Best first professional saw

[Coralillo Lo Pro]

One thing about your desire for future mods - I wouldn't bother with a bark box. There are an infinity of opinions on them but to me 90 percent of the people who say "it really woke my saw up" are suffering placebo effect of associating something twice as loud with dramatically increased performance. Spend the time instead on becoming the best chain sharpener you can possibly be and get and maintain the best bars and chains you can. That will make WAY more real world difference to how fast you cut. I lent a tree service guy a 24 year old heavily used Husky 455 Rancher, no mods, an ordinary saw no one thinks much of, but with a razor sharp 18" bar and chain he said it cut better than any saw he'd ever used. I run everything stock, I have one dual port muffler Stihl made as an OEM design for one of my old 87cc saws and like it, but otherwise spend all my spare time sharpening, not performance tinkering.

 

[Exophysical]

I have been looking at a 362 also, the 4 plus hp should indeed be plenty. I have some 362’s in my area that are for sale. I am right now just looking at a 462c that is on a second hand site for 450 bucks so im going to check that one out inside and out, because they is an insanely good deal but very risky, if that one doesn’t turn out like I hope (what I’m afraid it won’t but it’s always worth checking) I am planning to look at some of the 362’s as well.

Thanks for the advice

If you've got the bucks, I dont think going with a 70cc for a main saw is a bad idea. Personally, I dont find them that much heavier than a 60cc saw. Neither do I think most 60cc saws are light enough to be that much better for limbing/ topping... so if you will be eventually adding a smaller saw anyways, a 70cc makes more sense to me.

I'm partial to the Husqvarna 365, 272, and 372 myself.

 

[donmakesallthefuelbegone]

One thing about your desire for future mods - I wouldn't bother with a bark box. There are an infinity of opinions on them but to me 90 percent of the people who say "it really woke my saw up" are suffering placebo effect of associating something twice as loud with dramatically increased performance. Spend the time instead on becoming the best chain sharpener you can possibly be and get and maintain the best bars and chains you can. That will make WAY more real world difference to how fast you cut. I lent a tree service guy a 24 year old heavily used Husky 455 Rancher, no mods, an ordinary saw no one thinks much of, but with a razor sharp 18" bar and chain he said it cut better than any saw he'd ever used. I run everything stock, I have one dual port muffler Stihl made as an OEM design for one of my old 87cc saws and like it, but otherwise spend all my spare time sharpening, not performance tinkering.

What about aftermarket dogs? Are those any good or an airfilter system upgrade?

 

[donmakesallthefuelbegone]

If you've got the bucks, I dont think going with a 70cc for a main saw is a bad idea. Personally, I dont find them that much heavier than a 60cc saw. Neither do I think most 60cc saws are light enough to be that much better for limbing/ topping... so if you will be eventually adding a smaller saw anyways, a 70cc makes more sense to me.

I'm partial to the Husqvarna 365, 272, and 372 myself.

I am hoping to eventually get a 2511t as climbing saw for when I’m an arborist, I don’t think I need 70cc but better have in and not need it than need it and not have it I guess. I cannot see any big downside to more power except for the fuel consumption maybe

 

[Exophysical]

I am hoping to eventually get a 2511t as climbing saw for when I’m an arborist, I don’t think I need 70cc but better have in and not need it than need it and not have it I guess. I cannot see any big downside to more power except for the fuel consumption maybe

IMO a big saw works best with a longer bar, so you can keep the heavier powerhead close to your body while your working. So I usually use a 70cc with a 28" bar.

If thats way too much saw for the job then I step down to a 50cc saw with an 18 or 20" bar. Because I'm working with a light saw, using my arms and back to do the reaching isnt a big deal.

IMO a 60 doesnt work as well with a long bar, but is still more weight than I'd want to sling around all day with a short bar on it. JMO.

 

[Coralillo Lo Pro]

What about aftermarket dogs? Are those any good or an airfilter system upgrade?

AM dogs might be worth it if you're using a big saw felling big trees and want more aggressive ones, but for a 50-60cc saw, I see no point. Apparently the stock air filter on the 361 is quite good, wouldn't bother. My serious arborist friends pay no attention to chainsaw performance and mods and just run stock pro saws. They're more interested in trees than saws. Stihl and Husky have great engineers who have designed great saws that work well with no mods. For an arborist, nothing really needs to be done to them.

 

[donmakesallthefuelbegone]

AM dogs might be worth it if you're using a big saw felling big trees and want more aggressive ones, but for a 50-60cc saw, I see no point. Apparently the stock air filter on the 361 is quite good, wouldn't bother. My serious arborist friends pay no attention to chainsaw performance and mods and just run stock pro saws. They're more interested in trees than saws. Stihl and Husky have great engineers who have designed great saws that work well with no mods. For an arborist, nothing really needs to be done to them.

I guess the want for mods is not so much purely preformance focused for me but to me modding my saw is more the personalisation/customisation, I love screwing around on 2 stroke engines so just modding my own saw makes I feel more like MY saw instead of just A saw, I don’t really care about the performance that comes with it, I know the saw will change the way it runs, it’ll probably have at least a slight increase of preformance but I see that as a byproduct/a bonus but not as the main goal.
I wanna be able to see my saw as my saw, not just as a tool, I wanna know that I put thought and effort into getting it to be different in a way that I like.

I guess its fairly hard to articulate what my thoughts are on modding but the basics are: its just to have my saw be mine, to have a customised piece of equipment that I enjoy running

 

[Coralillo Lo Pro]

I guess its fairly hard to articulate what my thoughts are on modding but the basics are: its just to have my saw be mine, to have a customised piece of equipment that I enjoy running

Totally get that, and suspected that was your intent. Just wanted to make sure it was a matter of personal taste rather than seeing too many Youtube videos and forum posts that were hyping mods for performance. I'm still working on a big foam filter air intake for one of my ancient 87cc Stihls for milling just because the stock filters clog so easily. And I went to a lot of effort to fix a bent 3/4 wrap handle that came with one of them so I could have one saw with a 3/4 wrap, rather than just cutting it down so it would fit. Nothing wrong with modding for personal preference or to suit a certain purpose.

 

[donmakesallthefuelbegone]

Totally get that, and suspected that was your intent. Just wanted to make sure it was a matter of personal taste rather than seeing too many Youtube videos and forum posts that were hyping mods for performance. I'm still working on a big foam filter air intake for one of my ancient 87cc Stihls for milling just because the stock filters clog so easily. And I went to a lot of effort to fix a bent 3/4 wrap handle that came with one of them so I could have one saw with a 3/4 wrap, rather than just cutting it down so it would fit. Nothing wrong with modding for personal preference or to suit a certain purpose.

I’m glad you understand, “personal taste” indeed is a word choice that could have made it easier to articulate what my reasoning is.

 

[sean donato]

One thing about your desire for future mods - I wouldn't bother with a bark box. There are an infinity of opinions on them but to me 90 percent of the people who say "it really woke my saw up" are suffering placebo effect of associating something twice as loud with dramatically increased performance. Spend the time instead on becoming the best chain sharpener you can possibly be and get and maintain the best bars and chains you can. That will make WAY more real world difference to how fast you cut. I lent a tree service guy a 24 year old heavily used Husky 455 Rancher, no mods, an ordinary saw no one thinks much of, but with a razor sharp 18" bar and chain he said it cut better than any saw he'd ever used. I run everything stock, I have one dual port muffler Stihl made as an OEM design for one of my old 87cc saws and like it, but otherwise spend all my spare time sharpening, not performance tinkering.

Bark boxes make a noticeable difference in performance on some saws, but make them all too loud. Even a normal muffler mod will result in about the same performance gains and not give all that racket.

 

[donmakesallthefuelbegone]

Bark boxes make a noticeable difference in performance on some saws, but make them all too loud. Even a normal muffler mod will result in about the same performance gains and not give all that racket.

I don’t know why but all the noise does make the saw sound more powerful, I guess it’s more psychological that you associate a lot of noise with a lot of power (just like cars and motorcycles) I’d say as long as it sounds good it’s fine, if it is an annoying sound then I would not like it though.

 

[altatim]

I don’t know why but all the noise does make the saw sound more powerful, I guess it’s more psychological that you associate a lot of noise with a lot of power (just like cars and motorcycles) I’d say as long as it sounds good it’s fine, if it is an annoying sound then I would not like it though.

If you haven't run an MS400 or MS462, even stock they are hellishly loud. Stock they have an open muffler with only a spark arrestor so they don't feel like a clogged up saw at all. More noise is definitely not more better with these specific saws unless you are porting at which point a muffler mod is simple enough to do yourself

 

[Coralillo Lo Pro]

Bark boxes make a noticeable difference in performance on some saws, but make them all too loud. Even a normal muffler mod will result in about the same performance gains and not give all that racket.

My concern about bark boxes is whether or not they're properly designed with an output size roughly 80 percent of the exhaust port and whether they deliver any of the desirable back pressure of a regular muffler. A normal muffler mod seems better to use in that regard, and single vs dual port (or even triple) in those is still mostly a matter of preference, as even such porting gurus as Mastermind are happy with single port designs. This was the best explanation I've found of the basic mechanics of it in by a user in another forum thread - "One exhaust port 80 percent the size of the exhaust port on the cylinder has worked well for me. The idea is to get the exhaust can to simulate how an expansion pipe would work in the way a percentage of the exhaust is directed back into the exhaust port on the cylinder to pressurize the crankcase along with the downward stroke of the piston. Therefore scavenging more air fuel mixture from the intake charging the crankcase to increase air fuel thru the transfer ports into the combustion chamber increasing power as the rpms of the engine increase."

Seems like the first thing everyone says for a mod is "open up your exhaust" without a lot of folks understanding there's a reason for restriction and a science to designing exhaust flow, and so there's a cottage industry of selling to people chasing performance who buy any bark box or can with a pipe on it. I got sucked into wondering if I should get one myself and asked about those can-with-a-pipe barkbox variants and a lot of knowledgeable veterans on here dismissed them as ridiculous noisemakers marketed to know-nothings that they wouldn't dream of putting on one of their saws. Yes, most mufflers are overly restrictive - particularly cat mufflers and more modern ones governed by EPA restrictions - but opening them up willy nilly can be counterproductive. To the point of the OP not wanting to mess with carburetors, there's no point in messing with exhaust if you don't want to mess with intake too.

 

[Exophysical]

My concern about bark boxes is whether or not they're properly designed with an output size roughly 80 percent of the exhaust port and whether they deliver any of the desirable back pressure of a regular muffler. A normal muffler mod seems better to use in that regard, and single vs dual port (or even triple) in those is still mostly a matter of preference, as even such porting gurus as Mastermind are happy with single port designs. This was the best explanation I've found of the basic mechanics of it in by a user in another forum thread - "One (muffler) exhaust port 80 percent the size of the exhaust port on the cylinder has worked well for me. The idea is to get the exhaust can to simulate how an expansion pipe would work in the way a percentage of the exhaust is directed back into the exhaust port on the cylinder to pressurize the crankcase along with the downward stroke of the piston. Therefore scavenging more air fuel mixture from the intake charging the crankcase to increase air fuel thru the transfer ports into the combustion chamber increasing power as the rpms of the engine increase."

Seems like the first thing everyone says for a mod is "open up your exhaust" without a lot of folks understanding there's a reason for restriction and a science to designing exhaust flow, and so there's a cottage industry of selling to people chasing performance who buy any bark box or can with a pipe on it. I got sucked into wondering if I should get one myself and asked about those can-with-a-pipe barkbox variants and a lot of knowledgeable veterans on here dismissed them as ridiculous noisemakers marketed to know-nothings that they wouldn't dream of putting on one of their saws. Yes, most mufflers are overly restrictive - particularly cat mufflers and more modern ones governed by EPA restrictions - but opening them up willy nilly can be counterproductive. To the point of the OP not wanting to mess with carburetors, there's no point in messing with exhaust if you don't want to mess with intake too.

I agree with this, on my 345 I just opened up the stock port... a bit too much and gains were negligable though it did get plenty loud. Afterwards I used a bit of sheet metal mounted in the place of the spark arrester to partially block the port. With a bit of experimenting its deffinately picked up some snap and power over stock.

My takeaway is that getting actual power gains with an exhaust modification can be a bit complicated, its going to vary quite a bit from model to model, and its probably going to be a bit different with a stock saw VS a ported saw. I think carefully modifying the stock muffler to suit your particular situation is probably a better plan than using some random bark box of dubious origin.

 

[sean donato]

My concern about bark boxes is whether or not they're properly designed with an output size roughly 80 percent of the exhaust port and whether they deliver any of the desirable back pressure of a regular muffler. A normal muffler mod seems better to use in that regard, and single vs dual port (or even triple) in those is still mostly a matter of preference, as even such porting gurus as Mastermind are happy with single port designs. This was the best explanation I've found of the basic mechanics of it in by a user in another forum thread - "One (muffler) exhaust port 80 percent the size of the exhaust port on the cylinder has worked well for me. The idea is to get the exhaust can to simulate how an expansion pipe would work in the way a percentage of the exhaust is directed back into the exhaust port on the cylinder to pressurize the crankcase along with the downward stroke of the piston. Therefore scavenging more air fuel mixture from the intake charging the crankcase to increase air fuel thru the transfer ports into the combustion chamber increasing power as the rpms of the engine increase."

Seems like the first thing everyone says for a mod is "open up your exhaust" without a lot of folks understanding there's a reason for restriction and a science to designing exhaust flow, and so there's a cottage industry of selling to people chasing performance who buy any bark box or can with a pipe on it. I got sucked into wondering if I should get one myself and asked about those can-with-a-pipe barkbox variants and a lot of knowledgeable veterans on here dismissed them as ridiculous noisemakers marketed to know-nothings that they wouldn't dream of putting on one of their saws. Yes, most mufflers are overly restrictive - particularly cat mufflers and more modern ones governed by EPA restrictions - but opening them up willy nilly can be counterproductive. To the point of the OP not wanting to mess with carburetors, there's no point in messing with exhaust if you don't want to mess with intake too.

First, there's no making a box muffler work like an expansion pipe. By design it's impossible. Back pressure in a loop scavenger 2 stroke is, also, undesirable. Tuned pipes use pressure waves to "force" least air/fuel back into the cylinder, not the crankcase. Depending on cone design will dictate what rpm range a tuned pipe works best at. Hence the term "getting on the pipe." No way to do that with the factory exhaust. Doesn't matter what ratio of exhaust opening you use. 70-80% of exhaust port for muffler opening does seem to be the general consensus for optimal with can mufflers. Another consideration is exhaust exit placement, baffle design and placement etc.
Assuming any aftermarket "bark box"/ mufflers don't have some sort of r&d or purpose to port placement and hole size isn't the best thought process. Like I've said before, gains will differ from model to model, some making more difference and some not as much.

 

[stihl sawing]

What are you going to do with the saw? if you're just a firewood cutter a 261 or 400 is all you need. also depends on the type of wood and how big of trees do you plan to cut.

 

[donmakesallthefuelbegone]

My concern about bark boxes is whether or not they're properly designed with an output size roughly 80 percent of the exhaust port and whether they deliver any of the desirable back pressure of a regular muffler. A normal muffler mod seems better to use in that regard, and single vs dual port (or even triple) in those is still mostly a matter of preference, as even such porting gurus as Mastermind are happy with single port designs. This was the best explanation I've found of the basic mechanics of it in by a user in another forum thread - "One exhaust port 80 percent the size of the exhaust port on the cylinder has worked well for me. The idea is to get the exhaust can to simulate how an expansion pipe would work in the way a percentage of the exhaust is directed back into the exhaust port on the cylinder to pressurize the crankcase along with the downward stroke of the piston. Therefore scavenging more air fuel mixture from the intake charging the crankcase to increase air fuel thru the transfer ports into the combustion chamber increasing power as the rpms of the engine increase."

Seems like the first thing everyone says for a mod is "open up your exhaust" without a lot of folks understanding there's a reason for restriction and a science to designing exhaust flow, and so there's a cottage industry of selling to people chasing performance who buy any bark box or can with a pipe on it. I got sucked into wondering if I should get one myself and asked about those can-with-a-pipe barkbox variants and a lot of knowledgeable veterans on here dismissed them as ridiculous noisemakers marketed to know-nothings that they wouldn't dream of putting on one of their saws. Yes, most mufflers are overly restrictive - particularly cat mufflers and more modern ones governed by EPA restrictions - but opening them up willy nilly can be counterproductive. To the point of the OP not wanting to mess with carburetors, there's no point in messing with exhaust if you don't want to mess with intake too.

My plan is that I either learn how to work on carburettors or have a professional do it, I am just afraid to screw up my chainsaw if I do anything wrong

 

[donmakesallthefuelbegone]

What are you going to do with the saw? if you're just a firewood cutter a 261 or 400 is all you need. also depends on the type of wood and how big of trees do you plan to cut.

View attachment 1180149

I plan to basically do everything except for milling and climbing

 

[Crftrapper535]

I would say if you want a 462 get a 462 I personally have a 661 and I love it I use it for even the littlest of **** also keep in mind there is husky and there 562 to 592s look pretty cool still yet get what you think you can handle that's just my 2 cents

 

[aokpops]

In 1981 I bought a new 028 couple years later a used 041. Was always a break down every truck load. About 1987 I was watching this old guy with a small 42 Husqvarna just making load after load of firewood . I went town and bought a 50 special. That day I found a saw I could cut wood and not break down. About no person finds a one and done saw. The best advice I got just keep buying saws. Make them work for you never mind what is popular. A big question are parts cost and how easy they can be found?