# Chinese Stihl & Husky saws



## jason6586 (Apr 28, 2011)

I know many of you may think im crazy but I would like to get my hands on a few china knock offs just for the heck of it. Any ideas where I could get them?


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## z71mike (Apr 28, 2011)

pretty sure that's gonna be internet only

Chain Saw, China Chain Saw, Chain Saw Manufacturers, China Chain Saw Suppliers


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## 67L36Driver (Apr 28, 2011)

Ebay.


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## jason6586 (Apr 28, 2011)

67L36Driver said:


> Ebay.


 
I looked on ebay and couldn't find anything, maybe im not searching correctly or using the right key words


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## 67L36Driver (Apr 28, 2011)

Try "cutting wood tools". One of the funky brands from china uses that phrase.

Likely some wacked translation.

Don't have a "blood leson" = accident.


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## Rudolf73 (Apr 29, 2011)

Try this site: Wholesale chain saw - Buy Low Price chain saw Lots on Aliexpress.com


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## aldo (Apr 29, 2011)

Perhaps different in Oz but I simply type Stihl into search and there seem to be more turning up by the week.

The last few I bothered to read had quotes like Stihl inspired and looked 90% like a Stihl and had no badging. The one I read this evening has the same jargon but now even has the model on the starter cover. This particluar one had MS380 on it.

I've just gone back and the listing appears to have disappeared. Either unfortunately purchased or hopefully reported.


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## motoman.5150 (Apr 29, 2011)

I wouldn't mind trying one either most of the cylinder kits i rebuild with are chinese anyway so whats the difference ????opcorn:


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## JDNicol (Apr 29, 2011)

I mean this in the nicest possible way but you will only be lining the pockets of those who seek to deceive and defraud others...

EDIT: do you mean you want clones? If not the above may not apply.


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## jason6586 (Apr 29, 2011)

JDNicol said:


> I mean this in the nicest possible way but you will only be lining the pockets of those who seek to deceive and defraud others...
> 
> EDIT: do you mean you want clones? If not the above may not apply.


 
Well i totally understand where you are coming from. The only reason I would like to try one is to see how they compare with the originals. Like someone posted alot of the rebuild components are Chinese as it is so how bad can these be. I would like to run the crap out of it and see if it holds up. If it does and parts are interchangeable why not get a few to rebuild original stihl saws with? I know there are not alot of guys that go to stihl for a cylinder kit or crank due to the price so in reality they are more than likely using the same stuff these saws use. It was just an idea that i was looking for more information on. I thought they were going to be cheaper than what they are but i suppose the shipping is the big part unless you ordered in mass quantity.


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## spike60 (Apr 29, 2011)

jason6586 said:


> Well i totally understand where you are coming from. The only reason I would like to try one is to see how they compare with the originals. Like someone posted alot of the rebuild components are Chinese as it is so how bad can these be. I would like to run the crap out of it and see if it holds up. If it does and parts are interchangeable why not get a few to rebuild original stihl saws with? I know there are not alot of guys that go to stihl for a cylinder kit or crank due to the price so in reality they are more than likely using the same stuff these saws use. It was just an idea that i was looking for more information on. I thought they were going to be cheaper than what they are but i suppose the shipping is the big part unless you ordered in mass quantity.


 

Jason, I don't mean to come off as insulting, but frankly, the above post indicates that you really don't know what you are talking about. No way Stihl or Husky are selling parts that are of the same inferior quality as those used to build Chinese imitation saws. 

But if you like, go ahead and throw your money away. If you were closer, you could stop in my store and see the quality of some of these knockoffs. A local guy got ripped on one of the Husky 365 copies, and he got so disgusted he just gave the thing to me. I promise you, if you saw this thing up close you wouldn't want to toss $300 away just to play around with it.


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## Work Saw Collector (Apr 29, 2011)

spike60 said:


> Jason, I don't mean to come off as insulting, but frankly, the above post indicates that you really don't know what you are talking about. No way Stihl or Husky are selling parts that are of the same inferior quality as those used to build Chinese imitation saws.
> 
> But if you like, go ahead and throw your money away. If you were closer, you could stop in my store and see the quality of some of these knockoffs. A local guy got ripped on one of the Husky 365 copies, and he got so disgusted he just gave the thing to me. I promise you, if you saw this thing up close you wouldn't want to toss $300 away just to play around with it.


 
Repped.


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## mayhem100 (Apr 29, 2011)

Wholesale MS260 Stihl Copy chain saw,52CC

Here you go then. One cheap, Chinese piece of crap knockoff chainsaw. $428 shipped to your door (including the $263 shipping charge to the US from China). Note the specs and compare to the actual Stihl.

2cc larger displacement, almost 1hp lower which is somewhere around 30% loss in power, 25:1 recommended mix ratio (when was the last time you saw a 2 stroke in the USA with that kind of recommendation? comes from the land of no emissions standards), much lower rev limit.

You're giving up an awful lot for the $100 saved. 

And its helping put people we might all give a damn about out of work.


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## BlackOakTreeServ (Apr 29, 2011)

Just go to your husky dealer...lol..opcorn:opcorn:


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## mayhem100 (Apr 29, 2011)

As the owner of a shiny new Husky 359 I have to say Ouch!

My only real Husky dealer (as in a dealer that sells saws bigger than a 455 Rancher) sells Stihls too...what do I do in this case? Echo?


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## Warped5 (Apr 29, 2011)

Try searching for 'Gio' on eBay ..... yup, I just turned up ten ....


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## ChrisF (Apr 29, 2011)

mayhem100 said:


> My only real Husky dealer (as in a dealer that sells saws bigger than a 455 Rancher) sells Stihls too...what do I do in this case? Echo?



I fail to see the problem.


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## snake_2586 (Apr 29, 2011)

stick 'chainsaw 5200' into ebay,

I have one of these and thay are adequite for light work, seems to like throwing its chain under heave work,

you get what you pay for.


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## jason6586 (Apr 29, 2011)

spike60 said:


> Jason, I don't mean to come off as insulting, but frankly, the above post indicates that you really don't know what you are talking about. No way Stihl or Husky are selling parts that are of the same inferior quality as those used to build Chinese imitation saws.
> 
> But if you like, go ahead and throw your money away. If you were closer, you could stop in my store and see the quality of some of these knockoffs. A local guy got ripped on one of the Husky 365 copies, and he got so disgusted he just gave the thing to me. I promise you, if you saw this thing up close you wouldn't want to toss $300 away just to play around with it.


 
If you read my post i never say that Stihl or Husky uses inferior china parts. What I did say is that alot of people dont want to spend the big money on original sithl or husky parts so they buy kits off of ebay and such which are more than likely made in china or Taiwan. With that being said most of the parts on the copys would be the same quality as "SOME" of the generic aftermarket stuff. I had no intentions of starting an argument, I was just looking for information because it interested me and I pondered the idea of getting one or two and using the crap out of them or maybe just tearing them apart to see whats inside. Its just like the Honda engine look a likes, 99% of the parts fit the original honda but its made in china. People around here have seem to have decent luck with them. Maybe thats not the same with the china copy saws. But there again i'm just curious.


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## jason6586 (Apr 29, 2011)

I have been around saws the majority of my life and i know that the copys are no where near the quality of original. I myself have Dolmars 5100, 5105, 401, 120,116, 9010 and a few others. I play around with old homelite stuff, have restored a few homelites and am going to be in the process of doing a few stihl's soon. I'm not a newbie to the saw world. This whole copy thing just grabbed my attention for some reason or another, lol.


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## MCW (Apr 29, 2011)

There are some good Chinese knock offs around such as SOME versions of the Husky 365. Not ALL of them are good. Just remember that there are literally dozens of factories producing knock off saws and the quality control varies substantially.
I've imported a few from China and the Stihl knockoffs were crap but the Husky 365 knock offs were very very good. I started a thread on AS about the 365's a while ago and copped a bit of a pasting for it  Mainly because I said they were pretty good saws. If I'd have said they were crap everybody would have agreed but because I actually said they were good war broke out  
For me though the best part is that these 365's are a bolt for bolt knock off of the modern 365 version. This means that I can buy 100% of the parts for an absolute steal and a few members here already have some of these parts with no quality issues.
My two Chinese 365's are now running the 76cc BB kits, have muffler mods, have the HD Husky felling spikes fitted, and would surprise a few people with how they run. I used one for 7 hours the other day stumping with a 24" bar and it ran like a clock.
Everybody "wants" to think that everything coming out of China is crap but that's simply not the case.

In saying that though the saws I got were not being sold under the Husky banner and had absolutely no Husqvarna labelling anywhere. I definately have a problem with knock off saws being sold under the guise that they are original.


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## homelitejim (Apr 29, 2011)

A popular video sharing website has quite a few videos of Chinese saws and how poorly they are made and run.


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## masculator (Apr 29, 2011)

mayhem100 said:


> As the owner of a shiny new Husky 359 I have to say Ouch!
> 
> My only real Husky dealer (as in a dealer that sells saws bigger than a 455 Rancher) sells Stihls too...what do I do in this case? Echo?


 

Nope, walk straight past the husky and buy the stihl....lol


Oh you thought I was joking didn't you! I wasn't!!!!


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## imagineero (Apr 30, 2011)

There was an explosion of knock offs on aus ebay a few weeks ago, they seem to be mostly gone now so im guessing they were reported. still a couple the though

a stihl 380 for $390

Brand New 72cc 20 Inch Bar Chainsaw Stihl chain | eBay

a stihl 250 for $250

Brand New 45cc 18 inch Bar Chainsaw Stihl Chain | eBay

a stihl 180 for $220

Brand New 32cc 14 inch Bar Chainsaw Stihl Chain | eBay

another 380 from a different guy

New 72cc CHAINSAW - MS3800 20inch bar and chain | eBay

huskies seem to be gone.

Shaun


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## Ambull (Apr 30, 2011)

Please do not support these knock off companies, even if it is just from a curiosity standpoint. They are gray market thieves, and they have no honor or dignity.


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## pro94lt (Apr 30, 2011)

it really hurts me to read this. keep this up and we'll have nothing but red china saws. just remember who they are, not our freinds.


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## a. palmer jr. (May 1, 2011)

Rudolf73 said:


> Try this site: Wholesale chain saw - Buy Low Price chain saw Lots on Aliexpress.com


 
On the ad for the "Stihl 381" the chain was on backwards!


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## a. palmer jr. (May 1, 2011)

pro94lt said:


> it really hurts me to read this. keep this up and we'll have nothing but red china saws. just remember who they are, not our freinds.


 
They don't even try to hide it anymore...they counterfeit them and even put the decal saying Husqvarna or Stihl on the saw. I think they used to put a Chinese name on the saws, guess they could make more money calling them a Stihl or Husky. Just looking at the picture I can't tell the difference.


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## Oldsawnut (May 25, 2011)

OK guys is this one a knock off I can't tell other than the top sticker

Husqvarna 365 Chainsaw head unit new | eBay 

Local guy said he would sell me one with bar and chain for 500.. Top sticker looks a little off is there any other way to tell?


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## w8ye (May 25, 2011)

chinaemas is a company in China making the Husky and Stihlo knockoffs.

Do search for Emas carb

The also make Walbro and Tillotson knock offs


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## Rudolf73 (May 25, 2011)

Oldsawnut said:


> OK guys is this one a knock off I can't tell other than the top sticker
> 
> Husqvarna 365 Chainsaw head unit new | eBay
> 
> Local guy said he would sell me one with bar and chain for 500.. Top sticker looks a little off is there any other way to tell?


 
By looking at the accessories and the jungle muffler I am 99% sure that it is chinese. I bought one a while ago with pretty much exactly the same accessories - most likely the same manufacturer. They are only about $260 including shipping from china. I would not recommend them though...


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## Oldsawnut (May 26, 2011)

Dang you are right I didn't even notice the muffler till you pointed it out... Thanks.. I'm sure its chicom krap now


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## roostersgt (May 26, 2011)

Why waste your money on an inferior tool that you might need to depend on? Buy your tools at Harbor Freight and expect them to be as durable as a good quality known brand? Chain saws are built to work under dirty / harsh conditions and I wouldn't want to trust my physical well-being / life to something like a cheap "knock-off" to save a couple of dollars. While some of the parts might be acceptable, I'm sure many are made of inferior metal / alloys etc.... Don't risk it.


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## MCW (May 26, 2011)

Oldsawnut said:


> OK guys is this one a knock off I can't tell other than the top sticker
> Local guy said he would sell me one with bar and chain for 500.. Top sticker looks a little off is there any other way to tell?



It's a bit too difficult to tell from those photos and to be honest even in real life it may be difficult. I'd say it's probably the real deal as all the knock offs I've seen have silver spikes, not black.
The toolkit that comes with it looks the good too but hey, the Chinese can copy anything


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## Boskaerm (May 26, 2011)

MCW said:


> It's a bit too difficult to tell from those photos and to be honest even in real life it may be difficult. I'd say it's probably the real deal as all the knock offs I've seen have silver spikes, not black.
> The toolkit that comes with it looks the good too but hey, the Chinese can copy anything


 
To me, the throttle trigger and lock, looks to be black! Black throttle means it´s copy!

Edit: That muffler dosen´t say: It´s a copy! I have more than one REAL Husky, originaly equipped with that type of muffler.


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## MCW (May 26, 2011)

Boskaerm said:


> To me, the throttle trigger and lock, looks to be black! Black throttle means it´s copy



Well spotted  Even the throttle trigger and lock on my 365 knock offs are grey


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## Boskaerm (May 26, 2011)

MCW said:


> Well spotted  Even the throttle trigger and lock on my 365 knock offs are grey


 
Thanks  but even though, I could still be fooled! Looks very close to the real thing!


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## MCW (May 26, 2011)

Boskaerm said:


> Thanks  but even though, I could still be fooled! Looks very close to the real thing!



Apart from the Chinese writing on the carby, the shiny spike, and the non Husky ID plate on my saws if placed side by side with a real Husky 365 you are hard pressed the tell the difference. Mine were never sold as Husqvarna knock offs though - the side sticker is HH365 and the ID plate has garble written on it


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## Boskaerm (May 26, 2011)

MCW said:


> Apart from the Chinese writing on the carby, the shiny spike, and the non Husky ID plate on my saws if placed side by side with a real Husky 365 you are hard pressed the tell the difference. Mine were never sold as Husqvarna knock offs though - the side sticker is HH365 and the ID plate has garble written on it


 
I wouldn´t say it´s ok to do that! But at least you don´t fool anybody to believe it´s a REAL Husqvarna!


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## Oldsawnut (May 26, 2011)

Yea thats the problem I have is he doesn't say its a knock off.. I talk to him on the phone and ask where he got them an I get " They were imported" I ask where from and get "Switzerland" hmmmm thats a first.. So I look a little closer and post here to have you guys help me out... Thanks fellas save me some time. Damn this one was hard to tell I think they used the real 365 stickers!!! Slick little bastards


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## slipknot (May 26, 2011)

But if you like, go ahead and throw your money away. If you were closer, you could stop in my store and see the quality of some of these knockoffs. A local guy got ripped on one of the Husky 365 copies, and he got so disgusted he just gave the thing to me. I promise you, if you saw this thing up close you wouldn't want to toss $300 away just to play around with it.[/QUOTE]

I wish I could rep ya spike....you may be an azz at times but you do tell it like it is and i agree with you 110% that idiot is contributing to the problem which makes our saw prices go up to make up for lost revenue.....And I do mean to come accross insulting make no bones about it!! You idiots stop buy the chinese knock offs.....:taped:


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## OH_Varmntr (May 26, 2011)

I agree Slipknot. All it is doing is adding fuel to fire these knockoff companies. :angry2:

I know exactly how it goes, being in the plastic injection molding industry. The parts we produce are nearly twice as much as "comparable" (I use that word loosely) parts from China. But American companies are still buying our products because of our superior quality. 

The Chinese quality is getting better though...


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## AUSSIE1 (May 26, 2011)

slipknot said:


> I wish I could rep ya spike....you may be an azz at times but you do tell it like it is and i agree with you 110% that idiot is contributing to the problem which makes our saw prices go up to make up for lost revenue.....And I do mean to come accross insulting make no bones about it!! You idiots stop buy the chinese knock offs.....:taped:




Well that must have made you feel like a big man, Spike licker!


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## indiansprings (May 26, 2011)

On several of my buying trips where I spent three to four consecutive weeks in China and Taiwan I bought some knocks offs of very popular products and sent home. The majority of them were/are inferior in quality to the real product. I did pay a 125.00 for a high quality knock off of a rolex submariner, almost identical to my real one, it has been a good everyday watch, keeps time as good as the real one.

I believe the saws they are building today are very inferior to the real products and wouldn't touch one with a ten foot pole............but the chinese are capable of producing the same quality, and you will see these saws evolve over time to just as good as quality once they figure out the market is there. I've been in to many factories making parts for Cummins, Mercedes and BWM in China. They are capable of making any quality level that is specified, the customer just has to be willing to pay for it.

I won't support the chinese knock off saws, they aren't paying a dime for R&D, liability insurance, not paying corporate taxes. not employing the hundreds if not thousands of Americans working for the American mfg/distrobution arms of Stihl or Husky.

You always get what you pay for in the long run.


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## slipknot (May 26, 2011)

AUSSIE1 said:


> Well that must have made you feel like a big man, Spike licker!



LOL..I am a big man actually at 6-4 285 lbs, so I feel this way everyday. the only way i would lick spike is if he were a good lookin woman...and he's not..so i find humor in that statement..but I can take a joke so its ok. But.......

No offense to you Aussies....but what does your country even manufacture? What drives your economy?(im just curious) What jobs do you guys have to lose? Whether its a good knock off or not..your supporting a communist nation that is basically stealing when they make a product that is a knock off of someone else's and your supporting child labor and or BS wages....and when you do that it has many consequences and they will eventually show their ugly head here very shortly. I still stand by what I said..you guys are idiots for importing BS junk here to the most superior nation in the world..the United States of America. Look at all the technical advancements we have come up with and are generous enough to share with the rest of the world...I mean if it wasnt for us..the chinese wouldn't have much to steal....minus the chainsaws...I bet the germans are pissed about that. Isnt it illegal to import that crap here anyways? :msp_w00t:


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## AUSSIE1 (May 26, 2011)

slipknot said:


> LOL..I am a big man actually at 6-4 285 lbs, so I feel this way everyday. the only way i would lick spike is if he were a good lookin woman...and he's not..so i find humor in that statement..but I can take a joke so its ok. But.......
> 
> No offense to you Aussies....but what does your country even manufacture? What drives your economy?(im just curious) What jobs do you guys have to lose? Whether its a good knock off or not..your supporting a communist nation that is basically stealing when they make a product that is a knock off of someone else's and your supporting child labor and or BS wages....and when you do that it has many consequences and they will eventually show their ugly head here very shortly. I still stand by what I said..you guys are idiots for importing BS junk here to the most superior nation in the world..the United States of America. Look at all the technical advancements we have come up with and are generous enough to share with the rest of the world...I mean if it wasnt for us..the chinese wouldn't have much to steal....minus the chainsaws...I bet the germans are pissed about that. Isnt it illegal to import that crap here anyways? :msp_w00t:


 
Here we go, another "our country is better than yours"....yawn!

Pull your head out of the sand sunshine!


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## MCW (May 26, 2011)

slipknot said:


> LOL..I am a big man actually at 6-4 285 lbs, so I feel this way everyday. the only way i would lick spike is if he were a good lookin woman...and he's not..so i find humor in that statement..but I can take a joke so its ok. But.......
> 
> No offense to you Aussies....but what does your country even manufacture? What drives your economy?(im just curious) What jobs do you guys have to lose? Whether its a good knock off or not..your supporting a communist nation that is basically stealing when they make a product that is a knock off of someone else's and your supporting child labor and or BS wages....and when you do that it has many consequences and they will eventually show their ugly head here very shortly. I still stand by what I said..you guys are idiots for importing BS junk here to the most superior nation in the world..the United States of America. Look at all the technical advancements we have come up with and are generous enough to share with the rest of the world...I mean if it wasnt for us..the chinese wouldn't have much to steal....minus the chainsaws...I bet the germans are pissed about that. Isnt it illegal to import that crap here anyways? :msp_w00t:



I see where you're coming from and can understand to some extent apart from the fact you need to pull your head out your butt in regard to just how good your manufacturing is and the fact that many many other countries are at least as good or better. I like the US, we share a lot in common, but to say you're the most superior nation on earth sounds a bit Nazi WWII.
As far as the Chinese thing goes I won't get too excited about it but maybe instead of having a go at knock offs maybe look a bit further...
...like that Chinese made carb on my new "US made" MS261 for instance?
Blame the consumer all you like but the real problem lies with the big name manufacturers.
Also maybe have a go at nearly every member here who has bought a Chinese/Taiwanese piston and cylinder kit instead of an overpriced original OEM top end. Not to mention aftermarket parts that are nearly entirely Chinese. Maybe look at your automotive manufacturers and get a rough percentage of what the foreign content is? You'll piss and sh*t yourself.
Starting to see where I'm coming from? Stihl, Husky, Dolmar - they're all in on it. More and more Chinese components are starting to appear on OEM saws.
I'd also like to know how buying a knock off 365 makes a difference to the US manufacturers. Last time I checked it wasn't made in the US. I'll tell you what though, when you can get a US made 365 to my door for $300 let me know, I'll buy 10.

As far as what Australians produce? Maybe when you talk of manufacturing you might want to think of where your steel came from or the Uranium in your reactors. Also when a family member is sick or dying and gets saved by some new wonder drug there is a good chance it was invented in Australia.

As mentioned, I like the US for many reasons but particularly because we are allies. For you to not even know what Australia produces or what drives our economy shows your ignorance and leaves me wondering why you even opened your mouth to start with...


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## MCW (May 26, 2011)

AUSSIE1 said:


> Here we go, another "our country is better than yours"....yawn!
> 
> Pull your head out of the sand sunshine!



Funniest thing I remember Al was when a certain large golf club manufacturer started to find Chinese copies floating around in various world markets.
The cry of "We're gonna lose jobs" etc etc was loud and clear (as it's like a reflex response) yet what the most vocal opponents were too stupid to realise was that the original manufacturer's heads AND shafts were coming out of China anyway...


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## Stihlman441 (May 26, 2011)

*what does your country even manufacture?*

Ok i will start with oil,gas,minerals,trees (wood chip),wheat and grains,wool,cars the list is endless..............


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## a. palmer jr. (May 26, 2011)

MCW said:


> Funniest thing I remember Al was when a certain large golf club manufacturer started to find Chinese copies floating around in various world markets.
> The cry of "We're gonna lose jobs" etc etc was loud and clear (as it's like a reflex response) yet what the most vocal opponents were too stupid to realise was that the original manufacturer's heads AND shafts were coming out of China anyway...


 
You gotta remember though that the real McCoys were made of titanium on the club heads and the cheaper ones were aluminum. It is that difference that makes the Callaway Big Bertha and others, like Taylor Made much superior to the cheaper no-names also made in China. Also, check the swing weight on the name brands vs. the no names, they are more consistent on the good ones. However, I wasn't too crazy about our better companies moving to China, either.


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## Stihlman441 (May 26, 2011)

I bet ya can find some china made bits on ya Harleys.:hmm3grin2orange:


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## Rudolf73 (May 26, 2011)

slipknot said:


> ...the most superior nation in the world..the United States of America.


 
Maybe you should turn on the TV and watch some news some time... you might learn something (its not all sunshine and roses) :msp_wink:


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## a. palmer jr. (May 26, 2011)

Stihlman441 said:


> I bet ya can find some china made bits on ya Harleys.:hmm3grin2orange:


 
I went to a Harley shop to buy some parts for my friend's Harley that I was working on. I believe the parts at that time said "Made in Japan".


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## Stihlman441 (May 26, 2011)

deleted


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## OH_Varmntr (May 26, 2011)

Stihlman441 said:


> *what does your country even manufacture?*
> 
> Ok i will start with oil,gas,minerals,trees (wood chip),wheat and grains,wool,cars the list is endless..............


 
We were visited by a previous exchange student from Australia this past weekend. 

He is a Geologist for a mining company that mines Nickel and much of our conversation was about the mining industry in Australia. I found it extremely interesting, and never would have thought the environmental policies of Australia would have been that stringent, compared to our American policies. So much is produced either directly or in-directly from the mining industry. 

I won't dive into the differences I found here, but needless to say my eyes were opened. 

It's amazing how close-minded most are to parts of the world other than here in the USA.


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## slipknot (May 26, 2011)

Lol sure is windy in here. Thanks for the education on what Aussies make...I admitted I was ignorant when it came to that...that's why I asked. Now i know A little more than I did an hour ago...Also I never exclusively had a go at you aussies..my so called rampage was about we Americans and everyone else buying the crap. I do believe you proved my point...the manufacturers are having to take steps necessary since they are losing profits to the chinese manufacturing practices stealing technology...they did not pay their dues like we americans have. They have to get in bed with the chinese..how else can they compete? Just how the dirty chinese go about buisness is not honest IMO. I have nothing against you aussies...I would almost give my left arm to come see your beautiful country. How else would you expect me to respond when insulted....But I didnt take it personal since I did insult those that buy chinese knock offs..its all fair game! As far as what you guys make...you wouldnt be able to do it with out us...but I didnt mean to turn it into a pissing match with the US being superior....I mean look at everything important used today in the world...we invented most of it...cars, electricity, lighting, etc. As far as my head in my butt or in the sand...im well aware of whats going on..thats why i said anything at all...We americans and our complacency is a real big problem...we're falling behind...the chinese are catching up and its our fault! So its ok for you aussies to stick together..thats what most of us americans will do. I got nothing against you guys and dont worry we wont be the most superior country on earth for long...Keep supporting the chinese technology thiefs..lol the chinese I think are still behind the japanese as far as most technology stolen from the US...dont get me started on dirt bikes and motorcycles....


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## MCW (May 26, 2011)

a. palmer jr. said:


> You gotta remember though that the real McCoys were made of titanium on the club heads and the cheaper ones were aluminum. It is that difference that makes the Callaway Big Bertha and others, like Taylor Made much superior to the cheaper no-names also made in China. Also, check the swing weight on the name brands vs. the no names, they are more consistent on the good ones. However, I wasn't too crazy about our better companies moving to China, either.



I'm well aware of the quality differences but the Chinese driver heads I was referring to were actually stainless, not aluminium - they still had tags of MIG wire hanging inside the heads. I used to play a lot of competition golf and import(ed) a lot of gear from the states. I wasn't stating the quality difference (which wasn't actually obvious in most cases until the clubs were actually used) but simply the Made In China issue. Many people don't realise that most of the big names in a lot of different fields are now made offshore.



slipknot said:


> Lol sure is windy in here. Thanks for the education on what Aussies make...I admitted I was ignorant when it came to that...that's why I asked. Now i know A little more than I did an hour ago...Also I never exclusively had a go at you aussies..my so called rampage was about we Americans and everyone else buying the crap. I do believe you proved my point...the manufacturers are having to take steps necessary since they are losing profits to the chinese manufacturing practices stealing technology...they did not pay their dues like we americans have. They have to get in bed with the chinese..how else can they compete? Just how the dirty chinese go about buisness is not honest IMO. I have nothing against you aussies...I would almost give my left arm to come see your beautiful country. How else would you expect me to respond when insulted....But I didnt take it personal since I did insult those that buy chinese knock offs..its all fair game! As far as what you guys make...you wouldnt be able to do it with out us...but I didnt mean to turn it into a pissing match with the US being superior....I mean look at everything important used today in the world...we invented most of it...cars, electricity, lighting, etc. As far as my head in my butt or in the sand...im well aware of whats going on..thats why i said anything at all...We americans and our complacency is a real big problem...we're falling behind...the chinese are catching up and its our fault! So its ok for you aussies to stick together..thats what most of us americans will do. I got nothing against you guys and dont worry we wont be the most superior country on earth for long...Keep supporting the chinese technology thiefs..lol the chinese I think are still behind the japanese as far as most technology stolen from the US...dont get me started on dirt bikes and motorcycles....



Thanks for the level headed reply. It's certainly a topic that's always going to get heated!
Just remember though that the technology the Chinese have isn't always stolen. There have been many ingenious products get invented that the inventor's home country isn't willing to invest in. That is a real problem in Australia which is why state of the art weaponry for example (ie: Metal Storm) has gone offshore (to the US thankfully) as the Australian government were too lame to invest in it.
The same goes for China - they'll throw way more money at somebody to get hold of an innovative new idea than either the US or Australia unless it's something like Metal Storm which may directly affect their homeland security one day.

What really gets up my nose is in the world of Agriculture and this affects both the US and Australia. Many people with qualifications such as mine are being poached by Chinese, South American etc agricultural groups for MASSIVE amounts of money to provide advice and expertise on how to grow better quality fruit and other crops. Although it seems a good idea at the time these same consultants are actually putting US and Australian farmers out of business as before you know it our very own opposition have the same expertise we have with 1/4 the labour costs.
In fact quite often it's even our own government employed agricultural experts telling our opposition how to grow better produce.


----------



## masculator (May 27, 2011)

Stihlman441 said:


> *what does your country even manufacture?*
> 
> Ok i will start with oil,gas,minerals,trees (wood chip),wheat and grains,wool,cars the list is endless..............



It took us AUSSIES to make an AMERICAN car that handles....lol pontiac, camaro and all the others built on the commodore frame right here in AUS!!!!oh and the 3.8 litre v6 that the yanks couldn't balance for more than twenty years that we managed to quite easily.


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## masculator (May 27, 2011)

MCW said:


> What really gets up my nose is in the world of Agriculture and this affects both the US and Australia. Many people with qualifications such as mine are being poached by Chinese, South American etc agricultural groups for MASSIVE amounts of money to provide advice and expertise on how to grow better quality fruit and other crops. Although it seems a good idea at the time these same consultants are actually putting US and Australian farmers out of business as before you know it our very own opposition have the same expertise we have with 1/4 the labour costs.
> In fact quite often it's even our own government employed agricultural experts telling our opposition how to grow better produce.



And then we employ Poms to come and manage our farms!!!

Oh and don,t forget the fact that the xerox/photocopier was an australian invention and all of the cutting edge medical innovations that have come out of australia, and a lot of technical electrical innovations which have had their roots developed here.

I think that SLopKnOb would be surprised at how much australian designed technology is in use every day in almost every industry there is in the US.


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## MCW (May 27, 2011)

masculator said:


> And then we employ Poms to come and manage our farms!!!



Actually it's mainly South Africans. Although I know a number of them and like these guys the main reason they are managing a lot of Australian owned farms is because...

1) They know what they're doing.
2) They'll do it cheaper.
3) Emphasise the cheaper bit...
4) As in $30k a year cheaper!


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## slipknot (May 27, 2011)

[/QUOTE]
I think that SLopKnOb would be surprised at how much australian designed technology is in use every day in almost every industry there is in the US.[/QUOTE]

I think we got it figured out there masterbater....piss piss..lol...dont piss in the wind as you attempt to rekindle the pissing match.

The thing I cant figure out is....its almost exclusively aussies that I pissed off. Why are you guys so defensive when it comes to the chinese....the chinese are screwing you guys in the azz too...

That guy on ebay wont say its fake or real...he just responds...why do you think its fake.. when I asked him...which i couldnt resist


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## MCW (May 27, 2011)

slipknot said:


> The thing I cant figure out is....*its almost exclusively aussies that I pissed off*. Why are you guys so defensive when it comes to the chinese....the chinese are screwing you guys in the azz too...
> 
> That guy on ebay wont say its fake or real...he just responds...why do you think its fake.. when I asked him...which i couldnt resist



Well your earlier post about idiots buying Chinese knock offs did tend to point towards Australians. Also the fact that I have two Chinese 365 knock offs that I bought direct from a Chinese supplier. Along with all my piston and cylinder kits, 365 cranks, brake handles, coils, mufflers etc etc 
Before you flame me for this ask where half of Bailey's stuff is coming in from. I am an insignificant player in all of this but an easy target. Which doesn't worry me in the least...

If the eBay guy's responding like you've said then definately a fake. If it wasn't a fake he'd be trying his hardest to prove it's original.


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## a. palmer jr. (May 27, 2011)

I just hate to see the Chinese take over the manufacturing totally. There are people who lost their jobs because our companies went for the cheap (slave) labor. I, for one, was laid off in 1998 because our company went first to Mexico, then to China. People don't seem to realize that they're no friend to the US, they've just figured another way to destroy us, with our greed and wanting things for cheap.


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## MCW (May 27, 2011)

a. palmer jr. said:


> I just hate to see the Chinese take over the manufacturing totally. There are people who lost their jobs because our companies went for the cheap (slave) labor. I, for one, was laid off in 1998 because our company went first to Mexico, then to China. People don't seem to realize that they're no friend to the US, they've just figured another way to destroy us, with our greed and wanting things for cheap.



Did the Chinese make your company move offshore? No they didn't. No matter how much you dislike the Chinese etc they have NEVER made an American or Australian company move offshore. The ONLY reason companies are moving offshore is due to corporate greed originally, as you mentioned, but now you nearly have to move offshore to be competitive. It is not China's fault despite everybody pointing the finger at them.
They have a passion to succeed that our lazy arse's have forgotten about a long long time ago.
There is also another major reason why I've seen companies move offshore and that is due to Unions. Love them or hate them they have caused that many disruptions in workplace efficiency that in the end many companies have packed their bags and left.
Another example is what happened at a company where I used to work. They had a strong union influence and every day the Unions were pushing for payrises etc etc. In the end employees were that expensive per hour that it turned out to be cheaper to install auto packing and palletising machinery.
All of a sudden dozens of jobs were lost. If greedy employees and super pushy unions had pulled in the reins a bit these guys would still have jobs, albeit for a few dollars less an hour.
I'm not sure of the mentality in the US but the younger generation in Australia seem to think that they should be earning $25 an hour flipping burgers. People in China are happy to earn enough to feed themselves.


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## CentaurG2 (May 27, 2011)

Not too much aussie makes it to US consumers. Most recognized is beer (Fosters) and wine (yellowtail). Yellowtail is actually good stuff for the price but I swear fosters is nothing but roo wiz in a can. Thanks to the last free trade agreement I think we can also get aussie beef and sugar much to the chagrin of the domestic producers of these products. 

The 362xp knock offs are actually very easy to spot. I saw one at a dealer the other day waiting to get fixed. The color of the plastic is wrong and stands out like a sore thumb. Quality of the saw was very poor in both its appearance and fit of the outer plastic parts. I am sure china will get better at producing these things but as quality increases so will the price. As far as I am concerned, the more choices a consumer has the better it is for the consumer. Free market=free choice. Choose wisely.

YouTube - ‪My Boomerang Won't Come Back‬&rlm;


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## a. palmer jr. (May 27, 2011)

CentaurG2 said:


> Not too much aussie makes it to US consumers. Most recognized is beer (Fosters) and wine (yellowtail). Yellowtail is actually good stuff for the price but I swear fosters is nothing but roo wiz in a can. Thanks to the last free trade agreement I think we can also get aussie beef and sugar much to the chagrin of the domestic producers of these products.
> 
> The 362xp knock offs are actually very easy to spot. I saw one at a dealer the other day waiting to get fixed. The color of the plastic is wrong and stands out like a sore thumb. Quality of the saw was very poor in both its appearance and fit of the outer plastic parts. I am sure china will get better at producing these things but as quality increases so will the price. As far as I am concerned, the more choices a consumer has the better it is for the consumer. Free market=free choice. Choose wisely.
> 
> YouTube - ‪My Boomerang Won't Come Back‬&rlm;


 
I hope Fosters isn't the best beer you have!


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## Rudolf73 (May 27, 2011)

a. palmer jr. said:


> I hope Fosters isn't the best beer you have!


 
We have better beer for sure, I actually don't know any Australia's who do drink Fosters.


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## CentaurG2 (May 27, 2011)

a. palmer jr. said:


> I hope Fosters isn't the best beer you have!


 
A life time ago, we used to drink fosters “oil cans” with a genuine oil spout. Yea we was trying to be cool. Times change. You cant get oil in a can anymore and fosters changed the design of their cans to be toolless. Sam Addams Larger is the goto beer of choice around here. Most of the microbrews in the area taste like they are brewin with seawater cept for Geary’s. For the cheap stuff, I still prefer ice cold Michelob pounders but I am liking the InBev Budweiser American ale.


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## a. palmer jr. (May 27, 2011)

MCW said:


> Did the Chinese make your company move offshore? No they didn't. No matter how much you dislike the Chinese etc they have NEVER made an American or Australian company move offshore. The ONLY reason companies are moving offshore is due to corporate greed originally, as you mentioned, but now you nearly have to move offshore to be competitive. It is not China's fault despite everybody pointing the finger at them.
> They have a passion to succeed that our lazy arse's have forgotten about a long long time ago.
> There is also another major reason why I've seen companies move offshore and that is due to Unions. Love them or hate them they have caused that many disruptions in workplace efficiency that in the end many companies have packed their bags and left.
> Another example is what happened at a company where I used to work. They had a strong union influence and every day the Unions were pushing for payrises etc etc. In the end employees were that expensive per hour that it turned out to be cheaper to install auto packing and palletising machinery.
> ...


 
I'll agree with you up to a point...when I lost my job in 1998 our union wasn't that good. I had over 25 years with the company and was making about 10.50 an hour, which isn't all that good here. The union never did us that much good, but you had to join or lose your job. Of course I was a minor player and had nothing to do with corporate decisions.
About the Chinese...they have deliberately kept their currency and their wages low so that our companies would be tempted to go there for the excess profits. Again, it's corporate greed as we agreed on plus the consumer being willing to settle for poor quality initially in exchange for a cheap price and so we could buy things we couldn't otherwise afford. I feel that the US made the worst mistake in our 200+ year history by starting to trade with communist China. I feel that we played right into their hands by offering to be trading "partners". I don't think China can be trusted enough to call them an ally because of all the manipulating of currency on their part (and now on ours by the Fed), counterfeiting, etc.
I had originally thought this about the Japanese, turns out they were more honorable than I'd thought, but they still didn't allow many of our exports into their country. I imagine they will in the near future due to the current happenings in that country.


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## a. palmer jr. (May 27, 2011)

slipknot said:


> Now thats funny..you europeans prefering american beer...while alot of us americans prefer european beer...what gives..lol. I like Bass beer(england?) and warstiener from germany....american beer to me just tastes like dirty dish water and is very weak and i have to drink more in order to achieve my goal of catching a beer buzz..oh wait forgot about sammy adams...best mass produced beer in america


 
I didn't know New England was in Europe...gotta go look at my globe on that one!


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## Jed1124 (May 27, 2011)

This thread is going to wind up getting kicked over to the political section. I read through it and I think what a lot of folks don't get is how fed up Americans are with seeing all the manufacturing jobs go over to China. I do not think it is about unions, or high wages in the US, or even greedy corporations. I think it is the idea of a global economy that has been pushed down our throats since Bush senior. Just redistribution of wealth in a different form. Take all US manufacturing jobs and allow them to go over seas and there will be peace throughout the world! We will be a service economy that produces absolutely nothing. There was a time when this country would never allow companies to manufacture products in communist dictatorship countries that use political prisoners to staff there factories. Now we encourage it so we can buy cheap crap at Wall-Mart. We are just waking up to the fact that the politicians have sold us out with there utopian ideals and we are just a little pissed that is all. That is all us yanks that have to works for a living.


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## slipknot (May 27, 2011)

a. palmer jr. said:


> I didn't know New England was in Europe...gotta go look at my globe on that one!


 
Lol..i didn't catch that...but I think your right new England aint in Europe....that's funny:hmm3grin2orange:

Woops..

Come on you Australians..if ya wanted to flame me good there ya are..LOL..Have a go at it as ya'll say.
plus I think i may have lost the argument to mcw he made quite a lot of sense on that last go at it...lol...I'm not a fan of the unions...
Jed made even more sense though..


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## a. palmer jr. (May 28, 2011)

I don't know how many millions of dollars we spent fighting the communists in the last 40 years..they have opposed us in several wars, korea, viet nam, etc. and now we send them our jobs along with large donations to get them started! It's like we want them to compete with us and with an un-level playing field. Of course China and Russia, who we also bailed out, are using that help to further their armies, to use against us at some future date.


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## MCW (May 28, 2011)

As a few guys have mentioned trade agreements with countries like China aren't worth a piece of piss.
You can bet your left nut when it comes to them taking something of ours after we've bought a heap of things off of them they'll find something wrong with our produce.
As a well known Australian politician said recently - "Free trade is great but not when you're the only one doing it".

Also as far as guys flaming the Chinese 365's they've seen remember there are at least 1/2 a dozen companies that I know of making 365 knock offs. The quality varies substantially.

Oh and Fosters is crap beer. As Rudy said nobody here drinks it yet somehow people overseas think it's the best beer we have


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## a. palmer jr. (May 28, 2011)

As far as the fake Husqvarna and Stihl saws, I probably wouldn't buy a new one...I'm still getting used to having the real ones around. Up until this year I was still using the McCulloch, Homelite and Poland saws! I don't see much advantage to the Stihl and Husqvarna saws, might be a tad quicker but I'm not in that big of a hurry and the newer saws are harder to work on and the parts are more expensive.


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## CentaurG2 (May 28, 2011)

slipknot said:


> Now thats funny..you europeans prefering american beer...while alot of us americans prefer european beer...what gives..lol. I like Bass beer(england?) and warstiener from germany....american beer to me just tastes like dirty dish water and is very weak and i have to drink more in order to achieve my goal of catching a beer buzz..oh wait forgot about sammy adams...best mass produced beer in america


 
I have been called a lot of things but European is not one of them. Fosters is not all bad. It is better than no beer at all and they do have the portions down right. I have also had swan larger from down under and from what I remember it was very good. Never tried vegemite or a Chinese 365 knockoff but I would give them both the benefit of the doubt despite appearances.


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## slipknot (May 28, 2011)

Now dont you guys don't go blaming me for turning this into the political beer thread about chinese knock off saws.:hmm3grin2orange:I had some help. All i know is im glad it seems like things have cooled down and we can all talk about beer.
Since the great Steve Erwin and crocodile dundee are the only austrailians I've ever heard talk.....As a few guys have mentioned trade agreements with countries like China aren't worth a piece of piss...keeps going through my head in a steve erwin accent and i keep laughing....that saying/term "piece of piss" is deffinately aussie..lol..I thought it was so funny it inspired me to tell my old lady what I thought of her today...now I dont have to spend the day with her getting stuff for the memorial day cook out and such....now im banished to my man cave where I can finish up an engine rebuild.... thank YOU MCW Noice!!!


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## slipknot (May 28, 2011)

CentaurG2 said:


> I have been called a lot of things but European is not one of them. Fosters is not all bad. It is better than no beer at all and they do have the portions down right. I have also had swan larger from down under and from what I remember it was very good. Never tried vegemite or a Chinese 365 knockoff but I would give them both the benefit of the doubt despite appearances.


 
I am sorry...it was an accident and I wont let it happen again...not that there is anything wrong with europeans...just sayin..lol


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## slipknot (May 28, 2011)

Before I head out to the shop....

What is vegimite? 

It sounds like some kind of herbicide or fertilizer that the stupid greedy basterds Monsanto would come up with.


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## CentaurG2 (May 28, 2011)

slipknot said:


> I am sorry...it was an accident and I wont let it happen again...not that there is anything wrong with europeans...just sayin..lol


 
No harm done. I have been called a lot worse.


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## MCW (May 28, 2011)

slipknot said:


> that saying/term "piece of piss" is deffinately aussie..lol..I thought it was so funny it inspired me to tell my old lady what I thought of her today...now I dont have to spend the day with her getting stuff for the memorial day cook out and such....now im banished to my man cave where I can finish up an engine rebuild.... thank YOU MCW Noice!!!



Glad I could help but even gladder you understood piece of piss!
It's sort of self explanatory 



slipknot said:


> Before I head out to the shop....
> 
> What is vegimite?
> 
> It sounds like some kind of herbicide or fertilizer that the stupid greedy basterds Monsanto would come up with.



Vegemite is a yeast extract. It's black, looks like grease, and most Australians were brought up on it. Problem being now is that most Australians aren't really Australian anymore if you get the idea 

Vegemite to the unititiated is like eating a spreadable form of battery acid. Well that's how an American exchange student described it back at school. Very high in vitamins etc. It's good stuff. Do you guys have Promite or Marmite? Vegemite is a more potent form of those. PM me your address and I'll send you a jar 
At the very least it will clean the sap of your bars and chains.


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## a. palmer jr. (May 28, 2011)

MCW said:


> Glad I could help but even gladder you understood piece of piss!
> It's sort of self explanatory
> 
> 
> ...


 
Uh..I think I forgot my address...


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## Rudolf73 (May 28, 2011)

MCW said:


> Vegemite is a yeast extract. It's black, looks like grease, and most Australians were brought up on it. Problem being now is that most Australians aren't really Australian anymore if you get the idea
> 
> Vegemite to the unititiated is like eating a spreadable form of battery acid. Well that's how an American exchange student described it back at school. Very high in vitamins etc. It's good stuff. Do you guys have Promite or Marmite? Vegemite is a more potent form of those. PM me your address and I'll send you a jar
> At the very least it will clean the sap of your bars and chains.


 
That is a pretty good description Matt, I had to 'learn' to eat vegemite and now I don't mind. I prefer Bovril though - bit more beefy 

According to an old guy I know vegemite tea is a cure for quite a few things, can't say I have tried it though...


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## Oldsawnut (May 28, 2011)

hmmm whats that old saying... The cure is worse than the disease


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## KME (May 29, 2011)

CentaurG2 said:


> Not too much aussie makes it to US consumers. Most recognized is beer (Fosters) and wine (yellowtail). Yellowtail is actually good stuff for the price but I swear fosters is nothing but roo wiz in a can. Thanks to the last free trade agreement I think we can also get aussie beef and sugar much to the chagrin of the domestic producers of these products.
> 
> The 362xp knock offs are actually very easy to spot. I saw one at a dealer the other day waiting to get fixed. The color of the plastic is wrong and stands out like a sore thumb. Quality of the saw was very poor in both its appearance and fit of the outer plastic parts. I am sure china will get better at producing these things but as quality increases so will the price. As far as I am concerned, the more choices a consumer has the better it is for the consumer. Free market=free choice. Choose wisely.
> 
> YouTube - ‪My Boomerang Won't Come Back‬&rlm;


 
No one here has drunk Fosters since about 1985! Yellowtail is cheap, but enjoyable wine!

What you guys in the US forget is that your economy from years ago is based upon what the Chinese are doing now. You won't won't to hear it, but, you were, very, very good at copying overseas inventions & it made your country very, very wealthy!

Sound familiar?


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## wainohg (May 29, 2011)

I sure wish Ford would import those neat little Falcon Utes I've seen pictures of. Kinda looks like a modern version of the old Rancheros.



Stihlman441 said:


> *what does your country even manufacture?*
> 
> Ok i will start with oil,gas,minerals,trees (wood chip),wheat and grains,wool,cars the list is endless..............


----------



## a. palmer jr. (May 29, 2011)

KME said:


> No one here has drunk Fosters since about 1985! Yellowtail is cheap, but enjoyable wine!
> 
> What you guys in the US forget is that your economy from years ago is based upon what the Chinese are doing now. You won't won't to hear it, but, you were, very, very good at copying overseas inventions & it made your country very, very wealthy!
> 
> Sound familiar?


 
I guess the original post was about knockoff Stihl and Husqvarna, neither were from America. We didn't copy either of them, we had pretty good saws of our own. Our problem was that we quit making them like we used to. Of course if we made them in the USA like we made them in the 70s and 80s they would probably cost $2000 or more and people wouldn't buy them.


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## slipknot (May 29, 2011)

KME said:


> No one here has drunk Fosters since about 1985! Yellowtail is cheap, but enjoyable wine!
> 
> What you guys in the US forget is that your economy from years ago is based upon what the Chinese are doing now. You won't won't to hear it, but, you were, very, very good at copying overseas inventions & it made your country very, very wealthy!
> 
> Sound familiar?



What have we stolen? We pioneered modern manufacturing assembly lines...we all gotta thank henry ford for that and his model-t ford..Infact we pioneered the 21 century pretty much.


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## lspmmp (May 29, 2011)

Rudolf73 said:


> Try this site: Wholesale chain saw - Buy Low Price chain saw Lots on Aliexpress.com


 
Ok, I came in way late to this thread, but - What the ?????

These guys have a MS 260 copy for $165.00, and they admit that it is a copy, right down to the flippy caps.

Click here: Wholesale MS260 Stihl Copy chain saw,52CC

I have an older 026 and this looks just like the real thing. If I was Stihl I would be really unhappy with this situation. 

If it's like everything else coming from China, I'm sure it's pure junk. I wouldn't touch one of these no matter what the price is.


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## CentaurG2 (May 29, 2011)

MCW said:


> Vegemite is a yeast extract. It's black, looks like grease, and most Australians were brought up on it. Problem being now is that most Australians aren't really Australian anymore if you get the idea
> 
> Vegemite to the unititiated is like eating a spreadable form of battery acid. Well that's how an American exchange student described it back at school. Very high in vitamins etc. It's good stuff. Do you guys have Promite or Marmite? Vegemite is a more potent form of those. PM me your address and I'll send you a jar
> At the very least it will clean the sap of your bars and chains.


 
Yummy! Sounds just like okra. 

No vege, pro or mar mites in the states. We do have peanut butter but I think most kids are allergic to that stuff these days. Closest import I think would be nutella. 
Years ago we used to have a spruce gum industry in the state. It is also an acquired taste but it does leave the teeth and gums squeaky clean. Might give vegemite a run for its money.


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## CentaurG2 (May 29, 2011)

KME said:


> No one here has drunk Fosters since about 1985! Yellowtail is cheap, but enjoyable wine!
> 
> What you guys in the US forget is that your economy from years ago is based upon what the Chinese are doing now. You won't won't to hear it, but, you were, very, very good at copying overseas inventions & it made your country very, very wealthy!
> 
> Sound familiar?


 
Ah 1985. Now that was a good year. All you needed to do was acquire stuff. No earthy crunchy. No green. No exercise. How I miss the big fat 80’s. 

No following your argument here. The key to technology and scientific advancement is not to replicate what has already been done but to learn what has been done and take the next logical step. US has always been good at this and we got some good schools where you can learn about it and we have lots of business that dump lots of money into R&D to achieve the next step. 

Milton Hersey “borrowed” the technology necessary to produce milk chocolate from the Swiss or Germans (I think). He then proceded to build an empire with it. I don’t think this is what china is trying to do here.


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## Oldsawnut (May 29, 2011)

Actually its more of a quality issue and I doubt if hershey said it was imported swiss chocolate he said it was hersheys


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## AUSSIE1 (May 29, 2011)

slipknot said:


> What have we stolen? We pioneered modern manufacturing assembly lines...we all gotta thank henry ford for that and his model-t ford..Infact we pioneered the 21 century pretty much.


 
Are you double jointed Slip?


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## AUSSIE1 (May 29, 2011)

CentaurG2 said:


> Might give vegemite a run for its money.



Just had some for breaky on toast!

A tip for you Cent, apply it as THINLY as you possibly can.


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## a. palmer jr. (May 29, 2011)

lspmmp said:


> Ok, I came in way late to this thread, but - What the ?????
> 
> These guys have a MS 260 copy for $165.00, and they admit that it is a copy, right down to the flippy caps.
> 
> ...


 
That's bad, but not as bad as when they put labels on it that say it's a Stihl. I've seen that also and people buy these and think they really are the good ones, then when they tear up or wear out they think that Stihl has really slipped in quality.


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## 025Drew (May 29, 2011)

Buying knockoffs is a really bad idea even if they run well.

You are supporting a company and country that believes they have the right to copy anything anyone else makes. There is zero respect for patent rights and copy rights, in China.

I went through this with a company I was an engineer for. They got complaints every day from people buying the knock off product. All you can tell them is we are sorry, that is not ours, you purchased a knockoff. And in the end the company making the knockoffs sued Our company. It ended badly. 

You buy knockoffs, you should be taken out back and shot!


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## CentaurG2 (May 29, 2011)

That might be a bit harsh. Knockoffs can be a good thing. Lot of folks buy “generic” prescription drugs. They are cheaper but just as effective as name brand medicine. If the knockoffs are on the market, they force the price of genuine products down to compete with them. Consumers should be allowed to choose what they want to buy or what they can afford to buy. The more choices you have the better off for the consumers. A sole provider in a given industry can demand whatever they want for their products. That’s why the states has anti-trust laws. Free market=free choice.


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## CentaurG2 (May 29, 2011)

AUSSIE1 said:


> Just had some for breaky on toast!
> 
> A tip for you Cent, apply it as THINLY as you possibly can.


 
I had to look this vegemite stuff up. It is rumored to be available at Whole Foods (also called whole paycheck by the locals).I will try and pick up a bottle/can/pack/glob next time I am out. Anything made by Kraft foods (headquarted in Northfield, IL USA) can’t be too bad. Aint globalization great?


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## AUSSIE1 (May 29, 2011)

CentaurG2 said:


> I had to look this vegemite stuff up. It is rumored to be available at Whole Foods (also called whole paycheck by the locals).I will try and pick up a bottle/can/pack/glob next time I am out. Anything made by Kraft foods (headquarted in Northfield, IL USA) can’t be too bad. Aint globalization great?



:msp_thumbup:


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## Rudolf73 (May 29, 2011)

025Drew said:


> Buying knockoffs is a really bad idea even if they run well.
> 
> You are supporting a company and country that believes they have the right to copy anything anyone else makes. There is zero respect for patent rights and copy rights, in China.
> 
> ...


 
Buying a knock off saw might be a bad idea in most cases, but remember some knock offs are only about 10% of the 'real' saw price. And in some case people can't justify the extra 90% for something that will only be used a handful of times. And yes we have seen some examples of bad quality knock offs, but there are good ones also. 

Another point - just to clarify, buying blatant knock offs may support a country with no respect for copyright, etc. but don't forget - everytime you buy something with "made in china" on in you are supporting the same country and motivating them to continue copying whatever they please. 

You might think that everyone who has bought a knock off should be shot, but can you honestly tell me you have never bought something with "made in china" on it??


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## JimM (May 29, 2011)

Rudolf73 said:


> but can you honestly tell me you have never bought something with "made in china" on it??


 
Only fools believe otherwise.


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## gmax (May 29, 2011)

I have a 070 knock off, well sort off it's painted red & black, i didn't buy it, was a freebie from a friend. 
Should I be taken out the back and shot or perhaps just horse whipped


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## MCW (May 30, 2011)

025Drew said:


> You buy knockoffs, you should be taken out back and shot!


 
I'll supply you my address and the rifle and ammo 
I'll even let you touch my Chinese 365's if you like prior to shooting me. While you're at it you'll need a lot of ammo to shoot all of your car manufacturers and everybody else.
Oh and guess what else arrived today?
What do you know, ten 066/660 BB kits from you guessed it, CHINA  Oh and six 395XP mufflers, probably copied from Husqvarna?
I wonder if they actually copied the P&C from Stihl? Well they'd have to wouldn't they?







You are trying to make a very complex worldwide trend sound so simple without looking past the tip of your nose. If you think little old me is spelling the demise for the Western World by buying a couple of copied 365 saws (without Husqvarna labelling etc) you're wrong. By the way, last I heard the 365 was no longer available so when they start copying the 365 X-Torq feel free to complain.
Oh and the genuine Husqvarna HD filter setup fits these Chinese 365 saws nicely as well, as do the 76cc BB kits


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## Rudolf73 (May 30, 2011)

MCW said:


>


 
Looks like Christmas has come early Matt, Lucky you!


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## MCW (May 30, 2011)

Rudolf73 said:


> Looks like Christmas has come early Matt, Lucky you!



I'm bidding on an 066 at the moment on Fleabay to get a test mule again  These kits are from a different manufacturer. Slightly more expensive but extremely well finished and without the freeporting exhaust.

I'm not going any higher than $720 by the way (in case anyone here is bidding) 

Stihl Magnum 066 Chainsaw (eBay item 320705877571 end time 04-Jun-11 16:13:22 AEST) : Home


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## Rudolf73 (May 30, 2011)

MCW said:


> I'm bidding on an 066 at the moment on Fleabay to get a test mule again  These kits are from a different manufacturer. Slightly more expensive but extremely well finished and without the freeporting exhaust.
> 
> I'm not going any higher than $720 by the way (in case anyone here is bidding)
> 
> Stihl Magnum 066 Chainsaw (eBay item 320705877571 end time 04-Jun-11 16:13:22 AEST) : Home


 
Looks like a nice saw and hope you get it for that money - I won't bid on it to better your chances  haha

I have been looking at half of a 660 powerhead on ebay also (missing jug and covers by the looks) but eager ebay guys are already up to $320 last time i checked.


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## indiansprings (May 30, 2011)

Having sourced product globally for a greater portion of my life, I've come to the realization that most people have no friggin clue that about 60% of the worlds population/workforce makes less than 2.00 an hour. In a lot of countries still less than a 1.00 and hour. 
It hard to compete when you have unions demanding that you make 30.00 an hour and add to that 25k a year in benefits. We have simply priced ourselves out of the competitive mfg market compared to the GLOBAL economy/picture. Yes, in the past our quality and productivity were vastly superior, those days are over folks.
You get a college educated worker in China for about 80 cents and hour, you get a skilled garment worker in South Africa for about a 1.00 an hour, the same in Central America. 

You can stick your head in the sand and raise hell about how unfair it is but we have done it to ourselves along with our politicians.

The problem is our govt. is not stopping the illegal importation of the knockoffs. Our trade agreements are not worth the paper they are wrote on, until Washington decides to get serious with China and others that violate trade agreements this chit will continue to happen.

I buy American every time I can, and when it makes sense, my second choice is buying product made in Europe, but from a pricing stand point it is getting tougher and tougher to rationalize paying the price difference, the quality gap is narrowing.

I'll gladly pay up to 15% more for American product but no more.


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## Stihlman441 (May 30, 2011)

Ha Matt i hope ya get the 066 you have plenty of BB kits for it haha , and nice ironing board there mate i didny know you were like that.


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## gmax (May 30, 2011)

MCW said:


> I'll supply you my address and the rifle and ammo
> I'll even let you touch my Chinese 365's if you like prior to shooting me. While you're at it you'll need a lot of ammo to shoot all of your car manufacturers and everybody else.
> Oh and guess what else arrived today?
> What do you know, ten 066/660 BB kits from you guessed it, CHINA  Oh and six 395XP mufflers, probably copied from Husqvarna?
> ...


 
My Woodland Pro BB kit also arrived today, just the one but it's a big one :smile2:, i would hate to think what a genuine Stihl 090 P/C would cost


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## Rudolf73 (May 30, 2011)

gmax said:


> My Woodland Pro BB kit also arrived today, just the one but it's a big one :smile2:, i would hate to think what a genuine Stihl 090 P/C would cost


 
Very nice! can't wait to see a video :cool2:


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## gmax (May 30, 2011)

No worries, I'm just trying to get a better carby for it, depends if I get outbid tomorrow.


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## koshari (May 30, 2011)

while there is a lot of negative sentiment from people critisising others for buying chinese knock offs, i believe stihl ( at least stihl australia pty ltd) themselves need to take a small part of the blame as far as aussies buying knock offs goes, 

i recently got a ms261 sent over from a 3rd party who bought it legit from a walk in store from the US. he promptly paid state taxes on top of the retail, drove down to the local postal office , boxed it up and sent it over to me here in Australia, i gave him $30 for his troubles and a few other bucks to cover the cost of the paypal currency conversion.

total cost to me, $716AUD. list price from the same saw from an australian dealer, $1300!

the saw is made in the US so iam supporting American jobs, 

i even got an aistralian made GB bar made in sunshine, Melbourne shipped from the UK cheaper than i can get one in an australian retail store!

what the hell is going on there where a bar shipped half way round the world, handled twice then shipped back here is CHEAPER than what i can get it for locally????

and as for the beer part of the thread, forget fosters, we have boage , lowenbrau and hoegarrten here, 

( oh wait lowwey s and hoeys are european  )


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## a. palmer jr. (May 30, 2011)

I think we've defined the problem simply but well, it's a case of large corporations trying to get their products built as cheaply as possible and consumers wanting to buy the products as cheap as possible. That works fine when you're dealing with honest, moral and ethical people. China truly is none of those things, they manipulate their currency to their advantage and they counterfeit patented products freely. Americans and Europeans would be arrested for infringement of patent laws but we let the Chinese get away with it. It would be in our best interest to do without the products made in China. Red China has always been an enemy of the United States and their trade policies would hardly qualify them as our ally now.


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## koshari (May 30, 2011)

a. palmer jr. said:


> I think we've defined the problem simply but well, it's a case of large corporations trying to get their products built as cheaply as possible and consumers wanting to buy the products as cheap as possible. That works fine when you're dealing with honest, moral and ethical people. China truly is none of those things, they manipulate their currency to their advantage and they counterfeit patented products freely. Americans and Europeans would be arrested for infringement of patent laws but we let the Chinese get away with it. It would be in our best interest to do without the products made in China. Red China has always been an enemy of the United States and their trade policies would hardly qualify them as our ally now.


 
i still think it all to easy to blame china without looking at our own backyards, i can only really speak for australian scenarios, but for years businesses here have been moving production offshore to china, taking advantage of lesser manufacturing costs, which i can accept, however the retail prices being charged here are the same or more as what they were when the product was produced locally, so they are the ones who have done the moral back flip, 

now people have woken up that they can get the same item from china bypassing the local distributor for a closer to actual production cost they cry foul on moral grounds, 

a local Australian retailing giant found out just recently how pi$$ed off aussies were from being reamed by retail in this country,


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## a. palmer jr. (May 30, 2011)

My previous post was not to say that America is completely blameless in all this, they're not. Our country does plenty of currency manipulation on it's own. Did you ever wonder why you only get 1% or less on money you have in the bank? Our interest rates are being kept artificially low when they should be hovering closer to 10%. Another case of the "haves" sticking it to the "have nots!"


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## a. palmer jr. (May 30, 2011)

koshari said:


> i still think it all to easy to blame china without looking at our own backyards, i can only really speak for australian scenarios, but for years businesses here have been moving production offshore to china, taking advantage of lesser manufacturing costs, which i can accept, however the retail prices being charged here are the same or more as what they were when the product was produced locally, so they are the ones who have done the moral back flip,
> 
> now people have woken up that they can get the same item from china bypassing the local distributor for a closer to actual production cost they cry foul on moral grounds,
> 
> a local Australian retailing giant found out just recently how pi$$ed off aussies were from being reamed by retail in this country,


 
There's plenty of blame to go around on this one. Our citizens buy their products knowing full well what is going on. I would imagine Australia isn't much different than the US. Everyone wants to buy things and not pay a high price for it. If we think things are all right this way then we're only one step away from shoplifting. Why not just steal the product off the shelf and save 100% of the price? We're condoning stealing when we buy counterfeited products anyway.


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## tdi-rick (May 30, 2011)

Don't forget that all the Western nations have been playing economic rape and pillage with the second and third world for centuries, it's just that the Chinese have some clout now and are willing to wield it.

Their influence comes from firstly being cashed up, partially from embracing trade with the west in the eighties and then manipulating their currency to keep favourable balance of trade figures as you've pointed out.
Then, when US citizens became hooked on cheap, easy credit and the Feds didn't have the balls to step in and regulate the market they bought US Treasury Bonds to keep their main market afloat.

As a consequence you are both in a dance embrace neither can break without major economic consequences for either nation, or until China generates a substantial and affluent middle class. The outcome of that is even more frightening unless you guys can drag yourselves out of your hole.



What is scary is how unstable China is politically.

There is a massive play going on behind the scenes high up in the Communist Party between the moderates who wish to engage the world, trade with us and liberalise China and the arch leftist conservatives (and i know that sounds like an oxymoron to those in the US, but that's exactly what they are) 
who are pushing for things to go back to the Mao/cultural revolution days and take on the west in an idealogical/confrontationist/military aggressive way.

I read as much as I can on the buggers, there are some good columnists here that have been based in China for years and it's fascinating and frightening what is playing out behind a veil in Beijing. 

This bloke is good reading.
I try and read every article of his that is published.
John Garnaut - Business - smh.com.au


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## MCW (May 30, 2011)

indiansprings said:


> Having sourced product globally for a greater portion of my life, I've come to the realization that most people have no friggin clue that about 60% of the worlds population/workforce makes less than 2.00 an hour. In a lot of countries still less than a 1.00 and hour.
> It hard to compete when you have unions demanding that you make 30.00 an hour and add to that 25k a year in benefits. We have simply priced ourselves out of the competitive mfg market compared to the GLOBAL economy/picture. Yes, in the past our quality and productivity were vastly superior, those days are over folks.
> You get a college educated worker in China for about 80 cents and hour, you get a skilled garment worker in South Africa for about a 1.00 an hour, the same in Central America.
> 
> ...



Very well written mate and I agree. However it is easy to point the finger at John Q Citizen for willfully buying Chinese made produce and as some have done point the finger at me for importing Chinese 365 knock offs (ouch...my eye!).
Illegally produced knock offs are not the problem as truth be known they are a very very small portion of the Chinese produced goods entering both of our countries. 99.99% of Chinese goods entering our countries are 100% legit and legal.
Seriously though the simple consumer is not to blame for all of this. Labelling laws are a shocker and despite people for example seeing "Made In USA" on their new MS261 they don't for one second think of asking ask what percentage of the saw is actually US Made. Chinese carb for example. Even if you did ask I'd bet my left nut that you wouldn't get a truthful reply from Stihl USA.
For example we have an "Australian Made" Holden (GM) Cruze car. Australian made my arse - it's 75% foreign content.
See what I'm saying? This goes way deeper than the average consumer can hope to fathom.



Stihlman441 said:


> Ha Matt i hope ya get the 066 you have plenty of BB kits for it haha , and nice ironing board there mate i didny know you were like that.



Yeah I have to iron the wrinkles out of the Chinese bores 



a. palmer jr. said:


> There's plenty of blame to go around on this one. Our citizens buy their products knowing full well what is going on. I would imagine Australia isn't much different than the US. *Everyone wants to buy things and not pay a high price for it. If we think things are all right this way then we're only one step away from shoplifting.* Why not just steal the product off the shelf and save 100% of the price? We're condoning stealing when we buy counterfeited products anyway.



See my reply above to Indiansprings. Your analogy in bold is also plain stupid - it is not that simple and trying to convince people like myself that I am one step off of being a criminal doesn't sit well. The other thing too is that quite often the only product available is now ONLY made in China - buy some US made sandshoes for example. If you saw me in the supermarket you'd probably get a big shock as I absolutely refuse to buy Chinese food due to it's dubious quality. I am constantly amazed at just how much poor quality but low priced foodstuffs are gradually making their way onto our supermarket shelves.
I have no issue buying Chinese goods when the quality is up to scratch.
Despite a massive push by many Australian businessmen to "Buy Australian" the fact remains that when times are tough, people will buy the cheapest possible produce to sustain themselves and their families. It's easy for people to jump on their high horse about things such as this but money is tight in many circles at the moment.


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## MCW (May 30, 2011)

CentaurG2 said:


> That might be a bit harsh. Knockoffs can be a good thing. Lot of folks buy “generic” prescription drugs. They are cheaper but just as effective as name brand medicine. If the knockoffs are on the market, they force the price of genuine products down to compete with them. Consumers should be allowed to choose what they want to buy or what they can afford to buy. The more choices you have the better off for the consumers. A sole provider in a given industry can demand whatever they want for their products. That’s why the states has anti-trust laws. Free market=free choice.



This is exactly right. For example in Agricultural chemicals the average profit margin on new chemicals (before the patent expires) is 1000-1200%!!!
After 5 years (I think) when the product can be produced generically the margins for the manufacturers drop to around 20% or slightly more (funnily enough the retailers in our region are lucky to make 5%).
Same goes for drugs like you mentioned. How many people have died because drug companies have inflated their margins and poorer people can't afford the appropriate medication.
This isn't to say that companies who have invested the time and money into producing and testing the products can't make their money back, but they can't keep doing it forever.

Like chainsaws. As mentioned I have no time at all for blatent knock offs (Stihl/Husky labels etc) but remember that there is a time frame with which patents expire.
I have no problem with the Chinese knocking off saws that are no longer available from the major manufacturers. Like the 365


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## roostersgt (May 30, 2011)

I posted this earlier, but got no response. How is it that we can afford the European saws, Huskvarna and Stihl, but our companies here can't produce one of similar quality / price? The European nations that produce those saw brands are more heavily taxed and regulated than companies in the U.S. Furthermore, they have more unionization and affilliated employee costs than we. The U.S. can't produce a $600 - $1500 saw?


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## MCW (May 30, 2011)

roostersgt said:


> I posted this earlier, but got no response. How is it that we can afford the European saws, Huskvarna and Stihl, but our companies here can't produce one of similar quality / price? The European nations that produce those saw brands are more heavily taxed and regulated than companies in the U.S. Furthermore, they have more unionization and affilliated employee costs than we. The U.S. can't produce a $600 - $1500 saw?



I missed your post but I agree 100%. Their automotive industry is another example - generally very successful.


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## a. palmer jr. (May 30, 2011)

MCW said:


> Very well written mate and I agree. However it is easy to point the finger at John Q Citizen for willfully buying Chinese made produce and as some have done point the finger at me for importing Chinese 365 knock offs (ouch...my eye!).
> Illegally produced knock offs are not the problem as truth be known they are a very very small portion of the Chinese produced goods entering both of our countries. 99.99% of Chinese goods entering our countries are 100% legit and legal.
> Seriously though the simple consumer is not to blame for all of this. Labelling laws are a shocker and despite people for example seeing "Made In USA" on their new MS261 they don't for one second think of asking ask what percentage of the saw is actually US Made. Chinese carb for example. Even if you did ask I'd bet my left nut that you wouldn't get a truthful reply from Stihl USA.
> For example we have an "Australian Made" Holden (GM) Cruze car. Australian made my arse - it's 75% foreign content.
> ...


 
If you'll take the time to read that again you'll find that I didn't accuse you of anything, I was speaking in generalities. And I definitely wasn't throwing any of this at Australians. I'm sorry you took it so personal, maybe it's the slight differences in our form of English. In the USA we have a law against counterfeiting. We consider counterfeiting a form of theft and I guess, rightly so. If anybody wants to buy something made in China it's their right but it is not the Chinese' or anybody else's right to cobble up a chainsaw and call it a Stihl. Only the Stihl company has a right to do this. This may not be a problem in Australia but over here we see lots of knock-offs with name brand labels on them. And in my opinion that is the same as stealing from their company.
Personally, I prefer the older, metal, Homelite Poulan and McCulloch saws...nobody is trying to copy them.


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## MCW (May 31, 2011)

a. palmer jr. said:


> If you'll take the time to read that again you'll find that I didn't accuse you of anything, I was speaking in generalities. And I definitely wasn't throwing any of this at Australians. I'm sorry you took it so personal, maybe it's the slight differences in our form of English. In the USA we have a law against counterfeiting. We consider counterfeiting a form of theft and I guess, rightly so. If anybody wants to buy something made in China it's their right but it is not the Chinese' or anybody else's right to cobble up a chainsaw and call it a Stihl. Only the Stihl company has a right to do this. This may not be a problem in Australia but over here we see lots of knock-offs with name brand labels on them. And in my opinion that is the same as stealing from their company.
> Personally, I prefer the older, metal, Homelite Poulan and McCulloch saws...nobody is trying to copy them.


 
I'm aware that you were generalising however the fact that I'd made it plainly obvious that I have bought copied 365's did sort of point at people like me. Sorry if I came across the wrong way too but the internet can make things come across harsher than intended 

Now as mentioned I have never bought a Husky *labelled* rip off. The saws I have are blatant 365 copies but there is not one thing written anywhere to try and trick somebody into thinking they are a genuine Husky.
I draw the line there just like yourself and do not condone rip offs of any kind that are trying to deceive customers into believing they are the real deal. I have reported a guy on Australian eBay for selling knock off 090's yet claiming they are original Stihls. This prick even cracked over $2,000 for one from memory (I could have also imported these copy 090's landed in Australia for around USD$440 a piece). Funny thing was (and this shows how gullible even informed people can be) is that a thread was posted on Tre*world about this eBay auction and a fair few members fell for it. I piped in and had to burst their bubble. The penny didn't even drop with these guys when a second "Genuine" 090 popped up from the same seller immediately after the first one sold.

When I ordered the 365 clones I also ordered an 070 and an 038 knock off to have a look at (The quality turned out to be, um, very special...not). The manufacturer that my supplier purchased the saws from was that sh*t scared of getting busted by Australian Customs selling Stihl branded copies that the 070 arrived painted black and red, the Stihl branded bar had been spray painted black, and the 038 copy had all Stihl badges removed from it. I bought the 365's as test mules for the 76cc BB kits I've been importing and to basically thrash the crap out of without feeling bad about trashing a genuine Husky. I own a lot of genuine saws and have spent a small fortune in the industry on genuine gear so I don't feel as bad about it as some people think I should.

Blatant forgeries are looked upon just as harshly in Australia as in the US, maybe more so.


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## David (saltas) (May 31, 2011)

Genuine stihl part sold at a stihl dealer in USA 







I have no dog in this fight just had to post the pic in this thread


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## cc firefighter (May 31, 2011)

*Gio*

Do a google search for GIO.


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## gmax (May 31, 2011)

*I reported this counterfeit STIHL MS250 today*

Engine: 2-stroke,air cooled

Engine Displacement: 45.4cc

Rated Output Power: 2.2kw

Fuel tank capacity: 0.46L

Oil tank capacity: 0.20L

Cutting Diameter: 16"

Two-cycle oil/Gasoling Mixing Ratio: 1:25 

Pitch: 3/8"

Net weight: 5.6kgs Gross weight: 7.02kgs 

BNIB - STIHL MS250 Gasoline Chain Saw 16" Bar Chain | eBay


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## Rudolf73 (May 31, 2011)

gmax said:


> *I reported this counterfeit STIHL MS250 today*
> 
> Engine: 2-stroke,air cooled
> 
> ...


 
Thanks gmax, I thought it might be a fake but didn't look close enough. 

There is a 070 in SA also on ebay - incase you want to add to your collection haha.


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## David (saltas) (May 31, 2011)

cc firefighter said:


> Do a google search for GIO.


 
All I get is general insurance office


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## gmax (May 31, 2011)

Rudolf73 said:


> Thanks gmax, I thought it might be a fake but didn't look close enough.
> 
> There is a 070 in SA also on ebay - incase you want to add to your collection haha.


 
Thanks Rudolf, that 070 was listed a couple of weeks ago I watched it until the bidding went to about $300. No mention of why it's being re-listed? , maybe it's a dud.


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## Rudolf73 (May 31, 2011)

gmax said:


> Thanks Rudolf, that 070 was listed a couple of weeks ago I watched it until the bidding went to about $300. No mention of why it's being re-listed? , maybe it's a dud.


 
oh okay, thats seems like a reasonable price. how about that 090G - it looks like new but $2000 is way out of my price range.


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## gmax (May 31, 2011)

Rudolf73 said:


> oh okay, thats seems like a reasonable price. how about that 090G - it looks like new but $2000 is way out of my price range.


 
For $2000 I would rather have a Solo Twin


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## MCW (May 31, 2011)

gmax said:


> For $2000 I would rather have a Solo Twin



Sorry for the harsh response Wayne but if you bought a Solo Twin and didn't let me use it I'd kick you fair in the nuts.

I wouldn't help you stand back up either as I'd be running away with said Solo Twin.

Share and be friends or nut kicky - your choice mate.


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## David (saltas) (May 31, 2011)

MCW said:


> Sorry for the harsh response Wayne but if you bought a Solo Twin and didn't let me use it I'd kick you fair in the nuts.
> 
> I wouldn't help you stand back up either as I'd be running away with said Solo Twin.
> 
> Share and be friends or nut kicky - your choice mate.


 
Gmax 
You better bid on this as well as the solo twin
Cricket=Gloves=Pads=Upper body guard=Mixed items=(Puma) | eBay


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## gmax (May 31, 2011)

saltas said:


> Gmax
> You better bid on this as well as the solo twin
> Cricket=Gloves=Pads=Upper body guard=Mixed items=(Puma) | eBay
> Looks like I will have too


 


MCW said:


> Sorry for the harsh response Wayne but if you bought a Solo Twin and didn't let me use it I'd kick you fair in the nuts.
> 
> I wouldn't help you stand back up either as I'd be running away with said Solo Twin.
> 
> Share and be friends or nut kicky - your choice mate.


 
Wow how can I refuse an offer like that! , mate by the time I get a Solo Twin you will be too old to lift your leg high enough to kick me in the nuts


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## MCW (May 31, 2011)

saltas said:


> Gmax
> You better bid on this as well as the solo twin
> Cricket=Gloves=Pads=Upper body guard=Mixed items=(Puma) | eBay



He only needs the bat. While he's holding it and pulling off some Clive Lloyd classic 1980's reenactments I'll pissbolt with the Twin. Wayne has short legs but even then I'll still need a distraction and a head start I reckon...


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## MCW (May 31, 2011)

gmax said:


> Wow how can I refuse an offer like that! , mate by the time I get a Solo Twin you will be too old to lift your leg high enough to kick me in the nuts



Too old now  I was just acting cybertuff. You can do that online...


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## gmax (May 31, 2011)

MCW said:


> Too old now  I was just acting cybertuff. You can do that online...


 
If I find one in the next 20 years you won't be too old, but I might be


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## MCW (May 31, 2011)

gmax said:


> If I find one in the next 20 years you won't be too old, but I might be



Cool. If I'm lucky they won't let you start it in the retirement home so I'll get to take it out and run it everyday. I'd just rev it and listen to that sweet sweet sound...


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## gmax (May 31, 2011)

MCW said:


> Cool. If I'm lucky they won't let you start it in the retirement home so I'll get to take it out and run it everyday. I'd just rev it and listen to that sweet sweet sound...


 
We might have to settle for an Echo Twin


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## MCW (May 31, 2011)

gmax said:


> We might have to settle for an Echo Twin



I'll buy one cylinder and you can buy the other.


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## cc firefighter (May 31, 2011)

saltas said:


> All I get is general insurance office


 
GIO Chain Saw 52cc | GIO


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## koshari (May 31, 2011)

cc firefighter said:


> GIO Chain Saw 52cc | GIO


 
i wouldnt say that GIO saw was intended to fool anybody into thinking it was a genuine stihl, the ally handle, different colours and generally totally different styling are vastly different to any saws in the stihl 50cc range.

the back handle grip may be simmilay but no more than a husky for that matter, 

just like those bauhnAGs being flogged in aus.


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## Pharod (May 31, 2011)

to get the discussion back to topic, i feel free to advice you to watch this video: YouTube - ‪Warnung vor nicht konformen Motorsägen‬&rlm;

perhaps some of you know it already.


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## Rudolf73 (May 31, 2011)

koshari said:


> i wouldnt say that GIO saw was intended to fool anybody into thinking it was a genuine stihl, the ally handle, different colours and generally totally different styling are vastly different to any saws in the stihl 50cc range.
> 
> the back handle grip may be simmilay but no more than a husky for that matter,
> 
> just like those bauhnAGs being flogged in aus.



That particular chainsaw is another version of the "standard" chinese chainsaw which is produced by many different manufactures. It is based on a Redmax G5000 from memory. So, its not a stihl copy/knock off. 



Pharod said:


> to get the discussion back to topic, i feel free to advice you to watch this video: YouTube - ‪Warnung vor nicht konformen Motorsägen‬&rlm;
> 
> perhaps some of you know it already.


 
I have seen this video before and it shows how good a stihl really is. I think the chinese R & D department has a few things to answer for...

I do feel sorry for that stihl though... poor saw.


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## J.W Younger (Jun 3, 2011)

subscribing


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## tdi-rick (Jun 3, 2011)

Regarding the Chinese economy, this is interesting.



> Sure, there are some Australian companies exposed to the American consumer, but not many. China bears who haven't been keeping up with the changes underway there will carry on about an alleged dependence on American consumption patterns, but that's been exaggerated and increasingly lacks truth. *Most of China's exports now go to other emerging nations.* Beijing knows it has to flick the switch to greater domestic consumption spending and is working on it. *The percentage of US imports coming from Asia has remained about the same for two decades.*



From here Michael Pascoe | US growth going nowhere


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## vw_motorsports (Jun 3, 2011)

mayhem100 said:


> As the owner of a shiny new Husky 359 I have to say Ouch!
> 
> My only real Husky dealer (as in a dealer that sells saws bigger than a 455 Rancher) sells Stihls too...what do I do in this case? Echo?


 

Holy Crap, I thought you were on crack....Peru, MA? Never heard of it...then I googled it and sure enough you exist! And I live in MA....what an idiot I am.:msp_w00t:


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## delweis (Jan 22, 2013)

*Chinese Junk*

For your information ...the guys in China who build this stuff all have the same name...Wong Wei (Way)!!!


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## StihlKiwi (Jan 22, 2013)

delweis said:


> For your information ...the guys in China who build this stuff all have the same name...Wong Wei (Way)!!!



Explaining your own joke? Good one..


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## ozflea (Jan 22, 2013)

pro94lt said:


> it really hurts me to read this. keep this up and we'll have nothing but red china saws. just remember who they are, not our freinds.



Well i'll be buggered they own more of America than you do and your fellow countrymen buy there stuff by the truck load and are too tight to buy American stuff cause its too expensive 

Come-on give us chings a break ..... we will luv you for a long long time


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## ozflea (Jan 22, 2013)

MCW said:


> There are some good Chinese knock offs around such as SOME versions of the Husky 365. Not ALL of them are good. Just remember that there are literally dozens of factories producing knock off saws and the quality control varies substantially.
> I've imported a few from China and the Stihl knockoffs were crap but the Husky 365 knock offs were very very good. I started a thread on AS about the 365's a while ago and copped a bit of a pasting for it  Mainly because I said they were pretty good saws. If I'd have said they were crap everybody would have agreed but because I actually said they were good war broke out
> For me though the best part is that these 365's are a bolt for bolt knock off of the modern 365 version. This means that I can buy 100% of the parts for an absolute steal and a few members here already have some of these parts with no quality issues.
> My two Chinese 365's are now running the 76cc BB kits, have muffler mods, have the HD Husky felling spikes fitted, and would surprise a few people with how they run. I used one for 7 hours the other day stumping with a 24" bar and it ran like a clock.
> ...



Well maybe you shouldn't let that cat outta the bag whose side you on your one of the ones causing their problem i might have to report you to Husqvarna ..... ching lover


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## ozflea (Jan 22, 2013)

*No offense to you Aussies....but what does your country even manufacture? *What drives your economy?(im just curious) What jobs do you guys have to lose? Whether its a good knock off or not..your supporting a communist nation that is basically stealing when they make a product that is a knock off of someone else's and your supporting child labor and or BS wages....and when you do that it has many consequences and they will eventually show their ugly head here very shortly. I still stand by what I said..you guys are idiots for importing BS junk here to the most superior nation in the world..the United States of America. Look at all the technical advancements we have come up with and are generous enough to share with the rest of the world...I mean if it wasnt for us..the chinese wouldn't have much to steal....minus the chainsaws...I bet the germans are pissed about that. Isnt it illegal to import that crap here anyways? :msp_w00t:[/QUOTE]

*Well said after you Americans prostituted our market with cheap stuff and took our manfacturing away i'd say its the pot calling the kettle black !*

We'll just keep selling more dirt to them Iron Ore so they can sell their stuff to you.


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## ozflea (Jan 22, 2013)

MCW said:


> I'll supply you my address and the rifle and ammo
> I'll even let you touch my Chinese 365's if you like prior to shooting me. While you're at it you'll need a lot of ammo to shoot all of your car manufacturers and everybody else.
> Oh and guess what else arrived today?
> What do you know, ten 066/660 BB kits from you guessed it, CHINA  Oh and six 395XP mufflers, probably copied from Husqvarna?
> ...


*
I hope your not importing Chinese bullets ............... young fella*


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## ozflea (Jan 22, 2013)

Rudolf73 said:


> Very nice! can't wait to see a video :cool2:



*Proberly made in china *


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## ozflea (Jan 22, 2013)

gmax said:


> *I reported this counterfeit STIHL MS250 today*
> 
> Engine: 2-stroke,air cooled
> 
> ...



*Dobber *


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## ozflea (Jan 22, 2013)

gmax said:


> For $2000 I would rather have a Solo Twin



I can sell ya one


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## srb08 (Jan 22, 2013)

jason6586 said:


> I know many of you may think im crazy but I would like to get my hands on a few china knock offs just for the heck of it. Any ideas where I could get them?


 
There is a guy in Nixa Mo selling them. Go to Springfield Mo Craigs list and search chainsaw.


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## ozflea (Jan 22, 2013)

gmax said:


> We might have to settle for an Echo Twin



Got one of them too


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## hunter h (Jan 22, 2013)

*New to the thread.*

I have been reading this and it is very interesting I myself like many others do not like to by products made over seas unless I have no choice haveing said that I wonder how maney of us that feel that way have. Buy things from Harbor Freight, Wallmart, or just about any wear else that we think we can save some money. I am guilty and I know it. How about our food do you know how much food you eat comes from over seas. When it comes down to will I by made in the USA or save money what do we chose I wish I could say made in the USA but I can not afford it. Is China making money on us yes. Do they copy our products yes. Do they use our products and tech yes. But it is kind of hard to compete when our goverment has a trade deal that will let them sell a product here that is not as good as what is made here. Why is it Toyota can have a plant here and make cars and sell them to us cheaper than we can make them maybe that they are in right to work state and they are not union. What saws are made in the US. Before you say Stihl I mean made in US not put together here. I know this is alot of questions my point is we the US have got to come to a point that if we are going to be what we once were then we will have to make changes and we need to vote for that kind of change. I am done I will keep using my old Poulans for now or as long as I can find parts and keep them going.


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## Chris-PA (Jan 22, 2013)

I've been thinking about this topic lately since I got my Earthquake 38cc saw. These are marketed/imported by this outfit:

Chainsaw 16" - 38cc Viper Engine - Detail information for Chainsaw 16" - 38cc Viper Engine

They have a nice site, professional looking manuals, post IPLs and claim to be able to provide some parts (have not tried). The saws are clearly RedMax G3800 and G450 based designs, and are retailed by Sears, Tractor Supply and other large chains. They appear to be made by this company:

3800 gasoline chain saw,View chain saw,EMAS Product Details from Taizhou Emas Machine Co., Ltd. on Alibaba.com

Chain Saws direct from China (Mainland)

Although there are some very minor differences from the pictures so maybe not. 

What I wonder about is that this saw is an exact copy of a G3800 with an exact copy of a Walbro WT carb, to the point that parts will swap. But if they are sold through such large retailers, wouldn't you think they must have permission? Wouldn't that be a huge liability otherwise? It's not the new stuff, it's copies of obsolete products. But then if you look at the other saws they make, there are exact copies of other saws as well as more of these RedMax based units with covers shaped and colored to look like Husky, Stihl and even Poulan. I am curious about the legal status of these saws, and if they have any supply connections to the real stuff. 

..............

The saw itself has inferior quality castings, plastic molding and machining, but it does run. The exhaust port was tiny and the muffler a restrictive cat unit, but those are not production quality issues. With some porting and a MM and the plastic cleaned up it runs great - like a G3800. We'll see how long it lasts but I actually suspect it will do fine. So they can manufacture a saw, and they could do it better if they wanted to. They've got decent designs to start from, and while I suspect local regulations may keep them out of many places they'll get sales in plenty of the rest of the world, and could well become effective competition.


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## Javelin (Jan 22, 2013)

the guy in nixa mo is not a legit shop. He is a homeowner fixing up saws and ruining the market. He is buying off of ebay and is not a dealer for the infinity chainsaw that he claims he is dealing in.


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## ausneil 1 (Jan 23, 2013)

gmax said:


> We might have to settle for an Echo Twin



echo twin,,,, please explain!!!!!!!!
Are you by chance refereing to those 80 sum thing cc's jamed into a twin which came out in the early 80's.


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## MCW (Jan 23, 2013)

ausneil 1 said:


> echo twin,,,, please explain!!!!!!!!
> Are you by chance refereing to those 80 sum thing cc's jamed into a twin which came out in the early 80's.



If I'm not mistaken Neil you have a good story in regard to Echo in your felling days


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## ausneil 1 (Jan 23, 2013)

MCW said:


> If I'm not mistaken Neil you have a good story in regard to Echo in your felling days



If its the same saw matt then yes i do know a little on the subject.


Hey ladies and gentlemen, i have just counted 14 chineese 070 copies on this very page, they have stihl on them but the gentleman has clearly stated they are indeed a copy. Talk about advertisement for china.:msp_thumbup:


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## scallywag (Jan 23, 2013)

slipknot said:


> LOL..I am a big man actually at 6-4 285 lbs, so I feel this way everyday. the only way i would lick spike is if he were a good lookin woman...and he's not..so i find humor in that statement..but I can take a joke so its ok. But.......
> 
> No offense to you Aussies....but what does your country even manufacture? What drives your economy?(im just curious) What jobs do you guys have to lose? Whether its a good knock off or not..your supporting a communist nation that is basically stealing when they make a product that is a knock off of someone else's and your supporting child labor and or BS wages....and when you do that it has many consequences and they will eventually show their ugly head here very shortly. I still stand by what I said..you guys are idiots for importing BS junk here to the most superior nation in the world..the United States of America. Look at all the technical advancements we have come up with and are generous enough to share with the rest of the world...I mean if it wasnt for us..the chinese wouldn't have much to steal....minus the chainsaws...I bet the germans are pissed about that. Isnt it illegal to import that crap here anyways? :msp_w00t:



Hmmm......I believe I can answer some of your questions for you. 

What do we manufacture? Kangaroo's and sheep and lots of em !

What drives our economy? Well, beer of course.

What jobs do we have? Well naturally all us good looking bronze Aussie men are gigolo's (that's a man whore ):msp_tongue:


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## pgg (Jan 23, 2013)

chinese saws, yeah right


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## gmax (Jan 23, 2013)

ausneil 1 said:


> echo twin,,,, please explain!!!!!!!!
> Are you by chance refereing to those 80 sum thing cc's jamed into a twin which came out in the early 80's.



61.0 cc Twin, I'm not really looking for one I've heard from many people that they're under powered and unreliable, besides
I have a new saw to play with this week :msp_w00t:


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## WidowMaker1 (Jan 23, 2013)

60cc twin huh. that be like wacking two whipper snippers together. lol


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## MCW (Jan 23, 2013)

gmax said:


> besides I have a new saw to play with this week :msp_w00t:



My 550XP?


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## gmax (Jan 23, 2013)

MCW said:


> My 550XP?



I hope so


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## ausneil 1 (Jan 23, 2013)

gmax said:


> 61.0 cc Twin, I'm not really looking for one I've heard from many people that they're under powered and unreliable, besides
> I have a new saw to play with this week :msp_w00t:



From memory i thought they were 80 odd cc's but at 61.0 that explains a lot.
My guess, some have been restored or just shelved by colectors, which is where they should be.


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## ozflea (Jan 23, 2013)

ausneil 1 said:


> From memory i thought they were 80 odd cc's but at 61.0 that explains a lot.
> My guess, some have been restored or just shelved by colectors, which is where they should be.



The Echo Twin in its day was not a cheap saw which didnt do the saw any favours and being 
only 60cc was kinda gutless compared to what else was running around for less money 
I recall Bob Reid Mowers of Maitland sold a few a good realiable saw but underpowered 

McBob


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