# Cedar...Help!



## Amy (Jul 18, 2001)

I'm new to this whole logging thing. But it is going to hopefully support my fiance` and I.

My question is about northern white cedar. I was wondering what the prices are for say a good, straight 12 " or larger cedar tree.

We have about 80 cord of beautiful cedar and just want to know what it's going for.

We're in Wisconsin.

Thanks for your help!


----------



## the tree guy (Jul 18, 2001)

Amy,ARE you planing to log the trees yourself,or have a company come in and cut it for you.Next question what do you mean by 80 cords?You will not want to cut trees under 18 inches in diameter no money in small trees plus you will want trees to cut again in 15 to 20 years.The best thing you can do is find a good forester he can give you a very close figure on the worth of your trees plus help you mark valueable trees as well as ones to leave and ones to remove for better grow for years to come.Becareful of who does the logging,check some of the jobs they have done.You don't to head out to the woods only to find some set a bomb off.There is alot more to look at than logging than cutting trees and getting money Dan


----------



## Deere John (Jul 19, 2001)

I agree with the above advice - no riches in properly managed forests 99% of the time. Sustainable growth and consistent income is what you want.


----------



## Amy (Jul 19, 2001)

*Re:cedar help*

No, I'm not planning on logging the tree's myself, although if we had a portable mill we would. Which is why I'm wondering about cedar prices. Nobody know's Approximate numbers...it's like it's all hush hush.

Second--you ask what do I mean about 80 cords. On my "history" sheet of the land it say's 80 cords of cedar usable AS lumber, veneer etc. A forester came in and marked them etc.

I realise there is more to logging than just cutting and making money. Just because I'm knew to this does not mean I don't have an understanding of what it's about.

We are camped out on our land, it's been a week since we purchased and we're in there cleaning and making it beautiful as it is quite old woods. We'd like to keep it pristine while at the same time make an income to get us by.

Not trying to get rich...Just trying to find out the prices on cedar by individuals that have experience, not just lumber Co.'s.


----------



## treeclimber165 (Jul 19, 2001)

Sounds like you are proceeding in an intelligent manner. However, since I have approximately 0 experience in logging and lumber, I am gonna toss this one back to Deere John!


----------



## the tree guy (Jul 19, 2001)

Try www.timberbuyers.com.IT


----------



## the tree guy (Jul 19, 2001)

Try www.timberbuyers.com. It is hard to give a price,there are differnt grades to the lumber. Have you asked a lumber company to come and give you a price bid on your trees.Get two or three bids and that will give you the number to figure on.I'm not saying you have to sell,but there must be a market for the cedar.If your area as lots cedar trees the price will show it.Woods to wood prices vary,a logging company or mill will be way to get a ballpark figure since they will be doing the buying. Dan


----------



## the tree guy (Jul 19, 2001)

www.timberbuyer.net You would think I could copy it right.Sorry  Dan


----------



## Amy (Jul 19, 2001)

Dan~
Thanks for the feedback and the website...
I'll check it out.

I have two timber buyers coming to check it out. They're both enthusiastic, because cedar"forests" like we have are rare in our area.

I just wanted a heads up before they came so I knew if they were legitimate purchase prices.

Anyway, thanks again, I'm checking out the site now.

Amy


----------



## Deere John (Jul 20, 2001)

To give you an ideere of what 80 cords is, a 48' logging trailer will hold about 20 cords, so you have had a forester tell you you have 4 truckloads worth.

Advice: do not sell it by the ton - cedar is way light and you will not receive fair value.

Ask for the log rule that the wood will be scaled with. Beware that some log rules allow for a 1/4 saw kurf, and nobody has used 1/4 inch saw blades for years, because they turn too much wood into sawdust. 

Logging is pretty straight forward. Costs for logging up my way are about $30 cord, all found. I am referring to a 4'x4'x8' stacked cord. Maybe a bit less if access is good and wood is big, and more if the other way.

In terms of value, big clear cedar is worth some money. I can't speculate on a value having not seen it, but my latest issue of the Forest Products Marketing Bulletin (www.oforest.on.ca) lists cedar anywhere from $240 to $960/ cord (they list their prices in $/cubic metre of solid wood, of which there are about 2.4 cubic metres in one cord). These prices are on the stump, so all costs associated with getting them off the stump to the mill must be accounted from these numbers.

Best way to scale, IMHO, is in cubic metres. You are dealing with solid wood with no air spaces, deductions for defect made and no saw kurf rules to play with your volumes. Good luck trying to ask for a scale in cubic metres from someone dealing for years in one log rule or another. You should get about 48 cubic metres of wood on the same truck as mentioned above. I can provide more detail given more detail on size and straightness.

BTW, this far north, we call it eastern white cedar. Thuja occidentalis is the latin name.


----------



## John Paul Sanborn (Jul 20, 2001)

Veneer is the gold nugget log. If you have some large straight pieces, this is where th money may be. if it has few defects.

I would recomend you contact a forester to go over the property with you. At least contact the one who cruised it for the real estate company, but it may not be too comprehensive. How many acres in what part of WI are you at? With that much arborvitae, I'ld think it is sorta swampy!


----------



## Amy (Jul 24, 2001)

John,
We have 28 acres near Solon Springs, WI.

It is actually quite swampy, but there is nice level ground also.
A lot of work for loggers to come in and do their job. I'm just trying to find out if it's worth it or if we should invest and do it ourselves.


----------



## John Paul Sanborn (Jul 24, 2001)

Wow, you better get out of that tent before winter  . My Mom comes from Phillips, and it gets snowy up there.

My Uncle is on the board in Price county and is impressed with the forester they've been using. If you want I can get you a number.


----------



## sawcutmill (Aug 11, 2001)

I have been reading this forum, and i am a portable sawmill operator as well as marine shipwright. it looks like you are on the right track. a few comments though,firstly look into the wood mizer family of sawmills, they are well worth the investment, i have made my living with one lt25, logging and collecting others trees for myself, then commercially, i can make anywhere from $30- 80,000 a year!Secondly, white cedar is boatbuilding wood, the top end of the wood world next to musical instruments, cedar dries well and fast, cut it at least 5/4 to 16/4 for optimal yield and value, thicker relates to price two fold or so, you can leave the natural edges as boatbuilders love that, thirdly, board foot prices as relating to cords, there is approxiamately 800 board feet per cord, or forty cord of white cedar will yeild 32,000 board feet! NOW, in my area, New England, one typically finds air dried cedar in the range of $2-$4 a board foot for 4/4 , you do the math, no matter how you slice it, the purchase of a sawmill will be recouped in less than a week a week 's worth of milling, i can saw about 2-3000 board feet in a eight hour day.be careful not to let them steal you.


----------



## John Paul Sanborn (Aug 13, 2001)

What is the quality of the cedar that you have there? Is it clear #1 or knoty #3? There is a big differance between grades.

One can find niche markets, but the finding is the rub.

BTW, 2-3 kbf is something to be proud of!


----------



## John Paul Sanborn (Aug 13, 2001)

What is the quality of the cedar that you have there? Is it clear #1 or knoty #3? There is a big differance between grades.

One can find niche markets, but the finding is the rub.

BTW, 2-3 kbf is something to be proud of!

what can you do on QS hardwoods?


----------

