# Opinions wanted: Hazard oak tree felling



## mboln52000 (Dec 2, 2003)

Hello all,
I am a professional by no means, but I have been cutting wood for heat for 20+ years, and for the past 10 or so I have timbered several trees for my wood working hobby. When i cut for that, and almost all the time, i use the bore-method....notch, leave a hinge, bore, then cut the back strap....never fails me. But, I am in the process of clearing out an old fencrow and there is a pin oak tree about 48" or so across. Usually no problem, but this tree is hollow, and even worse than that, one side of the base of the trunk is open about 40% around the tree. I am very sure that halfway through cutting, or even less, its going to split, and shoot in some unknown direction. Anybody have any ideas on how i can control the drop of this monster??

Thanks,
Matt


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## Stumper (Dec 2, 2003)

Rope it. 
You said that it is in a fence row-do you have room for it to be 'off a bit' in its fall? If you just have to get it to go in a general direction it shouldn't be hard to do with a single, tensioned rope rigged up in the canopy. If the window is smaller things get more complex.


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## Dobber (Dec 3, 2003)

got any pics to show us.


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## wiley_p (Dec 3, 2003)

How thick is the wood on each side of the catface?


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## Pacific (Dec 9, 2003)

There is nothing safer than hooking a 3/8s or 1/2 wire rope to it and the other end to a truck or some kind of heavy equipment. The key with pulling a tree over is get the cable high enough on the tree so it doesn't pull the bottom out.

If there is enough meat on the front where you can cut a decent mouth on it then back cut it till you feel its safe then start pulling like hell on the cable. Once she is starting to fall you have to keep tension on the cable so it pulls the tree straight down and prevent it falling sideways.


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## Stumper (Dec 10, 2003)

Pacific, With all do respect-wire rope/cable will work but is not best or safest. Cordage is easier to set high, easier to attach well, able to store energy in tension better, better adapted to shock loading and somewhat less dangerous if it parts under load. Use rope of adequate strength-it is the best choice.:angel:


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## Pacific (Dec 10, 2003)

How strong is that arborist rope I never used it before


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## MasterBlaster (Dec 10, 2003)

Check this out, Pacific;

http://www.wtsherrill.com/TEST/page14.shtml


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## Pacific (Dec 10, 2003)

That stuff is pretty strong but wow is it expensive I guess if your in the business where you are falling or doing tree removal in residential areas you need that rope.


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## zero (Dec 31, 2003)

*holy oak*

52 first you plumb the lean, if it at all favors the gap you need to cut a humboldt face/ sometimes called a quick fall face/ first cut one side of the gap horizontal line higher than normal second cut is made from the ground up same angle as your regular face,repeat on the other side then make your back cut alittle on the high side 4 or 5 inches above the horizontal remember to swamp out your escape path- a high line would not hurt . i cut a lot of cat faced beech in nepa on clear cuts almost all of our beech over12 inches has heart rot . good luck and happy new year .


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## mboln52000 (Jan 12, 2004)

*Its down!*

I have pics, but i dont have them scanned yet, but i will post them as soon as i can. It had about a 25 degree lean south west. The catface was directly on the south side. It was forked about 50 ft up. one fork was rotten and dropping flaking chunks, hanging off the north east side, and the other fork was the tallest, dead, with a few branches, hanging west. Looking it all over, i really thought it was too rotten for a rope to help since it was so dead.

So, my plan was to cut a very large notch, or chunk, out of the complete east side, going north about half way. All went well there. Then i made a straight back cut from the east. Getting close it shifted a tiny bit and pinched the bar, so i broke out the wedge, and lifted it to get my bar free. Wife was watching it from a safe distance and she was telling me it was moving over just like i wanted it too.

But.......i thought i needed to reach inside the catface, and remove a little more wood, because i thought the hinge was way too thick. good plan, if i would have stopped about 3 secs sooner than i did. It did a very slow barber chair and rolled off the wedge..and fell west, and broke into many pieces.

Looking back.........if i had used 2 wedges, did not make that last internal cut, i think it would have wedges right on over, as it was moving easy as i was freeing up the bar. 

In lots of other cases though, due to everybodies suggestions, i have been using the rope a lot more on leaners and have had perfect sucess ever since. For what i cut, usually a leaner doesnt matter, but there have been a few i want to drop a certain way to compress an already too large brush pile or something and it really helps out. 

I will post pics when i can! The trunk size of this thing was pretty impressive!


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## mboln52000 (Jan 30, 2004)

*Pic #1*

Here is the first pic of the ol' pin oak tree, from a little distance.


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## mboln52000 (Jan 30, 2004)

*Pic #2*

Here is one a little closer.


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## mboln52000 (Jan 30, 2004)

*Pic with saw*

Here is one from the good side with the 066 leaning againt it.


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## mboln52000 (Jan 30, 2004)

*Last pic, showing the open, or catface*

Last pic, I swear!


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## MasterBlaster (Jan 30, 2004)

I know you wanted to throw the tree, but I would probably have tried to throw each fork by itself(climbing), then thrown the snag.

So you got it down with no problem? Good!


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## wiley_p (Jan 30, 2004)

I couldnt see the callous on the left side of your pic, but I saw the conk in the tree down low, Hey do you have a good dz? This might be a goode candidate for 4# of Kinnepac or Tovex. Safe and Sane is my motto on some trees.


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## mboln52000 (Jan 31, 2004)

*Huh?*

Wiley_P,
I am not trying to be a smartass, but i have no idea what your talking about! lol. Whats a callous, and a conk? What about a dz?

I am just guessing, but the kinnepac is some kind of porta-power or heavy duty bottle jack?

Please explain, as i would like to know the correct terminology.

Really, untill finding this forum, i have just done this stuff for the past 15-20 years and basically just winging it from lessons learned from my dad, neighbors, and the like. 

The person that i learned the most from is the guy who owns the band mill that cuts all my lumber. Basically at one point in his life he has done about everything in the logging industry, and now he has retired to bandmilling.

I like the tips, ideas, and techiniques i read about here, plus getting all the terminology down, so i sound halfway like i know something about what i am talking about!


Thanks,
Matt


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## wiley_p (Feb 3, 2004)

Sorry, callous is the wood tissue that forms around a wound In this case the catface at the bottom of the tree, conk is a term used for fruiting bodies produced by various pathogens, thats the shelf like mushroom sort of thing seen in one of your phhtos, and lastly kinnepac is sort of like a jack, its a good explosive lifts trees up just enough to come down generally where u wanted, tovex works but is a little better for shooting some gravel.


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## ROLLACOSTA (Mar 1, 2004)

try a pound or 2 of SEMTEX on each side of the cavity


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## mboln52000 (Mar 4, 2004)

2 lbs of SEMTEX. I dont know how you guys get this stuff. I have contacted the indiana state DNR, some mining agencies, and basically, they tell me there is no way an individual like me can get explosives for a legitimate use.

I have been clearing alot of old pasture ground, all kinds of stumps...hundreds of them, so i wanted to blast some out.

Plus there are some remnants of the old oil field days left out there, concrete pilings and pillars, sandstone blocks..all that need blasted...and i cant get the stuff.

But anyway, the tree is down, along with a couple hundred others, and that 1/4 mile of fencerow is clear now!


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## ROLLACOSTA (Mar 4, 2004)

> _Originally posted by mboln52000 _
> *2 lbs of SEMTEX. I dont know how you guys get this stuff. I have contacted the indiana state DNR, some mining agencies, and basically, they tell me there is no way an individual like me can get explosives for a legitimate use.
> 
> I have been clearing alot of old pasture ground, all kinds of stumps...hundreds of them, so i wanted to blast some out.
> ...



ive just got some IRISH pals who can get it for me


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## mboln52000 (Mar 4, 2004)

Lucky guy! Wish i had the same pals!


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## ROLLACOSTA (Mar 4, 2004)

st paddys days comin up yee haaa


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## wiley_p (Mar 8, 2004)

Before things became all "homeland security" if you have a mining claim you could get ahold of Tovex for sure and we always used Kinnepac on the forest, maybe they're a littlew more reasonable out West.


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