Average Groundman education level

[Guy Meilleur]

Originally posted by OutOnaLimb
when are you gonna get off of this fricken dont cut down trees kick? When they pry my dod dead fingers off my diagnostic toolbag, that's when
As arborists thats our job 50% of the time.

Only if you sell that many removals. You do what you sell. Arborists by definition care for trees; Mike's doctor analogy is spot on.
Yesterday I whacked a dead elm; couldn't wait for a sub. 18" dbh, rigging over house, not extremely hard or easy. The work was so mechanical, I felt like I was only half there. It's relaxing in a way to have half your mind disengaged from the work, but nowhere near fun.

The money was very useful, but the only satisfying thing about the job was selling the pruning of damaged trees which will bring them around, and selling the planting of two trees.

My groundman on the job--16 months experience-- has little education and less common sense or care about trees. His work was so poor I told him I was going back to using my 14-year old next week, and if after reviewing his career options he wanted to work the week after his pay would be $8/hour instead of 10. Too many screwups.

 

[Froggy]

Removals are kick a$$ fun. All the rigging involved. It takes a well trained professional to do a removal right and walk away with nothing bothered or destroyed. Some may think different, but it's a kick a$$ advantage of the job. If I could do BIG removals all the time it wouldn't bother me. On the other hand pruning trees are just as fun. I guess I'm just a tree climbing geek. As for the groundmen. A well trained groundman who can drag brush well, do maintenance on the chipper with out any help, run the ropes, work on saws, and be right on top of things with the climber. Knowing the exact move a climber is going to do every time. No matter what tree. That people is a priceless groundman. I would pay good money to keep somone around like this. This combined with an excellent climber would make a kick a$$ crew.:blob6:

 

[OutOnaLimb]

Dont get me wrong, two days ago I had a customer want to take almost 75% of the canopy off of his beautiful silver maple. I told him it would probibly kill it or at best it would sucker back and look like crap. Took out two leaders that were over his house and one over the neighbors, I advocate saving trees when ever possible, however there is a time when trees get to be either a hazard, or an eye sore. Thats when they have to come down, and thats when they call me.

Kenn

 

[Nathan Wreyford]

I think I am the only one here who is a hired gun that does almost no removals. I mainly do security work for private companies that get city contracts to ensure trees in parks are safe. I love this work. I enter several huge trees a day, blow the dead wood out, check for hazards, and install dynamic cabling when needed (when there is any doubt).

I love saving trees. The more lucrative end of tree work for sure. It is value based. Removals are a commodity. Period.

I hear you with the poetry in motion. A good team beats a great climber and crew of jugheads any day.

I need a bigger saw. I had to fell this guy today due to bark beetle infestation that is killing most picea in Bavaria. Talk about views, I could see the snow capped Alps in Austria when I was chunking this thing down.

 

[OutOnaLimb]

Dude, your 100% right on that Rocky. I was gin poleing some tall cottonwoods yesterday and had my groundie runnning the ropes. There were 4 cottonwoods along the fence line about 3 ft from each other and they were about 45 ft high. We used the biggest one as a central crotch, used the BS and got a line up there and then tied off to the tree we were cutting at about the same height as the lowering crotch using a running bowline. Cut the smaller ones at an angle and hung them and cut pieces as he lowered the whole tree. The biggest one was a bear, but we put two ropes in it, a bull rope and a 1/2 inch line to direct it. Brandon did a kick a$$ job of working both ropes while I cut little pieces as he lowered it. I wish I had a camera on that one. it was pretty sweet, 4 good sized cottonwoods, roped out and cleaned up. Had to climb the last one, but we were out of there by noon. A good groundie is worth his weight in gold. He is even more valuable if he can climb the little stuff and give you a break. LOL

Kenn

 

[TheTreeSpyder]

Dang, Guy, when are you gonna get off of this fricken dont cut down trees kick? As arborists thats our job 50% of the time. Get off your soap box and quit preaching. If I get banned for saying that then so be it, Im just tired of hearing the tree hugger crap.

{i hopefully, safely choose this quote as not this specific person's, but what be going thru a few minds in some form or another. Waht i may have thought of similar words, not all to long ago}



i guess the internal conflict makes such words necessary. Trying to be a good person, trying to take more and more care, and hearing haunting echoes that maybe we all been trying real hard and missing the target, and all else is a lil'disgruntling.

It seems hard to listen to. Tossing it all away, even if it might be true, is kinda self protecting in a way, but also taking the easy way out. Not standing toe to toe in the tumble with the ideas, to see where they come out, right or wrong, jsut see it the way it is. i've learned a lot here from dang Mike, JP, Tom now Guy etc. hitting it hard. i guess i've stepped thru some of the stages of denial /change from it; so i have been there at different stages with it, as i imagine those mentioned and others know and see the same things to a certain extent as the some of the expected reactions come.

Harder still i think is to listen, not walk away from what you are doing, maintaining your place, to be the one that can alert and mediate 'damage' to do what you can. To do what you have to, change some of the requests, and walk from some etc. Sometimes i have felt the conflict in what i was doing and looked at it as i was the "Sin Eater" (Night Gallery) and so took the 'wrongs' on myself, for i was the one that knew better; and so became more serious about it.

That, i think is a lot tougher, yet 'realler'; to walk with the truth and obvious proof; yet carry on buisness when ya had to; til ya couldn't take it and turn some jobs down. This puts you in the voting, maintains me in the position to do good/right when possible, when allowed the oppurtunity. Maybe softly that too will fade. In my Eviler than Tom Daze; as i was 'losing my spurs' and going more 'barefoot'. When i was wearing them here and there, i knew, and kinda apologized to the tree as i did. i've come a long way since then, nothing overnight; and still see more things to understand.

Or something like that
:alien: