# Blaze king how does it work



## stihly dan (Jan 14, 2013)

How, or can, the blaze king get a 40 hr burn? efficiently? with usable heat? Not starting trouble, just would like to understand. Drop some knowledge on me.


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## stihly dan (Jan 15, 2013)

Where is excaliber? Doesn't he have one?


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## blacklocst (Jan 15, 2013)

Does anyone own one north of the Mason Dixon line?


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## EXCALIBER (Jan 16, 2013)

Sorry been busy lately haven't had time to get on. The stoves are air tight, they have a bi-metal thermostat that is constantly adjusting the amount of air the stove needs to keep a consistent burn. Basically the thermostat is like going from an older carb vehicle (old stoves with damper), to a new multiport fuel injected vehicle. Obviously the new vehicle gets better mileage. They are very efficient. They do not heat up as fast as the old stoves, but they will keep heating for way longer. Now add in the cat to lower burn temps that you can effectively burn the smoke at which has about 85% of the BTU's you will get from your wood, at a much lower temp then secondary air tubes. Secondary air tubes are designed to have a hot fire burning in order to engage the secondary combustion. Now add in the 4.32 cube firebox to hold lots of big pieces of wood. Actually the manual only recommends me splitting logs that are 10 inches or more in diameter. Now keep in mind the 40 hour burn time is on low, so if its say idk 50ish outside you can run the stove on low getting very long burn time and enough heat to keep the house where you want it. Now if its -50 out of course your burn time is going to be less. Basically the stove gives you the ability to put out very little heat for a long time or more heat with reduced burn times. I did a thread on the burn with pics. You can also find a lot of good info and videos online at the Blaze King web site. 
http://www.arboristsite.com/firewood-heating-wood-burning-equipment/217824.htm
Any other questions that I can answer just ask.


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## cmsmoke (Jan 16, 2013)

So smoke burns at a lower temperature in a cat stove than one with secondary air tubes? Smoke combustion takes place at the same temperature in either stove.


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## cmsmoke (Jan 16, 2013)

I stand corrected to the start of "lite off" temperatures...but, the fact remains that the reaction doesn't take place until around1100 degrees Fahrenheit. It doesn't matter if it is the smoke or the core temp. of the combustor.


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## tbow388 (Jan 16, 2013)

*Okay*



EXCALIBER said:


> Any other questions that I can answer just ask.



Okay, How much is that doggy in the window?


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## stihly dan (Jan 16, 2013)

Such large wood, and a lower cat temp make sense. I did see your vid earlier, good stuff. Just could not wrap my head around 40 hr burn times. I did look at there site, but they don't show much detail.


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## EXCALIBER (Jan 21, 2013)

stihly dan said:


> Such large wood, and a lower cat temp make sense. I did see your vid earlier, good stuff. Just could not wrap my head around 40 hr burn times. I did look at there site, but they don't show much detail.



Their is a video that kind of roughly explains how the stove works, and some features. I really would not blow too much smoke up your tail pipe about them. I put three pieces of wood in mine today, and came home to a warm house with coals left in the firebox. Why only three pieces? Well I have been to lazy to run down to the wood pile and bring up more wood. Of course the burn time is subject to how your house is set up and temp outside. 

There was a guy on here who had a quadra fire insert, and I got him to switch to a Blaze King Princess insert. He said he wished he had switched years ago, and the quadra's are no slouch from what I understand. There was another that put a princess in and has been happy with it so far. I have sold two King freestanding models here locally after I told people at work about my stove and how it works. They have both been very happy. Now even my stove place that I sell wood to, which only had been carrying Lopi brand, has been ordering stoves from Blaze King. He had asked why I didn't support him when I bought a new stove. I said well the Lopi's seem to be nice stoves, but I want a large stove which they don't make. Short wood and small splits. I just don't have time for that. Plus I am gone 12 plus hours everyday. So after he researched it and seen he was losing business, he now carries them. Heck I should call BK and maybe they will give me a free stove for my shop for selling so many stoves for them???
[video=youtube;jBSNWKI-d-A]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jBSNWKI-d-A[/video]


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## mhrischuk (Jan 21, 2013)

Great stoves. I thought about one but didn't like the styling for our room.

Went with a Heartstone Equinox. I get one full overnight burn. 40 hours is insane.


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## stihly dan (Jan 21, 2013)

That is one awesome looking stove set up.


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## mhrischuk (Jan 21, 2013)

Thanks.


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## Iron Head (Jan 21, 2013)

A few years ago I was seriously looking to get a Blaze King.
My local dealer said they don't carry and will never carry Cat Stoves.
They said the Cats are more efficient than after burner tubes but Cats have a life expectancy and will fail.
And the replacement Cats are very expensive.
After burner tubes hardly ever fail but if they do, it's cheap to replace.
I don't know if all this was a sale's pitch but I bought into it and got a Lopi instead.

I'm going to go on a tangent and like to ask if anyone ever thought if an after burner tube could be stacked with a layer of Cats to create a more efficient burner?


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## stihly dan (Jan 21, 2013)

WOODSTOCK stoves do that.


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## mhrischuk (Jan 22, 2013)

Iron Head said:


> A few years ago I was seriously looking to get a Blaze King.
> My local dealer said they don't carry and will never carry Cat Stoves.
> They said the Cats are more efficient than after burner tubes but Cats have a life expectancy and will fail.
> And the replacement Cats are very expensive.
> ...



You dealer is just anti-cat LOL.

The trend is cat stoves. The cats are made much better these days.

I have two....


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## Marc (Jan 22, 2013)

Del_ said:


> I thought it was only one model of Woodstock stove that does that, The Woodstock Progress Hybrid Woodstove.
> 
> I've been reading about it for a couple of months now and it sounds like a real advancement in woodstove technology and I expect to see more woodstoves using both technologies in the near future. I'd love to have a Jotul made Cat added to the top of my Firelight F600CB. My Riteway Model 37 had a Cat in it back in 1980 and still does though it just sits in my shop un used these days. 7.5cu. ft. firebox!



I believe you're right. I also believe the reincarnated Vermont Castings new Defiant and Encore models use a secondary system in conjunction with a catalytic converter as well. And somehow managed to keep them top loading, which intrigues me. I kinda wish they were around when I bought my Heritage. I grew up with a VC Encore and top loading is a really nice thing.


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## atlarge54 (Jan 22, 2013)

tbow388 said:


> Okay, How much is that doggy in the window?



I guess nobody wants to reveal a price range on these units?


Don't know much about CAT's but my BIL's insert just had one go out to the tune of $300.


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## mhrischuk (Jan 22, 2013)

Princess around $2500

Ultra a few hundred more.


Found this on another site...



> My family owns a small hearth store in Salcha Alaska where it gets 50 below and one of our best sellers are the inexpensive Timberwolf line from Napoleon. The 2200 model on average gets 10 hours which is more than the company states and can heat 1200sqft in on low fire, Napoleon says 800sqft on low but our houses are very tight up here. Our customers burn a combo of Birch and Spruce with fantastic results. I was very skeptical about Napoleon but their product has really proven it’s self. Another great brand that gets over looked is Archgard. The 1800 Archgard gets fantastic burn times with only a 2.0 firebox. The gasification tubes are located high in the top of the stove which makes for easy loading of the stove. Customers have reported solid 8-10 hour burn with one load and 18 hour coal life for easy restarts. Osburn (SBI) builds a rock solid unit as well. I don’t recommend their bay front units like the1800 or the 2200 because they can be a little difficult to get fully loaded due to the design of the firebox and they are double decked meaning that they have upper shield over the upper surface of the stove. If you do get an Osburn 1800 or 2200 get the blower you'll be happier with the stove. When stove companies make statements about burn times and how their stove will magically make your cord wood last longer look at the facts. Firewood only contains a certain amount of carbon energy and a BTU is a BTU. Example heating 1000sqft at 0 degrees outside using a Pacific Energy T5 VS a BlazeKing Princess. Get a good hot fire going in both stoves and then load 20lbs of wood into each stove. You will need roughly 32000 btus per hr.from each stove. Once going and heating the room you will find that the 2 units will burn through the same amount of wood in the same amount of time to heat the same amount of space. Remember a BTU is a BTU and no stove can make energy from nothing. A Catalyst does not give you better burn times, all catalysts do is clog up, break apart, and rob energy that you could use to heat your home. Catalytic stoves can be turned down lower than non-cat stoves but you will notice that you will never see your fire and creosote will start to form on the inner walls of the catalytic stoves. This happens because the catalytic stove has no combustion efficiency and relies on a costly catalyst to maintain efficiency, not to mention when they are run so low your flue gas temps drop to 200 degrees or less (water vapor starts to condensate at 200) and condensation ruins chimneys and creates crystallized creosote which causes chimney fires. Then we come down to catalytic stove break down, cats have to be replaced, cats have to be made in a factory and you have to pay for them... so how efficient is a stove that relies on a part that is made in a chemical factory on the east coast that creates pollution in order to make a catalyst to make a wood stove efficient and uses precious metals like platinum and palladium. The simple fact is that a catalyst will need to be replaced, whether it is in the first year of owning the stove or 10 years down the road...it will have to be replaced eventually and more than once, usually 4-5 times within the life of the stove and at $250-$300 a pop. In any modern stove you will have what is called Pyrolysis. When organic material (wood) is exposed to heat of 390-550 degrees F Pyrolysis starts which is the release of gas and liquid from the organic matter. This gas that is released from the wood is highly combustible and can be used to heat your home if you have the right stove. The only thing the "wood gas" does for you in a catalytic stove is help maintain catalytic temperature (cold cat=no efficiently and a blocked up cat) so in other words you don’t get to use the energy from the gas to heat your area. With a non-cat stove you have under fire air and over fire air so your combustion efficiency is spectacular, catalytic stoves like BlazeKing only use one source of combustion air, no over fire combustion air which reduces combustion efficiency. When you have a non-cat stove you will notice when you shut down the air supply you will get a brilliant blue/orange flame over your wood in the top of your stove, this is the gases produced by Pyrolysis being burnt or "lit off", my customers call it their caveman TV or Aurora in a box and it is beautiful to watch. The energy you get from the gases burning off is used to heat your area. So with a non-cat stove you have two sources of fuel to burn and get useable heat from, the "wood gas" burns first and when that is depleted your stove will burn the carbon rich fuel left behind called char. Non-cat stoves have fewer moving parts which is great because when metal is heated and cooled it becomes week and can break and when parts break its not going to be 60 degrees outside and it sucks when you have a catalytic stove with a bypass damper that won’t open or close because of a part failure. In my opinion, if it’s not evident by what I wrote, I would go with a non-cat stove every time. Select a non-cat stove that will heat your area properly on its low to medium setting so you have room to turn the stove up during cold snaps, use properly seasoned fire wood, if at all possible, and enjoy an appliance that will treat you and your wallet respectfully.
> Happy burning


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## mhrischuk (Jan 22, 2013)

Del_ said:


> Some half truths there, IMO.



Yea but one of the strong moderators told the guy to "not let the door..."


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## stvnshnn (Jan 22, 2013)

*I don't know about 40 hours, but...*

In August my wife and I bought our first home. In September we had our Blaze King Princess Ultra installed. We live in Fairbanks, AK and Blaze Kings are very popular in town. Up here we our wood of choice is white birch due to a lack or hardwoods to burn. Our house is a hair over a thousand square feet and with an open floor plan. We have never gotten near 40 hours of burn time, but we have many factors that lower our burn time (you don't burn on low at -30). 
I do love that stove though. Fuel oil (Toyo stove) is our other option for heating and it is outrageously expensive. When it gets brutally cold, I load the stove 3x a day and the wood goes into a good bed of hot coals, I don't let it burn down too far or it gets cold in the time it takes to start the next burn. Also, the motivation for the "cat" stove is Fairbanks is working with the EPA and state govt to improve our local air quality, which currently sucks. So, the cat stove helps burn a little cleaner/more efficiently. 
IMO, I think it is a great stove, I have never gotten a 40 burn for reasons stated, but I wouldn't hesitate to recommend one to anyone interested in burning wood for heat.


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## mhrischuk (Jan 22, 2013)

stvnshnn said:


> In August my wife and I bought our first home. In September we had our Blaze King Princess Ultra installed. We live in Fairbanks, AK and Blaze Kings are very popular in town. Up here we our wood of choice is white birch due to a lack or hardwoods to burn. Our house is a hair over a thousand square feet and with an open floor plan. We have never gotten near 40 hours of burn time, but we have many factors that lower our burn time (you don't burn on low at -30).
> I do love that stove though. Fuel oil (Toyo stove) is our other option for heating and it is outrageously expensive. When it gets brutally cold, I load the stove 3x a day and the wood goes into a good bed of hot coals, I don't let it burn down too far or it gets cold in the time it takes to start the next burn. Also, the motivation for the "cat" stove is Fairbanks is working with the EPA and state govt to improve our local air quality, which currently sucks. So, the cat stove helps burn a little cleaner/more efficiently.
> IMO, I think it is a great stove, I have never gotten a 40 burn for reasons stated, but I wouldn't hesitate to recommend one to anyone interested in burning wood for heat.



Thank you stvnshnn for your honest report.
The fellow I quoted was from Alaska also and had similar experiences. He was called a bs'r and even a liar.
There are far too many Blaze King promoters on all of these sites that seem to only talk about this long low burn. It's 19 deg F here today and the low burn just won't cut it. I can see how great it can be on the 30 + days for sure as there is no way I can even get a 14 hour burn out of either my Hearthstone Equinox or Hearthstone Clydesdale. My Equinox can do 12 hour to enough coal for a relight. The stone mass keeps heating for hours more. I prefer burning off the creosote than laying it on.

But then again, as others have said... depends in the house.. the wood and other factors.
But when it gets down to very cold temps, slow burn goes out the door.

I considered a Blaze King myself as I do believe they are very good stoves. The styling really turned me off.


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## blacklocst (Jan 22, 2013)

So my question is why did Jotul stop making cat stoves?


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## mhrischuk (Jan 22, 2013)

Can't answer that but i did see somewhere where Jotul was a pioneer in cat technology. If you read todays Jotul advertisements, they often mention simplicity of use. They even have a top load non-cat model (Rangeley)


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## Iron Head (Jan 22, 2013)

I have a business idea for someone who might consider designing.
After market specialty in CAT after burner tubes for all stoves with after burners.


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## mooseracing (Jan 23, 2013)

mhrischuk said:


> But when it gets down to very cold temps, slow burn goes out the door.



Assuming you have an EPA stove how do you keep it full of fresh wood? If I do anything besides a low burn I just end up with a firebox full to the brim of coals, or low burn and the house is cold. Even though I have a pretty new stove I keep looking at models with a larger firebox to get over this issue.


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## mhrischuk (Jan 23, 2013)

mooseracing said:


> Assuming you have an EPA stove how do you keep it full of fresh wood? If I do anything besides a low burn I just end up with a firebox full to the brim of coals, or low burn and the house is cold. Even though I have a pretty new stove I keep looking at models with a larger firebox to get over this issue.



When I get down to a bed of coals I rustle them around with a rake and open the air up full blast. Let the coals burn down for about an hour then rustle them up again and reload. You are correct.. you have to keep the coals down. Bigger boxes let you load more wood but you have to manage it so you aren't simply burning more wood in the same amount of time. I guess that's what's nice about the Blaze King. It helps manage the rate of burn for you. I keep an eye on the rate of burn and adjust the air accordingly to try and get the most heat without wasting it all up the chimney. For a hot stove... mine in particular, I need to have the air open a quarter to a half for a while. Once she is 300-400 I back the air down and it's pretty much on it's own.

Right now my EQ just passed 400 and I shut the air all the way down. Gets the room real toasty with the fan blowing cool air from the other part of the house in.


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## Highbeam (Jan 23, 2013)

I am a recent convert to the BK family. Previously I burned a hearthstone heritage for 5 years and more than 25 cords of wood. We burn for 9 months out of the year and use nothing else for heat. I am near Mt. Rainier and last week's low temps were in the upper teens but our usual outside temps are just above freezing. 

I installed a princess ultra freestander. Only the huge King, with the 8" flue requirement, is rated for 40 hours, the regular stoves like the princess are only 2.85 CF and are rated for 30 hours which I have no problem getting with red alder and other low quality softwoods. 

You can burn it low for 30 hours and reload once per day. I did this for the first few months. Or you can turn up the output and get lower burn times, usually 12 hours is about the minimum and doing this will still use less wood than any non-cat stove since the BK efficiency is tops. Seriously, the EPA ratings have the king as #1 and the princess as #2 tied with woodstock PH out of all stoves in the world. 

I chose to put the blowers on this stove and it when I run it at 50% throttle plus fans it will flat out make some major heat. Talking raising the house temps 15 degrees in three hours when it is below freezing outside.

So yes, the BKs are what they say. Another nice benefit is that the firebox is large yet it won't overheat the space like a large non-cat in a medium sized home. Large fireboxes are easier to load, hold more, and hold more ash below the door. 6" deep firebox on the princess.


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## stihly dan (Jan 23, 2013)

Wow, that sounds like some stove.


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