# Burning aluminum cans?



## MontanaResident (Nov 20, 2014)

Stove is a little backed up and spent a creosote sweeping log, and to futher my prayer to NOT have to climb the roof, I tossed in some aluminum cans. Not sure the cans do much, but they can't hurt. Fires got to be hot to burn them and maybe the extra hot (lots of kindling) is what does the job.

Anybody an expert on burning Hamms Beer cans and what they constructively do?


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## Joesell (Nov 20, 2014)

My CB dealer told me to throw a dozen cans in every few weeks. He said the aluminum bonds with the creosote and breaks it down somehow. It seems to work pretty good.


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## flotek (Nov 20, 2014)

A sprig of salt, a special sweep log tossing in aluminum cans ,eye of newt ,wing of bat .. All just gimmicks .. The best way to stop creosote is by burning good seasoned wood and giving your burner enough air instead of choking it down


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## Cerran (Nov 20, 2014)

MontanaResident said:


> Stove is a little backed up and spent a creosote sweeping log, and to futher my prayer to NOT have to climb the roof, I tossed in some aluminum cans. Not sure the cans do much, but they can't hurt. Fires got to be hot to burn them and maybe the extra hot (lots of kindling) is what does the job.
> 
> Anybody an expert on burning Hamms Beer cans and what they constructively do?



I have some great magnets for your gas lines in your car that will improve mileage by 20-30%!

Seriously though, best way to avoid creosote is to burn clean by utilizing good seasoned wood and burning hot enough so it doesn't smoke out your chimney when burning.


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## slowp (Nov 20, 2014)

Seasoned wood and an EPA stove opcorn: will keep it clean. What are you burning besides cans? Green Ponderosa Pine? Green spruce?


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## blades (Nov 21, 2014)

don't want to climb roof- learn how clean bottom up, stop burning green wood- or switch to bio bricks. Sorry no tolerance here for creosote factories unless of course you are trying to make enough to treat 4x4's .


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## skindaddy (Nov 21, 2014)

what about build up in an owb? mine is choked down alot cause it hardly runs which builds alot of creasote!


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## MontanaResident (Nov 21, 2014)

Seems to have done the job. We've had some exceptionally cold days, 8+ in a row. The wood I'm burning is well seasoned. I'm hypothesizing that the stove pip cap was not heating up enough which allowed the creosote to build. All last winter I did the aluminum can thing and never had a problem. I will now begin burning the cans again.


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## Whitespider (Nov 21, 2014)

flotek said:


> _*A sprig of salt, a special sweep log tossing in aluminum cans ,eye of newt ,wing of bat .. All just gimmicks .. The best way to stop creosote is by burning good seasoned wood and giving your burner enough air instead of choking it down*_


The OP wasn't asking how to stop creosote, he was asking if burning aluminum cans will avoid the chore of climbing on the roof and cleaning the chimney _after_ creosote has formed. Besides, you can't "stop" the formation of creosote... you can only minimize it. Newt eyes and bat wings won't help, salt is better reserved for helping put out a chimney fire... but it requires more than a sprig.

Actually there is a benefit to burning aluminum cans in a *hot* fire... manganese is released, which, through chemical reaction, causes creosote to (for lack of better terminology this morning) "dry out", flake, release from the chimney walls, and fall to the bottom. Gauging the effectiveness in your chimney is easy... just open the bottom clean-out and see how much loose stuff is there over time, verses how much was there without burning cans. Beverage cans contain something 'round 1% (or a bit more) manganese... not all aluminum alloys do. Burning them won't _eliminate_ the need for brushing, but it will (or may) reduce build-up, extend the time between brushing, and make the job easier. Burning them has another benefit (or advantage)... it reduces the odds of creosote ignition (I ain't gonna' get into why that is), although the *hot* fire required also increases the odds during application.

And for a large portion of the country, aluminum cans are cheaper than store bought (so called) "creosote destroyers"... they're basically free.

Beware, burning aluminum may possibly pose some risk (depending), some of the by-products of heating and/or combustion are classified as a neurotoxin...
*


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## slowp (Nov 21, 2014)

Just wondering, are you a new resident of Montana?


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## firebrick43 (Nov 21, 2014)

Whitespider said:


> The OP wasn't asking how to stop creosote, he was asking if burning aluminum cans will avoid the chore of climbing on the roof and cleaning the chimney _after_ creosote has formed. Besides, you can't "stop" the formation of creosote... you can only minimize it. Newt eyes and bat wings won't help, salt is better reserved for helping put out a chimney fire... but it requires more than a sprig.
> 
> Actually there is a benefit to burning aluminum cans in a *hot* fire... manganese is released, which, through chemical reaction, causes creosote to (for lack of better terminology this morning) "dry out", flake, release from the chimney walls, and fall to the bottom. Gauging the effectiveness in your chimney is easy... just open the bottom clean-out and see how much loose stuff is there over time, verses how much was there without burning cans. Beverage cans contain something 'round 1% (or a bit more) manganese... not all aluminum alloys do. Burning them won't _eliminate_ the need for brushing, but it will (or may) reduce build-up, extend the time between brushing, and make the job easier. Burning them has another benefit (or advantage)... it reduces the odds of creosote ignition (I ain't gonna' get into why that is), although the *hot* fire required also increases the odds during application.
> 
> ...




So let me get this straight you don't find Value in inexpensive moisture meter but do in burning aluminum cans?


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## Whitespider (Nov 21, 2014)

firebrick43 said:


> _*So let me get this straight you don't find Value in inexpensive moisture meter but do in burning aluminum cans?*_


What-the-he!! does one have to do with another??
*


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## 7sleeper (Nov 21, 2014)

Just scrounge cl adds for old dead saw cases. Cut them down and throw them into your stove. The magnesium will make a nice warm fire and keep your chimney clean.....



7


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## MontanaResident (Nov 21, 2014)

slowp said:


> Just wondering, are you a new resident of Montana?


 
This will be my 4th year here.


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## Whitespider (Nov 21, 2014)

7sleeper said:


> _*...old dead saw cases. Cut them down and through them into your stove. The magnesium will... keep your chimney clean.....*_


Ummmmm.....
Magnesium (chemical symbol *Mg*) and manganese (chemical symbol *Mn*) ain't the same thing.
The metal you're referring to is a magnesium alloy that contains little manganese (mostly as an impurity).
Beverage cans are an aluminum alloy, not a magnesium alloy... the manganese in beverage can alloy is added to increase corrosion resistance.
*


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## 7sleeper (Nov 21, 2014)

Whitespider said:


> Ummmmm.....
> *Magnesium (chemical symbol Mg) and manganese (chemical symbol Mn) ain't the same thing.*
> The metal you're referring to is a magnesium alloy that contains little manganese (mostly as an impurity).
> Beverage cans are an aluminum alloy, not a magnesium alloy... the manganese in beverage can alloy is added to increase corrosion resistance.
> *


I know. 

7


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## Sawdust inspector (Nov 21, 2014)

Now I can sit by the fire and throw my beer cans in it and when the wife asks me wtf am I doing I can say I read on the AS site that I can clean the chimney without going on the roof by throwing beer cans in it.


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## Marshy (Nov 21, 2014)

Sawdust inspector said:


> Now I can sit by the fire and throw my beer cans in it and when the wife asks me wtf am I doing I can say I read on the AS site that I can clean the chimney without going on the roof by throwing beer cans in it.


 
You must consume the beverage inside it first. That is important.


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## Whitespider (Nov 21, 2014)

Sawdust inspector said:


> _*Now I can sit by the fire and throw my beer cans in it and when the wife asks...*_





Marshy said:


> _*You must consume the beverage inside it first. That is important.*_


See... even if it don't work, there's still an advantage 
*


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## Sawdust inspector (Nov 21, 2014)

I'll ask her to get me more beer when she goes into the garage to get more wood


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## steved (Nov 22, 2014)

Whitespider said:


> Gauging the effectiveness in your chimney is easy... just open the bottom clean-out and see how much loose stuff is there over time, verses how much was there without burning cans.
> *




You might not find much, most of it just lifts up through the top of the chimney from the draft. I find big flakes all over my cars and driveway...I use the Rutland chimney cleaner. 

When it cools down and then refiring, you can watch them float out the chimney cap.


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## Whitespider (Nov 23, 2014)

steved said:


> _*I find big flakes all over my cars and driveway...*_


OH MY LORD ‼ The sky is falling‼ Particulate emissions‼ Big ones‼ 
*


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## mga (Nov 23, 2014)

i throw pennies in mine just to get rid of them.


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## Toxic2 (Nov 23, 2014)

Never swept my chimney in 10 years of bhrning and its clean as new..i have used the aluminum can trick on years when my wood was less then fully seasoned..i am so far ahead now that the wood going in needs barely any air to burn its so dry..


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## chuckwood (Nov 23, 2014)

Whitespider said:


> Actually there is a benefit to burning aluminum cans in a *hot* fire... manganese is released, which, through chemical reaction, causes creosote to (for lack of better terminology this morning) "dry out", flake, release from the chimney walls, and fall to the bottom.
> *



A better source of manganese is a product made by Rutland specifically for wood burners. It comes in a spray bottle or in bulk gallon jugs. I think most all the woodstove dealers sell it, you can get it online, I got mine at Home Depot. It contains a solution of Manganese Nitrate. You squirt the stuff onto your fire once a day, a dozen squirts or so. If you have a catalytic stove, you must put it in bypass mode for around an hour after spraying, the manganese can poison the cat. The stuff works well for me. Don't spill it, it makes bad stains that won't come out.


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## chuckwood (Nov 23, 2014)

7sleeper said:


> Just scrounge cl adds for old dead saw cases. Cut them down and throw them into your stove. The magnesium will make a nice warm fire and keep your chimney clean.....



Burning magnesium produces quite a show, and once it gets started, it's nearly impossible to put out. It produces a light as bright as a welding arc, it might damage a stove, don't nobody try that at home.......


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## zogger (Nov 24, 2014)

chuckwood said:


> A better source of manganese is a product made by Rutland specifically for wood burners. It comes in a spray bottle or in bulk gallon jugs. I think most all the woodstove dealers sell it, you can get it online, I got mine at Home Depot. It contains a solution of Manganese Nitrate. You squirt the stuff onto your fire once a day, a dozen squirts or so. If you have a catalytic stove, you must put it in bypass mode for around an hour after spraying, the manganese can poison the cat. The stuff works well for me. Don't spill it, it makes bad stains that won't come out.



Supposedly this chemical takes any creosote and makes it flaky and loose. My question is, are the flakes still burnable? Or does it make the creosote sort of inert?


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## MontanaResident (Nov 24, 2014)

zogger said:


> Supposedly this chemical takes any creosote and makes it flaky and loose. My question is, are the flakes still burnable? Or does it make the creosote sort of inert?


 
I've had it fall down the flue, and I suppose it then burns up. I've also had it get carried out the pipe and litter up the roof top with the black flakes.


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## Whitespider (Nov 24, 2014)

zogger said:


> _*...are the flakes still burnable? Or does it make the creosote sort of inert?*_


Inert?? I don't think so... but, honestly I'm not 110% sure (I mean, near anything will burn with enough heat).
I believe the manganese causes it to be less likely (or, harder to) ignite, while at the same time (should) reduce the amount of built-up, which also reduces the tendency to ignite (shrug)
*


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## chuckwood (Nov 24, 2014)

zogger said:


> Supposedly this chemical takes any creosote and makes it flaky and loose. My question is, are the flakes still burnable? Or does it make the creosote sort of inert?



As far as I know, the flakes are burnable. My stove sits out in the open, with the pipe going out the back of the stove, then it elbos up into the chimney. I have the special elbo that is more like a "t", and the flakes collect there. I periodically open the bottom of the "t" and dump out the flakes. I think the manganese somehow affects tar formation in the creosote, making it less gummy and sticky.


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## Joesell (Nov 24, 2014)

chuckwood said:


> I think the manganese somehow affects tar formation in the creosote, making it less gummy and sticky.



Bingo! This is the effect I've noticed when I burn cans. It goes from sticky tar to flakes that fall off. 

I wish I could get far enough ahead to burn only 4 year aged wood. Then I wouldn't need to resort to wives tales and witch craft to clean the owb.


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## steved (Nov 24, 2014)

MontanaResident said:


> I've had it fall down the flue, and I suppose it then burns up. I've also had it get carried out the pipe and litter up the roof top with the black flakes.


Same here...the only true glassy creosote buildup I get is a film at the very top, probably where outside air mixes with the flue gases. The rest just flakes off and floats away.

It was a real issue the first year because the flakes of ash kept plugging the screen on the cap...I enlarged the screen (stainless hardware cloth) from 3/8" square to 3/4" square openings and that seems to have solved my problem.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G730A using Tapatalk


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## Coldfront (Nov 24, 2014)

Screen? I have never used a screen on my chimney cap, seems like you are asking for trouble with a screen.


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## ray benson (Nov 24, 2014)

Coldfront said:


> Screen? I have never used a screen on my chimney cap, seems like you are asking for trouble with a screen.


I removed the screen several years ago and had 2 birds in the in one year. They were trapped at the top of the stove and a pain to remove. Put a stainless cap on with thick mesh, problem solved. A buddy had a squirrel go into his flue.


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## firebrick43 (Nov 24, 2014)

ray benson said:


> I removed the screen several years ago and had 2 birds in the in one year. They were trapped at the top of the stove and a pain to remove. Put a stainless cap on with thick mesh, problem solved. A buddy had a squirrel go into his flue.




Kitty TV. My house cat loves watching trapped birds in the stove


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## maine (Nov 24, 2014)

Whitespider said:


> The OP wasn't asking how to stop creosote, he was asking if burning aluminum cans will avoid the chore of climbing on the roof and cleaning the chimney _after_ creosote has formed. Besides, you can't "stop" the formation of creosote... you can only minimize it. Newt eyes and bat wings won't help, salt is better reserved for helping put out a chimney fire... but it requires more than a sprig.
> 
> Actually there is a benefit to burning aluminum cans in a *hot* fire... manganese is released, which, through chemical reaction, causes creosote to (for lack of better terminology this morning) "dry out", flake, release from the chimney walls, and fall to the bottom. Gauging the effectiveness in your chimney is easy... just open the bottom clean-out and see how much loose stuff is there over time, verses how much was there without burning cans. Beverage cans contain something 'round 1% (or a bit more) manganese... not all aluminum alloys do. Burning them won't _eliminate_ the need for brushing, but it will (or may) reduce build-up, extend the time between brushing, and make the job easier. Burning them has another benefit (or advantage)... it reduces the odds of creosote ignition (I ain't gonna' get into why that is), although the *hot* fire required also increases the odds during application.
> 
> ...




how many cans do i put in
im up to about a 30rack and now it is glowing hot
there is lots of black stuff shooting from chimney like tornado from dorothy wizard of oz
and occasionally a poof of blue flame like dragon
the glowing black snow is drifting over to the neighbors yard as well
i am afraid for his huge piles of leaves
they may catch on fire


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## steved (Nov 24, 2014)

Coldfront said:


> Screen? I have never used a screen on my chimney cap, seems like you are asking for trouble with a screen.


Keeps the critters out, I took it off thinking it wasn't needed and several birds found their demise in my stove in the summer months...

RSF terms the screen a "spark arrester"...required by law in some places.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G730A using Tapatalk


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## wudpirat (Nov 24, 2014)

I use a compound painters use to clean greasy walls before painting.
It's called TSP, main ingreatent in Rutland cleaner.
I got mine from Lowe's paint dept. Be carfull, there's TSP and EPA TSP, you want the former.
It turns the creosote into a crisp crunchy that flakes off and falls into the clean out.

Warning, I have had the creosote flake off in large sheets and clog the flue, killing the draft.
Checking the flue with a mirror, didn't see any daylight, I dropped a short length of chain on a rope and broke up the larger pieces and removed them out the cleanout.
IIRC, I had been burning green wood. This hasn't happened since, as I now try to have seasoned wood available.
That was when I was newb wood burner learning about burning wood. Low air , lots of smoke and green wood.
Now I also monitor the stack temp. Keeps me from overfireing and/or makeing creosote buildup.
YES, I burn pine and my flue is clean. Live and learn and a couple scoops a week keep my flue clean.
TSP is not a cure all, I still clean out about a five gal pail of crunchies each season. They fall into the cleanout and not stuck to the flue.
May have to try the alum can trick, my boys are beer drinkers and never return the empties, got a large pile.


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## Whitespider (Nov 24, 2014)

maine said:


> _*how many cans do i put in
> im up to about a 30rack...
> ...blue flame...
> ...glowing black snow...*_


Man, sounds like you're havin' a blast‼
If I bring over another 30 pack, can I join the fun??
*


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## brenndatomu (Nov 24, 2014)

maine said:


> drifting over to the neighbors yard as well
> i am afraid for his huge piles of leaves


Uh oh. Better read this...http://www.arboristsite.com/community/threads/setting-leaves-on-fire.267031/unread


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## MechanicMatt (Nov 25, 2014)

Just to see if it would work, cleaned out the trap. Threw 10 empty coors lights cans on top of the hot coals. Next day cleaned trap again, amazed how much [email protected] had fallen off into the bottom of the stack. Always considered whitespider above average intel, now im convinced..... maganesse ehh?


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## Whitespider (Nov 25, 2014)

MechanicMatt said:


> _*...maganesse ehh?*_


No... its manganese  not maganesse.
Next time use Budweiser cans... everything is better with Bud 

The history of manganese is interesting if your care to study it... what ores its found in, how it got its name, how it was discovered and isolated, what parts of the world it comes from, and what it has been used for. None that I know of comes from the USA, but South Africa, Australia, and the former lands of the USSR produce a lot (and I believe South America). Its been used for coins, a gasoline additive (that eventually developed into law suits with the EPA), and alloying with different metals a a corrosion inhibitor... just to name a few.
*


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## MontanaResident (Nov 26, 2014)

maine said:


> how many cans do i put in
> im up to about a 30rack and now it is glowing hot
> there is lots of black stuff shooting from chimney like tornado from dorothy wizard of oz
> and occasionally a poof of blue flame like dragon
> ...


 
I'm burning 1 or 2 a day. The stove is getting better each day.


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## MechanicMatt (Nov 26, 2014)

Read a lot on the web about it last night, sadly most went over my head except the part about aluminum cans. Not much in them, wonder where I can get more in concetrated form..........


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## firebrick43 (Nov 26, 2014)

I tried it last night, silver bullet ended up as a gray puddle in the ash??? Since I spread wood ash on my pastures and garden that will not do. Not like I have a creosote problem anyhow. Maybe get a quart from my chimney when I brush in the spring.


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## gary s (Nov 26, 2014)

If you got a puddle of melted aluminum your fire isn't burning hot enough, give it more air once in a while.


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## huntindog1 (Nov 26, 2014)

Roll up 4 or 5 pieces of paper towel into a roll about the size of a corn cob.

This is great for dipping and holds liquid well with little dripping.

Dip your homemade corn cob into full strength bleach. Let it soak up as much as it can. Use more paper towels for a bigger corn cob if needed.

Throw the bleach soaked paper towel corn cob into a hot stove and the liquid will evaporate and steam the flue and break down the creosote.

I have a Masonry Flue.

Some times I mist the chimney from the top with a spray bottle of bleach when the stove isnt being used and the mist falls down the flue.

Dont use bleach if you have a catalytic combustor in your stove.

Not sure if a stainless steel liner can take bleach but creosote is so dang corrosive I would not think stainless would be harmed by bleach if creosote doesnt bother it.


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## Chris-PA (Nov 26, 2014)

skindaddy said:


> what about build up in an owb? mine is choked down alot cause it hardly runs which builds alot of creasote!


Just crank it up and nature's chimney sweep will visit.


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## Motorsen (Nov 26, 2014)

Throw a wheel rim on the fire. Preferably an alloy wheel allthough a steel rim will last a little longer. Maybe with a worn tyre mounted to get things going. Should keep things in mint condition for while!

Motorsen


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## Whitespider (Nov 26, 2014)

firebrick43 said:


> _*I tried it last night, silver bullet ended up as a gray puddle in the ash???*_


Yep... fire not hot enough.
It needs to be hot enough to _burn_ the can, just melting it ain't worth sour owl crap.
*


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## MontanaResident (Nov 26, 2014)

Soft woods here. I put a crease in the can and lay it over a burning log, then another log piece on them both to hold the can in place. It pretty much does the trick.


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## TdiDave (Nov 27, 2014)

wudpirat said:


> I use a compound painters use to clean greasy walls before painting.
> It's called TSP, main ingreatent in Rutland cleaner.
> I got mine from Lowe's paint dept. Be carfull, there's TSP and EPA TSP, you want the former.
> It turns the creosote into a crisp crunchy that flakes off and falls into the clean out.
> ...



Think it would work if you filled a aluminum can with TSP ?


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## MontanaResident (Nov 27, 2014)

TdiDave said:


> Think it would work if you filled a aluminum can with TSP ?


 
I'm going to find out. Ordered a 4.5lb box of TSP, and will add a few ounces to my can burning.


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## wudpirat (Nov 27, 2014)

MontanaResident said:


> I'm going to find out. Ordered a 4.5lb box of TSP, and will add a few ounces to my can burning.


I used to full empty TP tubes with TSP, but a couple scoops works fine.


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## benp (Nov 27, 2014)

I use pulverized/barn lime religiously. I put a scoop in each filling 

It does the same as white spider described. 

Turns everything to flake.


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## dancan (Nov 28, 2014)

Well , since the temps up here have been all over the map but 27 as the occasional low and highs of 40's to 50's the draft has been closed more often than not so since it's around 30 tonight I threw some small splits of pine , opened the draft past the WOT and threw in a 6-pack of empties .....
Sure heard some noises like a lot of flakes falling down the pipe and I got that real hot smell but no flames out of my chimney so all is good 
30 cents of recyclables up in smoke LOL


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## MontanaResident (Nov 28, 2014)

Mines still not flowing the way I like. Much better, but I'm anxious to get the TSP into the fire.


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## Whitespider (Nov 29, 2014)

dancan said:


> _*...threw in a 6-pack of empties...
> ...30 cents of recyclables up in smoke LOL*_


Yep... it's a nickle deposit here also.
A lot of my pistol and revolver targets cost me nickle... LOL
*


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## hotrodusa (Nov 29, 2014)

I'll have to try the can trick, been burning wood for 20 years and never new that aluminum cans were so useful.


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## Chris-PA (Nov 29, 2014)

I like the idea of burning Stihl crankcases. The pro ones burn hotter, but the plastic ones burn longer.


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