# Logger pay



## milkie62 (Jun 1, 2008)

What is the average salary of a logger who works for someone ? Do they have to supply all their equipment,gas and oil.I am only cutting on my own property plus whatever tree services drop off to me.Too hard of a business to make money but a hell of a way to stay in shape.


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## Nailsbeats (Jun 1, 2008)

I can't help you on the salary part.

I do it partime, just some small jobs and can tell you when it's over about all you have left are the burnt calories. That's really why I do it, that and the excitement I get out of falling timber and running saws and equipment. I'm guessing it's about the same all over. The guys at the top make some money, not the workers. Just a guess, but a slightly educated one.


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## redprospector (Jun 1, 2008)

milkie62 said:


> What is the average salary of a logger who works for someone ? Do they have to supply all their equipment,gas and oil.I am only cutting on my own property plus whatever tree services drop off to me.Too hard of a business to make money but a hell of a way to stay in shape.



Every time I've worked for someone else as a cutter I've had to supply my own equipment. There's really not a good answer for the average salary part. So many different ways to do it. Some cut by scale, some by the count, some by the tree, some by weight. It's more of a lifestyle than a living.
The term "logger" covers a broad area, it covers cat skinner's, skidder operator's, loader operator's, yarder operator's, hooker's, landing men, etc. etc. I know some old "timber faller's" who are highly insulted if you call them a logger, they are faller's. That being said, most "logger's" just bring their lunch to work. 

Andy


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## slowp (Jun 2, 2008)

A gyppo logger here was paying his hooktender $20 an hour and the rest of the crew $16 to $18 an hour. His cutters, who are very good, were getting paid by what they produced and I don't know what that was except they were happy and the owner was happy. Cutters wages were running around $30 an hour. The wages have not gone up in years. His cutters and the other small operator's cutters were supplying everything on their dollar includiing driving their own rig. The logging crew carpools in a crummy owned by the operator. 

One of the larger outfits here must pay more because they fire people a lot more and have a good crew. They supply saw gas and oil, and a crummy for their cutters too. They also have steadier employment except right now two of their yarders are sitting at the shop.


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## Humptulips (Jun 2, 2008)

slowp said:


> A gyppo logger here was paying his hooktender $20 an hour and the rest of the crew $16 to $18 an hour. His cutters, who are very good, were getting paid by what they produced and I don't know what that was except they were happy and the owner was happy. Cutters wages were running around $30 an hour. The wages have not gone up in years. His cutters and the other small operator's cutters were supplying everything on their dollar includiing driving their own rig. The logging crew carpools in a crummy owned by the operator.
> 
> One of the larger outfits here must pay more because they fire people a lot more and have a good crew. They supply saw gas and oil, and a crummy for their cutters too. They also have steadier employment except right now two of their yarders are sitting at the shop.[/QUOTE
> 
> ...


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## slowp (Jun 2, 2008)

The gyppo from Oregon complains that Washingtonians expect more pay than do Oregon crews. He also can somehow get a tax break if he supplies lunches and living quarters in Oregon. Must have to do with their state income tax.


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## Humptulips (Jun 2, 2008)

That explains something I've been pondering. A friend of mine recently took a job down near Coos Bay. He told me the company furnishes all work clothes, caulk shoes, gloves and rain clothes. He's also getting free space for his trailer. I should have known it had something to do with taxes.


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## tramp bushler (Jun 3, 2008)

*Fallers pay*

Hump ;;;; You ought to take a quick job in O G , have them get you a new pair of your corks .. opcorn: 

Today I fell and bucked some where between 10,000 -15,000 dollars worth of old growth Yellow Cedar , Sitka Spruce and Western Hemlock ....

I made 250 $ , but all I had to supply was me , Saw crapped out this morning so I ran the bosses for the rest of the day ....

Most larger companies up here , which there are not many of now , pay cutters around 300 a day, day wage or if it,s a Bushel show the price is set so a guy can avg. around 300 a day .. but the co. that hires the fallers pays the insurance and they supply the gas and oil and most of the time the crummy ...If you are going to cut full time up here you have to figure on buying 2 new power heads per year , and 660 Magnums are going for more than 1 k $ ...395 Huskys are simular ..


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## slowp (Jun 3, 2008)

I like it. When your gear is about shot, go work in Oregon! I wonder if the lunches are any good? Homemade cookies? But the stories (or information) I heard about the crew sharing two motel rooms were pretty bad.


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## tramp bushler (Jun 3, 2008)

*Rooms*

.
A guy can always spring for his own room .....


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## Humptulips (Jun 3, 2008)

My friend was wondering if they would spring for a pair of Kuliens. I kind of doubt it.
I've seen a few guys in camp that you couldn't pay me enough to room with.
Tramp Busheler,
You ever run into a guy up there they called Crusty the Clown. He was a beaut. He chased for me at Port Alice. Good man on the job but definitly strange. He was on the 86 list of every establishment in Craig and most places in Ketchikan. I think he had a split personality plus being a bad alcholic. Looked exactly like Bozo with a bad skin condition.


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## tramp bushler (Jun 3, 2008)

*Heard of him*

... No doubt there were some of the worst degenerates on the west coast in the camps of Southeast ... 
Back when the Foc'sle was a bar and not a diamond shop ., Seriously , it became a jewelry shop for the tourists off the cruise ships .
I heard stories of some of the most disgusting events taking place there ..... That was Jack Adams outfit in Port Alice wasn,t it ... El Cap had moved to Coffman Cove by then ...

Ever run into Bronko Billy , he,s dead now ECT .ECT. ECT ....


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## Humptulips (Jun 4, 2008)

Yea, I almost hate to admit it but I worked for Jack. Pay was good but was reputed to be the worst camp in AK. I was there working in Jan. Crazy I know!
Water froze, no electricity and the bunk house leaked heat like a sieve. You could set a cup of coffee by your bed at night and it would be frozen solid in the morning. We finally shut down when the snow was hitting me at the shoulders. We were logging the timber that LP tried to walk away from but the FS wouldn't let them in other words tough logging and poor timber.
One place a busheler had chalked on a log (this is the worst crap I ever cut) Bet he didn't make much that day!
Never ran into Bronco Billy. Did you know Scott Brown? He was killed the year after I left.


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## huskykid141 (Jun 4, 2008)

would the pay increase a little if a cutter or someone else on the job had a college degree?


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## forestryworks (Jun 4, 2008)

college degree doesn't really mean a thing on a logging crew

either use your degree working for the feds or state or private agency
or save it to fall back on


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## Boleclimber (Jun 4, 2008)

If you have a college degree you would be best off to use the degree and fall back on your logging experience. Employers requiring a degree will be skeptical of any applicant who has a degree and has not been using it. When you attempt to apply for jobs requiring a degree, after having x amount of years logging, you will likely be told you do not have sufficient experience in the field. You would have to start over with an entry level position competing against newly graduated students. 

This is especially true in government positions.


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## Humptulips (Jun 5, 2008)

huskykid141 said:


> would the pay increase a little if a cutter or someone else on the job had a college degree?



Possibly a PHD in Sthilology or chokerology with a minor in (Get up that hill or hit the road). Be sure to take splicing 101 too.


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## Gologit (Jun 5, 2008)

Humptulips said:


> Possibly a PHD in Sthilology or chokerology with a minor in (Get up that hill or hit the road). Be sure to take splicing 101 too.



LOL...Don't forget Log-Truck Avoidance 101 and an extra credit class in tape measure reading.


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## Burvol (Jun 5, 2008)

I keep telling myself I am making money, then I add it all up, not so much! (But there are good weeks here and there) Being a faller is something special that I would not trade for the money of being a suit and tie dork with a water cooler, big boobs in the office, lunch with a salad and dinner fork, and company functions. I like being a contract faller, I have the freedom to live my life how I see fit. It's pretty easy really, produce...or you're down the road jack.


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## slowp (Jun 5, 2008)

Don't forget to take these elective classes: Group Dynamics, Creative Whining, and Cussology I. But I think you have to have a _preisit_ thing of a couple years of experience for Creative Whining.  

Oh, and a logger who was logging here, recommends taking a couple quarters of Debate to deal with the Forest Service. I'd recommend a class in Abnormal Psychology for that too.


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## Gologit (Jun 5, 2008)

slowp said:


> Don't forget to take these elective classes: Group Dynamics, Creative Whining, and Cussology I. But I think you have to have a _preisit_ thing of a couple years of experience for Creative Whining.
> 
> Oh, and a logger who was logging here, recommends taking a couple quarters of Debate to deal with the Forest Service. I'd recommend a class in Abnormal Psychology for that too.



Don't forget Aberrant Behavior...An Introduction to Dealing With Bureaucrats and 'Ologists.

And Slowp...you know we don't whine. We just describe the situation in great detail. Over and over and over.


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## slowp (Jun 5, 2008)

I would add a few more overs to that line in some instances. Had to listen to quite a bit yesterday done over the phone. But I would not rate it as very creative. I would give him a C- maybe a D.  

A course in funny storytelling would be a good thing. This morning started out with a good one, and I would give him an A in the delivery of said story.

It had to do with touristas stating that All Wheel Drive is way better than Four Wheel Drive, a snowplowing dozer, and not having $100.


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## Humptulips (Jun 5, 2008)

That's just mean. I mean you whetted my appetite for a good story and then left me hanging.


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## slowp (Jun 6, 2008)

I can't tell it nearly as good, because it didn't happen to me. The teller also has the local dialect. He's from one of the been here a while families. Stay tuned, I gotta go walk another unit and then cut some stuff so more tourists can speed up the road to nowhere, turnaround and come back.


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## huskykid141 (Jun 6, 2008)

Humptulips said:


> Possibly a PHD in Sthilology or chokerology with a minor in (Get up that hill or hit the road). Be sure to take splicing 101 too.



lol 
   :greenchainsaw:


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## slowp (Jun 6, 2008)

Ok, I'm at home trying to get warmed up after a morning in the outdoors in what can only be said are winter conditions...no snow but 40 degrees and a steady rain. So, I'll try to tell the story as best I can.

The setting is on the road to one of the good viewpoints to view Mt St. Helens. Often, it is plowed open by now but we have had too much snow this year so you can't even get close. You can't get anywhere on that road to even catch a glimpse right now. There are 3 signs up that say Road Closed 20
miles ahead, but still they come. 

The logger was plowing into one of his units. Knowing the way people are on that road, he has permission to keep the gate closed. He plowed the area in front of the gate the very last. 

When he was plowing the little area in front of the gate, a nice SUV comes up with two women in it (men also do this). One got out and asked him how to get to St. Helens. He told her that no way could she get there as there was too much snow. He couldn't even get up the road with his 4x4 truck. She then said well, her SUV was not just a 4 wheel drive, it was much better. It was an ALL wheel drive. He told her it didn't make no difference, she would get stuck. She only had highway tires on her rig. She argued and he said he felt like slappin' her. She then asked what that yellow thing was that he was driving. Maybe he could drive them up to the volcano in it? He told her that it was too far, too slow and no room for anybody to ride. Besides, he was ready to go home. She then got back in her SUV with ALL wheel drive and said she would drive there then--to the volcano. He asked her if she had $100 cash? She said no. He said then he wasn't going to pull her ass out when she got stuck unless she had $100 cuz that's what it would cost. 

She got in her SUV. Meanwhile, her friend got out and asked if the logger would take her to town if the other got stuck. She said they had been on a road trip for the weekend and it had turned into a bad road trip and she didn't think she would stay friends anymore after this. I think he said he'd haul her to town. 

Anyway, the ALL wheel drive vehicle started up the unplowed road, but not far as she chickened out and backed back down. She told the logger he was right, and they went on down the hill towards town. Not only was there too much snow, but there was also a locked gate on that road too. End of story.

That's the mentality of a lot of our visitors. So, I spent the morning in the rain cutting more bent over trees so the shiny new round (the ones lately seem to be round shaped) SUVs won't get scratched or dinged. Since gas prices ar so high, it seems to be only the high end $$$ ALL wheel drives that are going up there. 

I'm warmed up now, time to go to town.


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## huskykid141 (Jun 6, 2008)

nice story, if i were him i wouldn't of argued and let them go up and i would leave as soon as they got in the snow part of the road.
:greenchainsaw:


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## Humptulips (Jun 7, 2008)

I once rescued a couple in a chevy malibu that followed my tracks in. I was barely making it in 4WD. I can't figure how they made it as far as they did except for the fact that they were going down hill. When I asked what they were thinking about driving a car like that into 18" of snow they said "Well, you made it" LOL I had to drag them for over a mile after I got them turned around. It was almost dark and they weren't even grateful.


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## joesawer (Jun 7, 2008)

Slowp's story reminds me of a city fire watch and his girl friends.
There was a big ol sissy boy that had been hired for fire watch that had told every body who would listen what a great "lumberjack" he was. 
One day at their lunch time as I was leaving, a Land Rover with two women pulled up and asked where this individual was. I directed them towards the landing and the crew there told them he was up the hill doing fire watch. 
To make a long story shorter, they tried to drive the all wheel drive suv up the skid trail and evidently got stuck and almost turned over. The skid trail was blocked for over an hour after lunch while the fire watch used the company tractor to get them out. 
He was suprised that the boss was mad and could not understand why the crew did not like him. 
Later he was fired for sleeping while on fire watch.


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## slowp (Jun 7, 2008)

Tourists will get stuck every day on that road. I think they believe the SUV commercials. I helped a Swiss Tourist get unstuck a couple weeks ago. She was trying to go through snowmobile packed gloppy snow in a rental van with street tires on it. I had turned my pickup around at that point and was working on a blowdown that was partially blocking the road. My "Bubba" pickup would have been stuck in that stuff. The same logger has pulled people out this year too. While working in the same area a couple winters ago, he found a woman stumbling down the road. She was stuck on the other side of the pass and thought a restaurant was nearby. She was lucky he found her.


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## tramp bushler (Jun 7, 2008)

*College Degrees*

. 
Tho not imediately related to logs , there was a guy who worked at the Garbage Transfer place in Sitka , ., Who would ask people who would do something real stupid [ WHERE DO YOU TEACH ]

.Just the thot of college degrees in the timber makes me want to kill something ..

I better stop there ..


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## Jacob J. (Jun 14, 2008)

slowp said:


> Cutters wages were running around $30 an hour.



Anyone still cutting for that wage is a damn fool.


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## John Ellison (Sep 21, 2008)

Humptulips said:


> Yea, I almost hate to admit it but I worked for Jack. Pay was good but was reputed to be the worst camp in AK. I was there working in Jan. Crazy I know!
> Water froze, no electricity and the bunk house leaked heat like a sieve. You could set a cup of coffee by your bed at night and it would be frozen solid in the morning. We finally shut down when the snow was hitting me at the shoulders. We were logging the timber that LP tried to walk away from but the FS wouldn't let them in other words tough logging and poor timber.
> One place a busheler had chalked on a log (this is the worst crap I ever cut) Bet he didn't make much that day!
> Never ran into Bronco Billy. Did you know Scott Brown? He was killed the year after I left.



Hey, thats something to see this here. I knew Scott Brown, I was at Port Alice in 83 or 4. Do you know Luke and Slyvia at Tokeen?Anybody at Little Naukati? I also worked at several camps with Bronko Billy, some good stories about him.


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## milkie62 (Sep 21, 2008)

At $30 an hr is there any other benefits to the job ????


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## Tree Sling'r (Sep 21, 2008)

milkie62 said:


> At $30 an hr is there any other benefits to the job ????



Around here it is at least $50 an hour on the employers books and if you carry your own insurance, like I do, then it is around $70.
That is just day pay though, I would rather bushel (paid by the 1000mmbf) I have always made more bushling then day pay.


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## forestryworks (Sep 23, 2008)

Tree Sling'r said:


> Around here it is at least $50 an hour on the employers books and if you carry your own insurance, like I do, then it is around $70.
> That is just day pay though, I would rather bushel (paid by the 1000mmbf) I have always made more bushling then day pay.



what are you gettin' per thousand?


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## slowp (Sep 23, 2008)

milkie62 said:


> At $30 an hr is there any other benefits to the job ????



The crew gets a crummy, and their sawgas and oil supplied. They also seem to work pretty steady, although they have some long drives from home.


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## Gologit (Sep 24, 2008)

slowp said:


> The crew gets a crummy, and their sawgas and oil supplied. They also seem to work pretty steady, although they have some long drives from home.



LOL...That's one of the things they never showed on Axe-Men. A two hour ride each way every day isn't unusual. A lot of outfits don't pay for the travel time, either, except for the guy driving the crummy.

I got to sleep in this morning...I'm usually up and gone by 1 a.m. and get home around five or six. Unless I'm loading...then the hours get really long.


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## slowp (Sep 24, 2008)

One guy was driving 3 hours to get to work, falling for 6 hours, then driving back home. He bought an old, high mpg, deathmobile to commute in just because of the long drive and high fuel prices. Now he's working here so has a 20 minute commute over a bumpy, scenic road.


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## Tree Sling'r (Sep 24, 2008)

forestryworks said:


> what are you gettin' per thousand?



It's not what you get paid, it's what you get done.:greenchainsaw:


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## hammerlogging (Sep 25, 2008)

Tree Sling'r said:


> It's not what you get paid, it's what you get done.:greenchainsaw:



That vaguely reminds me of "no officer, I'm not jumping off the bridge, I'm jumping into the river"


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## testlight (Sep 27, 2008)

So I guess by logger you're talking about fallers?
As a choker setter I made $12, and $14 in Oregon, in Alaska I have seen ads for $16-$18.

If you want to run a company saw and all you should look into a job a as chaser, but unless you make some friends or get married into you still have to work your way up from the bottom. 

If you can't hang with the loggers, maybe you could try fighting fire. You generally don't need much experience to run saw for fires, usually some easy certification hoop they make you jump thru on top of the usually wildland fir training.


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