# telephone poles for firewood



## mjs97 (Feb 27, 2007)

is it ok to burn telephone poles. recent ice storm was hard on them so plenty of broken ones everywhere. they are cedar wood i think.

thanks,
matt


----------



## PA. Woodsman (Feb 27, 2007)

*No!*



mjs97 said:


> is it ok to burn telephone poles. recent ice storm was hard on them so plenty of broken ones everywhere. they are cedar wood i think.
> 
> thanks,
> matt



I would think that they are treated with a chemical so I'd say NO!!! You don't want to burn something like that that can give off who-knows-what when burning!!!


----------



## kevinj (Feb 27, 2007)

Absolutly not!
Too many poisons.
Not only dangerous to yourself.
But, What if AL GORE found out.


----------



## Wismer (Feb 27, 2007)

Yea, They are soaked in creosote.

It's bad enough just burnin' em, but definatly do not do it inside.


----------



## mjs97 (Feb 27, 2007)

i figured that it wasnt a good idea. it would be burned in outdoor boiler, but still not worth it.

matt


----------



## Husky137 (Feb 27, 2007)

not a good idea. guys burning [email protected] like that gives owb's a bad rep.


----------



## Haywire Haywood (Feb 27, 2007)

Send a dozen to so to me, I need them to build a small retaining wall.

Ian


----------



## Powerlineman (Feb 27, 2007)

Like stated before they are treated with a form of creasote, not a good thing to burn. They do make excellent fence posts and will last a lifetime!


----------



## bigbadbob (Feb 27, 2007)

Don't everybody panic about burning cedar telephone poles. There are a few different types of treated poles. By looking they are easy to tell apart. There are the redish brown ones called a full treat, treated with creosote top to bottom, don't burn those. Then there is the butt treated poles, they are only treated from the base to approximatly 12feet up or at the hash mark, ok to burn the portion above 12feet of the hash mark as that is untreated. Then there are the green treated ones don't burn them. Sometime it is easier to do a cut on a pole above the hash mark and look at the wood for any sign of being treated. Burning the creosote in the open is not to bad, but when you burn it in a wood stove it creates some toxic gases etc. We must tag our old treated poles with a do not incinerate tag. We are also warned not to have skin contact with the green ones, not to sure what it will do to you, but it's ok to use it in playground structures.
Bob


----------



## TooTall999 (Feb 27, 2007)

bigbadbob said:


> Don't everybody panic about burning cedar telephone poles. There are a few different types of treated poles. By looking they are easy to tell apart. There are the redish brown ones called a full treat, treated with creosote top to bottom, don't burn those. Then there is the butt treated poles, they are only treated from the base to approximatly 12feet up or at the hash mark, ok to burn the portion above 12feet of the hash mark as that is untreated. Then there are the green treated ones don't burn them. Sometime it is easier to do a cut on a pole above the hash mark and look at the wood for any sign of being treated. Burning the creosote in the open is not to bad, but when you burn it in a wood stove it creates some toxic gases etc. We must tag our old treated poles with a do not incinerate tag. We are also warned not to have skin contact with the green ones, not to sure what it will do to you, but it's ok to use it in playground structures.
> Bob



Seems to me the safest bet is don't burn 'em


----------



## Gologit (Feb 27, 2007)

*cedar poles?*

Do they really use cedar for poles? Down here it's mostly white fir. Sounds like those cedar poles would make good corral posts or fence bucks.


----------



## bigbadbob (Feb 27, 2007)

The older poles here a western red cedar, yellow cedar, tamarac and now pine.
The pine I doubt will last very long. The farmers are always begging us for our old poles, sheds, barns, fences etc etc. Wood workers always want the yellow cedar.


----------



## bassman (Feb 28, 2007)

just burn them.
guy i know burns tires.....
OWB will eat anything .


----------



## livewire (Feb 28, 2007)

bassman said:


> just burn them.
> guy i know burns tires.....
> OWB will eat anything .



WHOA...

I wouldn't even consider that. Forget air quality for a minute and consider the fine you will get if your local FD catches wind of those things burning in your OWB.

Okay now consider air quality; tar, rubber, and various other airborn toxins.
That crap is not good for the lungs. Dmn glad that guys not my neughbor!!!


----------



## turnkey4099 (Feb 28, 2007)

If they are cedar and only treated on the bottom you could burn the top. Not very good wood at all as it burns fast and hot. I would use it only if it was delivered for me, wouldn't bother going after it myself.

Tamarack, pine, fire would be worth the trouble if you can leave the treated portion in place. If you haul that stuff home, you have a disposal problem.

Harry K


----------



## Husky137 (Feb 28, 2007)

livewire said:


> WHOA...
> 
> I wouldn't even consider that. Forget air quality for a minute and consider the fine you will get if your local FD catches wind of those things burning in your OWB.
> 
> ...



Good points, not to mention it isn't good for the OWB either. Burning [email protected] like that will eat the firebox. 

Funny how people can justify things just because they happen to know a jacka$$ that does it. I know a guy who insists on felling trees without a notch, he isn't dead yet, so it must be a good thing to do.


----------



## BIG JAKE (Feb 28, 2007)

I cleaned a chimney for a guy who told me he burns railroad ties. That was after I was already there. His clay lined masonry chimney was coated with creosote that looked like it was poured on as a liquid and then dried. I got what I could with a brush. What was left (most of it) would only come off with a chimney fire or chemical treatment. 
I wonder if an insurance company could wave paying for a burned down house if they could prove railroad ties or telephone poles were being burned? My guess would be yes-if they could prove that. Chemical test from the residue? Never heard of that. In any case it wouldn't be worth the risk to me.


----------



## michael j (Feb 28, 2007)

I burnt alot of rr tie a few years back. Never had chimney problems or stove problems. The only problem I had was gettin' 'em cut. Haven't burnt as many poles, but I do when I can get 'em.

Mike


----------



## johnha (Feb 28, 2007)

michael j said:


> I burnt alot of rr tie a few years back. Never had chimney problems or stove problems. The only problem I had was gettin' 'em cut. Haven't burnt as many poles, but I do when I can get 'em.




You might want to get a chest x-ray, though.


----------



## TooTall999 (Feb 28, 2007)

michael j said:


> I burnt alot of rr tie a few years back. Never had chimney problems or stove problems. The only problem I had was gettin' 'em cut. Haven't burnt as many poles, but I do when I can get 'em.
> 
> Mike



It's this kind of bullsh*t that gives woodburners a bad rep.Just because it will burn doesn't mean it should be burnt.Time to grow up a little and be responsible.Just because you don't give a crap doesn't mean you should cause trouble for everyone else.:bang: :bang:   :censored: :censored: :angry2: :angry2:


----------



## livewire (Feb 28, 2007)

TooTall999 said:


> It's this kind of bullsh*t that gives woodburners a bad rep.Just because it will burn doesn't mean it should be burnt.Time to grow up a little and be responsible.Just because you don't give a crap doesn't mean you should cause trouble for everyone else.:bang: :bang:   :censored: :censored: :angry2: :angry2:



YUP!

The EPA doesn't need anymore examples for why we need limitations! STOP HELPING THEM!


----------



## MS-310 (Feb 28, 2007)

Use an OWb just like an indoor wood stove, clean and dry. The "EPA" there are here for us........lol sorry. But only burn good wood.


----------



## ben14826 (Feb 28, 2007)

livewire said:


> WHOA...
> 
> I wouldn't even consider that. Forget air quality for a minute and consider the fine you will get if your local FD catches wind of those things burning in your OWB.
> 
> ...



I think he was kidding?


----------



## Gologit (Feb 28, 2007)

ben14826 said:


> I think he was kidding?



Let's hope so. Otherwise he'll be a candidate for the next Darwinism award.


----------



## Kate Butler (Feb 28, 2007)

*telephone poles*

http://www.osmose.com/utilities/products/treatment/

I have a friend who worked for this company for years all around the country and you would not believe the toxcicity of the chemicals used in pole preservation. Not that the chemicals are inherently "bad" - they do the job. BUT, the job is to preserve the poles..... not to make fireweood.


----------



## michael j (Feb 28, 2007)

Keep 'em comin'!!

Mike


----------



## bassman (Mar 1, 2007)

people on this forum and others seem to think an OWB is in some way like a indoor woodstove.
well there not .
my OWB eats wood at 10 times the rate of my indoor stove and that SUCKS!!
I was lied to when i bought it and it was a last minute way to heat my wifes greenhouse.
the dumb idea i had was to run it to the house and make it pay for its self in 3 years .
well sure it saves on gas but when your wood pile gets low you get scared and will try anything.
I only burn good dry wood in mine but i have tried used cooking oil dumped on the wood and 1 tire .
the cooking oil seems ok and i think if i could get a pan type burner it would work real good but there is the design flaw of no complete combustion so no matter what you burn most of the heat goes up and out.
burn dry hard wood in a barrel and it dosent smoke much ....
the original post of poles sounds more like "hey what can i feed my woodpig as i am outta wood" to me.


----------



## windthrown (Mar 1, 2007)

*Burning creosote may not be a problem...*

Creosote burns. It would seem to me that burning creosote may not be that big of an issue. Our OWB builds up creosote inside all the time. I sluff it off of the sides of the burn chamber into the boiler ashes and it burns fine. There are several companies in Northern California that burn creosote-only RR ties in boilers for fuel and they do not trip any EPA emmissions limits. The problem is if the poles are treated with anything *other* than creosote.


----------



## windthrown (Mar 1, 2007)

*Owb?*



bassman said:


> people on this forum and others seem to think an OWB is in some way like a indoor woodstove.
> well there not .
> my OWB eats wood at 10 times the rate of my indoor stove and that SUCKS!!



What kind of OWB do you have there? We do not seem to have a problem with huge amounts of wood burning here, and we burn about 5 cords during the heating season as expected. We love our OWB! But we only burn wood and paper and cardboard in there. Keeps the house and water nice and toasty.


----------



## Haywire Haywood (Mar 1, 2007)

I was under the impression that the EPA had stopped them from using creosote to treat telephone poles because it was leaching into the soil. Any truth to it?

Ian


----------



## turnkey4099 (Mar 1, 2007)

Haywire Haywood said:


> I was under the impression that the EPA had stopped them from using creosote to treat telephone poles because it was leaching into the soil. Any truth to it?
> 
> Ian



It seemed to me to be more a batch of activists pushing for it until they finally bent over. No matter how much info was put out that any 'leaching' was minimal and a lot of drinking water naturally contains more arsenic than you could get from the wood (other than by chewing and eating it).

Harry K


----------



## redprospector (Mar 1, 2007)

A better use for old power poles is to go over them with a metal detector, and mill them into planks for trailer floors. Be sure to wear a resperator when milling!

Andy


----------



## kevinj (Mar 1, 2007)

*Birthday boy.*

Happy Birthday Red !
:bday:


----------



## redprospector (Mar 1, 2007)

Haha, Thanks Kevinj. 

Andy


----------



## windthrown (Mar 1, 2007)

Haywire Haywood said:


> I was under the impression that the EPA had stopped them from using creosote to treat telephone poles because it was leaching into the soil. Any truth to it?
> 
> Ian



Actually the vapor from creosote will kill plants around it and leech into the soil. But there must be a billion poles out there soaked in creosote.


----------



## olyman (Mar 1, 2007)

i agree with windthrown--creosote is a O I L derative---and there are plenty of waste oil burners heating shops---all around the country---so--its not the creosote--its what might be in it----and did you know--its not against the law to burn tires--some of the elec generating plants burn ground up tires--and their stacks have to pass emissions-----also--a tire in a woodburner--with the air on full----will burn a tire fairly clean---because your getting the tire hot enough to burn all of it--the black smoke from a open burn tire--is fuel that will burn if hot enough--which is what a wood burner is---


----------



## musch (Mar 2, 2007)

Man I wish I could get my hands on 20 or 30 of em.
I need a good backstop for my shooting range.


----------



## jhellwig (Mar 2, 2007)

In Iowa I think you are allowed to burn one tire in a brush pile. Any brush piles I have made burn so fast and hot that the tire doesn't have a chance to give out black smoke. I would not think of sticking one of the stinking things in the owb. The smoke from the thing goes through our yard and towards the barn most of the time.


----------



## Bowtie (Mar 3, 2007)

I cant believe people would put creosote soaked poles or tires in any firebox. Use some common sense. Just the smell from creosote soaked poles or a tire is enough to gag a person. I dont care what anyone else says, it aint right.


----------



## michael j (Mar 29, 2007)

I see I got some bashing for burning RR ties. Well, I was trying to answer the original question. It had no adverse affect on my stove. I didn't post it to be judged by people that weren't big enough to carry a saw in 1984. Yes in 1984 I burnt ties. Creosote which is a derivative of coal tar, not crude oil, was available to the general public at the local hardware store. I preferred ties to the coal alot of people burn because it burnt cleaner than smoking, soot spewing coal. 
I also remember my Dad dusting the garden with chlordane, when it was the thing to use, and we ate the veggies. If you buy produce from Mexico today, you're probably eating it too. Don't bash me for answering a question. What I did was acceptable at the time.I really don't know why I'm explaining myself anyway. I guess I just got a burr in my boot or something.
Rant off.

Mike


----------



## olyman (Mar 29, 2007)

michealj--i agree, some people just aint happy speaking a opinion--they just about have to call you a idiot for doing it--but if they own a owb--and someone condemns that--they get all up in arms--and remember--we are feeding the global warming by burning wood---have to buy some credits from goreless so i feel good---blahhhhhh why dont some of the people on here get a life--period--dont like it--tough


----------



## bushinspector (Mar 29, 2007)

Only thing I know about railroad ties is when we planted them around a tree is the old tree died within a year.


----------



## olyman (Mar 29, 2007)

bush--if they are just set on top of ground--your ok--but when you bury them--the creosote leaches


----------



## turnkey4099 (Mar 29, 2007)

olyman said:


> michealj--i agree, some people just aint happy speaking a opinion--they just about have to call you a idiot for doing it--but if they own a owb--and someone condemns that--they get all up in arms--and remember--we are feeding the global warming by burning wood---have to buy some credits from goreless so i feel good---blahhhhhh why dont some of the people on here get a life--period--dont like it--tough



I'm curious about your reasoning "feeding the GW by burning wood". I think it is almost neutral as if I weren't burning wood, I would be burning oil.

Harry K


----------



## turnkey4099 (Mar 29, 2007)

michael j said:


> I see I got some bashing for burning RR ties. Well, I was trying to answer the original question. It had no adverse affect on my stove. I didn't post it to be judged by people that weren't big enough to carry a saw in 1984. Yes in 1984 I burnt ties. Creosote which is a derivative of coal tar, not crude oil, was available to the general public at the local hardware store. I preferred ties to the coal alot of people burn because it burnt cleaner than smoking, soot spewing coal.
> I also remember my Dad dusting the garden with chlordane, when it was the thing to use, and we ate the veggies. If you buy produce from Mexico today, you're probably eating it too. Don't bash me for answering a question. What I did was acceptable at the time.I really don't know why I'm explaining myself anyway. I guess I just got a burr in my boot or something.
> Rant off.
> 
> Mike



Fairly reasonable post except that in 1984 it was _not_ acceptable. I started burning in the 70s and it was already a no-no then.

Harry K


----------



## olyman (Mar 30, 2007)

turnkey4099 said:


> I'm curious about your reasoning "feeding the GW by burning wood". I think it is almost neutral as if I weren't burning wood, I would be burning oil.
> 
> Harry K


 turnkey--that was sarcasm--i dont believe we are feeding it---and the woodburners in use now--are lots more efficent than years ago--- also post 46--the yuppies were in business even then--they nearly always want to spout off about something--with no FACTS--just repeat drivel they have heard--sheep to the slaughter---


----------



## Sprig (Apr 3, 2007)

bigbadbob said:


> Don't everybody panic about burning cedar telephone poles. There are a few different types of treated poles. By looking they are easy to tell apart. There are the redish brown ones called a full treat, treated with creosote top to bottom, don't burn those. Then there is the butt treated poles, they are only treated from the base to approximatly 12feet up or at the hash mark, ok to burn the portion above 12feet of the hash mark as that is untreated. Then there are the green treated ones don't burn them. Sometime it is easier to do a cut on a pole above the hash mark and look at the wood for any sign of being treated. Burning the creosote in the open is not to bad, but when you burn it in a wood stove it creates some toxic gases etc. We must tag our old treated poles with a do not incinerate tag. We are also warned not to have skin contact with the green ones, not to sure what it will do to you, but it's ok to use it in playground structures.
> Bob


The 'green' I believe is 'Coprinol' (sp), a copper-based antirot agent, very toxic bad bad stuff, many playgrounds (including all the ones around here) that used treated woods for their structures are being torn down, the ground scraped down, and replaced by plastic or metal yard toys. As far as I know treated woods are now banned from Canadian playgrounds, not sure about the States, may be a local state-by-state thing, dunno. Yup, don't burn it! They do make great corner posts for fences or floor/structure supports tho.



Serge


----------



## BigSawMan (Nov 17, 2007)

olyman said:


> bush--if they are just set on top of ground--your ok--but when you bury them--the creosote leaches


 
So if these are old poles, and most of the creosote has been allready leached out, then it probably wouldnt be that bad then huh?

We have a classic CL75 owb and I can fill the fire box up to the hilt in that thing at night, then have to put logs in it in the early AM when I'm burning yellow pine logs treated with creosote, or bare. Course I'm radiant heating a 40x60x16 shop with no insulation in it and a open peak roof at the moment untill we get it finished up, along with a heat exchanger in the house(30x60x8). 


They burn clean, cant smell em, and the smoke just wafts off into our woods, which we have 3 acres of.


----------



## goblin (Nov 17, 2007)

turnkey4099 said:


> It seemed to me to be more a batch of activists pushing for it until they finally bent over. No matter how much info was put out that any 'leaching' was minimal and a lot of drinking water naturally contains more arsenic than you could get from the wood (other than by chewing and eating it).
> 
> Harry K



Around here when they outlawed creosote (late 80's?) they switched from creosote to copper arsenic, which is like going from the frying pan into the fire. It wasn't until several years later that they realized the arsenic was leaching out of the wood into the environment (children's playgrounds!) much worse than the creosote ever did. Now they use copper something-or-other instead of the arsenic.

By the way, the copper is actually 'verdigris', or copper acetate, the greenish-blue stuff that coats old copper (brass, etc) when left to weather. Also can be used as an insecticide.


----------



## johnb (Nov 17, 2007)

*Why burn them*

Hey just saw them into posts and sell them or trade them for good hardwood firewood. I've burned stuff in my OWB that would make Al Gore stroke out but not anymore. We have a new local OWB ordinace in place even though most units are far from Neibors. The ordinace states if you burn anything other that what it is intended to burn by manufactures specification you will be fined. Good luck The Hoosier


----------



## mudguts (Nov 17, 2007)

The only poles safe to burn are the untreated cedars. When we pull them, we lay'em in a seperate pile for the employees to take. I would'nt burn any other pole.


----------



## Patrick62 (Nov 17, 2007)

*Been there, done that*

1984-1985 I was burning RR ties as well! I had a weekly flue fire to keep it cleaned out. It stank, but it heated.
At the time we were kinda broke, and had no way to get firewood.
The ties were free, and easy to get.

I would probably not burn stuff like that now.

-Pat


----------



## bassman (Nov 18, 2007)

A local guy with a small saw mill has been buying old poles and making 2 x 4's and fence boards .
he told me he made $72000 last year in sales .
I asked what he does with the reject pieces and he said he burns them in his Tarm boiler with no smoke and no problems.
I said they are treated and that its a big NO NO to burn treated wood .
His reply was that the government has guidlines on this type of thing and that his tarm meets them....
He then went on to tell me about how medical waste is disposed of and that a good design will burn all the bad out of the smoke and all will be OK .
what do I know 
untill I cant get wood I will still burn just good dry wood.
shayne


----------



## Husky137 (Nov 18, 2007)

He must have hundreds of thousands of dollars in scrubbers on that Tarm or........... He is just an idiot.


----------



## Fuzly (Nov 23, 2007)

mudguts said:


> The only poles safe to burn are the untreated cedars. When we pull them, we lay'em in a seperate pile for the employees to take. I would'nt burn any other pole.



The mill my Dad works at replaced all the power poles. The old ones were beautiful, untreated cedar. So they blocked them up and let the guys take the chunks to get rid of them. Best kindling ever.

The consensous among the guys is that they are about 60 years old.

It may be true. Big, straight cedar trees are unheard of nowadays in our area and have been for sometime.

I think all the new poles are treated norway pine, reddish with the black stuff on them.


----------



## Sprig (Nov 24, 2007)

Fuzly said:


> The mill my Dad works at replaced all the power poles. The old ones were beautiful, untreated cedar. So they blocked them up and let the guys take the chunks to get rid of them. Best kindling ever.
> 
> The consensous among the guys is that they are about 60 years old.
> 
> ...


Agree Fuzly, some of the old poles I've run into were great stuff, pure and non-treated. Now-a-days you have to be wary of creosote (black stuff) and (the worst) 'Couprinol' (sp, its bluey/green carp, I thinks its a coppersulphate based anti-fungiside, we use to use it on pilons and decking joists etc. years ago, can still get it in various forms but yuck, also a base for now banned copper bottom paints if I'm not mistaken, nasty stuff, bleh!). If you value you and your families' health you should NOT burn this or _any_ treated woods (construction ends etc., somewhere posted about the joys of 'tri-pentachloriformates' (sp)nice good ol' heavy metal 'it doesn't affect ya' junk) no matter _how_ good you think your stove is, PERIOD!
Nuff said............................maybe............................later...........   



Serge


----------



## Mike Van (Nov 25, 2007)

*better living through chemistry*

The green colored poles are treated with CCA or Chromated copper arsenate, to .6 which was about twice what the lumber was. When you burn this, it gives off Hydrogen Cyanide, you don't want to breath this gas, trust me - The newer brown ones have pentachlorophenol in them, look that up sometime, it's just as bad. Lots of towns are banning OWB's, burning stuff like this sure doesn't help any of us. No, I didn't vote for Gore, I'm not a greenpeace member either - I worked with all of it as a lineman for 35 years.


----------



## hammer0419 (Nov 25, 2007)

mudguts said:


> The only poles safe to burn are the untreated cedars. When we pull them, we lay'em in a seperate pile for the employees to take. I would'nt burn any other pole.



We do the same. Bring them back to the yard cut them up then divide between all of us!


----------

