# Ppe



## ciscoguy01 (Nov 7, 2006)

How many of ya'll actually wear it? What do you wear? I mean specifics. I know everyone encourages it, but what do you wear yourself? Safety glasses? Hard hat with face shield and hearing protectors? Chaps? Gloves? Stihl toed boots? (pun there) What do you wear daily??? and who are the manufacturer's of the safety gear you wear? Thanks for the info...


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## Kneejerk Bombas (Nov 7, 2006)

There are two parts to PPE. 
First, is the image you portray by wearing it. Are there any tree services you wish to emulate? Do they wear PPE?
Second, is the safety it gives you. Do you know guys that walk around and are alive? Wouldn't it be nice to walk around and be alive? Not having big old scars on your face is an added benefit.
The ANSI standards are pretty much the absolute minimum for me.


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## SRT-Tech (Nov 8, 2006)

gear i wear, wether its just a quick branch trim or a full days work:

- Petzl Vertex helmet, with PELTOR Optime 102 ear muffs, flip up face shield
- Full Kevlar wrap chainsaw pants
- Chainsaw boots, steel toe with shin armour
- chainsaw mitts with Kevlar pads on back of palms


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## OTG BOSTON (Nov 8, 2006)

*all of it*

I always have eye protection, dark, amber, and clear depending on the light conditions. Hard hat, hearing protection, and chaps unless I'm climbing.


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## ASEMASTER (Nov 8, 2006)

I wear it all even on the pile of wood , I had to many close call's before they had all the ppg.


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## PUclimber (Nov 8, 2006)

Vertex Vented helmet
Safety glasses
Earplugs
Husquvarna Chainsaw pants

Bought the pants to wear in the tree just in case since you never know when an accident will happen.


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## John Paul Sanborn (Nov 8, 2006)

Helmet with chin strap
Ear plugs
glasses
Saw pants on the ground.

I do from time to time "cheat", but then I'm only cheating myself, my wife, my parents. The people who work with me who will have to deal with the mishap.....


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## computeruser (Nov 8, 2006)

Steel-toe boots, chaps, eye protection, ear protection (often the kind with the radio built in...), and good gloves (i.e. whatever kind that I feel confident will provide me a grip I can trust under the conditions I'm working in). I should get a helmet/face screen, I just haven't gotten around to it. Always. The cost of the PPE is undoubtedly less than the cost of an accident, both in time and money, so it seems worthwhile. And properly selected and fitted PPE should not be burdensome to wear, rather it should be comforting and maybe even comfortable!


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## dc59222 (Nov 8, 2006)

Srt-Tech whats up with those chainsaw boots? who makes them, where can i find them on the web? thanks


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## JohN Dee (Nov 8, 2006)

Myself and my father are very strict when it comes to safety and PPE. All of the guys that work with me wear: Steel Cap boots, Stihl hard hats with earmuffs and mesh visors, Rated safety glasses, leather gloves and a backbrace. 

We're all in uniform the uniform counts aswell because its all durable King Gee..

Computeruser: Also where did you get your


> ar protection (often the kind with the radio built in...)


 if you dont mind me asking? I've been interested in them for awhile but cant seem to find them anywhere..


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## Bermie (Nov 8, 2006)

PPE, comforting and comfortable...I liked that!!

I wear:
Hi vis green moisture control shirt w/sun protection
Vertex vent w/ear muffs & visor
Safety glasses - after getting poked in the eye even under the visor
Gloves - tight fitting 
SIP chainsaw boots w/steel toes and kevlar
When the weather cools down - Stihl high flex chainsaw trousers otherwise arborwear


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## jmack (Nov 8, 2006)

ciscoguy01 said:


> How many of ya'll actually wear it? What do you wear? I mean specifics. I know everyone encourages it, but what do you wear yourself? Safety glasses? Hard hat with face shield and hearing protectors? Chaps? Gloves? Stihl toed boots? (pun there) What do you wear daily??? and who are the manufacturer's of the safety gear you wear? Thanks for the info...


da ansi z-133 standards are your guide for mandatory ppe reqs/ ex. chaps using saw yes on ground all da time/ chaps in tree no/ face sheild on helmet optional/ glasses with a z87stamp mandatory, btw interestingly enough osha will also use our z133 as their guide/ if your in the dacks maybe yer logging ....... thats a whole other standard


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## TackleTree (Nov 8, 2006)

One thing I would warn about the radio earmuffs. Make sure they have noise dampening, because turning up the volume to overcome the outside noise defeats the purpose.


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## Jumper (Nov 9, 2006)

*All of it , all of the time*

CSA Approved Boots, chain saw pants, hard hat, muffs, safety glasses, screen, gloves. Hi vis t shirt or jacket.

One PPE item often neglected by outdoor workers-sunscreen as necessary. 

I can honestly say wearing a hardhat at the very least saved my from a nasty bump on the head by a hanger that I did not see while I was tugging on another. Knocked me flat on my butt into a snowbank. 

One really good reason for wearing this stuff up here-keeps the Workmans Comp Board off your back, not to mention the Labour Ministry. Three weeks ago I reinjured an arm I broke in 1999, fortunately minor, just nerve damage. I was off work two plus days while I saw docs, got xrays etc. Because I could honestly say I was working in a safe manner, which included PPE, I got a cheque for $105 in the mail to replace my lost wages for those days. I expected nothing, so this was a nice surprise. Wearing the prescribed PPE is a small price to pay. 

I am currently working on a sometimes casual basis in a warehouse as well, and the lack of adherance to basic PPE regs is appalling. At the least, steel toed footwear should be manditory, but they have people wandering around in sneakers using MHE. Go figure.

Wearing this stuff can be a pain in the derriere at times, but on the other I agree with the above, it makes one look like a professional, and not a rag tag bandit outfit dressed in cut off shorts or track pants, and ratty old tennis shoes, wife beater T shirt, ball cap. You've all seen these clowns parading around and stealing business from legit arborists. Realize there is more to tree work than looking the part BTW. My last boss used to routinely phone the Ministry and rat out the rag tag competition, and I confess to having raised concerns to larger companies as well-I pay these clowns medical bills and comp claims. Prime example, we are getting a new sidewalk this week, and they are cutting concrete with a rotary Stihl saw; no eye protection, no mask and no ear plugs. These are the same people that will put in a huge Comp claim 20 years from now.


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## Jumper (Nov 9, 2006)

dc59222 said:


> Srt-Tech whats up with those chainsaw boots? who makes them, where can i find them on the web? thanks



Sherill sell them. Made by Royer in Canada. I have a pair and confess they are somewhat cumbersome.


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## SRT-Tech (Nov 10, 2006)

^ thats the ones! they are a bit clunky. sadly my brand new boots are no more, they went the way of the car thief  i had less than two weeks wear on them...


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## treemendous (Nov 10, 2006)

I wear all the ppe but just purchased a set of bugz eye mesh goggles from baileys after a wood chip cut my eye under my full face shield. Worst day of my life.


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## Jumper (Nov 10, 2006)

I believe the recommendation is to wear eye protection in addition to the shield, which you unfortunately discovered.

I have experienced cornea tears on the surface of my eye (not related to work) and can honestly say an eye injury is one of the most painful anyone will ever experience. Hope you are OK.


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## wdchuck (Nov 10, 2006)

generic but ansi approved hardhat, steel toe boots, Stihl chaps from the dealer, leather gloves, ear plugs-soft & comfortable, since I wear glasses anyway I have safety lenses in them,( twice took a stone through the open car window at 55mph that hit my lenses, imagine what that would have done done without glasses; no laser surgery for me.)

Guilty of wearing a baseball cap at times. keeps the sun out my eyes better than the hardhat.

Next item(s) to get, face shield/screen, and remember to keep some dustmasks on hand, that smokers cough from the fumes/dust suck.

What gloves would you guys recommend or where to look for them.


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## BlueRidgeMark (Nov 10, 2006)

wdchuck said:


> ear plugs-soft & comfortable,



Ear plugs are WAAAAY better than nothing, but they don't do as much as muffs. The reason is that a lot of sound is transmitted through the mastoid bone (right behind your ear), and ear plugs don't stop that at all. A good set of muffs DO reduce that quite a bit.

If a sound hurts your ears, you passed "permanent damage" a few deciBels back.


I wish I'd known this a long time ago. I keep having to remind my wife and children to speak up. Not fun. It's not bad enough for hearing aids yet, but it will get there. Hearing loss is cumulative and progressive.




It's your hearing, it's your choice. 

Me? I'm going to do everything I can to save what I have left.


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## beowulf343 (Nov 10, 2006)

BlueRidgeMark said:


> Ear plugs are WAAAAY better than nothing, but they don't do as much as muffs. The reason is that a lot of sound is transmitted through the mastoid bone (right behind your ear), and ear plugs don't stop that at all. A good set of muffs DO reduce that quite a bit.


Plus ear muffs help keep your ears warm when it's cold out!


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## b1rdman (Nov 10, 2006)

ciscoguy01 said:


> How many of ya'll actually wear it? What do you wear? I mean specifics. I know everyone encourages it, but what do you wear yourself? Safety glasses? Hard hat with face shield and hearing protectors? Chaps? Gloves? Stihl toed boots? (pun there) What do you wear daily??? and who are the manufacturer's of the safety gear you wear? Thanks for the info...



I cut for 20 years in whatever I happened to be wearing at the time. The only PPE I knew was a pair of saftey glasses if there was one nearby.

I started wearing chaps, ear protection, and glass every time I cut about a year or so ago....largely because of this site and the peer pressure. I'll wear gloves if it's cold, and boots if it's muddy....still working on those.

A brain bucket/mesh guard will probably become a standard for me soon. I cut a lot of "dead standing" trees on my property so I think it's time for me to stop gambling. Plus..the eyeglass are good for a spec in the eye but logic tells me they're only a "feel good" for real eye hazards.


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## ciscoguy01 (Nov 11, 2006)

*Ugh*



b1rdman said:


> I cut for 20 years in whatever I happened to be wearing at the time. The only PPE I knew was a pair of saftey glasses if there was one nearby.
> 
> I started wearing chaps, ear protection, and glass every time I cut about a year or so ago....largely because of this site and the peer pressure. I'll wear gloves if it's cold, and boots if it's muddy....still working on those.
> 
> A brain bucket/mesh guard will probably become a standard for me soon. I cut a lot of "dead standing" trees on my property so I think it's time for me to stop gambling. Plus..the eyeglass are good for a spec in the eye but logic tells me they're only a "feel good" for real eye hazards.



You guys are all so good about it too. I'm so friggin bad. I've never even worn steel toed boots or Safety glasses. I should, I know I should, I just never have. Now I've got all these old dudes hounding me about wearing safety gear I figured I'd ask. In 21 yrs of cutting I've never worn hard hat, safety glasses, chaps, steel toed boots, mostly never worn gloves, nothing really at all. I'm going to start, at least small anyways. I'm gonna buy some steeltoes, safety glasses, I've already got hard hats from when I was a steel worker. That'll be a good start for now. Do ya'll wear hard hats when bucking up wood??? Thanks for all the great info...


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## John Paul Sanborn (Nov 11, 2006)

ciscoguy01 said:


> Do ya'll wear hard hats when bucking up wood???



Do we wear hardhats when running a chainsaw?  

Head, ear and eye at all times. Anything else is cheating yourself.

Just assume you've been lucky since your early teens.

The thing is, the more often you do something the more risk you have. Studies have shown that the incidence of injury declines as a worker gains knowledge/experiance then will spike back up after ~8 years. This is based soly on repoorted injuries and "Time in Service" for lack of a better term.


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## Jumper (Nov 12, 2006)

ciscoguy01 said:


> I've already got hard hats from when I was a steel worker. That'll be a good start for now. Do ya'll wear hard hats when bucking up wood???



Bear in mind old hard hards are brittle and not much protection-up here the safety rating expires after a given number of years. Splurge and buy yourself a new state of the art hat with muff and shield. Yes I wear the hat when bucking because it is integral to the shield and muff system.


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## ciscoguy01 (Nov 12, 2006)

*Hmmm*



John Paul Sanborn said:


> The thing is, the more often you do something the more risk you have. Studies have shown that the incidence of injury declines as a worker gains knowledge/experiance then will spike back up after ~8 years. This is based soly on repoorted injuries and "Time in Service" for lack of a better term.



I guess that makes sense. The whole comfort thing and all. Getting comfortable with something as unsafe as sawing can be a bad thing I'd think. My hardhats are all only 4 or 5 yrs old, what we/most of us wear are really just bump caps, i.e. those plastic ones. I reckon I'll start throwing it on. Anyone use the newer carbon fiber boots in place of the steel toes yet? I was wondering how comfortable they are comparatively. Steel toed boots get really cold up here in the winter so most I know tend to steer clear of them...


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## SRT-Tech (Nov 12, 2006)

something i have noticed while working in many different fields, is that people DO NOT wear PPE when it is uncomfortable or hard to adjust. A lot of the cheaper stuff, particularly helmets/hardhats simply does not fit many people, and is limited in fit adjustment....so workers tend to avoid using it. Same with eyeglases...the frames break if you breath on them, the lens fog up, workers dont wear them. Earplugs - hard to insert sometimes, dont stay in when wet, uncomfortable, workers chuck em. 

I dropped pretty big coin for my Petzl Vertex helmet, Peltor Optime 102 muffs and mesh face shield, it was money well spent. At the end of the day i'm still wearing them, sometimes i dont notice until i'm sitting in traffic :biggrinbounce2: The Peltor muffs are so comfortable to wear, they dont get waterlogged with sweat, they block out over 35 DB of noise (i tested them with a meter). The Vertex lid is infinitely adjustable, and with a simple turn of the wheel i can wear a tuque (wool hat) underneath the helmet. 

fit is important, i think more people should try out the gear in the store, wear it for ten minutes, move about mimicking the work positions, rather than thinking about the money spent on it...


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## Bermie (Nov 13, 2006)

Jumper said:


> I believe the recommendation is to wear eye protection in addition to the shield, which you unfortunately discovered.
> 
> I have experienced retina tears on the surface of my eye (not related to work) and can honestly say an eye injury is one of the most painful anyone will ever experience. Hope you are OK.



I too have experienced eye injuries, I almost lost my sight as a child when I got poked in the eye. I always wore safety glasses for landscaping, but moving to arb, I figured the mesh face shield was enough, a few weeks ago I got a wake up call, a springy branch flipped up under the face shield and jabbed me in the eyeball. A trip to the ER, scratched eye and thank goodness it was the weekend, time to recover. Now I'm sporting those orange glasses as well!

I find a big part of the problem with wearing PPE, or not, is that if it's not part of the work culture, you're looked on as a pansy, people laugh, call you a show off and stuff like that. I've developed a thick skin and ignore them. I go home at the end of the day with all the bits God gave me still attached!

PS; the surface scratches are in your cornea -the outer covering of the eye, they are painful, feels like sand and glass in your eye, luckily they can heal with no lasting damage depending where and how deep they are. The retina is inside the eye at the back, where the rods and cones do all the amazing light filtering magic to let you see, if your retina is damaged...big trouble...been there survived that!


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## wdchuck (Nov 13, 2006)

BlueRidgeMark said:


> Ear plugs are WAAAAY better than nothing, but they don't do as much as muffs. The reason is that a lot of sound is transmitted through the mastoid bone (right behind your ear), and ear plugs don't stop that at all. A good set of muffs DO reduce that quite a bit.
> 
> If a sound hurts your ears, you passed "permanent damage" a few deciBels back.



I wear earplugs, fully inserted, because the muffs don't cut enough sound. I've worked in shops were we could order any muffs we wanted, I ordered some very nice ones, they were more convenient than earplugs when hands were oily/dirty. 

Now that I only wear hearing protection around power equipment and the kids I have found my hearing to be better after wearing the plugs vs. muffs. This is my personal observation, now, when it get's colder out I wear both, but the difference is hardly noticeable.

I also wear earplugs at concerts and the odd live band bar party. No sense going home half-deef.

Thanks for the info on the mastoid bone, I'll look into that more.

Now, about that question about gloves, what would be some good ones to help reduce the vibe getting through, I wear all leather gloves now, and could use an upgrade for saw-only chores.


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## blis (Nov 13, 2006)

i like the comfort gloves made by husqvarna...









```
Linky
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but IMO, buying a husky helps alot with vibes :hmm3grin2orange: :hmm3grin2orange:


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## wdchuck (Nov 13, 2006)

blis said:


> i like the comfort gloves made by husqvarna...
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Now, all they need is some white tape with *STIHL*over that other name and they'd be wearable in public.:hmm3grin2orange: :sword:


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## Jumper (Nov 13, 2006)

Bermie said:


> I
> 
> PS; the surface scratches are in your cornea -the outer covering of the eye, they are painful, feels like sand and glass in your eye, luckily they can heal with no lasting damage depending where and how deep they are. The retina is inside the eye at the back, where the rods and cones do all the amazing light filtering magic to let you see, if your retina is damaged...big trouble...been there survived that!



I meant cornea-you are right, very PAINFUL! And also right, after a little cleaning of the damaged tissue, I healed good as new.


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## Jumper (Nov 13, 2006)

Bermie said:


> I
> 
> PS; the surface scratches are in your cornea -the outer covering of the eye, they are painful, feels like sand and glass in your eye, luckily they can heal with no lasting damage depending where and how deep they are. The retina is inside the eye at the back, where the rods and cones do all the amazing light filtering magic to let you see, if your retina is damaged...big trouble...been there survived that!



I meant cornea-you are right, very PAINFUL! And also right, after a little cleaning of the damaged tissue, I healed good as new.


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## Bermie (Nov 13, 2006)

Jumper said:


> I meant cornea-you are right, very PAINFUL! And also right, after a little cleaning of the damaged tissue, I healed good as new.



Good news! Stay safe


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## Tom Dunlap (Nov 15, 2006)

This is such an ecouraging thread  

It wasn't too long ago when this topic would have spun down into a spitting match about how silly looking, hard to wear and worthless PPE is. 

Things are looking up!

My hearing pro of choice are Tiger Tails:

http://www.safety.com.sg/hlaccessories.htm


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## OTG BOSTON (Nov 15, 2006)

Tom Dunlap said:


> This is such an ecouraging thread
> 
> It wasn't too long ago when this topic would have spun down into a spitting match about how silly looking, hard to wear and worthless PPE is.
> 
> ...



Hey Tom, are those insert plugs any better or worse for the ears than the traditional ear muff style?


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## blis (Nov 15, 2006)

the best hardhat around (after huskys own)






got older version of that and its great...


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## Tom Dunlap (Nov 15, 2006)

Some people do have problems with inserts. 

Knock on wood...my noggin :bang: I've never had an ear problem using inserts. The TTs are easy to clean as opposed to the foam ones.


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## Sprig (Nov 15, 2006)

I  my foamies, and use them with my 'No-Noise' (made in Sweden)helmet mounted muffs. All inserted ones have different ratings, some are better specifically for high frequencies (those do the most damage) and most have ratings db reductions of between 24-30. Ive used ringed ones (like the type that come with the TTs) and have a whole collection of odd-balls, hard to get a decent fit unless I shell out around 40$ for custom fits (which I lose too, gah). I find the foamies easy to wash with a little hand soap, warm water, and a squeeze in a towel and they're good to go. I always carry a pocket full and use fresh ones whenever I take them out (oily/sawdusty/greasy fingers), especially in wet weather as wet plugs stop doing their job. Keep a bunch inna small ziplock baggy where they'll stay warm and pliable). They are the cheapest piece of PPE and work as long as you don't shove them into da ol' brainpan (and can't get the buggers out), last time I did that I forgot about it till my kid dug it out with 'er teeny fingers lol, sheesh! :bang: . 
But what ever you choose, just do it! This goes for all PPE, buy it, use it, make it second nature. As far as I'm concerned you cannot put a price on your health (until you lose it) and safety.
Ya Ya, :deadhorse:, and well worth beating often imo.



Serge


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## JohN Dee (Nov 16, 2006)

So none of you guys wear a Backbrace?


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## ciscoguy01 (Nov 16, 2006)

*Back Braces*



JohN Dee said:


> So none of you guys wear a Backbrace?



I've heard that those are bad to wear. Alot of people told me that if you do use them you get dependent, and it can cause you to lift improperly thinking there's some magical thing there to protect your back. If lifted correctly you shouldn't have to worry about your back anyways. They also told me that you can really weaken the muscles in your back using these. Anyone else hear anything like that??? I'm not knocking them, just what I heard guy...opcorn:

Hey man, had you ever met Steve Irwin??? He was my fave dude. I was sad about his passing a while back.


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## Jumper (Nov 16, 2006)

*What happens when you don't use PPE/Fall Arrest Gear in ON!*

Ministry of Labour

Seeley's Bay contractor jailed 30 days for health and safety violation

KINGSTON, ON, Oct. 25 /CNW/ - A partner of Peaks & Valleys Contracting, a
roofing contractor based in Seeley's Bay, Ont., was ordered jailed for 30 days
today for a violation of the Occupational Health and Safety Act that resulted
in injuries to a young employee.
On September 14, 2004, a worker fell from a roof about three storeys into
a refuse bin on the ground below. The worker suffered a bruised shin bone.
Just prior to the incident the worker had been instructed by the defendant to
ascend the roof to remove old shingles so they could be replaced. The roof was
about eight metres (27 feet) from the top of the eavestrough to the ground.
The worker had been on the roof for about 10 minutes before falling. It was
the worker's first day on the job. The incident occurred at a shingling
project at row housing on Craig Lane in Kingston. K.B. Home Insulation Ltd., a
Kingston-based contractor, was hired by the row housing's condominium
corporation for the shingling project. K.B. Home Insulation Ltd., in turn,
hired the defendant to do the work.
A Ministry of Labour investigation found the worker was not wearing a
fall harness when ascending the roof. However, as the worker lay injured in
the bin, the defendant put a fall harness on the worker and told the worker to
tell Ministry of Labour investigators the worker had been wearing it while on
the roof. The worker did as instructed.
The defendant pleaded guilty, as an employer, to failing to ensure fall
protection was used by the worker, as required by Section 26.1(2) of the
Regulations for Construction Projects. This was contrary to Section 25(1)(d)
of the act.
The jail term was imposed by Justice of the Peace Fred Ross of the
Ontario Court of Justice in Kingston.
In a separate matter, following a trial, K.B. Home Insulation Ltd. was
found guilty, as a constructor, of the following two violations of the act in
connection with the worker's fall:

<<
1. Failing to ensure the worker was adequately protected by fall
protection, as required by Section 26.1(2) of the Regulations for
Construction Projects. This was contrary to Section 23(1)(b) of the
act.
2. Failing to ensure the worker was adequately trained in the use of
fall protection, as required by Section 26.2 of the Regulations for
Construction Projects. This was contrary to Section 23(1)(b) of the
act.

Justice of the Peace Fred Ross fined the company a total of $43,000,
including $25,000 on the first count and $18,000 on the second count.
In addition to the fines, the court imposed a 25-per-cent victim fine
surcharge, as required by the Provincial Offences Act. The surcharge is
credited to a special provincial government fund to assist victims of crime"


Although this involved a construction project, it could have just as easily been a young worker in tree service sent onto a roof to remove some cut branches. Note that both contractor and subcontractor got dinged concerning this event. Lucky the guy fell into a bin!


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## blis (Nov 16, 2006)

ciscoguy01 said:


> I've heard that those are bad to wear. Alot of people told me that if you do use them you get dependent, and it can cause you to lift improperly thinking there's some magical thing there to protect your back. If lifted correctly you shouldn't have to worry about your back anyways. They also told me that you can really weaken the muscles in your back using these. Anyone else hear anything like that??? I'm not knocking them, just what I heard guy...opcorn:
> 
> Hey man, had you ever met Steve Irwin??? He was my fave dude. I was sad about his passing a while back.



those backbraces offer support to spine and back, which allows you to lift more than your muscles would allow (supporting muscles).... but the thing is that when you use em the supporting muscles get less activation and do not develop at the same rate as back muscles... And when you lift next time without brace the supporting muscles cant afford enough support and SNAP... your back gets hurt...


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## blis (Nov 16, 2006)

ciscoguy01 said:


> I've heard that those are bad to wear. Alot of people told me that if you do use them you get dependent, and it can cause you to lift improperly thinking there's some magical thing there to protect your back. If lifted correctly you shouldn't have to worry about your back anyways. They also told me that you can really weaken the muscles in your back using these. Anyone else hear anything like that??? I'm not knocking them, just what I heard guy...opcorn:
> 
> Hey man, had you ever met Steve Irwin??? He was my fave dude. I was sad about his passing a while back.



those backbraces offer support to spine and back, which allows you to lift more than your muscles would allow (supporting muscles).... but the thing is that when you use em the supporting muscles get less activation and do not develop at the same rate as back muscles... And when you lift next time without brace the supporting muscles cant afford enough support and SNAP... your back gets hurt...


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## Bermie (Nov 16, 2006)

*Pics of NO ppe guy in tree*

I've certainly heard the same thing about backbraces. It goes for knee braces as well. I was told after knee surgery to concentrate on regaining strength in the muscles and get off the brace as soon as possible.

Hey, I took these picture TODAY, I heard some saws on my way home from the post office and doubled back to have a look - guy up a tree - ZIPPO ppe. I stopped and gave them my card, the work was being done at a housing development run by an NGO with their own employees. I know the guy in the tree, he thought he was cool! The wind was blowing right to left in the picture, they almost lost the top backwards where it would have fallen into the road below!
Sorry about the size of pics, someone can resize if they want.


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