# How does your company pay?



## maloufstree (Mar 2, 2010)

I was just wondering how companies pay their guys. Hourly, day rate or salary. I try to guarantee my lead guy so many days a week and have been able to for the last 3 year but with the slow months and the exceptional wet months this year it has been a financial burden on the biz. Just wanted to see what everyone else did to keep help.

Thanks, 
Craig


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## mckeetree (Mar 2, 2010)

Howdy neighbor. I pay employees strictly by the hour. There is one guy here that has his own little business that I contract quite a bit of work to. You have to keep an open mind with a situation like that though because he is his own man and sometimes I end up bidding against him and he gets the job, but that's just business. You have to let good regular employees get some hours somehow when it is slow or they are gone. I do that but it gets mucho expensive. We have an accident plan, paid vacation, bonus plan and some other things I do to keep them around. I have had years I didn't make any money whatsoever but it was either keep them working or go out of business.


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## maloufstree (Mar 2, 2010)

mckeetree said:


> Howdy neighbor. I pay employees strictly by the hour. There is one guy here that has his own little business that I contract quite a bit of work to. You have to keep an open mind with a situation like that though because he is his own man and sometimes I end up bidding against him and he gets the job, but that's just business. You have to let good regular employees get some hours somehow when it is slow or they are gone. I do that but it gets mucho expensive. We have an accident plan, paid vacation, bonus plan and some other things I do to keep them around. I have had years I didn't make any money whatsoever but it was either keep them working or go out of business.



Thanks for the imput Mr. Mckee I have had some really good years in the past but this year is about to kill me. How many hrs a week do you try to give them on weeks when you have no work that can be done? It's really becoming a big weight on my shoulders, not because the work is not there but we have work from as far back as Sept. on the books.(STILL TO WET) Work has been consistant through the winter but the bigger stuff has to wait till it dries out so I have a lot of large (2-3 day) jobs and quiet a few good money removals on the books. Just hope it dries out before it kills me.


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## mckeetree (Mar 3, 2010)

maloufstree said:


> Thanks for the imput Mr. Mckee I have had some really good years in the past but this year is about to kill me. How many hrs a week do you try to give them on weeks when you have no work that can be done? It's really becoming a big weight on my shoulders, not because the work is not there but we have work from as far back as Sept. on the books.(STILL TO WET) Work has been consistant through the winter but the bigger stuff has to wait till it dries out so I have a lot of large (2-3 day) jobs and quiet a few good money removals on the books. Just hope it dries out before it kills me.



I give them a minimum of 24 hours a week. I've got my breaking point though. If it ever gets bad enough I will just have to call them together and say "Well boys, I guess that's about it." I guess that's where I go to work for the hardware store.


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## maloufstree (Mar 3, 2010)

mckeetree said:


> Howdy neighbor. I pay employees strictly by the hour. There is one guy here that has his own little business that I contract quite a bit of work to. You have to keep an open mind with a situation like that though because he is his own man and sometimes I end up bidding against him and he gets the job, but that's just business. You have to let good regular employees get some hours somehow when it is slow or they are gone. I do that but it gets mucho expensive. We have an accident plan, paid vacation, bonus plan and some other things I do to keep them around. I have had years I didn't make any money whatsoever but it was either keep them working or go out of business.



I you dont mind me asking, why do you contract out work to the other guy?


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## RAG66 (Mar 3, 2010)

Pardon me for geting in on your disscusion but here it goes. I pay hourly only unless there is a good reason to pay for the whole day. If we get tips I usualy give it to the guys or if it is me and one guy I split it. I can not provide any insurance but I do have L&I. I usualy have between 1-3 guys on the books during the year. I will say I have a very small company though. Just one truck and chipper. Work load is 2-4 days / week. I want more but seem to grow slowly.


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## mckeetree (Mar 3, 2010)

maloufstree said:


> I you dont mind me asking, why do you contract out work to the other guy?



There are a couple reasons. One, it is a no obligation relationship. I feel obligated to employees and if work is sporadic (like it is now) I hesitate to bring another full time climber in and then things fall off to nothing for three weeks and there I am getting him some hours at a climbers wages and not really making anything. With a sub-contractor if there is no work there is no work. You never guaranteed anything to begin with. Second, I have a pretty high overhead. You may have heard we are not crazy about jobs that pay less than $700.00 or so. In fact I do everything I can to avoid them. But if you have some guy that will run in there and do some little old job you bid $450.00 on for $250.00 and you don't have to touch it, well, that's $200.00 dollars. I worked a full crew all day today in Brownsboro and probably didn't clear more than $200.00. On a side note, have you ever wondered how those Mexican Tree Services in Athens like Lupe work so cheap? I wondered for years. The fact is they don't pay their climbers ####. It never computed to me because when those guys look for work they tell you Poncho so and so was paying them big money per hour. It took me years to figure out Mexicans base their existence on not being up front with you.


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## maloufstree (Mar 3, 2010)

mckeetree said:


> There are a couple reasons. One, it is a no obligation relationship. I feel obligated to employees and if work is sporadic (like it is now) I hesitate to bring another full time climber in and then things fall off to nothing for three weeks and there I am getting him some hours at a climbers wages and not really making anything. With a sub-contractor if there is no work there is no work. You never guaranteed anything to begin with. Second, I have a pretty high overhead. You may have heard we are not crazy about jobs that pay less than $700.00 or so. In fact I do everything I can to avoid them. But if you have some guy that will run in there and do some little old job you bid $450.00 on for $250.00 and you don't have to touch it, well, that's $200.00 dollars. I worked a full crew all day today in Brownsboro and probably didn't clear more than $200.00. On a side note, have you ever wondered how those Mexican Tree Services in Athens like Lupe work so cheap? I wondered for years. The fact is they don't pay their climbers ####. It never computed to me because when those guys look for work they tell you Poncho so and so was paying them big money per hour. It took me years to figure out Mexicans base their existence on not being up front with you.



I see, well this I guess my thread was just a way for me to vent with my frustration. I've made an obligation with this man three years ago, and to be honest I couldn't have a better employee. I don't know what kind of overhead you have but I feel that my is pretty high, and its just frustrating when the last few months I feel as if I should have become a "swamp logger"


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## maloufstree (Mar 3, 2010)

RAG66 said:


> Pardon me for geting in on your disscusion but here it goes. I pay hourly only unless there is a good reason to pay for the whole day. If we get tips I usualy give it to the guys or if it is me and one guy I split it. I can not provide any insurance but I do have L&I. I usualy have between 1-3 guys on the books during the year. I will say I have a very small company though. Just one truck and chipper. Work load is 2-4 days / week. I want more but seem to grow slowly.



I posted this for anyone to jump in. I appreciated the reply.


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## maloufstree (Mar 4, 2010)

Our bread and butter jobs are all the smaller jobs. On all the bigger jobs everyone says were too GD expensive!!! Lupe is another story Mr. Mckee, I don't understand how you can keep anyone paying the kind of wages that he pays his guys. I wish I had a dollar for every time someone said to me in Athens "Well Lupe said he would do it for X dollars" Anyways thats another subject, Thanks for all your imput, at least it makes me feel better about the situation.


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## ozarktreeman (Mar 6, 2010)

maloufstree said:


> I see, well this I guess my thread was just a way for me to vent with my frustration. I've made an obligation with this man three years ago, and to be honest I couldn't have a better employee. I don't know what kind of overhead you have but I feel that my is pretty high, and its just frustrating when the last few months I feel as if I should have become a "swamp logger"




maloufstree,sounds like were in the same boat.I too am a small outfit.
And like you am nestled in a area were tree,s are plentiful,and have a guy my climber that I have somewhat adopted.When work is slow and fortunately this is the 1st year that I have had to deal with it in this extreme.But I can always pull in some others gigs,my climber cannot he's a one trick pony.But I always make room for him in whatever i,m working on.So I understand your loyalty to your guys.Some times it,s hard.but when they have p/u the pace for you and listened to your bichin and moaning and any other crap that you deal with on a daily basis in this bus.what other choice do you have.
Yea I have made a few sacrifices and so has he.I just try to keep it going as long as possible.Then you have no other choice. Good luck! sorry a little long winded tonight must be the crown. Answer by the hour and I make some adjustments when necessary.


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## maloufstree (Mar 8, 2010)

ozarktreeman said:


> maloufstree,sounds like were in the same boat.I too am a small outfit.
> And like you am nestled in a area were tree,s are plentiful,and have a guy my climber that I have somewhat adopted.When work is slow and fortunately this is the 1st year that I have had to deal with it in this extreme.But I can always pull in some others gigs,my climber cannot he's a one trick pony.But I always make room for him in whatever i,m working on.So I understand your loyalty to your guys.Some times it,s hard.but when they have p/u the pace for you and listened to your bichin and moaning and any other crap that you deal with on a daily basis in this bus.what other choice do you have.
> Yea I have made a few sacrifices and so has he.I just try to keep it going as long as possible.Then you have no other choice. Good luck! sorry a little long winded tonight must be the crown. Answer by the hour and I make some adjustments when necessary.



I appreciate your imput Ozark. I just get really frustrated with it sometimes and wonder even thought I'm doing something that I love is it really worth it?
Then I vent a little and it makes me feel better so like I said I appreciate your imput.


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