# What do you drive wedges with



## rob066 (May 3, 2021)

I tend to like a Eswing 3lb hammer. Its short and delivers a hard hit without the awkardness of an axe.


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## old CB (May 3, 2021)

A single bit axe. From long experience, it doesn't feel awkward to me.


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## tfp (May 3, 2021)

I use a small axe when using a wedge to stop the bar pinching while bucking and a mallet when falling and I really need to bash it in. I’m worried about the hole in the axe head deforming if I go too hard so I don’t use it on the latter.


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## SS396driver (May 3, 2021)

This was my dad's when he was a volunter fireman


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## Woodslasher (May 3, 2021)

I use a 3.5?lb Collins rafting axe on a ~20 inch hand made straight haft.


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## northmanlogging (May 4, 2021)

Short straight handled axes, cause sometimes that chopping head comes in awfully handy

Mostly a battered and patched together Craftsmen 3.5#, when I can't find it or its broken again a 4# Council rafting pattern. 

Sometimes just another wedge is all you really need for bucking, or the ever present just in case the wind shifts wedge, couple love taps to take up the slack.

If things are really stubborn, a 28000# shovel


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## rwoods (May 4, 2021)

Plumb 5# rafting axe.



Couldn't do this without it - two stacks of two and two stacks of three. This tree about wore me out.



Ron


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## Skeans (May 4, 2021)

5 pound council normally and a couple of custom weight ones as well. [mention]northmanlogging [/mention] I agree on the shovel but sometimes a set of jacks is handier and faster.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## madhatte (May 4, 2021)

My favorites are 3-4 lb Dayton pattern axes on 20-28" handles. I have a few and like them all. Brand isn't important. A square poll is.


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## Gologit (May 5, 2021)

I used everything from the palm of my hand if I was just slipping one in to stop a set back to a 5lb council that our local blacksmith custom polled for me.
I always tried to avoid having to really wail on the wedges. When you hear somebody knocking wedges for more than ten minutes it's usually a sign that they screwed up. They read the tree wrong or they're trying to pull the tree around with wedges instead of tapering the hinge, throwing a chunk in the face, or putting in a sizwheel.
You'll notice the older fallers spend more time on useful cuts than they do beating on stalled out wedges.


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## rwoods (May 6, 2021)

Gologit said:


> I used everything from the palm of my hand if I was just slipping one in to stop a set back to a 5lb council that our local blacksmith custom polled for me.
> I always tried to avoid having to really wail on the wedges. When you hear somebody knocking wedges for more than ten minutes *it's usually a sign that they screwed up*. They read the tree wrong or they're trying to pull the tree around with wedges instead of tapering the hinge, throwing a chunk in the face, or putting in a sizwheel.
> You'll notice the older fallers spend more time on useful cuts than they do beating on stalled out wedges.



That is my usual *MO*. Ron


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## EchoRomeoCharlie (May 6, 2021)

3.5lb Beaver Tooth on a 28" straight handle....works well.

Righted some pretty big back leaners with it...everyone(non tree people) always wants to bring me a sledge hammer when they see me banging wedges...not real sure why. Swinging a 10lb sledge is going to wear a fella out in short order swinging sideways. I can swing an axe quite a while without needing a break.


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## 2dogs (May 16, 2021)

A 5lb SB on a 28" handle or a 4lb SB on a 20" handle. I usually end of driving a few wedges for the inmate fallers. They use the 5lb SB Husqvarna lifetime guarantee plastic handle axes. Those axes are very tough, not unbreakable but nearly so. They sell for around $100.00.


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## rwoods (May 22, 2021)

Today: Old axe, old saw and little tractor.


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## TheDarkLordChinChin (May 22, 2021)

At the moment I am using a 2.6lb hultafors with a 26" handle. 
I couldn't find anything 3-4lb that would fit in my axe pouch. Car boot sales are a great place to find odd tools but there haven't been many of those over the last year.


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## TheDarkLordChinChin (May 22, 2021)

rwoods said:


> Plumb 5# rafting axe.
> View attachment 905168
> 
> 
> ...


Could you have cut your face deeper?


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## rwoods (May 22, 2021)

Typically, the deeper the face the harder the wedge driving due to less leverage. Too deep and the load will increase, inviting disaster.

Today tree had almost all of its limb load on the back side. The tree posted earlier was a back leaner. Due to hazards both had to be felled against the load.

My back cut today also wasn’t level. My error. I am told a sloppy downward sloping back cut also makes wedging harder.

Ron


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## Bango Skank (May 22, 2021)

Fiskars X27 lately. Nice for splitting and bangs wedges just fine. 
I thought Fiskars stuff was homeowner grade tools, but I’m impressed with this axe. Splits better than my 6 pound maul.


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## northmanlogging (May 22, 2021)

rwoods said:


> Typically, the deeper the face the harder the wedge driving due to less leverage. Too deep and the load will increase, inviting disaster.
> 
> Today tree had almost all of its limb load on the back side. The tree posted earlier was a back leaner. Due to hazards both had to be felled against the load.
> 
> ...


I don't know if it makes wedging harder, cause you at least have gravity helping you swing, it does make wedging a lot more dangerous, cause it creates a fulcrum that can shear off the hold wood.


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## rwoods (May 22, 2021)

northmanlogging said:


> I don't know if it makes wedging harder, cause you at least have gravity helping you swing, it does make wedging a lot more dangerous, cause it creates a fulcrum that can shear off the hold wood.


Not sure which scenario you are addressing - the deep face or the sloping back cut. As you know, gravity doesn’t help you on a face cut unless you are cutting compression wood or you have converted the back cut compression wood to tension wood, or severed it and supported it; both of which require some mechanical means - wedge, tension line, jack, heavy equipment, etc. If your compression wood is in the back you have to move the center of gravity forward - a deep face gives you less leverage with a wedge thus making it harder to drive - like starting in second gear. Also like 2nd gear, the stem will be lifted higher with each movement of the wedge. So theoretically, a deeper face requires less wedge height to get the job done but requires more force to get it there - and as you noted it makes things more dangerous - bust the hinge when the center of gravity is still in the wrong place and it over. Nothing here you don’t already know, but maybe some don’t.

Ron


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## northmanlogging (May 23, 2021)

rwoods said:


> Not sure which scenario you are addressing - the deep face or the sloping back cut. As you know, gravity doesn’t help you on a face cut unless you are cutting compression wood or you have converted the back cut compression wood to tension wood, or severed it and supported it; both of which require some mechanical means - wedge, tension line, jack, heavy equipment, etc. If your compression wood is in the back you have to move the center of gravity forward - a deep face gives you less leverage with a wedge thus making it harder to drive - like starting in second gear. Also like 2nd gear, the stem will be lifted higher with each movement of the wedge. So theoretically, a deeper face requires less wedge height to get the job done but requires more force to get it there - and as you noted it makes things more dangerous - bust the hinge when the center of gravity is still in the wrong place and it over. Nothing here you don’t already know, but maybe some don’t.
> 
> Ron


I was referring to the sloping back cut... lots of idiots like to put a steep angle on the back cut thinking that it will prevent the tree from going over backwards... it won't, but the angle does make driving wedges easier, up until the hinge wood shears off and kills yer pick-em-up truck...

as for depth of face cut, meh, its a matter of how hard its leaning, and how much room you have for wedges, sometimes a little tree you want a small face just so you can bury the wedges all the way. 

does a shallow face help banging over a back leaner? Seems that a deeper face works better? but as for the physics of it I'm not sure. 
In truth I think it has more to do with how hard its leaning, if I think I can just wedge it over, its not leaning real hard (lazy remember) so I make a deep face cut, giving better hinge/counter weight activity. if its real hard leaner and needs a jack, I'll make the face shallower mostly to provide plenty of room for jacks and wedges etc.


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## rwoods (May 23, 2021)

northmanlogging said:


> I was referring to the sloping back cut... lots of idiots like to put a steep angle on the back cut thinking that it will prevent the tree from going over backwards... it won't, but the angle does make driving wedges easier, up until the hinge wood shears off and kills yer pick-em-up truck...
> 
> as for depth of face cut, meh, its a matter of how hard its leaning, and how much room you have for wedges, sometimes a little tree you want a small face just so you can bury the wedges all the way.
> 
> ...



NM, I doubt we actually disagree in practice. I would toss this comment in the arena: Laying aside the dangers of a sloping back cut, I don't see why wedging would be harder though many say it is, stating that you are pushing the stem forward as opposed to lifting the stem. I don't agree with that premise. Wedging (besides the support function) is simply pivoting the stem on the hinge and, in the aspect of force required, it doesn't matter much how the wedging surface is oriented.

Besides the mechanical advantage of wedging with a shallow face cut, I find it safer for me as I am a poor judge of the actual limb/lean load and the internal integrity of the stem. When the lean or limb load clearly appears to be in my favor, I typically employ the steep and deep face. 

Ron


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## TheDarkLordChinChin (May 23, 2021)

I keep seeing videos of guys in Europe using sledge hammers or mauls to drive wedges. I can't see how a tool like that would be practical for anything other than wedging. Can't see it being any use for cutting off bark, cutting the face out etc etc.


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## northmanlogging (May 23, 2021)

northmanlogging said:


> I was referring to the sloping back cut... lots of idiots like to put a steep angle on the back cut thinking that it will prevent the tree from going over backwards... it won't, but the angle does make driving wedges easier, up until the hinge wood shears off and kills yer pick-em-up truck...
> 
> as for depth of face cut, meh, its a matter of how hard its leaning, and how much room you have for wedges, sometimes a little tree you want a small face just so you can bury the wedges all the way.
> 
> ...


I was thinking purely for the reasons of the motion of swinging downward is more natural vs. Swinging sidewards.


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## catbuster (May 26, 2021)

I’ve had a few. My go to now is a 5 lb Sager head I’ve put on a 30” straight handle. I keep a 5 lb Council with a 32” straight handle in the truck with my 441 and a couple K&H wedges, seems to work well for me if I need to tip something and I’m not set up to go tip some trees. I really don’t think I want a longer handle though, I’ve used one of the real heavy (8 lb single bit) forcible entry axes with a 36” handle off our ‘01 Seagrave and it sucked, too long and the weight just mashed wedges with me gorilla swinging. I’ve used a lighter axe and it didn’t do it for me either, had to swing really hard to drive wedges. Mauls smash wedges, especially if the pole is smaller than the long edge of the wedge.

The TL/DR of this post is... I’ll use anything ~5 lb with a short, straight handle and a square pole. That’s my sweet spot.


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## catbuster (May 27, 2021)

In picture form, I like this for driving falling wedges.

I do not, and cannot stand, these.


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## young bucker (Aug 21, 2021)

3.5lb double pinned head, with a 18” handle. I use those aluminum scabbards…seen guys in a lot of trouble with small axes or not having it with them. It’s all fun and games until the afternoon breeze makes your tree sit back. On a side note it boils down to what your doing and personal preference.


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## John Lyngdal (Aug 22, 2021)

I use a 2 lb orange dead blow hammer. Not the best, but I can at least find it when I drop it in the woods.


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## NorthernMaverick (Aug 22, 2021)

Bought this from these folks, and been using it for the last week.

Was using a Fiskars x25 before this, that I ground on the poll to make it more flat. Seems like it had a 3.5 lb head, where the husky has a 4. On the husky the poll is nice and flat, but small enough to drive wedges sideways, further than flush into the back cut. I've used 8 lb sledge hammers, boys /camp axes, Michigan axes, wood handle etc. Seems a synthetic 28" +/- handle, and around 4lbs for a head, makes the best combo for me. I made a sheath similar to the aluminum ones by folding a sheet of thick plastic together. Someday I'll get a grizzly peak ordered.


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## NorthernMaverick (Aug 22, 2021)

John Lyngdal said:


> I use a 2 lb orange dead blow hammer. Not the best, but I can at least find it when I drop it in the woods.


Dad got one from Harbor Fright. It won't bring a good back leaner around as it just doesn't have the shear force of something heavy and steel. Works ok until you really need to move something around. Plus it can't knock bark off, or cut you out of a pinch. But you're right, its easy to find.


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## Cynfawr (Nov 19, 2021)

Good info here  As an arborist I put a rope in most trees I fell (a paltry number compared to you guys logging).

I use a small gransfors axe or my felling bar to drive wedges when I use them. Would love to work with some loggers for a bit to learn that side of things.


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## Clark10 (Dec 27, 2021)

Council Axe about 4 lbs. with a 25 inch straight handle from poll top to butt end.


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