# Fair warnin' to y'all



## Whitespider (Dec 23, 2014)

I've decided to use up the last of my vacation time.
Workin' today... but won't be goin' back until January 5th.
So... if'n I'm in the mood, I can sit here at this keyboard for 12 days straight days 
Figured it was only fair to warn ya'... just in case ya' wanted to stay away for a week or so 
Lucky for y'all, dad has a couple dead elms he wants taken down... so I will be away from the keyboard for two, or maybe three of those days (during daylight hours).
But I ain't gonna' tell ya' which days ... you'll just haf'ta take your chances.


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## ckr74 (Dec 23, 2014)

Does that mean we can rib you some more about secondary burn stoves?


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## Whitespider (Dec 23, 2014)

*ABSOLUTLY ‼*
When do we start??
*


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## Hinerman (Dec 23, 2014)

Maybe it is time for you to purchase a moisture meter and do some testing


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## farmer steve (Dec 23, 2014)

ckr74 said:


> Does that mean we can rib you some more about secondary burn stoves?



AND BIAS TIRES.


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## 1project2many (Dec 23, 2014)

I think the thing to do is keep pinging the site so we can determine when you're away to refill the stove. We'll figure out the true schedule...


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## Retired (Dec 23, 2014)

I'm guessing you don't have any snow on the ground yet? So this would be a good week for me to bring up a couple sheets of tin to cover your stacks?


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## Rudedog (Dec 23, 2014)

Im going to make this thread implode by asking an oil mix question. Kinda like asking the main frame to solve pie on Star Trek. You'll be stuck in an oil war vortex for 12 days.


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## Chris-PA (Dec 23, 2014)

Rudedog said:


> You'll be stuck in an oil war vortex for 12 days.


Beats being stuck in a Polar Vortex for months!


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## ash man (Dec 23, 2014)

Speaking of polar vortex, what happened to it? Been almost springlike so fare this year in Ohio. Looks like I'll have some wood left over.


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## blades (Dec 23, 2014)

Wait for it !!!!!!!


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## BeatCJ (Dec 23, 2014)

A general grammatical question,off topic, but shouldn't that be "all y'all"?


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## ChoppyChoppy (Dec 23, 2014)

Back when I had a paying job (vs owning a company... haha!) I usually ended up working harder on vacation.
All my Co workers would go on trips. I'd take time off to bring in my firewood, hang drywall, fix a car, etc! Even still I did 12 years in the Air Force and when I got out I sold almost 90 days of leave. We got 30 days a year.


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## benp (Dec 23, 2014)

Chris-PA said:


> Beats being stuck in a Polar Vortex for months!



No kidding!!!! I'll drink to that one.



ash man said:


> Speaking of polar vortex, what happened to it? Been almost springlike so fare this year in Ohio. Looks like I'll have some wood left over.



Way to poke the bear. Great.

It's like going on a roadtrip and saying out loud " We haven't seen any cops yet, while the cruise is set at 90."

there are some things you just think and not say.


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## Del_ (Dec 23, 2014)

Whitespider said:


> I've decided to use up the last of my vacation time.
> Workin' today... but won't be goin' back until January 5th.
> So... if'n I'm in the mood, I can sit here at this keyboard for 12 days straight days
> Figured it was only fair to warn ya'... just in case ya' wanted to stay away for a week or so
> ...




That's a hellofa lot of beer!

Merry Christmas to you and yours.


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## Guswhit (Dec 23, 2014)

No body is safe now!


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## hanniedog (Dec 23, 2014)

12 days of whitespider and they say waterboarding is torture.


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## Overclock (Dec 23, 2014)

Any body else want to spend twelve days and nights at club Gitmo instead?



hanniedog said:


> 12 days of whitespider and they say waterboarding is torture.


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## zogger (Dec 23, 2014)

Well, I am prepared. Just reprogrammed my robot chicken drones to gather up and stack aluminum beer cans....


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## hupte (Dec 23, 2014)

lol. white spidey has a bunch of friends here. lol.

i have a question about elm. Ulmus americana, to be exact. i know its the exact same thing as red elm (aka chineese elm) and that it gets up to 40 inches in diameter. and that it has leaves bigger than the average human foot. but what i'm wondering is that since its black when you cut it does the smoke that comes out of the fire will be black too??

lol!!!


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## 1project2many (Dec 23, 2014)

zogger said:


> Well, I am prepared. Just reprogrammed my robot chicken drones to gather up and stack aluminum beer cans....



They can be programmed to type you know.


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## Overclock (Dec 23, 2014)

hanniedog said:


> 12 days of whitespider and they say waterboarding is torture.



12 days of Whitespider this calls for a nice Christmas song.

On the first day of Whitespider my true love gave to me 
large box of beer.
On the second day of Whitespider my true love gave to me
Stihl 026
On the third day of Whitespider my true love gave to me
pounding migraine pain Stihl 026 and a large box of budweiser beer.
On the fourth day of Whitespider my true love gave to me
bumper chains with depth gauges filed off
On the fifth day of Whitespider my true love gave to me
almost new tires from 1978
On the sixth day of Whitespider my true love gave to me
giant pulsating brain

Giant pulsating brain, Tires from '78, all them bumper chains, pounding migraine pain, Stihl 026 and Another case of cold Budweiser beer.

On the seventh day of Whitespider my true love gave to me
Budweiser underwear
Eighth day of Whitespider my true love gave to me
two dumptrucks of hardwood
on the ninth day of Whitespider my true love gave to me
ticket stubs from Santana at the Horizon
on the tenth day of Whitespider my true love gave to me
Brief history of Iowa from '59
On the eleventh day of Whitespider my true love gave to me
Steve NWWI password to this site
On the twelth day of Whitespider my true love gave to me
a thirty pack of Budweiser cans.

Thirty more Bud, Steve's password, 'brief' history, used Santana stubs, two loads of wood, Boxer's not briefs, giant pulsating brain, tires from '78, converted safety chains, pounding migraine pain, Stihl 026 and another case Anheuser-Busch cheer.




We love you man.


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## Deleted member 83629 (Dec 23, 2014)

im sure he is busy fighting his smoke dragon furnace.


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## Whitespider (Dec 23, 2014)

Well, this thread turned out to be way more fun than I figured it would be... way more.
The 12 Days of Christmas song was over the top 
And it goes to show that Overclock pays closer attention then he lets on to.
*


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## Guswhit (Dec 23, 2014)

Overclock said:


> 12 days of Whitespider this calls for a nice Christmas song.
> 
> On the first day of Whitespider my true love gave to me
> large box of beer.
> ...



All that and no mention of biased ply tires? I think you need to redo the part about '78 tires.


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## Overclock (Dec 23, 2014)

It was 'imply-ed'. 


The tires were the only gift mentioned that keeps on giving besides the 026 and Steve's password.


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## Deleted member 83629 (Dec 23, 2014)

they had radials in 78 they also went by the alpha numeric system like H78-15 or G78-15.


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## Whitespider (Dec 23, 2014)

Remember Cragar and Red Line combination??
I probably still have a set layin' 'round somewhere


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## mainewoods (Dec 23, 2014)

Took me 3 paychecks to pay for my first set of Cragar's back in '67.


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## brenndatomu (Dec 23, 2014)

hupte said:


> but what i'm wondering is that since its black when you cut it does the smoke that comes out of the fire will be black too??


Only if you run used diesel motor oil in your saw for bar lube


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## 1project2many (Dec 23, 2014)

Price of Cragars & Redlines today is a wee bit more then when we were kids. I've bought cars for less than one tire/wheel combo today.

Firewood can still be had for free, though.


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## zogger (Dec 23, 2014)

1project2many said:


> Price of Cragars & Redlines today is a wee bit more then when we were kids. I've bought cars for less than one tire/wheel combo today.
> 
> Firewood can still be had for free, though.



I miss the $100 rat row in the back of the used car lots..I think they crush all the cheap almost runners today as soon as they can...my best one I ever scored was a 55 ford panel wagon.


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## chucker (Dec 23, 2014)

Whitespider said:


> I've decided to use up the last of my vacation time.
> Workin' today... but won't be goin' back until January 5th.
> So... if'n I'm in the mood, I can sit here at this keyboard for 12 days straight days
> Figured it was only fair to warn ya'... just in case ya' wanted to stay away for a week or so
> ...


whooooa!! wait a minute! you had us worried there for a minute! we actually thought you were going to take a Bahama vacation for you and the little woman. so you will be here to keep some of us politically correct and the others just in check? do I have this partially right? either way chill out with a cold one and enjoy ole man (need a vacation ? from all that A. S. correctness)winter next to the warm confuzzer! ..... lol and "MERRY CHRISTMAS" to you and yours!


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## Whitespider (Dec 23, 2014)

zogger said:


> _*I miss the $100 rat row in the back of the used car lots..I think they crush all the cheap almost runners today as soon as they can...*_


The Obama Administration "Cash for Clunkers" program in 2009 sounded the death knell for rat row. A program that cost the American tax pay payer $3 billion and only improved the average fuel economy of all vehicles sold in that year by a mere 0.7 MPG, not even saving us one days worth of fuel. CO2 emissions were cut less than 1%... and that doesn't allow for building and shipping the new cars. _Some_ studies claim the costs outweighed the benefits by nearly $1.5 billion. (No, I'm not gonna' post links to references, 'cause someone will just post a link that says the opposite... do your own research, make your own decision.)

The program required the trade-in be destroyed... which took nearly nearly a million "clunkers" off the roads and dealer lots. The balance of supply and demand was thrown completely askew... it drove up the price of used cars, and forever removed the $100 (or even $1000) rat row. What was a $1500 used car became a $3000 used car overnight... and the $3000 car became a $5000 car... etc...
I was in the business at the time...
Before 2009 we always had 6-12 runners sittin' on "rat row"... as is, no warranty, priced from $100 (or going scrap price) to $1500. If they didn't sell in a week or two (usually any offer would buy it), we called the salvage yard. And heck, the salvage yard would set them out front for a month or so and sell half of 'em or better. If'n I had to guess, all said and done... at least 85% of 'em were sold and re-licensed.
After 2009, rat row was where we piled the snow in winter... what few "rats" that did come in weren't worth messin' with... complete unsaleable junk.

The "poor" fella' was screwed again... and so was the middle class fella' looking for a good, cheap used third car for the kid to drive (like the $1995.00 special... they were gone also). Now-a-days, what was a $500 rat is the $1995.00 special... thanks tree-huggers.
*


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## Whitespider (Dec 23, 2014)

Oh ‼ And when I said, "_Some_ studies claim the costs outweighed the benefits by nearly $1.5 billion"... that's just the tax dollars spent, it don't include what it's cost the consumer since.
*


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## Jim Timber (Dec 23, 2014)

The song made me laugh - that was great!

Thinking about what's happened to the used car industry since '09 is sad. It's true too. Been looking for a beater farm truck and they just aren't out there like they used to be. Scrap price is part of it, but that's down now and vehicle prices haven't corrected yet.


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## svk (Dec 23, 2014)

Overclock said:


> 12 days of Whitespider this calls for a nice Christmas song.
> 
> On the first day of Whitespider my true love gave to me
> large box of beer.
> ...


That's awesome.

I thought there might be a high end moisture meter or romantic date with slowp in there somewhere...


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## unclemoustache (Dec 23, 2014)

Now that's good thinking - let's take up a collection and send him on a 12-day vacation to SW Warshington to visit slowp!


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## chucker (Dec 23, 2014)

unclemoustache said:


> Now that's good thinking - let's take up a collection and send him on a 12-day vacation to SW Warshington to visit slowp!


? he might decide to move there.....lol


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## Overclock (Dec 24, 2014)

Thankfully Warshington is just fly over country.


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## Whitespider (Dec 24, 2014)

unclemoustache said:


> _*Now that's good thinking - let's take up a collection and send him on a 12-day vacation to SW Warshington to visit slowp!*_


My birthday is on the 9th if'n y'all are lookin' for a gift idea...
That would be a kick... can you see it?? I'm knockin' on her door with suitcase in hand... she answers... "can I help you"... I push by her as I'm sayin', "hey slowp, it's me, Whitespider‼ Where do I put my stuff?? Where's the beer??... (you fill in the blank from there) 

Heck, I'd even pitch in on the cost just to see the look on her face...
*


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## Rudedog (Dec 24, 2014)

Whitespider said:


> My birthday is on the 9th if'n y'all are lookin' for a gift idea...
> That would be a kick... can you see it?? I'm knockin' on her door with suitcase in hand... she answers... "can I help you"... I push by her as I'm sayin', "hey slowp, it's me, Whitespider‼ Where do I put my stuff?? Where's the beer??... (you fill in the blank from there)
> 
> Heck, I'd even pitch in on the cost just to see the look on her face...
> *


She'd probably just babble over and over again about not moving there.


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## brenndatomu (Dec 24, 2014)

Whitespider said:


> My birthday is on the 9th if'n y'all are lookin' for a gift idea...
> That would be a kick... can you see it?? I'm knockin' on her door with suitcase in hand... she answers... "can I help you"... I push by her as I'm sayin', "hey slowp, it's me, Whitespider‼ Where do I put my stuff?? Where's the beer??... (you fill in the blank from there)
> 
> Heck, I'd even pitch in on the cost just to see the look on her face...
> *


You'd finally get to see a real stove in action!


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## philoshop (Dec 24, 2014)

I'd send you some information on the FDA's plan to ban e-cigarettes, but I don't think you want to spend the next 12 days quite that pizzed off.
OTOH, it does provide some interesting insight into the methods and motivations of our country's regulatory agencies.


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## hupte (Dec 24, 2014)

Whitespider said:


> (you fill in the blank from there)
> *


she looks at you starry eyed and says in a chillingly calm voice, "we've been waiting for you..."
whitespider replies "...(gulp) who's we??"

and thats the last time anyone heard from whitespidey... although a picture surfaced years later. of someone who looked just like him at the democratic national convention, with slowp standing next to him.


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## Guswhit (Dec 24, 2014)

Damn you guys are funny! I'm sitting at the doctors office reading this lol and getting lots of looks! The democratic convention takes the cake!


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## mn woodcutter (Dec 24, 2014)

Guswhit said:


> Damn you guys are funny! I'm sitting at the doctors office reading this lol and getting lots of looks! The democratic convention takes the cake!


Sitting at the doctors office on Christmas eve. That sucks. I hope all is well.


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## farmer steve (Dec 24, 2014)

hupte said:


> she looks at you starry eyed and says in a chillingly calm voice, "we've been waiting for you..."
> whitespider replies "...(gulp) who's we??"
> 
> and thats the last time anyone heard from whitespidey... although a picture surfaced years later. of someone who looked just like him at the democratic national convention, with slowp standing next to him.


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## mn woodcutter (Dec 24, 2014)

Remember that only stihl saws with the model plate riveted on the top are any good!


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## slowp (Dec 24, 2014)

I don't think you'd be able to find my place. We have a lot of topography that would scare you flatlanders too much. My road would probably cause you to have a heart attack. It has a bit of outsloping to it. Nope, don't move here. Enjoy your holidays in Iowa, where you won't get a bloody nose from all the elevation changes. Oh, and you'd REALLY feel like you needed a gun in our woodsy area. Besides having topography, we've got cougars, bears, and those scary chipmunks. Nope, "you all" wouldn't be able to handle it. Now don't drink too much and enjoy the time off. Get off the #@# computer and go out and do something fun with the family. I'm stuck here horking my lungs out, or I'd be doing something else. The ski area opened up more runs today.


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## farmer steve (Dec 24, 2014)

slowp said:


> I don't think you'd be able to find my place. We have a lot of topography that would scare you flatlanders too much. My road would probably cause you to have a heart attack. It has a bit of outsloping to it. Nope, don't move here. Enjoy your holidays in Iowa, where you won't get a bloody nose from all the elevation changes. Oh, and you'd REALLY feel like you needed a gun in our woodsy area. Besides having topography, we've got cougars, bears, and those scary chipmunks. Nope, "you all" wouldn't be able to handle it. Now don't drink too much and enjoy the time off. Get off the #@# computer and go out and do something fun with the family. I'm stuck here horking my lungs out, or I'd be doing something else. The ski area opened up more runs today.


chipmunks are great over some hickory coals.skin'em,dress 'em roast.em.  Merry Christmas SlowP have a good one. FS.


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## Overclock (Dec 24, 2014)

Whitespider said:


> My birthday is on the 9th if'n y'all are lookin' for a gift idea...
> That would be a kick... can you see it?? I'm knockin' on her door with suitcase in hand... she answers... "can I help you"... I push by her as I'm sayin', "hey slowp, it's me, Whitespider‼ Where do I put my stuff?? Where's the beer??... *(you fill in the blank from there)* *



OK no problem lol wait for it...................


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## Overclock (Dec 24, 2014)

Whitespider said:


> My birthday is on the 9th if'n y'all are lookin' for a gift idea...
> That would be a kick... can you see it?? I'm knockin' on her door with suitcase in hand... she answers... "can I help you"... I push by her as I'm sayin', "hey slowp, it's me, Whitespider‼ Where do I put my stuff?? Where's the beer??... (you fill in the blank from there)




"What do you expect man free beer huh when you left me for my sister walked out on me at the skynard concert in '75 with Penelope my 'sister' fastp, what ever made you think i would take you back?
BYOB you beer whore I invite you to my trailer for one thing and that is the ritual BTW the skandihoovian candle has been lit since the minute you called me." slowp said

"Baby I didn't mean you no harm. You know how manipulitive fastp can be." said the spider

"Well it has been a long time. I have two lids of solid green gank from the veterinary dispensary. The used dog has glaucoma, you know. Research indicates Thai Blueberry Master will cure any Lab." she said. 

"Do you mind if I invite a friend for our reunion?" slowp added in a subtle moan.

"Sure," said Whitespider on his 13th beer.

After two decades were recaptured in twenty minutes, Gologit's Toyota headlights illuminated the Airstream..........


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## unclemoustache (Dec 25, 2014)

Who the heck is overclock? He's obviously been around here for a while! Is this another manifestation of the Ljute ghost?


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## Steve NW WI (Dec 25, 2014)

unclemoustache said:


> Who the heck is overclock? He's obviously been around here for a while! Is this another manifestation of the Ljute ghost?



I had to look, I thought it'd be much closer to ol' Avalancher's home town of Newport, but they're clear across the state from each other. Maybe they share the same rural distillation specialist?

Merry Christmas, everybody!


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## stratton (Dec 25, 2014)

slowp said:


> I don't think you'd be able to find my place. We have a lot of topography that would scare you flatlanders too much. My road would probably cause you to have a heart attack. It has a bit of outsloping to it. Nope, don't move here. Enjoy your holidays in Iowa, where you won't get a bloody nose from all the elevation changes. Oh, and you'd REALLY feel like you needed a gun in our woodsy area. Besides having topography, we've got cougars, bears, and those scary chipmunks. Nope, "you all" wouldn't be able to handle it. Now don't drink too much and enjoy the time off. Get off the #@# computer and go out and do something fun with the family. I'm stuck here horking my lungs out, or I'd be doing something else. The ski area opened up more runs today.


Slowp, Im a big skier up in vt, Jay peak and Stowe..... While we have 12 days to talk about it, give me some details of your area. thx Luke


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## Whitespider (Dec 25, 2014)

I'm sittin' here with my coffee, during my mornin' alone time, waitin' for the family to arise, and admirin' all the stuff Santa brought last night.
Still... I can't help but wonder where fastp is these days, as a tear falls from the corner of my eye rememberin' a lid of green gank was only 15-bucks at that Skynard concert...


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## Overclock (Dec 25, 2014)




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## Rudedog (Dec 25, 2014)

Overclock said:


>


If this picture doesn't scream for the caption "Burn Witch, Burn!", then I'm a Monkeys Uncle.


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## Whitespider (Dec 25, 2014)

As you can see, other than puttin' on a little weight, ain't much changed much since the 70s...


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## Overclock (Dec 25, 2014)

Sorry Rudedog, violence is not called for. I'm a gun totin' country kid here with a vastly different worldview than some other folk, but I happen to like and respect Patty.


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## Rudedog (Dec 25, 2014)

Too bad you didn't have a "Power Stache" in that pic. I'd nominate it for the Smithsonians 70's exhibit.


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## farmer steve (Dec 25, 2014)

Whitespider said:


> As you can see, other than puttin' on a little weight, ain't much changed much since the 70s...
> 
> View attachment 389356


F-78-14 bias ply


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## Rudedog (Dec 25, 2014)

Overclock said:


> Sorry Rudedog, violence is not not called for. I'm a gun totin' country kid here with a vastly different worldview than some other folk, but I happen to like and respect Patty.


I didn't know that was her picture. When you look at the pic it looks almost like she's staked out above the fire but in the middle of it like the Salem Witch trials movie. I meant no personal disrespect. I've never seen a picture of slowp.


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## Overclock (Dec 25, 2014)

Whitespider said:


> As you can see, other than puttin' on a little weight, ain't much changed much since the 70s...
> 
> View attachment 389356



15 per lid? lol


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## Overclock (Dec 25, 2014)

Rudedog said:


> I didn't know that was her picture. When you look at the pic it looks almost like she's staked out above the fire but in the middle of it like the Salem Witch trials movie. I meant no personal disrespect. I've never seen a picture of slowp.



It was from one of her threads about camping. Sorry I misunderstood you.


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## Whitespider (Dec 25, 2014)

Here's another from the '70s for y'all to enjoy.
The speedo is dad  not me... I'm the guy with the Budweiser  (it likely has one of those new-fangled tear-off pop-tops... no church key required).




Did ya' notice the fender skirts on that road tank?? 
*


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## Overclock (Dec 25, 2014)

Those two chicks look like they are expecting you to say or do something strange.....



Whitespider said:


> Did ya' notice the fender skirts on that road tank??



Yup, I was thinking why did the Ford dealers have a freaking Newport? Haha. Is it a Grand Marquis with the Lincoln package? I can't tell by the bodylines.


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## philoshop (Dec 25, 2014)

Yer leanin' a bit to the left in that pic. Wind, or the Buds? Or "the wind-n-the Buds"? Maybe the buds, and not the Buds??? Merry Christmas Bud-dy!!


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## Overclock (Dec 25, 2014)

philoshop said:


> Yer leanin' a bit to the left in that pic. Wind, or the Buds? Or "the wind-n-the Buds"? Maybe the buds, and not the Buds??? Merry Christmas Bud-dy!!



I think he broke wind in the wind. The old classic leg hike and the look on the chicks' faces. Clearly a well-timed fart.


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## slowp (Dec 25, 2014)

Rudedog said:


> If this picture doesn't scream for the caption "Burn Witch, Burn!", then I'm a Monkeys Uncle.



Getting a little emotional, aren't you. I made that candle and got it going. It was hard to do because the wood was a bit wet. Now go have a good Christmas.


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## Overclock (Dec 25, 2014)

slowp said:


> I made that candle and got it going. It was hard to do because the wood was a bit wet. Now go have a good Christmas.









Rudedog was just kidding. Actually you are kind of cute. Do loggers blush when you threaten to box their ears?


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## hanniedog (Dec 25, 2014)

I do believe the Used Dog looks to be under demonic influences.


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## Overclock (Dec 25, 2014)

hanniedog said:


> I do believe the Used Dog looks to be under demonic influences.



His glaucoma was gettin' inflamed. I think he was OK later.


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## Whitespider (Dec 25, 2014)

Overclock said:


> *Is it a Grand Marquis with the Lincoln package?*


Pretty sure that's a '73 (maybe '72, maybe '74) Mercury Brougham 2-door.
The "Grand" Marquis wasn't until '75 and had a lot more chrome... the dead give-a-way for a Grand Marquis is chrome moldings along the mid body line, about where everyone's knees are in that picture. Both the Brougham and Grand Marquis had the rear fender skirts through '78 I believe.

Lordy, those things were friggin' tanks‼ Dad always drove the current year model, with the biggest engine available... so if that's a '73 it's got a 460 sittin' in it, if it's a '72 it would have the 429.
*


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## philoshop (Dec 25, 2014)

The family truckster.


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## Overclock (Dec 26, 2014)

Fastp was in the passenger seat of Gologit's truck. She'd had him at gunpoint all the way from NorCal demanding he drive her to Patty's to, "settle the score." Gologit obliged her out of fear for his life, but he tried to talk sense into her all the way up the coast. Penelope was convinced Whitespider would be hers and Gologit was her ticket......


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## farmer steve (Dec 26, 2014)

Overclock said:


> Fastp was in the passenger seat of Gologit's truck. She'd had him at gunpoint all the way from NorCal demanding he drive her to Patty's to, "settle the score." Gologit obliged her out of fear for his life, but he tried to talk sense into her all the way up the coast. Penelope was convinced Whitespider would be hers and Gologit was her ticket......


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## Whitespider (Dec 26, 2014)

Hey‼ Don't stop the man, I wanna' know how the story plays out 
Carry on Overclock.
*


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## AIM (Dec 26, 2014)

A little late to this party so I thought I'd mention that I just bought a twin pack of Husky SYNTHETIC 2 stroke oil. Sorry spidey but I'm a believer.


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## Vibes (Dec 26, 2014)

Overclock said:


> 15 per lid? lol


 It was four fingers for $20 around these parts. So you looked for the fat guy


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## Overclock (Dec 26, 2014)

Sorry Dude I'm all thumbs.


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## Vibes (Dec 26, 2014)

Overclock said:


> Sorry Dude I'm all thumbs.



Youda man!!!!


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## philoshop (Dec 26, 2014)

Overclock said:


> Fastp was in the passenger seat of Gologit's truck. She'd had him at gunpoint all the way from NorCal demanding he drive her to Patty's to, "settle the score." Gologit obliged her out of fear for his life, but he tried to talk sense into her all the way up the coast. Penelope was convinced Whitespider would be hers and Gologit was her ticket......



...The inky darkness held no clues to the fate which would be theirs, as they inched their way through the foggy mountains in search of properly covered firewood and a stove that wouldn't produce any smoke, lest it give away their progress and annoy the neighbors. Stopping briefly at the side of the road, ears alert to any indication of Progress and hearing none but the call of the spotted owl and the shivering of those without proper stoves, Penelope pushed on...


----------



## slowp (Dec 26, 2014)

You know, that's not a "clever" thing to be writing. You go to the stereotypical thinking that women must be enemies. That's kind of insulting, but that's par for the course when one guy who advocates being mean to "his" women is admired because he posts lots of cool videos. Such high standards!!

I happen to know Mrs. Gologit and she's a neat person. She's good people. She used to post on this forum but decided it wasn't worth the time and aggravation. I'm beginning to think she might be right. 

So go on. I guess you've run the topics of Which Saw Should I Buy, Bark Side Down, I Hate EPA, See My Manly Stacks, etc into the ground. 

And Overclock, you may be on this forum, but I don't consider you to be a friend. My friends are people I know. 

Now go out and do something productive. Pick your nose, scratch yer manly parts, drink cheap beer, and smell your farts. I guess that's what flatlanders like to do.


----------



## 1project2many (Dec 26, 2014)

slowp said:


> You know, that's not a "clever" thing to be writing. You go to the stereotypical thinking that women must be enemies.



Ummm... and you reply with an aggressive, adversarial tone to do what? Confirm the stereotype? Is there a chance you're misunderstanding what's happening?

Just sayin...


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## Deleted member 83629 (Dec 26, 2014)

wat could be worse spidey or brush ape


----------



## olyman (Dec 26, 2014)

1project2many said:


> Ummm... and you reply with an aggressive, adversarial tone to do what? Confirm the stereotype? Is there a chance you're misunderstanding what's happening?
> 
> Just sayin...


----------



## olyman (Dec 26, 2014)

philoshop said:


> ...The inky darkness held no clues to the fate which would be theirs, as they inched their way through the foggy mountains in search of properly covered firewood and a stove that wouldn't produce any smoke, lest it give away their progress and annoy the neighbors. Stopping briefly at the side of the road, ears alert to any indication of Progress and hearing none but the call of the spotted owl and the shivering of those without proper stoves, Penelope pushed on...


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## olyman (Dec 26, 2014)

yup. more and more on here,, figuring it out.................


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## Chris-PA (Dec 26, 2014)

slowp said:


> You know, that's not a "clever" thing to be writing. You go to the stereotypical thinking that women must be enemies. That's kind of insulting, but that's par for the course when one guy who advocates being mean to "his" women is admired because he posts lots of cool videos. Such high standards!!
> 
> I happen to know Mrs. Gologit and she's a neat person. She's good people. She used to post on this forum but decided it wasn't worth the time and aggravation. I'm beginning to think she might be right.
> 
> ...


Slowp, not all of us are impressed by this inappropriate and obnoxious BS. 

Guys - what are you, 12? Grow the hell up.


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## Whitespider (Dec 26, 2014)

Impressed?? What's to be impressed with?? Fun is just that... fun.
Heck... I still wanna' know how the story plays out... and it has nothin' to do with all the sensitive stuff.
I find laughin' at myself quite entertaining, and wholesome... damn wholesome‼
If'n ya' can't laugh at yourself, ya' got yourself a big-azz problem.



slowp said:


> *You know, that's not a "clever" thing to be writing.
> Overclock...I don't consider you to be a friend.*


Seriously slowp? There weren't nothin' meant by any of it.
See, here's the difference between us... I consider you a friend, our differences don't enter into it. You may only be an internet friend, which don't hold the near the same weight as a personal and trusted friend, but still a friend...
*


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## stihly dan (Dec 26, 2014)

I don't know what is really going on, but it seems clever and funny from an innocent bystanders view.


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## unclemoustache (Dec 27, 2014)

One of these days I'm going to have to try one of slowp's Scandahoovian Candles.

And I'd consider most everybody I've ever conversed with around here a friend. None of you are 'good' friends, since I've not met most of you, but friends anyway.


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## Deleted member 83629 (Dec 27, 2014)

glad i missed the fun i spent the better part of the afternoon getting my 200 gallon fuel tank filled with gasoline at my house. been wondering when it is going to get cold 
this 52 degree crap is getting on my nerves.


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## Whitespider (Dec 27, 2014)

stihly dan said:


> *I don't know what is really going on...*


I do. Let me explain it to you.
It seems someone has been offended by some harmless fun... so much offended that they post this...


> You know, that's not a "clever" thing to be writing. You go to the *stereotypical thinking* that women must be enemies. That's kind of *insulting*, but that's *par for the course* when one guy who advocates being mean to "his" women is admired because he posts lots of cool videos. *Such high standards*!!


Then, after first claiming the moral high ground, and stating that stereotyping and insulting women is "par for the course", the same person ends the same post with this...


> Now go out and do something productive. Pick your nose, scratch yer manly parts, drink cheap beer, and smell your farts. *I guess that's what flatlanders like to do*.


Next comes this sort'a thing...


> ...not all of us are impressed by this inappropriate and obnoxious BS.
> Guys - what are you, 12? Grow the hell up.


So I just gotta' ask...
 Who's stereotyping?? Who's being insulting?? Who's being inappropriate?? Who's being obnoxious?? Who's acting like they're 12?? And just exactly who needs to grow the hell up??

*


----------



## farmer steve (Dec 27, 2014)

Whitespider said:


> Impressed?? What's to be impressed with?? Fun is just that... fun.
> Heck... I still wanna' know how the story plays out... and it has nothin' to do with all the sensitive stuff.
> I find laughin' at myself quite entertaining, and wholesome... damn wholesome‼
> If'n ya' can't laugh at yourself, ya' got yourself a big-azz problem.
> ...


i agree 110% Spidey. i don't agree with some things i read here but i consider every member a friend. i think we all joined AS with things in common like saws ,firewood and stuff. i know the thread was started in fun.and most have done that. 8 days to go. i can't wait to see how the story plays out.


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## Whitespider (Dec 27, 2014)

This here is a _true_ story...
Wednesday evening I stopped at the bowling ally to wish my brother-in-law a merry Christmas (he owns it). I'm standing at the bar with a glass of beer talkin' with this guy (from out'a town, visiting friends over the holiday) next to me. We're gettin' along pretty good, laughin' a bit, and he tells me a couple pretty funny jokes... one is a Scandinavian joke (Ole and Lena), the other is a Pollock joke.

Now get this...
The first joke stereotypes Scandinavian people and, as is typical of Ole and Lena jokes, stereotypes the man as a putz. The second joke stereotypes the Polish people as plain retards. Neither joke is in any way "flattering" of the subjects... quite the opposite.
So I tell him a pretty funny stereotypical black joke, (by-the-way, a black friend told it to me)... this guy gets a funny look on his face, and accuses _me_ of being racist‼ I said, "What‼??‼ You just told a Scandinavian and a Polish joke, and I'm racist but you're not??" He actually tried tellin' me that it was not the same thing. When I started laughin', he walked away pizzed-off. My brother-in-law looks at me and says with a grin, "He must be German." 

True damn story...
*


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## Overclock (Dec 27, 2014)

farmer steve said:


> 8 days to go. i can't wait to see how the story plays out.




Oh Yeah!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## Overclock (Dec 27, 2014)

slowp said:


> Pick your nose, scratch yer manly parts, drink cheap beer, and smell your farts.



Was that a haiku??????.............


.....or an incantation?????????


----------



## Overclock (Dec 27, 2014)

..........or an anthem?????


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## svk (Dec 27, 2014)

Whitespider said:


> "What‼??‼ You just told a Scandinavian and a Polish joke, and I'm racist but you're not??" He actually tried tellin' me that it was not the same thing. When I started laughin', he walked away pizzed-off. My brother-in-law looks at me and says with a grin, "He must be German."
> 
> True damn story...
> *


And that right there is the double standard of the decade. There can be one protected class but not others. Why is that. You were dead on in your comeback too. 

Some day the pendulum will swing.


----------



## olyman (Dec 27, 2014)

Whitespider said:


> This here is a _true_ story...
> Wednesday evening I stopped at the bowling ally to wish my brother-in-law a merry Christmas (he owns it). I'm standing at the bar with a glass of beer talkin' with this guy (from out'a town, visiting friends over the holiday) next to me. We're gettin' along pretty good, laughin' a bit, and he tells me a couple pretty funny jokes... one is a Scandinavian joke (Ole and Lena), the other is a Pollock joke.
> 
> Now get this...
> ...


  blind in one eye, was he??? sheesh.....................


----------



## Gologit (Dec 27, 2014)

Whitespider said:


> So I just gotta' ask...
> Who's stereotyping?? Who's being insulting?? Who's being inappropriate?? Who's being obnoxious?? Who's acting like they're 12?? And just exactly who needs to grow the hell up??
> 
> *



I'm not upset by any of this. It's hard to be offended by people, grown men supposedly, whose level of behavior and decency reached it's peak somewhere around the age of 10. It would be like being offended by the mentally ill or the retarded. I can feel sorry for you and I can be really glad that you're not any important part of my life but to be offended by you would mean that what you say has any real substance or affect on my life. It doesn't. It never will. 
You and Overclock are just doing what you do best, being obnoxious and making noise. Those seem to be your only real skills. I'm glad that you two found each other. It's a good fit. People who are poorly adjusted, lacking in social ability, not measurably successful in life, and who like to make themselves feel better by denigrating others also like peer approval. You two can fuel each other's ego. You both apparently need that.
I don't need to defend Slowp. She's perfectly capable of defending herself but, then again, she hasn't really done anything that needs defending. She called you out, showed you up for what you really are, and left you with your juvenile attitudes and behavior exposed for all to see. Did a good job of it too.
So, you and Overclock keep on with your little displays of playground mentality. Maybe I'll read them, maybe I won't. It doesn't really matter. You guys are harmless. Childish, but harmless.


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## Overclock (Dec 27, 2014)

That's a relief! Whew. Thanks.

Stay tuned for Chapter 2, "Man Bowling, Nine Pin with the Twins."


----------



## Guswhit (Dec 27, 2014)

Overclock said:


> Was that a haiku??????.............
> 
> 
> .....or an incantation?????????


Well it doesn't have the correct number of syllables for a haiku and I'm too lazy at the moment to look up an incantation


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## Whitespider (Dec 27, 2014)

So Gologit... since you weren't offended, and you felt no need to defend anyone... the whole point of your post was to belittle, insult and offend (i.e., denigrate)??
FYI... didn't work... but I liked the post because it was a damn good attempt‼
*


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## Vibes (Dec 27, 2014)

Just checked back at this thread.What happened to all the holiday cheer? Can it go back to the 70's jokes?


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## brenndatomu (Dec 27, 2014)

Seems to be a lot of threads here lately that change elevation and direction like a mountain side goat trail


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## svk (Dec 27, 2014)

Vibes said:


> Just checked back at this thread.What happened to all the holiday cheer? Can it go back to the 70's jokes?


Left coasters don't have much of a sense of humor I guess.


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## Whitespider (Dec 27, 2014)

The problem ain't just the lack of a sense of humor...
*


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## slowp (Dec 27, 2014)

svk said:


> Left coasters don't have much of a sense of humor I guess.


Maybe not, but we can operate our woodstoves successfully without making a major production of it. Oh my, this fire was sooooooo hard to get going....NOT.


----------



## hseII (Dec 27, 2014)

Whitespider said:


> Well, this thread turned out to be way more fun than I figured it would be... way more.
> The 12 Days of Christmas song was over the top
> And it goes to show that Overclock pays closer attention then he lets on to.
> *


It's almost like he's been here a while


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## Whitespider (Dec 27, 2014)

svk said:


> *And that right there is the double standard of the decade. There can be one protected class but not others. Why is that.*


Decade*s*...
Why?? Because "we the people" have allowed it. It ain't about being fair, or sensitive, or understanding, or anything like that... it's about being politically correct.
Except, that is, for the people who champion and drive the correctness agenda... for them it's all about the money.
Sad really...
And you're correct about the pendulum... the people who started it swinging in one direction ain't smart enough to see they need to get out'a the way of the return swing.
*


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## Whitespider (Dec 27, 2014)

slowp said:


> *...we can operate our woodstoves successfully without making a major production of it. Oh my, this fire was sooooooo hard to get going....NOT.*


I hate to tell ya' this slowp, but the above, along with the added picture... is makin' pretty close to a "major production" out'a it.
No doubt you're unable to see the irony of it though.
*


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## svk (Dec 27, 2014)

Whitespider said:


> Decade*s*...
> Why?? Because "we the people" have allowed it. It ain't about being fair, or sensitive, or understanding, or anything like that... it's about being politically correct.
> Except, that is, for the people who champion and drive the correctness agenda... for them it's all about the money.
> Sad really...
> ...


Yes decades. But in this decade you can lose everything for saying a bad word ie Paula Deen. So many PC police out there looking for ways to be offended.


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## hseII (Dec 27, 2014)

svk said:


> Yes decades. But in this decade you can lose everything for saying a bad word ie Paula Deen. So many PC police out there looking for ways to be offended.


That she said 30 yrs ago.


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## Whitespider (Dec 27, 2014)

Who's Paula Deen??

Never mind... I just Googled her.
*


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## svk (Dec 27, 2014)

Whitespider said:


> Who's Paula Deen??
> 
> Never mind... I just Googled her.
> *


She actually annoys me. But didn't deserve the wrath she received.


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## Whitespider (Dec 27, 2014)

I just asked my wife if she knows who Paula Deen is... and if she knew about the n-word thing... this is how she answered me...
"_How can you not know about Paula Deen?? Typical man... you dumb-azz putz‼_"

So, I can sue her for talkin' to me that way... correct??
Maybe for profiling?? Sexual harassment?? Slander?? How 'bout for just being mean?? 

Can you imaging the backlash from some on this board if I called her a "_typical woman... dumb-azz blond_" in one of my posts?? But I can promise you if she joined and called me a "_typical man... dumb-azz putz_" in one of her posts, those same people would nod their heads in agreement. Heck, they'd even extend sympathy to her for her plight...
*


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## svk (Dec 27, 2014)

Whitespider said:


> I just asked my wife if she knows who Paula Deen is... and if she knew about the n-word thing... this is how she answered me...
> "_How can you not know about Paula Deen?? Typical man... you dumb-azz putz‼_"
> 
> So, I can sue her for talkin' to me that way... correct??
> ...


LOL


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## Overclock (Dec 27, 2014)

Whitespider said:


> Why?? Because "we the people" have allowed it. It ain't about being fair, or sensitive, or understanding, or anything like that... it's about being politically correct.
> *Except, that is, for the people who champion and drive the correctness agenda*... for them it's all about the money.



Well I saw one driving a Prius and another driving a Volt just as a marginal side-note.


----------



## philoshop (Dec 27, 2014)

Overclock said:


> Well I saw one driving a Prius and another driving a Volt just as a marginal side-note.



...racing through the inky darkness of the foggy hills, with the '73 (or'74) family truckster nipping at their heels...

I just like being able to type "inky darkness". No offense to anyone with ink on their hands, or who lives without light.


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## farmer steve (Dec 27, 2014)

philoshop said:


> ...racing through the inky darkness of the foggy hills, with the '73 (or'74) family truckster nipping at their heels...
> 
> I just like being able to type "inky darkness". No offense to anyone with ink on their hands, or who lives without light.


 it just sounds sooooooooooo Spidey.


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## Overclock (Dec 27, 2014)

*Man Bowling; Nine Pin with the Twins
*
_Pick your nose, scratch yer manly parts, drink cheap beer, and smell your farts._
_Eye of newt and wool of lamb Used Dog doo and shell of clam._
_Now put lid down when you pee then wipe the seat off clean for me._
_If candle's fate burns too late horse piss beer inebriate.
Seven's heaven two more makes nine; eight is great but nine is fine._


_
"Eight is great nine heads all mine._" On the evening of the winter solstice, slowp murmured to Penelope through the shadows of moonlit boughs. In the flickering Skandahoovian candlelight, she stood there alone.............


----------



## brenndatomu (Dec 27, 2014)

Whitespider said:


> Heck, they'd even extend sympathy to her for her plight...


Weeeell...I seem to recall somewhere here recently even you admitted she puts up with a lot from you, so, yeah, we be extendin!


----------



## philoshop (Dec 27, 2014)

......beckoning the inky shadows to come hither that the games should commence upon the dawn. With the rumble of the bias ply tires of the 1973 (or '74) family truckster growing ever louder and nearer.....


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## Overclock (Dec 28, 2014)

philoshop said:


> ......beckoning the inky shadows to come hither that the games should commence upon the dawn. With the rumble of the bias ply tires of the 1973 (or '74) family truckster growing ever louder and nearer.....



He was drunk and duct taped up in the Airstream! 



Who's driving the '73 Mercury Brougham?


----------



## tla100 (Dec 28, 2014)

Meow that's some good reading right there......got Super Troopers on right now, anyway......


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## olyman (Dec 28, 2014)

Overclock said:


> Well I saw one driving a Prius and another driving a Volt just as a marginal side-note.


  prickus owners,, are faaarr overated...............


----------



## olyman (Dec 28, 2014)

philoshop said:


> ...racing through the inky darkness of the foggy hills, with the '73 (or'74) family truckster nipping at their heels...
> 
> I just like being able to type "inky darkness". No offense to anyone with ink on their hands, or who lives without light.


 thanks!!!


----------



## olyman (Dec 28, 2014)

Overclock said:


> *Man Bowling; Nine Pin with the Twins
> *
> _Pick your nose, scratch yer manly parts, drink cheap beer, and smell your farts._
> _Eye of newt and wool of lamb Used Dog doo and shell of clam._
> ...


----------



## Whitespider (Dec 28, 2014)

Overclock said:


> *Who's driving the '73 Mercury Brougham?*


My wife...
*


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## Overclock (Dec 28, 2014)

lol the plot sickens.


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## Whitespider (Dec 28, 2014)

...and she never goes anywhere unarmed.
*


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## philoshop (Dec 28, 2014)

Isn't just the act of driving a '73 Merc Brougham basically considered 'being armed'?


----------



## Overclock (Dec 28, 2014)

philoshop said:


> Isn't just the act of driving a '73 Merc Brougham basically considered 'being armed'?



Not if an Imperial is coming head-on.


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## Whitespider (Dec 28, 2014)

Ahhhhhh yes... the '73 Imperial... the last year for the "fuselage" model. A sad fact of the day was that great 440 had been de-tuned so badly due to government regulations (not sayin' Chrysler was the only one forced to do that).
Personally, I liked the leaner, meaner look of the coupe... and the first thing ya' did was swap-out the front bumper with one from a '72 (to rid yourself of those ugly, government mandated, rubber things hangin' on it).


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## hanniedog (Dec 28, 2014)

Nice looking 73, suicide doors would really make that look bitchin.


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## Chris-PA (Dec 28, 2014)

Absurd vehicles to use for transportation, thankfully killed by the peak in US oil production of the early 1970's. They were too big to perform well no matter what engine was in them.

Alas, only to be replaced by the equally stupid SUV's and full sized trucks that I see every day on my commute to work - with one passenger. Often I blast past the 4WD vehicles in the snow with my tiny 1500cc front wheel drive car, while their terrified drivers crawl along at walking speed.


----------



## farmer steve (Dec 28, 2014)

Chris-PA said:


> Absurd vehicles to use for transportation, thankfully killed by the peak in US oil production of the early 1970's. They were too big to perform well no matter what engine was in them.
> 
> Alas, only to be replaced by the equally stupid SUV's and full sized trucks that I see every day on my commute to work - with one passenger. Often I blast past the 4WD vehicles in the snow with my tiny 1500cc front wheel drive car, while their terrified drivers crawl along at walking speed.


BUT,they had a big back seat.


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## Chris-PA (Dec 28, 2014)

farmer steve said:


> BUT,they had a big back seat.


OK. You win.


----------



## Whitespider (Dec 28, 2014)

Chris-PA said:


> *Often I blast past the 4WD vehicles in the snow with my tiny 1500cc front wheel drive car, while their terrified drivers crawl along at walking speed.*


Maybe in Pennsylvania...  ...but any good Iowa boy can drive the bias tire equipped '73 family truckster at 80 MPH, in 8 inches of snow, at night during a raging blizzard, on a narrow gravel road, without flinching, and only one hand on the wheel... 'cause the other hand is needed for holdin' the beer  (headlamps optional)
*


----------



## Whitespider (Dec 28, 2014)

Heck... if she's worth sour owl crap, his girl friend can do it too.
fastp could 
*


----------



## Overclock (Dec 28, 2014)

Chris-PA said:


> Absurd vehicles .... Often I blast past the 4WD vehicles in the snow with my tiny 1500cc front wheel drive car, while their terrified drivers crawl along at walking speed.



Your extra brainpower makes 'er at least 3000cc. Blasting past 4x4's. lol Adding you to the storyline now.


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## Whitespider (Dec 28, 2014)

Today's SUVs are mostly not 4WD...
For example, even the 8-cylinder Ford Explorer is a "one-wheel-wonder" front-wheel drive with on demand rear wheel _assist_. No matter how you advertize it... it ain't no better than front-wheel-drive with a couple drunks sittin' in the back seat ready to push when needed. Friggin' stupid‼
I put my daughter in a '93 rear-wheel-drive Crown Victoria and told her to learn how to drive... even in winter, damnit‼
She learned fast... and actually _*knows*_ how to drive.
*


----------



## Overclock (Dec 28, 2014)

Something to be said for skinny tires. Model T's would go almost anywhere even in mud. I had a 1980 Ford Fairmont and couldn't give you the tire specs but I think they were 4 1/2 inches wide. Dang thing never got stuck.


----------



## philoshop (Dec 28, 2014)

....With the duct tape covered Airstream severely hindering their gas mileage they pushed on through the foreign mountainous terrain (which was still inky), ever aware that the box o' beer was emptying nearly as fast as the gas tank, and desperately searching for the nearest Toyota dealership.....


----------



## AIM (Dec 29, 2014)

I can't vouch for many AWD vehicles but I did drive a AWD gmc safari for a time and I gotta say I was rather impressed with it's ability in the snow.


----------



## 1project2many (Dec 29, 2014)

Overclock said:


> Model T's would go almost anywhere even in mud.



An old time trick for the T and other vehicles with spoked wheels was to tie rags around the wheels for better traction in mud. Worked great but if you looked out to see if the wheels were spinning you'd get a face full of mud.


----------



## fixit1960 (Dec 29, 2014)

Whitespider said:


> The Obama Administration "Cash for Clunkers" program in 2009 sounded the death knell for rat row. A program that cost the American tax pay payer $3 billion and only improved the average fuel economy of all vehicles sold in that year by a mere 0.7 MPG, not even saving us one days worth of fuel. CO2 emissions were cut less than 1%... and that doesn't allow for building and shipping the new cars. _Some_ studies claim the costs outweighed the benefits by nearly $1.5 billion. (No, I'm not gonna' post links to references, 'cause someone will just post a link that says the opposite... do your own research, make your own decision.)
> 
> The program required the trade-in be destroyed... which took nearly nearly a million "clunkers" off the roads and dealer lots. The balance of supply and demand was thrown completely askew... it drove up the price of used cars, and forever removed the $100 (or even $1000) rat row. What was a $1500 used car became a $3000 used car overnight... and the $3000 car became a $5000 car... etc...
> I was in the business at the time...
> ...




I agree with all the aforementioned and would add that the one of the driving forces behind this debacle was the deal made with China by the State Department and Mrs. Clinton that we would supply China with a source of scrap metal (our beaters) to drive their infrastructure expansion in 2008 and 2009 and in return they would loan us money against our debt to try and bail our economy out. Seems like we got the short end of the stick again  thanks to our wonderful administration looking out for our best interests...again...


----------



## olyman (Dec 29, 2014)

Whitespider said:


> Heck... if she's worth sour owl crap, his girl friend can do it too.
> fastp could
> *


----------



## olyman (Dec 29, 2014)

Overclock said:


> Your extra brainpower makes 'er at least 3000cc. Blasting past 4x4's. lol Adding you to the storyline now.


----------



## Whitespider (Dec 29, 2014)

AIM said:


> *...I did drive a AWD gmc safari for a time and I gotta say I was rather impressed...*


True AWD is not the same as AWD Assist. The transfer case or transmission of true AWD vehicles is evenly distributing power to both axles at all times. There ain't nothin' new or innovative about (true) AWD... 50 years ago it was called "Full-Time 4WD". A transfer case that could be shifted in and out of 4WD via user input (i.e., a shift lever or even a bush button) was called "On-Demand 4WD".

In 1990 Ford put an Electronic AWD _system_ in their rear drive Aerostar mini-van; when the _system_ detected rear wheel spin it automatically engaged the front axle... this was essentially a rear wheel drive with _front assist_. The _system_ used a unique center differential transfer case controlled by electronics... meaning the system regulated power between the axles, power was not necessarily distributed equally to the front and rear. The system made it possible for soccer mom to drive up the inclined driveway in a snow storm... it was never intended to be 4WD. When cruising down an icy roadway it was still a rear drive vehicle, the fronts were not pulling... you could "lose" the front end on ice and snow just as easily as you would with the rear wheel drive only.

The original SUVs were either "Full-Time 4WD" or rear drive with (manually engaged) "On-Demand 4WD" and designed with off-road capability... such as the Bronco, Blazer, Suburban and the like. The next generation of SUVs, such as the Explorer, S-10 Blazer, and such, were still designed with at least some limited off-road capability in mind. But what we have now is not intended for any sort of off-road use... they are _front wheel drive vehicles_ with rear assist. They may be marketed as AWD, or even as "Electronically Controlled On-Demand AWD"... but they ain't really "On-Demand" 'cause the user cannot "demand" engagement, and they ain't 4WD either. Heck, most of 'em ain't really even a SUV, they're actually a CUV (Crossover Utility Vehicle)... the Tahoe and Expedition are SUVs. The CUV is not 4WD, they are not designed or intended for any sort of off-road use... they are designed for soccer mom to drive up the inclined driveway in a snow storm.
*


----------



## Overclock (Dec 29, 2014)

Whitespider said:


> In 1990 Ford put an Electronic AWD _system_ in their rear drive Aerostar mini-van; ................ The system made it possible for soccer mom to drive up the inclined driveway in a snow storm... ...



Oh yeah why because she was so dumb? What are you twelve. Arrested development sheesh......




Whitespider said:


> ‼
> I put my daughter in a '93 rear-wheel-drive Crown Victoria and told her to learn how to drive... even in winter, damnit‼
> She learned fast... and actually _*knows*_ how to drive.



If you want an omelet you have to break a few eggs. haha. I put my kid in a '78 V8 Monte and we ran over a pregnant raccoon on her first drive making her first curve. Pounded it lol. She was scared shirtless and I just laughed, "Hun why do you think I got ya one of these instead of an '04 Malibu."


----------



## Whitespider (Dec 29, 2014)

Overclock said:


> *Oh yeah why because she was so dumb? What are you twelve. Arrested development sheesh......*


 Yup... that Aerostar was discontinued because it was politically incorrect.
*


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## Steve NW WI (Dec 29, 2014)

Chris-PA said:


> Absurd vehicles to use for transportation, thankfully killed by the peak in US oil production of the early 1970's. They were too big to perform well no matter what engine was in them.
> 
> Alas, only to be replaced by the equally stupid SUV's and full sized trucks that I see every day on my commute to work - with one passenger. Often I blast past the 4WD vehicles in the snow with my tiny 1500cc front wheel drive car, while their terrified drivers crawl along at walking speed.


Arrogant self impotent geeks in shoebox cars piss me off, especially when they're driving too fast for conditions. 

Think I'll take the truck today, just for you. Stick that in your fart can pipe, or wherever makes you happy...


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## Chris-PA (Dec 29, 2014)

Steve NW WI said:


> Arrogant self impotent geeks in shoebox cars piss me off, especially when they're driving too fast for conditions.
> 
> Think I'll take the truck today, just for you. Stick that in your fart can pipe, or wherever makes you happy...


Lol - I've never been called "self impotent" before! 

So I'm arrogant because my driving skills exceed those of the typical SUV driver? How do you know I was driving too fast for conditions - what were the conditions? Were you there? Of course not, you're just blowing crap out your pipe. 

I have a '94 F250 4WD, what became the Super Duty in '95 - I drive it for hauling stuff and when I must drive in more serious snow. I used to be into full-sized Jeeps and know what a good 4WD system is and how to drive one in the snow. Here in PA we used to get more regular snow, and people were generally competent driving in it, although few drove 4WD vehicles. Not any more. Now an inch or two of snow will bring traffic to a crawl - long parades of 4WD vehicles with terrified drivers. Cars are stuck all over the place. Heck, a little rain is enough to make the commute 50% longer. So why drive those things?. 

Reality check: You don't need 4WD to get around in a couple of inches of snow. A little front wheel drive vehicle with decent tires is fine, especially if it has a manual trans. 

Have fun driving your truck - I don't care. After all, fuel is cheap and will be forever.


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## Overclock (Dec 29, 2014)

Chris-PA said:


> just blowing crap out your pipe. .



That's what I do when Hundai driver try to pass me. Blow it out my pipe of my 450 ft lb Cummins then you are in the ditch Hundai. Pull ya out on the flip side lol> Not.


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## Steve NW WI (Dec 29, 2014)

No you're arrogant because you believe you're better than everyone else.


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## Overclock (Dec 29, 2014)

Whitespider said:


> ................ The system made it possible for soccer mom to drive up the inclined driveway in a snow storm... ...



I'm so glad she made it home. Now she can make me some waffles.


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## Chris-PA (Dec 29, 2014)

Steve NW WI said:


> No you're arrogant because you believe you're better than everyone else.


And I think you are arrogant for pretending to know what I think - especially based on your faulty assumptions of things which you could not know, such as my driving too fast for conditions, etc. But you go ahead and believe what you wish. I'm certainly guilty of not giving a crap about that.


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## Chris-PA (Dec 29, 2014)

Overclock said:


> That's what I do when Hundai driver try to pass me. Blow it out my pipe of my 450 ft lb Cummins then you are in the ditch Hundai. Pull ya out on the flip side lol> Not.


You would join me in that ditch, and wish you had not.


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## Overclock (Dec 29, 2014)

Chris-PA said:


> You would join me in that ditch, and wish you had not.



Do not be hijackin' this Spider thread or you may wish you had stayed in bed.


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## Chris-PA (Dec 29, 2014)

Overclock said:


> Do not be hijackin' this Spider thread or you may wish you had stayed in bed.


You certainly talk pretty tough on the internet Brush Ape - that's two posts with threats you have no way to back up.


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## Overclock (Dec 29, 2014)

Chris-PA said:


> You certainly talk pretty tough on the internet Brush Ape - that's two posts with threats you have no way to back up.



Are you the woodsman?


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## Trx250r180 (Dec 29, 2014)

Overclock said:


> Something to be said for skinny tires. Model T's would go almost anywhere even in mud. I had a 1980 Ford Fairmont and couldn't give you the tire specs but I think they were 4 1/2 inches wide. Dang thing never got stuck.


I bet that car had the girls hanging all over you in school


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## Overclock (Dec 29, 2014)

Trx250r180 said:


> I bet that car had the girls hanging all over you in school



Ya their Grandmas.


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## olyman (Dec 29, 2014)

Steve NW WI said:


> Arrogant self impotent geeks in shoebox cars piss me off, especially when they're driving too fast for conditions.
> 
> Think I'll take the truck today, just for you. Stick that in your fart can pipe, or wherever makes you happy...


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## Whitespider (Dec 29, 2014)

Chris-PA said:


> *Reality check: You don't need 4WD to get around in a couple of inches of snow. A little front wheel drive vehicle with decent tires is fine, especially if it has a manual trans.*


No... here's the reality check...
You don't need 4WD, a little front wheel drive, decent tires, or a manual transmission to get around in a couple inches of snow. The truth is I'd rather have rear wheel drive over front wheel drive in any amount of snow... heck, in any sort of driving conditions. Every time I drive a front wheel drive in snow, on ice, or even on wet pavement I'm the one terrified, when/if those front wheels break loose you lose 100% control of the vehicle... now that's friggin' absurd‼ Front wheel drive ain't an asset in snow, it's a liability... unless you don't know how to drive, then it's a band-aid fix for ignorance. Driving is controlling both ends of the vehicle... both ends, 100% of the time... the rears are controlled by the throttle and brakes, the fronts by the steering wheel and brakes.

My first 20-25 years of driving... including winter driving... was in 60s and early 70s vintage rear wheel drive cars, running bias ply tires, and many of them near as bald as a cue ball. I don't remember ever not making it to and from school, to and from work, to and from where-the-hell-ever. My first car was a 1966 V8 Mustang running bias ply tires... my birthday is in January... meaning I got my drivers license in mid-friggin'-winter... and I drove that car every friggin' day, snow or no snow.

And if ya' really wanna' see terrified, put me in one of those "tiny 1500cc front wheel drive" pieces of crap. Christ, if I hit a turtle crossin' the road the damn car is likely to disintegrate. And don't argue that with me either; I managed and ran the body shop of or dealership for over 20 years... those "tiny" friggin' pieces of crap are death traps. That's one reason my daughter is driving a full-size rear wheel drive car... the other reason is so she actually knows how to drive.

A little front wheel drive vehicle with decent tires and a manual transmission... my azz‼
Yeah, maybe if ya' have no friggin' clue how to drive... but if you do know how, the last thing you'd drive is "tiny" front wheel drive piece of crap. I'd run circles around you with the '73 family truckster... period‼
*


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## brenndatomu (Dec 29, 2014)

Overclock said:


> I had a 1980 Ford Fairmont





Overclock said:


> Dang thing never got stuck.


Yah, and wasn't worth pullin out if ya ever did get 'er stuck! Well, on second thought, some good times were had back in the day in a buddys 2 door straight 6 auto trans Fairmont. Exhaust was fallin off, crusin down the road, cut the ignition off, pump the heck outta the gas pedal, ignition back on....KAWHOOM!!! Could feel the heat and percussion through the floorboard  It was best at night, could see the fireball in the mirrors...never could figure out why the trunk smelled like burnt carpet?  Yet another dumb thing I lived through...


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## stihly dan (Dec 29, 2014)

Because you were doing out of control 360's??


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## Overclock (Dec 29, 2014)

Mine never got stuck because we were about six miles off the ground.


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## Whitespider (Dec 29, 2014)

brenndatomu said:


> KAWHOOM!!!


Ever do the flame thrower thing... manual choke and spark plugs in the tail pipes??
It worked best with headers and straight pipes... you could literally "light-up" the world behind you.
*


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## brenndatomu (Dec 29, 2014)

Whitespider said:


> Ever do the flame thrower thing... manual choke and spark plugs in the tail pipes??


Seen it done, big fun!
Man, modern kids have no idea what they are missing with their shiny new EFI-auto-anti everything cars!
It's kinda sad, there are a lot more new cars in the student side of the local high school parking lot than on the teachers side. Weren't that way when I were there...looked more like we all shopped at Rusty Clunkers used car Emporium! Only used cars you see now are the "tuners" and the diesel trucks with 6" chrome stacks blowin $3.50+ per gallon (still!) diesel up in black smoke! EEEEH HAAWWWW YA'LLL!!! lemmings


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## AIM (Dec 29, 2014)

UMMM.... HMMMMM.... I'm not sure I really want to jump back in here but what the hell. I noticed the mention of bias tires a couple times. Oh spidey get over it..... Nobody is gonna change tires with the seasons. Or at least not very many... Why would you??? A decent set or radials will get you 50+K miles without a hitch. I'm not arguing if bias works. I'm just saying that switchin out for winter would be a pain. Hell spidey don't get me wrong cause I'm as anti advancement as you are but I have seen where SOME things have actually helped. (front wheel drive gets around in moderate snow better) (radial tires ride better and last longer) (todays engines run better and longer than the old stuff) (ya I hate all the techno bs we have today but it really does work)It works because of a work smarter not harder idealogic. (is idealogic a word???)


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## 1project2many (Dec 29, 2014)

Whitespider said:


> Ever do the flame thrower thing... manual choke and spark plugs in the tail pipes??
> It worked best with headers and straight pipes... you could literally "light-up" the world behind you.
> *



About 20 years ago I helped build a 2wd Datsun truck for a "tough truck" competition. Shortened wheelbase, 14" ag rear tires, auxilliary springs on the front... fun little truck. We turned the exhaust manifold upside down and let the pipe exit through the hood. Just for fun I put a spark plug in the pipe, added an aux ignition module to drive it, routed propane to the exhaust, and built a 3" diameter "blowtorch" tip. When we fired it up inside the stadium the flames were 4 feet high and the whole place shook like an out of tune oil burner in the basement of an old farmhouse. The place roared and rumbled for about two minutes until the fitting on the tiny propane tank froze up. We got plenty of cheers outta that one. That little truck earned us 3rd place and beat out two serious teams that had competition trucks they ran in the southwest. What can I say? Front brakes only, two spinning rear wheels, wheelbase like a Farmall 300 and a capable driver make for some quick, tight turns compared to a 4wd truck. I got the biggest kick out of our driver spraying mud and dirt at the professional monster trucks. The pro drivers were scurrying for cover! Yee-haw!

Then there's the story about blowing the muffler off the dealership shop truck while showing the shop kid how to do a "real" backfire. (turn off key in gear, decel to draw fuel, then open throttle so low vacuum causes diverter valve to open and force air into exhaust with fuel, then hit key) The bang and resulting loss of exhaust were exciting, but watching that poor old lady dump her bag of groceries just topped it off. I understand that it's not funny. But it _seemed_ like it at the time.


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## Chris-PA (Dec 29, 2014)

Whitespider said:


> My first car was a 1966 V8 Mustang running bias ply tires... my birthday is in January... meaning I got my drivers license in mid-friggin'-winter... and I drove that car every friggin' day, snow or no snow.


So was mine - 289 4V and an automatic. It was hopelessly pathetic even with snows, although I drove it everywhere too for 4 to 5 years. 


Whitespider said:


> Every time I drive a front wheel drive in snow, on ice, or even on wet pavement I'm the one terrified, when/if those front wheels break loose you lose 100% control of the vehicle...


Because you have no ability to control your right foot? Google "traction circle". If you're putting out too much power for the available traction, then the tire spins - amazingly, you can tell that, and it's actually possible to reduce the throttle. 


Whitespider said:


> And if ya' really wanna' see terrified, put me in one of those "tiny 1500cc front wheel drive" pieces of crap. Christ, if I hit a turtle crossin' the road the damn car is likely to disintegrate.


Bull. I rode an '86 Escort GT to hell. That thing took a hit in the worst possible location - an oblique left front impact while I was doing at least 70mph and a car (a Buick wagon) came across the median of a divided highway. It actually held up pretty well even though the passenger compartment was narrower than my present car. If the door arm rest had been better designed I'd probably still have a left kidney. 

My present Accent is 16 years old, and been smacked a few times, including hitting a deer (which are bigger than turtles here in PA). It's a tough, strong chassis. You fear what you do not know, but that is a pattern for you.



Whitespider said:


> Yeah, maybe if ya' have no friggin' clue how to drive... but if you do know how, the last thing you'd drive is "tiny" front wheel drive piece of crap. I'd run circles around you with the '73 family truckster... period‼


I have some idea how it's done, and I'll take the front wheel drive over a front engined, rear wheel drive in the snow any day. I've had plenty of both and I'd laugh at you trying to keep up. I don't even have snows on mine, although we did put 4 full snows on my Wife's last KIA (also a manual) - it was a hoot in the snow. 

We had a '94 Nissan Altima SE with front wheel drive, a manual trans and a Torsen limited slip diff up front. That thing was incredible in snow - I watched a guy spin his lifted pickup on the highway trying to keep up with me.


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## Whitespider (Dec 29, 2014)

AIM said:


> *UMMM.... HMMMMM.... I'm not arguing if bias works. I'm just saying that switchin out for winter would be a pain.*


UMMM.... HMMMMM.... That weren't what I was talkin' 'bout in this thread.

I was talkin' 'bout cars never designed for radial tires... cars runnin' those bias ply, semi-smooth, saw-tooth tread, street tires. The early radials in this country (the radials of the '70) drove and handled like crap on cars without the (so called) "radial tuned suspension"... and they wore-out in just a few thousand miles also. It was the late '70s before "radial tuned suspension" became common on cars coming out'a Detroit... if you drove a '60s or early '70s car, especially anything with horsepower, you flat couldn't run those early radials on 'em unless you wanted to drive 25 MPH. It was late '80s/early '90s before US tire makers produced anything "radial" that would perform on those non-radial tuned suspensions.
*


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## Whitespider (Dec 29, 2014)

Chris-PA said:


> *Because you have no ability to control your right foot? Google "traction circle".
> I have some idea how it's done, and I'll take the front wheel drive over a front engined, rear wheel drive in the snow any day. I've had plenty of both and I'd laugh at you trying to keep up.*


Traction circle?? LMFAO‼
I've run more races than you've seen... heck, I've won more just on ice than you've seen on any surface.
Chris... you're full'a crap.
*


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## theswampthing (Dec 29, 2014)

I actually went brain dead for like 15 minutes after reading the last few pages of this thread. Thanks guys.


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## Jakers (Dec 29, 2014)

its gonna be another long winter i fear.... as always, some interesting reading


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## unclemoustache (Dec 30, 2014)

Let's get started on politics or something that doesn't get people upset with each other all the time.


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## pennsywoodburnr (Dec 30, 2014)

Unc, I think the politics would have everyone at each others throats _even more_. Entertaining thread though! Not as funny as the one though with that goofball smacking that monster round 300 times with his fiskars


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## Chris-PA (Dec 30, 2014)

Whitespider said:


> heck, I've won more just on ice than you've seen on any surface.


And yet driving a front wheel drive car in snow terrifies you? I'll just chalk that up to yet another difference in how things work in your alternate universe.


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## Overclock (Dec 30, 2014)

Traction circle LMFAO!!!!!


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## Whitespider (Dec 30, 2014)

unclemoustache said:


> *Let's get started on politics...*


Hey... have I ever told you guys about my uncle (great uncle actually)??
He was a state senator, Lieutenant Governor, and then Governor of Iowa.
Before entering public life he attended Augsburg Seminary, ISU, and Hamilton.
He was a Republican... I only met him once, he died before I became a teenager.
He didn't live long enough to see a radial tire... or front wheel drive (but I hear-tell he rode in an airplane a few times).
*


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## Overclock (Dec 30, 2014)

President Reagan sent my Grandpa and Grandma a letter for their 50th wedding anniversary I suppose a formality. Grandpa tore it up and mailed it back to him with some direction for where Ron could go and some advice on how he could get there quicker. Mom told me later that the men in black suits were watching at a distance for some time.


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## Overclock (Dec 30, 2014)

unclemoustache said:


> Let's get started on politics or something that doesn't get people upset with each other all the time.



Well, maybe we can discuss this:


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## Overclock (Dec 30, 2014)

Place your bets gentlemen. I'm like Whitespider I like a good race. You will not believe what happens in this, "heat."


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## Whitespider (Dec 30, 2014)

Men in black... now that there is funny‼ Sounds like your grandpa and I would have gotten along just fine.



Chris-PA said:


> *I'll just chalk that up to yet another difference in how things work in your alternate universe.*


Well... remember... Iowa is in a different universe than Pennsylvania.
For one thing, Iowa has nearly twice the miles of just _unpaved_ roads than Pennsylvania has _total_... and traffic, even in Des Moines, doesn't slow to a crawl in a snowstorm. Most of us learned to drive as soon as we could see over the steering wheel... some of us had our own car or pickup (complete with shotgun behind the seat) long before we reached "license" age. Booze-cruising and bar-hopping during a blizzard is considered sport... which, because most little towns only have one or two bars, means driving from town-to-town. Your "tiny 1500cc front wheel drive" would be worthless out here... it would be high-centered on a family truckster tire rut in the first mile. Which would be bad for you 'cause some farm boy in a pickup would drive right over ya'... then look at his girl friend and ask, "Hey, did you feel that?? Hand me another beer, would ya' babe?? Let's put some Skynyrd in the 8-track... kay??"
*


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## Overclock (Dec 30, 2014)

Here's how the it would play out for Chris-PA and his Hundia Elantra down heah.......



Whitespider said:


> ........... some farm boy in a pickup would drive right over ya'... then look at his girl friend and ask, "Hey, did you feel that??"




Then she would say, "I think. Could y'all back it up and see if it's still there?" Thump Thump. "Yeah Baby still there." Thump Thump.




Whitespider said:


> "Hand me another beer, would ya' babe?? Let's put some Skynyrd in the 8-track... kay??"



"I like this song, Baby. Let's go Reap Produce."


----------



## 1project2many (Dec 30, 2014)

Whitespider said:


> A little front wheel drive vehicle with decent tires and a manual transmission... my azz‼
> Yeah, maybe if ya' have no friggin' clue how to drive... but if you do know how, the last thing you'd drive is "tiny" front wheel drive piece of crap. I'd run circles around you with the '73 family truckster... period‼



Front drive and rear drive _both_ suck when the vehicle doesn't have enough weight on the drive tires. 2WD pickups, empty one ton vans, and lightweight RWD cars made in the '80s all require added weight in the rear to behave well in snow. And while you may have confidence in the family truckster, VW bugs were legendary for out-driving it in snow with only half the weight. Of course the bug requires several hundred added pounds in the front to steer.

You know, it's funny how "piece a crap" changes over the years. While rebuilding my Toyota truck trans last year, I found a web page that said to avoid bearings made in China because they were junk. It said stick with quality Japanese bearings. I still remember when anything made in Japan was a piece -a- crap. But they're right about the bearings.


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## Chris-PA (Dec 30, 2014)

Whitespider said:


> Most of us learned to drive as soon as we could see over the steering wheel


Yeah, I figured you for a late starter - probably explains the fear thing. 



Whitespider said:


> Iowa has nearly twice the miles of just _unpaved_ roads than Pennsylvania has _total_.


From a Google search I found for road miles by State: Pennsylvania = 253,838, Iowa = 235,460. We also have these things called curves and hills, which you may be unfamiliar with. They make having 65% of the weight over the non-driven wheels undesirable. 



Whitespider said:


> Booze-cruising and bar-hopping during a blizzard is considered sport... which, because most little towns only have one or two bars, means driving from town-to-town.


Bar hopping? Sounds like a city boy. In the area where I grew up you could drive 40min in one direction and never go through a noticeable town at all. Sad to say that in my youth we all drank and we all drove everywhere too. Generally the party was in the car or next to them.


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## Overclock (Dec 30, 2014)

Overclock said:


> "I like this song, Baby. Let's go Reap Produce."



Later:

"Dang Baby, I got a flat. There's an inkpen and a smashed pocket pro tector stuck in my lugs."


----------



## Whitespider (Dec 30, 2014)

1project2many said:


> *...while you may have confidence in the family truckster, VW bugs were legendary for out-driving it in snow...*


Ummmm..... not out here. We have wind here, which means the snow is near always in hard-packed drifts. The same thing that allowed the VW to float like a boat caused it to ride up on the snow like a toboggan... leaving the wheels hanging in mid-air. Those things were death traps if ya' got them stuck out in the boonies 'cause of the air-cooled engine and how the heater worked... basically, you had no heat unless RPMs were up and you were moving. A friend of mine bought a brand spankin' new VW 'round '73 or so. After gettin' it high-centered several times he adopted a new strategy; hit the drifts as fast as possible and "slide" over the top of 'em... the result was upside-down in a creek bed after "sliding" clean over the bridge rails.
He replaced it with a '68 Olds Ninty-Eight with the 455 rocket under the hood... that one went through the ice over at the lake, the only thing stickin' out'a the water was the radio antenna. I friggin' told him not to stop... he just wouldn't listen 
*


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## 1project2many (Dec 30, 2014)

lol...

Hey, I never said the bug was appropriate for winter. I said it had good traction. 

We borrowed a bug when I was a kid. Warm air was supplied by a single piece of 3" flexible dryer vent tube from the heater passages in the floor to the front. My job was to alternate blowing warm air on the driver's window then on the passenger's window. I had to sneak in warm air for myself when dad wasn't looking If he caught me warming up while he was freezing, well, it wasn't good.


----------



## unclemoustache (Dec 30, 2014)

pennsywoodburnr said:


> Unc, I think the politics would have everyone at each others throats _even more_. Entertaining thread though! Not as funny as the one though with that goofball smacking that monster round 300 times with his fiskars



I was being sarcastic. If people can get into an internet pee fight over cars, then there's something wrong with them and they'll fight like a couple toddlers over a moldy cracker. Sheesh.

So what thread you talking about with the fiskars? I missed that one.


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## fixit1960 (Dec 30, 2014)

Go to Fiskars X27, what a piece of plastic. Video of a comparison between a x27 and a 30 lb anvil on a piece of pipe, this younger dude is just wailing on big 40" rounds in his yard. Oh and he has a heart rate monitor on to show us the difference in effort. Kinda funny.


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## Whitespider (Dec 30, 2014)

Chris-PA said:


> *From a Google search I found for road miles by State: Pennsylvania = 253,838, Iowa = 235,460.*


That's funny... LOL‼ I wasn't counting city and residential streets, suburban byways, and Interstate highways. Good lord man, how many miles of streets, roads and Interstate is just in the Philadelphia area?? Heck, if you look at it that way (or even remove Philadelphia).... Pennsylvania ain't crap-o-la for roads. Most of Iowa is made up of 1 mile square sections...
Iowa has over 98,000 miles of state/county controlled roads (not townships, cities, or Interstate)... and over 72,000 miles of that is _unpaved_.
What's the mileage of _total_ _commonwealth_ _controlled_ roads (not townships, cities, or Interstate) in Pennsylvania?? Something 'round 40,000?? Maybe 50,000 but I doubt it.
*


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## pennsywoodburnr (Dec 30, 2014)

Overclock said:


> Well, maybe we can discuss this:




My, those Japanese people certainly are into some weird crap. I remember seeing a Jap game show some years back where "contestants" (if you want to call them that) were made to stand in a tub of water which they slowly brought to a boil. The first one that jumped out, lost. LOL


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## pennsywoodburnr (Dec 30, 2014)

unclemoustache said:


> I was being sarcastic. If people can get into an internet pee fight over cars, then there's something wrong with them and they'll fight like a couple toddlers over a moldy cracker. Sheesh.
> 
> So what thread you talking about with the fiskars? I missed that one.



Oh yeah, I know you were being a wisenheimer . That thread was started by Overclock and was titled "Fiskars, what a piece of plastic" or something to that effect. And svk and Chris-PA were trying to throw out a guess as to who Overclock really was and said it was Brush Ape. Could be...possibly. I'm going to throw a guess out there myself and say it's MasterBlaster! Do I win a prize or anything??


----------



## pennsywoodburnr (Dec 30, 2014)

Whitespider, what's the terrain out there in Iowa look like? Is it relatively flat with rolling hills? Or do you guys have decent sized mountains out there too? The reason I'm asking is because with all this talk about driving in the snow makes me wonder what everyone else is up against. Let me describe my terrain. We have single lane roads out here just barely wide enough for two cars to make it through while they're side-by-side passing each other. We've got mountains with hundreds of feet of elevation changes that you absolutely need to get some kind of running start at in order to clear the crest, but really can't, because that corner you just turned killed off all of the momentum you just had. Tractor trailers going down these same mountains would be (and I'm just guessing here since I don't have my class A) more than likely be kept in 1st or 2nd gear, with the jake brake on to keep their descent under control. Add in that plow crews hardly plow any secondary roads until _after _the snow has stopped and all the other drivers have compacted it to ice now. Then when they do plow, the trucks just throw pea gravel off of the spreader, not the calcium chloride like they should be. Sometimes when I drive these roads in the winter, I am thankful I can fall back on my many years of off road riding to get me through.


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## Chris-PA (Dec 30, 2014)

Whitespider said:


> Iowa has over 98,000 miles of state/county controlled roads (not townships, cities, or Interstate).


You have better or worse traction on state roads? My car doesn't really care. 

As for paved - PA has a lot of variation from region to region. We've got plenty of unpaved stuff around here - it's just routine.


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## Overclock (Dec 30, 2014)

pennsywoodburnr said:


> . And svk and Chris-PA were trying to throw out a guess as to who Overclock really was and said it was Brush Ape. Could be...possibly. I'm going to throw a guess out there myself and say it's MasterBlaster! Do I win a prize or anything??



Master Blaster = Brush Ape? Haha no comparison. BA is in a league of his own.


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## pennsywoodburnr (Dec 30, 2014)

*So it is you!!!*


----------



## pennsywoodburnr (Dec 30, 2014)

Chris-PA said:


> You have better or worse traction on state roads? My car doesn't really care.
> 
> As for paved - PA has a lot of variation from region to region. We've got plenty of unpaved stuff around here - it's just routine.



It's funny you mentioned the unpaved road thing. Years back there was a body discovered inside a sealed 55 gallon steel drum dumped off on the side of the road not to far from me. It was just there, rotting away. A friend of mine told me a couple of hunters found it. Crazy what can happen on a non-maintained road!


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## farmer steve (Dec 30, 2014)

Whitespider said:


> Men in black... now that there is funny‼ Sounds like your grandpa and I would have gotten along just fine.
> 
> 
> Well... remember... Iowa is in a different universe than Pennsylvania.
> ...


some of us keystoners know how to drive Spidey. used to take the '74 pinto wagon w/B-60/13 BIAS ply tires out in a snow storm and run down the 4 lane as fast as that little 4-banger would go . push in the clutch,pull up the emergency brake and slide through the median into the opposing lane and head back from where we came from. no other cars on the highway but we had fun. and yes Skynard was prolly in the 8 track. and


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## brenndatomu (Dec 30, 2014)

Whitespider said:


> Well... remember... Iowa is in a different universe than Pennsylvania.


I'm starting to come to the conclusion that this statement must be SOOO very true, IA must be _completely_ different than ANYWHERE else. Explains a lot...a whole lot


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## farmer steve (Dec 30, 2014)

brenndatomu said:


> I'm starting to come to the conclusion that this statement must be SOOO very true, IA must be _completely_ different than ANYWHERE else. Explains a lot...a whole lot


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## Steve NW WI (Dec 30, 2014)

Just Spidey's corner lol.

Most of the IA guys I know from here are pretty normal.

I did say most, Oly


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## Overclock (Dec 30, 2014)

pennsywoodburnr said:


> *So it is you!!!*



Yes it is me, Overclock. Remember when Robin turned into the Dark Knight???????........

...well I may never steal Batman's thunder. Maybe in some other city but never in Gotham.



brenndatomu said:


> I'm starting to come to the conclusion that this statement must be SOOO very true, IA must be _completely_ different than ANYWHERE else. Explains a lot...a whole lot



It is very true. Iowa is much different because the corn is so good. That makes for the biggest whitetail bucks and some huge knockers only surpassed by Illinois by any account.


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## Whitespider (Dec 30, 2014)

pennsywoodburnr said:


> *Whitespider, what's the terrain out there in Iowa look like?*


Well, certainly no mountains, but as you move closer to the Mississippi the hills and bluffs get pretty decent size with steep grades and winding roads... the far northeast is probably the worst. The north-central is as flat as a pancake and once the ditches fill up the snow can drift deep enough to swallow a Greyhound bus... the plows basically make tunnels. I live in a transitional area between those two extremes. Parts of the southwest remind me of Missouri and South Dakota breaks land, but with a less rock showing... much of it better suited for cattle than corn. A lot of southeast Iowa (other than along the Mississippi) is hard to distinguish from much of western Illinois... there's even a few small oil wells. But no matter what part you're in, there's uncounted river and stream bottoms that toss in all sorts of wrinkles, curves, and grades.

Our crushed rock roads are not "plowed clean", they're mostly hard-pack and ice... but the maintainers will put teeth on the blades to rough it up a bit when things get too slick. The school bus routes are cleared as soon as possible... but others may not get much attention for 2-3 days depending on the amount of snow and length of the storm. I lived in a farm house once where the road was routinely ignored fore 2-3 days... the longest was 10 days. Drifting is probably the biggest hazard... you can drive down a county road to get somewhere, and 10 or 15 minutes later, on the return trip, it may be drifted in as high as the roof of your car... especially if the ditches are full.
*


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## svk (Dec 30, 2014)

pennsywoodburnr said:


> Oh yeah, I know you were being a wisenheimer . That thread was started by Overclock and was titled "Fiskars, what a piece of plastic" or something to that effect. And svk and Chris-PA were trying to throw out a guess as to who Overclock really was and said it was Brush Ape. Could be...possibly. I'm going to throw a guess out there myself and say it's MasterBlaster! Do I win a prize or anything??


Did masterblaster get banned? I always enjoyed his posts.


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## pennsywoodburnr (Dec 31, 2014)

svk said:


> Did masterblaster get banned? I always enjoyed his posts.



No idea man. I know he hung out in the Commercial Tree Care forum most of the time. Ain't seen him lately either.


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## olyman (Dec 31, 2014)

Steve NW WI said:


> Just Spidey's corner lol.
> 
> Most of the IA guys I know from here are pretty normal.
> 
> I did say most, Oly


 and how did I act at the gtg???? just dont like bs,,and aint pc...... notice,, more than a few on here,, have figured out sp.....


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## Whitespider (Dec 31, 2014)

farmer steve said:


> *some of us keystoners know how to drive Spidey. used to take the '74 pinto wagon w/B-60/13 BIAS ply tires out in a snow storm...*


In '76 I put my '66 Galaxie 500 end-over-end when the front u-joint let go, the drive shaft hooked the roadway, kicking the rear end off the ground, and sending me front-first into the ditch where I promptly hit a driveway... a wild ride, and total loss. Needing a fast replacement, and short on cash, I found a clean little '74 Pinto with the optional 2300 4cyl and a 4spd manual. I was always impressed with the "snow-driving" ability of that little thing. I didn't have it long... it had Firestone 500 radials on it. Just before Christmas one of the front treads separated at 70 MPH on I-694 in Minneapolis and I smacked a bridge. The transmission tail shaft housing came up through the floor when the front end folded under... my second wild ride and total loss of '76. The year 1977 brought the baby-blue '73 Satellite Sebring Plus and the puke-green '71 Torino GT... both of which I managed to unload before they were wrecked or using too much oil 

The '70s were definitely a good time


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## Guswhit (Dec 31, 2014)

pennsywoodburnr said:


> It's funny you mentioned the unpaved road thing. Years back there was a body discovered inside a sealed 55 gallon steel drum dumped off on the side of the road not to far from me. It was just there, rotting away. A friend of mine told me a couple of hunters found it. Crazy what can happen on a non-maintained road!



Jimmy Hoffa??????????


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## 1project2many (Dec 31, 2014)

Guswhit said:


> Jimmy Hoffa??????????





Whitespider said:


> The '70s were definitely a good time


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## hanniedog (Dec 31, 2014)

Wonder if the death was ruled accidental?


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## philoshop (Dec 31, 2014)

I can still pee almost my whole name in the snow.


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## Whitespider (Dec 31, 2014)

I can still do a one-armed push-up... or... at least I could last time I tried 
*


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## AIM (Dec 31, 2014)

And I can still????? Well I can ????? UMMMMM...... Well I guess I just can't compare...


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## 1project2many (Jan 1, 2015)

philoshop said:


> I can still pee almost my whole name in the snow.



Maiden or married? 

I'm just happy I still remember to unzip before peeing in the snow.

I did want to mention, about the whole RWD vs FWD thing, there are plenty of people who still prefer a vintage RWD car over the small front drivers. After bunches of research I've discovered that today's wheel and tire technology is allowing midwesterners to build their cars for drifts and blowing snow just like what's found in Iowa. Most of the pictures I found showed 'em wearing summer tires, but it's no surprise given how the sub arctic temperatures and fierce winter winds will blow parked cars right out of the driveway. No one in that country is fool enough to venture out in that weather for a silly car picture. So consider these pictures while you start out 2015 and if you happen to be inspired to trade in a tiny FWD car for something more utilitarian I'd love to hear about it.

Happy New Year.


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## pennsywoodburnr (Jan 1, 2015)

Those photos, man....... it's painful even looking at them


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## Whitespider (Jan 1, 2015)

Yeah... we have a few of those around also  but that last one is just over the top.
Can someone explain to me when, exactly, a 4dr became "cool"??
*


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## AIM (Jan 1, 2015)

The green one has a chance at cool if you lower back down, change the wheels and paint it blue.


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## olyman (Jan 1, 2015)

and just guess who,, owns most of those cars....


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## pennsywoodburnr (Jan 1, 2015)

Whitespider said:


> Yeah... we have a few of those around also  but that last one is just over the top.
> Can someone explain to me when, exactly, a 4dr became "cool"??
> *



Whitespider, those could be the ultimate snow vehicles out there in Iowa. Rear wheel drive? _And_ a ton of ground clearance? Dude you're good to go!


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## Chris-PA (Jan 1, 2015)

I see tires not too far from those on SUVs regularly - especially Escalades and Hummers. And trucks jacked that high too. Usually with twin chrome pipes up through the bed. At least these guys aren't pretending their vehicles are useful!


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## 1project2many (Jan 1, 2015)

Whitespider said:


> Can someone explain to me when, exactly, a 4dr became "cool"??



When the young kids realized that thanks to us ol pharts all the cool 2 drs have been wrecked, crushed, burned, hoarded, or restored to a level no youngster could afford.


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## zogger (Jan 1, 2015)

pennsywoodburnr said:


> Whitespider, those could be the ultimate snow vehicles out there in Iowa. Rear wheel drive? _And_ a ton of ground clearance? Dude you're good to go!



Ya, that last one with some skinny tractor tires and chains would probably go through some deep snow on the road.

Tell ya what is weirder to me though, guys who take really nice trucks and lower them to like 1/2 inch ground clearance. Looks like a random pebble would tear stuff up. I just don't get it....


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## philoshop (Jan 1, 2015)

Things that make ya go hmmm? Or huh??


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