# Just getting started



## jotzilla (Jan 15, 2012)

Milled my second Hackberry log today along with a small red cedar log. I have an Alaskan chainsaw mill, and a Stihl 460 Magnum with a 36" bar. I wish I had longer pieces of that cedar, lt smells great when is cut and is very beautiful. I got alot of downed trees in the back. I had a 24" sweet gum that I thought I could get some good stuff off of yesterday but it was down a long time and had termites and beetles to the core. That stuff would have been pretty too. I know how to tell the species of a couple of trees but I'm gonna learn every different one I have down or standing. Any pointers ya'll can gve this Cajun will be appreciated.


----------



## RedArrow (Jan 16, 2012)

Congrats on your new addiction! Here is a tip, we all like pics! Here is a ERC from Minnesota 

View attachment 217804


Good luck, make some sawdust!!


----------



## jotzilla (Jan 16, 2012)

RedArrow said:


> Congrats on your new addiction! Here is a tip, we all like pics! Here is a ERC from Minnesota
> 
> View attachment 217804
> 
> ...



Thanx Red! I cut a broken water oak down about 30 min ago. Its about 8ft long & 20" diam. Will not be able to mill it till wednesday. I'll try to take pics of some of the boards I cut. The hackberry I think has what you guys call "spalting" if thats the proper term. It gives some dark coloring and speckling to contrast with the light colored wood. I wish I had some cedar like the pic you posted.Pretty stuff. I'm hoping to get a few logs of bald cypress from a man down the road. thats some pretty stuff also. Trees are about 40-50yrs old and been cut and laying for a little over a year. Gotta go back to the river for work friday. will try to cut some more and post pics before then. Later!


----------



## twoclones (Jan 16, 2012)

jotzilla said:


> I wish I had longer pieces of that cedar, lt smells great when is cut and is very beautiful.



Bear in mind that cedar is toxic. Some chainsaw carvers have become so allergic to cedar that they cannot work with it any longer. Respirator is a good idea when milling toxic woods.


----------



## Timberframed (Jan 17, 2012)

Golden Books "Guide To North American Trees" works for me. Good binding and a little waterproof when ya'll in a swamp. The Bald Cypress I've seen is knock out beautiful. What do you do there in the World's largest river-swamp system? Got some rain here today so a little more Appalachian mountain butter's coming your way. I need to visit the Atchafalyla one day especially Old River Control . Something draws me there if you'll pardon the pun.


----------



## Gologit (Jan 17, 2012)

twoclones said:


> Bear in mind that cedar is toxic. Some chainsaw carvers have become so allergic to cedar that they cannot work with it any longer. Respirator is a good idea when milling toxic woods.



Toxic? Please explain.


----------



## sachsmo (Jan 17, 2012)

Hackberry?


Milled some of that, wish I had more capacity than 28" at the time.

That chit wont happen again.


----------



## Timberframed (Jan 17, 2012)

Sachsmo, What kind of saw is that?


----------



## twoclones (Jan 17, 2012)

Gologit said:


> Toxic? Please explain.



There is a toxic wood list here: 
Toxic Woods List

Western Cedar makes my skin itch/burn {as does black walnut} when I cut it but if one breathes the dust enough, the reaction can become severe enough to put you in the hospital. 

_*Potentially Toxic Woods*

The following information is reprinted with permission from data provided by Roy Banner, a wood turner from Torrance, California who almost lost his life in 1989 to anaphylactic shock after turning pieces of exotic wood. You can bet Roy wears his RACAL respirator every time he turns on his lathe now! Roy has assembled this data over the years from various sources and when an entry appears in red, this indicates that the information has come from only one source and has not been verified elsewhere. Some of the information here has come as a surprise to me and its a wonder I've never had a toxic reaction to wood that I've been aware of. As a luthier, I've worked with a lot of exotics, but as a wood collector I've worked with lots more strange stuff from all over the world with no ill effects. Each of us is different and you can call me old "iron gut".

Sorry that this file is such a patchwork effort and may be difficult to follow, and that Latin names of woods are not included. I can't judge with any authority the validity of the information presented here and it's up to the user's discretion to further research any wood themselves, though Roy has told me the information here has appeared in several woodworking magazines (for what that's worth). Take this as a jumping off point. You might also want to check out The Botanical Dermatology Database.

After each wood name comes categories between slashes / /:
Class: Woods are either an irritant which cause a reaction fairly rapidly after exposure and will cause a similar reaction repeatedly, or sensitizers which may have a latency period of hours or months and may require repeated handling before reaction occurs. Sensitizer's are the more severe, because once you're sensitized, you're sensitized for life and the reactions only get more dramatic. A bit like paying taxes to the Gov, huh?

Reaction Category:
Eye and skin irritation (hives, itching, redness).
Respiratory problems.
Nausea, headache, or general malaise, possibly even liver or kidney malfunction.
Cancer of nose and sinus. Statistics show that woodworkers have a 40 per cent greater chance of nasal cancer than the general population, but the majority of statistics on nasal cancer are based on data from 1920-1960 when the furniture industry became highly mechanized with little or no dust control methods. So don't freak.

Potency: Small, great, extreme. This is the potential of the wood or sawdust doing harm and would vary with the individual i.e., those who are allergy prone might think twice about working with wood classed as extremely potent.
Source: Dust or wood, or both
Incidence: Unknown, rare, or common. This is probably the vaguest of the categories as most doctors wouldn't know an allergic reaction to wood if it bit them in the face.

Note that this data does not take into consideration Man's penchant for trying to poison himself by using formaldehyde in plywood, treated woods, sodium compounds in white pine to prevent blue stain, etc.

Afromosia: irritant/eye & skin, respiratory/great/dust/rare
Alder: irritant/eye & skin, respiratory
Angelico: irritant/eye & skin, respiratory/great/dust
Arborvitae: irritant/respiratory
Ash: irritant/respiratory
Baldcypress: sensitizer/respiratory/small/dust/rare
Balsam fir: sensitizer/eye & skin/small/dust/rare
Beech: sensitizer/respiratory/great/dust/rare
Birch: sensitizer/respiratory, nausea/great/dust, wood/rare
Black locust: irritant/nausea/great/rare
Blackwood: sensitizer/eye & skin/great/dust, wood/common
Boxwood: sensitizer/respiratory/small/dust, wood/rare
Cashew: sensitizer/eye & skin/great/dust, wood/rare
Chechem: irritant/respiratory, eye & skin/great/dust, wood/unknown
Cocobolo: irritant/respiratory, eye & skin/great/dust, wood/common
Dahoma: sensitizer/respiratory/great/dust/common
Ebony: irritant, sensitizer/respiratory, eye & skin/great/dust, wood/common
Elm: sensitizer/eye & skin/small/dust/rare
Fir: irritant/eye & skin/small/rare
Goncolo alves: sensitizer/eye & skin/small/dust, wood/rare
Greenheart: sensitizer/respiratory, eye & skin/extreme/dust, wood/common
Guarea: sensitizer/eye & skin/extreme/dust/rare
Hemlock: nasal cancer/great/dust/rare
Ipe: irritant/respiratory, eye & skin
Iroko: irritant/respiratory, eye & skin/extreme/dust, wood/common
Katon: irritant/respiratory
Kingwood: irritant/eye & skin
Mahogany, American: sensitizer/respiratory, eye & skin/small/dust/rare
Mahogany, African: sensitizer/respiratory/great/dust/rare
Makore: irritant/respiratory, eye & skin
Mansonia: irritant/respiratory, eye & skin/extreme/dust, wood/common 
Manzinilla: irritant/respiratory/dust/rare
Maple: sensitizer/respiratory/great/dust, wood/rare
Mimosa: irritant/nasal/extreme/dust, wood/common
Myrtle: sensitizer/respiratory/great/dust, wood/common
Oak, red: nasal/great/dust/rare
Obeche: sensitizer/respiratory, eye & skin/great/dust/common
Olivewood: sensitizer/respiratory, eye & skin/great/dust, wood/common
Opepe: sensitizer/respiratory/small/dust/rare
Orangewood: respiratory/rare
Padauk: irritant/respiratory, eye & skin, nausea/extreme/dust, wood/common
Pau ferro: sensitizer/eye & skin/small/dust, wood/rare
Peroba rose: sensitizer/respiratory/great/dust, wood/common
Peroba white: sensitizer/respiratory, eye & skin
Purpleheart: sensitizer/eye & skin, nausea/small/dust, wood/rare
Quebracho: nasal cancer/great/dust/rare
Ramin: irritant/respiratory, eye & skin/small/dust/rare
Redwood: sensitizer/respiratory, nasal cancer/small/dust/rare
Rosewood(s): irritant, sensitizer/respiratory, eye & skin/extreme/dust, wood/common
Satinwood: irritant/respiratory, eye & skin/extreme/dust, wood/common
Sassafras: sensitizer/respiratory, nausea, nasal cancer/small/dust, wood/rare
Sequoia: irritant/respiratory, nasal cancer/small/dust, wood/rare
Snakewood: irritant/respiratory/great/dust, wood/rare
Spruce: sensitizer/respiratory/small/dust, wood/rare
Stavewood: irritant/respiratory
Sucupira: irritant/respiratory
Teak: sensitizer/eye & skin/extreme/dust/common
Walnut, black: sensitizer/eye & skin/great/leaves & bark/unknown
Wenge: sensitizer/respiratory, eye & skin/great/dust/common
Willow: sensitizer/nasal cancer/great/dust/unknown
*W. redcedar: sensitizer/respiratory, nasal cancer/great/dust/common*
Yew, Europe: irritant/eye & skin/great/dust/common
Zebrawood: sensitizer/eye & skin/great/dust/rare

This is an archived file from the Musical Instrument Makers Forum_


----------



## twoclones (Jan 17, 2012)

Note that while some woods may not be listed, they can still cause problems. Catalpa is said to be non-toxic but I know someone who is allergic to it and develops a skin rash when carving catalpa.


----------



## sachsmo (Jan 17, 2012)

Timberframed said:


> Sachsmo, What kind of saw is that?


----------



## jotzilla (Jan 17, 2012)

Timberframed said:


> Golden Books "Guide To North American Trees" works for me. Good binding and a little waterproof when ya'll in a swamp. The Bald Cypress I've seen is knock out beautiful. What do you do there in the World's largest river-swamp system? Got some rain here today so a little more Appalachian mountain butter's coming your way. I need to visit the Atchafalyla one day especially Old River Control . Something draws me there if you'll pardon the pun.



I am a Towboat Captain. I work mostly between New Orleans and Chicago pushing 75,000 to 150,000 barrels of petroleum products in large tank barges, but I have worked on the Atchafalaya and been thru Old River locks numerous times. And to your pun, that control structure at Old River really does draw you to it when the river is up. We stay away from it. I have been on every major river and commercially navigated waterway that touches the Mississippi except for the Missouri River. I live roughly 50 miles west of the Mississippi and 50 miles east of the Atchafalaya on the coast and have been a Captain for over 25 years. I love being on the water and seeing this country like most people will never see it. I have always had an affinity for things made of wood, but now I've got to cut it. I looked into the history of mass harvesting of cypress trees long before my time and talked with my uncle about the fading cypress swamp behind his home. One thing led to another then I got an Alaskan saw mill, a new chainsaw to fit it, and now I have sawdust in my shoes and want to make things with the wood I cut.


----------



## Timberframed (Jan 18, 2012)

Dang! I knew it! I told my oldest boy. Towboat Captain! Hats off to you. Thanks for sharing that. Lord I'd give a lot to go along some day. I grew up poling a raft made of two logs some 2 x's and plywood in a man made canal that was 50' wide by several miles long. Wild it was then (1970 - 1974) but no more. Yes I did play Huck Finn as a ladd. 8500 horsepower is nothing to shake a stick at. You ever push anything big past Paducah? I hear it's kind of tight through there. This feeder eventually runs into the Allegheny. This image I took last Spring. Elevation 2041' North Central Pennsylvania.


----------



## jotzilla (Jan 18, 2012)

Timberframed said:


> Dang! I knew it! I told my oldest boy. Towboat Captain! Hats off to you. Thanks for sharing that. Lord I'd give a lot to go along some day. I grew up poling a raft made of two logs some 2 x's and plywood in a man made canal that was 50' wide by several miles long. Wild it was then (1970 - 1974) but no more. Yes I did play Huck Finn as a ladd. 8500 horsepower is nothing to shake a stick at. You ever push anything big past Paducah? I hear it's kind of tight through there. This feeder eventually runs into the Allegheny. This image I took last Spring. Elevation 2041' North Central Pennsylvania.



Been up the Ohio river as far up as Georgetown,PA. about mile 38. I work regularly on a 4000 HP boat but have ran a few 6000 HP boats. The tows are usually limited to 1180' long by 108' wide which is what we push.All the locks below Georgetown are 1200' x 110' wide. Six 300' x 54' "red flag" tank barges is our largest tow up there.It doesn't give us alot of room to work with, but we squeeze it in. We used to have a regular run to Catlettsburg West Virginia about mile 316. It's beautiful country up there, but I always gotta come back "down da bayou" to get my seafood cravings satisfied. Going to pick up some stone crab claws from a crab fisherman down the road later this morning. Gonna be some lip smackin' good stuff for me & my gal to eat for lunch. I'm gonna finish drinking my coffee then when the sun comes up good, I'm going in the back to slab that old broken water oak I cut day before yesterday. I'll try to post some pics tonight if I can remember.


----------



## sachsmo (Jan 18, 2012)

nothing more satisfying than millin' your own.


----------



## hunt22j (Jan 18, 2012)

*attaching ladder to logs*

I see alot of people using ladders for their rail system. Does anyone have a pic showing how you attach it to the log to stabilize it. Always looking for a better way. 

Right now I am using a rail system I made out of gas pipe and welded cross sections. Tapped 2 screws per each section for leveling and added a middle hole for a large wood screw to hold it down. Works decent but a little flimsy.


----------



## BobL (Jan 18, 2012)

hunt22j said:


> I see alot of people using ladders for their rail system. Does anyone have a pic showing how you attach it to the log to stabilize it. Always looking for a better way.
> .



Look here.


----------



## blee803 (Jan 19, 2012)

RedArrow said:


> Congrats on your new addiction! Here is a tip, we all like pics! Here is a ERC from Minnesota
> 
> View attachment 217804
> 
> ...



Thats some good grain


----------



## sachsmo (Jan 20, 2012)

I have used conduit clamps etc, finally drilled three holes through every other rung on my 20' section.

Only takes 6-8 lags (usually)


----------



## twoclones (Jan 20, 2012)

I suppose how much effort is put into attaching a flat surface to the log depends on the length of the log... I use a concrete form which is plenty long for me since I mill short longs {60"} for bench seats. To attach the form, I use 2 x 3" long deck screws on each end. When it's necessary to use a wooden wedge to hold the form more stable, I run the screw through the wedge. 

Photo here.


----------



## betterbuilt (Jan 20, 2012)

twoclones said:


> I suppose how much effort is put into attaching a flat surface to the log depends on the length of the log... I use a concrete form which is plenty long for me since I mill short longs {60"} for bench seats. To attach the form, I use 2 x 3" long deck screws on each end. When it's necessary to use a wooden wedge to hold the form more stable, I run the screw through the wedge.
> 
> Photo here.



Your link isn't working for me.

www.arboristsite.com/milling-saw-mills/188738.htm#post3356339

I think this is it.

Nice work!!!!


----------



## twoclones (Jan 20, 2012)

betterbuilt said:


> Your link isn't working for me.
> 
> www.arboristsite.com/milling-saw-mills/188738.htm#post3356339
> 
> ...



Sorry. I please "coffee deficiency."


----------



## Talltom (Jan 27, 2012)

*Ladder attachment*

I recently purchased a Panthermill 2 for slabbing and cutting big logs in half and needed a way to attach a ladder to use as a guide for the first cut. I tend to make my jigs out of wood rather than metal like many of you guys.
View attachment 220080

I'm splitting a medium sized (21 inch diam.) red oak in half to quartersaw later on my M-5. I chose this log because it's close to my house and easier to test my jigs. The end supports have two small oak pieces with kerfs cut to capture the edge of the ladder's rail. One is permanently attached, the other is screwed on after the ladder is placed on the log. The whole end piece is screwed into the end of the log after the low end of the ladder is shimmed to get the ladder the same distance from the center of the log on both ends.
View attachment 220081

View attachment 220082

The center clamp fits between the rungs and the 3 thinner pieces keep it firmly between the rails. It's shimmed and screwed into the log with a 1/4 inch x 5 Spax lag after the ends are set. I drilled holes at different depths so I can use the same length lag with different thicknesses of shims. The ladder is pretty stiff to begin with, but the whole set-up was rock solid during the cut.
View attachment 220084
View attachment 220085

So far, so good. The second picture shows why I go to the trouble of quartersawing oak. My next log is from the same tree and has a pretty good curve to it that I will cut into slabs. I'll see how well my set-up works with logs that don't have square ends. I have two more of the center clamps. so I can always use them near the ends of the log if the end supports don't hold well.


----------



## betterbuilt (Jan 27, 2012)

Here's Talltom's pic's






















That's nice looking oak.


----------

