# Crane accident



## koz (Aug 9, 2009)

SYLVAN BEACH —

A Sylvan Beach home and several boats were damaged Saturday when a crane collapsed on Vienna Road, state police said.

A 130-ton crane was taking down trees behind a residence at 1116 Vienna Road at about 8:23 a.m. when the accident occurred. A large tree limb caused the crane to tip forward and the fully extended boom to crash to the ground, police said.

A rear deck on the residence and three boats docked along the Mariner’s Landing canal were damaged by the crane and debris. The state Department of Environmental Conservation later was called to assist with leaking diesel fluid and hydraulic fluid from the crane and the boats, police said.

The accident temporarily closed Vienna Road between Route 13 and Kenwood Avenue, and is still under investigation, police said.


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## toddstreeservic (Aug 9, 2009)

Wow! I bet that was a ride! Hope he (or she) was wearing their seatbelt!


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## Scottscape (Aug 9, 2009)

Did anyone get hurt?


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## tomtrees58 (Aug 9, 2009)

got to love it big crane you think you can cut big wood not:censored: never cut Any big er then you can handle tom trees


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## outofmytree (Aug 9, 2009)

I would need new underwear.


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## ropensaddle (Aug 9, 2009)

outofmytree said:


> I would need new underwear.



+2 I would hate to be the climber cause you can't get out of the way fast enough.


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## Dadatwins (Aug 9, 2009)

That would fall under a 'really bad day' category.


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## koz (Aug 9, 2009)

The news is saying there were no injuries.
Here's another pic


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## BuddhaKat (Aug 9, 2009)

Wow, talk about miscalculating your load. This is a classic example of one of my biggest pet peeves. Somebody, usually completely unqualified, just looks at something and builds a picture in their head of the lift, but doesn't have a clue about factoring all of the variables that are actually in play. "It'll work" coming out of the mouth of some dumb kid, myself included when I was a young man, is a recipe for disaster. 

I'm much happier when a fully qualified and highly experienced operator makes a mistake like this. At least the guy knows what he's doing.


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## ropensaddle (Aug 9, 2009)

BuddhaKat said:


> Wow, talk about miscalculating your load. This is a classic example of one of my biggest pet peeves. Somebody, usually completely unqualified, just looks at something and builds a picture in their head of the lift, but doesn't have a clue about factoring all of the variables that are actually in play. "It'll work" coming out of the mouth of some dumb kid, myself included when I was a young man, is a recipe for disaster.
> 
> I'm much happier when a fully qualified and highly experienced operator makes a mistake like this. At least the guy knows what he's doing.



It has more to do with dumb arse than qualification If it were my crane I would never take enough weight to even stress it. I am not certified but would not do that.


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## Shaun Bowler (Aug 9, 2009)

I would love to see WTF the pick was.


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## Texas Traveler (Aug 10, 2009)

Shaun Bowler said:


> I would love to see WTF the pick was.



If the load was near the limit, it has to be kept under the tip of boom to keep from overturning the crane.

If it swings outward past the tip over it goes, the law of murphy sets in.

Ole murphy is a hard fast teacher


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## Pruitt1222 (Aug 10, 2009)

Like Texas said it probably wasn't over loaded it probably had a swing and went over. I am a certified operator, and have had this happen to me. Just not that severe, When you put a heavy load on a crane thats picking fairly flat you need to hook one to two foot away from the hook. That way when the boom is loaded its vertical, newbie riggers will often hook the load vertical from the tip. When loaded the boom drops a few feet and changes the lift point and cause the load to swing away from the crane. I was running a 50 ton trex when the same thing happened to me, just picked the load of a lowboy swing out and tilted the crane over. I was in the cab pulling and pushing levers freaking out, nothing was working though. when the crane tilted all the fuel went to the front of the tank and the engine died. after getting it restarted and getting the riggers on the ground I got out and I tell yea, the seat had a mountian range down the middle of it. Needle and sledge hammer thing


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## outofmytree (Aug 12, 2009)

Pruitt1222 said:


> Like Texas said it probably wasn't over loaded it probably had a swing and went over. I am a certified operator, and have had this happen to me. Just not that severe, When you put a heavy load on a crane thats picking fairly flat you need to hook one to two foot away from the hook. That way when the boom is loaded its vertical, newbie riggers will often hook the load vertical from the tip. When loaded the boom drops a few feet and changes the lift point and cause the load to swing away from the crane. I was running a 50 ton trex when the same thing happened to me, just picked the load of a lowboy swing out and tilted the crane over. I was in the cab pulling and pushing levers freaking out, nothing was working though. when the crane tilted all the fuel went to the front of the tank and the engine died. after getting it restarted and getting the riggers on the ground I got out and I tell yea, the seat had a mountian range down the middle of it. Needle and sledge hammer thing



Pruitt could you draw this for me? Nothing fancy just a side on view. I read and reread but I have a weird mental image of what you are saying so it's probably just the coffee.....


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## Texas Traveler (Aug 12, 2009)

outofmytree said:


> Pruitt could you draw this for me? Nothing fancy just a side on view. I read and reread but I have a weird mental image of what you are saying so it's probably just the coffee.....



I am not Pruitt but I am sure he is referring to boom defection.

When you tighten up on a load the boom will defect downward moving the center lift point of the load inward causing it to swing outwards.

Always keep the lift point of the boom over the load, that is why a good groundman or rigger is indispensible.


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## Texas Traveler (Aug 12, 2009)

Texas Traveler said:


> I am not Pruitt but I am sure he is referring to boom defection.
> 
> When you tighten up on a load the boom will defect downward moving the center lift point of the load inward causing it to swing outwards.
> 
> Always keep the lift point of the boom over the load, that is why a good groundman or rigger is indispensible.


 What I am trying to say is some times you have to boom up to offset the boom defection instead of hoisting up to center your boom over the lift point.

In rigging there is a book out that would help on crane picks


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## Pruitt1222 (Aug 12, 2009)

More or less when your working with high lift angles you rarely notice this but when picking loads with boom below 60 degree when you pick up some thing the boom will sag down several feet. If you rig the load true vertical from the tip of the boom upon picking the load the boom will drop and extend causeing the lift point to be away from the load. Which in turn causes the load to swing away from the crane. a rt 555 full stick at 40deg. will hold 3k lower the boom 10ft and the crane can't even hold its self. What I am saying is the limits come quickly, If you was gonna pick something up in that set up when the boom drops if the load swings two feet you are only about 200lbs from floating riggers. Scary part is thats normal practice.


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## Texas Traveler (Aug 12, 2009)

Pruitt1222 said:


> More or less when your working with high lift angles you rarely notice this but when picking loads with boom below 60 degree when you pick up some thing the boom will sag down several feet. If you rig the load true vertical from the tip of the boom upon picking the load the boom will drop and extend causeing the lift point to be away from the load. Which in turn causes the load to swing away from the crane. a rt 555 full stick at 40deg. will hold 3k lower the boom 10ft and the crane can't even hold its self. What I am saying is the limits come quickly, If you was gonna pick something up in that set up when the boom drops if the load swings two feet you are only about 200lbs from floating riggers. Scary part is thats normal practice.


 Pruitt is right.
Here is a list of some books & there is a lot more out there.

http://www.toolsforstagecraft.com/books-riggingsafety.htm
In most unfamiliar crane lifts talk it over with your groundman before the lift & always look for the unexpected.


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## outofmytree (Aug 14, 2009)

Thanks guys.

Pruitt you explained that really well. I had not encountered this as my meagre crane experience has always been rigging and cutting from a 200ft EWP. I have always planned on getting my riggers ticket so I could use a smaller crane and rig from the tree so this sort of information will come in handy one day.


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## Rickytree (Aug 14, 2009)

koz said:


> SYLVAN BEACH —
> 
> A Sylvan Beach home and several boats were damaged Saturday when a crane collapsed on Vienna Road, state police said.
> 
> ...




WOW how much stick would that crane have? And what could it lift at 45 degrees? These guys must have been pickin TREES!
Thanks for the post KOZ! That happened on a job once and the crane guy was a veteran, could not see cuz of the house. Cut the tree off the ladder and ....Well it all went good no one got hurt. I was giving signals.


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## treeslayer (Aug 14, 2009)

Shaun Bowler said:


> I would love to see WTF the pick was.



ditto. 135 ton even with full reach? I've worked with up to a 200 ton, doing trees, and a 350 lifting rooftop A/C units, and these guys F----ed up royally.

gotta be the swing factor, and a climber who , unfortunately, didn't know enough. 

and I bet they didn't have radios.


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## BlueRidgeMark (Aug 14, 2009)

Texas Traveler said:


> What I am trying to say is some times you have to boom up to offset the boom *defection *...




Isn't the word, "deflection"?


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## Pruitt1222 (Aug 15, 2009)

Rickytree said:


> WOW how much stick would that crane have? And what could it lift at 45 degrees?



Not to sure on a 130 ton? Looks like a demag 395 to me. If so its a 150t crane, looks exactly same as the one in the image. Now to answer your questions stick would be 193' or 253' with jib. Full stick at 45 about 6200lbs. only about 135 feet way from turret, with jib at 45 would be 2400lbs at 177' from turret. Keep in mind that would be for a 150t crane, If I had to bet on it I would say that its a 150 maybe short a strand on the block. Maybe thay forgot to add there block weight or to windy? No telling, there was a tree company doing a removal at a friends house when I was younger and the operator set the rigger down on the septic tank, Soon as he got the load he busted through and crushed their garage. It was awsome, the operator pee'd on himself. From then out I just wanted a crane for myself.


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## koz (Aug 15, 2009)

Here's a post from another forum from someone that was there.



> Saw the crane in person as we live only about 3 miles from where it happened. Had to do a double take when we passed it, alot of wheels sticking in the air. Awesome sight. I looked at the trees a couple years ago, seems I mentioned do it in the winter, no boats, harbor is froze.
> Anyway my neighbor's son-in-law took some of the surronding limbs off so they could get 2 more cranes in to lower it. One on the boom and one in the front. When they got it on the ground they put a dozer blade on it to keep it from tipping again. He said the truck started right up and the boom reeled in no problem. From the way he understood it the crane belonged to a relative and is used to set mobile homes up with. I asked if it was too big a piece they were picking he said no, thought the cut wasn,t all the way through and boom was extended a ways. He took some digital pictures said he might pass on. Got the info from my neighbor, he was there most of the time so I'm assuming its relatively accurate.


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## Rickytree (Aug 15, 2009)

Pruitt1222 said:


> Not to sure on a 130 ton? Looks like a demag 395 to me. If so its a 150t crane, looks exactly same as the one in the image. Now to answer your questions stick would be 193' or 253' with jib. Full stick at 45 about 6200lbs. only about 135 feet way from turret, with jib at 45 would be 2400lbs at 177' from turret. Keep in mind that would be for a 150t crane, If I had to bet on it I would say that its a 150 maybe short a strand on the block. Maybe thay forgot to add there block weight or to windy? No telling, there was a tree company doing a removal at a friends house when I was younger and the operator set the rigger down on the septic tank, Soon as he got the load he busted through and crushed their garage. It was awsome, the operator pee'd on himself. From then out I just wanted a crane for myself.



Thanks for the info? It would be cool if they invented a crane with a kinda sliding counter weight like a tractor pull trailer. The more it goes out the more you can lift. Well maybe not. I just woke up soo.


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## Texas Traveler (Aug 16, 2009)

Rickytree said:


> Thanks for the info? It would be cool if they invented a crane with a kinda sliding counter weight like a tractor pull trailer. The more it goes out the more you can lift. Well maybe not. I just woke up soo.


 Grove used to have sliding counter weights on mobile cranes, but after some crushing deaths & forgetful operators that ended.

Some of the foreign made hyd cranes can lift more at greater distance by reconfigureing the extended boom. I think grove had that feature on some RT cranes like the 55 ton 

I have been on cranes that if boom was fully extended they would flip without a load.

I have been on a new Manitowoc 777 that would flip if you boom down over the side of the tracks, only boom down over the front of the tracks.

Others you could lift more from the side but flip if you swung over the front.

Figure all of your loads & go only with the cab load chart on each machine.

Never max a crane out, leave youself at least a 25 % safty factor.

I have been forced to retire for 8 years now, from bad knees & shoulders.

There is so much I have forgotten, but after a life-time of crane work I still have bad deams fairly often.

You youngsters that aspire to be operators can have all of my blessings & all of my bad dreams of the unknown factors.


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## Rickytree (Aug 16, 2009)

Thanks Texas! Good to know..


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