# Climbing gear?



## Gologit (Oct 31, 2012)

One of our members, dh1984, posted this picture in Off Topic. He says that this is his climbing gear and he's going to be the climber for a tree service.

I'm no expert on climbing gear. What do you guys think of this collection? Is it safe? Will it even work?


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## 2treeornot2tree (Oct 31, 2012)

I would use it if I had a death wish. The spurs might be ok, but I would replace all the straps and inspect them thourghly.


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## ddhlakebound (Oct 31, 2012)

Looks to me like a rotted out linesmans belt, another not so rotted linesmans belt, and a pair of rusty spikes. 

The spikes could be made usable w/ all new pads and straps, and a sandblasting and powder coat or paint job.


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## dh1984 (Oct 31, 2012)

ddhlakebound said:


> Looks to me like a rotted out linesmans belt, another not so rotted linesmans belt, and a pair of rusty spikes.
> 
> The spikes could be made usable w/ all new pads and straps, and a sandblasting and powder coat or paint job.



I'm going to get new pads and straps.Then i'm going to bead blast the spikes and then give them a good paint job where they will not rust again.

What other gear would you all suggest me getting?


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## 2treeornot2tree (Oct 31, 2012)

After looking at the picture again. I would throw out those spurs too. They look like they are bent wrong or something. Maybe ran over by a truck or something. Either buy a climbing kit or buy a saddle, rope, flip line and spurs.


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## dh1984 (Oct 31, 2012)

Ok i got an extra set of spurs that has longer spikes on them. 

I'm goin to look right now and see what the pads,straps and replacement spikes will cost. Then i'll look for a saddle,rope and a flip line. 

Then what else will i have to have to be safe when climbing tree's ?


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## 2treeornot2tree (Oct 31, 2012)

dh1984 said:


> Ok i got an extra set of spurs that has longer spikes on them.
> 
> I'm goin to look right now and see what the pads,straps and replacement spikes will cost. Then i'll look for a saddle,rope and a flip line.
> 
> Then what else will i have to have to be safe when climbing tree's ?



Your looking at around $50-$70 for basic straps and pads.

Before I answer your question, let me ask one. Do you know how to use this equipment?


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## dh1984 (Oct 31, 2012)

2treeornot2tree said:


> Your looking at around $50-$70 for basic straps and pads.
> 
> Before I answer your question, let me ask one. Do you know how to use this equipment?



Well i know how to use the spurs and flip line. But to really tell the truth about the saddle i really don't know how to use it.

I been trying to find a class to go to so i can learn how to use it and some more equipment.


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## dh1984 (Oct 31, 2012)

Del_ said:


> Look at our sponser's climbing saddles. Climbing saddles are designed for overhead rope support along with pole climbing D rings. It is very unsafe to use a lineman's saddle to climb trees as they are not designed to support the climbers weight except for when the have their spikes set into the tree.



Oh i c I'm looking at wesspur on here and i seen a package deal that was pretty close to 800.00 bucks for it. 

Here is what it has in the package.


Buckingham Viking Saddle (SAD124)
1 Pair Buckingham Steel Tree Spurs (SPU102)
1 Pair Buckingham Big Buck Pads (SPU702)
1 Pair Universal Lower Straps SPU717)
2 Pair Universal Upper Straps (SPU718)
1 Pair Gaff Guards SPU901
5/8" x 12' Maxi-Flip Flipline FLI124
Petzl Macrograb Adjuster ASC102
Pirate Auto-locking Carabiner CAR134
Tree Climber's Companion BOO101
Large Canvas Gear Bag BAG203

Then if i need more then i can get a upgrade kit for it.


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## treemandan (Oct 31, 2012)

Be careful mate.


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## ddhlakebound (Oct 31, 2012)

dh1984 said:


> Oh i c I'm looking at wesspur on here and i seen a package deal that was pretty close to 800.00 bucks for it.
> 
> Here is what it has in the package.
> 
> ...



That kit looks pretty good. The saddle, spikes, and flipline total $635. That kit shows as $679 for me, so the bag and extra biner, and tree climbers companion make up the difference. You'll still need a rope, and a couple biners. You can cut a piece off your rope for a split tail, or keep it full length and buy a seperate pc. of rope or premade split tail. If you buy them seperate, get the tree climbers companion, it'll be worth way more to you than the $15 bucks it costs.


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## Zale (Oct 31, 2012)

I would suggest you get new gear. The gear in the picture should be discarded. Remember, this gear supports you and your life. Don't try to do it on the cheap. Stay safe.


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## jam70 (Oct 31, 2012)

tree climbers international in Atlanta, GA offers climbing classes, they have a few coming up. might be worth looking into. I would not climb on any of that gear.


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## k5alive (Oct 31, 2012)

hate to sound like an a s s but there's a lot to climbing and the gear required to do it safely.
first and foremost.... are you comfortable with heights or working over power lines? standing on a limb 60+ feet off the ground swaying with the breeze? climbing dead trees in the same condition? its not all balls but a lot of brains


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## Genius. (Oct 31, 2012)

k5alive said:


> hate to sound like an a s s but there's a lot to climbing and the gear required to do it safely.
> first and foremost.... are you comfortable with heights or working over power lines? standing on a limb 60+ feet off the ground swaying with the breeze? climbing dead trees in the same condition? its not all balls but a lot of brains



If you want hours of fun search out his posts......

Grab a few beers and enjoy:hmm3grin2orange:


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## 046 (Oct 31, 2012)

dh1984 said:


> Well i know how to use the spurs and flip line. But to really tell the truth about the saddle i really don't know how to use it.
> 
> I been trying to find a class to go to so i can learn how to use it and some more equipment.



don't buy anything until you've read the Tree Climbers Companion and have spent a few days watching professional climbers local to you. 

start low and slow... learn all the basic knots... keep practicing and practicing those knots. when you can tie a knot blindfolded. then you know it well enough to trust your life to that knot. 

don't worry about trying to know every knot. just learn a few select knots to where you know with dead certainty it's being tied correct.

here's a few lifeline knots. with one glance, you know those knots are tied correctly and you can trust your life to that knot.


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## Steve NW WI (Nov 1, 2012)

++++DISCLAIMER - NOT A CLIMBER, NEVER BEEN ONE, DON'T WANT TO BE ONE++++

046, I gotta ask, what purpose would the knot in the strap be used for? In my uses of straps (tie down and lifting), I've always been taught that knots are a big no-no in straps?


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## imagineero (Nov 1, 2012)

That cresent wrench looks like it's probably serviceable with a bit of oil

Shaun


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## imagineero (Nov 1, 2012)

Steve NW WI said:


> ++++DISCLAIMER - NOT A CLIMBER, NEVER BEEN ONE, DON'T WANT TO BE ONE++++
> 
> 046, I gotta ask, what purpose would the knot in the strap be used for? In my uses of straps (tie down and lifting), I've always been taught that knots are a big no-no in straps?



I'll take a guess; It's either a water knot or a beer knot. Looks like a beer knot from this angle. Tape/webbing can be tied into a sling by the use of either knot. The water knot is the traditional way, and the beer knot is its more recently invented and supposedly stronger cousin. It's certainly neater. Most other knots come undone in tape/webbing.

Shaun


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## russhd1997 (Nov 1, 2012)

opcorn:


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## Grendel (Nov 1, 2012)

Well, I'm kind of in the same boat, new to climbing and all.

I spent about $1200 on all new gear before I ever went up a tree. researched it for months. . . 

Sherilltree's Edge saddle
Sampson True Blue 150' w/ a spliced end
Kein steel gaffs w/ Weaver L Pads and Straps
Yale Maxiflip 5/8 15' wire core flip line (way to long. . . )
16 strand Blue Streak hip Prusik
8 and 10 mm spliced eye split tails
Hitchclimber pulley, DMM Ultra O Biners
14 Oz. throw weight and Poly line.

and of course, The Tree Climbers Companion, which showed me the way. 

The gear is really cool, but being 70' up a big old white pine on a windy day is much cooler 

Looking to acquire some kind of official certification this winter so I can start working in the trees for $, but really I just wanted to learn how you guys do what you do. Awsome skill set!

Anyways, don't skimp on your equipment, it will help build confidence.


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## Goose IBEW (Nov 1, 2012)

Man, that pic makes me very grateful that I got into some good gear right off the bat.:msp_scared: 

I have been down your road, wondering what I have for gear and if its any good, how to use it for that matter.......still working on that part. One thing I did have was OSHA 30 training and competent persons training for suspended scaffolding on high rise buildings. These classes teach you how to check your fall protection and I would not use that pile. The stitching surely is very old and could literally fall apart. Salvaging the spikes may be one thing but the rest is in no shape to support your life. The clip isn't even double acting, insurance would not cover a mishap if they inspected that gear. 

When it comes to safety, nobody here wants to see you get hurt. The kits you are looking at would be a great start, good luck.:angel:


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## dh1984 (Nov 1, 2012)

Goose IBEW said:


> Man, that pic makes me very grateful that I got into some good gear right off the bat.:msp_scared:
> 
> I have been down your road, wondering what I have for gear and if its any good, how to use it for that matter.......still working on that part. One thing I did have was OSHA 30 training and competent persons training for suspended scaffolding on high rise buildings. These classes teach you how to check your fall protection and I would not use that pile. The stitching surely is very old and could literally fall apart. Salvaging the spikes may be one thing but the rest is in no shape to support your life. The clip isn't even double acting, insurance would not cover a mishap if they inspected that gear.
> 
> When it comes to safety, nobody here wants to see you get hurt. The kits you are looking at would be a great start, good luck.:angel:



Thanks all for the info i'll go ahead and get the money ready to get the gear. It might take a few months to get but i'll make sure i will get and not climb no tree's with this gear i got.

I got the whole lot at a good deal for 50 bucks out the door at a pawn shop so i got the whole lot and they have been setting in the truck every since i got them.

I've been lucky so far every tree i climbed had limbs all the way from the base to the top. I been trying my self in every time before i cut something. So thanks again for all the info i'll make sure i'll get the gear i showed you all on the first page.


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## Jwalker1911 (Nov 2, 2012)

dh1984 said:


> Thanks all for the info i'll go ahead and get the money ready to get the gear. It might take a few months to get but i'll make sure i will get and not climb no tree's with this gear i got.
> 
> I got the whole lot at a good deal for 50 bucks out the door at a pawn shop so i got the whole lot and they have been setting in the truck every since i got them.
> 
> I've been lucky so far every tree i climbed had limbs all the way from the base to the top. I been trying my self in every time before i cut something. So thanks again for all the info i'll make sure i'll get the gear i showed you all on the first page.



How is 50 bucks for a pile of crap a good deal?


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## 046 (Nov 2, 2012)

imagineero said:


> I'll take a guess; It's either a water knot or a beer knot. Looks like a beer knot from this angle. Tape/webbing can be tied into a sling by the use of either knot. The water knot is the traditional way, and the beer knot is its more recently invented and supposedly stronger cousin. It's certainly neater. Most other knots come undone in tape/webbing.
> 
> Shaun



yup that's a beer knot ... the two lifeline knots was what I was really trying to showcase. 

first up is a triple fisherman, the only knot I'd trust without a backup for a lifeline. note fisherman knot is just a general term. hopefully the real knot experts will step up with correct terminology. 

second is a figure eight, backed up with a double fisherman. either knot is strong enough in it's own right. 

please notice how all of my knots are neatly tied. this is not done for strength purposes but to aid in recognizing when a knot is properly tied with one glance. properly setting a knot can be just as important as tying a knot correctly. 

again ... it's not how many knots one knows.... but how well one knows how to tie that knot. the tried and true test for knowing your knots is... can you tie that knot blindfolded? 

learn every knot described in the Tree Climbers Companion as if your life depends on it. don't worry there is not very many to learn. just learn them well because if you climb, your life does depend on it!

here's a properly tied split tail. note lashing is not meant for strength






here's gear that some will get into a bit later


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## Guran (Nov 2, 2012)

> here's gear that some will get into a bit later



Good info. Just curious; how do you use your Petzl Mini Traxion? In what situations?
Thanks.


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## 2treeornot2tree (Nov 2, 2012)

046 said:


> second is a figure eight, backed up with a double fisherman. either knot is strong enough in it's own right
> 
> please notice how all of my knots are neatly tied. this is not done for strength purposes but to aid in recognizing when a knot is properly tied with one glance. properly setting a knot can be just as important as tying a knot correctly.



I dont backup a figure 8 knot. You just have to make sure you leave at least 3" of tail and set the knot. If i was gonna backup a figure 8 knot as they teach for fire company rescue classes, they use a overhand knot. Thats all thats needed. A double fishermans knot uses alot more rope and is much more bulky.

I disagree. It is also for strength. A well dressed knot will hold better then a sloppy tied one. 


You can also use a double fishermans knot. It holds just a good, uses less tail.

The major knots I would say you should know are:
Your climb line knot. Which ever one you choice to use. I use a VT.
Bowline
Figure 8
Clove hitch
Half hitch
Double / Triple Fishermans. Also know how use them to make a prussik loop.
Timber Hitch and or Cow Hitch.

As far as the webbing goes. I use a water knot alot. If I plan on not un tying a piece, I use a beer knot. You can also use a figure 8 knot in webbing. It is stronger then the water knot, but alot more of a pain to tie.


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## dh1984 (Nov 2, 2012)

Jwalker1911 said:


> How is 50 bucks for a pile of crap a good deal?



well the spikes didn't look that bad rusted when i got them. i had them behind my seat on my truck and they have been there for about 6 months.


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## dh1984 (Nov 2, 2012)

2treeornot2tree said:


> I dont backup a figure 8 knot. You just have to make sure you leave at least 3" of tail and set the knot. If i was gonna backup a figure 8 knot as they teach for fire company rescue classes, they use a overhand knot. Thats all thats needed. A double fishermans knot uses alot more rope and is much more bulky.
> 
> I disagree. It is also for strength. A well dressed knot will hold better then a sloppy tied one.
> 
> ...



Thanks for the information i'll start practicing these knots. Then when i get my gear i'll be ready to use them.


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## tramp bushler (Nov 8, 2012)

dh1984 said:


> well the spikes didn't look that bad rusted when i got them. i had them behind my seat on my truck and they have been there for about 6 months.



OK. Thats one thing that you need to get past first. You HAVE TO TAKE GOOD CARE OF ALL!!! YOUR CLIMBING GEAR! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Dry it out carefully at night! Would you let a brand new 660 Stihl rattle around in the back of a truck. ? Your climbing gear is a lot more important than a new saw.


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## KenJax Tree (Nov 8, 2012)

Nice collection there, i however have no comment


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## tramp bushler (Nov 8, 2012)

Many on here wouldn't climb on my gear but I have many vertical miles climbing, rigging trees for tower loggin, topping, and competition speed climbing practice. Using spurs a waist belt and 4 strand wirecore manilla flip line.
Worked great. For removals and tower loggin.

Now that I'm getting into Arborist work, I've modernized my gear. 
I use Klein spurs with tree gaffs. They are very comfortable and hold very well in the tree when I have to lean way over or spur in above a Burl or limb base. At this point I use Arbor Plex rope because it meets my needs at this point. Tree Climbers companion is a MUST.


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## KenJax Tree (Nov 8, 2012)

I don't believe a word this guy says (dh1984) he is the biggest BSer to walk in the AS door and i see he's at camp again.


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## 046 (Dec 20, 2012)

2treeornot2tree said:


> I dont backup a figure 8 knot. You just have to make sure you leave at least 3" of tail and set the knot. If i was gonna backup a figure 8 knot as they teach for fire company rescue classes, they use a overhand knot. Thats all thats needed. A double fishermans knot uses alot more rope and is much more bulky.
> 
> I disagree. It is also for strength. A well dressed knot will hold better then a sloppy tied one.
> 
> ...



sorry for taking so long to respond ... according to multiple pull to destruction tests. how knot was tied (neatly or not) so long as knot was tied correctly made little difference in results. don't get me wrong I'm a big proponent for neat knots because one can instantly tell if it's tied correctly. but not for strength. 

reason for backing up figure eight is the tremendous variety of lines used to climb with. some dyneema rope mfg will recommend only triple fisherman be used for termination knots. an overhand is fine to backup a figure eight, my logic is if one is going to tie a backup knot, then that knot should be secure enough for primary duty. 

triple fisherman is the only termination knot I'd use without a backup knot. note I'm referring to a termination knot on a lifeline. according to latest regulations requires a knot that cinches down. 

double fisherman is an excellent knot too, but when used for a termination knot adding that extra loop adds security with little difference in effort. due to difficulty to untie, triple fisherman is usually used for knots that don't need to be untied.


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## SUBMAN719 (Dec 20, 2012)

dh1984 said:


> I'm going to get new pads and straps.Then i'm going to bead blast the spikes and then give them a good paint job where they will not rust again.
> 
> What other gear would you all suggest me getting?



I would suggest getting EVERYTHING!!! Sorry but that stuff is all rotted JUNK and I wouldn't even put it on let alone get one foot off the ground and trust my life with it! If you don't care if you live or not then go ahead and use it! Metal fatigues with age... webbing rots and weakens with age! Even though everything may look sound, once you put stress on ANY of those components you run the risk of failure! 60 feet in the air is NOT the time to find out that there's a defect! TOSS IT ALL AND START FRESH!!!


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