# EAB confirmed in Cicinnati



## cryo stops wear (May 25, 2007)

EAB confirmed in Cincinnati.
Well wednesday this week a 100 or so trees found infested with EAB dept of ag. confirms.

It seems that the eab has been in cincy area for a couple years. This week they were found in Turpin hills area and Wyoming area of cincinnati .
BAD NEWS this area of cincy has mostly Ash trees and they have flocked to a upscale side of town.
I have lived here all my life and this will have a huge impact on these heavily Ash forested areas.

Ohio recently approved the use of Pentra Bark and SAFARI for USE on EAB

12 OZ of SAFARI, 5 OUNCES OF PENTRA BARK IN 1 GAL H20 THIS WILL TREAT UP TO 32" DBH TREE. Used AS a bark spray on lower 6` of trunk
It is carried thru tree in 5 days and kills internal borers and beetles eating leaf tissue. .
Michigan state tested and proved this will get near 100% kill for 2 months.
Lets hope it works well since we are 4" or more low on rain fall.

The Arborist that detected EAB AND Cincinnati enquirer said imidacloprid was only option. Of course that would move too slow thru tree and is it even technically labeled for EAB? As far as i know the SAFARI AND PENTRA BARK ARE THE ONLY LABELED CHEMICAL FOR EAB.


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## ATH (May 25, 2007)

cryo stops wear said:


> Of course that would move too slow thru tree and is it even technically labeled for EAB? As far as i know the SAFARI AND PENTRA BARK ARE THE ONLY LABELED CHEMICAL FOR EAB.


Yes EAB is on Merit's label (click here to see)

Imidacloprid has a longer track record. Safari has one study. Promising results, but *one* study. Acephate (Acecaps) has also shown some promise; as has Bidrin. We each need to read the research, make professional and educated decisions, and help customers understand our recommendations. I'm running with imidacloprid, but looking forward to keeping an eye on more info about Safari.

If you are seeing heavy symptoms now, probably not worth treating with anything...


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## jrparbor04 (May 26, 2007)

the readings that i have read says that yes,,,there are treatments to help,,,not stop EAB,,,cut 'em down and try to recover,,,here in st.louis has not been id'd yet,,,i do believe EAB is living here though,,,,this is greater than the dutch elm disease already


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## begleytree (May 26, 2007)

if its in cincy it will be here soon. the winds and storms blow directly from cincy to us. not to mention all the wood running in and out the appo...
-Ralph


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## treevet (May 28, 2007)

cryo stops wear said:


> EAB confirmed in Cincinnati.
> Well wednesday this week a 100 or so trees found infested with EAB dept of ag. confirms.
> 
> It seems that the eab has been in cincy area for a couple years. This week they were found in Turpin hills area and Wyoming area of cincinnati .
> ...




I think this is an inaccurate post re eab in Wyoming. I live in Wyo and am on Urb For board (we meet Wed.) and this was not in the Enquirer. Discovery site is approx 20 miles away. I am with you on Safari and Pentrabark. Might add Safari is $350.00 per 3lb bag!


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## cryo stops wear (May 28, 2007)

*eab*

The eab are in Wyoming, we have seen damage from them on
leafs " notching". We were also doing some Safari treatments in Wyoming and almost caught a beetle.
They sure do move quick. You might take a better look around. A fellow Arborist has also seen damage and evidence from them in Milford . DONT BELIEVE EVERYTHING YOU READ IN THE PAPER OR THE MEDIA, remember they also said the only treatment was imidacloprid.


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## cryo stops wear (May 28, 2007)

ATH said:


> Yes EAB is on Merit's label (click here to see)
> 
> Imidacloprid has a longer track record. Safari has one study. Promising results, but *one* study. Acephate (Acecaps) has also shown some promise; as has Bidrin. We each need to read the research, make professional and educated decisions, and help customers understand our recommendations. I'm running with imidacloprid, but looking forward to keeping an eye on more info about Safari.
> 
> If you are seeing heavy symptoms now, probably not worth treating with anything...



When you have heavy pressure and the beetles are active iimidacloprid moves too slow thru tree.
In a big tree it can take months and with our drought conditions who knows .


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## treevet (May 28, 2007)

cryo stops wear said:


> The eab are in Wyoming, we have seen damage from them on
> leafs " notching". We were also doing some Safari treatments in Wyoming and almost caught a beetle.
> They sure do move quick. You might take a better look around. A fellow Arborist has also seen damage and evidence from them in Milford . DONT BELIEVE EVERYTHING YOU READ IN THE PAPER OR THE MEDIA, remember they also said the only treatment was imidacloprid.



Don t know who you are (who are you) but there is no confirmed infestation in my town (lived here for 30 years). I work in this town usually 6 days a week so I still say you should not spread misinformation until verified. Also almost everyone already knows about Safari for quite a while. Old news.

P.S. any perceived notching you may have seen, would have been on leaves, not leafs.


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## jrparbor04 (May 28, 2007)

I Believe Eab Is Already In The St. Louis Area,,,we Have Many Arborists' Looking Everyday


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## xander9727 (May 28, 2007)

I am the arborist that identified the infestation. I'll stick with Xytect because it has good results in the studies. I'd like to see more research on Safari before I commit to it.


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## treevet (May 28, 2007)

xander9727 said:


> I am the arborist that identified the infestation. I'll stick with Xytect because it has good results in the studies. I'd like to see more research on Safari before I commit to it.



If that is the case, xander, you will find a message from me on your voice mail. The studies I have seen on imidacloprid have all had inconclusive results. What is the most recent of studies you ve seen? I think we re looking to Deb McCullough at Michigan State for further on Safari as I m fairly sure she did the only one so far. Such ease of application, quick infusion, lack of injury to tree, and lack of worry of injury to applicator and public makes me go for Safari. The results were promising (seems to be a trend w words like this). An ash, tough is it is can take some involvement w eab (not infestation).

Anyway current worries include problems w translocation bcs of lack of rainfall I feel. I have been e mailing w Dr. Dan Herms, Ohio State, author of the EAB fact sheet, and talking w Joe Boggs, Oh St Extension Agent. Would like to exchange thoughts w you if interested. As I said on msg, I am prob too far from you to be competitor of yours.


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## xander9727 (May 30, 2007)

Treevet,
I'll try and call you tomorrow. I am getting my ankle reconstructed on Friday so I'm a little over whelmed. I always look to share knowledge with fellow Arborist. I don't worry about competition......there is no way that ten companies could handle all of the work in the Tri-State area. 
What I am worried about is the potential for scamming and unqualified (unskilled) contractors using this as a profit source and giving the rest of us a bad name.


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## treevet (May 31, 2007)

xander9727 said:


> Treevet,
> I'll try and call you tomorrow. I am getting my ankle reconstructed on Friday so I'm a little over whelmed. I always look to share knowledge with fellow Arborist. I don't worry about competition......there is no way that ten companies could handle all of the work in the Tri-State area.
> What I am worried about is the potential for scamming and unqualified (unskilled) contractors using this as a profit source and giving the rest of us a bad name.



Hi Xander
I got your message yesterday. I had to go to my town s urb. forestry meeting right after work until I thought it was too late to call you. Got in tonight at 9:30 and gave you a call and left a message. What s the scoop on your ankle? Hope all goes well Fri. I ll keep trying to reach you over the weekend. Just let me know if I am imposing bcs of your operation. Good luck again. 

Just wanted to throw this out there. What is the chance that we are being scammed somewhat by the companies manufacturing and or distributing the chemicals involved w this? Like to see them justify the costs. They seem to be exorbitant to the point that it takes us out of making it worthwhile doing it and we will be the 1st to be blamed for cost and lack of effectiveness? I would have made more money doing regular tree jobs today instead of eab and IMO eab has to be done right now or not at all. Not talking about big profits just industry standard $ per man hour.


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## xander9727 (May 31, 2007)

Treevet,
Send me a pm or an email. I understand what your going through and I think I may have some answers. Call me on my cell, it's the emergency number on my answering machine.
My ankle surgery is to correct an injury I received parachuting in the military.......should have had it fixed years ago.


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## treevet (May 31, 2007)

xander9727 said:


> Treevet,
> Send me a pm or an email. I understand what your going through and I think I may have some answers. Call me on my cell, it's the emergency number on my answering machine.
> My ankle surgery is to correct an injury I received parachuting in the military.......should have had it fixed years ago.



I ll give you a call later tomorrow. I d like to have some time to talk to you and it is getting late. I ve got to get up at 5 tomorrow and drive to Columbus as my kid got in the state track meet. 

Look forward to it, Dave


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## BonsaiJedi (Jun 1, 2007)

treevet said:


> Hi Xander
> I got your message yesterday. I had to go to my town s urb. forestry meeting right after work until I thought it was too late to call you. Got in tonight at 9:30 and gave you a call and left a message. What s the scoop on your ankle? Hope all goes well Fri. I ll keep trying to reach you over the weekend. Just let me know if I am imposing bcs of your operation. Good luck again.
> 
> Just wanted to throw this out there. What is the chance that we are being scammed somewhat by the companies manufacturing and or distributing the chemicals involved w this? Like to see them justify the costs. They seem to be exorbitant to the point that it takes us out of making it worthwhile doing it and we will be the 1st to be blamed for cost and lack of effectiveness? I would have made more money doing regular tree jobs today instead of eab and IMO eab has to be done right now or not at all. Not talking about big profits just industry standard $ per man hour.




If you buy Xytect 2F at $191/qt the cost per inch the cost is $1.19/DBH inch and gets cheaper from there with higher purchasing volumes. Application via basal drench takes one man about five minutes per tree with no fancy equipment. That makes it one of the most cost effective and profitable services a tree care company can offer. The research backs up the efficacy, please contact me if you are looking for the work on imidacloprid for EAB. Also feel free to contact us for info on how to price your tree health care services so they are fair to you without being exorbitant to your clients.


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## treevet (Jun 2, 2007)

BonsaiJedi said:


> If you buy Xytect 2F at $191/qt the cost per inch the cost is $1.19/DBH inch and gets cheaper from there with higher purchasing volumes. Application via basal drench takes one man about five minutes per tree with no fancy equipment. That makes it one of the most cost effective and profitable services a tree care company can offer. The research backs up the efficacy, please contact me if you are looking for the work on imidacloprid for EAB. Also feel free to contact us for info on how to price your tree health care services so they are fair to you without being exorbitant to your clients.



Brandon, we have just recently (days ago) been identified as being close to a verified infestation. I feel it is too late for imidacloprid and Safari is the only viable option at this time with that in mind. Two weeks to wait for control of larvae when safari is an immediate infusion makes it the tool of choice in my situation IMO. If it was earlier in the season I would agree with you and the cheaper mtl choice. This application couldn t be any easier. A 99$ Stihl backpack sprayer and approx 10 min mix time and the same for application is not an issue. I just cannot understand the cost of approx 370.00$ for 3 lbs of this product.


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## BonsaiJedi (Jun 4, 2007)

I certainly cannot speak to how Valent is pricing their product. I can only say that it is VERY expensive to get a new chemical developed, manufactured, packaged, researched, EPA labeled, and state registered. On top of the costs of R&D, any new product that is brought into the market is spendy at first due to the basics of supply and demand. As demand continues to increase, price drops. Then products go off patent and others can manufacture the same item and price drops further. That's what happened with imidacloprid, propoconazole, and will someday happen with dinotefuron (Safari). This also speaks to why any arborist should be working with multiple chemistries, use the more spendy ones for niche situations (like the client who calls in midsummer and needs fast efficacy) and the more cost effective ones for more general applications (like fall or early spring preventative treatments).
BTW...congrats on your recent experience as a media darling! I'm sure you were great!


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## treevet (Jun 4, 2007)

BonsaiJedi said:


> I certainly cannot speak to how Valent is pricing their product. I can only say that it is VERY expensive to get a new chemical developed, manufactured, packaged, researched, EPA labeled, and state registered. On top of the costs of R&D, any new product that is brought into the market is spendy at first due to the basics of supply and demand. As demand continues to increase, price drops. Then products go off patent and others can manufacture the same item and price drops further. That's what happened with imidacloprid, propoconazole, and will someday happen with dinotefuron (Safari). This also speaks to why any arborist should be working with multiple chemistries, use the more spendy ones for niche situations (like the client who calls in midsummer and needs fast efficacy) and the more cost effective ones for more general applications (like fall or early spring preventative treatments).
> BTW...congrats on your recent experience as a media darling! I'm sure you were great!




Well stated Brandon. Btw, it was xander, not me in the media (this time) for his timely find and professional, educated eye.


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## Urban Forester (Jun 12, 2007)

cryo stops wear said:


> 12 OZ of SAFARI, 5 OUNCES OF PENTRA BARK IN 1 GAL H20 technically labeled for EAB? As far as i know the SAFARI AND PENTRA BARK ARE THE ONLY LABELED CHEMICAL FOR EAB.



Pentra bark will stain the trunk of an Ash tree. Also if your treating a tree in a landscape area it will kill the lawn under it. Onyx (Bifenthrin) has a silicon bark penetrant that allows for good control. Treatment window needs to be adjusted for the 56 days it takes for bark penetration. Imidicloprid is still the treatment of choice either by trunk injection or soil application, due to slow translocation time soil in the spring (April) Trunk in late May, June depending on when good vascular flow occurs in your area.


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