# HELP: I need advice for my trees



## roscoemix (Aug 28, 2006)

I want to feed / fertilize several species of mature trees around my residence . . where can I go for no nonsense - straight forward advice on the how's & what's ? web sites, books, publications, etc.


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## woodville (Aug 28, 2006)

roscoemix said:


> I want to feed / fertilize several species of mature trees around my residence . . where can I go for no nonsense - straight forward advice on the how's & what's ? web sites, books, publications, etc.


I'd try ArboristSite.com I hear It's pretty good. Seriously if your trees are mature their is not much the homeowner can do without special equipment or products. Your only do it yourself option is granular fertilizer but for large trees I don't recommend it. Your best bet is to call a professional tree co. and get quotes for deep root fertilization


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## Themadd1 (Sep 12, 2006)

I agree with "wood" Our company uses a deep root fertilizer mix of mycorihzae spores, benefiticial bacteria and a 27-9-9 fert mix. Our fert portion is fairly low compared to the rest of the mixture. We pump this mix into the ground about 4in deep and it covers the area fairly well at high psi. 

Your best result will come from the following.

1. Be sure your root flare is uncovered, no dirt or mulch on the flare, this helps keep down flare rot, fungus, and mold growing on the most delicate part of your tree. 

2. Remove all grass out to the edge of the canopy or drip line to help the roots you have get all the water and nutrients in the soil. 

3. Mulch the area under the tree with a high nutrient type of mulch. Black medalion, (high in organics)

4. Get a soil test to find out what minerals and nutrients your soil is lacking. Check online for testing sites and prices under "soil testing facilities"

5. A good pruning to remove deadwood, and lighten the limbs, as well as thinning of the crown.

6. There are commercial products available at your local mega stores that have mychor, bacteria, and ferts. I would recommend soil drenching for your situation to help get these into the soil. Spread the product around the area you are trying to maintain, and slowly water it into the soil. By slow you do not want the product to runoff. You should also water it into the soil for a few days, or over time. The mycorihzae should be in spore form so you dont have to worry about high loss. These fungus in active form will die off due to drying and sunlight. 


Your goal should be to put the tree in an environment that is as close to an untouched wooded environment as possible. 

Good luck


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## M.D. Vaden (Sep 12, 2006)

My trend is with the mycorrhizae also. Although I'm not much of a fertilizer person.

My page of comment is...

Tree feeding / Mycorrhizae Page

I am not anti-fertilizer, but am not for it much at all, unless the soil is deficient.

Fertilizers, even organics, can produce salts that damage beneficial microorganisms.


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## Themadd1 (Sep 13, 2006)

As mentioned about the fertilizer I usually do a soil test before adding anything to the soil. I know, I know... There is a lot of research out there on fertilizers these days, beneficial or damaging. The only time I would just inject without soil testing, which is about 20% of the time, is when I look at the light brown soil that has been compacted for years and from experience just know the soil is lacking. Alot of customers have 2'-3' diameter oaks or maples in their yards with no soil amending for years. The worst are the trees with dog runs in the vacinity. It seems all of these customers have no idea how damaging this practice is for their trees.


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## Kneejerk Bombas (Sep 13, 2006)

What do the dog runs do, cause areas too high in nitrogen?


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## treeseer (Sep 14, 2006)

"light brown soil that has been compacted for years and from experience just know the soil is lacking."

if it is compacted, it is lacking air, right? How effective is the injector at correcting compaction?


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## Ekka (Sep 14, 2006)

Any chance of some pics mate?


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## Themadd1 (Sep 14, 2006)

Two responses... The dog run creates compaction not neccesarily high nitrogen from waste. In the city lots are small. This in turn creates a small environment for children and dogs. I have seen most of the trees I inject with fertilizer, WITHOUT testing first, (I test most customers before soil injection) have been compacted by little feet for years. Dry ligh soil with little or no nutrient. 

The second response. 
I inject at 200 PSI at the tip which really breaks up the soil layer. Some say this method can disrupt animal life in the soil but I have consulted with many experts, and they agree the benefits outweight the consequences. I can actually feel the ground raise under my feet as I inject the product at least two inches. That tells me I am doing alot of aeration as well as injection. There are great products out on the commercial market for this type of application. 

Personally, I use spores, not active fungus, during my applications. The result takes longer, but the spores survive in the soil longer than living fungus. Since the fungus has to form a symbiotic relationship with tree roots, the tree root has to be extremely close active fungi for them to survive. By using spores I can inject and walk away, over time the spores will spring to life when the roots grow into the area. The other benefit is I only need to inject the spores once and then in future years manage their levels. Saving me money on materials next year.

Themadd1


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## Kneejerk Bombas (Sep 15, 2006)

I would be very surprised if the dog run areas weren't very high in nitrogen, so high in fact, that grass can't grow. Especially after the spring thaw.
The other thing you mentioned is aeration from high pressure fertilizing. The soil does lift up, but it tends to open up along existing horizontal fracture lines and then settle right back together. I recall hearing about some work where they fertilized and then dig into the areas to expose the soil profile. They found very little aeration.
Fertilizing is a cash cow for tree services. So much so, it's hard to look at fertilizing critically. Years back when the industry decided Nitrogen applications did more damage than good, they needed a good way to justify fertilizing, and they came up with the aeration idea, mychoriza, beneficial bacteria, low fertilizer fertilizing, deep feeding, and a few other justifications to continue to milk the cow.
I have free access to spray rigs set up to deep root fertilize, with all the latest products, and I have several mature trees on my lot. I have no interest in using any of it.


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## M.D. Vaden (Sep 15, 2006)

Mike Maas said:


> Fertilizing is a cash cow for tree services. So much so, it's hard to look at fertilizing critically. Years back when the industry decided Nitrogen applications did more damage than good, they needed a good way to justify fertilizing, and they came up with the aeration idea, mychoriza, beneficial bacteria, low fertilizer fertilizing, deep feeding, and a few other justifications to continue to milk the cow.
> I have free access to spray rigs set up to deep root fertilize, with all the latest products, and I have several mature trees on my lot. I have no interest in using any of it.



That's why my site's tree feeding page, refers to fertilizer trucks, being like kegs on wheels in many cases.

It is a cash cow for many tree companies.


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## treeseer (Sep 16, 2006)

M.D. Vaden said:


> That's why my site's tree feeding page, refers to fertilizer trucks, being like kegs on wheels in many cases.
> 
> It is a cash cow for many tree companies.



It's a good service if done right, but too often it is not. I've seen trees killed by excessive fertilizing, and I don't like aquifers polluted (I drink from a well).

Mulch.


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## M.D. Vaden (Sep 16, 2006)

In Oregon, many trees under "fertilizing programs" (no real need - just the ritual side of it) tended to have larger leaves and elongated limbs, that became damaged easier when snow fell, or even from rain, when leaves were still on.


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