# Grinding surface roots?



## heartland (Feb 3, 2003)

Anybody have experience with grinding surface roots of trees?

I have a friend with several Sycamore (plantanus occidentalis) in the yard. Some of the roots have been exposed over time and he is trying to "clean things up". We are talking about 3-4' sections of <6" diameter roots here.

I'd estimate 1/2 dozen of these throughout the yard. Don't know which tree(s) they belong to.

Would grinding these pose a serious threat to these trees?


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## Kneejerk Bombas (Feb 3, 2003)

Can you give us a rough idea of how big the trees are and how close you are cutting to the tree?


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## heartland (Feb 3, 2003)

Good question.

They are all fairly mature trees: on the order of 40-50' tall. The target roots are not within 20' of any tree...


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## Kneejerk Bombas (Feb 3, 2003)

I could spew some rules of thumb, or tell you what would happen here in WI, but I will defer to those in TX with some experience in cutting roots. Your soils and rainfall are so different, I have a feeling these roots are much more critical than similar roots here.

I can say it probably isn't good for the trees.


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## Stumper (Feb 3, 2003)

I agree with Mike. , While it may not prove fatal or make the trees unstable it is pretty certain to be "ungood". I have ground a great many exposed roots on removed trees and I will occassionally do so on a live tree, but, even when they are small and far from the trunk I advise against it and warn the owner that the damage may iniate a cycle of decline.


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## John Paul Sanborn (Feb 3, 2003)

Typical problem with flood plane trees, they do not root very deep. One good thing though is that they will take grade change better then upland species.

Can you undermine them and try to burry them lower? I've heard of the practice, but net done/seen it. 

What is the DBH?


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## heartland (Feb 3, 2003)

DBH is approx 24" on all of the sycamores.

Undermine and bury is an interesting idea that I could suggest. 

I'm curious though: Is there a dramatic difference in the way a tree reacts to removal of a limb vs. removal/severing of a root?

I realize that roots are an essencial lifeline of support for a tree, but wouldn't it compensate for the loss in the same manner that it does when a limb is removed? i.e., the concept of "shoot invigoration" can take place after pruning. Does something similar exist for the root structure?

I don't know much about tree physiology, so please forgive me if that is a really dumb question


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## Matt Follett (Feb 3, 2003)

I agree with Dan

Is there some way to elimnate the lawn, while keeping your client happy? 

Is it front yard, back yard, what is the yard used for etc. what could you do as an alternative to mown grass. How about large leaf rings, these allow lots of gas exchange and little weed develpoment, while beifiting the health of the tree by adding nutrients and organic matter to the soil.

Stump grinders leave a nasty wound for the tree to try to seal off, I would be afraid of soil born pathogens finding an easy entry point to start comprimising the trees health.


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## Reed (Feb 3, 2003)

It's not just a question of root/limb/nutritional dynamic.....

Architecture then stability. Vertical wind shear or dead-on winds from storms (complicated by saturated soils) leave damage that is quite obvious. Tornados often leave 'twisting' remnants if the vortex was responsible for the carnage, otherwise look closely at after-effect from storms - root balls generally surface when lateral roots give way. I saw many trees simply fall over after trenching programs for root graft severing, given the site lines were in close proximity to the trunk. 

Everyone's right so far - submerge the roots with loose matter.


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## John Paul Sanborn (Feb 4, 2003)

I think 3x the dbh is where you start getting problems with rootrots from root pruning getting into the basal area. 5x is the current nominal distance ROT for trenching.

This is from a statistical point of veiw, it does not help if your tree is one of those high on the scatter chart.

The rots travel up the underside of the root so they are impossible to monitor visualy. 

You might try talking with Louie Hampton, the company he is with has an airspade.

If you have to prune roots, then not doing them all at once is best. Masybe treating the wound with subdue and a rooting stimulant like cytokinin, organic bakfills and such.

Short durration irigation that does not penetrate the soil makes conditions that favor surface roots, ie, if that is where the water is, that is where the roots will grow.


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## heartland (Feb 4, 2003)

Guys - once again, I am so thankful to have access to your knowledge  

Thanks for your time and info on this matter. Truley invaluable


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