# Newest addition 241c-m



## KG441c (Oct 18, 2014)

Sold my 026 and purchased this 241cm. Wasnt too impressed with stock form but a sharp chain and lowered rakers and a muffler mod woke her up


----------



## Spectre468 (Oct 18, 2014)

Nice! How does it compare to the 026?


----------



## KG441c (Oct 18, 2014)

Thinking about a cannon 18" supermini .370 picco bar and a Stihl ps picco square filed chain with a 7 or 8 pin sprocket?


----------



## KG441c (Oct 18, 2014)

Spectre468 said:


> Nice! How does it compare to the 026?


Lighter , more maneuverable, and fast . I was surprised how hard u can dawg it and the torque it has for a little machine. Its got some breaking in to do Im sure but my ported 026 had alota torque at 195psi.


----------



## KG441c (Oct 18, 2014)

Im not too crazy about the 3005 mount 16" bar as it seems very short. Not many options out there but cannon does make a 18" lp picco bar in the 3005 mount or cannon calls it c1 mount. That would give alil more reach


----------



## KG441c (Oct 18, 2014)

Would like to hear some chain setups for this saw if anyone has tried any that they feel r the best


----------



## Stihlman441 (Oct 18, 2014)

Hows the throttle response after the muff mod ?.
I bit it will run a bit richer as well.

I use a .325 .063 chain and 7 pin rim sprocket set up


----------



## KG441c (Oct 18, 2014)

Responded much better on the trigger. Does anyone know if these saws like a timing advance?


Stihlman441 said:


> Hows the throttle response after the muff mod ?.
> I bit it will run a bit richer as well.


----------



## Stihlman441 (Oct 18, 2014)

Randy ported my one with no timing advance.


----------



## KG441c (Oct 18, 2014)

Its a pretty hairy little machine with just a mm. I think with the picco chain and square filed with rakers set it will be awesome in 14" and under wood


----------



## maulhead (Oct 18, 2014)

Nice saw looks familiar. I bet that she really can breath now. They really do have torque for as small as they are. I'm sure you could dog it if you pushed it really hard, but I was never able to, even in bigger wood. They sure are fun to run 

Stihl has a 18" picco bar in the 3005 mount 3005 000 4817


----------



## KG441c (Oct 18, 2014)

Ive got the rim sprocket kit ordered and a 7 and 8 pin and gonna be playing with thoso and square filing the picco


----------



## KG441c (Oct 18, 2014)

maulhead said:


> Nice saw looks familiar. I bet that she really can breath now. They really do have torque for as small as they are. I'm sure you could dog it if you pushed it really hard, but I was never able to, even in bigger wood. They sure are fun to run
> 
> Stihl has a 18" picco bar in the 3005 mount 3005 000 4817



Thanks for the saw Maulhead!! Lol! Ya it has quite the rumble and shake with the muffler opened up!! Lol! Thanks for the bar#


----------



## maulhead (Oct 18, 2014)

Your welcome. I'm sure it does, look forward to some videos of it!! I should make some mods to my other one....


----------



## KG441c (Oct 18, 2014)

I ran it stock and went straight to the shop and opened the exhaust up and recalibrated. Big difference!!


----------



## Stihlman441 (Oct 18, 2014)

Here is my well used little fella,i had a coil/control modual die there awhile ago,put a new one in all good.
I like this saw so much i got another one done.


----------



## KG441c (Oct 18, 2014)

Stihlman441 said:


> Here is my well used little fella,i had a coil/control modual die there awhile ago,put a new one in all good.
> I like this saw so much i got another one done.
> 
> View attachment 374495
> ...


Very nice!


----------



## KG441c (Oct 18, 2014)

I like putting heatshrink over my handle. Gives that plastic handle more grip and cushion


----------



## maulhead (Oct 18, 2014)

That's the only thing I dont like about them is the plastic handles. Not sure why they dont put metal ones on them?? They do on the 241 VW C-M's. I thought about buying a handle for the VW 241 and putting it on, but not hooking up the wires for the heated handle. You would also need the upper AV spring from a VW.


----------



## KG441c (Oct 18, 2014)

$$$$$!!!!!


----------



## maulhead (Oct 18, 2014)

that is all it takes


----------



## KG441c (Oct 18, 2014)

maulhead said:


> That's the only thing I dont like about them is the plastic handles. Not sure why they dont put metal ones on them?? They do on the 241 VW C-M's. I thought about buying a handle for the VW 241 and putting it on, but not hooking up the wires for the heated handle. You would also need the upper AV spring from a VW.


U would like the heatshrink. Slide it on and put the heat gun to it. 1 1/2" with glue inside. Perfect snug fit


----------



## maulhead (Oct 18, 2014)

I will look into it, they sell that at the local Napa in bulk or by the inch. I have a new heat gun I only used once might give it a try.


----------



## KG441c (Oct 18, 2014)

maulhead said:


> I will look into it, they sell that at the local Napa in bulk or by the inch. I have a new heat gun I only used once might give it a try.


Where the bends r it will crease up but just give it a minute and reheat and eventually it will level right out


----------



## BBP (Oct 18, 2014)

KG441c said:


> I ran it stock and went straight to the shop and opened the exhaust up and recalibrated. Big difference!!


What does recalibrating consist of?


----------



## KG441c (Oct 18, 2014)

Put the saw on start and crank it and dont blip the throttle for 90 sec. Cut it off , recrank, and go make 5 loaded cuts and its done


----------



## BBP (Oct 18, 2014)

KG441c said:


> Put the saw on start and crank it and dont blip the throttle for 90 sec. Cut it off , recrank, and go make 5 loaded cuts and its done


Thanks. Same procedure for the 261cm? Nice saw by the way.


----------



## KG441c (Oct 18, 2014)

Yes all the mtronics. Be sure to let it idle on choke for 90sec without touching the throttle


----------



## Mastermind (Oct 18, 2014)

Andrew.......how does that new one compare to the older one? I changed up the port timing numbers a little.


----------



## Stihlman441 (Oct 18, 2014)

Dont know yet Randy havnt given it a good run, having a week or so off cutting wood for a change.
How did you change the timing number to improve in what area ?.


----------



## Mastermind (Oct 18, 2014)

The transfers are a bit higher....


----------



## KG441c (Oct 18, 2014)

What is stock vs ported compression?


----------



## KG441c (Oct 18, 2014)

Randy can it be ran without a base gasket or is it too tight?


----------



## AKDoug (Oct 19, 2014)

I started off hating this saw. I couldn't get anyone to buy it from my shop, so I just added it to my fleet as the excavator/firewood processor limbing/topping saw. After a few tanks this little saw really took off. I'm going to MM it when I get back from vacation and see what transpires. I switched mine to .325 /.063 Stihl Rm chain. I didn't see much difference other than I feel I go longer between sharpening with this chain. I do so much sub 16" wood that this saw makes total sense for me. I second the comments that it is tough to bog down, which is amazing for a saw this small.


----------



## KG441c (Oct 19, 2014)

AKDoug said:


> I started off hating this saw. I couldn't get anyone to buy it from my shop, so I just added it to my fleet as the excavator/firewood processor limbing/topping saw. After a few tanks this little saw really took off. I'm going to MM it when I get back from vacation and see what transpires. I switched mine to .325 /.063 Stihl Rm chain. I didn't see much difference other than I feel I go longer between sharpening with this chain. I do so much sub 16" wood that this saw makes total sense for me. I second the comments that it is tough to bog down, which is amazing for a saw this small.


I agree! When I really leaned on it is where I was most impressed. AK do u notice if the saw self feeds better with the picco or .325?


----------



## AKDoug (Oct 19, 2014)

I think it self feeds better with .325, but I also switched over when the picco was dull, so it's tainted my impression somewhat. Using that saw around my heavy equipment and the processor means dirty wood, so the .325 is better for me in this case.


----------



## MCW (Oct 19, 2014)

In clean wood don't underestimate picco. It is FAST but unfortunately it doesn't last long in dirty wood. Personally I use Stihl 26RM or Carlton K3C because I cut in pretty abrasive conditions but I wouldn't hesitate in using picco under clean conditions. The 241C is a cracker little saw though, that's for sure.


----------



## KG441c (Oct 19, 2014)

Ya Mastermech did a test with .325, 3/8, and 3/8 picco. The picco was 3 sec. Faster in the same wood with a 261c


----------



## MCW (Oct 19, 2014)

The picco rim is also the same diameter as an 8 tooth .325" rim so chain speed is pretty quick too. Running a 7 tooth .325" rim isn't exactly a fair comparison.


----------



## KG441c (Oct 19, 2014)

He did test with all rim sprockets on all sizes. No spurs. 7 and 8 pin on all the chain sizes. The fastest of the lot was 3/8 picco 8 pin


----------



## MCW (Oct 19, 2014)

KG441c said:


> He did test with all rim sprockets on all sizes. No spurs. 7 and 8 pin on all the chain sizes. The fastest of the lot was 3/8 picco 8 pin



Cool. The 8 tooth picco rims are hard to find. In harder wood my stock 241 is faster with a 7 tooth .325" rim than an 8 tooth but in picco it would pull it easily.


----------



## KG441c (Oct 19, 2014)

Ya I can tell the 6 tooth spur that comes on it is holding it back so I ordereded the rim kit and a 7 and 8 pin sprockets in picco
.


----------



## KG441c (Oct 19, 2014)

Ya I can tell the 6 tooth spur that comes on it is holding it back so I ordereded the rim kit and a 7 and 8 pin sprockets in picco. Ill mostly be cutting clean green so I think the picco will work good. Im gonna square file some to see of the shoulder support on the square vs the fine point on the round will stay sharper?
.


----------



## MCW (Oct 19, 2014)

KG441c said:


> Ya I can tell the 6 tooth spur that comes on it is holding it back so I ordereded the rim kit and a 7 and 8 pin sprockets in picco. Ill mostly be cutting clean green so I think the picco will work good. Im gonna square file some to see of the shoulder support on the square vs the fine point on the round will stay sharper?
> .



I've heard a few people say that square stays sharper for longer than round filed chisel although I've found the opposite.


----------



## KG441c (Oct 19, 2014)

The picco filed at 35 makes a small fine point that seems to damage pretty easy. Im thinkin the square with the extra shoulder support may stay sharper on the picco but on larger chain round may stay sharper longer?


----------



## Time's Standing Stihl (Oct 19, 2014)

Whats a heated handle 241 go for?


----------



## AKDoug (Oct 19, 2014)

I'm running the 7t .325 sprocket off of a 251. I don't know if an 8T would go very well with that size chain in my wood. In reality it really doesn't matter to me. I won't be changing anytime soon. Cutting off small tops and odd limbs before it goes into the processor is all this saw will see this year.


----------



## blsnelling (Oct 19, 2014)

KG441c said:


> Does anyone know if these saws like a timing advance?


Not on an MTronic saw.


----------



## KG441c (Oct 19, 2014)

blsnelling said:


> Not on an MTronic saw.


Brad can these be run without a base gasket or is lathe work required?


----------



## blsnelling (Oct 19, 2014)

Factory squish was .028, so the gasket cannot be deleted.


----------



## KG441c (Oct 19, 2014)

Thanks for the response Brad


----------



## KG441c (Oct 19, 2014)

How about dropping the gasket and losing about .010 in the dome Brad?


----------



## blsnelling (Oct 19, 2014)

That would work. I simply cut the base and tightened the squish, and ended up at 178 PSI.



Here's another.


----------



## KG441c (Oct 19, 2014)

Very nice!!


----------



## SawTroll (Oct 19, 2014)

maulhead said:


> ...
> 
> Stihl has a 18" picco bar in the 3005 mount 3005 000 4817



At 62dl it is only a 16 1/2" or so bar though...


----------



## KG441c (Oct 19, 2014)

SawTroll said:


> At 62dl it is only a 16 1/2" or so bar though...


I thought the 16 " picco seemed small??? So the 16 is really a 14 1/2?


----------



## LowVolt (Oct 19, 2014)

Just picked up one of these saws off eBay and just waiting for it to arrive. It is coming as power head only so I will be looking for a good bar/chain combo.


----------



## KG441c (Oct 19, 2014)

LowVolt said:


> Just picked up one of these saws off eBay and just waiting for it to arrive. It is coming as power head only so I will be looking for a good bar/chain combo.


I saw a new one on ebay go for like 406$$ the other day!! Killer deal


----------



## LowVolt (Oct 19, 2014)

KG441c said:


> I saw a new one on ebay go for like 406$$ the other day!! Killer deal



I don't have it yet but mine pho was $320 to my door. From the pictures it looks mint.


----------



## SawTroll (Oct 19, 2014)

KG441c said:


> I thought the 16 " picco seemed small??? So the 16 is really a 14 1/2?


Between 14 1/2 and 15".


----------



## SawTroll (Oct 19, 2014)

AKDoug said:


> I'm running the 7t .325 sprocket off of a 251. I don't know if an 8T would go very well with that size chain in my wood. In reality it really doesn't matter to me. I won't be changing anytime soon. Cutting off small tops and odd limbs before it goes into the processor is all this saw will see this year.



There is no point in trying an 8-pin on that saw, unless you use it for limbing saplings...


----------



## KG441c (Oct 19, 2014)

SawTroll said:


> Between 14 1/2 and 15".


I thought that bar seemed short!!! Lol! Thanks Sawtroll


----------



## KG441c (Oct 19, 2014)

SawTroll said:


> There is no point in trying an 8-pin on that saw, unless you use it for limbing saplings...


Sawtroll do u know if a 3003 mount will work on the 241 3005 mount with a adapter?


----------



## SawTroll (Oct 19, 2014)

KG441c said:


> Sawtroll do u know if a 3003 mount will work on the 241 3005 mount with a adapter?


I highly doubt it will, as the oiler holes and tail size will be off. Doing what is needed to adapt it isn't woth the trouble (basically the same issue as with small s. large Husky mounts).


----------



## KG441c (Oct 19, 2014)

SawTroll said:


> I highly doubt it will, as the oiler holes and tail size will be off. Doing what is needed to adapt it isn't woth the trouble (basically the same issue as with small s. large Husky mounts).


Ok thanks


----------



## maulhead (Oct 19, 2014)

LowVolt said:


> I don't have it yet but mine pho was $320 to my door. From the pictures it looks mint.



Your talking about the one that was PHO in Canada for buy it now of $279 + $40 shipping, right? I saw that one, I was really tempted to click the buy it now just because it looked like SUCH a good deal. But I already had two at the time. It SURE was tempting though, I had to walk away from the computer because it was so tempting and came back a few minutes later and hit refresh, and saw someone had bought it, Thank You!! That was Great deal!! I hope it's everything it looked like in the pictures!!


----------



## bryanr2 (Oct 19, 2014)

makes me kinda miss the one I sold.


----------



## KG441c (Oct 19, 2014)

Just made a discovery. Hadnt finished but it will work. A 261 or 362 or 026 magnesium clutch cover will work on the 241. Grind off about 3/4" of inside mount behind back stud hole and it fits flush on the 241. To cover the back stud hole grind a extra stud down to the tapered part so its flush when inserted on the back side of clutch cover then screw a stud nut on outside and it looks like it has 2 studs! 241 plastic cover gone!!!


----------



## SAWMIKAZE (Oct 19, 2014)

Congrats on the saw keith , they are very handy little saws !


----------



## blsnelling (Oct 19, 2014)

The point of the 241 is it's light weight. Otherwise, you might as well step up to a 261.


----------



## KG441c (Oct 19, 2014)

Ya that 261 clutch cover may be alil heavier than the plastic one. I dony care too much for the plastic though


----------



## SAWMIKAZE (Oct 19, 2014)

KG441c said:


> Ya I can tell the 6 tooth spur that comes on it is holding it back so I ordereded the rim kit and a 7 and 8 pin sprockets in picco
> .



Did i give you the right part number keith ?


----------



## KG441c (Oct 19, 2014)

SAWMIKAZE said:


> Did i give you the right part number keith ?


Yes appreciate it.


----------



## SAWMIKAZE (Oct 19, 2014)

LowVolt said:


> Just picked up one of these saws off eBay and just waiting for it to arrive. It is coming as power head only so I will be looking for a good bar/chain combo.



I just realized i missed your last message rory ill send those pictures asap


----------



## KG441c (Oct 19, 2014)

As soon as the new bar comes in I plan on trying the 7 tooth rim picco sprocket kit and Ps square filed


----------



## SAWMIKAZE (Oct 19, 2014)

KG441c said:


> As soon as the new bar comes in I plan on trying the 7 tooth rim picco sprocket kit and Ps square filed



Is it possible to get a 8t rim for picco ?


----------



## KG441c (Oct 19, 2014)

Yes I bought a 7 and a 8


----------



## KG441c (Oct 19, 2014)

KG441c said:


> Yes I bought a 7 and a 8


0000 642 1241- 8t 3/8 p sprocket


----------



## SAWMIKAZE (Oct 19, 2014)

Cool...my dealer said there was no 8t..thanks for the part number


----------



## KG441c (Oct 19, 2014)

Sawmikaze I called left coast for the gb bar but they only have the 16 and no 18. According to sawtroll the 18 is only 16 " anyway. 61dl


----------



## SAWMIKAZE (Oct 19, 2014)

KG441c said:


> Sawmikaze I called left coast for the gb bar but they only have the 16 and no 18. According to sawtroll the 18 is only 16 " anyway. 61dl



My bar 16" and 55 drivers..i had to go to 56 because of the rim..what its actual length is im not sure

http://leftcoastsupplies.com/product/16-gb-arbor-tech-bar-38lp/

i didnt know there was an 18" option for picco


----------



## KG441c (Oct 19, 2014)

SAWMIKAZE said:


> My bar 16" and 55 drivers..i had to go to 56 because of the rim..what its actual length is im not sure
> 
> http://leftcoastsupplies.com/product/16-gb-arbor-tech-bar-38lp/


14.5". Sure is a nice bar though.


----------



## SAWMIKAZE (Oct 19, 2014)

KG441c said:


> 14.5". Sure is a nice bar though.



I use mine to limb and cut small wood so i dont really need a long bar


----------



## MCW (Oct 19, 2014)

SAWMIKAZE said:


> My bar 16" and 55 drivers..i had to go to 56 because of the rim..what its actual length is im not sure
> 
> http://leftcoastsupplies.com/product/16-gb-arbor-tech-bar-38lp/
> 
> i didnt know there was an 18" option for picco



Stihl do an E bar in picco 18". Not available from Stihl Australia but available from Stihl USA.


----------



## LowVolt (Oct 19, 2014)

maulhead said:


> Your talking about the one that was PHO in Canada for buy it now of $279 + $40 shipping, right? I saw that one, I was really tempted to click the buy it now just because it looked like SUCH a good deal. But I already had two at the time. It SURE was tempting though, I had to walk away from the computer because it was so tempting and came back a few minutes later and hit refresh, and saw someone had bought it, Thank You!! That was Great deal!! I hope it's everything it looked like in the pictures!!



That is the one. I do not have the saw yet but the guy tells me it is on the way. His communication has not been the greatest but we will just have to be a little patient I guess.



SAWMIKAZE said:


> I just realized i missed your last message rory ill send those pictures asap



NP. Whenever you get a chance.



SAWMIKAZE said:


> My bar 16" and 55 drivers..i had to go to 56 because of the rim..what its actual length is im not sure
> 
> http://leftcoastsupplies.com/product/16-gb-arbor-tech-bar-38lp/
> 
> i didnt know there was an 18" option for picco



Good looking bar and priced well too. Just hope they don't inflate the shipping cost.


----------



## KenJax Tree (Oct 19, 2014)

LowVolt said:


> That is the one. I do not have the saw yet but the guy tells me it is on the way. His communication has not been the greatest but we will just have to be a little patient I guess.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I hope his name isn't Chris Wells


----------



## KG441c (Oct 19, 2014)

15 or 16 in shipping


----------



## SAWMIKAZE (Oct 19, 2014)

Ya the shipping isnt cheap ..but its still not a bad price even with the shipping cost , my dealer wanted around 30 bucks anyway so it wasnt a huge difference..im sure if you lived closer it wouldnt be as bad..but PA is pretty far from cali


----------



## LowVolt (Oct 20, 2014)

KenJax Tree said:


> I hope his name isn't Chris Wells


That thread popped up just a couple days after it bought the saw and I quickly went back and checked. No it is not.


----------



## LowVolt (Oct 20, 2014)

Hopefully I will post up some pics of mine if and when it shows up.


----------



## bryanr2 (Oct 20, 2014)

LowVolt said:


> That thread popped up just a couple days after it bought the saw and I quickly went back and checked. No it is not.


Thank God. That prick has it coming.


----------



## VinceGU05 (Oct 20, 2014)

KG441c said:


> Sawtroll do u know if a 3003 mount will work on the 241 3005 mount with a adapter?


 well there you go.. have t buy a 261cm now


----------



## KG441c (Oct 20, 2014)

VinceGU05 said:


> well there you go.. have t buy a 261cm now


261 doesnt make sense to me . Ive had a 261 and a 026. I just as soon pick up a 362c as it feels better in hand to me. The 261 to me is that in between saw that cant be small or big but on the other hand most people feel that way about a 362. Guess thats why I have a 241 and a 362!! Lol!! I have the 241c, 362c, and a 461r. Thats a perfect 3 saw plan for me anyways


----------



## VinceGU05 (Oct 20, 2014)

KG441c said:


> 261 doesnt make sense to me . Ive had a 261 and a 026. I just as soon pick up a 362c as it feels better in hand to me. The 261 to me is that in between saw that cant be small or big but on the other hand most people feel that way about a 362. Guess thats why I have a 241 and a 362!! Lol!! I have the 241c, 362c, and a 461r. Thats a perfect 3 saw plan for me anyways



yup .. i just staggered similar with 261 441 660


----------



## KG441c (Oct 20, 2014)

I love the 241 but knew I wasnt a fan of that very short bar the minute I picked it up. At least the 3005 mount 18" will give me a full 16" reach. Ill post a weight of the whole setup with the rim sprocket kit and a 18" picco bar when I get it all in


----------



## SawTroll (Oct 20, 2014)

KG441c said:


> Thinking about a cannon 18" supermini .370 picco bar and a Stihl ps picco square filed chain with a 7 or 8 pin sprocket?



A search tells me that the 18" Cannon Supermini in 3/8" lo-pro (they call it .370) is listed for 69dl, which is a "long" 18" bar - and that the Cannon C1 mount is a combo mount for Stihl 3005 and Small Husky.

I don't quite trust the listed Cannon dl counts though, as there are inconsistencies between different lists I have seen, and between dl counts in .325 vs. 3/8" - but this is from a 2014 price list, and consistant with 78dl in .325....

This bar may be a bit much on a MS241 though.


----------



## KG441c (Oct 20, 2014)

Im suppose to have the supermini c1 16" coming. I guess by the 64 dl it should be a true 16"?


----------



## SawTroll (Oct 20, 2014)

KG441c said:


> Im suppose to have the supermini c1 16" coming. I guess by the 64 dl it should be a true 16"?



Thought of that one actually - 64dl 3/8" should be around 17".


----------



## LowVolt (Oct 27, 2014)

Finally!!!


----------



## KG441c (Oct 27, 2014)

Is it ported Lowolt


----------



## KG441c (Oct 27, 2014)

They sure r good running little saws


----------



## LowVolt (Oct 27, 2014)

Nope just got it USPS today. It also came with half a tank of oil and fuel! Ugh...


----------



## flyinlow (Oct 27, 2014)

LowVolt said:


> Finally!!!
> 
> View attachment 376222
> View attachment 376223
> ...


You are going to love that saw. If you want to really have some fun send it to brad snelling. My 241 has 195 lb. of comp. & runs 325 full chisel. I call it " The little monster". That will put a smile on your face.


----------



## blsnelling (Oct 27, 2014)

That's a really nice saw Rory. I'd like to have one myself.


----------



## SAWMIKAZE (Oct 27, 2014)

KG441c said:


> 261 doesnt make sense to me . Ive had a 261 and a 026. I just as soon pick up a 362c as it feels better in hand to me. The 261 to me is that in between saw that cant be small or big but on the other hand most people feel that way about a 362. Guess thats why I have a 241 and a 362!! Lol!! I have the 241c, 362c, and a 461r. Thats a perfect 3 saw plan for me anyways



Im with ya , im finding more and more use for 40/60cc combo


----------



## KG441c (Oct 27, 2014)

Brad u still not porting but doin just stage 1


----------



## blsnelling (Oct 27, 2014)

I'm taking a few jobs now. I did a 460 and a 660 last week. I ordered a 550 today. Send me a PM.


----------



## LowVolt (Oct 27, 2014)

flyinlow said:


> You are going to love that saw. If you want to really have some fun send it to brad snelling. My 241 has 195 lb. of comp. & runs 325 full chisel. I call it " The little monster". That will put a smile on your face.


Fully ported?


----------



## flyinlow (Oct 27, 2014)

LowVolt said:


> Fully ported?


Yes-- and it took 30 tanks to reach full potential. And it resides in the NOS Stihl case I bought from you! Thanks again.


----------



## LowVolt (Oct 27, 2014)

Gosh I totally forgot about that.


----------



## flyinlow (Oct 28, 2014)

A good deed on your part will not be forgotten on my part. I wish you could run my 241-- it's one of my go 2 saws. 1/3 of every tree I cut is done with the 241. After Brad did his magic it really came alive. It's sure easier on my shoulders and back.


----------



## Stew7 (Oct 28, 2014)

Since there seem to be a few 241 owners here, I was wondering if anyone has handled one of these and a Dolmar PS 421. I'm interested in picking up a saw in this size range and was wondering how they compare in real life. None of my local Stihl dealers have any 241s so I'd have to order one and I don't really have a local Dolmar dealer to compare myself. I've read good things on the Dolmar but have never owned that brand.

I don't mind spending the extra money for the Stihl but was just wondering from a user's point of view if there is a noticeable performance gap. The usage would be mostly limbing and small bucking for firewood.


----------



## KG441c (Oct 28, 2014)

Heavier


----------



## KenJax Tree (Oct 28, 2014)

Stew7 said:


> Since there seem to be a few 241 owners here, I was wondering if anyone has handled one of these and a Dolmar PS 421. I'm interested in picking up a saw in this size range and was wondering how they compare in real life. None of my local Stihl dealers have any 241s so I'd have to order one and I don't really have a local Dolmar dealer to compare myself. I've read good things on the Dolmar but have never owned that brand.
> 
> I don't mind spending the extra money for the Stihl but was just wondering from a user's point of view if there is a noticeable performance gap. The usage would be mostly limbing and small bucking for firewood.


I love my Dolmar 421 but i've never held a 241 and im just not a fan of how Stihl saws feel so i can't compare them, i'm not sure if the 241 is really worth $250 more. In real life the 421 is .5 oz. heavier.


----------



## KG441c (Oct 28, 2014)

The mtronics alone is worth 250 imo


----------



## KenJax Tree (Oct 28, 2014)

Yeah MTronic and AutoTune is nice and i like it on my 550 and 562 but i wouldn't necessarily pay that much extra just to have it.


----------



## KG441c (Oct 28, 2014)

No comparison. Carbs to me idle one way one time one way another time cut rich or lean in this size wood or that way in that size wood? Mtronics adjust perfect for every situation with no thinking on the operators part. Lets me think about sharpening chain and other things like safety instead of tuning a saw


----------



## KenJax Tree (Oct 28, 2014)

I've never had the wood lean or richen my tune and rarely touch my idle, but none of mine are spot on perfectly tweaked i tune a little rich.


----------



## KG441c (Oct 28, 2014)

If u 4 stroke slightly out of the cut and cleans up in say 4" wood u will no doubt be lean in 20" wood?


----------



## KG441c (Oct 28, 2014)

U have to retune for big wood especially if u r already lean in small wood?


----------



## KenJax Tree (Oct 28, 2014)

Not sure Keith i've never had my saws that close to the edge they're more on the fat side and my 372 and 390 i have to push a little or dog in to really clean up so even if im limbing 4" wood im still ok.


----------



## KG441c (Oct 28, 2014)

Makes sense. Better safe than sorry but my point was mtronics is optimum regardless of situation. Carbs to me r like manual shift


----------



## KG441c (Oct 28, 2014)

My Mastermind ported 461 is extremely nice and runs flawless but Id trade it in a minute for a 661c


----------



## KenJax Tree (Oct 28, 2014)

I let you analyze all this stuff Keith i just read your report like with the oil


----------



## KG441c (Oct 28, 2014)

Anybody got a 661c they wanna trade for a masterminded 461 with about 5 tanks through it?


----------



## GCJenks204 (Oct 28, 2014)

KG441c said:


> Anybody got a 661c they wanna trade for a masterminded 461 with about 5 tanks through it?



After your speech about M-tronic? If it was a 441CM that had some extra bananas I might think about taking a trip up the road but... I think if a newbie like me is going to have something that nice it better tune itself or I will kill it some how.


----------



## treesmith (Nov 6, 2014)

It's funny, I never realised how many people can't tune a saw until recently, I kind of knew most homeowners have no idea but most of the professionals I've met don't either, not even increasing idle speed


----------



## KG441c (Nov 6, 2014)

treesmith said:


> It's funny, I never realised how many people can't tune a saw until recently, I kind of knew most homeowners have no idea but most of the professionals I've met don't either, not even increasing idle speed


Very true! I can tune one but ill take an Mtronics/Autotune anyday over manual carb


----------



## KG441c (Nov 6, 2014)

GCJenks204 said:


> After your speech about M-tronic? If it was a 441CM that had some extra bananas I might think about taking a trip up the road but... I think if a newbie like me is going to have something that nice it better tune itself or I will kill it some how.


Theres just too many advantages of mtronics over a manual carb but in the right hands the standard carb is deadly!!! To me tuning a carb is like a manual shift vehicle. Mtronics cranks easy, idles perfect, accelerates quick, adjust for optimum cut regardless the size of wood! Whats not to like? Let me guess , "It has too much stuff on it !!" Really???? A board and a solenoid???


----------



## wyk (Nov 8, 2014)

KG441c said:


> Theres just too many advantages of mtronics over a manual carb but in the right hands the standard carb is deadly!!! To me tuning a carb is like a manual shift vehicle. Mtronics cranks easy, idles perfect, accelerates quick, adjust for optimum cut regardless the size of wood! Whats not to like? Let me guess , "It has too much stuff on it !!" Really???? A board and a solenoid???



A computer board and a solenoid inside a rattle box out in all manner of weather - what could possibly go wrong?


----------



## KG441c (Nov 8, 2014)

Who all wants to go back to carb vehicles with manual shift?


----------



## wyk (Nov 8, 2014)

KG441c said:


> Who all wants to go back to carb vehicles with manual shift?



It's nearly impossible to find an automatic car in Europe that isn't a Mercedes or a rental car. I haven't driven an automatic in 3 years.  

My point was it isn't perfect, and there are genuine reasons to be wary about it's reliability - and the cost of repair.


----------



## KG441c (Nov 8, 2014)

Board is around 150 and the solenoid im not sure? If you havent tried mtronics u should give it a whirl. My opinion is if a board or a solenoid made a saw unreliable and we used that philosophy with cars we would still be in the stone age with vehicles? Seems vehicles have worked out just fine with electronics and solenoids?


----------



## wyk (Nov 8, 2014)

KG441c said:


> Board is around 150 and the solenoid im not sure? If you havent tried mtronics u should give it a whirl. My opinion is if a board or a solenoid made a saw unreliable and we used that philosophy with cars we would still be in the stone age with vehicles? Seems vehicles have worked out just fine with electronics and solenoids?



I remember when they first came out for cars - they weren't reliable.

I'm not saying it doesn't work - they obviously do. In fact, I am surprised it took so long to introduce them.

I am saying there are more parts, and more to go wrong. Especially when you are using parts that are known not to be reliable in the types of operations, weather conditions, and vibration levels a chainsaw has to deal with - especially when they have already shown to be less reliable than their predecessors, both here on these boards, and in practise here in the UK and Ireland. I am paid to use my saw - if it is unreliable, my pay is unreliable. To others, it may make no difference. Some here have dozens of saws, and it makes no matter how reliable they are - they are basically toys. I don't toy with my saws, and I expect them to be reliable. MT and AT still haven't shown themselves to be as reliable as a standard carb. I have personally seen and read about too many horror stories from professionals to jump on board yet. Eventually, they will come around, or we will run out of standard carbs. One or the other. Until then, I am not exactly missing out with my ported saws using standard carbs being all reliable and stuff.


----------



## KG441c (Nov 8, 2014)

Ive read plenty of reviews of logging crews being handed mtronics to try and none of them wanted to go backwards


----------



## KG441c (Nov 8, 2014)

Reliability is still up in the air I guess on mtronics but for a professional user mtronics in every other way is better


----------



## Franny K (Nov 8, 2014)

There must be extra windings in the fan/flywheel, maybe something to regulate the electricity produced.


----------



## tacomatrd98 (Nov 8, 2014)

KG441c said:


> Thinking about a cannon 18" supermini .370 picco bar and a Stihl ps picco square filed chain with a 7 or 8 pin sprocket?



I didnt read the entire thread yet but...I am gonna say you will kill the lightness and flick-ability that saw is known for with a cannon bar. I could be wrong but I would go with the OEM Stihl Rollo E 18 picco bar. Doesnt mean you shouldnt try it. If they werent 100 ducks I would have one just to try too.

I have not tried the 8t on the picco yet as there was noticeable torque drop going to the 7t 3/8. The 7T .325 did not seem much different as far as lugging power is concerned than the 6t spur it came with.

I have run on mine with combinations of 6t spur or 7t rims the following:
16" picco Stihl Rollomatic E bar - good setup, just to short to be practical
18" picco Stihl Rollomatic E bar - Highly recommended. My favorite setup. best overall performance / balance.
16" .063 .325 Stihl Rollomatic E bar - works well but again, too short for my liking
16" .050 .325 GB Arbor Pro solid RSN bar - cuts faster than the stihl bar for some reason, but makes the saw more nose heavy.
18" .325 .050 STIHL Rollomatic E bar - Would be my 2nd choice behind the 18" picco bar.

To me it works the best with the 18" stihl bars. The 16" 3005 mount bars seem too short for anybody not a troll. The .325 is a larger chain and works better for brush cutting and heavier work than the picco just for wear reasons but it seems slower in actual wood to me due to the slower chain speed than picco with the 7t rim. A 6t spur makes it a relative torque monster. Overall, I personally like the picco as I can swap bars with my 201T if I have to when I'm out cutting should I booger a chain on one of them and need to use the other for a given task. Plus it's one less type of filing equip to drag along. I take stuff for picco and full 3/8 and I'm set. Sorry for the long post.


----------



## KG441c (Nov 8, 2014)

tacomatrd98 said:


> I didnt read the entire thread yet but...I am gonna say you will kill the lightness and flick-ability that saw is known for with a cannon bar. I could be wrong but I would go with the OEM Stihl Rollo E 18 picco bar. Doesnt mean you shouldnt try it. If they werent 100 ducks I would have one just to try too.
> 
> I have not tried the 8t on the picco yet as there was noticeable torque drop going to the 7t 3/8. The 7T .325 did not seem much different as far as lugging power is concerned than the 6t spur it came with.
> I
> ...


I agree. I like the 6 spur , 3/8 ps chain with rakers at .025, and the stihl 18 bar for all around performance


----------



## KG441c (Nov 8, 2014)

tacomatrd98 said:


> I didnt read the entire thread yet but...I am gonna say you will kill the lightness and flick-ability that saw is known for with a cannon bar. I could be wrong but I would go with the OEM Stihl Rollo E 18 picco bar. Doesnt mean you shouldnt try it. If they werent 100 ducks I would have one just to try too.
> 
> I have not tried the 8t on the picco yet as there was noticeable torque drop going to the 7t 3/8. The 7T .325 did not seem much different as far as lugging power is concerned than the 6t spur it came with.
> 
> ...


Appreciate the post. Useful info


----------



## SAWMIKAZE (Nov 8, 2014)

I didnt notice any torque loss on the 3/8 7T picco at all with a 16" bar..seemed like the perfect blend of speed and torque


----------



## wyk (Nov 8, 2014)

KG441c said:


> Reliability is still up in the air I guess on mtronics but for a professional user mtronics in every other way is better



We'll see. I have a bud that wants to trade a 241CM for some port work here in Ireland... I WILL be abusing it as a work saw. I am the sole forester for an entire estate on the side of a mountain here in Waterford. I just spent 3 hours straight yesterday with a ported 044 cutting mature Rhododendron. While it was literally awesome how fast it went, that is a long time to wave around a 70cc saw without much rest besides refueling(4 tanks worth). The 241 will take over that duty after I port it. I am curious to see how long she lasts - I have maybe 100 acres of the stuff to go through before spring. And then there's all the ivy and vines...many larger than my arms


----------



## KG441c (Nov 8, 2014)

I dont see why it wouldnt hold up? Same saw as a standard carb with a different fuel management


----------



## SawTroll (Nov 8, 2014)

KG441c said:


> I dont see why it wouldnt hold up? Same saw as a standard carb with a different fuel management


AutoTune has been around for almost a decade now, and there are no indications that it is unreliable, or doesn't hold up. The few issues have been ordinary carb issues or operator/dealer errors - not issues with the AT/Mtronic itself.


----------



## wyk (Nov 8, 2014)

SawTroll said:


> AutoTune has been around for almost a decade now, and there are no indications that it is unreliable, or doesn't hold up. The few issues have been ordinary carb issues or operator/dealer errors - not issues with the AT/Mtronic itself.



A very bold statement, Saw Troll. Of course, you could have personally inspected any and all AT MT problems I have seen or read about here and on ArbTalk, and the ones I have seen in person, and been informed about by fellow foresters... I am sure every single one of them, including DOA and resets, were operator and carb problems...

This also begs the question, if it is a carb problem, is it not also an AT problem since one can not simply tune the carb... Without AT or MT, you could simply retune yourself...


----------



## tacomatrd98 (Nov 8, 2014)

SAWMIKAZE said:


> I didnt notice any torque loss on the 3/8 7T picco at all with a 16" bar..seemed like the perfect blend of speed and torque



IDK, It went from being able to dog in and yank on the rear handle to only being able to pull on it. Granted this saw is not meant to "buck" logs, but that was my findings. Same log, same chain, different sprockets. i'm talking 18" burried in dry walnut.


----------



## SAWMIKAZE (Nov 8, 2014)

tacomatrd98 said:


> IDK, It went from being able to dog in and yank on the rear handle to only being able to pull on it. Granted this saw is not meant to "buck" logs, but that was my findings. Same log, same chain, different sprockets. i'm talking 18" burried in dry walnut.



Ya i suppose thats different , i wanna try an 8T and see how it does with 16..my dealer said there was no 8T for picco but you know how that is..but with the 7 i didnt have any complaints cuttin green stuff in the 10 inch range


----------



## KG441c (Nov 8, 2014)

I have an 8t Ryan. What size bar are u using with the .325?


----------



## SAWMIKAZE (Nov 8, 2014)

KG441c said:


> I have an 8t Ryan. What size bar are u using with the .325?



Im not using .325 i went with picco


----------



## tacomatrd98 (Nov 8, 2014)

SAWMIKAZE said:


> Ya i suppose thats different , i wanna try an 8T and see how it does with 16..my dealer said there was no 8T for picco but you know how that is..but with the 7 i didnt have any complaints cuttin green stuff in the 10 inch range



Look up the p/n in either an 026 or 024 ipl...They should still list it. I have a few of them laying around. There are so many sprockets that dealers do not know about it is ridiculous. Just in small spline there is 6t spur, 7t .325, 7t .375, 7t .375 picco, 8t .325, 8t .375 picco.


----------



## tacomatrd98 (Nov 8, 2014)

be warned, 8t picco is even larger than regular 8t .375. as the LP drivers are longer. It makes some serious chain speed. I have an NOS 16" 3003 mount picco bar that I ran on a ported 260 for awhile with a loop of PS and an 8t picco rim...Can you say chain stretch lol cut like an angry beaver but was really hard on the chain.


----------



## SAWMIKAZE (Nov 8, 2014)

I wish i knew how to upload vids here , i have so many on my phone..i made a few cuts in bigger wood with the 3/8 7T picco set up and it did well with 16"


----------



## SAWMIKAZE (Nov 8, 2014)

tacomatrd98 said:


> be warned, 8t picco is even larger than regular 8t .375. as the LP drivers are longer. It makes some serious chain speed. I have an NOS 16" 3003 mount picco bar that I ran on a ported 260 for awhile with a loop of PS and an 8t picco rim...Can you say chain stretch lol cut like an angry beaver but was really hard on the chain.



I went to 56 drivers on the 16" bar as the standard 55 driver chain was too short with the rim set up , i wonder if the 56 driver chain works with 8T as well


----------



## KG441c (Nov 8, 2014)

I have a cannon c1 mount .370 picco 16" bar ordered that im gonna try the 8t picco sprocket with. The cannon supermini is a true 16" bar at 62dl though


----------



## AKDoug (Nov 8, 2014)

KG441c said:


> Board is around 150 and the solenoid im not sure? If you havent tried mtronics u should give it a whirl. My opinion is if a board or a solenoid made a saw unreliable and we used that philosophy with cars we would still be in the stone age with vehicles? Seems vehicles have worked out just fine with electronics and solenoids?


There is no board. The entire works is housed within the ignition coil. Just like the electronics that have been inside the ignition coil of Stihl saws for almost 40 years. Otherwise, the only other different thing is the solenoid on the carb. My 241 has been riding in the bed of my pickup for over a month. Rain, snow, temps from 40F to 0F. Not even a burp of trouble.

M-Tronic won't save you from straight gas, though. I've had two now come into the shop with the owner's cussing at the "new electronices" only to drain the tanks and find straight gas.


----------



## KG441c (Nov 8, 2014)

AKDoug said:


> There is no board. The entire works is housed within the ignition coil. Just like the electronics that have been inside the ignition coil of Stihl saws for almost 40 years. Otherwise, the only other different thing is the solenoid on the carb. My 241 has been riding in the bed of my pickup for over a month. Rain, snow, temps from 40F to 0F. Not even a burp of trouble.
> 
> M-Tronic won't save you from straight gas, though. I've had two now come into the shop with the owner's cussing at the "new electronices" only to drain the tanks and find straight gas.


Sounds right to me. I love mtronics


----------



## KG441c (Nov 8, 2014)

Ak is the coil 2 stage that retards the timing for easier starts?


----------



## SawTroll (Nov 8, 2014)

KG441c said:


> I have a cannon c1 mount .370 picco 16" bar ordered that im gonna try the 8t picco sprocket with. The cannon supermini is a true 16" bar at 62dl though



It will be interesting to see if it actually takes 62dl - I am sceptical to listed Cannon dl counts, as I have seen inconsistencies between different documents....


----------



## SawTroll (Nov 8, 2014)

SAWMIKAZE said:


> I went to 56 drivers on the 16" bar as the standard 55 driver chain was too short with the rim set up , i wonder if the 56 driver chain works with 8T as well



8-pin 3/8" sounds like a lot on that saw, despite it is Picco!


----------



## SAWMIKAZE (Nov 8, 2014)

SawTroll said:


> 8-pin 3/8" sounds like a lot on that saw, despite it is Picco!



It may be niko , id like to try it anyway to satisfy my own curiousity.


----------



## SawTroll (Nov 8, 2014)

tacomatrd98 said:


> be warned,* 8t picco is even larger than regular 8t .375*. as the LP drivers are longer. It makes some serious chain speed. I have an NOS 16" 3003 mount picco bar that I ran on a ported 260 for awhile with a loop of PS and an 8t picco rim...Can you say chain stretch lol cut like an angry beaver but was really hard on the chain.



The rim is larger, but that is to compensate for the lower chassis on the Picco chain, and make the diameter at the rivets the same.

Max chain speed will be the same as for regular 3/8x8.

The pitch is the same .366" or so for both 3/8" chain types.


----------



## SawTroll (Nov 8, 2014)

SAWMIKAZE said:


> It may be niko , id like to try it anyway to satisfy my own curiousity.



Nothing wrong with that - and you may have some fun with it!


----------



## AKDoug (Nov 10, 2014)

KG441c said:


> Ak is the coil 2 stage that retards the timing for easier starts?


That I don't know. I didn't pay that much attention in class.


----------



## treesmith (Nov 10, 2014)

KG441c said:


> Who all wants to go back to carb vehicles with manual shift?


That sounds great!


----------



## KG441c (Nov 10, 2014)

Go for it!! Lol! Ill stick with automatics and efi


----------



## MustangMike (Nov 10, 2014)

I still like a stick shift (in the Mustang, it gives me more control), but I don't miss the motor being hard to start in the winter, pumping the gas pedal, etc.

I'll take the EFI, variable cam timing, etc. I may not be able to work on it, but it has gone 110,000 miles w/o needing any work. (one idler pulley failed, that is it).


----------



## KG441c (Nov 10, 2014)

I agree on a sports car


----------



## wyk (Nov 12, 2014)

Got a man from Cork coming up to Waterford tomorrow. He has a 372xp that needs porting. He also has a 241CM with him in trade for the work. It has a few fins broken off the top of the cylinder. So I am curious to see how long it will last. I'll do an MM, then a port job(without lathe work or squish mods). She will be spending the next few months brashing Rhododendron, and doing small jobs on a nearly daily basis.


----------



## KG441c (Nov 12, 2014)

I would consider the lathe work the most important part? The compression bump? I think this little saw will last alot longer than u think especially mixed with good oil @32to1


----------



## KenJax Tree (Nov 12, 2014)

What oil are you using now Keith? Did you settle on one?


----------



## KG441c (Nov 12, 2014)

Sunoco 110/ non ethanol 87 mixed 1/2 and 1/2 with Motul 800t


----------



## wyk (Nov 12, 2014)

KG441c said:


> I would consider the lathe work the most important part? The compression bump? I think this little saw will last alot longer than u think especially mixed with good oil @32to1



Nah, she doesn't need to be too high strung. A simple port job and MM should wake her up enough so I am not cursing the EPA. Not sure I want any more compression on a saw with broken fins, anyways. Simple porting and MM should help her run cooler. I'll run her a bit with just an MM and see how I like it. If I need more grunt, she'll be ported. My current small job saw is the estate's MS181. That thing has me greatly missing my modded 330EVL! So, basically, this saw doesn't have to live up to much, power-wise. It just has to last. And I intend to torture test it since it is only costing me a port job and some beer. She'll be run at 32:1. All my saws are.


----------



## KG441c (Nov 12, 2014)

Mine is just muffler modded and I can bury the 18" bar with ps chain no problem


----------



## SAWMIKAZE (Nov 12, 2014)

I dont think a 241 needs a lot to run well , just with the muffler opened up i am more than happy with mine , the throttle response is amazing


----------



## KenJax Tree (Nov 12, 2014)

KG441c said:


> Sunoco 110/ non ethanol 87 mixed 1/2 and 1/2 with Motul 800t


Still using 91 E free with Lucas semi-synthetic 32:1....yeah boring i know but it works


----------



## wyk (Nov 13, 2014)

First day on the job - firewood duty:







Loads of grunt, great fuel economy, impressed so far. Gonna go and get a larger B&C.


----------



## KG441c (Nov 13, 2014)

I have the 18" bar with the ps chain but cant help but think the16 or 18" bar .325 will probably stay sharp longer with some stihl semi chisel rm chain


----------



## KenJax Tree (Nov 13, 2014)

KG441c said:


> I have the 18" bar with the ps chain but cant help but think the16 or 18" bar .325 will probably stay sharp longer with some stihl semi chisel rm chain


If you want semi chisel picco get some Stihl PM


----------



## KG441c (Nov 13, 2014)

Do they make it in semi chisel yellow link or is it all green?


----------



## LowVolt (Nov 13, 2014)

63pm3?


----------



## KG441c (Nov 13, 2014)

Pm3 is green link safety. Wonder if 63pm yellow can be found? Lowvolt I think thats what I sent u was 63pm3?


----------



## LowVolt (Nov 13, 2014)

I believe it was 63ps3 but could be wrong.


----------



## wyk (Nov 13, 2014)

We have a 181 with picco, and now I've got the 241 with 325. I would never voluntarily go with picco simply for how much longer 325 lasts between sharpening, especially when the wood gets dirty like seasoned firewood in a barn.


----------



## KG441c (Nov 13, 2014)

LowVolt said:


> I believe it was 63ps3 but could be wrong.


Ps3 I guess is the green link and ps is yellow link. Im pretty sure the pm or pm3 would stay sharper longer


----------



## KG441c (Nov 13, 2014)

reindeer said:


> We have a 181 with picco, and now I've got the 241 with 325. I would never voluntarily go with picco simply for how much longer 325 lasts between sharpening, especially when the wood gets dirty like seasoned firewood in a barn.


Did the 241 surprise u reindeer?


----------



## wyk (Nov 13, 2014)

KG441c said:


> Did the 241 surprise u reindeer?



It's sort of odd. It has some real grunt for larger wood, but it doesn't rev like you would think a 42cc saw would. I am thinking a muff mod will wake it up more and give better throttle response.
I am certainly surprised at the torque deep down, though. Feels more like a 50cc saw normally would when it's buried.


----------



## KG441c (Nov 13, 2014)

Ya thats the way it felt to me also. The muffler mod will no doubt wake it up. Recalibrate after mm


----------



## KG441c (Nov 13, 2014)

Pretty sure ive settled on a 241c 40cc class saw, and a 60cc class 362c, and a 461r 70cc class. Im thinkin id like a 2nd big saw with a sharp chain on standby and thinkin ported 046 or 044. Got another lil load today with the 461


----------



## wyk (Nov 13, 2014)

Uh... how exactly do you recalibrate these dodads?


----------



## KG441c (Nov 13, 2014)

Crank on choke and leave on choke idling for 90sec. Move control all the way to off. Recrank and let idle in the run pisition for 90sec and move control to off. Recrank and make 5 fully loaded cuts. Thats it


----------



## KenJax Tree (Nov 13, 2014)

KG441c said:


> Do they make it in semi chisel yellow link or is it all green?


Yellow link 63PM


----------



## KG441c (Nov 13, 2014)

Chris does it stay sharp longer than the ps?


----------



## KenJax Tree (Nov 13, 2014)

Oh yeah like RM compared to RS in the same conditions.


----------



## KG441c (Nov 13, 2014)

Ordered a loop of rm for my 461 and a loop of pm for the 241


----------



## KenJax Tree (Nov 13, 2014)

It cuts plenty fast enough


----------



## KG441c (Nov 13, 2014)

Ya fast is one thing when play cutting but stopping to sharpen instead of getting work done sucks!!!


----------



## KG441c (Nov 13, 2014)

Semi skip square chisel stays sharper for me than rs does


----------



## KenJax Tree (Nov 13, 2014)

KG441c said:


> Ya fast is one thing when play cutting but stopping to sharpen instead of getting work done sucks!!!


That why 90% of the time i just use SC i never know what I'm gonna be cutting from day to day


----------



## wyk (Nov 17, 2014)

I did the MM and reset the 241. It's certainly more peppy. She winds out a bit more, too. But I think porting is in the near future.

The original port:





The after:




Also added two more louvred ports to the other side of the muffler. Not too loud, though. I didn't do anything to the interior of the muffler.

This chain has seen better days, but it's all I had for the vid. Here she is in surprisingly hard well-seasoned Larch(You can see the other ports if ya look closely, and at one point during the first cut you can see light through the muffler):

www.youtube.com/watch?v=GOrynYinTIo

That's maybe 10 or so cuts after the reset.


----------



## KG441c (Nov 17, 2014)

Shouldnt u have went toward the back wall with the factory opening instead of foward? The flow is gonna hit brake handle?


----------



## BBP (Nov 17, 2014)

KG441c said:


> Crank on choke and leave on choke idling for 90sec. Move control all the way to off. Recrank and let idle in the run pisition for 90sec and move control to off. Recrank and make 5 fully loaded cuts. Thats it


What exactly does this do? According to another thread, the Mtronic continually recalibrates while running. Does this procedure do something different?


----------



## KG441c (Nov 17, 2014)

Not sure but the manual calls for it and Stihl tech told me the same thing but Id be willing to bet if u ran it enough it would recalibrate anyway


----------



## KG441c (Nov 17, 2014)

Reindeer what kinda wood is that? My 241 with just the mm and picco ps chain seems to be a good bit quicker than the video? Is that .325 chain?


----------



## blsnelling (Nov 17, 2014)

KG441c said:


> Shouldnt u have went toward the back wall with the factory opening instead of foward? The flow is gonna hit brake handle?


Exactly.


----------



## LowVolt (Nov 17, 2014)

KG441c said:


> Not sure but the manual calls for it and Stihl tech told me the same thing but Id be willing to bet if u ran it enough it would recalibrate anyway


What page in the manual is that?


----------



## KG441c (Nov 17, 2014)

Not sure without being home but its not the owners manual but the service shop manual


----------



## KG441c (Nov 17, 2014)

Pg 70 of 241c shop manual


----------



## KG441c (Nov 17, 2014)

The older mtronics manuals of 441c adds 5 full cuts to the calibration and stihl tech also told me to add the 90sec idle in run position


----------



## blsnelling (Nov 17, 2014)

Never heard of non-Start position idle or cuts being part of the re-calibration procedure. I'd stick with the manual, although the added steps shouldn't hurt anything.


----------



## KG441c (Nov 17, 2014)

The 5 full cuts r in the older mtronics manuals but the run position is what john and casey told me awhile back but seems they have deleted a few steps now. Brad have u ever noticed the calibration making a difference?


----------



## blsnelling (Nov 17, 2014)

I can't say that I have or haven't. I simply do it as a routine after porting a saw.


----------



## wyk (Nov 17, 2014)

blsnelling said:


> Exactly.



Nah, it clears fine. Theres a lot of room in there.


----------



## wyk (Nov 17, 2014)

KG441c said:


> Reindeer what kinda wood is that? My 241 with just the mm and picco ps chain seems to be a good bit quicker than the video? Is that .325 chain?



325, but its missing a few teeth and old chain. I'll have new chain on it soon enough. The wood is seasoned larch, but it's very hard for some reason. My guess is the log may have seen some heat and some of the sap got hard. In any case, it is quite a bit mroe peppy and more torque than she had before. You can tell simply at idle that she's already tuned herself more aggressively. That's maybe the 10th cut since I did the mod.


----------



## wyk (Nov 17, 2014)

KG441c said:


> Shouldnt u have went toward the back wall with the factory opening instead of foward? The flow is gonna hit brake handle?



If you hold your 241, you'll see that very little of the exhaust from the opening I made is going to hit the brake if any. It is larger than factory, but the factory port was so small, it really doesn't make anywhere near the difference the two HUGE ports I put on the other side of the muffler will. In other words, it's not coming out of that side fast, or hard enough to cause any problems since most of the exhaust is coming out the other side of the muffler(I would guess the other two ports together are about 5X the size). And, if you look at the first cut, you'll notice you can see light through the muffler port. In other words, most of the exhaust is going into the air, and not into the handle.


----------



## wyk (Nov 17, 2014)

KG441c said:


> The 5 full cuts r in the older mtronics manuals but the run position is what john and casey told me awhile back but seems they have deleted a few steps now. Brad have u ever noticed the calibration making a difference?



She got much stronger after the first few cuts I did the way you explained to me. The first cut - she was a dog, and she seemed to be confused about where she wanted to idle at. After the 3rd cut, she started to come to life. I actually think that log may have been a bit hard to calibrate it correctly. I'll have something softer like beech tomorrow maybe. In any case, you can tell in the vid simply by the idle that she is already more aggressive. It is idling higher and the throttle response is far better.


----------



## wyk (Nov 17, 2014)

reindeer said:


> She got much stronger after the first few cuts I did the way you explained to me. The first cut - she was a dog, and she seemed to be confused about where she wanted to idle at. After the 3rd cut, she started to come to life. I actually think that log may have been a bit hard to calibrate it correctly. I'll have something softer like beech tomorrow maybe. In any case, you can tell in the vid simply by the idle that she is already more aggressive. It is idling higher and the throttle response is far better.



ETA - BTW, the reason I didn't use another log was I injured my knee in work Friday. 6 stitches. It was all I could do to go out and MM a saw and try it out at the wood pile(which is about 200 yards away from the farm house). I just wasn't able to find another log and put it up on that saw horse. In any case, I think she's gonna be ported soon here.


----------



## SawTroll (Nov 17, 2014)

reindeer said:


> It's nearly impossible to find an automatic car in Europe that isn't a Mercedes or a rental car. *I haven't driven an automatic in 3 years*.
> 
> ......



I actually *never* have, despite they aren't that uncommon here!


----------



## SawTroll (Nov 17, 2014)

KG441c said:


> Pm3 is green link safety. Wonder if 63pm yellow can be found? Lowvolt I think thats what I sent u was 63pm3?



As far as I know it is, but they don't list it as an option everywhere?


----------



## wyk (Nov 17, 2014)

KG441c said:


> The 5 full cuts r in the older mtronics manuals but the run position is what john and casey told me awhile back but seems they have deleted a few steps now. Brad have u ever noticed the calibration making a difference?



So, is there a consensus on how to recalibrate?


----------



## Time's Standing Stihl (Nov 17, 2014)

Gots me a new toy today! Smiles from ear to ear! Went with a 14" picco as I have two other small saws that have the same setup. Next up will be a muffler mod for it


----------



## KG441c (Nov 17, 2014)

reindeer said:


> So, is there a consensus on how to recalibrate?


U will be fine to crank on start and let idle 90sec and cut off then go make 5 full cuts. Only makes sense it would calibrate idle and top end


----------



## AKDoug (Nov 18, 2014)

I doubled the size of the stock muffler outlet. Really nothing to write home about. Times through the log were the same as stock. I might try a couple louvers on the other side, or open the stock opening up some more, but I doubt it.


----------



## KG441c (Nov 18, 2014)

First gills I ever tried. Dont look too good but work very well


----------



## wyk (Nov 18, 2014)

Wow. You didn't **** around with the stock outlet.  And with that pic, you can see how the brake handle seems as though it was made to loop around the exhaust there and avoid it.

Porting a 372XT today. If I am feeling frisky, I'll throw the 241 into the mix.


----------



## KG441c (Nov 18, 2014)

I took everything behind the factory opening. Throaty for a 40cc


----------



## wyk (Nov 18, 2014)

OK, took the chain and raped it. It's nearly a race chain now. Here's the chips(not bad for 325, uh?) - and the v id to follow(this time in seasoned Sycamore. Yeah, it's not poplar, but it isn't that crazy stuff I was rubbing on yesterday).







And here's the vid:


----------



## KG441c (Nov 18, 2014)

Cut pretty good. You should try Stihl pm semi chisel picco its pretty fast and stays sharp.


----------



## KenJax Tree (Nov 18, 2014)

Did you get your PM chain Keith?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## wyk (Nov 18, 2014)

KG441c said:


> Cut pretty good. You should try Stihl pm semi chisel picco its pretty fast and stays sharp.



I dunno. I like using the same file to sharpen both my saws(13/64), and the fact 325 lasts forever compared to VXl etc.
I think I am gonna port it very mildly- like just the intake and the exhaust. Open up the original muffler port like you did, and I should be happy. Well, you can actually open the exhaust port on the cylinder quite a bit, it's rather restrictive.
Then she'll get a 16" bar(for reals, not a Stihl 16" bar that is 14.5" like the one she's wearing now).


----------



## KG441c (Nov 18, 2014)

KenJax Tree said:


> Did you get your PM chain Keith?
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


yes and very satisfied with the way it cuts


----------



## KG441c (Nov 18, 2014)

Id cut the squish and bump that compression if I was gonna port it. Imo that would be the only beneficial mod


----------



## KenJax Tree (Nov 18, 2014)

KG441c said:


> yes and very satisfied with the way it cuts


Glad you like it....RM is the same way thats why i use semi chisel 90% of the time and if it filed right its pretty fast. Oregon VXL is nice too but i don't like their other semi chisel chain just the VXL 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## wyk (Nov 18, 2014)

KG441c said:


> Id cut the squish and bump that compression if I was gonna port it. Imo that would be the only beneficial mod



I'm not just looking for more power, I want it to respond a bit better and be more zippy for limbing, and to pull a touch more bar for reach(not for bigger cuts). As she stands, she's still a bit of a pig compared to my previous 40-50cc saws. I need her for a LOT of Rhododendron clearing, and small trees. More intake and exhaust ought to get me there. I'm told the transfers are fine where they are.


----------



## KG441c (Nov 19, 2014)

What other kind of 40 or 50 cc did u have that was stronger?


----------



## wyk (Nov 19, 2014)

KG441c said:


> What other kind of 40 or 50 cc did u have that was stronger?



A ported 42 special, ported 444se, ported Echo 520, etc etc... the 444SE ran 3/8 chain on a 16" AKA 18"(if yer Stihl) bar.



And that's set rich for break in... leaned out for cookie cutting, it gets angry.


----------



## KG441c (Nov 19, 2014)

Looks strong . No reason that 241 especially ported, sholudnt run stronger with the right chain. Chains make a HUGE difference. Do u square file any??


----------



## SAWMIKAZE (Nov 19, 2014)

I dont know if a 241 would run with that triple 4 keith..chains bridge gaps but not canyons


----------



## KG441c (Nov 19, 2014)

That 444 looked to have excellent torque in the cut but not too fast but I know that chain and type of wood has alot to do with speed too


----------



## KG441c (Nov 19, 2014)

Thats impressive for a small saw Reindeer!! Im starting to appreciate saws with torque for no bog instead of flat out speed. A steady cut self feeding saw is what I like now days


----------



## SAWMIKAZE (Nov 19, 2014)

Naturally , as he said it was still a little rich , i had a 444 timberwolf ported for about 6 months..it was stronger than a ported 241..no questions


----------



## SAWMIKAZE (Nov 19, 2014)

That said id still take a 241 , old saws are cool dont get me wrong and im not really a big technology guy but when it comes to saws its a great thing in my eyes , i like the 044 , 064 , 066 etc but they are dinosaurs with shitty filtration and a/v etc etc , id take the 241 for its filtration set up alone !


----------



## KG441c (Nov 19, 2014)

So a 444 is an echo?


----------



## SAWMIKAZE (Nov 19, 2014)

Its a junky old husky


----------



## KG441c (Nov 19, 2014)

Ya Im with u on the old saws! My ported 026 I just sold would blow my 241 away but for the size wood I cut with the 241 there is more to appreciate with the 241. With the rakers lowered on Pm picco the 241 cuts pretty aggressively and stays sharp


----------



## KG441c (Nov 19, 2014)

I dont know Mike im rebuilding a husky 262xp right now and I have to admit Im impressed with the build quality


----------



## SAWMIKAZE (Nov 19, 2014)

I didnt buy a 241 with the intention of bucking logs so i guess its all in what you expect it to do , i bought it to limb , cut saplings and **** like that and i think its awesome for those things but the price is absurd..awesome saw though..if a 543 had AT i probably would have bought it instead.


----------



## SAWMIKAZE (Nov 19, 2014)

KG441c said:


> I dont know Mike im rebuilding a husky 262xp right now and I have to admit Im impressed with the build quality




I was jokin about huskys bein junk..


----------



## wyk (Nov 19, 2014)

And that puppy is pushing out 225psi. Down from 240 where it was detonating on 94 octane 

Anywho, this is gonna be a difficult post for me to write. I went ahead and literally raped the factory port like you did, and even whirly gigged a little bit of the baffle away.
I then reset it as per yer instructions. And POW(Is there a "POW" image thingy? Anyways...) this thing came way alive. Revs out fast and hard and high now. And she cuts with even more torque. Loud as hell for a 43cc saw, tho. Ah well. So, I won't be bothering to port it(especially with the missing fins...  )


----------



## KG441c (Nov 19, 2014)

Wow!! Nice! Ya I whirled my inner baffle also ! Lol! I figure with more cutting time and the mtronics learning curve it will do alil better even


----------



## SAWMIKAZE (Nov 19, 2014)

Keith is there an advantage to recalibrate mine..the muffler was modded before i even fueled it so im assuming it broke in to that configuration ?


----------



## KG441c (Nov 19, 2014)

How did u get the 444 to blow 240psi?? Wow!! Id like to hear how much come out of the dome? Base cut? Base gasket or not?


----------



## KG441c (Nov 19, 2014)

Not sure Ryan but it surely couldnt hurt but it probably has learned its curve if u cut with it enough? Kinda like retuning a standard carb after u muffler mod


----------



## SAWMIKAZE (Nov 19, 2014)

KG441c said:


> Not sure Ryan but it surely couldnt hurt but it probably has learned its curve if u cut with it enough? Kinda like retuning a standard carb after u muffler mod



I ran it 3 or 4 tanks straight the first time i used it cuttin around 10 to 12" wood..its was scootin pretty good


----------



## KG441c (Nov 19, 2014)

SAWMIKAZE said:


> I ran it 3 or 4 tanks straight the first time i used it cuttin around 10 to 12" wood..its was scootin pretty good


I always calibrate my mtronics saws if I change anything major. Guess it clears the memory and starts over??


----------



## wyk (Nov 19, 2014)

KG441c said:


> How did u get the 444 to blow 240psi?? Wow!! Id like to hear how much come out of the dome? Base cut? Base gasket or not?



Used a piston from a 346xpOE. NMurph was kind enough to send me one free of charge as he was practicing at the time, and I was rather poor working part time in forestry. It had way too much meat on top as it arrived. It was 240 PSI AFTER I took a dremel and some fine sand paper to it. I then reshaped the piston to fit the combustion chamber by hand(I used to make knives as a hobby, so working with metal is a good time). That 444SE won first place at the PNW GTG last June  When that thing is leaned out, it is a weapon, even with 3/8 chain.


----------



## blsnelling (Nov 19, 2014)

Just port that thing already 

Stihl MS241C Ported:


----------



## SAWMIKAZE (Nov 19, 2014)

Mine has had no changes in fuel or anything so i guess its fine , it broke in around the muffler mod and runs awesome.


----------



## maulhead (Nov 20, 2014)

So is this now the official what did you do with your 241c OR to your 241c today,,, thread??


----------



## KG441c (Nov 20, 2014)

Either one!! Lol! Most good threads add variety


----------



## LowVolt (Nov 20, 2014)

Finally got her 100%


----------



## KG441c (Nov 20, 2014)

Nice!!!


----------



## LowVolt (Nov 20, 2014)

Now we need to get it dirty.

BTW you did send me a 63RS3 chain with that bar.


----------



## KG441c (Nov 20, 2014)

63ps3. The fast chain with the safety rake


----------



## KenJax Tree (Nov 20, 2014)

I wouldn't even call it a safety chain, its shorter than the raker is its not like the shark fin junk.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## KG441c (Nov 20, 2014)

Lowvolt Ive cut with 63ps3, 63ps, 63pm , but havent cut with 63pm3. So far all around I like the 63pm the best and it stays sharper longer and cuts very well with the right sharping


----------



## KenJax Tree (Nov 20, 2014)

I'm glad you like that chain Keith


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## maulhead (Nov 20, 2014)

OK, so I put my 7t rim kit on my 241 today and went and did a little cutting. This is the 1st mod I've done to the saw, it is still stock otherwise, not even a muffler mod.

Seems to have lost some of its torque, but gained some speed. I cant lean on it as hard as I did with the 6t spur.

It also lost another 1/2" in bar length, So now it has a 14" bar errr, had to almost bottom out the chain adjuster with the rim kit, to fit the 55DL chain back on it. Guess SAWMIKAZE was right when he told me I would have to add a link to the chain with the rim kit. Now I have to go buy a few new 56DL chains.

Short vid with the 7t rim kit, and 63pm chain, wood is dry elm,


----------



## KG441c (Nov 20, 2014)

KenJax Tree said:


> I'm glad you like that chain Keith
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Ya latley ive changed my way of thinking on saws other than speed!! I like saws setup for torque and chain that cuts and self feeds and stays sharp


----------



## KenJax Tree (Nov 20, 2014)

Square and chisel are fun to use but for everyday work chain give me semi chisel.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## SAWMIKAZE (Nov 20, 2014)

Told ya ..get the muffler open and you will get the torque back you lost and keep the chain speed up..the throttle response gets 200T-ish after the muffler is breathin


----------



## SAWMIKAZE (Nov 20, 2014)

KG441c said:


> Ya latley ive changed my way of thinking on saws other than speed!! I like saws setup for torque and chain that cuts and self feeds and stays sharp



Att-a boy keith !


----------



## MustangMike (Nov 20, 2014)

My brother has a 200, not a T, but loud as H*** and he loves it . (Part of his 2 saw set w/his 460).


----------



## KenJax Tree (Nov 20, 2014)

SAWMIKAZE said:


> Att-a boy keith !


Yeah leave the speed for the cookie cutters


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## maulhead (Nov 20, 2014)

LowVolt said:


> Finally got her 100%
> 
> View attachment 380952
> View attachment 380953
> ...



Looks real nice Rory, but it only looks about 90% to me,,,, as I dont see a mastermind sticker on its hood


----------



## KG441c (Nov 20, 2014)

Im at work now but fixin to get off in a minute and got alil present waiting when I get home. A cannon .370 supermini 64dl bar with a loop of ps that came in the mail today. Will post up pics tomorrow


----------



## SAWMIKAZE (Nov 20, 2014)

KenJax Tree said:


> Square and chisel are fun to use but for everyday work chain give me semi chisel.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk




Im a huge RM fan..all those lots we cleared this summer made me a bigger fan of semi-chizz than i already was !..and after i file em on a good day you might mistake one for a full-chizzler anyway


----------



## KenJax Tree (Nov 20, 2014)

SAWMIKAZE said:


> Im a huge RM fan..all those lots we cleared this summer made me a bigger fan of semi-chizz than i already was !..and after i file em on a good day you might mistake one for a full-chizzler anyway


I've been saying this for years lol


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## KG441c (Nov 21, 2014)

What size files do yall like for pm picco and 3/8 rm? What angles do yall use?


----------



## KenJax Tree (Nov 21, 2014)

5/32 on picco and 7/32 on 3/8 RM...Stihl recommends 13/64 which is an oddball size but i just use the 7/32 my Oregon chains use. Some guys use 7/32 then use the 13/64 after the tooth is smaller.

Just a heads up the 7/32 is gonna be tight at first because Stihl chain sits a little lower in the front of the tooth than others but once you run the file through a few times it loosens up.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## wyk (Nov 21, 2014)

KG441c said:


> Looks strong . No reason that 241 especially ported, sholudnt run stronger with the right chain. Chains make a HUGE difference. Do u square file any??



Not in nearly 6 years. The chain and the files are expensive to get here.  The funny thing is MDaveLee showed me how to hand file square, and ever since I now file my full chisel the same way when they need a lot of metal removed - from the outside in. Makes folks who see me scratch their heads.

OK, I got to go to the doctor today to have a look at my leg. When I come back, more vids.


----------



## wyk (Nov 21, 2014)

I just noticed the European model doesn't even have a provision for a spark arrestor. That's sort of interesting.



reindeer said:


>


----------



## blsnelling (Nov 21, 2014)

Definitely not 100% yet  This is 100%!

Stihl MS241C Ported:


----------



## KG441c (Nov 21, 2014)

Okay here is the Cannon Supermini on the 241. 61dl ps chain with a 7t rim sprocket. The Cannon 16" bar is the exact same length as Stihls 18"!





.


----------



## wyk (Nov 21, 2014)

What mount is that super mini?


----------



## KG441c (Nov 21, 2014)

reindeer said:


> What mount is that super mini?


3005 picco .370 lp


----------



## KG441c (Nov 21, 2014)

Not very much weight savings for a solid bar with replaceable nose vs laminated non replaceable? The cannon balances perfect on the 241 and it doesnt take away from it being agile in the handling at all to me


----------



## blsnelling (Nov 21, 2014)

Less than an ounce different. Nice.


----------



## SawTroll (Nov 21, 2014)

reindeer said:


> I just noticed the European model doesn't even have a provision for a spark arrestor. That's sort of interesting.




Nothing new with that - it is a very common differense.


----------



## SAWMIKAZE (Nov 21, 2014)

Are you buying your PS chain locally keith ?


----------



## SawTroll (Nov 21, 2014)

KG441c said:


> Okay here is the Cannon Supermini on the 241. 61dl ps chain with a 7t rim sprocket. The Cannon 16" bar is the exact same length as Stihls 18"!
> .



Not a surprice with the fact that they are the same length - the Cannon specs said 62 dl (same as the Stihl 18" one) didn't they?


----------



## SawTroll (Nov 21, 2014)

KG441c said:


> 3005 picco .370 lp


Cannon C1, which is a combo small Husky (K095)/small Stihl (3005).

An oddity is that Baileys claim it fits saws with K095 and K041 mounts, but not Stihl 3005 - so I'm not sure if it has the opening making it suitable for K041 mounts as well (Cannon says nothing about that, that I have seen)....


----------



## KG441c (Nov 21, 2014)

SAWMIKAZE said:


> Are you buying your PS chain locally keith ?


Ps came from MasterMech and pm came from Ebay


----------



## KG441c (Nov 21, 2014)

SawTroll said:


> Not a surprice with the fact that they are the same length - the Cannon specs said 62 dl (same as the Stihl 18" one) didn't they?


Actually Cannon lists this c1-16-50 as a 64dl. It has the .370 lp sprocket nose


----------



## SAWMIKAZE (Nov 21, 2014)

KG441c said:


> Ps came from MasterMech and pm came from Ebay



I can buy the pm locally but not the ps..my dealer said he cant even order loops of ps at 56 drivers only 55


----------



## KG441c (Nov 21, 2014)

Theres no doubt thats a 61dl on the bar in picture as I counted them this morning before posting but Cannon list the bar as a 64dl?


----------



## KG441c (Nov 21, 2014)

I can get pm3 locally but not pm and no ps locally period


----------



## KG441c (Nov 21, 2014)

SAWMIKAZE said:


> I can buy the pm locally but not the ps..my dealer said he cant even order loops of ps at 56 drivers only 55


I ordered a chain break and spinner and dont worry to much about a loop dl. If I find a good deal on something longer I just buy and cut to fit. The chain break/spinner is some of the best money Ive spent


----------



## KenJax Tree (Nov 21, 2014)

SAWMIKAZE said:


> I can buy the pm locally but not the ps..my dealer said he cant even order loops of ps at 56 drivers only 55


Same BS i heard


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## SawTroll (Nov 21, 2014)

KG441c said:


> Actually Cannon lists this c1-16-50 as a 64dl. It has the .370 lp sprocket nose



Well, confirms my suspicions regarding their listed dl counts then, and makes it a bit hard to pull the trigger on one of them - it's a pity it is that way, as the supermini otherwise is tempting for smaller saws!


----------



## wyk (Nov 21, 2014)

SawTroll said:


> Cannon C1, which is a combo small Husky (K095)/small Stihl (3005).
> 
> An oddity is that Baileys claim it fits saws with K095 and K041 mounts, but not Stihl 3005 - so I'm not sure if it has the opening making it suitable for K041 mounts as well (Cannon says nothing about that, that I have seen)....



Yeah - I was thinking it looked like a 095 mount.


----------



## KG441c (Nov 21, 2014)

SawTroll said:


> Well, confirms my suspicions regarding their listed dl counts then, and makes it a bit hard to pull the trigger on one of them - it's a pity it is that way, as the supermini otherwise is tempting for smaller saws!


Sawtroll this is my guess. In the picture the bar list 614. My guess would be 61dl for 3005 and and 64dl for KO95 as designation for universal? In any sense it fits very well and quality wise imo untouchable


----------



## wyk (Nov 21, 2014)

OK, so got off my crippled butt and got some photos today:











Every cut on that Chestnut is by that 241. Vid to follow...


----------



## SawTroll (Nov 21, 2014)

SAWMIKAZE said:


> I can buy the pm locally but not the ps..my dealer said he cant even order loops of ps at 56 drivers only 55



Your dealer and or his distributer either are uninformed idiots, or are just being lazy!


----------



## maulhead (Nov 21, 2014)

The dealer I bought the new 241 at, ordered in a bulk roll of PS the week after I bought the saw. So he can make me PS in any drive count. He also has pre made loops of PM on the shelf in either 55DL or 56Dl.

I'm thinking about getting a Sugihara 16" bar for my 241??


----------



## SawTroll (Nov 21, 2014)

KG441c said:


> Sawtroll this is my guess. In the picture the bar list 614. My guess would be 61dl for 3005 and and 64dl for KO95 as designation for universal? In any sense it fits very well and quality wise imo untouchable


Interesting theory - but I have my doubts....

Could you check if there are openings between the front adjuster holes and the bottom of the bar slots? If so, the bar covers the K041 mount as well.


----------



## KG441c (Nov 21, 2014)

SawTroll said:


> Interesting theory - but I have my doubts....
> 
> Could you check if there are openings between the front adjuster holes and the bottom of the bar slots? If so, the bar covers the K041 mount as well.


Zoom in on the pic I posted Sawtroll I see 2 sets of adjuster holes and 2 sets of oilers. Its no doubt a universal.


----------



## SAWMIKAZE (Nov 21, 2014)

I can get PM obviously in 56 but not PS according to him..he doesnt even stock PS.


----------



## SawTroll (Nov 21, 2014)

KG441c said:


> Zoom in on the pic I posted Sawtroll I see 2 sets of adjuster holes and 2 sets of oilers. Its no doubt a universal.



Yes, but the question of K041 is open until you look for those holes(openings) I mentioned.....

The doubt I expressed was about the 64dl on a Husky mount saw.


----------



## blsnelling (Nov 21, 2014)

Evidently, PS isn't available around these parts either. I've also tried to order it.


----------



## SAWMIKAZE (Nov 21, 2014)

KG441c said:


> Lowvolt Ive cut with 63ps3, 63ps, 63pm , but havent cut with 63pm3. So far all around I like the 63pm the best and it stays sharper longer and cuts very well with the right sharping



What does the " 3 " mean as far as chain ID goes keith ?


----------



## KG441c (Nov 21, 2014)

SAWMIKAZE said:


> What does the " 3 " mean as far as chain ID goes keith ?


Safety green link designation


----------



## wyk (Nov 21, 2014)

The difficult part about work like this for a 43cc saw is the oiler. It can barely keep up.



In any case, she's got more grunt and speed than ever. And she gets stronger all the time. This is just the second tank since she was reset last. She is thirstier now, too.


----------



## MustangMike (Nov 21, 2014)

Not the size saw I would normally choose for that task, but she does sound very healthy!


----------



## SAWMIKAZE (Nov 21, 2014)

I think it was more to demonstrate the saws capability mike.


----------



## SAWMIKAZE (Nov 21, 2014)

SAWMIKAZE said:


> What does the " 3 " mean as far as chain ID goes keith ?



Gotcha..i just looked at some of my saw packs and i was buyin 63pm.


----------



## wyk (Nov 21, 2014)

SAWMIKAZE said:


> I think it was more to demonstrate the saws capability mike.



ANd to show off our wood pile and pto wood splitter, of course.


----------



## wyk (Nov 21, 2014)

And that's just the pile for seasoning the wood. The seasoned wood is in the pile I had in a previous video. Bout 6'X6'X100', So uh...er... carry the one..divide by zero... er... nearly 28 cords of wood ready for sale.

Speaking of which - I know the French and I have a language gap, but... Yesterday while I was down the wood shed making big wood into tiny wood, I asked the Frenchies to go and grab the beech I cut off in this video() and bring it to me at the wood shed for processing to season. After lunch I found my leg and hips were still not able for any real work, and I took the rest of the day off. I return the next day expecting to see nearly 2 cords of beech ready for processing. What do I find? Nothing. Were the French lazy? Nah. What they had done is put all the freshly cut beech, which was all very solid, healthy wood, into the garbage pit we have for old leaves, branches, rotten or junk wood etc. I mean, I understand the language gap and all. But how much common sense do you have to lack to spend half a day, moving half a ton of wood with a tractor into a pit before you maybe think the wood you are chunking away may be worth something for firewood on an estate that freaking SELLS that ****?


----------



## MustangMike (Nov 21, 2014)

I figured that, was just sayin ... would be nice to see it rippin through some limbs!


----------



## Franny K (Nov 21, 2014)

blsnelling said:


> Evidently, PS isn't available around these parts either. I've also tried to order it.


I have ordered ps3 in Marietta Ohio. And Tolland Ct. Never tried to get straight ps.
I found a box 3616 005 0056 (56 dl loop)

You can get the ps off ebay as you most likely know.


----------



## rburg (Nov 21, 2014)

The 3 in 63pm should indicate 50 gauge chain. The 3 at the end of the ps3 would indicate the green chain.


----------



## SAWMIKAZE (Nov 21, 2014)

rburg said:


> The 3 in 63pm should indicate 50 gauge chain. The 3 at the end of the ps3 would indicate the green chain.



Ahhhhhh interesting.


----------



## KG441c (Nov 21, 2014)

61-.043 3/8 picco micro
63-.050 3/8 picco
26-.325 .063
46-.404
33-3/8 .050
36- 3/8 .063


----------



## KenJax Tree (Nov 21, 2014)

KG441c said:


> 61-.043 picco micro
> 63-.050 picco
> 26-.325 .063
> 46-.404
> ...


25-.325 .058
35- 3/8 .058

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## KG441c (Nov 21, 2014)

KenJax Tree said:


> 25-.325 .058
> 35- 3/8 .058
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Sorry I didnt know the Huskys #s!!! Lol


----------



## KenJax Tree (Nov 21, 2014)

KG441c said:


> Sorry I didnt know the Huskys #s!!! Lol


I gotcha covered


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## SawTroll (Nov 21, 2014)

KenJax Tree said:


> 25-.325 .058
> 35- 3/8 .058



Yep, those are the really useful numbers if you have to use Stihl chain! Sadly, they mostly are special order at the Stihl dealers....


----------



## SAWMIKAZE (Nov 21, 2014)

KG441c said:


> 61-.043 3/8 picco micro
> 63-.050 3/8 picco
> 26-.325 .063
> 46-.404
> ...




Good info keith..so add the " 3 " on the picco chains and that means it has the safety raker ?


----------



## KG441c (Nov 21, 2014)

SawTroll said:


> Yep, those are the really useful numbers if you have to use Stihl chain! Sadly, they mostly are special order at the Stihl dealers....


I ordered a bar adapter so I can use my Sugi 3003 20" bar on my 262xp!! Lol!!


----------



## SAWMIKAZE (Nov 21, 2014)

SawTroll said:


> Yep, those are the really useful numbers if you have to use Stihl chain! Sadly, they mostly are special order at the Stihl dealers....



My dealer actually stocks 58 gauge niko , hes good on chains except PS


----------



## KG441c (Nov 21, 2014)

SawTroll said:


> Yep, those are the really useful numbers if you have to use Stihl chain! Sadly, they mostly are special order at the Stihl dealers....


I ordered a bar adapter so I can use my Sugi 3003 20" bar on my 262xp!! Lol!!


----------



## SawTroll (Nov 21, 2014)

KG441c said:


> I ordered a bar adapter so I can use my Sugi 3003 20" bar on my 262xp!! Lol!!




The oil holes will not add up, because the 3003 (D025) bar has a wider tail end than a K095 bar - so that will not work. 

Also, the common Stihl bar to Husky saw adaptors are for the Huskys with the large mount (9mm studs), and not for the small mount with 8.2mm studs.


----------



## KG441c (Nov 21, 2014)

SawTroll said:


> The oil holes will not add up, because the 3003 (D025) bar has a wider tail end than a K095 bar - so that will not work.
> 
> Also, the common Stihl bar to Husky saw adaptors are for the Huskys with the large mount (9mm studs), and not for the small mount with 8.2mm studs.


----------



## SawTroll (Nov 21, 2014)

HUH?


----------



## KG441c (Nov 21, 2014)

SawTroll said:


> HUH?


It will fit when Im done with it Niko!!! Lol! Never say never! A welder and a grinder will fix alot!!!!!


----------



## SawTroll (Nov 21, 2014)

KG441c said:


> It will fit when Im done with it Niko!!! Lol! Never say never! A welder and a grinder will fix alot!!!!!



Of course it is possible to rework the oiler holes, but I don't think it is worth the trouble - each to his own.That will render it useless for the original purpose of course.

It is much simpler to just buy the correct bar!


----------



## KG441c (Nov 21, 2014)

Im not sure on the adapter Niko but the list for the one I bought says it will


----------



## SawTroll (Nov 21, 2014)

KG441c said:


> Im not sure on the adapter Niko but the list for the one I bought says it will




That list only mentions Husky models with the large mount, that I can see - not the 262.


----------



## KG441c (Nov 21, 2014)

It says 262 on the top line Niko?


----------



## SawTroll (Nov 21, 2014)

KG441c said:


> It says 262 on the top line Niko?



No, it says 162, which is an older and physically larger saw.

On the flip side, your Cannon Supermini will fit the 262xp, and then you can test your theory about the dl count as well!


----------



## KG441c (Nov 21, 2014)

SawTroll said:


> No, it says 162, which is an older and physically larger saw.
> 
> On the flip side, your Cannon Supermini will fit the 262xp, and then you can test your theory about the dl count as well!


Well heck!!! Lol!!


----------



## SawTroll (Nov 21, 2014)

Are you halv blind? 

...or did you just assume things?


----------



## KG441c (Nov 21, 2014)

Husky is a new ballgame for me Niko! Thanks for clarifying. Maybe one of thoso black woodland pro bars in 20" 8.2mm would be nice looking on the 262xp when Im done??


----------



## SawTroll (Nov 21, 2014)

Go on and test the dl theory, I don't mind if I am proven wrong! 

Just one problem with that (and with using your Cannon Supermini on the 262xp), no 3/8 lo-pro rim that fit the 262xp (or any Husky) are easily availiable. For just testing the dl count, a regular 3/8 rim likely will be close enough though.....


----------



## KG441c (Nov 21, 2014)

I bet that 18" ps picco would scream on that ported 262xp


----------



## SawTroll (Nov 21, 2014)

KG441c said:


> I bet that 18" ps picco would scream on that ported 262xp




Likely a lot of fun with an 8-pin rim, but but finding such a rim that fits the saw is at least a challenge, even though "costume" makers like Danzco likely have made some in the past....


----------



## wyk (Nov 21, 2014)

SawTroll said:


> Likely a lot of fun with an 8-pin rim, but but finding such a rim that fits the saw is at least a challenge, even though "costume" makers like Danzco likely have made some in the past....




One word...

Piltz


----------



## SawTroll (Nov 21, 2014)

reindeer said:


> One word...
> 
> Piltz



No thanks!


----------



## KG441c (Nov 21, 2014)

reindeer said:


> One word...
> 
> Piltz


Reindeer r u really Mr. PLITZ????? LOL!!


----------



## wyk (Nov 21, 2014)




----------



## KG441c (Nov 21, 2014)

reindeer said:


>


----------



## wyk (Nov 21, 2014)

For the right price, you too can have a 32" picco chainsaw bar.


----------



## KG441c (Nov 21, 2014)

I have to admit the youtube video he has of a 251 with a 24 b/c looks pretty fast!!!lol


----------



## AKDoug (Nov 22, 2014)

SAWMIKAZE said:


> I can buy the pm locally but not the ps..my dealer said he cant even order loops of ps at 56 drivers only 55


It's stocked in the Northwest.


----------



## KG441c (Nov 22, 2014)

Here u go Niko. It has the slot


----------



## wyk (Nov 22, 2014)

Wait, does this mean with little modification, my 241 can wear an 095 mount?


----------



## KG441c (Nov 22, 2014)

Im not sure Plitz!! Lol! We will have to wait to Niko comes along. This Husky mount stuff is new and Greek to me


----------



## wyk (Nov 22, 2014)

KG441c said:


> Im not sure Plitz!! Lol! We will have to wait to Niko comes along. This Husky mount stuff is new and Greek to me



I just don't have a husky mount to try it with. But it looks close. Mebbe redo an oil hole - that's no biggie since I have to redrill the existing hole in the Stihl bar to get more flow anyways.


----------



## MustangMike (Nov 22, 2014)

I'm glad the bars & chains on all my saws interchange, U guys are making me dizzy with all the bar/chain combos for these little saws, not that it would not be nice to have one.

So Keith, tell me about UR 262, my nephew has one but it is not running yet. R U porting it, or getting it done? They are supposed to be very strong.


----------



## KG441c (Nov 22, 2014)

MustangMike said:


> I'm glad the bars & chains on all my saws interchange, U guys are making me dizzy with all the bar/chain combos for these little saws, not that it would not be nice to have one.
> 
> So Keith, tell me about UR 262, my nephew has one but it is not running yet. R U porting it, or getting it done? They are supposed to be very strong.


Mike Ive ported it myself and its turned out very nice. Complete restoration. Painted the crankcases this morning and gotta get some drying time before I go back together with it. Its gonna be one of my best restorations yet. It will look new and should be a runner


----------



## SawTroll (Nov 22, 2014)

KG441c said:


> Here u go Niko. It has the slotView attachment 381271




Thanks - looks like Baileys are right that the Cannon C1 covers the K041 as well then - but they fail to mention that it fits the small Stihl (3005) mount saws.....

Sadly, it also means that there may be a slight oil leak issue on saws with captive bar nuts.


----------



## SawTroll (Nov 22, 2014)

reindeer said:


> Wait, does this mean with little modification, my 241 can wear an 095 mount?



Not a regular K095, but you can use the Cannon C1 mount bars. 

http://www.cannonbar.com/PDFs/PriceListMSRPCADJune2014.pdf

I dont trust the listed dl counts, for reasons that I have mentioned before.....


----------



## KG441c (Nov 22, 2014)

Niko I guess that means the c1 in 3/8 non lo pro will fit my 262?


----------



## SawTroll (Nov 22, 2014)

KG441c said:


> Niko I guess that means the c1 in 3/8 non lo pro will fit my 262?




Yes, it will.


----------



## Full Chisel (Nov 22, 2014)

Stihlman441 said:


> Here is my well used little fella,i had a coil/control modual die there awhile ago,put a new one in all good.
> I like this saw so much i got another one done.
> 
> View attachment 374495
> ...



That peein' poplar is pretty cool, I've heard you can cook it down into syrup...anyone around here ever tried that? Tapping sycamores?


----------



## KenJax Tree (Nov 22, 2014)

SawTroll said:


> Thanks - looks like Baileys are right that the Cannon C1 covers the K041 as well then - but they fail to mention that it fits the small Stihl (3005) mount saws.....
> 
> Sadly, it also means that there may be a slight oil leak issue on saws with captive bar nuts.


That little oil leak is not even an issue, and what little that does leak gets absorbed by the saw dust anyways and just falls off. My 550 leaked a little with the Sugi bar. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## fin460 (Nov 22, 2014)

Well I read the first page of the thread, and now I want one again, I had myself talked out of it!


----------



## KG441c (Nov 22, 2014)




----------



## wyk (Nov 23, 2014)

MustangMike said:


> Not the size saw I would normally choose for that task, but she does sound very healthy!



Hope this is more to your liking. Notice how much quicker she gets when she clears the knots... Much better throttle response. Not ported quick, but far better than stock. This is the 7" or so unseasoned Larch I was making stakes out of for electric fencing.


----------



## MustangMike (Nov 23, 2014)

Cookies for dessert tonight! Looks real nice!


----------



## wyk (Nov 23, 2014)

MustangMike said:


> Cookies for dessert tonight! Looks real nice!



I also think she makes a nice noise.


----------



## wyk (Nov 23, 2014)

I noticed she was having difficulty oiling with the big cuts I was making the other day. When she was nearly out of fuel, I saw she had a few ounces of oil left, a significant amount more than fuel regardless. I went ahead and ground out the oil holes just a tad and she is oiling a touch better. I'm not gonna torture test her like that any time again soon, but she will find herself on the occasional firewood duty, and that means she will have to tackle larger than usual wood. So thought it would be good insurance.


----------



## SawTroll (Nov 23, 2014)

KenJax Tree said:


> That little oil leak is not even an issue, and what little that does leak gets absorbed by the saw dust anyways and just falls off. My 550 leaked a little with the Sugi bar.



I know - but some may be disturbed by the fact that it is there anyway....


----------



## KG441c (Nov 23, 2014)

How r u liking that mtronics Plitz? Looks like its a pretty tough little saw?


----------



## wyk (Nov 23, 2014)

KG441c said:


> How r u liking that mtronics Plitz? Looks like its a pretty tough little saw?



It's crap. Gonna trade it for a Husqvarna 440e and a bag of chips.


----------



## KG441c (Nov 23, 2014)

Send it to me ill figure out something I can use it for


----------



## wyk (Nov 23, 2014)

Gonna send me a ported 242 in return?

But seriously, she has more grunt than the last ported 42 special. I am just not enamored with the throttle response. When I get a set of socketdrivers I'll port it. I tried to pull the intake off, but my sockets aren't deep enough... typical. I never have the right tool handy...


----------



## KG441c (Nov 23, 2014)

Just grind a 1/4 deep socket down alil. It will fit


----------



## SawTroll (Nov 23, 2014)

reindeer said:


> Gonna send me a ported 242 in return?
> 
> But seriously, she has more grunt than the last ported 42 special. I am just not enamored with the throttle response. When I get a set of socketdrivers I'll port it. I tried to pull the intake off, but my sockets aren't deep enough... typical. I never have the right tool handy...



Throttle response seem to be a Husky specialty, and is very important on smaller saws!


----------



## KG441c (Nov 23, 2014)

Somethings not right! My 241 doesnt lack at all on throttle response?? The stock 261 I had was boggy off bottom but that was corrected with a mm


----------



## wyk (Nov 23, 2014)

It has good throttle response. It just doesn't have _great_ throttle response like a ported 42 has.


----------



## KG441c (Nov 23, 2014)

I hear u! The 036 I just ported has an excellent crisp throttle response. Advanced timing and a good crisp low end carb adjustment


----------



## wyk (Dec 15, 2014)

I'll just leave this here...


----------



## KG441c (Dec 15, 2014)

Ported the 241?


----------



## wyk (Dec 15, 2014)

Video tomorrow. The gasket is curing...


----------



## KG441c (Dec 15, 2014)

Good deal. Ready to see it. What sealant do u like? Did u cut squish or just delete base gasket
?


----------



## wyk (Dec 15, 2014)

KG441c said:


> Good deal. Ready to see it. What sealant do u like? Did u cut squish or just delete base gasket
> ?



I got very lucky. Squish was .034. Gasket is .016. Had to massage some of the cylinder side and the bottom of the coil flange, tho. Coil barely had enough room to clear the flywheel for a bidniss card, too.
LOADS of flashing on this cylinder. I did a lot of clean up as well as porting. I went conservatively with the transfers, opened up the exhaust a lot and added timing since she had a ton of torque to start, also added plenty of intake timing. Massaged the lower transfers a lot. Numbers aren't hugely different from brad or randy's. I have an adapter enroute to take the compression off this thing.


----------



## KG441c (Dec 15, 2014)

reindeer said:


> I got very lucky. Squish was .034. Gasket is .016. Had to massage some of the cylinder side and the bottom of the coil flange, tho. Coil barely had enough room to clear the flywheel for a bidniss card, too.
> LOADS of flashing on this cylinder. I did a lot of clean up as well as porting. I went conservatively with the transfers, opened up the exhaust a lot and added timing since she had a ton of torque to start, also added plenty of intake timing. Massaged the lower transfers a lot. Numbers aren't hugely different from brad or randy's. I have an adapter enroute to take the compression off this thing.


Cool! Sounds like a plan for me to do mine but too much on my bench to do right now!


----------



## KG441c (Dec 15, 2014)

Im wanting to make an adapter for spark plug holes to 1/4 hose barb for pressure testing through the spark plug hole? Any ideas ? They may make a spark plug thread to a 1/4 hose barb fitting?


----------



## KG441c (Dec 15, 2014)

So stock squish was .034?? Dang at .018 it should be loads of compression


----------



## wyk (Dec 15, 2014)

KG441c said:


> Im wanting to make an adapter for spark plug holes to 1/4 hose barb for pressure testing through the spark plug hole? Any ideas ? They may make a spark plug thread to a 1/4 hose barb fitting?



I got nuttin. I jis order adapters for my Gunson. My Proto died after using it on my 044.


----------



## KG441c (Dec 15, 2014)

Somethings not right Reindeer. I checked my squish over and over and came up with .024 repeatedly? Compression for stock is 170 psi


----------



## wyk (Dec 15, 2014)

KG441c said:


> Somethings not right Reindeer. I checked my squish over and over and came up with .024 repeatedly? Compression for stock is 170 psi



That would explain why your muff mod is doing so well.


----------



## Time's Standing Stihl (Dec 15, 2014)

Damn Keith! I've only got a couple tanks through and mine was around 162 psi


----------



## KG441c (Dec 15, 2014)

Only explanation I could see is high and low compression gaskets and that may explain the difference in throttle response because my saw spools up very quick


----------



## KG441c (Dec 15, 2014)

Time's Standing Stihl said:


> Damn Keith! I've only got a couple tanks through and mine was around 162 psi


Mine is actually more toward about 173


----------



## Time's Standing Stihl (Dec 15, 2014)

KG441c said:


> Somethings not right Reindeer. I checked my squish over and over and came up with .024 repeatedly? Compression for stock is 170 psi



I believe mine is around .027


----------



## KG441c (Dec 15, 2014)

Maybe Randy or Brad could shed some light on the differences we r seeing. I checked mine probably 10 times and it was around .023 and .024. Compression at 170 to 173. Depending on the gasket size if its .016 and could run an .010 gasket and put me right at .018. That should bump compression considerably.


----------



## wyk (Dec 15, 2014)

.023 to .034 is a big difference.


KG441c said:


> Only explanation I could see is high and low compression gaskets and that may explain the difference in throttle response because my saw spools up very quick



I've never seen .023 with a gasket from the factory.


----------



## KG441c (Dec 15, 2014)

Well I sure have one


----------



## wyk (Dec 16, 2014)

Well, I got good news and bad news.

The good news is WOW. Shes fast now and revs out. 

The bad news is POW! She detonates now after long cuts. I think it's a combo of the high compression brought on by the squish and the fact we are at sea level, and it's winter. And she had a tree fall on her before I got her(one of the reasons she was traded to me for jis a port job). If you look in the image previously, she is missing quite a few fins.

So yeah, gonna throw her back together with the gasket. She won't have the same compression, but she should wind the freak out now with all the timing sort of crazy. Mebbe I can do a beer can gasket...


----------



## KG441c (Dec 16, 2014)

Id like to know where you are on compression ? What about higher octane for it before u tear her back down?


----------



## KG441c (Dec 16, 2014)

The higher compression shouldnt make the mtronics compensate to the point of detonation? Ive heard of people running 441c at 220psi. How about retarding that timing back to where it was and trying it?


----------



## MustangMike (Dec 16, 2014)

I had heard that it was not a good idea to adjust the timing on a M-Tronic saw, since the adjust on their own.

Maybe with UR adjustment, the M-Tronic is messed up and does not know where it is, and is causing the problem.

I would return the M-Tronic timing back to the factory setting first and see what happens.


----------



## wyk (Dec 16, 2014)

Oh, she was messed up a bit to start. She sorted herself eventually. But after a few long cuts, she is not happy.

She has the classic signs of detonation. She starts fine. Runs eager, then leans out a touch before she starts to buck/stutter. And when she stops you get that whiff out of the exhaust that smells of detonation, and the cylinder is hot as fk.When she starts to detonate, the MTronic goes a bit bonkers, too. It starts to studder badly. 

I'm not gonna fight it. Why bother. Gonna put the gasket back in. This is a work saw, so no need to make her nervous or require more octane. The minimum here is 95 anyways. If she won't run on that, then she's not gonna be happy on much else. 98 and 100 are only available in select places in Dublin and the UK. 

I never modified the timing at all. It is factory. I never mod the timing on MTronic saws.


----------



## wyk (Dec 16, 2014)

KG441c said:


> The higher compression shouldnt make the mtronics compensate to the point of detonation? Ive heard of people running 441c at 220psi. How about retarding that timing back to where it was and trying it?



It may have as much to do with the missing fins as the compression. Timing was never changed. When I mentioned timing - I meant port timing.


----------



## KG441c (Dec 16, 2014)

Odd. I wouldnt think it would detonate on .018 squish. Think maybe the port timing is off ?


----------



## blsnelling (Dec 16, 2014)

I doubt it's detonating. Did I read that you advanced the ignition? If so, I would put that back.


----------



## KG441c (Dec 16, 2014)

Sounds as the ignition or port timing is off?


----------



## wyk (Dec 16, 2014)

Why do people think I advanced the ignition? This is an MTronic saw.

Detonation, or random timing event, or whatever. Anyways, put the gasket back in and shes fine now. It's gone dark, so I'll see if there's a vid in it tomorrow. She's rather peppy. Sounds GREAT at idle, too.


----------



## KG441c (Dec 16, 2014)

This is what I come up with to pressure check bottomend. Works really well


----------



## wyk (Dec 16, 2014)

Gee, hope yer husky gets well soon.


----------



## KG441c (Dec 16, 2014)

Thats alil 235 im workin on for someone.


----------



## KG441c (Dec 16, 2014)

Reindeer I looked at Brads photos of his first 241 and his squish was .024. His compression was only like 155 though. Mine is making a good bit more compression in stock form


----------



## wyk (Dec 16, 2014)

Bear in mind, it takes a lot of long cuts before she starts acting up and over heating. I think people have also forgotten I am missing the first 3 cooling fins at the top of my cylinder(the part that does the most work cooling the saw). This may be the main culprit. Also bear in mind that this saw was made long before they were available in the states(2012). It can be a bit different than the newest versions.


----------



## KG441c (Dec 16, 2014)

Im like u thats a big difference between .023 and .034. Did u check squish after u got it back together? Im curious as to what ur saw was doin?


----------



## wyk (Dec 16, 2014)

I'm not.  I'm gonna try it tomorrow and see how she does. If she works, I am just gonna run with it. I already have a temperamental 044. I don't need another one. In fact, I may do the beer can thing for my 044. I'll try and find a big chunk of chestnut so we can sort of compare it to my 261 vid I did in chestnut. I got work to do here on the estate. We've 2 huge beech's, a large oak, and several other trees down. I dunno if I can even make a vid tomorrow. I am only awake because I was thirsty. I had the fire roasting.


----------



## wyk (Dec 16, 2014)

That's semi chisel chain btw ^


----------



## wyk (Dec 17, 2014)

OK, the vid is up. She runs well. That bar is very worn, tho. I was hoping my new bar would arrive before this vid, but it will just have to wait. So sometimes that thing binds a bit. I think I found my problem, though. She was having difficulty idling for any real length of time today off of 'start'. I think maybe sumfin's obstructing the impulse lines or carb. I'll pull her apart again soon here. It might explain the bog, which she still has to some degree.

Crank it up(this Ash is quite hard, th0):


----------



## wyk (Dec 18, 2014)

Gonna play with the metering arm and maybe the set screw for the butterflies tomorrow and see if she improves off idle. She is still having idle issues. I found a few old posts were 441's were having the same issues. SOme of them would also die at idle, too. Mine is having the same issues.


----------



## KG441c (Dec 18, 2014)

My 441 never didnt idle, mine woulnt like to start after it had gotten up to operating temperature and used for awhile.


----------



## wyk (Dec 18, 2014)

Yeah, this poor thing is acting like she's rich at idle. It got worse after porting. And the weather has gotten warmer, which has made it even worse. I checked the plug after she died last and pow - wet. SO gonna try the metering. Hopefully that fixes the idle and the bog. I have a feeling having to play around with the set screw on the butterflies is gonna be a pain.


----------



## KG441c (Dec 18, 2014)

reindeer said:


> Yeah, this poor thing is acting like she's rich at idle. It got worse after porting. And the weather has gotten warmer, which has made it even worse. I checked the plug after she died last and pow - wet. SO gonna try the metering. Hopefully that fixes the idle and the bog. I have a feeling having to play around with the set screw on the butterflies is gonna be a pain.


Which way on the metering lever for less fuel? Down?


----------



## wyk (Dec 18, 2014)

Yes. I'll play with her tomorrow and see if I can get it right with the first few tries.

Judging by the amount of carbon built up in this thing, she was running rich long before I got her.


----------



## wyk (Dec 19, 2014)

OK...so... anyone know where I can get a new diaphram for this carb? 

Gonna go into the IPL and see what the local stihl guy wants to rape me for. But I suspect the part is the same for pre mtronic...

Hah, Walbro calls is the "WTF" series. Nice.

So I need a diaphragm for a WTF -1/-3


----------



## KG441c (Dec 19, 2014)

reindeer said:


> OK...so... anyone know where I can get a new diaphram for this carb?
> 
> Gonna go into the IPL and see what the local stihl guy wants to rape me for. But I suspect the part is the same for pre mtronic...


The diagram has a hole in it Reindeer?


----------



## KG441c (Dec 19, 2014)

Reindeer I was looking and the only differences I see between a mtronic carb is some linkage and a solenoid? Gaskets and diaphragm looks the same ?


----------



## wyk (Dec 19, 2014)

I went ahead and ordered it from the local stihl rapist. He will have it in by tuesday. Says I am the first person to have ordered parts for an MTronic carb - including themselves. So wish me luck on them arriving and being correct. Do not ask me how much it will cost. I don't want to repeat it. But the cost of shipping from the states and potential down time makes it worth it.


----------



## lone wolf (Dec 19, 2014)

KG441c said:


> Which way on the metering lever for less fuel? Down?


Yes, it should sit level though to be correct.


----------



## KG441c (Dec 19, 2014)

Checked the stock compression on my 241c again just to double check my reading again. 172psi


----------



## wyk (Dec 19, 2014)

What's your altitude?


----------



## KG441c (Dec 19, 2014)

118ft


----------



## wyk (Dec 19, 2014)

Ah. I am at 50 or so depending where I am on the estate, and the air is always cold and dense here.

My adapter should be here any day now.


----------



## KG441c (Dec 19, 2014)

reindeer said:


> Ah. I am at 50 or so depending where I am on the estate, and the air is always cold and dense here.
> 
> My adapter should be here any day now.


Its winter time here in Louisiana! Its 49° today!! Lol


----------



## KG441c (Dec 19, 2014)

The snap on gauge kit I have came with 3 size hoses. That 241 fits the smallest hose


----------



## blsnelling (Dec 19, 2014)

KG441c said:


> The snap on gauge kit I have came with 3 size hoses. That 241 fits the smallest hose


10mm.


----------



## lone wolf (Dec 19, 2014)

https://video.search.yahoo.com/vide...:s,v:v,m:sa&hsimp=yhs-001&hspart=mozilla&tt=b


----------



## wyk (Dec 19, 2014)

About the same here. Been 'warm' lately. We're in a valley, so the weather is usually tame, even by Irish standards.

http://www.pbase.com/wyk/gurteen_de_la_poer


----------



## lone wolf (Dec 19, 2014)

blsnelling said:


> 10mm.


Ten MM plug?


----------



## blsnelling (Dec 19, 2014)

lone wolf said:


> Ten MM plug?


Yes.


----------



## KG441c (Dec 19, 2014)

Brad what compression do u see on a 241c after porting?.


----------



## maulhead (Dec 19, 2014)

KG441c said:


> The snap on gauge kit I have came with 3 size hoses. That 241 fits the smallest hose



What is the snap on part # and model # on your gauge kit? Thanks.


----------



## lone wolf (Dec 19, 2014)

maulhead said:


> What is the snap on part # and model # on your gauge kit? Thanks.


I need a 10 MM hose for my snap on now


----------



## KG441c (Dec 19, 2014)

maulhead said:


> What is the snap on part # and model # on your gauge kit? Thanks.


Not at home but Brad may remember as mine is just like his


----------



## lone wolf (Dec 19, 2014)

KG441c said:


> Not at home but Brad may remember as mine is just like his


It has the 10 mm in it?


----------



## KG441c (Dec 19, 2014)

lone wolf said:


> It has the 10 mm in it?


Yes it has the 10mm for the 241 and 2 bigger fittings with hose in the snap on kit. I wanna say that kit on snap 9n is like 185 but you can probably find it on Ebay for alot less


----------



## wyk (Dec 19, 2014)

This is why I need that 241 sooner than later. I was out doing two things today - killing the bigger vines I found, and finding a christmas tree for the farm house. There's also some views of the rhododendron problem we have(Yes - some of it is 35' tall, yes that's a vine hugging that larch):


----------



## KG441c (Dec 19, 2014)

Snap on model 303 or 308 looks like the kit


----------



## blsnelling (Dec 19, 2014)

I don't recall. I'll have to check my notes at home.


----------



## maulhead (Dec 19, 2014)

Is it this one? 308M

http://www.ebay.com/itm/SNAP-ON-MT3...D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557

Or this 308L

http://www.ebay.com/itm/SNAP-ON-EXC...D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557

Not sure what the M or the L means? But they are both 308's

thanks!


----------



## KG441c (Dec 19, 2014)

maulhead said:


> Is it this one? 308M
> 
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/SNAP-ON-MT308M-034-NEW-STYLE-034-COMPRESSION-TESTER-SET-/151518877380?pt=Motors_Automotive_Tools&hash=item23473a96c4&vxp=mtr&item=151518877380&nma=true&si=wbCd8hxFtwBZ4%2FU2wmrq7bDANmg%3D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557
> 
> ...


Not sure? Heres a pic of my gauge with the part # on it


----------



## MustangMike (Dec 19, 2014)

Keith, which saw is pumping 220??? That is stiff!


----------



## KG441c (Dec 19, 2014)

MustangMike said:


> Keith, which saw is pumping 220??? That is stiff!


Rons 036 but we dropped it back to about 185


----------



## MustangMike (Dec 19, 2014)

???


----------



## KG441c (Dec 19, 2014)

My internet is acting up in bad weather. Sorry for the half post!! Lol


----------



## lone wolf (Dec 19, 2014)

KG441c said:


> My internet is acting up in bad weather. Sorry for the half post!! Lol


Snowing?


----------



## KG441c (Dec 19, 2014)

No just rained about 3" and my internet gets slow in the rural area I work along Red River in bad weather


----------



## wyk (Dec 20, 2014)

KG441c said:


> My internet is acting up in bad weather. Sorry for the half post!! Lol


You goin all dozer dan on us now?


----------



## KG441c (Dec 20, 2014)

reindeer said:


> You goin all dozer dan on us now?


Lmbo!! Not hardly but my data on my mobile phone acts up in the area I work during bad weather! At one point I could barely refresh pages when the rain was bad enough


----------



## KG441c (Dec 20, 2014)

Reindeer Ive been thinkin on my 241c again . My compression is already stout but I was thinkin about replacing the factory .016 gasket with a .010 and that should put me around .018 with alil more bump in compression? Not sure about the upper transfer and exhaust height after dropping the jug a tad? Just thinking. Still curious as to what was goin on with ur 241 after dropping ur jug?


----------



## wyk (Dec 20, 2014)

KG441c said:


> Reindeer Ive been thinkin on my 241c again . My compression is already stout but I was thinkin about replacing the factory .016 gasket with a .010 and that should put me around .018 with alil more bump in compression? Not sure about the upper transfer and exhaust height after dropping the jug a tad? Just thinking. Still curious as to what was goin on with ur 241 after dropping ur jug?



I think Brad may be right. Coulda been sumfin else. NOw that the carb is being sorted, I will give it another try. First I'll do a compression check.

A beer can gets you .008 I think, according to oldcat. Haven't measured it myself yet. I may make one. That vid I did doesn't do this thing justice, tho. I think with a new B&C and the carb sorted, she will scream. She didn't lose any torque for the raised exhaust(and it is now raised a lot - well .016...), but she winds up very quickly.


----------



## KG441c (Dec 20, 2014)

reindeer said:


> I think Brad may be right. Coulda been sumfin else. NOw that the carb is being sorted, I will give it another try. First I'll do a compression check.
> 
> A beer can gets you .008 I think, according to oldcat. Haven't measured it myself yet. I may make one. That vid I did doesn't do this thing justice, tho. I think with a new B&C and the carb sorted, she will scream. She didn't lose any torque for the raised exhaust(and it is now raised a lot - well .016...), but she winds up very quickly.


Ya im thinkin doing a .010 gasket and just clean the ports up and check the port timing after I get the new gasket in and go from there


----------



## KG441c (Dec 20, 2014)

Maulhead my snap on gauge kit is a 303 model


----------



## wyk (Jan 13, 2015)

KG441c said:


> Ya im thinkin doing a .010 gasket and just clean the ports up and check the port timing after I get the new gasket in and go from there



I'm gonna adjust the squish in a bit here. Right now I am still having carb issues(this unit has always had issues). I may end up having to simply replace the carb. Here she is when she cooperated enough to do a vid before the MTronic eventually kicked in an ran her pig rich again.
This is also without resetting the MT. It simply loads up at idle and dies now.



Chain is 325 semi chisel on a 16" husqvarna bar modded to fit the 241.


----------



## wyk (Jan 15, 2015)

Spoke to a couple of Stihl techs. New carb is on order. We'll see if there's any difference.


----------



## wyk (Jan 15, 2015)

Of course Niko likes it.

The two techs could only agree on one thing - replacing the carb. I asked them if the coil could make the saw do what it was doing, and they both said it was most likely the carb. I am gonna be rather upset if it is the coil or the trigger control unit.


----------



## MustangMike (Jan 15, 2015)

Best of Luck with it.


----------



## Joe Kidd (Jan 15, 2015)

KG441c said:


> Put the saw on start and crank it and dont blip the throttle for 90 sec. Cut it off , recrank, and go make 5 loaded cuts and its done


If the muff is modded before it's fired up for the first time, is a re-cal necessary?


----------



## KG441c (Jan 15, 2015)

Joe Kidd said:


> If the muff is modded before it's fired up for the first time, is a re-cal necessary?[/QUOT
> I recalibrate if I change anything but im not sure its neccessary


----------



## AKDoug (Jan 15, 2015)

reindeer said:


> Of course Niko likes it.
> 
> The two techs could only agree on one thing - replacing the carb. I asked them if the coil could make the saw do what it was doing, and they both said it was most likely the carb. I am gonna be rather upset if it is the coil or the trigger control unit.


Do you have a shop manual? The diagnosis is pretty simple with a multi-meter.


----------



## KG441c (Jan 15, 2015)

AKDoug said:


> Do you have a shop manual? The diagnosis is pretty simple with a multi-meter.


AK Whats the procedure for checking with the multi meter?


----------



## AKDoug (Jan 15, 2015)

I'll post it tomorrow. I'm away from my work computer.


----------



## Spectre468 (Jan 15, 2015)

What's the going rate on a 241 PHO these days?


----------



## wyk (Jan 16, 2015)

AKDoug said:


> Do you have a shop manual? The diagnosis is pretty simple with a multi-meter.



To drop it off and have them 'properly' diagnose the saw and fix it would have cost more than a new carb and throttle control sensor, and then add to that the cost of a new carb and throttle control sensor. I spent 5 minutes with each tech on the phone, telling them how the saw was acting. It was readily apparent to me that they had no idea how to handle an MTronic issue. I decided on a new carb, and possibly new other parts rather early in my conversations. The only dealer set up to diagnose it with a computer is an hour and a half away. That's 30 euro in fuel alone, plus 4+ hours off work as they are not open most weekends. Needless to say, I am not too fond of this electronic stuff right now.

I do recall earlier on stating that my only issue with the new electronic saws is if they start having gremlins. Well, here we are.

I may have a multimeter here. How do I test the sensor?


----------



## wyk (Jan 16, 2015)

SO I set the carb aside to bring with me to the stealership tomorrow coz they are like open for 3 hours or somthing stupid like that. I put it on the counter next to the door. One of the sisters came in to look after her mother and brought her kids with her. In short order I notice the carb is missing. After looking around for 15 minutes, I find it in the kids toy box.


----------



## KG441c (Jan 16, 2015)

Lol! I believe this 241 is bad Mojo for u!!


----------



## VinceGU05 (Jan 16, 2015)

Spectre468 said:


> What's the going rate on a 241 PHO these days?



$1289 in the land down under.


----------



## wyk (Jan 16, 2015)

VinceGU05 said:


> $1289 in the land down under.



Well, I know where to sell a 241cm parts saw if this doesn't pan out ...


----------



## AKDoug (Jan 16, 2015)

reindeer said:


> To drop it off and have them 'properly' diagnose the saw and fix it would have cost more than a new carb and throttle control sensor, and then add to that the cost of a new carb and throttle control sensor. I spent 5 minutes with each tech on the phone, telling them how the saw was acting. It was readily apparent to me that they had no idea how to handle an MTronic issue. I decided on a new carb, and possibly new other parts rather early in my conversations. The only dealer set up to diagnose it with a computer is an hour and a half away. That's 30 euro in fuel alone, plus 4+ hours off work as they are not open most weekends. Needless to say, I am not too fond of this electronic stuff right now.
> 
> I do recall earlier on stating that my only issue with the new electronic saws is if they start having gremlins. Well, here we are.
> 
> I may have a multimeter here. How do I test the sensor?


I have tried everything my limited computer knowledge will allow me to break out the several pages of diagnostics in my shop manual .PDF to no avail. I like you guys, but I'm not typing out several pages of instructions either. 

I have also had time to think about your issue and I doubt very much it's the M-tronic judging by your description. Generally, without a reason, the M-tronic is not just going to adjust the saw to full rich. M-Tronic is pretty simple. It bases it's adjustments of the carb through simply measuring the temperature of the crankcase and the RPM. An air leak causes a lean condition, which causes high R.P.M. and more heat. The system reacts by adding fuel. Same goes for a change in temperature, the system reacts by adding or removing fuel to meet the pre-set perimeters. 

I have no idea how the M-tronic is going to react to your porting. It could simply be a case of changing something in the porting that causes enough heat to make the M-Tronic go full rich and not come back. It could also be an air leak that it's reacting to. Or it could be broken in some way. In the shop manual they make a big deal of thoroughly checking wiring and connections before replacing components. 

Then, the carb, as you discovered isn't that different from a normal carb. In reality, your situation probably isn't the carb, but the solenoid attached to it, which is replaceable separate. 

Do you have any hard data that it's going too rich? What is the top RPM attained at no load. If it's not reaching 13,000 then there is an issue. That is one of the hard values in the troubleshooting guide. Have you tested the saw for air leaks?


----------



## VinceGU05 (Jan 16, 2015)

i read some where on AS about 441c's having stalling probs.. think it was the fuel metering leveler needed adjustment.. something like that.. HTH


----------



## wyk (Jan 16, 2015)

This is the history of this 241:

It has always ran very rich. Even stock. And has always had a bog if left to idle for anything more than a few seconds. It had been returned to the dealer a few times for the issue, but was never resolved. Occasionally it will load up and die if left to idle(richen itself up until it can no longer idle). It would rev out at WOT, but be very rich on the top end, especially for a 43cc saw. It had good torque when it liked to run, though. But never had decent throttle response. And the issues were getting worse and worse. It was then passed on to me in exchange for some saw work I did for the original owner.

I took it, tore it down, cleaned it up, and then did a muff mod by removing the baffle. She ran a bit better, but still had the bog, and never had the responsiveness a 43cc saw should have. She loaded up a touch less, but still ran very rich. I was hoping porting it would draw the fuel it wanted to give her. Then I very mildly ported it. Mostly removing the lip on the intake and adding a small amount of timing to the intake and transfers, and cleaned up the flashing on the lower transfers. No ignition timing mods, no gasket removal, no machine work. She ran great for a couple of days. Then the rich running issues returned. I tried to modify the metering lever as well(with the help of a couple of stihl and small engine techs, and no more than 6 different adjustments and trials). She would run great for a few cuts, then start to go richer and richer until she wouldn't rev out any more - she would only just idle. And she will no longer start without the throttle at WOT now. I set the meter to where it was originally, and now she hardly works at all. I cleaned the carb as best I could - no improvement. Checked the impulse, replaced the hoses and filter - no change. Then the other day she started to surge a bit at idle, load up, then die. The exhaust port is covered in soot, and she eats fuel faster than my heavily ported 044 does, but acts pig rich the entire time and is basically useless.

So, whattaya think it is?


----------



## VinceGU05 (Jan 16, 2015)

naa i got nothing lol, sorry.


----------



## KG441c (Jan 16, 2015)

Malfunctioning solenoid on carb would be my guess


----------



## AKDoug (Jan 17, 2015)

I've got nothing either. Unless I had the saw in hand I don't have any further suggestions. Try the new carb and see what happens.


----------



## traktorz (Jan 17, 2015)

Both the AutoTune and the mTronic will go bezerk if one of their sensors aren't working. 
The M-Tronic system is therefore trying to adapt all over the place, yet to no avail. 

Therefore at least the AutoTune Diagnostic Tool has a sensor diagnostic test procedure, as a starter. 

The smaller the saw is, the less forgiving the electronic carburetor control is. More demands on sensors and actuators, so the adaptive algorithm can do it's job.


----------



## wyk (Jan 17, 2015)

KG441c said:


> Malfunctioning solenoid on carb would be my guess



That's what were thinking. I'll call the local guys and see if the carb is in. At least I don't feel so bad replacing parts, even if they are expensive, since I basically got this saw for less than a couple hundred bucks in work.


----------



## Deleted member 83629 (Jan 17, 2015)

i might get one after taxes are filed


----------



## KG441c (Jan 17, 2015)

reindeer said:


> That's what were thinking. I'll call the local guys and see if the carb is in. At least I don't feel so bad replacing parts, even if they are expensive, since I basically got this saw for less than a couple hundred bucks in work.


Ya and u will have a spare parts carb too. Wonder how much the solenoid vs the carb is?


----------



## KG441c (Jan 17, 2015)

Didnt u say a tree or something fell on it? Maybe it knocked some of the carb linkage around?


----------



## wyk (Jan 17, 2015)

This is the first tank. She started to pull much better on the second tank, but my camera died(prolly a solenoid). Wood is a mix of chestnut and very hard ash.


----------



## KG441c (Jan 17, 2015)

Is that with the new carb?


----------



## wyk (Jan 17, 2015)

Yep. First tank. She was still hunting around. She's stronger now. I'll have a scary vid to put up tomorrow if the weather cooperates.
I love seeing that Husqvarna bar on it, too.
She sounds much more aggressive in person. Might be the acoustics.
Still has the slight bog, tho. I wonder what is causing it. But I am afraid to fiddle with it now


----------



## KG441c (Jan 17, 2015)

Sounds to be holding good rpm but im not sure on the bog. Still may be a linkage problem


----------



## wyk (Jan 17, 2015)

Doubt it's linkage. Everything looks fine. Randy was telling me some of the first few had bad response off idle. I was told to raise the xfers


----------



## KG441c (Jan 17, 2015)

reindeer said:


> Doubt it's linkage. Everything looks fine. Randy was telling me some of the first few had bad response off idle. I was told to raise the xfers


What # on the transfer?


----------



## KG441c (Jan 17, 2015)

Theres no way deleting that base gasket would hurt it. Id shoot for .020.


----------



## wyk (Jan 17, 2015)

Yeah, when I have cause to pull her apart again, I'll remove the gasket and raise the xfers. Right now, thou, she's in a good place.That Husqvarna bar started life at 18". I knew I would have to cut the butt off of it and lose an inch or more. Turns out it was less work than I thought, she went from 72DL to 70. So that thing is pulling about 17" of bar on that v id.


----------



## KG441c (Jan 17, 2015)

reindeer said:


> Yeah, when I have cause to pull her apart again, I'll remove the gasket and raise the xfers. Right now, thou, she's in a good place.That Husqvarna bar started life at 18". I knew I would have to cut the butt off of it and lose an inch or more. Turns out it was less work than I thought, she went from 72DL to 70. So that thing is pulling about 17" of bar on that v id.


Yes it sounds great in the cut. Imagine what about 185 psi and more intake and transfer duration is gonna do?


----------



## wyk (Jan 17, 2015)

KG441c said:


> Yes it sounds great in the cut. Imagine what about 185 psi and more intake and transfer duration is gonna do?



Oh, it would be awesomer. Almost as awesome as bastardizing a Husqvarna bar to fit a Stihl coz Stihl NK bars and chains cost twice as much here


----------



## Spectre468 (Jan 18, 2015)

Those of you who have 241's and have watched the video, would you say that this is about normal performance for these saws?


----------



## AKDoug (Jan 18, 2015)

Spectre468 said:


> Those of you who have 241's and have watched the video, would you say that this is about normal performance for these saws?


Hard to say because of the type of wood. Here is a video of mine on it's first tank.


----------



## KG441c (Jan 18, 2015)

Spectre468 said:


> Those of you who have 241's and have watched the video, would you say that this is about normal performance for these saws?


It can be faster with some more compression and porting and ps picco but with the 325 chain and stock compression it looks to be cutting very well and reindeer was letting it self feed also.


----------



## Spectre468 (Jan 18, 2015)

Thanks, Doug! These look like strong little saws!


Thanks, Keith!


----------



## KG441c (Jan 18, 2015)

Spectre468 said:


> Thanks, Doug! These look like strong little saws!
> 
> 
> Thanks, Keith!


We were cutting 12 to 15" pine today with a stock 261 and my mm241c and the 241 was everybit as fast. Id take the 241 in that size wood anyday


----------



## Spectre468 (Jan 18, 2015)

KG441c said:


> We were cutting 12 to 15" pine today with a stock 261 and my mm241c and the 241 was everybit as fast. Id take the 241 in that size wood anyday




Sweet! Did you do gills?


----------



## KG441c (Jan 18, 2015)

Yea. Ditched the arrestor, opened factory opening, and added gills. Added a 7 pin sprocket kit with ps chain. Its super nice with that setup but its getting ported when I get time. I dont understand Reindeers saw though I believe he said was at .033 squish . Mine when I got it was .023 squish and about 172psi from factory


----------



## maulhead (Jan 18, 2015)

man, i wish this thread would die, every time I sign into AS, I see some update from this thread  

Makes me wanna go buy another 241c, I sure miss mine,,,, both of them,,


----------



## wyk (Jan 18, 2015)

KG441c said:


> It can be faster with some more compression and porting and ps picco but with the 325 chain and stock compression it looks to be cutting very well and reindeer was letting it self feed also.



That's the first tank after a reset on a brand spanking new carb, and with a top end that was recently put back together. She was even stronger on the second tank.
She is not only pulling 325, she is doing it with a 17.5" B&C(70DL), with a 7 pin rim, and that ash is very hard having grown in a dry run off area. So on the one big round, I am not leaning on it. On all the others I am pushing on it fairly hard. On the last round, well triangle, which is Chestnut, I am leaning on it hard - you can see the entire saw horse shaking, and the bar fly off the wood when the cut is done. In softwoods, she would be pretty quick. She has loads of torque. I will use her a bit more and see how she does.


----------



## KG441c (Jan 18, 2015)

reindeer said:


> That's the first tank after a reset on a brand spanking new carb, and with a top end that was recently put back together. She was even stronger on the second tank.
> She is not only pulling 325, she is doing it with a 17.5" B&C(70DL), with a 7 pin rim, and that ash is very hard having grown in a dry run off area. So on the one big round, I am not leaning on it. On all the others I am pushing on it fairly hard. On the last round, well triangle, which is Chestnut, I am leaning on it hard - you can see the entire saw horse shaking, and the bar fly off the wood when the cut is done. In softwoods, she would be pretty quick. She has loads of torque. I will use her a bit more and see how she does.


It looks great Reindeer. Good rpm. Im interested to see it under a port job again


----------



## wyk (Jan 18, 2015)

KG441c said:


> It looks great Reindeer. Good rpm. Im interested to see it under a port job again



Also with semi chisel chain. 

I'm not sure she needs more work. She's been getting stronger and stronger, and does the job I need her to do. I'll put up another vid in a bit.


----------



## KG441c (Jan 18, 2015)

reindeer said:


> Also with semi chisel chain.
> 
> I'm not sure she needs more work. She's been getting stronger and stronger, and does the job I need her to do. I'll put up another vid in a bit.


With a port job I believe it will be right there with the 261 but thats just me.


----------



## wyk (Jan 18, 2015)

It IS with the 261. Fourth tank:


----------



## wyk (Jan 18, 2015)

Yeah, she's much better than when I first put the carb in. Got her to 6 tanks today, and she got better every tank. I am very happy with this little dude right now. Tomorrow it's back to firewood duty once again:


----------



## Deleted member 83629 (Jan 18, 2015)

how many tanks till this saw wakes up completely if left bone stock with no mods.


----------



## Red97 (Jan 19, 2015)

Dad has 4 tanks through his 241, and it keeps getting stronger, I am on 4 with the 261 and it seems to get better each time. So more than 4. Probably 6-8 would be my guess.


----------



## Spectre468 (Jan 19, 2015)

RDeer,

That looks like a cuttin' sumbitch!


----------



## wyk (Jan 19, 2015)

Spectre468 said:


> RDeer,
> 
> That looks like a cuttin' sumbitch!



Yeah, she's smoking now. Made a huge difference putting a few tanks through her. Seems even though you do a reset, MTronic can still take a while to really tune in. If you look at the last vid, when I first grab the saw I also go and grab a hand full of throttle to test the bog since she's been idling for at least 10 seconds there. Usually that was enough for it to have a terrible bog. But as you can see, it's gone there. So she's getting better all around.

The wood I have been cutting has all been pretty tough hardwoods, and she's done really well. The wood you see in the firewood vid is all seasoned ash and rhododendron, very hard wood, and she slices right through them with that 17" bar, 325, semi chisel chain. I am very pleased now.


----------



## KG441c (Jan 19, 2015)

I knew u needed to give that 241 a chance. Ive had an 026 and 261 but if I had to reach for one for smaller wood it would no doubt be the 241c


----------



## Mastermind (Jan 19, 2015)

I do quite a lot of these saws......

I'm thinking if the price was a little lower they would get more attention. They deserve more attention.


----------



## Red97 (Jan 19, 2015)

How about a dual port ms 241c?


----------



## KG441c (Jan 19, 2015)

Nice! Did u make that?


----------



## Red97 (Jan 19, 2015)

KG441c said:


> Nice! Did u make that?


 
Maybe.


----------



## KG441c (Jan 19, 2015)

Red97 said:


> Maybe.


Keith Gandy 2361 Desoto St. Robeline , La. 71469!!! Lol!!


----------



## Red97 (Jan 19, 2015)

KG441c said:


> Keith Gandy 2361 Desoto St. Robeline , La. 71469!!! Lol!!


 
LOL Check your PM box


----------



## wyk (Jan 19, 2015)

The biggest difference you can make with an exhaust mod on a 261, 241, and a 362 is removing the baffle. The largest gain I have ever seen from a muffler mod was from removing the baffle on a 261c. It went from cuts in the 26 second range to 16 seconds in the same wood. No other mods. If I got a 261c, I wouldn't bother porting it if it came alive like that.


----------



## wyk (Jan 19, 2015)




----------



## MustangMike (Jan 19, 2015)

Reindeer ... Thanks for the info, but I have a few questions/comments:

1) A 362 C does not have a baffle.

2) Was the saw brand new when U first tested it, or was it already broken in?

Thanks.


----------



## wyk (Jan 19, 2015)

MustangMike said:


> Reindeer ... Thanks for the info, but I have a few questions/comments:
> 
> 1) A 362 C does not have a baffle.
> 
> ...



I doubt they've removed the baffle. In fact, some people miss the fact the 261 and the 241 have baffles. All you have to do is look at the exhaust outlet - if you can not see the inlet from the outlet, there is a baffle. The 362 becomes much louder when the baffle is removed, so I doubt they've removed it on recent versions. In fact, the 261 becomes so loud it caused distortion in one of my videos.

The 261c was well broken in over a couple of years.









Another very hard piece of ash ^


----------



## Tnshaker (Jan 19, 2015)

Just traded my OE 261 for a 241 today. Very impressed so far. Best quality I have seen in a saw under 50cc and has m tronic...I think I love this little guy


----------



## wyk (Jan 19, 2015)




----------



## MustangMike (Jan 19, 2015)

Reindeer,

OK, I though you were talking about a baffle like the 046/460 and 066/660s have.

I just consider that enlarging the outlet hole. On the 046, I enlarged the outlet hole, removed the baffle, and added the dp cover.


----------



## wyk (Jan 19, 2015)

MustangMike said:


> Reindeer,
> 
> OK, I though you were talking about a baffle like the 046/460 and 066/660s have.
> 
> I just consider that enlarging the outlet hole. On the 046, I enlarged the outlet hole, removed the baffle, and added the dp cover.



Nope, there is a baffle inside the muffler not much different from that of the 066/044. It causes the exhaust to go all the way to the front of the muffler, bounce back and up into the corner where the exhaust outlet is. When you remove this baffle, the exhaust then has a straight shot from the cylinder port to the muffler exit port. But the increase in dB is quite a lot as you now have a direct line from the exhaust to the outside world of less than 2". Just because it isn't directly in front of the cylinder exhaust doesn't mean it doesn't have the same effect of choking the saw. It's just as restrictive, only it is right before the muffler exit port.


----------



## MustangMike (Jan 19, 2015)

Next time I take one apart, I will give it a closer look, but the 046 has (make that had) a baffle that the 044 does not have.


----------



## wyk (Jan 20, 2015)

MustangMike said:


> Next time I take one apart, I will give it a closer look, but the 046 has (make that had) a baffle that the 044 does not have.



I meant to say 046. Sorry.

The thing is, to some, it doesn't look like a baffle. But, to make it all very clear, ANY thing inside of a muffler that is not the muffler housing, is basically installed as a baffle. Removing these things, more often than not, means better flow out the muffler. On the newer MTronic saws, you can easily dismiss it since adding another outlet by passes it some. But when you remove that baffle instead of simply adding another port, you get HUGE gains.


----------



## wyk (Jan 20, 2015)

Here we go. Check this post out:

http://www.arboristsite.com/community/threads/ms-362-muffler-mod.198334/page-2#post-3602256

His quote : _"No baffle"_

But there is obviously a baffle right in front of your face there. See it on the image on the right?






Now why does it make such a difference when you remove this baffle VS simply adding another port out the front or side? It's because on the 241-362 models, the stock muffler port can be made huge enough, and then the distance between the cyl outlet and the muffler outlet is as short as I have ever seen on about any saw ever. It's like 1.8". That allows a huge amount of pressure to escape the moment the piston drops below the exhaust port. I also think the design of the muffler overall helps to make a bigger difference.

Check this vid out again - that is NOT poplar or pine like you see in other vids. It's hard unseasoned ash. When I am cutting at the sheds in my vids, it's for firewood. That means it's hardwoods. That saw has only had a muffler mod and small timing advance. No porting at all:


----------



## MustangMike (Jan 20, 2015)

I don't think the muffler in my 362 C looked like that, but it has been a while since I had it apart.


----------



## Mastermind (Jan 20, 2015)

That's a different muffler design Wes. The 362C has a totally open muffler...


----------



## blsnelling (Jan 20, 2015)

Just for reference, here's both a stock and ported 241. There is no break in time on this saw.

Stihl MS241C Stock: 

Stihl MS241C Ported:


----------



## MustangMike (Jan 20, 2015)

Randy, thanks for those pics!

Brad, great work (No, I won't ask if it has a pop up Ha Ha).

That is a big difference.


----------



## wyk (Jan 20, 2015)

Is it totally open? I see a baffle in the upper left. How open is it up there?

As I stated previously, you can add a port to the muffler, but the flow still builds pressure before it leaves the front part of the muffler. If you remove the baffle in the upper left of that muffler, I bet the gains are far better, as the exhaust doesn't have a chance to build pressure. It bleeds off the moment it hits the muffler.

If I recall earlier, you had added a port to a 261 and saw no effect on performance.You had to go further.

When you remove the baffle and open the exterior muffler port, you get astounding results. Unfortunately, you also get astounding dBs.




Mastermind said:


> That's a different muffler design Wes. The 362C has a totally open muffler...


----------



## wyk (Jan 20, 2015)

blsnelling said:


> Just for reference, here's both a stock and ported 241. There is no break in time on this saw.
> 
> Stihl MS241C Stock:
> 
> Stihl MS241C Ported:




I notice my 241 revs higher and higher the more I use it. It revs a good bit more than yours does in the vid. I wonder how yer saw is doing now after some break in.


----------



## blsnelling (Jan 20, 2015)

I noticed the same as well. That was a customers saw. My personal saw still only has a MM and has only made a couple test cuts.


----------



## MustangMike (Jan 20, 2015)

I removed the muffler screen in my 362 C, but it was while it was still breaking in, so not sure how much difference it made. Possibly, that is why I liked it so much. That is all that is in that upper left corner, the screen and the port.

I left that port stock, but eventually added another on the opposite side, which Randy opened even more when he ported it.


----------



## SAWMIKAZE (Jan 20, 2015)

It didnt make a big difference mike


----------



## wyk (Jan 20, 2015)

I think I found an old vid I did before I started to have carb problems, and before she was ported. But, more importantly, I think I still have that exact same piece of wood in the pile that hasn't been touched since. I'll try and do a belated before and after tomorrow.


----------



## MustangMike (Jan 20, 2015)

The saw kept getting stronger as it was breaking in, so it was tough to figure if it made much difference. I was just glad it got stronger.


----------



## wyk (Jan 21, 2015)

Well, there's a result. So, OK. Same piece of Ash in both vids. I found this piece while I was thinning the pile yesterday and thought it looked familiar. This vid has the 241 with several tanks after a muffler mod on a 14"Stihl (AKA 13") bar with full chisel non NK 325 chain at the start. The second cut in the vid is with a 17" bar with semi chisel NK chain and ported.



Muffler modded saw is ~10.1 seconds. Ported is at ~5.5 seconds.


----------



## wyk (Jan 21, 2015)

I found this interesting:



Are any of you this guy? If you listen, you can hear the thing has a slight bog off idle.


----------



## Time's Standing Stihl (Jan 21, 2015)

After he starts up from hitting the chain brake, I would call that more than a slight bog. Sounds like chit


----------



## wyk (Jan 22, 2015)

Time's Standing Stihl said:


> After he starts up from hitting the chain brake, I would call that more than a slight bog. Sounds like chit



I sent a message to the guy. He says the bog can be bad.

But I noticed something the last few days that affected the bog. So, today I spent all day practicing it to see if there was a difference. When I let the 241 sit in the past, if she was canted at any sort of angle, she had no bog off idle. Today I tried sitting it on it's clutch side when she had to idle, and then normally upright. EVERY time I picked her up canted, she responded like she should have. Upright often ended up in a bog off idle. I ask Treewise if he noticed the same thing. We'll see if he gets back to me. So... pooling? I dunno.

12-15 tanks now since new carb last Saturday. Lots of big wood, too. She has loads of torque. Here she was yesterday in a good sized(and usually not 40cc class wood) seasoned Beech:



Bit of a pinch on the bottom as that is not really a sawhorse for larger logs.


----------



## Spectre468 (Jan 29, 2015)

I'm thinking about going to look at one of these tomorrow. MMMMMmmmm M-tronic! Alloy crankcase, great air filtration, fantastic reviews. Talk me out of bring it home! Plastic clutch cover without chip deflector, single bar stud mount, spur sprocket, WAY too expensive for what it is, especially with all the "downgraded" parts...


----------



## Stihl99 (Jan 29, 2015)

Spectre468 said:


> I'm thinking about going to look at one of these tomorrow. MMMMMmmmm M-tronic! Alloy crankcase, great air filtration, fantastic reviews. Talk me out of bring it home! Plastic clutch cover without chip deflector, single bar stud mount, spur sprocket, WAY too expensive for what it is, especially with all the "downgraded" parts...


Oh that little guy would look so nice sitting next to your 661R like a little brother wouldn't it, so be sure to get plenty of pics when you get it home.
Did that help any?


----------



## KG441c (Jan 29, 2015)

Spectre468 said:


> I'm thinking about going to look at one of these tomorrow. MMMMMmmmm M-tronic! Alloy crankcase, great air filtration, fantastic reviews. Talk me out of bring it home! Plastic clutch cover without chip deflector, single bar stud mount, spur sprocket, WAY too expensive for what it is, especially with all the "downgraded" parts...


I dont like the plastic clutch cover either but it works. U can modify a regular clutch cover to fit it, and make a dummy nut with a captive nut to cover the back hole. The single bar nut tightens and works just fine though and the spur sprocket can be swapped out for a rim. Remember the 16" 3005 mount bar that comes with it really isnt 16" its more like 14.5". If u want a true 16" of bar get the 3005 mount stihl 18" picco bar or a cannon supermini 16" in the c1 mount. The saw is light, agile, and awesome with a muffler mod though


----------



## wyk (Jan 29, 2015)

KG441c said:


> I dont like the plastic clutch cover either but it works. U can modify a regular clutch cover to fit it, and make a dummy nut with a captive nut to cover the back hole. The single bar nut tightens and works just fine though and the spur sprocket can be swapped out for a rim. Remember the 16" 3005 mount bar that comes with it really isnt 16" its more like 14.5". If u want a true 16" of bar get the 3005 mount stihl 18" picco bar or a cannon supermini 16" in the c1 mount. The saw is light, agile, and awesome with a muffler mod though



Or get the Stihl 18" in 3005. It's at about 16.5" or so.


----------



## KG441c (Jan 29, 2015)

Thats what I have Reindeer is the 3005 stihl 18". Oddly the Cannon 16" is over 16" also


----------



## wyk (Jan 29, 2015)

KG441c said:


> Thats what I have Reindeer is the 3005 stihl 18". Oddly the Cannon 16" is over 16" also



But it's not a Husky!


----------



## KG441c (Jan 29, 2015)

Id take the Cannon bar any day over any other personally. None of them compare to the Cannons


----------



## wyk (Jan 29, 2015)

I would have a cannon, too. But it is very expensive here. I am already thinking on my next bar. The husqvarna pixel is not up to the task of firewood duty. It's hell on any bar, really. But I see one more month, maybe two for this Husky. What you see in the pic above is the firewood for this week alone. 

The tip has two greaser holes, which is odd. I notice it goes dry sooner than my Oregons do. I use the synthetic stuff we put into the tractors, etc about the estate. Tips still feels good when I spin it by hand.


----------



## wyk (Jan 29, 2015)

Then there's this - Spruce blow downs. Between 20-24" in size DBH. We had maybe 8 of them. All freed from their rootballs and limbed with the 241. I wanna say, the drawback to semi chisel is it doesn't limb nearly as well as full chisel. But it does last a lon time in dirty circumstances, which most of the time I am in. However, for spruce duty, I would have preferred full chisel.



Also, another firewood pic:


----------



## Spectre468 (Jan 29, 2015)

Well, my dealer didn't have one in stock. Stopped at a couple other places, too, same story.


----------



## KG441c (Jan 29, 2015)

Spectre468 said:


> Well, my dealer didn't have one in stock. Stopped at a couple other places, too, same story.


Thats a bummer!!


----------



## Spectre468 (Jan 30, 2015)

KG441c said:


> Thats a bummer!!


Yes and no. I'm still not 100% sold on the saw, and it's really pricey for what it is. Had I been able to get my hands on one today, I may have walked away from it all the same. That's why I didn't have them order one today for pick up next week.


----------



## MustangMike (Jan 30, 2015)

I've never run one, but I see that a lot of people are impressed with them. I think the 241 and 661 are getting about the highest percentage of favorable reviews of all the Stihl saws.


----------



## wyk (Jan 30, 2015)

I see the 241 as a very niche saw for professionals. A 40cc saw for $500+ is a big ask of any amateur. Especially when a 550xp, which weighs just 11 ounces or so more, and has MUCH more power and rev boost(which this 241 is sorely lacking), is in the same price range. This thing is for all day use, every day, clearing trees and large brush. If I only had that job on occasion, and I wasn't a pro, I would much prefer the 550, and even a 261. The gap in power is cavernous. Hell, I still would prefer a 261 with an MM to this saw as it is. It is just more capable. Hell, I would actually rather have a Shindaiwa 452S or 502S, or Echo 500P, to be honest. Those all weigh the same as this 241 and cost nearly $200 less here, and are lasers in your hand.


----------



## VinceGU05 (Jan 30, 2015)

Over $1200 for a 241 down under !


----------



## wyk (Jan 30, 2015)

VinceGU05 said:


> Over $1200 for a 241 down under !



They are nearly $800 msrp here.  The Shindaiwa 452S is $500. 500P's are 600 smacks.

I'll put it this way - I have this 241 because the original owner wanted to get rid of it for a 261.


----------



## wyk (Jan 30, 2015)

Here's the results in filtration of nearly a week of firewood and falling duty:


----------



## KG441c (Jan 30, 2015)

Reindeer I think u have something wacky with that saw? Mine doesnt lack in acceleration at all?


----------



## wyk (Jan 30, 2015)

KG441c said:


> Reindeer I think u have something wacky with that saw? Mine doesnt lack in acceleration at all?



It has a bit of hesitation still off throttle here and there. I'll have to see a newer one before I can't decide if I like it or not. Even so, the weight savings aren't worth the power differential between it and 50cc saws - especially since an Echo 500P/Shindaiwa 452S weigh the same and have more displacement, and potentially more power and responsiveness.


----------



## KG441c (Jan 30, 2015)

I guess its all in perception of what each does and wants in a saw. I had the ported 026 and ported 261 and a ported 362c. The 026 or 261 just doesnt feel small to me so I flipped them both and got the 241c and hadnt regretted it yet


----------



## KG441c (Jan 30, 2015)

I havent come across anything yet that I felt the 026,261 could do that the 241 couldnt and if so I just grab the 362c or 262xp


----------



## KG441c (Jan 30, 2015)

A ported 262xp will make anyone a light , well handling firewood saw


----------



## MustangMike (Jan 30, 2015)

Keith, how do the 362 and 262 compare in wt & power?


----------



## wyk (Jan 30, 2015)

KG441c said:


> I guess its all in perception of what each does and wants in a saw. I had the ported 026 and ported 261 and a ported 362c. The 026 or 261 just doesnt feel small to me so I flipped them both and got the 241c and hadnt regretted it yet



The problem with the 241 really showed the last couple of days in work for me. It maxes out under 14K or so before the MT richens her up and caps her off. She has a load of torque for bucking up wood and felling, but loses way out on the top end for limbing compared to other 40 and 50cc rivals. If you spend any time limbing, you know a few more rpms up top make a big difference in how fast you can limb. So, basically, I use it as an all around torquey little ground saw. And it does the job. Would I buy one? Nah - especially not after having to replace the carb on my own dime just 3 years after she was manufactured. If this thing starts to act up again, she will be sold as a parts saw. It will be replaced with a ported 452S or 500P most likely. Hell, those don't even have caps on their H screws in this country.


----------



## KG441c (Jan 30, 2015)

MustangMike said:


> Keith, how do the 362 and 262 compare in wt & power?


Mike I will have to weigh both saws for u in a few but I have bridges in the 262 which the 262 is alil racier and snappy but the 362c has alil more torque. Very close to me. The 262 fells lighter and easier handling though


----------



## KG441c (Jan 30, 2015)

reindeer said:


> The problem with the 241 really showed the last couple of days in work for me. It maxes out under 14K or so before the MT richens her up and caps her off. She has a load of torque for bucking up wood and felling, but loses way out on the top end for limbing compared to other 40 and 50cc rivals. If you spend any time limbing, you know a few more rpms up top make a big difference in how fast you can limb. So, basically, I use it as an all around torquey little ground saw. And it does the job. Would I buy one? Nah - especially not after having to replace the carb on my own dime just 3 years after she was manufactured. If this thing starts to act up again, she will be sold as a parts saw. It will be replaced with a ported 452S or 500P most likely. Hell, those don't even have caps on their H screws in this country.


If u r strictly gonna limb maybe a rim sprocket kit with a 8 pin and 3/8 picco chain?? Big difference


----------



## MustangMike (Jan 30, 2015)

May be that outboard clutch.


----------



## wyk (Jan 30, 2015)

KG441c said:


> A ported 262xp will make anyone a light , well handling firewood saw



A ported 261 makes a 362 redundant. I would like one to compliment my ported 044.



That is with simply removing the baffle - a 30% improvement in an already decent performing saw. 

This is how it is ported - 42-45% difference, with loads of torque. Strongest 50cc saw I have ever used(and I have used plenty of them), and I ain't even Mastermind. I just watch his threads. No compression mod, either. 189 psi from the factory. I am starting to notice saws here have more compression than stateside. You would be hard-pressed to find 89 octane in many places in the EU, let alone 87. Our lowest here is 95.


----------



## wyk (Jan 30, 2015)

KG441c said:


> If u r strictly gonna limb maybe a rim sprocket kit with a 8 pin and 3/8 picco chain?? Big difference



Exactly - I would have to modify the saw for limbing. Then lose the attributes I need for cutting. Nah, I'll go with a saw better made for such work instead next time out.


----------



## KG441c (Jan 30, 2015)

MustangMike said:


> Keith, how do the 362 and 262 compare in wt & power?


All r fueled and full of oil


----------



## wyk (Jan 30, 2015)

Yer right, tho - the 261 weighs significantly more than the 241...


----------



## MustangMike (Jan 30, 2015)

Your ported 261 looks very strong, but I'm sure a ported 362 has more guts.

How do you like that ported 044?


----------



## MustangMike (Jan 30, 2015)

Keith, looks like you added a metal skid plate under that 362???


----------



## KG441c (Jan 30, 2015)

MustangMike said:


> Keith, looks like you added a metal skid plate under that 362???


I did Mustang so thats a few ounces more. I still like the ported 362c better all around but the 262s center of weight is carried lower as opposed to the 362 feeling more topheavy if that makes sense?


----------



## wyk (Jan 30, 2015)

MustangMike said:


> Your ported 261 looks very strong, but I'm sure a ported 362 has more guts.
> 
> How do you like that ported 044?



It better have more guts. It's got more weight.

For a one saw plan, yeah, a 362 makes sense. Or in Keith's case, a 241/362. But since I have 4-5' DBH trees here and there, I need a ported 044. That means there's no room for a 362. But a 261 would fit in perfectly.


----------



## wyk (Jan 30, 2015)

KG441c said:


> I did Mustang so thats a few ounces more. I still like the ported 362c better all around but the 262s center of weight is carried lower as opposed to the 362 feeling more topheavy if that makes sense?



I have owned a Mastermind 262. I would prefer a MMWS 261CM to that 262 any freakin day of the week(or one of my own), and I would be running 3/8 20" bars on it all day long.

I prefer the 261CM not because it is lighter, but because it is much stronger.


----------



## KG441c (Jan 30, 2015)

I actually worry more about balance than I do weight. I prefer a neutral balanced setup for limbing and alil tip heavy for bucking


----------



## KG441c (Jan 30, 2015)

reindeer said:


> It better have more guts. It's got more weight.
> 
> For a one saw plan, yeah, a 362 makes sense. Or in Keith's case, a 241/362. But since I have 4-5' DBH trees here and there, I need a ported 044. That means there's no room for a 362. But a 261 would fit in perfectly.


As much wood as u cut one would need what feels good ,works good all day and gets the job done. Thats probably different for all people. Heck I just fool around cutting firewood, cutting a few cants , and alota noodling


----------



## wyk (Jan 30, 2015)

Speaking of cutting wood. I got a bit to do before I can call this a weekend. Hasta la vista.


----------



## MustangMike (Jan 30, 2015)

Reindeer, How do U like that ported 044????


----------



## wyk (Jan 30, 2015)

MustangMike said:


> Reindeer, How do U like that ported 044????



It's an MMWS special with bridge ports and lathe work done. She gets on - 30" bar in beech:



And this is some very heavy and hard oak I just bucked up to fuel the stove in the estate owner's house(pardon the shiddi images - my phones about dead)


:


----------



## KG441c (Jan 30, 2015)

The 044 looks really good


----------



## wyk (Jan 30, 2015)

KG441c said:


> All r fueled and full of oilView attachment 399309
> View attachment 399311
> View attachment 399310



Fueled and oiled with a Stihl 25" "E" Rollomaddic - 20lbs on the dot:


----------



## wyk (Jan 30, 2015)

23lbs with the 30" Iggesund bar and full comp chain - almost flickable


----------



## blsnelling (Jan 30, 2015)

reindeer said:


> I see the 241 as a very niche saw for professionals. A 40cc saw for $500+ is a big ask of any amateur. Especially when a 550xp, which weighs just 11 ounces or so more, and has MUCH more power and rev boost(which this 241 is sorely lacking), is in the same price range. This thing is for all day use, every day, clearing trees and large brush. If I only had that job on occasion, and I wasn't a pro, I would much prefer the 550, and even a 261. The gap in power is cavernous. Hell, I still would prefer a 261 with an MM to this saw as it is. It is just more capable. Hell, I would actually rather have a Shindaiwa 452S or 502S, or Echo 500P, to be honest. Those all weigh the same as this 241 and cost nearly $200 less here, and are lasers in your hand.


I agree entirely. While it's a great little saw, it's WAY too close in size and weight to a 346/550, with way less power. I actually already sold mine.


----------



## KG441c (Jan 30, 2015)

reindeer said:


> 23lbs with the 30" Iggesund bar and full comp chain - almost flickable




Ported 461r with 28" es light


----------



## wyk (Jan 30, 2015)

The 461 is my next saw. I liked it back when I tried the prototype dave keith had in Enniskerry.


----------



## KG441c (Jan 30, 2015)

reindeer said:


> The 461 is my next saw. I liked it back when I tried the prototype dave keith had in Enniskerry.


My 441c was nice but the 461 has a broader torque curve for sure


----------



## wyk (Jan 30, 2015)

blsnelling said:


> I agree entirely. While it's a great little saw, it's WAY too close in size and weight to a 346/550, with way less power. I actually already sold mine.



Any suggestions on how to clear the off idle bog?


----------



## blsnelling (Jan 30, 2015)

reindeer said:


> Any suggestions on how to clear the off idle bog?


Adjust the L needle 

I haven't noticed it, but don't have a lot of run time on them.


----------



## VinceGU05 (Jan 30, 2015)

blsnelling said:


> Adjust the L needle
> 
> I haven't noticed it, but don't have a lot of run time on them.


It's a cm saw.


----------



## MustangMike (Jan 30, 2015)

He knew, he is just bustin em a bit.


----------



## blsnelling (Jan 30, 2015)

VinceGU05 said:


> It's a cm saw.


That's why I put the smiley.


----------



## VinceGU05 (Jan 30, 2015)

uh ha ! should have used this one


----------



## Joe Kidd (Jan 30, 2015)

blsnelling said:


> That's why I put the smiley.


No "hidden" screw on the 241/261 carb like the 550?


----------



## blsnelling (Jan 30, 2015)

Joe Kidd said:


> No "hidden" screw on the 241/261 carb like the 550?


Not that I have found. I haven't had the need to though. I give all 550s a 1/4 turn as standard procedure.


----------



## KG441c (Jan 30, 2015)

blsnelling said:


> Not that I have found. I haven't had the need to though. I give all 550s a 1/4 turn as standard procedure.


Mine is quick off idle. No hesitation? Id like to know whats goin on with Reindeers though


----------



## Time's Standing Stihl (Jan 30, 2015)

Fast forward to around 2:45 seems like this stock one that randy was using loaded up after a long idle. Maybe its a more common issue???


----------



## KG441c (Jan 30, 2015)

Time's Standing Stihl said:


> Fast forward to around 2:45 seems like this stock one that randy was using loaded up after a long idle. Maybe its a more common issue???



Wow! Not sure why anyone would want anything for limbing any better than that!!


----------



## Stihl99 (Jan 31, 2015)

KG441c said:


> Wow! Not sure why anyone would want anything for limbing any better than that!!


I agree that little saw was sure eating some wood. I think it did excellent job limbing out that tree.


----------



## KG441c (Jan 31, 2015)

Stihl99 said:


> I agree that little saw was sure eating some wood. I think it did excellent job limbing out that tree.


I cant find anything about mine I dislike . Its perfect for what it is, a small saw, plus I like the mtronics!


----------



## wyk (Jan 31, 2015)

Time's Standing Stihl said:


> Fast forward to around 2:45 seems like this stock one that randy was using loaded up after a long idle. Maybe its a more common issue???




According to Randy, it was common with the earlier models. The one I have is a 2012 model. The bog can be very bad at times.


----------



## KG441c (Jan 31, 2015)

reindeer said:


> According to Randy, it was common with the earlier models. The one I have is a 2012 model. The bog can be very bad at times.


Hmmmmm!! Hadnt heard that. Glad I got a new one! Maybe that explains the .023 squish and 172psi from the factory on newer ones too?? I checked the compression again yesterday. 171psi. Heck I dont see a need to port this one really


----------



## ktoom (Jan 31, 2015)

reindeer said:


> According to Randy, it was common with the earlier models. The one I have is a 2012 model. The bog can be very bad at times.



2012 model? The saw just came to the U.S. In 2014.... Just curious?


----------



## wyk (Jan 31, 2015)

ktoom said:


> 2012 model? The saw just came to the U.S. In 2014.... Just curious?



You answered your own question, really.



KG441c said:


> Hmmmmm!! Hadnt heard that. Glad I got a new one! Maybe that explains the .023 squish and 172psi from the factory on newer ones too?? I checked the compression again yesterday. 171psi. Heck I dont see a need to port this one really



This one has healthy compression. Still, I may remove the gasket if I ever have cause to break her down again. As it is, she runs fine - aside from the occasional bog off idle. The 261 in my videos has a .034 or so squish and 189 psi compression. It's almost always cold and dense air here, so saws usually perform very well.

Also, when I first took down the rakers on this carlton NK chain I realised it musta been silly low from the factory. I have a .025 guide I use on my chain, and it wasn't deep enough to touch the rakers after 4-5 sharpenings. That chain must have been about .030+ from the factory. It was a bit grabby. Once the top end seated in, I was able to bring the rakers back up to .030. She seems happy with that, even buried in oak now.


----------



## wyk (Jan 31, 2015)

KG441c said:


> Wow! Not sure why anyone would want anything for limbing any better than that!!



You should see me limb a big spruce with the ported 044... it embarasses that 241.


----------



## ktoom (Jan 31, 2015)

reindeer said:


> You answered your own question, really.



Sorry didnt realize you live in a diff country!!!! Lolol. Party on!!!! Viewing this on mobile app.


----------



## MustangMike (Jan 31, 2015)

I should hope a ported 044 out performs a 241! Heck, an not ported 10 mm 044 will out perform a ported 362. Size does matter!


----------



## lone wolf (Jan 31, 2015)

MustangMike said:


> I should hope a ported 044 out performs a 241! Heck, an not ported 10 mm 044 will out perform a ported 362. Size does matter!


Try them in small branches.


----------



## MustangMike (Jan 31, 2015)

I'm not advocating using the bigger saw for limbing, but if you can wield it, it should cut better!

IMO, comparing a 044 to a 241 was just weird!


----------



## wyk (Jan 31, 2015)

MustangMike said:


> I should hope a ported 044 out performs a 241! Heck, an not ported 10 mm 044 will out perform a ported 362. Size does matter!



I'm not talking about the power, but the responsiveness. My 044 is more revvy and quicker than that 241 in the vid.

One of the thing some seem to miss about a limbing saw is the thing is meant to be responsive. Unless ported, the 241 is not what I would call responsive. Same with most stock saws that are strato charged, and even some ported ones.


----------



## wyk (Jan 31, 2015)

MustangMike said:


> I should hope a ported 044 out performs a 241! Heck, an not ported 10 mm 044 will out perform a ported 362. Size does matter!



Not limbing, it won't. The best limbing saw I ever used was a Wicked Work Saw 361 with 210 psi. That thing was a laser.

I wonder how many people fascinated with 10mm 044's have ever used them. I've used them - my bog stock 046 kicked it's ass four ways to sunday, and a muffler modded 372 wasn't far behind it. It's not suddenly a ported 044 - it's just a slightly more stout 044 is all.


----------



## MustangMike (Jan 31, 2015)

My 046 would not out run my 10 mm 044s stock. I understand the 1st yr 046s have different port timing, and perhaps foreign ones do also. Ditto for my bother's 460, and another one that was at the GTG. Ported, the 046 really woke up, and IMO is a really impressive saw.

Care to share your 046 SN? Also, did it come with a dp? (some did). When I saw an experienced AS member post that a dp muff and filter could make a 044 run a s strong as an 046 I was skeptical, I am not skeptical any more, that guy knew what he was talking about.


----------



## wyk (Jan 31, 2015)

460's were never very strong.







Hell if I know what the serial # was. I used to have a video of a 10mm 044 vs 046/372 etc. The 044 was strong. But acting like it was ported? nah.


----------



## MustangMike (Jan 31, 2015)

Looks like a nice saw. I never said they run like they are ported, they just run very well for not being ported. If you are looking for a used saw and don't have the funds to get it ported, a 10 mm 044 or 1st yr 046 would be high on my list of saws to look for.


----------



## wyk (Jan 31, 2015)

blsnelling said:


> Adjust the L needle
> 
> I haven't noticed it, but don't have a lot of run time on them.



I'm considering boring out the carb...


----------



## wyk (Jan 31, 2015)

Spectre468 said:


> Yes and no. I'm still not 100% sold on the saw, and it's really pricey for what it is. Had I been able to get my hands on one today, I may have walked away from it all the same. That's why I didn't have them order one today for pick up next week.



http://www.baileysonline.com/Chains...1-Chainsaw-with-14-Bar-and-Chain-NON-CARB.axd

Jis sayin...


----------



## KG441c (Jan 31, 2015)

reindeer said:


> I'm not talking about the power, but the responsiveness. My 044 is more revvy and quicker than that 241 in the vid.
> 
> One of the thing some seem to miss about a limbing saw is the thing is meant to be responsive. Unless ported, the 241 is not what I would call responsive. Same with most stock saws that are strato charged, and even some ported ones.


I may disagree on this one. All my saws r ported except the 241 but they r all very responsive


----------



## Spectre468 (Feb 1, 2015)

reindeer said:


> http://www.baileysonline.com/Chains...1-Chainsaw-with-14-Bar-and-Chain-NON-CARB.axd
> 
> Jis sayin...



Yeah, but its only half the hp output, and no M-tronic...


----------



## wyk (Feb 1, 2015)

Spectre468 said:


> Yeah, but its only half the hp output, and no M-tronic...



But 1/3 the cost! Gowan! You want it!


----------



## KG441c (Feb 1, 2015)

Alil high but an awesome saw!!


----------



## wyk (Feb 1, 2015)

I need bigger dawgs for buckin


----------



## wyk (Feb 3, 2015)

Enjoy some birds singing.



After I let it idle, im showing how it can bog , but only if it is sitting upright. 
Rakers are at .030. She seems to like them low. The first cut is to show how much you can lean in to it.


----------



## wyk (Feb 3, 2015)

KG441c said:


> View attachment 399892
> Alil high but an awesome saw!!



Is that 68DL?


----------



## KG441c (Feb 3, 2015)

Yes 68dl c1 mount which is universal for stihl 3003 and husky 95 mounts


----------



## wyk (Feb 5, 2015)

Remember when I Said I needed 325 for dirty conditions. Well, how about filthy? This is me today:






Fishing an ash, a beech, and a chestnut - all fallen down, all in the pig stie.


----------



## wyk (Feb 5, 2015)

Heh, I like how the oak on the right makes all the trees look small. Let me put it this way, the oak directly in front of you in that pic that the beech is behind is 2' DBH. The left limb on the oak to the right on the corner of the stie is larger than the oak in the middle.


----------



## wyk (Feb 10, 2015)

Got me some full chisel, standard kerf, 325 chain. Whatcha think?


----------



## wyk (Feb 12, 2015)

This ought to make Keith happy. I did this today while I was working on a few other saws on the estate:


----------



## wyk (Feb 14, 2015)

New port timing numbers. More intake, less exhaust. Same transfers. Compression at 188. Squish set to .018".



That is in Larch and English Oak. That Oak isn't quite as hard as the ash I have been cutting lately. But in it's defense, the ash I have been collecting is mature and been growing in a dry area, so is quite hard for ash.


----------



## KG441c (Feb 14, 2015)

Looks great


----------



## KG441c (Feb 14, 2015)

.


reindeer said:


> This ought to make Keith happy. I did this today while I was working on a few other saws on the estate:
> 
> View attachment 402957


I like permatex motoseal and locktite 518. Never had a problem with either


----------



## wyk (Feb 14, 2015)

KG441c said:


> .
> 
> I like permatex motoseal and locktite 518. Never had a problem with either



518 is ridiculously expensive here. No permatex at all. Hyalomar seems to be the standard. 3b 1104 is the same thing is yamabond4. The newer stuff has no lead in it. 1104 does. Wooo! I'm running on leaded! BTW, that vid is using standard kerf 325 70DL chain.


----------



## KG441c (Feb 14, 2015)

Did the hesitation disappear ?


----------



## wyk (Feb 14, 2015)

KG441c said:


> Did the hesitation disappear ?



Nope. It's hidden somewhere in the electronics is my guess.


----------



## KG441c (Feb 14, 2015)

Ya I have a friend thats having trouble with his new 261c not having torque and revving out. He said cylinder, piston, rings look good, chain turns freely , filter r clean, no kinked lines? My guess was the solenoid


----------



## wyk (Feb 14, 2015)

It's frustrating when electronics act up.

In other news - I've found that this thing likes you to run the rakers low to take advantage of the torque. You can see the chip size has increased. The saw is now cutting at about where a stock 261cm cuts. So it's next B&C will be standard 325. That husky pixel bar has nearly had it after a month of firewood.


----------



## KG441c (Feb 14, 2015)

Yes I did notice the larger chips! Thoso 241s do have torque for their size dont they


----------



## wyk (Feb 14, 2015)

I am impressed now. I knew bringing back the squish would help, but I think a lot of it also had to do with more intake and less exhaust timing. Very few saws like more exhaust timing, I've found. Well, not unless you are purely cookie cutting. So now she has a ton of torque. And that's only the first tank since I have put her back together. If the last time was any indication, she should be awake in about 10 more tanks. She's already revving way up there. 

I was felling ash and a larch yesterday, and she was eating through the wood so fast, I nearly lost my hinges.


----------



## KG441c (Feb 14, 2015)

Nothing like porting one yourself and being impressed with it


----------



## wyk (Feb 14, 2015)

Well, let's be honest, Randy and Brad gave me the numbers  All I did was butcher the saw.


----------



## KG441c (Feb 14, 2015)

Ive seen both #s for each porter and the #s r quite different. What were the #s u went with?


----------



## wyk (Feb 14, 2015)

I went with randy's transfer #'s and exhaust, and added a touch more intake than Randy suggested because the width was jis so small, and I was curious to see what the results would be. 
I also noticed I hadn't thoroughly gutted the baffle in this saw. So, I went in again and also opened the exhaust port another mm just for kicks. She sounds a bit different now. Much more growly. Almost as though it had two cylinders. Especially when the limiter kicks in.


----------



## wyk (Aug 27, 2015)

I'll just leave this here...







Ya can't say I've been easy on her. That's an 18" picco set up, too.


----------



## MCW (Aug 27, 2015)

reindeer said:


> I'll just leave this here...
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Looks Photoshopped to me.


----------



## wyk (Aug 27, 2015)

MCW said:


> Looks Photoshopped to me.



Swear it's real. Nearly 25 minutes of non stop cutting there.(And behind that stack of Chestnut in the distance is a pool of small rounds 5 high, 10 foot deep. We been busy during that 25 minutes)


----------



## MCW (Aug 27, 2015)

reindeer said:


> Swear it's real. Nearly 25 minutes of non stop cutting there.(And behind that stack of Chestnut in the distance is a pool of small rounds 5 high, 10 foot deep. We been busy during that 25 minutes)



I reckon all the logs are 2 inches round and you've used photo trickery


----------



## wyk (Aug 27, 2015)

MCW said:


> I reckon all the logs are 2 inches round and you've used photo trickery



It's the old Irish tiny PineyOakChestnutBeechAsh tree forced perspective trick. That saw isn't casting a shadow...


----------



## MCW (Aug 27, 2015)

reindeer said:


> It's the old Irish tiny PineyOakChestnutBeechAsh tree forced perspective trick. That saw isn't casting a shadow...



And that American flag looks like it's in a Hollywood studio...
Suspect at best


----------



## wyk (Aug 28, 2015)

I would think noodling beech with a 241 on an 18" bar constitutes a bit of abuse.


----------



## wyk (Aug 28, 2015)

The problem with picco is it doesn't last very long on full chisel. I need to get me some semi chisel stuff to see if it will work for firewood. I like it because it makes a small kerf, and leaves more wood. But the 325 still lasts noticably longer. And 325 is actually faster in NK version on this set up because it's a 7 pin VS the picco's 6(swapped out the picco set up, everything - including the clutch drum, from a 250 parts saw a local farmer gave me). But geziz the torque this thing has for a 42cc saw with a 6 pin sprocket. When there's a pinch or the wood is hard, it makes that chugga-chugga sound ported saws make.


----------



## wyk (Aug 28, 2015)

Well, why read about it when you can see about it.


----------



## Flip D (Aug 28, 2015)

I'd be interested in the picco 18" semi chisel set up. I have a 339xp that I use for a brush and limber for the farm but after using a 562(with an EL46 carb), I'm sold on the electronic carbs. The only thing that worries me, it that we used to have a MS250 with a picco setup and it seemed like I was always sharpening the chain.


----------



## SquareFile (Aug 28, 2015)

Was there any gains with the 8t rim?

Was any gains made square filed?

I gave up after about 20 pages.


----------



## wyk (Aug 31, 2015)

Well, speak of the devil. The farmer arrived the other day with a loop of picco semi chisel. Only problem is it has 63 or 64 links. Dunno what he could have been using it on. And since it seems to have never been used, I can only assume it was the wrong size to start with. I'll try and have her shortened soon and try it out. I also noticed the bar oil was going down much slower than usual. My NK shares the same .050 channel, so I went and checked out the oil passages. The hole in the picco bar is nearly half the size as is my NK bar. So I opened it up a bit just to make sure there wouldn't be any problems here since the 241 is ported.


----------



## wyk (Sep 28, 2015)

OK, ran the semi and the full chisel picco. I think I got a pic of the ash I had to process today on another Estate friendly to ours across the River Suir in Tipperary... That is Slievenamon in the background. The mountain my Estate is at the base of is the Comeraghs. 












You can just about see the saw in the second pic. The limb was starting to pull from from the trunk, so I set her free earlier today. It measured about 18" or so in width where I made the felling cut. A lot ff wood to process with a lil 241. Good thing it's ported.

The semi chisel lasts MUCH longer than the full picco, and it also is much more forgiving if a tooth is damaged. But I think we all knew that. The benefits were reach more than speed. Since I have a 6 pin rim, I can't really compare it to my 7 pin 325 set up(especially since it is faster on a 325 set up). What I can say is, 325 lasts much longer. Far longer. In fact, 325 cuts more, faster, longer in full chisel than semi chisel picco does on this set up. Now, bear in mind I am also taking advantage of the 6 pin picco rim by putting the rakers down to .030.

Another disappointing thing about picco is once the tooth is about half gone, the cutting doesn't improve. And if the tooth loses much more than that, the cutting degrades, even with low rakers. Whereas with 325, it is at it's best the less cutter there is until you are very low. So, I feel unless you simply do not have the torque to pull it, that 325 wins all over the place.


----------



## wyk (Sep 29, 2015)

I may have spoke too soon regarding that semi chisel lasting longer...


----------

