# used motor oil for bar oil



## starterlogg (Oct 9, 2010)

who uses used motor oil for bar oil ,an old cogger I work with filters it with a couple of old sock and is off to the races ,what do you guys think


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## garmar (Oct 9, 2010)

Never ever do that no matter how many old timers tell you to. Reasons?

You'll burn up your bar and chain sooner. 

Bar and chain oil is biodegradable so you're not slinging toxic oil everywhere. 

And while we're talking about slinging oil bar and chain oil sticks to your chain better because it has an additive specifically to keep the oil where it belongs - on your bar and chain lubricating it. And used motor oil will absolutely soak your pants.

Other agents in the B&C oil help prevent pitch build-up. I'm sure there are many other reasons if I thought about it, but I think these are enough to convince any reasonable minded person.

And if your oil is too thick to pour out in the winter warm it up next to the stove before you go out and keep it close to the truck's heater vent on the way to your cutting area.

Never use motor oil - used or otherwise - for your chain and bar or fuel mix. Ever. Sorry for the rant. :greenchainsaw:


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## Deprime (Oct 9, 2010)

Better than no oil at all but *NOT* recommended.


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## travis91 (Oct 9, 2010)

IT doesnt have the sticky compounds found in bar lube that makes it stick to the chain and bar.. not the same viscosity either.. wouldn't recommend it. Im no expert but ive worked along side a stihl certified mechanic for a lil while.


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## sawinredneck (Oct 9, 2010)

..................AND, all the metal particulate that was accumulated while the motor wears down probably wont help bar and chain wear. Plus the toxins gained in said breaking down motor ADD to the toxins you are already spreading with good oil. Then the lack of a tackifier to make the oil stick, the oil is too thin to start with, then heats up and thins more. That's IF it doesn't plug up the oiling system, or burn up the oil pump from all the crap that's in the used oil.
So you get less use from the bar and chain, the possibility of burning up the oiling system and polluting the environment........... need we go on?
It's a bad idea that's been beat to death numerous times.


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## banshee67 (Oct 9, 2010)

garmar said:


> And if your oil is too thick to pour out in the winter..



.. buy some winter weight bar and chain lube :greenchainsaw:


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## Alaskat (Oct 10, 2010)

I have used new gear oil when nothing else readily available and I would only do it again in a pinch, it stinks. Used motor oil seems like a obvious poor choice for many reasons.


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## chevyforlife21 (Oct 10, 2010)

iv made my own with fresh 10w40 and some gear oil to add tack before but i wouldnt use old oil your moving metal shards across your bar and chain at very fast speeds its got to do some grinding damage like sanding or filing would do. on top of that go to lowes its 10 bucks for a gallon it will last u 1 2 maybe three or more years if your not commercial. ive used 1/3 of one in a year so far.


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## J.W Younger (Oct 10, 2010)

chevyforlife21 said:


> iv made my own with fresh 10w40 and some gear oil to add tack before but i wouldnt use old oil your moving metal shards across your bar and chain at very fast speeds its got to do some grinding damage like sanding or filing would do. on top of that go to lowes its 10 bucks for a gallon it will last u 1 2 maybe three or more years if your not commercial. ive used 1/3 of one in a year so far.


I'm just a firewood cutter and i use 6 gallons a year.TSC has it on sale for 6 bucks.


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## dingeryote (Oct 10, 2010)

J.W Younger said:


> I'm just a firewood cutter and i use 6 gallons a year.TSC has it on sale for 6 bucks.



Yep.

6 Gallons a MONTH ain't hard if ya find a sweet spot or get into a couple big bastards. 

Used motor oil contains heavy metals and plenty of skin absorbed Carcinogens that target internal organs. It's nastier stuff than many banned pesticides.

6 bucks a gallon, versus losing a Kidney,Liver, or taking a dirt nap?
DEAL!!

Stay safe!
Dingeryote


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## Storm56 (Oct 10, 2010)

Not again...

Properly recycle used motor oil. Bar oil is not that expensive, does a better job and is easier on the environment.


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## Scootermsp (Oct 10, 2010)

*Not for me*

A friend of mine who is on the commercial side swears by used motor oil for his saws. It does save him a ton of money as he uses a lot. This is not for me though. I buy a case of 4 1-gallon jugs and it lasts me a while. I don't need to be exposed to any components of used motor oil. I agree with you guys.


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## Ambull (Oct 10, 2010)

Scootermsp said:


> It does save him a ton of money as he uses a lot.



This is "perceived" savings, but not real savings. He is shortening the life of the saw's oil pump, the bar, and the chain. Because the chain is not properly lubricated, it is probably getting dull faster, and creating more down time for sharpening and replacing. He is wasting time trying to filter the waste oil and putting it in containers. 

I think it is penny wise and pound foolish.


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## Scootermsp (Oct 10, 2010)

He has been doing this for many years and gets all the money he can out of his saws. He does not have any mechanical problems in doing this. I side with you folks in that I do not want used motor oil slung everywhere.


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## blackdogon57 (Oct 10, 2010)

garmar said:


> Bar and chain oil is biodegradable so you're not slinging toxic oil everywhere.
> 
> :



Standard bar oil is NOT biodegradable. Bio oil is much more expensive. 
Used motor oil IS toxic and bad for both the user and the environment.


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## wampum (Oct 10, 2010)

I have to admit I started using bar and chain oil about 10 years ago,I really do not know why,I guess I got snookered like most by the fancy advertising. But 45 years ago when I got my first chain saw I never heard of bar and chain oil. Everyone used 30 weight motor oil,or gear oil and most thinned it in the colder months with kerosene,or lighter oil. Back then the saws were slower then they are now,there was even gear driven saws,bars seemed to last for ever. I still have several old saws that still have the original bars.

When I had my shop,especially in the 70's and 80's,you did not sell to much bar oil. I have seen this argument on here several times. Personally I really could care less what you use. Its your saw do what you want. As far as an environmental impact,I really think that is over stretched. Most bar oils are not bio-degradable. Look at the cost of the ones that are from Bailey's. I have a brand new gallon I am looking at from TSC,no where on it does it say it is biodegradable.

One more thing,I just do not agree that motor oil will tear up your bar,your going to use that bar a long time before it gets tore up,as long as you keep oil on that bar. Like I said I use bar oil,but if a fellow wants to use motor oil,he could save enough on the price of oil over time to buy several bars. Even if you use used motor oil,if you keep your bar lubed it will run a long time. Where did that oil come from? It was lubing an engine that was running for thousands of miles and did not seize up,and would have been good to go for a while longer.

This argument is a lot like the argument that you have to use the chain saw brands engine oil. Do what you want its your saw,try both,if you like bar oil go with it. If motor oil is good for you use that. People's opinions on here are like an itch,everyone's got one.

Here is a link from Bailey's; http://www.baileysonline.com/itemdetail.asp?item=17071 

Their biodegradable oil is 19.95 a gallon,(plus shipping)so unless your oil says biodegradable you are slinging out regular oil into the environment. I admit that used motor oil has metals in it. But regular bar oil and new motor oil,are not doing much different then the other. If you really are serious about the environment,then by all means buy that non petroleum oil,for 19.95 a gallon (plus Shipping)

Here is a combo bar and chain from bailey's for a 20 inch saw. link: http://www.baileysonline.com/itemdetail.asp?item=WBC 20 SS50

It sells for $59.95 (plus shipping) so if you use 10 or 20 gallons through your saw of regular motor oil and your bar is still okay,how much did you save?


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## Walt41 (Oct 10, 2010)

Take a stroll thru the cancer ward of your local hospital.
Used oil is carcinogenic, limit your exposure, live longer...get to know your grandkids.


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## garmar (Oct 10, 2010)

Okay, as many pointed out standard B&C oil isn't biodegradable. It's still a bad idea to use used motor oil imo. 

I find it interesting that as many posters seem interested in debating an oversight on my part as there are convincing this guy that using used motor oil for their bar and chain is a bad idea. The potential cost of damaging your machine should be enough to turn anyone away from the idea. 

I prefer using the proper tool for the job instead of stepping over dollars to pick up dimes.


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## wampum (Oct 10, 2010)

Walt you really have to handle the stuff a lot to get cancer from it. Link:http://arrc.epnet.com/autoapp/9348CHR/9348CHR01_Handling_Used_Motor_Oil.htm

I really think that using used oil in your saw is stretching it to the point of mentioning cancer wards. According to this link lab rats have to be in continuous contact with it. 

When I worked in the steel mill or on heavy equipment,I got lots of oil on me. Especially when I had to do repairs in the tub of a dragline. Now I can see how this could cause skin cancer,but even then we wore protective suits and respirators. Because of the confined space. Out in the woods,you are in open air and I am not getting oil on me.Some one who runs a saw 8 to 10 hours or more a day I can see a potential problem. But for the guy that cuts a dozen or less cords a year,I think its a stretch to say you will get cancer from it.


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## wampum (Oct 10, 2010)

garmar said:


> Okay, as many pointed out standard B&C oil isn't biodegradable. It's still a bad idea to use used motor oil imo.
> 
> I find it interesting that as many posters seem interested in debating an oversight on my part as there are convincing this guy that using used motor oil for their bar and chain is a bad idea. The potential cost of damaging your machine should be enough to turn anyone away from the idea.
> 
> I prefer using the proper tool for the job instead of stepping over dollars to pick up dimes.



Prove it,for my chain lube I ran motor oil both used and new in my saws for over 30 years,I never had one incident of a failure from using it. Where is the potential to damage your machine? I can see the possibility of shorter bar life,though I have never noticed it. You believe that Bar and chain oil is for you go for it. If someone wants to run other oil thats what works for him.

That biodegradable oil from Bailey's is really Veggie oil with additives. I have read where lots of folks are veggie oil on their bars.

Here is a good link about using Veggie oil in your saw: http://www.earthenexposure.com/permaculture/chainsaws/vegioils.htm

I have probably well over 100 gallons of used Veggie oil,I may clean it by filtration and try it in one of my older saws. I have never done this,but if anyone here has please post your results.


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## wvlogger (Oct 10, 2010)

Well if you dislkie you oil pump bar and chain or have some deep pockest and like doing repairs then by all mean run the used motro oil. I have used hydraulic fluid for the dozer in a pinch but i really hated to do it but it sure did beat driving 20 miles to town and 15 of em was off road


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## garmar (Oct 10, 2010)

wampum said:


> Prove it,for my chain lube I ran motor oil both used and new in my saws for over 30 years,I never had one incident of a failure from using it. Where is the potential to damage your machine? I can see the possibility of shorter bar life,though I have never noticed it. You believe that Bar and chain oil is for you go for it. If someone wants to run other oil thats what works for him.



I don't have to prove anything. It's just common sense not to use an inferior product in an expensive machine in an attempt to save a couple bucks when there is something better available. I have a brand new Stihl and the 7 bucks for a gallon the dealer has is cheap insurance imo. 

And how do you know whether or not you're getting shorter bar life if you've always used motor oil?

The proper use for used motor oil is turned in to your local recycler. Unless you have an oil burner in your garage.



I feel like I walked into an alternate universe today or something. Am I really discussing this stupidity?


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## DSS (Oct 10, 2010)

I don't see paying how much...6,7,8 hundred bucks for a saw and then putting dirty oil in the tank to save six bucks a gallon.

Not to mention the mess on the saw itself when you go to work on it. There is no way that old stink ass oil is not harming the oiler, the b/c ....and the environment, if you want to get anal. It won't cling to the chain either, no tackifier in it.

Why ????


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## dingeryote (Oct 10, 2010)

wampum said:


> Prove it,for my chain lube I ran motor oil both used and new in my saws for over 30 years,I never had one incident of a failure from using it. Where is the potential to damage your machine? I can see the possibility of shorter bar life,though I have never noticed it. You believe that Bar and chain oil is for you go for it. If someone wants to run other oil thats what works for him.
> 
> That biodegradable oil from Bailey's is really Veggie oil with additives. I have read where lots of folks are veggie oil on their bars.
> 
> ...



Plain old motor oil would be fine if it didn't fling off so bad.
USED motor oil is the issue.

The biggest reason to change oil in the first place is, the chemical contamination from the combustion process. All kinds of nasty crap with twenty five letter chemical names, and compounds that are proven to be detrimental to human health, and not too friendly to mechanical objects.

Ya wouldn't pour hydrochloric acid on your saw right?
How about soak your trousers with sulfphur dioxide? Methyl benzene?

Nah, USED motor oil just ain't smart for Bar lube, unless ya don't have other options. 

Stay safe!
Dingeryote


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## savageactor7 (Oct 11, 2010)

I knew folks that used it but I never did mostly cause I don't like the smell of it. 

I save and use old motor oil to coat mowing decks etc... so in a pinch I'd probably use it.


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## fatjoe (Oct 11, 2010)

*Low Viscosity*

I use to work for a Tree guy who did that.It bothered me, but not him.I think his reasoning was that he had so many different people using the saws and they were abused so much that the saws would be trashed in a year or so anyway.The stuff he used was black as coal and thin as water.It got all over you too, cause there was no viscosity to it.I wouldn`t use it in my saws.


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## BlueRidgeMark (Oct 11, 2010)

wampum said:


> I have probably well over 100 gallons of used Veggie oil,I may clean it by filtration and try it in one of my older saws. I have never done this,but if anyone here has please post your results.





I've used it. It seems to lube quite well. I liked the way it worked for me.

I don't recommend it. 

It might be okay for pros who are running their saws constantly, but not for weekend warriors. Why? Vegetable based oils turn to varnish when exposed to the air. Ever heard of using tung oil or linseed oil as a wood finish? Same deal. All veggie oils exhibit this to one degree or another. What this means to the saw owner is that veggie oil must be cleaned off of your saw, bar and chains, or it will gum them up something fierce. 

Been there, done that. 


If they are constantly in use, the stuff probably won't have a chance to turn to varnish. Some pros on here use it and like it. I have no argument with them, but I don't think it's a good thing for the occasional cutter, unless you want to do a complete cleaning of the bar, chain, saw, and inside of the oiler system every time you put the saw away.


Okay, end of thread hijack!


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## BlueRidgeMark (Oct 11, 2010)

daddy66 said:


> I don't see paying how much...6,7,8 hundred bucks for a saw and then putting dirty oil in the tank to save six bucks a gallon.






garmar said:


> I prefer using the proper tool for the job instead of stepping over dollars to pick up dimes.




:agree2:


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## CWME (Oct 11, 2010)

I have five gallons of used ISO 48 hydro oil from my log splitter. Looking pretty good instead of dropping more $ on oil.


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## 4seasons (Oct 11, 2010)

Used motor oil will not hurt your saw. Dirty oil will. The simple truth is motor oil is constantly changed because it is dirty, not worn out. Don't believe me? Check into putting a bypass oil filter system on a big truck. There are trucks on the road running the same motor oil for 50-100k miles. So why would you think that oil with 3-5k miles on it wouldn't lube a bar for a few laps of a chain before getting slung off? Now saying that most people running used oil aren't filtering out the particles and are running dirty oil. I don't think pouring oil through and old sock is going to do much more than make your sock dirty or make the oil smell like feet. Now if you want to make a case for not slinging dirty oil all over the woods you have a valid point there. But because it wont lube or wear out parts faster, find someones saw that was damaged because of used oil. I can see small metal particles damaging the oil pump but if they are filtered out what is in the oil to hurt the saw? I have filtered used oil and used it to cut bar oil that wont pour out of the bottle on a cold day. And for putting the oil next to the heat to get it to pour, what do you do when your in the woods for 8 hours? I'm sure not going to run the truck the whole time to keep the oil warm.


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## Jredsjeep (Oct 11, 2010)

i used to run used motor oil in my saws all the time up until a couple of years ago. i used to sell firewood on the side on a small scale and never had an oiler problem with my saws. i havent noticed any real bar wear differance either, i am still running the same bars and chains i did before. i do it more for the right tool for the job mentality and i have differant uses for my motor oil like running my truck off it.

its a good idea and recommended to use but its not all doom and gloom if you don't. this is coming from my life experaince over the past 10+ years of chainsawing and is just my opinion.


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## Stihl310 (Oct 11, 2010)

I've ran used motor oil in my saws for some time now... Never had the slightest of problems with pumps, bars, chains... anything... I generally only use it in the winter time, however if I don't have anything else in the summer I'll throw it in... Seems to lube the chain just fine... Every now and then though I'll get my hands on some bar oil, not too often though...

I'd like to see some serious data backing up the claims that it will wear out your saw, if someone could prove it I may buy into it. However, my own experience has shown me that there have been no negative affects.


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## banshee67 (Oct 11, 2010)

the only data i need is to put my finger in some motor oil , and pull it away... no strings sticking, just drips off
now try it with some good bar oil.. you can stretch the snot quite a ways before it breaks off
thats enough to prove how real bar lube sticks to the bar and chain while motor oil just flings off and drips everywhere
while flinging and dripping off everywhere, how does it ever get time to properly lubricate anything it needs to?


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## logbutcher (Oct 11, 2010)

banshee67 said:


> the only data i need is to put my finger in some motor oil , and pull it away... no strings sticking, just drips off
> now try it with some good bar oil.. you can stretch the snot quite a ways before it breaks off
> thats enough to prove how real bar lube sticks to the bar and chain while motor oil just flings off and drips everywhere
> while flinging and dripping off everywhere, how does it ever get time to properly lubricate anything it needs to?



:agree2:

C'mon now, you got a gold plated tool (IF Stihl). Why F around with cheap, you &%$#@*. 
Just say no to Motor Oil----used or not.


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## Iska3 (Oct 11, 2010)

banshee67 said:


> *the only data i need is to put my finger in some motor oil , and pull it away... no strings sticking, just drips off*
> now try it with some good bar oil.. you can stretch the snot quite a ways before it breaks off
> thats enough to prove how real bar lube sticks to the bar and chain while motor oil just flings off and drips everywhere
> while flinging and dripping off everywhere, how does it ever get time to properly lubricate anything it needs to?



:agree2: This is all the proof anyone should need.


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## TreePointer (Oct 11, 2010)

I pick my nose before I put my finger in the bar & chain oil. That way, my saw will always cut with some real snot!


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## reaperman (Oct 11, 2010)

Its tempting to start using used motor oil. The last time I went into the local Stihl dealer he wanted almost $15/gallon for bar oil.


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## wampum (Oct 12, 2010)

reaperman said:


> Its tempting to start using used motor oil. The last time I went into the local Stihl dealer he wanted almost $15/gallon for bar oil.



That's why I say its up to each person. A lot of folks are out of work,and will cut corners where ever they can. I usually buy bar oil on sale at TSC. But I would not hesitate to go back to Motor oil,if I had to. When I use it I mostly use new 30 weight and cut it in the winter with kerosene or 10 weight. When I use,used oil I put several layers of cheese cloth banded on a 5 gallon bucket and run it threw. Usually mixing it with new oil. 

Like I said in a previous post I used motor oil both new and used for over 30 years. I never wore out one pump or a chain,I really can not remember the last time I bought a bar. The manufacturer wants you to use bar oil,and most will tell you theirs is the best. I would to if I could get a customer to fork out $10 to $15 dollars,a gallon.

I believe in doing what you want to do,I do not like being told I am stupid when something has worked for me for over 30 years. I will not call anyone stupid when things work for them. I am very libertarian in many of my beliefs. So I do basically what works for me,and have no problem if you do something different.

As far as clinging,if the oil isn't working the chain will seize. Years ago some off us tended to over lube with the hand pump and ran the oil tank MT before the Gas tank. You knew it pretty quick because you would lose pressure on the pump and it would soon heat up and slow down or seize. You just filled back up and poured a little oil on the bar and chain,and off you went. That link I posted about Veggie oil,said that no oil clings well when a saw is running over 13000 rpm's. I do not know if thats true.

Thanks Mark on that info on veggie oil. I may still filter some and try it my self just for fun. But now I know what to look for. One last thing I used Dad's saws until I got out of the service,in 1971. I bought my first saw that year. I still have it,it still runs and the pump is fine,and it has had gallons of motor oil ran through it.That saw is 39 years old,its probably older then most of you that are telling me I am going to ruin my saw.


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## ray benson (Oct 12, 2010)

To manufacture lubricating oil for automobiles, some additives(additive packs) are added and include detergents, corrosion inhibitors, and rust inhibitors. 

While automobile engine is running, the motor oil collects heavy metal (lead, cadmium, zinc, and barium), iron steel particles, and copper. Several of these contaminants are toxic and harmful to you and the environment.

Nasty things happen to motor oil when it's been in your engine for several thousand miles. The most significant problem is the accumulation of benzene compounds from the cylinder blow-by. Benzines are known carcinogens, and you should do all you can to avoid prolonged exposure to them. They are volatile compounds similar to gasoline, that you can't get rid of by filtering. All you can and should do - is take your used oil to a facility that accepts it for reprocessing. Although much of used motor oil can be reclaimed and re-used, it's not something you can do at home.


Do a search on used motor oil, many states have laws that used motor oil must be properly recycled. They don't even want the oil in landfills.


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## goof008 (Oct 12, 2010)

I admit, I used it once. I was out of bar oil and needed to cut up a couple of small downed trees in the back yard. I only used about 1/2 a tank of it, then switched back to bar oil. Anything is better than nothing.

To all the people complaining about the cancer issue...I get more used oil on me changing the oil on my truck then I do cutting. I don't know about you, but I cut in long pants/chaps, long sleeved shirt. I wear gloves, glasses and a hat...and sometimes a bandanna over my mouth. There isn't that much exposed skin for it the get on! And, it's usually being slung away from the user...and if it's not, you may have other issues!!

Just being devils advocate and argumentative.


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## Marc (Oct 12, 2010)

goof008 said:


> To all the people complaining about the cancer issue...I get more used oil on me changing the oil on my truck then I do cutting. I don't know about you, but I cut in long pants/chaps, long sleeved shirt. I wear gloves, glasses and a hat...and sometimes a bandanna over my mouth. There isn't that much exposed skin for it the get on! And, it's usually being slung away from the user...and if it's not, you may have other issues!!



They probably mean in the handling from drain pan to container to chainsaw... handling the oil cap, etc. etc. More chance for contact; probably weren't thinking as much about oil coming off the chain.

Of course there are safe ways of handling it, but if something contains several known carcinogens... isn't it worth 6 bucks a gallon to limit your exposure?


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## 4seasons (Oct 12, 2010)

It has been shown that research causes cancer in lab rats.

I found a sprinkler head at Home Depot that had a warning posted on it that it contained materials known to cause cancer in California. To this day I don't know if it only causes cancer in California or if that is the only place that they know it.

While I'm sure that used oil has some bad stuff in it, Ive never seen the quick lube kid wearing a haz-mat suit. When was the last time your neighborhood mechanic died of fingernail cancer from all the oil under their nails? This kind of "something is going to kill you" mentality is given to us from a bunch of sue happy layers trying to make a buck from someone's misfortune.


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## goof008 (Oct 12, 2010)

I agree it isn't healthy stuff, and I don't use it as chain lube unless it's an act of desperation.

To NOT use it just because it is a carcinogen is a bad argument...most of my fishing tackle has warnings on it...I don't believe that inhaling 2-stroke exhaust is especially healthy either...or cutting in the sun w/o sunblock....the list of unhealthy things we do is no doubt longer than the things we do that are good for us.


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## 1harlowr (Oct 12, 2010)

I've never used old motor oil as bar/chain oil. I don't think it would hurt a saw if the metal shavings were filtered out though. It's crazy to say motor oil would be a health risk if used in a saw since some of the people on here gets more toxins opening their wood stove to put another log on. What about eating a grilled steak with carcinogens from the gas grill? What about the preservatives in our food?
It's not like many people are actually mixing used motor oil with their gas for the saw's engine.


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## HOGBEAR (Oct 12, 2010)

I cant see that it would hurt the saw but you know it cant be good for your bar or the oiler but to each his own just wouldnt do it myself.


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## ray benson (Oct 12, 2010)

Try some canola oil. It will surprise you.


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## Motorsen (Oct 12, 2010)

Why use "disposed" oil in a saw when you can get better???
I can´t see my self cutting in a mist of used motor oil. If it´s not good for your engine anymore, will it be good for you? 
What about the environmental factor? The woods that supply us with nice trees and heat etc. in the winter time. An old word says "Bad bird ####s in it`s own nest".
In person I use "raps olie" probably known as "canola oil" in woodcutter land.
Presents absolutely no problems in the cutting season. But it´s a fact that it will harden up if exposed to oxygen for a period of time (a couple of weeks or a month and will present a problem to your cutting equipment". But when cutting on a regular basis this could be ignored. If you know you will not be cutting for a longer period/end of season/vacation, simply fill with regular chain oil for the last couple of bar oil top ups and system will be flushed out and be preserved for next time.
As far as lubrication is concerned seed oil should be more than adequate for bar`n chain lubrication. The absense of tackifiers seems not to present a problem. Remember the chain is lubed from the inside out. There will be enough oil trapped behind the chain to travel around the nose wheel to lube the underside of the bar where the biggest pressure between bar/chain is present. Newer chains also have "lubrilink" drive links to carry oil around the nose.
Any one considered viscosityindex of the oils? Canola have an natural index of apx 155. Dino oil without viscosityindeximprovers has a natural index of 110. Canola thins less under stress IE heat.
Think this could be a controversial topic.
But none the less this is my first reply to a very interesting forum I have been watching closely for over half a year. Hope that i`ll not be blown out a here for this post.:bang:

Big hellos to everyone of you tree heads in here.
And thanks for all the educating and entertaining reading on this arboristsite.

Motorsen


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## wampum (Oct 12, 2010)

Well I have to admit this thread really had me worried. I was scared but somehow I found the courage to go back to my wooded area,just to see all the damage that had been done by myself and others over the past thirty years or so by running motor oil in my saws for bar oil. 

I know what kind of damage can occur,because I saw the results of agent orange in Nam. So I expected the worse. But to my amazement I could not find any evidence of any damage by using motor oil. I expected all the animals to be losing their hides and have worts or something. They all looked great,I just do not understand it. I checked with all the neighbors expecting a class action suit,but they also had no side effects from motor oil. I checked and rechecked,the area we did most of our bucking would be in really bad shape,so I went there and it is covered in nice grass,there was even evidence that the cows and horses were eating the grass. Now I probably won't be able to eat the meat from a heifer I am fattening up to butcher next month. But wait a minute,the beef we butchered last year ate in the same area,that is some good meat.ma-be bar oil helps tenderize the beef.

Then I decided to check some old tree stumps that were cut using motor oil. I could not believe my eyes,most had re sprouted and were growing into nice sized trees ready to get cut again. After all the hype and all the warnings my woods is vibrant.


Guys I hope you realize I am kidding with you. But in all seriousness,if you do not want to run it fine do not use it. But if other folks want to use it,it is really nobody else's business. To those of you that smoke,drink,eat to much,drive to fast,or what ever you are doing more harm then someone running motor oil.But go for it,that is your business not mine. I also checked there is no law that I can find in Pa that says I am not allowed to use it. There is a law in several states that forbids you from removing the spark screen from your muffler. How many on this forum have removed that and even posted how there saw runs better by removing it and heaven forbid they even made modes to their muffler

You know, what ever you do with your saw in my mind is your business. And what I do with mine is my business. I have several saws over 30 years old that are fine and have never failed running motor oil. My woods is in great shape,and I do not have cancer from using motor oil. I am also not a criminal for using it,and if I want I will use it again.


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## sawinredneck (Oct 12, 2010)

Wamp, I wasn't going down that road, and won't, I smoke too damn much to say anything about that.
I got the tongue in cheek bit for sure, but I still attest that I can't see it being good for a saw. I can't prove anything either way, and if you want to run it, be my guest, but I don't recommend it to you. That's all.


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## blackdogon57 (Oct 12, 2010)

Great post ! Rep sent.



Motorsen said:


> Why use "disposed" oil in a saw when you can get better???
> I can´t see my self cutting in a mist of used motor oil. If it´s not good for your engine anymore, will it be good for you?
> What about the environmental factor? The woods that supply us with nice trees and heat etc. in the winter time. An old word says "Bad bird ####s in it`s own nest".
> In person I use "raps olie" probably known as "canola oil" in woodcutter land.
> ...


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## Sledcrazzy (Oct 12, 2010)

The way i look at it is if you want to feed that black crap to your $800 saw and do it all kinds of harm, yes it does that is a fact, then that is your problem and your trashed saw. If someone brings me a saw to my shop that has oiling problems and its all covered in black used oil goo i tell him to please take it some were else cause i wont be working on it.


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## wampum (Oct 12, 2010)

sawinredneck said:


> Wamp, I wasn't going down that road, and won't, I smoke too damn much to say anything about that.
> I got the tongue in cheek bit for sure, but I still attest that I can't see it being good for a saw. I can't prove anything either way, and if you want to run it, be my guest, but I don't recommend it to you. That's all.



Sawinredneck,I haven't used motor oil in over 10 years,and most likely will never use it again. I have to admit I am having a little fun with this post. I just like all the great comments,your ruining the environment,your going to get cancer,you wouldn't pour acid on your leg. It just plain gets funny after awhile. And what gets really funny is when it gets posted that the government says this. I am a patriotic American,but a lot of what the governments says or does is just so much BS.

All my new saws with pumps that are gear driven I would never put dirty oil in them. The saw I have that is 39 years old is pressure driven with out a gear drive pump that got its oil by pushing an oiler button. 39 years ago I never heard of bar oil. 

But I will not tell someone else not to run motor oil if they want to,that is their business and the heck with the government.

This is the first bar oil I ever heard of and sold in my saw shop : http://www.worthpoint.com/worthopedia/old-vintage-chainsaw-bar-chain-oilzum-oil


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## Marc (Oct 12, 2010)

wampum said:


> Well I have to admit this thread really had me worried. I was scared but somehow I found the courage to go back to my wooded area,just to see all the damage that had been done by myself and others over the past thirty years or so by running motor oil in my saws for bar oil.
> 
> I know what kind of damage can occur,because I saw the results of agent orange in Nam. So I expected the worse. But to my amazement I could not find any evidence of any damage by using motor oil. I expected all the animals to be losing their hides and have worts or something. They all looked great,I just do not understand it. I checked with all the neighbors expecting a class action suit,but they also had no side effects from motor oil. I checked and rechecked,the area we did most of our bucking would be in really bad shape,so I went there and it is covered in nice grass,there was even evidence that the cows and horses were eating the grass. Now I probably won't be able to eat the meat from a heifer I am fattening up to butcher next month. But wait a minute,the beef we butchered last year ate in the same area,that is some good meat.ma-be bar oil helps tenderize the beef.
> 
> ...



The OP asked for opinions.


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## Somesawguy (Oct 12, 2010)

I know this thread is about used oil, but my dad has always used new 10w-30 in his saws, and as far as I know he's never had any oiler or bar/chain wear issues. 

Used oil may be a different critter entirely. :biggrinbounce2:


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## 4seasons (Oct 13, 2010)

Motorsen said:


> Why use "disposed" oil in a saw when you can get better???
> I can´t see my self cutting in a mist of used motor oil. If it´s not good for your engine anymore, will it be good for you?
> What about the environmental factor? The woods that supply us with nice trees and heat etc. in the winter time. An old word says "Bad bird ####s in it`s own nest".
> In person I use "raps olie" probably known as "canola oil" in woodcutter land.
> ...



Welcome to the site and congratulations on your first post. First time I've ever seen a 1 poster get rep. Thank you for doing your research and not just posting "But it causes cancer" like some are doing. Feel free to chime in any time that you have something useful to add.


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## alleyyooper (Oct 13, 2010)

*What about the environmental factor?*
Your cutting wood just to get it out of the way? 

What about the environmental factor, for those of you who dar to burn said wood. Don't you relize that buring wood isn't good for the enviroment either, some lab some place has proved that.

Also why are you useing bar oil in your saws that oil is as deadly to grass and other living things as the used stuff. Just spill some on the grass or a worm and take a look latter on.

Best stuff to use is motor cycle chain lube. It sprays on in a thin stream, lubes all the links and rollers with out any throw off and will last for a whole day thru some of the deepest mud holes and sandpits you can find.

Use what you can afford, be your own judge and leave the fad stuff to the yuppies.

 Al


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## fatjoe (Oct 13, 2010)

*Read the manual...*

This post has gotten a little silly.The best advice I could give would be to use what the owners manual for the saw says.Plain and simple.Read the manual.Ther manual is there for a reason.......


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## sbhooper (Oct 14, 2010)

It really amazes me that people will pay big money for a saw and then discuss something so rediculous as putting used oil on the bar. Many do the same with cars. They buy a $30,000+ car and put cheap Wal Mart oil in it vs a good quality synthetic or something that will take care of their investment. 

If you are sucker enough to pay $15 for a gallon of bar oil, then so be it, but bar oil can be had generally a couple times a year on sale at farm stores for $6 or $7 dollars a gallon. 

Actual bar oil flings off badly enough. I cannot even imagine what a mess that used oil makes. The cancer, environment etc. etc. is pure nonsense unless you are bathing in the stuff, but is just another reason not to use the old oil. 

I'll stick to the real thing for my use.


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## CountryBoy19 (Oct 14, 2010)

sbhooper said:


> It really amazes me that people will pay big money for a saw and then discuss something so rediculous as putting used oil on the bar. Many do the same with cars. They buy a $30,000+ car and put cheap Wal Mart oil in it vs a good quality synthetic or something that will take care of their investment.
> 
> If you are sucker enough to pay $15 for a gallon of bar oil, then so be it, but bar oil can be had generally a couple times a year on sale at farm stores for $6 or $7 dollars a gallon.
> 
> ...


I think it's comical that people make comparisons like this.

The engine in your car is a lot more complicated, it's a larger percentage of the vehicle cost to replace it. Sure, it seems absurd to save $20 a year at the risk of a $10,000 engine replacement; but it's not quite as absurd when you start to get into the arena of saving $25 a year at the risk of a $50 bar/chain replacement or $50 for an oil pump.

For the most part, oil is oil, regular motor oil will lubricate a bar and chain just as good as b&c oil. Even without the tackifiers the parts are still being lubricated. Tackifiers don't matter a whole lot at 13,000 rpm, the oil is still slinging off the end. An oil pump will even pump regular oil just fine. Putting aside the safety/environmental arguments (which I personally don't buy into) the only thing that I would imagine may cause problems would be particulates in the oil. 99% of the particulates are small enough that they likely won't harm anything, especially the B&C. Think about it, the B&C is already covered in particulates (chips, dust, dirt, worn metal particles from one or the other etc); the addition of more particulates isn't going to make a noticeable difference because the oil isn't being recycled, it's there to lubricate the B&C for a few passes of the chain and it is then washed away by the new oil streaming in. The oil used in a chainsaw for B&C is a sacrificial oil that is used to wash away other particulates and foreign materials. 

Comparing a cars engine to the B&C of chainsaw is completely ludicrous; if you really think they're a similar comparison then you clearly don't understand how one or the other, or even both of them work.


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## Jredsjeep (Oct 14, 2010)

i can agree with that, if the oil is not going to ruin a close tolerance engine running soft lead based bearings passing by them for hours. why would it suddenly ruin a dirty hardened steel bar while it passed by for a few seconds.


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## treemandan (Oct 14, 2010)

Typically bar oil is sae 30 weight with Hi -Tack additives. Of course used motor oil is filthy and stinks but if its clean then knock your filthy stinky ass out, maybe just add some Hi-Tack, which is to slow down fling off. You do notice the extra used motor oil smell along with all the other fumes associated with chainsaws and it makes the saw look real nasty.


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## DSS (Oct 14, 2010)

I don't think I'm going to get cancer from used oil.
I don't think it's going to kill every blade of grass and tree for miles around.
I don't think the bar is going to fall off my saw in a matter of minutes.

I wonder how many gallons of bar oil are sold in north america every year?

Is everyone who buys one wasting their money?

I don't use used oil for the same reason I don't buy oil for my truck at wally world, or mix oil at a yard sale.

Why would you? I don't want to take the chance. Maybe used oil doesn't hurt anything, but I'm pretty sure that proper bar oil isn't going to.


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## wampum (Oct 14, 2010)

Back to being serious. Those of you that cut in freezing or colder weather are probably aware that if you use heavy bar oil,it gets pretty stiff in the winter. Those of you who are not, please make sure you use thinner or winterized oil. Thick oil can do several things,if the saw is left out side it can stiffen up pretty good. Even good bar oil that is really cold can cause damage to your pump. Also please check your bar grooves and oil hole in the bar. Make sure they are clean and run the saw just a little against an object that you can see the oil being slung off. Personally I do not believe good new oil(motor or bar)will harm the saw. Just make sure what ever you use is getting to the bar and doing its job.


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## sbhooper (Oct 14, 2010)

Go ahead and use that Obama oil if you want, coutryboy, but it is still rediculous that people are arguing over a few dollars a year in savings with nasty used oil vs clean bar oil. If you are that broke, then maybe you need to get a second job at McDonald's or something. 

It is still the same principle as with autos. You are paying big bucks for the equipment and then trying to spend pennies on lubricants. 

It is your equipment. Treat it how you want, but don't throw darts at me for calling a spade a spade.


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## fatjoe (Oct 14, 2010)

CountryBoy19 said:


> I think it's comical that people make comparisons like this.
> 
> The engine in your car is a lot more complicated, it's a larger percentage of the vehicle cost to replace it. Sure, it seems absurd to save $20 a year at the risk of a $10,000 engine replacement; but it's not quite as absurd when you start to get into the arena of saving $25 a year at the risk of a $50 bar/chain replacement or $50 for an oil pump.
> 
> ...


Have you ever used, used motor oil in a chainsaw?It makes a freakin mess!I have used it, and it is like pouring the darkest chocolate, but thin as water and gets all over everthing.The fact that it is almost as thin as water, but being a petroleum product, allows it to still stick.We all overpour our oil occasionally, and old motor oil is bad.Once you spill it, it gets in every nook and cranny and makes it black.It will turn a nice clean saw to a dirty looking saw in no time.Why ANYONE would consider anything with it except burning it, is rediculous.It`s had its course, it`s used up.Throw it out or burn it!!I`ve got a few gallons in the garage, I`ll send it to you if you want.I`ll guarantee you will only use it once, unless you don`t care about you saw...


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## garmar (Oct 14, 2010)

sbhooper said:


> It really amazes me that people will pay big money for a saw and then discuss something so rediculous as putting used oil on the bar. Many do the same with cars. They buy a $30,000+ car and put cheap Wal Mart oil in it vs a good quality synthetic or something that will take care of their investment.
> 
> If you are sucker enough to pay $15 for a gallon of bar oil, then so be it, but bar oil can be had generally a couple times a year on sale at farm stores for $6 or $7 dollars a gallon.
> 
> ...





CountryBoy19 said:


> I think it's comical that people make comparisons like this.
> 
> The engine in your car is a lot more complicated, it's a larger percentage of the vehicle cost to replace it. Sure, it seems absurd to save $20 a year at the risk of a $10,000 engine replacement; but it's not quite as absurd when you start to get into the arena of saving $25 a year at the risk of a $50 bar/chain replacement or $50 for an oil pump.
> 
> ...



I didn't get that comparison at all. What I got was that he was comparing the mentality that some people have of spending a lot money on something then treating it like junk by not caring for it properly. And *good* chainsaws are expensive.


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## fatjoe (Oct 14, 2010)

garmar said:


> I didn't get that comparison at all. What I got was that he was comparing the mentality that some people have of spending a lot money on something then treating it like junk by not caring for it properly. And *good* chainsaws are expensive.



:agree2:


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## treemandan (Oct 14, 2010)

I worked with an outfit that strictly used the used motor oil for bar oil. They had tons of nasty greasy drippy jugs of the stuff. The best was one of the old jugs they used leaked which was about once a month or so.
Its not a bad idea save for the stuff in the oil from the motor it was in. I don't seem to remember those guys going through oil pumps and they didn't filter it.
I run my used oil through a 5 micron filter and then dump it straight in the tank of my 7.3. I went through a 55 gal drum over the summer mixing it with desiel.


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## CountryBoy19 (Oct 15, 2010)

sbhooper said:


> Go ahead and use that Obama oil if you want, coutryboy, but it is still rediculous that people are arguing over a few dollars a year in savings with nasty used oil vs clean bar oil. If you are that broke, then maybe you need to get a second job at McDonald's or something.
> 
> It is still the same principle as with autos. You are paying big bucks for the equipment and then trying to spend pennies on lubricants.
> 
> It is your equipment. Treat it how you want, but don't throw darts at me for calling a spade a spade.


Obama oil? WTH does this discusion have to do with the POTUS? You seem to have some problems...

BTW, I don't use used motor oil in my saws; I'm just approaching this from a non-biased technical background and the people that try to make comparisons between cars and chainsaws either don't have a technical background, or they aren't using it properly.

Maybe still the same "principle" as with autos, but it's not the same. Like I pointed out, and you clearly didn't understand, a full engine replacement in an auto is going to cost you $5-10k. 2 points considering that, #1, cheap oil has the possibility to damage an engine much more than it does a bar/chain/oil-pump on a saw because of the tight tolerances and soft bearings. If you still don't get that then you clearly don't understand how engines (or chainsaws) work, #2, trying to save $20 a year on oil at the risk of a $10,000 engine replacement is completely different than trying to save $20 a year at the risk of much cheaper repairs. If you still don't understand that then you aren't thinking about it; it's really simple to understand.





fatjoe said:


> Have you ever used, used motor oil in a chainsaw?It makes a freakin mess!I have used it, and it is like pouring the darkest chocolate, but thin as water and gets all over everthing.The fact that it is almost as thin as water, but being a petroleum product, allows it to still stick.We all overpour our oil occasionally, and old motor oil is bad.Once you spill it, it gets in every nook and cranny and makes it black.It will turn a nice clean saw to a dirty looking saw in no time.Why ANYONE would consider anything with it except burning it, is rediculous.It`s had its course, it`s used up.Throw it out or burn it!!I`ve got a few gallons in the garage, I`ll send it to you if you want.I`ll guarantee you will only use it once, unless you don`t care about you saw...



We're not discussing the mess it makes, we're discussing whether or not it will damage the saw, and as long as there aren't any large particulates in the oil it's not going to damage a thing.

Gotta love this little gem, "It`s had its course, it`s used up." :bang: Really? You don't have a clue at all about lubricants do you? Once you get a clue maybe your unexpert opinion will matter a little more but until then don't try to act like you know a whole lot about lubrication when you clearly don't.




garmar said:


> I didn't get that comparison at all. What I got was that he was comparing the mentality that some people have of spending a lot money on something then treating it like junk by not caring for it properly. And *good* chainsaws are expensive.



Who said they aren't treating it properly? I think this whole thread can be considered a discussion of whether or not using used motor oil could be considered "treating it properly". The only down-side to using used motor-oil is that it does, in fact, make a big mess. But as long as the operator cleans the saw up it doesn't make any difference. You're making a false conclusion that using used motor oil is not proper, when in fact, you should be presenting evidence to support your claim that using used motor oil isn't proper.

I'm not recommending that anybody should use used motor oil, I already admitted that I don't use it myself. I'm just presenting information so that people can make up their own mind on using it. It's not going to hurt your chainsaw; comparing an engine with tight tolerances and soft bearings to a chainsaw with very, very loose tolerances and a hardened steel b&c is not an accurate comparison as far as the actual mechanics of b&c vs. motor oil goes. Rather than make unsubstantiated claims about "not taking care of equipment" and "you wouldn't do that to your car" why not actually present some information on it?


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## sbhooper (Oct 15, 2010)

Gee Countryboy, aren't we touchy. No one is comparing chainsaws to cars technically. It is just pure logic and principle. Why would you take an expensive piece of equipment and use crap in it. 

And no, you are not the only one that knows anything about lubricants. You mouth at those of us who say it is crazy to use old oil, and then admit that you don't even use it! Unbiased-I don't think so.


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## CountryBoy19 (Oct 15, 2010)

sbhooper said:


> Gee Countryboy, aren't we touchy. No one is comparing chainsaws to cars technically. It is just pure logic and principle. Why would you take an expensive piece of equipment and use crap in it.


 That shows my point exactly, you continue to claim that using used motor oil for B&C oil is equivalent to using crap, but you can't support any of that claim, you have yet to provide any evidence. All you can say is, "You shouldn't do it because your chainsaw is an expensive piece of equipment." Yet, if you came across somebody on the street that said, "You shouldn't ever run synthetic oil in an engine because it's crap." you would laugh at him until you couldn't breath anymore and then when you caught your breath you would ask him for his supporting evidence, of which he has none.




sbhooper said:


> And no, you are not the only one that knows anything about lubricants. You mouth at those of us who say it is crazy to use old oil, and then admit that you don't even use it! Unbiased-I don't think so.


 How is that biased? To me that seems like a completely unbiased source there, I have no personal interest in running used motor oil and my feelings aren't going to be hurt if somebody does or doesn't use it because I never have myself. Just how is that biased? I think you confused the words biased and un-biased... look up the definitions.

I'm still waiting on your evidence also. Can you please provide some evidence to support your claim that used motor oil is crap?


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## fatjoe (Oct 15, 2010)

CountryBoy19 said:


> Obama oil? WTH does this discusion have to do with the POTUS? You seem to have some problems...
> 
> BTW, I don't use used motor oil in my saws; I'm just approaching this from a non-biased technical background and the people that try to make comparisons between cars and chainsaws either don't have a technical background, or they aren't using it properly.
> 
> ...


The fact is it can hurt your chainsaw.Viscosity is the resistance to flow or thickness of an oil.Chainsaw bar oil has a high viscosity.Motor oil that has been in your engine for 10,000 miles has lost much of its viscosity.Heating and cooling the oil reduces viscosity.It loses it ability to stick.The used oil also has metal and dirt particles in it.Used motor oil will not stick to the bar and chain like new Bar oil can.Bar oil has additives designed to do just what it does, lube the bar and stick to the bar.Runnig your saw with used oil will lead to the bar wearing quicker.Plain ansd simple.Maybe some of you don`t consider overheating your bar and chain, damage, but I do.It will wear the bar out faster.All this was said previously.It WILL wear your bar and chain faster....


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## CountryBoy19 (Oct 15, 2010)

fatjoe said:


> The fact is it can hurt your chainsaw.Viscosity is the resistance to flow or thickness of an oil.Chainsaw bar oil has a high viscosity.Motor oil that has been in your engine for 10,000 miles has lost much of its viscosity.Heating and cooling the oil reduces viscosity.


Yes, it is certainly less viscous, but my point is that the viscosity doesn't make a large impact. In an engine? Yes, viscosity is huge, on a b&c, no it doesn't matter much. Yes, the oil slings off more easily, but as pointed out earlier, it doesn't matter much when the saw is turning 13k rpms, even B&C oil slings off at that speed. The oil residue is still there however, and that is where the lubrication comes from. B&C oil that slings off is supposed to sling off, that is how it carries the particulates away from the b&c.



fatjoe said:


> The used oil also has metal and dirt particles in it.


And your chainsaw bar doesn't already have those? That was one of my points in my original reply. Those particulates may be detrimental in an engine, but those particles don't matter on a chainsaw unless they're HUGE (relatively speaking), that is why cars have oil-filters and chainsaws don't. Chainsaw only have a small screen to prevent large particles from clogging the pump etc. Don't you think that if it was really that important to keep tiny particles out that they would install full-size oil-filters on saws? Most particles in used motor oil are comprised of worn bearing material. Bearing are soft metals that actually have lubricating properties on their own (bronze). Those particles are not going to cause any detrimental effects on your b&c.



fatjoe said:


> Runnig your saw with used oil will lead to the bar wearing quicker.Plain ansd simple.Maybe some of you don`t consider overheating your bar and chain, damage, but I do.It will wear the bar out faster.All this was said previously.It WILL wear your bar and chain faster....


Proof? Have you done any scientifically controlled studies or do you have any results from such studies?

Even if your b&c does wear faster, how much faster? Hypothetically speaking, if your claim of increased wear is true, lets compare the economics of it. We'll say that you reduce your b&c lifetime by 10%.

Jim Bob has a 25 inch b&c on his saw, he cuts enough wood to go through 3 chains and 1 bar every year, at a cost of $100. While cutting with those chains and bars he burns... oh let's say 12 gallons of b&c oil per year on those. Even the cheap TSC oil costs him $6/gal so his cost on oil is $72/year.

Now, Jim Bob is thinking running used motor oil that he gets for free (some could even counter that they normally have to pay to dispose of used oil but we'll ignore that) when he changes his oil. He buys his bar and chains for $100, but only gets 90% of the life out of them. So his cost for 90% of a year is $100 vs. his cost of $154.80 for 90% of a year when running b&c oil in his saw.

His cost savings on oil more than makes up for any additional wear on the b&c, as a matter of fact, using used oil would need to cause 42% more wear before it becomes economically equal to run either oil. Of course that scenario is hypothetical and the consumption numbers may not completely line up, every saw and user is different, but it demonstrates my point exactly.


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## WetBehindtheEar (Oct 15, 2010)

starterlogg said:


> who uses used motor oil for bar oil ,an old cogger I work with filters it with a couple of old sock and is off to the races ,what do you guys think




:notrolls2:opcorn:

Jeeze!! I don't keep up for a couple of days and this place turns into a flame war.


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## cameron2171 (Oct 15, 2010)

so what about using hydraulic fluid, do you think that would work good because i got 5 gallons of it i dont need


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## CountryBoy19 (Oct 15, 2010)

cameron2171 said:


> so what about using hydraulic fluid, do you think that would work good because i got 5 gallons of it i dont need



Still going to make more mess, just not as black as used motor oil...

As far as actual lubricating properties, I would say it would be equivalent to b&c oil and motor oil.


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## dingeryote (Oct 15, 2010)

cameron2171 said:


> so what about using hydraulic fluid, do you think that would work good because i got 5 gallons of it i dont need



LOL!!!

I take you don't have an older tractor that constantly drips a bit.

Hydro works great for thinning the cheapo TSC and wally world Bar oil when it gets below 20 or so.

Run straight, in warm weather, hydro flings like mad and gets everywhere, but works well enough if ya don't mind.

Ya got a farm buddy that will trade ya 3 jugs of cheap bar oil?

How about a cuttin' buddy with a splitter?

I'd jump on that in a heartbeat if you were closer.

Stay safe!
Dingeryote


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## DSS (Oct 15, 2010)

If I ever get a gallon of squirrel pizz gathered up, I'm gonna try that instead of oil.

Makes as much sense to me as used motor oil.

I'll let you know how I make out........


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## fatjoe (Oct 15, 2010)

CountryBoy19 said:


> Yes, it is certainly less viscous, but my point is that the viscosity doesn't make a large impact. In an engine? Yes, viscosity is huge, on a b&c, no it doesn't matter much. Yes, the oil slings off more easily, but as pointed out earlier, it doesn't matter much when the saw is turning 13k rpms, even B&C oil slings off at that speed. The oil residue is still there however, and that is where the lubrication comes from. B&C oil that slings off is supposed to sling off, that is how it carries the particulates away from the b&c.
> 
> 
> And your chainsaw bar doesn't already have those? That was one of my points in my original reply. Those particulates may be detrimental in an engine, but those particles don't matter on a chainsaw unless they're HUGE (relatively speaking), that is why cars have oil-filters and chainsaws don't. Chainsaw only have a small screen to prevent large particles from clogging the pump etc. Don't you think that if it was really that important to keep tiny particles out that they would install full-size oil-filters on saws? Most particles in used motor oil are comprised of worn bearing material. Bearing are soft metals that actually have lubricating properties on their own (bronze). Those particles are not going to cause any detrimental effects on your b&c.
> ...



What about the oil under the chain?What about the tip, the rim sprocket?So it`s ok to add more dirt and particles?How about the oil pump?Is it designed to pump metal shavings and dirt.Viscosity and tact do matter.All the oil doesn`t get flung off.Thats why it`s important to use oil with a higher viscosity and tact.New oil sticks better, thus protecting, lubing and cooling the bar and chain better.If you use motor oil that is too thin you also run the risk of running out of oil before the saw runs out of fuel.And, oh ya, if your brother Jim Bob is so smart and uses old stinkin motor oil in his saw, why don`t you.I don`t need a scientific study, I just told you the reasons why new oil works better than oil motor oil.It`s common sense.The used oil has lost much of it lubing capabilities.It CAN~T work the same.It is inferior to new bar oil..There are at least 10 reasons not to use it, and only one reason to use it.Price...


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## Hunt'n'photos (Oct 15, 2010)

Just say "NO" to nasty lube on your bar!


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## garmar (Oct 16, 2010)

garmar said:


> I didn't get that comparison at all. What I got was that he was comparing the mentality that some people have of spending a lot money on something then treating it like junk by not caring for it properly. And *good* chainsaws are expensive.





CountryBoy19 said:


> Who said they aren't treating it properly? I think this whole thread can be considered a discussion of whether or not using used motor oil could be considered "treating it properly". The only down-side to using used motor-oil is that it does, in fact, make a big mess. But as long as the operator cleans the saw up it doesn't make any difference. You're making a false conclusion that using used motor oil is not proper, when in fact, you should be presenting evidence to support your claim that using used motor oil isn't proper.
> 
> I'm not recommending that anybody should use used motor oil, I already admitted that I don't use it myself. I'm just presenting information so that people can make up their own mind on using it. It's not going to hurt your chainsaw; comparing an engine with tight tolerances and soft bearings to a chainsaw with very, very loose tolerances and a hardened steel b&c is not an accurate comparison as far as the actual mechanics of b&c vs. motor oil goes. Rather than make unsubstantiated claims about "not taking care of equipment" and "you wouldn't do that to your car" why not actually present some information on it?


You seem to have a hard time with reading comprehension, dontcha? 

If you read my post I was explaining my take on another misunderstood post, not drawing any conclusions. I did that on page 1.  

And yes, my *opinion *is that using anything other than the manufacturers recommended lubricant as chain oil is misuse of the tool. I'll not impose judgment on the practice of using _clean_ motor oil in cold weather, but used oil? I don't think so; especially not in my new Stihl chainsaw I paid dearly for. I wouldn't even do that to a Poulan. 

The OP asked for opinions and got them.


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## dingeryote (Oct 16, 2010)

http://www.dawn.com/wps/wcm/connect...+used+motor+oil+poses+hazard+to+public+health

And even the Backwards Paki's are figuring out used motor oil ain't good for your health...and maybe even deadly.

KU analysis 

The KU laboratory collected samples of used motor oil from 15 sites across the city. According to the analysis, the average level of concentration of different metals found in the samples was: lead 110ppm (parts per million), zinc 685ppm, barium 18.1ppm, arsenic 5ppm, cadmium 2.5ppm and chromium 3.2ppm. 

The soil contaminated with used motor oil had about 100ppm arsenic, 20ppm cadmium, 1,800ppm lead and 285ppm barium. All these metals, the research says, are highly toxic with carcinogenic and teratogenic properties. Any direct contact with the skin is, therefore, extremely dangerous. In view of the complex nature of the used lubricants, it is necessary to consider the cumulative effect of the exposure to used lubricants, warns the KU study. 

The increase in concentration of metals in soil occurs mainly due to accumulation. Polycyclic aromatic hydrocarbons (PAHs), which are formed on account of combustion in motor engines, could concentrate up to 1,000 times more in used motor oil, the research says. PAHs are known to be highly toxic environmental contaminants with carcinogenic and mutagenic properties. 

“The spray of a fine mist containing a high concentration of metals and hydrocarbons is a serious health hazard not only for men working at service stations but also for customers standing nearby. Persistent human exposure over a long period can even cause cancer while onlookers inhaling fumes of harmful oils may also develop nose, throat and skin infections,” said Dr Nasiruddin. 

Regarding the disposal of used oil in the environment, he said used oil was to a certain extent biodegradable and its disposal in the atmosphere carried serious risks to natural systems. Improper disposal could contaminate soil and underground water and damage the sewerage. 

Dawn spoke to a number of workers at various service stations in the city about the use and disposal of used motor oil. It came to light that used motor oil is either sold for different purposes or utilised for servicing of vehicles. “We sell it to people involved in shuttering businesses. They buy 205 litres for Rs4,000,” said a worker at a service station in Saddar. To protect vehicles from rust, used oil is sprayed under the floor of vehicles and on the floor of public buses, he said. When asked about any health problems that they might face, a majority of workers replied in the negative while others said they had now become used to the foul smell of the oil. 

Patients at hospitals 

According to specialists at major public sector hospitals, skin ailments caused by exposure to contaminated and toxic oil were very common because people were generally unaware of the extent of the damage the oil could cause to their bodies and if they were concerned about health issues, their employers showed the least concern. 

Dr Sikander Mehar of the Sindh Institute of Skin Diseases said: “Around a dozen people, most of them between 10 and 20 years of age working at auto service stations, report every week at the institute. Generally, they have allergic contact dermatitis, developed due to contact with allergens and irritants. The symptoms include itching, redness, skin damage and bristles.” 

Agreeing with this, Dr Azam Samdani of the Jinnah Postgraduate Medical Centre added that hydrocarbons present in used motor oils had a damaging effect on health, especially skin because of direct exposure. This could cause mild to severe reactions depending upon the duration and intensity of exposure. Often people come with eczema, at times with secondary infection, he said. Though he agreed that skin infections caused by exposure to contaminant oils was a common hazard and could lead to occupational disability, he rejected the possibility of development of skin A service station worker, wearing no protective clothing, uses the water jet from a pipe to spray used motor oil, kept in a receptacle, onto the underside of a 

cancer in a short period. 

Regarding any possible effects on eyes, Dr Idrees Edhi, an eye specialist at the Civil Hospital Karachi, said: “Eyes are seriously affected. Most patients come with scars of foreign bodies. If the eyes of 100 mechanics are examined, 70 of them would have scars of foreign bodies, which if not taken out on time, can cause a loss of vision. Toxic fumes also affect the front portion of the eyes and cause infections.” 

Prolonged exposure to benzenes found in petrochemical compounds causes bladder cancer, according to Dr Altaf Hashmi at the Sindh Institute of Urology. “The link between bladder cancer and benzene compounds was established in 1854 in Germany at a rubber industry. Absorbed through skin or inhaled, the traces of the compounds are detoxified in the liver, but they are re-activated when they are released from kidneys upon reaction with a chemical. The latent period for disease is from 20 to 25 years, though it doesn’t pose any immediate hazard. 

“Secondly, not all patients develop bladder cancer. According to the research, of the 18 per cent people who developed bladder cancer at the rubber industry, 40 per cent were smokers. The actual mechanics that work in the development of the disease is still not known.” 


Meh.
Menards has thier bar oil on sale for 6 bucks a gallon.
It's cheaper than Chemo and dialysis twice a week.

Stay safe!
Dingeryote


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## CountryBoy19 (Oct 16, 2010)

fatjoe said:


> What about the oil under the chain?What about the tip, the rim sprocket?So it`s ok to add more dirt and particles?How about the oil pump?Is it designed to pump metal shavings and dirt.Viscosity and tact do matter.All the oil doesn`t get flung off.Thats why it`s important to use oil with a higher viscosity and tact.New oil sticks better, thus protecting, lubing and cooling the bar and chain better.If you use motor oil that is too thin you also run the risk of running out of oil before the saw runs out of fuel.And, oh ya, if your brother Jim Bob is so smart and uses old stinkin motor oil in his saw, why don`t you.I don`t need a scientific study, I just told you the reasons why new oil works better than oil motor oil.It`s common sense.The used oil has lost much of it lubing capabilities.It CAN~T work the same.It is inferior to new bar oil..There are at least 10 reasons not to use it, and only one reason to use it.Price...



The used oil hasn't lost it's lube capabilities, you don't seem to get that yet.

You didn't even address my economics scenario other than trying to insult me. Are you admitting defeat on that? Even if there were 10:1 reason not to use it the economics of using it still out-weigh the reasons not to.

We're just going to have to agree to disagree... you obviously don't understand it... that's ok.




garmar said:


> You seem to have a hard time with reading comprehension, dontcha?
> 
> If you read my post I was explaining my take on another misunderstood post, not drawing any conclusions. I did that on page 1.
> 
> ...



It doesn't matter if you were explaining another post or not, you were still drawing conclusions, and drawing them out of thin air to boot. So if your manual recommends to run their brand of mix oil would you consider it misuse if you used another brand? No because other oils can be equivalent... I'll just let you think about that one...


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## fatjoe (Oct 16, 2010)

CountryBoy19 said:


> The used oil hasn't lost it's lube capabilities, you don't seem to get that yet.
> 
> You didn't even address my economics scenario other than trying to insult me. Are you admitting defeat on that? Even if there were 10:1 reason not to use it the economics of using it still out-weigh the reasons not to.
> 
> ...


I admitted that PRICE was the only good reason to use it.I`ve got two Apple trees in my yard, they produce apples,I could eat them, but I BUY apples that are better.It has lost it`s lubing ability. because it DOESN~T stick to the bar as good.How can it lubricate if it just runs off like water!!! It doesn`t STICK!!!!! God, are you that stubborn!!!!It has lost it`s Viscosity, Tack and filming ability!!!!Do you understand!!!!!It has been heated and cooled so much that it has lost these Characteristics!!!!Getting it free is the only advantage.That it!!!It is not good for your saw!!!I addressed your economic issue.Yes, the fact that it is free, you could save money, but when you treat youer equiptment poorly, you start to not care about it.When it gets dirty and ratty looking, you tend to treat it worse.Leaving it in the back of the truck, in the rain etc.etc..So, I don`t believe using dirty oil is really economically good.Treat your saw like shat, pretty soon it is shat!!!


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## fatjoe (Oct 16, 2010)

You didn`t address the oil pump issue.If the viscosity is way low, wouldn`t the oil be pumped out faster?Aren`t these pumps designed to pump thicker oil?Couldn`t the oil run out before the gas on very hot days?Wouldn`t that lead to overheating the bar and chain??


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## super3 (Oct 16, 2010)

CountryBoy19 said:


> The used oil hasn't lost it's lube capabilities, you don't seem to get that yet..




Then why are you pissin away money draining it out of your car,truck,tractor,what ever. If it still has it's lube capabilities,leave it in there.


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## garmar (Oct 16, 2010)

CountryBoy19 said:


> It doesn't matter if you were explaining another post or not, you were still drawing conclusions, and drawing them out of thin air to boot. So if your manual recommends to run their brand of mix oil would you consider it misuse if you used another brand? No because other oils can be equivalent... I'll just let you think about that one...



Actually, that's exactly what you're doing by making assumptions. You did the same thing with the post I was referring to. 

And ironically enough you've made a comparison similar to the one you were scoffing at earlier. There's a HUGE difference between using, say, Husky oil in a Stihl and using used motor oil in the place of bar and chain oil. Or did I misread your reply to this post? 


sbhooper said:


> It really amazes me that people will pay big money for a saw and then discuss something so rediculous as putting used oil on the bar. Many do the same with cars. They buy a $30,000+ car and put cheap Wal Mart oil in it vs a good quality synthetic or something that will take care of their investment.
> 
> If you are sucker enough to pay $15 for a gallon of bar oil, then so be it, but bar oil can be had generally a couple times a year on sale at farm stores for $6 or $7 dollars a gallon.
> 
> ...






CountryBoy19 said:


> I think it's comical that people make comparisons like this.
> 
> The engine in your car is a lot more complicated, it's a larger percentage of the vehicle cost to replace it. Sure, it seems absurd to save $20 a year at the risk of a $10,000 engine replacement; but it's not quite as absurd when you start to get into the arena of saving $25 a year at the risk of a $50 bar/chain replacement or $50 for an oil pump.
> 
> ...



So, your argument is that since it costs much less to replace a pump/bar/chain than to replace parts on a vehicle it's okay to use whatever you like in a chainsaw? 

And if oil that runs onto the bar is just for washing away particulates and foreign materials then why not just use water - it's a passable lubricant. And that stuff is really cheap to boot. (see how I drew a wrong conclusion from something you wrote?)


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## CountryBoy19 (Oct 16, 2010)

fatjoe said:


> You didn`t address the oil pump issue.If the viscosity is way low, wouldn`t the oil be pumped out faster?Aren`t these pumps designed to pump thicker oil?Couldn`t the oil run out before the gas on very hot days?Wouldn`t that lead to overheating the bar and chain??



With a stock oil pump you shouldn't have that problem, period. If you've turned your oil-pump up, then you obviously have the ability to turn it back down if the tank is running out before the gas. See how easy that was?




super3 said:


> Then why are you pissin away money draining it out of your car,truck,tractor,what ever. If it still has it's lube capabilities,leave it in there.



You didn't even read the thread did you?



garmar said:


> So, your argument is that since it costs much less to replace a pump/bar/chain than to replace parts on a vehicle it's okay to use whatever you like in a chainsaw?


Well, not exactly. My argument is that running used motor oil isn't going to cause any damage, and even if damage did occur, you're not losing any money because the cost of anything you have to replace was exceeded by the savings of not buying b&c oil.



garmar said:


> And if oil that runs onto the bar is just for washing away particulates and foreign materials then why not just use water - it's a passable lubricant. And that stuff is really cheap to boot. (see how I drew a wrong conclusion from something you wrote?)


I never said that was it's only purpose, you're taking that out of context. That is one of it's primary jobs, washing away debris; it's other primary job is lubrication. But to address your question about water, water can actually be used as a lubricant, but you would have to run a lot more water because it doesn't have very good lubricating properties compared to oil.


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## garmar (Oct 16, 2010)

CountryBoy19 said:


> I never said that was it's only purpose, you're taking that out of context. That is one of it's primary jobs, washing away debris; it's other primary job is lubrication. But to address your question about water, water can actually be used as a lubricant, but you would have to run a lot more water because it doesn't have very good lubricating properties compared to oil.



Again, did you read my post? 

I underlined the pertinent part for you. (that's sarcasm if you still don't get it) :biggrinbounce2:



garmar said:


> And if oil that runs onto the bar is just for washing away particulates and foreign materials then why not just use water - it's a passable lubricant. And that stuff is really cheap to boot. *(see how I drew a wrong conclusion from something you wrote?)*


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## builder1101 (Oct 17, 2010)

i guess i'll post my opinion...

been filling up with used motor oil for 10 years 

dad has been doing it for 40 years

last year i cut 20 cord, and still had a healthy chain, although i ripped a few teeth off snagging nails. and occasionally a knot will rip pretty good, i was drinking one night and got a bit wild taking down the rackers...

if it's a manual oiler, pump it more often
if it's automatic, just open her all the way.

i figure if used motor oil is clean enough to run in an engine which requires: 

polished crank journals 
on soft bearing babbit 
with only 15-20PSI 
having .0005" clearance 
with god only knows how much down force from the piston combustion

then it's more then good enough to lube a chain whirling in circles...

and yes, you still need to grease the roller if you have a roller nose...and i hate 'em, i'll spend the extra money on a solid-non roller nose bar anyday.

but back to the oil, in any case, it's not recommended for the enviroment, but, i squeak when i walk....


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## super3 (Oct 17, 2010)

CountryBoy19 said:


> You didn't even read the thread did you?



Every post, every word. Again, you are the one claiming it has not lost it's lube capabilities,why change it?



CountryBoy19 said:


> Proof? Have you done any scientifically controlled studies or do you have any results from such studies?
> 
> Have you? All I see is an opinion.
> Now, Jim Bob is thinking running used motor oil that he gets for free (some could even counter that they normally have to pay to dispose of used oil but we'll ignore that) when he changes his oil. He buys his bar and chains for $100, but only gets 90% of the life out of them. So his cost for 90% of a year is $100 vs. his cost of $154.80 for 90% of a year when running b&c oil in his saw.



Oh, there's that scientific evidence!



CountryBoy19 said:


> I'm still waiting on your evidence also. Can you please provide some evidence to support your claim that used motor oil is crap?



Same here , where's yours.


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## CountryBoy19 (Oct 17, 2010)

super3 said:


> Every post, every word. Again, you are the one claiming it has not lost it's lube capabilities,why change it?


You should just stop posting before you make yourself look like even more of a fool. Please, do us all a favor, the answer to the question you're asking has been posted AT LEAST 2 times already.



QUOTE=super3;2508764]Oh, there's that scientific evidence!



Same here , where's yours.[/QUOTE]
I'm not the one claiming that something that people have done successfully for decades won't work. I want to see evidence that it won't work because so far all I've seen is a lot of first-hand stories of people that have done it and say it works fine (other than the mess) and a whole bunch of people that say it won't work. VERY FEW people have posted in here that they've done both and used motor oil doesn't work or it ruins things. Many of the people that have run both have stopped doing so because of the mess. How is that for evidence? Now, where is the evidence to the contrary?


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## super3 (Oct 17, 2010)

CountryBoy19 said:


> I'm not the one claiming that something that people have done successfully for decades won't work. I want to see evidence that it won't work because so far all I've seen is a lot of first-hand stories of people that have done it and say it works fine (other than the mess) and a whole bunch of people that say it won't work. VERY FEW people have posted in here that they've done both and used motor oil doesn't work or it ruins things. Many of the people that have run both have stopped doing so because of the mess. How is that for evidence? Now, where is the evidence to the contrary?







I guess your definition of "successful" is a lot different than mine. The opinions that i've seen here is that it wears parts prematurely not that it won't work. 

Do a little searching old threads, plenty of posts from long time saw wrenches on premature parts failure on saws running used oil.


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## 4seasons (Oct 18, 2010)

*Read this*

For everyone who keep saying used oil doesn't have it lubricating properties, read on this web site how a truck has ran 1,000,000 on one oil change. 
http://gulfcoastfilters.com/1,000,000 MILES.htm
Now tell my how oil than has been in your car for 3,000-5,000 miles wont lube your 20 inch bar for a few laps of the chain. If you do some more reading on that site you will see that oil gets to dirty to keep using in an engine as it starts carrying particulates. By removing the particles in the oil the life of the oil is extended by huge margins. Now if you want to run bar oil because it is stickier and will stay on the bar longer that is fine. I do the same thing, but in really cold weather my bar oil won't pour out of the bottle so it won't be able to lube the bar because I can't get it in the saw. I still haven't seen anyone provide evidence of saw damage due to used oil. Now it may have happened, but if it was so common someone would have posted a link or two to incidents where that was the case.
Now I can understand people that don't want to sling dirty oil all over the place, but if you are using clean oil in the saw you are still flinging oil off the chain so the difference is really in how dirty the oil you fling is. Personally I get way more oil on myself just changing the oil in my car one time than I have ever got on me sawing in the woods. By the way, for the "but it causes cancer" crowd, I'm still waiting for someone to show me a case of fingernail cancer from the buildup of old oil under their mechanics fingernails. Lets not forget that the centers that research all these cancer causing materials get their funding through donations and grants. If they said there is no evidence that something causes cancer the funding would be cut off. The people doing the research and the people writing the papers on results know this and will make the results get them more funding. The only way they wont benefit would be if they went for a company or industry that would fight back to disprove the results. So who would fight them on used oil research? Not the oil company, they want to sell more oil so get rid of old oil and buy new. Not the recycle centers that handle the stuff, because they want you used oil, more business, more funding. How about the mechanics and quick oil change places? No, if you're scared to touch the stuff more business for them.


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## fatjoe (Oct 18, 2010)

WOW!!! That one filter could save the planet!!You better buy two!!!


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## dingeryote (Oct 18, 2010)

Used Motor oil will still have adequate lubricating propertys for light presure and light shear resistance application...I.E. Bar oil.
No controversy. Friggin' Mazola will likely be adequate, and I don't doubt unsalted butter might work.

Filering removes abrasive particulates. That's better for the pump to deal with.

So what about the corrisive, Toxic, carcinogenic, and other negative content?

In the case of this wonder filter, I also seriously doubt the molecular structure of the oil is magicly restored, and the loss of pressure/shear resistance would easily be demonstrated. You can run a small block Chevy for 50,000 miles on 0W-20 instead of 10W-30, and that IS what is going on with that 100,000 mile oil change, along with a toxic corrosive cocktail forming.

The real question shouldn't be "Can you run used motor oil", it should be "Is it an intelligent and informed practice, to consistently run used motor oil, for Bar oil". It's a Free country. If a guy wants to dip his Cigar in arsenic and smoke it, ya wont hear me telling him he can't.
Just don't ask me if it's dumber than a stump to do so.

Stay safe!
Dingeryote


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## Wood Doctor (Oct 18, 2010)

*Stumps may be smarter*

Dingeryote said "If a guy wants to dip his Cigar in arsenic and smoke it, ya wont hear me telling him he can't. Just don't ask me if it's dumber than a stump to do so."
---------------
To which the Doctor replies:

Some stumps are smarter than that and more benevolent. This past weekend I watched a freshly cut cottonwood tree stump offer me a drink of water from one of its cavities when I was thirsty. Looked pretty clean and I should have accepted it.


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## builder1101 (Oct 18, 2010)

oh boy.
so drian your motor oil, let it sit for 10 years.

skim the top and reuse it..

so actually what did we learn on this thread?

all i know is i've never witnessed, nor accomplished, with much effort, in every way or any way possible, from crisp sharp teeth, to dull teeth, too low rackers, too high rackers, worn/uneven bar, loose/worn nosewheel, worn out sprocket or slightly bent bar; to get the bar/chain links so hot they to the point of turning blue; which results in temper loss of the iron/steel composites, while using 'used motor oil' as a lubricant strictly.

'nuff said. 

used motor oil is a good lubricant, it's just full of #### and floaties that it's filtered out from the engine of what the spin on wasn't capable of...

well maybe, but it would filter so slow to catch all the floaties you'd have to plumb a filter with surface area of a 55gal drum to satisify the draw of the pump..


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## builder1101 (Oct 18, 2010)

builder1101 said:


> the spin on wasn't capable of...



note;

cheap oil filters and frequent oil changes outweigh a seized engine from pump starvation...


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## fatjoe (Oct 18, 2010)

builder1101 said:


> oh boy.
> so drian your motor oil, let it sit for 10 years.
> 
> skim the top and reuse it..
> ...



You shouldn`t use it at all, it`s bad for the environment.All you learned is that you use it and think it`s ok.Would it void your warranty on a new saw?Is it good for the environment?Should every saw owner in America start using old oil?Or is it just ok for a few hundred thoudsand of you to pollute our forests?Do you know that 1 gallon of used motor oil can cantaminate 1 million gallons of water?Like I said before, there are at least 10 reasons NOT to use it, and only 1 reason to use it..It`s selfish and stupid..


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## builder1101 (Oct 18, 2010)

fatjoe said:


> You shouldn`t use it at all, it`s bad for the environment.All you learned is that you use it and think it`s ok.Would it void your warranty on a new saw?Is it good for the environment?Should every saw owner in America start using old oil?Or is it just ok for a few hundred thoudsand of you to pollute our forests?Do you know that 1 gallon of used motor oil can cantaminate 1 million gallons of water?Like I said before, there are at least 10 reasons NOT to use it, and only 1 reason to use it..It`s selfish and stupid..




i'll copy and paste to save the scrolling, just for you.




builder1101 said:


> but back to the oil, in any case, it's not recommended for the enviroment


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## builder1101 (Oct 18, 2010)

ha, this hsould be locked or removed. 

it's quickly turning into a cache hog.....
honstly people, lets save it for the fun threads, wtf pics and giave and take a word...

where's trimmmmed??!?


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## sawkiller (Oct 19, 2010)

Why don't someone make a valid comparison. I think we could all agree that friction causes heat. And that bar and chain wear is caused by friction.
So this is an easy one to settle atleast on a wear standpoint. Run a new sharp chain with bar oil cut a predetermined amount of wood and check temp of bar and chain several times throughout cutting to get an average. Do the same with used oil heck cut 2" from the original cuts for a good comparison.
After we solve this we can move on to real problems!
Next question this "new" bar and chain oil you are buying how much of it is virgin stock? I would bet that some if not all of it is recycled oil.
Want to add tack add a pint of STP to each gallon of used and it will stick!

From personal experiance I would put my money on used oil with STP keeping a bar and chain cooler. Don't know why or how but that was my experience of course it was not a side by side test and could have been because of several factors! I did hate the nasty mess of the used oil so I quit using it.


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## CountryBoy19 (Oct 19, 2010)

fatjoe said:


> You shouldn`t use it at all, it`s bad for the environment.All you learned is that you use it and think it`s ok.Would it void your warranty on a new saw?Is it good for the environment?Should every saw owner in America start using old oil?Or is it just ok for a few hundred thoudsand of you to pollute our forests?Do you know that 1 gallon of used motor oil can cantaminate 1 million gallons of water?Like I said before, there are at least 10 reasons NOT to use it, and only 1 reason to use it..It`s selfish and stupid..



 Really? and regular bar oil doesn't pollute the environment?


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## builder1101 (Oct 19, 2010)

CountryBoy19 said:


> Really? and regular bar oil doesn't pollute the environment?



ha, that's what my point was, they do recycle used motor oil, and by recycle i mean by not burning it with waste oil burners, that puts all these nasty chemicals in the air that no one wants in their back yard....

and my previous post about what we learned, was the fact i've never ruined a bar or chain from used motor oil. like i said, i know i've done 20 cord last year; that i stacked and used a tape measure; with the same bar and chain, and i didn't even keep track of the year before, and i've had the same bar/chain for 3 years!!! don't get me wrong, the teeth don't have much meat left to sharpen, but it still slides down the bar and cuts like it should. also using the same sprocket. i can't for the life of me, over heat a bar or chain by any means possible by using dirty motor oil that has 'bad lubricating properties'.

if you need the ULTIMATE lubricating oil, then go buy cutting oil for CNC and mills. that's engineered for high speed precision zero wear on ultra hard bits while cutting material. I"m sure nothing will beat it when it comes to steel cutting wood

and for the record, *all* oil is bad for the environment, the DNR will give you a fine if your caught dumping used olive oil for frying a turkey.....my buddy has the ticket to prove it.


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## alleyyooper (Oct 19, 2010)

You shouldn`t use it at all, it`s bad for the environment

What am I missing on this whole bad for the environment thing so many keep posting?

Your burning fire wood to save a few dollars. Burning wood, a fossil fuel is bad for the environment you know. so all that dribble is horse hocky as Henery kept saying.

Use the oil you wish. those quick change places and auto parts stores that take your used oil are selling it. They clean it and make bar oil with it. The frieght line I worked for paid 30 cents a gallon to have theirs refined to use in the Cummins again.

 Al


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## Phil_Marino (Oct 19, 2010)

alleyyooper said:


> You shouldn`t use it at all, it`s bad for the environment
> 
> What am I missing on this whole bad for the environment thing so many keep posting?
> 
> ...




First - wood is not a fossil fuel. 

From Wikipedia: "Fossil fuels are fuels formed by natural resources such as anaerobic decomposition of buried dead organisms. The age of the organisms and their resulting fossil fuels is typically millions of years, and sometimes exceeds 650 million years"

AND - burning wood is GOOD for the environment - compared to burning fossil fuels. Burning fossil fuels releases its carbon into the atmosphere - the main cause of global warming. 

Wood is a renewable energy source - it has recently taken the carbon that's in it out of the atmosphere ( as CO2), so there is no net addition of carbon to the air from burning wood. If you didn't burn it, it would just decompose and return its carbon to the air anyway.


Phil


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## sawkiller (Oct 19, 2010)

I think the whole bad for enviroment idea is rediculous IMHO. How do they deal with oil contaminated soil? They spread it out in thin layers and let the natural enviroment break it down! Yes it is hazardous material and it does cost large sums of cash to dispose of but when it gets to Rumpke they spread it out and let the enviroment take care of it. So me spreading around 2 gallons a week of new or used oil isn't going to make any difference because the enviroment will take care of it. 

Before someone reads to far into the above I am not advocating pouring everyones used oil in the ground. I am simply saying that a chainsaw does spread it out pretty thin. It isn't even enough to kill the weeds where I cut!


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## sbhooper (Oct 20, 2010)

The global warming thing is pure crap and the real science is starting to come out to prove it. Global warming fear is designed to make powerful people even more powerful by controlling the world's resources. Global warming is caused primarily by changes in the sun.

Owl Gore's pocket book is growing quickly because of global warming and he does not even practice what he preaches. 

The amount of used oil thrown into the environment by saws is so small that it is as rediculous to even talk about it as it is to run it in saws to start with.


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## 4seasons (Oct 20, 2010)

sbhooper said:


> The global warming thing is pure crap and the real science is starting to come out to prove it. Global warming fear is designed to make powerful people even more powerful by controlling the world's resources. Global warming is caused primarily by changes in the sun.
> 
> Owl Gore's pocket book is growing quickly because of global warming and he does not even practice what he preaches.
> 
> The amount of used oil thrown into the environment by saws is so small that it is as rediculous to even talk about it as it is to run it in saws to start with.


:agree2:


fatjoe said:


> Do you know that 1 gallon of used motor oil can cantaminate 1 million gallons of water?


 Really? Where did you find that piece of fiction? Everyone knows that oil floats on the surface of water, oil and water don't mix. I had a timing chain wear a hole in the water jacket of a Toyota once. When I checked the oil the dipstick looked like chocolate milk. I was busy with other things so I parked the truck for a week before I went back to work on it. When I pulled the drain plug I got out water first followed by oil. Just sitting for a while the oil and water separated on their own.


sawkiller said:


> I am simply saying that a chainsaw does spread it out pretty thin. It isn't even enough to kill the weeds where I cut!


This has been my experience as well. Everybody that is acting like used oil will bring about the end of the world keeps throwing out words like cancer, global warming, etc... in other words scare tactics with little to no evidence to back up those claims. Now I can see you not wanting to void you warranty, or just using bar oil case it is tackier, or even using canola oil cause you can drink it so it must be safer, but quit acting like it is the end of the world if you might reduce the chain, bar, or pump life of your saw by some small unproven margin in an attempt to save $6-12 per gallon on bar oil.


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## Jredsjeep (Oct 20, 2010)

farmers used to spray oil on there dirt roads to keep dust down, what do you think a primary ingrediant is in asphalt. the environment can break down oil within reason. dumping a oil change down the drain is NOT realistic but i have never seen or heard of the oil from a running chainsaw causing a problem.

if it was a problem the EPA would be all over it.


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## 4seasons (Oct 20, 2010)

TreeCo said:


> The person most exposed to the carcinogens in used motor oil being used for bar oil is the chain saw operator. Makes me smile.


I'm still waiting for someone to show me a case of fingernail cancer from the buildup of old oil under their mechanics fingernails. Until then I will stand by my conclusion that the only thing ever proven to cause cancer in lab rats is research. I had a college professor who's favorite saying was "Figures don't lie but liars can figure." Maybe I should re-post my post about how research is funded. Maybe if someone who has never smoked, or been in a restaurant where people have smoked, or had a sunburn, or lived in a house with radon, suddenly came down with cancer from changing their own oil, I might be convinced of the hazards of dirty oil. I'm not saying that oil is good for you, only that screaming cancer is kinda like the boy who cried wolf. I'm also not saying that anyone has to use used motor oil in their saw or that no harm can come from it. I am only saying that many people have and have never reported problems.


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## 4seasons (Oct 20, 2010)

TreeCo said:


> It is important is that people avoid known hazards when they can and used motor oil is a known hazard.



I don't disagree with that. I'm only pointing out that the amount of oil that I am exposed to while running a chainsaw is very little compared to the amount of oil that runs up to my armpit when I unscrew the oil filter on my wife's Jeep. I am much more worried about hurting myself with a chainsaw's chain as in cutting a leg or arm off than a little oil getting on me. We wear chainsaw chap, safety glasses, hearing protection, and hard hats to protect us while running a chainsaw, so if you want to run canola oil because you feel it is safer go right ahead. I just think it is stupid to think that running used oil on my chain is going to give me cancer. I certainly don't lay awake at night worrying about the high probability that one of the 90%+ of people that cant drive will run me off the road and kill me, so why would I worry about the tiny chance that I might expose myself to a hazard during the small amount of time spent cutting wood.


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## CTYank (Oct 20, 2010)

sbhooper said:


> The global warming thing is pure crap and the real science is starting to come out to prove it. Global warming fear is designed to make powerful people even more powerful by controlling the world's resources. Global warming is caused primarily by changes in the sun.
> 
> Owl Gore's pocket book is growing quickly because of global warming and he does not even practice what he preaches.



Nothing like a good ad-hominem argument. I'd be very interested in seeing the info gathered by the "real science" but not from the hands of big-oil shills.
Meanwhile, do check out what's been going on with glaciers on Greenland and Antarctica and in the Alps. Among others. Check out June 2010 Nat. Geog. Data collected for many decades on Mauna Loa clearly shows long-term changes in atmospheric composition.
A reasonable person might conclude that global climate change is happening; no matter, we need cool-headed reason rather than rancor.


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## ray benson (Oct 20, 2010)

The 48 oz. bottles of canola oil at the grocery store are a nice size. Only a couple bucks.


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## 4seasons (Oct 20, 2010)

CTYank said:


> Nothing like a good ad-hominem argument. I'd be very interested in seeing the info gathered by the "real science" but not from the hands of big-oil shills.
> Meanwhile, do check out what's been going on with glaciers on Greenland and Antarctica and in the Alps. Among others. Check out June 2010 Nat. Geog. Data collected for many decades on Mauna Loa clearly shows long-term changes in atmospheric composition.
> A reasonable person might conclude that global climate change is happening; no matter, we need cool-headed reason rather than rancor.


I give you credit for having a big vocabulary. I had to look up what ad-hominen means. But you must remember that Al Gore is the face of global warming. To attack global warming it to attack Al Gore and the same for attacking Al Gore. Most of the evidence of global warming is just as full of lies, half truths, and photo shop editing as his movie. Every time that someone shows new evidence of the lies the left has to discredit, use their own ad-hominem argument, or just simply ignore the facts and push forward. The evidence now shows that the average global temperature has not increased in 10 year. So now the left changes the wording to climate change. So what about the warming that Al Gore was warning us about? I guess we have to worry about it since it is not happening. Lets just change what we call it so no one will notice the big fraud we've been selling. The simplest way to disprove global warming and all the lies being told to get us to change our way of life is to look to the past. I know my car didn't cause the last ice age, nor my chainsaw, nor jet engine or any other carbon footprint myth, because none of those things were around. And why did the ice melt to end the ice age? Was it because the cavemen didn't have catalytic converters on their cars? Must have been all the used motor oil they used on their chains. The truth is the weather changes, the planet goes through cycles and there isn't anything you or I can do about it. And as far as Al Gore is concerned, if he was really worried about the environment he would at least be doing the things that he wants us to do to save the planet, not jumping on a jet and flying all over the planet giving speeches about how we should all cut back and not live like he does.


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## Wood Doctor (Oct 20, 2010)

sbhooper said:


> The global warming thing is pure crap and the real science is starting to come out to prove it. Global warming fear is designed to make powerful people even more powerful by controlling the world's resources. Global warming is caused primarily by changes in the sun.
> 
> Owl Gore's pocket book is growing quickly because of global warming and he does not even practice what he preaches.
> 
> The amount of used oil thrown into the environment by saws is so small that it is as rediculous to even talk about it as it is to run it in saws to start with.


+1. That says it all. 'nuff said. Thanks for the post, Hoop.

Looks like some men still can't wait to kill their saws, one way or the other, and then save the environment by "recycling" crankcase oil. I'm not sure whether I sould laugh or cry. :bang:


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## garmar (Oct 20, 2010)

4seasons said:


> I had to look up what ad-hominen means.



I think that's what they grind up to make grits, right?


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## sbhooper (Oct 21, 2010)

Cytank, 

I am not saying the climate is not changing. It is-NATURALLY! Climate always changes and we can not do anything about it. 

You obviously drank the Obama coolaid if you believe that it is all man-made. 

Even one of the UN people admitted that documents were altered when they started to release the info on global warming. It is a hoax to relieve all gullible coolaid drinkers of their hard-earned money.


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## rustyb (Nov 9, 2010)

goof008 said:


> To all the people complaining about the cancer issue...I get more used oil on me changing the oil on my truck then I do cutting. I don't know about you, but I cut in long pants/chaps, long sleeved shirt. I wear gloves, glasses and a hat...and sometimes a bandanna over my mouth. There isn't that much exposed skin for it the get on! And, it's usually being slung away from the user...and if it's not, you may have other issues!!
> 
> Just being devils advocate and argumentative.



Dermal absorption is not the only source of exposure. After the chain reaches a certain RPM, misting begins. At this point, the user will be taking in all these known and unknown contaminants via inhalation. 

Unlike getting oil spilled on you, misting is not something that can easily be seen. It also goes to reason that the less viscous the oil is, the more misting there'll be...and the more the user will be exposed to.


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## rustyb (Nov 9, 2010)

Jredsjeep said:


> farmers used to spray oil on there dirt roads to keep dust down, what do you think a primary ingrediant is in asphalt. the environment can break down oil within reason. dumping a oil change down the drain is NOT realistic but i have never seen or heard of the oil from a running chainsaw causing a problem.
> 
> if it was a problem the EPA would be all over it.



Actually, last time I checked (a few yrs ago), the regulatory figures were indeed cracking down on non-vegi based bar/chain lubes. Point Reyes and Denali National Parks are the ones in N America that I recall banning petrol based bar/chain lubes and many if not most Euro nations banned it some years ago.

The thing about this whole argument that isn't well understood is the silent or undetected damage certain oils cause or "can" cause. Just because one hasn't developed cancer doesn't mean that he hasn't experienced other problems that could be traced back to his choice of oils. The same can be said for plants and all the little microbes that our eyes don't see. 

We all have choices and one of those choices is to avoid, or at least make an effort to minimize, our exposure to compounds that are either known to be problematic or are thought to be whether we're talking personal health or that of the little creatures our naked eyes don't see. That isn't "environmentalism" or lipstick liberalism. It's just practicality.


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## rustyb (Nov 9, 2010)

wampum said:


> That link I posted about Veggie oil,said that no oil clings well when a saw is running over 13000 rpm's. I do not know if thats true.



Not to nitpick but it actually said "little oil" not no oil. 

If tac made all that oil stick to the chain, the saw wouldn't need an oil reservoir.  As it is, think how heavy the saw would get if that tac really kept all the oil we pour into that reservoir on the chain. Silly thought isn't it!  Total Loss Lubricating System is the system saws rely on.

Thanks for the link and post.


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## merlynr (Nov 9, 2010)

Back in the early 70's I purchased a brand new discontinued Poulan S33 with manual oiler. I used that thing for about 20 something years and I'd say 75% of the oil I put in that saw was used motor oil and it didn't seem to have any adverse affect on the b/c. I probably over oiled the bar for the most part. Still had the original bar. I probably cut 2-3 cords of firerwood per year and lots of cedars for posts or just clearing land. Occasionally cut lumber with it. Now I know that Poulans get a bad rap nowdays, but it was a good saw only kinda heavy cause there were no plastics involved, except for that clear gas line that never needed replacing.


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## CTYank (Nov 9, 2010)

sbhooper said:


> Cytank,
> 
> I am not saying the climate is not changing. It is-NATURALLY! Climate always changes and we can not do anything about it.
> 
> ...



You're entitled to your opinion, but not your facts. And, for that I'll defer to scientists who've not reached conclusion, then listened to the evidence.

You over-simplify, and demonize, which makes a reasonable discussion difficult.

Actually, we have a possible trifecta:
1. We are at, or closely approaching "peak oil" after which annual oil extracted will decline. We have big-time competitors for access to oil: China and India. We have a stimulus to detox from oil addiction.
2. Air quality in much of the globe is declining from coal and oil consumption. This could use help.
3. Atmospheric co2 has risen for many decades, and is resulting in major loss of Greenland and Antartic ice caps- a HUGE threat. Rising co2 in the oceans is threatening shellfish. Warming of ocean areas results in increasing evaporation of moisture- also a greenhouse gas. Warming of boreal forests results in liberation of methane previously trapped in bogs- a much more powerful greenhouse gas than co2. Much can be done here.

Don't get hung up on all/nothing; you didn't hear such from me.
We can learn, adapt, evolve our behavior, or go "ostrich."

POTUS is properly referred to as "President" or "Mr.", except by the likes of Rush or Fox shills. At a minimum, the office deserves respect.

So, please save the silly accusations, and per Jack Friday:
"The facts ma'am, just the facts."

"cytank" sounds like something involved with plating.


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## sbhooper (Nov 9, 2010)

You can drink whatever coolaid you want, but that is pure bs. According to people that study it, only 19 percent of the oil in the world has ever been tapped. I was in Iraq and it is still RUNNING OUT OF THE GROUND over there. 

You have obviously bought off on the left-wing political agenda and believe the doctored evidence that is pure crap. A lot of the so-called evidence is from proven-to-be-doctored UN documents from the people that want a one world order so that all the resources can be controlled. 

Keep drinking and they will love you! Quit drinking and listen to the FACTS and you will know what is really happening. 

One volcano distroys more ozone than all the hair spray ever used. Climate change is natural and if you believe otherwise, then I will bet that you voted for our illustrious left-wing elite.


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## rustyb (Nov 9, 2010)

sbhooper said:


> You can drink whatever coolaid you want, but that is pure bs. According to people that study it, only 19 percent of the oil in the world has ever been tapped. I was in Iraq and it is still RUNNING OUT OF THE GROUND over there.
> 
> You have obviously bought off on the left-wing political agenda and believe the doctored evidence that is pure crap. A lot of the so-called evidence is from proven-to-be-doctored UN documents from the people that want a one world order so that all the resources can be controlled.
> 
> Keep drinking and they will love you! Quit drinking and listen to the FACTS and you will know what is really happening.




Out of curiosity, where did you get your 19% fact from? 

Regardless, there's a big difference between the amount of oil left in the ground and the ease as to which to get it. Running out of oil, any time soon, is not what is at issue. The problem is that most of the easily accessed oil has already been taken. In other words, "that" oil has peaked, hence the term "peak oil".....

....or at least according to Ali Samsam Bakhtiari, Senior Expert in the Corporate Planning Directorate of the National Iranian Oil Company; Kenneth Deffeyes, petroleum geologist, professor Emeritus at Princeton University, researcher for Shell Oil; and Colin Campbell, trustee for the Petroleum Institute of London & former geologist for Oxford University, Texaco, British Petroleum & Amoco.

I'm merely guessing that those people might actually know a few things a handful of chainsaw enthusiast don't. But I don't know for sure. Please let the readers here know where they can find the "facts" you refer to. Thanks!


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## Marc (Nov 10, 2010)

rustyb said:


> Out of curiosity, where did you get your 19% fact from?
> 
> Regardless, there's a big difference between the amount of oil left in the ground and the ease as to which to get it. Running out of oil, any time soon, is not what is at issue. The problem is that most of the easily accessed oil has already been taken. In other words, "that" oil has peaked, hence the term "peak oil".....
> 
> ...



Although I can't remember where I read it, I did read somewhere (maybe in the Economist?) that tar sand petroleum extraction becomes economically viable around $80/bbl. And our good friends to the north have quite a bit of that stuff. Of course, efficiency is much less than drilling for crude and unfortunately most of the time creates a lot more net CO2. I'm mostly in agreement that fossil fuels should be phased out as soon as practically and economically viable.

Also reading lately a lot about "geoengineering" solutions to warming. Some very interesting stuff out there.

As much as I hate to admit it, the ozone layer really did recover significantly since the Montreal Protocol. I still have some disdain for it as a fire protection engineer though because it resulted in the ban of Halon production, one of the best fire supression tools to come along since the automatic sprinkler. On the other hand, the research into water mist technologies might not have happened either. C'est la vie.


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## logbutcher (Nov 10, 2010)

Wood you ladies just calm the F down for a bit. Garter snap somewhere else.
This concept has become non-science, not empirical, and is now ideological boredom....on all sides.

You want to be Msr. Green, fine. You need to be Msr. Denier, fine.

I and other saw users will do what we do, at least until I do not come down for breakfast. My personal choice is NOT to use new or used motor oil. My choice, your choice. You can thank those who risk thier lives for this---especially on Thursday. 

For you AlGore extremists, neither you nor he walk anywhere, or use carbon-free fuels for much of anything. Hypocrisy ?:monkey:

For you other side right ideologues, the science, observable and projected, does show regional Climate Change. Read the verifiable research. Do due diligence.

JMNSHFO


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## rustyb (Nov 10, 2010)

logbutcher said:


> For you AlGore extremists, neither you nor he walk anywhere, or use carbon-free fuels for much of anything. Hypocrisy ?:monkey:
> 
> JMNSHFO




 
Hypocrisy? Yes, there's plenty of that in the world.Doesn't matter which side one is on in this juvenile game of politics; ignorant redneck to lipstick liberal, hypocrisy runs amok. 

It shouldn't be forgotten though. Even though we all enjoy the use of inexpensive (relative speaking) energy gained from fossil fuels, there are those who consciously choose to use less....those who make the choice to live more simply...those who are able to set their greed and personal egos aside so the broader picture becomes more clear. These people don't do it to align themselves with any one political side or for some sort of trendy "green" image; they do it because it's practical... and they understand the value of not wasting. They do it because they have the foresight to consider their kids and their successors. They do it because they value health and well being above all else. I don't think there's anything wrong with that......


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## logbutcher (Nov 10, 2010)

rustyb said:


> Hypocrisy? Yes, there's plenty of that in the world.Doesn't matter which side one is on in this juvenile game of politics; ignorant redneck to lipstick liberal, hypocrisy runs amok.
> 
> It shouldn't be forgotten though. Even though we all enjoy the use of inexpensive (relative speaking) energy gained from fossil fuels, there are those who consciously choose to use less....those who make the choice to live more simply...those who are able to set their greed and personal egos aside so the broader picture becomes more clear. These people don't do it to align themselves with any one political side or for some sort of trendy "green" image; they do it because it's practical... and they understand the value of not wasting. They do it because they have the foresight to consider their kids and their successors. They do it because they value health and well being above all else. I don't think there's anything wrong with that......



Deer Rusty:

:agree2::agree2:

Lest you forget---this is a *WOOD* web site. Trees: the only carbon-free solar fuel around. 
Most on the site work the woods, use the woods, mill, log for pulp and lumber, and....do arborist things up trees.

From my fav philosopher: " I burn, therefore I am."

JMNSHO


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## CountryBoy19 (Nov 10, 2010)

logbutcher said:


> Deer Rusty:
> 
> :agree2::agree2:
> 
> ...



Actually, to be technically correct, wood is not carbon-free, I think the term you were looking for was "carbon-neutral", meaning that it takes the same amount of carbon out of the atmosphere as it puts in when it's burning. However, I also would not agree that it is completely carbon neutral. I think it would only be fair if you factor in the fuel/oil you use in your saws, the fuel in your splitter, and the fuel in your wood-hauler. So wood isn't completely carbon-neutral, but it's pretty close when you figure how little CO2 is produced in the gathering of firewood.


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## logbutcher (Nov 10, 2010)

CountryBoy19 said:


> Actually, to be technically correct, wood is not carbon-free, I think the term you were looking for was "carbon-neutral", meaning that it takes the same amount of carbon out of the atmosphere as it puts in when it's burning. However, I also would not agree that it is completely carbon neutral. I think it would only be fair if you factor in the fuel/oil you use in your saws, the fuel in your splitter, and the fuel in your wood-hauler. So wood isn't completely carbon-neutral, but it's pretty close when you figure how little CO2 is produced in the gathering of firewood.



You are correct Msr., it is indeed "Carbon Neutral".  It was the hormones kicking in ( and the Laphroaig ). 

Carbon Neutral is more than "technically correct", it is the only correct term for the process of burning trees for fuel---excluding all other factors of production.

Now, may I be excused ? It is past my bedtime.:newbie:


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## WOODHOGG (Dec 8, 2010)

*bar oil*

Hi, i was told years ago that you could use motor on your bar,but will not work
very well because of the way it is made,bar oil i understand is made so that it is
stringy and well stay on your bar where as motor oil will work in a emergencey 
but you will go thru a lot of it.


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## DangerTree (Dec 8, 2010)

But motor oil will help your wood burn better! Best used near a lake or creek or a city ditch for added effect. I like the rainbow! it's beautiful.


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## pook (Dec 8, 2010)

WOODHOGG said:


> Hi, i was told years ago that you could use motor on your bar,but will not work
> very well because of the way it is made,bar oil i understand is made so that it is
> stringy and well stay on your bar where as motor oil will work in a emergencey
> but you will go thru a lot of it.


u call it stringy, i call it clingy= if the oil flies off the chain the bar & chain will wear from lack of lubrication


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## branchbuzzer (Dec 8, 2010)

DangerTree said:


> I like the rainbow! it's beautiful.



Me too, colors.

You can taste them after a while if you sniff the mist. I like strawberry best.


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## D.Marsh (Dec 12, 2010)

branchbuzzer said:


> You can taste them after a while if you sniff the mist. I like strawberry best.



The snozzberries taste like snozzberries!


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## qweesdraw (Dec 12, 2010)

Why did you change oil in your vehicle in the first place?
(so it will last longer)
Using scrap oil from one machine to make another makes no sense to me.
Use the right stuff and your saws/bars/chains will last longer.
Used oil for the shop on an oil burner! ,also
The wood planks on my log hauler trailer.
Mark


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## mad_mat222 (Mar 21, 2021)

Hi,
Just doing some reading. I have always run used engine oil and just like to read what others use. I recently saw mention of canola oils. I didn’t realise nature could provide a cleaner option. I filter my engine oil and never considered the tackiness of the oil. Might start adding the stp, morels or lucas stuff To help it stick. The oil is only on the bar for a couple of seconds so pretty sure it has enough life left to last that long.

in relation to used oil not having any protective qualities left, means your vehicles engine was running with no protection which is simply not the case. Very cleaver people calculate the service intervals and get a good balance of protection and costs.

I was looking at attempts to clean engine oil and found this piece of text https://www.prweb.com/releases/2012/6/prweb9565402.htm
If valvoline can reuse the stuff it can’t be all bad.


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## olyman (Mar 23, 2021)

sawinredneck said:


> ..................AND, all the metal particulate that was accumulated while the motor wears down probably wont help bar and chain wear. Plus the toxins gained in said breaking down motor ADD to the toxins you are already spreading with good oil. Then the lack of a tackifier to make the oil stick, the oil is too thin to start with, then heats up and thins more. That's IF it doesn't plug up the oiling system, or burn up the oil pump from all the crap that's in the used oil.
> So you get less use from the bar and chain, the possibility of burning up the oiling system and polluting the environment........... need we go on?
> It's a bad idea that's been beat to death numerous times.


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## mad_mat222 (Apr 25, 2021)




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## mad_mat222 (Apr 25, 2021)

Went through the Stihl MSDS and it stated viscosity was 220 @40’c for its b&c oil. Found this. Crankcase oil is listed as 50wt for viscosity of 220. Doubt that’s the standard and more likely the gear lube of 90wt at 40’c. 

i have access to used 90 gear oil from outboard gearboxes. It’s still at the right price and is a bit cleaner. Could use diff oil I suppose but that stinks.


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## joe25DA (Apr 25, 2021)

We had a blizzard a few years ago, had 2 big maples come down. One was in front of an elderly neighbors driveway. While we were clearing during the storm I ran out of bar oil. I used what I found in the garage, an old quart of atf mixed with some 75w90. I was running a 3.7 craftsman (Poulan 3700) and it didn’t seem to notice. If anything the atf detergents cleaned the works a bit and kept the oil flowing in sub freezing temps. But I’d never run used motor oil.


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## FlyingDutchman (Apr 26, 2021)

I've always been tempted to use waste oil for this but I don't want to clean it off my saw too bad or have it stain my pants/saw plastic


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## LondonNeil (Apr 27, 2021)

Husky manual do for my 365 actually says if no bar oil available, ep80 gear oil is the correct viscosity. I had half a gallon of unused ep80 I'd cleared out my dad's garage so I used it in the saw. I had forgotten how bad that stuff smells!


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