# I'm from China. I need logs. There's a log to come.



## Lizhen (Oct 28, 2018)

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## 95custmz (Oct 29, 2018)

Nice. What species of tree?


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## northmanlogging (Oct 29, 2018)

talk to trump about his trade deals


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## Lizhen (Oct 29, 2018)

[QUOTE =“95custmz，帖子：6704569，成员：123007”]很好。什么树种？[/ QUOTE]
各种木材，只需木材的数量。


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## Lizhen (Oct 29, 2018)

[QUOTE =“northmanlogging，post：6704716，member：76731”]与特朗普谈谈他的贸易协议[/ QUOTE]
I don't know if you can say anything about your leader! But it does have an impact on trade.


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## Jhenderson (Oct 29, 2018)

Just tell the Chinese to stop stealing intellectual property, lower the 80% tariff on a Jeep Wrangler, and quit putting glycol in pet food and tooth paste. The trade war will end at the end of business the following day.


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## northmanlogging (Oct 29, 2018)

Lizhen said:


> [QUOTE =“northmanlogging，post：6704716，member：76731”]与特朗普谈谈他的贸易协议[/ QUOTE]
> I don't know if you can say anything about your leader! But it does have an impact on trade.


Not sure if you can read this without breaking the law over there, but round here we have the freedom of speech, we can say or write anything about anybody or anything, without fear of prosecution or jail. (doesn't mean that everyone has to like what you say, just that the government cant stop you)

Some folks love the guy, some folks hate him, both are loud about it


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## northmanlogging (Oct 30, 2018)

Jhenderson said:


> Just tell the Chinese to stop stealing intellectual property, lower the 80% tariff on a Jeep Wrangler, and quit putting glycol in pet food and tooth paste. The trade war will end at the end of business the following day.



in the fear of making this dangerously political, do you really think the trade war is about jeeps or glycol or the blatant robbing of ideas, or coal, or soybeans

Cause its about money, just good ole fashioned greed and petty theft nothing more, meanwhile those of us directly effected by this little trade war, get the short straw and possibly end up loosing our businesses, homes, farms and livelihood, for what exactly im not real clear on


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## Jhenderson (Oct 30, 2018)

I’m real clear on it. The re-negotiating of NAFTA was a real good start. You and I have a much different view on the situation. You’re concerned about you’re pocket book today. Nothing wrong with that. I , on the other hand would spend $10K to get back $1 somebody tried to steal from me. It sets an example you don’t have to show too many times before nobody tries to steal from you any more.


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## Gologit (Oct 30, 2018)

Logs for China? I had some this morning but I flushed them. Better luck next time.


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## Marshy (Oct 30, 2018)

Gologit said:


> Logs for China? I had some this morning but I flushed them. Better luck next time.


LOL!!!!


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## grizz55chev (Oct 30, 2018)

Gologit said:


> Logs for China? I had some this morning but I flushed them. Better luck next time.


Chinese food will do that, easy problem to solve.


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## northmanlogging (Oct 30, 2018)

Jhenderson said:


> I’m real clear on it. The re-negotiating of NAFTA was a real good start. You and I have a much different view on the situation. You’re concerned about you’re pocket book today. Nothing wrong with that. I , on the other hand would spend $10K to get back $1 somebody tried to steal from me. It sets an example you don’t have to show too many times before nobody tries to steal from you any more.


Think you're confused by who is stealing from who.

The export market goes away, log prices will plummet, ruining what is left of the timber industry here.


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## CR888 (Oct 30, 2018)

At least he's not spamming the site. Poor feller...


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## Huntaholic (Oct 30, 2018)

Believe me, I hate to see this embargo ******** as much as anybody! YES it is going to affect me directly, I sold some shipping logs today in fact. My buyer told me that in order for them to make it before the deadline, his containers had to be shipped by next week. Tighten your belts guys, we may be in for a rough ride in the veneer business. My logs today did VERY well, 2 weeks from now who knows what the markets will be.


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## Jhenderson (Oct 30, 2018)

northmanlogging said:


> Think you're confused by who is stealing from who.
> 
> The export market goes away, log prices will plummet, ruining what is left of the timber industry here.



Do you think you’re the only one? You don’t think China buys red oak logs? Biggest market in the world. But I’m not confused at all. You’re worried about yourself. I’m worried about the country. Who’s stealing from who? Try being a tech company or manufacturer who’s spent millions of $$ developing a product only to have the intellectual property stolen after the hard work and money has been spent. The Chinese do this on a daily basis and you pay them for the products they illegally copy. Just read the posts on the FarmerTech copy of the 660. Think that’s right? Take a good look in the mirror before you blame some nameless, faceless boogie man for picking your pocket. You and I have brought this on ourselves by looking the other way when we know right from wrong. Time to pay the piper.


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## northmanlogging (Oct 30, 2018)

Nameless and faceless Huh.


Before this gets angry, I'm done.

Never argue with stupid people, they will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.


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## Jhenderson (Oct 30, 2018)

You’re calling ME stupid? Where did your degree in geopolitical economics come from? Coco puffs box? It’s the selfish people who got us into this. You know, the ones YOU voted for. They won’t get us out. If you think they care about you, you’d better look in that mirror before calling anybody else stupid.


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## northmanlogging (Oct 30, 2018)

You really need to stop ass-u-me-ing it makes you look even dumber


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## Ted Jenkins (Oct 30, 2018)

A number of years ago when I was completely depending on USDA wood I had to sign and agreement that I would not export wood unless several people signed off on the sale. Now that some of my wood is from private sources I grab any possible export possibility. What some countries pay is unbelievable. Thanks


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## Jhenderson (Oct 31, 2018)

northmanlogging said:


> You really need to stop ass-u-me-ing it makes you look even dumber


I’m not assuming anything. West coast politicians, voted on by their constituents, packed the 9 th circuit with activist judges. Those judges allowed nuisance law suits to shut down logging in the PNW. It doesn’t matter if it was about the owl or road building, it cut off supply. This forced the closure of most of the mills in the area due to lack of raw material. After that came nafta. You’re not the only outfit affected. In the NE our best logs suddenly started going to Canada. Sent there by folks like you. That slowly forced the local mills to close, one by one. When I started logging there were 11 sawmills in R.I. Now there’s one. And everyone cries about no markets and no competition while they ignore the fact it’s their own shortsighted fault. It’s obvious your happy doing business with people who steal from your neighbors. Your also chuck full self righteous indignation when you get called on it. Hooray for me and to hell with everyone else. That’s not how I was raised.


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## Jhenderson (Oct 31, 2018)

Ted Jenkins said:


> A number of years ago when I was completely depending on USDA wood I had to sign and agreement that I would not export wood unless several people signed off on the sale. Now that some of my wood is from private sources I grab any possible export possibility. What some countries pay is unbelievable. Thanks



Read my previous post.


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## northmanlogging (Oct 31, 2018)

Self righteous indignation...

Cause I was totally old enough to vote in 1991 yup. All my fault again yep.

How about ya look up George bush sr. Trip to China and trade deals, maybe get some education instead of opinions


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## catbuster (Oct 31, 2018)

northmanlogging said:


> Self righteous indignation...
> 
> Cause I was totally old enough to vote in 1991 yup. All my fault again yep.
> 
> How about ya look up George bush sr. Trip to China and trade deals, maybe get some education instead of opinions



To preface-I agree with you (the Gyppo’s Gyppo) on most of your points. At the time of the 1991 election I was 5. I agree with the definite Trump voter worried about “MAGA” when he talks about China and intellectual property. They do steal it, and it is wrong. But it is what it is right now.

My degree came from University pf Louisville. While it is in civil engineering, we studied supply chains and economics and shtuff. What is evident is that a trade war is a knife fight. You pretty much cut each other until one bleeds out. We get ****ed by China pretty hard, but we did the same to them and continue to do so.

If you’re alright with hurting industry here even worse than competition does then maybe high tariffs and trade wars are for you. SE Asia can do things faster and cheaper than we can and is better equipped to weather an economic storm than we are stateside. The fact of the matter is that the current federal policies are not good for the U.S. Both on trade and environmental.

I won’t start there because what’s-his-face will probably call me some overedjumacated engineer, and make the assumption I don’t do anything actually in the field. The U.S is not going back to its prime industrial age from the 1870s-1970s any time soon. No policy can dictate that short of Mao/Xi Jinping style economic dictation.

I’ll leave this before the thread is locked.


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## Jhenderson (Oct 31, 2018)

northmanlogging said:


> Self righteous indignation...
> 
> Cause I was totally old enough to vote in 1991 yup. All my fault again yep.
> 
> How about ya look up George bush sr. Trip to China and trade deals, maybe get some education instead of opinions



You, as in the PNW electorate. When did you start voting? Or should I ask, have you ever voted? Your friends and neighbors voted in the crew who for all intents and purposes shut down logging for decades. Tariffs with China won’t kill the industry. Closing the big mills was the death of it. Selling high grade to export markets is just life support. If you folks fought for the mills decades ago the export market would just be gravy. Blaming tariffs for the problem is like saying someone died from chemotheropy.


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## Jhenderson (Oct 31, 2018)

catbuster said:


> To preface-I agree with you (the Gyppo’s Gyppo) on most of your points. At the time of the 1991 election I was 5. I agree with the definite Trump voter worried about “MAGA” when he talks about China and intellectual property. They do steal it, and it is wrong. But it is what it is right now.
> 
> My degree came from University pf Louisville. While it is in civil engineering, we studied supply chains and economics and shtuff. What is evident is that a trade war is a knife fight. You pretty much cut each other until one bleeds out. We get ****ed by China pretty hard, but we did the same to them and continue to do so.
> 
> ...


 
Educated people rarely resort to name calling so I’ll assume it’s the school of hard knocks you attended. Tell us all about the facts behind your declarations on environmental and trade policies that are bad for the United States. Please be specific as to policy changes and the actual results, not predictions or opinions.


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## madhatte (Oct 31, 2018)

Y'all best be civil or I swear I'll nuke this thread from orbit.


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## northmanlogging (Oct 31, 2018)

Jhenderson said:


> You, as in the PNW electorate. When did you start voting? Or should I ask, have you ever voted? Your friends and neighbors voted in the crew who for all intents and purposes shut down logging for decades. Tariffs with China won’t kill the industry. Closing the big mills was the death of it. Selling high grade to export markets is just life support. If you folks fought for the mills decades ago the export market would just be gravy. Blaming tariffs for the problem is like saying someone died from chemotheropy.


Yer sure quick to lay blame.

The big mills closed as a result of the spotted owl case circa 1991-4?, ending big lumber and the eventual decline into managed stands as well as much more efficient mills as a whole, ironically, we produce more now with less mills. Maybe not on the east coast, but certainly here.

a quick search will tell you that at the time the 9th circuit was largely populated by Reagan and Bush apointees.

The way I vote is irrelevant, as I have grown a lot in the last 30 years, but i will say Clinton, Perot, and Bush were on the ticket. And my first memories involve Iran, hostages, and Carter throwing the election to prevent war.

Seriously though, you need to stop assuming and blaming folks as a whole, it's not healthy or wise.

Trade works both ways, the us is screwed and has been for 30 or more years, pulling the plug and threatening war against a stronger larger foreign nations is less than wise, in fact its stupid and infantile.


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## catbuster (Nov 1, 2018)

Jhenderson said:


> Educated people rarely resort to name calling so I’ll assume it’s the school of hard knocks you attended. Tell us all about the facts behind your declarations on environmental and trade policies that are bad for the United States. Please be specific as to policy changes and the actual results, not predictions or opinions.



For clarity’s sake, I went to Crestwood Elementary School, the South Oldham Middle School followed by South Oldham High School. I graduated there in 2005 with a 3.77 GPA. Then I went to University of Louisville’s Speed School of Engineering. I got out of there with a 2.79 GPA, and had passed the FE by the time I got out with a B.S in Civil Engineering with emphasis on geotechnical and environmental engineering. The last school I went to was University of Kentucky for some P.E continuing education time. I am not uneducated, though I have spent some time, many summers in high school and college in the school of hard knocks and continue as I run my own company. I’m not trying to make this a “show off what you got” competition, but would you care to share your educational background?

Here’s an example of policy and how it effects industry/trade. Let’s talk about diesel exhaust emissions regulation, particularly in off-road applications.

Here in the States, we are currently governed under the TIER system, brought by CARB, EPA, and engine makers (Cummins, Caterpillar, Isuzu, Kubota, etc.) The TIER system put Detroit Diesel out of the off-road market for good. What I find interesting is TIER is not much of a carbon regulator-mind you, nothing to curb the greenhouse effect-as it is a limit on NOx gases and particulate matter. Diesel engines do emit particulate matter and nitrous oxides, but emit marginal amounts of volatile organic compounds or ozone as gasoline powered engines do, which is where most of your smog and air pollution that makes it difficult to breathe come from. I can explain the chemistry if you’d like.

TIER 1-3 were mostly easy to do through engine design. They were rolled out between 1998 and 2004. They’re the big reason Caterpillar came up with the 3406E from the 3406C and then made it the C-15 and C-16. It drove most of the changes in product lines not so much in production advancements as it did drivetrain changes. TIER 3 machines were, and many of them still are, though 7-10 years old as TIER 4 was rolled out between 2008 and 2011, still very reliable and productive machines. They are easily worked on, and the U.S dominated the market on construction and forestry equipment. I own about $8M worth of TIER 3 stuff. The Caterpillar 330D L is still my favorite excavator I’ve ever run, but that’s beside the point.

TIER 4 was split into two parts. TIER 4 phase A (TIER 4 Interim) was complete in 2011, where TIER 4 B (TIER 4 Final) was complete in 2015. With TIER 4, it moved beyond efficiency and design improvments. Additional systems such as diesel particulate filters and selective catalytic reduction. In order to work properly, a DPF system must regenerate, or to say burn itself out. In order to do this, the engine must first derate its power, lowering production, then raise exhaust gas temperatures enough to burn the accumulated material from the filter. In ahort, you use more fuel and lower the operating efficiency, as well as add another system, monitored by electronics not everyone can work on, to fail. SCR systems do not require as much maintenance, but use another consumable-diesel exhaust fluid, also known as DEF or AddBlue in certain areas. The components of DEF are caustic, urea is the primary component, and it eats the SCR and related systems alive, as well as adding another system to fail.

By comparison, few countries I hear a lot of modern politicians say are ripping us off have regulations like this in place. Because of tbis, they produce basic, poorly engineered and inefficient engines that burn a lot of fuel and don’g produce a lot of power. Take a look at China’s XCMG company, PowerPlus from there or the Hyundai machines I see cropping up here and there stateside. Yet the standard of living is low, and the air quality is awful. Look at photos of Los Angeles in the 1970s, prime industrial time for that city. There is usually so much smog you can’t see the Hollywood hills from downtown. The quality of living here has improved, though be it we lost market share. It’s not always possible to have your cake and eat it too.


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## Jhenderson (Nov 1, 2018)

northmanlogging said:


> Yer sure quick to lay blame.
> 
> The big mills closed as a result of the spotted owl case circa 1991-4?, ending big lumber and the eventual decline into managed stands as well as much more efficient mills as a whole, ironically, we produce more now with less mills. Maybe not on the east coast, but certainly here.
> 
> ...



Carter “ Throw the election” ? You’re kidding right? Your solution to unfair trade practices is capitulation? I guess we have nothing else to discuss.
Ps. Just for informational purposes look up the “BLUE CARD” system for court appointments before you make statements about the 9th circuit.


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## Jhenderson (Nov 1, 2018)

catbuster said:


> For clarity’s sake, I went to Crestwood Elementary School, the South Oldham Middle School followed by South Oldham High School. I graduated there in 2005 with a 3.77 GPA. Then I went to University of Louisville’s Speed School of Engineering. I got out of there with a 2.79 GPA, and had passed the FE by the time I got out with a B.S in Civil Engineering with emphasis on geotechnical and environmental engineering. The last school I went to was University of Kentucky for some P.E continuing education time. I am not uneducated, though I have spent some time, many summers in high school and college in the school of hard knocks and continue as I run my own company. I’m not trying to make this a “show off what you got” competition, but would you care to share your educational background?
> 
> Here’s an example of policy and how it effects industry/trade. Let’s talk about diesel exhaust emissions regulation, particularly in off-road applications.
> 
> ...




Rather that a tutorial on a subject I’m probably far more experienced with than you, I expected examples of where the current administration has erred with their policies on trade and the environment as you declared in the post I referred to. Any particular reason you couldn’t address those points?


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## catbuster (Nov 1, 2018)

Jhenderson said:


> Rather that a tutorial on a subject I’m probably far more experienced with than you, I expected examples of where the current administration has erred with their policies on trade and the environment as you declared in the post I referred to. Any particular reason you couldn’t address those points?



You didn’t ask for them. Would you care to answer my question? What are you vastly more experienced in than I am? What do I need a tutorial on?

You don’t have any answers. You’re starting to sound a lot like Trump on defense right now. That’s not a good thing.

I’ll get to the trade/environment policies when I get off work.


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## northmanlogging (Nov 1, 2018)

Jhenderson said:


> Carter “ Throw the election” ? You’re kidding right? Your solution to unfair trade practices is capitulation? I guess we have nothing else to discuss.
> Ps. Just for informational purposes look up the “BLUE CARD” system for court appointments before you make statements about the 9th circuit.



Gods damn yer thick arn't ya.

Negotiations take time, period. 

Know what I repeat, you to stupid to debate with, its like educating a brick, waste a lot of time yet all it knows is wall wall wall


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## Jhenderson (Nov 1, 2018)

catbuster said:


> You didn’t ask for them. Would you care to answer my question? What are you vastly more experienced in than I am? What do I need a tutorial on?
> 
> You don’t have any answers. You’re starting to sound a lot like Trump on defense right now. That’s not a good thing.
> 
> I’ll get to the trade/environment policies when I get off work.



I refer you to post # 26. As for being more experienced with tier 3 and 4 emissions standards I have over 500,000 miles in tier 3 and 4 vehicles performing all the service on those systems. While I gave up renewing my ASE cert long ago I still moonlight several nights and weekends a month in a friends shop servicing among other things the local Vol Fire Co trucks, including rescue vehicles which are tier 4 fords. Where do you want to start? DOF, SCR, DEF dosing pumps and nozzles, EGR systems along with their associated coolers? VGTs, common rail high pressure pumps and injectors? I eagerly await your response.
Ps. It wasn’t emissions that put DD out of the off- road market. It was a better mousetrap in the for of a Cummins BT that did them in long before diesel emissions were a factor. Quieter, lower fuel consumption, and longevity for starting points.


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## Jhenderson (Nov 1, 2018)

northmanlogging said:


> Gods damn yer thick arn't ya.
> 
> Negotiations take time, period.
> 
> Know what I repeat, you to stupid to debate with, its like educating a brick, waste a lot of time yet all it knows is wall wall wall



We are in negotiations. Just because you don’t like the style doesn’t mean they’re not ongoing.


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## Gologit (Nov 1, 2018)

madhatte said:


> Y'all best be civil or I swear I'll nuke this thread from orbit.



Please do.


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## madhatte (Nov 1, 2018)

When it passes the "three warnings" threshold, I will.


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## northmanlogging (Nov 1, 2018)

Gologit said:


> Please do.


so... Do you miss the fun and excitement of being a mod around here, or is retirement all its cracked up to be


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## Gologit (Nov 1, 2018)

northmanlogging said:


> so... Do you miss the fun and excitement of being a mod around here, or is retirement all its cracked up to be



Well, first of all it wasn't fun. Secondly, it sure as hell wasn't exciting. Think about it for a minute...having to read every damn one of the posts in the Homeowner's Help section and still keep some shred of sanity..

Or, having to plow through your 359th "what saw should I buy" post for the week.

Then there's the eternal arguments...as in "my saw won't cut straight and what should I do" and you _have _ to read them because eventually they turn into a brawl and you have to referee.
The "what saw" threads weren't nearly as bad as the "how should I fall this tree" lunacies.

Madhatte does it right. He stays pretty much in Foresty & Logging. I don't blame him a bit.

Retirement? It's what you make of it. I'm enjoying mine. 
Working? I miss the scenery, the sense of accomplishment, the problem solving, and I truly miss the good people I worked with but there's a whole lot about it that I don't miss at all. I'm glad to be done with it.


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## madhatte (Nov 2, 2018)

Gologit said:


> Madhatte does it right. He stays pretty much in Foresty & Logging. I don't blame him a bit.



I know my people. If there's one thing I expect of myself as a mod here, it's that my personal opinions are divorced entirely from my Mod duties. The real-world implication is that when I show up at a GTG, nobody has reason to question my integrity. I'm not a keyboard warrior. Loggerfolk can smell BS from a mile away. I'm a lowly forester and I know my place. 

However, I am obligated to respond to the stuff that gets flagged for all of us mods, like spam, which is easy to kill once we see it. Posts marked or reported "Spam" allow me to flag and delete all of the poster's posts preemptively. If that sounds like an abuse of power... well, don't spam. I have often sent posters who I think might be legit but merely stupid a note saying "hey if you want to sell stuff here there are some rules". I have seldom seen a response. 

There's also a lot of grey area, which is most of the work. A specific scenario which I have seen many times: Poster A hates Poster B and continually tries to goad them into a fight but is very careful to not violate any of the board's rules. Poster B tries for a long long time to take the High Road because morals and all but eventually has JUST HAD IT and posts something that clearly violates a board rule, or maybe several. Who do I clobber, and when? Well, if I've done my job right, Poster A never gets a chance to push Poster B to that point. I try to jump in before it gets there. If, however, it does get there, I might throw a warning to both, or to the poster who I think is more volatile, or the poster who I think is more guilty. I'm most interested in maintaining neutrality and peace here. I believe that disagreement is an essential and useful tool for learning, so there's no way I'm going to respond to every "he said she said" complaint with a ban. I encourage each and every member of this board to review the rules that you agreed to when you signed on as a member here because each and every violation of those rules has the potential to be a pain in my ass. 

I promise you all that I won't kill a post or remove a poster because I disagree with them personally. This is a community and I am here to make sure that it functions as one. My feelings are mine, and you should never be subject to them. Unless, of course, we are drinking beers around the campfire at a GTG. In that case, you're gonna have to support your points same as me. It pays to do your homework. Just sayin'.


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## KiwiBro (Nov 2, 2018)

What Trump is doing with China is the last ditch effort from at least a decade of USA painting itself into this particular corner. He will prevail in this so-called trade war. Actually, what will be painted and perhaps perceived as a win is actually merely restoring the trade to a more balanced position. If I'm not mistaken, USA's current trade deficits with China are at or near record highs. It's unsustainable on many levels.

I'd be bloody happy if we can finally buy cedar logs/products from the Northern Hemisphere at less than nose-bleed pricing. Hopefully it doesn't hurt the guys actually doing the felling and processing, rather the middle men are shunted out of the way.

*editing to add* I've toured Chinese mills as a buying agent for different customers of different countries. Bent doesn't begin to describe the mill owners I've encountered, mainly in Northern China. But to be honest, I have to say I was quite disgusted by the conduct of one particular group of American buyers. Let's just say the opportunities to blackmail the bastards and threaten to tell their wives back in USA about the pros they engaged while in China were many. I purposely declined to deal with them after the way they behaved.


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## northmanlogging (Nov 2, 2018)

KiwiBro said:


> What Trump is doing with China is the last ditch effort from at least a decade of USA painting itself into this particular corner. He will prevail in this so-called trade war. Actually, what will be painted and perhaps perceived as a win is actually merely restoring the trade to a more balanced position. If I'm not mistaken, USA's current trade deficits with China are at or near record highs. It's unsustainable on many levels.
> 
> I'd be bloody happy if we can finally buy cedar logs/products from the Northern Hemisphere at less than nose-bleed pricing. Hopefully it doesn't hurt the guys actually doing the felling and processing, rather the middle men are shunted out of the way.
> 
> *editing to add* I've toured Chinese mills as a buying agent for different customers of different countries. Bent doesn't begin to describe the mill owners I've encountered, mainly in Northern China. But to be honest, I have to say I was quite disgusted by the conduct of one particular group of American buyers. Let's just say the opportunities to blackmail the bastards and threaten to tell their wives back in USA about the pros they engaged while in China were many. I purposely declined to deal with them after the way they behaved.


Now I agree trade with China needs fixed, but I don't see the cheetos plan as last ditch, but more of a knee jerk reaction, that is heavily biased on misinformation.

The blatant patent violations could easily be fixed by not allowing such things into the US, by regulating the amazon/allibubba/Ebay markets or simply just observing what gets shipped in. You know, doing what customs agents are supposed to be doing.

Before folks get all shirty about customs enforcement, there are long standing international laws regulating these things, china is in violation of them, but the US is just as guilty for allowing it to happen, like I said before some crooked suit is making bank off the deals, while the rest of us pay for it.

All that said US heavy industries have been in decline since the early 80's. Largely due to trickle down economics, thanks Reagan... and Bush, and now the cheeto too. Making it profitable to not invest in one's company, but rather outsource it to some half assed third world or communist country, with lower standards of both production and safety. Because **** you and your American dream, I'm rich and don't need to care about the workers.


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## Lizhen (Nov 2, 2018)

[QUOTE =“Jhenderson，帖子：6705252，会员：143764”]告诉中国人停止窃取知识产权，降低吉普牧马人的80％关税，并放弃将乙二醇加入宠物食品和牙膏中。贸易战将在第二天营业结束时结束。[/ QUOTE]
My friend, I'm a timber dealer. I can't do anything else.


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## Lizhen (Nov 2, 2018)

[QUOTE =“northmanlogging，post：6705512，member：76731”]因为担心这种危险的政治，你真的认为贸易战是关于吉普车或乙二醇或公然掠夺思想，煤炭或大豆

造成它的钱，仅仅是好的贪婪和小偷小摸，同时我们这些直接受到这场小小的贸易战的影响，得到短暂的吸管，最终可能失去我们的业务，家园，农场和生计，在[/ QUOTE]上不明确
We are ordinary people, we treat you my friends, we are not malicious, we hope everyone can be good


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## Lizhen (Nov 2, 2018)

My friend, we may not translate exactly. I don't understand you.


Gologit said:


> Logs for China? I had some this morning but I flushed them. Better luck next time.


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## Lizhen (Nov 2, 2018)

[QUOTE =“grizz55chev，帖子：6705849，会员：58629”]中国菜会做到这一点，容易解决问题。：p[/引用]


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## Lizhen (Nov 2, 2018)

[QUOTE =“CR888，帖子：6705881，成员：109954”]至少他并没有向该网站发送垃圾邮件。差的人... [/ QUOTE]
我的，看到你们能回复我我很开心。你们都用什么聊天。


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## northmanlogging (Nov 2, 2018)

Lizhen said:


> [QUOTE =“northmanlogging，post：6705512，member：76731”]因为担心这种危险的政治，你真的认为贸易战是关于吉普车或乙二醇或公然掠夺思想，煤炭或大豆
> 
> 造成它的钱，仅仅是好的贪婪和小偷小摸，同时我们这些直接受到这场小小的贸易战的影响，得到短暂的吸管，最终可能失去我们的业务，家园，农场和生计，在[/ QUOTE]上不明确
> We are ordinary people, we treat you my friends, we are not malicious, we hope everyone can be good


It's not the people, it's the government and big business


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## Lizhen (Nov 2, 2018)

[QUOTE =“Jhenderson，帖子：6706248，成员：143764”]你在叫我傻吗？你的地缘政治经济学学位来自哪里？可可泡芙盒子？让我们陷入困境的是自私的人。你知道，你投票的那些。他们不会让我们离开。如果你认为他们关心你，你最好先看看那个镜子，然后再打电话给别人。[/ QUOTE]
My friend, we don't want to fight a trade war, we want peace, we want a happy life. I don't know how to leave a message. I'm not familiar with our platform. That friend can teach me if he can.


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## Lizhen (Nov 2, 2018)

[QUOTE =“catbuster，post：6706853，member：43470”]前言 - 我同意你（Gyppo's Gyppo）的大部分要点。在1991年大选时我才5岁。我同意特朗普当选人在讨论中国和知识产权时对“MAGA”的担忧。他们确实偷了它，这是错误的。但现在就是这样。

我的学位来自路易斯维尔大学。虽然它是在土木工程，我们研究供应链和经济学和shtuff。显而易见的是，贸易战是一场刀战。你几乎互相切断，直到一个人流血。我们很难得到中国的支持，但我们对他们做了同样的事情并继续这样做。

如果你对这里的工业受到伤害比竞争更糟，那么高关税和贸易战可能适合你。东南亚可以比我们更快，更便宜地做事情，并且比我们在美国本土更能应对经济风暴。事实上，目前的联邦政策对美国的贸易和环境都不利。

我不会从那里开始，因为他的面孔可能会叫我一些有过度工作的工程师，并假设我在这个领域没有做任何事情。美国不会很快从1870年代到1970年代回到其主要的工业时代。没有任何政策可以决定毛泽东/习近平的经济口述。
我会在线程被锁定之前离开。[/ QUOTE]
Friends, what do you do? Are they all made of wood?


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## ChoppyChoppy (Nov 2, 2018)

Huntaholic said:


> Believe me, I hate to see this embargo ******** as much as anybody! YES it is going to affect me directly, I sold some shipping logs today in fact. My buyer told me that in order for them to make it before the deadline, his containers had to be shipped by next week. Tighten your belts guys, we may be in for a rough ride in the veneer business. My logs today did VERY well, 2 weeks from now who knows what the markets will be.



It helped me. I picked up about 700 tons of logs that were otherwise supposed to go to China. Contract got cancelled.

The guy that logged it is happy. Wood stays local, much less headache, and he loves that he's able to help a disabled vet grow his business.


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## KiwiBro (Nov 2, 2018)

northmanlogging said:


> Now I agree trade with China needs fixed, but I don't see the cheetos plan as last ditch, but more of a knee jerk reaction, that is heavily biased on misinformation.
> 
> The blatant patent violations could easily be fixed by not allowing such things into the US, by regulating the amazon/allibubba/Ebay markets or simply just observing what gets shipped in. You know, doing what customs agents are supposed to be doing.
> 
> ...


That's what I mean by painting yourselves into a corner but if laying blame I don't think consumers should get a free ride. It became too easy to choose the cheaper product consequences be damned. Happens here too. I marvel at how clueless consumers can be.


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## Jhenderson (Nov 2, 2018)

northmanlogging said:


> Now I agree trade with China needs fixed, but I don't see the cheetos plan as last ditch, but more of a knee jerk reaction, that is heavily biased on misinformation.
> 
> The blatant patent violations could easily be fixed by not allowing such things into the US, by regulating the amazon/allibubba/Ebay markets or simply just observing what gets shipped in. You know, doing what customs agents are supposed to be doing.
> 
> ...



I’d think someone who cares so much about workers would be sending their wood to all those local, high production mills you spoke about. It must be when the money goes in your pocket it’s different than those “ I’m rich and don’t need to care about the workers” guys you bad mouth on a daily basis.


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## northmanlogging (Nov 2, 2018)

KiwiBro said:


> That's what I mean by painting yourselves into a corner but if laying blame I don't think consumers should get a free ride. It became too easy to choose the cheaper product consequences be damned. Happens here too. I marvel at how clueless consumers can be.


Absolutely!

Oh but I saved $10!...

Buy junk. Eat junk, use junk, act like junk, walk like junk... 

On a slightly related note. Slightly... been driving truck the last 3 weeks, passing one of 4 locale wallmerch warts. Every day, and sometimes twice the police are called to wallyworld here...


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## Lizhen (Nov 2, 2018)

Do you have friends from Europe or North America? Can you give me a message? Take a look at the cooperative wood.


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## northmanlogging (Nov 2, 2018)

Lizhen said:


> Do you have friends from Europe or North America? Can you give me a message? Take a look at the cooperative wood.


there is an international forum on the main page of this sight, might have luck there

though folks from all over the world check in here from time to time


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## anymanusa (Nov 13, 2018)

northmanlogging said:


> You really need to stop ass-u-me-ing it makes you look even dumber


You should find a corner and have a good cry, snowflake.

Buck up, it's time to take care of the 800lb gorilla in the room. China.


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## newforest (Nov 13, 2018)

I have learned that China has a big demand for Pond Pine (Pinus serotina), a tree basically detested in the forest products industry in the southeastern states of the US. They are buying the logs and shipping them out from the Atlantic and Gulf Coastal plain ports. That's a long way to ship a raw log.

I am super curious to know what the application is for what comes out of those logs.

I also suspect that this is driving a big demand for Pond Pine seed, something I specialize in though it is not easy to get. I would really like to be in contact with whoever it is in China that wants this seed. Dealers offer me outstanding prices for the seed - which means someone is offering them a good price. But there is almost zero demand for the seedlings of that species here in the USA.


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## northmanlogging (Nov 14, 2018)

anymanusa said:


> You should find a corner and have a good cry, snowflake.
> 
> Buck up, it's time to take care of the 800lb gorilla in the room. China.



what is this kindergarten

Grow up, until then no one is going to take you seriously.

Seems the ultra conservatives only way to argue anymore is name calling and belittling, much like a shitty parent to snot nosed brat, that then usually grows up to be a shittier parent to criminal... but maybe thats just my perspective coming from a family of scum and criminals, who notably most are dead or in prison


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## anymanusa (Nov 14, 2018)

northmanlogging said:


> what is this kindergarten
> 
> Grow up, until then no one is going to take you seriously.
> 
> Seems the ultra conservatives only way to argue anymore is name calling and belittling, much like a shitty parent to snot nosed brat, that then usually grows up to be a shittier parent to criminal... but maybe thats just my perspective coming from a family of scum and criminals, who notably most are dead or in prison


"Ultra conservative"? Try "realist"

That's why you're in the corner with the dunce hat.


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## northmanlogging (Nov 14, 2018)

so much winning its hard to see reality...


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## CLASSIIILVR (Dec 9, 2018)

Flush some dandys this morning.....oops...sorry!


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## ChoppyChoppy (Dec 10, 2018)

ChoppyChoppy said:


> It helped me. I picked up about 700 tons of logs that were otherwise supposed to go to China. Contract got cancelled.
> 
> The guy that logged it is happy. Wood stays local, much less headache, and he loves that he's able to help a disabled vet grow his business.



Take that back, ended up with about 1000 tons total.


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## KiwiBro (Dec 10, 2018)

ChoppyChoppy said:


> Take that back, ended up with about 1000 tons total.


You know what's crazy? I know someone putting the final details on exporting firewood from overseas to USA and Canada. Whoda thunk there could possibly be enough $ in it for that carry on. He was saying the margins are better than his local market.


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## ChoppyChoppy (Dec 10, 2018)

Couple years ago the grocery store was selling birch campfire wood that had been brought in from Latvia.

I couldn't understand how it made sense $$ wise.

That wood we bought... the contract that fell out was a New Zealand company that was buying and exporting. Not sure all the details but in the end the deal fell through.

He has a boatload of wood though. Would have loved to get it all, but I don't have that kind of $$. A shady outfit in the neighboring town (the type that everyone is pretty sure is a front for not so legal things, but for some reason hasn't been caught), cut him a check for about 100k for logs. He's got a yard that's maybe an 1-2 acres and full of all sorts of junk cars and what not. They had to stack the logs as high as a 330 shovel loader will go.
Also a few others ended up with ~50-100 cords as well.

So Alaska wood, bought by a New Zealand company and shipped to China.

I can't understand how that could have enough $$ all around that everyone has butter on their bread.
I mean shoot, we have declined jobs because they were too far to haul equipment and logs.. and that was just ~100-150 mile area, not around the world!


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## KiwiBro (Dec 10, 2018)

It's a mad, mad world. I wouldn't be surprised if that NZ company was trying to line up back-to-back LC's and China revoked theirs. In the words of Tom Jones, it's not unusual.


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## Huntaholic (Dec 10, 2018)

One of my veneer buyers called again and is begging for logs. The China market is still booming for at least 90 days due to a "truce" on tariffs. I wish I had some more to sell!


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## woodfarmer (Dec 10, 2018)

What exactly do they do with these logs in China?


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