# homboldt with a snipe



## forestryworks (Dec 29, 2007)

anyone see this type of face used anymore?

got beranek's "fundamentals" book for christmas
and have been reading it nightly


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## joesawer (Dec 29, 2007)

That is a great book. 
Yes, the snipe is still used.


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## Tree Sling'r (Jan 2, 2008)

I snipe quite a bit on small drops in the terrain. Especially with sugar pine. It is often times amazing.


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## turnkey4099 (Jan 3, 2008)

Tree Sling'r said:


> I snipe quite a bit on small drops in the terrain. Especially with sugar pine. It is often times amazing.



Any pictures or a cite with one? I tried google and all I got was referred back to this thread.

Never too old to learn something new.

Harry K


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## treejunkie13 (Jan 3, 2008)

What a great book indeed, also High Climbers and Timber Fallers. Priceless investments for the book collection. Bailey's is the cheapest source, buy them, read them, share them. You will be pleased!

Humboldt - the face (notch) of the tree, where the top cut is square to the trunk and the bottom cut is on the diagonal. Common on hill sides.

Snipe - (loose term) for a wide variety of diagonal cuts taken from the face, to influence the outcome of the trees lay.

cut up the face and add a snipe.


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## turnkey4099 (Jan 4, 2008)

treejunkie13 said:


> What a great book indeed, also High Climbers and Timber Fallers. Priceless investments for the book collection. Bailey's is the cheapest source, buy them, read them, share them. You will be pleased!
> 
> Humboldt - the face (notch) of the tree, where the top cut is square to the trunk and the bottom cut is on the diagonal. Common on hill sides.
> 
> ...



Okay, thought that would be about it, thanks. I have done that (if I understand correctly) on regular face cuts but mostly to correct my screwups.

Harry K


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## Canyonbc (Jan 4, 2008)

Dont they show examples in the book???

I own it, love it, and would recomend it to any and every one. 

But i thought it showed examples.

But dont quote been a while sense i have read it..should read it again. 

I use the snipe, more and more....its nice to set big trees down with out a bounce...especially on hillsides. 

But i am young i am sure the old timers can tell some great stories.


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## treejunkie13 (Jan 4, 2008)

Yes! There are picture's (drawing's) in the book. To top it off Beranak writes in woodsman language, so it's interesting and readable.

A correction to the face is a correction. a Snipe is an added angle to an already set up face.


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## smokechase II (Jan 4, 2008)

*Name*

I believe you are referring to a block face with a snipe. {That is a small humboldt.}

The snipe is the angled cut.


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## ak4195 (Jan 9, 2008)

The "snipe" you refer to sounds like what I was shown when I worked for the ROW clearing dept here for the local util.The term tought me was "Dutch cut",used to influence or swing a tree's fall about 10 -15degrees.If you parous the OSHA logging guide they call it a "swing dutch cut".As long as your hinge wood is sound,lean not to great it was an awesome technique to influence the fall.

ak4195


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## gavin (Jan 9, 2008)

ak4195 said:


> The "snipe" you refer to sounds like what I was shown when I worked for the ROW clearing dept here for the local util.The term tought me was "Dutch cut",used to influence or swing a tree's fall about 10 -15degrees.If you parous the OSHA logging guide they call it a "swing dutch cut".As long as your hinge wood is sound,lean not to great it was an awesome technique to influence the fall.
> 
> ak4195



thats different. a "swinging dutchman" cut is a dutchman: an unclean portion of the undercut [face cut] if you carry the horrizontal cutof your undercut past the angled cut on one side of the tree, you can encourage the tree to swing to the side.

the cut they're talking about here (my interpretation) is cutting the backcut on an angle compared to the undercut's direction. like when you're falling a side leaner, you leave more holding wood on the tension side (the side opposite to the lean).


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## joesawer (Jan 9, 2008)

gavin said:


> thats different. a "swinging dutchman" cut is a dutchman: an unclean portion of the undercut [face cut] if you carry the horrizontal cutof your undercut past the angled cut on one side of the tree, you can encourage the tree to swing to the side.
> 
> the cut they're talking about here (my interpretation) is cutting the backcut on an angle compared to the undercut's direction. like when you're falling a side leaner, you leave more holding wood on the tension side (the side opposite to the lean).




Nope, gentlemen. It has nothing to do with the back cut and it is not a dutchman. It is a third cut in the face that angles down that allows the butt to slide down. It has little or no practical purpose for tree service or small limber trees. If you are not falling timber on bad ground that is decent sized, don't even worry about it. It is still used but knowing the why, how and when is not something you are going to learn over the 'net.


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## clearance (Jan 9, 2008)

joesawer said:


> Nope, gentlemen. It has nothing to do with the back cut and it is not a dutchman. It is a third cut in the face that angles down that allows the butt to slide down. It has little or no practical purpose for tree service or small limber trees. If you are not falling timber on bad ground that is decent sized, don't even worry about it. It is still used but knowing the why, how and when is not something you are going to learn over the 'net.



I believe what you are talking about is called a "Swanson" here. After you make the humboldt undercut you cut down the bottom cut on a sharp angle down, only about 1/3 of the way in. Kind of hard to explain, like the sloping part of the undercut is on about a 30 degree angle, then it suddenly drops sharply. This is so the tree falls and the butt drops right away and stays put, very close to the stump. Am I right?


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## gavin (Jan 10, 2008)

yeah thats basically a swanson. the way they're teaching is to not make two angles, just one really steep one (should be 45 degrees or 1:1 depth to opening instead of the 3:1 of the humoldt). same effect, so the butt slides off and hits first to try to stop the tree from moving.


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## Canyonbc (Jan 10, 2008)

Doesnt EKKA have a video on this..i will try and look it up. I thought he had one in there showing the use of the Humbolt


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## clearance (Jan 10, 2008)

gavin said:


> yeah thats basically a swanson. the way they're teaching is to not make two angles, just one really steep one (should be 45 degrees or 1:1 depth to opening instead of the 3:1 of the humoldt). same effect, so the butt slides off and hits first to try to stop the tree from moving.



Thats what I was told as well, the original swanson isn't good enough, or unsafe or something, whatever, kind of like the b.s. of starting your saw on the ground, or between your legs. I have used the real swanson a couple of times, like when I figured I could fall the buttlog, but then was scared it would nail the fence. High up humbolt with a swanson, when it broke the holding wood it just dropped right at the stump and stayed put. Impressed my partner, told him I was shown it by a faller.


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## joe wood (Jan 22, 2008)

sounds like what i would call a root ripper if you do it right it can rip the roots right out from under youre feet. If i remember ill bring my camera tommorow and show you a picture of one.


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## WidowMaker (Jan 23, 2008)

I understan the Proper use and application of a Snipe Cut is to be the subject of the next Bob Villa demo video.....   


WidowMaker


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