# How would you tackle this tree.



## Rhygin (Oct 1, 2016)

Hello, I've been lurking for a while and now have a situation that has me a bit stumped (sorry, it just came out that way). We recently had 13 inches of rain and it flooded some creeks on our property. A huge tree came down across a creek and the root ball brought another with it-about 15 inches in diameter. It is suspended about 5 feet above the larger tree at the base and goes farther apart as you go. I don't want to leave it suspended because it is above a foot path along the creek. I thought about cutting from the root ball but that isn't a very stable perch. Cutting from underneath would probably get me crushed.

Has anyone here ever come across this or dealt with a similar situation. Thanks in advance.


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## beastmaster (Oct 1, 2016)

Its not going to fall on any body way it is. You should if you decide to cut it start from the top and lighten it as you go. It could start lifting up as you do the ends. Pole saw might help. Stay a way from ladders.


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## northmanlogging (Oct 1, 2016)

long butt the stump on the big tree and the whole werks will likely stand back up, or stay where it is either way its scary.

starting from the top eventually will end up with the same results. stump will flop back into it hole usually...

if yer real scared werk the little tree back from its small end then lop off the stump


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## Rhygin (Oct 1, 2016)

I have a extendable pole saw. That is a fantastic idea. Then I can go after big boy. He's sunk in pretty deep but I've always wanted an Alaskan saw mill. I'll just cut until the dirt line.


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## Rhygin (Oct 1, 2016)

northmanlogging said:


> long butt the stump on the big tree and the whole werks will likely stand back up, or stay where it is either way its scary.
> 
> starting from the top eventually will end up with the same results. stump will flop back into it hole usually...
> 
> if yer real scared werk the little tree back from its small end then lop off the stump



The small end of the little tree is about 25 feet in the air. If I can polesaw the little guy out of the equation, can I reverse the big one back into the hole? By that I mean cut a wedge facing downward torward the creek. Then plunge cut or just start at the top and create the hinge?

Like I said, I really don't have any experience with this. I just conceptually know what I think I want to do.

Thanks guys. Keep me from killing myself.


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## HuskStihl (Oct 1, 2016)

I'd bore the big stem out and then release the strap with u'r pole saw. The weight of the hitch-hiking tree may prevent the ball from flopping back.


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## treesmith (Oct 1, 2016)

Just make sure you work out the forces first, is it hung up or is the canopy end free? 

Sent from my SM-T805Y using Tapatalk


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## Rhygin (Oct 1, 2016)

treesmith said:


> Just make sure you work out the forces first, is it hung up or is the canopy end free?
> 
> Sent from my SM-T805Y using Tapatalk



It's pretty much canopy free. My first thought was to take a shovel and remove the dirt and cut roots as I went on the back side of the dirt ball. I then thought about the whole thing upending on top of me - instant grave. Thanks to you guys, I am now seeing a proper path.


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## radio (Oct 1, 2016)

Whenever I see a root ball this is what I think of:
https://www.instagram.com/p/_FxuWOjC5a/?taken-by=tradochsakerhet&hl=en


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## Westboastfaller (Oct 1, 2016)

At the end of the day you are removing the little tree as it's an overhead hazard therefore why would we want to work with it overhead, Good call! Deal with it first, good habit to be in. You seemed to like the pole saw idea so stick with that as it's safe; I think the worst thing that can happen is not cutting it properly and getting pinched and its better than working with a chainsaw over your head and getting pinched....or worse. After that is done then limb the big tree and then start blocking from the top eventually the trunk will start lifting making the bucking easier.


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## Westboastfaller (Oct 1, 2016)

radio said:


> Whenever I see a root ball this is what I think of:
> https://www.instagram.com/p/_FxuWOjC5a/?taken-by=tradochsakerhet&hl=en


 I wish it was only this^^ that came to mind when I think of root wads. In this case the tops would have been bent to the left likely from other trees in the path of the fall. Here you would want to be on the left of the trunk end but not necessarily under the root wad. You can first alleviate the side bind by cutting a series of very shallow nicks spread along the inner bend (compression side) or wait for time to take the preasure out. 
*I do believe they were salvaging the logs, not that a log takes precedence over safety.


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## northmanlogging (Oct 1, 2016)

Or, I bet you could stand on the big log, and reach the little upper one, say 10 feet or so from the root wad, undercut the bottom side, maybe even make a face cut, no need to go real deep or anything just enough to relieve tension, then hack through the top.

It will drop like a rock and maybe chair a bit, but keep these things in mind as you work on it. If you put a "face" on it, it will tend to sag as you cut the top side and probably come down nice and easy until you sever the back off completely.

As far as the big bastard, get yer self a plastic wedge, eyeball a point up hill and clear of the root wad if it does go towards you, and start cutting yer way through, around half way the kerf will either start to close or start to open, if it starts to close, cram that wedge in, and keep cutting. The Stump end will act as a kickstand and keep the wad from rolling on top of you. if it does go the other way, i.e. back from wence it came etc. Just keep yer noggin clear, and watch for it tearing bits off the bottom side of the log.

Just like falling a tree once it starts to commit get out and away.


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## Westboastfaller (Oct 1, 2016)

^^^this ain't Ax men lol


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## beastmaster (Oct 2, 2016)

Would it maybe safer to just redirect your little path around the hazard. Its not like its in your front yard.


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## northmanlogging (Oct 2, 2016)

Fer ****s sake folks is just a wind fall on flat ground. Its not a boulder in a cave surrounded by booby traps and corpses.

Lop it off with enough stump to act as a kickstand and be done with it.


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## capetrees (Oct 2, 2016)

A similar situation was posted in here not too long ago and some responders in here jumped me for giving the exact instruction as they currently are for this situation.

Yes to cutting the smaller upper one first, yes to cutting it slowly so as to understand where the pressure in the trunk is so it doesn't pop back at you, and yes to using a pole saw, fully extended.
The larger one on the ground has the stump which could flop back to it's original position. As thick as it is, I wouldn't be so concerned with the dangers as I would the upper one and I would use a chainsaw like they showed in the video from an earlier post. Cut slow, watch where the pressure is and cut it close to the stump as possible.


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## Zale (Oct 2, 2016)

Using a pole saw........that's funny.


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## capetrees (Oct 2, 2016)

Where's the humor? Fully extended puts you about 10' away and removes you from the danger zone. Are you worried about bar size? Mine came with a 14" bar.

I'm missing the humor.


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## Rhygin (Oct 2, 2016)

I had initially thought I would leave the large tree where it lay and use it as a bridge across the creek. The pole saw would be used just to remove the sword of Damocles suspended above it. After I get it out of the way, I may try to upright the root ball.

Thanks for all of the advice.


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## Zale (Oct 2, 2016)

capetrees said:


> Where's the humor? Fully extended puts you about 10' away and removes you from the danger zone. Are you worried about bar size? Mine came with a 14" bar.
> 
> I'm missing the humor.



I'll use my 460 with a 24" bar and save my arms the workout.


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## Westboastfaller (Oct 2, 2016)

Zale said:


> I'll use my 460 with a 24" bar and save my arms the workout.


The advice is relating to his comfort level.
I believe the OP said "keep the advice comming to prevent me from killing myself". Even if they ask "what would 'you' do". Rarely what I would do and what the person asking should do are the same.

It's like this:
"What would you do"?
" blah blah blah"...." Oh great...I'll give it a try"!. .."Easy tiger, I said that's what I would do". "OK then what should I do"?
"Open the wallet"!


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## capetrees (Oct 2, 2016)

Cutting a trunk that big, most likely under stress/force from unknown direction and overhead?

Good luck. Make sure you video


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## capetrees (Oct 2, 2016)

http://www.arboristsite.com/community/threads/stihl-ht-131-pole-prunner.301506/


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## Zale (Oct 3, 2016)

Westboastfaller said:


> The advice is relating to his comfort level.
> I believe the OP said "keep the advice comming to prevent me from killing myself". Even if they ask "what would 'you' do". Rarely what I would do and what the person asking should do are the same.
> 
> It's like this:
> ...



You are correct. Better to waste a pole saw than risk injury.


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## Zale (Oct 3, 2016)

capetrees said:


> Cutting a trunk that big, most likely under stress/force from unknown direction and overhead?
> 
> Good luck. Make sure you video



The stresses and forces are known and the trunk is not that big. It's not that difficult. Also, I never take video when working. It's not professional.


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## tompands (Oct 3, 2016)

I would definitely get rid of the hitchhiker first. Cut a wide big wedge in the big boy. It's going to hold the root ball until the last minute. Let it fall back.


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## Rhygin (Oct 3, 2016)

capetrees said:


> http://www.arboristsite.com/community/threads/stihl-ht-131-pole-prunner.301506/



That is the exact model I have. I was using it to keep the "roads" clear on the property. "Roads" being glorified 4-wheeler trails. I ended up abandoning it for a chainsaw because taking a little off the top with the polesaw was a constant battle. The chainsaw took care of it for the season.


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## DR. P. Proteus (Oct 5, 2016)

I would start by cutting the bigger tree off the stump right there and see what happens then. It looks safe enough to do now, it looks like the very first step. The smaller higher tree might flop back in. If it didn't:

One method of dealing with uproots like this is to rig the tree so it can't tip back up while you cut it. You just get a rope in the tipped tree and anchor it to the base of another with a porty or something so you can let it back up slow after you climb it to get the top off.

You can do it with just one anchor depending of situation and if that's all you have but installing other ropes and anchors can help direct things and add security.

You can also set a high pulley in an adjacent tree.

I did something like this and just rode the pole back across the fence til upright. Had a few guy lines on that and it was nothing scary, no HAIL MARY cuts at the stump. Lawd NO!


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## DR. P. Proteus (Oct 5, 2016)

Zale said:


> Using a pole saw........that's funny.




Yeah, it sure does.


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## DR. P. Proteus (Oct 5, 2016)

Zale said:


> I'll use my 460 with a 24" bar and save my arms the workout.



That sounds even sillier now come on!


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## beastmaster (Oct 7, 2016)

Im sure most of us could do that job all in a days work. Remember the guy isn't a pro, and we don't want to get him hurt.


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## Rhygin (Oct 7, 2016)

Just to clarify. When I originally started this thread, The "tree" referred to in the title was the hitchhiker, not the larger one that caused the root ball to begin with. I was content to leave the big one where he was. But now y'all done gone and put a notion in my head that I may be able to take care of them both and return the root ball back to it's original position. I think I might need a bigger saw. Heck, I will always need a bigger saw.

We have the remnants of the hurricane coming through this weekend so I'll probably just survey a little more and cut when the weather is better. I'll keep you all updated on my progress with pics as I go.


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## Zale (Oct 7, 2016)

DR. P. Proteus said:


> That sounds even sillier now come on!



Why does that sound silly?


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## Rhygin (Nov 11, 2016)

I figured I would provide an update for you alls' amusement.

After reading all of the replies, I thought I would attempt to go after the larger tree at the bottom of the photos and see if I could roll back the root ball and return the upper tree to the upright. I figured I would cut a small face on the bottom side, plunge cut the middle and then leave myself about a 6 inch cut on the top to prevent it from kicking around when the root ball started rolling. Terrified

Since I never had done it before, I decided to practice plunge cutting on a fallen red oak nearby. Easy peasy. About 400 yards from this tree was another - much smaller - tree that had fallen over during the same storm. It was about 16 in diameter and suspended 4 feet off the ground with a 4 or 5 foot root ball. This would be perfect to see how the root ball would move and which direct the tree goes when it breaks free.

I notched the bottom with a small 2"cut. I then went in for the plunge cut. Perfect. I moved the saw up to within 5 inches of the top. I then wanted to finish the "hinge" by cutting closer to the notch. Did I mention that the entire tree was suspended in the air?

BRRRrrrr..........p.


Oops. Pinched and going nowhere.







I guess it could have been worse. At least I had my wrench so there's only a bar and chain stuck in a tree, deep in woods, in the middle of NC. Note to self- bring wedges and use them.

The Rookie


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## capetrees (Nov 11, 2016)

couldn't you find a smaller saw??


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## Rhygin (Nov 11, 2016)

I had intended just to clean up some trails today so it was the only saw I had with me. The whole point was to try some techniques so I thought the half scale saw would be ok.

At my current experience level, anything I had in my hand was going to get stuck.


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## BC WetCoast (Nov 11, 2016)

Time to learn compression vs tension.


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## Rhygin (Nov 13, 2016)

Free at last, free at last, thank Stihl so tiny, we are free at last.

Lesson 1: Compression - learned. We will see how long I retain the knowledge.


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## Rhygin (Dec 18, 2016)

the saga continues...

After finally realizing I was way over my head, I decided to start at the top. My neighbor and I have been cutting and collecting firewood working our way toward the base.

Here is my thrill seeking daughter tempting fate. I think the main tree has settled down into the ground about six inches since it fell.






We have pulled about 5 6x10 flatbed trailer loads out of the woods with a tractor so far.






Sorry about they crappy photos.


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## unclemoustache (Dec 20, 2016)

Nice. I do hope you get a video of your cuts as they near the root ball. I'd be interested to see if the little tree stands back up. It's probably dead by now, though.


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## jefflovstrom (Dec 24, 2016)

http://www.artofmanliness.com/2011/12/12/a-beginners-guide-to-whittling/

Jeff


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## Rhygin (Dec 24, 2016)

Plan C:

Let the beavers do it and hopefully they'll get crushed in the process.












Win-win.

Merry Christmas y'all.


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## Jengle15 (Dec 30, 2018)

I know its been almost 2 years now, but what was the fate of the tree? No final report?


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