# Meteor Cylinder Kits



## wigglesworth (Apr 28, 2011)

Got the new baileys flier today. Meteor Cylinder Kits are $149. Anybody else anxious to try one? Im bettin there nice.


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## lfnh (Apr 28, 2011)

If the cylinders are anything like the piston quality, bet they will be pretty good. Priced right.


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## jus2fat (Apr 28, 2011)

Would any of you rebuilders please explain briefly the difference 
between a Mahle cylinder kit and a Meteor cylinder kit.
Basically, from what I gather Mahle is/was stock on Stihls??

Is one more preferable than the other...and why??

I did a search and found this about Meteor...and it sounds good...!!!

http://www.arboristsite.com/baileys/168600.htm

I'm just curious...as I've read many posts with both brands mentioned...
if I ever do a rebuild...
I would just like to have some knowledge of both before buying.
TIA for any replies...!!

J2F


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## mdavlee (Apr 28, 2011)

Mahle is oem for husky, dolmar, and some stihl cylinders still. Meteor is an aftermarket manufacturer. The mahle kits for stihls are usually over $300.


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## motoman.5150 (Apr 29, 2011)

What !!! no BBkits :bang:


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## wigglesworth (May 13, 2011)

Well, I got one in the mail the otter day. The jug don't look bad, but is definitely rough around the edges. Also some bad rough spots on the squish band, but the combustion chamber appears a lot smaller than oem, so that's a plus. I'll se if i can get some pics up soon.


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## RiverRat2 (May 13, 2011)

wigglesworth said:


> Well, I got one in the mail the otter day. The jug don't look bad, but is definitely rough around the edges. Also some bad rough spots on the squish band, but the combustion chamber appears a lot smaller than oem, so that's a plus. I'll se if i can get some pics up soon.



Sounds good,,, get crackin!!!!!!


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## ttyR2 (May 13, 2011)

Mahle is also an OEM supplier for Porsche. They are the defacto standard in aluminum casting for engines.


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## lfnh (May 13, 2011)

wigglesworth said:


> Well, I got one in the mail the otter day. The jug don't look bad, but is definitely rough around the edges. Also some bad rough spots on the squish band, but the combustion chamber appears a lot smaller than oem, so that's a plus. I'll se if i can get some pics up soon.


 
Any chance you could check jug bore with a gage for run out
at top and around ports ? Thanks.


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## Mad Professor (May 13, 2011)

For _some saws_ there is still another quality option, tecomec/precision tooling.

Last I checked a 026 kit was $170 USD.

They make OEM parts for motorcycles too: Ducati.


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## Meadow Beaver (May 13, 2011)

The only current Mahle p&c that I can think of for Stihl is the MS880.


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## SkippyKtm (May 14, 2011)

Mad Professor said:


> For _some saws_ there is still another quality option, tecomec/precision tooling.
> 
> Last I checked a 026 kit was $170 USD.
> 
> They make OEM parts for motorcycles too: Ducati.


 
Don't forget Gilardoni, they make a good cylinder as well. I believe they made cylinders for Moto-Guzzi.


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## RiverRat2 (May 14, 2011)

jus2fat said:


> Would any of you rebuilders please explain briefly the difference
> between a Mahle cylinder kit and a Meteor cylinder kit.
> Basically, from what I gather Mahle is/was stock on Stihls??
> 
> ...


 
If You ever do a rebuild??? if you keep hanging around here its only a matter of time,,, then once you do the first one and it runs good!!!!

Look out!!!! then you're toast cause the CAD overdrive kicks in!!!!!!! LOLOLOL!!!!


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## fatboymoe (May 14, 2011)

I just bought a new MS 460 from Brad that he ported and it had a Mahle P&C. Maybe it's just the luck of the draw now.


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## FATGUY (May 14, 2011)

SkippyKtm said:


> Don't forget Gilardoni, they make a good cylinder as well. I believe they made cylinders for Moto-Guzzi.


 
+1


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## slipknot (May 14, 2011)

SkippyKtm said:


> Don't forget Gilardoni, they make a good cylinder as well. I believe they made cylinders for Moto-Guzzi.


 
They are OEM for all efco saws! good quality

According to gregg from baileys these meteors are gilardoni cylinders...he just cant spell..lol
I copied and pasted this from that other meteor link
Howdy,
They're beeing cast in Taiwan. Machined and Plated by Gilatdoni in Italy, and stuffed with a Meteor piston.
Regards
Gregg


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## Fred482 (May 14, 2011)

Mahle makes replacement pistons and engine kits for some of the light duty diesels too, GM 6.2 & 6.5 are two listed in their catalog. They make special application trubo pistons, lower pin heights, etc. They are also making movement in the high performance after-market for most popular automotive gas engine applications.


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## promac850 (May 14, 2011)

ttyR2 said:


> Mahle is also an OEM supplier for Porsche. They are the defacto standard in aluminum casting for engines.


 
Also for VW, Audi, Bugatti, and some more auto, and powersports manufacturers...

The pistons in my VW 1.8L four banger are Mahle.

The pistons in a 2002 Ford Mustang GT Cobra are Mahle.

The Mahle company knows what they are doing when it comes to pistons and such...

As mentioned by Fred482, Mahle makes diesel pistons, and much more for both stock and aftermarket applications.


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## Roanoker494 (May 14, 2011)

SkippyKtm said:


> Don't forget Gilardoni, they make a good cylinder as well. I believe they made cylinders for Moto-Guzzi.


 
They have also provided top ends for a few Husqvarna saws over the years, I believe it was either the 268 or 272.


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## mweba (May 14, 2011)

Roanoker494 said:


> They have also provided top ends for a few Husqvarna saws over the years, I believe it was either the 268 or 272.


 
Add the non decomp 288 P&C to that list.


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## wigglesworth (Jun 29, 2011)

I figured id post some pics, as its been a while. First pic is of the crappy combustion chamber. It was real bad, and actually hung down into the cylinder a bit. 







When it was shipped, the slug was just dropped into the barrel, and this is what it did to the top of the piston from the long ride from CA.


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## wigglesworth (Jun 29, 2011)

Here is the combustion chamber after re-surfacing.


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## wigglesworth (Jun 29, 2011)

There was a pretty bad void on the exhaust port floor. It's fixed now, and there was ample room to do so, but it was there nonetheless.


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## wigglesworth (Jun 29, 2011)

Here was the void from the cylinder side. Nevermind the scratches in the plating, as they werent there when it got here, just some rubbing from cutting the chamber. They came right out.


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## woodgrenade (Jun 29, 2011)

Thanks for the pics. I've been considering this kit. Not really liking what I'm seeing though


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## wigglesworth (Jun 29, 2011)

woodgrenade said:


> Thanks for the pics. I've been considering this kit. Not really liking what I'm seeing though


 
Im really only showing the bad. The piston is like all meteor's, which is perfect, other than the damage to the top, but it aint bad. The plating is perfect, smooth and even, but it does have a small dark ring around the top from the plating missing, and there is a small spot near the top where there was a machine mark in the cylinder that got plated over. all the probems is in the casting, not the plating. I havent measured the combustion chamber volume, but it's nicely sized and very well machined. All I have done is I opened the lower transfers, as they were tiny and not symetrical, but that is all I have done thus far. Im gonna put it together with the ports untouched for now and see how she runs before I start grinding on it. Well see how she goes.


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## wigglesworth (Jun 29, 2011)

Here is a shot of the transfers after I opened them. I looked and cant find a before pic. WHoops. You can also see they went hog wild with the bevels on the ports. Oh well, nothing a grinder cant fix.  Anyways, like I said, this is the only grinding that has been done other than smooth the exhaust floor void out. Nothing has been changed to the timing yet. 






ANd here is the test mule for it. Other than JB patch in the front of it, its a pretty nice case. All new OEM bearings, seals and gaskets.


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## mtngun (Jun 29, 2011)

wigglesworth said:


> it does have a small dark ring around the top from the plating missing


Bummer.

Plating doesn't go to the top, and combustion chamber machined incorrectly. There went my interest in the Meteor jugs.

Thanks for the great pics and explanation, Wigglesworth. :msp_thumbsup:


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## wigglesworth (Jun 29, 2011)

mtngun said:


> Bummer.
> 
> Plating doesn't go to the top, and combustion chamber machined incorrectly. There went my interest in the Meteor jugs.
> 
> Thanks for the great pics and explanation, Wigglesworth. :msp_thumbsup:


 
Your welcome. The comustion chamber is an easy enough fix, but the plating void is not.


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## roostersgt (Jun 30, 2011)

Wow! Thanks for sharing. OEM from Ebay looking better all the time for cylinders.


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## nmurph (Jun 30, 2011)

That cylinder isn't any better than the NWP kits and they are 1/3 the cost, though the piston might be a little better. Still, for the weekend cutter, I think the quality is passable. For someone who is using their saw daily, the money might be better spent on OEM.


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## wigglesworth (Jun 30, 2011)

nmurph said:


> That cylinder isn't any better than the NWP kits and they are 1/3 the cost, though the piston might be a little better. Still, for the weekend cutter, I think the quality is passable. For someone who is using their saw daily, the money might be better spent on OEM.


 
Agreed. IIRC, I was told they were cast in tiawan, then shipped to Italy to finish. I'm bettin they came from the exact same place.


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## Jacob J. (Jun 30, 2011)

You sure did good work on that combustion chamber J. It looks like it will make a great runner.


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## JDNicol (Jun 30, 2011)

SkippyKtm said:


> Don't forget Gilardoni.


 
Or Kolbenshmidt.


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## Arrowhead (Jun 30, 2011)

Cool... it has 2 sparkplugs. :msp_rolleyes:

That's a shame about the quality. I thought it would be much better. 

Thanks for the pics Jeremy.


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## fredmc (Jun 30, 2011)

Roanoker494 said:


> They have also provided top ends for a few Husqvarna saws over the years, I believe it was either the 268 or 272.


 
66s' too


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## tdi-rick (Jun 30, 2011)

JDNicol said:


> Or Kolbenshmidt.


 

Didn't think they did small engine stuff anymore (they used to cast cylinders and pistons for Dolmar, eg the 166) but found that they still supply Stihl with pistons from their European and Brazilian factories.

Googled and found a Bill of Loading from their Czech factory to Virginia Beach.


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## PogoInTheWoods (Jun 30, 2011)

Jacob J. said:


> You sure did good work on that combustion chamber J....



Indeed. Care to share the particular method used, Wiggs? 

Poge


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## AUSSIE1 (Jun 30, 2011)

Well that's unfortunate. 

I had to clean up another NWP kit that I've had sitting here for a while. Similar to what you have had to do here. Only I had to straighten a tilted exhaust port and cure the droop in the middle. Nikasil chipping around the upper transfers. There was an unmachined area around the squish where it met the combustion chamber that needed to be cleaned up.

Being aftermarket doesn't mean it can't be basically flawless. Just look at the meteor pistons!


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## trappermike (Jun 30, 2011)

Thanks for all the photos and info on them. I think they'd be ok stock replacements(If the prove to last) if some cleanup work is done on them.
Chipping Nikasil worries me,I'm curious to know if the plating remains intact after a lot of work.
The tiny little "nodules" left on the squish band could possibly be a problem if not cleaned up like you did a nice job doing. It's possible(Maybe remotely) that those little "nodes" could get hot and cause pre-ignition in the worst case.
The real question of the pistons is knowing exactly what aluminum alloy is used in making the pistons,more expensive pistons often have a higher silicone content. Mahle pistons are high quality stuff,used in Rotax snowmobile motors too(Skidoo),very high output motors,and used in many European motors of all sorts.. I've not really had many problems with jobber pistons in most things I've used them in,but I'm sure I wouldn't waste all the money and effort of building a really hot motor and using them.
I think after a little inspection and any necessary cleanup these could be cost effective replacements. Has anyone put some real time and work on these kits?


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## mweba (Jun 30, 2011)

AUSSIE1 said:


> Well that's unfortunate.
> 
> I had to clean up another NWP kit that I've had sitting here for a while. Similar to what you have had to do here. Only I had to straighten a tilted exhaust port and cure the droop in the middle. There was an unmachined area around the squish where it met the combustion chamber that needed to be cleaned up.


 
This has been my experience with the last half dozen kits.


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## wigglesworth (Jun 30, 2011)

PogoInTheWoods said:


> Indeed. Care to share the particular method used, Wiggs?
> 
> Poge


 
Sure. Nothing scientific. 







I used this modified mini flap wheel in a drill press to get it cut down, and used finer grit scotchbrite pads to finish it off. It may or may not be pefectly square, but it sure beats the chamber hanging down into the cylinder, and a much nicer finish than a dremel job.


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## wigglesworth (Jun 30, 2011)

Jacob J. said:


> You sure did good work on that combustion chamber J. It looks like it will make a great runner.


 
Thanks JJ. Im hope it runs well. If I cant source an OEM cylinder, it looks like this one might be on my build off saw. I was gonna do the whole she-bang with a pop up and all, but there isnt room with the dark ring of death around the top. Bummer.


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## Mastermind (Jun 30, 2011)

Good pics and stuff Wiggs. Those kits look good for the price but I ain't sure about them still.

Shame you can't get a pop-up in that thing my 460 is getting stronger everyday!!!


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## wigglesworth (Jun 30, 2011)

Mastermind said:


> Good pics and stuff Wiggs. Those kits look good for the price but I ain't sure about them still.
> 
> Shame you can't get a pop-up in that thing my 460 is getting stronger everyday!!!


 
I hear ya on that one. It's still not out of the question for a pop-up, as I know a really good tig welder. I've made them that way before. 


Yet again, I found another problem with the kit. The piston pin was too long. It was the same length as the OEM one, at 1.375, but there was no possible way to get the circlips in. No step for a stepper though.  Ended up using the OEM as it was noticibly lighter in the hand, and took .050 off it, and all is well.


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## JDNicol (Jul 1, 2011)

tdi-rick said:


> Didn't think they did small engine stuff anymore (they used to cast cylinders and pistons for Dolmar, eg the 166) but found that they still supply Stihl with pistons from their European and Brazilian factories.
> 
> Googled and found a Bill of Loading from their Czech factory to Virginia Beach.


 
I agree they don't do much anymore. They used to do P+Cs for some of the older Stihl/Husky/Jonsered e.g. Stihl 075/076, Husky 61 to name a few. I think they were also used on the 3120 at some point?

What you say about Virginia Beach would fit with what I have found more recently. Some of the smaller homeowner models seem to be coming out of Virginia Beach with Mahle cylinders and Kolbenshmidt pistons in them!


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## Mastermind (Jul 1, 2011)

wigglesworth said:


> I hear ya on that one. It's still not out of the question for a pop-up, as I know a really good tig welder. I've made them that way before.
> 
> 
> Yet again, I found another problem with the kit. The piston pin was too long. It was the same length as the OEM one, at 1.375, but there was no possible way to get the circlips in. No step for a stepper though.  Ended up using the OEM as it was noticibly lighter in the hand, and took .050 off it, and all is well.


 
I've heard several others say they found the pin to be too long in the meteor piston kit. I've had good luck with the meteor, and the golf in some apps, even though it's a heavy piston. The last two episan pistons I got had issues with the pin bosses. I had to open the connecting rod area to get the pin through. It was as if the bosses were not square with each other, preventing the rod from lining up with the pin. And yes, these two came from Greece.


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## wigglesworth (Jul 3, 2011)

Quick Tech lesson #1.....always inspect your equipment carefully.  So 1st thank of fuel it ate its fair share of sawdust. No worries, as im sure it will just help the break in process.  

The filter had a nice sized crack in it, but you couldnt see it unless you put pressure on it, or obviously torqued it down without the cover on. Oh well, It could be worse. 






And here she is, new filter in place, on her second tank full in a couple year old dry as crap white oak. Admittedly, its a bit too lean in this vid. It sounds real nice at 13.5K, but here it was closer to 14K. Its really not bad for AM. It runs a lot better than the BB variants out of the box, but still no where near OEM, IMHO. Its headed down to the mill tomorrow morning for a real world break in. Its nice to have friends in the industry. Every saw I build gets a first had torture test by the Mitch at the mill. If anybody can break it, Mitch can. LOL 

<iframe width="425" height="349" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/LM92xe1NVPM" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>


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## wigglesworth (Jul 3, 2011)

Comp ain't bad so far. I did square the base with the combustion chamber, but squish is still at .028. Once I go back into it, I don't think 170 or more will be a problem.


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## Outlaw5.0 (Jul 3, 2011)

roostersgt said:


> Wow! Thanks for sharing. OEM from Ebay looking better all the time for cylinders.


That is what I'm going to do once I have the spare funds.


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## wigglesworth (Jul 3, 2011)

Outlaw5.0 said:


> That is what I'm going to do once I have the spare funds.


 
At this point, I'm gonna agree with u 100%. It definitely won't run with a stocker, but it's still tight as can be. Once it returns from the torture test, I'll make up another vid to see if she picks up any. 

If u happen to find any used OEM, please share the wealth. Not been many on the bay lately.


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## Outlaw5.0 (Jul 3, 2011)

wigglesworth said:


> At this point, I'm gonna agree with u 100%. It definitely won't run with a stocker, but it's still tight as can be. Once it returns from the torture test, I'll make up another vid to see if she picks up any.
> 
> If u happen to find any used OEM, please share the wealth. Not been many on the bay lately.


The last used cylinder I purchased on Ebay ended being a old 046 D-shaped chamber. Someone had honed it, the plating is paper thin. I need a piston to run the D-cylinder, since all my pistons have a dome. It probably won't run the best, but I'll give it a go. I'm buying new OEM from now on, too many sellers not telling the "entire" truth on used parts.


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## stihl038x2 (Jul 3, 2011)

Mastermind said:


> I've heard *several others say they found the pin to be too long in the meteor piston kit*. I've had good luck with the meteor, and the golf in some apps, even though it's a heavy piston. The last two episan pistons I got had issues with the pin bosses. I had to open the connecting rod area to get the pin through. It was as if the bosses were not square with each other, preventing the rod from lining up with the pin. And yes, these two came from Greece.



Yep, I've posted on more than one forum to watch the pin lengths on assembly, I think some premature failures may be attributed to this problem :taped:

Steve


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## Stihlofadeal64 (Jan 18, 2012)

I know this thread has some time on it, but after reading about aftermarket circlips, I'm not sure that I understand the final solution. One poster said the aftermarket clips had essentially no temper in their make-up and essentially when they are pushed in they are weakened to the point that they come out. Another suggestion was to go with the OEM, but the reply was that the OEM clips will not fit the aftermarket piston groove. NOW:

What's the end solution. If I buy a quality aftermarket Meteor/Episan piston am I going to have to hit the hardware store to find a circlip that will fit my piston, or am I missing it somewhere here? Thanks for your reply.


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## Jacob J. (Jan 18, 2012)

Stihlofadeal64 said:


> What's the end solution. If I buy a quality aftermarket Meteor/Episan piston am I going to have to hit the hardware store to find a circlip that will fit my piston, or am I missing it somewhere here? Thanks for your reply.



You're not going to find one at the hardware store, unless the hardware store is a Stihl/Husqvarna dealer. Most hardware stores only carry snap rings and those are not suitable for modern chainsaw pistons due to the clip groove being hemispherical in shape and a snap ring being square in profile.

You may need to get creative with a Dremel or simply find an OEM clip that works.


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## nmurph (Jan 18, 2012)

JJ, have you compiled any measurements of OEM clips? That would be great bc lots of times the OEM and AM clips do not share dimensions for the same piston.


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## Bowtie (Jan 18, 2012)

I also took another member's advice and put a lil dab of loctite on the snap ring when I install it. It cant hurt.


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## PogoInTheWoods (Jan 18, 2012)

Bowtie said:


> I also took another member's advice and put a lil dab of loctite on the snap ring when I install it. It cant hurt.



Locking it to what? And it seems like even a small chunk of loctite getting loose in a cylinder wouldn't be very good for a piston. Also seems like it would be even more risky than using aftermarket clips.:msp_confused:

Poge


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## Jacob J. (Jan 18, 2012)

nmurph said:


> JJ, have you compiled any measurements of OEM clips? That would be great bc lots of times the OEM and AM clips do not share dimensions for the same piston.



I could probably get some. I have a whole box of aftermarket clips from the hundreds of saws I've gone through in last seven years or so. 

I also have a few dozen pairs of the "grooved" piston rings that Bailey's supplies with their in-house pistons in all of the common sizes if you
guys want any. I'm not going to use them. The first and last time I used one it broke after a couple hours use (Big Bore 372) but I caught it
before any real damage occurred.


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## nmurph (Jan 18, 2012)

Maybe we could do a thread and post measurements. We would need pin size and clip diameter and what saw is comes from; anything else? I'm NOT going to suggest it be a stickie!!


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## AUSSIE1 (Jan 18, 2012)

nmurph said:


> JJ, have you compiled any measurements of OEM clips? That would be great bc lots of times the OEM and AM clips do not share dimensions for the same piston.



There is a lot of variance in wire dia between makes for a particular saw.


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## nmurph (Jan 18, 2012)

AUSSIE1 said:


> There is a lot of variance in wire dia between makes for a particular saw.



Are you saying that measuring pistons from the same lot will reveal differing clip diameters? If so, then at what point does the difference become significant enough to cause problems? Off the top of my head (yeah dangerous, I know), 346 Meteor clips are about .042 and the OEM clips are about .028. I will try to get some exact numbers tonight.


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## Bowtie (Jan 18, 2012)

PogoInTheWoods said:


> Locking it to what? And it seems like even a small chunk of loctite getting loose in a cylinder wouldn't be very good for a piston. Also seems like it would be even more risky than using aftermarket clips.:msp_confused:
> 
> Poge



Well, for one, loctite activates under pressure among other things. So the spring action of the circlip creates that effect. Also I use just a tiny bit on the ring ends, not a whole drizzling, oozing red gaping wound sort of deal at all. No way will there be any "small chunks" getting loose. I do not use aftermarket clips anymore either. Learned that the hard way.


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## PogoInTheWoods (Jan 18, 2012)

Bowtie said:


> Well, for one, loctite activates under pressure among other things. So the spring action of the circlip creates that effect. Also I use just a tiny bit on the ring ends, not a whole drizzling, oozing red gaping wound sort of deal at all. No way will there be any "small chunks" getting loose. I do not use aftermarket clips anymore either. Learned that the hard way.



So the question remains...., it locks what to what in the particular application you describe to minimize the probability of aftermarket circlip failure -- or OEM circlip failure for that matter?

opcorn:

And regarding the OEM vs. AM circlip physical dimension specs, seems like the various physical dimension specs of the grooves in the respective pistons need to be part of any assessment of what clip to use -- based on that criteria alone.

How many of you put an OEM clip in a AM piston application "just because" without actually measuring what is specifically required in the physical tolerances/dimensions involved in that particular situation -- or just automatically "know" it is the best way to go, again, just because?

Will an OEM 10mm Stihl circlip automatically be a better choice for an application with an aftermarket piston in all cases requiring a 10mm pin -- period?

Not wanting to be an a-hole, here. Just want to understand a more logical realm of reasoning besides all the standard "I learned the hard way, done it a thousand times, or will never do it again" stuff.

Why don't the vendors who are selling all this AM junk offer a disclaimer against the fact that their circlips and wrist pins are basically trash and should be discarded in favor of OEM, but "You can't beat our pistons!"

Poge


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## Bowtie (Jan 18, 2012)

PogoInTheWoods said:


> So the question remains...., it locks what to what in the particular application you describe to minimize the probability of aftermarket circlip failure -- or OEM circlip failure for that matter?
> 
> opcorn:
> 
> ...



Very good point Poge. When the Meteor piston failed in the 064 I built, I called and talked to a Bailey's tech. He asked me what circlips I used. I told him I used the clips supplied with the kit. he advised me to use OE clips. I said "I used the supplied clips because if I had a problem you would have told me I used clips other than supplied". He could not deny that. I then asked him what clips to use with the new topend I was ordering. He said to use the supplied clips. What the hell?

I agree, not all OE circlips fit aftermarket pistons of the same saw. Usually the aftermarket clips are larger diameter. The OE clips did fit my 064 however. A few off the top of my head that did not fit were 034/036 and some of the 026.

The loctite deal I dont know if it works or not, I have only tried this once. I hate circlip failures.


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## PogoInTheWoods (Jan 18, 2012)

Bowtie said:


> Very good point Poge. When the Meteor piston failed in the 064 I built, I called and talked to a Bailey's tech. He asked me what circlips I used. I told him I used the clips supplied with the kit. he advised me to use OE clips. I said "I used the supplied clips because if I had a problem you would have told me I used clips other than supplied". He could not deny that. I then asked him what clips to use with the new topend I was ordering. He said to use the supplied clips. What the hell?
> 
> I agree, not all OE circlips fit aftermarket pistons of the same saw. Usually the aftermarket clips are larger diameter. The OE clips did fit my 064 however. A few off the top of my head that did not fit were 034/036 and some of the 026.
> 
> The loctite deal I dont know if it works or not, I have only tried this once. I hate circlip failures.



In defense of the "OEM Only" positiion, I have experienced considerable confusion with an AM topend kit for an 026 that presented some circlip challenges -- as in they weren't even close to the correct sized clips. I reluctantly re-used the OEM clips for the task at hand, but they weren't quite right either. My saw. No problem. Runs great -- for now.

Makes me nervous every time I fire it up -- as it should considering the lack of conformity across the board with what is probably the single-most critical component of any saw whether it be a bigbox cheapie or a high-end production machine.

A half cent piece of metal (if that) without specifically established standards and specifications from which we can make educated choices or decisions for even using, (let alone replacing), that piece of metal for our own specific/particular applications...

Poge


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## wigglesworth (Dec 4, 2012)

With the recent talks, I figured I'd bump this. This top end is still truck'in on today, I might add.


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## WoodChuck'r (Dec 4, 2012)

wigglesworth said:


> With the recent talks, I figured I'd bump this. This top end is still truck'in on today, I might add.






Not only will I point out how self indulged you are to bump one of your own threads back into submission - I will do you one better by pointing out the most obvious fact here, chump - no one cares. :msp_angry:


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## wigglesworth (Dec 4, 2012)

WoodChuck'r said:


> Not only will I point out how self indulged you are to bump one of your own threads back into submission - I will do you one better by pointing out the most obvious fact here, chump - no one cares. :msp_angry:


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## WoodChuck'r (Dec 4, 2012)

Oh.... Oh I'm sorry buddy....


Why I.... I.... I thought you were someone else....




You know I'd never talk to my little cupcake like that. :wink2:


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## blsnelling (Dec 4, 2012)

wigglesworth said:


> First pic is of the crappy combustion chamber. It was real bad, and actually hung down into the cylinder a bit.
> 
> There was a pretty bad void on the exhaust port floor.
> 
> ...





wigglesworth said:


> With the recent talks, I figured I'd bump this. This top end is still truck'in on today, I might add.



From your perspective as a builder, this cylinder was "salvageable". To the average user, it was unuseable in it's delivered state.


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## wigglesworth (Dec 4, 2012)

blsnelling said:


> From your perspective as a builder, this cylinder was "salvageable". To the average user, it was unuseable in it's delivered state.



The only thing that would had kept it from running was the wrist pin length. From an "end user" perspective, would it had ran and cut wood? Yep. No doubt. That void in the casting was in the beveled part, and wouldn't had touched the ring. 

From a max performance standpoint, that kit needed help, no doubt. 

All I'm saying is don't write em off. For their price point, they are every bit as good as any other aftermarket cylinder out there.


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## Mastermind (Dec 4, 2012)

I've been running the snot outta one......totally unaltered.

I did just finish porting it tonight though.


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## blsnelling (Dec 4, 2012)

wigglesworth said:


> All I'm saying is don't write em off. For their price point, they are every bit as good as any other aftermarket cylinder out there.



That's pretty much what I have done. I will not work on a paying customers saw with an AM topend. It's not worth their money or my time and reputation.


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## kevinm9558 (Dec 4, 2012)

Mastermind said:


> I did just finish porting it tonight though.



So how would a :newbie: like me go about porting a saw, if they were so inclined?


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## Mastermind (Dec 4, 2012)

kevinm9558 said:


> So how would a :newbie: like me go about porting a saw, if they were so inclined?



Well I sell these kits see.


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## WoodChuck'r (Dec 4, 2012)

kevinm9558 said:


> So how would a :newbie: like me go about porting a saw, if they were so inclined?





They'd box their saw up and send it to someone who knows what they're doing.


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## president (Apr 23, 2017)

JDNicol said:


> Or Kolbenshmidt.


t-1


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