# Newbie wedge question



## Woodie (Apr 10, 2007)

Okay, so I'd like to get into some falling now. (You bastages are having all the fun!)

I'll be ordering the Dent book from Bailey's, and while I'm at it, in order to keep from paying $8 shipping on a $12 book, I may as well get some wedges.

So my question is, what's a good collection to start with? I'll be working almost 100% on hardwoods, nothing too out-of-hand to start with. Think probably a max of 20-25" dbh in the beginning, maybe smaller. Nothing out of the ordinary, either...no rotted-out side-leaners on 60* slopes in 45 mph winds. (At least not while they are actively burning.) 

Suggestions on sizes/tapers/numbers? And are the metal-capped "hardheads" good options?

Suffice it to say I will be in the company of experienced others at all times when falling, and PPE is a given.

TIA.


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## computeruser (Apr 10, 2007)

I'd get a bunch of cheapie orange 5" and 7" for felling and bucking, and some 10" red-head ones for the bigger felling jobs.


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## John Ellison (Apr 10, 2007)

If I were you I would get a variety of 10 and 12 in. wedges. Everbody has their favorites and you will go thru them pretty quick if you have never used them before. This way you can find out what you like best.
The more expensive ones usually last longer and are harder, so they deform less easily with a misplaced blow of the axe. But dont be afraid to try the cheap ones, if you can hit them square with the axe they are all you need most of the time. And until you get used to using them you will ruin them quickly no matter if they are the cheap ones or the high priced ones.
A single bit axe with a straight rafting handle is the best to drive them with. A sledge will work, but the axe is better if you are doubling them (wedges) up. Make sure it has a good flat surface to drive with.

After you have beat them up pretty good they can be put in a vice and an angle grinder taken to them. 
Dent's book is a must have.

I use a wedge pouch usually and anything smaller than 10" gets swallowed up, same thing with my hip pockets and a chap belt in the way < 10 and they are hard for me to get to. I guess it depends on if you are carying them on you or not.


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## Timberhauler (Apr 10, 2007)

I very seldom ever use wedges...I prefer using a throwline and setting a rope up in the top of the tree and pulling.For anyone falling trees,I would seriously reccomend getting a throwline and a 5/8 bull rope..There are situations where a wedge won't quite do it,but I have yet to encounter a tree where I couldn't pull down with a rope....You would also need to learn a good knot that won't bind up and be hard to untie,Like a running bowline.


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## Austin1 (Apr 10, 2007)

wood_newbie said:


> Okay, so I'd like to get into some falling now. (You bastages are having all the fun!)
> 
> I'll be ordering the Dent book from Bailey's, and while I'm at it, in order to keep from paying $8 shipping on a $12 book, I may as well get some wedges.
> 
> ...


I live in the land of small trees but lot's of them! So I don't use anything bigger than a 8'' I have cut down trees that were smoking but not on fire yet! You might want to stick to the 10'' size never having cut a hard wood I really don't know. My friend that is a really good feller say's I am always in a rush must be my back ground


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## sperho (Apr 10, 2007)

Austin1 said:


> My friend that is a really good feller



I thought only southerners spoke like that... e.g. "There's a lot of fellers around here that aren't so good and as a result, they end up in jail all too often."


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## clearance (Apr 10, 2007)

Timberhauler said:


> I very seldom ever use wedges...I prefer using a throwline and setting a rope up in the top of the tree and pulling.For anyone falling trees,I would seriously reccomend getting a throwline and a 5/8 bull rope..There are situations where a wedge won't quite do it,but I have yet to encounter a tree where I couldn't pull down with a rope....You would also need to learn a good knot that won't bind up and be hard to untie,Like a running bowline.



Wow.


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## Austin1 (Apr 10, 2007)

sperho said:


> I thought only southerners spoke like that... e.g. "There's a lot of fellers around here that aren't so good and as a result, they end up in jail all too often."


Ah yes but I am a bit of a hick also!


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## stihl 440 (Apr 10, 2007)

*10-12*

I have 10-12 wedges now,(not including the ones the saws have hit). I would say 6 is a good number to start with. I have 10 timber savage wedges double and single taper. And I have some of the forester double taper wedges, their good too. I'm going to get some K&H wedges soon. :hmm3grin2orange: :biggrinbounce2:


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## GASoline71 (Apr 10, 2007)

Timberhauler said:


> I very seldom ever use wedges...I prefer using a throwline and setting a rope up in the top of the tree and pulling.For anyone falling trees,I would seriously reccomend getting a throwline and a 5/8 bull rope..There are situations where a wedge won't quite do it,but I have yet to encounter a tree where I couldn't pull down with a rope....You would also need to learn a good knot that won't bind up and be hard to untie,Like a running bowline.




Hmmm... sounds like a PITA to me. I haven't been in a situation yet where wedges can't/won't get the job done. I've had some serious heavy leaners where we hooked a line to, and pulled 'em over with a winch and choker. But those were extreme situations.

A good faller will ALWAYS have wedges. Just plain nuts to not use 'em on bigger stuff. Small stuff like 20" dbh trees I don't have to use wedges all the time. But for the big 'uns... I use a wedge no matter what.

Gary


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## Austin1 (Apr 10, 2007)

GASoline71 said:


> Hmmm... sounds like a PITA to me. I haven't been in a situation yet where wedges can't/won't get the job done. I've had some serious heavy leaners where we hooked a line to, and pulled 'em over with a winch and choker. But those were extreme situations.
> 
> A good faller will ALWAYS have wedges. Just plain nuts to not use 'em on bigger stuff. Small stuff like 20" dbh trees I don't have to use wedges all the time. But for the big 'uns... I use a wedge no matter what.
> 
> Gary


Yes but you live in the land of big tree's! I worked in B.C for a few years and know what it is like. Then I get back home and cut a 20'' tree and tell all my friend what a monster I cut :greenchainsaw: I am so jealous! But at least I get to cut a big poplar this weekend going to take my old sp 105 out:biggrinbounce2:


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## Ray Bennett (Apr 10, 2007)

I agree, wedges seem much easier than using a rope. Not much you can not do with them, Im starting to think I can even make a tree fall up with my wedges.


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## ents (Apr 10, 2007)

I use Stihl wedges and would *not* recommend them. It's probably my fault but they break up too easy. I've busted up 3 so far all in moderate weather (not freezing). However, all is not lost since I save the larger parts and grind a new taper on them. So I start with a 12" wedge and end up with an 8 or 10". It's my experience that all sizes sooner or later come in handy. 

What brand would I recommend?? Since Stihl is the only ones I've tried, and I'm not happy with them, I am following this thread for advice too.

BTW I carry 4 12" double taper wedges and my broken 10/8s in a tool/nail pouch (couldn't see buying a wedge pouch) along with a 3 lb. hand sledge. 

Happy and safe felling. Hope they all land where you wanted them.


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## Gologit (Apr 10, 2007)

Like John Ellison says...get a variety. And get several. It really sucks to use all your wedges and still need just one more. The cheapos are good to learn with. Another tip...hit the wedge and look up, hit the wedge and look up....repeat until something starts to move. Look up often...I can't emphasize that enough. Dead limbs, pine cones, bird nests (don't laugh,some of them are huge) will make you wish you'd stayed home that day. And no need, usually, to really slam the wedge. Start wedging early enough and you won't have to hit it too hard. I've seen wedges break and one I know of first hand added a couple of paragraphs to the faller's dental records. And (since I'm lecturing) don't expect wedges to compensate for poorly executed cuts....at least not every time. You can do a lot with wedges but sneak up on that fancy stuff a little at a time.


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## GASoline71 (Apr 10, 2007)

Good advice Bob... 

Gary


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## Timberhauler (Apr 10, 2007)

GASoline71 said:


> Hmmm... sounds like a PITA to me. I haven't been in a situation yet where wedges can't/won't get the job done. I've had some serious heavy leaners where we hooked a line to, and pulled 'em over with a winch and choker. But those were extreme situations.
> 
> A good faller will ALWAYS have wedges. Just plain nuts to not use 'em on bigger stuff. Small stuff like 20" dbh trees I don't have to use wedges all the time. But for the big 'uns... I use a wedge no matter what.
> 
> Gary





Ray Bennett said:


> I agree, wedges seem much easier than using a rope. Not much you can not do with them, Im starting to think I can even make a tree fall up with my wedges.



opcorn:  ....Just come on down here and I'll show ya' what I'm talking about....I think I would much rather pull on a rope with a tractor or a skid loader than pound on a wedge with a hammer...I do keep them around,but do not use them to fall big trees.


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## BlueRidgeMark (Apr 10, 2007)

wood_newbie said:


> I'll be working almost 100% on hardwoods, nothing too out-of-hand to start with. Think probably a max of 20-25" dbh in the beginning, maybe smaller. Nothing out of the ordinary, either...no rotted-out side-leaners on 60* slopes in 45 mph winds. (At least not while they are actively burning.)




:hmm3grin2orange: 



Harry Calahan said:


> _*"A man's got to know his limitations."*_


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## GASoline71 (Apr 10, 2007)

Timberhauler said:


> opcorn:  ....Just come on down here and I'll show ya' what I'm talking about....I think I would much rather pull on a rope with a tractor or a skid loader than pound on a wedge with a hammer...I do keep them around,but do not use them to fall big trees.



Can't get no tractors or skidders where I have been doin' most of my cuttin' recently... that's mainly why I said it can be a PITA... 

More wedges...   

Gary


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## clearance (Apr 10, 2007)

Timberhauler said:


> opcorn:  ....Just come on down here and I'll show ya' what I'm talking about....I think I would much rather pull on a rope with a tractor or a skid loader than pound on a wedge with a hammer...I do keep them around,but do not use them to fall big trees.



What if you ain't got the machine? Whatcha gonna do then Willis?


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## Timberhauler (Apr 10, 2007)

clearance said:


> What if you ain't got the machine? Whatcha gonna do then Willis?



If I aint got no machine,then I'd just quit.


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## sperho (Apr 10, 2007)

Tastes great! :monkey:


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## sawinredneck (Apr 10, 2007)

I ordered a half dozen of 5", been near perfect for everything I have cut. Get the cheap ones first, don't worry about what you will do with hammer, you will cut them up with the saw first:hmm3grin2orange: But like the others said, ge plenty of them, once you start using them for bucking, you're life will never be the same again, and you will never have too many wedges!!!


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## PA Plumber (Apr 10, 2007)

*On Sale*

Your in luck, Woodie. Bailys has wedges on sale and I'm looking to get some more. I have the 5.5 inchers and use them for bucking/blocking and they're pretty handy. I bought 6 of the 8" rifled wedges and they certainly are nice to stack. I have been beating up on them pretty hard and it has been recommended to me to try Bailys Green ones in 10". I am considering an order in the next few days. 

Buy at least 1/2 dozen if you are serious about falling some trees.


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## clearance (Apr 10, 2007)

There is a difference between bucking and falling wedges, know it. I have three of each in my belt, along with my tape. I just carry my axe (I am not in the bush), it is a 41/2lb. Arvika.


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## sawinredneck (Apr 10, 2007)

clearance said:


> There is a difference between bucking and falling wedges, know it. I have three of each in my belt, along with my tape. I just carry my axe (I am not in the bush), it is a 41/2lb. Arvika.



I am sure there is a difference clearance, but did anyone bother to tell you I am a redneck?:hmm3grin2orange:


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## Woodie (Apr 10, 2007)

boboak said:


> Like John Ellison says...get a variety. And get several. It really sucks to use all your wedges and still need just one more. The cheapos are good to learn with. Another tip...hit the wedge and look up, hit the wedge and look up....repeat until something starts to move. Look up often...I can't emphasize that enough. Dead limbs, pine cones, bird nests (don't laugh,some of them are huge) will make you wish you'd stayed home that day. And no need, usually, to really slam the wedge. Start wedging early enough and you won't have to hit it too hard. I've seen wedges break and one I know of first hand added a couple of paragraphs to the faller's dental records. And (since I'm lecturing) don't expect wedges to compensate for poorly executed cuts....at least not every time. You can do a lot with wedges but sneak up on that fancy stuff a little at a time.



Good stuff...keep it coming! (That goes for the rest of you, too...good info...more please!!)


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## John Ellison (Apr 10, 2007)

Two twelve inchers and some black tape make a passable splint on a broken forearm.... if you forget about looking up.


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## Gologit (Apr 10, 2007)

John Ellison said:


> Two twelve inchers and some black tape make a passable splint on a broken forearm.... if you forget about looking up.



Yup. And if you need a tourniquet a wedge makes a good winder.


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## Dubai Vol (Apr 10, 2007)

I second the recommendation of the Bailey's green 10" wedges. Wish I'd ordered more, but what do I know, I'm so green the Bailey's wedges blend right in with me. I got a variety, and still have a lot to learn about using them. For a raw newbie like me, this forum is pure gold


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## 2000ssm6 (Apr 10, 2007)

wood_newbie said:


> Okay, so I'd like to get into some falling now. (You bastages are having all the fun!)



Are those a part of the cabbage family:jester:


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## Husky137 (Apr 10, 2007)

Timberhauler said:


> opcorn:  ....Just come on down here and I'll show ya' what I'm talking about....I think I would much rather pull on a rope with a tractor or a skid loader than pound on a wedge with a hammer...I do keep them around,but do not use them to fall big trees.



Try learning how to use wedges properly. I would have a tree limbed and bucked by the time you had your bull rope set. Wedges are so much easier when applied with some know-how.

Hey Clearance, Double WOW! 


I like a mix of the small 5 1/2" & 8" double tapers and some 10" hardheads.


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## West Texas (Apr 10, 2007)

I would recommend the cheap plastic wedges for a beginner, its amazing how many of those my chain chewed up until I get the hang of using wedges and a running saw at the same time.  The plastic wedges are cheaper than a good chain any day. Once you've used a few and chewed a few, you will know what's best for you and your situation. Good luck.


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## joesawer (Apr 11, 2007)

Get the Fundamentals of general tree work by G F Brenarek from Baileys also.
It has much more practical application and lots of good pics. 
If you are working in the woods get a straight handled ax with a flat back surface, carry it in your belt. It is a must for breaking out face cuts, driving and trimming wedges. 
When your wedges mushroom out you can set them in the kerf and trim them with some careful swings of the axe. 
Get some different taper wedges. A thin taper will drive easier and get a tree started moving but might not move it ahead enough so then you can set a faster taper and tip it over. When stacking wedges the thin ones are much easier and safer, never stack any wedges more than two high. The middle wedge has no grip on the wood and will spit out very easy. If a 2" to 3" inch lift in the back cut wont tip it over it is well beyond the limits of wedges any way. Beware of the wedges spitting out, set the wedge with gentle blows. If you really have to hit the wedge hard, set another wedge. Two wedges have roughly twice the lift, three triple etc. 
The cuts you make when wedging are the most critical part of being sucsessful. You must have a good hinge but to much and the tree won't move ahead. Making you back cut high (Stumpshot) will make it a little harder to wedge the tree. Make it lower than the face, even by a little, makes wedging extremly difficult. Wedging is about finess not brut force. 
Be careful, have fun and live to do it again tomorrow.


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## Cheese (Apr 11, 2007)

Those rifled wedges are a pain to get in when I have misjudged or the wind picks up. The rifle groove and slightly higher profile has made things exciting when thye didn't go in right away.

I always carry pairs of wedges of the same size, usually 4 in my pockets, a couple more hanging at the truck.

Newbie or otherwise, use plastic then if you have to put some teeth to them the chain is fine.


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## SawTroll (Apr 11, 2007)

boboak said:


> Like John Ellison says...get a variety. And get several. It really sucks to use all your wedges and still need just one more. The cheapos are good to learn with. Another tip...hit the wedge and look up, hit the wedge and look up....repeat until something starts to move. Look up often...I can't emphasize that enough. Dead limbs, pine cones, bird nests (don't laugh,some of them are huge) will make you wish you'd stayed home that day. And no need, usually, to really slam the wedge. Start wedging early enough and you won't have to hit it too hard. I've seen wedges break and one I know of first hand added a couple of paragraphs to the faller's dental records. And (since I'm lecturing) don't expect wedges to compensate for poorly executed cuts....at least not every time. You can do a lot with wedges but sneak up on that fancy stuff a little at a time.



As others said, very good advice!

Personally, I mostly use 5" wedges, and I see no reason to have longer wedges than 8", for 20" trees.

I like to have at least tree 5" ones, and a couple of 8" ones with me, when felling + you need some spare ones to complete the set as needed, between the trips.


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## Timberhauler (Apr 11, 2007)

Husky137 said:


> Try learning how to use wedges properly. I would have a tree limbed and bucked by the time you had your bull rope set. Wedges are so much easier when applied with some know-how.
> 
> Hey Clearance, Double WOW!
> 
> ...



I like my method better.


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## Ed*L (Apr 11, 2007)

joesawer said:


> Get the Fundamentals of general tree work by G F Brenarek from Baileys also.
> It has much more practical application and lots of good pics.
> If you are working in the woods get a straight handled ax with a flat back surface, carry it in your belt. It is a must for breaking out face cuts, driving and trimming wedges.
> When your wedges mushroom out you can set them in the kerf and trim them with some careful swings of the axe.
> ...



Very well said.  

Ed


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## Husky137 (Apr 11, 2007)

Timberhauler said:


> I like my method better.



Bull ropes have a time and place. I use one from time to time , but always back it up with wedges. What do you do when your pull line breaks?


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## Gypo Logger (Apr 11, 2007)

It's been my finding that using wedges can create problems as well as get you out of them.
It's sorta like a parking brake on a vehicle, either use it all the time or never at all. Wedges, especialy on large hardwoods will only commit a tree so far.
Just like falling, wedges require technique and a knowledge of the mechanical advantage they have.
Surely on the big trees of the west, wedges are just as important as a bar wrench.
John


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## SawTroll (Apr 11, 2007)

Timberhauler said:


> I like my method better.



For domestic trees, I understand that, but in the woods that will slow the work down quite a bit, I believe.....


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## SawTroll (Apr 11, 2007)

Gypo Logger said:


> It's been my finding that using wedges can create problems as well as get you out of them.
> It's sorta like a parking brake on a vehicle, either use it all the time or never at all. Wedges, especialy on large hardwoods will only commit a tree so far.
> Just like falling, wedges require technique and a knowledge of the mechanical advantage they have.
> Surely on the big trees of the west, wedges are just as important as a bar wrench.
> John



Maybe they would have helped you avoid crushing your saws all the time............:yoyo: :yoyo: :taped: :help:


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## 59Billy (Apr 11, 2007)

sawinredneck said:


> I am sure there is a difference clearance, but did anyone bother to tell you I am a redneck?:hmm3grin2orange:



Real rednecks cut wedges outta 2x4s or whatever other junk is lying around.

:hmm3grin2orange:


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## Woodie (Apr 11, 2007)

joesawer said:


> Get the Fundamentals of general tree work by G F Brenarek from Baileys also.
> It has much more practical application and lots of good pics.



Looked at that one when I ordered yesterday, wasn't sure about it...thought it might be more geared toward arborist work. 

Thanks for the tip...I just called Baileys and added that one to the order.


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## GASoline71 (Apr 11, 2007)

Gypo Logger said:


> It's been my finding that using wedges can create problems as well as get you out of them.
> It's sorta like a parking brake on a vehicle, either use it all the time or never at all. Wedges, especialy on large hardwoods will only commit a tree so far.
> Just like falling, wedges require technique and a knowledge of the mechanical advantage they have.
> Surely on the big trees of the west, wedges are just as important as a bar wrench.
> John



Good post John... not having wedges out here is like not having files for your chain. 

Gary


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## computeruser (Apr 11, 2007)

wood_newbie said:


> Looked at that one when I ordered yesterday, wasn't sure about it...thought it might be more geared toward arborist work.
> 
> Thanks for the tip...I just called Baileys and added that one to the order.



Smart move. It's a great book and together with Mr. Dent's book you'll be on the road to learnin' a lot.


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## Gypo Logger (Apr 11, 2007)

SawTroll said:


> Maybe they would have helped you avoid crushing your saws all the time............:yoyo: :yoyo: :taped: :help:


 Maybe if you were a logger and not an army offiser, you might smash a chainsaw too. :notrolls2: 

Anyway, I have been known to use wedges and smash saws.


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## SawTroll (Apr 11, 2007)

Gypo Logger said:


> Maybe if you were a logger and not an army offiser, you might smash a chainsaw too. :notrolls2:
> 
> Anyway, I have been known to use wedges and smash saws.



Lol - good answer! :hmm3grin2orange: :hmm3grin2orange:


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## KMB (Apr 11, 2007)

sawinredneck said:


> once you start using them for bucking, you're life will never be the same again



Yep, heartily agree!  

Kevin


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## oldsaw (Apr 11, 2007)

stihl 440 said:


> I have 10-12 wedges now,(not including the ones the saws have hit). I would say 6 is a good number to start with. I have 10 timber savage wedges double and single taper. And I have some of the forester double taper wedges, their good too. I'm going to get some K&H wedges soon. :hmm3grin2orange: :biggrinbounce2:



Just buy 10 so you have 6 left when you cut up 4. Easy.

Mark


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## Burvol (Apr 11, 2007)

OK, how bout' tree jacks?


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## stihl 440 (Apr 11, 2007)

*funny!*



Gypo Logger said:


> Maybe if you were a logger and not an army offiser, you might smash a chainsaw too. :notrolls2:
> 
> Anyway, I have been known to use wedges and smash saws.



LOL, now that's funny! And nice pic!  :rockn:


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## Gologit (Apr 11, 2007)

Burvol said:


> OK, how bout' tree jacks?



Tree jacks? Better really know what you're doing before you tackle a tree that's bad enough to need jacking. That being said, they do save a lot of trees from getting busted up.


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## GASoline71 (Apr 11, 2007)

boboak said:


> Tree jacks? Better really know what you're doing before you tackle a tree that's bad enough to need jacking. That being said, they do save a lot of trees from getting busted up.



Yup... normally reserved for *BIG* timber. Plus they cost from 2,000 to 3,000 bucks.:jawdrop: If you need a tree jack... you are in some big sh1t!

Gary


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## Burvol (Apr 11, 2007)

I knew I could get a response. Ya, I've seen my dad jack some crazy suff, but we tend to use them for big wood where beating wedges is almost useless.


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## GASoline71 (Apr 11, 2007)

Burvol said:


> I knew I could get a response.



WTF is that supposed to mean???:help: 

Gary


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## Timberhauler (Apr 11, 2007)

I'm gonna have me one of them tree jacks...I've been wanting one since I got my first Bailey's catalog over 10 years ago...Will have one soon


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## Gologit (Apr 11, 2007)

Timberhauler said:


> I'm gonna have me one of them tree jacks...I've been wanting one since I got my first Bailey's catalog over 10 years ago...Will have one soon



:hmm3grin2orange: :hmm3grin2orange: You don't need a jack. Just tie a piece of clothes-line to the tree and pull it over with your riding lawnmower. And you had to know that was coming.


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## GASoline71 (Apr 11, 2007)

boboak said:


> :hmm3grin2orange: :hmm3grin2orange: You don't need a jack. Just tie a piece of clothes-line to the tree and pull it over with your riding lawnmower. And you had to know that was coming.



HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!! 

Dang it Bob!!! I just spit beer all over my monitor!     

Gary


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## joesawer (Apr 11, 2007)

I'm gonna have me one of them tree jacks...I've been wanting one since I got my first Bailey's catalog over 10 years ago...Will have one soon 
Today 03:54 PM 
You better learn to wedge first. 
Wedges and jacks work hand in hand. You can wedge without a jack, but jacking without wedges is crazy.


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## Ray Bennett (Apr 12, 2007)

boboak said:


> :hmm3grin2orange: :hmm3grin2orange: You don't need a jack. Just tie a piece of clothes-line to the tree and pull it over with your riding lawnmower. And you had to know that was coming.



Now that is funny, I dont care who ya are.  


The only bad thing about using wedges is that I rely on them too much and some times feel like Im loosing my skills at knowing which way a tree will naturally fall. About a month ago I was taking down a real twisted and bent sugar maple (too small to use wedges on) and got my saw stuck. I felt like a real rookie. I almost had to call Boboak to see if he could bring his lawn mower and clothes line over and get er out.


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## Timberhauler (Apr 12, 2007)

joesawer said:


> I'm gonna have me one of them tree jacks...I've been wanting one since I got my first Bailey's catalog over 10 years ago...Will have one soon
> Today 03:54 PM
> You better learn to wedge first.
> Wedges and jacks work hand in hand. You can wedge without a jack, but jacking without wedges is crazy.



 ...Hmmmm...25 years,over half a million dollars worth of tree removal and logging equipment sitting outside my house,three months worth of back-logged work on my schedule...Not one miss in I don't know,at least the last several thousand trees I've brought down...Not 1 employee hurt on the job including myself(except for being nicked with a saw once or twice)...And to think I've been doing it the wrong way all this time ..I guess I'll have to call all of the loggers that I come in and make precision drops for from time to time not to call again now that I don't know what I'm doing...I guess I should just give all the jobs I've bid on away and give myself time to learn how to do it the right way..Dammm...How am I gonna pay the bills now...Anyone care to come over and show me how to use all of this equipment I've got sitting out here?I was pretty sure I bought that stuff for a reason,but now I don't know...I guess I could buy me a really cool bass boat and pay my house off when it sells..


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## GASoline71 (Apr 12, 2007)

Send me a plane ticket...:biggrinbounce2: 

Gary


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## 04ultra (Apr 12, 2007)

Still waiting for pictures of all of it....



.


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## joesawer (Apr 12, 2007)

I didn't make any reference to what you have or what you have done. But you discredit the use of wedges then say you are going to buy a jack. A jack is an awsome tool. but it uses the same physics as wedges. It is the next step after wedges. you frequently need to use wedges when jacking. your safety record will not be the same the first time you blow your jack out becouse you didn't have wedges. There are any number of things to go wrong when jacking trees over. You really should not skip learning to wedge before using a jack.


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## Timberhauler (Apr 12, 2007)

GASoline71 said:


> Send me a plane ticket...:biggrinbounce2:
> 
> Gary


 Yours is comin'....Then you'll be in a big hurry to get back home.:hmm3grin2orange: 


joesawer said:


> I didn't make any reference to what you have or what you have done. But you discredit the use of wedges then say you are going to buy a jack. A jack is an awsome tool. but it uses the same physics as wedges. It is the next step after wedges. you frequently need to use wedges when jacking. your safety record will not be the same the first time you blow your jack out becouse you didn't have wedges. There are any number of things to go wrong when jacking trees over. You really should not skip learning to wedge before using a jack.



I never discredited the use of wedges,I simply stated what I prefer using over a wedge....If I haven't learned the physics of it all by now,I don't guess I ever will


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## Husky137 (Apr 12, 2007)

Timberhauler said:


> ...Hmmmm...25 years,over half a million dollars worth of tree removal and logging equipment sitting outside my house,three months worth of back-logged work on my schedule...Not one miss in I don't know,at least the last several thousand trees I've brought down...Not 1 employee hurt on the job including myself(except for being nicked with a saw once or twice)...And to think I've been doing it the wrong way all this time ..I guess I'll have to call all of the loggers that I come in and make precision drops for from time to time not to call again now that I don't know what I'm doing...I guess I should just give all the jobs I've bid on away and give myself time to learn how to do it the right way..Dammm...How am I gonna pay the bills now...Anyone care to come over and show me how to use all of this equipment I've got sitting out here?I was pretty sure I bought that stuff for a reason,but now I don't know...I guess I could buy me a really cool bass boat and pay my house off when it sells..



Ahhhh, the good old, doing it half-a$$ed for 25 years and spent lots of money on iron so it must be the right way explanation.

A big difference between the "right way" and the right way for the right situation. There is no one right way all the time.


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## GASoline71 (Apr 12, 2007)

Husky137 said:


> A big difference between the "right way" and the right way for the right situation. There is no one right way all the time.



Hey, I'm right all the time... at least that's what I tell myself anyways.opcorn: :hmm3grin2orange: :hmm3grin2orange: 

Gary


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## SawTroll (Apr 12, 2007)

GASoline71 said:


> Hey, I'm right all the time... at least that's what I tell myself anyways.opcorn: :hmm3grin2orange: :hmm3grin2orange:
> 
> Gary



Try another approach, no-one is right all the time, not even Andy.......:deadhorse: :deadhorse:


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## GASoline71 (Apr 12, 2007)

SawTroll said:


> Try another approach, no-one is right all the time, not even Andy.......:deadhorse: :deadhorse:



Yes I am... Just ask me! I'll tell ya!    

Gary


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## PA Plumber (Apr 12, 2007)

Ummm... I guess no one's asking.:hmm3grin2orange:


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## GASoline71 (Apr 12, 2007)

Dang...:blush: :smoking: 

Gary


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## Timberhauler (Apr 12, 2007)

GASoline71 said:


> Yes I am... Just ask me! I'll tell ya!
> 
> Gary



Only once in my life have been wrong about something.....I thought I was wrong about it,but it turned out I was actually right.:hmm3grin2orange:


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## 04ultra (Apr 12, 2007)

GASoline71 said:


> Yes I am... Just ask me! I'll tell ya!
> 
> Gary





Hey Gary are you right all the time ????





.


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## GASoline71 (Apr 12, 2007)

04ultra said:


> Hey Gary are you right all the time ????
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Hey Steve.... yep! 

Gary


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## 04ultra (Apr 12, 2007)

GASoline71 said:


> Hey Steve.... yep!
> 
> Gary





  *Gary*   





You Da Mang!!!!


.


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## GASoline71 (Apr 12, 2007)

04ultra said:


> You Da Mang!!!!



I know.... LOL      

Gary


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## sawinredneck (Apr 12, 2007)

I don't think I have had enough to dink to participate in this thread anymore:hmm3grin2orange:


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## GASoline71 (Apr 12, 2007)

Gettin' pretty deep in here huh??? 

Gary


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## Timberhauler (Apr 12, 2007)

Well...I know I'm not the best...But when the best of the best all get together and need to know something...They call me


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## sawinredneck (Apr 12, 2007)

GASoline71 said:


> Gettin' pretty deep in here huh???
> 
> Gary





Timberhauler said:


> Well...I know I'm not the best...But when the best of the best all get together and need to know something...They call me



UMMMMMMMMMMM................... You tell me?


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## Gologit (Apr 12, 2007)

Timberhauler said:


> Well...I know I'm not the best...But when the best of the best all get together and need to know something...They call me



:hmm3grin2orange: And what do you tell them? "Wedges??!! We don't need no stinking wedges!!! Just tie all your bootlaces together and have the heaviest guy on the crew (and the fastest runner) pull that side-leaning SOB right on over. Be sure to get the bootlaces back when you're done...otherwise your corks'll come off and stay stuck in the tree"


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## GASoline71 (Apr 12, 2007)

Another beaut' of a pearl of wisdom from Bob...:hmm3grin2orange: :biggrinbounce2: :hmm3grin2orange: :biggrinbounce2: 

Gary


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## 04ultra (Apr 12, 2007)

Timberhauler said:


> Well...I know I'm not the best...But when the best of the best all get together and need to know something...They call me




And we sure know what they call you..................:hmm3grin2orange: :hmm3grin2orange: 



.


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## sperho (Apr 13, 2007)

Less filling! :monkey:


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## ChuckinOhio (Apr 13, 2007)

SawTroll said:


> Try another approach, no-one is right all the time, not even Andy.......:deadhorse: :deadhorse:




AND TROLL HAS GOT THE SPECS TO PROVE IT!:taped: 


Chuck


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## Timberhauler (Apr 13, 2007)

04ultra said:


> And we sure know what they call you..................:hmm3grin2orange: :hmm3grin2orange:
> 
> 
> 
> .


 And I really don't give a rats ass what you think.


boboak said:


> :hmm3grin2orange: And what do you tell them? "Wedges??!! We don't need no stinking wedges!!! Just tie all your bootlaces together and have the heaviest guy on the crew (and the fastest runner) pull that side-leaning SOB right on over. Be sure to get the bootlaces back when you're done...otherwise your corks'll come off and stay stuck in the tree"



OK,it was funny the first time,but I've now had enough...I suggested using a BULL ROPE placed in the very top of the tree..Placed there by either a throwline or a climber..Then pulled with either a dump truck,new holland,or the CAT257 rubber track skid steer loader...How do you plan on getting more leverage than that from the BOTTOM OF THE TREE????......In cases where I cannot get a machine to pull with..I have tied off the top of the tree and used a wegde at the same time..I do this every single day and it has yet to fail..I know wedges have their place...I don't recall anything about using a boot lace or shoe string,or whatever the hell else,then pulling with a riding lawnmower,OR ANYTHING ELSE OTHER THAN A TRUCK OR SKID LOADER.As a business owner it is up to me to do things as safely as possible..


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## Timberhauler (Apr 13, 2007)

Husky137 said:


> Bull ropes have a time and place. I use one from time to time , but always back it up with wedges. What do you do when your pull line breaks?



The Samson stable braid rope has a 20,400 pound breaking strength...It ain't gonna break,and if it is a really big tree that need a hard pull,then I will set two bull ropes in it.


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## clearance (Apr 13, 2007)

Timberhauler said:


> The Samson stable braid rope has a 20,400 pound breaking strength...It ain't gonna break,and if it is a really big tree that need a hard pull,then I will set two bull ropes in it.



You have been put in your place, by pros and amatuers alike, give up.:deadhorse:


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## Tzed250 (Apr 13, 2007)

I have used a rope plenty of times. It gives you a warm fuzzy feeling in your belly to know that if the holding wood in the tree you are working on gives it up that the $375,000 dollar house that is 30 feet away won't become an insurance adjusters next project. A rope in the woods, prolly a waste of time. As a safety device next to valuable property, it has a place.


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## SawTroll (Apr 13, 2007)

Tzed250 said:


> ..... A rope in the woods, prolly a waste of time. As a safety device next to valuable property, it has a place.



100% true, imo.....


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## Husky137 (Apr 13, 2007)

Timberhauler said:


> The Samson stable braid rope has a 20,400 pound breaking strength...It ain't gonna break,and if it is a really big tree that need a hard pull,then I will set two bull ropes in it.



Every line breaks, sometime,eventually.


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## joatmon (Apr 13, 2007)

Tzed250 said:


> I have used a rope plenty of times. It gives you a warm fuzzy feeling in your belly to know that if the holding wood in the tree you are working on gives it up that the $375,000 dollar house that is 30 feet away won't become an insurance adjusters next project. A rope in the woods, prolly a waste of time. As a safety device next to valuable property, it has a place.



OK. First the disclaimer. I don't know jack about fellin' trees. I've done a few, and watched pros take down a few, but I'm a rank ametuer.

Now, it's very possible I'll ask TH to take down a tree for me someday. I like him, seem's honest, appears to be a family man, and he's provided lots of feedback from his experience.

TH has a method that works. Provided he's shooting straight, he's gotta lotta tress under his boots. Everyone has a slightly different method, and that's OK.

But, to suggest wedges are all that's needed in most cases while a rope is necessary for only a few, well consider this. I like the fact that he uses the same technique all the time. No thinkin' or debatin', just here's how we do it, let's get it done. Kinda like wearin' a seat belt. Well, I don't need it to just run a block to the store, but I needd it for the vacation trip. No, he does it one, safe way, and it becomes a habit. A safe habit is your friend.

Please consider this. Saving a $375k home makes sense. But, if you own a 50' trailer that's 20 years old, it is still a mans/womans castle and deserves the same care, caution and respect shown to a larger home.

Based on TH comments here, he can take out MY trees near MY castle.

TH, and TC, I'll drink a toast to you tonight.

Oh, I do realize that TH is big enough to take care of himself.


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## John Ellison (Apr 13, 2007)

I believe the original poster was talking about falling trees in the woods. It does not matter how good you are with a saw or if you are the swinging Dutchman himself, some trees need some encouragment to go where you want. That means wedges, heavy equipment, ropes and or jacks. Wedges are the only thing a faller can easily carry on himself that is effective. A lot of wedging can be a sign of inexperience, but thats ok, we all have to go thru that learning process. There is only so much you can absorb thru books, AS, talking and watching. I think it is best to learn the basics in the woods with just wedges and no pull ropes. Then you will know just what a hinge can and cannot do.
Near a house, I would nearly always set a pull line unless it is a very easy slam dunk. I believe a properly set pull line/s is the most sure fire and stress free way to fell a tree in a must do situation.But,having wedges right there at every tree should be a no brainer. Think of all those sayings like Murphys Law, or Dont put all your eggs in one basket. The pull rope is just part of it, there is also the winch, rope come a long or whatever and also whoever is operating it. There are all kinds of links. If any things fails, a wedge could be the most valuable piece of equipment you have ever owned.
As a matter of fact, a wedge is the only thing in the woods that I can think of offhand that I have never seen fail. Who has'nt seen anything with moving parts fail, or the bozo thats operating it. A hinge will fail, but a wedge? No.


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## begleytree (Apr 13, 2007)

*differences between arbos and loggers*

you guys are argueing about different methods for different situations.
don't know of any loggers who can climb, or throw a rope worth a crap, so they use wedges. their only target is the ground usually.
ropes have their place, and work much better than wedges in their application. sure, a wedge will induce lean in a general direction while a rope will pull a tree in an exact location.
as an arborist, I have wedges, but usually little use for them unless I'm flushing a stump due to tight quarters, and blocking down stubs.
jacks? honestly no need. ever. ropes and wedges are enough for the size stuff I cut here.

if you only use wedges, you are half assing it as much as a guy with only ropes. a wedge won't work on every tree in the arb world. we get the dead nasty stuff no one else will touch. 
like TH, I too set ropes for loggers working edges along powerlines. they have enough sense to know when a wedge is done and its time for some leverage up high.
lots of differences between big timber in the woods and big nasty stuff beside your house. 
all of this is provided, of course, you do your job making the right cuts to begin with.

from now on, no more felling discussions in chainsaw. 
put them where they go. if you're an arb working next to a house, then CTC&C is your place, loggers and firewood droppers with no targets, use forestry and logging.
too many chances of someone getting the wrong idea when 2 or 3 different types of work all start argueing over methods. we all have ours that work where we work. chancing a fall along a house with wedges is as absurd as climbing and roping every tree while in the logging woods.
-Ralph


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## SawTroll (Apr 13, 2007)

begleytree said:


> ...you guys are argueing about different methods for different situations. ...



Not me and Tzed250.......:biggrinbounce2: 




Tzed250 said:


> .... A rope in the woods, prolly a waste of time. As a safety device next to valuable property, it has a place.





SawTroll said:


> 100% true, imo.....


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## GASoline71 (Apr 13, 2007)

Me either... I cut mostly in timber... but on the occassion that I am in close proximity to a house or other property that can be damaged... I use a pull line to my winch. Been there done that.

Sooooo... I don't care what you guys think... nanny-nanny-boo-boo!

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!! 

Gary


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## Gologit (Apr 13, 2007)

:hmm3grin2orange: Point taken, Ralph. I just flat wouldn't try to fall a tree leaning over my house. I'd call an arborist for that. And I wouldn't care what method he used,either. We had some really nasty cottonwoods taken down a while back that leaned out over my neighbor's walnut orchard. Watching those kids gave me a new appreciation for what arborists do. Damn hard work that was very well done. And compared to having to replace my neighbor's walnut trees if I fell a cottonwood on them it was well worth the price.


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## SawTroll (Apr 13, 2007)

boboak said:


> :hmm3grin2orange: Point taken, Ralph. I just flat wouldn't try to fall a tree leaning over my house. I'd call an arborist for that. .... .



I did that at the cottage last year, but used a double strong rope, and a strong man at the end of it - it went streight trough the opening I had made in the fence. 
The backcut was secured from closing, by wedges......


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## begleytree (Apr 13, 2007)

OK, edit previous post to read _ except sawtroll_ lol 

ST, when something has to go one way and cannot for any reason go backwards one bit, we tie off. that is, notch the tree, run a come-along off another tree and cinch it down. making the backcut and watching it lay exactly where I want it is sweet heaven. plus if a guy is pulling, it always happens that when you need him to pull, thats when his feet slip, or he releases to get a better grip, ect. i'm saying eliminate the weak point in the rigging, and thats usually the human involved.

wedges would have to be the same. knock one in and lift that big SOB and tilt it over and watch it follow your notch perfectly right to where you aimed it.

although arbs and loggers use both rope and wedges, I'm sure each could teach the other a few things about their particular piece of kit. although I use wedges, I'd look as green with them to a logger as that same logger would look to me trying to use a rope.
we're all good at what we do (or we'd be dead/maimed by now), we just do different stuff to achieve the same results.
-Ralph


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## clearance (Apr 13, 2007)

*Fun*

No one has talked about the fun of wedging over trees without a rope, by powerlines or houses. I am not talking about trying stupid stuff, just having some skill and confidence and making it work. I mean falling decent trees that are reliable, like Doug. firs, pines, birches etc, never cottonwoods or maples etc. Using ropes or excavators to fall is cheating, it ain't falling.


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## SawTroll (Apr 13, 2007)

begleytree said:


> OK, edit previous post to read _ except sawtroll_ lol  ....



Hmmm, that tree wasn't that large, only 16" dbh, but thicker at about 10', and very top heavy and high for birches in our area (about 60'). It was about 3 yards from the cottage, and natural fall direction was streight at the cottage. I needed the rope and the man, as I wasn't sure that the wedges would be enough - but they actually were - it was on the way in the right direction, before he really pulled on the rope......

My point is that in a tight spot, it isn't either - or, but both, to be safe.


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## Timberhauler (Apr 13, 2007)

There was no wedging this...It it weren't for the rope,it would have been through the roof.


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## Timberhauler (Apr 13, 2007)




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## clearance (Apr 13, 2007)

Looks like you cut all your holding wood off, I can't see any in the pic. And the backcut is really high. And it looks like a harsh dutchman as well. I see why you always use a rope now. :monkey:


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## SawTroll (Apr 13, 2007)

clearance said:


> Looks like you cut all your holding wood off, I can't see any in the pic. And the backcut is really high. And it looks like a harsh dutchman as well. I see why you always use a rope now. :monkey:




Yep, agree - and the notch looks way too deep! :hmm3grin2orange: :hmm3grin2orange:

It is a risky sport to post pictures of your handywork on the AS (who said that before).........


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## Timberhauler (Apr 13, 2007)

Cut the hinge off????I made the backcut high so it would jump off of the stump and clear the water line that was near the base of the stump....I use a rope much of the time because most of the trees I am bringing down you would probably run from.


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## clearance (Apr 13, 2007)

Timberhauler said:


> Cut the hinge off????I made the backcut high so it would jump off of the stump and clear the water line that was near the base of the stump....I use a rope much of the time because most of the trees I am bringing down you would probably run from.



The height of the backcut does not influence the "jump", that is controlled by the size of the undercut.


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## GASoline71 (Apr 13, 2007)

:food: :food: :food: 

Gary


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## Gologit (Apr 13, 2007)

Where's the hinge?


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## SawTroll (Apr 13, 2007)

boboak said:


> Where's the hinge?



I also wondered about that, but was too polite to ask.........:yoyo: :yoyo:


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## Husky137 (Apr 13, 2007)

boboak said:


> Where's the hinge?



It jumped off it was so scared.:greenchainsaw:


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## PA Plumber (Apr 13, 2007)

Before I post any of my stumps, I'm going to put on a suit of mental armor and get ready for the beating.:help:


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## Timberhauler (Apr 13, 2007)

That particular wood rarely leaves any fiber pull,there was alot of weight leaning straight back towards the house,so a rope was placed less than a foot from the very top for maximum leverage,then the new holland was used to pull it....Yes,the back cut was slightly high,but I used the lip left by the higher back cut,plus a couple of wedges to keep it from trying to twist one way or another...That did not have to be as precise as some falls I have made,but I did have to avoid the water line,those two holly trees and that brick wall...I knew that with the rope in the very top and the wedges to keep it from turning it was pretty much bound for where I wanted it,so technically I cut much more of the hinge than I shoule have to get a little more falling speed before the top of the wedge hit the base of the stump to gain as much jump as I could get...Anyone who has regularly fallen trees that big and bigger knows that they ain't gonna jump that far no matter what you do,but I made my best effort at this one and it worked....So ya'll keep BSing about using wedges on the occasional trees some of you are falling,and trying to find things wrong with everyone else,and I'll keep using what works for me every single day to make ends meet for myself and my family...Are any of your names on the sides of my dump trucks or grapple truck???I don't think so...Again,it all might not be by your spec books or how you dream about doing it someday,but I've built a half million dollar a year business by using these same things I've talked about here....What I suggested to the guy that started this thread was only to help him out and to keep himself or something or someone around him from potentially getting hurt while learning how to fall trees.


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## SawTroll (Apr 13, 2007)

PA Plumber said:


> Before I post any of my stumps, I'm going to put on a suit of mental armor and get ready for the beating.:help:




That's about how I feel also - there can be lots of reasons to do what you did, but the pics won't show them........


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## Gologit (Apr 13, 2007)

PA Plumber said:


> Before I post any of my stumps, I'm going to put on a suit of mental armor and get ready for the beating.:help:



LOL...Probably a good idea.


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## Timberhauler (Apr 13, 2007)

Husky137 said:


> Every line breaks, sometime,eventually.





Husky137 said:


> It jumped off it was so scared.:greenchainsaw:



And I'm 100% sure you could have brought your 137 husky and shown us all how to do it...:censored:


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## clearance (Apr 13, 2007)

*The sun don't shine outta my....*

I am far from perfect, I have cut off my holding wood as well, and put a tree across a three phase powerline because of that error, and more, over the years, and not just with chainsaws..... Whatever works for you T.H., just don't b.s. about falling here, it ain't gonna work.


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## PA Plumber (Apr 13, 2007)

boboak said:


> LOL...Probably a good idea.



I'll go through and pick the best one. I'll find somewhere to post it. Probably be a few days before I get back to felling. I do have one in mind that looks great. We'll let the "panel" decide.


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## joesawer (Apr 14, 2007)

Timberhauler, The origianal post was a request for information about falling trees with wedges.
I don't do this part time or as a hobby. I do both contract falling and residential tree removal. (no I don't claim to be an arborist-I don't know enough about pruning or treating trees). Next week I have a side leaner growing through the deck, dead with conks, that I am going to pull and use a guy rope in, and jump it past the porch rail and the chain link fence below.
There is most definiatly a place for a pull line, even in the deepest, darkest woods. It might even be a one inch swedged steal cable hooked to a D-8 or a yarder. 
Sawtroll, in spite of what the books say, the best holding wood is often near the center of the tree and a deep face (notch) often makes a tree easier to pull.
Clearance, That dutchman is what made his tree jump.


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## Husky137 (Apr 14, 2007)

Timberhauler said:


> And I'm 100% sure you could have brought your 137 husky and shown us all how to do it...:censored:



I don't have one, can I borrow yers?:deadhorse:


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## SawTroll (Apr 14, 2007)

clearance said:


> I am far from perfect, I have cut off my holding wood as well, and put a tree across a three phase powerline because of that error, and more, over the years, and not just with chainsaws..... Whatever works for you T.H., just don't b.s. about falling here, it ain't gonna work.



Nobody is perfect, I have got the saw in a pinch a couple of times, because I made short-cuts on side-leaners on a steep slope (didn't care to use the wedges) - and I believe most of us has done similar mistakes......:bang: :bang:

Btw, one of the trees went downhill, not where I wanted it, 
when I cut the saw out with an axe....
- I was really sloppy that day, and didn't bring another bar or saw either.

Btw, the other trees on that ridge went the right way, thanks to triangular holding wood - they all leaned downhill, but landed on the ridge, 90 degrees or more off natural fall direction....


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## Tzed250 (Apr 14, 2007)

There are two kinds of chain saw operators...Those that have got a saw stuck...and those that will get a saw stuck...


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## PA Plumber (Apr 14, 2007)

I have never gotten a saw stuck. Sometimes they are unpleasantly situated in an objectionable predicament for a while. But never stuck!:monkey:

In fact, I haven't had this happen since, Oh, a couple of days ago.


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## Gologit (Apr 14, 2007)

clearance said:


> I am far from perfect, I have cut off my holding wood as well, and put a tree across a three phase powerline because of that error, and more, over the years, and not just with chainsaws..... Whatever works for you T.H., just don't b.s. about falling here, it ain't gonna work.



Yup...we all make mistakes. I'm not even going to start listing all the trees I've had that really made me wish I'd stayed home that day. Not enough space.
But...most of us can take the ribbing, or advice on how to to it better, or explain why we did something without falling back on that "I'm the owner and the boss so I must be right" garbage. 
I really don't give a damn how TH drops his trees. I made a couple of jokes at his expense, mostly to lighten things up a little and let him see that nobody was taking this too seriously. Oh well...


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## sawinredneck (Apr 14, 2007)

Mistakes? Who me?????:monkey:


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## Gologit (Apr 14, 2007)

PA Plumber said:


> I have never gotten a saw stuck. Sometimes they are unpleasantly situated in an objectionable predicament for a while. But never stuck!:monkey:
> 
> In fact, I haven't had this happen since, Oh, a couple of days ago.



LOL...I'm going to add that to my excuse file..."My saw isn't hung up...it's just unpleasantly situated. Again".


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## Urbicide (Apr 14, 2007)

PA Plumber said:


> I have never gotten a saw stuck. Sometimes they are unpleasantly situated in an objectionable predicament for a while. But never stuck!:monkey:
> 
> In fact, I haven't had this happen since, Oh, a couple of days ago.



I agree! Mine have never been stuck either. There have been a few times when the saw I was using at the moment decided that it was time for a break right in the middle of a cut. Then there was the time one of my saws wanted to spend the night camping out under the stars while I went on home.


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## John Ellison (Apr 14, 2007)

Mine never get stuck, they are placed in an anti-theft position.


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## Gologit (Apr 14, 2007)

John Ellison said:


> Mine never get stuck, they are placed in an anti-theft position.



 Hey John...that one goes on my list, too. And how about "I left the saw stuck in the tree so I'd know where to start tomorrow morning"?


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## ericjeeper (Apr 14, 2007)

*I honestly hate to tell on myself*

I was cutting firewood after the loggers went through. They broke the top off a 15"DBH cherry tree. So I figured I would go ahead and fall it and buck it up. It was only about 10-12 feet tall had a limb split off to one side and had a big limb out of a black walnut tying it the other direction.. I eyeballed it.. made my notch then plunged through and cut my way out. Bugger just stood there.. so I though cut some of the hinge out. so I put the saw back in behind the hinge made a bit of a cut and boom it dropped straight down on the saw.,. No wedges with me.. so I Unbolted the bar and put the 24 inch on it.. Looked it over some and decided to just buck a 20 inch piece off from above the stuck bar.(thinking maybe it would kick out Remember it was just a stub with a limb and a snag). so I proceeded to cut a 20 inch piece out of it.. and bam it again sat down on my saw.. so here I am a saw and a bar stuck in this darned tree when my father comes driving around the field.. I just stood and smiled.. Darned tree was starting to look like a porcupine.. So I unbolted the PH and left bar number two in there and grabbed the branch and pulled tree over by hand.. Why did I not do that after bar number one? I have not a clue..LOL I needed a wedge..huh?
When the loggers were logging the woods for us the sawyer cut a maple and it hung up.vertical..he said I will go get some wedges.. We were close to the truck. So he walks up the hill about 35 feet and sits his saw down on a stump and proceeds to start sharpening his chain.. I called him a a few names and said hey.. You left that tree standing with barely a hinge.If it falls it is going to land on your DA.. He looked at me like I had just saved his life and said" I was not thinking" well duh.. We went back and banged three wedges in and fell it on target.


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## PA Plumber (Apr 14, 2007)

boboak said:


> Hey John...that one goes on my list, too. And how about "I left the saw stuck in the tree so I'd know where to start tomorrow morning"?



Hey, that's what my neighbor does, eventually, in a few months, after the bar is rusted, etc.... (I think there may be at least one on his place now, seasoning in a tree somewhere.


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## John Ellison (Apr 14, 2007)

ericjeeper said:


> clue..LOL I needed a wedge..huh?
> When the loggers were logging the woods for us the sawyer cut a maple and it hung up.vertical..he said I will go get some wedges.. We were close to the truck. So he walks up the hill about 35 feet and sits his saw down on a stump and proceeds to start sharpening his chain.. I called him a a few names and said hey.. You left that tree standing with barely a hinge.If it falls it is going to land on your DA.. He looked at me like I had just saved his life and said" I was not thinking" well duh.. We went back and banged three wedges in and fell it on target.



 Are you sure that was'nt an arborist instead of a logger?


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## ents (Apr 14, 2007)

When I first started this project (3 yrs. ago) I used a come-along and snatchum straps to get those south leaners going north. I spent as much time clearing away brush for my escape route as I did cutting the tree. Also used this method to get my saw out of several objectionable predicaments. Then I discovered wedges.  Still get a few "anti theft" moments but can usually whack those wedges in and extract the saw before any harm is done. Has anyone gotten there wedges stuck?  I had 3 stuck for a couple days until I could get the 933 down to the tree to push it over. Why didn't I use the come-along??? Lazy. I knew I'd work my way down to that tree and get the 933 in there.

BTW Wood_Newbie Did you ever get your answer as to what assortment of wedges to use? Certainly enough opinions and methods here.

Just my 2 cents


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## Engineeringnerd (Apr 14, 2007)

I normally cut fairly small trees, around 20" in diameter, and a 5" or 8" wedges work good. If you use too big of a wedge, you don't have enough room for the bar, and you chew up the wedge like everyone else says.

The picture below shows the profile of a few different wedge types. From top to bottom:

Top: Single taper 10" (cheapo)
Middle: Double Taper 8" (cheapo)
Bottom: K&H Triple taper 10" (good wedge - note staggered angles.)

The K&H triple taper is a good wedge for a larger trees (30"+). It's made to go in really easily with its thin leading edge like a single taper, then graduates to a bigger angle to avoid having to stack wedges. Supposedly you can put them back to back and stack them, but I've never tried it.


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## clearance (Apr 14, 2007)

joesawer said:


> Timberhauler, The origianal post was a request for information about falling trees with wedges.
> I don't do this part time or as a hobby. I do both contract falling and residential tree removal. (no I don't claim to be an arborist-I don't know enough about pruning or treating trees). Next week I have a side leaner growing through the deck, dead with conks, that I am going to pull and use a guy rope in, and jump it past the porch rail and the chain link fence below.
> There is most definiatly a place for a pull line, even in the deepest, darkest woods. It might even be a one inch swedged steal cable hooked to a D-8 or a yarder.
> Sawtroll, in spite of what the books say, the best holding wood is often near the center of the tree and a deep face (notch) often makes a tree easier to pull.
> Clearance, That dutchman is what made his tree jump.



Joe-Thats not what he thinks, read his post, may well be what happened though. Also, you are a faller, not an arborist pretending to be faller, seen that, you would be the guy I would call, I mean if I didn't have half a clue myself. Enginenerd- you can put in your back cut in first, set a wedge and then put in your undercut on skinny trees.


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## Engineeringnerd (Apr 14, 2007)

Clearance,

Don't you risk pinching your saw in the undercut?


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## clearance (Apr 14, 2007)

engineeringnerd said:


> Clearance,
> 
> Don't you risk pinching your saw in the undercut?



No, I mean you don't pound the snot out of the wedge, you just put it in by hand and a little tap, maybe. What you really have to be carefull of is that you don't cut off your holding wood. You are using a wedge 'cause its not going over on its own, therefore the natural force of the tree will be away from your undercut. Try this method out where it doesn't really matter.


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## Woodie (Apr 15, 2007)

PA Plumber said:


> I have never gotten a saw stuck. Sometimes they are unpleasantly situated in an objectionable predicament for a while.





Urbicide said:


> Mine have never been stuck either. There have been a few times when the saw I was using at the moment decided that it was time for a break right in the middle of a cut. Then there was the time one of my saws wanted to spend the night camping out under the stars while I went on home.





John Ellison said:


> Mine never get stuck, they are placed in an anti-theft position.





boboak said:


> "I left the saw stuck in the tree so I'd know where to start tomorrow morning"



I've been laughing out loud literally for like two minutes now, and I think I just pulled a lung.


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## Engineeringnerd (Apr 15, 2007)

Clearance,

Unfortunately, I've misjudged lean on more than one occasion. Getting a saw stuck is really a drag, and damages the ego when others are watching!


Newbie, 

Thanks for the humor! I like the "anti-theft-device" line the best! Been there on several occasions!


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## tawilson (Apr 15, 2007)

Timberhauler, do you ever get concerned about a tree going the wrong way and taking the New Holland for a ride? I always run my winch through a snatch block so it can only drag the tractor so far. Course if it ever happened I could really have a situation to deal with.


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## joesawer (Apr 15, 2007)

Unfortunately, I've misjudged lean on more than one occasion. Getting a saw stuck is really a drag, and damages the ego when others are watching!

There are all kinds of optical illusions that will make us misjudge the lean of a tree. We try to judge the lean by the surroundings, but nothing is flat or square in the woods. A plumb bob is the best referance to judge the lean by. If you have an ax with you it makes a fair plumb bob. pinch the handle between your thumb and finger and let the head hang down being careful not to tilt it with your grip. judge the lean from at least two points at 90 degrees from each other. 
If it is close to balanced visualize where the hinge will be and look straight up from there. Don't just look at the trunk look at the center of mass. 
I hope that I'm making this clear.


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## John Ellison (Apr 15, 2007)

Accuratley judging lean was one of the hardest things for me to learn. I carried a fishing sinker/line in my pocket for a long time. It sure is hard to make any money when all the ground is steep and you have to plumb most every tree.:biggrinbounce2:


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## Timberhauler (Apr 15, 2007)

tawilson said:


> Timberhauler, do you ever get concerned about a tree going the wrong way and taking the New Holland for a ride? I always run my winch through a snatch block so it can only drag the tractor so far. Course if it ever happened I could really have a situation to deal with.


 As long as you have a rope near the very top,you're OK...If I have one with that much weight on one side,I would get some of the weight off of it before attempting to pull..


joesawer said:


> Unfortunately, I've misjudged lean on more than one occasion. Getting a saw stuck is really a drag, and damages the ego when others are watching!
> 
> There are all kinds of optical illusions that will make us misjudge the lean of a tree. We try to judge the lean by the surroundings, but nothing is flat or square in the woods. A plumb bob is the best referance to judge the lean by. If you have an ax with you it makes a fair plumb bob. pinch the handle between your thumb and finger and let the head hang down being careful not to tilt it with your grip. judge the lean from at least two points at 90 degrees from each other.
> If it is close to balanced visualize where the hinge will be and look straight up from there. Don't just look at the trunk look at the center of mass.
> I hope that I'm making this clear.



This is again where I would set a rope,then you minimize the room for error even more....You people can knock the way I do it all you want to,but for some starange reason it works for me,and has been for a long time...I do not only do tree work,pruning,climbing,ect..We also clear small patches of timber,up to about five acres or so.


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## SawTroll (Apr 15, 2007)

engineeringnerd said:


> ..... Bottom: K&H Triple taper 10" (good wedge - note staggered angles.)
> ...



That one looks really good, I have never seen anything like it........


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## clearance (Apr 15, 2007)

Timberhauler said:


> We also clear small patches of timber,up to about five acres or so.



Hmmm, you must be there a long time, putting a rope in every tree on five acres.


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## Urbicide (Apr 15, 2007)

SawTroll said:


> That one looks really good, I have never seen anything like it........



Bailey's carries them. opcorn:

http://store.baileys-online.com/cgi-bin/baileys/106?mv_session_id=4JRW2oX5&product_sku=15323


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## John Ellison (Apr 15, 2007)

:hmm3grin2orange: :hmm3grin2orange:


clearance said:


> Hmmm, you must be there a long time, putting a rope in every tree on five acres.


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## Timberchic (Apr 15, 2007)

clearance said:


> Hmmm, you must be there a long time, putting a rope in every tree on five acres.



I read this entire thread over several times trying to see it from several different sides,and all I could come up with is this....I would like to know who the hell you think you are???Paul Bunyon or something???....First off,NO!!!..He's not roping every single tree in the woods when clearing a big tract,just as he said,just the ones that need it..And who are you to criticize the way someone else does something just because it's not exactly the way you do it..To say TH is no tree feller would about be like saying Dale Jr. isn't a race car driver..He's made too many miraculous falls for it only to be mere luck...Pulling them with a rope,wedging,what's the difference?,both accomplish the same goal...I've pulled enough trees to know as well that once you have gotten the tree started with a rope,it is no longer in your control,it follows the lead that was left by the faller,just like when one is wedged over..I'm no faller myself,but have seen it done many times both ways....Timber made his suggestion to help the guy who started the thread learn how to accomplish his goal as safely as possible,and yes,it was a thread about wedging,but he also mentioned he wanted to fall trees in his post,so he just added a 2nd opinion...Just because you're too closed minded to visualize what he was trying to tell the guy does not mean you are the only one on this site who knows anything about falling trees.Now he left this thread alone and was done with it until someone simply asked him a question,then you had to chime in and throw gas on the fire again.The last post of yours was absolutely unnecessary.


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## Urbicide (Apr 15, 2007)

*Aluminum wedges?*

I was wondering if any of the Pros here ever use aluminum felling wedges. Part of my TSI is removing quite a few standing dead elms. Most have lost their bark and are harder than hell. Plastic wedges don't last too long in these either. opcorn:


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## SawTroll (Apr 15, 2007)

Urbicide said:


> I was wondering if any of the Pros here ever use aluminum felling wedges. Part of my TSI is removing quite a few standing dead elms. Most have lost their bark and are harder than hell. Plastic wedges don't last too long in these either. opcorn:



I am not a pro, but over here we have plastic and magnesium ones, never heard of Alu ones.........:greenchainsaw:


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## 04ultra (Apr 15, 2007)

Timberchic said:


> I read this entire thread over several times trying to see it from several different sides,and all I could come up with is this....I would like to know who the hell you think you are???Paul Bunyon or something???....First off,NO!!!..He's not roping every single tree in the woods when clearing a big tract,just as he said,just the ones that need it..And who are you to criticize the way someone else does something just because it's not exactly the way you do it..To say TH is no tree feller would about be like saying Dale Jr. isn't a race car driver..He's made too many miraculous falls for it only to be mere luck...Pulling them with a rope,wedging,what's the difference?,both accomplish the same goal...I've pulled enough trees to know as well that once you have gotten the tree started with a rope,it is no longer in your control,it follows the lead that was left by the faller,just like when one is wedged over..I'm no faller myself,but have seen it done many times both ways....Timber made his suggestion to help the guy who started the thread learn how to accomplish his goal as safely as possible,and yes,it was a thread about wedging,but he also mentioned he wanted to fall trees in his post,so he just added a 2nd opinion...Just because you're too closed minded to visualize what he was trying to tell the guy does not mean you are the only one on this site who knows anything about falling trees.Now he left this thread alone and was done with it until someone simply asked him a question,then you had to chime in and throw gas on the fire again.The last post of yours was absolutely unnecessary.




opcorn: opcorn: opcorn: opcorn:



.


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## Gologit (Apr 15, 2007)

04ultra said:


> opcorn: opcorn: opcorn: opcorn:
> 
> 
> 
> .



:hmm3grin2orange: Ahhhh, hell, never mind.


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## PA Plumber (Apr 15, 2007)

TC,
I think TH has earned a lot of respect on this site. I know he has from me. I am guessing he is being given such a hard time is because of posts like this one:



Timberhauler said:


> opcorn:  ....Just come on down here and I'll show ya' what I'm talking about....I think I would much rather pull on a rope with a tractor or a skid loader than pound on a wedge with a hammer...I do keep them around,but do not use them to fall big trees.



I figured the ribbing as part of the read on this thread. I also thought TH was taking it pretty well and had some fun replies. This thread has been a good read and informative. I never thought of it any other way.


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## Engineeringnerd (Apr 15, 2007)

Something I've started doing is carrying a light weight dead blow hammer tucked into my chaps belt. It has somewhere around an 18" long handle and allows me to carry it wherever I go to tap in a wedge, when bucking, or sometimes I can fell the tree without having to fetch an axe. You are able to get two hands on the sucker and pound pretty good. I noticed Sears (Craftsman) has a deadblow with a metal face, which would be even better.

Someone mentioned a difference between a felling wedge and a bucking wedge. I just use a 5" wedge for bucking. What's the difference?


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## SawTroll (Apr 15, 2007)

PA Plumber said:


> ... I figured the ribbing as part of the read on this thread. I also thought TH was taking it pretty well and had some fun replies. This thread has been a good read and informative. I never thought of it any other way.



Yep, that's it - no hard feelings, hopefully.........:yoyo: :yoyo:


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## Timberhauler (Apr 15, 2007)

boboak said:


> :hmm3grin2orange: :hmm3grin2orange: You don't need a jack. Just tie a piece of clothes-line to the tree and pull it over with your riding lawnmower. And you had to know that was coming.





boboak said:


> :hmm3grin2orange: And what do you tell them? "Wedges??!! We don't need no stinking wedges!!! Just tie all your bootlaces together and have the heaviest guy on the crew (and the fastest runner) pull that side-leaning SOB right on over. Be sure to get the bootlaces back when you're done...otherwise your corks'll come off and stay stuck in the tree"


 


clearance said:


> You have been put in your place, by pros and amatuers alike, give up.:deadhorse:





clearance said:


> I am far from perfect, I have cut off my holding wood as well, and put a tree across a three phase powerline because of that error, and more, over the years, and not just with chainsaws..... Whatever works for you T.H., just don't b.s. about falling here, it ain't gonna work.





clearance said:


> Joe-Thats not what he thinks, read his post, may well be what happened though. Also, you are a faller, not an arborist pretending to be faller, seen that, you would be the guy I would call, I mean if I didn't have half a clue myself. Enginenerd- you can put in your back cut in first, set a wedge and then put in your undercut on skinny trees.



First off...I can take jokes with the best of them,for the most part,there is no hard feelings...I just realized that I did not include the remarks made by husky137...When it happens once or twice,it's a joke,but keep on pushing and it's no longer funny.I was OK with everything that was said until certain people started giving me discredit on the methods I use,then started to imply that I didn't know what I was doing.Everything either I or one of my employee's do is done to minimize risk.If we are clearing a lot,then it's no big deal,usually we can let the tree lay wherever it wants to go..But when we're doing residential work,9 times out of 10 if the tree goes anywhere else other than where we plan for it to go the results can be very costly,if not deadly.So why not take every precaution possible?Again,the reason I suggested what I did to the guy who started the thread was to simply minimize his room for error..Not to give him any discredit,but being new to falling,I'm assuming he might not have an experienced enough eye to accurately judge some trees,so if he learned what I'm talking about and used it,it would give him another advantage should he get himself into a bad situation.


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## Engineeringnerd (Apr 15, 2007)

Timber,

I don't think there's much fault with being too safe. I don't cut very much compared to many of you guys, but when it matters, a rope can be a great safety, if not the primary means of pull.

Since I don't cut trees for a living, I have the ability to choose which trees I am going to cut. For the most part I dodge the ones that can cause damage --hey its a hobby-- but that isn't your role. You have to take down the tricky stuff next to valuable property; and do it without crushing anything or anybody.

Truth is, a wedge can pop out and a rope/rig can break. Each of us has to do what he/she can do to be professional and safe depending on what the situation demands.


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## clearance (Apr 15, 2007)

Timberchic said:


> I read this entire thread over several times trying to see it from several different sides,and all I could come up with is this....I would like to know who the hell you think you are???Paul Bunyon or something???....First off,NO!!!..He's not roping every single tree in the woods when clearing a big tract,just as he said,just the ones that need it..And who are you to criticize the way someone else does something just because it's not exactly the way you do it..To say TH is no tree feller would about be like saying Dale Jr. isn't a race car driver..He's made too many miraculous falls for it only to be mere luck...Pulling them with a rope,wedging,what's the difference?,both accomplish the same goal...I've pulled enough trees to know as well that once you have gotten the tree started with a rope,it is no longer in your control,it follows the lead that was left by the faller,just like when one is wedged over..I'm no faller myself,but have seen it done many times both ways....Timber made his suggestion to help the guy who started the thread learn how to accomplish his goal as safely as possible,and yes,it was a thread about wedging,but he also mentioned he wanted to fall trees in his post,so he just added a 2nd opinion...Just because you're too closed minded to visualize what he was trying to tell the guy does not mean you are the only one on this site who knows anything about falling trees.Now he left this thread alone and was done with it until someone simply asked him a question,then you had to chime in and throw gas on the fire again.The last post of yours was absolutely unnecessary.



Thank you for the ticket ma'am, can I have my drivers licence back please? Too funny, by far, the guy B.S.s about falling, gets called on it and has to get his woman to biatch out the guys who know what they are doing. I just walked in the door after finishing a job, cutting down four decent sized (approx. 80'-90' tall, 20"-30" d.b.h.) dead pines. One was good, just fell it, the next two leaned towards the neighboring property (house, garage), one I wedged over, the bad one I got a rope in it and had my g/f pull it over with the Blazer. The last one was straight up and down, I wedged it over. Took my time, left lots of holding wood, less than two hours, driving included. A real faller would have just pounded it all, but hey, ropes have there place and I use them accordingly.  :biggrinbounce2: Dale Earnhart is a race car driver, TH ain't no faller, thats been well established, by himself, no less.:hmm3grin2orange:


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## Fordman99 (Apr 15, 2007)

*Dinggg..dinggg..dinggg*

In This Corner...!!!!....


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## clearance (Apr 15, 2007)

Fordman99 said:


> In This Corner...!!!!....



You missed the brawl, coming from all sides, over the ropes and into the ring, a free for all, even the girl holding the rounds sign got involved. But it was no contest, a couple of straight right handers and he was down for the count. Don King has left the building, its all over but the crying.


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## Timberhauler (Apr 15, 2007)

clearance said:


> Thank you for the ticket ma'am, can I have my drivers licence back please? :biggrinbounce2: Dale Earnhart is a race car driver, TH ain't no faller..:hmm3grin2orange:



OK....Now that was funny..:hmm3grin2orange: .It'll piss her off even worse because she ain't no traffic cop...Hopefully I'll get to see her face when she reads it.....BUT...She chimmed in on her own,I can handle myself.....I will say this and stop it right here..I actually got in this business because I spent the first years of my life falling trees for a logging outfit...Altogether 30 years in the business if you go all the way back..I will agree to disagree here...My way has worked and paid the bills for the last fifteen years or so...I will leave this thread at that.


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## chainsawworld (Apr 15, 2007)

i perfer to use a 10" long plastic wedge with a 1 1/4" thickness. the 1/4 inch makes up the differance in the kerf from the saw so i still have 1 inch worth of lift from the wedge. now times that against a 100 foot tree. how much will the wedge move the top of that tree? ut-oh. i think i just touch on how to determine how tall a tree is. that is called tanget. why would that and tree back lean be important while felling trees. once you learn how tall a tree is and how it leans you can hit a broom handle driven in the ground each and every time with the top of a tree. marty


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## Timberhauler (Apr 15, 2007)

I prefer a John Deere 648E sawhead when I can use it....Much faster.


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## PA Plumber (Apr 15, 2007)

When I have a "heavy leaner" (okay, hung up tree) I grab the 931C deleaner tool. Recently I couldn't get to a "heavy leaner" so I chained the hung tree to a downed tree an pulled down the hung. Worked out pretty well. Nice not to have too many "heavy leaners" though.


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## joesawer (Apr 15, 2007)

TH having a women that will stand up for you is a good thing.
This line was started to learn about wedges, there is and always will be a place for pulling trees. 
Even now I can not stand in front of a certain group of men and say that "I am a good faller" They will smile and say that "he is capable faller"
The places I fall it would be extremely difficult and extremely slow (expensive) to carry a pull line and tractor or rope along, a big shot and or my climbing gear. Just carrying it would be prohibitive much less using it. I might fall hundreds or even thousands of trees with wedges without a mishap. That requires working around the ones that are beyond my ability with wedges. In my line a tree can never fall out of control and be considered ok, every one is fell to a desired direction. A few may not, but this is not considered acceptable. 
As property value risk goes up so does the time that is acceptable to remove small percentages of risk. The human life and limb factor never changes.
I just submitted a bid on a crane tree for $8,600. This same tree in the woods on some contracts would only pay me twelve dollars to fell. See the difference?

Urbicide, The aluminum wedges are tougher but much heavier and much more expensive.I don't know if they will last long enough to justify this for you. They are also less forgiving if driven into your bar and chain. To me their biggest advantage is they don't absorb as much energy so they lift a little better and they are easier to drive into a closed kerf. 
An old single bit ax head from the flea market makes a severe duty wedge but is brutal on chain and bars and the driving surface of you ax.
From here on I will only comment in wedges in the forestry and logging forum.
The monitors have already told us to move there.


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## sawinredneck (Apr 15, 2007)

Well................ This has gotten good and ugly!!!!

TH: I used to fell everything that was questionable with a bull rope as well, and they have their place, that is a fact!! But with wedges you have better control, unless I screw up ( I have, and they still saved my butt!!!). I have bull roped leaning cottonwoods that would scare most, but with what I have learned now, I could swing it, much safer, with wedges and land the same trees without having to worry about sling shotting a truck!!
I believe, at least, what is getting you the most criticism, is you're unwillingness to listen to other options.


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## Timberhauler (Apr 15, 2007)

sawinredneck said:


> Well................ This has gotten good and ugly!!!!
> 
> TH: I used to fell everything that was questionable with a bull rope as well, and they have their place, that is a fact!! But with wedges you have better control, unless I screw up ( I have, and they still saved my butt!!!). I have bull roped leaning cottonwoods that would scare most, but with what I have learned now, I could swing it, much safer, with wedges and land the same trees without having to worry about sling shotting a truck!!
> I believe, at least, what is getting you the most criticism, is you're unwillingness to listen to other options.


 No offense meant here...But over the years I have used just about every thing available
Joesawer:..I never discredited the use of wedges,and said several times that on occasion that I do use both.I have a poplar tree to cut sometime in the near future that is five feet in diameter and well over 100 feet tall.I am scared to work in this tree because the top is dead,and we can't get a crane in there.So I will have to fall it between two houses,with about five feet to spare on either side..I will not only rope it,but will wedge it as well....I never said I was against using wedges or any other method...I simply listed what I use the most...And again,the guy asked about wedges and is new to falling,so mentioned what I did to give him another safe option.


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## sawinredneck (Apr 15, 2007)

Timberhauler said:


> No offense meant here...But over the years I have used just about every thing available
> Joesawer:..I never discredited the use of wedges,and said several times that on occasion that I do use both.I have a poplar tree to cut sometime in the near future that is five feet in diameter and well over 100 feet tall.I am scared to work in this tree because the top is dead,and we can't get a crane in there.So I will have to fall it between two houses,with about five feet to spare on either side..I will not only rope it,but will wedge it as well....I never said I was against using wedges or any other method...I simply listed what I use the most...And again,the guy asked about wedges and is new to falling,so mentioned what I did to give him another safe option.



No offense taken, I'm easy:hmm3grin2orange: 
That Poplar sounds lie a climb job to me, but thats a whole other story:hmm3grin2orange: 
I wasn't picking on you, just trying to interviene a bit.


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## Timberhauler (Apr 15, 2007)

sawinredneck said:


> No offense taken, I'm easy:hmm3grin2orange:
> That Poplar sounds lie a climb job to me, but thats a whole other story:hmm3grin2orange:
> I wasn't picking on you, just trying to interviene a bit.



There must be a story I don't know behind that...I promise,ya' don't wanna climb it...It's OK for about 70 feet,then it gets ugly


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## Timberchic (Apr 15, 2007)

clearance said:


> Thank you for the ticket ma'am, can I have my drivers licence back please?



Nope...You've got about two seconds to turn around and put your hands behind your back before I hit you with the tazer....I'll be keeping your license for a while...Gonna impound your vehicle as well.


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## slowp (Apr 15, 2007)

Sounds like it is time for a group hug.


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## Timberchic (Apr 16, 2007)

slowp said:


> Sounds like it is time for a group hug.



:angry2: .....:hmm3grin2orange: ....


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## joatmon (Apr 16, 2007)

slowp said:


> Sounds like it is time for a group hug.



I figured that taser would bring out a request for a group hug!


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## FBX1986 (Apr 16, 2007)

*wedges*

timberhauler, with over 1000 post since jan 2007 4 months when do you find time to actually fall timber oh i mean those pecker poles you call timber


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## Timberhauler (Apr 16, 2007)

FBX1986 said:


> timberhauler, with over 1000 post since jan 2007 4 months when do you find time to actually fall timber oh i mean those pecker poles you call timber



There was a disagreement here between several of us that did not involve you...It looks as if all you are trying to do is re-kindle a fire that has already gone out...If that is your intention,then I suggest you go do it someplace else....Most all of us here butt heads at times,but BS and joke about it when it's said and done...I have no use or do not even desire to have conversation with someone intentionally looking to start another fight......There are many others than have been here less time than I have with more posts..


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## Timberhauler (Apr 16, 2007)

I see ya' down there Gary....You missed a helluva party here over the weekend...


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## Timberchic (Apr 16, 2007)

HEY WOODY HAVE YOU PICKED UP WHAT YOU INTENDED TO GET FROM THIS THREAD????

Haven't seen very much of you since you started this thread.


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## sawinredneck (Apr 16, 2007)

OK, some "enlightnment" has been gleaned upon me, we are discussing two types of falling here. Timber is talking about semi hazardous residential trees, and "WE are talking woods dropping. I for one, hardly even cary my wedges into the woods (I'm getting better, I promise) but the only thing that will get hurt is me, and usually it's small (less that 14" oak) I am cutting in the woods. NOW, on removals, I take my gear, ALL OF IT!!!! You never know what you will come across!!! (Or what I mya screw up )
So, thinking along those lines, maybe we can clear somethings up?


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## Timberhauler (Apr 16, 2007)

sawinredneck said:


> OK, some "enlightnment" has been gleaned upon me, we are discussing two types of falling here. Timber is talking about semi hazardous residential trees, and "WE are talking woods dropping. I for one, hardly even cary my wedges into the woods (I'm getting better, I promise) but the only thing that will get hurt is me, and usually it's small (less that 14" oak) I am cutting in the woods. NOW, on removals, I take my gear, ALL OF IT!!!! You never know what you will come across!!! (Or what I mya screw up )
> So, thinking along those lines, maybe we can clear somethings up?



OK,Now I'm confused.....I never take all of my gear...Just half of it.:monkey:


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## clearance (Apr 17, 2007)

sawinredneck said:


> OK, some "enlightnment" has been gleaned upon me, we are discussing two types of falling here. Timber is talking about semi hazardous residential trees, and "WE are talking woods dropping.



First of all, don't be saying "WE". I fall trees and butt logs around and beside houses all the time, without ropes. These are semi-hazardous trees, the nasty ones I rope. Pay attention to whats been said here.


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