# The best Mini?



## JCONN (Feb 23, 2010)

I am really looking to buy a used mini this season. I was wondering if any of you have used a variety of these units and the pros and cons? I am sure this will be a similar debate like whats better Chevy or Ford but can't hurt to ask. We have a toro and bobcat dealer near me anything else is at least 3 hours away if this makes a difference. I am going towards units that go in 36" gates. I intend to use it for moving logs and brush also for landscaping like mulch and possible an auger for planting.  Any advice would be greatly appreciated for I have no experience with these I always used my buddies Kubota tractor for these small areas but he just sold it. FYI I have access to a full size cat skid steer for really big jobs so this would be for smaller and tight access jobs.


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## ihatevines (Feb 23, 2010)

I have used Bobcats, Boxers, Ditch Witch, and Vermeers. The Vermeers are easily the best I have used. The controls are so user friendly. Also the pin height and reach due to the curved loader boom make it easier to load up into the back of a chip truck. 

Just want to say agian the 2 joystick control is really what separates the machines. Within minutes any operator can become very smooth. Also it inables the operator to hold on much easier. 

Either machine will help you big time. You will begin to wonder how you got along without it all these years. Also the only thing I have agianst the bobcats is they dont use the same mini skid attachment plate. Which means you will either be limited by the attachments you can get or you will have to pay more to have the Mt plate put on them.

Just my opinion


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## Mikecutstrees (Feb 23, 2010)

Like you said I'd stick with something with nearby service. Then I'd shop craigslist etc for the best buy I could find. Lots of good machines for sale now at very reasonable prices. Lift height is also important depending on what you are loading into. My TX425 can lift onto my tailgate but not over it which isn't a huge deal for us. Good luck and look around hard!.... Mike


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## Slvrmple72 (Feb 23, 2010)

Go diesel if you can! Seconds on the Vermeer! The tracked units can be tough on turf so plan your turns over plywood/plastic sheets. Their is a new 38 hp stump grinding attachment out their for minis now too.

My favorite mini is still the "skirt" variety!


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## randyg (Feb 23, 2010)

Three hours is quite a ways to haul for service if that becomes necessary more than a time or two. I have a Vermeer s600tx, and I can tell you this much about track vs. tires. To sit and spin, they will both dig a hole. To turn gently in a wide arc, they are both ALMOST as forgiving as something that articulates or with steer tires like that tractor. The track units BOAST about lower ground pressure BUT when you pick up large load (near capacity) you go right up on your nose with most of the TOTAL weight of load and unit combined, and the pressure (psi of ground pressure) is no different than being on 2 front tires if you get my drift? Grapple bucket is great attachment, allowing some dirt work along with the ability to HOLD ON to a log or logs or brush while on the move. Good luck!


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## Juicemang (Feb 23, 2010)

Toro dingo tx525 narrow track. Well worth the extra dollars to go from 425 to 525 for the diesel. Make sure to get yourself the ride platform and a branch manager grapple. I wish I wasn't part time so I could use mine everyday!! Only downside is the cost... I dropped around 16k for mine used and another 4k for attachments it had 150 hours.


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## Grace Tree (Feb 23, 2010)

Juicemang said:


> Toro dingo tx525 narrow track. Well worth the extra dollars to go from 425 to 525 for the diesel. Make sure to get yourself the ride platform and a branch manager grapple. I wish I wasn't part time so I could use mine everyday!! Only downside is the cost... I dropped around 16k for mine used and another 4k for attachments it had 150 hours.



Branch Manager +1


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## Mikecutstrees (Feb 23, 2010)

Juice,Why do you like the Diesel better? Diesels are more expensive to buy, more expensive to fix and the 525 barely lifts more than a 425. Also the gas motor is easier to deal with in the winter. My TX425 was 5K with a new motor, forks and a bucket. Just wondering.... Mike


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## JCONN (Feb 23, 2010)

Is the diesel worth the extra money, my knowledge on them is limited compared to gas motors. I would have to assume that these units are fairly similar to zero turn lawn mowers which I have alot of experience fixing, minus the attachment portion. What is the amount of hours were these machines start to break down or how old and how many hours should I be looking at on a unit?


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## The Lawn Shark (Feb 23, 2010)

I'm in the same position have skid loader want a used mini for back yard access...ect
Keep the replys coming


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## cedar (Feb 23, 2010)

I have a boxer 427 with tracks. Very user friendly controls with a 900 lb lift capacity. 

I have not had any trouble keeping yard damage to a minimum. I have a 14x7 dump trailer with ramps to load the mini. I use the branch manager grapple to load the wood. This setup works well, but when there is a lot of wood I need to make an extra trip to pick up the boxer. Today I loaded a 3' diameter oak in 3 to 4 foot sections. Much better than the log dolly I used in the past.


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## ihatevines (Feb 23, 2010)

+1 branch manger one more time. Works great and love having the built in rope break. Makes a great mid line tie point.

Also to Cedar. Have the same setup as you except I have a Vermeer. Used to have to make two trips then I got ramps where I could drive the mini in the bed of my 1 ton and make it in one trip. Yes the ramps paid for themselves quickly.


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## Juicemang (Feb 23, 2010)

Mike. When I have the option I have just always leaned towards diesel over gas. More power, less fuel consumption and longer engine life. I rented the 425 about 10 times before I bought my 525, it was a good machine. Time will tell if the diesel was worth it or not. I used it this winter without a problem, its kept in the shop when not in use though..


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## Mikecutstrees (Feb 23, 2010)

Juicemang said:


> Mike. When I have the option I have just always leaned towards diesel over gas. More power, less fuel consumption and longer engine life. I rented the 425 about 10 times before I bought my 525, it was a good machine. Time will tell if the diesel was worth it or not. I used it this winter without a problem, its kept in the shop when not in use though..



Ok, Got it.... they are both nice machines. Especially for big wood... Mike


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## sgreanbeans (Feb 24, 2010)

I'm looking into these machines as-well, could u guys show us some pics with the grapple, And what are the max loads and max height? Had a skid loader before I was called back to service, sold everything!, now I'm back home, rebuilding and think that this machine might be a little more economical and more versatile.


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## RAG66 (Feb 24, 2010)

I'm really looking at some used machines too is the Vermeer that much better? My use is mainly backyard wood hauls which happens about 6-8 times per year. Another use could be small stumps with the grinder attachment.


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## ihatevines (Feb 24, 2010)

Vermeer S600tx with Kohler gas. Using top notch grapple in video. I can take some helmet cam video of me running a 600 if anyone wants. Just got another 600tx might be wanting to move the one in the video.

One other thing I would def get a tracked unit. In florida all the small tires do is spin in the sugar sand.


Sorry there isn't more 600tx footage in this video. 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MFbYJHHjdTg


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## PurdueJoe (Feb 24, 2010)

I picked up a used Bobcat MT52 about a year and half ago and can say it's one of the best purchases I ever made. It's older with separate controls for each function but I can run just as well as the dingo 525 my old boss had with the joysticks. I too would go diesel. Everything in my fleet is diesel except my stump grinder and I wish it was. Off road diesel is usually cheaper if you can buy in bulk and stock up. One thing to keep in mind about a Bobcat style mini compared to any other, is that you can run a full size skid steer attachment on them(if the weight is right). I've built a log splitter and plan on building a winch that fit both my MT50 and my New Holland LS170. Down side is most ALL mini attachments you want to rent or buy are the "mini styel plate" . All that being said I've ran the dingo 420, 525 plus the bigger vermeer (42" wide) and out of those would only look at dingo or bobcat if buying new.


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## treeclimber101 (Feb 24, 2010)

I bought this mini three yrs ago its a Ramrod 900 t with a 25 horse Kohler , I like the machine except for the tires they wear fast and are constantly going flat..


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## Dutch295 (Feb 24, 2010)

I would encourage you to look at the Ditch Witch Zahn. Along the same line, when I went shopping I wanted a Gehl Al-20dx some kind of bad but my budget and that little bit of extra width were deal breakers ... mostly the budget. The Zahn may prove to be a little too unstable in hilly country ... I've never worked one. I love my Boxer but the biggest headache.... the lug tracks will tear some ch!t up... plywood is a must and a little bit of a headache.
I've rented toros... good machines, liked the performance.. only headache was it was difficult to be in the neutral position which was required to start it. I'd like to emphasize that the starting issue may have been an isolated case on that particular machine.
I think the Vermeers have a safety feature where you must be standing on the platform for it to operate... I see this as a negative as there are plenty of times when you feel it's best / want to step off while operating.
But just like a lot of folks on here have said about chippers.... "any chipper is better than no chipper" , I think the same can be said for minis.
I've attached about as good a place as any to see these things work... scroll down just a little and you will see some videos for the grapple... besides, who doesn't enjoy the theme to Benny Hill 

http://branchmanagerattachments.com/

Finally, for anyone that is interested in a toro stump grinder .... I'm a motivated seller.... be forewarned though... notice my signature.


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## capetrees (Feb 24, 2010)

Anyone try out the new Vermeer 800tx? Just got a pamphlet about it the other day. 38 hp.


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## Koa Man (Feb 24, 2010)

I love my Gehl AL20DX. The 40" width prevents me from going through a 36 inch gate, but I still have found numerous occasions to use it. It lifts 700 lbs. higher than most any miniskid, travel speed is twice as fast at 6.8 mph vs around 3mph for most minis. The real plus is it does not tear up even the finest lawns.

The plywood you see on the lawn is for the spider lift, not the Gehl.


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## treeclimber101 (Feb 24, 2010)

Koa Man said:


> I love my Gehl AL20DX. The 40" width prevents me from going through a 36 inch gate, but I still have found numerous occasions to use it. It lifts 700 lbs. higher than most any miniskid, travel speed is twice as fast at 6.8 mph vs around 3mph for most minis. The real plus is it does not tear up even the finest lawns.
> 
> The plywood you see on the lawn is for the spider lift, not the Gehl.



Ah why is there a tire in the tree in the 2nd pic?


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## Koa Man (Feb 24, 2010)

treeclimber101 said:


> Ah why is there a tire in the tree in the 2nd pic?



This is the tire you are looking at. It is on the bottom of the 15GT bucket so you can move the bucket around when it is detached from the machine to get through a real tight opening.


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## treeclimber101 (Feb 24, 2010)

Koa Man said:


> This is the tire you are looking at. It is on the bottom of the 15GT bucket so you can move the bucket around when it is detached from the machine to get through a real tight opening.



Oh thats cool I thought that my eyes were tricking me


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## sgreanbeans (Feb 25, 2010)

I have gots to gets me wun of dees! Those videos were what I needed to see. How much does the whole unit weigh? mini and clamp together that is.
Thanks for posting the link


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## Dutch295 (Feb 25, 2010)

sgreanbeans, 
You are very welcome, mine weighs 2025 with nothing attached and another 200 for the grapple. I think some units weigh as little as 1700 lbs but not sure.

I went back and looked at the specs on the Zahn as this thread got me thinking.... the lift capacity by the time you add some type of grapple seems a little weak for tree work.

There's a powerhouse (powerhouse / boxer reminds me of Ford / Mercury) on machinery trader right now that looks like it "might" be a good deal considering all the attachments ... Probably a long ride for you and you probably don't need all the attachments.... I'd probably offer to buy the breaker from you... it's comical how many people have approached me on a job and point to my boxer and say, "can't those things break concrete?"


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## treevet (Feb 25, 2010)

We have had a 525 TX (narrow) for a couple of years and just sold a Bobcat mt50. The Dingo is a far superior machine to the Bobcat and their rep even agreed. That is why they still sell both. The Dingo has 5 pumps. It will get through a 36" gate easily. It is also much easier on the lawn and more refined.

I bought the Dingo grapple (non bucket grapple that I do not like) and we had a BMG grapple on the bobcat which I kept and am going to convert to the Dingo. I feel the BMG is best for brush as you can go right to stems and grab a bunch and go but with the Dingo grapple it grabs logs easier as you can push them around to get a good grab and also because it does not swivel like the BMG.

Any Mini is going to match up real well with a dump trailer....


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## treevet (Feb 25, 2010)

My Dingo weighs a little over 2k and here is the Dingo grapple..


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## prentice110 (Feb 25, 2010)

*Pumps*

Got a Bobcat mt52 new december 08. If it wasnt for this machine I wouldve been bankrupt by now. I make a third of my income subing out work for guys that dont have one. Anyway, some of these things have 2 rooster master pumps for the drive and one for the accesories, (boom operation and attachments). Some only have one big pump for every thing. I strongly recomend getting one with three pumps like my Bobcat. My buddy has a boxer with one pump and when you lift, lower, or curl the boom while moving forward or backward, the drive hesitates and you get "gigled" if thats the right term for it. I love my Bobcat but like VINES said, the universal plate would be nice. I would demo all that you can with a trencher if you plan on using one because some of these dont have a high enough gpm to run that kind of attachment, and the dealer may neglect to inform you of this. There are a few 'mini' theads goin on over in the equipment forum. Check em out for more info, and links/pics/vids.


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## treeclimber101 (Feb 26, 2010)

capetrees said:


> Anyone try out the new Vermeer 800tx? Just got a pamphlet about it the other day. 38 hp.



How much do they want 25K I am starting to believe that there parts people are all retoided ,they mess up every third order of mine and give me other peoples orders ... And to boot they are ignorant to me when they are wrong..


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## treevet (Feb 26, 2010)

treeclimber101 said:


> How much do they want 25K I am starting to believe that there parts people are all retoided ,they mess up every third order of mine and give me other peoples orders ... And to boot they are ignorant to me when they are wrong..



I searched Vermeer 800 TX and come up with nada. When I bought my Dingo over a year ago I asked Vermeer for a demo prior to the Dingo. They said they would get me one within a week. 

Well they call me 3 months after I bought my Dingo and said they had my demo ready to bring over.....duhhhh


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## treeclimber101 (Feb 26, 2010)

treevet said:


> I searched Vermeer 800 TX and come up with nada. When I bought my Dingo over a year ago I asked Vermeer for a demo prior to the Dingo. They said they would get me one within a week.
> 
> Well they call me 3 months after I bought my Dingo and said they had my demo ready to bring over.....duhhhh



Yea I dunno I think my next chipper will be an ALTEC and after that stump cutters maybe Morbark , Vermeer service is herendous and there parts people should go work for Walmart there along the same lines of intelligence..


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## tntree (Feb 26, 2010)

Thanks for the grapple compliments, I am currently working on a couple more features for the grapple. A receiver hitch, a saw scabbard, and a plywood carrier The latter giving me the most trouble. Once I am satisfied with there practicability(?) I hope to include them at no extra cost. Any Ideas on the BMgrapple moving plwood would be greatly appreciated.

Oops Derail sorry, minis . . . my experience, Diesels will cost up to 3K more than Gas. I have gotten 1500 hrs on Kohler Gas, I figure I could replace the Gas engine for less bucks than the Diesel. 
I preferred the stand on machines as with my grapple you are often traveling in Reverse, I have heard of a couple of Injures involving the walk behinds and backing up curbs. 
The controls on the Toro and Vermeer are more user friendly to the first time operator, but It doesn't take very long to learn the other style controls out there, so I wouldn't let that dissuade any purchase decision.
Personally any thing 0ver 15K is getting pretty pricey for maybe arguably 10 to 20% more performance.

If I was going to spend >20K on a stand on a machine, I would think twice about upping my budget to around 25K and opt for the new Gehl 140 articulating - Debate-ably 3 times the machine of ANY of the minis on the Market. 
http://www.gehl.com/const/prodpg_al.html


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## treevet (Feb 26, 2010)

looks much bigger and heavier than a mini Dave?


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## capetrees (Feb 26, 2010)

treeclimber101 said:


> Yea I dunno I think my next chipper will be an ALTEC and after that stump cutters maybe Morbark , Vermeer service is herendous and there parts people should go work for Walmart there along the same lines of intelligence..



My Vermeer guy is just the opposite. Great to work with, fast service and always one trip fixes. I did get an order mixed up though. 

As far as the info on the 800 tx, http://www.vermeer.com/vcom/CompactEquipment/Model.jsp?PrdlnID=47717&ModID=136564


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## treevet (Feb 26, 2010)

I have said it before but I am extremely happy with my 12 year history with Vermeer service. Had some major billing snafus but we ironed them out to my satisfaction. Absolutely love the equipment.


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## tntree (Feb 26, 2010)

treevet said:


> looks much bigger and heavier than a mini Dave?



More like a middi then I guess, dollar for dollar pound for pound, more than 3 times any Mini. Absolutely No turning Turf Damage
It will not ride on the back of your chipper thats for sure.
20 HP Yanmar Diesel, operating weight I think 3500#s. Damm some of the minis are weighing in at over 2300 #s 

Service is important so its tough to beat the big yellows network. Gehl has an excellant dealer network also.
If you can do a little wrenching your self, most of the minis are pretty Butt simple, usually the better advice is to do treework though and pay a prof mechanic to repair your minis.


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## treeclimber101 (Feb 27, 2010)

I love the equipment but with poor parts support , your screwed where are you ordering from upstate NY, or is there a dealer in CT?


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## sgreanbeans (Feb 27, 2010)

What about the BOBCAT mini's, I have always had their skidloaders, great machines, IMO, dealer here is decent enough. But none have experience in tree work, any of you have a Bobcat?


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## treeclimber101 (Feb 27, 2010)

I rented one and my first thought was what if you tripped walking backwards and accidentally ran yourself over with that MOFO could that happen ?


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## treeclimber101 (Feb 27, 2010)

sgreanbeans said:


> What about the BOBCAT mini's, I have always had their skidloaders, great machines, IMO, dealer here is decent enough. But none have experience in tree work, any of you have a Bobcat?



I have a 7753 and a Ramrod 900T ..


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## treevet (Feb 27, 2010)

treeclimber101 said:


> I rented one and my first thought was what if you tripped walking backwards and accidentally ran yourself over with that MOFO could that happen ?



not unless the control stuck...you take your hands off and it stops moving.


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## treeclimber101 (Feb 27, 2010)

treevet said:


> not unless the control stuck...you take your hands off and it stops moving.



What if you held the control to try to catch yourself???


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## gr8scott72 (Feb 27, 2010)

treeclimber101 said:


> What if you held the control to try to catch yourself???



It might just hurt a little. :greenchainsaw:


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## tntree (Feb 27, 2010)

Gehl dealers are all over the US, MT is the one that broke the guys ankle,
don't walk behind when you can ride.
That ramrod 900T is a solid great machine I have had several, Both Thomas and Finn copied that model. The 427W Boxer kicks its azz though, 3 year warranty less money than the Vermeer

I'll say it again it is absolutely Financially Stupid to pay men to hump brush and logs. Any Mini for forwarding is going to change your Biz for the better in many ways. :deadhorse:

I kinda feel like you guys argue over Nickels and Dimes, All the specs are close. Buy one in your budget range and don't look back. 
Picture is the smallest mini I have ever used (16hp) 24" wide it was pretty cool. wish I would have adapted a grapple to one


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## Koa Man (Feb 27, 2010)

Even the smallest mini will lift more than one ground man and move it faster.
Someone who has never used a mini loader on a job will not understand or appreciate just how fast the brush gets moved compared to manual labor.

That new Gehl 140 loader looks good. Only slightly bigger than the AL20DX.


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## capetrees (Feb 27, 2010)

I've had my eye on a boxer for a couple years now and mostly because of the lift it has as opposed to the others. There is a local dealer nearby. The money is the biggest issue. If I could keep it running all the time, no problem but to see it sit would kill me. Need to put out feelers for additional work considering the attachments. Loacl guy has one and i'm going to inquire to him if he likes it and if it is working out for him. He's seasonal and has one so it couldn't be too bad to afford.


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## JCONN (Mar 4, 2010)

Their is a toro425 for sale near me its looks a few years old and has little over 2000hrs on the gas motor is this alot of hours for this machine. How much would be a good price for this unit and how much should I plan on putting into it for repairs? The outside of the unit looks like it was keeped in decent condition but I have yet to hear it run.


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## tntree (Mar 4, 2010)

JCONN said:


> Their is a toro425 for sale near me its looks a few years old and has little over 2000hrs on the gas motor is this alot of hours for this machine. How much would be a good price for this unit and how much should I plan on putting into it for repairs? The outside of the unit looks like it was keeped in decent condition but I have yet to hear it run.



2000 hrs is exceptional for a gas eng, definitely a mature eng and machine. Take the attachment off, raise the arm belly level and shake the mounting plate to ck all your connecting pins for slop. You can guess the track will be similar condition. figure at least $1500 for an eng replace, keep an 1-2 grand for possible Hyd issues and track systems. 
I would say maybe 2~3.5 grand for the machine tops. what work has been done to it?

good luck Dave


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## ihatevines (Mar 4, 2010)

http://cgi.ebay.com/2006-Vermeer-S6...emQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item1c10a40f0d


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## gr8scott72 (Mar 4, 2010)

ihatevines said:


> http://cgi.ebay.com/2006-Vermeer-S6...emQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item1c10a40f0d



Looks good but with 0 feedback, you better actually put your eyes and hands on that thing before you bid.


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## tntree (Mar 4, 2010)

The first Vermeers that came out had serious Hyd issues, which has since been remedied.
frick . . . . the problem is I don't know what year that was, or serial #s involved.

Other than that discouraging piece of early history, hell of a buy at 2grand,
real good value at 6 to 8 grand


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## ihatevines (Mar 4, 2010)

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=120538271501

This is a POV demo video of the above mini. Shows the machine at work. 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xgYFGO91UqE


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## arbor pro (Aug 26, 2010)

For sale in trading post:

2009 Boxer 532dx with only 40 hours if anyone interested. See attached photo. New custom grapple available also (similar to one in photo but better).

You can call me for more info or pm me.

Scott 605-228-9350


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## treevet (Aug 26, 2010)

arbor pro said:


> For sale in trading post:
> 
> 2009 Boxer 532dx with only 40 hours if anyone interested. See attached photo. New custom grapple available also (similar to one in photo but better).
> 
> ...



Selling it to buy a Dingo...JK ....


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