# Bandit 2550, Carlton 4012, Rayco RG 45.



## bamastumphumper (Mar 20, 2015)

Any one running one ? I have a 2250 bandit moving up to a rg 45, Carlton 4012, or bandit 2550 soon any help? / experience ? I tested a rg and Carlton


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## gorman (Mar 20, 2015)

Scroll down and see the thread about the bandit wheels flying off.


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## Stump Grinder52 (Mar 22, 2015)

Bought a 08 Carlton 4012 last summer,it has a 33hp Kubota,4 wheel drive,scraper blade,Sandvic wheel,wireless and wired remote.Bought it with 420hrs.,is a great machine,plenty of power.


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## gorman (Mar 23, 2015)

Stump Grinder52 said:


> Bought a 08 Carlton 4012 last summer,it has a 33hp Kubota,4 wheel drive,scraper blade,Sandvic wheel,wireless and wired remote.Bought it with 420hrs.,is a great machine,plenty of power.



If you had the choice, would you have opted for the 44hp engine?


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## Mowingman (Mar 23, 2015)

I bought a new 4012 about 3 years ago next month. I love the machine. no problems whatsoever. I got the 44hp diesel. I think it is well worth the money to move up to the 44hp. You need to buy all the hp you can afford right up front, plus, I believe the 4012 would be a little underpowered with just a 33hp on it.
Jeff


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## Stump Grinder52 (Mar 23, 2015)

Yes i would op for the 44hp Kubota. I bought used from a private owner,low hours [420hrs],between the 33hp Kubota,Sandvic wheel,and wireless remote, makes it a great machine.I moved up from a Carlton 2500-4 with a 27hp Kolher with Green Teeth,which was also a good machine.The newer one is just a different class of machine,burns about the same amount of fuel about a one gallon a hour.Buy the way ,the 4 wheel drive and push blade is also a great option.


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## gorman (Mar 23, 2015)

The reason I asked is that my carlton dealer said that the power increase isn't that noticeable going from 33 to 44 hp.


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## Coen (Mar 23, 2015)

A year ago when I went from a 252 to a 4012 with a 44 I thought grinding might be a pleasure. It's not quite the big step up I thought it would be. If I could go back I would just keep sharp teeth on the 252 or spend more and get the 7012.


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## Stump Grinder52 (Mar 23, 2015)

Gorman,i presume your talking about George at Shelter Tree in Attleboro Ma. He's good people,he told me the same,in fact he told me there's i think, 4k difference between the 33hp and 44hp version so when i saw a good 33hp version with high options and low hrs. i grabbed it.Coen i looked for months for a good used SP7015,people wanted big money for worn out ,oil leaking ,junks, so i decided to step back and pick up a more modern version of what i had.I have no regrets.Sp7015 is nice if you have use for it.


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## Coen (Mar 24, 2015)

Yeah, I looked for a long time for a used 7015 before buying the new 4012. One of my sons (the patient one) does all the grinding. The thing he really loves over the 252 is the remote control.


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## Stump Grinder52 (Mar 24, 2015)

Yes you have to be patient and have a plan to grind stumps at least around here. Do you have the Sandvic wheel? Does a great job,leaves most of the mess in the hole.The glacier wasn't good to us around,stones everywhere,very common to find/hit stones inbeded in the stump.


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## Coen (Mar 24, 2015)

Yep, it has the Sandvic wheel and it's pretty rocky here to. Overall, I guess I'm satisfied with the 4012. The return on investment just doesn't seem to be where I wish it was.


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## gorman (Mar 24, 2015)

Stump Grinder52 said:


> Gorman,i presume your talking about George at Shelter Tree in Attleboro Ma. He's good people,he told me the same,in fact he told me there's i think, 4k difference between the 33hp and 44hp version so when i saw a good 33hp version with high options and low hrs. i grabbed it.Coen i looked for months for a good used SP7015,people wanted big money for worn out ,oil leaking ,junks, so i decided to step back and pick up a more modern version of what i had.I have no regrets.Sp7015 is nice if you have use for it.



George is the man. He has helped me out countless times whenever my piece of junk grinder broke. I was gonna pull the trigger on a new grinder last year but thankfully I didn't because I really didn't do much grinding. If I got a larger grinder I would opt for the sandvik wheel if not for the faster grinding but for the easier cleanup.


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## Mtrstump (Mar 24, 2015)

Why are none of you guys considering Vermeer? I personally, want to buy a stump grinder from someone who has their shop in my town. I have owned 4 stump grinders, nothing but vermeer. And let me tell u I have had some problems but they have never been anything but extreamly helpful and never left me without a loaner so I could keep working. That means a lot to me. Just my two cents


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## Coen (Mar 24, 2015)

I feel like I went overboard on researching the 4012 before I bought it. I felt confident the machine was bulletproof and I really wasn't concerned about dealer support being a 5 hour drive. Right after buying it I started reading from people who were not happy with theirs. I wasn't very happy with a few minor things just after the sale. For example, they had just changed the way the teeth were set 45 degrees. The dealer sent me the wrong teeth twice and then headquarters ships me the wrong teeth. I was in a hurry to get them and I don't think any of them gave a rats ass. During this frustrating time, I thought I'll just call Revolution to get them. The person I talked to there had an interesting story. He basically said Carlton....... I better quit 
Anyway, I wish I had something other then Carlton in my garage. When I look at it or think about this it, I just lie to myself; it makes it easier. The vermeer and the bandit reps I've dealt with are both very good.


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## Mtrstump (Mar 24, 2015)

Coen, I have never owned or even operated a Carlton. So I have nothing against them. I just can't stand the thought of support being a couple states away when we need help. That's why I buy vermeer. That and the fact they they have never been anything but GOOD to me.


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## Coen (Mar 24, 2015)

I have a great mechanic and like I said, I thought I was buying something that was bulletproof. I regret that decision now. I just know that I could call my bandit rep tomorrow and he would do everything he could to make sure I'm takin care of. I feel like the carlton rep would be bothered that I called. This is not a comforting feeling. 
Another thing about my Carlton purchase. The machine was delivered by truck. The salesman was going to bring his family to vacation near me the week that it was to be delivered and shoot over to my place to introduce himself and go over the machine. That didn't happen!! It didn't bother me too much at the time, but I sure know what to expect in the future. 
The explanation I received about the change from the revolution wheel to the evolution wheel does nothing to improve my thoughts about the company. Just seems crooked.


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## Mtrstump (Mar 24, 2015)

Coen, I think u need to demo a 652 or 852. The speed and versatility is incredible. I don't know if ur in a position to trade, but I'm sure vermeer would be glad to demo it for you. It just must be a real bummer to go to work everyday with a piece of equipment you don't like. Sometimes you just have to chalk a mistake up to a valuable lesson learned. BTW I run a 852 and love it.


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## Coen (Mar 24, 2015)

Thanks. This is the first time I've opened up about this.


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## Mtrstump (Mar 24, 2015)

Your welcome. And good luck to you


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## Stump Grinder52 (Mar 24, 2015)

I read your posts,and agree with you guys,dealer service/network is everything,weather it's chainsaws,chippers,log splitters, trucks ect.If you can't get service,parts or question answered what good is their product.I am just very lucky i live 25 miles from my dealer and have the owners and his mechanic tel. number and could call those guys and they would do their best to try to help me out.I have yet bought a machine from them,if they had what i wanted i would,yet they don't care.They know they are building up a long term customer relationship.Mtrstump sounds like you have a good dealer ,don't blame you for sticking with him and his product.Coen that just shows you that dealer just doesn't care.When i went over to buy teeth for my grinder he asked me what style teeth had ,i didn't have the slightest idea,lucky enough i had copied the vin number off the machine,he called Carlton gave them the vin number and they told him what kind of teeth i had,things like that make a difference.


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## Coen (Mar 25, 2015)

Yep, I wish I could replay that story in my life. Just one more gripe and I'll quit. No two more. 
When it was delivered it was the first Carlton I'd ever seen in my life and the operations manual that came with it was for some tow-behind model. I notified the dealer right away about this and he said he would bring the right one with him when he came to see me which never happened. I think I received the correct one two weeks later in the mail after quite a bit of aggravation by my son trying to figure out how to run it. 
Last thing which was probably my fault. The poly belt going to the cutter head came apart after about 20 hours. It probably should have been tightened, which we didn't do. Carlton got a belt to me right away. 
I was pretty good at checking belts on my 252, but they rarely needed tightening. 
Ok: I'm done talking trash about _________. That's just my experience.


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## Coen (Mar 25, 2015)

Three times I was sent the wrong teeth. Why the hell should I have been responsible for shipping costs to send them back??!! If Carlton wanted to rotate the teeth 45 degrees, why didn't the people they had me dealing with in Detroit and Chicago know this? They knew I was mad, and I never got one apology or nothing.


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## Mowingman (Mar 25, 2015)

I have purchased two, brand new Carlton stump grinders over the years. I am located about 1000 miles from the factory, which is my only source of parts and warranty assistance. This has never bothered me at all. Never had any trouble with either machine, other than a couple of very small issues. The factory folks helped me with all the info I needed, to correct those issues myself. Factory support from Carlton is second to none.
Jeff


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## Coen (Mar 25, 2015)

I'm happy to hear you feel this way, but I've been disgusted thus far. Thank god I haven't had anything major. 
To me when I order teeth with parts numbers 0450131 and 0450130 told to me right from the factory, and two different dealers send me teeth that are 45 degrees out, I think the factory is responsible for my frustration. When I get a machine that I need right now and I get the wrong operations manual???? When someone is supposed to show up at my house and go over the machine with me and doesn't? To me that factory/dealer support is BS. 
I know these things I've mentioned seem small, but I'm too busy during tree season to deal with crap like that. 
The last chipper I bought from Bandit; I can't tell you all the trouble the rep went through to make sure I understood the machine, and was satisfied after the sale.


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## Mtrstump (Mar 25, 2015)

Coen, I think you owe it to yourself to investigate some other grinder. Just call Vermeer and ask for a demo, tell them your situation. Maybe not right now, but later they may run up on a demo machine or a low hour trade in and they will think about you. If you don't open the door no one will ever come in. Just put some feelers out there. 
Good luck.


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## Stump Grinder52 (Mar 25, 2015)

Coen,That is so unexceptable the dealer should lose his franchise,bad enough give you no manuel,but give you one for a tow behind.You must be a mild mannered person,if it was me i would casually asked the [scumbag] i mean salesman where he was staying on vacation,then every time i had a question or problem i would pay him a visit early in the morning,make sure he was having as much fun as i was,it would be the last time he'd ever pull a stunt like dropping off a piece of equipment on his way on vacation.That is such a different animal than a 252,you had remote control ,adjustments to your ground speed and cutter head so you don't charge into a stump and bog it down if you swing to fast.When i bought my used machine the guy was nice enough to let me grind two stumps just to get the feel of it.One final note you should ,you should let everybody who the dealer is so nobody else makes that that mistake


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## Coen (Mar 25, 2015)

Stump Grinder52 said:


> Coen,That is so unexceptable the dealer should lose his franchise,bad enough give you no manuel,but give you one for a tow behind.You must be a mild mannered person,if it was me i would casually asked the [scumbag] i mean salesman where he was staying on vacation,then every time i had a question or problem i would pay him a visit early in the morning,make sure he was having as much fun as i was,it would be the last time he'd ever pull a stunt like dropping off a piece of equipment on his way on vacation.That is such a different animal than a 252,you had remote control ,adjustments to your ground speed and cutter head so you don't charge into a stump and bog it down if you swing to fast.When i bought my used machine the guy was nice enough to let me grind two stumps just to get the feel of it.One final note you should ,you should let everybody who the dealer is so nobody else makes that that mistake


The wrong manual was shipped right from the factory with the machine. It is southeastern equipment out of detroit. I found out that selling carlton grinders is just a small part of their operations so I think the sale meant little to them. And I am way north of them. Not far from Sault St. Marie, Canada. Too far for them to be concerned about. I went with them because they are the closest dealer.


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## Mtrstump (Mar 27, 2015)

Hey coen, I thought Vermeer was phasing out the sc1152, but I just found out today that the 652,852 and 1152 are no more because of the tier 4 engine requirement. Might be a good time to get a deal on close-out. Just a thought


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## Coen (Mar 27, 2015)

Probably good advice, but I think I'll just keep my fingers crossed for now and hope for the best. My mind is too occupied with grapple trucks. I have to figure out how to get one without getting burned. I dont trust anyone anymore. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Mowingman (Mar 27, 2015)

In the future, forget about that dealer. Just call Carlton direct, give them your machine S/N, and order the parts you need. Same for any questions you have, or problems that come up. Call the factory and ask to talk to Huey. He, or one of the other parts/service guys will fix you up with exactly the parts or info you need.
They ship fast, and you can also request next day, for a little extra cost.
Jeff


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## Coen (Mar 27, 2015)

Thanks


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## Coen (Mar 27, 2015)

These are the teeth they kept sending me compared to what I needed. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Mowingman (Mar 27, 2015)

Yes, you need the 45 degree, angled shank, as I call it. Carlton factory folks will ask for your machine's serial number when you order teeth. They can tell from that, which style teeth you need. The "squared" shank, fits older Carlton machines. This type is the standard tooth you can get from any Sandvic dealer. The 45 degree shank is only available from Carlton. It is their own design modification to the Sandvic tooth. I am not sure exactly whay year the change was made. However, older Carlton machines use the squared shank, while newer models use the angled shank. Again, the factory could have told the dealer exactly what tooth you need to save you a lot of trouble. I think you have a dealer problem for sure.
Jeff


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## Stump Grinder52 (Mar 28, 2015)

I have a 2008 and has the 45 degree angle shank,like Mowingman said call the factory direct


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## craneguy1 (Mar 28, 2015)

Mtrstump said:


> Hey coen, I thought Vermeer was phasing out the sc1152, but I just found out today that the 652,852 and 1152 are no more because of the tier 4 engine requirement. Might be a good time to get a deal on close-out. Just a thought


Lol...no deals to be had! Just gave back the last 852 my area will ever see! It cut well but nothing like an 1102 which is our main machine...and $64000 for a stump grinder that is twice as slow is a hard pill to swallow!


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## Mtrstump (Mar 29, 2015)

craneguy1 said:


> Lol...no deals to be had! Just gave back the last 852 my area will ever see! It cut well but nothing like an 1102 which is our main machine...and $64000 for a stump grinder that is twice as slow is a hard pill to swallow!


Your right, that is no deal. Trust me when I tell you much better deals than that are available. And how do you get that 1102 through a gate


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## craneguy1 (Mar 29, 2015)

Lol...crane it over like the tree came out! All kidding aside, going through a gate is not a deal breaker for us. We also have a 206, 630b,and a 502. And a friend that spezializes in stump jobs like that with a modded rayco 1625. For a lot of our jobs a fence is dropped to get the big equipment in anyway, and the money isn't in grinding stumps.


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## Mtrstump (Mar 29, 2015)

craneguy1 said:


> Lol...crane it over like the tree came out! All kidding aside, going through a gate is not a deal breaker for us. We also have a 206, 630b,and a 502. And a friend that spezializes in stump jobs like that with a modded rayco 1625. For a lot of our jobs a fence is dropped to get the big equipment in anyway, and the money isn't in grinding stumps.


Don't get me wrong, 1102 is a great machine. I started with a 502. Just missed out on too many jobs when the tornados hit alabama. Went to a 60tx and now a 852. Sounds like your a Vermeer man anyway


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## craneguy1 (Mar 29, 2015)

Vermeer is the only company that seems to understand that chip containment is important...however; that being said why develope a self propelled stumper grinder line that involves the 2 most expensive ways of transmitting power to the working end? Follow that up with "oopsey! Out of motors and no new designs ready!" Good work from the original stump cutter maker. Too many irons in the fire if you ask me.


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## Mtrstump (Mar 29, 2015)

craneguy1 said:


> Vermeer is the only company that seems to understand that chip containment is important...however; that being said why develope a self propelled stumper grinder line that involves the 2 most expensive ways of transmitting power to the working end? Follow that up with "oopsey! Out of motors and no new designs ready!" Good work from the original stump cutter maker. Too many irons in the fire if you ask me.


That's the best thing that can be said for a pull behind. Very little down time. Almost nothing to break. I never did anything to my 502 but a clutch and a fuel pump. Hydraulic drive brings a whole world of new problems. But I don't think I could ever leave to versatility and go back to a pull behind.


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## craneguy1 (May 16, 2015)

Ended up buying the 852...


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## Mtrstump (May 17, 2015)

craneguy1 said:


> Ended up buying the 852...


Good for you. That's what I have. How do you like it so far?


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## craneguy1 (May 18, 2015)

I like it quite a bit...in terms of overall productivity on jobs where the stumps aren't 5 or 6 feet in diameter i thinks its just as fast as the 1102...once you add up the quicker cleanup, the fact that you can snake it in anywhere, can grind while the tractor is busy moving wood, ect. There are 4 things i think could be better, but overall i'm happy.


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## Mtrstump (May 18, 2015)

craneguy1 said:


> I like it quite a bit...in terms of overall productivity on jobs where the stumps aren't 5 or 6 feet in diameter i thinks its just as fast as the 1102...once you add up the quicker cleanup, the fact that you can snake it in anywhere, can grind while the tractor is busy moving wood, ect. There are 4 things i think could be better, but overall i'm happy.


Did you get remote with it?


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## craneguy1 (May 21, 2015)

Not yet...if i was the primary operator i would have...still might down the road.


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## Mtrstump (May 21, 2015)

craneguy1 said:


> Not yet...if i was the primary operator i would have...still might down the road.


I would recommend you add it. Trust me the speed and versatility is awsome. It's a whole new machine. And your employees will be greatful


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## craneguy1 (May 22, 2015)

Might be too many buttons for a couple of them!


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