# Should I fill in hole?



## Cowboy78064 (Sep 12, 2012)

Ok got my first job where the customer wants the stump removed. Should I fill in the hole left behind? Even if yall say no im going to fill it in anyway I just want to see what the norm is. But secondly should I put grass back over the dirt?


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## Gologit (Sep 12, 2012)

If you already have your mind made up what to do, why are you asking?


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## KenJax Tree (Sep 12, 2012)

I always fill the hole in with the chips and dirt if the HO wants the chips removed and grass seed or sod down i will do that but for more $$ of course.


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## Cowboy78064 (Sep 12, 2012)

Gologit said:


> If you already have your mind made up what to do, why are you asking?



Im filling this one in because its a small tree and an old widowed lady. Im asking about the grass and the fact that one day hopefully I will have bigger jobs and am wondering what the standard is on filling holes and putting new grass down.


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## Cowboy78064 (Sep 12, 2012)

I need more opinions please


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## KenJax Tree (Sep 12, 2012)

What more do you need fill it in or don't but what are you gonna do with all the dirt and chips if you don't push it back in the hole.


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## Cowboy78064 (Sep 12, 2012)

KenJax Tree said:


> What more do you need fill it in or don't but what are you gonna do with all the dirt and chips if you don't push it back in the hole.



Of course I would push all of that back in, but does anyone ever haul dirt in to fill the rest of the hole? Because there wont ever be enough chips from cutting it down to fill in where a big stump used to be.


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## KenJax Tree (Sep 12, 2012)

I don't just haul in dirt unless asked and paid accordingly. The hole will always level off but it will settle after a while but the HO usually deals with that. My suggestion is just fill it back in and leave it because the fill dirt is coming out of your pocket.


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## Cowboy78064 (Sep 12, 2012)

KenJax Tree said:


> I don't just haul in dirt unless asked and paid accordingly. The hole will always level off but it will settle after a while but the HO usually deals with that. My suggestion is just fill it back in and leave it because the fill dirt is coming out of your pocket.



Thank you


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## mattfr12 (Sep 13, 2012)

Cowboy78064 said:


> Of course I would push all of that back in, but does anyone ever haul dirt in to fill the rest of the hole? Because there wont ever be enough chips from cutting it down to fill in where a big stump used to be.



Are you sure there is not gonna be enough chips, usually its way the opposite way for for me. when i grind out like a 60 inch stump i wind up with a dump truck full of chips before the hole is flush with the ground again. And yes i always fill the hole back in its actually a liability if you don't. Someone breaks there ankle in it and now you created a hazardous situation that a slime bag lawyer might try and go after you for.


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## rtsims (Sep 13, 2012)

mattfr12 said:


> Are you sure there is not gonna be enough chips, usually its way the opposite way for for me. when i grind out like a 60 inch stump i wind up with a dump truck full of chips before the hole is flush with the ground again. And yes i always fill the hole back in its actually a liability if you don't. Someone breaks there ankle in it and now you created a hazardous situation that a slime bag lawyer might try and go after you for.



I second that. Every stump I have ever ground out left way more shavings and dirt than was needed to fill the hole. Even packing it down your left with a mound.


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## OHWC (Sep 13, 2012)

That is between you an the homeowner and what she wants. Honestly if you are asking questions like this you may want to go work for someone else first to learn how to interact with clients.

Sorry if I am a little rough. But if you do not know to cover this in your bid how are you going to run the rest of the business.


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## Cowboy78064 (Sep 13, 2012)

OHWC said:


> That is between you an the homeowner and what she wants. Honestly if you are asking questions like this you may want to go work for someone else first to learn how to interact with clients.
> 
> Sorry if I am a little rough. But if you do not know to cover this in your bid how are you going to run the rest of the business.



1. I didnt say I didnt say I dont know how to do a bid or interact with clients. I would honestly fill in every hole when Im done just out of professional courtesy. I was just wondering if it was common practice among other companies.

2. The reason I started this company was because everyone else in my area is a bunch of illegals who do half the job and usually do it wrong.

3. Thank you for your reply and opinion.


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## Cowboy78064 (Sep 13, 2012)

rtsims said:


> I second that. Every stump I have ever ground out left way more shavings and dirt than was needed to fill the hole. Even packing it down your left with a mound.



Now I get why yall are saying to fill it with shavings. Guess I left that part out. When I was doing this stuff as a part time thing for friends I just dug down about 3 ft and cut the stump out. It doesnt take too much time with the size of trees we have down here. But yes I do plan on grinding them out when I get that attachment for my skid steer.


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## mattfr12 (Sep 13, 2012)

Cowboy78064 said:


> Now I get why yall are saying to fill it with shavings. Guess I left that part out. When I was doing this stuff as a part time thing for friends I just dug down about 3 ft and cut the stump out. I doest take too much time with the size of trees we have down here. But yes I do plan on grinding them out when I get that attachment for my skid steer.



Ok i get it now so your not actually grinding the stump. your going to dig a trench around it below ground level and cut it off with a saw if i understand you correctly? then you are definitely going to need dirt.


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## Cowboy78064 (Sep 13, 2012)

mattfr12 said:


> Ok i get it now so your not actually grinding the stump. your going to dig a trench around it below ground level and cut it off with a saw if i understand you correctly? then you are definitely going to need dirt.



yes, that is correct. thanks


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## trees2 (Sep 13, 2012)

Cowboy78064 said:


> Ok got my first job where the customer wants the stump removed. Should I fill in the hole left behind? Even if yall say no im going to fill it in anyway I just want to see what the norm is. But secondly should I put grass back over the dirt?



Any job i do , unless it is going to be excavated , I always clean the hole replace it with high quality compost then either seed or sot it. Thats the way i roll! Remember people talk good or bad .But QUALITY is always better.


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## rtsims (Sep 13, 2012)

Just out of curiosity, how much time and/or money are you spending digging around the stump, dulling your chain cutting it out with dirt caked on it, re sharpening your chain, fuel and time to get clean top soil and fill in the hole? In my way of thinking I would rent a stump grinder for about $65/ 3 hrs and grind all the stumps I had. My 2 cents. Just FYI. I bought a Carlton stump grinder last November for 5k, it has more than paid for itself.


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## Cupocoffee (Sep 16, 2012)

*I rarely backfill ...*

When I bid a job and when I advertise my job, I make it clear that I do not backfill. Every now and then, I will backfill if it is for an old man or old woman who simply can't do it themselves. If they ask for me to backfill, I will add $10 to the job if it isn't a huge stump. I have NEVER had anyone balk at filling their own holes. Also, I will backfill if a hole is in the front yard and there is a chance a kid might ride his bike through it before the homeowner can get to it. I have a minimum price of $80 for any job, regardless of how small the stump. My minimum price per stump is $40 for anything 12" or less and the price goes up according to stump size. The only person who has ever complained about my price is my neighbor who is a self proclaimed millionaire. Wouldn't you know it. I try not to work hard but to work smart. That is why I don't understand trying to dig out a stump. Just last week I was called to a job by a plumber who had two workers trying to dig out a stump for five hours which was in the trench he needed to dig. He called me and I had the entire stump ground out in ten minutes. They were amazed. He paid those two guys $10 per hour for five hours each trying to get the stump out ($100) and then paid me $80 to grind it out. The plumber was really excited by the work I did and was very pleased with my price. I don't make much money on single stumps but it is still worth my time and often leads to more work.


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## OLD MAN GRINDER (Sep 16, 2012)

I grind em and my wife fills them.....we allways push shavings into the hole and press
them down and then level and spread the rest, unless the customer has a tractor or
tells us not to bother, we just finished a 192 stump job and filled and leveled all the
holes, we get a lot of compliments on our work and it leads to more jobs, a lot of
times customer will give us more than the bid just because of our work....

Bob.....


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## Cupocoffee (Sep 16, 2012)

OLD MAN GRINDER said:


> I grind em and my wife fills them.....we allways push shavings into the hole and press
> them down and then level and spread the rest, unless the customer has a tractor or
> tells us not to bother, we just finished a 192 stump job and filled and leveled all the
> holes, we get a lot of compliments on our work and it leads to more jobs, a lot of
> ...



Hey Bob, I am curious how others bid and price jobs. I am curious how much you made on a 192 stump job. How deep did you grind? How long did it take? What grinder do you have? Did you have to deal with rocks? Were the trees cut low to the ground? I have never had a job that big but would love to. Thanks.


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## RDAA (Sep 16, 2012)

On a full clean up job I always clean my grindings out, rake everything up nice, backfill with topsoil, and seed with grass.
I rarely do that for a single stump. I usually stack up a bunch of stumps and go around with my grinder behind one truck and take my dump truck and pull a trailer with the skid and my 8' snow bucket one guy grinds while the other cleans up chips with the skid. We go back after the grinding and clean up to backfill with topsoil and double team that. I am lucky that I am in a small town thats not too big. If Im not in town Im at a farmplace where we can usually scrounge up some topsoil. I am lucky that I can do this with our market and we dont have guys taking out three foot stumps for twenty bucks like other places. Grinding stumps isn't my favorite but It sells removals and leaving the job as perfect as possible helps build the reputation.


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## OLD MAN GRINDER (Sep 17, 2012)

Cupocoffee said:


> Hey Bob, I am curious how others bid and price jobs. I am curious how much you made on a 192 stump job. How deep did you grind? How long did it take? What grinder do you have? Did you have to deal with rocks? Were the trees cut low to the ground? I have never had a job that big but would love to. Thanks.



U really do not make as much on big jobs, my best money is on jobs 25 stumps and under..

On this job i made 2400 at 12.50 per stump, did job in 20 hrs so 120 per hr, i try to 
get a min of 100 per hr, u won't get the big money down here like u do in other parts
of the country, lots of competition..

Most trees were low, had to cut down about 10-12 of the bigger ones, they were a mix
of pines and oak, mostly pine but 2-3 yrs old so they ground up pretty easy, if they had
been fresh cut pine i could not have done them as cheap, lots of dust but no rocks...

I am presently using a bandit 2150xp, love it so far, 160 hrs been thru one jacksaft belt
still on orig cutter belt,,,have about 100 teeth on hand for it, thinking about trying to
sharpen a set of teeth and see how they cut, don't know if it will be worth it or not, i have
had a vermeer sc252 and a shaver sc25 pto grinder on a kubota tractor, the bandit is
hands down better than either one of those, will take on any size stump, i can do a 40 inch
stump in at the most 1/2 hr if it is cut down low, if not that is what i have my 660 for....

i normally grind 6-8 inches down unless customer wants them deeper, hope this ans
some of your questions, i work for 4 diff tree services plus call ins and that keeps this
old man plenty busy...

Bob...


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## Cowboy78064 (Sep 17, 2012)

Thank yall for being very informative. I just started this company and its good to get great info from others who have more experience than I do. I would love to get a stump grinder but Im not really sure if anyone in my area would even carry them. We dont have alot of demand for them down here. But I do work for John Deere and have basically and unlimited supply of finding different equipment dealers.


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## landscape doc (Mar 8, 2013)

Chips decomposing suck up nitrogen ,taking it difficult for grass to grow.


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## beastmaster (Mar 9, 2013)

landscape doc said:


> Chips decomposing suck up nitrogen ,taking it difficult for grass to grow.



Yep. That's the reality of it. It helps sometimes to throw in a few handfuls of ammonium sulfate. It'll sink as it decomposes also, if its leveled out to grade it'll leave a depression. The difference in texture of the soil that was put back into the hole from its parent soil will affect its ability to hold water or release it, forming a dry spot or bog. 
It's not as cut and dry as some think, and back filling is mostly for safety, cosmetics, and convenience. Talking about doing it "right", opens up a whole can of worms.


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