# Belt and rope on my next list



## Rygel (Dec 20, 2005)

Been working a second job to buy my own equipment (our work uses the old thick leather belts). So what i was thinking was going with the new type steel corded flipline,a new type nylon belt (look more comfortable),and my own spikes. Our supervisor gives each climber there own true blue so mines still new and hasnt been spiked! 
Being a heavier climber (245) are the aluminum spikes ok?
also are the nylon belts that much more comfortable?good for heavier guys?
any problems from the mircosenders on the fliplines? just seems not having a "knot" there would have some problems with slipping.
Currently our company spikes every tree we cant get with our trucks(prunning also) I hope to learn some new techniques soon so I'll be asking about other equipment soon!
any help and what types seem to be working for you would be great! -jimmy


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## fmueller (Dec 20, 2005)

There is alot of good reading to be had on websites and books. There is a wide variety of equipment out there to choose from so educate yourself thoroughly before shelling out the cash so you don't have regrets. I'm sure you'll be guided to "the tree climbers companion" if you have'nt been already. Maybe you can educate your employer in a delicate way about proper pruning practices in the future. Good luck. T


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## Redbull (Dec 20, 2005)

Go to Sherrills website. Click on the Ad above. Order both catalogs (recreational and the Arborists). Those catalogs in themselves are great resources, and you can order the books and gear that you'll need from the catalog. The mechanical devices used for rope work is very reliable but like any other piece of gear, it needs to be inspected EVERY TIME you use it. Have fun and be safe.


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## Rygel (Dec 20, 2005)

are most of you using the nylon type belts now? I have been looking at the catalogs at work and all i can find on the net. But i have no one to actually say what belts they perfer or why they think one isnt so good.I see a good belt that says "the competion guys use this one the most" but is it gonna be applicible to proper tree work? Due to the guys i work with are all old school. as in ,no helmets while climbing, most dont use a flipline 90% of the time, cant even help me in non spike climbing. (most are old school asplundh) so they have taught there ways to even us new guys. And i see where there is so much to improve on just at this site! Much less all the other stuff out there. anyone actually using aluminum spike? are they worth the extra buck?


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## Stumper (Dec 21, 2005)

Jimmy, The Ness Work Saddle from New Tribe is a very comfortable saddle. The Komet Butterfly is very popular amongst the competion climbers -and most of them work in it to-Most who try it love it - a few hate it. The Buckingham Master is decent saddle-but a little pricey IMO because it isn't as comfy as a Komet , or Tree austria or Ness but costs more than the Ness and almost as much as the European saddles(Komet and Tree Austria). Many guys like the Buckingham Versatile. The old Weaver 1040 is comfortable saddle when lanyarded in to a spar but it isn't very comfortable to hang in. The Weaver 1038 exchanges the 1040 buttstrap for individual leg loops-many guys like it but others complain of pinching of the private parts. I'm not sure what you mean when you speak of leather Belts. Are you climbing in a Lineman's Belt? The better Weavers have leather backpads but the structural stength is in the nylon webbing. Karl Kuemmerling still sell ropestrung leather saddles- the strength is inthe rope-the leather is padding. If you are climbing in one of those - almost any saddle beyond the "basic" Weaver and Buckingham "Suislide" Buttstraps will be an improvement.

Aluminium shanked Gaffs are rated for guys of our weight(I'm 245 too). So are theGraphite composite shanked climbers.


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## Dadatwins (Dec 21, 2005)

Saddle preference will be different for everyone, Try to get somewhere, trade show, arborist supply, and try on a few, it is hard to buy one out of a catalog.
I started with the old leather weaver style buttstrap and now have a Blair ultra-light leg-strap. Much more comfortable. Aluminum / titanium spikes are just as strong as steel and they are lighter. As for the extra cost vs. weight another matter of opinion, I used my steel buckinghams w/leather straps for 15 years and always liked them, because I knew nothing different. Now I have the titanium bucks with velcro straps and would not go back to the old ones. Good luck in your search.


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## Rygel (Dec 22, 2005)

Thanks much for the great info! Guess I'm gonna have to wait for the next rain day and take the 3 hr drive to the closest outlet. And yes i mean a nylon type belt with all the leather padding. Its just basic cheap stuff that our company provides. Ans we have to share....... Not that i like that idea .


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## Redbull (Dec 22, 2005)

Do you do line clearance work or residential? If your company allows it, I would definately get my own gear. Especially saddle, rope, and lanyard. Your life depends on this gear and I trust very few people with my life so don't share if you don't have to. Sharing climbing gear is like sharing needles if you know what I mean. When I worked with Asplundh, we were assigned equipment, and thats all we could use. No personal gear, and we had to use a TLH for our friction hitch, no Blakes. It made climbing on my own gear that much more appreciated. It would be worth the drive to get the right fit for your saddle.


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## skwerl (Dec 22, 2005)

Nothing wrong with starting out with the basics. I climbed on a Karl Kummerling (same as a Weaver) basic buttstrap saddle for years and thought it was great. I averaged 5-7 years of use from a saddle and they cost about $70 each. Moved up to a $150 Buckingham and it lasted 2-3 years. Today I'm in my second $250+ Tree Austria Duo and my first one lasted less than a year. 

So keep in mind that the more expensive saddles are usually selling light weight and comfort at the expense of durability.


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## Redbull (Dec 22, 2005)

That's a good point you made about durability.


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## okietreedude1 (Dec 22, 2005)

If you are wanting to learn spikeless climbing, Id switch companies....fast.

As for gear, I too climb on the Tree austria and have had mine over a year and its still going strong. Spikes - I have a pair of Al. bashlins that Ive never used. flipline - I use a 12' 11mm blaze w/ a aluminum snap spliced on one end and a small snappy thingy (Im not sure what its called, Nick put it on there) on the other. 

Like was said above, get a Tree Climbers Companion if you dont have one already and definitly shop around. Ask your salesman questions about the gear hes selling. 

Hang around here too. Ask your questions as need be.


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## Rygel (Dec 22, 2005)

Yeah i wish i could just switch companies! But all of the companies here use spikes. everyone at work has buds with them and this is the only way anyone uses here- i have found a guy that works for the power company that knows how to climb spikeless. So im gonna get up with him and pay him alittle to run me through it.
Yes I work for a line clearance company. We contract the local power company. I love the work and strive to do my job right but is hard with everything (almost) i see is improper or "lazily" done. Have one guy that does really well and im on his truck now i think ,so it wil help me alot.
He uses the orange 10' steelcord flipline unless there is some really close line work to do.So i know im gonna get that first. Think my boss will get me a new Blue so i dont have to worry much on that. Thanks all for the comments and help! Asked my foreman if he wanted to ride to greensboro to the Sherrill place on our next rain day. So it looks like I'll be going eventually.


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## dakota (Dec 23, 2005)

I've always been leery about steel core fliplines for most pruning/removals. I can see if you're up with a big saw and want a bit more security against saw knicks but for most work a regular flipline ought to do. What about that one-in-a-million chance that a barberchair event pulls you in and you can't release ascender and can't cut through flipline...ouch.


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## Bermie (Dec 29, 2005)

I have climbed in a Komet butterfly for 2 years, have just finished a course and got to try a lot more, Austrian duo and duo 2, Komet butterfly 2 and evolution, Weaver and Edelrid tree magic.
With 17 others on the course we all had our favourites, what one person liked someone else didn't, it's definitly and individual fit and feel, literally. I bought an Edelrid tree magic for my second harness, it was soooo comfortable and has lots of gear loops and rings all rated 30kg. If you can, try some on and put your weight in them, you don't want a ball buster! 
If you buy a wire core flipline just make sure that you have rope or webbing somewhere in the setup, so if, God forbid you have an accident you can be cut out of the system easily. I use a prussik on my wirecore, and if a micrograb is used a short bit of nylon webbing joins it to the karabiner that clips to the harness.
Someone else mentioned that you don't really need a wirecore if you're not doing removals, I agree, a 12' bit of climbing line with karabiners on both ends and a friction hitch is just fine. 
Pruning with spikes, well enough has been said before, get the Tree Climber's Companion and sit down for a good read. 
Good luck


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## clearance (Dec 30, 2005)

Always a steelcore flipline, always. Dakota, you can cut right through a steelcore flipline with a sharp 020 (but it won't be sharp anymore), I have done it in a moment of stupidity, luckily I was tied in with my rope.


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## rebelman (Dec 31, 2005)

Get a ladder.


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## Rygel (Dec 31, 2005)

All I hear is bad stuff about ladders in trees! 
Well i did find some alum Bashlin spikes for $49 today so i got them. I've read alot of ggod stuff on them.Need to get new spikes for them as the ones in them are for poles. Next check I'm gonna get my flipline i think.


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## Stumper (Dec 31, 2005)

Rygel, Some of us prefer th epole gaffs in trees-much depends upon th especies thta you usually climb and individual style.


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## Rygel (Dec 31, 2005)

Yeah i was looking at them and with my weight i dont think I'd have a problem in most trees. Mostly hard woods but in NC we have way to many pine trees. Of couse I'm heavy enough i run into probs with pulling them out of soft trees!lol! I once hit a tree that wore me slap out from having to wiggle my legs to get the spikes out!


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## dakota (Dec 31, 2005)

$49 seems too cheap for Bashlins. Since they have pole gaffs on they may have belonged to a lineman. I would look really closely at the part of the hook that makes contact with the heel and also the thickness of the bottom. Some utilities do not allow aluminum hooks because they can wear out. Most lineman wear boots that have a steel insert in the heel and the lugs aren't as thick as logging boots. And some have been known to wear their hooks while walking around on asphalt, concrete, in gas stations, to church, weddings...

Anyway, I did linework for awhile and Bashlins were what I was trained on am quite comfortable with them. I worked for cable TV and telephone where safety and training aren't as rigorous as it is with power co's, so this nugget of info did not reach me into I was into arboriculture and no longer wearing lineman's boots. The wearing happens so gradual that it's hard to notice until it's really bad. When I check over my gear I can see just a slight flat spot where the heel insert rubbed.


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## dakota (Dec 31, 2005)

clearance said:


> Always a steelcore flipline, always. Dakota, you can cut right through a steelcore flipline with a sharp 020 (but it won't be sharp anymore), I have done it in a moment of stupidity, luckily I was tied in with my rope.



If you can cut right through steelcore with an 020, then why bother with them?


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## Rygel (Dec 31, 2005)

Thanks for the info. i did look at them close and then again when you wrote this. I can see where they have been on asphalt alittle but it dont see lik emuch wear is on them from that. I also dont see any place where the heel part is wore flat. I can tell they have some wear on them but no more than what we have at work (in which we share). Also I think they were a tree guys due to the belt that was sitting there next to had the same flipline and rope for a chainsaw on it. They wanted $39 for the belt but it was one size to small for me.
I did wonder alittle about aluminum ,due to my weight but i've heard they are all rated around the same. 
I found spikes for $59 at the Sherril site,seems to be cheapest.


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## rebelman (Jan 1, 2006)

the bad stuff you hear about ladders is about ladders left in trees while working. Once you gain access to the tree, the ladder is removed by groundcrew. I get the job done right with ladders, whether a removal or pruning. Of course, on removals, i wear spikes once tied in and off the ladder. Ladders are the only efficient answer for a large percentage of a residential arborists work.


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