# Video of a Dead Pine Tree being Cut Down



## TrailChaser (Aug 13, 2011)

Just thought this might be a good video for you pro's to discuss and as the renter of the place I'm curious to see what you guys/gals have to say. 

A little background info on the video:
My family and I moved into the place a few months ago and I noticed the tree was dead and definitely close enough to hit the house if it were to fall in that direction. If it fell on the house it would have gone thru one of the two kids rooms. The landlord had her handyman come out to cut it down and after looking at it from every angle and discussing several different ways to get it down safely he decided to call her and inform her that the only safe way to go was hire a bucket truck or rent one for the day.... About two weeks go by with no word. Then I got a guy from around here that has a tree service to come out to give me a quote. Then he said he could have it down in no time so I gave him the go-ahead and grabbed the camera to record the action. 

[video=youtube;zekubpNJIHE]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zekubpNJIHE[/video]


----------



## gorman (Aug 14, 2011)

This guy is felling a dead tree with no helmet. Not a good idea. No pull line. Ugh. And he's by himself.


----------



## belgian (Aug 14, 2011)

I think he's getting dangerous once the tree hang up on him, but I don't know myself how to handle it from there myself.
Should he have used a cant hook and try to release it by rocking it free..?

Curious what the pro's have the say about it.


----------



## DG2244 (Aug 14, 2011)

Very dangerous fellow you found to drop a dead tree. He almost bought it there at the end! :msp_w00t:


----------



## TreeAce (Aug 14, 2011)

Well, I have seen worse. Plus u get two for the price of one. I guess.


----------



## Toddppm (Aug 14, 2011)

If that was AA, he wouldn't have moved when the piece swung and got knocked out. 

This is why I wouldn't let tenants make decisions concerning my property.


----------



## keh10 (Aug 14, 2011)

belgian said:


> I think he's getting dangerous once the tree hang up on him, but I don't know myself how to handle it from there myself.
> Should he have used a cant hook and try to release it by rocking it free..?
> 
> Curious what the pro's have the say about it.


 
If there's any chance of a tree hanging up, I don't drop it unless I have a pull line in it. It can be a very dangerous and frustrating position to be in. Don't know if he'd be the first guy I call next time.


----------



## TreeAce (Aug 14, 2011)

Ya, its not the prettiest felling job but i will say he did do a good job of not pinching his saw after the tree was hung up. He also kept two hands on the saw the whole time (i think). So under the conditions he was working with, meaning...woods, nothing but room to drop it, I think he did just fine. EXCEPT for not wearing any PPE. But thats his choice as far as I am concerned.


----------



## brookpederson (Aug 14, 2011)

Nice:bang: I love how he has to cut the other tree down too, I know none of us would be able to get away with that, at least not with my customers.


----------



## tree md (Aug 14, 2011)

Never a good idea to hang one up intentionally unless you are planning on lowering it in a controlled fashion with a bull line... And it's never a good idea to hang a dead one period. I have seen them jump off the stump when they are hung up like that and break a guys ankle. I've read about worse happening. There was a post in the injury and fatality forum of a man being killed doing exactly that a couple of weeks back. People don't really comprehend the forces at work. If that dead top decides to break out there is no time to react. It can bean you in the head before you can say ####. Same if the butt decides to jump off the stump and come at you. 

Personally, I would have either got a line in it and pulled it in another direction where it would not hang up or if that wasn't possible I would have climbed it and pieced it out without hanging it up. If the tree was too dead to safely climb I would have swung over from one of the live trees.


----------



## TimberMcPherson (Aug 14, 2011)

I would think its a case of "well I have a saw in the back, I wont go home and get more gear". He was being lazy and thinking of the $ before his and your safety. (I am wondering how close you were during the hang up phase)

No helmet on dead trees is pure stupid. Wedges and a cant hook would have been the minimum requirement for that job, Personally I would have a tirfir handy to help get things unstuck. (and pines amongst other pines almost always get stuck)


----------



## BlackOakTreeServ (Aug 14, 2011)

At 5:38 "Saw & truck bubba" almost lost some more teeth 

To the OP, cutting down another tree to to get the first tree un-hung is a very big no no...if I did that without asking home owner, I would be in big do do


----------



## jefflovstrom (Aug 14, 2011)

There ya go, OP.
13 Responses.
Jeff :msp_ohmy:


----------



## mic687 (Aug 14, 2011)

tree md said:


> Never a good idea to hang one up intentionally unless you are planning on lowering it in a controlled fashion with a bull line... And it's never a good idea to hang a dead one period. I have seen them jump off the stump when they are hung up like that and break a guys ankle. I've read about worse happening. There was a post in the injury and fatality forum of a man being killed doing exactly that a couple of weeks back. People don't really comprehend the forces at work. If that dead top decides to break out there is no time to react. It can bean you in the head before you can say ####. Same if the butt decides to jump off the stump and come at you.
> 
> Personally, I would have either got a line in it and pulled it in another direction where it would not hang up or if that wasn't possible I would have climbed it and pieced it out without hanging it up. If the tree was too dead to safely climb I would have swung over from one of the live trees.


 
I agree on the climbing it, plenty of tall trees to tie into and a test borecut maybe but it looked pretty sturdy. Where do you think his big shot to get a rope in it to pull it free was . I have used the big shot and a rope puller on a few of storm hung up trees that I did just did not want to climb. I also cut a nasty long dead white pine by transfering from a healthy one next to it and staying tied into the good one doesn't get rid of the nervousness but it is safe.


----------



## TrailChaser (Aug 14, 2011)

> Toddppm
> If that was AA, he wouldn't have moved when the piece swung and got knocked out.
> This is why I wouldn't let tenants make decisions concerning my property.



How should I have hired a tree service company? Gone and watched different companies work at a couple of their other jobs before making a decision?
This guy owns a tree service, and I felt way better having him cutting the tree down by himself as opposed to the "handyman" the landlord sent over originally.(He was definitely confident in his abilities.) The handyman was going to tie a rope to the other two closeby pine trees with about 10ft of slack then cut the two live pines and have their "momentum" pull the dead one down... Hopefully. After pointing out the bad things that could happen when his walmart rope broke he called the landlord to tell her he didn't want to be held responsible if "things went wrong" and that she would have to rent a bucket truck for a day or call the pro's. 

That being said, what about us renters with reckless landlords.. What if that handyman showed up while I was gone to work and just went to town on that tree with my wife and kids in the house. Which was his plan, as I had to walk outside and greet them after they had already been there for several minutes. I like to think they would have came in and told us to clear the kids out of that part of the house before they started cutting, but I really don't think that was in their plans. I also feel I was instrumental in them deciding not to go ahead with the plan they cooked up while scratching their heads.(Meaning they had zero confidence, but felt they were hired to do a job and by god they were gonna get'r done one way or another.) I was firm but nice when pointing out that I have to live here, and don't have any other options for my family if they crushed the house.



> woodsman44
> At 5:38 "Saw & truck bubba" almost lost some more teeth
> To the OP, cutting down another tree to to get the first tree un-hung is a very big no no...if I did that without asking home owner, I would be in big do do



He made 100% sure it was okay to cut the other tree instead of putting a line on it before he got started. We agreed on the price for just the dead one with the understanding that it would probably get hung up for a 2 for the price of 1 deal. The land/homeowner is an elderly lady who doesn't give a ____ about any of the trees and told me I could cut whatever I wanted. All she cares about is whether or not you have pets inside the house.

He was just there to do an estimate while his crew was on another job. I'm sure the lack of safety was due to it being a quick job. I got a little worried about his safety when he was cutting into the dead tree after it got hung up. I stayed at(what I thought was) a safe distance the whole time. 

This was my first time recording someone working. I didn't ask, just grabbed the camera and started shooting without really thinking about asking his permission. 
How would/do feel about your customers recording you as I'm sure it happens pretty often in this age of the camera in every ones pocket.?

Also what do you think is a fair price for the job done? What you see in the vid is what I got. The landlord wants her handyman to come cleanup the mess.(I'm about 95% sure I got a steal, just wondering.)


----------



## HILLBILLYREDNEC (Aug 14, 2011)

Several issues pop to mind. One you did have tree removed with no written permission of the land owner. The hacker you hired has no insurance. The third thing is you made your self liable to pay for any and all damages done to the land. Fourth is if this un insured hacker got hurt or killed your legally in deep manure. If he hit the structure your responsible for all cost involved.You created a video that could come back and bite you in the arse if the land owner decides to sue you for what ever reason. He show how he did not know a thing about hazard tree falling.


----------



## TrailChaser (Aug 14, 2011)

HILLBILLYREDNEC said:


> Several issues pop to mind. One you did have tree removed with no written permission of the land owner. The hacker you hired has no insurance. The third thing is you made your self liable to pay for any and all damages done to the land. Fourth is if this un insured hacker got hurt or killed your legally in deep manure. If he hit the structure your responsible for all cost involved.You created a video that could come back and bite you in the arse if the land owner decides to sue you for what ever reason. He show how he did not know a thing about hazard tree falling.


 
The landowner was calling me to find out if I got the quote that morning before the guy showed up because I okay'ed it with her the day before having him drive out. I was on the phone with her while discussing a price and what needed to happen with the owner of the tree service, who is bonded and insured.
She was worried about the tree falling and damaging her property because she admittedly doesn't keep any insurance on her properties..(too expensive in her book.) The owner of the tree service told me to ask her about her insurance covering the cost of cutting and removing the tree because according to him most insurance companies would rather pay that than pay for the damages after it falls in a storm or high winds.


----------



## HILLBILLYREDNEC (Aug 14, 2011)

Well if this guy is a licensed tree service, why did he show up unprepared with out PPE? And yo say this guy is reputable company the way he handled the saw makes that sound like he lied to you. The owner should have had a letter in your hands to provide for legal coverage in case the guy hit the house or got killed or maimed.


----------



## BlackOakTreeServ (Aug 14, 2011)

TrailChaser said:


> How should I have hired a tree service company? Gone and watched different companies work at a couple of their other jobs before making a decision?
> This guy owns a tree service, and I felt way better having him cutting the tree down by himself as opposed to the "handyman" the landlord sent over originally.(He was definitely confident in his abilities.) The handyman was going to tie a rope to the other two closeby pine trees with about 10ft of slack then cut the two live pines and have their "momentum" pull the dead one down... Hopefully. After pointing out the bad things that could happen when his walmart rope broke he called the landlord to tell her he didn't want to be held responsible if "things went wrong" and that she would have to rent a bucket truck for a day or call the pro's.
> 
> That being said, what about us renters with reckless landlords.. What if that handyman showed up while I was gone to work and just went to town on that tree with my wife and kids in the house. Which was his plan, as I had to walk outside and greet them after they had already been there for several minutes. I like to think they would have came in and told us to clear the kids out of that part of the house before they started cutting, but I really don't think that was in their plans. I also feel I was instrumental in them deciding not to go ahead with the plan they cooked up while scratching their heads.(Meaning they had zero confidence, but felt they were hired to do a job and by god they were gonna get'r done one way or another.) I was firm but nice when pointing out that I have to live here, and don't have any other options for my family if they crushed the house.
> ...



Ok, Im glad he got the ok to take out other tree, but in reality he should not of had to do it...like others said, he should have put a rope about half way up to have more control of were it falls....it really seemed to me this was a CUT&RUN job, thats why you got a good deal on the price, it was just him, with no saw chaps or forestry helmet when felling and bucking...its just not safe practice, it made him look like a saw bubba...no hard fellings, just posting what I see.


----------



## Pelorus (Aug 14, 2011)

OP's tree guy is gonna get nipped in the butt sooner than later.
Not good, not professional.

Portable gas powered capstan winch works great for anything likely to hang up. 
Have owned several chainsaw powerhead capstans available through Madsens and Baileys, but recently purchased a neat 4-stroke Honda powered one made in Quebec. (available on eBay, Wes Spur, Sherrill, etc)


----------



## Pelorus (Aug 14, 2011)

(from post 18) "The owner of the tree service told me to ask her about her insurance covering the cost of cutting and removing the tree because according to him most insurance companies would rather pay that than pay for the damages after it falls in a storm or high winds"


This is news to me, at least in my neck of the woods. Have had several clients over the years receive notification from their insurance providers that their policy would be cancelled if the homeowner did not get a hazard (dead) tree removed.

The insurance company didn't offer to cover the cost of the pre-emptive removal, lol. Makes sense that "wilful neglect" of a hazard tree would raise the ire of any insurer.


----------



## CNBTreeTrimming (Aug 14, 2011)

I think we all could have run up and down that tree about ten times before he got it down. That was awesome. I want to be that good someday. Nah maybe not quite that good. Haha


----------



## Blakesmaster (Aug 15, 2011)

Jeez, you boys are sure giving this guy a hard time. I think Timber probably hit the nail on the head. He was out doing estimates, happened to have a saw on him and figured he'd just take care of the little tree now so he didn't need to make another trip. Sure, there's about a million ways it could have been done safer, and he def looks hackish from this vid, but he got it done w/out incident.


----------



## tree md (Aug 15, 2011)

Well, was asked for my thoughts, as was everyone else... My thoughts are the dude looked sloppy and reckless... And I have seen someone break a bone doing exactly what this dude is doing. Never a good idea to intentionally hang a dead tree up then stand under it and cut no matter how you slice it... I guess if you don't want to hear someone's true thoughts and opinions then don't ask.


----------



## Rftreeman (Aug 15, 2011)

I probably would have used a rope and wore a hard hat but other than that, I guess I'm a hack cause I have and will hang trees up cause I ain't perfect and ain't none of you guys either, some think they are but they're not....like Blakes said, there's a million ways it could be done but this guy chose to do it that way and got it done without incident....


----------



## tree MDS (Aug 15, 2011)

Del_Corbin said:


> 25 Bucks??
> 
> 
> You came closer than you know to having a video that they wouldn't let you show on Utube.



Yeah, maybe it's just me, but I don't think almost getting your head smashed in during a short six and a half minute video, is a real good sign. 

At least the saw looked nice and sharp! 

What was that thing leaning against the tree?


----------

