# british columbia faller training advice and discussion



## northwest coast (Apr 12, 2011)

i recently looked into becoming a faller and found out that new faller training in b.c. is a ten thousand dollar course, plus hst plus gear and accommodations its closer to twenty thousand dollars for a one month course !! this seems like a big cash grab for the insurance companies or whoever is secretly in charge. 

i realize falling is dangerous but it seems like a hidden agenda to me, like trying to keep people out of the industry ?? 

what are your thoughts and opinions ?? is there any other way for me to get into forestry ?

compare it to fishing, as dangerous if not more so and very few safety regulations, anyone can go out on a dragger or salmon seiner.

i would appreciate any feedback and with luck it will be a prolific discussion, thanks.


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## coastalfaller (Apr 12, 2011)

northwest coast said:


> i recently looked into becoming a faller and found out that new faller training in b.c. is a ten thousand dollar course, plus hst plus gear and accommodations its closer to twenty thousand dollars for a one month course !! this seems like a big cash grab for the insurance companies or whoever is secretly in charge.
> 
> i realize falling is dangerous but it seems like a hidden agenda to me, like trying to keep people out of the industry ??
> 
> ...


 
I know they're not trying to keep people out of the industry, we are going to be desperately short of fallers in the near future. It does make it extremely tough though for people who are interested in getting in to it. We used to be able to break guys in ourselves, but a few bad apples ruined that for us all. 

If you already have experience falling, you can challenge the course to get your certificiation. I also believe there is funding available through EI. 

Don't give up yet!


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## Burvol (Apr 12, 2011)

coastalfaller said:


> I know they're not trying to keep people out of the industry, we are going to be desperately short of fallers in the near future. It does make it extremely tough though for people who are interested in getting in to it. We used to be able to break guys in ourselves, but a few bad apples ruined that for us all.
> 
> If you already have experience falling, you can challenge the course to get your certificiation. I also believe there is funding available through EI.
> 
> Don't give up yet!


 
Brother Jordon, long time me no here. I am wanting to challange that course and come up within 5 years, just because my heart has always wanted to and I love BC. Things are ok here, just finished my second unit of the season, I am finally able to not feel greedy or leaving people behind and look out for myself this time, just like when you are in a strip. No one is gonna protect you but yourself. All Nice wood, some hammers in the bottom, 36" 40's at the first buck, 40-42 on stump with bar with and less the majority. You can break me in on the big big big wood


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## ChrisF (Apr 12, 2011)

Not to hijack, but hey Burvol! Haven't seen you post here in a while, good to see you back!


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## nw axe man (Apr 12, 2011)

I can see where you're coming from, however, you have to understand that this business is based on production. To take a man and take the time necessary to break him in costs a ton of money. For you to provide your own tools is nothing new. Everyone has to provide for himself. It's better that way as you learn to take care of your tools as the maintenance comes from your own pocket. It takes a long time to take this type of timber and to fall it right with the highest objective of saving it to next years growth. Understand that all of the "good" ground has been logged off and the new crop coming up is all mechanically felled and processed. That means that the rough ground makes it all the more costly to break a man in as the production typically goes down. 
I would just imagine that another of the reasons for the cost in BC to break a man in is to make sure that there is a commitment of following through with the training. To invest even a months time and have him leave if he figures out he doesn't want to continue with timber falling is a lot of money. If someone takes a man on to break him in properly, it takes a lot of stopping and explaining of both the falling and bucking basics and the hazard anaylis and safety considerations.
I really don't think that the BC people are trying to keep people out of the industry. I completely agree with Coast Faller that we're in for a real shortage of men that can handle nice timber in the future. We're just not cutting the nicer timber that takes artwork and finesse and promotes pride in ones work anymore.
I also agree with him about a few bad fallers not taking the time to work with inexperience men to make sure that they're broken in right. I hate to rat on myself, but I did that many years ago thinking that I was a great teacher. Cost me a few relationships that I wish I hadn't lost. My fault but I sure learned that I didn't know all there was to know about breaking someone in. I think maturity in years has helped in that regard.
Anyway, Chris, is you really want to break in, no matter with who you choose, it will cost you more in todays market. I can tell you that if you decide to choose this as a career, be careful, it nevers leaves you if you decide to get out. You can take the man out of the woods, but you can never take the woods out of the man.
All the best to you in your endeavors.


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## joesawer (Apr 12, 2011)

Lol The ten grand is what they hafta pay the government for certification then they have to go some where to break in. Its kinda like CDL license and tuck driving in the states.


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## nw axe man (Apr 12, 2011)

If the 10Gs is just for the certification then I'd say I'd have a bit of a problem. I do know that BC is very concerned about the safety and well being of their cutters. They've put out a pretty good series of falling/bucking techniques and safety videos. Quite expensive to buy them.


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## coastalfaller (Apr 12, 2011)

Burvol said:


> Brother Jordon, long time me no here. I am wanting to challange that course and come up within 5 years, just because my heart has always wanted to and I love BC. Things are ok here, just finished my second unit of the season, I am finally able to not feel greedy or leaving people behind and look out for myself this time, just like when you are in a strip. No one is gonna protect you but yourself. All Nice wood, some hammers in the bottom, 36" 40's at the first buck, 40-42 on stump with bar with and less the majority. You can break me in on the big big big wood


 
Anytime, buddy! Come on up! We're going to be needing your services! 

Nice timber! Perfect production size wood.


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## coastalfaller (Apr 12, 2011)

nw axe man said:


> I can see where you're coming from, however, you have to understand that this business is based on production. To take a man and take the time necessary to break him in costs a ton of money. For you to provide your own tools is nothing new. Everyone has to provide for himself. It's better that way as you learn to take care of your tools as the maintenance comes from your own pocket. It takes a long time to take this type of timber and to fall it right with the highest objective of saving it to next years growth. Understand that all of the "good" ground has been logged off and the new crop coming up is all mechanically felled and processed. That means that the rough ground makes it all the more costly to break a man in as the production typically goes down.
> I would just imagine that another of the reasons for the cost in BC to break a man in is to make sure that there is a commitment of following through with the training. To invest even a months time and have him leave if he figures out he doesn't want to continue with timber falling is a lot of money. If someone takes a man on to break him in properly, it takes a lot of stopping and explaining of both the falling and bucking basics and the hazard anaylis and safety considerations.
> I really don't think that the BC people are trying to keep people out of the industry. I completely agree with Coast Faller that we're in for a real shortage of men that can handle nice timber in the future. We're just not cutting the nicer timber that takes artwork and finesse and promotes pride in ones work anymore.
> I also agree with him about a few bad fallers not taking the time to work with inexperience men to make sure that they're broken in right. I hate to rat on myself, but I did that many years ago thinking that I was a great teacher. Cost me a few relationships that I wish I hadn't lost. My fault but I sure learned that I didn't know all there was to know about breaking someone in. I think maturity in years has helped in that regard.
> ...


 
I agree NW, good post. Joe is right, the $10 000 is just for the course. Problem with it is you don't get to pick the guy you want to break in anymore, you get to pick out of a pool that comes out of the course. And ANYONE can take the course if they have the money. And being as we're loggers, very few of the guys who actually have the savvy and general knowledge to become safe productive fallers actually have the money to take the course. I have one faller that has come out of the course and he is a good man, but unfortunately, he is the exception not the rule from what I've seen so far. It is a very costly endeavor to break in new guys, but it helps when you are able to pick the right candidate.


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## joesawer (Apr 12, 2011)

The same thing happened to truck driving here when the federal government decided to make it safer.
There are exceptions to the rule but by a huge margin the quality of drivers has gone way down.


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## nw axe man (Apr 12, 2011)

Yeah, having the right guy to break in is critical. I've found that attitude is an essential element that can't be overlooked. I had a good friend of mine from Libby, MT call me in '88 for a job. I told him that I was in some real nice timber and needed an experience hand. He said he could handle it. I said to come on over and that I would give him 3 days to show himself. He fell one tree and busted it all up. He looked at me rather sheepishly and said that it was an anamoly. OK, I said. He fell another one and did the same thing. After that he did it one more time and I had to stop him. He knew what was coming so he beat me to the punch. He was honest and said that he had never been in that tall or large of timber before. But, he said, if you'll give me a chance I'll listen to you, do everything you say and be that cutter you want me to be.
How was I supposed to respond? Alright. I did give him a chance based on what savvy I saw and his great attitude. He turned out to be a terrific faller very quickly by just humbling himself and swallowing his pride. That seems to be something that all of us fallers have in spades.


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## paccity (Apr 12, 2011)

nw axe man said:


> Yeah, having the right guy to break in is critical. I've found that attitude is an essential element that can't be overlooked. I had a good friend of mine from Libby, MT call me in '88 for a job. I told him that I was in some real nice timber and needed an experience hand. He said he could handle it. I said to come on over and that I would give him 3 days to show himself. He fell one tree and busted it all up. He looked at me rather sheepishly and said that it was an anamoly. OK, I said. He fell another one and did the same thing. After that he did it one more time and I had to stop him. He knew what was coming so he beat me to the punch. He was honest and said that he had never been in that tall or large of timber before. But, he said, if you'll give me a chance I'll listen to you, do everything you say and be that cutter you want me to be.
> How was I supposed to respond? Alright. I did give him a chance based on what savvy I saw and his great attitude. He turned out to be a terrific faller very quickly by just humbling himself and swallowing his pride. That seems to be something that all of us fallers have in spades.


 
being confident in your work is a must. that said, someone who thinks they know it all, knows nothing.


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## nw axe man (Apr 12, 2011)

Yeah, those are the guys that are always bragging about how they've gotten hurt here and there and cut more timber than everyone combined. I had a guy once tell me that he wore out twenty-three 076s in one season. He's the same guy when I went in to finish up a sale that his brother let go back I found 39, count 'em, 39 trees undercut facing the same direction. I was so dumbfounded I called my father over so he could be a witness that I wasn't seeing things. Never seen anything like it before or since. He was certainly a professional braggart of the basest sort. We have enough problems in this industry without those kind of people running around. They're usually the ones that wind up cutting most of their trees at the restaurant table.


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## northwest coast (Apr 12, 2011)

yeah thats what gets me is that the money for the course goes to the government and the companies cant train who they want, they have to pick out of the people who forked out the cash. 

plus 1200 dollars in taxes for a training course seems outrageous, thanks gordon for the hst. 

i guess that course is held only a couple times a year, theres one in june but i'm pretty committed to a summer contract for fisheries. i guess i'll have to wait til next feb. 

i didnt realize one could challenge it though, ill ask my faller friend about that and maybe he can spend a few days with me. 

what are your thoughts on the necessity of a course like that ? is it something that makes sense or just cents ?


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## coastalfaller (Apr 12, 2011)

northwest coast said:


> yeah thats what gets me is that the money for the course goes to the government and the companies cant train who they want, they have to pick out of the people who forked out the cash.
> 
> plus 1200 dollars in taxes for a training course seems outrageous, thanks gordon for the hst.
> 
> ...


 
Speaking to the necessity, you need your certification to even think about getting hired, that or the course. As for the course itself, you do learn the basics, but you also learn in second growth and usually flat ground, not at all like what you will encounter in the real world. You will come out of it with some great habits and a handle on the theory and technique, but you have to have the attitude that now you're ready to break in as a faller. 

Attitude is key, and what NW Axe Man alluded to, you need to be humble, don't be afraid to ask questions, and don't b******t to get hired, be honest about where you're at in your development. Not doing so will only get you in trouble fast. Likely get you fired and if you're lucky, that will be the worst thing that will happen.


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## coastalfaller (Apr 12, 2011)

nw axe man said:


> Yeah, those are the guys that are always bragging about how they've gotten hurt here and there and cut more timber than everyone combined. I had a guy once tell me that he wore out twenty-three 076s in one season. He's the same guy when I went in to finish up a sale that his brother let go back I found 39, count 'em, 39 trees undercut facing the same direction. I was so dumbfounded I called my father over so he could be a witness that I wasn't seeing things. Never seen anything like it before or since. He was certainly a professional braggart of the basest sort. We have enough problems in this industry without those kind of people running around. They're usually the ones that wind up cutting most of their trees at the restaurant table.


 
 If I only had a dollar for every time on the phone I heard "you'll never see anyone fall more timber than me! I'll make you so much money!" lol


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## northwest coast (Apr 12, 2011)

yeah coastalfaller, i just mean the necessity of a course like that within the industry. i guess i'm just kinda choked that it's ten grand for a month of training, my biology degree wont cost that much over 4 full time years. 

i can see why a company doesnt want to spend the money training someone who will not turn out to be a loyal employee but its like that in every profession. 

i dont understand where the money is going thoug, i mean say you get 10 people in the course, thats 100 grand, maybe i should strive to be an instructor ! haha 

i dont have an attitude, i just want some opinions from some people in the know, ya know ?


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## nw axe man (Apr 12, 2011)

northwest coast said:


> yeah thats what gets me is that the money for the course goes to the government and the companies cant train who they want, they have to pick out of the people who forked out the cash.
> 
> plus 1200 dollars in taxes for a training course seems outrageous, thanks gordon for the hst.
> 
> ...


 
As far as the necessity of the course, I'd have to evaluate it myself to be able to critique it. It sounds like a good course. Like Coastalfaller says, though, you need to have it just to be certified. I guess if they can teach you the basics so you at least have some knowledge and theory of it in practice that's a good thing. My question is, is it enough?
I just spent a week working with the California Disaster Relief chainsaw team. I worked specifically with 2 guys that have some experience. They've been cutting for years. After we were done the team leader asked me if I though they were able to teach others to fall trees in the 24" category. I flat out told him that no, they don't even have the basics down yet. It's a huge responsibility to turn someone loose in the woods with just enough information and training to get him hurt or killed. Take the guy in Virginia in one of the other posts that just got killed last week. I don't want to be that guy that sends someone out with too little information and training. This is a business that is OJT but at the same time you have to have someone who is knowledgable to help you survive.


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## coastalfaller (Apr 12, 2011)

northwest coast said:


> yeah coastalfaller, i just mean the necessity of a course like that within the industry. i guess i'm just kinda choked that it's ten grand for a month of training, my biology degree wont cost that much over 4 full time years.
> 
> i can see why a company doesnt want to spend the money training someone who will not turn out to be a loyal employee but its like that in every profession.
> 
> ...


 
I hear ya. Check out bcforestsafe.org to see where the money goes. 

On average, to do it right, it costs minimum $40 000 (and that's being conservative) for a company breaking in a faller between the costs for wages for trainee and faller, lost production, safety, time off the stump, etc, etc.. 

No worries, doesn't hurt to ask questions!


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## coastalfaller (Apr 12, 2011)

I guess if they can teach you the basics so you at least have some knowledge and theory of it in practice that's a good thing. My question is, is it enough?


Absolutely not! In my opinion, when the guys get through the course then they are ready to start breaking in. And that's where the right attitude comes in. If you come out of there with the impression that now you're a "faller", you'll be sadly mistaken. The guys that succeed know their place. I don't mean that to sound arrogant, but the newbies have to have the respect both for the job and the men already doing it successfully. You don't have to be a wallflower, but eyes and ears wide open is a good start!


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## Gologit (Apr 12, 2011)

coastalfaller said:


> I guess if they can teach you the basics so you at least have some knowledge and theory of it in practice that's a good thing. My question is, is it enough?
> 
> 
> Absolutely not! In my opinion, when the guys get through the course then they are ready to start breaking in. And that's where the right attitude comes in. If you come out of there with the impression that now you're a "faller", you'll be sadly mistaken. The guys that succeed know their place. I don't mean that to sound arrogant, but the newbies have to have the respect both for the job and the men already doing it successfully. You don't have to be a wallflower, but eyes and ears wide open is a good start!


 
Well said.


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## Gologit (Apr 12, 2011)

nw axe man said:


> .... It's a huge responsibility to turn someone loose in the woods with just enough information and training to get him hurt or killed.
> 
> 
> ... I don't want to be that guy that sends someone out with too little information and training. This is a business that is OJT but at the same time you have to have someone who is knowledgable to help you survive.


 
Exactly. I take very few trainees anymore for just that reason. The last guy I taught to fall was my nephew. He'd been in the woods all his life, had a good attitude, and he did alright but it's still a worrisome process. He worked with me for two seasons before I turned him loose and I still stop and wonder if there wasn't something else I should have mentioned or shown or cautioned him about. He's doing fine...but I still think about it.

New guys screw up...that's a given. You allow for that because it's part of the process. Always has been, always will be. You show them the best you can, show them what they did wrong and how to fix it, show them how to keep a mistake from becoming a disaster, show them how to keep it from happening again...and hope it sinks in.


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## northwest coast (Apr 13, 2011)

do you think the big price tag for the course is partly meant to shy people away so that it keeps joe shmo from thinking falling is the answer to his jobless problems ? 

i mean, you'd have to really want to be a committed faller to pay ten grand to do it right ? if thats the case then i disagree with it, because it might keep the right but also the wrong people out of the industry. 

an alternative ? i don't know, maybe a hiring pool where demonstrated skills and written exams allow only people who are worth training into a group whereby the company can choose from and take them on. ten thousand dollar course or not, the company will have to invest a lot into a new recruit. 

also, most people with previous falling experience got it before that course existed. paradoxical, no ? 

it encourages me to get rogue training and challenge the exam. 

thanks everyone for letting me vent, and helping me see both sides of the issue. i'm keeping an open mind about it.


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## coastalfaller (Apr 13, 2011)

northwest coast said:


> do you think the big price tag for the course is partly meant to shy people away so that it keeps joe shmo from thinking falling is the answer to his jobless problems ?
> 
> i mean, you'd have to really want to be a committed faller to pay ten grand to do it right ? if thats the case then i disagree with it, because it might keep the right but also the wrong people out of the industry.
> 
> ...


 
I know the industry recognizes there is going to be a shortage very soon and there is a push afoot to make a change to the current system of training fallers.

Many of the people who take the training right now, either have the money or are sponsored to take it, either through government programs or First Nations. Currently, I don't believe many end up in the industry afterward.


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## madhatte (Apr 13, 2011)

coastalfaller said:


> Currently, I don't believe many end up in the industry afterward.



Sounds to me like ten grand a head is just a revenue stream. For training to mean anything, it needs to be first and foremost available. 

The argument that "it costs at least that to break in a new guy" is a point sort-of-well-taken; sure there are expenses in training, but if a business makes that investment in an employee, they are going to do so with the understanding that the employee will not only stick around long enough to pay for that expense, but that the business will, in the end, make a profit.

For a government agency to take on that process as an expense to the employee, and to expect the business to accept their "blessing" of said employee as gospel, undermines the ages-old tradition of apprenticeship, by which knowledge is passed from one generation to the next. In this system, the government behaves as though they are a timeless entity and that generations don't matter. Nothing could be farther from the truth.

A better way to approach standardization in training is to take a page from the Wildfire world; there are standardized training modules, sure, but someone in the field with the proper experience has to bottom-line a qualification. In a commercial environment, that would be the equivalent of a crew boss being responsible for keeping track of training and certification for crew members. If I'm not mistaken, that's pretty much how it's already done elsewhere. 

Wasn't it Jefferson who said "The Government governs best which governs least"?


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## hammerlogging (Apr 13, 2011)

If experience can really get you out of the class, sounds to me like I can get some BC hopeful fallers to come work for me for a year or two at a time, heck they don't even have to pay me 10 grand, then I'll ship them back ready to go!!!!

On another note, I believe its been suggested before that this has something to do with the inherent dangers of the trade coupled with the nationalized health care-- prevention is cheaper. Maybe?


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## madhatte (Apr 13, 2011)

hammerlogging said:


> prevention is cheaper



I bet it is, on paper. I still believe in apprenticeship.


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## RandyMac (Apr 13, 2011)

madhatte said:


> I bet it is, on paper. * I still believe in apprenticeship.*


 

I do also, even after having been an indentured servant.


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## northwest coast (Apr 14, 2011)

your right on the money with that one hammerlogging. i would have to work for a few months to save up enough dough for that course, why wouldn't i try to get experience instead, and not only save money, but make it gaining the experience. 

funny though, just what they are trying to prevent is what i am forced to do. 

canadian health care ? yeah thats a valid point, i've even heard it argued on the radio that paying for people to quit smoking will be cheaper for tax payers in the long run. thats canadian through and through. i've always thought that insurance companies rule the world, this is just one more bit of evidence. 

i think the bc forest safety council lost funding and is trying to maintain their inflated salaries.


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## gavin (Apr 14, 2011)

You'll get a different opinion from everybody about the certification program. Everybody thinks it's over priced, but to be fair the instructors aren't going to do it for nothing. Some guys like certain aspects of the certification. From talking to the older guys I work with, in the past when things got busy lots of companies would lower their standards (or throw them out completely) and hire as many "crummy stuffers" as they could just to get wood on the ground. I've heard so many stories from the past about guys bull####ting their way into a job and getting sent home after a day or two. That's not cheap for companies either. I know some guys would like it to be more like a recognized trade too.

I broke in recently. I was able to challenge the course from my experience as a forest fire fighter previously. I was saving up frantically to do the course because you need a decent amount of experience to be able to challenge it. When I was applying for work (it took a long time get on with a company do to the markets and shortage of work) I told every company I applied with the truth: that I was confident with basic falling skills, but I still had to get broken in. Everybody told me it cost them $50,000-60,000 to break a guy in. I made an agreement with the guys that broke me in that I would stick around and be loyal to them for the opportunity they gave me. One thing is that I definitely had my eyes blown wide open when I started my first shift. The size of the trees doesn't really mean much, it was the steep, broken ground with rock bluffs and salal over my head and ridiculous amounts of rotten cedar/hemlock hangups involving 10 or 15 trees that really shocked me. I was in camp with a guy who had been falling for something crazy like 40 years or something like that and he said if someone told him one day he'd be working in his type of ground he would have told them they were crazy. Hahaha.


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## Big_Wood (Aug 2, 2014)

Think of it this way guys. They put a QST out in the woods with 2 guys to train. These QST's don't just train for free. Now let's think of what the BC fallers make a month at full rate. Over $10,000 on a good month. So let's say the course is a month and also that these QST's deserve to be paid more then a production faller. So between 2 guys they're bringing in $20,000 and those QST's gotta be making around $16,000 of that. That's $4000 going into the forest safety council desk jobs lets call them. I'm currently working on going through with this and I tell you, the forest safety council don't even have a clue. First they're telling me this date, then this date, then all of the sudden a course gets canceled a week in because WCB showed up on site and busted a QST with to many guys at the stump and now they cancelled another course because of high fire risks.The cost of the course at $10,000 a head made sense to me but the course is now $17,000. I know a few QST's and they are outraged because even though the cost of the course went up they ain't getting paid anymore. So my opinion on the whole thing is that the cost to get into forestry was fair to start but it has since turned into a money grab. Non profit my ass. I know Bill Boardman who is one of the highest regarded QST's in BC and he is absolutely sick of seeing who is going through that course. I was just sitting down have a coffee and a ******** with him last week about this very matter. Just cause a guy has the money to pay for the course does not mean it's a job for him. The EI thing drives me nuts. You got hard working individuals who have never been on EI but it seems the lazy sack of ***** going on EI every year get the privilege of funding for this course. I know so many flakes who go on EI every winter and say they can't find work. Such a bunch of BS. These people just have to suck it up and do something they don't want to do. As bill told me, if a guy is going into falling for the money he is way more likely to get seriously hurt or killed doing his job then someone going cause they truelly want to do it as a career. A faller is 10x more likely to get killed doing his job then a police officer in a city with the highest crime rate in the world. A faller is also 15x more likely to have a crippling life changing injury then a pro NFL football player. The guys who got money on the mind should just stay away and go do something else for a living.


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## cupar (Aug 2, 2014)

I've got experience felling in the most difficult of terrain around very dangerous hazards. However I don't have lots experience running 80cc+ saws with 32"+ bars felling trees 100'+ tall. I'm lucky to cut 75' trees and unfortunately I've been able to cut alot of 40"+ trees lately but they're inner city so I've had to cut their tops off first leaving on 30' or shorter stems. I really would like to do the BC faller course as it is valued here in Alberta even if it isn't a requirement for anything. I just can't justify $10k. I can cut a 160' spruce in the rocky mountains beside a high voltage powerline with a 75cc saw and 3 wedges but I can't cross that line on a map into BC. There's alot I need to learn about felling tree's to have them easy to recover and not damage the wood. Until they change the course to make it possible for me to go, it just won't happen. I'd love to be a professional faller but I don't know if I'd be any good having my bad habits for doing powerline work.


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## Big_Wood (Aug 2, 2014)

Cupar, the requirements for challenging the course these days is a minimum 2 years falling experience ending within 3 months of the falling course challenge. Other then that challenging the course is very rare these days as no one has legit 2 year term falling tree's. A lot of guys from BC go do their enform ticket in Alberta cause it is so much cheaper then come over after 2 years to challenge the BC course. Way cheaper but a way longer path for certification the fall here in BC. You sound like you meet the requirements to challenge the course. If your serious about it give the forest safety council a call.


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## cupar (Aug 2, 2014)

I had my chainsaw faller competency level 3. Supplied training from my previous employer and they kept my Transportation of dangerous goods and my faller cert when I left and a few other cert's that they paid the training for, however those 2 I've never gotten back and they can't seem to find me in their system. However I believe the people on the phone find it alot easier to brush me off then actually look.


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