# Husqvarna 450 or Dolmar 421?



## LittleLebowski (Apr 22, 2016)

_Please _don't say "just find one of these XYZ saw's for the same price used" unless you have an actual link for said deal.

I'm a hard working homeowner with a few acres and lots and lots of wood to cut. My trees rarely get over one foot in width. I have two wood stoves. I want a saw I can rely upon. I want a manufacturer that will stand behind their saw. I don't want to tinker with the saw, I want to work. I don't have spare time to fiddle with stuff. I'd like to do not much more or just sharpen chains, replace chains, add fluids, check air the filter. I will clean the bar, check the spark plug, etc.

I don't want "buy XYZ saw for cheap and learn how to maintain it" as an answer. I don't have spare time to fiddle with something. 

I have a local Husqvarna dealer. I have made contact with a Dolmar dealer on here that I trust.


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## rageej (Apr 22, 2016)

Due to your " no fiddle policy" your only option is a Husqvarna because that is your local dealer. For someone who doesn't work on their own equipment dealer support is mandatory. Having someone somewhere else just means you will pay shipping and handling should the saw need attention beyond regular maintenance. The owners manual will outline maintenance and the prescribed schedule. If you do not follow these procedures you will have wasted your money and have a really nice door stop. Things like greasing the roller bearings, edging the bar, cleaning the bar oiler holes, spark plugs and cleaning the saw after use are just a few of the things required to maintain a chainsaw so it lasts. Perhaps you knew all of this but it doesn't hurt to point it out just in case. As far as which saw for your purpose just about any 50cc saw will do. Actually you could get away with a 40cc class saw but I personally would opt for a 50cc class saw. They weigh about the same and offer more in terms of performance. 


Sent using mental telepathy.


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## computeruser (Apr 22, 2016)

421 is probably the better saw, but the lack of a local dealer would concern me if it was my only saw.


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## LittleLebowski (Apr 22, 2016)

rageej said:


> Due to your " no fiddle policy" your only option is a Husqvarna because that is your local dealer. For someone who doesn't work on their own equipment dealer support is mandatory. Having someone somewhere else just means you will pay shipping and handling should the saw need attention beyond regular maintenance. The owners manual will outline maintenance and the prescribed schedule. If you do not follow these procedures you will have wasted your money and have a really nice door stop. Things like greasing the roller bearings, edging the bar, cleaning the bar oiler holes, spark plugs and cleaning the saw after use are just a few of the things required to maintain a chainsaw so it lasts. Perhaps you knew all of this but it doesn't hurt to point it out just in case. As far as which saw for your purpose just about any 50cc saw will do. Actually you could get away with a 40cc class saw but I personally would opt for a 50cc class saw. They weigh about the same and offer more in terms of performance.



I should have added that in the first post, I will indeed do basic maintenance like you detailed. 

I don't mind going with the Dolmar and the possible shipping to a dealer if it is the better saw.


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## LittleLebowski (Apr 22, 2016)

Additionally, am I correct in assuming that the 450 would run better with an 18" bar over a 20" bar for my needs?


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## rageej (Apr 22, 2016)

Any saw will run better the shorter the bar. It requires less power to run a smaller bar, less chain being pulled around the bar and through the wood. Also the narrower the chain the less power required. So... Yes you are correct


Sent using mental telepathy.


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## Franny K (Apr 22, 2016)

How did you have in mind getting the 421 as to the chain and sprocket? Not so familiar with the Husqvarna 450. The dolmar has an inboard clutch hence easy access able sprocket. There is a 6 tooth 3/8lp that might be "stock", a spur 0.325, and as you may have read on here the ability to use a rim drive set up so long as a tiny shim is used. That effects what bar it comes with as well. Neither design is intended to run 7 teeth 3/8 lp like say the Sthil 251 could be set up.

I think both should work fine without fussing.


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## rageej (Apr 22, 2016)

I don't own a Dolmar saw. This realization has me sad... *begins looking for used Dolmar saws*. 


Sent using mental telepathy.


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## Franny K (Apr 22, 2016)

rageej said:


> I don't own a Dolmar saw. This realization has me sad... *begins looking for used Dolmar saws*.
> 
> 
> Sent using mental telepathy.


They have some new models stuck getting epa approval and I believe there is approx 40cc somewhat lighter one that has been discussed on here but I do not see it on the Dolmar website.


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## LittleLebowski (Apr 22, 2016)

Franny K said:


> How did you have in mind getting the 421 as to the chain and sprocket? Not so familiar with the Husqvarna 450. The dolmar has an inboard clutch hence easy access able sprocket. There is a 6 tooth 3/8lp that might be "stock", a spur 0.325, and as you may have read on here the ability to use a rim drive set up so long as a tiny shim is used. That effects what bar it comes with as well. Neither design is intended to run 7 teeth 3/8 lp like say the Sthil 251 could be set up.
> 
> I think both should work fine without fussing.



Stock for now, for a long while.


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## Franny K (Apr 22, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> Stock for now, for a long while.


A lot of talk on here is about dealer and service. I do not generally need service but often want it set up somewhat different than "stock" and that is where dealer makes a difference. As you may have read on here many dealers set the 421 up with 0.325. They are all going to be overly busy the day after a hurricane. I was pointing to the different drive and cutting attachment that probably is on the two choices you put here. If you are going to cut under 12 inch stuff the small bore version of the Dolmar 421, the 351 with the 6 tooth low profile "stock sprocket" should be sufficient. I have one of those and it starts great, warms up quick, shuts off easy, holds a lot of fuel.


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## svk (Apr 22, 2016)

450 is a real nice saw. 

But I'm confused, I thought you wanted something significantly lighter than your 5020? These saws are of higher quality but roughly the same weight of your Poulan.


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## Ryan'smilling (Apr 23, 2016)

I'll mention something about dealers. I have a local Stihl dealership in my town. I'd never even begin to consider bringing either of my Stihl saws to them for service. Not in a million years. I buy parts from them, sure, but they'd have no problem charging a guy $100 bucks and not fixing what was wrong with something. 

I think you'll have much better luck figuring out what's wrong with a saw and getting it fixed working with the dealers who participate here. 2-strokes are simple creatures. Chances are low that you'll have a problem with that Dolmar, but if you do, I'm sure the seller will help you figure it out. Many local dealerships are like my stihl dealer. They certainly aren't all created equally.

So, yes, having a local husky dealer is nice, but unless they're a really great dealer, they are only a fraction as good as the dealers on here.


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## rageej (Apr 23, 2016)

Ryan'smilling said:


> I'll mention something about dealers. I have a local Stihl dealership in my town. I'd never even begin to consider bringing either of my Stihl saws to them for service. Not in a million years. I buy parts from them, sure, but they'd have no problem charging a guy $100 bucks and not fixing what was wrong with something.
> 
> I think you'll have much better luck figuring out what's wrong with a saw and getting it fixed working with the dealers who participate here. 2-strokes are simple creatures. Chances are low that you'll have a problem with that Dolmar, but if you do, I'm sure the seller will help you figure it out. Many local dealerships are like my stihl dealer. They certainly aren't all created equally.
> 
> So, yes, having a local husky dealer is nice, but unless they're a really great dealer, they are only a fraction as good as the dealers on here.


I have to admit, I have met small engine dealers who reminded me of car dealers. I am currently working on an 026 which the guy was charged about $60 from one of the dealers and I can find absolutely no evidence of the saw being worked on. For this area we do have reputable dealers though, even if a couple of the others are crooked as hell. I am not a dealer so I don't know what all goes into it but it seems to me it is more to do with character than profession.


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## LittleLebowski (Apr 23, 2016)

svk said:


> 450 is a real nice saw.
> 
> But I'm confused, I thought you wanted something significantly lighter than your 5020? These saws are of higher quality but roughly the same weight of your Poulan.



That was when the Poulan was running. Now, I just want *one good saw*.


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## GeorgiaVol (Apr 23, 2016)

For $400 you can go to the local Wal-Mart pick up a brand new PP5020 use it till the warranty runs out. Any problems during that time just go back and exchange it. After the first ones warranty runs out, if it screws up again, buy a 2nd. That's 6 months to do what ever clearing you need to do at least with no worries to any malfunctions.


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## LittleLebowski (Apr 23, 2016)

GeorgiaVol said:


> For $400 you can go to the local Wal-Mart pick up a brand new PP5020 use it till the warranty runs out. Any problems during that time just go back and exchange it. After the first ones warranty runs out, if it screws up again, buy a 2nd. That's 6 months to do what ever clearing you need to do at least with no worries to any malfunctions.



I'd rather have *one good saw*.


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## GeorgiaVol (Apr 23, 2016)

I've had mine over 3 years with zero issues other than a slight tune.


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## GeorgiaVol (Apr 23, 2016)

I even used it to cut up a hedge apple tree


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## LittleLebowski (Apr 23, 2016)

GeorgiaVol said:


> I've had mine over 3 years with zero issues other than a slight tune.



Roger that and I'm told that I'm an anomaly but I would like to use this opportunity to get something with support, not something I can return to Walmart when it starts running poorly. My guns work perfectly, my computers work perfectly, my trucks runs great, and so on.


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## GeorgiaVol (Apr 23, 2016)

Well advice is free, do what you want. I always have a tight budget, so my suggestions reflect that. Lol, one of my most dependable saws is a 70s Homelite Super XL Automatic. I picked it up for $8. That thing is nearly indestructible. It always runs.


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## LittleLebowski (Apr 23, 2016)

I appreciate the advice but if I have the money, a new saw with a solid dealer backing it as opposed to Walmart seems like a no brainer. The chat I had with my local dealer about Poulan's "warranty" was pretty sobering. I'd really like to use this opportunity to "buy once, cry once" not "buy twice, cry twice."


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## Chris-PA (Apr 23, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> My guns work perfectly, my computers work perfectly, my trucks runs great, and so on.


I'm going to take a wild guess and suggest that they work perfectly because you understand how they work and how to maintain/repair them, and so you make sure they do. This is what I've been telling you - saws are fussy and no saw will be bulletproof unless you gain the knowledge to keep them running. It's the knowledge that makes the saw reliable. I certainly understand not having enough time, as I'm perpetually in that situation too. 

My saws are mostly old, many were put together for multiple old saws, and most are considered total junk here anyways. But for the most part they all start and run well and reliably, and when some little thing goes wrong I can fix it fast, often from boxes of spare parts. But it took a while to get to that point, and it's not an investment many will want to make. Just like trucks or computors, you either do it yourself or pay someone else to keep them working, along with the inconvenience and associated cost.

In fairness to the Poulan, it wasn't new and so your experience is likely not representative.


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## LittleLebowski (Apr 23, 2016)

Actually, I'd jettison a vehicle, gun, or computer that was finicky. However, I have the experience and training to pick the right ones and like you said, I do indeed have the knowledge to fix them when needed. I'll probably pick up that knowledge with regards to chainsaw as well. However, right now I believe that buying a saw from a dealer like F150 will help me actually work on my property instead of tinkering on my work bench.


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## 7sleeper (Apr 23, 2016)

With fordf150 on your team there is hardly anything that can deter you on your path! For me it would be a no brainer and I would get the 421. 

As for the comments on "local dealer", I find that totally useless! How often does one ever really need a dealer. If you like going there for a coffee and a chat and proclaim it was needed that is fine for me, but beyond REAL pro's who work with their saw 10/5 I hardly ever see the need for a dealer IF you do your part on maintenance. 

7


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## LittleLebowski (Apr 23, 2016)

I'll do my part and appreciate the post, 7Sleeper.


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## GeorgiaVol (Apr 23, 2016)

Well keep me posted, because if you find a saw you can use everyday that never needs maintenance I will be first in line to get one.


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## LittleLebowski (Apr 23, 2016)

GeorgiaVol said:


> Well keep me posted, because if you find a saw you can use everyday that never needs maintenance I will be first in line to get one.



I'm not certain that I said those words, GeorgiaVol but I am certain I've said I would do basic maintenance and can find and quote those posts from myself if you don't believe me. I understand that you are saying that the 5020 can do the job and other saws aren't more reliable than that but I've done my best emphasize my focus on working with a good dealer. I also understand that you think I'm wasting money but it's mine to waste and to me, time is money. If the 421 or 450 keep me working longer with fewe interruptions, I consider that money saved. I mean, it's not like I didn't try to fix this 5020 and it's not like said effort to fix it isn't publicly documented for the whole world to see on this site.


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## sunfish (Apr 23, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> The chat I had with my local dealer about Poulan's "warranty" was pretty sobering.


Should take with a grain of salt. A different dealer would likely have a different story.


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## GeorgiaVol (Apr 23, 2016)

Not saying that at all. Simply saying you don't have time to learn how to repair one because you have too much work to do. Means whatever you do get will be run hard and constant. So if you find one that does not require repairs under those conditions I want one. Keep me posted.


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## 7sleeper (Apr 23, 2016)

GeorgiaVol said:


> Well keep me posted, because if you find a saw you can use everyday that never needs maintenance I will be first in line to get one.


Typical demonstration of being unable to comprehend/understand what someone before has written.

To recolect, he is looking for a saw to cut some firewood and a few trees to change his property the way he likes it. This is light years away from production felling, with daily use, where time lost is money lost and the better dealers might have a spare saw at hand during repair.


Something I might add to the original question and answers. Forget the discussion about what setup on chaintype (325 or 3/8h) and sproket versus ring type, this is absolutely idiotic talk for a beginner who, no offense meant littlelebowski, has no idea how to correctly tune a saw and I assume also has problems getting a chain correctly sharpened with the rakers set a correct height with the correct tension, etc.! So littlelebowski you can simply ignore all that smart talk and just focus on a saw in the 40 -50 cc/2.5-3.5hp range with a 16 inch bar what YOU like. And after about two or three worn through sprokets = ~12 - 16 chains you can come back and we can talk again which setup you would like to try out. Any saw mentioned will be MORE than sufficient for trees averaging 1 foot diametre.

7


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## GeorgiaVol (Apr 23, 2016)

Read my response. I did not use my sarcastic font so let me know what saw meets his criteria and I want one. No belittling intended.


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## rageej (Apr 23, 2016)

I think we have got side tracked here, he stated he would do the outlined maintenance on whatever saw he buys. Regardless of which saw he buys the owners manual will detail the maintenance and the schedule. At least every Husqvarna, Dolmar and Stihl owners manual I have read does. He has also stated that he isn't opposed to getting a saw from someone on this site rather than the dealer. So the question remains as to which saw should he buy, new (because that is what he wants). 

I will post some information about the saws from Husqvarna in just a moment. 


Sent using mental telepathy.


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## GeorgiaVol (Apr 23, 2016)

Yes I apologize if I offended someone. It was not intended. I guess I should have chosen my words more carefully.


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## 7sleeper (Apr 23, 2016)

@GeorgiaVol ,

I might also have to appologize for my words. 

7


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## rageej (Apr 23, 2016)

Husqvarna 440

40.9 cc
9.7 lbs PHO (powerhead only)
.325" .050 gauge chain
OM (owner's manual) details safety, operating procedures, cutting techniques, maintenance procedures, maintenance schedule and basic trouble shooting.
$299.95 msrp w/18" bar
Husqvarna 450

50.2 cc
10.8 lbs PHO
.325" .050 OR .058 gauge chain
OM (owner's manual) details safety, operating procedures, cutting techniques, maintenance procedures, maintenance schedule and basic trouble shooting.
$369.95 msrp w/18" bar
Dolmar 421

42.4 cc
10.8 lbs PHO
3/8" .050 gauge
OM (owner's manual) details safety, operating procedures, cutting techniques, maintenance procedures, maintenance schedule and basic trouble shooting.
$339.99 msrp w/16" bar


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## markintopton (Apr 23, 2016)

Doesn't the Dolmar have a cat muffler ? I'd rather have a strat that a cat.


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## rageej (Apr 23, 2016)

I don't recall the OP voicing any concerns with emissions technology but to answer the question, yes the Dolmar PS-421 has a catalytic converter.


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## GeorgiaVol (Apr 23, 2016)

I know we are discussing these 2 saws, but why are you not considering the $399 CS590 Echo? It has been talked about many times on here for being a great saw. I don't own one but I want one.


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## rageej (Apr 23, 2016)

GeorgiaVol said:


> I know we are discussing these 2 saws, but why are you not considering the $399 CS590 Echo? It has been talked about many times on here for being a great saw. I don't own one but I want one.


I don't own am Echo chainsaw either  *begins searching for used Echos* lol


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## GeorgiaVol (Apr 23, 2016)

I want and looked at one today. Again. Had to wipe the drool off of it and put it back down. CAD man, I got it bad.


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## CoreyB (Apr 23, 2016)

Just look for a used dolmar 421 for sale.


Can't find one?


Hmm mm there may be a reason for that!


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## square1 (Apr 23, 2016)

My huskies have been great trouble free saws year after year after year after....
Given your criteria, buy the 450. That being said, I want a Dolmar bad!


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## LittleLebowski (Apr 23, 2016)

GeorgiaVol said:


> I know we are discussing these 2 saws, but why are you not considering the $399 CS590 Echo? It has been talked about many times on here for being a great saw. I don't own one but I want one.



I'm already pushing my budget hard and also, the aforementioned dealer support.


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## LittleLebowski (Apr 23, 2016)

rageej said:


> I don't recall the OP voicing any concerns with emissions technology but to answer the question, yes the Dolmar PS-421 has a catalytic converter.



Also, removing the cat and richening it up just a bit seems very easily done but I would wait until it's out of warranty first.


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## LittleLebowski (Apr 23, 2016)

Thoughts on the stock chain choices as shipped for the Husqvarna 450 and Dolmar 421?


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## moondoggie (Apr 23, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> Thoughts on the stock chain choices as shipped for the Husqvarna 450 and Dolmar 421?


Buy a rs stihl chain to go with your stock chain. So you have atleast one back up with you.


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## LittleLebowski (Apr 23, 2016)

moondoggie said:


> Buy a rs stihl chain to go with your stock chain. So you have atleast one back up with you.



Oh, I'll buy more than one. I'm just wondering which saw is going to cut the best out of the box and if either needs a change in chain choice.


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## moondoggie (Apr 23, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> Oh, I'll buy more than one. I'm just wondering which saw is going to cut the best out of the box and if either needs a change in chain choice.


Hmmm I cannot comment on the dolmar chain. The husky chain that comes on the saw is good for dirty wood but I really like the stihl .325 rs chains. They made my 445 cut much faster than the husky chain that came with it. I do have 3 husky chains that came with my used 350 I bought. I will use them before I buy any new chains for it.

I may of not been much help .... that's all I know on the topic


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## William Balaska (Apr 23, 2016)

Husqvarna 545 all the way. U can get on on ebay for roughly 400. See mighty mouse. It's a all out commercial machine.


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## rageej (Apr 23, 2016)

So many chain threads, so little time.


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## LittleLebowski (Apr 23, 2016)

William Balaska said:


> Husqvarna 545 all the way. U can get on on ebay for roughly 400. See mighty mouse. It's a all out commercial machine.



You mean a 455, right?


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## William Balaska (Apr 23, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> You mean a 455, right?


No 545.


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## GeorgiaVol (Apr 23, 2016)

How is the survey going? I didn't vote because I'm not familiar with the dolmar so my vote would not be fair


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## LittleLebowski (Apr 23, 2016)

William Balaska said:


> No 545.



Then have you checked eBay recently with regards to your statement that these can be had on eBay for "roughly $400"?


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## LittleLebowski (Apr 23, 2016)

GeorgiaVol said:


> How is the survey going? I didn't vote because I'm not familiar with the dolmar so my vote would not be fair



10 for Dolmar, 6 for Husky.


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## TBS (Apr 23, 2016)

I think you meant 200 for the 5020, thats what they run at sears for the craftsman version.


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## GeorgiaVol (Apr 23, 2016)

Any decision made yet?


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## William Balaska (Apr 23, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> Then have you checked eBay recently with regards to your statement that these can be had on eBay for "roughly $400"?


Yes. I just bought one myself. The ra


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## TBS (Apr 23, 2016)

William Balaska said:


> Yes. I just bought one myself. The ra



Are you picking it up, the one i looked at was 439 with local pickup.


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## LittleLebowski (Apr 23, 2016)

William Balaska said:


> Yes. I just bought one myself. The ra



Sorry, I don't see any on eBay for $450 or less.


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## svk (Apr 23, 2016)

Check with AS member spike60 if you want a 545. I'd bet he'll be in the $400 price range. He can also probably give you a better price on the 450.


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## LittleLebowski (Apr 23, 2016)

GeorgiaVol said:


> Any decision made yet?



Leaning towards the Dolmar unless the vendor I'm returning the Poulan to (that has the Huskys) makes me a good deal.

I like the Dolmar because F150 will ship to me tested and tuned for my elevation. I like the Husky because I have a known good local dealer and I bet that 450 would rip with a 16" bar. I do have an impression that the Dolmar is built tougher which suits my knuckle dragging nature.


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## William Balaska (Apr 23, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> Sorry, I don't see any on eBay for $450 or less.


I see one for $432. Don't cheap out over thirty bucks. Stop playing and start sawing.


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## TBS (Apr 23, 2016)

http://m.ebay.com/itm/Husqvarna-545-Chainsaw-Model-9666486-08-/272211910556?nav=SEARCH


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## CoreyB (Apr 23, 2016)

Nathan lassley said:


> http://m.ebay.com/itm/Husqvarna-545-Chainsaw-Model-9666486-08-/272211910556?nav=SEARCH


Ya local pick up in NY, so add another $30 plus for shipping.


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## CoreyB (Apr 23, 2016)

Oh plus 8% sales tax, and does it even come with a bar and chain? 
The man is on a budget and the 421 is still probably better built with fewer problems and weighs less.


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## LittleLebowski (Apr 23, 2016)

CoreyB said:


> Ya local pick up in NY, so add another $30 plus for shipping.


 So, $462. This is the problem I ran into, folks will say "oh, you can buy this for this price" and when I go look for "this at this price," it ain't there hence my request in the first for _*links*_.


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## LittleLebowski (Apr 23, 2016)

William Balaska said:


> I see one for $432. Don't cheap out over thirty bucks. Stop *playing* and start sawing.



I've worn out a few chains and got blisters from using an axe.


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## William Balaska (Apr 23, 2016)

You can also look at the jred 2252 which is the same saw they are on ebay from a dealer in Ohio. Offer him 400 as thats what I paid for mine from him.I got my 545 for $386 to my door on an auction.


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## LittleLebowski (Apr 24, 2016)

William Balaska said:


> You can also look at the jred 2252 which is the same saw they are on ebay from a dealer in Ohio. Offer him 400 as thats what I paid for mine from him.I got my 545 for $386 to my door on an auction.



I don't appreciate your comment over "playing" when it's my money on the line and furthermore, I'm not finding your statements to be truthful so I won't be reading anything else from you,


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## rageej (Apr 24, 2016)

Let me know how that Dolmar works out, at some point I have to own a Dolmar... right? LOL


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## Franny K (Apr 24, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> Then have you checked eBay recently with regards to your statement that these can be had on eBay for "roughly $400"?


$386 plus extra chain shipping included. Found in completed listings ended April 17. You seem a bit quick on some responses here.

It takes about a 10% fee to sell on ebay and take pay pal. A lot of stuff it the opposite of bottom fishing. We can just speculate what circumstances lead to the low ball prices.


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## William Balaska (Apr 24, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> I don't appreciate your comment over "playing" when it's my money on the line and furthermore, I'm not finding your statements to be truthful so I won't be reading anything else from you,


If you can't handle a little friendly banter you're truly in the wrong place. You should be more careful who you call a liar.
this HTML class. Value is http://m.ebay.com/or item number 141957353115


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## LittleLebowski (Apr 24, 2016)

rageej said:


> Let me know how that Dolmar works out, at some point I have to own a Dolmar... right? LOL



I'm 90% sold on the Dolmar, I'll post my impressions of whatever I get.


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## LittleLebowski (Apr 24, 2016)

Franny K said:


> $386 plus extra chain shipping included. Found in completed listings ended April 17. You seem a bit quick on some responses here.



You're quite right, I didn't search past, finished sales but oh well. I intend to PM the Husky dealer referenced in this thread about his prices. I cannot find 545s in my price range currently.


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## James Miller (Apr 24, 2016)

I vote domar of the 2 choices. But run an echo 590 for fire wood work. Lowes is the only place to buy Husqvarna around here so I won't buy one.


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## moondoggie (Apr 24, 2016)

M-


James Miller said:


> I vote domar of the 2 choices. But run an echo 590 for fire wood work. Lowes is the only place to buy Husqvarna around here so I won't buy one.


my first saw (445)came from lowes. I cut atleast 300 full cords with that saw. It has a new carb and throttle cable and two new sprockets. It's a 2010 model. I never touched the carb once to tune it. It came correct from lowes. FWIW


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## LittleLebowski (Apr 24, 2016)

moondoggie said:


> M-
> 
> my first saw (445)came from lowes. I cut atleast 300 full cords with that saw. It has a new carb and throttle cable and two new sprockets. It's a 2010 model. I never touched the carb once to tune it. It came correct from lowes. FWIW



Did you replace the parts yourself or were they done on warranty?


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## moondoggie (Apr 24, 2016)

I paid the local stihl dealer to do the work. The carb was replaced last year in January I think. I paid the dealer to change the sprockets too. Saw was definatly out of warranty when the carb was replaced and sprockets are a normal maintenance thing. I would get a 445 instead of a 450. My 445 has only wore an 18" bar. I have bucked up dozens and dozens of 30"+ logs with it.


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## LittleLebowski (Apr 24, 2016)

moondoggie said:


> I paid the local stihl dealer to do the work. The carb was replaced last year in January I think. I paid the dealer to change the sprockets too. Saw was definatly out of warranty when the carb was replaced and sprockets are a normal maintenance thing. I would get a 445 instead of a 450. My 445 has only wore an 18" bar. I have bucked up dozens and dozens of 30"+ logs with it.



Why do you recommend the 445 over the 450?


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## moondoggie (Apr 24, 2016)

Lighter/cheaper and it will definitely cut everything you will feel comfortable cutting.


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## TBS (Apr 24, 2016)

moondoggie said:


> Lighter/cheaper and it will definitely cut everything you will feel comfortable cutting.



And you can get basic tune items plus the fuel and oil caps at places like lowes or tractor supply. Imo the sears craftsman pro version of the 445 is a bit nicer for nearly the same price and having the built-in scrench holder is pretty handy.


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## LittleLebowski (Apr 24, 2016)

We'll see, perhaps the vendor I'm dealing with (who sells new and refurbished Husqvarnas) will make me an offer that I cannot refuse.


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## LittleLebowski (Apr 24, 2016)

Voting is 6 for the Husky, 12 for the Dolmar.


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## CR888 (Apr 25, 2016)

At $300 bucks for a Dolmar 421 and the fact if you did not like it after 10tanks members would be fighting over it in the trading post for $250.....it seems like a simple no brainer. Just go buy it.


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## LittleLebowski (Apr 25, 2016)

CR888 said:


> At $300 bucks for a Dolmar 421 and the fact if you did not like it after 10tanks members would be fighting over it in the trading post for $250.....it seems like a simple no brainer. Just go buy it.



Advice like this, do like. Loved your country when I visited.


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## CoreyB (Apr 25, 2016)

CR888 said:


> At $300 bucks for a Dolmar 421 and the fact if you did not like it after 10tanks members would be fighting over it in the trading post for $250.....it seems like a simple no brainer. Just go buy it.


Where is this used 421 at? Share a link please.


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## Franny K (Apr 25, 2016)

CoreyB said:


> Where is this used 421 at? Share a link please.


I viewed the post you quoted as a suggestion should the original poster here not like a 421 he could sell it off for not too much less than it cost.


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## LittleLebowski (Apr 25, 2016)

Franny K said:


> I viewed the post you quoted as a suggestion should the original poster here not like a 421 he could sell it off for not too much less than it cost.



Same here.


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## SCOTTS_4X (Apr 25, 2016)

I vote husky. I have a 450, bought refurbed in oct of last year. I have done a muff mod and put on one of those $14 gb bars from left coast with some Carlton non safety semi chisel (I only cut down trees). I've cut 6-8 cords of wood with this saw so far and I'm stoked. I know it's not a pro saw, has a plastic chassis and clamshell construction, everything you'll be told will make the saw fall apart after the second cut on this site. mine is running flawlessly and relatively strong after the MM and retune, it's nipping at the heels of my brothers cs590. I am meticulous about cleaning and chain sharpening so that may play into my success with this saw, but I would not hesitate to recommend this saw to anyone that will us it as a farm/ranch/firewood saw. just my .02

-scott


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## CoreyB (Apr 25, 2016)

Franny K said:


> I viewed the post you quoted as a suggestion should the original poster here not like a 421 he could sell it off for not too much less than it cost.





LittleLebowski said:


> Same here.


Well shucks I was hoping I could snag a lightly used 421. I got all excited and my hopes all up.


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## MountainHigh (Apr 25, 2016)

CoreyB said:


> Well shucks I was hoping I could snag a lightly used 421. I got all excited and my hopes all up.


hahaha .... good try though!


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## RedneckChainsawRepair (Apr 25, 2016)

Just going from a build stand point. I would vote for the Dolmar. 

I just put a new OEM carb on a 450, being the carb was as cheap as buying a rebuild kit. Next on list for 450 that wasnt used much needing new seals and prob crank bearings.


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## CoreyB (Apr 25, 2016)

MountainHigh said:


> hahaha .... good try though!


That's alright it would have already been gone by the time I responded.


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## LittleLebowski (Apr 25, 2016)

Working on the return, guys. Migraine attack, quite debilitating.


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## quotedraven (Apr 25, 2016)

Buy an echo 400 or 590 online cheapest you can find don't look back


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## Ryan'smilling (Apr 26, 2016)

quotedraven said:


> Buy an echo 400 or 590 online cheapest you can find don't look back



I'm gonna agree and disagree with this.

First, they're two very different saws. The 400 costs as much as a Dolmar 421. You can only get the 400 with an 18" bar, where the 421 comes with a 16". If you want a 16 on the Echo, you have to buy the saw, and then separately buy a second bar and chain (the dealer likely won't swap it for you before the sale). Personally, after considering both of these saws, I chose the 421. It's got a little more displacement, runs great out of the box, and has a loyal following. 

The 590 seems like a great saw to own, but it's a pretty big saw for an only saw. I'd agree that the OP should consider one, but only as a second saw when he runs into wood that is a little big for his Dolmar 421.

Lastly, I'd disagree with your suggestion to buy from the cheapest source online. The OP has voiced a desire for support for his saw after the sale. Buy from a_ good _local dealer or trusted dealer from AS seems like the best way to ensure support down the road. Saving $10-20 isn't worth not having someone to call with questions about your purchase.


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## GeorgiaVol (Apr 26, 2016)

Nah, just get an ole Homelite XL. 26cc's of fury!


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## quotedraven (Apr 26, 2016)

The 490 can be had for $ 350 or less no dealer needed


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## 7sleeper (Apr 26, 2016)

quotedraven said:


> The 490 can be had for $ 350 or less no dealer needed


So around what a Dolmar 421 costs. By the recomendation of a dealer, who sell's both brands, the 421 is the nicer and equally powerful saw. 

7


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## LittleLebowski (Apr 27, 2016)

Ryan'smilling said:


> I'm gonna agree and disagree with this.
> 
> First, they're two very different saws. The 400 costs as much as a Dolmar 421. You can only get the 400 with an 18" bar, where the 421 comes with a 16". If you want a 16 on the Echo, you have to buy the saw, and then separately buy a second bar and chain (the dealer likely won't swap it for you before the sale). Personally, after considering both of these saws, I chose the 421. It's got a little more displacement, runs great out of the box, and has a loyal following.
> 
> ...



Solid advice, thank you. I figure that $15 in shipping to a trusted AS dealer is money well spent if my future 421 ever has a problem.


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## Douglas Wend (Apr 27, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> _Please _don't say "just find one of these XYZ saw's for the same price used" unless you have an actual link for said deal.
> 
> I'm a hard working homeowner with a few acres and lots and lots of wood to cut. My trees rarely get over one foot in width. I have two wood stoves. I want a saw I can rely upon. I want a manufacturer that will stand behind their saw. I don't want to tinker with the saw, I want to work. I don't have spare time to fiddle with stuff. I'd like to do not much more or just sharpen chains, replace chains, add fluids, check air the filter. I will clean the bar, check the spark plug, etc.
> 
> ...


I recently went though similar decision, wanting a solid 40 to 50 cc saw for my 2 acre lot. Mostly stuff under 1 foot, mostly softwoods. After owning a Makita 6421, I decided the extra weight is not worth the trouble. So power/weight is important. Do not under estimate the significance of 1 pound. I have come to value a lighter weight saw and briefly considered a Stihl MS241 but could not justify the extra expense. I am partial to ECHO and Makita/Dolmar brands, but respect Husky and Stihls as well. But to get to your question, I would suggest that the Dolmar is a simpler more rugged piece of gear and would be simpler to maintain over the life of the saw. While the Husky boasts of some nice features, their may be a penalty down the road when you find that replacement parts are more exensive and the increased complexty of the fuel system will require dealer level support at a steep price. This has been true of cars for some time and it appears that outdoor equipment is heading down the same path. I bought a Stihl MS271 a couple of years ago and was disappointed on how stingy it oiled. Went to the dealer and he explained that the EPA had started regulating oil wastes and the Stihl engineers went to work. I wound up selling the saw. So I wound up with a Makita verision of the 421 and "love it." Best saw decision I have made to date. It is right at my limit for a "light, manueverable saw" that I can easily handle in the woods without fatigue. I am 6'3" and in good shape. I just feel that lighter saws are safer for the type of wood cutting I am into. The Makita is powerful for its size, starts easy and runs like a champ. I performed the muffler mod which is pretty easy to do but honestly you would be happy just the way it is. I put a Oregon Pro Lite 16" Bar on it and also have an 18" bar if needed. I kepy my Echo 370 as a backup. Until I prove that I need a larger saw, this may be it for me. So to sum up, go with the 421. Over the life of the saw, it will probably be less expensive to own, I doubt you need a dealer as they are simple but rugged designs.


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## LittleLebowski (Apr 27, 2016)

Douglas Wend said:


> I recently went though similar decision, wanting a solid 40 to 50 cc saw for my 2 acre lot. Mostly stuff under 1 foot, mostly softwoods. After owning a Makita 6421, I decided the extra weight is not worth the trouble. So power/weight is important. Do not under estimate the significance of 1 pound. I have come to value a lighter weight saw and briefly considered a Stihl MS241 but could not justify the extra expense. I am partial to ECHO and Makita/Dolmar brands, but respect Husky and Stihls as well. But to get to your question, I would suggest that the Dolmar is a simpler more rugged piece of gear and would be simpler to maintain over the life of the saw. While the Husky boasts of some nice features, their may be a penalty down the road when you find that replacement parts are more exensive and the increased complexty of the fuel system will require dealer level support at a steep price. This has been true of cars for some time and it appears that outdoor equipment is heading down the same path. I bought a Stihl MS271 a couple of years ago and was disappointed on how stingy it oiled. Went to the dealer and he explained that the EPA had started regulating oil wastes and the Stihl engineers went to work. I wound up selling the saw. So I wound up with a Makita verision of the 421 and "love it." Best saw decision I have made to date. It is right at my limit for a "light, manueverable saw" that I can easily handle in the woods without fatigue. I am 6'3" and in good shape. I just feel that lighter saws are safer for the type of wood cutting I am into. The Makita is powerful for its size, starts easy and runs like a champ. I performed the muffler mod which is pretty easy to do but honestly you would be happy just the way it is. I put a Oregon Pro Lite 16" Bar on it and also have an 18" bar if needed. I kepy my Echo 370 as a backup. Until I prove that I need a larger saw, this may be it for me. So to sum up, go with the 421. Over the life of the saw, it will probably be less expensive to own, I doubt you need a dealer as they are simple but rugged designs.



Fantastic post, thank you!

I plan to stay at 16", what is the number of drive links on the stock setup?


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## Chris-PA (Apr 27, 2016)

Douglas Wend said:


> the increased complexty of the fuel system


I liked your comment, but wanted to correct this point - there is no increased fuel system complexity on this range of Husqvarnas. The strato system uses a typical Zama C1M carb with one extra link to open the air valve.


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## quotedraven (Apr 27, 2016)

7sleeper said:


> So around what a Dolmar 421 costs. By the recomendation of a dealer, who sell's both brands, the 421 is the nicer and equally powerful saw.
> 
> 7


I doubt the 421 a 40 cc equals a 50 cc but that is opinion. I would take the Japanese built engine.


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## LittleLebowski (Apr 27, 2016)

Went ahead and ordered Dolmar 421 from @fordf150, hopefully he will have more in soon.


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## 7sleeper (Apr 27, 2016)

quotedraven said:


> I doubt the 421 a 40 cc equals a 50 cc but that is opinion. I would take the Japanese built engine.


Echo 490 50ccm/2.14kw/2.9 hp
http://www.yamabiko-corp.co.jp/echo_global/products/category_detail/id=3599

Dolmar 421 42ccm/2.2kw/3hp

And the story is not invented by me, but from a dealer who has both brands in his program.

7


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## Douglas Wend (Apr 27, 2016)

Chris-PA said:


> I liked your comment, but wanted to correct this point - there is no increased fuel system complexity on this range of Husqvarnas. The strato system uses a typical Zama C1M carb with one extra link to open the air valve.


Thanks for the correction. I was relying too much on a amazon review and checked with a local dealer and your correct. I withdrwa my statement about complexity, however Husk makes a lot of marketing claims that might cause one to wonder about reliability. Having said this, I have no data too support this concern beyond my awareness of increasing complexity in consumer products that make it more expensive to fix I can speak a little to the Dolmar products having taken a couple apart and like their approach to design and building. Yes they are a little heavier but seem more rugged to me. But I am not going to knock another brand.


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## Douglas Wend (Apr 27, 2016)

quotedraven said:


> I doubt the 421 a 40 cc equals a 50 cc but that is opinion. I would take the Japanese built engine.


There is some youtube video out there showing a 421 beating a 490. I forget the particulars on mods and chain setups but would not doubt that it could.


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## quotedraven (Apr 27, 2016)

Hope the saw works out


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## CoreyB (Apr 27, 2016)

Stock vs stock the 421 is the winner. But with porting the 490 pulls ahead.


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## fordf150 (Apr 27, 2016)

CoreyB said:


> Stock vs stock the 421 is the winner. But with porting the 490 pulls ahead.


im not sure whether that shows how strong a 421 is or how weak a 490 is in stock form but ported it should be expected that a saw with an 8cc advantage should win


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## svk (Apr 27, 2016)

I'm sorry I had to laugh. Only on AS would a "help me pick my first real saw" turn to a discussion on porting lol.


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## LittleLebowski (Apr 27, 2016)

Near as I can ascertain, stock chain is 16" 3/8 .050 56DL, correct? Do I need a 5/32 setup for sharpening or is it 7/32?


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## LittleLebowski (Apr 27, 2016)

svk said:


> I'm sorry I had to laugh. Only on AS would a "help me pick my first real saw" turn to a discussion on porting lol.



Fine by me, I enjoy the discussion.


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## Franny K (Apr 27, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> Near as I can ascertain, stock chain is 16" 3/8 .050 56DL, correct? Do I need a 5/32 setup for sharpening or is it 7/32?



16" 3/8 .050 56DL, correct? Probably if you did not discuss otherwise. I am not a dealer and do not know how many part numbers they have for complete saws or power head only. The bar is most likely the 7 tooth nose if you did not discuss otherwise. "16" 56 DL probably is more like 15 inches if measured to the case going past the prongs of the bucking spike. 3/8 low profile chain not normal 3/8.
5/32" file and guide
https://www.oregonproducts.com/pro/products/chain/38pro_chain_main.htm 
like 91vxl at above link

There is a link to the manual here
http://www.dolmarpowerproducts.com/productcatalog/chain_saws_gasoline/ps-421/index.html


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## LittleLebowski (Apr 29, 2016)

Thanks, Franny K. I appreciate it. The manual is well written. I've got a Stihl chain en route and @fordf150 should be sending me a Carlton NC1 chain once the chainsaw ships. That's what we're waiting on; Fordf150 had a shipment of Dolmar 421s last week that sold out and now he's waiting on the next shipment. Happily, I've already spoken for one of the ones coming in. He'll be testing and tuning my saw as needed and sending it to me.


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## CoreyB (Apr 29, 2016)

@fordf150 will take good care of you. And is great to do business with.


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## MountainHigh (Apr 29, 2016)

just received my Makita EA4300 (aka Dolmar 421).
First impressions ... very sturdy, nicely balanced, quality feeling saw that seems more powerful than it's rating.

Standing on bathroom scale, the EA4300 comes in just a couple ounces lighter than my 45cc OE 346xp. Haven't ran this saw hard yet, but from the brief slice and dice on some back yard 8" sticks, I really like its feel and performance. It will wind up nicely like my 346 - definitely a runner.

I'll run some tanks through mine before doing the muffler mod and carb tune. Wondering how the extra heat of the Cat will reduce the longevity of the motor?

Unlike my 346xp, this saw sits flat and steady on ground. A nice change.

So far, very happy I bought it and can see how it could easily be an ideal single saw solution for those who are mainly cutting wood under 14".

The ease of starting this saw is amazing! After years of pulling hard to start saws, you really have to remind yourself to do the opposite. It doesn't get any easier than this, yet it feels much sturdier than the flimsy Stihl easy start system I tried on a 250 C-BE.


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## LittleLebowski (Apr 29, 2016)

Pretty jealous of @MountainHigh, waiting on the good word from fordf150. 

Get any extra chains w/ yours, MH?


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## SawTroll (Apr 29, 2016)

A classic question of power vs, quality - as the 450 is stronger, but a "homeowner" saw. The Dolmar is a semi-pro, as is the Echo 500/490 if you include them in the discussion.

You have to go back to the diesel saws of the 1950s to find a decent quality (meaning non-Chinese) 50cc saw that has less rated power than those Echo saws though.


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## LittleLebowski (Apr 29, 2016)

SawTroll said:


> A classic question of power vs, quality - as the 450 is stronger, but a "homeowner" saw. The Dolmar is a semi-pro, as is the Echo 500/490 if you include them in the discussion.
> 
> You have to go back to the diesel saws of the 1950s to find a decent quality (meaning non-Chinese) 50cc saw that has less rated power than those Echo saws though.



Since I'm a knuckle dragging jarhead that is hard on his equipment, I went with the Dolmar. I am pleased to see your endorsement of its quality and am glad to see you chiming in as I enjoy your posts.


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## SawTroll (Apr 29, 2016)

I haven't voted in the poll, and will not, as it is an apples to bananas question = hopeless to answer.


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## MountainHigh (Apr 29, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> Pretty jealous of @MountainHigh, waiting on the good word from fordf150.
> 
> Get any extra chains w/ yours, MH?



The ea4300 comes with 18" bar and .325 chain. I'll put a 16" on it soon.

Heading up the mountain next week to do a 1/2 days cutting with it. Should be fun.


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## LittleLebowski (Apr 30, 2016)

SawTroll said:


> I haven't voted in the poll, and will not, as it is an apples to bananas question = hopeless to answer.



I believe I understand what you are saying but I'm economically constrained and prefer a new saw with dealer support. I believe that I chose the right saw, though.



MountainHigh said:


> The ea4300 comes with 18" bar and .325 chain. I'll put a 16" on it soon.
> 
> Heading up the mountain next week to do a 1/2 days cutting with it. Should be fun.



Hurry up and go do some work! Mine hasn't even shipped yet


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## MountainHigh (May 1, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> I believe I understand what you are saying but I'm economically constrained and prefer a new saw with dealer support. I believe that I chose the right saw, though.
> 
> Hurry up and go do some work! Mine hasn't even shipped yet



Anticipation is half the fun eh 

I hear the Makita Chainsaws are changing to an Orange colour from their current blue. Not sure how long before they also start down the autotune/mtronic path, but I bet it's not that far off.

The fact this nice little sturdy German made saw (EA4300/PS 421) can be easily modded and is something the average guy can still work on without a laptop, is a plus in my mind. Maybe not be a bad idea to buy another one in a box and put it away for a few years, just might turn into a Vintage collectors item as we move full speed ahead into the digital era.

Saws seem to be going the way our vehicles have. Computer diagnostics and complexity beyond the reach of the backyard mechanic. I hold dear the honest old school vehicle repair shops where they shoot straight and don't empty your wallet. Unfortunately, many now can't do troubleshooting on new cars, because they don't have the $$pricey$$ diagnostic machines new cars demand. So too the saw shops now evidently require software and computers to diagnose new saw issues.

Watching all the TV ads about the latest and greatest cars and trucks for sale, it seems to be coming down to who has the coolest tailgate stepper, the highest power wif-fi to slow cook the kiddies in the back seat (microwave radiation exposure, now there's a bomb waiting to explode), who has the best cup holders or has the guts to let the car decide when you should stop - lol - last I heard they all have 4 wheels and move forward and backwards.

Wake me up when you can buy something new that is going to last a longtime and cause you little expense or grief. Not holding my breath on that concept.

- - - - - end of Sunday rant


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## Chris-PA (May 1, 2016)

MountainHigh said:


> Computer diagnostics and complexity beyond the reach of the backyard mechanic.


Let's not get carried away - these feedback carb systems are about a stone simple as possible. It's just a carb with the adjustment needles replaced by a fuel solenoid, and a small micro looking at rpm. Go down the toy isle at any big box store and you'll find things far more complex than AT/MT. The diagnostics software is just that - it gives you some data that will help you figure out what's wrong, but you could diagnose it like a traditional carb saw anyway. About the only difference is that the self adjustment may mask some partial failures, mainly having to do with air leaks.


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## MountainHigh (May 1, 2016)

Chris-PA said:


> Let's not get carried away - these feedback carb systems are about a stone simple as possible. It's just a carb with the adjustment needles replaced by a fuel solenoid, and a small micro looking at rpm. Go down the toy isle at any big box store and you'll find things far more complex than AT/MT. The diagnostics software is just that - it gives you some data that will help you figure out what's wrong, but you could diagnose it like a traditional carb saw anyway. About the only difference is that the self adjustment may mask some partial failures, mainly having to do with air leaks.




My point is the saw shops now *have to* diagnose new saws via computer diagnostics along with their historically usual peak and poke. Unlike buying a scrench or carb adjusting screwdriver*, backyard guys don't have access to that digital tool. * The more we go down this road, the more it will become like car industry. High priced repairs only able to be done by those with the carefully controlled digital tools. If manufacturers want to open up the diag software to you and I, well that is a different kettle of fish ... but so far, you can't buy a new saw and also get the tool to peak inside the digital component, without being an accredited dealer. If I'm wrong and there is a way to get the dongle and software at a reasonable price, I'm all ears.

Makita/Dolmar may also be on this slippery slope (for the consumer) soon, but so far they seem to remain to be an old school builder of nice sturdy chainsaws, that have yet to enter the digital era. Vintage collectors item? Just might be.


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## 7sleeper (May 1, 2016)

MountainHigh said:


> My point is the saw shops now *have to* diagnose new saws via computer diagnostics along with their usual peak and poke. Backyard guys don't have access to that tool. The more we go down this road, the more it will become like car industry. High priced repairs only able to be done by those with the digital tools. Makita/Dolmar may be on this slippery slope soon, but so far they remain older school well built saws.


The main problem I see is that sooner or later the technicans will start relying ONLY on what the computer tells them. Just like in the car repair industry. The technicans are slowly but surely only plugging in and waiting for the computer to tell them what to do. The young ones have absolutely NO IDEA what they need to do anymore! 
There was a TV show in Germany where they exchanged two car technicans out of some central african country with two from a premium german brand. They african guys could diagnose almost ALL problems in the cars just by LISTENING to the engine running! The german guys were absolute useless in the african country and had NO IDEA what to do with out a plugin station... Sure is a pitty how the industry is manipulating the people to become stupid.

7


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## Franny K (May 1, 2016)

Introducing puffs of air into the transfer passages need not be paired with auto tune.

The 421 discussed here is a simple cylinder and uses a catalyst. Whether this and the epa averaging for emissions stuff is behind their top handle and 90+-cc saw having problems getting approved here is something to wonder about. The Husqvarna 543 does not have auto tune for an example of a similar displacement model.

Is there really a correlation between the presence of an auto tune/m tronic system and a lower clean air index on the tag a new saw comes with? The ones that introduce puffs of fresh air whatever trade mark word they make up. I noticed the Dolmar 6100 got a 3 out of 10 and that has no auto tune.


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## Chris-PA (May 1, 2016)

MountainHigh said:


> My point is the saw shops now *have to* diagnose new saws via computer diagnostics


This is what I disagree on. The saw is mechanically just as it always was, and the carb is very similar to what it's been for years too. I think people run around with their hair on fire because it's "electronic", and think they can't be worked on, but the differences are very small. Pretty much the same old carb with a cheap micro adjusting the mixture. 

Here's the reality: very few people ever understood how the old non-feedback carbs work anyway! They can unscrew covers and replace parts and make adjustments, but the inner workings are a big mystery to most (not all). How many threads have there been on here about how someone swapped all the parts but still can't figure out why the carb doesn't work? Yet that lack of understanding is somehow different if electronics are involved.

All that maintenance and parts replacement stuff is the same with AT, except for the mixture needles which are now computer controlled. 

Then people confuse strato and AT (there are strato saws without feedback carbs, and feedback carbs without strato). Strato is also stone simple - even more so now with split air flow carbs, as there isn't even one additional moving part.


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## MountainHigh (May 1, 2016)

Chris-PA said:


> This is what I disagree on. The saw is mechanically just as it always was, and the carb is very similar to what it's been for years too. I think people run around with their hair on fire because it's "electronic", and think they can't be worked on, but the differences are very small. Pretty much the same old carb with a cheap micro adjusting the mixture.




I value your knowledge Chris, but I just checked and I don't think I'm on fire , just stating the facts as I see them. As you may know, my autotune saw is in the shop and has had to wait for latest diagnostic software to show up before they could make any pronouncements ... and like 7sleeper said in his post, they are relying on the software to tell them what is wrong with it.

Can you and I put a new later model carb on my saw without the related software and updates? Evidently we can't, so therein lies the rub and the way this industry, along with car and truck repair industry is going. Does this move to the current digital domain mean all backyard saw guys are immediately out of work, absolutely not, but if the car and truck industry are any bellwethers, give it time. I'm happy to now have 2 old school saws still around and am going to do some more 2 stroke tear down rebuild learning.


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## zogger (May 1, 2016)

MountainHigh said:


> I value your knowledge Chris, but I just checked and I don't think I'm on fire , just stating the facts as I see them. As you may know, my autotune saw is in the shop and has had to wait for latest diagnostic software to show up before they could make any pronouncements ... and like 7sleeper said in his post, they are relying on the software to tell them what is wrong with it.
> 
> Can you and I put a new later model carb on my saw without the related software and updates? Evidently we can't, so therein lies the rub and the way this industry, along with car and truck repair industry is going. Does this move to the current digital domain mean all backyard saw guys are immediately out of work, absolutely not, but if the car and truck industry are any bellwethers, give it time. I'm happy to now have 2 old school saws still around and am going to do some more 2 stroke tear down rebuild learning.



Eventually, when there is enough demand and some geeks with knowledge feel so inclined, someone will build a new image to reflash what is there, making it easier to work on them yourself. Having to go through a dealer or pay big bucks for fifty cents worth of cable and software is...sucks, just sucks. 

Or someone will mix and match parts and get an AT or MT saw going with all old school "analog" parts and just eliminate all the computer controlled jazz. 

I am not against computerized saws, but I am against closed source proprietary and price gouging via contrived artificial scarcity..


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## Chris-PA (May 1, 2016)

MountainHigh said:


> I value your knowledge Chris, but I just checked and I don't think I'm on fire , just stating the facts as I see them. As you may know, my autotune saw is in the shop and has had to wait for latest diagnostic software to show up before they could make any pronouncements ... and like 7sleeper said in his post, they are relying on the software to tell them what is wrong with it.
> 
> Can you and I put a new later model carb on my saw without the related software and updates? Evidently we can't, so therein lies the rub and the way this industry, along with car and truck repair industry is going. Does this move to the current digital domain mean all backyard saw guys are immediately out of work, absolutely not, but if the car and truck industry are any bellwethers, give it time. I'm happy to now have 2 old school saws still around and am going to do some more 2 stroke tear down rebuild learning.


I think yours was the one that had the bad compression release that fried the cylinder? If it was, the only tie in with AT was that maybe it masked the symptoms and when it got bad enough that it could not compensate then the cylinder got damaged (I would still like to see a warning light).

Anyway, it's perfect example of what I'm saying - it was a mechanical problem on an unrelated part, and there's no indication there was ever anything wrong with the fuel system. Why don't you have your saw back yet??!!! How long does it take to put on a new piston, cylinder and ring, and a compression release that works? But because it's electronic everyone's afraid of the darn thing and you're still out a saw for nothing. I wonder if they keep it in a cage at night?

A leaking CR made it lean, made it run hotter, damaged the P&C and led to increased vapor lock issues. There's no guarantee you'd have caught it in time if it wasn't AT, although we'd all like to think we would. Had the leak been smaller, it's quite possible AT could have compensated for it and prevented damage that would otherwise occurred.


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## MountainHigh (May 1, 2016)

Chris-PA said:


> Why don't you have your saw back yet??!!! How long does it take to put on a new piston, cylinder and ring, and a compression release that works? But because it's electronic everyone's afraid of the darn thing and you're still out a saw for nothing. I wonder if they keep it in a cage at night?


lol - yep, it's taking a long time alright. I think they had to first get the software, then take some training before they could read it and then diagnose along with HQ tech dept. Evidently now standard practice for autotune saws  

But I digress - I don't want to highjack this nice thread about our shiny new Makita ea4300 and Dolmar PS421.


----------



## SawTroll (May 2, 2016)

Franny K said:


> Introducing puffs of air into the transfer passages need not be paired with auto tune.
> 
> The 421 discussed here is a simple cylinder and uses a catalyst. Whether this and the epa averaging for emissions stuff is behind their top handle and 90+-cc saw having problems getting approved here is something to wonder about. The Husqvarna 543 does not have auto tune for an example of a similar displacement model.
> 
> Is there really a correlation between the presence of an auto tune/m tronic system and a lower clean air index on the tag a new saw comes with? The ones that introduce puffs of fresh air whatever trade mark word they make up. I noticed the Dolmar 6100 got a 3 out of 10 and that has no auto tune.




I believe the main advantage about Autotune _in the EPA setting_ is that the carb basically becomes "tamper proof". The there is no need for the silly solutions we some times see, to make regular carbs tamper proof enough to satisfy the EPA, and there is no risk of too rich (for the EPA or otherwise) carb settings. Of course it also eliminates the risk of too lean carb settings, but that has nothing to do with the EPA.


----------



## LittleLebowski (May 2, 2016)

MountainHigh said:


> But I digress - I don't want to highjack this nice thread about our shiny new Makita ea4300 and Dolmar PS421.



I don't mind the tangent but you owe us a Makita update when you finally cut with it!


----------



## LittleLebowski (May 2, 2016)

Serious question: what is actually needed for accessing the new saws' data?


----------



## CoreyB (May 2, 2016)

Computer, software, and dongle/ cable


----------



## Idahonative (May 2, 2016)

I'm glad I'm not the only one who see's a problem with the auto tune technology. I won't ever own one. And my advise to others is buy these "old school", reliable, strong running, quality built, machines now while you can. They are reasonably priced and a guy can afford to salt one (or two or three...) away for use years down the road.

Five years from now, when there is no other choice but to run auto tune of some sort, I will be happily cutting away with my low tech Echo's. And Chris will still be trying to convince people that auto tune is worth the inconvenience and cost to save the earth. Even though the average firewood cutter probably burns far less than 5 gallons of two stroke annually.

From all indications, the Dolmar 421 would be an excellent saw to add to the stable.


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## Michigan Escapee (May 2, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> Serious question: what is actually needed for accessing the new saws' data?



From the device I saw this weekend, it looked like a basic 3 wire serial interface going into a black box, probably with some voltage converters, buffer chips, and this box was hooked up to a USB interface. Plug it into the "magic" piece of software that uses all the usual visual basic interface bling(but not too expertly applied), and then organize the data read off the chip.

http://cdn.power.husqvarnagroup.com...als/Manual_Engine_Diagnostic_Tool_English.pdf


And a sort of universal serial programmer looks something like this, you just hook up whatever kind of cable interface you want to the pin header.
https://www.coolcomponents.co.uk/usb-avr-programmer.html

If you want I2C, JTAG, or other different serial interfaces, you get a different gizmo for $20.


http://www.ebay.com/itm/Blackcat-US...ON-MXIC-Winbond-Microchip-ATMEL-/290505181360

Most of the variations all look like that.

I mention the last two, because generally, manufactures don't reinvent the wheel when it comes to interface standards. You might have to squirt the right data into the chip to get the responses you need, and then a way to organize the data returned.


----------



## Chris-PA (May 2, 2016)

Idahonative said:


> And Chris will still be trying to convince people that auto tune is worth the inconvenience and cost to save the earth.


Totally ignoring the fact that the correct mixture makes more power. Only slow guys think more fuel = more power.


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## Idahonative (May 2, 2016)

Chris-PA said:


> Totally ignoring the fact that the correct mixture makes more power. *Only slow guys* think more fuel = more power.



Only slow guys can't figure out how to adjust a carb with a screw driver. I don't know, maybe a guy like you needs AT...no shame in that Chris.


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## LittleLebowski (May 2, 2016)

Come on gents, no need to get personal. Also, I'm one of those slow ones that has trouble adjusting carbs


----------



## Idahonative (May 2, 2016)




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## Chris-PA (May 2, 2016)

Idahonative said:


> Only slow guys can't figure out how to adjust a carb with a screw driver. I don't know, maybe a guy like you needs AT...no shame in that Chris.


LOL - you're one of those who haven't figured out how these carbs work, and still think you can adjust them to give a correct mixture. Your "properly adjusted" carb goes from a perfectly correct mixture at some point under load to so rich it's misfiring with maybe a 20% increase in air flow. Now instead of lifting push a little harder - do you know what happens? It gets leaner. 

AT can keep a correct mixture as the load varies, which the carbs you think you're adjusting correctly _cannot _do.


----------



## Idahonative (May 2, 2016)

Chris-PA said:


> LOL - you're one of those who haven't figured out how these carbs work, and still think you can adjust them to give a correct mixture. Your "properly adjusted" carb goes from a perfectly correct mixture at some point under load to so rich it's misfiring with maybe a 20% increase in air flow. Now instead of lifting push a little harder - do you know what happens? It gets leaner.
> 
> AT can keep a correct mixture as the load varies, which the carbs you think you're adjusting correctly _cannot _do.



Thanks for the lesson professor. Hey Chris, how did we ever get along without AT? Never mind, I already know your answer.


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## Chris-PA (May 2, 2016)

Idahonative said:


> Thanks for the lesson professor. Hey Chris, how did we ever get along without AT? Never mind, I already know your answer.


We let them run rich. 

BTW, it was not necessary to go to electronic feedback to make an all position carb that could hold a correct mixture, but doing so would have been a bit larger, more complex and cost a few cents more.


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## Michigan Escapee (May 2, 2016)

Yes, but why? Why all this worry about heat? Ceramic coatings have been around since the 80s. And it doesn't exactly look super hard to do. 
http://honda-tech.com/tech-misc-15/diy-internal-engine-coatings-first-attempt-check-out-1971333/

Was the world so entranced by slick 50 snake oil, ron popeil gadgets, and new duct tape formulations that they weren't ceramic coating their engine parts? 

I mean, look at this, if a crazed nascar hillbilly could do it, why not others? http://www.legendarycollectorcars.c...s-see-and-hear-it-run-in-our-exclusive-video/

Why did the world seemingly snooze for three decades on this technology? It was **** on VHS tapes wasn't it? Once that came out, and the internet, progress stopped cold, people were too distracted to develop new things!


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## MountainHigh (May 2, 2016)

Idahonative said:


> my advise to others is *buy these "old school", reliable, strong running, quality built, machines now **while you can. * They are reasonably priced and a guy can afford to salt one (or two or three...) away for use years down the road.
> From all indications, the Dolmar 421 would be an excellent saw to add to the stable.



My sentiment exactly. We should be getting a commission on these things


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## CoreyB (May 2, 2016)

I have had a few problematic carbs that an auto tune would be appealing.
However I truly enjoy a good solid simplistic machine.
I guess I am kind of nostalgic as well.


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## Chris-PA (May 2, 2016)

I like simple as well - it's one of the reasons I like both strato and AT, as both make major improvements with very low complexity. In the case of strato it greatly reduces scavenging losses by virtue of the shapes of a couple of parts and requires no additional parts at all, moving or otherwise. In the case of AT it gives a fuel system that can not only hold a constant fuel/air mixture for the first time ever in a chainsaw, it self adjusts - and it requires almost no sensors at all and one fuel control actuator.


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## LittleLebowski (May 2, 2016)

Chris-PA said:


> I like simple as well - it's one of the reasons I like both strato and AT, as both make major improvements with very low complexity. In the case of strato it greatly reduces scavenging losses by virtue of the shapes of a couple of parts and requires no additional parts at all, moving or otherwise. In the case of AT it gives a fuel system that can not only hold a constant fuel/air mixture for the first time ever in a chainsaw, it self adjusts - and it requires almost no sensors at all and one fuel control actuator.



Which saws have both?


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## CoreyB (May 2, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> Which saws have both?


I think the stihl 362, 262, husky 555,562,545,550 but don't quote me on it.


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## Idahonative (May 2, 2016)

Chris-PA said:


> *I like simple as well - it's one of the reasons I like both strato and AT, as both make major improvements with very low complexity*. In the case of strato it greatly reduces scavenging losses by virtue of the shapes of a couple of parts and requires no additional parts at all, moving or otherwise. In the case of AT it gives a fuel system that can not only hold a constant fuel/air mixture for the first time ever in a chainsaw, it self adjusts - and it requires almost no sensors at all and one fuel control actuator.



Sounds good but in the real world, if you have a problem with your AT, you have almost ZERO chance of fixing it yourself. Then you take it to the dealer and have about a 50% chance that they can/will fix it. If that's "major improvements with very low complexity", count me out.


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## Chris-PA (May 2, 2016)

Idahonative said:


> if you have a problem with your AT, you have almost ZERO chance of fixing it yourself.


Lol, maybe you don't.


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## Idahonative (May 3, 2016)

Chris-PA said:


> Lol, maybe you don't.



I'll never know because I refuse to own an AT saw. Probably easy for you to fix one...with your chainsaw phone app...LOL


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## Chris-PA (May 3, 2016)

Idahonative said:


> I'll never know because I refuse to own an AT saw. Probably easy for you to fix one.


There are plenty of others here who are not afraid of them and have already diagnosed and fixed problems with AT carbs. On the thread about the 550 bog there was a guy (who clearly understands carbs) that simply modified the metering lever spring, which would be a decent approach for any carb that had such an issue. I'm sure you understand about metering levers and springs in tuning traditional carbs, right?



Idahonative said:


> with your chainsaw phone app...LOL


Another simple and effective solution that you don't understand and so laugh at. It's neither a chainsaw nor a phone app, rather a widely used audio spectrum analyzer. Nor is it mine, I just showed how to use it for this purpose. As usual, you're wrong on most every count. 

I think it's a hoot that your buddies on the other site where you hang out were lamenting not knowing what rpm their ported saws ran in the cut, while making similar snide comments. Yet I already know what they don't, or could at any time - and so could they since I showed how to use it for exactly that purpose! Guess who's laughing hardest?


----------



## LittleLebowski (May 3, 2016)

I can't say I'm enjoying the vitriol but serious question:
Saw parts can and are usually cheap. Has anyone here replaced AT parts?


----------



## LittleLebowski (May 3, 2016)

Michigan Escapee said:


> Yes, but why? Why all this worry about heat? Ceramic coatings have been around since the 80s. And it doesn't exactly look super hard to do.
> http://honda-tech.com/tech-misc-15/diy-internal-engine-coatings-first-attempt-check-out-1971333/
> 
> Was the world so entranced by slick 50 snake oil, ron popeil gadgets, and new duct tape formulations that they weren't ceramic coating their engine parts?
> ...



*Why* were the manufacturers so complacent? I don't see how the internet had anything to do with it; it's just information and it makes it widely available. If anything, the internet helps development as people can share information so much more easily and collaborate online.


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## Franny K (May 3, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> *Why* were the manufacturers so complacent?


Some of the stuff on here is just stirring the pot so to speak. The 421 you have coming likely has it's cylinder made in a very modern facility that makes stuff for a wide range of products. It will have worse exhaust fumes than some other options but not worse than what most of us have been around for a long time. I doubt it will need re tuning if you do not tamper with something. I have never adjusted my 351.


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## Chris-PA (May 3, 2016)

Michigan Escapee said:


> Why did the world seemingly snooze for three decades on this technology?


Well, chainsaws are cheap power tools, even the best and most desirable ones. There is no advanced technology in any of them, and any modestly competent industrial economy can produce them at whatever quality level is needed. It's about making money not making cool stuff for enthusiasts, so you get the minimum required to sell the stuff.


----------



## Franny K (May 3, 2016)

Chris-PA said:


> Well, chainsaws are cheap power tools, even the best and most desirable ones. There is no advanced technology in any of them,


I do not have an issue with the portion of your post I did not quote.

change cheap to inexpensive
The cylinder coatings are most likely advancing.
The ignition seems improving, the only relatively new chainsaw I have that kicks back is my efco 132. There must be something going on in the ignition module that has advanced (and not in degrees).


----------



## Michigan Escapee (May 3, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> *Why* were the manufacturers so complacent? I don't see how the internet had anything to do with it; it's just information and it makes it widely available. If anything, the internet helps development as people can share information so much more easily and collaborate online.



The autocensor bleeped out my word. Lets just say, I suspect people found new hobbies relating to electronics and adult entertainments, rather than meddling with engines, as was popular from the 1920s-1970s. For those still playing with small engines, probably the offroad bikes of various sorts had people's attentions rather than chainsaws, and various nuts were putting snowmobile engines into different things, and going crazy. And to date, that seems to be where the attention still is. That and the various honda/yamaha/toyota rice rockets. 

Still, the materials and technology are there, I suppose it's just a question of if people want to apply it. Or of there's more interest in restoring 50 year old chainsaws.


----------



## Chris-PA (May 3, 2016)

Franny K said:


> I do not have an issue with the portion of your post I did not quote.
> 
> change cheap to inexpensive
> The cylinder coatings are most likely advancing.
> The ignition seems improving, the only relatively new chainsaw I have that kicks back is my efco 132. There must be something going on in the ignition module that has advanced (and not in degrees).


Oh, there is advancement, but other than Strato and AT they're pretty much roaring into the 1980's!

Heck, the clever part of AT was figuring out how to measure fuel mixture with nothing but an rpm measurement. Somebody earned their pay with that.


----------



## zogger (May 3, 2016)

Chris-PA said:


> Oh, there is advancement, but other than Strato and AT they're pretty much roaring into the 1980's!
> 
> Heck, the clever part of AT was figuring out how to measure fuel mixture with nothing but an rpm measurement. Somebody earned their pay with that.



If you can actually make a straight mechanical carb that performs as good or better as MT or AT, and can pass emissions, etc., man, that's a ticket to fame and fortune I would think! I'd buy a few right now, like for the 346xp, 371/2, 394 etc.


----------



## CoreyB (May 3, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> I can't say I'm enjoying the vitriol but serious question:
> Saw parts can and are usually cheap. Has anyone here replaced AT parts?


Oh Ya lots of AT parts have had to be replaced. Heck the 562 as went through at least 3 updates on carbs sense they came out do to problems. Plus everything mechanical breaks down and a lot of these saws get used daily and real hard .


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## CoreyB (May 3, 2016)

I don't see how an AT carb could be more epa friendly other than removing the human component.


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## Chris-PA (May 3, 2016)

CoreyB said:


> I don't see how an AT carb could be more epa friendly other than removing the human component.


It's because of the point I've been repeating for some time now - in order to make these carbs all-position, they had to remove a basic part of all other carbs, namely the air corrector jets. These are what keep the fuel mixture constant as the air flow changes. Without them the mixture gets very, very rich as air flow increases, to the point that it misfires (4-strokes) with only a small increase in rpm. In addition to self adjusting, AT fixes this basic flaw. It could have been fixed with out AT, but...



zogger said:


> If you can actually make a straight mechanical carb that performs as good or better as MT or AT, and can pass emissions, etc., man, that's a ticket to fame and fortune I would think! I'd buy a few right now, like for the 346xp, 371/2, 394 etc.


You'd have to add something like a 3rd diaphragm and a tapered needle in the H jet, or go to a full CV carb like a Zenith or Mikuni. This would be larger and more mechanically complex than AT, and it still would need adjustment. And adjustment would be the real big problem with it, as it would no longer 4-stroke and would not have a terminal WOT rpm to use as a mixture set point. How would you tell people to adjust it? You'd also need a limited coil, as the rich mixture would no longer limit rpm so safe levels.


----------



## LittleLebowski (May 3, 2016)

Michigan Escapee said:


> The autocensor bleeped out my word. Lets just say, I suspect people found new hobbies relating to electronics and adult entertainments, rather than meddling with engines, as was popular from the 1920s-1970s. For those still playing with small engines, probably the offroad bikes of various sorts had people's attentions rather than chainsaws, and various nuts were putting snowmobile engines into different things, and going crazy. And to date, that seems to be where the attention still is. That and the various honda/yamaha/toyota rice rockets.



Respectfully, that does not make sense _at all_ to me. Are you saying that the user base for small engines drove development from "the 1920s-1970s" and when the user base lost interest in small engines as a hobby, *that *kept the companies from developing and evolving small engine design?


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## Michigan Escapee (May 3, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> Respectfully, that does not make sense _at all_ to me. Are you saying that the user base for small engines drove development from "the 1920s-1970s" and when the user base lost interest in small engines as a hobby, *that *kept the companies from developing and evolving small engine design?



It makes more sense if you look at automotive racing, motorcycle racing, various offroad bikes, 4 wheelers, etc, etc. There's a sort of feedback loop, of what the users develop in their mods, and the industry trying to keep up and supply what's of interest to a certain niche. Obviously GM, Nissan, Dodge, and others are going to be a bit more conservative with what they supply out of the factory. The modders, they're going to push the technology to the absolute bleeding edge. And in automotive, you have professional racing where engines, cars, everything are fabricated from the ground up. Various part suppliers will make different items to supply to each of those groups. 

Now chainsaws, for the most part, you've got home owners/farmers, professionals who use the saws as a means to make money, and a small hobbyist base. The hobbyist base, as you can see, a lot of them are keeping old saws alive, doing some simple mods, and more advance mods. Not too many are fabricating pistons, cylinders, cranks, etc, etc out of bare metal stock, or doing their own forging, casting, surface hardening. Oh, certainly there are SOME, but I have to wonder how many of those are doing chainsaw porting, piping, and all of that are just doing it as a sideline along with offroad bikes, and who knows what else. 

And while there are some good base models of chainsaws out there to mod, I don't think too many manufacturers are thinking, yeah, we'll add a little extra thickness to these parts, and improve tolerances a bit in case someone wants to go crazy with em.


----------



## MountainHigh (May 5, 2016)

spent 45 minutes cutting with the EA4300 (PS421) today. I'm really liking this little saw!
It seems incredibly strong in the cut for 43cc saw. Noodled some knotty maple rounds today and was quite amazed at how well it handled them. 

Weight is nice, handling is good, handy size, stable on it's feet, quality suspension, but the thing that really stands out on this saw is *starting* - this is a saw that an 80 year could start. It's so easy it brings a smile to my face every time. The recoil spring assist is pretty strong so you can't get complacent about the return snap. Keep a firm grip on the pull handle. So far there is nothing flimsy or cheap about this saw I can see, except its price.

I know I'll miss my 562 (still in the shop) when I want to *tearthrough* a couple of downed trees tomorrow, but I'm looking forward to seeing how the 4300 does when running hot for some time. (haven't gutted the muffler yet).

Heading up the mountain tomorrow for a better workout.


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## LittleLebowski (May 5, 2016)

Mine has shipped from @fordf150! I seriously might take the day off after it arrives, I need to work it.


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## 7sleeper (May 6, 2016)

MountainHigh said:


> spent 45 minutes cutting with the EA4300 (PS421) today. I'm really liking this little saw!
> It seems incredibly strong in the cut for 43cc saw. Noodled some knotty maple rounds today and was quite amazed at how well it handled them.
> 
> Weight is nice, handling is good, handy size, stable on it's feet, quality suspension, but the thing that really stands out on this saw is *starting* - this is a saw that an 80 year could start. It's so easy it brings a smile to my face every time. The recoil spring assist is pretty strong so you can't get complacent about the return snap. Keep a firm grip on the pull handle. So far there is nothing flimsy or cheap about this saw I can see, except its price.
> ...


No pics?!? It never happened....











  

Congratulation!

7


----------



## CoreyB (May 7, 2016)

7sleeper said:


> No pics?!? It never happened....
> 
> 
> 
> ...


This is exactly why I never take photos or video of me petting  or I mean polishing my saws......
It never happened.


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## LittleLebowski (May 7, 2016)

Darned near praying that the USPS delivers today like they claim they will.


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## CoreyB (May 7, 2016)

Ya it sucks waiting.


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## MountainHigh (May 7, 2016)

Great little saw - mine (with cat) prefers 50/1 mix - guessing the Cat chokes things down and can't handle 40/1 as well as my other saws, as the ea4300 was stumbling on hot start until I changed the mix to 50/1 and leaned the L just a smidge when at elevation.

So handy and light - prefer using this to my 562 in anything under 12" for sure. It will even cut 16" wood at max bar oil pretty easily on the stock 18" bar. Did I say it's a great saw yet 
Not quite ready to say I won't ever use my 346 again, but the solid stance of this saw compared to my OE346 is much better and power seems pretty darn close.

Second tank through and the partial load of wood it cut:


That tank of gas also cut 40% of my buddies load as his ms250 struggled to keep up.


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## LittleLebowski (May 8, 2016)

Guys, I got it in yesterday. I was so worried that the USPS would screw up the delivery and leave without my new saw for the weekend that I went to the post office before the carrier took delivery and got the saw myself 

I ain't gonna say what goodies were in the box but between those, the lightning fast shipping, the price no one else,could beat, and the _perfectly _tuned saw; I cannot recommend doing business with @fordf150 enough. If he has what you are looking for, it's worth it to go to him for your equipment needs.

So after getting confused with the overly verbose manual, I got the chain on there and tensioned just right. Added the proper mix and some oil and even though I was technically helping get the house ready for guests, _I just had to get it on_.

Oh man, after all of that dinking around with the Poulan 5020AV, this was like upgrading to a Mercedes or BMW. Ridiculously easy start, cuts way way better than the Poulan, and it just functioned *right*. No dying in the cut, idled just right, and it just ripped right through the several already downed trees I needed to buck. After that, I cut down a very large stump and found out later that there was a nail buried deep in the wood (not in the bark, way deep in there!) that the saw cut through.

I am truly satisfied with the Dolmar 421 and wish I'd bought it sooner. The saw just exudes high build quality and performs at a level I've never experienced before.


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## LittleLebowski (May 8, 2016)

The metal I cut through.


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## MountainHigh (May 8, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> The metal I cut through.


Congratulations on the new saw and good to hear Fordf150 set it up so nicely for you. 

How's the chain looking after the nail cut?


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## LittleLebowski (May 8, 2016)

MountainHigh said:


> Congratulations on the new saw and good to hear Fordf150 set it up so nicely for you.
> 
> How's the chain looking after the nail cut?


----------



## CoreyB (May 8, 2016)

Yep more Dolmar converts. Lol 
Dolmar just makes a great saw.


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## rburg (May 8, 2016)

Semi-skip chain now.


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## MountainHigh (May 8, 2016)

rburg said:


> Semi-skip chain now.


Semi skip is faster to file for sure, but kind of grabby on the small stuff for me.
I run semi on my 562 but would be interested to hear more on semi skip on small bar saw.


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## MountainHigh (May 8, 2016)

looks like the chain/nail encounter could have been worse.


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## LittleLebowski (May 8, 2016)

Just finished my fifth tank of fuel. It just runs and runs and runs. I filed the chain with five swipes on each tooth before cutting today.


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## MountainHigh (May 8, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> Just finished my fifth tank of fuel. It just runs and runs and runs. I filed the chain with five swipes on each tooth before cutting today.



5 tanks in one day .... you're a machine!


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## LittleLebowski (May 8, 2016)

MountainHigh said:


> 5 tanks in one day .... you're a machine!



I did one tank yesterday so only four today. I seriously have a lot of wood to buck and many more trees to fell after I finish bucking what is already down and stacking it in the wood pile. I flush cut a couple stumps too.

Man, I love this saw. I can't think of a better saw for my needs. My arms and hands are kinda tired right now


----------



## CoreyB (May 8, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> Just finished my fifth tank of fuel. It just runs and runs and runs. I filed the chain with five swipes on each tooth before cutting today.


Sound like you might like that 421? 5 tanks is a whole Lotta wood.


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## LittleLebowski (May 8, 2016)

CoreyB said:


> Sound like you might like that 421? 5 tanks is a whole Lotta wood.



I'm madly in love with it 

My property was neglected for years before I bought it and we are reclaiming part of the lawn from the forest and also extending it. The trees in Virginia grow like weeds.


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## LittleLebowski (May 8, 2016)

When should I be looking at upgrading the bar? Just when it looks worn? Which bar should I go with?


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## LittleLebowski (May 8, 2016)

Just caught myself looking at bigger Dolmars...


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## CoreyB (May 8, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> Just caught myself looking at bigger Dolmars...


Don't look at a 6100. It is like a sophisticated big brother of the 421 that just got back from some covert military top secret program.


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## Michigan Escapee (May 8, 2016)

CoreyB said:


> Don't look at a 6100. It is like a sophisticated big brother of the 421 that just got back from some covert military top secret program.



Yeah, won't matter. Last I looked they only had a few in stock at chainsaws direct. After that last Dolmar 6100s are gone, it'll all be down to aquamarine Makita "smurf" saws.


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## rburg (May 8, 2016)

Take a look at Left Coast Supply. They have a couple of ao41 bars that would work on your saw that are made by GB.


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## MountainHigh (May 8, 2016)

CoreyB said:


> Don't look at a 6100. It is like a sophisticated big brother of the 421 that just got back from some covert military top secret program.



Dolmar 6100
http://www.dolmarpowerproducts.com/productcatalog/chain_saws_gasoline/ps-6100/index.html

Makita EA6100
http://makita.ca/index2.php?event=tool&id=1933&catid=7

Ya looks like the same saw to me ... couple of ounces heavier than my 562, but looks like a nice saw! Would love to compare one to my 562.

Makita's aquamarine colour is switching to orange soon evidently. Get the blue while you can - collectors item


----------



## CoreyB (May 8, 2016)

Ya the 6100 is not going anywhere. As far as makita is concerned the have owned dolmar for close to 20 years. The have no intention of changing the saws or the manufacturing. From what little I have learned the name change is a marketing and distribution change. Probably to make a push into box stores and cut out the middle distribution so they make more money off the small dealers.


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## Michigan Escapee (May 8, 2016)

Oh yeah, because copper chloride aquamarine/blue dye is really hard to find. 
Although even the same chemical is differing shades based on hydration(light blue to dark blue to green). And you're gonna get more of a "green" just from plasticisers in the paint, and the plastics. Sometimes you even get variations in one big crystal mass. http://www.sciencemadness.org/talk/files.php?pid=358716&aid=34634







Funny how some of the most popular colors are relatively simple chemically. 
http://www.compoundchem.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/01/Colourful-Chemistry.png


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## LittleLebowski (May 9, 2016)

rburg said:


> Take a look at Left Coast Supply. They have a couple of ao41 bars that would work on your saw that are made by GB.



What are the benefits of upgrading to one of these?


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## Ryan'smilling (May 9, 2016)

I generally turn the bar on my saw over every 4-6 hours of use. I've honestly never worn one out. 

I don't think you need to worry about replacing your bar yet, but on the other hand, since it's your only saw, having a backup bar would be a good idea. That way, if you get the bar pinched real bad, you can remove the power head and install the new bar, free the stuck one, and get back to work. Same if you destroy the bar somehow.

Bars for these saws are cheap. Get anything that is the right pitch and gauge, uses the right number of driver links, and matches the type of mount you have.


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## LittleLebowski (May 9, 2016)

Well, there goes the excuse to upgrade to the expensive but color matching Cannon bar 

What should I do with my existing Poulan 16" chains? I don't have the tools to modify them from 60DL to 56DL. Is there someone that modifies them for a small fee or should I just sell them all? Some are new.


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## rburg (May 9, 2016)

Currently the GB bars are being phased out by left coast and the price has been lowered. Basically a good bar at a good price.


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## LittleLebowski (May 9, 2016)

rburg said:


> Currently the GB bars are being phased out by left coast and the price has been lowered. Basically a good bar at a good price.



So, just tuck it away for the future since it's a good deal now? This is a very good price, then?


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## Ryan'smilling (May 9, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> Well, there goes the excuse to upgrade to the expensive but color matching Cannon bar
> 
> What should I do with my existing Poulan 16" chains? I don't have the tools to modify them from 60DL to 56DL. Is there someone that modifies them for a small fee or should I just sell them all? Some are new.



Most saw dealerships can remove a few drive links for you. Before you take them in, though, make sure that they are the same pitch and gauge as your new setup. The Dolmar is 3/8 lo-profile, I'm not sure what the Poulan runs, but it may not be the same. 

This is one situation where having a relationship with a local dealer helps, because they might spin them down to size for free for you while you're there picking up some 2-stroke oil and bar and chain oil. Otherwise, they might want $5/chain or so.


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## svk (May 9, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> Well, there goes the excuse to upgrade to the expensive but color matching Cannon bar
> 
> What should I do with my existing Poulan 16" chains? I don't have the tools to modify them from 60DL to 56DL. Is there someone that modifies them for a small fee or should I just sell them all? Some are new.





Ryan'smilling said:


> The Dolmar is 3/8 lo-profile, I'm not sure what the Poulan runs, but it may not be the same.



Those Poulans are full 3/8 chains so they will not fit a 3/8 low profile saw. Either keep them for your back up saw or throw them on the trading post here.


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## CoreyB (May 9, 2016)

The 5020 that I worked on a few weeks ago came stock with 3/8 .050 vanguard chain. Not what comes on a 421.


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## svk (May 9, 2016)

CoreyB said:


> The 5020 that I worked on a few weeks ago came stock with 3/8 .050 vanguard chain. Not what comes on a 421.


OT, but I wonder how much better a 5020 would cut if someone converted it to low pro or .325?


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## CoreyB (May 9, 2016)

svk said:


> OT, but I wonder how much better a 5020 would cut if someone converted it to low pro or .325?


Well with the stock bar and chain you will be replacing them soon enough to check out something new. The bar on the one I worked on bent very east and stared to separate while just trying to do some minor straightening.


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## LittleLebowski (May 10, 2016)

svk said:


> Those Poulans are full 3/8 chains so they will not fit a 3/8 low profile saw. Either keep them for your back up saw or throw them on the trading post here.



I'll be putting up a mess of used/new 16" and 20" chains plus a 16" bar for the Poulan as soon as I do an inventory. Just want to get rid of it all.

Last night, I was very frustrated as my riding mower had a mandrel break at a bad time so I had to fire up the 421 and fell a tree (I've got tons of trees that still need felling). My little German girl did not disappoint, she buzzed right through the tree and showered me with chips, it fell right where I planned, and I bucked most of it before I had to quit for the night. I'm getting there, we can almost completely see from our window, the creek that runs through our property. The 421 is absolutely an asset to my family.


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## LittleLebowski (May 11, 2016)

Pinched the factory bar today felling a willow oak. Pro Lite bar en route. I think that I can repair the factory bar.


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## CR888 (May 11, 2016)

I'd be surprised if the op did not have a hammer/small axe, punch and file.... that's all you really need to adjust the length of your loops. 5 mins per chain is all it takes, breakers & spinners are great but far from essential! I have adjusted loops in the field with very basic equipment.


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## LittleLebowski (May 11, 2016)

CR888 said:


> I'd be surprised if the op did not have a hammer/small axe, punch and file.... that's all you really need to adjust the length of your loops. 5 mins per chain is all it takes, breakers & spinners are great but far from essential! I have adjusted loops in the field with very basic equipment.



I thought the same but the new saw uses low profile chain and the old one did not.


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## LittleLebowski (May 14, 2016)

Five tanks between yesterday and today. I really like how easy it is to turn up the oiler when flush cutting stumps.

My little German girl continues to run like clockwork. Never more than two pulls to start after you do the first two at full choke. Warm, she starts on one pull without being choked.


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## CoreyB (May 14, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> Five tanks between yesterday and today. I really like how easy it is to turn up the oiler when flush cutting stumps.
> 
> My little German girl continues to run like clockwork. Never more than two pulls to start after you do the first two at full choke. Warm, she starts on one pull without being choked.


No you see why us who use Dolmar's always refer them to people we like. Lol


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## LittleLebowski (May 14, 2016)

CoreyB said:


> No you see why us who use Dolmar's always refer them to people we like. Lol



YUP. Man, I'm a sucker for stuff that just _works_. I keep eyeing 6100s and 7910s even though nearly all of my work can be done with my 421. I'm happy to have convinced someone else on this forum to buy a 421 from @fordf150.

Kinda tired from running a saw for four hours. Anyone want to come out and gather up the scraggly top limbs and haul them away for me


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## Chris-PA (May 14, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> Kinda tired from running a saw for four hours. Anyone want to come out and gather up the scraggly top limbs and haul them away for me


LOL - running the saw is the short, easy part of the job. A faster saw just means you have to get to the working part sooner.


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## LittleLebowski (May 14, 2016)

Chris-PA said:


> LOL - running the saw is the short, easy part of the job. A faster saw just means you have to get to the working part sooner.



Yeah, it's just like hunting. The real work starts after you drop the animal or the tree.


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## CoreyB (May 14, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> YUP. Man, I'm a sucker for stuff that just _works_. I keep eyeing 6100s and 7910s even though nearly all of my work can be done with my 421. I'm happy to have convinced someone else on this forum to buy a 421 from @fordf150.
> 
> Kinda tired from running a saw for four hours. Anyone want to come out and gather up the scraggly top limbs and haul them away for me


The 6100 and 7910 are serious work saws and can get tons of wood down and cut.
I am not sure how large the majority of tippy trees are or how much land you want to clear. However to give you an idea I have 40 acres of timber majority is oak and hickory and few trees are over 24-26 in across. I got the 6100 and it will handle everything I have. I also know that a 421 would handle 75% of the timber I have. Of course I would have no problem taking down a 16" Hickory with a 421.


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## LittleLebowski (May 14, 2016)

This was a brand new bar this morning.


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## CTYank (May 14, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> I'd rather have *one good saw*.


Shouldn't be a problem, with any reasonable care. IMHO. I've had one for ~3.5 yrs. It's been my main mid-size saw for much of that time. Takes a licking & keeps on ticking. You can now get factory-refurbs PP5020s for $140 from VMInnovations-dot-com, shipping included.
IMO, they could lose a pound or so, but for the price, c'mon. Gas, oil, go.


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## SawTroll (May 14, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> I believe I understand what you are saying *but I'm economically constrained* and prefer a new saw with dealer support. I believe that I chose the right saw, though.
> 
> 
> 
> Hurry up and go do some work! Mine hasn't even shipped yet



I never bough saws often enough to be economically concerned about it. My only "cheap" mistake (it always is) was to buy a 353 instead of a 346xp in 2003.

Both models are better options than those this thread is about though.


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## LittleLebowski (May 15, 2016)

SawTroll said:


> I never bough saws often enough to be economically concerned about it. My only "cheap" mistake (it always is) was to buy a 353 instead of a 346xp in 2003.
> 
> Both models are better options than those this thread is about though.



Well, good for you. I'm not buying saws a lot and am supporting my family on a single income so I *am* on a budget. I'm pleased that I got a saw that won't let me down and I'm not at all worried nor jealous of the saws you mentioned.


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## CoreyB (May 15, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> Well, good for you. I'm not buying saws a lot and am supporting my family on a single income so I *am* on a budget. I'm pleased that I got a saw that won't let me down and I'm not at all worried nor jealous of the saws you mentioned.


LOL ST just likes to get guys riled up i think. He bleeds husky.
Even though that Dolmar produces a better saw. Husqvarna has no competition for the 421. In fact it looks like they gave up trying in the 40cc market and just expect customers to pay the extra premium for the 545 or 550.
And for 60cc saws. Well I will just say I never see a "help my 6100 is broke thread" however there is usually one or two a week about 562 problems.
In all honesty I just respond like this to give ST a hard time. Lol even though it is just a fact that Dolmar is better.


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## LittleLebowski (May 15, 2016)

Yeah, I don't see anything on the US market that can compete in the 40cc class with the Dolmar 421. 

It seems like most Dolmar owners are quietly satisfied.


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## 7sleeper (May 15, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> Yeah, I don't see anything on the US market that can compete in the 40cc class with the Dolmar 421....


Actually Husqvarna 543 & Stihl 241 can easily compete.

7


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## LittleLebowski (May 15, 2016)

7sleeper said:


> Actually Husqvarna 543 & Stihl 241 can easily compete.



Sorry, I should have added "price" as well.


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## svk (May 15, 2016)

CTYank said:


> Shouldn't be a problem, with any reasonable care. IMHO. I've had one for ~3.5 yrs. It's been my main mid-size saw for much of that time. Takes a licking & keeps on ticking. You can now get factory-refurbs PP5020s for $140 from VMInnovations-dot-com, shipping included.
> IMO, they could lose a pound or so, but for the price, c'mon. Gas, oil, go.


Yank, he had a Poulan and it was junk so now he bought a good saw. You should drop the fanboy rhetoric from every post you make.


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## Chris-PA (May 15, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> Sorry, I should have added "price" as well.


Price matters to me as well - and there are other less expensive saws I would buy before a 421. I would buy a PP5020 before I'd shell out for a 421, and even if I didn't port it I have no doubt I'd have it running well because there's simply nothing wrong with the design. 

It's important to keep in mind that the PP5020 you bought was a used/reconditioned saw that apparently had something wrong with it. And then you experimented with tuning on it - and we still don't know what's wrong with it (it might be minor). Most of what you're experiencing with the 421 is a saw that isn't defective and has been properly tuned. But it doesn't have any magic secret sauce that will keep it tuned any more that the 5020 did, as it has a similar fuel system. The case material and split case vs. clamshell makes no difference at all in terms of how a stock (or nearly stock) saw will perform or last for this use. 

The other thing you and other converts to the 421 are experiencing is that by golly a good 40cc saw with sharp lo pro chain will actually cut a lot of wood. I have 8 saws from 38cc to 42cc, some stock and some ported, some plastic cased Poulan clamshells and some Zenoah split cased designs, and every one will do that too.


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## LittleLebowski (May 15, 2016)

Chris-PA said:


> Price matters to me as well - and there are other less expensive saws I would buy before a 421. I would buy a PP5020 before I'd shell out for a 421, and even if I didn't port it I have no doubt I'd have it running well because there's simply nothing wrong with the design.
> 
> It's important to keep in mind that the PP5020 you bought was a used/reconditioned saw that apparently had something wrong with it. And then you experimented with tuning on it - and we still don't know what's wrong with it (it might be minor). Most of what you're experiencing with the 421 is a saw that isn't defective and has been properly tuned. But it doesn't have any magic secret sauce that will keep it tuned any more that the 5020 did, as it has a similar fuel system. The case material and split case vs. clamshell makes no difference at all in terms of how a stock (or nearly stock) saw will perform or last for this use.
> 
> The other thing you and other converts to the 421 are experiencing is that by golly a good 40cc saw with sharp lo pro chain will actually cut a lot of wood. I have 8 saws from 38cc to 42cc, some stock and some ported, some plastic cased Poulan clamshells and some Zenoah split cased designs, and every one will do that too.



I agree with some of what you said and disagree with other parts but I say all of this in the spirit of civil discourse and hope not to give any offense as I do not mean to.

There's no doubt *you* could get _anything _running. There is much doubt that I or Joe Homeowner could nor if it was worth the time to do so when on a limited time budget. I can make any AR15 run well. I can diagnose what's wrong from barrel crown to buffer weight to extractor spring to gas port and beyond. That doesn't mean I recommend a cheap AR15 because _I _can make any AR15 run. I recommend something that is problem free out of the gate or at least supported by a manufacturer that _will _step up and fix the problem.

In my case, Poulan referred me to my local authorized repair center which was my Stihl dealer who was dealing with their spring backlog from the numerous arborists out here and they also advised that it's extremely difficult dealing with Poulan once the saw is diagnosed (diagnosis is the first step, no work can be done until the local authorized repair center diagnoses the saw and Poulan authorizes or refuses repair _and _sends the parts). So, I do understand that under the hood the saw are essentially the same but you sure don't hear a lot about Dolmar problems as opposed to Poulans. Obviously, that's probably due to the number of each on the market mainly but I sincerely doubt that the same care and attention to detail is taken with a Poulan's assembly as is a Dolmar's. Also, in my limited experience and as reported by many others, the Dolmar 42CC feels at least as strong as most 50CC saws, mine feels way stronger than my old Poulan 5020AV even when I was running my 5020AV with a 16" bar.

If I have a problem with this saw, Dolmar or fordf150 will make it right. I absolutely acknowledge that I probably had a bad Poulan. I also happily admit that there's probably no way of statistically proving my hunch that Dolmars are assembled to a higher level of quality control than Poulans. However, I think that the Dolmar is a safer bet than Poulan for those that don't tear down carbs and redesign saws in their spare time


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## LittleLebowski (May 15, 2016)

CTYank said:


> Shouldn't be a problem, with any reasonable care. IMHO. I've had one for ~3.5 yrs. It's been my main mid-size saw for much of that time. Takes a licking & keeps on ticking. You can now get factory-refurbs PP5020s for $140 from VMInnovations-dot-com, shipping included.
> IMO, they could lose a pound or so, but for the price, c'mon. Gas, oil, go.



I did buy a reconditioned one and it ran poorly before a fuel line melted and fell out. I gave up and returned it. I don't doubt that there's many good Poulan 5020AVs out there but I have had enough of tinkering with stuff.


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## 7sleeper (May 15, 2016)

Chris-PA said:


> Price matters to me as well - and there are other less expensive saws I would buy before a 421. I would buy a PP5020 before I'd shell out for a 421, and even if I didn't port it I have no doubt I'd have it running well because there's simply nothing wrong with the design.
> 
> It's important to keep in mind that the PP5020 you bought was a used/reconditioned saw that apparently had something wrong with it. And then you experimented with tuning on it - and we still don't know what's wrong with it (it might be minor). Most of what you're experiencing with the 421 is a saw that isn't defective and has been properly tuned. But it doesn't have any magic secret sauce that will keep it tuned any more that the 5020 did, as it has a similar fuel system. The case material and split case vs. clamshell makes no difference at all in terms of how a stock (or nearly stock) saw will perform or last for this use.
> 
> The other thing you and other converts to the 421 are experiencing is that by golly a good 40cc saw with sharp lo pro chain will actually cut a lot of wood. I have 8 saws from 38cc to 42cc, some stock and some ported, some plastic cased Poulan clamshells and some Zenoah split cased designs, and every one will do that too.


I usually agree with a lot that you say Chris-PA, but this time I doubt that the Poulan is going to last the same as the Dolmar. I presume there is a reason that f.e. @KenJax Tree has run hundreds of refill's through his 421 without a fault. 

7


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## CoreyB (May 15, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> I also happily admit that there's probably no way of statistically proving my hunch that Dolmars are assembled to a higher level of quality control than Poulans. However, I think that the Dolmar is safer bet than Poulan for those that don't tear down carbs and redesign saws in their spare time


Actually Dolmar/ Makita proudly boast about their saws being made one at a time by one technician start to finish.


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## CoreyB (May 15, 2016)

It is not in English but this video shows the build process of a 420.


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## Andyshine77 (May 15, 2016)

The 5020 is OK for what it is, but it's really a pos like all Poulan's these days. My guess is some are just trying to stir the pot a little, as comparing a 5020 to a 421 is absurd on many different levels.

Sent from my HTC One_M8 using Tapatalk


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## swatbwana (May 15, 2016)

421 it's a beast

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk


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## LittleLebowski (May 15, 2016)

CoreyB said:


> Actually Dolmar/ Makita proudly boast about their saws being made one at a time by one technician start to finish.





CoreyB said:


> It is not in English but this video shows the build process of a 420.



That was some seriously cool info you posted, thank you. Makes me feel even better about my purchase.


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## GeorgiaVol (May 15, 2016)

Andyshine77 said:


> The 5020 is OK for what it is, but it's really a pos like all Poulan's these days. My guess is some are just trying to stir the pot a little, as comparing a 5020 to a 421 is absurd on many different levels.
> 
> Sent from my HTC One_M8 using Tapatalk



Ouch, in one breath you say it's okay for what it is, the next you say it's a POS. Its a $200 home owner saw. That's what it is. Comparing it to a professional saw is ridiculous. For the amount of use it was purchased and being a refurbished saw was an equally an unfair "review" of its intended purpose. For the average homeowner it is a good buy for that price.


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## Chris-PA (May 15, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> There's no doubt *you* could get _anything _running. There is much doubt that I or Joe Homeowner could nor if it was worth the time to do so when on a limited time budget.


But you're starting from the premise that they don't already run. I know your used saw didn't, but how about others bought them new and like them?



Andyshine77 said:


> The 5020 is OK for what it is, but it's really a pos like all Poulan's these days. My guess is some are just trying to stir the pot a little, as comparing a 5020 to a 421 is absurd on many different levels.


You guys are really gonna make me get one aren't you? It would go along with all my other POS Poulans, all of which seem to work just fine.


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## LittleLebowski (May 15, 2016)

Chris-PA said:


> But you're starting from the premise that they don't already run. I know your used saw didn't, but how about others bought them new and like them?



I think that for those that ever have problems, they'd better be mechanically inclined and carb knowledgeable or have free time to learn because in my experience, the Poulan warranty is not impressive. It's not just the saw that many of us are buying but the total package. I think that it would of course make a good saw for those that can fix everything wrong with the saw themselves, like you but it sounds like a 40CC saw running low pro chain can cut right alongside a 50CC saw, like you said. I know that from my experiences, my Dolmar cuts way better than my Poulan 5020AV, even when the Poulan had a 16" bar. 

I would have gladly sold you my 5020 at a loss had I known you were curious about that model.


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## CoreyB (May 15, 2016)

A buddy if mine bought a 5020 last winter when it was on sale for I think he said $160. He brought it up to me because it needed some repair. Tuning it was not as easy as some, some things where not up to my standards. But if I only had a $160 and had to get wood for my family to stay warm I could get it done with a 5020.
However I would sure rather have a 421 and would scoop driveways and side walks if I had to for the extra money to get one. Lol


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## MountainHigh (May 16, 2016)

Chris-PA said:


> The other thing you and other converts to the 421 are experiencing is that by golly a good 40cc saw with sharp lo pro chain will actually cut a lot of wood. I have 8 saws from 38cc to 42cc, some stock and some ported, some plastic cased Poulan clamshells and some Zenoah split cased designs, and every one will do that too.



I've ran a few 45 cc saws too Chris and none other than my OE346xp is close to the 421 ... you better get one to see for yourself


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## Andyshine77 (May 16, 2016)

Let me be clear you can still like a saw and they can still be pos. Case in point my Poulan WT, bought it for $20 some new fuel lines,carb kit, ported it and it runs awesome. But it's still a pos lol.

Sent from my HTC One_M8 using Tapatalk


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## LittleLebowski (May 16, 2016)

MountainHigh said:


> I've ran a few 45 cc saws too Chris and none other than my OE346xp is close to the 421 ... you better get one to see for yourself



I'm glad you checked in, have you been running your 421 hard? I sure have been using the hell out of mine.


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## LittleLebowski (May 16, 2016)

7sleeper said:


> Actually Husqvarna 543 & Stihl 241 can easily compete.



I checked and both look to be at least 50% more than the Dolmar 421.


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## Michigan Escapee (May 16, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> I checked and both look to be at least 50% more than the Dolmar 421.



Yeah, but you'll totally lose the respect of the logs you're cutting, they'll think you're some sort of cheapskate dutchman. 

Only problem I noticed with the dolmar 421 was, on a cold and rainy day, it's kind of hard to start until you get the hang of it. 

Similar story with the 6100, but it's far easier to get your foot through the handle for leverage. 

On a Husky, you've at least got a pressure release. 

After that though, you'd be looking more at durable build, and the power band for sustained cutting on the Dolmar. 

The Husky, I'm not really so hot on their chainbrake system. When cutting through lots of nasty and rotten trees, you'll get gunked up to the point that the chainbrake is just a decoration. Pop it off, whomp it clean, and back in action, but, still a safety issue. 

As far as Stihl goes, I think someone is whispering in the ears of the board members and telling em they have a devoted following, and a reputation they can take advantage of. Expand their base rapidly, along with production rate, and if there's a few stumbling blocks, oh well! Which is usually a danger sign in terms of repair issues. 

Have a local hardware store, and they're nice enough people and all, but they've got NO CLUE on chainsaws. Fertilizer, lawn and garden care, no problem. Finding a 20mm fine thread to hose thread adapter, nope! They do have free popcorn in the store though. lol! BUT, they have a pretty wide assortment of Stihl products, just a shitload of different gizmos, of which, they probably don't know anything about. I'm guessing they've got online dealer training or some BS like that in the event they get jammed up on questions or the like. 

Interestingly enough, on chains, they have just an endless assortment of full chisel chain. Looking around for semi-chisel, etc. Nope! Gotta go around the corner to the ghetto brand aisle and dig through the Oregon selection for that! 

So, guessing Stihl has kinda stuck their **** in the hornets nest of rapid market expansion, which is probably going to cause havok for their repair centers, parts suppliers, and criteria for warranty service. On the later, it'll probably have the fallout of turning friendly mom and pop hardware stores into a bunch of crazed people, who on the sight of a Stihl being returned will scream out "You straight gassed another one didn't you *******!" 

Dolmar/Makita, it's hard to find any of it. Home Despot and a smattering of dealers have em here and there. The mower place down the road had all of 1 5100 on the shelves. Way easier to find Echo. Probably they're still going on mostly reputation, and long haul strategy, which will mean the prices will stay fairly low, and it'll be a pain in the ass if you can't find a local repair center. 

So, sort of good news/bad news. Husky, I can find them anywhere. Northern Tool, Fleet Farm, and half a dozen other places I'm forgetting. Very good news if you need a few simple parts(air filters, bars, spark plugs, fuel filters). But kind of a bad joke if you do need an oddball part like a muffler, or a handle component, throttle linkage, carb, etc. A service center might be willing to sell you some used parts if you're in a hurry, others wise, you wait 3 days to 2 weeks. 

On that front, you're just as out of luck as anyone no matter what brand. Unless.... 

You've got a poulan, and need junk saws to steal parts off of! Check on craigslist, and yep, LOTS of poulans for sale, cheap!


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## LittleLebowski (May 17, 2016)

I think I'm at 17 tanks so far, plus or minus one.


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## CoreyB (May 17, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> I think I'm at 17 tanks so far, plus or minus one.


Sure won't be long at that pace that the 421 will pay for itself.


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## LittleLebowski (May 17, 2016)

CoreyB said:


> Sure won't be long at that pace that the 421 will pay for itself.



I think so. I know that I probably got a bad 5020AV but this saw's ability to work as long as I want to run it is refreshing after constantly having to fiddle with the 5020AV. Right now, I've done so much work that I have to set up a new woodpile for all of the trees that I have felled and bucked. I really look forward to showing before and after pictures of my back few acres.


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## MountainHigh (May 20, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> I think I'm at 17 tanks so far, plus or minus one.


17 tanks 

does yours still have the cat?


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## CoreyB (May 20, 2016)

MountainHigh said:


> 17 tanks
> 
> does yours still have the cat?


Don't take this the wrong way but I hope his still has the cat. Previous tuning didn't seem to go that we'll.
@LittleLebowski if you send me your 421 I will remove the cat and retune it. Lol


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## Chris J. (May 20, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> ...
> 
> I don't mind going with the Dolmar and the possible shipping to a dealer if it is the better saw.



I know that many posts have been made since the above ^ one, but...

1. The shipping costs could get very high should the saw have problems.

2. You said that you want to cut wood, and not have to work on the saw other than normal maintenance. Shipping time would add to your downtime.

Of course all that is moot if you bought your 421 from a good local dealer and/or the saw runs well for many hours with no issues.


----------



## 7sleeper (May 20, 2016)

Chris J. said:


> I know that many posts have been made since the above ^ one, but...
> 
> 1. The shipping costs could get very high should the saw have problems.
> 
> ...


What one should not forget is the reputation of a product and if a pro here clearly states that he has run hundreds of refills wihtout any problem, on german sites there are members who have used the saw exclusively for years as their firewood saw without a problem.
What problems arise more often? The only ones that I am aware of is the ignition coil. There were a few that had problems, but even this is a easily detected/diagnosed problem that, at least in my eyes, wouldn't require shipping to anywhere if you have a good communication with your dealer. 

7


----------



## LittleLebowski (May 20, 2016)

CoreyB said:


> Don't take this the wrong way but I hope his still has the cat. Previous tuning didn't seem to go that we'll.
> @LittleLebowski if you send me your 421 I will remove the cat and retune it. Lol



Thanks, man, I will indeed send it to you sooner or later. I am going to run it stock for a while. My last tuning attempt was stymied by a fuel line melting on the Poulan 5020AV. The Dolmar has already been ran much harder than that Poulan and she just needs oil and fuel, no tuning, no babying. Eighteenth tank was consumed today. I've slowed down on cutting as I have been splitting and stacking wood by hand.


----------



## LittleLebowski (May 20, 2016)

Chris J. said:


> I know that many posts have been made since the above ^ one, but...
> 
> 1. The shipping costs could get very high should the saw have problems.
> 
> ...



$15 shipping to @fordf150 or there's authorized local repair centers nearby.


----------



## GrassGuerilla (May 20, 2016)

So, what oil and ratio are you running in your new Dollie? 

Congrats Lebowski, I've heard nothing but good about the small Dolmars. The 6401 I had was a smooth running machine. Great torque, and all around strong cutter.

Sorry, couldn't resist. This thread has everything else I love about AS, had to go there...


----------



## LittleLebowski (May 20, 2016)

I'm tired... There's another stack of wood of equivalent size that you cannot see in the picture. I felled, bucked, and split all of this myself using only the tools you see in the picture (the Glock 19 is there to protect the rest and I wear it daily). The family did help a little with stacking but not much. I still have a lot more work ahead of me.


----------



## fordf150 (May 20, 2016)

CoreyB said:


> Don't take this the wrong way but I hope his still has the cat. Previous tuning didn't seem to go that we'll.
> @LittleLebowski if you send me your 421 I will remove the cat and retune it. Lol


we specifically left the cat in for a reason.....local dealers may not take a gutted muffler lightly so with previous experiences in mind we left her stock. knock on wood i havent seen any measurable decrease in life on these saws with the cat still in them. local saws i sold when i first started selling dolly are all running a cat and are 5-6 yrs old now with just bar and chain replacements. 


@LittleLebowski glad you like the saw and gave me opportunity. Looks like it is treating you pretty good so far


----------



## Jeffkrib (May 20, 2016)

WTF is the go with the gun, do you seriously need to keep a gun on you in your own back yard?
I've never been to the USA is it realy thet bad there. Don't know what the laws are like there but if you had to use that gun wouldn't you end up in jail for life?

Nice saw, part of me wishes Id bought one of them rather than my 550xp, just form a bullet proof and simplicity point of view.


----------



## MountainHigh (May 20, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> (the Glock 19 is there to protect the rest and I wear it daily).



Glock worn daily - Wow!  . . . . Is it really that rough around your neck of the woods? or are you in law enforcement?


----------



## fordf150 (May 20, 2016)

Jeffkrib said:


> WTF is the go with the gun, do you seriously need to keep a gun on you in your own back yard?
> I've never been to the USA is it realy thet bad there. Don't know what the laws are like there but if you had to use that gun wouldn't you end up in jail for life?


I would say its habit.....lots of conceal carry guys wear their gun everyday, in every situation so that its habit and natural. guns are like parachutes....better to have it and not need it than to need it and not have it.


----------



## GrassGuerilla (May 20, 2016)

MountainHigh said:


> Glock worn daily - Wow!  . . . . Is it really that rough around your neck of the woods? or are you in law enforcement?


A daily carry piece is a bit like a parachute. If you need one and don't have one, you'll probably never need one again.


----------



## GrassGuerilla (May 20, 2016)

fordf150 said:


> I would say its habit.....lots of conceal carry guys wear their gun everyday, in every situation so that its habit and natural. guns are like parachutes....better to have it and not need it than to need it and not have it.


Exactly... Beat me to it.


----------



## LittleLebowski (May 20, 2016)

MountainHigh said:


> Glock worn daily - Wow!  . . . . Is it really that rough around your neck of the woods? or are you in law enforcement?



Neither. I like being able to defend myself and my family if needed. I carry concealed in public and sometimes open carry at home while working.


----------



## LittleLebowski (May 20, 2016)

Jeffkrib said:


> WTF is the go with the gun, do you seriously need to keep a gun on you in your own back yard?
> I've never been to the USA is it realy thet bad there. Don't know what the laws are like there but if you had to use that gun wouldn't you end up in jail for life?
> 
> Nice saw, part of me wishes Id bought one of them rather than my 550xp, just form a bullet proof and simplicity point of view.



No and no. If it's self defense, I'd be quite fine. 

Loved your country when I visited. Great people.


----------



## LittleLebowski (May 20, 2016)

fordf150 said:


> we specifically left the cat in for a reason.....local dealers may not take a gutted muffler lightly so with previous experiences in mind we left her stock. knock on wood i havent seen any measurable decrease in life on these saws with the cat still in them. local saws i sold when i first started selling dolly are all running a cat and are 5-6 yrs old now with just bar and chain replacements.
> 
> 
> @LittleLebowski glad you like the saw and gave me opportunity. Looks like it is treating you pretty good so far



Hey man, it's not hard to brag on this saw and doing business with you. By all rights, your Dolmar stock should be sold out before you take delivery.


----------



## moondoggie (May 20, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> Hey man, it's not hard to brag on this saw and doing business with you. By all rights, your Dolmar stock should be sold out before you take delivery.


When you getting a tat?


----------



## LittleLebowski (May 20, 2016)

moondoggie said:


> When you getting a tat?



I'm a pureskin


----------



## CoreyB (May 21, 2016)

moondoggie said:


> When you getting a tat?


Hey a tat, now that is a good idea. I gotta search some logos lol


----------



## 7sleeper (May 21, 2016)

All wrong guys! Gun carrying when having a Dolmar is mandatory! All those mtronic/autotune guys without running saws hording you trying to steal a problem free saw...



7


----------



## fordf150 (May 21, 2016)

CoreyB said:


> Hey a tat, now that is a good idea. I gotta search some logos lol


----------



## LittleLebowski (May 21, 2016)

7sleeper said:


> All wrong guys! Gun carrying when having a Dolmar is mandatory! All those mtronic/autotune guys without running saws hording you trying to steal a problem free saw...



I'll stop the hordes with my .300Blackout


----------



## LittleLebowski (May 21, 2016)

CoreyB said:


> Hey a tat, now that is a good idea. I gotta search some logos lol



I've searched for stickers, shirts, and hats. There's some Dolmar hats on eBay but I don't like the one shown.


----------



## Chris J. (May 21, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> $15 shipping to @fordf150 or there's authorized local repair centers nearby.



That's good, and @fordf150 has a sold rep here. You'll most likely never need either.


----------



## fordf150 (May 21, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> I've searched for stickers, shirts, and hats. There's some Dolmar hats on eBay but I don't like the one shown.


most of what you find for dolmar is going to be dealer specific....they dont put out much for advertising/promotional items.


----------



## CoreyB (May 21, 2016)

fordf150 said:


>


I LIKE! Maybe as a big chest piece! Lol


----------



## LittleLebowski (May 21, 2016)

Chris J. said:


> That's good, and @fordf150 has a sold rep here. You'll most likely never need either.



I agree. I hope to send more business his way sooner or later, he's certainly earned it and Dolmar makes solid, well, priced saws. I keep eyeing the 6100.


----------



## moondoggie (May 21, 2016)

CoreyB said:


> I LIKE! Maybe as a big chest piece! Lol








"One on the wife's forehead"


----------



## 7sleeper (May 22, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> I agree. I hope to send more business his way sooner or later, he's certainly earned it and Dolmar makes solid, well, priced saws. I keep eyeing the 6100.


With your medical backround and your experience with the 421, for me the only logical choice! Although even without your medical backround and your positive experience it would be a logical choice in my eyes!


7


----------



## LittleLebowski (May 23, 2016)

Nineteen trouble free tanks so far.


----------



## 7sleeper (May 24, 2016)

And still no pics...




7


----------



## CoreyB (May 24, 2016)

7sleeper said:


> And still no pics...
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Or videos! I would love to see some videos of the 421 felling some trees and limbing a big oak crown.


----------



## grizz55chev (May 24, 2016)

7sleeper said:


> And still no pics...
> 
> 
> 
> ...


So it didn't happen, according to AS rule #1.


----------



## Chris J. (May 24, 2016)

7sleeper said:


> And still no pics...
> 
> 
> 
> ...





CoreyB said:


> Or videos! I would love to see some videos of the 421 felling some trees and limbing a big oak crown.





grizz55chev said:


> So it didn't happen, according to AS rule #1.



Would a shooting joke be inappropriate?


----------



## LittleLebowski (May 24, 2016)

Well, the first picture shows the good part of my backyard. The second shows what I've been working on. The third shows what the second area used to look like. Geographically speaking, the pictures are left to right in numerical order. The second picture is the area planned to be actual lawn in the future. The third picture shows land that may be slightly cleared where it borders the second area/picture.

Clear as beer?


----------



## LittleLebowski (May 24, 2016)

I also need to rebuild the shed, get rid of those leaf piles, get rid of that pile of top growth from what I've already felled, and still have a lot of wood to split and stack, not to mention setting up more woodpiles (I'm making sure they're off of the ground). I'm not a very handy guy with building stuff but I'm hell on brute labor, even with my rebuilt shoulder and elbow


----------



## LittleLebowski (May 24, 2016)

The little Fiskars X25 has really grown on me but it really needs a pound or two more of weight in the axe head. For most of my splitting work, it's fine but there's definitely some pieces of wood it can't split cleanly in one shot. I really wish I'd bought its big brother, the X27


----------



## moondoggie (May 24, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> Nineteen trouble free tanks so far.


where is said saw


----------



## LittleLebowski (May 24, 2016)

Pics on pages 12 and 13.


----------



## LittleLebowski (May 24, 2016)




----------



## 7sleeper (May 24, 2016)

You clearly need a compressor! Fastest way to clean your saw. Further looks like a lot of very fine "dust", check your chain if it might need a sharpening. 

Great pics btw! Thanks!

7


----------



## LittleLebowski (May 24, 2016)

I think that the fine dust build up was from when I turned up the oiler to maximum when flush cutting some stumps therefore contributing to buildup in the clutch cover but I've definitely had times when I should have switched chains and didn't.


----------



## GeorgiaVol (May 24, 2016)

Man, what I would give for some straight tree cutting to clear my property. My yard is surrounded by 50-100' of privet hedge so thick you can't even crawl through it on your hands and knees.


----------



## LittleLebowski (May 24, 2016)

Unfortunately, I work at my day job NOT cutting wood and only get to cut/split/stack after work during the hottest part of the day. Yesterday, I sweated all of the way through the pants I was wearing under my chaps. I need to switch to shorts under the chaps or look for some chaps that are better for hot weather.


----------



## MountainHigh (May 24, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> I also need to rebuild the shed, get rid of those leaf piles, get rid of that pile of top growth from what I've already felled, and still have a lot of wood to split and stack, not to mention setting up more woodpiles (I'm making sure they're off of the ground). I'm not a very handy guy with building stuff but I'm hell on brute labor, even with my rebuilt shoulder and elbow



Thanks for the photos. Looks like a nice back yard for the kids to play in.
Those leaf piles will compost down and provide good garden soil nutrients in about a year. I make a fence out of pallettes or chicken wire around tight leaf piles and then when composted, throw it into the vegy garden in the spring. Free organic fertilizer.


----------



## Chris-PA (May 24, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> The little Fiskars X25 has really grown on me but it really needs a pound or two more of weight in the axe head. For most of my splitting work, it's fine but there's definitely some pieces of wood it can't split cleanly in one shot. I really wish I'd bought its big brother, the X27
> 
> View attachment 504707


Find something 4 to 4-1/2lb - I bet you find it just right for splitting like I have. You can actually get a decent weight axe at Harbor Freight cheap if there is one near you, but the handle won't last long and profile is very narrow. It works well for some wood but will get stuck a lot in others - I prefer something with wider profile wedge at the edge for splitting. And you can always put a new handle on it.


----------



## grizz55chev (May 24, 2016)

Nice pics, great looking yard!


----------



## LittleLebowski (May 24, 2016)

MountainHigh said:


> Thanks for the photos. Looks like a nice back yard for the kids to play in.
> Those leaf piles will compost down and provide good garden soil nutrients in about a year. I make a fence out of pallettes or chicken wire around tight leaf piles and then when composted, throw it into the vegy garden in the spring. Free organic fertilizer.



Thanks, man. I have a lot of leaves to get rid of, including that pile. I just have too much. I'll still have _plenty _left over for fertilizer.



grizz55chev said:


> Nice pics, great looking yard!



Thank you! It's a work in process. For out here in Northern Virginia, five acres is huge. Back home in Wyoming...not so much


----------



## LittleLebowski (May 24, 2016)

Taking it easy on my rebuilt shoulder after splitting wood yesterday so I'm cleaning up along the driveway. These trees will just line the property line with the neighbor's few acres of forest so I'm limbing them just enough so they'll lay flat. The second picture is to the right of the driveway leaving the house.


----------



## LittleLebowski (May 24, 2016)

Old, dead trees like this are clearly enough justification to get a bigger Dolmar, right? RIGHT?


----------



## mountainlake (May 24, 2016)

Depends on how many trees you have that big, just a few the 421 will get it done. Steve


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## 7sleeper (May 24, 2016)

Easy work for a 421.

7


----------



## Andyshine77 (May 24, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> Old, dead trees like this are clearly enough justification to get a bigger Dolmar, right? RIGHT?
> 
> View attachment 504775


Absolutely! The next set of pics best be of the 7910 variety!! [emoji106]


----------



## LittleLebowski (May 24, 2016)

Chain is sharp today, methinks.


----------



## MountainHigh (May 24, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> Old, dead trees like this are clearly enough justification to get a bigger Dolmar, right? RIGHT?
> 
> View attachment 504775



Yes, please tell your wife that *The ChainsSaw Forum *approves and sanctions this *essential* purchase


----------



## LittleLebowski (May 25, 2016)

21 tanks so far. After refilling for the last time yesterday, it was hard to start. I assume that's because of fuel and the high ambient temperature outside? First time that I've seen it. It did not repeat that after the one time.


----------



## BGE541 (May 25, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> _Please _don't say "just find one of these XYZ saw's for the same price used" unless you have an actual link for said deal.
> 
> I'm a hard working homeowner with a few acres and lots and lots of wood to cut. My trees rarely get over one foot in width. I have two wood stoves. I want a saw I can rely upon.
> 
> I have a local Husqvarna dealer. I have made contact with a Dolmar dealer on here that I trust.



I have a 51 Husqvarna I just went though, OEM P/C, woods ported, strong saw... $300 SHIPPED PHO to you, check it out here... 

Better then both saws you listed IMHO.


----------



## BGE541 (May 25, 2016)

Just see you bought a saw  Enjoy!


----------



## CoreyB (May 25, 2016)

BGE541 said:


> Just see you bought a saw  Enjoy!


He is now looking at a larger saw as well.
@LittleLebowski BGE541 has a ported echo 600 for sale as well.


----------



## BGE541 (May 25, 2016)

Good call Corey and thank you. Yeah have a ported CS600 that does pretty well for itself!!!


----------



## MountainHigh (May 26, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> 21 tanks so far. After refilling for the last time yesterday, it was hard to start. I assume that's because of fuel and the high ambient temperature outside? First time that I've seen it. It did not repeat that after the one time.



Heat ... I'm *guessing* once the cat is gone, it will run cooler and not choke like that.


----------



## LittleLebowski (May 26, 2016)

MountainHigh said:


> Heat ... I'm *guessing* once the cat is gone, it will run cooler and not choke like that.



I like my two year warranty though.


----------



## MountainHigh (May 26, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> I like my two year warranty though.


Ya that's why I've been hesitant to remove mine as well.

I had a vapour lock near the end of the first time I ran mine. It was after pushing it hard, bucking up a 16" x 30' log non-stop (wanted to see how it would handle medium sized sticks that are more suited to my 562) on a very unusually hot day. In retrospect, a little slower breaking in period might have been a good idea 
Guessing the cat holding lots of heat didn't help.

If Fordf150 sees this, any thoughts?


----------



## zogger (May 26, 2016)

MountainHigh said:


> Ya that's why I've been hesitant to remove mine as well.
> 
> I had a vapour lock near the end of the first time I ran mine. It was after pushing it hard, bucking up a 16" x 30' log non-stop (wanted to see how it would handle medium sized sticks that are more suited to my 562) on a very unusually hot day. In retrospect, a little slower breaking in period might have been a good idea
> Guessing the cat holding lots of heat didn't help.
> ...



I am not him, but if I had 20 plus tanks in and had a cat muffler, out it goes, or modded! Also time to retune. Those rings are as seated as they will get.

I personally don't give a flip about warranties, maybe just a few tanks max, then on to modding/grinding whatever. Most of the time, most shops just utter the mantra STRAIGHT GASSED. Better to have it tuned correctly and muffler flowing like it should. Running cool is the best warranty you will get. Running with carb set too lean then with a cat perverter heating things up..meh, pass.


----------



## LittleLebowski (May 26, 2016)

zogger said:


> I am not him, but if I had 20 plus tanks in and had a cat muffler, out it goes, or modded! Also time to retune. Those rings are as seated as they will get.
> 
> I personally don't give a flip about warranties, maybe just a few tanks max, then on to modding/grinding whatever. Most of the time, most shops just utter the mantra STRAIGHT GASSED. Better to have it tuned correctly and muffler flowing like it should. Running cool is the best warranty you will get. Running with carb set too lean then with a cat perverter heating things up..meh, pass.



I understand but I trust in @fordf150 to take care of me if I have an issue during my warranty period. Plus, I know very little about tuning. I also prefer to keep my saw factory in order to have said two year warranty protection. I'm not a chainsaw tuner nor a modder; I'm a homeowner who needs a tool that _always works_.


----------



## 7sleeper (May 26, 2016)

I don't see the cat as pessimistic as many here. Sure it heats up, sure it takes longer to cool down, but as lont as no major plastic pieces are around there is hardly anything to worry about in my eyes. WHY? Because even if the cat heats up, it will NEVER reach the inside temperatures of the combustion engine. Although removing clearly benifits the engines responsivness. On the other hand the exhausts clearly are not as bad with a cat muffler!

7


----------



## zogger (May 26, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> I understand but I trust in @fordf150 to take care of me if I have an issue during my warranty period. Plus, I know very little about tuning. I also prefer to keep my saw factory in order to have said two year warranty protection. I'm not a chainsaw tuner nor a modder; I'm a homeowner who needs a tool that _always works_.



That's fine. You are just on a board that is full of chainsaw enthusiasts (among other engine oriented pursuits). Very simple stuff is..very simple to most of us. To each their own, personally, got no use for cat converters in small engines, nor epa mandated too lean tune, although I would bet your dealer took care of that part.  Just most saws after break in need a scosh of adjusting, but..fly with what ya got, have fun, glad you are getting some work done. Sell off that pp5020 for shipping to some member who wants to dork around with it, chalk it up to a learning experience. Buy once even if a higher price for something you need, cry once.


----------



## LittleLebowski (May 27, 2016)

22 tanks now. Yesterday was the hottest day so far that I've ran that 421, no issues with vapor lock this time. I had a really difficult time felling a hard leaning white oak yesterday but got it done.


----------



## Michigan Escapee (May 27, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> I like my two year warranty though.



I usually had problems like that on my 445 when the filter was getting clogged


----------



## svk (May 27, 2016)

zogger said:


> with a cat _*perverter*_ heating things up..meh, pass.


A what? 

Don't you just love autotext? LOL.


----------



## GrassGuerilla (May 27, 2016)

Did someone say cat perverter?


----------



## zogger (May 27, 2016)

svk said:


> A what?
> 
> Don't you just love autotext? LOL.



Oh I do stuff like that on purpose..the full engineering name is catastrophic perverter. Around here the bubbas call them cadillac converters.


----------



## svk (May 27, 2016)

zogger said:


> Oh I do stuff like that on purpose..the full engineering name is catastrophic perverter. Around here the bubbas call them cadillac converters.


Lol. 

One lady I know working at the power company calls the lineman a "right away inspector".


----------



## Chris J. (May 28, 2016)

"cat perverter" = funny 

One fellow here--who was not popular because he was abrasive in at least 80% of his post, esp towards newbies--once posted years ago that he "buggered" one of his saws . 

Back then there were some pretty wild folks here; y'all can imagine the fun they had with that comment.


----------



## LittleLebowski (May 28, 2016)

I had the oiler turned all of the way up yesterday while felling and then cutting a stump. I thought it was smoking in the stump but it looks like it was perhaps moisture from the tree and the oil evaporating? At any rate, got'er done but I'm tossing the chain in the ultrasonic cleaner since it's caked with carbon. I suppose I'm babying my chains


----------



## MountainHigh (May 28, 2016)

speaking of oiler on the 421. 

3 settings on mine and when i turn it to the right (1 o'clock) it seems to be at max # 3 setting, now if I depress the screw in and press it hard, it sinks in deeper and I get another turn to the right. I don`t think this is one of the 3 settings at it needs depressing the screw hard, but it does seem to oil even better at this location when in bigger wood. Has anyone found this on their EA4300/421?


----------



## 7sleeper (May 29, 2016)

I don't see any sense at all in forcing saws to oil more than they do. The times of oil flowing all over, just to satisfy some false sense of security, are in my eyes long over. With a regular 15 inch bar I have no problems whatsoever in the middle setting. Of course I donot recomend a bar length over 16 inch on such a saw size irrespective of model/brand.

7


----------



## LittleLebowski (May 29, 2016)

Just did a handle wrap with bike tape. Gonna go saw while you guys chat . Just bucking and cutting a stump.


----------



## Chris J. (May 29, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> View attachment 505456
> Just did a handle wrap with bike tape. Gonna go saw while you guys chat . Just bucking and cutting a stump.



You haven't yet rigged a holster to the saw?


----------



## LittleLebowski (May 29, 2016)

7sleeper said:


> I don't see any sense at all in forcing saws to oil more than they do. The times of oil flowing all over, just to satisfy some false sense of security, are in my eyes long over. With a regular 15 inch bar I have no problems whatsoever in the middle setting. Of course I donot recomend a bar length over 16 inch on such a saw size irrespective of model/brand.
> 
> 7



It's not forcing anything, it's making a conscious decision to use another setting on the adjustable by design oiler.


----------



## LittleLebowski (May 29, 2016)

Chris J. said:


> You haven't yet rigged a holster to the saw?



Nah, just checking to see if anyone here notices something about that Glock 19.


----------



## LittleLebowski (May 29, 2016)

MountainHigh said:


> speaking of oiler on the 421.
> 
> 3 settings on mine and when i turn it to the right (1 o'clock) it seems to be at max # 3 setting, now if I depress the screw in and press it hard, it sinks in deeper and I get another turn to the right. I don`t think this is one of the 3 settings at it needs depressing the screw hard, but it does seem to oil even better at this location when in bigger wood. Has anyone found this on their EA4300/421?



Not me. Better ask @fordf150


----------



## Jeffkrib (May 30, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> Nah, just checking to see if anyone here notices something about that Glock 19.



Put that thing away, seriously hoping your giving me a skewed view of how dangerous it is in your part of the world. I mean what are the chances of some nut case walking into you property and saying "stick em up punk and hand me your Dolmar 421". Lets face it they would never have heard of Dolmar unless they've been on AS. Just tell em its pronounced Dolmaar in a Chinese accent and you bought it from ebay China for $12.99 delivered.


----------



## LittleLebowski (May 30, 2016)

Jeffkrib said:


> Put that thing away, seriously hoping your giving me a skewed view of how dangerous it is in your part of the world. I mean what are the chances of some nut case walking into you property and saying "stick em up punk and hand me your Dolmar 421". Lets face it they would never have heard of Dolmar unless they've been on AS. Just tell em its pronounced Dolmaar in a Chinese accent and you bought it from ebay China for $12.99 delivered.



I'll never post a pic on here again without a gun in it


----------



## Chris J. (May 30, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> I'll never post a pic on here again without a gun in it



IME at least 90% of the active members here are pro-firearms and that includes handguns. You're obviously proud of your Glock, rightfully so, but including it in photos of your saw in akin to preaching to the choir. Honestly, doing so makes you look like a kid who just lost his virginity and can't stop talking about it.

And yes, I noticed that you included a  in your post.


----------



## MountainHigh (May 30, 2016)

7sleeper said:


> I don't see any sense at all in forcing saws to oil more than they do. The times of oil flowing all over, just to satisfy some false sense of security, are in my eyes long over. With a regular 15 inch bar I have no problems whatsoever in the middle setting. Of course I donot recomend a bar length over 16 inch on such a saw size irrespective of model/brand.
> 
> 7



Ya ... the Makita's stock 18" bar is working hard to get enough oil when buried. I know the saw is better suited to <16" bar but haven't bought one yet and just wondering if this last 'sunken' oiler setting is actually supposed to be there - guessing not, but it does seem to oil better on the 18" with it there.


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## LittleLebowski (May 30, 2016)

Chris J. said:


> IME at least 90% of the active members here are pro-firearms and that includes handguns. You're obviously proud of your Glock, rightfully so, but including it in photos of your saw in akin to preaching to the choir. Honestly, doing so makes you look like a kid who just lost his virginity and can't stop talking about it.
> 
> And yes, I noticed that you included a  in your post.



I enjoy the banter with our international members plus you seem to have missed this post from me (no one has caught it yet):



LittleLebowski said:


> Nah, just checking to see if anyone here notices something about that Glock 19.



I caught a bit of flack from one guy here over a gun pic so I have been enjoying posting the pics to see who else had an issue with certain inanimate objects. I'm also fairly handy with my carry guns, having won a match or two with them (am I still a virgin gun owner?) but if my pictures that include guns bother you feel free to click Ignore as it won't bother me. If I'm breaking a forum rule, let me know or report me.


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## tpence2177 (May 30, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> Nah, just checking to see if anyone here notices something about that Glock 19.


Gen 2? target sights are the only difference I can see? I can't see much detail on the back plate, I was looking for a fun switch but I can't see what I'm usually looking for as far as a fun switch 

Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk


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## LittleLebowski (May 30, 2016)

tpence2177 said:


> Gen 2? target sights are the only difference I can see? I can't see much detail on the back plate, I was looking for a fun switch but I can't see what I'm usually looking for as far as a fun switch



Good eyes! It is the back plate. I wrote this article about it.

http://www.gunnuts.net/2015/07/03/the-gadget-an-additional-safety-device-for-glock-pistols/


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## tpence2177 (May 30, 2016)

Cool I'll try and read that in a little bit. I noticed there was a difference just couldn't see exactly what was different 

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## Andyshine77 (May 30, 2016)

Metal sights instead of the stock polymer, that's the only thing I noticed.

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## Michigan Escapee (May 30, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> I'll never post a pic on here again without a gun in it



The glock lost its mojo in the 80s after everyone ended up buying them. Now if you don't want someone to think it's your 16 year old daughters guns, you need something a bit less refined, and maybe more east european. Like this thing.


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## tpence2177 (May 30, 2016)

Michigan Escapee said:


> The glock lost its mojo in the 80s after everyone ended up buying them. Now if you don't want someone to think it's your 16 year old daughters guns, you need something a bit less refined, and maybe more east european. Like this thing.


I shoot my friends frequently. I haven't seen a sp01 for myself to get in years though. The most accurate handgun I have ever shot

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## tpence2177 (May 30, 2016)

Last off topic post but this was our last range trip had well over 3000 rounds and shot until we couldn't physically load magazines anymore lol.





A couple of my SIG's were in the safe and I didn't have room for them to come play. 

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## LittleLebowski (May 31, 2016)

Back on topic, not that I mind the thread drift that I started 

23 tanks so far on my 421. Had an Oregon 91VXL chain come off twice and each time the teeth that ride i the groove on the bar needed filing afterwards. I absolutely had the chain pretty tight too, it was certainly not loose. I believe that I need to try a Stihl chain. Are all "picco" chains low profile?


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## GeorgiaVol (May 31, 2016)

tpence2177 said:


> I shoot my friends frequently. I haven't seen a sp01 for myself to get in years though. The most accurate handgun I have ever shot



When punctuation makes a big difference. Lol. I would hate to be one of your friends.


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## tpence2177 (May 31, 2016)

Haha I was walking around academy when I typed that. I shoot my friends cz often, not my friend lol. 

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## raventai (Jun 2, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> 23 tanks so far on my 421. Had an Oregon 91VXL chain come off twice and each time the teeth that ride i the groove on the bar needed filing afterwards. I absolutely had the chain pretty tight too, it was certainly not loose. I believe that I need to try a Stihl chain. Are all "picco" chains low profile?





My understanding is that for Stihl "picco" = oregon 3/8 low profile, 

Probably to avoid confusion with regular 3/8.


To further derail this thread my oldest boy (8yo) shot his first center fire memorial day, 9mm from a G2 compact Glock.

I only gave him one round in the mag and he had a bit of a hard time with the large grip but a few minutes of coaching and he let it rip, he has not been able to shut up about it since. [emoji4] 

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## raventai (Jun 2, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> View attachment 504716



Are you missing the washer over the drive spur? ?

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## Franny K (Jun 2, 2016)

raventai said:


> My understanding is that for Stihl "picco" = oregon 3/8 low profile,
> 
> Probably to avoid confusion with regular 3/8.


I have seen Oregon put a trademark symbol next to low profile in some of their literature. Picco is a Stihl trademarked word. I have found three product lines that Stihl puts picco on, the 3/8 "lo profile" stuff in both 0.050 and o.043 gauge and the 1/4 pitch in 0.043. While the parts that contact the bar and the drive portions of the sprocket are interchangeable say 63pm vs 91vxl the rivet size at the pivot, the thickness of the tie strap the height of the cutting edge above the sliding surface are all more on the Stihl Picco in both 3/8 classes.


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## LittleLebowski (Jun 3, 2016)

raventai said:


> Are you missing the washer over the drive spur? ?



I don't think that I'm missing anything but am confused (I'm admittedly dumb) by your nomenclature.


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## Franny K (Jun 3, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> I don't think that I'm missing anything but am confused (I'm admittedly dumb) by your nomenclature.


I think it is on post 291 there are missing parts in the picture you posted. an e clip and a washer of sorts. Perhaps you just had them off at the time of the picture.


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## LittleLebowski (Jun 3, 2016)

No, never seen those parts.


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## Franny K (Jun 3, 2016)

look on the parts sheet or ipl (illustrated parts list)


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## raventai (Jun 3, 2016)

That washer prevents the chain from sliding off the end of the drive spur, may have got knocked off when your chains came off? 

If you have to buy parts I would loo at going ahead and swapping the spur drive for a rim drive.

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## LittleLebowski (Jun 3, 2016)

@fordf150 am I missing a part? Let me know.


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## fordf150 (Jun 3, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> @fordf150 am I missing a part? Let me know.


Yep, missing the washer and E clip. Apparently got knocked off when it threw the chain.


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## Franny K (Jun 3, 2016)

raventai said:


> If you have to buy parts I would loo at going ahead and swapping the spur drive for a rim drive.


I tried to bring this up before he decided what model or brand chainsaw to buy but did not intend on getting anything extra like bars or sprockets. There is not really a good rim drive for the 3/8lp unless you get a Stihl saw.


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## raventai (Jun 3, 2016)

There is a dolmar .325 rim, I assumed there was a 3/8 picco also? Aparently not.

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## LittleLebowski (Jun 3, 2016)

Got links to these parts suggestions? @fordf150, can you sell me what I need on the missing parts?


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## raventai (Jun 3, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> Got links to these parts?



http://www.makitatools.com/en-us/Modules/Tools/ToolDetails.aspx?Name=EA4300F40B

For a drawing of the missing bits Click on parts breakdown, page 10 & 11, item # 133 & 134.



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## fordf150 (Jun 3, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> Got links to these parts suggestions? @fordf150, can you sell me what I need on the missing parts?


yep. shoot me a pm and i will get them in an envelope and on there way


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## fordf150 (Jun 3, 2016)

@LittleLebowski your missing #133 and 134 in the lower right corner


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## LittleLebowski (Jun 3, 2016)

I'm kind of invested in 3/8 chains, not sure if I should consider switching to .325, any benefits to this?

Sending PM, fordf150. Great support as always!


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## 7sleeper (Jun 3, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> I'm kind of invested in 3/8 chains, not sure if I should consider switching to .325, any benefits to this?


No!

7


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## fordf150 (Jun 3, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> I'm kind of invested in 3/8 chains, not sure if I should consider switching to .325, any benefits to this?
> 
> Sending PM, fordf150. Great support as always!


if your happy with the 3/8lp chain....stick with it.


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## Andyshine77 (Jun 3, 2016)

3/8 low-pro is the best chain for the 421 IMHO.

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## LittleLebowski (Jun 3, 2016)

I was more than a little surprised to see "Trilink" 16" 3/8 .050 lowpro at Walmart.


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## LittleLebowski (Jun 3, 2016)

fordf150 said:


> if your happy with the 3/8lp chain....stick with it.



If I like my 3/8 chain, I can keep my 3/8 chain?


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## 7sleeper (Jun 3, 2016)

Andyshine77 said:


> 3/8 low-pro is the best chain for the 421 IMHO.


I am also going to switch to 3/8 low pro as soon as my 325 setup is worn down on my 420. 

7


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## CoreyB (Jun 3, 2016)

I like the lopro stuff myself.


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## Michigan Escapee (Jun 3, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> If I like my 3/8 chain, I can keep my 3/8 chain?


 Yes, but you can only use it on a 10-14 inch bar, no more than two days a week, but not if a bird or a squirrel is watching, because you don't wanna traumatize them.


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## LittleLebowski (Jun 5, 2016)

Took 7Sleeper's advice and cleaned up with my air compressor, glad I did. Thanks, man. 

24 trouble free tanks of fuel. The Teutonic design impresses me. When cold, you pull twice on full choke, go to normal, pull twice, it starts. Not once, not thrice. Twice, always.

Regarding dealer support, I lost some non critical parts (last page or two in this thread. My dealer @fordf150 saw that on here, sent me the parts. That's how he rolls, I never worry about dealer support for my Dolmar.


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## LittleLebowski (Jun 5, 2016)

Franny K said:


> I think it is on post 291 there are missing parts in the picture you posted. an e clip and a washer of sorts. Perhaps you just had them off at the time of the picture.



Thanks again for catching that.


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## NC Cutter (Jun 6, 2016)

Did anyone who owns or has owned both lay out the pros and cons of each? I know the 450 is a consumer saw with some pro features and the 421 is as well. I'm not a fan of outboard clutches if the 450 has one.

I found a barely used 450 cheap locally. I'm wondering if it's worth the hassle and extra expense for the Dolmar. I've read about their fuel line issues. What does a new Dolmar 421 cost from an online dealer?


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## fordf150 (Jun 6, 2016)

NC Cutter said:


> Did anyone who owns or has owned both lay out the pros and cons of each? I know the 450 is a consumer saw with some pro features and the 421 is as well. I'm not a fan of outboard clutches if the 450 has one.
> 
> I found a barely used 450 cheap locally. I'm wondering if it's worth the hassle and extra expense for the Dolmar. I've read about their fuel line issues. What does a new Dolmar 421 cost from an online dealer?


cant speak to the 450....saw a few pass thru the shop but never paid much attention.

think of the 421 as pro saw with a couple homeowner features, spur drum and plastic wrap handle, instead of a homeowner saw with pro features. 

$320 shipped is the going rate on a 421


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## NC Cutter (Jun 6, 2016)

Is $320 pho? I've read the bars are kind of junky anyway. Not sure about 3/8 low pro either, but some seem to like it.

I was seriously considering one for my little saw and was actually going to IM you sometime this week to ask about particulars. This has me thinking otherwise for $70 cheaper. I'll have to think on it.

This thread kind of turned into a Dolmar fan fast with very little factual comparison. The little 421 does seem to have quite the following! I have read a few threads on here where the owners were not happy though.


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## 7sleeper (Jun 6, 2016)

NC Cutter said:


> Is $320 pho? I've read the bars are kind of junky anyway. Not sure about 3/8 low pro either, but some seem to like it.
> 
> I was seriously considering one for my little saw and was actually going to IM you sometime this week to ask about particulars. This has me thinking otherwise for $70 cheaper. I'll have to think on it.
> 
> This thread kind of turned into a Dolmar fan fast with very little factual comparison. The little 421 does seem to have quite the following! I have read a few threads on here where the owners were not happy though.


As @fordf150 already mentioned, I see it the same that the 421 is pro saw with homeowner features. 

I have 325 on my 420 (old version) and am quite happy. Personally I have nothing to lament about because my chains are usually quite sharp. At least the pros I sometimes work with mention it. That might also be the reason my "low class" saw's easily cut with the rest of the boys...

The bars are as good as it gets for a all in one package. You won't be getting anything better on a husqvarna, small to medium echo, etc. If you expect a sugi hara or tsumura type bar expect to pay 100$ extra!

To be serious, I donot see this as a Dolmar fan post thread. The guys here are just describing their experience. Of course everyone is on a different level of experience and if you cannot distinguish between the members, then one easily gets the impression this is a fan thread. 

I would be interested which threads that were where the owners were not happy. Do you have links?

7


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## LittleLebowski (Jun 6, 2016)

It's $320 shipped to you with chain and bar. I spent a lot of time research it and did not find threads where owners were unhappy with it; I'd appreciate links to the ones you found. 

Insofar as "fan fest thread," I think that to you so much positivity is indicative of a "fan fest" but have you considered that 


Dolmar saws are nearly always well spoken of by their owners
There is not another 40cc pro or "semi-pro" class saw that you can buy for under $500.


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## NC Cutter (Jun 6, 2016)

I think I punched in variations of Husqvarna 450 vs Dolmar 421, which is better, which more reliable etc. Not trying to be an ass, but this has been over a several week period and I've cleared history several times since. I know one from here is like "wanting to replace my Dolmar 421". I'm not sure how to copy and paste from this phone anyway to be honest.

Almost ever review describe the 421 bar as less than optimal, home owner grade on a pro saw or simply "junk".

ETA: most of the reviews and comments are very positive on the Dolmar 421 as well as the service from Ford f150. Just wanted to add that in case someone thought my intention was to take it across the coals.


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## NC Cutter (Jun 6, 2016)

Back to the question, what are the exact differences between the 450 and 450 rancher? I see a weight difference, but no explanation. I called Husqvarna customer service and they didn't know. One is considerably heavier than the 421 and that would tip the scales for me in Dolmar favor if in fact that was the actual 450 weight.


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## RedFir Down (Jun 6, 2016)

NC Cutter said:


> Back to the question, *what are the exact differences between the 450 and 450 rancher?* I see a weight difference, but no explanation. I called Husqvarna customer service and they didn't know. One is considerably heavier than the 421 and that would tip the scales for me in Dolmar favor if in fact that was the actual 450 weight.


The only difference between the 2 is the sticker on the recoil cover. I had both new on the bench a while back and looked them over real close and thats the only difference. They also weigh the exact same, 11.1 lbs on my scale.


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## fordf150 (Jun 6, 2016)

I am a dolmar fanboy and dont try to hide it but i also think that i give pretty fair advise on most saws. I readily admit the dolmars failings....most of the time that amounts to size and weight penalties. 

421 is the 2nd best saw in the 40cc class to me, 1# spot goes to the Stihl 241 but are you willing to pay $230 more for a saw that the only real advantage is it has a bit slimmer profile and weighs a few ounces less? I am not but in all fairness i havent ran a 241 so maybe they are that much better. Everything else is a big compromise compared to the 421, how much do you want to give up in build quality to save a few bucks.

421 has a few flaws in past models that sometimes showed up, the fuel line issue which has since been fixed, occasional coil failure....never had one in my hand but have sold a half dozen coils over the last few years.....cant think of any other parts that i have sold for these saws other than a few clutch covers which isnt a design flaw....that just normal use or abuse IMHO


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## 7sleeper (Jun 6, 2016)

Well we now know from this thread that some newbys can loose the circlip and washer... 




@NC Cutter,

If your question is pointig at what saw is better, 450 or 421? Then my answer is this.

If I was presented either saw, I truely do believe that, with proper maintenance, they will both last the homeowner at least 2 to 3 decades! Personally I wouldn't mind owning either and cutting my type of firewood with either. I seriously doubt that over a days work, either saw would give me any speed advantage!

If I spend my money, I have certain criteria that are important for me. It all comes down to build quality and there is one point that kind of disturbes me with the clam shell designs. The bar nuts are simply turned into the plastic! I have seen over the years quite a few threads about "ripped out barnuts". In the beginning of the clamshell era the saw's engine extended so far out front that the bar nuts were in the engine housing!

7


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## Franny K (Jun 6, 2016)

7sleeper said:


> there is one point that kind of disturbes me with the clam shell designs. The bar nuts are simply turned into the plastic!
> 
> 7



I am not sure what the ipl shows it looks like two t bolts and one threaded stud. The t bolts go through a metal channel that would rest against the plastic the way it looks to me. Just because one brand threads into the plastic does not mean they all do.

The Husqvarna top handle "clamshell" gasoline saws (I think only one at this point) do have metal that goes to connect with the bar stud.


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## Chris-PA (Jun 6, 2016)

7sleeper said:


> there is one point that kind of disturbes me with the clam shell designs. The bar nuts are simply turned into the plastic!


That is only on Stihls. They also put inboard clutches next to the plastic case, with predictable results. Other companies understand the materials properties better than that.


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## NC Cutter (Jun 6, 2016)

One thing that people complain about with the farm grade Husky's is that they're sold in Lowes. I see that as an advantage over other makes. Lowes stores are everywhere, they carry a decent supply of parts for these saws (filters, chains, bars), are usually well stocked in those parts and have very liberal hours compared to the average saw shop. The disadvantage is the obvious lack of service.

Stihl has caught on and are branching out to hardware stores, garden centers and some department style farm stores like Rural King. That's great for the consumer, but bad for the small dealer.


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## SCOTTS_4X (Jun 6, 2016)

I've put a good 8-10 cords of wood in a trailer with my 450 since last October with zero problems. I keep the saw clean, chain sharp and adjusted, air filter clean, gas fresh (no more than a month or 2 old) and it's given me flawless performance, and it's even a refurb unit. I don't think anyone here who takes care of their saws and is one of the "pro or nothing" guys has ever worn out a lesser saw. yes they break, but I'd venture a guess that it's mostly due to lack of maintenance/upkeep or just straight negligence. that's my .02

-scott


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## RedFir Down (Jun 6, 2016)

NC Cutter said:


> One thing that people complain about with the farm grade Husky's is that they're sold in Lowes. I see that as an advantage over other makes. Lowes stores are everywhere, they carry a decent supply of parts for these saws (filters, chains, bars), are usually well stocked in those parts and have very liberal hours compared to the average saw shop. The disadvantage is the obvious lack of service.
> 
> Stihl has caught on and are branching out to hardware stores, garden centers and some department style farm stores like Rural King. That's great for the consumer, but bad for the small dealer.


I disagree. Wait till you have a problem with a saw that you bought from a box store that you can't figure out and you take it back to them for repair... chances are you will get a look like your an alien from mars or something of the sort.

Here's a little story. I was buying trimmer line at Home Depot awhile back. Down the isle I heard a guys asking a store worker what bar and chain he needed for his saw that he bought there. I listen for a few minutes (while the employee was clearly thoroughly confused) as I was looking over there line selection. As I walked past I humbly pointed out the set up the customer needed for his saw. 

We need respectable dealers for O P E.


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## NC Cutter (Jun 6, 2016)

The models that each respective products fit is printed prominently on the front of the Husqvarna packaging. The customer and store employee sound clueless.

Warranties are worthless as I've found out. Especially the Husqvarna warranty. I took mine into the local dealer for a recoil and he charged me for the part, but changed it out. Said getting them to pay for warranty work was like pulling teeth and that he wouldn't get paid for that. So to answer your question, if I was faced with an issue I couldn't fix, it would go to the dealer or a small engine place and I'd be treated the same regardless of where I bought the saw.

Good, honest dealers would be great, but they're a rarity today. I know of none that would qualify locally and that includes all makes.


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## MountainHigh (Jun 6, 2016)

RedFir Down said:


> I disagree. Wait till you have a problem with a saw that you bought from a box store that you can't figure out and you take it back to them for repair... chances are you will get a look like your an alien from mars or something of the sort.
> 
> We need respectable dealers for O P E.



Well said ^ .... I _'suspect'_ traditional saw dealers are challenged by different levels of support from saw manufacturers depending on their volume. My dealer does high volume and the reps seem to pay close attention to what they ask for.

 - "alien from mars" lol


Just muff modded my ea4300/421 the other day. Hoping to get out soon with screw drivers to give it a run, richen it up a bit and see the difference. Will be hunting for rich burble out of the cut. Great little saw!


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## RedFir Down (Jun 6, 2016)

NC Cutter said:


> The models that each respective products fit is printed prominently on the front of the Husqvarna packaging. The customer and store employee sound clueless.


Most consumers buying a saw at a box store are clueless, that's part of the problem.


NC Cutter said:


> if I was faced with an issue I couldn't fix, it would go to the dealer or a small engine place and* I'd be treated the same regardless*.


I highly doubt that would be the case if you did not buy from them. You scratch my back, I scratch your back kind of deal.


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## Grey (Jun 6, 2016)

I was set on picking up a Dolmar 421 based on price and quality. However, Husqvarna is throwing in their 543xp's as a package deal with their zero-turn mowers. I was able to pick one up NIB for a major discount from a zero-turn buyer. It was a win-win deal. This is a quality, Japan-built saw with time-tested technology (Zeohah/Redmax http://www.arboristsite.com/community/threads/40cc-shoot-out.233295/). I highly recommend this saw IF you can get it for what it's worth ($3-400). If not, bend over and get yourself an Stihl MS241C.


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## LittleLebowski (Jun 6, 2016)

Grey said:


> If not, bend over and get yourself an Stihl MS241C.



Why not a Dolmar 421?


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## LittleLebowski (Jun 6, 2016)

NC Cutter said:


> The models that each respective products fit is printed prominently on the front of the Husqvarna packaging. The customer and store employee sound clueless.
> 
> Warranties are worthless as I've found out. Especially the Husqvarna warranty. I took mine into the local dealer for a recoil and he charged me for the part, but changed it out. Said getting them to pay for warranty work was like pulling teeth and that he wouldn't get paid for that. So to answer your question, if I was faced with an issue I couldn't fix, it would go to the dealer or a small engine place and I'd be treated the same regardless of where I bought the saw.
> 
> Good, honest dealers would be great, but they're a rarity today. I know of none that would qualify locally and that includes all makes.



It's $15 to send my Dolmar to @fordf150 if needed. Peace of mind. I lost some parts on my 421, he saw that and had them in the mail before I knew he'd mailed them.


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## LittleLebowski (Jun 7, 2016)

MountainHigh said:


> Just muff modded my ea4300/421 the other day. Hoping to get out soon with screw drivers to give it a run, richen it up a bit and see the difference. Will be hunting for rich burble out of the cut. Great little saw!



From what I understand, it's a eighth to a quarter turn richer. Please keep us updated!


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## Customz4 (Jun 7, 2016)

You wouldn't go wrong with a Dolmar 421..especially a a muff modded one..They are easy to mod the muffler too and retune and very easy to start...


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## LittleLebowski (Jun 7, 2016)

Yup, got a 421 and love it. Have not muffler modded it because of concerns of voiding the warranty.


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## Customz4 (Jun 7, 2016)

My father currently has the 421 that I had and muff modded.... That's still in the two year warranty period and never had any issues....can't tell it's been modded other than sound and how good it pulls in wood.... All I did was remove cat from inside muffler


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## LittleLebowski (Jun 7, 2016)

Customz4 said:


> My father currently has the 421 that I had and muff modded.... That's still in the two year warranty period and never had any issues....can't tell it's been modded other than sound and how good it pulls in wood.... All I did was remove cat from inside muffler



I'd love to buy a spare muffler to try this out. How much of a difference did it make?


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## Customz4 (Jun 7, 2016)

It makes a fairly big difference... One is it runs a lot cooler along with better response and power


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## LittleLebowski (Jun 7, 2016)

Did weight/handling change much?


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## Customz4 (Jun 7, 2016)

Weight changed a little but handling didn't change


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## Grey (Jun 7, 2016)

Weight.  To me, a 40 cc. saw is all about light weight. I have a very powerful 50 cc. saw, and a few bigger ones already. As a single saw, the Dolmar looks a really good saw for a really good price.


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## LittleLebowski (Jun 7, 2016)

RedFir Down said:


> I disagree. Wait till you have a problem with a saw that you bought from a box store that you can't figure out and you take it back to them for repair... chances are you will get a look like your an alien from mars or something of the sort.
> 
> Here's a little story. I was buying trimmer line at Home Depot awhile back. Down the isle I heard a guys asking a store worker what bar and chain he needed for his saw that he bought there. I listen for a few minutes (while the employee was clearly thoroughly confused) as I was looking over there line selection. As I walked past I humbly pointed out the set up the customer needed for his saw.
> 
> We need respectable dealers for O P E.



I couldn't agree more. A Poulan, Home Depot, or Lowes warranty is not the same as your local dealer who knows you or say @fordf150. They're not even in the same ballpark. Two totally different concepts.


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## Kegerator5 (Jun 7, 2016)

Dolmar = pro quality
Husqvarna 450 = quality name, good saw.

Dolmar definitely built better. But unless you're a pro, the quality difference shouldn't make much of a difference. If you plan to stick with this site and get CAD, (goodluck trying not to get it)... which will most likely end up happening, most issues you have, you'll fix yourself, or at least attempt.

I've had my eye out for a dolmar 421 or makita ea4300 (actually would love to grab the makita ea4300), but I've only ever seen 2 that weren't "buy it now" new. One was non running and still sold for 175.. The other was new and box got beat up in shipping. Sold for 250...

With all that being said, that clearly shows the Dolmar is a very high desired saw, that almost never gets sold after bought. Meaning it's loved... But again, with a one saw plan, if anything acts up on it, you have no saw until shipped back to you.

If I had to pick 1, I'd go dolmar. But, if it was my only saw, and I needed a saw, I'd probably lean 450. Larger cc saw for 1 saw plan, and parts are easier to purchase (Lowes, or eBay always has tons of new and used 450 parts). Again, assuming those 2 are the only options.


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## LittleLebowski (Jun 7, 2016)

The lack of Dolmars being resold is what they would call "a clue" in police work


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## NC Cutter (Jun 8, 2016)

I know the OP made his decision, but I have a few questions for those familiar with both if y'all don't mind.

1. The Dolmar is a 40 cc listed at 2.9 HP and the Husky is a 50cc listed at 3.2 HP. Will gutting the cat make up the difference in HP or even surpass the Husky for power? Also some posters have commented that the Dolmar felt like it had adequate torque, but lacked rpm.

2. Where are you guys buying parts for these saws? None of the local dealers are carrying parts or saws for that matter.

3. I noticed some older posts mentioned the saw shipping with a nice case. Is Dolmar still doing this?

4. Is the weight on the Dolmar correct at 10.8 lbs?
Thanks!


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## Kegerator5 (Jun 8, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> The lack of Dolmars being resold is what they would call "a clue" in police work



Police work? They do? Lol just kidding 
But I completely agree. Which is why, the last thing I need is another 38-42cc saw... Yet if I came across a good deal on dolmar/makita 420/421/ea4300... I'd buy it.



NC Cutter said:


> I know the OP made his decision, but I have a few questions for those familiar with both if y'all don't mind.
> 
> 1. The Dolmar is a 40 cc listed at 2.9 HP and the Husky is a 50cc listed at 3.2 HP. Will gutting the cat make up the difference in HP or even surpass the Husky for power? Also some posters have commented that the Dolmar felt like it had adequate torque, but lacked rpm.
> 
> ...



1- I'm not real sure on HP.. But I just can't see it making up 8-10cc just by cat mod. Could be wrong, have been in the past, just seems too much of a jump.

2- eBay had parts. All my local dealers are stihl, husqvarna, echo, and 1 jred... I Know of no local dolmar dealers. As to husqvarna, you can find a TON of 450 parts or even parts saws.. Dolmar has some used, lots more new... Or, ask around. A few members here are dolmar dealers and can help you out with parts.. Idk members well enough to mention who supplies what, sorry current members.

3- the one on eBay I saw, was brand new and had a badly beat up box, which is why the dealer was selling on eBay. no case mentioned or shown. Which makes me think it is no longer sold with saws.


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## GeorgiaVol (Jun 8, 2016)

Nm


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## fordf150 (Jun 8, 2016)

@NC Cutter 

1. The Dolmar is a 40 cc listed at 2.9 HP and the Husky is a 50cc listed at 3.2 HP. Will gutting the cat make up the difference in HP or even surpass the Husky for power? Also some posters have commented that the Dolmar felt like it had adequate torque, but lacked rpm.

No its not going to make up the difference but they will be close enough in power that you probably wouldnt prefer one over the other. Torque is what makes the 421 what it is, its not a high RPM limbing saw but more of a all around saw that is just as happy buried bar deep as it is cutting 3" limbs. I dont think there is any one thing that makes people love the 421 but rather its a combination of traits that make it great all around small saw that in many cases feels like it punches above its class

2. Where are you guys buying parts for these saws? None of the local dealers are carrying parts or saws for that matter.

Several good dealers(including me) that stock lots of parts for them and ship. Finding good local dealers is difficult depending on your area. 

3. I noticed some older posts mentioned the saw shipping with a nice case. Is Dolmar still doing this?


shipping with a case was a certain online retailer, not sure if they are still selling them that way though and near as i could tell they didnt mess with parts and any warranty work they claimed the saw needed shipped back to them IIRC. thats been awhile back so my memory may be wrong. I dont mess with the Dolmar cases, too expensive and the echo toughchest is a much better option if you want a box

4. Is the weight on the Dolmar correct at 10.8 lbs?


Just threw one on the scale to check......PHO with about 1/3 tank of fuel and oil....10.8 lbs


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## NC Cutter (Jun 8, 2016)

Thanks for taking the time to answer fordf150! Still debating on what's best for me. If I end up getting the Dolmar, it will be from you.


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## mountainlake (Jun 8, 2016)

The Dolmar is a 40 cc listed at 2.9 HP and the Husky is a 50cc listed at 3.2 HP


Keep in mind those are manufactures published numbers and are often fudged, which one saws the fastest . Steve


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## Franny K (Jun 8, 2016)

With a bore of 42mm ans a stroke of 30.6mm the Dolmar comes out at 42.4cc. Some of the other stuff is likely rounded off maybe even rounded off before converting to hp.

From the 421/351 owners manual and the Husqvarna website USA version I see they both claim max torque of 2.6NM. The number that really stands out is the fuel consumption, I am guessing both numbers are at max power like it says in the 421 manual. 504 g/hr for the Husqvarna 450 and 900 g/hr for the Dolmar 421 and that likely goes higher with modifying the muffler/catalyst.

I would not do detective work on the sales/re-sales numbers unless you make sure you are working off a percentage of sold, not absolute numbers.


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## LittleLebowski (Jun 8, 2016)

Wow on the fuel consumption.


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## NC Cutter (Jun 8, 2016)

Wow, so the Dolmar is a thirsty little piggy. I would have guessed the other way around given their respective cc.


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## Rio95 (Jun 8, 2016)

Franny K said:


> With a bore of 42mm ans a stroke of 30.6mm the Dolmar comes out at 42.4cc. Some of the other stuff is likely rounded off maybe even rounded off before converting to hp.
> 
> From the 421/351 owners manual and the Husqvarna website USA version I see they both claim max torque of 2.6NM. The number that really stands out is the fuel consumption, I am guessing both numbers are at max power like it says in the 421 manual. 504 g/hr for the Husqvarna 450 and 900 g/hr for the Dolmar 421 and that likely goes higher with modifying the muffler/catalyst.
> 
> I would not do detective work on the sales/re-sales numbers unless you make sure you are working off a percentage of sold, not absolute numbers.



Watch your units there. Husqvarna lists 504g/*kW*h for the 450 and Dolmar lists 480g/*kW*h, so the Dolmar actually uses less fuel to get the same power. Husqvarna don't list a kg/h at max load like Dolmar do. See page 18 of http://download.dolmar.com/manuals/20237.pdf and the bottom of this page http://www.husqvarna.com/au/products/chainsaws/450/967187838/


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## Franny K (Jun 9, 2016)

That is good someone caught that. There were two values on the Dolmar manual and one on the husky site. I know my 351 is less fuel effecient than the 421 from the manual.


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## Kegerator5 (Jun 10, 2016)

I hope I don't offend anyone. But if I'm looking for a quality saw, one that I intend to count on, day in and day out...
The last thing I'm checking is fuel consumption...

MAYBE the only time I'd consider that, is if I'm looking at a dolmar 420 and 421... Just seeing every little + and - with the new model.

But when comparing these 2, popular models, fuel consumption is something I would not even check. Both are established, both are well liked all over...

That said, I understand and do appreciate the outside observation that I truthfully would've never even thought about checking....... BUT, if you're buying a saw that will cut wood to heat your home, and not looking at an unknown saw, new model, than fuel consumption is not something that would have me lean one way or the other.

But, that is my opinion. Which might not even be worth 2 cents lol


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## MountainHigh (Jun 10, 2016)

fordf150 said:


> @NC Cutter
> I dont think there is any one thing that makes people love the 421 but rather its a combination of traits that make it great all around small saw that in many cases feels like it punches above its class



well said ...

EA4300/421 - I like the weight, the handling, the sturdy feel, the quality build, the easy start is like none other, the power is impressive, the suspension is top notch, the reported long term reliability, the low price. Have I missed anything? - lol 

Haven't been able to get up the hill this past week and it's raining hard today, so now that the cat is out I'll look for an opportunity next week to tune the saw on some rounds in my back yard. 

Enjoy your weekend.


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## Kegerator5 (Jun 10, 2016)

MountainHigh said:


> EA4300/421 - I like the weight, the handling, the sturdy feel, the quality build, the easy start is like none other, the power is impressive, the suspension is top notch, the reported long term reliability, the low price. Have I missed anything? - lol




Yes, you should've put an "O" face after that saw-gasm you just had there lol.


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## MountainHigh (Jun 10, 2016)

"Sawgasm" -  
Might be a good name for a new chain saw forum.
Sawgasm.com


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## MountainHigh (Jun 12, 2016)

MountainHigh said:


> well said ...
> 
> EA4300/421 - I like the weight, the handling, the sturdy feel, the quality build, the easy start is like none other, the power is impressive, the suspension is top notch, the reported long term reliability, the low price. Have I missed anything? - lol
> 
> ...



Note:
Forgot to add under the LIKE category: it is dead easy to do a muffler mod.

Only downside for me is the oiler on an 18" bar the ea4300 comes with is too stingy especially when you're burrying the bar (ya I know, this is after all just a 42cc, not my 562 - but it has the power to do much more than a normal 42cc IF the oiler gushed a little more). 16" bar or less would be far better on this saw to take advantage of its nice grunt _as well as _keep the bar from plugging up.


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## CoreyB (Jun 12, 2016)

With all the 421 love would someone post a video of one noodling some hard wood?


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## LittleLebowski (Jun 12, 2016)

CoreyB said:


> With all the 421 love would someone post a video of one noodling some hard wood?



I'll try to sooner or later, just busy splitting and stacking all of the wood it's already felled . Plus, that heat wave has been kicking.


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## raventai (Jun 12, 2016)

CoreyB said:


> With all the 421 love would someone post a video of one noodling some hard wood?


Sweet gum hard enough for you? By noodling you mean rip cut? 

Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk


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## Chris-PA (Jun 12, 2016)

MountainHigh said:


> Only downside for me is the oiler on an 18" bar the ea4300 comes with is too stingy especially when you're burrying the bar (ya I know, this is after all just a 42cc, not my 562 - but it has the power to do much more than a normal 42cc IF the oiler gushed a little more).


Now now, don't get too excited - that's not much of a test. Even my "normal" unported 42cc plastic Poulan will run an 18" bar buried in hardwood, and oil it too. Of course they'll oil everything else too, sometimes even without power.


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## CoreyB (Jun 13, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> I'll try to sooner or later, just busy splitting and stacking all of the wood it's already felled . Plus, that heat wave has been kicking.


Well that is the point of noodling to save yourself from swinging a maul. 


raventai said:


> Sweet gum hard enough for you? By noodling you mean rip cut?
> 
> Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk


Yep rip cut. How does sweet gum compair to oak or hickory? 
Either way I would like to check it out.


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## KiwiBro (Jun 13, 2016)

7sleeper said:


> Of course I donot recomend a bar length over 16 inch on such a saw size irrespective of model/brand.
> 
> 7


Well, you won't like the 20" semi-skip picco I will have on my 241 soon then. Who knows - I may not either, but I won't die wondering.


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## 7sleeper (Jun 13, 2016)

KiwiBro said:


> Well, you won't like the 20" semi-skip picco I will have on my 241 soon then. Who knows - I may not either, but I won't die wondering.


I don't remember ever seeing semi skip chain here. Although I wouldn't wonder if they had them on the supermarkt specials with 35cc and 16inch bar or 40cc and 18 inch bar.

7


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## raventai (Jun 13, 2016)

CoreyB said:


> Well that is the point of noodling to save yourself from swinging a maul.
> 
> Yep rip cut. How does sweet gum compair to oak or hickory?
> Either way I would like to check it out.


It's a bit softer than hickory or water oak, quite a bit softer than laurel or live oak. 

I have 4 laurel oaks, a half dead stunted live oak, and a massive long dead live oak to come down in the clearing I am working but those will be a few weekends away yet. 




Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk


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## MountainHigh (Jun 15, 2016)

raventai said:


> It's a bit softer than hickory or water oak, quite a bit softer than laurel or live oak.
> 
> I have 4 laurel oaks, a half dead stunted live oak, and a massive long dead live oak to come down in the clearing I am working but those will be a few weekends away yet.
> 
> ...



Lots of nice wood! Do you have to watch your step for venomous snakes? Nature channel shows Florida as creepy crawler reptile heaven


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## raventai (Jun 15, 2016)

Yes Coral snakes, I have killed about half a dozen over the years, about twice that got away. 

There are eastern diamond backs in this part of the state but they like dry sandy pine Forrest, they don't like the oak hammock I live in.




We have several kinds of rat snakes, black racers and several variety of lizards and frogs, and of course a seamingly endless variety of bugs, saw a grey cammo praying mantis on one of the felled trunks, has he not been moving i would have never seen him. 



If I have the ability to eradicate the corals here I will, 2 young kids and a third in the way. But moast likely my efforts will just keep the numbers down. 

Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk


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## MountainHigh (Jun 17, 2016)

eeeeeeesh - I'd be wearing knee high boots and chaps


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## 7sleeper (Jun 17, 2016)

MountainHigh said:


> eeeeeeesh - I'd be wearing knee high boots and chaps


That's what we have come to expect from you, running around in knee long high heeled boots....





7


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## raventai (Jun 17, 2016)

Lol, at 98 degrees with a matching humidity most of the time we run around in flip flops, unless I am doing serious work, work boots only come out when absolutely necessary. 

Last time I ran the saw it was boots, boxer shorts, ear plugs, safety glasses and saw chaps, that's it, still had to stop and head inside drink lots of water on a regular basis. The sweat just rains off of you, with high humidity it does not evaporate to cool you off.

Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk


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## LittleLebowski (Jun 17, 2016)

raventai said:


> Lol, at 98 degrees with a matching humidity most of the time we run around in flip flops, unless I am doing serious work, work boots only come out when absolutely necessary.
> 
> Last time I ran the saw it was boots boxer shorts and saw chaps, that's it, still had to stop and head inside drink lots of water on a regular basis. The sweat just rains off of you, with high humidity it does not evaporate to cool you off.



That's about how what I have to do, wearing pants with the chaps is enough to kill a woodsman. The heat is picking up.


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## MountainHigh (Jun 18, 2016)

7sleeper said:


> That's what we have come to expect from you, running around in knee long high heeled boots....
> 
> 7



Yup, been wearing high heeled boots for many years and proud of it.
Here's my original pair of Daytons from 1974 in a dainty pose for ya


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## KenJax Tree (Jun 18, 2016)

I know where there is a 421 in excellent condition for sale


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## CR888 (Jun 19, 2016)

Ripping = cutting horizontal to wood grain like with a mill. Noodling = cutting parallel to the grain. One way gets dust & is slow the later gets long noodles & is fast.


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## LittleLebowski (Jun 29, 2016)

31 tanks through the 421 now. _Three _today and I'm freaking tired, gents. It seems to have lost a little grunt when buried, I assume it needs a slight adjustment on the carb? Still rock solid reliable, always starts on the second pull cold no matter what. I tried some Stihl safety chain and I'm buying more Stihl chain but not safety. You can _feel _the quality difference between the Stihl and other brands.


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## CoreyB (Jun 29, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> 31 tanks through the 421 now. _Three _today and I'm freaking tired, gents. It seems to have lost a little grunt when buried, I assume it needs a slight adjustment on the carb? Still rock solid reliable, always starts on the second pull cold no matter what. I tried some Stihl safety chain and I'm buying more Stihl chain but not safety. You can _feel _the quality difference between the Stihl and other brands.


I like stihl chain best. I use Oregon a fair bit as well but prefer the stihl.


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## LittleLebowski (Jun 30, 2016)

CoreyB said:


> I like stihl chain best. I use Oregon a fair bit as well but prefer the stihl.



The difference is tangible. FYI, I've been meaning to tell you that my Dolmar also has that "hidden" oiler setting. I never even tried to check and see if mine does but you can push down and go up one more notch so I reckon there's four settings from the factory?


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## LittleLebowski (Jul 28, 2016)

At 38 tanks so far. Love my 421! Always tempted by the Makita 6400 locally for $322 from Home Depot (used) but so far, other needs take priorities.


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## Jeffkrib (Jul 29, 2016)

6400 are a good thing...... Infact worth selling a gun to pay for it.


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## LittleLebowski (Jul 29, 2016)

Jeffkrib said:


> 6400 are a good thing...... Infact worth selling a gun to pay for it.



How about selling a bike


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## RedneckChainsawRepair (Jul 29, 2016)

Jeffkrib said:


> 6400 are a good thing...... Infact worth selling a gun to pay for it.



Part 1 agree. Part 2 disagree.


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## LittleLebowski (Nov 8, 2016)

I love this Dolmar! I paid a local arborist to safely take down this sick white oak with a bad lean over my house and then I've been doing the rest after voting this morning.


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## RedneckChainsawRepair (Nov 8, 2016)

Nice to see a saw dirty and being used like they are suppose to be.


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## LittleLebowski (Nov 8, 2016)

JeremiahJohnson said:


> Nice to see a saw dirty and being used like they are suppose to be.



Think I'm at about 60 flawless tanks of fuel so far.


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## jakethesnake (Nov 8, 2016)

Better than the 5020?


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## Homelitexl903 (Nov 9, 2016)

What did you end up using to wrap the handle bar with?


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## LittleLebowski (Nov 10, 2016)

jakethesnake said:


> Better than the 5020?



That's like asking if a good quarter horse is better than a Shetland pony  This thing never quits, never lets me down, just sharpen the chain, add fuel, and oil. I want a bigger Dolmar bad, need to start watching the classifieds here.


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## LittleLebowski (Nov 10, 2016)

Homelitexl903 said:


> What did you end up using to wrap the handle bar with?



That's an old wrap of cheaper bike tape I did that clearly isn't very good, waiting for my old boss to come by and fix it up right.


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## GeorgiaVol (Nov 10, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> That's like asking if a good quarter horse is better than a Shetland pony  This thing never quits, never lets me down, just sharpen the chain, add fuel, and oil. I want a bigger Dolmar bad, need to start watching the classifieds here.



To be fair, it's more like asking if someone else's rigged up Silverado is better than a brand new Colorado.


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## LittleLebowski (Nov 10, 2016)

GeorgiaVol said:


> To be fair, it's more like asking if someone else's rigged up Silverado is better than a brand new Colorado.



In my experience, it's a pretty huge gulf between the two saws. Plus, the Colorado has widely reported shifting problems (I've been considering one for a while).


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## GeorgiaVol (Nov 10, 2016)

I was just refering to the 5020AV not being new, being a larger saw, and the Dolmar being professionally setup for you. Just not a fair comparison in my book. But I am glad you like your new saw.


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## LittleLebowski (Nov 10, 2016)

GeorgiaVol said:


> I was just refering to the 5020AV not being new, being a larger saw, and the Dolmar being professionally setup for you. Just not a fair comparison in my book. But I am glad you like your new saw.



Understood, prolly would have made more sense in person but tuning aside, the 5020 had other problems that I documented.


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## jakethesnake (Nov 10, 2016)

The 5020 isn't near the playing field a dolmar is. Nothing against either just a fact


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## LittleLebowski (Nov 10, 2016)

jakethesnake said:


> The 5020 isn't near the playing field a dolmar is. Nothing against either just a fact



Yup, that's what I was trying to say with my poor analogy.


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## CoreyB (Nov 10, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> Yup, that's what I was trying to say with my poor analogy.


28 min of sweet sounding 421 music. Plus testing different chains .


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## Homelitexl903 (Nov 11, 2016)

So I finally got a Dolmar 421 in blue. I plan on doing the muff mod and proper tune like I do on all my modern saws. I plan on ditching the chain it came with. My question for CoreyB, and others is what's the final result for best chain on this saw? I usually buy Stihl chain from my local saw shop but I have messed around with other brands I bought online. My question for Lebowski is how did the first go at the grip tape work? I sweat way more than a normal person in the summer and hate wearing gloves in the heat and I usually wear insulated leather gloves in the colder months and I would like more grip out of my plastic handle.


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## CoreyB (Nov 11, 2016)

Homelitexl903 said:


> So I finally got a Dolmar 421 in blue. I plan on doing the muff mod and proper tune like I do on all my modern saws. I plan on ditching the chain it came with. My question for CoreyB, and others is what's the final result for best chain on this saw? I usually buy Stihl chain from my local saw shop but I have messed around with other brands I bought online. My question for Lebowski is how did the first go at the grip tape work? I sweat way more than a normal person in the summer and hate wearing gloves in the heat and I usually wear insulated leather gloves in the colder months and I would like more grip out of my plastic handle.


I really like 3/8 lp on the 421. It will pull .325 fine but.....
Stihl ps is king I have good luck with Oregon 91vxl after I sharpened it lol
Stihl ps on a 16" bar is a really capable combo.


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## Andyshine77 (Nov 11, 2016)

Stihl PS all the way.



Sent from my HTC One_M8 using Tapatalk


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## LittleLebowski (Nov 18, 2016)

I assume that I need a new bar? Just dressed the edges off.


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## 7sleeper (Nov 18, 2016)

Nothing major wrong with your bar. Look's like you might have the chain a bit sloppy tightend. By the amount of paint left you should still run your bar at least half a dozen chains.

7


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## LittleLebowski (Nov 18, 2016)

I'm fairly certain it's been tightened properly after each sharpening but the Stihl chains still stretch a bit.


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## CoreyB (Nov 18, 2016)

The GB bars are cheep and seem to hold up pretty good.


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## Andyshine77 (Nov 18, 2016)

Still looks pretty good to me, but I do agree the chain was ran a bit loose. 

Sent from my HTC One_M8 using Tapatalk


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## LittleLebowski (Nov 18, 2016)

Andyshine77 said:


> Still looks pretty good to me, but I do agree the chain was ran a bit loose.



It loosened up in less than a tank, more than once. These pre tensioned Stihl chains definitely stretch.


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## Andyshine77 (Nov 18, 2016)

Make sure to lift up the tip of the bar when you tension the chain, it takes the slack out. Depending on a few variables tightening the chain may be required more than once a tank of fuel.

Sent from my HTC One_M8 using Tapatalk


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## Chris-PA (Nov 18, 2016)

Supposedly that wear spot/dip just behind the tip sprocket is from a loose chain, but all my narrow tip lo pro bars seem to do it. I suspect that somehow it is exacerbated by the small tip sprocket, but I don't know how. I think I read somewhere that it has to do with the chain links banging back against the bar after they come off the tip. It doesn't really make sense to me why the tip diameter would matter.


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## jakethesnake (Nov 19, 2016)

Bar is still good to go I run my chain loose normally anyhow that bar will run a long time as some others mentioned


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## Franny K (Nov 19, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> I'm fairly certain it's been tightened properly after each sharpening but the Stihl chains still stretch a bit.


I find the Stihl Picco chains take a while to start to need any adjustment. The brand x ones seem to need adjustment within the first tank. The bar in the picture is normal, maybe at most half way to being put aside. I think it is just the chain going around the sprocket and tending to want to continue in circular motion. Similar wear is common where the chain comes off the drive sprocket. In theory I think it should want to go off as a tangent so if the chain wraps more than half way around it will have some inward force. As things warm up the chain will tend to get a bit looser, the more so the longer the bar.


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## Ryan'smilling (Nov 19, 2016)

Homelitexl903 said:


> So I finally got a Dolmar 421 in blue. I plan on doing the muff mod and proper tune like I do on all my modern saws. I plan on ditching the chain it came with. My question for CoreyB, and others is what's the final result for best chain on this saw? I usually buy Stihl chain from my local saw shop but I have messed around with other brands I bought online. My question for Lebowski is how did the first go at the grip tape work? I sweat way more than a normal person in the summer and hate wearing gloves in the heat and I usually wear insulated leather gloves in the colder months and I would like more grip out of my plastic handle.



I've tried the 91vxl, the Carlton N1C, and the Stihl PS. The Stihl is nice chain, and definitely fast. It's also not cheap. I like the Carlton and the Oregon pretty well also. I think the 3/8lp just makes that saw seem very zippy. Even with a semi chisel chain, it cuts pretty quick for its size. The Oregon and Carlton are much cheaper. I paid $10/loop for my 56dl loops of Carlton.


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## CoreyB (Nov 19, 2016)

I agree the 421 with lp is better then .325. I know many guys run it and the 421 pulls it just fine but you do lose something especially limbing .


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## Chris-PA (Nov 19, 2016)

I was running a narrow tip lo pro bar today and looking at it I see it is more tapered going to the narrow tip. Maybe this means the links are getting pulling into the bar more than on larger tip bars.


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## LittleLebowski (Nov 19, 2016)

Franny K said:


> I find the Stihl Picco chains take a while to start to need any adjustment.



I have had the opposite experience.


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## LittleLebowski (Nov 22, 2016)

CoreyB said:


> The GB bars are cheep and seem to hold up pretty good.



Is this the one you got for your 421?

http://leftcoastsupplies.com/product/16-gb-arbor-tech-bar-38lp/


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## Homelitexl903 (Nov 22, 2016)

I think the 421 is ao41 mount. The bar in the link was ao74.


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## fordf150 (Nov 22, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> Is this the one you got for your 421?
> 
> http://leftcoastsupplies.com/product/16-gb-arbor-tech-bar-38lp/


http://leftcoastsupplies.com/product/18-gb-arbor-tech-bar/ your looking for A041 mount


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## fordf150 (Nov 22, 2016)

at quick glance i didnt see any 16" A041 bars available...only 12 and 18"


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## tpence2177 (Nov 22, 2016)

I don't notice a lot of GB arbor bars in 16" period. I was looking for a .325 0.50 16" bar for my Husqvarna 51 and can't find any for it either. 

Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk


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## CoreyB (Nov 22, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> Is this the one you got for your 421?
> 
> http://leftcoastsupplies.com/product/16-gb-arbor-tech-bar-38lp/


Nope.
This one
http://leftcoastsupplies.com/product/18-gb-arbor-tech-bar/


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## LittleLebowski (Nov 22, 2016)

CoreyB said:


> Nope.
> This one
> http://leftcoastsupplies.com/product/18-gb-arbor-tech-bar/



I don't want an 18" bar but that price makes that pretty darned tempting...


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## CoreyB (Nov 22, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> I don't want an 18" bar but that price makes that pretty darned tempting...


Ya I think a 16" is good for the 421. it does ok with the 18.
I also have a 14" I really like that.


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## Ryan'smilling (Nov 22, 2016)

I'm rocking one of those 12" arbortech bars on my 421. At $9 for the bar and about that much for a loop of chain, i figured it'd be fun to try. It's a super fun little setup. I put it in the hands of my buddy who runs a tree service while I was helping him with a job the other day. He also thought it was pretty slick.


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## CoreyB (Nov 22, 2016)

I like using the 14" for felling. it handles those 12" oak and hickory just great and narrow enough to do a bore cut with a trigger . great little worker.


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## Chris-PA (Nov 22, 2016)

LittleLebowski said:


> I don't want an 18" bar but that price makes that pretty darned tempting...


That's a nice bar, but note that it is 68DL instead of the typical 62Dl for lo pro 18" bars. It ends up about an inch longer. This is a 20" Poulan bar, the 68DL GB bar and a 62DL lo pro bar:




This was a test of a different 42cc saw running that bar fully buried in ash - it will make your saw work:


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