# Best First Chipper for My Company



## ApexTreeService (Feb 15, 2008)

I am purchasing a my first used chipper soon and would value an opinion or two. My company is a few years old, and I have been doing the dump trailer routine which is old!

My climber swears by the Whisper Chippers, so I started there.

My dilema now after talking to some people is should I go chuck n duck drum chipper or self feed disk?

I will be using an '84 Ford F-350 2 wheel drive duelley with the 454 gasoline engine and 17 yard dump box.

I will be chipping alot of removals, species such as Chineese Elm, Russian Olive, Sycamore, Cherry, Apple, Crab Apple, Globe Willow, Maples, Cottonwoods, Poppler, Honey Locust, Blue Spruce (easier to trailer and dump?), Aspen, River Birch, etc.

Candidates I am considering are the Bandit 90 for disk and a Mitts & Merril 16" chuck n duck with either a Ford 4 cyl. diesel or the reliable Ford 300, or a 12" or 16" Whisper Chipper by Altec.

I need light, my truck isn't a powerhouse despite new engine. I need safe, question is do ya want the chuck n duck to take your hand off or the feed rollers to suck the new guy in. I need reliable and cheap. Sounds like the drum, but then you have to cut stuff down to get it in costing me all season with lower productivity! Is a drum self feed going to suck it all down if I hire on a couple of temps for bigger jobs?

Help, thanks!


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## clearance (Feb 15, 2008)

Whisper with the 300 Ford. Old workhorse, proven. When you get a bigger truck and more money get a diesel self feeder.


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## woodchux (Feb 15, 2008)

What the Heck are you doin with a GM motor In a F350??!!


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## Canyonbc (Feb 15, 2008)

Have you looked into the Vermeer 12 inch BC 1000 xl....i think they weigh in right at 4,600 lbs...which is roughly i believe according to the website's the 

BC 1000xl and the Bandit Model 90 are roughly the same weight. 

Jmo, on something to look into.


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## Canyonbc (Feb 15, 2008)

ApexTreeService said:


> I am purchasing a my first used chipper soon and would value an opinion or two. My company is a few years old, and I have been doing the dump trailer routine which is old!
> 
> My climber swears by the Whisper Chippers, so I started there.
> 
> ...




16-17 yard of chips...how long or tall is your chip truck??


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## ApexTreeService (Feb 15, 2008)

woodchux said:


> What the Heck are you doin with a GM motor In a F350??!!



Oh yeah, sorry, I guess the Ford is the 460! Ha, I don't pay attention to the gassers, love the Cummins . . .


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## ApexTreeService (Feb 15, 2008)

Canyonbc said:


> 16-17 yard of chips...how long or tall is your chip truck??



Yeah I know, it's a 12 foot long dump bed, by 8 wide and 5 high. The bed isn't even boxed in yet, I just figured 5' sounds like a good height if I taper the front. Is this too big or what?


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## ApexTreeService (Feb 15, 2008)

Canyonbc said:


> Have you looked into the Vermeer 12 inch BC 1000 xl....i think they weigh in right at 4,600 lbs...which is roughly i believe according to the website's the
> 
> BC 1000xl and the Bandit Model 90 are roughly the same weight.
> 
> Jmo, on something to look into.



Yep the Vermeer 1000 is on the list along with Wisconsin 12x, but both are quite a bit heavier than a 3700# chucknduck so that was my only concern with those. Another issue is the hydraulic feed rollers and maintenance associated with the hydraulic units. Salesman told me today the bearings need replacing every 2000 or so hours at a cost of $1000 or so.


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## Canyonbc (Feb 16, 2008)

ApexTreeService said:


> Yeah I know, it's a 12 foot long dump bed, by 8 wide and 5 high. The bed isn't even boxed in yet, I just figured 5' sounds like a good height if I taper the front. Is this too big or what?



Every one here will have a different opinion...by example i worked with a guy today who has a F 350 dually..however is a diesel with 12 ft bed...and i would say just under 5 ft...with a retractable top..

We were pulling a Model 100 12 inch bandit...basically a old Bandit 150. 

We filled it up pretty much to the top with Oak,...i thought it towed it fine...

i think it depends alot on your terrain and how long term are you looking...tools can pay them selves back quick...and i think the 1000 in the long run will satisfy and your company as you grow.


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## extremewoodwork (Feb 22, 2008)

I started with a vermeer 6 inch chipper and soon realized I wasted my money. Trucks are cheaper than chippers so buy the biggest chipper you can and make sure it is new. I now have a bandit 250 xp pulled by a f450 with an 8 yard chip box. It does a great job pulling just has to be emptied too often. Since I have owned two different chippers and used several others, I can honestly say that I will only buy a bandit 250 or larger in the future.


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## ApexTreeService (Feb 23, 2008)

That would be ideal, my budget for now is $10000. I have my eye on an Altec WC16 Whisper Chipper with 16" wide drum, inline 6 cyl. Ford industrial engine, year 2000 chucknduck with 1500 hours for $9900.


I am getting ready to buy, should I spend the extra cash and get a new Bandit 90 or bigger?


There's also a '91 Mitts & Merrill chucknduck, has 16" wide x 16" oversize diameter drum, electric brakes, 4830 hrs on Ford 4cyl. diesel (he says it will go 15000hrs ?!), up to 8" green wood, fresh yellow paint and sharpened knives, grease, oil, etc. for $7865.


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## tomtrees58 (Feb 23, 2008)

*chipper*

good chipper my first one new 1980 i paid 7500 new just sold it for 2500 i have a 1230 vermmer paid 2100.00 tom trees


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## beowulf343 (Feb 23, 2008)

clearance said:


> Whisper with the 300 Ford. Old workhorse, proven. When you get a bigger truck and more money get a diesel self feeder.



Yep


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## ApexTreeService (Feb 25, 2008)

Well I know the roller fed disk are great, but for my first chipper, limited budget and small company I'm leaning toward a $9900 Whisper Chipper for simplicities sake, both short and long term engine and hydraulics (or lack thereof) maintenance.

I have never used a chucknduck, will it work for me?


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## Skywalker (Feb 25, 2008)

we just completed year number one

we have a Woodchuck 12 inch chuck and duck

we paid 4500.00 for it works good

I think its fine, my partner thinks we need a Vermeer 1000 or 1500

We just got back from the local farm and garden show

we have 90 ++ estimates to run down

hope we land some


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## woodchux (Feb 25, 2008)

Chuck & ducks are very fast... You will get scratched up a little though.


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## tomtrees58 (Feb 25, 2008)

*chipper*

1 your climber?? if you dont climb you should keep cutting grass


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## Magnum783 (Feb 25, 2008)

I have used both vote highly for the hydro roller. Also as far as the bearings go grease makes things go a long way. Another thing on the rollers and bearings you can buy after market bearings form different manufactures that are way cheaper and sometimes better. Try checking out timken or someone like that. Just my opinion, I think that hydro rollers are safer because of a more controlled feed and more safety options typically.
Jared


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## Slvrmple72 (Feb 25, 2008)

You can get more work done with a hydraulic chipper feeding itself. That said, you will want to get one in better condition and more expensive than a used chuck and duck. Also consider getting an hydraulic winch equipped chipper. The 90XP is the smallest size that Bandit will equip with the winch. Look at your workload in respect to chipping. What do you do more of: removals,lot clearing, pruning, chipping/disposing of brush for customers that cut/prune their own stuff. A chipper is a "volume maximizer" , fewer trips dumping, savings on fuel, and decreased labor moving around the "fluff" but this will be offset somewhat by maintenance and upkeep on the chipper. The initial cost of the chipper is only the beginning, that is why a lot of startups use the reliable old chuck n ducks, low maintenance, low initial cost. Burn it out, throw a new motor in it, or just buy another used one. If you have the labor this is a good way to go but if it is just you and your partner having a more powerful, winch equipped, chipper is nice.


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## ropensaddle (Feb 25, 2008)

Slvrmple72 said:


> You can get more work done with a hydraulic chipper feeding itself. That said, you will want to get one in better condition and more expensive than a used chuck and duck. Also consider getting an hydraulic winch equipped chipper. The 90XP is the smallest size that Bandit will equip with the winch. Look at your workload in respect to chipping. What do you do more of: removals,lot clearing, pruning, chipping/disposing of brush for customers that cut/prune their own stuff. A chipper is a "volume maximizer" , fewer trips dumping, savings on fuel, and decreased labor moving around the "fluff" but this will be offset somewhat by maintenance and upkeep on the chipper. The initial cost of the chipper is only the beginning, that is why a lot of startups use the reliable old chuck n ducks, low maintenance, low initial cost. Burn it out, throw a new motor in it, or just buy another used one. If you have the labor this is a good way to go but if it is just you and your partner having a more powerful, winch equipped, chipper is nice.



I get more done with a chuck and duck no waiting in line will keep
six men busy! It also is not broke down every other day!


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## rbtree (Feb 25, 2008)

The 16" M&M is the best hand fed old style drum chipper ever made. Unlike all chuck and ducks save the old old Fitchburg, it feeds the brush relatively slowly, but requires sharp knives or you have to force the brush in. And it only takes 6 " material easily......

A 9" Bandit or Morbark is a better machine. However, there's a lot more used 12" chippers out on the market. All are good...look for Bandit, Morbark, Woodchuck, or Woodsman before Vermeer....the 1250 Vermeer is not as desirable a machine but it will get the job done.....A winch is a great accessory. Some of these will be drums, but self feeders.


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## ApexTreeService (Feb 27, 2008)

tomtrees58 said:


> 1 your climber?? if you dont climb you should keep cutting grass





I have never cut grass, but apparently you know something about it?

I climb every day, then get down and lift logs and brush.

I only use Stihl, I have a 200 and all the way up to an 880. I grind my own stumps, climb all my jobs, work fast as hell, and never had an accident.

I suppose I should have phrased my thoughts better. What I meant to say is: "A" climber I hired on as an independent contractor last spring because I broke my leg in Feb. of last year, and couldn't climb by Mar (a.k.a. hell week), regarded Whisper Chippers highly.

I started my tree service knowledge 10 years ago when I decided I wanted to be a wildland firefighter. I completed a 1 week (plus many weeks of fire fighting training) of chainsaw trianing including safety/maint./felling technique/brush removal, (swamping) and all aspects of felling large timber during a campout in the Rockies. We also performed many clearings in the Rockies for ski resorts so I have plenty of large timber felling experience with the Stihls!

I then worked for a tree service company short term and decided f this so I started my company 5 years ago and I have been servicing clients since. Yes, I have been too cheap to buy a chipper if you can believe it, I have been using dump trailers and dumpsters. The company I worked for had the $30000 Vermeers that would suck half a tree in via the rollers, so I know they kick butt! My question is WILL A CHUCK AND DUCK BE A GOOD CHOICE?

Thanks to every one who has given their opinion.


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## tomtrees58 (Feb 27, 2008)

*chipper*

no kid I have bein and arborist for 33 years a+ climber and on top of my tree service I have and arborist supply co my good friend is don Blair can you figure it out tom trees


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## tree MDS (Feb 27, 2008)

I still have the same chipper I started out with, a 1990 brush bandit 200+ with cummins 76 hp. The motor was new as well as the clutch, belts etc., it has the big fender/tire combo wich helps on lawns. I got it in primer for 9500 12 years ago and we painted it with Imron, decaled it and went to work. When I got some more money I added a winch from the factory (installed it myself), best thing ever, paid fot itself in weeks, was 2700 with cable. Four years ago I had to do new pto, cost about 1300. A couple years ago I got offered 10000 trade in ! talk about gettin yer moneys worth. Point is there are good deals out there you just gotta look for them. After looking at all chippers closely I think bandit 250 with JD 120 hp+ winch, autofeed is best deal for realistically all you need chipper. I decided when I get some money I'll look for used or reconditioned, about 16000 to 18000, done deal, go to workie ! Too many guys go too big these days. 15 years ago we were feedin a 250 with a log truck and thinkin it was God. Just my 2 cents.


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## ApexTreeService (Feb 27, 2008)

tomtrees58 said:


> no kid I have bein and arborist for 33 years a+ climber and on top of my tree service I have and arborist supply co my good friend is don Blair can you figure it out tom trees



If your posts are indicative of mental age than your the kid. I guess you've always had 33 years experience haven't you, you started with 33 years experience 33 years ago didn't you. I know your kind, know everything but know nothing. At least I have a long life ahead of me, rather say that than claim 33 years. Please, I don't care about tomtrees or whatever, If you have some experience with chucknducks please feel free to comment, otherwise go the the rant section.


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## ropensaddle (Feb 27, 2008)

I know there is a lot of good ones out there, a chuck and duck
is the most durable I have seen as of yet. Less moving parts
less maintenance. I don't have time to repair a chipper and
most of the self feeding types get repairs more than a simple 
whisper chipper. The whisper is fast and care in feeding it from
the side should be exercised! Or like I do mostly, throw it in from
a distance that clears me. They will lite your ear lobe and fingers
up on a cold mourning! I have got to were I kind of enjoy the 
sting  I have not run the newest big chippers that are
a friggin house payment, but if I was to spend it would want
a grapple fed whole tree chipper.


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## Slvrmple72 (Feb 27, 2008)

Apex, how big of a crew are you running? I ask this because it will help to determine the chipper you may want to consider. I have myself and a helper, sometimes two so a chipper with a winch was an indespensible addition to my operation. While I am up in a tree the groundie can tie off a large limb or a bunch of limbs end first and winch them over to the chipper. Works for the big logs as well when you use a log arch and a little planning. A chuck and duck is good when you have enough guys to keep it busy and yes, as others have mentioned it is less maintenance, but it has the potential to more seriously injure inexperienced workers so give newbies thorough training before letting them have at it.( Granted, this is true of all chippers, saws, grinders, etc.) Documented training on equipment use and maintenance is a good thing to do regularly. Keep us posted on what you finally decide to get and remember " she dont have to look pretty, she just has to get the job done!"


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## ropensaddle (Feb 27, 2008)

Slvrmple72 said:


> Apex, how big of a crew are you running? I ask this because it will help to determine the chipper you may want to consider. I have myself and a helper, sometimes two so a chipper with a winch was an indespensible addition to my operation. While I am up in a tree the groundie can tie off a large limb or a bunch of limbs end first and winch them over to the chipper. Works for the big logs as well when you use a log arch and a little planning. A chuck and duck is good when you have enough guys to keep it busy and yes, as others have mentioned it is less maintenance, but it has the potential to more seriously injure inexperienced workers so give newbies thorough training before letting them have at it.( Granted, this is true of all chippers, saws, grinders, etc.) Documented training on equipment use and maintenance is a good thing to do regularly. Keep us posted on what you finally decide to get and remember " she dont have to look pretty, she just has to get the job done!"



More people are hurt by the self feeders than chuck and ducks.
It was posted on a different forum a while back,seems too many
try to use their feet to feed it! A chuck and duck scare factor
will make anyone think safe


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## ApexTreeService (Feb 28, 2008)

Slvrmple72 said:


> Apex, how big of a crew are you running? I ask this because it will help to determine the chipper you may want to consider. I have myself and a helper, sometimes two so a chipper with a winch was an indespensible addition to my operation. While I am up in a tree the groundie can tie off a large limb or a bunch of limbs end first and winch them over to the chipper. Works for the big logs as well when you use a log arch and a little planning. A chuck and duck is good when you have enough guys to keep it busy and yes, as others have mentioned it is less maintenance, but it has the potential to more seriously injure inexperienced workers so give newbies thorough training before letting them have at it.( Granted, this is true of all chippers, saws, grinders, etc.) Documented training on equipment use and maintenance is a good thing to do regularly. Keep us posted on what you finally decide to get and remember " she dont have to look pretty, she just has to get the job done!"







Last year I ran two employee's, so three with myself. I hire temps if the job dictates, however many are needed, 1-3 or more. I am now thinking get it right the first time with a Bandit 250 and winch, get half a job chipped up with one pull?


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## tree MDS (Feb 28, 2008)

ApexTreeService said:


> Last year I ran two employee's, so three with myself. I hire temps if the job dictates, however many are needed, 1-3 or more. I am now thinking get it right the first time with a Bandit 250 and winch, get half a job chipped up with one pull?


Yep, its a good choice and there are a ton of those chippers out there- and thats why, good towability, good power (with right motor), lift cylinder with down pressure is sweet too. Thats what I dont like about vermeer, if sowething real bushy wont go all ya can do is reverse it and try it again, or take some out- lame.


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## ApexTreeService (Mar 10, 2008)

Well I think I am going to purchase a 2000 Altec Whisper Chipper with the 16" drum and I-6 Ford industrial engine. It has 1400 or so hours on it and they're asking $9900 plus shipping. White paint has normal wear. New clutch. I know a new Bandit 250 with a winch is the way to go, but worried about the economy and just don't have the funds right now. A new 250 would be $30k plus, then I would have to get a bigger diesel chip truck $$. So, for now $10k is looking nice.


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## OLD CHIPMONK (Mar 10, 2008)

I've been doing a little calculation : 17 cu. yds. of chips x 500 lbs. per cu.yd. = 8500 lbs. plus truck weight from manufactuers sticker. Check Gross Vehicle Weight. Then tounge weight of the chipper, usually 900-1000 lbs..All this on a F-350, I don't think so ! Braking would be a problem & frame breakage on the truck. You would probably chance a D.O.T. or State Police Scale Fine which is not cheap. Personally, I'd be looking for a larger truck, just to be safe & avoid possible fines or an accident.


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## Slvrmple72 (Mar 11, 2008)

Bought an old fitchburg for under 4000 off e-bay. It is a drum chipper with the Ford 300 inline 6. Time to see how it compares to my Bandit but to be fair I will have to use the winch on my truck to bring stuff to the Fitchburg. Time to do a major overhaul on the Bandit so it will be in pieces for a while.


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## OLD CHIPMONK (Mar 11, 2008)

If only someone could make a chuck & duck with feed rollers. I've got to much time on my hands ! No more getting all scuffed up while feeding limbs !


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## ApexTreeService (Mar 13, 2008)

OLD CHIPMONK said:


> If only someone could make a chuck & duck with feed rollers. I've got to much time on my hands ! No more getting all scuffed up while feeding limbs !




They do have the chuck n ducks with feed rollers now, Karl Kuemmerling bought out and now continues production of Mitts & Merril chippers. The KH16 is a 16"x16" drum style chipper with hydraulic feed roller and auto feed. 100hp diesel, looks pretty cool.


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## ApexTreeService (Mar 13, 2008)

Here are the purchase choices, buyin within a day or so:

1) 2000 Altec WC416 Whisper Chiper with 560 hrs., 4 cyl. Perkins diesel engine, 16" wide drum, decent paint, $8200+200 gas to pick it up.

2) 1991 Mitts & Merrill with 16" dia. x 16" wide cutter drum, 4 cyl. Ford diesel, 4000 hrs., refurbished with new paint, new fenders, inspection, sharp knives, etc. $8700+800 shipping.

3) 2000 Altec WC616 Whisper Chipper with 1450 hrs., 6 cyl. Ford industrial 300, 16" wide drum, decent paint, $9900+800 shipping.




Pretty much I am thinking the first listed cause of the hours. Although I would like to have the Mitts & Merril cause of the new paint, staggered knive pattern, and supposed better cutting action. Also been told changing knives is night and day between the Altec and Mitts.

ANYONE?


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## joninatree (Mar 26, 2011)

What did you end up purchasing?


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## ApexTreeService (Mar 27, 2011)

I purchased an Altec 16" (drum size) Whisper Chipper with a 4 cyl. Perkins diesel engine. Limb capacity is 8", but doesnt take large dead wood at all, spits it out. This thing sucks limbs in at an alarming rate, much faster than infeed rollers. If you factor in the time for cutting down crotches, and forcing brush in, obviously infeed rollers are the way to go. All out production with cost not a factor, a Bandit unit with a winch, infeed rollers, diesel, hydraulic lift cylinder, auto feed, rotatable chute would be the obvious way to go. A chuck and duck beats up the workers, more dangerous, less efficient and less safe. Positives: thousands less in cost, less moving parts, no hydraulics to fail or maintain, fast flat limb processing, less weight, simple and good for straight limbs.


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## rarefish383 (Mar 27, 2011)

I grew up on Asplundh 16" drums so I think you'll be OK. Something no one else mentioned is your storage and dissposal situation. A big disk will beat the snot out of a drum for grinding big wood. We had 5 acres on our lot and didn't have the room to store the mountais of chips. When grinding brush the chipper makes the pile smaller, when grinding big wood, it's like popcorn, it makes the pile bigger. We had a guy that ran a fruit stand that gave us $75 a truck load for any wood, F600 with 12'X6' high box. He was about half way from where most of our work was, back to the shop, so we saved on gas and handling the wood. We had a strong customer base so firewood was an evil of the business. The profit margin on firewood is terrible compared to daily work. My cousin tried a big 18" grinder for a few years and found it beat his trucks to death, took more trips back to the lot to dump, and he had no good market to get rid of the chips either. For him, it was esier to get rid of the wood than the chips too. He went back to smaller chippers, but no drums. Good luck, Joe.


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