# man thru chipper



## Mr. Firewood (Jun 16, 2003)

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/nypost/20030616/lo_nypost/jerseywoodchiphorror

the guy had a crotch stuck in the intake and tried to kick it in... u know the rest


~Nate~


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## Tom Dunlap (Jun 16, 2003)

Mark posted a note about another daeth in NJ last week on the Tr**buzz forum.

Tom


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## TheTreeSpyder (Jun 27, 2003)

20 years old!!

".....foot somehow became caught in the machine....."

yeah; the machine doesn't have a brain; and was fullfilling it's purpose of ravenously demolishing anything put in it's gullet; preferring tons of solid oak, but taking anything you hand it softer too.....

Sorry, but i think that quote shows how little the public realizes the ferocius power, speed and possible terror of these machines.

Here is a pic kept as a book mark presently in (Dent's Pro Timber Felling)from memorial card of a young lady here in town that made the same error, to be found by her husband of not quite a year, as his last sight of her to remember hanging out the exhaust shoot (not as you get to see her here), when he couldn't find her that day (3-26-2003). Ya only have to go to one memorial like that; to see (and hear) that horror in someone's face and soul; and their inconsoulability to mark ya good and deep.....

Way i figure it, that machine wasn't forgiving to this young lass; it ain't gonna give a Damm about any of us guys.......

Yeahhhhhh, burn it in good; maybe there will be just one less.....


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## NeTree (Jun 27, 2003)

Okay, here's where I go nuts....

WHY THE ???? ON EARTH DO PEOPLE STILL TRY TO KICK ???? INTO A CHIPPER KNOWING PEOPLE HAVE BEEN KILLED DOING IT??????

STUPID ???? LIKE THAT IS WHY OUR INDUSTRY IS UNDER THE ????ING GUN ALL THE TIME!!!!!

DON'T THESE GOD???? HACKS EVER TEACH ANYONE BASIC ????ING SAFETY????????


Deaths like this are soooo preventable.


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## Nickrosis (Jun 28, 2003)

> _Originally posted by Tim Walsh _
> *Once, at a conference, a fatal accident was being discussed. Someone in the audience stood up and said that the victim had done everything wrong, was stupid and just stopped short of saying that the person deserved to die. A family member of the victim was in the audience.
> 
> Please think about what you say here, before you say it.
> *



Netree: You should think before you speak. Imagine if I had just said that about a brother, sister, son or daughter of yours.

Nickrosis


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## NeTree (Jun 29, 2003)

If people thought before they acted, this thread wouldn't be necessary. I'm not saying he deserved to die; just that it was completely preventable... as most accidents are. Despite the number of people that get hurt or killed doing something unsafe, nobody seems to learn. And if his boss never instructed him (as required by law) in safe equipment use, he is just as responsible.

But noone seems to really care.

Machines are just that; we must keep in mind that chippers, bucket trucks, stump cutters, and such don't really care about people. Thay have no consience, no cognitive thought- other than the operators'.

Safety should be taken VERY seriously. Preventable accidents should anger everyone. They are needless deaths. This kid was just starting out his life, and now he's gone way before his time. He won't see his kids graduate from school, or play with his grandkids, or enjoy a retirement doing what he loved. Why? Did noone ever see him kicking things in before? If they did, did they not say anything to him? Did his boss know? 

How many more preventables must there be before we say enough and start cracking down?

No, he didn't deserve to die, Nick. But unless people get angry and start ????canning workers who refuse to work safe, and educating people how to go home alive and in one piece every day by working safe, then his death (like so many others) goes meaningless. And that would be the ULTIMATE insult, both to him and the family who lost him.

Focus your anger constructively. 

And Nick, you really don't know me or my life well enough to make that kind of blanket statement. Not by a long shot, but my ghosts are mine, and they keep me alive.


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## TheTreeSpyder (Jun 29, 2003)

How much training is necessary?

Is part of that supervised/buddied OJT hours?

If any of that is necessary, is it reasonable to suspect that any person renting one over the weekend would be under the blanket of that pro-tection?

Would they know deeply that it is not a friendly household machine of today? It is nothing like they have ever been around before, save etreme open farm machinery etc. in some instances. 

Can they possibly envision it and respect it as a voraciously, hungry caged beast behind the metal? Who's insatiable hunger you abuse by sliding gruel you want dispsoed off up near the cage and pulling back, never taking your eye off any way it can reach you, never feeding it a foot or hand or chance. For that is a applesauce consistency, sweet treat compared to the dry crumbleys you force it to be satisfied with; while every day it drools for meat as any other BEAST!

And as any powerful, prowling, proud animal sits eyeing you it's temporary captor, waiting for that time you take your eye off of it...........





edit- so it can even the score for treating it so, while giving leash not of just chain, but shorter even heavy pipe to the frame of your biggest truck, only freedom is being dragged down the road, hoping to keep up! That is a lot of PayBack it seeks; i'd rather keep trying to sneek one in on JP and run; and darn....already found that don't all ways work!:blob6: Course if ya edit in where he already looked.........






Orrrrrr something like that!
:alien:


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## NeTree (Jun 29, 2003)

You missed your calling, Spidey...you should have been a writer. You described the beast in the machine well.


As for the training:
chipper safety video
then a quiz
a hands on demo, supervised
an explanation of what is expected of them
a game hen (frozen) is fed in for graphic example 
first few days are buddied
first safety slip (reaching into the shute, etc) automatic termination


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## Stumper (Jun 29, 2003)

As Shakespeare said, "familiarity breeds contempt". Ironically , it is the pro who is much more likely to do something stupid with a chipper compared to Joe Homeowner. Most 1st time users are intimidated by the mighty wood chomping beasts. When we are around them a while we get "familiar". There are exceptions of course on both sides.


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## Striker (Jun 29, 2003)

I try to keep a close eye on the boys running the chipper. I have pulled them aside and explained the facts of death by brush chipper to them.I have told them that if they see someone else doing something stupid to not be afraid to tell them about it. I have explained to them that we have to watch each other to make sure that we get home at night in one piece.


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## NeTree (Jun 29, 2003)

Also very well put. A little well-managed fear for the machines we work with is a good thing. I'm guessing that most fatalities aren't first time users/workers; rather more experienced personnel who got complacent. 

We who work in the industry must strive to make sure that attitudes towards safety remain ever vigilent. We should not "poke fun" at those who spend a few extra minutes checking their saddle, or spend ten minutes going over every inch of their climbing line, or waiting til they have a pushstick or the like. Such practices do eat up some time, but in the end, it is time very well invested.

After I left Asplundh, I worked for Arbo***** for a very short time. I never have seen a more unsafe group of people, from the groundmen up thru to the owner. I quit within two months. It almost sent me into bankruptcy doing it, but I was determined not to work for someone with a record of one major injury and several smaller ones a year; in a company of 8 people, that was a 14 percent chance I'd be next. No thanks.

In my life of work in the green industry, I have seen all kinds of accidents; some fatal. Some will say I rule my company with an iron fist- and maybe it's true. But Chris, and Dan, and Wayne and Chuck all know it's for a good reason.

We cannot compromise on safety. All else is secondary. Money is worthless if you aren't around to spend it. There are some in this industry who take the competition between companies very personal. I don't. Every tree guy is our brother, and like family, we should look out for them, correct them when they wrong, and maybe someday we can make this Inj/Fat forum unneccesary.


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## TheTreeSpyder (Jun 29, 2003)

Thanx,
Fo-cussing on being more of a righter too this......

Pretty good idea with frozen chicken;

Dang functioning one dude only has the brain the size of a peanut though!

i've werked a farm some

So what would be the problem there?

Save that the chicken, itself would be too smart to go near;
sensing the beast's hunger and ferocity!


How about dip that froze'chicken in a gallon of Catch-Up,

real good, bread bag it

wrap that lil'lady's picture around it,

Fire up, and stand at feed, peer in look back at chicken

Ask: "How many times do you think it will take?;
to turn beauty to abs-soul-ute horrorr?"
(Make bags with pic for purpose?)

"Should we test to see; if this beauty would be spared?"
"Sorry guys, .....already did before"
-Chunk Chicken to show it comes out the same this time too;
to rule out any doubt.

Probably get more volun-tears, to clean residual sinew,
inside knives etc. for sanitation,
cuz somebody has to do that,
can get wrapped around and stuff,
doesn't just blow out i hear.

There are non-chlorinated sanitizers to finish,
perhaps iodine and water,
to kill fowl odors etc. without corrosion.
Maybe chicken is so much smaller, ya can sneak by with 1 with lil'hassle......



Fair hit on familiarity,
must con-fess i see it too;
it must share some blame.....

Fact our small college in town,
has more 3rd year students walk out in front of traffic,
than can be found 3rd graders doing same locally;
even with way more 3rd graders!

Do the 3rd graders,
though quite not chickens;
somehow know the laws of physics,
has more gravity than the law of traffic;
better than the science majors?



So as i told Stumper:

"And as maintained novice to chipper
(always in air)
lend my best: vision of the beast.....

paint rows of sharp fangs on it's feed shoot,
Call it Medusa in respect,
Keep that issue forward in any way......

and remember you are like the lion tamer in the cage,
running a bluff around ferocity,to get it to your bidding,
(like i do ushering force in the tree with rig and saw)

never giving the upper hand,
or any other body part,
scarf etc. connected to thereof.

Don't give the S.o.B. the freaking satisfaction!

Amen!
:angel:


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## Bob Wulkowicz (Jun 30, 2003)

I'd recommend every one reading a book called <i>The Sand Pebbles</i> by Richard McKenna--the book that the film of the same name is based on, with the movie never catching on to what was masterfully written about the mystery and dangers of machines.

When I read the book, I was struck by the clarity and insight the author had abouts machines.

Jake Holman, an engine room engineer, came on board a ship where all the ship's jobs were covered by Chinese in a monkey see--monkey do, kind of take over of functions. Holman wanted to run his engine room his way, but he was up against breaking the Chinese's rice bowl, the practice of crew members paying pennies for Chinese to do their jobs. 

I have never read, before or after, the quality of his understandings about how machines lay in wait for someone to be ignorant or make a mistake. 

It's a really well written book and the movie was a disappointment to me because it missed so much.

Here's an Amazon page:

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/t...557504466/all/ref=dp_pb_a/103-1189000-4393416

Get it from a library or a used book store. You won't regret the read.



Bob Wulkowicz


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## John Paul Sanborn (Jun 30, 2003)

For the used book people try Half.com

http://half.ebay.com/search/search.jsp?nthTime=1&product=books&keyword=The+Sand+Pebbles&x=16&y=17


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## TheTreeSpyder (Jul 3, 2003)

i've seen the monsters in all kinds of things guide me around their pens safely while connivingly using their strengths the best way.

In the air i humbley usher massive bull elephants from square to square, with 2 frail sticks to them tapping at either side. One ushering stick is a saw, the other a line. So they'll prolly go where they want to, with light taps to slant that from me; as itry not to get rolled over or smooooshed on, while standing bluffedly right nest to them.

i've seen merciless beasts in mighty conbines devouring off at the ground, A blast furnace as a mighty dragon to charge and catch on inhale.

A mighty lion in a grande, majestic chow with full main, that i was bluffing even walking within 10'around. i even got another dog, female for a while to make the royal breed give full way to the queen of the home. Who's one trick was to turn his head and pant with a careless smile, tounge hanging happily from head, with bright eyes smiling in his head. While so deep chestedly such a growl so low; most of it came through the ground to be sensed by ya and not so much the air to your ear. Just to let ya kindly know he never played. Till 2 years later on his very last day while doing his favorite thing, he picked me up by the hinge of my jaw. Luckily no other traffic, for it is hard to see with both eyes pressed higher than the angle of the glass. He let go luckily as i commandedly screamed. So sat back like nothing smiling all the way home. Everyone should go so good.

Another was certainly a japanamiation segmenting python in our olde small town (First eletrically lighted city, cuz it only took one! Still had it in lil'museum), most knew everyone. At 18 i worked a factory where just a year before, there a man that lived mere blocks away from me, popular wife -both of hometown;was taken from her job suddenly one dark grisly day; to come down and bid him tear full farewell clasped between boxcars in those big C jaws waiting in blood curdling pain and fear. All full well knowing, when they pulled the cars apart soon the final hemmoraging with a bursting rush would ensue.......

Younger in Chicago plenty of horrror stories, a man named Spec, just to begin....

So easily see the monster in the steel cage, so ferocious it devours seemingly 18" solid oak mast, 22' long , self fed in 3 seconds flat(?); without barely seeming even to change motor speed. Like that chow.

i think the imagery fits. The comical characteriazations mneumic and light, energizing colors but with a message. We say a picture is worth a 1000 words, a blind mans senses hightened in emergency realizes can't see, a kiss saves some energy to go to the other senses tuned somewhat as the blind man's anyway. It seems our sight senses are what are species depends on most. So it is easier to hear the snarling, breathing beasts, associate their ferrociousness with the cued imagery, to protect us naturaly that way. Werks fer me.

Still compounding the force i would seem to guess that males of any species are more visually cued ; especially breeding age. Even in Flower /Bee scenario. And that happens to be the age, species and sex of people running the chippers etc. So that would be most lined up route to the heart.

Even compounding all tendencies on our side further, we have this poor girl,that this same set of werkers is visually cued to over millions of years, species and forms; to give way as the royal chow. We speak of using what natureally exists for a system to right itself to maximum. Who sells more SnapOn tools?


So i give the maximized visual cue to trigger the select crowd of most visulally cued etc. to tune into the rest of the animal attributes of breathing, grabbing, belching for more, of beauty and the beast; the day it went wrong. JP is reaching for more permission and pictures of her. This is why i think it would werk so well; better than any other, also the beast on the same line.

i also see that the impact of the devastation, adds to the mix. Like leveraged reach the span from beauty to horror, the quickness it happened, some kind of velocity. Even standing in the vaccum as all forces msutered if only we can align and aim them, give em a shove, they jsut might roll!

Also to note 5 can pull sweat and plan, trying to slide something right in. Taking breaks, reseeting and constant effort while shaking, mite cause slight quaking, perhaps make it sudelny worse, cause aggraavation and all of the worst.. But when it is all lined up right, is the time for far fewer to magically, full forcedly leverage in tight in mere seconds. i think that not just a huge transmission, will take all your time and energy let you waste it all; lest you focus all your force as the faces exactly eclipse like portals lining up for your one chandce to jump through that window. For that is the only time any of your energy would count....to the good. And accomplishing that task precisely once, knowing how it coulda went; can be energizing rather than fatiguing; let alone possible. 

Other things have timing, some not as exclusive. But still the most leveraged shot at the right time, will pack your best whallup; maximizing anything you can spill into it.

Anytime we can give demonic face, leveraged, initial propulsion etc. everything with that girl to compound anything else that can be said; best started while recent history. Not a faded black and white of a guy from 60's that got hurt or whatever (if anything). A face especially of this, brought closer being from a present time.

Go with the flow i guess!


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## Tom Dunlap (Jul 3, 2003)

When I get my chipper repainted I'm going to treat the infeed chute to a customized paint or vinyl lettering treatment.

Instead of just a plain paint scheme, the whole infeed chute will be done up in white and red, diagonal stripes. Along the top edges where the material won't get worn off I'll put in the words "No Body Parts!" along with skull and cross bones. I'm sure that my friend who does my lettering can come up with a circle/slash, universal NO that can be superimposed over a body part.

One of my plastic rakes was worn down. I brought it home and cut off the tines to make a nice push stick. The stick now has about a twelve inch "rake" to shove debris in. No reason to have any body part cross the demarcation line.

When I worked in the UK in April I found that the chipers all had safety bars around the chutes. This included along the bottom of the chute. I asked the guys on the gang if any of the brash would hit the bar. They said that it would occasionaly. I asked if they felt that it was a nuisance. They all said that it was but the extra safety was well worth having to hit the reset button once in a while. I liked hearing that attitude. With that outlook, those chaps will live to be old arbos.

Tom


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## TheTreeSpyder (Jul 4, 2003)

i'd think that certainly would have impact! i've seen painted chippers, with no new stickers; to replace what was removed. Is that legal? Seen more matress tags with non-removal or warning shot in back off head warnings, don't remember ever seeing any of the like on chipper sticker.

Perhaps a scorecard with that skull and cross bones center top, like paper on the side; everytime someone gets killed the beast gets a 1 (mini date under mo./yr.?)on his sheet, till 4 + 1 get that diagonal slash. Right over the on switch? If a half dozen people did the same, an email might go out, to say score again..... Maybe easier to do on shop wall, maybe even chipper box. On the chipper puts it right there.

Something; like a better set rig. Sometyhing easy, something cheap, something right there. Maybe by just lacing the line a different way, setting tighter, taking pulley from belt. Whatever right there, or ready to go on hip; just that better idea, usually lining up with existing pulls and pushes, not against, save if ya wanna restrict the movement......


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## NeTree (Jul 4, 2003)

I wonder; Does anyone know the numbers as far as hydraulic feed deaths versus self-feeder deaths/injuries? Personally I doubt my chuck'n'duck could ever actually pull someone in. (completely, anyways).


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## Matt Follett (Jul 5, 2003)

TreeSpyder, I know your comment about painted chippers, yeah law is there, In fact... one of the stickers will say 'Owner is responsible for replacing damaged warning labels' I figure they paint over that one first!

I try to maintain constant virgil over the chipper, and our's is small, not quite the beast of others, But man do you get a lickin' if you hands go beyond the control bar! 

I feel very strongly that not only training, but also constent reminders must be made, in the persuit of the all might dollar, one must recognize wher time can be made and where it can not, and instill that upon the crew, over and over and over, it's one thing to briskly move brush to the chipper, keeping the beast fed, but the feeding itself must not be rushed. Effiecientcy (sp), and good job planing can make things go well, and end well.


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## TheTreeSpyder (Aug 26, 2003)

Some of ya know that i carry, hand out 'Beauty & Beast' cards; with young lady's picture from above on front and description of ravenous beast that took her on the back. i give em to tree guys, gear sellers, chipper renters; tell em they are missing something important from their safety kit i think.

Today werking in a different town, i went to the Stihl shop to see if my buddy that transferred there was still about. He was wanting help at picking gear to sell for this location as the last, we got to talking; i gave him half'dozen B&B cards; he said not many would do that, he asked about memorial etc.; as lady had been a customer of his at other location etc.

i told him of the haunting, inhuman, bone chilling constant wail that her husband of 8 mos.; (that was looking for her and had to be the one that figured out where she went....) made as he clutched the 7 year old child she left behind; undoubtedly as the last gruesome sights of her raced thru his head.... Then showed my buddy the goosebumps on my arm that commonly arose as i revisited that scene. And told how those high, open spacious ceilings, so airy and reminiscient of open mountain fresh air; weren't worth a sh!t; whenst all they did was reflect the open emptiness of such a young, bright life so vacant from her nested place with her young family............

Noone should have to here those sounds/ or author them, nor feel the heaviness in air that was designed to be so light and open; so i keep handing out the cards.........



Keeping it Forward,
Paying it Forward

-KC


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## murphy4trees (Aug 28, 2003)

The rubber flaps covering the opening on my Woodchuck does more than just prevent debris from flying back... Its a physical barrier........... No body parts past here.
Great safety idea and only very occasionally is it inconvenient.


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## Herriwill (Oct 5, 2003)

Here you go guys, the regs that are the basis for chipper safety in the UK.

http://www.hse.gov.uk/pubns/ais38.pdf


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