# Indoor forced air wood furnace recommendations



## joe kelsch (Jun 20, 2015)

My home is about 2000 sq ft and about 2600 sq ft if I include the attic which we plan to use someday as a bedroom. I'm currently using a 106,000 btu rheem 91% gas furnace for primary heat. My budget is $135 per month, but I also have a gas water heater and a gas cook stove. I have 2 chimneys in the basement one is lined to the basement with stainless and has my wood stove from the living room hooked up to it (which was able to heat the whole house using fans).

Last year I moved the wood stove to the basement since it was in a bad location in the living room. I hooked it up to the lined chimney and I fired it this winter thinking it would at least heat the floor and maybe the heat would rise up throughout the house. I was wrong. It heated the area around the stove great(about 90*), but the heat was considerably less the further away you got. I guess all the effort was heating up the stone wall behind it. So this isn't going to work the way I want.

Question is what indoor forced air wood furnace would you guys recommend?

I don't want to spend over $2000. I just can't afford more than that. Tractor Supply sells the HotBlast furnaces and the people who I know who have them love them. My neighbor has had his for 10 years. He uses his gas furnace fan instead of the wood furnace fan.

I saw that the Summers Heat stove is sold by Ace as well as Lowes. At Ace its $1250. Is this a good furnace?


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## Johnmn (Jun 20, 2015)

My dad has had a charmaster Bearcat since 1981 works good for him I know he would recommend it.


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## robson1015 (Jun 20, 2015)

Woodchuck - burn wood and coal.


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## brenndatomu (Jun 20, 2015)

joe kelsch said:


> Tractor Supply sells the HotBlast furnaces and the people who I know who have them love them


Wow, that makes 3 of ya! 
Seriously though, don't buy a hot blast or anything even remotely similar, you will be disappointed if you do. If you look on CL in the heating season you will find TONS of HB for sale. Those things have turned many away from wood heat.
The summers heat (or Englander 28-3500, same unit) seems to be fairly well liked. The drolet tundra would be an option, but wait until fall for the new model to come out. They had some issues with the earlier ones, supposedly SBI fixed 'em and those will be out soon (already?)


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## Wood Cutter (Jun 21, 2015)

What's wrong with a HB?? 10 years and no complaints.


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## JeffHK454 (Jun 21, 2015)

Wood Cutter said:


> What's wrong with a HB?? 10 years and no complaints.


Nothing, I know a couple guys that heat their homes with them just fine. They're low tech and wood hungry but they'll keep you warm ( or hot..) all winter.


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## brenndatomu (Jun 21, 2015)

I guess it is just all about expectations. If you expect to feed the furnace like a starved horse every 4 hrs...it's all good. Just don't damp down the air intake in an attempt to sleep the night through...unless you are tryin to toss the local chimney sweep a bone. I just don't know why a person would spend the money on an inferior product when there is better to be had for relatively the same price. OP already mentioned the one at Ace Hardware...
I'm really surprised to see more than 1 or 2 people sticking up for the HB. Normally when this comes up around here it goes about 10:1 in favor of taking the HB out back and using it for target practice. Just ask @blades, I think I remember reading his is coming out here pretty soon after being abandoned for a few years due to its unpredictable "auto damper" for one...and I'm sure he can come up with a few other reasons to "love" it. Just use the search feature here, lots of HB haters threads to read...


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## sawjunky23 (Jun 22, 2015)

There are guys on here having good luck with Daka and Shelter furnaces, I think any furnace is going to do a better at what you are looking to do than the wood stove it's replacing. The newer EPA units, are supposed to be more efficient than the older "smoke dragons" I've never had one but I have heard they have a bit of a learning curve to get them burning just right, I have also heard they are a little bit more fussy about what they will burn. There are up sides and downsides to both, you just have to decide what works best for your situation.


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## joe kelsch (Jun 22, 2015)

I've been reading good things about the drolet. Seems that they're worth the extra $500. My problem with those is that there are no dealers around me. Lowe's is listed on the drolet website as a dealer but I looked at their website and the only wood furnace that came up is the Englander/Summers Heat 3000. Has anyone purchased a drolet wood furnace through Lowe's?


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## brenndatomu (Jun 22, 2015)

Hmm, I don't think Lowes is actually a Drolet dealer, I may be wrong though. Never heard of anybody getting one there.
If you are in NW PA then you are probably within a 2 hr drive of the Massillon OH Menards. Menards is by far the lowest price seller of the Drolet Tundra. They will deliver to your door for a few hundred more too, check on their website for exact delivery price. Menards has historically put the Tundra on sale for ~$1565 a couple times per year, but they really did it up this last winter, on sale for...$1399 I think it was, plus a 11% in store rebate making it $1250 "final price", I bet they sold a buttload of 'em! 
How tall is the chimney that goes to the basement? Is it 6"? Insulated liner? Proper draft is a key to making the EPA fireboxes really hum


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## alleyyooper (Jun 23, 2015)

Well let me weigh in on the hot blast. I was given one free because the person/s didn't like th4e way it ate wood.
I was looking for some thing cheap to heat my deer camp cabin so took it. The cabin is 24'x24' with a 12'x24' loft. It works fine for heating when every one is awake. once sleep time comes that hot blast had better be down to coals or you will get smoked out side when shutting down the draft and damper for night time. I am replacing it as soon as I find some thing better I can afford.

Here at home I bought the England 28 3000 to replace a 30 plus year old Southernaire that was all cracked up in the fire box. I got the England from Home Depot and being a Vet got the 10% discount and free to the house shipping. Lowe's has the same furnace called the Summer heat same 10% vet discount but they wanted $50.00 to deliver to the store and I pick it up there.

I installed it in Oct 2013/14 heat season, with all the polar vortex days with wind chills down to 30+ below it kept the house at a steady 75F day and night, Used 1/3 less wood than the old Southernaire did in much warmer winters. I close the draft up tight for the night after loading it full and it burns from 9:00 PM to 9:00AM and still maintains the heat in the house at no less than 70F in the early morning. I have had to clean the chimney 4 times in two heating seasons with it using well seasoned Ash. It also tells me when the chimney need a scrub. If I don't wait a bit after opening the draft it will smoke back in the house.Only thing is I wish I would have made a stand to raise it off the floor at least a foot so I don't have to bend so far to remove the Ash pan.

OK the cons.
The plate that slide on the top raises up when you stuff it full. Then with just a tab on each side it will some times slid to the right or left and fall on top of the fire and I need to let the fire go out to replace it. I fixed that by welding tabs at all 4 corners and making a L piece that bolts to the center factory tab to stop it from raising up much. 
I didn't care for the ash pan that fixed what I felt was the worst problem with it by making a center folding handle so I can slide it out part way and use the center handle to finish removing it. Still the pan is to narrow to fill up the area so you get ashes down around the sides and back where the rear handle doesn't allow it to go tight up against the rear wall. I have to shovel out that Ash with a flat shovel with a straight handle. That ash is so fine it is impossible to do with out a lot of dust, solution to that is have the shop vac near by with a good fine particle filter to capture the dust.

I really like the furnace and found it easy to install and England help line people were great to talk to and gave good advice.
One thing they should put in the owners manual is
*FIRST FIRE FURNACE OUT SIDE TO BURN OFF MFG OILS AND PAINTS.*
I did because I knew people with other brands who didn't. Imagine the stink from all tha white smoke in the basement with no windows just a walk out basement door.









Once I got the trailer to the walk out door I wheeled it in place using a barrel truck with a 800 pound rating.

 Al


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## joe kelsch (Jun 24, 2015)

I've been thinking that I want an Englander since there's a home depot within 20 miles of my house and my dad would be probably get it since he gets a discount since he's a vet. They are selling it right now for $1199. But that drolet is still in my budget.

One of my many concerns is cleaning my chimney more often while using a wood furnace. Since my house is quite old both of my chimneys go up through the middle and exit at the peak of my house. I have a two story house with a full walk up attic (like a third story) and you can walk into my basement without stepping down in the front of my house. So it's like a 4 story house when standing in front of it. The chimneys exit the house at least 2 feet above the house. One chimney is lined with a 6" stainless steel liner that goes from the basement to 2 feet above the top of the brick. The other chimney isn't lined and needs work done to it. I need to clean the chimney this summer. Would I expect to need it done during winter? If so then its not going to happen. None of the chimney sweeps will do it with snow on the roof and I don't blame them.


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## lampmfg (Jun 24, 2015)

If you don't want a furnace with the newer technology I recommend buying very soon, because most won't be able to be sold with the new EPA regulations going into effect. Otherwise it's tough to beat a Kuuma Vapor-Fire!
http://www.arboristsite.com/community/threads/kuuma-vapor-fire-100-wood-furnace-results.242982/
http://www.arboristsite.com/community/threads/kuuma-vaporfire-100-clean-out.245659/


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## brenndatomu (Jun 24, 2015)

joe kelsch said:


> Would I expect to need it done during winter?


It all depends. The better furnace you buy the better chances you have at a summer only cleaning. One thing that makes more difference than any other (except maybe turning the air intake down too far and smoldering the fire) is dry wood, I mean TRULY dry wood, not just "seasoned" whatever that means anyways. Any furnace (except MAYBE, and I did say MAYBE, that Kuuma mentioned above) will crap the chimney up with wet wood, dry wood is your _only_ shot at a once per season cleaning.
Speaking of Kuuma, there have been people that own them that say they have NEVER cleaned their chimney!
You see what @alleyyooper said about his Englander...cleans twice per year...but that MAY be due to damping down for a looong overnight burn though?
Sounds like you have a good chimney setup for a strong consistent draft, that would be a good first step for the Drolet...


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## greenskeeper (Jun 24, 2015)

is there a way that you could plumb duct work from near the stove to tie into the return on your air handler? That would be the cheapest option to try first.


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## blades (Jun 25, 2015)

There have been pictures of set ups such as Greenkeeper mentioned, code compliancy may be an issue. 
Joe- you are correct in assuming that a goodly portion of the heat from the stove is being wasted on the heating of the uninsulated basement walls. Those walls act as giant heat sinks. You could spend the funds on sealing up the sill and top plate as well as insulating the walls down there ( would be a heck of a better choice than the low end HB furnace). I have a friend with an Englander furnace it has been working out well for him, but a lot depends on your expectations and your home. Personally I do not want to be hauling wood down the basement stairs ( that got old real quick). If you have external access at that level that's a different story. I never got more than a bout 4 hours of usable heat from the HB - and I paid particular attention to not overfireing it. The purpose of it was to reduce the crazy high NG charges but I was not there for 12 hour stretches per day and there for could not baby sit it. It did reduce the NG charges about 10 % which in my estimation was not worth the effort & cost factors. I have a NC30 on the main floor ( 2000 sq ft ranch) it is centrally located. I am happy with it ( although I could use a wee bit larger unit on occasion - gets a bit nippy around from time to time). It does supply 98% of my heating needs - at its price point can't complain ( it cost me less than the HB unit as both had to have proper flues so that doesn't enter into the picture. )


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## alleyyooper (Jun 26, 2015)

Yes I had to clean my chimney twice a year. I clean every summer regardless if it needs it or not just so I know it is ready for the winter heating season. The second time is in the spring when day time highs can go as high as 60F and night time lows get down in the 20'S so I keep a fire all day choked down and at night also. During the cold days and nights I open the stove up in the morning and let it burn really good to reduce any build up that may be in the pipe.

Isn't the cleanest way to clean a chimney but my brother in law with a old farm house with a 6/12 pitch or steeper does it from below with a fiber glass rod and brush and a couple shop vac set up to suck up the dust. Go slow and it hardly allows any dust to escape.

 Al


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## joe kelsch (Jun 26, 2015)

My basement walls are stone. So to insulating them would be difficult. I do need to seal up some cracks and I could use a couple new windows, though the 120 windows down there are in good shape. 

I do have outside access to my basement. I can walk from my front yard and into my basement by stepping down one step. I have a 36" man door and I can fit my wheel barrow through it. So far I have about 2 1/2 to 3 cord of maple under my front porch (next to my basement door) that's been there since last summer, plus another cord behind the house. I have about 30 dead ash trees on my property from the emerald ash borer. Most have been dead for a couple years (the bark is coming off). I think if I drop them, cut them and split them they might be ok for the end of winter or early spring.


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## blades (Jun 26, 2015)

Upper areas of the dead and bark falling off will be good to go for this fall. Maybe even 2/3 of the trunk top down if harvested split and stacked quickly. Ash is another one that dries out fairly quickly as it is not a high moisture wood to begin with. The big key is to get it split, wood doesn't dry to well sitting in rounds - it will look good on the ends but be wet in the middle.


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## aokpops (Jun 26, 2015)

I used a fire fox for about 2 decades might have been well ahead of its time . Bought a shelter 2 years ago it heats an holds fire good but the chimney likes to plug up . I never had chimney fire until this year . This might be serendipity the very night of the fire menards had a great deal on the drolet . Might take some time to get back were I was . Cleaning a chimney more than twice a year is enough .The firefox is still here an that's all it needed .


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## alleyyooper (Jun 27, 2015)

I burn dead Ask that is standing like that for at least 5 years. I don't even fall and cut it up till the fall Stuff is as dry as hay in a barn.
I also bring in and stack behind the furnace enough wood for a week and a half usually never let it get down to a weeks worth. Never know when some thing will happen to me and Wife will need to fill the furnace.
















 Al


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## flotek (Jun 27, 2015)

The Englander IMHO is better than a hotblast . It's more efficient it's a lot better made ( higher level of craftsmanship ) and provides tons of heat (to do so it will eat some wood though) .. However if you add a several hundred more the drolet tundra may be a better answer in terms of burn time ease of operation and efficiency . In real world use after Having had both I would say the Englander will heat a bigger area closer to 2500 sq ft but as mentioned it has drawbacks.. I would rate the drolet to be suited for 1800 sq ft with good efficiency for the money


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## joe kelsch (Jun 27, 2015)

I'm leaning towards the Englander. I just looked it up on home depot's website and I can get it delivered to my house for $1298 plus tax. That's hard to beat. I would like a Drolet but I need to keep my costs down. I wish there was a menard's near me. If there was I'd probably go with the Drolet for sure. With shipping a Drolet would be over $2000. Maybe I'm still in the market for one. I don't plan on doing this till August or September. Maybe there will be a sale or something.

I have lots of dead standing trees so my wood supply will only cost me fuel for my chainsaw and time, though my property is 5 miles from my house. Before I had kids I was cutting in the early spring (like March or April whenever the snow starts to melt off). I'd split and stack on my property. Then in November or so (when the bugs aren't crawling) I'd start hauling it over to the house. Now time is precious. I can't do anything without scheduling then rescheduling then doing something else till I get time again.


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## ChoppyChoppy (Jun 27, 2015)

My brother heats his house with a Hot Blast.

Seems to work ok, but the fire box is quite small IMO. I think it would need to be nearly doubled in size to be a "good" primary heat source. With as small as the firebox is, it's very much a "load every few hours" type stove. His house isn't huge, 2 story place, maybe 1600ish sq ft. Iit's nearly a full time job keeping that stove going.
I'd have to think there is something designed like a Blaze King in a furnace format that would get at least 12hrs on a load of wood?

The smoke curtain plate in the Hot Blast firebox is a frigging hazard IMO. It blocks the door opening and gets your arm everytime... which is real great when it's hot. 

He is on stove #2, the first one cracked in several places in the first season and was replaced under warranty. Hasn't fired the new one yet. The company claimed they had a few come back and suspect they ended up with some bad quality steel.
It cracked along the corners of the door frame and across the front near the top of the firebox.


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## brenndatomu (Jun 27, 2015)

ValleyFirewood said:


> I'd have to think there is something designed like a Blaze King in a furnace format that would get at least 12hrs on a load of wood?


http://www.blazeking.com/PDF/brochures/en/current/furnace/78135_BK_APEX-CBT.pdf


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## blades (Jun 28, 2015)

Ah - very interesting. Considering where Blaze King pricing factors are with their stoves I will take an uneducated guess of $3-4 grand maybe more for the furnace. In that area I would be much more disposed to go with the Kuma and a proven track record.


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## brenndatomu (Jun 28, 2015)

blades said:


> I will take an uneducated guess of $3-4 grand maybe more for the furnace


I'd guess more. And the really weird thing is that huge firebox is only "rated" to heat 1400 sq ft.!? From what I hear BK is a lil conservative on their ratings though. 
I'm with blades, I'd go Kuuma, between the two anyways. But since we are over double the OPs price range, this is all just chatter


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## joe kelsch (Jun 28, 2015)

Yeah, those furnaces are way out of my price range. I would have to heat my home for a very long time before I'd recoup my costs over NG. The Englander (or maybe even the drolet) would be recouped in a year or two. I can live with that.


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## flotek (Jun 28, 2015)

There is a quality EPA wood furnace with a giant firebox that heats 2500-3000 sq ft for over 12 hours ,it's called a Max caddy . Takes 26" long wood and burns clean. Unfortunately for you Its about 4 times your budget ( good things are seldom cheap and cheap things are seldom good !) .... The woodblast I mean hotblast has a huge 7cubic ft firebox I don't know how you could want anything bigger lol ( my dad has used the same old tired hotblast unit for the last 20 years ) it's problem is it's completely inefficient at claiming or exchanging the heat and it ultimately sends it right up the flue along with the smoke ,That is why you get 5 hours burn instead of the 10 it should get... Now if I was dead set on spending no more than 1200 bucks then the Englander furnace would be difficult to beat for the money . Yes it's not real efficient ( can burn 8-9 hours when fully loaded and damped down ) or easy on wood ( expect 6-7 full cords) but it will burn a fairly long time and throws plenty of heat without problems ..As mentioned if you plan to go that route don't mess around and wait because new strict laws are outlawing sales of those type units this year . Once that is in effect people will be buying them up and you'll be screwed with few options


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## joe kelsch (Jun 28, 2015)

Has anyone tried doing a loop for hot water in an Englander, or any other furnace? I know US Stove sells a kit for their bigger furnaces. From the pictures it doesn't seem that involved.


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## brenndatomu (Jun 28, 2015)

Although shows "out of stock" currently, keep an eye on these guys, factory second Englander 28-3500 $999 delivered. http://www.amfmenergy.com/50trw35--addon-wood-furnace--3050353001.html This place seems to have a pretty good rep over on that other site.
Also, FYI, there is a used Englander furnace over in NH listed on fleabay for "$500 buy it now" or best offer, guy has a 100% rating. Might cost a few hundred more to have palleted up and shipped...


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## stihly dan (Jun 28, 2015)

Looked at the hot blast at TS today. All I can say is I now understand why some people are afraid to burn when no one is home.


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