# Looking To Get into Forestry For a Career



## Cummins_ISB_5.9 (Jan 30, 2007)

Well, I've been around Trucking and Forestry all my life, we mostly float the equipment and haul chips. When I was younger I went with my father all the time and when we moved the equipment he gave me the keys and told me to load them on the float, I was around 11-12 when He taught me the basic operations (I learned on a excavator) I fell in love immediately and i knew then i wanted to do something with forestry. I lost my dad in 2003, I was 15 at the time, we still run our business, but since then I have lost touch with the industry. I'm now 18 and currently enrolled in College taking Diesel Mechanics, but when I complete the course I'm looking to get a job operating equipment. I would just be wondering about some suggestions, and what job to apply for (ie: Skidder, Forwarder, or Buncher) Any suggestions would be appreciated..

Thanks.

Jared.


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## Rick Alger (Jan 31, 2007)

*Looking toward Forestry*

Good question. I wish I could give you a more positive answer.

In New Hampshire the forestry business is seeing tough times. Mills are shutting down, prices at the remaining mills are not keeping up with inflation, pay is depressed, and woodland is being bought up by speculators for resale as camp sites, resorts, prisons and what-all. In the last five years roughly a third of the small logging contractors have sold out and turned to something else. The contractors that are left can't pay equipment operators anywhere near what they'd make operating similar equipment on construction.

Learn all you can about diesel repair. If the logging picks up, you can still go for it. But if it doesn't you'll have those very valuable technical skills to rely on.

Good luck,

Rick


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## Kiwilogger (Feb 1, 2007)

Here in NZ, loader and skidder drivers are a dime a dozen. Learn to operate a hauler. Then you can almost name your price.

Do what I did, my first job in forestry was operating a hauler. I approached a contractor who was looking for a hauler operator, offered him my services for 3 months, no charge, absolutely free! I said to him, "if I am no good, just tell me to piss off, but, if I have learnt enough, give me a full time job." After 2 weeks, I was on the payroll. Never looked back. I have now learnt the hauler, skidder, and am learning the loader at the moment.

Good luck with the job hunting.


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## Timberjackboy (Feb 3, 2007)

What exactly is a hauler? you mean trailer trucks? Forwarders?


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## Kiwilogger (Feb 3, 2007)

Sorry. You guys call them yarders. Heres a couple of pics of the one I operate.

From the back







From the front






The cockpit






Side view






The tower


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## Timberjackboy (Feb 3, 2007)

*Yikes*

I have never seen one of those in my life lol. Is that how they log the steep slopes basically set that out fit at the top and it sends cables down? Shes quite a big rig.


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## Kiwilogger (Feb 3, 2007)

Yup. Cable logging. Its a series of winches etc that send out a set of chokers or chains on steel wire ropes. The guys down the hill hook logs up to them, then we pull them in. The tower is 70 feet tall.


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## Timberjackboy (Feb 3, 2007)

*yesir*

yeah h guess we don't got hills around here big enough for that lol. Ive ehard of people using chains but i know ive seen logs where it would be hard to get chokers under, and with a choker you got a lil leverage there to force with where as with a chain you can't do that.


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## Kiwilogger (Feb 3, 2007)

We only use chains, chokers are a pain. If the log is lying hard flat on the ground, you just dig a little dirt out using a stick, and then poke it through with the stick.


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## slowp (Feb 11, 2007)

A yarder from here. Rigged up for downhill yarding in a thinning. Taken last July, 2006.

View attachment 45242


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## Pacific (Feb 24, 2007)

Spar like Kiwilogger posted is rarely used a swing grapple yarder like the old Washington is used for slopes. Hoe chucking is the quickest way of getting wood out of the bush using a log loader like the 3800. As for getting into Forestry its a dying industry in B.C. because the B.C. gov't keeps screwing around. Over the last year there prolly has been 300 plus jobs lost in the forest industry.


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## Kiwilogger (Feb 24, 2007)

Swing yarders are only good for shorter settings, with good height, and not too much steepness or ridges to cross. They are definately faster in the right settings, but tower yarders are more versatile. We often set our gear up without the skyline in creamy settings, similar to what you may use on your yarder. Running skyline, where we use the tail as the skyline. No interlock tho.. 

Hoe chucking sounds like what we call shovel logging, we just use knuckle boom loaders when we can shovel. I like the pic of the madill, I haven't seen one of those before. We would never get a machine like that on our terrain though. In fact, you wouldn't get any machines on most of our terrain.

Our boss just came back from a trip to the states. He bought 2 yarders. 1 is a swinger, a Thunderbird, but not sure which model, and the other a Thunderbird TTY90, 90 foot tower.

Just wondering, what is it that your govt is doing to make your logging industry die? Over here in NZ, we have no interference from the govt, apart from environmental rules etc, but certainly no regulation of the industry.


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## Pacific (Feb 25, 2007)

I'am from the West Coast of B.C. were we have some of the steepest logging terrian you can get. If its too steep then the forestry contractors heli log.

Hoe chuckers can work on steep slopes it just takes practice. The log diameters are still up to 48 inches and 40-50 feet long. 

Here is some pictures of real logging


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## Pacific (Feb 25, 2007)

More Pictures and as for logging dying in B.C. is because it is so regulated the rule books the loggers have to follow fills over 1000 pages or more. There is so many rules and regulations on timber harvesting it will make mind boggle.


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## Pacific (Feb 25, 2007)

Some more pictures


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## Pacific (Feb 25, 2007)

Couple more


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## BC_Logger (Feb 25, 2007)

hey pacific great pic's there 

where abouts are you logging in BC


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## Pacific (Feb 25, 2007)

I'am on the Coast  

The pictures are from a webite they are close to my area they are West Coast Logging.


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## sawsong (Feb 25, 2007)

i wish you the very best of luck mate. im in the same position as you. i'm 20 and wanting in on arb/forestry. i already work as a groundie but im trying to move up to climber while still studying something unrelated at uni.

hopefully the forestry industry is in better shape in the UK but im not 100% sure on that either. sounds like youve got a good qualification there, so as said, worst comes to the worst, it'll see you right. i'm furthering my study by doing a more related forestry course in a year's time.

all the best


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## slowp (Feb 25, 2007)

This is what happened here. Logging used to be a profession. It paid well when compared with other work available to people with no college education.
Then the environmental movement hit...spotted owl, salmon, etc. The national forests pretty much shut down, the private lands kept going, some at a higher rate of harvest due to a fear of new restrictions. The national forest in this area used to have a cut of about 500mmbf a year, now it is 10, which is an improvement from 0. Logging wages are about the same. Timber is now second growth. The folks who could, found other lines of work or moved away. Now it is hard to get a good crew together as wages are about the same as 20 years ago. So many guys got out of it so there is not the experience level either. A few are starting up, and relearning how to cable log. I work with guys who have just purchased a yarder and are learning, and some who grew up in the business. There's quite a difference safety-wise. 
I don't have any digital pictures of the 80s logging. The equipment was the size of the New Zealand yarders and the logs were big--6 foot diameter was not uncommon. Here's a couple more pictures of work here and a today's "parade logs". I take my camera out on sunny days. The first picture is of a landing. The second is guys rigging up an intermediate support. This project has a court order that only cable logging can be done on it regardless of the slope or profile.


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## slowp (Feb 25, 2007)

Here's the parade load. He won for best working truck.


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## Pacific (Feb 26, 2007)

Holy crap thats the cleanest Kenworth logger I have ever seen  

The safety rules now for logging is so strict here in B.C. guys have to go for training and certification courses on a regular basis. West Coast Fallers have to be certified and pass a exam.

Would I want a job in the Forest industry probably not because its not a guaranteed industry. Most of the logging contractors are getting tired of the rules and regulations and major headaches. You will eventually see these smaller independant companies with up to 100 employees pull the plug. Most of the owners are sticking it out to keep their guys working once the guys start retiring that will be it.

The government and enviromentalists have screwed up a good industry. It makes you sick when you see logging companies close up shop.


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## Soul Assassin (Feb 26, 2007)

Nice pics, thanks for posting them.

The do alot of "salvage logging" here in Colorado, due to recent wildfires. Nothing nearly as big as you have on the Left coast.

In my 20's I logged with a guy nicknamed "wild Bill S******", he had all his front teeth knocked out by an aspen that sprung back up after dropping a large tree. He was old school.

He used to call his work site "uncle Bills fitness camp" lol.


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## 1I'dJak (Feb 26, 2007)

despite the logging industry setbacks...due to the regulation, it seems fallers are going to be in high demand....to become a cert faller it costs 10,000 bucks now...which means not a lot of guys a coming into the industry... but the wages are good....500-600 a day for a 6.5 hr day.... except its almost all camp work and the ground is getting steeper and steeper as all the easy spots have been creamed out...takes balls though...


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## Gologit (Feb 26, 2007)

1I'dJak said:


> despite the logging industry setbacks...due to the regulation, it seems fallers are going to be in high demand....to become a cert faller it costs 10,000 bucks now...which means not a lot of guys a coming into the industry... but the wages are good....500-600 a day for a 6.5 hr day.... except its almost all camp work and the ground is getting steeper and steeper as all the easy spots have been creamed out...takes balls though...



That's a pretty good wage. Do most of the outfits pay by the bf or do they pay day wages?


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## Pacific (Feb 27, 2007)

I didn't think it was that much to be a certified faller now :jawdrop: 


Myself I only fall for my own use I don't think I would want to be a faller even if the money is good. I know a few fallers and the stories of living in camps. West Coast Fallers have always been paid good.


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## TimberPig (Feb 27, 2007)

boboak said:


> That's a pretty good wage. Do most of the outfits pay by the bf or do they pay day wages?



Day rate. Union crews had pay by the bf felled, outlawed in 1972. Independent crews could get paid that way if they really wanted, but no one does.


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## 1I'dJak (Mar 4, 2007)

...or if you don't wanna shell out the time and money to be a faller you can become a climber....that's what i do....we windfirm (top or prune) trees along the cutblocks so they don't blow over...and we single stem...which invloves limbing and topping a tree which will eventually be plucked outta the block with a chopper...the pay's pretty good...400-500 bucks/day once you get good...no expensive certification needed... just some balls to take down some big hammer tops and swing from tree to tree...and the ability to hike through the bush with with about 70lbs of gear on your back! however, the work is up and down and you get alot of down days due to wind and fog (often rely on choppers to get into the block)....but the work's never boring!


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## A100HVA (Mar 4, 2007)

Rick Alger said:


> Good question. I wish I could give you a more positive answer.
> 
> In New Hampshire the forestry business is seeing tough times. Mills are shutting down, prices at the remaining mills are not keeping up with inflation, pay is depressed, and woodland is being bought up by speculators for resale as camp sites, resorts, prisons and what-all. In the last five years roughly a third of the small logging contractors have sold out and turned to something else. The contractors that are left can't pay equipment operators anywhere near what they'd make operating similar equipment on construction.
> 
> ...



this is sound advice listen to what he is sayin' if we could paint you a better picture we would. the world of wood is a roller coaster ride! make sure you wanna come for the ride.:bang: :greenchainsaw:


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## burlman (Mar 10, 2007)

*mecanical logging*

I see adds from the professional training college in our regional quebec newspaper, looking for students to train in feller-buncher, and forwarder operators. says starting salary of $880.00 per week. of course their is the fact of who is going to hire you because the wood business sucks right now. they also have courses for timber cruising and clearing saw (for thinning plantations) supposed to be a demand for that as well good luck with whatever your future brings you


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## Drive_1305 (Mar 15, 2007)

Cummins_ISB_5.9 said:


> Well, I've been around Trucking and Forestry all my life, we mostly float the equipment and haul chips. When I was younger I went with my father all the time and when we moved the equipment he gave me the keys and told me to load them on the float, I was around 11-12 when He taught me the basic operations (I learned on a excavator) I fell in love immediately and i knew then i wanted to do something with forestry. I lost my dad in 2003, I was 15 at the time, we still run our business, but since then I have lost touch with the industry. I'm now 18 and currently enrolled in College taking Diesel Mechanics, but when I complete the course I'm looking to get a job operating equipment. I would just be wondering about some suggestions, and what job to apply for (ie: Skidder, Forwarder, or Buncher) Any suggestions would be appreciated..
> 
> Thanks.
> 
> Jared.




Since your so young, if it doesn't take too many more years finish your Diesel Mechanics. Then if you have the "smarts", use your past experience in heavy equipment and mechanics to get summer and part-time work, to work your way through a 4 year college program. Take engineering, construction management or something similar. Shoot for an office job in engineering or management, you'll make a lot more money and it won't be hard on your back when you get older. Use the physical labor jobs to " Get the adventure" and "experience". Sometimes people in the office don't have the hands on experience- you will have it and that will be a plus.


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## prolog (Oct 30, 2009)

*Washington Photo*



Pacific said:


> Spar like Kiwilogger posted is rarely used a swing grapple yarder like the old Washington is used for slopes. Hoe chucking is the quickest way of getting wood out of the bush using a log loader like the 3800. As for getting into Forestry its a dying industry in B.C. because the B.C. gov't keeps screwing around. Over the last year there prolly has been 300 plus jobs lost in the forest industry.



Hey,
Do you have the 78 Washington photo? I can't open the one you were showing.


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## RPM (Oct 30, 2009)

prolog said:


> Hey,
> Do you have the 78 Washington photo? I can't open the one you were showing.



We used to use these on the coast - Skagit 110' towers - BU-99 / BU-98 for skyline yarding. One was track mounted the other rubber tire. A couple of long ones out to 1,600m to the tailhold - downhill yarding. 

These probably went to the scrap yard a couple of years ago.


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## slowp (Oct 30, 2009)

These are from this year. Nothing new. The Skagit was a new to them yarder. I believe it had some plating welded on to give it more height.


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## prolog (Oct 30, 2009)

*Washington Swingyarder*

Thanks for the pix, I'm looking at purchasing a track mounted 78 Washington Swingyarder 3 drum with interlock (skylock). Can someone tell me a little about the productivity and or pro's and con's of these?


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