# echo cs4400 or stihl 290?



## North Wood (Oct 27, 2006)

hey all here is the question i am faced with 

i can get a cs4400 on ebay for around 200 delivered or there is a stihl 290 in the paper that would be 325

which should i go with is the 290 125 dollars better?

any comments or wisdom would be appreciated  


i do own the cs305 not a bad saw wish i had gone with the cs345 becouse it uses standard bar and chains not the homo depot only parts :bang: 

thanx


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## NYH1 (Oct 27, 2006)

I don't know anything about Echo chainsaws. I do have a Stihl 029 Farm Boss which is basically the same thing as the MS290. I have a 20 inch bar on mine which I believe is to big for the saw. I'll probably change the bar to an 18 inch if I keep the saw (and I probably will). The only complaint I have about the saw is it's weight. It does make decent power, but it's heavier then it should be for the amount of power it makes in my opinion. But if you look at it as power, weight *and cost* it's not a bad deal, in my opinion. I paid $300 for mine brand new in the spring 2000. It's been 100% reliable. I change the air filter and sharpen the chain when needed, that's it! Good luck!


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## trax (Oct 27, 2006)

It all depends on what your doing with it. The MS290 is a 56cc saw that weighs 13 lbs and the CS 440 is a 43cc saw that weighs 10.5 lbs


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## computeruser (Oct 27, 2006)

You can get the Stihl new for that price. So I'd pass on the one in the paper, no matter what. There is NO reason to pay that much for a used 029/MS290 - when I sold my lightly-used 290 a while back, it went for $250 with a case, four sharpened loops and four new loops, a case, spare air filter, oil, scrench, and files/guide.

Returning to the issue at hand, you're back to the 44cc versus 56cc issue. Apples and oranges, to be quite honest. If it was a 520 Echo versus the 290, well then we might have something to talk about.

You'd be better off figuring out what kind of saw you need to do the kind of work you intend to do and once you've done that, decide how much you are willing and able to spend. From there, the choice will more or less make itself. And don't just jump on the first saw you see, there is no shortage of good saws out there.


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## computeruser (Oct 27, 2006)

North Wood said:


> i do own the cs305 not a bad saw wish i had gone with the cs345 becouse it uses standard bar and chains not the homo depot only parts :bang:



You can run standard bars/chains on the 3000/301/305 saws, too. Are you complaining about the Intenz bar, or something else?

If you're complaining about the Intenz bar, you can retrofit a standard bar tensioner setup for about $7 and 7 minutes of your time. Then you can run a standard bar. I've ditched the Intenz bars on all the Echos I've owned or used.

I've run the Oregon Pro91 bars and Stihl PM chain (oops, a loop of the safety stuff is pictured on the saw below, for some reason). Bailey's currently has some good specials on bar/chain combos for the little Echos. About $20 for a bar and chain, I believe, and they should be able to set you up with a tensioner setup, too.


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## buckwheat (Oct 27, 2006)

Do some research.

How much wood are you going to cut per year? (Pro saw v. home-owner)
What size wood will that usually be? (bar length and displacement/size)
Can you get it serviced locally? Is the shop reliable?
If you buy a used saw and it isn't as advertised, can you readily get your money back? Can you try it out beforehand?
What are the going prices for the models you are interested in?


If priced right, the 029 is a reliable home-owner saw. Although heavy, you can put a 16"/.325 setup on it and make the chips fly. If you are buying used, it should be cosmetically and operationally near new to be worth the hassle - and make sure the piston has not been burned with straight gas. I think the 025 is actually a better deal.

Echo is also a reliable product for low to moderate use, but servicing can be a concern. They can be a little quirky, but my Echo 3450 just keeps on impressing me over the years. Many pro's are attracted by the price point, and regard them as bargain "throw away" saws.

I don't have a 4400, but I've never heard many complaints about them. I have owned an 029, and I found the saw ran smooth, was reliable, and was far better than the reputation that "purists" had given it. It was the first saw I owned that paid for itself.


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## North Wood (Oct 27, 2006)

lets see 

thanx for all the info so far

mostly popul wood to cut up for the wood boiler say 9-15 inches 15 being the biggest mainly in the 10-12 range diameter

currently use the pullon pro 295 for this and it does an ok job but has nasty habbit of throwing the chain say about every tankful or so. never hurts the blade but dang anooying:deadhorse: 

also a bit more power would be nice seems to bog in the wood and i find myself liftingthe saw to get rpm's back and continue

running the stock 20" bar and low kickback chain

other than the chain slipping off and the bogging it runs flawlessly starts 1-2 pulls idels perfect feels good in the hand.....

is the chain slipping a common problum of the pollun or is it becouse of the quality of the saw?

sorry about all the questions


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## l2edneck (Oct 27, 2006)

I run 4400 cuts great.I wouldnt ever say it would out cut a 290.I have a 20" bar on mine and gives me no probs so far.

If yer gonna spend the 325,go for the stihl new.If its just between those 2 saws id go for the 4400 just cause its new and theres usually a reason someone is sellin theres in the paper. JMO


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## timothykamp (Oct 28, 2006)

i have the 290 and love it- although I would love to go from a 16" to a 20" bar- btw anyone got one? pm me

the 290 cuts pretty quickly with a sharp chain - i use it to cut like 15 cords a year for firewood.


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## windthrown (Oct 28, 2006)

*Cannot go wrong with Echo or Stihl...*

We have a smaller Echo 14 inch saw with the top grip and it is bulletproof. Light weight and easy to use, starts well and runs great. They take a real beating. I am looking for another new or near-new same-model one if I can find one on Ebay or Craigslist. 

We also have the Stihl 290 with both a 16 and a 20 inch bar, and it has more than enough power to run the 20 inch bar from what I have run it through. Actually the 20 inch bar will probably stay on there unless my girlfriend wants to use it. She is better with the shorter bar on the Stihl, but is happy using the smaller Echo. The 290 cuts alder, Doug fir, maple, oak and madrone like butter. No real problems, except a gas line break that was easilly replaced. It has an odd air-tune requirement with the summer/winter flippy air adjustments, but considering that you have to clean any air filter element anyway, it is not really an issue. It will definatly have more oomph over the Echo you list with the smaller engine. 

Also owning a Stihl is like owning an Toyota PU truck. They are highly rated, and they command a high premium in the used market. Even an old broken Stihl or one in a pile of pieces will get interest from a lot of people. For that reason, buying a new one will probably cost you about the same as a near-new one, so you may as well buy the new one.


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## dankerrigan (Nov 2, 2006)

*I have both of these saws*

I have an Echo CS-4400 that I acquired (for free) from my mother in law shortly after I purchased a brand new MS 290 and between the two I prefer the Stihl MS 290. Below I've listed the pros/cons for each of the saws based on my personal usage:

Echo CS-4400:
Pros:
Fast chain speed
Lightweight (~10lbs incl. 18" bar/chain)
Uses standard Oregon bars/chains
Moderately easy to maintain (cleaning, sharpening), screwdriver required to remove the head/filter cover, standard screws throughout, nuts on side
Uses 50:1 gas/oil mixture, conveniently the same as my Stihl
Was free to me, otherwise would not have considered it
Starts reliably for me
Easier to physically control due to light weight and less power
Uses less fuel than the Stihl due to lower displacement
Plenty of power for what I cut for firewood (locust, walnut, oak + many other softer woods) but requires more time compared to the Stihl

Cons:
Less sustained power when cutting compared to MS 290 due to lower displacement
Chain tensioning screw is positioned parallel with a scrench making this task a handfull
Saw is old enough that it has little or no vibration dampening compared to the Stihl

Stihl MS 290
Pros:
Relatively fast chain speed on a 20" bar although I'll probably get a 16" or 18" to use most of the time in the future
Plenty of power to make it through long cuts faster
Truly easy to maintain - filter cover can be removed without tools, filter removed with screwdriver/scrench, nuts on side, Torx everywhere else though
Built in winterizing features (below 50 F), switchable using the scrench
Chain tensioning screw is positioned perpendicular to the bar in between the bar attachment bolts which makes it very easy to access and use
Plenty of power for 99% of my firewood cutting needs
Starts very reliably for me after it was broken in
Vibration dampening works very well

Cons:
50:1 gas/oil mixture - makes it a no-brainer to pick up the Stihl brand oil, pre-measured for one gallon of gas
Heavy (13lb (head only I think) + bar chain weight) compared to the Echo although I spend less time cutting with the Stihl so it probably evens things out a little
Must visit the Stihl dealer to obtain chains/bars. No on-line ordering that I'm aware of however a Stihl dealer happens to be less than 5 miles from my home
Harder to control due to heavier weight and more power
Uses more fuel than the Echo due to larger displacement

In conclusion, although the Echo is lighter, is easier to handle, and starts just as well, even for small jobs I prefer to use the Stihl. I get through faster and my hands still have feeling in them at the end of a longer cutting session. The vibration dampening in my new Stihl is so superior to the Echo that there is not a question as to which saw is more comfortable to use. Also I saw on Ebay that people are auctioning CS-440s (newer CS-4400 I believe) for well under $200. A new Stihl MS 290 should be around $350 which includes a chain and bar, a full tank of gas, and is assembled by a professional (those last two are required of Stihl Dealers.) A new CS-440 costs $300 at the Home Depot here and I believe some assembly is required. I use the MS 290 as my main saw and keep the CS-4400 as my backup saw (ever get your bar pinched?) 

Side note - I had a chance to use a Stihl 064 with a 24" bar (pro saw, older version of a new 640) and not only did it have a very noticable increase in power over my 290 but it seemed as though it weighed as much as or less than my saw!


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## rozett (Nov 4, 2006)

I'd go with a new Stihl 290. I've owned an 029 for about five years and run an 18" bar. It has been 100% reliable. Iv'e cut about 150 cords of mixed hardwoods in the last three years and all I've had to replace was one broken sprocket. Every time I turn the bar over, I take my air line and blow out all the oily sawdust and blow out the filter. But as it's been said already, the Stihl is on the heavy side. It's a perfect saw for working on a pile of logs, but not a bucking saw. I keep an old Mac 320 around for doing bucking work.


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