# Bidding Insurance Jobs??



## JTinaTree (Jan 9, 2007)

I am curious when you full timers go to bid on a job and the homeowners insurance is paying (ie.storm damage or what not etc...) Is your bid not so conservative on that job? I guess what I am asking since I have not been a buisness owner long, can you price alot higher when bidding insurance jobs?

Do insurance companies pay what ever for storm damage to homeowners, or do they tell them to get the lowest quote. Ice storm season is coming and I wan't to be prepared and be able to price the jobs accordingly. Any help on this would be greatly appreciated as I value your info greatly.


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## rfwoodvt (Jan 9, 2007)

*Do you mean "can we hose the insurance company?"*

Be fair, be honest and above all be consistent.

Yes, there are certain "secrets" about insurance jobs that can line your pockets but I can tell you for sure that if you abuse them your reputation can suffer.

We have done tons of "insurance" work and have always turned a comfortable profit without taking advantage of the opportunities to "maximize" based on the homeowners insurance. We also regularly get called back and told that the insurance company wanted to confirm that our price was correct because it was so reasonable.

Because we are "reasonable" and not taking them for all we can get, many adjusters are suggesting that thier insured contact us for an estimate in addition to anyone else they are considering. For us it has been the best Word-Of-Mouth advertising.

Lets face it, any time you put the screws to someone, even if it is not your client, your client will begin to wonder whether you are putting the screws to them.

Oh, and one last thought...if you value your business, always bill your customer and clearly state that payment is due regardless of any insurance settlement. From bitter experience we have learned that it is best to have the customer pay you and let them settle with thier insurance carrier. Otherwise it may be months even years before you see payment.


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## alanarbor (Jan 10, 2007)

rfwoodvt said:


> From bitter experience we have learned that it is best to have the customer pay you and let them settle with thier insurance carrier. Otherwise it may be months even years before you see payment.



Quoted for truth.

You are working for the client, not the insurance company. Be sure your terms and conditions are clear up front.


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## stipton (Jan 10, 2007)

As an insurance agent (among other things), the advice given above is correct. Be fair and truthful.

The worst job in the world is an insurance adjuster. These guys and gals have seen it all and have an excellent bs detector. What they look for in a service provider is a fair price, quick and professional service because what it is all about is making the homeowner happy and satisfied. As with everything in business, if you provide a good service, the adjuster will remember you and you could end up with a lot of good jobs. Along with the rants and raves for the insurance company, your name will be in the same sentence.

Plain ol' good business.


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## JTinaTree (Jan 10, 2007)

I must add I am not out to rape customers on jobs. I am keeping my price very conservative right now on bids, so I can build my business. However I would like to increase my prices in the furture. I will keep that in mind about letting the cust know my terms up front payment etc...


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## alanarbor (Jan 10, 2007)

JTinaTree said:


> I must add I am not out to rape customers on jobs. I am keeping my price very conservative right now on bids, so I can build my business. However I would like to increase my prices in the furture. I will keep that in mind about letting the cust know my terms up front payment etc...



Just keep in mind, jobs where insurance companies are involved are likely to be hazardous, technical, and sometimes a book keeping pain in the ass.

Don't sell yourself short, when you are likely to expose yourself to greater risks.


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## toscottm (Jan 11, 2007)

*Insurance Pricing: Lining Pockets*

JTinaTree,

Firstly, I am in the insurance business, however on the broker side, not the insurer side. Anyway, I'm going to try to answer philosophically rather than from the point of view of an 'insurance insider'.

As has been pointed out by others, fair market value is always a good idea. While short-term gains might be had, in the long-term damage to your reputation will result. The insurance world is actually a small place. It is actually a paradox. It is a huge industry and yet, many know each other. Insurance adjusters (the one's who handle homeowner claims) in your area, attend conferences together and other networking functions. The last thing you probably want is to be a topic of discussion over dinner. An adjuster that works for insurer A telling his other adjuster buddies servicing your area (adjusters are usually local) that you pad your bills is going to be bad for your business. It's more likely that you want adjusters telling each other that you do quality work at a fair price. 

A business mentor once told me that providing good value is always the way to ensure that you will eat well and can sleep with yourself at night!

Best Wishes!

Scott


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## Timberhauler (Jan 29, 2007)

I have a formula of bidding jobs that never changes,no matter who the customer is....It has payed well.I actually have several insurance companies that reccomend me,and I didn't even realize until we had a big ice storm here last winter..It got me alot of high end work that I might not have otherwise gotten.


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## rfwoodvt (Jan 30, 2007)

Just curious TH, 

can you share the rudiments of your bidding formula? would be interesting to see how someone else bids...


ThanX!


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## boo (Jan 30, 2007)

it's up to the property owner to hire for services, not the insurance company.
it's not legal for insurance agents to recomend companies for services.
collect from the homeowner, as the insurance company may find any way they can to get out of paying .....oh the horror stories.
not trying to derail the thread but, how many cases have you heard of the insurance company being the "goodguys" vs. being the "organized crime"?


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## treeseer (Jan 30, 2007)

boo said:


> it's not legal for insurance agents to recomend companies for services.



Which law would this be breaking?


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## toscottm (Jan 30, 2007)

*Insurance: Organized Crime*



boo said:


> how many cases have you heard of the insurance company being the "goodguys" vs. being the "organized crime"?



Boo,

In more than 15 years as an insurance agent, I have never witnessed an insurance company behaving in a manner that could be equated to 'organized crime'. Insurance companies are highly regulated (in Canada and presumedly elsewhere). When a claim is presented, insurance adjusters are appointed to review the insurance contract (policy) and settle claims in accordance to the contract and legal mandate imposed (in Canada) by the Insurance Act which requires the principle of 'Utmost Good Faith' be applied.

When disputes between policy holder and insurer do occur, independent adjusters can be hired by either party, they can choose various avenues of arbitration or they can pursue litigation. These civil processes can hardly be compared to 'organized crime'. 

In the minimal number of cases where I have seen disagreement between insurer and insured, it is usually in the determination of values. In remaining circumstances, insureds were disatisfied with the scope of coverage. The reasons for scope of coverage being disappointing have always been one of:

The insured became involved in activities that were not disclosed and thus insurance wasn't arranged on their behalf.

The agent did not understand the nature of the insureds needs and thus did not arrange appropriate insurance coverage. (fault of agent, not insurer)

The insured did not appreciate the reasonable conditions of insurance protection. (i.e. exclusions for normal wear and tear, intentional acts, etc.)

Over the years, I have seen insurers as super-hero's for their handling of situations that could have been financial devastating for insureds. I've had grown men in tears hug me with 'thanks' for saving their business. What I can say is that there is nothing more satisfying than knowing my expertise has played a positive role in wellbeing of others. 

Scott


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## toscottm (Jan 30, 2007)

*Insurance Agents: Adjusting Claims*



treeseer said:


> Which law would this be breaking?



In Canada, an insurance agent (or broker) cannot 'adjust' a claim by appointing or otherwise handling the repair, settlement, etc. An insurance adjuster is legally required. The insurance broker may 'advocate' the claim by sharing knowledge that is genuinely of benefit to both insurer and insured such as information that mitigates and expedites the situation. Similar regulation likely applies in the U.S.

To answer your question, in Canada an insurance agent (or broker) who is appointing, recommending or directing insureds to a source of supply is breaching the Insurance Act mandate that forbids the broker from acting as an insurance adjuster.

Of course, in practice, insurance agents may provide 'ideas and input' on how a matter can be attended to. This must be done very delicately to ensure potential conflicts of interest are avoided. In my work for arborists, it is not uncommon to let both the insured and insurer know of various sources that may be able to assist them in attending to a claim (i.e. equipment dealers that carry a particular brand). The 'line in the sand' that must not be crossed is the point at which this could be interpreted as a recommendation or endorsement of a particular dealer. 

Oddly, if I'm at an ISA conference chatting with someone who mentions an interest in a buying something (i.e. Rayco RG50), I can refer a particular dealer that has one on sale. However 10 minutes later if one of my insurance clients tells me his Rayco RG50 was just stolen and asks if I know where he can get this replaced, I would be walking very close to the 'line in the sand' if I let him know the same information that only minutes ago was given out in a casual conversation. For those insurance bashers out there, this is an example of a situation where indeed insurance regulation can be ridiculous.


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## boo (Jan 31, 2007)

treeseer said:


> Which law would this be breaking?


good call treeseer, my mistake. that info was given to me by a group of insurance guys set up in rv's during Katrina.
I made a call to the commission of insurance, they informed me that it was not LAW, but only common policy.
Thank You treeseer, for making me double check what the insurance guys told me.
I stand corrected.


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## boo (Jan 31, 2007)

toscottm said:


> In Canada, an insurance agent (or broker) cannot 'adjust' a claim by appointing or otherwise handling the repair, settlement, etc. An insurance adjuster is legally required. The insurance broker may 'advocate' the claim by sharing knowledge that is genuinely of benefit to both insurer and insured such as information that mitigates and expedites the situation. Similar regulation likely applies in the U.S.
> 
> To answer your question, in Canada an insurance agent (or broker) who is appointing, recommending or directing insureds to a source of supply is breaching the Insurance Act mandate that forbids the broker from acting as an insurance adjuster.
> 
> ...


try to sell an "insurance good guy" story to the folks of Katrina, or the people at screwedbyinsurance.com.
I noticed the site doesnt have the horror stories posted anymore.
I have never had a claim against me, on the other hand my wife is now disabled because of someone making a u-turn from the right lane of a 4 lane road, I was also banged up in the accident, I was in a Philly Collar on the couch for 9 mos. the guy was clearly at fault, sited, and insured.
guess what happened.
bitter and biased? not really, just the facts and stats.


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## toscottm (Jan 31, 2007)

*Good Guys v. Organized Crime*



boo said:


> try to sell an "insurance good guy" story to the folks of Katrina, or the people at screwedbyinsurance.com.
> I noticed the site doesnt have the horror stories posted anymore.
> I have never had a claim against me, on the other hand my wife is now disabled because of someone making a u-turn from the right lane of a 4 lane road, I was also banged up in the accident, I was in a Philly Collar on the couch for 9 mos. the guy was clearly at fault, sited, and insured.
> guess what happened.
> bitter and biased? not really, just the facts and stats.



Boo,

The question I was responding to was "how many of you guys have seen cases where insurance companies are good guys instead of organized crime". From my perspective, I have answered your question.

As for guessing what happened following your automobile accident above, I sincerely hope that you received the full benefits and compensation that are due to you as per the laws in your state. 

Scott


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## Timberhauler (Feb 1, 2007)

rfwoodvt said:


> Just curious TH,
> 
> can you share the rudiments of your bidding formula? would be interesting to see how someone else bids...
> 
> ...



I used formula because I thought it sounded good,but for what it's worth...I have a $150 minimum which covers up to about an hour of labor.I carefully look at the job,and go over what has to be done to get it done as safely as possible,then I add two hours to the ammount of time that I figure for the job.I then figure my labor/equipment rate at $200 per hour....In the case that a crane has to be used,I pass that cost on to the customer,and don't try to mark it up...So not really a formula,but it works for me


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## ropensaddle (Feb 14, 2007)

*be dern*

man its hard to get one hundred p er hour for bucket , grapple 
labor and all gear here maybe i should move:deadhorse:


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