Stihl 041 AV Super clutch question?

[texican65]

Hi guys. A few years ago, a friends dad gave me an old 041 AV super. He said it had sat for 20 years in his garage and he was happy to get rid of it. I put some fresh gas in it and it fired right up...I almost couldn't believe it. I used it for some small stuff around the house, but when I took it up in the mountains to cut some big red fir....as soon as it started to get deep into the wood, the chain would just stop. RPMs were still screaming with my throttle request, but the chain just slowed WAY down and came to a stop. And thats how it continues to behave. I'm wondering if the clutch is worn out? I took a picture of the clutch to show you all, I can't tell if its bad or not? I thought it would have the lining on each shoe that makes contact with the drum, but it doesn't...not sure if its completely worn away, or its not the kind of clutch with liners? The drum and shaft were a little wobbly, figuring it ought to be pretty tight?

And also, this saw has a 30" Oregon bar, with a .404 chain. Is this the right size chain and bar for this saw, I thought they ran a 3/8, with a bit smaller bar?

Dow

 

[hotshot]

Hey Drew,
.404 on a 30" is a stretch. Be alot faster cutting with a 24" &. 3/8" chain on hard wood.

That clutches' shoes & the sprocket needs replaced, as it has way too big of an air gap. The clutch & sprocket is so worn out that the shoes are getting flat spots from the drum being too big, but it is the later style w/o friction pads. What part number is stamped on the drum?

I'll post a picture of my 3/8" set up here in a while.

 

[Biigg50]

Here is a picture of the clutch on my 041 super.

I'm currently running a 3/8 x 24" bar and it cuts really fast, no bog.
When purchased new in 1979 this saw came with a 36" b&c from the dealer in Salem, Or. it ran great but we mostly cut soft woods then. Now I mostly cut oak and the shorter bar is working great.


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[hotshot]

My Super is buried in the hot shop, here's an 032 that uses the same clutch. Look at differences in drum diameters...

 

[Biigg50]

Wow I think mine is getting worn down as well. It still cuts great but compared to your 032 I'd say mine is gone.


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[hotshot]

It may be the drums' ID differences as that's an aftermarket Oregon 18200X rim drive on the 032. He (Drew) used to have a friction shoe clutch, I remember him running a wanted add a few years ago for a clutch assembly.

 

[texican65]

Hi Randy! Good memory, that was a few years ago, I bought a house and had a baby since then....been super busy, tired of looking at this saw on the shelf though. I wasn't really sure what type of clutch I had even back then, I think I asked some guys which type I needed...again I can't remember? Will either fit, with the same drum, or do the different types of clutches require theirs own separate drum?
And...if i want to run 3/8 chain, do I have to get a different size sprocket than the type currently in the saw for .404? anything else I ought to replace while doing this job, sprocket bearing?

Dow

 

[67L36Driver]

An 051 (?) I had in here once needed new lined shoes but are NLA. We just saved the spider and ordered in the later model shoes and a new set of springs.

 

[HarleyT]

texican65

Put up a pic of the tooth part of your sprocket, just for the heck of it.

 

[hotshot]

Congrats on the baby and the house, two life changers right there.

If the bar has a 404 sprocket tip, then yes it would gave to be changed.

I assume you are replacing the sprocket, the Oregon brand 18200 rim type works fine, and 3/8" is a common size.

Used 031/032/041 clutches are all over fleabay...new types anyway. I seldom see the friction pad lined ones.

 

[texican65]

Hi guys, I can barely make out Oregon 18200 on the sprocket. I've included The best picture of it that I can without taking it off.

 

[hotshot]

That's the right drum, so it's possible that the clutch shoes are the old style and have lost
their linings.

That rim should have been replaced 60,000 miles ago, LOL.

Anyhow, if you'll put a new/used late style clutch on it (& a rim) you'll be good to go.

There were four different clutches used on those series...

 

[texican65]

Well...get this. I took the old saw in to my local Stihl dealer, an older guy who REALLY knows his saws, I've done business with him for 10+ years, and he's a whizz with repairing them. He's a little more hesitant these days to work on the older stuff, but will if I have parts. Anyways, I bring this 041 in and set it on the counter, he snickers and says "ewwww, dump that in the scrap bin." I discussed the clutch issue and he smiles and says "come on back" and brings my saw to the back work bench. He whips out a rattle jack and zap...has the clutch off and in pieces in about 5 seconds. It was so quick I didn't even see how it came apart, I'll need help re-assembling. He said he didn't have the parts anymore that i needed, but that I could see everything i would need with it apart now. What a guy! How many dealers do that anymore? I bought some fuel line, and that was all he charged me for...$1.50. He said it was an old friction clutch that was completely worn down, I really can't tell if it is or not, so I've included pictures.

My question. do I need to get a new drum, or is this one ok....and if I keep this Oregon 18200 drum, should I get a friction pad clutch or the newer non-friction pad.....which will fit?

And also....any way to date this saw by the serial number provided? I'm guessing early '80s...its electronic.

Thanks,

Dow

 

[Biigg50]

I know mine was new in 1979, if that helps.


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[hotshot]

New clutch needle bearing, drive rim, & late steel style clutch, try reusing that 18200X drum.

The friction lined & full steel clutch type diameters are the same & will fit, ar least the new ones are LOL.

Have you ever pressure tested that 041 saw Dow?, as I had air leaks & had to replace the clutch side seal, reseal intake manifold gaskets, & then replace the oil pump shaft O-rings on every one that I've brought back to life, just saying.

 

[texican65]

Check it out! got me a New/Used friction clutch! Look at the differences in the spacing between the old one and this new-to-me one. When the man took this apart so quickly, I didn't see how it came apart. The last 3 photos...is
that the right order for those pieces? Haven't pressure tested it Rando...that'd probably be a good idea....those other seals too while the clutch is off.

Thanks,

Dow

 

[texican65]

Well.....all back to-gether and she's a' cuttin'! No more chain stopping when i bore down on a round....that solved the worn clutch issue. NOW.....for the next issue.....i can't get the chain to stop spinning when in idle...tried adjusting the idler screw low enough where the saw is just barely running...but the chain keeps spinning....and when I rested the tip of the bar with the chain spinning against a wood round...the saw died as soon as the chain bound up in the wood. I tried pulling the chain by hand and I can feel it trying to rotate the piston inside. What did I do wrong, something in the re-assembly process out of place? Over tighten something?

Thanks,

Dow

Here's the new-to-me friction clutch I just installed....much better fit....too tight of a fit?

 

[67L36Driver]

Not enuff endplay on the clutch drum.

It may need one or more of the little washers in your picture. Bottom left.

 

[Dawnsman]

We had two of those 041 we ran 24 in Oregon chipper/chisel chains had no problems with power or rims until the clutch like yours started slipping changed it with your ordinary nothing special clutch ten more years sold saw it's still in service

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[texican65]

Hey driver, I put everything back in that came out, I just didn't see how somebody else took my saw apart, it happened too quickly. I think I've got something installed wrong, or I over torqued the clutch, I'm not sure of the torque requirement, so I just reefed on it, anybody know the value?

And also, in that photo of mine that you provided in your last post, which order and direction do the two bottom pieces go?

Thanks,

Dow