# Sumac



## buzz sawyer (Oct 22, 2008)

Somewhere on this site I had read a thread on Sumac - wondering what the wood was like. A friend ran some smooth sumac through his band mill last year and just gave it to me. A lot of 4x6 and some 8/4 and 4/4. Growth rings are very wide - some 1/4" wide and there was a lot of movement from drying. The wood seems about as heavy and hard as cherry and turns OK. Tools need to be sharp to avoid tear out, but it's not as bad as redwood. I planed a few pieces and will watch to see how they hold their dimensions, but I don't think they will. The cup I turned is about 5 1/2" tall and the top is 2 1/4" dia. The first shot is without flash, the second is more like the real color of the wood. Anyone else have experience they can share?


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## carvinmark (Oct 23, 2008)

I've never used any Sumac, but your cup looks nice.


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## mtfallsmikey (Dec 2, 2008)

Buzz: Is this the same as Heavenwood?..i know there's a s**tload of it in W.V. Got some from a fella in Wardensville a few yrs. ago...has a nice cathedral-type grain to it.


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## buzz sawyer (Dec 2, 2008)

mtfallsmikey said:


> Buzz: Is this the same as Heavenwood?..i know there's a s**tload of it in W.V. Got some from a fella in Wardensville a few yrs. ago...has a nice cathedral-type grain to it.



Well, after doing a search, you may be right. I always thought these were big for sumac. I took one down about 20" dbh and have another that size still standing. Ailanthus is invasive but sumac is native. 

Thanks for pointing this out.

http://www.forestprod.org/smallwood06becker.pdf


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## aquan8tor (Dec 3, 2008)

Nice work, buzz. I was going to ask about the Ailanthus, but somebody beat me to it. Looks a lot like ash, IMO. A couple folks in the turning club I belong to made some ailanthus bowls. I turned a small cup for my girlfriend's daughter, but making the stem that skinny is a feat! Nice job.


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## mtfallsmikey (Dec 3, 2008)

I remember looking this up in a big ($50) tree ID book at a Woodcraft store a few years ago, thought it said Heavenwood was AKA Chinese Beech. The logger/dealer I mentioned in Wardensville told me that years ago, these were planted in logged out areas, and were being studied for possible use as construction lumber, and was not deemed suitable due to not having the strength of pine. It has a funky "green" kind of smell when worked...glues well, not much warping after planing.


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## ramrod98 (Jan 25, 2009)

buzz sawyer said:


> Somewhere on this site I had read a thread on Sumac - wondering what the wood was like. A friend ran some smooth sumac through his band mill last year and just gave it to me. A lot of 4x6 and some 8/4 and 4/4. Growth rings are very wide - some 1/4" wide and there was a lot of movement from drying. The wood seems about as heavy and hard as cherry and turns OK. Tools need to be sharp to avoid tear out, but it's not as bad as redwood. I planed a few pieces and will watch to see how they hold their dimensions, but I don't think they will. The cup I turned is about 5 1/2" tall and the top is 2 1/4" dia. The first shot is without flash, the second is more like the real color of the wood. Anyone else have experience they can share?



Not sure if you have sumac or not by looking at your pictures. Sumac is hollow inside and is a junk wood around here. I live in Pa. Only uses I ever knew of for sumac was for dying traps and for tapping maple trees for their sap for syrup(this was the poor mans way of doing it). Should you indeed have sumac and can't find any for future use, please contact me. i surely would take the time to cut some for you and send it to you, if this would be of help.


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## buzz sawyer (Jan 25, 2009)

ramrod98 said:


> Not sure if you have sumac or not by looking at your pictures. Sumac is hollow inside and is a junk wood around here. I live in Pa. Only uses I ever knew of for sumac was for dying traps and for tapping maple trees for their sap for syrup(this was the poor mans way of doing it). Should you indeed have sumac and can't find any for future use, please contact me. i surely would take the time to cut some for you and send it to you, if this would be of help.



I found out this ailanthus altissima - Tree of Heaven, aka Chinese Sumac.
seems to work OK but I'm concerned about dimensional stability due to the wide growth rings. Brought in about 200 years ago and is an invasive species, but not worthless. I have about 200bf in 4x6 and 1x6 I'll be playing with for a while, but thanks for the offer. 

http://www.forestprod.org/smallwood06becker.pdf


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## chipr (Apr 12, 2009)

buzz sawyer said:


> I found out this ailanthus altissima - Tree of Heaven, aka Chinese Sumac.
> seems to work OK but I'm concerned about dimensional stability due to the wide growth rings. Brought in about 200 years ago and is an invasive species, but not worthless. I have about 200bf in 4x6 and 1x6 I'll be playing with for a while, but thanks for the offer.
> 
> http://www.forestprod.org/smallwood06becker.pdf



We call it paradise around here (E. Wa. state) tree of heaven, ailanthus, usually recognizable by the small diamonds on the bark (not to be confused with diamond willow by any means). Leaves mimic black walnut for looks, but the black walnut has a spicy smell and the paradise has a stinky green smell. When it blossoms, it puts a cooked yellow squash or pumpkin smell into the air.


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