# Grapple truck--Yes or No?



## Sunrise Guy (Oct 18, 2007)

Well, for many different reasons I've talked myself out of buying a chipper and a chipper truck or a bucket truck. In taking a good, long look at the gigs I work, I have found that none of the above would make a big difference in time saved and/or ease of completing a job, some climbing, nothwithstanding, when it comes to the bucket. Now I'm starting to get the idea that a grapple truck might make a big difference. The way I see it, as I watch the city pick up fairly large loads at curbside on brush pick-up day, in a matter of seconds, a grapple truck with an eleven to fifteen foot box would see me spending up to two hours less on any given job: Just have my groundies haul to the curb and then lift the complete load, spend a few minutes raking and blowing and then off to dump.
OK, what do you guys think of a grapple truck? Do any of you work 'em for your in-city gigs or do you think of them as overkill? All info and ideas are appreciated.
Related matter: Some recent clients have specifically asked if I chip on site. They were concerned with airbourne wood particles, fungal spores and bacteria that are more likely to be released and spread during the chipping process. They wanted to make sure I did not chip on site. In doing a search on Google, there are a few articles that have some anecdotal evidence of the above, but no controlled studies. I have to wonder if this concern will spread in the public via our alarmist media and make me very happy that I did not invest in the chipper route. Hmmm---Days of $500 used BC1250 chippers coming down the pipe?


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## kkottemann (Oct 18, 2007)

Sunrise, my outfit is a grapple truck. I really do like it and it is a must when dealing with big wood. Also I haul tree length to some mills and get a return on some of the crane work I do. the one important thing to remember is you just cannot haul as much volume of brush, wood ect... without chipping it. If dump costs are high in your area, get set up with a chip truck, If not get a loader and be done with it. As far as clients worried about air particles, tell them to go inside when you work. I cannot stand a client who is that involved in my operation, you sell it and do the job as you see fit. Also when loading into a truck with a loader it is really important that the brush and wood be stacked really neatly. If the groundies just throw the brush into a big pile you will catch hell trying to load it. I like my pile 4feet long by 4 feet high. I can pick that up and pack it neatly into the truck.


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## Wolfking42084 (Oct 18, 2007)

Sunrise,
one thing i have been considering is a grapple trailer from like hudson forest products. i have a 03' super duty 9' dump to pull it with. the way i see it is you could load the trailer the grapple sits on and then the truck that i would be pulling it with. anything firewood logs over 4" go to the old man anyways, could load those in the truck and brush in the trailer.


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## Sunrise Guy (Oct 18, 2007)

kkottemann said:


> Sunrise, my outfit is a grapple truck. I really do like it and it is a must when dealing with big wood. Also I haul tree length to some mills and get a return on some of the crane work I do. the one important thing to remember is you just cannot haul as much volume of brush, wood ect... without chipping it. If dump costs are high in your area, get set up with a chip truck, If not get a loader and be done with it. As far as clients worried about air particles, tell them to go inside when you work. I cannot stand a client who is that involved in my operation, you sell it and do the job as you see fit. Also when loading into a truck with a loader it is really important that the brush and wood be stacked really neatly. If the groundies just throw the brush into a big pile you will catch hell trying to load it. I like my pile 4feet long by 4 feet high. I can pick that up and pack it neatly into the truck.



Thanks! Good info. The dump costs here are very low. I can unload a 16'x6'x4' trailer for $10 at some of the yards here. I imagine the dump cost for a grapple box will be a bit higher, but chips are charged by volume here, so as long as I compact my grapple load with the heavier stuff on top that a chipper couldn't do anyway, I imagine the costs will be similar.


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## sloth9669 (Oct 18, 2007)

*dump/grapple*

Anyone on here own a trailer /dump/grapple ? If so how do they work and how much can they carry...seems the way to go for small or medium usage.


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## Canyonbc (Oct 18, 2007)

I use to use a 5x8x4 single axle trailer...we would load brush then go back in with a saw and saw the heck out of it...normally a cross pattern...making 8 inch sq.'s now this isnt excat but you get the point.....

It really compacts the stuff...we would put a bull line through the bottom and tie it up running bowline...

My local dump site would let us hook it up to there D-9...and then give it a good yank...i post a pic.


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## Panama (Oct 18, 2007)

Sunrise, I run a grapple/dump (14' bed) as my chip truck. We run a small crew so it is one less vehicle. Chip the limbs, drop the wood on top. Pull a BC2000 w/grapple with it and haul the multiOne mini-loader w/top notch grapple in a dump trailer with a pickup. On larger jobs we can leave the loader in a back yard and haul with the dump trailer also. I waited to find a grapple truck that was short enough to work in busy neighborhoods, and it has worked out well. I still need to improve on the chip containment, but will tackle that this winter.


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## John464 (Oct 18, 2007)

A grapple truck IMO is for logs only. Brush should be seperate and compacted with a chipper and shot into a chipper truck. For us we normally do multiple jobs a day and the idea is to get as much as you can in each truck. For removal days rows of logs stacked up in one truck and load of chips in the other. On pruning you dont need to haul the log truck.

For us we use a skid loader instead of a grapple truck, because one, they eat too much fuel due to their weight. Two, because, a skid loader can manuever right where the wood is at and a grapple truck has more access limitation.

I think you need a truck and chipper before anything else. That's the basic start of a tree co.


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## Dadatwins (Oct 18, 2007)

Grapple trucks are very versatile, and a must have in a storm situation. Pulling up to a tangled up mess of wind blown brush and logs with a chipper truck makes for a long day. A grapple will make short work of it. The capacity of the grapple truck will never equal chipping. the flip side is the chipper will never be able to lift or chip what the grapple can. I would say it really depends on the dump situation and how they handle debris. I use a dump trailer and while it does not fit as much material as a chipper, it is cheaper to dump and less expense than a truck & chipper combo. Back to benefit of grapple boom is less cutting of logs and material, the grapple will crush and load in one motion. If you have the dump site available the grapple/ dump makes a good argument.


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## Sunrise Guy (Oct 19, 2007)

I've been doing tree work for five years, so I must respectfully disagree with advice given where a chipper and chipper truck are seen as the basic start of a tree company. Having worked with a chipper crew, I know that chippers are great at reducing a load, and a chipper truck makes dumping very easy. However, there is still the time element involved where the crew is feeding in the brush and then loading the larger logs on the trailer. There is also the safety factor to consider when relying on groundies to not feed themselves into the chipper. Also, lately, customers are specifically requesting that I not chip onsite due to airbourne bacteria, fungi, sawdust, etc., and the noise factor. When I've watched grapple trucks in action, the removal of large loads is insanely fast and easy, limitted only by the skill of the grapple operator. I have never worked any of my own gigs where my ground crew did not haul the complete load to the curb before loading and reducing it on my trailers. With a grapple truck, I would save anywhere from one to two hours of loading and reducing time. If I went the chipper route, I would still save a good amount of time using a grapple truck instead, as I see it, at this point. As I start checking out grapple trucks, I may change my mind again, if I cannot find a truck that will be small enough to comfortably manuever into my job sites. Has anyone here seen the Southco removable-top chipper/grapple truck combo in action? I guess that model is too new to find a lower-priced used unit, but perhaps in a couple of years that will be possible.


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## kkottemann (Oct 19, 2007)

Sunrise, grapple trucks are great for starting out. As said earlier it is all I currently have plus stumper. A grapple truck is a great tool, also good for reaching up onto houses and lifting tree tops off. I have a medium sized truck and struggle in some areas sometimes. I did have a chipper for a while and blew chips into it. If I had the good credit and start up money I had now that I had when I got set up I would do it differently however. I am really impressed with a package Southco truck sales puts togather. It is a knuckle boom loader which folds behind the cab of the truck with a seat on it. Behind that is a chip body with a removable top. This to me is the way to go. Take the top off and use the truck simply as a typical grapple truck. Or, put the top on and chip into it. You can remove the top with the loader. It is a really nice truck, and If you have the money I would recomend you go with this kind of set up. When customers are concerned about the chipping issue, just load her up with the loader. When that is not an issue, chip away. Southco has a really nice website, Check it out. I think you could get into that set up for around 63K or so, but I am not sure. Also you could shop around and buy a used truck, get it to them and have them put the loader and body on for mabe 2/3 of that. then when you can get a 12" chipper to pull behind it. If I could have taken this advice 4 years ago I would have. good luck.


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## Dadatwins (Oct 19, 2007)

One other thing to look at when shopping for a grapple truck is the claw configuration. A bypass type will work best for logs and brush and can help 'pinch' on trees as you piece them down. A scoop type grapple works best on dirt and stump grinding. Also look for something with a 360 degree rotation in the grapple and main boom. There are many safety advantages to the units, but they do take some operational skill. I have seen many novices blow grapple hoses trying to pack up brush. Bad day to have 20-30 gallons hydraulic oil all over the road. I have run a prentice 120 for years and they are an amazing unit. I really like the extend unit that gives an extra 6' on the boom when needed. I like the southco units, have never run one but I like the setup. For the ultimate combo, a southco dump with grapple, towing a trailer with a bobcat grapple to get in the back yards. As I said if you have the dump site available to take the brush and logs a grapple would make a great addition.


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## mikecross23 (Oct 25, 2007)

Loader For Sure!!!

I bought a Dump trailor first, then a tractor, we would slice and dice and pack and, well crap that was terrible! We did stuff a lot in, but the wear on the saws and mostly me and my men was awful. I used to sub out so many loads to larger tree co's that I could have easily made the payment and driver salary. After 4 years I was finacially stable enough I bought this old loader. . .







I paid $25K, repainted it, worked over the mechanics and run it hard. If you buy one don't go cheap like I did because you will only get a mechanical nightmare. Spend more on a better truck and save down time and many costly repair bills.


Mike


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## mikecross23 (Oct 25, 2007)

Here it is in use...


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## Canyonbc (Oct 25, 2007)

Just Wondering...

what type of problems have you experienced...well let me get more specific, problems with the truck it self...or the grapple unit???

How much can a grapple truck like that pick??


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## Canyonbc (Oct 25, 2007)

Does anyone make a hooklift truck...that has a grapple unit too...???

Just Wondering..

Not trying to steal/change the tread.


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## mikecross23 (Oct 25, 2007)

Canyonbc said:


> Just Wondering...
> 
> what type of problems have you experienced...well let me get more specific, problems with the truck it self...or the grapple unit???
> 
> How much can a grapple truck like that pick??



The main problem is the truck is just old and tired.

The prentice grapple unit is old and tired but really doesn't give any abnormal problems. Leaks hydro oil (typical) and every once in a while will bust a grapple hose (keep spares on truck.)

I don't know the lift capacity but to give you a guesstimation it will load 18' pine logs with a girth of about 20"-25". What is that about 2000 lbs. The farther out the grapple the less it will pick up.

The other stupid thing about this truck is the box is way too big for a single axle chasis. DOT popped my driver weighing in at 5K over weight and he said it wasn't even stuffed.

We load the bottom with logs and top and pack with brush and try to be carefull the best possible.

Someone once told me that DOT is a cost of doing business. Bad attitude, you be the judge. We just take the back roads. 

Mike


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## Canyonbc (Oct 25, 2007)

Gotcha...they have a life on them...and thats how she goes i guess..

I agree though...loading the logs first then brush and taking back roads is the best you can do...

That a fair pick on it...had no idea on them. 

Looking at everything...i still think a hook lift truck might be the best. Can chip into it...throw logs right in...or have a mini skid load it up...or larger...for bigger stuff.

but everyone situation is different. 

P.s. 
I like the pics...the truck looks older but good.


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## mikecross23 (Oct 26, 2007)

True, I like the SouthCo chip/loader truck idea. My budget is limited. 

I rent a 12" chipper every now and then and chips are great and all, but I don't like the noise. 

One day I would love to have a 18"-20" beast of a chipper and a dedicated chip box truck. A BIG chip box truck!!! That would make it worth while.

Until then I'll just have to run that loader into the ground.

Time for bed. . .

Mike


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## treepres1 (Oct 26, 2007)

*grapple truck*

hey miles, just like most have said if you have cheap dump fees,you can do great with a grapple .the time ,wear and tear you save on your equit.and men .you will kill frontyard removals.you can also sub contact hauling from other tree companys or weekend warriors.besides having 4 chippers and trucks for sale .we have 4 grapple trucks 4 sale some behind the cab ,one rear mount and 1 short wheel base rear mount with no body its set up to pull a 22 ft. dump trailer.:greenchainsaw:


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## Canyonbc (Oct 26, 2007)

Treepres1

Ya dump cost is a real valid point...i dont think mine are cheap enough to make is feesible to have a chipper truck...

if you do have cheap dump site....its a match made in heaven


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## Rftreeman (Oct 26, 2007)

what do I think of them, I think that when I can afford one, I'll buy the thing and get rid of the chipper, I don't pay much to get rid of brush and stuff so it would be beneficial in the long run to have.


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## ropensaddle (Oct 26, 2007)

My old mack I would part with a toe or a finger before
my grapple it looks like hel? old r modle twin screw mad max looking
but the 18 foot bed with 7 foot sides I can stuff all We cut in a day
on there most times and don't dread cleanup. Back yard jobs kill me
now and I charge twice for them if can't get bucket and grapple to
it!!!!


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