# Building the ultimate sleeper saw.... 46cc Craftsman into a ported 72cc



## Arrowhead (Feb 28, 2013)

I've been wanting to do something like this for awhile. I finally came up with a great combination that will work. The saw is a 46cc Craftsman that I put a ported 72cc top end from a Stihl 038 Mag.  

The Craftsman actually has a mag case, pro style cylinder, adjustable oiler, good av, light and compact. In my opinion, the Craftsman is built much like an 026. Same style case, covers, handles and tank. I've been working on this saw on and off for the last few weeks. I finally got it finished today. I plan on using this saw as my go-to firewood saw. I took it out to the woods and ran almost 2 tanks through it... filling the truck up with firewood. It was a treat to run... what's not to like about an 11lb 12oz 72cc saw. 

I know several of you are thinking..... _will it hold up_? I think it will. Poulan used the same crank, bearings etc. on their 60cc saws. It never missed a lick today, I had the 20" bar buried several times. I plan on using it as much as possible the next few weeks to put it through the test. There's only one way to find out if it will hold together... that's by running the heck out of it. So far the simple 2 shoe clutch is working fine, but a heavier 3 shoe is available if needed. 

The saw preforms great so far. Compared to the 038 Mag, the Craftsman has a smaller case volume, lighter flywheel, lighter crank and lighter clutch... making it very responsive and spools up quick. And only 1/2 the weight of an 038 Mag. 

My goal was to take a below average saw and turn it into something that will turn heads. Using all the original covers and such. Keeping it 100% stock appearing.

*The Craftsman before the transplant*


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## Arrowhead (Feb 28, 2013)

My computer is taking forever to upload the pics.... I'll post what I can, but I most likely will have to finish tomorrow.


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## moody (Feb 28, 2013)

Got any pictures of this chick with her top off? Maybe a video of some chips flyin


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## brokenbudget (Feb 28, 2013)

so is it a stoulan or a stihlan?:msp_unsure:


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## huskydude (Feb 28, 2013)

awesome!!!


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## barneyrb (Feb 28, 2013)

Why ruin a great POULAN of all things......


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## cpr (Feb 28, 2013)

I love mashups. Good work Ed!!!


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## Arrowhead (Feb 28, 2013)

moody said:


> Got any pictures of this chick with her top off? Maybe a video of some chips flyin



The pics are loading now, more soon. I'll do a video tomorrow.


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## Chris-PA (Feb 28, 2013)

A Stoulan saw? Run it like you Stoul it. Stohl?

That's enough punishment for me.


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## excess650 (Feb 28, 2013)

You're a month ahead of schedule.:msp_rolleyes:


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## jughead500 (Feb 28, 2013)

Please do This is Very Interesting.:devil: Details Afterwards Please.:msp_w00t:


I actually have a Scorched 3300 Poulan that would be perfect for this.


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## Arrowhead (Feb 28, 2013)

You can see the similarities to the 026. Av mounts are darn near in the same spot.


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## mactodd (Feb 28, 2013)

I see a run on 3000 series Poulans and aftermarket Stihl jugs in our future...


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## Arrowhead (Feb 28, 2013)

*Taking it apart.*


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## Modifiedmark (Feb 28, 2013)

Dang Ed, you got it done quick! I didnt think it was going to show its face here for a while yet though. 

I can understand your excitement, I'm excited too! I think I can get over the week after next to get my hands on it!


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## Arrowhead (Feb 28, 2013)

*The original jug on the left, the 038 Mag on the right.  *


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## brokenbudget (Feb 28, 2013)

somebody better hurry up with the pics!:camera: gots me an 038 sitting in the shed with a bad bottom end.


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## Arrowhead (Feb 28, 2013)

*I had to notch the fins in a couple areas to make it fit.*


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## tbone75 (Feb 28, 2013)

Oh my ! I have a Craftsman with a bad top end ! uttahere2: That is just to cool !

Got me thinking if something bigger will fit ? LOL


Wat to go Ed !!


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## Arrowhead (Feb 28, 2013)

I milled .018 off the bottom of the jug and had to move the mount holes over a little.











*The flywheel had to be beveled on the backside to clear the transfers on the jug.*





*
I had to remove the little fins near the flywheel also.*


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## Arrowhead (Feb 28, 2013)

*Once I got the jug to fit, I set up the degree wheel to check the timing.*


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## outdoorlivin247 (Feb 28, 2013)

opcorn:


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## Arrowhead (Feb 28, 2013)

Piston looks a little big.


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## moody (Feb 28, 2013)

Saws like this make my sticker peck out opcorn:


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## joe25DA (Feb 28, 2013)

Wow. cant wait to see the finished product! I think the saw was actually 49cc though.


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## brokenbudget (Feb 28, 2013)

so the pin is the same diameter? what about piston/case clearance?:msp_thumbsup:


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## brokenbudget (Feb 28, 2013)

joe25DA said:


> Wow. cant wait to see the finished product! I think the saw as actually 49cc though.



if it was a 2.8, it's 46cc


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## Big_Wood (Feb 28, 2013)

i need to see more ....opcorn:


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## northwoods18 (Feb 28, 2013)

great job!!! can't wait to see the video of that thing eat wood:yourock:...


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## Arrowhead (Feb 28, 2013)

joe25DA said:


> Wow. cant wait to see the finished product! I think the saw as actually 49cc though.



Same as the 2800... 46cc.



brokenbudget said:


> so the pin is the same diameter? what about piston/case clearance?:msp_thumbsup:



It's coming. :msp_wink:


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## rwoods (Feb 28, 2013)

Sure beats any of my sleeper ideas. Very cool. Ron


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## Arrowhead (Feb 28, 2013)

*Porting Pics compared to a stock 038 Mag jug.*


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## Arrowhead (Feb 28, 2013)

Modifiedmark said:


> Dang Ed, you got it done quick! I didnt think it was going to show its face here for a while yet though.
> 
> I can understand your excitement, I'm excited too! I think I can get over the week after next to get my hands on it!



Sounds good. I should have it broke in by then.


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## Arrowhead (Feb 28, 2013)

*The piston had a 12mm pin and the rod had a 10mm pin. We made bushings from Ampco Brass on the lathe... basically a brass with the hardness of a mild steel. They fit nice and snug. I had to trim some off the piston skirts to clear the deck of the saw. I have .030 clearance. I opted to do this rather than relieve the case, to lighten the piston some. There is still plenty skirt not to freeport. *

















*I trimmed more than this, this was just a start.*


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## Arrowhead (Feb 28, 2013)

*Piston before and after... *


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## axlr8 (Feb 28, 2013)

VIdeo needed.


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## tomdcoker (Feb 28, 2013)

Arrowhead said:


> *Piston before and after... *



Looks very good Ed. I am waiting on a video. Tom


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## Arrowhead (Feb 28, 2013)

*The rod has the same width as the 038 Mag so the piston was a perfect fit.*


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## Arrowhead (Feb 28, 2013)

Rest of the pics tomorrow Gents. My Son started a download on his PS3, so loading pics will be almost impossible. I'll let them load overnight. 
Plus I'm tired.


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## 3000 FPS (Feb 28, 2013)

I am very impressed with the work so far and your vision for doing such a Mod. It shows your over all knowlege of many different brands of saws and your skills as a mechanic and machinist. I like it.

I tried to rep you but I have to spread some around.


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## thomas1 (Feb 28, 2013)

Arrowhead said:


> I've been wanting to do something like this for awhile.
> 
> *The Craftsman before the transplant*



Nice work, Ed! That Craftsman looks familiar. :msp_wink:


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## thomas1 (Feb 28, 2013)

Do your bushings have a lip to contain the piston pin? Then the circlips hold the bushing?


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## z71mike (Feb 28, 2013)

Awesome. Lovin it.


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## trophyhunter (Mar 1, 2013)

Arrowhead is the mad scientist of chainsaw mods! Coolest AS thread ever I can't wait to see that thing growl and rip chips.


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## Itsme7 (Mar 1, 2013)

Slick looking project! Cant wait to see more pics/vids!


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## wigglesworth (Mar 1, 2013)

Ed, your a sick and twisted man..... That's why I like ya. 



Arrowhead said:


> *Once I got the jug to fit, I set up the degree wheel to check the timing.*



So, what numbers did ya end up with? Cutting the skirt take your intake way up? 

Also, What was the stroke difference between em?


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## sawfun9 (Mar 1, 2013)

Congratulations on capturing the true essence of hot rodding so rarely seen today. It's like the days of V8 Pinto's and Vega's or model T's with big V8's. Anyone remember Opel GT's with 354 and 392 hemi's? Take the bigest engine you can get and put it in the smallest and lightest car. We sure scraped a lot of good Impala's, Imperials, and Ford LTD's just for the big blocks that we put into Camaros, Novas, Challangers, and Mustangs.


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## 3000 FPS (Mar 1, 2013)

wigglesworth said:


> Ed, your a sick and twisted man..... That's why I like ya.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I don't know wigglesworth I think I might like Arrowhead's craftsman better, not that your sleeper isn't cool also. :msp_rolleyes:


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## Dan_IN_MN (Mar 1, 2013)

Arrowhead said:


> *You can see the similarities to the 026. Av mounts are darn near in the same spot.*



Would the 038 top end go on an 026?


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## mt.stalker (Mar 1, 2013)

:msp_w00t: WOW , Brilliant !!! I'm drooling on the keyboard . I hope she screams .


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## Rudolf73 (Mar 1, 2013)

Just passing around some opcorn:


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## Nardoo (Mar 1, 2013)

Ed, that is cool. And I like the fact that you based it on a US made Poulan.


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## RBurtcher (Mar 1, 2013)

Nice!

"It don't fit". 
"It will in a minute or so". 
"What about that clearance"? 
" Mill will take care of that no problem".

Custom. Good job Mr.


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## bcorradi (Mar 1, 2013)

manyhobies said:


> Would the 038 top end go on an 026?



Nope, but an 028 super top end would work with some machinework.


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## LegDeLimber (Mar 1, 2013)

I haven't read all of the Earthquake thread.
Are they working on anything like this yet?

Damn!! i miss being in a job shop machine shop.


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## Metals406 (Mar 1, 2013)

Ed, I poo'd a little. . . :msp_ohmy:


Looking forward to more! Great project!


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## Cannon51 (Mar 1, 2013)

thomas1 said:


> Do your bushings have a lip to contain the piston pin? Then the circlips hold the bushing?



I was worried about that too.
Cannon


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## DSS (Mar 1, 2013)

I got me a craftsman like that. Cool bananas.


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## joe25DA (Mar 1, 2013)

Arrowhead said:


> Same as the 2800... 46cc.
> 
> 
> Brain lapse.
> ...


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## Adirondackstihl (Mar 1, 2013)

opcorn:


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## 2Twannabe (Mar 1, 2013)

Man, that's awesome! Makes me wish I had a machine shop, knowledge, and a pile of old saws. Can't wait to see the videos.


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## Streblerm (Mar 1, 2013)

That is freaking awesome. And I thought my 60cc poulan was a sleeper. The AM 038 parts are even cheaper than the OEM 60cc poulan top end. I may have to consider a project like this. I'm amazed that it went together as (relatively) easily as it did. Great work. 

This would be a great upgrade for the 330/380/3450/3750 series of saws. They are very similar. I may be wrong but I was under the impression that the crankcase was a bit wider. It may reduce some of the clearancing that needed to be done on the cylinder and flywheel.

Freaking Awesome!!!:msp_thumbsup::msp_thumbsup::msp_thumbsup:


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## steve316 (Mar 1, 2013)

*sleeper*

Arrowhead do you have finished weight for your creation; great post. Steve


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## MnSam (Mar 1, 2013)

This is much more interesting than the earthquake thread :hmm3grin2orange:


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## Jacob J. (Mar 1, 2013)

DSS said:


> I got me a craftsman like that. Cool bananas.



Are you going to put an 056 Magnum top end on yours?


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## outdoorlivin247 (Mar 1, 2013)

Hmmmm, must be sleeping in this morning...:msp_sleep:


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## 8433jeff (Mar 1, 2013)

Jacob J. said:


> Are you going to put an 056 Magnum top end on yours?



Love to see that with the dual port exhaust towards the back.

Ed, I would have waited for a buildoff, at least a race of some sort. Wheres the guy that said Poulans were nothing but complete junk? I don't think a MS250 could absorb that much extra power. I have doubts that an 026 would hold up.


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## 8433jeff (Mar 1, 2013)

outdoorlivin247 said:


> Hmmmm, must be sleeping in this morning...:msp_sleep:



So you do still walk this earth.


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## Mastermind (Mar 1, 2013)




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## watsonr (Mar 1, 2013)

Maybe you should sell the bushing so everybody can do this mod... flywheel too?


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## Arrowhead (Mar 1, 2013)

I've been fighting with the stomach flu all week.... I think it won this morning. :msp_sad:


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## 8433jeff (Mar 1, 2013)

Arrowhead said:


> I've been fighting with the stomach flu all week.... I think it won this morning. :msp_sad:



Get well soon, Arrowhead.:msp_smile:


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## Arrowhead (Mar 1, 2013)

3000 FPS said:


> I am very impressed with the work so far and your vision for doing such a Mod. It shows your over all knowlege of many different brands of saws and your skills as a mechanic and machinist. I like it.
> 
> I tried to rep you but I have to spread some around.



Thank you, but I'm not a machinist, just a beginner trying to learn. My friend is the experienced machinist, he was coaching me. 



thomas1 said:


> Nice work, Ed! That Craftsman looks familiar. :msp_wink:



Yep. 



thomas1 said:


> Do your bushings have a lip to contain the piston pin? Then the circlips hold the bushing?



Tom, the bushings has a very slight taper on the end. They get installed from the center of the piston with the taper towards the rod. They basically lock into place.


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## thomas1 (Mar 1, 2013)

Arrowhead said:


> Thank you, but I'm not a machinist, just a beginner trying to learn. My friend is the experienced machinist, he was coaching me.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



If you need another Craftsman, I think I saw one in the pile at one of my local dealers.


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## Arrowhead (Mar 1, 2013)

wigglesworth said:


> So, what numbers did ya end up with? Cutting the skirt take your intake way up?
> 
> Also, What was the stroke difference between em?



The timing numbers were EX. 106
TR. 130
IN. 77

I may go back and raise the transfers some. 

I adjusted them to ... EX. 100
TR. 130
IN. 80

The stroke is the same on both. There was plenty of skirt. That's how I adjusted the number, by trimming the skirt instead of dropping the port.


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## Arrowhead (Mar 1, 2013)

*The jug is done and fits. *


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## Hedgerow (Mar 1, 2013)

opcorn:...


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## Arrowhead (Mar 1, 2013)

*I used an intake from an 044. The original was tiny. *






*Here's how the original looked.*







*I had to Dremel the plastic opening larger to fit the bigger intake.*






*Here's how it looks now.*


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## Arrowhead (Mar 1, 2013)

*ModifiedMark was nice enough to tell me the larger carb that is a direct bolt on. It's an HDA ?? ( I forget). He did tell me that series carb had some issues. I thought I bought an nos older one (before the problems). But I'm thinking not. The low screw is probably 2.5 full turns out. :msp_mellow:
It 4 strokes fine, but something don't seem right with the carb. Maybe Mark will chime in and explain the issues. New carb is on the right.*


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## DSS (Mar 1, 2013)

Jacob J. said:


> Are you going to put an 056 Magnum top end on yours?




Allegedly...


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## tbone75 (Mar 1, 2013)

Bolt on kits ?  Once your set up , you could put out a few a day ! :hmm3grin2orange:


I would take one !!


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## tbone75 (Mar 1, 2013)

DSS said:


> Allegedly...



Was wondering where rubber udders was hiding ! :msp_w00t:


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## Arrowhead (Mar 1, 2013)

*I had to turn the jug bolts way down and grind on the jug some, just to get the heads to fit. 
I used a pop-can gasket and ended up with a .019 squish. The comp was 150 after assembly, I haven't checked it after it ran.*


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## outdoorlivin247 (Mar 1, 2013)

tbone75 said:


> Bolt on kits ?  Once your set up , you could put out a few a day ! :hmm3grin2orange:
> 
> 
> I would take one !!



Way to much work with bolt on kits!!! 

I think I will just stop by his shop someday and when he is not looking and steal the completed product...


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## Stihlofadeal64 (Mar 1, 2013)

opcorn:
I'm in a waiting on the video!


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## Arrowhead (Mar 1, 2013)

*You can see how little room there was for the bolt heads. The new holes are the larger ones. *


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## tbone75 (Mar 1, 2013)

outdoorlivin247 said:


> Way to much work with bolt on kits!!!
> 
> I think I will just stop by his shop someday and when he is not looking and steal the completed product...



Didn't think of that ! Why build it if you can stihl it ! :msp_rolleyes:


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## Arrowhead (Mar 1, 2013)

Stihlofadeal64 said:


> opcorn:
> I'm in a waiting on the video!



I gonna try like heck to do one today, but I feel like crap. Might have to wait till tomorrow though. :msp_unsure:


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## 8433jeff (Mar 1, 2013)

tbone75 said:


> Didn't think of that ! Why build it if you can buy the factory! :msp_rolleyes:



Been the Huskavarna way for a long time.


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## ckelp (Mar 1, 2013)

Arrowhead said:


> I've been fighting with the stomach flu all week.... I think it won this morning. :msp_sad:



i hate it when it gets to the point that it's coming out of both ends and you say #### it and crawl into the bathtub


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## Overtrained (Mar 1, 2013)

Nice job Arrowhead


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## Arrowhead (Mar 1, 2013)

*I used the factory 2 shoe clutch with a rim drum. So far so good. A heavier 3 shoe is available if needed though. *


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## Arrowhead (Mar 1, 2013)

*I used Marks method of dual porting the muffler.*

*I cut a slot with the dremmel. *






*Then I heated it up and lightly lifted the edge with an old screwdriver.*





*
Finished dual port. Factory look. *


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## tbone75 (Mar 1, 2013)

8433jeff said:


> Been the Huskavarna way for a long time.



Sad truth ! Won't be long , the only saws left will be Husky and Stihl ! Maybe ?


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## andrethegiant70 (Mar 1, 2013)

Arrowhead said:


> *I used Marks method of dual porting the muffler.*
> 
> *I cut a slot with the dremmel. *
> 
> ...




You'd better do about 4 more of those. 

I'm just thinking that anyone who hears it fire up is going to know SOMETHING is up. Heck, you'll be lucky if that saw doesn't just rear up and punch somebody in the face!!

Helluva project.


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## brokenbudget (Mar 1, 2013)

Arrowhead said:


> *I used the factory 2 shoe clutch with a rim drum. So far so good. A heavier 3 shoe is available if needed though. *



the clutch/drum assembly from a 3400-3700etc. will also fit.:hmm3grin2orange:


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## Jimmy in NC (Mar 1, 2013)

Everything about this build has come out so clean, I know it took lots of thinking and head scratching. This is the coolest saw I've seen in awhile.


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## 8433jeff (Mar 1, 2013)

Jimmy in NC said:


> Everything about this build has come out so clean, I know it took lots of thinking and head scratching. This is the coolest saw I've seen in awhile.



Its a typical Ed project.


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## Arrowhead (Mar 1, 2013)

*I used part of an 036 air deflector to strengthen the back side of the muffler. I cut it and welded it on the inside. That also gave me the proper bolt pattern.*











*Here's the finished muffler. I port matched the opening. *


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## Arrowhead (Mar 1, 2013)

*I had to trim a little under the cover. The plug is more angled with the Stihl jug. I had to cut a notch to make it fit. *





*
I had a new air filter I installed.*


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## Blazin (Mar 1, 2013)

Pretty awesome job Ed!  Musta got bored putting fangs on whitetails eh :hmm3grin2orange:


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## Arrowhead (Mar 1, 2013)

*The finished powerhead weighs in at 11lbs 12oz.* 






*






Here it is with a 20" 3/8 bar.*


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## Trx250r180 (Mar 1, 2013)

whole new meaning to a frankensaw ,nice work ,cant wait to see it come to life


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## Dan_IN_MN (Mar 1, 2013)

Looks like a hot thread! 29 viewers! Great work! Hope you feel better real soon!

Are you planning on replacing the muffler bolts with SHCScrews?


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## 8433jeff (Mar 1, 2013)

Would swapping out the starter handle give it away, or doesn't it give any trouble with snatchback?


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## Arrowhead (Mar 1, 2013)

manyhobies said:


> Looks like a hot thread! 29 viewers! Great work! Hope you feel better real soon!
> 
> Are you planning on replacing the muffler bolts with SHCScrews?
> 
> I'm just going to stick with the ones I put on it already.





8433jeff said:


> Would swapping out the starter handle give it away, or doesn't it give any trouble with snatchback?



It would probably help. lol
The original is the smallest I've ever seen. You have to _concentrate_ when starting it. lol


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## LegDeLimber (Mar 1, 2013)

But are Ya gonna sell T-shirts ?

I think MasterMind may have the copyright on the ported ones.


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## Arrowhead (Mar 1, 2013)

*Oh Yea... a Stihl 3/4 wrap from an 044 bolts right on. *


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## 8433jeff (Mar 1, 2013)

Now you are entering the Matrix, my friend.


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## Gushh (Mar 1, 2013)

Amazing build!

I wouldn't bother with SHCs on the muffler, but I would add some lock washers.


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## Mastermind (Mar 1, 2013)

Forkin awesome Ed


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## BIG JAKE (Mar 1, 2013)

Very slick indeed! Nice work-looking forward to the video


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## Trx250r180 (Mar 1, 2013)

bet that little dude will pull a 28 inch bar real nice ,if the oiler will keep up


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## Arrowhead (Mar 1, 2013)

There is still considerably more I can do to the saw... advance ignition timing, increase the compression, full circle crank, I can go larger with the ports... etc.
I want to put many hours on it cutting wood, before I push the envelope anymore. 

Right now I'd like to figure out the carb thing. Anybody know of a direct bolt on that would work?


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## 54stude (Mar 1, 2013)

Arrowhead said:


> *Oh Yea... a Stihl 3/4 wrap from an 044 bolts right on. *



And that is how the legendary Craftsman model 3844 was born...


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## Arrowhead (Mar 1, 2013)

trx250r180 said:


> bet that little dude will pull a 28 inch bar real nice ,if the oiler will keep up



I think it will. I had the oiler maxed out yesterday while cutting. It had more than enough on the 20".


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## 8433jeff (Mar 1, 2013)

trx250r180 said:


> bet that little dude will pull a 28 inch bar real nice ,if the oiler will keep up



When they work, they do OK. And somebody seeing a 28"er would know something was up.

They sell the almost same size saw, I suspect with strato or whatever now, with 20" and 3/8's on it new. And it does OK. 

I don't think its keeping up with Ed, though.


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## Gushh (Mar 1, 2013)

I would so buy this... How much you reckon the shipping would cost to Argentina? :msp_w00t:


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## Trx250r180 (Mar 1, 2013)

all it needs now is some mini dual dogs off an 026/036 :hmm3grin2orange:


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## barneyrb (Mar 1, 2013)

barneyrb said:


> Why ruin a great POULAN of all things......



Ok, I'll have a side of dirty rice and jambalaya with my crow.......maybe some gumbo for an appetizer. It looks like it will be a great runner, just gotta ask one question, What made you decide on using the 038?


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## Arrowhead (Mar 1, 2013)

barneyrb said:


> Ok, I'll have a side of dirty rice and jambalaya with my crow.......maybe some gumbo for an appetizer. It looks like it will be a great runner, just gotta ask one question, What made you decide on using the 038?



I had to stay with the 34mm stroke. The 038 Mag was the largest top end that I had with a 34mm stroke.
I started to do another one with an 036 top end. That uses a 10mm pin, so no bushings are needed. I notched the fins to get the jug to fit. Then I checked the squish and found out it had .070ish. So I quit then. If somebody knows a piston with a taller pin to crown height than an 036, that mod would be even easier. Still need to cut the flywheel though and remove the fins on the transfers.


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## Warped5 (Mar 1, 2013)

Post #126 ....


Ed, you're quickly gaining on the T-shirt thread ....


.... damn nice saw, BTW. :msp_thumbup:


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## tbone75 (Mar 1, 2013)

Carb maybe ? HDB came off a Poulan ? I know it bolts up right.


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## Arrowhead (Mar 1, 2013)

tbone75 said:


> Carb maybe ? HDB came off a Poulan ? I know it bolts up right.



That looks great!! Mine is a 16mm venturi. What is the number on it... HDB??


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## tbone75 (Mar 1, 2013)

Arrowhead said:


> That looks great!! Mine is a 16mm venturi. What is the number on it... HDB??



8C on the side , top has 21-263-3-2


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## tbone75 (Mar 1, 2013)

I can send it out Mon. if you want it ?


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## Arrowhead (Mar 1, 2013)

Dang. Mine measures the same in that spot. The venturi inside is 16.6 on that carb according to Walbro.
The one I have is the same size.

I don't think a video is going to happen today. It's cold, windy and snowing here. I'm sitting here with a heating pad on my back and a blanket over me.... I'm still cold. :msp_unsure:


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## Arrowhead (Mar 1, 2013)

tbone75 said:


> I can send it out Mon. if you want it ?



Thanks!! I'd like to try it. I can always send it back on our next trade if it doesn't make a difference. 

I noticed that the HDB 1, 2, 4, 5 all have 19mm venturies according to Walbro. I'll take a look at them also.


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## cowroy (Mar 1, 2013)

As much as we all would love to see it run Ed, we would rather yo be healthy doing it. Get well soon! This is the same crowd that waited on the 562 Husky, and the 461 Stihl, so I think a day or three won't hurt us. :msp_wink:


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## Scooterbum (Mar 1, 2013)

Nice build Ed. Gotta love it when someone thinks outside the box !!!

Looking forward to a video................


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## Arrowhead (Mar 1, 2013)

cowroy said:


> As much as we all would love to see it run Ed, we would rather yo be healthy doing it. Get well soon! This is the same crowd that waited on the 562 Husky, and the 461 Stihl, so I think a day or three won't hurt us. :msp_wink:



Thank You. 
I'm hoping for tomorrow.


----------



## tbone75 (Mar 1, 2013)

Arrowhead said:


> Thanks!! I'd like to try it. I can always send it back on our next trade if it doesn't make a difference.
> 
> I noticed that the HDB 1, 2, 4, 5 all have 19mm venturies according to Walbro. I'll take a look at them also.



I don't need it ! Been laying here 2 years now ! LOL It will go out Mon.

Sure hope it works !


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## Warped5 (Mar 1, 2013)

cowroy said:


> As much as we all would love to see it run Ed, we would rather yo be healthy doing it. Get well soon! This is the same crowd that waited on the 562 Husky, and the 461 Stihl, so I think a day or three won't hurt us. :msp_wink:




Yah .. and the same crowd that continues to wait for the Echo twin .... :hmm3grin2orange:

(Sorry, Randy. Couldn't resist.)

Get well quick, Ed!

... Seems to me to be a good time for a saw-hunting foray into IL ... :smile2:


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## Mastermind (Mar 1, 2013)

Warped5 said:


> Yah .. and the same crowd that continues to wait for the Echo twin .... :hmm3grin2orange:
> 
> (Sorry, Randy. Couldn't resist.)
> 
> ...


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## joatmon (Mar 1, 2013)

Scooterbum said:


> Nice build Ed. Gotta love it when someone thinks outside the box !!!
> 
> Looking forward to a video................



Heck, that's nothing! You see Ed's latest?

Ed researches his next saw project


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## Tractorsaw1 (Mar 1, 2013)

Ok, I need one of these projects. Just left a message to a clist add. Let me know who wants to unload a lowly 2.8 crapsman. My buddy will never believe it when I out cut his 038 super!


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## RedneckChainsawRepair (Mar 1, 2013)

Wow this project floored me.  WTG :msp_thumbup:

Isnt the poulan 32mm stroke though? With a 52mm bore would be 67.98cc 68cc Where the 038 mag uses 34mm stroke for 72.2cc. 


Way to think out of the box.


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## ckelp (Mar 1, 2013)

joatmon said:


> Heck, that's nothing! You see Ed's latest?
> 
> Ed researches his next saw project


the trick is to fold the paper in half longways first..


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## MnSam (Mar 1, 2013)

Great work Edward Fronkenshtine. Very inspiring. I'm sure I'm not the only one staring at the wall, rubbing my chin, and spit balling what the heck could rival this creation.


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## Jeff Lary (Mar 1, 2013)

Great job Ed !


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## Eccentric (Mar 1, 2013)

Arrowhead said:


> I had to stay with the 34mm stroke. The 038 Mag was the largest top end that I had with a 34mm stroke.
> I started to do another one with an 036 top end. That uses a 10mm pin, so no bushings are needed. I notched the fins to get the jug to fit. Then I checked the squish and found out it had .070ish. So I quit then. *If somebody knows a piston with a taller pin to crown height than an 036, that mod would be even easier.* Still need to cut the flywheel though and remove the fins on the transfers.



A Husky 61 has a 34mm stroke and a 48mm bore. Not sure what the crown to pin measurement is....and can't remember the pin diameter right now. You're gonna end up with 61.5cc using an 036 top end. A Poulan 3500 is 60cc (and that top end bolts onto a 2800 Poulan). Not sure if your 036 hybrid is worth the trouble. 72cc sure is though.

Have you looked into using a 268XP or 272XP top end? Again....I can't remember the pin diameter, pin-crown measurement,or rod small end width for that saw series. They also have 34mm stroke measurements........and have 50mm & 52mm bore measurements (respectively). that series (61-thru-272XP) also doesn't use a spigot on the cylinder and a boot........but instead uses a rigid intake manifold. Maybe you could make up your own spigot that bolts to the cylinder...

Model Profile: 61 RANCHER

Model Profile: 036 AVSEQ

Model Profile: 266XP

Model Profile: 272XP


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## brokenbudget (Mar 1, 2013)

10mm 044? i otstir:


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## Arrowhead (Mar 1, 2013)

JeremiahJohnson said:


> Wow this project floored me.  WTG :msp_thumbup:
> 
> Isnt the poulan 32mm stroke though? With a 52mm bore would be 67.98cc 68cc Where the 038 mag uses 34mm stroke for 72.2cc.
> 
> ...



It's 34mm. I measured it and checked info on it. 




brokenbudget said:


> 10mm 044? i otstir:



I thought of that, but the 044 has a 36mm stroke. Can be done, but more work than I wanted.


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## Arrowhead (Mar 1, 2013)

Eccentric said:


> A Husky 61 has a 34mm stroke and a 48mm bore. Not sure what the crown to pin measurement is....and can't remember the pin diameter right now. You're gonna end up with 61.5cc using an 036 top end. A Poulan 3500 is 60cc (and that top end bolts onto a 2800 Poulan). Not sure if your 036 hybrid is worth the trouble. 72cc sure is though.
> 
> Have you looked into using a 268XP or 272XP top end? Again....I can't remember the pin diameter, pin-crown measurement,or rod small end width for that saw series. They also have 34mm stroke measurements........and have 50mm & 52mm bore measurements (respectively). that series (61-thru-272XP) also doesn't use a spigot on the cylinder and a boot........but instead uses a rigid intake manifold. Maybe you could make up your own spigot that bolts to the cylinder...
> 
> ...



A solid intake is in the future for sure. The 044 works OK, but there is a slight offset in it that I don't like.


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## echoshawn (Mar 1, 2013)

can't believe it took me this long to stumble on this thread.... subscribed.. opcorn:


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## rmh3481 (Mar 1, 2013)

Great project!

The largest HDA carb is going to have a 16.7mm venturi with a 20.56mm throttle bore and a 22mm choke plate. You can open these up a little. Otherwise your into WJ territory and those carbs have the diagonal mount.


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## Arrowhead (Mar 1, 2013)

What do you builders think of raising the transfers some? They are at 130 now. Exhaust is 100. I was thinking 122ish.


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## barneyrb (Mar 1, 2013)

Arrowhead said:


> What do you builders think of raising the transfers some? They are at 130 now. Exhaust is 100. I was thinking 122ish.



Ed, I'm just a dumb country boy but I think I would split that in half, 126 or so, you can always go back in and remove more, can't add it back......


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## locofrog (Mar 1, 2013)

you sir.... 
are amazing. great vision of projects' end and good follow through. seriously bro you have an amazing saw here and i can't wait for video.

loco


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## Arrowhead (Mar 1, 2013)

barneyrb said:


> Ed, I'm just a dumb country boy but I think I would split that in half, 126 or so, you can always go back in and remove more, can't add it back......



Very true. I usually like 20 degrees of blowdown, figured I give the 30 a try since that's where they were. I think there is a lot more to be had if I get the transfers closer to 120.


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## Modifiedmark (Mar 1, 2013)

Arrowhead said:


> *ModifiedMark was nice enough to tell me the larger carb that is a direct bolt on. It's an HDA ?? ( I forget). He did tell me that series carb had some issues. I thought I bought an nos older one (before the problems). But I'm thinking not. The low screw is probably 2.5 full turns out. :msp_mellow:
> It 4 strokes fine, but something don't seem right with the carb. Maybe Mark will chime in and explain the issues. New carb is on the right.*




Ed, I have a HDA 137 here thats the same size that I have been saving for a project. I'll rebuild it and bring it with me or send it to you to try. Thats the earlier version of the HDA 164 that you got. 

Seens some 164s were fine and just the later ones had some bad ones pop up from time to time. Kinda like that Husky deal with those Walbros.


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## RedneckChainsawRepair (Mar 1, 2013)

Arrowhead said:


> It's 34mm. I measured it and checked info on it.



Just giving you a heads up. The 3000 305 3300 365 330 3750 etc etc are all 32mm stroke in those series of saws. :msp_wink:

Do the math 49mm bore x 32mm stroke 60cc 3750 380 365 3500. 46.5mm bore x 32mm stroke 54cc 330 3300. 44mm bore x 32mm 49cc 3000 305 etc 

I dont know what the bore of 2800 2900 is but 32mm stroke x 42.5mm bore 45.4cc or 43mm bore 46.4cc


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## Modifiedmark (Mar 1, 2013)

brokenbudget said:


> the clutch/drum assembly from a 3400-3700etc. will also fit.:hmm3grin2orange:



Really, I never thought to look at that! 



8433jeff said:


> Would swapping out the starter handle give it away, or doesn't it give any trouble with snatchback?



I know a guy who can hook him up with a handle thats original and a little bigger, and will probably be a good idea. 




8433jeff said:


> When they work, they do OK. And somebody seeing a 28"er would know something was up.
> 
> They sell the almost same size saw, I suspect with strato or whatever now, with 20" and 3/8's on it new. And it does OK.
> 
> I don't think its keeping up with Ed, though.



Probably have to find a old 28" bar in the 276 Mac mount to use on that. 



JeremiahJohnson said:


> Just giving you a heads up. The 3000 305 3300 365 330 3750 etc etc are all 32mm stroke in those series of saws. :msp_wink:
> 
> Do the math 49mm bore x 32mm stroke 60cc 3750 380 365 3500. 46.5mm bore x 32mm stroke 54cc 330 3300. 44mm bore x 32mm 49cc 3000 305 etc
> 
> I dont know what the bore of 2800 2900 is but 32mm stroke x 42.5mm bore 45.4cc or 43mm bore 46.4cc



Yeah I think your right, those saws all use the same crank.


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## Modifiedmark (Mar 1, 2013)

trx250r180 said:


> all it needs now is some mini dual dogs off an 026/036 :hmm3grin2orange:



Naw, no need, I just need to find another 61 266, 272 etc type dogs and I will fix him up with a set like this.


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## brokenbudget (Mar 1, 2013)

Modifiedmark said:


> Really, I never thought to look at that!



don't know if the side cover would go on, i know it wouldn't if it had a chainbrake, just had the 2 saws apart one night and......:hmm3grin2orange:


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## WoodChuck'r (Mar 1, 2013)

Possibly the best thread in AS history....???


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## Arrowhead (Mar 1, 2013)

JeremiahJohnson said:


> Just giving you a heads up. The 3000 305 3300 365 330 3750 etc etc are all 32mm stroke in those series of saws. :msp_wink:
> 
> Do the math 49mm bore x 32mm stroke 60cc 3750 380 365 3500. 46.5mm bore x 32mm stroke 54cc 330 3300. 44mm bore x 32mm 49cc 3000 305 etc
> 
> I dont know what the bore of 2800 2900 is but 32mm stroke x 42.5mm bore 45.4cc or 43mm bore 46.4cc



I rechecked my info. You are correct Kevin. 
My first thought was a 10mm 044 top with a 36mm stroke. I read too many numbers.... lol.
I now have a 68cc. I have another one of these... I'll find a way to 72+cc though. 
My friend was wanting to make a billet crank/rod, I didn't think it was necessary. Now I do. :msp_thumbup:


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## Modifiedmark (Mar 1, 2013)

Arrowhead said:


> I rechecked my info. You are correct Kevin.
> My first thought was a 10mm 044 top with a 36mm stroke. I read too many numbers.... lol.
> I now have a 68cc. I have another one of these... I'll find a way to 72+cc though.
> My friend was wanting to make a billet crank/rod, I didn't think it was necessary. Now I do. :msp_thumbup:



Hey, you still got a 22cc increase! Not to freaking shabby!


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## barneyrb (Mar 1, 2013)

Modifiedmark said:


> Hey, you still got a 22cc increase! Not to freaking shabby!



The best part is 22cc bump *AND* closed ports............


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## Dan_IN_MN (Mar 1, 2013)

WoodChuck'r said:


> Possibly the best thread in AS history....???



I guess you'd know, coming from a person who's been around sense *2001*!


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## barneyrb (Mar 1, 2013)

Arrowhead said:


> What do you builders think of raising the transfers some? They are at 130 now. Exhaust is 100. I was thinking 122ish.



Ed, by doing the math 4* (on a 32mm stroke) should be equal to ~.028 and that would be a lot to raise the transfers IMHO...


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## tomdcoker (Mar 1, 2013)

Ed, I have several carbs. that are from the big Pioneers and Poulan Pros. Let me know if they will work and i will send you what I have. Tom


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## Hedgerow (Mar 1, 2013)

barneyrb said:


> Ed, by doing the math 4* (on a 32mm stroke) should be equal to ~.028 and that would be a lot to raise the transfers IMHO...



Yea... But Stihl transfers are a little slow on the uptake, so they need a head start...
And stuff...


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## barneyrb (Mar 1, 2013)

Hedgerow said:


> Yea... But Stihls are a little slow, so they need a head start...
> And stuff...



I fixed that for ya.......jus sayin........


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## Naked Arborist (Mar 2, 2013)

sawfun9 said:


> Congratulations on capturing the true essence of hot rodding so rarely seen today. It's like the days of V8 Pinto's and Vega's or model T's with big V8's. Anyone remember Opel GT's with 354 and 392 hemi's? Take the bigest engine you can get and put it in the smallest and lightest car. We sure scraped a lot of good Impala's, Imperials, and Ford LTD's just for the big blocks that we put into Camaros, Novas, Challangers, and Mustangs.



Well said. You must be a true old school muscle car lov'in quarter mile gear head. I'm young to be one myself. I started very young. Rod Runs in the 70's and 80's were off the chain. My youngest memories are of falling asleep in the back off a 66 Chevy Carryall. It was the hauler and pulled a 57 Chevy running F Experimental, dads car. Those were the days and I was three maybe four. Trips looked cool and I learnt me some tuning tricks there at Atco.


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## Naked Arborist (Mar 2, 2013)

watsonr said:


> Maybe you should sell the bushing so everybody can do this mod... flywheel too?



Bite your tongue
shh


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## Naked Arborist (Mar 2, 2013)

Mastermind said:


> Forkin awesome Ed



Very well said.

Take that handle off dead give away, com on'. One more slit on the top. Go half the width on the opening and lengthen it. Needs a 16" all grey stock bar.


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## Naked Arborist (Mar 2, 2013)

Tractorsaw1 said:


> Ok, I need one of these projects. Just left a message to a clist add. Let me know who wants to unload a lowly 2.8 crapsman. My buddy will never believe it when I out cut his 038 super!



It should eat up a stock super. The 038 Mag jug is a pretty big bore for the fin size. That helps hid the cool factor under the hood.

Hope to get a 54 mm on the 3500. Saves having the off-set crank pin and issues and stuff and stuff...

Nice build! Take a look at the PP455 and 655 carb setups.


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## Tractorsaw1 (Mar 2, 2013)

What saw models are the same as this 2.8? I have found a poulan 3000 & 2700 that look the same, but what were the craftsman equivalents? Most 2.8 i see are newer & i assume different. Thanks


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## Modifiedmark (Mar 2, 2013)

Tractorsaw1 said:


> What saw models are the same as this 2.8? I have found a poulan 3000 & 2700 that look the same, but what were the craftsman equivalents? Most 2.8 i see are newer & i assume different. Thanks



Shoot, I see the Poulan prices rising now. :msp_wink:

Remember folks, these saws are junk! This whole build was ment to be a joke. Move along now. LOL


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## Tractorsaw1 (Mar 2, 2013)

Ok let me rephrase this. Which saws are similar or share the same bottom end? I assume the poulan 2700 & 3000 are the same with different cylinders. Want to make sure I get the right junk ones headed to the dumpster:msp_biggrin:


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## Naked Arborist (Mar 2, 2013)

Modifiedmark said:


> Shoot, I see the Poulan prices rising now. :msp_wink:
> 
> Remember folks, these saws are junk! This whole build was ment to be a joke. Move along now. LOL



Hey now, we only run junk for FUN. I'd like to see how many cords it chops up before going boom. The head turning factor is worth the build


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## jughead500 (Mar 2, 2013)

Bringin' this back to the Front page. Ed I hope your Feelin' better.


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## Mastermind (Mar 2, 2013)

jughead500 said:


> Bringin' this back to the Front page. Ed I hope your Feelin' better.



Repped


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## WoodChuck'r (Mar 2, 2013)

Sup Randifyer. 


How'z the hammer hangin' this evenin'....??


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## heimannm (Mar 2, 2013)

Very interesting project Ed.

I don't have the time, patience, or tools to do anything like that. Guess I will just keep playing with my yellow ones for now.

Mark


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## barneyrb (Mar 3, 2013)

Ed, be glad when you feel up to posting a video.


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## Streblerm (Mar 4, 2013)

Bump. 

I think lots of people (including me) are hoping you feel well enough to post a vid. opcorn:


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## DSS (Mar 4, 2013)

I never saw one before so I guess I can wait a day or two. I know I don't feel much like running a saw when I got the flu.


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## tbone75 (Mar 4, 2013)

Carb is ready to mail this morning ! Hope you feel better soon Ed !


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## Tractorsaw1 (Mar 4, 2013)

Couple of questions for the guru's

1. What size are the jug bolts? When I put an 066 top end on an 064 i moved them in the case when opening them up, maybe they are all ready 6mm?

2. If one is to hunt up a carb for this setup, can anyone enlighten me on what saws they are on or some where to start looking for one.

Picking up a 2700 poulan afterwork tonight


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## IEL (Mar 4, 2013)

Any bets on how long the bottom end will last?


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## brokenbudget (Mar 4, 2013)

IEL said:


> Any bets on how long the bottom end will last?



i wouldn't imagine any issues with the bottom end. they're quite beafy.


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## Wagnerwerks (Mar 4, 2013)

brokenbudget said:


> i wouldn't imagine any issues with the bottom end. they're quite beafy.



Yeah...This isn't a 170. It's green.


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## Modifiedmark (Mar 4, 2013)

IEL said:


> Any bets on how long the bottom end will last?



I'm a betting man at times, lay the bet on out there and let's see what ya got. :msp_rolleyes:


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## IEL (Mar 4, 2013)

Modifiedmark said:


> I'm a betting man at times, lay the bet on out there and let's see what ya got. :msp_rolleyes:



I would bet the oil filler cap off a stihl ms170 that this saw wouldn't last for 50 cords of wood.


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## Tractorsaw1 (Mar 4, 2013)

My fil has ms170 I bet it don't cut 50 cord in stock form & i raise ya oil cap to a new meteor 066 piston.


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## Modifiedmark (Mar 4, 2013)

IEL said:


> I would bet the oil filler cap off a stihl ms170 that this saw wouldn't last for 50 cords of wood.



I can see your quite the high roller ain't ya. :hmm3grin2orange:


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## tbone75 (Mar 4, 2013)

Modifiedmark said:


> I can see your quite the high roller ain't ya. :hmm3grin2orange:



Yep ............ Hes all in ! :hmm3grin2orange:

That bottom end will be just fine !


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## barneyrb (Mar 4, 2013)

I have seen one of those bottom ends turn 15,600 with a 60cc non windowed piston. That saw is still 4stroking and tuned for cutting at 14,700. Don't let your mouth write a check your azz won't be able to cash. Jus saying.............:msp_thumbup::msp_thumbup:


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## IEL (Mar 4, 2013)

I know nothing about those poulans. I was just thinking that with that much extra power, it might not last. feel free to flame me, I am new to saw mods, and am still learning.


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## tbone75 (Mar 4, 2013)

IEL said:


> I know nothing about those poulans. I was just thinking that with that much extra power, it might not last. feel free to flame me, I am new to saw mods, and am still learning.



Them ol Poulans are some tough saws ! Really over built I think ? I only have 5 or 6 of that type , sold 4 others. LOL 3300 is one of my favorites !



Edit : Don't you guys go getting any ideas ! They aint going no where ! LOL


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## Wagnerwerks (Mar 4, 2013)

IEL said:


> I know nothing about those poulans. I was just thinking that with that much extra power, it might not last. feel free to flame me, I am new to saw mods, and am still learning.



We aren't bashing...lol. Just loving the stoutly engineered green machines of late. You weren't rude and I didn't mean to bash you. 

There were amazing saws that get no love from newbies... We're defensive...


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## Jimmy in NC (Mar 4, 2013)

I like looking for the last years of them. They are often confused with the newer clam shell saws and can be had for cheap. They are stout machines.


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## IEL (Mar 4, 2013)

Wagnerwerks said:


> We aren't bashing...lol. Just loving the stoutly engineered green machines of late. You weren't rude and I didn't mean to bash you.
> 
> There were amazing saws that get no love from newbies... We're defensive...



No worries lol. I was just admitting I was wrong. I figured these poulans were after he quality nose dive, and didnt think they would stand up to it. I have survived weldingweb, and those guys go ot of heir way to flame people


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## tbone75 (Mar 4, 2013)

Jimmy in NC said:


> I like looking for the last years of them. They are often confused with the newer clam shell saws and can be had for cheap. They are stout machines.



Hey !! Keep quiet ! :hmm3grin2orange:


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## tbone75 (Mar 4, 2013)

IEL said:


> No worries lol. I was just admitting I was wrong. I figured these poulans were after he quality nose dive, and didnt think they would stand up to it. I have survived weldingweb, and those guys go ot of heir way to flame people



You'll be OK. LOL


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## Naked Arborist (Mar 4, 2013)

I honestly think the saw will make it for a hunge cords and then some. Time will tell and it has to just flat out jam with a short bar.


----------



## srcarr52 (Mar 4, 2013)

Did I miss the movie? This build is almost as long as a Mastermood 610EVL. :hmm3grin2orange:


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## Jimmy in NC (Mar 4, 2013)

tbone75 said:


> Hey !! Keep quiet ! :hmm3grin2orange:



Got teach those younger than me... only way I knew to look was someone shared a tip with me!


----------



## tbone75 (Mar 4, 2013)

Jimmy in NC said:


> Got teach those younger than me... only way I knew to look was someone shared a tip with me!



Ed is already making them go high ! LOL Now everyone will know ! No more cheapies ! 



Nah ................. They won't believe it ! :hmm3grin2orange:


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## MS460WOODCHUCK (Mar 4, 2013)

IEL said:


> No worries lol. I was just admitting I was wrong. I figured these poulans were after he quality nose dive, and didnt think they would stand up to it. I have survived weldingweb, and those guys go ot of heir way to flame people



Have you seen the video of Ed's wildthing he picked up from walmart yet?:hmm3grin2orange: I'm sure someone will post the link to it for ya...:help:


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## Warped5 (Mar 4, 2013)

wait a sec here ..... just thinking out loud, of course ....

Seems to me that Ed posted to the thread and said " ... will post more tomorrow. Son is downloading to his PS3, so speed isn't so good .... "

Then Ed gets sick.

Did his son download a virus?

:hmm3grin2orange: :hmm3grin2orange: :hmm3grin2orange: :hmm3grin2orange:


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## dboyd351 (Mar 4, 2013)

Come on Ed, get well!
You got us all stroked with all those awesome pics of the build. We want to see it chew some wood!!!

Seriously, this is a killer project


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## outdoorlivin247 (Mar 4, 2013)

Talked to Ed on the phone this afternoon...He is feeling better but still not up to par... He promised he would get videos up as soon as he feels better...


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## jughead500 (Mar 6, 2013)

bump


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## Modifiedmark (Mar 6, 2013)

Ed probably dont feel like dealing with about 10" of snow today. I know I didnt.


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## jughead500 (Mar 6, 2013)

shew i dont even want to deal with 3-4". but somebodys got to check the docks and heat on the houses.wish i could clean up leaves and pressure wash.i hate winter.best thing about march... it aint december janurary or feburary. lol


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## barneyrb (Mar 6, 2013)

Modifiedmark said:


> Ed probably dont feel like dealing with about 10" of snow today. I know I didnt.



Dang, we got us a little cold snap here too. It is 50* right now but we do have a forecast of 56 today and a warming trend until Saturday with a high of 72. I hate it for yall'


----------



## jughead500 (Mar 6, 2013)

45 would be a heat wave here.lol


----------



## cmarti (Mar 6, 2013)

Warped5 said:


> wait a sec here ..... just thinking out loud, of course ....
> 
> Seems to me that Ed posted to the thread and said " ... will post more tomorrow. Son is downloading to his PS3, so speed isn't so good .... "
> 
> ...



Brought a smile:msp_tongue:


----------



## nstueve (Mar 6, 2013)

Ok so maybe I missed it but was there any talk about the crank case volumes? It seems like a 50-60cc crankcase volume wouldn't support 68cc's of ported saw.

Also I have to agree that the 2 little slits are pretty small for that 038mag cylinder! Maybe a 3rd?

Other than those two little things... WOW Ed! loving every bit of this build! :biggrinbounce2:


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## Hedgerow (Mar 6, 2013)

nstueve said:


> Ok so maybe I missed it but was there any talk about the crank case volumes? It seems like a 50-60cc crankcase volume wouldn't support 68cc's of ported saw.
> 
> Also I have to agree that the 2 little slits are pretty small for that 038mag cylinder! Maybe a 3rd?
> 
> Other than those two little things... WOW Ed! loving every bit of this build! :biggrinbounce2:



I'm guessing there's a lot of cc volume in that old Poulan's carcass...
Not to mention the transfer runners.
I'm sure Ed removed some material from the lowers...
But just a guess...


----------



## Trx250r180 (Mar 6, 2013)

nstueve said:


> Ok so maybe I missed it but was there any talk about the crank case volumes? It seems like a 50-60cc crankcase volume wouldn't support 68cc's of ported saw.
> 
> Also I have to agree that the 2 little slits are pretty small for that 038mag cylinder! Maybe a 3rd?
> 
> Other than those two little things... WOW Ed! loving every bit of this build! :biggrinbounce2:



he took the wall out between the crank and the oil tank for added volume ,then added a 3/4 wrap off the 044 ,fills the wrap handle as oil storage now :hmm3grin2orange:


----------



## sefh3 (Mar 7, 2013)

Keepin this thread alive. 

How you feeling Ed?

Great thread.


----------



## SawTroll (Mar 7, 2013)

Stephen C. said:


> back in the day we did everything possible to reduce crankcase volume, "stuffed" the cases, aluminum plugs in the flywheel balance holes to reduce case volume, full circle flywheels tucked tight to the case walls with just enough space between them for the rod to swing this effectively increases the compression ratio of the crankcase as the piston comes down causing a higher pressure pushing a larger volume of fuel/air mix thru the transfers. At top dead center it fills the case as the piston comes down it compresses the volume in the case until the transfers open.:hmm3grin2orange::hmm3grin2orange: then woosh bang pow...less is more...



Husky does something like that on some xp saws.


----------



## Hedgerow (Mar 7, 2013)

SawTroll said:


> Husky does something like that on some xp saws.



And it works...........
But not on the BEST ones.....
Howdy Niko...
:hmm3grin2orange:


----------



## outdoorlivin247 (Mar 7, 2013)

Ed really is alive guys... I saw him with my own eyes... Dropped off a couple old saws as I was driving by but was kind of in a hurry so no updates on this project... The Camaro on the other hand is going to be NICE!!!


----------



## LowVolt (Mar 7, 2013)

Get better Ed!

So what video will be first? Echo twin in wood, Ported MS 241 in wood or this frankensaw monster?

Cast you votes........................................NOW!


----------



## Warped5 (Mar 7, 2013)

outdoorlivin247 said:


> Ed really is alive guys... I saw him with my own eyes... Dropped off a couple old saws as I was driving by but was kind of in a hurry so no updates on this project... The Camaro on the other hand is going to be NICE!!!



What Camaro? 

He turned a little tractor into a Camaro?

Now THAT'S amazing! :msp_thumbup:


----------



## LowVolt (Mar 7, 2013)

LowVolt said:


> Get better Ed!
> 
> So what video will be first? Echo twin in wood, Ported MS 241 in wood, this frankensaw monster *or the incredible Tracamaro*?
> 
> Cast you votes........................................NOW!



Fixed it!


----------



## tbone75 (Mar 7, 2013)

Warped5 said:


> What Camaro?
> 
> He turned a little tractor into a Camaro?
> 
> Now THAT'S amazing! :msp_thumbup:



Ed is good , started with a Pinto !


----------



## rms61moparman (Mar 7, 2013)

Warped5 said:


> What Camaro?
> 
> He turned a little tractor into a Camaro?
> 
> Now THAT'S amazing! :msp_thumbup:






Well I for SURE wouldn't put anything past THAT boy!!!
If anyone can do it.......HE is the one!

Mike


----------



## Naked Arborist (Mar 8, 2013)

This sleeper should spool up stupid fast with a short bar.


----------



## rheima (Mar 8, 2013)

*movie*



srcarr52 said:


> Did I miss the movie? This build is almost as long as a Mastermood 610EVL. :hmm3grin2orange:



I have been following this thread for several days and I want to see the Craftsman run on viedo. Is there one?


Ray


----------



## Hinerman (Mar 9, 2013)

rheima said:


> I have been following this thread for several days and I want to see the Craftsman run on viedo. Is there one?
> 
> 
> Ray



No, get your popcorn, or some pie, or some bacon like the rest of us and wait for the show to begin.


----------



## Tractorsaw1 (Mar 9, 2013)

Well i have picked up a poulan 2700....
cylinder check
carb check
intake check
anyone have an 036 heat shield they can part with?


----------



## slipknot (Mar 9, 2013)

Wow...i cast my vote as this being best AS thread ever....Its a nice day out today...perfect for video making.


----------



## Arrowhead (Mar 9, 2013)

I'm back on my feet. 
I started with the stomach flu, then it turned into a sinus/respiratory/ infection. It was the sickest I've ever been. 

I'm going to *try* to get a video up in the next couple days. We got hit with a good amount of snow the other day. Now it's melting and a muddy mess. I have to go to the woods and bring back a log to run the saw in. Sorry to leave everybody hanging. 

I have a bunch to get caught up on now. If I promised to send anybody parts, please send me a reminder pm.


----------



## Eccentric (Mar 9, 2013)

Arrowhead said:


> I'm back on my feet.
> I started with the stomach flu, then it turned into a sinus/respiratory/ infection. It was the sickest I've ever been.
> 
> I'm going to *try* to get a video up in the next couple days. We got hit with a good amount of snow the other day. Now it's melting and a muddy mess. I have to go to the woods and bring back a log to run the saw in. Sorry to leave everybody hanging.
> ...



Glad you're on the mend Ed. Now you can box up that NOS 655BP and send it out to me like we agreed.


----------



## moody (Mar 9, 2013)

Arrowhead said:


> I'm back on my feet.
> I started with the stomach flu, then it turned into a sinus/respiratory/ infection. It was the sickest I've ever been.
> 
> I'm going to *try* to get a video up in the next couple days. We got hit with a good amount of snow the other day. Now it's melting and a muddy mess. I have to go to the woods and bring back a log to run the saw in. Sorry to leave everybody hanging.
> ...



Good to see you're up and around again. I dont know you but I wouldn't wish anyone to be down sick. I'm excited to see this beast run.


----------



## moody (Mar 9, 2013)

rheima said:


> I have been following this thread for several days and I want to see the Craftsman run on viedo. Is there one?
> 
> 
> Ray



Haha Ray it say's you're a senior member :biggrin:


----------



## Arrowhead (Mar 9, 2013)

moody said:


> Good to see you're up and around again. I dont know you but I wouldn't wish anyone to be down sick. I'm excited to see this beast run.



Thanks.


----------



## Arrowhead (Mar 9, 2013)

I cleared some room in my pm box. Sorry I didn't reply sooner to those that pm'd me. This is the 1st time I've been on in a week.


----------



## Modifiedmark (Mar 9, 2013)

Arrowhead said:


> I'm back on my feet.
> I started with the stomach flu, then it turned into a sinus/respiratory/ infection. It was the sickest I've ever been.
> 
> I'm going to *try* to get a video up in the next couple days. We got hit with a good amount of snow the other day. Now it's melting and a muddy mess. I have to go to the woods and bring back a log to run the saw in. Sorry to leave everybody hanging.
> ...



Glad your up and around, been kinda down with the same things myself! Kinda why I ain't called you as well. 

Take things at your own time for a bit, dont worry about nothing else.


----------



## rms61moparman (Mar 9, 2013)

And I think you two scoundrels gave that dang stuff to me!
Feeling like I been kicked in the gut by a mule today!


Mike


----------



## tbone75 (Mar 9, 2013)

Arrowhead said:


> I cleared some room in my pm box. Sorry I didn't reply sooner to those that pm'd me. This is the 1st time I've been on in a week.



Glad to see you pulled through ! Had the same thing a month or so ago,ended up in the ER at 2am one morning !

I am rounding up parts for one these things ! LOL Just need them wrist pin bushings. And build some kind of muffler. LOL


----------



## Arrowhead (Mar 9, 2013)

Modifiedmark said:


> Glad your up and around, been kinda down with the same things myself! Kinda why I ain't called you as well.
> 
> Take things at your own time for a bit, dont worry about nothing else.





rms61moparman said:


> And I think you two scoundrels gave that dang stuff to me!
> Feeling like I been kicked in the gut by a mule today!
> 
> 
> Mike





tbone75 said:


> Glad to see you pulled through ! Had the same thing a month or so ago,ended up in the ER at 2am one morning !
> 
> I am rounding up parts for one these things ! LOL Just need them wrist pin bushings. And build some kind of muffler. LOL



I hope you guys get over it quicker than I did. My head felt like it was going to explode, I tried to post 5 or 6 days ago... just looking at the screen made things worse. I only lasted a minute. I think this crazy weather has a bunch to do with it. 10 degrees one day.... then 60 degrees a couple days later. That's how this entire winter has been here.


----------



## tbone75 (Mar 9, 2013)

Arrowhead said:


> I hope you guys get over it quicker than I did. My head felt like it was going to explode, I tried to post 5 or 6 days ago... just looking at the screen made things worse. I only lasted a minute. I think this crazy weather has a bunch to do with it. 10 degrees one day.... then 60 degrees a couple days later. That's how this entire winter has been here.



Took about 3 weeks to feel good again.


----------



## Modifiedmark (Mar 9, 2013)

Arrowhead said:


> I hope you guys get over it quicker than I did. My head felt like it was going to explode, I tried to post 5 or 6 days ago... just looking at the screen made things worse. I only lasted a minute. I think this crazy weather has a bunch to do with it. 10 degrees one day.... then 60 degrees a couple days later. That's how this entire winter has been here.



Might be the dang weather, but I always blame it on the wifes cooking. :msp_wink:


----------



## tbone75 (Mar 9, 2013)

Modifiedmark said:


> Might be the dang weather, but I always blame it on the wifes cooking. :msp_wink:



:msp_scared:


----------



## rms61moparman (Mar 9, 2013)

Modifiedmark said:


> Might be the dang weather, but I always blame it on the wifes cooking. :msp_wink:






Yes Sir!!!!
I can see that you are starving to death!!!LOL
Poor boy is ready to just dry up and blow away.


Mike


----------



## Mastermind (Mar 9, 2013)

Eccentric said:


> Glad you're on the mend Ed. Now you can box up that NOS 655BP and send it out to me like we agreed.



Easy there big feller.....Ed said I was the guy he was sending that to. After all I agreed that I would paid the postage.


----------



## Locust Cutter (Mar 9, 2013)

Arrowhead said:


> I hope you guys get over it quicker than I did. My head felt like it was going to explode, I tried to post 5 or 6 days ago... just looking at the screen made things worse. I only lasted a minute. I think this crazy weather has a bunch to do with it. 10 degrees one day.... then 60 degrees a couple days later. That's how this entire winter has been here.



Luckily I didn't have the rest of your follow-on opportunities, BUT I also just got over the worst stomach bug I've ever had. I puked more in 12 hours, than I have in the last 6-8 years... Among other things.:bang: Still not tracking quite right and it started Wednesday night.


----------



## Mastermind (Mar 9, 2013)

Glad you're feeling a little better Ed.


----------



## jwp (Mar 10, 2013)

Ok somebody has to say it. Enough of this touchy feely girl stuff, how is the saw doing?


----------



## steve316 (Mar 10, 2013)

Locust Cutter,in Missouri we call that a cleansing,not realy in to that kind of thing myself,health food and all. bar-b-q & beer for me. Steve


----------



## Mastermind (Mar 10, 2013)

jwp said:


> Ok somebody has to say it. Enough of this touchy feely girl stuff, how is the saw doing?



:hmm3grin2orange:


----------



## Trx250r180 (Mar 11, 2013)

this must be the saw that was faster than the echo twin............


----------



## Mastermind (Mar 11, 2013)

trx250r180 said:


> this must be the saw that was faster than the echo twin............



They all are. Right? :msp_tongue:


----------



## 8433jeff (Mar 11, 2013)

Mastermind said:


> They all are. Right? :msp_tongue:



The video appearances are....


----------



## Mastermind (Mar 11, 2013)

8433jeff said:


> The video appearances are....



I might have over done the wood size......but it was faster than a 262XP.


----------



## 8433jeff (Mar 11, 2013)

Mastermind said:


> *I might have over done the wood size.*.....but it was faster than a 262XP.



Gee, ya think?

The first clue was the calendar pages flipping, right?

I've never seen one in person running. I think Mo Jim had a couple at the IA spring GTG a couple years ago, but there was other things, like the BP-1. And cinnamon rolls.


----------



## Mastermind (Mar 11, 2013)

8433jeff said:


> Gee, ya think?
> 
> The first clue was the calendar pages flipping, right?
> 
> I've never seen one in person running. I think Mo Jim had a couple at the IA spring GTG a couple years ago, but there was other things, like the BP-1. And cinnamon rolls.



You know the old saying "any port in a storm" right?

You guys backed me into a corner with the video demands and that was the only wood I had. So..........it's all your fault. :msp_mellow:


----------



## 8433jeff (Mar 11, 2013)

Mastermind said:


> You know the old saying "any port in a storm" right?
> 
> You guys backed me into a corner with the video demands and that was the only wood I had. So..........it's all your fault. :msp_mellow:



140 Cuddles Lane
Whinerstown, Ohio 44456 

I guess there is room on the flag for Puerto Rico, now. Or Mexico. Hopefully not both.


----------



## Mastermind (Mar 11, 2013)

8433jeff said:


> 140 Cuddles Lane
> Whinerstown, Ohio 44456
> 
> I guess there is room on the flag for Puerto Rico, now. Or Mexico. Hopefully not both.



Touche


----------



## 8433jeff (Mar 11, 2013)

Mastermind said:


> Touche



1-17, serving.


----------



## Trx250r180 (Mar 11, 2013)

oops i thought i was in the echo twin thread ,carry on ..........


----------



## rheima (Mar 11, 2013)

*Senior*



moody said:


> Haha Ray it say's you're a senior member :biggrin:



My question is, does the senior mean age or time on the site?:msp_unsure:


----------



## 3000 FPS (Mar 11, 2013)

rheima said:


> My question is, does the senior mean age or time on the site?:msp_unsure:



If you have to ask then your to old. :msp_rolleyes:


----------



## rheima (Mar 11, 2013)

*Old age*



3000 FPS said:


> If you have to ask then your to old. :msp_rolleyes:



I was afraid that might be the definition, but at least I know I made it there!



Ray


----------



## 3000 FPS (Mar 11, 2013)

rheima said:


> I was afraid that might be the definition, but at least I know I made it there! Ray



Yea me too I am just another old guy also.


----------



## outdoorlivin247 (Mar 13, 2013)

:dunno:


----------



## MS460WOODCHUCK (Mar 14, 2013)

Any video of this saw yet Ed?


----------



## brokenbudget (Mar 14, 2013)

MS460WOODCHUCK said:


> Any video of this saw yet Ed?



his son is still downloading ps3 games:hmm3grin2orange:


----------



## dboyd351 (Mar 15, 2013)

brokenbudget said:


> his son is still downloading ps3 games:hmm3grin2orange:



Maybe he's got the computer locked up with all those games on it!


----------



## srcarr52 (Mar 15, 2013)

dboyd351 said:


> Maybe he's got the computer locked up with all those games on it!



I'm sure it was all the computer games and not all the... other stuff. :hmm3grin2orange:


----------



## Jacob J. (Mar 15, 2013)

srcarr52 said:


> I'm sure it was all the computer games and not all the... other stuff. :hmm3grin2orange:



Bill Dance fishing videos? umpkin2:


----------



## thomas1 (Mar 15, 2013)

Jacob J. said:


> Bill Dance fishing videos? umpkin2:



I said: I'm sorry buddy, I can't go. I'm watchin' the Orlando Wilson fishin' show.


----------



## srcarr52 (Mar 15, 2013)

Jacob J. said:


> Bill Dance fishing videos? umpkin2:



Sure, maybe some fishing video.


----------



## Jlhotstick3 (Mar 15, 2013)

:msp_thumbsup:


----------



## slipknot (Mar 19, 2013)

Any updates?


----------



## outdoorlivin247 (Mar 21, 2013)

Earth to Arrowhead, Earth to Arrowhead, come in Arrowhead?...

Oh wait, ignore this post if you are working on my deer head!!!


----------



## Streblerm (Mar 24, 2013)

Bump


----------



## knockbill (Mar 24, 2013)

Very impressed with teh build,,, Hate to see everybody finding out about these P3300, and 3.3 Craftsman's, tho,,,, I been heating teh house with them for years... found teh last one in a dumpster... 
Oh well, the secret is out...


----------



## Chris J. (Mar 25, 2013)

I haven't been on AS much over the last couple of months, glad I found this thread.

Great work , Ed. How's she running? Maybe I accidently skipped over the vid(s)?


----------



## barneyrb (Mar 25, 2013)

How do you keep a saw geek in suspense???????????????














































































wait for the video....


----------



## RiverRocket (Mar 25, 2013)

I sure hope Ed is OK, I’m guessing that the build didn’t work so great:bang:
Sure Looked Good On Paper.


----------



## hotshot (Mar 25, 2013)

*Is it tomorrow yet??*



Arrowhead said:


> The pics are loading now, more soon. I'll do a video tomorrow.



Garth Brooks If Tomorrow Never Comes - Bing Videos


----------



## dboyd351 (Mar 25, 2013)

excess650 said:


> You're a month ahead of schedule.:msp_rolleyes:



Not any more!


----------



## Modifiedmark (Mar 25, 2013)

RiverRocket said:


> I sure hope Ed is OK, I’m guessing that the build didn’t work so great:bang:
> Sure Looked Good On Paper.



I talked to him just a day or so ago, he's still fighting off the bug thats been going around here. Except for Satuday the weathers been kinda bad around here as well.


----------



## dboyd351 (Mar 26, 2013)

Glad to hear he's OK. Must be bad if he can't play with saws!!!


----------



## Arrowhead (Mar 28, 2013)

RiverRocket said:


> I sure hope Ed is OK, I’m guessing that the build didn’t work so great:bang:
> Sure Looked Good On Paper.



No problems with the saw.


----------



## Arrowhead (Mar 28, 2013)

Sorry to drop out again. In the last couple weeks, I've had a friend and a distant relative pass away, plus I've been feeling like crap. I think I figured out what's going on. Along with this bug that's been going around, I have severe allergies, for 3+ years I've been getting weekly allergy shots. They were working great, I was almost built up to a monthly maintenance dosage. Several months ago my allergy doc just up and left... moved to Kentucky. :bang: He was about the only local allergy doc. Now everything is coming back... seems even worse now. Along with major fatigue. :msp_unsure:

Along with feeling like crap, all my wood cutting areas were flooded out. I need to get a log back to the house to do the video. Last week there were duck ponds in all the cornfields around here. I did manage to sneak out to the field in front of my house for a couple hours last week and kill some Snow-Blue-Ross Geese.  I've lived here almost 20 years, that was the first time there was ever any considerable amounts of Snow Geese here.

Anyhoo... I'm hoping tomorrow is the day. The fields have dried up decent. I should have time to get a log and do the video. I haven't ran the saw since the 1st time in the woods when I first got it done. Plus my 14yr old son is on Spring break. He can help me with the video/Youtube loading crap. I think I only did one video years ago of the Wild Thing I built. I remember it was an all day thing trying to get it uploaded. I struggle with that kinda stuff. Plus having a minor step above dial-up internet, it takes all freakin day to upload.


----------



## Arrowhead (Mar 28, 2013)

outdoorlivin247 said:


> Earth to Arrowhead, Earth to Arrowhead, come in Arrowhead?...
> 
> Oh wait, ignore this post if you are working on my deer head!!!



Deer head? What deer head? umpkin2:
Thanks again for the saws you brought over.


----------



## Big_Wood (Mar 28, 2013)

Arrowhead said:


> Sorry to drop out again. In the last couple weeks, I've had a friend and a distant relative pass away, plus I've been feeling like crap. I think I figured out what's going on. Along with this bug that's been going around, I have severe allergies, for 3+ years I've been getting weekly allergy shots. They were working great, I was almost built up to a monthly maintenance dosage. Several months ago my allergy doc just up and left... moved to Kentucky. :bang: He was about the only local allergy doc. Now everything is coming back... seems even worse now. Along with major fatigue. :msp_unsure:
> 
> Along with feeling like crap, all my wood cutting areas were flooded out. I need to get a log back to the house to do the video. Last week there were duck ponds in all the cornfields around here. I did manage to sneak out to the field in front of my house for a couple hours last week and kill some Snow-Blue-Ross Geese.  I've lived here almost 20 years, that was the first time there was ever any considerable amounts of Snow Geese here.
> 
> Anyhoo... I'm hoping tomorrow is the day. The fields have dried up decent. I should have time to get a log and do the video. I haven't ran the saw since the 1st time in the woods when I first got it done. Plus my 14yr old son is on Spring break. He can help me with the video/Youtube loading crap. I think I only did one video years ago of the Wild Thing I built. I remember it was an all day thing trying to get it uploaded. I struggle with that kinda stuff. Plus having a minor step above dial-up internet, it takes all freakin day to upload.



 definitely looking forward to this one :msp_thumbup:


----------



## Vibes (Mar 28, 2013)

I'll be the first to ask. I'll take that stock jug and piston off your hands. I have a 2800 Poulan in need.


----------



## dboyd351 (Mar 28, 2013)

Glad to hear you're gettin back on your feet!:msp_thumbup:


----------



## Arrowhead (Mar 28, 2013)

I managed to get a log home and video made. Now to figure out the upload thing.


----------



## DSS (Mar 28, 2013)

Hi Ed. Glad you're back


----------



## tbone75 (Mar 28, 2013)

Arrowhead said:


> I managed to get a log home and video made. Now to figure out the upload thing.



And all I got is dial up chit ! Would take me 3 days to watch 2 mins of it ! LOL


----------



## Arrowhead (Mar 28, 2013)

Youtube is saying 57 minutes remaining.... for a 10 second video.


----------



## Arrowhead (Mar 28, 2013)

tbone75 said:


> And all I got is dial up chit ! Would take me 3 days to watch 2 mins of it ! LOL



It's not long, I was in a hurry just to get a few cuts in before dark. I'll do a better video later.


----------



## tbone75 (Mar 28, 2013)

Arrowhead said:


> It's not long, I was in a hurry just to get a few cuts in before dark. I'll do a better video later.



I will get it ! Just take as long to down load it,or longer ! LOL


----------



## Arrowhead (Mar 28, 2013)

[video=youtube;esUeFr5TYE0]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=esUeFr5TYE0&feature=youtu.be[/video]

Here's a quick video. I believe the saw has a lot more potential with a better carb. The carb was new, but either has issues or too small of a jet. The venturi size is good, but something ain't right. In the video the L screw is 3 1/4 turns out and the H is 2 1/4 turns out. :msp_mellow: Tbone sent me a carb I might try tomorrow if I have time to play.


----------



## Macman125 (Mar 28, 2013)

pretty sick little saw. I stihl want one.


----------



## DSS (Mar 28, 2013)

Sounds great, got a nice crackle. 

Giddyup


----------



## Mastermind (Mar 28, 2013)

I love watching that chip flow. 

You are the man Ed........


----------



## Wagnerwerks (Mar 28, 2013)

That was worth the wait...lol. Nice job!


----------



## LowVolt (Mar 28, 2013)




----------



## Arrowhead (Mar 28, 2013)

Thanks for the comments fellas. I'll do a better video once I get the bugs worked out of the saw. 
Today was only the second time I ran it. This morning I tore it down to raise the transfers from 130 to 120. Everything inside the saw looked good. Once I got the transfers finished, I put the 20" bar back on it from earlier and buried in the big piece of Ash you see in the background by the shed. It was running great and I was able to lean on the saw a decent amount with the bar buried. About a 1/3 of the way through the cut it stuttered a couple times. I readjusted the carb and started back in the cut... seconds later I cut through a nail. :taped: I had the bar buried several times the 1st time out. It was fine. I thinking the carb has issues, everything mechanically with the saw is still sound. I've had several saws in the last couple months come in the shop with the welch plug sealant floating around in the carb.


----------



## barneyrb (Mar 28, 2013)

Wicked mean and nasty.........jus sayin..........


----------



## Modifiedmark (Mar 28, 2013)

Arrowhead said:


> [video=youtube;esUeFr5TYE0]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=esUeFr5TYE0&feature=youtu.be[/video]
> 
> Here's a quick video. I believe the saw has a lot more potential with a better carb. The carb was new, but either has issues or too small of a jet. The venturi size is good, but something ain't right. In the video the L screw is 3 1/4 turns out and the H is 2 1/4 turns out. :msp_mellow: Tbone sent me a carb I might try tomorrow if I have time to play.



It sounds good but personally I bet the jet is too small. Not sure what has to be done to fix it, just let me know if you want to try the HDA 137 and I'll get it to you.


----------



## tomdcoker (Mar 28, 2013)

If you use it at a gtg with people there that do not know what you have done to the saw or if they know it will get there attention quickly. It sounded good to me. Glad to see you back. Tom PS I have some carbs from the big Pioneer saws. If you think one of them will work let me know.


----------



## Arrowhead (Mar 28, 2013)

Modifiedmark said:


> It sounds good but personally I bet the jet is too small. Not sure what has to be done to fix it, just let me know if you want to try the HDA 137 and I'll get it to you.


I'd sure like to try it. I might try the carb John sent tomorrow. 


tomdcoker said:


> If you use it at a gtg with people there that do not know what you have done to the saw or if they know it will get there attention quickly. It sounded good to me. Glad to see you back. Tom PS I have some carbs from the big Pioneer saws. If you think one of them will work let me know.



Thanks Tom, I can always use another SDC-80 if you have one.


----------



## jughead500 (Mar 28, 2013)

Hello Ed glad your Back on your feet.Loved the Vid.I'm still following.


----------



## 8433jeff (Mar 28, 2013)

I had know doubt it would run that well, and take your time. Holiday time and all, no sense of being out of the line-up for that. Glad you're feeling better, whatever is going around kicks ass as well as that saw, from personal experience.


----------



## Mastermind (Mar 28, 2013)

Arrowhead said:


> Thanks for the comments fellas. I'll do a better video once I get the bugs worked out of the saw.
> Today was only the second time I ran it. This morning I tore it down to raise the transfers from 130 to 120. Everything inside the saw looked good. Once I got the transfers finished, I put the 20" bar back on it from earlier and buried in the big piece of Ash you see in the background by the shed. It was running great and I was able to lean on the saw a decent amount with the bar buried. About a 1/3 of the way through the cut it stuttered a couple times. I readjusted the carb and started back in the cut... seconds later I cut through a nail. :taped: I had the bar buried several times the 1st time out. It was fine. I thinking the carb has issues, everything mechanically with the saw is still sound. I've had several saws in the last couple months come in the shop with *the welch plug sealant floating around in the carb*.



Damn ethanol.


----------



## Arrowhead (Mar 28, 2013)

I'll check the rpm with the tach tomorrow. I forgot today, along with checking the comp. Was in a hurry. 
I'm only running one ring also.


----------



## Arrowhead (Mar 28, 2013)

Vibes said:


> I'll be the first to ask. I'll take that stock jug and piston off your hands. I have a 2800 Poulan in need.



It's yours. PM me your address.


----------



## Hinerman (Mar 29, 2013)

I am speechless


----------



## cowroy (Mar 29, 2013)

Hey Randy, would this make a good candidate? :msp_sneaky: the one in the back that is


----------



## Vibes (Mar 29, 2013)

cowroy said:


> Hey Randy, would this make a good candidate? :msp_sneaky: the one in the back that is



DON'T!!!!!!!!!!! Please don't.


----------



## bowtechmadman (Mar 29, 2013)

Ed that is Sick!


----------



## qbilder (Mar 29, 2013)

Crazy. Yep, that's the word. Lots of words come to mind but crazy sums it up.


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## rms61moparman (Mar 29, 2013)

It's not really CRAZY.............................yet!

You boys ain't seen nothin' yet.
Wait until he's finished with it!!!


By the way have you seen his Wildthing?
Makes that Craftsman look like a Mini Mac!


Mike


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## dboyd351 (Mar 29, 2013)

Really nice cuttin' saw! Sounds great and throws chips like no tomorrow. Glad you and the saw are both up to speed.


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## qbilder (Mar 29, 2013)

rms61moparman said:


> By the way have you seen his Wildthing?
> Makes that Craftsman look like a Mini Mac!



Haven't seen it but would like to. While reading this thread, all I could think was that a Wildthing would be kick butt souped up like this.


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## rms61moparman (Mar 29, 2013)

If I can make this work!

Here is a tast of it!!!


Mike


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## tomdcoker (Mar 29, 2013)

Arrowhead said:


> I'd sure like to try it. I might try the carb John sent tomorrow.
> 
> 
> Thanks Tom, I can always use another SDC-80 if you have one.



I have been under a sink doing plumbing and wood work all day today. I will check tomorrow. Tom


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## jerrycmorrow (May 2, 2013)

how the heck i missed this thread for couple a months i'll never know. totally amazing. i always thought something like this could be done. just not by me. way to go. btw, are the bugs worked out of the saw yet?


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## locofrog (May 2, 2013)

Holy chit man! That saw is just plain sick. Too bad it ain't contagious or I'd send my saws over for a while. Good job Ed. Well played sir, well played.

Loco


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## kevin j (May 2, 2013)

maybe it was asked already but would any WildThing bodywork fit on this thing?


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## Eccentric (May 2, 2013)

kevin j said:


> maybe it was asked already but would any WildThing bodywork fit on this thing?



Nope.


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## olyman (May 3, 2013)

anyone know the progress of this saw?? ed hasnt posted in a bit..


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## Modifiedmark (May 3, 2013)

olyman said:


> anyone know the progress of this saw?? ed hasnt posted in a bit..



You started a thread asking a about this yesterday and I answered it there. 

http://www.arboristsite.com/chainsaw/235487.htm


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## olyman (May 3, 2013)

Modifiedmark said:


> You started a thread asking a about this yesterday and I answered it there.
> 
> http://www.arboristsite.com/chainsaw/235487.htm



i started that thread,,before i seen your reply,,then the original thread came back to the top....sorry....


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## mini mac man (May 11, 2013)

Ed 
You did such a great job with this thread my friend copied you. View attachment 294898

Well almost. There is no port work. 
Ran it for the first time today.
The carb is a hdb from a 3400 poulan
View attachment 294899

The choke works backward from the hda carb. Plus the choke arm has to be modified to fit. Flipped and shortened..
Running the three shoe clutch also from the 3400. 
Thanks for such a great idea.


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## kspakland (May 12, 2013)

Okay, I gotta get in on this, I am looking for a very lightweight but powerful saw myself.

I have a china made Homelite "pro" 46 cc saw that is the perfect weight for me to handle, can I do a p/c swap on it to boost it up to something close to what is in the thread ?


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## rms61moparman (May 12, 2013)

kspakland said:


> Okay, I gotta get in on this, I am looking for a very lightweight but powerful saw myself.
> 
> I have a china made Homelite "pro" 46 cc saw that is the perfect weight for me to handle, can I do a p/c swap on it to boost it up to something close to what is in the thread ?





Nope!

You have to have a split cased bolt on cylinder and your saw is a clamshell.


Mike


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## kspakland (May 12, 2013)

rms61moparman said:


> Nope!
> 
> You have to have a split cased bolt on cylinder and your saw is a clamshell.
> 
> ...



Oh well, it was a nice dream while it lasted ............thanks for the info.


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## ChainFinn (May 12, 2013)

Possibly the best topic ive seen here so far opcorn:


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## jerbear (May 12, 2013)

mini mac man said:


> Ed
> You did such a great job with this thread my friend copied you. View attachment 294898
> 
> Well almost. There is no port work.
> ...



It was a fun project
View attachment 295052
View attachment 295053
View attachment 295054
View attachment 295055
View attachment 295056

Thanks for such a detailed thread and sharing your knowledge.
I am going to look for a deferent carb the backwards choke bugs me


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## kspakland (May 12, 2013)

ChainFinn said:


> Possibly the best topic i've seen here so far opcorn:



Agreed, and the best part is: NO snackie wimmin pix !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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## tbone75 (May 12, 2013)

I have most of what I need for this build ! Just need them bushings for the pin.

But when I will get there ???? LOL


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## MechanicMatt (May 14, 2013)

Ed, you gonna start marketing these bushing?? :msp_biggrin:


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## mp5n (Jun 13, 2013)

*Hey Arrowhead. How's she running?*

I have all of the parts for a copycat build and was wondering what you ended up doing with the carb? I was able to get the mag cylinder and piston off of ebay and the saw was a local CL find in really nice condition. I was also thinking of tracking down a 038 crank and machining the journals to match the stock crank. This will give it the extra stroke to get her over 70 cc along with eliminating the need for the pin bushings. Any thoughts?

Thanks,
MP5N


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## Arrowhead (Jun 13, 2013)

UPDATE....

I've been super busy lately. The last time I ran the saw was in the video I posted. Mark and John both sent me different carbs to try, but haven't had the time to mess with it. I've been *really* wanting to get it up to where it should be, but unfortunately I have more important priorities. I'm hoping to have time in a week or so to play with it.

As for the 038 crank, I've been thinking of that also. The biggest issue is the clearance inside the crankcase. I'll try to do some measuring of the lobes and crank ends, which would both need to be turned on a machine.


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## Arrowhead (Jun 13, 2013)

MechanicMatt said:


> Ed, you gonna start marketing these bushing?? :msp_biggrin:



Not really. I could always make some for certain members though. 
Until I get the saw where I'm 100% happy with it (power/performance wise) and know it's going to hold up, I hate to make anything else for it or stuff for anybody else.


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## Naked Arborist (Jun 14, 2013)

I have had a Poulan 3500 Timber master sitting on the shelf for two years+ now. It has a smoked piston. Just lack the time to alter and port a jug for it. When she does go on the chopping block I'm shooting for a quad port ported jug :hmm3grin2orange:


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## mp5n (Jun 14, 2013)

*Same thoughts with the crank*



Arrowhead said:


> UPDATE....
> As for the 038 crank, I've been thinking of that also. The biggest issue is the clearance inside the crankcase. I'll try to do some measuring of the lobes and crank ends, which would both need to be turned on a machine.



I'm thinking the same with the clearance. I'm not so much worried about the radial clearance as much as I am the width of the counter weights. If it looks doable I'll either set it up in a lathe and if it seems like it's cutting good I'll finish it there. If not I'll rough it in then finish it on a cylindrical grinder. as soon as I find a crank I'll have a better idea of what I'm up against.


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## Modifiedmark (Jun 14, 2013)

Naked Arborist said:


> I have had a Poulan 3500 Timber master sitting on the shelf for two years+ now. It has a smoked piston. Just lack the time to alter and port a jug for it. When she does go on the chopping block I'm shooting for a quad port ported jug :hmm3grin2orange:




The 60cc 3500 is probably a better candidate for the conversion then the 46-49cc saws. The cyl bolts are spaced a little bit wider to begin with and you can use the heavier duty double pawl starter assy on it.

It also has a wider cutout on the front of the case to use the wider muffler.


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## Naked Arborist (Jun 15, 2013)

Modifiedmark said:


> The 60cc 3500 is probably a better candidate for the conversion then the 46-49cc saws. The cyl bolts are spaced a little bit wider to begin with and you can use the heavier duty double pawl starter assy on it.
> 
> It also has a wider cutout on the front of the case to use the wider muffler.



Spot on and I'm shooting for the 80's. I need heft in the bottom.


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## dooby (Jun 17, 2013)

opcorn:


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## dooby (Jun 21, 2013)

kspakland said:


> Agreed, and the best part is: NO snackie wimmin pix !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!



I can't wait to see the next part of this. This guy is Good!!! IMOopcorn:


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## MechanicMatt (Jan 10, 2014)

Ed, I loved this thread. Ever get the carb figured out?


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## Arrowhead (Jan 11, 2014)

Hi Matt, honestly... I still haven't messed with it since I did the video. I think about it quite a bit, and look at it almost everyday sitting on the bench.  
I've just had sooo many other projects / priorities I have to get finished. I hoping to have time soon.


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## jeff taswelder (Jan 11, 2014)

That is just wicked 
cant whate to see the end video opcorn:opcorn:


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## Tractorsaw1 (Jan 11, 2014)

I need to make time for this project. I had everything waiting to do it with no time. Picked up another 2700 yesterday. Real shame these air filters are NLA. If there really is some interest in the bushings send me a pm. When I make mine I could buzz out a few more sets, but don't expect that to happen tomorrow!


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## redfin (Jan 11, 2014)

I tried to google the youtube link to find his video. Can someone help me out?


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## MnSam (Jan 11, 2014)

Post #305 on page 16


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## GrassGuerilla (Jan 11, 2014)

Bump for a great thread. Hope there's some follow up...


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## Modifiedmark (Jan 11, 2014)

I already told Ed soon as the job I'm on is over I'm going over to his place. I'll personally give him a boot to kick start him back on this one.

I sent him a good HDA 137 carb to try on it, but I really don't think it will change anything as I found those carbs need to be base set at least two turns out to begin with so I think he is fine with the one he already has, but we will see.


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## Tractorsaw1 (Jan 11, 2014)

Sure sounds pretty good in the video!


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## stubnail67 (Jan 11, 2014)

great read....nice job!!!!


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## The Ripper (Jan 11, 2014)

Tractorsaw1 said:


> I need to make time for this project. I had everything waiting to do it with no time. Picked up another 2700 yesterday. Real shame these air filters are NLA. If there really is some interest in the bushings send me a pm. When I make mine I could buzz out a few more sets, but don't expect that to happen tomorrow!




While you got everything tooled up,make me set and just PM me when your done. I check the site daily.

I'd like to thank Ed for taking the time to think outside the box in masterminding the ultimate sleeper IMO,kinda like adapting small block chevy vortex heads to a mopar where it's a win win solution in building a very robust saw. Hat's off to Ed 

After watching the video,I see no signs of the saw having carb issues.


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## MechanicMatt (Jan 18, 2014)

opcorn:


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## tombukt2 (Feb 1, 2014)

Interesting this is the Ron Hartil designed Baird poulan 2700-3300 series Made in the 80's we had this unit to 65 cc back in the late 80's wen hot saws were really taking off Ive stated for years the Hartil 3.3 cube units could run circles round a wood boss stock and it always did at less than half cost .. the Black Pro craftsman model added twin ring piston . and nikasil coatings My two were burnt in a garage fire all that survived was the engine assy all plastics melted .. mine were all found in trash or being thrown out at a sears service center once yearly Had a friend at sears who'd call me in Jan to let me know throw out days coming theyre hard to find now days . I used rim sprocket at 325 pitch solid roller bar 16-18. and it could also pull a 404 setup but the 325 was much more fun . its interestin to see this Revisited again .. Thanx anyone have an old baird 5-7 cube power head theyd like to sell maybe in orig green?


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## tombukt2 (Feb 1, 2014)

Interesting this is the Ron Hartil designed Baird poulan 2700-3300 series Made in the 80's we had this unit to 65 cc back in the late 80's wen hot saws were really taking off Ive stated for years the Hartil 3.3 cube units could run circles round a wood boss stock and it always did at less than half cost .. the Black Pro craftsman model added twin ring piston . and nikasil coatings My two were burnt in a garage fire all that survived was the engine assy all plastics melted .. mine were all found in trash or being thrown out at a sears service center once yearly Had a friend at sears who'd call me in Jan to let me know throw out days coming theyre hard to find now days . I used rim sprocket at 325 pitch solid roller bar 16-18. and it could also pull a 404 setup but the 325 was much more fun . its interestin to see this Revisited again .. Thanx anyone have an old baird 5-7 cube power head theyd like to sell maybe in orig green?


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## sachsmo (Feb 1, 2014)

I got one o' them 'frankensaws' it's not what I would call a sleeper since it is based off a 116si.

Them were pretty good ones stock.

I put a 272 top end on one and came out to damned near 77 cc!

I'm going to do another and use an OEM 7900 top end.

Perhaps I will start a thread on that one.


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## tombukt2 (Feb 1, 2014)

do not know all those model numbers ..


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## HuskyHeadDave (Feb 2, 2014)

Husqvarna 36 sidecover


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## HuskyHeadDave (Feb 2, 2014)

Husqvarna 36 sidecover


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## MechanicMatt (Apr 3, 2014)

ED! did you ever figure out the tuning on this project? Its made me rethink a lot of combos, every time i say to myself, "nah, can't be done" i think about the poulan sporting the stihl top end. Still love it man! I wish you lived local, my buddy, a die hard stihl head, told me there are no good poulans, I brought him with me to a GTG and let him run one of Leeha's, yeah he was speechless. I think it was a pp405 can't remember, Ill i remember is it sure changed his mind quickly.


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## B-N (Jul 30, 2014)

sachsmo said:


> I got one o' them 'frankensaws' it's not what I would call a sleeper since it is based off a 116si.
> 
> Them were pretty good ones stock.
> 
> ...


I would be very interested in seeing a thread about that.


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