# Door knocking -Soliciting



## chipperscompany

I know door knocking has to be the most effective way to get customers, however, I seem to stay blank whenever I approach a customer. Especially not know the kind of reaction I will get. My question to you is, what do you say when knocking on a strangers door to offer your tree services? Like a script. I would like to read what every says. I know I have to be happy and polite. Thanks guys


----------



## mckeetree

chipperscompany said:


> I know door knocking has to be the most effective way to get customers, however, I seem to stay blank whenever I approach a customer. Especially not know the kind of reaction I will get. My question to you is, what do you say when knocking on a strangers door to offer your tree services? Like a script. I would like to read what every says. I know I have to be happy and polite. Thanks guys



I thought door knockers were all bums. Are you a bum?


----------



## chipperscompany

umm no. A lot of small business do it to advertise. Heck, even Verizon wireless has salespeople door knocking. So your telling me you don't solicitate mckeetree?


----------



## mckeetree

chipperscompany said:


> umm no. A lot of small business do it to advertise. Heck, even Verizon wireless has salespeople door knocking. So your telling me you don't solicitate mckeetree?



I never solicite. I read a TCIA article a year or so ago that said it is almost unheard of for a good tree company to go door to door looking for work. I have been saying that for 20 years.


----------



## TreeBot

"Would you care for a free estimate?"

I don't knock on doors but if I am slow I will stop if I see someone in their yard who is in obvious need to my services. The best is if you drive by and see them staring into the tops of their trees with a puzzled look on their face.


----------



## ASD

If I were going door to door I would say something like "hi I am a hak with no work and nothin beter to do then pester ya and i wana no if ya needs some tree work cuse i need cash"

But we do not do d to d


----------



## ASD

Ok on the other hand their is one scenario that we would do d to d that's when we are in 911 mode and are working on a property and the property next door or across the st. has a blocked drive way or some other 911.


----------



## chipperscompany

mckeetree said:


> I never solicite. I read a TCIA article a year or so ago that said it is almost unheard of for a good tree company to go door to door looking for work. I have been saying that for 20 years.



Difference between me and you is you have been in business for over 20 years, were as we have been in business for a few years. Therefore, you most likely have repeated customers calling or being refered to you keeping you busy. Don't get me wrong we are very loyal to our customers and always we leave a great job, but we are not quite there yet and could use some extra leads.


----------



## mckeetree

ASD said:


> If I were going door to door I would say something like "hi I am a hak with no work and nothin beter to do then pester ya and i wana no if ya needs some tree work cuse i need cash"
> 
> But we do not do d to d



I love it. Who could have said it better.


----------



## Burvol

ASD said:


> If I were going door to door I would say something like "hi I am a hak with no work and nothin beter to do then pester ya and i wana no if ya needs some tree work cuse i need cash"
> 
> But we do not do d to d



I know it's funny, but it's also disgusting, rude, and down right mean to critique a working man who is trying hard to make it. You should be ashamed of yourself for making fun of someone who could very well have little, nothing to loose, and would probably kill you for your last piece of bread. I have been there, and it sucks. 

No one wants to go door to door. It's not easy, and it's not the proudest of things to do either. But hey, this guy wants to work and is willing to do so. It's sad you can't recognize that, but instead pick him apart for wanting to succeed.


----------



## Metals406

Burvol said:


> I know it's funny, but it's also disgusting, rude, and down right mean to critique a working man who is trying hard to make it. You should be ashamed of yourself for making fun of someone who could very well have little, nothing to loose, and would probably kill you for your last piece of bread. I have been there, and it sucks.
> 
> No one wants to go door to door. It's not easy, and it's not the proudest of things to do either. But hey, this guy wants to work and is willing to do so. It's sad you can't recognize that, but instead pick him apart for wanting to succeed.



Amen! The dude could have said, "Hey, I'm out of work... What Gub'Ment assistance programs should I sign up for, so I can sit on my ass."


----------



## mckeetree

Burvol said:


> I know it's funny, but it's also disgusting, rude, and down right mean to critique a working man who is trying hard to make it. You should be ashamed of yourself for making fun of someone who could very well have little, nothing to loose, and would probably kill you for your last piece of bread. I have been there, and it sucks.
> 
> No one wants to go door to door. It's not easy, and it's not the proudest of things to do either. But hey, this guy wants to work and is willing to do so. It's sad you can't recognize that, but instead pick him apart for wanting to succeed.



Hmmmmmmmmm.


----------



## ASD

Burvol said:


> I know it's funny, but it's also disgusting, rude, and down right mean to critique a working man who is trying hard to make it. You should be ashamed of yourself for making fun of someone who could very well have little, nothing to loose, and would probably kill you for your last piece of bread. I have been there, and it sucks.
> 
> No one wants to go door to door. It's not easy, and it's not the proudest of things to do either. But hey, this guy wants to work and is willing to do so. It's sad you can't recognize that, but instead pick him apart for wanting to succeed.



My bad

All i was trying to point out was that no mater what you have to say all people are going to here is BLA BLA BLA I have no work and need $$ 

It's a fact that d to d dose not work well and pisses people off !!!!!!! put an add on Craig's list or flyer's, post cards and the like would be a better use of time


----------



## Burvol

asd said:


> my bad
> 
> all i was trying to point out was that no mater what you have to say all people are going to here is bla bla bla i have no work and need $$
> 
> it's a fact that d to d dose not work well and pisses people off !!!!!!! Put an add on craig's list or flyer's, post cards and the like would be a better use of time



ok


----------



## Stein

chipperscompany said:


> Difference between me and you is you have been in business for over 20 years, were as we have been in business for a few years. Therefore, you most likely have repeated customers calling or being refered to you keeping you busy. Don't get me wrong we are very loyal to our customers and always we leave a great job, but we are not quite there yet and could use some extra leads.



If you have been around for a few years and have some good customers, maybe some that you have done repeat work for, I would start with them. Contact them to see if they know anyone else that would benefit from your services. Sometime they know that aunt Betty needs a tree removed or so and so needs trimming. They just don't think about it unless someone asks. If not (and some people are always hesitant to refer you to someone else directly-no offense to you or your work-it's just the way they are wired) then ask them if you could use them as a reference or would be willing to write a letter of recommendation. It's good to have a list of references ready in the event someone asks. Obviously, there are no guarantees, but your chances will be better this way than true cold calling.


----------



## tree md

When I was 10 years old I used to go door to door with my lawn mower asking to cut grass. I used to make $50 or $60 a week charging $10 a yard in the Summertime. Quite a bit of coin for a 10 year old in the 70's.

When I got into tree work I started out with some tree gypsies who would door knock. Not that there weren't excellent climbers to learn from, on the contrary, there were a couple of excellent climbers and salesmen I learned from. I worked with a guy my first three years that went from solicitor to big time with 2 full page yellowpage ads. I literally watched and helped him grow into something to really be proud of. Probably the best experience I could have ever received. I learned all aspects of the business from this guy, climbing, sales, efficient ground work, how to survive.

When I started out on my own I made his plan my own. I would door knock and solicit. Back in GA we had many dead pines. I would cruise neighborhoods and knock on doors with dead trees in the yard, introduce myself and tell them my company name, explain that I was working in the neighborhood and was giving really good prices while in the neighborhood and ask them if they would like me to quote them a price. Most were nice but you will get a few doors slammed in your face. Goes with the territory when your a salesman. Any good salesman can't be afraid to get a door slammed in their face or be rejected. You have to be thick skinned and not take it personal. I consider door knocking a form of guerrilla marketing. Guerrilla marketing is used by the best salesmen in the country no matter the profession. Hell my folks sell real estate and put out neighborhood news letters and go door to door delivering the news letter (flier) with info in it like what's been sold in their neighbor hood and how much. They offer free market analysis to people and let them know what their houses are worth and develope a lot of leads in doing so. You could print up brochures with proper tree care facts and deliver them door to door as an entrance. A good salesman will beat the bushes when times are slow. I normally do mass mailings of fliers but will post them on doors and mailboxes sometimes. I usually don't go door knocking these days but will definitely speak to someone if they are outside in the yard. Just haven't been hungry enough to door knock lately. Don't be ashamed to knock on doors, salesmen of all varieties have been doing it for eons. A good salesman does whatever he has to (ethically) to make the sale.


----------



## scott t

Burvol said:


> I know it's funny, but it's also disgusting, rude, and down right mean to critique a working man who is trying hard to make it. You should be ashamed of yourself for making fun of someone who could very well have little, nothing to loose, and would probably kill you for your last piece of bread. I have been there, and it sucks.
> 
> No one wants to go door to door. It's not easy, and it's not the proudest of things to do either. But hey, this guy wants to work and is willing to do so. It's sad you can't recognize that, but instead pick him apart for wanting to succeed.



:agree2: I do not do it but a man has to do what it takes to provide for his family..... 95% of my work is referal.


----------



## Dadatwins

chipperscompany said:


> I know door knocking has to be the most effective way to get customers, however, I seem to stay blank whenever I approach a customer. Especially not know the kind of reaction I will get. My question to you is, what do you say when knocking on a strangers door to offer your tree services? Like a script. I would like to read what every says. I know I have to be happy and polite. Thanks guys



Been there when I first started, if things get any rougher I might be there again. My approach was always to look at the property first and have specific jobs in mind, like limbs hitting the house, deadwood in a tree. Sell the small job and get them as a customer. After that you can discuss bigger projects, ie: extending the mulch bed in that shaded area under the oak tree would look great with a flowering dogwood in it. Never approach the customer asking them what they need, Selling is all about telling them what should be done as a professional in the business.


----------



## mckeetree

tree md said:


> When I was 10 years old I used to go door to door with my lawn mower asking to cut grass. I used to make $50 or $60 a week charging $10 a yard in the Summertime. Quite a bit of coin for a 10 year old in the 70's.
> 
> When I got into tree work I started out with some tree gypsies who would door knock. Not that there weren't excellent climbers to learn from, on the contrary, there were a couple of excellent climbers and salesmen I learned from. I worked with a guy my first three years that went from solicitor to big time with 2 full page yellowpage ads. I literally watched and helped him grow into something to really be proud of. Probably the best experience I could have ever received. I learned all aspects of the business from this guy, climbing, sales, efficient ground work, how to survive.
> 
> When I started out on my own I made his plan my own. I would door knock and solicit. Back in GA we had many dead pines. I would cruise neighborhoods and knock on doors with dead trees in the yard, introduce myself and tell them my company name, explain that I was working in the neighborhood and was giving really good prices while in the neighborhood and ask them if they would like me to quote them a price. Most were nice but you will get a few doors slammed in your face. Goes with the territory when your a salesman. Any good salesman can't be afraid to get a door slammed in their face or be rejected. You have to be thick skinned and not take it personal. I consider door knocking a form of guerrilla marketing. Guerrilla marketing is used by the best salesmen in the country no matter the profession. Hell my folks sell real estate and put out neighborhood news letters and go door to door delivering the news letter (flier) with info in it like what's been sold in their neighbor hood and how much. They offer free market analysis to people and let them know what their houses are worth and develope a lot of leads in doing so. You could print up brochures with proper tree care facts and deliver them door to door as an entrance. A good salesman will beat the bushes when times are slow. I normally do mass mailings of fliers but will post them on doors and mailboxes sometimes. I usually don't go door knocking these days but will definitely speak to someone if they are outside in the yard. Just haven't been hungry enough to door knock lately. Don't be ashamed to knock on doors, salesmen of all varieties have been doing it for eons. A good salesman does whatever he has to (ethically) to make the sale.



I hate tree gypsies. That is where the word gyp came from. I bet you are a piece of work.


----------



## John464

I don't knock on a door, but I will leave a card if I see a tree blown over up against the shed and laying on the fence like I did today.

While Im on my way to the estimate im driving slowly looking for any other potential work I can line up on the same street. I am working 3 houses in a row tomorrow that all have storm damage. If the card I left calls I'll have a 4th. I don't look desperate but ill be damn if I dont hustle to get work.

for the 60mph gusts we had Thursday night!


----------



## tree md

mckeetree said:


> I hate tree gypsies. That is where the word gyp came from. I bet you are a piece of work.



Your opinion means about as much to me as a mote of dust floating through the air.

Could care less of what you think of me. For the record, I have been in business 15 years on my own, am a member of the BBB and a well established tree service in my community. Some of the founders of this site have contracted with me. I am honorable and ethical, my word is gold in my town.

I come from hardscrabble people. My grandfather was a coal miner, my dad is a veteran who came home from the war and went to work for AT&T. He climbed microwave antennas to put food on our table when he started out even though he is afraid of heights. He was promoted to sales and when they deregulated the phone companies he camped out at the lobby of MCI on their first day in operation to sell the service of his company to people in the street on their own door step. That is where I learned the term "guerrilla marketing" I'm a fierce competitor and you better hope I never come to your town. There are plenty who would like to have me on thier payroll.


----------



## tree md

Chipperscompany,

Believe me tree service is a competitive business and you will get plently of nay sayers when asking about advice on going it on your own. Remember that most professional tree services would rather not see competition, To tell the truth, I think twice before offering advice on these forums. Let's face it, what is the sense in giving the competition your hard earned knowledge and experience when they are competing against you. I can't help but offer advice from the experiences I have had on my road. I guess I should keep my mouth shut a lot of the times but when someone is struggling in areas that I have already been through it is just my nature to want to help. I never wanted anything but to be a good climber and have my own tree service. I have sacraficed and worked to make it happen. When I see others trying to do the same it makes me want to help them. After all, I doubt very seriously you could or will be competing with me.

Here's my advice:

First of all, know what you are doing. Learn from a pro and don't speak or offer advice on what you don't know. people can smell a fake. If you have learned the climbing and tree care aspect then and only then it is time to take it to the next level. I spent years working with professionals learning how to do the work. There is no way to fake knowing how to do it (just look at Nosak). Second, be honest. Know your limitations and tell people up front what you are capable of. Be honest if your not a certified arborist, know how to brace and cable or have insurance or workman's comp. Just be honest with people about you capabilities. Don't overprice or gouge. Figure out what it takes for you to operate and how much you expect to make and stick to that. Figure out how much it costs you to operate and how much you expect to make and figure your rate. Don't deviate. If you are in it for the long haul your name means everything. Always stand by your word.

As far as soliciting, I would advise you to always look the customer in the eye. Shake their hand and be open and honest with them. Tell them you are a small business and can't afford to advertise yet. Tell them what seperates you from the other tree services. Give them references. Build good customer relationships. This is what will ultimately make or break you. If you know what you are doing and provide quality service you stand a good chance of making it. If you don't know squat and are just trying to hustle people for short time money you won't last. You can't fake what you don't know for very long and get away with it.

Best of luck to you.


----------



## mckeetree

tree md said:


> Your opinion means about as much to me as a mote of dust floating through the air.
> 
> Could care less of what you think of me. For the record, I have been in business 15 years on my own, am a member of the BBB and a well established tree service in my community. Some of the founders of this site have contracted with me. I am honorable and ethical, my word is gold in my town.
> 
> I come from hardscrabble people. My grandfather was a coal miner, my dad is a veteran who came home from the war and went to work for AT&T. He climbed microwave antennas to put food on our table when he started out even though he is afraid of heights. He was promoted to sales and when they deregulated the phone companies he camped out at the lobby of MCI on their first day in operation to sell the service of his company to people in the street on their own door step. That is where I learned the term "guerrilla marketing" I'm a fierce competitor and you better hope I never come to your town. There are plenty who would like to have me on thier payroll.



I always wondered what that was called. Guerrilla marketing. Don't get all stirred up. I had just lost a good job to some door knockers and was in a bad mood. I am sorry I said that you were a piece of work.


----------



## tree md

LOL, no problem. I've been there myself. I got one running around town stealing my signs.


----------



## Greenleaf

I 100% agree with Tree MD. While there are indeed hacks out there going door to door looking for a quick buck and lowballing. I have no shame in knocking on a door offering my services with the intention of creating a lasting relationship with the customer. I won't let what the hacks and low ballers do affect my business. 

Being in a small town with not many knowledgeable tree folks around I have found that LOTS of people have no clue about what services they might need. I have gained many clients by knocking on their doors and I cross paths with these people around town every day. If I were to gouge, do poor work etc. I'd have a hard time hiding from people. I am proud of the services I offer and think that people on here generalizing that all door knockers are scum need to give their head a shake. If you open your doors to business and are lucky enough to have more than enough to not have to fight for more work, good on you. I advertise a lot, and I also knock on doors when I'm in a neighborhood...they both work. Being in a small market it is tough and I have no shame in getting work and lasting customers however you can.


----------



## tree md

Another thing I do is talk to people everywhere I go and work that I own a tree service into the conversation. I have developed many leads and got many a job by just chatting friendly with folks around town. I just did one this morning for a guy I met who manages the auto parts store in town. I was just chatting with him, let him know that I own a tree service and he gave me his address and told me to come by, that he had some trees for me to work on. Nothing major, two 80 or better year old Cedars with some storm damage from last year and cleared a few limbs from over his service drop for $250. Took me two hours this morning. I did it by myself. Not a huge payday but I'll give up 2 hours on a Saturday for $250 anytime. Wish I had one of those to do everyday. All from just being friendly and chatting it up with a guy in town. Another form of "guerrilla marketing"; Getting in there amongst the people...


----------



## treeclimber101

tree md said:


> Another thing I do is talk to people everywhere I go and work that I own a tree service into the conversation. I have developed many leads and got many a job by just chatting friendly with folks around town. I just did one this morning for a guy I met who manages the auto parts store in town. I was just chatting with him, let him know that I own a tree service and he gave me his address and told me to come by, that he had some trees for me to work on. Nothing major, two 80 or better year old Cedars with some storm damage from last year and cleared a few limbs from over his service drop for $250. Took me two hours this morning. I did it by myself. Not a huge payday but I'll give up 2 hours on a Saturday for $250 anytime. Wish I had one of those to do everyday. All from just being friendly and chatting it up with a guy in town. Another form of "guerrilla marketing"; Getting in there amongst the people...


i like what you have to say and respect your thoughts and given the horrible economy recently i find myself content with work that when i was busy might have passed up. i am really thankful now to be able to afford my bills. i also find myself networking with other companies, often they have something i need and likewise i offer something that they need. many times recently i have traded my time for theres wow what a chance to learn new things and it costs nothing.


----------



## treeclimber101

John464 said:


> I don't knock on a door, but I will leave a card if I see a tree blown over up against the shed and laying on the fence like I did today.
> 
> While Im on my way to the estimate im driving slowly looking for any other potential work I can line up on the same street. I am working 3 houses in a row tomorrow that all have storm damage. If the card I left calls I'll have a 4th. I don't look desperate but ill be damn if I dont hustle to get work.
> 
> for the 60mph gusts we had Thursday night!


what part of jersey sir were near:greenchainsaw: philly no storm calls yet


----------



## treeclimber101

ASD said:


> If I were going door to door I would say something like "hi I am a hak with no work and nothin beter to do then pester ya and i wana no if ya needs some tree work cuse i need cash"
> 
> But we do not do d to d


your equipment list is impressive grasshopper , but if you've knocked on one door than you are indeed a door knocker


----------



## chipperscompany

tree md said:


> Chipperscompany,
> 
> Believe me tree service is a competitive business and you will get plently of nay sayers when asking about advice on going it on your own. Remember that most professional tree services would rather not see competition, To tell the truth, I think twice before offering advice on these forums. Let's face it, what is the sense in giving the competition your hard earned knowledge and experience when they are competing against you. I can't help but offer advice from the experiences I have had on my road. I guess I should keep my mouth shut a lot of the times but when someone is struggling in areas that I have already been through it is just my nature to want to help. I never wanted anything but to be a good climber and have my own tree service. I have sacraficed and worked to make it happen. When I see others trying to do the same it makes me want to help them. After all, I doubt very seriously you could or will be competing with me.
> 
> Here's my advice:
> 
> First of all, know what you are doing. Learn from a pro and don't speak or offer advice on what you don't know. people can smell a fake. If you have learned the climbing and tree care aspect then and only then it is time to take it to the next level. I spent years working with professionals learning how to do the work. There is no way to fake knowing how to do it (just look at Nosak). Second, be honest. Know your limitations and tell people up front what you are capable of. Be honest if your not a certified arborist, know how to brace and cable or have insurance or workman's comp. Just be honest with people about you capabilities. Don't overprice or gouge. Figure out what it takes for you to operate and how much you expect to make and stick to that. Figure out how much it costs you to operate and how much you expect to make and figure your rate. Don't deviate. If you are in it for the long haul your name means everything. Always stand by your word.
> 
> As far as soliciting, I would advise you to always look the customer in the eye. Shake their hand and be open and honest with them. Tell them you are a small business and can't afford to advertise yet. Tell them what seperates you from the other tree services. Give them references. Build good customer relationships. This is what will ultimately make or break you. If you know what you are doing and provide quality service you stand a good chance of making it. If you don't know squat and are just trying to hustle people for short time money you won't last. You can't fake what you don't know for very long and get away with it.
> 
> Best of luck to you.



Sir, this makes sense completely. I appreciate your support and your kindness.


----------



## lawnmowertech37

chipperscompany said:


> Difference between me and you is you have been in business for over 20 years, were as we have been in business for a few years. Therefore, you most likely have repeated customers calling or being refered to you keeping you busy. Don't get me wrong we are very loyal to our customers and always we leave a great job, but we are not quite there yet and could use some extra leads.



ever thought of your local paper in the classifieds also your local craigslist ads work also that is how i sold a local guy a ayp belt for his mower for 11.00 when it costs over 30 elsewhere i put the ad on craigslist and bang i get a email from someone needing a belt 

so its free dont cost no gas and it goes to many people that use craigslist 

not to mention the paper has a jobs wanted section in the classifieds i myself am thinking of doing this to draw in customers needing repair work on the mowers and chainsaws 

hope this helps 
calvin


----------



## chipperscompany

Ekka said:


> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pJsyTX31S0Y


even though im su mostly everyone wont agree with but why is it if the people feel over charged, why do they hand over the check?


----------



## arbadacarba

Everyone should make it a practise to hand out two cards to every cusomer after the job is done. It costs you $.20 maximum. If you only hand out one card you are much less likely to get a referral as the person you did the job for will likely keep the card nearby in case they need you again. If you hand out two then they can easily hand it on to a friend for a referral and the friend will have it on hand to make it easy to contact you when the time comes. *Don't*hand out more than two as the customer is then subconsciously put under pressure and you may end up with them sitting in his or her desk. The whole idea is to create some scarcity in the mind of the customer and have them feel that they are doing their friend a favour by referring you to them. Think of your customers as part of your marketing effort. Do a good job for them and they will be far more efficient than anything you do. Good luck, and l'd love to hear how it goes for you! ( I don't have to do this anymore so I can let you in on it. )


----------



## John Paul Sanborn

Fliers and doorhangers do much better then door knocking. I've had clients get work from fliers that were put out 2 years prior. Some people just keep them on file.

The best are ones that tell the recipient that you were working in the area. Most can tell where you were, and can ask the neighbor how you did.

Per %/unit is low, but the %/$ is very high. Often the first job on a printing run can pay for them all.


----------



## MonkeyMan_812

When I first started I used to do the door to door thing. Then after a year or so when I got busy I started thinking that it was un proffesional. But I havent got a call in about four days> I think I might go back to passing out fliers too.


----------



## VL07

I mail out brochures and fliers, (great return). Have a small yellow page ad, and put ads in the local paper. I don't know of any succesful business that doesn't advertise. If I'm out doing estimates, I'll troll the neigborhood so neigbors can see my truck signs. I've never knocked on a door, but don't see anything wrong with it, (the returns may be better than fliers in the mail). jm2c


----------



## Raymond

I have a confession to make. 
I still go out and look for work sometimes. I really don't knock on doors anymore though. I look for people looking up at their trees, raking leaves, etc.

Nother one I do is look for garage sales. 
I go up look around for a minute pick up a splitting maul for 2 bucks, then asks loudly if they needed any tree work done of any kind. You'll find them usually in a good mood, with a pocket full of cash. Or maybe someone else shopping will speak up and ask for a card for their trees.

It may seem desperate to hustle work but I still don't spit out stupid figures.


----------



## Henry111

Burvol said:


> I know it's funny, but it's also disgusting, rude, and down right mean to critique a working man who is trying hard to make it. You should be ashamed of yourself for making fun of someone who could very well have little, nothing to loose, and would probably kill you for your last piece of bread. I have been there, and it sucks.
> 
> No one wants to go door to door. It's not easy, and it's not the proudest of things to do either. But hey, this guy wants to work and is willing to do so. It's sad you can't recognize that, but instead pick him apart for wanting to succeed.



You said it just as i feel. you guys who knock on those who try their ass off really piss me off.


----------



## outdoor images

chipperscompany said:


> Difference between me and you is you have been in business for over 20 years, were as we have been in business for a few years. Therefore, you most likely have repeated customers calling or being refered to you keeping you busy. Don't get me wrong we are very loyal to our customers and always we leave a great job, but we are not quite there yet and could use some extra leads.



hey dont let those guys scare you moast likely they are so ugly they cant knok on doors because the cops will be called or they dont know how to talk to people (just trees) i have been verry sucsesfull door to door we still get calls but i also go door to door in a mile or so radius of whare we are do ing the mast work it is verry productive i dont know of anyone who has to much money and more work is more money ahh well everyone braggs that they are tow weeks out well let me tell you something if you cant do a job for two weeks you will probly lose atleast half or better you have and ad in the yelow pages or pay for advertizing right well i dont want my advertizing money laying on the coffe table or in the crapper i would rather pay a good sales guy 10% plus fule and a phone uniform compony car give him 5 or 6 leads a day and have him knoking on doors till his knckles blead i promise you it pays off


----------



## John Paul Sanborn

Pamphleting an area you've worked and have a yard sign in is effective.


----------



## treemandan

TreeCo said:


> :agree2:



Not unheard of is the neighbors of the client walk over and ask for something... but maybe its best just to leave a note?


----------



## John Paul Sanborn

treemandan said:


> Not unheard of is the neighbors of the client walk over and ask for something... but maybe its best just to leave a note?



Something I like about pamphlets, you can have your boilerplate marketing, and a place to add a personal note.

Though you are right, having the neighbors come over is the best way to get work. Quite often I have worked my way down a block with this. Sometimes if I want to get my foot in a subdivision i make a point of showing up on a weekend.


----------



## treemandan

Ekka said:


> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pJsyTX31S0Y



The real scam is that reporter girl trying to wear those pumps.


----------



## chipmaker29

chipperscompany said:


> Sir, this makes sense completely. I appreciate your support and your kindness.



I may be new but I have to comment on this thread. First off, much thanks to "tree md" for your well spoken words. They were an inspiration to me as well. Also I believe this was a great thread started by chipperscompany! Me & my dad have a small tree service business in Southeastern, IN and no, were are not certified arborist as of yet and we dont have 20 years in the business either but we do have experience in this trade and we are also honest, straight forward, hardworking individuals. Our area has suffered tremendously from the economic downturn and as a result our business is slow so ya, we have been doing the door knocking thing and it has been quite interesting for us. 

We have tried this with stump grinding and you would be surprised how many people are either unaware or oblivious to this service or think it just cost way to much to consider. We have been able to land ALOT of business from people thru this method. And I guess first & foremost we are in the SERVICE business and that means taking care of customers and sometimes going the extra mile to make sure they are satisfied and got a fair deal. We have gotten many, many quality references from satisfied customers that have led to bigger and better paying jobs that we would not have gotten if we were not "Seeing the people". That means a firm handshake and introduction and offering our service if folks are concerned about dead trees or sick and tired of mowing around stumps. These people would have never called a Yellow Page ad or were not even aware that they could have a potential real problem due to dead trees or etc. We have even had customers that we took a couple payments on so that they were able to have trees removed or stumps ground. Hardly any company would do such a thing but we have and use good judgement when allowing such but have many happy customers. 

You must KNOW your limits and be fair but also firm in your pricing and we do FIRST CLASS work and try our very best to take care of people. Of course there are customers that are a pain but we use the first face to face intro and conversation to get to know who we are talking to and what their expectations are. This will lessen the bull that you may potentially have to deal with.

Obviously many of you on here do not agree with this approach and that is fine. If you are overloaded with work or either sitting on your ass waiting on your phone to ring then good for you! Whatever works for you and your business is fine. DONT criticize others for showing enough initiative to get up and get out there and "see the people" and try to build their business. I have nothing but respect for someone doing what they must to establish themselves and support your families. That is what we are doing and we intend on having our business get stronger & stronger and be built around strong work ethics, integrity and a desire to succeed!

Good Luck in your business!!


----------



## treemandan

I think ekka should have just titled the thread " Beware of doorknocking scam artists" and left it at that. It all must be taken in context and there is something to be said about a proper appraoch which was mentioned by some of the better businessmen here thank you.
Now did anybody see that poor girl trying to keep right side up in those shoes? That was dam funny. Poor thing, she has no idea.


----------



## Ekka

I didn't start this thread, it's some-one elses.


----------



## chipmaker29

We have the same problem here in the states in our area that everyone saw on the video. Plenty of scam artist price gouging customers and doing the work although they are not qualified. What kind of idiot tries grabbing a falling branch! That is scary!

We have run into people who have been taken by scammers that talked the customers into paying up front for what they wanted done then ripping them off. Crazy! Last week we were on a job and noticed a fair sized tree cut down and laying in the front yard of a nicer home. We could not help but wonder why it was just cut down and laying there so after we finished the job we were on we walked down to the house, knocked on the door and an older lady answered. We introduced ourselves and stated what we do and ask if she wanted the large tree removed from her front yard. She immediately turned defensive and stated that she had a so called tree company stop and offer to cut down the tree and saw it up, chip the brush and grind out the stump. She wanted it out so she hired them and they somehow talked her into paying upfront. So once they had their money they pulled out their saws fell the tree and then proceeded to put up their saws and leave. The lady ask "where are you going" and they stated they would return shortly with more equipment and finish the job. Well, they left and she never saw or heard from them again! This lady was really upset and had every reason to be! 

Long story short, we talked to the lady for quite awhile, apologizing over & over for their actions and offering to help her. We quoted her a fair price to finish the job with removing what was left of the tree and grinding the stump. After negotiations we got the job and got on it and finished. After completion we approached her and ask if she was happy and she stated that she was very pleased and our price was reasonable and she thanked us for helping her get the job finished. She then said, well I also have 2 other stumps I would like to have removed in my back yard. She proceeded to show us, we bid and she accepted and we ground them out for her. 

So what was a bad situation to start with had a good outcome and we got more business from her than what we originally planned. We were happy and so was she. Unfortunately we have seen this scam over & over and some people did not even want to speak to us when we said "Tree Service" and we understood why they felt that way and in that situation we apologize for the way they were treated and leave our information and say if in the future we can help just contact us.

It is shameful that these scammers are out there trashing things for those of us that are legitimate business people and do exactly what we say we are going to. I feel for their victims and it sure makes things harder on those of us that have only honorable intentions. Hopefully some of these scammers can be apprehended and these bad practices eliminated!


----------



## treemandan

Ekka said:


> I didn't start this thread, it's some-one elses.



I guess I was thinking of the movie you posted about the boys in the green trucks and the reporter with the big dumper running round on high heals after them.
Its true a loose crew is bad news and will do the unbelievable. We just drove by an senior citizens house who had a broken limb on the wires. we knocked. Her phone was out so we gave her a phone to call her kids and told her we would do the limb for 100 bucks. We also ended up climbing a diferent tree to get a another hanger after the fact just because. I would have spliced the phone but it spanned the street.


----------



## outofmytree

I still use what we call the magic five drop. Do a job at say, number 6 in a street and drop flyers in numbers 4,8 and across the street at 3,5, and 7. It is amazing how many times you will get a call from people who weren't there when you worked but saw the site afterwards. I find many of them speak to my original client so it is another reason to make sure the client is ALWAYS happy with the job. This will sound trite but it is worth saying to every client "are you happy with the job"? It is good when they say yes and even better when they say no because the ones who say no will then tell you what they don't like. Fix it and they will advertise your business like nothing else will.


----------



## Daddy M Dawg

outofmytree said:


> I still use what we call the magic five drop. Do a job at say, number 6 in a street and drop flyers in numbers 4,8 and across the street at 3,5, and 7. It is amazing how many times you will get a call from people who weren't there when you worked but saw the site afterwards. I find many of them speak to my original client so it is another reason to make sure the client is ALWAYS happy with the job. This will sound trite but it is worth saying to every client "are you happy with the job"? It is good when they say yes and even better when they say no because the ones who say no will then tell you what they don't like. Fix it and they will advertise your business like nothing else will.



Great idea.Thanks for sharing. I can't tell you how many times my customers have asked to drop a card off for a neighbor. Good time saving idea.


----------



## ewoolsey

If i see a house that is close by were i am working or were im going to be working soon that needs some tree work i will stop, if no one home i leave my card, i have did good with this, some times you need just one more job to make it worth going there.


----------



## John Paul Sanborn

Since word of mouth is the best advertising, you give some pamphlets to a good client. They pass the marketing material to neighbors with the understanding that you will do a little more for them when you do jobs for which they generated the lead.


----------



## squad143

Door Knocking... depends on the work you are doing and how you go about it.

My business is comprised of about 98% removals. The majority of them are dead. While in my travels if I see a dead tree on someone's property (one that would require technical removal), I have no problem dropping a card in their mail box or knocking on their door and saying if they are considering having the tree removed, that I would like to be considered in giving them a quote for the job. Most of the time they ask for an estimate right on the spot and I get quite a majority of the bids I submit.


----------



## John Paul Sanborn

Straight removal work is for the young. It is all bull work and you have to chase every job. 

Maintenance and preservation work builds revolving accounts that help you spend more time on getting work done then finding it.

my simple math example will always hold true. A portfolio of 300 clients, that average $1000 per visit, on a 3 year cycle will generate $100,000 per annum in 100 days.

If we say that there are 200 days (4x50)per year of good work (do the math, I have only a couple days cushion) then we have 100 more days to fill out the annual budget.


----------



## treevet

That all makes sense JPS. Kinda scary to just have 100 useful days remaining. I know every year around this time if I see picts. of snow and ice I get a little anxious and even depressed.

If one is selling take downs every day they are in a much more competitive environment. I like to live in the upper tier of bids. Can't do that if mostly removals are bid.

If one is doing take downs every day then no matter what one says energy is waning as the week goes by and Monday comes all too fast. Maintenance work is not as physically demanding day to day and gives a more intellectual rep. that leads to more $ in the long run IMO.


----------



## woodguy105

Burvol said:


> I know it's funny, but it's also disgusting, rude, and down right mean to critique a working man who is trying hard to make it. You should be ashamed of yourself for making fun of someone who could very well have little, nothing to loose, and would probably kill you for your last piece of bread. I have been there, and it sucks.
> 
> No one wants to go door to door. It's not easy, and it's not the proudest of things to do either. But hey, this guy wants to work and is willing to do so. It's sad you can't recognize that, but instead pick him apart for wanting to succeed.



:agree2:


----------



## treevet

I do not have to door knock anymore and although it is still done.....it is illegal in my town and place of business.

But back when I first started with Bartlett back in the late 60's they had salesmen that went out all day knocking on doors and would try to make 50 or 60 contacts (not just sales calls but contacts with decision makers) in one day.

I took that attitude when I first started my business in 1971 and had dogs chase me, people swear at me, doors slammed in my face, etc. But work was sold, we worked and bills were paid. There was nothing whatsoever wrong with door knocking or door knockers back in the day (that day).


----------



## treeman82

I actually went and did some door knocking today. I felt terrible about it. I had taken down a DEAD tulip for a lady on Thursday and left a lawn sign there until Saturday afternoon (today). When I drove by to pick it up in a plain car and clothes I stopped at the next door neighbor's house because I had noticed a big, DEAD oak tree in the yard. Pulled in the driveway, knocked on the door, and introduced myself... but I asked if she would like a price on the big dead oak tree in the back yard. Lady said that she didn't have the money for it, but I think part of it was that I was a door knocker. Oh well, went to some regular clients and got some good jobs out of them at least.


----------



## mckeetree

treeman82 said:


> I actually went and did some door knocking today. I felt terrible about it. I had taken down a DEAD tulip for a lady on Thursday and left a lawn sign there until Saturday afternoon (today). When I drove by to pick it up in a plain car and clothes I stopped at the next door neighbor's house because I had noticed a big, DEAD oak tree in the yard. Pulled in the driveway, knocked on the door, and introduced myself... but I asked if she would like a price on the big dead oak tree in the back yard. Lady said that she didn't have the money for it, but I think part of it was that I was a door knocker. Oh well, went to some regular clients and got some good jobs out of them at least.



When you knock doors you put yourself in the old vacuum cleaner sales guy's class. I have worked tirelessly around here here to educate people about door knockers and it it has finally paid off.


----------



## southsoundtree

Make sure you have good looking signs on your trucks. Start with what you can afford, and have it professionally done, or professional quality.

When you are working, you are advertising. If it is your running-errands-mobile you are advertising, if you are slow, park at an appropriate busy location, and read a book, do you marketing, brainstorming, etc, you are advertising. 

I went too, too long without a professional sign because I thought it would be too costly. In the end, I got a lot of lettering on my dump truck, pickup truck, and a decent amount on my chipper. $1000 or so. I could have easily broken it down to start with the part of the pick-up for $200. 

I ended up getting a $1000 removal and grind from the sign company.




Get a few shirts made in simple one color ink that say your name and phone number, maybe services offered, "Talk to me about your tree!".


Ask customers for referrals and a reference. 

Write up a little script and practice for approaching people at their homes, and for calling past customers to say that you are working hard to build your business in this economy, and if anybody comes to mind that they know needs treework, you would gladly offer a fair bid and great service. Use friends and family to practice on.

Keep on working hard. On days without jobs, keep all your equipment maintained and ready to go if something pops up.


----------



## squad143

John Paul Sanborn said:


> Straight removal work is for the young. QUOTE]
> 
> I hear you JPS.
> 
> Good advice about building revolving clients. This is a part-time gig for me and I'm not interested in becoming a certified arborist (a little too late in life and I'm busy with other aspects). I inform my clients that I am not an arborist. Except for the odd small limb here and there, I only do removals which keeps me busy enough.
> 
> My thoughts on door knocking were towards dead trees and hazards (hangers, etc.).


----------



## Toddppm

treevet said:


> I do not have to door knock anymore and although it is still done.....it is illegal in my town and place of business.
> 
> But back when I first started with Bartlett back in the late 60's they had salesmen that went out all day knocking on doors and would try to make 50 or 60 contacts (not just sales calls but contacts with decision makers) in one day.
> 
> I took that attitude when I first started my business in 1971 and had dogs chase me, people swear at me, doors slammed in my face, etc. But work was sold, we worked and bills were paid. There was nothing whatsoever wrong with door knocking or door knockers back in the day (that day).



That's pretty interesting I never heard about Bartlett doing that but it makes sense since it was almost a new thing to actually take care of your trees.
I don't see any problem with doing that now either but only if it's done professionally. 

You can't look like drunken tree gypsies rolling slowly through the hoods in your beat up dually, uncle jeb or the wife driving because she's the only one without a current DWI and the doorknocking salesmen are wearing wife beaters, 1 tooth and stink. Like the guys that stopped at my house last night and I see everyday. 

If done in decent dress and without your crew driving behind ready to pounce it would probably work very good. I've been tempted a couple times this year to start but thankfully we've been working steadily.


----------



## John Paul Sanborn

Toddppm said:


> I've been tempted a couple times this year to start but thankfully we've been working steadily.




I think a yard sign and some semipro pamphletes are better time spent.


----------



## southsoundtree

Take the time during your jobs in a neighborhood as a target-market. Ask your current HO if they can be contacted for a reference, and use it in your door to door. 

Try not to sound like you are soliciting current work, rather just spreading your name, your work is your best resource, if HO-allowed pass out the street address of your current HO. Have all your current insurance, etc in hand. 

For $10-15 apiece, you can get matching hi-vis shirts. Start with one apiece and wash it at night. A minor expense, and a good value for the impression that is given.


----------



## mckeetree

southsoundtree said:


> Start with one apiece and wash it at night.




Wait a minute, let me get my violin out here.


----------



## John Paul Sanborn

southsoundtree said:


> For $10-15 apiece, you can get matching hi-vis shirts. Start with one apiece and wash it at night. A minor expense, and a good value for the impression that is given.



Buy them at around a hundred a pop and get a scaled discount form the printer most printers.


----------



## Greenleaf

Best bit of marketing I did this year was creating a driving billboard out of one of our pickups. Clean and professional graphics go a long ways to drawing attention.....the wrap paid itself off in no time.


----------



## mckeetree

Greenleaf said:


> Best bit of marketing I did this year was creating a driving billboard out of one of our pickups. Clean and professional graphics go a long ways to drawing attention.....the wrap paid itself off in no time.



I like that. Looks good. Some folks around here have tried some do-it-yourself stuff like that and it didn't come out so good. One guy's truck reminds me of a giant milk of magnesia bottle.


----------



## southsoundtree

John Paul Sanborn said:


> Buy them at around a hundred a pop and get a scaled discount form the printer most printers.



Definitely buy personalized ones when you can afford and have a good deal available. 

I suggested that generic safety shirts are better than nothing, and if one per person is all that you can afford, its a start for the small start-ups.


----------



## TOP TREE FELLER

*lawn boy*

stick to a little off the top lawn barber! tee heee hee:monkey:


----------



## chipmaker29

Greenleaf said:


> Best bit of marketing I did this year was creating a driving billboard out of one of our pickups. Clean and professional graphics go a long ways to drawing attention.....the wrap paid itself off in no time.



that looks really great! if u dont mind me asking, how much did it cost you to have ur truck done like that?

thanks!


----------



## Koa Man

After 23 years in business, I took my name out of the phone book completely. Only number I have is my cell phone. No name on my truck. 100% of my work is repeat and referrals. Currently booked to the end of the year, with only 6 open days for rain outs or if I need reschedule someone for an emergency job. 2010 and 2011 each has 22 weeks already booked for my scheduled maintenance contracts at the 4 hotels and 3 very high end residentials I do.

It took me 23 years to get to this point, currently in business for 25 years. I spend $0 on advertising.

Treat your customers right, return phone calls promptly, get them to like you as a person and you will have a loyal customer base. Whenever we do a fruit tree like mango or avocado and we have a lot of fruit, I make house calls on my customers sharing the fruit with them. 

I would say for me, the first 10 years in business was a real struggle to get a regular customer base going.


----------



## Daddy M Dawg

mckeetree said:


> When you knock doors you put yourself in the old vacuum cleaner sales guy's class. I have worked tirelessly around here here to educate people about door knockers and it it has finally paid off.



I have to disagree. I have family that started a business 4 yrs ago and only advertised by knocking and leaving flyers on the doors. After starting with a truck and a trailer he now has a forestry bucket, 2 chippers, chipper truck, skid-steer, etc... It is all paid for. So knocking when done properly is an effective way to gain sales.


----------



## Overhead

*Wow! Perhaps You Should Keep Your Judgements To Yourself!*

"If I were going door to door I would say something like "hi I am a hak with no work and nothin beter to do then pester ya and i wana no if ya needs some tree work cuse i need cash"

But we do not do d to d"

My spouse and I have created a successful tree service in just under a year! We started out going door-to-door with professional marketing materials. We were well-received and gained respect with hard work. Word has spread throughout the county and while it is no longer necessary, we still explore new neighborhoods, door-to-door, every Sunday!

On the other hand, we know how to speak & write the English language. I wouldn't let an idiot like you anywhere near my home either!


----------



## treevet

You have a hard week and are sitting on the couch reading the paper and listening to the tv and enjoying relaxing.

The door bell rings.....ugggghhhh

You get up and put the paper down walk through the whole house and wonder....is it the religious guys, the political guys, or the tree guys?

Why don't they just play the game like everyone else. Not push their agenda on you in the privacy of your home with their perceived outlook on how it should really be.

Hey mister, your trees need a bag of this here mycorrhizzae. I am new in the biz and know all kinds of things that all the guys in the phone book have no idea about. For this week and this week only.....we have a special.....


----------



## mckeetree

Overhead said:


> My spouse and I have created a successful tree service in just under a year! We started out going door-to-door with professional marketing materials. We were well-received and gained respect with hard work. Word has spread throughout the county and while it is no longer necessary, we still explore new neighborhoods, door-to-door, every Sunday!



Well received huh? Well come try my street because these folks will turn the water hose on your ass. Come on a Sunday and you might get your ass kicked.


----------



## mckeetree

Daddy M Dawg said:


> I have to disagree. I have family that started a business 4 yrs ago and only advertised by knocking and leaving flyers on the doors. After starting with a truck and a trailer he now has a forestry bucket, 2 chippers, chipper truck, skid-steer, etc... It is all paid for. So knocking when done properly is an effective way to gain sales.



Yeah, yeah. I saw that movie.


----------



## John Paul Sanborn

mckeetree said:


> Well received huh? Well come try my street because these folks will turn the water hose on your ass. Come on a Sunday and you might get your ass kicked.



Around here, if you come while the Packers are playing....


----------



## Grace Tree

*Cleveland Craigslist Ad*

http://cleveland.craigslist.org/evg/1488951723.html


----------



## treevet

That is ugly. This is why those that care need to get on UFB boards and City Councils to legislate against this sort of thing.


----------



## John Paul Sanborn

I had a guy pull up my driveway on Sunday and hand me a flyer for an out of area company. I called him asked if he was one of those gaffing hacks from Minni-soda and politely told him where to go.


----------



## treevet

We have an ordinance against solicitation door to door. Few weeks ago my wife and I followed a crew of 3 that parked near our house and took to knocking on doors with a big stack of fliers.

I called the cops.....they will do something....no show.....called them again and again from different locations and id'd where they were and gave license number of beater pickup and description of hacks.....no show.

So next UFB meeting where the city manager has taken to showing up at all our meetings because they want to suck up the EAB treatment bucks, I embarrassed him in front of 7 members and some guests with the story after they all are crying about hacked up trees in town. He followed me into the parking lot and told me if it happens just to call him personally and he will handle it.

They cry about hacked up trees and they have these guys driving down 50 miles to knock on doors in this little suburb. Then they wonder about all the recent break ins and robberies and cars broken into which never happened before this as they were all over town during the hurricane last year..


----------



## mckeetree

I started a little consumer education drive about door knockers and fly by nights some years back and it has helped to an extent. Had a Jim Wallace call yesterday with a half finished job from Oct. I guess my consumer information never made it to him. He seemed like a nice guy and gave us the job. We had some gypsies move in here from up north somewhere about 15 years ago that would go door to door bugging people to let them mow or trim trees. If you made the mistake of hiring them they cased your place out and tried to steal stuff. Finally a hurricane hit that fall and the next day they were all gone chasing that. They were some tough devils though. I remember seeing a guy hit one so hard it actually, and I'm not making this up, lifted him up off the ground and slammed him back hard against the wall outside Pizza Hut. The sucker got up and he hit him again and same thing. Up again same thing. He would sorta try to fight back but that first punch had him ALL screwed up. I finally got in the middle of that deal and talked the guy into not hitting him again because he was just standing there beating the ###### to death one punch at a time.


----------



## treevet

Damn, lucky for both of them you broke that up.


----------



## ArborSmithNw

So just to toss in my two cents... not that it matters! :0)

Door knocking to me plays a very important part in marketing my outfit & cuttting overhead. 

I know of at least 5 other owners of services that sit around with their size tens kicked up waiting for the phone to ring.. 

Correction, make that 2 other owners, the other 3 have now shut down because of their high yellow page ad costs and minimal results have led to their demise. 

Why, if you are reputable, safe, and honest wouldn't you approach those in need of obvious service? Don't you think that a certain number of people have no clue about what proper care for their trees is all about? And how would they ever learn? They wouldn't. They would wait for a catastrophic failure and then run to the internet or yellow pages & call. A ton of good that would do if you HAPPENED to be the one out of 962 services listed that they called. You get one job out of the client. 

Knock on that door, alert them to the issue & gain a client (referals) for life. That is if they can trust you.

I get a kick out of the guys that are so anti door knock. I honestly feel like its more a self confidence issue with them (let the hate mail begin) and they are too nervous to even try. Or too high on their laurels. Either way, its ego.

I personally make a game of it. I don't go home until I have knocked on thirty doors a day in between my set appointments. More often than not I get my set appointments to tell me who is more likely to hire than not, making it even easier to earn another client.

It's the same day in and day out. And it yields VERY well. 

So to all you nay-sayers, keep on throwing yer' hard earned dollars at big yellow books that help keep my furnace filter from rattling, I'll keep on intoducing myself to your clients!

(and trust me, my clients don't get the "craigslist" special when they work with me, hacks are hacks and they will always be out there)


----------



## ozzy42

:agree2:

Nothing wrong with an honest man looking for work.IMO.

I know of a few tree guys that have their big ads in the phone book ,along with the other 2 dozen ads, and are home sitting on their tushes complaining about having no work.

Everyone that knocks on a door ,or just leaves a card in one as I do is not a hack.
Just as somebody with a full page ad can be the biggest crooked hack their is.No credentials are required to take out an ad.

I have quite a few repeat clients that have used me for years ,and it all started with a card left in their door.


BTW,My lawn guy put his card in my door 3 years ago.
He does a great job and for a price that is only a bit more than it would cost me to do it myself ,when you add everything up.


----------



## boo

mckeetree said:


> Well received huh? Well come try my street because these folks will turn the water hose on your ass. Come on a Sunday and you might get your ass kicked.


Hoefully they know what league they're in when attempting the ass kicking.

Sad...
If a person can't speak clearly, and confident, with education...
if they look like a bum or a dopehead, carry themselves like a crook or hack, then maybe they should not sell door to door. 
(Hide behind a sign or phone call)
I have had 5 different yellow page ads some years ago....I only got 2 calls which only 1 job I got for the whole year from posting in 5 books. It would be dumb to try to advertise that way again in the same areas.
I have not used signs for well over a year.
I have done door to door 3 different days, over a 16 month period.
Turn out> we get 4 out of 5 jobs solicited.... 
we don't work for beer, (we don't drink) then one job leads to another.(word of mouth)
The ones that cry that it's shamefull to door knock, I could probably buy and sell them and their equipment many times over.
I am a certified arborist, insured, experienced, equipped.

They meet me, they like me, they trust me, they hire me.
We are good at what we do, the hacks can't compete.


----------



## ArborSmithNw

Well put Boo.

Here is my simple recipe to a SOLID 2 month backlog of $2K days all through the winter...

A clean, modest, late model truck, without the 8" lift & $4,000 wheels & blacked out windows that so many of the ArborEgoists tend to fancy.

Clean shaven, clean & untorn clothes, no hats or sunglasses.

A solid knowledge of our industry & how it works... with full proof of current liability & workmans comp stapled to the written proposal.

So again, all the guys that think door knocking is for hacks, good luck surviving the current economy, I'll buy your equipment .52 cents on the dollar come January.


----------



## treevet

My town was saturated with sleeze doorknockers last fall that drove 50 miles down from another town to take advantage of a hurricane. There are plenty of services in this city to handle the work load. It is against local law to knock on doors to solicit work in my town. Why?....

Last year they went thru and told residents they had emerald ash borer and most times they did not even have ash trees. They crashed other trees and property while felling trees that should have been dismantled. There was a huge increase in break ins and thefts that some convictions pointed at the solicitors.

My wife ran into a friend that had an elm with ded removed and I had been their service for 30 years prior to that. She was asking my wife to have me price the stump (20 foot by 4 foot dia.) removal. My wife asked her why she didn't call me like usual. Her answer was all these crews were all over the neighborhood claiming the lowest prices ever and everyone was buying. I was too busy to even notice. She said the crew said they needed paid now and they would be back tomorrow and finish up. That was a year ago.

This stump is full of metal and in a deck area and huge and worth more to remove than the tree itself. 2 of these crews have aliases as they have 3 different names for the same company.

They spike all over everything, knock on doors after dark take advantage of senior citizens, park on residential streets in violation over night and generally make our profession look like the scam it used to be portrayed as in the media.


----------



## ArborSmithNw

Which absolutely without a doubt the dirtbags are still out there. 

We certainly have them here in Oregon. Point being though, if I can't approach a potential client with needs (in good faith & with integrity) then whats the point in being in business?

Must I pay an extra $4,000 a month to advertise to survive? That does not serve the client either, that cost gets factored into their proposal after all.

Like someone mentioned above, scabs are scabs & crooks are crooks. They can pay Verizon & Dex the same way I can.

I can prove my credentials every minute of the day, and anybody that attemps to directly market those in need should do so as well to avoid accusations of crookedness.


----------



## treevet

Just as the dirtbags have dirtied the profession of arboriculture they have also soiled the technique of doorknocking. Like I said earlier in this post, back when I started in the late 60's early 70's national companies like Bartlett sent out salesmen to get 40 to 60 contacts in a day. They were very professional and like you very successful.

Now the dirtbags are the majority of the salesmen as in everything else they took advantage of a situation, took it past a positive to a negative.

I understand your perspective but you have to understand others not wanting to be perceived along with the lowlife and choosing to sit on the couch rather than being lumped with them.

Me, I choose to solicit by phone or fliers with a website, credentials, and a very established business with references to follow up with once I get a foot in the door.


----------



## ArborSmithNw

treevet said:


> Just as the dirtbags have dirtied the profession of arboriculture they have also soiled the technique of doorknocking. Like I said earlier in this post, back when I started in the late 60's early 70's national companies like Bartlett sent out salesmen to get 40 to 60 contacts in a day. They were very professional and like you very successful.
> 
> Now the dirtbags are the majority of the salesmen as in everything else they took advantage of a situation, took it past a positive to a negative.
> 
> I understand your perspective but you have to understand others not wanting to be perceived along with the lowlife and choosing to sit on the couch rather than being lumped with them.
> 
> Me, I choose to solicit by phone or fliers with a website, credentials, and a very established business with references to follow up with once I get a foot in the door.




Sure, I certainly see the other side as well in regards to not being grouped in, but working at fixing the perception seems a better option vs. banning it. It only bothers me to hear guys crying about no work when there is effort that can be made to fix the situation. Its especially sad to see when employees are affected by the lack of work.

At this point, I could cease knocking all together and get by, but I enjoy it way too much. To me its more a study of human nature. You certainly get to meet all walks of life.

Cheers!


----------



## mckeetree

boo said:


> The ones that cry that it's shamefull to door knock, I could probably buy and sell them and their equipment many times over.




Yeah, yeah.....I have heard all that crap before. Many times over huh?


----------



## mckeetree

ArborSmithNw said:


> At this point, I could cease knocking all together and get by, but I enjoy it way too much.



Good God. It's hard to find a comment for that little morsel.


----------



## ozarktreeman

treemandan said:


> The real scam is that reporter girl trying to wear those pumps.




Man I know this is old #### but you make me laugh my a$$ off.


----------



## ArborSmithNw

Hard time finding a comment for what, the fact that as a professional I enjoy my career of educating people about their trees so that uninsured scabs don't stick it to them once they do need the service? 

I try to redefine our industry on a daily basis, fending off the misconceptions that anyone with a pick up truck & chainsaw is a "tree guy".

I also cold call builders, disaster restoration companies, business park managers, golf courses, parks departments etc etc etc... I belong to home builders groups, real estate groups, general lead groups etc etc etc... 

I enjoy & progress the field I have spent 16 years in, yet you fail to find a comment for my marketing morsel.

Pardon my snideness, being the newbie & all I am not trying to make to big of waves & am not trying to disrespect others, I just feel strongly about my ethics.


----------



## treevet

I can see the cold calls to business entities but the residential stuff is, well....just plain rude. What makes you assume the homeowner needs or even wants your input? 

In the sanctity of their home the doorbell rings. The dogs go wild and the dad cannot hear the ball game, the daughter cannot hear the boyfriend, the wife is cooking dinner and cannot leave a boiling pot.... "Who the hell is it....is it the religious people or the tree guys?"

"Its the damn tree guys again"...."Are they leaving?" "no, they are just standing there".......

In the meantime the treeguy is standing out there thinking ....hey people come to the front door all the time...this is ok....(not really, others are expected and welcomed...you're not)

So after a while you leave and move on to the next victim convincing yourself that they weren't home....or in the shower....or the stereo was too loud to hear your repeated knocking and or doorbell ringing. 

How come the plumber, the painter, the a/c guy, the roofer, the carpet guy isn't banging on the door imposing their perceived opinion of how and who should provide their services?

Manners


----------



## ArborSmithNw

treevet said:


> What makes you assume the homeowner needs or even wants your input?



Simple: I know that the 110' douglas fir 17' off their foundation has laminated root disease & is just a time bomb waiting to happen & THEY DO NOT. 

So if they want to get pissy for that, THEY are the ones with the anger issue and don't realize the value of the education I was trying to provide, for free. 

I certainly appreciate the barking dog factor, that is the worst, I have 2 myself. Thats why the first words out of my mouth are "my apologies for disturbing the house ma'am"

As far as disturbing the ball game or the deep conversation, there is usually a slim chance of me disturbing that. (i do get your point though) I only market myself during business hours on business days. If the homeowner is the type of person sitting home at 10:47 on a Wednesday morning, chances are I am not even knocking on the door. That type of person usually has a trashy yard, a trashy home & wouldn't spend a nickel anyway. Other things that thwart me are transmissions in driveways, weeds growing out of gutters & brown lawns. These people don't care about upkeep either.

Since I narrowed down by the numbers who my ideal doors are long ago, I usually find affluent housewives & retired or semi retired POLITE ladies (or gentleman) of the house home during the day. Most of the time, due to being clean cut & professional, I can step back and point to exactly what I stopped there for and they at least have a vested enough interest to listen for a second. An actual reason, not snake oil, not $17,000 windows. 

A 110' Douglas Fir tree with laminated root rot 17' off a foundation is a true threat, not a fake religion or a fancy upgrade. 

The anger, which you elude to, has been bred into us. We as a culture do all we can to shut off communication with each other & find reasons not to interact. I get a kick out of those people who are over the top pissed off that I just "disturbed their kingdom". I have the proper responses to reverse their anger and point out that they are just being #######s & I was only trying to help. They usually turn out to be the best clients too. Those folks and the ones that find the need to post No Solicitors signs, 9 out of 10 times I get a signed contract with those people.

So go ahead and get angry at an honest working man, he'll be walking off your porch laughing at you because of your anti-social behavior.

He'll also be laughing at the fact that the socially inept HO will be thumbing through the yellow pages at 3 in the morning that winter and paying DOUBLE to that yellow page outfit so he can cover his marketing costs. 

But we consider that "better service" 

It boggles me why other arborists would see direct marketing as such a bad thing. Have a little faith in what you do & the service you provide, and understand that you can be proactive instead of just responsive & your client list can grow ten fold.

I would just assume spit on religious solicitors because religion is just mind twisting BS, but will always at least find out what type of service the guy at my door is doing because maybe I do have a need and I can save money if he's working for a neighbor. He is obviously interested in bettering his company and building his brand with footwork & decent service, not just a credit card for an annual ad.

But again, scammers are scammers, scabs are scabs. I can't control the thieves out there, only my own valuable service.


----------



## treevet

Come on Arborsmith....how many times have you called a homeowner an azzwhole (I assume this is what is represented by the #'s) and they "become your best client and 9 times out 10 sign the contract?

In my upper middle class town it is illegal to knock on doors. Why....privacy. Where else can you find it anymore besides in your proverbial castle. You are invading that. You make it sound like you are running a charity. You may spot an impending hazard on occasion, but more often than not you are "disturbing the peace" not in the capacity of roof rescuer but rather just plain to stuff Mr. ArborSmith's pockets with green stuff. Most of the time you are gonna have to go fishing all over someone's yard to find a reason to be there.

This puts a housewife in a very anxious situation given today's climate of crime and terrorism. You have invaded their privacy and now you are gonna go snooping all over their yard while the homeowner waits for this experience to end. Maybe you have movie star looks and maybe you could charm the pants off a virgin and are the fairest most honest person in all the lands... but these "salesmen" (this is what you are....not arborist at this point...they have no idea of your capabilities) are few and far between.

I would love to go knock on doors all over my area if everyone was ok with it and receptive and welcoming but I don't want ANYONE knocking on my door telling me what I need and what I should pay when I haven't asked for it, am not expecting it and ultimately do not know if the whole situation is safe for my well being.

True story I hear every day.....passed a friend of mine (and client) walking through my town yesterday. During conversing naturally the economy came up. He mentioned being slow and said these tree guys are constantly knocking on his door (every door on his street). Just today he says he answers the door (what are you gonna do to get the dork to leave....take a brick to hit them in the head you don't want them there).

The first words he says are.....you got a tree that needs to come down. He replies what tree. Guy points to a 140 foot perfect specimen red oak in back over his roof that we had just pruned last year. My friends says "no it doesn't" then the guy starts to get belligerent (like you said you do) and my friend says get the fk off my property or I'll call the cops.

Delightful encounter ...have you ever had any of these at your home.


----------



## mckeetree

treevet said:


> Come on Arborsmith....how many times have you called a homeowner an azzwhole (I assume this is what is represented by the #'s) and they "become your best client and 9 times out 10 sign the contract?
> 
> In my upper middle class town it is illegal to knock on doors. Why....privacy. Where else can you find it anymore besides in your proverbial castle. You are invading that. You make it sound like you are running a charity. You may spot an impending hazard on occasion, but more often than not you are "disturbing the peace" not in the capacity of roof rescuer but rather just plain to stuff Mr. ArborSmith's pockets with green stuff. Most of the time you are gonna have to go fishing all over someone's yard to find a reason to be there.
> 
> This puts a housewife in a very anxious situation given today's climate of crime and terrorism. You have invaded their privacy and now you are gonna go snooping all over their yard while the homeowner waits for this experience to end. Maybe you have movie star looks and maybe you could charm the pants off a virgin and are the fairest most honest person in all the lands... but these "salesmen" (this is what you are....not arborist at this point...they have no idea of your capabilities) are few and far between.
> 
> I would love to go knock on doors all over my area if everyone was ok with it and receptive and welcoming but I don't want ANYONE knocking on my door telling me what I need and what I should pay when I haven't asked for it, am not expecting it and ultimately do not know if the whole situation is safe for my well being.
> 
> True story I hear every day.....passed a friend of mine (and client) walking through my town yesterday. During conversing naturally the economy came up. He mentioned being slow and said these tree guys are constantly knocking on his door (every door on his street). Just today he says he answers the door (what are you gonna do to get the dork to leave....take a brick to hit them in the head you don't want them there).
> 
> The first words he says are.....you got a tree that needs to come down. He replies what tree. Guy points to a 140 foot perfect specimen red oak in back over his roof that we had just pruned last year. My friends says "no it doesn't" then the guy starts to get belligerent (like you said you do) and my friend says get the fk off my property or I'll call the cops.
> 
> Delightful encounter ...have you ever had any of these at your home.




Exactly. ArborSmith is a door knocker deluxe that has convinced himself he is not an assclown because of his self perceived high ethics and valuable "service." He better stay up there where he is because around here it is illegal to solicit in the good neighborhoods and the chance of getting the water hose turned on you or the cops called on you are extremely high. My neighbor ran some dumbass off just last Sat. that was trying to tell him he had a sick shrub or something another. Can't these stupid #######s take a hint and leave people alone in their home. The home is where you should at least have a little privacy and peace.


----------



## John Paul Sanborn

How about a $10 Christmas tree disposal service as a reason to get in a neighborhood to estimate? Send out postcards and for those who take the service, include a small estimate with your bill for $10+tax. 

You can target high end, large lot neighborhoods.


----------



## ArborSmithNw

Got it. No door knocking in the red states. 

As far as physical threats... nowhere did I mention that i get beligerent with anybody, I said I laugh to myself as I walk away. I don't push issues, I don't strong arm people, and I certainly don't waste my time long enough to have somebody ready the garden hose.

It would suck to live in such a state of paranoia that everybody is out to get you.

Climate of terrorism, that was just commical. Fox news at its finest.


And no, I have never had one of "those" at my home. I use people skills to in no uncertain terms let somebody know I am not interested in something in a sentence or two, not threats & barbaric grunts.


----------



## treevet

Tree disposal is free in high end neighborhoods like my town.

re...jps post


----------



## treevet

ArborSmithNw said:


> I have the proper responses to reverse their anger and point out that they are just being #######s & I was only trying to help.



This doesn't sound like you "laugh to yourself and walk away" this sounds belligerent doesn't it?


----------



## mckeetree

ArborSmithNw said:


> Got it. No door knocking in the red states.
> 
> Climate of terrorism, that was just commical. Fox news at its finest.





Does not like red states. Has problem with Fox news. Invades peoples privacy. Tries to push himself on others. Well well well. It all comes clear to me now. Yes sir it does. So that is what you are. Now it all makes sense.


----------



## treevet

ArborSmithNw said:


> I would just assume spit on religious solicitors because religion is just mind twisting BS,



There will be no Christmas displays or celebrations permitted at the White House by the Obama's during...... CHRISTMAS .....this year.


----------



## ArborSmithNw

treevet said:


> This doesn't sound like you "laugh to yourself and walk away" this sounds belligerent doesn't it?



Right, because using humor, wit & tone scale to difuse sombodies anger is very aggresive.

I guess we'll just have to leave it as it is, everybodies got their take & who's to say who is right or wrong. I know the client list I have developed with exceptional business practice, so all of the discussion here is really just for entertainment value.

Now, as far as no Xmas in the white house, wherever that came from...

GOOD! 

Its called seperation of church & state for a reason. I expect my government to be focused on running my country, not slinging tinsel in celebration of any religion or commercialized holiday.

I have a feeling we may not see eye to eye on politics in general... 

And please gentlemen, don't take any of my words as personal digs, to me its about the dialogue & debate. 

But just for giggles Mckee, what exactly is it that I am? Outside of an oposing view of course.


----------



## boo

Glad I don't live in your neighborhoods.. HAHAHA!! upperclass?!?!?
Sounds like a joke... maybe the ghetto would give results as described, not upperclass.
I have never been thrown out or disrespected by a homeowner... ever!
over 250k for the tree service alone so far this year.... go figure.
Maybe the guys that get these results look and sound like common uneducated, dopehead, maggots. 
there are several celebs that I do tree work for regularly, they're always happy to see me 

Door to Door also works well for my roofing company... 
yes mckee I also own a construction company and a roofing company.
including several homes built for a few nascar drivers.... fairly high profile jobs, multi million dollar homes.

ArborSmith I hear you Sir. I understand and appreciate your perspective Sir. This could be like a debate with a rock, then again maybe there are certain areas that really treat people like crooks.... we all are a product of our environment.
We only know what we have been exposed to.
It is a cruel world no doubt.
I hope those nay sayers are just feeding their egos rather than having people treat them like criminals.


----------



## treevet

boo said:


> Glad I don't live in your neighborhoods.. HAHAHA!! upperclass?!?!?
> Sounds like a joke... maybe the ghetto would give results as described, not upperclass.
> I have never been thrown out or disrespected by a homeowner... ever!
> over 250k for the tree service alone so far this year.... go figure.
> Maybe the guys that get these results look and sound like common uneducated, dopehead, maggots.
> there are several celebs that I do tree work for regularly, they're always happy to see me
> 
> Door to Door also works well for my roofing company...
> yes mckee I also own a construction company and a roofing company.
> including several homes built for a few nascar drivers.... fairly high profile jobs, multi million dollar homes.
> 
> ArborSmith I hear you Sir. I understand and appreciate your perspective Sir. This could be like a debate with a rock, then again maybe there are certain areas that really treat people like crooks.... we all are a product of our environment.
> We only know what we have been exposed to.
> It is a cruel world no doubt.
> I hope those nay sayers are just feeding their egos rather than having people treat them like criminals.



Both you, Mr. Boo, and you Mr. Arborsmith try to illustrate correctness at doorbell harassing the public by attempting condescension. You work for celebrities and Nascar drivers, he can buy and sell the lot of us. You have roofing and construction company (jack of all trades...master of...?). 

I run a very successful tree service for decades. Have mostly high end clients and have worked for numerous celebs and on historical properties and on historical trees. I live WITH the high end clients and socialize with them and know they DESPISE you door knocker work beggars. They despise you so much that the 2 upper middle class villages I predominantly work in have gone through the long extensive process of excluding your pathetic technique by enacting laws through city councils. Why is that do you think. 

You knock on doors all the time and....have never been thrown off a property?


----------



## ArborSmithNw

Well maybe once I am hob knobbing with the upper class village people like yourself, I can sit on my laurels as well and look down at the infidels who dare talk to me. Maybe even get an ordinance passed for beheading these filthy terrorists.

I can only guess you are the owner that pays peanuts & fancies himself a socialite at the expense of the labor of his employees. $60K truck, nice big ol' house, vacationing 3 months out of the year, while you keep the guys starving just enough to feel blessed to be working. Kudos. 

I love stealing clients from guys like that. Ding dong, a clients gone.

Don't worry though mate, I have zero interest in Ohio.

:biggrinbounce2::biggrinbounce2::biggrinbounce2:


----------



## ArborSmithNw

treevet said:


> I do not have to door knock anymore and although it is still done.....it is illegal in my town and place of business.




So it was ok at one point in time.. for you... but since *YOU* don't *have* to anymore, us that choose to should be jailed.

Hyy... hhhyyy.... hypocrite. Excuse me, capitol H-ypocrite


Size 10's, kicked up.


----------



## mckeetree

ArborSmithNw said:


> But just for giggles Mckee, what exactly is it that I am? Outside of an oposing view of course.



I outlined it above where anybody with an ounce of sense could tell what you "are". Oh, I left out thinks religion is BS.


----------



## mckeetree

boo said:


> Door to Door also works well for my roofing company...



If you ever left a shred of doubt in my mind that you might have any credibility at all you just blew with that one. A ####### door to door roofer. Give me a ####### break. I would give $500.00 to see you roll up to my old Uncle's house with your line of ####. The first thing he would do is put the dog on you and he has one that will literally eat your ass up.


----------



## ozarktreeman

:jawdrop:opcorn:


----------



## ArborSmithNw

mckeetree said:


> If you ever left a shred of doubt in my mind that you might have any credibility at all you just blew with that one. A ####### door to door roofer. Give me a ####### break. I would give $500.00 to see you roll up to my old Uncle's house with your line of ####. The first thing he would do is put the dog on you and he has one that will literally eat your ass up.



Thats a pretty unstable uncle you got there. You should have him evaluated.


At this point paco, I know exactly what you are as well, and its exactly what I work towards changing about our industry.

Been nice conversation though, I beg your leave.


----------



## mckeetree

ArborSmithNw said:


> At this point paco, I know exactly what you are as well, and its exactly what I work towards changing about our industry.




So you want to ruin our industry. That is what you are working toward. I guess you are also working towards convincing people that it is okay to bug folks at home, religion is BS, red states are bad, Fox news is too far right and it is cool for you to try to invade people's privacy and use your "people skills' on them. At least we know what each other are.


----------



## boo

treevet... you've added words to my post? 
"all the time"? or "3 days over a 16 month period"?
none the less, it is what it is.
As I posted earlier, some are better off hiding behind a sign or phone... similar to the internet tough guy. 
mckeetree... I don't blame you for not doing door to door sales. Maybe you are one of those guys that would get a beatdown on someones front step. :O
I know it could be bad for you to come to my house and speak.
-OR-

From what I gather(?), it would be smart for anyone as friendly as you, and talks as well as you do, to retire from doing sales and teach others how to make a wonderful living from paid printing or magic markers?

Although I'm not a crackhead, I do know that they have big problems with being paranoid, and facing the public.
ARE YOU GUYS SMOKING CRACK?!?

chipperscompany I'm sure you can see the brilliant posts by dumba$$e$.
hopefully these posts will help answer your question in an indirect, stupid kind of way atleast.
Only as a basic guide, I see newer members with lots of posts as bigmouth, ego, fools.
I don't care for the drama and haters. Hopefully more people will chime in with "real" answers for you.


----------



## mckeetree

boo said:


> I don't blame you for not doing door to door sales. Maybe you are one of those guys that would get a beatdown on someones front step.



No, I just don't want to make a dumbass out of myself by invading people's privacy. It is possible, however, for me to get shot or beat up if I made a habit of bugging people going door to door with some retarded spiel about their trees and roof. That sort of thing does not go over well around here. And as far as your little saying "it is what it is" I thought that got worn out and folks stopped saying that 30 years ago or did you just find out about it.


----------



## treevet

ArborSmithNw said:


> I can only guess you are the owner that pays peanuts & fancies himself a socialite at the expense of the labor of his employees. $60K truck, nice big ol' house, vacationing 3 months out of the year, while you keep the guys starving just enough to feel blessed to be working. Kudos.



You got me wrong to no surprise Arborswift. My business is just myself and a groundman (also a Certified Arborist) (who I bet is the best paid gm in Cinci) and a ton of equipment. I do all the climbing for 40 years and bucket/crane work. Just real good at it and unlike you don't have to grovel at people's feet on the front doorstep terrorizing them with banging on doors, perpetual door honking and driving the dogs insane into barking their ass off. My socializing involves hanging out with my son's classmate's parents. I don't drink and I don't take any vacations (maybe a 3 day weekend now and then). My drive around pickup is a new one ton but it has an aluminum dump insert in it for work. 

I think you should just carry around a big airhorn from a diesel truck and stand in the front yard with it attached to a 12volt battery and lay on it and wear one of those sandwich shop over the shoulder signs that say

TREEWORK
CHEAP 



> I love stealing clients from guys like that. Ding dong, a clients gone.
> 
> Don't worry though mate, I have zero interest in Ohio.



The rest of the world better keep the women and children inside....lookout here comes Arborswift. :rockn:


----------



## Grace Tree

Something like this


----------



## treevet

Small Wood said:


> Something like this



:hmm3grin2orange:


----------



## treevet

Tried to send ya some rep but no luck. I'll get ya later.


----------



## ArborSmithNw

treevet said:


> You got me wrong to no surprise Arborswift. My business is just myself and a groundman (also a Certified Arborist) (who I bet is the best paid gm in Cinci) and a ton of equipment. I do all the climbing for 40 years and bucket/crane work. Just real good at it and unlike you don't have to grovel at people's feet on the front doorstep terrorizing them with banging on doors, perpetual door honking and driving the dogs insane into barking their ass off. My socializing involves hanging out with my son's classmate's parents. I don't drink and I don't take any vacations (maybe a 3 day weekend now and then). My drive around pickup is a new one ton but it has an aluminum dump insert in it for work.
> 
> I think you should just carry around a big airhorn from a diesel truck and stand in the front yard with it attached to a 12volt battery and lay on it and wear one of those sandwich shop over the shoulder signs that say
> 
> TREEWORK
> CHEAP
> 
> 
> 
> The rest of the world better keep the women and children inside....lookout here comes Arborswift. :rockn:



Well treepet, I guess I had you all wrong. 

You do have all the answers. You can keep 2 guys busy, impressive. 

40 years of manual labor, now that is a plan I should have gone with.

My bad, I thought I was having a debate with another tree service owner, not a hobbyist. Apples to oranges champ.

I'll take up no more of your time sir.


----------



## ArborSmithNw

Small Wood said:


> Something like this




Does that come in a Hemi?


----------



## treevet

ArborSmithNw said:


> Apples to oranges champ.



And you're the apples (rotten) chump.


----------



## Grace Tree

ArborSmithNw said:


> Does that come in a Hemi?


Everyone know a bidmobile comes with a 440 in plant
BIDMOBILE


----------



## ArborSmithNw

Small Wood said:


> Everyone know a bidmobile comes with a 440 in plant
> BIDMOBILE



My bad Cooter.


----------



## Ekka

ArborSmithNw said:


> You can keep 2 guys busy, impressive.
> 
> 40 years of manual labor, now that is a plan I should have gone with.
> 
> My bad, I thought I was having a debate with another tree service owner, not a hobbyist. Apples to oranges champ.
> 
> I'll take up no more of your time sir.



Isn't it a sad day when a person gets put down for exercising their preferences which are totally legal and have no affect upon a party that denigrates them.

If Mr Smith wants to climb trees or work 3 days a week what right do you have to crap all over them? So you are different, good for you, but it doesn't mean bad for others.

It's clear the heirachy of success to you includes the control and denigration of others.


----------



## Buckettruckbabe

Thank Ekka for your post. I'm new to the forums and was rather horrified at the turn this whole thread took. I was under the impression this was a "community" of arborists and vendors to the industry. 

I'd hope for mutual respect, not ripping each other to shreds over how someone decides to market their company or work their trade.

Door Knocking is legit if done properly. Some areas of the country have become jaded because of the "transient treeworkers" that show up every year and go door to door. Typically unlicensed, unskilled and just looking for work, they lend a bad name to the legit tree services.

Rather than knock, I say do a door hanger with your contact info (website, phone, owner, services info, years in business, etc.) Know where you canvassed and do follow up calls. Also be sure to check with your city government on soliciting laws. Some require permits depending on where you are.

In otherwords, be smart about your personal marketing. Just banging on a door won't get the results you probably want, and yes, probably tick some people off. 


If you aren't a large firm or just starting out, there are a lot of freebies available to you. Don't discount having a website and email account, no matter how small you are. These are available for FREE all day long, including local directories. The only expense I would recommend is purchasing a domain name. (preferably your business name or catch phrase)

Domains are roughly $25 for two years, and can be transferred to the free sites so you don't have a goofy URL. 

While the internet and search engine ranking are huge in getting found, continue to utilize traditional marketing methods: phone calls, direct mail, email, etc.

Be sure to list yourself on Merchantcircle (online) where you can create a site as well as link with local partners also listed in your area.

www.merchantcircle.com


----------



## mckeetree

Buckettruckbabe said:


> I'm new to the forums and was rather horrified at the turn this whole thread took.





They can get way worse than this so some might be to horrifying for you to read. Sometimes they deal with some real big boy stuff.


----------



## Ekka

mckeetree said:


> They can get way worse than this so some might be to horrifying for you to read. Sometimes they deal with some real big boy stuff.



More like big ego stuff where fools attempt to bully facts with BS and ignorance.


----------



## mckeetree

Ekka said:


> More like big ego stuff where fools attempt to bully facts with BS and ignorance.




More like guys that are really in the know having to hose down the hogwash from time to time with a dose of reality.


----------



## ArborSmithNw

Yes, and very rarely would it have anything to do with online conservative tough guys who feel like they get to attack any opinion different from their own.


----------



## treevet

ArborSmithNw said:


> Yes, and very rarely would it have anything to do with online conservative tough guys who feel like they get to attack any opinion different from their own.



Blowhards like bucketbabe and you while spewing all kinds of self important rhetoric fail to acknowledge that this thread is about "door knocking/soliciting" and not how impressive you are or your plan to become a legend in your own mind. 

Many of us are out there every day doing the work in areas where this sleeze is ruining the trees of our areas and the rep of the top level arb, and no matter how much you sugar coat it, it is more the norm than an aberration. 

Some of the posters try to condescend to the working arborist. I think it would be a surprise to the self proclaimed big shots just how much "stuff" we have compared to the armchair arborists like them. I'd be happy to match up with Arborsmith who seems to somehow feel he is better than me, a 41 year very successful arborist. You would be amazed just how much a top level 2 man crew can make in the right area with the right cliente.

Garborsmith wants to continue to portray us reality speakers as "online toughguys". I can't speak for others but I am a real "tough guy" and this is part of what has got me where I am today.


----------



## ozarktreeman

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ekka View Post
More like big ego stuff where fools attempt to bully facts with BS and ignorance. 



mckeetree said:


> More like guys that are really in the know having to hose down the hogwash from time to time with a dose of reality.



I don't know why they just don't rub bars till there chains click!!
:love1::love1:


----------



## Ekka

Now what can 2 smart guys achieve? More than a crew of idiots I assure you.

Working intelligently using the best tools of the trade is a luxury for most people. How many times I see a boss undercut a crane job by having a crew of dumb sherpas carry the 8 ton log out in small bits, that's real clever eh. Even more clever if you get 10 Mexicans doing it for $10 a day. Bosses have a habit of telling people to jobs that they'd never do or capable of doing themselves.

I often work with a guy who I trained. Customers are continually gobsmacked by what we do in a day. Coz we're smart, methodical and lay down a game plan better than a generals assault plans. We even tape measure the cuts on logs to determine suitable length for lifting and disposal.

Not much is left to chance.

As time passes we also grow and evolve, follow what suits us best. I have personally persued the consulting avenue further figuring that distancing myself from door knocking hacks with education means lowering competing idiots. To compete they'd have to get educated and for most that aint gonna happen. However the internet allows those uneducated idiots to gob off like no tomorrow, on some sites we control that. :hmm3grin2orange:


----------



## treevet

Great post Eric.

Last year we had a hurricane demolish trees in our town. No streets were open, electric was lost for over a week and in the aftermath the town was saturated with hack doorknockers despite local ordinance which was not enforced.

How does a tree service get work?

1. Professional advertising honestly portraying their service's knowledge, experience and capabilities, and credentials.

2. High quality websites doing the same.

3. Repeat work from established satisfied clients.

4. Referrals from established clients.

5. Sheer length of time in business in an area noticed by potential clients.

6. Suppliers recognizing the professionalism and recommending them.


How does a door ringing, banging, dog barking causing hack get work?......

1. DOOR KNOCKING

2. -O-



What happens when your town is buried with hack door terrorists? 

Extreme conditions make it more obvious. We have our hurricane hacks and Ekka has the hack "islanders" who he profiled in a local news documentary (that took a lot of guts as these guys are potentially dangerous) who canvas every street and threaten other services with their families coming after them. Both places take advantage of senior citizens.

What happens when you have the misfortune to have this inundation (as opposed to a small dose of them)?

1. The man hour rate for tree work plummets after being previously established by fair and legal competition over a period of time and including things like high quality equipment costs, insurance, advertising, credentials/licensing, etc.

2. Beautiful healthy trees are removed out of greed and ignorance and lack of education.

3. Other trees and property are significantly banged up and injured in the process pissing of clients and residents as well.

4. The public is ripped off by lies and misinformation and cheating. Things like giving partial service....collecting in full while promising to come back and finish and never showing. Leave most of a stump and cover it with chips and collect as though it was ground properly well below ground. Leaving a stump, brush, logs, etc. and promising to come back ....collecting...no show to finish.

Trees spiked, branch collars destroyed, root collars bombed, cuts torn, big dangerous hangers left, etc. etc.

5. Good work (jobs) and clients are "used up" and may never have tree work done again after this experience and a black eye is cast over an entire area of arborists in general. Often this is documented by the newspapers and news.


----------



## Buckettruckbabe

Whatever. I kept on topic. Someone asked about door knocking and I answered from a marketing point of view and my experience. Rather than post snark and run, I offered up suggestions. (OMG)

This turned into an argument about door knockers, versus door knocking. I am well aware of what the transient tree dudes do to the 
industry. However, that wasn't the question. So rather than educate the person who asked whether or not it was a good idea (obviously not)
it turned into a soapbox for the rest of you.

(blowhard...LOL*)

Yeah, I come here for validation. BWAAHAHAHA


:hmm3grin2orange:


----------



## danthestumpman

Hey man this is how I got started 18 years ago, and I still knock on doors today If I see a potentially good job. I have a stump grinding business. Knocking on doors or leaving a brochure with a price on it has landed me so much work. Most of the time the homeowner is happy to see me. The only problem with knocking on doors today is that youre not going to get as many people wanting to have the work done. When the customer awnsers the door I just say. Hi I was wondering If you would be interested In having that stump grinded. Be as nice as you can with the person and be willing to talk with them for a few minutes. Thats it, It works great


----------



## ArborSmithNw

danthestumpman said:


> Hey man this is how I got started 18 years ago, and I still knock on doors today If I see a potentially good job. I have a stump grinding business. Knocking on doors or leaving a brochure with a price on it has landed me so much work. Most of the time the homeowner is happy to see me. The only problem with knocking on doors today is that youre not going to get as many people wanting to have the work done. When the customer awnsers the door I just say. Hi I was wondering If you would be interested In having that stump grinded. Be as nice as you can with the person and be willing to talk with them for a few minutes. Thats it, It works great



And in all honesty everyone who has read through this, that is all I was trying to get across myself before the mauling that led to the self defense.

My apologies for stooping to levels usually unbecoming of me. 

Door knocking, when done HONESTLY, is the most gratifying marketing you can get. You rely solely on your personality, experience & integrity.


----------



## treevet

Illegal in every upscale neighborhood in the greater Cincinnati area.

Wonder why that is?


----------



## outofmytree

treevet said:


> Illegal in every upscale neighborhood in the greater Cincinnati area.
> 
> Wonder why that is?



Notes in mail boxes still ok? I ask because we get a good response from dropping leaflets or even hand written notes in mailboxes when we are working a good sized job in the street.

I used to cold call but then discovered that it is in breach of the fair trading act in Australia so now its leaflets or a chat with walk ups but no door knocking.


----------



## John Paul Sanborn

outofmytree said:


> Notes in mail boxes still ok? I ask because we get a good response from dropping leaflets or even hand written notes in mailboxes when we are working a good sized job in the street.



In the US it violates postal code and we can be fined for it. I've gotten threats from carriers, but never heard of a fine levied.


----------



## ArborSmithNw

treevet said:


> Illegal in every upscale neighborhood in the greater Cincinnati area.
> 
> Wonder why that is?



Not sure, seems kind of weird that a law would apply to just upscale neighborhoods though. 

Wonder what the prosecution rate is?


----------



## treevet

The reason is upscale neighborhoods (meaning municipalities) have their own individual governments just like depressed municipalities do. The door knocker will target these upscale neighborhoods and drive them nuts and sometimes commit other crimes. Nothing (relatively) to steal or sell from/to in the depressed municipalities hence less ordinance nec.

Outofmytree, in our town to pass out literature about your business you have to have it presented and reviewed and if approved....guess what....you have to pay a permit fee to hang them on doors. Like JPS said ....no mailbox fillers are legal as the mailbox is technically Fed govt. property even tho you buy it.


----------



## treevet

outofmytree said:


> I used to cold call but then discovered that it is in
> 
> !!!!!!!!!! BREACH OF THE FAIR TRADING !!!!!!!!!!!!
> 
> act in Australia so now its leaflets or a chat with walk ups but no door knocking.



Arborsmith,
This another good description of the door knocking process. Just like monopolies. Now an entire nation is in opposition to your asserted beneficial work gathering process.

If a law is in effect in a neighborhood do you ignore it? ("wonder what the prosecution rate is")


----------



## outofmytree

Oops. I made a mistake. It is the door to door trading act NOT the fair trading act. My bad. 

http://www.docep.wa.gov.au/ConsumerProtection/Content/Shopping/For_consumers/Door_to_door_sales.html

The most pertinent parts of the act to us are;



> The major benefit of the Door to Door Trading Act 1987 is that it gives you a 10-day cooling-off period on goods or services worth more than $50. This means you can cancel the contract during this time with no penalty.


So if you offer to do the work on the spot the client is legally allowed to change their mind up to 10 days later. Got any super glue guys?


----------



## Buckettruckbabe

We have something similar in Illinois, only it's 3-days to cancel a written
contract. 

For those businesses that want to use the door to door/knocker approach, the BBB guidelines prepare you with what you should have to separate you from the illegitimate businesses and scam artists.

(This comes from the Denver, CO BBB)

http://denver.bbb.org/article/tree-services-3824


----------



## Toddppm

The 3 day rule applies here too if you didn't initiate the sales call. That's why the doorknockers trucks are slowly cruising along ready to pounce if a sucke.... er sale is made. 

I have to admit though, I sometimes get a little jealous when these guys are working almost every day if they want. But a whole lot of them are practically working for free with the lowball rates they charge except for the occasional overpriced bid they might hit on with an unsuspecting customer.

Always amazes me that anybody falls for the sales pitch- We are just in the neighborhood trying to get a couple jobs before we head back home. 
OK Sure, I had hired XYZ Tree Co. already and signed a contract but what would you charge me for this job????? No consideration if the gypsies really have ins., licensed or have a clue what they are doing but a lower price will throw all common sense out the window for some people:monkey:


----------



## Buckettruckbabe

I think for all of the legit tree service/arborists out there, it's going to be a matter of educating john q. public. Of course they'll be money motivated for a cheap deal until one of the transients gets killed on their property, drops a tree on their house or worse...:jawdrop:

I'm amazed that when we got hit last summer with 90 mph straight line winds we didn't have them cruising our neighborhood...there was a lot of damage. Hubby called his tree guy asap for the big stuff that was still treebound or sheared while we cleared the ground. (We sport two 75' cottonwoods on our sideyard.)

Watching them work was amazing.


----------



## treevet

It should probably be clarified that we are looking at 2 totally different areas of expertise here.

One is the tree removal, limb removal, debris removal company. They are sometimes referred to as "tree garbage" companies.

The other is the tree care, maintenance, monitoring and diagnosis and treatment company.

The top level companies should be both but many are one or the other or neither.


----------



## Buckettruckbabe

Absolutely Treevet, sorry if I wasn't clear. I do know the difference between the two, and you're right. In a perfect world both skills in one service would be ideal.

Don't worry, I'm not letting anyone top out my maples. 
Hubby's tree guys aren't arborists. I still like watching all the ropework though, regardless.


----------



## treevet

Buckettruckbabe said:


> Absolutely Treevet, sorry if I wasn't clear. I do know the difference between the two, and you're right. In a perfect world both skills in one service would be ideal.
> 
> Don't worry, I'm not letting anyone top out my maples.
> Hubby's tree guys aren't arborists. I still like watching all the ropework though, regardless.



I understand completely, believe me.


----------



## mckeetree

ArborSmithNw said:


> Not sure, seems kind of weird that a law would apply to just upscale neighborhoods though.
> 
> Wonder what the prosecution rate is?



Higher than you think.


----------



## John Paul Sanborn

treevet said:


> Illegal in every upscale neighborhood in the greater Cincinnati area.
> 
> Wonder why that is?





ArborSmithNw said:


> Not sure, seems kind of weird that a law would apply to just upscale neighborhoods though.
> 
> Wonder what the prosecution rate is?





mckeetree said:


> Higher than you think.



It depends on the complaint rate. It is a form of trespass in some areas, in mine peddling is a licensed trade. If it is a very high rent district they haul you off very fast.

One reason is that there is a high percentage of people going door-to-door under false pretense.

This is off the Berkley PD website



> Berkeley Municipal Codes related to door to door solicitation - the full text of these codes may be reviewed via the Police or City web sites or at the City Clerks office.
> 
> Solicitors must have a solicitor/vendor permit in their immediate possession and show it on demand - BMC 9.40.140 - sample attached below.
> 
> Hours for door to door solicitation - 0800am to 700pm, seven days a week - BMC 9.40.180
> 
> Unlawful to enter any property that is posted No Soliciting, No Peddling, No Agents or other similar verbiage - BMC 9.40.170. This does not include religious organizations or groups.
> 
> Soliciting defined - sell, take orders, offer to sell, offer to take orders for merchandise, wares, goods or anything - 9.40.010



Town of Yarmoth



> § 114-9. Penalties.
> 
> 
> 
> A. Each violation of any provision of this By-Law shall be punished by a fine not to exceed Three Hundred ($300) Dollars.
> 
> 
> 
> B. Upon the occurrence of a second violation of this By-Law by any sales person, the issuing authority may revoke that sales person’s Town of Yarmouth Door to Door Sales Permit.


----------



## VL07

Just had Orkin pest control knock on my door offering me 50% off. He had a door hanger ready to put on my door. Looked out in the street, and there was a three man team moving through my Nhood. Orkin is a big company...are they hacks? NO! This is something I may start doing soon too.


----------



## mckeetree

VL07 said:


> Just had Orkin pest control knock on my door offering me 50% off. He had a door hanger ready to put on my door. Looked out in the street, and there was a three man team moving through my Nhood. Orkin is a big company...are they hacks? NO! This is something I may start doing soon too.



I just called Orkin and they assured me they DO NOT go door to door soliciting and if someone representing Orkin is doing so, that is grounds for disassociation with the company.


----------



## VL07

Sorry man, orkin uniform, orkin truck, Orkin all the way. Orkin door hangers too.


----------



## mckeetree

VL07 said:


> Sorry man, orkin uniform, orkin truck, Orkin all the way. Orkin door hangers too.



Look man, Orkin had over 15,000 consumer complaints in Florida over a four year period and numerous lawsuits in that state, and yes, some of those had to do with soliciting...... BUT, their company policy is not to go door to door. I got that info right from the horses mouth. Also if their associates are caught going door to door leaving "cold call" advertising they say they fire them. The exact words of their rep was " I can't guarantee you there are not techs going door to door in Florida or any where else for that matter. We have had it happen. I can guarantee you it is not our policy to do so." So that is the way it stacks up cat.


----------



## outonalimbts

*When I got started I would knock on many doors-*

I went door to door to nice homes, offering my services- No big deal, do an honest days work for an honest days pay- People respect this work ethic, I am in my 18th year of business, I still do door to door sales at times...

I have a solicitors license, which I didn't back in the day- To get a solicitors license I had to submit myself to a background check, a full check that I paid for, pictures, fingerprints etc. I must wear my license in plain view, and surrender it to anyone that asks to see it.

I have had the police called on me, I present my license and they say have a nice day. I have an A+ rating with the BBB with zero complaints since I joined in 2003, I have won Angie's list super service award two years in a row.

I don't have any problem with door knocking- it is a good way to meet people!

But, I also use as many tools as possible, I advertise on Craigslist, I am a favorite place on Google maps, I post pictures of my work on Google Earth, I have advertisements running all of the time. At the grocery store I am in my professional wear- with logos and numbers- I hand out a box of cards a month.

I post flyers when we work in a neighborhood- Each flyer is custom made with printed dates that I am working in the neighborhood, I never give out any personal info about the project I am doing, if they want to watch I welcome it. I have coupons on each flyer, offering either Free Arborist consultations or other business incentives- such as multiple tree discounts, etc.

There is nothing wrong with marketing, I don't compare my services with others- I point to articles that have been written about my company in major news outlets. I sometimes bring our DVD with our TV interviews, and work samples. When our clients choose us, they are happy they did. 

Finally, I have many, many clients that have been clients since the beginning when all I did was knock doors, these people constantly give great referrals.

Keep up the good work, don't be too discouraged when people say no, leave your card and say thank you for your time.

Smile when you answer your telephone-

:chainsawguy:


----------



## VL07

mckeetree said:


> Look man, Orkin had over 15,000 consumer complaints in Florida over a four year period and numerous lawsuits in that state, and yes, some of those had to do with soliciting...... BUT, their company policy is not to go door to door. I got that info right from the horses mouth. Also if their associates are caught going door to door leaving "cold call" advertising they say they fire them. The exact words of their rep was " I can't guarantee you there are not techs going door to door in Florida or any where else for that matter. We have had it happen. I can guarantee you it is not our policy to do so." So that is the way it stacks up cat.



Not some, but one. You got your info from Wikipedia...not a great place for facts. Did you really call Orkin? They have an A+ rating with the BBB.


----------



## mckeetree

VL07 said:


> You got your info from Wikipedia...not a great place for facts. Did you really call Orkin? They have an A+ rating with the BBB.



Nope. I got my info from the Orlando Sentinel and consumeraffairs.com. Don't know what you are talking about with the Wikipedia thing. 65,000 folks sued them in Florida in a class action lawsuit. Yes, I really called Orkin. The BBB is ridiculous. Some of the worst companies have good ratings there.


----------



## BakerTREE

Agreed about the BBB -- grr...arrggg. Then there's angie's list: You are allowed to buy your bad rep away and so many companies seem to do it. I'm not a big fan of any refs you have to pay for or be a member of ...a bit of bias is present far too easily. 
And fwiw - door to door in dallas area and you WON'T be the first to be graciously providing unsolicited knowledge...grr...its annoying the prices around here :monkey:


----------



## mckeetree

VL07 said:


> I just don't know what to say...sorry for your anger.



You don't have to say anything. I am not the least bit angry. I just didn't want you to get too far off track there pardner.


----------



## mckeetree

BakerTREE said:


> Agreed about the BBB -- grr...arrggg. Then there's angie's list: You are allowed to buy your bad rep away and so many companies seem to do it. I'm not a big fan of any refs you have to pay for or be a member of ...a bit of bias is present far too easily.
> And fwiw - door to door in dallas area and you WON'T be the first to be graciously providing unsolicited knowledge...grr...its annoying the prices around here :monkey:



BBB had it's day. You are right, any refs you have to basically "pay for" are not reliable. Door to door in Dallas used to be a good way to get your ass kicked.


----------



## VL07

mckeetree said:


> BBB had it's day. You are right, any refs you have to basically "pay for" are not reliable. Door to door in Dallas used to be a good way to get your ass kicked.





You kick someones ass here in Florida, and that door to door owns your home. It's not the wild west down here.


----------



## mckeetree

VL07 said:


> You kick someones ass here in Florida, and that door to door owns your home. It's not the wild west down here.



Oh, I don't know. Tell that to Virgil Zatarain. He reported getting a genuine beat down back about 1992 after hurricane Andrew. This came after several threats and a mini-asskicking had already occurred from going door to door and he didn't get to own anybody's home. As I remember it the first problem that little entourage from Dallas encountered was some local boys that thought they owned the hurricane clean up in that particular neighborhood. After some Mexican looking guy tried to hit one of them with a pipe wrench they decided to hire on with a "big time" contractor doing some of the major clean up. Three weeks into that and not a single dime in pay brought them to the bright idea of knocking on doors. One of the first doors they knocked produced a man in his fifties or so that chased them off with a baseball bat. The next day this guy about forty told him "Just a second, we might need something" and the next thing he knows the guy is back with somebody else and together they administer an olde tyme beat down.


----------



## treeserv.jax

i simply just put a business card on the front door.and write down when i came by and the problem i seen.thats usually how i get calls then i give them an estimate my uncles company puts estimates on the business cards i think it usually shuns people away.


----------



## tree md

Wow, this is still going on???

Some neighborhoods are open to direct marketing, some aren't. Avoid the snobs, deal with the real people who are open to direct marketing.

Working people will not knock a clean cut, honest, working man who is trying to work for a living rather than set home and live on the government (our) dime.

I find a lot of work on rural properties. It is not uncommon for people to still seek work as a ranch hand buy stopping by and talking to owners where I live.


... I'm thinking I am going to put my ground hand out on the sidewalk wearing a billboard... :hmm3grin2orange:


----------



## treeslayer

Who kicks A$$ because somebody asks for work? 

I've done quite a bit of door knocking all over the country during storms, sometimes people can get squirrely, but violent? never seen it from a HO.

I get a lot of work wherever I live that way. ride a good neighborhood, look for dead trees in front yards or bad hangers, and ride past most minor stuff. get one job for a low price, and I'm in. 
I'm polite, honest, and tell people I'd rather look for work than sit on my butt waiting for what? Show em my insurance, copies of my license and my newspaper ad, and offer cheap quality work, *cause I need it!!*
lot of people respect that.

picked up a bunch of work this week doing just that. it's 5 deg, -20 windchill, and I'm headed to work, picked up half a dozen jobs in one neighborhood.


----------



## familytreeman

*real scam*



treemandan said:


> The real scam is that reporter girl trying to wear those pumps.



yeah LOL looking like a preying mantis


----------



## familytreeman

*proper English*



Overhead said:


> On the other hand, we know how to speak & write the English language.



This is a lesson yet to be learned by many, it seems...


----------



## familytreeman

*Mn*



John Paul Sanborn said:


> I had a guy pull up my driveway on Sunday and hand me a flyer for an out of area company. I called him asked if he was one of those gaffing hacks from Minni-soda and politely told him where to go.



I think there are more arborists here in MN than over there in 'sconnie.

how many WI residents commute to MN all week? even Brett Favre gave it a shot LOL

and you guys truck your wood all over county/state lines... dont you know that spreads disease? 

talk about hacks


----------



## Corymbia

*I am a bum*



mckeetree said:


> I thought door knockers were all bums. Are you a bum?



I'd rather be a bum than be poor! Aren't bums poor?

So you take care of the trees and you ask the tree owner for the name of the neighbours so you can help take care of their trees and that makes you a bum?

You see a tree problem as you drive a long so you stop and tell the tree owner and offer to help and that makes you a bum?

Can I suggest that if we all waited for life to happen it would be a shame. Door knocking, direct mail, calling on the phone are all valid marketing systems. In management terms it is called being proactive.


----------



## John Paul Sanborn

Corymbia said:


> Can I suggest that if we all waited for life to happen it would be a shame. Door knocking, direct mail, calling on the phone are all valid marketing systems. In management terms it is called being proactive.



It depends on what is door knocking. Would you go up and down a street, knocking on each and every door, asking for a chance to bid on work?

Asking for referrals is a bit different. "Who do you know that I can talk to next? I'll give you a discount for every sale I make." is good trade craft.


----------



## Corymbia

John Paul Sanborn said:


> It depends on what is door knocking. Would you go up and down a street, knocking on each and every door, asking for a chance to bid on work?
> 
> Asking for referrals is a bit different. "Who do you know that I can talk to next? I'll give you a discount for every sale I make." is good trade craft.



I agree although I am sure there are areas in most cities where knocking on each door would still be a smart move if work was quiet. Apart from anything else the work will all be in the same locality.


----------



## outofmytree

IMO there is a stark difference between spotting a problem then discussing it with the tree owner and knocking on every door in the street. 

These 2 big girls were the victims of some form of poisoning and were a danger to any of the 150 plus residents of the building let alone any visitors.







I spotted them from the street, called the managing agent, then followed up with a hazard assessment via email. 3 weeks later they were out. That is proactive marketting whilst observing peoples inherent right to the privacy of their own home.


----------



## tree md

You know, I have worked for a lot of tree services in my time. Some of the largest in my area. I've met a lot of owners. When I have asked or they have offered to tell me how they started out every one of them, to a man has told me working out of a pickup, going door to door, working neighborhoods. I'm not exaggerating, every one of them have told me that. 

That's why I often laugh when someone wants to beat their chest about how legitimate a service they run. Most have started out just like everyone else, working out of a pickup hitting neighborhoods. And if they haven't the owner or founder of the tree service they work for has. Either that or they have bought someone out or had the business handed to them.


----------



## tree md

And as for the young black man in the article you posted. I believe in due process of the law (another cornerstone of a free society). I'll reserve judgment until he is judged by 12 of his peers.

As bad as it that story sounds, I have seen some pretty crafty seniors. I had a dealing with one myself who had hired three different tree services to do his job (97 trees). He tried to swindle everyone of us.


----------



## JayD

EdenT said:


> Yep I was right!
> 
> Mate, that wasn't a venomous post. You are deluding yourself. It was a plea for you to pull your head out of yours or someone elses _Equus asinus_.
> 
> And yes for better and worse the US of A does give freedom of speech as does the owner of this site. It is sad that their are no reflections of this pinnacle of democracy in your world. It is sad that all you can do is abuse this privilege.
> 
> I really do hope you can find some happiness this Easter JayD, as your sad lonely bitterness is a testament to the emptiness of your life! Really man, go and spend some time with your family and forget about AS/TW etc for a day. It is meant to be a time for celebrating and enjoying the good things in life. Before you start, I am an Atheist. My good wishes are not my theological beliefs they are my beliefs in humanity.
> 
> If it will help - I am a dum dum poo poo head. Now go and smell the roses!



How funny, Happy Easter one more time cuppa...lol..


----------



## Corymbia

JayD said:


> lol..well it only took you 912 hours to learn how to spell arborist..lol..did you run that spelling past your buddies first?..lol



JayD 

I said "912 hours ago I couldn't spell arbortist and now I are consulting one" 

The delights of humour were unfortunately wasted on the uneducated. The spelling mistake was deliberate as was the grammatical mistake ... both these make it clear to the educated that this was a joke. I apologise that you took the sentence literally rather than seeing the humour that was plainly intended.

Yes it is true, I do like spelling to be correct on completed documents and in my confabulations I am known for my sesquipedalian loquaciousness and my desire to communicate using correct English grammar. I apologize if this offends. 

If you want one of my spelling buddies they are called dictionaries and they are on line for free or you can by them in these things called books.


----------



## JayD

Corymbia said:


> JayD
> 
> I said "912 hours ago I couldn't spell arbortist and now I are consulting one"
> 
> The delights of humour were unfortunately wasted on the uneducated. The spelling mistake was deliberate as was the grammatical mistake ... both these make it clear to the educated that this was a joke. I apologise that you took the sentence literally rather than seeing the humour that was plainly intended.
> 
> Yes it is true, I do like spelling to be correct on completed documents and in my confabulations I am known for my sesquipedalian loquaciousness and my desire to communicate using correct English grammar. I apologize if this offends.
> 
> If you want one of my spelling buddies they are called dictionaries and they are on line for free or you can by them in these things called books.



Typical condescending pretentious post..get a life you loser!


----------



## Corymbia

JayD said:


> Typical condescending pretentious post..get a life you loser!



JayD,

I certainly did not mean to be condescending or pretentious. Far from it I am ever overwhelmed by the great capacity of many arborists. I was simply pointing out that your previous smart criticism was not so smart. You seemed very quick to criticise and not so fast to get the facts. 

This is something that you again do in this post. "Typical" is thrown in like a loose punch but of my 55 or so posts here it must be plain to most that I can at least respond civilly a lesson that you would do well to learn. 

One of course may challenge you with "typical" of what? 

Being educated ... I stand guilt. 
Having manners ... Again I have no defence!
Telling the truth ... What else should I do?
Valuing integrity ... Shouldn't we all?
Defensive of my honour ... why be disrespectful and challenge it without cause

What is your typical JayD? 

You are throwing punches but loosing ground. You do not need to behave like a rude obnoxious uneducated thug. Use your skills to at least write something a little more stylish and lacking in spite and venom. Once you master that you can then worry about facts.

As for getting a life, I have a simply charming and very fulfilling and rewarding one so I thank you for your blessing. May you also find a life as blessed.


----------



## JayD

Corymbia said:


> JayD,
> 
> I certainly did not mean to be condescending or pretentious. Far from it I am ever overwhelmed by the great capacity of many arborists. I was simply pointing out that your previous smart criticism was not so smart. You seemed very quick to criticise and not so fast to get the facts.
> 
> This is something that you again do in this post. "Typical" is thrown in like a loose punch but of my 55 or so posts here it must be plain to most that I can at least respond civilly a lesson that you would do well to learn.
> 
> One of course may challenge you with "typical" of what?
> 
> Being educated ... I stand guilt.
> Having manners ... Again I have no defence!
> Telling the truth ... What else should I do?
> Valuing integrity ... Shouldn't we all?
> Defensive of my honour ... why be disrespectful and challenge it without cause
> 
> What is your typical JayD?
> 
> You are throwing punches but loosing ground. You do not need to behave like a rude obnoxious uneducated thug. Use your skills to at least write something a little more stylish and lacking in spite and venom. Once you master that you can then worry about facts.
> 
> As for getting a life, I have a simply charming and very fulfilling and rewarding one so I thank you for your blessing. May you also find a life as blessed.



I put it to you, you are the thug in this thread, you imagine we are having a fight, me losing ground, I laugh at the notion....you are delusional ! 

Shane pk is not to far from Blacktown you should be able to find some help there.


----------



## jefflovstrom

af7850 said:


> To me it is a matter of intention. If I see a noticeable issue with a tree I might stop in if I have a few minutes. However, my intention is NOT to get the owner to hire us! My goal is to mention the offending item, explain why it is a problem, and leave literature. I invite the owner to call and schedule a thorough Tree Health Analysis if they are so-inclined.
> 
> I think that people are generally thankful to recieve honest accurate information without being pressured in any way. Plus, we are not in an area known for general tree care aptitude, so this is a great way to raise awareness of the importance of proper tree care.



Just what I as saying, you would seem hungry for work, not some-one that would be in the same biz as me.
Jeff
BTW- Intention is marketing.


----------



## treemandan

Hell, way back I would see a screwed up tree I would stop and staple a freaking proposal to it! I still have the urge for that cowboy crap every now and again.
But if one has time and is working next door its good business to say HI. There is no harm in that... no more than nailing a piece of paper to a dead tree that say's " I will chop this sob down for 400 hundred bucks!" Lord have mercy!


----------



## treevet

af7850 said:


> To me it is a matter of intention. If I see a noticeable issue with a tree I might stop in if I have a few minutes. However, my intention is NOT to get the owner to hire us! My goal is to mention the offending item, explain why it is a problem, and leave literature. I invite the owner to call and schedule a thorough Tree Health Analysis if they are so-inclined.



Are we skipping structural and risk assessment for any reason?


----------



## af7850

treevet said:


> Are skipping structural and risk assessment for any reason?



No, "Tree Health Analysis" is what we call the detailed consultation. Includes an assessment of canopy, structure and root/soil. 

Around here we still get a ton of calls for things like, "How much will you charge to take these three limbs out of my tree?" Hell, I went to look at two Bradford pears last Thursday and the homeowner's first words to me were, "I'm sure youll agree that these things obviously need to be topped. How much?" 

If I can sell these people on the fact that they are going to value my professional diagnosis, then we're moving in the right direction.


----------



## treevet

af7850 said:


> No, "Tree Health Analysis" is what we call the detailed consultation. Includes an assessment of canopy, structure and root/soil.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Just my opinion (and that is what we are all here for) but I think you could call it something more descriptive. Health and structure.....2 different aminals.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> two Bradford pears last Thursday and the homeowner's first words to me were, "I'm sure youll agree that these things obviously need to be topped. How much?"
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Bradfords are banned for street trees in most towns around here. We are learning lessons. I think they are, or shortly to be, on the invasive plant list.
> Sure are pretty sometimes tho.
Click to expand...


----------



## NCTREE

Ekka said:


> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pJsyTX31S0Y



I'd punch that camera guy out to if he put that thing in my face. Whats the big deal people do what they need to do to survive. The one clip where you expose this other tree co because they charge $350 for a tree you would have done for $200. Thats 150 bucks difference... I would have bid 350 on that tree myself. I think Ekka doesn't like other tree cos coming into his territory trying to make a living so he makes them look bad on TV. That ####ing horse ####! Who do you think you are gods gift to trees. #### You!


----------



## Corymbia

af7850 said:


> I do not believe that it is specifically illegal to knock in Australia. However, the actions of gypsy door knockers which are discussed in this forum and others are in direct violation of both the Fair Trading Act and the Door to Door Trading Act (Australian laws).
> 
> Let me know if I qualify for the $10k donation.



Regrettably no on two accounts. The first is that Eric needed to prove it because he said that "*door knocking is illegal*" and the second is you start your post by acknowledging it is not illegal. 

We all agree that people can and do break the law ... in most instances selling work door to door is not a breach of statute law.

The phrase "gypsy" is a little offensive and I know it was not meant to be. What you are saying is true that there are some unethical operators that do take advantage of people and they are there in the big companies as well. Just in the last few days the Feds have been down at Sachs Goldman and at that level of corruption in Wall Street when it occurs, is always far more wide spread and significant than one person taking advantage door to door but there is no forum against multinational tree services ... yet


----------



## treemandan

NCTREE said:


> I'd punch that camera guy out to if he put that thing in my face. Whats the big deal people do what they need to do to survive. The one clip where you expose this other tree co because they charge $350 for a tree you would have done for $200. Thats 150 bucks difference... I would have bid 350 on that tree myself. I think Ekka doesn't like other tree cos coming into his territory trying to make a living so he makes them look bad on TV. That ####ing horse ####! Who do you think you are gods gift to trees. #### You!



Whoa! Hold on! He IS God's gift to the trees. Just goes to show God don't give a dam bout no stinking tree.


----------



## af7850

NCTREE said:


> I'd punch that camera guy out to if he put that thing in my face. Whats the big deal people do what they need to do to survive. The one clip where you expose this other tree co because they charge $350 for a tree you would have done for $200. Thats 150 bucks difference... I would have bid 350 on that tree myself. I think Ekka doesn't like other tree cos coming into his territory trying to make a living so he makes them look bad on TV. That ####ing horse ####! Who do you think you are gods gift to trees. #### You!



if you've ever been involved with journalists, then you know that the "spin" of the story is beyond the control of the persons interviewed.

If you'd quote $350, then so be it - but would you do it without proper PPE? Would you leave a nasty branch stub, as they did in the first tree documented in the video? Let's agree that prices are negotiable, but proper standards of safety and performance aren't. 

Also, I can assume that these clients were not offered the 10 day "cooling off" period mandated by law for door-knocked solicitations. Is this acceptable to you?

Whether you agree with the price or not is inconsequential. I find your lack of concern for poor work standards far more telling.


----------



## NCTREE

af7850 said:


> if you've ever been involved with journalists, then you know that the "spin" of the story is beyond the control of the persons interviewed.
> 
> If you'd quote $350, then so be it - but would you do it without proper PPE? Would you leave a nasty branch stub, as they did in the first tree documented in the video? Let's agree that prices are negotiable, but proper standards of safety and performance aren't.
> 
> Also, I can assume that these clients were not offered the 10 day "cooling off" period mandated by law for door-knocked solicitations. Is this acceptable to you?
> 
> Whether you agree with the price or not is inconsequential. I find your lack of concern for poor work standards far more telling.



hey i'm all about wearing PPE and making good cuts. I agree that the "spin" of the story is beyond anyones control other than the interviewer. Maybe the interviewer forgot to tell the public that that old lady wanted the branch cut like that so she could hang a swing or a bird feeder on it. Ive left cuts like that before because the HO wanted me too eeven after I explained that it wasn't right. I just have a beef with this guy saying the HOs are getting ripped off for a lousey 150 bucks when off camera he probably would have bid the same price.


----------



## treemandan

treevet said:


> af7850 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Just my opinion (and that is what we are all here for) but I think you could call it something more descriptive. Health and structure.....2 different aminals.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bradfords are banned for street trees in most towns around here. We are learning lessons. I think they are, or shortly to be, on the invasive plant list.
> Sure are pretty sometimes tho.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I can see why there are not a good idea for street trees and such but are they really an invasive? All the ones I have seen have been planted. Oh wait, I see, they were planted by the cheap developers by thier mexican work force. So they ARE invasive.
Click to expand...


----------



## treemandan

Ekka said:


> More twist and lies from Hartley.
> 
> Talking ethics, look in the mirror and see none fool!
> 
> The thread is full of all the legal requirements of door knocking, times, days etc with links but *fool Hartley* has to apply his demented twists.
> 
> Get therapy mate.



Listen, I have some good advice for you Ekka. Take it or leave it but PLEASE take it... STOP SMOKING DOPE ! I did and I am a whole lot less paranoid and raving. Not completly less paranoid and raving but still, it helped... a little. If its not that then it must be to much sun.
Man dude, bro, holmes, you getting any or what?


----------



## treevet

treemandan said:


> I can see why there are not a good idea for street trees and such but are they really an invasive? All the ones I have seen have been planted. Oh wait, I see, they were planted by the cheap developers by thier mexican work force. So they ARE invasive.



Invasive as in spreading through unmaintained land such as parks and private lots.


----------



## treemandan

I wanna get a little handheld crossbow, I can tape a proposal to the arrow so I can just drive by and shoot an estimate into the trunk of the tree.


----------



## treevet

I have an idea.....doesn't happen often....and it may be bullshiht...but it is an idea none the less....

How about we have Mark and Eric write a post on what is important about tree care and limit it to, oh say, 200?....500?... (some limit) words and have a limited time to respond. 

Then we have a poll and decide which one is the smartest and we can discuss until the cow jumps over the moon just why we think that.  Both agree to defer to the other that wins the poll. The one that wins cannot condescend but may generally act smug and very knowledgeable (a far cry from status quo I admit).

What about it you two.....showdown at the OK Corral at high noon? Who is gonna blink first?


----------



## tree md

Uhh... Uhh... What was the question again???


----------



## treevet

tree md said:


> Uhh... Uhh... What was the question again???



See now MD, if you were in the contest you would gain points for an existentialist reply. 

Might lose out on content and thought development tho.


----------



## treevet

Corymbia said:


> I have offered to debate the topic of his choice on this forum and he has declined that offer and I think we all know why that is ...



That is somewhat in line with what I had in mind.

Your post again seems like an attempt at reconciliation but I wouldn't hold my breath were I you.


----------



## jefflovstrom

Likewise there are some areas where Eric is unquestionably better informed and or skilled than me. And no they are not in just the negative areas. The guy has more zeal that I have and has a hide 10 times thicker than mine and is heaps more safety conscious that I have ever been. He has heaps more computer smarts and he probably knows more about Brisbane trees.


 I think you two are different kinds of tree guys- those bidding and consulting and those who have actually climbed, (me 26 years climbing, now 9 years in management), Mark, you are in an office, Eric , you hate people in the office. I think I am gonna write a sitcom show called " The Office".
Jeff


----------



## treevet

Knowledge can so easily be feigned in this era with instantaneous downloads on any subject. That is why I thought it would be interesting and telling to hear what each of them "feels" about tree care in regards to what is important and what is in their gut.

I think the crux of the feud is just plain "I know more than you do". Very difficult to prove that regardless of credentials or time in. Instruction, comprehension, retention, content, currentness, etc. of information all play into this and there are so many variables that there may be no answer.

You, Jeff and others ask why Mark comes over here to confront Eric. The answer is this is neutral grounds. If people don't want to read it, just go to another thread. If Mark goes to that forum he is restricted, censored, intimidated and ultimately banned then his posts are removed. I have seen it happen.


----------



## mckeetree

treevet said:


> Knowledge can so easily be feigned in this era with instantaneous downloads on any subject.



Well, maybe to some extent. Usually the "dumbass" shows through pretty quick. I know a guy who they stuck in a "management" job who tries to BS his way through consultations from time to time. It's not a pretty thing to witness.


----------



## treevet

mckeetree said:


> Well, maybe to some extent. Usually the "dumbass" shows through pretty quick. I know a guy who they stuck in a "management" job who tries to BS his way through consultations from time to time. It's not a pretty thing to witness.



Back when I started I had a district manager with Bartlett who called every tree a "native tree". Even the beginners knew he was a dumbass.


----------



## mckeetree

treevet said:


> Back when I started I had a district manager with Bartlett who called every tree a "native tree". Even the beginners knew he was a dumbass.



Yep. I've known several who fit in that class. The other day one of my competitor's top consultants (actually his only consultant) was trying to tell the HO some old gaff marks were an insect infestation. This same guy failed his applicators license test about 43 times and finally gave up.


----------



## treevet

mckeetree said:


> Yep. I've known several who fit in that class. The other day one of my competitor's top consultants (actually his only consultant) was trying to tell the HO some old gaff marks were an insect infestation. This same guy failed his applicators license test about 43 times and finally gave up.



you'd have to be a pretty gullible ho to buy into that one too. Pretty distinct pattern there as a give away.

you were out for a while....you been real busy?


----------



## jefflovstrom

And the thread goes on!
Jeff


----------



## mckeetree

treevet said:


> you were out for a while....you been real busy?



No, it's really been kinda slow. I have sold a lot of trees this year and that has kept us going. We have four six inch container grown Shumard Red Oaks to put in tomorrow.


----------



## treevet

mckeetree said:


> No, it's really been kinda slow. I have sold a lot of trees this year and that has kept us going. We have four six inch container grown Shumard Red Oaks to put in tomorrow.



That has to be a big ass container. I have seen them on home shows on tv but none has shown up here.

We were dead as a door nail couple of weeks ago and now we're buried. Man if you can fill in the glitches in the season with alternatives you keep treading water and don't fall below the surface. We did a lot of firewood last winter and have been planting quite a few trees this spring. I literally have my own forest growing around my home town. Plenty of bucks to be made there and we obviously are going to be a lot more judicious when it comes to trees than a landscraper.


----------



## mckeetree

treevet said:


> That has to be a big ass container.



200 gallon. I've sold 200 gallon Shumards that were about 5 inch caliper (container trees are measured six inches above the soil line) but these will go six.


----------



## Ekka

mckeetree,

You got any pics of that .... sounds like a serious soil mass for tree size, just need to see a pic of it.


----------



## mckeetree

Ekka said:


> mckeetree,
> 
> You got any pics of that .... sounds like a serious soil mass for tree size, just need to see a pic of it.



Do you know anything about container grown trees? We are not talking B&B here now. That is not an unusual soil mass for a 6 inch container grown tree.


----------



## treevet

mckeetree said:


> Do you know anything about container grown trees? We are not talking B&B here now. That is not an unusual soil mass for a 6 inch container grown tree.



Are you setting that with a crane. I have planted some that big with my crane (balled) but some did not survive. Lot of work to come up a loser. I still got paid but replaced them with something smaller on the guarantee from nursery.


----------



## mckeetree

treevet said:


> Are you setting that with a crane. I have planted some that big with my crane (balled) but some did not survive. Lot of work to come up a loser. I still got paid but replaced them with something smaller on the guarantee from nursery.



I use a wheel loader to set them.


----------



## treevet

mckeetree said:


> I use a wheel loader to set them.



Love to see a pict too maybe with someone standing beside it for perspective.


----------



## Corymbia

*750 litre tree*

Eric, this roughly is what a 750 pot looks like. It is an appropriate sized pot for a 125mm tree. Hope that helps


----------



## Corymbia

*For the scale*



treevet said:


> Love to see a pict too maybe with someone standing beside it for perspective.



Sorry, to give a sense of scale this sized pot is typically about 36 - 42 inches across


----------



## Corymbia

*1,500 gallon boxed trees*

The car gives some perspective


----------



## Ekka

Corymbia said:


> Yes it is true that the referrals we get for consulting in Qld we refer it to guys like Sam Cowie, Peter Bishop, Shaun Freeman and Adam Tom



Good to see disclosure like this .... I'm sure I am not the only one who raises an eyebrow.  couldn't be some sort of boys club though, nah, to ethical for that to happen eh.


----------



## Ekka

Corymbia said:


> The constitution (Australian) gives local government no authority so it "does not have power" other than power that is delegated by the state. Council does not have any planning laws ... the state has them and management of them is delegated to the local authority.
> 
> As such the state has the statutory power so the only impact the council has over the state is in ensuring the state complies with its own legislation if and where compliance is required.



Source: http://www.baysidebulletin.com.au/n...cure-changes-to-plan/1761429.aspx?storypage=0



> They are calling for the State to adhere to Redland City Council's development codes for the area, which the State currently does not have to do.
> 
> "We have no problem with the social housing. Who of us knows when we might need it one day?" Mr Hickson said.
> 
> "But it needs to be done properly, with consideration for the traffic overcrowding we already see on this little road with a school and two childcare centres, and the environmental values all of the residents love about living here."
> 
> Plans for the community housing seen by the residents propose only 12 carparks for 20 units, with the development to extend right up to the boundary and clear all bushland.
> 
> If the plans complied with council regulations, car parks would need to be increased to 25 and the 'footprint' reduced to adhere to a 'habitat overlay' for the site.



Source: http://www.baysidebulletin.com.au/n...-reject-revised-mary-street-plan/1770360.aspx



> The plans seen by the community group originally proposed 20 units with 12 carparks, which was reduced to 16 units and 16 carparks at a meeting with government staff last week. It was submitted to Redland City Council planning staff for feedback last week, although the State does not have to comply with any council regulations.


----------



## mckeetree

Corymbia said:


> Eric, this roughly is what a 750 pot looks like. It is an appropriate sized pot for a 125mm tree. Hope that helps



I don't have any pics but that is exactly the size. I don't know the weight but a case 480LL picks one up no problem.


----------



## Corymbia

*How else should it be done*



Ekka said:


> Good to see disclosure like this .... I'm sure I am not the only one who raises an eyebrow.  couldn't be some sort of boys club though, nah, to ethical for that to happen eh.



Why shouldn't we decide to whom we sends referrals, particularly given that we pay to generate the enquiries? We pick people that we know are competent and ethical and who we know will care for the client. 

How do you suggest that we should make the selection ... ???


----------



## treevet

Remember when you booted Reg Coates outta the Moderator group because he was a friend/acquaintance of Mark's? He left the forum and that was a huge loss to what was a very impressive group with Treeseer (undemocratically booted) and many others gone bye bye (booted or voluntarily). Sad....very sad.

No big surprise Sean Freeman finally left. I remember years of you attempting to condescend to Sean in a battle for superiority of knowledge (read downloads in your case for the most part). Sean has way too much class to lower his self to the levels you are willing to go to.

Remember when I started a thread on Safari and the surfactant Pentrabark and with my inside information from University contacts and their research I denounced the product.

You posted some results you had done on your own in your backyard, I think, that (un) scientifically proved you correct as usual?

A female poster named Lenore (not remembering her screen name) who had credentials came on and said you were in violation of using these products under law.

Well you went ballistic and banned her and whitewashed all her posts so she never even existed after years of posting and thousands of posts. And you have the stones to characterize the ISA with a Hitler caricature? What a belly laugher.

You have no idea Corymbia, but many many many have been down your road before. You may not be without blame but you are going through a predictable process. Right now you are in the stage where he buries you with rhetoric and contorts the truth and it becomes a war of attrition. Get ready to hunker down. Reconciliation is just a sign of weakness and ammunition for his assault at this time and place.


----------



## Ekka

My comments in red.



treevet said:


> Remember when you booted Reg Coates outta the Moderator group because he was a friend/acquaintance of Mark's? He left the forum and that was a huge loss to what was a very impressive group with Treeseer (undemocratically booted) and many others gone bye bye (booted or voluntarily). Sad....very sad.
> 
> Not true, but it suits your agenda. Reg simply did not believe or entertain Marks angle of attack. In doing so Reg aligned himself without observing the facts as discussed at TW, he was relating to his memories of over 10 years ago rather than what was happening now. Nothing sad about that, just the way it is. Democracy is a strange thing, taking a vote at a KKK meeting for black peoples rights is democratic eh? TW is my site, just like this is Darin's, difference is I am a tree man.
> 
> No big surprise Sean Freeman finally left. I remember years of you attempting to condescend to Sean in a battle for superiority of knowledge (read downloads in your case for the most part). Sean has way too much class to lower his self to the levels you are willing to go to.
> 
> Yeah right, Sean can do as he pleases, just like you have done. I challenged Sean as seen fit on certain opinions, like say subsidence, that is all. You perceive whatever you like, I care not, but the coincidence of his non posting and that of Adam's news is worth noting. People can come and go as these please, up to them, just like you have chosen not to come (thank goodness)
> 
> Remember when I started a thread on Safari and the surfactant Pentrabark and with my inside information from University contacts and their research I denounced the product.
> 
> You posted some results you had done on your own in your backyard, I think, that (un) scientifically proved you correct as usual?
> 
> Again just your opinion. I posted that I had good results in comparison to previous methods of spraying/collar drench .... how you interpret that is up to you.
> 
> A female poster named Lenore (not remembering her screen name) who had credentials came on and said you were in violation of using these products under law.
> 
> Well you went ballistic and banned her and whitewashed all her posts so she never even existed after years of posting and thousands of posts. And you have the stones to characterize the ISA with a Hitler caricature? What a belly laugher.
> 
> Lol, just love the theatrics eh. Some-one dobbed that's for sure but no-one asked the facts and to this day no-one knows what happened except me. I kept that 100% to myself knowing trusting people, especially the likes of you is highly risky. You know, to this day there is people out there reading who know I still hold their years old secrets and through any adversity they are kept, there are some people like that, but definately not you.
> 
> You have no idea Corymbia, but many many many have been down your road before. You may not be without blame but you are going through a predictable process. Right now you are in the stage where he buries you with rhetoric and contorts the truth and it becomes a war of attrition. Get ready to hunker down. Reconciliation is just a sign of weakness and ammunition for his assault at this time and place.
> 
> Anyway huff n' puff, your motive is fighting, all you do and know, run in, throw a few punches and run away, then cry like a baby. The thing that is clear is that the so called "guru's" spit the dummy if they do not get their own way, they result, like you and corymbia to name calling venom.... the facts, well, I have asked if Corymbia has the balls to post the lot up rather than threaten to sue all the time. Hardly the Nazi regime that you purport. More Nazi to fight a man with his hands tied behind his back eh.
> 
> You are just offering your typical undesirable venom, which frankly has nothing to do with this specific case. Like it or not, TW is here to stay, and it's growing solid. The philosophy of TW is about finding new untainted blood and self promotion for posters. For front line people to feel OK regardless of their spelling or grammar.
> 
> Hartley has demonstrated how NAAA is a business acquiring leads and passing them out to mates, well TW is a little more democratic and transparent than that, and is not an organisation. Posters get links and exposure in return for their contribution, readers can contact them if they want, simple, no-one getting in the way.


----------



## Ekka

Here's what you really thought at the time. It's sad I have to do this to remind you what you really are, trust is something that should never be bestowed upon you by anyone.


----------



## JayD

*Your either a man of your word or your not*



Ekka said:


> Here's what you really thought at the time. It's sad I have to do this to remind you what you really are, trust is something that should never be bestowed upon you by anyone.



Oh my Treevet did you really say this??


----------



## treevet

Quite the coup you fellas have scored here. 

You 2 lame brains musta worked all day on this one. And this says what....?


----------



## JayD

*So typical of you*



> Corymbia posted #353 *Oh and of course wear responsibility for any harm that may arise from taking that action.*



Once more you try and fool the good people out there, look what he is saying people.


----------



## Corymbia

*This will teach you to be cheeky*



treevet said:


> Quite the coup you fellas have scored here.
> 
> You 2 lame brains musta worked all day on this one. And this says what....?



Now that was silly because I have to mess with your head. Fancy calling me after something so useful. Every time you go to use your pr&^ck from now on I want you to see a miniature me ... now that has sure killed your sex life now hasn't it? :hmm3grin2orange::biggrinbounce2:


----------



## treeclimber101

treevet said:


> WRONG mustache breath....
> 
> He actually THINKS he knows more than DR. Shigo, Chief Scientist for the United States Forestry Service and Scientist for more than 60 years when it comes to Wall 4 of compartmentalization. He, a scientist of 00 years even has his own designation of Wall4 instead of Wall 4 likely to show he discovered something that Shigo discovered through years of scientific experiments.
> 
> "Wounding experiments have shown that the symplast regulates the activities of the vascular cambium by sending it messages. When trees were wounded with drill bits AND LATER DISSECTED, it was observed that the cambium need not be touched to respond. A barrier zone of specialized cells was formed by the cambium in response to injured cells elsewhere in the symplast.
> 
> These results are significant because they show that the cambium can receive messages from the symplast......The cambium responds even if the problem has occurred elsewhere in the tree. This explains how barrier zones can form far in advance of injured tissue and demonstrates that survival in trees depends on the communication of new information."



I was trimming a tree the other day and it said ouch ,is this common for maples to speak before 10am


----------



## treemandan

If door knocking is so wrong why is it Ok for a guy to walk up to the job while we are working and ask to have atree cut down down for 50 bucks right then and there?
AHHH! watch that sword, its sharp on all sides. 
I agree its not cool to bang on someone's door and throw some kind od ultimatum at them " We are here now so it 200 but if we come back its more" That crap is crap. Some sort of fearmongering I would say.


----------



## treevet

Let's look at an exaggerated example.....

Whaaatttt iiiiifffff.....

Say they took away the soliciting laws in Beverly Hills. Just imagine how many tree guys would be lined up the driveway and down the sidewalk to trim Pamela Anderson's bush?


----------



## Corymbia

jefflovstrom said:


> when Eric said he knew more than Shigo, I just got the feeling he was saying he read alot, I think like he meant it to emphasis as to him reading and going over it so much, he made a joke- so to speak, not a deliberate statement that he knew more. You do seem to be pushing this a little hard and not sure what your motive is.
> Jeff Lovstrom



Jeff, you may be right but I have my doubts. Eric has been free to clarify that comment but again he has failed to take that opportunity instead choosing to sling mud. On the other hand I have taken considerable effort to answer questions and state things a clearly as I can.

As far as clarifying the alleged death threats, Eric has actually now taken the time (on the 27th of April 4 months after the phone messages were left) to make proper enquiries to finally establish that no death threats were made. It will be interesting to see what he now says about the smears. I guess a very humble apology is unlikely because after all according to John Rambo Frei ... after all I "drew the first blood"


----------



## HTST

*Hello*

High all.

First post on this site and I got to say what a interesting time people are having on this site. I personally don't give one rats arse for personal sledging. I would love to know the amount of time two people have spent on posting insults to each other. If you multiplied this by my Aust. hourly rate for consulting ($220.00 per hour) the mind boggles. 

Cheers

Love and kisses xxoo


----------



## treevet

welcome to AS HTST


----------



## af7850

HTST said:


> High all.
> 
> First post on this site and I got to say what a interesting time people are having on this site. I personally don't give one rats arse for personal sledging. I would love to know the amount of time two people have spent on posting insults to each other. If you multiplied this by my Aust. hourly rate for consulting ($220.00 per hour) the mind boggles.
> 
> Cheers
> 
> Love and kisses xxoo



Spot on.


----------



## tree md

I knocked on a door today for the first time in I can't remember when. Two doors down from the house I was working at. The idiots had poured a huge concrete slab over two Oaks when they extended their driveway. New concrete with two freshly killed Oaks. I offered to take them out while I was there. No go. Total waste of time.


----------



## jefflovstrom

I was leaving fo work when I realized that I had to pee! Had to wake wifey to let me in.
Jeff 

I locked myself out-ha!


----------



## Corymbia

*Coming out*



jefflovstrom said:


> I was leaving fo work when I realized that I had to pee! Had to wake wifey to let me in.
> Jeff
> 
> I locked myself out-ha!



Jeff, I knew you were a closeted door knocker. I still have a house full of kids so I still knock before I go to the bathroom ... there now I'm out of the closet as well


----------



## ttimpain

*Door knocking -Soliciting Reload this Page*

Door Knocking is Nothing but a One Type Of Marketing.It is One Of-the Best Way To sale a particular Product.By Doing This,People Come To Know About Your Product and Quality Of A Product.If Your Product is Extra Ordinary Then The Other.


----------



## jacobstreeworx

To the guy who says he's been in business for 20 years and ain't never had to go knockin' on doors......B.S.!!! Unless you had your business handed down from Daddy, or bought it from someone else who put in their blood, sweat & tears, Everyone has had to knock at one time or another. No business just starts up with customers lined up at the door. It might just be that those guys out their knockin' on doors Are getting customers, and it's eating into your bottom line, and that's why you are so quick to criticize and insult. Everyone has gotta start somewhere, this IS still AMERICA!!!


----------



## jefflovstrom

jacobstreeworx said:


> To the guy who says he's been in business for 20 years and ain't never had to go knockin' on doors......B.S.!!! Unless you had your business handed down from Daddy, or bought it from someone else who put in their blood, sweat & tears, Everyone has had to knock at one time or another. No business just starts up with customers lined up at the door. It might just be that those guys out their knockin' on doors Are getting customers, and it's eating into your bottom line, and that's why you are so quick to criticize and insult. Everyone has gotta start somewhere, this IS still AMERICA!!!



Ha! You may be a little ignorant or something else. You don't knock on doors when you participate on a bid invite. Big difference between marketing and begging for work. Got your sign ready?
Jeff


----------



## Nick359

I grew up in the country no door knockers. My job sent me to the city. I was bothered almost everyday with services I didn't want.

I moved back to an area where everyone owns 2 to 10 acres. I have been bothered by several knockers selling meat to grinding stumps. 

I was home when one guy said he would grind every stump in my front yard for $330, he counted 10 stumps. I told him get the grinder and make it happen. He didn't have the grinder with him at the time. After a quick walk thu with me counting yielded over 30 stumps, he quickly changed his price. 

If you are going door to door with a I'm hungry price, don't try to scam people thinking they don't know what they have and then charging them more.


----------



## jacobstreeworx

jefflovstrom said:


> Ha! You may be a little ignorant or something else. You don't knock on doors when you participate on a bid invite. Big difference between marketing and begging for work. Got your sign ready?
> Jeff [/QUOTE
> 
> Maybe I jumped the gun a little bit. I saw nothing about a bid invite,so in that case, I agree no knockers. But to assume that door knockers in general do not provide quality services or that they are not a "good reputable tree company" is not always the case. Sometimes business slows to the point where you either do all you can to keep your crew working or they go hungry. My guys work to hard for me to let them down without trying all options. So, when all else fails.........Knock Knock!


----------



## treevet

jacobstreeworx said:


> [
> 
> . So, when all else fails.........Knock Knock!



You will be subject to arrest from breaking town ordinance in my town. 

Research has proven that break ins reduced significantly when they enacted this ordinance here.


----------



## search24sc

*Re*

I would also like some more information regarding this.


----------



## boo

boo said:


> Hoefully they know what league they're in when attempting the ass kicking.
> 
> Sad...
> If a person can't speak clearly, and confident, with education...
> if they look like a bum or a dopehead, carry themselves like a crook or hack, then maybe they should not sell door to door.
> (Hide behind a sign or phone call)
> I have had 5 different yellow page ads some years ago....I only got 2 calls which only 1 job I got for the whole year from posting in 5 books. It would be dumb to try to advertise that way again in the same areas.
> I have not used signs for well over a year.
> I have done door to door 3 different days, over a 16 month period.
> Turn out> we get 4 out of 5 jobs solicited....
> we don't work for beer, (we don't drink) then one job leads to another.(word of mouth)
> The ones that cry that it's shamefull to door knock, I could probably buy and sell them and their equipment many times over.
> I am a certified arborist, insured, experienced, equipped.
> 
> They meet me, they like me, they trust me, they hire me.
> We are good at what we do, the hacks can't compete.







boo said:


> Glad I don't live in your neighborhoods.. HAHAHA!! upperclass?!?!?
> Sounds like a joke... maybe the ghetto would give results as described, not upperclass.
> I have never been thrown out or disrespected by a homeowner... ever!
> over 250k for the tree service alone so far this year.... go figure.
> Maybe the guys that get these results look and sound like common uneducated, dopehead, maggots.
> there are several celebs that I do tree work for regularly, they're always happy to see me
> 
> Door to Door also works well for my roofing company...
> yes mckee I also own a construction company and a roofing company.
> including several homes built for a few nascar drivers.... fairly high profile jobs, multi million dollar homes.
> 
> ArborSmith I hear you Sir. I understand and appreciate your perspective Sir. This could be like a debate with a rock, then again maybe there are certain areas that really treat people like crooks.... we all are a product of our environment.
> We only know what we have been exposed to.
> It is a cruel world no doubt.
> I hope those nay sayers are just feeding their egos rather than having people treat them like criminals.


 



boo said:


> treevet... you've added words to my post?
> "all the time"? or "3 days over a 16 month period"?
> none the less, it is what it is.
> As I posted earlier, some are better off hiding behind a sign or phone... similar to the internet tough guy.
> mckeetree... I don't blame you for not doing door to door sales. Maybe you are one of those guys that would get a beatdown on someones front step. :O
> I know it could be bad for you to come to my house and speak.
> -OR-
> 
> From what I gather(?), it would be smart for anyone as friendly as you, and talks as well as you do, to retire from doing sales and teach others how to make a wonderful living from paid printing or magic markers?
> 
> Although I'm not a crackhead, I do know that they have big problems with being paranoid, and facing the public.
> ARE YOU GUYS SMOKING CRACK?!?
> 
> chipperscompany I'm sure you can see the brilliant posts by dumba$$e$.
> hopefully these posts will help answer your question in an indirect, stupid kind of way atleast.
> Only as a basic guide, I see newer members with lots of posts as bigmouth, ego, fools.
> I don't care for the drama and haters. Hopefully more people will chime in with "real" answers for you.


  

I meant every word of it.... it is what it is


----------



## jefflovstrom

Feel better, boo?
Jeff


----------



## boo

yeah, a little.. thanks for asking.
almost bothers me to know that people get bashed for trying, and even called hacks or low lifes.
Most of the bashers probably don't know what it's like to have to work to survive, and take care of their family.
Some of us had to start wiping our own butts at some point.


----------



## jefflovstrom

It is a regional thing, boo. We all come from all over and it is different depending where you live. Personally, I don't believe in door knocking, but that's me. I also don't live in your market. 
Hey, start posting more!
Jeff


----------



## tree md

jefflovstrom said:


> It is a regional thing, boo. We all come from all over and it is different depending where you live. Personally, I don't believe in door knocking, but that's me. I also don't live in your market.
> Hey, start posting more!
> Jeff



Hey, if you think I would ever go door knocking in Southern California you are off your rocker!!!


----------



## jefflovstrom

tree md said:


> Hey, if you think I would ever go door knocking in Southern California you are off your rocker!!!



OK, you are joking right? The door knocker's in Cali are hacks. You are not a hack. Did you read me wrong? 
Jeff


----------



## tree md

jefflovstrom said:


> OK, you are joking right? The door knocker's in Cali are hacks. You are not a hack. Did you read me wrong?
> Jeff



No, I just know what the streets look like in socal... I've lived in some pretty tough towns but Calli is just a crazy place... Door knock there if you want to... You might end up with your head in a freezer...


----------



## jefflovstrom

tree md said:


> No, I just know what the streets look like in socal... I've lived in some pretty tough towns but Calli is just a crazy place... Door knock there if you want to... You might end up with your head in a freezer...



Duh!, I agree, did you bump your head?
Jeff


----------



## FanOFatherNash

*Door Hangers*

Door Hangers?


----------



## jefflovstrom

FanOFatherNash said:


> Door Hangers?


 
Go ahead and touch a strangers door knob! Don't be a fool!
Jeffeace:


----------



## treevet

Boo is an advertisement for legislation against inbreeding. Gets cold up thar in them ther hills don't it?


----------



## ducaticorse

treevet said:


> Boo is an advertisement for legislation against inbreeding. Gets cold up thar in them ther hills don't it?


 
One of our outspoken members here is employed by a mid sized tree service here in MA that has a warning on their website on "door knocker con artists". I also use to employ a guy who started door knocking on his own, and got enough jobs that he thought he could start his own "tree company". Didn't work out to well for him.


----------



## boo

I understand that some areas look at soliciting differently, I've worked all over the country. (treepet stay in ohio and stop posting in public) sorry for your bad personalities, appearance, social skills, and lack of knowledge, otherwise... 
Hide behind the print as you will


----------



## treevet

boo said:


> I understand that some areas look at soliciting differently, I've worked all over the country. (treepet stay in ohio and stop posting in public) sorry for your bad personalities, appearance, social skills, and lack of knowledge, otherwise...
> Hide behind the print as you will


 
good come back boo boo

I suppose if you wanna go cross the pasture thru the cow pies and tell Jed he has a dead tree and you and Zeke will cut it down tomorrow for a couple of corn pipes and a bottle of hootch.,,, it is ok to knock on his door under these circumstances. You do it in my town and you find yourself in the pokey son.


----------



## boo

Like I said... stay in your town and hide behind your sign  
and... I'm in Baton Rouge lately, (they love me) and yes I still have a home in NC.
You are an obvious fool, considering you have no clue as to who I am, where I am, or where I have been.


----------



## treevet

boo said:


> Like I said... stay in your town and hide behind your sign
> and... I'm in Baton Rouge lately, (they love me) and yes I still have a home in NC.
> You are an obvious fool, considering you have no clue as to who I am, where I am, or where I have been.


 
Dumass like you would have to be light on his feet and move around a lot. 

Just what is it you think that you know that a smart, educated, upper middle class home owner would not already know about their trees? What is it you know you gotta tell em and make them get up from the dinner table, taking a hard earned nap, or playing with the kids or putting the baby to sleep? 

Ring ring ring ring knock knock knock....Booboo is here

Hey....duh....you gotta a dead tree thar. I'll cut it down cheaper than those guys hiding behind their yellow page ads and Certi ma cashuns....duhhhh.


----------



## boo

gotta love the mentality... and it's "Dumbass", dumbass. 
I had 5 yellow page books covered.. generated 2 calls, got me 1 job.
Now that's efficient!.. oh, but in OHIO things are obviously different.
I bet even here in Baton Rouge, NC., or anywhere else, you would get a beat down by trying to talk to people.


----------



## treevet

boo said:


> gotta love the mentality... and it's "Dumbass", dumbass.
> I had 5 yellow page books covered.. generated 2 calls, got me 1 job.
> Now that's efficient!.. oh, but in OHIO things are obviously different.
> I bet even here in Baton Rouge, NC., or anywhere else, you would get a beat down by trying to talk to people.


 
5 yellow pages ads? You ARE a pathetic creature. Please hire me, please, please. 

Haven't had many "beat downs" in my day. Pretty good at taking care of myself...both financially and physically. 

You....on the other hand, dumass....now that's another story I'm sure lol.


----------



## treevet

While you in deep thought on your next response....

Tell me, what's the story on a Boo, anyhoo?

I got a website up there says a little bout me. What's your site? What you do? Whatcha ya got?


----------



## boo

Brilliant!!... treepet, you are obviously a "boy" ...feed your ego.
Back to topic >> don't solicit in treepet's town >
otherwise check the laws, and know your trade. 
If you look and/or sound like a dope head, drunkard, ego-minded, dumbass, with no more education than your local homeowner in the tree care industry, hide behind a sign, or phone call.
Simple.


----------



## treevet

boo said:


> Brilliant!!... treepet, you are obviously a "boy" ...feed your ego.
> Back to topic >> don't solicit in treepet's town >
> otherwise check the laws, and know your trade.
> If you look and/or sound like a dope head, drunkard, ego-minded, dumbass, with no more education than your local homeowner in the tree care industry, hide behind a sign, or phone call.
> Simple.


 
What kinda education in the tree care industry you got booby? You must be a Certified Arborist to know all that stuff to tell the ho? Say somethin smart.

What kinda equipment you got? (you really big into this "hidin" stuff???)


----------



## boo

Read my other posts "dumbass". Quit turning this good thread into something personal, and pathetic again... it don't always have to be about YOU.


----------



## treevet

boo said:


> Read my other posts "dumbass". Quit turning this good thread into something personal, and pathetic again... it don't always have to be about YOU.


 
ouchy....

think I'll pass on yer other posts


----------



## BlackOakTreeServ

opcorn: opcorn: opcorn:


----------



## Labman

As a home owner, I dislike all direct marketing. Cough up for some advertising, subsudise my news and enertainment. Maybe I will call you.


----------



## Toddppm

Have had several people mention they hired some door knockers "because they needed some work" 

Wanted to tell them Yeah, so do all of the legit businesses around that didn't come begging at your door.


----------



## boo

Labman said:


> As a home owner, I dislike all direct marketing. Cough up for some advertising, subsudise my news and enertainment. Maybe I will call you.


 
you mean throw money away on advertising, and wait for a caller to have me bid against 20 other tree services... no thanks.
a couple days of door to door sales with flyers and education in almost 3 years, has generated lots of work, not to mention the referrals that came, and are still coming.


----------



## meatwagon45

In my community, you need a permit issued by the police to knock on someones door. $100 per person for a 30 day permit. $1000 fine if you dont have the permit. Hours are restricted too. With a permit, you can knock on all the doors you want between the hours of 9am and 5pm. All solicitors need an ID badge attached on their shirt and clearly visable. The only way around getting the permit and getting the fine is if you approach someone that is already outside without going on their property. Every spring you can see the lawn fertilizer trucks and the tree guys waiting on the side of the road watching for people to come home at night. Most of these guys get reported to the police who tell them to move on. 

The service providers in this area do not need to go door to door. They get alot of business from word of mouth and the real good ones get referals from the chamber of commerce. The door to door guys tend to avoid our town because they know the police are watching.


----------



## jefflovstrom

*Bottom Line
Door knocking is a regional thing and mostly frowned upon!!
Jeff *


----------



## treemandan

I keep road cones at the bottom of the walkway and a door mat that says" go away" at my front door so if you knock ( and you could be GOD, it don't matter) you will get escorted out by the police. Walk arcoss the lawn and that is serious tresspassing and also making me liable if you get hurt so don't try that either, you'll be put down hard. Even the UPS guy knows that.
All that even solved the problem of me having to shovel the front walkway... its permantly out of order. And you will need God to help you if you park on my lot, I'll call the wrecker and it will cost ya.
The last schmuck that came around knocking on doors was swarmed by the police and it wasn't even me who called them that time. Turns out the guy was sent by a power washing company ( that's another name for useless ####), the company itself had a very bad rep and the guy had a rap sheet. The police around here love to do their job... sometimes.
Go ahead, knock, I dare ya. In fact, I'm bored, drunk and pissed off, so please, please, please, knock on my door.


----------



## jefflovstrom

treemandan said:


> Go ahead, knock, I dare ya. In fact, I'm bored, drunk and pissed off, so please, please, please, knock on my door.



Dude! You should of took a nap instead of looking dumb with that post!
Jeff :hmm3grin2orange:


----------



## treemandan

jefflovstrom said:


> Dude! You should of took a nap instead of looking dumb with that post!
> Jeff :hmm3grin2orange:


 
Yeah but how mad do you think I would be if someone woke me up knocking on my door?


----------



## Rickytree

treemandan said:


> Yeah but how mad do you think I would be if someone woke me up knocking on my door?


 
I'm guessing alittle pissed off. Just a guess though.


----------



## treemandan

door to door salesman great pay*** (surrounding phila area)

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: 2011-03-03, 11:40AM EST
Reply to: [email protected] [Errors when replying to ads?]

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


We are a local Reliable Tree service and need a reliable salesman to get some more work in the areas we are working in. Willing to train . All Materials needed will be provided. You will earn 10% of each job you bring in please email me and I will set up a phone interview. You must have own transportation.This is a great position for a person who is outgoing and honest. you have the potential to make as much or a little as you need. The more you knock on doors the more people you meet and the more money you make. We Pride ourselves on Great Customer Service , Excellent Workmanship and Always leave the client and Neighbors Happy to have us in there area. We have a large base of Repeat clients. Please only Serious Inquires 


•Location: surrounding phila area 
•it's NOT ok to contact this poster with services or other commercial interests 
•Compensation: 10% of each job you bring in 


PostingID: 2244780964


They say they provide training. I guess that means they teach you how to run away , dodge bullets and be able to talk yerself out of whatever the cops are going to do to you. Oh and the name of the company is obviously Reliable Tree, they let that slip out by accident.


----------



## treevet

haha go try cold calls knocking doors with no appointment at the mansions on the estates in the Main Line in Philly.

One word comes to mind....Doberman


----------



## boo

treevet said:


> haha go try cold calls knocking doors with no appointment at the mansions on the estates in the Main Line in Philly.
> 
> One word comes to mind....Doberman


 
Sounds like experience.
Remember, if you look like a drunk or junkie, or if you have no more education in the trade than your local homeowner, do not solicit door to door.
If you live in an area where the crime is so high that laws have been passed to keep you away from people's property, it's probably not worth soliciting in the first place. 
Hide behind a sign, or paid advertising... this way potential clients don't have to see who you really are.


----------



## treevet

Also if you are a moron and cannot get any work because you just plain aren't that smart, are incompetent at this profession or have an offensive personality, appearance, or body odor etc..... and you don't get recommended by ANYONE.....


perhaps your best option is to interrupt people's lives without an appointment and annoy them into answering a door and trick a senior citizen into thinking you know what you are doing. Then you can do part of the job half ascs, tell the old lady you need money for baby's milk and if she pays you in full, you will promise to be back early tomorrow.

Then when tomorrow am (likely mid day after a hangover causes a sleep- in from hating yourself) comes....you forget about the rest of the job and go to another town while the old bag and the cops try to locate your gypsy ascs.

oop: this is the only evidence they find to go on as you are not insured, certified, licensed and she, being old, could not remember what kinda 70's rust bucket you squeeled out with after getting the $.


----------



## prentice110

Jeff's right, its regional. Talked to more than a few co's from Minisoda that all said if you dont door knock up there, you dont work. Gave one of em' a week of climbing last summer while there guy was on vacation, one of the only co's around that actullaly worked everyday. It works, just depends on how you feel about it I guess. I personally havent done it since high school. Makes me feel like a scum bum.


----------



## jefflovstrom

It is not just regional, it is how you market. I am bias'ed because we don't do residential work. Most of our job's require a cert. CA, and more recently a TCIA Accredited only get to bid. So, yeah, regional is a good way of saying it, I guess.
Jeff :msp_smile:


----------



## tree md

treevet said:


> Also if you are a moron and cannot get any work because you just plain aren't that smart, are incompetent at this profession or have an offensive personality, appearance, or body odor etc..... and you don't get recommended by ANYONE.....
> 
> 
> perhaps your best option is to interrupt people's lives without an appointment and annoy them into answering a door and trick a senior citizen into thinking you know what you are doing. Then you can do part of the job half ascs, tell the old lady you need money for baby's milk and if she pays you in full, you will promise to be back early tomorrow.
> 
> Then when tomorrow am (likely mid day after a hangover causes a sleep- in from hating yourself) comes....you forget about the rest of the job and go to another town while the old bag and the cops try to locate your gypsy ascs.
> 
> oop: this is the only evidence they find to go on as you are not insured, certified, licensed and she, being old, could not remember what kinda 70's rust bucket you squeeled out with after getting the $.


 
Easy TV... You have already admitted to door knocking once upon a time yourself...

Regional is a good answer... You're not likely to get a job In Jeffy's Beverly Hills but then again they are not going to get the same price... We have large companies from out of state hiring people to canvas neighborhoods and put out door hangers here... They wouldn't be doing it if it didn't work...

YouTube - ‪Can't you hear me knocking- rolling stones‬&rlm;


----------



## treevet

door knocking and door hangers....different things son


----------



## tree md

LOL, I would usually bristle at someone calling me son... But I have no problem with it coming from you.


----------



## boo

Quote Originally Posted by boo View Post
Hoefully they know what league they're in when attempting the ass kicking.

Sad...
If a person can't speak clearly, and confident, with education...
if they look like a bum or a dopehead, carry themselves like a crook or hack, then maybe they should not sell door to door.
(Hide behind a sign or phone call)
I have had 5 different yellow page ads some years ago....I only got 2 calls which only 1 job I got for the whole year from posting in 5 books. It would be dumb to try to advertise that way again in the same areas.
I have not used signs for well over a year.
I have done door to door 3 different days, over a 16 month period.
Turn out> we get 4 out of 5 jobs solicited....
we don't work for beer, (we don't drink) then one job leads to another.(word of mouth)
The ones that cry that it's shamefull to door knock, I could probably buy and sell them and their equipment many times over.
I am a certified arborist, insured, experienced, equipped.

They meet me, they like me, they trust me, they hire me.
We are good at what we do, the hacks can't compete.


Quote Originally Posted by boo View Post
Glad I don't live in your neighborhoods.. HAHAHA!! upperclass?!?!?
Sounds like a joke... maybe the ghetto would give results as described, not upperclass.
I have never been thrown out or disrespected by a homeowner... ever!
over 250k for the tree service alone so far this year.... go figure.
Maybe the guys that get these results look and sound like common uneducated, dopehead, maggots.
there are several celebs that I do tree work for regularly, they're always happy to see me

Door to Door also works well for my roofing company...
yes mckee I also own a construction company and a roofing company.
including several homes built for a few nascar drivers.... fairly high profile jobs, multi million dollar homes.

ArborSmith I hear you Sir. I understand and appreciate your perspective Sir. This could be like a debate with a rock, then again maybe there are certain areas that really treat people like crooks.... we all are a product of our environment.
We only know what we have been exposed to.
It is a cruel world no doubt.
I hope those nay sayers are just feeding their egos rather than having people treat them like criminals.


Quote Originally Posted by boo View Post
treevet... you've added words to my post?
"all the time"? or "3 days over a 16 month period"?
none the less, it is what it is.
As I posted earlier, some are better off hiding behind a sign or phone... similar to the internet tough guy.
mckeetree... I don't blame you for not doing door to door sales. Maybe you are one of those guys that would get a beatdown on someones front step. :O
I know it could be bad for you to come to my house and speak.
-OR-

From what I gather(?), it would be smart for anyone as friendly as you, and talks as well as you do, to retire from doing sales and teach others how to make a wonderful living from paid printing or magic markers?

Although I'm not a crackhead, I do know that they have big problems with being paranoid, and facing the public.
ARE YOU GUYS SMOKING CRACK?!?

chipperscompany I'm sure you can see the brilliant posts by dumba$$e$.
hopefully these posts will help answer your question in an indirect, stupid kind of way atleast.
Only as a basic guide, I see newer members with lots of posts as bigmouth, ego, fools.
I don't care for the drama and haters. Hopefully more people will chime in with "real" answers for you.


I understand that some areas look at soliciting differently, I've worked all over the country. (treepet stay in ohio and stop posting in public) sorry for your bad personalities, appearance, social skills, and lack of knowledge, otherwise...
Hide behind the print as you will 

you mean throw money away on advertising, and wait for a caller to have me bid against 20 other tree services... no thanks.
a couple days of door to door sales with flyers and education in almost 3 years, has generated lots of work, not to mention the referrals that came, and are still coming. 

Glad I don't live in your neighborhoods.. HAHAHA!! upperclass?!?!?
Sounds like a joke... maybe the ghetto would give results as described, not upperclass.
I have never been thrown out or disrespected by a homeowner... ever!
over 250k for the tree service alone so far this year.... go figure.
Maybe the guys that get these results look and sound like common uneducated, dopehead, maggots.
there are several celebs that I do tree work for regularly, they're always happy to see me

Door to Door also works well for my roofing company...
yes mckee I also own a construction company and a roofing company.
including several homes built for a few nascar drivers.... fairly high profile jobs, multi million dollar homes.

ArborSmith I hear you Sir. I understand and appreciate your perspective Sir. This could be like a debate with a rock, then again maybe there are certain areas that really treat people like crooks.... we all are a product of our environment.
We only know what we have been exposed to.
It is a cruel world no doubt.
I hope those nay sayers are just feeding their egos rather than having people treat them like criminals. 


Quote Originally Posted by treevet View Post
haha go try cold calls knocking doors with no appointment at the mansions on the estates in the Main Line in Philly.

One word comes to mind....Doberman

Sounds like experience.
Remember, if you look like a drunk or junkie, or if you have no more education in the trade than your local homeowner, do not solicit door to door.
If you live in an area where the crime is so high that laws have been passed to keep you away from people's property, it's probably not worth soliciting in the first place.
Hide behind a sign, or paid advertising... this way potential clients don't have to see who you really are. 

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

treepet... I've seen your kind many times.. loudmouth, arrogant, over bearing, know it all, dumbasses... 
I've noticed your join date and posting total, point and case.
Your comment about inbreeding... WOW! although I'm not the product of such, and was born and raised in the big city until the age of 20yrs., I doubt you even know the reason those folks decided to inbreed.
For the record, I AM a CA, which means nothing other than I passed a test, as my marriage certificate is not the reason I am married. 

as far as comparing any part of Ohio or Pa. to Beverly Hills... we ALL laugh at that!


----------



## jefflovstrom

Hey Boo! , 
You have Way too much time on your hand's!!!
Jeff 
<iframe title="YouTube video player" width="480" height="390" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/5XcKBmdfpWs" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>


----------



## jefflovstrom

[video]<iframe title="YouTube video player" width="480" height="390" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/5XcKBmdfpWs" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>[/video]Try again!
<iframe title="YouTube video player" width="480" height="390" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/5XcKBmdfpWs" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>


----------



## jefflovstrom

boo said:


> Quote Originally Posted by boo View Post
> Hoefully they know what league they're in when attempting the ass kicking.
> 
> Sad...
> If a person can't speak clearly, and confident, with education...
> if they look like a bum or a dopehead, carry themselves like a crook or hack, then maybe they should not sell door to door.
> (Hide behind a sign or phone call)
> I have had 5 different yellow page ads some years ago....I only got 2 calls which only 1 job I got for the whole year from posting in 5 books. It would be dumb to try to advertise that way again in the same areas.
> I have not used signs for well over a year.
> I have done door to door 3 different days, over a 16 month period.
> Turn out> we get 4 out of 5 jobs solicited....
> we don't work for beer, (we don't drink) then one job leads to another.(word of mouth)
> The ones that cry that it's shamefull to door knock, I could probably buy and sell them and their equipment many times over.
> I am a certified arborist, insured, experienced, equipped.
> 
> They meet me, they like me, they trust me, they hire me.
> We are good at what we do, the hacks can't compete.
> 
> 
> Quote Originally Posted by boo View Post
> Glad I don't live in your neighborhoods.. HAHAHA!! upperclass?!?!?
> Sounds like a joke... maybe the ghetto would give results as described, not upperclass.
> I have never been thrown out or disrespected by a homeowner... ever!
> over 250k for the tree service alone so far this year.... go figure.
> Maybe the guys that get these results look and sound like common uneducated, dopehead, maggots.
> there are several celebs that I do tree work for regularly, they're always happy to see me
> 
> Door to Door also works well for my roofing company...
> yes mckee I also own a construction company and a roofing company.
> including several homes built for a few nascar drivers.... fairly high profile jobs, multi million dollar homes.
> 
> ArborSmith I hear you Sir. I understand and appreciate your perspective Sir. This could be like a debate with a rock, then again maybe there are certain areas that really treat people like crooks.... we all are a product of our environment.
> We only know what we have been exposed to.
> It is a cruel world no doubt.
> I hope those nay sayers are just feeding their egos rather than having people treat them like criminals.
> 
> 
> Quote Originally Posted by boo View Post
> treevet... you've added words to my post?
> "all the time"? or "3 days over a 16 month period"?
> none the less, it is what it is.
> As I posted earlier, some are better off hiding behind a sign or phone... similar to the internet tough guy.
> mckeetree... I don't blame you for not doing door to door sales. Maybe you are one of those guys that would get a beatdown on someones front step. :O
> I know it could be bad for you to come to my house and speak.
> -OR-
> 
> From what I gather(?), it would be smart for anyone as friendly as you, and talks as well as you do, to retire from doing sales and teach others how to make a wonderful living from paid printing or magic markers?
> 
> Although I'm not a crackhead, I do know that they have big problems with being paranoid, and facing the public.
> ARE YOU GUYS SMOKING CRACK?!?
> 
> chipperscompany I'm sure you can see the brilliant posts by dumba$$e$.
> hopefully these posts will help answer your question in an indirect, stupid kind of way atleast.
> Only as a basic guide, I see newer members with lots of posts as bigmouth, ego, fools.
> I don't care for the drama and haters. Hopefully more people will chime in with "real" answers for you.
> 
> 
> I understand that some areas look at soliciting differently, I've worked all over the country. (treepet stay in ohio and stop posting in public) sorry for your bad personalities, appearance, social skills, and lack of knowledge, otherwise...
> Hide behind the print as you will
> 
> you mean throw money away on advertising, and wait for a caller to have me bid against 20 other tree services... no thanks.
> a couple days of door to door sales with flyers and education in almost 3 years, has generated lots of work, not to mention the referrals that came, and are still coming.
> 
> Glad I don't live in your neighborhoods.. HAHAHA!! upperclass?!?!?
> Sounds like a joke... maybe the ghetto would give results as described, not upperclass.
> I have never been thrown out or disrespected by a homeowner... ever!
> over 250k for the tree service alone so far this year.... go figure.
> Maybe the guys that get these results look and sound like common uneducated, dopehead, maggots.
> there are several celebs that I do tree work for regularly, they're always happy to see me
> 
> Door to Door also works well for my roofing company...
> yes mckee I also own a construction company and a roofing company.
> including several homes built for a few nascar drivers.... fairly high profile jobs, multi million dollar homes.
> 
> ArborSmith I hear you Sir. I understand and appreciate your perspective Sir. This could be like a debate with a rock, then again maybe there are certain areas that really treat people like crooks.... we all are a product of our environment.
> We only know what we have been exposed to.
> It is a cruel world no doubt.
> I hope those nay sayers are just feeding their egos rather than having people treat them like criminals.
> 
> 
> Quote Originally Posted by treevet View Post
> haha go try cold calls knocking doors with no appointment at the mansions on the estates in the Main Line in Philly.
> 
> One word comes to mind....Doberman
> 
> Sounds like experience.
> Remember, if you look like a drunk or junkie, or if you have no more education in the trade than your local homeowner, do not solicit door to door.
> If you live in an area where the crime is so high that laws have been passed to keep you away from people's property, it's probably not worth soliciting in the first place.
> Hide behind a sign, or paid advertising... this way potential clients don't have to see who you really are.
> 
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> treepet... I've seen your kind many times.. loudmouth, arrogant, over bearing, know it all, dumbasses...
> I've noticed your join date and posting total, point and case.
> Your comment about inbreeding... WOW! although I'm not the product of such, and was born and raised in the big city until the age of 20yrs., I doubt you even know the reason those folks decided to inbreed.
> For the record, I AM a CA, which means nothing other than I passed a test, as my marriage certificate is not the reason I am married.
> 
> as far as comparing any part of Ohio or Pa. to Beverly Hills... we ALL laugh at that!



So, you waited until your Shrink had to go to the bathroom so you could spew you dumb-ass-ness! Ha! Boo!! Ha!
Jeff


----------



## Natewood

I gained a new respect for tree md after reading this thread.... Good to be a hustler and not forget where you came from and never too proud to do what it takes to make an honest living and support your family! I grew up piss poor but with ethics and values and that turned out all I needed to be sucsessfull!


----------



## davistree

*Chainsaws talk, don t door knock*

I have found the greatest success by investing a little money and a little bit of mental effort in creating a flier to place in doors while in a neighborhood. Often times we see trees/stumps that need to be maintained or removed. How do you approach the homeowner? I usually sit back and look at the bigger picture. Do I want to be disturbed in my own home? Or have a strange burly tree guy showing up on the doorstep to greet my wife? Most certainly, I don t. However, there are subtle ways to get your name out in a neighborhood without knocking on the door. As we all know, chainsaws talk, when we work, everyone knows where we are. Some neighbors will at times approach you too actively... walking onto an active work zone with leads coming down from the sky; or the neighbor that walks back by repeatedly or those that sit and watch. As a business owner, this is an business opportunity that has yet to come to fruition. Engage these people in conversation, often you ll find they re looking for an estimate and don t know how to approach you. For those neighbors that are busy making a living during the day, utilize the leaflets in the doorways, small yard signs, and the connections you ve made with neighbors to boost your business via word amouth. I started my business after leaving the military, obtaining a college education, and not finding any work. There was a time that I could nt afford the advertising that the larger established companies could. Leaflets worked very well for me starting out, a couple cents per leaflet is well worth the small investment (check local solicitation laws). I would make it a point to fill the down time on the job by sending one or two of my ground crew up and down the neighborhood placing the leaflets in doors. It was not uncommon for one job to turn into a half a dozen or better jobs in one neighborhood. I d save money by not having to move equipment and further established a "foothold" in an area becoming the friendly neighborhood "tree guy". Along with business networking with other contractors, plumbers, excavators, roofers, etc. Surround yourself with other reputable contractors and put business on another's table and it surely will be returned. Don t be discouraged by not having the assets that others do, even the largest companies were at time a start up company. I began with one truck and a trailer and making a meager 20-30k my first season. Three years later, I have a fleet of trucks, equipment (all paid off), 26 employees, and my annual income is a very big jump from what it was a few years ago. Despite being able to now afford other advertising ventures, I still stand behind the flier method and its proven success.


----------



## jefflovstrom

davistree said:


> I have found the greatest success by investing a little money and a little bit of mental effort in creating a flier to place in doors while in a neighborhood. Often times we see trees/stumps that need to be maintained or removed. How do you approach the homeowner? I usually sit back and look at the bigger picture. Do I want to be disturbed in my own home? Or have a strange burly tree guy showing up on the doorstep to greet my wife? Most certainly, I don t. However, there are subtle ways to get your name out in a neighborhood without knocking on the door. As we all know, chainsaws talk, when we work, everyone knows where we are. Some neighbors will at times approach you too actively... walking onto an active work zone with leads coming down from the sky; or the neighbor that walks back by repeatedly or those that sit and watch. As a business owner, this is an business opportunity that has yet to come to fruition. Engage these people in conversation, often you ll find they re looking for an estimate and don t know how to approach you. For those neighbors that are busy making a living during the day, utilize the leaflets in the doorways, small yard signs, and the connections you ve made with neighbors to boost your business via word amouth. I started my business after leaving the military, obtaining a college education, and not finding any work. There was a time that I could nt afford the advertising that the larger established companies could. Leaflets worked very well for me starting out, a couple cents per leaflet is well worth the small investment (check local solicitation laws). I would make it a point to fill the down time on the job by sending one or two of my ground crew up and down the neighborhood placing the leaflets in doors. It was not uncommon for one job to turn into a half a dozen or better jobs in one neighborhood. I d save money by not having to move equipment and further established a "foothold" in an area becoming the friendly neighborhood "tree guy". Along with business networking with other contractors, plumbers, excavators, roofers, etc. Surround yourself with other reputable contractors and put business on another's table and it surely will be returned. Don t be discouraged by not having the assets that others do, even the largest companies were at time a start up company. I began with one truck and a trailer and making a meager 20-30k my first season. Three years later, I have a fleet of trucks, equipment (all paid off), 26 employees, and my annual income is a very big jump from what it was a few years ago. Despite being able to now afford other advertising ventures, I still stand behind the flier method and its proven success.


 
I did not know if they pay you by the word or by the hour. Troll!
Jeff


----------



## davistree

*Paid by the word*

haha, this troll must get paid by the word.... I ve spent a vast majority of my time out there on the Silver Strand training on Good ole Coronado Island. When I come back to SD, come grab a beer, and enjoy the verbage... Fellow Trolls drink free.


----------



## jefflovstrom

davistree said:


> haha, this troll must get paid by the word.... I ve spent a vast majority of my time out there on the Silver Strand training on Good ole Coronado Island. When I come back to SD, come grab a beer, and enjoy the verbage... Fellow Trolls drink free.


 
So you are a local guy? Pretty cool! I am in the north county, San Marcos., Grew up some in Chula Vista.
Jeff


----------



## davistree

*Cool*

No, I m originally from PA. I was stationed with NSW on Coronado and lived on the silver strand back when I was active in the Navy for 8 years. Love it out there. Back here in PA.


----------



## BC WetCoast

A friend told me that the local Davey office had a couple of guys going door to door because things were slow.


----------



## jefflovstrom

Corymbia said:


> Jeff is that particularly honest?
> 
> You are a contributor at Pekkaworld and you know that the Pekka head bans anyone who even likes me (that is why you used the word lurking below). As you know Arboristsite has a far more democratic approach to dissenting opinions. Darin is not paranoid about someone disagreeing with him.
> 
> A google alert brought the thread to my attention that included posts from you. To remind you .. you said "Mr. Hartley must be Outraged!!!!!! (right mister? I know you are lurking)" and then "So then, He is protected by mean's of tax-payer's. I wonder how he sleep's at nite?"
> 
> Well Jeff, Google was lurking and I am outraged that someone thinks I am responsible just because I didn't comment on someone else's bad pruning work. What gives ... did you get the idea from Pekka that I did the work?
> 
> Didn't you find it strange that he got the name of the person that did the work and then never named them yet blamed me for doing nothing after the damage had been done?
> 
> Is it a Pekkaworld official that he is protecting?
> 
> Did you know one of the big names at Pekkaworld was not working to the standards but no name and shame?


 
I think you should listen to you doctor and stay on the med's 
! You are sure troubled-  Door knocking? Hack? Lopper? Dude, you need a vacation! Take a pill and go!
Jeff


----------



## tree md

YouTube - ‪Can't you hear me knocking- rolling stones‬&rlm;


----------



## boo

I've noticed lots of sad ass nothings post how they are too good to knock on a door of an owner of an obvious tree hazard or tree in decline... keep feeding your egos, that's all you'll have in the end too.
Like some "books" that have written about it being unprofessional to door knock... I have read many printed mistakes. Reminds me of preachers that molest little boys. Some places have laws against door knocking... some places have a lower crime rate. Not all knockers are hacks. I have knocked doors before... not much, but none the less, I could work circles around many of you nay sayers, and am better educated than many also.. and I have several certs.. arborist being one of them.
Not everyone is smart enough or clean enough to talk to people honestly.


----------



## jefflovstrom

boo said:


> I've noticed lots of sad ass nothings post how they are too good to knock on a door of an owner of an obvious tree hazard or tree in decline.



Just curious , Who th hell are you? Did I come to your house and tell you your house is ugly? Don't come to my house and tell me I need tree work!!
Jeff


----------



## boo

You're an idiot. 
Obviously one of those inflated ego nobodies I was talking about.
I would love to come to your house.


----------



## Grace Tree

boo said:


> I've noticed lots of sad ass nothings post how they are too good to knock on a door of an owner of an obvious tree hazard or tree in decline... keep feeding your egos, that's all you'll have in the end too.
> Like some "books" that have written about it being unprofessional to door knock... I have read many printed mistakes. Reminds me of preachers that molest little boys. Some places have laws against door knocking... some places have a lower crime rate. Not all knockers are hacks. I have knocked doors before... not much, but none the less, I could work circles around many of you nay sayers, and am better educated than many also.. and I have several certs.. arborist being one of them.
> Not everyone is smart enough or clean enough to talk to people honestly.


 
You're rambling there, boob. What's your point?


----------



## tree md

Just a for instance: You have a crane on site and are taking a tree off of a house in a storm damaged area... There is a tree on the house next door, one across the street and another one two doors down... Are you not going to knock on those doors and advise the people that now is the most economical time to get the trees off of their houses as I have a crane on site???

Come on, get real folks...


----------



## boo

it is what it is there "small wood". 
Does your name mean similar to penis envy?
Maybe you should read more on the subject matter before posting and becoming perceived similar to jeff. 
Maybe you, like jeff, could use some help to get your head and/or the silver spoon out of your ass long enough to learn how to wipe it.


----------



## jefflovstrom

boo said:


> it is what it is there "small wood".
> Does your name mean similar to penis envy?
> Maybe you should read more on the subject matter before posting and becoming perceived similar to jeff.
> Maybe you, like jeff, could use some help to get your head and/or the silver spoon out of your ass long enough to learn how to wipe it.


 
Hey, just because you need to go around knocking on doors and begging for work dont mean we all do,Boo hoo!
Hahaha!
Jeff


----------



## Grace Tree

boo said:


> it is what it is there "small wood".
> Does your name mean similar to penis envy?
> Maybe you should read more on the subject matter before posting and becoming perceived similar to jeff.
> Maybe you, like jeff, could use some help to get your head and/or the silver spoon out of your ass long enough to learn how to wipe it.


I'm just SHOCKED that you would speak to me in this manner. In particular, your lack of capitalization of proper names ((J)jeff and (S)small wood) indicates that you're a dope fiend. Stop it! Stop knocking on doors. You'll ruin our whole industry and we'll all be out of work.
Get a haircut and have a nice day,
Phil


----------



## boo

You don't deserve caps in your name with comments like that. I'm glad to inform you that, I don't do dope... I don't even drink alcohol.  
I've learned that the ones that make these accusations are normally the dope heads and drunkards, and the ones that say they don't have to knock doors... wish they could.
As I previously mentioned, if you are the seriously stupid, a crack head, pill head, meth head, heroin addict, coke head, drunkard, and/or any other kind of scum bag, you should just hide behind your signs, listings, and phone calls... and pray the potential client does not hang up or throw you off of their property after they see and/or speak with you.


----------



## ropensaddle

jefflovstrom said:


> Hey, just because you need to go around knocking on doors and begging for work dont mean we all do,Boo hoo!
> Hahaha!
> Jeff


 
Hey Jeff we dont have a cushy chair lol. I would knock if need be and I also can sell doing it, as a matter of fact jeffy, I bet I could take some of your clients away doing itoke:


----------



## tree md

Yea, I had to chuckle about that a little too... I thought you were in operations Jeff? Do a lot of sales for your outfit do ya? Ever tried making it on your own?


----------



## Grace Tree

boo said:


> You don't deserve caps in your name with comments like that. I'm glad to inform you that, I don't do dope... I don't even drink alcohol.
> I've learned that the ones that make these accusations are normally the dope heads and drunkards, and the ones that say they don't have to knock doors... wish they could.
> As I previously mentioned, if you are the seriously stupid, a crack head, pill head, meth head, heroin addict, coke head, drunkard, and/or any other kind of scum bag, you should just hide behind your signs, listings, and phone calls... and pray the potential client does not hang up or throw you off of their property after they see and/or speak with you.


 Hmmmm. I think maybe you do a little dope but don't want to admit it.
YouTube - ‪Reefer Madness - The famous piano-scene.‬&rlm;


----------



## chipperscompany

Wow this thread has came a long way. I am no longer using this username, new name is ChippersTreeSvc. Our website is Dallas Tree Service - Chippers Tree Service - Tree Removal, Stump Grinding, Trimming, Pruning - Fort Worth - Texas . Check it out. We have been fortunate to have a lot of repeat and referred customers, I cant remember the last time I have had to knock a door. I don't mind doing it, but I have been busy running all over town bidding jobs.. Thanks for everyone who has replied to this thread with something good to say.


----------



## jefflovstrom

tree md said:


> Yea, I had to chuckle about that a little too... I thought you were in operations Jeff? Do a lot of sales for your outfit do ya? Ever tried making it on your own?


 
Thought we went thru this before, but, yeah, I do!
Jeff


----------



## boo

chipperscompany said:


> I know door knocking has to be the most effective way to get customers, however, I seem to stay blank whenever I approach a customer. Especially not know the kind of reaction I will get. My question to you is, what do you say when knocking on a strangers door to offer your tree services? Like a script. I would like to read what every says. I know I have to be happy and polite. Thanks guys






chipperscompany said:


> Wow this thread has came a long way. I am no longer using this username, new name is ChippersTreeSvc. Our website is Dallas Tree Service - Chippers Tree Service - Tree Removal, Stump Grinding, Trimming, Pruning - Fort Worth - Texas . Check it out. We have been fortunate to have a lot of repeat and referred customers, I cant remember the last time I have had to knock a door. I don't mind doing it, but I have been busy running all over town bidding jobs.. Thanks for everyone who has replied to this thread with something good to say.


 
Nice!


----------



## Toddppm

waiting for the spam link:cat::hypnotized:


----------



## ChippersTreeSvc

nalysale said:


> Now days door knocking has no good impact on customer.Customer needs are different and brands are in demand.Door knocking is time consuming and costly beside this a lot of ways we have such as social networking site and the best way in my opinion is every door direct mail system.


 
It's funny but about 2 month after I started this thread, I had an arborist from Kansas call me for a sales position in our company. He found us in google or so. He said he will work full commission as a salesman door knocking with no hourly rate. First day he started was a Saturday and sold about $1,300 of work in 2 properties in the day. Jobs were not bidded poorly either. I was very impressed at how quickly he sold work, I didn't believe that was possible until then. He kept us busy through the whole summer by door knocking and also bidding our current customers. To bad he had to leave early last year for a family emergency. Long story short, door knocking can be very effective for someone that has the confidence to knock on a door when they see an opportunity. And of course be knowledable about the field.


----------



## jefflovstrom

*You know what we say to ugly children.*



ChippersTreeSvc said:


> It's funny but .



Yup, that is funny, 
Bless your heart. :jester:
Jeff


----------



## Corymbia

outofmytree said:


> If you had as much of a _Seridium cardinale_ problem as we do then carrying a 1% bleach solution in a $5 spray bottle would be the norm. Just cut the infected branches last, spray and pack up.
> 
> Then again I have never been asked to work on Pamela's bush so what would I know!


 
What a moron! In my last post on this subject I said 10% it should have been 70%. Damn lying no good for nothing dumb arborist I am


----------



## Corymbia

HTST said:


> High all.
> 
> First post on this site and I got to say what a interesting time people are having on this site. I personally don't give one rats arse for personal sledging. I would love to know the amount of time two people have spent on posting insults to each other. If you multiplied this by my Aust. hourly rate for consulting ($220.00 per hour) the mind boggles.
> 
> Cheers
> 
> Love and kisses xxoo


 
It's still scewing with my billable hours but he is still out there with the same old crap


----------



## jefflovstrom

ChippersTreeSvc said:


> It's funny but about 2 month after I started this thread, I had an arborist from Kansas call me for a sales position in our company. He found us in google or so. He said he will work full commission as a salesman door knocking with no hourly rate. First day he started was a Saturday and sold about $1,300 of work in 2 properties in the day. Jobs were not bidded poorly either. I was very impressed at how quickly he sold work, I didn't believe that was possible until then. He kept us busy through the whole summer by door knocking and also bidding our current customers. To bad he had to leave early last year for a family emergency. Long story short, door knocking can be very effective for someone that has the confidence to knock on a door when they see an opportunity. And of course be knowledable about the field.


 



Yeah!! That is what I would say too!!!!!
How ya doing?
Jeff


----------



## JayD

*Looks like the past came calling*

This is public knowledge as of 2nd of May 2004...


----------



## victoria stiles

Door knocking is not necessarily cheaper than sending out letters. People assume that letters have to go out in lots of 100. Not true. You can send out as many or as few letters as your budget will allow. With current gasoline prices being what they are, you will probably spend more money going around and knocking on doors all day, using up a tank of gas than you would if you'd mailed the same, targeted group of folks.


----------



## Corymbia

JayD said:


> This is public knowledge as of 2nd of May 2004...


 
As is this Jeff ... since you came out of the closet and posted it on Pekkaworld

I would like to nominate myself,

Jeffrey J Darby
DOB: 7 th May 1959
POB: Sydney NSW
26 Dawn Drive Seven Hills NSW​
Which leads us to the following information, all public information available on the Internet.

You run a highly successful and well known Sydney Western Stump Grinding from home. You like to go 4WDing (a Nissan man) and you like to go fishing. You have worked for a while as an arborist / tree worker at North Sydney Council. You and your team take care of all of the council trees in North Sydney. (This is the same council that Pekka head says " North Sydney Council also restricts trade and is in bed with the NAAA" ... perhaps you should go and give your boss what for? You have a blog "JayD the antz pantz in Arboriculture" a title that is a tad pretentious. You run a Macbook Pro 15 which you have just upgraded to 8 gig of ram. You have a daughter who has a pet ferret call princess and your wife has a neat tattoo on her right upper arm.

To quote you, you are "a man of learning" with an AQF level 4 in Arboriculture [I think he means Cert 4 in Horticulture (arboriculture)] and you have enrolled in a Diploma. 

You have an almost 2 year old Hyundai (rego number AO 78 UX). And your wife gave you a copy of "the Body Language of Trees" for Christmas in 2009. 

With your life experience, great training and qualifications, I trust you will bring a lot to the new organisation! The reality is the Internet age makes it easier for most people to check to see with whom they are dealing regardless of how they come across them ... knocking on doors or spruiking for work on a forum.


----------



## JDTreeLakeTahoe

chipperscompany said:


> I know door knocking has to be the most effective way to get customers, however, I seem to stay blank whenever I approach a customer. Especially not know the kind of reaction I will get. My question to you is, what do you say when knocking on a strangers door to offer your tree services? Like a script. I would like to read what every says. I know I have to be happy and polite. Thanks guys


 
Practice a scenario with friends. Have some literature about your services AND you to give to prospects. A short list of references is good to have available as well. Be prepared to do an estimate or a short consult as well. If you can't answer a question, tell them you'll get back to them and be sure to follow up. I've disseminated fliers every Spring for 4 years. It works.
NEVER B.S. your way into a payin job...it'll haunt you forever.

good luck


----------



## Corymbia

JDTreeLakeTahoe said:


> Practice a scenario with friends. Have some literature about your services AND you to give to prospects. A short list of references is good to have available as well. Be prepared to do an estimate or a short consult as well. If you can't answer a question, tell them you'll get back to them and be sure to follow up. I've disseminated fliers every Spring for 4 years. It works.
> NEVER B.S. your way into a payin job...it'll haunt you forever.
> 
> good luck


 
I agree! Always be genuine and sincerely interested in helping and serving the property owner. The one great thing about door knocking is that you are often not competing against any one else, so you do not have to be so price driven. However, you should still expect to hear "No" regularly because they often have other things competing for their budget.

Of course, it goes without saying ... always abide by the appropriate laws.


----------



## victoria stiles

Door knocking,allows the prospective buyer to interact, by asking questions and getting answers on the spot before their interest wanes. Your company can put a face to the company name and your buyers feel special for the effort you have made.


----------



## Iustinian

I don't think door knocking makes anyone look like a hak, or broke, etc. If you have a neat appearance, are articulate and professional - you won't have to worry about looking like a hak.

We've sent people out with doorhangers with fair response, but usually after hitting the same neighborhood more than once with the door hanger fliers. It has seemed like the second time around in the same nieghborhood with like 2-3 months in between visits has a worthwhile return.

When I'm out and about, and see properties that are obviously in need of tree care, I have no problem with stopping and saying, "Hi, I'm out delivering an estimate in this neighborhood and noticed: (a) you have branches hanging over your house, (b) you have a large dead/dangerous tree (c) you have pin oak or birch with chlorosis (d) etc, etc, etc; if you have time I can give you a quote right now.....

Shaking someones hand, making in person contact with them - it is meaningful to that person, and you're more likely to get that job, sometimes even if you are not the low-bidder.

I dont see how any of that is demeaning or projects an image of a "hack". I've gotten quite a few jobs like that, and they've referred me to people who refer me to people. 

go door-knockers lol


----------



## PAYLESS

boo said:


> Nice!



how did you get to that point were no door knocking was needed , iam new and trying to find out the most efficiaant way way to grow my business, were did you advertise, or how did u do it please help iam in california and finding hard to find work , it not that i dont know how to do the work its that i dont know were to start , please help


----------



## jefflovstrom

PAYLESS said:


> how did you get to that point were no door knocking was needed , iam new and trying to find out the most efficiaant way way to grow my business, were did you advertise, or how did u do it please help iam in california and finding hard to find work , it not that i dont know how to do the work its that i dont know were to start , please help



You are in LA? Good luck with door knocking. Everyone in SOCAL know better unless they are clue-less hack's. Your better off advertising in Craig's List. Sorry, and welcome!
Jeff :msp_wink:


----------



## ropensaddle

jefflovstrom said:


> You are in LA? Good luck with door knocking. Everyone in SOCAL know better unless they are clue-less hack's. Your better off advertising in Craig's List. Sorry, and welcome!
> Jeff :msp_wink:



Lmao door knock there, no way without me 


NUCLEAR CANNON - YouTube


----------



## PAYLESS

*door knocking*



jefflovstrom said:


> You are in LA? Good luck with door knocking. Everyone in SOCAL know better unless they are clue-less hack's. Your better off advertising in Craig's List. Sorry, and welcome!
> Jeff :msp_wink:



what do you recommend then , i tried craigslist and i find that most of the people are window shoppers and are not really going to pay what the job is worth, thanks for your reply, what do you do out there? do you spend on adverstising were do i advertise?, i need help in staying busy ? i have 1 year d oing this and see other guys working dauly ? what do you think they do, thanks again for the help....


----------



## PAYLESS

ropensaddle said:


> Lmao door knock there, no way without me
> 
> 
> NUCLEAR CANNON - YouTube



what do you recommend then , i tried craigslist and i find that most of the people are window shoppers and are not really going to pay what the job is worth, thanks for your reply, what do you do out there? do you spend on adverstising were do i advertise?, i need help in staying busy ? i have 1 year d oing this and see other guys working dauly ? what do you think they do, thanks again for the help.... if door knocking is not the answer. what do you recommend thank you


----------



## PAYLESS

*to door knoc or not to door knok?*



mckeetree said:


> I never solicite. I read a TCIA article a year or so ago that said it is almost unheard of for a good tree company to go door to door looking for work. I have been saying that for 20 years.



that is great that u dont have to do that, so can you help what is the way to get leads and stay busy all week, ive been in business 2 years and have found it difficult, were do you advertise ? what methids do you use to stay busy , i know that work dont just drop from the sky!.. please help iam in lis angeles thank you


----------



## jefflovstrom

Maybe this is not the right business for you. The one's that ask these kind of questions probably don't last long. BTW, we market.
Jeff


----------



## farmboss45

Bottom line here is, a question was asked by a guy trying to put food on the table doing an honest days work! What we used to do when we had the stump grinder is spread out in the neighborhood we were in and offer a deal on stumps, ei.., 1.50 an inch, or if we had the bucket, same principle, offer a deal on trimming. Try local hardware store bulletin boards as well. whatever it takes to an honest approach to building your business and provide for you and yours.


----------



## jefflovstrom

farmboss45 said:


> Bottom line here is, a question was asked by a guy trying to put food on the table doing an honest days work! What we used to do when we had the stump grinder is spread out in the neighborhood we were in and offer a deal on stumps, ei.., 1.50 an inch, or if we had the bucket, same principle, offer a deal on trimming. Try local hardware store bulletin boards as well. whatever it takes to an honest approach to building your business and provide for you and yours.



Honestly, I am the nicest guy in the room, so don't take offense when I ask you what year you are living in. 
Jeff


----------



## farmboss45

jefflovstrom said:


> Honestly, I am the nicest guy in the room, so don't take offense when I ask you what year you are living in.
> Jeff



This year, thanks for asking, I was simply trying to offer up some suggestions, also, in small town michigan, these are things that have worked in the past, keep in mind however, due to the economy, ageing equipment and lack of money for bonding etc... the company I worked with is now gone. This was 5 plus years ago...


----------



## komatsuvarna

I cant stand door knockers. I worked all day and come home to spend time with the family and some guy knocks on my door wanting to sell me something i don't want. No, if i wanted that damn tree cut, or the ####ing barn painted, or the gutters cleaned, or my fence row cleared, or whatever,,, id be on the phone getting someone to come do it!!! Im positive every salesman thats ever knocked on my door thinks im 150% ass hole......that fine by me too, maybe theyll never come back. Advertise in the local news paper, classifieds, trading papers, craiglist, or do a good job and word of mouth is good advertisement too.


----------



## jefflovstrom

farmboss45 said:


> This year, thanks for asking, I was simply trying to offer up some suggestions, also, in small town michigan, these are things that have worked in the past, keep in mind however, due to the econemy, ageing equipment and lack of money for bonding etc... the company I worked with is now gone. This was 5 plus years ago...



First, I would listen to what a guy in Tennessee said, (small town maybe)
Second, Use spell check.
Jeff :msp_tongue:


----------



## live2climb

Burvol said:


> ok


Door Knocking is a very effective generator of income and business and better yet cost only time and gas. I started my tree service completely on door to door business. There is an art to being a successful solicitor and most importantly is appearance. If you present yourself as successful you will be perceived as successful. I only knock on doors of houses with hazard trees or dead trees in need of removal on the property. I usually open with an introduction of my company and myself and then say that i was in the area and unfortunately i noticed you have a tree or trees in possible need of attention and would like to offer my services if you are at all interested at this time. I also always offer a copy of my business license and insurance. I am still surprised by the number of people that say man i am glad you stopped by i have been meaning to do something about that. Door to door works well if done right! Keep up the effort, I now have many avenues of advertisement but built it all by and still use door to door.
Hope this is helpful never be ashamed to promote yourself by face to face communication it takes a unique skill set but can jumpstart small business into the big time.


----------



## Jolestree

I go D 2 D all the time and get better jobs than off call ins, for 1 you dont have to be the cheapiest bidder 2 you can pick your job and I gross more than all my competitors cause i do the ones that call and the ones that I sell door to door. I think those guys are a little arrogent, I say just tell them Who u r and what you do, be polite and honest and ignore the nasayers and you will have more work thn you can do............ Good Luck!!!!!


----------



## jefflovstrom

Jolestree said:


> I go D 2 D all the time and get better jobs than off call ins, for 1 you dont have to be the cheapiest bidder 2 you can pick your job and I gross more than all my competitors cause i do the ones that call and the ones that I sell door to door. I think those guys are a little arrogent, I say just tell them Who u r and what you do, be polite and honest and ignore the nasayers and you will have more work thn you can do............ Good Luck!!!!!



Hacks go D2D, are you a certified arborist? I bet not.
Jeff


----------



## Jolestree

jefflovstrom said:


> Hacks go D2D, are you a certified arborist? I bet not.
> Jeff



Im a licenced Arborist thank you, If you dont go d2d good for you but some poeple like dealing with new people and some people would never have called anybody if they wernt contacted first by someone. There are some people who dont hire people who come to thier door, But no form of marketing gets everybody. I have alot of customers and repeat buisness but I still cant pass by someone who needs my services. And if someone is sitting home without a job they need to go find something while they are waiting on advertising to work, that shows ambition in my book. More of america needs to look for work instead of waiting for someone to give them something.


----------



## jefflovstrom

Jolestree said:


> Im a licenced Arborist thank you, If you dont go d2d good for you but some poeple like dealing with new people and some people would never have called anybody if they wernt contacted first by someone. There are some people who dont hire people who come to thier door, But no form of marketing gets everybody. I have alot of customers and repeat buisness but I still cant pass by someone who needs my services. And if someone is sitting home without a job they need to go find something while they are waiting on advertising to work, that shows ambition in my book. More of america needs to look for work instead of waiting for someone to give them something.



Finally, a common sense answer to the original question!
Welcome Jolestree,, 
Jeff


----------



## 2treeornot2tree

maarrkk said:


> Door knocking is one of crap way reaching customers. By doing this customers gets frustrated and they never go for your product. There are many other ways to attract a customers like direct mail, advertising, email marketing and many more which will boost your businee for sure but door knocking will surely ruin your business.



I would rather have someone to stop and take the time to knock on my door then send me pesky emails and mailings in the mail. All junk mail and advertisments goes right in my trash without looking at it. Door knocking can be a good thing if done right. I prefer face to face communication myself. I like customers to be home so i can sell not only the tree job, but myself to them. Sounds like you may not be a people person and d2d doesnt work for you.


----------



## SquirrelMan

2treeornot2tree said:


> I would rather have someone to stop and take the time to knock on my door then send me pesky emails and mailings in the mail. All junk mail and advertisments goes right in my trash without looking at it. Door knocking can be a good thing if done right. I prefer face to face communication myself. I like customers to be home so i can sell not only the tree job, but myself to them. Sounds like you may not be a people person and d2d doesnt work for you.



I door knock. Its gets alot of low quality customers that I often times regret doing business with but also has some that shine. Close a 5k on a door knock and finished the job in one long 10 hour day. Doesn't always work like that but it works. Dont expect good bids on trimming though, most d2d companies are hacks are bidding $100 on a spike hack job on say a silver maple that they are going to do in 30 min when you see a hour of spikeless pruning that actually addresses the tree's issues. All the uneducated customer can see is a $300 price tag and a $100 price tag.


----------



## NEKS Tree Svc

*Hell yes im gonna knock*

I had my first job knockin on doors at 15 yrs old, this thread had some good info from those who knock regularly. Newer companies like mine who are respectful and have customers tell us we went above and beyond will have no issue at the door. Looks like there were some arb wars a few yrs back ROFL im still laughin at those who think it was okay for them to knock but now that some other guy wants to it should be illegal :hmm3grin2orange: get some slacks, shine your shoes, and knock , then you better show respect cause they took time out of their day to come talk to you at THEIR door. If you got a problem with knockin, better check your ego fools -----Here i go again on my own....walkin down the only street i've ever known.... (i know i changed the lyrics, to fit the knockin topic)


----------



## treecutterjr

If I see something obvious Like a totally dead tree in the front yard or a big stump I'll knock; Or stick a card with an estimate in the door or Mailbox.

I can usually tell from the upkeep of the house and yard whether they will go for it or not before I decide to try to knock or anything.

I find you get more "door-knocking" business from stumps than anything ( in my opinion). Its usually something they did their self, or had some boot leggers do, and no one had a stump cutter so they left it.

If I'm working next door or up the street, I knock and say " I was working next door/up the street/ in the neighbor hood and noticed that stump/dead tree/ limb down.....are you interested in having it removed?"

they either say, "yes/ how much would it be?" and I give them a good price or they say "no thanks" and I throw them a " It would only be "low-ball-price".

they bite or they don't. 

Doesn't make you a hack/ bootleg guy if you do or don't. 

I am a 2nd generation in the tree business. I used to take my dad's stump grinder when I was 18 & 19 and go cruising on a Sunday just knocking on doors doing stumps. I might make $400-$500 bucks on Sunday. Just from knocking.

You got to do what you got to do.

I don't just knock like " HEY, you got anything I can do?!"

but if its obvious and you are there go for it!


----------



## ClimbMIT

live2climb said:


> Door Knocking is a very effective generator of income and business and better yet cost only time and gas. I started my tree service completely on door to door business. There is an art to being a successful solicitor and most importantly is appearance. If you present yourself as successful you will be perceived as successful. I only knock on doors of houses with hazard trees or dead trees in need of removal on the property. I usually open with an introduction of my company and myself and then say that i was in the area and unfortunately i noticed you have a tree or trees in possible need of attention and would like to offer my services if you are at all interested at this time. I also always offer a copy of my business license and insurance. I am still surprised by the number of people that say man i am glad you stopped by i have been meaning to do something about that. Door to door works well if done right! Keep up the effort, I now have many avenues of advertisement but built it all by and still use door to door.
> Hope this is helpful never be ashamed to promote yourself by face to face communication it takes a unique skill set but can jumpstart small business into the big time.



Thumb Up!!!


----------



## Damie236

Try e-mails, try adds try it all. And be sure to keep on knocking on those doors *"every no brings you closer to a yes!"* Don't Give up bro, the longest and hardest journeys start with one step, so be sure you make that step and get out there.


----------



## jefflovstrom

opcorn:
Jeff


----------



## treebutler

ASD said:


> My bad
> 
> All i was trying to point out was that no mater what you have to say all people are going to here is BLA BLA BLA I have no work and need $$
> 
> It's a fact that d to d dose not work well and pisses people off !!!!!!! put an add on Craig's list or flyer's, post cards and the like would be a better use of time



You dont know what your talking about. I get most of my work d to d. I have met some great people that way who I still have as a customer 2 yrs later. Its not fun, but its better than sittin on your ass doin' nothin'. Craigslist is a joke around here. I have been posting ads on there for two years and Ive never gotten a job from it. A good attitude and a smile is all you need d to d. If they're not interested, say thank you for your time and move on to the next.


----------



## treebutler

komatsuvarna said:


> I cant stand door knockers. I worked all day and come home to spend time with the family and some guy knocks on my door wanting to sell me something i don't want. No, if i wanted that damn tree cut, or the ####ing barn painted, or the gutters cleaned, or my fence row cleared, or whatever,,, id be on the phone getting someone to come do it!!! Im positive every salesman thats ever knocked on my door thinks im 150% ass hole......that fine by me too, maybe theyll never come back. Advertise in the local news paper, classifieds, trading papers, craiglist, or do a good job and word of mouth is good advertisement too.



I cant stand ####heads


----------



## familytreeman

*door knocking*

I actually prefer door knocking to a CL ad however.

I've found I get a much higher ROI from my own personal sales approach vs. low ball CL shoppers

Then again, the customers are usually coming out of their doors, over to our trucks, asking for estimates!


----------



## Albert25

*re*

Its a good services and they also providing the soliciting services through their sites.So you can now easily get soliciting services with a quick access to solicitor and also they offering normal rates for their services.


----------



## VL07

I just get the address, go to the county appraisers office website, get the owners name and mailing address, then mail a letter/flyer to the owner. takes about 15min to get the info and mail out the letter...all from the comfort of my office. No need to knock on doors anymore.


----------



## Lil Red

VL07 said:


> I just get the address, go to the county appraisers office website, get the owners name and mailing address, then mail a letter/flyer to the owner. takes about 15min to get the info and mail out the letter...all from the comfort of my office. No need to knock on doors anymore.



What kind of feedback have you gotten doing this?


----------



## husqvarna335xpt

Vl07 has the same idea I did I sent out 10 flyers yesterday I figure if I get 1-2 jobs out of it .47 cents a letter is peanuts... I really dont ever want to knock on doors...I did a limb removel in little rock last yr and the home owner was telling me about a guy knocking on doors and he did have some work done by him... and I quote yeah man he slapped on those spike deals and shimmied right up that limb....he did a good job.... so I went in the back and looked sure enoungh you could see the spike spots and the awesome flush cuts.....
I was amazed that he didnt know any better but then I always forget to some people there just a tree and there just there... so I nicely laid it down for him no no no....... no


----------



## NEKS Tree Svc

*Is is working?*



VL07 said:


> I just get the address, go to the county appraisers office website, get the owners name and mailing address, then mail a letter/flyer to the owner. takes about 15min to get the info and mail out the letter...all from the comfort of my office. No need to knock on doors anymore.



Im curious to know what kind of response your getting from this method. I get a job from about 35% of the people that come to the door.


----------



## NEKS Tree Svc

*at least 4?*



husqvarna335xpt said:


> Vl07 has the same idea I did I sent out 10 flyers yesterday I figure if I get 1-2 jobs out of it .47 cents a letter is peanuts... I really dont ever want to knock on doors...I did a limb removel in little rock last yr and the home owner was telling me about a guy knocking on doors and he did have some work done by him... and I quote yeah man he slapped on those spike deals and shimmied right up that limb....he did a good job.... so I went in the back and looked sure enoungh you could see the spike spots and the awesome flush cuts.....
> I was amazed that he didnt know any better but then I always forget to some people there just a tree and there just there... so I nicely laid it down for him no no no....... no



did at least 4 people call you from the targeted address'?


----------



## husqvarna335xpt

NEKS Tree Svc said:


> did at least 4 people call you from the targeted address'?



Never got a call one! Lol support your local post office!


----------



## Single_Shooter

FACT: Over 70% of people who buy new cars do so because..."THEY LIKED AND TRUSTED THEIR SALESMAN"

I am new to this and don't know any other way to sell than face to face. And so far a large part of our tree business and 80% of our stumps come from door to door. And the stumps lead to the neighbor's stumps...and tree trimming....and tree removal...and eventually you are the guy that the whole street uses for their tree work. And the best part is that since you can't see the back yards from the street...once one person lets you in their back yard...you get a glimpse of everyone else's back yard...and see even more possible work.

Being new, I cannot survive, let alone succeed on what comes to me...I have to hunt it down and hope it leads to bigger better jobs and more profits and long term repeat customers with friends and family they refer to us. And so far....this is what is happening...so we must be doing something right. The last 4 jobs we did were referrals from previous jobs we got from door knocking. I guess I am not to the point where I feel that asking people for work is beneath me...


----------



## azrival

Seems to me there are alot of people on here who have established companies. In my case im 24 and just starting a bis. There is nothing I wouldn'touldnt do to be successful. D to d is effective. Just be confident in your ability and don't be afraid to hear no. selling is a skill just like climmbing, keep practicing


----------



## FanOFatherNash

I don't door knock , but what i have done was had flyers printed out ,when we were doing a large removal and will be in the area 2 days or at least all day, i would have groundies pass out flyers , they get % of job if we land it,
you get calls and you are 2 -3 blocks away , they get to see you in action ( helps with cred.) I prefer giving someone a bid on spur of moment vs, when they are shopping getting 3 or 4 estimates


----------



## L Mason

Columbus took a chance why not, approach a customer with a hello my name is __________ with ___________ tree service here is my card I dident know if you had any work that needed to be done we give free estimates. 

Or something along those lines i do it when I'm slow, or I'm working in a neighborhood that I have yet to advertise. You can also send flyers through the mail using a marketing service pretty reasonable usually $.25-.40/each. Depending on how many and the service you use.


----------



## jefflovstrom

We were working at an HOA that borders a nice golf course today. One of the homeowners came over and asked me if I could give her an estimate. She really has a lot of work needed. She said she asked me because lately she has had several 'door knocker's soliciting' and she don't trust people that go around and look at peoples trees and try to sell them a job.
Jeff


----------



## familytreeman

Keeping up with the times in this busier than ever 2013/14 season!

Door-knocking is something that may or may not be for you. There is no best way to sell. We don't all run our tree crews the same way, and we don't sell the same way either. If you can knock and sell, hey great, you are looking and acting professional. However, there are plenty of "100$ Bubba's" , teeth missing and all, 'runnin aroun, wit dey truck and saw, jus lookin for sum tree ta cut 'er up real good like,,.' Its these types that everyones afraid of, and what makes it extra difficult.


----------



## mckeetree

I have been in and involved in the tree business for 35 years and I have yet to meet a door knocker that either wasn't a scam artist, a dumbass, or just a jackrag in general. Might be one out there that's not...but I have not met or heard of him yet.


----------



## familytreeman

Well, I'm not any of those things you mentioned. I also am a Certified Arborist and I offer high quality work. Just because I dont rely on door knocking anymore, I still started my business that way. My first year I did over 30k from door 2 door, growing into a six figure income within several years. When the timing is right, I still knock, because I can get an extra job. Almost like a field goal.


----------



## mckeetree

familytreeman said:


> Well, I'm not any of those things you mentioned. I also am a Certified Arborist and I offer high quality work. Just because I dont rely on door knocking anymore, I still started my business that way. My first year I did over 30k from door 2 door, growing into a six figure income within several years. When the timing is right, I still knock, because I can get an extra job. Almost like a field goal.



I never said you were...I just said I never met one that wasn't one of those things in my 35 years in the industry. I am also a certified arborist and since you are a certified arborist you are probably a ISA member. You then would know they frown on "door knocking". Same with NAA (now TCIA). In the old days NAA would just about throw your ass out if you did something as gypsyish and unprofessional as door knocking. All the upscale neighborhoods we work in have passed ordinances against ANY type of solicitation. Some not so upscale have. Well, it's just damn insulting for some SOB to come ringing the bell begging for work..and that's basically what it is. Don't agree with me...call ANY professional tree org. and ask their opinion on it. ISA, TCIA, ASCA...they will say what you don't want to hear.


----------



## familytreeman

I agree with you. Door knocking is not ideal. You will generally get less for the same job this way. But you have to start somewhere. This was an efficient way to learn sales, and a cheap way to advertise for me while starting my business, but not something I focus on. Just knock the surrounding homes to each client. Pretty easy, and they usually all know each other. Im not saying flood a cold neighborhood, and no beggin' !


----------



## mckeetree

When I worked for Park Cities Tree Service back in the early 80's there was this guy we called shithook that would drive around knocking doors. We would see him around maybe twice a week. He did tree work out of an old Plymouth and either made a deal to not dispose of anything or leave it all piled up by the curb. We were working at a house one time and here comes shithook driving along, stopping every house or two to knock a door. We had worked for the old man next door to where we were. He was an old retired dentist and had a dog that would eat your ass up...big old german shepard chow mix looking thing. He didn't have a bad dog sign up but that was a zero tolerance absolutlely no soliciting by city ordinance neighborhood and most of those folks thoght that was enough. Sure enough, here comes shithook up to the door and we just watch. That old man was in a wheelchair and he barely gets the door cracked and jackass is trying to tell something about a tree that needs to come down when out comes the dog. Man, that dog like to have eaten that poor bastard up.


----------



## familytreeman

typical Bubba ! we dont name them here, they're all just bubbas . 
This is no comparison to my current method. I'm riding a fleet of powerstroke diesels with professional signs, crew with helmets and ppe, safety cones, etc... So usually the neighbors are coming out to us, or if I go up to the door, they're opening it up with SMILES - 
But starting out, I certainly encountered people who didn't want to hear it,, thats fine, just moved on.


----------



## mckeetree

familytreeman said:


> So usually the neighbors are coming out to us



That's what we do...let them come to us. I have never solicited a job in my life. Well...it's like I said earlier, if you are a member of any of the professional tree orgs. and solicit it's just plain old homespun hypocrisy. There is no two ways to slice that.


----------



## Klayton

i used to work for an insurance company that made me do door to door. some people are cut out for it and some are not. if i had advice for you it would be to buy the book "the smiling idiot" sounds like a stupid book but it is the best way to go about sales. when someone turns you down you just look forward with a smile and think one down a few more and i will get a sale. listen to inspirational talks like mort utley (youtube) keep a positive attitude. Keep your head up and put in the hours. thats how all respectable businessmen make it


----------



## FanOFatherNash

trailer would be 
just get a bunch of liars passed out when you in the neighborhood do in a tree tell you ground guy I get 5 or 10 percent of the sale. you'll be able to give an estimate why you're right there in the neighborhood spur of the moment right on the spot and I'll have two or three other tree services coming out

Sent from my SCH-R720 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## Corymbia

mckeetree said:


> I have been in and involved in the tree business for 35 years and I have yet to meet a door knocker that either wasn't a scam artist, a dumbass, or just a jackrag in general. Might be one out there that's not...but I have not met or heard of him yet.



Sounds like a good division of much of humanity. I have yet to meet someone who doesn't lie, cheat, steal and break the law when it suits them, myself included ... 'yes, darling, that meal was wonderful', 'Can I pay you cash and lets skip the tax' , 'I downloaded it', ,I was only going 10 miles over the limit'. 

We are who we are regardless of whether we door knock or we sit and hope that the phone rings. It takes balls to door knock and I suspect the oakmen amongst us (including myself) tend to lnot to have that courage and therefore door knocking is perhaps a bit more of a eucman activity.


----------



## FanOFatherNash

if you can decipher that you can make lots of money

Sent from my SCH-R720 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## Corymbia

Good thing I could decipher it then!


----------



## glov3r

I was workin for a guy the other day...(self-made millionaire), as he holds up rough knarled hands, he says..."You see how nasty these knuckles are? Thats from knocking on doors..."


----------



## inventtis

You guys got a website up? Google Adwords is really cheap to advertise on, you can probably get local traffic for less than $0.05 per click. If you need a website built and need some help in the internet marketing arena, I could help you out in that department.


----------



## treecutterjr

inventtis said:


> You guys got a website up? Google Adwords is really cheap to advertise on, you can probably get local traffic for less than $0.05 per click. If you need a website built and need some help in the internet marketing arena, I could help you out in that department.


0.05 cent a click If you are the only tree service in your area. In reality, Google ad words is more like $2,3, even 4$ a click. 

Sent from my SM-N900T using Tapatalk


----------



## inventtis

treecutterjr said:


> 0.05 cent a click If you are the only tree service in your area. In reality, Google ad words is more like $2,3, even 4$ a click.
> 
> Sent from my SM-N900T using Tapatalk



Competition always drives the costs up and your profit down.


----------



## Topbuilder

A good salesman does whatever he has to (ethically) to make the sale.[/QUOTE]

One of the tree services I grind for will talk to the neighbors while his guys are working a job. Offer discounts on trimming/felling since he is already there. I have gone to grind 4 addresses all next to each other. Good for the tree service, good for the grinder, good for the home owner. Gypsy or good business...


----------



## mckeetree

Topbuilder said:


> A good salesman does whatever he has to (ethically) to make the sale.



One of the tree services I grind for will talk to the neighbors while his guys are working a job. Offer discounts on trimming/felling since he is already there. I have gone to grind 4 addresses all next to each other. Good for the tree service, good for the grinder, good for the home owner. Gypsy or good business...[/QUOTE]

Gypsy.


----------



## inventtis

Gotprint.net has the best prices on door hangers and other promotional material, thought I would share since they are soo much cheaper than alternatives out there. If you need a business card or flyer made up, I could do that for you, just drop me an email.


----------



## RDAA

I have sold a few thousand bucks worth of door knocks in the past few weeks. I was working next door to one of them and noticed they were watching most of the day. They had a large part of the top of the tree broken and hanging. So I sold them an eleven hundred dollar removal out of the deal and it's five miles from my house. I guess I haven't knocked on every door in a neighborhood but if I am nearby I knock and drop a card if they have potential for some work. It works pretty well since I am a people person. I used to be a scrapper and comb the countryside looking for junk cars to buy. I wouldn't have had a whole lot to haul if I didn't hustle for it.


----------



## mckeetree

RDAA said:


> I used to be a scrapper and comb the countryside looking for junk cars to buy..




Knocking doors as an arborist is very unprofessional. As a scrap man...not so much. But thanks, you just made my point.


----------



## FanOFatherNash

what about passing out flyers ?

Sent from my SCH-R720 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## mckeetree

FanOFatherNash said:


> what about passing out flyers ?
> 
> Sent from my SCH-R720 using Tapatalk 2



That sounds more like a scrap man too. Or an asian nail parlor.


----------



## Marshy

You might want to consider when you do land a job, go knock on the immediate neighbors doors (at a reasonable hour) and let them know that you will be working next door between X and X hours on such a day and wanted to make sure they dont have any issue like birthday party etc that you might be interupting with the loud noise you will be generating. At the end slip them a business card and let them know you do free esitmates and would be happy to help them out if they were considering having something removed. That way you get some face time with new potential customers, they think your being considerate and they get a card in their hands. Other thought is to have an agreement with the land owner you do a job for to keep a small 12x12 advertisement in the lawn by the road for X many days after removal then come by and pick up the sigh or leave it for the home owner...


----------



## JimmyTree

Don't do door knocking. If they want your services they'll ask for them. Think of the last salesman who came knocking on your door and remember how annoying it is. Tree companies that do it are generally not the sort of companies you want to be associated with. Your credibility is what will sell your services long term and door knocking will not help. Not to mention how time consuming and awkward it would be


----------



## Volandtitanfan

I will stop and give people a card if I see a tree that needs attention. I have gotten many many jobs doing this. I do believe word of mouth is the best advertisment though. When I do go to someones door I pretty much use the same routine. "Hi I won't bother you long. Just seen you had some bradford pears that are looking ready to break and wanted to give you my card. I would love to give you an estimate on shaping those up if you ever decide to do so. Thank you for your time." Majority of the time they start asking me more questions as Im leaving. Ive had some that I thought they could care less and sure enough some time down the road I get a call from them. Just remember if they ask for a quote right then make sure and write down what you told them. lol


----------



## Ben Musha

chipperscompany said:


> I know door knocking has to be the most effective way to get customers, however, I seem to stay blank whenever I approach a customer. Especially not know the kind of reaction I will get. My question to you is, what do you say when knocking on a strangers door to offer your tree services? Like a script. I would like to read what every says. I know I have to be happy and polite. Thanks guys


I camly walk up to the door knock and or ring the bell, take a few steps back from the door. So I do not feel like I'm rushing the person answering, plus if you stand back there is more of a chance of somebody stepping outside to talk to you. I introduce myself and the company I am working for. Let them know I am working in their area, and politely ask if they would like a estimate on any trees around their property. Depending on their response and how they read my flyer dictates my response. But if they say NO. Politely say "Ok have a nice day. I appreaciate your time Sir/Mam." Sometimes its a first door job, sometimes its a 100th knock that you find a job. But keep it up you will find work.


----------



## KrisSchmandt

There are a lot of good ideas in this thread, some not so good too, lol. In the end most businesses want/need more work. Even the "big guys" still market and work towards generating more work. If they get it they simply grow, how do you think they got big. Anyone who "has enough work" is simply not growth minded, which is ok (for them) if that's what they want and are comfortable with. There are trade offs with growth, obviously. 
I think the simplest answer is staring everyone in the face. Everyone reading this thread is reading it on a computer/mobile device. The same goes for your potential customers, they don't check the phone book anymore, at least those that do are quickly becoming the minority, if they aren't already. Rather than spending your time walking all over the place, spend it working on your web presence. Put your business where your customers are looking and they will find you.


----------



## Kevin87

Ok first off anyone who is dogging door knocking can go suck balls. You guys are probably 2nd generation company owners who's daddy set you up or don't even truly own your company. There are people who don't even know they need tree work until a true professional points it out. For example when a tree starts getting sucker growth. A lot of homeowners don't even know what that is so if you make them aware of a situation and recommend that they get it taken care before it becomes more hazardous then not only are you looking for the homeowners best interest but your employees as well cause anyone who has any kind of real experience in a tree knows how dangerous a dead tree can be. I could diss on any form of advertising but what's the point? We're not on here to get talked down upon but to help each other out and give advice or look for answers. Those who are dissing need to grow up. This isn't 3rd grade anymore. Everybody has different walks of life and if you can't understand that then shame on you and your stupidity


----------



## jefflovstrom

Kevin87 said:


> Ok first off anyone who is dogging door knocking can go suck balls. You guys are probably 2nd generation company owners who's daddy set you up or don't even truly own your company. There are people who don't even know they need tree work until a true professional points it out. For example when a tree starts getting sucker growth. A lot of homeowners don't even know what that is so if you make them aware of a situation and recommend that they get it taken care before it becomes more hazardous then not only are you looking for the homeowners best interest but your employees as well cause anyone who has any kind of real experience in a tree knows how dangerous a dead tree can be. I could diss on any form of advertising but what's the point? We're not on here to get talked down upon but to help each other out and give advice or look for answers. Those who are dissing need to grow up. This isn't 3rd grade anymore. Everybody has different walks of life and if you can't understand that then shame on you and your stupidity



Are you a certified ISA Arborist?
Jeff


----------

