# NY man dies in tree trimming accident



## NYCHA FORESTER (Dec 15, 2005)

Long Island Tree Trimmer Dies When Branch Breaks

POSTED: 8:35 am EST December 15, 2005

HUNTINGTON STATION, N.Y. -- A Long Island tree trimmer was killed Wednesday after a branch broke and he fell 100 feet to the ground, Suffolk County police said.

John Johnson, 51, of Melville, who owns Tifco Tree Service, was trimming the branches of a tree on Oakcrest Street in Huntington Station at about 2:30 p.m., police said.

Police said Johnson was secured to a branch when it broke and sent him tumbling about 100 feet to the ground. Johnson was pronounced dead at a hospital.


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## moss (Dec 15, 2005)

Sorry to hear of this.

Are there ever any investigations of these types of accidents by safety experts with knowledge of arborist technique and tree structural issues? The reason I ask is that while it's good to know about these incidents it's even better if we can learn something from them.

For instance it would be useful to know what species of tree he was climbing, condition of the tree, branch diameter and condition of branch, how much weight on the rope, what was he doing at the time of the break etc. etc.

I was also curious how he fell 100 ft., that must have been one of the taller trees on Long Island since if he was hanging off a branch on a rope and was at 100 ft. his tie-in must have been higher unless he was within several feet of the top or TIP.

I know there isn't enough info to answer these questions but these are things to think about.
-moss


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## kf_tree (Dec 15, 2005)

moss said:


> I was also curious how he fell 100 ft.


 

i'm sure it's just an exaggeration by the police or media, there are some big tree's out there but, i doubt it was a 100ft fall.


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## gitrdun_climbr (Jan 4, 2006)

*Climber falls*

:Eye: I don't know about you all but when I'm working 100' in the tree I'm not just tied into one single branch. Without knowing the facts of this unfortunate accident I would venture to say that was the mistake right there. I like to work off two climbing lines AND my steel-cored flipline. When I have to move a climbing line, I clip in with the lanyard. May take a bit longer but a hell-of-alot safer.

Sad.


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## rfwoodvt (Jan 12, 2006)

I know they are there but don't think I'd see many 100 footers down that way. Hell its hard to find any 100 footers here in vermont. A lot oo 80 & 90 footers but 100' is a monster.

Good questions tho, where was tip, what kind of tree, were was the securing lanyard, yadayadayada.....

Wouldn't NYOSHA do an investigation? Maybe they could spare some details.


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## Chronic1 (Jan 13, 2006)

Isn't it the same speed after 40 foot anyway ? Terminal velocity...without branches etc ? Sorry to hear this.

I was up in a widow maker yesterday, 70 foot dead cottonwood, god I hate those. Wouldn't you know it, when I reached the top, the wind picked up. (of course), you all know how that goes. I used my old style buckstrap, instead of my steel core cammed flipline and my climbing rope.......had my spider knife clenched in my teeth in case I had to bail. Cut myself free from the buckstrap. Bail with the lifeline, if possible.

I felt like I was doing this dance with death (I know, dramatic)...but I got the worst done, I don't think I'll bid those types anymore. Too stressful for me. 

Anyone else have suggestions on how to do these types of jobs safer....No bucket truck.


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## Chronic1 (Jan 13, 2006)

I had a branch that looked and felt perfectly stable give way without any warning. Had lanyard and climbing rope tied in. Lesson learned.

I used to climb with just one lifeline. Stupid me.


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## Chronic1 (Jan 13, 2006)

I get freaked though when I have my steel flipline around the trunk of a dead tree. I knew a guy at Asplundh that cut a large limb he was tied into....it ripped his saddle in half and left his torso black and blue. No permanent injury thank god.


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## kf_tree (Jan 13, 2006)

steel core, rope or nylon, there all rated for 5000lbs. thats why fresco sells a break a way link made by yate's, for those situations. if you want more info i'll find the link for you.


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## Chronic1 (Jan 13, 2006)

That would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.


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## kf_tree (Jan 13, 2006)

Chronic1 said:


> That would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.



https://ecomecs.securesites.com/cgi...98-35889&WSC1037031288-18053&1030729481-63795


i really should order one myself, just set it up between your d ring and lanyard strap for those leg shaking times.


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## OutOnaLimb (Jan 13, 2006)

When ever possible I try to get tied into a near by live tree, or we try and rent a Genie lift for those big dead Cottonwoods. My biggest fear is haveing a TIP break and I become a dirt dart. I guess that is why I am super safe when it comes to my climbing. Statistically more people are injured or killed by equiptmen, not falls.

Kenn


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## clearance (Jan 13, 2006)

Seeing as I always climb with spurs and steelcores no matter what, I can always examine where I am going to tie into to rappel very closely, I was always taught never to use just one branch. Too bad about this guy, sad. The bigger question is, why are people climbing dead garbage, especially cottonwoods? I would only climb it if I was tied into a nearby good tree. When you are blowing the top of a dead tree you can unclip your steelcore and hold it with one hand and your saw with the other hand during the backcut if it has a good lean, tied into another tree of course.


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## moss (Jan 13, 2006)

kf_tree said:


> https://ecomecs.securesites.com/cgi...98-35889&WSC1037031288-18053&1030729481-63795
> 
> 
> i really should order one myself, just set it up between your d ring and lanyard strap for those leg shaking times.



Does this strap break away at 220 lbs. load? Or does it start absorbing shock at 220 and break free at a higher load? If it breaks at 220 that seems a little low for an emergency lanyard bust out. Maybe not, what do you think?
-moss


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## kf_tree (Jan 13, 2006)

moss said:


> Does this strap break away at 220 lbs. load? Or does it start absorbing shock at 220 and break free at a higher load? If it breaks at 220 that seems a little low for an emergency lanyard bust out. Maybe not, what do you think?
> -moss



i've used similar "screamer's" for ice climbing, they go between the protection and the rope, so if you fall the thread's rip to lessen the shock load. but the ones used in ice climbing don'y rip apart they stay in a loop. the way they work is there computer sewn stitch's that will "pop" under a certain weight. if you would like to read a little about them.http://www.yatesgear.com/climbing/screamer/index.htm

220lbs seems reasonable to me but i would like to see the #'s a little higher, say 300lbs. lets say your tied into another tree and working a dead tree down. now most of your weight will be on the climbing line. the lanyard will mainly be used for work "positioning" not supporting your full body weight. 

yate's is a big name in rec climbing gear as well as commercial gear. tom d has spoke of the owner before as a mad scientist who is very methodical and thorough in his work. he is involved in saftey gear in alot of fields other than just climbing, so i'm sure he did his home work on the 220lbs rating.

there use to be a guy here by the name of hobby climber, do a search for breakaway lanyard and see what comes up. he was trying to develope his own, but it had a handle like a rip cord.


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## jmack (Jan 14, 2006)

*climber*



Chronic1 said:


> I get freaked though when I have my steel flipline around the trunk of a dead tree. I knew a guy at Asplundh that cut a large limb he was tied into....it ripped his saddle in half and left his torso black and blue. No permanent injury thank god.


asplundh aint know for its climbers a utlity trimmer with a steel core flipline hmmm ....... i wonder if that would conduct electricity hmm.....


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## jmack (Jan 14, 2006)

*knife in mouth*



Chronic1 said:


> Isn't it the same speed after 40 foot anyway ? Terminal velocity...without branches etc ? Sorry to hear this.
> 
> I was up in a widow maker yesterday, 70 foot dead cottonwood, god I hate those. Wouldn't you know it, when I reached the top, the wind picked up. (of course), you all know how that goes. I used my old style buckstrap, instead of my steel core cammed flipline and my climbing rope.......had my spider knife clenched in my teeth in case I had to bail. Cut myself free from the buckstrap. Bail with the lifeline, if possible.
> 
> ...


 guy take the knife outta yer mouth, listen try taking your lanyard off so your rope is taking the sway of the tree sitback in your saddle and relax if you got a knife in your mouth like a pirate ya gotta come down till the storm passes.


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## moss (Jan 14, 2006)

kf_tree said:


> i've used similar "screamer's" for ice climbing, they go between the protection and the rope, so if you fall the thread's rip to lessen the shock load. but the ones used in ice climbing don'y rip apart they stay in a loop. the way they work is there computer sewn stitch's that will "pop" under a certain weight. if you would like to read a little about them.http://www.yatesgear.com/climbing/screamer/index.htm
> 
> 220lbs seems reasonable to me but i would like to see the #'s a little higher, say 300lbs. lets say your tied into another tree and working a dead tree down. now most of your weight will be on the climbing line. the lanyard will mainly be used for work "positioning" not supporting your full body weight.
> 
> ...



Checked out the Yates Screamers link, very cool except the fact that those slings tear at 550 lbs (good) but the loop stays intact up to 27 kn. Means not good for the scenario we've been talking about where you want full release of the lanyard. Since the 220 lb. Tear Away Screamer that Fresco carries is made for chainsaw attachment it isn't exactly calibrated for lanyard use. But something Yates mentioned provides a solution. He says it's accepted practice to gang up Screamers to increase the tear-out threshold. So if you put two of the Fresco 220 lb equipment Screamers side-by-side between two carabiners or screwlinks you've got yourself a 540 lb. breakaway.

I've followed some of the talk about using some kind of ripcord lanyard release. The downside there is that: 
a. you have to pull the ripcord which is an action to perform in a panic situation
b. the chance of accidentally snagging the rip cord and pulling it out while climbing (bummer)

I'm really liking the idea of ganging a pair of the equipment tear outs to get a 540 lbs release point.
-moss


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## kf_tree (Jan 14, 2006)

moss said:


> Checked out the Yates Screamers link, very cool except the fact that those slings tear at 550 lbs (good) but the loop stays intact up to 27 kn. Means not good for the scenario we've been talking about where you want full release of the lanyard. Since the 220 lb. Tear Away Screamer that Fresco carries is made for chainsaw attachment it isn't exactly calibrated for lanyard use. But something Yates mentioned provides a solution. He says it's accepted practice to gang up Screamers to increase the tear-out threshold. So if you put two of the Fresco 220 lb equipment Screamers side-by-side between two carabiners or screwlinks you've got yourself a 540 lb. breakaway.
> 
> I've followed some of the talk about using some kind of ripcord lanyard release. The downside there is that:
> a. you have to pull the ripcord which is an action to perform in a panic situation
> ...




i was never too fond of the rip cord idea. i feel things would happen so quickly you wouldn't have a chance to pull the cord.

ganging up the tear aways could be the ticket.


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## gitrdun_climbr (Jan 15, 2006)

*tear-away experience?*

We got some 100+ footers out here in Washington, I have to remove a stand of about 20 of them in the coming weeks for development of a three car garage (only about 10 are REAL big). All conifers except for two big Maples with about 8 leaders each! Every tree is healthy .. a climber's paradise actually. Some of the wood is really, really heavy though. What does happen when your lanyard takes the jerk of a big tree falling in it while you're secured into a climbing line as well? Side Ds vs. front Ds?

Tear-away link for your lanyard?? Sounds both scary .. and brilliant. Anyone have an experience where one of these helped you? Hurt you?


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