# Chainsaw Chain



## skyhightree1 (Aug 13, 2008)

I have never broke chain and made my own chains out of a spool. I am told it is more cost efficent to do so. How many of yall make your own chains? Is it worth it or should i just continue to buy them then sharpen them and keep them on hand I like starting jobs with new chains and when that chain dulls then use the used chains thats been resharpened. I may be asking stupid questions but let me have it guys.


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## Billy_Bob (Aug 14, 2008)

I just bought all the stuff to make my own chains and am quite pleased with this. I figure chains for a 36 inch bar will cost about $14 each not including the cost of the tools (which I look at as a one time expense).

The best part is I can get any size bar I want and make my own chains for it.

So before if I wanted a different sized bar, I would need to get the bar and at least 4 chains. So maybe looking at $250 to do this.

I bought the breaker and spinner kit from Bailey's. Also the Woodsman Pro chain scale, which is three stickers you stick on your "work bench" and use it to figure out how long of chain you need for a particular bar.

The thing is you need an 8 ft. distance for these stickers to be all layed out. I don't have an 8 ft. work bench. So what I did was stick the stickers on a 2" x 6" and 8 ft. long piece of wood. Then I can place this piece of wood on a table.

To measure your chain... Your bar will have a picture of a chain drive link and then a number. Like my 3/8 pitch 32 inch bar says 105. So I just lay the chain off the reel onto the chain scale (on my 2 x 6 x 8 ft piece of wood) and stick the end of the chain in the finishing nail installed on the wood per the instructions, then pull it tight on the 3/8 scale. Then I adjusted it back a little so the chain drive links would line up with the markings on the 3/8 scale. Then I put masking tape around that last link which covered number 105 so I would know where to break the link. (The chain scale has numbers on it to indicate how many drive links. Like 1, 2, 3, 4, etc.)

They assume you know all about this chain breaking/spinning stuff, so the instructions are little or none. Some of the instructions were not sent with my stuff, but I found them on the Bailey's web site where the individual spinner or breaker was listed for sale.

The instructions don't relate to what you get. For the breaker there are extra parts. I called and they said these were for harvester chains, but for my 3/8 pitch chains, they said to use the installed tip for breaking my chain.

Then there is a rectangular little bar for the breaker. I figured out you stick this in the same sized slot below the punch and this holds a large rectangular metal piece in place. The large rectangular piece has the same size slots in it as the holding piece and this is for holding the large metal piece in place. The slots in the large metal piece are marked. For example one says 3/8. The 3/8 is the large slot *below* where it says 3/8 (not the small slot above where it says 3/8). 

Also, for the breaker, they said to place the punch exactly in the center of the rivet before pulling the handle down. I learned I had to break two rivets before the chain would come undone. The bottom chain link has the rivets stuck to it, so you are just releasing the top plate by punching the rivets, so therefore need to punch two rivets to release the plate!

I don't know this stuff!  

The spinner "squishes" the rivets. The new chain in a reel also comes with the connectors to connect the chain together. So you squish a rivet with one handle, then turn the other handle and this spins (or smoothes out) the squished rivet! Makes it a nice and smooth round shape. Stick a drop of oil in there before squishing and spinning as the directions say.

The various spinning parts for the spinner are labeled, but not the same as what the directions say! I have 3/8 pitch chain. The instructions say to use the "13" anvil used on 354, 3/8, and 404. Well there are 6 "anvils" and two slots in which to place these on the spinner. Luckily 3 will only fit in one side, so I could tell which went where. Then the anvils are marked with dots and nowhere does it say "13". Instead they have one dot, two dots, or three dots. Then there is a plastic anvil tool storage holder which has 6 holes. Two holes have 3 dots, two holes 2 dots, and two holes 1 dot. Then below the row for the two 2 dot anvils, it says 404 and 375...

So the information I have to go by is...
-The instructions which say: "13" anvil used on 354, 3/8, and 404.
-The dots to place the anvils in the correct spots on the tool holder.
-And 404 and 375 printed below the second row of the tool holder.

So I guessed that I should use the two anvils marked with two dots because the 404 number was the same as the instructions said for 3/8!

Then I was able to put each anvil into the correct holder on the spinner because one was hex shaped and would only go into that holder.

Then there was an extra small part which came with this and the instructions didn't say anything about it! I learned that I needed to stick this small round part into the round holder first before sticking in the round anvil. This was so the spinner could squish small enough for my 3/8 chain. It extends the anvil out a bit more.

Then nothing in instructions on how tight to squish the rivets other than not too tight. What I did was I noticed the chain links had a bit of play in them. So I squished a bit then checked the play of the adjoining link. If too much play, then squish a little more. When play same as other links, then done! (If too tight, not good of course because the links would not be able to go around bends.)

Another thing is the chain breaker and spinner needs to be mounted to a table or work bench with screws or it will be almost impossible to use them. 

Anyway they need better instructions for these things!


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## Cedarkerf (Aug 14, 2008)

Yes it is cheaper i figured $15 for 32" chain.


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## skyhightree1 (Aug 14, 2008)

Thanks for all the info I greatly appreciate it I was thinking about breaking a whole roll for my 20 inch bar chains since thats what I used most often and maybe a roll for my limbing saw. since I use those most often WHEN I have treework to do...lol... Do you order your chain from baileys ?


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## Cedarkerf (Aug 14, 2008)

I use Stihl chain exclusively. RSLHK semi skip square ground thats what I have a roll of. Use RSC and RSK for round ground but I buy it by the loop. 28" 460 is my limbing saw unless I am using the 066 then its my limbing saw with a 32" bar. I just think in my experience Stihl chain stays sharper longer in same conditions than other chains I have tried.


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## skyhightree1 (Aug 14, 2008)

Thats a good point I shouldn't break the whole roll I must say stihl chains do stay alot sharper I use the Stihl RS chain as well. I love it we have a place here where you pay them around 8 dollars per chain to have it sharpened and there like new. But I am thinking seriously about breaking my own chains I have a enclosed 6x12 trailer in which i take to large tree jobs or clearing jobs and i have my chain sharpener mounted on a bench in there and when all chains were using dull the guys go in there and sharpen the chains and keep working.


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## Billy_Bob (Aug 14, 2008)

I am trying the Oregon chain this time which I bought from Bailey's. I bought a 100 ft. roll. I use square ground full skip chain.


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## pdqdl (Aug 14, 2008)

*It's not about saving money on chains...*

You will have to make your own chains hundreds of times before you come out ahead on the basic expenses of tools, rolls of chain, and sharpeners. Do it anyway!

You will save so much time and frustration by being able to solve your own chain problems when they happen. Not later, not after you drive to the dealer, and not when UPS brings what you ordered.

It's all about reducing downtime, and getting what is needed WHEN it is needed.


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## woodchux (Aug 14, 2008)

pdqdl said:


> You will have to make your own chains hundreds of times before you come out ahead on the basic expenses of tools, rolls of chain, and sharpeners. /



This is NOT true. You will save money on the FIRST 100' roll. Even with buying the spinner and breaker ! If you do the math you will find that 1640 drive links on a 100 ft roll = 22.7777 20" chains (72 drive links). Now if youre paying $18 per 20" chain youre spending $410 for the same amount of chain. You can get the tools that you need for $90 and a roll of chain for $250 = only $340. You save $70 on the first roll, even including the cost of the tools. 

:greenchainsaw:


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## pdqdl (Aug 14, 2008)

Well, sure. But what about the time you spend MAKING the chains. It doesn't go very fast when you are just learning how.

And who can just buy one roll. Get some 3/8ths and then some 3/8ths low profile.

Oops. Need some .058 guage...


Darn! that new pole saw uses thin kerf... and the list goes on.


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## skyhightree1 (Aug 14, 2008)

woodchux said:


> This is NOT true. You will save money on the FIRST 100' roll. Even with buying the spinner and breaker ! If you do the math you will find that 1640 drive links on a 100 ft roll = 22.7777 20" chains (72 drive links). Now if youre paying $18 per 20" chain youre spending $410 for the same amount of chain. You can get the tools that you need for $90 and a roll of chain for $250 = only $340. You save $70 on the first roll, even including the cost of the tools.
> 
> :greenchainsaw:



That is a good point and the math adds up... I aint got alot of tree work right now actually none at all so I got plenty of time to make some up and hope for the next storm...lol


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## rbtree (Aug 15, 2008)

Billy_Bob said:


> I just bought all the stuff to make my own chains and am quite pleased with this. I figure chains for a 36 inch bar will cost about $14 each not including the cost of the tools (which I look at as a one time expense).
> 
> At $225 for a 100 foot reel, a 116 dl chain costs a bit over $16.....


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## Billy_Bob (Aug 15, 2008)

rbtree said:


> ...At $225 for a 100 foot reel, a 116 dl chain costs a bit over $16.....



Now this is interesting because my 36" bar says "114" next to the drive link picture. (3/8 pitch) And I made a chain with 114 drive links in it and it barely fit on my 36" saw. I also noticed the chain I made looked to be one drive link shorter than a 36" Stihl chain.

So should a chain for a bar which says 114 actually have 116 links? (As I said, I know nothing about all this.)

Also I figured 36" - well that's 3 ft.... Double it and it is 6 ft. per chain.... Then divide 100 ft of chain by 6 = about 16 chains...

Well I just measured an uncut 36" chain and it is 7 ft. layed out in a straight line! (So not 6 ft., but 7 ft. per chain.)

Some funny math going on here. (Is this anything like 2 x 4's not being 2 x 4? )


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## winchman (Aug 15, 2008)

*watch that chart!*

Billy_Bob said...

"So should a chain for a bar which says 114 actually have 116 links? (As I said, I know nothing about all this.)"

No. it should be 114. follow the numbers on the bar.

and don't trust the chart that bailey's sent you. i love bailey's, their saw chain is great, the breaker and spinner combo is a great deal etc., but their chart is messed up. or at least the one they sent us last time was - and could account for your 2 dl error. Count the drivelinks out by hand and make sure you really have 114. 

The chart that they sent us - just like our old one, but the old one was too scratched up to be very useful anymore - must have been printed just a little too small or large - as in, it isn't printed "life-size" and the real chain doesn't match up. I thought about calling Bailey's and informing them, but it just seems too weird that a tool meant for measuring isn't measuring right. 

I just count them out by hand now and haven't gotten one wrong since the new chart got pasted to the bench.

Hope this helps. Trust the numbers on the bar and make sure you have the correct pitch chain.

And for the record, we use all Oregon chain on everything from our little 200Ts to our 385, 395, and 3120. Round chisel on everything so that we can use our grinder to hasten the sharpening process. Most efficient system we can muster - you don't have to swear when you spin the chain in the dirt - the grinder takes all of eight minutes for a 36" skip chain after you are experienced.


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## Billy_Bob (Aug 15, 2008)

Ok I found the problem with my chain being too short. My 36" bar says 114 drive links and another Stihl chain has 114 drive links.

When I set up the chain measuring scale...
On the bottom it has inches. I set it up so the inches would be correct from the starting point. The first chain scale sticker (there are 3 stickers which butt up next to each other to get the long length needed) starts with the inches scale on the bottom at 30. So I lined up on the bottom so it would go 29, 30, 31, etc. accurately from the starting point.

This was wrong. I counted the links on the chain scale and it was missing a link. So I think I made my 114 link chain with 113 links. I'll pull it off the saw later and see.

(So ignore the inches scale and go by counting drive links instead when setting up the chain scale chart.)

Also the drive links don't line up from the first part of the scale to the end near 105 links or 114 links which I will be mostly using. So I adjusted the starting point (finishing nail in board) so the links line up right by the time they get to 105 and 114.

So I will now get 105 and 114!

Thanks!


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## pdqdl (Aug 15, 2008)

if you are are using 3/8th pitch chain the _average_ distance from rivet to rivet is .375 inches. Since there are two spans (tie strap + drag link) at .375", then each drag link represents .75" (3/4") of chain length.

Divide one foot of chain, and you will get 16 drag links per foot of chain.

It's easy to multiply the length on the roll times the number of links per foot to get the number of links per roll. Divide by links per chain loop, and you will know how many you can get to the roll.

I always just divide the cost of the roll by the number of links, and then I have a cost per link. This makes it easy to find my cost per chain.


Regarding "saving money" by making your own chains: so far you are probably losing a lot of time, and your cost per chain loop will be very high. Don't worry, after you have done a few, it will speed up.


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## Billy_Bob (Aug 15, 2008)

Actually my Oregon chain, which was shorter than the Stihl chain, did in fact have 114 drive links!

So both the Stihl and the Oregon chain have 114 drive links (for a 36" Stihl bar), but the Oregon chain looks like it is shorter by one link! *[Edit: See post below...]


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## pdqdl (Aug 15, 2008)

Run it for 30 seconds and see if it doesn't stretch out to the same length.


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## Billy_Bob (Aug 15, 2008)

Well well! I just held it up to the Stihl chain and today they are now both the same size. (I cut a few pieces of wood yesterday trying out the chain.)

So now I have a Stihl chain 114 links and an Oregon chain 114 links - both same size.


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## jefflovstrom (Aug 16, 2008)

I just buy it--- those guys need there job. I make it up, anyway.
Jeff


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## Billy_Bob (Aug 16, 2008)

One more little thing I learned when making chain...

When "spinning" the rivets on the new chain, some metal particles may be on the "anvil" after spinning. So just wipe the "spinner anvil" with a paper towel to clean it before spinning the next rivet.


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## woodchux (Aug 17, 2008)

The best way i've found to measure new chain is by taking an old chain and cutting one connecting link out. Ive got a chain saw file stuck in the wall with the chain hanging from the file. Take the end of the new chain hang it on the file, match up the bottom end, and mark by wrapping a small piece of teflon tape where it needs to be cut. Then i grind down the rivet heads before punching them out ( the first time i used my punch the tip on it was damaged, thats why i grind the rivet heads first) 
I can slap together 5 chains in about 10-12 minutes...


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## 046 (Aug 17, 2008)

that's been the easiest way for me too..

take an old chain the correct size. then hang or lay flat. 
roll new chain out to match... done...



woodchux said:


> The best way i've found to measure new chain is by taking an old chain and cutting one connecting link out. Ive got a chain saw file stuck in the wall with the chain hanging from the file. Take the end of the new chain hang it on the file, match up the bottom end, and mark by wrapping a small piece of teflon tape where it needs to be cut. Then i grind down the rivet heads before punching them out ( the first time i used my punch the tip on it was damaged, thats why i grind the rivet heads first)
> I can slap together 5 chains in about 10-12 minutes...


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## pdqdl (Aug 19, 2008)

*This is the easiest, quickest way to count links*

In my experience, laying an old chain side by side with a new roll doesn't work: the stretch in the old chain will cause problems with matching the links. Just count the drag links and make a new chain with the same number.

grab the old chain by a tie strap, so that all the drag links on the loop are opposite each other; "paired up". Count by two's from top to bottom.

When you get to the bottom, if they are still evenly paired, you are done. If there is an odd link out at the bottom of the loop, stop counting by two's, add the last single link, and you are done.

Do it twice if you lack confidence or practice.


To measure out cut chain: count out 10 links, fold over to make 20. Grab that 20, fold over to make 40 links. This technique can be used for almost any even number of links. 

63 links? count out 15, double to 30, double that to 60, add three, mark your rivets and then break the chain. Check your length before you rivet them back together !


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## loveroftrees (Aug 19, 2008)

Take a 1inch x 1inch by 6foot piece of wood. Count out dl's cut and now mark on stick end to end. I did this for the four chains I make. Put it in the corner and when needed whip it out measure cut done...Very easy. bob


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