# Opening a tree service business



## KeithKoharski

Hey guys.. I have decided to open my own tree service company. I have so many questions as to how and what are the best ways to start it.Here is a little bit about myself.. Im located in New Jersey. This will be my second (side) job at first and hopefully it can grow into a full time business. My full time job is an aviation maintenance tech. I work the night shift so i will be doing this during the days or my weekends at first. I am a combat veteran so I have access to the GI bill and other great financial support, however, I would like to do it without taking massive loans. I bought my house 3 years ago and I decided to cut down all the trees (50+ and massive oak trees) myself and since then I fell in love with tree work. I climbed them (with all of the PROFESSIONAL gear), felled them and then saved the logs for my fireplace and then even sold dozens of cords on the side. This past summer I picked up part time work with a friends tree business and I saw how much opportunity and money there is in the area. I have about $10K to invest into the company. I know it isnt much but it can get me some used equipment if I keep searching and am willing to travel. Here are a few questions just to get things going. I hope I can get some good opinions. Any advice is greatly appreciated.

What pieces of equipment are the most important a new company should have? 
Should I spend 10-12k on a used stump grinder?
Should I start off small with a helper, diesel pick up truck and dump trailer and back break hauling away logs etc.?
How should I attempt to get side jobs in the beginning? 
- I live in a very rural area (each house has 1-2+acres and heavily wooded). Should I attempt to go door to door and introduce myself as a neighbor and point out their tree work I see and give them a low price that theyd never get from a pro company? I would think any business and word of mouth for myself is good at first?
Should I wait until the busy season to start looking for side jobs? 
Id like to avoid leaving logs behind to "Reduce the price" I think its unprofessional and just leaves another thing for the homeowner to worry about. 

I am going to create a business plan, business name license and insured and get all of the certifications from ISA. I want to do this the correct way from the beginning. 
again, any advice is greatly appreciated. thank you in advance.


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## jefflovstrom




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## mckeetree

Here is my advice...DON'T DO IT.


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## lone wolf

KeithKoharski said:


> Hey guys.. I have decided to open my own tree service company. I have so many questions as to how and what are the best ways to start it.Here is a little bit about myself.. Im located in New Jersey. This will be my second (side) job at first and hopefully it can grow into a full time business. My full time job is an aviation maintenance tech. I work the night shift so i will be doing this during the days or my weekends at first. I am a combat veteran so I have access to the GI bill and other great financial support, however, I would like to do it without taking massive loans. I bought my house 3 years ago and I decided to cut down all the trees (50+ and massive oak trees) myself and since then I fell in love with tree work. I climbed them (with all of the PROFESSIONAL gear), felled them and then saved the logs for my fireplace and then even sold dozens of cords on the side. This past summer I picked up part time work with a friends tree business and I saw how much opportunity and money there is in the area. I have about $10K to invest into the company. I know it isnt much but it can get me some used equipment if I keep searching and am willing to travel. Here are a few questions just to get things going. I hope I can get some good opinions. Any advice is greatly appreciated.
> 
> What pieces of equipment are the most important a new company should have?
> Should I spend 10-12k on a used stump grinder?
> Should I start off small with a helper, diesel pick up truck and dump trailer and back break hauling away logs etc.?
> How should I attempt to get side jobs in the beginning?
> - I live in a very rural area (each house has 1-2+acres and heavily wooded). Should I attempt to go door to door and introduce myself as a neighbor and point out their tree work I see and give them a low price that theyd never get from a pro company? I would think any business and word of mouth for myself is good at first?
> Should I wait until the busy season to start looking for side jobs?
> Id like to avoid leaving logs behind to "Reduce the price" I think its unprofessional and just leaves another thing for the homeowner to worry about.
> 
> I am going to create a business plan, business name license and insured and get all of the certifications from ISA. I want to do this the correct way from the beginning.
> again, any advice is greatly appreciated. thank you in advance.


NJ law now requires you to be licensed with the State .





Home







njtreeexperts.org


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## KeithKoharski

mckeetree said:


> Here is my advice...DON'T DO IT.




Why do you say that?


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## DannytreeLLC

We don’t need another fly by night guy so if that’s your intention I will have to have your account deactivated. $10k won’t even buy a dump trailer... You need to continue to save money up and do this right bro.


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## full chizel

Who put you in charge of deactivating accounts?


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## lone wolf

full chizel said:


> Who put you in charge or deactivating accounts?


39 messages!


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## KeithKoharski

No, “fly by night guy” whatever that means isn’t my intention. I have a great full time career and it would be dumb for me to walk away and start a tree business with nothing. Like I said, I have professional climbing equipment & saws. I’m not afraid to be up in a tree (not everyone can say that). I’m sure there’s owners out there that won’t climb and they run the other day to day side of the business and that’s fine. I know opportunity when I see it.

I’m also sure there’s companies out there that started with bare minimum equipment and slowly grew over time. Id hope to build it into a full time business so I CAN leave my full time job. I’m not implying I that I know everything. There is a lot to learn and I fully know I’m capable of it all. I can easily get loans because of my 800+ credit score and my combat Veteran status. But I want to start small rather then start off in a massive debt hole. 
I’m still very early in the thought process of it all.


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## lone wolf

To answer your question buddy you need a dump truck or bucket truck first.


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## KeithKoharski

I’m also considering just working part time with my buddies tree business and learning more. Then I don’t have to worry about employees, acquiring jobs, managing equip, damage from jobs gone wrong. I can learn more. And possibly just become a “contract climber” one day and do it on my own schedule as needed by companies in the area.

99% of the laborers in my area are Mexicans (probably illegal). Unlike them I speak English, have drivers license, hard work ethic & am clean cut presentable appearance.


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## KeithKoharski

lone wolf said:


> To answer your question buddy you need a dump truck or bucket truck first.




That’s what I was thinking minimum or best equip to have is. Bucket truck with dump and maybe chipper. It’ll still suck when you get to the big logs that the chip won’t take.


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## mckeetree

KeithKoharski said:


> Why do you say that?


Very few individuals are really willing to invest the time and money it takes to make it in the tree service business in 2020. Back in the 80's it wasn't so hard to break out...now it's damn near impossible if you don't have a very strong financial backup to depend on. Most guys want to see way more money than this deal will ever produce for working 60 hours a week and sinking $100,000 of their own money and borrowing another $100,000 just to get started. I've been doing this for over 40 years...34 of it for me. Knowing what I know would I get into it again if I could go back in time? Hell no. Hell no.


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## Jed1124

lone wolf said:


> NJ law now requires you to be licensed with the State .
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Home
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> njtreeexperts.org




*ISA - License by Reciprocity*

The Board of Tree Experts voted at its June 20, 2017 meeting that the *ISA Certified Arborist (CA) is equivalent to the Licensed Tree Care Operator (LTCO)*. Use the *License by Reciprocity Application (fill-in version) or License by Reciprocity Application (static version) *to apply for the LTCO and include a copy of your current CA certificate or CA card as evidence. Remember to include the application fee too.

Is the Jersey license required for removals?
In CT our license is required for any work done to improve the condition of a tree.
Removals do not require licensing.


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## KeithKoharski

mckeetree said:


> Very few individuals are really willing to invest the time and money it takes to make it in the tree service business in 2020. Back in the 80's it wasn't so hard to break out...now it's damn near impossible if you don't have a very strong financial backup to depend on. Most guys want to see way more money than this deal will ever produce for working 60 hours a week and sinking $100,000 of their own money and borrowing another $100,000 just to get started. I've been doing this for over 40 years...34 of it for me. Knowing what I know would I get into it again if I could go back in time? Hell no. Hell no.



That’s very good advice. Thank you. I’ll take that into consideration. After all debts, taxes, employees other misc fees paid. What do you think the average take home is?


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## DannytreeLLC

Not a smart thing to say. Anyhow. Back to the point. $10,000 is not enough to start a tree business. Have you considered any other business? Such as lawn mowing, doing landscape jobs, or house vacuuming? Until you can save up enough coin to start a proper tree service. These ventures would be easier to start with a small amount of capital.


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## lone wolf

Jed1124 said:


> *ISA - License by Reciprocity*
> 
> The Board of Tree Experts voted at its June 20, 2017 meeting that the *ISA Certified Arborist (CA) is equivalent to the Licensed Tree Care Operator (LTCO)*. Use the *License by Reciprocity Application (fill-in version) or License by Reciprocity Application (static version) *to apply for the LTCO and include a copy of your current CA certificate or CA card as evidence. Remember to include the application fee too.
> 
> Is the Jersey license required for removals?
> In CT our license is required for any work done to improve the condition of a tree.
> Removals do not require licensing.


Yes it is if your are climbing or using an Aeriallift the onky time you are able to get around it is if you drop them whole without a rope.


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## mckeetree

KeithKoharski said:


> That’s very good advice. Thank you. I’ll take that into consideration. After all debts, taxes, employees other misc fees paid. What do you think the average take home is?


Often in red ink.


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## lone wolf

KeithKoharski said:


> That’s what I was thinking minimum or best equip to have is. Bucket truck with dump and maybe chipper. It’ll still suck when you get to the big logs that the chip won’t take.


Wait till you price all that stuff. don't buy inferior equipment just because the price seems low get the best you possibly can.


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## KeithKoharski

DannytreeLLC said:


> Not a smart thing to say. Anyhow. Back to the point. $10,000 is not enough to start a tree business. Have you considered any other business? Such as lawn mowing, doing landscape jobs, or house vacuuming? Until you can save up enough coin to start a proper tree service. These ventures would be easier to start with a small amount of capital.



So you’re telling me all the tree companies out there started their business with over $100k?! GTFOH. I beg to differ. Businesses have been started with less than $10k and grown into syccessful entities. Don’t misjudge my capabilities and COH with your dumb comments. I’m curious...Are you a business owner? How much capital did you start with? How many crews do you have going? How many jobs is each crew given per day? What’s your real day to day role in the company?
I’m looking for advice and to have a conversation with industry pros if you don’t have any good advice keep it to yourself. Thanks bro.


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## DannytreeLLC

I make well over $372,000 now but starting out I was making under $15,000 annually. This was 30 years ago but still


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## KeithKoharski

mckeetree said:


> Often in red ink.



damn. That sucks. I’m sure it does have it’s good seasons and bad seasons. I want to hear all the bad experiences bc those are the things most people won’t say when you run into them and say “hey, how’s business?“.

In a perfect world I’d love to keep myfull time night shift job since it does pay well. And once the tree go is up and running successfully with all the necessity equipment I could manage and quote and run it from the owner/administration side of things. There’s definitely plenty of people out there who do that through out the country in many fields.

the whole point of my thread is for ideas on how to get STARTED, UP AND RUNNING & what equipment is the best to purchase as a new company. Thanks again for your input man.


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## Woodanhor

DannytreeLLC said:


> I make well over $372,000 now but starting out I was making under $15,000 annually. This was 30 years ago but still


What did you start at birth?


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## lone wolf

Woodanhor said:


> What did you start at birth?


How you figure if he started at 20 the math works.


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## DannytreeLLC

I started when I was 22. I was a “fly by night” type until I was 30. 25 years being truly in business. I am 55 now, planning to retire in 5 years or less.


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## DannytreeLLC

Times were different back then. Now, anyone can look to see if you are licensed or insured. Any smart homeowner will not hire a fly by night guy


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## lone wolf

DannytreeLLC said:


> Times were different back then. Now, anyone can look to see if you are licensed or insured. Any smart homeowner will not hire a fly by night guy


Lots of them don't care if its cheaper . But I guess they learn after they hire the Gypsies.


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## DannytreeLLC

I hold myself to a higher standard. I won’t do a job under $2,500. I had to fire a guy so I only have 2 guys working for me now, but we need another guy with all the calls we get done. I tell people my minimum over the phone which disqualifies a lot of them so I am not wasting my time or theirs


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## KeithKoharski

DannytreeLLC said:


> I started when I was 22. I was a “fly by night” type until I was 30. 25 years being truly in business. I am 55 now, planning to retire in 5 years or less.



Fly by night meaning. It wasn’t your full time profession at first? You did tree work part time & slowest funded it Ofer time?
If so, and you did that. Why is it a bad thing for me to? Contradicting don’t you think lol.

I said I want to do it legit from my very first post. License, insured ISA certs.I’m not attempting to be some backyard hillbilly cutting down a tree from a ladder with an echo cs.


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## Woodanhor

lone wolf said:


> How you figure if he started at 20 the math works.


His profile says 25 
So something dont add up 
I smell something


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## DannytreeLLC

I am guilty of that when I was younger we accidentally sent a huge limb down on a mobile home. I didn’t have insurance so we had to take off. Back then I was operating under many different names but it was on the news. Luckily they didn’t have the technology to track me down.


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## mckeetree

DannytreeLLC said:


> I hold myself to a higher standard. I won’t do a job under $2,500. I had to fire a guy so I only have 2 guys working for me now, but we need another guy with all the calls we get done. I tell people my minimum over the phone which disqualifies a lot of them so I am not wasting my time or theirs


What's up with this...


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## DannytreeLLC

when I signed up on this site I put my Years in Business as my age. I didn’t realize they wanted my personal age. This profile is for my company Danny Tree LLC, not myself Daniel Charn


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## mckeetree

Dannytree is a troll.


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## lone wolf

Woodanhor said:


> His profile says 25
> So something dont add up
> I smell something


OH!


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## mckeetree

DannytreeLLC said:


> when I signed up on this site I put my Years in Business as my age. I didn’t realize they wanted my personal age. This profile is for my company Danny Tree LLC, not myself Daniel Charn


Yeah, you have the right name...Charn.


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## DannytreeLLC

Mckeetree nice Photo Shot picture you posted of a message purportedly from me. Nobody will be fooled as it is clearly photo shot.


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## mckeetree

DannytreeLLC said:


> Mckeetree nice Photo Shot picture you posted of a message purportedly from me. Nobody will be fooled as it is clearly photo shot.


It's from you. Don't you have anything better to do than troll a site like this. You are pretty pitiful. Pathetic really.


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## lone wolf

DannytreeLLC said:


> Mckeetree nice Photo Shot picture you posted of a message purportedly from me. Nobody will be fooled as it is clearly photo shot.


Mckee Tree isn't a liar !


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## DannytreeLLC

Mckee you are the “troll” photo shotting a message to discredit me on the forum. Nobody other than a fool would find that to be funny. You are just upset because you were proven wrong


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## sundance

DannytreeLLC said:


> I am guilty of that when I was younger we accidentally sent a huge limb down on a mobile home. I didn’t have insurance so we had to take off. Back then I was operating under many different names but it was on the news. Luckily they didn’t have the technology to track me down.


Real class act. Would make me want you doing my work.


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## sundance

DannytreeLLC said:


> I make well over $372,000 now but starting out I was making under $15,000 annually. This was 30 years ago but still


$372,000 seems like a mighty strange "round number" to be well over. I assume you're claiming to net this much? Gross doesn't mean much.


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## lone wolf

DannytreeLLC said:


> Mckee you are the “troll” photo shotting a message to discredit me on the forum. Nobody other than a fool would find that to be funny. You are just upset because you were proven wrong


Shut up you damn fool.


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## DannytreeLLC

@sundance Yes, that would be net. That number includes my salary, however. The gap between 1M to 2M gross was the most difficult for us. The key to our growth has been subcontracting with the utility companies. We still do a lot of residential removals, but the line work has proven to be extremely consistent and equally profitable. We used to travel for storms but have found it not to be worth it in terms of opportunity costs.


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## Woodanhor

lone wolf said:


> Shut up you damn fool.


Need @capetrees. Troll spray


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## Woodanhor

Oh Danny boy


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## capetrees

DannytreeLLC said:


> Times were different back then. Now, anyone can look to see if you are licensed or insured. Any smart homeowner will not hire a fly by night guy


they hired you back then as a fly by night, no?


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## capetrees

DannytreeLLC said:


> @sundance Yes, that would be net. That number includes my salary, however. The gap between 1M to 2M gross was the most difficult for us. The key to our growth has been subcontracting with the utility companies. We still do a lot of residential removals, but the line work has proven to be extremely consistent and equally profitable. We used to travel for storms but have found it not to be worth it in terms of opportunity costs.


you net 372K off 2 million gross? Three guys? 40 hours a week, 10 months. 200K/month?

really ......


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## Woodanhor

lone wolf said:


> Shut up you damn fool.


Heres his thread hes looking for everyone help and advice for drunk employees





Employee Problems


My employees have been acting up lately. I am a smaller operation and it is just me and 3 guys that work for me. Today, on a job site the clients neighbor came out and was upset we were taking down the clients tree. Long story short the two guys on the ground beat the neighbor up. Talk about...




www.arboristsite.com


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## jefflovstrom

I love reading this thread,, I am not in the same league as Dannyboy, but since he has been here he has been a smart ass know nothing idiot looking to piss us off. I doubt he knows what EBITDA is. I live in a different tree world than some,, no residential,, but I like to read the posts from those that do, takes me back. Anyway, starting a tree biz with 10k sounds desperate.
Jeff
It was a beautiful day!


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## mckeetree

DannytreeLLC said:


> @sundance Yes, that would be net. That number includes my salary, however. The gap between 1M to 2M gross was the most difficult for us. The key to our growth has been subcontracting with the utility companies. We still do a lot of residential removals, but the line work has proven to be extremely consistent and equally profitable. We used to travel for storms but have found it not to be worth it in terms of opportunity costs.


At least you made over 50 post before being absolutely outed as a lying idiot troll. I remember back in the old days here most never made 20 before they were flushed out for the assclown they were.


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## KeithKoharski

I’m not the least bit desperate. I live a very comfortable life with my current profession. I have extra money and time and am considering putting that into a line of work I thoroughly enjoy.

I enjoy being in the tree or on the ground as limbs are dropping. On the saw eating the chips, dripping sweat in my eyes cutting up a monster log or stump. I’ve mostly done residential with few commercial but the only real difference was it’s in a parking lot vs next to a house. I’ve worked at garden centers for years and am knlowgevale on landscaping and trees/plants so I love the entire industry of “plants”. I’ve been in way more dangerous situations than cutting down a tree lol. Like I said I am a combat veteran.

Yes I know 10K isn’t going to get me much at first so sure I can save or another 10 maybe. Puts me at 20k. I also wanted info on what’s the best equipment to have starting a brand new company. Someone states a bucket truck. I agree. A bucket truck w dump. 

I find it hard to believe every tree company started out with the following..

bucket: 30k (used avg reliable starter truck maybe)
Utility trailer for bucket truck: 10k
Mini ride on w grapple: 15-20k used 
Stump grinder: 20k
Chipper:15-20k
Chip truck: 20-30k
That’s all rough estimates on used equip maybe say $150k. No way everyone out there went to a bank and took out a loan and started their business.


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## mckeetree

mckeetree said:


> At least you made over 50 post before being absolutely outed as a lying idiot troll. I remember back in the old days here most never made 20 before they were flushed out for the assclown they were.


And to reply to my own post...I remember one guy that hung around here for a short time back about 2010 or 11 that was about the same caliber as Dannyboy. Seems like he called himself acetree or something or another like that. Anyway, the guy admitted he got off to posting BS in miscellaneous forums. Not just this one, many others. Apparently he would post lies and just set there and masturbate I suppose. I don't know what else he would have meant by "got off" posting erroneous crap in internet forums. Weird. And you have to wonder really how old some of those clowns are. Dantree might not be out of junior high.


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## KeithKoharski

.. I’m all done here. Thanks For the advice I guess lol. Good luck with the trolls.


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## capetrees

KeithKoharski said:


> .. I’m all done here. Thanks For the advice I guess lol. Good luck with the trolls.


bottom line?

Start with what you have, bust your ass working every job big or small, add to your fleet of equipment as needed and grow according to the area you're in.


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## jrider

Just curious where in NJ?


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## under_the_hill

KeithKoharski said:


> - Should I attempt to go door to door and introduce myself as a neighbor and point out their tree work I see and give them a low price that theyd never get from a pro company?



Nothing I'd like less than if someone moved into my neighborhood and pointed out expenses to me. Maybe if it's a safety issue that might harm your neighbor and you really want to be neighborly, offer to do the work for free. But even then it puts the neighbor in the position of trusting you before you've even gotten to know each other.


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## jefflovstrom

KeithKoharski said:


> Hey guys.. Should I attempt to go door to door and introduce myself as a neighbor and point out their tree work I see and give them a low price that theyd never get from a pro company?



What kind of experience do you have to give that advice? What are your credentials? Are you a certified arborist ? Why should they NOT go with a 'Pro' company?,,Like I said,,'Desperate',,just saying and joining in the conversation,,
Jeff
It was a beautiful day!,,but hot!


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## Tetanus

OP, What would your reaction be if someone got hold of you and asked how they could get into close protection work, because they like shooting guns and strongarming other people and reckon they might make that their career in life? You know, 'cause it's not that hard, in fact, in a couple of years they're going to employ other guys that will do the hard yards while they run the business? Not getting at you mate, but there's a hell of a lot more to the job than just being able to climb a tree and hack it down. Get some education on trees (there is LOTS to learn!), at the very least work for a reputable company so you know what you're really in for. I know nothing about being in combat, but if i can compare the situation for you, in both jobs, what you don't know can kill you. I don't usually have much to say on here, but at present i have plenty of time to spare while ruefully contemplating my climbing future following a silly accident up a tree. I'm now waiting for an appointment with an orthopedic surgeon to repair cartilage damage to my knee. I guess it boils down to this- don't run before you can walk. Good luck, whatever you decide.


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## ElevatorGuy

Anyone knocking on my door soliciting work would never work for me. That means you walked passed all the no soliciting and no trespassing signs. Make sure you smile for the cameras and you’ll probably be greeted with 2 angry German shepherds and a gun.


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## Luztree

capetrees said:


> you net 372K off 2 million gross? Three guys? 40 hours a week, 10 months. 200K/month?
> 
> really ......


$10,000 per day with a 3 man crew With a 5 day workweek?


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## DannytreeLLC

Wish we only worked 5 days. We work 6 full days and every other Sunday afternoon. I am replacing the guy that I had to let go soon. Our average day is around $7-8000 although sometimes quite a bit more if it is emergency work. That is gross obviously, but our expenses remain somewhat fixed so I have a good idea of what net should be on a given day.


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## capetrees

DannytreeLLC said:


> Wish we only worked 5 days. We work 6 full days and every other Sunday afternoon. I am replacing the guy that I had to let go soon. Our average day is around $7-8000 although sometimes quite a bit more if it is emergency work. That is gross obviously, but our expenses remain somewhat fixed so I have a good idea of what net should be on a given day.


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## lone wolf

DannytreeLLC said:


> Wish we only worked 5 days. We work 6 full days and every other Sunday afternoon. I am replacing the guy that I had to let go soon. Our average day is around $7-8000 although sometimes quite a bit more if it is emergency work. That is gross obviously, but our expenses remain somewhat fixed so I have a good idea of what net should be on a given day.


As much money as you have you can recruit lots of help with all that money to spare. If you really make that much you can pay your guys triple the norm! I got to call BS!


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## DancesWithTrees

KeithKoharski said:


> I’m not the least bit desperate. I live a very comfortable life with my current profession. I have extra money and time and am considering putting that into a line of work I thoroughly enjoy.
> 
> I enjoy being in the tree or on the ground as limbs are dropping. On the saw eating the chips, dripping sweat in my eyes cutting up a monster log or stump. I’ve mostly done residential with few commercial but the only real difference was it’s in a parking lot vs next to a house. I’ve worked at garden centers for years and am knlowgevale on landscaping and trees/plants so I love the entire industry of “plants”. I’ve been in way more dangerous situations than cutting down a tree lol. Like I said I am a combat veteran.
> 
> Yes I know 10K isn’t going to get me much at first so sure I can save or another 10 maybe. Puts me at 20k. I also wanted info on what’s the best equipment to have starting a brand new company. Someone states a bucket truck. I agree. A bucket truck w dump.
> 
> I find it hard to believe every tree company started out with the following..
> 
> bucket: 30k (used avg reliable starter truck maybe)
> Utility trailer for bucket truck: 10k
> Mini ride on w grapple: 15-20k used
> Stump grinder: 20k
> Chipper:15-20k
> Chip truck: 20-30k
> That’s all rough estimates on used equip maybe say $150k. No way everyone out there went to a bank and took out a loan and started their business.


Keith, I'm new here, and new in business myself. I can't tell you a lot, not even sure if you're going to see this- but the one thing I can tell you is this- get as much education as you can first, maybe an Associate's degree or whatever you can afford. At the very least, read all the books you can get ahold of. Once you understand ANSI standards, maybe work for someone for a while- but make sure they are certified, or at least follow ANSI. Sounds like that will be easy where you are; it's not so much where I am. Once you go out on your own, the hardest part is building reputation and getting steady work. Until you start getting a lot of people talking you up and referring you to their friends, it is a tough ride. I'm still at that stage, doing work for cheaper than I would like to just to get my name out there. It kinda sucks, but in any business you have to pay your dues until people know who you are. I built my website, studied some SEO, found a great book on that- and using some free tools I figured out that 90% of people in my area are searching Google for specific companies they already know. That means I'm fighting with the hordes for the other 10%. It's tough. But you survived combat, so you know how to be tenacious. You'll need that. For equipment- you will need a pickup truck. Everything else you should rent as needed until you get steady work, or your debts will destroy you. I use a utility trailer and accumulate brush in my back yard (I have a few acres) until it's enough to justify renting a chipper for a day and reducing it all down. It's not optimal, but it keeps my equipment costs down. And I agree in principal with whoever it was as far as qualifying people for tree removals before running out to their house and working up a bid. I've figure out that much- make sure they are not going to balk at a job that costs a couple of thousand dollars. If that's out of their league, don't waste your time and fuel making a bid that they are just going to throw away anyway. Focus your early efforts on marketing more than equipment. I used Yelp to get a few leads. It's not paying for itself on paper, but it did connect me with at least one good person who is talking me up. Also, talk to your realtor who you bought your house with. They should know people, and might be helpful in connecting you with potential customers. Keep up the fight, bro- you can do it if you want it bad enough.


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## Iwrush

Good advice I’d recommend the same. Keep fighting and one day it’ll happen.


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## Silmaril

Hey Keith,

I've read this whole thread and I'm going to try to actually give you advise based off what you asked. For some reason almost no body wants to do that, it looks like most everyone here just wants to complain about their situation, not yours.

I have a very similar situation to yours. I am a veteran, I have a credit score over 800, I have a full time job, I started a tree company within the last year.
That being said, we have some differences too. I have a few years of climbing experience with a very good tree care company that focused on being an arborist, not a log humper. They sent me to a climbing school, and since I left that company I have climbed recreationally since for about 7 years. I am no master but I am comfortable and am aware of what my limits are. I also have experience (the last 7 years) working at a dealership for outdoor power so I know how to fix saws and engines, how to properly run and maintain them.

So when I started my business I did it with a partner. He doesn't have experience or financial backing BUT he is a hard worker and it allowed me to have someone else to share the load. PLUS you really do need someone else to do tree work, just from a safety aspect but also a practical stand point.

We didn't have a lot of money either, far less than you in fact. The first step for us was getting incorporated. From there we opened a bank account and then got insurance. Bingo bango, we were in business. We already had saws and climbing equipment (which it sounds like you have as well) so everything else outside of that is just there to make it easier for you, NOT requirements. So guys who say $100,000 to start simply have no perspective of BUILDING a business.

We did the jobs that we knew we could handle with the equipment and experience we had. And we worked hard. If someone had three pin oaks next to their house, 90 feet tall leaning over the house... guess what, we said no. We took the small jobs, saved up more money. We also market ourselves as expert pruners and a tree CARE company, not Joe-Shmo with a Ford Ranger and chainsaw. My experience was in formative and structural pruning. I stay up to date on the best practices and techniques for what is best for the tree. That being said, of course we do removals but it's not our primary area of expertise so we often price ourselves out of jobs. If the person says no, great, we aren't looking to do that kind of work anyway. If they say yes, great, we priced it so it was well worth our time. Maybe this type of business model isn't for you but our area has many tree-conscience people so we can.

So we got a number of jobs under out belt, got great experience and banked what we made. The key to our scenario and to your scenario that everyone on here seems to be ignoring is that you and I are NOT relying on the tree company as a living. We both have successful careers. This allows us to build the company over time, as long as you have patience.

So, all that being said we found that outside of the obvious stuff (saws, ropes, climbing gear, etc.) the next most important thing was a chipper and then in turn a truck to pull said chipper. We are a small outfit, we don't need the biggest, baddest, newest stuff. We found a couple local auctions that sell these things used. So we got a solid chipper and truck to make our jobs easier and it allows us to more competitively quote. These set us back about 12K. We went with a regular dump truck too because it does what we need and is cheaper and more available than a chip truck or bucket truck.

We do on average 3 jobs a month and make at this point about 3k per month. As a side business that is perfect. It adds some to what we already make and it's not so much work that we are killing ourselves.

I agree with Danceswithtrees about education. In your free time, research tree care. You want to show up at a job well informed of what you are looking at. And all the marketing stuff, sure that is great and I am well versed in it but you are going to get a ton of work from word of mouth. Show up on time, presentable and do good work. Word will travel quickly. That will get you further quicker than any SEO techniques or Yelp reviews (again, not saying those aren't important but you are just starting out).

I feel bad for you that a lot of people on here are bashing you. It sounds like you are doing this in the smartest way possible and you are researching before you make the plunge. How can anyone knock you for that? I commend you and wish you the best. If you ever need any REAL advise, reach out to me I am always happy to help a fellow tree care specialist and veteran.


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## Blue Oaks

OP- My advice would be to go work for the company and learn the business on someone else's dime. I did the same when I went to work in a machine shop. I learned over a few years that I didn't want to have my own shop after all, and it didn't cost me my life's savings to figure it out.


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## TreeDoctorsoftheWorld

Make sure you have the right software/tool to assist you with your company. It will be a lot easier. 
We heard so many positive reviews with Arbostar Business Management Platform. 
Try to look it up on Google, this would make things easier for you especially the accounting side.


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## AshleyTree

TreeDoc, I think you need to look into the thread a little. He's not anywhere even close to needing software. Simple accounting software is plenty at the outset. I wish I had my old account but I have been able to get to where I am today from next to nothing like a lot of people but that came from a few things that this person doesn't have: 

A: I got an College Degree in Arboriculture
B: I climbed for a company for many years and then became a municipal arborist
C: I got connected to the industry early in my career by getting certified (ON-1320A) and going to conferences
D: I am not doing this 'part time' so I actually understand the industry

If you want my advice, if you want a side line and enjoy tree work - you need to UNDERSTAND what the jobs require and how to do them first or your taking a huge risk, people are going to have to trust you and your far far out of your league in almost any situation if your representing yourself as anything other than a handy man. Please don't take this as an insult but even a savvy homeowner at this point can stump you on tree ID or technique and your coming to him as a "Tree Service". People who get started with next to nothing have many years in the trade and can build there way up based on their foundation. Which you NEED. Your side line will go horribly wrong until your at least competent with the many facets of tree care, even if it simply a surface level understanding.

Work with your friend for at least a year, keep saving money for a 3/4 ton and take on only what you are ABSOLUTELY sure you can handle. In a small rural area you can ruin your brand and your rep if you don't work carefully at first.


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## KingBeee

Your success will mostly depend on your dedication and a bit of luck landing your first big jobs


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## MariHer75

Starting a business is not a small venture. My opinion is that you should go for it If you have the capital and resources


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## Deleted member 152182

You'll be fine, or you wont. First one for me I started out doing landscape installs but quickly learned I could make more doing tree work. Hired an arborist and ground crew and we went to work. Didn't do it for long just a couple years. Was pulling in 10k a week by the end of it. All with just myself, 1 arborist, 1 laborer. We borrowed a chipper when needed but mostly just threw everything into a 14' trailer and chainsawed it up. I would try to convince people to leave the stump if it was something that wouldn't sucker out. If they wouldn't go for it I just rented a shitty home depot stump grinder. It got the job done. Then I moved. 

Been running another landscaping business for the past few years while my wife finished up grad school. She graduated so I gave it to my helper and moved again just now. Made a killing off the house so now have the luxury of going all in. Found a nice truck (internatinoal) for 50k, new Morbark 1415 chipper, Morbark track loader, Morbark stump grinder, new saws and whatever other random stuff I need. Looking at about 200k+/- spent by the end of this month. 
I will have thus gone into business on the two extreme ends. I think if you are pro-active and give things time you will be fine. If you are lazy and give up easily you will fail. If you can stick with it for 2-3 years its around that time frame you will start to see a significant uptick in referrals and will have your niche figured out and know how to get jobs and really start being able to upgrade your equipment. 
My first business I worked at a nursery when we first moved. I poached all of their customers. That worked well. Then I put cards at all the other nurseries, one let me make a sign and I made friends with workers at various places. I also taught gardening classes at various venues and got a crap load of work from that. 
Second time around but just doing maintenance and not tree work just landscaping and a few mid sized installs I did all out of my truck. Pulled in 500-1k per day. Not a lot but enough to get by while my wife finished grad school. 
I have no idea what will happen with the new business going all in like this. A little nervous. A lot of tree businesses already in the area. So we will see... I would say you can totally start with just a trailer and the tools you need and work up from that.


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