# Chain saw basics please



## davvyd (Sep 20, 2006)

well as a few of you have read, I am the new guy; know nothing about anything and am frantically trying to educate myself from your experience and knowledge. I own no mill, no chain saw infact I have never even seen saw milling done before. I just know that if facinates me. so here comes the bomb....
someone please tell me about chainsaw basics. motor type and size, bar size, chain size, teeth spacing or something. I have read a number of posts and am totally lost when you guys discuss your tools. HELP!!

example: 404 to 3/8 chain conversion by: hautions11 makes no sense to me at all!!


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## John Paul Sanborn (Sep 20, 2006)

What do you want to do with it?

The bigger the mill, the bigger the saw. I was supprised when I was told my 385 (~80cc engine) was too small for some mills. 

"that is best for 2 3120's"


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## oldsaw (Sep 20, 2006)

davvyd said:


> well as a few of you have read, I am the new guy; know nothing about anything and am frantically trying to educate myself from your experience and knowledge. I own no mill, no chain saw infact I have never even seen saw milling done before. I just know that if facinates me. so here comes the bomb....
> someone please tell me about chainsaw basics. motor type and size, bar size, chain size, teeth spacing or something. I have read a number of posts and am totally lost when you guys discuss your tools. HELP!!
> 
> example: 404 to 3/8 chain conversion by: hautions11 makes no sense to me at all!!



How close are you to Lansing? If it isn't too bad, maybe Casey Forrest could help get you started with a quick overview. Would be worth the drive no matter what part of the state you were from. He has a set-up and knows how to use it.

Saws to look for: Husky 385, 395, 3120...maybe on the 3120, it's a beast. Stihl 066, 660, 088 (see 3120 note). Actually any Stihl or Husky that is 80-100ccs would be a good start.

Mark


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## computeruser (Sep 20, 2006)

oldsaw said:


> How close are you to Lansing? If it isn't too bad, maybe Casey Forrest could help get you started with a quick overview. Would be worth the drive no matter what part of the state you were from. He has a set-up and knows how to use it.
> 
> Saws to look for: Husky 385, 395, 3120...maybe on the 3120, it's a beast. Stihl 066, 660, 088 (see 3120 note). Actually any Stihl or Husky that is 80-100ccs would be a good start.
> 
> Mark



I second that suggestion, and I'd assume that he'd be open to it, too. If you're anywhere near Lansing, you should come over our way and get a hands-on introduction. I've found that it is a lot easier to go over the "intro to saws" sort of stuff hands-on than in text.

Similarly, if you've got the time on October 7th, a bunch of us are getting together at Carvinmark's house in Frederick for some saw racing, some milling, stuff like that. It would be a great way to learn some stuff and meet some of the folks who are regularly on here. Plus, fall color should be in full swing up there by then.


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## oldsaw (Sep 20, 2006)

I thought about you after I hit "send", Mark.

Built in "support group" here.

Mark


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## l2edneck (Sep 20, 2006)

GROUPIESSSSSS

application,application,application 

Welcome aboard now run out double time and buy a saw!!!!!!!!!!!

Hurry b4 the oct7 GTG sos you can run it ..........


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## manual (Sep 20, 2006)

davvyd said:


> well as a few of you have read, I am the new guy; know nothing about anything and am frantically trying to educate myself from your experience and knowledge. I own no mill, no chain saw infact I have never even seen saw milling done before. I just know that if facinates me. so here comes the bomb....
> someone please tell me about chainsaw basics. motor type and size, bar size, chain size, teeth spacing or something. I have read a number of posts and am totally lost when you guys discuss your tools. HELP!!
> 
> example: 404 to 3/8 chain conversion by: hautions11 makes no sense to me at all!!



Take it slow. Don't dive in. 
Go shopping around talk to saw dealers. talk to people that use saws in your area. Maybe thay will let you try there saw out.
404 to 3/8 chain is how wide the cutters are on the chain.


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## flht01 (Sep 20, 2006)

davvyd said:


> well as a few of you have read, I am the new guy; know nothing about anything and am frantically trying to educate myself from your experience and knowledge. I own no mill, no chain saw infact I have never even seen saw milling done before. I just know that if facinates me. so here comes the bomb....
> someone please tell me about chainsaw basics. motor type and size, bar size, chain size, teeth spacing or something. I have read a number of posts and am totally lost when you guys discuss your tools. HELP!!
> 
> example: 404 to 3/8 chain conversion by: hautions11 makes no sense to me at all!!



If you have broadband access, there are a few good videos to watch on this site:
Granberg How-To Video's
These should give you the basics of how a chainsaw mill (csm) works. You've already made the most important first step, finding this site.
Kevin


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## woodshop (Sep 20, 2006)

davvyd said:


> someone please tell me about chainsaw basics. motor type and size, bar size, chain size, teeth spacing or something. I have read a number of posts and am totally lost when you guys discuss your tools. HELP!!


I think John Paul asked the right question. At least narrow it down for us by telling us what (if anything) you plan on DOING with a chainsaw. Will you be cutting firewood to heat your house? Will you be milling wood (cutting logs into rough lumber) for woodworking? There are as many options when buying a chainsaw as there are buying a car or truck. You wouldn't buy a tractor trailer just to run the kids to school, and you wouldn't buy a VW Beetle to carry 2000 lbs of wet heavy freshly milled oak boards. So, do you have any plans for a chainsaw?


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## TedChristiansen (Sep 20, 2006)

In addition to the "live" information sources here, there are some books that might be useful:

Wood and How to Dry It (Taunton Press)

Sawmilling for Woodworkers
http://www.sawmillingforwoodworkers.com/

You may not want to buy Logosol equipment, but there is still some interesting information there (check the forum as well): http://www.logosol.com 

Ted


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## CaseyForrest (Sep 20, 2006)

oldsaw said:


> How close are you to Lansing? If it isn't too bad, maybe Casey Forrest could help get you started with a quick overview. Would be worth the drive no matter what part of the state you were from. He has a set-up and knows how to use it.
> 
> Saws to look for: Husky 385, 395, 3120...maybe on the 3120, it's a beast. Stihl 066, 660, 088 (see 3120 note). Actually any Stihl or Husky that is 80-100ccs would be a good start.
> 
> Mark



I extended that offer to him via Email. I also told him about the GTG on the 7th.

David, there is a wealth of knowledge here, you came to the right place.

Give us some ideas about your expectations of starting out, and we will help you from there.


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## pyromaniac guy (Sep 20, 2006)

for all that posted info for the newbs in this thread (of which i am one. a newb, i mean.) thank you so much. i would have floundered around for ages looking for these links...


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## davvyd (Sep 21, 2006)

*Thank you to everyone!!!*

to everyone who replyed -- THANK YOU! this is one heck of a network. I think that i am interested in sawmilling for woodworking boards. I am so new to both areas, that i am not sure. I may take a couple of you up on getting together in lansing, to see some of your set ups. i will definitly check out the websites and books and hopefully understand what they are saying. Thanks everyone!


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## TedChristiansen (Sep 21, 2006)

Davyyd,

Since you are new to both woodworking and milling logs to lumber, let me offer some information. Woodworking is like anything else - start slow to see if you like it and have the aptitude for it, increasing your skill level continually. For me that is the enjoyment.

Starting Out
Most woodworkers starting out build things of boards/sheet goods in commonly available thicknesses, i.e. 1/4, 1/2, 3/4" plywoods, 3/4" boards. If you buy hardwoods from the big box stores, you will probably only find oak and poplar 3/4" thick at premium prices. It is cheaper to goto a hardwood retailer, select the boards you want and have them plane the boards to the thickness you want ($40/hr typically).

In order to use these boards, you really need:
1. Tablesaw
2. Jointer
3. Router

With these three tools you can build many different kinds of useful pieces. The next logical step would be to purchase a planar, so you can plane rough stock to the thickness you want, when you want. Then you will want to cut curves (bandsaw), so the next two tools you need are:

4. Planar
5. Bandsaw

Next you might want to include some turnings in your projects. That means a lathe.

6. Lathe

With these six tools you can build just about anything with creativity, patience and skill.

Now, where can milling your own lumber fit into this plan? Because the boards (from your mill) will be rough sawn and will warp and twist to some degree, you will need a planar in order to use them. I would suggest that you need tools 1-4 in the list above before you can use rough sawn lumber from a mill of your own. That is unless you have a friend who would plane the boards for you.

This is the order I purchased my tools in, and it has worked well for me. I got my mill after the bandsaw and dont have a lathe yet.

Ted


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## woodshop (Sep 21, 2006)

TedChristiansen said:


> The next logical step would be to purchase a planar, so you can plane rough stock to the thickness you want, when you want... Now, where can milling your own lumber fit into this plan? Because the boards (from your mill) will be rough sawn and will warp and twist to some degree, you will need a planar in order to use them. Ted



good post... like Ted says... with those three tools, tablesaw, jointer and planer you can take that rough milled lumber from your mill (after it has dried) and turn it into S4S (surfaced 4 sides) dimensioned lumber ready for your cherry corner cabinet. 
The method rough milled lumber to S4S is:
1) one surface on the jointer
2) plane that to thickness, now you have two surfaces
3) jointer again one edge, makes three surfaces
4) rip to width and crosscut to length on tablesaw... S4S
If this wasn't a chainsaw and milling forum, I'd post pics taking a rough milled board to S4S for those curious.


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## flht01 (Sep 21, 2006)

woodshop said:


> ...
> If this wasn't a chainsaw and milling forum, I'd post pics taking a rough milled board to S4S for those curious.



Come'on Dave, you know we like pictures  I'm sure there's quite a few of us that would like to see some of the steps used to create finished lumber from the dried rough cut stuff. I know I would. I might even be able to justify a few more tools 

Just thought I'd add a few comments:
In my opinion, discussing/showing techniques used to process milled lumber is on topic and is a very important step in learning the _milling and sawmill_ process. Being able to dry the wood and create useable S4S lumber is essential and I'd like to see it discussed. If it ends up not being allowed here, I'd really appreciate a link or two to sites where it is discussed.


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## manual (Sep 22, 2006)

woodshop said:


> good post... like Ted says... with those three tools, tablesaw, jointer and planer you can take that rough milled lumber from your mill (after it has dried) and turn it into S4S (surfaced 4 sides) dimensioned lumber ready for your cherry corner cabinet.
> The method rough milled lumber to S4S is:
> 1) one surface on the jointer
> 2) plane that to thickness, now you have two surfaces
> ...



See davvyd, I told you to take it slow. Now everybody is spending your retirement fund.
Hear that giant sucking sound? It's this site pulling you in.


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## CaseyForrest (Sep 22, 2006)

Manual is right, Ive bought more stuff just because of AS.


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## aggiewoodbutchr (Sep 22, 2006)

CaseyForrest said:


> Manual is right, Ive bought more stuff just because of AS.




Yup, it's got me too.


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## oldsaw (Sep 23, 2006)

aggiewoodbutchr said:


> Yup, it's got me too.



Ahh, nope, not me...I haven't got sucked it yet...this place doesn't make me want to buy anything...:blush: 

Did it work? did you believe me?

Mark


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## l2edneck (Sep 23, 2006)

Broke since the day i joined :bang:


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## toolfreak (Sep 23, 2006)

aggiewoodbutchr said:


> Yup, it's got me too.



Im with ya!


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## woodshop (Sep 23, 2006)

...just bought a Maxx grinder (thanks for the input aggie), a breaker/spinner combo and a couple hundred feet of chain... dropped $800+ that quick... am I addicted? YOU BET!!!... after one day milling oak or cherry do I bring home a minimum of $500 worth of hardwood to feed my woodshop? YOU BET!!! Hey it all comes out in the wash gentlemen (and ladies?). Gotta spend money to make/save money.


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## aggiewoodbutchr (Sep 23, 2006)

woodshop said:


> ...just bought a Maxx grinder (thanks for the input aggie), a breaker/spinner combo and a couple hundred feet of chain... dropped $800+ that quick... am I addicted? YOU BET!!!... after one day milling oak or cherry do I bring home a minimum of $500 worth of hardwood to feed my woodshop? YOU BET!!! Hey it all comes out in the wash gentlemen (and ladies?). Gotta spend money to make/save money.



 Any time! 

Well said as always.


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