# Help me spend $1000 on freehand milling



## jamieS (Nov 24, 2020)

I have a large locust tree that will be professionally taken down later this year. It has a nice straight trunk section that is about 20 feet tall, 22" in diameter at chest height, and about 26" at the base. There is another vertical fork higher in the tree about 16" and 12 feet long. I hate the idea of turning that all into firewood...

I've been looking at freehand milling and I think it's right for me. I have plenty of time to go slow and I think this style puts less of a demand on a saw since only a few teeth are engaged at a time. I have some smaller homeowner electric pruning saws with shorter bars, but I'm not that crazy...

So I'm looking to spend about 1000 on all of the things I would need to be safe for a bigger job like this. Bigger saw, chaps, boots, etc. 
*If it was your money, how would you allocate it? How much to spend a saw, longer bar, and safety gear? * Specific brands/models greatly appreciated! 

-jamie


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## Whiskers (Nov 24, 2020)

If you want to save it for lumber why done you just find someone with a portable bandsaw mill. Also, urban trees are known to contain objects that are not good for saw blades of any sort. Which is why most are turned into mulch.


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## jamieS (Nov 24, 2020)

Whiskers said:


> If you want to save it for lumber why done you just find someone with a portable bandsaw mill. Also, urban trees are known to contain objects that are not good for saw blades of any sort. Which is why most are turned into mulch.


Good point and I've reached out to one local milling service... but I think the urban tree problem is going to scare folks away from the tree. I'm willing to take the risks on a chain saw blade, but my hunch is that no one wants to risk a bandsaw blade on this tree.


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## ElevatorGuy (Nov 24, 2020)

Im drooling over all that locust firewood!


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## buzz sawyer (Nov 24, 2020)

Locust is bad enough just bucking into firewood. Ripping lengthwise is going to require some serious chainsaw HP. I'd go for a bandsaw mill. My dad had one cut some years ago. It does make Great planks.


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## motolife313 (Nov 24, 2020)

Buy a metal detector from harbor freight.
u can buy a 362 for about 750$ And run a 25” bar might need a 32”. A used 064 or 066 would also work and one is good shape will go for about 500-600$. I got a 064
took that pic today


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## csmillingnoob (Nov 25, 2020)

Freehand? As in no mill?

Little if any big saw experience?

color me skeptical


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## jamieS (Nov 25, 2020)

ElevatorGuy said:


> Im drooling over all that locust firewood!


Yeah, I'm looking forward to splitting most of it into some nice hardwood firewood!


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## jamieS (Nov 25, 2020)

csmillingnoob said:


> Freehand? As in no mill?
> 
> Little if any big saw experience?
> 
> color me skeptical


Yeah, this is definitely a jump into the deep end of the pool. I'm skeptical, too. My goal is to take my time, learn as I go, see if the milling addiction takes hold... and if it is a total failure, then it's more firewood.


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## Whiskers (Nov 25, 2020)

I’d assume you’d want something in the 90cc range. I don’t know anything about freehand milling though. Seems like a heavy saw to get a cut accurately started. If you thought milling was for you but freehand didn’t get the desired results you could always buy a milling jig and at least have the right saw. With that being said, Chainsaw’s are dangerous and with little experience I’d be very careful wading into swinging around a 90cc saw.


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## Husky Man (Nov 25, 2020)

jamieS said:


> Yeah, this is definitely a jump into the deep end of the pool. I'm skeptical, too. My goal is to take my time, learn as I go, see if the milling addiction takes hold... and if it is a total failure, then it's more firewood.


Are You familiar with Granberg mills?

A 30” would do it, except for the 26” end, you would likely have to mill from both Top , then flip it and mill from the Top(old bottom) down again, but would be a bit short of milling right through the center

A 36” Granberg with a 36” bar would get you there with about a 28” maximum width cut.. To get the full capacity you need about 6” more bar than the “Rated Size” of the mill, and you will still be about 2.5-3” less between the clamp faces, my 36” maxes out at 33.5”

For a couple hundred dollars, you will get much more efficient utilization of your wood, I think enough to be worth getting a mill, your Wood, Money and Choice though

Doug


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## csmillingnoob (Nov 25, 2020)

jamieS said:


> Yeah, this is definitely a jump into the deep end of the pool. I'm skeptical, too. My goal is to take my time, learn as I go, see if the milling addiction takes hold... and if it is a total failure, then it's more firewood.




My recommendation on spending $1000.00 to mill:

1. Order a Holzfforma 660 from thechainsawguy. Order through this board, not ebay. It will have been cranked and tested by him for less than $500.00. If you spend @ $525.00 with him you can get the big bore (98cc) that he has worked through thoroughly. You can save money by ordering through Holzfforma directly but I advise against it unless you have small engine mechanic ability because they frequently have small bugs in oil lines, fuel lines, carbs etc.

2. Get a 36' knockoff Granburg Alaskan mill from ebay about $100.00

3. 36" bar $100.00

4. two 36' skip tooth chains $100.00

5. FILE GUIDE: $10.00 to $40.00. Developing your sharpening skills is absolutely critical. 

6. Files: $20.00

7 Metal detector: $25.00 from Harbor freight

8. 3 ton floor jack $85.00 Harbor freight. Maybe a two ton will work

9. Cant hook $50.00. Maybe less.

10. some 4x4s to keep log off the ground

11. At least three plastic felling wedges $15.00

Ladder for at least first cut. Hopefully you already own one.

two-stroke oil, oil for gas mix, etc, etc, etc.

$1,000 gonOops:

Ear protection is a must 40.00
Chainsaw gloves 35.00
Chaps $75.00

I always wear ear protection and should wear gloves more often, I rarely use chaps when milling - but use them when not in the mill


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## jamieS (Nov 25, 2020)

I appreciate it csmillingnoob, that's exactly the kind of post I was hoping for!


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## toadman (Nov 25, 2020)

I'd post links, but they don't work here...
a budget Alaskan mill is doable with $1000, I have less than that in my knockoff setup.

I did learn a lesson, and that's to buy a decent bar & chain. 
I bought an oregon 42" with ripping chain for $135 on ebay & it's performed very well for the price. 
36" would do for your log & should be slightly less $$$.

I frequently mill with a hutzl 660 clone I put together, and it's performed as well as I could ask for. 
I also mill with other saw's, a 661 & 394, but the hutzl has done about 1.8-2k board feet by itself with no issues yet.

Chaps are a must. 

Hearing protection is a must. 
I bought 3M bluetooth NR muffs, and they make it much more pleasant. 
I listen to podcasts while milling, but be certain you can still hear the saw a bit. paying attention to motor pitch is critical for keeping the saw happy & healthy while milling.

The first time I milled I watched a video of myself & when I put the saw onto the log I was within a half of an inch from my thigh while kneeling. Chaps.

sharpening is the #1 thing IMO for good results. 
There was a steep learning curve where I struggled to get it to bite at all, even under heavy pressure & with a chain that would fly through crosscuts... I used a little $20 ebay winch & still do sometimes if I can't angle the log. 
with a sharp chain and the log pointing downhill, basiclly just hold onto the throttle & listen to music while the saw does the work mostly by itself

Pretty much what Csmillingnoob said.

I tried for several years to learn to chainsaw mill freehand, and I'm not saying it's impossible to just jump into it- there are people with crazy knack for these things out there... 
Those videos on U tube make it look easy, but it's 100% not in my case.
I have mad respect & skill envy for the guys who can do it freehand
Maybe you're one of the lucky ones & for sure give it a try if you think you can!!
I do have a good eye for level and straight, along with years of saw experience, construction experience, and some fine woodcraft experience, but I can't do freehand milling with any decent results.


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## motolife313 (Nov 26, 2020)

I honestly never use ear protection running a saw. I’m not at full rpm much either on my 064. And my mufflers are pretty much stock. If the muffler was opened up I’d probably be wearing some ear plugs but my ears don’t have a problem how I’m doing it now.


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## jamieS (Nov 26, 2020)

toadman said:


> I frequently mill with a hutzl 660 clone I put together, and it's performed as well as I could ask for.
> I also mill with other saw's, a 661 & 394, but the hutzl has done about 1.8-2k board feet by itself with no issues yet.
> 
> Chaps are a must.
> ...


Nice, thanks toadman. I'm already a sharpening fanatic from woodworking and I've been re-reading about chain sharpening, including getting the depth gauges set right.

And thanks for your experiences with freehanding... one thing I'm realizing is that I'm much more likely to be able to create ~1" boards with a mill, whereas I can probably create sloppy 2" boards freehanding which would have to be resawn later if I wanted to use it in casework (as opposed to table tops, etc.)... and resawing has the enevitable challenges with warping again. So your input has definitely got me thinking.

I'm good with hearing protection. I've done too much loud stuff in my life, so got a good arsenal of gear for keeping my ability to hear a whisper into old age.

And I'm definitely hearing "chaps"!

Out of curiosity, where did you buy your hutzl 660 clone?

-j


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## toadman (Nov 26, 2020)

jamieS said:


> Nice, thanks toadman. I'm already a sharpening fanatic from woodworking and I've been re-reading about chain sharpening, including getting the depth gauges set right.
> 
> And thanks for your experiences with freehanding... one thing I'm realizing is that I'm much more likely to be able to create ~1" boards with a mill, whereas I can probably create sloppy 2" boards freehanding which would have to be resawn later if I wanted to use it in casework (as opposed to table tops, etc.)... and resawing has the enevitable challenges with warping again. So your input has definitely got me thinking.
> 
> ...



I actually got my clone half way assembled in a box from a friend who couldn't get it to work, and disassembled it & reassembled it correctly.
There where several things he had done wrong...
it's a standard hutzl kit I assembled "from scratch". 
I didn't exchange any parts for another brand, except the rings. I felt better using my trusted brand of piston rings. 
Caber, which are standard with the new kits & assembled saws from what I have seen. 
I have noted the blue saws I have used have several improvements over mine... 
the casting is better, and the overall quality control is better now than it was when I got mine IMO.

I ordered another assembled clone on Ebay recently and it hasn't arrived yet, but I will gladly give my impression of it when it does!!!


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## jamieS (Nov 26, 2020)

toadman said:


> I ordered another assembled clone on Ebay recently and it hasn't arrived yet, but I will gladly give my impression of it when it does!!!



Looking forward to that!


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## csmillingnoob (Nov 26, 2020)

motolife313 said:


> I honestly never use ear protection running a saw. I’m not at full rpm much either on my 064. And my mufflers are pretty much stock. If the muffler was opened up I’d probably be wearing some ear plugs but my ears don’t have a problem how I’m doing it now.



wear it.

wjen you reach my age you’ll be glad. Modern man constantly abuses his ears. A chainsaw is a bridge too far. And I hate air compressors!


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## motolife313 (Nov 26, 2020)

I know my body pretty good. I used to wear them everyday at work because they used impacted hammers to river box truck body’s together, that was a must for me to have them in there. I appreciate the advice. I see what my ears think next time I’m running it. Was running it today with out the screen in the filter and it was a little annoying. We’re taking a little 171 tho with a pip squeak engine


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## toadman (Nov 26, 2020)

motolife313 said:


> I know my body pretty good. I used to wear them everyday at work because they used impacted hammers to river box truck body’s together, that was a must for me to have them in there. I appreciate the advice. I see what my ears think next time I’m running it. Was running it today with out the screen in the filter and it was a little annoying. We’re taking a little 171 tho with a pip squeak engine


I was surprised to find out my 661 is quieter than my 250 & 193 according to an app on my iphone.
I've muffler modded the 193. 250 is stock & 661 is stock but with a 1/4" hole added in front of the factory hole. 
All still have screens.
I have 70% hearing loss in my right ear (according to my Dr.) due to a shotgun exploding on me when I was 13, and it's up to you, but to me it's worth protecting your hearing.


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## Husky Man (Nov 26, 2020)

Hearing Protection USE IT

After too many years in my youth around Chainsaws, outboard motors, ATV’s, JetSki’s, Snowmobiles, Loud Music etc, I hate not being able to understand a lot of the Dialogue on TV and in Movies, it thoroughly SUCKS.

I frequently have to ask people to repeat themselves. It really helps when they Look AT me when talking.

years ago, when I bought my Colt Combat Commander, I went shooting and forgot my hearing protection, I had wanted a 1911 for ever, I put one Mag through it, and that was it. It will be a Very Dire situation before I ever pull a trigger again without hearing protection.

After firing my 1911 unprotected, it took dayum near a week before I could hear half decent again, that incident sure didn’t HELP any, but wasn’t the only thing that Damaged my hearing.

My Doctor even told me that my hearing loss was a Cumulative effect, not any particular incident, but years of repeated abuse.

The occasional use won’t do it overnight, but it will add up. If running a saw without hearing protection doesn’t bother you, it should CONCERN You, that you are already started down a road with no U Turn available 

Your Ears, Your Choice, if I could go back, I would sure do a lot of things differently 

Woulda, Shoulda, Coulda,


Doug


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## BlackCoffin (Nov 26, 2020)

All my saws are ported, and they’re even loud with ear protection. Can never have enough horsepower when milling. 90cc saw and a granberg mill would be the ideal setup.


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## csmillingnoob (Nov 27, 2020)

Husky Man said:


> Hearing Protection USE IT
> 
> After too many years in my youth around Chainsaws, outboard motors, ATV’s, JetSki’s, Snowmobiles, Loud Music etc, I hate not being able to understand a lot of the Dialogue on TV and in Movies, it thoroughly SUCKS.
> 
> ...


Cumulative damage is exactly what my doctor told me. Except for the Colt, everything you are saying describes me. I hate missing 25% of the dialogue in a movie. Or 25% of the words in a sentence. I can come up with strange gap fillers.

the only sound I HATE IS AN AIR COMPRESSOR. My 390xp doesn’t sound pound to me but my neighbors hate it when I’m doing shop work. Okay the 3120xp sounds loud even to me but I love the sound.

heck I should probably wear protection when I listen to Stevie Ray


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## motolife313 (Nov 27, 2020)

How’s that 3120 been treating you?


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## Husky Man (Nov 28, 2020)

Something else that I just thought of, that might help you out, is the Granberg 555(IIRC) now called the “Edging Mill” previously known as the “Mini Mill”.

If you don’t want a “Live Edge” on both sides of the boards, the G555 is a Great Tool to have. If you are Milling for dimensional lumber, mill your initial top slab, for a flat surface, then you can mill one side vertically, this will give you a smooth side to cut your slabs to width on a Table Saw, and reduce the width of your cut milling, which would allow in your case, a 30” mill to do it all, and reduce the stress on your powerhead.
You can also mill both vertical edges of the log, and have dimensional lumber slicing boards off the log with the mill, while reducing the load on your milling powerhead, and the size of the mill you need even more. IIRC, my G555 was a bit over $150, and well worth it 

Doug


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## Husky Man (Nov 28, 2020)

motolife313 said:


> How’s that 3120 been treating you?


Hi Neighbor, if you’re asking Me, I haven’t had much time to use it in awhile, I have been working 65-70 hour weeks since late April, not counting my travel time, with only 3 or 4 weeks that I have even been home more than 48 hours. I’m Killin it pay wise, already 25% over what I made all last year, but I need some Home Time, fortunately I did get this week off because of Doctor and Dental appointments.

I have been Very Happy with the 3120XP so far, once I figured out what it Likes when starting. Since adding the 390XP and 395XP’s, the 3120XP is used almost exclusively for milling, and I have a Bunch of that to catch up on, the neighbors across the street had a Large Maple taken down and gave it to me, they have asked for some Benches for their fire pit from it, but they don’t even burn much in it.





I still have a pile of Maple Logs in front of the house that I am trying to make time to mill, I want to mill a solid Maple Workbench Top from it, I will mill some lumber for future projects yet to be determined, and what isn’t suitable for lumber/projects will become BTU’s


Doug


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## motolife313 (Nov 28, 2020)

Thanks for the feedback.

Ran my saws yesterday no problem without ear plugs. My little boys screaming I my ear because he doesn’t wanna go to sleep is far worse lol.


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## csmillingnoob (Nov 28, 2020)

motolife313 said:


> Thanks for the feedback.
> 
> Ran my saws yesterday no problem without ear plugs. My little boys screaming I my ear because he doesn’t wanna go to sleep is far worse lol.


It’s not about it bothering you now. I love the sound of a chainsaw. I loved AC/DC cranked up too. Quail/duck/deer hunted without ear protection. No problem - then.

It’s about the cumulative damage to your ears when you reach my age.


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## Husky Man (Nov 28, 2020)

For about $50, a basic Husqvarna Helmet with Face Shield and Ear Muffs is Money WELL SPENT.

We can’t make you use any PPE, but in my opinion, it is FOOLISH not to. The effect is Cumulative and Irreversible, and SUCKS to Live with 

My hearing loss could be worse, but now I do what I can to avoid it getting any worse, but sure wish that I had done a Lot more, a Lot Sooner 

Your Ears, Your Choices, 
I learned the Hard Way, learn from my mistakes, not your own, hearing protection is a CHEAP and EASY way to preserve a Priceless sense 

Doug


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## motolife313 (Nov 28, 2020)

ok thanks guys I’ll try some ear muffs next time. Brought them over for my little boy when I’m running the saw. Haven’t tried them on him yet


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## Husky Man (Nov 28, 2020)

motolife313 said:


> ok thanks guys I’ll try some ear muffs next time. Brought them over for my little boy when I’m running the saw. Haven’t tried them on him yet


You won’t regret it 
Unfortunately, you won’t know what the consequences would have been from not using them, but that is much better than Suffering those consequences 

Trust me, I Truly Wish that I had been more careful about my hearing in the past, it would have made Life more enjoyable then, now and in the future 

I wish that I could hear my Wife, the FIRST Time, a lot of times, sometimes, it loses something the second time around, if you know what I mean 

Doug


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## jamieS (Nov 29, 2020)

Husky Man said:


> Something else that I just thought of, that might help you out, is the Granberg 555(IIRC) now called the “Edging Mill” previously known as the “Mini Mill”.
> 
> 
> 
> Doug


Excellent recommendation. And great looking maple pics! Man, the northwest can really grow trees and moss... and moss on trees!

Happy that this thread has swerved into safety gear, that was part of my hopes. One of the worst things about hearing is it doesn't just get bad, so you miss out on conversations, but many times people will also get tinnitus --- a constant and annoying ringing in the ears that never goes away, even as you try to sleep. I have a family member that has tinnitus and the definitely wish they wore hearing protection.


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## Woodanhor (Nov 29, 2020)

jamieS said:


> Excellent recommendation. And great looking maple pics! Man, the northwest can really grow trees and moss... and moss on trees!
> 
> Happy that this thread has swerved into safety gear, that was part of my hopes. One of the worst things about hearing is it doesn't just get bad, so you miss out on conversations, but many times people will also get tinnitus --- a constant and annoying ringing in the ears that never goes away, even as you try to sleep. I have a family member that has tinnitus and the definitely wish they wore hearing protection.


I have a friend who has it and also sensitive to loud noises some can cause him physical pain

His is from rock bands and artillery with no ear protection

Back to your original question there is a utube video of guys freehand cutting lumber from logs

It might be too much for your level
Always think safety first and dont do anything your not 100% comfortable with

Heres one video


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## jamieS (Nov 29, 2020)

Thanks, that's one of the videos that got me thinking along the lines of freehanding.

Here's two others that are also pretty interesting:


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## Whiskers (Nov 29, 2020)

The log moving moped in the first video will probably be over your budget!


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## Husky Man (Nov 29, 2020)

jamieS said:


> Excellent recommendation. And great looking maple pics! Man, the northwest can really grow trees and moss... and moss on trees!
> 
> Happy that this thread has swerved into safety gear, that was part of my hopes. One of the worst things about hearing is it doesn't just get bad, so you miss out on conversations, but many times people will also get tinnitus --- a constant and annoying ringing in the ears that never goes away, even as you try to sleep. I have a family member that has tinnitus and the definitely wish they wore hearing protection.


The G555 is definitely worth considering, to me, it was money well spent

We do get some truly BIG Trees out West, with the Douglas Firs being second only to the Coastal Redwoods. I don’t notice D Firs until they are 48”+DBH.

I recently was working the Southern Oregon/Northern California Coast, running 199/197/101, through Grants Pass and Brookings, OR down to Arcata,CA just North of Eureka, Right through the Heart of Redwood Country, a familiar area for me, and those HUGE Coastals simply never cease to AMAZE Me, I need to get some pics. 8’DBH Coastals are everywhere, and you quit noticing them pretty quickly when you see the 12-15’ Coastals, without a person, car or TRUCK near them for scale comparison, pictures often just don’t do them justice. To add to the Majesty of the Coastals, Hwy 199 runs along the Smith River, which is where the movie “Bird Box” was filmed. I didn’t care much for the movie, and it sure didn’t do the Natural Beauty of the area Justice, especially in the Fall, it Compares Very Favorably with anywhere in New England for Colors. Being a Truck Driver has it’s drawbacks, but has it’s Rewards as well ( I have even picked up SEVERAL of my chainsaws in the truck)

Yeah, Tinnitus is another EXCELLENT Reason to use hearing protection. Fortunately, for me it is an occasional annoyance, not very frequent or very severe, just a minor case for me, I sometimes go months between episodes, and it usually is just slight ringing, that I can mostly ignore, and still converse in-spite of, and usually doesn’t last for very long, 5-10 minutes typically

I am Fortunate to Live where I do, for the job that I have, and most importantly, for the Family and Friends in my Life

I Truly have Very Much to be Thankful For

Doug


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## jamieS (Nov 29, 2020)

Okay, and now you are making me want to travel to the NW during the fall!


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## jamieS (Nov 29, 2020)

csmillingnoob said:


> My recommendation on spending $1000.00 to mill:
> 
> 1. Order a Holzfforma 660 from thechainsawguy. Order through this board, not ebay. It will have been cranked and tested by him for less than $500.00. If you spend @ $525.00 with him you can get the big bore (98cc) that he has worked through thoroughly. You can save money by ordering through Holzfforma directly but I advise against it unless you have small engine mechanic ability because they frequently have small bugs in oil lines, fuel lines, carbs etc.
> 
> ...


csmillingnoob, I'm talking with thechainsawguy now... but any suggestions on where to purchase bar and chains?

-j


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## abbott295 (Nov 30, 2020)

I will add my voice to those who say use hearing protection. I think I have pretty much always used hearing protection running chainsaw; been aware that they are too noisy for quite a while, but a life time growing up on a farm and working in landscape and construction not realizing how much noise some of the tools and equipment make and how long I'm running them, I am on my second set of hearing aids at about $3600 per pair in eight years. They don't come cheap and they don't restore hearing 100%. As Husky Man says, 
"I wish that I could hear my Wife, the FIRST Time, a lot of times, sometimes, it loses something the second time around, if you know what I mean "

She wishes I could hear her the first time, and so do my kids also.


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## U&A (Nov 30, 2020)

Question,

If you spend $1000 on gear and end up not wanting to do it or not liking it......then you just wasted $1000 right? 


Sent while firmly grasping my redline lubed RAM [emoji231]


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## toadman (Nov 30, 2020)

U&A said:


> Question,
> 
> If you spend $1000 on gear and end up not wanting to do it or not liking it......then you just wasted $1000 right?
> 
> ...



Nope. 
At least that's not how I see it...
You end up knowing first hand why you don't like X POS & so gained some insight, likely skills & almost certainly can sell it for a small loss if it's not broken.
Or in some cases a slight profit


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## jamieS (Nov 30, 2020)

Yeah, life is short and the list of things I want to try is long.

I'm getting pretty good at reselling things I no longer need. In a way, buying/trying/selling is almost like buying a class or renting equipment for a while. Even if I don't take something up, I'm happy to KNOW that I don't like it and I'm happy to pass on my used-but-not-abused gear to someone else for a good price.


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## csmillingnoob (Nov 30, 2020)

No, I wouldn't consider $1,000 a waste even if I turn out not like milling. A $500.00 chainsaw can have value down the road even if the resale value drops. A chainsaw has value after a hurricane, tornado, ice storm, beetle infestation, or just cleaning up at the lot/cabin at the river.

Anybody wanna buy some antique bamboo flyrods. Time to fish for trout has been drastically altered.


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## csmillingnoob (Nov 30, 2020)

jamieS said:


> csmillingnoob, I'm talking with thechainsawguy now... but any suggestions on where to purchase bar and chains?
> 
> -j


That's a bit of a tricky question.

I have never used low-pro bars and chains. I've pretty much stuck with 3/8 .063 (_though I.m going with 404 .063 on my new 3120xp_.) It's easy to find decent deals on 3/8 bars and skip chains on fleabay. Just go with price and big volume/likes on Oregon stuff. Remember that Stihl and Husqvarna have different mounts.

However, I might consider buying Stihl skipchain from your local dealer if you get the 660 from dave. Stihl makes high quality chain. Also, it doesn't hurt to establish some relationship with a Stihl dealer. As a general rule, they won't work on stihl clones but they might if you build up a relationship with them before you need their help. 

Dave will have tested and run your Holzfforma/Hutzell 660 clone. He's at about 170 ft. above sea level. I'm at 200 ft. My 3120 came perfectly tuned out of the box and a bit rich. What's your elevation? Are you ready to tune or need a lesson? Stihl dealer *might *give you a lesson. Hint: Big dealers are less helpful than smaller guys.


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## jamieS (Nov 30, 2020)

csmillingnoob said:


> That's a bit of a tricky question.
> 
> I have never used low-pro bars and chains. I've pretty much stuck with 3/8 .063 (_though I.m going with 404 .063 on my new 3120xp_.) It's easy to find decent deals on 3/8 bars and skip chains on fleabay. Just go with price and big volume/likes on Oregon stuff. Remember that Stihl and Husqvarna have different mounts.
> 
> ...


Thanks, I appreciate the info on chains. I've been doing a lot of searching... I'm sorta, half-way, starting to make sense of it all (!)

And interesting about the tuning. I'm at ~500 ft. I think I'll do a little searching to see if I can learn about tuning...


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## toadman (Nov 30, 2020)

Plus 1 on making friends with a local shop!!
I have been blessed with a local shop who goes way out of their way to help me when I need parts, warranty work, or advice, but sadly that's not always the case & it took me years to get a good relationship with them, as well as spending a fair amount of money with them to get to this point.


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## jamieS (Dec 1, 2020)

An update: I went ahead and bought the Granberg mini/edging mill... and also bought a 85$ fake "Alaskian" mill just to give it a try. I'll replace the bolts before using the mill. 660 clone with replaced piston and oiler is on it's way...

I don't have an aluminum ladder, but I can run some decent 2x4 through my jointer and planer as references for the first cuts... or maybe if this is definitely the way to go, I can borrow one from a neighbor...

Thinking about how I'm going to mill. I'm leaning towards quarter sawing most of it, which will work best for the cabinet/shelves I plan to make. (Plus less likely to warp in drying.) Trying to figure out the order of cuts so that I have flats to reference each board...


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## toadman (Dec 1, 2020)

I use a known flat 2x12 for a first cut reference a lot when a ladder is unavailable. 
Mine has 2 2x2's screwed to it, one on each side of the 2x12 where it sits on the log.
I find it's really hard to get 2 2x4 sections lined up perfectly with each other on top of an uneven log, even with "rungs" of 2x4 screwing the 2 long ones together. 
I have used that method before though & it works quite well when given some effort to get everything aligned, tight & square before putting it on the log.

for the mini mill, a planed & edged 2x4 would be a dream!!


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## jamieS (Dec 1, 2020)

Ah, 2x12 with 2x4 rails makes sense! I can see how this is easier than trying to level just rails alone.


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## csmillingnoob (Dec 1, 2020)

toadman said:


> I use a known flat 2x12 for a first cut reference a lot when a ladder is unavailable.
> Mine has 2 2x2's screwed to it, one on each side of the 2x12 where it sits on the log.
> I find it's really hard to get 2 2x4 sections lined up perfectly with each other on top of an uneven log, even with "rungs" of 2x4 screwing the 2 long ones together.
> I have used that method before though & it works quite well when given some effort to get everything aligned, tight & square before putting it on the log.
> ...


I don't have any experience with the Granberg mini mill. I use a Haddon lumbermaker for edging or field ripping. 


Most of my sellable cuts are live edge slabs. Edging the plith can help reduce a big log down to something small enough to go through the mill. Therefore, I sometimes edge the plith of too-big logs. 


The plith is pretty useless as live edge and can do crazy things in your drying stack. I _now always_ rip a 3-5/8ths plith cut of a log in half or along any noticeable crack/stress lines with the Haddon. Careful! Those cuts can blow up when they separate along stress lines. The Haddon works best with a straight 2x6 that has been lightly "cleaned" on one edge through the table saw. I usually just cut the true plith into posts. Depending on the log, I sometimes do this on the 9/4ths slabs on either side of the 3-5/8 "true plith", then saw them into boards instead of posts after drying. This means I do not have live edge slabs from the @8-1/2 inch heart of the log.


After I field edge/rip, I follow up with a Skill 10-1/4" worm gear (_cut depth 3-11/16ths_) circular saw in a homemade ripping jig. Pretty close to perfect. Later, I rip off the other edge with a table saw or cut the "true plith" into posts.


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## toadman (Dec 3, 2020)

So, I got My Ebay clone today!! 
I didn't take any pics as my camera is MIA & the one on my phone hasn't worked since I got the phone (oops) but it did need a couple little things to work well; 
-the selector switch was very hard to get to stay in half choke. It actually started fine like this, but I fixed that pretty easily anyway, it was the linkage was slightly too long by half a mm or so, so I bent it just slightly in themiddle of the straighter section. 
Seems to start very easily now & stay in half choke/fast idle properly.
-the pull cord return spring was not wound properly & after 15 pulls or so it stopped retracting the pull cord all the way, leaving 6" or so of cord hanging out... I tried to put a few more twists in the spring, but I can't be ceratin after it sproinged out in a mess on me (as usual, lol.) & seems to function as intended. 
This is my first kit saw I haven't assembled myself, so time will tell how it performs


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## csmillingnoob (Dec 3, 2020)

toadman said:


> So, I got My Ebay clone today!!
> I didn't take any pics as my camera is MIA & the one on my phone hasn't worked since I got the phone (oops) but it did need a couple little things to work well;
> -the selector switch was very hard to get to stay in half choke. It actually started fine like this, but I fixed that pretty easily anyway, it was the linkage was slightly too long by half a mm or so, so I bent it just slightly in themiddle of the straighter section.
> Seems to start very easily now & stay in half choke/fast idle properly.
> ...



That's why I suggested that OP buy a bugged-out version from Dave. The reports of the engines are very good, but they have a reputation for small bugs out of the box. Check your oil/gas lines when new and then fairly regularly thereafter.


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## jamieS (Dec 21, 2020)

Well, not bad for a first milling job. Finished with all my eyes, fingers, and toes.

I decided not to freehand afterall. It wasn't that much more expensive to buy the grandberg edging mill and a chinese cheap horizontal mill.

Got about of cord of fire wood and a 2' x 4' x 6' stack of lumber. (And an amazing amount of sawdust.) And learned a bit more that I knew before I started.

Thanks for everyone's help on this thread!


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## Whiskers (Dec 21, 2020)

Nice! Bet you woke up the neighborhood!


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## csmillingnoob (Dec 22, 2020)

jamieS said:


> Well, not bad for a first milling job. Finished with all my eyes, fingers, and toes.
> 
> I decided not to freehand afterall. It wasn't that much more expensive to buy the grandberg edging mill and a chinese cheap horizontal mill.
> 
> ...



Welcome to the club.

How did the dave-worked Holzfforma run? 

Hope you get a solid, long life out of it - that will tell you whether you want to continue on with this pasttime.

How's the budget looking? $1,000.00 spent yet?


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## jamieS (Dec 22, 2020)

Yeah, the 660 clone Dave put together is a beast. It has the Meteor piston and a new oiler. Worked great. 
The safety gear put me over $1000, but that was money well spent


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## csmillingnoob (Dec 23, 2020)

jamieS said:


> Yeah, the 660 clone Dave put together is a beast. It has the Meteor piston and a new oiler. Worked great.
> The safety gear put me over $1000, but that was money well spent



So, tell us what all you got. What you think you still need. Mill modifications.

Cant hook?
Lifting device like floor jack, etc.?
Slab moving cart/devices?
wedges?
bar(s)?
chains?
Sharpening tools?


I'm barely out of the "noobie" stage myself. It's interesting to watch someone else get set up. I'm sure you will be getting more tools as you progress


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## jamieS (Dec 23, 2020)

Sure, so here's what I got...

36" cheap horizontal mill
36" cheap forester brand bar, 0.50, 
woodlandpro 36" 3/8 0.50 ripping chain 
granburg edging mill
24" oregon brand bar 0.50 (spent more here since this will also be my general crosscutting saw)
woodlandpro 24" 3/8 0.50 ripping chain and crosscut chain (cross cut for bucking stove rounds for the stuff I didn't turn into lumber)
stihl sharpening kit with file, plate, depth gauge jig
chainsawdave's 660 clone, with replacement piston and oiler, test run before shipping
4 plastic felling wedges (could make own out of hardwood)
helmet with noise muffs and face shield
long safety chaps (I'm 6' tall and the "42 inch" husq chaps drapped over the top of my boot -- which is what I wanted)
(used gloves and boots and fume respirator that I already owned)
gas container, fuel oil
bar oil
homemade bar-end oiler made out of plastic bottle, 1/4" tubing and brass fittings/valves from homedepot
I would say that's about what's minimally required.

I milled all the logs where they had been dropped, so no additional equipment needed to move the wood --- otherwise that would have added the cost of a winch,/come-along, jack, peavey, etc. Basically by buying the edging mill, I could make quartersawn lumber without having to rotate the log. But I would have loved to have had the wood jacked up higher and be standing, not kneeling. 

I just got the book "chainsaw lumbermaking" by Maloff and really like all the jigs/fixtures in that book to make milling easier. Being able to stand up straight, winch the mill, operate the throttle remotely, etc. I can see that as being the next thing I pursue.

Hope that helps!


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## csmillingnoob (Dec 23, 2020)

jamieS said:


> Sure, so here's what I got...
> 
> 36" cheap horizontal mill
> 36" cheap forester brand bar, 0.50,
> ...


Good expenditure on Maloff!

3 ton floor jack from Harbor freight or Craigslist combined with can’t hook/peavy will help you maneuver and jack up logs. Elevation to cut down hill is better than a winch.

have fun!


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## toadman (Dec 23, 2020)

__





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I have been using this for quite some time, but just recently to pick up logs... it works great, better than a floor or railroad jack, because I can just roll the log onto it with a cant hook, and put a 1/2" lag through each of the hooks used to hold a motorcycle to it. The log doesn't budge after that, and I have lifted One end of 12ft x 34" Green oak logs with it.
The 2 ton rating is highly conservative IMO, that log weighed 4700 lbs in boards once milled, and I have jacked my work 550 with a full load of wood to change a tire.
1.5 tons Seasoned fits easily in the 550, which weighs 9800 empty.
Edit; it also allows for a steel bar to lock it in the full upright position, so I don't have to worry about accidentally releasing or lowering the jack while working. Or sag.


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