# Practice Tree - How would you drop / dismantle?



## LFEngineering (Aug 5, 2013)

So here's the deal: This tree has been on my hit list since I moved to my house a few years back. As you can see from the pictures the power & cable lines are going right thru it. Let me say right from the beginning *THE POWER & CABLE LINES WILL BE DISCONNECTED AND MOVED OUT OF THE WAY BY A PROFESSIONAL PRIOR TO CUTTING.*

Setting the scene: 
1.) Tree is on my property, but the bushes behind are on my neighbors land. He's already said there would be no problem if I hit the bushes, but I would like to do as little damage as possible.
2.) My wife would like me to do as little damage to the bushes on our property as well.
3.) The only other obstacle is the well head which is hidden under that (unfinished) concrete rock-like formation in the yard.
4.) The tree is weighted towards the property line / the bushes.

I would like to take this opportunity to try dismantling the tree in place using the bushes as soft obstacles, strictly for practice. If an unsafe situation were develop the tree would be dropped traditionally and whatever happens happens. 

That being said I'd like to hear everyone opinions on how they would tackle this project. I have an 8" pole saw, 14" top handle and 16-20" rear handles for cutting equipment.












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## LFEngineering (Aug 5, 2013)

I should also mention: Although it's hard to see from the camera angles, but there is a good 3-4 feet between each of the bushes.


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## hour18 (Aug 5, 2013)

what gear do you have to help drop it?


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## TheJollyLogger (Aug 5, 2013)

So when you say practice, you mean climbing practice? What gear do you have?


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## LFEngineering (Aug 6, 2013)

Well it was suppose to be climbing practice, but I can't for the life of me find my gear. It's been years since I've done any climbing and now that I'm thinking about it I'm pretty sure I sold my gear to a friend, all I found was my OSHA fall protection / harness & lanyard. So it looks like I'll be dropping it from the ground.


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## Tree&Stump (Aug 6, 2013)

There are power lines all over that tree, so ya, you could think about dropping it.  If you kind of drop it a little bit, you could see about missing the lines suppose, but you're going to need a total pro. Not you though unless you're not scared, but if you are, make sure you have someone video taping the drop, and make sure it goes on youtube. You'll be famous. :msp_w00t: 


Good luck, and check twice before you roll the dice! zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz


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## Gologit (Aug 6, 2013)

Tree&Stump said:


> There are power lines all over that tree, so ya, you could think about dropping it.  If you kind of drop it a little bit, you could see about missing the lines suppose, but you're going to need a total pro. Not you though unless you're not scared, but if you are, make sure you have someone video taping the drop, and make sure it goes on youtube. You'll be famous. :msp_w00t:
> 
> 
> Good luck, and check twice before you roll the dice! zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz



Didn't you say, in another thread, that you were leaving here?


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## LFEngineering (Aug 6, 2013)

Tree&Stump said:


> There are power lines all over that tree, so ya, you could think about dropping it.  If you kind of drop it a little bit, you could see about missing the lines suppose, but you're going to need a total pro. Not you though unless you're not scared, but if you are, make sure you have someone video taping the drop, and make sure it goes on youtube. You'll be famous. :msp_w00t:
> 
> 
> Good luck, and check twice before you roll the dice! zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz



So I guess the *big bold red letters* in my post weren't big enough.... the lines will be moved by linesman before I go doing anything with the tree.

As for the actual drop, I think I'll just clean up some of the lower stuff with the polesaw just to play with it then drop it towards the weighted side. Worst case I buy my neighbor some new bushes & a 12pack.


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## HuskStihl (Aug 6, 2013)

Looks like fun, unless you hit the wellhead, then it will still be fun, but considerably more expensive fun. If it were me, I'd probably limb it with one foot in my tractor bucket, the other on the 12' ladder. I'd be using a way too big saw, have no PPE, and prolly be wearing crocs. If you don't have a lot of practice with this falling style, I probably wouldn't try it:biggrin:


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## Tree&Stump (Aug 6, 2013)

Haha, I think you know what to do. It's an average to less than average tree, so no need for smecial pics and so forth. 

Anyway, sorry about missing the red lettering. I had just woke up and it was a little bit after 4am here. :msp_rolleyes: I'll be extra helpful to make it up to you. You know you can access the crotch at 6'. Get in there, and clear out all of the sticks so you can work around in there without getting poked in the eye. Use a light rope. For stuff like this I would be throwing my rope over branches with a large steel clip on the end....throwing that like a baseball, or I would hook that clip on my pole saw to poke that clip over a branch on those leaders. Just stick the clip over a stick up there on one of those leaders, and pull the clip back down with your pole saw. Clip the clip off back onto the line itself to create a choke around the branch. Now you can pull the branch in the right direction. If you can't just pull down those leaders, you can place a sling and pulley on an appropriate leader to hold the weight of the branch you are taking down. Right? Just lower it down. If you don't have a sling and pulley, try to find a natural crotch that is actually capable of holding the branch you're cutting off. If you don't have a ground guy to help, wrap your rope around a stub until your cut is made. Once it's cut, unwrap and lower. 

If you do any of this, DON'T GET PINCHED BY THE BUTTS OF THOSE BRANCHES. Doing what I just described get's quirky in trees like that especially since you don't have spikes to climb up the leaders to place your ropes exactly where they should be instead of just where you can kind of place them from the crotch. 

If you had all of the gear, you would not need the lines down, but you don't. Oh well. Good luck. :msp_razz:


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## Tree&Stump (Aug 6, 2013)

Gologit said:


> Didn't you say, in another thread, that you were leaving here?



z


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## LFEngineering (Aug 6, 2013)

Good ideas. Admittedly the tree is a target of opportunity normally I'd just have a pro come in an trim around the lines, but the lines are coming down to be relocated after siding the house so I figured why not.


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## Tree&Stump (Aug 6, 2013)

Can you tie it to the truck without smashing the truck? If you do, put your ropes on the tree, and be sure the are equally proportioned. No too much rope no one side, and not enough on the other side. No room for errors, eh. If the rope is not going to pull one side more than the other, then go from there and cut out your notch. Now pull the rope and put some strong tension on the rope. Go back and do some back cut, but you may or may not want to go all they way with that back cut. If I were working alone on this one, I would put in some back cut, but not enough to fall the tree. I would then go back to the truck, and break off the hinge with the power of the truck to be sure I'm pulling the damn thing straight onto the landing zone. No room for error. 

And don't go out there drinking beer doing this thing. You need your brain cells to do all of the heavy thinking especially if this isn't something you do all the time. Drink a coffee. :msp_thumbup:

Oh, and if you don't have room to fit the truck in, maybe you can tie a pulley block to a tree as a pull rope redirect. Then you run the rope from the redirect to your truck somewhere. 

What kind of ropes do you have? I'd be inclined to say you need a bull rope if you are going to pull it over with a truck to prevent losing it over the neighbor's side because of the over weighted side.


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## LFEngineering (Aug 6, 2013)

I have 75' 5/8 bull rope. As for the no beer I couldn't agree more, save them till the days over and the tree's on the ground. I may not be a pro, but if I'm going to attempt something like this I better damn well act like one. Not to mean attempting things that are out of my comfort zone, but taking a logical approach to every step through the process.

I like the idea of hinge cutting & breaking off with the truck / tractor. I'd say w/o a better harness setup I wouldn't venture more then 10-12' up the tree provided there's solid footing. As you mentioned using the pole to get the rope up there I could probably take the top 10-15' with out any problems then just take 2' sections at a time till I'm down.


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## stltreedr (Aug 6, 2013)

Put a rope in that sumbich and pull it over. I don't think they get much easier than that.


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## Zale (Aug 6, 2013)

[
That being said I'd like to hear everyone opinions on how they would tackle this project. I have an 8" pole saw, 14" top handle and 16-20" rear handles for cutting equipment.











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[/QUOTE]

A 8" pole saw is going to be way too short. You will need more sections.


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## B Harrison (Aug 6, 2013)

I would start with the out of balanced limbs from in the tree, tied off, and then with a rope pretty high, and a face and backcut; pull it down with a mountain bike! Or a rope and come along or a block and tackle, or a tractor, or a truck, or the beered up neighbor and a crotch rocket (rope around waist of coarse)
However you do it make a vid, we want to see.


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## Trx250r180 (Aug 6, 2013)

in a man lift you can just hoist yourself up and start with limbing then take down in sections till it's below the power lines(power turned off of course ) ,then fall it once its short 

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## TheJollyLogger (Aug 6, 2013)

Zale, what else do you have as far as rigging gear, and prior experience? Don't expect a full answer if you don't give enough info.


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## HuskStihl (Aug 6, 2013)

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That's how you do it:msp_biggrin:


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## Zale (Aug 7, 2013)

TheJollyLogger said:


> Zale, what else do you have as far as rigging gear, and prior experience? Don't expect a full answer if you don't give enough info.



I've been a production climber for 20+ years. As far as rigging gear, I have all the basics. Experience covers all aspects of tree care. Not sure the meaning of your question.


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## TheJollyLogger (Aug 7, 2013)

Zale said:


> [
> That being said I'd like to hear everyone opinions on how they would tackle this project. I have an 8" pole saw, 14" top handle and 16-20" rear handles for cutting equipment.
> 
> 
> ...



A 8" pole saw is going to be way too short. You will need more sections.[/QUOTE]

You had asked opinion on how to tackle this project, but just said what saws you had. Anyway, I'd just go ahead and get up in there and start whittling on it. Go about halfway up and hinge those leaders over, then get everything blocked down to the original stump. Dig up that little bush and drop the stob that way.


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## HuskStihl (Aug 7, 2013)

Zale said:


> I've been a production climber for 20+ years. As far as rigging gear, I have all the basics. Experience covers all aspects of tree care. Not sure the meaning of your question.



Zale accidentally removed the "quote" bracket making his quoting of the original post look like his own. He was responding to the OP, not asking a question. Therein lies the confusion.

Jolly, what's the difference between a stob and a snag?


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## TheJollyLogger (Aug 7, 2013)

To me, a snag is a good spot to cast at on the river, and a stob is just Texan for a spar, or pole.:msp_biggrin:


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## old_soul (Aug 7, 2013)

that is one UGLY hemlock tree

Looks fairly easy from the pics, especially since you are dropping the utilities....

set rope over halfway up, notch and pull it over

Take time to make a good notch and back cut and leave a good straight hinge


But honestly, i just logged in to say that the business slogan for "left field engineering" cracked me up..................is that for real?


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## LFEngineering (Aug 7, 2013)

Yes "I'd Tap That" is / was one of my slogans. I had stickers made up a few years back and boy were they a hit.


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## B Harrison (Aug 7, 2013)

HuskStihl said:


> View attachment 307934
> 
> 
> That's how you do it:msp_biggrin:



And here I thought you were just being a smartass. If that is a rake against the fence it should be removed prior to that work happening, rakes could be dangerous when left unattended.


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## Zale (Aug 7, 2013)

HuskStihl said:


> Zale accidentally removed the "quote" bracket making his quoting of the original post look like his own. He was responding to the OP, not asking a question. Therein lies the confusion.
> 
> Jolly, what's the difference between a stob and a snag?



Thank you for clarifying that. I'm pretty good with a chainsaw but lousy with a computer.


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## miko0618 (Aug 7, 2013)

not to be smart but if you are experienced, why would you need advice on an easy tree like this? maybe I am misunderstood.


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## TheJollyLogger (Aug 7, 2013)

Zale said:


> Thank you for clarifying that. I'm pretty good with a chainsaw but lousy with a computer.



Yeah, sorry about that zale, I was confused too. I was thinking wtf? The zale I know has way more saws and rips trees like that up before coffee break. Jeff


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## LFEngineering (Aug 8, 2013)

miko0618 said:


> not to be smart but if you are experienced, why would you need advice on an easy tree like this? maybe I am misunderstood.



It's not as much advice, just to see what other people thought. In my experiences looking at a problem from multiple points of view can lead to new techniques or just a better way of doing things.


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## miko0618 (Aug 9, 2013)

if it where mine, I would go as high as its safe to do and take as small of pieces as you can. I'd use a short rope and butt tie the limbs, cut them and then throw them down. or peel them and do the same. take them larger where theres room. leave a small pile of brush to land your logs on. if you don't have gear, fell it in the safest place and leave the hinge strong opposite the lean or weighted side. a nice open face notch will help keep the hinge working as long as possible too.


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## LFEngineering (Aug 9, 2013)

So after everyone input and a half hour starring at the tree here's what I've come up with as a general plan; 

1.) Move utilities
2.) Use 11' (8" bar) pole saw to clear all the smalls within reach from the ground.
3.) Use ladder to climb up to crotch at 6-8' level & tie in using my osha fall protection harness.
4.) Use top handle to clear up everything within reach
5.) Still at 6-8' level use pole saw again to clear everything in reach (should be halfway up tree)
6.) Using rope lifting pole set 5/8 bull rope 1/2 - 2/3 up each of the large vertical branches face cut > back cut, get out of tree and pull to snap.
7.) Repeat for the all the vertical branches.
8.) Climb back up to crotch and chunk off remaining verticals into firewood length pieces, work my way down.


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## beastmaster (Aug 13, 2013)

That's a cute little tree. be kind of hard to hurt your self in except for cutting your self in the tree. Why not just cut the branches on the side with all the weight on it with your pole saw from the ground. Just rip cut them so they hang on the tree, then after one side is down finish your cut, that way you won't crush the bushes. Then just put a line as high as you can, tie a truckers hitch, make your face cut, tighten up the truckers hitch as tight as you can, have a wedge or two ready just in case and fall it. Or even cut it high with a big face cut, and let it fall on the bushes. If it stays on the stump, it won't hurt them to bad you can't clean them up.


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## old_soul (Aug 13, 2013)

LFEngineering said:


> So after everyone input and a half hour starring at the tree here's what I've come up with as a general plan;
> 
> 1.) Move utilities
> 2.) Use 11' (8" bar) pole saw to clear all the smalls within reach from the ground.
> ...



what is the reason for a pole saw in this situation? If you're going to tie off each lead and pull over with a rope there is no point in stripping the limbs off.

Much safer to cut up once on the ground.

Unless you are trying to make this take twice as long, on purpose..............


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## BC WetCoast (Aug 13, 2013)

If I wasn't going to fall it and the service lines were removed, what I would do is climb into the crotch, strip out everthing you can reach and then fast cut the verticals. They'll stick into the ground and your groundie can then just carry them away. I may notch and fall the verticals or snap cut and toss, depending on what I found when I was in the tree.


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## LFEngineering (Aug 14, 2013)

The purpose of the pole sawing from the ground is strictly screwing around with the new pole saw, however once up in the tree it's to clear away enough of the smalls to push the rope up there.


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## TheJollyLogger (Aug 14, 2013)

LFEngineering said:


> The purpose of the pole sawing from the ground is strictly screwing around with the new pole saw, however once up in the tree it's to clear away enough of the smalls to push the rope up there.



That get's my vote for answer of the week. :msp_thumbup: I was at woodcrafters the other day and picked up a feather edge file for my Silky finally. Ended up going over to the neighbor's and trimming the watersprouts off a couple of his trees just to see how it did.


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## LFEngineering (Sep 9, 2013)

*Took Long Enough*

Well, after weeks of waiting for everything to fall in place I was finally able to take the tree down. I ended up going with a half practice dismantle half get it on the GD ground plan. I did use the pole saw to clean up the small stuff, enough to to lay a ladder against the tree and climb up there. After that I took the top handle and notched and dropped each section pushing them over in between bushes. Overall the surrounding bushes did pretty well, they were way overgrown anyway after the clean up and some trimming they'll be good as new. Now that the tree near the power lines is gone I can take the other ones down later this week. Again thank you everyone for your input.


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