# need slme spur climbing tips



## dwerden (Jul 17, 2013)

Recently got buckingham spurs with t pads, im practicing on a few poplar trees that need to come down, they areare about 10" diameter. 

The problem I'm having is they all have a slight lean to them away from a cedar hedge, I realize you are supposed to climb the top side of the tree but I would literally have to be inside a hedge to do so. Climbing the sides of the trees, it wants to force me on the bottom side of the tree and I can't seem to stay straight onto the tree. The only thing that seems to help is having my flipline up as high as possible . I see people say to doi le wrap it but I'm thinking that's only for when your stationary doing a cut as I can't see how you would actually climb like that .

Also, like I said the trees are about 10" diameter, my spurs are maybe 2-3 inches apart from the center of the tree. Does this sound right ? I've got my toes touching the outside of the tree and my feet are about 45 degrees from eachother. 

Do you actually kick in the spurs or just set them where you want and apply weight on them to get them in the tree, I am climbing a soft (i think poplar) so they are going in probably 5/8s of an inch. Everything sound about right?


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## isaaccarlson (Jul 17, 2013)

The smaller stuff can be a little tricky just because you can't get your foot out to the side and get leverage to push yourself around the tree. Get your feet spread out some and you will have more control. Put about 1/4-1/3 of the tree circumference between your spurs on that small stuff. It can be hard to get from the bottom to the top on a heavy leaner. Letting out some lanyard will let you lean around the tree and shift your balance.

Sometimes I use a ladder go get above an object or a part of the tree that I want to preserve and start climbing from there. I make bows, so sometimes the bottom 10 feet of a tree is worth a lot to me. The spurs would poke in and damage the first few rings so I just use a ladder. People give me funny looks because I have all my gear on and I'm wearing spurs, but I'm using a ladder to get started.:msp_biggrin:


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## stltreedr (Jul 17, 2013)

agree with above, smaller trees can be a bit tricky. Let me proceed by saying first that if you don't know how to climb without spikes, you shouldn't try to climb with them. If possible, I try to tie a rope in up high even if I'm climbing with spikes. It gives me some security and you can lean on your rope. If not, you are just going to practice and learn to balance, low and slow.


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## dwerden (Jul 17, 2013)

Yes I have a drt setup aswell I was just trying to get the hang of it. Ive honestly probably gone 8 feet. 

I will try and set a rope


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## CanopyGorilla (Jul 17, 2013)

You can climb the underside to get past the hedge, but reversing to the top side can be a bit tricky without some practice. If it is still confusing you though, I would avoid getting that high and trying something new. When I make cuts on the small stuff I will sometimes clove hitch the wood in front of me with my life line, then tie some half hitches as a back up, then put my VT with pulley right below that so I can lower off SRT style if the #### hits the fan for any reason. Also if I loose my balance on a leaner I just slide to the underside rather than do loops 20 feet down the thing.


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## dwerden (Jul 18, 2013)

CanopyGorilla said:


> You can climb the underside to get past the hedge, but reversing to the top side can be a bit tricky without some practice. If it is still confusing you though, I would avoid getting that high and trying something new. When I make cuts on the small stuff I will sometimes clove hitch the wood in front of me with my life line, then tie some half hitches as a back up, then put my VT with pulley right below that so I can lower off SRT style if the #### hits the fan for any reason. Also if I loose my balance on a leaner I just slide to the underside rather than do loops 20 feet down the thing.



Not a bad idea, a blakes would also suffice?


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## miko0618 (Jul 18, 2013)

It just takes time to devlope. Its unique muscles involved. Some trees you can just walk on the spikes, some you have to stomp them in. Your spikes are designed so that the more pressure you put on them, the more they bite. So as long as you use good form, you will not slip. Its usually bent knees that cause slips because it puts your spikes at too vertical of an angle. Keep your legs and back straight and pivot like a hinge on the spikes. Use the lanyard to set your position. Medium sized trunks are the easiest to climb. As far as falling towards the low side, thats just how it is


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## tramp bushler (Jul 21, 2013)

stltreedr said:


> agree with above, smaller trees can be a bit tricky. Let me proceed by saying first that if you don't know how to climb without spikes, you shouldn't try to climb with them. If possible, I try to tie a rope in up high even if I'm climbing with spikes. It gives me some security and you can lean on your rope. If not, you are just going to practice and learn to balance, low and slow.


 I couldn't disagree more . I've been climbing since 1983 with spurs and fliplines. Only just started using a climbing rope. There is no reason to have a top line in a straight single stem tree if the tree is scheduled for death. 
You either trust your flipline or you don't. Climbing a leaner is a pia but on small ones the easiest way if you can't get on the high side is to be fully on the underside. . On small trees I keep my flipline fairly short and do more of a lineman's climb where I reach around the tree with my hands for support and balance. . Then reach down and lift the flipline up as I progress. Rotating around the tree, you flip it up armpit high and use your hands and spurs to rotate your position. I find that rotating to the low side I step down and rotating to the high side I step up.


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## tramp bushler (Jul 21, 2013)

You need to climb a thousand feet or more to begin to get good and comfortable in the spurs. And even then you have miles verticle to go to really be a professional. Find some nice straight trees that are around 2' diameter on the stump and wear them out going up and down. 
Spur climbing is so much more efficient than rope climbing as to not even be in the same league.

And watch some timber sport speed climbing vids and old time PNW + BC loggin vids. They most always show the climber doing his thing.


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## sgreanbeans (Jul 22, 2013)

If your climbing, ya need a life line tied in, no matter what. I know that a lanyard will do the job on many things, but one mistake and u cut your lanyard, you have nothing else to fall back on. Learn to climb with out the spikes. Only use them when ya have too. Even on removals, if I use them to get into the tree, they come off until I get to the trunk.


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## TheJollyLogger (Jul 22, 2013)

tramp bushler said:


> I couldn't disagree more . I've been climbing since 1983 with spurs and fliplines. Only just started using a climbing rope. There is no reason to have a top line in a straight single stem tree if the tree is scheduled for death.
> You either trust your flipline or you don't. Climbing a leaner is a pia but on small ones the easiest way if you can't get on the high side is to be fully on the underside. . On small trees I keep my flipline fairly short and do more of a lineman's climb where I reach around the tree with my hands for support and balance. . Then reach down and lift the flipline up as I progress. Rotating around the tree, you flip it up armpit high and use your hands and spurs to rotate your position. I find that rotating to the low side I step down and rotating to the high side I step up.



Tramp, you're not loggin anymore, you're an arborist now, and a good arborist always has a line in the tree. This is arborist 101, not the logging forum. Not to mention ansi standards require it. Dwerden, post some pics of the trees and we can give you better advice. Jeff


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## dwerden (Jul 22, 2013)

Thanks to everyone who has responded, lots of good tips in here, I went up today practiced going over a couple limbs with 2 lanyards, choked a line with a bowline and hung off that for a while at the top of the tree to give my feet a rest. I'm getting more confortable in myself and the equipment. I got an old 019 off eBay that's supposed to be in this week, once I can get it running these trees are gonna be on the ground.

There is 3 trees, theyre hard to get good pictures, the angle is maybe 10 degrees, I climbed the bottom side today and it worked good. one picture loaded all see if I can get the other 2 up. they are the small trees right beside the garage


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## tramp bushler (Jul 22, 2013)

So let me see if I got this. 
When you guys are climbing, srt or drt you use 2 different lifelines. At the same time. All the time. ?????? 

I've watched a bunch of yt vids and haven't seen that yet.


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## TheJollyLogger (Jul 22, 2013)

No, but a lanyard is not considered a primary tie in. I can't find my ansi book, but they require a secure way out of the tree at all times. Maybe somebody can post the exact language. And I don't recommend learning to climb by watching youtube vids, or off this forum for that matter. Find a good mentor who can teach you in person.


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## tramp bushler (Jul 22, 2013)

:msp_wink:

I better quit bugging you guys. . 
I think I need to change my user name to Tree Killer. Or something. Similar. 

I mean, a tree is a tree
no doubt there are times a guy needs a top rope. But I've never needed a top rope in a conifer yet. But, that's OK. Y'all do it your way and I'll just keep trusting a wire core flip line. I fail to see how a fiber rope that is draped over a limb in the top of a tree is as safe. 
I'll shut up now.


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## bootboy (Jul 22, 2013)

Yeah, the skinny stuff can be tough because all of your contact points are so close. Obviously the wider stuff is easy to a point. On the skinny stuff, don't be afraid to get your spurs around the sides of the tree a little and let out a little flip line so you can get a good lean away from it. It feels really awkward at first and may require a little knee bending but you'll learn to trust your balance after a while. Just play around with positioning while backed up with a climbing line. Just get a feel for what positions are inherently stable, regardless of how awkward and unnatural it feels.


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## dwerden (Jul 22, 2013)

The whole thing feels unnatural and awkward Haha getting better


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## joezilla11 (Jul 22, 2013)

Not sure if this helps but I found the less I think about it the better I do, just keep the flow going. Stopping and over thinking each step really screws me up and slows me down and it'll make you start second guessing yourself. Spur climbing is not my strong point but I'm getting there and i do it so I like posts like this. Seems like the better I get the trees keep getting bigger so its a constant effort to keep my progress going!


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## tramp bushler (Jul 23, 2013)




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## bootboy (Jul 23, 2013)

tramp bushler said:


>



I see your skinny alder, and raise you a skinny-ER poplar...


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## tramp bushler (Jul 23, 2013)




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## tramp bushler (Jul 23, 2013)

bootboy said:


> I see your skinny alder, and raise you a skinny-ER poplar...



What's an ER? 
In the 1 st pic. I klum and Limbed the hangin tree then put my life line in it. Went down a ways and swung over into the littler one. Went up it and topped it then over to the 3 rd one and topped it. Blocked them down then swung back to the hangin tree and went back up it and topped it and blocked it down. All cottonwoods .


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## tramp bushler (Jul 23, 2013)

Gotta try that again


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## tramp bushler (Jul 23, 2013)

Once again I klum the hangin tree and started transferring into other trees to get them topped and blocked down. I really need a grapple so I can transfer faster and easier. Only two hundred and thirty five bucks.


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## bootboy (Jul 23, 2013)

Just giving you a hard time.

-ER was to emphasize the end of "skinnier"


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## tramp bushler (Jul 23, 2013)

I think I'm gonna get a shark hook and try it. It oughta work. Hundred percent fer sure, maybe, perhaps.


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## dwerden (Jul 26, 2013)

Coming along with the climbing, picked up an 019 and went for a climb today and peeled off some branches


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## beastmaster (Jul 27, 2013)

I'm getting a little confused. I always climb on spikes with a monkey line on my belt. But on conifers i limb up the tree working off my lanyard. I learned the 3 point system and a lanyard is good for two points. Now when blocking out a tree I always use a second tie in below my lanyard, started doing that about 10 years ago. I learned early on not to cut across my lanyard and to switch sides behind my back with the saw. I remember they told us there is only one thing you have to remember, don't cut your rope.
On leaners and on skinny trees it helps to keep one foot higher then the other. That'll keep you balanced and stabilized. On bigger trees with a lot of lean you can sometimes throw your climbing line up over a branch on the high side a few feet above your head, and then climb to the low side to work. The climbing line at a right angle will keep you stabilized and make it easier to get back to the high side.
On a skinny tree or a leaner keeping you feet at the same height next to each other will cause you to pivot. By keeping the foot on the low side down more, it'll hold you in place. You'll get a feel for it and know how much to stagger them.


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## dwerden (Aug 4, 2013)

Slowly getting the hang of this, spurred up this 4-5" spar and set my climb line, now I'm just working stuff down. I've got a small rigging pulley on the way I'm gonna use for the other spars and will definatly need it for the other 2 trees behind this one. I've heard of people rigging and using wraps on a trunk of spar to control the decent from the tree top not in the ground. How is that accomplished? Can i just run it through a figure 8 choked to the tree?


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## CanopyGorilla (Aug 4, 2013)

Nice dwerden!!! Looks like a good tree to be learning in. Def not the easiest, nor the hardest. Solid work!


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## TheJollyLogger (Aug 4, 2013)

Lookin good, D. There are several ways to lower from the tree, an eight being one, or a wrap around a stub. These first few, though, you've got enough on your plate. Let someone on the ground handle the load. Jeff


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## BC WetCoast (Aug 5, 2013)

dwerden said:


> Slowly getting the hang of this, spurred up this 4-5" spar and set my climb line, now I'm just working stuff down. I've got a small rigging pulley on the way I'm gonna use for the other spars and will definatly need it for the other 2 trees behind this one. I've heard of people rigging and using wraps on a trunk of spar to control the decent from the tree top not in the ground. How is that accomplished? Can i just run it through a figure 8 choked to the tree?




The company I used to work at was too cheap to buy a porta wrap. The groundies would just take the rope and wrap around another tree enough to give us the required friction. Small piece, it would only go around the tree a quarter turn. Some pieces we would weave among a couple of trees to give sufficient friction but not bind the rope.

Unless you are gong to tie off the rigging line for each cut and let the piece hang, let your groundies control the rope.


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## dwerden (Aug 24, 2013)

Well i finally got my cousin over to play groundie for me, rigged some stuff down with an omni then the rest I snap cut and chucked onto the driveway (gravel)











Here's my 1 ton dump truck and 12" chipper


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