# Remove rakers?



## MNBobcat (Sep 21, 2011)

A friend said he knows someone who when he buys a new chain the first thing he does is grind the rakers off. I know rakers are supposed to prevent kick-back. Just wondering if any of you remove the rakers rather than grind them a little at a time?


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## Deets066 (Sep 21, 2011)

Not a great idea if you ask me, one its dangerous, and two a properly maintained chain usually cuts the best and stays shaper for a longer period oif time.


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## dingeryote (Sep 21, 2011)

Ummm...your friend knows some guy who is fixing to get dead or mangled, at some not too distant point in the future.
In addition, never buy a saw from this genious.

Have a distant cousin that did the same dumbassed thing. He got cocky bucking a good sized log, and now the guy puts his teeth in a glass at night. The rakers are there to control the depth or bite, that the cutters take, and have nothing to do with "Kickback".

They do however keep the saw from busting the chain, the crank from snapping off, and clutches from getting fried every other week. LOTS of big money, and a bazillion hours of engineer time, plus a bazillion hours of saw geek time have gone into figuring the most efficient raker height. Not one of 'em has come to the conclusion that Rakers need to be removed, for any reason.

Next time ya hear that sorta stuff, just grin and agree, and DON'T run thier saw or stand near 'em when they do.

Stay safe!
Dingeryote


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## Slamm (Sep 21, 2011)

In short, removing or excessive lowering of the rakers, is dumb and counterproductive.

Sam


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## DangerTree (Sep 21, 2011)

A chain with no raker's will bind instantly! It will not cut faster. A chain with no raker's is garbage. 

There is no safe place for stupid people in the tree business!!


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## mingo (Sep 21, 2011)

Well if he did he must not have made a cut because if he did he would be telling everyone what a bad idea that was.


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## MNBobcat (Sep 21, 2011)

The guy has been doing it that way for years and never had a problem. I didn't think it was a great idea, but was mostly curious if anyone else had tried it.

I take a little off the tops of the rakers when they need it. I have an electric sharpener but it doesn't work great for the rakers. Hand filing them is so darned slow.


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## 8433jeff (Sep 21, 2011)

MNBobcat said:


> The guy has been doing it that way for years and never had a problem. I didn't think it was a great idea, but was mostly curious if anyone else had tried it.
> 
> I take a little off the tops of the rakers when they need it. I have an electric sharpener but it doesn't work great for the rakers. Hand filing them is so darned slow.


 
Time taken to file them properly is time saved squared in cutting efficiency. Not to mention the aggravation saved trying to cut with a saw with a chain that keeps stalling or breaking down clutch wise. 
Maybe he has the bumper link and raker terminology mixed up; if hes filing the bumper link out of existence, why not buy chain with out them or at least a different style of them?


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## madhatte (Sep 21, 2011)

8433jeff said:


> Maybe he has the bumper link and raker terminology mixed up; if hes filing the bumper link out of existence, why not buy chain with out them or at least a different style of them?


 

Beat me to it. No rakers = dangerous and ineffective. No big ol' humped bumper strap? Normal chain. I've ground a few off myself. One bit of advice: Grind 'em as evenly as possible or you'll end up with lots of vibration due to eccentric weighting.


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## Slamm (Sep 21, 2011)

I laugh at those that take the rakers down much lower than say .035, because they think they are faster, but they never take into account how many times they stall or lockup their saw on normal cuts. I watched a guy stall his saw 4 times on a 4" knot that needed to be trimmed off of a log. This after saying he takes the rakers down a lot more for bucking up, and then he couldn't ever get it restarted in the cut if he stopped.

Again, its one of the things I keep saying,"Faster by seconds and slower by minutes." Its just dumb, if its less safe than normal, so much the dumber yet, LOL, but it isn't faster. Plus how the crank or clutch lives through it is beyond me.

Sam


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## 2dogs (Sep 21, 2011)

Slamm said:


> I laugh at those that take the rakers down much lower than say .035, because they think they are faster, but they never take into account how many times they stall or lockup their saw on normal cuts. I watched a guy stall his saw 4 times on a 4" knot that needed to be trimmed off of a log. This after saying he takes the rakers down a lot more for bucking up, and then he couldn't ever get it restarted in the cut if he stopped.
> 
> Again, its one of the things I keep saying,"Faster by seconds and slower by minutes." Its just dumb, if its less safe than normal, so much the dumber yet, LOL, but it isn't faster. Plus how the crank or clutch lives through it is beyond me.
> 
> Sam


 
A new qoute for my sig line!


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## Oldtimer (Sep 21, 2011)

In pine I will take one "light" swipe off each raker of a brand new chain with my flat file, in hardwood I only take them down when I have to "push" the saw through a cut.


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## mingo (Sep 21, 2011)

I use the Carlton file-o -plate to take my rakers down works fine for me.


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## 056 kid (Sep 21, 2011)

to the OP, your buddy is a liar. .


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## 2dogs (Sep 21, 2011)

056 kid said:


> to the OP, your buddy is a liar. .


 
...or an idiot. Likely both.


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## paccity (Sep 21, 2011)

not worth a coment.......... oops i comented.


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## 056 kid (Sep 21, 2011)

2dogs said:


> ...or an idiot. Likely both.


 
I would have to agree. 
Say how are those pickled eggs doing?


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## RandyMac (Sep 21, 2011)

You can cut ice with no rakers.


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## dingeryote (Sep 21, 2011)

RandyMac said:


> You can cut ice with no rakers.


 
Yep. But the stuff needs lotsa Diesel to get it to warm up a stove.

Stay safe!
Dingeryote


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## 2dogs (Sep 21, 2011)

RandyMac said:


> You can cut ice with no rakers.


 
A chainsaw would knock over my glass. I just use cubes.


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## Billy_Bob (Sep 22, 2011)

Rakers or "depth gauges" are there for a reason. Chain saw manufacturers have engineers with years of experience who test and design these things. And they of course want theirs saws to cut as fast as possible, but as SAFELY and fast as possible!

With that said, you can buy a "depth gauge' tool like the following which is .25 and is factory spec...
Bailey's - Oregon Depth Gauge Tool

You place that on your chain and the lower portion over a raker. If you can feel the raker sticking up a bit, then you can file each raker down a bit. Maybe try two or three swipes with a flat file on all the rakers. Then check with the depth gauge tool again.

All the rakers need to be the same height, so always file all of them and file each the same number of swipes. Then they are all taken down the same amount.

And the thing is, .25 is pretty high and does not allow much of a cut, HOWEVER this height might be perfect for a harder wood like oak!

I can file them a bit lower for a softer wood, but then if I use that saw for a hard wood like oak, it can become almost uncontrollable! (Saw goes wild!)

Anyway .25 is a good starting point. But don't get very far away from that and only for softer woods.

They sell these depth gauge tools at chainsaw shops as well as online.


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## GASoline71 (Sep 22, 2011)

Rakers, shmakers... 'round here we call 'em "riders".

Gary


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## madhatte (Sep 22, 2011)

GASoline71 said:


> Rakers, shmakers... 'round here we call 'em "riders".



... or "Drags", same diff.


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## dingeryote (Sep 22, 2011)

GASoline71 said:


> Rakers, shmakers... 'round here we call 'em "riders".
> 
> Gary


 
So then whaddya call riders when they aren't Drags?

Stay safe!
Dingeryote


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## Slamm (Sep 22, 2011)

Never heard of the Riders, but I have heard of Drags and have used it sometimes, usually I just call them rakers.

Sam


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## GASoline71 (Sep 22, 2011)

All the old fallers here used to call them "riders' and "drags". I never heard them called "rakers" till I joined AS. 

Gary


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## Slamm (Sep 22, 2011)

"Bumpers" is another one.

Sam


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## lone wolf (Sep 22, 2011)

You friend is not smarter than hundreds of engineers:msp_w00t:


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## Terry L (Sep 22, 2011)

*Removing rakers is very stupid*

The reason this guy gets away with removing his rakers is because he doesn't know how to sharpen the chain properly. The cutting surface of his chain is tending to repel the wood. I only sharpen with a Silvey or Simington, always run chisel chain sharpened square ground. I also use a Silvey depth gauge machine to take down the rakers. It is about 10 times more accurate than any other method. If I screw up and take the rakers down too far that chain will grab the wood and stop moving-not productive! Even .005" makes a huge difference. 

That dude is not someone to learn anything about cutting wood from!


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## les-or-more (Sep 22, 2011)

GASoline71 said:


> Rakers, shmakers... 'round here we call 'em "riders".
> 
> Gary


 
Up here riders are the guys on the short bus


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## paccity (Sep 22, 2011)

Terry L said:


> The reason this guy gets away with removing his rakers is because he doesn't know how to sharpen the chain properly. The cutting surface of his chain is tending to repel the wood. I only sharpen with a Silvey or Simington, always run chisel chain sharpened square ground. I also use a Silvey depth gauge machine to take down the rakers. It is about 10 times more accurate than any other method. If I screw up and take the rakers down too far that chain will grab the wood and stop moving-not productive! Even .005" makes a huge difference.
> 
> That dude is not someone to learn anything about cutting wood from!


 
small world, welcom. sort through the slash and enjoy the rest. oop's noticed you've ben a member for a while.


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## mitch95100 (Sep 22, 2011)

dingeryote said:


> Ummm...your friend knows some guy who is fixing to get dead or mangled, at some not too distant point in the future.
> In addition, never buy a saw from this genious.
> 
> Have a distant cousin that did the same dumbassed thing. He got cocky bucking a good sized log, and now the guy puts his teeth in a glass at night. The rakers are there to control the depth or bite, that the cutters take, and have nothing to do with "Kickback".
> ...


 
Thats what i thought they were supposed to do if keep the cutter from taking too big a bite not kickback


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## LoggingEngineer (Sep 23, 2011)

Always heard them called riders or rakers here.....drags is new to me.


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