Automatic Chain Sharpener - Under $300

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@Philbert is there any bias between left and right?
Not that is obvious.

The top plate angle is adjustable 0° to 40°, independently, for R and L cutters, so it is possible to make a user set up error, just as there is with most manual grinders. You have to read the printed scale (not a digital readout), and I have recommended to Gun that these markings be larger, with more contrast, for us old guys to see!

The unit also comes with a wheel centering tool, and instructions for making that adjustment, if needed.

Philbert
 
I just wanted to pop in and say that I've been lurking and reading everything, but didn't really want to interject myself since everyone's playing around with the unit. I've refrained from commenting how to do something cause I'm also interested in seeing how everyone naturally uses the product, even if it's being used incorrectly. This sort of information lets us know what needs to be worked on.

However, anyone with the unit should be aware that if you ever can't figure something out, I and the company are at your disposal to troubleshoot and resolve the matter.

I'm really excited to be reading along and learning about what you guys are doing with it. Lots of us here at TEMCo Industrial are reading this as well, so just a reminder that our designers, engineers, customer service personnel, etc. are all reading - your technical criticisms allow us to grow, and so far you guys have been amazing about backing up your critiques with sound reasoning, which truly allows us to solve these problems and work on user experience.
 
Been too cold to cut around here. Hoping to get out this weekend and dull some chain. Might have a couple things I need some help on to fine tune but that is gonna require some measuring of teeth and testing of the grinder.
 
Been too cold to cut around here. Hoping to get out this weekend and dull some chain. Might have a couple things I need some help on to fine tune but that is gonna require some measuring of teeth and testing of the grinder.

@panolo You can either write a message here and I can get back to it, or if you need an immediate answer you can give us a phone call between about 11AM and 5PM PST when Justin is in the office and he can help you out. Dial our main line, say you're an FP1000 customer from the ArborSite Forum, and that you'd like to speak to Justin for some technical assistance on it. The person on the line can help forward you to him. I doubt I can post the number here, but it's written on the box and all over our website.

As a California guy, born and raised, I shiver at the mere thought of the cold temps you guys get over there in Minnesota.
 
NAKED PICTURES!!!!

A lot more activity on this topic in another forum, but wanted to share some more information here, for those interested. Looking under the covers helps explain how the machine works, and how to use it better. It also shows a remarkably simple and refined design for this type of machine, IMO.

This photo shows the chain advancement arm (and hinged pawl), the cutter clamp, and the Right / Left cutter proximity sensor.
Screen shot 2019-02-14 at 4.45.35 PM.png

'Same' area from the other side, shows how the pitch and length knobs are related, and act as hard stops for the shaft that rotates the chain advancement arm. ***If these knobs are screwed out past a certain point, no additional adjustment in the shaft rotation is provided. A user has no way of knowing this with the covers in place*** This can lead to confusion and frustration (maybe I should cut a viewing window?).
Screen shot 2019-02-14 at 4.45.07 PM.png

Similar situation on the grinder arm: a rotating cam allows the arm to move forward and back by gravity only - the depth knob is a hard stop which prevents the arm from going too deep. I labeled the large bearing which might be mistaken for a motor.
Screen shot 2019-02-14 at 4.11.38 PM.png

Hard, adjustable stops (Right and Left) limit the movement of the grinder head via a stop post.
Screen shot 2019-02-14 at 4.14.53 PM.png

Not exactly 'Full Frontal' nudity, but a good idea of what the guts look like, after the design has been refined down to a production version.
Screen shot 2019-02-14 at 4.14.19 PM.png

I hope that these help folks understand the machine - they will certainly help me with fine adjustments, which should help me get the cutter profiles I am trying to achieve, going forward.

Philbert
 
Took it to a GTG . . .

IMG_3242.JPG

Took the FP1000 the Iowa GTG this weekend. Due to the weather, we spent a lot of time inside, and the grinder got a lot of notice. I set it up with some 'practice' chain, and posted my version of the 'Quick Start' guide on the work bench. The grinder was out for more than a day, and I gave a number of 'guided tours', but no one asked to operate it themselves, or to try and sharpen their own chains.

In fairness, the GTG crowd is often more focused on race chain, with lots of 'secret sauce' angles, hand filers, etc. I tried to solicit initial comments (generally positive) before answering any questions, to avoid potentially biasing perspectives on it. And, since I already had the practice chains 'dialed in', I probably made things look easy, as I walked through the Quick Start guide.

We did experience a couple of 'hiccups'. One where the grinding wheel seemed to randomly come down and hack off more of one cutter than all of the others. Maybe the chain hung up slightly when pushed, then jerked forward a bit when released? When using a manual grinder, I pull the chain back against the positioning dog / pawl to positively position each cutter. On the FP1000 the positioning arm retracts before the grinding head lowers. Might have to do with when the clamp grabs the drive link?

A second issue was the grinding head failing to lower occasionally on one loop; happened to be only on Left hand cutters, but not all. These practice chains were worn back to (or close to) their witness marks. Perhaps the proximity sensor read this as 'no cutter', but enough was present to allow the pusher arm to advance the chain?

Just speculating here on both of these. Hopefully @Gun can provide some insight.

Philbert.
 

Attachments

  • TEMCo FP1000 Automatic Chain Sharpener Quick Start Guide.pdf
    60.3 KB
New CBN Wheels

So p-r-e-t-t-y when new! Very professional appearance.

Received the CBN wheels for the TEMCO grinder (1/8", 3/16", and depth gauge). I like that they now provide different thickness wheels for smaller (1/4, 3/8 low profile, and some .325) and larger (some .325 and full sized 3/8) pitch chains. This helps obtain the correct cutter profile.

I was confused why they had a directional arrow in the photos, but upon receipt, it is pretty clear: the cutter sharpening wheels have a shoulder on the back, and the depth gauge wheel is profiled at a specific angle. Standard TEMCO vitreous wheel is shown for reference (can be mounted either way)

The grit on these CBN wheels feels very fine; even finer than the original vitreous wheels. eBay posting lists them at 150 grit.

Very nicely packaged in a re-usable holder. Used these at the GTG, above.

Philbert

IMG_3225.jpg IMG_3226.jpg IMG_3227.jpg
 
Philbert's Summary - Part 1

I like the idea of an automatic chain grinder: it should save time and increase cutter consistency. I am really impressed that TEMCo was able to develop and produce this model for the price that it is offered at. Looking 'under the covers', the design is both clever and elegantly simple.

Comments posted in these threads have provided the company with a lot of invaluable feedback, advice, and suggestions from a dedicated group of chainsaw users and potential customers. E.g. this type of device should cover the full range of common, consumer saw chains, including:
· 1/4 inch to full-sized 3/8 pitch chain;
· 0.043 to 0.063 gauge chains; and
· skip tooth chains, or at least the extra space common on many odd length loops.

'Automatic', of course, means that it runs unattended once set up. This is not, "Alexa: sharpen my chain!"technology. A user still needs to understand what a properly sharpened chain looks like, and how to set the controls, in order to get satisfactory results.

TEMCo generously provided a unit for evaluation in these forums. For reference, no one else asked to participate in this review, per the guidelines posted. In fairness, the company's offer of a 'one-year satisfaction warranty, with shipping paid both ways' on eBay is, perhaps, a better offer.

I hope that others who try and use this product share their comments, experiences, and recommendations in these threads. I also hope to continue using and evaluating it further, and to take it to other events for folks to try. Longer-term feedback can only come from extended use.

An evaluation of the product really falls into 2 categories: the product itself, and how it compares to other chain grinders or sharpening methods.

Philbert
 
Philbert's Summary - Part 2

Overall, the TEMCo FP100 feels like a well made and well finished product. The design is compact and the packaging is very professional. Many photos are posted earlier in these threads. The manual feels a bit more like a work in progress.

Use of the grinder was not intuitive for me, however a series of YouTube videos were very helpful to understand basic operations. Familiarity came with use. This might vary with the type of previous sharpening experience a user has. I have sent the company many comments, beyond those that I have included in these threads, and continue to send updates, occasionally.

A key set up issue I had was with the 'Length' and 'Pitch' knobs. Because these adjustments are mechanically related, and the design allows the knobs to be rotated past the limits of having any effect, it is confusing when adjustments apparently make no difference, or when they have disproportionate or unintended results. Cutting viewing 'windows' to see what these knobs actually do was a big help for me, but something I still have to think about.

The 'bubble buttons' on the digital display panel also have a learning curve, since they are multi-functional: hold them a little too long and they do something else. Periodically, I have to turn the power 'Off' and start over.

The 'Depth' knob is pretty straightforward. However, the cam-operated, gravity feed of the grinder head sometimes made this confusing, when the wheel would not travel as far as desired; this turned out to primarily be an issue with the grinding wheels.

In my mind, the wheels of a grinder are analogous to the chain on a saw: their quality and condition are critical for good performance. The red/brown, fine grit, vitreous, OEM grinding wheels cut well when new, but soon became glazed, even though I routinely clean chains before sharpening. They were also challenging to dress, compared to conventional grinding wheels. Glazed wheels, in turn prevent the head from grinding to the desired depth during the programmed cycle time, resulting in inconsistent cutters.

Eventually, I was able to learn how to dress the wheels appropriately; this is information that should be included in the instructions. The optional CBN wheels have performed well, during the limited time that I have tried them. Because they are offered in 2 widths (1/8" and 3/16") it is also easier to get good cutter profiles for a variety of chain pitches in a single pass.

Changing wheels should be more convenient, as this is required for different pitch chains (with the CBN wheels) and when adjusting depth gauges. The small screws securing the guard require a lot of turns, and are very easy to lose.

With some practice and experimentation, I was able to sharpen cutters, clean out gullets, and get acceptable chains. If starting with a hand filed chain, it may take a few passes to 'even up' the cutters: after than, maintaining edges with the sharpener is easier.

The FP1000 could be a good choice for a saw user seeking to sharpen edges dulled from normal use; who runs a limited number of chain pitches; who is satisfied with conventional cutter profiles; who is technology minded; or just appreciates the automated function. Frankly, it is kind of fun to watch, once you have it 'dialed in'.

This grinder is for personal use: it is not the unit to start a chain sharpening business with. It would not be as good of a choice for users demanding custom angles or cutter profiles; for those restoring 'rocked' or damaged chains; or for those not comfortable with technology.

Philbert
 
Philbert's Summary - Part 3

Hand filing chains requires some knowledge, skill, and experience for proficiency. Grinders generally produce more uniform cutters, and are faster when a lot a material needs to be removed. In fairness, it takes some knowledge, skill, and experience to become adept using most grinders as well.

Inexpensive, manual chain grinders can improve cutter edges with standard angles, but often have limited power. Other automated chain grinders cost more than my first few cars! It is most fair, therefore, to compare the FP1000 to other grinders in a similar price range.

The Oregon / Tecomec style grinders generally have more powerful motors and larger diameter wheels. Depending on the model, most offer a greater range of angle options for custom cutter profiles, especially 'hook' angles, for those who desire those options, and understand how to set them up.

With the right wheels, these manual grinders will work on any (round ground) chain. They have the power to grind away a lot of material when fixing a damaged cutter, or re-profiling a chain. Incremental adjustments are somewhat intuitive (e.g. turning a knob slightly lets you see the cutter or wheel move a similar amount).

Even though a few models have 'automatic' clamping mechanisms, grinding with them is a highly repetitive, mundane task. So, if the additional capabilities are not required, an automated grinder could be very attractive, and the TEMCo is the only automated grinder currently offered in this price range.

Greater control or automated operation? Few people in these threads have just one chainsaw: no reason why they can only have one way to sharpen chains!

Philbert
 
I was pondering on opening up a saw chain sharpening business along with bar maintenance. A automatic chain sharpener would be awesome when chains try to cut rocks n dirt. Setup the sharpener then do maintenance on the bar too, while the grinder does its thing.

I had a Oregon grinder when I was in the firewood bizz but didn’t need it that often. Unless rocks or steel was hit. But that’s time consuming to make all the teeth the same again. It’s not only lost sleep but time is money too.

It does do .325”/3/8”, in 050”, .058, .063”? .404” too? Maybe multiple grinders is the answer one for .3/8” chain, 325” chain, .404” chain. Another for rakers.
 
The “proprietary” wheel throws a red flag for me. Many times before I retired we would try new tooling and generally the one with proprietary wheels or cutters presented a problem if they had to be replaced and the salesman or company was nowhere to be found.

Like anything else we need to stock up on consumables ahead of time, keep a running inventory of grinding stones.
 
Read through all of this and looks good with a lot of comments , but only thing is i use 3/8 0.58 gauge chains over in UK on my bigger saws and only .325 0.50 on my 550 and 346 , so hope sometime i can get one ,I use the oregon grinder Ssometimes with some tooth damage with metal or rocks or dirt and is a bit of hassle sometimes as have to do adjustments on the cutters and then the angle seems to be slightly off on LH cutters so have to again adjust it correctly which can take a fair while , on slight dull chains i use the Pferd combie file and use the big CBN wheel and the pink stones sometimes on the Oregon , but iwont fit the Temco one :-( ,
 
Buy an Efco, Oregon (made by Efco) or a Silvey. Spend the extra money and get the Oregon 510A. I've seen them around $240 (google shopping search). The 510A is night day and better machine than the Oregon you listed. Bigger wheels, slower turning motor, more adjustments. The smaller Oregon is alright, but it's just not the same (I've had both). The Northern listed grinder is C-clamped to the table...kinda of odd. All of mine are lag bolted to the bench. I also like the picture with all the sparks, he is taking way too much material off on a single pass. Skip the Buffalo.....

The Efco/Oregon are made in Italy. The Silvey is US made but very expensive. The others are China junk. I presently have the Oregon 510A, an older reversible motor Efco (same size as the 510) and a Silvey 300.

Hope this helps!
 
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