# Total PPE



## memetic (Jul 3, 2008)

This has probably been beaten to death randomly over a million random threads, as I have been searching for a day or so and haven't hit the "gold-mine" of info. But, my tree partner and I am about to outfit all of us with new matching safety gear and I want to get some feedback. 

Safety glasses: one of the uvex styles. 

Hard hats: Bullard Hard Hat - Full Brim 

Chaps: 6 Ply Kevlar Chainsaw Chaps (so much for my shorts, solo that is)

Hearing protection: boxes of Spark Plugs or equivalent

We want to be safe, but so far we have been operating at a _very_ minimum. So, knowing there are a plethora of top of the line gear, we just want to get us all reasonably safe at a decent price. 

We just want to get us all more safe than we are now and we can upgrade ourselves later.


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## treemandan (Jul 4, 2008)

safety glasses= wire mesh screens with complete head band.BUGZ
whatever is used make sure to strap in on pretty good.


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## memetic (Jul 4, 2008)

I saw the wire mesh screens, that really helps? I mean on a day to day basis? I like the clearest safety glasses I can find I can't imagine looking through a wire mesh. My thought was the mesh would hinder sight and make for a more dangerous situation. I never looked through the things, so what do I know.

Thanks


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## treemandan (Jul 4, 2008)

memetic said:


> I saw the wire mesh screens, that really helps? I mean on a day to day basis? I like the clearest safety glasses I can find I can't imagine looking through a wire mesh. My thought was the mesh would hinder sight and make for a more dangerous situation. I never looked through the things, so what do I know.
> 
> Thanks



Its a lot of up and down with the screens. First I look at what am about to do with them up then do it with them down, its automatic for me now.
Dust gets in but same with glasses but something that will really wreck your next few days is kept out. Odd things happen though so an odd eye shield is needed. I keep them on all day, everyday.


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## clearance (Jul 4, 2008)

Hardhat with ear muffs and a mesh facescreen. All in one package, easy. Used them for years and years. Vision is not obstructed, you will get used to it quickly. And, if you are falling, bucking and climbing, fallers pants are best.


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## treemandan (Jul 4, 2008)

clearance said:


> Hardhat with ear muffs and a mesh facescreen. All in one package, easy. Used them for years and years. Vision is not obstructed, you will get used to it quickly. And, if you are falling, bucking and climbing, fallers pants are best.



The only major problem I have with those helmets is tight quarters and no chin strap and they always break and nobody has the parts.
Perssonally I would like something in a climatized motorcycle helmet with elavator muzac and what the heck toss in the full body suit. It could be solar powered.


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## clearance (Jul 4, 2008)

treemandan said:


> The only major problem I have with those helmets is tight quarters and no chin strap and they always break and nobody has the parts.
> Perssonally I would like something in a climatized motorcycle helmet with elavator muzac and what the heck toss in the full body suit. It could be solar powered.



Chinstraps are available, but they are ghey, the earmuffs will hold the hardhat on. Mine has only come off a couple of times in many years. Perhaps you have used a weak model. I have used them climbing in the bush, swinging from tree to tree, which is tougher on you and the hat than other things.


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## Jumper (Jul 4, 2008)

You did not mention footwear. Steel toes recommended.

I am with clearance go with the pants.


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## shokidq (Jul 4, 2008)

Jumper said:


> You did not mention footwear. Steel toes recommended.
> 
> I am with clearance go with the pants.





With the Kevlar lining


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## shokidq (Jul 4, 2008)

clearance said:


> Hardhat with ear muffs and a mesh facescreen. All in one package, easy. Used them for years and years. Vision is not obstructed, you will get used to it quickly. And, if you are falling, bucking and climbing, fallers pants are best.





The only thing with the mesh is it gets dark quicker when working in thinnings. I like my all round protection bibs rather than chaps although pretty dam hot in the sun.


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## Bigus Termitius (Jul 4, 2008)

treemandan said:


> The only major problem I have with those helmets is tight quarters and no chin strap and they always break and nobody has the parts.
> *Perssonally I would like something in a climatized motorcycle helmet with elavator muzac and what the heck toss in the full body suit. It could be solar powered.*




LOL...or in your case, wind generated. Hey, at least you're being green...though I hear it's not easy.

I'll take mine with symphonic musik. I enjoy it whenever I'm creating a work of art, either on canvas or with a tree. Obviously, I'll take the wind generated version too, the sun doesn't always shine you know. I can guarantee wind. 

Did I mention that I'm a surreal abstractionist? Most utility hacks are.


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## serial killer (Jul 4, 2008)

I'm not a big fan of the ear plugs that you have to smush up with your finger to put in your ear. They get filthy and are a hassle getting in and out. I much prefer earmuffs, or at least the foam plugs on the plastic band. I just find myself shifting between spots when I need to hear clearly and spots that are crazy loud too quickly. If I gotta roll up a little plug that I can't find, sometimes I will end up not using them if it's just for a few seconds. I'd rather have a set of muffs that I can just throw on or slide down when needed.

Also, most arborists that I know of use something along the lines of a rock climbing helmet. The Bullard might actually be better, but it just screams "logger." Of course, you didn't say and you might actually be a logger. So, whatever floats your boat. I've used the Petzel Vertex Vent and another type of Petzl that I can't remember. Red for most of the guys and white for the foreman, or whoever gets elected that day to deal with questions from the public.

As far as the face shield, I've never used one, but I've often thought it might be nice when feeding a chipper for those times when a branch wants to whack you in the face. Otherwise, I just like to have a selection of safety glasses that I can switch out depending on conditions. I always have a couple pairs of clear and dark MSAs from Home Depot and like to have some yellow ones around for rainy and overcast days also. I tried a set of orange Stihl glasses recently and had to junk them because they were just too disorienting. 

Throw in a fresh pair of the latex dipped gloves every couple of weeks and you're set.


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## Nailsbeats (Jul 4, 2008)

The only thing I like the mesh screen faceshield for is running the chuck-n-duck chipper. Good face protection.

Other than that I run clear or tinted glasses, I can see much more clearly through them.


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## Pete M (Jul 5, 2008)

Vote for the mesh face shield. Provided you focus on what you're working on then you won't even know the shield is there. Only if you focus on the end of your nose do you really notice it. It gets an even bigger vote if you're someone who sweats a lot like me. Glasses are absolutely useless when they've got sweat running down them and dust sticking to them.

And definitely a helmet and ear defenders. I was using ear plugs all the time instead of defenders, but found them awkward when I needed to talk to someone. The plugs are comfortable though - best thing to do is get a pack of 300 so you can put fresh ones in instead of trying to re-use them. Nothing worse than ramming a dirty sweaty swelled up plug in your ear.


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## memetic (Jul 5, 2008)

Thanks for all the input, it's really appreciated. This is where I'm at so far after a little more poking around and after all the great input I got here. It's likely to change as I get more feedback. Still need some more input in the chaps department.


*Ear Protection:*

I use plugs all the time when I am around construction and have been using them for the tree work lately with good results. My partner and the guys we use all like the plugs. I definitely don't put a dirty pair back in that's just wrong. If it comes out, it stays out. I don't touch new plugs going in to roll them. I roll them in the plastic they come in. You only have to grab the end that doesn't go into your ear to put them in. 

I read a lot of people saying to go with the earmuffs so maybe I will get a pair and see how it works out. I like the light-weightness of the plugs myself and I can usually get them in real quick (granted not as quick as earmuffs, unless I set my earmuffs down WAY over there and forgot, then my plugs win).

*Eye Protection:*

Will probably go with something like this:

http://www.discountsafetygear.com/uvexfitlogic.html

Clear for usual use and maybe a tinted for those times when needed.

I understand the point about the mesh being better because of sweat and dirt etc, otherwise I would get something like these (that are tight to the face):

http://www.discountsafetygear.com/pyramex-goggles.html

But, it would never work for me. I would be blind from sweat and dirt/dust in about 1 minute. 

edit: I am still not convinced about not noticing the mesh. My eyes are very sharp and sensitive to obstruction - it is difficult for me to even drive with sunglasses on unless the sun is just too much. I like crystal clear seeing, anything else bothers me. I don't know if anyone else has this problem. Maybe Nailsbeats? Maybe I will try to find them local and try it out. 

*Head Protection:*

Based on the logger comment above and my guys' input about looking stupid, we switched to the "Bullard Hard Hat - Cap Style", from the "Full Brim". 

Only my partner climbs right now and he is getting a new "Petzl Vertex Vent Helmet". 

*Leg Protection:*

We are getting the 6 Ply Kevlar Chainsaw Chaps as seen here (the first two at the top):

http://www.wesspur.com/chaps/chaps.html

This is where I still need a lot of input - remember I wear shorts. I like the price range of these for now. But, most important (in this kind of price range) is my crotch being able to breath. Does anyone know of a better chap than the second one from link above? Something airy in the right place, with good protection, in this price range? I want to wear shorts under them and I don't care if the shorts show thru at all. 

*Foot Protection:*

We all already have steel tip boots that's why I left it out. (I got mine at an Army/Navy surplus store for $50-60 a few years ago.) Unfortunately, we don't always all wear them. Something to work on I guess. 


Thanks


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## shokidq (Jul 5, 2008)

*Foot Protection:*

We all already have steel tip boots that's why I left it out. (I got mine at an Army/Navy surplus store for $50-60 a few years ago.) Unfortunately, we don't always all wear them. Something to work on I guess. 


Thanks[/QUOTE]

It amazes me that you all wear standard steal caps & not chainsaw boots, the only time I've caught myself with the saw running was on the foot, & it's been the same with other operators we had work for us although one did cut his hand. the worst case was a guy who cut his foot with standard boots and it run along the back of the steel toe and when he took the boot off he had to shake his toes out and put them in a bag for the hospital.
to work on most sites here now you must have a forestry hat with visor and muffs, kevlar leggings and chainsaw certified boots they also try to get the mits which are a reel pain to work with.


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## memetic (Jul 5, 2008)

"...when he took the boot off he had to shake his toes out and put them in a bag for the hospital."

*Thanks, I just threw up in my mouth! *

Did the toes sew back on OK, or were they all mangled from the saw and un-sewable? I know a saw cut in wood can look smooth and neat, but I also notice the 5/8" of wood missing after the cut. Well, not missing, but lying in a pile on the ground as saw dust. Does he wear a size 10 and a size 9 now?

Did his saw have a break? 

Joking aside, I want to point this out to everyone so you understand where I am coming from, I am not against safety in any way - it's not a joke. I am the most concerned person I know about safety - maybe it is because I have a third degree burn on 1/3 of my thigh that could have been prevented by proper safety (nothing to do with tree work). I just want our crew to be a lot more safe than we are now. Maybe you read some of my other posts and get what I mean. Eventually, I would love to have the finest safety gear from head to toe for all of us, but right now it's just not feasible. This is a major investment and I am approaching it step by step - well kind of, because we are buying head to almost toe gear for everyone. 

Helmets for the ground guys are better than baseball caps (yes, it's true).
Safety rated glasses are better than sun glasses (it does happen).
Chaps are way better than my shorts or their work pants (every day now).
Steel toe boots are better than hiking boots (almost every day someone does this, including me a few times).

I don't want anyone to get hurt. And I think it is worth the investment to buy safety gear (it's not about the bare minimum for OSHA). That's why I started this thread. Thanks for all the input.


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## shokidq (Jul 5, 2008)

memetic said:


> "...when he took the boot off he had to shake his toes out and put them in a bag for the hospital."
> 
> *Thanks, I just threw up in my mouth! *
> 
> ...


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## Pete M (Jul 5, 2008)

Memetic, are you stumping up for all the gear yourself? Reason I ask is that I work for someone, yet am happy to purchase my own PPE for which I get acknowledged in the pay to an extent. I like having my own freedom of choice in what I buy rather than having someone buy it for me. After all, it's Personal Protective Equipment. Would your guys be happy to do this?


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## memetic (Jul 5, 2008)

They won't pony up for the gear themselves all at once, but it basically comes out of their pay over the _long haul_ (and they know and are cool with this and as you read from my earlier post are getting input on what we are getting). If they quit early the equipment becomes someone else's). I'm not going to start being a #### about this and start firing/yelling at people because I am just as guilty. The only difference is I am a partner and have to start making good decisions for EVERYONE. 

I totally get your point, but if you read the end of my last post where we're at in terms of safety gear now, you'll understand why we're taking the route we are. And I think it is a good choice vs current practices.

edit: "at that time they tended to do away with the breaks reckoned they were a nuisance, back before health and safety got out of control" 

See, that's what I'm talking about. I am knocking on wood right now even though I don't believe in superstition, but I think if the break is not broken or disabled then we should be good with non-saw rated steel toes until we get more money. It's not about arrogance, it's simply a matter of economics at this point. The best gear is coming in due time.


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## serial killer (Jul 5, 2008)

I have a buddy who throws his used ear plugs through the wash with a bunch of other laundry and reuses them. I think he's a little goofy, but it seems to work for him. 

Pete, the way I understand it, according to US regulations the employer is responsible for providing PPE. In actuality, it tends to be a little bit of a tradeoff, especially with most smaller companies. The owners know that they are unlikely to face any sort of government scrutiny and tend to skimp on what they provide. 

I own all my own stuff because I have fairly specific preferences. For instance, I can have all the earplugs I want for free, but I own a couple pair of earmuffs because I like them much better. I like to replace my glasses much more often than most because I hate scratches. I prefer a pair of full wrap chaps and have freakishly long legs, so screw the stinky old shorty chaps on the truck. Etc, etc. I think that I'm a rarity though. Most of the guys I know do their dangedest to avoid wearing any PPE at all. I guess I just value my hearing and all my appendages more than most.


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## Job Corps Tree (Jul 5, 2008)

Glad to see a Employer trying to do his best for his Crew. I have always bought my own when I had to. I want to See my Sons graduate and to Hear my Sons graduate. Anything to make you & your guys Safer. Husky makes a good pair of Gloves( with saw protection in the left hand, most cuts are here. on the hands) better than MIT's. You go! Safety First! Please don't forget Training


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## memetic (Jul 5, 2008)

Job Corps Tree said:


> Glad to see a Employer trying to do his best for his Crew. I have always bought my own when I had to. I want to See my Sons graduate and to Hear my Sons graduate. Anything to make you & your guys Safer. Husky makes a good pair of Gloves( with saw protection in the left hand, most cuts are here. on the hands) better than MIT's. You go! Safety First! Please don't forget Training



I'm not sure if we are required to buy all the safety gear, but we are doing it anyway because we love our crew - and I don't want any gimps at my house when we have parties  . We are only "kind of" buying it because we are getting it up front for everyone, but VERY slowly the crew pays in to it to keep it for themselves. That's part of the reason why I have been asking them what they want. I think it's a good deal because they get the gear for free up front and don't have to pay interest or anything and get to keep it. It's good for everyone. 

I've heard of other employers some of our guys worked for didn't provide them with anything. Not even $3 safety glasses. One guy showed me a scar where a twig caught him in the eye and he had stitches. A fraction of an inch higher and he would be wearing a patch now and out of work. And he was excited because his boss paid for the hospital bill. That kind of stuff makes my stomach turn. 


Re hands: 

All right, I'll bite. Tell me about hand safety. Gloves and mits are just about the last thing I'd ever wear, right behind knickers and a corset. I don't understand how anyone cuts their hand while sawing (both hands are on the saw?). It seems to me you have a superior grip with a bare hand. I have used gloves in the past for all types of activities and I always have a better grip without. The only activities I do with gloves/mits is motorcycles and snowboarding. And snowboarding doesn't require a grip!

Also, my hands are pretty hardened from construction, martial arts, and other things - no not that. Tell me the horror stories. Bring 'em on. Maybe I'll add gloves to the mix.



edit: Forgot this:

"Most of the guys I know do their dangedest to avoid wearing any PPE at all."

I don't understand why this is. I have seen it a lot now that I have been paying attention to it. For me it is complete discomfort why I skip a couple things. I feel safer when I am focused on work rather than what I am wearing (the discomfort because of it). I will have to adjust. I know some people think they are cool without safety gear. They think they look cooler or stronger without it. I could give two shiiites how macho or cool I LOOK. I know I look a lot stronger with two arms and two legs and two feet and two eyes and my head....


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## clearance (Jul 5, 2008)

I wear gloves now, didn't used to. Just the cheap yellow/orange chainsaw type gloves, they work real good in the rain. Better grip than bare hands when wet. Gloves do protect your hands somewhat. Maybe you get scratched instead of cut, maybe a little cut instead of a cut that needs stitches. Maybe the glove burns a little instead of your flesh sizzling (like when you touch a hot muffler by mistake). 

Gloves are not a must like the other things though. 

I prefer the hardhat, muff, facescreen combo, all in one package, no looking around for another piece. People cut thier hands, wrists, by one handing a saw, usually a top handled climbing saw.


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## memetic (Jul 5, 2008)

"People cut thier hands, wrists, by one handing a saw, usually a top handled climbing saw."

*That's what I thought!*

My partner does this shiite all the time it f'n freaks me out. I know he does it to rile me up sometimes. I hope he's really not showing off. Most people know showing off is a sure way to get your arse handed to you - or your hand handed to you in this case. 

A saw has a place for both hands for a reason I don't care how bad arse a saw handler you think you are. But, what do I know.


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## secureland (Jul 5, 2008)

shokidq said:


> memetic said:
> 
> 
> > "...when he took the boot off he had to shake his toes out and put them in a bag for the hospital."
> ...


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## Bermie (Jul 6, 2008)

Go with the all-in-one helmet system, beats looking for separate pieces all the time.
I know what you mean about the face shield, sometimes the sun is slanting at an angle and actually reflects off the inside of the screen, making it harder to see...but this doesn't happen often enough to be a major issue, the protection I've had over the years from face slapping branches and eye poking twigs more than makes up!

I'm switching to chaps for the summer, I just can no longer bear my all around protection Stihl trousers, waaayy to hot! 

I invest in chainsaw boots, SIP leather, they have steel toes and kevlar strands. I have to import them, worth the cost

Gloves not only give you a better grip with sweaty/wet hands, Clearance said it best with how they can reduce an injury from major to minor! I concur, Silky saw cuts are nasty on bare flesh. The chainsaw protective ones with the pad on the left hand are a holdover from days of no left hand guard...the UK still insists you wear them, once they have a law, its hard to undo it! Improvements in chainsaw 'safety features' now has significantly reduced the risk. Yup, left hand cuts are usually 99% caused by one handing a top handle saw...


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## shokidq (Jul 6, 2008)

secureland said:


> shokidq said:
> 
> 
> > For the US folks, a "lorry" is a big rig or semi.
> ...


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## Sprig (Jul 6, 2008)

serial killer said:


> I have a buddy who throws his used ear plugs through the wash with a bunch of other laundry and reuses them. I think he's a little goofy, but it seems to work for him.
> 
> Pete, the way I understand it, according to US regulations the employer is responsible for providing PPE. In actuality, it tends to be a little bit of a tradeoff, especially with most smaller companies. The owners know that they are unlikely to face any sort of government scrutiny and tend to skimp on what they provide.
> 
> I own all my own stuff because I have fairly specific preferences. For instance, I can have all the earplugs I want for free, but I own a couple pair of earmuffs because I like them much better. I like to replace my glasses much more often than most because I hate scratches. I prefer a pair of full wrap chaps and have freakishly long legs, so screw the stinky old shorty chaps on the truck. Etc, etc. I think that I'm a rarity though. Most of the guys I know do their dangedest to avoid wearing any PPE at all. I guess I just value my hearing and all my appendages more than most.



Its quite alright to wash yer foamies, personally I just use Ivory soap and warm water, squeeze, re-do, squeeze, re-do, squeeze in clean dry towel. avoid detergents as they have been suspected of causing bio-grief, a good real soap is just fine. Also avoid high temp water as it may degrade the foam.
Just my semi-worthy .02$ wotrth fer the afternoon.
Value your hearing man, you will never appreciate as much as you will when its gone 

 From a safety slut.

Serge


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## scotclayshooter (Jul 6, 2008)

shokidq said:


> secureland said:
> 
> 
> > I'm down in Perth but I do love it in the highlands, done a bit of clearfell over around the Isle of Mull and up around Thurso so long as you skip june july and august for the good old midge.
> ...


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## scotclayshooter (Jul 6, 2008)

Sprig said:


> Its quite alright to wash yer foamies, personally I just use Ivory soap and warm water, squeeze, re-do, squeeze, re-do, squeeze in clean dry towel. avoid detergents as they have been suspected of causing bio-grief, a good real soap is just fine. Also avoid high temp water as it may degrade the foam.
> Just my semi-worthy .02$ wotrth fer the afternoon.
> Value your hearing man, you will never appreciate as much as you will when its gone
> 
> ...



Whe i use foamies its 3M type they come in a little plastic bag, The trick is to roll them up while in the bag then when you take them out put them back in the bag and roll them up for re-use again that way they stay clean (apart from the crud that comes out of your ears lol)
I may be odd but i have to put them in fat end first or thy wont seal, I guess i gave big earholes 
Over a certain DB the bones behind your ear transmit sound so quality muffs are better protection IMO


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## shokidq (Jul 6, 2008)

scotclayshooter said:


> shokidq said:
> 
> 
> > There was a report on tv that the midge was now as far north as TAIN lol
> ...


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## memetic (Jul 6, 2008)

Being half Scottish - my mom and her family is Kerr - it's good to see some Scotts here. Any of you guys want to send me a Kerr family kilt? I can't find one for under $200. Maybe someone you guys know can hook me up?

"The trick is to roll them up while in the bag..."

That's what I do. 

"...then when you take them out put them back in the bag and roll them up for re-use again..."

That's how I definitely know your Scottish. I'm only half, I guess that's why I don't reuse them. We have a running joke here about Scotts being cheap as Jews. No offense to the Jews, my wife's one (I guess my son is too according to tradition). haha. 

We have been to England, but our next trip is to Scotland. Not sure when, but if any of you Scotts want to meet up for drinks let me know.


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## Kate Butler (Jul 6, 2008)

I wear Clics (magnetic front-closing sunglasses) with a foam band around the eye. Almost goggles, but not quite. They are THE BEST for keeping small particulates totally out of the eyes!! If it's serious work, the full helmet goes over the glasses.


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## scotclayshooter (Jul 7, 2008)

shokidq said:


> scotclayshooter said:
> 
> 
> > Lol last contracting job we done was at strathy i think you head 6 or 7 miles inland but it was about 14 years ago, did like to stop in at capaldi's in brora for a tub o ice cream on the way up.
> ...


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## scotclayshooter (Jul 7, 2008)

Kate Butler said:


> I wear Clics (magnetic front-closing sunglasses) with a foam band around the eye. Almost goggles, but not quite. They are THE BEST for keeping small particulates totally out of the eyes!! If it's serious work, the full helmet goes over the glasses.



Any chance of some more details? website? photos?


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## Pete M (Jul 7, 2008)

This must be 'em... http://eyewearclics.ca/shop/index.php?cPath=29&osCsid=35b91cddb761dca8dfa0e7c7756aa0ad


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## Pete M (Jul 7, 2008)

When I have to wear goggles (which is usually when I'm using a cicular saw or a cutting disc and the dust is blowing around and getting all over my contact lenses) then I wear the Bolle X90 low profile safety goggles. Quite a bit cheaper at about £8, but also comfortable and pretty much resistant to steaming up, unless I'm sweaty in the rain.


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## Pete M (Jul 7, 2008)

by the way, I'm quarter Scottish, having a half Scottish dad and a fully Scottish grandmother from Largs.


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## scotclayshooter (Jul 7, 2008)

Pete M said:


> This must be 'em... http://eyewearclics.ca/shop/index.php?cPath=29&osCsid=35b91cddb761dca8dfa0e7c7756aa0ad



Cheers back to plan b lol they aint shy with the prices!
Swiss one riders is my safety glasses of choice, I cut the arms off just on top of my ears so they dont hurt with muffs on.


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## Kate Butler (Jul 7, 2008)

scotclayshooter said:


> Cheers back to plan b lol they aint shy with the prices!
> Swiss one riders is my safety glasses of choice, I cut the arms off just on top of my ears so they dont hurt with muffs on.



Sadly, they are kind of pricey. I'd be happy to locate a source where they are less expensive. But the front closing aspect is really convenient.


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## Lawnmowerboy48 (Jul 8, 2008)

Ztek for the eyes I have had great luck with them, whatever you get though look for the Z87 on them. You can run a mesh screen on your helmet but you do also need glasses on in addition to that. I don't intentionally wash my plugs but many a time I have come across a freshly cleaned set in a pair of cleanish pants. As for the helmet I have petzl vertex vent which I have no complaints about. I took the ears and connectors off of my old husky helmet and snapped them right on. Some may disagree but I don't see the point of a helmet unless it has a chinstrap. For the future though I am not 100% sure how it works but you may want to look into equipment allowances for your employees. Say you give them an additional 25 cents per hour to their current wage. The 25 cents goes into their equipment account which they are allowed to spend on equipment that they want, new rope, saddle, some new little gadget that has come out. Benefits the company as a tax right off and the the benefit to the employee that he is not spending money out of his pocket on stuff that he needs to do work for you.


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## memetic (Jul 9, 2008)

"For the future though I am not 100% sure how it works but you may want to look into equipment allowances for your employees. Say you give them an additional 25 cents per hour to their current wage. The 25 cents goes into their equipment account which they are allowed to spend on equipment that they want, new rope, saddle, some new little gadget that has come out. Benefits the company as a tax right off and the the benefit to the employee that he is not spending money out of his pocket on stuff that he needs to do work for you."

That's kind of what we're doing. It's not much about the tax right off though - that's what huge parties and company dinners are for!! 

Any one order from w e s s p u r ? I am about to place an order, but can't find any decent reviews (not good reviews, just reviews in general). It seems like a reputable business, just want to check before I throw down almost a g note.


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## scotclayshooter (Jul 31, 2008)

Kate Butler said:


> Sadly, they are kind of pricey. I'd be happy to locate a source where they are less expensive. But the front closing aspect is really convenient.



Im now the proud owner of 2 pairs of cliks one all the way brand new from Canada and another pair from ebay.co.uk
They are great for strimming but the arms are a little thick to be comfy with ear defenders (dremel time!!!)


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## treemandan (Jul 31, 2008)

Bigus Termitius said:


> LOL...or in your case, wind generated. Hey, at least you're being green...though I hear it's not easy.
> 
> I'll take mine with symphonic musik. I enjoy it whenever I'm creating a work of art, either on canvas or with a tree. Obviously, I'll take the wind generated version too, the sun doesn't always shine you know. I can guarantee wind.
> 
> Did I mention that I'm a surreal abstractionist? Most utility hacks are.



Hey I missed that poke... I must retaliate. Uhm let me think, oh I know- UP YOUR NOSE WITH A RUBBER HOSE. There is some wind for ya Bigus ####ius.
Don't take it to heart but face to face you probably would do what most do which is to look at me strange and keep a good amount of distance. So far you have been doing pretty dam good.


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## treemandan (Aug 1, 2008)

Very little of me I am sure but what the heck?
Anyway good for all total PPE, which ever you chose, use or lose it is sure your going to get poked in the eye... probably worse.
Do you have to take the chaps off to chip?


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## memetic (Aug 1, 2008)

I chip in shorts.


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## treemandan (Aug 2, 2008)

memetic said:


> I chip in shorts.



Short shorts?


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## OLD CHIPMONK (Aug 2, 2008)

Film at eleven " OSHA " reports today's happenings " .


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## memetic (Aug 2, 2008)

treemandan said:


> Short shorts?



Very short shorts. Remember the early eighties. Those.


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