# Best Chainsaw for Groundwork



## memetic (May 28, 2008)

I just expanded my business to include tree work and need a recommendation for a good saw for ground work. My guys have all the other smaller saws covered (some husqvarnas, and a stihl or two) we just need a saw for decent size trunks and what not. 

Thanks


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## Industry (May 28, 2008)

Why not ask the professional that will be using it? when you say you expanded into tree work, you did hire someone who is experienced at it right?

How big is a decent sized trunk? 20" DBH? 60" DBH?


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## guitarborist (May 28, 2008)

I love the Stihl 660 for most stumps and dropping larger trees. We run a 32" bar so it will cut 50" stumps easily if you come in from both sides and use wedges. Make sure it is sharpened well or you will not match your cuts and you'll have a hell of a time getting the stump off.


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## memetic (May 28, 2008)

Thanks guitarborist. I'll look into that saw.

Industry, I'm not trying to be coky, but suppose I did. It doesn't hurt to get a second, or third, or fourth opinion for free does it? Especially when there are a lot of experts here (i've been reading a lot before posting). Besides, it's not my guys shelling out the dough for the new equipment. Yes, 20-60 is a good approximation, the fact that you guessed it right is the reason I only had to say "decent size". If you got some advice I'd love to read it.


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## Nailsbeats (May 28, 2008)

395 Husqvarna, it the same class as the 660. Either one will work fine.


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## memetic (May 28, 2008)

Thanks Nailsbeats I'll check that one too.


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## Highclimber OR (May 29, 2008)

For residential and some commercial I use a 460 with a 24" bar and a 460 with a 30" bar. Between the two I can take care of most anything. The saw matters to a point but it is more about the user and their experience cutting large timber and running large saw in general.


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## Industry (May 29, 2008)

Whichever brand you prefer your gonna want a saw over 90cc for a 60" tree. Sorry if I got a little snide, but when a landscape architect says they expanded into tree work it makes me think of the guys up here who don't have the licenses or insurance(landscape insurance doesn't cover tree work) and don't have experienced guys on their crews. Good luck to you.


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## memetic (May 29, 2008)

Thanks everyone, that should help my research along. At least now I know there isn't something like a 200t that is THE saw for groundwork.


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## treemandan (May 29, 2008)

Nailsbeats said:


> 395 Husqvarna, it the same class as the 660. Either one will work fine.



To be honest I have always had sthils cause it was convieniant and they workk good. I used a 395 today, it was older but lighter, smoother and cut just peachy. It could of used a look at the bar and chain cause it bound on the big wood and then would not start after the first tank. We found 2 loose screws in the air filter houseing and othe missing bolts. I gave up as I was not putting either 44 to that stump, although I coulda. I sent for the 88.


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## memetic (May 29, 2008)

Yeah, I was kinda leaning towards a stihl. Not that I have anything against other manufacturers, I just like their saws from my experience and mostly what I hear and see from others. If I find a good deal on something similar in another brand I may switch. I don't know yet and I got time to figure it out.


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## JohnBurns (Jun 1, 2008)

i run an echo 670 with 24 inch bar, it has proved to be a well balanced saw for ground work


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## memetic (Jun 1, 2008)

OK, thanks. One more for the list. I got another couple weeks till I buy. After some research I'll post my options. Hopefully I can narrow it down to 3 saws.


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## originalhooker (Jun 7, 2008)

Stihl 044, 441, or what ever new # they have for that size saw.
Been using the 038,041,& 044 for 26 years- Saws were designed to work all day.....YOU WILL NOT BE DISAPPOINTED. Also, if you do enter in to the world of proper tree care & removals, the 044 will be much desired for blocking trunks & removing large limbs while climbing.
I wouldn't go any larger, we have larger saws and they get used few times throughout the year. 24"with skip tooth will cut 98% of the trees encountered if you are experienced. That being said, "big wood" beings about another set of mental issues, better have clear communication & make sure your guys are quick learners - professional leaf rakers and grass cutters can easily find themselves outgunned & hurt. A bigger saw normally doesn't make the job go easier, if anything Without proper experience, it will add to the days frustration & expense.


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## squad143 (Jun 7, 2008)

My favorite ground work saw (for bucking wood) is my 460 magnum. So much that I'm hoping to buy a second one. I have an 088 for really big stuff, but it is a heavy saw that I only bring out on stuff 30" and larger. Just wish it had electric start (LOL).


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## memetic (Jun 12, 2008)

I know these wern't suggested, but will any of these do the job:

Stihl 028 AV Super $249.00

Stihl MS 250 $229.00

Husqvarna 141 $129.00

Husqvarna 55 $229.00

They seem a little small and none of the recommended bar lengths exceeds 20". Not sure if any of these will do the job until I can get a brand new saw.

Thanks


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## TreeGhost (Jun 12, 2008)

I run with 3 saws. 14", 18" and 24" bars. I rarely bring out the saw with the 24" bar. It always is a good idea to have a back-up.


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## memetic (Jun 12, 2008)

I think a 20" bar will do the job. I just wonder if any of the saws I just posted are recommended by any one. Do those prices seem ok for a used, but good condition, saw?


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## Bowhunter01 (Jun 13, 2008)

I've got a shindaiwa 757 that I use a lot for felling, bucking and stump cuts. It is my big nasty saw at this point, haven't got anything bigger yet. Got a couple 24" bars and a couple 20". Also use a Stihl 440 and a Husky 455 quite a bit.


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## Bermie (Jun 13, 2008)

I sold my 250 to buy a 260pro...even 18" is a bit much for a 250 imo. Its a fine saw does what its asked, but meant for smallish stuff.

I have a 14" 200t for in the tree, 16" 260pro for most ground work, and a 20" 361 for the bigger stuff. Either of the ground saws can go up in the tree as well. In the rare time I need something bigger, I'll borrow a 440....


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## SawTroll (Jun 13, 2008)

Industry said:


> Whichever brand you prefer your gonna want a saw over 90cc for a 60" tree. .....



I agree, but the gap from the MS200T etc to the 90cc one is just too large, and I suspect the 90cc one will be overkill for a good part of the ground work.

He also need some backup - so he needs _at least _a 70cc saw in addition, preferably a smaller rear-handle saw as well....


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## Industry (Jun 13, 2008)

I have 0 experience with Stihl saws. The Huskys I run EVERY day. the 141 is NOT big enough for a ground saw for day in/ day out use. The 55 Rancher is a occasional use saw. A tree service that is going to stay in business is going to use their ground saw more than occasionally. get yourself a Dolmar 6400 or a 7900. for a Husky(if they have better dealer support in your area) I would get a 372xp or a 357xp.


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## tomtrees58 (Jun 13, 2008)

Highclimber OR said:


> For residential and some commercial I use a 460 with a 24" bar and a 460 with a 30" bar. Between the two I can take care of most anything. The saw matters to a point but it is more about the user and their experience cutting large timber and running large saw in general.



to big four ground saw 026 tom trees


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## TreeBot (Jun 13, 2008)

memetic said:


> Thanks everyone, that should help my research along. At least now I know there isn't something like a 200t that is THE saw for groundwork.



There is, the Stihl 044. Good luck finding one. The 441 is the new version and it's very smooth. I myself don't have a 44 because I have a 361 and an 660, but for the most part it has been the default ground saw for a long time. I have seen many many crews who run only 200t's and 44's.


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## memetic (Jun 13, 2008)

So, basically, the saws I posted above are pooh pooh. Those are from a local store. I guess I'll start checking online. I just want to get a used saw in good condition, then buy a new one in a month or two. I guess all I need is something that will work to bring in some bucks, then get the proper tool. 

Thanks


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## fireball33 (Jun 13, 2008)

if you watch ebay and be careful you can find a deal if your not in a hurry i bought a stihl 460 for $280 is a great saw did nothing but add gas + oil. 
just be careful who you bid on check their remarks.. otherwise check out this site for the occasional saw.
my vote goes for a 440 or 460 as a good ground saw you can get away with cutting almost anything if you have 2 bars 20", 24" or 32"... i think a 260 is ok but they are not great when needed to cut something big. when you have the 440 or 460 you'll most of the time have the power needed.

goodluck
Kevin


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## SustainableTree (Jun 14, 2008)

My main saws on the ground are a 440 and a 260. I have a 28" bar and 16" or 20" bar on the 260. Not much hardwood here, saws pull these bars just fine in oak as well. I bought the 260 to use when the 440 wasn't needed, but I still reach for it most of the time over the 260. I'm tall so the extra weight of the 440 is better than leaning over more with the 260 I guess. I'd say get a 361 or 440 or Husky equivalent. Have fun!!!


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## Slvrmple72 (Jun 15, 2008)

squad143 said:


> My favorite ground work saw (for bucking wood) is my 460 magnum. So much that I'm hoping to buy a second one. I have an 088 for really big stuff, but it is a heavy saw that I only bring out on stuff 30" and larger. Just wish it had electric start (LOL).



I have the 460 as well with the 18" and 28" bar. I seem to always run her with the 28", nice balance for limbing and bucking without a lot of bending over you have to do with a shorter bar. I have a 455 Rancher with 20" bar for limbing and bucking small stuff and I just put a new piston and cylinder in my 088 that has a 30" and 48" bar. Having been continually frustrated with my climbing saw I bought a new 192T down in Smithville,Ohio last week. I have since relegated the 339xp to back up duty and I am fairly confident she is going to get really dusty. The final nail in the coffin so to speak was the sprocket binding up. Maybe I could put a different bar on her but I am really enjoying the 192T.


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## tree md (Jun 15, 2008)

We run all Stihl: 441, 361, 029, 290, on the ground. The 029 and 290 are mostly for the groundies to use so they don't dull the 441 and 361 .I know there has been a lot said about the 029 but ours has been a rock solid saw for about 4 years now. The 361 and the 441 rock the boat!!! :greenchainsaw: 

Heres the 441 going through some big wood:


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## treeoperations (Jun 15, 2008)

husky 385 (now a 390) with 22 and 32inch bar, havent found a tree i couldnt deal to with the 32" bar yet.


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## geocom (Jun 15, 2008)

*I have the MS250 and MS460*

I own both the MS250 and the MS460 and having known then what I know now I would opt out of the 250 pony up the extra cash and get the 260 totally different saw much better built and much more you can do with them 

Having said that the 250 does do what I need it to but I have been having so much fun with the 460 that the 250 is getting a little dusty lately though at the end of the day when my arms and back are getting tired the 250 takes the cake doesn't do the same amount of cutting but sure is a lot lighter so it is worth having patience.. opcorn: opcorn:

Oh yeah just thought that I would add that I am a homeowner not a pro but I cut a lot..


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## SustainableTree (Jun 15, 2008)

GEOCOM is right on about the 250. I had an older 025 (pretty much the same as 250) and now have a 260. The 260 will outlast the 250 by many years because of the way they are built. Metal crankcase and clutch cover instead of plastic, etc. In my opinion in cuts noticeably faster also. Worth the extra $$$ if that is the cc of saw you are thinking of buying. You can't go wrong with a 440/460 though......buy that first and fill the gap later.


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## memetic (Jun 27, 2008)

OK, I think its down to the 260 vs 441.

Not sure yet. Lately, we haven't been getting too much huge stuff - not sure if the 441 would be as handy or versatile as the 260 seems to be. Maybe I'll pick up the 260 now and wait for the next huge tree to get the 441. Any thoughts?

Thanks everyone.


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## SustainableTree (Jun 28, 2008)

I'd go as big as you can afford. Unless you are going to be climbing with the new saw I'd get the 441 because it can do everything and add the 260 later as a "luxury" (less weight) later. If you get a call the day after you buy the 260 for a big tree, can you buy the 441 if needed? Go for the big dog!


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## memetic (Jun 28, 2008)

I'm not climbing with this saw. Neither of these potential saws will ever be up in a tree. 

I understand the point everyone has made for the 441, I do. I also get what people are saying about the 260. 

The only thing I'm afraid of is I will be lugging this 441 around for six months cutting up small stuff, breaking my back, and then six months later I finally get to truly use it for what it's capable of. It's kind of a gamble like you point out, what if I buy the 260 and then the next day... That would suck (if it was 2-4 weeks later I wouldn't be that upset). That's why I'm still thinking.


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## reachtreeservi (Jun 28, 2008)

If you had to have only one ground saw .....

I'd get a 460


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## memetic (Jun 28, 2008)

reachtreeservi said:


> If you had to have only one ground saw .....
> 
> I'd get a 460



Thanks. I think you're right. I just checked it out. 

Maybe someone posted the 460 earlier. I must have missed it when I wrote them down. 

460 vs 260 until I own both.


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## hornett224 (Jun 28, 2008)

*skip the 441.*

it's not what it's cracked up to be.get an ms 460 or a 372xp or even a Dolmar 7900.i know of at least two dealers in CT that still have an ms440 on the shelf.another great saw.


memetic said:


> OK, I think its down to the 260 vs 441.
> 
> Not sure yet. Lately, we haven't been getting too much huge stuff - not sure if the 441 would be as handy or versatile as the 260 seems to be. Maybe I'll pick up the 260 now and wait for the next huge tree to get the 441. Any thoughts?
> 
> Thanks everyone.


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## hornett224 (Jun 28, 2008)

*also............*

the 50cc 346xp walks on the ms260.the 260 is a nice saw but it's time has come and gone.i'd say it's replacement is in the works as we speak.


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## memetic (Jun 28, 2008)

Thanks. I knew about the 460 - I already switched to that from the 441. 

So, I guess the 460 seems to be the way to go. I got about one more week till I have to buy. I guess I can just buy a couple bars for it and switch 'em out as needed. 

Let me know about the dealers with the 440s. Post here or PM me or whatever and I'll check it out.


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## palogger (Jun 29, 2008)

+1 on the 460, makes a nice saw with a 20" or 24" bar and 8 pin sprocket


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## coolbrze (Jun 29, 2008)

If you could only get 1 bar for the 460, what length would it be?


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## reachtreeservi (Jun 29, 2008)

Bars and chains are cheap, relatively.....

Why would you not buy a few different lengths?


There is no one perfect length.


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## SustainableTree (Jun 29, 2008)

I'd get a 28" bar..........but I live in the PNW.


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## Spockbob (Jun 30, 2008)

don't laugh, but after felling a tree I use a Stihl 17 with the micro bar to limb it and cut smaller firewood, then finish up with a 66. That micro bar is so thin that it cuts as fast as a 25, but weighs half as much. BTW, use winter bar oil on 17s and 18s, the oilers are notoriously weak.


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## memetic (Jun 30, 2008)

I'm getting a 460 with a 25" bar to start - I've been putting it off too long now. It's $860. If anyone knows where to get one cheaper, let me know. I called the local shops and that's the going rate. I might consider used if it's a good deal. 

Here are a few shots of yesterdays' job. That's the last time I use a 18" bar for a job that size. Check out the stump next to my 18 month old son. Remember I was wondering when that next big one was coming. The big one is approx 3 feet in diameter (in the longer direction). 

We had 'em felled, chopped, and stacked in about 4-5 hours (Me my partner and one worker). It would have been 2-3 if I had the proper saw for the job like the 460. I know, I know, you don't have to say it. I've already kicked my own butt over this. We also did a huge amount of trimming on pines around the property. 

For those guys trying to diss my rep because we drive two-door sports cars to the job sites because we never have to haul wood around, notice we didn't steal the wood and sell it to some guy on craigslist. We stacked it real nice like. He wanted one of our company shirts after he saw the sweet arse job we did, so I dropped one off when I picked up the payment today - he even paid cash, woo hoo. He's throwing a ton of referrals our way now. Our clients always love us.

edit: I just read the stihl vs husky post. I saw a few people were saying the husky is better with the big saws. Post your alternative to the 460 so I can check it out.


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## Nailsbeats (Jun 30, 2008)

Husky does not make the same sized saw as the 460, they make a 385 which is a little bigger, and some that are smaller, like the 372 and 575. Hard to compare apples to apples here. A good comparison used to be the 372 vs the 440. I have and like them both, though I feel the power edge goes to the 372 stock.


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## Nailsbeats (Jun 30, 2008)

coolbrze said:


> If you could only get 1 bar for the 460, what length would it be?



Put me down for a 20". Not much you can't do well with one in most eastern hardwoods. That will cut roughly a 36" tree from both sides, that's pretty good size hardwood around here. It will cut faster in most situations and handles better in my opinion. Most loggers around here carry a 70cc class saw with a 20" bar for good reason.


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## memetic (Jul 1, 2008)

Nailsbeats - I see you got a 372 and a 460. Which would you rather have. I'm still convinced about the 460. 

I understand your point about the 20". I will probably by it with a 25" and add the 20" a week later. We have more 3' trees coming up soon and seems to make sense to have the 25" over the 20", but wtf do I know.


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## OilHead (Jul 1, 2008)

SustainableTree said:


> I'd get a 28" bar..........but I live in the PNW.


Yep for me its 16, 20 & 28 ES Bars. The 18 & 25 are kind of ho hum in between sizes.


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## Nailsbeats (Jul 1, 2008)

For treework I would go with the 25". You will be bucking up a lot of stuff in that range and it is more critical at times to be able to reach all the way through a felling cut when valuable obstacles are present. I meant the 20" bar for logging.

As far as the 460 vs. the 372, that is a tough call. I tell you what, I muffler modded the 372 and it will absolutely rip and is light. The 460 has the dual port muffler, has good power and I like it for bigger trunk wood, the weight tips it as my second choice though. Overall power to weight performance I would say the 372 can't be beat. Not apples to apples though and they are both excellent saws. A question like that hurts to even answer.


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## memetic (Jul 1, 2008)

I was worried about weight at first due to my back, but my 5hit is ripped so my arms don't care about extra weight. That's why I've been thinking the 460 is the way to go. I'm leaning towards power over weight lately. Especially since the last job where the proper saw could of saved us at least a couple hours.

28" would be sweet, but that would be overkill for this place. Check out my Pics and you'll see what I mean. We have been trimming a lot of 4 foot + diameter trees, but not felling them. Our biggest take downs so far have been in the 2-3+ foot range. 

I'm bound to buy a range of bars for the 460, but I think the first will be the 25. Then, it will be something smaller like a 20. I just don't see the need for a 28 in this area. Unless it is an old specimen that died. But, I still think I'd do ok with a 25 for a long time.


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## booboo (Jul 1, 2008)

Nailsbeats said:


> As far as the 460 vs. the 372, that is a tough call. I tell you what, I muffler modded the 372 and it will absolutely rip and is light. The 460 has the dual port muffler, has good power and I like it for bigger trunk wood, the weight tips it as my second choice though. Overall power to weight performance I would say the 372 can't be beat. Not apples to apples though and they are both excellent saws. A question like that hurts to even answer.



I'm running them both, both with 28" bars. I think that the 372 has slightly better power to weight. Both pull the 28" bar fine though the 460 has seen mostly softwood so far. I was looking for another 372 but the prices on them has blown up around here and my Stihl guy gave me a good price on the 460. I still haven't run them side by side enough to give a really strong opinion on which is better, both are good saws. Also agree that a 70cc class saw with a 20" bar is the way to go for most general groundwork. I'm running an old, slightly modded J'red 670S with a 20" bar and it's a screamer.


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## Nailsbeats (Jul 1, 2008)

Oh yes, the old 670. Will always be the "Champ" to me. It is one of the saws I started on at 11 or 12. Fond memories. My buddy just sold a Champ to my other buddy for $300 with excellent 20" and 24" bars. Nice saw.


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## memetic (Jul 5, 2008)

Just waiting until my time off lines up with dealer being open to pick up the 460. Can't f'n wait. I love new tools. 

I think I switched my mind and will purchase the 460 w/ the 20" bar. Then, add the 25". I was thinking if we've been cutting what we have been with an 18" with less power, a 20" with 15+ more cc's will be just fine. 

Thanks for all the help.


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## Skywalker (Jul 14, 2008)

*Ground saws*

Memetic

thata boy just expanded my landscape company too

were in tree work just about 16months

It has already blown my landscaping numbers out of the water

anyway

we run 1 660

2 460s

2 260s

4 180s

the 460 is the all around best saw for the money if youre not gettin crazy

around 8ooish


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## SAW (Jul 24, 2008)

372XP is the way to go. 

A 372XP with 20" bar will take care of some nice size trees... and if it doesnt then throw a bigger bar on it. 

Its a great saw and should have PLENTY of power for your needs.


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## ASD (Jul 24, 2008)

We use 

t200 16"

ms 260 pro 20"

ms 440 / 441 30"

ms 660 42"

ms 880 48" and 60"

hope it helps


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## HolmenTree (Jul 26, 2008)

I have been running Stihls for 27yrs , Jonsereds 7 yrs before that. Never owned a Husky . My 19 yr old 044 needs replacing and the 441 is not the one to do it. So I am buying a Husky 372XP. Love the looks of this saw.

Willard


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## HolmenTree (Jul 28, 2008)

*Final decision*

Well folks I made a complete 360 turn decision this morning. Tryed out a new Stihl 441 demo . The thoughts of a Husky 372 have quickly evaporated. What can I say?.... this 441 is brand new but it revs like a well broke in saw with a thousand hours on it. Different kind of power band from the 044. I limbed a big white spruce and the power was smooth and strong even from mid revs, didn't have to keep it peaked out to get the job done. I don't know what all the fuss is about the 460 being the same weight as the 441. The 441 feels lighter then the 460. We had a 460 to compare. The 441 feels more balanced ,compact and soooooo smooth in the cut over the 460. And another thing I noticed, no exhaust fumes. And to bonus this thing sips gas. At my stage in life this will probably be the last 70 cc saw I'll buy, seeing I get 20 years out of them[ with a couple of rebuilds of course]. You know if I was still logging piecework cutting yeah the lighter Husky 372 would be attractive, 8 hrs a day 5 days a week. But for my tree service doing residential work and only running it alot less in a day,no I like the feel of the 441 for the work I'm doing. I guess I'm lucky, if I need more power my old 85 cc. 064 does the job [not much heavier then the 460].My 066 can cover the 064 if needed and if they can't do a good enough job then the 090- 60inch will settle any differences.

Willard:lifter:


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