# Spider lift



## B-Edwards (Dec 31, 2008)

Haven't heard anything about these in awhile. I am seeing other brands being advertised more and more. You guys that have them, what do you think of them at this point? How have they performed? Have there been any mechanical problems? Was Tuepen fast at repairing them? How would you rate customer relations? Would you buy another lift from them? Has anyone tried another Brand (by that I mean one comparable to the tracked gt23). I am seeing more and more guys doing tree work with the little tow-able units. That is good and bad as it lets people do tree work who couldn't otherwise but it also puts inexperienced people in a position to get great parking for the rest of their lives or a funeral party.


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## John464 (Jan 2, 2009)

I think we spoke about my Teupen 23gt before. If you do a search Ive shared my story. All in all I love the machine for what it does, getting into places where the bucket truck can't fit or doesn't belong; i.e a nice lawn, swampy terrain, steep slopes, etc.

As for comparing it to other lifts. I have been watching the competition closely. Teupen's closest competitor for the 23gt model is the Reachmaster LL76. It has a nice outreach of 38ft, but the outreach can be achieved only at a 38ft work height. While the Teupen has an outreach of 36ft, but can be achieved at 45ft. So the Teupen can go up about 8ft higher and provide 2ft less of out reach. Having that extra 8ft when you need side reach is real important. Also when you are below 38ft you will get less than 38ft outreach because the boom folds on the Reachmaster. The teupen lower boom telescopes so you get your full outreach from 15ft high continuously to your 45ft max height. The Reachmaster does not have a telescoping lower boom, therefore it is fixed, collapse only by folding. If this doesn't make sense carefully examine both charts on their respective sites to see the range.

Same story with the Italmec R21. Max outreach is 39ft, but this can only be achieved at a mere 28ft high.

This all relates to the higher you can go up and reach over the canopy or even through the canopy(good luck doing that with the Italmec and Reachmaster two man basket). Going up over higher and reaching out allows you to reach more of the tree's structure without repositioning and since you are using this lift because you are in close quarters to begin with repositioning may not even be an opton to get that back side of the tree.

The other design flaw on the Reachmaster and the Itlamec is the way the basket is mounted in the middle of the cage. The basket can't be rotated to become streamlined. Unlike the Teupen 2 man basket is mounted on the corner. The rotation allows the basket to be as narrow as a regular bucket truck basket. 
Both the Reachmaster and Itlamec are Italian made lifts. The Teupen is German. The German's usually do a bit better in engineering than the Italians.


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## Gerasimek (Jan 16, 2009)

*Alternative to Teupen*

Check out www.manliftengineering.com
Their Atrium spider lifts are very similar in design to the Teupen. Many features of these lifts are very smart. For example, the lift can deploy from a trailer without ramps and any problems with the unit can be diagnosed from the factory in Wisconsin through your laptop (if you have one ).
The best thing is that all of the parts are domestic, which means you don't have to wait for the part to ship (literally- in a ship) from Germany.
I'm heading up to check one out in February.
Gerasimek


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## B-Edwards (Jan 16, 2009)

Thanks guys. Yes John we spoke before and I appreciate you taking the time to respond to this question. I have kept up with the threads on here and was just wondering if any opinions had changed and also what the competition was doing. I have stated on this site that I had a heart attack in march of this year and was getting out of the business. That is true but I am thinking that I may just get out of the business of hiring anyone and might possibly be interested in a lift like this and try and do some things on my own. Maybe just a thought but atleast I'm still thinking. Thanks again for response.


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## John464 (Jan 16, 2009)

B-Edwards

No prob for the writeup. I left out that company the Gerasimek just posted. That lift looks excellent. Height and side reach ranges are right on par with the teupen. Upper and lower telscoping booms as well. Looks like a great machine, but one thing. That two man basket mounted in the middle is no good for tree work. The option I see when you click for the insulated options shows a much slimmer one man basket. Thats a must have or you can always cut and reweld the standard basket to be smaller. The At70 is the 23gt's newest competition, perhaps even better?

Gerasimek,

Please post your experience after you demo that unit and thanks for sharing this new co.


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## John464 (Jan 28, 2009)

After Gerasimek's post I have been in contact with MLE about their spider.
It definitely has some feature that the 23gt Teupen does not have. 

*+*Most notable are it fits through a 36" gate. The Teupen is 38". 2" difference may not seem like much, but I have had to take down many fences and come to despise the jobs with the PVC plastic fences with 3 ft concrete bases. an average of 1-3hr to take down and put back up

*+*On board LCD screen. The 23gt does not have a self diagnostic screen. In a few instances something like this would of saved me a lot of time while learning the machine. 

*+*Insulated upper boom 46kV. Teupen does not offer this. To me this is a nice plus but not necessary since I have a bucket truck plus my spider. Where high voltage street wires are a concern access has never been a problem with the bucket truck. For someone who wants just one piece of equipment the $15,000 insulated boom option would make sense.

*-*Now to the big thing here. Price. I was expecting a price lower or very close to the Teupen. US manufacturing should make it less expensive that importing a machine from Germany? No.

Here is my price qoute
Base Unit: 70 ft Platform Height, 48V Battery	$138,900.00
Diesel Engine	$2,200.00
Tree Care Package: Protective Guards, Diesel Engine	$5,200.00
Gas Generator	$4200.00
Diesel Generator	$4900.00
46kV Insulated Package with Diesel Engine	$15,875.00

The options I chose put me at $144,100 plus tax = *TOTAL $154,187* + whatever shipping charge . If I were to sell my bucket truck and opt for the insulated package id be at $154,775 plus tax = *TOTAL $165,000 *+ shipping

In summary, I think this unit may slightlly offer an advatange over theTeupen 23gt, however for being $20,000-$45,000 more costly I think it makes sense to continue taking a few fences down in those yards with the smaller gates, which happens to be only a small percentage.


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## B-Edwards (Jan 28, 2009)

Thanks again John, Great info!


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## dtw902 (Jan 28, 2009)

I hear that John. I have not had that problem in my area, most small gates are around 40 inch openings. 36" gate plus hinges and latch. Anyway no problems with the lift so far, replaced a few hoses, still going strong.


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## pdqdl (Feb 5, 2009)

Unless I am mistaken, only Teupen has the adjustable height tracks. Correct?

Wouldn't that make a huge difference when traversing slopes? Aren't all spider lifts prone to flopping on their sides? They look top heavy when in transport mode.


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## John464 (Feb 5, 2009)

pdqdl,

Teupen and MLE have height adjustable tracks. With the Tuepen you can just adjust one side at a time when travelling on slopes to balance the machine. I hardly ever do this since there is usually a way to drive straight up the incline instead of traveling on the incline.

I am not positive the MLE adjusts the tracks independently or both at the same time. I would assume its one at a time for stability, but I am not 100% sure.


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## pdqdl (Feb 5, 2009)

I don't think they have it, but I only have this evidence:

1. They don't mention that feature in their literature or on their website.
2. I looked at all the machine controls shown in their literature, and nothing looks like it would affect the tracks. It's in English, and nothing I saw looked like track controls.

If they have this feature, they are doing a pretty poor job of marketing their product.

I would think (just by looking at the spider lifts in general) that they are easy to flop on their side if traveling on a side slope. They are only 36" wide, and something that cost $150,000 and weighs a delicate 7-8,000 lbs would not be the sort of machine that I would like to take chances with.

So how is the Teupen on a side slope with & without using the adjustable track? If operating in a wide enough area, could you lower the downhill outriggers enough to protect against turnovers?


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## John464 (Feb 5, 2009)

pdqdl said:


> I don't think they have it, but I only have this evidence:
> 
> 1. They don't mention that feature in their literature or on their website.
> So how is the Teupen on a side slope with & without using the adjustable track? If operating in a wide enough area, could you lower the downhill outriggers enough to protect against turnovers?


It clearly states retractable tracts as the 1st the product feature on the pdf file of their website
http://www.manliftengineering.com/products/atrium/pdf/A70TD/A70-Features.pdf



pdqdl said:


> So how is the Teupen on a side slope with & without using the adjustable track? If operating in a wide enough area, could you lower the downhill outriggers enough to protect against turnovers?



no need to lower your outriggers. you could if you wanted. you retract one track and the machine is level. The machine is very stable when taveling, before you could tip the machine you would notice track digging into the ground on the side with all the pressure. I have never felt the machine was going to tip because I am a safe/good operator. In the wrong hands, yes, it could tip.


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## pdqdl (Feb 6, 2009)

Ok. I missed that, Thanks. I guess it is still a presumption that it can be used to level the machine?

I would think that an important feature like that would be highlighted better. Teupen certainly shows theirs off. These guys have such poor marketing skills, I can't believe they are making any money. Only two pages of information on a $150,000 machine? Ridiculous!

I would tell some engineer to take pictures of every feature on that chunk of iron and put together a 20 page brochure. I'd put the owners manual on-line, and I would have hundreds of pictures available of the unit in operation.


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## pdqdl (Feb 6, 2009)

*I asked them that question. Answers!*

I found that MLE has a live chat feature, so I asked. Here is the text:

*********************************************************
Sarah: Welcome to our real-time support chat. How can I help you today?

Guest: Your sales literature on line does not state whether or how the spider lift tracks are adjustable. Can they be used to level the machine? (Teupen does)

http://www.arboristsite.com/showthread.php?p=1367996&posted=1#post1367996

You may wish to bring this thread to the attention of the sales department.

Sarah: The tracks are adjustable in an out (up and down) for driving.
However we have an automatic leveling system for the outriggers while the lift is being used

Guest: My question remains unanswered. Do the tracks adjust independently to accomodate changes in grade while driving the machine across a slope? Outriggers are only good if you are parked.

Sarah: I see, let me check on this for you really quick. can I get your name, number and email in case we loose connection?

Guest: David Little. [email protected]

Sarah: We also do have the independently adjusting tracks as an option
Thank you David for bringing this question to our attention

Guest: Thank you for answering. Bye.
********************************************************
So if you think you need to level your machine, you can pay extra! I can't believe that would not be standard option. I guess if a machine was only used indoors, that would allow the machine to be cheaper to buy. But that also makes it more expensive for the majority of applications.


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## John464 (Feb 6, 2009)

Wow. So the retractable tracks are standard but idependently adjustable is a cost added option. More $!

I really like this lift, and will strongly consider it when it comes time to buy another spider. I could really use two spiderlifts and had planned to add another this year, but with the cost I can't justify spending more than I spent for the Teupen, especially in this economy. 

MLE could become a fierce competitor for Teupen. They have redesgned their 23gt and made some nice improvements, but they should of kept pricing in line with the 23gt. Design these machines with a price point slightly lower than their competitors and take over market territory.


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## pdqdl (Feb 6, 2009)

As you might have noticed, I made them aware of this thread. I think they read it. They sent me a personal e-mail, indicating that they would be taking my marketing comments seriously.

Maybe they will become a forum sponsor. Who knows?

I would like it better if they sold me a deeply discounted unit, so that I could become a factory rep, take some action photo's, and otherwise pump up their market share. Somehow, I don't think that will happen.


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## John464 (Feb 6, 2009)

Teupen does a decent job at marketing their lifts. Full page 1st page ad in TCIA mag every month. Attending every trade show. Previous sponsor of this site(which didnt go over so well). Very detailed website. Plus a lot more.

This all adds to their overhead. If MLE markets more... would their lifts then become even more expensive? In theory, yes, atleast initially.


On paper MLE makes a very well designed lift. Their price is what will hold them back gaining a big presence in the tree care industry. 

When I bought my lift board members here couldnt believe that something so small costs so much and attacked Teupen for being outrageous in their pricing. Given they are importing these machine from Germany paying big import fees, playing our US dollar against the EURO, and are a middle man(dealer) in the process.....Teupen America has done a good job at keeping costs relative.

MLE...hmmm..perhaps are using their current profit margin ratio and applying it to their newest lineup of spiderlifts? I understand the R&D process is crucial and extensive in designing something so cutting edge, but I feel they may have set their margins a bit too high.

I know the euro dollar keeps effecting Teupens price. Anyone have a recent price qoute from them on a new 23gt? Last I checked it was $128,000 with all options needed for tree care.


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## John464 (Feb 12, 2009)

just wanted to update ya'll. The MLE tracks idependently adjust as a no cost standard option.


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## pdqdl (Feb 12, 2009)

What did they do, change their mind?

I was live chat with one of their representatives. She didn't know, and had to inquire from a higher authority. That thread posted above.

Do you know if they adjust at an outward angle, or just up and down? I would think that an outward/downward angle of 45° would be best.


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## John464 (Feb 12, 2009)

She told me that they can offer the tracks to retract simeltaneously or idependently. For those doing glass cleaning want to hit one button tracks retract pass through the front door. For those doing tree care want to retract one side at a time. They will offer the machine either way. Standard for both industries.

I had a good convo with them today. I basically told them they need to be competitive with Teupen's price. I explained to them that designing a product very similar to their competition they should be less expensive since they are a US based company. They dont have to compete with the euro dollar, ship a machine and pay import fees associated, pay a dealer. Teupen goes through a high cost with this. Also their machine is steel, which less than the price of aluminum(teupen) If we were in Germany buying a Teupen it would be 10's of thousands less than it costs here in the US. So this should apply to MLE also. She seemed to understand my points and was going to speak to her boss. They havent sold any of these machines yet, therefore pricing I am not sure is exactly finalized.

I plan to fly out to their headuarters to meet with them. PDql what do you feel this machine should sell for?


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## pdqdl (Feb 12, 2009)

From a manufacturers point of view: as much as you can get, and still keep the sales volume up.

My perspective: I think that design is as neat as it can be, and I am avidly wishing I could afford one, especially with the insulated stick. I think the machine should be priced to compete with similar capacity equipment, given it's unique features. They need to price it to sell a lot of machines, otherwise they will never make enough money to re-coup their development costs.

Given that they have been gambling on selling the things at all, they should price it to compete with comparable aerial units mounted on trucks. I'm sure that it is less expensive to make a spider lift than it is to make a 70' aerial lift mounted on a truck. If they would go for the volume sales instead of the specialty/low volume sales, I'll bet they could move a lot of machines. Look at how Microsoft became the monster company that they are: good, cheap software...corner the market by out-competing the competition.

I don't think the tree trimming industry is a responsible enough market for MLE to pursue, and there can't be that many window cleaners that need aerial lifts. Look at how few tree companies even buy a new lift of any sort. We usually go to auctions and used equipment dealers and buy the utility trucks after they are mostly used up. 

Most of the tree business can be serviced with a truck mounted unit. The occasional job that can't be reached by climbing or truck usually gets done with a big crane, so they need to compete more on price, if they will sell in our market.

I'd look REAL hard at financing a $100,000 unit. If they were in that price range, Teupen would already know me on a first name basis. Unfortunately, the economics don't support >$150,000 worth of equipment to trim trees for my area. The cost per hour of ownership puts it out of the market.


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## John464 (Feb 12, 2009)

Yep, you are looking at it the same why I am, exactly. While I have done well with implementing the use of spider lifts, raising the price anywhere over $120,000 starts turning the benefits in terms of a cost benefit ratio to very slim. Profit margins in tree care are not that great to begin with.

Since owning a spiderlift for nearly 3 years now I would never operate without one, but for me to buy another it must cost me less. I took that risk as being one of the first tree care companies in the USA to use a spiderlift in our industry. While I didnt feel $120,000 was a fair price to pay, I bought one anyhow because I saw the need for it and had no other company to choose from other than Teupen. Now, we finally have a well thought out alternative, new competition. Teupen had a monoply market, if you will, now has competition to face. To enter as competition in a monopoly market it does create a change to the market in two ways. Drives prices lower, keeps pushing the bar for better ideas. From here on out, its a push and shove game. I'll tell you who the winner is when I lay down my next 100 grand. 

Right now(2/12/09), even at a sub $100,000 price I wouldnt be buying. We are still very uncertain how sales will be this year. We shall see if things imrpove come spring


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## basnighttrees (Feb 14, 2009)

I just saw the MLE yesterday in this month isa mag. I talked to a sells rep this morning and was surprised the unit was so expensive. I was looking forward to hearing a price for a USA better made machine for less than a oversees unit. I agree with you guys completely. Cost of design, materials, marketing, manufacturing, and profit can't be that much. If your reading, please lower the price some.


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## dtw902 (Feb 14, 2009)

The adjustable tracks on my lift(23GT) are very important I use it every time I use the lift. Often just to get through a gate, if the ground is not level you can tip the machine to get through. It would be nice if they did not cost so much. But I am not going down that road any more people want to fight and squable over these lifts, they can do that without me sorry. If you need one and your business can pay for it (it's also a right off on tax's) then buy it and don't look back. If you can't afford it buy what you can afford. 
About forgot My lift has the hydraulic adjustable tracks not manual like Johns. Ours was the first one with this option. 
Like John said I would not be without our Spider lift, the other 2 bucket trucks are not used nearly as much anymore. John talked about the rotating bucket pivots from the corner, and I agree, would be a must on any future lift I would consider buying.


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## Koa Man (Feb 23, 2009)

The MLE is way too long in travel mode, 25.5 ft. for the 23GT equivalent. 
The 23GT is 5 ft. shorter. That extra length is going to give you big problems in tight areas. Also the work envelope sucks compared to the 23GT. 

Italmec lifts work envelope is also very bad, and the fact that you cannot position the legs like the 23GT makes setup much more difficult. 

I am trying to get a 2009 23GT to add to my 15GT. Despite the way some feel about Teupen, they have given me excellent warranty service, their machines are much improved from even 2 years ago, and currently have the best all around machines from the research I have done. 

I find out this week if a 23GT is in my immediate future.


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## John464 (Feb 23, 2009)

Koa Man said:


> The MLE is way too long in travel mode, 25.5 ft. for the 23GT equivalent.
> The 23GT is 5 ft. shorter. That extra length is going to give you big problems in tight areas. Also the work envelope sucks compared to the 23GT.



not true. the MLE is 
Stowed Length: 19.9 ft (6.02 m)

the insulated version is 25.5, but the boom can be raised while driving unlike the Teupen to make length even shorther than the Teupen.

what do you mean the work envelope sucks? looks the same as my 23gt. care to explain?


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## dtw902 (Feb 23, 2009)

You can move the 23GT with the upper boom slightly elevated, if you understand your limit switch's. Only done it in a bind, but use caution as it raises the center of gravity. But for a few feet or to get around a corner it can be done.


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## lukev (Mar 17, 2009)

if you are looking for the smaller units please check out our website www.trakliftusa.com. this is the teupen machine just for a lot less. 




B-Edwards said:


> Haven't heard anything about these in awhile. I am seeing other brands being advertised more and more. You guys that have them, what do you think of them at this point? How have they performed? Have there been any mechanical problems? Was Tuepen fast at repairing them? How would you rate customer relations? Would you buy another lift from them? Has anyone tried another Brand (by that I mean one comparable to the tracked gt23). I am seeing more and more guys doing tree work with the little tow-able units. That is good and bad as it lets people do tree work who couldn't otherwise but it also puts inexperienced people in a position to get great parking for the rest of their lives or a funeral party.


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## UP Equip (Oct 23, 2014)

B-Edwards said:


> Haven't heard anything about these in awhile. I am seeing other brands being advertised more and more. You guys that have them, what do you think of them at this point? How have they performed? Have there been any mechanical problems? Was Tuepen fast at repairing them? How would you rate customer relations? Would you buy another lift from them? Has anyone tried another Brand (by that I mean one comparable to the tracked gt23). I am seeing more and more guys doing tree work with the little tow-able units. That is good and bad as it lets people do tree work who couldn't otherwise but it also puts inexperienced people in a position to get great parking for the rest of their lives or a funeral party.


Very late but I wish to get in touch with you if you have plans on acquiring a second, or maybe even third unit. Please contact me.


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## UP Equip (Oct 23, 2014)

pdqdl said:


> From a manufacturers point of view: as much as you can get, and still keep the sales volume up.
> 
> My perspective: I think that design is a neat as it can be, and I am avidly wishing I could afford one, especially with the insulated stick. I think the machine should be priced to compete with similar capacity equipment, given it's unique features. They need to price it to sell a lot of machines, otherwise they will never make enough money to re-coup their development costs.
> 
> ...


Again, I know it's late but I would really like to get in touch with you. Things are changing and moving forward...


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## pdqdl (Oct 23, 2014)

Well...It's not like I am hiding on this website. If you really want to get in touch with me, just send me a private message or call my business.

Please tell us how things are changing. Each new post moves the thread back up to the top of the forum listing, so lots of other fellows will be reading this thread again.

If you want to loan out one of your machines to someone to do some research on it's capabilities, I'll be happy to volunteer. Just today I was pricing rental on a trailer-aerial unit; cemeteries are not very accommodating to bucket trucks. Big dead oak, we need 60' of height and a bit of side reach would be nice.


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## UP Equip (Oct 24, 2014)

pdqdl said:


> Well...It's not like I am hiding on this website. If you really want to get in touch with me, just send me a private message or call my business.
> 
> Please tell us how things are changing. Each new post moves the thread back up to the top of the forum listing, so lots of other fellows will be reading this thread again.
> 
> If you want to loan out one of your machines to someone to do some research on it's capabilities, I'll be happy to volunteer. Just today I was pricing rental on a trailer-aerial unit; cemeteries are not very accommodating to bucket trucks. Big dead oak, we need 60' of height and a bit of side reach would be nice.



Thanks for the cozy reminder on how to get in touch with you! I am fairly new here and I thought that if the posting was public, it was appropriate to reply public.
That said, I was browsing on spider lifts topic and found this very old thread started in 2005, almost 10 years ago. I answered saying I was aware to jump in late, but that if it wasn't too late, I want to have a chat with whoever still perceive the situation as being the same. Thank you to provide me with the occasion to bring this up front by telling everyone how we, at UP Equip feels the situation have changed since then.
More brands hit North America since 2005. Back then, Teupen was pretty much alone as well as Man Engineering and Reachmaster. (I know there were a few more but these were the majors) They had a unique product, highly niche and extremely rare. They fought hard to put them on the map, and they did. Long story short, they owned the market for quite a while before others came in, and more or less "copied" their business model with great success somehow. When we arrived, two and a half years ago, we realized that the opportunity was huge because, despite the fact spider lifts were present for roughly 15 years, they were all perceived as expensive, complicated, somewhat restricted to a very few specific usage, fairly fragile (electronic components mainly) and complicated to repair (hoses, electricity inside of booms, hard to find parts and not a lot of service companies to know them). Not to mention downtime for both rental houses and end users during all the above...
When we went in Europe to find the right manufacturer partner, we were very pleased with Easy Lift philosophy of "keeping it simple". At first, we thought that they were either reluctant to introduce new technologies. Digging in further and as time and conversations went, we realized how great their decision was. They made sure that everyone of their customers, everywhere in the world could find replacement parts locally. For us, it was a perfect fit if we were to send units away throughout North and South America. Everyone would have the opportunity to repair their machines easily. That was a big scream from the market, and we answered that.
But there is more. All our models have the greatest departure angle of the industry. What is a departure angle? It is the easiness end users have to climb an obstacle, right off the tracks, without the use of any help (wood blocks, ramps). I'm not saying they climb everywhere, what I'm saying is compared to all other brands, Easy Lift is the one every end user will place at the work site with the least efforts and puzzling. At the end of the day, when you make such an investment, it has to pay. At the end of the day, if you can use a machine with minimum effort, and a maximum return on time and effort, you are indeed going to find other types of work for it, even if at first you were considering this acquisition just for specific jobs.
All our customers very rapidly realized this fact. The ease of use made them more productive, generated new business, helped them to pump out volume of work from their actual schedule and helped them also to retain their crew. The fact that they unfold their lifts on jobs generated demand, hence increase their work load, and so on and so forth.
And we haven't talked about pricing yet, which is we believe the main reason that perception still holds after all these years. We are here to make this fabulous tool available to all companies that sit on the edge of growth. And we are getting a lot of calls from all over the continent.
Hope this helps and provide everyone with a good portrait of our company, and the spider lifts as well.
Best regards.


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## pdqdl (May 23, 2020)

Bump.


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