# OK, I finally started milling - my blog entry about it



## RikBrooks (Aug 7, 2010)

I'm building a 2000 square foot house with my wife. We are hand crafting everything we can. I had a minor injury lately when I almost cut off a finger in a table saw so I was a little scared of milling. You know, big chainsaw coupled with never having done it before.

Here's my blog entry about it.

http://texasmob.com/rikbrooks/?p=205


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## betterbuilt (Aug 7, 2010)

Nice blog. 

Sorry I can't help you with the mini mill. I don't have one yet.
One thing I can tell you is make sure you sticker that hickory as soon as you can. I had some 2x10's cut a while back and just left them out because I was gonna use them green. When I did get around to using them they had bowed about 12 inches. I'd also get the bark off of the boards, it's prone to get powder post beetles. 

It sounds like your chainsaw milling. Its not fast. It takes some time. Its worth the effort. 

Keep up the good work.


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## mtngun (Aug 7, 2010)

Thanks for the story.

What are you using for a guide rail ?


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## mtngun (Aug 7, 2010)

Here's a pic of a mini-mill setup, courtesy of MR4WD:


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## RikBrooks (Aug 7, 2010)

Not using a guide rail. The setup lasted longer than I hoped. I finally just said, "What the heck, I'm cutting this" and we went for it.


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## mtngun (Aug 7, 2010)

RikBrooks said:


> Not using a guide rail. The setup lasted longer than I hoped. I finally just said, "What the heck, I'm cutting this" and we went for it.


How do you make the first cut without a guide rail ?


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## gemniii (Aug 7, 2010)

Nice to see you back!

Milling in Mississippi in the Summertime!

Do you have a death wish?

C'mon - use the summertime for gathering thoughts and working on things that can be done in the cool.

Now that you've experienced making 1 cut you need a few more to go.

If you don't already have it, get some unistrut or channel steel like they use for barn door hangers for rails to slide the saw down. See BobL's sticky. 

If you can afford it and don't have one already get a small tractor, a back injury can be VERY expensive. Looking at CL you should be able to find something in the area for about $5K. If you've got fairly flat land a good old 50HP DIESEL Ford or similar 2WD w/ 3PT would be great. There's always mission creep, but a 10'long x2' diameter log weighs about a ton.

And with a 50HP the 3pt should be able to lift that ton and drag 2.

And the main reason I harp on back injury is because I've been laid up since June with one, and I think the drugs are starting to show.

Anyways. take care, be safe.


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## RikBrooks (Aug 8, 2010)

mtngun said:


> How do you make the first cut without a guide rail ?



Very slowly. Seriously. This is hickory. I made sure that I had a straight side up and then slowly went over that. I had a couple of hitches where I had to wiggle the frame a little but otherwise it went smoothly


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## RikBrooks (Aug 8, 2010)

Geminiii, I don't have to worry about a back injury. That's why I bought the engine hoist. I take the hoist to the log. I only use a cant hook for a couple of feet.

I'll try to find bobl's sticky. I'm also considering a ladder


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## betterbuilt (Aug 8, 2010)

If I follow you correctly your not using anything to start the first cut. I would call that dangerous. 

Your making it harder then it need to be. Get yourself a ladder or even a 2x10,2x12 or build yourself something. It pays to take the time to get setup. 

BobL's sticky Link: http://www.arboristsite.com/showthread.php?t=93458


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## mtngun (Aug 8, 2010)

> I can’t imagine a stronger set of joists than oak or hickory


I can't imagine anyone using hickory for framing. You'll have to pre-drill every nail hole. 

Use hardwoods for flooring, cabinets, and trim.

Use softwoods for framing.


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## smokinj (Aug 8, 2010)

mtngun said:


> I can't imagine anyone using hickory for framing. You'll have to pre-drill every nail hole.
> 
> Use hardwoods for flooring, cabinets, and trim.
> 
> Use softwoods for framing.



Sure would speed things up a bit.


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## RikBrooks (Aug 8, 2010)

Maybe I haven't been clear - I have a ton of hickory, almost no pine and time is not a factor.

All other considerations aside, wouldn't framing with hickory, especially the joists, be superior to pine?


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## smokinj (Aug 8, 2010)

RikBrooks said:


> Maybe I haven't been clear - I have a ton of hickory, almost no pine and time is not a factor.
> 
> All other considerations aside, wouldn't framing with hickory, especially the joists, be superior to pine?


Yes sir! To me it would be a waist just because I would frame with silver maple because there is so much more of it and not as vauable........In the old days around here everthing was frame in oak and hickory.


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## RikBrooks (Aug 8, 2010)

smokinj said:


> Yes sir! To me it would be a waist just because I would frame with silver maple because there is so much more of it and not as vauable........In the old days around here everthing was frame in oak and hickory.



There you go then. This house is our life long dream. My wife and I have always wanted to build our own house with our own hands and make sure that no corners were cut. We intend this to be our address when we die.

We have but two considerations, safety and quality


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## smokinj (Aug 8, 2010)

RikBrooks said:


> There you go then. This house is our life long dream. My wife and I have always wanted to build our own house with our own hands and make sure that no corners were cut. We intend this to be our address when we die.
> 
> We have but two considerations, safety and quality



Should last 10 life times.....I know a pasload nail gun will shot it at about 120psi. Remodel a few homes with the hardwood.


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## NC4TN (Aug 8, 2010)

RikBrooks said:


> Maybe I haven't been clear - I have a ton of hickory, almost no pine and time is not a factor.
> 
> All other considerations aside, wouldn't framing with hickory, especially the joists, be superior to pine?



Man, I'm not trying to sound one-up on you and discourage you from using your hickory, but I think you would be better off cutting your hickory for firewood, selling it, and then using the proceeds to buy your framing lumber from Lowes or wherever. All these little BBQ joints that haven't switched over to gas or charcoal love to get good hickory wood to cook on. Of all firewoods, hickory is the king, unarguably, and the demand for it as a fuelwood is insatiable. 

I have been around sawmills nearly all my life and I've never known of hickory being used as a framing lumber; it's way to hard, and it splits when cured and sawn thin, and rots faster than pine when it gets wet. But it won't break! You can bend it double and it will NOT break. 

When the logyards were buying hickory, it was all for veneering logs (paneling) and a very select few of it got used for fine furniture (and even that was laminates), because of it's hardness. Nowadays, no logyard here in the southern appalachians will buy hickory because there's no market for it, period. There is a specialty niche demand for it coming from cabinet makers and other woodworkers, but even that is sparse.

The $75 board that you mentioned on your blog is probobly intended for use as woodworker's lumber, and was more than likely kiln dried and a very select piece of wood at that (no knots, perfect straight grain, etc.) 

However, if you're bent on using it for framing, and chainsaw milling it to boot, then go for it. Have you given any thought to using your hickory for cabin logs? Instead of hand hewing them using a broadaxe and foot adze, you could use your chainsaw mill to saw them and then lay up your cabin. See the THE FOXFIRE BOOK for reference. I have never seen an original log cabin built with hickory logs, but then again; the southern appalachian mountaineers more valued their hickory as a fuel wood and for use in wagon wheel spokes and axles.


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## RikBrooks (Aug 15, 2010)

Well, I went back out there again. It's so hot in Mississippi at this time of year but I'm not in a rush.

I do have a question though - I've lost the nuts off my clutch cover several times. I went back on youtube and found I have the mill set up right. Are there any suggestions for preventing the vibrations from rattling these loose?

Oh, here's my blog entry about today and yesterday's work.
http://texasmob.com/rikbrooks/?p=215


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## betterbuilt (Aug 15, 2010)

You gotta tighten them down. I always tighten and check and see that everything is where it should be and then I tighten a little more. I bought a big bag of extra with the anticipation of losing them but I haven't needed them. You might want to get a wand metal detector to find them when you lose them. I have one and you'd be surprised at how well it works.

You work in auto parts store if I recall correctly get yourself a torque wrench. That would get rid of the guessing.


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## BobL (Aug 15, 2010)

RikBrooks said:


> Well, I went back out there again. It's so hot in Mississippi at this time of year but I'm not in a rush.
> 
> I do have a question though - I've lost the nuts off my clutch cover several times. I went back on youtube and found I have the mill set up right. Are there any suggestions for preventing the vibrations from rattling these loose?
> 
> ...



It's probably too much rapid stopping. Its the repeated and rapid stopping which jerks the clutch and twists the nut into the undone rotation diection. A nice gentle smooth pressure so the chain does not bind will avoid this.

Clutch nuts also have fairly specific torque requirement and need a left handed torque wrench which not everyone has access to. Too much torque and the clutch end of the crankshaft can shear right off. 

Half an hour seems like an awfully long time to mill one board eight inches across and ten feet long.
That's a cutting rate of 0.067 in/second. That's the sort of cutting speed I get in aussie hard wood that is is 48 inches wide. I would expect an 8" wide board even in hard wood to take about 5 minutes or so to cut.


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## RikBrooks (Aug 15, 2010)

BobL said:


> Half an hour seems like an awfully long time to mill one board eight inches across and ten feet long.
> That's a cutting rate of 0.067 in/second. That's the sort of cutting speed I get in aussie hard wood that is is 48 inches wide. I would expect an 8" wide board even in hard wood to take about 5 minutes or so to cut.



Well like I said, we are rank beginners. We'll get better.


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## mtngun (Aug 15, 2010)

I'm thinking Riki is talking about the bar nuts. Ya, they got to be tight. As tight as you can get them using the scrench and one hand. 

Besides rattling off, loose bar nuts will put a lot of stress on the chain tensioner, and may eventually destroy it.

Got a guide rail yet ?

Hickory = 1820 Janka. _Almost_ as hard as Aussie wood.


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## RikBrooks (Aug 15, 2010)

mtngun said:


> I'm thinking Riki is talking about the bar nuts. Ya, they got to be tight. As tight as you can get them using the scrench and one hand.
> 
> Besides rattling off, loose bar nuts will put a lot of stress on the chain tensioner, and may eventually destroy it.
> 
> ...



mtngun, I'm learning a whole lot on this forum. One of the things I've learned is to listen to mtngun and don't discount his opinion.

I got a ladder for a guide rail.

Another question - is milling dangerous? I'm looking at this mill and how the chainsaw fits in it and it just looks like it's pretty safe.


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## mtngun (Aug 15, 2010)

RikBrooks said:


> mtngun, I'm learning a whole lot on this forum. One of the things I've learned is to listen to mtngun and don't discount his opinion.


Ha ha ha. Mtngun can be full of chit sometimes, but believe it or not, I'm *trying* to help. 



> I got a ladder for a guide rail.


Cool.



> Another question - is milling dangerous? I'm looking at this mill and how the chainsaw fits in it and it just looks like it's pretty safe.


It's not as dangerous as felling, bucking, or limbing, but it's not idiot proof, either. 

Definitely got to respect that moving chain. If you need to pause to adjust something, set the chain brake. It's a good idea to get into the habit of setting the chain brake anytime the saw is idling. Then release the brake when you are ready to cut.

I think the biggest danger in milling is the heavy lifting while moving the logs and boards and mill around. Also just getting tuckered out and dehydrated -- that makes you careless. Sounds like you are doing a good job of not overdoing it.


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## gemniii (Aug 15, 2010)

RikBrooks said:


> Another question - is milling dangerous? I'm looking at this mill and how the chainsaw fits in it and it just looks like it's pretty safe.



Man! BobL hurt his fingers, you lost your nuts!

Sounds like if milling isn't dangerous millers are accident prone!!

Anyways - as far as milling danger - once up in the cut it seems safe, despite you being inches from chain traveling fast.

I think there are more dangers in the "not on" category. Lifting dangers, dropping wood on toe danger, working in Mississippi heat dangers. I've cut myself twice on the chainsaw, both times it was off and I nicked myself with the chain. There might be some danger in breathing the fumes, so make sure you have good air.

Nuts - I bought about a half dozen of each at Bailey's, have had 2 fall off, lost one. I also had one of the U bolts snap on the MKIII. Don't travel w/o spares.

And we need pictures!!

/edit - went and read your blog - 
NEVER TOUCH THE CHAIN AFTER IT's BEEN RUNNING.

mtngun and others have some good numbers on feed rate, if your half hour includes setting up for cut, adjusting the ladder, making sure all your settings are right, adjusting your hat, getting a drink (guzzle that water) etc. 30 minutes isn't too bad.
BUTT
That Solo 694 is running with the big dogs, and if properly tuned and with a sharp chain, it should just slide thru the 8" wide hickory, especially since you have it on an angle.

Have you sharpened your chain? Earlier you blogged that "a 15 foot 2×8 was about 20 minutes." I suspect you need to sharpen or at least touch up your chain about every 10' to 20' of wood.

The thing to do is figure out how you can touch up the chain ON the saw. You have an outboard clutch, a real pain for milling, I know, my JD CS 62 has one. I've almost thought of breakin and spinning chain when swapping.


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## RikBrooks (Aug 15, 2010)

mtngun said:


> I think the biggest danger in milling is the heavy lifting while moving the logs and boards and mill around. Also just getting tuckered out and dehydrated -- that makes you careless. Sounds like you are doing a good job of not overdoing it.



I think you are right. I'm still recovering from almost amputating a finger with a table saw last month. Can't make a fist with my left hand yet and still not entirely healed so I'm taking my time.


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## RikBrooks (Aug 15, 2010)

gemniii said:


> Man! BobL hurt his fingers, you lost your nuts!



Now THAT'S funny, I don't care who you are.




> And we need pictures!!



Working on it. Those blog entries are actually my book in progress on how an extreme urbanite - business executive, etc., is becoming a homesteader in preperation for retirement.

You wouldn't BELIEVE all the stuff I'm learning. I know I look like Charlie Daniels but looks can be decieving.


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## stipes (Aug 20, 2010)

*I rather run the csm anytime.*



RikBrooks said:


> I think you are right. I'm still recovering from almost amputating a finger with a table saw last month. Can't make a fist with my left hand yet and still not entirely healed so I'm taking my time.



To me,,,a table saw is a heck of alot more dangerous than a csm in my eyes...I had a few kickbacks on a table saw where it makes you really on top of the game when you use it.......
The mini mill...What I look out for is a firm grip on the handle,,the alaskan is pretty much boxed in and if you hand slipped the bar and chain is mostly buried in the wood,,but the mini mill,,you have alot more cutting surface exposed,,top and bottom,,so you have to watch where your legs and toes are at all times,,and keep a firm grip...I cant say I was ever nervous using both cause you have to do something really stupid to get hurt...I always been really comfortable using em both and have had alot of enjoyment from them..
Get well soon....I about amputated my left pinky cause of something stupid I did...Trying to break loose a 2 inch bolt and it wouldnt budge,,so I grapped the baby sledge and and was pullin with my left hand and as I came down with the sledge it hit something on my down swing and ,,if I wasnt wearing heavy gloves,,It prob. would have cut it off...After 11,000.00 dollars,,and 2 months off of work,,it still isnt,,and prob. never work like used too...That what I get for being in a hurry.....


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## BobL (Aug 20, 2010)

stipes said:


> To me,,,a table saw is a heck of alot more dangerous than a csm in my eyes...I had a few kickbacks on a table saw where it makes you really on top of the game when you use it.......



I agree these things can be very very nasty. One of the worst non-lethal accidents I heard about with a table saw was when someone was ripping 1/2" wide hardwood strips from a 1" thick board and a 4 ft long fat sliver broke off and was kicked back by the saw. The sliver entered the operators wrist at the base of the top if his hand and speared itself through his wrist and along the forearm spreading the two forearm bones and with the tip just breaking the skin below the elbow. The surgeons had to take his forearm apart to get all the splinters out and the operator never recovered the full use of his arm.


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## TraditionalTool (Aug 20, 2010)

RikBrooks said:


> Well like I said, we are rank beginners. We'll get better.


How often do you sharpen your chain?


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