# creeping charlie: how to get rid of it?



## mga

maybe this isn't the forum for this, but has anyone had any success with any product out there that kills this stuff? i have tried many top brand names weed killers that don't work and the stuff seems to be spreading more. i have over 2 acres so removal by hand is out of the question.

any suggestions???


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## BlueRidgeMark

Can you describe this stuff? The Creeping Charlie that I'm familiar with doesn't survive frost, so it can't be the same thing.


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## Speedzilla

Is this it?


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## mga

Speedzilla said:


> Is this it?



YES!!! that's it.......now...what can i do to get rid of it?


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## Elmore

Is it in your lawn or a grassy area? If so use Trimec. Around trees and shrubs Round Up should do. Just a quick guess.


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## BlueRidgeMark

Yeah, that's the Charlie I know. Never knew it to survive freezing temps, though.


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## mga

Elmore said:


> Is it in your lawn or a grassy area? If so use Trimec. Around trees and shrubs Round Up should do. Just a quick guess.



i tried that stuff. in some areas, it worked, while in others nothing happened. the stuff is running rampant in the yard. however, in the areas that it worked, it came back again later on.

i just thought that maybe someone had found a product that would eliminate this stuff. i've researched it and so far...altho many claim to kill it, as does Trimec and a couple others, it just grows back...even when it looks like it's dead.

Blueridge Mark: ha...this stuff grows like weeds up here in rochester. there is some growing in the woods out back and it's so thick it chokes everything in it's path. the problem is when you cut the lawn, even a small leaf chip can produce a new growth...it spreads that easily.


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## BlueRidgeMark

mga said:


> Blueridge Mark: ha...this stuff grows like weeds up here in rochester. there is some growing in the woods out back and it's so thick it chokes everything in it's path. the problem is when you cut the lawn, even a small leaf chip can produce a new growth...it spreads that easily.




I know it grows well from cuttings. Great stuff ... If you want it!


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## Cut4fun

A farmer up the road used something called 2D-40 for his problem of CC. He got it at the local TSC (tractor supply company). I havent tried it because where it bothers us is in the flower gardens. The yard I can live with been on a farm.


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## mga

*Cut4fun *


> A farmer up the road used something called 2D-40 for his problem of CC. He got it at the local TSC (tractor supply company). I havent tried it because where it bothers us is in the flower gardens. The yard I can live with been on



thanks...i'll check it out.

*TreeCo *


> I've been reading up on Creeping Charlie.
> 
> It looks like the only herbicides that will kill it will also do damage to surrounding trees.
> 
> Proceed with caution.
> 
> Dan



thanks, dan. i read that somewhere too. i'll keep that in mind.


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## Elmore

*Maybe add some MSMA to your Trimec or find Puccinia glechomatis*

The best choice for homeowners is a weed killer containing salt of dicamba (3, 6-dichloro-o-anisic acid). This active ingredient is often found in combination products, such as Trimec or Three Way Lawn Weed Killer, so check the ingredient list on the label to see if it contains dicamba
http://www.hort.wisc.edu/mastergardener/Features/weeds/creepingcharlie/creepcharlie.htm

Resistant to 2,4-D; Repeat treatments of 2,4-D + mecoprop + dicamba in turf. Optimum timing is early June or September. 
http://www.omafra.gov.on.ca/english/crops/hort/news/hortmatt/2005/11hrt05a5.htm

The rust is called Puccinia glechomatis. It forms very small tan dots on the undersides of ground ivy leaves and stems. A severe infection can cause death of a whole leaf segment or an entire stolon and all its leaves. The fungus spreads via spores (shown in the background of this page) and appears to be highly specific to ground ivy.
http://www.css.cornell.edu/WeedEco/creepingcharlie.htm


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## GroundKprs

Eric Kohler recently did a thesis at Purdue on ground ivy (aka creeping charlie). He used samples from several areas of the US and Canada in his study, and did find different responses to chemicals based on origin, so you need to find what works best for you.

You will need to use specific chemicals and *proper timing*. Get accurate info at http://www.agry.purdue.edu/turf/tips/2004/bdlv189.htm.

I wiped out ground ivy on all my properties years ago with _Turflon-D_, which is no longer available. It was an ester combo of 2,4-D and triclopyr.


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## Adkpk

I use Confront. It isn't easy. It takes three applications during the best conditions. Like dry and high temps at 80 degrees. It gets it off the lawn but it always comes back slowly but surely. I also pull it out by hand comes up pretty easily. Sorry, I didn't read any off the hyperlinks. 
While your find a way to kill it, you might find a way to combat by changing it's optomun conditions.


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## BlueRidgeMark

Hmmm. Found this item in my bookmarks. Can't remember when I found it or why I bookmarked it!

http://www.extension.umn.edu/info-u/plants/BG522.html



> Borax can be used against creeping charlie because the weed is more sensitive to boron than grass is. Small amounts can kill creeping charlie without permanently harming the lawn. (Grass may brown a bit, but it will grow out of it.)


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## mga

ya know, i used to use Borax to kill poison ivy and other stuff way out back near the woods. i would just spread handfuls of it and wait until it took effect. it worked great and lasted for years.

i just might try this next spring.......


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## stihlatit

http://images.google.ca/imgres?imgu...es?q=creeping+charlie&svnum=10&hl=en&lr=&sa=G

A lengthy read but very discriptive. Borax is mentioned as an organic control.

The best means of controlling creeping Charlie is with a postemergence broadleaf herbicide. As with any pesticide, always read and follow label directions. The best choice for homeowners is a weed killer containing salt of dicamba (3, 6-dichloro-o-anisic acid). This active ingredient is often found in combination products, such as Trimec or Three Way Lawn Weed Killer, so check the ingredient list on the label to see if it contains dicamba. The other chemicals in these combinations are generally 2,4-D (2, 4 dichlorophenoxyacetic acid) and mecoprop or MCPP (2-(2-methly-4-chlorophenoxy) propionic acid). Products containing triclopyr or 2,4-DP may also provide decent control. These products are good for applications on lawns, but can't be used in vegetable or flower gardens as many broadleaf plants are very susceptible to these herbicides and even minimal amounts of the herbicide will cause severe injury. In those areas it's best to hand pull or hoe the invaders. If there's more creeping Charlie than grass in your lawn, it may be easier to start over by killing all the vegetation and reseeding the lawn.

Read the whole article on application and as mentioned it would appear that you should apply the herbicides with caution.


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## Sawdust7

Borax for poison ivy huh? Hmmmm, sounds worth a shot to me MGA. So, can you give a little more detail on "spread it by the handful"? Did you just spread it on the ground or toss it at the vine?  Now, if I could just find the stuff by the railcar, or at least a 50# bag, I'd be able to do some damage. Now this ain't the same stuff you buy at Wally-World to wash your hands with is it?


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## siduramaxde

Adrpk said:


> I use Confront. It isn't easy. It takes three applications during the best conditions. Like dry and high temps at 80 degrees. It gets it off the lawn but it always comes back slowly but surely. I also pull it out by hand comes up pretty easily. Sorry, I didn't read any off the hyperlinks.
> While your find a way to kill it, you might find a way to combat by changing it's optomun conditions.




I am a lic. turf applicator in the state of Illinois. If you use Confront on any residential lawn, in any state, you WILL be breaking the law. The label on confront says it is not for use in residential lawns. Creeping Charlie is one of the hardest weeds to kill (along with violets). The reason confront works so well on creeping charlie is because of it's ingredient of colrpyralid(sp?), which has been taken off the market about 2 years ago due to problems with it staying in the ground too long. You need to find a company called Lesco (they are on the web and they have about 300 stores) and buy a product called momentum fx. It's about the best stuff out there right now but you may have to make multiple applications. 

Having said all this, It would be much wiser of you to contact a LOCAL pesticide applicator(not trugreen chemlawn) and have them evaluate the lawn and put the lawn on regular treatments. You will have much better results if a Pro make the application. I would also say the if you have alot of weeds in your yard you probably need to make the turf much thicker (fertilizer at least 4x yearly).

Call a PRO!!


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## GroundKprs

Sorry, Illinois, clopyralid is not the effective ingredient in _Confront_ on ground ivy. It is the triclopyr.

And if anyone wants to try most of the hogwash in this post, feel free to waste your time. If you want real scientific info, As I stated above Dr. Kohler has done the research just a few years ago:

From http://www.agry.purdue.edu/turf/report/2002/page122.pdf

"Summary
• Based on the results of our experiments, a ground ivy control strategy can be developed for cool-season turf. First, the turf site should receive an annual nitrogen application of 4 lbs/1000 sq ft to improve or maintain turf density. Second, a one-time application of 1.0 lb ai/A isoxaben in the spring will coincide with the beginning of the lateral growth habit of ground ivy stolons, severely curtailing its ability to spread. Third, a postemergence herbicide product containing 2,4-D combined with triclopyr and/or fluroxypyr should be applied in the fall at the highest labeled rate for a given turfgrass species. Proper nitrogen fertility programming, preemergence herbicide application, and postemergence herbicide application can improve ground ivy control."


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## siduramaxde

GroundKprs said:


> Sorry, Illinois, clopyralid is not the effective ingredient in _Confront_ on ground ivy. It is the triclopyr.
> 
> And if anyone wants to try most of the hogwash in this post, feel free to waste your time. If you want real scientific info, As I stated above Dr. Kohler has done the research just a few years ago:
> 
> From http://www.agry.purdue.edu/turf/report/2002/page122.pdf
> 
> "Summary
> • Based on the results of our experiments, a ground ivy control strategy can be developed for cool-season turf. First, the turf site should receive an annual nitrogen application of 4 lbs/1000 sq ft to improve or maintain turf density. Second, a one-time application of 1.0 lb ai/A isoxaben in the spring will coincide with the beginning of the lateral growth habit of ground ivy stolons, severely curtailing its ability to spread. Third, a postemergence herbicide product containing 2,4-D combined with triclopyr and/or fluroxypyr should be applied in the fall at the highest labeled rate for a given turfgrass species. Proper nitrogen fertility programming, preemergence herbicide application, and postemergence herbicide application can improve ground ivy control."



Here is the label and clorpyralid is one of the active ingredient
http://www.cdms.net/ldat/ld0AR000.pdf

When clorpyralid was in momentum it was more effective on hard to kill weeds.


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## begleytree

don't get me wrong, I used to hold a ohio license, cat 5a, and love herbicides myself, but....you're just treating the effect. why not shoot for the cause?

creeping charlie (and violets) love acidic soil. grass does not. good regular applications of lime hurts the charlie, and strengthens the grass. 
and another thing, raise the mower up, don't cut grass (turf, whatever) too short.
and fertillize the lawn regularly. Lawn grasses should be so thick that nothing else can grow. don't forget to aerate.
oh yeah, most herbicides are acidic, over time, that builds up in the soil.
-Ralph


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## 18watt

GroundKprs said:


> Eric Kohler recently did a thesis at Purdue on ground ivy (aka creeping charlie). He used samples from several areas of the US and Canada in his study, and did find different responses to chemicals based on origin, so you need to find what works best for you.
> 
> You will need to use specific chemicals and *proper timing*. Get accurate info at http://www.agry.purdue.edu/turf/tips/2004/bdlv189.htm.
> 
> I wiped out ground ivy on all my properties years ago with _Turflon-D_, which is no longer available. It was an ester combo of 2,4-D and triclopyr.



Great link! 

We have some 2,4-D, but haven't used it yet. We (my wife and I) have had our most success at grabbing a beer or two after work and spending 15 minutes talking and digging it out manually. You'll "never" get rid of it. We've balked at the chemicals due to dogs, concerns over pregnancy issues.


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## elmnut

momentum (spelling maybe wrong) back on the market in NY, applied when cc is in flower, killed all of it in my lawn. I am not a grass guy, all I know is the label that was on my door said momentum(sp?) Three way never did anything, and round up kills everything.


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## Gearhead1

I've had excellent success using 2,4D around my yard to kill off creeping charlie, plantain, dandelion, and all other broadleaf weeds. It does not however do anything against common clover. Clover kill requires some other herbicide, garlon (?) I believe. To achieve the best kill rates of all broadleaf weeds, use the 2,4D at the full recommended application rate. I have found that even at reduced rates, creeping charlie is completely eliminated.


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## Woodie

Licensed private pesticide applicator here in SE Michigan. 

I had a problem in my yard several years ago with Creeping Charlie. It is considered "very" difficult to remove, but I disagree. The thing to remember when dealing with CC is multiple applications, of the right combination of chemicals, at the right times, with a little patience. You don't eradicate it with one application, you control it down over time until it's eradicated.

First off, the right combination (at least here in SE Michigan) is 2,4-D and Tryclopyr. The 2,4-D will give you *some* quick burn-down, and the tryclopyr gives you the longer-term control. Also, some strains of CC are resistant to the 2,4-D; the tryc will blast those.

Second, the right time is early October, then again in springtime. The weed is putting down carbs to the roots and is most susceptible. Research shows spring apps to be slightly less effective, but in combination with fall they are part of the control strategy. Summer is useless; it is a waste of time, money, and chemicals.

As for timing, two applications two weeks apart worked for me. Hit it immediately (today is Oct. 4), then again two weeks later. Due to the herbicides and the first frost, you will likely see very little in your lawn come November.

But it's still there!! Come springtime, you will see a LOT less sprouting up, but you will see some. Hit it once more, same chemical combo. Do it post-emergence, but before it starts to flower. *DO NOT *let it flower!!!

You can use off-the-shelf chemicals, I used Ortho Weed-B-Gone. There are several types, you want the "regular" type and the purple-lable type for Oxalis and Clover. The regular has the 2,4-D, the purple has the tryc. The "regular" type has the instructions for tank-mixing and spray concentrations. 

Remember, patience is the key. You will get rid of it, but it can take a year to do so. 

Good luck!


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## crashagn

I had that stuff all over in the yard.. I mixed up a hotbatch of 2-4-d some buctril and some herbimax.. Burnt that stuff into the ground the next day. Works Great also for Thistles/ dandilions// tomatoes.. 

per 250 gal.
2-1/2 gal 2-4-d
2-1/2 gal buctril
1/4 gal herbimax


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## Dixie1

be very careful using 2,4-D around desireable trees. I would urge you NOT to use any product containing dicamba around your trees. If the creeping charlie isn't growing near your trees, by all mean go ahead and use whatever. Dicamba is readily absorbed by trees roots and 2,4-D is highly volatile so becareful on hot days when spraying. I think there is a product called Speed Zone that is labeled for use in lawns that contains 2,4-D and can be used during cooler periods as opposed to Trimec where is needs to be sprayed during warmer temps to properly work.


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## crashagn

Dixie1 said:


> be very careful using 2,4-D around desireable trees. I would urge you NOT to use any product containing dicamba around your trees. If the creeping charlie isn't growing near your trees, by all mean go ahead and use whatever. Dicamba is readily absorbed by trees roots and 2,4-D is highly volatile so becareful on hot days when spraying. I think there is a product called Speed Zone that is labeled for use in lawns that contains 2,4-D and can be used during cooler periods as opposed to Trimec where is needs to be sprayed during warmer temps to properly work.



If the tree roots are coming out of the ground.. then yes be carefull. But wehn i spray i dont soak the ground. Only enough to soak the "enemys" that i would like to eradicate. After spraying the creeping charlie or thistles will pull the chemicle down into thier own root system


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## Haywire Haywood

Don't feel bad... I've got Violiets, Creeping Charlie, and Creeping Cinquefoil (sp?) in my yard. I've given up and just cut the lawn. I'm not spending the cash for ongoing treatments for 1.5 acres. It's easier to cut than thick grass anyway... LOL


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## (WLL)

crashagn said:


> If the tree roots are coming out of the ground.. then yes be carefull. But wehn i spray i dont soak the ground. Only enough to soak the "enemys" that i would like to eradicate. After spraying the creeping charlie or thistles will pull the chemicle down into thier own root system


TRY FENCING YARD AND GET A DOZEN SHEEP:hmm3grin2orange: :hmm3grin2orange: :hmm3grin2orange:


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