# Harbor Freight bandsaw mill



## chuckwood

I just noticed this on their website. 7 hp motor, max cutting width 20". All for the low price of $1900.00. 
This one is labeled their house brand, Central Machinery. As always, if you buy one, you'd better have a good shop available to modify and beef up the machine to make it reliable. However, I must admit, I'm a Harbor Freight fan and shopper. I have some of their machines that have worked very well for me. 

http://www.harborfreight.com/lawn-garden/power-tools/saw-mill-with-280cc-gas-engine-61712.html


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## hamish

There are many people out there that have bought them and there are some good review of them here and on the Forestry Forum, even some of the modifications made to them. Add on a coupon code and I read somebody got one delivered for about $1300!

The biggest complaint I have read is the delay in having the product ship.


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## mesupra

Mine will be in on Tuesday, I expect to make some modifications but when you have a little shop what doesn't get modified, I'm not looking for high productions but rather to make better use of some of the wood I have. We have recently taken down 13 large pines, getting 2-3 ice 8' logs per tree, I figure sawing out those alone will pay for my half of the mill, the coupons work as well, we applied a 25% off New Year's Day and it worked. I'll try to get some pics next week.


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## hamish

I look


mesupra said:


> Mine will be in on Tuesday, I expect to make some modifications but when you have a little shop what doesn't get modified, I'm not looking for high productions but rather to make better use of some of the wood I have. We have recently taken down 13 large pines, getting 2-3 ice 8' logs per tree, I figure sawing out those alone will pay for my half of the mill, the coupons work as well, we applied a 25% off New Year's Day and it worked. I'll try to get some pics next week.


I look forward to seeing some pictures and an unbiased review. From what I have read thus far those that had a problem it was with the up and down mechanism, basically the block that the acme rod travels in.


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## mesupra

I have also read about the brass nut stripping out in the up down mechanism, I also came across another thread saying that the newer models are redesigned, but should still be disassembled and lubed with a good quality grease. I am looking forward to playing around with it, not sure exactly what I want to do for a base yet, any ideas?


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## hamish

Get it off the ground, to a height for the logs you may be milling, so that you are not constantly bending over! Mill your own base, then figure out what works for you and your style of milling. You will find a lot of it becomes personal preference. I am 6'1" my uncle/milling buddy is 5'4" what works for me doesn't work for him and vice versa. You will realize that its the non cutting operations that will be the hardest.


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## chuckwood

hamish said:


> Get it off the ground, to a height for the logs you may be milling, so that you are not constantly bending over! Mill your own base, then figure out what works for you and your style of milling. You will find a lot of it becomes personal preference. I am 6'1" my uncle/milling buddy is 5'4" what works for me doesn't work for him and vice versa. You will realize that its the non cutting operations that will be the hardest.



I don't know much about bandsaw mills, but it seems to me that this machine will have to sit on a near perfectly level platform in order to work right. If the frame/tracks are not level all the way around, then the mill can't cut true, am I correct? If I ever get one of these, I'll build a platform using a laser level on a tripod to make sure everything is true. For cutting longer boards, I suppose you can purchase or fabricate as much track as you need?


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## mesupra

You are correct, level is key, keeping it level is another thing from what I have heard from friends who has a mill. I really like the idea of mounting it to a trailer for mobility as I only have one tractor to load and unload loads and think it would be easier to move the mill vs moving the logs. Woodland mills website has a great set of trailer plans, I am pretty sure I can build this thing but not sure if it would be more cost effective to buy a old camper frame and do some modification. I've seen frames for as little as $200 with a decent axel or sometimes two.


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## hunterbuild

I'm still happy with my HF mill. I have cut a lot of logs, mostly pine, but have cut a 20" oak. I made 20' track for it. I'm still on the ground, but will put on pilings the summer.


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## hunterbuild

I did have the problem with the height adjustment, but after I fixed that clear running.


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## mesupra

Hunter build,

Anything I should keep in mind as a first time user, esp. Anything in regards to assembly? 

What are you using for blades?


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## hunterbuild

Set up is very easy, maybe 1 hr. The blade it comes with is not the best, but good to learn with. I got blades from Cooks. They have a good re-sharp program. Take time and play with the guides, I didn't at first, but they are critical to cutting true. If the height adjustment has any hard to turn spots in it you may have trouble down the road, so address that right away. Getting parts seems to be a problem, so I ordered one each of most of the moving parts. I'm on my second year and several thousand board ft and haven't needed them yet. It's a little under powered so don't push it to hard. I bought a 13hp electric start from HF I my put on when I get it to it's permanent spot. If I was cutting a lot of hard wood I think I would look at different blade angle, although I have cut some hard oak with it. I did luck out on some 20+ ft of 3" angle iron and made 20' track so I can cut just under 18'. Also I'm going to make some more log dogs for it.


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## mesupra

Does it come with 3" angle iron for tracks, I couldn't seem to find any dimensions in reference to the angle iron sizing. I have a 13hp hf engine on my centrifugal splitter, which really only needs about 3hp, a swap might be in order, do you happen to know if the 280cc shaft is 3/4 or 1"? Might need to get another clutch.


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## hunterbuild

mesupra said:


> Does it come with 3" angle iron for tracks, I couldn't seem to find any dimensions in reference to the angle iron sizing. I have a 13hp hf engine on my centrifugal splitter, which really only needs about 3hp, a swap might be in order, do you happen to know if the 280cc shaft is 3/4 or 1"? Might need to get another clutch.


It comes with 3X2 something angle. Not off the rack stuff that I could find, so I went with the 3" I found for sale in the paper. I haven't had time to really check out the swap yet. I would try the motor on it for awhile. I did find the shaft size and bolt lay out on their motor site. As I recall it should have the same shaft size.


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## rwthom279

The engine is actually in the 9hp range and is near identical to the 9.5hp Kohler with the difference being in the air filter (Kohler engine is now a CHonda). Engine has a 1" shaft. FLUSH THE ENGINE several times before use!! Keep an eye on your air filter as well. As hunterbuild mentioned, lower hook angle is VERY important. It even helps in softwood because of the density changes when encountering knots or adverse grain patterns. To aggressive of a hook angle and/or blade profile puts a lot of load on the blade and the mill both.

A good source for blades is: http://www.kascosharptech.com/sawmill-blades.html No one can beat their prices, and they are darn good blades. Blades SHIPPED to your door are less than blades alone from anywhere else I've found. I personally would recommend their 4 deg. blade in an 0.045 thickness. They don't list it on their website, but call and ask for Derek Davenport and he'll take care of you. A 4 deg. blade will cut pretty much everything you can put on the little mill ( or any lower hp band mill for that matter ) with excellent results and productivity. Since the HF mill doesn't have roller guides, the 0.045" thickness GREATLY improves the cut quality and surface finish of the lumber.

As for re-sharpening, I've got that covered. Several sawyers ship blades here for service and all the ones who have tried the Kasco blades have now converted 100%. Quality is comparable to a WM double hard w/ longer blade life. As one fella said, "For the price, I get my first re-sharpening free including shipping, round trip !!", due to the initial lower cost. Word of caution, just because a place has a sharpener and setter, doesn't mean they KNOW what they're doing Ex: Do they *operate* a sawmill?? ... I've had to fix/re-condition SO MANY blades that were done elsewhere 'cause they wouldn't cut properly. But to do good blade maintenance, a sharpening service MUST have the proper tooling and experience. I can only imagine their frustration trying to produce good lumber with blades in such poor condition. Its happens more times than we know...even from "factory re-sharp" services.

Hope this helps. Best of luck!!


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## mesupra

Great information, I figured the shaft size would be 1 inch but I know the 212cc predator is 3/4. I agree with the engine flush, I've had 4 predator greyhound engine and I've flushed each one after about 10-15 run time to find the first oil to have a nice golden hue. Thanks for the blade link And the hook angle recommendation. This site has proved very helpful.


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## Jim Timber

hunterbuild said:


> It comes with 3X2 something angle. Not off the rack stuff that I could find, so I went with the 3" I found for sale in the paper. I haven't had time to really check out the swap yet. I would try the motor on it for awhile. I did find the shaft size and bolt lay out on their motor site. As I recall it should have the same shaft size.



Uneven length leg angle is pretty common, but I could see why some yards wouldn't stock it.

Could you post up how the log is dogged on the bed?


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## Pfin

I've been very tempted to pull the trigger on one of these as well. With a coupon it looks like a very good buy. Keep us posted on how things turn out!


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## mesupra

It should be in on Tuesday not sure if I will get it together during the week or wait to the weekend.


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## hamish

mesupra said:


> It should be in on Tuesday not sure if I will get it together during the week or wait to the weekend.


Something tells me you will have it together Tuesday evening! As mentioned previously, Kasco Woodmaxx bands are an amazing deal, and perform very well also. Delivered I pay less than half the price of any band out there, I pay $15.52 per band delivered, taxes in to my door. The nearest competitor is $26.22 delivered to my door, taxes in. I live in Canada so adjust your pricing accordingly, however the US price and CDN price of the Woodmaxx bands are the same. Usually on a box of 10 bands here in Canada I pay an additional $20-$40 in shipping costs.


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## mesupra

Yea there's a good chance I skip out early Tuesday or Wednesday and get it together, hopefully be testing it out next weekend.


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## mesupra

Well the mill is together and we were able to make a couple text cuts in some spruce, some minor adjustments and we were able to everything squared up. Overall not a bad rig, the head move around a little more than I would like but for the price I don't mind making a few modifications, I don't think I could have bought the materials and hardware to build this thing for what we have into it, never mind the time.


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## hamish

Spruce, get the knottiest one you can find best log to learn how to mill on!
The head moves around a lot on all of them. A lil head shake is ok.

Thanks for the pictures, I look forward to following your adventure.


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## Jim Timber

How are the blade guides on those mills?


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## mesupra

Everything on the mill seems to be of pretty good quality, my only complaints so far would be the lube system, the shut off valve leaked immediately, I think a little Teflon tape will cure that and the blade guard doors rattle, which I think some weather stripping will fix. The steel is plenty heavy enough, the welds looked good, the fastners were good quality, the motor is as good as any small engine out there, the clutch is pretty robust, came wih a Lenox blade.


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## hunterbuild

How long did it take to get it together? Did you have to adjust the guides? Mine were cutting good I thought, but after adjusting them it cut better.


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## mesupra

It took about 2hrs give or take. We have not yet played with the guides yet, really didn't have much chance to play with it.


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## rwthom279

mesupra said:


> Everything on the mill seems to be of pretty good quality, ......... came with a Lenox blade.



Don't expect much from the Lenox blade. There was a lot of hype and BS from Lenox when they introduced their new C-Sharp profile. Some people liked it, most of us who saw above the hobby level absolutely despise them. They dull very quickly, even in soft wood like Poplar. Forget about getting any kind of sharpness life in harder woods like Locust and White Oak. Best I could get was 150-200 bd.ft. sawing de-barked GREEN White oak and 300-400 bd.ft. in debarked green Poplar.

Don't be surprised if you get wavy cuts as well. Blade body is only .042 thick and for some reason the blades will consistently dodge EVERY knot and adverse grain changes. I ran the tension up to 26,000 lbs. + of strain (measured at/on the blade itself) with no improvement in cut quality (3/16" of down pressure). They cut even worse with the lack of a roller guide system to apply down pressure.... yes, I tried for experimental purposes to help others. The only blade that I found cuts worse than the C-Sharp is the TimberWolf blade, from Suffolk Machinery (I'll leave it at that  ). It all depends on your expectations of the product quality you expect to produce.

IMHO, not worth the money to even re-sharpen and have told customers as much... and those C-Sharp blades aren't cheap to buy. Most have switched, but a couple guys still run them. I had (2) break after the 1st re-sharpening (not at the weld) others have reported this as well. Not trying to pith anyone off, just sharing experience and feedback of myself and others who have attempted to saw productively with them.

Glad you've got the mill up and running!! Nice shop BTW


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## mesupra

Which blade would you recommend?


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## rwthom279

These are from earlier in this thread: 



rwthom279 said:


> A good source for blades is: http://www.kascosharptech.com/sawmill-blades.html No one can beat their prices, and they are darn good blades. Blades SHIPPED to your door are less than blades alone from anywhere else I've found. I personally would recommend their 4 deg. blade in an 0.045 thickness. They don't list it on their website, but call and ask for Derek Davenport and he'll take care of you. A 4 deg. blade will cut pretty much everything you can put on the little mill ( or any lower hp band mill for that matter ) with excellent results and productivity. Since the HF mill doesn't have roller guides, the 0.045" thickness GREATLY improves the cut quality and surface finish of the lumber.





hamish said:


> As mentioned previously, Kasco Woodmaxx bands are an amazing deal, and perform very well also.



KASCO WoodMaxx Blades - again, ask for Derek Davenport. He'll get you taken care of.
Phone: 314-771-1550 | Toll Free USA: 1-800-325-3251 | Toll Free Canada: 1-800-361-3329


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## mesupra

Thanks for the contact information, what are we talking for "cheap" I've heard great things about cooks too, looks like there around $155 for 10 blades.


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## rwthom279

Looks like a 144" .042" thick blade form Kasco is $13.50, so the .045 thick blade is just a little bit more. With shipping you'll probably come in less than Cooks before shipping. If you read the above, another member posted what he paid delivered to his door.

You'll just have to call. I'm not a salesman for them.

In regards to Cooks blades...IMO, they are 3rd from the bottom in regards to quality. Even if the quality was greatly improved, the blade profile/hook angle is FAR to aggressive for a low HP mill (under 25hp). The Cooks SuperSharp blade *needs significant HP and torque* to pull it through the cut... these little mills do not have the sand in their britches to saw efficiently with an aggressive blade. I've run them and they are an extremely power hungry blade. I just shipped out a box of Cooks SS blades that just had their 1st re-sharpening. Those blades were by far the WORST new blades I had ever re-sharpened. After the first re-sharp, they cut MUCH better, but it takes time and attention to detail to "re-condition" them. If I typed the details out, we'd have a short novel... and the devil is in the details.

Again, not trying to ruffle any feathers. Just sharing what I and other sawyers have experienced.


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## mesupra

I greatly appreciate the information. I read the reviews on pretty much any product now before purchasing. Given all the information out there one can save a great deal of money, time and frustration. If I had not been able to read reviews on the HF mill I would not have been the one to take a chance and therefore would not own a mill. Seems like with every China purchase the quality gets better and better.


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## rwthom279

Glad the information is helpful. That was one reason I made a point of running almost every blade available (with the exception of a couple) so I could offer re-sharp customers advice. There seems to be a lot of mis-information put out by some manufactures with the intent of making a sale... and nothing more. The end consumer ends up paying the price both for initial quality and the blade maintenance. Its better to buy quality to begin with and avoid the extra costs when getting them re-sharpened.... if the place providing you service actually pays attention and does the job right (many don't).

Just remember, the blade is the MOST IMPORTANT part of your mill. Everything else is there to power, support and guide the blade. If your blade has issues, your lumber quality, production, and patience will suffer immensely.  That just takes the fun out of the whole experience. 

We all do this because we enjoy it and hopefully make/save a little money along the way.


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## millbilly

opcorn:opcorn:


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## lps8

I have a mill based loosely on Gene's mill drawing. I ordered bladed from a place in my state that is supposed to have a good blade. When I first got it going, I was having trouble getting it to cut straight. I tried different blades and adjusted on everything trying to get them to cut straight. I dulled some and took some off thinking I was doing something wrong. I made some upgrades to my mill (log leveler, log turner, log clamp, and backstop, all remotely operated) and started cutting again. I had a blade on that I had been using and cut up several logs. It was cutting pretty good, but I wanted to try a new blade to see if it was faster. 

Put the new blade on and did not make one cut. Get about 2 feet and it had dipped about 1/2". Was not cutting as well as well as the well used blade. Put the old blade back on and it cut ok.

I have several more new blades from the same co and when the snow leaves, I am going to try them all to see how they work. Then I will post a report. If they all cut like the new one I just took off, I will be sending them back. What I'm thinking, for the time a resharpener has to spend getting them right, I could buy new blades. 

I have resharpened blades coming from one of the members here. I told him how I had a hard time getting the saw adjusted and he said he did not see how I could have gotten them to cut. We will see when I get to do a comparison. I know my resharpen will be better, but I don't know about the rest of the new ones yet. Thanks RW

Larry


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## Mrpacman

hunterbuild said:


> I did have the problem with the height adjustment, but after I fixed that clear running.


Dear son just what did you do to fix he heigght adjustment problem?


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## Mrpacman

mesupra said:


> Great information, I figured the shaft size would be 1 inch but I know the 212cc predator is 3/4. I agree with the engine flush, I've had 4 predator greyhound engine and I've flushed each one after about 10-15 run time to find the first oil to have a nice golden hue. Thanks for the blade link And the hook angle recommendation. This site has proved very helpful.


Dear sir please explain in more detail about the the flush and run procedure first i've heard of this technique Thank you


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## mesupra

Dear,

I typically start with a nice thick (30 wt) Dino non synthetic oil to complete the break in / flush with. I fill to the desired level start engine let idle for a second or two till it runs with the choke off then vary the throttle from low to medium for around 3 min. I then shut the engine off and drain the oil quickly, next I will run it for a couple hours and drain again, after that every 20-30hrs. I also use rotella t6 full synthetic after the first break in / flush


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