# Swing Booms on regular skidders???



## Slamm (Nov 25, 2010)

I'm thinking about getting a swing boom and putting it on my 540B cable skidder. Esco quit making the swing boom 5 years ago, and the guy at Esco stated that the new cost was over $50,000, is that why you don't see them very much or do they not work or what?

I think they are a great idea, and therefore I'm getting a used one for $2,000 to put on my cable skidder as the coming jobs for the next forseeable year are not going to require the extensive use of a dedicated cable skidder and if I am going to put a grapple type attachement on the back I wanted a "cool one", LOL.

The are primiarly used on the west coast and was wondering what you guys thought of them out there and why they didn't every "catch on" farther east ...... actually they are used on the East Coast as well, LOL, just not as much. No one around here has even heard of one and after I describe it they think its the best idea, then I tell them, that they don't make them anymore and we can't figure out why, LOL.

What are your thoughts,

Sam


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## SWE#Kipp (Nov 25, 2010)

They seem to be popular in Germany with that setup,, 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sPfad8mP1CQ&feature=related


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## 380LGR (Nov 27, 2010)

Your 540B is way to short of a machine to put one on . You wont pull crap for wood with it either. They were made for steep gound where you couldnt move the machine around a lot on a side hill.


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## Slamm (Nov 27, 2010)

380LGR said:


> Your 540B is way to short of a machine to put one on . You wont pull crap for wood with it either. They were made for steep gound where you couldnt move the machine around a lot on a side hill.



Have you tried one? or how do you know? What model skidders did you use the swing boom on and what size were the trees?

I called Esco and they couldn't give any specs on the swing boom like how much it could lift or how much it weighed and such????

Thanks,

Sam


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## 056 kid (Nov 27, 2010)

I was going to give you an answer, but I thought Id wait for someone else to then agree with them sou you might heed the advice

your boom grapple is best suited for steep ground behind a 5, that's what they ran back home.
I don't know about how much they will handle, but I know they can do everything a regular esco 100'' can do. They come in handy on nasty ground where you need reach way down. . .

the PNW loggers would know more about this subject, I don't know where they are though. . . . .


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## joesawer (Nov 27, 2010)

I have run one on a D5 hi drive and a single arch on a nearly identical tractor and I would not have one on a rubber tire machine. 
A dozier cant articulate to move the grapple so it has some use but mostly it is a pain in the butt. Even on the cat most of the time it was a waste once you learn to place the tractor and slip the grapple.
I have never seen one anywhere small enough for a 540 JD but I have seen one on a 525 it worked for on a skid trail punched into the side of a mountain but it greatly reduced what it could skid.


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## Slamm (Nov 28, 2010)

Thanks guys for the responses and opinion, but I'm going to give it a try, I have several ideas/reasons why I think I can make it work so for no more than what its was worth, I'm going to give it a whirl.

Well I got the boom after about 30 hours of driving.









It is currently attached to a Franklin 170 rearend. The seller, stated that he would cut it off for me, but the price was the same with or without the rearend and the rearend frame is nothing but very nice 1/2"+ metal that I can use for fabrication or scrap it.

At first without having my 540B next to it for comparison I thought it was going to be too big, but I unloaded it next to the 540B and it appears that it is just the right size, certainly wouldn't want it to be bigger. This attachment shouldn't provide much more or different forces than what we currently experience when sidelining with the cable or rearing the front off the ground when pulling a biggin from the back, but we will see.

I mostly wanted to try this attachment because, I do need the capability of a cable skidder, but not as much, with what I see as the next year's lineup of work which appears to be a rather large amount of work that is more bottoms and flatter than the hills that I am accustom too. So I want to convert my cable machine to a grapple machine, and this swing boom allows me to do that without loses the ease of operation of the winch cable, because I hate using the winch on the grapple machine as you can't see anything that is going on back there. At least with this swing boom you can get the grapple out of the way and see down your line better, without the cable having to scrape against the grapple the whole way.

If it causes the front to rear up too much as to not be practical, that may be "calmed" down with the addition of some 150-200 hp engines and other modd's that are going to be installed in both the 540B Grapple and this 540B Swing Boom, and a 518 CAT with grapple may be coming this way shortly and I would swap the grapple for this swing boom and a different 11' grapple, but will have to see. The CAT use way too much fuel as compared to Deere's in my opinion, but I can get the 518 for very cheap and it is very low hours.

Nothing is going to happen quick as we have a 650,000+ bdft job that both 540B's have to be on the next Monday and I am just going to send them in the "state" that they currently are, as this next job is a race to get the wood out before April 1st or there are very large fines for not having the job completed.

We'll see, thanks,

Sam


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## Oldtimer (Nov 28, 2010)

I personally wouldn't want one on any machine smaller than a 640. Even then, the mechanical leverage it will have when drawn up with a big tree is enough to flip even a 640 over if you are not very careful.
As others have mentioned, it would work best on the back of a D5 or D6 hi-track. They would be a lot harder to flip over on a corner with a big twitch.

I have seen 540s with swing booms, but knowing how "tippy" the 540 can be...I don't think it'll be any where close to as useful as a dual arch would be.

For the money, time, and labor you'll have involved...I think you might be better off with another machine entirely, maybe a 648 D/A.

Just my opinion.


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## Slamm (Nov 28, 2010)

Oldtimer said:


> I personally wouldn't want one on any machine smaller than a 640. Even then, the mechanical leverage it will have when drawn up with a big tree is enough to flip even a 640 over if you are not very careful.
> As others have mentioned, it would work best on the back of a D5 or D6 hi-track. They would be a lot harder to flip over on a corner with a big twitch.
> 
> I have seen 540s with swing booms, but knowing how "tippy" the 540 can be...I don't think it'll be any where close to as useful as a dual arch would be.
> ...



Yeah, might be right, but I'm going to try it. The straight away function between the dual arch and the swing boom will be about the same from the machines point of view. I understand that I won't be able to pick up the largest log from the farthest reach, but that is not what I'm looking for. For every 36" oak we cut, we cut 20 normal sized trees and I'm sure it won't have any problem with those. On the super large trees, I'll just have to get just as close to them as a single function grapple to lift it and then I'm not out anything.

So in summary on a majority of the normal/mid sized trees, I should be able to grab them from the extents of the boom's reach without much excitment, and on the larger stuff, its not going to be any different than a single action grapple, which means I can haul a 48" oak without too much trouble provided I get within reasonable reach of it, or the same as the single action grapple.

From my perspective, for $2k I got a grapple system that is very flexiable. It can do what a single action grapple can do, and it should still be of the same capacity at the closer ranges of the single/shorter single grapple. So I lose little/nothing and gain greater flexibility on the majority of timber that we skid, which is 200-400 bdft.

Thats what I'm shooting for anyways, LOL.

I love the 540B platform with 23x26 tires.

Sam


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## 380LGR (Nov 28, 2010)

Grapple skidders are all over the south for cheap!! You are going to have a fabrication nightmare...


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## 056 kid (Nov 28, 2010)

Correct me if Im wrong, but your boom doesn't look like it is going to be doing much swinging..?


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## 380LGR (Nov 28, 2010)

I have a dual function 380C and i can winch with no problems. the sorting head thats on that is probably only about a 70 to maybe 85 inch head. You wount get much behind you. I have a 110 inch esco bunching grapple and thats not big enough!!


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## Slamm (Nov 28, 2010)

056 kid said:


> Correct me if Im wrong, but your boom doesn't look like it is going to be doing much swinging..?



How do you want me to correct you?

Sam


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## 380LGR (Nov 28, 2010)

If you look at the bottom of the tube you will see the old rack style turning.


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## Slamm (Nov 28, 2010)

380LGR said:


> I have a dual function 380C and i can winch with no problems. the sorting head thats on that is probably only about a 70 to maybe 85 inch head. You wount get much behind you. I have a 110 inch esco bunching grapple and thats not big enough!!



I didn't say I couldn't winch with the single function grapple, I said I don't like too. The grapple hangs down in the way slightly.

I have a 84" grapple on my 540B single function grapple and for our timber it works just fine.

The esco sorting head on the swing boom is suppose to be something like a 72" or something, which is perfect for one big tree or two medium trees.

I can also get one of those Esco 110" heads for free for this thing if I need it.

Thanks,

Sam


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## 380LGR (Nov 28, 2010)

Dont get me wrong im a sucker for a headache myself.. Why are you using a swing boom just to get away from the cable skidder?


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## 380LGR (Nov 28, 2010)

The reason for the small heads on the swing booms is so you cant over load them in a turn. It cant hold the hitch behind you.


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## 056 kid (Nov 28, 2010)

Slamm said:


> How do you want me to correct you?
> 
> Sam



A start would be explaining weather the boom swings or not..

It looks like it is fixed & can only go north & south. .


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## 380LGR (Nov 28, 2010)

It pivots in the center almost like a backhoe. Follow that top cylinder down and everything turns sort of off of that.


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## Slamm (Nov 28, 2010)

380LGR said:


> Dont get me wrong im a sucker for a headache myself.. Why are you using a swing boom just to get away from the cable skidder?



I like to use the cable skidder for staging logs in the woods for the grapple skidder/s.

This has worked very well on long skids or steep hills, but I can see that in the next 1.5 million bdft, I'm not going to be in steep hills enough to justify a dedicated cable machine, so I wanted something that would allow me to work the cable/synthetic rope without dragging it against the grapple hanging down, and also something that would allow this one machine to be more flexible if/when I do get into steeper stuff or more technical work. Obviously the swing boom has many advantages over the single or dual arch grapples.

I am partners in a machine/hydraulic/welding shop with everything from CNC mills and lathes to wire EDM so I can fab or do just about anything I want .......... and I want a smaller machine that is very flexible and powerful. The ingredients are here to do it, just have to put it together just right, will it pick up what a 648 can? No, but a 648 can't sneak through the woods as fast as I can either, and I can't put two 648's on one semi trailer and haul them for the same price. Also, the little 540B's are cheap and tough, after I get the 150+ engines in them the only weak point will be the rear axles and I have a fix for that too, but I will wait until I break a couple before I whip out that modd, LOL.

Sam


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## 380LGR (Nov 28, 2010)

Ohhhh its not going to cost much just lots and lots of time.....


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## Slamm (Nov 28, 2010)

380LGR said:


> The reason for the small heads on the swing booms is so you cant over load them in a turn. It cant hold the hitch behind you.



?? Okay, but its only 12" smaller than the 84" head on the single action grapple that I currently use and that head works just fine on trees up to 60" in diameter so why do I need to drag around a 110" head?? I don't.

I don't pull out pulp tree bundles with the 540B's, where you need the super large grapple heads, I pull out trees/logs that are usually no smaller than 20" DBH .......... of course that might change, LOL, the next job has an estimated 6000+ tons of pulp and I'm working on getting a machine cutter in for that, but I'm not sure if I'm going to skid the bundles/hitches or if a 548 is going to.

Sam


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## 380LGR (Nov 28, 2010)

I never under stood the bunching with a cable skidder to a grapple...


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## Slamm (Nov 28, 2010)

380LGR said:


> Ohhhh its not going to cost much just lots and lots of time.....



It won't take much more time than just installing a single action boom on this cable machine, acually in some ways it will be easier, due to the design of the base. One week of shop time, and some "brain" time designing the hydraulic system and Terry is working on that with slick Joystick controls for everything.

Compared to some of the machines and systems that I have designed and built as a tool and die maker, this is just a fun project, pimping out a skidder, LOL.

Sam


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## Slamm (Nov 28, 2010)

380LGR said:


> I never under stood the bunching with a cable skidder to a grapple...



On steep hills, the cable machine can pull the trees up to the skidder trail where the grapple driver can quickly and easily grab them and run. Additionally it allows you to take a less skilled operator and make them very profitable in the grapple machine due to the lack of side hill operation.

Sam


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## Slamm (Nov 28, 2010)

380LGR said:


> Dont get me wrong im a sucker for a headache myself.. Why are you using a swing boom just to get away from the cable skidder?



To answer that question better, I am not trying to get completely away from the cable, I can just see that I have 1+ million bdft to pull in the coming months and very little of it is on what anyone would call a hill, LOL.

So instead of selling my 540B cable skidder and/or buying another machine to replace it, and really I don't want to let this great 540B go, it is very tight and fast steering with large steering rams and bigger steering valve than most newer skidders.

For a total cost of less than $4,000 (including travel to get it) I can put this swing boom on it and get a very flexible machine that will, also be able to very nicely place hitchs together for my grapple skidders due to the swinging action of the boom.

Sam


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## 056 kid (Nov 28, 2010)

380LGR said:


> I never under stood the bunching with a cable skidder to a grapple...



it saves alot of time when the ground is steep and the skids are long.


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## Slamm (Nov 28, 2010)

380LGR said:


> I never under stood the bunching with a cable skidder to a grapple...



When I mean bunching I am only talking about two or three trees, not pulp sized stuff.

The 540B can only really pull about 800-1000bdft within reason. We get that in one or two trees at times. So if I get one big tree it sits by itself. If I get two 400 bdft trees I "bunch" them together, LOL. If I get three 250 bdft trees I lay them together for the grapple, again, I haven't had the best grapple operators all the time. Karen (my wife is pretty good) but some of the help just sucks. I run the cable machine and use my knowledge and experience of the machines and operator's skill to put together hitchs that can get pulled out without much thought, LOL.

With this method I don't have rookies driving my grapple skidder off some hill, only to flip it or something. With this method I can take a rookie operator and he can pull just as much wood as a skilled operator could, because I have made the job very easy, so that the difference between the two skill sets is really meaniless.

As I see the operator gain skill and courage, I can leave some easier sidehill trees for them to get and in doing so I keep the production up, by taking up the slack myself.

Sam


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## hammerlogging (Nov 28, 2010)

056 kid said:


> it saves alot of time when the ground is steep and the skids are long.



Bingo.

Accumulating a reasonable turn takes a lot of time. Dozers bunching for grapple skidders is really common too. We do it with jammers. Little machines accumulate a large turn for a big ol' grapple skidder. yes, it could be a forwarder instead. 2 or more cable machines might feed one grapple skidder, depending on skid distance.

I think the swing boom will not be regretted, even if you're not dealing with steep ground. Especially for what its going to cost you.


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## Oldtimer (Nov 28, 2010)

When I said mechanical leverage, I was meaning when the boom was fully "retracted" with a big tree on...you go around a corner and the boom is so high up that it can tip the skidder where it never would have if it was a cable dragging it.
I guess I mean a much higher center of gravity. That's the biggest issue I see with one.

And I am glad to see a 540 owner say his machine takes 800-1000' at a time "reasonably". I know guys who try to take double that. And they do, but they break sh!t all the time too.

I have my eye on a 748 G-II D/A with winch, heat and AC both work, chains all around, and a new engine and tranny....$45K.. If it's still there in 3 months, I'll try for it. Need to pay off the F550 first.


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## Slamm (Nov 28, 2010)

hammerlogging said:


> Bingo.
> 
> Accumulating a reasonable turn takes a lot of time. Dozers bunching for grapple skidders is really common too. We do it with jammers. Little machines accumulate a large turn for a big ol' grapple skidder. yes, it could be a forwarder instead. 2 or more cable machines might feed one grapple skidder, depending on skid distance.



Yes, Hammer, that is exactly the reasons for the cable machine, in the hills that is.



> I think the swing boom will not be regretted, even if you're not dealing with steep ground. Especially for what its going to cost you



Well, that is what I am thinking. I called Esco and they said the things were $55,000 brand new, so I don't think I got screwed, when I paid $2,000 for it. The pins are good and the missing grapple cylinder is in the back of my truck ......... so it isn't missing. All I have to do is unbolt the Cable Arch from the 540B and plasma cut the swing boom's tower off and fab some 1" mounting plates for the swing boom and bolt it onto the back. 

We have some different ideas for the joystick or button controls or lever controls whichever we decide to go with. I don't really like the lever control, as they aren't as quick as joystick. There are 5 functions on the swing boom so I'm going to get 6 function controls and put the front blade onto it and then I will have everything at my fingertips, and not spread out all over.

Worse case scenario its only as good as a regular grapple and best case scenario it is very handy for grabbing logs around trees and over stumps and down in ditches/slopes, staging logs with perfect placement, you can also use the longer stinger/boom to push the skidder when it starts to get stuck like you do with a single function grapple, but this one can really push the skidder through stuff and for longer distances.

I think it will be very handy.

Sam


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## Slamm (Nov 28, 2010)

Oldtimer said:


> When I said mechanical leverage, I was meaning when the boom was fully "retracted" with a big tree on...you go around a corner and the boom is so high up that it can tip the skidder where it never would have if it was a cable dragging it.
> I guess I mean a much higher center of gravity. That's the biggest issue I see with one.
> 
> And I am glad to see a 540 owner say his machine takes 800-1000' at a time "reasonably". I know guys who try to take double that. And they do, but they break sh!t all the time too.
> ...



That is a misconception about this system. Once the log is in the "traveling position" there isn't any differences in the load forces between a cable or single action grapple, because that is based on the log's placement not what is holding it, provided all systems are designed to hold the log in the same position, which is right behind the axle and slightly up.



> And I am glad to see a 540 owner say his machine takes 800-1000' at a time "reasonably". I know guys who try to take double that. And they do, but they break sh!t all the time too.



Yeah, you can pull more but it is hard on them, but there becomes a real compromise between speed and the amount being pulled, as in the little 100 hp 4 cylinders are only going to do it in 1-2 gear period. That is why I'm going to put 150+ engines in them, not so that I can pull bigger trees per say, but that I can pull the same loads in higher gears and hold the higher gears through the hills without shifting.

The bigger engines give me a lot more weight up front where I need it, yet I'm not carrying around the extra 6,000-15,000 pounds of the much larger, clumsy machines. Everything can handle the extra power except for the rear axle. We are going to reset the axle gear clearances and see how long it takes before we break it, LOL. If it ever becomes a problem, I know where some cheap 648 axles are that I can either narrow or cut the centers out of the wheels and reweld them out farther, again well see, might not ever be a problem.

Sam


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## 056 kid (Nov 28, 2010)

I dont know about that, going around turns with trees on the road to help timber stay in the road with a grapple holding a tree just above the ground is ALOT different than going around it with the grapple let down, dragging the tree. They will turn over fast if you let too much side force go on the grapple, it has nothing to do with the log but everything to do with the position of the grapple arch and where its load is coming from. Same physics go for a cable skidder, just not as exaggerated. . 
IMO


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## Slamm (Nov 28, 2010)

056 kid said:


> I dont know about that, going around turns with trees on the road to help timber stay in the road with a grapple holding a tree just above the ground is ALOT different than going around it with the grapple let down, dragging the tree. They will turn over fast if you let too much side force go on the grapple, it has nothing to do with the log but everything to do with the position of the grapple arch and where its load is coming from. Same physics go for a cable skidder, just not as exaggerated. .
> IMO



??? Your point is not what he was talking about??

Are you saying that the swing boom can't put the butt of the tree in the exact same position as any other carrying system?? 

Or are you just trying to explain something to others, that we already know??? 

I will explain again, regardless of the carrying system, cable, swing boom or single/dual grapple. There isn't any difference to the skidder and the center of gravity ONCE the butt of the log is up in the proper carrying position, up and back of the rear axle, BETWEEN the three systems.

Between all three systems if a log it is too high for a turn, it is too high, the skidder will flip regardless of what system is holding it in the wrong position. One great advantage I see in the swing boom is I can manipulate the center of gravity to the opposite side of the pull to put the skidder back down, no other system can do this.

Sam


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## 056 kid (Nov 28, 2010)

Slamm said:


> ??? Your point is not what he was talking about??
> 
> Are you saying that the swing boom can't put the butt of the tree in the exact same position as any other carrying system??
> 
> ...



Im saying that that boom grapple is alot more likely to tip your machine than you think. Hows that? There is a difference in my experiences.


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## Slamm (Nov 28, 2010)

056 kid said:


> Im saying that that boom grapple is alot more likely to tip your machine than you think. Hows that? There is a difference in my experiences.



Like I said, it is a miss conception that the boom grapple will flip your machine over any more than any other carry system, PROVIDED they all are holding the butt of the log in a similar height and distance from the back axle. Additionally, if there is a repeating problem with a particular "corner" then the swing boom could be moved over to off balance the skidder/load and this is a great advantage to other traditional systems.

Sam


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## 056 kid (Nov 28, 2010)

the ability to counter the forces with the swing boom introduces a big advantage for sure!!

But I discredit the "misconseption" I ran a TJ380 with a winch and a TJ450 with a winch and a single arch grapple the most along with a cat here and there. the grapple skidder behaived alot differently than the cable skidder. if you want to go around a turn with the grapple where you risk turning over, you have to lay it down or choke up on the tree which is for extremes. to avoid turning over. The cable skidder you track until she rises and hit the lever, but you can for sure do more in means of lateral force with a cable skidder imo..


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## 380LGR (Nov 28, 2010)

I think you better do some math.. Your tub on your 540 is going to be nowhere long enough for the swing boom!! Its going to be sitting to close to the rear of the machine.


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## hammerlogging (Nov 28, 2010)

Oh yeah, wiggle waggling. I haven't worked for a wiggle waggle crew for a LONG time. Main extraction routes are ####in highways. Staight, lowest grade possible, wood moves steady all day every day, except in the wettest of weather.

I think dude will be fine with his boom. Yes, there will be adaptations to be made, and sacrifices, but it doesn't sound like even a mistake would be too consequential with a healthy equipment spread and the ability to do all this fab work himself. I still say go for it.

Uh oh, sounds like a productivity study in the making.....

I'd rather cut timber than collect and punch data. Guess I'm not patient enough. And addicted to the faller's dance.


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## tlandrum (Nov 28, 2010)

i think the world may be coming to an end,i seen slamm mention pulp, surely you were kidding and are not going to move that no money making pulp. you may make a logger yet lol


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## Slamm (Nov 28, 2010)

380LGR said:


> I think you better do some math.. Your tub on your 540 is going to be nowhere long enough for the swing boom!! Its going to be sitting to close to the rear of the machine.



Thanks for the concern, but I can assure you that as a past machine builder and developer of many efficiency enhancing machines and attachments for many different industries, I have done my math. I fact I have the boom swing sitting next to the skidder right now for comparisons and measurements and I can assure it will be fine.

*This is the best way that I can explain it:*
Due to the smaller size of the 540B, I understand that I MAY or MAY NOT be able to maximize the full potential of the swing boom.

BUT

I will be able to maximize the full potential of my 540B with the swing boom.And that is a huge step toward more production with that little machine.

Again, at worst it isn't any different than a single action grapple.

At best it will do many things that a single action grapple could only dream of.

I found this video, my machine will look similiar to this machine:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=efuXECu073Q


Sam


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## Slamm (Nov 29, 2010)

tlandrum2002 said:


> i think the world may be coming to an end,i seen slamm mention pulp, surely you were kidding and are not going to move that no money making pulp. you may make a logger yet lol



Terry, as I have always stated, I move what makes me money. Cutting pulp while cutting my normal hardwood stuff does not make me money, or better stated it doesn't make me enough for the effort I have to put forth to collect it and ship it. Trust me if you got paid what I got paid for pulp and had to do what I have to do and live in this area, you wouldn't screw with it either, if you had as much other great timber that the people who pay you want cut, and they aren't making any money on pulp either ...... comparatively.

This is a little different, 300+ acres that has to be leveled, as per the contract. That means everything 5" and larger is going bye bye, and there is a lot of big timber on this job.

There are 5 figure fines if this is not accomplished within a certain time period and with the winter upon us. That time frame could be very difficult due to weird weather conditions.

I'm currently working on getting two machine cutters in here and possibly 3 or more skidders, along with hand cutters and such. The pulp in this case was stated as being somewhere in the range of 6000+ tons, so we will see how it goes. Will be going over more details tomorrow as there might be a "slight" change in the contract tomorrow and have to see how that effects this operation, this week is going to be busy.

Sam


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## 056 kid (Nov 29, 2010)

And your gonna buck all that with saws & load all that with your forked skip loader?


:yourock:

:agree2:

:monkey:

wow


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## tlandrum (Nov 29, 2010)

sam if your going to be moving that kind of pulp you better make sure the pulp mill will take all of it. right now the yard i deal with wont take but 100ton per week from me. but with nasty wet winter weather coming on they will go back to letting me haul full tilt. the small tractor and ton truck loggers will fall out and the guys left with the equipment will get the rest of the quota. sounds like youll need a limbing gate and maybe a loader with limber mounted on trailer. ive seen a few good deals lately if your going in the big leauges you better get the proper tools or like you mentioned fines may cost more than the tools to prevent them. sometimes those big contract jobs can wipe a man out if trouble occurs and the big guys dont care what happens to us little guys.


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## Oldtimer (Nov 29, 2010)

Why is all 300 acres being stripped? Re-planting, or development?


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## 380LGR (Nov 29, 2010)

I love pulp wood... Problem is once you go down pulp alley you never come back!


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## Slamm (Nov 29, 2010)

tlandrum2002 said:


> sam if your going to be moving that kind of pulp you better make sure the pulp mill will take all of it. right now the yard i deal with wont take but 100ton per week from me. but with nasty wet winter weather coming on they will go back to letting me haul full tilt. the small tractor and ton truck loggers will fall out and the guys left with the equipment will get the rest of the quota. sounds like youll need a limbing gate and maybe a loader with limber mounted on trailer. ive seen a few good deals lately if your going in the big leauges you better get the proper tools or like you mentioned fines may cost more than the tools to prevent them. sometimes those big contract jobs can wipe a man out if trouble occurs and the big guys dont care what happens to us little guys.



Thanks for the concern, but I'm pretty sure I have done my homework and have the best of all worlds with this setup.

Without going into much detail .............. all I have to do is cut and skid it to the landing and nothing more. I don't buy timber and I don't sell timber so the rest is of little concern to me, within reason, as long as they have the money to pay me ...... which they do.

I don't understand pulp, I don't really want to understand or deal with the drama that pulp wood involves. With all the mills closing and insane waits for the truckers. I'm happy that someone can make money with it, but I would rather just cut and pull big logs. The pulp part just kinda fell into my lap, as I am going to be there already for the 650,000+BDFT (logs) that we are cutting and skidding so I might as well get my buddy that has machine cutters in to level the little stuff, so my hand cutters have it easier, obviously a start from the front and drop everything until you reach the back, kinda job. As of today, we are still kinda unclear as to how much of this job we get??? There were 3-4 meetings with higher ups and I got 3 phone calls today that were all positive, but nobody said to load the machines yet, so I'm still praying, LOL. Hopefull tomorrow, I get the for sure okay. We are all meeting on the land on Wednesday, I know the area and its pretty flat.

Well see.

Sam


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## jay_d (Nov 30, 2010)

Slamm said:


> \
> 
> I will be able to maximize the full potential of my 540B with the swing boom.[/COLOR]And that is a huge step toward more production with that little machine.
> 
> ...




aint trying to be mean, but a good single arch with a winch will outdo that contraption with ease. what time you are busy turned over the guy on the single arch will be steady going. It looks good in theory but ive yet to be made a believer. if you only gave 2k for it you didnt lose money, looks like the grapple is worth that/

put a heel on it and load trucks lol


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## Slamm (Nov 30, 2010)

jay_d said:


> aint trying to be mean, but a good single arch with a winch will outdo that contraption with ease. what time you are busy turned over the guy on the single arch will be steady going. It looks good in theory but ive yet to be made a believer. if you only gave 2k for it you didnt lose money, looks like the grapple is worth that/
> 
> put a heel on it and load trucks lol



???? it can operated just like a single boom, so explain to me how the single arch has an advantage again?? The advantages of the swing boom are quite numerous, in fact there aren't any disadvantages to it, if you know what you are doing.

Sam


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## Slamm (Nov 30, 2010)

380LGR said:


> I love pulp wood... Problem is once you go down pulp alley you never come back!



Yeah, I see that as a potential risk, with this job, LOL.

We'll see, I'm really not interested in pulp, it seems like it sets you up for big money ........................... and then one big failure down the road. I'm big enough to be useful and small enough, that just me and Karen (wife) can do small jobs and make them pay good, or I can just quit logging for awhile if the jobs just get pear shaped, and do something else that makes more money.

The swing boom allows me to make my beloved cable skidder into a fast grapple type skidder and still use the cable/winch with good visibility and do things with that boom in the woods and at the landing that you can't do with either, cable or single action grapple.

The more I think about it and come up with more possibilities the more I like it, LOL.

Sam


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## 371groundie (Nov 30, 2010)

i was told i could make a living cutting with a tractor. i proved them wrong. the only reason im not doing it now was that the quotas shut me out, not that i wasnt moving enough wood.

so dont let the naysayers get you down. i think that looks like a cunnin little rig and would like to fool around with it for a week or so and see how it goes. 

cutting and skidding with a tractor i was in much the same situation you are, one or two trees and i was at the limit my machine would pull. (albeit my trees were smaller) i spent alot of time trying to stuff a choker under a log thinking, 'i wonder how a grapple would work?' and with the tractor i could swap out 3pt implements fairly quick and easy. 

keeps us posted as you get this critter assembled, especially the control unit.


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## Slamm (Nov 30, 2010)

371groundie said:


> i was told i could make a living cutting with a tractor. i proved them wrong. the only reason im not doing it now was that the quotas shut me out, not that i wasnt moving enough wood.
> 
> so dont let the naysayers get you down. i think that looks like a cunnin little rig and would like to fool around with it for a week or so and see how it goes.
> 
> ...



Will do, we are working out what joystick/s that I want to use and some mounting ideas, but it should be pretty easy.

Sam


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## joesawer (Nov 30, 2010)

Slamm said:


> ???? it can operated just like a single boom, so explain to me how the single arch has an advantage again?? The advantages of the swing boom are quite numerous, in fact there aren't any disadvantages to it, if you know what you are doing.
> 
> Sam






Hmmmm I see a big surprise in your future.
With the ability to articulate the tractor you already have something of a swing boom.

On anything but the steepest or roughest ground i can not see any need for a swing grapple. You would do better to invest a few thousand dollars and a few hundred hours learning from some really slick grapple operators.

But you are sold on the idea and it is your baby. And when you get done you will have a very limited application highly customized tractor.

That swing boom does look smaller than and lighter than ones on a D5


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## Slamm (Dec 1, 2010)

joesawer said:


> Hmmmm I see a big surprise in your future.
> With the ability to articulate the tractor you already have something of a swing boom.
> 
> On anything but the steepest or roughest ground i can not see any need for a swing grapple. You would do better to invest a few thousand dollars and a few hundred hours learning from some really slick grapple operators.
> ...



Ha ha, thanks for the advice. You gotta love the internet, its give just about anyone the opportunity to "help", especially when I ask for it, LOL. So now I can't drive a grapple skidder and need to learn from someone who is better.



> On anything but the steepest or roughest ground i can not see any need for a swing grapple. You would do better to invest a few thousand dollars and a few hundred hours learning from some really slick grapple operators.



Is that your final answer, because if it is, I will stand in amazement. So let me get this straight. I should get rid of this swing boom attachment or I shouldn't have bought it in the first place and instead, should have either bought a less capable attachment like a single arch grapple or not convert the cable skidder at all and just spend the thousands of dollars and my valuable time finding some other grapple skidder driver and I guess videoing and watch him. Right? Did I get that right? I'm really interested in your next answer, because personally, if I took your advice to a T, I would be the dumbest SOB that ever walked, LOL. If your mind is so foggy that you can't see the additional capabilities privided by a grapple system that can do anything a regular grapple skidder can do, and a lot more for virtually NO additional output on my part, I will really be interested in how you could spin your way out of this ignorant advice.

What I think is still amazing is your don't know me, and just because I have purchased a more advanced grappling system, for very little money, it somehow in your mind proves or shows in your mind that I somehow suck as a grapple skidder operator ......................... Please, explain how you came to that conclusion. I will await your answer, LOL.

Later, Oh yee of little vision,

Sam


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## 380LGR (Dec 1, 2010)

Wheewww somebody wacked the bees nest!!!


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## Slamm (Dec 1, 2010)

380LGR said:


> Wheewww somebody wacked the bees nest!!!



Illogical people just amaze me is all, LOL.

Sam


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## 056 kid (Dec 1, 2010)

Whatever you do, please dont get hurt Slamm, It would be a tragedy to lose a proud hobby logger such as you!


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## Slamm (Dec 1, 2010)

056 kid said:


> Whatever you do, please dont get hurt Slamm, It would be a tragedy to lose a proud hobby logger such as you!



You logging or cutting trees now?? Or do you just act like it?

Sam


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## 056 kid (Dec 1, 2010)

I just act like it Slizzamm, I cut about 10 chords of firewood recently, but I negate that from any actual work. Last time I produced was about 2 or three months ago and that makes me sad .

Why do you ask, are you preparing a personal attack for me?

OH BOY!!


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## Slamm (Dec 2, 2010)

056 kid said:


> I just act like it Slizzamm, I cut about 10 chords of firewood recently, but I negate that from any actual work. Last time I produced was about 2 or three months ago and that makes me sad .
> 
> Why do you ask, are you preparing a personal attack for me?
> 
> OH BOY!!



I have heard people on these forums talk about an ignore button ..... where is that at??

Be helpful for a change.

Sam


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## joesawer (Dec 2, 2010)

Slamm said:


> Ha ha, thanks for the advice. You gotta love the internet, its give just about anyone the opportunity to "help", especially when I ask for it, LOL. So now I can't drive a grapple skidder and need to learn from someone who is better.
> 
> 
> 
> ...





Calm down mister fab genuis. Like you said you asked for it and then reject it. If you already know all that there is to know WHY do you ask at all.
If you stay in the business long enough, eventually you will hear the popping sound of your head coming out of your anus! Lol!!!!
Having personally run a single arch skidder and a swing boom quite a bit I will tell you that I can smoke a swing boom skidder with a single arch grapple skidder on virtually all the terrain in western Ky. And yes I know what kind of ground and timber you have there.
You will be in for a big surprise if you ever see a good grapple operator working next to a swing boom.
It is not just my opinion, if it was better they would be every where. 
and esco would be building them like crazy. lol
And finally you ask how I know that you suck as a grapple operator!!! If you where a good grapple operator you would already know that more functions are a pain in the butt when you don't have to have them.


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## 056 kid (Dec 2, 2010)

Slamm said:


> I have heard people on these forums talk about an ignore button ..... where is that at??
> 
> Be helpful for a change.
> 
> Sam



I dont even think being helpful is possible with you your so full of self righteous beans!!


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## Slamm (Dec 2, 2010)

joesawer said:


> Blah, blah blah .........And finally you ask how I know that you suck as a grapple operator!!! If you where a good grapple operator you would already know that more functions are a pain in the butt when you don't have to have them.




Additional functions and capabilities on a machine only serve to limit additional production if the operator is limited in his capabilities. So what you are saying is your current/past skill level is of a lower level that you should just stay with the simple machines, and I understand that, I have some skidder operators that are just like you, and I have found ways to work around those with handicaps like that, but since I have both a single action grapple skidder and a cable skidder, which is going to be converted into a swing boom, I'll have a machine for those of limited thinking capacity and one for those that are more advanced in brain function, and situations that require a more advanced machine.

And I don't mind, so much you giving me your opinion of the attachment if you don't mind me qualifying it for my application and situation.

Honestly can someone point me to the ignore feature?? Surely this forum has one.

Thanks,

Sam


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## yooper (Dec 2, 2010)

Slamm said:


> Honestly can someone point me to the ignore feature?? Surely this forum has one.
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> Sam



its under settings and options on your user page


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## 380LGR (Dec 2, 2010)

if you have a dual function grapple you would throw the single and the swing boom out to auction!!


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## Slamm (Dec 2, 2010)

380LGR said:


> if you have a dual function grapple you would throw the single and the swing boom out to auction!!



Well, that makes no sense at all, but I guess, everyone can have an opinion.

The single function is the simplest and the swing boom is the more complex or has the most functions. So on a scale from least useful to most useful the dual function is in the middle. Because the swing boom can do anything that either the single or dual function grapples can do and then a lot more. I am shocked ...... well no I'm not, its the internet, that this is not obvious to others, very weird.

I have spoke with several logging company's who have nothing but swing booms due to the usefulness of them, and yet there are people here to state they are next to useless, LOL.

Thanks about the ignore deal, it will save me time in the future.

Sam


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## 056 kid (Dec 2, 2010)

Am I ignored yet?


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## hammerlogging (Dec 2, 2010)

056 kid said:


> Am I ignored yet?



I try but I get such a damn kick out of you I can't.


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## Slamm (Dec 2, 2010)

hammerlogging said:


> I try but I get such a damn kick out of you I can't.



LOL, Hammer, it won't do me any good to ignore him if you quote him LOL. I try to get away from the ignorance and it still finds me, LOL.

Sam


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## 056 kid (Dec 2, 2010)

You haven't even had a taste Joe, you should have let me work:hmm3grin2orange:. . .

BTW, how does the ignore feature work? Do my posts still post, and everyone but Slamm can see them? LOL. . .


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## hammerlogging (Dec 2, 2010)

Kid, I can only imagine. I tried, and I'll try again.


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## joesawer (Dec 3, 2010)

Lol not only do your posts show a gross lack of experience your skin is much too thin to be a logger!
Buck up Buttercup!!!
Grow some hide an get some experience and when you hear that popping sound let me know. LOL

P.S.
someone please quote me


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## tlandrum (Dec 3, 2010)

joesawer said:


> Lol not only do your posts show a gross lack of experience your skin is much too thin to be a logger!
> Buck up Buttercup!!!
> Grow some hide an get some experience and when you hear that popping sound let me know. LOL
> 
> ...



:hmm3grin2orange:


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## slowp (Dec 3, 2010)

056 kid said:


> Am I ignored yet?



I think you are, but apparently if we quote you, we'll have to be ignored. Kind of like

I AM SPARTACUS. NO, I AM SPARTACUS. 

This might be fun! :hmm3grin2orange:


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## slowp (Dec 3, 2010)

joesawer said:


> Lol not only do your posts show a gross lack of experience your skin is much too thin to be a logger!
> Buck up Buttercup!!!
> Grow some hide an get some experience and when you hear that popping sound let me know. LOL
> 
> ...



Just in case...Spartacus...:biggrinbounce2:

Not a logger but why does the video of the grapple show it never leaving the road? Is there a lesson in that video? Hmmmmmm.


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## Gologit (Dec 3, 2010)

056 kid said:


> Am I ignored yet?



Nope.


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## whitebutler (Dec 3, 2010)

Awh the love around here!

so the whole swing boom thing on a conventional is ok just NEVER forget make sure it has a swing lock and NEVER forget to lock it with skid on only bunchin with out it or the time loss for putting it back on the tire side will cost ya.......


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## SWE#Kipp (Dec 10, 2010)

This one looks nice ,,

http://www.youtube.com/user/Lumberking100#p/u/7/q-wXvkJgHt4


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## joesawer (Dec 11, 2010)

SWE#Kipp said:


> This one looks nice ,,
> 
> http://www.youtube.com/user/Lumberking100#p/u/7/q-wXvkJgHt4





That is kinda painful to watch.


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## Oldtimer (Dec 11, 2010)

Yes, it was. Hope he is the owner, and not an hourly worker.


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## Metals406 (Dec 11, 2010)

All you guys are dumb heads!! It's almost 2011!

Sam clearly  needs to be using up-to-date technology to get his wood out! All other ideas are stupid. :jester:


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## 056 kid (Dec 11, 2010)

Lololololololololololololololol


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## Gologit (Dec 11, 2010)

*Metals406*

Okay Nate...now you owe me for a monitor/keyboard Sprite spray removal ! :hmm3grin2orange::hmm3grin2orange::hmm3grin2orange:


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## slowp (Dec 11, 2010)

Metals406 said:


> All you guys are dumb heads!! It's almost 2011!
> 
> Sam clearly  needs to be using up-to-date technology to get his wood out! All other ideas are stupid. :jester:



Now that's just stupid. Everybody knows that if you have a starship, you don't need no stinkin' chokers. You use the transporter and BEAM THEM UP!
Get with the program.....


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## hammerlogging (Dec 11, 2010)

I just Zen that #### from stump to deck. Mind over matter.


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## slowp (Dec 11, 2010)

hammerlogging said:


> I just Zen that #### from stump to deck. Mind over matter.



Zen might work in peckerpoles but the high balling outfits use the Transporter. I mean, it worked for moving whales didn't it? 

Maybe Zen is taught as part of the GOL? :biggrinbounce2: And, admit it, it IS DEFINITELY and Eastern method. :hmm3grin2orange:


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## Metals406 (Dec 12, 2010)

slowp said:


> Now that's just stupid. Everybody knows that if you have a starship, you don't need no stinkin' chokers. You use the transporter and BEAM THEM UP!
> Get with the program.....





hammerlogging said:


> I just Zen that #### from stump to deck. Mind over matter.





slowp said:


> Zen might work in peckerpoles but the high balling outfits use the Transporter. I mean, it worked for moving whales didn't it?
> 
> Maybe Zen is taught as part of the GOL? :biggrinbounce2: And, admit it, it IS DEFINITELY and Eastern method. :hmm3grin2orange:



:hmm3grin2orange::hmm3grin2orange::hmm3grin2orange:


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## Metals406 (Dec 12, 2010)

Gologit said:


> Okay Nate...now you owe me for a monitor/keyboard Sprite spray removal ! :hmm3grin2orange::hmm3grin2orange::hmm3grin2orange:



Sorry Bob!


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## joesawer (Dec 12, 2010)

Lmao!!!
No you just need to up grade the space ship with a swing boom and you know it will be the ultimate logging ship!
Even better than beaming them up or zen!


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## slowp (Dec 12, 2010)

joesawer said:


> Lmao!!!
> No you just need to up grade the space ship with a swing boom and you know it will be the ultimate logging ship!
> Even better than beaming them up or zen!



I wouldn't invest in one right now. I hear that Tribbles are going to be placed on the endangered species list.


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## 056 kid (Dec 12, 2010)

Space cadet logging, taught by a GOL instructor near you!


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## RandyMac (Dec 12, 2010)

Nate, the Enterprise is soo last century.

Hey Kid!!!
We should tie one on, post a lot of nonsense, I want to increase my ignore listings.





















































joesawer said:


> Lol not only do your posts show a gross lack of experience your skin is much too thin to be a logger!
> Buck up Buttercup!!!
> Grow some hide an get some experience and when you hear that *popping *sound let me know. LOL


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## 056 kid (Dec 12, 2010)

You bet Old timer, gonna have to wait alittle though, Im traveling this evening,(bus driver will boot you if you are boozed.)


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## Slamm (Dec 13, 2010)

Been using a Cat 518 with the larger model swing boom on it and myself and the other operator like it. At this point the only draw we have found is the lever controls. Knowing what you want it to do and knowing that the attachment can do it doesn't do any good if you can't communicate it to the attachment with the lever controls. So we are going to convert it to either joystick control or a touchpad with electric valves, and that should solve that problem. The problem with the lever controls is you can't get enough or multi movements very easily with the levers so in certain situations when you can use both hands on the levers it is great but other times it could be much faster with the joystick control.

Additionally, while I know that Esco grapples have pulled out Billions of feet of wood .................. they suck when compared to a Deere grapple's continuous rotating motor and Deere's much more precise angle control and stronger rotating motor, plus I like the bunching grapples on the Deere's better, so we are going to cut the Esco's grapple part off and put Deere's grapple system on the end, which should work much better.

As to the other spaceship stuff, don't know, I run kinda a low budget setup, so one of you guys will have to give that a try, but I guess it would be more in line with the helicopter type of "skidding" that they do.

Later,

Sam


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## TumblebugTaylor (Dec 13, 2010)

Theres a neat little skidder made in europe called Woody Ive seen on You Tube that is about the size of your skidder with a swing boom on it and its bidirectional and remotecontrol ed to. The neat thing about it was it had 2 small inverted grapples like mini clam bunks one on each side. It could put a log in each one of those and haul one in the grapple.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5NzIH185cqM&feature=related
Its kind of a cross breed skidder/tool carrier.


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## KyMasterLogger (Dec 27, 2010)

a couple of things that come to mind right off: 

im pretty sure the 540b cable has a smaller hydraulic pump than a grapple machine. 

that swing boom have bigger hydraulic cylinders than the cyls on a grapple 540b? there could be a very slow operating time of the boom, having to move more fluid and all that jazz takes time.

best i can remember, the grapple machine(as compared to a cable machine) is a little longer. for a swing boom, it may even have to be longer (but i dont know). do you plan on using that complete frame as the rear half of your skidder or are you going to adapt that frame to the cable machine rear frame.

just curious, but how old is the 540B(s) that you have?

and please PM me your location and a phone #. i'd love to see this thing in person.


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## Slamm (Dec 31, 2010)

KyMasterLogger said:


> a couple of things that come to mind right off:
> 
> im pretty sure the 540b cable has a smaller hydraulic pump than a grapple machine.
> 
> ...


 
No problem on the grapple hydro pump size they are all the same on a Deere.

The cylinders are not bigger and there is only one cylinder per action instead of two like on a single function grapple so action might be faster instead of slower.

The rear of the cable machine is shorter than the same 540B grapple rearend, but that shouldn't bother it too much, as this is the smaller version of the Esco Swing Boom that I am mounting onto it.

For a few weeks I have been using my CAT 518 Skidder with the larger model Swing Boom, and it can pick up 30" oak trees and move them from side to side and up and down at the further extents with complete ease. So I don't see this scaled down version as being any sort of problem for the smaller 540B skidder size, and I love this skidder it is the tightest best handling skidder I know of, flawless describes it best, as it has super fast steering and I'm putting a bigger engine in it as soon as a hill job presents itself. Right now the 90-100 hp is fine for flat ground work, but I hate it for any kinda hill work.

Now we are just too busy to get away and get the swing boom mounted. I have some more guys coming to help work and that might give me a chance to take the cable machine home or to the machine shop and mount the swing boom and joystick controls. As soon as I get that completed, then joystick controls are going onto the 518, that machine is just amazing at what it can do with that boom. I will never log without a swing boom, I can tell you that for sure. What you can do with them is tops.

Sam


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## KyMasterLogger (Jan 1, 2011)

Slamm said:


> No problem on the grapple hydro pump size they are all the same on a Deere.
> 
> The cylinders are not bigger and there is only one cylinder per action instead of two like on a single function grapple so action might be faster instead of slower.
> 
> ...


 
sam, there are 2 different pumps. a 3 cubic inch pump for cable machines and a 4 cubic inch pump for grapple machines according to the JD Tech Manual 1139, section 21 page 2160-4. i believe they are the same physical size though.

i have a late 70's 540b that was originally a cable machine, but has a esco grapple on it now. the hydraulics on it are slow, imo and needs a larger pump. the rear arch was unbolted and the grapple was fabricated to bolt onto the rear frame at the same place where the arch was. the machine will rare up on even the smallest hills with a decent load. if the machine was 1 or 2 feet longer, this problem would be helped alot or possibly solved. fluid filled front tires would also help, but is something im not willing to do. 

having been down a similar road with modifying a machine to better suit your needs, heres some lessons i have learned:
1) bigger and faster is not always better, unless we are talking about hyd pumps and fluid flow.
2) wheelbase (especially on hilly terrain), longer is usually better. and if you dont believe me ask any woman! lol

KML


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## 380LGR (Jan 2, 2011)

The pumps are not the same on the cable or the grapple. There is no hydro tank on cable machines its in the tranny. Grapple has seperate hydro tank with a charge pump and a tandem hydro pump.


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## Slamm (Jan 2, 2011)

380LGR said:


> The pumps are not the same on the cable or the grapple. There is no hydro tank on cable machines its in the tranny. Grapple has seperate hydro tank with a charge pump and a tandem hydro pump.


 
?? My 540B Cable and 540B Grapple may have different sized pumps internally, but the external size and all is the same, but there isn't any separate Hydro Tank or Charge pump. Possibly you are talking about a separate manufacturer of skidders.

Sam


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## TMFARM 2009 (Jan 2, 2011)

that pretty cool i agree... i wonder if you could fab a cutter head for it also....one machine does all thing?hmm would be a good concept. especially for ky...


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## 380LGR (Jan 2, 2011)

Sorry was refering to a 640 648 machines never owned a 540 548.


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## Slamm (Jan 2, 2011)

I just learned how to tell if a Deere pump is high capacity or not, by an extra hole in the end of the splined shaft, so I can check my cable machine when I take it apart to see if it is.

I don't know anything about the 600 series Deere Skidders, just that they are huge, LOL.

Sam


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## Slamm (Jan 7, 2011)

Here is my 518 at work. Pulled 242 trees and pecker poles in 5.5 hours with this 518 Swing Boom and a 540B Grapple. I guess, I'll wait a little longer for that "popping sound ". Did this post with my phone so no narrative.










































Sam


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## KyMasterLogger (Jan 8, 2011)

thought you might like to see this. YouTube - 1980 John Deere 540B Swing Grapple Skidder


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## madhatte (Jan 11, 2011)

There's an outfit cutting one of our units right now running two skidders with swing booms. If I get a chance, I'll take some pictures and ask some questions.


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## Slamm (Jan 15, 2011)

KyMasterLogger said:


> thought you might like to see this. YouTube - 1980 John Deere 540B Swing Grapple Skidder


 
Sorry for slow response, been working from before sun up to after sun down for weeks with no computer time. Thanks, thats the same video I posted before on number 41 post of this thread. I've really learned a lot from running the Cat 518 Swinger that I have. I *can* see how I lived without one for years, because I did it, but man it sure is a lot easier with a swing boom on the job. 

While I don't think every skidder that a multi-skidder operation has, should have a swinger on it, certainly one swinger to one or two single/dual grapples is a nice ratio. It does take some getting use to, to get fast with it, but once you do, it has easily up'd production to almost double on some days in what would be crappy conditions. Depending on the logs amount and their lay out and density and the length of the skid, I can stay 1-5 hitches/bunches ahead of the regular skidder and that machine is only stopping just long enough to shift from reverse to forward when picking up the next hitch in the woods that I have built for him, and then its 3-6 gear to the landing to drop them off on the fly and back again. The hitches are sorted better pulp on one hitch and saw logs in others. I can reach of tops, throw tops out of the way, reach across ditches and creeks, down hills, over stumps all without having to drive my skidders through or over these obstacles and racking up wear and abuse on them. My hitches or bunches are better sized toward the single action grapple and already setup for an optimum pull, with hills or other obstacles taken into account. For instance if it is level or downhill, I know to build larger hitches, if uphill or bad/muddy crossings, I go smaller. It allows me to keep the "traveling" skidder running at full production all day with no stops.

One day Jerry had three stops in the whole day, twice to pee and once for short lunch. He was quite proud of that day, so was I, the amount of wood that came out that day would just flat put a grin on your face, LOL, and it all came out without any undo abuse to the skidders, now my back and neck were sore from running that swing boom skidder backwards all day, but that is good pain, LOL. 

I can see how those machines that have swivel seats or something would really be nice ...... but not for the money at my little level. Because when you get good with this thing you end up driving it backwards about as much as you drive it forwards, thankfully the 518's seat is already canted to the right about 15 degrees and the seat is the size of a small sofa. The torque converter tranny is really nice too, as you don't have to wear your right arm out operating the boom and then shifting gears too.

Later,

Sam


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## Iron Mike2 (Feb 11, 2013)

*Swing Boom Grapple*

Did you ever get this mounted on your 540B? Wondering how it turned out.


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## StihlKiwi (Feb 12, 2013)

Another classic "What do you guys think of this, even though I know best and my mind's made up" thread.

I wonder if Slamm's heard any "popping" sounds recently :hmm3grin2orange:


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## springboard (Feb 12, 2013)

*0k*

really enjoyed reading this old post. Got the quote in "blue" letters memorized now. It really makes sense.


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## Iron Mike2 (May 9, 2014)

Slamm, did you ever finish this? How did it work out? I would love to see some pic's of it.


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