# What is more dangerous, rock climbing or tree climbing?



## mikeg520 (Jan 30, 2005)

Just wondering, which one has more fatalities?


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## MasterBlaster (Jan 30, 2005)

Interesting question. I'm curious as to the per 100 fatalities. My guess is treeclimbing.


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## teressa green (Jan 31, 2005)

mine too ,aint seen many rock climbers with ,chainsaws,silkys,they climb with nothing more dangerous than a swiss army knife in their pockets,ive seen cliff hanger ,


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## pbtree (Jan 31, 2005)

I agree, besides, there are probably more loco tree climbers than rock climbers on any give day!


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## M.D. Vaden (Jan 31, 2005)

Do you think the rock climbers have one of those injury charts showing red dots on parts of the body to show where the most injuries occur?

I'll bet it's a toss up.

If I have to guess, I'll say rock climbing, but mainly for two reasons:

1. Foolishness, like the guys in Oregon near Mulnomah Falls that climbed too late at night.

2. The free climbers that don't use gear.

The part that may throw off comparison is that rock climbing can be more recreational and not so much professional, whereas tree climbing is primarily professional.


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## TimberMcPherson (Jan 31, 2005)

If your measuring free or solo climbers they would be pretty high but having worked in both industries I think tree climbers would win the scars competition hands down. Recreational climbing branched from moutaineering which is far more dangerous.


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## xander9727 (Jan 31, 2005)

I'm not sure about fatalities but I've seen WAY more stranded rock climbers in need of rescue than I've seen tree climbers. Addtionally more tree climbers are employed.......but then I guess that's why they are tree climbers.


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## rb_in_va (Jan 31, 2005)

M.D. Vaden said:


> The part that may throw off comparison is that rock climbing can be more recreational and not so much professional, whereas tree climbing is primarily professional.



Recreational tree climbing is gaining in popularity though. I would bet there are many rec climbers right here at AS.


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## NickfromWI (Jan 31, 2005)

I'm gonna have to guess rock-climbing is more dangerous. 

how to we find out the answers?

love
nick


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## MasterBlaster (Jan 31, 2005)

OSHA stastistics don't really help much here, I guess.


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## OutOnaLimb (Jan 31, 2005)

We have had at least half a dozen rock climbers get killed in the Garden of the Gods here in Colorado Springs this year. As with tree climbing fatalities most of the deaths are do to ignorance and improper training. Im gonna go out on a limb here and say that thier are way more rock climbers get killed than tree climbers. My groundie is a big time rock climber, I will have to ask his opinion tomorrow. When your climbing trees the most you are usually gonna fall is 65 ft. But if your on a multi pitch rock 250ft up and you fall and your protection blows out. Its hasta lasagna, dont get any on ya.

Kenn


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## jamie (Jan 31, 2005)

*rock*

im saying rock climbing, look at the anchors, most of the time tree anchors are prety ???? stable, incidents are down to improper conduct, 

rock climbing when you fall there is the chance that the anchor may not hold.

rock climbing tends to be above anchor with less controlled falls where ax tree work is (should) be on a static line

jamie


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## TREEWRK (Jan 31, 2005)

*rock climbing or tree climbing*

tree climbing is really more dangeruos rocks are stable and don;t have have
included bark or dead leaders :blob5:


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## OutOnaLimb (Jan 31, 2005)

TREEWRK said:


> tree climbing is really more dangeruos rocks are stable and don;t have have
> included bark or dead leaders :blob5:



Have you ever heard of rotten rock? Sand stone that is frozen and thawed over and over again. Im not talking about bolted sport routes that are screwed into shale or granite. Rock can be crumbly and if your setting protection via a camalot or a hex on a lead climb then chances are its gonna blow out. Where as if your in a tree and your smart your around the leader or at least on a solid crotch. I disagree more rock climbers get killed every year than arborists. 

Kenn


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## Newfie (Jan 31, 2005)

I would think they are both equally dangerous but that is from my perspective and limited to a little bit of rock climbing and repelling in the Army. 
I would think that rock climbing has more fatalities simply because the tree climbing community is going to be made up predominantly of professionals w/ experience and training while the rock climbing community is more likely to have a much larger percentage of inexperienced, more money than common sense limp dicked yuppies.  

But that is just my opinion,not fact, and i don't have any sources to reference.


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## TimberMcPherson (Jan 31, 2005)

I think rock climbers would have more fatalities due to the fact that they are often hours from any sort of help (if anyone can reach them at all), they normally deck on very solid ground, most dont wear helmets, and even when all there safety gear works to 100% of its application its still very possible to get killed if you wing. 
Lead climbing is a great way to get nailed, I was knocked out belaying while climbing (I was a rock,kayak and mountain instructor with the NZ army for a time) when the guy I was belaying on a multipitch climbing peeled and hit me. After that he hit me another 2 times before we managed to get up and out.
If you guys saw what kind of natural protection (like micro wires) that climbers put falls force on, youd stick to trees (I know I do)


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## teressa green (Feb 1, 2005)

personally i dont climb unless theres some cash at the end of it ,


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## MasterBlaster (Feb 1, 2005)

Ditto that!


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## P_woozel (Feb 1, 2005)

Depending on how you define "rock climber", a couple scrambling in the boulders in J-tree after smoking a joint one falls gets a head injury because they dont have a helmet on, (why would they?) gets labled as a climbing accident. A group of Serria club baffoons hiking around the general vicinity of Mt.Baker gets called climbers when they become lost in the wet weather. So based on that I woulkd say "rock climbers" have us beat. I've yet to figure out the strange fascination with the fatality rate anyway, hardly a badge of honor :blob5:


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## rb_in_va (Feb 1, 2005)

If you had to trim these trees I think it would be very dangerous.


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## Proj Eng (Feb 1, 2005)

I would guess there are more tree climbers in the world than rock climbers, therby also having more injuries, but the injuries of rock climbers I would think would be more severe. Therefore, higher percentage of injuries and fatal ones in rock climbing. Maybe about the same percentage of injuries per participant. So do you say rock climbing is more dangerous? I say no. Maybe more fatal though. Where else can you encounter such a dangerous environment with heights combined with power lines, ice, bad weather, chainsaws, chippers, cranes, etc?


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## xander9727 (Feb 1, 2005)

Tom Dunlap said:


> Without fatalities/hours it's all conjecture.
> 
> I'll bet that it would be treework being more dangerous. After seeing climbers in either discipline, the rock/ice/mountain, rim, world seems to have a better tradition of safety standards and practices. Of course there will always be the front page articles and dramatic rescues.
> 
> Just because someone climbs trees for a living doesn't make them a safer climber than a recreational rim climber. Every time arbos get together there are stories tossed back and forth about some scary climber that was just seen. Maybe tree climbers have more luck than skill.



Your first line is brilliant.....none of us thought of that.

I don't know what isolated group of rock climbers you choose to associate with but..........go to Joshua tree, red river gorge, Zion, etc. on any given weekend and see how many wanna be climbers are trying out their new found, life purpose. I often get asked to rock climb with people and have seen hundreds of people with absolutely no training or skill rock climbing (without safety gear, other than a rope and saddle). How often does someone ask strangers to spend the weekend climbing doing tree work????? For some reason a lot of people view tree climbing as really dangerous and rock climbing as something anyone can do. Serious rock climbers are as much like the weekend clowns as professional arborist are like the weekend hacks. Most people who decide to do their own tree work, do it from the ground or use a ladder. Most people who decide to spend a weekend mountaineering or rock climbing do just that and you don't have to fall far to die.


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## xander9727 (Feb 1, 2005)

Which ever one kills you is more dangerous!


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## TREETX (Feb 1, 2005)

teressa green said:


> personally i dont climb unless theres some cash at the end of it ,



I've climbed on lots of things just to see the veiw from on top


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## scrapologist (Feb 1, 2005)

*danger*

its not the job or hobby. Its the sudden stop at the bottom that kills,
I leave all the climbing to the younsters now days, They bounce better.
Roger
Fremont,Ca USA


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## OutOnaLimb (Feb 1, 2005)

I talked to my groundie about this subject this morning, he is an avid rock climber who climbs at least once a week and is at the climbing gym at least twice a week. (usually on ladies night. Yes our climbing gym has a ladies night where they get in free, you should see all the hotties in spandex, but I digress) Kramers room mate is a professional climbing guide, and talked to him about this subject before. To quote his room mate trask, "its all about calculated risk." Most arborists I know dont take un-nessisary risks. Rock guys on the other had are always pushing the edge. and when I talk about rock guys Im talking about guys that do multi pitch lead climbs on clean faces on huge 2,000 ft slabs in Yosemite. If you make a mistake there and fall and all your protection blows out not only are you gonna be a greasy mess on the bottom of the mountain, but your partner is gonna be there right along side you. Like Kramer said, if you fall from a tree, the lawn is a lot softer than a tallus slope.

Kenn


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## DDM (Feb 1, 2005)

I'd Have to say For me it would be rock climbing Because i have no experience climbing them and no training.


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## J2Tree (Feb 2, 2005)

I would tend to agree with outonalimb as far as the calculated risk thing.


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## TimberMcPherson (Feb 2, 2005)

Depend if the people have the knowledge or skill to recognise all the risks they are calculating


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## Ax-man (Feb 2, 2005)

Off topic I know

Can someone explain what all the hoopla is all about when comes to this rock climbing. People ask me the same question all the time after doing their trees. " Do you also do rock climbing when your not climbing trees " my answer " Heck no, I have no desire to even try that."

My experience with rocks has never been a good one without my feet even having to leave the ground. I have had many blood blisters, smashed fingers, and some nasty cuts on my hands from just handling rocks, why a person would go climbing on the side of a rock is just beyond me.

Is it the fancy equipment that draws people into rec climbing of trees and big rocks, some kind of macho, daredevil image that is attached to using this equipment. What is the big deal here, I must be missing something. If it for the view when your done , I still don't get it, this guy is going to use the beaten path and hike up.

I have never climbed a tree for just the fun of it, it has always just been a way to make a living and nothing more. Maybe this is my problem, I dunno. 

Larry


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## MasterBlaster (Feb 2, 2005)

I think it would be fun to do, we don't have anything climbable around here.


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## jamie (Feb 2, 2005)

*tales*

ive been told that a good rock climber will make a good tree climber (maybe not a good arborist), but a good tree climber will lack the skills to be a good rock climber.

im enjoying climbing at an indoor wall and cant wait until the weather improves.

for me its not gadgets and gear (but i do like it all), its all about the challenege and figuring out problems.

jamie


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## NickfromWI (Feb 3, 2005)

I remember when I first started climbing trees. I would rarely use the rope. One day one of the other guys at work was watching me struggle my way up this elm lead that went up at about 45 degrees. He too was a rock climber. He was in the same tree and hollered over, "this isn't rock climbing...you can use the rope you know!"

I advanced leaps and bounds in my climbing skills that day!

love
nick


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## TimberMcPherson (Feb 3, 2005)

Ax-man said:


> Off topic I know
> 
> Can someone explain what all the hoopla is all about when comes to this rock climbing. People ask me the same question all the time after doing their trees. " Do you also do rock climbing when your not climbing trees " my answer " Heck no, I have no desire to even try that."
> 
> ...




Climbing is a physical and mental challenge, once climbing grades get more differcult there are few holds and only a few ways that a person can succeed in making the climb. Youve got the thought of falling to your death to motivate you and the limit of your strength and endurance which you have to manage by using good technique. (women have better technique to start with as they dont have the strength that men can fall back on to grunt up).

There is a certain thrill involved as the adrenaline gets pumping when you think your going to fall (or you actually do.) Rock climbing developed from mountaineering, its all about the challenge of getting up and down rather than being at the top.


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## canopychick (Feb 5, 2005)

jamie said:


> for me its not gadgets and gear (but i do like it all), its all about the challenege and figuring out problems.
> 
> jamie



Ditto! It's exciting, extremely physical, and a terrific challenge.


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## darkstar (Mar 1, 2005)

*.*

well having rock climbed for 20 years and been sponsered by several rock climbing companies; as well as tree climbing for about the same ; i couldnt help but respond .... tree climbing is freakin way more dangerous ...duh how many rock climbers have you seen carrying chainsaws ... ive been cut badly 6 months on crutches ,,, brusied - and in the er twice and have had 3 hernias tree climbing ... i broke my ankle once and pulled my a 1 pulley tendon in my poor little finger rock climbing ... rock climbing is so much safer ... every once in a while i encounter loose rock and thats alot like tree exposure .... either way from 20 years at both ,i vote tree climbing about 10 times to 1 more dangerous ....


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## JonnyHart (Mar 7, 2005)

Remember that add in TCI for arborwear(I know, there were a few). For climbing trees, rocks, or trees growing out of rocks.


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## Manco (Mar 7, 2005)

I've never been rock climbing,but running a chainsaw on the ground is inherently dangerous, not to mention being aloft in a tree. Sometimes I think I have beaten the law of averages as far as accidents go. Knock on wood, never had a bad accident.


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## Tom D. Wilson (Mar 8, 2005)

i started going to an in door wall just before i started collage - myboss said it was a good idea. i learnt the knots i use in tree climbing and its good exercise as well, but the technique is completly different, i got told that when rock climbing i climb like a gorrila coz i have a lot of upper body strength i just pul myself up which means that my arms get tired and i struggle on over hangs after i'v climbed a bit

And i 'v never heard of a cliff deciding its going to break of 5' up a topple in to some ones green house with someone climbing it.


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## TheTreeSpyder (Mar 8, 2005)

> What is more dangerous, rock climbing or tree climbing?



Falling is more dangerous than climbing by recent, government, tax paid polls :blob5:


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## jamie (Mar 8, 2005)

*to much arms*

tom ive been told that i do the same thing, im trying really crimpy routes to get myself out of the habit, i use my arms because i can.

the overhangs getcha all the time

jamie


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## ropensaddle (Feb 15, 2018)

In either case falling is the most dangerous, however; tree workers are utilizing sharp tools its a toss up i suppose.


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## teacherman (Feb 28, 2018)

I think it's hard to compare the two. Tree work is likely more dangerous in terms of potential for injury, because rock climbing is far easier to manage the risk level. Toprope vs lead, difficulty rating, trad vs sport. That said, rock climbing includes some very risky, reckless scenarios, and guys like http://www.alexhonnold.com/ take risks the mere thought of pucker up my gizzards, and I rode Harleys for years. I love rock climbing and tree climbing, and I hope to do both for many years to come.

Tree work has the added risk factor of close proximity to the tip of a chainsaw bar, upon which a sharp steel chain is moving at a high rate of speed...

Be safe out there!


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