# How to tell if wood has too much rot



## TomH83 (Apr 10, 2011)

I have no real firewood experience yet so bear with me here! On one side of my property a bunch of trees were felled around 1 1/2 years ago, and some large logs left around. The wood is oak. Since I have to get rid of these for some tree planting anyway, I've been cutting it up. Now some of it is obviously rotten and junk, while other stuff looks like it might be ok. How would I tell? Is a small ring on the outside of the log a good indicator of rot? And if so how much is acceptable for burning, if any? If it's no good I'll just chop it up enough to get rid of and not bother with it. If some of it is good I'd like to split and pile it. I'll be installing a wood stove between now and this fall.







I know this isn't a great picture but that's some of the bigger stuff, that pile looked decent to me. I can get better pictures of course. This wood has of course been on the ground for a while, but some was suspended up due to terrain etc.


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## sunfish (Apr 10, 2011)

I have to look at it to tell. If the sap wood around the outside is rotten, but the hart wood is good, I stack it in the shed.


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## freemind (Apr 10, 2011)

Outer rot doesn't turn me off as much as inner rot.

Whatever you have for solid wood, is what will be "prime".

Were it me, I wouldn't waste anything unless it is all punky (spongey).


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## stihl sawing (Apr 10, 2011)

That wood looks fine, I am cutting oak that's been blowed over more than two years now. It takes a long time for a trunk to rot. If you can push the heart of the log in with your finger, It is rotten. Now the outside still may be good. If it's still hard it's ok.


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## TMFARM 2009 (Apr 10, 2011)

test it with a dull chain... hit it with the dull chain on your saw and if it cuts like butter its rotten...
if you go to pick it up by hand and it falls apart in your hand its rotten..
if you kick it and it d-centigrades on impact..its rotten..
:hmm3grin2orange::hmm3grin2orange::hmm3grin2orange::hmm3grin2orange:


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## stihl sawing (Apr 10, 2011)

TMFARM 2009 said:


> test it with a dull chain... hit it with the dull chain on your saw and if it cuts like butter its rotten...
> if you go to pick it up by hand and it falls apart in your hand its rotten..
> *if you kick it and it d-centigrades on impact..its rotten..*:hmm3grin2orange::hmm3grin2orange::hmm3grin2orange::hmm3grin2orange:


LOL, If it's not you have a broken toe.


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## TMFARM 2009 (Apr 10, 2011)

i figured they would get the picture... opcorn:


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## TomH83 (Apr 10, 2011)

TMFARM 2009 said:


> test it with a dull chain... hit it with the dull chain on your saw and if it cuts like butter its rotten...
> if you go to pick it up by hand and it falls apart in your hand its rotten..
> if you kick it and it d-centigrades on impact..its rotten..
> :hmm3grin2orange::hmm3grin2orange::hmm3grin2orange::hmm3grin2orange:


 
Haha! Well I know that if it blows apart it's obviously rotten. Everything I have is solid, but the outside a bit softer on much of it. The bark comes off easy on some of it and some white worms fall out from just under. But it's still hard, no holes etc. It's been sitting in grass/dirty for that entire time.


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## stihl sawing (Apr 10, 2011)

TMFARM 2009 said:


> i figured they would get the picture... opcorn:


Yup.


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## TMFARM 2009 (Apr 10, 2011)

if you hit it with the saw and sparks and teeth fly, it might be petrified. just a hint....


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## memory (Apr 10, 2011)

I have been cleaning up some trees that have been down a while and if it is still hard on the outside, then I will cut it up for firewood.

Even though some of it may be rotten in the middle, the way I see it is it is going to be burned eventually anyways, whether piled up or in a stove. Might as well get some use out of it. 

Now if it is completely rotten where it falls to pieces, then I don't touch it. But as long as there is some hard wood left in it, I will cut it up for firewood.


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## TMFARM 2009 (Apr 10, 2011)

i look at it this way.. if it is a little rotten, it splits easier.
but if you drop it on the tail gate and it splits itself it might be a little too old...:hmm3grin2orange:


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## 4seasons (Apr 10, 2011)

If you can dent it with you hand or foot it is rotten. But if only the outside inch or so is rotten then split it and stack it. Bark falling off doesn't mean anything. Even some rot is ok as it will burn just not give of the heat or long burn times as a solid piece.

I am cutting up tops that have been down for 3 years with very little rot. What part of the wood was in direct contact with the ground is spongy, but the limbs that are off the ground are good wood and the trunks are solid because the limbs on the underside keep it off the ground.


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## TomH83 (Apr 10, 2011)

Thanks for the advice guys. It sounds like most of this wood will be useful. Biggest issue is dirt stuck to the bottom sides. I've been brushing like crazy!


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## TMFARM 2009 (Apr 10, 2011)

yup, my wife hates dirty wood also....


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## needwood (Apr 11, 2011)

memory said:


> I have been cleaning up some trees that have been down a while and if it is still hard on the outside, then I will cut it up for firewood.
> 
> Even though some of it may be rotten in the middle, the way I see it is it is going to be burned eventually anyways, whether piled up or in a stove. Might as well get some use out of it.
> 
> Now if it is completely rotten where it falls to pieces, then I don't touch it. But as long as there is some hard wood left in it, I will cut it up for firewood.




That's me" If your going to heat with wood you will need all you can get. It may look like allot when its laying on the ground but when it is split it just don't add up"


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## TreePointer (Apr 11, 2011)

I've taken oak trunks that have been sitting on the ground for 2 and 3 years. The outer portion of sapwood may be a punky, but the rest is just fine if you split it and let it dry.


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## MNGuns (Apr 11, 2011)

TreePointer said:


> I've taken oak trunks that have been sitting on the ground for 2 and 3 years. The outer portion of sapwood may be a punky, but the rest is just fine if you split it and let it dry.


 
Agreed...I'll sticka saw in most and old log just to see what it's like on the inside. You would be surprised. As log as it is not like a sponge, it's good, and some may have a hard center or outer and dry rot. Well that dry rot falls away as soon as it hit the splitter. Not always worth messing with, but I try to get the most out of the land I have available to work off of.


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## Sherwood stoker (Apr 11, 2011)

TreePointer said:


> I've taken oak trunks that have been sitting on the ground for 2 and 3 years. The outer portion of sapwood may be a punky, but the rest is just fine if you split it and let it dry.


 
Treepointer is on the money there.
A lot of stove owners over here have a problem with firewood showing any signs of rot & are just being generally over fussy. 
It's their loss.
Oak heartwood is superb, who cares if you can pull the rotten sapwood off in handfuls.
The end result is good firewood.


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## mga (Apr 11, 2011)

if it doesn't burn, it's rotten.


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## v8titan (Apr 11, 2011)

If your heating with wood you tend to get less picky when the supplies get low. I will burn almost anything as long as its seasoned / dry. the pieces with the partial rot are good for spring and fall when you don't need the stove kicking max btu's.


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## TomH83 (Apr 11, 2011)

Another question: will this kind of wood heat up a chain and bar faster? My bar is getting hot after maybe 5 cuts or so through some of this stuff. I am getting the dirt off the best that I can. I'm still cutting through and making chips with no problem, but the chain is getting a brown hue to it after some of these cuts. My saw is a brand new 346xp. I turned up the bar lube to the high setting. My guess is some of this is really seasoned, and in combination with a bit of dirt is really creating some friction. I don't want to damage my saw though.

How hot should a bar get??? Too hot to touch?


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## TMFARM 2009 (Apr 11, 2011)

nope.. you got saw issues...... by the way did you put oil in it?
if so i would take it back to dealer.... i had four brand new poulan pro's do the same thing.. and guess what ???? they wouldn't warranty them for the oiler....
now you can see why i run echo's now... traded all them in... three hadn't even been through one cord yet..:msp_biggrin::msp_biggrin:


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## TomH83 (Apr 11, 2011)

Yeah, I filled the oil right up. So I might bring it in for them to have a look. I'm using some stihl bar oil I believe, no idea how old it is. I wouldn't think that would make a difference.


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## TMFARM 2009 (Apr 11, 2011)

i know they've had massive issues with the poulans oilers... good luck, since husky owns poulan...:msp_w00t:


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## zogger (Apr 11, 2011)

*Burn it!*



TomH83 said:


> Yeah, I filled the oil right up. So I might bring it in for them to have a look. I'm using some stihl bar oil I believe, no idea how old it is. I wouldn't think that would make a difference.


 

--stack that stuff up and burn it later, a little rot will dry out just fine. 

Bar not oiling..STOP..check it out yourself CAREFULLY with the cover off, see if it is actually pumping oil out the little hole, or take it to the dealer. No sense wrecking a new bar and chain.

Did the oil level go down in the tank when you used it? That's a clue to start from. Is it pumping, if yes (oil level goes down) now look to see why it isn't making it to the chain.

Down in the bar groove, at the rear under the cover area, look for the little slit that lets the oil in from the hole on the side. Sometimes these are plugged up or even might have never been opened after painting! If that is all it is, a real thin sharp whatever will open it up. I use old hack saw blades, run the back down through the bar groove to keep it all open and clean, then a little from the air compressor

(if you are going to own a chainsaw..an air compressor is really your friend...you'll use it after every excursion)

If you are gong to start burning firewood this next winter..don't be picky, it's spring already, go get you all the wood (any kind outside of pressure treated... it all burns...) you can right now before real hot weather hits. Scrounge it up! You simply can't have enough dry seasoned stacked wood. Money in the bank, accruing interest as it seasons...


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## TomH83 (Apr 11, 2011)

I cleaned the bar and chain up after I noticed it got hot the first time. Everything was clear. I'm not sure how to check if it's pumping, do I run the saw with the bar off to see? The level does go down, so oil must be coming out. I can see a light oil film when I lift the chain up. I'll have it checked out either way.


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## woodbooga (Apr 12, 2011)

I go by the bible here...Ecclesiastes - for every season there is a wood for burning.

Nonpunkwood, oak, hard maple, beech...that's what gets burnt in Jan. and Feb. Nowadays, with temps above 40, burning oak is dumb.Burn pine, popple, and punkwood. Hell, burn these woods in primetime for quick heat and lay down a layer of heat for the denser stuff.

Not a bible thumper myself, but the Book's got wisdom. For everything there is a season.

Burn accordingly


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## needwood (Apr 12, 2011)

TMFARM 2009 said:


> i know they've had massive issues with the poulans oilers... good luck, since husky owns poulan...:msp_w00t:


 
:msp_angry:Hey, watch it now" LOL!


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## mga (Apr 12, 2011)

TomH83 said:


> I cleaned the bar and chain up after I noticed it got hot the first time. Everything was clear. I'm not sure how to check if it's pumping, *do I run the saw with the bar off *to see? The level does go down, so oil must be coming out. I can see a light oil film when I lift the chain up. I'll have it checked out either way.


 
not recommended

if your oil tank level goes down with the gas level, the oil pump is working.

after each use, try cleaning the clutch/oil port area. some woods and a duller chain creates fine particles that will clog up in there and prevent the oil from reaching the chain.

once cleaned, run the saw and point the chain at the ground or at some thing. you should see some oil spray.


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## artbaldoni (Apr 12, 2011)

Is your chain sharp? All the oil in the world won't help if you have a dull chain and really have to bear down on the saw to get it to cut. I know you said it was throwing chips but you sound like a new saw operator and may not have acquired the sense of sharp vs dull that it so important when cutting more than a little limb or two. 

You should use aprx. 1 tank oil for ever tank fuel. 

Also please, please, please wear proper PPE. Chaps, ear and eye protection etc.

Once you start cutting and everything is working properly you won't want to stop. Good luck!!


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## Guido Salvage (Apr 12, 2011)

woodbooga said:


> Burn pine, *popple*, and punkwood.



Your signature does not tell me where you are, but I have never heard of a "popple" tree. What type of wood is this?


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## 4seasons (Apr 12, 2011)

If your bar and chain are getting hot it can be oil not getting to the chain because of bad pumps or clogged oil holes but you could have the chain too tight as well. A hard nose bar likes less chain tension than a roller nose and if you can't pull the chain down 1/4 inch from the bar while the saw ISN"T running then the chain is too tight on a roller nose about twice that for a hard nose. Another issue you may have is the wrong size chain for you bar. For example you may have a .058 gauge chain in a .050 bar. If the bar is worn a bit the chain will work but it would be a tight fit and cause more friction and heat the bar up.


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## Mike PA (Apr 12, 2011)

One tank of oil per tank of gas. If you don't fill it that often, then you have a problem. To check oiling, rev the saw out of the cut and see if it sprays oil. Use a piece of cardboard or something to check this. The chain will sling oil off at the tip and should splatter a decent, but not excessive, amount of oil. Just takes a second or two to check, no need to rev it long.

With the saw off, check to see how the chain moves on the bar. If it is too tight, hangs, or you have trouble moving it, figure out why. With the saw off and the brake off, you should be able to easily turn the chain on the bar. 

The most common cause of excess heat is probably a dull chain. Chains dull quickly and need to be sharpened freuqently, depending on conditions. If you cut all day on one chain without sharpening it, you are probalby cutting with a dull chain. I like to sharpen every other tank or so, depending what I am cutting. When cutting dirty wood, use a semi-chisel chain and stay out of the ground. Don't cut all the way through the log, as there is a good chance of hitting the ground that way.


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## TomH83 (Apr 12, 2011)

I posted about the saw issue in the saw forum: http://www.arboristsite.com/chainsaw/169787.htm#post2889389


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## woodbooga (Apr 13, 2011)

Guido Salvage said:


> Your signature does not tell me where you are, but I have never heard of a "popple" tree. What type of wood is this?


 
Poplar slurred.

Firewood equivalent of 'giddy up' for 'get thee up'

Or, think about when we played hide and seek as kiddos. Give up searching...you call, "Olly olly oxen free" - a slur of 'All thee, all thee out and free'


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## stihl_in_texas (Apr 14, 2011)

I can't say for sure about felled timber. Depends on who's burnin' it I reckon. As for standing dead timber, if it "shatters" when it hits the ground it ain't no good.


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## Jmaffei (Apr 14, 2011)

I don't really think the point of the oiler is to cool off the bar and chain, just to keep it lubed. I have been noodling like crazy on white and red oak with my 460 with 25 inch bar and sharp chains and the bar gets really hot. I can touch it for half a sec but any longer and I'm pretty sure I'd get burned. I just think moving through that much hard material it is going to get hot, if I tried to keep it cool I'd be doing a cut every 5 or 10 mins. I check the oiler and its working and on max,etc. It's not burning the bar or chain but it definitely gets quite hot.


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