# The MS200T alternative?



## jefflovstrom (Oct 6, 2012)

I dropped of a saw to have it checked out at Lawnmowers Plus Incorporated in San Marcos | Lawnmowers Plus Incorporated (760) 744-6761 & 289 S Pacific St, San Marcos, CA 92078 | <Home & Garden/Lawn & Garden/Equipment & Tools> - Yahoo! US Local,
These guy's are really great. I have been with these guy's for many year's, so they know me and would not 'pull my leg'. 
So, I drop the saw and they are pushing the Echo CS-355T.
Got a demo and was impressed.
What do you guy's think? 
Take in mind that this saw is being introduced for those that do not like the Stihl MS-201T.
I will probably get one next week and give it to my top guy and let you guy's know what he think's.
Jeff


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## millbilly (Oct 6, 2012)

jefflovstrom said:


> I dropped of a saw to have it checked out at Lawnmowers Plus Incorporated in San Marcos | Lawnmowers Plus Incorporated (760) 744-6761 & 289 S Pacific St, San Marcos, CA 92078 | <Home & Garden/Lawn & Garden/Equipment & Tools> - Yahoo! US Local,
> These guy's are really great. I have been with these guy's for many year's, so they know me and would not 'pull my leg'.
> So, I drop the saw and they are pushing the Echo CS-355T.
> Got a demo and was impressed.
> ...



Dang Jeff, this post will bring every stihl lovin echo basher to the fore front again. That being said Im a big, modern day echo fan. My opinions are based on actual opperation of just about every saw on the market over the past 40. Granted the ms200t might be able to beat my cs330 by a second ( muffler mod) or two in a 6/8 inch piece of oak. If i make 85 cuts a day, which nobody does. Its savin me a grand total of about 2 minutes or half cigarette. If I were to buy a saw, at almost twice the price it better do more. 

As I've stated in many stihl vs. echo, I have both saws on my truck, what saws get picked up and the most? The SHARP ones! Bet you thought I was gonna say Echo. If you thought that you were right.


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## Tree Pig (Oct 6, 2012)

Thats absolute bull#### dont walk but run away from the echo if its for commercial use (if its built like the 330t)... I have a 330t and though it is well balance, runs well and cuts pretty decent for the money. The Chain adjuster is built in to the *plastic* clutch cover and if you torque the saw the wrong way you are going to end up having to mickey mouse the thing with washers to get it to actually allow you to get the chain to a acceptable level. For the money for a back up its fine but as a daily work saw I would not depend on it.


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## treeman75 (Oct 6, 2012)

This is funny, I was just thinking about asking for an alternative 200t.


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## jefflovstrom (Oct 6, 2012)

Tree Pig said:


> (if its built like the 330t)... I have a 330t


I am not talking about a 330T, 
Jeff


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## lone wolf (Oct 6, 2012)

*Here it is*





View attachment 255882


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## jefflovstrom (Oct 6, 2012)

treeman75 said:


> This is funny, I was just thinking about asking for an alternative 200t.



So am I. I have 6 climber's that can get pretty upset with change's.
Jeff


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## jefflovstrom (Oct 6, 2012)

lone wolf said:


> View attachment 255882


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## millbilly (Oct 6, 2012)

*here is an earlier thread*

http://www.arboristsite.com/chainsaw/205814.htm


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## Tree Pig (Oct 6, 2012)

jefflovstrom said:


> I am not talking about a 330T,
> Jeff



well go buy it then... you will lose more money on production with your climbers using inferior saws then you will ever gain for being cheap... the 355t exploded parts view looks almost identical to the 330t. If you read my reply I mentioned that "if its built like the 330t" I am only suggesting you look at it first. But if that adjuster is in the same plastic channel in the clutch cover I bet you my 330t that you will be kicking yourself later. If you havent noticed I am not preaching to only buy a stihl or any other particular saw... just that I believe you should think twice before buying the echo. But then again your buying for a pretty good size company who could afford to experiment and its not your money so then maybe you should buy it.


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## lone wolf (Oct 6, 2012)

jefflovstrom said:


> Yeah, I got all those and more. Got a couple 200T's in the box, but I might check this Echo out for $200 less.
> Let you know.
> Jeff



A couple put away means you don't like the 201,neither do I it just takes all day to cut!


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## jefflovstrom (Oct 6, 2012)

Tree Pig said:


> well go buy it then... you will lose more money on production with your climbers using inferior saws then you will ever gain for being cheap... the 355t exploded parts view looks almost identical to the 330t. If you read my reply I mentioned that "if its built like the 330t" I am only suggesting you look at it first. But if that adjuster is in the same plastic channel in the clutch cover I bet you my 330t that you will be kicking yourself later. If you havent noticed I am not preaching to only buy a stihl or any other particular saw... just that I believe you should think twice before buying the echo. But then again your buying for a pretty good size company who could afford to experiment and its not your money so then maybe you should buy it.



I hear you. I just said I was thinking about getting one, not out-fitting my climber's with them. Thanks for the info.
Jeff


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## treeman75 (Oct 6, 2012)

I would like to hear what you think. I know they are a pain in the butt to gas and oil. The holes are smaller then the stihls


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## lone wolf (Oct 6, 2012)

Don't do it then thank us later :hmm3grin2orange:


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## KenJax Tree (Oct 6, 2012)

I like my 201T now that its modded and broke in


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## BlackOakTreeServ (Oct 6, 2012)

I hope stihl brings back the 200T like they did with the ms 440.....fingers crossed!


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## sgreanbeans (Oct 7, 2012)

I was thinking about switching over to these,LOL. You guys seen the infomercial on these, OMG! Someone is going to get hurt using one.

JawSaw

I have 2 Echos, CS400, actually have turned out to be pretty good little saws, run really good, great for the groundies. I agree with SOM, the way they have the chain tightener, is not the greatest, but haven't had any problems..............yet.


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## tree MDS (Oct 7, 2012)

I'm waiting to see what this T540 is all about (if they ever arrive). My dealer says $639 with a 14" bar and chain, $649 with a 16". Better be something at that rate.


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## Blakesmaster (Oct 7, 2012)

I bought the first 201 out of my local shop. It's been in the shop more than out. Crank seals, several carbs, a few re-tunings. It's a piece of ####. Nice saw for a geek and light user but not able to stand up to everyday, heavy use. I've picked up 3 spare 200's since and will continue to buy every one I come across.


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## treeclimber101 (Oct 7, 2012)

I really like the 338 husky I have never ran anything other the still , but I have to say it runs well and has been reliable for almost 6 months and believe me we don't baby saws period ! As a matter of fact 2 years is usually about it , so I will let ya know again in 16 months the true outcome


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## treeclimber101 (Oct 7, 2012)

The only problem I have with it is when you go to refill it with gas the douche bags put the oil and gas fills right under the to handle , and you gotta kinda tilt the saw forward to not spill oil , it's an art at first but a real bummer none the less


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## treeclimber101 (Oct 7, 2012)

woodsman44 said:


> I hope stihl brings back the 200T like they did with the ms 440.....fingers crossed!



It's never going to happen so let it go ! For real never ever ever ever ever , but you can just keep resurrecting the one you have now .


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## lone wolf (Oct 7, 2012)

treeclimber101 said:


> It's never going to happen so let it go ! For real never ever ever ever ever , but you can just keep resurrecting the one you have now .



That seems to be working for me now.


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## treeclimber101 (Oct 7, 2012)

lone wolf said:


> That seems to be working for me now.



I have 2 now and I could a least get another 3 at the drop of a dime if I wanted , they are stacked up to the ceiling at the saw shop some have tired heads or bad pistons , I mean they just need some TLC if I chose to go and get em !


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## pro94lt (Oct 8, 2012)

Echos are great back up saws, but just won't carry the load for me. I'm waiting on the t540xp.


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## beastmaster (Oct 10, 2012)

I'v been using echo top handle saws for 25 years. The 330 I use now, has a muffler mod, and when it runs it runs good, but has a bad habit of not running every now and again. I did the mod out of the box, so I voided the warranty. It's taking me some time to get it tuned right, after the mod. Figured out the jets were moving after removing the limiters.
I was looking to get me a 200t, but even used ones on ebay are going for 600.00 now.(There not that good.) I might get the 355(buy it out of state)as the only complaint I have with my 330 is its a little under powered. I am pretty sure my lil 330 can beat a 201t calif model.
Jeff try out the echo 355 as a back up or give it to the guy who's always dropping or damageing his 200t saw as punishment. Just kidding.


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## imagineero (Oct 10, 2012)

I'm an all Stihl guy, but I'd swap any saw in my line up for any competitors saw and probably notice no difference at all. I run huskies that belong to other guys prety often and they're just as good. Most pro saws of the same grade are very comparable, and performance differences and reliability differences are pretty minor. The 200T is a saw for which there is no replacement though. It's not a matter of a second of difference, that power, response and handling give enormous control in the tree. Being able to snap, pop, spear and jump branches off very consistently means control, which equals higher productivity and safety. It reduces the need for roping down dramatically. The difference adds up to hours, not seconds. 

I've got a few good runners, and one new 200T sitting in a box. I'm still on the lookout for more, and I'm happy to pay whatever price. That saw is my money maker. 

If mine all wear out and I can't get more then I'm going the brad mod route. If you haven't seen the vid, take a look. Muff mod, timing advance and a re-tune and the saw looks to out cut a muff modded 200T.

Shaun


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## mtrees (Oct 10, 2012)

imagineero said:


> I'm an all Stihl guy, but I'd swap any saw in my line up for any competitors saw and probably notice no difference at all. I run huskies that belong to other guys prety often and they're just as good. Most pro saws of the same grade are very comparable, and performance differences and reliability differences are pretty minor. The 200T is a saw for which there is no replacement though. It's not a matter of a second of difference, that power, response and handling give enormous control in the tree. Being able to snap, pop, spear and jump branches off very consistently means control, which equals higher productivity and safety. It reduces the need for roping down dramatically. The difference adds up to hours, not seconds.
> 
> I've got a few good runners, and one new 200T sitting in a box. I'm still on the lookout for more, and I'm happy to pay whatever price. That saw is my money maker.
> 
> ...



Mine is equal to slightly better than my BIL 200t now that Brad worked his magic. I still would love to find a new 200t as well though for the handling.


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## millbilly (Oct 10, 2012)

imagineero said:


> I'm an all Stihl guy, but I'd swap any saw in my line up for any competitors saw and probably notice no difference at all. I run huskies that belong to other guys prety often and they're just as good. Most pro saws of the same grade are very comparable, and performance differences and reliability differences are pretty minor. The 200T is a saw for which there is no replacement though. It's not a matter of a second of difference, that power, response and handling give enormous control in the tree. Being able to snap, pop, spear and jump branches off very consistently means control, which equals higher productivity and safety. It reduces the need for roping down dramatically. The difference adds up to hours, not seconds.
> 
> I've got a few good runners, and one new 200T sitting in a box. I'm still on the lookout for more, and I'm happy to pay whatever price. That saw is my money maker.
> 
> ...



Well said, it opened my eyes a little.


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## KenJax Tree (Oct 10, 2012)

I can see why people don't like the 201 out of the box, its slow,the throttle response sucks,it bogs constantly,and isn't fun to use but with a few small mods it really wakes up and is like a new saw. I wouldn't just dump your 200's just to get a 201, but if i needed another top handle i wouldn't hesitate to buy one again.


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## pro94lt (Oct 10, 2012)

I've never ran a cali model 201 but if a 330t can beat one well i understand. We have to realize we may not be comparing apples to apples because my 330t is the definition of molasses.


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## beastmaster (Oct 11, 2012)

I removed the catalytic converter, and opened up the muffler some and it made all the difference in the world power wise on my 330 echo. Granted it's not a 200t, but the chains always sharp and the air cleaner clean, and that's an edge I have over most other climbers out here. A dull chain, dirty air cleaner and out of tune, just makes a 200 a heavy slow chainsaw. I use a lot of saws from different places I work, and I say 90% of saws used are never maintained by the people using them. Waste of money giving some people a nice saw. That's where the echos come in. Let em tare up a 250.00 saw,


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## lucchesitree (Oct 14, 2012)

I have been in the buisness for 25 years and as I do love the beloved 200t all is not lost. I recently bought a 201 and did all brass mods. Wow let me tell you after this thong broke in I'm starting to reach for this before my 200. It should come this way out of the box and it doesn't. I beileive this is why there are so many haters. It is a great saw you just have to open up the muffler a tad and richen it up. Enough said.


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## millbilly (Oct 14, 2012)

lucchesitree said:


> I have been in the buisness for 25 years and as I do love the beloved 200t all is not lost. I recently bought a 201 and did all brass mods. Wow let me tell you after this thong broke in I'm starting to reach for this before my 200. It should come this way out of the box and it doesn't. I beileive this is why there are so many haters. It is a great saw you just have to open up the muffler a tad and richen it up. Enough said.



Yep I love breakin in new thongs too.


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## R2D (Oct 18, 2012)

I am a newbie to climbing trees. I just teamed up with a small, father and son, tree service that has been in the business for 30+ years. They HATE their 201t. It has been in and out of the shop and it is never right. They still have a 200t that they fight over and they would rather use a 192t than the 201. I have a muffler modded Jonsered 2139t. They used it and liked it but in comparison to the 200t it still lacks in performance. I know some here will say that a muffler modded 339xp/338xp/2139t will compare to a 200t. I used a 200t for the first time today and I now understand why you all love this saw so much. It is, based on my experience with it today, the best climbing saw on the planet! I need to find one for a reasonable price now :bang:


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## jefflovstrom (Oct 18, 2012)

R2D said:


> I am a newbie to climbing trees. I just teamed up with a small, father and son, tree service that has been in the business for 30+ years. They HATE their 201t. It has been in and out of the shop and it is never right. They still have a 200t that they fight over and they would rather use a 192t than the 201. I have a muffler modded Jonsered 2139t. They used it and liked it but in comparison to the 200t it still lacks in performance. I know some here will say that a muffler modded 339xp/338xp/2139t will compare to a 200t. I used a 200t for the first time today and I now understand why you all love this saw so much. It is, based on my experience with it today, the best climbing saw on the planet! I need to find one for a reasonable price now :bang:



I'm glad I stocked up one the 200T's. I got a few still in the box in the office and the guy's don't know!
Jeff


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## treeman75 (Oct 18, 2012)

jefflovstrom said:


> I'm glad I stocked up one the 200T's. I got a few still in the box in the office and the guy's don't know!
> Jeff



Hows the guys liking the echo?


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## jefflovstrom (Oct 18, 2012)

treeman75 said:


> Hows the guys liking the echo?



Ain't got one yet, I want tho!. I want to give it to my best of 6 climber's to try out. I hope to steal and black-market the saw's in the office! not.
Jeff :msp_biggrin:


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## Youngbuck20 (Oct 18, 2012)

hopefully it cuts better than it does in the promotional video. That was pretty slow. Lookin like my 192


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## R2D (Oct 18, 2012)

jefflovstrom said:


> I'm glad I stocked up one the 200T's. I got a few still in the box in the office and the guy's don't know!
> Jeff



It would be yet another awesome display of comradery here on Arboristsite when you send me one Jeff :msp_biggrin: Thank you in advance.


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## Bermie (Oct 18, 2012)

Fer pete's sake Jeff, lose the excess apostrophes!!!!

Your climber's what?
The saw's what? AAAAgggghhhhh!

Ok, until I wear out my 020t, my 5yr old 200t and the 6yr old 200t I just got as backup...I ain't buying no stinkin' 201!


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## Tree Pig (Oct 18, 2012)

Bermie said:


> Fer pete's sake Jeff, lose the excess apostrophes!!!!
> 
> Your climber's what?
> The saw's what? AAAAgggghhhhh!
> ...



HEY BERMIE... good to see you!!!


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## Bermie (Oct 18, 2012)

Ah, I've been rumbled...just stopping in for a bit of variety!


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## sgreanbeans (Oct 19, 2012)

Bermie said:


> Fer pete's sake Jeff, lose the excess apostrophes!!!!
> 
> Your climber's what?
> The saw's what? AAAAgggghhhhh!
> ...



020t- now that was a freakin good aas saw, so sick that mine was stolen...............someday uz sumbeyatch, ilz getchur sorry aas. I know exactly who took too, lived right down the street from me, little freakin wanna be punk.


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## Kottonwood (Oct 20, 2012)

So what is the word on the 355T? Anyone try one yet?

I am running two 200's and and two 201's right now. I am not impressed with the 201. I just called my nearest echo dealer and got a 355 on order, so we will see.


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## jefflovstrom (Oct 20, 2012)

PatriotTreeCO said:


> So what is the word on the 355T? Anyone try one yet?
> 
> I am running two 200's and and two 201's right now. I am not impressed with the 201. I just called my nearest echo dealer and got a 355 on order, so we will see.



Before I break out any of the 200's still in the box, I will get a 355. 
Jeff


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## mikewhite85 (Oct 20, 2012)

Who needs an alternative to the ms200t when you can still find them for a grand on ebay??? Brand New Stihl MS200T Chainsaw Fuel Oil Never BEEN in It So It's Truly New | eBay


I don't mind the 201. At about 6 months old it's still my newest prettiest saw and seems to cut pretty well. I haven't needed to bring it to the shop aside from when it got dropped from a tree and needed to replace the handle. Where can I find how to do the mods?


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## shawnw (Oct 20, 2012)

Forgive my ignorance, but why was the 200T discontinued to begin with? Emissions?


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## jefflovstrom (Oct 20, 2012)

shawnw said:


> Forgive my ignorance, but why was the 200T discontinued to begin with? Emissions?



We forgive,
Your question should be 'Why was the 020T discontinued.
Jeff


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## mikewhite85 (Oct 20, 2012)

STIHL USA News: Review of the STIHL MS 201 T

Emissions


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## troythetreeman (Oct 21, 2012)

ive never liked the stihl climbers, ive always preferred echo, tho i like the cs341
i think its funny tho stihl is loosing people to echo


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## troythetreeman (Oct 21, 2012)

mikewhite85 said:


> STIHL USA News: Review of the STIHL MS 201 T
> 
> Emissions



idk, it all sounds good and fine to me excluding the rev limiter, there are many times i intentionally "red line" my saws for various reasons and ive yet to wreck one, i do this for a living, i dont want an idiot proof saw
but, i have yet to run the 201, so i cant really make any qualified statements about it
i can say that on paper, the 88 is a better saw then a 3120, but it isnt
so, on paper doesnt really hold water for me


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## see3 (Nov 1, 2012)

*stihl 020 to the 200*

the 200T has been the 'definition' of a climbing saw for years. why? because it is the product of decades of improvements starting at the O20 model. 
simply put, stihl is in a corner with the EPA with emissions and thus had to discontinue the 200 series and introducted the 201 series. a strato engine, not commonly seen in their saw catalog in the past.


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## ConcordGarden (Nov 6, 2012)

see3 said:


> the 200T has been the 'definition' of a climbing saw for years. why? because it is the product of decades of improvements starting at the O20 model.
> simply put, stihl is in a corner with the EPA with emissions and thus had to discontinue the 200 series and introducted the 201 series. a strato engine, not commonly seen in their saw catalog in the past.



Unfortunately it was replaced for the same reason they stopped making 1969 Camaros and Mustangs... Because Technology is changing to more Fuel Efficient and less Emissions. 

We work closely with Stihl over here in CA. (former employee works their)... The MS200T was perfect out of the box.. which is why most people don't like the 201.. It requires a break in and an adjustment that must go back to the service shop you bought it from.... Once broken in and readjusted it's actually got more power than the 200. However only 20% or less of my customers have brought their 201 back for an adjustment. 

We've been sending the CS-355T out on Demo's to every tree crew in our area and they say it has more power than the 338 husky but not as much as the MS200. Its a very close contender and they seem to have pretty good feedback on it so far. But remember you're still not comparing apple to apple. If i am not mistaken we are talking $449 retail vs $629 on the Stihl. 

So considering its price its a great saw. (but our customers still prefer the MS200) 

you can't knock service from either Companies. They are both willing to stand behind their products 100%. 

If price is a concern I'd say try the Echo. If not the 201 is the best option. I have yet to see the new husqvarna top handle come out but am long awaiting it.


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## TreeGuyHR (Nov 12, 2012)

I have two MS200T saws -- and I have replaced the carb twice on one and once on the other. I have had them for about 4 years.

I have been told that they will last longer if I switch to no ethanol premium for the mix, which I have. 

Now one of the saws is going bad again: starts, but won't rev to full rpm without stalling for awhile, and then once its warmed up and in use, follows the same pattern but less often. This can be really annoying when you are using the saw in a tree; my climber won't use that one, which he identifies by its longer start cord and clean handle -- his fav is gunked up with pitch on the handle and has a short start cord. I could label the saws? 

Anyway, I really don't want to pay for another carb replacement; any ideas?


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## troythetreeman (Nov 12, 2012)

TreeGuyHR said:


> I have two MS200T saws -- and I have replaced the carb twice on one and once on the other. I have had them for about 4 years.
> 
> I have been told that they will last longer if I switch to no ethanol premium for the mix, which I have.
> 
> ...



bfh


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## TreeGuyHR (Nov 12, 2012)

troythetreeman said:


> bfh



Well, I have considered throwing it out of the tree. I have heard about someone doing that to a saw, but have not seen it done yet. 

Years ago, a worked for a tree company that had a touchy climber: he ran the saw down the sidewalk full bore for 10 seconds and tossed it in the truck because he said that the chain sharpening guy didn't file it right.

So, I'll probably take the carb out and hit it with a hammer to save the rst of the saw...


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## Bermie (Nov 12, 2012)

When I bought my 200t new, it developped a stalling problem, it was the fuel tank breather, it was full of gunk, once I cleaned it out its never looked back, try that.


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## TreeGuyHR (Nov 12, 2012)

Bermie said:


> When I bought my 200t new, it developped a stalling problem, it was the fuel tank breather, it was full of gunk, once I cleaned it out its never looked back, try that.



Thanks -- I'll try that. 

I always try to support the timber industry -- I am printing out the 118 pg. tech manual (as opposed to the worthless one you get with the saw) right now. It seems there is either a single or multi-part fuel venting system in the MS200T -- who knew?! Rather than go back and forth from my office to shop (or take the saw apart on the desk over the keyboard) I now am the proud owner of the tech manual for the exploded diagram and instruction page in question! 

Maybe if I break a leg, I'll have the down time to learn to tear all of my own saws apart.


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## millbilly (Nov 12, 2012)

TreeGuyHR said:


> Thanks -- I'll try that.
> 
> I always try to support the timber industry -- I am printing out the 118 pg. tech manual (as opposed to the worthless one you get with the saw) right now. It seems there is either a single or multi-part fuel venting system in the MS200T -- who knew?! Rather than go back and forth from my office to shop (or take the saw apart on the desk over the keyboard) I now am the proud owner of the tech manual for the exploded diagram and instruction page in question!
> 
> Maybe if I break a leg, I'll have the down time to learn to tear all of my own saws apart.



Did you have to pay for that manual?


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## swingdude (Nov 12, 2012)

TreeGuyHR said:


> Thanks -- I'll try that.
> 
> I always try to support the timber industry -- I am printing out the 118 pg. tech manual (as opposed to the worthless one you get with the saw) right now. It seems there is either a single or multi-part fuel venting system in the MS200T -- who knew?! Rather than go back and forth from my office to shop (or take the saw apart on the desk over the keyboard) I now am the proud owner of the tech manual for the exploded diagram and instruction page in question!
> 
> Maybe if I break a leg, I'll have the down time to learn to tear all of my own saws apart.



Tearing them apart might go well, however putting them back in primo working order is a whole other kettle of fish. BTW, hope you don't break a leg. :msp_wink:


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## TreeAce (Nov 12, 2012)

FWIW, I checked out a 355t in Baltimore and all I can say is it felt cheap. Like it would break easy. The new husky top handle felt better but not as good as the 201 as far as just holding them. But I havnt actually ran any of them so...... Personally, I would prolly take my chances with the 201. I do know that I def grin every time I think about that brand spankin new 200t i have in the garage:msp_smile:


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## jefflovstrom (Nov 12, 2012)

TreeAce said:


> FWIW, I checked out a 355t in Baltimore and all I can say is it felt cheap. Like it would break easy. The new husky top handle felt better but not as good as the 201 as far as just holding them. But I havnt actually ran any of them so...... Personally, I would prolly take my chances with the 201. I do know that I def grin every time I think about that brand spankin new 200t i have in the garage:msp_smile:



Got at least 14, 200T's everyday, only use synthetic mix, got one 192T, (he hates it), and one CS-355T (he loves it).
Jeff


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## Slvrmple72 (Nov 12, 2012)

Ran and still run 192T. Good little saw when you keep the chain sharp. I like the 200 for removal work and having run the 201 like it as well. I am looking forward to the T540xp with great interest to see how it compares. My buddy likes his Echo tophandle but I was not as impressed.....


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## Incomplete (Nov 12, 2012)

Been running my CS341 all year, very little complaints, in fact when we pulled the limiters out of the throttle body in July, it turned into an entirely new machine. 

I think the outboard chain adjuster would only be a problem if you're a Neanderthal, or a Eukman. If you take care of your tools, you're tools will take care of you. 

What about this little cutey?

http://www.baileysonline.com/itemdetail.asp?item=TK+TCS+3401+14&catID=


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## Kottonwood (Nov 30, 2012)

Jeff, glad to hear your echo is working out for ya. 

I got mine and I am not happy. It runs great and cuts like a champ until you run it for about a half hour and it starts running like a dog, can't get it started and it dies in the cut.

I gotta take it to the dealer to have it checked out but is an hour away.

Otherwise, it seems like a great saw. Feels good in the hand and it really cuts great when it's running good.... hopefully I can get these kinks worked out without to much headache.


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## Pelorus (Nov 30, 2012)

PatriotTreeCO said:


> Jeff, glad to hear your echo is working out for ya.
> 
> I got mine and I am not happy. It runs great and cuts like a champ until you run it for about a half hour and it starts running like a dog, can't get it started and it dies in the cut.
> 
> ...



Gas tank vent plugged mebbe?


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## jefflovstrom (Nov 30, 2012)

PatriotTreeCO said:


> Jeff, glad to hear your echo is working out for ya.
> 
> I got mine and I am not happy. It runs great and cuts like a champ until you run it for about a half hour and it starts running like a dog, can't get it started and it dies in the cut.
> 
> ...



Hope it works out for you, 1 year warranty is good.
No problems here, I got 2 more and other than the throttle on one would still rev when you let go. I took it in and got it back in 15 minutes, it was an adjustment that was supposed to be done before the saw was sold. Sorry your dealer is 1 hour away,,I cannot relate to you guys that think that is far. Different for me, I think 3 hours is to far!,,lol! Sometimes it takes an hour to go to San Diego and that is less than 30 miles, Anyway, the guys really like the saw.
Jeff


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## arborjockey (Dec 5, 2012)

338 338 338. I will never EVER EVER buy a new stihl trim saw for the price their asking. Wait tell someone else pays top dollar, then buy it from them for cheap. Thats the only way to own 1. Its a good saw. BUT BY NO MEANS worth that price. They think they have the industry by the balls. The ergonomics of the handle is redicules on it as well. My modified 338 puts the boots to a 200t. Its on its 3rd year. Ive ran my bosses Echos and if you keep them clean and sharp as a razor their not bad. I have no idea what "tree pig" is talking about with the chain adjuster my boss has run them forever and had no problems. keep em clean. Take any other saw, port it and run amsoil 100 to 1 and call it good.

Keep in my boss in oregon with the echos is no dummy. He's a master tech small engine mechanic and owns roughly 150 saws. Hes gone through maybe 20 stihl ms200 t's. 5 years ago he said he's done with them but still buys them for the climbers who insist on running them. He does still run exclusively stihl for everything other then trim. 361,440,660,880.


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## arborjockey (Dec 5, 2012)

one more thing.....the air intake on the echos is not right. It cant be run in the rain tell you put a piece of plastic in place to stop the water from entering the carb. jeff you desert dog you wont have to worry


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## PainAndMurphy (Feb 18, 2013)

*What I did is..*



Pelorus said:


> Gas tank vent plugged mebbe?




(after cat' mod)
I just relocated the fuel tank breather's location for good!! 

*1* 
Removed the recoil starter cover , and the flywheel (tapping gently) , Pulled the poor lil' breather from the *hole* it was buried in AND the *looooooong *breather hose .. 

*2* 
I sealed the hole in the wall where the breather hose went through, between the flywheel space and the carb compartment with a piece of matching hose and inserted a matching screw to press the rubber to the hole. 

*3* 
cut a little piece fuel hose , similar in size to the one I pulled out - just slightly tougher in that case , and reinstalled the breather -- just that now it sits right there - next to the carburetor, so I can access it whenever I open the air filter cover! 

Anyone here has done this ? 


I have yet to find anyone to have done this.. :/ 


Jo


PS
I can take a photo..
say?


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## T-rain (Feb 18, 2013)

[QUOTE


PS
I can take a photo..
say?[/QUOTE]

I wouldn't mind seeing a picture of this.


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## PainAndMurphy (Feb 18, 2013)

T-rain said:


> [QUOTE
> 
> 
> PS
> ...



I wouldn't mind seeing a picture of this.[/QUOTE]


*Working on it *


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## PainAndMurphy (Feb 18, 2013)

T-rain said:


> [QUOTE
> 
> 
> PS
> ...



I wouldn't mind seeing a picture of this.[/QUOTE]


if there's any Q's - ask away  

comments - please do - pros and cons alike!

for me it works flawlessly.. 


Jo.


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## Eoghan (Feb 18, 2013)

jefflovstrom said:


> I hear you. I just said I was thinking about getting one, not out-fitting my climber's with them. Thanks for the info.
> Jeff



Have you tried a 338xpt?? Lighter and than a 200t and more torque. With exhaust mods and porting it out cuts all of my 200t's.


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## PainAndMurphy (Feb 18, 2013)

*Imho..*



Eoghan said:


> Have you tried a 338xpt?? Lighter and than a 200t and more torque. With exhaust mods and porting it out cuts all of my 200t's.



after dealing with both 338XPT and MS-200T , The Husky is hell to rebuild and/or fix , and also to refuel. another lil example: intake manifold is weak spot on both while it's worse on the XPT, and harder to find - and way more expensive.. just another sign for which one is more popular and therefore more parts to find out there..


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## PainAndMurphy (Feb 19, 2013)

*Yo T-Rain..*



T-rain said:


> [QUOTE
> 
> 
> PS
> ...



I wouldn't mind seeing a picture of this.[/QUOTE]


Please let me know if that did any good.. 

Jo.


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## T-rain (Feb 21, 2013)

Thanks for the pics PainandMurphy, I may have to try that to my saw soon.


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## timberland ts (Feb 21, 2013)

Ill stick with the stihl. Ive had all the husky top handles,very unreliable, tempermental and a pain to work on. The echos are ok but lack power and comfort. I still have an 020 that gets used in the rotation. Worth the extra money.


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## Eoghan (Feb 22, 2013)

timberland ts said:


> Ill stick with the stihl. Ive had all the husky top handles,very unreliable, tempermental and a pain to work on. The echos are ok but lack power and comfort. I still have an 020 that gets used in the rotation. Worth the extra money.



I know the older husqy's were #### to work on, but as far as reliability we have had a far better experience with husqy than with Stihl. I'm not brand Loyal by any means, I just buy what works. I'm am tempted however to give the new Tanaka Top handle a go!! anyone here had any experience with them??


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## PainAndMurphy (Feb 22, 2013)

*just never buy used. never.*



Eoghan said:


> I know the older husqy's were #### to work on, but as far as reliability we have had a far better experience with husqy than with Stihl. I'm not brand Loyal by any means, I just buy what works. I'm am tempted however to give the new Tanaka Top handle a go!! anyone here had any experience with them??



Damn! I wrote a really good comment - and an accidental refresh has erased all of it! (the uploads remain though..) 

What can I so to recover it ?? 

I know it saves draft like email composing.. 

say?


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## PainAndMurphy (Feb 22, 2013)

*Husqy XPT's soft spot..*

:biggrinbounce2:


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## timberland ts (Feb 22, 2013)

Just like everything some swear by them some swear at them!


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## PainAndMurphy (Feb 23, 2013)

*hey, I know exactly what you mean. but..*

I'm still trying to speak reason. I hoped you could see it. I'm here because I love chainsaws, love working with them - and I'd rather have those that make it as much as joyful as can be (pardon my English, 2nd language..) 

What I wrote about the top handle Tanaka -and can't restore as well as it came out the 1st time- is about something like this: 

I had the TCS-2800, which is a super-lightweight (might even say featherweight!) 31cc (?) chainsaw. 
Don't know about the newer one, though I had a short experience with a newer 34-35cc Hitachi/Tanaka. 

If you see a *used* one - *don't take it.* 

If you wish to have *your own and personal* featherweight little 10"-12" machine to have fun with since you have some extra cash - I'd say try the 31cc *brand spankin' new*. Get away from used Tanakas. 

If something fails, and you don't have a dealer to take care of it - bummer. 
It's not like a highly proven model like the more popular top-handled ones.. think that over. 

'Less' significant issues: 
Vibration absorption - not very refined, though ok for less frequent use.. pay attention to the lower front mount in those that have it - calibrate if needed so the spring has enough play between the stoppers/mounts. 
Fuel tank breather - a bit pain to get there - pull out and clean / replace. I needed that ASAP so I had to improvise -cut the nipple of an ECHO vent - and shoved it in there.. 

Just *my experience and opinion * with and about it. 

Feel free to ask or comment.. 

Jo.


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## PassionForTrees (Feb 25, 2013)

So much ranting and raving over all these saws! !!! and exclamation points too! uhggg! I had to join the fun and let yall know what I did was bought 2 - 200t's problems solved! I have a 020T and now 2 - 200t's... think Im all set. None other will do. as they keep trying but keep failing, even Stihl has a hard time making something different and try to match up to the legendary saw as we know it. I hear alot of talk talk talk from Stihl , Husky and Echo but still no deliver...yet. yea im an optimist! but dont take my right hand 020 from me and expect me to be happy. :msp_sneaky:


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## PainAndMurphy (Feb 26, 2013)

*try..*



PassionForTrees said:


> So much ranting and raving over all these saws! !!! and exclamation points too! uhggg! I had to join the fun and let yall know what I did was bought 2 - 200t's problems solved! I have a 020T and now 2 - 200t's... think Im all set. None other will do. as they keep trying but keep failing, even Stihl has a hard time making something different and try to match up to the legendary saw as we know it. I hear alot of talk talk talk from Stihl , Husky and Echo but still no deliver...yet. yea im an optimist! but dont take my right hand 020 from me and expect me to be happy. :msp_sneaky:




I rebuilt *three* 200T's and *another* 020T from scrap.. 
Had a hard time learning their soft spots , and here I am.. living in relative peace with'em. 

try thoroughly cleaning them this time. compressed air and even using a little home steamer to get the rough junk out of it (but not too close, it could be too warm) -- with closed choke!!

Aside from carb issues, they could have either: 

- Clogged/damaged fuel tank breather 
- punctured intake boot (little hole or a tear) 
- other punctured/cracked fuel hose 
- Air leak from the case (try tightening the case screws with the T27 next time you dis-assemble it for thorough treatment) 

I could try go on about it, but I preferred putting the finger on the ones that are most likely.. 


Jo.


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## Sunrise Guy (Mar 1, 2013)

Watched a 355 blaze through a job, the other day. Belonged to a subbed-out 2nd climber I was using. Super impressed to the point that I'm popping for one, soon.


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## PainAndMurphy (Mar 2, 2013)

*well..*



Sunrise Guy said:


> Watched a 355 blaze through a job, the other day. Belonged to a subbed-out 2nd climber I was using. Super impressed to the point that I'm popping for one, soon.




maybe next time shoot a video, even with some cellphone/smartphone.. don't mind the quality


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## Sunrise Guy (Mar 2, 2013)

PainAndMurphy said:


> maybe next time shoot a video, even with some cellphone/smartphone.. don't mind the quality



Will do. 

The guy was slicing through 6" Live Oak limbs like they were sticks of butter, no exaggeration. (Live Oak is the heaviest, most dense, wood around here, and most of the US, from what I remember.)

I don't honestly know what's wrong with Stihl, these days. Yeah, I'm one who always ran 192's, but the reason for never popping for 200's was simple: The 192's did what I needed them to do---until the 192 TC came along, and I didn't want to spend an extra three hundred bucks, if I didn't have to. Even after a five hour break-in with the 192 TC, babying the heck out of it, I still was getting bogged down in ridiculously small cuts, even with new chains. When you're having to pull out of 4" wood to rev back up, at 60', there is a greater chance of injuries and line cutting. Definitely not cool.

To be fair, I asked the guy with the 355 how he liked it compared to his 201. He said he preferred the 355 because he found it to be more aggressive. I may get one, today. If I do, I'll report back, in here. Stay tuned.


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## PainAndMurphy (Mar 2, 2013)

*Sure thing!*



Sunrise Guy said:


> Will do.
> 
> The guy was slicing through 6" Live Oak limbs like they were sticks of butter, no exaggeration. (Live Oak is the heaviest, most dense, wood around here, and most of the US, from what I remember.)
> 
> ...




And feel free to take some snapshots  
Already asked videos 

Jo.



P.S.
Did you ever try to open up the mufflers and pop the carb limiters off on the newer 192's?


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## Gerasimek (Mar 3, 2013)

*an actual review*

I've always used the ms200t's. I heard all the complaints about the 201 and saw an advertisement for the new echo. The closest echo dealer to me called his rep and asked him to bring one out for me to try. I brought some logs and my ms200t and used them both, alternating cuts between the two.
Before I go on, let me tell you that all of my 8 saws are Stihls. 
The echo cut a little faster probably because the chain was brand new. Power-wise, I found there to be no difference. 
The echo has a great handle that fits like a glove with a little pommel that you can change according to hand size. 
Yes, the gas and oil lids are smaller than the stihl. The echo's screw on caps will surely not break like the ms200t's though. I'm certain everyone has had the misfortune of having the ms200t's caps break.
I have 2 ms200t's and the echo in my tool box and I always grab the echo before I climb into the bucket. Same power, same weight, same capacities, same dimensions but, that handle just makes up my mind every time I have to make the choice.
Bottom line: I bought a saw as good as an ms200t for the introductory price of $400.
Note: The echo rep brought the entire line of echo saws for me to try out. Needless to say, I tried them all. The echo cs335t was the only one That I liked. The rest seemed cheap and unrefined to me. It was like they put all of their efforts into the 335t and it paid off.
So, in closing, to cover my butt I will say this: if it craps out on me in a couple months, I will only be out $400($200 less than the helmet I wear) and that's only an hour and 15 minutes work.
I hope you found my review both useful and entertaining. Remember guys, it's a dangerous profession-charge accordingly.
Gerasimek


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## jefflovstrom (Mar 3, 2013)

Don't forget the warranty.
Jeff


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## millbilly (Mar 3, 2013)

Gerasimek said:


> I've always used the ms200t's. I heard all the complaints about the 201 and saw an advertisement for the new echo. The closest echo dealer to me called his rep and asked him to bring one out for me to try. I brought some logs and my ms200t and used them both, alternating cuts between the two.
> 
> Gerasimek



Im sure you meant 355t, thanks for the evaluation.


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## treeman75 (Mar 3, 2013)

jefflovstrom said:


> Don't forget the warranty.
> Jeff



How are your 355's holding up Jeff? What kind of hours you have on them?


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## jefflovstrom (Mar 3, 2013)

treeman75 said:


> How are your 355's holding up Jeff? What kind of hours you have on them?



Pretty good,,just picked up another one.

View attachment 282587

Jeff


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## Gerasimek (Mar 4, 2013)

millbilly said:


> Im sure you meant 355t, thanks for the evaluation.



Yes, I meant 355t. Sorry about that.
Gerasimek


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## jsdogs1 (Mar 4, 2013)

I have always been happy with all of my Stihls


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## Sunrise Guy (Mar 4, 2013)

jsdogs1 said:


> I have always been happy with all of my Stihls



And I am happy with your avatar. Hot!


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## Kottonwood (Mar 4, 2013)

So today one of my other climbers threw the chain on the 201 so I sent him up my echo then I used the 201.... I was amazed at how much I missed that echo and I was swearing at the damn 201.


When we got down I asked him "how'd you like that echo" He says "well I definitely wasn't mad at it"


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## ClimbMIT (Mar 7, 2013)

Hey Jeff, Glad to hear the feedback on the Echo's Is positive. I have one top handle at the moment Stihl MS 192tc. I have been pushing it to its limits really. Are the 355t's modded are they working that well out of the box? If so could be my next saw. Of course the palm rest is a must: big grin! I like new  

Thanks, Mark


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## PainAndMurphy (Mar 7, 2013)

*ergonomics*



ClimbMIT said:


> Hey Jeff, Glad to hear the feedback on the Echo's Is positive. I have one top handle at the moment Stihl MS 192tc. I have been pushing it to its limits really. Are the 355t's modded are they working that well out of the box? If so could be my next saw. Of course the palm rest is a must: big grin! I like new
> 
> Thanks, Mark




been waiting 4ever that someone will produce one to have a handle that would be not just balanced - but would also have an angled handle that allows the palm, wrist and arm to be as close as can be to the natural angles.. 

Now I can't wait to hold a 355T..

Jo.


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## ClimbMIT (Mar 7, 2013)

I was joking a bit but honestly you are right. Ergonomics is very important. Less pain more energy= more productivity=more money and time for yourself. If I had the dough I would be out buying one! yes indeed!


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## Stihl n Wood (Mar 7, 2013)

I'll take my modded 201s over my 200t's on any given day. If you haven't run one modded your missing out big-time. The mods are relatively easy to do and then u have a little animal hanging off your harness instead of a thought to be POS....Out of the box though, they are gutless. ..but there is a hidden beast in there. .


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## Erwin (Mar 7, 2013)

I run a small operation for 16 years, exclusively echo for climbing saws. One big reason for this is my skinny little arms anything heavier than a 330 is too heavy for me waving it up and down all day. Currently running Husky for 32 inch and longer, but would not hesitate to switch to Stihl (they're same to me). If you're one of those guys put pride into every equipment you use (top notch everything), I salute you because you help to keep my profit higher. Thank you.


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