# Good/Best Carving Saw



## wuwayne1818

I am new to arborist site and carving as well. Over the winter I had a 75 foot ash tree cut down on my property and had them leave the stump so I could carve a bear. I got a new john deere cs46 (pro series) with a 16 in bar and got to work. I love the john deere but cannot find a carving bar. I am now looking for a carving saw. I talked to the guy at the stihl dealer about the 390 and 290 models but they are both close to 13 pounds. My girlfriends father has let me use his husquvarna 445 with is an excellent saw for blocking out and such. I know these saws are all moderate use saws, should i go with a pro saw, or are the occasional use saws good enough for what I need. You guys are the experts; what would be the best saw for me to get for my occasional carving. I want something that can accept a dime tip carving bar. I assume it will be between husky and stihl.

Thank you guys very much.


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## wuwayne1818

*one other question*

I hear from everyone that stihl, husky and jonsered are the best. How about echo? Is it true that they are the number one carving brand? And since some small saws have such a small tip on the bar, do you still need the dime time bar??? I just want a saw that will last a long time and help me detail my work the best. 

Thanks again!


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## wuwayne1818

*Carving Saw*

Well thanks for all the pointers, lol.


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## pastryguyhawaii

wuwayne1818 said:


> Well thanks for all the pointers, lol.



I'd just be patient with this question. There are a few very good carvers on this site but this section doesn't get a lot of traffic. I don't know a lot but you do want a saw that's easy to handle and feels comfortable to you. My Stihl MS250 is a decent saw. Carvinmark will be along eventually to give you some expert advice. 
Say, is Sterling Heights down by Detroit? I grew up near Lansing.


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## wuwayne1818

*Thanks*

Thanks for the response. Detroit is about 25 minutes south of Sterling Heights. My father lives near Lansing, in Laingsburg.


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## carvinmark

Sorry I haven't been around for a while. Expert? LOL. I just have fun with it.
As far as saws go, I love my ms200 rear handle, tons of power and super light. It is a pro saw and should last for a very long time.
I was born and raised in Oakland County, just around the corner from you. If you want to take a tripp up north, you can try mine. Oh ya, welcome to AS.


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## twoclones

carvinmark said:


> As far as saws go, I love my ms200 rear handle, tons of power and super light. It is a pro saw and should last for a very long time.



I second the ms200 for a detail saw and nominate the biggest Stihl you can handle for blocking out large carvings... Big engine size, not bar length! The most expensive part of any job is the offal _[scrap]_ and chips because they cost you time to make and cannot be sold so why waste time making them? 

Echo? Not a product for the professional in my opinion. They don't like large changes in elevation either. 


Butch 
www.WoodHacker.com


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## TraditionalTool

twoclones said:


> Echo? Not a product for the professional in my opinion. They don't like large changes in elevation either.


Butch,

Curious, I have Steve Backus' video on carving a small bear and he speaks highly of the Echo 3450. He calls it one of the best chainsaws made.

I was curious as I spotted a near mint one, asking $150.

Anyone use the Echo 3450?


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## carvinmark

TraditionalTool said:


> Anyone use the Echo 3450?



I had one, glad I sold it. Not enough power for me. Just my .02.


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## wuwayne1818

*thanks*



carvinmark said:


> Sorry I haven't been around for a while. Expert? LOL. I just have fun with it.
> As far as saws go, I love my ms200 rear handle, tons of power and super light. It is a pro saw and should last for a very long time.
> I was born and raised in Oakland County, just around the corner from you. If you want to take a tripp up north, you can try mine. Oh ya, welcome to AS.



THanks for the response! I went to the dealer and looked at several saws, the ms 200 rear handle being one of them. The saw seemed great, but the price was kind of high. I know that a pro saw is the way to go because of the hardened crank berings and such. But how do you feel about the MS 180. The salesman said he would give me the 180 with a 12 in carving bar, the chain, 1/2 in sprocket; this also includes the stock bar, sprocket and chain for $350.oo Is the ms180 an inadequate saw? I really don't know. 

Thanks

Wayne


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## twoclones

Steve Backus may be sponsored by Echo as he flys their banner on his tent at carving events. I have not used the 3450. 

As for the ms180, I haven't used it but do have a couple of ms192 saws which are low profile, run great but just do not have the cutting power of the ms200. 


Butch


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## twoclones

wuwayne1818 said:


> Is the ms180 an inadequate saw?



I really doubt anyone would find it inadequate for carving but for carving on a serious level, the ms200 is a better buy. It's like any job requiring tools... There's adequate and there are better performing, longer lasting tools used by professionals. 

How much carving do you plan to do? [rhetorical] 

Butch


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## Philbert

Wecome to A.S.

Site sponsor Baileys has some carving outfits on sale, and some bars to fit other saws http://www.baileysonline.com/.

Maybe also think about an electric saw for carving?

Philbert


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## wuwayne1818

*Thanks everyone*

Thank you guys for the info! Does anyone know how much it will cost me for the ms 200 and also the carving bar and chain? Also, is it possible to find a carving bar for my john deere cs46 (pro series)? I looked but couldn't find anything. 

Thanks again

Wayne


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## wuwayne1818

carvinmark said:


> Sorry I haven't been around for a while. Expert? LOL. I just have fun with it.
> As far as saws go, I love my ms200 rear handle, tons of power and super light. It is a pro saw and should last for a very long time.
> I was born and raised in Oakland County, just around the corner from you. If you want to take a tripp up north, you can try mine. Oh ya, welcome to AS.



Where at in oakland county? It would be nice to try the saw first, lol. 

Thanks


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## carvinmark

wuwayne1818 said:


> Where at in oakland county? It would be nice to try the saw first, lol.
> 
> Thanks



Not there any more, come up to Frederic, near Grayling and I'll be glad to let you run mine.


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## the westspartan

I don't do much carving anymore, but I have used the ms180 in those applications, and I was quite pleased. My only beef with that saw is it's construction (not pro), however, I have never had a problem with mine, so the issue may not actually be an issue! In terms of power and weight, it is excellent.


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## wuwayne1818

the westspartan said:


> I don't do much carving anymore, but I have used the ms180 in those applications, and I was quite pleased. My only beef with that saw is it's construction (not pro), however, I have never had a problem with mine, so the issue may not actually be an issue! In terms of power and weight, it is excellent.



Thanks for the info, it is good to know some used and liked the saw.


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## wuwayne1818

*thanks*



carvinmark said:


> Not there any more, come up to Frederic, near Grayling and I'll be glad to let you run mine.



Thanks for the offer! I think i am going to get the saw today (my girlfriend is buying it for my birthday gift). 

Thanks

Wayne


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## carvinmark

wuwayne1818 said:


> Thanks for the offer! I think i am going to get the saw today (my girlfriend is buying it for my birthday gift).
> 
> Thanks
> 
> Wayne



You're welcome, so what saw did you get? :chainsawguy:


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## 046

not a carver... but have watched Clayton Coss in action. He uses a fleet of Shindaiwa chainsaws, small to large. aprox 6 saws are out fitted inside a small enclosed trailer. 

Coss is hands down the most famous/prolific chainsaw carver in north eastern OK. His fabulous works dot Tulsa.


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## wuwayne1818

*180*



carvinmark said:


> You're welcome, so what saw did you get? :chainsawguy:



I ended up getting the ms 180 with the stock 14 in bar and the 10 in carving bar with 1/4 in sprocket and chain. The saw is awesome; it rips and is extremely light. I am very satisfied and planning on getting out to my bear tomorow.


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## mmstihl038

*ms180*

I have an ms170 and it's ok. Had an Echo CS346. Stihl's wimpiest home owner saw is way better. I just sucked it up and got an ms200. Really no comparison. Will save me tons of time and pay me back quickly in both time and frustration savings. The extra power for same weight makes triple the price worth it for the pro. If you get into it seriously, you'll want to upgrade eventually.

The thing about a carving bar is not just the small tip with regards to detailing, but reducing kick back when working with the tip of the saw, which the small tip, going down to 1/4" chain, and carving chain, which is designed so that the back of the cutter doesn't hit the wood as it comes around, in other words it's sloped back more.

Stihl just started getting really serious about carving this year, offering their own bar, chain, and sprockets for a number of small saws. Echo's promoted carving for a long time now, so that's partly why you hear so much about them with regards to carving saws. They're light, but there's no comparison to Stihl or Husqvarna in terms of quality IMO.


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## twoclones

*Congrats*



mmstihl038 said:


> I just sucked it up and got an ms200. Really no comparison. Will save me tons of time and pay me back quickly in both time and frustration savings.



Congrats on the 200! 
On the Woodcarving Illustrated Magazine forum someone called the ms200 a 
"660 mini-me" which I thought was the perfect description. 

Butch 
http://www.WoodHacker.com/


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## mmstihl038

> On the Woodcarving Illustrated Magazine forum someone called the ms200 a
> "660 mini-me" which I thought was the perfect description.



That was me. 

Thanks for the picture of your scaffolding setup. That's a heck of a tree.


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## twoclones

mmstihl038 said:


> Thanks for the picture of your scaffolding setup. That's a heck of a tree.



Paul Jones and I carved 2 of those in Howard Amon Park in Richland, WA. I was the helper... I have a couple of photos of the finished Maple tree at the below link. None read of the Walnut tree yet. 

http://www.woodhacker.com/amon/phpslideshow.php 

The Maple is a carving of the city history with a few designs contributed by local school children. Walnut tree was carved with indiginous people and animals.


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## wuwayne1818

*My first Carving*

Since you gentlemen were kind enough to give me your advice on my questions, I wanted to post pics of my first carving. 

Thanks again guys

Wayne


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## Philbert

REALLY nice, especially for a first attempt!

Philbert


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## wuwayne1818

Philbert said:


> REALLY nice, especially for a first attempt!
> 
> Philbert



Thanks


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## wuwayne1818

*The right finish*

After I finished the hair markings, I took a torch to the entire thing, then BEHR semi-transparent deck and fence stain. Is that enough, or do I need something else on it (shellac?). Does anyone have any recomendations???

Thanks 

Wayne


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## twoclones

wuwayne1818 said:


> After I finished the hair markings, I took a torch to the entire thing, then BEHR semi-transparent deck and fence stain. Is that enough, or do I need something else on it (shellac?). Does anyone have any recomendations???



Spar Varnish. Sealing the carving will slow the drying process and reduce checking. When cracks appear, I apply more varnish and let it run into the crack to keep the log as sealed as possible. 


Butch


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## wuwayne1818

*varnish*



twoclones said:


> Spar Varnish. Sealing the carving will slow the drying process and reduce checking. When cracks appear, I apply more varnish and let it run into the crack to keep the log as sealed as possible.
> 
> 
> Butch



So just use a clear marine spar varnish? I was also wondering what you thought about using some clear silicone caulk for the cracks. At least the ones on the top of the head and such. There are a few that are almost 1/2 inch in width, and I am worried that the water will freeze in the winter, then expand and...you get the picture. 

Thanks


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## twoclones

wuwayne1818 said:


> So just use a clear marine spar varnish? I was also wondering what you thought about using some clear silicone caulk for the cracks. At least the ones on the top of the head and such. There are a few that are almost 1/2 inch in width, and I am worried that the water will freeze in the winter, then expand and...you get the picture.



Yes. Just clear marine spar varnish. Glossy or satin per your taste. 

The caulk won't hurt anything. It's better to start with wood having no cracks and seal it immediately. "Stitch in time..." 

Butch


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## wuwayne1818

twoclones said:


> Yes. Just clear marine spar varnish. Glossy or satin per your taste.
> 
> The caulk won't hurt anything. It's better to start with wood having no cracks and seal it immediately. "Stitch in time..."
> 
> Butch



Thanks again!

Wayne


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## B-Edwards

twoclones said:


> Paul Jones and I carved 2 of those in Howard Amon Park in Richland, WA. I was the helper... I have a couple of photos of the finished Maple tree at the below link. None read of the Walnut tree yet.
> 
> http://www.woodhacker.com/amon/phpslideshow.php
> 
> The Maple is a carving of the city history with a few designs contributed by local school children. Walnut tree was carved with indiginous people and animals.



Nice!!!


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## B-Edwards

wuwayne1818 said:


> Since you gentlemen were kind enough to give me your advice on my questions, I wanted to post pics of my first carving.
> 
> Thanks again guys
> 
> Wayne



Very nice for your first!!


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## wuwayne1818

*Thanks*



B-Edwards said:


> Very nice for your first!!



I appreciate it. My next will be an eagle for my neighbor. He had a maple fall split during a storm. I am just glad it is not another ash.


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