# Is there any Good News?



## Fireaxman (Mar 17, 2006)

I'm new at climbing trees with a chain saw, but it's obvious from my own near misses and from reading this forum that a lot can go wrong when you combine climbing (hazardous) with chainsaws (also hazardous). Of 6 professional climbers who have worked for me or whom I have worked with, 4 have had life threatening and/or permanently debilitating injuries. Is there any good news? Is there anyone out there who has worked in this industry longer than, perhaps, 10 years - without a lost time injury?


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## clearance (Mar 17, 2006)

Fireaxman said:


> I'm new at climbing trees with a chain saw, but it's obvious from my own near misses and from reading this forum that a lot can go wrong when you combine climbing (hazardous) with chainsaws (also hazardous). Of 6 professional climbers who have worked for me or whom I have worked with, 4 have had life threatening and/or permanently debilitating injuries. Is there any good news? Is there anyone out there who has worked in this industry longer than, perhaps, 10 years - without a lost time injury?


No, and no


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## coydog (Mar 17, 2006)

I've been climbing for 9 years and i've not cut myself (or my chaps or climbing rope) with chainsaw. I've done some very heavy production work during this time, and I can't say that I won't cut myself or otherwise have an accident tomorrow. I've been banged up pretty good and gone on a few days light light duty here and there but never a serious or debilitating accident (yet). And I can say the same for many climbers with more experience than myself. Good safety must be ingrained through training and self discipline. There are lots of protocols out there to keep you safe, the trick is to implement them into your routine and then stick to them.


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## coydog (Mar 17, 2006)

so... one year to go


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## climber1966 (Mar 17, 2006)

*28 years*

been at it 28 years...cant count the problems on all 9 fingers....:greenchainsaw:


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## TreeLady (Mar 17, 2006)

Please tell me you are joking...or are you really one finger lighter?


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## sjkezar (Mar 17, 2006)

*This is Dangerous, but...*

Currently, the industry of arboriculture is the 5th most dangerous industry in the US according to deaths per 100,000 workers. However, the most common injury or fatality is not from climbers, it is from people being struck-by or hit by objects on the ground (ie. chainsaws, falling trees, branches etc.
). Of tree climbing injuries, being struck by a chainsaw or falling are the two highest ranking categories. Furthermore, when injuries are sustained, they are usually severe and require medical services care.
As far as climbing is concerned. When injuries happen they are also from struck-bys or exposure (electrical). Research results are sketchy for climber accident data. This can be helped by better recording and data collection by tree care companies when any accident occurs, even if it is a scrap that needs a band aid.
The rest of this information and more can be found my reading a thesis published last year by Shane Vosberg and Dr. John Ball at South Dakota State University. That is the source of this information.
Proper accident prevention and safety training comes from proper recording and reporting of accidents. Please take the time to report and record and accidents that happen in your company.


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## clearance (Mar 17, 2006)

sjkezar said:


> Currently, the industry of arboriculture is the 5th most dangerous industry in the US according to deaths per 100,000 workers. However, the most common injury or fatality is not from climbers, it is from people being struck-by or hit by objects on the ground (ie. chainsaws, falling trees, branches etc.
> ). Of tree climbing injuries, being struck by a chainsaw or falling are the two highest ranking categories. Furthermore, when injuries are sustained, they are usually severe and require medical services care.
> As far as climbing is concerned. When injuries happen they are also from struck-bys or exposure (electrical). Research results are sketchy for climber accident data. This can be helped by better recording and data collection by tree care companies when any accident occurs, even if it is a scrap that needs a band aid.
> The rest of this information and more can be found my reading a thesis published last year by Shane Vosberg and Dr. John Ball at South Dakota State University. That is the source of this information.
> Proper accident prevention and safety training comes from proper recording and reporting of accidents. Please take the time to report and record and accidents that happen in your company.


http://www.isa-arbor.com/publications/arbnews/apr04/feature2.aspx There you go. The report about why it happens. Shane and Johnny


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## oldugly (Mar 17, 2006)

Yup there is good news
Been at it for well over 25 years now, no lost time injuries...several that have hurt for awhile, but never stopped me from working the next day. Never, no matter how good you are....think that you are too good to learn...or too macho to not take risks....or fast enough to take short cuts. It IS a dangerous business. The old climbers know they are lucky to be old, and respect the dangers they face. The good news...respect the industry for what it is, and you are accomplishing everyday what others look at as the "impossible".


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## sjkezar (Mar 17, 2006)

*More to come*



clearance said:


> http://www.isa-arbor.com/publications/arbnews/apr04/feature2.aspx There you go. The report about why it happens. Shane and Johnny




That is part of the research that I am talking about. There is more to just that article. The full thesis can be found through the South Dakota State University Library. More research will be out soon.
By the way, so you know these to gentleman personally to be referring to them as Jonny and Shane? Please show respect.


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## clearance (Mar 18, 2006)

sjkezar said:


> That is part of the research that I am talking about. There is more to just that article. The full thesis can be found through the South Dakota State University Library. More research will be out soon.
> By the way, so you know these to gentleman personally to be referring to them as Jonny and Shane? Please show respect.


Get lost, what do you want me to bend down and worship them?, I know ISA guys have a pretty high opinion of themselves but get real. That article tells you all you really need to know, I especially like how it acknowledges the fact that arborists are increasingly outsmarting themselves by rigging of more than the tree can handle.


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## Eagle1 (Mar 18, 2006)

View attachment 32350


very lucky at 75 feet. 200t


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## Xtra (Mar 18, 2006)

There are two types of tree guys . . . those that have been injured and those that are going to be.

I heard at a seminar that we account for 1/3 a percent of the total US work force, but also 6% of the fatalities.

Usually the reports show us at a lower level because we are grouped in with the "green industry" (landscapers, etc). 
Most dangerous in the green industry are loggers/fallers and then arborist/residential guys.


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## Fireaxman (Mar 18, 2006)

oldugly said:


> Yup there is good news
> Been at it for well over 25 years now, no lost time injuries...several that have hurt for awhile, but never stopped me from working the next day. Never, no matter how good you are....think that you are too good to learn...or too macho to not take risks....or fast enough to take short cuts. It IS a dangerous business. The old climbers know they are lucky to be old, and respect the dangers they face. The good news...respect the industry for what it is, and you are accomplishing everyday what others look at as the "impossible".



Many THANKS! and CONGRATULATIONS, oldugly! There's hope! But it is pretty sobering that I've only gotten two positive responses so far in this thread. 

So, I guess I'ld better just stay sober.

Thanks also for the references to the work by Vosberge and Ball. It helps to recognize where the biggest risks are.


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## clearance (Mar 18, 2006)

Fireaxman said:


> Many THANKS! and CONGRATULATIONS, oldugly! There's hope! But it is pretty sobering that I've only gotten two positive responses so far in this thread.
> 
> So, I guess I'ld better just stay sober.
> 
> Thanks also for the references to the work by Vosberge and Ball. It helps to recognize where the biggest risks are.


That'll be Mr. Vosberg and Mr. Ball to you, show a little respect.


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## Xtra (Mar 19, 2006)

Not to split hairs, but it's actually -- Dr. John Ball.
He's a great guy & presenter if you ever have the chance to see or meet him.


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## climber1966 (Mar 20, 2006)

*no have all ten*

no I was joking ...but have witnessed alot of accidents...95% on the ground but the ones in the tree were doozies....I believe that if a climber feals safe and protects his gear and knows the proper use of it he is safe. 28 years has taught me well to also respect the fact that even now I dont know it all.....it scares me to think that there are climbers out there that think they are the masters of the trade but there are...they are the accidents waiting to happen..its called overconfidence.....I have learned more in the last ten years then all the years prior...mostly from younger climbers.


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## oldugly (Apr 2, 2006)

*stay sober?*

Jeesh if you stayed sober all the time you could never be a tree man...the kind of work we do....you might as well have a hangover. Nine times out of ten its gonna hurt anyway....LOL

Seriously...I don't drink too much anymore...but almost every one i know in this industry is either a drunk, or an ex-drunk.


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