# footlocking



## david miller (Jun 12, 2010)

I use to have the hardest trouble ascending this way, it wasn't technique or body strength it was my boot, the rope kept slipping, I bought a pair of wolverine with nonslip sole, now I hardly break out my SRT toy to ascend,


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## treevet (Jun 13, 2010)

david miller said:


> I use to have the hardest trouble ascending this way, it wasn't technique or body strength it was my boot, the rope kept slipping, I bought a pair of wolverine with nonslip sole, now I hardly break out my SRT toy to ascend,



You might want to try out a couple of Pantins sometime. What is your srt toy?


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## IcePick (Jun 13, 2010)

I never footlock, what's the point if you have a CMI or Pantin? It takes two minutes to strap one on and up you go. Footlocking is for show offs.


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## beastmaster (Jun 13, 2010)

IcePick said:


> I never footlock, what's the point if you have a CMI or Pantin? It takes two minutes to strap one on and up you go. Footlocking is for show offs.



Oh I don't think so. I footlock all the time. By the time those other guys dig out their pantin or other gadgets I am already in the tree working. Its like any technique if you do it enough it becomes second nature to you. 
I am always improving my climbing style and equipment, but I don't need an arsenal of stuff to go up a tree.
Thats not to say they don't have a place and time. If I did a lot of really high ascends(60ft)ever day I might be singing a different tune. As it is now if I do have a long high ascend I just switch from single rope, to double static rope ascend. The best thing going isn't those pretty anodized toys, but the big shot. Now thats a cool tool. Beastmaster


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## NCTREE (Jun 13, 2010)

IcePick said:


> I never footlock, what's the point if you have a CMI or Pantin? It takes two minutes to strap one on and up you go. Footlocking is for show offs.



Or for people that don't want to spend the money on all those bells and whistles. So what if it's showing off, not many climbers can footlock good. My customers are quite impressed when they see me footlock a rope 60' into a tree. Plus it gets me more work sometimes, shows this clown doesn't fool around.


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## tree MDS (Jun 13, 2010)

NCTREE said:


> Or for people that don't want to spend the money on all those bells and whistles. So what if it's showing off, not many climbers can footlock good. My customers are quite impressed when they see me footlock a rope 60' into a tree. Plus it gets me more work sometimes, shows this clown doesn't fool around.



Yep! double line footlock, with just a prussik cord is some tough stuff.. I used to be pretty good at it, but when I think about it now, I'm sorta glad I do mostly takedowns.


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## Climb020 (Jun 13, 2010)

I'm finding it more and more each has it's place. Also deals more with the height of trees you tend to climb. I use to know nothing but footlocking. But footlocking multiple 90' climbs per day can get pretty rough no matter how good you are at it. And not too uncommon to get into things 120' and bigger. So I decided to get a rope walking system which I plan to use as often as i feel fit. If only going up 50" or so I'll just footlock it being it takes no time at all. But anything much heigher I will be grabbing mr srt set-up.

Too many ppl go on the argument about which style or type is better. Feel it's best to know multiple ascent methods to be able apply them to each individuall situation. A better climbing will be able to take better action on a tree by tree and job by job basis verse thoughs with a single view point on how to always to do things.


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## david miller (Jun 13, 2010)

trust me I like using foot patin. croll and ascended, with foot strap but sometime it gets time consuming for me,Plus the height of most trees down here it so much faster with footlocking and switching over to DRT, like I said with these boot they grip the rope with hardly no pressure, before with work boots,army boots even with tennis shoe, every time I grasp the rope with my feet the rope would slip


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## treesquirrel (Jun 13, 2010)

I have not done enough footlocking to even hit the radar. Its just not something I have ever tried much. Once the technique is mastered I can see the benefits. maybe I should get on the rope and get some practice. 

But as it stands, when I footlock I look like I'm drunk or retarded.


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## mattfr12 (Jun 15, 2010)

i footlock almost evertime i shoot the throwbag. i dont carry all those fancy gadgets and gizmo's i was always taught thats just more stuff to carry and empty your wallet. all i carry for climbing is a saddle,lanyard, piece of iceline and a pursic cord for footlocking and of cousre my climbing line and beaners. but i guess different strokes for different folks.


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## voxac30dude (Jun 15, 2010)

for me, foot locking is a faster way up but uses more energy. on longer climbs i like to use a yoyo/rads system with a ID ascender/descender in place if a gri gri since i dont like using 7/16 line. samson arbormaster all the way baby!!! anyway as for foot locking being show offy, the only people who complain about footlocking are those who cant do it to well. so you can stick with your old blakes hitch DRT and all the cool people can foot lock.


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## NCTREE (Jun 15, 2010)

if you get good at footlocking it takes less energy than hip thrusting and no more energy then spiking.


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## tree MDS (Jun 15, 2010)

NCTREE said:


> if you get good at footlocking it takes less energy than hip thrusting and no more energy then spiking.



I wouldn't go that far.


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## treevet (Jun 15, 2010)

I have had my Wraptor since Feb and have probably used it a hundred times easy. Nobody will beat me up a tree no matter what system you are using on a long climb. I get excited just thinking about that thing like I do about my Dingo, Cherry pickers, crane, bc2000, stump cutters, Timberwolf stuff etc etc. Wraptor is the future but the future will have to wait for those who can't come up with 2500 clams.

I still play around with footlocking, pantins and Ascentree at times.opcorn:


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## pdqdl (Jun 15, 2010)

treesquirrel said:


> I have not done enough footlocking to even hit the radar. Its just not something I have ever tried much. Once the technique is mastered I can see the benefits. maybe I should get on the rope and get some practice.
> 
> But as it stands, when I footlock I look like I'm drunk or retarded.



:agree2:

I'd like to say otherwise about myself, but it would be a lie.


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## NCTREE (Jun 15, 2010)

tree MDS said:


> I wouldn't go that far.



well maybe not spiking but what D-bag spikes a tree he going to prune anyways...


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## Jumper (Jun 15, 2010)

NCTREE said:


> well maybe not spiking but what D-bag spikes a tree he going to prune anyways...



I worked for one once. Spike em all . He had anger issues........


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## treemandan (Jun 15, 2010)

Not a fan of the footlock myself.


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## tree md (Jun 15, 2010)

X3

I can do it but nowhere near as efficiently as I can get up the rope with my ascenders. I have an old foot injury that makes it hard and painful to footlock. I'll stick with my ascenders and make the easy trip.


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## NCTREE (Jun 15, 2010)

Jumper said:


> I worked for one once. Spike em all . He had anger issues........



i call that laziness and unwilling to learn no techniques


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## jefflovstrom (Jun 15, 2010)

I remember back when a new climber had to footlock 30 or so feet. It sure did weed out the wannabes. But that was awhile ago and we said " what is a Prushik?" :biggrinbounce2:
Jeff


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## jefflovstrom (Jun 15, 2010)

TreeCo said:


> I'm not knocking the Wraptor or your use of it but in the TCC's guys are hitting 50ft in under 15 seconds. That's some three times faster than the Wraptor if I'm not mistaken. Sayingnobody will beat you might be a bit of an exaggeration.



Ouch! That was a knock-out.
Jeff


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## dandandatreeman (Jun 15, 2010)

Just started this technique and I love it. Do it at home after work. I am getting good enough that I did it at work Monday. I work with some REALY OLD SCHOOL tree men. They could not believe how fast I got In the top and started working it. I will say that my arms were fried at 50 ft. But pain is weakness leaving the body. Love it!


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## treemandan (Jun 15, 2010)

jefflovstrom said:


> Ouch! That was a knock-out.
> Jeff



Not really. You have to be in real good shape for that. That means you have to work out, eat right, get good sleep and work hard. Who the #### in their right mind would want to do that?
I just think the acsenders are more versatile. You can go through and around things that would be an outright ##### if footlocking.
I had a footlocker working with me the other day, looked like punishment. I get that at home so I try to avoid it on the job.


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## dandandatreeman (Jun 15, 2010)

That was funny I don't care who you are.


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## The Lawn Shark (Jun 15, 2010)

I can hit 60' in about 22 to 24 seconds footlocking.


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## tree MDS (Jun 16, 2010)

treemandan said:


> Not a fan of the footlock myself.



Like I said, I can do it.. but would rather just go hand over hand these days, maybe stop for a smoke.


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## NCTREE (Jun 16, 2010)

treemandan said:


> Not really. You have to be in real good shape for that. That means you have to work out, eat right, get good sleep and work hard. Who the #### in their right mind would want to do that?
> I just think the acsenders are more versatile. You can go through and around things that would be an outright ##### if footlocking.
> I had a footlocker working with me the other day, looked like punishment. I get that at home so I try to avoid it on the job.



Thats no excuse, I smoked on and off for 15 year, I don't workout and eat crappy fried bar food more than I should. Don't get me wrong I foot lock 90% of the time on ascenders these days actually footlocking on ascenders is what trained me to get good at the technique. It really doesn't take that much energy. If you are doing it right then you are mostly using leg strength rather than arm strength.


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## treevet (Jun 16, 2010)

TreeCo said:


> I'm not knocking the Wraptor or your use of it but in the TCC's guys are hitting 50ft in under 15 seconds. That's some three times faster than the Wraptor if I'm not mistaken. Sayingnobody will beat you might be a bit of an exaggeration.



My guess is a 100 feet would fall to more than the minute the machine takes. Pretty sure I said a long climb. 

If the machine does 100' in a minute .....your math is a little off bud ("3 times faster"). Bit of an exaggeration on your part, no?


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## treevet (Jun 16, 2010)

jefflovstrom said:


> Ouch! That was a knock-out.
> Jeff



How would you know jeffie......you're not a climber haha


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## outofmytree (Jun 16, 2010)

Footlocking = pain
Ascenders = less pain
Wraptor = wallet pain

Hey it's just my opinion.


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## pdqdl (Jun 16, 2010)

treevet said:


> My guess is a 100 feet would fall to more than the minute the machine takes. Pretty sure I said a long climb.
> 
> If the machine does 100' in a minute .....your math is a little off bud ("3 times faster"). Bit of an exaggeration on your part, no?



Not if you count setup time. {You guys really should quit sniping at each other.}

It would be hard to beat a highly skilled footlocking climber on a 50' (or less) climb, except perhaps with spurs. Starting from "rope in tree" and "belt is on", there is almost no time spent putting on hardware, attaching tools, un-rigging, lowering wraptors, etc. If the climber scampers up the rope, that is really hard to beat for efficiency.

What difference does it make? Nobody works all day at super-high speed. If they try it, they will end up posted in that other forum nobody wants to be found in.

I think I'll try some more footlocking practice, seeing you guys think it is so easy...

Just use what is safe, efficient, and works for you.


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## treevet (Jun 16, 2010)

pdqdl said:


> > Not if you count setup time. {You guys really should quit sniping at each other.}
> 
> 
> 
> ...


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## treevet (Jun 16, 2010)

outofmytree said:


> Wraptor = wallet pain



$2500? Can be made in a day and will make tons of $ with the machine.

Probably cheaper than a week vacation sliding around on a snowy hill?


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## tree md (Jun 16, 2010)

Personally, I'd love to have a wraptor. Just not in my budget right now. The ascenders are working fine for me.

That is the thing about footlocking, hip thrusting, hand over hand, whatever you want to do, I've hired a lot of climbers that were great at that stuff but on long climbs they are out of gas by the time they get in the tree. Not to mention they are usually slower than someone who uses some kind of mechanical device.

Not trying to step on any toes, that has just been my experience with the climbers I have hired in the past.


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## brnchbrkr (Jun 16, 2010)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3VVJPZvqLZE&feature=related

Embedding turned off for me.

Having to learn this technique with a thicker rope and no harness this month.

Won't be trying this barefoot again...at least not as shown in the video.

;-)


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## Climb020 (Jun 16, 2010)

Is one thing some of you may be forgetting. You aren't getting paid just to ascend the tree and come down. The 5min it takes to set-up and break down rope-walking/SRT sytem or a wraptor can easily be shaved off. All the extra energy you save you can spend actually doing the work that you are getting paid for. On big trees I much rather have whatever energy I can go towards actually getting around and pruning verse ascending it.
I actually would have gotten a wraptor but it was a toss up between that and a GRCS this spring. But I went with the GRCS being I would get more use out of it and is an extra selling point as a sub to many of companies that don't have one.


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## jefflovstrom (Jun 16, 2010)

Climb020 said:


> Is one thing some of you may be forgetting. You aren't getting paid just to ascend the tree and come down. The 5min it takes to set-up and break down rope-walking/SRT sytem or a wraptor can easily be shaved off. All the extra energy you save you can spend actually doing the work that you are getting paid for. On big trees I much rather have whatever energy I can go towards actually getting around and pruning verse ascending it.
> I actually would have gotten a wraptor but it was a toss up between that and a GRCS this spring. But I went with the GRCS being I would get more use out of it and is an extra selling point as a sub to many of companies that don't have one.



La La La, Where you been? 
Jeff CTSP


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## voxac30dude (Jun 20, 2010)

I just got my Kong Tender Ascender in the mail today!! i cant wait to use it on my foot locking setup.


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## tree md (Jun 20, 2010)

I've got a large Pin Oak to do tomorrow. One good size limb that is making contact with the shingles, a decent size hanger from storm damage and four or five smaller dead limbs near the top. I will likely footlock this one. I love my CMI foot ascender but I find that it can really mar up bark when I am working in the tree. Especially on smooth barked trees like a Pin Oak. This tree is prolly the oldest on the street. I want to make sure I don't scar it up and leave a good impression with the HO and folks in the neighborhood.


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## voxac30dude (Jun 22, 2010)

tree md said:


> I've got a large Pin Oak to do tomorrow. One good size limb that is making contact with the shingles, a decent size hanger from storm damage and four or five smaller dead limbs near the top. I will likely footlock this one. I love my CMI foot ascender but I find that it can really mar up bark when I am working in the tree. Especially on smooth barked trees like a Pin Oak. This tree is prolly the oldest on the street. I want to make sure I don't scar it up and leave a good impression with the HO and folks in the neighborhood.


 old school prussiks maybe? hahaha


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## tree MDS (Jun 22, 2010)

voxac30dude said:


> old school prussiks maybe? hahaha



What are you giggling about?


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## voxac30dude (Jun 22, 2010)

the old way of secured footlocking. you know... the one where you use prussiks that lock up on you and make it a fight to climb up.


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## tree MDS (Jun 22, 2010)

voxac30dude said:


> the old way of secured footlocking. you know... the one where you use prussiks that lock up on you and make it a fight to climb up.



Only time it should tighten up is if you screw up, or have to take a break like a wuss bag.

That being said, I'm not feeling the footlock, and its been a while since I've HAD to do it..


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## tree md (Jun 22, 2010)

voxac30dude said:


> old school prussiks maybe? hahaha



I ended up using my ascenders and my VT. I was just careful not to mar up the bark with the foot ascender. I fractured my heel about 10 years ago and it is painful for me to footlock. The foot ascender doesn't bother me at all though. I got about 75 feet yesterday in about 5 minutes. That was with stopping a few times to do some work. Wish I were doing the same thing today. Today I have to work on an old dead Cottonwood in a desert. 

I have footlocked, hip thrusted, hand over hand and nothing has been easier or quicker for me than the ascenders... Except for a lift...


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## D Mc (Jun 22, 2010)

tree md said:


> I have footlocked, hip thrusted, hand over hand and nothing has been easier or quicker for me than the ascenders... Except for a lift...



I agree. Having used all the above techniques it is easy to see why ascender systems have become so popular.

Dave


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## voxac30dude (Jun 22, 2010)

tree md said:


> I ended up using my ascenders and my VT. I was just careful not to mar up the bark with the foot ascender. I fractured my heel about 10 years ago and it is painful for me to footlock. The foot ascender doesn't bother me at all though. I got about 75 feet yesterday in about 5 minutes. That was with stopping a few times to do some work. Wish I were doing the same thing today. Today I have to work on an old dead Cottonwood in a desert.
> 
> I have footlocked, hip thrusted, hand over hand and nothing has been easier or quicker for me than the ascenders... Except for a lift...



i love footlocking alot. i guess it's all personal preference. i personally feel more comfortable footlocking up a tree where there is no branches for the first 20-30 feet or so. if the tree has branches lower i just use a drt split tail system and can even foot lock on that if i wanted to.


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## jefflovstrom (Jun 22, 2010)

voxac30dude said:


> i love footlocking alot. i guess it's all personal preference. i personally feel more comfortable footlocking up a tree where there is no branches for the first 20-30 feet or so. if the tree has branches lower i just use a drt split tail system and can even foot lock on that if i wanted to.



I bet most would say it is the fastest and most preferred method. Back in the 70's and 80's, if you could not footlock, you were not hired.
Jeff


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## tree md (Jun 22, 2010)

voxac30dude said:


> i love footlocking alot. i guess it's all personal preference. i personally feel more comfortable footlocking up a tree where there is no branches for the first 20-30 feet or so. if the tree has branches lower i just use a drt split tail system and can even foot lock on that if i wanted to.



Hey, if you're young, healthy and in good shape it's the way to go. Any climber that came to work for me and went up 60 or 70 feet footlocking would be very impressive to me.

Sounds like you're doing a good job.


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## voxac30dude (Jun 23, 2010)

tree md said:


> Hey, if you're young, healthy and in good shape it's the way to go. Any climber that came to work for me and went up 60 or 70 feet footlocking would be very impressive to me.
> 
> Sounds like you're doing a good job.



climbing to me is less about speed and efficiency and more about working comfortable. what good does footlocking do if your not comfortable doing it? everyone has a level and comfort zone. if your working in pain and outta your comfort zone bad things will happen. iv'e heard it time and time again from guys who have been doing this job for 30-40 years. they all tell me one thing. safety, brains and work in comfort. speed will come after all that.


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## jefflovstrom (Jul 21, 2010)

perthelizabeth said:


> i guess it's all personal preference. i personally feel more comfortable foot locking up a tree where there is no branches for the first 20-30 feet or so.



Can we get to know you before you make a statement with your link? Elaborate on your foot-locking technique and the type and style ( prussik?). After that, I will click your link.
Jeff 
If you cant footlock 20 feet it be hard to find a climber job. 
Jeff


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## Climb020 (Jul 21, 2010)

Just wondering how many of those that say they find it best or is there preference has actually tried a wide variety of ascent methods? Which brings me to another point of actually happened today and a few other times. Obviously you can't FL with spikes on but you can wear ropewalking systems over them for heavy leans, when canopy and work starts much heigher then normal or in case of storm work where there maybe be a number of leaning on the removal to not make spiking very possible. Granted I know you could just put your spikes on in the tree and having done it before I find it pretty uncomfortable.


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