# How much will a spruce 20' 8"x8" shrink?



## Cowboy Billy (Nov 2, 2009)

Last year I logged some spruce to build a entry way into a trailer with. I had a friend saw four 8"x8"x20' beams to build it on so I could skid it if when I move the trailer. 

Now here is my question I cut the beams 20' 6" to 21' I started building it last week and two of my beams measured 19' 11.5" which was no big deal and it all worked out.

My friend say I was drunk and messed up. I know wood will shrink with ways when it dries. But I never thought about it shrinking length ways. Does it or was I drunk

Decking the 8x8's with 1.5" spruce boards that were cut and sawed at the same time as the 8x8's 







Checking out the shooting height of the window opening.











Billy


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## mtngun (Nov 2, 2009)

Cowboy Billy said:


> My friend say I was drunk and messed up. I know wood will shrink with ways when it dries. But I never thought about it shrinking length ways. Does it or was I drunk




What were you drinking ?

Is that a hunting cabin ? 

Good thread.


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## deeker (Nov 2, 2009)

Spruce of 12"x1.5"x8' will shrink no more than one inch each way for 12 years if it was cut by one who had been drinking.

Most shrinking will be from the width..an eighth of an inch to a quarter with 12" and less for the thickness.

You should not lose more than one quarter to half of an inch in length at the very most.

Seal the ends. Anchor seal is my favorite. Latex paint will do a good job. 

Great pics, keep posting 'em.

Kevin


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## Sawyer Rob (Nov 3, 2009)

I've never seen a beam or even a stick of lumber shrink "lengthwise" any measurable amount at all. Wood doesn't shrink on the long grain, it shrinks in width.

BTW, i see you are in Mi.. Within 10 years the carpenter ants are going to be in that untreated lumber so bad, you are going to wish you had bought some PT lumber!

Rob


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## Cowboy Billy (Nov 3, 2009)

Howdy Mtngun

Depending on the time of day Guinness Extra Stout, Jack and Coke or Vodka and OJ. My Dad Brother and I have 120 acres of woods in Michigan's eastern UP about 40 miles past the Mackinaw Bridge. It adjoins my Uncles 240 acres and Cousins 80. My Uncles is where our big summer vacation was. So our property is combination hunting and vacation. Rather than having one big cabin. We are going to have 3-4 small cabins. That way when my brothers and sister come up with their familys everyone will have there own cabin. We will also make a 20'x20' screened in pavilion where we can have family dinners and party

Thanks Kevin

That's good to know. I'll have to keep drinking so it doesn't dry out too fast Dad did paint it last week when he painted the osb sheeting we used. I plan on siding it with 1/4 round cedar next year.

Thanks Rob

I did screw and glue treated 2x8's to the bottom of the 8x8's and those sit on treated 4x4's. To try to keep the moisture from wicking into the 8x8's. I hope that helps keep the ants at bay. But maybe I should soak them in alcohol?

A few more pictures of the building











And a few from the the logging last year
















Billy


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## Backwoods (Nov 3, 2009)

Cowboy Billy said:


>



In this photo, it shows that one of the 8x8s is shorter then the others, but I can only see one end, so if you don’t mind, would you walk around to the other end and see if it is flush with the ends of the other beams.
Being drunk would be the best explanation of why the beams had shrunk length wise as the cells in the wood swell and shrink in diameter not in length, other wise we would be seeing trees out there in the forest bobbing up and down. But do let us know if the trees in your area are bobbing up and down as they may be a new species,:wave: either that or someone has had to much to drink and is having trouble standing.


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## billstuewe (Nov 4, 2009)

I agree, If your timbers have shrunk lengthwise someone has had way too much to drink--probably the guy that made the cut. Maybe someone stepped on his tape measure. Anyway, check out this link.

http://www.woodweb.com/Resources/RSCalculators.html

It will give you all kinds of great info on shrinkage, etc. Go to the forums page 

http://www.woodweb.com/SiteMapForums.html

and then to the Sawing and Drying Forum and do a search for "longitudinal shrinkage"
Have fun,
Bill


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## FJH (Nov 4, 2009)

Cowboy Billy said:


> Howdy Mtngun
> 
> Depending on the time of day Guinness Extra Stout, Jack and Coke or Vodka and OJ. My Dad Brother and I have 120 acres of woods in Michigan's eastern UP about 40 miles past the Mackinaw Bridge. It adjoins my Uncles 240 acres and Cousins 80. My Uncles is where our big summer vacation was. So our property is combination hunting and vacation. Rather than having one big cabin. We are going to have 3-4 small cabins. That way when my brothers and sister come up with their familys everyone will have there own cabin. We will also make a 20'x20' screened in pavilion where we can have family dinners and party
> 
> ...


Bill You seem to be in the middle of nowhere there,
I have to ask ?where do you get your water and how do you deal with your sewage.


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## Cowboy Billy (Nov 4, 2009)

Howdy Backwoods

I would get my time machine out and get that picture for you but is seems it is not working. It can't even tell me how long I cut those logs I have been known to bob up and down at times and bounce off a tree a time or two. I think I am going to have to go back up sit down next to the trees and see if they are going up and down The answer may be that they were stretched out reaching for the sun and now they are curled up taking a nap:jawdrop:

Thanks Bill

I bookmarked that page. Way too much to read at one time. But I can see I will be referring to it a lot. Its obvious to me now that I measured wrong. But I sure have leaned a lot because of it.

Hi FJH

We had to make a 1/4 mile road across my Uncle's property from the end a dead end road just to get to ours. The closest power is over a half mile away. We have a 20hp diesel running a 12k generator head and two solar panels on 24v forklift battery and 5000 watt power inverter for power. We also have two 750 windgenerators we haven't put up yet. For now we have a 60gal water tank we fill up at my cousins and set next to the trailer with a shallow well pump. And bring up bottled water to drink. We don't use the bathroom in the trailer. But are using a out house in the woods. Once we get a pole barn up. We are going to put a shower bathroom and laundry in it hooked to a septic tank and field.

Billy


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## Brmorgan (Nov 5, 2009)

You can expect green Spruce to shrink about 4% as it dries past the "fiber saturation point" which is generally 19-23% Moisture Content in softwoods. At 8" wide, you can calculate 8 X 0.04 = 0.32 X 16 = 5.12, or 5/16". So you can expect it to end up at about 7-5/8" to 7-11/16". If it's a box-heart beam, meaning the pith center of the tree is (relatively) in the center of the beam, you can expect even shrinkage across all faces of the piece. If not, you might end up with more shrinkage in one direction than the other, because the wood will tend to shrink more radially than laterally - that is, it would shrink more perpendicular to the growth rings than it would parallel to them.


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## rarefish383 (Nov 6, 2009)

Great pix. I was up on my farm in WV this past week end. I was thinking about milling the wood to build an 8X8 room on the back of our trailer. Every one gave me so much stuff about taking the time I got mad and mowed the field. I'll just go up after hunting season and do it with a friend that doesn't know so much. What year is your IH tractor? It looks a lot like my dads old 57 C 130, Joe.


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## Cowboy Billy (Nov 25, 2009)

Thanks Brad

The beams are box-heart. There are only a few spruce trees on the property that are big and strait enough to be able to get a 8x8 out of 20' up. If I had wanted to go with white pine I would not have had a problem.

Howdy RareFish

I think I was told it was a 58 when I bought it. But I have not looked up the serial number to make sure. It does have a single point fast hitch on it. I also went way oversized on the rear tires 14.9x24. We have a lot of mud but it goes right through it now! 

Good luck on your building:biggrinbounce2: Watch all the guys giving you a hard time are going to want to stay in the new part You might want to think about going 12x12. It doesn't cost much more but gives you a lot more room. It also makes it so you can build the walls on the new floor and stand them up. With a 8' wall on a 8' floor you don't have room to make the second wall on the floor and stand it up. 

You might want to read this page: Span Tables for Rafters http://daveosborne.com/dave/articles/rafter-span-table.php

From the left. Me both my brothers Timmy and Tommy and then Dad






The roof is about 1/8 thick plastic. It is liner material for a landfill. It is used to contain all the water and chemicals inside a landfill and keep it from leaking into the ground.






The inside is all sheeted with 7/16 osb.






The floor is three layers. 1.5 inch thick spruce boards then one inch foam R-7 board then 3/4" thick chipboard. We will finish it with vinyl flooring. With all the layers the floor is super quiet. When I get around to building my new hunting shack I am going to build it the same way.






This building could not have been built with out the help of my BIL Bob. He got me a Sirus radio to use at the farm. And I would have went nuts trying to build this without it :!: :!:


Wow I knew I was at the farm for a long time but I did not realize it was this long. Sorry it took so long to get back to ya all.

Billy


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