# Friction Wrap/Lowering device



## JayD (Sep 6, 2006)

Hi All,
I have a friction wrap which has a diameter of 50 mm/2" OD, do you think a larger size pipe of say 100 mm/4" OD would work better? what do you think.
Thanks in Advance
JayD


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## begleytree (Sep 6, 2006)

I made mine with 4" pipe, works much better than that toy sized porty they sell. 
Rope runs over more surface area, with a larger bend radius. Works great with the bull ropes too
-Ralph


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## SRT-Tech (Sep 6, 2006)

currently fabricating a pro-type "monster Portawrap" using 1/4" thick stainless steel tubing that is 6" in diameter.


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## bendtrees (Sep 7, 2006)

*always wondered about this*

Kicking myself for not thinking of building my own with a larger pipe. Our current portawrap locks on everything and I get the worst rides as a result. Did you guys simply copy the standard design?


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## SRT-Tech (Sep 7, 2006)

similar....mine will be more like a big bollard, anchored with 3/8"s grade 70 transport chain and anchor shackles....


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## JayD (Sep 7, 2006)

Thanx for taking time to answer my question,I suspected the larger pipe would be the go,my small wrap does the job but is'nt as smooth in operation as I would have liked..you have to help it some..after you make up your monster wrap post a picture of it,I would like to see it.down the road a bit I want to make up a friction drum,as soon as I do I will post a picture of it.
All The Best
JayD


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## TackleTree (Sep 8, 2006)

Question about the port a wraps. When i have used them they tend to coil the rope when removed. MAkes for a big headache in between blocks and end of day clean up. Any tips or just the way it is? I love the thing it is a great invention. Maybe a bigger diameter would ease this a little.


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## JayD (Sep 10, 2006)

*Pictures of 4" Wrap*

Hi All,
After reading the posts I decided to make a larger Friction Wrap and I thought you all might like to see it,the yellow one is my original and its a 2" one the larger is 4" it's been cut to size and all it needs is weld and a little bending and it's ready to go into service,if you have any doubt about your ability to weld! do not try and make this tool..me in another life I was a structural welder,if it breaks I fix it,If I can make it up I do,and it usually keeps me busy between quotes and bad weather which here in Sydney it has been bucketing down,high winds.Having work and not being able to do it because of the weather is nearly as bad as having none.
All The Best
JayD


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## TackleTree (Sep 10, 2006)

nice work


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## JayD (Sep 17, 2006)

This is the finished product, just took some pictures of it and here it is:


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## Tree Machine (Sep 18, 2006)

Very nice.


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## Kneejerk Bombas (Sep 18, 2006)

Threads like this do the industry a disservice. What motivation does a guy have to invent a tree tool, spend a bunch of money designing, testing, patenting, marketing it, only to have it copied by a bunch of do-it-yourselfers?
Why don't you change the design and come up with something better?


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## Ekka (Sep 18, 2006)

$222 here

http://www.arbor.com.au/index.php?cPath=123&osCsid=35f7c20ea9c124eabdc4991be9ec7b2b

But one thing JayD.

The rope has to run around those welds so polish them up.

Now looking at the design there's some things I dont like.

A chain is only as strong as it's weakest link right.

What prevents that porty from flying up the tree is a weld. To me, that's not good. I've been thinking about this for a while.

Engineering of towbars on vehicles has changed a lot in the last 10 years and new standards brought out as the towbar used to be only as strong as it's welds.

Now with the porty I have an idea.

Where I have marked red in addition to a weld perhaps a pin could be drilled through, pressed in and welded.

The dia of that steel rod they use could be larger and heated then forged square to give more room for a pin.

Now a 6mm dia pin has what, around 4000kg shear and thats for mild steel, you have two though so it could be smaller.


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## JayD (Sep 18, 2006)

Hi Ekka,
Your thoughts on the welds I have already spent a little time pondering about,as I realised that the only thing holding the pipe in place is the welds..me I compensated with more weld spreading the stresses over a wider area..ie:two layer three run fillet..which will be extremly strong..nice pick on the finnish of the welds..yes I do have to dress them a little,I will probably destroy this wrap under controlled conditions just to see how much it will take under load...I just watched your mod to your stumper nice.
All The Best
JayD


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## Tree Machine (Sep 18, 2006)

Mike Maas said:


> Why don't you change the design and come up with something better?


That's an excellent suggestion. Be an innovator. Do something outside the beaten track. Mike will still give you a hard time over it, but it may lead to a benefit industry-wide.

'Add value' is the point here. Why make something that's already been made? There is no real challenge in that, it's just an exercise and it DOES promote to others that they, too, can replicate an existing device.

But then, shortly after Mike's expression, come ideas for improvement of the existing design. I'll be confident there could be more. Now we're going somewhere.

Nice, fat welds, JayD, nice, accurate bending of the rod stock. It is impressive, your talent.


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## coydog (Sep 18, 2006)

hence the advice don't attempt unless you know you can weld, a good weld is not a weak point, a bad weld is, my first welding teacher used to beat our welds with a sledgehammer after locking them down in a vice, if it breaks at the weld, its not a weld.


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## DDM (Sep 19, 2006)

I built this one 4 yrs ago Still works great. I'm going to copy the grcs as soon as i find a suitable winch.


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## trevmcrev (Sep 25, 2006)

DDM said:


> I built this one 4 yrs ago Still works great. I'm going to copy the grcs as soon as i find a suitable winch.



Just do what GRCS do themselves and put a Harken winch on it. Available from any good Sailing store. Still not cheap though! 

Trev


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## old timer (Sep 30, 2006)

*porta raps*

always found the base of the tree the best / but times have changed, for the good?


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## jonseredbred (Sep 30, 2006)

we have good luck with a 3" diameter t bar welded to the rear bumper of our rear mount bucket. been using it for years.

Use a flex sanding bad to polish those welds down. We also have them powder coated to smooth it up even more.

_*In one of those pics (jd's I think) I see they used galvanized and by the color of the weld I can tell they didnt grind thru the galvanizing, this makes for a really weak weld. BE CAREFUL*_


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## northernmover (Oct 2, 2006)

How much time & effort is worth saving $100? Go buy the porty & get back to cutting trees.


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## begleytree (Oct 2, 2006)

northernmover said:


> How much time & effort is worth saving $100? Go buy the porty & get back to cutting trees.



Because for a lot less, you can make a much better product. It's really not the money savings, the darn thing they sell is too small.
-Ralph


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## Customcuts (Sep 21, 2012)

JayD said:


> Hi All,
> After reading the posts I decided to make a larger Friction Wrap and I thought you all might like to see it,the yellow one is my original and its a 2" one the larger is 4" it's been cut to size and all it needs is weld and a little bending and it's ready to go into service,if you have any doubt about your ability to weld! do not try and make this tool..me in another life I was a structural welder,if it breaks I fix it,If I can make it up I do,and it usually keeps me busy between quotes and bad weather which here in Sydney it has been bucketing down,high winds.Having work and not being able to do it because of the weather is nearly as bad as having none.
> All The Best
> JayD



Is the yellow one powder coated or painted? I made a big double barrell lowering device that is powdercoated and it has streaked my lines. Kinda wish I left it raw.


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## Carburetorless (Sep 21, 2012)

He'll probably be back to answer that in another six years. :msp_rolleyes:


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## Customcuts (Sep 22, 2012)

*Lol*



Carburetorless said:


> He'll probably be back to answer that in another six years. :msp_rolleyes:


 Hey, ya never know. He could stihl be an active member. I didn't check into his profile to see if he has been on recently..That is funny tho. I'll check back in 2018:msp_w00t:


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## formationrx (Sep 22, 2012)

*...*

buy one... dont make it...


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## Carburetorless (Sep 22, 2012)

formationrx said:


> buy one... dont make it...



I definitely agree with that. 

If you just have to make one though, set up a safe testing system to ensure it's reliable, and test it at 10X the loads you're going to be putting on it. That means you'll have to sacrifice a rigging rope too, so if you're doing it to save money you're probably better off buying one.


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## Customcuts (Sep 22, 2012)

*lowering devices*







I can't justify buying something that I can make myself. I also wanted to make my own style and design for my own applications. I work part time @ an off road race car shop so I have access to cnc plasmacutter, and all kinds of fabrication tools.
View attachment 253740
View attachment 253741


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## Carburetorless (Sep 22, 2012)

Customcuts said:


> I can't justify buying something that I can make myself. I also wanted to make my own style and design for my own applications. I work part time @ an off road race car shop so I have access to cnc plasmacutter, and all kinds of fabrication tools.
> View attachment 253740
> View attachment 253741



Cool, but what's the trampoline for?


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## formationrx (Sep 22, 2012)

*...*

i would never trust a ratchet strap like that with the size of the wood i lower out... if that thing exploded the device would hit my ground guy in the face or it would go up the trunk and drop a bomb on him... i ll stick to my fat single eye loop and my bought friction brake... using homemade equipment is just asking for trouble... and it in this business its trouble with a capital T...


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## millbilly (Sep 22, 2012)

I make things, because I can. I don't even care if it cost me more in the long run. As I have always said, you have to pay tuition to go to college, I will call this course lowering devise 101.


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## Customcuts (Sep 23, 2012)

formationrx said:


> i would never trust a ratchet strap like that with the size of the wood i lower out... if that thing exploded the device would hit my ground guy in the face or it would go up the trunk and drop a bomb on him... i ll stick to my fat single eye loop and my bought friction brake... using homemade equipment is just asking for trouble... and it in this business its trouble with a capit
> 
> That ratchet strap is rated @ 5000lbs. It is for my light duty rigging. And to be honest I trust my welds more than some mass produced Chinese welds. I can understand if you aren't familiar with welding or metal fab. Not everyone is. On the other hand I have a lot of experience welding heavy duty critical pieces, The bigger device mounts in a notch cut to into the trunk with the ratchet strap and an eye sling as a backup. I have tied off bull ropes to it and used it to guide whole 25"dbh oak trees the only thing that happened was powder coat got rubbed off. I have put it thru tests that are well within the loads I will be using it for. I can appreciate your concern tho. If not done right it can be fatal...,


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## formationrx (Sep 23, 2012)

[/QUOTE]That ratchet strap is rated @ 5000lbs. It is for my light duty rigging. And to be honest I trust my welds more than some mass produced Chinese welds. I can understand if you aren't familiar with welding or metal fab. Not everyone is. On the other hand I have a lot of experience welding heavy duty critical pieces, The bigger device mounts in a notch cut to into the trunk with the ratchet strap and an eye sling as a backup. I have tied off bull ropes to it and used it to guide whole 25"dbh oak trees the only thing that happened was powder coat got rubbed off. I have put it thru tests that are well within the loads I will be using it for. I can appreciate your concern tho. If not done right it can be fatal...,[/QUOTE]

i gotcha... i m sure some guys like you can make an ass kick device... hell i could make one too... but not everyone can... i can see a lot of ######## seeing that and wanting to make one and someone ends up dead... having a backup sling on it is the right way to go... those straps are made by lots of companies and they are not all the same quality... i prefer the rope sling cuz its a single piece and its easy to spot damage... a ratchet strap has all those moving parts and they all depend on each other... if one tiny part is defective or damaged its easily overlooked... and that may put the hurt on someone...


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## Customcuts (Sep 23, 2012)

That ratchet strap is rated @ 5000lbs. It is for my light duty rigging. And to be honest I trust my welds more than some mass produced Chinese welds. I can understand if you aren't familiar with welding or metal fab. Not everyone is. On the other hand I have a lot of experience welding heavy duty critical pieces, The bigger device mounts in a notch cut to into the trunk with the ratchet strap and an eye sling as a backup. I have tied off bull ropes to it and used it to guide whole 25"dbh oak trees the only thing that happened was powder coat got rubbed off. I have put it thru tests that are well within the loads I will be using it for. I can appreciate your concern tho. If not done right it can be fatal...,[/QUOTE]

i gotcha... i m sure some guys like you can make an ass kick device... hell i could make one too... but not everyone can... i can see a lot of ######## seeing that and wanting to make one and someone ends up dead... having a backup sling on it is the right way to go... those straps are made by lots of companies and they are not all the same quality... i prefer the rope sling cuz its a single piece and its easy to spot damage... a ratchet strap has all those moving parts and they all depend on each other... if one tiny part is defective or damaged its easily overlooked... and that may put the hurt on someone...[/QUOTE]

Yeah, u are right there. I would just hope that anyone who ever think s of making something as critical as a lowering device or anything that will support a person's weight would really think it thru thoroughly, just like when doing dangerous removals everything should be well thought out and the outcome should already be known. Now that u mention it I'm just waiting to hear about a weekend warrior getting hurt or damaging property because be thought he could make something himself...


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## Customcuts (Sep 23, 2012)

*Some of the Stuff we build @ the shop.*
















View attachment 253842
View attachment 253843
View attachment 253844
View attachment 253845
View attachment 253846

Everybit of this car was fabricated @ the shop I work at. The car dyno tested with 660 HP with ls1 turnkey motor. And is I.F.S. we built one with a Dana 60 front axle that is mostly for rock crawling. The I.F.S car is for desert racing and has raced in the King of the hammers and several other big races. I am truly lucky to have 2 jobs that I absolutely love...


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## Customcuts (Sep 23, 2012)

*Here is a better view of the big one.*

[video=youtube;ZPVBffzLMdo]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZPVBffzLMdo&feature=youtube_gdata_player[/video]

I only use the eye sling on trees that are not being removed in whick case a rubber mudflap goes in between the device and the tree then a 3/4 tenex slingis choked to bottom ring which is thru bolted and welded to bottom of device. It is very secure when it is mounted into a notch tho. And usually there is almost never any reason to remove such large heavy limbs on prunes. Unless of course it is hazardous or damaged. But usually I use the small one which has a piece of angle iron that bolts to the top and sits in a kerf cut which helps to keep the device from running up on heavy loads..... I tend to think outside of the boxalot when it comes to fabrication...:boss:


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## Customcuts (Sep 23, 2012)

Carburetorless said:


> Cool, but what's the trampoline for?


 

Trampoline is there to prevent damage to the lawn... Haha:msp_biggrin::msp_biggrin:


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## sgreanbeans (Sep 24, 2012)

You guys are right about weekend warriors. I have seen a few home made devices, they are freakin scary! The welds!! Hell, THEY look like they could slice a rope! All jagged and chit,one even had wire still coming off the back end of a bead, and they painted it like that! 
I can weld pretty good........I think, been a long time, but that stuff I would leave to actual fabricators, with the right tools.


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## Customcuts (Sep 24, 2012)

sgreanbeans said:


> You guys are right about weekend warriors. I have seen a few home made devices, they are freakin scary! The welds!! Hell, THEY look like they could slice a rope! All jagged and chit,one even had wire still coming off the back end of a bead, and they painted it like that!
> I can weld pretty good........I think, been a long time, but that stuff I would leave to actual fabricators, with the right tools.




Yeah, having access to a 4x4 torchmate is so awesome, it can cut put anything with precision. Plus we have tube benders (digital hydraulic) tube notcher, lathe etc..... We can make anything and I mean anything... That's funny about the weld with a piece of wire sticking off of it. Atleast snip it off or grind the welds down if they ain't purty... Lol


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## Customcuts (Sep 25, 2012)

*Custom Jeep Coilover Tower*




View attachment 254192

http://www.arboristsite.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=254192&d=1348573528

These towers were made in house. They weld directly to frame to mount a coilover shock i and replaces the factory shock and springs... Plus the coilover is adjustable for a stiffer or softer ride depending on what type of driving you will be doing.. hwy, mudding,rick crawling,etc....


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## sgreanbeans (Sep 26, 2012)

Damn those are some nice welds! I just bought a huge welding kit from a old dude, gas set up, have everything but tanks, waiting till I get out to cali for those. Going to get a mig when I get there, for what, not yet sure, but always wanted one, so I am sure I will find sumtin. We are talking dune buggies! Not to build one, but to fix what I break!


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## Customcuts (Sep 26, 2012)

sgreanbeans said:


> Damn those are some nice welds! I just bought a huge welding kit from a old dude, gas set up, have everything but tanks, waiting till I get out to cali for those. Going to get a mig when I get there, for what, not yet sure, but always wanted one, so I am sure I will find sumtin. We are talking dune buggies! Not to build one, but to fix what I break!



You will find every reason to weld stff once u get it... Practice practice practice. And remember if your going to be doing a couple hours worth of tacking wear a mask. One day o spent about half the day tack welding and I would just close my eyes then tack and move to the next one. Well the next day my face was burnt like I had been sun tanning all day with no sun screen. My eye lids were puffy and burning.:angry2:.. I definately won't do that again.. haha. Yeah man welding / fabricating is my first love and has now taken second place to tree work.


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## Customcuts (Nov 13, 2012)

*latest creation*





View attachment 262230
the others I made only have fairleads on one side but this one was custom ordered. It's inside because its too cold outside in garage for the paint to properly cure.


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## Customcuts (Nov 13, 2012)

*Production Video*

[video=youtube;3fAisyg1RyM]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3fAisyg1RyM&feature=channel&list=UL[/video]


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## Customcuts (Nov 13, 2012)

*Setup demo*

[video=youtube;lvblVo1k5iw]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lvblVo1k5iw&feature=channel&list=UL[/video]


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