Bar Length vs. Performance

[Chainsaw Pete]

Obviously, putting a very long bar on a low powered saw will result in slower chain speed and cutting. I wonder what the effect is if you move up in bar length within Stihl's recommendations for a given saw. Yesterday I was trying to cut the base of a dead trunk away from the remaining live trunk. The 20" bar on my MS250 was just too short, and sawing from the opposite side was awkward and partially blocked by the live tree. My MS311 also has a 20" bar, but Stihl says it can take a 25 incher.

Can my MS311 run a 25" bar?
What kind of performance drop does one see going up a bar size or two? Having a longer bar for the occasional large stump would be useful. I'm ignoring the increase in saw weight - the longer bar would not be used most of the time.

 

[Evan]

What do you gbain by running a longer bar. What is the typical size of the trees you handle.? Where I cut I cut Pine and fur I usually shoot for fur so I don't I'm not cut super hardwood so I run 70cc size with one side has 28 one has a 32.

The 311 isn't a bad saw saw I have Granite with a 25 inch in the same Pine and first type stuff it's not my top choice but it will definitely get it done

For the 311 to be my main saw for what I do I'd be severely handicapped

 

[Chainsaw Pete]

What is the typical size of the trees you handle.?

I mostly mop up downed trees after a storm for friends and neighbors. We took down easily a dozen trees when we bought this house 23 years ago. I've also downed trees at my shooting club. Recently, I've been bucking trees and taking down several at a friend's farm. This summer, I spent two days in the woods at a friend's 65 acre property clearing downed trees. My main saw is the 250, for larger trees I use the 311.

The longer bar will let me trim stumps down a lot lower. I had an 042AV Stihl* w/ a 25" bar that I used on the larger trees in our yard, but that saw has not been running for years. A longer bar will let me trim a trunk near the base (see my first post above). I'd use it occasionally, when I hit a larger tree. My friend's farm has some dead or knocked over trees that will demand a bar longer than 20" and some will not permit sawing from both sides.

*subject of another thread

 

[NSEric]

With skip tooth chain the 25 inch bar will work just fine on the 311.
I find saws run out of oiling ability and get front heavy before they run out of power for slightly longer bars.
Keep an eye on the bar to see if it's getting enough bar oil.

 

[James Sawyer]

60cc saw will run a 25" bar, that a standard bar length on MS362 here in PNW but we don't cut the east coast hardwoods. I run a FC chisel on my MS362, it does ok. If your want pick up the power on MS311 with the 25" bar go to full Skip chain. The Skip actually doesn't run that much slower then you would think, it'll bring up your chain speed over a FC chain. If you can afford it go with Stihl Lightweight bar it'll help on the saw balance. If your on a budget, just looking for a stump bar I go with an Oregon bar over a the Stihl bar. I sure there are cheaper bars but I primary I run Stihl or Oregon bars so have no experience with other MFG bars.

 

[Evan]

In my opinion 20-25 isnt much different. I find it easier limbing with a longer bar.
I used play the small saw paired with a big saw game. Limb and buck small wood with the small big with the big.

Ive since found i work less with the longer bar even limbing. Put the tree down then drag the 32" down it walking the tree or limbing both sides from the one side.

I have a ported 026 with 18" the saw works well but i just cant reach very much. I gota move more to do the same cutting as the longer bar.

Weight really is no issue since the saw is 90% sliding down the tree.

I say 25" on the 311 keep it sharp and cut lots

 

[Hermio]

Obviously, putting a very long bar on a low powered saw will result in slower chain speed and cutting. I wonder what the effect is if you move up in bar length within Stihl's recommendations for a given saw. Yesterday I was trying to cut the base of a dead trunk away from the remaining live trunk. The 20" bar on my MS250 was just too short, and sawing from the opposite side was awkward and partially blocked by the live tree. My MS311 also has a 20" bar, but Stihl says it can take a 25 incher.

Can my MS311 run a 25" bar?
What kind of performance drop does one see going up a bar size or two? Having a longer bar for the occasional large stump would be useful. I'm ignoring the increase in saw weight - the longer bar would not be used most of the time.

With a sharp chain you can probably use a longer bar than even the manufacturer's recommendation as long as you let the saw find its speed and not lean into it. For occasional, use, that should be fine. You could also use skip tooth chain, which reduces the power requirements.

 

[thomasinvancouver]

I tend to run a longer bar on my saws. 25” .325 on a 261. 28-32 3/8 skip on my 572. The benefit to me is that I don’t have to bend over or squat down if it’s on the ground (nose awareness) and I’m a bit further from the log (blowdown) when I make my release cut.

I can also cut larger logs without doing a full double cut. Now that’s done knowing I can’t dog in and reef on it. Using the full bar length buried in wood requires some mechanical sympathy and conservative depth gauge filing to not bog it down. Your oiler will be sufficient for a slightly over length bar.

I think my approach is typical west coast thinking a la BBR. I’m not a faller or tree surgeon. I’m on a trail crew and clearing trail is what I know. Different strokes blah blah blah.

 

[Hermio]

I tend to run a longer bar on my saws. 25” .325 on a 261. 28-32 3/8 skip on my 572. The benefit to me is that I don’t have to bend over or squat down if it’s on the ground (nose awareness) and I’m a bit further from the log (blowdown) when I make my release cut.

I can also cut larger logs without doing a full double cut. Now that’s done knowing I can’t dog in and reef on it. Using the full bar length buried in wood requires some mechanical sympathy and conservative depth gauge filing to not bog it down. Your oiler will be sufficient for a slightly over length bar.

I think my approach is typical west coast thinking a la BBR. I’m not a faller or tree surgeon. I’m on a trail crew and clearing trail is what I know. Different strokes blah blah blah.

I cut firewood on my own tree farm. I use the opposite approach: short bar for speed and maneuverability. I use a 20" on my MS500i normally, and my longest bar is a 25". I don't usually put anything in my woodpile that I cannot through cut with these. And I do not have equipment to move logs bigger than I can cut from both sides. I use a Mahindra 5035 HST with loaded rear tires and a 4-way bucket. It generally weighs just over 10,000# with the setup I use for logging. I have dragged 20" butt end diameter x 60-foot-long green hickory logs uphill out of the woods with it. That weighs about 5000-6000#. But a similar 48" log of similar length would weigh over 30,000 lb, I would have to cut it into about 10' sections to budge it, but I could not drag it, as I would be unable to get it off the ground. (I don't have a logging winch. I use a quick hitch. I pull from the lower arms with a drawbar to get the log to the tractor, then use the upper link with a chain to lift the log. 20" is close to the maximum diameter it has clearance to lift off the ground.) I also would be unable to get logs larger than 24" cut to 20-22" long into my wood pile. (I age wood 2 years before splitting, so I first store them as rounds.)