# new to milling-need a little advice



## TheKid (Dec 12, 2007)

Hello all, to make a long story short: I've been a residential climbing arborist for about 5 years now and am tired of seeing great, usable wood going to waste. I want to start milling for my own use primarily, and to give some to the customer perhaps. I think I plan on using the husq. 3120 powerhead and then purchasing an alaskan mill. what seems to be the most practical size, given the fact that I work mainly in the backyards of a city? Is it wise to get the biggest one and assume it will perform well towards the smaller end of it's range? Forgive me in advance for my perhaps elementary questions. What about chainsaw powerhead bandsaws? Can I use the husq. 372? I usually encounter cherry, black walnut,douglas fir, bigleaf maple,sweetgum, english walnut.Thank you all in advance.


----------



## aggiewoodbutchr (Dec 12, 2007)

3120 is certainly enough powerhead to pull just about any bar length. I recommend you decide on biggest bar you think you will use and get the mill to fit it. You can always shorten the mill to fit shorter bars. I do this with my GB mill all the time. I have it cut to fit my 72" bar and adjust it to fit my 66" and 44" bars when I can use them.

You will want to use the shortest bar you can for a log as it's much easier on you, the saw and fuel.

As far as he bandmill goes... Woodshop should be by some time soon. He's the resident expert on that subject.

Good luck.


----------



## aquan8tor (Dec 12, 2007)

aggiewoodbutchr said:


> 3120 is certainly enough powerhead to pull just about any bar length. I recommend you decide on biggest bar you think you will use and get the mill to fit it. You can always shorten the mill to fit shorter bars. I do this with my GB mill all the time. I have it cut to fit my 72" bar and adjust it to fit my 66" and 44" bars when I can use them.
> 
> You will want to use the shortest bar you can for a log as it's much easier on you, the saw and fuel.
> 
> ...





Ditto what Aggie said. Plus, the extra length of the mill even if you're not using it all the time will help balance the powerhead so you don't have to keep so much pressure upwards on the saw to keep it level. I know the 3120 is about 5 lbs heavier than the already lead filled 395. Something like 23 lbs if I'm remembering right.


----------



## BobL (Dec 12, 2007)

aquan8tor said:


> Something like 23 lbs if I'm remembering right.



yep.
See; http://www.acresinternet.com/cscc.n...c0b348984d0ea51288256b52001a5c15?OpenDocument


----------



## TedChristiansen (Dec 12, 2007)

Ed,

You should also check out Logosol (www.logosol.com) and the Ripsaw bandsaw.

Regards,

Ted


----------



## woodshop (Dec 12, 2007)

You have lots of choices depending on how much you want to spend, which at least partly depends on how much wood you plan on milling year to year. CSM (basic chain saw milling)... Logosol type mills take the csm to the next level, little more automated, easier on the back. Ripsaw, a small chainsaw powered bandmill uses less power and takes a much smaller kerf, so less wood is wasted. If you have the room and the time (I lack both) a full blown bandmill or swing mill tops the list. I mill enough wood every year to justify both a csm and a Ripsaw. I use the csm to mill the logs into cants, then use the Ripsaw to slice that into lumber. If you want more details on my particular method, read through this thread:

http://arboristsite.com/showthread.php?t=19709

Few pics to illustrate... first step, the csm taking off slabs to square up the log







After squaring things up, used the csm to slab off a 9 inch thick cant






...then stood that cant on it's side and used the ripsaw to slice that into boards, 6/4 in this case, you can see a stack of them already milled in back of pic next to that short unmilled log. You only need a saw in the 60cc range for the Ripsaw, so your 372 would work fine there, but you need a big saw for the csm. 






Keep in mind though, if you're going to be doing this in somebodies back yard, it really makes a mess. Lots of fine sawdust, and I mean fine... like powder. Nothing a good rain won't take care of after you rake up as much as you can though. Here is what I'm talking about...






More questions... ask away.


----------



## TheKid (Dec 12, 2007)

thanks to all who responded so far. woodshop-i've thouroughly read your a-z and am cooking up some questions. too bad I have to work and have a small social life, or it would be hours of milling daily. and building. and not climbing trees and cutting limbs off them. the mess is something i've considered and wonder if a few tarps wouldn't make cleanup a bit easier. and what about selling/donating the sawdust to community gardens? or convincing the homeowner to keep it (perhaps easy in oh-so-green Portland). Anyone see issues with this? I'm gonna stick with the portable as can be setup, as I'll be doing this onsite-no means of moving logs yet. awesome pix woodshop! inspiring.


----------



## ropensaddle (Dec 12, 2007)

How slow does a csm work?
Wood shop did you get the straight edge with your mill?


----------



## woodshop (Dec 12, 2007)

TheKid said:


> ... and what about selling/donating the sawdust to community gardens? or convincing the homeowner to keep it (perhaps easy in oh-so-green Portland). Anyone see issues with this?



..you have to be careful with some species putting sawdust on gardens and such. Walnut for example contains natural toxins that will kill or damage other foliage. Example, Tomatoes don't tolerate walnut trees/leaves/bark/fruit at all, and won't grow well if at all near a walnut tree. Tarps will help, I have done that in sensitive areas, but you just can't contain it all because the sawdust from milling is so fine that just a little breeze spreads it all over the place. 

Keep in mind your time invested in milling for profit also. With a Ripsaw/csm combo it is possible to mill 500 bd ft a day, but that's a full day and a LOT of hard work. Neither a csm or Ripsaw were designed to bang out lumber to sell unless your time isn't worth more than a few bucks an hour. You need a bigger bandsaw with a carriage if you want to make any money for your time. That said, I have done the math, and even if I paid myself $20/hour and accounted for my transportation and mix/oil/chain and even depreciated the mills and saws over 10 years... after all those costs, I can still bring home certain species like walnut and cherry cheaper than I can buy it. But the icing on the cake is I get custom milled wood. Say you want a thick solid table top out of fairly stable wood... ever priced 8/4 quartersawn walnut, cherry or oak?


----------



## woodshop (Dec 12, 2007)

ropensaddle said:


> How slow does a csm work?
> Wood shop did you get the straight edge with your mill?



If you mean that aluminum 2x6 guide bar, yes, 2 5ft sections come with the Ripsaw along with the hardware to attach them to the log. You can buy them separate, but they are pricey. Here is a better pic of what that hardware looks like, it has the ability to be adjusted for different shaped ends of logs.


----------



## oldsaw (Dec 12, 2007)

woodshop said:


> ..you have to be careful with some species putting sawdust on gardens and such. Walnut for example contains natural toxins that will kill or damage other foliage. Example, Tomatoes don't tolerate walnut trees/leaves/bark/fruit at all, and won't grow well if at all near a walnut tree. Tarps will help, I have done that in sensitive areas, but you just can't contain it all because the sawdust from milling is so fine that just a little breeze spreads it all over the place.
> 
> Keep in mind your time invested in milling for profit also. With a Ripsaw/csm combo it is possible to mill 500 bd ft a day, but that's a full day and a LOT of hard work. Neither a csm or Ripsaw were designed to bang out lumber to sell unless your time isn't worth more than a few bucks an hour. You need a bigger bandsaw with a carriage if you want to make any money for your time. That said, I have done the math, and even if I paid myself $20/hour and accounted for my transportation and mix/oil/chain and even depreciated the mills and saws over 10 years... after all those costs, I can still bring home certain species like walnut and cherry cheaper than I can buy it. But the icing on the cake is I get custom milled wood. Say you want a thick solid table top out of fairly stable wood... ever priced 8/4 quartersawn walnut, cherry or oak?



But who accounts for it that way? I like being out in the woods, or playing outside, so I just see it from the $$ spent side of things. I got into milling for about $650-700. My first batch was 400bft of walnut and oak. At $1.75/bdft, my rig was paid for, plus fuel and oil which wasn't that bad. I don't know of too many places where you can get hardwood lumber that cheap. Sure it took some time, but I enjoyed it. Then I had to buy a planer, then bought a bigger saw, but cut more lumber. I'd have to figure I'm in for $1.25/bdft now, all inclusive. If my oak deal goes through this winter, it will go much lower.

Mark


----------



## VT-Woodchuck (Dec 13, 2007)

*Or, consider this*

The Woodbug and it is fairly close to you in BC. Still involves labor but not as much as an Alaskan. Like mine a lot but I am looking for a bandsaw mill to supplement (like Woodsaw) or replace. Worth a look at www.woodbug.com


----------



## TedChristiansen (Dec 13, 2007)

In addition to the mess, the other problem is the noise. You will be running a chainsaw at wide open throttle for the majority of the 8 hours it would take to saw 500 bdft of lumber with the Ripsaw (or X bdft with CSM). If there are houses nearby, this won't be tolerated for long. Solutions are:

1. Find logs to mill not near houses
2. Load and haul the logs - as small as you must to be able to manage them.

Regards,

Ted


----------



## TheKid (Dec 14, 2007)

ted, thanks for the input. the noise is definitely a concern and I'm hoping for the best and plan to employ the whole permaculture approach, kindly explaining to neighbors that this beautiful tree (which perhaps they could purchase from me in lumber form) was just going to get cut up, ground up, and turned into hogfuel and put on a barge to china. again, anything any of you guys see wrong with my newly hatching plan, LET ME KNOW. I love the input so far and I vote milling and saw mills section of as the most sane and well behaved!


----------



## Semi-Hex (Dec 14, 2007)

woodshop said:


> If you mean that aluminum 2x6 guide bar, yes, 2 5ft sections come with the Ripsaw along with the hardware to attach them to the log. You can buy them separate, but they are pricey. Here is a better pic of what that hardware looks like, it has the ability to be adjusted for different shaped ends of logs.



I like the fact you wear your PPE too.


----------



## woodshop (Dec 15, 2007)

Loweecey said:


> I like the fact you wear your PPE too.


Didn't always... used to run around as if I could stop somewhere on the way home and pick up a pair of eyes, ears or lungs. If and when you damage something, often it's permanent and forever! Something quite obvious that somehow eluded my live forever logic 30 years ago. As it is now, I do have some hearing loss and sporadic tinnitus from years of not always wearing enough (if any) hearing protection from rifle and handgun fire when I was in the military, as well as chainsaws and my woodshop machinery. Anyway... never too late to get religion.


----------

