# Rope Wrench



## TreEmergencyB (Mar 9, 2012)

Think I'm going to pull the trigger and pick it up. Never climbed on SRT before but its about time. The rope wrench srt style is most like Ddrt so I think i can get it down quickly. Anyone else out there climbing on it suggestions anyone else thinking about getting it questions. Theres a couple good videos on YouTube and i was at the Lancaster show this year so I'm hooked now.


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## dts99 (Mar 9, 2012)

i just got one and have been fooling around with diffrent ascending options and havent found a good one yet, it is very difficult to go up on. im close to giving up on it to be honest


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## TreEmergencyB (Mar 9, 2012)

dts99 said:


> i just got one and have been fooling around with diffrent ascending options and havent found a good one yet, it is very difficult to go up on. im close to giving up on it to be honest



Frog walker, with Rope Wrench - YouTube


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## epicklein22 (Mar 9, 2012)

Sprung22 climbs with one. He's pretty much set up like the last video. He really likes it and it seems efficient. He went up a tree in my yard in no time with little effort. Steve told me he averages 30 hours a week in the tree, mostly pruning, so that's a big toll on the body. 

It's too much for me to learn and use, as I'm completely old school, but if one was doing a lot of pruning each week, it's something that needs serious consideration. I like the Ddrt traits and Steve said he works the tree completely in SRT with this system. It seems it takes a while to get the correct setup.


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## dts99 (Mar 9, 2012)

TreEmergencyB said:


> Frog walker, with Rope Wrench - YouTube



i only tried that breiftly in my yard only haveing a small climb, i havnt tried it on an actuall job yet. in my yard i can only go up about ten feet not realy enuf to see if it works, i will try it again. i did 3 trees last week and tried 3 differnt aproches on the ascend, ill i got was tired. i even made a 3to1 with an acender and a pully that i could push way up with a pole saw, i could ascnd with one hand, for a few pulls then i was beat., i do most of my long climbs with a treeacsned and 2 pantins its super fast


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## Saw Dust Smoken (Mar 9, 2012)

*wrench*

Just ship that wrench my way if it dont work for ya. Ill give it a go for ya.


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## 802climber (Mar 9, 2012)

I like mine a lot. And the only way I have used it for work is just with a solo foot ascender and velocity rope. Yes, it does take some messing around with it to find the right setup.

I do wish they came with the quick release pin for mid-line attachable. Still haven't ordered my pin yet.

I wonder why it is giving you so much trouble. What hitch/tail are you using? You can also rig it up to be self-advancing pretty easily, that takes some of the hassle out of the system right there.


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## treevet (Mar 10, 2012)

dieseldirt said:


> I like mine a lot. And the only way I have used it for work is just with a solo foot ascender and velocity rope. Yes, it does take some messing around with it to find the right setup.
> 
> I do wish they came with the quick release pin for mid-line attachable. Still haven't ordered my pin yet.
> 
> I wonder why it is giving you so much trouble. What hitch/tail are you using? You can also rig it up to be self-advancing pretty easily, that takes some of the hassle out of the system right there.



what ya usin for the self advancing...chest kroll, lanyard over the shoulder with swivel snap? Any vid of that set up/process in action?


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## TreEmergencyB (Mar 10, 2012)

dieseldirt said:


> I do wish they came with the quick release pin for mid-line attachable. Still haven't ordered my pin yet.
> 
> .



they do make it do a search on the other tree care forum its been covered there. I believe the pin can be ordered from treestuff as well


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## Shandrum (Mar 10, 2012)

I made one. Im sure it sets up and reacts about the same as the manufactured one. My set up works really well. I climb on blaze. I also use a black diamond vario chest harness. Ive tried a few hitches and have had the best results with a 4/1 distel on 30" beeline split tail. Using a hitchclimber pulley, i attach my main connection point to the bottom holes of the pulley, the wrench tether to the top hole and my chest harness to the center hole. It tends great and supports everything nicely. I use a pantin on my right foot for climbs below 50' and add a basic ascender walker set-up to my left leg for longer aacents. Hope this helps.


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## arborjockey (Mar 10, 2012)

I like that the guy in the video said twice that there's not a lot of gear involved :msp_scared: only thing he was misssing was the chipper and truck. I guess that's stuffs cool for an old or overweight women. I go to work for the work out:lifter: old school. Not harder nor smarter just faster. Speed fallows technique but when your technique takes 10min. to set up im already pruning. Unless the trees are big.....are the trees that big?


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## formationrx (Mar 10, 2012)

*one mans opinion....*

....the more you #### with the plumbing..... the easier it is to clog up the drain.....


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## TreeAce (Mar 10, 2012)

I tried the wrench and didnt care for it. But I am def old school at heart so srt is unnatural to me. For acsent srt is cool but for working a tree I am just not into it. I coulda tried harder to get used to it.....but didnt want to.


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## arborjockey (Mar 10, 2012)

If 1 mans opinion clogs the drain. The sensitivity filter is turned on a little high.:msp_w00t:


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## ROPECLIMBER (Mar 11, 2012)

Formation was agreeing with you Arborjockey "to much stuff clogs the drain" is what I read into it, I have read alot of your post and am very impressed with your skill and knowledge especially with high climbs and Arborculture knowledge, your opinion matters more than you think.
Paul


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## imagineero (Mar 11, 2012)

SRT is great for bigger trees. I don't get a lot of bigger trees, but when i do it's worth the switch over. All SRT systems are good, it's more a matter of which one you're proficient with. The wrench, like any system has its pros and cons.

I think most residential tree guys could benefit more from spruicing up there normal working techniques. A good foot ascender plus a slack tender takes most of the work out of ascending in the sub 80 foot range. The pantene kicks out too easy for my liking, and I'm a petzl nut from way back. I use the CMI foot ascender. It's ugly as sin and about the size of a russian tank, but it engages positively and never kicks out. 

I use a small u shaped shackle plus a loop of zing it for my slack tender. I'll photograph the setup sometime this week if anyone's interested. It cost me about $6. The U shaped shackle has a captive pin so you can't drop it, and the zing it loop acts as a prussik. It's tied to the shackle in such a way that the shackle cant come off. I attach the zing it 'prussik' to the harness side of my climb line. The shackle clips on under my hitch. You can slide the prusik up or down to set it right for no set back. When you're in the tree, one of the biggest pains of a slack tender system is that you can't easily give yourself slack when you need it. The advantage of this system is that you can unclip the shackle in about 1 second.

The slack tender saves a lot of work, but the real benefit is with having it together with the foot ascender. With a normal hitch system you can only hump air equal to the distance of about one prusik loop length. ie. if your prussik loop is 18", the hitch ends up at about waist height with each 'hump' and you slide it up. You don't see guys humping to the point the hitch ends up at their knee. If you use a foot ascender without a slack tender, you can only take 'steps' equal to your hitch length. Because it's hard to slide the prusik up from your knee. With the slack tender, the hitch never drops. So you can take steps as big as you want, easily as big as two full size 'humps'. The effort is a lot less, none of it is wasted. Yeah, you're still only getting half your height out of each go, but it's so easy and smooth.

For long ascents, you can add a single ascender and footloop plus a bit of shock cord for a texas rope walked styled ascent. Coupled with the $6 slack tender it's a hard system to beat. I use it for medium trees (up to about 100' freehanging ascent). It already uses the hitch that we all know and love and is great for working the tree. The foot ascender is pretty transparent and good to have on for working the tree. I set my high point with a big shot, setup the ascender. Tie my hitch and get moving. It's pretty effortless, and you can get to 110' and not be out of breath. I say this as a big fat bastard. At that point I usually send the ascender down and the only extra bit of gear I'm carrying is the foot ascender which is good for working the tree. This is really only for pruning work, on a removal I'm going spikes all the way.

Will take pics/vids if anybody is interested.

Shaun


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## TreeAce (Mar 11, 2012)

I wouldnt mind checking out any photos or video you wanna share.


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## treevet (Mar 11, 2012)

imagineero said:


> SRT is great for bigger trees. I don't get a lot of bigger trees, but when i do it's worth the switch over. All SRT systems are good, it's more a matter of which one you're proficient with. The wrench, like any system has its pros and cons.
> 
> I think most residential tree guys could benefit more from spruicing up there normal working techniques. A good foot ascender plus a slack tender takes most of the work out of ascending in the sub 80 foot range. The pantene kicks out too easy for my liking, and I'm a petzl nut from way back. I use the CMI foot ascender. It's ugly as sin and about the size of a russian tank, but it engages positively and never kicks out.
> 
> ...



Different strokes for different blokes but to me the POSITIVE aspect of the Pantin is that it kicks out easily. The whole positive or improvement of this system is obviously being to able to descend on a single line. On big trees I am gonna wraptor up (another huge revelation in the biz) and easy change over. 

After sending the wraptor down, Going down and back up is part of a big prune. This rw, makes it so easy...prune one side of a big tree then you still have your srt to go back up and down the other side. Whatever distance you pull your bod up you get instead of half the distance in ddrt.

The ideal situation is having 2 guys (I have even been in huge elms in Princeton NJ with 4 guys in one tree and not even get close to each other) but having a second pruner on my crew hasn't been do able for a few years. I probably did 15 to 20 $1500 or more all day one day pruning jobs last year (incl clean up) and I think I am gonna spring for one of these next week. It just makes sense.

If you are still climbing on a taught line or blakes with no hclimber/tender...you are REALLY in the stone ages. The ole put the inner side of your boot or shoe on the down part of your cl line so you can advance your hitch...so yesterday. Dangerous too, or time consuming if you lanyard in each time.


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## husabud (Mar 11, 2012)

TreeAce said:


> I wouldnt mind checking out any photos or video you wanna share.




YouTube has all you need. Anything Kevin Bingham has put up is spot on. I use a frog system for ascent and leave my left hand ascender on the line for limb walking, clip a dmm pulley onto it and you can easily pull yourself back into the trunk when done, as long as you clip the tail end of the rope to your saddle. I have been using your RW almost exclusively since I bought it except for a few removals. SRT is the future once you get used to it. So much easier on the body. I have even ascended SRT and switched over to Ddrt once I am where I want to be. It is fast. The only thing that sketches me out is the basal tie off. Too easy to cut your lifeline if your not paying attention. I have been sending up a running bolen as aTIP, once there you are set to work.
You should go to a local TCC and check out some of the systems the other guys use.


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## arborjockey (Mar 11, 2012)

ROPECLIMBER said:


> Formation was agreeing with you Arborjockey "to much stuff clogs the drain" is what I read into it, I have read alot of your post and am very impressed with your skill and knowledge especially with high climbs and Arborculture knowledge, your opinion matters more than you think.
> Paul



:msp_tongue: Oops my bad. Sorry formation. I wish more people that sit idle and read would post more. I love to hear other opinions even if I don't agree. I dig a new thing. The industry sat idle with the taunt line then blakes hitch for 50 years. Now its exploding. The newer mochiaco?? Whatever it is. Sucks. To sticky. 

Remember I get out of the truck, throw my saddle on, grab my rope, and climb right to the top of the tree. While most guys are trying to fly a kite with the throw ball. Then they're looking for a certain do hickey. Now the their in the tree but have to tie in and get rid of the crap they drug up. My old boss was older school then me and still shamed the young guys. I do understand smarter not harder. It cuts down on the injuries as well as saves tou some energy for maintenance after work:smile2:


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## treevet (Mar 11, 2012)

arborjockey said:


> :msp_tongue: Oops my bad. Sorry formation. I wish more people that sit idle and read would post more. I love to hear other opinions even if I don't agree. I dig a new thing. The industry sat idle with the taunt line then blakes hitch for 50 years. Now its exploding. The newer mochiaco?? Whatever it is. Sucks. To sticky.
> 
> Remember I get out of the truck, throw my saddle on, grab my rope, and climb right to the top of the tree. While most guys are trying to fly a kite with the throw ball. Then they're looking for a certain do hickey. Now the their in the tree but have to tie in and get rid of the crap they drug up. My old boss was older school then me and still shamed the young guys. I do understand smarter not harder. It cuts down on the injuries as well as saves tou some energy for maintenance after work:smile2:



If you got a 120' oak or tuliptree like we have many and other species around here...you won't be "throwing your saddle on, grabbing your rope, and climbing right to the top of the tree" when you got 30 foot spans between branches with 3' trunk dia sometimes. Don't even think of saying you shimmy up there either. Sorry but just gotta call bs on that one...I likely got way more time in the tree than your old boss or any other boss you ever had.

Just sayin lol


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## treevet (Mar 11, 2012)

Hey AJ, is that you? Haven't talked to ya for a while if it was you up in Hamilton Ohio for a while. If so, where ya at now? Hope all is going good for ya.


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## arborjockey (Mar 12, 2012)

*Ah the vet*

Here's pic # 4 View attachment 228520



I was working for a guy who had his equipment in Hamiltuckey. My house was in Kettering. I went to Oregon to work for an old friend for a couple of years. I spent 2 months in Carmel Indiana cutting for a guy. The last year I've been in Hawaii. I asked in the begging of the threade if the trees were big around there. I did Dayton University and lots of historical trees in the Natti, and had some good accounts in Indian hill. 
The big oh has big trees but not all over. Where's the pics of that big ash trunk in the bed of your cab over?

Here's a huge ash that grew up through a sycamore. I hiked in for an hour to get to it and climb it.

1My x girl friend

2Ol' Barttlet rig.

3. Cold day in Dayton

4. Top of 1st tree


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## treevet (Mar 12, 2012)

arborjockey said:


> The big oh has big trees but not all over. Where's the pics of that big ash trunk in the bed of your cab over?



Couldn't find the single pict but here is one with other trucks. That was only one of the two main stems on an ancient ash just walking distance from our lot on Wyoming Country Club that was dropping 2 ft. dia. branches right on the second shot area on 3rd hole.


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## treevet (Mar 24, 2012)

View attachment 230533


gonna work out very smoothly I think.


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## imagineero (Mar 24, 2012)

Not with that much distance between your pulley and your hitch me thinks.... A different hitch or a shorter I2I?

Shaun


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## flushcut (Mar 24, 2012)

Over at TH Pctree (of the wraptor fame) is making something call the Hitch Hiker and that is going to be the end of the rope wrench IMO. It is a much cleaner design with easy midline attachment and is on my shopping list.


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## treevet (Mar 24, 2012)

imagineero said:


> Not with that much distance between your pulley and your hitch me thinks.... A different hitch or a shorter I2I?
> 
> Shaun



haven't taken it up in the air yet but seems to work ok on my lat machine. yes the big gap will give a lag from pull gained to pull realized?


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## treevet (Mar 24, 2012)

flushcut said:


> Over at TH Pctree (of the wraptor fame) is making something call the Hitch Hiker and that is going to be the end of the rope wrench IMO. It is a much cleaner design with easy midline attachment and is on my shopping list.




couldn't be any easier mid line attachmt. than this with 4.95 pin (bigger pin n/good). keep us posted on this on this thread flush as I don't like to slum over there :-}


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## imagineero (Mar 25, 2012)

treevet said:


> haven't taken it up in the air yet but seems to work ok on my lat machine. yes the big gap will give a lag from pull gained to pull realized?



Yeah, aka sitback. An inch or two is no big deal, but looks like you've got quite a lot there. That length of I2I is probably about right for a VT. With hitches that don't use as much cord you need a shorter I2I. You can just tie one and experiement until you get the length right, then order a spliced one if you like the spliced eyes. If you've tried the VT and didn't like the way it needs to be attended to then you might try the XT variant. I tried it and found it more stable than the VT but still went back to my old klemheist. 

If you're not a fan of having the tender down at your harness then you can put the whole system on a leash to have it sit up where a standard hitch would normall go. That starts to get tricky with the rope wrench setup though. I've got a home made rope wrench that I've played with a few times but I need to put some more non-working hours on it to get it right. I'm not sure I'd really have a lot of use for it in the sort of trees we mostly do anyhow. 

Found my camera yesterday, it was wedged under the seat of the truck. I've got the battery on charge so hopefully I'll get a few pics up today or tomorrow. 

Shaun


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## pdqdl (Mar 25, 2012)

imagineero said:


> ... With hitches that don't use as much cord you need a shorter I2I. You can just tie one and experiement until you get the length right, then order a spliced one if you like the spliced eyes. ...
> Shaun



You really can't make an i2i much shorter than 26"-28", certainly not with Bee Line. The eye splices run out of room to bury the tail. I found some for sale as short as 21", but that just doesn't seem right. 

The cord gets stiffer where it is doubled for the tail-bury. A 21" i2i would be very stiff 
for most all of it's length; I think this would adversely affect how it performs in a friction hitch.

You are right about getting them shorter though; that's why I splice my own.


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## imagineero (Mar 25, 2012)

Here's a vid as promised of the D shackle slack tender system. If I get some spare energy and time then I'll do some vids later in the week of myself doing some ascending on the different systems with and without tender. I need to get someone to hold the camera though, makes it hard to work the rope and hitch with only one hand. 

The shackle is a halyard shackle, it's stainless and only costs a few dollars from sail supply stores. Be sure to get the type with the separator pin as shown in the vid, and the 1/4 turn captive pin with the bent bar rather than the standard screw pin. The screw pins are almost impossible to open with bare hands once loaded, but the 1/4 turn ones open and close easily with one hand. They come in a few sizes, you want the one where the shackle size is just over 1/2". 

This is the ronstan one which I use. The part number is RF1032 I'm pretty sure from looking at the 3 different sies available on the web. The breaking strain is a bit over 2500lbs, and the weight is 1oz. Gotta love stainless steel. It's obviously not intended for life support purposes due to how easy it is to open the pin;






and another similar one made by a different manufacturer with a 'push' style pin that would probably work ok too






stay away from this style of screw pin. You'll never get it open with your bare hands. Most boats carry a shackle key for the purpose.






It's not as smooth of a system as a finely tuned VT with a hitch climber pulley, but it only costs a few dollars and sets up easy and fast with any type of hitch. You can use it with I2I systems and not worry about getting the length of your cord right since you can just slide the slack tender to wherever it needs to be. It's great if you climb in different hitches/cords.

[video=youtube_share;Y-QFhVgWNRM]http://youtu.be/Y-QFhVgWNRM[/video]


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## flushcut (Mar 25, 2012)

treevet said:


> couldn't be any easier mid line attachmt. than this with 4.95 pin (bigger pin n/good). keep us posted on this on this thread flush as I don't like to slum over there :-}



Sure. The attachment is two steel bieners but the design is what I really like, it fits in between the saddle and hitch with no floppy eye poker on a leash.


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## arborjockey (Mar 25, 2012)

Small loop of dacron, dog clip, and a mico pulley as a slack tender has worked for me. Same method as above. Been around since the tauntline.:msp_rolleyes: with the wrench where do you grab the rope with all that crap on their?


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## treevet (Mar 25, 2012)

flushcut said:


> Sure. The attachment is two steel bieners but the design is what I really like, it fits in between the saddle and hitch with no floppy eye poker on a leash.



I actually meant the Rwrench attachment couldn't be any easier. Has a pin that won't fall out and get lost either.


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## FanOFatherNash (Mar 25, 2012)

arborjockey said:


> :msp_tongue: While most guys are trying to fly a kite with the throw ball. :smile2:



I agree there is alot of new stuff , thats just stuff. Throw bag (kite) is not one of them , how are you pruning with out spikes with out a throw line?



arborjockey said:


> :msp_tongue: My old boss was older school then me :smile2:



( he was so old school he used a flint axe , and wore a loin cloth ?)


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## arborjockey (Mar 26, 2012)

I actually use the throwball quite a bit. Just not as much as most. Takes to much time. The trees have to be good size. My 27' polesaw sets most my rope. My theory is "get to work in the tree I don't care how."



I'm in the tree raining down branchs while guys look through they're bag of tricks for that 1 thing that makes them a little faster. Im not against toys I got plenty. but if I blow $ now days that s.o.b better be simple and make my work easier.:msp_thumbup:


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## pdqdl (Mar 26, 2012)

arborjockey said:


> Small loop of dacron, dog clip, and a mico pulley as a slack tender has worked for me. Same method as above. Been around since the tauntline.:msp_rolleyes: with the wrench where do you grab the rope with all that crap on their?



I think the usual method is to be standing on a foot ascender, and using the hand ascender to hang onto the rope.

I haven't tried the rope wrench yet, but I have been thinking about it. Your point of running out of free space on the working region of the rope is worth thinking about.


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## kevin bingham (Mar 26, 2012)

flushcut said:


> Over at TH Pctree (of the wraptor fame) is making something call the Hitch Hiker and that is going to be the end of the rope wrench IMO. It is a much cleaner design with easy midline attachment and is on my shopping list.



Are you currently an SRT climber?


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## flushcut (Mar 26, 2012)

kevin bingham said:


> Are you currently an SRT climber?



I mostly use SRT for access and switch out to DRT and have used the RADS, but have played with the RW and can't get comfy with it. I don't like the "slack" with the tether I find it to be cumbersome. But that is my opinion.


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## kevin bingham (Mar 26, 2012)

flushcut said:


> I mostly use SRT for access and switch out to DRT and have used the RADS, but have played with the RW and can't get comfy with it. I don't like the "slack" with the tether I find it to be cumbersome. But that is my opinion.



I would say that the difference between a unicender, a ropewrench, the petzl RIG, The fate revolver system, the Kong Robot.... the Hitch Hiker. Is like comparing a distel to a VT to a swabish to a blakes hitch. The fact that if you are climbing SRT than you have made the jump.

One technique might be mildly cleaner or more refined than another but I would take any of these tools over ever working a tree dDRT. But that is my climbing style, for some people dDRT is just a better way to go. I was climbing SRT well before the Rope Wrench came along. There are a hundred ways to configure SRT systems I'm sure. Its not about the tool so much as the Single Line. I am opposite you in that it is more common that sometimes I use dDRT to get up in the tree and then will switch to SRT to work the tree.


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## treevet (Mar 26, 2012)

kevin bingham said:


> sometimes I use dDRT to get up in the tree and then will switch to SRT to work the tree.



That's silly. Takes away the advantage of not switching systems in the canopy. I assume you mean secured footlocking.

You let your gm anchor the srt? I'd kinda at least like to get a look at the anchor although he can tie it off.


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## husabud (Mar 26, 2012)

opcorn:opcorn:


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## newsawtooth (Mar 26, 2012)

kevin bingham said:


> One technique might be mildly cleaner or more refined than another but I would take any of these tools over ever working a tree dDRT.



I've used a RW for a few days now. An elegant solution, Kevin. Endless redirects, consistent friction and smooth descents are what stand out now. I'll still use DdRT for removals and at other times mostly because remote retrieval of the TIP without assistance is helpful.


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## treevet (Mar 27, 2012)

I plan to use it in conjunction with my Wraptor on initial ascent on big prunes as the srt is already set up. Just use the line I am tied into the wraptor with to send down the machine. If someone invents a machine that goes up and down they may have something. This stuff is alot of fun. Esp for an old school manilla rope climber like me from the stone ages.


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