependent on the tools at your disposal. Did a video years ago using a wood stove, made fun of the "red neck" approach or extreme field conditions but made the point it's about physics.....many ways to skin this cat.



You got it. I can think of at least a few ways ways to split and reassemble a bottom end without a specialized tool and probably a few more ways if custom tooling is an option. How many and what kind of tools you have available is going to be the deciding factor to get the job done.

At bare minimum I'm thinking all one needs to re/re a bottom end is a way to peel the bearings off the crank(if replacing), a 32oz ball peen hammer and an assortment of deep sockets and/or old races to use as drivers/supports and a brass hammer/drift. Using heat OR special pulls and presses is definitely the cleanest way to approach the job. Quickest could be argued. Depends what you're set up for.


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