# buddy got lifelined today



## camaroman (Feb 1, 2011)

well me and a buddy were dropping a hickory today and the tree fell on top of him. I made my face cut like always then started on my back cut, as i was making my back cut my buddy was driving a wedge, the tree started to go so we step back about 10 ft and all of the sudden the tree splits up about 15 feet, when the top hit the ground the base of the tree kicked out and landed right smack on top of him from about 10 ft in the air and brought him down like a rag doll. Medic took him to the local hospital and found out it was more severe so they life lined him to Methodist in Indianapolis. He has a punctured lung, they removed his kidney and splien, he has a broken leg, skull fracture, 5 broken ribs and lost 40 units of blood. he is in stable but still criticle condition. Does anybody kno why the tree split like this? are hickorys known for this or could it have been cold weather or did the tree already have a split in it? the tree was not dead. this makes me not want to fall another tree again, if someone could tell me what they think happen, it would be much appricated so it wont happen again! thank you


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## wigglesworth (Feb 1, 2011)

Sorry to hear about your pal. My prayers are with him and his family. 

Ive seen several hickorys split lengthwise like you mentioned. Not sure why though.


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## PineFever (Feb 1, 2011)

Sorry to hear about your buddy. Hope he will recover.
Prayers sent.


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## derwoodii (Feb 1, 2011)

camaroman said:


> . Does anybody kno why the tree split like this? are hickorys known for this or could it have been cold weather or did the tree already have a split in it? the tree was not dead. this makes me not want to fall another tree again, if someone could tell me what they think happen, it would be much appricated so it wont happen again! thank you




Very sorry for your mates pain, sure hope he mends fast n well. Perhaps the cause is somewhere in this thread.

http://www.arboristsite.com/arborist-101/158360.htm


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## justme23005 (Feb 1, 2011)

sorry to hear about your friend.. hope he recovers quickly. 
I've seen more trees splitting lately.. I figured its due to the extra weight from the snow and ice that's coating them.


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## Wolfcsm (Feb 1, 2011)

This might help with understanding the barber chair:

BarberChair

Very sorry to hear about your friend.

Hal


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## tree md (Feb 1, 2011)

Sorry to hear about your bud. Hope he makes a full recovery.

Truth is, it is just plain dangerous when you are involved with moving something with such large mass and the inertia involved.

Things don't always go as planned. Hidden defects can cause trees to do all kinds of crazy things. I've had a hollow tree twist and turn 90 degrees from my intended target. I'm sure someone with more education and knowledge than me could examine the tree and probably tell you exactly what happened but I can tell you this, whether you realize it or not you are taking a chance with your life every time you drop one.

I am constantly telling my guys to keep their heads up when I'm dropping wood. They get so used to wood dropping that they will often keep right on with the task at hand and not even stop to watch when something is coming down. I had to get on one yesterday for walking right in front of my drop zone where I was dropping a pole. I told him to stop what he's doing and get away from the drop zone and watch when something is coming down. Don't matter if your out of reach or not, the pole or tree could throw a piece of wood at you. Especially if you are using chunks as a buffer to reduce ground damage.


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## zogger (Feb 2, 2011)

*Sorry to hear that.*

Hope your buddy makes a ..well, it won't be a full, but a full enough recovery. I got real injured on the job back in the 90s, and have never fully recovered. More or less forced early retirement and just part time work now. Still get some done, but it took the pizazz out of things bad, blew a slew of disks in my spine. I am *lucky* to not be in a wheelchair now.

As to trees doing weird things, I missed a kickback once that scared me pretty good. Just started falling fine, I was doing my retreat, then wham, straight back ten feet or so *fast*. I have no idea why it did it either...Well, I didn't then, thinking about it right now (haven't thought about it for 35 years) I bet I made my hinge too small.


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## PinnaclePete (Feb 2, 2011)

Camaro, Prayers that your freind pulls through without long-term issues. It sounds like he's being well cared for. 

But you know that you're affected too by this. Seek out someone you can talk to, confide in and lean on when you need it. Don't let feelings of guilt or "what ifs" tear you up. You both need to heal from this. Best of luck.


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## camaroman (Feb 2, 2011)

Thanks everyone for your support. He has multiple fractures in his leg and skull, he lost 40 units of blood, his lungs were collapsed, 5 broken ribs, they had to remove a kidney and splien, and broke a couple other things as well i cant think of it right now. they replaced his blood and they had trouble stabalizing him out of surgery but he is stable now, he opens his eyes occasionaly but it will be a few days before he is fully awake. the doctor said it shouldnt go down hill from here, it will be a long and slow recovery and he will remain in ICU for about 2 weeks. i just scares me so much to drop another tree because of this and knowing that if it would happen again it would happen to quick and i would have no time to react, but im sure when he recovers we will be back out and doing what we love to do again!


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## Wolfcsm (Feb 3, 2011)

camaroman said:


> Thanks everyone for your support. He has multiple fractures in his leg and skull, he lost 40 units of blood, his lungs were collapsed, 5 broken ribs, they had to remove a kidney and splien, and broke a couple other things as well i cant think of it right now. they replaced his blood and they had trouble stabalizing him out of surgery but he is stable now, he opens his eyes occasionaly but it will be a few days before he is fully awake. the doctor said it shouldnt go down hill from here, it will be a long and slow recovery and he will remain in ICU for about 2 weeks. i just scares me so much to drop another tree because of this and knowing that if it would happen again it would happen to quick and i would have no time to react, but im sure when he recovers we will be back out and doing what we love to do again!


 
Accidents can and should shake you to your core. They should make us question our methods and learn from them and as necessary modify them based on your analysis of them.

You now have very real first hand knowledge of what a barber chairing tree can do. That knowledge can and will make you better at falling and cutting with your saws.

Learn from the experience, don't let the experience run your life.

Be safe and take care. Keep us up on your friends progress.

Hal


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## camaroman (Feb 3, 2011)

i was thinking maby i should start making bore cuts, would that eliminate barber chairing or is there still a down side to that?


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## Wolfcsm (Feb 4, 2011)

camaroman said:


> i was thinking maby i should start making bore cuts, would that eliminate barber chairing or is there still a down side to that?


 
I would think there is a down side to just about anything done with a saw. The thing is to know of the possible dangers, avoid as many as you can, use proper technique, and always be aware of where you are and what you are doing.

One lesson with barber chairs may be to move at right angles to the fall of the tree. 

Here is a training site from OSHA:

Logging eTool

Another:

http://www.laymar-crafts.co.uk/linkd.htm


Might get a few ideas from them.

Hal


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## buzz sawyer (Feb 4, 2011)

Prayers said for your friend. Hope he pulls through OK.
Some years ago I had a big ash barberchair on me but it missed. Not too many things scarier that that. I borecut a lot anymore, just for the extra control and practice.


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## lumberjackchef (Feb 4, 2011)

Very sorry to hear about your friend. PM me his name if you'd like and I will add it to our prayer list at church. I have never actually seen a Barber Chair before but I will certainly be taking more precautions when I go to fell a tree next time. We had a local teacher back about ten years ago who had cut a large hackberry down, I believe, and one of the limbs was under a tremendous amount of pressure. So when he cut it loose, unaware, it splintered out and slammed a stake right into his heart. He died within just a few minutes. I know that sounds like an awful story, but just remember to count yours and your buddies blessings, it could've ended up much worse! My prayers are with you both.


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## treemandan (Feb 4, 2011)

Yes, Hickory can be a very particular tree to cut. What I mean is you have to make each cut particular to the desired effect of the cut or you will end up like a stromboli. I can't even eat stromboli cause it gets me thinking.
We never like to hear about this stuff and now you have a little education yourself. Beleive me, we all need itand yours sounds like a real rough start. Not to sound to harsh but we do like to dissect this sort of thing for that sole purpose. This specific case in general I think can be ( sadly) refered to as a routine novice mistake.
Definately quite a load to bear, sorry I have not much other to say in condolence -

But you were saved and now you are here...


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## camaroman (Feb 4, 2011)

so when the tree started to fall should i have kept cutting on it or what? my cut went past where the tree split. im just trying to figure out what happend and what i can do si it wont happen again, or will barber chairing happen on some tree no matter what? i have read of some people puttin a chain or strap around the tree about a foot or so above the cut to help prevent it, to me that dont sound like a bad idea.


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## tree md (Feb 4, 2011)

Heavy leaners are bad about splitting (barber chair). When you put a rope on one and give it a hard pull it creates the same effect. I always try to clean the corners of the notch out real good and will often cut about two inches on either corner, what we (the people in my circle when I was young) called the ears of the notch. I will also lay into the wood with the saw when I am cutting one with the potential to split. I don't slow cut them.


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## 046 (Feb 4, 2011)

sorry to hear about your buddy.... 

need more details of the tree in question. was it a leaner? 
please provide detailed pictures if you can. 

otherwise without details we are all guessing with you. 
someone here will be able to analyze what happened.


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## camaroman (Feb 4, 2011)

ok i will try and post pics later but the tree was not a leaner but it did have a little bow in it and the tree was about 16-17 inches in diameter and about 50 ft tall so pretty tall and skinny


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## deevo (Feb 5, 2011)

camaroman said:


> ok i will try and post pics later but the tree was not a leaner but it did have a little bow in it and the tree was about 16-17 inches in diameter and about 50 ft tall so pretty tall and skinny


 
Wow, just this week we did this one. Started to crack when we had weather that was -35 for a few days. I will post more pictures later, but this one was one of the harder ones I have done recently, we carefully removed the leader branches going from one side to the other as we didn't want to take to much weight off one side, and the other would cause it to crack more. This was a nasty tree, we started it was -18, very hard to get the spikes into. Hydro dropped the service line for us.


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## deevo (Feb 5, 2011)

few more....this was a fair size tree as you could see


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## deevo (Feb 5, 2011)

My tip on the one pick wasn't the highest because the crown and upper sections of the tree were in very poor shape and i wanted something strong to be swinging from in case of trouble. Almost every leader branch going up had some sort of crack in it. I took every step up very carefully and was careful how much weight I was lowering down. Once I thinned the crown, we rigged and dropped the rest of it.


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## deevo (Feb 5, 2011)

A few more as well. As you could see when the tree hit the ground it split into 2 and broke the 10,000 lb rated strap clean. It dropped exactly where we wanted it to with no issues. This was definelty not a home owner do it yourselfer! I went over on how I was going to do this tree in my head over and over. Took my time thought out every cut I made, and turned out exactly how I planned it! Homeowner wanted just the tree down and no clean up. Those last pics are of the hydro dudes....had to take a pic of them! They were great at being on time dropping the lines and coming back after 4 hours to re-connect! It was a fun day! Cold but fun! Don't mean to high jack this thread, but since you were talking about cracks in trees and barber chairing, this was for sure the tree to show, as a lot could of went wrong with this tree, especially for a novice! Hope your friend makes out ok. If you are ever in doubt of a tree, ask first before you do anything. A lot of of on here are willing to help, and give some advice to an extent


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## r&r (Feb 5, 2011)

Hope your friend makes a quick recovery.

Sounds like your motivated to learn what went wrong it would be a great time to get some books and let all that knowledge sink in. 

For what its worth the only tree Ive seen barber chair was a hickory.


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## ShermanC (Feb 6, 2011)

*This is one of the best threads I've ever read because everyone is empathic.*

As I went through these posts and photos I relived some of my close calls the past 18 years. Of 4,000 takedowns I had two white oaks twist unexpectedly in 2004 and '05 doing $4,800 property damage which I had to pay for out of pocket because my business had not produced enough $ to afford liability insurance. No one was injured but my pride.
Back in 1999 I fell 20' with safety belt and hard hat on, broke a hip and earned no income for five months while recuperating. I had health insurance but it was 80/20 coverage so my co-payment obligation totaled $9,000.
I have never had a tree to barber chair and I attribute that to this book: Faller's and Bucker's Handbook subtitled "Practical Methods for Falling and Bucking Timber, WORK SAFE". The ISBN number is 0-7726-3456-4 on the 1993 edition from the Workers' Compensation Board of British Columbia telephone 1-888-621-7233 (SAFE). I go back through the book at the beginning of each season.
I pray your friend will recover and regain some abilities and you can forgive yourself for making a mistake. 
On the woven webstraps I prefer the 3" wide 27' webstraps and would strap a codominant tree in four places real tight rather than two. I had to do this two years ago for an 80 year old codominant red oak 49" dbh that had steel pipe, twisted shank nails, barbed wire, welded wire fence and a horseshoe inside. It was a beast of a job taking 106 two man crew hours, a crane, and we ground the stump nine feet in diameter. Even with use of my Lumber Wizard we could not tell the metal was in the trunk base. I praised God that the job went okay and no injuries occurred. 
May all of us pledge to keep helping each other through this web site and email.


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## mpatch (Feb 6, 2011)

mistake was "i was making my back cut my buddy was driving a wedge, the tree started to go so we step back about 10 ft" never step back always to the side for a few reasons, if you are backing up you are either A) not looking where you are going B) not looking at the tree ...both bad. Anytime I have had a tree go sketchy on me I always go at a angle from the stump that way I can move quick and see where my feet are going and keep an eye on the tree. Also stuff happens some of the worst injuries I have seen/heard of have been by people that have many years experience.


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## winchman (Feb 9, 2011)

*one feller at a time*

Also, you NEVER have two fellers doing the same tree. It's an industry rule, part of the Z133.

One guy felling, others are AT LEAST a treelength away. Two people is too many.

Sorry about your friend.


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## camaroman (Feb 10, 2011)

well i just found out that he is paralized from the waste down. thats still not gettin my hope down bc i have heard several stories of doctors telling people they are paralized and they will never walk again and over time they come out of it, and i also dont undersrtand how they can tell if he is paralized if he is laying in a bed cant even talk and can barely move his arms. i guess time will tell and hopefully he will come out of it. thanks everyone for your support


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## wildwilly411 (Feb 10, 2011)

Deevo please tie off higher we dont want to be reading about you here.
http://www.arboristsite.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=171184&d=1296955203


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## wildwilly411 (Feb 10, 2011)

deevo please tie off higher, we dont want to be reading about you in here 
http://www.arboristsite.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=171184&d=1296955203


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## randyg (Feb 10, 2011)

I will pray that you never loose hope, and that your friend recovers way sooner than "they" expect. I want more than ever as well as most following this I'm sure, to be able to help you figure out exactly what went wrong. Several pictures of the stump, some close up, some different angles, and we can more often than not, tell the story. We all have room to learn, and most are willing.

randy


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## tree md (Feb 10, 2011)

Prayers sent for your friend. I know the feeling. I have had 2 close personal friends who have been paralyzed by climbing accidents. One was only 22. I have lost others. 

Stay safe.


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## camaroman (Feb 10, 2011)

ya and the sad thing is my buddy is only 23...thanks again for everyones prayers and support


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## cjnspecial (Feb 11, 2011)

camaroman said:


> ya and the sad thing is my buddy is only 23...thanks again for everyones prayers and support


 
That's tough no matter how old you are. Praying for you and your friend.


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## deevo (Feb 12, 2011)

camaroman said:


> well i just found out that he is paralized from the waste down. thats still not gettin my hope down bc i have heard several stories of doctors telling people they are paralized and they will never walk again and over time they come out of it, and i also dont undersrtand how they can tell if he is paralized if he is laying in a bed cant even talk and can barely move his arms. i guess time will tell and hopefully he will come out of it. thanks everyone for your support


 
That's too bad, never know like you said, maybe he will defy the odds


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## deevo (Feb 12, 2011)

wildwilly411 said:


> deevo please tie off higher, we dont want to be reading about you in here
> http://www.arboristsite.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=171184&d=1296955203


 
Read the thread! Couldn't because the crown higher up was in very poor shape, and the other side there was a large crack and wasn't too stable. Took my time with everything I did. Thanks for your concerns, post some of you jobs, not the easy ones....if you have them! Ever climbed when it was -20, trees frozen like a concrete block? Then come talk to me.:msp_tongue: Did you look at the pictures of the tree when it was on the ground? That's why i posted it on here, the split could of been a bad barber chair, but it didn't because it was done right!


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## Rickochet (Feb 20, 2011)

Camaro--We are praying for a fast and full healing for your pal. God still performs mighty miracles through the marvels of medicine. Please keep us posted and we will keep praying for him and you too. Hang in there!


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## camaroman (Feb 25, 2011)

he has surgery on his heart a couple days ago and he is still doing ok now. they changed all his meds and are going to start winging him off of them and he has been moving his toes a little so that def a plus. Its just going to take time for him to heal. Its a miracle he is still alive, god must have a reason for him to still be here. The doc said it helps that he is young and a bigger kid or they pry wouldnt hasve made it off the operating table. thanks eveyone for your support!


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## lego1970 (Feb 26, 2011)

Prayers and thoughts for your friend and a fellow tree worker. I had a Hickory tree barberchair on my about 10 years ago. Sounds similiar to yours. Pretty much straight up and was about 50' high and about 12-17" dia at chest hieght. I think it's in how a hickory tree will lean and bow as it's falling that causes it to snap like that. I read on here a year ago about useing straps and since then I have used them a couple times on leaners. Didn't seem to work on Deevo's tree, but I think in some circumstances it would work, depending on the size of the tree, the size of the straps, and how many you use. I don't know....again thoughts and prayers to your friend.


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## burlman (Feb 27, 2011)

prayers and speedy recovery for your sidekick. when I was a young pup with chainsaw in hand I had an underwear filling expieriance with a large red oak. we were clearing a roadway and had a beauty of a red oak to take down. 24in. and clear trunk for 40 feet. based on what I know now I can tell you what I did wrong. I cut my notch to shallow and did not check to see that my undercut and face cut met properly. I jumped right into the back cut, got about 1/2 way through and the tree started to move, feeling like a pro lumberjack, I started to exit the area when a gunshot went off, the weight and momentum of the tree closed on my to shallow poorly made notch. the full length of the tree sheered in two halves. the front went off 45degrees left from its intended target. the right side did the opposite 45 degrees.I walked away thank the lord, and sought out all the info I could on falling if I was going to stay in this business alive. Here in frosty cold quebec, trees easily split with the frost in the wood and snow loads in the tops. every tree we make our notch, then we make a cut along each side about a 1/4 depth of the trunk, at the same height as the back cut. then proeed to cut the backcut. most trees will want to split if pressure to fall exceeds your speed to cut. I now work residential tree removal, as logging prices suck. if we are winching on a tree to pull over ,or a dangrous hollow or seam is present. we wrap a chain or straps around the trunk to contain a barber chair to protect the faller. an ounce of prevention. speed kills in the tree business, good luck and hope you keep at it. it is unfortunate that we learn the most from this section of arboristsite.


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