# Milling some small Juniper in the basement



## Brmorgan (Jun 19, 2009)

I've been thinking of making some small wood boxes to hold the fishing flies that I've tied and I thought that Juniper would make a perfect wood for that. I'm not sure if the strong scent would affect the usability of the flies though - the wood would either probably have to be sealed on the inside, or just used for displaying. Anyway I went out for a drive with my uncle today to see if I could round up a decent tree for a trial run. Here's what I came home with:











I know, some of you guys in the southwestern States might scoff at it, but any juniper over 8" up here is a rarity. The largest log is about 5' long by 8" at one end and 6" at the other. I was going to mill the works up tonight on my bandsaw sled mill, but after trying in vain for an hour to get it to track the rip blade, I discovered that the cast aluminum housing of the band tensioner and tracking assembly is pretty much crumbling away along its pivot points so the wheel wouldn't stay straight. Cheap POS Chinese :censored: casting! I don't think it was designed to withstand the tension necessary for a 3/4" X 104" band. Gotta call Ridgid tomorrow for a new one I guess. I'm going to see if I can talk my way into a replacement for free, but if not it'll be about $20.

So since that wasn't going to work, I cut the log on the left in the photo into 2 18" pieces and one just under a foot. I squared two sides of these with the 041AVS and proceeded to mill them down with the tablesaw. This is what I ended up with:






Actually I did have four more pieces that I forgot about before I took that picture, so I had a little more than what's shown there. Everything's between 4-6" wide and all 3/4" thick except for a couple "leftovers" that are random thickness.

Got a couple nice fairly-bookmatched pieces too:





And even some really nice figured grain:




Though keep in mind that's a closeup of about a 2.5" X 3" area adjacent to a big knot. Still would make for a really nice tool handle or kitchen utensil of some sort.


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## deeker (Jun 19, 2009)

Dammit.....you forgot to post the smell.

Looks great!!!!


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## Brmorgan (Jun 19, 2009)

Oh yeah, I did forget to mention that they're all simmering away nicely in my kiln box right now at 90F. Since that's in the basement, the whole house smells like a blanket chest right now! I was actually headed downstairs pretty soon to check up on it before I head to bed. Which brings me to the other use I had in mind for some Juniper wood, and that is to line a blanket chest I plan on building for my mom. She's gotten into quilting quite a bit in the last couple years so it was a project idea for next year's Mother's Day or something.

It's going to take a while to learn how best to saw these logs to grade. What with the generally twisted nature of the trees and all the bark inclusions and furrows in the log, it can make it hard to read the log before cracking it open.

Edit: I also forgot to post a pic of the nice bright red noodle pile I made while ripping the sides off of the round logs. Trying to figure out a use for them.


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## Stihlman441 (Jun 19, 2009)

Never herd of that wood but it looks great,make afew fly boxes and sell them to ya mates.


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## Brmorgan (Jun 19, 2009)

It's a member of the Cypress family along with the cedars. If you know of "aromatic" or "incense" cedar, this stuff smells and looks pretty much the same. It only grows in very dry areas and even a small tree can be decades old.


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## Taxed Mind (Jun 19, 2009)

*Gin anyone?*

It is the berries of the juniper tree which is used to flavour plain grain spirit to turn it into gin.


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## BobL (Jun 19, 2009)

Brmorgan said:


> Though keep in mind that's a closeup of about a 2.5" X 3" area adjacent to a big knot. Still would make for a really nice tool handle or kitchen utensil of some sort.



I'm drooling on this stuff - really really nice. How hard is it?


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## Brmorgan (Jun 19, 2009)

I don't know exactly how hard it is but I'd say probably harder than all of the Spruces, Pines, and True Firs, maybe not quite as hard as Larch or Hemlock but it's up there.


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## bigbadbob (Jun 19, 2009)

Brad if you are ever in the Cache Creek or Deadmans River area the juniper there gets quite large. Sure has a nice grain. My bro built a ton of fly boxes from juniper. Yours is looking good. Maybe Clearance has seen some bigger stuff around his area also??


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## redprospector (Jun 19, 2009)

I'm in the southwest, and I have one rule I never break. Never, ever scoff at Juniper of any size!! A lot of what I cut winds up being 1x6, and 1x4.

The Juniper you have is a little different than what we have here, but I like.

One of my friends got some Juniper 6x6's out of Mexico because he didn't want to pay the price for it here. He got it and it's totally different than what he started with. So he either has to scrap what he's already done and start over, or buy some more from a local and start a new project with his Mexican Juniper. 

Andy


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## deeker (Jun 19, 2009)

We can get some pretty good sized (for Utah) around here.











A larger slab.


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## outdoorlivin247 (Jun 19, 2009)

deeker said:


> Dammit.....you forgot to post the smell.
> 
> Looks great!!!!



Got to love those scratch and sniff threads...


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## deeker (Jun 19, 2009)

outdoorlivin247 said:


> Got to love those scratch and sniff threads...



I second that....even the wood cutting and milling ones.....


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## pastryguyhawaii (Jun 19, 2009)

That is some nice looking wood! Does it keep that color when it's dried and finished?


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## deeker (Jun 19, 2009)

pastryguyhawaii said:


> That is some nice looking wood! Does it keep that color when it's dried and finished?



Yes, if quickly treated....polyurethane...or....if not...it fades to a brownish red.


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## texx (Jun 19, 2009)

there is a lot of great pen blanks in that stuff


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## Brmorgan (Jun 19, 2009)

texx said:


> there is a lot of great pen blanks in that stuff



Yeah that's another thing I've been wanting to get into doing. I don't have my lathe set up quite properly for it yet though, nor do I have one of the little mandrel kits for turning the pieces. Too much fun to be had in the wood shop and not enough time to try everything I want to yet. Hopefully in a couple years I'll have enough invested into equipment and will have learned enough that I can make a pretty steady income between milling and woodworking, and not have to spend 40 hours a week working for someone else.


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## texx (Jun 19, 2009)

good time to start putting timber aside to dry , then when you are equipped to start turning or what ever you decide to do in the wood work dept you have some nice dried timber ready to go ,
so start stashing it away now for later
write the date cut and the timber type on any wood you stash away it will make life a lot easier in 3 or 4 years time.


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## Ted J (Jun 19, 2009)

Brmorgan said:


> Oh yeah, I did forget to mention that they're all simmering away nicely in my kiln box right now at 90F. Since that's in the basement, the whole house smells like a blanket chest right now! I was actually headed downstairs pretty soon to check up on it before I head to bed. Which brings me to the other use I had in mind for some Juniper wood, and that is to line a blanket chest I plan on building for my mom. She's gotten into quilting quite a bit in the last couple years so it was a project idea for next year's Mother's Day or something.
> 
> It's going to take a while to learn how best to saw these logs to grade. What with the generally twisted nature of the trees and all the bark inclusions and furrows in the log, it can make it hard to read the log before cracking it open.
> 
> Edit: I also forgot to post a pic of the nice bright red noodle pile I made while ripping the sides off of the round logs. Trying to figure out a use for them.



I want to hear about this kiln box in the basement, and see a couple pictures. Unless you've posted about it in another thread somewhere else???
Ted

Oh... and that is some nice looking Juniper you got there!!!!


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## dustytools (Jun 19, 2009)

texx said:


> there is a lot of great pen blanks in that stuff



Yes sir!! I have about 20-25 Red Cedar blanks in my blank bin down at the shop.


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## redprospector (Jun 19, 2009)

Our Juniper looks a little different than the Juniper North, and West of here. There was a thread about it a year or so back, but I can"t remember what it was called.
Here's some I made V-T&G out of for a wall in our house.







Here's what the bark on our Juniper looks like.





One on the mill.





Here's a little stack, air drying in the yard before the monsoon's hit.





Andy


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## Brmorgan (Jun 20, 2009)

That's Alligator Juniper (no surprise there judging by the pic). Pretty much only native to Arizona and New Mexico. Incidentally it can also grow to be one of the largest of the Junipers. Its color looks almost like a yellow pine, but the grain is much nicer.

Ted - It's your lucky day. I did in fact just post a thread regarding my kiln box a few weeks ago. It's over here:
http://www.arboristsite.com/showthread.php?t=98381


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## redprospector (Jun 20, 2009)

Yep, Alligator Juniper is what it's called locally (I can't remember it's scientific name though).
It can grow pretty large. I have a customer that wants me to mill some 30" logs when I can get to them.
I really like the color in the stuff you're milling. There are some trees around here that has bark real similar to what you showed, but I've never had the privilage of cutting one. They are few, and far between.

Andy


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## Brmorgan (Jun 22, 2009)

Well after three nights in the kiln box - one with just the heatlamps and the last two with the dehumidifier - at 110°F, the white sapwood has gone from an average of 55% moisture content down to a fairly constant 9-10%. I'm amazed at how little loss there was to splits and warping. The only small splits and shakes to speak of were either in the pith center or radiating from a bark inclusion. The 3/4" boards have cupped very little so far, maybe 1/32" over a 5" wide piece. I did have probably 75 lbs. of weight or more on top of them during the drying process though. Either way, I'm really impressed with the stability of this stuff. It was not at all what I expected, since these trees grow only in open, windswept areas and are so knotty and twisted as a result. I'm starting to get soooo many ideas for this stuff, and no idea how to get enough of it. 



bigbadbob said:


> Brad if you are ever in the Cache Creek or Deadmans River area the juniper there gets quite large. Sure has a nice grain. My bro built a ton of fly boxes from juniper. Yours is looking good. Maybe Clearance has seen some bigger stuff around his area also??



Yeah I've seen some pretty big ones down that way, also along the Fraser around the Big Bar area. But if anyone in the BC Interior or Okanagan has access to a decent quantity of large juniper logs, let me know. It may be worth a few hours' drive depending on the logs. Bob, did your brother seal the inside of the box with Polyurethane or some such? I'm just wondering whether the strong scent of the juniper wood would affect the usability of the flies inside? Of course this wouldn't be an issue if the box was just used for display or decorative purposes, and to be honest I wouldn't really want to take a nice wood box out to be tossed around the boat very much either.


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## clearance (Jun 22, 2009)

bigbadbob said:


> Brad if you are ever in the Cache Creek or Deadmans River area the juniper there gets quite large. Sure has a nice grain. My bro built a ton of fly boxes from juniper. Yours is looking good. Maybe Clearance has seen some bigger stuff around his area also??



Hi Bob. Yes, I have seen it, nice wood. Rare, like yew.


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## billstuewe (Jun 22, 2009)

Something else to consider---normally you do not want to Kiln dry cedar because the heat will destroy/lesson the smell. It air drys very fast--usually a couple of weeks at the most and is also quite stable.
Bill


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## Brmorgan (Jun 28, 2009)

Went for a ride on the quad this afternoon out on the back trails to an area that I thought might have some Junipers after looking at it on Google Earth. It's about 6 miles away so it's not exactly close to the house, but it turns out there is a good supply of Junipers around 6" diameter or larger there. I found one tree that had been dropped and the bottom 5 feet or so was missing - looks like someone had the same idea as me a couple years ago. There is literally a skid trail only a few years old directly to the spot I found, so it's fairly easy access - the only problem is that it's on a fairly steep hillside, at least steep enough that I wouldn't dare sidehill with the ATV. 

Anyway I managed to come home with five 40-inch logs around 6-7 inches, an 18" piece about 7" round at one end and 6" x 12" at the other, with some center rot at the base. Also got a few miscellaneous smaller crotches and the like for spoons or whatnot. This stuff for whatever reason has a significantly thinner sapwood band - maybe 1/2" at most, instead of 1 to 1-1/2" of the stuff I cut a few days ago. Not that I'm complaining!





In a related story, this also happened today:





The big Douglas Fir you can see at the far left center of the picture was across the old skid road I was following, and since I only had my little Poulan 335/16" with me I didn't feel like tackling a >2' center-suspended log that would need some extra work to avoid pinching. So I fought my way through the trees and made a temporary ride-around, but when I came back over the bulldozed edge of the skid road the one wheel caught a high point I didn't see and tipped the quad over onto the sides of the wheels. Nobody hurt and no damage done, and it didn't come close to completely rolling so that was good. Thank heavens for winches though! There was no way I was going to roll it back over _uphill_ the old-fashioned way alone. If this was my dad's older 400 2-stroke I could pretty much throw it around however I needed to, but mine is significantly heavier. I cut some stakes with the saw and drove them into the ground to block the tires so the quad couldn't slide, and then attached the winch cable up higher on a tree 90° in the direction I wanted to flip it, and pulled it right over. Barely strained the winch at all. The whole situation had me worried for a bit though.


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## Texas Traveler (Jun 28, 2009)

Brmorgan we call it mountain cedar here in North Texas.

There are some in South Dallas that grow to 50 ft or better with 18 to 20 inch trunks.

Most of the old growth is straight as a pine 

There a coule of sawmillers here that are in business for the local craftmens.


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## wavefreak (Jun 28, 2009)

Beautiful wood. Seems to me that Juniper like that would make a good trade for some maple or walnut.


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## Brmorgan (Jun 29, 2009)

Sounds good to me, but I doubt the shipping costs would be worth it between our locations. 

Today I built a makeshift Logosol-type mill on my tablesaw to mill the logs I brought back yesterday. It isn't the prettiest setup and it isn't very easy to adjust but it got the job done for the few little logs I wanted to do.






My tablesaw isn't anything fancy, just an old Rockwell I got for $50 at a yard sale. I only really bought it for the working 1hp motor. It has a 4' homemade extension with a plywood top, which usually doubles as my saw workbench as well. The fence guide rail is a 6' long 2" squaretube, so I cut some 1' long Birch pieces to fit snugly into the ends of the squaretube. I built a guide board assembly from a 3.5" X 1-3/4" Douglas Fir board, with 15-1/2" X 1-3/4" square pieces of Birch on the ends for depth posts. These were clamped to the wood posts at the ends of the table saw at whatever depth necessary. The Fir board is plenty rigid enough to support my homemade Mini-Mill jig with a small saw. And yes, that _is_ my Homelite XL-2 bravely stepping up for some milling duties. 26cc but it chewed right through the 5" - 8" pieces. It was handy because since it was a top-handle, I could push the saw and mill with one hand and steady the log with the other if necessary. And it's so small that with the door wide open and a box fan blowing out the door, fumes and smoke weren't an issue either.





Backside view of the log and jig. To secure the log, I cut some random 2X2 scraps I had lying around at 45° and these were pushed up to the side of the log to cradle it. Since the top of the table is just some old greasy plywood, I didn't mind running screws through it to secure these pieces.





First cut is off. This is the smallest of the logs. I didn't get this one secured well enough and it rolled a bit as the chain pulled on it. The cut was off-square end to end by at least 15°. To mitigate this for future cuts, I took a third 2X2 with a 45° end and put it up against the log with the sharp part of the angle at the top, to dig into the log and keep it from turning. This secured it REALLY well.





To avoid any more waste than absolutely necessary, I wanted to split these further on the tablesaw rather than using the CSM. Not to mention it was a lot faster that way too. I only needed to square three sides as the fourth could be ripped off with the tablesaw. The near end of this log ended up nice and square, but you can see the first twisted cut at the far end. 





The very bottom piece of the tree was about 18" long, 7" round at one end and about 7" X 12" at the other but very irregular. It also had some heavy center rot in the part above the guide board in this photo, so i wanted to cull that off and get the log back to more of a consistent size. I just raised one end of the guide and re-clamped it. Worked great.


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## Brmorgan (Jun 29, 2009)

Here are the cants I was able to get from those logs. Three a little under 5" and one around 6", all 40" long, and then the odd base piece. Not a bad result for the first run.





And here is what I got out of them after the tablesaw did its thing. The three rows on the far right are all 1/2" thick, then the 6" wide stack next to that are all 3/4" thick. The center pieces are all 1-3/4" thick as I have some plans for some thicker stock. The last four pieces on the left (and a couple not in the photo) are the edgings that are mostly random thickness and may only produce small usable pieces.





Just a closer view of the pieces. Good heavens I love the look and smell of this stuff.





All loaded up into the kiln, just needs some weight on top. I didn't set it very hot for overnight. I do agree that kilning probably removes some of the smell of the wood too, but if so it isn't a lot because the ones I kilned still smell great. The smell decreases a fair amount as the wood dries no matter what though. As does the color - that beautiful deep burgundy color fades slightly brownish as it dries, though a good finish will restore a lot of the color.


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## BIG JAKE (Jun 29, 2009)

Sharp Brad-well worth the effort. You could build a nice chest with that. Thks for posting


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## wavefreak (Jun 29, 2009)

Beautiful wood.

How did you deal with the exhaust fumes from the saw? People commit suicide doing that stuff indoors.


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## Brmorgan (Jun 29, 2009)

I left the door open with a big box fan blowing out full-bore and it seemed to keep things pretty clear. Not to mention that I would make one 30-45 second cut and then have to spend a few minutes making adjustments and re-securing the log for the next cut, so I wasn't going hard at it. Now if I had been taking slabs off a cant with the 066, that would be another story!


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## arbadacarba (Jun 29, 2009)

If you have any really grungy looking pieces left ,that are relatively solid, try turning it. It comes up beautifully for small bowls.

The pieces where the branch hits the trunk are also in demand by native carvers for adze handles. They have just the right combination of springiness and strength


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