# Climbing Hitches - What's your hitch?



## Timbit (Dec 28, 2011)

When I first started in the tree business (many years ago) we were taught the tautline hitch as the only acceptable climbing hitch. 
It has worked well for me over the years but now I see many newer hitches out there and I am a little interested in trying a new method. From my high angle rescue days we preached - minimal equipment used = less chance of equipment failure. 
Doing a bit of research and would like to hear some comments from the field (or canopy), what do you use up the tree (Blakes, Distel, VT, Tautline ...) and how well does it work for you?


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## dts99 (Dec 28, 2011)

Timbit said:


> When I first started in the tree business (many years ago) we were taught the tautline hitch as the only acceptable climbing hitch.
> It has worked well for me over the years but now I see many newer hitches out there and I am a little interested in trying a new method. From my high angle rescue days we preached - minimal equipment used = less chance of equipment failure.
> Doing a bit of research and would like to hear some comments from the field (or canopy), what do you use up the tree (Blakes, Distel, VT, Tautline ...) and how well does it work for you?



i started with the tauntline in highschool, for it very difficult to advance limb to limb, retieing 3 knots every time, i switched to a split tail with a blakes hitch and a hitch tending pully, i was high class for a month or so i said i better at least ty the eye to eye hitches, i climbed on a distel with a hitch climber pully and a petzl pantin foot acsender for the past year, i loved it put found it hard to decend with out a lot of wieght on the rope not so good for limb walking but still better by far than tauntline, i rescently have been climbing on vt, perfect took the wieght problem away, now i see the a.r.t. spider jack!!! as soon as i feel like dropping $350 and figure out if the "not about to atach mid line" issue (if it is one) i may give that a shot, i cant keep up with the new stuff... as for less equipent less failure, it take but a second to look at our set up and see that all auto locking beaners are locked and your safe, fast, streamline and smooth


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## ForTheArborist (Dec 28, 2011)

I throw around prussics a lot. They're good for a lot of uses, and they can be adjusted from greater to lesser binding strength. 

I used to use a blakes in my drt, but it required too much tending to keep it grabbing on the rope. I'd keep a shunt just above it just in case that know failed. That blakes might have been loosening up all of the time because I was using a static line that doesn't allow the blakes to set snug on the line. The static line is probably just too stiff. 

I might try the blakes again this dynamic line I've been climbing on. 

I'm going to look into the tress when I get a moment. I heard it's as strong as the prussic, but it's easier to loosen up after the load has been put on it.


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## 2treeornot2tree (Dec 28, 2011)

I started out by using the blakes hitch, but it got real tight and was hard for me to move it one handed while accending. I then tried the vt. I liked it alot except for one long decents (20' or more) it would get really hot no matter how slow I went and I felt like i was burning my fingers. This is most likely due to the fact that I weigh around 300 lbs. (working on losing it, but dang I like to eat) I bought a A.R.T. Lockjack yesturday at a arborist store after playing/ hanging on it for about 30 mins. It can be put on midline. The owner told me that he wont sell the spider jack because it has a wood handle that protrudes upwards. He said ( might be a once and a million chance) that if you fell and smacked into the tree that the handle could possible puncture your chest. The lockjack also has a swivel on the saddle connection.


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## TreeAce (Dec 28, 2011)

I tend to mix it up alittle. My two main choices are distel and blakes. VT is very good but I tend to use the distel more cuz I think its bomb proof. Now a days I tend to use the blakes for situations where it wont stay tied for long, like if I just need a second TIP for a little while. Its a good knot except I noticed it's not worth crap when used with tachyon. But my ocean poly I2I works very well with it using a distel. Blakes works OK with bluemoon (poison ivy) and works maybe the best with good old saftey blue or arbormaster. I am fat and I cant really say the distel ever binds up to tight. My biggest beef with the VT is that it doesnt always set for me. Only takes a second to fix but requires more attention. The VT is the smoothest but just not enough to make me switch.


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## dts99 (Dec 28, 2011)

TreeAce said:


> I tend to mix it up alittle. My two main choices are distel and blakes. VT is very good but I tend to use the distel more cuz I think its bomb proof. Now a days I tend to use the blakes for situations where it wont stay tied for long, like if I just need a second TIP for a little while. Its a good knot except I noticed it's not worth crap when used with tachyon. But my ocean poly I2I works very well with it using a distel. Blakes works OK with bluemoon (poison ivy) and works maybe the best with good old saftey blue or arbormaster. I am fat and I cant really say the distel ever binds up to tight. My biggest beef with the VT is that it doesnt always set for me. Only takes a second to fix but requires more attention. The VT is the smoothest but just not enough to make me switch.



i should ad that i used a 28 inch beeline when i was climbing on distel and i have a 36 for vt, a longer beeline on distel may have solved the one problem i did have with it


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## Tree Pig (Dec 28, 2011)

dts99 said:


> i should ad that i used a 28 inch beeline when i was climbing on distel and i have a 36 for vt, a longer beeline on distel may have solved the one problem i did have with it



I use a either 26" or 24" 8mm beeline with distel its just long enough to get the legs around and connect to the biner. have not had a single issue with it as of yet. I had 10mm on before and it did seem to bind up more then the smaller cord does. 
11mm rope by the way.


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## Nailsbeats (Dec 28, 2011)

Schwabisch, nothing fancy but very reliable. I can just take a flying leap and it'll catch everytime.


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## formationrx (Dec 28, 2011)

*hitch*

for me, the tautline is the best fiction hitch. its simple, highly adjustable, and has never failed me. I've seen guys use one wrap over and two under, or two over and two under, or one over and three under. on the tail lever i have seen one high deadhead, one low deadhead, two deadheads- one high one low, one deadhead in the center and one low, even three 3 deadheads equally spaced for instant recognition in case of slipping. funny how that little slip feels like a long mile.....


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## TreEmergencyB (Dec 28, 2011)

i switch it up often, Distil mostly swabish sometimes, depends on how i feel like wrapping the rope that morning. Like to use the blakes on removals at times and sometimes on the ball.


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## TreeAce (Dec 28, 2011)

formationrx said:


> for me, the tautline is the best fiction hitch. its simple, highly adjustable, and has never failed me. I've seen guys use one wrap over and two under, or two over and two under, or one over and three under. on the tail lever i have seen one high deadhead, one low deadhead, two deadheads- one high one low, one deadhead in the center and one low, even three 3 deadheads equally spaced for instant recognition in case of slipping. funny how that little slip feels like a long mile.....



1st...welcome to AS.
2nd...This posts reminds of a something that Prentice110 once said..."anyone who likes climbing on a taughtline needs to have there ******* head examined!!"
Take that how you wish, but I couldn't resist.

RIP Prentice110


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## pdqdl (Dec 28, 2011)

There are about 3 important considerations for every friction hitch:

How reliable is it, how well does it hold under load, and how easy is it to use otherwise?

The VT is the ultimate for easy to use, since it releases very easy, and ties rather quickly also. It also holds very well; so much so that it isn't very good for sliding quickly down a rope. Others have commented about burning their hands, but I think that is because it is generally used with smaller diameter tress cords. Almost everyone agrees that the VT needs to be set, other wise it can drop you. _So reliability isn't too good here._

The schwabisch, distal, and some of the other eye-to-eye rigs are quite a bit more reliable that the VT, but don't release quite as well. They probably bind and hold equally well, and will have the same heat problems when used with smaller diameter tress cords. Tying them is slightly more complicated than the VT.

Blake's hitch is the old standard to beat; it releases reliably but with quite a bit of reluctance, so sliding the knot up always comes with an expense of extra effort. I don't think it can be beat for reliability and ease of going down the rope on a long slide. Since it is usually tied with the same rope size as it is binding to, getting hot and burning the hand of the climber is not too much of a problem. I don't think too many climbers use the blake's hitch with the smaller diameter climbing lines, so heat issues might be a problem on less than 1/2" rope. Sadly, this ability to slide down a rope with good control will also encourage the more adventurous climbers to damage their ropes on hot slides down out of the tree.

The old "taut-line" is the original knot that many learned on (I did!); but should always be replaced at least with a Blake's hitch. While it holds just as well, it has a tendency to creep untied, and it can choke down onto the line so tight you can't slide at all. It comes with the greatest expense in labor to release and slide up the rope.

The Prussic, either in a closed loop or in I2I, is still a pretty good knot. While this is a very reliable knot, it shares most of the performance of the Blakes and taut line hitches, and offers several advantages: It cannot come untied by accident and it will hold well no matter which direction you pull on it. Sadly, this means sliding up the rope isn't too easy, much like the taut line.


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## Scrat (Dec 28, 2011)

2treeornot2tree said:


> I started out by using the blakes hitch, but it got real tight and was hard for me to move it one handed while accending. I then tried the vt. I liked it alot except for one long decents (20' or more) it would get really hot no matter how slow I went and I felt like i was burning my fingers. This is most likely due to the fact that I weigh around 300 lbs. (working on losing it, but dang I like to eat) I bought a A.R.T. Lockjack yesturday at a arborist store after playing/ hanging on it for about 30 mins. It can be put on midline. The owner told me that he wont sell the spider jack because it has a wood handle that protrudes upwards. He said ( might be a once and a million chance) that if you fell and smacked into the tree that the handle could possible puncture your chest. The lockjack also has a swivel on the saddle connection.



Just to share my opinion on the SpiderJack concern, The said 'wood handle' is the brake lever and it is 2-1/2" long nearly an inch wide and almost as thick with a fully rounded end, in addition it is on a pin like a hinge on the main body so it is not rigid and the SJ is attached via an eye to a caribeener to your saddle, or swivel, or ring. I think it is less than likely (1:100,000,000,000,000,000,000) that you could puncture anything with it. At best maybe a bruise the same as any hard object between you and the tree. Honestly you have a way better chance of puncturing yourself with a misplaced gaff or during a kickout. I climb on a SJ and if that is your only reason for not using it I think you should re-evaluate your considreation of the SJ, as well as the source of that information. As far as your weight you must be one big Dude, I am 6'5" and just barely over 200, with full gear (including a sizable saw) I'm just at 240 which is the limit for the Gecko spurs I use. I believe Buckingham steel spurs limit is 350. I don't know your frame size but if your muscles are used to carring that weight and you lean out a bit like you want, I venture to say you would be one lean mean tree wrecking machine! 

Best
Scrat


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## 2treeornot2tree (Dec 29, 2011)

I havent every seen a spider jack in person, so I was just relaying what the store owner had to say. You are right, you are probably more likey to get a puncture wound from something else, like branches. I am a big dude. I am about 6'2" tall. But I have alot of musle. In college, I could leg press 1000lbs. Went to buy 16" climbing boots, and found out that they wont close around my calves. Think my calves are like 20" around.


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## sir_nick2 (Dec 29, 2011)

Vt 4 wraps 3 tresses on a hitch climber setup since retired for a spider jack


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## sgreanbeans (Dec 29, 2011)

Taught line 93-99, Blakes 99-07, Swabash (sp?)


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## deevo (Dec 29, 2011)

I have been using Blakes with 8mm Beeline,DMM pulley, and a pantin last 4 years. I personally like it, I climb on Blue Streak/Yellow jacket, slides and releases nice for me, and have no issues. I want to get a 600' roll of the new Samson Vortex in the spring. I got a small hank of it at the TCIA show and want to give it a further go.


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## TreeAce (Dec 29, 2011)

Do you spider jack users find it annonying that it cannot be attachet mid line? Why not just use a lock jack? I have used either one but am considering it.


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## sir_nick2 (Dec 29, 2011)

You mean spider jack users lol, i just got one and every thing i read mentions that it's not mid-line attachable i really dont see the big deal. Watch the sperjackery series by joe harris on youtube and you'll probably see that this one down fall greatly out weighs the pros of this device.


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## dts99 (Dec 29, 2011)

sir_nick2 said:


> Vt 4 wraps 3 tresses on a hitch climber setup since retired for a spider jack



my question for the spiderjack... i climb about 80% of my trims starting with a big shot and climb up into the canopy on a treeaccend with dueling pantins, i then switch over to a vt, can i do this even if my tie in spot is not right infront of me, like say still 20 feet over my head or what ever, or do i need to slide it onto the rope and then back over a limb or thu a friction device? or can it be put on before i climb, or should i just buy it and adjust my system to use it. maybe clip a pulley to my treeaccend and use drt off Dbrt, and have all the benys from everything.... on this note and old timer called me a gadget climber, i said how whould you get up there, he said i wouldnt.


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## dts99 (Dec 29, 2011)

dts99 said:


> my question for the spiderjack... i climb about 80% of my trims starting with a big shot and climb up into the canopy on a treeaccend with dueling pantins, i then switch over to a vt, can i do this even if my tie in spot is not right infront of me, like say still 20 feet over my head or what ever, or do i need to slide it onto the rope and then back over a limb or thu a friction device? or can it be put on before i climb, or should i just buy it and adjust my system to use it. maybe clip a pulley to my treeaccend and use drt off Dbrt, and have all the benys from everything.... on this note and old timer called me a gadget climber, i said how whould you get up there, he said i wouldnt.



my question was answered mostly i didnt see there was a page 2, next question on sherrill tree there are 2 spiderjacks , costing a few bucks apart, with the same discription, whats up with them?


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## sir_nick2 (Dec 29, 2011)

Watch spiderjackery 3 and it'll all be explained, you would have the SJ aleady on your line, set your TIP with the throwline leave the SJ on the ground setup, ascend drt as you would normally once you are there lanyard in remove your acenders and pull the working end of the line down and the SJ will self tend up to your position then you can work Ddrt from there


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## TreeAce (Dec 29, 2011)

dts99 said:


> my question was answered mostly i didnt see there was a page 2, next question on sherrill tree there are 2 spiderjacks , costing a few bucks apart, with the same discription, whats up with them?



Does one have a swivel?


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## dts99 (Dec 29, 2011)

Apon further investigation the more expencive one (by 5 bucks) is the spidejack 2, it just doenst say that, i think it only requires 1 carabeaner as aposed to 2 for the sj1 , im guna get one when i feel like dropping the cash


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## Timbit (Dec 29, 2011)

2treeornot2tree said:


> I havent every seen a spider jack in person, so I was just relaying what the store owner had to say. You are right, you are probably more likey to get a puncture wound from something else, like branches. I am a big dude. I am about 6'2" tall. But I have alot of musle. In college, I could leg press 1000lbs. Went to buy 16" climbing boots, and found out that they wont close around my calves. Think my calves are like 20" around.



If you got the coin there is the ID 20 (I think around $245 or 5 beaver pelts), I used it lots on 1/2" static kernmantle rope for positioning and descending. Works great, easy to use, can be put mid rope, handle is small and not really in the way. 
BTW I will keep your number handy for my next bar fight. :hmm3grin2orange:


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## TreeAce (Dec 29, 2011)

Timbit said:


> If you got the coin there is the ID 20 (I think around $245 or 5 beaver pelts), I used it lots on 1/2" static kernmantle rope for positioning and descending. Works great, easy to use, can be put mid rope, handle is small and not really in the way.
> BTW I will keep your number handy for my next bar fight. :hmm3grin2orange:



Do you have any more info? ID 20 didnt show anything tree climbing wise when I searched it. I watched that spiderjack3 video. Its pretty good.


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## Timbit (Dec 29, 2011)

TreeAce said:


> Do you have any more info? ID 20 didnt show anything tree climbing wise when I searched it. I watched that spiderjack3 video. Its pretty good.



TreeAce - try this link: Descenders and Figure 8s for Tree Climbing and Rappelling


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## Timbit (Dec 29, 2011)

TreeAce said:


> Do you have any more info? ID 20 didnt show anything tree climbing wise when I searched it. I watched that spiderjack3 video. Its pretty good.



here's another one with more product info ... I'D S | Petzl


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## TreeAce (Dec 29, 2011)

Ok I got it,thx. I am familiar with the ID. I guess the "20" threw me off.


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## 2treeornot2tree (Dec 29, 2011)

i have a id already. It is great for coming down, but to go up, you either have to be heman to pull the rope up threw the device or attach a pully above the id as a redirect. ( i think sherrill tree has a detail showing the pulley and id setup). The nice thing about the id is it can acutally lock it so it doesnt move on the rope no matter what. (The handle moves the cam and pinches the rope.)


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## minuteman tree (Dec 29, 2011)

*hitch*

I typically use a klemheist (5/16 ultratech) with 1/2" yellow streak and a cmi foot ascender. It tends to lock up under my weight though.


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## squad143 (Dec 29, 2011)

Nailsbeats said:


> Schwabisch, nothing fancy but very reliable. I can just take a flying leap and it'll catch everytime.



I a Schwabish fan as well.


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## dts99 (Dec 29, 2011)

squad143 said:


> I a Schwabish fan as well.



from looks a shwabashki is just a distel with the botton wrapped opposite, id think the distal would act the same and just hook to your carabeaner smoother?


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## jimbo666 (Aug 11, 2012)

Wow ive read all the post nobody use this???? i use Machard Tresse 4wrap all the time
sometimes Valdotain Tresse kind of french prussic really smooth! dosent grab a lot tho, sliding but really good for fast climb , i use it on Yales BlueMoon with a short beeline or 22''tenex 10mm


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## beastmaster (Aug 13, 2012)

I use one of two set-ups these days, on 11mm blaze I use both a vt with a hitch climber pulley, and a gri gri with a hand ascender and pulley for SRT. I some times interchange systems converting my SRT to double rope still using the gri gri, and my Vt and hitch climber pulley with a rope wrench for SRT. I like the rope wrench set up but Im not comfortable ascending on it yet, but its sweet for working through the canopy of big trees. I have my eye on a SJ my self, but that's a lot of money to drop with out first trying one.
I think more important then what hitch to use is using a hitch with a pulley to advance your line. I don't know how I did it for all those years with out a pulley to one hand advance my climbing line. Iv'e also got rid of all those big heavy clips and use light weight carabiners, makes a big difference at the end of the day.


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## jefflovstrom (Aug 13, 2012)

beastmaster said:


> I use one of two set-ups these days, on 11mm blaze I use both a vt with a hitch climber pulley, and a gri gri with a hand ascender and pulley for SRT. I some times interchange systems converting my SRT to double rope still using the gri gri, and my Vt and hitch climber pulley with a rope wrench for SRT. I like the rope wrench set up but Im not comfortable ascending on it yet, but its sweet for working through the canopy of big trees. I have my eye on a SJ my self, but that's a lot of money to drop with out first trying one.
> I think more important then what hitch to use is using a hitch with a pulley to advance your line. I don't know how I did it for all those years with out a pulley to one hand advance my climbing line. Iv'e also got rid of all those big heavy clips and use light weight carabiners, makes a big difference at the end of the day.



You are a tough bastid, Beast!
If I did actually climb again, it would be on a monkey fist, a scare strap and some other stuff.
Jeff :msp_w00t:


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## BigUglySquirrel (Aug 13, 2012)

I have to say, I think almost everyone goes through this type of progression:

A) Tauntline on a traditional tie-in with a rope snap or a pair of half hitches at the attachment point
B) A Blakes hitch on a traditional tie
C) A Blakes hitch on a split tail
D) Add a tending pulley to the split tail
E) Eye to eye split tail with a distel or schwabish and a tending pulley
F) VT or something similar with a hitch climber

Somewhere in there, it seems most people discover some sort of friction saver...which I recommend...especially if your a bit...um..."stout", such as myself. Honestly...I see no reason to go past that for DdRT. Of course, there are accessories and variations (pantin, Anchor Bridge system, variations to the hitch climber system...)
that one can employ to suit whatever application arises, but I am so happy with the VT/hitch climber setup, that I haven't thought twice about the spider jack/lock jack etc. (That's my personal opinion....you may love some sort of mechanical friction device...keep an open mind)

Now, this isn't taking SRT into account. I haven't spent much time with those systems, but I really see the benefit of at least knowing how to use those systems and owning the minimum gear involved to take advantage of them when needed. The static tie in point really appeals to me, as I usually don't have any means of feasible rescue coming from the ground crew. Just a few things to consider. 

My last piece of advice: Never allow yourself to stop learning. Arborculture and climbing are constantly changing....so should you.

I should also add, that I use Samson Arbormaster rope and either 8mm Oceans Polyester or HRT eye to eye tails.


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## Iustinian (Aug 14, 2012)

I usually start a new eye-to-eye (I've been splicing my own out of ocean poly or vectran 8mm) with a VT or XT, and when the cord starts to develop memory, then I switch to distel or michocain until the memory changes again and I switch back or buy or make a new e2e. I've used ultratech and 8mm beeline alot, but ocean poly and vectran seem alot better, Sterling RIT is tough as well, but so far the best is the newest Donaughy's Armor Prus -- really awesome stuff.


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## tramp bushler (Aug 14, 2012)

2treeornot2tree said:


> I havent every seen a spider jack in person, so I was just relaying what the store owner had to say. You are right, you are probably more likey to get a puncture wound from something else, like branches. I am a big dude. I am about 6'2" tall. But I have alot of musle. In college, I could leg press 1000lbs. Went to buy 16" climbing boots, and found out that they wont close around my calves. Think my calves are like 20" around.



Viberg will build the 16" double sole Lineman's boot to fit you like a glove. Just have them send you a fitting kit. It comes with a tape and instructions on where to measure. My calves are 20" also and my 16" 148s lace up just right. I am close to 280 lbs in the spurs with a climbing saw on.


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## Tree services. (Aug 16, 2012)

VT,Bee-line 3 wrap


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## Pjasonpsquirrel (Oct 19, 2012)

Tree Pig said:


> I use a either 26" or 24" 8mm beeline with distel its just long enough to get the legs around and connect to the biner. have not had a single issue with it as of yet. I had 10mm on before and it did seem to bind up more then the smaller cord does.
> 11mm rope by the way.



Is that with. Hitch climber?????


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## Dannicus (Oct 19, 2012)

VT, Hitchclimber - Beeline/Ocean/Ultratech 5/16"

Very rarely these days a 3 wrap english prusik.


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## wottiv (Oct 20, 2012)

I liked the reply about the hitch progression.

Blakes to VT(hitchclimber) to XT(hitchclimber)
At first I did not like the new Armor Prus I2I, but after a few uses it has broken in nicely.


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## treemandan (Oct 20, 2012)

For the last few years i have been using these.


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## matty f (Oct 21, 2012)

V.T all the way with a hitch climber and rope guide.. Rope wrench and pantin for SRT but will switch to double rope when anchore is achieved as its just so slick with a rope guide!


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