Chainsaw 2 Cycle Oil Poll

[OM617YOTA]

Maybe. I've seen some manufacturers claim a quart per thousand miles oil consumption is fine. Or "fine" anyway. At that rate I'd spin on a new filter every 5000 miles and not change it, too. It's already being changed.

 

[Hermio]

I don't buy that for a second, additives are used as the engine runs, it's one of the reasons they are there, acidity rises in the oil the more fuel you run through the engine, as well as carbon content and a host of other substances. It's usually not the lubricity of the oil in question, but the amount of helpful additives left in them to continue their job effectively.

I saw the test report. The base content was still within required product standards. So were the dispersants and anti-wear additives. Whether you believe it or not is not that important to me, but know that in essence you are calling me a liar.

 

[jellyroll]

Maybe. I've seen some manufacturers claim a quart per thousand miles oil consumption is fine. Or "fine" anyway. At that rate I'd spin on a new filter every 5000 miles and not change it, too. It's already being changed.

I change the filter in my car every other change because its pita to change it. My truck is the same way
They both get super tech oil the oil has the api donut and meets all the specs i use the cheapest filters i can get.

 

[Hermio]

Maybe. I've seen some manufacturers claim a quart per thousand miles oil consumption is fine. Or "fine" anyway. At that rate I'd spin on a new filter every 5000 miles and not change it, too. It's already being changed.

In my current diesel truck, which has 130,000 miles on it, I do not use a quart between changes, which are every 10,000 miles. What many folks do not realize is that the oil consumption typical in the past was not due to leakage as much as due to boiling off the short chain molecules. A good synthetic oil has nearly uniform chain length, so there are almost no short chain molecules to evaporate.

 

[jellyroll]

My truck uses a pint every 5,000 miles but it doesn't matter if i am using syn or conventional. It doesn't smoke or leak but it is high miles.

 

[Hermio]

The 4 ball test wasn't ment to test motor oils and doesn't approximate any of the operating conditions of a four cycle motor.

Amsoil Saber is absolutely not a JASO FD oil.

The 4 ball test need not exactly correspond to engine operating conditions to have value. What it does show is how strong the oil's film strength and lubricity stand up. Todd Osgood's sliding bearing scar test also does that. They are both good ways of measuring lubricity. As for Amsoil Saber not being a JASO FD oil, you are completely wrong about that.

 

[Lionsfan]

The 4 ball test need not exactly correspond to engine operating conditions to have value. What it does show is how strong the oil's film strength and lubricity stand up. Todd Osgood's sliding bearing scar test also does that. They are both good ways of measuring lubricity. As for Amsoil Saber not being a JASO FD oil, you are completely wrong about that.

Does not say JASO FD certified on the open quart I have.

 

[Hermio]

Does not say JASO FD certified on the open quart I have.

It says so in their product brochures. I have also seen other blogs not written by Amsoil confirming that it is an FD oil. Since Stihl Ultra is not, I don't use it.

 

[Hermio]

My truck uses a pint every 5,000 miles but it doesn't matter if i am using syn or conventional. It doesn't smoke or leak but it is high miles.

That really isn't too bad. But in your case, if the consumption rate is independent of oil type, it is probably getting past the rings. BTW, my first several cars used about a quart per thousand miles even when they were low mileage. I am frankly astonished that many new vehicles use less than a quart in 10,000 miles. But that has been my experience with the last several vehicles I bought.

 

[OM617YOTA]

In my current diesel truck, which has 130,000 miles on it, I do not use a quart between changes, which are every 10,000 miles. What many folks do not realize is that the oil consumption typical in the past was not due to leakage as much as due to boiling off the short chain molecules. A good synthetic oil has nearly uniform chain length, so there are almost no short chain molecules to evaporate.

I don't mean to move the goalposts on you, but I'm less concerned about whether Amsoil can pass those tests, and more concerned about whether they're actually any better than other oils that cost a fraction as much and are 100x more available. Can those other oils also pass those tests? Several companies are coming out with 20k mile OCI oils, even though I'd never run them.

Amsoil's 100:1 claims are also borderline fraud in my eyes, and hugely damage the veracity of their claims on any other technical subject. 100:1 is bologna, and makes me think their long OCI claims and JASO FD claims are bologna as well.

If JASO had tested their stuff and rated it, great, but JASO hasn't. List in my signature line.

 

[Hermio]

I don't mean to move the goalposts on you, but I'm less concerned about whether Amsoil can pass those tests, and more concerned about whether they're actually any better than other oils that cost a fraction as much and are 100x more available. Can those other oils also pass those tests? Several companies are coming out with 20k mile OCI oils, even though I'd never run them.

Amsoil's 100:1 claims are also borderline fraud in my eyes, and hugely damage the veracity of their claims on any other technical subject. 100:1 is bologna, and makes me think their long OCI claims and JASO FD claims are bologna as well.

If JASO had tested their stuff rated it, great, but JASO hasn't. List in my signature line.

Well, I cannot certify if 100:1 is OK or not. There is an earlier poster on this thread who claims he has been using it at 100:1 on dozens of 2-cycle equipment including chain saws, weed whackers, hedge trimmers, etc., for many years without problems. I am reluctant to go that far. But the main things that would allow such a ratio are stability and low volatility under high temperatures. If there is enough oil present to coat all wearing parts, any more oil than that just goes out the exhaust anyway. Remember, 16:1 was once the norm. Now we have most people accepting 50:1. For me, I will use 50:1 as an insurance policy. If I am wasting some oil, so be it. Maybe after a few more years, I will try 80:1 if more and more people get good results. But the cost of the oil does not mean a lot to me when compared to the cost of the equipment I am using it in.

 

[bruiser1]

I know I'm going to get torched for this but, here it goes. Walmart Super Tech 2-cycle Full Synthetic. Been using it for 15 years no problems. Did the Stihl thing for a number of years.

 

[Hermio]

I know I'm going to get tourched for this but, here it goes. Walmart Super Tech 2-cycle Full Synthetic. Been using it for 15 years no problems. Did the Stihl thing for a number of years.

No torching from me. Any full synthetic is likely better than the non-synthetic oils.

 

[North by Northwest]

I have run the cheapest oil I could find that met mfg specs, changed at least as often as the mfg says to change it, for decades, and take my vehicles to 250k+ miles as well. Same deal, the rest of the vehicle falls apart, the engine is fine.

I generally like PF, but even if Amsoil does the best on some test somewhere, plain ole Chevron 5w-30 does perfectly fine in my car and truck, and Rotella did fine in my diesel, for a fraction of the price. I pay less for an entire oil change than you pay for two quarts of Amsoil. Even at Amsoil's extended drain intervals(which I think are bologna without additional aftermarket filtration), I'd rather change my oil 3x more often with the cheap stuff to reach the same cost per mile. Rather be running clean cheap oil than dirty expensive oil.

Rotella T , which I used for 20 yrs in my Diesel applications was a very fine product . Amsoil Diesel oil does the same & is cheaper as a preferred customer . $13.76 usd. Compared to $14.00 for Rotella . Chevron same , fine product just a little more cost . The overall cost difference is minimal , the extended mileage of a quality synthetic over conventional mineral oils is what jogged my conscience . Why dump out perfectly good oil every 5000 miles . I have all my used oils tested , always has been within spec . Actually a quality synthetic filter is more important . The 2T 100:1 ratio marketing is pushing the envelope . I have utilized Saber @ 70:1 in properly tuned saws & sled engines , in racing environments no issues . However I always recommend no less than 50:1 with any quality oil . I like a little residual oil in the bottom end . Personally I run 44:1 in my Commercial & Ported saws . I pretty well now run Red Armor in all my saws . Dominator was also a fine product for performance saw usage & competitively priced as a preferred customer . Anyhow as for the testing criteria , utube testimonial testing is questionable at best . Real life experience has taught me better !

 

[bwalker]

I don't buy that for a second, additives are used as the engine runs, it's one of the reasons they are there, acidity rises in the oil the more fuel you run through the engine, as well as carbon content and a host of other substances. It's usually not the lubricity of the oil in question, but the amount of helpful additives left in them to continue their job effectively.

I don't buy it either. In fact it's complete BS and anyone who has viewed a UOA and compared it to a VOA knows this.

 

[bwalker]

Rotella T , which I used for 20 yrs in my Diesel applications was a very fine product . Amsoil Diesel oil does the same & is cheaper as a preferred customer . $13.76 usd. Compared to $14.00 for Rotella . Chevron same , fine product just a little more cost . The overall cost difference is minimal , the extended mileage of a quality synthetic over conventional mineral oils is what jogged my conscience . Why dump out perfectly good oil every 5000 miles . I have all my used oils tested , always has been within spec . Actually a quality synthetic filter is more important . The 2T 100:1 ratio marketing is pushing the envelope . I have utilized Saber @ 70:1 in properly tuned saws & sled engines , in racing environments no issues . However I always recommend no less than 50:1 with any quality oil . I like a little residual oil in the bottom end . Personally I run 44:1 in my Commercial & Ported saws . I pretty well now run Red Armor in all my saws . Dominator was also a fine product for performance saw usage & competitively priced as a preferred customer . Anyhow as for the testing criteria , utube testimonial testing is questionable at best . Real life experience has taught me better !

I've never seen a synthetic diesel oil of any kind that sells for the same price as a traditional oil.
Petro Canada also makes a very good syn diesel engine oil.

 

[bwalker]

Well, I cannot certify if 100:1 is OK or not. There is an earlier poster on this thread who claims he has been using it at 100:1 on dozens of 2-cycle equipment including chain saws, weed whackers, hedge trimmers, etc., for many years without problems. I am reluctant to go that far. But the main things that would allow such a ratio are stability and low volatility under high temperatures. If there is enough oil present to coat all wearing parts, any more oil than that just goes out the exhaust anyway. Remember, 16:1 was once the norm. Now we have most people accepting 50:1. For me, I will use 50:1 as an insurance policy. If I am wasting some oil, so be it. Maybe after a few more years, I will try 80:1 if more and more people get good results. But the cost of the oil does not mean a lot to me when compared to the cost of the equipment I am using it in.

Stability and volatility have no relevance to two cycle oils...

 

[bwalker]

It says so in their product brochures. I have also seen other blogs not written by Amsoil confirming that it is an FD oil. Since Stihl Ultra is not, I don't use it.

Amsoil does not make a FD certified oil, period.. in addition a 100:1 oil will not pass FD.

 

[bwalker]

The 4 ball test need not exactly correspond to engine operating conditions to have value. What it does show is how strong the oil's film strength and lubricity stand up. Todd Osgood's sliding bearing scar test also does that. They are both good ways of measuring lubricity. As for Amsoil Saber not being a JASO FD oil, you are completely wrong about that.

It doesn't correspond at all and no reputable company uses it for testing motor oils.
And I am not wrong on Amsoil not being FD certified... a small amount of research will prove I am correct.

 

[bwalker]

In my current diesel truck, which has 130,000 miles on it, I do not use a quart between changes, which are every 10,000 miles. What many folks do not realize is that the oil consumption typical in the past was not due to leakage as much as due to boiling off the short chain molecules. A good synthetic oil has nearly uniform chain length, so there are almost no short chain molecules to evaporate.

Funny, I have over 200K on my truck and it consumes zero oil. All with 10k OCI using Mobil EP.