# Carpenter Ants



## curdy (Oct 13, 2005)

Hi everyone,

This is the first time posting to this site...or any for that matter! I've read a lot of material from the site and found it very helpful. My wife and I recently purchased a home in the Philadelphia area. We have been very busy fixing everything up and spending a good deal of time in the yard which is 2 acres. The land had never been taken care of...at all. There was tons of brush, poison ivy, and dead/dying trees. I've cut down all the brush and dead/dying trees and the land is awesome. Lots of 75+ yr old oak, hickory, and maple trees. 

Problem is that it appears to me that there are a lot of trees that have carpenter ant problems. I'm not about to let those little devils destroy my trees that took so long to grow.  

I've read that they don't like hardwood...well oak and hickory are pretty darn hard and they're in there. Does anyone have some experience with this sort of issue? Cost of treating them? Hope of treating them?

Thanks,

DAN


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## Elmore (Oct 13, 2005)

You can find info on Carpenter Ants here:

http://lancaster.unl.edu/enviro/pest/factsheets/004-97.htm

I am apprehensive about filling in cavities on otherwise healthy trees though.


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## begleytree (Oct 13, 2005)

Neither carpenter ants nor any other ant you'll find around Philly have been proven to penetrate CODIT walls. I've not found any evidence of that with all the wood I've cut and ripped just for that purpose. 
IMO, and there's a GUY on here who could tell you better than I, Ants only make nests in dead/decaying wood. The ants are not there killing your trees, but merely inhabiting the parts that are already dead.
Check into having your trees deadwooded, and if you like, spray or bait the ants.
I've never seen an old tree that didn't have ants.
I dislike filling cavities also.

Great cleanup job, BTW. looking good!
-Ralph


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## 12guns (Oct 13, 2005)

Carpenter ants don't eat trees and kill them...they burrow into already dead/soft wood for nests...find the nest, kill them...problem solved. oh yeah, ants have very sensitive respritory systems, so just about anything will kill them.


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## curdy (Oct 14, 2005)

Had the trees deadwooded already. My tree guy was way up in one of the old oaks and said there were a lot of them in there. I can understand a couple of the trees have been damaged by weather or whatever and being infested...but it just seems like too many trees for that to be the case.

Interesting thing though... I cut down a small maple next to my driveway (looked to me to be healthy, but was in the way for a wider one being put in), the stump showed no decay or signs of any ants when I dropped it. The next day I went to get into my car and found 30+ carpenter ants surrounding the top of the stump chomping away. They were joined by some feisty yellow jackets too. My understanding is that the tree was neither dead nor decaying...while it will be in the future, it wasn't the day after I cut it.

What's up with that?


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## Elmore (Oct 14, 2005)

danielmccurdy said:


> Had the trees deadwooded already. My tree guy was way up in one of the old oaks and said there were a lot of them in there. I can understand a couple of the trees have been damaged by weather or whatever and being infested...but it just seems like too many trees for that to be the case.
> 
> Interesting thing though... I cut down a small maple next to my driveway (looked to me to be healthy, but was in the way for a wider one being put in), the stump showed no decay or signs of any ants when I dropped it. The next day I went to get into my car and found 30+ carpenter ants surrounding the top of the stump chomping away. They were joined by some feisty yellow jackets too. My understanding is that the tree was neither dead nor decaying...while it will be in the future, it wasn't the day after I cut it.
> 
> What's up with that?


Sugars in the sap. With Carpenter Ants, come the end of Summer, towards Fall, before Winter and in preparation for such...they will seek out carbohydrates and the sugar in the tree sap is a potent, simple carbohydrate. In Spring I think that their favored food is protein, like insect carcasses, Probably a similar situation with Yellow Jackets. Interesting info if you plan to bait and prepare your own preparations. I think I have the order right.


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## 12guns (Oct 14, 2005)

Elmore said:


> Sugars in the sap. With Carpenter Ants, come the end of Summer, towards Fall, before Winter and in preparation for such...they will seek out carbohydrates and the sugar in the tree sap is a potent, simple carbohydrate. In Spring I think that their favored food is protein, like insect carcasses, Probably a similar situation with Yellow Jackets. Interesting info if you plan to bait and prepare your own preparations. I think I have the order right.



yeah, what he said...also keep in mind termites are the only organism that can digest cellulose (in all wood), so the ants are looking for something else. if you look in the soft wood where the ants have been "eating" you'll see parts of other ants and small granular pieces of wood...kind of interesting.


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## curdy (Oct 14, 2005)

Yeah, I know the ants don't actually eat the wood. I'm just very suprised that there are so many trees that seem to be infested. I'll take some pictures this weekend and post them. I really hope I can take care of them before things get worse.

I have an expert coming over next week to walk through with me to see what we can do.


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## moss (Oct 14, 2005)

danielmccurdy said:


> Yeah, I know the ants don't actually eat the wood. I'm just very suprised that there are so many trees that seem to be infested. I'll take some pictures this weekend and post them. I really hope I can take care of them before things get worse.



I've never been in woods that didn't have carpenter ants running up and down trees, they're part of the woodland ecosystem. From what you describe there was plenty of dead wood and duff buildup on the ground, a good environment for them. As everyone else pointed out, the ants aren't doing damage to your trees, I would forget about them, they're part of the landscape. Don't forget to leave a couple of dead branches attached, quite a few native bird species need these to create nest cavities. They love to eat carpenter ants too. Don't sterilize your little piece of heaven!


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## jerseydevil (Oct 21, 2005)

Hey there,
Welcome to the neighborhood. I live in West Chester( almost in malvern). We have a lot in common. I have been clearing our yard as you have after about 25-40 years of neglect  . I live in an old farm house(about 300 years old)
Here is my 2 cents. It is pretty much what others have said but i will try to be very clear.  
The ants have been in those trees forever. If they have not done unnatural harm by now, then they incapable of doing so.
The ants are doing what they are supposed to do and they serve a purpose.I remember seeing ants in tree cavitys when i was a child 25+ years ago, some of those trees are still alive and kicking a$$. Remember though, trees like humans are not meant to last forever and there is nothing wrong with death, It may give you the chance to plant your own trees which would be admired by future generations(food for thought). although by the pics you posted, you have pretty healthy trees. 
Even if you wipe them out now, they would soon be replaced by others. What is your plan? Do you plan to spend every weekend for the rest of your life killing ants? I would leave them alone. Spend your time ant proofing your house.
I would not be surprised to hear that your expert wants to kill the ants and set up monitors,traps perhaps cameras and recording equipment; I would hope not but would not be surprised. I am curious to find out what he/she says.
Please see my own post regarding ants, maybe it will help. I didn't listen to those who told me to kill the ants and I am glad. I have learned much about ants and other insects since then.
Use common sense, And remember, the ants have been in those trees longer then man has been on this or any other continent, you still have lots of trees right. Think about it.
Two last things, trees that are too close to your house can be dangerous if they fall and roots can do serious damage to foundations and patios. Also, carpenter ants don't belong in your house. Worry about those two problems first and formost.
Thanks for your time and attention my friend
JD


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