# Tsumura saw bars



## Spotted Owl (Dec 7, 2014)

That's it. I'm sold.

Oregon haven't been what they used to be. Light weight are to limp for me. I give up on Oregon bars
Stihl ES are good. Bad experiences with their lightweights.
Cannon are phenomenal. But to darned heavy for me, maybe I'm getting to be a bit of a wimp. 
GB titanium, are fair at best in my limited use.
Haven't tried any others to speak of.

These checker board bars, take a beating and keep on going. The rails are tougher than anything, on par with and probably a sneezle better than Cannon, I do like Cannons belly though. Even when abused I don't have cause to say anything bad about them. There is a guy on the site here that sells them, decent price I think, and a very very good guy to work/deal with. I got my first one from a guy in town that was selling out. Got the next two from the guy on the site. Just ordered 3 more. Only down side I can see is the tips, the do wear a bit quicker than I expected from the way the rails wear, but nothing at all to sneeze at either.

So long as I can get my hands on them, my saws will be wearing these bars.

After reading this I wish I had some stock in the company, pretty good commercial huh?

Kidding aside, if you're looking for a good saw bar these are very good.



Owl


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## CR888 (Dec 7, 2014)

l am still not sold on which bar you like..l have found there are pros and cons to every 'feature' different brands have i.e cannon are super strong but super heavy at the same time. l have had good results with both light stihl bars either ES or E light bars are great. A 28" light ES bar on a 660 is as perfect balance as you can get. Other 28's unbalance the saw making it very nose heavy. l would rather go through a bar twice as fast if it made my cutting experience twice as good. Just saying.


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## Spotted Owl (Dec 7, 2014)

CR888 said:


> l am still not sold on which bar you like.



The checkerboard Tsumura bars. 

If Cannon could be the same weight as Tsumura, I would most likely run Cannon, I like their belly and wide tip. Pros and cons for sure, just seems that lately there have been more cons than pros to most bars. Balance isn't something I look for to much, 32 is minimum for my area, with 36 or 42 used regularly by many, blows balance right out of the water.

For my works I disagree about burning through twice as many bars for twice the cutting experience. I need a bar that works, I need a bar that does it's job well and lasts as long a time as possible under hard use and minimal care. If it does it's job well but doesn't last, I can't count on it, ain't gonna work. That's for me though.



Owl


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## northmanlogging (Dec 7, 2014)

Been running the stihl light bars for a year or so now, other then running em over occasionally and cutting to much hold wood from time to time they are holding up just fine, only smashed one to unusable so far... (skidders is heavy...)

I might try out on of them tsumara bars if the price is right though.


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## Spotted Owl (Dec 7, 2014)

Their on tap with Oregon lights as far as price.

I have heard some whistle in the wind about a carbon insert Stihl bar. That could prove interesting. Anyone know anything about that?



Owl


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## imagineero (Dec 8, 2014)

I think that carbon bar is just a concept for the carbon saw that wore it.

I've used the ES lights (36" and 28") and found them to be very durable and the rails hold up pretty good. My 36 needs a new nose now, flogged out a bit around the tip. It's got a lot of hours on it.


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## mdavlee (Dec 8, 2014)

Good bars Owl. I have used some milling and not got near the wear a stihl bar or oregon gets


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## treeslayer2003 (Dec 8, 2014)

owl, i been running tsumara and sugi for a year now......i would say they both are better and last longer than anything else i have run. tsumara gets the nod as far as price, i can get one delivered for around the same price as a stihl from the dealer here.
i only have one light, a sugi, light is not as important to me as i don't normally have to pack in far, so i'm mostly running the solids in 28, 32 and36.


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## madhatte (Dec 8, 2014)

I've had good service from Sugi. Haven't got a Tsumura yet but I surely would like to.


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## troylee (Dec 8, 2014)

Sugi is the only bars I currently run. Had one on the 026 (sold it with the saw), the one you see to the left on the 55, and one on the 371. Do everything I need and then some. Weedeaterman.com


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## OlympicYJ (Dec 11, 2014)

Nate I've got a Sugi that I'd like to liquidate myself of as I'm tired of dicking around with the adaptor on my Husky. Soon as I can I'm gonna order a couple Tsumura's. Still haven't decided which lengths though. 28, 30, or 32, then maybe a 36 for the second one.


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## KiwiBro (Dec 13, 2014)

Tsumura body/rails=great. Sprocket nose=good, but not as outstanding as the rest of the bar. Still trying to wear out the rails but could take a few more years at this rate. But the noses have been replaced. Twice on the 20", once on the 24", still just the original on the 'light and tough' "checkerboard" 32".

Also, in case anyone is wondering, they can't do anything bigger than 36", not even custom orders. So a 72" Tsumura milling bar is off the list.


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## Spotted Owl (Dec 13, 2014)

Burned my 36 yesterday. Oil pump failed and I couldn't stop. Visual heat colors on the rails, down into the body and lot's of smoke. We'll see how it holds up now. Never had an oil pump fail before. This 36 has officially been handed more than it should ever have been. I'm very interested in the rest of it's life. Not the bars fault by any means, but it will pay the price? 

Any way to test oil pumps? Other than the obvious? Unless I'm wrong(impossible), they're either a work or don't work type of needless necessity, no middle ground or way to maintenance test for upcoming failure.



Owl


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## hseII (Dec 13, 2014)

OlympicYJ said:


> Nate I've got a Sugi that I'd like to liquidate myself of as I'm tired of dicking around with the adaptor on my Husky. Soon as I can I'm gonna order a couple Tsumura's. Still haven't decided which lengths though. 28, 30, or 32, then maybe a 36 for the second one.


Details please


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## northmanlogging (Dec 13, 2014)

Spotted Owl said:


> Burned my 36 yesterday. Oil pump failed and I couldn't stop. Visual heat colors on the rails, down into the body and lot's of smoke. We'll see how it holds up now. Never had an oil pump fail before. This 36 has officially been handed more than it should ever have been. I'm very interested in the rest of it's life. Not the bars fault by any means, but it will pay the price?
> 
> Any way to test oil pumps? Other than the obvious? Unless I'm wrong(impossible), they're either a work or don't work type of needless necessity, no middle ground or way to maintenance test for upcoming failure.
> 
> ...


 its either clogged which you could then clean, or its burned up, usually the gear that drives em gets wore out, so both need changed, or something is stuck inside the pump itself, and then needs changed anyway.


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## mdavlee (Dec 13, 2014)

Spotted Owl said:


> Burned my 36 yesterday. Oil pump failed and I couldn't stop. Visual heat colors on the rails, down into the body and lot's of smoke. We'll see how it holds up now. Never had an oil pump fail before. This 36 has officially been handed more than it should ever have been. I'm very interested in the rest of it's life. Not the bars fault by any means, but it will pay the price?
> 
> Any way to test oil pumps? Other than the obvious? Unless I'm wrong(impossible), they're either a work or don't work type of needless necessity, no middle ground or way to maintenance test for upcoming failure.
> 
> ...


Usually if it quits it's the drive gear that messed up. The oiler if it's turning will pretty much pump oil.


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## Spotted Owl (Dec 13, 2014)

That's what I thought. At least the new pump, new bar and chain are covered. It's sinking feeling, knowing that you are destroying something and you have no choice but to keep going. Never have, never will like that, just hope to keep it at an absolute minimum.



Owl


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## northmanlogging (Dec 13, 2014)

I've always got a spare bar... or a second saw, but the crummy has a 32 and a 36 in the tool box at all times, barring that a back up saw is pretty much on deck at all times, I don't currently have a spare to cover the 066 (661? maybe???) but the 461's do a fair job of covering most things the 66 can handle.


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## XSKIER (Dec 13, 2014)

If you're "abusing" that many blades on the same powerhead, I can only imagine how poor of condition it is in now.


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## treeslayer2003 (Dec 13, 2014)

you just came in the middle of a conversation.........read more before ya post


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## treeslayer2003 (Dec 13, 2014)

owl, what kind of saw?


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## OlympicYJ (Dec 13, 2014)

They are bars not blades.

hsell, it's a 32 inch Sugi lightweight.


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## Eccentric (Dec 14, 2014)

Oil pump pickup could be clogged with chips and such in the tank. Otherwise, it's probably the drive gear. Both already stated by Northy. On older saws I've seen the rubber pickup line collapse like a tapeworm, usually after the pickup screen is at least partially clogged. This usually doesn't happen until that line's been there for a LONG time and has gotten soft. Once they're soft enough, they'll collapse even when the pickup is clear.


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## Spotted Owl (Dec 14, 2014)

XSKIER said:


> If you're "abusing" that many blades on the same powerhead, I can only imagine how poor of condition it is in now.



Saw bars take abuse, sometimes there's no way around it. With enough time(years) you will see what can and does happen to a bar. I certainly hope people don't do such things on purpose or cause it with out thinking. A bar in my mind is a consumable though, the power head is an asset. I will always abuse or sacrifice a bar before the head. Sometimes you're in it and you can't stop to get back up, you just clamp your teeth and do what needs to be done, knowing full well what's happening(damage) as you go. Needed to finish and get rid of the post I left, wedges may have held it but I wasn't able to take that risk in this situation.



treeslayer2003 said:


> owl, what kind of saw?



It's a newer 660.



Eccentric said:


> Oil pump pickup could be clogged with chips and such in the tank. Otherwise, it's probably the drive gear. Both already stated by Northy. On older saws I've seen the rubber pickup line collapse like a tapeworm, usually after the pickup screen is at least partially clogged. This usually doesn't happen until that line's been there for a LONG time and has gotten soft. Once they're soft enough, they'll collapse even when the pickup is clear.



Everything looks good, I think it just gave up the ghost. I'll get another ordered, got a replacement installed and everything is working right as rain now. I was just hoping there was another maintenance check I could do, when I go over things to try and head this off from happening again.



Owl


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## Freakingstang (Dec 14, 2014)

when you say Tsumura checkered are you talking about the lighter versions, and not the solids? i've got about 10 years on one regular Total Super bar(tsumura) and 5 yearss on another 24". I blew the tip out of the 20" long time ago and have a spare on hand, Still going strong. Wish the tip was a tad longer/braoder but compared to everything else out there, they're rails are hard, hardly a burr like any oregon, windsor or the like. Never tried the lighter versions, or never had one over 24" though. They used to be quite the deal compared to everything else, now it seems they are priced in line with everything else.


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## hseII (Dec 14, 2014)

OlympicYJ said:


> They are bars not blades.
> 
> hsell, it's a 32 inch Sugi lightweight.


Details.
PM scented


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## Homelite410 (Dec 14, 2014)

OlympicYJ said:


> Nate I've got a Sugi that I'd like to liquidate myself of as I'm tired of dicking around with the adaptor on my Husky. Soon as I can I'm gonna order a couple Tsumura's. Still haven't decided which lengths though. 28, 30, or 32, then maybe a 36 for the second one.


Sounds like you need a better adapter..


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## Eccentric (Dec 14, 2014)

Homelite410 said:


> Sounds like you need my upcoming *Homelite and Poulan* adapters..



Yessir.


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## Homelite410 (Dec 14, 2014)

Eccentric said:


> Yessir.


Bam!


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## Eccentric (Dec 14, 2014)

Homelite410 said:


> Bam!



Hiya Mike. Hit "click to expand" at the bottom of the quote in my last post.


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## Homelite410 (Dec 14, 2014)

Eccentric said:


> Hiya Mike. Hit "click to expand" at the bottom of the quote in my last post.


I did!


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## OlympicYJ (Dec 14, 2014)

I have one of those good adaptors. It's not loose on the adaptor it just seems I can't get the bar adjusted quite right. Has a brand new adjustors cover and that seems to function just fine with my windsor. I just want a light bar with the proper mounting and I wanna try the lightweight tsumura. I wanna say they are a tad lighter than the sugis. I'll get back to you later hell as I'm on my phone.


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## treeslayer2003 (Dec 14, 2014)

Spotted Owl said:


> Saw bars take abuse, sometimes there's no way around it. With enough time(years) you will see what can and does happen to a bar. I certainly hope people don't do such things on purpose or cause it with out thinking. A bar in my mind is a consumable though, the power head is an asset. I will always abuse or sacrifice a bar before the head. Sometimes you're in it and you can't stop to get back up, you just clamp your teeth and do what needs to be done, knowing full well what's happening(damage) as you go. Needed to finish and get rid of the post I left, wedges may have held it but I wasn't able to take that risk in this situation.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


owl, you replaced the whole pump? or just the plastic worm drive? reason i ask, the old 064 in the early years gave pump trouble because we used motor oil then.......it would gum up and strip the worm over and over. i took it all apart and it had a gummy glaze inside that was hell to clean. i did get it clean and then it worked just fine. worth a look, drive out the tiny roll pin and pull the adjustment screw, then the plunger will pull out.


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## Spotted Owl (Dec 14, 2014)

Replaced the whole thing. I'll pull it apart some other time, just to see how this thing works. I had a replacement in the bag. Ran the tank, screens and lines all that's all clean no problems now. I fiddled with this thing a bit, I'll get it torn down to the bits and pieces in the next couple days when time allows.



Owl


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## Skeans (Dec 15, 2014)

OlympicYJ said:


> I have one of those good adaptors. It's not loose on the adaptor it just seems I can't get the bar adjusted quite right. Has a brand new adjustors cover and that seems to function just fine with my windsor. I just want a light bar with the proper mounting and I wanna try the lightweight tsumura. I wanna say they are a tad lighter than the sugis. I'll get back to you later hell as I'm on my phone.


You can get a lightweight Sugihara 32" .63g 3/8 in a husky mount, I just picked one up.


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## OlympicYJ (Dec 15, 2014)

I was only ever able to get em in 50th and still mount. Well its sold now nonetheless. I'll get me a tsumura and try that for a while lol


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## Homelite410 (Dec 15, 2014)

OlympicYJ said:


> I was only ever able to get em in 50th and still mount. Well its sold now nonetheless. I'll get me a tsumura and try that for a while lol


Was it my adapter or the baileys adapter. I have a baileys adapter and used it on my 32 stihl mount sugi and the adapter is thicker than the bar so the clutch cover will not tighten down or oil properly.


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## Little Al (Dec 15, 2014)

imagineero said:


> I think that carbon bar is just a concept for the carbon saw that wore it.
> 
> I've used the ES lights (36" and 28") and found them to be very durable and the rails hold up pretty good. My 36 needs a new nose now, flogged out a bit around the tip. It's got a lot of hours on it.



Here in France the Stihl carbon insert bar is available but you need to take out a mortgage to buy, I don't know of 1 in use as cost is the killer The Op is pleased with his Tsumura bars, we have used them in a commercial setup but we now use Sugihara, very little to choose performance wise, but in our case the Sugi's are sourced at a better to us price so as a living is being made with them it's a no brainer. Cannon's are not readily available so we have not used them although I have 1 fitted to a saw I own & it is a quality bit of kit.


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## OlympicYJ (Dec 15, 2014)

Homelite410 said:


> Was it my adapter or the baileys adapter. I have a baileys adapter and used it on my 32 stihl mount sugi and the adapter is thicker than the bar so the clutch cover will not tighten down or oil properly.


Maybe mine needs a little shaved off but the main thing is I wanna go to 63ga.


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## Homelite410 (Dec 15, 2014)

OK sounds good! I just wanted to say that if my adapter was not right please let me know so that I can take care of the issue! 

Carry on!


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## imagineero (Dec 16, 2014)

Little Al said:


> Here in France the Stihl carbon insert bar is available but you need to take out a mortgage to buy, I don't know of 1 in use as cost is the killer



How much are they? Cost is kind of a relative thing. I buy ES lite bars from the states for less than the cost of standard ES bars in australia.  Im guessing the carbon bar costs less than the ES lite bars do here, From memory close on $500 for an ES lite 36".


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## OlympicYJ (Dec 16, 2014)

Good god that's expensive!


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## imagineero (Dec 16, 2014)

Yeah it's kind of relative again though. We pay $1500 here for saws that cost $500, so they felt the parts and bars ought to be scaled to suit. Chain is about the same price funny enough.


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## OlympicYJ (Dec 16, 2014)

Crying out loud!


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## Little Al (Dec 16, 2014)

imagineero said:


> How much are they? Cost is kind of a relative thing. I buy ES lite bars from the states for less than the cost of standard ES bars in australia. Im guessing the carbon bar costs less than the ES lite bars do here, From memory close on $500 for an ES lite 36".



Some months back when the advertising splurge first appeared our boss inquired the price but at that time the set up was order & the price was guesstimated, at between 265/ 300 euros, but don't know the settled price, which at today's exchange rate is in the region of 402/456 aus $'s, but I have no knowledge of Stihl's market price in Aus, that was based on the French price converted to Aus $'s, as we can get 2 Sugi's + shrapnel change, it for us is a non starter as a living has to be made from our cutting


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## imagineero (Dec 16, 2014)

That's pricey for sure. We all have to make a living from our cutting, but it's a relative thing. If I can get a year out of a bar and it only costs an extra $200 over a standard but is a lot nicer to handle, I don't mind missing out on the $4 a week. My back is worth something. In reality, you can price that sort of thing into a job and not miss out on any money at all. Bars and chains are way down there on the list of expenses to keep the show on the road.


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## Little Al (Dec 16, 2014)

imagineero said:


> That's pricey for sure. We all have to make a living from our cutting, but it's a relative thing. If I can get a year out of a bar and it only costs an extra $200 over a standard but is a lot nicer to handle, I don't mind missing out on the $4 a week. My back is worth something. In reality, you can price that sort of thing into a job and not miss out on any money at all. Bars and chains are way down there on the list of expenses to keep the show on the road.



The sugi's I was referring to are the lightweight jobbies & we are getting approx 3 times the use over the best of Blount products; & they seem to out last a Stihl bar by between 5 to 8 weeks in our usage, as we are paying slightly less for them than stihl's cost, that's the way we're going. As you say it's relative to your needs & you can factor in the costs, but our concern would be the non proven performance of the carbon insert bar, to quote our boss " Let some one else do the R&D & then we'll go from there" Not saying they are not good/good but unwilling to risk big Euro's to find out. As in the old adage " you pays your money & makes your choice".


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## hammerlogging (Dec 16, 2014)

imagineero said:


> That's pricey for sure. We all have to make a living from our cutting, but it's a relative thing. If I can get a year out of a bar and it only costs an extra $200 over a standard but is a lot nicer to handle, I don't mind missing out on the $4 a week. My back is worth something. In reality, you can price that sort of thing into a job and not miss out on any money at all. Bars and chains are way down there on the list of expenses to keep the show on the road.


Yeah thats the truth!


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