# Bi-annual polesaw/ pole pruner rant



## Greg (Aug 28, 2003)

I am a happy new owner of a Huyauchi pole saw. That sucker has got some reach!! I've had it for 2 weeks and am very happy with it. I had been using a cheap home depot Carona pole saw for the last 3 years, but got tired of the bent blades. This thing is really nice and feels good in your hands. --walking around in the back of my truck with spikes on yesterday I steped on the handle and put a nice little rip in the rubber.... 
Greg


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## Kneejerk Bombas (Aug 28, 2003)

I also got a silky pole saw after using the jameson fiberglass for years. It cuts faster, it's lighter and adjustable.
I don't use the jameson, except for the pruner head, anymore.
I like the way the silky scabbard has a place for a strap so you can clip it to your belt, the bucket, or the tree.


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## monkeypuzzle (Aug 28, 2003)

Been using the 21 footer for about a year now. You really have to be easy on it because the cheap slot buttons are wimpy. 

Overall, good tool.On a scale of 1-10 I give it a 5


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## Tom Dunlap (Aug 28, 2003)

Brian, 

I was being a smart-mouth 

Well, you opened the door, buddy...

I put a new pole saw blade on and it bent within a few cuts. What's the deal? Can anyone recommend a specific blade that holds up? 

The Corona pruner head is a pretty cheesy rip off of the Marvin pruner head. I get tight jawed when a company takes a proven design and makes, subtle and mostly cosmetic changes. This is close to a bait and switch scheme. From what I can see, the only difference in the Corona is a swivel on the pulley and a tiny bit larger opening. I can't see any need for a swivel. Can someone enlighten me? 

Marvin has served me well for over 25 years. They're American made not from the Pacific rim. That isn't a real big deal to me, but seeing the copy, its enough to confirm my loyalty to Marvin, even if they are a few dollars more. The two heads that I have in service are many years old so the pro-rated cost isn't even a consideration.

I'm still using wooden hex poles from Marvin. They get a coat of yellow, latex enamel and last for years. The head section of a pole saw broke but it was in service for many years. I like the light weight of the wood. Cost is a bit of a factor too. On some brand fiberglass sticks, the male end would go too deep into the female end. This is a PITB because I needed to fiddle around lining up the retainer spring pin. On Marvin poles I slip the sections together and twist to line things up, snap, and I'm off to work.

Tom


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## John Paul Sanborn (Aug 28, 2003)

I like the basswood poles if I'm using a polesaw.

I bought a 21ft hayauchi last week, the blade is wicked and it does telescope, but as others have said, it has some drawbacks. 

At that price, I don't like taking it in the tree, cuz it has a tendancy to fall a part. 

No way to hang it on a branch without making a hook.

I'm having plastic from the cam locks jam in the detent pins.

It's not real handy for pulling hanggers.

As Mike M. said a while back, the blade angle could be moved.

it telescopes from the botom out so it is allways tip heavy.

But it is a 21ft saw with a wicked sharp blade. great for those line of sight jobs (For those who think Vista is very tightly defined) where you need to grab that one little twig 20 ft up it is a time saver.

Or deadwooding spruce....


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## Stumper (Aug 28, 2003)

Tom You lost me on the Corona vs Marvin bit. I own a Marvin (PH4 was the designation back when I bought it I think) Great head. I also own a Corona "Bull Lopper" a totally different design that has served me well for over a decade. My guess is that you are talking about the Sherrill head being a copy of the Marvin-I assumed that it IS a Marvin head just private branded????. No arguement about the Marvin being an excellent design-it's been around for ages and is hard to improve upon. I used to use wooden poles (still use wood for the head pole) but after switching to fiberglass I won't switch back-they hold up better and stay straight. I share everyone else's frustration about Polesaw blades. The ones that cut the best all seem to have something flimsy in the design!. I haven't had too much trouble with the ARS razortooth blades bending but they drilled so stinkin' many holes in the base trying to make it fit everything that the tail just breaks out after a while. The Corona I tried cuts good but bends all over the place.


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## Tom Dunlap (Aug 28, 2003)

The Marvin PH4 is King! Made tough to last.

Just looked in the Sherrill catlog and they have the 15372 pruner head. NOT made by Marvin. I've spent time talking with the Marvin owner @ TCI. If you compare them side by side you will see the similarities and the differences. Both are subtle. That's what bugs me. If a company is going to design something, why not make it look and function different instead of making a shadow of the original? That's unseemly to me. 

Tom


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## Rob Murphy (Aug 28, 2003)

Stumper, Just had the tail of my ARS break as well !! Nice pole saw head...got a long life with minium bending till it eventually broke.Just got a shop to grind of tip and base , drill new hole, Iam thinking to make it a handsaw to hang of the chipper. 
I am using Jamieson poles, same as for Big Shot adapted to WOLF adapted to ARS head.


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## MasterBlaster (Aug 28, 2003)

The Mondo blade, from Sherrill, is the stoutest blade I've ever used. And, it has the stoutest price, but well worth it.


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## Rob Murphy (Aug 29, 2003)

Just saw the Ars head in the sherrill cattledog ..mines a bit diff.
Handsaw , Polesaw head refitted , Polesaw Head.


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## Tree Machine (Aug 29, 2003)

*Pole Pruner Favorite*

I'll be honest; I just don't get the polesaw thing. I tried one in the early 90's and found that the push / pull, push / pull action out in front of my chest to be one of the most exhausting exercises I had endured. Very unnatural action for a human. Also, you have little ability, especially the longer the pole is, to put the downward force of the blade into the limb. You can push/pull til you're sweating beans, but without that woodward directed pressure, sawing this way seems rather inefficient. If the blade is in any way dull, you compound this effort. If you are anything but 90 degrees to the limb, your cut (ellipse, rather than a circle) will take longer. What about undercutting to avoid tearout. And what happens when that saw blade gets a good limb-pinching?

If you are up in a tree with a pole saw, does that mean you don't have a pole pruner up there with you? I mean, is it one or the other? 

I'm fortunate in being able to use a Power Pruner; a gas chainsaw on a telescoping pole, which gives me a 3 meter reach from the ground. It is a fast cutter, though I never climb with it. If I had a Silky Hyuachi pole saw, I bet it would get very limited use, and I would not climb with this, either, because I climb with my pole pruner, which can do a lot of things that a pole saw can't. 

If the limb is too big to cut with the Corona's large 1-3/4" capacity, and the 2:1 pully advantage of the pruner head, then I'm climbing after it anyway. -TM-


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## rbtree (Aug 29, 2003)

Brian,

Thanks for the tip!

Actually I'm quite happy with my blades which I get from Bishop for about $14. I think they are Fanno, but now have an extra unneeded hole. They are a bit flimsy, but rarely break, unlike the ones that Sherril used to sell. I have informed Sherril of the problem a couple times, maybe they found a better source.

I'll check out the Marvin ones from BR Arb. Wondering though, if they are thicker, maybe they cut a bit slower? Whaddya think?

Re the hooked blades, they are the cat's meow--been using them for many years. Way better than the saw head hook for hangers, and invaluable for breaking evergreen duff. (twigs under 1/2 inch)

I just ordered a Zubat polesaw, looking forward to it, having used one briefly. I use Jameson hollow poles, 6 and 8 footers, they are adequate. The 21 foot Hayauchi is too fragile, and I broke it last year after using it for 1.5 yrs. But I had damaged it the first time I used it, due to the dang clamps. Plus the detents don't stay in place, and the red clamps are worthless. Scabbard is awesome though, use a minibiner to hang it from the end. But the length and cutting power are great.

Hey I'm happy, 3, count em three Butterfly saddles arrived today via the big brown truck!!!! Thanks Tony!!


Umm, is this thread also for debating the reasons for using a pole saw and the possible problems? Some time ago, I had a heated discussion on da buz* with Tony (Greenman). He didn't know I was not a hack. But he said that Beddes Strasser will never use a pole saw. i also know our great friend and agile warrior Dan Kraus largely exchews their use.

Well anyhow, I think I'm as nimble ( if not quite as fast) as most good climbers at maneuvering throughout a canopy, but find that the work can be done much faster with a pole saw. And, in a nice shade tree, if one is careful, cuts can be made very cleanly and correctly. If not, then I climb out after the cut, if at all possible. So a very small percentage of cuts can end up being sloppy, especially if I get a little lazy or impatient, tired, or move too fast. Hey, no one is perfect, but that can apply to a hand saw cut too...( in shade trees, I do try to limit pole use.)

However, with conifer pruning, at least done to my specifications, it is darn near impossible to do without an extension. I would gladly challenge anyone to come prune a conifer, such as this one in the next few pictures, as I require, which is branch lightening all the way to the tips, without a pole saw. Most likely the work could not be done completely, or it would take over twice as long.

Now I'm not talking about the idea that many conifers do not need thinning, which is often true. However, those that have developed huge, and heavy limbs, from age or previous topping, absolutely require branch lightening, often shortening, to reduce limb failure from wind or snow loading.

Here's one pic from a recent fir we thinned, in Medina, home to Bill Gates and many other opulent estates. Dubya was recently at a $2000 a plate fundraiser at a McCaw (cellular magnates) residence in nearby Hunt's Point. I'll post the rest of the pics in a new thread---"Conifer thinning pics, polesaws, and other prattle" or something....


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## Ax-man (Aug 29, 2003)

Might as put my two cents in here for what it's worth.

I use all three pruner heads that are available.

Snap Cut econo for light detail pruning for suckers, crown thinning, nip and tuck around the outer edges, ect.ect. I also like it because it's not tip heavy.

The Marvin PH 4 is a good all around pruner for most pruning work. I especially like it for working around electric lines.

The Corona Bull pruner is king on the ground and this is where I like it . It is clumsy and heavy to work with up in a tree.

On pole saw heads Smith is the only way to go IMO. I tried Fanno heads didn't care for them at all. Currently we are using ARS turbocut CT-32-F-1 saw blabes. I'm quite satisfied with these blade, no bending, quick cutting and best of all no alterations are needed to fit our pole saw heads. They do have a tendency to dull down if one is doing a lot of deadwooding of 2 - 4 in. material.

As far as poles we use both fiberglass and wood or a combination of the two. Pro's and con's to both. Fiberglass is heavier and has more flex than wood, but holds up better than wood in the long run and best of all no splinters. All wood is a good choice for the Corona Bull pruner no flexing of the pole(s) and is lighter than fiberglass.

FYI Rocky and Tom

A.M. Leonard is still featuring the Smith saw head with the paint brush holder Brian wants to scarf up. They have the Marvin Ph4 & PH3 the actual Marvins not the imitations. 

I got a bad feeling these old popular field proven tools are going to be a thing of the past, like the good old fashion yellow lamenated, octagon Hemlock poles.

Just out of curiousity, what is the most pole sections anybody has joined together to save on climbing. I've joined at least five to get at small annoying broken branches. You have to use the tree itself to stabilize this many sections

What is the big deal with hooked pole saw blades. I tried one then promptly threw it out. Always stuck in the kerf or catching on small twigs while sawing or moving the saw head around while in the tree.


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## seanlarkin (Aug 29, 2003)

Tobe asked me to post his response to Tom's comments regarding our pruner head and the Marvin head:



Dear Tom,

No one here will argue your point about proven performance, and Jeff Mussey
(a real estate guy) has done a great job marketing the company he acquired
(Fred Marvin & Associates) several years ago. What I would argue is
comparing the product you bought 25 years ago to what's being produced
today. Today (past 2 years) you get a "stamped or laser cut" metal blade and
anvil, the 2 primary working components of this product. Check that out and
get back to me.

Jameson Manufacturing makes their "near copy" product (in the USA),
primarily for the (much larger) utility markets. As explained to us, Jameson
faces stiff competition in the utility markets where the once famous Snap
Cut #11, now the Gilmore (at last check) head has held position as the
highest selling, low cost pruner for years. You'll likely never hear about
the "good ole boy" network that makes it difficult for often better, more
efficient products to get into the stream. So Jameson, knowing that the #11
was long out of patent first made a perfect copy of that head, offered it at
a competitive price (more so than Gilmore, the multi conglomerate would do)
and the "good ole boy's boss" made them buy it. Jameson succeeded in the
face of tough odds. Soon after, Jameson took similar action with the long
expired Marvin patent and here's what you get.

• For virtually the same price, Jameson produces (like Marvin did) a
"forged" blade and hook. Both last longer and hold a sharper edge longer.

• Reinforced spring pins. The most often failing part on the Marvin head (at
least from this distributor) but never addressed for reinforcement by Marvin
and Associates, for "whatever" reason.

• larger cutting throat... for obvious reasons

• And the swivel pulley. Although subtle, this feature does make a
difference to both puller and line.

As for the bait and switch comment, that’s usually an accusation relating to
a similar or copied product that’s been "cheapened-down" (via materials or
country of origin). If this really tightens your jaw, perhaps you should
speak to "the King!"

Sherrill intends to focus on the best quality products for the
professional's money. If ever you have a complaint relating to our not
upholding this value, please feel free to contact me directly. 

Tobe Sherrill


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## Guy Meilleur (Aug 29, 2003)

I tried the all-aluminum 3-part telescoping tool vermeer sells and found it pretty effective but kind of clunky. No one else mentioned Florian, which has 2 ea. 8' sections that open and shut just by twisting. This is a great tool; I am spoiled for life. The larger one takes the same head as a Jameson, for heavy branches. 

I use the smaller one more. Their blades bend and go right bak to straight manytimes before losing their temper (unlike Brian, who drops his at the drop of a hat lately --just kidding of course.

Once you've twisted- telescoped, you'll never go back. It helps you maneuver well enough to get a good angle on most cuts. and is so light that you can undercut to avoid rips without straining. Florian's the bomb.


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## MasterBlaster (Aug 29, 2003)

Who sells this Florian of which you speak, Guy?


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## Ax-man (Aug 29, 2003)

I keep forgetting to put this up.

If it hadn't been for this thread I would have missed it completely.

Sherrill has a new telescopic pole by Jameson, now this is some thing I'm interested in. Any one try one of these yet????

Any thing that telescopes on the market today is pretty chinzy and isn't much good for serious tree work. Just wondering if this new toy is any better.


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## TREETX (Aug 30, 2003)

Fanno mondo double thick  

.02


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## Guy Meilleur (Aug 30, 2003)

> _Originally posted by Ax-man _
> Sherrill has a new telescopic pole by Jameson, now this is some thing I'm interested in. Any one try one of these yet????
> ** Where is it? Not on the online catalog; I went thru the 27 items on the site, not there. I searched for "Jameson telescoping pole", not found. Sherrill's, what did I do/not do?
> 
> ...


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## seanlarkin (Aug 30, 2003)

*Jameson Telescoping Pole*

I know I've not set up any new pictures online, because I'vebeen working on the new version, so when you look it up on our site it will say "no picture available". However, you can look at the test version of our new site to see it by going here: http://www.wtsherrill.com/TEST/page08.shtml

You can even add it to your cart from the test version but to checkout, you need to go back to the old version http://store.wtsherrill.com

-Sean


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## Guy Meilleur (Aug 30, 2003)

*Re: Jameson Telescoping Pole*



> _Originally posted by seanlarkin _
> * you can look at the test version of our new site to see it by going here: http://www.wtsherrill.com/TEST/page08.shtml
> -Sean *


So $68. + $39. =$107, while florian is $109. coincidentally close, eh?  

Wondering how close total weight is. A very big factor for old and weak climbers like me.


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## John Paul Sanborn (Aug 30, 2003)

I' used Guys Florian pole a few times. Kinda nice gadgette. I would probably have to get used to the thickness of the handle first.

I just wish he would have had sharp blades


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## Guy Meilleur (Aug 30, 2003)

> _Originally posted by John Paul Sanborn _
> I' used Guys Florian pole a few times. Kinda nice gadgette. I would probably have to get used to the thickness of the handle first.
> ** The Maxi is thicker than a jameson, the Mini much thinner. I use it exclusively now since the Maxi was ripped off. It will make 6" cuts on pretty hard wood.
> 
> ...


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## Ax-man (Aug 30, 2003)

Brian ( Rocky )

Thanks for steering Guy in the right direction, saves me some typing.

Guy,

I'm not familiar with florian, I never heard of it till you mentioned it. But I am going to check it out.

My reference to cheap and chinzy was toward those combo units sold in discount chains to homeowners who want to "Save on the high cost of tree trimming".  These same combo units are sold in some of the trade catalogs. They are almost worthless IMO.

I don't know if they come with a booklet on proper tree pruning, I wish they did and people would read it.

I get so tired of seeing dead stubs, or internodal cuts that sucker on the ends and become what I call " Frizily, Frazily, Frustrated limbs " caused by homeowners, lawn people and wanna be tree trimmers all for the sake of clearance for lawn mowing.

In regards to your muscular sub trainee. 

When employees break tools I have a little chat with them. The first thing I say to them is "" BRUTE FORCE ACCOMPLISHES NOTHING'''' It only results in broken tools or maybe a bad injury to yourself. If you can't solve a problem one way, try another and get the right tools to do it with. In other words ' THINK BEFORE YOU GET A BIGGER HAMMER'

Your lucky you got some money back. In most cases your just plain S.O.L. might as well have thrown that $100 plus bucks to the wind. Because you now you have to buy it twice or do with out it.


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## Stumper (Aug 30, 2003)

Guy, Since you have a Florian I was wondering-Have you tried their pruner head? I've looked at it in the past but didn't want to spring the bucks to try it out.

And has anyone tried the Azel Aluminum poles? They claim that they are super light and the 'cat's pajamas'. I could find them useful in lots of situatuions but I'm afraid of conductive poles-I'd have to carry non conductors too and there is only so much room for gear on the truck.


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## Guy Meilleur (Aug 30, 2003)

> _Originally posted by Stumper _
> *Guy, Since you have a Florian I was wondering-Have you tried their pruner head? I've looked at it in the past but didn't want to spring the bucks to try it out.
> 
> *


Their ratchet pruner is wagt first caught my eye, makes very clean cuts and that ratchet saves the shoulders.


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## rbtree (Aug 30, 2003)

Sean,

I went to your "test" site page, and am very disappointed to see that the new Jameson saw head now has no eye. That is the most convenient way to hang the saw, and now one will have to do some mod or add a sling and mini biner or ring.


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## seanlarkin (Aug 30, 2003)

rbtree,
Apparently you weren't alone in your disappointment. They've redesigned the head, though I've not seen it yet, so that may not have been the issue they resolved. 

Also, I don't know if I mentioned this already, but we are bringing back the Gilmore polesaw heads, which are the ones we used to sell.


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## Guy Meilleur (Aug 31, 2003)

> _Originally posted by rbtree
> the new Jameson saw head now has no eye.
> ** Jameson has to lose weight; maybe that's why the eye got cut out. florian has no eye; I just wrap the sling and clip a biner. Lightness is worth the hassle. I clip on the polesaw less than 5 times a day but I stroke it hundreds of times.
> Hmm, maybe a hole could be drilled in the wide part of the blade so a dogleash-sized snap could clip on...:Monkey:
> Also I wonder how much the Jameson pole w Gilmore head weighs...anybogy got thta rig they can put on a scale?_


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## TheTreeSpyder (Aug 31, 2003)

i'm not sure where these are being hung, but i seen guys hang 8' polesaw from hip? Even with scabbard, i dont think i want something stiff hanging um uhhhhh even 4' below me ready to jam against or in to me if i fell against pole or slid jamming pole up? Let alone getting cut by blade; there prolly is a demonstration somewhere's whereby you can be cut by one of those blades from 1/2" away !

i think the spring steel would be hard to drill!


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## rbtree (Aug 31, 2003)

" stroke it hundreds of times "

Impressive, Guy!... :Monkey:


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## MasterBlaster (Aug 31, 2003)

I've climbed lotsa times with the polesaw hanging from my saddle, but only to move into another quadrant of the canopy. I have a hole drilled in the end with a piece of slickline tied in it. The blade hangs down, on the other end.


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## Ax-man (Aug 31, 2003)

Guy, 

I checked out the Florian, nice tool

The only thing I saw that I didn't like was the hook on it. It looked a little small to me from the picture. Hooks like that only allow one to pull hangers inward, some times hangers have to be pushed out the tree. Curved hooks like that on the Florian make this hard to do.

This is why I have always liked those Smith heads on pole saws. One can push or pull a hanger from the crown of a tree.

In addition to the push pull thing, the larger hooks make snagging ropes easier, grabbing limbs away from roofs easier, raising or pulling a wire if need be.

My favorite thing to do for low limbs over a roof is to side notch the limb with power pruner, while doing backcut have some one pull (prefer push) limb with pole saw hook and hinge the limb away from target.

But to make a fair evaluation I would have to have the tool in my hands and work with it .


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## Guy Meilleur (Sep 1, 2003)

> _Originally posted by Ax-man
> 
> I checked out the Florian, nice tool
> The only thing I saw that I didn't like was the hook on it.
> ...


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