# Any advice for using LumberMaker?



## Baron11 (May 9, 2006)

I realize many of you folks here have some form of a 'real' milling tool or set-up. I purchased this LumberMaker contraption in the hopes that I can salvage some boards from two old cherry trees that have been on my property longer than I have been alive. The trees are about 18" in diameter at most give or take a few inches depending the side of the tree you are looking at.

Any advice on best practices? I am not asking for advice on what to buy, I have already made the purchase. It may not be the best tool and it may take me a loooooong time to make lumber, I am simply asking what advice you have to offer to make the best of a potentially challenging situation. Thanks in advance.

Kind Regards,

Bryan


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## flht01 (May 9, 2006)

I'd start with suggesting a ripping chain to match the saw/bar combination your going to use. Having the right chain and keeping it _sharp_ makes a lot of difference. I have a 36" alaskan and have spent a lot of time making great looking firewood, until I started taking my time getting a straight guide beam setup, that is. :hmm3grin2orange: 

Maybe someone here with lumbermaker experience will step up.

Good luck and keep us posted,
kevin


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## coveredinsap (May 9, 2006)

The LumberMaker doesn't appear to me to be any better or worse than any other handheld chainsaw mill. It's just a matter of personal choice....vertical cutting or horizontal cutting.
About the only advice I can give you is that most cherry is hard stuff... harder than oak, so it will likely take a hefty cc chainsaw and (constantly sharpened) sharp chain to cut. Maybe not so bad, though if your logs are only 18" or so.

That...and keep your feet out of the way 

Take some pics so we can see how it goes.

By the way, I generally use a different chainsaw to freehand square up the top of the log on logs that are really irregular.


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## WRW (May 9, 2006)

Where you at in Va.?


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## Baron11 (May 9, 2006)

*Fredericksburg VA*

Hartwood area.

Regards,

Bryan


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## WRW (May 9, 2006)

OK, I'm close and have a bandmill. If it's 6' long (minimum), and if you want, we can mill it on that...N/C. I'll even throw in some end sealer.


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## BlueRidgeMark (May 9, 2006)

You guys are neighbors!


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## hautions11 (May 9, 2006)

*Lumbermaker*

I cut some nice oak quarterswan boards with a lumbermaker. Not as accurate as my Alaskan, but if you are carefull it does a nice job. Take a look at the picture attached. Doing 18" logs should be no problem. I do recommend the ripping chain. I use Bailey's.


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## woodshop (May 9, 2006)

I have to agree with Kevin, a good sharp chain is essential to any chainsaw milling but my best milling resulted when I took the extra time to set up a good strait solid guide beam. If the saw has a good solid strait guide, you will end up with strait milled boards. I cheat though, and use the 2 by 6 hollow aluminum guide bars that came with my Ripsaw for all my milling, alaskan included. I suppose you could adapt them to the lumbermaker, not sure. You can buy them on the Ripsaw website. A bit pricy, but they sure beat a 2x4 by a mile. 

Not sure what kind of cherry Sap is talking about there in California that is harder than oak. Here on the east coast, every cherry (prunus serotina) I ever milled was at least as easy going down the log if not easier than oaks of similar diameter. It tends to burn easier, get hot and thus the bandsaw blade starts to wander right away if not sharp, but oaks I've milled are usually tougher going.


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## Newfie (May 9, 2006)

woodshop said:


> Not sure what kind of cherry Sap is talking about there in California that is harder than oak. Here on the east coast, every cherry (prunus serotina) I ever milled was at least as easy going down the log if not easier than oaks of similar diameter. It tends to burn easier, get hot and thus the bandsaw blade starts to wander right away if not sharp, but oaks I've milled are usually tougher going.



Like wise experience in milling here, with csm and bandmill. Cherry is easier to mill than red or white oak.


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## Lakeside53 (May 10, 2006)

Newfie said:


> Like wise experience in milling here, with csm and bandmill. Cherry is easier to mill than red or white oak.




Same up here in Western WA. Easier then maple any day. Maybe Sap tried it with his 455.


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## CaseyForrest (May 10, 2006)

Ill jump on that wagon too, No way is cherry harder than oak.


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## Newfie (May 10, 2006)

With any of the csm type jigs, the key to a quality end result is the setup and the guide beam. But that's been said by others here already.


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## Finnbear (May 10, 2006)

coveredinsap said:


> About the only advice I can give you is that most cherry is hard stuff... harder than oak, .........



I've trimmed quite a few houses in both cherry and oak and unless you have some different cherry in CA, oak is always harder than cherry. As hardwoods go, cherry is relatively soft when compared to oak or maple or ash or hickory.
Finnbear


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## Baron11 (May 10, 2006)

*Personal experience.*

Ok, from my personal experience, I have worked with both seasoned cherry and seasoned oak. I have found that the cherry is much harder to work with. It has in the past smoked drill bits, oak, in my experience hasn't. Maybe when the trees are alive or just cut oak may well be harder, I don't know. The cherry trees in question did give my saw much more trouble than the oak did. Then again I cut the cherry trees down because they died. I cut the oak tree down because its roots decided they wanted to play practical jokes on me by plugging up the pipes in my septic system. So in short the cherry may have been harder because it was standing dead. The oak may have been easier because it was happily sucking up as much water as it could find and was quite green and quite alive.

Regards,

Bryan


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## Baron11 (May 10, 2006)

*WRW, wow thanks!!*



WRW said:


> OK, I'm close and have a bandmill. If it's 6' long (minimum), and if you want, we can mill it on that...N/C. I'll even throw in some end sealer.



WRW,

What an incredible gesture. I would love to take you up on your offer. I really appreciate it. I would be more than happy to work with your schedule and do anything I can to help out. Let me know what we can work out.

Thanks!!!!


Kindest Regards,

Bryan


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## WRW (May 10, 2006)

Look for a PM.


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## woodshop (May 10, 2006)

Baron11 said:


> Ok, from my personal experience, I have worked with both seasoned cherry and seasoned oak. I have found that the cherry is much harder to work with. It has in the past smoked drill bits, oak, in my experience hasn't.


Not to beat this to death, but again, the cherry I work with in my woodshop is definitely not as hard as the oak I work with. Either red or white. And I'm talking about dry seasoned cherry. Ripping a cherry board, or even running it through the planer, is generally easier on a softer wood like cherry or walnut, than the oaks. Is cherry harder to WORK WITH? ...you bet! Maybe this is what he is talking about. It's easy to butcher a piece of cherry on a band saw or table saw. If your blade is not very sharp, it will burn the wood in a heartbeat, just like hard maple will. Yes a drill bit will "smoke" in cherry if its not sharp or your rpms on that drill are too high, definitely will burn. Running a piece of cherry past a router bit on the router table same thing. If you hesitate for a second at one spot, it will leave a burn mark at that spot you will have to sand out, guaranteed. Unlike oak, cherry is not very forgiving to the woodworker. But as far as hardness goes, it's not as hard as oak, and in my humble opinion, is easier to mill than oak because it's generally a little softer, and thus easier going down the log. My woodcrafts made from cherry sure are beautiful when done right though, with that ray fleck that shimmers when the sun hits it just right, so its worth the trouble working with it. I love the sweet smell of it going through my saws also, too bad it's getting so expensive.


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## Sawyer Rob (May 10, 2006)

I also find cherry easier to saw than oak. I really enjoy sawing cherry when i harvest one out of my woodlot! For me, it's NOT harder on the bands than oak either..

Rob


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## Newfie (May 11, 2006)

Boy Rob, pictures of those cherry boards still give me a woody(so to speak). Sweet looking stuff. 


Cherry is easy to mill, difficult to machine in the woodshop after drying.


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## woodshop (May 11, 2006)

BEAUTIFUL cherry cant... assuming 8ft log, foot wide boards, looks like around 50 bd ft of knot free, defect free premium grade stuff there. Maybe little less on the one or two boards from the very center of the tree. If it's dried right, then S2S on the jointer/planer, that much premium cherry would cost you over $300 retail here on the east coast. $200 even if you went to the sawmill and talked them into letting you have it right off the saw, which they probably wouldn't let you have unless it was you that brought the log in to them. Gold, growing right there in your back yard.


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## Sawyer Rob (May 11, 2006)

The cant pictured above is 8'6" and is the "top log" out of the 29' log pictured below. It did turn out some very high quality lumber, and both are now sawn up and air drying on stickers.. I'm going to build some cabinets and trim out of the lumber for my own use..

Rob







My sawmill pictures http://albums.photo.epson.com/j/AlbumList?u=4378744


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## woodshop (May 11, 2006)

Speak of the devil... I subscibe to several woodworking mags, and in the Jun/July 2006 issue of WOOD Magazine (Better Homes and Gardens mag) that just came to my door, there is a 6 page articale all about how difficult cherry can be to work with in the shop, and lots of tips and tricks to deal with that. :deadhorse:


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## woodshop (May 11, 2006)

Rob I'm curious what you do with your smaller dia pieces of a cherry tree like that. With Oak, soft make, stuff that's pretty plentiful and I have a lot of, anything smaller than say 10 inches or so gets sawn into firewood. I like cherry so much though, that I take the time to slice even a 6-8 inches dia. I saw them down the center, then into rough 3x5 pieces 3 or 4 foot long on my resaw bandsaw that I kinda use as a mini-sawmill. Often the lumber is not the greatest after it dries and sometimes twists up a bit, but I can usually get at least an 8/4 board 4-5 inches wide, enough for some of the small stuff I make in the shop. Again, I only take the time to do that with cherry or something pretty special I don't get to see much.


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## Sawyer Rob (May 11, 2006)

This won't be the answer you want to hear, but i don't have a market for the little stuff, so as you can see, it ends up on the firewood pile.... But, every once in a while (not often) someone may ask for a small chunk, and i just give it to them.

Anyone wanna buy some???  

Rob


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## woodshop (May 11, 2006)

...no I understand completely. Even with cherry, there is a law of diminishing returns for me, and time is my most precious commodity at this point. As I said, I often turn 10-12 inch oak and other hardwoods into firewood because I have so much of it now that I can pick and choose, and only take something I can get a 12-14 inch wide board from after slabbing off the sapwood and bark. Cherry burns nice in a woodstove. Back when I was working for a pulpwood company as a logger and had a little business on the side selling firewood I had one customer who wanted only cherry. He liked the way it smelled in his fireplace.


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## aggiewoodbutchr (May 12, 2006)

Nice looking dog, Rob. Brittany? I'm assuming by the collar he's in training. What for?


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## aggiewoodbutchr (May 12, 2006)

Oh, and nice wood. I'm jealous. I'm hoping to tear into one of my big oaks this weekend.:greenchainsaw:


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## aggiewoodbutchr (May 12, 2006)

I would post an armed guard on that stack if I were you.


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## Baron11 (May 12, 2006)

*I am so jealous!!*

What beautiful wood. Makes me want to cut trees down for the wood instead of waiting for them to die. I do have another cherry that may or may not survive, so only time will tell. We have an older home, approx 90 or so years old, the cherries were about 50 or so, still bearing fruit, however it was pretty a cherry pit with skin! It kills me to cut these trees down, but paving the driveway is what I believe did them in. The pavers put down some type of pellets to kill vegetation in the gravel driveway. I asked if it would harm the trees and I was told no, it wouldn't. Maybe if the trees were younger or healthier, alas now I have to make lumber out of them. 

Any thoughts of digging some of the large roots up and cutting them to size with a bandsaw? I was told roots will give a burled type wood, but I am very new to this stuff. Any thoughts? I won't use the chainsaw on roots due to dirt, but the bandsaw should be fine for small pieces. Is a half inch blade good enough? I think that is as big as my Delta bandsaw goes. Just curious. 

Kind Regards,

Bryan


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## WRW (May 12, 2006)

Baron11 said:


> Any thoughts of digging some of the large roots up and cutting them to size with a bandsaw? I was told roots will give a burled type wood, but I am very new to this stuff. Any thoughts? I won't use the chainsaw on roots due to dirt, but the bandsaw should be fine for small pieces. Is a half inch blade good enough? I think that is as big as my Delta bandsaw goes. Just curious.
> 
> Kind Regards,
> 
> Bryan




Know any woodturners?


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## woodshop (May 12, 2006)

In the early 70's for whatever reason, black walnut prices went through the roof for a while there. I heard of a two huge walnut trees cut down in the middle of the night in a park in Ohio, quickly loaded onto a truck and stolen. Here in PA at the time, some loggers were pulling the stumps out with a skidder/dozer, to get the thick roots which made excellent gun stock wood. Never heard of anybody doing that to cherry though. Personally I'm not sure I would go that far even with cherry. Lot of work unless you are really going to be rewarded with something special and it's for yourself or friend. If you're doing that to sell it, gosh, how much is your time worth? Bandsaw blade will dull up quickly going through a dirty root just like chain. I'd take a high pressure washer to it first if you were going to go through all that trouble to get that root to your band saw. As for blade thickness, in the past I have resawn small logs (6 inch dia) on my 14" bandsaw with a half inch blade. It has to be something like a 3-6 tpi though or it will clog up with that wet wood real quick. Now I use a larger resaw band saw with a 1 inch blade. Be prepared to clean off the rubber tires on your bandsaw wheels afterwords also, as wet wood gums up them too. I get it off with a dull knife, like a table knife. I've also used a hard piece of wood, like osage orange with a sharp machined edge. For cleaning the residue and deposits off my blades, I carefully hold that knife against the side of the saw blade as its moving, being carefull not to get the knife up near the teeth of the blade. I KNOW... this is dangerous... if you don't know what you're doing you could lose a finger or two in a heartbeat. But its the fastest easiest way I know to clean my blades from caked on wet wood and gum deposits after cutting wet wood. I should probably put some kind of disclaimer here... FOLKS, Don't try this at home!!


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## Baron11 (May 12, 2006)

*Roots, Cherry*

No I wouldn't be selling it. I can see a pretty large root right on top of the ground at least 6" in diameter. I just wanted to know if it was worth digging up. I was thinking the same thing about the pressure washer, I have one and will do so, if the root is worth it. I don't plan on digging the entire root ball up. I will get what I can, cut the stump short, then rent a stump grinder and be done with it.

Has anyone worked with thick diameter cherry roots before? Is this where the burled wood comes from or is burled wood something else?

Regards,

Bryan


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## Newfie (May 13, 2006)

Burled wood comes from burls which are growths on trees, like a tumor. Some suggest they grow in response to a wound.


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## WRW (May 13, 2006)

Newfie said:


> Burled wood comes from burls which are growths on trees, like a tumor. Some suggest they grow in response to a wound.




Yes. I would tend to use the term "figured" to describe root flare to root ball.


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## woodshop (May 13, 2006)

Newfie said:


> Burled wood comes from burls which are growths on trees, like a tumor. Some suggest they grow in response to a wound.


Some research also suggests that burls form in response to a biological attack to the tree. One thing is sure, some of the figure produced by a burl is just beautiful. Wild grain going every which way. Hard to dry without it cracking and deforming, and can be hard to work in the shop. I started working on a small piece of burl once, that although it looked solid, quickly broke up into small pieces when I started machining it.


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## Newfie (May 13, 2006)

woodshop said:


> Some research also suggests that burls form in response to a biological attack to the tree.



I have heard that as well, but not enough to feel qualified to comment.


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## woodshop (May 14, 2006)

Newfie said:


> I have heard that as well, but not enough to feel qualified to comment.


well... never said I was qualified either:jester: I do remember a few tidbits from one of my dendro classes though. That was in late 70's, and at least back then they really weren't sure what caused burls. Not sure they are sure now. Did a quick google search just now, didn't come up with anything definitive. Maybe if I took the time to fine tune it. Oh well.


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