# rockin 4 minute vid



## murphy4trees (Aug 12, 2010)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N_z9Lkw8sbI


Watch full screen and turn the volume up...


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## tree MDS (Aug 12, 2010)

Pretty crazy stuff murph. 

Personally, I would never try to pull a tree with that much backlean - at least not one over a structure.

I used to have a groundman that used to suggest things like that from time to time.. I would always look at him like he was a moron. That's not saying I haven't done some crazy ####, but I really don't like to push it that much.. too much drama for me.


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## Treetom (Aug 12, 2010)

*Entertaining*

So far, so good, Daniel. You do some scary things with trees that I would not do. Just wondering if both trees dropped exactly as planned or were you just a little off, especially on the maple that hung up in the adjacent tree?Remember Murpy's Law when you're dropping those trees . I sense danger in a few of your recent videos. Take care.


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## Blakesmaster (Aug 13, 2010)

All right. So...I don't know whether to jump up and down clapping and congratulate you for your obvious skill and compliment the size of your cojones for pulling that #### off or to bash you for being a loose cannon who takes far too extensive risks in the name of saving a few minutes of time on a job. 

Either way, I must say, your skid steer operator is top notch and you should buy him a beer.


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## flushcut (Aug 13, 2010)

Treetom said:


> So far, so good, Daniel. You do some scary things with trees that I would not do. Just wondering if both trees dropped exactly as planned or were you just a little off, especially on the maple that hung up in the adjacent tree?Remember Murpy's Law when you're dropping those trees . I sense danger in a few of your recent videos. Take care.


:agree2: and I think you might be a little crazy.


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## Burvol (Aug 13, 2010)

*nice video Daniel*

Here's a tip you might want to try: Once tension is set, start your back cut, then once you are in, get a wedge or two started directly in the back. Saw up, pound a few times and your in. Face it and pull. We do basically the same thing out West but with out tension. Jacks or wedges in the back first for extreme leaners. You don't lose as much on the lean that way. 

Good job


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## Blakesmaster (Aug 13, 2010)

Burvol said:


> You don't lose as much on the lean that way.



I've never considered this technique, Burv, and I was wondering if you'd care to elaborate on it. The above sentence in particular. Thanks.


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## Burvol (Aug 13, 2010)

Blakesmaster said:


> I've never considered this technique, Burv, and I was wondering if you'd care to elaborate on it. The above sentence in particular. Thanks.



If you start backing up a tree first (within reason) and get a wedge in behind your bar, the tree has less time to sit back farther. When you face a tree that is leaning back, the tension released from sawing in a face allows the crucial holding or tension side wood to be comprimised. Then when the back cut is started, the crucial tension is lowered even further and the tree will begin to sit back quicker. When going in from the back, the crucial tension wood is not comprimised. Now granted, you cannot get too greedy and need to calculate the situation, but when you start the cut from the back, get a wedge in, you have lost zero degrees on the lean. You can watch a tree sit back farther when you put a face in it. There's your lost ground that you have to pound back up to be at the same spot the tree was originally at. In hard leaning _tall timber_ it is way easier with this method- cheers


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## Blakesmaster (Aug 13, 2010)

Burvol said:


> If you start backing up a tree first (within reason) and get a wedge in behind your bar, the tree has less time to sit back farther. When you face a tree that is leaning back, the tension released from sawing in a face allows the crucial holding or tension side wood to be comprimised. Then when the back cut is started, the crucial tension is lowered even further and the tree will begin to sit back quicker. When going in from the back, the crucial tension wood is not comprimised. Now granted, you cannot get too greedy and need to calculate the situation, but when you start the cut from the back, get a wedge in, you have lost zero degrees on the lean. You can watch a tree sit back farther when you put a face in it. There's your lost ground that you have to pound back up to be at the same spot the tree was originally at. In hard leaning _tall timber_ it is way easier with this method- cheers



That makes sense. Thanks for the insight.


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## randyg (Aug 14, 2010)

*You're livin on the edge Daniel*

Have you enjoyed an adrenaline rush lately? "You're flirtin' with disaster man ya'll know what I mean." Really not tryin to start anything here or be critical but would like to share a couple things that work well for me in similar situations.

Set pull rope and test. (Pull harder than I think I will need to.) Back off a bit and try and place just enough tension on rope to HOLD weight of tree. (Less than enough is better, as to much will increase chance of barber chair.) Especially on smaller trees like these two, I like to get right down close to the ground (longer hinge = better) and start with the back cut. As soon as saw is far enough along, I place wedge behind bar into backcut and 1 tap with palm of hand. Then as I continue with the back cut I watch the wedge. If it starts to drop (back cut opening) at all, I stop and slack off on pull rope. If wedge gets tight (back cut closing) I stop and increase tension on pull rope. If I can't pull hard enough to get wedge to come back loose, I need more grunt. Once I've found that neutral point (kerf is not opening or closing) I make the face cut, finish the back cut, and go pull the tree over.

Since I have a "pulling force" I can leave the hinge wood nearly twice as thick as in typical felling, increasing control. Having that "pulling force" as close as possible to directly opposite the lean is also key.


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## tree MDS (Aug 14, 2010)

*If somebody forced me to try that..*

I might have had better luck with my 3/4" bull rope, more of a birdmouth on the box, and my tractor winch. Norway Maple sort of sucks for holding wood though..


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## Nailsbeats (Aug 14, 2010)

Nice video Murphy. I like to see the limits being pushed a bit, obvious by that maple hangup. I know it was your job and you had it figured though. That's the game risk vs. reward with a little know how mixed in.


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## treeclimber101 (Aug 14, 2010)

I am pretty sure that you coulda ripped that tree down by the roots , maybe a barberchair, but when you put a rubber track against a swamp maple in wet soil ASV always wins , the facecut was just for the camera .....Good Job maybe throw alittle PANTERA in your soundtrack selections ...


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## lawson's tree s (Aug 19, 2010)

Nice Video ..


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## ForTheArborist (Aug 29, 2010)

Can someone elaborate why this job was supposedly such a big risk? I can't see it falling anywhere except backwards or 90 degrees of the rope to either side.


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## murphy4trees (Aug 29, 2010)

ForTheAction said:


> Can someone elaborate why this job was supposedly such a big risk? I can't see it falling anywhere except backwards or 90 degrees of the rope to either side.




My brother!!!
That's what I AM talking about!

See that.. finally someone who understands


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## tree MDS (Aug 29, 2010)

murphy4trees said:


> My brother!!!
> That's what I AM talking about!
> 
> See that.. finally someone who understands



What you trolling now Murphy?


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## pwoller (Aug 29, 2010)

Looks like a job well done to me.


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## murphy4trees (Aug 30, 2010)

tree MDS said:


> What you trolling now Murphy?




Na... well maybe.. actually nope..
just telling it like it is.

those little maples tight lined to a 5,700 lb machine with a good notch and backcut, they aren;t going back, that's for sure.. so what are the other options?

ps.. the heartwood on both trees was all punky, might have had 2" of good wood on the corners of both notches/hinges.. still no worries... little stump shot to create a lip, and the holding wood didn;t matter that much as long as the pull was directly against the lean.. first one only had to get pulled out of the tree it was hung in, then we stopped pulling and let gravity take over.. second one if I had to do over again, I'd have taken a little more care with the direction of pull, adusting it to compensate for the other side of the pull line, being tied slighty off the lay, at the first stump


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## ForTheArborist (Aug 30, 2010)

You engineered a few good operations to say the least. Obviously the brains are there. These were not operations for the nil and dandy. I'm sure it's all been tried before though. It's just that after the fools that tried it before blew the whole operation, they knew they would never live down the shame of demonstrating their "talents" here on AS.com. 

Great demo


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## mattfr12 (Aug 30, 2010)

murphy4trees said:


> Na... well maybe.. actually nope..
> just telling it like it is.
> 
> those little maples tight lined to a 5,700 lb machine with a good notch and backcut, they aren;t going back, that's for sure.. so what are the other options?
> ...



ya i have to give you that murphy i have a T-320 bobcat that weighs in at a little over 10k and ive pulled 50 foot pines on the ground up hills in one piece so they will pull alot.


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## Nailsbeats (Aug 30, 2010)

ForTheAction said:


> You engineered a few good operations to say the least. Obviously the brains are there. These were not operations for the nil and dandy. I'm sure it's all been tried before though. It's just that after the fools that tried it before blew the whole operation, they knew they would never live down the shame of demonstrating their "talents" here on AS.com.
> 
> Great demo



What fools are you talking about?


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## Nailsbeats (Aug 30, 2010)

Murphy, what size ASV is that you have?


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## treeclimber101 (Aug 30, 2010)

Nailsbeats said:


> Murphy, what size ASV is that you have?



Doesn't much matter when was the last time you saw one lose a fight with a tree , if anything it'll be draw .... Like an anchor ..


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