# Hey Joat / THall



## blsnelling (Mar 16, 2010)

What supposed to be wrong with that 066? Two broken cylinder fins? Not when I shipped it. And you think you can just send it back with no discussion at all? I don't think so. First of all, it had no broken fins. Second of all, you bought a used saw. It's yours now. And claiming that two broken fins will lead to a "quick overheat and death"? Where'd you pull that out of, because it's certainly not true. Had I actually sent you a defective cylinder, I would simply replace it. The saw is yours plain and simple.

See, I told you guys he was up to no good. No, I don't like bringing this into the open forum. But Joat already did that when he bought the saw. You guys deserve to know the truth.


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## blsnelling (Mar 16, 2010)

Further more, you've had someone else working on the saw. It's not my baby any more.


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## STEVEGODSEYJR (Mar 16, 2010)

Someone is in trouble!! Stick it to them Brad!!! You will always run into people like that on the net. What a sucky deal!! Steve


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## 04ultra (Mar 16, 2010)

blsnelling said:


> What supposed to be wrong with that 066? *Two broken cylinder fins? Not when I shipped it. *And you think you can just send it back with no discussion at all? I don't think so. First of all, it had no broken fins. Second of all, you bought a used saw. It's yours now. And claiming that two broken fins will lead to a "quick overheat and death"? Where'd you pull that out of, because it's certainly not true. Had I actually sent you a defective cylinder, I would simply replace it. The saw is yours plain and simple.
> 
> See, I told you guys he was up to no good. No, I don't like bringing this into the open forum. But Joat already did that when he bought the saw. You guys deserve to know the truth.







blsnelling said:


>




Looks like it was when you shipped it .....


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## blsnelling (Mar 16, 2010)

04ultra said:


> Looks like it was when you shipped it .....



Hmmm. Looks like you might be right. My mistake. But since when will that lead to a "quick and early death"? I still stand by posting this thread. Your intention all along was to find something wrong with this saw, with full intentions of returning it. That's not going to happen. You bought it, it's your saw. If it's determined that the cylinder needs replaced, I will do so.


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## spacemule (Mar 16, 2010)

04ultra said:


> Looks like it was when you shipped it .....



Oh snap!


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## 04ultra (Mar 16, 2010)

Page 18 of your thread ........


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## spacemule (Mar 16, 2010)

blsnelling said:


> Hmmm. Looks like you might be right. My mistake.


You expect us to believe you mistakenly thought there were no broken fins? This from someone who modifies saws and goes through them in excruciating detail? 
Then, you have the nerve to ##### about the buyer being upset? What kind of a "christian" are you?


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## ZeroJunk (Mar 16, 2010)

Ooops.


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## STEVEGODSEYJR (Mar 16, 2010)

DAMN Ultra you have an eagle eye!!!:jawdrop: Steve


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## blsnelling (Mar 16, 2010)

spacemule said:


> You expect us to believe you mistakenly thought there were no broken fins? This from someone who modifies saws and goes through them in excruciating detail?
> Then, you have the nerve to ##### about the buyer being upset? What kind of a "christian" are you?





ZeroJunk said:


> Ooops.





STEVEGODSEYJR said:


> DAMN Ultra you have an eagle eye!!!:jawdrop: Steve


He knew this when he bought it, and this was his plan! I honestly do not recall the chips at all. Those little chips are completely inconsequential.



04ultra said:


> Page 18 of your thread ........


Like I said, you are correct. I'm sure Joat saw that before ever buying and this was the plan all along. I KNEW there was a plan, I was just stupid enough to fall for it. Lots of you guys warned me.

I'm 100% positive that those small chips will have no affect what so ever on the life of the saw. If it's Toms professional opinion that it needs replaced, I will do so. But you bought the saw Joat. You'r not going to jerk me around like this, and try to return the saw without any discussion what so ever!


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## 04ultra (Mar 16, 2010)

Was not broken in your first post when you got it ....





.


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## blsnelling (Mar 16, 2010)

spacemule said:


> Was not broken in your first post when you got it .....



Read the thread Steve. If you did, you'd know that I replaced that cylinder because it could not be used with the Meteor piston. Is was ported for the Wiseco piston that had wider skirts, making it no longer serviceable with any other piston.


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## blsnelling (Mar 16, 2010)

It's quite obvious that I've jumped from the frying pan into the fire. I'm off to a couple of Dr appointments. I'm sure this thread will be 20 pages long in short order. 

I stand by my comments above.


I honestly did not realize those chips were there. Even if I had, the cylinder causes me no concerns. I'd use it on my own saws.
I'm 100% confident this was all planned. It was obvious something was up in Joats initial thread.
If it is determined the the cylinder is indeed compromised and needs replaced, I will do so.


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## 04ultra (Mar 16, 2010)

blsnelling said:


> Read the thread Steve. If you did, you'd know that I replaced that cylinder because it could not be used with the Meteor piston. Is was ported for the Wiseco piston that had wider skirts, making it no longer serviceable with any other piston.



Im just showing the pictures you posted.....When you got the saw they were there .........When you replaced that cylinder there were broken fins on the replacement cylinder ........Just helping you support your first post in this thread....


.






.


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## spacemule (Mar 16, 2010)

blsnelling said:


> He knew this when he bought it, and this was his plan! I honestly do not recall the chips at all. Those little chips are completely inconsequential.



If I paid $750 for a saw, you can bet your arse I'd not want there to be any "little chips" off of the cylinder. Those cooling fins aren't there just for looks. 

Furthermore, to say that joat just wanted to buy the saw to return it is ridiculous. The saw is damaged. Own up to it like a man.


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## Maldeney (Mar 16, 2010)

This is going to be ugly! I bet it is closed within the day if not deleted!



opcorn:opcorn:


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## spacemule (Mar 16, 2010)

What disgusts me is this went from:


there were no broken fins when I had it
after photographic proof was posted, it's not my responsibility because another mechanic looked at it
the chips don't matter, and I didn't notice them. I'd use them myself.

I, however, would never accuse a seller of being sleazy and dishonest. I just wonder if the offer of a replacement cylinder would have been forthcoming had there been no pictures. Somehow I doubt it.


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## fredmc (Mar 16, 2010)

OMG! WTF!...the saga continues...


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## Tzed250 (Mar 16, 2010)

Wow


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## fredmc (Mar 16, 2010)

spacemule said:


> What disgusts me is this went from:
> 
> 
> there were no broken fins when I had it
> ...



:agree2:


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## mtngun (Mar 16, 2010)

Sounds like Joat is playing games. Must be nice to have money to play games with expensive saws. Joat, don't you have something more constructive to do with your money ?

My take is that Joat paid for a used, but carefully rebuilt saw, and that's what he got. Two broken cooling fins are not a reflection on Brad's workmanship. Joat did not pay for a brand new saw with warranty. 

Unfortunately for Brad, since Joat paid through Paypal, Joat could file a complaint against Brad and it's probably more trouble than it's worth to fight it.

In the future, I would not do business with Joat.


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## radoutdoors (Mar 16, 2010)

I'm just wondering why Four days ago Mr. Snelling was complaining about the 084 that he got and now he sells a saw for $750 that is supposed to be almost perfect and the fins are busted. That's a used cylinder on the saw and he has a right to be angry about paying that much and not getting what he wanted especially from someone who expects that everything he gets is perfect. JUST TIRED OF ALL THE COMPLAINING.


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## belgian (Mar 16, 2010)

spacemule said:


> If I paid $750 for a saw, you can bet your arse I'd not want there to be any "little chips" off of the cylinder. Those cooling fins aren't there just for looks.
> 
> Furthermore, to say that joat just wanted to buy the saw to return it is ridiculous. The saw is damaged. Own up to it like a man.



Space, I recommend you keep quite untill you know what the claim really is. You are judging and don't even know what the buyer claims, except for hearsay from the seller.


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## spacemule (Mar 16, 2010)

mtngun said:


> Sounds like Joat is playing games. Must be nice to have money to play games with expensive saws. Joat, don't you have something more constructive to do with your money ?
> 
> My take is that Joat paid for a used, but carefully rebuilt saw, and that's what he got. Two broken cooling fins are not a reflection on Brad's workmanship. Joat did not pay for a brand new saw with warranty.
> 
> ...


How carefully could the saw have been rebuilt if the seller doesn't even notice broken cooling fins?


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## PB (Mar 16, 2010)

Wow, I didn't see this coming.


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## THALL10326 (Mar 16, 2010)

Dayummmmmmm look at this. Facts are facts, the saw is not as it was described, whether by mistake or on purpose makes no differance. I personally called Stihl and asked about these missing fins. They say one missing fin maybe, two is very iffy, they don't recomend cylinders with two broken fins. 

So its plain and simple, the saw needs to go back where it came from and money needs to be refunded. Nothing more needs to be said...


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## spacemule (Mar 16, 2010)

belgian said:


> Space, I recommend you keep quite untill you know what the claim really is. You are judging and don't even know what the buyer claims, except for hearsay from the seller.


When have you ever known me to keep quiet?


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## mtngun (Mar 16, 2010)

04ultra said:


> Page 18 of your thread ........


 
WHICH ONLY PROVES THAT BRAD DID NOT HIDE ANYTHING. THAT JOAT KNEW WHAT HE WAS BUYING. NO DECEPTION, NO FALSE ADVERTISING. 

If this goes to a formal Paypal complaint, all Brad has to do is show Paypal the pictures and his arse is covered.


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## spacemule (Mar 16, 2010)

THALL10326 said:


> Dayummmmmmm look at this. Facts are facts, the saw is not as it was described, whether by mistake or on purpose makes no differance. I personally called Stihl and asked about these missing fins. They say one missing fin maybe, two is very iffy, they don't recomend cylinders with two broken fins.
> 
> So its plain and simple, the saw needs to go back where it came from and money needs to be refunded. Nothing more needs to be said...


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## PB (Mar 16, 2010)

spacemule said:


> When have you ever known me to keep quiet?



When there is a REAL woman in the room. Just look at your feet and kick the dirt.


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## mtngun (Mar 16, 2010)

THALL10326 said:


> the saw is not as it was described, whether by mistake or on purpose makes no differance.


The saw was described by pictures and the pictures show broken fins. I say the buyer knew what he was buying.


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## procarbine2k1 (Mar 16, 2010)

ABSOLUTE BS! I can't believe what I am reading, is it April 1st already? I am one that keeps to my own, but I am floored!!!

Brad, if you don't see something wrong with this picture- you are absolutely NUTS. I thought the transaction seemed fishy from the get go- but whatever their intentions... you sold them a saw with two broken cylinder fins. And you have the nerve to stand up and defend your position? You don't have one!
The saw was busted before you sent it out, and what I still can't get over is that you can say that it wasn't like that when it shipped. Someone called you out on that, and proved you wrong.
Like SpaceMule said, how in the heck did you not notice the broken cylinder fins? Especially with your so called "OCD." My arse, be a man and make this deal right. I will be interested to see how much more port work you do after this transaction...
And why did I chime in? I take this one personal. I just bought a saw on ebay, with broken cylinder fins that were not described in the auction. YA KNOW WHAT EBAY DID? Shoved it back down the seller's throat and made them pay for it.

I don't know what else to say. I am floored. You are spitting in every single person's face on the board, that has ever went to bat for you.


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## belgian (Mar 16, 2010)

THALL10326 said:


> So its plain and simple, the saw needs to go back where it came from and money needs to be refunded. Nothing more needs to be said...



If the statement of Stihl is to be taken as professional advice, which cannot be contested, the seller also can offer to replace the broken part free of charge, which he already did in a previous post.

Seems also a fair compromise to me.


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## landyboy (Mar 16, 2010)

This is going to get very ugly very quickly.
opcorn:opcorn:opcorn:opcorn:


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## 04ultra (Mar 16, 2010)

mtngun said:


> The saw was described by pictures and the pictures show broken fins. I say the buyer knew what he was buying.





blsnelling said:


> What supposed to be wrong with that 066? *Two broken cylinder fins? Not when I shipped it.* And you think you can just send it back with no discussion at all? I don't think so. First of all, it had no broken fins. Second of all, you bought a used saw. It's yours now. And claiming that two broken fins will lead to a "quick overheat and death"? Where'd you pull that out of, because it's certainly not true. Had I actually sent you a defective cylinder, I would simply replace it. The saw is yours plain and simple.


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## DANOAM (Mar 16, 2010)

belgian said:


> If the statement of Stihl is to be taken as professional advice, which cannot be contested, the seller also can offer to replace the broken part free of charge, which he already did in a previous post.
> 
> Seems also a fair compromise to me.



+1 
Sounds fair to me

This whole deal stunk from the start IMO


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## belgian (Mar 16, 2010)

landyboy said:


> This is going to get very ugly very quickly.
> opcorn:opcorn:opcorn:opcorn:



not necessarily.


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## sawinredneck (Mar 16, 2010)

Well, I'm not drunk yet, so I can't properly respond right now. I'll get to drinking so I can write a decent reply, see you in a few hours.


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## teatersroad (Mar 16, 2010)

damn..


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## gink595 (Mar 16, 2010)

blsnelling said:


> Further more, you've had someone else working on the saw. It's not my baby any more.



I find this comical but I know you aren't joking, which is even funnier. If you had bought a saw off of Joat and had these problems, you'd be MF'in him up and down. I think you have a attitude that you do no wrong, that what ever you do and say should be accepted. You sold him a Bum saw for a big price, no one else did that but you, own up to YOUR mistakes for once, it's always someone elses doings never yours, I think people are catching on rather quickly. Refund his money already and quite while your ahead. Doesn't PayPal have some insurance for deals like this.


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## blackoak (Mar 16, 2010)

sawinredneck said:


> Well, I'm not drunk yet, so I can't properly respond right now. I'll get to drinking so I can write a decent reply, see you in a few hours.


Bottoms up sawin, I look forward to your post. LOL


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## DANOAM (Mar 16, 2010)

belgian said:


> not necessarily.



Most of the ugliness will come from the peanut gallery. Maybe this should not have been posted in the public forum but that is neither here nor there now. Oh well, get it settled and let this thread die.


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## Donley (Mar 16, 2010)

DANOAM said:


> Most of the ugliness will come from the peanut gallery. Maybe this should not have been posted in the public forum but that is neither here nor there now. Oh well, get it settled and let this thread die.




sad to say but i agree.


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## swamprat46 (Mar 16, 2010)

One of the best things my father left me with was small bits of wisdom and wit. "It's a poor day when you don't learn something" comes to mind. Applied not only to the party of the first part and the party of the second part, but the audience as well.

John


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## spacemule (Mar 16, 2010)

DANOAM said:


> Most of the ugliness will come from the peanut gallery. Maybe this should not have been posted in the public forum but that is neither here nor there now. Oh well, get it settled and let this thread die.



I call them like I see them. Interesting to note I had negative rep within 30 seconds of posting in this thread.


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## thomas72 (Mar 16, 2010)

This is not a chainsaw forum anymore. It is a used tampon forum. I really enjoy the threads that deal with problem shooting chainsaws, and looking at the engineering of the old and new models. Things that increase knowledge. This "Not wanting to call people out" is crap. When I have problems you think I go sobbing to other people and try to make the other side look bad. Not no, but hell no! Most of the people on here that post these threads have the mentality of a two year old it seems. This has no merit to me at all. Here is a little post about a rant of a rant.


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## mtngun (Mar 16, 2010)

belgian said:


> If the statement of Stihl is to be taken as professional advice, which cannot be contested, the seller also can offer to replace the broken part free of charge, which he already did in a previous post.



He could offer to replace the broken part -- with another *USED* OEM jug, not a brand new jug. The saw was not advertised to have a brand new jug.

Since when are *USED* saws required to meet all Stihl standards and specifications ? ? ? I call BS on that. 

Gee, none of the used saws that I have purchased were perfect, nor did I expect them to be perfect. If the seller got the saw that Brad showed in his pictures, then he got what he paid for.

Let's not forget that Brad tried to discourage Joat from purchasing the saw. Joat INSISTED that he wanted the used saw, and wouldn't take no for an answer.


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## DANOAM (Mar 16, 2010)

spacemule said:


> I call them like I see them. Interesting to note I had negative rep within 30 seconds of posting in this thread.



Nothing wrong with posting, just sayin that this maybe should not have been brought up in the forum and just handled between the involved parties, but it's out now so it is what it is.


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## stihl sawing (Mar 16, 2010)

This should all have been done by telephone anyway. Dealing with it out in the open like this will only bring harder feelings.


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## wooddog (Mar 16, 2010)

Sir's I looked at the pictures of the 066 when in trader section and didn't see the broken fins either. Should I be at fault because I didn't see it in the picture and the seller never said a word in the description to bring it to my attention. Makes me wonder what else is hidden inside we don't have a clue on?


BROKEN FINS should be in the description of the saw being sold.


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## wooddog (Mar 16, 2010)

procarbine2k1 said:


> ABSOLUTE BS! I can't believe what I am reading, is it April 1st already? I am one that keeps to my own, but I am floored!!!
> 
> Brad, if you don't see something wrong with this picture- you are absolutely NUTS. I thought the transaction seemed fishy from the get go- but whatever their intentions... you sold them a saw with two broken cylinder fins. And you have the nerve to stand up and defend your position? You don't have one!
> The saw was busted before you sent it out, and what I still can't get over is that you can say that it wasn't like that when it shipped. Someone called you out on that, and proved you wrong.
> ...




:agree2::agree2::agree2::agree2::agree2:


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## belgian (Mar 16, 2010)

mtngun said:


> He could offer to replace the broken part -- with another *USED* OEM jug, not a brand new jug. The saw was not advertised to have a brand new jug.
> 
> Since when are *USED* saws required to meet all Stihl standards and specifications ? ? ? I call BS on that.
> 
> ...



You and I can think what we want, it's up to the buyer and seller to find an agreement. The saw had obviously hidden defects, and these defects can cause major trouble, as confirmed by the manufacterer.

The buyer in such case should have the right to sent the saw back, or accept a compromise offered by the seller(replacement, discount, etc). If they can't find a compromise, then the saw should go back.


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## gink595 (Mar 16, 2010)

mtngun said:


> He could offer to replace the broken part -- with another *USED* OEM jug, not a brand new jug. The saw was not advertised to have a brand new jug.
> 
> Since when are *USED* saws required to meet all Stihl standards and specifications ? ? ? I call BS on that.
> 
> ...



Do you think Joat would have thrown out 7 bones for a saw that had been advertised as having broken fins... If you do the answer would be NO he wouldn't have, no one would've. Thats plain stupid if he would've have paid that for a saw. Well maybe you would according to your above statement, you guys can deep throat as much as you like but it is spelled out pretty clearly in the pics that it was broken when Brad had it and I looked at the advertisment when it was for sale and recall nothing about the fins broke. For 700.00 I would expect a Immaculate saw in prestine condition.


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## TRI955 (Mar 16, 2010)

This needs to be done through PM's or over the phone.....this is embarrassing.

Mike


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## blsnelling (Mar 16, 2010)

I honestly did not know the fins were broken. Even Tom said he would not have noticed them had someone else not pointed it out. But they're there. It was not my intention to mislead anyone. For that I apologize. I also apologize for starting this thread. 

Joat, you're welcome to return the saw. I will return your money, and an additional $25 for return shipping.


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## wooddog (Mar 16, 2010)

blsnelling said:


> I honestly did not know the fins were broken. Even Tom said he would not have noticed them had someone else not pointed it out. But they're there. It was not my intention to mislead anyone. For that I apologize. I also apologize for starting this thread.
> 
> Joat, you're welcome to return the saw. I will return your money, and an additional $25 for return shipping.


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## gink595 (Mar 16, 2010)

:agree2:


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## Banacanin (Mar 16, 2010)

spacemule said:


> How carefully could the saw have been rebuilt if the seller doesn't even notice broken cooling fins?



Are you leading us somewhere space?

Space's britches are now big enough for him to comment on someone's competencies!:jawdrop:

Absolutely the only thing I have learned from all these threads is not to sell to anyone on this site without realizing that this BS will happen eventually. Brad says that he did not notice the missing fins, and people don't believe that it is mere chance or coincidence that it was overlooked. 

Here is a coincidence to ponder. On Friday Tommy wrote about how it is inappropriate to air grievances about deals that have gone awry UNLESS they are deals that went awry on this site. I think it is terribly coincidental that he spelled out that exception only days before it was exercised.

If you doubt one coincidence, why not the other?


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## volks-man (Mar 16, 2010)

blsnelling said:


> I honestly did not know the fins were broken. Even Tom said he would not have noticed them had someone else not pointed it out. But they're there. It was not my intention to mislead anyone. For that I apologize. I also apologize for starting this thread.
> 
> Joat, you're welcome to return the saw. I will return your money, and an additional $25 for return shipping.



problem solved.
this thread should now be *locked* down 
and the details sewn up in PMs.


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## gink595 (Mar 16, 2010)

Why??? Who are we trying to protect?


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## sawinredneck (Mar 16, 2010)

And now we can have peace and happiness reign over us again! YAY!


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## landyboy (Mar 16, 2010)

Good effort


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## volks-man (Mar 16, 2010)

gink595 said:


> Why??? Who are we trying to protect?



protect? everyone who has to read this drivel. 

i am not taking sides:

honestly, a refund and shipping refund to boot? doesn't matter who is at fault or who intended to do what. it is over for the spectaters and the details can be done off a public forum.


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## WoodChuck'r (Mar 16, 2010)

I'm going to do my best not to get involved - but I know I'm just shooting myself in the foot by making this one post. But I have purchasing experience with the seller being called out in this thread so I figured I could briefly describe how I feel....

I have purchased 2 saws from Brad in the past 4 months. The first saw was the Solo 681, and more recently was the MS260. I have not had a problem with Brad or the item in question for sale on either occasion. I do ask him lot's of questions before and after the purchase - but that's not because there is a trust issue, it's because I don't really understand a saw mechanically as well as he does. He is informative, honest, and he backs up his saws and his work. I'm quite certain that if there was a mistake on his end (with any saw he sells to anyone) he will make it right. 

I'm not defending "poor little Bradley" for those that think I'm doing so. I'm just sharing how well each transaction went and how I was not disappointed with anything. It's an opinion obviously - but it's an objective fact as well.

Whatever ended up going down in this purchase / sale is rather unfortunate. I'm not calling out anyone, or point a finger in any direction. But I have some experience with dealing with Brad - and I'd say that for him to sell shotty equipment or a saw he does not feel good about it's highly unlikely...

I'm *not* speaking *for* Brad, or *against* THall. I'm speaking for myself and telling my buying experiences with Brad. Each time I have dealt with him it was a pleasure doing so. I would be more than happy to buy from him again even after this thread. Like I said, if there was something wrong, and it was his doing, he'll do what is necessary to make it right between him and the buyer.

Some can quote me and argue, but this will be my only post in this thread. I hope I'm not adding to the fire. If I did, I apologize. Those who wish to flame me are more than welcome to do so. But they will not get a response.


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## KMB (Mar 16, 2010)

stihl sawing said:


> This should all have been done by telephone anyway. Dealing with it out in the open like this will only bring harder feelings.





TRI955 said:


> This needs to be done through PM's or over the phone.....this is embarrassing.
> 
> Mike



:agree2:

Kevin


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## Diesel Pro (Mar 16, 2010)

*Is this a used saw or a show piece?*

I'd like to see just how much of the fin(s) is actually chipped off. Yes Stihl would probably say no go with 2 fins missing, but that's a lot of fin if the entire fin is missing. From the looks in the pics it's far from perfect, but minimal loss of cooling capacity.

If I had a use for and owned it I'd run it as is.

If I was Brad I'd choose my customers more wisely.

Human error, he did not consider the fins to be a detriment as they were. Lesson learned: photo every part from every angle and document every nick, scratch etc.

Biggest key here is that he manned up and offered to take care of it which I feel is above and beyond...


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## Fish (Mar 16, 2010)

Why take it off the forum now, the Chainsaw forum has adopted the Jerry Springer motiff, it should stay with it.

If it was thrown out into this public forum, then it is fair game for the
whole forum to chime in on, no matter the end result.

The "good of the forum" rhetoric is silly, because if that were true, these
silly threads would not be allowed in the first place.

I advocated keeping them out a long time ago, as it just gets ugly, but if it is
allowed, then both sides should be treated fairly, with no preference to
seniority, sponsorships, or popularity.

Ending it early makes no sense at this point, just wish we could have more
details leading up to this thread.

This Chainsaw Detective thing is kind of fun too!!!!!


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## Tzed250 (Mar 16, 2010)

That was quick.


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## mtngun (Mar 16, 2010)

gink595 said:


> Do you think Joat would have thrown out 7 bones for a saw that had been advertised as having broken fins... If you do the answer would be NO he wouldn't have, no one would've. Thats plain stupid if he would've have paid that for a saw. Well maybe you would according to your above statement, you guys can deep throat as much as you like but it is spelled out pretty clearly in the pics that it was broken when Brad had it and I looked at the advertisment when it was for sale and recall nothing about the fins broke. For 700.00 I would expect a Immaculate saw in prestine condition.


No RATIONAL person would have paid that much for a used 066 AND also paid Thall to install an OEM piston and new filter cover. For the money, you could have just as well bought a new saw with warranty, so why bother with a used saw ? 

It was obvious from the get-go that Joat was playing games. Call out Brad in public to force Brad to sell the saw to Joat against Brad's better judgement. Brad looks like a meanie unless he agrees to sell the saw to Joat. 

Then Joat finds a minor imperfection -- I wouldn't have lost an iota of sleep over 2 broken fins -- and makes a stink about it.

Brad's only mistake was falling into the trap.

Brad, in the future, trust your instincts. You've been dragged through the mud, and that was the plan all along.

BTW Brad, if you want to sell that defective jug, I'm looking for a used OEM jug, and the broken fins don't bother me if the price is right.


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## FATGUY (Mar 16, 2010)

blsnelling said:


> I honestly did not know the fins were broken. Even Tom said he would not have noticed them had someone else not pointed it out. But they're there. It was not my intention to mislead anyone. For that I apologize. I also apologize for starting this thread.
> 
> Joat, you're welcome to return the saw. I will return your money, and an additional $25 for return shipping.



Way to man up, that's being a lot more kind than I would have been...


----------



## Donley (Mar 16, 2010)

blsnelling said:


> I honestly did not know the fins were broken. Even Tom said he would not have noticed them had someone else not pointed it out. But they're there. It was not my intention to mislead anyone. For that I apologize. I also apologize for starting this thread.
> 
> Joat, you're welcome to return the saw. I will return your money, and an additional $25 for return shipping.




but now your out $30 in the grand scheme of things.


----------



## teacherman (Mar 16, 2010)

*Are we not men? We are Devo......*

If we wish to use the internet to resolve our business/interpersonal issues, I believe it is called Skype. Email works, too.

The AS community is an important functional and interpersonal resource for us all. Stihl doesn't want us to be able to fix our own saws. We need AS and the help it provides. Division and mistrust can result from abusing this forum, leaving us all much poorer, merely for the sake of personal venting and vicarious entertainment. There are many instances of people "getting over" on one another, and we need to be able to trust in the goodwill of other members of the community. In this way, AS gives us a refuge from the predatory avarice that infects our society to the core. That is more valuable than we know, and it is the duty of each of us to uphold it with integrity.

Now, if any of the fellows in the group hug (that looks sooo diseased) still have ßºner$, they need to take care of that in private, lest they risk "screwing" up the whole AS community, in my opinion.


----------



## Fish (Mar 16, 2010)

mtngun said:


> No RATIONAL person would have paid that much for a used 066 AND also paid Thall to install an OEM piston and new filter cover. For the money, you could have just as well bought a new saw with warranty, so why bother with a used saw ?
> 
> It was obvious from the get-go that Joat was playing games. Call out Brad in public to force Brad to sell the saw to Joat against Brad's better judgement. Brad looks like a meanie unless he agrees to sell the saw to Joat.
> 
> ...



What threads held all of these former discussions? Just so those of this
that don't read all of this stuff can get caught up to speed....


----------



## Racerboy832 (Mar 16, 2010)

Can I have the Old Cylinder and Piston. I'm poor. Heck 10 min with the tig welder it'll have both fins on.


----------



## blackoak (Mar 16, 2010)

DANOAM said:


> Nothing wrong with posting, just sayin that this maybe should not have been brought up in the forum and just handled between the involved parties, but it's out now so it is what it is.


Yes I think the place need a new forum. "The Entertainment Drama Soap Opera Forum" for BS like this. No actually this crap shouldn't be allowed on this site. Take it to the www.daysofourlife forum where it belongs. Both parties should be ashamed for bringing crap onto this board and degrading it.


----------



## barneyrb (Mar 16, 2010)

spacemule said:


> When have you ever known me to keep quiet?



Yep, Grand daddy always said it was better to remain quite and thought an idiot than to talk and remove all doubt. Again Space removed any doubt about himself.


----------



## spacemule (Mar 16, 2010)

barneyrb said:


> Yep, Grand daddy always said it was better to remain quite and thought an idiot than to talk and remove all doubt. Again Space removed any doubt about himself.



"All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing." (Edmund Burke)


----------



## DSS (Mar 16, 2010)

thomas72 said:


> This is not a chainsaw forum anymore. It is a used tampon forum. I really enjoy the threads that deal with problem shooting chainsaws, and looking at the engineering of the old and new models. Things that increase knowledge. This "Not wanting to call people out" is crap. When I have problems you think I go sobbing to other people and try to make the other side look bad. Not no, but hell no! Most of the people on here that post these threads have the mentality of a two year old it seems. This has no merit to me at all. Here is a little post about a rant of a rant.



:agree2: Another day, another drama......:spam:


----------



## gink595 (Mar 16, 2010)

mtngun said:


> No RATIONAL person would have paid that much for a used 066 AND also paid Thall to install an OEM piston and new filter cover. For the money, you could have just as well bought a new saw with warranty, so why bother with a used saw ?



So is it fair to say that a rational person wouldn't have asked that much for it?




mtngun said:


> It was obvious from the get-go that Joat was playing games. Call out Brad in public to force Brad to sell the saw to Joat against Brad's better judgement. Brad looks like a meanie unless he agrees to sell the saw to Joat.



I don't remember Joat or Thall calling him out in public, where's that at? If I felt like somone was trying to stick it to me I sure wouldn't have sold it, it's truly amazing what the power of the almighty buck will make people do!.



mtngun said:


> Then Joat finds a minor imperfection -- I wouldn't have lost an iota of sleep over 2 broken fins -- and makes a stink about it.
> 
> Brad's only mistake was falling into the trap.


 I don't think that is a minor imperfection, especially if Joat had plans on porting the saw.



mtngun said:


> Brad, in the future, trust your instincts. You've been dragged through the mud, and that was the plan all along.
> 
> BTW Brad, if you want to sell that defective jug, I'm looking for a used OEM jug, and the broken fins don't bother me if the price is right.



Everything has a price and I'm sure he would sell it to you, since it only has a couple broken fins on it!

BTW would you expect the cylinder to be had at a discounted price? I'm curious what would you pay for a cylinder with missing fins? I bet it wouldn't be alot.


----------



## Maldeney (Mar 16, 2010)

gink595 said:


> So is it fair to say that a rational person wouldn't have asked that much for it?
> 
> 
> 
> ...



No use in arguing with them...... It is just the way they are.:greenchainsaw:


----------



## Gypo Logger (Mar 16, 2010)

Without taking sides, two broken fins are functionaly inconsequential. How many cyl. have you seen that were impacted with sap and sawdust and still ran ok?
But that's not the point. It looks ugly and devalues it for resale.
I think the 2 parties should be happy if a new or gently used jug was exchanged for the suspect cyl.
Gypo


----------



## belgian (Mar 16, 2010)

Yukonsawman said:


> Without taking sides, two broken fins are functionaly inconsequential. How many cyl. have you seen that were impacted with sap and sawdust and still ran ok?
> But that's not the point. It looks ugly and devalues it for resale.
> I think the 2 parties should be happy if a new or gently used jug was exchanged for the suspect cyl.
> Gypo



My take on it as well. But the parties involved agreed otherwise.


----------



## indiansprings (Mar 16, 2010)

Unbelievable! If Brad couldn't figure out why the saw was bought in the first place it would be beyond my comprehension. He was openly called out on Tradin Post on how in the hell you could get so much in a saw that started out at 350.00, Joat actually asked some very pertinent questions, the post was deleted by a moderator as it was none of Joat's business, Joat was asked to put up or shut up, in my opinion he "put up" with a ton of cash for that model of saw.
I personally would want the saw as advertised, it had better be a 9 on a scale of 10 for that kind of money.
Whether Brad knew or didn't notice the fins is only known to Brad.

I personally am far from having the detailed knowlegde some of the people on this site have about saws. But I fix my own when possible.
I think it's reached the point where their definetly is a group, and after this post I would include myself in this group that is tired of all the drama, the attitude, the profiteering done on this site and it usually revolves around one individual. Vanity and Pride come to mind, nothing humble about it.
There has been a lot of great contributions, but lately "the chainsaw god" attitude, ripping new members about posting in the wrong location, acting if one owns the site is a just a little much. I've seen some post that they think whatever the fee's are to port a saw are ridiculous and a rip off. Hell, if someone is stupid enough to part with 250.00+ to let some one dremel away on a saw, it's their money? If Brad is comfortable with the risk he is taking doing this in such an open manner, it's him and his family that have to pay the fiddler, no one else. But I'll make this prediction today, it's just a matter of time before all this open activity blows up in someone's face. I could care less about it, I have modded saws with a bridgeport for my own use. Dealt with the feds in my gun repair business because some idiot thought I was converting semi AR's into one capable of firing fully automatic, and buddy the burden of proof is on you.
The way I see it after this post is Brad is his own worst enemy, he dosen't need Joat or Tommy or me or anyone else to see himself in the worst light, he does a damn fine job by himself. But I have noticed he is man enough to say , I'm wrong and it does take a man to do it. I give him credit for that.
How many times he has to say it is up to him. The same set of rule should apply to anyone on the site, You can't scream I got burned and then not accept it and take it public when someone percieves they have been burned 
by you, can't have a double standard and that's what I percieve as Joat pointing out. This is bad for the individual, bad for the site and just plain bad business airing it out in public.


----------



## indiansprings (Mar 16, 2010)

Space Mule, I agree with you on this one, you've saddly, but truley one hundred percent correct on all counts. This one would be an easy win if litigated. I think I have the legal expertise to win this one.lol
Good post! rep for you


----------



## Gypo Logger (Mar 16, 2010)

belgian said:


> My take on it as well. But the parties involved agreed otherwise.



It's good that it has been resolved. If the seller sent the buyer a new/ used jug without taking the old one back, I bet the cyl. would never be re&re and the new one would end up on another project. Lol
Gypo


----------



## gink595 (Mar 16, 2010)

Yukonsawman said:


> It's good that it has been resolved. If the seller sent the buyer a new/ used jug without taking the old one back, I bet the cyl. would never be re&re and the new one would end up on another project. Lol
> Gypo



I don't think that is the kind of character Joat is, I beleive Joat wanted what he paid for, and if the saw was in perfect condition like it was sold to be there wouldn't be none of this. If this saw would have been sold to someone besides Joat would their character and motives be questioned?


----------



## Banacanin (Mar 16, 2010)

I seem to remember something about Thall ordering some plastic parts for cost last week. Perhaps he can ship those with the saw.


----------



## Gypo Logger (Mar 16, 2010)

gink595 said:


> I don't think that is the kind of character Joat is, I beleive Joat wanted what he paid for, and if the saw was in perfect condition like it was sold to be there wouldn't be none of this. If this saw would have been sold to someone besides Joat would their character and motives be questioned?



I agree, had I been in the buyers shoes, I would be disappointed and wanted an unbroken cyl., but I wouldn't change them out till I was good and ready.
Gypo


----------



## belgian (Mar 16, 2010)

Yukonsawman said:


> It's good that it has been resolved. If the seller sent the buyer a new/ used jug without taking the old one back, I bet the cyl. would never be re&re and the new one would end up on another project. Lol
> Gypo



I would have run the snot out of that saw, LOL. Judging by the pics, maybe that cylinder lost probably 5% of its total cooling surface. No biggie. 


But that was not the point. For 750$, I can buy almost a new saw :monkey:


----------



## joatmon (Mar 16, 2010)

*Let's end this!*

I take no joy in seeing this thread or the posts herein.

Brad and I have resolved this and I kindly ask that you end this thread.

Thanks,

joat


----------



## spacemule (Mar 16, 2010)

belgian said:


> I would have run the snot out of that saw, LOL. Judging by the pics, maybe that cylinder lost probably 5% of its total cooling surface. No biggie.



I have to listen to the engineers at Stihl. Saws run on the hot side to begin with. A minimum amount of cooling must be present, and removing 5% of the surface area of the fins may very well cut too far into the safety margin. 

For an analogy, and I freely admit the limitations of analogies, consider yourself lifting every ounce you can in a bench press, say 250 pounds. 5% of 250 pounds is 12 1/2 pounds. What's another 12 1/2 pounds? No biggie, right? 

But even if the difference were negligible, that's not the point. What if you bought a vehicle that has a quarter panel with the snot beat out of it. What if the seller said he shipped the vehicle in good condition without a beaten panel and sold it in good condition. Would you care since the beat up panel will make less than a 2% difference in wind resistance going down the road?


----------



## spacemule (Mar 16, 2010)

Gotcha Joat. I'll say no more. Glad it worked out for you.


----------



## belgian (Mar 16, 2010)

spacemule said:


> I have to listen to the engineers at Stihl. Saws run on the hot side to begin with. A minimum amount of cooling must be present, and removing 5% of the surface area of the fins may very well cut too far into the safety margin.
> 
> For an analogy, and I freely admit the limitations of analogies, consider yourself lifting every ounce you can in a bench press, say 250 pounds. 5% of 250 pounds is 12 1/2 pounds. What's another 12 1/2 pounds? No biggie, right?
> 
> But even if the difference were negligible, that's not the point. What if you bought a vehicle that has a quarter panel with the snot beat out of it. What if the seller said he shipped the vehicle in good condition without a beaten panel and sold it in good condition. Would you care since the beat up panel will make less than a 2% difference in wind resistance going down the road?



I referred to Gypo's post, do not pull it out of context. I did not say that I would have accepted the defect. But if I had received a replacement jug as compensation, I would have left the damaged one on the saw and run the ....out of it, just like 99% of the rest on AS.


----------



## wooddog (Mar 16, 2010)

joatmon said:


> Tommie,
> 
> Sorry to hear about Hoss's 084. Beware of the big three pees. Yep, pictures and paints and possuers. I KNOW how he feels. Oh, and as a reminder, possuers aren't exclusive to eBay.
> 
> ...





joatmon said:


> :agree2:
> 
> Steve,
> 
> ...





THALL10326 said:


> I'm with ya. I would never buy a repainted saw unless its done professionally like Lakeside did them. He would split the case, paint each half, install new bearings and put it back to together. Anytime you see a saw with the crankcase gasket painted over beware, usually means the case was painted as a whole, never separated for new bearings though claimimg it has new bearings. I see alot of those on E-bay. Gotta look closely to spot it though.
> 
> I take it you got nailed Joat. I'll send you my How To Buy A Used Saw Handbook, only $19.95, free shipping,LOL





joatmon said:


> Tommie,
> 
> *I got nailed real bad*.
> 
> ...





THALL10326 said:


> Well Joat I am kinda shy about talking about my 084, known as Bad Bob. Reason being is not to embarrass Bad Bob. For you though here goes.
> 
> Ya see the story of Bad Bob is a sad one. He was concieved over in Germany, son of Mean Leroy Brown and Big Burtha Brown . After he was born they sent him to the states here and he was sold into slavery, yup a rental center bought him. People would rent Bob for chores and such but one guy rented Bob and killed him, yup, cooked his engine.
> 
> ...





joatmon said:


> Tommie,
> 
> Well, I asked for it, and you delivered. It was most kind of you to bring BB back to life. It sounds as though BB is the King of 084s. So, he sits all day amounst his creamsicle brethern living a life of luxury. You must be every broken down saws dream adoptive parent.
> 
> ...





joatmon said:


> Tommie,
> 
> Bad Bob sounds lots better than my 084. I shall call him Too Bad.
> 
> ...





blsnelling said:


> What ever! I think you got my point.





blsnelling said:


> Joat, you've turned into nothing but a trouble causing, good for nothing Troll. I'm sorry to have to say that. You haven't always been that way.
> 
> You've come into this thread only with the intentions af taking shots at me again. Since you're too cowardly to come out and say it, yes, *I rebuilt the 084 you bought, and I'm not ashamed to say so!!!* I fully documented its build right here on AS. New crank bearings, brand new OEM P&C, all new OEM seals and gaskets, everything cleaned and *repainted*. You knew exactly what you bought! It had ZERO problems when it left here.
> 
> ...





joatmon said:


> Brad,
> 
> I hope you feel better now.
> 
> ...





blsnelling said:


> Don't try this reverse projection thing on my. I know enough psychology to see right through what you're trying to do here. This is *your *problem, not mine.





joatmon said:


> Brad,
> 
> Yep, the 084 is MY PROBLEM.
> 
> ...



Had to go a little reading on these two to see their history. 

Seems like somebody has sold a not as described 084 in the past too. :jawdrop:


----------



## Gypo Logger (Mar 16, 2010)

spacemule said:


> I have to listen to the engineers at Stihl. Saws run on the hot side to begin with. A minimum amount of cooling must be present, and removing 5% of the surface area of the fins may very well cut too far into the safety margin.
> 
> For an analogy, and I freely admit the limitations of analogies, consider yourself lifting every ounce you can in a bench press, say 250 pounds. 5% of 250 pounds is 12 1/2 pounds. What's another 12 1/2 pounds? No biggie, right?
> 
> But even if the difference were negligible, that's not the point. What if you bought a vehicle that has a quarter panel with the snot beat out of it. What if the seller said he shipped the vehicle in good condition without a beaten panel and sold it in good condition. Would you care since the beat up panel will make less than a 2% difference in wind resistance going down the road?


 Space, how's this for an analogy, you have a 390 I believe, take the hood off and with a hammer, knock off every fin in sight. Then go cut a bunch of wood, if it blows up I'll replace it with another saw.
All bets are off though if you try to blow it up deliberatly to prove your point. Lol
John


----------



## blsnelling (Mar 16, 2010)

wooddog said:


> Had to go a little reading on these two to see their history.
> 
> Seems like somebody has sold a not as described 084 in the past too. :jawdrop:



Not true at all. He knew exactly what he bought, just like I believe he did this time. He knew the 084 was repainted. The build was entirely documented in the thread linked above. If it's not obvious to you this whole thing was planned out, well....


----------



## Gypo Logger (Mar 16, 2010)

belgian said:


> I referred to Gypo's post, do not pull it out of context. I did not say that I would have accepted the defect. But if I had received a replacement jug as compensation, I would have left the damaged one on the saw and run the ....out of it, just like 99% of the rest on AS.



True, even if a guy was worried about heat retention, he could always open up the door in the air box which would probably give 15% additional cooling, thus making the saw run 10% cooler with the broken fins. Lol
Gypo


----------



## ZeroJunk (Mar 16, 2010)

Sure would be a boring ass place if not for Brad.


----------



## bcampbe7 (Mar 16, 2010)

Epic thread....

New here, but buyer beware.

If the buyer asked questions that were not answered truthfully or fully, then shame on the seller. If buyer did not ask questions and went strictly by the pictures, shame on buyer.

Sometimes the whole truth is not portrayed in a for sale write-up, either on purpose or not. It happens. Asking questions is not a full proof way secure of buying on the internet, but does put a kind of pressure on the person selling to tell the whole story.


----------



## Gypo Logger (Mar 16, 2010)

Yukonsawman said:


> Space, how's this for an analogy, you have a 390 I believe, take the hood off and with a hammer, knock off every fin in sight. Then go cut a bunch of wood, if it blows up I'll replace it with another saw.
> All bets are off though if you try to blow it up deliberatly to prove your point. Lol
> John



Space, I take that offer back. I forgot you don't have a modified saw, so that means it's running at least 50 degrees hotter, so if you break the fins off it will be sure to blow up, but I did have a nice purple Wild Thang I was gonna send to replace it. Lol
John


----------



## indiansprings (Mar 16, 2010)

Locking down or deleting the post is absolutely the wrong thing to do. It is just as educational and informative as any other on the site. It serves as a reminder on how not to do business. You simply don't do it out in the open or both parties are subject to review and judgement by the readers, let them form their own opinions, you let it stay out here visible for everyone and I'll guarantee you'll see less situations like this. Don't set a double standard by deleting based on who's involved. You can't post, then cry foul and then ask for it to be removed or locked. Education isn't always free and painless, had my butt switched plenty of times before I grew up. Wife still kicks me in the hiney from time to time.


----------



## Maldeney (Mar 16, 2010)

wooddog said:


> Had to go a little reading on these two to see their history.
> 
> Seems like somebody has sold a not as described 084 in the past too. :jawdrop:



So was this taken out of context or was this how it went down for the 084?


----------



## joatmon (Mar 16, 2010)

indiansprings said:


> Locking down or deleting the post is absolutely the wrong thing to do. It is just as educational and informative as any other on the site. It serves as a reminder on how not to do business. You simply don't do it out in the open or both parties are subject to review and judgement by the readers, let them form their own opinions, you let it stay out here visible for everyone and I'll guarantee you'll see less situations like this. Don't set a double standard by deleting based on who's involved. You can't post, then cry foul and then ask for it to be removed or locked. Education isn't always free and painless, had my butt switched plenty of times before I grew up. Wife still kicks me in the hiney from time to time.



I just put another quarter in the juke box. Carry on.


----------



## blackoak (Mar 16, 2010)

joatmon said:


> I just put another quarter in the juke box. Carry on.


Joat, I don't think a quarter is gonna get it. It's gonna cost you at LEAST a couple bucks.LOL


----------



## belgian (Mar 16, 2010)

joatmon said:


> I just put another quarter in the juke box. Carry on.



Hey Joat, gotta agree with indiansprings here. Only people who have somthing to hide don't like things in the open. Not taking sides here, but this is a weird deal to say the least.

apparently, you were unhappy with the 084 deal at first with the same seller, than you pull the trigger on an expensive rebuilt from the same seller, with the same result.

We have a saying here: a mule won't hurt itself on the same rock twice, ....and that counts for both of you.


----------



## wooddog (Mar 16, 2010)

blsnelling said:


> Not true at all. He knew exactly what he bought, just like I believe he did this time. He knew the 084 was repainted. The build was entirely documented in the thread linked above. If it's not obvious to you this whole thing was planned out, well....



He wasn't happy on the 084 and you basically told him to stick it up his :censored: :censored:  Why? 
You seemed so cold and blunt on unhappy customers. Yet you want everyone to run to your aid when your not happy about saws you buy. 





joatmon said:


> In January of last year I bought a "rebuilt 084". I paid $874 to get the saw. It was nice and shiney. First, the shiney covered up a cracked panel. It looked far better in the pictures than in person. Next, the saw wouldn't start without priming it. I don't think the carb and filter base were matched. Anyway, it wasn't what I expected.




Sir's, could you guys share why this deal went so bad in the past?




joatmon said:


> I just put another quarter in the juke box. Carry on.



:agree2::agree2:


----------



## Arrowhead (Mar 16, 2010)

How would this have gone if Ultra did not notice the broke fins in the pics? If I bought a saw for that much and it had two broke fins, I would not be happy to say the least. Weather it affects performance or not, its the point. Joat got a saw that was damaged, and also got called a liar that is was not damaged when shipped. If the broke fins were not in the box, Joat knew it was shipped this way. I would NOT be happy if someone accused me of being a liar! I read the post from the start, once Ultra posted the pics, I knew Brad would do a refund. Im glad everything worked out, and that Ultra posted the pics. Otherwise the finger pointing would have continued. As for Joat, I know he like things in tip top condition. I bought my MS460 from him and it was show-room new condition. It arrived in better than described condition. I was very pleased and I thought Joat was a great guy to deal with. 

P.S. Joat, If I knock a fin off the 460 will you give me some money back? :hmm3grin2orange:


----------



## joatmon (Mar 16, 2010)

Arrowhead said:


> P.S. Joat, If I knock a fin off the 460 will you give me some money back? :hmm3grin2orange:



Ed,

As I said, if you're not happy or I misrepresented the saw, you can get your money back. Just let me know and I'll send you a UPS return ticket.

joat


----------



## Tzed250 (Mar 16, 2010)

.




Brad has done the right thing, but I will point this out.

Brad claims to have not seen the broken fins. This on a used cylinder going on a rebuilt saw. A saw you would think extra time and care would go into since the point was to sell it. OK, fine, he didn't see the damage.

I do find it remarkable that he spotted flaws in a nearly new cylinder, and then followed up with one of the most epic and infamous threads in the history of AS. 

I would think that broken fins would be easier to see than what is pointed out in the following:





blsnelling said:


> Nice casting ehh?
> 
> 
> 
> ...





*...all they that take the sword shall perish with the sword*


.


----------



## joatmon (Mar 16, 2010)

belgian said:


> Hey Joat, gotta agree with indiansprings here. Only people who have somthing to hide don't like things in the open. Not taking sides here, but this is a weird deal to say the least.
> 
> apparently, you were unhappy with the 084 deal at first with the same seller, than you pull the trigger on an expensive rebuilt from the same seller, with the same result.
> 
> We have a saying here: a mule won't hurt itself on the same rock twice, ....and that counts for both of you.



Roland,

Nothing to hide here. Here's how it came down.

I asked what I thought to be a pertinent question ("How did you get that much money in it") in what I thought to be the pertinent place, the Tradin' Post section where questions and/or comments can be raised.

Brad called me a "troll" and was offended as he percieved this to be "questioning his character". A site moderator told me that "it was none of my business" and to "pony up". I didn't take kindly to being treated that way, so I accepted the challenge. I made a offer to buy the saw in a thread that needed but three or four posts. It escalated as I'm sure you know. At the time, three contemporaneous threads were running about Brad saws, two that he had purchased and one that he had sold.

At a little before 11:00 AM this morning, I learned that the saw had broken cooling fins and I PMed Brad. As we were discussing this via PM at 11:16 AM, Brad started this thread. Fine.

What do you think I'm hiding? I asked that people stop posting earlier after what I perceived to be "piling on". Most viewpoints had been expressed and after Brad posted for me to send the saw back, I felt the matter was closed.

But, feel free to carry on as you wish,

joat


----------



## THALL10326 (Mar 16, 2010)

blsnelling said:


> Not true at all. He knew exactly what he bought, just like I believe he did this time. He knew the 084 was repainted. The build was entirely documented in the thread linked above. If it's not obvious to you *this whole thing was planned out, well*....



Hold up right there. There wasn't anything planned out about this 066 I have on my bench. I told you last week why Joat bought your saw, you agreed 100%. He was called out to pony up or shut up, he ponied up out of a matter of pride and nothing more.

He asked would I get rid of the aftermarket piston if he had it shipped to me, I said no problem and no charge. Replacing a piston is like taking a wizz for me.

I opened the box this morning while I had a co-worker in the shop. I sat the saw on the bench and it was he, my co-worker, that spotted the missing cylinder fins, not me. I contacted Joat and asked him what to do. He asked would the missing fins hurt anything. I told him I had called Stihl with the same question. They point out one maybe no problem, two is iffy and would probably cause the saw to overheat. Joat told me to do nothing, he was going to contact you. 

I received PM's from you and you got replies from me. I can't post yours but I can mine if need be. I told you in one the best thing to do is refund the mans money and merely take the saw back. After that I saw this thread pop up. I told you in another PM you should not have started this thread.

You denied the broken cylinder fins untill I told you to go look at your own pics of the saw. You started this thread claiming it was shipped with no broken fins. The pics, your own, prove otherwise, you was wrong. I told you that as a saw builder overlooking missing fins did not look good on you, thats the main reason you should not have started this thread.

The saw is coming back to you in the same box. Far as I'm concerned its overwith but make no mistake about it, there was nothing planned concerning this saw. I realize some have said the cylinder should be swapped out and others have said the man knew what he was buying. I say BS to both counts. The buyer has recieved damaged goods and its he who decides whether to accept it or refuse it or have it repaired, its all up to the buyer, not the seller. Far as he knew the fins were broken how come not one person on this board saw the broken fins with all the pics of this saw in earlier threads, not one spotted them, not you, not me, so that assumtion is BS as well. If that is a just assumtion why didn't you see them when you had the jug in your own hand. So its best to let this deal go and call it a day..


----------



## teatersroad (Mar 16, 2010)

belgian said:


> .. Only people who have somthing to hide don't like things in the open...



Not true. Where I'm from it's called 'putting your business in the street', and it's frowned upon.


----------



## Fish (Mar 16, 2010)

The last page or so makes the whole picture less fuzzy, it would have been a shame it ended 4 hours ago.
Doubt it will cause any major rip in the fabric of the universe, but glad
the saga balanced out and filled in.


----------



## Maldeney (Mar 16, 2010)

Fish said:


> The last page or so makes the whole picture less fuzzy, it would have been a shame it ended 4 hours ago.
> Doubt it will cause any major rip in the fabric of the universe, but glad
> the saga balanced out and filled in.



Just curious..... To what end did the saga balance out?


----------



## Metals406 (Mar 16, 2010)

woodbooga said:


> LOL!! So the wife gets one and the other's off to snelling. In some cultures that'd be considered a rite of courtship.
> 
> And the way it all adds up, we get a half-shod Mrs. Metals, one-slipper snelling, and a shoeless Doug.
> 
> That's some pretty sassy stuff right there.



:hmm3grin2orange:


Well, one isn't off to Brad yet. . . I haven't gotten a PM with him taking me up on my offer. . . Which is weird, cause it's such a good one? I'll give it another 4 minutes, then I'll offer to throw in one of these:


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## Fish (Mar 16, 2010)

Hearing from Joat and Thall certainly balanced out things, and filled in all
the blanks in the contreversey, as many here don't read all of this crap.

One man started this turd down the hill, it should keep rolling until we hear
from the other side.

Whether or not the thread should have been started, well, that is another topic altogether, but starting it, and ending it before hearing from the one's
on the other side, well that would have been just wrong.

I am on neither side, as I have no reason to be......

These guys like or hate me for many other reasons than my blind loyalty.....

Which I really don't have.....

Except for Llammabert, he is my BFF!!!!!


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## Maldeney (Mar 16, 2010)

Fish said:


> Hearing from Joat and Thall certainly balanced out things, and filled in all
> the blanks in the contreversey, as many here don't read all of this crap.
> 
> One man started this turd down the hill, it should keep rolling until we hear
> ...




Got it thanks for that...... Oh I agree by the way. Glad to hear the other side of the mess!


----------



## indiansprings (Mar 16, 2010)

I find it funny that I have got a ton of positive rep, only with Trimmed sending me negative rep. I read the trading post before the comment's were pulled, and I stated my perception of the post after reading them before they were deleted,,,,,, Now Trim were did I get the fact's confused?.....
Joat questions the build price of the saw and which in my opinion where legitamate questions from a buyer, if you want to buy uninformed and ignorant of what exactly what in the saw, great for you. I'd want a detailed listing of parts, with a receipt for the parts. It keeps everyone honest. I need some positieve rep to kindly rid myself of Trim's negative.

Now, Tommy to answer the question of another post last night,
Can you make money rebuilding saws and sell them? post
It would be interesting to take this particular saw and start with the 350.00 start point add all parts at the cost of an AS member not someone getting discounts on parts as I do from my local dealer. Put in the time required to do the work at a reasonable non shop rate as an individual has no overhead and come up with a ballpark cost on the rebuilt saw. It would answer the poster's question, Can you make money rebuilding a saw? It's of no relavance how much profit one makes, if you have a buyer for the product, then he/she must have thought it was a value. Making profit is not a crime, it put's food on the table. 

Joat, done the admirable thing, he was called out and he put up. I don't think he had anything to hide. From what I have read, he took the high road in the whole deal at least from what you can read. Personally, I agree it is hard to miss broken fins, only Brad knows whether he knew if they were there or not.
With all the detail in previous post, it does raise questions in any reasonable persons mind. If just shows if your going to step out on the field and do business on an open forum you had better be ready to man up.


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## stihlboy (Mar 16, 2010)

ebay 660, cinci craigslist buyers beware, another ebay burn, 


each of those threads brad pissed and moaned about little defects on the items he bought. 

now, when somebody buys something that is broken and he failed to mention that in the listing, we usually call them a dishonest seller or a crook.


so why is everyone mad? joat got screwed from a dishonest seller
funny part is the seller started a thread thinking that everyone would take the side of the AS sponsor.......
im not siding with a crook!

hmm so first the 084 now the 066?
man you got him twice........

you know another funny thing i noticed,
the 681 was slower than stock.... hmm he sold it
the 361 was past its prime.... sold it too

seems he only sells the saws that are not up to par.

time to get off the pedestal and realize your place.........
*You are not a god*
and lose the superior attitude you are no better than anyone else


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## 04ultra (Mar 16, 2010)

stihlboy said:


> ebay 660, cinci craigslist buyers beware, another ebay burn,
> 
> 
> each of those threads brad pissed and moaned about little defects on the items he bought.
> ...





Behave yourself young feller!!!




.


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## Andyshine77 (Mar 16, 2010)

Is the thing on test test, can anyone hear me test test.

Is Bread dead yet? I've been looking at all the obituaries but I can't seem to find his name. 

Cool you guys wanted Brad to look bad mission accomplished, hope you feel better.


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## Andyshine77 (Mar 16, 2010)

stihlboy said:


> ebay 660, cinci craigslist buyers beware, another ebay burn,
> 
> 
> each of those threads brad pissed and moaned about little defects on the items he bought.
> ...



Fred how many times has Brad gone out of his way to help you? How many time did you call him for help?


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## trimmmed (Mar 16, 2010)

indiansprings said:


> I find it funny that I have got a ton of positive rep, only with Trimmed sending me negative rep. I read the trading post before the comment's were pulled, and I stated my perception of the post after reading them before they were deleted,,,,,, Now Trim were did I get the fact's confused?.....
> Joat questions the build price of the saw and which in my opinion where legitamate questions from a buyer, if you want to buy uninformed and ignorant of what exactly what in the saw, great for you. I'd want a detailed listing of parts, with a receipt for the parts. It keeps everyone honest. I need some positieve rep to kindly rid myself of Trim's negative.
> 
> .



Yes you claimed I deleted something which I did not, so you are talking out your ass where I am concerned. In fact I flat out stated that I didn't delete anything in Joats buy thread. So get your facts straight where i am concerned or keep it to yourself.


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## 04ultra (Mar 16, 2010)

Andyshine77 said:


> Cool you guys wanted Brad to look bad mission accomplished, hope you feel better.



He does it all by himself...............Read post #1 ......Im pretty sure if you just installed the cylinder a week or two ago you would remember if it had fins broke off..............



Andy take him under your wing and guide him in a better direction ...........



.


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## deer slayer (Mar 16, 2010)

What do you think??:monkey:
Question #1 Would Joat have made the purchase if he wasn't "called out"???

Question #2 If Brad really knew the fin was broke, would he have knowingly sent it to a shop that he known prior to sale that it was getting a new piston?? Either which way I'm glad to see it resolved...Hope both parties learned a lesson.


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## trimmmed (Mar 16, 2010)

joatmon said:


> Roland,
> 
> Nothing to hide here. Here's how it came down.
> 
> ...



Hey Joat,
you can play whatever role you want, but don't be pissin on my leg and saying it's raining. You went over to the trading post to break Brad's chops, pure and simple. You can say different all you want, but you and I both know what's true. That said, I did tell you to put up or shut up, and SOB if you didn't put up. That satisfied me and Brad took your money, I am out of it at that point, whatever the motives were or weren't no longer mattered.

That was that.........this is a fresh can of worms.


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## stihlboy (Mar 16, 2010)

im calling it like i see it. i think it is wrong to not disclose the fact that it was broken.

"i didn't notice it" means (i noticed it but hoped you wouldn't)

or the infamous one.... "it wasn't that way when it was shipped"
means (it really was but i'll blame the shipper)

or "he knew what he bought" means (he knew only what i wanted him to)


speaks volumes for a persons credability doesn't it

oh well, whats done is done


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## Jtheo (Mar 16, 2010)

indiansprings said:


> Unbelievable! If Brad couldn't figure out why the saw was bought in the first place it would be beyond my comprehension. He was openly called out on Tradin Post on how in the hell you could get so much in a saw that started out at 350.00, Joat actually asked some very pertinent questions, the post was deleted by a moderator as it was none of Joat's business, Joat was asked to put up or shut up, in my opinion he "put up" with a ton of cash for that model of saw.
> I personally would want the saw as advertised, it had better be a 9 on a scale of 10 for that kind of money.
> Whether Brad knew or didn't notice the fins is only known to Brad.
> 
> ...



I agree 100 PC with Indiansprings on this.

If I am reading this right, JOAT started another thread on the saw on this forum before he bought it from Brad. I wonder why? Was it a set up from the getgo? 

Anthing I have bought or sold in the Trading Post was done by PM.


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## 04ultra (Mar 16, 2010)

stihlboy said:


> im calling it like i see it. i think it is wrong to not disclose the fact that it was broken.
> 
> "i didn't notice it" means (i noticed it but hoped you wouldn't)
> 
> ...



Young feller ...................Go to your room!!!


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## gink595 (Mar 16, 2010)

Jtheo said:


> I agree 100 PC with Indiansprings on this.
> 
> If I am reading this right, JOAT started another thread on the saw on this forum before he bought it from Brad. I wonder why? Was it a set up from the getgo?
> 
> Anthing I have bought or sold in the Trading Post was done by PM.



I don't understand? How was this a setup? Did Joat break the fins or were they broke already Brads pics showed they were broke before hand, so why is Joat the MF'er now. What if you had bought the saw, what would your feelings be towards it. I know what mine would be, the same as Joats.


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## Kemper (Mar 16, 2010)

stihlboy said:


> ebay 660, cinci craigslist buyers beware, another ebay burn,
> 
> 
> each of those threads brad pissed and moaned about little defects on the items he bought.
> ...



+1 Since this whining was brought out in front of A.S, I would suggest that the saw be returned and Joats money refunded plus shipping. We don't need all this pointing fingers crap here, should be handled via email.


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## Fish (Mar 16, 2010)

Andyshine77 said:


> Is the thing on test test, can anyone hear me test test.
> 
> Is Bread dead yet? I've been looking at all the obituaries but I can't seem to find his name.
> 
> Cool you guys wanted Brad to look bad mission accomplished, hope you feel better.



Bread was dead in the late 70's........

As far as a conspiracy to make him look bad, well, maybe he should stop
starting threads for a day or two.

I like you guys, but these threads do nothing but make folks divide into camps,
which is why they should not be started.


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## stihlboy (Mar 16, 2010)

Andyshine77 said:


> Fred how many times has Brad gone out of his way to help you? How many time did you call him for help?



he has, i agree on that. but he also has screwed the same guy twice.

he used to help me, now he doesn't even talk to me,


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## stihlboy (Mar 16, 2010)

04ultra said:


> Young feller ...................Go to your room!!!



im in my room


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## sawinredneck (Mar 16, 2010)

Damn, I gotta go back to the bar! I thought this was over.:censored:


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## Banacanin (Mar 16, 2010)

stihlboy said:


> he has, i agree on that. but he also has screwed the same guy twice.
> 
> he used to help me, now he doesn't even talk to me,



Fred, I think you might have tipped your hand.


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## indiansprings (Mar 16, 2010)

Trimmed, where exactly ddid I say you deleted it, grow up
here it is copied from the post,

the post was deleted by a moderator as it was none of Joat's business, Joat was asked to put up or shut up, in my opinion he "put up

Did I mention your name, only thought mods could delete, if I'm wrong I'll be the first to apologize, now where do you see you name as the person deleting it.lol Maybe in your haste negative repping there was a reading comprehension issue.

And I'm sure not pizzzzing up your leg.


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## Fish (Mar 16, 2010)

No,
The "valets" are just warming up the engine, this puppy has a full tank!!!!!!


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## teacherman (Mar 16, 2010)

sawinredneck said:


> Damn, I gotta go back to the bar! I thought this was over.:censored:



Aren't you drunk yet? LOL 

Be careful.


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## trimmmed (Mar 16, 2010)

indiansprings said:


> Trimmed, where exactly ddid I say you deleted it, grow up
> here it is copied from the post,
> 
> the post was deleted by a moderator as it was none of Joat's business, Joat was asked to put up or shut up, in my opinion he "put up
> ...



No, I read it right and you are stating things that are not true. Which moderator did you mean to infer deleted the posts? You said it, who exactly did you mean? 
And when you don't know something that is the time to ask and learn, not state something as fact that you admittedly don't know squat about.
That's all, no haste, no reading comprehension issues, just you spouting off about something you don't know anything about.


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## blsnelling (Mar 16, 2010)

Joat bought a 084 from me a couple years ago. He afterwards decided he didn't like a repainted saw. I have a hard time seeing where that's my problem. That right there is proof that he didn't buy this 066 because he wanted it. That 084 was built in a long detailed thread right here on AS. How Joat can claim he didn't know what was getting is beyond me. Why he had trouble starting it is beyond me. It had a brand new OEM P&C, rebuilt carb, etc... He never communicated to me what was wrong.

I was extremely leary of selling this 066 to Joat in the first place. He didn't like the 084 since it was repainted, so why would he want this one. On top of that, he's made it his place to be a pain in my butt, for no apparent reason. I had multiple people PM and warn me. I promised myself after he bad mouthed me through the grapevine on the 084 that I would never deal with him again. Maldeney, you're right. The almighty dollar clouded my reasoning. I was a fool to be sucked into this.

Plain and simple, Trimmmed humliated Joat last week when he called him out in the Tradin Post. After I knew Joat had seen it* I deleted that add *and reinstalled it to get rid of the rif raf. Like I stated above, and Joat already admitted too, Joat bought this saw *only *to save face. 

Joat and Tom both make it look like I posted this thread after I knew some of these details. Get for real! *Do you really think I'd start a thread like this had I known the cylinder did have broken fins?* Hardly! Like I'm so good for, my applogies here, I had already jumped the gun and started the thread. Tom, I took your advise and am refunding Joat. I've also applogized for starting this thread. But this thread was already started before I ever even PMd you. 

And to clear another thing up. Joat didn't contact me to discuss this situation. He sent a very short and curt PM that said "the cylinder has two broken fins and it's being shipped back". There was no discussion here, nor was I given a chance to make it right. *That's why I got ticked off and started the thread.* I had people as much as tell me that Joat would do exactly what he did. It doesn't take a rocket scientist.

Stihlboy, you're pathetic. You tell my "I'm like family" and then you stab me in the back That's all I have to say to you.

With all that said, I again appologize for starting both this thread and the one last week about my new 084. I'm an extravert, and I sometimes post too fast. Duhh, I guess you already knew that, lol. I talked to Nik today and told him that I don't need the few antagnists I have here to make problems for me, I do a good job of that myself. IndianSprings you are correct. I can only hope that one day, I'll learn to set on it for a while before I post it. Yes, I'm embarrased about all this, but not for one second, did I try to screw anyone over.


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## blsnelling (Mar 16, 2010)

indiansprings said:


> ...only thought mods could delete, if I'm wrong I'll be the first to apologize...



Any and everyone can delete their own Tradin' Post adds.


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## indiansprings (Mar 16, 2010)

After this post if I were going to be in the business of working on saws, trading, repairing and flipping them or if my primary business was modding saws, I would set me up a web page or ebay store, get me a local business liscence, federal tax ID number and get into business legitmately. How many guys on here run websites, or are sponsors, but do business in such a manner you don't even know they are here, unless someone ask. The self promoting has gone over the top. A person has to be aware of the saw techs on here that have spent countless years learning and applying their trade.
They have to operate within the legal boundries set by them the epa included. To see a guy who didn't know jack a two or three years ago to operating the way he has is bound to pizz a few of those off that have applied there trade in a legitamate fashion for years. It's a double standard, legitimate guys have to deal with all the b.s. of dealing with the public, stand behind there work, and comply to all the rules and regularions. Set a saw on the shelf in a shop around here in that shape and age and it would set there to hell froze over.


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## 7oaks (Mar 16, 2010)

THALL10326 said:


> Dayummmmmmm look at this. Facts are facts, the saw is not as it was described, whether by mistake or on purpose makes no differance. I personally called Stihl and asked about these missing fins. They say one missing fin maybe, two is very iffy, they don't recomend cylinders with two broken fins.
> 
> So its plain and simple, the saw needs to go back where it came from and money needs to be refunded. Nothing more needs to be said...



:agree2: I'd have to agree with Tom here. There is a plain and simple solution to this disagreement. No need for a weekly soap opera!


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## Rookie1 (Mar 16, 2010)

Miss a day and you miss alot!


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## indiansprings (Mar 16, 2010)

I stand 100% corrected on who can delete ads/post. But Trimm still needs to show me where I named him as the person who deleted it, isn't there at least one other moderator. Maybe feeling guilty for calling Joat out on this one?
At least old Joat will put up, by golly. Regardless of the situation you have to respect that. 

Not that it matters at all, but I respect Brad as well for taking the saw back, he really could have said "stick it up your azz", but by golly he's taking the high road. Can't improve much on that. 

Education just got paid for by several parties. Glad it's all worked out.


----------



## Freehand (Mar 16, 2010)

Now just follow the directions.....opcorn:


----------



## sawinredneck (Mar 16, 2010)

And all is well in the world now, Brad's a hero, joat's a zero and that redneck is just a stupid drunk. Back to my beer and fat girls.opcorn:


----------



## trimmmed (Mar 16, 2010)

indiansprings said:


> I stand 100% corrected on who can delete ads/post. *But Trimm still needs to show me where I named him as the person who deleted it, isn't there at least one other moderator*




Ok, go back a re-read what you wrote. Were there any other mods, that told Joat it wasn't his business and to pony up?

Aside from what you wrote, are you saying you were not naming me, but you were naming the other mod? A guy who hasn't been involved in any of this? Do you think that you might have been saying that the "other" mod deleted the posts, makes you any less full of crap? Puhleeeeeeeze, you were spouting crap then and still are.

As to feeling guilty that Joat bought the saw, damn, now that's a hoot. Why in hell would his decision to buy the saw bother me? Should I also feel guilty that Brad sold it to him? Where exactly should I stop feeling guilty? 

Oh yeah, re-read Brad's post about the editing features in the TP. 

Maybe you should just stick to your stories about scaring teenagers and what a tough guy you are instead of things you know nothing about.


----------



## 04ultra (Mar 16, 2010)

sawinredneck said:


> And all is well in the world now, Brad's a hero, joat's a zero and that redneck is just a stupid drunk. Back to my beer and fat girls.opcorn:



:agree2::agree2:


----------



## yooper (Mar 16, 2010)

04ultra said:


> :agree2::agree2:



you like fat girls too we need to make a club


----------



## Teddy.Scout (Mar 16, 2010)

WHAT HAPPENS WHEN YOU PUT DIESEL IN A WEEDWHACKER?

Thanks guys in advance!


----------



## PB (Mar 16, 2010)

yooper said:


> you like fat girls too we need to make a club



There is one, it's called Michigan. Land o' big ladies.


----------



## trimmmed (Mar 16, 2010)

Closing arguments guys, this thread is headed for memory lane.

Soon.


----------



## deer slayer (Mar 16, 2010)

trimmmed said:


> Closing arguments guys, this thread is headed for memory lane.
> 
> Soon.



Motion 2nd, All in favor????


----------



## yooper (Mar 16, 2010)

PlantBiologist said:


> There is one, it's called Michigan. Land o' big ladies.



we in the U.P. don't like to be referred to as Michiganders. To us Michigan is just another state under the great land of Superior. O ya and we got a lot of fatties here too.......HEY, is it a bad Idea to start potato plants early then replant them to get early taters?


----------



## Art Vandelay (Mar 16, 2010)

Teddy.Scout said:


> WHAT HAPPENS WHEN YOU PUT DIESEL IN A WEEDWHACKER?
> 
> Thanks guys in advance!



Mixed at 40-1 or 50-1?


----------



## yooper (Mar 16, 2010)

trimmmed said:


> Closing arguments guys, this thread is headed for memory lane.
> 
> Soon.



can you wait for me to get my tater question first?


----------



## deer slayer (Mar 16, 2010)

yooper said:


> can you wait for me to get my tater question first?



I like taters!!! what u want to know???


----------



## deer slayer (Mar 16, 2010)

yooper said:


> can you wait for me to get my tater question first?



I like taters!!! what u want to know???:greenchainsaw:


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## 04ultra (Mar 16, 2010)

Im sure there are plenty of dealings that go bad in this world.....





Brad just remember next time you post how you got screwed .....Somebody else might feel the same about dealing with you .......

.


----------



## Fish (Mar 16, 2010)

Hell, how many need to be put to "beddy bye"????


----------



## bcampbe7 (Mar 16, 2010)

I am new here, but I have to say; I haven't seen this much estrogen on a forum since I accidentally logged into the purse forum.


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## wendell (Mar 16, 2010)

I really got nothing to say but couldn't pass up the opportunity to be part of this wonderful thread. opcorn: Now, I won't need to watch my soap operas for a month! :monkey: :hmm3grin2orange:


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## PB (Mar 16, 2010)

yooper said:


> we in the U.P. don't like to be referred to as Michiganders. To us Michigan is just another state under the great land of Superior. O ya and we got a lot of fatties here too.......HEY, is it a bad Idea to start potato plants early then replant them to get early taters?



You mean start potatoes in a green house? If so, you may only harvest a week or two in advance. Once they start growing, they need to be in good soil or they will crap out. If you want early taters, just dig them up.  They will be small but good. I would recommend finding an early harvest variety. Try the Kennebec, atlantic or Sheppedy (sp?). i think they are early sooner.


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## 04ultra (Mar 16, 2010)

54 members and 5 guests watching this thread........LOL







.


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## yooper (Mar 16, 2010)

PlantBiologist said:


> You mean start potatoes in a green house? If so, you may only harvest a week or two in advance. Once they start growing, they need to be in good soil or they will crap out. If you want early taters, just dig them up.  They will be small but good. I would recommend finding an early harvest variety. Try the Kennebec, atlantic or Sheppedy (sp?). i think they are early sooner.



Thanks!
you can close up shop now boss


----------



## THALL10326 (Mar 16, 2010)

blsnelling said:


> Joat bought a 084 from me a couple years ago. He afterwards decided he didn't like a repainted saw. I have a hard time seeing where that's my problem. That right there is proof that he didn't buy this 066 because he wanted it. That 084 was built in a long detailed thread right here on AS. How Joat can claim he didn't know what was getting is beyond me. Why he had trouble starting it is beyond me. It had a brand new OEM P&C, rebuilt carb, etc... He never communicated to me what was wrong.
> 
> I was extremely leary of selling this 066 to Joat in the first place. He didn't like the 084 since it was repainted, so why would he want this one. On top of that, he's made it his place to be a pain in my butt, for no apparent reason. I had multiple people PM and warn me. I promised myself after he bad mouthed me through the grapevine on the 084 that I would never deal with him again. Maldeney, you're right. The almighty dollar clouded my reasoning. I was a fool to be sucked into this.
> 
> ...



Brad if you recall you passed along the PM Joat sent you to me. You are leaving out alittle bit of what he told you. Now either you can state fully what he told you or I can state it but this isn't MSNBC or FOX where you can cut out parts you don't like. You are also leaving out what you told him in reply. That too I can state or you can. His PM to you was justified by Stihl Inc, your testy reply was not justified. Makes no nevermind to me for I personally don't care, the squabble is between you and him. I was asked to replaced a piston, I agreed, thats all. My PM's to you about this whole matter were freindly and to the point. Why you started this thread is beyond me. I knew when I seen it all hell was going to break loose, it has. If it weren't for this thread no one would know you got the saw back cept you, Joat and me. Thats how it should have been handled. All this drama was created by you, no one else. I said my peace in a eariler post and was done. However I know what was said in those PM's and the truth will not be denied as long as I'm around. So keep it on the up and up..


----------



## sawinredneck (Mar 16, 2010)

I don't think it matters much trimmmed, I called it as I saw it, he threw mudd and innuendos but sure hasn't had the nuts to respond to me in any way since. Pretty much makes my point for me. I got no use for the tool.


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## 2000ssm6 (Mar 16, 2010)

And my hopes of getting that other 660 from Joat are shot down.


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## gonecountry (Mar 16, 2010)

*Oh the drama*

Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 61 (57 members and 4 guests) 

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## blsnelling (Mar 16, 2010)

THALL10326 said:


> Brad if you recall you passed along the PM Joat sent you to me. You are leaving out alittle bit of what he told you. Now either you can state fully what he told you or I can state it but this isn't MSNBC or FOX where you can cut out parts you don't like. You are also leaving out what you told him in reply. That too I can state or you can. His PM to you was justified by Stihl Inc, your testy reply was not justified. Makes no nevermind to me for I personally don't care, the squabble is between you and him. I was asked to replaced a piston, I agreed, thats all. My PM's to you about this whole matter were freindly and to the point. Why you started this thread is beyond me. I knew when I seen it all hell was going to break loose, it has. If it weren't for this thread no one would know you got the saw back cept you, Joat and me. Thats how it should have been handled. All this drama was created by you, no one else. I said my peace in a eariler post and was done. However I know what was said in those PM's and the truth will not be denied as long as I'm around. So keep it on the up and up..



Obviously, we see this a little differently. If Joat had bought this saw in good faith, he would have given me the opportunity to make it right. He did not. He *told *me he was returning it, just like he *told *me he was going to buy it. He knew I wouldn't sell it to him unless he called me out publically. I should have listened, not only to my better judgement, but to what many others were trying to tell me. 

At first, I flatly refused to accept the saw back. It was an honest mistake, one that I believe would have had no consequences. The fins aren't like completely missing. They're simply missing a corner. I assume that's what you're talking about in the rest of the PMs. But my better judgement tells me that I don't want Joat to own this saw. I don't care how much I lose on it. It was my mistake to sell it to him in the first place. I stand 100% by the belief that Joat was out to nail me, and he did.


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## MS460WOODCHUCK (Mar 16, 2010)

I must be nuts, I just read this thread from start to finish and all I can say is, HOLLY SHEEP!!! I'm GLAD I'm not on this JURY!!!:jawdrop:


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## fredmc (Mar 16, 2010)

yooper said:


> you like fat girls too we need to make a club



I'm in too!


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## joatmon (Mar 16, 2010)

blsnelling said:


> Obviously, we see this a little differently. If Joat had bought this saw in good faith, he would have given me the opportunity to make it right. He did not. He *told *me he was returning it, just like he *told *me he was going to buy it. At first, I flatly refused. I assume that's what you're talking about in the rest of the PMs. But my better judgement tells me that I don't want Joat to own this saw. I don't care how much I lose on it. It was my mistake to sell it to him in the first place. I stand 100% by the belief that Joat was out to nail me, and he did.



Brad,

I did PM you twice this morning and IMHO got arrogant, non responsive replies. I still have them for the record. I looked up your phone number and called you at 11:16 AM EST and I have that record as well. That's precisely when you started this thread. For the record, the number I found was "disconnected or no longer in service".

Brad, if the saw had been as described, this day would have gone better. That is the bottom line.

joat


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## blsnelling (Mar 16, 2010)

Joat, your PM this morning said nothing more than the saw had 2 broken cylinder fins which was not disclosed. According to Stihl, 2 broken cylinder fins will lead to a quick overheat and death. He then flatly stated that he would be returning the saw. Nothing else. I was given no opportunity to make it right, as you're suggesting.


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## joatmon (Mar 16, 2010)

blsnelling said:


> Joat, your PM this morning said nothing more than the saw had 2 broken cylinder fins which was not disclosed. According to Stihl, 2 broken cylinder fins will lead to a quick overheat and death. He then flatly stated that he would be returning the saw. Nothing else. I was given no opportunity to make it right, as he's suggesting.



Brad,

Well, I'd be happy to present the PM evidence to clear the air if you'd like. If both parties agree, is this within the AS rules?

joat


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## sawinredneck (Mar 16, 2010)

But it only counts if Brad gets the shaft. It only counts if Brad has someone calling him names. It only counts if Brad has to deal with the misery.
It's ok for him to be the one dealing dirty, it's ok for him to sling mud and call names, and it's ok for him to take advantage of the good natured people of this site.
I say it again, Karma, plain and simple! And I'll say again, I'd watch my mouth when speaking ill of other members!


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## blsnelling (Mar 16, 2010)

You PMd me once. But that's besides the point. Yes, I was very defensive in my two replies. I knew you had bad intentions when you bought this saw, and then you *inform *me that you were returning it, with no discussion, confirming my fears. Yes, I was wrong about the fins being broken. For that I again apologize.


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## trimmmed (Mar 16, 2010)

sawinredneck said:


> I don't think it matters much trimmmed, I called it as I saw it, he threw mudd and innuendos but sure hasn't had the nuts to respond to me in any way since. Pretty much makes my point for me. I got no use for the tool.



huh?


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## blsnelling (Mar 16, 2010)

sawinredneck said:


> But it only counts if Brad gets the shaft. It only counts if Brad has someone calling him names. It only counts if Brad has to deal with the misery.
> It's ok for him to be the one dealing dirty, it's ok for him to sling mud and call names, and it's ok for him to take advantage of the good natured people of this site.
> I say it again, Karma, plain and simple! And I'll say again, I'd watch my mouth when speaking ill of other members!



You're pointing your finger in the wrong direction buddy. I initially offered to replace the cylinder, and have now agreed to accept the saw back. BIG DIFFERENCE. You're just here to sling mud. You have nothing in this other than to participate in a blood bath.


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## trimmmed (Mar 16, 2010)

joatmon said:


> Brad,
> 
> Well, I'd be happy to present the PM evidence to clear the air if you'd like. If both parties agree, is this within the AS rules?
> 
> joat



No joat, *don't *post pm's. That rule has no exceptions. (formed from bad ju ju)

Just a paraphrase of the general jist is allowed.


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## joatmon (Mar 16, 2010)

blsnelling said:


> You PMd me once. But that's besides the point. Yes, I was very defensive in my two replies. I knew you had bad intentions when you bought this saw, and then you *inform *me that you were returning it, with no discussion, confirming my fears. Yes, I was wrong about the fins being broken. For that I again apologize.



Brad,

I PMed you this morning. You replied at 10:04 AM. You replied at 10:04 AM. As I was giving a response, you PMed again to the same message at 10:11 AM. I did not send that second response. I looked up your phone number at attempted to reach you at 10:16 AM. At that point, I noticed you had started this thread.

joat


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## sawinredneck (Mar 16, 2010)

trimmmed said:


> huh?



This post:



sawinredneck said:


> Here's my thing Brad, I'm gonna talk to you like a dad, then get banned.
> 
> A couple of years ago you couldn't even tune a saw, I've watched and helped and learned myself along the way. That was fine. But now you seem to be the "premiere saw builder" and "chainsaw guru to the newbies" on the site, which really makes me laugh. Give me a 1.75L of Jack and a dremel and I'll build something that can smoke what you got, but I don't sell it. I know what I build is a joke! I've run saws that people that knew what they were doing built! I've had people ask me to build saws Brad, I won't do it.
> I've watched as you had problem after problem with saws you have bought, and I've watched the people of this site step up and help you out time and again. Then I've watched you take that same saw and sell it for a profit.
> ...



Got this response:



blsnelling said:


> Whatever. That certainly wasn't one of the constructive comments I was referring to earlier. PUI perhaps?



Subtle hints.


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## volks-man (Mar 16, 2010)

*it is important to remember that there are people here who know more than they are saying.*

the truth is sometimes a hard thing to return to after leaving it behind.


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## Gypo Logger (Mar 16, 2010)

I don't know what the big deal is other than both parties over reacting.
I can't blame Joat for being pissed about the jug and I can't blame Brad for being pissed about not getting a chance to make it right.

It sounds like both parties assumed there was a conspiracy from the get go.
I mean it's not as though Joat planned on using the saw or that Brad needed the money! Lol

Gypo


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## joatmon (Mar 16, 2010)

trimmmed said:


> No joat, *don't *post pm's. That rule has no exceptions. (formed from bad ju ju)
> 
> Just a paraphrase of the general jist is allowed.



First response was something like, you're not jerking me around, I recall nothing of the such.

Second response was something like, Think twice about returning saw because I'll return to sender and there were no broken fins when I shipped it.

joat


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## deer slayer (Mar 16, 2010)

trimmmed said:


> Closing arguments guys, this thread is headed for memory lane.
> 
> Soon.



HELLLOOOOO!!!! Long over due, those of us who have kept up w/it know the saw had an issue, the saw was returned and monies refunded.............


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## deer slayer (Mar 16, 2010)

I do like one of the tags.....sphincters clenching !!! LOL


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## wendell (Mar 16, 2010)

We're up to 75 and 3 but down from 75 and 4. Is there an AS record for the most people on a thread?

C'mon guys, let's go for a Guiness Record!!


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## joatmon (Mar 16, 2010)

Yukonsawman said:


> I don't know what the big deal is other than both parties over reacting.
> I can't blame Joat for being pissed about the jug and I can't blame Brad for being pissed about not getting a chance to make it right.
> 
> It sounds like both parties assumed there was a conspiracy from the get go.
> ...



John,

I didn't start this thread or even respond to this thread until it was late in the game. In fact, my first post was on the order of, "it's over, nothing more to see here as it's all been said; cease".

To say I over reacted when others with no skin in the game have pontificated far more is a real stretch.

Fish put you up to this?

joat


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## trimmmed (Mar 16, 2010)

well.........the weekend will probably be anti-climatic. Tuesdays are normally pretty calm here.

Look down......down to the page bottom 

81 guys on this thread


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## blsnelling (Mar 16, 2010)

joatmon said:


> First response was something like, you're not jerking me around, I recall nothing of the such.
> 
> Second response was something like, Think twice about returning saw because I'll return to sender and there were no broken fins when I shipped it.
> 
> joat



Like I already said, I was *very defensive*, and believe *I had the right to be*. You *informed me *the saw was being returned, with no discussion, confirming what I fear from the very beginning. I do not appologize for the curt reply. I de appologize for not knowing the fins were broken.


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## Metals406 (Mar 16, 2010)

Now 85 viewing. . .


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## volks-man (Mar 16, 2010)

volks-man said:


> *it is important to remember that there are people here who know more than they are saying.*
> 
> the truth is sometimes a hard thing to return to after leaving it behind.





blsnelling said:


> Like I already said, I was *very defensive*, and believe *I had the right to be*. You *informed me *the saw was being returned, with no discussion, confirming what I fear from the very beginning. I do not appologize for the curt reply. I de appologize for not knowing the fins were broken.



perhaps it would be best to just let this go.

we can all go back to building saws.


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## trimmmed (Mar 16, 2010)

Countdown

10


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## sawinredneck (Mar 16, 2010)

I like nekid lezzbians, and the grilled chicken salad I made for the wife and for dinner was pretty tasty. But I'm just here to stir things up, so I won't. Bet it dies because I leave? Anyone?
"The truth is out there!"


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## Arrowhead (Mar 16, 2010)

volks-man said:


> *it is important to remember that there are people here who know more than they are saying.*
> 
> the truth is sometimes a hard thing to return to after leaving it behind.



*HMMM sounds like someone needs too come clean... cough cough* cough


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## trimmmed (Mar 16, 2010)

9


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## Fish (Mar 16, 2010)

joatmon said:


> John,
> 
> Fish put you up to this?
> 
> joat





Well, this whole group can kiss my hairy butt.

Next time I will take some aceholes side........................

This forum can spiral down into this poop and stay, I am done with it.


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## trimmmed (Mar 16, 2010)

8 7 6


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## PB (Mar 16, 2010)

Hey Trimmmed, if you skip straight to 1 you can just blame it on public education.


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## THALL10326 (Mar 16, 2010)

Trimmed is getting ready to shut this thread down, great idea. Here's all that matters. The saw is going back to Ohio in the morning, Joat got a refund. No one lost anything. Brad can sell it to someone else, Joat can go find another saw. This was a transaction and a return and nothing more. Good thing I don't handle returns like what all was said in this thread,wowow.

As for me I have no horse in this race, never did, I was looking forward to puttng in a piston, thats all. The saw is sitting here beside me, yes I'm guarding it with my life, its now a star after this thread, wow. In the morning I'll be happy to put it back on UPS and say farewell, Elvis has left the building.. Shutter down Trimmed, do your thing baby...


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## Tzed250 (Mar 16, 2010)

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## volks-man (Mar 16, 2010)

THALL10326 said:


> Trimmed is getting ready to shut this thread down, great idea. Here's all that matters. The saw is going back to Ohio in the morning, Joat got a refund. No one lost anything. Brad can sell it to someone else, Joat can go find another saw. This was a transaction and a return and nothing more. Good thing I don't handle returns like what all was said in this thread,wowow.
> 
> As for me I have no horse in this race, never did, I was looking forward to puttng in a piston, thats all. The saw is sitting here beside me, yes I'm guarding it with my life, its now a star after this thread, wow. In the morning I'll be happy to put it back on UPS and say farewell, Elvis has left the building.. Shutter down Trimmed, do your thing baby...



Rip, stihl-elvis.


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## joatmon (Mar 16, 2010)

Fish said:


> Well, this whole group can kiss my hairy butt.
> 
> Next time I will take some aceholes side........................
> 
> This forum can spiral down into this poop and stay, I am done with it.



Brad,

You want him on your side?

joat


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## RVALUE (Mar 16, 2010)

fredmc said:


> I'm in too!



I should learn to like them, I'd be a much happier person.


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## blsnelling (Mar 16, 2010)

THALL10326 said:


> Trimmed is getting ready to shut this thread down, great idea. Here's all that matters. The saw is going back to Ohio in the morning, Joat got a refund. No one lost anything. Brad can sell it to someone else, Joat can go find another saw. This was a transaction and a return and nothing more. Good thing I don't handle returns like what all was said in this thread,wowow.
> 
> As for me I have no horse in this race, never did, I was looking forward to puttng in a piston, thats all. The saw is sitting here beside me, yes I'm guarding it with my life, its now a star after this thread, wow. In the morning I'll be happy to put it back on UPS and say farewell, Elvis has left the building.. Shutter down Trimmed, do your thing baby...



You didn't scratch that shiny new paint job now did you, including the bottom:greenchainsaw: You can ask Nik. I wouldn't even let him set it on the floor Contrary to what 3-4 would have you believe, I take great pride in my work.


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## trimmmed (Mar 16, 2010)

5 4 3


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## Tzed250 (Mar 16, 2010)

<object width="480" height="385"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/lDGx3bNGJQo&hl=en_US&fs=1&"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/lDGx3bNGJQo&hl=en_US&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="480" height="385"></embed></object>


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## Arrowhead (Mar 16, 2010)

arrowhead said:


> *hmmm sounds like someone needs too come clean... Cough cough* cough



cough !!!!!!!


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## Muffler Bearing (Mar 16, 2010)

Hey, Does any-one know where I can get a 660 w/2 scratched fins for.....$400.:monkey:


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## Kemper (Mar 16, 2010)

People should really think before starting something like this on A.S, all it does is cause people to take sides and become divided,and not to mention what it does to ones reputation...


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## blsnelling (Mar 16, 2010)

The End


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## Metals406 (Mar 16, 2010)

JESUS said:


> Come on guys. . . What would I do?



I totally agree Jesus. . .


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## trimmmed (Mar 16, 2010)

2 1/2


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## 04ultra (Mar 16, 2010)

Funny how dog poo comes out smelling like roses......All rise Brad is in the room!!!




.


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## Baldman (Mar 16, 2010)

I bid $401 !


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## Paul001 (Mar 16, 2010)

blsnelling said:


> Like I already said, I was *very defensive*, and believe *I had the right to be*. You *informed me *the saw was being returned, with no discussion, confirming what I fear from the very beginning. I do not appologize for the curt reply. I de appologize for not knowing the fins were broken.



Well Brad, I'll start by saying you are a very talented individual. Not just with your saw building, but everything I've seen from you, work wise, has been nothing but top notch.

What you are not, is acting like a business person. You are experiencing something that many on here experience daily. Welcome to the wonderful world of selling ***.

You can not assume you know the intentions of anyone, period. Thats mistake number one. Selling someone something when your gut is telling you know, regardless of money, mistake number two. Coming out of the box with your original statement, "wasn't like that when I shipped it", mistake number three. Starting this thread and airing more dirty laundry, mistake number four.

I've alluded to this fact in more than a few threads, your attitude regarding the little people, at least here, has changed over the last year or so. I know where you are coming from, as dealing with customers can suck...you don't get to pick and choose who your customers are, unless you want to be a failed business.

Take a bit of time and read some of your old threads. More importantly some of your old responses to newer members...then read some of your posts from the last few months. If you are honest with yourself, you'll begin to see what many already have. 

Would hate for you to become that which you despise.

Your a huge asset around here...there isn't anyone on this board past or present, that hasn't been improved because of what you have done.

With all that said, there wasn't a question from the get go, you were in the wrong. You don't get to pick how you are going to make something right...right is right, period. In this case the only way to make right was to accept the saw back. If the customer was willing to accept a replacement cylinder, that is up to him, and him only.

Things are a bit different when you are trying to be a business vs a hobby.


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## 04ultra (Mar 16, 2010)

blsnelling said:


> the end



*lol*


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## Trigger Man (Mar 16, 2010)

I got two used cylinder fins in the mail today. I'm open to offers.


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## 04ultra (Mar 16, 2010)

Paul001 said:


> Well Brad, I'll start by saying you are a very talented individual. Not just with your saw building, but everything I've seen from you, work wise, has been nothing but top notch.
> 
> What you are not, is acting like a business person. You are experiencing something that many on here experience daily. Welcome to the wonderful world of selling ***.
> 
> ...



Paying taxes


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## trimmmed (Mar 16, 2010)

heheh


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## Muffler Bearing (Mar 16, 2010)

Baldman said:


> I bid $401 !



401.25 Dlv.:monkey:


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## LarryTheCableGuy (Mar 16, 2010)

What aisle are the danged fish recipes on?

.


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## RVALUE (Mar 16, 2010)

Has anyone figured out that you can't complain about this type of thread without becoming the very person you are complaining about?


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## stihlboy (Mar 16, 2010)

Brad you were like family, now you won't do anything without $

say what you want. i saw the true colors of you on another site.

Get off your high horse and give credit where it is due! 
without those guys you would be *Nothing*
and just because someone is a sponsor doesn't mean they are good


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## trimmmed (Mar 16, 2010)

2 1


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## Tzed250 (Mar 16, 2010)




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## 04ultra (Mar 16, 2010)

stihlboy said:


> Brad you were like family, now you won't do anything without $
> 
> say what you want. i saw the true colors of you on another site.







Its all about money........




.


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## trimmmed (Mar 16, 2010)

zero


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