# New saddle time



## BigUglySquirrel (May 22, 2006)

Time to get out of this 20lb buttstrap saddle and get something a bit more comfy and easier to move around in...did I mention LIGHTER would be a big plus?

I've searched all the threads on the topic...which took awhile and really didn't produce any real current stuff...but here's what I've got so far. 

It seems the top choices are the Butterfly II, the Petzl Vario and something from New Tribe...don't remember the model. The Edelrid Tree Magic came up several times, but the trail on it sorta stopped. So! I'm going to tell you the type of climber I am and waited anxiously for the input of all a'you's!

I climb on a split-tail most of the time, I do prunes/trims and removals. I don't use spikes on anything but take-downs and I'm not into all the mechanical ascenders and such so I need to be able to hump up a rope with no issues. I go about 210 lbs. and don't mind hanging on the rope. No one I know has anything other than the typical buttstrap type saddles and the nearest supply store is about 2 hours each way. My concerns lie mainly in the floating/rolling D bridge vs. a fixed attachment. I see the advantage of the floating setup, but will it make body thrust difficult?

The models most appealling to me at this point are the ButterflyII, the Tree Magic and the Master Deluxe (Sherrill)

Any input would be most stellar!!!

Thanks!


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## RedlineIt (May 22, 2006)

Hey BUS,

If any thing makes you gravitate to the Petzl Vario, you should know that it comes with options.

You want the Work saddle, (wider back support) the Fast leg clips, and the optional BIG side Dees.

Good Luck, and search the site for other opinions.

RedlineIt


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## pigwot (May 22, 2006)

Gonna chime in here. I am looking at saddle options, too. Climbed for years starting on triple twist hemp and the 4-D butt-strap Bashlin saddles with a tautline. Now using a BeeLine Vt on ropes that have names like Fire and Poison Hi-Vy... times sure have changed. Curious about a saddle with a bridge. New Tribe ProGear, Petzl Navaho Vario, Master II, and Komet Butterfly II all seem to have fans. Is the bridge replaceable on the New Tribe? Do the larger leg supports on the New Tribe get hot/collect sawdust? Did I hear Butterfly II has had some quality issues? 
There seems to be truth in the wisdom:
(and I paraphrase) 'that you tend to find the first saddle you use to be the definition of a good saddle, and you change to fit the saddle, the saddle doesn't change to fit you' (G.F.Beranek)...


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## BigUglySquirrel (May 23, 2006)

The deal with the bridge is my big thing. The New Tribe has the advantage of being so low-weight, but other than that it didn't do much for me. Granted a 2 lb. saddle sounds REALLY cool.  We're trying to put together a little field trip for this week to go check some things out. (Big Shot, Log Dolly, mech. ascenders, new saddles....) All I need now is a great big wad o' cash!

Also....what's up with the Glide? Anyone familiar??


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## moss (May 23, 2006)

To answer one of your questions, a floating D (or ring) won't cause you any trouble with body thrusting. Floating D's rock, once you climb on one it's tough to go back to a fixed point attachment.

The NT is very comfortable on the legs. None of the NT saddles have a floating attachment point.

If you ever plan on using ascenders for SRT the NT saddle can potentially cause nut crunching. Butterfly II has zero nut interference SRT.


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## BigUglySquirrel (May 23, 2006)

Roger that....zero nut interference is a good thing! Dig it like a ditch! Anyone familiar with the Tree Magic?? Any Brits listening? Help a brutha out!

eheheh beer is my friend.


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## okietreedude1 (May 24, 2006)

BUS and PW,

another saddle you might look at is the tree austria. It too is a lightweight saddle, floating d, individual legs. Ive had mine a year and a half and its still treating me great. 

I can attest to the above comment about the 'not switching back to a fixed AP'. I did just that once. Had a floater and picked up a master 2 cheap. Didnt really like it but Id dumped the money and wasnt going to waste it. when I finally switched back to the floater, I was back in heaven.


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## Stumper (May 24, 2006)

Of course you can add a floating attachment point (bridge) to the Master series. The NewTribe doesn't have a bridge but the legs do float and it remains the most comfortable Saddle I have ever flown


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## OTG BOSTON (May 24, 2006)

Ive had my Arbormaster for about 6 years now, before that I was playing musical chairs with all the different kinds. The Arbormaster works for me with the "western" style bridge, large "d's", and the wide back for support. Oh and the batton which I prefer over the individual leg straps. I added suspenders to keep it where it needs to be when I am lugging a big saw for chunking big wood.

My advice is to try 'em all on if you can.


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## jmack (May 24, 2006)

RedlineIt said:


> Hey BUS,
> 
> If any thing makes you gravitate to the Petzl Vario, you should know that it comes with options.
> 
> ...


brother red my vendor told me petzel wont modify the saddles you got anything?j


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## jmack (May 24, 2006)

pigwot said:


> Gonna chime in here. I am looking at saddle options, too. Climbed for years starting on triple twist hemp and the 4-D butt-strap Bashlin saddles with a tautline. Now using a BeeLine Vt on ropes that have names like Fire and Poison Hi-Vy... times sure have changed. Curious about a saddle with a bridge. New Tribe ProGear, Petzl Navaho Vario, Master II, and Komet Butterfly II all seem to have fans. Is the bridge replaceable on the New Tribe? Do the larger leg supports on the New Tribe get hot/collect sawdust? Did I hear Butterfly II has had some quality issues?
> There seems to be truth in the wisdom:
> (and I paraphrase) 'that you tend to find the first saddle you use to be the definition of a good saddle, and you change to fit the saddle, the saddle doesn't change to fit you' (G.F.Beranek)...


3 strand hemp?were you a bowline on a bight guy too


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## pigwot (May 24, 2006)

jmack said:


> 3 strand hemp?were you a bowline on a bight guy too



jmack: Only when necessary. Really enjoying these new ropes and tricks...


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## coydog (Jun 8, 2006)

I like sierra moreno saddles,I climbed on a bry-dan for years but they seem to be hard to find,...would be worth checking out if you can find a distributor . Never climbed with a glide but several climbers have told me they don't like it, just one of those designs that hasn't worked the glitches out of yet.


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## Dadatwins (Jun 8, 2006)

I would add the Blair Ultra lite to your list of potential try -ons. I tried the master 2 and could not get comfortable with it. Other problem was it would pull down to my knees when I hung a big saw on it. The Blair has Velcro and buckle waist strap keep it in place, individual leg straps. Has 2 floating d's but they do have a short range of float that I like. Some floaters come all the around to your side, which gives some pinch potential. Came out of butt strap with fixed d and will not go back. Good luck with your search.


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## Grace Tree (Jun 8, 2006)

Dadatwins said:


> I tried the master 2 and could not get comfortable with it. Other problem was it would pull down to my knees when I hung a big saw on it.



Suspenders made a big difference on mine. Plus it's a good place to hang a cell phone and a water bottle.
Phil


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## Bermie (Jun 8, 2006)

BigUglySquirrel said:


> Roger that....zero nut interference is a good thing! Dig it like a ditch! Anyone familiar with the Tree Magic?? Any Brits listening? Help a brutha out!
> 
> eheheh beer is my friend.



I have a Tree Magic II as a spare and rescue harness. I used one in the UK for about a month, it was a VERY comfortable saddle. (Buckingham II / Komet Butterfly being the others)
I bought one, only climbed it once, I haven't had time to adjust properly yet, so I still use my Komet. It has loads of attachment points 5 on the bottom of the back support - 4 on the top plus a a bent gate krab on the right hip. All the attachment points are rated at 30kg. It has 2 sliding D's and the bridge length is adjustable, has 2 fixed D's on hips. The leg loops don't have quick release clips, just web buckles.

I tried the Austrian Duo, I didn't like it but 3 of the other guys loved it and bought their own, I guess it comes down to what fits your shape and weight best.


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## Scars2prove-it (Jun 10, 2006)

Don't get a Master! Now that saddle is a nut cruncher. I just bought one after using my Buckingham for 18years. I'm now searching for a nut and hip friendly saddle.


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## jmack (Jun 11, 2006)

RedlineIt said:


> Hey BUS,
> 
> If any thing makes you gravitate to the Petzl Vario, you should know that it comes with options.
> 
> ...


red what options i checked my vendor again yesterday and was told petzel will not modify like buc


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## jmack (Jun 11, 2006)

pigwot said:


> Gonna chime in here. I am looking at saddle options, too. Climbed for years starting on triple twist hemp and the 4-D butt-strap Bashlin saddles with a tautline. Now using a BeeLine Vt on ropes that have names like Fire and Poison Hi-Vy... times sure have changed. Curious about a saddle with a bridge. New Tribe ProGear, Petzl Navaho Vario, Master II, and Komet Butterfly II all seem to have fans. Is the bridge replaceable on the New Tribe? Do the larger leg supports on the New Tribe get hot/collect sawdust? Did I hear Butterfly II has had some quality issues?
> There seems to be truth in the wisdom:
> (and I paraphrase) 'that you tend to find the first saddle you use to be the definition of a good saddle, and you change to fit the saddle, the saddle doesn't change to fit you' (G.F.Beranek)...


3-strand hemp what year was this???


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## jmack (Jun 11, 2006)

pigwot said:


> jmack: Only when necessary. Really enjoying these new ropes and tricks...


whoops been a few since ive been on thread


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## jmack (Jun 11, 2006)

Scars2prove-it said:


> Don't get a Master! Now that saddle is a nut cruncher. I just bought one after using my Buckingham for 18years. I'm now searching for a nut and hip friendly saddle.


master much pain indeed gave mine away to a chick. try either pinnacle or miniboss


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## Cornubia06 (Jun 11, 2006)

I used to get on great with the willans t20 for over ten yrs until i tried the heighteck tree hopper. Compared to the tree hopper i found the t20 with its seat and leg loops could be a bit hard on the hips after many hours and a bit restrictive in movement. Tree hopper has only leg loops, is set low on the hips suited for the good old body thrust/split tale style. It has a webbing bridge stitched into it, so only one crab is needed in the system. Its very light and allows superb unrestricted movement. I'm a firm believer in simplicity and cutting out all the clobber (potential failure points in a system) which seems to be the trend nowadays.

I would say choose a harness that is comfy and suited to your climbing style.


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## avalontree (Jun 12, 2006)

*hard seat*

gotta get the hard seat, dude
i climbed, at first, with a buckinham ball buster and it was
obviously
terrible
the hard seat is like being able to let go of the steering wheel and still be able to drive


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## pigwot (Jun 15, 2006)

Used the New Tribe Pro work saddle a few times now... I know a new style/fit takes some getting used to, but I am having one problem in particular: the nice wide well-padded belt cuts into my ribs in the front while hanging. Anyone use one know what I mean? Maybe I got one size too big? Other than that it is quite comfy.


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## PTS (Jun 17, 2006)

Just got in a new Navaho saddle and thought it looked like it was going to be great however I will warn you that all though it is comfortable the middle D to tie into after siting down will be somewhere between your nipples and chin. It is a joke and there is no adjusting. one of my bigger guys really likes it because he fills it up better however it comes large to xxl as a size and I know I can't fit into a medium. So beware.


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## Fireaxman (Jun 17, 2006)

I tried the Petzl Navaho BOD and did not like it. I could cinch the leg straps down far enough on my legs to be comfortable at the start of the work, but by the time I had worked in it for a half hour or so it had worked its way up into my crotch. Worse, I double crotched it pretty wide in a big live oak with one set of lines on the bottom D and the other in the top D (D's were too small to put both sets of lines in one D) and by the time I got through the bottom D had cut a few threads of the support webbing. I boxed it up today to send back to Sherrill Monday. 

So, Im back in my 1985 Klein Butt Strap with the modified sliding bridge. It's still in good shape, but the more I climb the more aware I am of the hip squeeze problem. 

I want the butt board and sliding D's. I think I'm going to a Buckingham Traverse.


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## jmack (Jun 18, 2006)

pigwot said:


> Used the New Tribe Pro work saddle a few times now... I know a new style/fit takes some getting used to, but I am having one problem in particular: the nice wide well-padded belt cuts into my ribs in the front while hanging. Anyone use one know what I mean? Maybe I got one size too big? Other than that it is quite comfy.


new tribe is rec climbing gear brudder pig


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## jmack (Jun 18, 2006)

Fireaxman said:


> I tried the Petzl Navaho BOD and did not like it. I could cinch the leg straps down far enough on my legs to be comfortable at the start of the work, but by the time I had worked in it for a half hour or so it had worked its way up into my crotch. Worse, I double crotched it pretty wide in a big live oak with one set of lines on the bottom D and the other in the top D (D's were too small to put both sets of lines in one D) and by the time I got through the bottom D had cut a few threads of the support webbing. I boxed it up today to send back to Sherrill Monday.
> 
> So, Im back in my 1985 Klein Butt Strap with the modified sliding bridge. It's still in good shape, but the more I climb the more aware I am of the hip squeeze problem.
> 
> I want the butt board and sliding D's. I think I'm going to a Buckingham Traverse.


 you tried the sherrill saddle and are returning it ????? are you getting refund, trade, credit, or what sounds like this would solve some problems with buying something you havent tried


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## pigwot (Jun 18, 2006)

I've spent about 5 days now in the New Tribe Progear work saddle. No sore hips at the end of the day. It's a winner, very comfortable.


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## jmack (Jun 18, 2006)

pigwot said:


> I've spent about 5 days now in the New Tribe Progear work saddle. No sore hips at the end of the day. It's a winner, very comfortable.


how much? do you have a link j


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## pigwot (Jun 18, 2006)

jmack said:


> how much? do you have a link j



http://www.newtribe.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=180

I got mine with the quick-release buckles on the leg straps and a "Sash" one-sided suspender (crosses from left at hip to right shoulder) as I hang my saw on the left.
Saddle $215.00
Buckles 26.50
Sash 11.00
Total $252.50

Very nice desin, and TESTED AND MEET ANSI A10.14-1991 STANDARD, Class I HARNESSES FOR FALL ARREST/RESTRAINT, and Class II WORK POSITIONING (their caps, not mine, just cut'n'pasted from their site, wasn't yelling)


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## Fireaxman (Jun 18, 2006)

jmack said:


> you tried the sherrill saddle and are returning it ????? are you getting refund, trade, credit, or what sounds like this would solve some problems with buying something you havent tried



Both Sherrill and OK Arborist Supply have offerred to let me buy a saddle and return it if I don't like it, as long as I return it in Like New condition and I pay the shipping. I think there are several vendors who will do that for you, and it is a good way to get the look and feel of a saddle if you are content to just hang on it in your living room where you wont get it dirty. Unfortunately, that is not going to help me with the BOD. 

When I first tried it out I liked it. I especially liked the sternal D ring and the fall protection rated harness, and it was comfortable enough as long I as I was just hanging on it. So I took it into the trees.

I used it for 3 months before the pelvic D started fraying the webbing. Now Sherrill is going to have to send it back to Petzle to decide if it was a defective harness before I can get any refund.


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## jmack (Jun 24, 2006)

Fireaxman said:


> Both Sherrill and OK Arborist Supply have offerred to let me buy a saddle and return it if I don't like it, as long as I return it in Like New condition and I pay the shipping. I think there are several vendors who will do that for you, and it is a good way to get the look and feel of a saddle if you are content to just hang on it in your living room where you wont get it dirty. Unfortunately, that is not going to help me with the BOD.
> 
> When I first tried it out I liked it. I especially liked the sternal D ring and the fall protection rated harness, and it was comfortable enough as long I as I was just hanging on it. So I took it into the trees.
> 
> I used it for 3 months before the pelvic D started fraying the webbing. Now Sherrill is going to have to send it back to Petzle to decide if it was a defective harness before I can get any refund.


 thanks guys i went with the weaver independent leg straps an large dees


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## balaban9331 (Jul 14, 2006)

been using my weaver double dee for the last couple of months and i like it alot.i like the way it looks and how it feels.it's heavier than the other saddles,but there is something i like about it.in the end,it's what suits you best.


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## 046 (Nov 3, 2007)

anyone else having nut crunching problems with SRT using New Tribe work saddles? 



moss said:


> To answer one of your questions, a floating D (or ring) won't cause you any trouble with body thrusting. Floating D's rock, once you climb on one it's tough to go back to a fixed point attachment.
> 
> The NT is very comfortable on the legs. None of the NT saddles have a floating attachment point.
> 
> If you ever plan on using ascenders for SRT the NT saddle can potentially cause nut crunching. Butterfly II has zero nut interference SRT.


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## pigwot (Nov 3, 2007)

046 said:


> anyone else having nut crunching problems with SRT using New Tribe work saddles?



I am not using SRT, but did lose about 20 pounds since last January and now when I climb I have had minor nut crunch problems with my NT. It had fit perfectly and I had no nut interference last winter, but now I am working at getting the leg straps adjusted differently. It is still the most comfortable saddle I've used overall.


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