# Depth Gauge Tools for Saw Chain



## Philbert (May 6, 2015)

Proper setting of chain depth gauges (a.k.a. 'rakers', 'drags', etc.) is critical for good chain performance. People might disagree on the specific offset, but whatever they choose, it should be intentional.

Thought this might be a good time to start a depth gauge tool ('depth gauge gauge'?) thread.

For reference, here is a link to BobL's classic thread on progressive depth gauge settings, using a digital angle finder ('DAF') and some comments on using a Carlton File-O-Plate ('FOP'):
http://www.arboristsite.com/communi...ly-progressive-depth-raker-generators.114624/

Philbert


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## Philbert (May 6, 2015)

Kept my eye out for one of these for awhile (since seeing it in another A.S. post!) - Oregon adjustable depth gauge tool.

Have not 'played' with it yet to determine how much each 'click' changes the depth gauge setting.

Philbert


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## Philbert (May 6, 2015)

Here are the classic, fixed offset, depth gauge tools - these happen to also be Oregon products.

Depth gauge tool with 0.030" offset in one end, and 0.025" offset in the other.



'Saddle' type/ center gauge with wide opening. These work better with reduced kickback chains that have center (drive link) or side (tie strap) 'bumpers' that do not fit into the narrow slots of the end gauges.



To keep SawTroll happy, here is one of the Husqvarna roller guides with an attached depth gauge tool. This works similar to the Carlton FOP, with separate hardwood and softwood settings.



Lastly, a set of automotive feeler gauges, which can be used with a straight edge, to measure existing depth gauge offsets as well as to set them.



Philbert


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## Raganr (May 6, 2015)

Good info as always Philbert. I have been trying to use a digital angle gauge (per BobL's outstanding thread) and am still fine tuning my system. Will post a few pics tomorrow.


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## ANewSawyer (May 6, 2015)

I am using a roller guide and the built in raker guide. I am happy for now. I sharpened a new chain and it was self feeding. I think the rakers are just a bit low though.


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## KenJax Tree (May 6, 2015)

I like mine a little lower, i usually take an extra swipe or 2.


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## jwilly (May 6, 2015)

Husky also has one similar to the Carlton.


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## dsell (May 6, 2015)

I just lay the flat edge of my micrometer across them and look at the gap. I have that cheap orange depth gauge that comes with the 511 to get my eyes adjusted. I was taught on this site to cut the right rakers first on the Oregon 511 grinder, then turn the chain around backwards and cut the left. The grinder's chisel stop usually lands in the center of a rivet so I can quickly see when the raker is in the correct place. This does two things, 1. it keeps the cut depth the same from right to left, 2. the clamp holds the raker better for grinding. Disclaimer: the chain in the pictures isn't sharp and the wheel isn't my raker wheel.


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## ChoppyChoppy (May 6, 2015)

I never even noticed that little red deal has those on it. I'm sure I have a few laying around somewhere.
I usually do my saw chains at around 0.030 and the processor at 0.050. I don't get super fussy though, I've got better things to waste my time on then getting anal on saw chains.


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## MGoBlue (May 7, 2015)

Philbert, I've been using one like pictured after moving on from the Husky guide.





I've been wondering about the "classic" style recently as the above pieces are pretty thin. What's you opinion of them(classic and saddle), which style do you like best?


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## jwilly (May 7, 2015)

This one ^^^ is the same one I use, branded by Husky we sell them for $3.95 and they last quite awhile. Seems to work well and it sets the gauge off each tooth which is good for us that have one side filed smaller than the other.


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## Philbert (May 7, 2015)

MGoBlue said:


> I've been using one like pictured after moving on from the Husky guide.
> What's you opinion of them(classic and saddle), which style do you like best?



I had not seen those flat plates. Thanks. Lots of brands and variations.

I like the saddle/center style depth gauge tools a little better. They work with any kind of chain, including low kickback styles, and they seem to wobble a little less than the end gauge styles. So I have a little more confidence in them. But both of them work.

Philbert


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## blsnelling (May 7, 2015)

MGoBlue said:


> Philbert, I've been using one like pictured after moving on from the Husky guide.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


This is what I use, sold by Husqvarna. I use the Hard setting. I find the FOP to make my rakers too low and aggressive on Stihl RS chain.


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## Landmark (May 7, 2015)

Philbert said:


> 'Saddle' type/ center gauge with wide opening. .
> View attachment 423074
> 
> Philbert




I use this style. I don't get real particular. Just hit it a few licks and go saw wood.


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## Philbert (May 7, 2015)

blsnelling said:


> I find the FOP to make my rakers too low and aggressive on Stihl RS chain.


Interesting point. The fixed offset gauges give a measured setting. The FOP gauges are intended to provide a consistent angular measurement.

Neither may be exactly what you want, or you might want different settings for different wood or different saws.

If the user understands how the tools work, they can decide to 'leave it slightly proud', or 'take off a few more licks'. The feeler gauges (or other machinists' tools) can be used to be more precise.

Also good to note that the depth gauges still need to be rounded over/profiled after the height is set.

Philbert


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## treesmith (May 7, 2015)

I use the husky basic flat ones too and stihl file guides with stihl files, works well. Mastermind saws get softwood end, stock saws get hardwood end but thats with shorter bars in aussie gum


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## huskihl (May 7, 2015)

I use a flat file and automotive feeler gauges. If I put a new rs chain loop on, I lay the file flat on top of the chain, and it takes 3 swipes to get down to .030". 4 or 5 swipes to get down to .035" for the ported 7900. Like Bob said. Touch up the teeth every tank. And a recheck and couple more swipes every 5 tanks. Factory rake height works up to about 50cc imo. Everything above 60cc could use 4 passes on the rakers. 

Excellent informative post Philbert


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## Ronaldo (May 7, 2015)

blsnelling said:


> This is what I use, sold by Husqvarna. I use the Hard setting. I find the FOP to make my rakers too low and aggressive on Stihl RS chain.


Where can I find one of these flat Husqvarna plate guides? My dealer only shows the roller guide. I use a F-O-P whenever possible, but they can be kind of chain type specific.
I dont see the flat ones offered on Husqvarna website?


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## Jimmy in NC (May 7, 2015)

Part numbers from Husky:

.325 - 505 69 81-00
3/8 - 505 69 81-01
3/8LP - 505 69 81-03
.404 - 505 69 81-02

Retail price on the website is $3.95 US so don't overpay!


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## Ronaldo (May 7, 2015)

Jimmy in NC said:


> Part numbers from Husky:
> 
> .325 - 505 69 81-00
> 3/8 - 505 69 81-01
> ...


Thanks!


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## nstueve (May 7, 2015)

The pic below is similar to some depth gauge tools. However it has few extras build in. if you look to the bottom left you'll see it's hooked for cleaning bar rails out. Also there are 4 different depth gauge settings on these 0.025, 0.030, 0.035, and 0.040. So you have choices for hard, soft, or in between wood. The right side is a rail depth gauge to check how deep your bar channel is compared to your chain teeth (for those that actually grind and file their rails). Lastly, there are 35* slots for guiding those of you who want to free hand file.


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## SawTroll (May 7, 2015)

blsnelling said:


> This is what I use, sold by Husqvarna. I use the Hard setting. I find the FOP to make my rakers too low and aggressive on Stihl RS chain.



I use the Husky guides on RS and RM chain as well (but usually the "soft" setting for birch), it doesn't matter if it is the ones on the combo version of the roller guides, or the seperate ones, they work in exactly the same way.
What makes those great is that they are progressive, and is setting each raker according to the individual tooth - it is the same with the FOP. I haven't tried the FOP on anything but Carlton chain.
Raker guides that ride on the top of two cutters are only usable if all cutters are the exact same length, and then you have to figure out when to change to a deeper setting. The setting needs to be deeper the more the cutters are filed back, to maintain the intended "angle of attack".


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## Philbert (May 7, 2015)

Ronaldo said:


> I use a F-O-P whenever possible, but they can be kind of chain type specific.



The FOPs were chain specific. Not a big deal if you only use one type of chain, but can be a pain if you sharpen lots of different types. 

I think that they also helped with top plate angle and filing depth. Like the tool that Nstueve posted: a multi-function aid.

Has anyone tried these Husky depth gauge guides with low kickback chain?

Philbert


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## dsell (May 7, 2015)

I've seen it mentioned twice in this thread, "if the chisels are not the same length". So I must ask, is the chain sharp if the chisels are different lengths? Are you adjusting the rakers to keep the chain from cutting an arc?


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## SawTroll (May 7, 2015)

dsell said:


> I've seen it mentioned twice in this thread, "if the chisels are not the same length". So I must ask, is the chain sharp if the chisels are different lengths? Are you adjusting the rakers to keep the chain from cutting an arc?



If most cutters one one side are shorter than on the other side, the chain will cut crooked, regardless if it is sharp. It doesn't matter much that a cutter here and there is shorter though, because you needed to remove damage. Filing all cutters way back because a few needs to be is not really necessary, if the corresponding rakers are set accordingly - at least on a work chain.


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## dsell (May 7, 2015)

SawTroll said:


> If most cutters one one side are shorter than on the other side, the chain will cut crooked, regardless if it is sharp. It doesn't matter much that a cutter here and there is shorter though, because you needed to remove damage. Filing all cutters way back because a few needs to be is not really necessary, if the corresponding rakers are set accordingly - at least on a work chain.



That explains some chains I've had to sharpen for people.


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## SawTroll (May 7, 2015)

Philbert said:


> .....
> 
> Has anyone tried these Husky depth gauge guides with low kickback chain?
> 
> Philbert



No, but they obviously will not work on chain with bumpers on the tie straps, and not with Oregon Vanguard. They obviously work with Oregon 95VP/VPX and with 20 series BPX - I'm not sure about the RS3 and RM3 (never used them, but both the rakers and the ramps are much larger than on the BPX). The large rakers aren't a problem, the the guides works on RS and RM, so it is the large ramps that may be a problem.
Oregon uses the ramps* instead* of large ramped rakers (LPX vs. LGX), Stihl use much larger ramps *in addition. *Oregon uses slightly enlarged rakes on the VPX and BPX though, just enough to make them pass as "green".


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## ANewSawyer (May 7, 2015)

Philbert said:


> The FOPs were chain specific. Not a big deal if you only use one type of chain, but can be a pain if you sharpen lots of different types.
> 
> I think that they also helped with top plate angle and filing depth. Like the tool that Nstueve posted: a multi-function aid.
> 
> ...



Troll beat me to it. What he said.

I have 95 vpx, well, Husky equivilent to it on my Husky 435. My raker guide on a roller guide for the 0.325 came cut out to let the anti kickback bumper through the raker hole. 

Best thread thread we have had on here in 6 months. I ain't kidding either.


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## Mad Professor (May 7, 2015)

Anybody just use a Pfred file/raker file combo? It seems to work well on my milling chains. If the cutters have = length the depth is right.

And while we are at it, what do you use for files/grinders? For the rakers. If I have the time I still use a flat file and radius the rakers, takes a lot of time. If a negelected chain I will use an angle grinder to get close then finish with a flat file. 

I still hand file all my cutters and have been doing so for > 35 years. I don't know anybody local who can get them sharper with a machine.


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## ANewSawyer (May 7, 2015)

Speaking of low kickback chain, I found out that the 95VPX will bore cut. A little bumpy but again, I have the rakers a little low. 

I may try to track down some of those plates. They would be mighty handy.


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## SawTroll (May 7, 2015)

ANewSawyer said:


> Speaking of low kickback chain, I found out that the 95VPX will bore cut. A little bumpy but again, I have the rakers a little low.
> 
> I may try to track down some of those plates. They would be mighty handy.




Yes, it certainly will. Small rakers and small ramps definately beats large ramped rakers for that.
I have done quite a bit of it with both designs.
LPX is of course the "king" of bore cutting, among the chain mentioned so far in this thread, simply because it has the "slimmest" rakers, and is chisel chain. RSK may be even better, I simply don't know.


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## ANewSawyer (May 7, 2015)

Hey, while we are at it, will a 3/8ths husky roller guide do both 3/8ths chisel and 3/8ths semi chisel? I don't know any why it won't. A loop of chisel chain came on Craftsman (Poulan 3700).


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## SawTroll (May 7, 2015)

ANewSawyer said:


> Hey, while we are at it, will a 3/8ths husky roller guide do both 3/8ths chisel and 3/8ths semi chisel? I don't know any why it won't. A loop of chisel chain came on Craftsman (Poulan 3700).



With the current semi chisel (DPX) it will, but for a final answer I need to know more about that older chain. If it has 76 or 77 in the drivers, the answer is no, as those have lower cutters and take a smaller file (3/16" vs. 7/32") than what the guide is made for....


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## jwilly (May 7, 2015)

I use the roller guide on semi chisel as well but the angle will be less than recommended. I don't really notice too much difference and on dirty firewood you don't lose as much tooth when resharpening. I always file one side shorter than the other even when I try to really pay attention, my son files one side right handed and the other left handed and his are more consistant and I've been trying that without much luck so the flat guides work well for me.


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## ANewSawyer (May 7, 2015)

Bar and chain are new on an old saw. But the chisel chain is sharpened wrong making for dust city. I haven't had the chain off to count the drivers. I have a shot of the bar though. Let me get to my PC (on a tablet right now) and post it. Voila! Photo!


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## SawTroll (May 7, 2015)

Mad Professor said:


> Anybody just use a Pfred file/raker file combo? .......



Stihl sell those as well as Pferd. To me, it sounds and looks like a really bad idea - but they may be a help for people that really have no idea to at least take the rakers down a bit.
There is no way that they can set the rakers right though, but likely better than not filing them at all. Also, it likely is a problem to hold the cutter file at the right hight, at the same time as you apply the correct backward/upward pressure, *and* a downward one on the raker file.


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## SawTroll (May 7, 2015)

ANewSawyer said:


> Bar and chain are new on an old saw. But the chisel chain is sharpened wrong making for dust city. I haven't had the chain off to count the drivers. I have a shot of the bar though. Let me get to my PC (on a tablet right now) and post it. Voila! Photo!



According to the markings on the bar, the chain should be .050, which means the numbers on the drivers (the parts of the chain that goes into the bar slots) should be either 72 or 76. To me, it looks like it is a 72LG chain, and if it says 72 on the drivers it is. If so, the blue bodied Husky roller guide will fit. It will not fit if it says 76, but it doesn't look like it is such a chain to me.

Anyway, it looks like the chain is in good general condition, but it certainly needs some strokes with a file.


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## SawTroll (May 7, 2015)

A funny thing about the Oregon 76/77 and the Stihl Topic is that they were low profile 3/8" chain, but they weren't 3/8" lo-pro.....


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## Philbert (May 7, 2015)

dsell said:


> I've seen it mentioned twice in this thread, "if the chisels are not the same length". So I must ask, is the chain sharp if the chisels are different lengths?



If the cutters are not the same length, they will also not be the same height, or stick out the same amount to the side. This is done by _jointing_ and _setting_ teeth on conventional crosscut saws, but is 'automatic' on modern saw chain. The top and side plate cutting bevels may be 'sharp', and cut wood fibers, but the cut will be rougher and less efficient if the cutters on a loop are all different. This may or may not be noticeable, depending on the user and their expectations. Same thing if the depth gauges are not set equally.

So the answer may depend on what the user considers as 'sharp' and 'good enough'. Ideally, all of the cutters and angles would be the same. As SawTroll notes, not a big deal if it is only one or two cutters that were damaged.



Mad Professor said:


> Anybody just use a Pfred file/raker file combo? It seems to work well on my milling chains.



Forgot about those. Thanks for bringing them up. I have never used them personally, but there have been a lot of positive comments about them here on A.S. from members who have. As I understand, the depth gauge offset is fixed - that is, you can't make them a bit higher or lower if you prefer. And they don't work on skip tooth chains? Please correct me if I am wrong. Again, a lot of users are happy with them.



Mad Professor said:


> If I have the time I still use a flat file and radius the rakers, takes a lot of time. If a negelected chain I will use an angle grinder to get close then finish with a flat file.



I think that rounding over depth gauges/restoring the original profile is important. Otherwise, you can create a point that tries to dig in the wood instead of sliding along in the kerf. I now will use a special depth gauge file or a grinder to set the depth (took me a while to get the hang of the grinder). I used to use the same file to round/profile the depth gauges but found that a ScotchBrite 'deburring' wheel does this much faster.
http://www.arboristsite.com/community/threads/depth-gauges-on-a-grinder.200410/

By the way, the difference between special 'depth gauge files' and ordinary flat files, is that the depth gauge files do not have any teeth along the sides, so they are less likely to accidentally damage the freshly sharpened bevels on the cutters. Some people will use the depth gauge tool to protect the cutters when filing or rounding depth gauges.

Philbert


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## Philbert (May 8, 2015)

SawTroll said:


> No, but they obviously will not work on chain with bumpers on the tie straps, and not with Oregon Vanguard.


I modified the depth gauge part on one the Husky roller guides to fit around low kickback bumpers, but had not seen those flat plate versions until MGoBlue posted them above. 
http://www.arboristsite.com/community/threads/husqvarna-filing-guide-help.193131/#post-3469981




Guess I could do the same with those, so that the same one would work with both standard and low kickback versions? Not sure if different brands of .325 chain(for example) have different cutter profiles and should have different plates (like the FOPs), or if it does not matter that much.

Philbert


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## ANewSawyer (May 8, 2015)

SawTroll said:


> According to the markings on the bar, the chain should be .050, which means the numbers on the drivers (the parts of the chain that goes into the bar slots) should be either 72 or 76. To me, it looks like it is a 72LG chain, and if it says 72 on the drivers it is. If so, the blue bodied Husky roller guide will fit. It will not fit if it says 76, but it doesn't look like it is such a chain to me.
> 
> Anyway, it looks like the chain is in good general condition, but it certainly needs some strokes with a file.



The tie straps are marked "SW" and the drivers 50a


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## SawTroll (May 8, 2015)

Philbert said:


> I modified the depth gauge part on one the Husky roller guides to fit around low kickback bumpers, but had not seen those flat plate versions until MGoBlue posted them above.
> http://www.arboristsite.com/community/threads/husqvarna-filing-guide-help.193131/#post-3469981
> 
> View attachment 423327
> ...



There is a special combo one for 95VP/VPX, that indicates a 30 degree top-plate angle, but I haven't checked if the raker plate is any different.

There also are .325 chain with low profile cutters ut there, but most I know of are discontinued by now. Oregon 33/34/35 LG and SL, Stihl Topic (TS and TM). Those take a 4.5 mm file (11/64"). All that remains is the horrible SL chain, with large bumpers on the tie straps.
These would likely need a different raker plate, but I don't think it ever was made.


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## SawTroll (May 8, 2015)

ANewSawyer said:


> The tie straps are marked "SW" and the drivers 50a



Then it isn't Oregon at all, just looks pretty much like LG. I don't know what brand it is, but someone on the site will know (if they see your question). Now it is "hidden" in this thread, and many will not see it. I suggest that you make a new thread.


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## treesmith (May 8, 2015)

stihl files, stihl file guides and husky depth gauge tools, works well on stihl chain, nice to have the option of softwood setting
.404, .325, 3/8, 3/8p and 1/4


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## dsell (May 8, 2015)

ANewSawyer said:


> The tie straps are marked "SW" and the drivers 50a



Perhaps that is Sandvik Windsor 50APL which crosses to Oregon 72LG.


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## SawTroll (May 8, 2015)

dsell said:


> Perhaps that is Sandvik Windsor 50APL which crosses to Oregon 72LG.



That would be my first guess as well, if I had to make one. I don't know how they look though, Windsor haven't been a common brand here.


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## Philbert (May 8, 2015)

ANewSawyer said:


> The tie straps are marked "SW" and the drivers 50a




I have some 'SW' marked chain. The appearance is similar to Sanvik and Windsor marked chains of the same types (e.g. chisel or semi-chisel, etc.). If the pitch, gauge, and DL count are OK, no reason not to run it. If you are getting dust, the basic sharpening rules apply: sharp bevels on the top and side plates, check your depth gauges, and (preferably) make all cutters the same (lengths, angles, etc.).

Philbert


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## Philbert (May 8, 2015)

treesmith said:


> stihl files, stihl file guides and husky depth gauge tools, works well on stihl chain, nice to have the option of softwood setting
> .404, .325, 3/8, 3/8p and 1/4



OK, if we are '_showing off'_ here . . . .


I don't have a 13/64, 5.2mm file guide (!), but my birthday is in September. My eyesight is also not as good as it used to be, so I labeled all of my stuff clearly.
I like the thumbwheels on the STIHL guides better than the spring clip on the Oregon guides. I have a few of those too, but not a full set.




There are also one or two (?) of the Husky roller guides I need to have the whole set.

Nice to have choices, as long as you understand the differences. These STIHL and Oregon file guides support the files from above, and are supposed to be used with a 0° 'down angle'. The Husky guides support the files from below, and hold the file at a 10° down angle (as I understand). The grooves on the Husky guides do not fit all brands/types of chains. If you go 'back-and-forth' between these different styles of filing guides, you may have to reshape the cutting edges a bit each time.

Philbert


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## SawTroll (May 8, 2015)

Philbert said:


> View attachment 423409
> 
> I have some 'SW' marked chain. The appearance is similar to Sanvik and Windsor marked chains of the same types (e.g. chisel or semi-chisel, etc.). If the pitch, gauge, and DL count are OK, no reason not to run it. If you are getting dust, the basic sharpening rules apply: sharp bevels on the top and side plates, check your depth gauges, and (preferably) make all cutters the same (lengths, angles, etc.).
> 
> Philbert



That chain has really horrible ramps/bumpers on the driver, unlike the chain in question, despite the markings adds up?
The Windsor 50 chain I have are .325 .050 semi-chisel (without any bumpers or ramps, but with the same large rakers).


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## Philbert (May 8, 2015)

SawTroll said:


> That chain have really horrible ramps/bumpers on the driver, unlike the chain in question, despite the markings add up?


Niko, that chain was donated to _*Philbert's No-Kill Chain Shelter and Home for Unloved Saw Chains*_, *where we accept all types of chains, regardless of their condition, ethnicity, or low kickback orientation/status. We harbor chains stamped and formed outside of the US, without any questions, even when they arrive without documentation. Each chain is gently bathed, sorted, and eventually re-homed with a loving sawyer for the rest of their useful lives.

That said . . . most chains are formed of components and assembled in various configurations. You will notice that the bumper drive links are stamped '50' and the non-bumper drive links '50A'. I am sure that some of the same components were also used to form chain that did not have the low kickback features, for semi-chisel chains, for skip tooth versions, etc., etc., etc.

Philbert


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## ANewSawyer (May 8, 2015)

Thanks for the help. I will pull the chain later and count drive links. I will find out the pitch then as well.


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## Philbert (May 8, 2015)

http://www.baileysonline.com/Chainsaw-Chain/Files-Filing-Accessories/Depth-Guage-Maintenance-Tools/

Philbert


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## Chris-PA (May 9, 2015)

SawTroll said:


> The setting needs to be deeper the more the cutters are filed back, to maintain the intended "angle of attack".


I've read something like this several times and it makes no sense to me. Like the blade on a hand plane, there is an angle between the blade and the shoe, but the exposure distance is what controls the cut. Here there is a 6deg angle, but the depth is what you want to change - why would you want to change it as the cutter edge moves (slightly) further from the depth gauge?

The only thing I can think of is that unlike a hand plane the cutter actually rotates down into the wood, pivoting on the depth gauge. How much depends on a lot of things, like chain tension. Still, as the distance between the cutter edge gets longer it would take a bigger bite for a given depth gauge setting so I would think you would want to reduce it not increase it!

I just use a cheap saddle type - if you figure the length of the entire cutter is maybe 0.250" then the 0.250 X SIN(6deg) = 0.026". So the total vertical height of the angled cutter is only 0.026" - how much variation due to cutter length would you expect, and how much does it really matter for working chains?


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## Philbert (May 9, 2015)

Yes, the cutters rock/pivot. Read BobL's thread referenced in the first post of this thread for an explanation. Or the '_Carlton Complete Book of Saw Chain'. _

As for a hand plane cutter (or 'blade', 'iron', etc.), that cutting bevel is advanced as the edge wears/is sharpened away, so its relatonship with the base plate/depth gauge remains constant.

Philbert


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## SawTroll (May 9, 2015)

@Chris-PA

Read the linked up document part 6 and 12-13, and you will understand how it actually works; http://www.carltonproducts.com/pdfs/CarltonSafetyMaintManual_EN.pdf

Pay attention to position 2 in the illustration of how the chain cuts.


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## Philbert (May 9, 2015)

Might as well share it here for everybody:







Philbert


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## Chris-PA (May 9, 2015)

Philbert said:


> Might as well share it here for everybody:
> View attachment 423596
> 
> View attachment 423597
> ...


Exactly why one must continually set the depth gauges as the cutter is sharpened back. I took issue with the claim that the setting must be _increased_ as the cutters wear - the required additional rotation angle of the cutter is pretty small. I'll have to calculate how much more would have to be removed from the depth gauge to compensate some time, but my hunch is that it's not enough to worry about.

Basically we set the gauges without the angle of rotation, and the question is how much does that angle increase as the cutter wears?


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## Philbert (May 9, 2015)

Chris-PA said:


> I took issue with the claim that the setting must be _increased_ as the cutters wear - the required additional rotation angle of the cutter is pretty small.



Again, BobL goes into that '_constant angle_' explanation in his thread. Many A.S. participants have noted that, in their experience, the cutters don't seem to cut as well when ground back at the standard depth gauge offset, so I feel that there is some credibility to this '_progressive depth gauge_' idea. Since Carlton, Husqvarna, and STIHL have all sold progressive gauge tools, they must put some stock into it as well.

I usually use the standard depth gauge tools shown in the first few posts, and take off 'a little more' when the top plates are ground back a ways. I have not measured this additional amount, but try to make all cutters and depth gauges the same. Maybe not as precise, but it cuts wood.

Philbert


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## Raganr (May 9, 2015)

Geometry is on the side of BobL.


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## ANewSawyer (May 21, 2015)

So I picked up a 3/8ths lo pro roller guide locally. I came with this plate and as near as I can tell, it sits on top of two cutters. Is it still considered progressive?

http://www.baileysonline.com/Chains...-3-8-Lo-Pro-Mini-Chainsaw-Chain-505698103.axd


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## old guy (May 21, 2015)

ANewSawyer said:


> So I picked up a 3/8ths lo pro roller guide locally. I came with this plate and as near as I can tell, it sits on top of two cutters. Is it still considered progressive?
> 
> http://www.baileysonline.com/Chains...-3-8-Lo-Pro-Mini-Chainsaw-Chain-505698103.axd


I don't have it in hand & can't really tell but it looks like it sits on one cutter with the raker sticking thru the slot and the other end against the base of the next cutter.

John


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## Philbert (May 21, 2015)

ANewSawyer said:


> So I picked up a 3/8ths lo pro roller guide locally. Is it still considered progressive?


Have not used that one, but I believe that it is progressive. I think that one side is for 'hard' wood, and the other is for 'soft' wood, not made to sit on 2 cutters on the same time. I could be wrong.

Philbert.


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## SawTroll (May 21, 2015)

Philbert said:


> Have not used that one, but I believe that it is progressive. I think that one side is for 'hard' wood, and the other is for 'soft' wood, not made to sit on 2 cutters on the same time. I could be wrong.
> 
> Philbert.



I don't think you are wrong at all, but I haven't seen that exact one before.


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## ANewSawyer (May 21, 2015)

This is a quite different depth gauge from the standard Husky gauge that comes on the saw. Big pictures to follow:
Doesn't look like the depth gauge on my full 3/8 or 0.325 roller guides.




I tried at first to use it like the depth gauges I am used too. No bueno.


This is the only way I can find that it fits. And illustrating what I mean by "On two cutters"


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## Philbert (May 21, 2015)

You are probably right - which would mean that it is _not_ 'progressive', but fixed offset.

Philbert


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## SawTroll (May 21, 2015)

ANewSawyer said:


> This is a quite different depth gauge from the standard Husky gauge that comes on the saw. Big pictures to follow:
> Doesn't look like the depth gauge on my full 3/8 or 0.325 roller guides.
> View attachment 426132
> 
> ...



Looks like it isn't what I thought it was then - but it is odd if Husky would sell a raker guide that isn't progressive - so I wonder if it really is an Husky guide? 

No Husky raker guide I have seen looks that way either, and all those are progressive, adjusts each raker to the corresponding cutter, and has "hard" or "soft" options.


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## ANewSawyer (May 22, 2015)

It is a husky guide alright. Part number: 505 69 81-03

I haven't found any other husqvarna guides that are progressive.  File O Plates are NLA. Any other progressive guides in lo pro 3/8ths available?


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## lambs (May 22, 2015)

Philbert said:


> Again, BobL goes into that '_constant angle_' explanation in his thread. Many A.S. participants have noted that, in their experience, the cutters don't seem to cut as well when ground back at the standard depth gauge offset, so I feel that there is some credibility to this '_progressive depth gauge_' idea. Since Carlton, Husqvarna, and STIHL have all sold progressive gauge tools, they must put some stock into it as well.
> 
> I usually use the standard depth gauge tools shown in the first few posts, and take off 'a little more' when the top plates are ground back a ways. I have not measured this additional amount, but try to make all cutters and depth gauges the same. Maybe not as precise, but it cuts wood.
> 
> Philbert


 
Exactly. Once you file cutters back several times and notice that although you also filed the depth gauges to a .025" gap, the chain will not cut well so you take off "a little more", you are progressively filing your depth gauges. Using a progressive depth gauge tool, or in my case, a digital angle finder, maintains the "drop" from cutter to depth gauge as a constant angle, not a constant depth. So measuring in terms of depth, you have to progressively file more and more off the gauge to get the same performance as when the chain was new. 

I had to read BobL's thread a few times to see what all the fuss was about. But I'm a believer. 

I do not have one of the Husky tools, but I'm going to get one and see how it compares to the DAF. BobL's thread started out as a discussion as to whether or not using the FOP resulted in true progressive filing, and I think he concluded it approximates progressive filing but was not quite the same thing. I have some FOPs and they do not fit well on Stihl chain. That is why I invested in a DAF, and it is great. But if the Husky tool is truly progressive, I may keep a couple of them on hand.


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## ANewSawyer (May 22, 2015)

lambs, may I ask which pitch chain the FOP doesn't fit on? I ask because I found some 3/8ths lo pro FOPs and I need a progressive depth gauge for a yellow 3/8ths lo pro Stihl chain. Thanks!


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## lambs (May 22, 2015)

ANewSawyer said:


> lambs, may I ask which pitch chain the FOP doesn't fit on? I ask because I found some 3/8ths lo pro FOPs and I need a progressive depth gauge for a yellow 3/8ths lo pro Stihl chain. Thanks!


 
They were a Carlton product, so they were designed to fit their chain. I have both a .325 and a 3/8 FOP, but all I can tell you is that they fit pretty well on Stihl RS chain, but do not work well on RM. I do not use LP chain, so I'm sorry I cannot help you there. 

Bailey's has them listed on their site for 3/8 LP at $3.59 each....I thought they were no longer available....part number is 65993. Looks like they fit Carlton and Woodland Pro. But at that price, I'd try one. Let us know if you get one and whether or not it works on your Stihl LP.


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## SawTroll (May 22, 2015)

I would try as well - but it is odd if Husky no longer offer progressive ones for 3/8" lo-pro? 

However, the progressive ones likely was specially made for the pretty "limited" H36/91VG though, and may been useful only on those? Now they often recommend the much better H37/91VX, at least on a saw like the T540xp.
Anyway, it looks like the one you got has "inherited" the part number, and I assume it will work on both.
I will not be surpriced if it turns out to be a short lived stop-gap solution.


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## lambs (May 22, 2015)

SawTroll said:


> I would try as well - but it is odd if Husky no longer offer progressive ones for 3/8" lo-pro?


 
SawTroll, are the Husky roller type tools suitable for any chain manufacturer? That would seem a better choice than an FOP, and they are commonly available. thanks.


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## SawTroll (May 22, 2015)

lambs said:


> SawTroll, are the Husky roller type tools suitable for any chain manufacturer? That would seem a better choice than an FOP, and they are commonly available. thanks.



They are all designed for specific Oregon chain, and when they work well on other chain it is pure luck.

Anyway, I don't think the combo roller/raker tool ever was made for 3/8" lo-pro, but the roller guide alone was and is.


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## dbittle (May 22, 2015)

Here is a progressive gauge that I made after reading through BobL's work. The point of the tooth fits at the back of the little block. The depth gauge setting is correct when the tool lays flat on the chain. It makes it really quick and easy to set up a chain.


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## Moparmyway (May 22, 2015)

Old fashioned, but works


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## Philbert (May 22, 2015)

FOP's were chain specific. Not a big problem if you only use one or two types and brands of chains, but could be a PIA if you sharpen lots of different chains.

If you cannot find a progressive depth gauge tool, you can still use a conventional tool, and take a few extra strokes off. Or you can measure the additional amount using a feeler gauge.

Philbert


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## Philbert (May 22, 2015)

You might also check out the newer STIHL FG4 which is supposed to have '_an integral fold-out filing plate_' . I have not seen this in person, or used one. Not sure if they fit other brands of chain:
http://www.stihlusa.com/products/chain-saws/accessories/filing-tools/fg4rollerguide/


Depth gauge part starts around 4:18 in the YouTube video.


Philbert


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## SawTroll (May 22, 2015)

Philbert said:


> FOP's were chain specific. Not a big problem if you only use one or two types and brands of chains, but could be a PIA if you sharpen lots of different chains.
> 
> *If you cannot find a progressive depth gauge tool, you can still use a conventional tool, and take a few extra strokes off. Or you can measure the additional amount using a feeler gauge.*
> 
> Philbert



The problem is of course to figure out how much more, at different cutter lengths - and it will not work right anyway, on chain with some shorter cutters here and there - they *all* need to be exactly the same length.


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## Philbert (May 22, 2015)

I said it was an option Niko, not necessarily the best way. Works for a lot of guys.

Philbert


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## SawTroll (May 22, 2015)

Philbert said:


> You might also check out the newer STIHL FG4 which is supposed to have '_an integral fold-out filing plate_' . I have not seen this in person, or used one. Not sure if they fit other brands of chain:
> http://www.stihlusa.com/products/chain-saws/accessories/filing-tools/fg4rollerguide/
> 
> 
> ...




I thought that one was discontinued after just a short time on the market? It surely is interesting, but looks a bit over-engineerd and complcated to me.


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## SawTroll (May 22, 2015)

Philbert said:


> I said it was an option Niko, not necessarily the best way. Works for a lot of guys.
> 
> Philbert



It does work, but not really well. Anyway, it is better than just guessing, as long as the cutters are approximately the same length - but the problem of guessing how much more to take will always be a challenge, with anything but new chain.
You can of course have several, with different depth settings, but then again you have to figure out when to change to the next deeper one.


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## imagineero (May 22, 2015)

Philbert said:


> Might as well share it here for everybody:



It's a complex issue, but it's also very simple. The BobL method is the best by a country mile. Some general caveats though;

Full chisel almost doesn't need the rakers done, almost to the end of the tooth. Full chisel is just so aggressive, and the raker is shaped very differently... generally tall and not very wide. Touching up the rakers on full chisel often leads to an unusable chain. I will generally only touch the rakers on full chisel if the chain is not biting like crazy, and then by only one or at most 2 file strokes. 

Semi chisel is an entirely different beast, and rakers are critical to get the most out of it. A well sharpened semi chisel with rakers set right comes very close to full chisel in terms of speed, but will stay sharp longer, cut a much greater volume of wood between sharpenings, and lose less tooth length at each sharpening. All up, in terms of volume of wood cut per chain I would estimate semi chisel to cut 3-4 times the volume of wood. The rakers are critical though! Stihl is the best chain by far. Carlton second best but comes from the factory with rakers way too high. I will put 4-5 full hard strokes from a fresh raker file on carlton chain straight out of the box before even using it.

Raker shape is every bit as important as height. Smooth round rakers will cut smoothly, and can be taken lower and remove a lot more material. Pointy triangular rakers are by far the worst and way too agressive, they will dig in and stall at the least provocation. Flattened rakers are jittery.


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## Philbert (May 22, 2015)

imagineero said:


> Raker shape is every bit as important as height. Smooth round rakers will cut smoothly, and can be taken lower and remove a lot more material. Pointy triangular rakers are by far the worst and way too agressive, they will dig in and stall at the least provocation. Flattened rakers are jittery.



Down with '_pointy rakers_'!

Philbert


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## ANewSawyer (May 22, 2015)

So far I have had good luck with roller guides fitting my saw chain. Hey, Sawtroll, you remember that mystery 3/8ths chain? 3/8ths roller guide worked for it. And I have test fitted the 3/8ths lo pro roller guide to my Lo Pro Stihl chain. So far, so good.

I see imagineero's post about not touching the rakers on full chisel chain. Oops. When I did the loop on my Craftsman, I touched up the rakers using the husky progressive guide, as I sharpened the chain.


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## lambs (May 22, 2015)

imagineero said:


> It's a complex issue, but it's also very simple. The BobL method is the best by a country mile. Some general caveats though;
> 
> Full chisel almost doesn't need the rakers done, almost to the end of the tooth. Full chisel is just so aggressive, and the raker is shaped very differently... generally tall and not very wide. Touching up the rakers on full chisel often leads to an unusable chain. I will generally only touch the rakers on full chisel if the chain is not biting like crazy, and then by only one or at most 2 file strokes.
> 
> ...


 
Not sure what wood you are cutting, but I touch the rakers on full chisel the first time I sharpen cutters to make sure I'm at about 6 degrees drop on them. I also make certain I have the depth gauges rounded off appropriately. I guess I just like my chains agressive, because they do indeed pull themselves into the wood. 

I will probably back off a bit on the 16" 3/8 chains that I'm now using on the 261. But the 046 using a 20" bar loves it.


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## lambs (May 22, 2015)

dbittle said:


> Here is a progressive gauge that I made after reading through BobL's work. The point of the tooth fits at the back of the little block. The depth gauge setting is correct when the tool lays flat on the chain. It makes it really quick and easy to set up a chain.


 
I would love to see a demo picture of this in use if you have one!


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## Philbert (May 22, 2015)

lambs said:


> I would love to see a demo picture of this in use if you have one!


I'd love to see him make a few more! Nice, simple gauge.

Philbert


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## dbittle (May 22, 2015)

lambs said:


> I would love to see a demo picture of this in use if you have one!


Here you go. It just lays on top of the cutter teeth. If the depth gauge is high, it rocks and won't sit flat on top of the teeth. You can take a swipe with a flat file and check again. I used to use the digital angle finder, but this is much faster. I tried to make it long enough to work with skip chain, but I don't run skip chain so I haven't checked that feature out.


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## dbittle (May 22, 2015)

Philbert said:


> I'd love to see him make a few more! Nice, simple gauge.
> 
> Philbert


Thanks much. The reason I put the drawing out this morning was to see if anybody with a 3-D printer might be interested in making a batch. Before I thought of this approach, I tried the feeler gauge method and the digital angle finder. This little gizmo is much faster and easier to use than those methods.


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## lambs (May 22, 2015)

dbittle said:


> Thanks much. The reason I put the drawing out this morning was to see if anybody with a 3-D printer might be interested in making a batch. Before I thought of this approach, I tried the feeler gauge method and the digital angle finder. This little gizmo is much faster and easier to use than those methods.


 
Thanks for posting that. I can see how it would be efficient. I'm getting handy with the DAF but I'm always looking for a better way, because my eyes are getting a little tired and sometimes I have a bit of trouble reading the DAF. The other issue with it is that since I file with the chain and bar mounted in a workshop vise, I need to reverse the direction of the chain to do one side of the cutters and gauges. And the DAF gives me different readings going the other direction, probably because the bar rails are not level; they have a slight rise and fall in them.

I'm going to experiment with the FOP a little and see what sort of drop it's providing, then decide how to move forward. I might try the Husky too since it looks promising; if it will just fit Stihl RS.


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## Justsaws (May 23, 2015)

Mad Professor said:


> Anybody just use a Pfred file/raker file combo? It seems to work well on my milling chains. If the cutters have = length the depth is right.
> *
> I use the the old Pherd single set almost every time I hand file 3/8 chains. I have using a Forrester copy on the .325 and Lo Pro, not as nice a setup to look at but functions as it should.*
> 
> ...



Filing or grinding generally depends on the condition of the chain, not filing the bad day chains. 

All chains get the the DGs maintained, it is night and day difference especially on the mills. Operating angle is not going to be the same in every instance but the DGs get maintained just as the cutters.


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## SawTroll (May 23, 2015)

imagineero said:


> It's a complex issue, but it's also very simple. The BobL method is the best by a country mile. Some general caveats though;
> 
> Full chisel almost doesn't need the rakers done, almost to the end of the tooth. Full chisel is just so aggressive, and the raker is shaped very differently... generally tall and not very wide. Touching up the rakers on full chisel often leads to an unusable chain. I will generally only touch the rakers on full chisel if the chain is not biting like crazy, and then by only one or at most 2 file strokes.
> 
> ...



 A lot is wrong in that post, in fact too much to even start commenting on the details. Mostly a bunch of BS and infactual statements - but also some correct statements inbetween, like that the handling of the rakers are very important.

Maybe the wood you cut just is too hard for chisel chain working like it should? I understand that is quite common in Australia.


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## Justsaws (May 23, 2015)

One of the things that maintaining the DGs seems to accomplish is allowing the chips to leave the cutter tunnel better throughout the life of the chain. Again if the chain is for milling this can make a big difference in the speed versus finish battle. There is always some carry over past the drive sprocket but there is an easily visible difference between a maintained chain and a cutter only chain.

Cleaned up gullets are good as well but not as significant or impressive a change as a maintained DG.


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## Philbert (May 24, 2015)

FYI - ran across a few 'New Old Stock' File-O-Plates (NOS FOP!), that illustrate how they were very simple, but chain specific.

These have been 're-homed' with someone who might actually have some Carlton .354 and .365 chains!

Philbert


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## Philbert (Aug 22, 2015)

Recently saw this on line. Looks interesting with the dial - not exactly sure how it works. Anyone ever see or used one? Hope it is good for $181.




Philbert


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## Terry Syd (Aug 23, 2015)

imagineero said:


> Raker shape is every bit as important as height. Smooth round rakers will cut smoothly, and can be taken lower and remove a lot more material. Pointy triangular rakers are by far the worst and way too agressive, they will dig in and stall at the least provocation. Flattened rakers are jittery.



I wonder if the pointy rakers themselves are really causing the stall, or if they are allowing a bigger cutting angle on the cutters. This is an issue we were discussing in the 'pointed raker' thread a while back - http://www.arboristsite.com/community/threads/pointed-rakers.283648/

I wouldn't expect the raker to cause that much drag to stall the saw, so it is probably an increase in cutting angle - the chain is taking a bigger bite.


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## gunnusmc03 (Aug 23, 2015)

@Philbert that's a limit stop for a vent saw. It's not used for adjusting cutter depth gauges.


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## blsnelling (Aug 23, 2015)

Raker depth is super critical on full chisel chain, just as it is on any chain.


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## Philbert (Aug 23, 2015)

gunnusmc03 said:


> @Philbert that's a limit stop for a vent saw. It's not used for adjusting cutter depth gauges.


Doh!

Thanks for the clarification!

I guess that is a better way to read that text . . . 

Philbert


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## Marshy (Aug 23, 2015)

Sorry in advance for this side tangent but I've been meaning to ask you guys about the Husqvarna roller guide. How do you feel about the angle that guide suggests? I think it's too much, it looks to be nearly 30* my only complaint with it is the angle. What are your thoughts on this?

Regarding rakers, I read an interesting post a while back where a guy was adjusting his raker with his round file. He filed the back of the raker towards the cutting direction. This opened up the gullet area in front of the cutter. What's your opinion on this method?


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## huskihl (Aug 23, 2015)

Marshy said:


> Sorry in advance for this side tangent but I've been meaning to ask you guys about the Husqvarna roller guide. How do you feel about the angle that guide suggests? I think it's too much, it looks to be nearly 30* my only complaint with it is the angle. What are your thoughts on this?
> 
> Regarding rakers, I read an interesting post a while back where a guy was adjusting his raker with his round file. He filed the back of the raker towards the cutting direction. This opened up the gullet area in front of the cutter. What's your opinion on this method?


In theory, it makes sense in every way


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## SawTroll (Aug 23, 2015)

Marshy said:


> Sorry in advance for this side tangent but I've been meaning to ask you guys about the Husqvarna roller guide. How do you feel about the angle that guide suggests? I think it's too much, it looks to be nearly 30* my only complaint with it is the angle. What are your thoughts on this?
> 
> ......


The indicated top-plate angles are the same conservative ones as Oregon recommends (usually 25 degrees for chisel and 30 for semi-chisel) - but you really can file at any angle you want. I use file handles with angle indicators, and it can be combined with the roller guides.


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## Rx7man (Aug 23, 2015)

I have yet to get myself a FOP or a decent sharpening system, for now I hand file without a guide. Using RS chain that's about 2/3rd worn I set my rakers to .045" with feeler gauges off the top of the teeth and it seems happy there (cutting fir). At some point I'll get something better


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## Philbert (Jun 14, 2016)

*Bump!*

I have referenced this twice in a week, so it is time for a bump!

Philbert


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## Rx7man (Jun 15, 2016)

I got a file guide.. can't remember what they're called.. can set all the angles up, it clamps to the bar and holds the file.. not the greatest thing around, but it does help a little


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## treesmith (Jun 15, 2016)

These are in my bag every day, stihl files and file holders for 1/4" picco mini micro piddly teeny on ms150t, then .325, .404, 3/8 and 3/8 picco

I dont like the stihl depth gauge tools so these came from Husqvarna with the exception of the 1/4"pmmpt which had to be from stihl. 
I use saws everyday and with this combination I find they give good cutting speed, good durability and unless cutting dirty stuff or really hard wood I don't need to sharpen very often, though this is for arboriculture not firewood or logging. I have found though that my fellow workers who all file free hand have to sharpen more often than I do. Also, the smallest chain - 1/4", which gets most use is the one that needs sharpening least though it's not usually doing dirty work. Having said that, I used it to cut dead fronds out of a Phoenix date palm that was full of dirt and it was still sharp enough afterwards to deadwood 4 big gums.
We only use stihl chains and I file left and right handed over the saw from behind, which gives great results and very even cutters and works on your knees, in a bench vice or in a log vice banged into a log


Sent from my SM-G900I using Tapatalk


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## Homeowner (Jun 15, 2016)

I cut sticky pine trees and less sticky birch trees with .325 Oregon 21BPX chain that I did sharpen with help of Husky roller file guide and depth gauge combination.

Got my hands messed with pine sap and nice long chips when cutting rounds off from the logs. 

I did set rakers with "soft" slot in Husky depth gauge tool, chain did cut quite well and I think it became better after few cuts. 

Somehow manage to keep my chain sharp when I stack logs to holder thing I welded together from old rusted pipes, but sometimes without any sensible reason I try to cut those pipes with the chainsaw and it does not do any good to my chain, I wonder why is that...


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## SawTroll (Jun 15, 2016)

Homeowner said:


> I cut sticky pine trees and less sticky birch trees with .325 Oregon 21BPX chain that I did sharpen with help of Husky roller file guide and depth gauge combination.
> 
> Got my hands messed with pine sap and nice long chips when cutting rounds off from the logs.
> 
> ...



I usually use the "soft" setting for birch as well - but you better make a stack holder out of wood, as you are bound to hit it with the chain now and then.


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## Tigdim (Oct 27, 2016)

Sorry to resurrect an old thread but seemed like I should post here rather than make a new one.

I am not sure about if I am sold on the progressive raker idea but figured I would make a gauge and try it out... PDf is the drawing. Also included 2 pics of the finished product. Had to make a few changes but did not update the drawing yet... I may have to make changes to get it to fit the chain for my ms171, I have confirmed it works for the ms261.

Aaron


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## Little Al (Oct 28, 2016)

Ronaldo said:


> Where can I find one of these flat Husqvarna plate guides? My dealer only shows the roller guide. I use a F-O-P whenever possible, but they can be kind of chain type specific.
> I dont see the flat ones offered on Husqvarna website?


At our dealers the Husky roller sharpening guide tool has the flat plate for raker height attached it swivels out. I also tried out the the filing guide reviewed by Philbert on a Knackered 3/8 Lo Pro chain & it cuts well So flushed with success I will when I have time attack the pile of " Scrap "chains inthe corner of the shop.


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## Ranchers-son (Oct 28, 2016)

Little Al said:


> At our dealers the Husky roller sharpening guide tool has the flat plate for raker height attached it swivels out. I also tried out the the filing guide reviewed by Philbert on a Knackered 3/8 Lo Pro chain & it cuts well So flushed with success I will when I have time attack the pile of " Scrap "chains inthe corner of the shop.


The depth raker plate on the husky roller guide works good on newer chain but once your tooth is about half used up the rivet starts to rest on top of the tooth on one side and not the other which causes the chain to cut sideways. You can find just the plate on Amazon


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## SawTroll (Oct 28, 2016)

Tigdim said:


> Sorry to resurrect an old thread but seemed like I should post here rather than make a new one.
> 
> I am not sure about if I am sold on the progressive raker idea but figured I would make a gauge and try it out... PDf is the drawing. Also included 2 pics of the finished product. Had to make a few changes but did not update the drawing yet... I may have to make changes to get it to fit the chain for my ms171, I have confirmed it works for the ms261.
> 
> ...




That one doesn't look progressive to me?


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## Tigdim (Oct 28, 2016)

It rests on 3 teeth and butts against the front of a tooth, the top of the "fork" (lacking a better term) is cut at 6 degrees from the corner the tooth sits in... as the tooth is filed back and the distance between the front of the tooth and the raker/depth gauge increases... the raker is progressively filed lower as the distance between the 2 grows due to the 6 degree angle on the top of the fork.

The attached picture should show the angled fork better. I will get a picture of it on a chain this weekend.

Aaron


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## Philbert (Oct 28, 2016)

SawTroll said:


> That one doesn't look progressive to me?


I was confused when one of the photos showed it upside down.

See Post #32 in this thread:
http://www.arboristsite.com/communi...gressive-depth-raker-generators.114624/page-2

Philbert


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## Tigdim (Oct 28, 2016)

Philbert said:


> I was confused when one of the photos showed it upside down.



I was just trying to show top and bottom... so everyone could get a complete mental picture of the gauge.

Aaron


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## SawTroll (Oct 28, 2016)

Tigdim said:


> It rests on 3 teeth and butts against the front of a tooth, the top of the "fork" (lacking a better term) is cut at 6 degrees from the corner the tooth sits in... as the tooth is filed back and the distance between the front of the tooth and the raker/depth gauge increases... the raker is progressively filed lower as the distance between the 2 grows due to the 6 degree angle on the top of the fork.
> 
> The attached picture should show the angled fork better. I will get a picture of it on a chain this weekend.
> 
> ...



That may work, provided the angle is calculated right - but a raker guide that rests on more than one cutter (tooth) only will work right if all cutters are _exactly _the same length. If you try to do that, you will "use up" the chains much sooner than needed, as you will file much more than needed.


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## Tigdim (Oct 28, 2016)

Geometry/angle is good, I drew it up in Solid works and cut it out of red board on the mill at work. 

As for resting on multiple teeth, you bring up a valid point I had not put much thought into. I do tend to take a little more off the left teeth than the right. But the left and right stay pretty consistent perspectively.

It may be as simple as cutting a relief so it sits on 2 teeth on the same side. I will have to put some thought into it.

Aaron


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## Philbert (Mar 31, 2017)

*Bump!*

I recently referenced this in 'another forum', so time to freshen it up here on A.S.

Philbert


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## Ax-man (Mar 31, 2017)

Glad you did . I picked up a few pointers already from this thread and the links. I got invited over to that "another forum" and learned more there also , all this has me rethinking my approach to filing depth gauges by hand and working up the courage to do depth gauges on my grinder which will be an all time first for me. This not so old dog is learning some new tricks.


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## Philbert (Mar 31, 2017)

Ax-man said:


> , all this has me rethinking my approach to filing depth gauges by hand and working up the courage to do depth gauges on my grinder which will be an all time first for me.


My experience:

http://www.arboristsite.com/community/threads/depth-gauges-on-a-grinder.200410/

Biggest problem I had was with reduced kickback chains that have the larger, bumper tie straps. The newer ones with the bumper drive links are not so bad. For chains without any low kickback bumpers, consider profiling a wider (1/4" or 5/16") wheel, and it will go quickly.

Philbert


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## Marshy (Apr 1, 2017)

Lately I've been thinking about a different way to adjust my rakers. Maybe someone has already tried this and can let me know what their experience was and if it's a good idea. 

My idea was to file the back edge off the raker forward (towards the chain rotation direction) to set the raker height. This will widen the gullet area and retain the profile of the raker. 

Thoughts?


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## Ax-man (Apr 1, 2017)

That is the way I have always filed the rakers to set them. I don't see anything wrong with that and have gotten good results.


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## old guy (Apr 1, 2017)

I do that with the vangaurd chains.


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## Pioneer (Apr 1, 2017)

Adjustable depth gauge from the 60's.


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## Philbert (Apr 1, 2017)

Pioneer said:


> Adjustable depth gauge from the 60's.


Very cool!

Does not look that difficult to make something similar, if a fellow wanted to go that route.



Marshy said:


> My idea was to file the back edge off the raker forward (towards the chain rotation direction) to set the raker height. This will widen the gullet area and retain the profile of the raker. Thoughts?



Interesting idea.

That would also shorten the _length_ of the depth gauges, which might cause them to dig in a bit more. But that is something that is done on some race chains. I assume there would be a practical limit of how far you would want to go before you went back to more conventional filing of the height.

Philbert


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## Philbert (Apr 1, 2017)

*Thought that this was in this thread . . .*

Hard to keep track. Idea is to use a digital tire tread depth gauge ($7 eBay) on chains.

http://www.arboristsite.com/community/threads/raker-dial-indicator-feedback-on-marketability.295188/




Philbert


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## bigfellascott (Apr 1, 2017)

I just use the stihl 2in1 file, it does it automatically as you sharpen the chain and never had a problem with it ever, I've been cutting on average 2 ton of wood per day for the last few weeks now in lots of different Aussie hardwoods and this setup is quick and easy to use and does a great job.


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## Philbert (Dec 30, 2017)

*
Bump!*

I recently referenced this in another post, so time to freshen it up here on A.S.

Philbert


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## PDXchain (Jan 8, 2018)

Philbert said:


> Kept my eye out for one of these for awhile (since seeing it in another A.S. post!) - Oregon adjustable depth gauge tool.
> 
> Have not 'played' with it yet to determine how much each 'click' changes the depth gauge setting.
> 
> ...


I haven' seen one of those in years! thanks for posting


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## PDXchain (Jan 8, 2018)

Philbert said:


> View attachment 423409
> 
> I have some 'SW' marked chain. The appearance is similar to Sanvik and Windsor marked chains of the same types (e.g. chisel or semi-chisel, etc.). If the pitch, gauge, and DL count are OK, no reason not to run it. If you are getting dust, the basic sharpening rules apply: sharp bevels on the top and side plates, check your depth gauges, and (preferably) make all cutters the same (lengths, angles, etc.).
> 
> Philbert


Yes, that is Windsor chain. SW was stamped on parts after Sandvik acquired them.


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## PDXchain (Jan 8, 2018)

Philbert said:


> FYI - ran across a few 'New Old Stock' File-O-Plates (NOS FOP!), that illustrate how they were very simple, but chain specific.
> 
> These have been 're-homed' with someone who might actually have some Carlton .354 and .365 chains!
> 
> ...


These were so simple, and worked very well. BTW the .365" was their designation for the N1C chain (3/8" LP)


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## Ronaldo (Jan 8, 2018)

PDXchain said:


> These were so simple, and worked very well. BTW the .365" was their designation for the N1C chain (3/8" LP)


I like using the File- O- Plates, too. I have several and use them for every type of chain that I can. Simple and effective. 

Sent from my SM-S320VL using Tapatalk


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## Albert Beerstein (Apr 28, 2018)

Philbert said:


> Kept my eye out for one of these for awhile (since seeing it in another A.S. post!) - Oregon adjustable depth gauge tool.
> 
> Have not 'played' with it yet to determine how much each 'click' changes the depth gauge setting.
> 
> ...


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## bigfellascott (Apr 29, 2018)

This stuff ain't that complicated, just buy a DG that suits, seems to me that most have a .25 or .30 gauge to choose from so pick which one you are happy to use and go for it (personally don't see much diff between the 2 options.


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## pioneerguy600 (Apr 29, 2018)

It can be made complicated by OCD types though there is nothing wrong with that. I bet more wood was cut by users that never knew anything about chain geometry.


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## Philbert (Oct 14, 2018)

*Bump!*

I just referenced this in another post, so time to freshen it up here on A.S.

Philbert


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## Philbert (Oct 31, 2019)

_Found these in response to another post. ***Started a separate thread to discuss***:
https://www.arboristsite.com/community/threads/stihl-progressive-depth-gauge-tool.336757/


_
*
Tools for MS-cutting attachment maintenance: File gauge*
_For manual reworking of the depth gauge made from hardened steel with special coating. Two settings for hard and soft wood. Using the hook, both the groove in the bar and the bar's oil hole can be cleaned. _

File gauge .404" 00008934010
File gauge 3/8" 00008934009
File gauge .325" 00008934008
File gauge 3/8"P 00008934007
File gauge 1/4"P 00008934006

STIHL 'FL1 - FL5 ' (might not be available through USA dealers):
https://www.stihl.com/sharpening-saw-chain.aspx (link to video)

https://www.stihl.com/STIHL-power-t...ent-maintenance/267816-63674/File-gauges.aspx

Philbert


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## Philbert (Dec 4, 2019)

Got a set, thanks to one of our European members (_Thanks!_). More info in the thread above.





Philbert


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## Huskybill (Dec 4, 2019)

*After a while in learning this I can look down the bar and see the shallow rakers that need to be filed. On a new chain after a few filings the raker is almost flush with the top of the tooth. I make two passes on each raker so there all even with a flat file. I haven’t used a raker gauge in decades.

When I use a round file with the file n guide I make the same amount of passes on each tooth too.*

*On any new chain I first put on I open up the gullet right away. Then it’s the file n guide only. Till the gullet is shallow then I open up the gullet farther back.*


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## Philbert (Jan 2, 2020)

*Page from Carlton 2016-2017 Catalog*

I don't know if any of these are still available, but the part numbers might be helpful for some folks.



Philbert


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## BangBang77 (Jan 2, 2020)

Philbert said:


> *Page from Carlton 2016-2017 Catalog*
> 
> I don't know if any of these are still available, but the part numbers might be helpful for some folks.
> View attachment 784817
> ...



Philbert

I have two of the Carlton file-o-plates, 1 in .325" and the other in 3/8", and recently bought a second one of each on Ebay. Karl D hooked me up with the new Stihl progressive depth gauges as well, 1 of each of the 5 sizes. I have used the .325" an the 3/8" size a few times.

You know which ones I like better? The Carlton file-o-plates. They are harder to hold due to their smaller size and maybe my preference is due to familiarity alone, but I find myself reaching for them much more often than the new Stihl ones.


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## old CB (Jan 2, 2020)

I still use the depth gauge tool I bought in the 70s. Made by Zip-Penn (a brand you'd recognize if you bought chainsaw goods by mail in the 70s), it's a "FILEMATE 4 in 1" tool, that has guides for .030 or .035 filing of rakers. (Photos are a giant PIA for me--have to find the camera, transfer photo to computer, etc.--or I'd take a pic.)

My main point is this: when I sharpen (file only--I gave away my grinder) I lay the gauge on the chain and run a flat file over one or two teeth. I now know that the rakers need about two passes with the flat file and I can see the size of the bright metal from filing. As I go around the chain, I just give it the same # of passes with the file until I see the right size of bright metal on top. No need to lay the gauge on every tooth. It's not exact, but I get very good results, never have had a problem with this method. I like to take them down pretty aggressively, and you can tell when cutting that the chain is just this side of grabby.


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## TheDarkLordChinChin (Jan 2, 2020)

This might be a really dumb question but can you file 3/8 lo pro rakers with a standard husky 3/8 raker gauge?
I dont want to get another lecture about "proper" filing equipment from my dealer.


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## Philbert (Jan 2, 2020)

TheDarkLordChinChin said:


> This might be a really dumb question but can you file 3/8 lo pro rakers with a standard husky 3/8 raker gauge?


'No'.

Separate Husqvana gauges for 3/8" low pro (aka: 'Picco', 'Mini') and full sized 3/8" pitch chains.
Here are the current part numbers for the Husqvana depth gauge tools:




_*Note that these part numbers (and price) have changed since @Jimmy in NC 's post a few years back (Post#19)_.

Also note that Husqvarna told me that I can use the same *depth gauge tool* for both Narrow Kerf and Standard .325 pitch chains, but I need separate *roller guides* for these chains, if I use those (!).

Philbert


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## Huskybill (Jan 2, 2020)

I look straight down the bar at the rakers and teeth and eyeball if it’s two or three passes with a flat file on the rakers. We’re talking only .020” to .025”. My bigger power heads I go .030” to .035” maybe .040” on the 2100. But the trick to running deeper rakers is keeping the chain razor sharp.


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## LonestarStihl (Jan 2, 2020)

These are Stihl but give a comparison of why they can’t be used across. My writing didn’t show well on the picture either


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## TheDarkLordChinChin (Jan 2, 2020)

Thanks guys. Wanted to be sure before I tried using my 3/8 husky depth gauge tool on a picco chain.


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## Philbert (Jan 2, 2020)

Something Related That I Put Together for A Training Session



Philbert


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## Huskybill (Jan 2, 2020)

I make the same number of passes on the teeth when using the file n guide. I make the same amount of passes with the flat file on the rakers. I try to keep the filing as even as possible. I been doing this for four decades.

With brand new saw chains in the past I’d open up the gullet to the max first. Today’s saw chain is so much better ground in the gullet I have noticed. The time we invest in making the gullet right is time saved in the field.


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## JW51 (Jan 7, 2020)

Looks to me like the raker portion of the Husqvarna roller gauge is functionally the same as the stamped steel one mentioned above.

I like the stamped steel one, but it’s RIDICULOUSLY soft steel isn’t going to last more than a few sharpenings.

Anyone know if the roller version is hardened steel ?


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## old CB (Jan 7, 2020)

I took a photo of the tool I use. The middle depressions are .030 and .035, which are the two I use--and then I sometimes take a little more off. Here we cut almost entirely pine and other conifers, soft wood, so the chain can take a bigger bite.

Actually, I use this tool less than I used to. I like the 2-in-1 oufit anymore. I have a Pferd one for 7/32 and a Stihl for .325.


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## Philbert (Jan 7, 2020)

old CB said:


> I took a photo of the tool I use.


Very nice. Classic. Simple. Effective. Multi-functional.

I searched and found that Bailey's sells a version of it (WoodlandPro Universal Filing Gauge (Filemate) 15525):
https://www.baileysonline.com/woodl...MI_8v09Nny5gIVS__jBx1b0AzaEAQYASABEgIibvD_BwE




There appear to be several other '_FileMate -style_' ones also posted on the web, but they do not look as nice as yours. E.g.:
https://www.treestuff.com/filemate-universal-filing-gauge/

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Archer-Rak...70AAOSwo4pYRf7V:sc:USPSFirstClass!55105!US!-1

https://www.cutterschoice.com/en/47252-file-guide

_'Four chain depth gauge settings. File guide for right and left hand cutters. Gauge for checking bar groove depth and bar groove cleaner."_

Thanks for posting that.

Philbert


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## Philbert (Jan 7, 2020)

Found an old ad:




Also seen it listed as a 'Sabre' product, as well as Zip-Penn.

Philbert


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## Philbert (Jan 15, 2020)

*Granberg EZ Gauge 2218AF**

Saw this on their website:







***This is for use with the Granberg rotary tools - it sets the height for the grinding stone on the tool, _NOT_ on the chain, to obtain the desired depth gauge offset. It is an alternative to using a standard offset style gauge, 'eyeballing it' and going back-and-forth. It also protects the cutting edges from damage while grinding the depth gauges.



Philbert


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## KiwiBro (Apr 25, 2020)

on ebay, $10 delivered. Job done. You're welcome.


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## Philbert (Apr 25, 2020)

KiwiBro said:


> on ebay, $10 delivered. Job done. You're welcome.











TL90 Digital Pitch Gauge LCD Display Backlight Blades Angle Measurement Tool | eBay


This TL90 gauge can be used on the helicopter that is equipped with stabilizer bar or flybarless, the built-in digital gyro can detect the height of the blade automatically and display on the backlight LCD screen.



www.ebay.com





So this measures '_pitch_' as in angle (e.g. 'pitch of a roof')? Would be a substitute fir the $30 DAF (digital angle finder) used in @BobL 's classic thread?





Are FOP really progressive depth raker generators?


I have not used an FOP or their look alikes but, following discussions and some of the images posted in a previous post, I wonder if FOPs are really true progressive raker depth makers after all. So I put the following up for your consideration - it's getting close to ultra geeky (a bit like...




www.arboristsite.com





Philbert


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## KiwiBro (Apr 25, 2020)

Yes.


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## KASH (Apr 26, 2020)

Husky Bill I use the exact same method as you.I think probably 90 percent of the pro loggers I know do also.I have a whole bunch of depth gauges including the one from the sixties that was adjustable.It was a pretty good tool.I reallly dont see a need for them when it is so easy to just to use a hand file.
Kash


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## Huskybill (Apr 26, 2020)

KASH said:


> Husky Bill I use the exact same method as you.I think probably 90 percent of the pro loggers I know do also.I have a whole bunch of depth gauges including the one from the sixties that was adjustable.It was a pretty good tool.I reallly dont see a need for them when it is so easy to just to use a hand file.
> Kash



I don’t have time to use raker gauges I just eyeball the rakers, make one or two passes keeping it even, the file n guide keeps the top edge of the tooth razor sharp. There’s a difference in the approach to maintaining a chain with the pros.


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## Alan_in_PA (May 18, 2020)

Philbert said:


> Kept my eye out for one of these for awhile (since seeing it in another A.S. post!) - Oregon adjustable depth gauge tool.
> 
> Have not 'played' with it yet to determine how much each 'click' changes the depth gauge setting.
> 
> ...



Here's a photo of a vintage Oregon Universal Depth Gauge Part No. 540 identical to this one of yours that was sold by somebody on eBay. According to that tool's original included instructions, "The numbers at the dial screw represent five thousandths graduations. They are accurate from the base starting point; each individual will soon learn to set the gauge at the best point suited for his own personal needs." Hope this info is helpful for you or anybody else wishing to use this tool.

Alan


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## Philbert (May 18, 2020)

Alan_in_PA said:


> Here's a photo of a vintage Oregon Universal Depth Gauge Part No. 540 identical to this one of yours that was sold by somebody on eBay. According to that tool's original included instructions, "The numbers at the dial screw represent five thousandths graduations. They are accurate from the base starting point; each individual will soon learn to set the gauge at the best point suited for his own personal needs." Hope this info is helpful for you or anybody else wishing to use this tool.


Thanks Alan!

Welcome to A.S.!

Philbert


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## Philbert (May 19, 2020)

*STIHL 2-in-1* (also Pferd)

Adding this here. It shows how the depth gauge setting is dependent on the height of _the cutter in front _of the one being filed. This popular tool does not work on skip tooth chains (that next cutter is not there), and does not work well on chains with cutters of significantly different / uneven lengths.




Philbert


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## old CB (May 19, 2020)

As a fan of the 2-in-one file thing, I'd been assuming that it works only on full comp chain. But someone here pointed out that you could probably use it on skip chain if you handle it right. Been meaning to try it that way. I have only one skip chain--on my 7900 with 24" bar--which I have use for only very rarely.

But in the illustration above, if you could maintain the #3 position flat on the tooth you're sharpening, seems like you could get the desired result. Probably not down to exactly perfect, but close enough. Sometime I'll give it a try.


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## Philbert (May 19, 2020)

old CB said:


> . . . someone here pointed out that you could probably use it on skip chain if you handle it right.


It would still file the depth gauges, but it has no reference point to base the height on. It would be like filing with no gauge, and just estimating the height.

Philbert


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## Philbert (Dec 27, 2020)

Philbert


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## MGoBlue (Dec 27, 2020)




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## Philbert (Dec 27, 2020)

MGoBlue said:


> View attachment 877954


Also see this post:


Philbert said:


> Something Related That I Put Together for A Training Session
> 
> View attachment 784866
> 
> Philbert


Philbert


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## Huskybill (Dec 27, 2020)

After decades of experience cutting with chainsaws I look down the front of the bar at the raker & cutting edge relationship. You can see a spark plug gap of .025” that’s around the raker depth. I make the same passes on each raker it’s usually two on each raker. Maximum three on the bigger power heads.
I make the same amount of passes when I sharpen each tooth. This keeps the chain sharpening even.


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## rupedoggy (Dec 27, 2020)

Hey Bill where ya been?


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## Huskybill (Dec 28, 2020)

I been here off and on. Ya miss me?


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## Huskybill (Dec 28, 2020)

MGoBlue said:


> View attachment 877954


Time my time is running out. We all have a date with destiny.


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## pioneerguy600 (Dec 28, 2020)

MGoBlue said:


> View attachment 877954


 Doesn`t look anything like a chainsaw chain does it. You know how to sharpen this type cutting instrument?


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## MGoBlue (Jan 15, 2021)

pioneerguy600 said:


> Doesn`t look anything like a chainsaw chain does it. You know how to sharpen this type cutting instrument?


Given the right jig, yes, lol.


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## Philbert (Jan 15, 2021)

pioneerguy600 said:


> Doesn`t look anything like a chainsaw chain does it. You know how to sharpen this type cutting instrument?


We have some threads on crosscut saws. Fun to use when sharp. More skill and knowledge required to sharpen them. Plus, you can’t simply toss them, like you might a chain, if they get buggered up, so skilled users tend to be protective of them. 

Here’s one thread:






Crosscut Saw Manuals / References


I picked up a few, older crosscut saws after the opportunity to try using some at a USFS training class http://www.arboristsite.com/chainsaw/199684.htm They are still used in wilderness areas, where chainsaws are not allowed, and like a lot of manual tools, can be fun to use if properly...




www.arboristsite.com





And another:






Crosscut saws


Just picked up a simonds 503 crosscut. I'm hoping to make a vintage racesaw out of it. Is there anyone else who plays around with crosscut saws on here?




www.arboristsite.com





Philbert


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## pioneerguy600 (Jan 15, 2021)

Philbert said:


> We have some threads on crosscut saws. Fun to use when sharp. More skill and knowledge required to sharpen them. Plus, you can’t simply toss them, like you might a chain, if they get buggered up, so skilled users tend to be protective of them.
> 
> Here’s one thread:
> 
> ...


 Thanks ,Philbert, I have been filing cross cut saws since the 1960`s, my dad was a master filer of them since the 1930`s. I have all the tooling, gauges and files for sharpening these blade saws along with a good collection of fine blades. I guess my question was a rhetorical one, should have made that plainer so as not to require you fine gentlemen to answer to it.


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## Philbert (Jan 15, 2021)

Share some of that knowledge in that thread!

Philbert


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## KASH (Jan 16, 2021)

Jerry when you were playing the Swedish Violin for a living you learned to file or you paid someone who could tune it to peak performance.
I don't miss it.
Kash


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## Oldtoolsnewproblems (Jan 16, 2021)

Word of warning folks, I got one of the file mate style guide, and I thought i bought name brand but nope. Anyways a few days ago I was fighting to get an old chain cutting well and I busted out a straightedge and some feelers and discovered the depth setting in the guide was just way way off. My .025 guides were actually set to about. 018, no wonder the saw was a dog.

I'm in the market for a trust worthy guide now, since setting the whole chain with feelers and a straight edge took bloody forever


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## Allar (Jan 16, 2021)

I bought some .325 Oregon txl chains and for my surprise the Husqvarna depth gauges doesnt work. It just doesnt fit right


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## Philbert (Jan 16, 2021)

Oldtoolsnewproblems said:


> I got one of the file mate style guide, and I thought i bought name brand but nope.


Yep. Lots of cheap knockoffs out there. Pretty simple tool, but it needs to be accurate. 



Allar said:


> I bought some .325 Oregon txl chains and for my surprise the Husqvarna depth gauges doesnt work. It just doesnt fit right.



Gauges are specific to certain chains. Husqvarna makes a separate roller guide for narrow kerf, .325 chain, which is different than the guide for standard.325 chain. 

See my photos in Posts #40 and 48 in this thread. 

Philbert


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## Oldtoolsnewproblems (Jan 16, 2021)

I get why the progressive depth guage are chain specific, as the distance between tooth and link and height could vary mfr to mfr, but I don't get how the roller guides can be chain specific, beyond the guage and angle mattering. All they have to do is sit parallel to the bar? What else am I missing in thier design?

I don't go thru enough chain to justify spending money on all these specific sharpeners, plus I have enough chain in useable shape lying around that I probably won't but any for the next 5 years minimum, but also have no clue what brand or style each one is, so I'm on the hunt for universal tools, even if they're a little harder to use.


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## Philbert (Jan 16, 2021)

Oldtoolsnewproblems said:


> I don't get how the roller guides can be chain specific, beyond the guage and angle mattering.


Width of the chain and guide bar are different. 

Philbert


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## rwoods (Jan 16, 2021)

I am told the chain widths vary somewhat between manufacturers. My Husky roller guides are a super tight fit on my Stihl chains, sometimes almost impossible to fit. IIRC there are threads on modifying these guides to fit Stihl chains by widening the slots.

Ron


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## Philbert (Jan 16, 2021)

95TXL is narrow kerf chain. 

Philbert


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## MGoBlue (Jan 16, 2021)

Oldtoolsnewproblems said:


> Word of warning folks, I got one of the file mate style guide, and I thought i bought name brand but nope. Anyways a few days ago I was fighting to get an old chain cutting well and I busted out a straightedge and some feelers and discovered the depth setting in the guide was just way way off. My .025 guides were actually set to about. 018, no wonder the saw was a dog.
> 
> I'm in the market for a trust worthy guide now, since setting the whole chain with feelers and a straight edge took bloody forever


Get yourself a progressive style and you'll never look back.


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## Philbert (Jan 16, 2021)

Oldtoolsnewproblems said:


> I'm on the hunt for universal tools, even if they're a little harder to use.


The basic, 'drop' / 'offset' gauges, shown in the first few posts in this thread are pretty universal: work with all brands and pitches of chain. The OEM models (STIHL, Husqvarna, Oregon, ECHO, etc.) should be reasonably accurate.

The rest of the posts in this thread look at alternatives to that simple, basic method.

Philbert


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## stihl86 (Jan 16, 2021)

Depth gauge tool? Every ones knows you should use a raker gauge.


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## ChasSC (Jan 16, 2021)

After I borrowed my neighbors Stihl 2n1, sharpener and depth file I bought two Pferd, 5/32" and 7/32" plus a box each of round and flat replacement files. I never looked back. I started hand filing after using one of those old Oregon files that mounted to your bar and was a PITA. Pferd and Stihl I believe are made by the same company, both made in Germany, just depends if you like blue, or orange and white. I check it every now and then with a manual depth gauge and it's spot on. Used to be those were the only two on Amazon, now it's flooded with knock-offs, be careful what you order. They are especially great in the field, if you have a log vise. Pferd makes two different replacement files, if I remember, ones regular and the other aggressive. Only takes about 3 strokes.

On another note, 2nd picture, when I was looking up something in the new Echo manual, I ran across this page, this thread reminded me about it. I don't remember doing this but a few times in my life, but I will look at some of my old standby chains, just to see what they look like.


.


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## HumBurner (Jan 17, 2021)

I, and most I know, only bother filing the tangs when they become damaged and won't set right or at all in the bar....generally after a bad chain toss. 

Probably some benefit in doing it regularly, but it's an annoyance, to say the least.


----------

