# Port-a-Wrap, Bollards, Etc.



## RacerX (Feb 21, 2011)

Has anyone tried this Stein device? And how does it compare to the Port-a-Wrap (bottom photo)or some other type of lowering system? It looks interesting since you can attach the top as well as the bottom to the trunk and not have the device swinging around when there is slack in the rigging line. But at $210 it is pricey. Any opinions?


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## Bigus Termitius (Feb 21, 2011)

I like it...if I didn't have two different size homemade port-a-wraps already I might part with 210. I haven't seen one of these yet. Where can I get one?


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## ducaticorse (Feb 21, 2011)

RacerX said:


> Has anyone tried this Stein device? And how does it compare to the Port-a-Wrap (bottom photo)or some other type of lowering system? It looks interesting since you can attach the top as well as the bottom to the trunk and not have the device swinging around when there is slack in the rigging line. But at $210 it is pricey. Any opinions?


 
It's just a different version of the porty. They have a cpl diff sizes that handle up to, and more than the PWIII does. 
Also, with the PW, you can cinch the line through to tighten the lowering line. I wouldn't pay the extra money for the top strap eye, I would however pay it for the added weight working limit if I deemed it necessary.


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## RacerX (Feb 21, 2011)

I'm guessing that they're manufactured in England but they have a US distributor. I was looking at a new Stainless steel Porty from Sherrill when I came across this. After checking out the video I was thinking that it might be worth the extra bucks.

Here's their US distributor:

Stein USA


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## ducaticorse (Feb 21, 2011)

RacerX said:


> I'm guessing that they're manufactured in England but they have a US distributor. I was looking at a new Stainless steel Porty from Sherrill when I came across this. After checking out the video I was thinking that it might be worth the extra bucks.
> 
> Here's their US distributor:
> 
> Stein USA


 
My gear shop has them, the ballard, and the double ballard. If you guys want contact info, lemme know.


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## Bigus Termitius (Feb 21, 2011)

Post up that info, or you can pm it if you want. Thanks.


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## ducaticorse (Feb 21, 2011)

Mayer Power Products
Essex MA
19787689909
Ask for Anthony
Tell him Ryan from Alpha Arbor sent you


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## treemandan (Feb 21, 2011)

Isn't that Regs' stuff?


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## Blakesmaster (Feb 21, 2011)

treemandan said:


> Isn't that Regs' stuff?


 
Yup. I'd just order it straight from his website too.


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## ducaticorse (Feb 21, 2011)

If you're ordering it from over seas, you're gonna pay more than ordering it from a US distributor. I don't know where his distribution center is located, but if it's in England, you're better off ordering it from a stateside distbr.


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## D Mc (Feb 21, 2011)

We use the RC 2000, which also is sold for the price quoted of $210. This is the one you will want if you want to surpass what the Porty is capable of. The picture initially showed is the RC 1000. And though it is better than the large Porty, it is still in the same category with a 2.5" barrel and a 2205 lb working load. 

The RC 2000 doesn't sound that much bigger with a 3" barrel but it is really stout. It has a working load limit of 4410 lbs. That is right up there with the big boys. 

These are cool devices that really do bridge the gap between the Port-a-Wrap and a strap on bollard. I like them a lot. They are stable enough to make taking the rope on and off very easy, yet the fact that they still pivot gives you more options in work positioning. I can't even imagine breaking one of these things. 

If there is a down side to the RC 2000, it is only that along with its capacity for handling far larger wood than a Porty is the fact that is where it shines. Meaning for small, light pieces, you are going to need to go with a lighter weight line to get it to run smoothly. 

This is not saying that it doesn't handle light wood well, you just will not really notice its advantages until you start getting up to the bigger stuff. And for a unit of this size, it is really quite amazing.

Dave


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## mic687 (Feb 22, 2011)

YouTube - 
this is the device in action if the link does not work just search Reg Coates on youtube


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## Bigus Termitius (Feb 22, 2011)

I checked out the main site, that "dual unit" was impressive. I watched a couple of vids on it. Anybody have any experience with it?


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## flushcut (Feb 24, 2011)

After having just watched the youtube video it has got me thinking has anybody tied off the top of a porty as well?


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## emr (Feb 25, 2011)

We have done that. It works but I didnt think it was worth the extra effort.


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## TreeClimber57 (Feb 25, 2011)

Have looked at these.. they have some neat looking devices and not too bad pricing.

But already having a porty, hobbs and grcs.. I never jumped at this.. not sure how much better than porty.. although looks bigger than porty. Does not have lifting ability the hobbs or grcs has though.


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## flushcut (Feb 25, 2011)

TreeClimber57 said:


> But already having a porty, hobbs and grcs..


 
You should buy one just to say you have them all


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## flushcut (Feb 25, 2011)

emr said:


> We have done that. It works but I didnt think it was worth the extra effort.


 
That's kinda what I was thinking. I have never had a problem with the little play there is when not pretensioned even then I strip out as much slack as possible.


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## TreeClimber57 (Feb 25, 2011)

flushcut said:


> You should buy one just to say you have them all


 
Can not think of them right now, but think there are maybe others out there that I have seen over the past while.. could be wrong but not sure if this would be them all!


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## TreeClimber57 (Feb 25, 2011)

flushcut said:


> That's kinda what I was thinking. I have never had a problem with the little play there is when not pretensioned even then I strip out as much slack as possible.


 
Agreed.. never bothered me. Have at times used a fiddle block to help with taking up slack if really want to snug up on it.


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## flushcut (Feb 25, 2011)

UMMM fiddle block !


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## TreeClimber57 (Feb 25, 2011)

flushcut said:


> UMMM fiddle block !



Bailey's - Climb Right Fiddle Block System


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## flushcut (Feb 25, 2011)

TreeClimber57 said:


> Bailey's - Climb Right Fiddle Block System


 
I have one. Thanks I was looking for the drooling smile but maybe that is a different site. As in Homer Simpson "doughnut"!


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## TreeClimber57 (Feb 25, 2011)

flushcut said:


> I have one. Thanks I was looking for the drooling smile but maybe that is a different site. As in Homer Simpson "doughnut"!





h: ps: :big_smile:


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## winchman (Feb 26, 2011)

*stein thread at *********

I recently posted pics of my newly acquired Stein Dual at ********. You can go there and see a removal and a preservation pruning.

Happy to answer any questions you may have about the $1300 device.

I have a ton of experience with the Hobbs and GRCS as well, so fire away.


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## emr (Feb 26, 2011)

I have a simple question...... say you do 50% prunings and 50% removals, which of "the big 3" would you buy?


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## flushcut (Feb 26, 2011)

GRCS I think it has more to offer.


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## TreeClimber57 (Feb 26, 2011)

flushcut said:


> GRCS I think it has more to offer.


 
But only by a hair.. the hobbs is awfully close.. the main advantage of the grcs is the mechanical advantage in lifting, and the ability to use a cordless drill to drive it -- all be it an option. May list self tailing as one as well..


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## flushcut (Feb 26, 2011)

TreeClimber57 said:


> But only by a hair.. the hobbs is awfully close.. the main advantage of the grcs is the mechanical advantage in lifting, and the ability to use a cordless drill to drive it -- all be it an option. May list self tailing as one as well..


 
:agree2: Now if the HOBBS has self-tailing game on!


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## winchman (Feb 27, 2011)

emr said:


> I have a simple question...... say you do 50% prunings and 50% removals, which of "the big 3" would you buy?


 
It's pretty early for me to say, since I've only done two jobs with it, but the Stein has two bollards, thus an advantage over the other two devices. It also can do the things the other two devices do and is significantly less expensive, so today my vote goes with the Dual.

Oh yeah and the WLL is twice the Hobbs, which is pretty good, considering our Hobbs is bent six different ways after 10+ years of use.


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## emr (Feb 27, 2011)

That is not what I was expecting you to say. It will be interesting to see if your opnion changes in the next 6mo to a year. We just got our GRCS last fall and I cant imagine a device being better than that.


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## winchman (Feb 27, 2011)

emr said:


> That is not what I was expecting you to say. It will be interesting to see if your opnion changes in the next 6mo to a year. We just got our GRCS last fall and I cant imagine a device being better than that.


 
To each his own opinion. I like all three devices, and the lifting capability of the Good is unsurpassed and easy to use.

However, I just don't have that many opportunities to lift branches. I like to balance limbs and tip-tie stuff all day, but most of the time, hand-tight is enough. Lifting things out of crotches when they get stuck is one definitely use and can save a lot of time and effort, but this situation can usually be avoided with a tag line.

Like you said, only time will tell.


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## Customcuts (May 23, 2012)

I like the dual line capabilities of the Stein dual it also has an extending arm that is used to pre-tension lines and some lifting.... When I first saw the Stein I wanted it so bad but it wasn't available for purchase in the states, and me being a metal fabricator for 7 yrs I couldn't resist the urge to build my own. So I did and tested it out with some logs I hoisted into a tree with a jeep and block. After I got all the kinks worked out I had it powder coated and it has worked excellent. It is capable of running2 lines too so I'm happy with it. I have used a prussik cord and a biner to tension the lines and done some lifting too...I have rigged out some 30+ft limbs with it with no problems. Still want a grcs tho.:msp_thumbup:

Big Wood chucked installed! - YouTube


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## mattfr12 (May 24, 2012)

flushcut said:


> :agree2: Now if the HOBBS has self-tailing game on!



The hobbs is the shiznit. thats all i mess with anymore. ill strap that sucker to a 10 inch diameter pine or a 60 oak it gets used on them all when rope rigging comes into play. the grcs is sweet and the price is probably right. but every time i look at its price tag i always pass.


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## imagineero (May 24, 2012)

I'm about to purchase a hobbs in the next couple of months. I've been looking and thinking on it a while, and have borrowed and used the hobbs and GRCS. Even if the price was the same, I think I'd be going with the hobbs. The GRCS is a great tool for sure, but I think it's a bit beyond the capabilities of my groundies. 

The self tailing function is overplayed in my opinion. It really only self tails well on 9/16 despite claiming 5/8 with its modified springs on the self tailing mechanism. Once I'm cracking out a device like that I really am more in the 5/8 or even 3/4 rope territory. Self tailing winches aren't all that brilliant generally. Because the rope size varies, and the diameter of the self tailer isn't going to match the diameter of the drum, it ends up fighting itself. That's a minor thing to me though... The big plus of the GRCS is the two speed winch with its awesome lifting power, and the excellent winch handle (why is the hobbs handle so awful?) I think it would be just as good without the self tailer. The big downside to the GRCS (and what keeps me from buying one) is that they seem to be pretty fussy about slack and lowering off. Yacht winches are not designed for rapid controlled release of lines under heavy load. 

Easing a rope off a severely loaded line on a boat is a delicate operation, because if you aren't careful you easily end up with the turns riding over each other, then you are screwed. And that's on a boat with a very stable fairlead. The hub is generally textured for grip on winches. For minor adjustments to sail trim you can ease a little out of the line, but it's a 2 handed procedure.... you hold the tail in one hand while with the left hand you manually rotate the coil stack on the hub. You don't 'slip the line' through your hand as we do on a porty or whatever. When lines are completely eased it's generally done mid turn, after the wind has spilled from the sail and the tension on the line has eased. If the line needs to be dropped in an emergency most good yachtsman will ease the load off the sail by steering into the wind before dumping the line. If you dump the line on a fully loaded sail, it does end up jamming on the winch from time to time, so that is not a common practice. Once it happens a knife sometimes has to come out to save the boat in storm conditions.

Easing tensioned lines rapidly in a controlled fashion is what these devices are about. I think that style of lowering just doesnt suit the yacht style winch. A few guys I've spoken to have had the line ride over itself and seize while lowering. It happens mostly while negative rigging (which they say you shouldn't use the GRCS for anyway) or whenever there is slack then a shock load. A good linesman will quickly take up the slack, then ease off. A good linesman is hard to come by. 

For those reasons, I'm going with the hobbs. I don't need to do so much big time lifting, pre tensioning is quite enough for most of my needs. Even without the winch handle, a few guys can put way more tension with a hobbs or GRCS than you can ever dream of putting on a porty or similar. That makes all the difference with branches over roof's which is what I deal with a lot. What I do at the moment with those sort of branches is keep them down to a manageable load, and have a few guys manually lift and lower - no friction device. With a hobbs, the guys can all pull to tension, then one guy can manage the load while the others run the tag lines. The hobbs device seems much less likely to override the line, its just a bit simpler.

As an aside, if you do ever use fiddle blocks dont run them vertically as in the video. Run the lowering line through a pulley at the base of the tree and redirect it to another tree/vehicle whatever. That way you can walk the fiddle block attachment point out as far as you need, and you can get a few guys pulling on the linhie. Have your porty rigged off the second tree too, so when you've lifted enough, just wrap and then release the fiddle block. Rinse and repeat for infinite lift. Beats the hell out of using a jamison pole to shuffle a prussik 2 feet vertically at a time as shown in the vid.

Shaun


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## flushcut (May 24, 2012)

mattfr12 said:


> The hobbs is the shiznit. thats all i mess with anymore. ill strap that sucker to a 10 inch diameter pine or a 60 oak it gets used on them all when rope rigging comes into play. the grcs is sweet and the price is probably right. but every time i look at its price tag i always pass.



The Hobbs is just bullet proof plain and simple. I have seen Beraneks video of the Hobbs and GRCS drop testing and OMG what a tank. The piece they were dropping was the size of a school bus as well as a Volvo station wagon (really a Volvo Station wagon) and the Hobbs took the hit. 
Just a little tip my buddy made a large socket to fit over the Hobbs and attaches a 3/4" drive ratchet to speed up the take up and lifting.


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## mattfr12 (May 25, 2012)

flushcut said:


> The Hobbs is just bullet proof plain and simple. I have seen Beraneks video of the Hobbs and GRCS drop testing and OMG what a tank. The piece they were dropping was the size of a school bus as well as a Volvo station wagon (really a Volvo Station wagon) and the Hobbs took the hit.
> Just a little tip my buddy made a large socket to fit over the Hobbs and attaches a 3/4" drive ratchet to speed up the take up and lifting.



Ya we have ventured into modifying one. we have a stihl gas powered drill for cable work in trees. and a local welder made a bracket that attaches to it so we can use the gas drill to spin the hobbs. he used a heavy duty 1/2 drive off a mason bit and it works well.


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## mattfr12 (May 25, 2012)

imagineero said:


> I'm about to purchase a hobbs in the next couple of months. I've been looking and thinking on it a while, and have borrowed and used the hobbs and GRCS. Even if the price was the same, I think I'd be going with the hobbs. The GRCS is a great tool for sure, but I think it's a bit beyond the capabilities of my groundies.
> 
> The self tailing function is overplayed in my opinion. It really only self tails well on 9/16 despite claiming 5/8 with its modified springs on the self tailing mechanism. Once I'm cracking out a device like that I really am more in the 5/8 or even 3/4 rope territory. Self tailing winches aren't all that brilliant generally. Because the rope size varies, and the diameter of the self tailer isn't going to match the diameter of the drum, it ends up fighting itself. That's a minor thing to me though... The big plus of the GRCS is the two speed winch with its awesome lifting power, and the excellent winch handle (why is the hobbs handle so awful?) I think it would be just as good without the self tailer. The big downside to the GRCS (and what keeps me from buying one) is that they seem to be pretty fussy about slack and lowering off. Yacht winches are not designed for rapid controlled release of lines under heavy load.
> 
> ...



The hobbs actually lifts pretty well. once you get into the lifting aspect of tree work it become much less violent. the forces applied are not any where near the same. its much more like a well orchestrated symphony than a death metal concert.

most of my rigging is done from adjacent trees. on most medium sized pines i just used the hobbs to crank them up and then pull the bottom out with a skid steer.


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