# hourly rates and quoting jobs?



## FerrisDiesel (Jan 31, 2008)

Ok, so my partner and I went and looked at a job yesterday. The homeowner wanted approx 2 acres brush cut and trees taken out, all the way down to the ocean, but leaving a 200 ft buffer for costal resource management. my first question is:

Would you guys give her a quote to do the whole job start to finish? or
Would you give her an hourly rate and take your time with no worries?
I have brush cut before, and know that it takes a while, especially since it is pretty wet right now.

My other question: When you bid out jobs for brush cutting with a machine, do you charge a rate for the machine and the operator: ex. 90 and hour for the machine and 45 an hour for the operator? or is it just one price for both? The reason I am asking, my partner was charging 65 and hour for the machine and operator........I don't see how we are going to make money charging that way.
Thanks for any help
Weave


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## lxt (Jan 31, 2008)

usually there is a dollar amount per acre, bid it like anything else how long will it take approx?., what do you charge per man hr?, whats the machines hourly rate? operation expenses, etc.. In a situation like this I usually try to find out what the home owners budget is, Not so I can charge them according to that, but so I know if the budget can handle the work needing done!

A home owner might think $2000.00 can cover all the work when in reality it will be much more, this will help you & lessen your bid cost analysis, also it will tell you if it is just a waste of time to even give a bid!! If she wont give you the approx budget figure then you just gotta bid the best you can!!


LXT..........


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## treemandan (Jan 31, 2008)

lxt said:


> usually there is a dollar amount per acre, bid it like anything else how long will it take approx?., what do you charge per man hr?, whats the machines hourly rate? operation expenses, etc.. In a situation like this I usually try to find out what the home owners budget is, Not so I can charge them according to that, but so I know if the budget can handle the work needing done!
> 
> A home owner might think $2000.00 can cover all the work when in reality it will be much more, this will help you & lessen your bid cost analysis, also it will tell you if it is just a waste of time to even give a bid!! If she wont give you the approx budget figure then you just gotta bid the best you can!!
> 
> ...


 I like you idea on asking the HO what their budget is. They often mistake it for shrewd tactics but in reality its not (for me at least). I blame their mistrust on those who have come before me.
If they give you an idea what they have in mind to spend it also serves as whether or not they are serious about doing the job.
Most people have a good idea of what their job might cost. If they say they have no idea they either are younger and don't know or trying to be shrewd or putting up a wall so they don't get screwed.
Considering the fact that they know tree work is expensive, they view it as something they could easily do if they had a chainsaw and a place to take the debris, and that they think that hardball sales is a practice everybody uses it is a tricky question to ask. If you want to ask it is is best to do it after you have established some repoire with them. 
I would like to take this time to thank the hard working people at Arborsite who have added the spell check at the bottom. Think how much worse I would have come off without it.


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## FerrisDiesel (Jan 31, 2008)

*The more I think about it*

I gotta tell ya, asking them what their budget is sounds like a great idea thanks LXT.
The homewoner I dealt with on this, is like a bigtime corporate executive.....and she basically buys properites and fixes them up to rent them out to her bigtime corporate friends for the weekends....
Have you guys ever talked to a person, and in your head your just like....red flag. red flag, red flag.....kinda have a bad feeling about the job, or the person????

Honestly, that is how I felt talking to this lady...She was concerned with getting screwed over, me messing up the yard, timeline....I understand that she is paying and all, but man, I seriously think she is gonna be there standing over my shoulder the whole time, and I can't stand that...
It just seems like to much aggravation than it's worth.


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## tree md (Jan 31, 2008)

Another thing to consider is how much you normally make in a week. If you can't make what you normally would it is not going to be worth it to you. To be honest, I prefer the smaller jobs to the larger ones because they always seem to take longer than I expect and I don't seem to make the money that I do by putting a few smaller jobs together. 

I never ask the customer what their budget is. It doesn't matter to me what their budget is, I know what mine is. I like to tell them what price I am going to charge, not the other way around. If you are slow right now you might be able to do the job cheaper than you would in the busy season but you still have to charge accordingly and make sure you don't screw yourself.


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## Mikecutstrees (Jan 31, 2008)

Those times when I have thought to myself "this person is going to be a total PITA do I really want to take this job?" I have been correct 90% of the time and wish I hadn't taken the job. But now when I get in that situation I just tack on 15% and smile because they are going to be a PITA and then at least I'm getting paid extra for the arrrivation or they don't want me to work for them which is fine too. Just my 2 cents....


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## Slvrmple72 (Jan 31, 2008)

If they do not view you as being on there level then you are just wasting your time. If it is a job that you do not have the resources on hand to throw at it( this includes tying up funds in equipment rental costs) then you are better off passing it on to a larger outfit. Avoid frustrating a homeowner who wants the job done NOW and putting yourself in a job that puts you in a hole instead of all the smaller jobs you could have done instead of it that keep you solvent. However, if the customer has no immediate time line and you can mutually agree on a timetable of work completion and payments ( payments which can be more agreeable to a homeowner instead of a lump sum) signed into a binding contract clearly outlining the work and payment requirements/schedule then go for it. This can be good for slow periods in your general operations and help in expansion to larger projects down the road. Just like trees the best businesses are the ones that grow slowly!


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## lxt (Jan 31, 2008)

tree md said:


> I never ask the customer what their budget is. It doesn't matter to me what their budget is, I know what mine is. I like to tell them what price I am going to charge, not the other way around. If you are slow right now you might be able to do the job cheaper than you would in the busy season but you still have to charge accordingly and make sure you don't screw yourself.




I normaly dont either unless the job is large, reason being & Ive had it happen, they want 3 oaks & 2 maples removed, tight area, large trees......should cost around $5000.00 but before I put pen to paper & waste my time, Ill let them know the approx cost & tell them it wont be cheap followed by whats your budget like? if I get a reply like....."Not that much" or "thats more than I thought" then I ask more questions about how much they would like to spend & how much they have to spend.

usually with the right questions you`ll get a feel for if they are serious or just plain out in left field & most importantly can they even afford what they want done, how many "I just wanted to see what it would cost" bids have we all done? Im not taking the time to write up a bid proposal & give my sales pitch to someone who has a $100.00 & wants $2500,00 worth of work done!! just not worth my time nor the effort.

LXT...........


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## tree md (Jan 31, 2008)

lxt said:


> I normaly dont either unless the job is large, reason being & Ive had it happen, they want 3 oaks & 2 maples removed, tight area, large trees......should cost around $5000.00 but before I put pen to paper & waste my time, Ill let them know the approx cost & tell them it wont be cheap followed by whats your budget like? if I get a reply like....."Not that much" or "thats more than I thought" then I ask more questions about how much they would like to spend & how much they have to spend.
> 
> usually with the right questions you`ll get a feel for if they are serious or just plain out in left field & most importantly can they even afford what they want done, how many "I just wanted to see what it would cost" bids have we all done? Im not taking the time to write up a bid proposal & give my sales pitch to someone who has a $100.00 & wants $2500,00 worth of work done!! just not worth my time nor the effort.
> 
> LXT...........



That makes sense. I guess I am looking at it from my own perspective. All of the larger jobs I have done have either been commercial or referrals so I know they are serious.

I have had my share of tire kickers too though. Seems like the more advertising I do the more window shoppers I get.


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## daveyclimber (Feb 1, 2008)

I have done well pricing each individual piece of equipment at $50 per hour and each laborer at $50 an hour for up to a 3 laborers and chip truck/chipper and aerial lift. $200-$250 per hour as of late. It sounds to me like a daily rate may be better for you. Estimate how many days it will take to complete the contract. Figure what your expenses are . Figure the profit you want to make to make it worth your while. If you have a 2 man crew and a mowing machine I don't see why $1500-$2000 per day would be out of the question depending on your local market.


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