# How to break down seriously large oak wood?



## PoulanInPA (Oct 2, 2017)

Hi All - New to the forum. I just had a very large white oak tree taken down. It was a hazard and the center was rotting, unfortunately. The tree service left me with the bigger pieces and now I have the task of breaking them down for firewood. How do you suggest I go about handling the monster rounds? Some are easily five foot in diameter, very wet and super heavy. They range in thickness from 18 inches to 3 feet (picture attached). I've broken down 1.5 of them using primarily wedges, sledgehammer, and the fiskars, but it was pretty brutal. Looking for suggestions on how to do this as efficiently as possible. Noodle them? The main thing I need to accomplish is breaking them down to manageable sizes that I can roll/push/pry bar onto the foot of the log splitter. Thanks!

For reference, equipment I have on hand:

-Log splitter (horizontal and vertical)
-Fiskars super splitter axe
-Maul and five wedges
-8 pound sledge
-5 foot pry bar
-18-inch Echo saw
-24-inch Poulan 4400 anti-vibe saw


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## benjo75 (Oct 2, 2017)

Sounds like you need wood more than most. That's the hardest way possible to go about getting firewood. To answer your question, I would personally cut them in half with a saw and long bar. Then they should be able to be man handled to the spliter. It's going to take a lot of swinging. The more wedges the better. Find the natural split of the piece. Saw a few inches down into the wood and all the way across going with the natural split. The deeper you saw the better. It wouldn't hurt to turn it over and do the same on the bottom staying in the same plane as the first cut. Start driving wedges in it. Steel wedges will work best. If you make it through all the beating and swinging you will have the most time consuming firewood possible. On the other hand it this particular firewood will warm you several times.


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## benjo75 (Oct 2, 2017)

You can also start slabbing pieces off the side.


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## ATH (Oct 2, 2017)

Option 1) "Free firewood" ad on Craigslist. Let somebody else deal with them.

Option 2)


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## chipper1 (Oct 2, 2017)

I would noodle them myself. You could noodle them in half and then noodle those pieces into 3rds, then you would be lifting a reasonable amount.
Then I would split them with the hydro, horizontally(personal preference ).
Also watch closely for the metal in there, the stains on some are a telltale sign.
There is a lot of great wood in that pile.
Think of all the things that tree has seen as your working with it, it was around at the turn of the century, cool stuff.
Let us know how it goes.
Brett


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## chipper1 (Oct 2, 2017)

ATH said:


> Option 1) "Free firewood" ad on Craigslist. Let somebody else deal with them.
> 
> Option 2)



Good stuff right there, gotta give that a try, I like fire , and explosions .
Looks like if someone wants to watch they will have to click on the youtube tape on the bottom right.


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## ATH (Oct 2, 2017)

I tried 3 different videos to get a good link. Looks like you quote me in the middle of those edits. But the point remains the same...blow it up!


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## chipper1 (Oct 2, 2017)

ATH said:


> I tried 3 different videos to get a good link. Looks like you quote me in the middle of those edits. But the point remains the same...blow it up!


That's funny, been there before lol.
Ok, everyone skip to 2:00 for the action, I don't want to watch him do a bore cut and dum a little powder in then pack it, just want to see it blow up .
I think I may try something like this with something different in the log sometime .


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## ATH (Oct 2, 2017)

I even right clicked on "copy video URL at the current time". Oh well. Yes...thanks for the note, skip to 2:00 for the one in my post. 1:18 for the one chipper quoted.


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## Greenmachine (Oct 3, 2017)

ATH said:


> Option 1) "Free firewood" ad on Craigslist. Let somebody else deal with them.
> 
> Option 2)



I laughed my ass off! Thanks! Then the cat rolling by after... Too funny.


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## PoulanInPA (Oct 3, 2017)

Thanks everyone, I appreciate the input; realistic or not! This is definitely the hard way to get firewood, I agree. But its from my front yard, just like my black cherry dining room table. So when I burn the oak I can relish in the fact it took three times as much work as it should to get the same amount of heat  Its good stress relief to break it down, I just don't want to get burned out by doing it the wrong way.


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## jrider (Oct 3, 2017)

Those look like pretty nice rounds without big knots or odd shapes. Take a board and with the help of another guy, roll them up onto your splitter beam. "Catch" whatever split is bigger - usually easily done as long as you keep part of it on the beam and slide it back and resplit. Then tag team lift the piece that fell on the ground and do the same thing until you have it all in manageable pieces.


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## PoulanInPA (Oct 3, 2017)

^Thanks, but these things are about 1500 pounds each. Nobody is rolling them onto anything in one piece.


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## PoulanInPA (Oct 3, 2017)

How about renting a small-ish jackhammer or large hammer drill with a spade bit??


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## Bobby Kirbos (Oct 3, 2017)

Let your saw do the work. Noodle it down until you have pieces that are small enough for you to put on the log splitter.


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## jrider (Oct 3, 2017)

PoulanInPA said:


> ^Thanks, but these things are about 1500 pounds each. Nobody is rolling them onto anything in one piece.


Heavy yes, 1500 pounds no. A cord of wet white oak weighs around 5500 pounds. By your measure, less than 4 of these equals a cord.


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## arathol (Oct 3, 2017)

jrider said:


> Heavy yes, 1500 pounds no. A cord of wet white oak weighs around 5500 pounds. By your measure, less than 4 of these equals a cord.



Weight of dry seasoned oak is about 6000 lbs per cord, or 47 lbs/ft³.
A cord is 128 ft³, green wet fresh cut white oak is about 62 lbs/ft³. That is 7936 lbs.
Actual measured weight will be somewhat less (20% give or take) when allowing for void content.
​


PoulanInPA said:


> ^Thanks, but these things are about 1500 pounds each. Nobody is rolling them onto anything in one piece.


A 5' round 1 foot in length weighs in at about 1200 lbs.
 πr²h = volume
3.1415 x 30² x 12 / 1728 = 19.6 ft³ x 62 = 1215 lbs


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## Ted Jenkins (Oct 4, 2017)

jrider said:


> Heavy yes, 1500 pounds no. A cord of wet white oak weighs around 5500 pounds. By your measure, less than 4 of these equals a cord.



A cord of wet Oak weighs much closer to 10,000 lbs per cord. A very dry seasoned load of Oak often times is 6,000 lbs. Live Oak is heavier that White Oak, but not nearly as light as dry Pine. I just finished breaking down a Oak that was averaging 60'' at the trunk/ A dozen wedges a couple of sledge handles. A great way to get into shape. Two or three hours a day swinging a hammer will get you going after a month you should be able to swing for up to six hours without being sore. Thanks


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## Catfish Hunter (Oct 4, 2017)

Noodle it 


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## PoulanInPA (Oct 4, 2017)

I'm an engineer and am all for calculations and such, but I can tell you without any of that that these things are sopping wet and heavy as hell. Made good progress yesterday in a couple of hours with sharpened wedges and the sledge, breaking them down into sixth-sizes pieces. I was able to get them on the vertical splitter and do the rest from there. Getting at least 60 pieces of wood from each round! Noodling might be less work, but I like the exercise and will avoid doing that unless its necessary.


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## chipper1 (Oct 4, 2017)

PoulanInPA said:


> Noodle them?


Glad you made progress. Why did you ask .


PoulanInPA said:


> Noodling might be less work, but I like the exercise and will avoid doing that unless its necessary.


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## PoulanInPA (Oct 4, 2017)

^Cause I didn't expect to make progress!


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## chipper1 (Oct 4, 2017)

PoulanInPA said:


> ^Cause I didn't expect to make progress!


I get that .
I like to do a little noodling too. After you are done spread the noodles out in the sun, they dry very quickly, then I place them in a box or paper bags. They are great for starting fires in the should seasons .


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## Ted Jenkins (Oct 4, 2017)

PoulanInPA said:


> I'm an engineer and am all for calculations and such, but I can tell you without any of that that these things are sopping wet and heavy as hell. Made good progress yesterday in a couple of hours with sharpened wedges and the sledge, breaking them down into sixth-sizes pieces. I was able to get them on the vertical splitter and do the rest from there. Getting at least 60 pieces of wood from each round! Noodling might be less work, but I like the exercise and will avoid doing that unless its necessary.



I try never to noodle wood because it destroys the wood unless it is for personal use. Thanks


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## Brian72 (Oct 4, 2017)

When we get logs too big at the mill, my buddy has a pretty slick solution. He does a bore cut in the middle of the log going down to the center. Puts some black powder in the hole, adds the fuse and then pounds a wedge in. Light it, get back and boom. Split some big logs.

Sent from my E6782 using Tapatalk


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## arathol (Oct 4, 2017)

PoulanInPA said:


> I'm an engineer and am all for calculations and such, but I can tell you without any of that that these things are sopping wet and heavy as hell. Made good progress yesterday in a couple of hours with sharpened wedges and the sledge, breaking them down into sixth-sizes pieces. I was able to get them on the vertical splitter and do the rest from there. Getting at least 60 pieces of wood from each round! Noodling might be less work, but I like the exercise and will avoid doing that unless its necessary.



One thing you're missing that might help a lot is a hand truck. If you have a vertical splitter its a lot easier to move those big chunks into position if you wheel them in.


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## James Miller (Oct 5, 2017)

chipper1 said:


> That's funny, been there before lol.
> Ok, everyone skip to 2:00 for the action, I don't want to watch him do a bore cut and dum a little powder in then pack it, just want to see it blow up .
> I think I may try something like this with something different in the log sometime .


You should invite some PA guys for you exploding log trials.


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## Bobby Kirbos (Oct 5, 2017)

James Miller said:


> You should invite some PA guys for you exploding log trials.



I'm in. I'll hold your beer.


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## chipper1 (Oct 5, 2017)

James Miller said:


> You should invite some PA guys for you exploding log trials.


Sounds like a good time doesn't it.
I'm thinking a nice large sweeping bore cut filled with oxy acetylene and the packed with clay .


Bobby Kirbos said:


> I'm in. I'll hold your beer.


Better take a few steps back with the beer, James has seen one or two of my fires  not the kicking part, but just get back .
This one was the second to last one at the house (one of my smaller fires), it's been very dry so I can't have one right now . Hopefully we have enough rain by this Saturday to have one as we have a nice size group of friends coming over for a bonfire, your welcome to come although there probably won't be any beer at this one.


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## James Miller (Oct 5, 2017)

chipper1 said:


> Sounds like a good time doesn't it.
> I'm thinking a nice large sweeping bore cut filled with oxy acetylene and the packed with clay .
> 
> Better take a few steps back with the beer, James has seen one or two of my fires  not the kicking part, but just get back .
> ...


We have one by my buddies cabin we were Gona try tanerite on but sounds like Maryland added it to there list of fun things your not allowed to have.


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## chipper1 (Oct 5, 2017)

James Miller said:


> We have one by my buddies cabin we were Gona try tanerite on but sounds like Maryland added it to there list of fun things your not allowed to have.


Nice, but they let you have the guns used to set it off lol. Just grab a couple of the large casess of match packages, that and a fuse will do a little damage .


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## jrider (Oct 5, 2017)

https://my.extension.illinois.edu/d...ucing, harvesting and processing firewood.pdf

Weights of different types of cord wood....


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## jrider (Oct 7, 2017)

Curious how the breakdown of these rounds is going?


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## jrider (Oct 7, 2017)

Ted Jenkins said:


> A cord of wet Oak weighs much closer to 10,000 lbs per cord. A very dry seasoned load of Oak often times is 6,000 lbs. Live Oak is heavier that White Oak, but not nearly as light as dry Pine. I just finished breaking down a Oak that was averaging 60'' at the trunk/ A dozen wedges a couple of sledge handles. A great way to get into shape. Two or three hours a day swinging a hammer will get you going after a month you should be able to swing for up to six hours without being sore. Thanks


I've looked all over and can't find any wood that weighs 10,000 pounds per cord.


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## chipper1 (Oct 10, 2017)

jrider said:


> I've looked all over and can't find any wood that weighs 10,000 pounds per cord.


Don't worry, there will be plenty of other people on the Internet who say wrong, or funny things, just search all my post.


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## PoulanInPA (Oct 12, 2017)

jrider said:


> Curious how the breakdown of these rounds is going?


Its going well, with what little time I've had to work on them. The sharpened wedges help a lot. I've also learned that when and where in the process the wedges are placed is a factor in whether they get buried and how effective each wedge is at splitting.

Plenty of the rounds are too thick for firewood, so I have some large-scale bucking to do with the Poulan 4400. Might be easier just to break them down into eights and then buck the smaller pieces to length. Come November, I'll be hitting the pile a lot more and will post updates.

Oh, I picked up a 5 foot pry bar on amazon for $30 and its a huge help for pulling apart partially split sections and freeing buried wedges.


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## PoulanInPA (Oct 13, 2017)

A before and after photo and the current wood pile...Have a solid 1.5 cords so far. I'm not counting, but I think that was generated from four or five big rounds.


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## Marine5068 (Oct 30, 2017)

PoulanInPA said:


> Thanks everyone, I appreciate the input; realistic or not! This is definitely the hard way to get firewood, I agree. But its from my front yard, just like my black cherry dining room table. So when I burn the oak I can relish in the fact it took three times as much work as it should to get the same amount of heat  Its good stress relief to break it down, I just don't want to get burned out by doing it the wrong way.


Remember that it will take 2-3 years to season that Oak before burning it.


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## JTM (Oct 31, 2017)

Can you noodle out a kerf then insert wedges and split?


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## Deleted member 117362 (Oct 31, 2017)

PoulanInPA said:


> A before and after photo and the current wood pile...Have a solid 1.5 cords so far. I'm not counting, but I think that was generated from four or five big rounds.


You may have a better method, but I place wedge at outside of round and follow a natural check in wood. I use one wedge, sledge and maul. Split rounds in half then use vertical splitter. Place 2x8s flat on ground in front of splitter, makes sliding half rounds under splitter wedge easier.


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## PoulanInPA (Nov 16, 2017)

Marine5068 said:


> Remember that it will take 2-3 years to season that Oak before burning it.


It will sit in a pile for 1 year, then be stacked in a 3/4 enclosed wood shed with full sun exposure for another year. That's all its getting!


JTM said:


> Can you noodle out a kerf then insert wedges and split?


Haven't tried it, but that may work.


Duce said:


> You may have a better method, but I place wedge at outside of round and follow a natural check in wood. I use one wedge, sledge and maul. Split rounds in half then use vertical splitter. Place 2x8s flat on ground in front of splitter, makes sliding half rounds under splitter wedge easier.


One wedge?? I'm using that method, but consistently needing two to three wedges. A 5' pry bar with a hooked edge is key.


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## Rick Hammer (Nov 28, 2017)

PoulanInPA said:


> Hi All - New to the forum. I just had a very large white oak tree taken down. It was a hazard and the center was rotting, unfortunately. The tree service left me with the bigger pieces and now I have the task of breaking them down for firewood. How do you suggest I go about handling the monster rounds? Some are easily five foot in diameter, very wet and super heavy. They range in thickness from 18 inches to 3 feet (picture attached). I've broken down 1.5 of them using primarily wedges, sledgehammer, and the fiskars, but it was pretty brutal. Looking for suggestions on how to do this as efficiently as possible. Noodle them? The main thing I need to accomplish is breaking them down to manageable sizes that I can roll/push/pry bar onto the foot of the log splitter. Thanks!
> 
> For reference, equipment I have on hand:
> 
> ...


Take your bigger rounds and half or even quarter them .Sometimes that is all you can do to even pick em up,or you can start popping off pieces with your mall on the outer ends and whittle away.Next time if you have a tree crew doing your work,tell the grunt on the ground to cut em for you could move them.They have the bigger saws and it would take no time to cut those but end chunks so you can handle them.


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## deberly12 (Dec 6, 2017)

Very cool about 15 years ago my grandfather had an oak taken down that was every bit as big. I was only 8 but I helped by swinging a sledge at some wedges lol. The whole family came together and did the whole thing by hand. 

One thing that I have found to help is to break the bark ring. On really big stuff like that I will usually work around the edges but ones you break the first bark ring it is much easier so just spit a slice off the side before you deal with the rest. Ymmv but it always seemed helpful to me.

PS when and where is the PA Log explosion happening? I want in!!!

Sent from my XT1635-01 using Tapatalk


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## PoulanInPA (Dec 21, 2017)

Did some more work with help from family. Light at the end of the tunnel for these rounds. The logs will be easy compared to the rounds. Just cut and split..

I'll add that I really like the ECHO CS-400 after the muffler mod. Its got great power and just keeps kicking a**. More impressed with it than the Poulan 4400 (not some new piece of crap Poulan).


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## Ted Jenkins (Dec 21, 2017)

In my my experience working with large Oak is hard work period. My smaller saws use a 24'' bar so cutting a 50 to 60'' is not difficult, but it can destroy your whole afternoon. I try to think of another place to be. I keep at least a dozen good sharp wedges handy 24-7. When you bury 10 wedges and there is no sign of cracking you can start to panic. Of course having a long bar or pipe some times makes the difference. Thanks


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## fearofpavement (Jan 6, 2018)

I never use wedges to split firewood, ever. Too much work. On big rounds like this, I start slabbing pieces off the outside edge with a monster maul and just work in a spiral motion to make the round smaller and smaller in diameter. When the piece is small enough to stand up on edge, I noodle it with a chainsaw into quarters. Then they either get more monster maul action or get put on the splitter.


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## Ted Jenkins (Jan 6, 2018)

A friend of mine called me back in July on a sizable Oak tree removal. He said the owner wanted all the limbs up to 20 to 24''. So he said bring your Bobcat and take the rest. I ended up with two trailer loads of nice Oak green as ever. Almost 30,000 lbs worth. I could not wiggle the larger rounds by myself unless via the Bobcat. I took 12 wedges and a sledge hammer to my process area. It took about 2 hours a day for almost a month to get it all stacked up. The largest log was 5 1/2 feet across with the smaller around 24''. Several of the larger rounds needed up to 10 wedges to get them halved. Now not even 6 months latter I have at least 4 cords of firewood. The stove cut wood comes in at 22 to 26% with the 18'' closer to 30%. With green Oak a big problem is that the wedges are very difficult to get started in that they pop out so easy. At the time I did not want to stop cutting at my larger tree removal, but I did anyway now I am glad it is done. In 40 years never found an easy way to break down Oak logs. Did not want to noodle any since it destroys any firewood value. Already sold some since it burns just fine. Just get it done. Thanks


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## PoulanInPA (Feb 16, 2018)

Updated pics are below. Almost done with the big rounds. Then its all downhill from there - just buck and split.

Also, I picked up an ECHO CS-590. modded the muffler and re-tuned the carb. It's a fantastic saw and value. I much prefer it over the Poulan 4400 and would put it up against the comparable Stihl and Husky saws any day.


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## blades (Feb 16, 2018)

Cut a grove with the chain saw to stick the wedges in.


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## PoulanInPA (Feb 16, 2018)

^ I’ve done that with success


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## old guy (Feb 16, 2018)

How does noodleing destroy firewood value?, I noodled a lot of it last year & it burned just as well as the any other wood.


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## Ted Jenkins (Feb 20, 2018)

old guy said:


> How does noodleing destroy firewood value?, I noodled a lot of it last year & it burned just as well as the any other wood.



If you noodle 50 cords for your self no body will care what it looks like or how well it burns. However when people want to buy wood in my area they care very much. Most of my customers would be considered high end type customers and they trust me to get them what they want. About half of them ask what the cost will be the other half never want to know. The wood that is delivered better look nice period and it better look nice when it is stacked. If the length and the diameter and the split better be consistent or its junk. Noodled wood for those that ask the price will want an 80% discount because it is scrap wood. Right now it is 15 F and am enjoying using scrap Oak that was on the end of some logs. This wood is chunks from 8'' to a 12'' and it heats the house perfectly, but it will not sell. Thanks


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## old guy (Feb 20, 2018)

Ted Jenkins said:


> If you noodle 50 cords for your self no body will care what it looks like or how well it burns. However when people want to buy wood in my area they care very much. Most of my customers would be considered high end type customers and they trust me to get them what they want. About half of them ask what the cost will be the other half never want to know. The wood that is delivered better look nice period and it better look nice when it is stacked. If the length and the diameter and the split better be consistent or its junk. Noodled wood for those that ask the price will want an 80% discount because it is scrap wood. Right now it is 15 F and am enjoying using scrap Oak that was on the end of some logs. This wood is chunks from 8'' to a 12'' and it heats the house perfectly, but it will not sell. Thanks


I guess I wouldn't sell wood to people like that.
For myself I take everything from 1'' on up, anything that will go in the stove door doesn't get split at all.


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## deberly12 (Feb 20, 2018)

You would sell wood to them if they paid enough lol

I would guess he is probably getting upwards of 300 a cord ... Maybe more.

I have heard of people selling wood for 150 a tossed pickup load around the outskirts of Philly. I guess some people have more money then brains lol.

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## Ted Jenkins (Feb 20, 2018)

Upwards of $300 a cord, how about $500 a cord. I can not afford to spend much time with folks who ask what the price is. They call when it is raining or snowing or really freezing. They are desperate because they are the ones that never plan ahead. Many of my customers expect me to go in to the house and look at their stack to see if it is low and then call them to say it is in its way. Those people are the best because I stack it when I want some time at 6 AM and all during the summer. They are the ones that keep me going when weather is really bad or other obstacles. Thanks


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## old guy (Feb 21, 2018)

Things have changed since I sold firewood 50 years ago, we got $57 a cord, mostly people only wanted a face cord or two at $19 each. This was in Minneapolis.


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## Ted Jenkins (Feb 21, 2018)

I bought my first saw when I was 14 more than 50 years ago to do a job that earned me about $600 while living in Washington State. That job took me several months to complete. Then my first cord of wood sold for $25. You know that my retirement plan was well financed. I still like cutting and selling wood, but I sell to people who pay well or I stay home. Thanks


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## ropensaddle (Feb 21, 2018)

Ted Jenkins said:


> If you noodle 50 cords for your self no body will care what it looks like or how well it burns. However when people want to buy wood in my area they care very much. Most of my customers would be considered high end type customers and they trust me to get them what they want. About half of them ask what the cost will be the other half never want to know. The wood that is delivered better look nice period and it better look nice when it is stacked. If the length and the diameter and the split better be consistent or its junk. Noodled wood for those that ask the price will want an 80% discount because it is scrap wood. Right now it is 15 F and am enjoying using scrap Oak that was on the end of some logs. This wood is chunks from 8'' to a 12'' and it heats the house perfectly, but it will not sell. Thanks


They would be sol here, the only thing that is consistent is irregularity knots and the like but then 175 to 200 per cord they best not beeotch or they are off the list. Then they can buy the half cords every other hack is selling for full cord price and believe me its happened and it is satisfying getting the call saying I'm sorry lol


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## ropensaddle (Feb 21, 2018)

As far as the topic goes I went back to saw kerf and wedges and sold my tw6 last summer it had done enough work to pay for itself and I was low on cash.


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## PoulanInPA (Feb 22, 2018)

A delivered cord of mixed hardwood goes for about $200 outside of Phillly. A cord of oak is about $275.


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## Ted Jenkins (Feb 23, 2018)

Wow that is very impressive very cheap. Is there an abundance of wood available with in a 100 miles. This past winter we had about 3 months of 45 lows to 65 highs. Very few people are interested in wood now maybe next year. You could sell it half price and people would not care. However for the last week we have had 14 lows and 35 highs. This could change peoples mind we will see. Thanks


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## PoulanInPA (Feb 26, 2018)

We are fortunate to have an abundance of natural hardwood in the region. I'm sure at some point, over development will change that, but I haven't see it yet. Nobody bothers with pine, fir, etc. around here.


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## akitasan (Mar 8, 2018)

You should've put an ad in the paper- 
Cross fit, free first class, then $20/ class until the cordwood is stacked


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## PoulanInPA (Apr 9, 2018)

The big rounds are done!! Got about 5+ cords split to this point. Very happy with the DHT splitter. Lots of very curly white oak pieces and it powers through them all.


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