# Using top corner of bar safely



## The Muskrat Man (Nov 24, 2014)

I am a non professional, so I wanted to ask this question to guys in the industry. 

*In what situations is it safe to use the fearsome "kickback corner" of the bar for cutting?*

I was taught to use the bore cut the majority of the time when felling. The guy that showed me this emphasized using full throttle and starting with the bottom corner of the bar before rotating the saw, but he said that the top corner could also be used. I hadn't thought about it in the years since, but recently I was thinking that it would be handy so that I could stand with a better view of the notch when starting the bore (when you cant stand on other side of notch or when double boring). Is this a safe practice? Are there other situations when it can be done (bucking a log on the ground etc..)?


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## northmanlogging (Nov 24, 2014)

legally never...

But if one where to try it... it helps for limbing using the top of the bar if you catch a bit of the "danger corner" the saw will pull itself through the limb, can help with underbucking as well, same basic Idea just use a bit of the corner and it pulls its way through, its really ****ing dangerous though and probably shouldn't be tried ever...

Not to be tried by the weak or vain though, if you do plan on using it make damn sure anything important is out of the way of a likely kickback, and that the brake is working properly on your saw.


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## madhatte (Nov 24, 2014)

Useful also for cleaning out face-cuts; you can look down the bar like sighting a rifle and see what you're nibbling at. Works way better with Humboldts than conventionals.


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## SliverPicker (Nov 25, 2014)

If you decide to try it be prepared for some pretty rude surprises that you may or not be able to handle along the learning curve. Even after the learning curve for that matter.


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## 056 kid (Nov 25, 2014)

It's all in your chain. I'd suggest learning other techniques than the gol bore cut though. Bore cutting has its place, but there are other, easier, safer ways to back up a tree. Be safe!


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## redoakneck (Nov 25, 2014)

Which chain works Best??? Square ground??


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## RandyMac (Nov 25, 2014)

another boring thread


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## 056 kid (Nov 25, 2014)

Pretty much. BUT. The right hook & the right raker depth on a round filed bit can work just as good. Back square filed bit, it can buck like hell too. Just in the setup. 
Its all about the chain. ...


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## HuskStihl (Nov 25, 2014)

Big saw, full throttle, non-pro user, top side of the tip...........If u'r asking if northy, kid, sliver, or Randy can safely do it, sure. If you mean guys like you and me........if you have to ask, then the answer is no


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## The Muskrat Man (Nov 25, 2014)

056 kid said:


> It's all in your chain. I'd suggest learning other techniques than the gol bore cut though. Bore cutting has its place, but there are other, easier, safer ways to back up a tree. Be safe!



Had to look up "gol" , I didn't do game of logging. After reading a few threads I've gathered that they really like bore cutting. I hope I didn't overplay my use of it though I probably do use it more than necessary. I am curious what other techniques you recommend. I have used few different sequences for making a back cut (straight thru, coos bay, single bore half diameter and cut around), but I can't imagine many other variations that would be practical. Please elaborate or point me in the right direction. I'm very interested in learning.


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## northmanlogging (Nov 25, 2014)

Not sure what its called but on bigger timber and to short of a bar you can dog in on the off side and use the tip of the bar to establish the offside hold wood, then swing the saw back around and finish off the front side back cut... Good thing to know on steep ground or hard to reach offside stuff, and its just faster than wandering around to the off side...

Otherwise not many ways to make a back cut, two ways to make a coos though triangle and T, I think the T method is meant more for large timber where the triangle works great on smaller stuff.

GOL=SSD, or game of logging/swedish stump dance


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## 056 kid (Nov 26, 2014)

If it looks like it's gonna bust, put a block in it. Coos bays are great. Don't tell but on real heavy leaners that will be flopped, I just ream until the front sits hard. Then hit the back and off she goes. Slick stumpin! Good for those 45° bastards haha. These east coasters really raise hell about a little corner pull(only way to get them side hilled so the skidded engineer can pull em out) in some situations.


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## SliverPicker (Nov 26, 2014)

Northy, can you do a video demonstration of this Swedish Stump Dance?


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## KYLogger (Nov 26, 2014)

If it's a bad leaner I do as "kid" said. A little side pull ain't never bothered me a bit. That being said, I will bore cut on occasion.......... a whole lotta cutting to achieve the same result for most trees though.


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## northmanlogging (Nov 26, 2014)

SliverPicker said:


> Northy, can you do a video demonstration of this Swedish Stump Dance?



You want me to cause an earthquake? I'm not sure my insurance will cover that...


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## Gologit (Nov 26, 2014)

northmanlogging said:


> You want me to cause an earthquake? I'm not sure my insurance will cover that...



Maybe you could set it to music, something graceful like Swan Lake or The NutCracker. We'll give you a pass on the ballet tights and the tutu. Gladly.


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## northmanlogging (Nov 26, 2014)

Me and Grace don't get along so well...

Although ya might be onto something, only problem is I don't have a bar short enough to make it legit. Maybe I could borrow the neighbors top handle limbing saw and find something to kill.


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## 4x4American (Nov 26, 2014)

Oh boy...subscribed


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## treeslayer2003 (Nov 27, 2014)

LOL!
Ted, if you mean corner as in the sap wood then that is fine yes. heart pull no.
i can't get on with GOL, feels really weird to me. heavy leaners i gut the heart from the face and let um go from the back like normal........any pull will be on the side like i think you mean. where you been any way?


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## Samlock (Nov 27, 2014)

Today I used the kickback corner few times for nibbing out the holding wood from the near side when I had a backleaning small but tall whip all stuffed with wedges, yet skybound. The slope was full of that stuff.

Well, it's not a safe thing to do.


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## SliverPicker (Nov 27, 2014)

It ain't the most stress-free way to run around the woods for sure.


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## Spotted Owl (Nov 28, 2014)

Ever heard the sayings, keep your nose clean, or don't stick your nose where it don't belong? Heed the advise.

If you're gonna do it anyway, use a small saw to see what is going to happen. Something you can control when she decides to bite and try and tear your head off. Lots of things come natural or automatic with time, I still purposefully and conscientiously think about where my nose is all the time. That's a big surprise I don't like and am never ready for, this speed and force that is a shocker to say the least. That doesn't mean I never use it at times, but I put every safety in the book i can to keep my blood where it belongs.



Owl


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## SliverPicker (Dec 2, 2014)

Exactly. 

Even a 362 can kick like rabid mule when the time is right.


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## HuskStihl (Dec 2, 2014)

I learned most of this stuff the hard way. One of my favorite saw misbehaviors is when the chain clogs with chips on a bore, and shoots the power head backwards at u'r nuts in a most disagreeable fashion


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## northmanlogging (Dec 2, 2014)

They'll do that when bucking too, especially the ones that sag quickly...


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## treeslayer2003 (Dec 2, 2014)

always be ready


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## KYLogger (Dec 2, 2014)

Osha will be requiring the use of kevlar cups if they see this thread!


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## northmanlogging (Dec 2, 2014)

Um I think they do in some places... either way **** em, can't Nerf the world, people die young or get old... and still die...

I was thinking on this the other day, parents and adults are always winging about "you'll shoot yer eye out" blah blah, if that where really the case wouldn't there be a whole lot more folks running around with glass eyes or eye patches?


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## SliverPicker (Dec 3, 2014)

" Don't run with scissors. You'll fall and put your eye out!" Is what my grandma used to harp on continuously. All I ever heard when she got on that high horse was " blah blah blaaaaah." Turns out her cousin ran through the house with scissors sometime in the late 1930's. She fell and placed the tips of the scissors directly in to her left eye. I stood corrected! That happens often to me though.


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## SliverPicker (Dec 3, 2014)

OSHA won't and can't keep you safe. Just another bueracracy to vacuum up our hard earned tax dollars.


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## BeatCJ (Dec 3, 2014)

It's all fun and games until someone loses an eye.

Then its just a game of find the eye.

Sometimes I think it's too bad Darwin isn't better at his process.


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## Thornton (Dec 3, 2014)

Wear your safety gear PPE


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## redoakneck (Dec 3, 2014)

Thornton said:


> Wear your safety gear PPE
> 
> View attachment 383855


That right there looks not good, dumb question-- is that from a saw???


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## Thornton (Dec 3, 2014)

redoakneck said:


> That right there looks not good, dumb question-- is that from a saw???


The site I was on said it was


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## HuskStihl (Dec 3, 2014)

Doesn't look like a saw injury to me. I don't know what's imbedded in there, but the edges look way too clean for a chainsaw.


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## Thornton (Dec 3, 2014)

HuskStihl said:


> Doesn't look like a saw injury to me. I don't know what's imbedded in there, but the edges look way too clean for a chainsaw.



looks like maybe metal


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## redoakneck (Dec 3, 2014)

Looks like a chop ????


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## redoakneck (Dec 3, 2014)

Doesn't look like a fun party!!!


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## HuskStihl (Dec 3, 2014)

Brush blade from a trimmer maybe?


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## redoakneck (Dec 3, 2014)

Definitely something stuck in his face. Not a chain or bar


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## redoakneck (Dec 3, 2014)

Road sign corner??! Piece of a concrete cutting disc ??? Not a chainsaw part


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## KYLogger (Dec 3, 2014)

Don't think my hard hat woulda' helped much there. Mighta caught the brim. That's why I won't wear plastic!


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## northmanlogging (Dec 3, 2014)

saw would have split the jaw, or done more damage to the forehead... anyway PPE is for people that are scared of death or injury, and to give the gubamint something to ***** about...

Hat, Boots, pants and a T shirt I'm good to go, if the situation calls for it I might throw on some safety glasses, other wise **** em, only the brave can live forever.


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## RandyMac (Dec 3, 2014)

northmanlogging said:


> saw would have split the jaw, or done more damage to the forehead... anyway PPE is for people that are scared of death or injury, and to give the gubamint something to ***** about...
> 
> Hat, Boots, pants and a T shirt I'm good to go, if the situation calls for it I might throw on some safety glasses, other wise **** em, only the brave can live forever.



add gloves or not.


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## hseII (Dec 3, 2014)

SliverPicker said:


> Northy, can you do a video demonstration of this Swedish Stump Dance?


SS is your man for any kinda Stumpin'


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## hseII (Dec 3, 2014)

northmanlogging said:


> Um I think they do in some places... either way **** em, can't Nerf the world, people die young or get old... and still die...
> 
> I was thinking on this the other day, parents and adults are always winging about "you'll shoot yer eye out" blah blah, if that where really the case wouldn't there be a whole lot more folks running around with glass eyes or eye patches?


Or 9 1/3rd Fingas?...


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## HuskStihl (Dec 3, 2014)

RandyMac said:


> add gloves or not.


I have very soft, delicate hands. Gloves (the $5 for a 3pk at lowes gloves) are a must


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## RandyMac (Dec 3, 2014)

I should be the last one to say anything, to anyone about PPE of any kind.


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## treeslayer2003 (Dec 4, 2014)

RandyMac said:


> I should be the last one to say anything, to anyone about PPE of any kind.


me too.......i do wear drivers gloves........i should prolly wear the tin hat......ain't found one that fits right yet.


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## hseII (Dec 4, 2014)

treeslayer2003 said:


> me too.......i do wear drivers gloves........i should prolly wear the tin hat......ain't found one that fits right yet.


Did you ever get your chain?


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## treeslayer2003 (Dec 4, 2014)

hseII said:


> Did you ever get your chain?


yes sir, 103 is tight but it will work. prolly never have to take out a link. Jasha sure can grind um.


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## KYLogger (Dec 4, 2014)

I hate gloves, if it's really cold then I will wear those white cotton "fallers gloves" (ropers gloves if you're a cowboy) I wore my old chaps out and have been too cheap to buy another pair, no hearing protection (can't keep up with the little foam buggers) and almost never glasses. Hard hat and calks about sums up my safety gear. That and stagged off britches.


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## treeslayer2003 (Dec 4, 2014)

when i was young and green, i sliced my knuckle to the bone fileing a chain.........always gloves since. leather......them jersy gloves is slipery.

oh and cold, yea i guess i got nerve damage or white finger or what ever.....insulated gloves when its cold and wish i had a fire in the fingers lol.


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## SliverPicker (Dec 10, 2014)

Tin hat. Safety spectacles. Ear plugs (rubber ones so I can still hear the "oops"). 99¢ gloves for vibration. That's it. Chaps are too dangerous. Of course I will change my tune if I ever give my thigh a 13,000 RPM filet job. I *won't* wear a neon, reflective vest. If I wanted to look like clown I would have gotten some oversized shoes and joined the circus. That vest won't keep you safe, they are so common no one even sees them anymore. Besides I work alone all day, who's to see it? It might help in a body recovery situation, but what do I care about that? In this neck of the woods during the summer months the green neon vest actually acts as camo. No matter the color it will snag on any thing it gets near.

ts, there might be a cure or what ails you...


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## chucker (Dec 10, 2014)

northmanlogging said:


> saw would have split the jaw, or done more damage to the forehead... anyway PPE is for people that are scared of death or injury, and to give the gubamint something to ***** about...
> 
> Hat, Boots, pants and a T shirt I'm good to go, if the situation calls for it I might throw on some safety glasses, other wise **** em, only the brave can live forever.


PPE, is for people that think they can't move faster than a 3000 fps moving chain! !!NON-PPE WEAR'ERS, are people who think they can move faster than a 3001 fps slow chain!! ???? it all comes down to attitude instead of aptitude as we all get our chance at both once. lol


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## treeslayer2003 (Dec 10, 2014)

SliverPicker said:


> Tin hat. Safety spectacles. Ear plugs (rubber ones so I can still hear the "oops"). 99¢ gloves for vibration. That's it. Chaps are too dangerous. Of course I will change my tune if I ever give my thigh a 13,000 RPM filet job. I *won't* wear a neon, reflective vest. If I wanted to look like clown I would have gotten some oversized shoes and joined the circus. That vest won't keep you safe, they are so common no one even sees them anymore. Besides I work alone all day, who's to see it? It might help in a body recovery situation, but what do I care about that? In this neck of the woods during the summer months the green neon vest actually acts as camo. No matter the color it will snag on any thing it gets near.
> 
> ts, there might be a cure or what ails you...


requires a doctor? surgion?


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## HuskStihl (Dec 10, 2014)

Heated handle?


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## madhatte (Dec 10, 2014)

Gloves. That's one I have mixed feelings over. For fire we are required to wear leather, but that's not really always appropriate. Leather, when wet, can get slick as hell, and that's no good, and uninsulated leather is not much better than no gloves at all in the cold. Fallers tend to prefer cotton gloves for their "feel". I usually wear the thin Atlas nitrile palm ones for general use and the cheap orange synthetic ones with the waffle pattern grip stuff for cutting, because they don't slip easily. I like to throw wool over nitrile sometimes when it's cold to preserve dexterity but I don't run a saw that way. When it's really nippy out, I like the Atlas "Therma Fit" gloves. So, yeah, I carry 4 or 5 different kinds of gloves in the truck. I don't believe that any one glove can do it all, nor should they be expected to.


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## SliverPicker (Dec 10, 2014)

300o fps. That's 2045 miles per hour. Yeah, I can move that fast, at least.


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## northmanlogging (Dec 12, 2014)

so to underscore a previous post, today while limbing a tree, I decided to under buck some vine maple that was in my way, sure enough it pinched the top side of the chain, saw shot back and chucked me into a pecker pole that was luckily right behind, other wise it was a longer drop then I care to fall...


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