# Felling for Firewood



## Jere39 (Jan 9, 2022)

I might operate differently from most of you. I am lucky to live in the middle of the woods, and unlucky to have hundred year old Oaks dying every year. So, I typically let them stand for a couple years till the bark loosens, then cut them down and process them for firewood. I've posted a couple video and pictures of me cutting down a tree, but I am never quite sure where to post them? Scrounging? Hauling? Processing? Not really good matches. So, I started this thread. If I am the only one doing this, or interested in this, it will just fade it's way down the list and off the first page. On the other hand, if others are cutting down trees in the process of making firewood, I'd love to see your work.

First post:

This 24-26" leaner was generally leaning in the right direction, so I only needed a couple degrees of adjust to keep it from seriously damaging a tree in it's path. It's the dead one in the middle of this picture:



I didn't change the bar, so I cut from both sides with my Dolmar PS 6100 and 20" bar.
At the end you can see a little swaying of my "to-be saved" tree.

_(about 2½ minutes)_


I was hoping the snow would make the drag easy, it didn't - my log arch isn't big enough for the bottom section, and my tractor wasn't getting enough traction to move the second section. So, I bucked the first two sections where they dropped:

_(<2 minutes)_


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## H-Ranch (Jan 9, 2022)

Jere39 said:


> I am never quite sure where to post them? Scrounging? Hauling? Processing? Not really good matches.


I enjoy seeing your low impact methods, regardless where you post it. I generally default to the scrounging thread, even if it's from my own property. Sometimes there are even 2 consecutive posts related to firewood there! LOL 

The stuff I'm working on now was all felled I suppose since it came from a tree service. But it doesn't quite fit here either.


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## djg james (Jan 9, 2022)

Man, nice log. Any sawmills in your area? You ever turn any of those logs into lumber?


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## Vtrombly (Jan 9, 2022)

Jere39 said:


> I might operate differently from most of you. I am lucky to live in the middle of the woods, and unlucky to have hundred year old Oaks dying every year. So, I typically let them stand for a couple years till the bark loosens, then cut them down and process them for firewood. I've posted a couple video and pictures of me cutting down a tree, but I am never quite sure where to post them? Scrounging? Hauling? Processing? Not really good matches. So, I started this thread. If I am the only one doing this, or interested in this, it will just fade it's way down the list and off the first page. On the other hand, if others are cutting down trees in the process of making firewood, I'd love to see your work.
> 
> First post:
> 
> ...



I'll tell you what felling aside I'm not going to second guess the role my garden tractor could play in firewood operations. That JD pulled a log just as good as an ATV. Might have to get my craftsman involved now.


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## Jere39 (Jan 9, 2022)

djg james said:


> Man, nice log. Any sawmills in your area? You ever turn any of those logs into lumber?


There are mills in the area. Last year I took about 4 or 5 Chestnut Oak logs and an equal number of Red Oak logs to a local mill. But trees came down in heavy winds, so they were green trees. This one:



I have two problems. I don't own a trailer big enough to move logs, and I don't own enough indoor space to store it while it dries. I have a friend who kindly exchanged loading. hauling and storing services for half the wood:



And now we wait:






Vtrombly said:


> I'll tell you what felling aside I'm not going to second guess the role my garden tractor could play in firewood operations. That JD pulled a log just as good as an ATV. Might have to get my craftsman involved now.



I have been really impressed with my 4wd Deere x728 in ability to pull with my log arch. But yesterday with the snow, and the lay of the land, I just couldn't get a pull started. But, it is a great machine for snaking among the trees and not making a rutted road:




This Deere GT weighs more than my ATV plus the rear tires are loaded, applies power to the wheels smoother by virtue of the hydro vs CVT transmission, and with grapple or blade on the tractor can move things out of the way better.
Thanks for watching and commenting.


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## Jere39 (Jan 9, 2022)

Another "Christmas" Tree I took down December 26:



Another standing dead Red Oak


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## Sandhill Crane (Jan 9, 2022)

Horses trained to skid logs start the pull at an angle to the log rather than a straight dead pull. You could try it and see if it makes a difference. You could also fab up some skis to replace the wheels on the arch for winter.
A LogRite arch would lift the log off the ground and have larger diameter tires than your present arch which may also help.


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## djg james (Jan 9, 2022)

Yes, I understand about lack of space. It just that the log looked clear of knots and branches and milling was my first thought. And you don't really need anymore oak.


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## cantoo (Jan 9, 2022)

I wonder if a skidding cone on the front and your arch father back the log would help?


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## rwoods (Jan 9, 2022)

Jere39,

I always enjoy your posts. I fall trees from time to time for our local firewood ministry. I don't have any videos. I have lots of stump pictures many of which have been posted over the years in the MAC sticky thread as I run a few old MACs. I'll post some here to help get your thread started.

White oak


Red oak


Ash






Ron


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## rwoods (Jan 9, 2022)

Ash









Red oak



Ron


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## rwoods (Jan 9, 2022)

Last one for now.
Red and White oaks


Ron


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## lohan808 (Jan 9, 2022)

Jere39 said:


> I might operate differently from most of you. I am lucky to live in the middle of the woods, and unlucky to have hundred year old Oaks dying every year. So, I typically let them stand for a couple years till the bark loosens, then cut them down and process them for firewood. I've posted a couple video and pictures of me cutting down a tree, but I am never quite sure where to post them? Scrounging? Hauling? Processing? Not really good matches. So, I started this thread. If I am the only one doing this, or interested in this, it will just fade it's way down the list and off the first page. On the other hand, if others are cutting down trees in the process of making firewood, I'd love to see your work.
> 
> First post:
> 
> ...



Hey brother thanks for starting this thread. I am begging most my wood from the elderly these days by doing clean up on their property for little or no money. Paying it forward and getting some saw time in. Win-win.


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## Kensterfly (Jan 9, 2022)

We have several acres of woods that are so thick with oak and hickory trees, saplings, and yaupon that the closet I could get a tractor is the perimeter easement. I never cut a healthy tree but dead, lightning struck, and wind fall are fair game and the proceeds feed our Vigilant II stove to keep the house warm in the winter.
But, man! I’m getting too old to haul bucks out from the middle of the woods to the outer trail! I just cut about 1000 feet of new trails that meander through the woods. I might be able to haul my splitter back there with a garden tractor, split the wood on the spot, then bring the splits back to the stacks by dragging a small trailer. Sure is a lot of extra steps!
It’s much easier when I can get close with my old Ford tractor.


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## djg james (Jan 9, 2022)

Kensterfly said:


> We have several acres of woods that are so thick with oak and hickory trees, saplings, and yaupon that the closet I could get a tractor is the perimeter easement. I never cut a healthy tree but dead, lightning struck, and wind fall are fair game and the proceeds feed our Vigilant II stove to keep the house warm in the winter.
> But, man! I’m getting too old to haul bucks out from the middle of the woods to the outer trail! I just cut about 1000 feet of new trails that meander through the woods. I might be able to haul my splitter back there with a garden tractor, split the wood on the spot, then bring the splits back to the stacks by dragging a small trailer. Sure is a lot of extra steps!
> It’s much easier when I can get close with my old Ford tractor. View attachment 955070


I like your boom. Is that home made or you buy it some where?


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## Kensterfly (Jan 9, 2022)

djg james said:


> I like your boom. Is that home made or you buy it some where?


I bought it used a farm auction. It’s one of my useful implements.


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## gggGary (Jan 9, 2022)

I'll throw in here. Got about 7 out of a dozen diseased ash cut and in the wood shed this fall/early winter. Mostly edge of the pasture trees. None were huge but several were heavy leaners. Did my first plunge and out the back cuts.


All has gone well so far. Full disclosure one I was trying to wedge against the lean went down at 90 degrees to the plan. I had an exit path, a bent fence post and a few insulators the only casualties.
I also have more "free ash" than I can get to for the cutting, both standing and dropped with easy access.


Doing some with friend who no longer can get all his firewood done on his own.
I buck and split where they fall before loading for the trip to the wood racks. Mower and trailer here at the farmette, into the van when out n about.
Don't know what you guys are seeing but looking around at the woods this winter is rather sad, so many species have been decimated by the various diseases, the woods are full of dead and looking pretty haggard, thin.


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## CDElliott (Jan 9, 2022)

Jere39 said:


> I might operate differently from most of you. I am lucky to live in the middle of the woods, and unlucky to have hundred year old Oaks dying every year. So, I typically let them stand for a couple years till the bark loosens, then cut them down and process them for firewood. I've posted a couple video and pictures of me cutting down a tree, but I am never quite sure where to post them? Scrounging? Hauling? Processing? Not really good matches. So, I started this thread. If I am the only one doing this, or interested in this, it will just fade it's way down the list and off the first page. On the other hand, if others are cutting down trees in the process of making firewood, I'd love to see your work.
> 
> First post:
> 
> ...



I have a similar problem with older oaks dying off from Hpoxylon Canker, now called Biscogniauxia Canker. Most of them end up on the burn pile.








Biscogniauxia (Hypoxylon) Canker and Dieback of Trees - Oklahoma State University


What Biscogniauxia Canker and dieback of oak trees is in Oklahoma and the proper control and prevention methods if symptoms occur.




extension.okstate.edu


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## djg james (Jan 9, 2022)

gggGary said:


> .....
> View attachment 955081
> 
> 
> ....... Mower and trailer here ........


You pull a trailer with a Zero Turn? I didn't think the transmissions were made for hauling.


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## gggGary (Jan 9, 2022)

djg james said:


> You pull a trailer with a Zero Turn? I didn't think the transmissions were made for hauling.


It's a Woods mower. They build em tough. A lot of my mowing is harder on it than a little trailer pulling. My last Woods was 30 years old I sold it on, still mowing good.
I pull that trailer all over the country with my Prius too. 


The funny thing is I get nearly the same mileage pulling a motorcycle on the trailer as I do riding the motorcycle! I buy n sell a fair # of bikes. It's my hobby, so I'm often driving out to haul em home.


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## CampHamp (Jan 10, 2022)

I like the topic. Good posts, too!

I live in the middle of a forrest as well and harvest lots of dead/dying trees. I heat with hardwood and boil sap with soft wood.

The ash borer beetle is killing all the ash and the beech are also being hit hard by a non-native insect here in NH. Sucks. I didn’t know the oaks were under attack is some U.S. states until reading this thread. Perhaps it takes a million years for nature to develop a tree species, so we’re witnessing quite a rapid loss.

So, ash and beech are my heating wood and may not even be around for the next generation. I prefer to take them down sick rather than dead, just because it is safer.

With the dead ones, I look up while cutting for fear that just the vibration of the saw will drop a branch. I’ve had whole tops break backwards from dead ones with just the slightest touch of a neighbor when they topple. I‘ve taken to pulling down trees with a rope come-along unless there are no adjacent trees.

I had a friend die a few years ago who was knowledgeable and safe - he was a pro logger and went to logging classes with his boys. Paperbark birch - they get weak as soon as they die and even a lone, dead branch is a hidden danger in those trees.

Sorry for the “Debbie Downer” post!


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## Jere39 (Jan 10, 2022)

I know what you mean. A crew taking down dead Ash in a local park told me they are bringing excavators in to push the Ash trees over because sometimes just the vibration of the saw starts a disintegration of the structure of the tree and it collapses like the Twin Towers.

Here is an Oak I took down that was growing less than 3' from our cabin in the mountains. While the tree was sound, and I was pretty confident in my ability to aim it, I lined it anyway and with a snatch block and a pick-up truck ensured it would not fall on our cabin:

_(40 seconds of Drone video)_



And, as wood is our heat source for this cabin, I cut it up and some of the other guys split and stacked it for a future year.


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## rwoods (Jan 10, 2022)

CampHamp said:


> I like the topic. Good posts, too!
> 
> ...
> 
> ...



Just posted this in another thread:
No stock answer to your question beyond every tree may kill you, especially dead ash. My dead ash tactics are to make sure you have a clear overhead where you stand, the clearest falling direction as possible, cut them quick, and run - don't look back - keep putting as much distance as you can from the stump - it is amazing how far stuff will travel through the air. If you can leave the crusty ones to nature, then leave them.

I recently cut this one with the lean. First movement and the top (in the foreground) broke off about 15' up; it landed just feet from the stump leaving a stem that I had to wedge over.



Even that perfect straight live tree that you can "easily" fall in any direction will team up with nature, complacency and mistakes to try to kill you. The red oak on the right with the saw leaning against it is a perfect example. Faller's choice of direction to fall on a windless day in November 2021.



BUT an overly aggressive face cut, hesitation on placing a wedge and a sudden puff of wind pinched my saw in the back cut. Too tight to start a wedge and a 20 minute walk to my back up saw. The tree wasn't going to wait. Within minutes, a few more puffs of wind and a small chair started. Within 15 minutes it chaired completely with the stem fell sideways taking my saw for a ride. 



I watched the chairing from what I thought was a safe distance 45 degrees from the *face* cut (out of frame but to the bottom left of the picture). Through no wisdom or forethought of my own I was in the best spot. I could just have easily been 45 degrees from the face but to the bottom right. In the end, I wouldn't have gotten hurt there but the scare from being that close to the action might have shortened my life a bit. My saw survived with a foot or so of pinched rails.

Ron


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## 3000 FPS (Jan 10, 2022)

Kensterfly said:


> We have several acres of woods that are so thick with oak and hickory trees, saplings, and yaupon that the closet I could get a tractor is the perimeter easement. I never cut a healthy tree but dead, lightning struck, and wind fall are fair game and the proceeds feed our Vigilant II stove to keep the house warm in the winter.
> But, man! I’m getting too old to haul bucks out from the middle of the woods to the outer trail! I just cut about 1000 feet of new trails that meander through the woods. I might be able to haul my splitter back there with a garden tractor, split the wood on the spot, then bring the splits back to the stacks by dragging a small trailer. Sure is a lot of extra steps!
> It’s much easier when I can get close with my old Ford tractor. View attachment 955070
> View attachment 955070
> View attachment 955071


8N?


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## Jere39 (Jan 10, 2022)

@rwoods Thanks for sharing those pictures. That is a great picture of what can happen, and a great experience to sit by a warm fire and contemplate what happened and how to avoid another similar fall. Glad you were safely able to take the pictures to share.


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## Jere39 (Jan 10, 2022)

This is a 2 minute video of another of the "goldilocks" (Not too big - not too small) standing dead Red Oaks. Just takes a little patience as the wedge takes effect:



And here is my award winning camera "man".


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## JRM (Jan 11, 2022)

I helped a friend cut down a 34" pin oak with a dangerous lean over his garage. He hired a tree climber to sling a heavy rope up in the tree and take down 2 limbs that would have likely damaged the corner of the garage. I generally do not get involved in jobs like this - my view is leave it to the professionals with insurance! But he was dealing with some serious life events and was stretched thin, and the tree could not wait any longer.




Short video, turn it up loud enough you can hear an amped up gleeful shout when it didn't come back over on the garage.

Woo hoo!!









New video by Jr Mason







photos.app.goo.gl


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## farmer steve (Jan 11, 2022)

Good thread Jere and the rest of you guys too.  Cutting a good amount ot dead ash here and like @rwoods said 'cut and run".


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## Jere39 (Jan 11, 2022)

JRM said:


> I helped a friend cut down a 34" pin oak with a dangerous lean over his garage. He hired a tree climber to sling a heavy rope up in the tree and take down 2 limbs that would have likely damaged the corner of the garage. I generally do not get involved in jobs like this - my view is leave it to the professionals with insurance! But he was dealing with some serious life events and was stretched thin, and the tree could not wait any longer.
> 
> View attachment 955391
> 
> https://photos.app.goo.gl/FNmU4LxqZ6PZMqRr6


I never climbed well or confidently, and I now don't even do it on a dare. I agree with your procedure 100% (for what little my agreement means). I am mostly cutting in the woods, and don't need to avoid structures or utilities - just other living trees. But I have 1500' of driveway thru the woods and when I have a sketchy take down there, I call on a pro, who now also rarely climbs, but rather brings in a bucket truck. 

I don't want to risk my rank amateur status.

Thanks for sharing your pictures.


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## JRM (Jan 11, 2022)

Does the video link in my post above work for you guys? When I click on it it looks as though I am still signed into my personal account, not sure if that means it is private or not.


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## CJ1 (Jan 11, 2022)

No more climbing for me OR bucket truck. If it has to come down from the top, the homeowner can call a tree service. I have loaders and bull ropes with throw lines, if I cant get it with that I leave it be!


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## Jere39 (Jan 11, 2022)

JRM said:


> Does the video link in my post above work for you guys? When I click on it it looks as though I am still signed into my personal account, not sure if that means it is private or not.


It works for me.

And, I wonder if you've been in the woods behind my house in the last 30 years???


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## JRM (Jan 11, 2022)

If you were on the other end of the state it would be a possibility! I am right on the state line.


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## Jere39 (Jan 11, 2022)

JRM said:


> If you were on the other end of the state it would be a possibility! I am right on the state line.


I actually know who did this quick carving - my Dad who was also a JRM, and liked to mark his (including my) territory where ever he ventured into the woods.


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## Cricket (Jan 11, 2022)

CampHamp said:


> I like the topic. Good posts, too!
> 
> I live in the middle of a forrest as well and harvest lots of dead/dying trees. I heat with hardwood and boil sap with soft wood.
> 
> ...


"I’ve had whole tops break backwards from dead ones with just the slightest touch of a neighbor when they topple."

You are wise - that's what killed my husband. He'd been trimming utility right-of-ways and cutting for the city, for thirty years.


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## Kensterfly (Jan 11, 2022)

Yes sir. 1952 8N


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## djg james (Jan 11, 2022)

Kensterfly said:


> Yes sir. 1952 8N


I've got one of those, but i have to get it running first.


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## Kensterfly (Jan 11, 2022)

Mine always ran great. I had it for 14 years but moved up to an 841 recently.


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## cantoo (Jan 16, 2022)

I wasn't the first guy to cut this tree but I was the one who got it the rest of the way down. The last picture is a 25" or so Poplar that will be an interesting take down some day. It was topped at about 30' about 20 years ago, has a bad branch break about 15' up and a couple of years ago was hit by lightening. I was going to cut it down but I decided to let it try to heal itself a bit first. The bark has grown around the wound and it seems pretty solid now so I think this summer it will come to the ground. There is a same size tree about 10' from it which also makes it fun. It will hit my house if it goes the wrong way.


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## rwoods (Jan 16, 2022)

cantoo, looks like an unintended Dutchman caused the fall to stall though I wouldn't put anything past an ash. 

Here's my 6' barber chair from yesterday's cutting where one side of a 24" ash let go prematurely. I couldn't tell it from the outside, but the wood on the left had lost its fibrous structure.






Ron


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## Lee192233 (Jan 16, 2022)

Good thread, I fell trees for firewood also. I have about 100 ash trees that had leaves last year but are showing pretty heavy infestation. I'm going to get as many on the ground this winter as possible. Here's some pics.


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## djg james (Jan 16, 2022)

Nice Ash. Looks like you'll be milling some of that into lumber. Let's see the pics when you do. I missed a log that went to the burn pile that I wanted to get milled. Still need to get new tires for my little trailer before I haul any small logs.


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## rwoods (Jan 16, 2022)

Nice to have some little helpers. Be extra careful with them around. 

Ron


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## Lee192233 (Jan 23, 2022)

Dropped another one today.


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## 3000 FPS (Jan 23, 2022)

Lee192233 said:


> Dropped another one today.
> View attachment 958885


Nice job. 
I was just looking a your sig line. You have an 026 with .017 squish. That is squeezing it tight.


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## Lee192233 (Jan 24, 2022)

3000 FPS said:


> Nice job.
> I was just looking a your sig line. You have an 026 with .017 squish. That is squeezing it tight.


Thanks!
Yeah probably a little too tight. It hasn't been a problem. I'm gonna pull the top end on it again and check for any signs of contact. I used the wrong sealer before I knew better and I want to redo it with Motoseal before it's a problem.


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## rwoods (Jan 24, 2022)

Surely Lee and I aren't the only ones that fell for firewood this past weekend. Here are four ash I cut on Saturday.

No.1



No. 2 on top of No. 1




No 3



No. 4




Fellow in the picture is one of my cutting buddies. It was nice of No. 4 to grow so close to my log pile. The others are a little over a quarter of a mile away.

Post some pictures and be safe,

Ron


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## djg james (Jan 25, 2022)

You guys are probably getting tired of me crying about lumber vs. firewood, but that last log looks like a nice saw log. I like Ash lumber better than boring R. Oak. I hope to run across one one day to have it milled.


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## Jere39 (Jan 25, 2022)

djg james said:


> You guys are probably getting tired of me crying about lumber vs. firewood, but that last log looks like a nice saw log. I like Ash lumber better than boring R. Oak. I hope to run across one one day to have it milled.


Not tired, appreciate your perspective. On the flip side, I've got very limited capacity to handle log length wood, even less capacity to haul log lengths, zero capacity to store sawed wood for an appropriate amount of time to dry before using the lumber. And, I just don't need a stack of lumber I won't be able to use for two years. Maybe there should be a thread for saw log harvest and milling. But, no need to not remind us of what alternatives there are for the trees I harvest for firewood.


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## Lee192233 (Jan 25, 2022)

I appreciate that perspective as well. I will likely have a couple good sized logs milled. However I'm not a woodworker so I'm never going to use it up. The rest is worth more to me as firewood. The best price I got was about $10 per each 12" × 8'6" saw log picked up and delivered to the mill. Hardly worth the time for that money. In our area ash prices are really depressed due to everyone logging it out of their woodlots.


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## djg james (Jan 25, 2022)

Yes I understand that position, too. No use, no room, inability to haul logs, $ return....
Right now, I've got more lumber than I can uses (lol). And people around here with mills trying to sell lumber, just don't sell much. I worked for a mill for a short time and that guy would mill everything that came in. But he sold very little;just kept filling up the barns with stacked lumber. The sawmill was big back in his father's time when farmers needed lumber for barns and fences, but not much call for it now.
Milling is disease, kind of like CAD. I'd guess you'd call it SMD. It's fun to see a log and find out what's inside. I see a nice log and just naturally want to have it milled. A farmer gave my Dad a large straight Bk. Walnut tree for firewood and we sawed it up into rounds. I just cringed.


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## rwoods (Jan 25, 2022)

djg james said:


> You guys are probably getting tired of me crying about lumber vs. firewood, but that last log looks like a nice saw log. I like Ash lumber better than boring R. Oak. I hope to run across one one day to have it milled.


Not a problem. You would be crying if you knew how many beautiful 30”+ red oaks I have cut for firewood.

Until last year I regularly preached the same sermon to the firewood ministry. They finally took me up on it with a few loads of red oak and white oak. After the time, effort and fuel, one white oak log brought much more $$$ than all of the other logs combined. They said selling logs was not worth it, except for the first log off the stump of white oak if it were clear. Nice white oaks are not plentiful here so we had none to sell.

I hate see beautiful logs chopped up for firewood, but that is where we are. The trees are given to us as no logger shows offering to buy. 
Ron


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## woodfarmer (Feb 1, 2022)

_Jere, I watched *your felling video, first of the year. Buddy you better quit before you get yourself killed. That was all kinds of a disaster waiting to happen .*_


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## TRTermite (Feb 1, 2022)

Jere39 said:


> Another "Christmas" Tree I took down December 26:
> 
> 
> 
> Another standing dead Red Oak



If you are cutting for firewood : no big deal but for grade lumber you left your yield in the stump..


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## Jere39 (Feb 1, 2022)

TRTermite said:


> If you are cutting for firewood : no big deal but for grade lumber you left your yield in the stump..


I usually cut them at that height for ease on my 68 year old back, then I take another round off the stump later. No yield wasted.


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## gggGary (Feb 1, 2022)

TRTermite said:


> If you are cutting for firewood : no big deal but for grade lumber you left your yield in the stump..


I'm with Jere39 on this. I AM cutting for firewood. (me n my back have seen better days). Prefer making the drop cut at or slightly above waist height. Sure beats working all scrunched up, easier to watch the tree top and quicker to leave the area, more likely to be above stump rot wood for the felling cut. Up in straight grain out of the weird stump grain. Less cutting, above the widest area. Easy enough to take a firewood round or two off the stump once the tree is on the ground.
Any downside to making the felling cut that high?


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## TRTermite (Feb 1, 2022)

Jere39 said:


> I usually cut them at that height for ease on my 68 year old back, then I take another round off the stump later. No yield wasted.


I regret making my post prior to reading through the whole thread. I normally read through but reality checks in on me occasionally and reaffirms that I am one of those sawmill addicts. "SMD?" mentioned in post #51. I am working towards replacing my 1956 Corley Left hand #8 mill with the one on UT "Table Rock Lumber, Last log sawed at a 40+ year old sawmill" If you note the date you can see Speedee is not my nick name.
You started a good thread I enjoyed reading through it.


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## mountainguyed67 (Feb 1, 2022)

TRTermite said:


> for grade lumber you left your yield in the stump..



Do you mean he should have made a Humboldt cut?


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## Captain Bruce (Feb 1, 2022)

djg james said:


> Nice Ash. Looks like you'll be milling some of that into lumber. Let's see the pics when you do. I missed a log that went to the burn pile that I wanted to get milled. Still need to get new tires for my little trailer before I haul any small logs.


How about a pic of that trailer?


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## djg james (Feb 1, 2022)

It's just a 5' x 8' single axle trailer. Light enough i can move around by hand when empty. 

It has a 2000 # axle I put on it but the frame can hold probably only half without failing.


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## Cricket (Feb 4, 2022)

gggGary said:


> I'm with Jere39 on this. I AM cutting for firewood. (me n my back have seen better days). Prefer making the drop cut at or slightly above waist height. Sure beats working all scrunched up, easier to watch the tree top and quicker to leave the area, more likely to be above stump rot wood for the felling cut. Up in straight grain out of the weird stump grain. Less cutting, above the widest area. Easy enough to take a firewood round or two off the stump once the tree is on the ground.
> Any downside to making the felling cut that high?


Same here. I had a 1800# horse fall on my a couple of years ago, and getting up and down, or bending holding weight (like a chainsaw) does unpleasant things to me 66 year old, Percheron flattened carcass.

Also some in my sandy/swampy weird property, I want to push over, so a taller stump is useful there.


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## Jere39 (Feb 5, 2022)

After that last fall, I sectioned the log into 12' lengths and skidded them to a processing site while there was a nice coating of easi-skid (snow):



This morning I went out to buck and start splitting, and found all manner of issues. A large dead Cherry fell across my drag path and needed to be cleared first, and my shed door lock was frozen (2.41" of rain yesterday, 40 degree drop in temps over night). But, I got to the logs late this afternoon and got them bucked to 18" lengths:


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## RichinNJ (Feb 7, 2022)

that's a serious pile of firewood! I'll trade you red oak for my ash trees, heck, you can have all of them


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## gggGary (Feb 8, 2022)

warning; dummy with saw vs fresh dead ash.


two trunks, first was a heavy leaner.
you can see trunk was split all the way down.
first notch lower right green line
"plunge" cut up about 8" from notch, red arrow points at it.
I had to plunge, but was in the existing split so there was no strap.
that drop was perfect.
second notch used plunge cut as the base, yellow line was the top cut.
Natural fall for the second trunk (also lots of lean) was to the left of the first, made my notch for the natural fall.
Back cut (green also up about 6" from the notch.
Dumb me hadn't sharpened the saw last time I put it away, it wasn't cutting real fast, trunk started to go when hinge was still 4" thick. I left. But it didn't complete the fall, a barber chair split went up a foot and stopped. Had to go back in and deepen the back cut, (dang it) then it dropped without drama.


Sharpened saw, will go back up and finish bucking it up tomorrow. Many more leaning fence line ash to go.


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## Lee192233 (Feb 8, 2022)

gggGary said:


> warning; dummy with saw vs fresh dead ash.
> View attachment 963313
> 
> two trunks, first was a heavy leaner.
> ...


Be careful! I don't want to hear about anything bad happening to you. Best thing I ever did was learn to bore cut. With heavily leaning trees I cut my notch then bore cut it, get my hinge right and then leaving a decent sized trigger on the side opposite the notch I put a wedge on either side of the trigger(in case I miscalculated the weight of the tree so it can't sit back on me) then I cut the trigger and skedaddle.

Glad you're ok!


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## gggGary (Feb 8, 2022)

Lee192233 said:


> Be careful! I don't want to hear about anything bad happening to you. Best thing I ever did was learn to bore cut. With heavily leaning trees I cut my notch then bore cut it, get my hinge right and then leaving a decent sized trigger on the side opposite the notch I put a wedge on either side of the trigger(in case I miscalculated the weight of the tree so it can't sit back on me) then I cut the trigger and skedaddle.


Thnx.I did my first bore cut earlier this year (also a heavy leaning multi trunk ash) and it went very well. Didn't really have much room for a bore cut on the second trunk here.


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## Jere39 (Feb 9, 2022)

Thanks for sharing. Any cut that ends safely can serve as a learning experience. I know not all my cuts are pro-perfect. I often rethink and come up with a better plan than the one I used. Hope I take that to the next tree.


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## esshup (Feb 13, 2022)

gggGary said:


> warning; dummy with saw vs fresh dead ash.
> View attachment 963313
> 
> two trunks, first was a heavy leaner.
> ...


I learned my lesson about 2008-2009. Now I make sure the chains are sharp AND the saws have tanks full of gas and oil. It took one tree where the saw ran out of gas before it dropped when it was windy out to make a believer of me. Talk about pins and needles getting it gassed and oiled up THEN going back to the tree to finish the cut before it let go on it's own.

Then a few years after that I had one go on me WAY too early. Luckily I plan things ahead but it barely went where it was supposed to go. The back to the center was rotten and it only had about 2" of good wood there, but on the face side the wood was good for at least 1/3 the depth of the diameter of the tree. I was relying on the back cut to hold on one side to twist the tree and make it fall in a certain spot. It didn't but nobody got hurt, only needed new underwear when it went.


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## cantoo (Feb 13, 2022)

rwoods said:


> cantoo, looks like an unintended Dutchman caused the fall to stall though I wouldn't put anything past an ash.
> 
> Here's my 6' barber chair from yesterday's cutting where one side of a 24" ash let go prematurely. I couldn't tell it from the outside, but the wood on the left had lost its fibrous structure.
> View attachment 956923
> ...


Hi Ron, and it was a Dutchman that had originally cut it. First day with a brand new saw too. I think likely the first tree he had ever cut that size too. A buddy and I dropped most of the rest of the trees after we got there. Tree cutting is one of those jobs that looks easy until it is your doing the work. A lot of good saw logs were ruined that day. A beautiful cherry that was butchered was hard for me to see. Big, beautiful and straight Ash trees cut terribly. We were only there for the firewood but was still a shame to see those logs ruined.


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## Jere39 (Feb 14, 2022)

I went out to take down another dead Red Oak, and somehow I had my PS 510 with an 18" bar instead of my PS 6100 with the 20" bar. This particular Oak was a little chunky for the 510, but I was too lazy to walk back to my garage to get the right saw. So, we both labored a little more than necessary including a little reach-around, but it ended on the ground with no particular trauma: _(2:45 video_)



Then, I sectioned it to 12' sections and started skidding them from the top down to my processing site. The snow always makes the drag easier as long as I can keep traction. No problem today:


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## Brufab (Feb 15, 2022)

Great work!


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## Jere39 (Feb 15, 2022)

Back today to pull the rest (bottom two logs - about 16'x20") off that dead Red Oak I cut down yesterday. This snow makes the skidding easy as long as I get enough traction with the 4wd Deere GT:

1:20 video pieced together from three GoPro mounts along my path:


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## Brufab (Feb 15, 2022)

Jere39 said:


> Back today to pull the rest (bottom two logs - about 16'x20") off that dead Red Oak I cut down yesterday. This snow makes the skidding easy as long as I get enough traction with the 4wd Deere GT:
> 
> 1:20 video pieced together from three GoPro mounts along my path:



Wow sweet video and log caddy.


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## Lee192233 (Feb 27, 2022)

Dropped a decent sized beech today that had the 50 % of it's top broken off last summer. It was competing with a couple sugar maples so bye bye beech. I also dropped an ash and got a sketchy windblown red oak safely to the ground. Hopefully I'll get some pics tomorrow. 
Stay safe guys.


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## Lee192233 (Feb 27, 2022)

The top pic is the beech and the bottom is the three 10' red oak logs.


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## Jere39 (Mar 2, 2022)

I've finished up splitting all the dead oak I cut and drug to processing location. I still have about 2 cord of the green Oak that came down across my driveway and severed my power lines - but it will likely take two years to season right, so, I decided to tackle this leaner dead Oak that snapped off about 6' up and leaned over to a nearby tree:




It's well hung, so I pulled out a cart load of my equipment for getting a line, then static line, then cable on it up there at the snag:




I used a line slingshot and got a perfect launch first time - I'd probably still be out there if I was trying to throw the line up there. Then I backed off to a safe distance, more or less dictated by the length of the cable and the come-along spool, and strapped up to a stump from a prior felling. I engaged one of my regular partners in taking some video with the GoPro:




And, if I were any good at video editing this would be about a 20 second video. But, I'm not, so this is about 1 minute 20 seconds of an old guy cranking on a come-along handle followed by about 3 seconds of crashing leaner with cable rattling down a nearby tree. Feel free to FF unless you really want to see if I make it all the way through a minute of clackity-clacking the come-along:



Anyway, I'll section it this morning, and skid it to my processing area next time my grandson comes to visit


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## mountainguyed67 (Mar 2, 2022)

What brand and model of come along is that?


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## Marine5068 (Mar 3, 2022)

Jere39 said:


> There are mills in the area. Last year I took about 4 or 5 Chestnut Oak logs and an equal number of Red Oak logs to a local mill. But trees came down in heavy winds, so they were green trees. This one:
> View attachment 954901
> 
> 
> ...


Just wondering if there's such thing as a rear log arch too?
One that could attach on the log's back end and do away with dragging the back end of the log along the ground.


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## Jere39 (Mar 3, 2022)

Marine5068 said:


> Just wondering if there's such thing as a rear log arch too?
> One that could attach on the log's back end and do away with dragging the back end of the log along the ground.


There are little trailers that attach to the log at the rear to keep the whole log off the ground. I've seen video of them in action. There are also longer tongue front arches that allow for a more central lift point. Then you can lift a 12' log completely off the ground for transport. Most of them have a stabilizer rig for the front of the log to keep it from swinging wildly.


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## sundance (Mar 3, 2022)

Jere39 said:


> There are little trailers that attach to the log at the rear to keep the whole log off the ground. I've seen video of them in action. There are also longer tongue front arches that allow for a more central lift point. Then you can lift a 12' log completely off the ground for transport. Most of them have a stabilizer rig for the front of the log to keep it from swinging wildly.


One thing to think about. If the log is off the ground any braking is only the towing machine. Dragging the back end helps with stopping.


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## Jere39 (Mar 3, 2022)

mountainguyed67 said:


> What brand and model of come along is that?


Sad to say, this commercial come-along came from a long career in construction, then on the farm. All the brand and model info, as well presumably as the capacity and safety notices are long worn off:




Only marking I can see at all is this in the cast of the body of the tool:




Which I think is a cast number, not a model number. I've never been able to find anything via google to help me know more about it.


sundance said:


> One thing to think about. If the log is off the ground any braking is only the towing machine. Dragging the back end helps with stopping.



Absolutely correct. Neither my smallish tractor, nor my ATV have sufficient brakes to handle a run-away. Truth be told, I work on the north facing slope of a hill and all my pulls are up hill, but I wouldn't want to ride either tractor of ATV while a log is playing crack the whip with me. Pulled the last two sections of that tree out this morning:


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## JimR (Sep 6, 2022)

gggGary said:


> I'll throw in here. Got about 7 out of a dozen diseased ash cut and in the wood shed this fall/early winter. Mostly edge of the pasture trees. None were huge but several were heavy leaners. Did my first plunge and out the back cuts.
> View attachment 955081
> 
> All has gone well so far. Full disclosure one I was trying to wedge against the lean went down at 90 degrees to the plan. I had an exit path, a bent fence post and a few insulators the only casualties.
> ...


What disease has hit your Ash trees? Is it Ash blight?


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## Lee192233 (Sep 6, 2022)

JimR said:


> What disease has hit your Ash trees? Is it Ash blight?


Emerald ash borer. All the ash trees are dead in my area. Damn shame.


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## TRTermite (Sep 6, 2022)

Jere39 said:


> Which I think is a cast number, not a model number. I've never been able to find anything via google to help me know more about it.


I have always called mine "LUGALL" i read it somewhere years ago but there is mothing to be read now.
Check out WWW.LUG-ALL.com


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## StihlsawuserMS361 (Sep 7, 2022)

EAB here also. It's so sad to see this happen, thanks to imported insects.

The next big one is the Lantern Butterfly. I guess that bug goes for any hardwood.


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## soloz2 (Sep 7, 2022)

dealing with EAB here too. Dropped, limbed, and bucked 3 more this weekend. That puts me at 23 still standing out of 86 we started with. Home stretch. Unfortunately, now that the weather is turning cooler I'm not sure how much time I'll have since I picked up an adjunct professor position this semester on top of seeing my normal clients.


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## James Belli (Sep 7, 2022)

StihlsawuserMS361 said:


> EAB here also. It's so sad to see this happen, thanks to imported insects.
> 
> The next big one is the Lantern Butterfly. I guess that bug goes for any hardwood.


Yes, the lantern fly likes the maples, but it will eat any hardwood. they don't necessarily kill the tree like the Emerald ash borer. they feed on the tree and kill branches and stress it. (Trees don't look good with dead branches) they also usually feed at the top of the tree makes it hard to control them.


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## rwoods (Sep 7, 2022)

Time to jump start this thread. Some pictures since January:























Be safe,
Ron


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## rwoods (Sep 7, 2022)

A few more:

Nice white oak.



Things don't always go as planned:



Last Saturday - nice white oak.







Bore cutting a hickory.



Got to go as the 2022/23 firewood season is about to start.



Be safe and post some pictures.

Ron


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## mountainguyed67 (Sep 8, 2022)

I’ve already felled 150+ bark beetle killed trees at our mountain place, here are a few more I need to do.


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## sean donato (Sep 8, 2022)

rwoods said:


> A few more:
> 
> Nice white oak.
> View attachment 1015682
> ...


Not making fun or judging, but why are your face cuts so small?


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## rwoods (Sep 8, 2022)

Not sure if you are referring to the depths, height or both. Unless I am trying something unusual my height is typically just a function of the depth as I rarely change the angle. Due to the chair potential of white oak and whatever kind of hickory I was falling in this patch, I started using a more shallow face when falling against the lean. This gives me more protection from a face chair, more room for boring and wedge placement. Not saying this is how it should be done - just my thought process and reaction to a dangerous red oak face chair I experienced this season with a deep face cut. 

Ron


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## James Sawyer (Sep 8, 2022)

Jere39 said:


> Sad to say, this commercial come-along came from a long career in construction, then on the farm. All the brand and model info, as well presumably as the capacity and safety notices are long worn off:
> 
> View attachment 969899
> 
> ...


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## James Sawyer (Sep 8, 2022)

Jere39 I sure like your log carriage/ arch idea... I have couple those come-along I think mine are like 50 years old i got them from my dad 40 years ago. Not quite as good of shape as yours. Mine the springs don't have tension anymore.


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## rwoods (Sep 8, 2022)

Growing up, I helped string many strands of barbed wire with a similar come-along. Not sure what happen to it, the last time I saw it almost 50 years ago, the wheel was broken from a creosote post tossed on it and the top of the handle holder was broken. I would love to have one. Actually, found one this summer for $40, I passed because it would have been a 140 mile round trip to get it plus the risk that it was stolen.

Ron


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## Pioneer (Sep 9, 2022)

I'm usually cutting up deadfall, but in this case it was time for the spruce trees in the front yard to go. The first two leaned towards the street so they were easy, but the closest one to the buildings was a back leaner, so it had to be roped and wedged.
Picture of the middle one down, with a couple of Pioneer saws taking care of business.
The big cookies destination the wood stove, along with the Ash cut during the previous summer. Those cookies actually dry out quicker than long splits, and save a step. The ones too big to fit in the stove get cut in half.

Notice all the branches on the big trailer in the background, not even all of them.


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## sean donato (Sep 9, 2022)

rwoods said:


> Not sure if you are referring to the depths, height or both. Unless I am trying something unusual my height is typically just a function of the depth as I rarely change the angle. Due to the chair potential of white oak and whatever kind of hickory I was falling in this patch, I started using a more shallow face when falling against the lean. This gives me more protection from a face chair, more room for boring and wedge placement. Not saying this is how it should be done - just my thought process and reaction to a dangerous red oak face chair I experienced this season with a deep face cut.
> 
> Ron


Yes, sorry, I was referring to depth of your face cut. Typically I go a good bit deeper then that. I can't say I've had any barber chair issues in either white or red oak. Wonder if it's an area specific type thing? Always interesting to know the why someone does something. Thanks


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## rwoods (Sep 9, 2022)

I used to go at least 1/3. I went too deep on a nice straight red oak late last winter. It sat back on my saw during the back cut too tightly to get a wedge in place (over confidence in my assessment of the lean -I should have placed a wedge as soon as there was room). While contemplating my next move fortunately at a safe distance, a puff of wind caused the tree to chair backwards with the stem ultimately falling sideways. Since then I have shortened most of my face cuts on trees I am falling against the lean or that have canopies that make it difficult to access the limb load.

Our white oak are the most chair prone trees that I encounter - until whatever type of hickory is on my present site. Once the stem moves, you better be on the trigger or near a finished hinge. I bogged the saw by binding the tip when falling the small hickory in the picture. That little hiccup is all it took for the stem movement to overrun the thinning of the hinge. After that one, I bore cut the remaining hickories. On this job, the LO wants high stumps left for mechanical removal. I am struggling with being precise while holding the saw at chest height.

Ron


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## mountainguyed67 (Sep 9, 2022)

sean donato said:


> Not making fun or judging, but why are your face cuts so small?



He’s the opposite of me, mine vary from just right to too big. Many of our trees are big enough that it’s difficult for me to get started straight and in line, sometimes I have three false starts before I’m ready to go.


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## sean donato (Sep 9, 2022)

mountainguyed67 said:


> He’s the opposite of me, mine vary from just right to too big. Many of our trees are big enough that it’s difficult for me to get started straight and in line, sometimes I have three false starts before I’m ready to go.


I aim for 30% as well in the face. I'm pretty particular about my face cuts. I also like to get a wedge in the back cut once um in deep enough. But I will add circumstances vary and there's no dead set way to fell a tree, hence why we all learn as many techniques as we can.


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## rwoods (Sep 9, 2022)

Got to be careful chasing cuts to fix a Dutchman as it is easy, at least for me, to go too deep. If you are short on one side, it is sometimes easier to fix it by correcting from that side. You may end up with a peak in your face cut but you can whittle on it; a less than flat face at times may be better than an over cut face.

Ron


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## Jere39 (Sep 10, 2022)

A tree service started cutting these mostly Tulip Poplars this morning, saws running at 7:30 am. This is a small (less than 2 acre) lot at the end of my driveway. I had a busy day, but watched them take down several of them while mowing my side of the driveway. They put steering lines on all the big trees and pulled them with the small skid steer. My grandson was with me on a couple of the early cuts and provided his commentary for them:

_Each video is shorter than a minute_



While making the face cuts, another guy was burning a hornets nest in the background:



A second poplar hits the ground:



A six year old gets pretty excited to watch equipment running, trees falling, chainsaws operating

This third tree, was a Hickory I believe, not sure, too far for me to be confident, but not a poplar:



And finally, I launched my drone to survey the result of a day of sawing:



That's me standing in the middle of my own driveway where I launched. This is about 1500' from my house, so I won't have to actually stare at this clearing from my home. But, every time I drive in or out the driveway, or walk down for my mail, I'll be reminded of these 20 or so big old trees that no longer shade this lot.
I guess next I'll be watching a house being built.


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## Captain Bruce (Sep 10, 2022)

Well said. 40 yrs. on, I still hear of smart woodsman, "almost" having a bad fall.....


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## mountainguyed67 (Sep 10, 2022)

rwoods said:


> Got to be careful chasing cuts to fix a Dutchman as it is easy, at least for me, to go too deep. If you are short on one side, it is sometimes easier to fix it by correcting from that side. You may end up with a peak in your face cut but you can whittle on it; a less than flat face at times may be better than an over cut face.
> 
> Ron



If you were referring to my post, I don’t cut far enough for that to happen until everything’s lined up. I’ve been experimenting with different methods, including cutting just enough to see where the cut goes. Being on the side of a hill doesn’t help, going from one side to the other feels different.


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## rwoods (Sep 14, 2022)

Saturday between rains, I cut a small white oak and a decent size beech. Last two before I move to cut at another site. 

White oak.



Hopefully my last chest high cut for awhile. Beech.



Ron


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## tfp (Sep 23, 2022)

Felled a large Stringybark (_Eucalyptus tindaliae_) that had been struck by lightning a few years ago and died. It had a large ants nest behind the bark which dulled my chain pretty good. Used a crow bar to peel off the bark and brushed the ants nest off, then bucked it up with the trusty old MS250.



Moisture reading a few days after bucking. Burns real good.


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## Brufab (Nov 9, 2022)

djg james said:


> I like your boom. Is that home made or you buy it some where?


I have a similar boom I bought at TSC for around 150$ but that was before inflation. Definitely worth the money. We use it to move equipment around like plows, discs plus wood.


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## Jere39 (Jan 5, 2023)

Had this dead Red Oak with a strong bowed lean toward my house (though my house is not close enough to be in the reach of the fall.





Although I've never had, nor even seen a dead Red barber chair, this one had me very cautious. This 3 minute GoPro shows me sawing face and back then stepping back and letting gravity finish the fall:



And, the after action photo shows the line was pretty much dead on, but short of my house. I had intended this photo to show how fat the hinge was, but I set my saw in front of it.


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## Brufab (Jan 5, 2023)

Nothing wrong with dolmar pics  that was a crazy leaner? Any chance of a moisture meter reading?


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## Jere39 (Jan 5, 2023)

Brufab said:


> Nothing wrong with dolmar pics  that was a crazy leaner? Any chance of a moisture meter reading?


Well, as close as this one was to the house, it was no problem to grab the meter and carry it down for a reading of 39%




And while there, I took an unencumbered picture of the hinge:


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## Brufab (Jan 5, 2023)

Jere39 said:


> Well, as close as this one was to the house, it was no problem to grab the meter and carry it down for a reading of 39%
> 
> View attachment 1046459
> 
> ...


We cut up a blowdown at the end of December. Tree fell in summer of 21 the whole tree was off the ground and that's about the same reading we got. I was shocked. But I had a live oak tree cut by my house in April and the wood was around 25 or less. The tree still had about 45 days or so till it leafed out.


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## Kdawg (Jan 6, 2023)

Red oak has open “straws”, not only in its sapwood but also in its heart wood. White oak has closed straws. So red oak will suck itself full of water if end grain is touching down to earth. Cool test in the shop is to take a 2” cube of white oak and red oak and put it end-grain down in 1/4” of solvent, like denatured alcohol, in a dish. That solvent will be coming to the top of the red oak cube in seconds. 

Nice job taking that dangerous one down. In the woods I have cut ones like these with a 1/3 wedge to front and back faces and let the next wind storm take it down.


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## Seachaser (Jan 6, 2023)

Jere39 said:


> There are mills in the area. Last year I took about 4 or 5 Chestnut Oak logs and an equal number of Red Oak logs to a local mill. But trees came down in heavy winds, so they were green trees. This one:
> View attachment 954901
> 
> 
> ...


Put some real tires on that JD filled with liquid and it’ll surprise you. Nice looking dog!


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## Jere39 (Jan 6, 2023)

Seachaser said:


> Put some real tires on that JD filled with liquid and it’ll surprise you. Nice looking dog!


Tires were a compromise for traction in the snow, and kindness to the lawn we mow. They were filled with Rimguard. I have a small grapple for the front, and the tractor has regularly surprised me. But, it isn't a big do it all in the woods tractor. And the dog has been a constant companion for 14 years now. We just celebrated our 14th anniversary of adoption date:


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## Martin Johansson (Jan 6, 2023)

A Norway spruce I took down the other day.



Cut to a little over 1meter lengts(4 feet?) and split into 4 pieces with a few swings of my trusty Billnäs axe.


Stacked in a sunny place until spring. Then I haul them home to be cut and split once again into smaller pieces and stack them in our woodshed so we'll survive next winter too.


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## Bearcreek (Jan 8, 2023)

Jere39 said:


> I was hoping the snow would make the drag easy, it didn't - my log arch isn't big enough for the bottom section, and my tractor wasn't getting enough traction to move the second section.


Tire chains make a huge difference in those kind of conditions.


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## Jere39 (Jan 8, 2023)

Bearcreek said:


> Tire chains make a huge difference in those kind of conditions.


But wouldn't have stretched the opening on my log arch to accommodate the log anyway.


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