# Talk me out of a push behind stump grinder?



## Bwoell14 (Dec 14, 2016)

The possibility of adding stump grinding to my tree service has me puzzled. We're a small tree service in FL and I'd like to advertise to do stumps also. I found a used Toro 13hp and a Bluebird 13hp stump grinder for sale. Everybody says I should drop the cash and get a big one but dropping $25K and not knowing how busy I'll be is a big risk. What do you think?


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## no tree to big (Dec 14, 2016)

They do grind stumps slowly but they do grind.... how big is your average stump? A vermeer 252 or similar would be world's better and be had for far less then 25k. But if you like abusing your body and have nothing else to do with your life feel free to buy a 13 hp machine.

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## CanopyGorilla (Dec 15, 2016)

I bought a dingo for $11,000 a BMG for $2,300 and a quick attach stump grinder for $4,500. One machine with multiple uses for $17,800. The stump attachment has actually exceeded my expectations, and the grapple saves days of rolling firewood.


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## Bwoell14 (Dec 15, 2016)

no tree to big said:


> They do grind stumps slowly but they do grind.... how big is your average stump? A vermeer 252 or similar would be world's better and be had for far less then 25k. But if you like abusing your body and have nothing else to do with your life feel free to buy a 13 hp machine.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G900T using Tapatalk



I'll have to look into the Vermeer 252. We are doing mostly smaller stuff but if I advertised for stumps too, I'm sure I'd get some bigger stuff that's been cut down by somebody else without a grinder. It's the small initial that attracts me to the cheaper handheld. 


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## Conquistador3 (Dec 15, 2016)

I don't know if something similar is available in the US as well, but you may want to look at something like this: http://www.caravaggi.com/fresaceppi-serie-sp-2/?lang=en
It was envisioned exactly to bridge the gap between the 12-15hp push units and the big expensive four wheel units using twin cylinder engines. 

Alternatively less than 25 grands will buy you a fully reconditioned second hand 1.5 ton escavator with plenty of life left and a stump grinding attachment. Those small escavators can get almost everywhere, are easy to transport and are a Godsend in many jobs.


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## AGoodSteward (Dec 15, 2016)

The man powered stump grinders will work you ragged. I used to rent the bluebird one for a few years. Bought a 222 and it paid for itself in 2 months. I just talked to a guy who is starting up a service here. He rents a nice tracked unit from the Vermeer dealership. Saves up and does all his stumps in 1 day/mo. You'll regret putting good coin into the underpowered junk. Use it as a down payment on something nice.


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## TheJollyLogger (Dec 15, 2016)

Just go rent one for a day, you'll talk yourself out of it.


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## gorman (Dec 15, 2016)

You will sweat your ass off using one. Hips moving side to side like some cheap Elvis impersonator.


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## JeffGu (Dec 15, 2016)

Those 13HP ones are easy to load/unload from the trailer and move around... but only good for stumps that nothing else can reach. I bought a used Carlton SP-2000 for $3K and it's a beast, by comparison. 30HP, not 13HP and self-propelled. Still, it's work to run it, but it doesn't vibrate you to death or completely wear you out like the little ones do. Paid for itself in one season, and it's plenty big enough for my needs. Fits through a gate, but needs a little more room than the Bluebird types, so a stump in tight quarters can be a pain. Still, I can get it places where the big ones aren't an option.


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## jefflovstrom (Dec 15, 2016)

You do not want a push behind 13hp,,like Jolly said, rent one for a day, 
You could get a Dosko self propelled like this,,
http://www.dosko.com/stump_grinders/620_Series.html
Jeff


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## Zale (Dec 15, 2016)

Your competitors will thank you. While your working like a slave and wasting time, they'll be doing the jobs you don't have time for.


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## Bwoell14 (Dec 15, 2016)

JeffGu said:


> Those 13HP ones are easy to load/unload from the trailer and move around... but only good for stumps that nothing else can reach. I bought a used Carlton SP-2000 for $3K and it's a beast, by comparison. 30HP, not 13HP and self-propelled. Still, it's work to run it, but it doesn't vibrate you to death or completely wear you out like the little ones do. Paid for itself in one season, and it's plenty big enough for my needs. Fits through a gate, but needs a little more room than the Bluebird types, so a stump in tight quarters can be a pain. Still, I can get it places where the big ones aren't an option.



Which did you like better, Bluebird or Toro?


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## BC WetCoast (Dec 16, 2016)

I had to rent a 13 hp toro yesterday when our self propelled machine crapped the bed and we had to finish the job. It works, but whether you should get one really depends on your market. If you're only doing stumps <10", many with difficult access, then it might be a good deal. I saw one guy who had built a carrier rack on his chipper for a small grinder, so was able to grind the stump without having to bring a second vehicle.

If you get bigger stumps, you'll want a bigger machine.

To follow others, go and rent a couple of machines and see how they work for you.


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## Bwoell14 (Dec 16, 2016)

BC WetCoast said:


> I had to rent a 13 hp toro yesterday when our self propelled machine crapped the bed and we had to finish the job. It works, but whether you should get one really depends on your market. If you're only doing stumps <10", many with difficult access, then it might be a good deal. I saw one guy who had built a carrier rack on his chipper for a small grinder, so was able to grind the stump without having to bring a second vehicle.
> 
> If you get bigger stumps, you'll want a bigger machine.
> 
> To follow others, go and rent a couple of machines and see how they work for you.



Thanks. Problem I'm having is nobody rents bigger machines in my area. Closest that rents is a Home Depot outside of my area and that's the Toro 13hp. 


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## gorman (Dec 16, 2016)

I would just save yourself the headache and buy a used self propelled. Find one on Craigslist and have some money saved to replace the engine. You can find gas engines for around 2k. Don't bother rebuilding them, they're throw-always.


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## TheJollyLogger (Dec 16, 2016)

It's like any other purchase in this business: a one time pinch, and a month later you cant figure out how you did without it. At the same time, Just like every other purchase, buying too small or lesser quality as a stopgap is almost always a waste of time and money, and you end up buying the one you should have gotten in the first place.

John Ruskin put it well.

https://www.goodreads.com/quotes/236559-it-s-unwise-to-pay-too-much-but-it-s-worse-to


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## JeffGu (Dec 16, 2016)

Bwoell14 said:


> Which did you like better, Bluebird or Toro?



I liked the Bluebird a little better, myself, but I can't really say why. Someone else is bound to have liked the Toro better. I didn't think there was a big difference.
On the other hand, the first time I used the Carlton, I knew I had made the right decision in holding out for a used one I could afford. It has required only a couple of very minor repairs, is a lot heavier and harder to load/unload and tie down to the trailer, but it is also a lot more powerful machine. Slower than the big machines, but a lot faster than the small ones. The teeth don't dull quickly and it doesn't vibrate you or bounce around. You still have to manhandle it into a good position sometimes, but I've found it pays to take your time and let the machine do the work. It might take a bit longer to use the self-propelled drive to make a few moves to get it into a better position, but that beats the hell out of trying to muscle the heavy beast around.

All in all, I think the John Ruskin quote sums it up well. It has ground stumps that the little ones would take all day to do. It's also taken more than 2 hours to grind one that a big machine could have done in 20 minutes or so. I was looking at buying one of the small ones new, and I'm glad I held out for the bigger machine. I'd be turning down a lot of stumps, otherwise. The used Carlton was in my budget, and is a reasonable compromise. There's no way I could afford one of the big machines with a remote control.


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## ArtB (Dec 16, 2016)

How deep d the comparative grinders grind? HO contentment the next year? 

Different approach:
Dig around stump foot or so deep, wash off with hose and small sump pump to drain.
Easy with the little excavator someone already mentioned. 

Chainsaw off at bottom of hole, backfill with a $15 load of topsoil. 
Did that with a 44" cottonwood stump, no problem.


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## jefflovstrom (Dec 16, 2016)

ArtB said:


> How deep d the comparative grinders grind? HO contentment the next year?
> 
> Different approach:
> Dig around stump foot or so deep, wash off with hose and small sump pump to drain.
> ...



,,,,.....,,,,...
See?,,,,,emotion,,,,,
Jeff


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## JeffGu (Dec 18, 2016)

The SP-2000 can cut 27" above grade, 24" below grade. I believe both the Toro and Bluebird are 12" both above and below grade.


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