# worms eating pine needles



## eric_271 (Mar 2, 2004)

I used to know the name for these worms but have forgotten. About five years ago I planted 250 austrian pines around my property. Three years ago I found small worms eating the needels. I used orthene to kill them and two or three days after I spray I check the trees for live worms. I cant find any liveing nor do any more needles turn brown the rest of the year. For the last two years I have sprayed while they were only a 1/8 inch long thinking they were all hatched and easy to kill but they come back the next spring. Rite now is the time I have to start looking for the hatch, is there any way to get rid of them for good?


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## eric_271 (Mar 2, 2004)

European pine sawflys are what these worms are called.


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## Elmore (Mar 4, 2004)

*Other species*

I recommend growing Japanese Maples as I have never seen a Sawfly larvae on any of my trees. I did have this ( see attachment ) on one of my trees last year.


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## eric_271 (Mar 4, 2004)

Elmore does that have fangs?


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## Elmore (Mar 4, 2004)

*Fangs*

No, he's a working class snake.


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## John Paul Sanborn (Mar 14, 2004)

Soaps work well, dormant oil can soften the cuticle of the needle if you have drought problems.

We see them often on Mugo pines around here and sometimes on Scot's.

I would go with an oil on the egg cases, then a soap on the first instar of the grub, or just the soap in drought prone areas.

Sevin and the like will work, but I've seen scale and mite problems in plants that get regular preventative treatemnts.


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## eric_271 (Mar 14, 2004)

JPS Thanks I will try the oil and see how it works. No hatch yet so I probly have time to spray. I kinda wish now that I had planted something els instead of the pines. Around here in the last 2 or 3 years all a sudden we have beetles, saw flys, and several other things going after the pines. Could be thats why they are not native trees around here.


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## phasthound (Mar 14, 2004)

Sorry to hear that you have planted so many Austrian Pines since they will cause you trouble for as long as you have them. The "worms" are indeed pine sawfly larvae. You will most likely have to treat for them every year as they can cause a great deal of damage in just a few days. The best time to treat is when the new "candles" have formed and not opened the new needles yet.
But that is just the start of your problems, as the trees mature, they will most likely be suseptible to Diplodia Tip Blight. This disease will slowly cause the decline of the trees. Check out http://ohioline.osu.edu/hyg-fact/2000/2555.html for pine sawfly
and http://ohioline.osu.edu/hyg-fact/3000/3041.html for tip blight.

Phasthound


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## John Paul Sanborn (Mar 15, 2004)

And diplodia has been asociated with high foliar N, so fertilization around the trees may hasten the onset.


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## Dan F (Mar 24, 2004)

So you are saying that I need to fertilize my Austrians to bring it on faster, huh? Maybe then my wife will listen to me.

Eric, are you sure what you had wasn't bagworms? See my attachment. These hatch around here in late May to early June. The pic is of a *very* young one.


Dan


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## Lumberjack (Mar 24, 2004)

Here is the same pic, should be easier to download.

Just tryin to help:angel:


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## Elmore (Mar 24, 2004)

*trees*

Eric, are you going to plant different trees now that you know of the short comings of that black pine? I planted 2 about 17 years ago. One folded up within 3-4 years. The remaining one is hanging in there but is only about 6' tall and pretty scraggly looking. It does provide a scaffold for japanese honeysuckle. I wish I had planted Pinus bungeana instead.


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## eric_271 (Mar 24, 2004)

Dan No they are not bag worms, I wish they were. They are for sure europian sawflys. They gether into clumps in the evening when it cools off and will turn a pine clear brown in day's or weeks if not sprayed pretty quickly. Elmore I dought I will replant. These pines are part of a double row, the other row being ceders which are getting pretty big. I planted 250 ceders about 8 years ago, my worst prob with them are the bag worms which dosen't bother me. Orthene or baytroid either one works well on the bag worms. I have started a lot of oak's on my property by acorn.I will probly suffer from oak wilt next.


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## emmy (May 9, 2006)

*pine sawfly larvae*

We've effectively used Sevin in years past. I had some rotenone in the garage and tried that this year on the mughos. The worms dropped off rather quickly with the dry powder! 
I'm wondering if Bayer systemic for insect control would keep them from doing damage next year as I never think to spray until a lot of visible damage has occurred. Has anyone tried it? 
Emmy


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## Treeman67 (May 10, 2006)

if it come into big plm, cut them down and chipped away or burn it , get rid of it as soon as possable, some treatment just don't work.... that easiest solution before it get out of control...

Treeman67


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