# A License to Shampoo: Jobs Needing State Approval Rise



## rmihalek (Feb 7, 2011)

Article in today's Wall Street Journal about how certain professions are "clamoring for more rules" regarding licensing, continuing education, etc. The article specifically mentions tree trimmers along with tattoo artists, cat groomers and music therapists. The author slightly redeems herself by admitting that "untrained electricians or tree-trimmers could put innocent bystanders in danger."

A License to Shampoo: Jobs Needing State Approval Rise - WSJ.com]Arts, Entertainment News, Music, Film, Television, Opera & Ballet News at WSJ.com - WSJ.com


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## hanniedog (Feb 7, 2011)

Why would anyone with more than two active brain cells want more gov rules and regs?


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## pdqdl (Feb 7, 2011)

'cause they were both (the two active brain cells) on the left side?


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## rmihalek (Feb 8, 2011)

Certification and regulation promote a more highly educated workforce. 99.9% of the time I want less gov't involvement and less bureaucracy, but tree work is a case where human lives can be saved by better training and the forests (urban, suburban and rural) can be saved by better education.

As an example, in my area which has been hit by the asian longhorn beetle, maybe tree crews were taking down affected maples for a couple years before someone realized what was happening. (I'm just guessing here.) They could've been hauling diseased wood away from job sites and without knowing it spreading the larvae.

But, a more highly educated work force stands a greater chance of spotting these types of problems and perhaps stopping the problem before it spreads. There are no guarantees but the odds are better if the guys know about pathogens, diseases, treatments, etc.


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## John Paul Sanborn (Feb 8, 2011)

hanniedog said:


> Why would anyone with more than two active brain cells want more gov rules and regs?


 
How can we complain about low-balling hacks if we do not want some means to control them?


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## hanniedog (Feb 8, 2011)

JPS how are more rules and regs going to effect your "hacks" when they pay no attention to them any way?


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## CNBTreeTrimming (Feb 8, 2011)

hanniedog said:


> JPS how are more rules and regs going to effect your "hacks" when they pay no attention to them any way?


Agreed! Already no license or insurance, so do they care bout more regs? Negative Ghost Rider!


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## John Paul Sanborn (Feb 8, 2011)

only if enforced, I am still PO'd that a hack company that killed an illegal worker is still in business here. With what is supposed to have happened they should have been broken.


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## ducaticorse (Feb 8, 2011)

John Paul Sanborn said:


> only if enforced, I am still PO'd that a hack company that killed an illegal worker is still in business here. With what is supposed to have happened they should have been broken.


 
Enforcement is the key.


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## brookpederson (Feb 15, 2011)

So true! My wife needs a license to cut hair, my friend who is one of the better tattoo artists I've seen has to apprentice for 2500 hrs! But anyone with a chainsaw and a set of brass balls can cut trees, which in my opinion is crazy. Think about that , 2500 hrs that's 62 forty hour weeks before you can practice on your own..? :monkey:


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## John Paul Sanborn (Feb 15, 2011)

brookpederson said:


> So true! My wife needs a license to cut hair, my friend who is one of the better tattoo artists I've seen has to apprentice for 2500 hrs! But anyone with a chainsaw and a set of brass balls can cut trees, which in my opinion is crazy. Think about that , 2500 hrs that's 62 forty hour weeks before you can practice on your own..? :monkey:


 
How many diseases can a bad ink-man or barber vector? There is a history behind that type of regulation. There was a story not too long ago, about illegal nail shops that were spreading a serious nail fungus around the city. Our bad operators rarely hurt people, they just mess up trees an cost property owners money, usually many years after the fact.


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## lxt (Feb 15, 2011)

John Paul Sanborn said:


> Our bad operators rarely hurt people, they just mess up trees an cost property owners money, usually many years after the fact.


 

I dont know about that! around here they`re usually hurting someone or something & as far as costing the HO money for a "hacked" tree..........maybe the HO wanted it trimmed that way???

I still get asked to top trees & do things that go against the code of ethics........I walk away not knowing if they really are serious or if its a test? Ill ride by a week or two later & bam...trees are topped!

so regulating the business without regulating the field is not gonna work!!! & honestly Im not for regulations anyway.............they wont work & the implementation of enforcing it would be costly...........especially when the Govt. is battling over how to lower the deficit!!!




LXT................


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## Nailsbeats (Feb 15, 2011)

So a few homeowners get some sub quality work. Big deal, that's life and it happens from time to time, I think most adults can deal with that. 

The solution is not government regulation, what that does is cost all tax payers (homeowners) and we all get sub quality enforcement/performance. 

As a homeowner my self I advise others to quit crying about your hacked up trees and find a company that does good work, take responsibility instead of looking to pass blame. Passing blame and whining to government will ultimately cost everyone more. Hey, then we could be like Canada, eh.


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## treemandan (Feb 15, 2011)

Nailsbeats said:


> So a few homeowners get some sub quality work. Big deal, that's life and it happens from time to time, I think most adults can deal with that.
> 
> The solution is not government regulation, what that does is cost all tax payers (homeowners) and we all get sub quality enforcement/performance.
> 
> As a homeowner my self I advise others to quit crying about your hacked up trees and find a company that does good work, take responsibility instead of looking to pass blame. Passing blame and whining to government will ultimately cost everyone more. Hey, then we could be like Canada, eh.


 
Most people would not know good work from bad but only cheap from expensive. Just because you people out there are able to fend for yourselves don't mean these people can.
That was one thing I wasnted to bring up about our education system... man, sure seems to pump out a lot of idiots and BS. I think they need to teach Home Economics througout college. I think what they are teaching is the loopholes one can use to circumnavigate around the basic principles, that work is not good and the better man gets someone else to do it. In fact, they have change the definition of work.


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## treeclimber101 (Feb 15, 2011)

Nailsbeats said:


> So a few homeowners get some sub quality work. Big deal, that's life and it happens from time to time, I think most adults can deal with that.
> 
> The solution is not government regulation, what that does is cost all tax payers (homeowners) and we all get sub quality enforcement/performance.
> 
> As a homeowner my self I advise others to quit crying about your hacked up trees and find a company that does good work, take responsibility instead of looking to pass blame. Passing blame and whining to government will ultimately cost everyone more. Hey, then we could be like Canada, eh.


 
Thank you , exactly ....Who cares about good work , all they care about is CHEAP , and the contractors will stand in line to give them exactly what they ask for , and its funny to here contractors complain about one another and make jokes when all I see is one trying to cut the throat of another , and the HO is at the root of it all , grabbing those gimmicks that these tards put out there like "WE'LL BEAT ANY COMPETITORS WRITTEN PRICE BY 50 BUCKS " these are the real criminals they drive the local prices down so low that it takes years to fix ... If the guy gets the tree down without ####ing something up the HO and the contractor are thrilled ...


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## treemandan (Feb 15, 2011)

treeclimber101 said:


> Thank you , exactly ....Who cares about good work , all they care about is CHEAP , and the contractors will stand in line to give them exactly what they ask for , and its funny to here contractors complain about one another and make jokes when all I see is one trying to cut the throat of another , and the HO is at the root of it all , grabbing those gimmicks that these tards put out there like "WE'LL BEAT ANY COMPETITORS WRITTEN PRICE BY 50 BUCKS " these are the real criminals they drive the local prices down so low that it takes years to fix ... If the guy gets the tree down without ####ing something up the HO and the contractor are thrilled ...


 
And some of these guys are all licensed and certified. Its true the gimmicks obscure the bad work and bury the good.


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## lxt (Feb 15, 2011)

treeclimber101 said:


> Thank you , exactly ....Who cares about good work , all they care about is CHEAP , and the contractors will stand in line to give them exactly what they ask for , and its funny to here contractors complain about one another and make jokes when all I see is one trying to cut the throat of another , and the HO is at the root of it all , grabbing those gimmicks that these tards put out there like "WE'LL BEAT ANY COMPETITORS WRITTEN PRICE BY 50 BUCKS " these are the real criminals they drive the local prices down so low that it takes years to fix ... If the guy gets the tree down without ####ing something up the HO and the contractor are thrilled ...


 

Honestly, I dont see anything wrong with "sales gimmicks", anyone here who has bought a car has been subjected to such, hell....beating someones price by $50 is nothing compared to what the Govt is doing to those 1st time homebuyers who got a tax credit in 2008! everyone has a salespitch...its after the sale that counts.

Here if you dont offer a discount, senior, vet or other you wont be considered!!! there are those here who advertise that they`ll beat the lowest price no matter what!........we have many businesses who use this tactic, everyone from......home builders, carpet & flooring, restaurants, lawn, landscape, window installers, cleaners & yes even tree services!!!!!

think of no gimmick no potential customer......if it gets me in front of em (a gimmick) Ill use one every time.....BUT, I educate them & explain proper tree care thats all you can do & it either works or doesnt! believe me I have bid jobs that if you discounted them $50 from what the competition bid..........you would work for free!!!



LXT..............


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## lxt (Feb 15, 2011)

treemandan said:


> And some of these guys are all licensed and certified. Its true the gimmicks obscure the bad work and bury the good.


 

Not all so true, I mean..........things can be said about the guy who promotes his biz from a station wagon with no work comp & rents all his tools along with having his buddies help him out of which none have proper liability insurance to sub their services..................did I mention these are cash jobs & not reported???

funny how some/many will work just as I have mentioned above, they claim enough of those cash jobs to report...but not all of it..............And some would take issue with a sales "gimmick"?.........thats the least of worries, hell its almost laughable compared to the above.

Danno............you once made a statement about what a business is to certain people............for instance: your biz model is different from mine & mine is different from tc101`s................does that make any one of ours better than the others? everyone runs their biz their way & certain areas use different tactics......doesnt make it wrong or mean that work is obscured for good or bad, its just a different way.......! $50 bucks if you lose a job cuz of that...well hey dont be salty over it....JUST GIVE A DISCOUNT ON TOP OF WHAT THE COMPETITION DOES!! only a tard would walk away beat!!


LXT.................


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## treemandan (Feb 15, 2011)

lxt said:


> Not all so true, I mean..........things can be said about the guy who promotes his biz from a station wagon with no work comp & rents all his tools along with having his buddies help him out of which none have proper liability insurance to sub their services..................did I mention these are cash jobs & not reported???
> 
> funny how some/many will work just as I have mentioned above, they claim enough of those cash jobs to report...but not all of it..............And some would take issue with a sales "gimmick"?.........thats the least of worries, hell its almost laughable compared to the above.
> 
> ...


 
I know IX, gimmicks don't kill people, people with gimmicks kill people.


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## BC WetCoast (Feb 16, 2011)

Nailsbeats said:


> Hey, then we could be like Canada, eh.



You should be so freaking lucky.


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## lxt (Feb 16, 2011)

treemandan said:


> I know IX, gimmicks don't kill people, people with gimmicks kill people.


 


Thats an unfounded statement! People without the right skillset, knowledge, education, etc... are the ones who bring danger to the workplace/site.

I highly doubt anyone offering a $50 discount or using the slogan "will beat any written price" are out there "killing" people! kinda like the gun argument uh....guns dont kill...people do!!

I have actually offered "free" gift when you hire us in my advertisements, a buddy of mine worked for a wholesale organization & was loaded with tons of product, he wanted rid of the cutlery, 4 slice toasters, gym bags, camping tents, etc.. so we made a deal...........if I landed jobs based on the offered free gift he would get a kickback!! after all these items were obtained free........it worked like a charm!

I landed more work than I could handle!!, he got his basement cleaned out & made money to boot..................yep, that gimmick killed people.....My competition!

sometimes danno.......your rebuttals to a posts are a little.......eh, out there!!!!




LXT................


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## lxt (Feb 16, 2011)

Funny, even some of the site sponsors have gimmicks to lure you in & ultimately take your money......2 free leads uh? anyway......some will take your money & some gimmicks may save you money........I prefer to save money!!!


LXT............


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## Kottonwood (Feb 16, 2011)

*state licensing*

I am just starting my own business. I have been going it on my own for a couple of months now and I must say I wish that in Colorado there was state licensing, not to protect the people from the hacks, because even with state licensing I am sure they will still be around.

The reason I would like state licensing is because it is such a pain in the ass that every little town requires their own license. I already have four separate licenses and I still can't legally work the whole Denver metro area. Luckily most places will accept other town's licenses without you having to take the written and practical exams, but you still have to pay a fee and go down to the office etc etc. Plus keeping track of when they all expire, it would just be much easier to have one state one. 

Also, what if there is a major ice or wind storm somewhere else in CO, if that specific area requires a tree license are they really not going to let other CO companies come in for storm response?


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## ducaticorse (Feb 16, 2011)

I can't comment on the lead service referenced above, but I can on the one I use. I've been very happy with the leads, and I have capitalized 100 fold on the fees involved. They aren't all bad...


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## treemandan (Feb 16, 2011)

lxt said:


> Thats an unfounded statement! People without the right skillset, knowledge, education, etc... are the ones who bring danger to the workplace/site.
> 
> I highly doubt anyone offering a $50 discount or using the slogan "will beat any written price" are out there "killing" people! kinda like the gun argument uh....guns dont kill...people do!!
> 
> ...


 
Actually it wasn't a rebuttal, I was agreeing with you. :msp_unsure: Sorry to be so vague.
I said that the gimmick itself wasn't that bad ( but can be) and that it takes the wrong person weilding it to make trouble. That is what said, I admit I said it funny. And I also say that the last thing I will be drawn in with is a gimmick. I tell them to keep the gimmick, I will pay full price, just make sure all the problems are taken care of before you tell me its done.

I have a gimmick for ya! Ya dumb boondock! Dam dude, you don't need a hard hat do ya?

Actaully I do have some:

1. Free Trees - they are about as big as your pinky finger ... and a donation would be nice.
2. Free Ho chainsaw safety classes - That's were I make fun of you and yer saw
3. Money saving coupons - The more you spend the more you save!

But you and I don't sell snake oil. A gimmick in the wrong hands is just like gun, or like a badge. The person who has it has a sort of power over those who don't. Yes, I am out there brotherman.


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## treemandan (Feb 16, 2011)

And I really do tell the salesman to stop right there and just give me the bottom line right from the start. If he is able to do that then the gimmicks stop being gimmicks and start being amenities. 
I am sure to include the amenities written in the proposals I write.

Chose one:

Gimmick OR Amenity

Which would you rather?

And that kinda explains what I meant about definition obscurity these days. Do you buy a car from a car dealer or do you go to the car store?

The Real Dan, not me, but the real one, the one before me and the one after sayeth this: One must be impeccable with his words for if not he shall fall into the abyss of obscurity.

And I didn't mean Treeco when i said The Real Dan, but The Real Dan is out there, watching, knowing, being - in all of us.


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## treemandan (Feb 16, 2011)

And before I go rewire the trailer I do want to let you guys know that it is actually the very first rule of being. To be immpecable with your words. There is 45 pages in summary of the dissertation of this alone but if anyone wants me to expand on it I will. If this very hard rule to follow would be followed then we would not be here talking about what we are talking about.


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## treemandan (Feb 16, 2011)

And when someone says they will beat out all other prices BOY did they just say a mouthful. What did they just say?:msp_blink:
While still being immpeccable at their word they offer a gimmick rather an amenity.
That is the second part of The Real Dan's teachings. I dunno if yer ready. :msp_laugh:


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## treemandan (Feb 16, 2011)

Are you heeding The Way of The Dan Ducaticourse? :msp_thumbup:


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## treemandan (Feb 16, 2011)

treemandan said:


> I know IX, gimmicks don't kill people, people with gimmicks kill people.


 
And yes, I might have stretched this a little bit but still...


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## pdqdl (Feb 16, 2011)

I think you're over the top today, Dan. That's SIX posts in a row on just one thread.

That may be a record!


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## treemandan (Feb 16, 2011)

pdqdl said:


> I think you're over the top today, Dan. That's SIX posts in a row on just one thread.
> 
> That may be a record!


 
Plus the one I started in the off topic forum about me wanting to be your spiritual leader.
I also got the trailer done and made bunch of calls. One of which was with a gent who is offering 750 a day as top rate for a climber.
Now I know I just said alot right there, its all true and I am not wanting to start a riot. You all know what I just said and all that goes with it I cannot deny.

Over the top? No, right on... its just that looks can be deceiving and that is why being impeccable with your words is so important. Think about the kinds of people who try to be so imppecable. Ya can't blame a man for calling a spade a spade, its when you ask for a spade and he tries to pawn off a shovel. See? Simple stuff really though very important if you are wanting to be on the up and up.


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## treemandan (Feb 16, 2011)

And that 750 would be strictly on the books. i know, amazing isn't it?


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## treeclimber101 (Feb 16, 2011)

lxt said:


> Honestly, I dont see anything wrong with "sales gimmicks", anyone here who has bought a car has been subjected to such, hell....beating someones price by $50 is nothing compared to what the Govt is doing to those 1st time homebuyers who got a tax credit in 2008! everyone has a salespitch...its after the sale that counts.
> 
> Here if you dont offer a discount, senior, vet or other you wont be considered!!! there are those here who advertise that they`ll beat the lowest price no matter what!........we have many businesses who use this tactic, everyone from......home builders, carpet & flooring, restaurants, lawn, landscape, window installers, cleaners & yes even tree services!!!!!
> 
> ...


 
Honestly I don't care about your business or the way you run it , I don't even care about the ones here that actually affect me , BUT it a SCUMMY GIMMICK bottom line , and if another contractor wants too best another do it with the quality of work produced ....Not by killing the entire market WITH SMOKE AND MIRRORS ...


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## pdqdl (Feb 16, 2011)

For $750 per day, I think the highway off-ramps near his business would be jammed with traffic from all the good climbers trying to go to work.


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## pdqdl (Feb 16, 2011)

treemandan said:


> ... Ya can't blame a man for calling a spade a spade, its when you ask for a spade and he tries to pawn off a shovel. ...


 
From Wikipedia:
To "call a spade a spade" is to speak honestly and directly about a topic, specifically topics that others may avoid speaking about due to their sensitivity or embarrassing nature. Brewer’s Dictionary of Phrase and Fable (1913) defines it as
“ To be outspoken, blunt, even to the point of rudeness; to call things by their proper names without any "beating about the bush". ”

Its ultimate source is Plutarch's Apophthegmata Laconica (178B) which has την σκαφην σκαφην λεγοντας (ten skafen skafen legontas). σκαφη (skafe) means "basin, trough", but it was mis-translated as ligo "shovel" by Erasmus in his Apophthegmatum opus. Lucian De Hist. Conscr. (41) has τα συκα συκα, την σκαφην δε σκαφην ονομασων (ta suka suka, ten skafen de skafen onomason) "calling a fig a fig, and a trough a trough".

The phrase was introduced to English in 1542 in Nicolas Udall's translation of Erasmus, Apophthegmes, that is to saie, prompte saiynges. First gathered by Erasmus:

Philippus aunswered, that the Macedonians wer feloes of no fyne witte in their termes but altogether grosse, clubbyshe, and rusticall, as they whiche had not the witte to calle a spade by any other name then a spade.

It is evident that the word spade refers to the instrument used to move earth, a very common tool. The same word was used in England and in Holland, Erasmus' country of origin.

The Oxford English Dictionary records a more forceful variant, "*to call a spade a bloody shovel*", attested since 1919. It is clear that the term shovel is used as a comparable but bigger tool than a spade.[citation needed]

The phrase predates the use of the word "spade" as an ethnic slur against African-Americans, which was not recorded until 1928; however, in contemporary U.S. society, the idiom is often avoided due to potential confusion with the slur.[1]

Who would have thought that the phrase goes back over 1900 years?


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## treemandan (Feb 16, 2011)

pdqdl said:


> From Wikipedia:
> To "call a spade a spade" is to speak honestly and directly about a topic, specifically topics that others may avoid speaking about due to their sensitivity or embarrassing nature. Brewer’s Dictionary of Phrase and Fable (1913) defines it as
> “ To be outspoken, blunt, even to the point of rudeness; to call things by their proper names without any "beating about the bush". ”
> 
> ...


 
But still it does not go back as far as The Dan does.




To be outspoken, blunt, even to the point of rudeness; to call things by their proper names without any "beating about the bush". ”

And this is how my own father describes me, well, he doesn't use those nice words.


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## lxt (Feb 17, 2011)

treeclimber101 said:


> Honestly I don't care about your business or the way you run it , I don't even care about the ones here that actually affect me , BUT it a SCUMMY GIMMICK bottom line , and if another contractor wants too best another do it with the quality of work produced ....Not by killing the entire market WITH SMOKE AND MIRRORS ...


 
Gimmicks dont kill the market & to think that is self opinionated! SOooo...I offer a free gift when you hire my service, thats killing the biz?........I think not, its making the competition mad cuz they didnt think of it first or cant do it!!!

"sales pitches", "gimmicks" have been around forever & if you think thats what is ruining our trade or what is causing your biz problems........well then you need to think of a different biz model..........*yeah the guy who has no insurance, pays the group of 4+ employees with multiple DUI`s $8 hr under the table is a much better biz man than the one using sales incentives!! *

that last line is what is ruining our trade......not someone offering a senior discount, $50 discount, or a match & beat pricing promotion!! these types of solicitation have been around forever & will be around a lot longer.........its the biz that dont conform or create a customer "pop" who will be bagging groceries at wally world............& *if a "gimmick" put you there? then you deserved it!!*


LXT..............


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## treemandan (Feb 17, 2011)

lxt said:


> Gimmicks dont kill the market & to think that is self opinionated! SOooo...I offer a free gift when you hire my service, thats killing the biz?........I think not, its making the competition mad cuz they didnt think of it first or cant do it!!!
> 
> "sales pitches", "gimmicks" have been around forever & if you think thats what is ruining our trade or what is causing your biz problems........well then you need to think of a different biz model..........*yeah the guy who has no insurance, pays the group of 4+ employees with multiple DUI`s $8 hr under the table is a much better biz man than the one using sales incentives!! *
> 
> ...


 
Drop it bro, you don't do gimmicks anyway,you provide amenities. Its like you didn't hear a word I said.


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## lxt (Feb 17, 2011)

treemandan said:


> Drop it bro, you don't do gimmicks anyway,you provide amenities. Its like you didn't hear a word I said.


 
I wasnt replying to your post, I was making a general statement in regards to gimmicks!...........Danno, are you sure you`re using the word amenity in the right context???? 

now we are an amenity service.....LOL



LXT................


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## treeclimber101 (Feb 17, 2011)

lxt said:


> Gimmicks dont kill the market & to think that is self opinionated! SOooo...I offer a free gift when you hire my service, thats killing the biz?........I think not, its making the competition mad cuz they didnt think of it first or cant do it!!!
> 
> "sales pitches", "gimmicks" have been around forever & if you think thats what is ruining our trade or what is causing your biz problems........well then you need to think of a different biz model..........*yeah the guy who has no insurance, pays the group of 4+ employees with multiple DUI`s $8 hr under the table is a much better biz man than the one using sales incentives!! *
> 
> ...


 Why do you take everything so personal ? Like I am speaking to you , I have a right to MY OPINION like I said I don't care what you do ... I don't even ask about other people bidding on my work , I just don't give a #### period , BUT when I take the time and money to be prompt to bid work and some D head runs and ad that says get prices and call us last , or we'll beat any written estimate , I THINK ITS SCUMMY... If thats how you bid thats great , seems like you can save a lot of gas all the people need to do is fax the bid to you with an address and when they want the work done and you go and bill 50 bucks less , RIGHT ..... Or is it a gimmick same product just cheaper ...It doesn't matter what the tree looks like or location its 50 bucks less... They can bid 1000.00 on a 3000.00 tree and you'll do it for 950.00 or are you full of #### ... Thats your angle with this , or do you think up some BS to sidestep that just to get you on the property , and now I am addressing you directly .. At least when I bid I speak directly to the HO and they express there concerns and I try to accomodate them within there budget .. Flat out


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## treeclimber101 (Feb 17, 2011)

Now back on topic I love the idea of a national license allowing to tree company to move from state to state to work where work needs to be done .. On the state level think if they enforce it than I am on board but to hammer every tax paying business and allow the others to slide under the wire is not gonna work , they need an auditor to constantly persue and enforce fines ..


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## lxt (Feb 17, 2011)

treeclimber101 said:


> Why do you take everything so personal ? Like I am speaking to you , I have a right to MY OPINION like I said I don't care what you do ... I don't even ask about other people bidding on my work , I just don't give a #### period , BUT when I take the time and money to be prompt to bid work and some D head runs and ad that says get prices and call us last , or we'll beat any written estimate , I THINK ITS SCUMMY... If thats how you bid thats great , seems like you can save a lot of gas all the people need to do is fax the bid to you with an address and when they want the work done and you go and bill 50 bucks less , RIGHT ..... Or is it a gimmick same product just cheaper ...It doesn't matter what the tree looks like or location its 50 bucks less... They can bid 1000.00 on a 3000.00 tree and you'll do it for 950.00 or are you full of #### ... Thats your angle with this , or do you think up some BS to sidestep that just to get you on the property , and now I am addressing you directly .. At least when I bid I speak directly to the HO and they express there concerns and I try to accomodate them within there budget .. Flat out


 

ahh 101.........whew, dont de-nut yourself with too tight a legstrap ole boy!! I really dont care what your opinion is & you can address me directly all you want south of my belts border! you and I dont see eye to eye & prolly never will.

the problem is......as was stated in my post! if gimmicks upset you, you think thats skummy, you dont like it.........get use to it cause everyone uses a sales tactic, my biz does very well with the tactics I use & I keep things professional!! I dont get why you think something that works is so bad...............unless its being used against you & your competition is doing better than you??? 

funny how you didnt address the the bold parts of my post..........cause thats what is ruining our trade!



LXT.................


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## lxt (Feb 17, 2011)

treeclimber101 said:


> Now back on topic I love the idea of a national license allowing to tree company to move from state to state to work where work needs to be done .. On the state level think if they enforce it than I am on board but to hammer every tax paying business and allow the others to slide under the wire is not gonna work , they need an auditor to constantly persue and enforce fines ..


 

yeah, that wont cost tax payers too much!! why do people think (and Im addressing you directly) that a license & auditing is the solution.......this is America! & free enterprise is a right........people like you want to regulate the hell outta something for your own benefit because............."how can x tree serv. do that for so little...that job should be $3000.00 dollars"

If your wanting regulations because someone is operating illegally...........then turn em in!!! but when a legit service is kicking your azz on the bid front......through whatever means, then suck it up!! maybe his standard of living is different than yours.......when regulation is desired because certain companies dont like competition then bump that!! again its supply & demand........when you have 20 tree companies where there use to be 3...prices are gonna drop & you either go with the flow or change fields!!


LXT..............


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## treeclimber101 (Feb 17, 2011)

lxt said:


> ahh 101.........whew, dont de-nut yourself with too tight a legstrap ole boy!! I really dont care what your opinion is & you can address me directly all you want south of my belts border! you and I dont see eye to eye & prolly never will.
> 
> the problem is......as was stated in my post! if gimmicks upset you, you think thats skummy, you dont like it.........get use to it cause everyone uses a sales tactic, my biz does very well with the tactics I use & I keep things professional!! I dont get why you think something that works is so bad...............unless its being used against you & your competition is doing better than you???
> 
> ...


 Thats exactly what I figured you'd say .... I laugh at any of your nonsense ... Nobody here kicks my ### believe me , I can work 2 days a week for real money and laugh all the way to the bank while all of the donkies kill themselves for 5/6 and make the same , I didn't lower my prices I just found a better class of customer and treat them fair and they return the favor ... I work smarter not harder and since 1999 I have grown annually and without breaking a sweat ... I haven't touched a saw since the end of DEC.


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## treemandan (Feb 17, 2011)

lxt said:


> I wasnt replying to your post, I was making a general statement in regards to gimmicks!...........Danno, are you sure you`re using the word amenity in the right context????
> 
> now we are an amenity service.....LOL
> 
> ...


 
I know you weren't but we are all just talking and I hate to see you guys go back and forth argueing when we all want the same things and yes, I am using the word amenity in true form. It is a word with a few meanings, one of which is : something serving to comfort or accomodate. Sounds good ?:msp_cool:


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## treeclimber101 (Feb 18, 2011)

treemandan said:


> I know you weren't but we are all just talking and I hate to see you guys go back and forth argueing when we all want the same things and yes, I am using the word amenity in true form. It is a word with a few meanings, one of which is : something serving to comfort or accomodate. Sounds good ?:msp_cool:


 I actually think that your misunderstanding a lively debate thats all , I am not arguing I would have to actually care to argue ...


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## lxt (Feb 18, 2011)

treeclimber101 said:


> Nobody here kicks my ### believe me , I can work 2 days a week for real money and laugh all the way to the bank while all of the donkies kill themselves for 5/6 and make the same , I didn't lower my prices I just found a better class of customer and treat them fair and they return the favor ... I work smarter not harder and since 1999 I have grown annually and without breaking a sweat ... I haven't touched a saw since the end of DEC.


 

1- if nobody is kicking your but...then why complain about what they`re doing? I mean you`re laughing all the way to the bank!!

2-I dont have the lowest prices in my area by any means & I actually pay my guys much better than the competition!

3- "a better class of customer" this is what keeps ya going, Look... I bid with the rest of the vultures like everyone else primarily to inform the customer & educate them...............good way to try n fix the wrong doings in our trade.

working smarter n Not harder is my motto also, man.....to not touch a saw in over 2 months.....I enjoy my trade to much to allow that to happen!!!



LXT..................


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## treemandan (Feb 18, 2011)

treeclimber101 said:


> I actually think that your misunderstanding a lively debate thats all , I am not arguing I would have to actually care to argue ...


 
Oh stop, you care, that's why you're argueing... I mean having this livley debate.


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## treemandan (Feb 18, 2011)

"I haven't touched a saw since the end of DEC. "


That's nothing to brag about.:msp_huh:


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## pdqdl (Feb 18, 2011)

treeclimber101 said:


> Now back on topic I love the idea of a national license allowing to tree company to move from state to state to work where work needs to be done .. ..


 
That will NEVER happen. Even Doctors and Lawyers can only be licensed on a state by state level. And the lawyers are the ones that write the rules for everybody else.

You see, we have a constitution (in the USA), and the enforcement of that document has led to a concept called "States rights". Basically, the states are the governing body on most issues of our society.


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## beastmaster (Feb 18, 2011)

There are citys in LA where you can only use a pre-approved(by the city) tree care company and crazy fines if you butcher your own tree. 
I'm a borderline anarchist and hate regulations. I also hate it when I see a beautiful tree thats been growing for half a century turned into a hat rack.
Education has to be the answer. People have to be taught that topping, and lion tailing, will ruin their tree for ever. 
Lot of Older people think topping is propper tree care. Management Company's have to learn its false economy to butcher their trees.
Regulations aren't the answer I believe. Education and legal recourse against a company who does damage to a ho trees. Malpractice if you will. That would eliminate lot of the butchers. Hit them where it hurts. Beastmaster


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## prentice110 (Feb 18, 2011)

lxt said:


> think of no gimmick no potential customer......if it gets me in front of em (a gimmick) Ill use one every time.....BUT, I educate them & explain proper tree care thats all you can do & it either works or doesnt! believe me I have bid jobs that if you discounted them $50 from what the competition bid..........you would work for free!!!
> 
> 
> 
> LXT..............


 
Or pay to go to work, after you get a flat tire on the way to the job.


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## BC WetCoast (Feb 19, 2011)

beastmaster said:


> There are citys in LA where you can only use a pre-approved(by the city) tree care company and crazy fines if you butcher your own tree.
> I'm a borderline anarchist and hate regulations. I also hate it when I see a beautiful tree thats been growing for half a century turned into a hat rack.
> Education has to be the answer. People have to be taught that topping, and lion tailing, will ruin their tree for ever.
> Lot of Older people think topping is propper tree care. Management Company's have to learn its false economy to butcher their trees.
> Regulations aren't the answer I believe. Education and legal recourse against a company who does damage to a ho trees. Malpractice if you will. That would eliminate lot of the butchers. Hit them where it hurts. Beastmaster


 
And in order to have legal recourse against a company that does damage to a HO trees, you have to have regulations/bylaws etc.

As a licenced professional (Registered Professional Forester), I believe that licencing would be good for the trade. Not everyone would need to become licenced, but a licenced professional arborist would be required to prepare the prescription and sign off on the completion. Then if there is a problem, the person signing off can be charged with malpractice. Will it cost the HO more money, yup, but how many people go looking for the low ball lawyer/doctor/dentist? IMHO, we need to raise the respect of the industry above that of "Two Crackheads and a Pickup".


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## treeclimber101 (Feb 19, 2011)

treemandan said:


> "I haven't touched a saw since the end of DEC. "
> 
> 
> That's nothing to brag about.:msp_huh:


Sure it is , its the winter..I did touch one yesterday felt nice ...


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## treeclimber101 (Feb 19, 2011)

lxt said:


> 1- if nobody is kicking your but...then why complain about what they`re doing? I mean you`re laughing all the way to the bank!!
> 
> 2-I dont have the lowest prices in my area by any means & I actually pay my guys much better than the competition!
> 
> ...


Damn you must have a guilty consense or something I am not complaining but FLAT OUT you call people HACKS but yet you run with them right ... Your words" I bid with all the voltures " what wrongs are you fixing when someone has a dead tree in there yard and your only there to PRICE MATCH it .. YOUR driving down the market flat out , than that woman has a friend that calls you and another company you bid dirt cheap and the "other" guy actually has respect for himself and bids to make something not just hand to mouth , and he looks like a bandit for what he bids ... I find it really hard to believe that your doing anything out there thats not ultimately for your gain somehow , stop saying your using GIMMICKS to educate people cause your nose is growing ...


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## treeclimber101 (Feb 19, 2011)

pdqdl said:


> That will NEVER happen. Even Doctors and Lawyers can only be licensed on a state by state level. And the lawyers are the ones that write the rules for everybody else.
> 
> You see, we have a constitution (in the USA), and the enforcement of that document has led to a concept called "States rights". Basically, the states are the governing body on most issues of our society.


 
Gotcha ... I am sure that it will never happen but IT WOULD BE NICE. This state will have a real problem enforcing anything now there alittle tapped out ...


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## treeclimber101 (Feb 19, 2011)

treemandan said:


> Oh stop, you care, that's why you're argueing... I mean having this livley debate.


 
Well the truth hurts and saying something without covering it with sweet words sure brings them out ..


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## treeclimber101 (Feb 19, 2011)

Whatever happens happens , but it needs to be fair , if theres a license needed then the governing body needs to enforce it .. Not like this HICL that this state dumped on all the registered tax paying companies and the "other" guys basically laugh at it , it did nothing for the customer and costs me money that I have to somehow recoup lettering trucks , changing bid forms business cards all of it ..


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## John Paul Sanborn (Feb 19, 2011)

pdqdl said:


> That will NEVER happen. Even Doctors and Lawyers can only be licensed on a state by state level. And the lawyers are the ones that write the rules for everybody else.
> 
> You see, we have a constitution (in the USA), and the enforcement of that document has led to a concept called "States rights". Basically, the states are the governing body on most issues of our society.


 
I think you are referring to the interstate commerce clause, which gives states authority over intrastate (that which happens within their borders) activities. Any service company would perform said service within a states borders, making federal regulation unconstitutional. 

Wingnut groups have blown the concept of states-rights out of proportion since the south tried to make the Civil War all about it.


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## pdqdl (Feb 19, 2011)

No, I was referring to the 10th amendment.

***********************************************************
Amendment 10 - Powers of the States and People. Ratified 12/15/1791. Note

The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people.
***********************************************************

You see, the constitution does not mention licensing of professions, so the states get to do it. 
(Most of the subsequent amendments were enacted to further limit the states rights, subject to the 10th amendment.)


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## John Paul Sanborn (Feb 19, 2011)

pdqdl said:


> No, I was referring to the 10th amendment.
> 
> ***********************************************************
> Amendment 10 - Powers of the States and People. Ratified 12/15/1791. Note
> ...


 
The tenth has had so many end-runs made on it that people go for others that will hold water better. Lawyers can poke holes in catch-all clauses with a little research, look at EPA regulations.

With interstate commerce you need to have to have the transaction going both ways. It is that clause that makes truckers get apportioned tags vs the Fed DoT making a universal license.


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## Labman (Feb 19, 2011)

Our states are broke. Can't think of a better area to make cuts.


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## lxt (Feb 21, 2011)

treeclimber101 said:


> Damn you must have a guilty consense or something I am not complaining but FLAT OUT you call people HACKS but yet you run with them right ... Your words" I bid with all the voltures " what wrongs are you fixing when someone has a dead tree in there yard and your only there to PRICE MATCH it .. YOUR driving down the market flat out , than that woman has a friend that calls you and another company you bid dirt cheap and the "other" guy actually has respect for himself and bids to make something not just hand to mouth , and he looks like a bandit for what he bids ... I find it really hard to believe that your doing anything out there thats not ultimately for your gain somehow , stop saying your using GIMMICKS to educate people cause your nose is growing ...


 

TC..............its "conscience" & "vulture"!!

All I can say is: I have touched a saw since December, I dont cry foul because someone sells a job better than me! I dont run with Hacks!! I bid against them them like everyone else!! (big difference)!

I dont consider someone "overpricing" a job that I can do cheaper to have respect anymore than I do.

Your darn right everything I do is for my "gain" & for my men too keep them working!! Ive walked away from many jobs that people only look at the price on, cause I cant match it or beat it!!

And.........you are complaining!! read your post, dam all you do is whine about hacks, lowballers,cheap bids, so & so`s not licensed, etc.. GOD........ your like the kid in elementary school that never got picked to play kickball.......so go tell the teacher & now he/she makes rules & regulations so lil tc101 can play!!

only in this case its the State/Govt. you have to cry to, Man up & be a smarter, better business than your competition & you wont have to FLAT OUT complain....cuz you`ll be too busy working, but then again you just touched your saw the other day for the 1st time in 2 months!



LXT.............


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## lxt (Feb 21, 2011)

lxt said:


> 1- if nobody is kicking your but...then why complain about what they`re doing? I mean you`re laughing all the way to the bank!!
> 
> 2-I dont have the lowest prices in my area by any means & I actually pay my guys much better than the competition!
> 
> ...


 


top line says it all!! or should I say asks a question that has yet to be answered!


LXT............


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## treeclimber101 (Feb 21, 2011)

lxt said:


> TC..............its "conscience" & "vulture"!!
> 
> All I can say is: I have touched a saw since December, I dont cry foul because someone sells a job better than me! I dont run with Hacks!! I bid against them them like everyone else!! (big difference)!
> 
> ...


 I am not complaining dope ... I was telling you to stop calling and referring to other people as hacks while you willingly partake in hackish behavior , your basically just making up BS now to side step what I had originally asked ya , so like I said you answered my question exactly the way I thought, with some gay azz line... I don't need to touch a tree after xmas and not before V day because I am smart enough to know and prepare for the certainty of no work ... I have worked, I did more than 100 hrs in the snow and probably more than 200 hrs on maintenance ... If theres a storm like we had Sat. then we work .. I hate when you engage me in any dialog , its like sticking my #### in a bee hive , nothing productive ever comes out of it ...


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## lxt (Feb 21, 2011)

treeclimber101 said:


> I am not complaining dope ... I was telling you to stop calling and referring to other people as hacks while you willingly partake in hackish behavior , your basically just making up BS now to side step what I had originally asked ya , so like I said you answered my question exactly the way I thought, with some gay azz line... I don't need to touch a tree after xmas and not before V day because I am smart enough to know and prepare for the certainty of no work ... I have worked, I did more than 100 hrs in the snow and probably more than 200 hrs on maintenance ... If theres a storm like we had Sat. then we work .. I hate when you engage me in any dialog , its like sticking my #### in a bee hive , nothing productive ever comes out of it ...


 
well certainly if you can fit your manhood into the beehive I imagine the pain would be similar as to what we all feel listening to your prattle!!

Now you have worked!!! LOL, you`re funny.....I never sidestepped any question of yours boy...........so what is it....you havent touched a saw since Dec, but you have what?? plowed snow & done maintenance? LOL, 

arent you the one who wanted a state level license so *everyone is on the same playing field??* Yep, just like I said.........lil elemenatry school kid who didnt get picked to play kickball.............somebody please make rules/regulations so the guy down the road dont beat my inflated price!!!!! its just not fair!!


LXT................


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## treeclimber101 (Feb 21, 2011)

lxt said:


> well certainly if you can fit your manhood into the beehive I imagine the pain would be similar as to what we all feel listening to your prattle!!
> 
> Now you have worked!!! LOL, you`re funny.....I never sidestepped any question of yours boy...........so what is it....you havent touched a saw since Dec, but you have what?? plowed snow & done maintenance? LOL,
> 
> ...


 
I don't know what to say anymore , you win I give up you've beat me mentally down to your level and it has now given me a headache .. JUST SO EVERYONE KNOWS LXT IS THE MAN


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## lxt (Feb 21, 2011)

lxt said:


> TC...... your like the kid in elementary school that never got picked to play kickball.......so go tell the teacher & now he/she makes rules & regulations so lil tc101 can play!!
> 
> LXT.............


 


whats funny is how you claim to be so smart that you dont need to work before valentines day.................but so foolish as to complain about others underbidding you & not playing fair................

_willingly partake in hackish behavior_....................you must have had it in the beehive when you typed that.... cause pillsbury...in my neck of the woods im the cleanest player in the tree game!! lil pansy like you wouldnt make it here!! heck the other treeguys would run you outta town like a rented mule!

trading jabs with you is fun to a point, but then your childish, crybaby banter just gets ridiculous to a point that I wonder if your werent breast fed as a baby??



LXT.......................


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## treeclimber101 (Feb 21, 2011)

lxt said:


> whats funny is how you claim to be so smart that you dont need to work before valentines day.................but so foolish as to complain about others underbidding you & not playing fair................
> 
> _willingly partake in hackish behavior_....................you must have had it in the beehive when you typed that.... cause pillsbury...in my neck of the woods im the cleanest player in the tree game!! lil pansy like you wouldnt make it here!! heck the other treeguys would run you outta town like a rented mule!
> 
> ...


Wow the word "HACK" really strikes a nerve with you, sorry I don't want ya to go beat the old lady now for something I said , and how would you know anything about me ... You stalking , your starting to sound like that other ### that was obsessed with me ... Your not going to show up here sniffing through my boxers are ya .. And I never cry your just upset that I will actually go around with you . I am sure that your youst to the other guys that cower in your presence ...Your just another swinging #### with a saw to me ..


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## lxt (Feb 21, 2011)

treeclimber101 said:


> I don't know what to say anymore , you win I give up you've beat me mentally down to your level and it has now given me a headache .. JUST SO EVERYONE KNOWS LXT IS THE MAN


 

Ya know I could agree with this & spike the ball....but thats not what Im trying to do here TC, Im just telling it like it is, but....like it is in my area!!

where you`re at is no doubt different, but here the tactics as you call them & hackish behavior........is all over the place!! you must live in the golden state or something...........cause in western pa, oh, wva, indiana,michigan...etc everbody ive talked to uses a match or beat policy...to a point!! hell even Davey & Bartlett do that..........so why go off & downgrade many/someones biz for trying to stay working??

I dont get you, personally.............I dont think you`re as smart as you want us to believe & I dont think your biz is doing so good that you`re laughing all the way to the bank?............I think you`re struggling & upset that the tree market has been infiltrated by those willing to work for less, they`ve cut into your biz profits & you dont like it........................so lets license & regulate the field to serve your needs??

I dont know TC...............I mean apparently your smart, biz is growing & you dont need to work for 2 months...so you say!! its just the rest of what you say doesnt coincide with what your wanting us to believe????




LXT................


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## lxt (Feb 21, 2011)

treeclimber101 said:


> Wow the word "HACK" really strikes a nerve with you, sorry I don't want ya to go beat the old lady now for something I said , and how would you know anything about me ... You stalking , your starting to sound like that other ### that was obsessed with me ... Your not going to show up here sniffing through my boxers are ya .. And I never cry your just upset that I will actually go around with you . I am sure that your youst to the other guys that cower in your presence ...Your just another swinging #### with a saw to me ..


 
LOL.....hack, dont bother me!! & no I wouldnt beat your wife for something you said.....ooops!! well now talk about putting it in the beehive :deadhorse: Bwahahahahah.

sniffing your boxers?? lol....no I just wear your clean ones when I finish up & I sit on the edge of your bed thinking.......wow TC`s prolly getting underbid right now!

But anyway.............on a serious note, Dude....why so hot about something that you cant do anything about? guys have been buzzing for years, side jobs are the best thing about certain trades.......to some its just extra money & yes others are as you say..........."hacks" but you`re doing well...so you say, just keep informing your customers & being a pro!!


LXT................


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## jefflovstrom (Feb 21, 2011)

You guy's sure liven up a thread! Been boring for a while.
Jeff :msp_laugh:


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## treeclimber101 (Feb 21, 2011)

lxt said:


> Ya know I could agree with this & spike the ball....but thats not what Im trying to do here TC, Im just telling it like it is, but....like it is in my area!!
> 
> where you`re at is no doubt different, but here the tactics as you call them & hackish behavior........is all over the place!! you must live in the golden state or something...........cause in western pa, oh, wva, indiana,michigan...etc everbody ive talked to uses a match or beat policy...to a point!! hell even Davey & Bartlett do that..........so why go off & downgrade many/someones biz for trying to stay working??
> 
> ...


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## lxt (Feb 22, 2011)

treeclimber101 said:


> What doesn't coincide , I have insulated myself and diversified to the point that I can survive anything that this economy has thrown my way ... I have grown in my customer base while maintaining previous customers , I have the same crew working for me that were here 10 years ago .. Tree work for us is routine and profitable , I don't need to cheapen myself or the service we provide , and believe me there is no one kicking my anything .. Maybe thats hard for some to understand that I am able to exist even in a "tough" economy , your welcome to come visit and see for yourself , I will treat ya with the respect that I feel you would show me as your guest .. I only pull the tid bits that you put out there , and never once have I ever made a damn thing up about you , there your words .. But you on the other hand PRESUME to know me and how I run my business and what were all about .. So what can you say , I am a hack , all I said is that IN MY OPINION THATS A GIMMICK and you got all AZZ PUCKERED so the truth hurts .. Tonight I will fire up the skidders and go make 300.00 an hour watching there headlights troll around the night while I sip coffee and occasionally pump some diesel .....Don't hate me because you can't figure me out it took me almost 20 years to make happen you will figure it out eventually


 

so you do plow snow?..........see while you`re pumping diesel through the night, My crew & I will be sleeping, we will wake at 5:30am & be doing the tree thing while all the other competitors are plowing & salting like you.

I dont plow snow cause the tree side of my biz is good enough to keep us busy & I am thankful......most lawn services, landscapers, roofers, framers & handyman services engage in plowing.... just not needed in my biz.

what doesnt coincide you asked? well...... every post you put up is a pat on your own back, laughing to the bank, sipping your coffee, making $300 an hr, so diversified you can handle anything! & la da da da da...

the things you brag about only have the rest of us scratching our heads.....I/we dont care to figure you out!!!!.......I have never heard of someone who has it so good (self stated) as you do, then would complain about all the lowball, gimmick hacks out there & how we need regulation! from a far what you say doesnt sound like you`re doing as good as you say?????

as far as hacks, gimmicks & other sales tactics...............you are the only one bringing such up, you are the one that calls people hacks & says they engage in hackish behavior...LOL BTW.... to me a hack is some unexperienced person who sells a homeowner a topping job that when done looks like a hat rack with rips & stubs left all over the place, one who engages in the work not knowing the BMP`s or A-300 standards...........usually some layed off person who just jumps in to make a buck & really doesnt care about the trade or the trees for that matter!!

what you have is no different that what many of us do.......same work force over time, good customers, etc... but I dont consider plowing & salting in addition to tree care to be diversified....but then again im sure you will respond in a true self righteous fashion telling us all just how dam good you are while giving out a webster version of what a hack truly is & how sales encentives are hack related!!! cant wait!!



LXT................


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## lxt (Feb 22, 2011)

treeclimber101 said:


> Damn you must have a guilty consense or something I am not complaining but FLAT OUT you call people HACKS but yet you run with them right ... Your words"




Mind showing me within this thread where I call people hacks???? maybe you should re-read post 12 & 18!!

see when you re-word a post or what someone says to try to make yourself shine when all along you are just mis directing people from the FLAT OUT FACT that you are complaining!!..................re-read what you have posted here, I have!!!! & what you are claiming is no where to be found.............yeah, I think you are the one whose nose is growing!!



LXT................


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## tree MDS (Feb 22, 2011)

I don't think I could look myself in the mirror if I were to offer up a free four slice toaster with purchase of my services.. just sayin..

I look at probably the most successful tree business around here (owner is a friend/aquaintance/ ex employer of mine), dude has managed to market himself almost exclusively to the rich and super-rich. I'm quite certain this guy never gave away any toasters to these people along the way.. They can buy their own ####ing toaster if they want one. lol.


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## lxt (Feb 22, 2011)

tree MDS said:


> I don't think I could look myself in the mirror if I were to offer up a free four slice toaster with purchase of my services.. just sayin..
> 
> I look at probably the most successful tree business around here (owner is a friend/aquaintance/ ex employer of mine), dude has managed to market himself almost exclusively to the rich and super-rich. I'm quite certain this guy never gave away any toasters to these people along the way.. They can buy their own ####ing toaster if they want one. lol.


 

LOL.... thats not how it was! they were actually given a list of gift items on a professional glossy print out..........they upon acceptance of the bid would check the appropriate box beside the gift in which they would like to receive!!

your buddy doesnt live here!!! cuz most of the folks that accepted that as you put it "####ing toaster" were rich!! one of those customers was a high rolling real estate broker & loved the idea...........!!

I looked myself in the mirror proud as hell pal, cause that lil "gimmick" threw my biz into a very nice 6 figure income!!!! as a matter of fact, most of my repeat customers are the ones who received such gifts & from time to time I will get asked when Im gonna run another special like that?

this was a one time deal though & it helped out a friend & helped me!! Sooo... if a 4 slice toaster will land me customers that as of current will use my service & pay me well........!!!! I personally deliver that sob with a bow on it, a smile & believe me.................Im truly laughing all the way to the bank!!! wonder if they make an 8slicer?? bwahahahahah...



LXT..................


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## treeclimber101 (Feb 23, 2011)

lxt said:


> so you do plow snow?..........see while you`re pumping diesel through the night, My crew & I will be sleeping, we will wake at 5:30am & be doing the tree thing while all the other competitors are plowing & salting like you.
> 
> I dont plow snow cause the tree side of my biz is good enough to keep us busy & I am thankful......most lawn services, landscapers, roofers, framers & handyman services engage in plowing.... just not needed in my biz.
> 
> ...


 Whats funny is that with all the work you have why are you posting in the "meat" of the workday ? I mean you have posts from 7am to 11am , someone like you should be busy ... Giving away expresso makers and #### like that , trying to find the next lucky winner of the "LXT" 3 day getaway to the IN AT THE DOVE ... I worked Sunday from the wind worked Monday all day than took a 3 hour nap , and worked til 11am yesterday , I could have woken up this morning and worked but I will wait til tomorrow to go back ... Sounds Suspect that the busiest guy In BUTZBURG has time to post here ..


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## treeclimber101 (Feb 23, 2011)

lxt said:


> LOL.... thats not how it was! they were actually given a list of gift items on a professional glossy print out..........they upon acceptance of the bid would check the appropriate box beside the gift in which they would like to receive!!
> 
> your buddy doesnt live here!!! cuz most of the folks that accepted that as you put it "####ing toaster" were rich!! one of those customers was a high rolling real estate broker & loved the idea...........!!
> 
> ...


 That may be the most pathetic post I have ever read , a toaster for a tree ... And your not doing "GIMMICKS" most of my customers spend there toaster money feeding us lunch and TIPPING the men well , I doubt those cheap ####'s that took advantage of the toaster fiasco would give a drink of hose water .... Hopefully for you they do make a 8 slicer than you can BUY A CLUE ..


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## NCTREE (Feb 23, 2011)

tree MDS said:


> I don't think I could look myself in the mirror if I were to offer up a free four slice toaster with purchase of my services.. just sayin..
> 
> I look at probably the most successful tree business around here (owner is a friend/aquaintance/ ex employer of mine), dude has managed to market himself almost exclusively to the rich and super-rich. I'm quite certain this guy never gave away any toasters to these people along the way.. They can buy their own ####ing toaster if they want one. lol.


 
I have an idea what if you gave away a free replacement tree for removing one. Set a monetary limit so that you aren't removing a $300 tree and replacing it for nothing, maybe discounts for lower priced jobs I think it be a good marketing strategy. It certainly would be easier to look yourself in the mirror giving away a tree rather than a toaster. Its just an idea I could be totally off the wall with my thinking.


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## tree MDS (Feb 23, 2011)

NCTREE said:


> I have an idea what if you gave away a free replacement tree for removing one. Set a monetary limit so that you aren't removing a $300 tree and replacing it for nothing, maybe discounts for lower priced jobs I think it be a good marketing strategy. It certainly would be easier to look yourself in the mirror giving away a tree rather than a toaster. Its just an idea I could be totally off the wall with my thinking.



In one of my adds it says "replacement planting available" (I have a backhoe attachment for the tractor). I've had a few people take me up on it.. it damn sure wasn't free though! lol..

Toaster with a bow.. lmfao!!


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## NCTREE (Feb 23, 2011)

tree MDS said:


> In one of my adds it says "replacement planting available" (I have a backhoe attachment for the tractor). I've had a few people take me up on it.. it damn sure wasn't free though! lol..
> 
> Toaster with a bow.. lmfao!!


 
I can get 6' to 7' B&B and container trees of native species dirt cheap like $40 to $80 cheap. I could plant these guys all day long by hand with a ball kart.


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## tree MDS (Feb 23, 2011)

NCTREE said:


> I can get 6' to 7' B&B and container trees of native species dirt cheap like $40 to $80 cheap. I could plant these guys all day long by hand with a ball kart.


 
I would charge $240 for the $80 one then. lol.


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## lxt (Feb 23, 2011)

treeclimber101 said:


> Whats funny is that with all the work you have why are you posting in the "meat" of the workday ? I mean you have posts from 7am to 11am , someone like you should be busy ... Giving away expresso makers and #### like that , trying to find the next lucky winner of the "LXT" 3 day getaway to the IN AT THE DOVE ... I worked Sunday from the wind worked Monday all day than took a 3 hour nap , and worked til 11am yesterday , I could have woken up this morning and worked but I will wait til tomorrow to go back ... Sounds Suspect that the busiest guy In BUTZBURG has time to post here ..


 

Its called being the owner!!!!.................ooops im posting now at 9:13am, my men are doing an estate winter pruning & deadwood contract, I will check on them this after noon just like the other days when I posted early, the job is mostly small to medium type trees, I am on site when the work is a little more hairy.

I would suggest a nap after all that coffee sipping at the plow & salt job at walmart, dont worry ole 101.............Im not the one who said I was the busiest, laughing to the bank, making $300 an hr, non saw touching, economically recession proof BS`er in the tree world like you...Bwahahahahah.

espressos.............this is Blitzburgh pudding, not jerwsey shore.....LOL, still cant reply to the "hack" question uh? yeah..... thats cause you *once again* mis-construed the truth & now you have to backpeddle to a different topic...LOL you sure your manhood didnt affect your brain function after you were puttin it in the beehive?????? keep trying girlfriend........!!!!



LXT................


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## lxt (Feb 23, 2011)

treeclimber101 said:


> That may be the most pathetic post I have ever read , a toaster for a tree ... And your not doing "GIMMICKS" most of my customers spend there toaster money feeding us lunch and TIPPING the men well , I doubt those cheap ####'s that took advantage of the toaster fiasco would give a drink of hose water .... Hopefully for you they do make a 8 slicer than you can BUY A CLUE ..


 


see once again...........your flatulance has left you to* mis-construe the truth*

Actually pillsbury........those customers have provided me with gift cards to some of the areas best high end restaurants/country clubs........look bozo......they dont have garden hoses............they have irrigation/sprinkler systems that cost more than your house, tools & biz put together!!!

LOL...yeah an 8 slicer & buy a clue was a good one..........NOT!!! 

maybe you should have read all that was offered but you decided to focus on a toaster....lol, no one minded getting the free leatherman tool, the camping equipment, gym bags, etc... we even had 2 hand held gps devices we included in the list.............I actually had to look up some of the stuff!!

Did I mention that this year I send all my 2010 customers a holiday post card thanking them along with a gift certificate to apply toward future services??? Look, my customers provide me a good living & I am thankful, I have been given tips & eaten at restaurants that were pricey & beyond me!!

its a true shame that you dont see the goodness in giving back to those who utilize your service...........not one person when I told them about the giveaway thought it was a "gimmick" some of those folks had friends, family & neighbors who arent as fortunate as YOU ($300 hr) & thought that these less fortunate folks could use some of the items...........its called a humanitarian effort.

I get my personal formaids printed up & the owner gives me a magnet & free pens, some give me calenders, tickets to the game, etc.... for being a good custome of theirs.............so whats wrong with giving back???

This economy is in ruin because of greedy, non giving back types like you!!! its all about keeping prices high, laughing to the bank & breaking your arm patting yourself on the back cause no one else will, your arrogance, boasting & greed are sickening to me.............you think you are better for not than for doing, all I see from your posts is the want for more & you are willing to regulate & license to do such.....................you are truly the cancer stricken bowel type that is gutting america!!! 




LXT...................


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## pdqdl (Feb 23, 2011)

tree MDS said:


> I would charge $240 for the $80 one then. lol.


 
Yep.

3x cost with warranty is pretty standard.


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## tree MDS (Feb 23, 2011)

pdqdl said:


> Yep.
> 
> 3x cost with warranty is pretty standard.


 
That's what I was told. Pretty good money in it at that rate too.

Those bags (like vet was talking about) are probably an awesome idea, especially if you're gonna guarantee the thing lives..


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## pdqdl (Feb 23, 2011)

tree MDS said:


> That's what I was told. Pretty good money in it at that rate too.
> 
> Those bags (like vet was talking about) are probably an awesome idea, especially if you're gonna guarantee the thing lives..


 
Are you referring to "tree gator" or some other related watering device? They work well, but they still require that you come and fill them...regularly. Unless you are going to charge for filling them, you had better make sure that your warranty does NOT include death from improper watering techniques.

Then, if you are like nearly every other landscaper in town, you tell them the plant died from too much water, or (usually) not enough. Sorry!


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## beowulf343 (Feb 23, 2011)

I'm really kind of surprised at the resistance to lxt here. Look up and down the road, is there a ma and pa business that isn't offering some "incentive" to bring in customers? Why are tree companies better than that?

I'm not a businessman, but work for a guy who has 20+ crews on the road year around. I bet he gives away over a thousand tv's, grills, and snowblowers every year. I broke some ribs and an arm a few years back and spent some time with the sales force-what an interesting study in human nature. I saw one of our guys pick up 20k worth of work by throwing in a $400 tv. And of course then the "i only work with rich clients" argument comes in. I've got to say, we've done a lot of work for rich people, and too many of them are the cheapest sob's i've ever seen. (Not all of course.) 

People like getting stuff for free, even the rich people. I've seen customers jump through hoops for the chance at getting the stupidist stuff for free. 

So what sets you apart from the other tree guys. Say i've put out that i need some tree work done as a homeowner. Two companies bid, they are about the same size, similar quote, etc. Do i go with the guy who hasn't touched a saw in two months or the guy who will give me a toaster. I like getting free stuff too.

It's the same choice consumers are presented with daily. Two banks with similar services, same location, etc. I'm going to go with the one who gives away a free mountain bike when you open a checking account. I like getting free stuff too.

I've got a choice between two ac guys, both do similar work at similar prices. I'm going with the guy who gives me a free calendar. I like free stuff too.

I've got three saw dealers that have similar prices, and service. I'm going with the one that will give me free screnches or files or glasses or chaps with every purchase. I like free stuff too.

My point is, as a consumer and customer i'm definitely not hurting in the pocketbook, but when i can get the same service from two different outfits for the same price, i'm going to be looking for something that will sway me to one side or the other. Freebies sway a lot of people.


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## pdqdl (Feb 23, 2011)

*I have been inspired by this thread to spend some money on promotional items !*

I agreed to purchase a bunch of promotional pens today, to be handed out to each new customer that signs up, or for each continuing customer that I renew services with. They are really neat pens that include our engraved name & info, a nice appearance, and a tiny built-in flashlight at the top. Really cool, my office assistant said she would let me see it, but that she wanted to keep it.

No big news about this idea, imprinted pens have been around forever, right?

In addition to being a really neat pen, I will be giving a lifetime replacement policy on the batteries and ink for each pen when I hand it to a customer. The idea is to make sure that they hang on to the pen, are reminded of my company on a regular basis, and that they call me whenever they need something, _like ink for their favorite pen._


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## lxt (Feb 23, 2011)

that will work!! around here football is huge, right before the football season starts I have magnets with company info & the teams schedule printed up. amazing how that & some professionalism will sell a job & ive even been the higher bid!!!

the "toaster" & other items thing was a one time deal, a good buddy of mine was a sales rep & demonstrator of products for....?amway/maleluca...one of those, he acquired so much stuff over the years his basement looked like a store, so we came up with the promo idea I mentioned, he couldnt sell the items (legally) but he got a cleaned out basement, made money, I made money, sold jobs & customers were happy!!!!!

dont know what more could of been done......Ill tell ya this, you give the customer a free item with bid or upon acceptance of contract & they wont forget you!!! yep, Ill engage in that type of salesmanship every chance I get......whats nice is when you see one of those customers out & they stand there talking to ya for 10-15min telling you about how handy that little leatherman tool is, etc...

funny fact is: one of my competitors would call & try to see what we were giving away.........then when he was found out, cursed me & hung up!! LOL, it will make the competition mad...........when you`re the first on the block offering such!!


LXT................


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## tree MDS (Feb 24, 2011)

pdqdl said:


> I agreed to purchase a bunch of promotional pens today, to be handed out to each new customer that signs up, or for each continuing customer that I renew services with. They are really neat pens that include our engraved name & info, a nice appearance, and a tiny built-in flashlight at the top. Really cool, my office assistant said she would let me see it, but that she wanted to keep it.
> 
> No big news about this idea, imprinted pens have been around forever, right?
> 
> In addition to being a really neat pen, I will be giving a lifetime replacement policy on the batteries and ink for each pen when I hand it to a customer. The idea is to make sure that they hang on to the pen, are reminded of my company on a regular basis, and that they call me whenever they need something, _like ink for their favorite pen._



Just give it up PDQ. Walmart Tree is already offering up free tv's to go with the deforestation of your property. There's no competing with that! Lol.


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## treeclimber101 (Feb 25, 2011)

lxt said:


> see once again...........your flatulance has left you to* mis-construe the truth*
> 
> Actually pillsbury........those customers have provided me with gift cards to some of the areas best high end restaurants/country clubs........look bozo......they dont have garden hoses............they have irrigation/sprinkler systems that cost more than your house, tools & biz put together!!!
> 
> ...


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## treeclimber101 (Feb 25, 2011)

You whats funny LXT with all your accolades with the original topic of this thread reguarding licence you say no way that won't work but your wrong if its enforced it will work much the same as a electrician and plumber .. What I think is that your certs. and all these groups that you belong too were from your previous employer that you've carried into your BIZ and hailed yourself as the cleanest guy in boozburg when deep down inside your probably roped with debt and these "IDEAS" are a desperate attempt at not letting the wheel stop and losing everything ... But believe me I know because I was there in 05' and I had all these" IDEAS" flying around my head ... I think that your full of it when you say things like while I am plowing your getting ready to go cut trees , I have never seen someone pulling a chipper to a job the morning after snow that wasn't an emergency and even then I could probably count on my one hand the times .. If you wanna to be taken for real and respected tell the truth , and I am not bragging about making 300 an hour but its the truth .. I pay my bills with that money and I may not live the way your claiming to live but I do well enough to have 2 children married with a house and plenty of time and the means to be a coach of football and softball and T ball, this business affords me with the flexibilty of being a full time dad so the money thing is just that something I need to pay my bills, I am not really worried about being rich right now .. There is a part of me that wishes that I was closer to you , so I could really see if your claims are really that accurate .. And please stop referring to my weight , IT MAKES YOU LOOK LIKE A ###got , I mean really theres has never been a man that has pi##ed me off enough to be a ### wad and comment on his body , you sound like a chick when you do it .. REALLY .


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## lxt (Feb 25, 2011)

ahhh....treewhiner, well I wish you were closer too!!! & if I remember correctly you have my website, phone number & address??? Im not hard to find lil fella! 

posting here more important than work??? No!, its called tax time big boy & while my guys ARE WORKING ON TREES...while you & your crew are stealing the 10yr olds shoveling job at Ms. smiths.......Im doing what is called paper work, audit preparation & compliance for vehicles (Class A driven equipment)

"you give back by being prompt & fair?" from what others & I gather from your posts I would seriously question that statement.....if you did your job (tree care) properly.......no home owner would have you go back up 70 ft & re-do missed work....especially when your closing the chipper hopper! 

we have had additional work requests.........but not on the tree(s) we were doing or finished with! Pal......you can hate what you`re calling a "gimmick" all you want, Im not the only one doing boy!! why? cuz......IT WORKS!!



LXT.................can someone get the jersey shore boy some whine & cheese? LOL


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## lxt (Feb 25, 2011)

treeclimber101 said:


> You whats funny LXT with all your accolades with the original topic of this thread reguarding licence you say no way that won't work but your wrong if its enforced it will work much the same as a electrician and plumber .. What I think is that your certs. and all these groups that you belong too were from your previous employer that you've carried into your BIZ and hailed yourself as the cleanest guy in boozburg when deep down inside your probably roped with debt and these "IDEAS" are a desperate attempt at not letting the wheel stop and losing everything ... But believe me I know because I was there in 05' and I had all these" IDEAS" flying around my head ... I think that your full of it when you say things like while I am plowing your getting ready to go cut trees , I have never seen someone pulling a chipper to a job the morning after snow that wasn't an emergency and even then I could probably count on my one hand the times .. If you wanna to be taken for real and respected tell the truth , and I am not bragging about making 300 an hour but its the truth .. I pay my bills with that money and I may not live the way your claiming to live but I do well enough to have 2 children married with a house and plenty of time and the means to be a coach of football and softball and T ball, this business affords me with the flexibilty of being a full time dad so the money thing is just that something I need to pay my bills, I am not really worried about being rich right now .. There is a part of me that wishes that I was closer to you , so I could really see if your claims are really that accurate .. And please stop referring to my weight , IT MAKES YOU LOOK LIKE A ###got , I mean really theres has never been a man that has pi##ed me off enough to be a ### wad and comment on his body , you sound like a chick when you do it .. REALLY .


 


Wow.....where do I even begin? I wish I could draw it in crayon for ya TC & then maybe, just maybe you might get it?!

1- license....dont want it! why? I just went through hell getting a new trailer registered/titled in this state..it came from a non title state....whats my point.....the commonwealth is hell to deal with for something of this level could you imagine what a biz license would be like??? whos paying for the enforcement....*you crying idiots never think of that!! yeah lets tell the already overburdened tax payer (especially in jersey) that your taxes are going up for tree trimming/ removal law enforcement*

2- all my Certs are mine & anyone with an ounce of knowledge would know you cant carry them over.....I have to get CEU`s & re-train/refresh in this trade just like most everyone else....so this comment of yours is unfounded & stupid in nature (not a surprise).

3- hard to believe my biz is doing trees?? thats your problem...BUT WE ARE!! Hmmm......yep at the end of my rope, verge of folding up, no money....*NOT* chubs...I will be bidding on an Apt complex job today for a very good client, we are working 2-3 days a wk depending on the weather.....im so bad off...that I am popping approx 20 grand for my up-coming wedding in october!!!! so as bad off as I am according to you.....NOT, LOL......Im thinking the scenario you portrayed reflects your situation......cause you are the one whinning & complaining, Im just stating what has helped my biz out & you dont like it......oh, want a cookie?

4-boozeburgh.................hmmm....?? the only thing jersey has is the "devil(s)" & a ITCC!! other than that..........your state is broke just like every other state is or will be.............but hell.......with your ability & recession proof knowledge maybe you could offer up advice & save the day???

as far as poking fun at your weight............you get a lil salty bout that uh? I would suggest a good fiber diet & smaller portions!!

As for the rest of your meritless, exagerated rantings.....we all just consider the source, *meaningless!!!!!*



LXT................


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## lxt (Feb 25, 2011)

lxt said:


> Mind showing me within this thread where I call people hacks???? maybe you should re-read post 12 & 18!!
> LXT................


 

heres the "hack" question again, you said in a previous post I called people "hacks"

So Im asking your nose growing, lying butt to show me where I said that!!!! re-read your post #66 on page 5......... & you say I need to buy a clue, you need to magically make one appear for you!!!



LXT.............


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## treeclimber101 (Feb 25, 2011)

lxt said:


> Wow.....where do I even begin? I wish I could draw it in crayon for ya TC & then maybe, just maybe you might get it?!
> 
> 1- license....dont want it! why? I just went through hell getting a new trailer registered/titled in this state..it came from a non title state....whats my point.....the commonwealth is hell to deal with for something of this level could you imagine what a biz license would be like??? whos paying for the enforcement....*you crying idiots never think of that!! yeah lets tell the already overburdened tax payer (especially in jersey) that your taxes are going up for tree trimming/ removal law enforcement*
> 
> ...


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## treeclimber101 (Feb 25, 2011)

LXT wrote $50 bucks if you lose a job cuz of that...well hey dont be salty over it....JUST GIVE A DISCOUNT ON TOP OF WHAT THE COMPETITION DOES!! only a tard would walk away beat!! this one sentence sums your biz up ...


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## lxt (Feb 25, 2011)

it will be ok TC101

dude I have nothing more to say to you!, 20 g`s is my part of the bill, & when I say crying Idiots............I should make that sigular....& yes Im talking to you!

If you want to lose a job over $50 thats your biz, if I feel we can do it at a match & beat price or for even less & meet our profit goals I will.....!

& any comment about your weight such as (pillsbury, chubby,etc..) are for comedic purposes along with conveying a profile of what you are! LOL

ohh...I forgot the terms (girlfriend & pudding) which basically is being used in the descriptive sense in reference to you! You still fail to answer my question...but you felt man enough to drum up a BS statement....typical of you!!

Ill just leave ya with this......: you make false statements (lie) to put off the real topic, every post you make only enlightens us as to how much of a BS`ing bag you are..........if as much work came from you as bowel dropping from your mouth you would be the size of asplundh tree.......but & there is the big word.... you only continue to insult while not answering or replying to any specific topic....your purpose is all to clear.....you just want to argue!

I wish you did live closer........as a matter of fact you should stop on in to ole boozeburgh as you put it sometime............then you & I could discuss that lil license issue................As for the rest of your dribble...its just all to clear who is doing what & how well................you dont hear others or myself crying about licenses or regulations the way you do!! why`s that?.......cause we`re to busy taking work from people like you to care!!!

read my post jackwagon.....I already said why I dont want a license, does anyone know this guy? I remember a teenager getting on here & doing similar as him..........TC101 are you Goblin or FTA......wow, you ask questions that have already been answered...............can you read? 



LXT...................dont worry folks his lies abound with stupidity, tc101 that is!


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## treemandan (Feb 25, 2011)

pdqdl said:


> I agreed to purchase a bunch of promotional pens today, to be handed out to each new customer that signs up, or for each continuing customer that I renew services with. They are really neat pens that include our engraved name & info, a nice appearance, and a tiny built-in flashlight at the top. Really cool, my office assistant said she would let me see it, but that she wanted to keep it.
> 
> No big news about this idea, imprinted pens have been around forever, right?
> 
> In addition to being a really neat pen, I will be giving a lifetime replacement policy on the batteries and ink for each pen when I hand it to a customer. The idea is to make sure that they hang on to the pen, are reminded of my company on a regular basis, and that they call me whenever they need something, _like ink for their favorite pen._


 
Once again, an amenity not a gimmick. If you gave them one of those cheap pens that break and are worthless then that would be a gimmick. No, you provided a true amenity for your clients there, you gave then a good pen, a clock, and made finding your phone number a little easier for them.


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## treemandan (Feb 25, 2011)

lxt said:


> it will be ok TC101
> 
> dude I have nothing more to say to you!, 20 g`s is my part of the bill, & when I say crying Idiots............I should make that sigular....& yes Im talking to you!
> 
> ...


 
Giving 50 bucks off the lowest price is a gimmick, that does nothing to accomodate your client... or anyone else for that matter.


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## treemandan (Feb 25, 2011)

tree MDS said:


> Just give it up PDQ. Walmart Tree is already offering up free tv's to go with the deforestation of your property. There's no competing with that! Lol.


 
:msp_laugh::msp_laugh::msp_laugh::msp_laugh:


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## treemandan (Feb 25, 2011)

NCTREE said:


> I have an idea what if you gave away a free replacement tree for removing one. Set a monetary limit so that you aren't removing a $300 tree and replacing it for nothing, maybe discounts for lower priced jobs I think it be a good marketing strategy. It certainly would be easier to look yourself in the mirror giving away a tree rather than a toaster. Its just an idea I could be totally off the wall with my thinking.


 
That is exactly what I do! Free Trees!


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## lxt (Feb 25, 2011)

treemandan said:


> Giving 50 bucks off the lowest price is a gimmick, that does nothing to accomodate your client... or anyone else for that matter.


 

No...gimmicks are tricks or other than reasonable "bait & switch" type ploys that basically screw someone!!

50 bucks off is a discount, refund, sales incentive, gift promotion, etc.. & my azz it doesnt accomodate......how about I send you a legal tender 50 bill in the mail right now!! Ill bet that would accomodate you......?? but hey....just send it back cause its a gimmick...............LOL


LXT.............


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## treemandan (Feb 25, 2011)

lxt said:


> No...gimmicks are tricks or other than reasonable "bait & switch" type ploys that basically screw someone!!
> 
> 50 bucks off is a discount, refund, sales incentive, gift promotion, etc.. & my azz it doesnt accomodate......how about I send you a legal tender 50 bill in the mail right now!! Ill bet that would accomodate you......?? but hey....just send it back cause its a gimmick...............LOL
> 
> ...


 
I am just trying to get you to rise above buddy. Now if you really want to start some #### ask 101 how many ilegall aliens he has on the payroll. I am kinda curious myself.:msp_razz:
Allright, I am gonna pound down another screwdriver and run through Smokestack Lightening! My wife is bringing the inlaws over and I need all the help I can get. I am starting to regret selling my big amp to my buddy, he won't sell it back the SOB.


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## lxt (Feb 25, 2011)

Danno...you are right man!

I just hate people that think a license & regulations through the Govt are the ticket.... every thing the Govt gets its hands on just goes to hell, look at public assistance....totally abused! most states are on the verge of bankruptcy & want to do away with collective bargaining & raise taxes...etc..

Now lets regulate the tree care industry.....ooops we need enforcement in the field (a forgotten issue) who do they think is gonna wanna pay for the enforcement pertaining to trees? LOL

uhh uum...scuse me Mr. treemandan....Ill need to see your trimming & removal license sir...........ok buddy, spread em...operating without a license eh? thats a tree felony of the 2nd degree................LMFAO! can you see it danno?



LXT..........


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## treeclimber101 (Feb 26, 2011)

treemandan said:


> I am just trying to get you to rise above buddy. Now if you really want to start some #### ask 101 how many ilegall aliens he has on the payroll. I am kinda curious myself.:msp_razz:
> Allright, I am gonna pound down another screwdriver and run through Smokestack Lightening! My wife is bringing the inlaws over and I need all the help I can get. I am starting to regret selling my big amp to my buddy, he won't sell it back the SOB.


 I have three workers and yes they are Mexican.. I am an open book , I will not lie about anything that you can think up , if you have a question like that than just ask , you don't have to have salty mouth do it for ya ...But do Mexicans now lower the prices ? Or is the question am attempt at something else , but I am not gonna post there personal info here, I don't think its right to heir someones else's life to the sake of an argument or point , even know alot of guys can't stand them they are people.. But I will say that we have done GOV. work for comps. like SEVENSON , and one of my snow contracts in Cherry Hill includes the I.N.S building , and after 10 years they have never even walked outside to ask a mans status ..


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## treeclimber101 (Feb 26, 2011)

lxt said:


> it will be ok TC101
> 
> dude I have nothing more to say to you!, 20 g`s is my part of the bill, & when I say crying Idiots............I should make that sigular....& yes Im talking to you!
> 
> ...


 
Hey I got an idea for your wedding registry you should ask for 150 20$ toasters , that will keep ya going for a while MR . MONEY bags and with comments like the whole weight thing I am thinking you know that salty taste very well .. But bottom line here BOBO is that even know most of these guys here can't stand me personally thats OK because I would rather be disliked for being honest than tolerated at BEST for being someone who would gladly slice the throats of every other tree company you come in contact with ... I can live with that ..Everything that I post here are your words and the "statement" your referring to is your words again go read back a while you'll see it , your just mad that everyone here won't validate your "business plan" and frankly I find it really funny ...


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## lxt (Feb 26, 2011)

treeclimber101 said:


> Hey I got an idea for your wedding registry you should ask for 150 20$ toasters , that will keep ya going for a while MR . MONEY bags and with comments like the whole weight thing I am thinking you know that salty taste very well .. But bottom line here BOBO is that even know most of these guys here can't stand me personally thats OK because I would rather be disliked for being honest than tolerated at BEST for being someone who would gladly slice the throats of every other tree company you come in contact with ... I can live with that ..Everything that I post here are your words and the "statement" your referring to is your words again go read back a while you'll see it , your just mad that everyone here won't validate your "business plan" and frankly I find it really funny ...


 
Wow.....150 $20 dollar toasters!!!! could you have your mexican workforce deliver those?? LOL...

LMFAO................dude you cry over promo items/free gifts & then your khadaffi azz hires a group of mexicans...........nothing you say from here on out means jack.... you are the lowest of the low in the biz arena!

you dont know the meaning of honest (you lied on here) & as for people not liking you...............guess what?......Im thinking from your posts its well deserved!! No-one other than you has cried over my "biz plan" as you put it!! & as for throat slicing.................you have room to talk lumpy.....you mexican hiring, non american waste!! no wonder you make $300 hr.....poor jose & Rio work for rice & a room off your trailer!!

guys like you are what is ruining this country & you proudly boast about it!! is Mrs. tc101 el hablo es panol? you coach sports for kids?? arribba mexicano uh? LOL................you have an open book........as well an open mouth too!! for who though is the question? "I have 3 mexicans" LOL......wow, how proud you must be? if only the seed that created you would have been cast upon the ground...how much better off we all would be!!

hey guys..........TC101 is having a pinyata party c`mon up..........this is how he gives back to his customers.............:jawdrop: seriously I dont know what more to say....*you are a joke!!!* 



LXT.................3, i got 3 dad.............3 mexicans..........lol


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## lxt (Feb 26, 2011)

treeclimber101 said:


> I have three workers and yes they are Mexican.. I am an open book , I will not lie about anything ,
> 
> But do Mexicans now lower the prices ?
> 
> ...


 


Line #1 says it all folks.....3 mexicans & a lie (still havent showed me where I said what you stated, big boy)

Line #2................YES!!!!! Idiot...prolly the wrong question to ask!

Line #3......really, we cant stand them....hmmmm cause they undermine labor prices donkey wad & I wouldnt have to do $50 off or all the "gimmick" crap that you dont like if it wasnt for skummy employers like you hiring mexicans (cheap labor)

Snow contracts..........thought you were a tree business....ohhh, you are one of those "we do it all" handyman, jack of all trade types that is the true ruination of the biz!! maybe Cherry hill should be contacted & let known that you have a latino work force............hope you got all their paper work & hope it is done right!!!!! not to mention..............Ill bet you were the lowest bid on that contract? I would say what I think of you....but everyone already knows & is thinking the same thing!

welp, I dont think you will ever be taken serious again...you have lied on here, admitted to having a pride of mexicans & above all....you make no sense! atleast Im working my biz with AMERICANS!


LXT...............this dog shaft should be put outta of biz, what an anti american skumbag!


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## tree MDS (Feb 26, 2011)

I gotta be honest here.. work is work, and if it takes a (legal) mexican to do it, because most of our youth are losers, then so be it. 

I hired a latino last year for the first time. Dude was an absolute pleasure to have around, way better than most all of the white trash I tried in prior years. Does that count as mexican? .. I mean, he was short and dark!


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## tree MDS (Feb 26, 2011)

View attachment 173855


Lol.. loved this guy! I hope I can get him back this year!


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## lxt (Feb 26, 2011)

tree MDS said:


> I gotta be honest here.. work is work, and if it takes a (legal) mexican to do it, because most of our youth are losers, then so be it.
> 
> I hired a latino last year for the first time. Dude was an absolute pleasure to have around, way better than most all of the white trash I tried in prior years. Does that count as mexican? .. I mean, he was short and dark!


 

well md............1 is your business but 3........do you maybe think they drove up in the microbus?

& if you have a latino worker? (let alone 3) Im willing to bet what he is doing for the pay goes hand in hand............they dont work any harder from what Ive been told...........they just work significantly cheaper!!!

Its just that the white/black guy know whats right & wrong & when they`re being asked to do more than what their pay is...........lets face it you know you pay him far less than what a white/black man would get paid & that sickens me!

thats the reason for hiring them uh? they come from a 3rd world country where $6 hr is awesome money.......you pay him on the books? fully legit?

People wonder why legitamate biz need to go above & beyond to obtain work, 1 mexican I gotta drop my price $50.............3 mexicans I cant compete with that & honestly I have half a mind to send some toasters to those workers...LOL



LXT.................


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## lxt (Feb 26, 2011)

tree MDS said:


> View attachment 173855
> 
> 
> Lol.. loved this guy! I hope I can get him back this year!


 


well where did he go? you just bring em in for the season or what? he didnt look all that impressive to me......now lets post up a copy of his pay check & I-9 form!!

LXT...........


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## tree MDS (Feb 26, 2011)

Actually, I think the reason I hired him was the CDL.. and the fact that he seemed like a decent guy..


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## tree MDS (Feb 26, 2011)

Oh, and he was puerto rican. Haven't tried out any straight up mexicans yet.. hmm, maybe this year though!! lmao..


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## lxt (Feb 26, 2011)

tree MDS said:


> Actually, I think the reason I hired him was the CDL.. and the fact that he seemed like a decent guy..


 

and not one white guy or black guy was decent? what was you paying him? cause hell.............if I can get a decent guy for minimum wage, why not eh?

see I hear the "worthless youth" thing all the time, but that has came at our generations hand at spoiling them..........& really who the hell for $8-$10hr wants to drag brush, rake yards & do ground work?.........Lowes, home depot, walmart pay just as good & at the end of the day you dont have to shower or fall over exhausted!! this kids arent dumb!!! now mexicans...why are they in the field?

most cant read, write or speak english.........let alone operate a computer, but put a sombrero on em, rake in hand & a wage of $3.50 hr.....whew wee & TC101 got himself a work force!!


LXT............


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## tree MDS (Feb 26, 2011)

lxt said:


> and not one white guy or black guy was decent? what was you paying him? cause hell.............if I can get a decent guy for minimum wage, why not eh?
> 
> see I hear the "worthless youth" thing all the time, but that has came at our generations hand at spoiling them..........& really who the hell for $8-$10hr wants to drag brush, rake yards & do ground work?.........Lowes, home depot, walmart pay just as good & at the end of the day you dont have to shower or fall over exhausted!! this kids arent dumb!!! now mexicans...why are they in the field?
> 
> ...



You forget, I charge roughly twice what you're getting (lol). Anybody that has ever worked for me got payed well.. and that's all you need to know for the sake of this conversation.


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## treeclimber101 (Feb 26, 2011)

Actually Lxt your the only one crying making up #### and telling lets just say "fibs" but I don't even think your aware of it , but Dan asked a question and of course you put a stupid spin on it , now I know that I have hit a real nerve with you , and while were talking the truth what is your crew worth for a day , $70 an hour a man or less ? I think the pay of an individual is a private business and when were talking about someone maybe we should just stick to what your charging per man a hour .. You would be very surprised how off you may be ...And as far my workforce , just stop your showing how little experience you have in both business and intelligence ....


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## jefflovstrom (Feb 26, 2011)

You two should have your own thread!
Jeff:msp_flapper::msp_flapper:


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## NCTREE (Feb 26, 2011)

Tc 101, tree mds and jeffy should all get together and have a taco party:hmm3grin2orange:


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## NCTREE (Feb 26, 2011)

tree MDS said:


> I gotta be honest here.. work is work, and if it takes a (legal) mexican to do it, because most of our youth are losers, then so be it.
> 
> I hired a latino last year for the first time. Dude was an absolute pleasure to have around, way better than most all of the white trash I tried in prior years. Does that count as mexican? .. I mean, he was short and dark!


 
To be honest i'm half tempted to go that route too. Around here the mexicans are the only ones who call me looking for work anyways. White trash with cigs hanging out their mouth while they are texting the scank they picked up at the bar last night seems to be all I can find myself. Lazy as hell too! I have yet to hire anyone who can work like I do.


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## jefflovstrom (Feb 26, 2011)

NCTREE said:


> Tc 101, tree mds and jeffy should all get together and have a taco party:hmm3grin2orange:



It would not be a party if you were not there!! You are hereby invited!!
Jeff :msp_flapper:


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## tree MDS (Feb 26, 2011)

NCTREE said:


> Tc 101, tree mds and jeffy should all get together and have a taco party:hmm3grin2orange:


 
Maybe we could get LXT to come along as well.. I'm sure he could choke back a good sized burrito! lmao..


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## jefflovstrom (Feb 26, 2011)

tree MDS said:


> Maybe we could get LXT to come along as well.. I'm sure he could choke back a good sized burrito! lmao..


 
Ha Ha! No, LXT is a racist and and Hate's Mexican's! 
Jeff :msp_scared:


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## tree MDS (Feb 26, 2011)

jefflovstrom said:


> Ha Ha! No, LXT is a racist and and Hate's Mexican's!
> Jeff :msp_scared:



Oh man.. that smiley is killing me! Lol!


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## treemandan (Feb 26, 2011)

It may not look like I am helping but I am. :msp_rolleyes:


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## jefflovstrom (Feb 26, 2011)

treemandan said:


> It may not look like I am helping but I am. :msp_rolleyes:


 
I hear ya talking, even though I can not see your lips moving!, 
Jeff


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## NCTREE (Feb 26, 2011)

jefflovstrom said:


> Ha Ha! No, LXT is a racist and and Hate's Mexican's!
> Jeff :msp_scared:


 
Well if he hates mexicans than he sure isn't gonna like a big nasty burrito...:fart:


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## treemandan (Feb 26, 2011)

jefflovstrom said:


> I hear ya talking, even though I can not see your lips moving!,
> Jeff


 
I consider it my job, my career, my destiny, to give the people what they DON'T want.


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## treemandan (Feb 26, 2011)

I read now from The Book of Dan:

tiger got hunt
bird got to fly
man got to sit around and wonder, " why, why, why?"


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## treemandan (Feb 26, 2011)

Wait! There's more:

Tiger got to sleep
Bird got to land
Man got to tell himself he understand


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## jefflovstrom (Feb 26, 2011)

WOW!!!

I will refer to you as the Deep Dan'!!! 
Not! Haha!
Jeff :msp_smile:


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## lxt (Feb 26, 2011)

jefflovstrom said:


> Ha Ha! No, LXT is a racist and and Hate's Mexican's!
> Jeff :msp_scared:


 

im not racist......I hate everyone! Nah.. thats not true!!! I dislike people who would talk crap about business promotionals, gifts, etc... cry about a license & regulating the field, lie like a dog on a rug & then come to find out that slack jawed ball bag has a crew of burritos shoveling snow.....LOL, Not to mention I havent seen any thing relating to the topic discussed by him......

*atleast when I insult the jumping bean dictator*.....I also post some relative to the topic

I dont even acknowledge his posts anymore.............prolly has Rico`s illegal teenage daughter typing for him!! 

taco party................well...I know where we can rent 3 servers!! LMFAO




LXT............


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## treemandan (Feb 26, 2011)

jefflovstrom said:


> WOW!!!
> 
> I will refer to you as the Deep Dan'!!!
> Not! Haha!
> Jeff :msp_smile:


 
Yeah, well I'm deep in something!:msp_laugh:


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## treemandan (Feb 26, 2011)

lxt said:


> im not racist......I hate everyone! Nah.. thats not true!!! I dislike people who would talk crap about business promotionals, gifts, etc... cry about a license & regulating the field, lie like a dog on a rug & then come to find out that slack jawed ball bag has a crew of burritos shoveling snow.....LOL, Not to mention I havent seen any thing relating to the topic discussed by him......
> 
> *atleast when I insult the jumping bean dictator*.....I also post some relative to the topic
> 
> ...


 
And what's with you? Biting my lines now?:smile2:


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## treemandan (Feb 26, 2011)

I think Treeco is mad at me for taking his job.


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## jefflovstrom (Feb 26, 2011)

Funny stuff, you guy's are crazy!


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## lxt (Feb 26, 2011)

Has any one checked out 101`s page..........man that goof sends private messages to people insulting them!

glad to see someone else confirming his trailer park residency, what a joke he is!!

look close at his avatar..............is that Jose about to fall outta a tree, thats what happens when someone with 101 in their title trains ya! 

hey TC....Ill be in jerwsey handing out promotional greencards as a "gimmick" I was wondering if I bring the big truck......welp, does your home...uh um I mean, trailer still have the axles & wheels on it? thought Id just hook up & bring some beanos back home..............hell thats what this trade is coming too!

now im not improper to the point that I wouldnt invite your senorita & ya say ya have some offspring do ya?............well bring those trophies with ya too, Ill put the whole lot of you too work.........got a neighbor down the road with a clogged leach field.........you all would fit right in!! bwahahahahaha




LXT........man this is too much fun & too EASY!! lmfao


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## treemandan (Feb 26, 2011)

jefflovstrom said:


> Funny stuff, you guy's are crazy!


 
Am
crazy
E 
but that's how it
Gm flat
goes

Am , E Gm flat
Am
millions of people

E 
living like

Gm flat
foes

Am ,E , Gm flat.


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## lxt (Feb 26, 2011)

treemandan said:


> Am
> crazy
> E
> but that's how it
> ...


 
what position are you playing these chords? I too play.......did summer sessions at berkley in boston, was accepted to their music program & actually teach part time!

cause the following part "mental wounds not healing" is derived from the opening chord F #/G b with a C #/D b on the bottom end......basically following the opening riff pattern using rhytmic phrasing...._ala._ Rhodes/ Van Halen schooling.......

what I love about Randy`s playing is the creative component using classical overtones while still playing pentatonics (blues style). 



LXT..............wow dialogue with a fellow musician...rock on Danno


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## treemandan (Feb 26, 2011)

lxt said:


> what position are you playing these chords? I too play.......did summer sessions at berkley in boston, was accepted to their music program & actually teach part time!
> 
> cause the following part "mental wounds not healing" is derived from the opening chord F #/G b with a C #/D b on the bottom end......basically following the opening riff pattern using rhytmic phrasing...._ala._ Rhodes/ Van Halen schooling.......
> 
> ...


 
Power cords. I never had lessons, I suck but its fun.


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## treeclimber101 (Feb 26, 2011)

tree MDS said:


> Maybe we could get LXT to come along as well.. I'm sure he could choke back a good sized burrito! lmao..


 
That is gonna be tough, he too busy choking back my burrito ...


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## treeclimber101 (Feb 26, 2011)

lxt said:


> Has any one checked out 101`s page..........man that goof sends private messages to people insulting them!
> 
> glad to see someone else confirming his trailer park residency, what a joke he is!!
> 
> ...


 
Now your gonna talk about my kids , dude really ... Lxt the point is your an idiot your cheap low balling pathetic tactics will run out one day and fold like the little sloppy second taking dirtbag who can't make the money that I make , and you never will hanging out in the armpit of PA ... So good luck and just remember that GOD loves ya ...Oh and while your out swinging around in frozen trees , I am sitting here laughing out how pathetic and feeble minded you are, glad that your working like a freezing little gutter dog cause you can't afford to take a month or so off , because your saving up for your big day at the VFW , with gourmet roast beef and meatballs , and probably a cash bar , than you can jet set off to The Baltimore aquarium for the weekend , can't not use those coupons .... Your right it is easy ....


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## treeclimber101 (Feb 26, 2011)

As a matter of fact I am flat out calling you the worst kind of "contractor" that can be ... I am glad that your there , because here even the idiots around here would still have more respect for themselves than to pop out of the truck with a toaster to get a job ... And if a customer called me and told me that I lost a job because of the CHEAP PIECE OF #### I would laugh in there ear and wish them all the luck .... A 41 year old 2nd generation trimmer with a tuba stuck in your ### bragging about a 20K wedding .. Thats my opinion of you ... Your 7 years older than me and I have more time in ..... Ha I guess you tryed to be better and get educated and couldn't and landed right back with a saw in you hand , Now thats funny , you can add failure to your resume... Please come to Joisey sometime I would love to meet ya ...


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## TMFARM 2009 (Feb 26, 2011)

you know this is all going to lead to a situation where you have to get a permit and inspection for each tree trimmed...its the obama plan!
putting america back to work as tree inspectors...:hmm3grin2orange::hmm3grin2orange::hmm3grin2orange:


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## treeclimber101 (Feb 27, 2011)

jefflovstrom said:


> Ha Ha! No, LXT is a racist and and Hate's Mexican's!
> Jeff :msp_scared:


 
And to think he may be responsible for educating children somewhere .. That is a little disturbing ....:msp_ohmy:


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## lxt (Feb 27, 2011)

TC101,

LOL.............whatever dude, you`re the laughing stock at AS right now.......3 mexicans is that all ya could swindle off the boat?

Im lowely for offering free gifts?, well lets for the sake of arguement say....Ok, no worse than the car lots, home centers doing your taxes to give ya a loan??...so now that the burrito you have stuck in ya while puttin it in the beehive has nothing more to fire back with...........what are you gonna use now?

so lets call it as we see it..............!

I had a one time offer of several free gifts that catapulted my biz into 3 tax brackets above what you could ever make!!

Ill be tying the knot with an American woman of which we will spend more than you do in wages for your crew in 3 lifetimes....LMFAO

you on the other hand:

HAVE UNDERPAID MEXICANS....3 of em, arriba


& you think you`re the better person & business owner? dude while your lil trophies & Ms. maria es panol wifey poo are out beaten your clothes on the rocks with your 3 hidden treasures..........I will be working.....cause unlike you Rico Suavey......I Love this country & work hard so that I can pay my taxes, you sir call me out?

I call you a liar, a lowely mexican hiring illigitamate biz owner, a cry baby, a whiner of shaft in the mouth proportions........your pathetic stance & name calling, bashing & otherwise angry beat down stupidity are being echoed throughout AS!!

Do you realize that....seriously! you are viewed now as an anti- american lowely desperate biz owner! you can say all you want about me, but never will I or have I stooped as low as a cowardly, lying person that you are!



LXT.............


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## lxt (Feb 27, 2011)

lxt said:


> Has any one checked out 101`s page..........man that goof sends private messages to people insulting them!
> 
> glad to see someone else confirming his trailer park residency, what a joke he is!!
> 
> ...


 


I didnt think I insulted your kids...I just asked if ya had offspring...? also I thought the offering of greencards was a novel cricket idea??? 

Others & I really like the phrase "jumping bean dictator" its such a fit for you & offering to tow your house over to PA with the family inside...twas an meritful offer...I mean by now your crew is prolly like family & with you apparently not working & taking time off ( no doubt due to the cold) I mean those warm climate workers dont function well in the cold..

But hey......you can apply for assistance here too!! thats why my biz & others pay all those taxes...........to help out people down on their luck like you.......I mean you`ve stooped so low as to hire MEXICANS..........& with not working, TC...dont be proud & diminish the fact you`re hurting....we`ll help you!!

Im still waiting for ya to show where in this thread I called people "hacks"...I mean you are so right on everything....howd you put that "fib" is that what you did? I cant wait to see where he goes now..........dig deep TC!!! or have one of your workers do it for ya! Bwahahahahahaha



LXT..............


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## lxt (Feb 27, 2011)

treeclimber101 said:


> As a matter of fact I am flat out calling you the worst kind of "contractor" that can be ... I am glad that your there , because here even the idiots around here would still have more respect for themselves than to pop out of the truck with a toaster to get a job ... And if a customer called me and told me that I lost a job because of the CHEAP PIECE OF #### I would laugh in there ear and wish them all the luck .... A 41 year old 2nd generation trimmer with a tuba stuck in your ### bragging about a 20K wedding .. Thats my opinion of you ... Your 7 years older than me and I have more time in ..... Ha I guess you tryed to be better and get educated and couldn't and landed right back with a saw in you hand , Now thats funny , you can add failure to your resume... Please come to Joisey sometime I would love to meet ya ...


 
did you say 7 yrs younger or 7 yrs old? siete...means 7 in your language! LOL
cause your typing reflects someone much younger!! unless your have panic attacks when typing?

tell ya what TC.............I offered a certain oregon landscaper a free round trip to my area to see how good he was........he had a big mouth & I called him out....funny he never took me up on that offer!

if you can legally get on the bus & have proper ID............I would more than happily pay for your way here.....I mean you`re not working, havent touched a saw in 2 months & have tons of cash.....so poor, broke lil ole me will pay to bring ya over & then we can personally discuss some issues...let alone Im sure some other companies here in boozeburgh would love to meet ya!! a few veteran operations here will like you!! what ya say?


LXT...............


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## lxt (Feb 27, 2011)

ohh BTW....maybe Md will come with you & bring the burritos........then we will see who can choke back what?? 

cant wait????


LXT..............


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## treemandan (Feb 27, 2011)

yeah IXT, the guitar is actually a percussion instrument, you strike it to play it... which explains why mine has been glued back together a few times:msp_cool:

I haven't played the electric in years, it sure is fun, a good release and its cool to find other treeguys who like to wail.

Sounds like you have good knowledge of the fretboard, I wish I could say the same, I can barely get through one song without a million mistakes and my thumb hurts like Hell. I just know a bunch of tunes but at least I am not tone deaf. Lately I have been thinking off getting some actuall music lessons and I want to teach my kid.


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## treeclimber101 (Feb 27, 2011)

lxt said:


> did you say 7 yrs younger or 7 yrs old? siete...means 7 in your language! LOL
> cause your typing reflects someone much younger!! unless your have panic attacks when typing?
> 
> tell ya what TC.............I offered a certain oregon landscaper a free round trip to my area to see how good he was........he had a big mouth & I called him out....funny he never took me up on that offer!
> ...


Yea that sounds great , I can get the noose packed that I am gonna hang myself with hanging out with a ####head like you in the most boring Zit of a area that PA has to offer and believe me I know I have family in Derry .. And what are we gonna do help you pick out your wedding dress , or go hang at Wal mart ... Or maybe you can take me for a ride in Your SPIDER , I hope your kidding , but seeing how you STALK me probably not ... And Yea ya did insult My CHILDREN read your post... I guess thats what you have to offer when you have nothing else , like I said a 41 year old man .. Even if you were joking you went way to far with that ...I may be a complete and total POS but I have and will never involve your family in any insults .. And I consider the source with you ..


----------



## lxt (Feb 27, 2011)

treemandan said:


> yeah IXT, the guitar is actually a percussion instrument, you strike it to play it... which explains why mine has been glued back together a few times:msp_cool:
> 
> I haven't played the electric in years, it sure is fun, a good release and its cool to find other treeguys who like to wail.
> 
> Sounds like you have good knowledge of the fretboard, I wish I could say the same, I can barely get through one song without a million mistakes and my thumb hurts like Hell. I just know a bunch of tunes but at least I am not tone deaf. Lately I have been thinking off getting some actuall music lessons and I want to teach my kid.


 
thats cool, a good site to go to is metalmethod.com, Doug Marks is a lil dated but his teachings are pretty good & affordable.....check it out, the theory part of his course helped me big time in school!



LXT............


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## lxt (Feb 27, 2011)

treeclimber101 said:


> I may be a complete and total POS


 

well finally the truth comes out!!!!

I didnt insult your kids!!!! you insult America by hiring mexicans, insult me, my wedding & how I operate a business, etc... then take offense to being asked if you have offspring...............C`mon???

Im done with you!!



LXT................


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## tree MDS (Feb 27, 2011)

lxt said:


> well finally the truth comes out!!!!
> 
> I didnt insult your kids!!!! you insult America by hiring mexicans, insult me, my wedding & how I operate a business, etc... then take offense to being asked if you have offspring...............C`mon???
> 
> ...



There was that comment.. something about a septic field, I believe. Seems like you only remember saying what you feel like remembering.. just saying here..


----------



## treeclimber101 (Feb 27, 2011)

lxt said:


> well finally the truth comes out!!!!
> 
> I didnt insult your kids!!!! you insult America by hiring mexicans, insult me, my wedding & how I operate a business, etc... then take offense to being asked if you have offspring...............C`mon???
> 
> ...


Then be done , we've already had that conversation but yet you still try to have dialog with me , just like this thread you opened your face and ran you mouth again now your done good ... Ignore ME please , actually I am fine with that and it shouldn't be hard for a 41 year old man to show some restraint ...


----------



## tree MDS (Feb 27, 2011)

lxt said:


> ohh BTW....maybe Md will come with you & bring the burritos........then we will see who can choke back what??
> 
> cant wait????
> 
> ...



It's MDS BTW, and I prefer taco's to burrito's. :msp_laugh:


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## treemandan (Feb 27, 2011)

lxt said:


> well finally the truth comes out!!!!
> 
> I didnt insult your kids!!!! you insult America by hiring mexicans, insult me, my wedding & how I operate a business, etc... then take offense to being asked if you have offspring...............C`mon???
> 
> ...


 
I should hope you are done with him, I thought I pretty much ended the discussion in post one oh seven. Now, do you want to go and find the rest of them?

Man, 101, you sure can flap dem lips like we was in the 3rd grade cafeteria.What could possible make you want to do that? Sounds like yer riding the gravy train.:msp_glare:


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## treeclimber101 (Feb 27, 2011)

tree MDS said:


> There was that comment.. something about a septic field, I believe. Seems like you only remember saying what you feel like remembering.. just saying here..


 
No actually this is what that ###### ###### said to be exact "now im not improper to the point that I wouldnt invite your senorita & ya say ya have some offspring do ya?............well bring those trophies with ya too, Ill put the whole lot of you too work.........got a neighbor down the road with a clogged leach field.........you all would fit right in!! bwahahahahaha "


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## treemandan (Feb 27, 2011)

tree MDS said:


> There was that comment.. something about a septic field, I believe. Seems like you only remember saying what you feel like remembering.. just saying here..


 
All the mudsling and name calling really just obscures the issues, its a pansy tactic.

I read again from The Book of Dan:

" Midget, midget, midget, how he struts and winks
For he knows a man's as big as what he hopes and thinks!"


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## treeclimber101 (Feb 27, 2011)

treemandan said:


> I should hope you are done with him, I thought I pretty much ended the discussion in post one oh seven. Now, do you want to go and find the rest of them?
> 
> Man, 101, you sure can flap dem lips like we was in the 3rd grade cafeteria.What could possible make you want to do that? Sounds like yer riding the gravy train.:msp_glare:


 It has nothing to do with that , this all started over what I called a "GIMMICK " he got upset and posted dialog to me , I have said in the past that I want nothing to do with him and have stayed away .. Why do you care anyway ? Seems like now your just being a #### too but maybe I am wrong , its just appears that way , if your gonna have something to say to 2 people acting crazy than post too the both of us , I don't have a problem with you "AT ALL" right now and I am hoping that this doesn't start us down the wrong road ... Maybe I should just allow someone to talk trash unchecked to me here and just ACT as though its fine ...


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## treeclimber101 (Feb 27, 2011)

treemandan said:


> All the mudsling and name calling really just obscures the issues, its a pansy tactic.
> 
> I read again from The Book of Dan:
> 
> ...


 I am sorry but I have already hugged all the trees in my yard , and turned the other cheek but really , Have I EVER said anything to YOU or MDS or ever really argued with someone and thrown a little hate out there that hasn't had it coming somehow , I don't live in poems sorry man , if I got something to say that out it comes through a post or more importantly from my mouth and believe me I would never post anything here that I wouldn't say in person ..


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## treeclimber101 (Feb 27, 2011)

You know what Ben I am sorry , flat out I was wrong to jump on you .. And if I have offended you that It will NEVER happen again ...


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## tree MDS (Feb 27, 2011)

treemandan said:


> All the mudsling and name calling really just obscures the issues, its a pansy tactic.
> 
> I read again from The Book of Dan:
> 
> ...


 
Don't even get me going on the pansy thing again dano! lol.

Back on topic here, did all you guys actually read the article in the OP? something in there about a license to groom cats, this broad says you have to really know your stuff and prove it 'before you put a cat on the table'. lol. It's called being a 'certified master cat groomer', or some ####! lmao!!

I gotta say, I'm definitely not for any more licensing within our trade.. I'm really not that concerned if some dumbass smashes a house or clobbers one of his cheap ass customers with a limb, takes out the powerlines.. whatever, just makes me look better!!

Life is complicated enough already.. and be careful what you ask for with these people too, just might get more than you bargained for.. especially with the government envolved!!


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## treemandan (Feb 27, 2011)

treeclimber101 said:


> I am sorry but I have already hugged all the trees in my yard , and turned the other cheek but really , Have I EVER said anything to YOU or MDS or ever really argued with someone and thrown a little hate out there that hasn't had it coming somehow , I don't live in poems sorry man , if I got something to say that out it comes through a post or more importantly from my mouth and believe me I would never post anything here that I wouldn't say in person ..


 
Actually every time you or IXT get into some kind of disscusion you both seem to start with the unrelated mudsling like ya'lls back in grade school or something. And not just between each other.
I believe that I have put many things into the light so you all could see you have little to argue about. But in your haste to spread diseased words to each other makes me believe you talk out of your own insecurities and fears. 
Now don't try to argue with me, everbody is insecure and scared for one and I am above the petty bickering anyway. There is little anyone could say to me that would actually hurt me and there is little I don't allready know.
So try to stay within the lines of mature intellect cause you both sound like children. I mean... well, I think you know what I mean, at least I hope you do. The Dan can only show you, He can't make you.


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## jefflovstrom (Feb 27, 2011)

I think you guy's drink too much!!!!!
 :msp_flapper::msp_flapper::msp_flapper:
Jeff:msp_smile:


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## NCTREE (Feb 27, 2011)

Geez! I haven't seen this much fighting and bickering since Dan called me a pansy:msp_smile:


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## treemandan (Feb 27, 2011)

NCTREE said:


> Geez! I haven't seen this much fighting and bickering since Dan called me a pansy:msp_smile:


 
Did I call you a pansy or did I say I thought you were acting like one?


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## NCTREE (Feb 27, 2011)

treemandan said:


> Did I call you a pansy or did I say I thought you were acting like one?


 
Uh...IDK, maybe I called you a pansy or something. Don't really care anymore, could care less what people think its the internet.


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## lxt (Feb 28, 2011)

tree MDS said:


> There was that comment.. something about a septic field, I believe. Seems like you only remember saying what you feel like remembering.. just saying here..


 

Ok, maybe it came across wrong.....I wasnt insulting his kids! I was offering his family a job..........Look, I have went rounds with this bun boy else where, I dont like him...flat out & now even less that I know how he operates his biz un-american like...!

Im insulting his children?????? He insults his own children & family with what he hires as employees.....he makes comment that gimmicks & such are destroying our trade by lowering costs........PLEeaasssee, what im doing doesnt even rival the begginings of the shortcomings to screwing this trade as he is doing!!!!!

So a septic field was bad.........but this cowardly, lying, loud mouth can run his "POS" mouth & say derogatory things about me, my biz & upcoming wedding & thats ok?....I sling mud right back for the sake of putting ball bags like him in his place.

His comments of me/others using "gimmicks" is suppose to make us feel bad?? Ill use gimmicks all day long if it means I dont have to hire the sort he does & if that sort didnt work for 2 pesos a day, beans & a burrito maybe others & I wouldnt have to use what he refers to as "gimmicks" cause then the playing field as far as money/costs go would truly be even!!

I have mentioned why I dont want a license & more regulations along with how in-effectual enforcement will be!!, case in point: here all of you have watched as TC & I have went back & forth over stupid crap......2 points of view that clash to a point of childish absurdity................now imagine us 2 in a room together trying to get rules & regs for licensing passed as law  

Now if we can discuss the topic......? & move on!!!




LXT.................


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## pdqdl (Feb 28, 2011)

treeclimber101 said:


> ... Have I EVER said anything to YOU or MDS or ever really argued with someone and thrown a little hate out there that hasn't had it coming somehow ...


 
Yes.

You posted quite the vitriolic comments to me about your relative snow removal experience and how snow removal should be conducted.

http://www.arboristsite.com/commercial-tree-care-climbing/157092.htm#post2622129

Not trying to bust your balls or anything, it's just that you come off pretty insulting and overly aggressive in many of your posts. You stated that you were smart and that I was lucky, you referred to my "stupid ass", while accusing me of taking cash payments to obscure my income, which was not even a topic of the conversation, and you stated that my business sounded shadey (sic), while making comparisons to cowpokes from Kansas. 

This was my balanced and reasonable response to your offensive post: http://www.arboristsite.com/commercial-tree-care-climbing/157092.htm#post2623005

You might waste less time in verbal battles if you didn't start so many.


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## treeclimber101 (Feb 28, 2011)

pdqdl said:


> Yes.
> 
> You posted quite the vitriolic comments to me about your relative snow removal experience and how snow removal should be conducted.
> 
> ...


 
SORRY.. It can get a little crazy sometimes ...You may not just flat out name call or insult but you can subtly dig on me too ... but I have know when enough is enough and some people just don't play well together all the time .. But I have lightened up alot with our "DEBATES" but I should always be the one to stop , look at post 173 he still is talking


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## pdqdl (Feb 28, 2011)

You are right. I don't do any name calling, and I try not to insult folks, but I am often taken for an arrogant ass. In fact, sometimes I guess I work hard at being one.

Subtle digs? You give me too much credit. I always thought I was pretty direct with them. 

I think both you and Lxt got pretty dirty in this mudflinging contest. I usually try to bow out before I inspire the other guy to throw too much mud at me. Right or wrong, you can't come out too big a winner in these verbal battles.

No one is perfect here in this forum, although there are a few gentlemen that hang out here whose opinion I respect a great deal.


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## treeclimber101 (Mar 1, 2011)

It would appear to me that If I say black you will surely say white so there is where it gets a little heated for me , but I am sure the same goes for me as well .. No harm no foul I don't really have any hard feelings with you , I just name call to get out the tongue and cheek #### out of the way ....


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## pdqdl (Mar 2, 2011)

Silly boy!

I almost never disagree with folks that are already agreeing with me. All you have to do is just say black when I am...then we'll get along great.


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## Chris Francis (Nov 21, 2012)

*License to do tree care*

Ugghhhhhh!!!!! I just read this entire thread, and I am none the wiser for doing so. I am actually interested in the topic, but I have been seriously turned off by the insulting banter. My thoughts:

- Licensing by the government means more government intrusion into eveyone's lives, but I'm guessing it could be enforced by the income from licensing fees and fines (for non-compliance). In Alabama, we have 4 horticultural categories governed by the Department of Agriculture; however the offenders generally get a slap on the wrist and a push to get proper licensing. Rarely do you see substantial fines materialize. Now, there is a push to change some laws with tree care, pesticide licensing, and irrigation licensing. And while I am torn on the issues (more about that in a minute), I feel it is in my best interest and that of the industry to get involved in the changes. We will have to live with the changes, so being involved with organizations that work with the Department of Ag. can help make sure that the new laws are reasonable and actually workable. 

- About regs, I don't think we "need" them, and I want less government intrusion, less government paperwork, fewer fees, and less burden. But I also see what licensing has done for certain industries, like hair cutting and plumbing. It forces the businesses and operators to become professional, gets a better product to the consumer, and effectively raises the rates for the business and employees. For example, if you want to be a plumber, you have to train and work under someone else for 2 years, then take a test, get your Journeyman's license, then work for like 5 years under a Master Plumber before taking another test. I may be wrong on some of those details, but the point is that you can't just get a truck and call yourself a plumber. We see every day, people get themselves a truck and a chainsaw, and call themselves a tree expert. Or, some guy gets a lawn mower in the back of a truck, and all of a sudden he is a "Landscaper." 

- Licensing and more government oversight is the wave of the future, whether we like it or not, so we may as well get involved to make sure we can live with the laws that will be passed and enforced.


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## Chris Francis (Nov 21, 2012)

*Hiring Mexicans to do tree work*

And the talk about and bashing of Mexicans is really uncalled for. While I agree that having low wage employees, especially illegals working, is damning to the industry and effectively lowers wages and price, this does not mean that all Hispanics are illegal or cheap. I don't mind going on record to say that people that are here illegally need to be deported, regardless of color or country of origin. But I really can't fault the Hispanics for being here. They can earn higher wages, and send most of it back home to help their families, which is something that most Americans would not even think about doing. They are willing to move thousands of miles away from friends, family, and home to try for a better future; whereas most Americans would rather sit on their butts and collect a check than move across town, much less move clear across the country or globe. Hispanics tend to have great work ethic, which is getting harder and harder to find in the American worker. And they do so because they have to figure things out or starve to death. Our free ride programs have ruined the work ethic inthis country. I have had legal Hispanics that's earned a really nice income. And before you advertise publicly that you won't hire someone because of his heritage, consider the legal consequences, especially in this ever-increasing litigious society. Personally, I don't care what your race, sex, religion, or sexual preference is; I just want people that show up and get the job done. I don't like the idea of hiring someone for their ethnicity or gender either, like affirmative action. I just think it shouldn't matter. I want the best man or woman for the job. But I do find it ironic that the left is so about hiring people for who they are and being fair, and not so much about whether they can do they can do the job or not; meanwhile, Hollywood can look for very specific person to fill a modeling or acting role (white man, 6'2", 195 pounds, muscular build, brown hair, and a mole). If I put out an ad anything similar to that, my butt would be in a court room, if not a jail cell. "Now hiring, white men." Yeah, right! And in this melting pot, don't be surprised to find "mixed" people, like I am.


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