# black walnut veneer - what's the value of my logs



## YoungTreeGuy

I've been looking for a system of priceing some logs that look like possible veneer logs. They are 12'L 24" wide no change in bark patern, looks like the growth was pretty uniform. So it's met the qualifactions based on a site I read. But there was no price system. A local logger is buying black walnut up and I want to get veneer price for these but not sure what grade of veneer it would be or the value.... I don't want saw log prices then he turns and sells it as veneer because I don't know the value. Anyone know the value of these black walnut logs?


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## sgreanbeans

yep, you need to watch the mills, they will short change ya every time, gotta shop it around, if you have enough of them it my be worth it, but just a few, i think you will be just wasting time.


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## Bigus Termitius

YoungTreeGuy said:


> I've been looking for a system of priceing some logs that look like possible veneer logs. They are 12'L 24" wide no change in bark patern, looks like the growth was pretty uniform. So it's met the qualifactions based on a site I read. But there was no price system. A local logger is buying black walnut up and I want to get veneer price for these but not sure what grade of veneer it would be or the value.... I don't want saw log prices then he turns and sells it as veneer because I don't know the value. Anyone know the value of these black walnut logs?


 
Where did you get them?


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## SDB777

Okay, I will play the 'devils advocate' for a moment:

Your wanting full price as a veneer log...great! All you need to do is cut it into veneer and sell it on the market as such.


I get this when someone brings me a log to cut up. Although I'm making blanks for bowls, game calls and such(a little different, but kind of the same). When they want $50/bF for a log(that isn't worth the gas/oil to cut it down), because such-n-such got that for theirs....what can you do?
Had a woman tell me that Remington wanted her Black Walnut tree, and she wanted me to pay her $800 and then cut it down and remove it. Unfortunately, I know the person at Remington that buys wood and called him on the spot(with her standing there)...bluff called, the tree still stands and is dripping crap all over her nice shiny new car!


What I'm trying to say is:
Sometimes, you won't get full value for a log. After all, the person with the equipment to make the veneer has to be able to make money also...or there just isn't any reason to buy said log(and take a chance it isn't the quality that it's claimed).



_I didn't mean this as an offensive post. I hope it didn't come across as such_


Scott


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## trimmmed

SDB777 said:


> Okay, I will play the 'devils advocate' for a moment:
> 
> Your wanting full price as a veneer log...great! All you need to do is cut it into veneer and sell it on the market as such.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Scott



Pursuing that devils advocacy thought...

He wants to be paid for a veneer log as opposed to just a lumber log, not looking for the retail price of actual veneer.

In any event, you can only get what the buyer will pay and if there's little competition the number might be small.


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## YoungTreeGuy

I have a few more logs. Black walnut seems to be going like gold around here at the moment. I don't expect retail price but is it worth it to load them up and take them to the mill around the corner or sell them to the logger.


They where haversted about 25 feet or more from a rail road similar to the log I cut in feb for this logger. My log is much better looking. Fathers friend sold one last week 12 ft by 24 in forr $500. I can get it to the mill if I get $800 for it.


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## justme23005

Where in NY are you?


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## YoungTreeGuy

Waterloo ny but the logs are out at the shop couple miles away from where I live


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## Natewood

dang wheres your mill?! I'd love prices like that! I blocked up a perfect 32" black walnut log for firewood:msp_angry:


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## justme23005

YoungTreeGuy said:


> Waterloo ny but the logs are out at the shop couple miles away from where I live


 

Our mill is near Albany.


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## YoungTreeGuy

Natewood said:


> dang wheres your mill?! I'd love prices like that! I blocked up a perfect 32" black walnut log for firewood:msp_angry:


 
From my understanding because it's my fathers friend... the guy came picked the logs up and took it to the mill and came back with $500. Must been worth it to get a loader and bring it to the mill and pay out $500.

My logs have uniform bark patern where his had some signs of change. I realize from my reasearch that every mill is different. Like I said my mill is right around the corner so if its an extra $300 if I bring them to the mill... its worth my time.


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## lego1970

Just based on what I've encountered in Missouri. Veneer Walnut goes for $3-9 dollars (based on a lot of varialbles such as log condition, market, buyers, etc, etc. ) bf if you cut down the tree and deliver to the mill. What you have based on 24" x 12' is roughly 300bf so you do the math. The problem is that log buyers are just as bad as used car salesmen. They will come up with every excuse as to why you can't get paid even the minimum bf rates. With only one log to sell, they won't give you the time of day. Sure they will deal with you because they are in the business, but with one log that won't spend much time haggling over prices. To be honest, I think you would be lucky if you got $300 out of that log, $500 if your playing hardball and $900 if the buyer just really likes you and or has an overseas buyer coming in town and is short on Veneer logs. Also it's a good idea to check for nails with a metal dectector, especially if the tree was an urban tree or grew near a fence line. That's just my experience. Good luck.


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## treeslayer

what makes you think its veneer quality? just because of that moderate size? whats the amount of dark heartwood to the lighter band? post some pics, and stop believing what people tell you they got, maybe...


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## GLOBOTREE

its very true that log buyers are made of excuses...they will tell you every excuse known to man as to why they cannot pay what you want. Last summer we took down a very nice tree (juglans nigra). Anyways... the quality was there, straight as an arrow as well. It was beautiful to say the very least. But as true as what we are reading here tonite...good luck gettin the big bucks. I ended up deliverin it to my uncle who in turn had a mill (portable) out to saw it up in to nice workable pieces. I at first thought it was a small fortune worth of the walnut wood...i settled for 300$
I thought maybe 1000, dreamin man dreamin


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## YoungTreeGuy

treeslayer said:


> what makes you think its veneer quality? just because of that moderate size? whats the amount of dark heartwood to the lighter band? post some pics, and stop believing what people tell you they got, maybe...


 
I can probably get some pictures tommrow. Its a verneer by defination. The color was the same all the way threw and growth patterns were evenly spaced apart. Local logger paid me $300 to knock down a veneer log so if he paid me $300 + the home owner for it and made money...got bet worth the time if this guy buying logs and paying some1 to knock them down.


Also I have at 2 veneer logs and maybe a 9f that also could be veneer quality. Or I wouldn't be tree to figure a value on this topic. Thanks for all the input.


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## treeslayer

YoungTreeGuy said:


> I can probably get some pictures tommrow. Its a verneer by defination. The color was the same all the way threw and growth patterns were evenly spaced apart. Local logger paid me $300 to knock down a veneer log so if he paid me $300 + the home owner for it and made money...got bet worth the time if this guy buying logs and paying some1 to knock them down.
> 
> 
> Also I have at 2 veneer logs and maybe a 9f that also could be veneer quality. Or I wouldn't be tree to figure a value on this topic. Thanks for all the input.



Man, this does not make much sense....Lay off the alcohol when you're typing......


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## YoungTreeGuy

treeslayer said:


> Man, this does not make much sense....Lay off the alcohol when you're typing......


 
Ok sense I'm bad at explaining things :

Logger paid me $300 to knock down a veneer walnut

Logger paid unknown amount to home owner for the veneer log

Logger made unknown amount of money after paying me

Or in a math formula : $300 + X amount to home owner + logger profit = total value of the tree.

Which gives me a ball park figure of my logs


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## John Paul Sanborn

One of the nice things about walnut is that they can steam them and the sapwood darkens.

One of the things with the logger is that he has a relationship with more then one mill. He may have a deal with the buyer to call him when they ++NEED++ certain species and lengths. He has a few honey holes in his hip pocket that makes every one involved some nice money. He creates a sellers market for his resource.

Us small timers do not know the market, or the buyers, and just show up when we have what we have. This creates a buyers market for the resource.

The buyers job is to get the best deal for the company, not for the supplier. If he wants to work with you in the future, he may treat you well, if he has no intensive to do so...


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## YoungTreeGuy

So... after to weeks of this logger screwing around. He pays me $300 to knock a tree down and cut it in lengths. He has to do the clean up and everything else. Now I got mine out there all he has to do is load them he offers $350 :msp_confused::msp_thumbdn::bang:

Something seems wrong with this old man...


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## mpatch

What grade did he say the logs were? More than likely they graded a 1 and not veneer which is a pretty decent price difference.


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## tomtrees58

treeslayer said:


> Man, this does not make much sense....Lay off the alcohol when you're typing......


 
that's a good one having black walnut logs and you think you have a 10.000 log wood is down unless its a deep woods tree no gun shots nails etc and over 3' 24 " is way to small


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## treeslayer

mpatch said:


> What grade did he say the logs were? More than likely they graded a 1 and not veneer which is a pretty decent price difference.


 
Exactly, its not a veneer log until its down and graded. 

walnuts grow nasty, and veneer is a fine grade requirement, but he obviously wouldn't know.....:bang:

you don't cut veneer sheets with a band saw lil boy.


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## John Paul Sanborn

I have worked with a couple buyers in the state and they all have told me each defect they are looking at. As said above, it does not take much to downgrade from a veneer. I have seen standing graded at veneer get downgraded after the cut; seams, shakes, staining are just a few of the reasons.


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## YoungTreeGuy

The two veneer logs were marker as 3 and others where 1's. Piont is he paid me $300 to knock one down in that wasn't nearly as nice as this log and paid the home owner for it. Best he could say was $350? What kinda logic is that.

I got some one else looking at them tommrow that useing it in his home.


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## teascouts

Veneer is processed in two ways; plane slice and rotary cut. There are three types of veneer cuts; rotary, plane slice, and rift. Rift cuts and plane slice cuts are produced on the same machine, rift cuts basically are just quartersawn first. Rotary cuts.... well , you figure it out. Unless you know a manufacturer, I suggest you take what you can get. We had a buyer for a while who exported v. quality logs to Germany for the Cuckoo clock industry and paid pretty good, but we had to haul them to the port in Toledo. I've had people who wanted me to pay them to remove their tree, lol, it would have to pretty special to justify that. In short, do some research, make some calls, or take what you can get.


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## YoungTreeGuy

teascouts said:


> Veneer is processed in two ways; plane slice and rotary cut. There are three types of veneer cuts; rotary, plane slice, and rift. Rift cuts and plane slice cuts are produced on the same machine, rift cuts basically are just quartersawn first. Rotary cuts.... well , you figure it out. Unless you know a manufacturer, I suggest you take what you can get. We had a buyer for a while who exported v. quality logs to Germany for the Cuckoo clock industry and paid pretty good, but we had to haul them to the port in Toledo. I've had people who wanted me to pay them to remove their tree, lol, it would have to pretty special to justify that. In short, do some research, make some calls, or take what you can get.


 


I think he forgot he paid me to knock trees down for him. He's not the only one buying walnut here that's why I gotta laugh at the low ball offer. If nothing else Ill call the mill in albany and take them there with the 16 ft dump tailer we got. If it's worth the time. If not Ill call the logger and say come get'em... have them chunker up into firewood when he gets there. " thanks for wasting my time now I've wasted some of yours."


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## John Paul Sanborn

teascouts said:


> I've had people who wanted me to pay them to remove their tree, lol, it would have to pretty special to justify that. In short, do some research, make some calls, or take what you can get.


 
Same here, you get people every once and a while who heard of someone 3-4 times removed who got paid $3500 to have a tree removed 20 years ago. I talked to one guy who said it was him in the +19 years I have been doing tree work in the Metro Milwaukee area. He told how they took all the major limbs and dug the stump out for gun-stocks. It was in an easy access so they could flop it, and it had a very long stem. 

I interrogated him  on the subject.

Talking to others it might have been the peak of the market when the Euro buyers were paying top dollar for the species. I know a few old-timers who made a few truck payments on U. americana in the 70's. These days we have to haul a load of logs near 200 miles to make a sale. The local mills will not even look at a wood-lot under 8 acres. That might have changed since the glut of spec . development has decimated the land clearing industry. Which, of course, has shifted all those companies into the residential market...

But i digress


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## lego1970

YoungTreeGuy said:


> I think he forgot he paid me to knock trees down for him. He's not the only one buying walnut here that's why I gotta laugh at the low ball offer. If nothing else Ill call the mill in albany and take them there with the 16 ft dump tailer we got. If it's worth the time. If not Ill call the logger and say come get'em... have them chunker up into firewood when he gets there. " thanks for wasting my time now I've wasted some of yours."




I hear what your saying and that would pretty amusing, however $300 is better then nothing. Also you have to remember he's gonna sell it for a profit to the mill, then more then likely the mill with sell it to European or Asian buyers at a profit. I don't doubt that your log is veneer, and I'm sure if you see your log at the mill next week it will have a veneer tag on one of the ends, but for now I wouldn't piss off the buyer/logger 

Couple things to keep in mind in case you don't already know. Don't notch and drop the trunk....it's an obvious sign to the log buyer you don't know the game. Dig around it at low as you can then plunge cut and sweep out the middle towards the side you want to drop, then cut down on the root flare/back straps that are holding the tree in place. That will maximize your BF. Also in the summer keep the logs out of direct sun light and heat if you can , otherwise they can start to splinter and blue too much. If your gonna be holding on to the logs for a long period go to a local craft store and buy chunks of wax, melt it in an old pan and then paint the ends of the logs to prevent too much moisture from coming out, also they sell little plastic spikes that you can hammer into the ends to prevent splitting, but I doubt that would be nessesary if you keep them out of direct sunlight and the ends waxed. I don't know what the moisture content is suppose to be so you might want to check in on that before waxing the ends.

That's all I can add, good luck.


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## 056 kid

If the guy was a logger, why did he pay 300 bones to have a tree cut? Cant the logger do it? Further more, why wouldn't he keep THE "veneer" log? I can tell you that there never was and never will be a veneer that came from someones yard, not as far as the mills are concerned.
Find the rest of the load then talk to the mill, otherwise, make some gun stocks or something. . .


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## 056 kid

lego1970 said:


> I hear what your saying and that would pretty amusing, however $300 is better then nothing. Also you have to remember he's gonna sell it for a profit to the mill, then more then likely the mill with sell it to European or Asian buyers at a profit. I don't doubt that your log is veneer, and I'm sure if you see your log at the mill next week it will have a veneer tag on one of the ends, but for now I wouldn't piss off the buyer/logger
> 
> Couple things to keep in mind in case you don't already know. Don't notch and drop the trunk....it's an obvious sign to the log buyer you don't know the game. Dig around it at low as you can then plunge cut and sweep out the middle towards the side you want to drop, then cut down on the root flare/back straps that are holding the tree in place. That will maximize your BF. Also in the summer keep the logs out of direct sun light and heat if you can , otherwise they can start to splinter and blue too much. If your gonna be holding on to the logs for a long period go to a local craft store and buy chunks of wax, melt it in an old pan and then paint the ends of the logs to prevent too much moisture from coming out, also they sell little plastic spikes that you can hammer into the ends to prevent splitting, but I doubt that would be nessesary if you keep them out of direct sunlight and the ends waxed. I don't know what the moisture content is suppose to be so you might want to check in on that before waxing the ends.
> 
> That's all I can add, good luck.


 
What do you mean, "don't notch & drop the trunk" Maybe I missed something all those months falling veneer logs,facing a tree below ground level is dumb, along with that screw ball GOL face you describe. . . 

logging is not a game. . . . . . . . .


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## Gypo Logger

The last walnut I sold was the ugliest stuff I ever saw. It was felled and cut by a land clearer into indiscriminate randon lengths and sat in a pile for four years. The sapwood was turning to punk. I thought it was just glorified firewood, but sold it for 1.50/BF to a Tiawanese woman log buyer.
Aisian markets usually have only 2 grades, while the U.S. has 6 or 8 The US likes to pick out the best logs and the Asians gets what's left and are good on the scale and fast with the $. There was a time when they bought without rolling the log, so most loggers would put the defect down. Lol These were known as 'bump down logs'.
John


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## YoungTreeGuy

056 kid said:


> If the guy was a logger, why did he pay 300 bones to have a tree cut? Cant the logger do it? Further more, why wouldn't he keep THE "veneer" log? I can tell you that there never was and never will be a veneer that came from someones yard, not as far as the mills are concerned.
> Find the rest of the load then talk to the mill, otherwise, make some gun stocks or something. . .


 
He's 89 years old. And he did keep the log for that tree. I cut some down for a friend that were better looking then the one I cut for him.

The other local logger said the log was dieased on one side and was a $400 saw log. He never rolled it. Even though he offered more... I saw how much his eyes lit up and how much the other guy low balled. Guess I'll have a small bidding war between the two of themto get a fair price.


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## lego1970

056 kid said:


> What do you mean, "don't notch & drop the trunk" Maybe I missed something all those months falling veneer logs,facing a tree below ground level is dumb, along with that screw ball GOL face you describe. . .
> 
> logging is not a game. . . . . . . . .



I don't know what GOL means? 

"Don't notch and drop it", means exactly that. Dig out the dirt, especially inbetween the root flares....go to the side where the tree will fall and plunge cut as low as you can into the center....gut it out without cutting the root flares.....then cut the felling side root flares down to meet the horizontal cut.....then go to the sides and back side and cut those root flares down to meet the horizontal cut. 

Screwball? I thought the same thing the first time I saw a tree felled that way, but that's how it's done on Walnut logs around here. If the mill see's the top side of a face cut they will know your an amateur. 

Logging is not a game? Yes and no. Staying safe is no game and that applies to all forms of tree work but the rest of logging is....especially the selling part.


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## 056 kid

GOL is "Game Of Logging" and is is dumbassery.

Digging the roots of a tree is also dumbassery, mills do not really care about the ####ed up ass grain that is in the stump of a log from what I gathered. Then again, I fell timber in hill country where the low side of the stump might be 4 feet in the air & the high side is level with the earth. . .


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## lego1970

056 kid said:


> GOL is "Game Of Logging" and is is dumbassery.
> 
> Digging the roots of a tree is also dumbassery, mills do not really care about the ####ed up ass grain that is in the stump of a log from what I gathered. Then again, I fell timber in hill country where the low side of the stump might be 4 feet in the air & the high side is level with the earth. . .


 
I didn't say roots....I said root flare. Stump.....if it's not hollow then you're throwing away bf. Hill country....some of the logs come from the Ozarks. I've been ALL OVER Virginia and the grade on the ozark hills are just the same as Virginia....matter of fact so are some of the waddi's and ravines in Kansas and they fell trees on hills pretty much the same way. 

I've said all I can say as far as what price to expect, how the Walnut mills like it done, and how loggers have been doing it here for decades. You folks can take it for what it's worth.....good luck.


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## pdqdl

Lego: got a question for you.

I have been hearing about the techniques you describe for quite a few years now, particularly from the walnut-tree thief I employed a few years back. He claimed to have made big money harvesting walnut trees in the distant past. He claimed to have dug out the root flare for maximum value.

My dad tried to make money with walnut log harvesting when I was just a kid, so I have been following the walnut veneer business almost all my life. My father, of course, had no idea what he was doing, and that venture flopped, prostrate on the ground without profits after the first truckload. More of that "big money in walnut logs" myth.

I see many semi-truck loads of walnut logs passing down the highway on the way to the St.Joseph veneer plant. Sometimes I take the time to look at the load very closely. I have never seen any of the logs taken down to the root flare in the manner you have described, and I have looked particularly at the log ends, how they were cut, what size they were, and how much dark wood was present.

Do you have any comments on this observation?


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## lego1970

pdqdl said:


> Lego: got a question for you.
> 
> I have been hearing about the techniques you describe for quite a few years now, particularly from the walnut-tree thief I employed a few years back. He claimed to have made big money harvesting walnut trees in the distant past. He claimed to have dug out the root flare for maximum value.
> 
> My dad tried to make money with walnut log harvesting when I was just a kid, so I have been following the walnut veneer business almost all my life. My father, of course, had no idea what he was doing, and that venture flopped, prostrate on the ground without profits after the first truckload. More of that "bid money in walnut logs" myth.
> 
> I see many semi-truck loads of walnut logs passing down the highway on the way to the St.Joseph veneer plant. Sometimes I take the time to look at the load very closely. I have never seen any of the logs taken down to the root flare in the manner you have described, and I have looked particularly at the log ends, how they were cut, what size they were, and how much dark wood was present.
> 
> Do you have any comments on this observation?



The root flares are trimmed off after it's felled, giving you that "two turns" in pencil sharpner look at the butt. Matter of fact if they don't trim at least a little bit of the flare, then it won't load good on the truck unless you overhang the root flares off the front or back of the trailer. Size of the tree doesn't really matter.

Your talking about American Walnut Company out of St. Joseph. Hell, call them up and ask for John, Allen, Frank, or Glenn and tell them you got a few Walnut tree you're gonna cut down and that you want to know how to plunge cut it. They will all tell you the same thing I described. Matter of fact the CEO John W. will tell you that's how he wants his logs to look. Likewise, I'm sure Silvers mill from Cameron, Mo. ,Pacific Walnut from Fayette, Mo, Missouri Walnut from Neosho, Mo, and Midwest Walnut from Council Bluff, Ia will all pretty much say the same thing. I can give you the loggers names if you want? 

Again, take it for what it's worth. I'm done with this thread.


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## pdqdl

I wasn't doubting you, I was asking for your opinions on my observations. Please draw no offense, none was offered. I think you misunderstood me. I was _looking_ for trimmed root flares, and have never found any on the trucks I had the opportunity to look at. I'm not claiming that I saw them all, either.

I gave up on selling walnut logs many years ago. Nobody wants to buy city trees from an unknown seller. They just won't pay what it's worth, particularly the guys up in St. Joe.

I might be wrong, but I just don't buy the argument that the metal detectors can't find the metal in the trees. I believe that it is just a buyers market, and if you are the little guy with an occasional walnut tree (like the average tree service)...don't bother.


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## lego1970

pdqdl said:


> I wasn't doubting you, I was asking for your opinions on my observations. Please draw no offense, none was offered. I think you misunderstood me. I was _looking_ for trimmed root flares, and have never found any on the trucks I had the opportunity to look at. I'm not claiming that I saw them all, either.
> 
> I gave up on selling walnut logs many years ago. Nobody wants to buy city trees from an unknown seller. They just won't pay what it's worth, particularly the guys up in St. Joe.
> 
> I might be wrong, but I just don't buy the argument that the metal detectors can't find the metal in the trees. I believe that it is just a buyers market, and if you are the little guy with an occasional walnut tree (like the average tree service)...don't bother.



Ok, sorry for being defensive. 

I've seen foreign buyers bring their metal dectectors to mills so I agree with you...a good quality metal detector should have no problem picking up metal in the wood. 

For future reference in case you come across another good log. 

You might already know these guys but if not try Danny Stephens on rt O about 5 miles south of Freeman. Met him once, seems like a good guy that has his stuff together. Of course he's in it for the money as well but being close to Peculiar he might be worth the drive.

Also South Side Lumber out of Butler, Mo. Don't have a contact name, but they seem pretty fair.


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## YoungTreeGuy

lego1970 said:


> Ok, sorry for being defensive.
> 
> I've seen foreign buyers bring their metal dectectors to mills so I agree with you...a good quality metal detector should have no problem picking up metal in the wood.
> 
> For future reference in case you come across another good log.
> 
> You might already know these guys but if not try Danny Stephens on rt O about 5 miles south of Freeman. Met him once, seems like a good guy that has his stuff together. Of course he's in it for the money as well but being close to Peculiar he might be worth the drive.
> 
> Also South Side Lumber out of Butler, Mo. Don't have a contact name, but they seem pretty fair.



I know what a plunge cut is and I think I understand how to do but it was on town along a rail track about 20 feet from it. We dug as low as we could and drop cut( drop cut was in the root flare). Got a vidoe so I can see this cut in action? Mite do side work with a guy on his land. He wanted to know should we find a market for his logs (oak locust black walnut and ashe) or go to the mill? I've got a 16' dump trailor and he was one slightly smaller. The 16fter has 7ft sides so it can hold a lot. if I should go to mark it with them, any suggestions where to start looking for a buyer?


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## lego1970

YoungTreeGuy said:


> I know what a plunge cut is and I think I understand how to do but it was on town along a rail track about 20 feet from it. We dug as low as we could and drop cut( drop cut was in the root flare). Got a vidoe so I can see this cut in action? Mite do side work with a guy on his land. He wanted to know should we find a market for his logs (oak locust black walnut and ashe) or go to the mill? I've got a 16' dump trailor and he was one slightly smaller. The 16fter has 7ft sides so it can hold a lot. if I should go to mark it with them, any suggestions where to start looking for a buyer?



I don't know of any video, you'd just have to look or ask around.

As far the market question? Generaly you find a buyer before you cut them down, otherwise somebody (whoever owns them) may be sitting on them for awhile, plus if you can't find a buyer you might as well let the tree grow more and pack on more bf. Like fattening up a cow before it goes to the slaughter house. Where to find the best buyers in your area or when to sell? I have not a clue. The market for walnut is picking up a little bit. I've never delt with Ash other then quick beer & gas money at the local Amish farm. I haven't delt with black locust around here much either. The few Black Locust buyers I've delt with make custom decks for some of the fancy lake home in mid-Missouri. I think some make fence post out of it. 

You may already know this but Woodweb is a great source of information with handy calculators to figure out bf and weight. 

Again, I don't know your business. For all I know, you already know all this but if not, a few more other thing to keep in mind in the coming 5-10 years is Emerald Ash Borer and Thousand Cankers Disease. Many Counties as well as State laws now prohibit transporting Ash and Walnut across county and state lines because of those two diseases. You need to check with your state's forrestry, ag, or conservation deptpartment, as well county depts to see what laws are in effect in your area. 

I'm not a logging expert by any means. Just sharing what I've experienced know to be true on the subject. What you've read is pretty much all I know. Good luck.


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## YoungTreeGuy

lego1970 said:


> I don't know of any video, you'd just have to look or ask around.
> 
> As far the market question? Generaly you find a buyer before you cut them down, otherwise somebody (whoever owns them) may be sitting on them for awhile, plus if you can't find a buyer you might as well let the tree grow more and pack on more bf. Like fattening up a cow before it goes to the slaughter house. Where to find the best buyers in your area or when to sell? I have not a clue. The market for walnut is picking up a little bit. I've never delt with Ash other then quick beer & gas money at the local Amish farm. I haven't delt with black locust around here much either. The few Black Locust buyers I've delt with make custom decks for some of the fancy lake home in mid-Missouri. I think some make fence post out of it.
> 
> You may already know this but Woodweb is a great source of information with handy calculators to figure out bf and weight.
> 
> Again, I don't know your business. For all I know, you already know all this but if not, a few more other thing to keep in mind in the coming 5-10 years is Emerald Ash Borer and Thousand Cankers Disease. Many Counties as well as State laws now prohibit transporting Ash and Walnut across county and state lines because of those two diseases. You need to check with your state's forrestry, ag, or conservation deptpartment, as well county depts to see what laws are in effect in your area.
> 
> I'm not a logging expert by any means. Just sharing what I've experienced know to be true on the subject. What you've read is pretty much all I know. Good luck.


 

Got lots of buyers around but they are all middle men. I wanna cut the middle guy out and take it right to the mill/veener place. Got paid $750 for 7 logs because my dad pushed me into it. Guy comes today(day later) offers 1.4k for them. I already got into with him yesterday. 

Now I got one for a home owner 3ft + wider with abotu 12 feet clear wood no bumps or damge in the bark. Sick of the middle man, sick of searching threw low ballers. But I don't know where to begin to look for veener mill besides albany.


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## 056 kid

lego1970 said:


> I didn't say roots....I said root flare. Stump.....if it's not hollow then you're throwing away bf. Hill country....some of the logs come from the Ozarks. I've been ALL OVER Virginia and the grade on the ozark hills are just the same as Virginia....matter of fact so are some of the waddi's and ravines in Kansas and they fell trees on hills pretty much the same way.
> 
> I've said all I can say as far as what price to expect, how the Walnut mills like it done, and how loggers have been doing it here for decades. You folks can take it for what it's worth.....good luck.


 
Neg rep for supposedly not being man enough to admit being wrong??

I Don't think Im wrong!! How bout that?! digging LOLOLOL. Flat landers. . . . .


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## YoungTreeGuy

So the veneer guy laughed to when they heard who bought the logs. Said he was a piece of work. So I went out and looked at the logs since there still on lot. The veneer guy looked at the standing trees I got left to do not ones on lot, they're sold for now.

As I said I went out and looked at them again and took pictures of the bumps and marks on the log + their is a crack pretty much threw the center of big log on one end. I'm not sure how to post pictures on here.


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## YoungTreeGuy

YoungTreeGuy said:


> So the veneer guy laughed to when they heard who bought the logs. Said he was a piece of work. So I went out and looked at the logs since there still on lot. The veneer guy looked at the standing trees I got left to do not ones on lot, they're sold for now.
> 
> As I said I went out and looked at them again and took pictures of the bumps and marks on the log + their is a crack pretty much threw the center of big log on one end. I'm not sure how to post pictures on here.



these are the pictures


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## John Paul Sanborn

If you can bury them in a chip pile they will be in better shape for sale. Best to do it fresh.


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## pdqdl

I got passed this morning by two semi-truckloads of walnut logs (my truck was loaded heavy), and I got a chance to look at the regional pro's handiwork.

Nothing was bigger than 30", and some of the logs looked like they were only good for 11"-12". Some of the butts showed rotten parts, but mostly in the outer areas, and all the logs that were not at the butt of the tree looked clean. Very few were symmetrically round, in fact most of the logs were rather misshapen in outline.

_At least two logs on each truck had been cut at or below the ground level, and the root flare had been sliced off to keep the same diameter as the trunk. _

Each truck had "Missouri Walnut Co" on the side, so these guys would be expected to know their business.


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## John Paul Sanborn

A buyer we worked with that did walnut plywood would buy every scrap of the tree. If there were several trees he would come out and mark off each cut. They would even take some limb wood as low grade if it was round.


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## farmer9

*log value*

Brand new at this site. Im looking for someone reliable (forester?) to help me sell some timber. Im in Central Illinois. Anybody recommend someone?
thx


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