# How Do You Clean Up A Yard? Interesting Post!



## StihlRockin' (Apr 14, 2009)

I'm interested to know how you clean up yards on your smaller residential tree jobs?

Many yards I'm in don't fair well with front end loaders like a bobcat, so most all jobs have to be without larger machinery. Keep this in mind.

Here are some things I'm interested to know how you do it:
*(Please keep in mind these are smaller yards)*

1.) How do you clean up and haul the stump mulch to the truck?

2.) How do you clean up the smaller leaves, sticks and debris from the yard?

3.) How do you haul the logs out to the truck?

4.) How do you haul the brush to the chipper?

Last fall I purchased a Dr. Powerwagon.... motorized wheelbarrow, and I haven't used it as much as I thought, yet. It does wonders for longer hauls or softer yards where using a wheelbarrow is extremely physical and slow.

Currently to do the jobs listed above, it's mostly manually done... grunt work. The smaller debris are hand raked with hard & plastic rakes and hauled away with wheelbarrow or placed on a tarp. The logs are cut into handable pieces like firewood size to fit horizontally in the wheelbarrow or about 4ft. long, depending on size, to be placed length-ways in the wheelbarrow. The brush is hand stacked and carried to chipper, unless they're longer and heavier, then they're dragged to chipper.

I created the post to share ideas and hopefully pick up some tips on how you do it... plus might pick up great ideas on using different equipment I never considered or even knew of!

*Edit:* Forgot to mention that I use to use a Shindaiwa Powerbroom with the rubber flaps, not the bristles. I see Stihl has the same attachment(s) now. Do any of you use the powerbroom paddles or bristles for raking? What do you think of them? (mine was stolen early when I had it, so didn't get to test much, but liked it)

Thanks,

*StihlRockin'*


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## Slvrmple72 (Apr 14, 2009)

This isn't rocket science! Mini or full size skidsteer with plywood at turning/pivot points. You already know not to bomb the stuff and tear up the yard poke holes in it. The better you mind the rigging the less you will have to rake!!! Charge more for the labor intensive jobs, you know, cut the 75'+ tree down piece meal and carry each darn piece up the ravine under the deck through the narrow gate down the steps between the houses where the neighbor will not move his vette and is videotaping for proof that the scratches are from those tree hicks and not his half his age gf's St. Bernard! Wheelbarrow(s),hand trucks, big trashcans, rakes, leafblower, shovels, cottonseed fork, and the dogged persistance of manpower working in cogged and efficient unison will get the job done... but a crane doesn't hurt either! Remember this all important rule of thumb: The location of and complexity of removal of the tree in question in combination with the tools, equipment, and manpower avaliable will determine the suitable sizes (chunks, lengths, logs, chips, splinters, etc. )to which said tree should be reduced to in order to maximize profits by minimizing time to completion! Whew! 

So, are you gonna bomb the tree into the yard in record time only to spend three times the effort raking and patching, after untangling the mess, cutting rope with the chainsaw, and finding the hornets! Or will you systematically dissect that tree like a small army of leafcutter ants marveling would be customers with your penchant for efficiency and respect of the property owners prized begonias! You decide.


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## tree md (Apr 14, 2009)

Slvrmple72 said:


> This isn't rocket science! Mini or full size skidsteer with plywood at turning/pivot points. You already know not to bomb the stuff and tear up the yard poke holes in it. The better you mind the rigging the less you will have to rake!!! Charge more for the labor intensive jobs, you know, cut the 75'+ tree down piece meal and carry each darn piece up the ravine under the deck through the narrow gate down the steps between the houses where the neighbor will not move his vette and is videotaping for proof that the scratches are from those tree hicks and not his half his age gf's St. Bernard! Wheelbarrow(s),hand trucks, big trashcans, rakes, leafblower, shovels, cottonseed fork, and the dogged persistance of manpower working in cogged and efficient unison will get the job done... but a crane doesn't hurt either! Remember this all important rule of thumb: The location of and complexity of removal of the tree in question in combination with the tools, equipment, and manpower avaliable will determine the suitable sizes (chunks, lengths, logs, chips, splinters, etc. )to which said tree should be reduced to in order to maximize profits by minimizing time to completion! Whew!
> 
> So, are you gonna bomb the tree into the yard in record time only to spend three times the effort raking and patching, after untangling the mess, cutting rope with the chainsaw, and finding the hornets! Or will you systematically dissect that tree like a small army of leafcutter ants marveling would be customers with your penchant for efficiency and respect of the property owners prized begonias! You decide.



LMAO! What he said... :agree2:

I will add that a small tarp saves tons of time when getting up the small rakings and mulch. And a scoop shovel to bump the curbs is a great tool to have as well.


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## StihlRockin' (Apr 14, 2009)

Hey, thanks for the posts so far!

=============================

I forgot to mention I use a backpack blower, one of Husqvarna's larger cc ones, and it does well in the situations I use them for.

*By "hand truck", I'm assuming that's some sort of dolly?*

*StihlRockin'*


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## murphy4trees (Apr 14, 2009)

Power broom works great on stump chips and saw dust.... not much good for regular tree clean ups because it glides right over the little sticks... 

Best way to get turf super clean is to use one man on a large backpack blower and one man on a rake working together. Tarps are very useful, and you also need a trash can. Use the trash can to do the last little bit of clean up around the truck and chipper.

Using the chipper's winch to pull big tops is fun.. Keep one man near the butt, pulling up on the cable to keep the wood from plowing through the turf.. 

No skid steer yet


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## Tree Pig (Apr 14, 2009)

StihlRockin' said:


> I'm interested to know how you clean up yards on your smaller residential tree jobs?
> 
> Many yards I'm in don't fair well with front end loaders like a bobcat, so most all jobs have to be without larger machinery. Keep this in mind.
> 
> ...



1) 













2) 



or















3)













4)


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## M.Green - SVTS (Apr 14, 2009)

*Tarp, wench, rake, and tough labor*

I'll answer this question to the best of my ability.

1. As far as the stump mulch goes, throw what you and another person can drag to your truck onto a tarp and drag it. Then shovel it in.

2. Rake the smaller leaves, sticks, etc.. into a pile and then do the same.

3. Either cut to logs to size where you can carry them, or get a wench and drag them across the yard. If the homeowner doesn't want there yard torn up, get a piece of plywood put it under the log and as the log falls off, move the plywood and do it all over again.

4. Hauling the brush with a wench is easy. Get a choke , a nice sized one. Stack a pile of brush as big as you want and wrap the choke around the buts make sure it's secure and then run the wench. That shouldn't tear up a yard at all.

That's my two cents. I hope all goes well in your venture to find an easier way of doing things. But sometimes there aren't. I just gave you a list of things that may be tougher but will save you a lot of money and really don't take that long to do.


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## Labman (Apr 14, 2009)

Slvrmple72 said:


> This isn't rocket science! Mini or full size skidsteer with plywood at turning/pivot points. .....



Yes, 3/4'' plywood works wonders. I once worked for a guy with a 48'' tree spade on a truck. I even built him a rack to hold a stack of plywood right behind the cab. On straight runs, we used 2'x 8' pieces. That way he could run that big truck through soft yards without damage.


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## treemandan (Apr 14, 2009)

murphy4trees said:


> Power broom works great on stump chips and saw dust.... not much good for regular tree clean ups because it glides right over the little sticks...
> 
> Best way to get turf super clean is to use one man on a large backpack blower and one man on a rake working together. Tarps are very useful, and you also need a trash can. Use the trash can to do the last little bit of clean up around the truck and chipper.
> 
> ...


 Sucks for you:greenchainsaw:

Ha ha just joking but to answer all the questions listed above... well dare I say it fellas? No you say it for me, chant it: Dingo, Dingo, Dingo. Hell, I would just sit on a log and watch with out it. Seriously, I would stay on the porch.


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## tree MDS (Apr 14, 2009)

I can usually get the tractor to the mess around here - if not they might not like my price too much, lol. Moving wood by hand really sucks once you get a machine.

Aluminum cleanup shovel under the butt of log when winching with groundguy walking along can enable winching where otherwise it might tear things up too much.

I once dragged an aluminum duck boat up a hilly snow covered lawn with the tractor winch, didnt leave a mark, worked sweet. There was no other way really, I'd thought of the motorized wheelbarrow but then it snowed. The boat was junk plus I dont fish - it was my oldest brothers and I dont really like him that much anyway, besides he was in FL, lol.


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## John464 (Apr 14, 2009)

1) I very rarely haul stump mulch. For the price I charge when a stump machine + operator is on site is not going to be worth it. I tell them to call your landscaper and if they don't have one I provide them with one(who also throws me leads)
2) Rakes and tarps and buckets and backpack blowers
3) 12ft to 14ft log lengths hauled with skid loader w/ grapple or crane the pieces out
4) Winch, manpower, or grapple


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## ntsarborist (Apr 14, 2009)

StihlRockin' said:


> 1.) How do you clean up and haul the stump mulch to the truck?
> 
> 2.) How do you clean up the smaller leaves, sticks and debris from the yard?
> 
> ...



1.) we use a wheelbarrow to haul to the trucks

2.) rake into piles and load on a tarp or wheelbarrow.a trashcan also works good

3.) we carry the logs out and the larger ones we ahave a dolly for

4.) well theres only one way to get that moved. start draggin


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## wood4heat (Apr 14, 2009)

My dad has an easter egg hunt each year for my kids and all the cousins. I recieved this in an email from him yesterday:

"For what ever reason, the kids started gathering sticks up in my side yard, and throwing them over the cliff. Not sure whose idea it was, but my side yard hasn't been this clean in quite a while 

I think I'll have the kids back next fall when the leaves come down." 

It seems they accept pay in the form of candy filled plastic eggs.


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## BlueRidgeMark (Apr 14, 2009)

M.Green - SVTS said:


> ..... get a wench and drag them across the yard.




Well, I like the mental image, but oh, man! N.O.W. is gonna _*hang *_you for that! :jawdrop:




This is a w*e*nch:






This is a w*i*nch:


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## treemandan (Apr 14, 2009)

BlueRidgeMark said:


> Well, I like the mental image, but oh, man! N.O.W. is gonna _*hang *_you for that! :jawdrop:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I am glad someone finally cleared that up. I have been using the wench, sorry.


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## woodchux (Apr 14, 2009)

The best way to get limbs and logs to the truck or chipper is a speedline...


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## tree MDS (Apr 14, 2009)

*RE: wench*

Yeah, I saw that too. I would like to try out the wench as well, looks like a tough ole gal fer sure.


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## Slvrmple72 (Apr 14, 2009)

She will drag you across the yard!


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## talloak (Apr 14, 2009)

I have a skidloader but rarely use it to avoid yard damge. For stump grindings I use a lite plastic trash can shovel it in and throw it up on my shoulder. For brush well just grap it and go. For wood a ball cart (sherill sells a nice one)or cut it in fire wood and put it on your shoulder and go :greenchainsaw:


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## talloak (Apr 14, 2009)

RIGHT ON WITH THE SPEED LINE


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## ozzy42 (Apr 14, 2009)

BlueRidgeMark said:


> Well, I like the mental image, but oh, man! N.O.W. is gonna _*hang *_you for that! :jawdrop:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I don't see the bid deal.
She looks as though she could get a lot of stuff to the truck in an 8hr day.


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## BlueRidgeMark (Apr 14, 2009)

treemandan said:


> I am glad someone finally cleared that up. *I have been using the wench*, sorry.




Uh... Uh...

Oh, I don't think we want to go there!


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## fishercat (Apr 14, 2009)

*the tractor and grapple are priceless.*

not sure how i made it without them.i turn the york rake around backwards and push it in reverse.works awesome on pine jobs.wide pithfork,rakes,and the Husqvarna BT 180.


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## prentice110 (Apr 14, 2009)

StihlRockin' said:


> I'm interested to know how you clean up yards on your smaller residential tree jobs?
> 
> Many yards I'm in don't fair well with front end loaders like without larger machinery. Keep this in mind.
> 
> ...



1. mini skid with bucket. if this wont fit throw em' in a garbage can and put it on the log cart. 2. Rakes and tarps and garbage can again. I will at this point add that if you can find a plastic 55 gallon drum and cut it in half and cut some handles or drill some holes and tie a rope to it for a handle, you may like it better than a garbage can. I know I do. I always tell the guys to start raking at the back of the yard toward where ever the debris is being loaded/chipped. I cant stand watching greenhorns start raking at the front or middle. I say, "what are you retarded or something, more crap is going to fall there and your going to end up raking the same spot 3-4 times. Always start at the back, I cannot express that enough. Rake until there is to much and then put the pile on a tarp. 3.Logs go out by hand, on a log cart, or, if there is enough room, on the mini Bob. When I get my branch manager grapple (soon I hope) all logs will go out that way, and I may stop bidding jobs that I cant use it on. 4. By hand if its in the way and i dont have room for the mini. Also will cut small and stack on the log cart if its a long drag, have had little brackets welded on to put stakes on the log cart so the brush gets stacked nice and tall. Saves trips and backs. If your working in a nice open yard, the mini will push large LEADS to the curb if you dont try to lift them too high. So whatya think of that?


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## arborworks1 (Apr 14, 2009)

I use the mini whenever I can. I have used the speed line method alot. More or less a load line to move wood and brush up hills. Very fast and super easy.


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## DirtyDog (Apr 14, 2009)

This is gonna sound pretty far fetched, but I have found that a wet/dry vac is awesome for getting every little chip off the grass. I blow most of it into a pile and use a shovel to get what i can. Then i vacuum the rest up with my wet/dry 6hp vac. You will look pretty silly vacuuming up the grass, but it works really well.
I wouldn't do that for the entire yard, but if you get most in one area. That works well as long as you have a generator or wall plug within a reasonable distance.

As far as moving logs, i use a smaller lawn tractor that i welded up a hitch onto it. I pull a long but narrow cart(fits in gates) to move from backyard to truck. Or, we use a heavy duty 2 wheel wheelbarrow good for 1200lbs. 
As far as brush, I like to lay out a piece of rope and start piling the brush ontop of it. When the pile gets waist high, I wrap the rope around and tie it off. The I tie another rope at the base of bottom ones(try to get behicd a crotch) and I tie the rope to ball of the mower and pull it to the truck. Works well for the most part as long s the bottom braches aren't poking into the ground. I have though about putting a tie point higher up on the tractor so it "lifts" the front of the pile up.

We are a 2 man team for the most part and we don't have the ability to carry large machines around. We work together and do lots of smaller jobs so the less we have to haul, the more money we make.
The kubota and skidsteers stay in the driveway unless we have a commercial job or a residentil lot clearing.


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## oldirty (Apr 14, 2009)

tarps suck. big green landscaping barrels much better for everything tarp related. 

when it come to brush make sure whoever is running the saw isnt cutting too much. i hate when the guys i work with make way too many cuts on a branch that is getting chipped, its more work. but they are boneheads who should know better but dont.

take the biggest branch and stack on top of that. then drag that whole mess out. fewer trips to the chipper that way.

for cleanup rakes first then the blower to get the lawn spotless. 

we need a mini. ive humped way too much wood at the company i am at now.


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## prentice110 (Apr 14, 2009)

I almost forgot, If you wanna go real fast with brush, use a 4 wheeler. TARPS ROCK!


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## woodchux (Apr 14, 2009)

Anyone tried the 'bagster' yet? http://www.northerntool.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_6970_200381470_200381470


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## oldirty (Apr 14, 2009)

prentice110 said:


> TARPS ROCK!



no thanks.


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## prentice110 (Apr 14, 2009)

oldirty said:


> no thanks.



may i inquire as to why you feel this way?


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## oldirty (Apr 14, 2009)

i'd rather hump the barrel up onto my shoulder and then toss it into the back of the truck than drag a tarp and then handle the crap again trying to get it into the truck. 

make a big draggable pile with the limbs and get them to the chipper then the rake makes piles that can be manhandled. then when it come to the small stuff......bang.....into the barrel and into the chip truck she go!


i just dont like tarps, it reminds me of fall cleanups and landscapers.


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## prentice110 (Apr 14, 2009)

ahh,its hard for me to remember those days. We just toss it onto the street so we can pick it up with the clam. We brush load with a Hood loader and tub grind. Only chip when we have to. Too hard to get rid of chips around here, but big market for mulch. I like tarps cuz you can fold em' real tight and put em' behind the seat. Bring a big bucket and one day you just might have to come back for one more log, or the bucket....


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## Tree Pig (Apr 14, 2009)

oldirty said:


> i'd rather hump the barrel up onto my shoulder and then toss it into the back of the truck than drag a tarp and then handle the crap again trying to get it into the truck.
> 
> make a big draggable pile with the limbs and get them to the chipper then the rake makes piles that can be manhandled. then when it come to the small stuff......bang.....into the barrel and into the chip truck she go!
> 
> ...



I think Old Dirty may suffer from a common affliction amongst the Tree work community _*Terra Laboro Phobias*_ (latin for the fear of landscapers)
I seldom go near them myself. There should be a support group.


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## Tree Pig (Apr 14, 2009)

prentice110 said:


> ahh,its hard for me to remember those days. We just toss it onto the street so we can pick it up with the clam. We brush load with a Hood loader and tub grind. Only chip when we have to. Too hard to get rid of chips around here, but big market for mulch. I like tarps cuz you can fold em' real tight and put em' behind the seat. Bring a big bucket and one day you just might have to come back for one more log, or the bucket....



Put the log in the bucket... Problem solved These puzzles are easy


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## prentice110 (Apr 15, 2009)

Stihl-O-Matic said:


> Put the log in the bucket... Problem solved These puzzles are easy



Please dont shatter my fragile little microcosm, its all I have.


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## Tree Pig (Apr 15, 2009)

prentice110 said:


> Please dont shatter my fragile little microcosm, its all I have.



Just goes to show you there is some truth to the saying. Ask three Tree guys how to due a job and you'll get 4 different answers.


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## oldirty (Apr 15, 2009)

Stihl-O-Matic said:


> I think Old Dirty may suffer from a common affliction amongst the Tree work community _*Terra Laboro Phobias*_ (latin for the fear of landscapers)
> I seldom go near them myself. There should be a support group.



PITA landscapers are. always in the way. about 9 mexicans stacked deep into a single cab. nary a word of english spoken except for "no speak". every bush in the yard is shaped like a ball after they leave. 

landscaping sucks. i ran a weedwacker for a summer before i found tree work. you can have the chit man.


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## DirtyDog (Apr 15, 2009)

woodchux said:


> Anyone tried the 'bagster' yet? http://www.northerntool.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_6970_200381470_200381470



LMAO..aaahahahahaaaaa Looking at that picture... What could possibly be going through their minds for adverstisement reasons??? You have a guy which appears to be a consruction worker or 'weekend warrior", throwing sinks, doors, scrap wood..etc into this bag in the driveway. Ummm, Okay, now what?? WTF wcould you possibly do with a bag full of all that stuff? You certainly couldn't pick it up by hand. Are those yellow ropes on the side the handles? maybe a bucket loader could pick it up by them, but then if you have a bucket loader you wouldn't need a dumb bag in the first place. 
The only thing I can see that being pretty handy and useful for....Leaves! However, your still gonna have to dump it. Branches, logs...No way in hell. Looks like a complete hassle


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## prentice110 (Apr 15, 2009)

Stihl-O-Matic said:


> Just goes to show you there is some truth to the saying. Ask three Tree guys how to due a job and you'll get 4 different answers.



I think I was about 20 when I said that there were as many ways to cut down a tree as there were people doing it. Came to the conclusion early on that the reason that there were so many tree companies, was because no body agreed on how it should be done, so sooner or later all your best guys qiut and start there own.


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## prentice110 (Apr 15, 2009)

oldirty said:


> every bush in the yard is shaped like a ball after they leave.
> you can have the chit man.



I cant stand the way they do that. Who in there right mind would pay for that? Oh wait, there looking at the bottom line, not the bush.


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## DirtyDog (Apr 15, 2009)

prentice110 said:


> I cant stand the way they do that. Who in there right mind would pay for that? Oh wait, there looking at the bottom line, not the bush.




My friend, were are of the same. Neither one of us like Balls....lol aaahahahaaa


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## pdqdl (Apr 15, 2009)

woodchux said:


> Anyone tried the 'bagster' yet? http://www.northerntool.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_6970_200381470_200381470



That's insanity. What are you going to do with it once it's full?

Call a tree service with a log grapple to come load it into your trash truck?

If it was sturdy enough, it might make a nice kiddie pool in the summertime.


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## arbor pro (Apr 15, 2009)

StihlRockin' said:


> I'm interested to know how you clean up yards on your smaller residential tree jobs?
> 
> Many yards I'm in don't fair well with front end loaders like a bobcat, so most all jobs have to be without larger machinery. Keep this in mind.
> 
> ...



Mini skid with bucket grapple. Will move everything you mentioned from logs and brush to stump grindings and dirt with minimal disturbance to lawns or landscapes.


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## teamtree (Apr 15, 2009)

Small Utility Tractor if we can get it in....usually we can...it is very effective for almost all trees....as long as you don't load the front in down....much less damage than any skid steer I have ever seen.....and I usually only have to take half the load that a skid steer could handle....so it usually only amounts to a few more cuts on a tree and a few more trips....for us the tree dictates how it is cut down

Otherwise we cut the logs down to firewood and pack it out.

Rake leaves and debris on tarp and drag to chipper.

We drag the limbs to the chipper...unless we can utilize the winch on the chipper.


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## Henry111 (Apr 15, 2009)

man i just have to ask where did you guys work before because this stuff sounds like a joke to me.


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## talloak (Apr 15, 2009)

AMEN BROTHER TREE GUYS ARE TOUGH SO LETS GET UNSISSYFIED.GETTER-DONE


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## BC WetCoast (Apr 16, 2009)

Henry111 said:


> man i just have to ask where did you guys work before because this stuff sounds like a joke to me.



Why? It's the way most outfits around here work, except most don't have all the fancy small equipment. It's usually brute force.


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## arborworks1 (Apr 16, 2009)

You know the last comment about not having fancy small equipment, and you guys using brute force is ridiculous. Small equipment is cheap compared to the time and labor savings, not to mention the shear amount of work you can accomplish with less pain later. 
A mini is a years salary for a greenhorn groundie, I see no reason to pull the macho card here, I will be sipping a corona while you guys are humping wood out of a backyard still. 
Even if you aren't able to justify an equipment payment. Get creative and use some complex rigging to save some manpower and speed up the process. It will take longer to setup rigging, but when everything is expedited to a central landing zone by gravity or a little common sense its all good.


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## fishercat (Apr 18, 2009)

*my equipment payment is less than $500 a month.*



arborworks1 said:


> You know the last comment about not having fancy small equipment, and you guys using brute force is ridiculous. Small equipment is cheap compared to the time and labor savings, not to mention the shear amount of work you can accomplish with less pain later.
> A mini is a years salary for a greenhorn groundie, I see no reason to pull the macho card here, I will be sipping a corona while you guys are humping wood out of a backyard still.
> Even if you aren't able to justify an equipment payment. Get creative and use some complex rigging to save some manpower and speed up the process. It will take longer to setup rigging, but when everything is expedited to a central landing zone by gravity or a little common sense its all good.



and i still have a tractor with a grapple.tarps are for Obama supporters to make dwellings out of.


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## Slvrmple72 (Apr 18, 2009)

DirtyDog said:


> LMAO..aaahahahahaaaaa Looking at that picture... What could possibly be going through their minds for adverstisement reasons??? You have a guy which appears to be a consruction worker or 'weekend warrior", throwing sinks, doors, scrap wood..etc into this bag in the driveway. Ummm, Okay, now what?? WTF wcould you possibly do with a bag full of all that stuff? You certainly couldn't pick it up by hand. Are those yellow ropes on the side the handles? maybe a bucket loader could pick it up by them, but then if you have a bucket loader you wouldn't need a dumb bag in the first place.
> The only thing I can see that being pretty handy and useful for....Leaves! However, your still gonna have to dump it. Branches, logs...No way in hell. Looks like a complete hassle



I got one on the way for the wife... dirty laundry basket deluxe for downstairs next to the washer and drier!


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## tree md (Apr 18, 2009)

I got two big guys that will tote anything all day long for $200. Maybe brute force but it works for me and them. Got a problem with that??? I could have them make you disappear as well...


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## Henry111 (Apr 20, 2009)

It's a good thing that you guys who rely on small equipment to do your clean up didn't climb in webbed sadles and 3 strand ropes, and didn't work with the guys who taught me what tree work was. Thank God for todays equipment or you wouldn't be a treeman now!!!:chainsawguy: Now as far as you guys that aren't scared of swet and dirt, hard muscles and a strong back this doesn't apply. With todays tools sissy's can climb trees. Hope that Corona comes with muscles.:hmm3grin2orange: there's not a damn thing wrong with hard work!!!


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## arborworks1 (Apr 20, 2009)

Never said that hard work was bad, I will be willing to bet I work circles around you. It is foolish to punish guys when equipment is cheap and will work as hard as you can take it. My tree crew runs lean with one groundie and myself climbing, We use the bucket truck when we can, and alot of crane work. Us "tree sissies" down south do things a little different its cool.

Change is not bad at all.


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## Rickytree (Apr 20, 2009)

Equipment saves time, energy, and moral. It also increases productivity and profits. You can still work hard with equipment, you just get tons more work done. Used my daughter's four wheeler ( 80 cc Raptor) to drag brush on a couple jobs. There's no way someone could drag brush all day long as far as that 4 wheeler did. The guy could of been in the best shape and he'd be done by the 2nd hour. Guaranteed!! There's hard work then there's stupidity!


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## John464 (Apr 20, 2009)

tree md said:


> I got two big guys that will tote anything all day long for $200.




ok, so you are paying out a grand a week for your brute force. thats 4 grand a month. You could cut your labor cost by half or more. Do you know how many mini skids and regular skid steers you could have with that extra money? You could also be doing jobs 5-10 times faster. Add it up bro. Think BIG.

BTW I am not a fan of mini skids. Get something with some power


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## tree md (Apr 20, 2009)

John464 said:


> ok, so you are paying out a grand a week for your brute force. thats 4 grand a month. You could cut your labor cost by half or more. Do you know how many mini skids and regular skid steers you could have with that extra money? You could also be doing jobs 5-10 times faster. Add it up bro. Think BIG.
> 
> BTW I am not a fan of mini skids. Get something with some power



LOL, that was a joke on my part. I do like to keep my guys working as much as possible but I agree, equipment is the way to go if you can afford it. I used to be able to rent a regular bobcat skid for $500 a week. That is average pay for a ground man and you get 20 times the work out of the skid and don't have to pay for the upkeep when you rent. I don't think you could rent one for anywhere near that these days. Trust me, I'll do anything I can to make it easier for my guys and myself, take a section of fence down to back up to the wood or whatever I can. Don't have a skid steer yet but there is one is in my plans.


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## arborworks1 (Apr 20, 2009)

I don't get the not having a loader of some kind, its kind of like not having a chainsaw if you remove trees.


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## StihlRockin' (Apr 20, 2009)

arborworks1 said:


> I don't get the not having a loader of some kind, its kind of like not having a chainsaw if you remove trees.



You also forgot what my post said originally:



StihlRockin' said:


> _I'm interested to know how you clean up yards on your smaller residential tree jobs?
> 
> *Many yards I'm in don't fair well with front end loaders like a bobcat*, so most all jobs have to be without larger machinery. *Keep this in mind*._



=========================================

*I love the replies to this post. While I learned a bit, I also got a lot of laughs too. It's funny watchin' y'all interject with each other. Some serious, so funnin' and some rockin' the boat to make waves.






I'm also from the old school. All my life I've bucked the hard work dragging brush, lifting logs into a wheelbarrow, then lifting the logs again to manually place into the back of a dump truck. Then I started getting smarter by using backpack power blowers when I could, then utilize power brooms and power pruner saws. Then I got the idea to get a Dr. Powerwagon; a motorized dumping wheelbarrow. Looks like I've done most of what y'all did too. But like some mentioned above, it's time to work smarter, harvest faster profits while at the same time saving the back and keeping moral up, because sometimes humping logs and dragging brush all the time gets boring... especially in 94 degree humid weather!

Now it's high time for me to get equipment, like a skid-steer loader, and do some faster, easier work!

Thank you again for the replies. Lovin' it!*

*Note: Keeping in mind the post, I do like the idea of a smaller loader to prevent lawn damage. I did the skid-steer loader thing years ago, had slicks for tires and KNEW how to turn properly and still had ruts to fill in at times and burn marks in softer areas where I did turn. So lighter smaller is better in many situations in more delicate lawns.*

*StihlRockin'*


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## talloak (Apr 20, 2009)

I would rather pay 2 good TOUGH tree guys then make a MINI payment when theres families trying to support them sevlves. It all comes down to who you are and what you prefer but in my opinion " BRUTE FORCE KICKS ASS". Im 6 foot 8 and 355 lbs. so brute is my way of life


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## tree md (Apr 21, 2009)

Most tree services around here don't have loaders except the larger outfits. Most use some kind of log dolly to move logs from the back yard. When I hear someone say they can't believe nobody has a loader that screams inexperience to me. Sounds like someone with a rich daddy who started out with all the equipment. I've won several bids where people did not want equipment in their yards and knocked the bucket jockeys and the steer que*ers out of the picture... If you can't imagine working without one, then more than likely you never have.


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## BC WetCoast (Apr 21, 2009)

When I made my comment about companies around here not using small equipment, it was an observation, not an opinion. There are some regular sized skid steers, but I haven't seen a mini loader around here. Wish I did, in our yard.


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## Henry111 (Apr 21, 2009)

arborworks1 said:


> Never said that hard work was bad, I will be willing to bet I work circles around you. It is foolish to punish guys when equipment is cheap and will work as hard as you can take it. My tree crew runs lean with one groundie and myself climbing, We use the bucket truck when we can, and alot of crane work. Us "tree sissies" down south do things a little different its cool.
> 
> Change is not bad at all.



I'll take that bet any time your ready pal ive worked hard since ive been 13 and with some of the hardest men, the kind they dont make anymore. SO BRING IT ON BROTHER and by the way i have a CAT that will carry logs and drag your mini at the same time. i also have a bucket truck, chip truck, chipper, stump grinder, dump trailer, 15 chain saws, and every hand tool and gadget known to man, don't pay a red cent of pay role out of my pocket. I can do it all and i do. thats not stupidity thats a hard, stronghearted tree man. AND WHAT MD TREE SAID SISSY WITH A RICH DADDY........


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## arborworks1 (Apr 23, 2009)

Pure stupid comments, I have humped wood in 100 degree weather, dragged brush from sun up to sun down. I had a pickup and a trailer when I started. I choose to equip myself so that I won't be crippled by age 60. 

Call me a rich ##### whatever. Its all paid for and I made the dough right by myself. I'll take my mini loader and my corona and laugh all the way to the bank. I highly doubt someone that has been climbing and running a successful business for 10 years is what you call inexperienced. 

This board is full of of a bunch of windbags IMO.


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## arborworks1 (Apr 23, 2009)

talloak said:


> I would rather pay 2 good TOUGH tree guys then make a MINI payment when theres families trying to support them sevlves. It all comes down to who you are and what you prefer but in my opinion " BRUTE FORCE KICKS ASS". Im 6 foot 8 and 355 lbs. so brute is my way of life



You don't climb many trees do you, Tiny!!


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## Henry111 (Apr 23, 2009)

arborworks1 said:


> Pure stupid comments, I have humped wood in 100 degree weather, dragged brush from sun up to sun down.  I had a pickup and a trailer when I started. I choose to equip myself so that I won't be crippled by age 60.
> 
> Call me a rich ##### whatever. Its all paid for and I made the dough right by myself. I'll take my mini loader and my corona and laugh all the way to the bank. I highly doubt someone that has been climbing and running a successful business for 10 years is what you call inexperienced.
> 
> This board is full of of a bunch of windbags IMO.



LOL you know what i like you instead of argueing you and i should team up and take over, you remind me of myself.


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## prentice110 (Apr 26, 2009)

I could and would quote a lot of you but it would take up 3 pages!!! One way or another we all know what were doing and are going to continue to do it the way we want. One poster said that he likes paying good employees so they can feed there familys and theres nothing wrong with that, but for myself, Ive had such bad luck with employees, weather they be drugged out losers, or the "Im white so Im worth SO much money" syndrome, now I just go out with one guy that knows how to rope, get the thing down and everyone goes home but me. Then I go solo with the mini untill the sun goes down. Like the old man said, and he started with brute force in 1947, "Equipment never asks for a raise.".


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## B-Edwards (Apr 27, 2009)

I'm with "The Dan", Dingo Dingo Dingo. But if I were staying in business I would chant ,Boxer Boxer Boxer.


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## asthesun (Apr 27, 2009)

StihlRockin' said:


> I'm interested to know how you clean up yards on your smaller residential tree jobs?
> 
> Many yards I'm in don't fair well with front end loaders like a bobcat, so most all jobs have to be without larger machinery. Keep this in mind.
> 
> ...



just keep doing what you're doing and charge more when necessary. occasionally if the job is too labor intensive, you can hire some day laborers, ones that you wont ever have to see again, and abuse them a bit. dont be afraid to tell the customer that you need to dig up a few plants and take down a section of fence to complete the job cost-effectively. as long as your operator knows how to be easy on the grass, a pitchfork works well on ruts. i only use plywood when the ground is really wet.

how do those powerbrooms work? are they as thorough as raking? will they move sticks and large pinecones and sweetgum balls and such?


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## StihlRockin' (Apr 27, 2009)

asthesun said:


> how do those powerbrooms work? are they as thorough as raking? will they move sticks and large pinecones and sweetgum balls and such?



Don't know about sweetgum balls, but larger sticks and pine cones are a breeze for the paddle powerbroom I used. 

Like someone mentioned above, if a raker and blower worked together, that's a good way too to move debris quickly. I've done that and should do it more.

*StihlRockin'*


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