# Back at it again!



## oregoncutter (Jul 8, 2009)

Not far from my house, and in an area I have logged in the past these protestors recently setup camp to shut down a timber sale that was allready being harvested. The first big sale I worked on we had a similair thing happen a guy had chained and paddlocked himself to our gate in, and threw away the key. Unfortunately for him he only locked himself to the swinging part of the gate and not the post. We opened the gate with him attached to it, locked it open, and took our time calling the sheriff department they didn't make any haste getting there either so he recieved alot of attention from passersby. I think a pictures worth a thousand words so here it is hopefully it shows up.


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## 2dogs (Jul 8, 2009)

Some people are alive only because it is against the law to call in an air strike.


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## wood4heat (Jul 8, 2009)

oregoncutter said:


> I think a pictures worth a thousand words so here it is hopefully it shows up.



Dang, I was hoping it would be of the guy chained to the open gate.


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## GASoline71 (Jul 8, 2009)

Farkin' hippies...

Gary


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## oregoncutter (Jul 8, 2009)

*might be short lived*

Here was the latest form our local papers website.
ELLIOTT STATE FOREST — Oregon State Police officers were at the site of a logging protest near Loon Lake this morning to ask those involved to leave voluntarily or face arrest.

Protester Jasmine Zimmer-Stucky reported at about 9:40 a.m. that about two dozen officers had arrived at the timber harvest site with a paddy wagon.

OSP Lt. Doug Ladd said earlier this morning that protesters who volunteer to leave would be allowed to do that, but those who refuse will be arrested. Protesters have overturned vehicles to block a logging road. Some are hanging from platforms in the trees to block vehicle access.....

I like that idea throw their stinkin a$$es in paddy wagon and haul em back to Eugene, Portland, Ashland, Big city California or whatever rock they climbed out from under to get here.


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## PB (Jul 8, 2009)

Throw a bar of soap, they will scatter like crazy. Or try some non-organic veggies. 

Healthy forests are working forests.


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## Metals406 (Jul 8, 2009)

Shoot them all in the forehead with pepper-spray paint balls... It's always open season on stupid.


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## hammerlogging (Jul 8, 2009)

If only we could give each of them one chance to drop a nice fine 36" stem they might catch the timber fever like us! Anyone of em could make a fine hand.

That picture was great, but I too was hoping for the dude on the gate.


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## oregoncutter (Jul 8, 2009)

hammerlogging said:


> If only we could give each of them one chance to drop a nice fine 36" stem they might catch the timber fever like us! Anyone of em could make a fine hand.
> 
> That picture was great, but I too was hoping for the dude on the gate.



Yeah, I wish I would have had a camera for the idiot that locked himself to the gate. At that point in my life I was 18 and it was my first day as a chokersetter under a Yarder (TY90) I didn't even have a cell phone back then. The look on his face when I said hey lets just open the gate was one of astonishment, fear, and that universal look of OHH $hit. He never said a word to us, the log truck drivers were stopping at the gate to tighten their binders, take a leak, and check up on him all morning.


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## Meadow Beaver (Jul 8, 2009)

All the hippies should be shipped to North Dakota or another plains state and not be allowed to leave.


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## clutch25 (Jul 8, 2009)

MMFaller39 said:


> All the hippies should be shipped to North Dakota or another plains state and not be allowed to leave.



Hey now!!!!

We don't want them here! Bad enough that Southern MN is full of them!!


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## Meadow Beaver (Jul 8, 2009)

Don't have any here, Southern MN, man their migrating East, get the saws out boys before the hippies stop us.


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## slowp (Jul 8, 2009)

I'd play country music and be eating a lot of meat --set up a barbecue by them. Make sure the meat smell was wafting their way.


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## Meadow Beaver (Jul 8, 2009)

I'd play Despised Icon and roast a pig on a spit.


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## bullbuck (Jul 8, 2009)

...gosh i would hate to be tightening my wrappers at the gate and accidentally slip of my boomer with the business end of my cheater pipe...


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## SURDO (Jul 8, 2009)

We had a similar issue outside of Medford, Oregon with some protesters a couple years back. They cut down a huge old growth Heritage tree that would have never been cut down and put it in the middle of the main road in downtown Medford in front of the Forest Service office. They then decided to handcuff themselves all to the tree stopping traffic for a little while. What we explained to them later was that it was a protected tree and would have never been cut down. IDIOTS. Shoulda seen the looks on their faces. PRICELESS.


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## ridgerunner97 (Jul 8, 2009)

HaHaHa that is absolutely priceless!!!!! Those idiots were so worried about there damn protest they cut down a protected tree, so damn stupid they went and did what they were protesting against. Some people are so worried about some dumbass agenda that seems novel and they fall in with all the sheep and don't think with their own heads. Thank God!!! that we don't have to many around my neck of the woods, well i take that back 1 is too many.:angrysoapbox:


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## SURDO (Jul 8, 2009)

The funniest part about it to me is that they sit in the woods for a couple of hours and what exactly do they accomplish? NOTHING. When has twenty or thirty protesters ever actually stopped a logging strip from being cut? NEVER. They can sit there for a little and think they are making a huge impact but in all reality its going to get cut one way or another.


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## Junior (Jul 8, 2009)

Apparently somebody ignored the "Dumping of trash prohibited" sign. Either that or the short bus got lost again...


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## sILlogger (Jul 8, 2009)

whe don't have many of them here...thank goodness. but there is one that is well known around our national forest. he has spiked trees, set up barbed wire on horse trails, and protests the hell out of everything..........

And lives in a log cabin...


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## Metals406 (Jul 8, 2009)

sILlogger said:


> whe don't have many of them here...thank goodness. but there is one that is well known around our national forest. he has spiked trees, set up barbed wire on horse trails, and protests the hell out of everything..........
> 
> And lives in a log cabin...



Typical of the loony liberal pukes. :rant:


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## [email protected] (Jul 9, 2009)

Fella (Ron) I used to work with has a sister that lives in Grand Forks, B.C. and works as a nurse at the hospital. 

Ron tells me one day way back, the hippies were going to have a good old time logging protest in the hills and blockaded the road in. Problem is, some of the loggers got wind of the protest and blocked the protesters in. Uhh oh, not going to play out well for the protest. After the protest and the road reopened, the ambulance service was called out to render aid to some of the protesters. When the ambulances get to the Grand Forks hospital with hurtin' hippies, they meet logger families that wouldn't allow the ambulances in seeing as timber dollars and loggers helped build the town and hospital. Apparently the ambulances diverted to another town which likely was a good haul to either Osoyoos or Rossland area.

I can't verify whether it's true or not, but boy do I want to believe it. Cool little town Grand Forks, liked it even before that story.


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## oregoncutter (Jul 9, 2009)

On the local news this morning, they said about 50 state troopers, and deputies arrested 23 of the protestors yesterday, and were working on apprehending the ones that were self restrained and in the trees. I can think of a few ways to get em down, or maybe I have too much time on my week off.


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## wvlogger (Jul 9, 2009)

stupid hippies do they not se that if the timber is not harvested then it will just die. i wonder if one has ever wrapped around a tre a cutter was about to cut?


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## wvlogger (Jul 9, 2009)

oregoncutter said:


> On the local news this morning, they said about 50 state troopers, and deputies arrested 23 of the protestors yesterday, and were working on apprehending the ones that were self restrained and in the trees. I can think of a few ways to get em down, or maybe I have too much time on my week off.



break out the saw


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## wood4heat (Jul 9, 2009)

oregoncutter said:


> On the local news this morning, they said about 50 state troopers, and deputies arrested 23 of the protestors yesterday, and were working on apprehending the ones that were self restrained and in the trees. I can think of a few ways to get em down, or maybe I have too much time on my week off.



Link to the story: !!!WARNING GRAPHIC PICS, YOU CAN ALMOST SMELL THE DIRTY HIPPIES!!! http://www.katu.com/news/local/50237102.html


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## wvlogger (Jul 9, 2009)

wood4heat said:


> Link to the story: !!!WARNING GRAPHIC PICS, YOU CAN ALMOST SMELL THE DIRTY HIPPIES!!! http://www.katu.com/news/local/50237102.html



so how much fuel oil and antifreeze was dumped out of that truck


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## fredmc (Jul 9, 2009)

ridgerunner97 said:


> HaHaHa that is absolutely priceless!!!!! Those idiots were so worried about there damn protest they cut down a protected tree, so damn stupid they went and did what they were protesting against. Some people are so worried about some dumbass agenda that seems novel and they fall in with all the sheep and don't think with their own heads. Thank God!!! that we don't have to many around my neck of the woods, well i take that back 1 is too many.:angrysoapbox:



Treehugginhippyfagpukes 

Could you see that happening around here? I can't....Too many of us rednecks clinging to our guns.


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## stihl sawing (Jul 9, 2009)

All of them toe heads need to get out and get a job and contribute to society other that stinkin it up. Cause they sure ain't got nothing to do. They would of course need to take a bath first before employment.


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## oregoncutter (Jul 9, 2009)

*Peaceful earth helping lovers, or terrorists?*

They claim to be peace lovers, and here to save earth but I have seen first hand alot of things that make me feel otherwise. About ten years ago we were cutting a remote unit about 70 miles from town in a national forest, as we were walking out we were greeted by a group of Rainbow members that preached to us about all the things we were doing wrong and how peaceful, and earth loving they are. When we got to my pickup they had it blocked in with a subaru wagon, and a volkswagen bus. I was younger and dumber and started spouting off at the mouth it didn't take long for them to get real unpeaceful. We decided that ten on two wasn't in our favor, but they wouldn't move the cars, I warned em and then proceeded to move em using a little ramming power. I reported the incident to law enforcement, they found them a few days later near an active yarding site which had been subject to fuel, and oil being drained from equipment tanks, and sugar and water being added to equipment no arrests were made due to the fact they could'nt prove they were the troublemakers. Maybe that's why their hippies seems pretty hippocritical to me.


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## PB (Jul 9, 2009)

The Earth Liberation Front spiked some trees in Erie PA where they were building a road. About a month later they set an excavator on fire. Then they set a bunch of SUV's on fire at a dealership. A couple months after that, they set a mink farm on fire. Get this; *THEY FORGOT TO RELEASE THE MINK BEFORE THEY SET IT ON FIRE!!*


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## ridgerunner97 (Jul 9, 2009)

fredmc said:


> Treehugginhippyfagpukes
> 
> Could you see that happening around here? I can't....Too many of us rednecks clinging to our guns.




Haha get it right Mr. Obama said that we are clinging to our bibles and guns something to that respect. LOL, Unfortunately i live exactly 20 some miles from Pittsburgh and these idiots are starting to slowly make there presence felt around my area. I'm not worried because once again as you well know, Pennsylvania is Pittsburgh in the west, Filthadelphia in the east, and ALABAMA in the middle as quoted from my gay professor at college. lol. He got some respect from me for acknowledging our growing minority that we belong to haha.


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## PB (Jul 9, 2009)

ridgerunner97 said:


> Haha get it right Mr. Obama said that we are clinging to our bibles and guns something to that respect. LOL, Unfortunately i live exactly 20 some miles from Pittsburgh and these idiots are starting to slowly make there presence felt around my area. I'm not worried because once again as you well know, Pennsylvania is Pittsburgh in the west, Filthadelphia in the east, and ALABAMA in the middle as quoted from my gay professor at college. lol. He got some respect from me for acknowledging our growing minority that we belong to haha.



I refer to it as Pennsyltuckey. 


I am proud to have grown up in NW PA.


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## slowp (Jul 9, 2009)

Since when does being liberal mean being a hippie tree hugger? I'm a semi middling Liberal, but support logging. It is a truly green industry and sustainability is not just a newly discovered buzz word when it comes to harvesting wood in our area. 

No, your hippie protestors are probably kids who have wealthy parents to support them, or people who rely on trust funds. Maybe it is a class project?
I'd still just barbecue, give the chained up ones lots of coffee and soy milk, and let nature take its course.

Seriously, one Earth Firstie from Texas, called Gypsy, was killed when he got hit by a tree in Humboldt County. He became a martyr. The stupid guy was running up from below the cutter to try to stop the cutting. The protestors wanted the cutter tried for manslaughter. The prosecutor refused. What a mess it was. I felt sorry for the cutter. How dare that idiot wreck a guy's life and I'm talking about wrecking the cutter's life--not the dead guy.


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## PB (Jul 9, 2009)

slowp said:


> Since when does being liberal mean being a hippie tree hugger? I'm a semi middling Liberal, but support logging. It is a truly green industry and sustainability is not just a newly discovered buzz word when it comes to harvesting wood in our area.



I getcha there slowp. I am a bit of a tree-hugger myself but am middle of the road on politics. I liked how they took away our concrete and wood benches here on campus and replaced them with the plastic/wood composite and called it "green". Can't get much "greener" than renewable timber.


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## bullbuck (Jul 9, 2009)

[email protected] said:


> Fella (Ron) I used to work with has a sister that lives in Grand Forks, B.C. and works as a nurse at the hospital.
> 
> Ron tells me one day way back, the hippies were going to have a good old time logging protest in the hills and blockaded the road in. Problem is, some of the loggers got wind of the protest and blocked the protesters in. Uhh oh, not going to play out well for the protest. After the protest and the road reopened, the ambulance service was called out to render aid to some of the protesters. When the ambulances get to the Grand Forks hospital with hurtin' hippies, they meet logger families that wouldn't allow the ambulances in seeing as timber dollars and loggers helped build the town and hospital. Apparently the ambulances diverted to another town which likely was a good haul to either Osoyoos or Rossland area.
> 
> I can't verify whether it's true or not, but boy do I want to believe it. Cool little town Grand Forks, liked it even before that story.



...that story is epic,and i would lean more towards truth,why would you make something like that up?firkin awesome story!ended lunch with the tale today,the boys loved it.


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## Junior (Jul 9, 2009)

I wonder what their signs were made of? Paper or plastic?


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## 1I'dJak (Jul 9, 2009)

and I'm sure they got their own chat forum complaining about rednecks...on and on it goes...hand around hippies I get sick of them...hang around rednecks same thing happens...


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## Jacob J. (Jul 10, 2009)

oregoncutter said:


> They claim to be peace lovers, and here to save earth but I have seen first hand alot of things that make me feel otherwise. About ten years ago we were cutting a remote unit about 70 miles from town in a national forest, as we were walking out we were greeted by a group of Rainbow members that preached to us about all the things we were doing wrong and how peaceful, and earth loving they are. When we got to my pickup they had it blocked in with a subaru wagon, and a volkswagen bus. I was younger and dumber and started spouting off at the mouth it didn't take long for them to get real unpeaceful. We decided that ten on two wasn't in our favor, but they wouldn't move the cars, I warned em and then proceeded to move em using a little ramming power. I reported the incident to law enforcement, they found them a few days later near an active yarding site which had been subject to fuel, and oil being drained from equipment tanks, and sugar and water being added to equipment no arrests were made due to the fact they could'nt prove they were the troublemakers. Maybe that's why their hippies seems pretty hippocritical to me.



Are you talking about the Snog sale? If so, who were you cutting for at the time?


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## oregoncutter (Jul 10, 2009)

I wasn't working the Snog sale, it was on the other side of 138 from us, we were over near BirdsPoint. But Yes it was during that whole mess, and probably the same peaceful protestors. Sometimes I wish the sales weren't made to be such public knowledge.


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## clearance (Jul 10, 2009)

slowp said:


> Seriously, one Earth Firstie from Texas, called Gypsy, was killed when he got hit by a tree in Humboldt County. He became a martyr. The stupid guy was running up from below the cutter to try to stop the cutting. The protestors wanted the cutter tried for manslaughter. The prosecutor refused. What a mess it was. I felt sorry for the cutter. How dare that idiot wreck a guy's life and I'm talking about wrecking the cutter's life--not the dead guy.


I know this sad tale. The faller actually shut off his saw and screamed at them to get the f-out of there. They were warned, had plenty of time to leave, but the cull got what he wanted. 

What would be funny here, if it wasn't so pathetic, is how some want to save "it" from being "destroyed", when it has already been clearcut and grown back. They call it pristine wilderness, its second or third growth, in reality.


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## slowp (Jul 10, 2009)

Here's their website.
http://forestdefensenow.org/

This protest seems to be about protecting FUTURE old growth. What a crock!


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## Meadow Beaver (Jul 10, 2009)

Where abouts is that Umpcoos ridge sale?


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## crashagn (Jul 10, 2009)

Ya know with them hippies and such to get thier attention away from the tree... walk slowly out of the area they are in and while holding up a rolled up joint or a glass pipe/water pipe sort of thing... and the other hand a bigmac from Mcdonalds.. they will follow you drooling..


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## fredmc (Jul 10, 2009)

crashagn said:


> Ya know with them hippies and such to get thier attention away from the tree... walk slowly out of the area they are in and while holding up a rolled up joint or a glass pipe/water pipe sort of thing... and the other hand a bigmac from Mcdonalds.. they will follow you drooling..



Or start a drum circle and they will follow....


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## ridgerunner97 (Jul 10, 2009)

LMAO!!! thats great.


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## eastside (Jul 10, 2009)

it's funny not one person has spoken up against this bashing with some common sense? :censored: here goes. 
as one who generally avoids conflict, it's sad to see people bashing on others saying they're hypocrites and should be contributing members of society, yet are at the forefront of societies degradation by being close-minded and refusing to listen to the opinions/perceptions of others. as a professional forester, i find it much more satisfying to educate people and change the way people think and look at forest operations, rather than create bigger divisions between those with differing opinions. 
now, i am not condoning the effort of the 'stinking fag hippies', but it could be a case of misguided information and while it does 'nothing' it raises awareness and has obviously triggered something within many of you. while it may not prevent logging or cutting of old growth, it is their way of being heard in a field where there is so much policy and litigation that the opinions of all groups are often lost in the political BS. as stewards of the land, it is our duty to act respectfully, as it is the trees and earth that allows us our lively hood. we must educate others on the benefits of forest management and silviculture practices and minimize conflict with those who may not fully understand what is happening. 
i'm sure i will receive a lot of hate for this opinion and point of view, but i figure that one changed mind or the next time that you are dealing with a situation that you will try not let you preconceived notions of 'dirty pot smoking hippies' coincide with the fact that people have different opinions and that educate and respecting another individual is really the best way to get your ideas across.


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## smokechase II (Jul 11, 2009)

*Those people*

These idiots aren't just harmless protestors.

There is a significant dirty tricks component to this movement.

Just because they're stupid doesn't mean they are not dangerous.

=============

The guy I really fear may be limited in his direct involvement but his behind the scenes control could be a serious factor in the stepping up of these protests again.
Particularly the fire bombing.


Tre Arrow is out in a half way house in Portland.


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## smokechase II (Jul 11, 2009)

*Eastside*

They are better than you.

Get ready for your education.


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## eastside (Jul 11, 2009)

smokechase-
i realize that some of the things they do i.e. spiking trees, etc. can be very dangerous and definitely think it stupid. thats what i'm trying to get across. the point being that creating a bigger division between groups doesn't help the situation, it just makes it worse for both sides.

better than me meaning what? i am assuming you mean in their views...while people are hesitant and resist change readily, if you approach most people in a level-headed and respectful manner, more often than not, they will actually listen. as for education, i have dealt with so many different cultures and ideas coming from hawaii being a haole 'white' and have found that above all else that respect is key.


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## bullbuck (Jul 11, 2009)

...i dont think the overturned bus,lock boxes,treesits,or numbnuts running around in an active tree felling area should be percieved as just wanting "to talk things out"over coffee and doughnuts!you can jawjack all you want but "these people" are obviously at war...and should not be taken lightly


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## oregoncutter (Jul 11, 2009)

*Over for now*

Last I heard they had arrested the protestors that refused to leave, and housed them in our county jail. Their spokesperson stated they would regroup, and begin the efforts as soon as everyone is released. Seems like nothing but a big disruptive mess to me.


MMFaller39 said:


> Where abouts is that Umpcoos ridge sale?


 Near a little commmunity called Ash Valley. The ridge it'sself is centered between Lakeside to the West(HWY 101), Kellog to the East(HWY 138), Scottsburg to the North, and Alleghany to the South.


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## oregoncutter (Jul 11, 2009)

*Respect is earned!*



eastside said:


> smokechase-
> i realize that some of the things they do i.e. spiking trees, etc. can be very dangerous and definitely think it stupid. thats what i'm trying to get across. the point being that creating a bigger division between groups doesn't help the situation, it just makes it worse for both sides.
> 
> better than me meaning what? i am assuming you mean in their views...while people are hesitant and resist change readily, if you approach most people in a level-headed and respectful manner, more often than not, they will actually listen. as for education, i have dealt with so many different cultures and ideas coming from hawaii being a haole 'white' and have found that above all else that respect is key.



If someone or some people came in to You're little office, unplugged You're computer, spiked You're keyboard, drained the oil out of You're car, got in You're face and started yelling at You, and preaching how You're killing the enviroment by you're consumption of natural resources, and aiding of the timber industry, would You still respect them, and would it not raise some emotion from within You. I will listen to the educated, and civil opinions of those whose outlooks, and beliefs are different than mine. But the way I was brought up You earn respect, and it's not earned by acting like terrorists, and interfering with peoples livelihoods, or throwing a fit, burning down car dealerships, turning over buses, and making slanderous remarks at people. True not all are like that but this is the way they are representing themselves like it or not, Oregon is a place that has been brought up by our timber industry, and agricultural industry, and no amount of big city, well educated, tree hugging, big money, sweet talking bull$hit by someone whom feels they are deserving respect even considering their behavior is going to sway the opinions of those who have experienced some of the radical ideas, and protests that these folks represent.


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## Gologit (Jul 11, 2009)

oregoncutter said:


> If someone or some people came in to You're little office, unplugged You're computer, spiked You're keyboard, drained the oil out of You're car, got in You're face and started yelling at You, and preaching how You're killing the enviroment by you're consumption of natural resources, and aiding of the timber industry, would You still respect them, and would it not raise some emotion from within You. I will listen to the educated, and civil opinions of those whose outlooks, and beliefs are different than mine. But the way I was brought up You earn respect, and it's not earned by acting like terrorists, and interfering with peoples livelihoods, or throwing a fit, burning down car dealerships, turning over buses, and making slanderous remarks at people. True not all are like that but this is the way they are representing themselves like it or not, Oregon is a place that has been brought up by our timber industry, and agricultural industry, and no amount of big city, well educated, tree hugging, big money, sweet talking bull$hit by someone whom feels they are deserving respect even considering their behavior is going to sway the opinions of those who have experienced some of the radical ideas, and protests that these folks represent.



Well said.


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## ridgerunner97 (Jul 11, 2009)

:agree2: They need to earn respect, not give out disrespect to people who make their livelihood off the timber and preserve it at the same time. Most of the preconceived notions that some people have of these people in this thread are not preconceived they are justified. I am not prejudiced against anybody in particular, except someone that shows up and FORCES their ideas upon me, it could be the pope and hes goin to have a :censored: problem. If they want to talk about there viewpoint then i will listen, when they get beligerent etc. they can expect the same from me. Why is the world so :censored: up?


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## oregoncutter (Jul 11, 2009)

eastside said:


> it's funny not one person has spoken up against this bashing with some common sense? :censored: here goes.
> as one who generally avoids conflict, it's sad to see people bashing on others saying they're hypocrites and should be contributing members of society, yet are at the forefront of societies degradation by being close-minded and refusing to listen to the opinions/perceptions of others. as a professional forester, i find it much more satisfying to educate people and change the way people think and look at forest operations, rather than create bigger divisions between those with differing opinions.
> now, i am not condoning the effort of the 'stinking fag hippies', but it could be a case of misguided information and while it does 'nothing' it raises awareness and has obviously triggered something within many of you. while it may not prevent logging or cutting of old growth, it is their way of being heard in a field where there is so much policy and litigation that the opinions of all groups are often lost in the political BS. as stewards of the land, it is our duty to act respectfully, as it is the trees and earth that allows us our lively hood. we must educate others on the benefits of forest management and silviculture practices and minimize conflict with those who may not fully understand what is happening.
> i'm sure i will receive a lot of hate for this opinion and point of view, but i figure that one changed mind or the next time that you are dealing with a situation that you will try not let you preconceived notions of 'dirty pot smoking hippies' coincide with the fact that people have different opinions and that educate and respecting another individual is really the best way to get your ideas across.



So by being recently educated in forestry will that automaticaly make one an experienced, and professional forester. I attended O.S.U some instructors were pretty biased on the side of enviromentally narrow minded protesting type motivated folks.

Quote from another post by Eastside. (I graduated from Oregon State college of forestry today and my advice would be to get a good background in as much as you can. Be aware that there are some many values held in any forest, so you must be open and willing to listen to the ideas of others in order to make educated and suitable management decisions. Often a decision you make can go against your own beliefs or values as a person, but will be the best management option. Oh yeah, the job market is sh!t right now, so it's the best possible time to be entering school.)


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## slowp (Jul 11, 2009)

eastside said:


> smokechase-
> i realize that some of the things they do i.e. spiking trees, etc. can be very dangerous and definitely think it stupid. thats what i'm trying to get across. the point being that creating a bigger division between groups doesn't help the situation, it just makes it worse for both sides.
> 
> better than me meaning what? i am assuming you mean in their views...while people are hesitant and resist change readily, if you approach most people in a level-headed and respectful manner, more often than not, they will actually listen. as for education, i have dealt with so many different cultures and ideas coming from hawaii being a haole 'white' and have found that above all else that respect is key.



I talk to a lot of people, go on show me trips where we can seldom get folks to walk off the road, and have found that a few people will take in info, and then there's the stubborn ones who have their own agenda. 

A lot of us are just sick and tired of this BS. It has been going on for 30 years now. We've seen the effects--our towns have been ruined along with some pretty good people. We've already compromised. Compromised a lot of businesses into bankruptcy prior to the lumber market crash. When does it stop? 

Now the idiots, and that is what they are, are protesting the cutting of FUTURE old growth (gotta get that Old Growth buzz word worked in.) There's a lot of them who are just doing it for attention. How will talking to them work? Some will just start yelling if you try to discuss things with them. They have time and money to keep it up, loggers don't. Especially now. 

Watch the arrest videos on their website. They are pretty polished in the PR department. They have what you guys would think as their cute chick working as their information dispenser. And they are that well organized to have thought that part out. 

Smokechase II, good detective thinking. I wouldn't have thought of the coincidence between that jerk being in Portland and the start up of this stuff.
I'm thinking you are on to something. 

There's lots of summer left get ready for a .


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## smokechase II (Jul 11, 2009)

*There is more than one species of environmentalist*

Eastside:

Many of the folks I know in the FS have learned a deep distrust of the extreme fractions.

*SlowP said:
"...... go on show me trips where we can seldom get folks to walk off the road, and have found that a few people will take in info, and then there's the stubborn ones who have their own agenda."*

============

I'm gonna go out on a limb here, (get it?), and say that the majority of the folks that were involved in the recent protest mentioned in this thread are not open to *anyone* elses ideas.

They know what is right for the forest. You simply do not.
(Although that I suspect that you do.)

===============

Education is still of great value.

Did anyone else note the "check the media" protocol by an enviro spokesperson regarding this sit?

The more facts we get out the less traction these radicals can get.
Facts like Pondo ecosystems need low intensity fire and with the fuel loads we have now we usually can't get that without mitigating the fuel problems first. Little preaching to the choir is standard in any Eastern Oregon Church.

So by all means go for it on the show me, press tours, school field trips, invitations etc. I was in on a powerpoint that showed objectives to a trail coalation in Bend that was very well appreciated. Only one guys' body posture and lack of questions indicated a waste of his time.

Just don't expect the tree sitting community to convert out of their religion.


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## Metals406 (Jul 11, 2009)

smokechase II said:


> Eastside:
> 
> Many of the folks I know in the FS have learned a deep distrust of the extreme fractions.
> 
> ...



:agree2::agree2:


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## Gologit (Jul 11, 2009)

eastside said:


> smokechase-
> i realize that some of the things they do i.e. spiking trees, etc. can be very dangerous and definitely think it stupid. thats what i'm trying to get across. the point being that creating a bigger division between groups doesn't help the situation, it just makes it worse for both sides.



You realize, of course, that you're not part of the solution. And that makes you part of the problem. Your degree in forestry just means that you got the minimum passing grade on enough exams. It doesn't mean anything other than that. It's certainly not a guarantee that we'll take you seriously if you start spouting nonsense like you have.

I think you're well intentioned, but you're also inexperienced and poorly informed. A little holier-than-thou, too, but we're used to that from people like you and we'll just ignore it. Your lofty idealism and vision of the world as it should be is a fine thing...it just doesn't work out here in the woods.

This is a logger's place and you and your opinions aren't worth an empty snoose can. Best take your cry-baby act on down the road. Find yourself a bunch of bunny fondlers, have a group hug or something. 

I neg-repped your post. You deserved it.


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## Greystoke (Jul 11, 2009)

*Logging Protestors are idiots!*



slowp said:


> Since when does being liberal mean being a hippie tree hugger? I'm a semi middling Liberal, but support logging. It is a truly green industry and sustainability is not just a newly discovered buzz word when it comes to harvesting wood in our area.
> 
> No, your hippie protestors are probably kids who have wealthy parents to support them, or people who rely on trust funds. Maybe it is a class project?
> I'd still just barbecue, give the chained up ones lots of coffee and soy milk, and let nature take its course.
> ...



Out of all the states in the PNW and Alaska that I have worked in, Humboldt County was by far the worst! I could fill five pages of threads on here with stories about ignorant hippie antics in Humboldt, and I was only there for four years! I showed up right after gypsy got himself killed and it was a zoo around that area. I definitely feel for that faller, as I dang near accidentally fell a tree on one too...had a tree faced and was back cutting (picture about a 30 inch tree with a good lean to the gun with about 4 inches of holding wood left with stiff gusts of wind from the backside) when his stupid head popped up in the brush right where I had the tree gunned:jawdrop:hurried up and jammed the wedge back in the undercut and tried to talk the idiot out of there to no avail. Luckily I had a couple of bullbucks with me, and the cops showed up and scared the moron away...that guy was so close to death, and I would have felt responsible for it, and that pisses me off! Those maggots were always trying to make it look like we were trying to hurt or kill them; They even brought cameras to take pictures of us and our pickup license plates...okay, sorry I am ranting:rant:this just really sticks in my craw! It was my understanding that the tree huggers in Humboldt were financed by Sierra Club and others like it, so a note to all reading this: always be sure that you know where your money is going!


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## eastside (Jul 11, 2009)

oregoncutter-
in regards to your reply, i think you make a great point about the fact that they do many ridiculous things and anyone in their right mind has reason to get mad. i would myself, anyone can relate to that. i'm coming from the standpoint that by conciously trying to maintain a non-biased view that more can be done by that than simply beating the :censored: out of each other. i realize that it has been ongoing for many years and those who have dealt with it are probably really over it by now, so my response lacks the first hand experience with it, that many of you have.

as for being a forester, i grew up doing forest work from a very young age and by no means consider an education a holier than thou or 'i'm better than you'. i consider myself a professional from both experience and education, but know that there are many others out there with far more knowledge and experience, even without an education. i consider an education simply supplemental to experience. 

as for goligit- its funny that despite what i have to say that you continue to call names and 'neg-rep' me. firstly, i could care less about a negative internet rating. it just strengthens my opinion that fighting with each other doesn't get anyone further, it only makes a problem worse. i did come from a standpoint of this is how it should be in and 'ideal world', but realize that nothing can be perfect and there will be conflicts, its inevitable. there was in no way any attempt to make myself seem better than anyone or say how people handle themselves is wrong i never said anything bad about anyone, but offered an opinion, so you can take it or leave it, leave it in your case. its a 'forestry and logging' forum, i replied to offer my opinion, sorry i didn't know it was a closed society of opinion and thought here.


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## Gologit (Jul 11, 2009)

eastside said:


> oregoncutter-
> 
> 
> as for goligit- its funny that despite what i have to say that you continue to call names and 'neg-rep' me. firstly, i could care less about a negative internet rating. it just strengthens my opinion that fighting with each other doesn't get anyone further, it only makes a problem worse. i did come from a standpoint of this is how it should be in and 'ideal world', but realize that nothing can be perfect and there will be conflicts, its inevitable. there was in no way any attempt to make myself seem better than anyone or say how people handle themselves is wrong i never said anything bad about anyone, but offered an opinion, so you can take it or leave it, leave it in your case. its a 'forestry and logging' forum, i replied to offer my opinion, sorry i didn't know it was a closed society of opinion and thought here.



I didn't call you any names...I simply described you. I stand by what I said.

You certainly have a right to offer your opinion here, ill informed and ridiculous as it may be. But if my opinion differs from yours, and it does in almost all repects, you have to realize that it's the opinion itself and not the person offering it who is being addressed. You need to work on this.

The Logging and Forestry thread has many many professional loggers in it. We make our money logging and it's also our way of life. We've been dealing with people who try to tell us our business for so long that we've become spring-loaded with defense mechanisms when some outsider, pro or con, tries to tell us our business. This isn't necessarily a bad thing. Unless we, as loggers, speak up when attacked, or even when ill advised as in your case, our industry will continue to suffer from well meaning but basically poorly qualified people who think they know anything at all about the world we work and live in.

So...offer your opinions. But when you get clobbered for them just buck up and learn from it. This ain't a church social.


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## Metals406 (Jul 11, 2009)

Gologit said:


> I didn't call you any names...I simply described you. I stand by what I said.
> 
> You certainly have a right to offer your opinion here, ill informed and ridiculous as it may be. But if my opinion differs from yours, and it does in almost all repects, you have to realize that it's the opinion itself and not the person offering it who is being addressed. You need to work on this.
> 
> ...


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## eastside (Jul 11, 2009)

gologit, you can make whatever assumptions and describe me how ever you see fit. i could care less. it may be "ill informed and ridiculous" to you, but your response to what i offered seems close-minded and bitter to me. i understand there are many pro loggers on this forum and have the upmost respect for what they do. my only intentions when i offered up my initial post was to present another way of looking at things. it's a high profile industry that deals with a lot of conflict, that's just the way it is. as for bucking up, no worries on that, can't make me run away to the bunny-lovers group hug that easy.


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## Metals406 (Jul 11, 2009)

Hey Bob!.. You're gonna get this kid as the forester on your next job! :hmm3grin2orange:


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## Gologit (Jul 12, 2009)

Metals406 said:


> Hey Bob!.. You're gonna get this kid as the forester on your next job! :hmm3grin2orange:



 If I do I'll put him in charge of dealing with the anti-logging protesters. He can be my public relations guy. Maybe he can try out some of his theories, make the world a kinder gentler place, have meaningful dialogues with opposing viewpoints, eat a few granola bars, drink some organic herbal tea, get his picture in the newspapers, maybe even get arrested with them to show his solidarity and dedication to meaningful communication.

Like I said, this kid probably means well. He just hasn't been around long enough to have seen enough real world situations. If his ideas would work I'd be the first person to encourage trying them. I wish his ideas _would_ work...things would be a lot simpler. But they won't. The protesters _want confrontation_. I've been dealing with anti-logging types for enough years to know that every time we concede even the most minor point to them we lose ground. 

Civility doesn't work with people who'll sabotage your equipment and endanger your life. I consider these to be acts of aggression and assault...and if faced with such acts I'll respond accordingly.


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## Metals406 (Jul 12, 2009)

Gologit said:


> If I do I'll put him in charge of dealing with the anti-logging protesters. He can be my public relations guy. Maybe he can try out some of his theories, make the world a kinder gentler place, have meaningful dialogues with opposing viewpoints, eat a few granola bars, drink some organic herbal tea, get his picture in the newspapers, maybe even get arrested with them to show his solidarity and dedication to meaningful communication.
> 
> Like I said, this kid probably means well. He just hasn't been around long enough to have seen enough real world situations. If his ideas would work I'd be the first person to encourage trying them. I wish his ideas _would_ work...things would be a lot simpler. But they won't. The protesters _want confrontation_. I've been dealing with anti-logging types for enough years to know that every time we concede even the most minor point to them we lose ground.
> 
> Civility doesn't work with people who'll sabotage your equipment and endanger your life. I consider these to be acts of aggression and assault...and if faced with such acts I'll respond accordingly.


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## oregoncutter (Jul 12, 2009)

*Typical*



eastside said:


> gologit, you can make whatever assumptions and describe me how ever you see fit. i could care less. it may be "ill informed and ridiculous" to you, but your response to what i offered seems close-minded and bitter to me. i understand there are many pro loggers on this forum and have the upmost respect for what they do. my only intentions when i offered up my initial post was to present another way of looking at things. it's a high profile industry that deals with a lot of conflict, that's just the way it is. as for bucking up, no worries on that, can't make me run away to the bunny-lovers group hug that easy.



I understand the point that Eastside is trying to get across, but the way it was presented was typical of a current or recently graduated college student, it was presented like it was a message from a higher being, and contained alot of comments that could be taken poorly. I think an education is important whether You get it from experience or from a school. Unfortunately alot of today's students have been made to believe they can save the whales, the trees, and make world peace by forcing their opinion on someone from the knowledge, and empowerment they have recieved in school by biased, and arrogant, brainwashing instructors (not all instructors either), I fear alot of these young folks are in for a hard lesson in reality when they enter the real world that has people that will disagree with them and call their bluff when they talk out their a$$. I agree with GOLOGIT after years of having unexperienced or unknowledgeable people try to tell You how to do You're job it gets real old, and I know my first response is to shut em up real quick, or defend myself.


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## PB (Jul 12, 2009)

Gologit said:


> If I do I'll put him in charge of dealing with the anti-logging protesters. He can be my public relations guy. Maybe he can try out some of his theories, make the world a kinder gentler place, have meaningful dialogues with opposing viewpoints, eat a few granola bars, drink some organic herbal tea, get his picture in the newspapers, maybe even get arrested with them to show his solidarity and dedication to meaningful communication.
> 
> Like I said, this kid probably means well. He just hasn't been around long enough to have seen enough real world situations. If his ideas would work I'd be the first person to encourage trying them. I wish his ideas _would_ work...things would be a lot simpler. But they won't. The protesters _want confrontation_. I've been dealing with anti-logging types for enough years to know that every time we concede even the most minor point to them we lose ground.
> 
> Civility doesn't work with people who'll sabotage your equipment and endanger your life. I consider these to be acts of aggression and assault...and if faced with such acts I'll respond accordingly.



See Eastside, you went and pissed off the cranky old man. Now get off his lawn. 

You may have good intentions, but you are also preaching to the people that are not breaking any laws or putting people in danger. They are trying to make a paycheck. I think their reaction is normal, and the protestors are so far out of line in their thoughts and they are the ones that need a dose of common sense. Hard line figures on both sides, long ago, planted the seeds for this "debate" and now people are paying the consequences. I don't know a single person that gives irrational protests any serious thought. If they stood at the gate with signs as the trucks drive by, maybe but when you chain yourself to a gate they are just looking to be on the TV as a martyr to satisfy their need for glory.


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## bullbuck (Jul 12, 2009)

...its funny what an "education"does to some people...i feel for whoever gets that guy on their jobsite...


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## slowp (Jul 12, 2009)

eastside said:


> gologit, you can make whatever assumptions and describe me how ever you see fit. i could care less. it may be "ill informed and ridiculous" to you, but your response to what i offered seems close-minded and bitter to me. i understand there are many pro loggers on this forum and have the upmost respect for what they do. my only intentions when i offered up my initial post was to present another way of looking at things. it's a high profile industry that deals with a lot of conflict, that's just the way it is. as for bucking up, no worries on that, can't make me run away to the bunny-lovers group hug that easy.



If, and I take it you haven't, you experienced what a lot of us (I'm a semi-educated "forester") you'd be bitter too. Take for instance, Clinton's Northwest Forest plan. It has never been implemented fully. Pretty much everything *BUT* the logging part has. How can those of us who have been affected by it not be bitter? Are we supposed to clap our hands cheer at the other jobs created by it? Like slug surveying, lichen surveying, owl surveying, but very little actual work to produce anything useful, unless one is a specialist who will get additional money to perform endless studies. Studies and Surveys...can't have enough....Ooops, I'm getting bitter. 

Meanwhile, you Douglas Countyers better start padding your county with more money. It took more money for Humboldt County to lock up the eco-jerks than they had budgeted for it. If they continue to protest, maybe the county needs an internet site for donations? Maybe somebody ought to remind the protesters that they themselves are taking money that could better be spent on libraries and such. But I don't think they really care about that.


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## peanut (Jul 12, 2009)

wvlogger said:


> so how much fuel oil and antifreeze was dumped out of that truck



yeah?


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## peanut (Jul 12, 2009)

Gologit said:


> I didn't call you any names...I simply described you. I stand by what I said.
> 
> You certainly have a right to offer your opinion here, ill informed and ridiculous as it may be. But if my opinion differs from yours, and it does in almost all repects, you have to realize that it's the opinion itself and not the person offering it who is being addressed. You need to work on this.
> 
> ...



I have to say 3 things: 1. college boy should get a job with the govt. 10 yrs ago I met a gov't inspecter for cattle who insisted the market cycle for beef was this, "cow, bull, steer, what's the difference,for 5 yrs you get milk, then turn the steer into boots and burgers. 2. I can't stomach stupidity or extremism, the hippies and college boy are being extremely stupid. 3. Gologit take the advice of the Gospels "if you find a non-believer shake the dust from your feet and leave". Don't waste your time arguing with fools.


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## peanut (Jul 12, 2009)

Maybe somebody ought to remind the protesters that they themselves are taking money that could better be spent on libraries and such. 


Libraries = books = more dead trees . Your calculus (my 50 cent word of the day) is flawed.


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## slowp (Jul 12, 2009)

peanut said:


> I have to say 3 things: 1. college boy should get a job with the govt. .



Actually, college person could get a job with the govt. if he/she was not to choosy where to go or what to do. There's a lot of openings and more to come. The latest? Hayfork, Collyfonia. They must not have gotten any applicants because they just extended the job applying time.:greenchainsaw:


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## Jacob J. (Jul 12, 2009)

I spent part of a season at Hayfork. It was as much fun as a root canal. A 30-day root canal.


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## Gologit (Jul 13, 2009)

Jacob J. said:


> I spent part of a season at Hayfork. It was as much fun as a root canal. A 30-day root canal.



LOL...Hayfork is better than Hyampom.


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## slowp (Aug 9, 2009)

I'll bump this up. For the first time in a long time, there is a want ad for a TY-90 yarder engineer and hook tender in the Chehalis/Centralia newspaper. It is an Oregon area code.

Also, our local mill is hiring. Strange?


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## Junior (Aug 11, 2009)

slowp said:


> I'll bump this up. For the first time in a long time, there is a want ad for a TY-90 yarder engineer and hook tender in the Chehalis/Centralia newspaper. It is an Oregon area code.
> 
> Also, our local mill is hiring. Strange?



Seen the same ad in the Oregonian...


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## slowp (Aug 12, 2009)

Junior said:


> Seen the same ad in the Oregonian...



It is an Oregon area code.


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