# Stihl MS 241 c-m questions



## Gopher Hunter (Jun 13, 2014)

Greetings from a fairly new member

Backgroiund: I currently own a 5 YO Husky 450 with an 18" bar and a newer Stihl 211 with a 14 & 16" bar. Both work fine for the most part.

Due to a 4000+ elevation and 80+ degree temperature variation over which I might use the 'bigger saw' I'm thinking of upgrading the bigger of my saws (the 450) to a saw with autotune. I'm pretty much convinced the best option for me would be a Stihl 241 or 261 just so that everything would be 'brand similar'. So here's my dilemma: I would prefer to go the 241 (over the 261) route due to the lighter weight but the US version is only offered in a 16" max bar length. I'm OK with 16" for 90% of what I'd use the saw for but there is the occasion when I'd like to run an 18" bar. I.e. I'd probably sell the 450 just so I don't have a shelf full of saws. 

The *very* curious thing is that the 241 is offered with an 18" bar in the UK but only a 16" bar in the US. 
http://www.stihl.co.uk/STIHL-Produc...insaws-for-forestry/21936-130/MS-241-C-M.aspx

Does anyone know if US dealers would setup a 241 with an 18" bar or optionally if running that bar long length would somehow violate the US warranty or have the Stihl gods PO'd at me? My WAG is that this shorter bar length is a certification/lawyer issue but that's just a guess! The fallback route would be to just purchase an 18" bar/chain 'on the sly' or go with the heavier 261. 

Thanks for any constructive advise! 

cheers
JohnG


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## KenJax Tree (Jun 13, 2014)

The 261 and 241 are smaller than your 450


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## Thornton (Jun 13, 2014)

John

I'm new here but the way I see it is they probably feel an 18 in bar on the 241 a 41cc saw is to much chain to drag the 241 and the 261 are both pro saws the 261 is a 50cc saw same as your 450 but being a pro saw it will have a little more HP than your 450 and probably out perform it pretty good JMO I'm like you wanting a 241 for the size and weight I don't know what you are cutting I mainly cut mesquite and small oak


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## AKDoug (Jun 14, 2014)

The 241's are o.k., but they depend on the picco chain and short bar for their performance. A 261 is a significant improvement over both the 241 and your 450.


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## 1Alpha1 (Jun 14, 2014)

Go with a MS-261 C-M. You simply will not regret it.


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## zogger (Jun 14, 2014)

Get the larger 261.


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## treesmith (Jun 14, 2014)

A 241c is nice but its happier with a 14" in hardwood


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## SawTroll (Jun 14, 2014)

Good for a Stihl - but still not great in the power to weight ratio, and generally not so.....


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## MCW (Jun 14, 2014)

I run my 241 with .325" and a 16" bar buried in Aussie hardwood and it does fine. Not sure why people would think it struggles? It does it easily. Even an 8 pin rim goes OK.
Picco certainly does cut well though but I run .325" because Picco goes blunt too quick with what I cut.


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## treesmith (Jun 14, 2014)

We had one at work on trial, came with a 12" picco bar, changed it for a 14" and it was great. Good to know it'll happily take a 16" .325. Isn't that standard size on the 261? Impressive


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## mountainlake (Jun 14, 2014)

Over here I find that picco chain stays sharp a lot better than .325 chisel cutting through some dirt. Steve


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## MCW (Jun 14, 2014)

mountainlake said:


> Over here I find that picco chain stays sharp a lot better than .325 chisel cutting through some dirt. Steve



I gather you're referring to semi chisel Picco? If so I agree 100%.


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## mountainlake (Jun 14, 2014)

Yes, I use that semi chisel pico around the mill cutting up slabs which some times have quite a bit of dirt. Steve


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## gary s (Jun 14, 2014)

I have had my 261 for a few years now and it is my "most used" saw, I like it.


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## Gopher Hunter (Jun 14, 2014)

Thanks for the informative feedback everyone.

I'm taking another look at the 261. The 261 is just over 4 oz heavier than my 450E so it's likely I won't notice much difference in handling between the two. 

Also, I do quite a bit of cleanup work with dirty wood so those chain suggestions are helpful. It sounds like the .325 chains are better than pico for cutting dirty wood. 

cheers
JohnG


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## MCW (Jun 14, 2014)

If you get a 261 then you can run 3/8" chain which will wear even better than .325". They have more than enough torque to pull a 20" bar with the larger chain.


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## SAWMIKAZE (Jun 14, 2014)

Not to make this a stihl vs husky thing , but , i bought a 241 unseen as my dealer had to order it and the one thing that came to my mind was that the saw as far as physical size goes wasnt much smaller than my 346..may not matter to you..a 261 is an awesome firewood saw


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## Chris-PA (Jun 14, 2014)

Any decent 40cc saw should be able to pull a 16" bar with Lo Pro/Picco easily in US hard woods. My GZ4000's can, my 142 can, even my ported 38cc Earthquake can. My GZ4000's usually run an 18" bar. Why not just get a spare 18" B&C and use it when you need it? It won't harm anything. 

You mentioned 4000' altitude changes but hot how high you get - if you are at high altitude you'll lose power so a larger displacement might make sense. But then if you move from Lo Pro/Picco the kerf will be wider and the saw will have to move more wood, so you lose some of the displacement advantage. You'll have to decide how much the weight matters to you.


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## bryanr2 (Jun 14, 2014)

since your selling your big saw (450) you dont need to downgrade to a small dispacement since the replacement saw will become your big saw. Between the 241 and 261 I would consider the 241 a limbing saw and the 261 a general firewood saw. Make sure you go with the CM version on the 261. Another option since you already own a 450 is to look very carefully at the Husq 550xp. Member Mesupra sells them at incredible savings here in the classifeds section from time to time. Here is some food for thought.....



the slowest is the 261cm.... but it also has more torque whereas the other two are known for chain speed. 261cm is also Mastermind's favorite 50cc saw- I know he likes the filter setup on them and the way they cut (torque vs speed) says you can lean on them more. I have a 261cm and the also own the 2153 in this video. The 2153 will never be sold. THe 261cm is stihl on trial with me. Wanted to try it out based on Randy's opinion of them.


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## beermeatguns (Jun 14, 2014)

The 241's are available w/ 16" and 18" bars in .325 and 3/8 lo pro all depending on where you're located. 
Our saws here in the Northeast are coming with 3/8 lo pro set ups.


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## Gopher Hunter (Jun 14, 2014)

bryanr2 said:


> since your selling your big saw (450) you dont need to downgrade to a small dispacement since the replacement saw will become your big saw. Between the 241 and 261 I would consider the 241 a limbing saw and the 261 a general firewood saw. Make sure you go with the CM version on the 261. Another option since you already own a 450 is to look very carefully at the Husq 550xp. Member Mesupra sells them at incredible savings here in the classifeds section from time to time. Here is some food for thought.....
> snip.......................



Yes, the 3 saws I'm considering are the 241, 261, and 550xp. All have autotune and are "pro" line products. I'm actually reasonably satisfied with the Husky 450e but I'm looking to 'step up'. The 550xp first caught my attention due to the light weight and smaller size. That really appeals to me as I'm not a big guy and I'm a member of the "retired age group". 

I should mention that most of my saw work is (has been) cleanup related. I actually cut no more than a cord of wood at the sawbuck each year. I also don't drop too many big trees any more. However, I seem to do a fair bit of trail/lot cleanup. Lots of dirty wood and also BIG old hard stumps. I've even contemplated keeping the 450E as my "stump/ugly-work" saw and getting the 241 or 550xp for more civilized stuff and when I need to go to other elevations. This might be the best triple play even considering I'd have one more saw on the shelf.

cheers
JohnG


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## Gopher Hunter (Jun 14, 2014)

beermeatguns said:


> The 241's are available w/ 16" and 18" bars in .325 and 3/8 lo pro all depending on where you're located.
> Our saws here in the Northeast are coming with 3/8 lo pro set ups.



Thanks for that info!


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## opinion (Jun 14, 2014)

These saws come from the factory with the 3/8P spur sprocket 16", but I don't see why you couldn't get .325, 18" if you wanted. The MS 250 and 241 has the same rated power with the 241 having more "efficient" power, and the 250 functions fine with its standard .325, 18" despite what AS enthusiasts think. But it's kind of a waste of money having to buy a new bar, chain and sprocket when you could just get the 261 for $50 more... unless the smaller and lighter weight is what your objective is I suppose.


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## bryanr2 (Jun 14, 2014)

Gopher Hunter said:


> Yes, the 3 saws I'm considering are the 241, 261, and 550xp. All have autotune and are "pro" line products. I'm actually reasonably satisfied with the Husky 450e but I'm looking to 'step up'. The 550xp first caught my attention due to the light weight and smaller size. That really appeals to me as I'm not a big guy and I'm a member of the "retired age group".
> 
> I should mention that most of my saw work is (has been) cleanup related. I actually cut no more than a cord of wood at the sawbuck each year. I also don't drop too many big trees any more. However, I seem to do a fair bit of trail/lot cleanup. Lots of dirty wood and also BIG old hard stumps. I've even contemplated keeping the 450E as my "stump/ugly-work" saw and getting the 241 or 550xp for more civilized stuff and when I need to go to other elevations. This might be the best triple play even considering I'd have one more saw on the shelf.
> 
> ...



Very small weight penalty between the 261cm and stepping up to the Triple Nickel- Husq 555. It is considered by many to be the ultimate firewood saw. If you go that route consider also the Jonsered 2258 (which is a better looking 555). PM Spike60 or Tlandrum for pricing. Both will beat your local price I bet. I use TL for Jonsered/Husq stuff cause I want to support a fellow TN businessman.


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## SawTroll (Jun 15, 2014)

beermeatguns said:


> The 241's are available w/ 16" and 18" bars in .325 and 3/8 lo pro all depending on where you're located.
> Our saws here in the Northeast are coming with 3/8 lo pro set ups.



Be aware that the Stihl small mount (3005) 18" bars actually are 16" bars, the 16" ones are 15", etc.


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## MCW (Jun 15, 2014)

SawTroll said:


> Be aware that the Stihl small mount (3005) 18" bars actually are 16" bars, the 16" ones are 15", etc.



As far as I am aware Niko Stihl do make an actual 18" 3005 mount bar and the DL count is something like 76DL in .325" - I was working on some SES (State Emergency Service) MS251's the other week that were fitted with Stihl E .325" 18" bars.


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## SawTroll (Jun 15, 2014)

MCW said:


> As far as I am aware Niko Stihl do make an actual 18" 3005 mount bar and the DL count is something like 76DL in .325" - I was working on some SES (State Emergency Service) MS251's the other week that were fitted with Stihl E .325" 18" bars.




If so, that's something new to me - they usually are 68dl.

http://www.stihllibrary.com/pdf/catalog/SawChainSelectionID.pdf



The only 76dl .325 bars I know of are the small Husky mount 18" Tsumura bars?


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## MCW (Jun 15, 2014)

SawTroll said:


> If so, that's something new to me - they usually are 68dl.
> 
> http://www.stihllibrary.com/pdf/catalog/SawChainSelectionID.pdf
> 
> ...



All I know is that the DL count was completely new to me. They had some Husky 346XP saws there as well with 18" bars and they wanted to run the same chain on both but that simply wasn't going to happen as the DL counts were different.


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## weedkilla (Jun 15, 2014)

My 2c - I think a 241 is a better saw than the 450, and so close to the 211 size and weight that you wouldn't bother with it very often. 
I think the 241 would replace both saws, if that's your aim, great. If not - then I think a husky 545,555, stihl 261 makes more sense.
I believe the husky 545/555 are better options for most people than their 550/562 siblings. Wider power band and more forgiving in use.


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## SawTroll (Jun 16, 2014)

MCW said:


> All I know is that the DL count was completely new to me. They had some Husky 346XP saws there as well with 18" bars and they wanted to run the same chain on both but that simply wasn't going to happen as the DL counts were different.



76dl in .325 was new to me as well, I learned about the 76dl Tsumura bars with small Husky mount just a few days ago, in another thread here. It looks like they simply use the same bar body as the 68dl 3/8" bars, with a .325 nose.
The result is a bar that actually is about 18 1/2" - and the only (known to me) true 18" bars in .325.


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## MCW (Jun 16, 2014)

SawTroll said:


> 76dl in .325 was new to me as well, I learned about the 76dl Tsumura bars with small Husky mount just a few days ago, in another thread here. It looks like they simply use the same bar body as the 68dl 3/8" bars, with a .325 nose.
> The result is a bar that actually is about 18 1/2" - and the only (known to me) true 18" bars in .325.



It may not have been exactly 76DL Niko but it was significantly more than the 62DL on a standard E 16" bar. It was over 72DL though.


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## SawTroll (Jun 16, 2014)

MCW said:


> It may not have been exactly 76DL Niko but it was significantly more than the 62DL on a standard E 16" bar. It was over 72DL though.



Interesting! Are you sure they were "called" 18", and not 20" - that would sort of fit with 62dl in 16" and 68dl in 18" called lengths?


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## MCW (Jun 16, 2014)

SawTroll said:


> Interesting! Are you sure they were "called" 18", and not 20" - that would sort of fit with 62dl in 16" and 68dl in 18" called lengths?



They were a 2-4 DL longer than the 18" chains from the 346XP's.


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## SawTroll (Jun 16, 2014)

74-76dl then, provided the 18" Husky bar is common (but short) 72dl variety.


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## Gopher Hunter (Jun 16, 2014)

weedkilla said:


> My 2c - I think a 241 is a better saw than the 450, and so close to the 211 size and weight that you wouldn't bother with it very often.
> I think the 241 would replace both saws, if that's your aim, great. If not - then I think a husky 545,555, stihl 261 makes more sense.
> I believe the husky 545/555 are better options for most people than their 550/562 siblings. Wider power band and more forgiving in use.



Thanks for the suggestions and I agree that the 211 might get orphaned if I go with the 241. The 211 was an impulse buy when my 450 was down for a 9 count. In retrospect I which I had done a "pro" upgrade at that time. 

Can you elaborate just a bit why the 545/555 would have a wider power band than the 550/562. 

thanks again for all of the excellent comments
John


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## SawTroll (Jun 16, 2014)

Gopher Hunter said:


> ....
> Can you elaborate just a bit why the 545/555 would have a wider power band than the 550/562.
> 
> ....



They don't really - but the power *feels* more "even", because they lack the higher top-end performanse of the xp versions.

Btw, you really have no use for the MS241 if you buy a 550xp or 545 - the weight differense is small.


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## weedkilla (Jun 16, 2014)

I'd disagree with sawtroll, they DO have a wider power band. The absence of crank stuffers on the 545/555 makes a significant difference to the way the power is delivered. They do lose a minimal amount of top end power, and they gain a wider power band/more low end torque. It's my opinion - formed by watching employees who aren't saw fanatics, they just want to get a job done and go home - that these saws suit more people than the xp versions. 
Chainsaw work isn't consistent work for us, I just use it to keep the guys working when the weather isn't suitable for spraying weeds. I notice a big difference in the way the guys use saws when we are on them every day vs infrequently. I think that most weekend cutters are better off with a 545/555 from what I've seen. 
If you like having the fastest version of things, if you are cutting consistent timber types, if you are going to take a genuine interest in chain sharpening and cutting technique - then the xp versions are great. It's not a big $ difference.


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## Stihlman441 (Jun 16, 2014)

241 16'' .325 semi chisel 7 pin


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## weedkilla (Jun 16, 2014)

@Gopher Hunter - there is enough advice on Arboristsite to confuse the issue. We all have an opinion that is formed from our own experience, from the 2 stihls mentioned and the 50/60cc husky options there is only one saw I wouldn't want to own. And that same saw has a lot of people claiming it as a favourite. 
Dealer and price will ultimately sway you, but at least get a feel of the saws in a shop. Demo if you can. I know that the first few hours on the stihl options had me changing my beliefs on them. 

Trying to keep my own bias out of things, listing these saws in order of weight/physical size - 
Stihl 241
Husky 545/550
Stihl 261
Husky 555
Husky 562 (few ounces heavier than 555 due to some small differences in spec)
At each step up in size the weight difference is very small, but noticeable.

If you made that list as an order of power, or ease of use, or air filtration, etc, etc then it would look different! And what matters to you will affect your decision. 
Honestly you could cut all of your firewood with any of them for many years and be completely happy.


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## Gopher Hunter (Jun 16, 2014)

weedkilla said:


> I'd disagree with sawtroll, they DO have a wider power band. The absence of crank stuffers on the 545/555 makes a significant difference to the way the power is delivered. They do lose a minimal amount of top end power, and they gain a wider power band/more low end torque. It's my opinion - formed by watching employees who aren't saw fanatics, they just want to get a job done and go home - that these saws suit more people than the xp versions.
> Chainsaw work isn't consistent work for us, I just use it to keep the guys working when the weather isn't suitable for spraying weeds. I notice a big difference in the way the guys use saws when we are on them every day vs infrequently. I think that most weekend cutters are better off with a 545/555 from what I've seen.
> If you like having the fastest version of things, if you are cutting consistent timber types, if you are going to take a genuine interest in chain sharpening and cutting technique - then the xp versions are great. It's not a big $ difference.



Thank you for those observations. That's a nuance I haven't seen elsewhere and one I suspect might generate further "debate". I would definitely fall into the "infrequent" cat so the 545 and 241 are now the top candidates for my next saw. 

Popcorn anyone??? 

regards
John


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## weedkilla (Jun 16, 2014)

It's such an unusual situation - for husky to be selling a pro saw and a mid range saw that are essentially the same, with minor differences in tune. Although there are other cases of husky doing similar things, in this case I think they nailed the tune to suit the different users - they didn't just cheapen/strangle the saw to suit a price point. 
Normally the lower end models have a different engine, and simply aren't as good as their pro siblings. The stihl 251 isn't in the same league as a 241 for instance.


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## Tnshaker (Jun 16, 2014)

I will have to agree with sawtroll.....not much weight difference in a 241 and a 545/550 but a huge increase in power. I am just not a 241 fan because of tthe 545/550.


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## weedkilla (Jun 16, 2014)

Tnshaker said:


> I will have to agree with sawtroll.....not much weight difference in a 241 and a 545/550 but a huge increase in power. I am just not a 241 fan because of tthe 545/550.


I notice it more when I compare a 261 to a 555. I think the 241 is a sweet little saw.


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## tacomatrd98 (Jun 16, 2014)

I'll bite...I have a 241, HAD a 261cm(that should say something there), have a 550xp and a 562xp. I tend to overbuy things due to the theory that using a small saw too hard will shorten it's life versus using a larger saw to less than it's design capabilities will extend it's useful life. 

With that said, I really like a 562xp as a one saw plan. Light enough to be a good limber and enough snot to fell/buck decent size wood with. Even bone stock they run like they have an attitude problem and are angry with the wood. Not as angry as a ported 346xp but close.

I also really like the 550xp and I feel this would probably be you're best option. I run 3/8 18" on mine and it pulls it just fine despite what other think, with a reasonably skilled hand you do not need 70cc's to pull 3/8 chain.

Onto the 261cm...I do not own it anymore...Maybe it was a factory dud, maybe it wasn't "broken in" but either way, it was a dud. And I'm a stihl guy. It was a slug from day one. With .325 it wasnt bad but it had no nuts with the 3/8th on it. A 261 does not feel light and flickable like a 241 or 550 feel.

Enter 241cm. BADA$$ little saw. Build quality is great sans the bleeping plastic clutch cover and handlebar. The air filter is great, stainless muffler, mag cases, spring av, etc etc. It is lighter and forgive me, handles better than the 550xp and 346xp. I haven't tried .325 on mine yet. I run 18" stihl bar and 3/8 PS Picco chain. You can burry it in whatever wood you want and it will hold it's rpm's really well and keep throwing chips. I'm not saying it is the fastest cutting saw, just that it is a pleasure to use.
I love the little thing but I don't think it would be my go to firewood saw unless I do not tackle anything over about 16" and weight was a concern. Mine is a used for limbing. I assume with heavy firewood duties you would be scrapping bar/chains often as they are made pretty light for these saws. Awesome saw for it's intended purpose.

Now that you are confused, I'd go with 550xp as my first choice, then the 241. The 241 has better filtration but the 550 with 3/8 semi chisel would be ideal for cleanup work with great power and little weight penalty. In most situations, The 241 will do anything the 261 will. In your situation, I think the 562 would be overkill.

-AJ


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## Fishnuts2 (Jun 16, 2014)

Gopher Hunter said:


> Thank you for those observations. That's a nuance I haven't seen elsewhere and one I suspect might generate further "debate". I would definitely fall into the "infrequent" cat so the 545 and 241 are now the top candidates for my next saw.
> 
> Popcorn anyone???
> 
> ...


If you are looking at the 545, don't overlook the Jonsered 2252. Same saw, different colors and perhaps you can secure a better deal from one of the vendors here. It is a most impressive little saw. Mine has an 18" bar with .325 and has a bad attitude for wood.


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## MCW (Jun 16, 2014)

For those that haven't run a 241 next to a 550XP in a production type environment they probably haven't realised the 241 will get around 10% more trees on the ground by the end of the day through fuel efficiency alone. On trees around 8-14" the 241 is actually a far more effective saw. I'm a Husky fan too


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## KenJax Tree (Jun 16, 2014)

In the 40cc class i like my Dolmar 421 for $200 less


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## bryanr2 (Jun 17, 2014)

Stihlman441 said:


> 241 16'' .325 semi chisel 7 pin




that video proves that the 241cm benefits greatly from a trip to Cuddle LN.


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## MCW (Jun 17, 2014)

KenJax Tree said:


> In the 40cc class i like my Dolmar 421 for $200 less



I've heard good things about that model Dolmar and I am a Dolmar fan. Have you run one against the 241C though? My situation is probably a bit different to most as all I do is fall trees moving from one tree to the next. In a 10 hour day the saw is probably running for nearly 9 1/2 hours. The extra efficiency of the 241 over for example the 550XP isn't apparent unless the run time is significant. For shorter faster jobs I generally grab the 550.


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## AKDoug (Jun 17, 2014)

We all use saws for different things. In my case, 99% of my current saw use is bucking wood for firewood and 99% of that wood is held up in the air by an excavator bucket. The 241 in this case won't keep up with a 261 in any way. Since you can refuel while in between log moves, fuel efficiency really doesn't come into play. After watching MCW's falling videos, I can easily see why a 241 is an advantage for him.


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## SawTroll (Jun 17, 2014)

MCW said:


> For those that haven't run a 241 next to a 550XP in a production type environment they probably haven't realised the 241 will get around 10% more trees on the ground by the end of the day through fuel efficiency alone. On trees around 8-14" the 241 is actually a far more effective saw. I'm a Husky fan too



I highly doubt that fuel efficiency is a big factor in _most_ peoples use of chainsaws this size - even though it is in yours. 

Mostly it simply is about trading a small gain in weight for a big loss of power.


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## SawTroll (Jun 17, 2014)

Tnshaker said:


> I will have to agree with sawtroll.....not much weight difference in a 241 and a 545/550 but a huge increase in power. I am just not a 241 fan because of tthe 545/550.



I would have bought one years ago if it wasn't for the 346xp. As it is, I simply can't define a need for a 241 or any other 42/43cc saw.


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## Mastermind (Jun 17, 2014)

The 241 is a great little saw......no doubt. 

We have a 241, 261, 2252, and a 562XP. 

All of them get used quite a bit.......but the 261 is still my favorite. 

The 241 gains less from the port work than the others though. I get 25% or so from them, it's a pretty good runner stock.


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## MCW (Jun 17, 2014)

SawTroll said:


> I highly doubt that fuel efficiency is a big factor in _most_ peoples use of chainsaws this size - even though it is in yours.
> 
> Mostly it simply is about trading a small gain in weight for a big loss of power.



It depends on how far away from your fuel source you are. Fuel efficiency however is probably underrated by a lot of people and fill up times actually add up to a lot more time than people think. I know people who can't even use 5 litres of fuel before it's stale so in these people's cases fuel efficiency means nothing. Also most people have never done the same work while having a variety of similar saws to use. Most guys have a small, medium, and possibly large saw, generally the same brand, and only use one at a time. When you have a few saws in the same class you can compare notes a bit. For example with these smaller trees in the 40-50cc class I've used an MS261, MS261C, Husky 353, MS241C, 550XP, Dolmar 5100-S, Stihl 026, and even a Sachs Dolmar 115i. I now only have the 241C and 550XP after selling the rest. For these smaller trees I actually rate the saws in this order for many reasons, not just fuel economy:

1) MS241C
2) Husky 353
3) Dolmar 5100-S
4) Husky 550XP/MS261C (Husky feels better but 261's filter and spikes are better)
5) Stihl 026
6) Stihl MS261
7) Sachs Dolmar 115i

I honestly regret selling the 5100-S. That was a cracker little saw and I kept my MS261 at the time instead. The throttle response and speed of the 5100-S was absolutely perfect for these smaller trees.
As mentioned if I just need to cut a few things up I generally reach for the 550XP. It is significantly faster than the 241 in the cut - the downside is the filter is pretty average and the felling spike is next to useless. I would suggest that when designing a spike on a saw most engineers with half a brain cell would make the spike long enough so that uneven tree shapes actually clear the front of the case. It would seem that Poppa Husqvarna and his clan overlooked this point and didn't realise that there are trees in the world that aren't perfectly spherical. Hence I have a caved in muffler and no paint on the front of the saw 
Like always though there are people who make comments about which saws are best without taking all saw use situations into account. I have a situation where the 241 has shown to be faster than the 550XP which makes people think about things a bit more. Many people rate saws simply by running them in a cant race and seeing which one finishes the cut faster. Using that analogy I should be using the 3120 which 18" bar to fell these smaller trees


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## weedkilla (Jun 17, 2014)

I still don't get how the 241 gets a flogging for being too close to the 550 weight, and the 261 gets a free pass when it can be compared to the 555. 
I guess I have to weigh them or look up independent tests to check - but they feel really close to me, and the 241 feels noticeably smaller and lighter than the 550.


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## bryanr2 (Jun 17, 2014)

all this talk about weight in these saws is amusing. We basically are passing judgement over a weight difference that boils down to a can of beer. Weight differences should be absolutely irrelevant in this class of saw.


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## Termite (Jun 17, 2014)

"I honestly regret selling the 5100-S. That was a cracker little saw and I kept my MS261 at the time instead. The throttle response and speed of the 5100-S was absolutely perfect for these smaller trees.
As mentioned if I just need to cut a few things up I generally reach for the 550XP. It is significantly faster than the 241 in the cut - the downside is the filter is pretty average and the felling spike is next to useless. "

I agree with these two statements. 5100 is a very nice and very smooth saw. I actually preferred running it to my 262xp.
And the spikes on the 550 and 2253 are ridiculous. I replaced the original 2253 spike with the one from my 2260 and bought the heavy duty spikes for the 2260. It is an improvement for both saws.

Not being a heavy user of chainsaws, why should the OP spend over $500 for a 40cc saw. If he has CAD or just wants one fine. But honestly, I use a 40cc saw more than any other because it is the correct size for the cedar I cut. I can not see how a Stihl 241 is 300+ dollars better than a Redmax 3800.


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## flyinlow (Jun 17, 2014)

I have both a Snellerized 241cm and a Snellerized 261cm and they both have attitudes. You can't tell the difference between them until the wood gets over 10" and then the torque of the 261 really shines. But------ why use a heavier saw to cut all the smaller limbs? My 241 weighs 13.2 lb and the 261 weighs 15 lb. ready to cut with 16" bars and .325 chain. I use 100LL at 40:1 with Stihl Ultra because it's the only high quality fuel available without alcohol. Both my saws are at about 195 lb compression and have advanced timing and the like the 100LL. I seldom use my bigger saws because these 2 put a smile on my face. And I cut hedge 80% of the time. These sure work for me.


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## tacomatrd98 (Jun 17, 2014)

Termite said:


> "
> I can not see how a Stihl 241 is 300+ dollars better than a Redmax 3800.



It's like the jeep thing, you just wouldn't understand.


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## Chris-PA (Jun 17, 2014)

Termite said:


> "Not being a heavy user of chainsaws, why should the OP spend over $500 for a 40cc saw. If he has CAD or just wants one fine. But honestly, I use a 40cc saw more than any other because it is the correct size for the cedar I cut. I can not see how a Stihl 241 is 300+ dollars better than a Redmax 3800.


I use 40cc saws to cut most of my firewood, because they are more than enough to do it with ease. But there are certainly other people with other requirements. Also, for a professional outfit an additional $300 for a basic tool is not that big a deal - it does provide Mtronic, and at the present time I think it is the only feedback carb 40cc saw.


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## Mastermind (Jun 17, 2014)

Stihl builds a high quality saw, with very good resale value.......they are worth more because of that. 

Period.


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## Chris-PA (Jun 17, 2014)

Mastermind said:


> Stihl builds a high quality saw, with very good resale value.......they are worth more because of that.
> 
> Period.


Only if you intend to sell it. If you are a home firewood cutter who buys a saw with the intent of using it until is of basically no value anymore, like you would many other tools, then resale value is irrelevant. I have never sold a saw and don't ever intend to, so I am more interested in value on the front end - what capability I can get for the money I pay. 

Things like power tools are poor financial investments, or maybe it is better to say poor stores of long term value, so the whole resale argument is suspect in my view. If you are a homeowner and buy a $1000 saw, in ten years it is yard sale material. The value of that same saw in use at a tree service is used up in a much shorter time. Enthusiasts like on AS create a market for saws that are not too old or have not been used up, but that market is small and likely to disappear if economic troubles persist, and people's disposable income and/or access to credit is reduced.


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## MCW (Jun 17, 2014)

bryanr2 said:


> all this talk about weight in these saws is amusing. We basically are passing judgement over a weight difference that boils down to a can of beer. Weight differences should be absolutely irrelevant in this class of saw.



In the 50cc class I can sort of agree but there is a reasonable difference between let's say the MS241 and MS261.
That can of beer may not sound like much but when you are going not stop all day with arms outstretched with the majority being limbing that can of beer makes a huge difference. I'm not a little guy and my "chainsaw fitness" is pretty good which helps but even I notice the difference. It's not enough to make tears well up in my eyes or make me want a hug but my arms certainly notice the difference.
If you're just dropping saws into logs all day then the weight difference isn't really noticeable as the log holds the weight.

Oh and I'm talking to the arborist who bought my 5100-S and he's not fussed if I buy it back off him


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## SawTroll (Jun 17, 2014)

While the 550xp and the 346xp are quite close to the MS241 in weight, the MS261 and the 5100S (or 5105) are quite a bit heavier.
The worst with those saws (261 and 5100/5105) aren't really the weight alone though, but in combination with an inboard clutch (that puts the bar too far from the centre of mass off the powerhead), the handling quality (specially when limbing) is seriously degraded in comparison.
Also, in stock form they lack the "explosive" throttle response of the 50cc Husky saws.


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## MCW (Jun 17, 2014)

SawTroll said:


> While the 550xp and the 346xp are quite close to the MS241 in weight, the MS261 and the 5100S (or 5105) are quite a bit heavier.
> The worst with those saws (261 and 5100/5105) aren't really the weight alone though, but in combination with an inboard clutch (that puts the bar too far from the centre of mass off the powerhead), the handling quality (specially when limbing) is seriously degraded in comparison.
> Also, in stock form they lack the "explosive" throttle response of the 50cc Husky saws.



Interesting. I've probably done more limbing than 95% of AS members and haven't found the balance an issue at all. You can notice it but it's clutching at straws (pardon the pun!) to say it's a major problem. 
Maybe I just had a good 5100-S but the only stock saws I have used with better throttle response are my 200T and 550XP.
Weight can be an issue, even small amounts, but the balance isn't as bad as you make it sound. Once again this is all subjective depending on the user but the Huskys are top shelf 50cc saws, no doubt about it.


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## dl5205 (Jun 17, 2014)

Chris-PA said:


> ...If you are a homeowner and buy a $1000 saw, in ten years it is yard sale material...



Not always. I bought a new 372xp in '01 that will bring more now than what I payed for it. It has been used, but taken care of.


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## SawTroll (Jun 17, 2014)

Just something I posted in another thread, that is relevant here;

"It is several years since I first saw and handled a 241, but I never really tried one - I simply don't see any use for that saw, or the PS-420/421, or the Husky 543xp, when the alternative is the 346xp or 550xp. If the alternative was the MS261 or the 50cc Dolmars, it would be different though."

People are different though, as are the conditions they use their saws under.


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## SawTroll (Jun 17, 2014)

MCW said:


> Interesting. I've probably done more limbing than 95% of AS members and haven't found the balance an issue at all. You can notice it but it's clutching at straws (pardon the pun!) to say it's a major problem.
> Maybe I just had a good 5100-S but the only stock saws I have used with better throttle response are my 200T and 550XP.
> Weight can be an issue, even small amounts, but the balance isn't as bad as you make it sound. Once again this is all subjective depending on the user but the Huskys are top shelf 50cc saws, no doubt about it.




I guess we will have to agree to disagree (again) then, but it does tell me something that you put the non-xp 353 as high on your list as you did.


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## Swamp Yankee (Jun 17, 2014)

MCW said:


> Interesting. I've probably done more limbing than 95% of AS members and haven't found the balance an issue at all. You can notice it but it's clutching at straws (pardon the pun!) to say it's a major problem.
> Maybe I just had a good 5100-S but the only stock saws I have used with better throttle response are my 200T and 550XP.
> Weight can be an issue, even small amounts, but the balance isn't as bad as you make it sound. Once again this is all subjective depending on the user but the Huskys are top shelf 50cc saws, no doubt about it.



Agreed

I have been cutting professionally mostly part time but full time as well for over 30 years. (Logs hard and soft, firewood and pulp) In all that time I have never said nor heard another cutter ever say he wished his XYZ saw had an outboard clutch for better handling. I have on the other hand, myself included, sworn at the blankity blank outboard clutch when I got the bar pinched and couldn't get the darn powerhead off. Of course if it was a 10 inch dia. softwood pecker pole I was stuck in, I could have just lifted the end myself or pushed the tree over by hand and got it free.

In short what you're politely alluding to MCW, is sometimes people really need to get out in the woods and cut to find out what is really important, what is BS, and what really happens when Mr. Murphy rears his head.

As to the PS5100S, yea I still got mine. The 346XP is gone. For all around work I in the woods or cutting on a pile of treelength firewood with a 50cc saw the 5100 is hard to beat. The 346 may have spooled up faster but in the big picture of cutting for a day, that means nothing when you think of the time spent when you have to rebalance yourself for safety, move a branch out of the way, clear the puckerbrush so you can access the cut etc. etc. I guess my question if anyone would care to address it, at the end of the day how many more board feet or cord could be produced using the difference in spool up time between a 5100 vs. a 346? Don't get me wrong, I liked my 346XP but it was not worth keeping two 50cc saws with such close performance.

As to the original discussion, in talking to the NE Stihl rep, as hard as it may be to believe, the MS241C-M was not created for cutting softwood pecker poles. It was developed with the arborist industry in mind as an alternative bucket saw to the MS200T/201T/192T as the big utility companies and their contractors are going away from top handle in the bucket trucks per increased pressure from their insurance carriers. It's a viable alternative as the companies' inventory of bars and chains is a direct fit so there is no need to resupply all the trucks or obsolete valuable inventory. I've been at the Stihl dealer when CL&P comes in for their order. It's on pallets that get loaded with forks on the skidsteer. We're not talking about 2 or 3 bars and a half dozen chains here.

As to fuel usage, once again in the bucket truck applications the last thing you want is the operator going up and down 60 or so feet, or stopping just to fill his saw. I help my buddy, an independent tree service from time to time when he needs extra ground crew. One job a few months ago down time due to fuel was absolutely critical. He was doing a removal and had a crane brought in. Every minute he could shave off the crane time on site was big money. He had his two MS201Ts in the bucket and borrowed my MS200T as well just to eliminate stopping and wasting time and money. Once again it's the market and how the saw is used that makes fuel usage critical. Just because it matters not to some to others it's huge.

One other reason, secondary to the arborist use for the MS241C-M is with the big price jump in the MS261C-M here in the US. Dealers wanted a saw to sell to prosumers as an upgrade, but still hit that $500 or so price point. This is where having the 18 inch bar 3/8 Picco PS3 combo makes it an attractive alternative at that particular price point.

Well I'm sure I've worn out my welcome by now, MCW, keep dropping those trees and battling the BS.

Take Care


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## SAWMIKAZE (Jun 17, 2014)

flyinlow said:


> I have both a Snellerized 241cm and a Snellerized 261cm and they both have attitudes. You can't tell the difference between them until the wood gets over 10" and then the torque of the 261 really shines. But------ why use a heavier saw to cut all the smaller limbs? My 241 weighs 13.2 lb and the 261 weighs 15 lb. ready to cut with 16" bars and .325 chain. I use 100LL at 40:1 with Stihl Ultra because it's the only high quality fuel available without alcohol. Both my saws are at about 195 lb compression and have advanced timing and the like the 100LL. I seldom use my bigger saws because these 2 put a smile on my face. And I cut hedge 80% of the time. These sure work for me.



I didnt think the m-tron's liked any ignition advance ?


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## flyinlow (Jun 17, 2014)

SAWMIKAZE said:


> I didnt think the m-tron's liked any ignition advance ?


Point well taken --I stand corrected-- the older saws are all advanced!


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## SAWMIKAZE (Jun 17, 2014)

flyinlow said:


> Point well taken --I stand corrected-- the older saws are all advanced!



No worries mate , i was wonderin if there was somethin new that i missed


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## KenJax Tree (Jun 17, 2014)

All M-Tronics need is a removed spark arrester and 5 tanks no need for anything else except......maybe some square filed chain?


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## XSKIER (Jun 17, 2014)

KenJax Tree said:


> All M-Tronics need is a removed spark arrester and 5 tanks no need for anything else except......maybe some square filed chain?


Is that a dig against mike, or have you actually run a C-M for 5 tanks?


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## KenJax Tree (Jun 17, 2014)

XSKIER said:


> Is that a dig against mike, or have you actually run a C-M for 5 tanks?


Funny you even mention Mike lol....i have run an MTronic 261 and 441 enough to know they're nice saws, but my Husky dealer treats me better so thats what i use. I know they're cheap and flimsy but they feel better to me too.


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## XSKIER (Jun 17, 2014)

KenJax Tree said:


> Funny you even mention Mike lol....i have run an MTronic 261 and 441 enough to know they're nice saws, but my Husky dealer treats me better so thats what i use. I know they're cheap and flimsy but they feel better to me too.


Oh. Do you spend a lot of time at the husqy dealer buying parts to keep flimsy saws held together enough to cut wood?


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## weedkilla (Jun 17, 2014)

Gopher Hunter said:


> Greetings from a fairly new member
> 
> Backgroiund: I currently own a 5 YO Husky 450 with an 18" bar and a newer Stihl 211 with a 14 & 16" bar. Both work fine for the most part.
> 
> ...


4 pages ago this was the question.

The OP wants an autotune/mtronic saw. He has his eyes in a 241, others would choose something else because of their own needs and the advice as to why has been given over and over. 

Surely we can all agree that the 241 is a top quality saw that will be still cutting wood long after the initial price has been forgotten. It's not my idea of a "big" saw, but that's fine. It has many good points and it's downsides are only in comparison to saws that the OP isn't considering - all though he suggested in a later post he would look at a husky 545/550 as well. 
My guess is he will really enjoy a 241, and down the track decide he wants a 60/70cc saw and will add to his collection.


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## KenJax Tree (Jun 17, 2014)

XSKIER said:


> Oh. Do you spend a lot of time at the husqy dealer buying parts to keep flimsy saws held together enough to cut wood?



Actually no none at all except air filters,fuel filters,and plugs and a gas line or 2.


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## MCW (Jun 18, 2014)

SawTroll said:


> I guess we will have to agree to disagree (again) then, but it does tell me something that you put the non-xp 353 as high on your list as you did.



That 353 was just a really good saw. In smaller trees people may find it amusing but when falling you can actually have a saw that cuts simply too fast to be controllable. The 550XP even with .325" is just too fast in the trees I'm in - remember that despite being small they still have to be accurately felled so the alignment of the cuts is critical. The 353 was a really good compromise between the size of the 241C, and the crazy grunt of the 550XP. Just a great saw for this particular job and if I didn't have to carve something out of my 40-50cc lineup I'd still have it. I reached a point where I had that many saws that did a similar job that something had to go.
I actually tried running my ported 7900 with 3/8" full chisel in these trees and it was simply stupid fast to the point I had no idea where the cuts were or where the trees were going to go 
You know I respect you a lot Niko and there will always be things we don't agree on. Overall though we tend to agree on 98% of things


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## treesmith (Jun 18, 2014)

SawTroll said:


> I guess we will have to agree to disagree (again) then


I chose a 261 after using somebody else's 346 for a while, a 346 is a good saw as is a 550 but having used all 3 I'd still choose a 261.
One mans husky is another mans Stihl


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## MCW (Jun 18, 2014)

treesmith said:


> One mans husky is another mans Stihl



I agree. They are certainly all good saws. The 261's have some excellent features however their off idle throttle response was a deal killer for this job. The 241C also has a habit of stuttering off idle and I've found myself subconsciously blipping the throttle between cuts to keep the revs up. The Huskies I've used haven't had this problem. 
The M-Tronic version of the 261 did fix the off idle response considerably. 
Porting also helps big time on the Stihls.


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## Philip Wheelock (Jun 18, 2014)

Chris-PA said:


> ...If you are a home firewood cutter who buys a saw with the intent of using it until is of basically no value anymore, like you would many other tools, then resale value is irrelevant. I have never sold a saw and don't ever intend to, so I am more interested in value on the front end - what capability I can get for the money I pay.
> 
> Things like power tools are poor financial investments, or maybe it is better to say poor stores of long term value, so the whole resale argument is suspect in my view. If you are a homeowner and buy a $1000 saw, in ten years it is yard sale material. The value of that same saw in use at a tree service is used up in a much shorter time. Enthusiasts like on AS create a market for saws that are not too old or have not been used up, but that market is small and likely to disappear if economic troubles persist, and people's disposable income and/or access to credit is reduced.


OK. But there remains a good possibility that the typical home firewood cutter will not be able to run a farm use or pro-level saw long or hard enough to exhaust its value, i.e., wear it out. Four out of five of my saws, aged two to ten years, were purchased used and run just fine with no breakdowns; the sale prices averaged half the original cost (new). Definitely not in the yard sale range.


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## Termite (Jun 18, 2014)

MCW said:


> I agree. They are certainly all good saws. The 261's have some excellent features however their off idle throttle response was a deal killer for this job. The 241C also has a habit of stuttering off idle and I've found myself subconsciously blipping the throttle between cuts to keep the revs up. The Huskies I've used haven't had this problem.
> The M-Tronic version of the 261 did fix the off idle response considerably.
> Porting also helps big time on the Stihls.


 And don't forget the superior build quality on those saws!


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## MCW (Jun 18, 2014)

Termite said:


> And don't forget the superior build quality on those saws!



Whoops. Small oversight on my part


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## Gopher Hunter (Jun 21, 2014)

Thanks again for the varied comments.

Like many of these sort of decisions I think mine has morphed a little. I'm currently thinking along these lines in terms of a 3 saw plan:

Pick up a new MS 170/180/192 C-E for the very lightest stuff: brush to 4"
Use my currently owned MS 211 for slightly heavier cleanup work and most of my sawbuck action: 3-8"
Sell my Husq 450 and pick up a new 555 for the 'bigger' stuff I have to tackle: >8" I want at least one saw with auto-tune.
So, the latest variation of my original question boils down to the quality/price of the 170/180/192. I think the 3 saw plan listed above makes the most sense with the 192 C-E since the 192 is significantly lighter than the 211 (middle) saw. The only thing holding me back is the price of the 192 C-E ($389 US) for the 14" bar. Is the 192 really "worth" that up charge? i.e. is there a proportional increase in quality/serviceability of that saw compared to the 170 and 180? I don't mind paying for quality IF there's really a quality dif there. Otherwise, I'll just go with the 180 and consider it a "disposable" saw over a 5 year lifetime of moderate "ranch" use.

Note: If I go with the 180 I'd be tempted to just sell the 211 (because it's so similar) and use it as part of a 2-saw plan with the 555.

Edit: Comments/suggestions on my latest plan are more than welcome

cheers
JohnG


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## MCW (Jun 21, 2014)

Don't go an MS170 as they're Chinese. Go a 171 or 181. Unless you definitely think you need a top handle leave the 192 alone and stick with the rear handle saws - you're paying more money just because it's a top handle, not because it's built better or performs better.


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## weedkilla (Jun 21, 2014)

I think you've picked the best fire wood saw on the market for your big saw, and the jump in size from your 211 to the 555 is about right. 20cc tends to be the right sort of difference between saws so that they actually have enough difference to justify putting one down and choosing another. 

It's obvious that a very light saw is important to you, but I'm not sure that it's worth buying another saw from the 170/180/192/211 family. There are differences - but they are all the same basic engine at heart. Having two of them doesn't make any sense to me. The 192ce is lightest by a fair margin, but I don't see that it's a big enough difference to matter. Selling your 211 to buy any of them would be a big dump of cash relative to the small gain in weight reduction you might enjoy. Maybe just buy a lightweight 14" bar and some stihl ps chain for the 211 and make do with it as your small saw? I just don't see a 3 saw plan in your choices.


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## Gopher Hunter (Jun 21, 2014)

weedkilla said:


> I think you've picked the best fire wood saw on the market for your big saw, and the jump in size from your 211 to the 555 is about right. 20cc tends to be the right sort of difference between saws so that they actually have enough difference to justify putting one down and choosing another.
> 
> It's obvious that a very light saw is important to you, but I'm not sure that it's worth buying another saw from the 170/180/192/211 family. There are differences - but they are all the same basic engine at heart. Having two of them doesn't make any sense to me. The 192ce is lightest by a fair margin, but I don't see that it's a big enough difference to matter. Selling your 211 to buy any of them would be a big dump of cash relative to the small gain in weight reduction you might enjoy. Maybe just buy a lightweight 14" bar and some stihl ps chain for the 211 and make do with it as your small saw? I just don't see a 3 saw plan in your choices.



I generally agree with you re the differences between the 211 and the other small Stihl saws. That said, I'd really like a lighter saw than the 211 for trail/brush use. As I stated in a previous comment the 211 was a bit of an unplanned/uneducated purchase. Picked it up when the Husky was sick. In retrospect, I really think the 192 C-E (rear handle) saw would have been a much better choice. OK, thinking about it even more.................I do agree "3 saw plan" that included a 180/192 + 211 makes very little sense. Thanks for the dope slap. 

Slight confession here: I'll admit that part of my jones for another new light saw is due to the fact that the 211 has been running really poorly the last couple times I fired it up. After reading a bit on this (and other forums) I think the problem might be a minor carb tweak, bad fuel, or even the spark arrestor being plugged. So, I'll get the 211 running well and *then* decide on whether it makes sense to sell it for a 192 C-E.

Would still like to hear from AS members about the 192 C-E (rear handle) saw. If it's a really good quality (lightweight) saw I wouldn't mind trading up from the 211 to it. For what I'd use it for, the MUCH lighter weight of the 192 would be much more important than the very slight power drop relative to the 211.

cheers
JohnG


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## MCW (Jun 21, 2014)

Whoops sorry - I didn't see the "CE" and thought you were talking the top handled version of the 192


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## Gopher Hunter (Jun 21, 2014)

MCW said:


> Whoops sorry - I didn't see the "CE" and thought you were talking the top handled version of the 192



No problemo............................... 

I very briefly considered a top handle but I'm just a weekend warrior/rancher and probably wouldn't be safe with one. NOT trying to hijack my own thread with this issue though. opcorn:

cheers
JohnG


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## weedkilla (Jun 21, 2014)

Gopher Hunter said:


> Would still like to hear from AS members about the 192 C-E (rear handle) saw. If it's a really good quality (lightweight) saw I wouldn't mind trading up from the 211 to it. For what I'd use it for, the MUCH lighter weight of the 192 would be much more important than the very slight power drop relative to the 211.
> 
> cheers
> JohnG


The quality is identical. Slightly worse to work on as it's a top handled saw that's had a rear handle added to it. 
I've looked at these saws plenty of time trying to find a saw lighter than my husky 346 that is a saw I genuinely want to own. I haven't found that saw yet. 
I have a dolmar 401, it's ok. I've used a stihl 241, it's a brilliant saw and will probably replace my 50cc huskies with them when the time comes but it isn't THAT much lighter, I've looked at the 192ce and can't justify the price when the 211 exists, I've looked at the 201ce but not available in Aus and would be very expensive by the time I import it. The redmax/zenoah 3800-4500 look very interesting but aren't available in Aus. I'm curious to try the husky 543 when it becomes available - but I don't hold high hopes as it's just not that light. 
So that's where my advice comes from - none of the options are brilliant, so the one you've already got is waaaaaay cheaper than buying something else. (Look more into the redmax saws. They are supposed to be pretty special and are quite cheap stateside)


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## longbowch (Jun 21, 2014)

I bet if you bought a husky 545 it would be the only saw you would need. Jmo. Maybe that's because I really want one.


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## MCW (Jun 22, 2014)

longbowch said:


> I bet if you bought a husky 545 it would be the only saw you would need. Jmo. Maybe that's because I really want one.



You need a Husky 3120 then


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## woodchipper95 (Jun 22, 2014)

I have a 545, life is good, really good!


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## Gopher Hunter (Jun 22, 2014)

weedkilla said:


> The quality is identical. Slightly worse to work on as it's a top handled saw that's had a rear handle added to it.
> I've looked at these saws plenty of time trying to find a saw lighter than my husky 346 that is a saw I genuinely want to own. I haven't found that saw yet.
> I have a dolmar 401, it's ok. I've used a stihl 241, it's a brilliant saw and will probably replace my 50cc huskies with them when the time comes but it isn't THAT much lighter, I've looked at the 192ce and can't justify the price when the 211 exists, I've looked at the 201ce but not available in Aus and would be very expensive by the time I import it. The redmax/zenoah 3800-4500 look very interesting but aren't available in Aus. I'm curious to try the husky 543 when it becomes available - but I don't hold high hopes as it's just not that light.
> So that's where my advice comes from - none of the options are brilliant, so the one you've already got is waaaaaay cheaper than buying something else. (Look more into the redmax saws. They are supposed to be pretty special and are quite cheap stateside)



Thanks for that info on the 192 CE. After digging a bit more I can't find any rave reviews on that saw so it's off the short list. I'll probably just get the 211 running better and then decide if it's light enough for my brush/light stuff. So maybe/likely keep the 211 or possibly replace it with a MS 180 or Husq 435. The 435 is intriguing because it's pretty light and at 40cc more than enough for brush/light use. About the same price as the MS 180 so it would be a toss-up on which to go with................ if I decided to go that direction.

The 555 looks like the near perfect saw for my 'bigger' work. I know the 555 is not a "big saw" by AS standards but it's plenty big enough for the largest trees (<36") I might deal with. Plus, it has auto-tune so I'd be good-to-go when using it under varied temperatures and elevations.

cheers
JohnG


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## weedkilla (Jun 22, 2014)

Sounds like a good plan to me. Hang around here, you'll find the answers about chains, bars, muffler mods for questions you don't know you have yet! You may even get keen enough to pick up a junker at a yard sale and start playing with it. Your knowledge and interest will only grow from here, just be aware that CAD is real and seems to be infectious in these parts.


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## woodchipper95 (Jun 22, 2014)

weedkilla said:


> Sounds like a good plan to me. Hang around here, you'll find the answers about chains, bars, muffler mods for questions you don't know you have yet! You may even get keen enough to pick up a junker at a yard sale and start playing with it. Your knowledge and interest will only grow from here, just be aware that CAD is real and seems to be infectious in these parts.



Probably one of the more true post I've read on here!


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## Spectre468 (Jun 23, 2014)

weedkilla said:


> Sounds like a good plan to me. Hang around here, you'll find the answers about chains, bars, muffler mods for questions you don't know you have yet! You may even get keen enough to pick up a junker at a yard sale and start playing with it. Your knowledge and interest will only grow from here, just be aware that CAD is real and seems to be infectious in these parts.



And, he forgot to warn you: THERE IS NO KNOWN CURE!!!


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## bryanr2 (Jun 23, 2014)

Spectre468 said:


> And, he forgot to warn you: THERE IS NO KNOWN CURE!!!




Who the hell wants to be cured? Cad is an "enlightened state of mind" not a disease. Embrace it people!


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## Stihlman441 (Jun 23, 2014)

AKDoug said:


> The 241's are o.k., but they depend on the picco chain and short bar for their performance. A 261 is a significant improvement over both the 241 and your 450.


 
Not true i use a 16'' and .325 no probs in Ozzy wood.


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## AKDoug (Jun 23, 2014)

Stihlman441 said:


> Not true i use a 16'' and .325 no probs in Ozzy wood.


I swear you Ausies got different 241's than I did. Mine will barely outrun an 025.


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## MCW (Jun 23, 2014)

AKDoug said:


> I swear you Ausies got different 241's than I did. Mine will barely outrun an 025.



The ones Andrew and I got actually came from the UK. I was under the impression that M-Tronic specs are the same worldwide unlike some of the carby versions?


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## Stihlman441 (Jun 23, 2014)

AKDoug said:


> I swear you Ausies got different 241's than I did. Mine will barely outrun an 025.


 
Plus Mastermind tinkered with my one.


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## MCW (Jun 23, 2014)

Stihlman441 said:


> Plus Mastermind tinkered with my one.



But you did run a stock one for a fair while too  Mine will pull a 16" bar buried in our hardwoods quite easily - have videos of it in Redgum and it does pretty well. Even with an 8 tooth rim it does OK although slightly faster with a 7 tooth rim.


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## Stihlman441 (Jun 23, 2014)

I ran two of um stock before sending one away,and yes even stock they are a very good little saw.


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## SawTroll (Jun 23, 2014)

MCW said:


> The ones Andrew and I got actually came from the UK. I was under the impression that M-Tronic specs are the same worldwide unlike some of the carby versions?



I don't really know if anything is different with the US version, but assume an IPL that is new enough would tell....


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## MCW (Jun 23, 2014)

SawTroll said:


> I don't really know if anything is different with the US version, but assume an IPL that is new enough would tell....



You'd probably know more Niko but as far as I'm aware the M-Tronics comply with emissions in every single country so I'd assume specs are basically the same globally.


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## SawTroll (Jun 23, 2014)

MCW said:


> You'd probably know more Niko but as far as I'm aware the M-Tronics comply with emissions in every single country so I'd assume specs are basically the same globally.



As far as I know - yes.


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## Gopher Hunter (Jun 24, 2014)

At the risk of scratching old wounds is the hot start issue with the Husky AT saws a thing of the past? All of the threads on that issue seem to have petered out mid-late 2013. 

kind regards
JohnG


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## MCW (Jun 25, 2014)

Gopher Hunter said:


> At the risk of scratching old wounds is the hot start issue with the Husky AT saws a thing of the past? All of the threads on that issue seem to have petered out mid-late 2013.
> 
> kind regards
> JohnG



They seem to be. To be honest I believe that some of the hot start issues that were complained about were actually user error although there were definitely some warrantable problems.
The AT saws will not idle on choke unlike the M-Tronics and it's easy to keep on pulling and flood them.
I intially thought I had the dreaded AT issues but once I got my starting procedure ironed out my 550XP has been fine.


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## RedFir Down (Jun 25, 2014)

MCW said:


> I intially thought I had the dreaded AT issues but once I got my starting procedure ironed out my 550XP has been fine.


What is your starting procedure for the 550xp Matt?


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## MCW (Jun 25, 2014)

RedFir Down said:


> What is your starting procedure for the 550xp Matt?



It's actually nothing special but it is easy to miss that initial "pop" and then flood the thing. When it fires under choke it is sometimes nearly inaudible. It really isn't that hard but coming from M-Tronic and standard carby saws, with a lot of time on both, it was a whole new ballgame for me and I swore more than once 
The thing I've found with my 550XP is that it's just SO easy to flood compared to my other saws if you get it wrong.


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## weedkilla (Jun 25, 2014)

Funny - I could start my 562 with my eyes closed, standing on my head with one hand tied behind my back when it was stock. Now it's ported I notice the same thing - listen really carefully for the pop. When the chipper is running I've learnt to walk away from the noise. 

I've never had a hot start problem, stock or ported.


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## RedFir Down (Jun 25, 2014)

MCW said:


> It's actually nothing special but it is easy to miss that initial "pop" and then flood the thing. When it fires under choke it is sometimes nearly inaudible. It really isn't that hard but coming from M-Tronic and standard carby saws, with a lot of time on both, it was a whole new ballgame for me and I swore more than once
> The thing I've found with my 550XP is that it's just SO easy to flood compared to my other saws if you get it wrong.


Good to know, thank you.


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## woodchipper95 (Jun 25, 2014)

Gopher Hunter said:


> At the risk of scratching old wounds is the hot start issue with the Husky AT saws a thing of the past? All of the threads on that issue seem to have petered out mid-late 2013.
> 
> kind regards
> JohnG


I am 18 I have a 545 I do not have much experience with saws. I read the starting process in the manual and I can start my saw in any temp with 0 problems! If im fast enough I can do it in one pull. It normally takes two with choke on 1 with it off. Hot starts are as simple as putting your choke on, then taking it off and pull 1 time. It re-sets the high idle.


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## woodchipper95 (Jun 25, 2014)

MCW said:


> It's actually nothing special but it is easy to miss that initial "pop" and then flood the thing. When it fires under choke it is sometimes nearly inaudible. It really isn't that hard but coming from M-Tronic and standard carby saws, with a lot of time on both, it was a whole new ballgame for me and I swore more than once
> The thing I've found with my 550XP is that it's just SO easy to flood compared to my other saws if you get it wrong.


I have never flooded my 545!


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## MCW (Jun 25, 2014)

woodchipper95 said:


> I have never flooded my 545!



Joy for you  The only times I had issues with my 550XP was when wearing a helmet with the muffs down. As I said when it fired on choke it was very difficult to hear and the muffs didn't help things. As I also said the "pop" was nearly inaudible. Unlike yourself I'd run a lot of saws and you do get into a certain mode I suppose and when the 550XP came along I had to change a few things.

I will say this though and it is unlike all of my other saws in this case. Sometimes when it's been run and has cooled a bit it seems to find this "sweet spot" where it won't start easily with choke or without it. It doesn't happen often but when it does you have to leave it sit for another few minutes and start it with choke.


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## Termite (Jun 25, 2014)

I have had several saws that if I waited for a pop I would flood them every time. 
My "Wicked 2260" resets the compression release every time I pull the rope Pop or not!


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## jeepyfz450 (Jun 25, 2014)

All my Saws start on one pull..... The problem is I don't know which one it will be

Smittybilt saws


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## weedkilla (Jun 25, 2014)

Termite said:


> I have had several saws that if I waited for a pop I would flood them every time.
> My "Wicked 2260" resets the compression release every time I pull the rope Pop or not!


Terry did my 562 - and it acts the same. Wish I had a compression tester that fitted in that little spark plug hole....


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## VinceGU05 (Jun 25, 2014)

MCW said:


> I agree. They are certainly all good saws. The 261's have some excellent features however their off idle throttle response was a deal killer for this job. The 241C also has a habit of stuttering off idle and I've found myself subconsciously blipping the throttle between cuts to keep the revs up. The Huskies I've used haven't had this problem.
> The M-Tronic version of the 261 did fix the off idle response considerably.
> Porting also helps big time on the Stihls.


 give it to benn*e to run it in his MDG 1 and see if it can retune it for you


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## MCW (Jun 25, 2014)

VinceGU05 said:


> give it to benn*e to run it in his MDG 1 and see if it can retune it for you



Don't worry mate. Stihl would make sure that if any Huskys are hooked up it would blow the circuitry straight away. 

All this talk of compression and decomp valves popping out every pull must mean that my Chinese MS660 copy has 220psi. Or a dodgey decomp


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## Gopher Hunter (Jun 27, 2014)

Quick update:

Taking a little detour from the last update. Going to try a Husky 261 (from an AS member) and will see if that old saw scratches my "big saw" itch. Conceivably, the 261 could sit comfy with a two saw plan with the MS 211. ??? Will see if the 261 can be easily tuned for my expected elevation changes. I'm guessing it can but I reserve the right to try an auto-tune saw sometime in the near future. I swear I'm not succumbing to CAD ....................  hahaha. OK, where is that thread on upgrading the 261 to a 262.............  

Thanks again for all of the suggestions
John


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