# My Splitter Build (heavy on photos)



## jthornton (Dec 11, 2013)

Seeing as we lost a lot with the hack attack I'm starting my splitter build over again.

This is the start of my build, I bought a Dodge K car rear axle and brought it home from the junk yard.







Then I stripped it down.






Then I drilled out one end of the support tube so I could split the axle in two parts and shorten it up.






Here is the axle mocked up with the springs.






Painted spring hangers in place and ready to go.






JT


----------



## jthornton (Dec 11, 2013)

I didn't have a beam long enough so I had to splice two together and they were not even the same height beams so I had to cut one down and add a cap back to it.






Building up the beam






Starting to fit up the cylinder and wedge.






Wedge is done.






Getting the supports in






Adding the reaction plate and support for it.






Finished the attachment structure for the beam.






Enjoy
JT


----------



## jthornton (Dec 11, 2013)

Getting started on the frame






Adding my retractable roll around wheels






Adding the beam support structure to the frame






Beam upright in the working position






Another view






JT


----------



## jthornton (Dec 11, 2013)

The engine and pump mount






In the frame






Completed engine and pump






JT


----------



## jthornton (Dec 11, 2013)

Building the wedge.


























JT


----------



## cre73 (Dec 11, 2013)

Beautiful work, should serve you well for many years.


----------



## jthornton (Dec 11, 2013)

Thanks, I just need to finish it LOL.

JT


----------



## dave_dj1 (Dec 11, 2013)

Ild' forgotten how nice it looks! Nice work now get 'er done! Nice shop too by the way, I'm envious. 
dave


----------



## Vermonster (Dec 11, 2013)

Wicked rugged looking. HD - Heavy Duty!! Very nice work!!


----------



## rancher2 (Dec 11, 2013)

You have a nice build going on. Keep up the good work.


----------



## MuskokaSplitter (Dec 11, 2013)

Heavy Duty is an Understatement. Really nice work!


----------



## clint53 (Dec 11, 2013)

Very well built and heavy duty. I am impressed so far. Can't wait to see it finished.


----------



## Smulax (Dec 11, 2013)

Very nice.


----------



## jhellwig (Dec 11, 2013)

Where did you come up with the engine? I like that series of engine as it is based on the quantum flat head. To bad they don't make it anymore.


----------



## Nosmo (Dec 12, 2013)

Certainly looks like you have done this before and you know what you are doing. Great job for sure.


----------



## jthornton (Dec 12, 2013)

jhellwig said:


> Where did you come up with the engine? I like that series of engine as it is based on the quantum flat head. To bad they don't make it anymore.


I get them as samples from Briggs when I build equipment for them. Actually this one is an Intek model that was made in the Rolla MO plant and is 190cc with overhead valves. They have been replaced by the W series engines. They still make the Quantum in both Poplar Bluff MO and Murray KY.

JT


----------



## jthornton (Dec 12, 2013)

Nosmo said:


> Certainly looks like you have done this before and you know what you are doing. Great job for sure.


Well this is my first splitter but not my first fabrication project... thanks for all the compliments guys.

JT


----------



## jthornton (Dec 12, 2013)

dave_dj1 said:


> Ild' forgotten how nice it looks! Nice work now get 'er done! Nice shop too by the way, I'm envious.
> dave


One of my projects for this winter is the finish the beast and paint it John Deere Green to match the engine. I have been overwhelmed with work lately and hope to get a break soon so I can finish up the splitter.

JT


----------



## Hinerman (Dec 12, 2013)

Nice work; but, I am not sure I understand the design. Is it a vertical splitter only? It looks like the motor and frame are in the way for horizontal splitting. Am I missing something? Are you going to add a lift to get the rounds up for vertical splitting?


----------



## jthornton (Dec 12, 2013)

Hinerman said:


> Nice work; but, I am not sure I understand the design. Is it a vertical splitter only? It looks like the motor and frame are in the way for horizontal splitting. Am I missing something? Are you going to add a lift to get the rounds up for vertical splitting?


Yes, it is for vertical splitting only. I built it for a comfortable work height for me. I will have a hook that can be connected to the wedge to lift heavy rounds up and on to the work table. I've used some horizontal splitters in the past and got tire of chasing the splits for re-splitting. Also I don't like to lean over the splitter to work.

JT


----------



## NSMaple1 (Dec 12, 2013)

That joint where the beams meet looks like a weak spot to me - can kind of picture it folding right at the welds. I'm no metal worker though, by any streatch - so might be good.


----------



## Jredsjeep (Dec 12, 2013)

nice work! just as a side note, i actually have a K car axle under my trailer i built 15 years ago or so. i had a rim that was bent so i went to get another, K cars don’t exist in the yards around me anymore. i was pleasantly surprised that Saturn rims fit right up though, that should buy me a few more years of parts availibility.


----------



## jthornton (Dec 12, 2013)

NSMaple1 said:


> That joint where the beams meet looks like a weak spot to me - can kind of picture it folding right at the welds. I'm no metal worker though, by any streatch - so might be good.


What you can't see is the doublers that I put on the tension side of the beam. I will pay attention to this area when I start splitting to see if any diagonal braces or boxing in is needed.

JT


----------



## wndwlkr (Dec 12, 2013)

I want one of them cannons !


----------



## Preston (Dec 12, 2013)

The splitter is nice, but that shop has me coveting, which Scripture tell me I shouldn't do. That shop is a dream world for me. And the canon, love it.


----------



## endmill (Dec 12, 2013)

Nice shop, used to run a Brown 7 sharpe grinder back in the day.


----------



## jthornton (Dec 13, 2013)

You can get the cannon and the plans from Dixie Gun Works.
Here is some more photos and a couple of videos
http://gnipsel.com/cannon/cannon.xhtml

I spent a couple of years sharpening point cutters for nail making machines on a Brown & Sharpe surface grinder.

JT


----------



## jags (Dec 13, 2013)

Impressive skillz and nice build to date. What size cylinder are you running?


----------



## jthornton (Dec 13, 2013)

jags said:


> Impressive skillz and nice build to date. What size cylinder are you running?


It is a Prince 4 x 24 tie rod cylinder.

Thanks
JT


----------



## NEKS Tree Svc (Jan 4, 2014)

finished pic? Looks good so far!


----------



## Torch68 (Jan 4, 2014)

Great work how many hours do you think you have into the build so far?


----------



## jthornton (Jan 4, 2014)

NEKS Tree Svc said:


> finished pic? Looks good so far!



Actually I will have some time to work on it in the next few weeks and try and get it done.

JT


----------



## jthornton (Jan 4, 2014)

Torch68 said:


> Great work how many hours do you think you have into the build so far?


Thanks, I never keep track of hours as I just work on things like that as time allows. If I was forced into a corner with a 1911 and told to take a SWAG I'd say 80-100 hours.

JT


----------



## milkie62 (Jan 4, 2014)

Nothing better to do than to cut and weld steel ? Work of art right there. I was thinking of using a vertical motor for my next one since they can usually be had cheaper and get bigger HP


----------



## Jakers (Jan 5, 2014)

opcorn: .... Again


----------



## jthornton (Jan 5, 2014)

milkie62 said:


> Nothing better to do than to cut and weld steel ? Work of art right there. I was thinking of using a vertical motor for my next one since they can usually be had cheaper and get bigger HP



Well metal working is fun to me... and I used the Intek because I had 3 new ones left over from building a primer testing machine for Briggs and Stratton. The machine was very near the end of the final assembly line so the test motors were complete. Usually I only get partial motors for testing.

JT


----------



## jthornton (Jan 6, 2014)

I finally got back on this project and started fabricating the hydraulic tank.






I have 6" between the pump and the tank. Is that too short for the suction line? My other option is to make a 180 degree loop from the pump to the tank front which makes some sense to me now that I think of it.






Thanks
JT


----------



## triptester (Jan 7, 2014)

It looks like with the suction line exiting the tank at the rear corner it will give you more room to put a shut off valve and assemble fittings.With the suction at the rear the line will be better protected in transit but more difficult to service. Where you have to place the return may need to be considered.

Looking real good so far.


----------



## jthornton (Jan 7, 2014)

Do you normally have a shut off valve on the suction line? I assume some kind of baffle between the return hole to break up the flow?

JT


----------



## dave_dj1 (Jan 7, 2014)

I have 11" of suction line and I wish it was longer so I could have put in a shut off. It would have been nice for servicing as I had to drain the system to fix a leak. One thing to consider is that with the line that short it makes it difficult to get the line on, I can barely get mine on. 
dave


----------



## jthornton (Jan 7, 2014)

Thanks Dave, I'll put a full flow ball valve in there. I think I'm going to come out of the front of the tank. I would need about 18" of hose for that so it would be easy to put on and off. This gives me the added benefit of the pressure hose facing the right way.

JT


----------



## ETpilot (Jan 7, 2014)

Are you adding a baffle inside the reservoir? If so, please post a picture of your design. I am going to use a round reservoir and am thinking of how to add a baffle.


----------



## jthornton (Jan 7, 2014)

ETpilot said:


> Are you adding a baffle inside the reservoir? If so, please post a picture of your design. I am going to use a round reservoir and am thinking of how to add a baffle.


I don't have a photo yet, I'm thinking something tacked to the side of the tank that covers the return with some holes to slow down the velocity and splashing. Maybe someone has some photos we can both look at.

JT


----------



## Jakers (Jan 7, 2014)

if you run your return below the full oil line you wont get any splashing. it just makes changing return filters interesting. they exchange oil pretty good with just that. if you arent gonna run a cooler and are slightly worried about temps getting warm then you can run cooling "flues" through the tank with just a fan on them too. i never really saw the need for a baffle tho


----------



## jthornton (Jan 7, 2014)

Does anyone see anything terribly wrong with this location for the splitter valve?











Keep in the back of your mind, I'm right handed, the beam folds down for transport only.

JT


----------



## triptester (Jan 7, 2014)

jthornton said:


> Do you normally have a shut off valve on the suction line? I assume some kind of baffle between the return hole to break up the flow?
> 
> JT


 I put a shut off in the suction line incase any work needs to be done on the pump or suction hose. Abaffle down the center of the tank with suction and discharge at the same end forces the fluid to travel the longess distance for cooling and removing air. Also consider an inspection openning in the top of the tank for cleaning.

http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c20/triptester/hydraulictank004.jpg

A drain can also be seen through the suction hole.


----------



## jthornton (Jan 7, 2014)

I hope my tank looks that good when I'm done. I pretty much have to have the return on one end and the suction on the other end or so it seems at this point. I'll make a similar setup to your fill cap, what kind of gasket material did you use? 

JT


----------



## triptester (Jan 7, 2014)

The valve at that level will be in the way of the split wood.It should be raised up.


----------



## jthornton (Jan 7, 2014)

That does pose a small problem as I can't mount the valve to the beam very high or it will hit the engine when I lower the beam for transport. I'll have to study the options...

JT


----------



## jags (Jan 7, 2014)

I agree that the suggested valve position is not optimal. It wouldn't need to be attached to the beam. An upright piece of 2x2 tubing would give you a substantial "base" to work with.


----------



## triptester (Jan 7, 2014)

The control valve could be mounted to the right and just above the wedge. It should clear the engine. I noticed the exhaust is right next to the hydraulic tank it could cause a heat problem.


----------



## Preston (Jan 7, 2014)

To me it looks like you will have to be over on or into the trailer to operate it. Is that so or am I looking at it wrong?


----------



## jthornton (Jan 7, 2014)

With the valve in this position or higher it clears the engine when down.






JT


----------



## jthornton (Jan 7, 2014)

Preston said:


> To me it looks like you will have to be over on or into the trailer to operate it. Is that so or am I looking at it wrong?



I'm standing behind the splitter when splitting.






I will have more table area around the reaction plate when I'm done (I hope).

JT


----------



## triptester (Jan 7, 2014)

The handle must be above the face of the wedge so wood doesn't interfere handle operation.


----------



## jthornton (Jan 7, 2014)

triptester said:


> The handle must be above the face of the wedge so wood doesn't interfere handle operation.



One of the things I value the most about this forum is the experience you guys have and that you don't mind sharing it.

I understand what your saying but I never cut 24" logs so the stop will be set at 20" as I usually only cut 18" rounds so the handle will above the bottom of the wedge in normal operation. Here is what I cobbled up and tacked on... the only thing that bugs me is the return line hanging out in outer space. Also a round would have to be 2' in diameter x 24" long to touch the handle if I split it in half. At this point I can always knock it off and move it up. I do like the feel of the handle at this position... I don't want it too high as I'm a bit short and don't want to reach above my shoulder to operate it.






Thanks
JT


----------



## gulity1 (Jan 7, 2014)

The valve is an Ok postion for you ? make sure stand there with you hand on it for some time The reason I say that is my shoulder cramps when my hand is raised above my shoulder for any time longer then about 1 min bad rotator cuff along with other stupid stuff. Now imagine a hose about the size of a shop vac hose and others hanging bending etc there are we still happy?? What height is the reaction plate off of the gorund? seems like about 28-34 inches is about right for height, figure kitchen counter top are 36" tall if I remeber right, just an example. If you need hyd hoses contact me I am sure I can help 1/4 3/8 1/2 5/8 or 3/4 Most suction is wire re-enforced just an fyi it ahs about a 6-8 bend radi if I remember.
When you fab your tank you can use a 90 shut off then a 90 to make your turn and get your 180 turn done and also take care of the shut off issue If you need a pic of the fittings I can try to post one if you would like


----------



## jthornton (Jan 7, 2014)

The reaction plate is 30" off the ground with the wheels off the ground. A 90 out of the tank would work perfect, the bend radius would be 12"-14" to the pump suction. I'd love to see some photos. The splitter valve is a Prince with 3/4" in and out and 1/2" working ports but the data sheet that came with it doesn't say what threads they are...

JT


----------



## triptester (Jan 7, 2014)

Consider running the valve flat it should make for a better hose routing

.


----------



## jthornton (Jan 7, 2014)

Mounting it flat does make sense and easier to operate with in and out instead of up/down on the lever... that's why I just tacked it in position until I got more feedback.

Thanks
JT


----------



## hseII (Jan 7, 2014)

Nice Fab Work. I really like the Gussets along the Beam.

I've got a few Questions:

1) What kind of shielding/guard ideas will you incorporate to protect that pump?
Hopefully nothing will ever get that high but now would be the time to address that. 
2) Why not mount your valve in the horizontal on a stub up of the material you built the frame out of with a piece of plate on top as the base?
3)will you only be splitting smaller wood,(< 12")?
I don't mean to sound smart, but it would look to be a chore to load larger wood onto you splitter.

I'm sure you've put countless hours in the design of this splitter, and it does look good thus far. 

We're going to build a new splitter soon and are discussing which direction we will be going. We are considering building a diesel powered horizontal with a loading gate for the big sections, as we already have a 3 point hitch horizontal unit that Dad and my uncle put together one winter at the fab shop 20+ years ago.

We saved a 10" H beam from some job done in the past and granddad had the local hydraulic shop fab is a cylinder just for the upcoming splitter.( He had this done probably 5-6 years ago, we just haven't got around to putting it together) My 78 yr old grandfather told me the other day that if he could hire,  3 welders for about 3 days, we'd have us our new splitter.

He's a Card


----------



## jthornton (Jan 7, 2014)

hseII said:


> Nice Fab Work. I really like the Gussets along the Beam.
> 
> I've got a few Questions:
> 
> ...



I'll fabricate some tubing to go in front, but I need to wait till I know for sure where the suction line runs.

This is the latest position for the valve and I think I'll lower it and put a straight handle on it. Just gotta make sure it clears the motor...





By smaller wood I assume 12" in diameter, no I'll split what ever I can find, I just finished splitting a 48" diameter red oak with my X27 (except for a few pieces I had to noodle) and wedges to quarter the rounds that gave me 3 cords of wood. I plan on having a lift to get larger rounds up to the splitting table and wings on each side to hold the splits for re-splitting.

After running a horizontal some I don't like leaning over the splitter, I hope being able to stand straight up will be more comfortable as I approach your grandfathers age. I also don't like chasing the splits to re-split them.

JT


----------



## gulity1 (Jan 7, 2014)

Those look like NPT ports , Are they threaded right to the top of the post or is there a chamfer or edge break for an Oring to seat on it? When you pull the plugs out are they sealed with anything tape dope and oring ? I they are NPT I can make hoses with npt fittings crimped on them and save you a fitting on thte valve and a hose fitting I just need to know what you want on the other end JIC NPT or Seal loc ( oring on the seal face) what ever you wnat or need let me know I will try to help if I can


----------



## jthornton (Jan 8, 2014)

The fittings on the cylinder have an o-ring and are not any NPT size. I'll have to look at my paper work to see what they are. I'm thinking on the cylinder if I can get long 90's that would make the hose routes much cleaner and free of tight bends. Both the pressure and return hose need to bend near the rear pin as the beam pivots into the towing position. I'll check the valve today to see if they are NPT. Do you have a link to that 90° suction ball valve? I'd like to see that.

JT


----------



## jthornton (Jan 8, 2014)

I did some checking this morning and my cylinder is a Lion with 3/4-16 ORB ports. What is the common type of female end on a hydraulic hose a 37° JIC? The rest of the fittings are NPT.

Edit: The pump pressure outlet is 1/2" NPT the valve is 3/4" NPT, would you reduce at the valve to 1/2" hose?

JT


----------



## triptester (Jan 8, 2014)

From the valve to the cylinder you should be able to run straight fittings or 45 degree fittings at the most. Here are some pics for the supply and return they can be angled back to the column.


----------



## jthornton (Jan 8, 2014)

The second photo is what I had in my mind this morning. Does the return line have to be high pressure or can it be something else?

I have to rework my mount a bit to make room for the pressure hose to come up from the bottom...

Thanks
JT


----------



## triptester (Jan 8, 2014)

The 1/2" NPT and 3/4"-16 ORB ( 08- ORB )are similar but not interchangable will both use 1/2" hose. Here is a link to hydraulic fittings. The return hose does not need to be high pressure but hydraulic fluid compatible.
http://www.discounthydraulichose.com/v/vspfiles/downloadables/thread_guide.pdf


----------



## jthornton (Jan 8, 2014)

Triptester, thanks for the photo of the fittings.

This is the final rendition of the valve support... I hope.









Edit: well it works fine if I move the engine back 2"... so back it goes. This is finally coming together.

Thanks
JT


----------



## triptester (Jan 8, 2014)

You could move the control valve forward toward where you will be standing. Less reach and bring the valve and cylinder ports more in line.
For your hydraulic hoses if you use NPT hose ends with the tapered seats that match the swivel fittings, you will find them readily available at most farm supply stores.


----------



## ETpilot (Jan 8, 2014)

Here is a picture I found of a tank with a baffle. The pipe in back is the return. The fluid would be returned to the return side just above the bottom then flow over the baffle to the suction side. By flowing a long distance it would have time to cool. Looks like this was a full weld around the baffle. I have read that you should have some small cut outs in the corner so the fluid can maintain an even level. 

I had some good info on reservoirs but it was on my laptop and it crashed. I am going to try to recover data from the hard drive. I am working with an iPad for now. I hope the picture comes out right side up. Last picture I posted it was up side down. Not sure if that is how it opens for the members.


----------



## woodcuter ms361 (Jan 8, 2014)

I used a sq hyd tank with no baffell ,never had a problem or had hyd oil to get hot,18hp -11gpm,want to put 23gpm on it someday,like your build!



[/URL][/IMG]


----------



## fastLeo151 (Jan 8, 2014)

Op

That wedge looks wicked


----------



## woodcuter ms361 (Jan 8, 2014)

since then I have built log lift


----------



## woodcuter ms361 (Jan 8, 2014)

ops


----------



## jthornton (Jan 9, 2014)

ETpilot said:


> Here is a picture I found of a tank with a baffle. The pipe in back is the return. The fluid would be returned to the return side just above the bottom then flow over the baffle to the suction side. By flowing a long distance it would have time to cool. Looks like this was a full weld around the baffle. I have read that you should have some small cut outs in the corner so the fluid can maintain an even level.
> 
> I had some good info on reservoirs but it was on my laptop and it crashed. I am going to try to recover data from the hard drive. I am working with an iPad for now. I hope the picture comes out right side up. Last picture I posted it was up side down. Not sure if that is how it opens for the members.


That's what I was thinking the baffle needed some corner cutouts to keep the fluid level. I'm also thinking of a maze looking baffle where the return comes in and has to go around the first baffle then around the second one then the suction is behind the third one.






JT


----------



## jthornton (Jan 9, 2014)

woodcuter ms361 said:


> I used a sq hyd tank with no baffell ,never had a problem or had hyd oil to get hot,18hp -11gpm,want to put 23gpm on it someday,like your build!



Thanks, I see you used an axle like mine possibly from a Dodge K car? While the tank does not have a lid it is easy to put a baffle in... I like your log lift. I plan on having a lift to pick up big rounds using log tongs hanging on a chain.

JT


----------



## jthornton (Jan 9, 2014)

fastLeo151 said:


> Op
> 
> That wedge looks wicked


I hope it works as good as it looks!

JT


----------



## ETpilot (Jan 9, 2014)

jthornton said:


> That's what I was thinking the baffle needed some corner cutouts to keep the fluid level. I'm also thinking of a maze looking baffle where the return comes in and has to go around the first baffle then around the second one then the suction is behind the third one.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Here is what is said about the baffle:

Permits foreign substance to settle to bottom, allows entrained air to escape from fluid, prevents localized turbulence, promotes heat dissipation from reservoir walls and it should have an access cover for cleaning. 

Your design covers it all. I think it should work very good.


----------



## Kevin in Ohio (Jan 9, 2014)

When I was building mine, the guy who sold me the parts and builds them for a living said it is best to use a dispersion tube that is capped off on the end. You can see here what it looks like.







He said this is the best way to insure no swirling of the fluid. I have a single baffle in mine with the dispersion tube on one side and the feed to the pump on the other.


----------



## jthornton (Jan 9, 2014)

Kevin in Ohio said:


> When I was building mine, the guy who sold me the parts and builds them for a living said it is best to use a dispersion tube that is capped off on the end. You can see here what it looks like.
> 
> He said this is the best way to insure no swirling of the fluid. I have a single baffle in mine with the dispersion tube on one side and the feed to the pump on the other.



Thanks for the photo, which way did you face the holes?

JT


----------



## Kevin in Ohio (Jan 9, 2014)

jthornton said:


> Thanks for the photo, which way did you face the holes?
> 
> JT


 It is crossed drilled, meaning 4 holes at each location. I tightened it till the holes were on 45 degrees from the bottom so it wasn't shooting straight down. 







If you make one up, be sure to deburr it on the inside to get all the shavings and such out. Either a deburring tool or some wrapped emery and rag on a long rod. I did both as I want no surprises.


----------



## Preston (Jan 10, 2014)

So what does the diversion tube do? Is that the return? Or am I lost?


----------



## Kevin in Ohio (Jan 10, 2014)

Preston said:


> So what does the diversion tube do? Is that the return? Or am I lost?



The dispersion tube is on the return side after the filter. All it is doing is keeping the fluid from having one solid stream in the tank that would cause a constant, heavy flow in one area. the tube is set down in the tank so fluid doesn't get air borne and introduce air into the system. The end of the tube is capped so the fluid has to go out the small holes. You have to remember, with a 28 GPM pump you are moving a lot of flow all the time when operating. Granted, not at the pressure of the high side but the fluid still has to move. this is how it was explained to me anyway.


----------



## jthornton (Jan 10, 2014)

Even 13 GPM is moving right along to pass through a 3/4" pipe so there is quite a bit of velocity in the oil. Spraying that into the tank is like having your hose nozzle on jet and trying to fill a bucket with some soap in it...

Edit: Seems like a fitting nightmare for me, the cylinder has -12 ORB ports and the only 45° fittings I can find are JIC 37° so that means I can't use Chinlee hoses from the farm supply as they are all NPSM. I can get hoses made at NAPA with JIC 37°. I assume it would be best to just have JIC on both ends of the working hoses?

JT


----------



## ttyR2 (Jan 10, 2014)

I would disagree with the dispersion tube idea. Every one of those holes is a point where air can be mixed in with the hydraulic fluid and will actually make things worse. The proper way to do it is to have a large diameter (4+") vertical tube inside the hydraulic tank, and have the fluid go in to that at a tangent so it swirls around the inside wall, thereby giving up any air that is entrapped. Holes at the bottom of the tube let the fluid flow out into the rest of the tank.

This is how dry sump oil system tanks are made for race cars that need to remove air from the oil whipped around by the crankshaft that is picked up by the scavenge pump and sent to the oil tank before going back to the high pressure oil pump.

Look at this and notice how the incoming oil fitting on the right comes in off to one side and will shoot the oil on to the inside wall causing it to spin around inside as it falls down. A simple large round tube with an open top and bottom would work fine and accomplish the same thing.


----------



## Kevin in Ohio (Jan 10, 2014)

H


ttyR2 said:


> I would disagree with the dispersion tube idea. Every one of those holes is a point where air can be mixed in with the hydraulic fluid and will actually make things worse. The proper way to do it is to have a large diameter (4+") vertical tube inside the hydraulic tank, and have the fluid go in to that at a tangent so it swirls around the inside wall, thereby giving up any air that is entrapped. Holes at the bottom of the tube let the fluid flow out into the rest of the tank.
> 
> This is how dry sump oil system tanks are made for race cars that need to remove air from the oil whipped around by the crankshaft that is picked up by the scavenge pump and sent to the oil tank before going back to the high pressure oil pump.
> 
> Look at this and notice how the incoming oil fitting on the right comes in off to one side and will shoot the oil on to the inside wall causing it to spin around inside as it falls down. A simple large round tube with an open top and bottom would work fine and accomplish the same thing.


How does air get to the close to the bottom of the tank where the tube comes in with a dispersion tube system? Just trying to learn here. To me, air can only be induced if the fluid squirts/swirls to the top where the air is naturally. The guy who told me, he builds hydraulic stuff for a living, said to make sure it was big enough in length and holes to keep it from having any back pressure. Just wondering out loud here.


----------



## kyle1! (Jan 10, 2014)

I purchased a couple of 20gal hyd oil reservoirs that came from Vermeer mfg equipment leftovers and were never used. The return and the 2 suction ports are on the same side (right side when facing reservoir) If you look inside the tank the return line (port is 20SAE in size) makes smooth 90 turn to the left goes across the top of the 2 chambered tank then makes another smooth 90 turn towards the bottom of the tank where it sits 1inch off the bottom. The baffle inside the tank in no more then a piece of plate with a long 1/2in slit at the bottom and small slits on the side to let fluid through. No pipe with small holes or fancy baffles. Probably alot of ways to limit air inducement/entrapment in the oil and mine is an example of one. 

Brian


----------



## jthornton (Jan 10, 2014)

ttyR2 said:


> I would disagree with the dispersion tube idea. Every one of those holes is a point where air can be mixed in with the hydraulic fluid and will actually make things worse. The proper way to do it is to have a large diameter (4+") vertical tube inside the hydraulic tank, and have the fluid go in to that at a tangent so it swirls around the inside wall, thereby giving up any air that is entrapped. Holes at the bottom of the tube let the fluid flow out into the rest of the tank.
> 
> This is how dry sump oil system tanks are made for race cars that need to remove air from the oil whipped around by the crankshaft that is picked up by the scavenge pump and sent to the oil tank before going back to the high pressure oil pump.
> 
> Look at this and notice how the incoming oil fitting on the right comes in off to one side and will shoot the oil on to the inside wall causing it to spin around inside as it falls down. A simple large round tube with an open top and bottom would work fine and accomplish the same thing.



I think you're talking apples and oranges here, a racing engine introduces air into the oil at the engine and the device you pictured is to remove that air. In a splitter the object is to not put air into the fluid in the first place and the only place that can happen is in the return line (provided the suction is not sucking air).

my 2 cents
JT


----------



## nathon918 (Jan 10, 2014)

kyle1! said:


> I purchased a couple of 20gal hyd oil reservoirs that came from Vermeer mfg equipment leftovers and were never used. The return and the 2 suction ports are on the same side (right side when facing reservoir) If you look inside the tank the return line (port is 20SAE in size) makes smooth 90 turn to the left goes across the top of the 2 chambered tank then makes another smooth 90 turn towards the bottom of the tank where it sits 1inch off the bottom. The baffle inside the tank in no more then a piece of plate with a long 1/2in slit at the bottom and small slits on the side to let fluid through. No pipe with small holes or fancy baffles. Probably alot of ways to limit air inducement/entrapment in the oil and mine is an example of one.
> 
> Brian


just because thats how Vermeer does it doesnt mean thats the best or proper way... most tanks are like that though, they just returnt he fluid to the bottom of the tank, but there are better ways. and i definetly wouldnt call Vermeer the best in the business (especially with chippers)...


----------



## jthornton (Jan 10, 2014)

Just to get back on topic, I got the valve mount done and primed the beam. Also you might not see it at first but I removed the cranks from the stabilizer jacks and replaced them with a bolt with the threads cut off. This keeps them from hitting my shin as I move around. I'll use a ratchet or a wrench from the sale barn to raise and lower them.


----------



## djones (Jan 10, 2014)

When all is said and done, Who lifts the ram assembly into position ? It looks slightly heavy or do you plan on putting a hydraulic lift cylinder on it ?


----------



## jthornton (Jan 10, 2014)

It's pretty heavy and the splitting cylinder will be the power to raise and lower the beam. I looked into a lift cylinder but by the time I had a long enough stroke cylinder I ran out of room. I even explored some mechanics driven with a short stroke cylinder but that got too complicated. When I want to raise and lower it I'll hook onto the wedge and put a sheave on the reaction plate and connect the other end of the cable to the frame. As I raise the wedge that will pull the beam up into position. Then I just put the pin in.

JT


----------



## ttyR2 (Jan 12, 2014)

Forget about the splitter, I'll take one of those cannons in the background, please 

Back to the comments about using the tube with holes in it to remove air from the hydraulic fluid...if said tube is going to be down near the bottom of the tank then I stand corrected. I was visualizing it being up at the top of the tank where the fluid would be effectively sprayed out and then fall down to the fluid level, splashing around, and picking up air.

To be honest, if you don't have a cavitation problem, just plumbing the return to be down at the bottom of the tank should be fine as there shouldn't be any air in the fluid to contend with.


----------



## jthornton (Jan 13, 2014)

I built two of them, one for me and one for a buddy. We now have 4 cannons and 2 mortars.

I think just about any method to return the fluid back to the tank and reduce the velocity without introducing air into the fluid will work. I'm still thinking about how I will do it...

JT


----------



## Sandhill Crane (Jan 13, 2014)

I am very interested in this seemingly efficient vertical design with a table. Powersplit International make a couple models with an interesting wedge design that allows two or four-way splitting with the same wedge, and is foot operated. I also am drawn to the SuperSplit at about 40% the price, but at the end of the day it looks like 'tons' of work positioning every re-split and lots of shoulder exercise in the engagement lever over the course of a day (or week). Spinning a vertical round on a table for multiple controlled splits appears easier, and no chasing re-splits as seen in many horizontal demo videos. I do not need a log lift personally, but for those that do, log lifts on most horizontal machines are on the opposite side of the beam as the operator. In the demo videos the operator steps around the end of the splitter making it look simple to load the log lift. The rub for me, as I work alone, is I would have to walk around the far end of the splitter, or around a conveyor. With a vertical table design it is not an issue walking around a beam because the lifts mount to the side of the table. Wish I could fabricate like some of you guys. For now the old SpeeCo is slow but good.


----------



## jthornton (Jan 13, 2014)

My planned log lift is a set of log tongs and a chain and a hook. Lower the wedge all the way down, hook the chain on the wedge and put tongs on round that is too big for me to lift then raise the wedge and lift the round. The only fault with this theory is the cylinder is a 24" stroke and the table is 30" off the ground. Gotta think on that one a while...

JT


----------



## gulity1 (Jan 13, 2014)

Most of what I use for hyd work is Parker/Hannford stuff. I will try to get to the pic that I was talking about sorry for taking so long been busy . This is a 1/2 hose to 3/4 oring crimp on fititng elimantes a fitting on the cylinder On the other end of the hose install a female of your choice usaully a JIC although a swivel NPT or a Seal Loc is possiable


----------



## gulity1 (Jan 13, 2014)

Here is apic of the St 90, valve and long sweep suction hose set up On the return side. I am going to use on my tank You get the idea


----------



## gulity1 (Jan 13, 2014)

Lastly a few more hose and fititng pics Last pic kinda hard to make it out its an 3/4 oring to 3/4 npt fitting/adapator to give you a few ideas of how to fit some of the itmes togther without extra bulk or restiction. Any questions ask I will try to answer


----------



## robespierre (Jan 14, 2014)

Incredible job Mr. Thornton, great skills and that machine looks tough.


----------



## jthornton (Jan 14, 2014)

Thanks, I hope so. Got a little time to spill some paint on the floor... it's going to take 2 coats painting with a brush.







I'm not done welding on the frame is why it is not painted... best to paint from top down any way.

JT


----------



## Preston (Jan 15, 2014)

Is this splitter going to travel with the beam up? If not, what size cylinder are you going to use to lower it? That is one heavy beam.


----------



## Typhke (Jan 15, 2014)

Preston said:


> Is this splitter going to travel with the beam up? If not, what size cylinder are you going to use to lower it? That is one heavy beam.


=> My Splitter Build #94


----------



## jthornton (Jan 15, 2014)

Preston said:


> Is this splitter going to travel with the beam up? If not, what size cylinder are you going to use to lower it? That is one heavy beam.


The beam is upright in the working position only. For travel it folds down and is attached to the frame. The splitting cylinder will lift and lower the beam. Here is a photo of it in the travel position.




Yes, it is one heavy beam.

JT


----------



## fastLeo151 (Jan 15, 2014)

jthornton said:


> Thanks, I hope so. Got a little time to spill some paint on the floor... it's going to take 2 coats painting with a brush.
> 
> 
> 
> ...




Do you have to lift everything up to the beam when your splitting?


----------



## Preston (Jan 15, 2014)

Thanks. I guess I've gotten old and frail minded but I don't see how it's going to work. 

But thanks.


----------



## jthornton (Jan 15, 2014)

fastLeo151 said:


> Do you have to lift everything up to the beam when your splitting?


It's no higher than a horizontal at 30" to the reaction plate and I'm closer to the wedge so I don't have to bend over when I split or chase splits for re-splitting. The splits will stay on the table (not there yet) until I'm done sizing them. That design may not be for everyone... but it works for me. I will have a lift for rounds that are too big to pick up.

JT


----------



## fastLeo151 (Jan 15, 2014)

I'll be tuned in for sure to see how it turns out. Looks like top quality craftsmanship to me.


----------



## jthornton (Jan 15, 2014)

Preston said:


> Thanks. I guess I've gotten old and frail minded but I don't see how it's going to work.
> 
> But thanks.


I will have a hook that matches up with the back of the wedge, a pad eye on the frame and a sheave on the reaction plate to make the corner with. In the travel position I extend the wedge all the way then connect the cable. As I retract the wedge it pulls on the cable, being attached to the frame at the other end the beam pulls itself up. I've done it with a come-a-long a few times and the force to raise it is quite small.

JT


----------



## wareagle5.0 (Jan 15, 2014)

thats a pretty neat idea using the splitter cyl to lift it up.


----------



## cutforfun (Jan 15, 2014)

Great build and great working height(IMOP) , How big are you going to make the table(i would make it as large as possible) and is there a spot were you can stack or stage rounds that need to be split. I found that i like being able to split, then gather 4 or 5 rounds at a time then go back to splitting

.


----------



## jthornton (Jan 16, 2014)

cutforfun said:


> Great build and great working height(IMOP) , How big are you going to make the table(i would make it as large as possible) and is there a spot were you can stack or stage rounds that need to be split. I found that i like being able to split, then gather 4 or 5 rounds at a time then go back to splitting.



Thanks for the photos. I like how yours self centers the round.

I'm thinking of using some 2" square tubing to build the tables out of with 1"-2" gaps between like a grate. Anyone have any thoughts on this idea?

Thanks
JT


----------



## jthornton (Jan 17, 2014)

I got my order in from Discount Hydraulic Hoses and mocked up the splitter valve.






When I removed the NPT plugs from the valve they all had red sealer on the threads. Is there a special sealer for hydraulic NPT threads?

Thanks
JT


----------



## triptester (Jan 17, 2014)

For the NPT threads I use Recto-seal #5. Only a light coating after the first thread to make sure no dope gets into the system.


----------



## nathon918 (Jan 17, 2014)

loctite 567 or 569 thread sealant...
and high dow vacuum grease on the o-ring of the ORB fittings


----------



## Jakers (Jan 18, 2014)

if you have some that just wont seal up you, _*arent supposed to use teflon pipe tape*_.... but it does work well. its only a splitter and not a hydro motor or hydrostatic system so there isnt much to wreck if you get a flake of tape in the system. simple gear pump and a ram are both pretty indestructable. remember, im not telling you to use it, but it does work. in theory you should only have to use dope on the valve end fittings. the swivel type fittings in NPT still seal on a shoulder like the JIC fittings do. in all reality they are interchangeable except for the tapered threads


----------



## Oliver1655 (Jan 18, 2014)

2" tubing is probably over kill. I used 3/4" black pipe with a 1-1/2" spacing running parallel to the direction you will be mostly sliding the rounds. This will allow trash/small pieces of bark to fall through but should keep most of the splits on the table, help the splits to slide in a straight line, & decrease the potential for pinching a finger. Pipe instead of flat or tubing helps with 2 things: 1 - Provides tapered edges which will not catch on the edges of the rounds as bad. 2 - A smaller area of contact which will have less friction = easier to slide on.

While I have see several tables & log lifts with expanded metal, I would not encourage it for these items. Small projections tend to snag on it & there is a much higher risk of catching a finger in it. There has been many a wood shop where the cast iron grating on the sides of tool like table saws were removed & replaced by either a smooth surface or parallel edges which stayed in line with the direction of travel due to fingers being injured.


----------



## jthornton (Jan 18, 2014)

I didn't consider the direction the splits might be sliding... as I see it in my mind they will slide left and right ie to from the wedge as I re-split.

I try and use what I have on the shelf and I don't have much round tubing mostly square. The 1 1/2" spacing is that edge to edge or center to center on your 3/4" black pipe? Hmm, I have some 1 1/2" square stainless tubing that would work well. I'm thinking I'll run the tables out over the tires for maximum work area.



triptester said:


> For the NPT threads I use Recto-seal #5. Only a light coating after the first thread to make sure no dope gets into the system.


I see that Home Depot has Rectorseal 1.75 oz. #5 Pipe Thread Sealant

Looks like several Loctite products fit the bill 545, 569 when searching the Loctite site with this as the top hit. 
*Loctite 569 Thread Sealant, Hydraulic Sealant *

And that is why I ask here on this site when I'm unsure.

Thanks
JT


----------



## Oliver1655 (Jan 18, 2014)

I just used pieces of a 2x4 for the 1-1/2" spacing. I like your idea of going out over you tires/wheel wells. Is should help protect the fenders & make it easier to reach the splits. IIRC you were going to add a log lift. If so, I am picturing it coming off the left side of the table. I have seen splitters setup similar to yours which use a cable & pulley system to raise the lift using the splitting cylinder.







This splitter IIRC used the cylinder to raise his beam in place then after pinning in place was ready to split. As I looked at the photo again, noticed the table edge the operator stood against was directly over the lower frame/support. If it was me operating it, I would be knocking my shins on the lower frame. I like the table sticking out at least 4" past the frame to same my legs.


----------



## jthornton (Jan 18, 2014)

The more I look at your splitter the more the table idea grows in my mind. I was going to use log tongs but the design of your log lift looks better and better to me. Thanks for the photos again.

JT


----------



## nathon918 (Jan 18, 2014)

jthornton said:


> I didn't consider the direction the splits might be sliding... as I see it in my mind they will slide left and right ie to from the wedge as I re-split.
> 
> I try and use what I have on the shelf and I don't have much round tubing mostly square. The 1 1/2" spacing is that edge to edge or center to center on your 3/4" black pipe? Hmm, I have some 1 1/2" square stainless tubing that would work well. I'm thinking I'll run the tables out over the tires for maximum work area.
> 
> ...


 567 has a higher temp rating, they both have the same pressure rating though (10,000 psi) i use 567 for most everything including hydraulic fittings...


----------



## nathon918 (Jan 18, 2014)

nathon918 said:


> 567 has a higher temp rating, they both have the same pressure rating though (10,000 psi) i use 567 for most everything including hydraulic fittings...


 i just looked through my loctite book, and looked up the 545 since ive never used it, looks to be a thread locker and sealant, and recommends a primer, then theres a cureing period...


----------



## jthornton (Jan 18, 2014)

I got some Rectorseal 1.75 oz. #5 from Home Depot.


----------



## Oliver1655 (Jan 18, 2014)

JT the photos are ones I found while researching log splitters. If I were to make one similar to yours, the cable lift would appeal to me as well. 

My splitter is the one in my avatar & it has a hydraulic log lift.


----------



## clint53 (Jan 19, 2014)

Oliver1655 said:


> JT the photos are ones I found while researching log splitters. If I were to make one similar to yours, the cable lift would appeal to me as well.
> 
> My splitter is the one in my avatar & it has a hydraulic log lift.



You don't have a close up of how the cylinder is pinned in the operating position do you? It looks to me that the cylinder shaft pushes the cylinder body up and then it's pinned.


----------



## triptester (Jan 19, 2014)

clint53 said:


> You don't have a close up of how the cylinder is pinned in the operating position do you? It looks to me that the cylinder shaft pushes the cylinder body up and then it's pinned.


 Yes the cylinder is extended and then two 1/2" pins are inserted to lock the cylinder in the work position.
http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c20/triptester/splitterdetails014Small.jpg


----------



## clint53 (Jan 19, 2014)

triptester said:


> Yes the cylinder is extended and then two 1/2" pins are inserted to lock the cylinder in the work position.
> http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c20/triptester/splitterdetails014Small.jpg


Now I understand. Many thanks.


----------



## jthornton (Feb 2, 2014)

Got a bit more done on the splitter project... been suffering from working interrupts me from playing.







Almost got all the leaks stopped in the hydraulic tank... bet I do a better job of prepping the metal before I weld the lid on that sucker.

JT


----------



## bigdaddy3 (Feb 3, 2014)

Hell of a nice job with many many man hours, .


----------



## jthornton (Feb 3, 2014)

Thanks, it is a work of love cause I love to do things like this.

JT


----------



## chadihman (Feb 3, 2014)

Nice work! I have plans in the near future to build a super splitter. Splitting is a pain for me. I love cutting wood and burning wood but splitters are slow and way to time consuming. I'm going to need a big engine with a pump that will match the engines HP for high flow. Fast cycle time takes high flow. High flow and high pressure take HP. A 3 cylinder diesel would be great if I could find one cheap.


----------



## ijon (Feb 3, 2014)

Great looking splitter, built like a tank.


----------



## jthornton (Feb 5, 2014)

I made some progress on the hydraulic tank... this is the dispersion tube. I made it from 1 1/2" angle so I could deburr the holes on both sides easy.






Here is the baffles...





Now to clean out the tank and put the lid on...

JT


----------



## jthornton (Feb 5, 2014)

Got the top on, now to see how many leaks I have...






JT


----------



## dave_dj1 (Feb 5, 2014)

Nice! With any luck and your skill you won't have any leaks


----------



## jthornton (Feb 5, 2014)

I never believed in luck and I don't have much skill so I wing it. The one thing I learned about building tanks is I hate building tanks! Well I did learn two things... prep the metal to remove mill scale before welding.

Down to my last pin hole...

JT


----------



## Preston (Feb 5, 2014)

Just think about what a tig machine would do.


----------



## jthornton (Feb 5, 2014)

LOL, I welded with a TIG except for one part I welded with my MIG. All the ugly is from patching pin holes from not prepping the metal.

JT


----------



## jthornton (Feb 5, 2014)

Just need some paint and make a gasket for the clean out opening... do you think cork gasket is OK?






JT


----------



## Preston (Feb 5, 2014)

You've got a lot of tedious time is that splitter. But it does look good.


----------



## johnha (Feb 5, 2014)

whoa, cool. A K-Car, you ever watch "The New Red Green Show"?, he was always using K-cars, mostly out of a feeling of revenge he said.

Nice job, I'm jealous of your shop but my real question is: what do you use the cannon for?


----------



## dave_dj1 (Feb 5, 2014)

I don't know whether a cork gasket will work or not, my only concern is if you leave it out in the rain will it wick the water in? I used permatex on my filler cap base.


----------



## jthornton (Feb 6, 2014)

johnha said:


> whoa, cool. A K-Car, you ever watch "The New Red Green Show"?, he was always using K-cars, mostly out of a feeling of revenge he said.
> 
> Nice job, I'm jealous of your shop but my real question is: what do you use the cannon for?



For fun! The rest of the children I play with have 3 more cannons and 2 mortars so we can make lots of noise.
http://gnipsel.com/cannon/cannon.xhtml
I built two identical cannons one for me and one for a friend.

JT


----------



## jthornton (Feb 6, 2014)

dave_dj1 said:


> I don't know whether a cork gasket will work or not, my only concern is if you leave it out in the rain will it wick the water in? I used permatex on my filler cap base.


Did you use the Permatex Gasket maker? That sure looks easier than cutting a gasket by hand.

http://www.permatex.com/products-2/...ermatex--the-right-stuff--gasket-maker-detail

JT


----------



## Preston (Feb 6, 2014)

JT.......how many times have you explained the cannon in this thread? Looks like somebody is not reading the thread. They just jump in on the end.


----------



## jthornton (Feb 6, 2014)

Preston said:


> JT.......how many times have you explained the cannon in this thread? Looks like somebody is not reading the thread. They just jump in on the end.


I don't know, I lost track LOL.

JT


----------



## dave_dj1 (Feb 6, 2014)

Yes, just gasket maker.
Splitter looks great btw.


----------



## jthornton (Feb 6, 2014)

Thanks, I can't wait to try it out...

JT


----------



## blkcloud (Feb 6, 2014)

whats the cannon for??


----------



## jthornton (Feb 6, 2014)

Stay still and I'll show you!

JT


----------



## jthornton (Feb 8, 2014)

I got some more work done on the splitter, I finished up the removable tongue... I made it removable to save space when not in use.






Here are a couple of photos with the beam down, checking for clearances etc. This is the way it will travel.


----------



## Preston (Feb 8, 2014)

What kinda tongue weight do you expect on the pin of the connection?


----------



## jthornton (Feb 8, 2014)

Do you mean the pin that holds the tongue in? It will only see pulling force.

Or are you talking about the square part that fits into the square tube?

JT


----------



## Preston (Feb 8, 2014)

The pin that holds the tongue. There has to be down pressure on it. Doesn't it. I did that on a trailer I used to use for hauling diesel to a job site. But I did mine to keep it from getting stolen.


----------



## jthornton (Feb 8, 2014)

All the pressure is carried by the 3/8" wall square box that fits inside the tube. I still need to drill the matching hole in the frame and ream the holes in situ.






JT


----------



## triptester (Feb 8, 2014)

I see the jack on the tounge are you leaving the jack there or are you putting it on the main frame.


----------



## jthornton (Feb 9, 2014)

triptester said:


> I see the jack on the tongue are you leaving the jack there or are you putting it on the main frame.


The jack will be on the removable tongue about 1/3 the way from the frame. When the tongue is off the front is supported by the castors. I'll only take the tongue off for storage after raising up the beam.

JT


----------



## jthornton (Feb 10, 2014)

Got one side of the table tacked together and mocked up in situ. Still need to figure out how to attache them and have them removable...






I think with both of them I'll have a decent work area...

JT


----------



## dave_dj1 (Feb 10, 2014)

Maybe some sort of receiver tubes? 
Where did you get those two rear jacks? I need a couple for my processor add on I'm building.
dave


----------



## jthornton (Feb 10, 2014)

They are std trailer jacks, I removed the crank and replaced it with a bolt with the thread cut off. All that holds the crank in is a pin in the top gear. The pins that I removed were junk so I replaced them with spring pins from the home depot.

That's what I had in mind having some pins on the frame and tubing on the work table so they don't fill up with junk if the table is off.

JT


----------



## jthornton (Feb 15, 2014)

Made some progress on my splitter...












JT


----------



## jthornton (Feb 15, 2014)

And some more...

Hydraulic tank and engine installed. The tongue is in the storage position.





Return line and filter installed





JT


----------



## dave_dj1 (Feb 15, 2014)

Nice!


----------



## clint53 (Feb 15, 2014)

It's coming together. Thanks for posting an update. This is my favorite post to follow.


----------



## TFPace (Feb 16, 2014)

Looks great! How will the beam move from horizontal to vertical?


----------



## jthornton (Feb 16, 2014)

TFPace said:


> Looks great! How will the beam move from horizontal to vertical?


I'll have a hook that goes to the wedge and a shackle to a pad eye on the frame and a turnaround sheave on the reaction plate so the cable goes around the corner nicely. When I raise the wedge it will pull the beam upright.

JT


----------



## cat-face timber (Feb 17, 2014)

You Sir, are one great metal worker!
Awesome, thanks for sharing!


----------



## jthornton (Feb 17, 2014)

Thanks, I got a few minutes to work on the work tables... they will be held in with pins and the log lift will be on the left one. It is really starting to take shape. I'm getting excited...






JT


----------



## nathon918 (Feb 17, 2014)

any reason for not doing continious welds on that tube??
ive seen you do alot if it on this, and about the only thing i find it might have been needed on is the hydraulic tank.
most joints under 6"-8" dont require multiple short welds, (uless its under somthing like 12Ga material), any small gain in not warping is usually eliminated by weld defects (cold starts, slag inclusions, etc) . if properly clamped, and braced, along with proper weld size, and sequence, warping can be kept to a minimum without having to make mutiple short welds...
sorry as welder it make me notice stuff like this...


----------



## Eric K (Feb 17, 2014)

Looking good JT. Nice work.


----------



## jthornton (Feb 18, 2014)

nathon918 said:


> any reason for not doing continuous welds on that tube??
> ive seen you do a lot if it on this, and about the only thing i find it might have been needed on is the hydraulic tank.
> most joints under 6"-8" don't require multiple short welds, (unless its under something like 12Ga material), any small gain in not warping is usually eliminated by weld defects (cold starts, slag inclusions, etc) . if properly clamped, and braced, along with proper weld size, and sequence, warping can be kept to a minimum without having to make multiple short welds...
> sorry as welder it make me notice stuff like this...



Stainless steel warps and pulls like crazy when you weld it so I was doing short welds out of habit to help stop the warping. On steel is not that much of a problem. I can comfortably weld about 6" if I can see the joint good. Any longer than that and I have reposition my hand as I rest my welding hand on something to help me keep the torch tip steady. If you have any tips I'm all eyes... oh and the hydraulic tank is 12 gauge. Boy did I foul up the tank, I forgot to remove the mill scale from the weld area when I assembled the bottom and I had leak after leak after leak... I finally got them all patched up.

I wish I knew the proper way to weld... all I know is from the school of hard knocks.

JT


----------



## nathon918 (Feb 18, 2014)

jthornton said:


> Stainless steel warps and pulls like crazy when you weld it so I was doing short welds out of habit to help stop the warping. On steel is not that much of a problem. I can comfortably weld about 6" if I can see the joint good. Any longer than that and I have reposition my hand as I rest my welding hand on something to help me keep the torch tip steady. If you have any tips I'm all eyes... oh and the hydraulic tank is 12 gauge. Boy did I foul up the tank, I forgot to remove the mill scale from the weld area when I assembled the bottom and I had leak after leak after leak... I finally got them all patched up.
> 
> I wish I knew the proper way to weld... all I know is from the school of hard knocks.
> 
> JT


instead of planting your hand, try planting your elbows, either into your stomach or on the table/work piece, i can get around 30+ inches of weld when i plant my elbows into my stomach, it also helps to lean on somthing or place your knee/hip againt something while welding, just standing without touching anything, you dont really have any refrence as to where you are,and your body seems to move on its own.
also before i weld i usually do a fast "dry run" to make sure im in a position that im able to weld that joint, if not i re-position my self...

as for your stainless tables, and your tank, thats where a proper weld size comes in, as those are some heaftey welds for 11 gauge? tube, and on your tank the welds i saw on that are about the size i would run on 3/8"-1/2" material... 12 gauge material usually requires about an a 1/8" weld (with proper penetration) of course you can go bigger but then warping becomes a concern.

really though i think your machine/fab work is awesome, but your welding needs a bit of work...

im a self taught welder also, the only thing someone showed me was oxy fuel welding, as i didnt have a torch...
my dad was a welder for 30 years never taught me to weld though, just said go play with the welder till i got it right, that was with a mig. then i worked for a company and we only had a tig welder, so i picked that up too, then another job with only a stick welder, so i had to learn that also. neither one of those jobs had another welder to guide me, it was all trial and error and a little bit of reasearch...
machining was the same way, the only cnc's i can run are proto traks, as ive never had the chance to run any others, but i can run any manual machine out there, i guess i was just lucky to have jobs that let me screw around to try and learn something on my own...


----------



## jthornton (Feb 18, 2014)

Thanks so much for the tips on welding. I'll practice that today. I weave back and forth a little as I weld to get good penetration on both parts. The stainless tubing is 11ga and the welds ended up being about 1/4" wide.

JT


----------



## jthornton (Feb 18, 2014)

One more question on welding while the subject is fresh... when I try and make a small bead I don't get good penetration so I weave back and forth then I get a large bead. What's the secret for getting a good small bead?

JT


----------



## nathon918 (Feb 18, 2014)

proper heat/wire speed/ travel speed...
i usually run a bit hot and travel "fast" for thin material
if you dont know the settings, then use scrap of the same material thickness and practice, different heat/ speeds

just curious, what are you running for wire?


----------



## Eric K (Feb 18, 2014)

A rule of thumb that will get you in the ball park for mig and tig is 1 amp per thousandth of an inch. IE 11 ga. stainless if .119/.120 so set your amps in the 120 range then adjust up or down to the travel speed you comfortably weld at. For me I tig weld lots of 11 ga. stainless and I run it at 125 amps petal mashed using 3/32 316ss rod. That may be to hot if your travel speed is to slow. They work hand in hand. Just like speed and feed in machining. Now the other thing you can do while tig welding is set amps a little higher say 150/160 amps and then feather the pedal to control width of the weld puddle. Less pedal less heat smaller puddle more pedal more heat bigger puddle. Also agree with Nathon about doing a dry run for body position. Makes a huge difference in length of weld. What type of tig/mig welder you running?


----------



## jthornton (Feb 19, 2014)

nathon918 said:


> proper heat/wire speed/ travel speed...
> i usually run a bit hot and travel "fast" for thin material
> if you dont know the settings, then use scrap of the same material thickness and practice, different heat/ speeds
> 
> just curious, what are you running for wire?



I use 0.030" solid wire in both MIG welders. The only exception is the spool of stainless wire is 0.035" for what reason I don't know.

JT


----------



## jthornton (Feb 19, 2014)

Eric K said:


> A rule of thumb that will get you in the ball park for mig and tig is 1 amp per thousandth of an inch. IE 11 ga. stainless if .119/.120 so set your amps in the 120 range then adjust up or down to the travel speed you comfortably weld at. For me I tig weld lots of 11 ga. stainless and I run it at 125 amps petal mashed using 3/32 316ss rod. That may be to hot if your travel speed is to slow. They work hand in hand. Just like speed and feed in machining. Now the other thing you can do while tig welding is set amps a little higher say 150/160 amps and then feather the pedal to control width of the weld puddle. Less pedal less heat smaller puddle more pedal more heat bigger puddle. Also agree with Nathon about doing a dry run for body position. Makes a huge difference in length of weld. What type of tig/mig welder you running?



I have a Miller Suitcase MIG welder (Multimatic 200 now a days) that can weld steel with straight CO2 and stainless with mixed gas. My main MIG/Spool Gun welder is a Miller Millermatic 212 and my TIG welder is a Miller Syncrowave 180 SD... LOL, I'm a poster child for Miller. The crappy weld was with too big wire and on the Suitcase MIG welder.

JT


----------



## nathon918 (Feb 19, 2014)

jthornton said:


> I have a Miller Suitcase MIG welder (Multimatic 200 now a days) that can weld steel with straight CO2 and stainless with mixed gas. My main MIG/Spool Gun welder is a Miller Millermatic 212 and my TIG welder is a Miller Syncrowave 180 SD... LOL, I'm a poster child for Miller. The crappy weld was with too big wire and on the Suitcase MIG welder.
> 
> JT


 .035 is fine for 11 gauge, i just asked incase you were running .045 because thats a bit big...
also any reason your running straight co2? c-25 (75% argon 25% co2) or airgas Steelmix (84% argon 16% co2) are a much better gas to run on either of those migs for steel, theyre a little more $$ but they run alot cleaner than straight co2...
what are you running for a spool gun? ive thought about picking one up for my old Millermatic 200 for aluminum, but i havent really needed it since i have the tig. id love a millermatic 350P with a push/pull gun but i dont think thats happening for a while 
also i like them blue welders alot better than those red, yellow,gray,etc ones too


----------



## jthornton (Mar 14, 2014)

Just an update on this, I put 5 gallons of AW 46 in the hydraulic tank, oil and gas in the Briggs and 2 pulls later it is idling nicely. I moved the ram up and down a few times but I had the A and B ports on the valve backwards. Got that fixed now just waiting for the Rectorseal to cure before a splitting test.

JT


----------



## wndwlkr (Mar 14, 2014)

No need to wait on the rectorseal, put it to work !


----------



## jthornton (Mar 14, 2014)

Wish I could, I'm heading for Puerto Rico in the morning to scatter the ashes of my mother in law into the sea at her birth place. I know the Rectorseal will be hardend by then. I'm just so glad to make it move under power you just can't imagine.

JT


----------



## Oliver1655 (Mar 14, 2014)

Prayers for a safe trip.


----------



## jthornton (Mar 15, 2014)

Thanks.

This is a very short video of the first moves.


JT


----------



## Eric K (Mar 15, 2014)

Good job Jt. That has to make you feel good after the hours invested to build. Congrats!!!!


----------



## Time's Standing Stihl (Mar 15, 2014)

Nice work JT! You'll be splitting wood in no time!


----------



## clint53 (Mar 16, 2014)

Fast in both directions. Very good job.


----------



## jthornton (Mar 16, 2014)

Thanks guys, I can't wait to get back and try it out. I've been having some thoughts on the work tables and making them a 1/2" below the reaction plate so they won't seem any pressure as the round splits... any thoughts?

JT


----------



## triptester (Mar 16, 2014)

Whether the work tables see pressure will be determined by the diameter of the wood. As the blocks are split the force is transmited to the outside edges of the wood opposite the wedge.The wider the wedge and the wood the greater the effect.


----------



## jthornton (Mar 17, 2014)

That's what I was thinking, I'll have to split a few big ones and see what I need to do.

JT


----------



## jthornton (Mar 20, 2014)

First split... bogged down a tad on the knot part but other than that I'm happy with it.






JT


----------



## Preston (Mar 20, 2014)

I would say what works for me but Nathan and me have already had "discussions" on the subject. I'll just stay out of this welding discussion.


----------



## ttyR2 (Mar 20, 2014)

Broken picture link.


----------



## jthornton (Mar 21, 2014)

Yea, I could not get it to fully upload last night for some reason. Here is another one that I could not split with any hand tools at all. She plowed right through.





JT


----------



## Preston (Mar 21, 2014)

Well looke there. The green monster is a working.


----------



## jthornton (Mar 22, 2014)

Preston said:


> Well looke there. The green monster is a working.


Finally! Well not done yet but close. I still need to attach the work tables and a few small things like build the lifting mechanics.

JT


----------



## Preston (Mar 22, 2014)

That make the word "hoss" look like a pony. Good job.


----------



## jthornton (Mar 23, 2014)

Man, I love this splitter! I thought I took a movie but must not have.

This is 30 minutes of splitting. Some of it was pretty gnarly too.






JT


----------



## woodcuter ms361 (Mar 23, 2014)

jthornton said:


> Thanks, I see you used an axle like mine possibly from a Dodge K car? While the tank does not have a lid it is easy to put a baffle in... I like your log lift. I plan on having a lift to pick up big rounds using log tongs hanging on a chain.
> 
> JT


nice job! yes I used a k car axle,did not cut it,with the length I don't have to worry about it turning over when I lift a heavy log.here's a good web site on welding I found some time ago,hope you enjoy it!http://www.weldingtipsandtricks.com/tig-welding-tips.html


----------



## jthornton (Mar 31, 2014)

I had a good day yesterday and we dropped a standing almost dead red oak that was about 60' tall. I towed the splitter to the tree and parked it right next to the rounds. Sure made life easier on me. In 3 hrs me and Ricky had bucked, split and brought home all the wood. The only thing left was the sawdust. I love my spitter!

Here is how I mounted the work tables with hitch pins so it is easy to remove.







Hooked up and heading to Ricky's house.





All set up leveled and ready to split. We used my backhoe to make sure the tree fell the way we wanted. It looked a bit heavy on the shop side of the tree and we didn't want it to fall on the shop.





All done and ready to head home.


----------



## dave_dj1 (Apr 1, 2014)

Pretty awesome!


----------



## iowa (Jul 29, 2014)

Love your log splitter build. Great machine work! 

Only thing it's missing is a log lift! Must have for me!


----------



## jthornton (Jul 29, 2014)

Log lift is in the works and I hope to have the beam lift and log lift in by fall.

Thanks
JT


----------



## iowa (Sep 18, 2014)

I started on my splitter build the other day. I had an old 4x8 trailer. I took the floor off of it and now have a bare frame to work with. Yanked the 12" puny tires and axle off and put in a rear axle from a chrysler mini van. Now has 14" tires. 

I am planning on a log lift. I have 2 chief cylinders that are around 2.5" bore and 16"-18" stroke. I will use one of them for the lift. Maybe use the other for lifting my beam into place. How are you raising and lowering your beam? I didn't see any cylinders??? 

Found a new Prince 3 spool valve on Craigslist with one spool having a dentent and the other 2 are spring to center. Gave $150 for it!!! I was happy. Now I need to find a ram. I'm going for speed with this splitter. My other one had a 4 1/2" bore. I think I will go with a 4" bore and 2" shaft. I have a 16gpm speeco pump and a 14.5hp generac engine that is electric start.


----------



## jthornton (Sep 19, 2014)

I'm using the ram to raise and lower the beam. I have a pulley that clips on the reaction plate and a chain that runs from the wedge to the frame. I've yet to finish it and try it.


----------



## iowa (Sep 19, 2014)

OH. I was wondering as I didn't see anything in the pics yet. 

So can you raise that heavy boy up by yourself? Or use the loader bucket? Looks heavy as all get out..


----------



## jthornton (Sep 19, 2014)

Actually two guys can raise it pretty easy, I can't raise it by myself or I won't try just in case it gets away from me.

JT


----------



## iowa (Sep 19, 2014)

Local steel guy found me an H beam drop. 10" x 33lb. I was wanting 8" x 30lb. Guess this will have to do. Should be plenty strong for a 20-22ton press.


----------



## blgskoon (Sep 28, 2014)

Thats a good looking splitter! As someone who has build a lot of stuff I can appreciate the amount of time you probably have in this unit. I currently have about 2 months of work into a nice splitter build myself.


----------



## jthornton (Nov 1, 2014)

I just tested the beam lift and it is going to work well. I have a few more details to do on it then some photos.

JT


----------



## iowa (Nov 1, 2014)

Good deal. Can't wait to see how it all works!


----------



## jthornton (Nov 1, 2014)

Yea, I was stoked when the beam slowly and effortlessly lifted up about a foot. Then I had to stop because of things in the way and lowered it down nice and easy. I'll get a photo here in a bit.

JT


----------



## palmrose2 (Nov 1, 2014)

It just blows your mind how much time it takes to build something out of a pile of nothing. You think to yourself, well I'll just abc. Before you know it, it's efg on down the line to xyz, and you thought you could do it pdq.


----------



## jthornton (Nov 2, 2014)

Here's a photo of the mechanics to lift the beam.





JT


----------



## iowa (Nov 2, 2014)

Very good idea! Next. Log lift!


----------



## jthornton (Feb 28, 2016)

Well after a few back fires while starting and my hand and elbow hurting like the dickens I dropped the coin for a starter motor. Building the battery box that will have the on/off switch, start button, solenoid, and battery.









JT


----------



## jthornton (Feb 29, 2016)

Made a little progress on the battery box tonight.


----------



## x308 (Feb 29, 2016)

jthornton said:


> Made a little progress on the battery box tonight.


Holes in the bottom to let gases and fluids escape?
Great work on the build, you are very handy with metal.


----------



## jthornton (Mar 1, 2016)

x308 said:


> Holes in the bottom to let gases and fluids escape?
> Great work on the build, you are very handy with metal.



Thanks, and yes the battery vent hose will have a hole in the bottom and a condensation drain as well just in case.

JT


----------



## jthornton (Mar 2, 2016)

Got the battery box done and tested, now for some paint and another project done!


----------



## iowa (Mar 2, 2016)

Looks nice!! How about a log lift?


----------



## jthornton (Mar 3, 2016)

Thanks, I have a few things ahead of the log lift but I've got some good ideas to start with.

JT


----------



## Jakers (Nov 29, 2016)

just bumping this to the top again so new guys can admire your amazing build


----------

