catalytic or not

[logbutcher]

Just ignore him, he hasnt said anything of value yet, I doubt this will change. Monk, you must be looking at ancient stoves. The ones being discusses here meet all current EPA requirements, if they burned as you said they must not meet the EPA regs and are outside the bounds of this discussion, simple as that.

..and that could be true Wolfie. Complement and rep appreciated. Simple is as simple does.

The ignorance is astounding: have any of you "serious" wood burners Like from "SE PA" -close to being on the Mason-Dixon line, or "Northern" California ,kind of an oxymoron like "northern" Alabama, ever used a cat stove ? Thought so .

I mean, this thin-skinned panty wad temperament ( quote from Wolf) about your non-cats is cute, but based on what ? You feel ( sing "Feelings" here opcorn: ) somehow insulted ? Whowoodaknown. Hey, it's just an appliance, take it easy.

Catalysts are the same as in your truck guys: the hot gases come out of the engine or wood, are re-burnt by a chemical reaction with a noble metal such as platinum or paladium coated on the cells of the catalyst. The emissions from your truck ( you do drive a truck ? ) are then mostly CO2. Your friend AlGore can step in now. The emissions from the wood -when the catalyst is lit or glowing-are recirculated to extract more heat then up the flue as clean gases. Non cats clean the wood gases (smoke) by heating tubes; principle is similar but not as efficient as a cat. And the re-heated gases are not usually recirculated in non cat stoves. That's the engineering science.

Not too complex. No?:monkey:

 

[bassman]

I understand that the cat burns the smoke but how does this burning of the smoke result in usuing less wood???
My truck has a cat like all trucks on the road but if I remove the cat my truck will not use more gas it will just not pass an emisions test .

 

[Saucydog]

Cat stoves can run at lower temps and still burn clean(if the cat is lit-off)as opposed to non-cats which need to run a little hotter to maintain good secondary burn(clean).This means 25 lbs of oak in a cat stove could burn longer(slower) than 25lbs of oak in a non-cat.......the overall btu output will be the same, just over two different time spans.

 

[skytow]

"The ignorance is astounding: have any of you "serious" wood burners Like from "SE PA" -close to being on the Mason-Dixon line, or "Northern" California ,kind of an oxymoron like "northern" Alabama, ever used a cat stove ? Thought so ."

Nope never used and don't need to. As to "serious" I went from 5 275 gallon tanks of oil to about 1/4 burning 24/7 all winter which is shorter than yours!! Woo Hoo!!. Ah, works for me....

My Oslo is 72 percent efficient. Do you need better than that? Maybe you do? Can you save another 2-5 percent with your cat? Perhaps. I'll just cut a few more logs and not worry with maintenance / replacement of the cat.

Whatever makes you happy, buy it and stay warm!!

JD in SE PA (yup, close to the Mason-Dixon line!!)

 

[logbutcher]

Closed Thread

Under the power invested in me, I hereby close this thread due to extreme emotion ( please refer to "panty wad"), and inability to understand basic physics and chemistry.
The thread is hereby locked...further posts will be dealt with herewith (whatever the H that means).
Dismissed.

 

[skytow]

Dang! I knew that chemistry degree wouldn't pay off!



JD Under the palms in PA

LOL....

 

[RaisedByWolves]

Someone has been hitting the sauce, and it isint Saucydog.......




Amymore input before our new mod bans us all?



.

 

[bassman]

Cat stoves can run at lower temps and still burn clean(if the cat is lit-off)as opposed to non-cats which need to run a little hotter to maintain good secondary burn(clean).This means 25 lbs of oak in a cat stove could burn longer(slower) than 25lbs of oak in a non-cat.......the overall btu output will be the same, just over two different time spans.

by slowing down the burn do you not then lower btu output??

 

[user 19670]

by slowing down the burn do you not then lower btu output??

Yes, you do but with a cat stove you don't loose the secondary burn. With a non=cat stove you have to run it wide open to keep the secondary burn AND you have to constantly baby-sit it to keep the secondary burn.

I have a non-cat stove from Regency and you have to stay on it constantly to keep the secondary burn. Works well otherwise, just should have been a larger stove for our usage. The cat disturbs me as far as energy to manufacture/ship, materials of construction and methods of safe disposal for the spent cat so I chose the non-cat stove because of these concerns.

 

[user 19670]

I can cut my air input back to 1/3 once the stove is up and running well and still keep secondary burn going easily with my Jotul F600 Firelight. In fact leaving the air input wide open reduces efficiency because of increased chimney temperatures.

I do agree with you though about the cats being able to run at lower temperatures once the cat lights off, I just don't think there is as extreme a difference as you are saying.

That may be so on your stove. I only spoke from my experience with our stove. Different stoves, climates, weather patterns, firewood, etc. will give differing results and these results cannot possibly be known beforehand although the operation of the cat versus non-cat can probably re estimated beforehand.
With our stove you add wood and open it wide to get everything working including the secondary burn. Adjust the draft at this time and it looses the secondary burn before my cheeks leave the hearth. Leave it wide open until the wood is burning cleanly and you no longer need the secondary burn because the smoke is clean when it leaves the chimney, just the same as it was with our previous non-EPA stove. What I have just described shows that I cannot leave the stove unattended unless it just gets left wide open (which is what usually happens).
It get so cold around here in the winter you don't want to close the draft anyway or your furnace will cycle because the temp drops. The woodstove cannot keep up when it is 30 below or colder which is why I should have purchased the largest stove we could get.

I cannot comment on a cat stove from experience but it sounds to me like you light off the cat and then you can adjust the draft and go about your business without loosing the secondary burn.

 

[RaisedByWolves]

Yeah, Im guessing its stove/design dependent.



I was burning pine and oak scraps last night from a local trimshop and I had to close both dampers completely to keep from overfiring. With regular firewood I find I get the best Economy by running the stove at 1/4-1/3 open on the main damper.



Im planning out a telemetry system this year to give me real time info on the stove from several points in the house, living room, bedrooms and stoveside for starters. This way I can get a better idea of what is optimal with the wood I have on hand and also give me High and low temp alerts.


.

 

[bassman]

I guess that those pellet stoves are the best way to go .
they use way less wood than any stove and always burn clean.

 

[WidowMaker]

I guess that those pellet stoves are the best way to go .
they use way less wood than any stove and always burn clean.

===

Have you checked the cost of a ton of pellets lately, You might want to rethink that conclusion....

 

[grampakev]

pellets

I guess that those pellet stoves are the best way to go .
they use way less wood than any stove and always burn clean.

I have 2 pellet stoves, 1 sitting in the corner of the breeze way (and its the one the starts and regulats itself) not even being used. the other is in a little cottage we have by the lake, we only use it for the chilly fall nights(summer cottage) they are the worst source of heat there is, imo. when ever i go the the stove shop the owner begs me not to go near the people thinking about buying a p stove because i tell them like it is. some people i know love them, but they leave them on hi and go threw 2 1/2 bags a day, thats 12.50 a day around here, to me that seams like a lot of money for no heat. just my .02

 

[skytow]

RBW,

"was burning pine and oak scraps last night from a local trimshop and I had to close both dampers completely to keep from overfiring. With regular firewood I find I get the best Economy by running the stove at 1/4-1/3 open on the main damper."

You may have already noted but what stove are you running? I have the Oslo 500 and run about the same way maybe a little less. With a good hot fire I have secondaries with the damper closed all the way for hours.


"Im planning out a telemetry system this year to give me real time info on the stove from several points in the house, living room, bedrooms and stoveside for starters. This way I can get a better idea of what is optimal with the wood I have on hand and also give me High and low temp alerts."

I'm really interested in your project! Where are you sourcing the parts to make this? Care to share your ideas?

JD in SE PA