Chainsaw Fuel and Storage Opinions 2023 (sticky?)

[Sidecarflip]

I use 87 E0 because there is no 90 or 93 E0. Ethanol fuel at the pumps is 15% and i don't have problems i use standard oil mixed at 40:1

If it's 15%, keep it away from air cooled engines like your lawnmower.

 

[muddy42]

Interesting discussion, so here's my limited experience.
I live in the UK where ethanol free fuel is freely available, so I use it. Stores for a year in a can with no problem. Left in a saw for a year it's horrible.

If I can't get ethanol free, then I add water and remove the ethanol, see youtube multiple vids. This is easy to do but takes time and by the time you've removed the 5-10% ethanol, then your fuel is more expensive than the premium ethanol free. In addition, it reduces the octane reading but it seems to work ok. My ethanol free is 99 octane but this doesn't seem to matter.

I avoid canned fuels as not only are they ridiculously expensive but you see some sensible people have real issues with them. No personal experience though.

If I'm storing a saw, then I pour out the fuel and add 30 mls of 1:10 oil:fuel mix. I turn off the kill switch and pull it over 10 times to fill the carb and cylinder with oil.

Just my experience but would welcome other's comments

I also live in the UK. When you refer to ethanol-free, are you referring to Esso Synergy Supreme 99? Sorry to be the bearer of bad news but from September, this will no longer be guaranteed as ethanol free, but "up to 5% ethanol". See below on the Esso website FAQs:

https://www.esso.co.uk/en-gb/faqsHow much ethanol is in Esso's E5 fuel?
We currently supply an ethanol-free Synergy Supreme * 99 unleaded in some parts of the UK.
From September 2023 our Synergy Supreme * 99 will transition to contain up to a maximum of 5% ethanol at all Esso pumps irrespective of which part of the country they are located. The labelling at our pumps will remain as E5 for Synergy Supreme * 99 unleaded.

 

[guym3]

Yes I just saw that and as you say bad bad news. Will be interesting to test the "premium" fuels from the big garages and see how much ethanol they actually have in them. Trouble then is that that may not remain consistent.

 

[muddy42]

Yes I just saw that and as you say bad bad news. Will be interesting to test the "premium" fuels from the big garages and see how much ethanol they actually have in them. Trouble then is that that may not remain consistent.

Agreed. also I would be surprised if Esso changed to 5% ethanol overnight, its more likely to be gradual. I'll probably have enough ethanol free for this summer's grass cutting, but next summer I'll probably start removing it myself. It'll still work out as £1.30 per litre compared to £4.80 for Aspen. I've watched a few youtube videos. My chainsaws always get treated to Apsen because I have to many and some get used infrequently. The garss cutting season is short and I use a lot of fuel.

The whole adding ethanol seems even more pointless if consumers start removing it. I wonder if cottage industries will spring up to remove ethanol for small engine people. In bulk, they might find a use for the ethanol and water byproduct.

 

[jellyroll]

Ethanol only showed up after 2010 here.

 

[Sidecarflip]

One thing I always want everyone to understand again and that is, corn alcohol is always mixed with pure gasoline at the fueling rack and it's done on per tank truck basis, so if it says 10% ethanol on the pump, in reality it can be any percentage depending on who at the fuel rack is controlling the blending. I know people really don't believe that but it's true and I know personally because I pulled a tanker (gas and diesel) for a couple years so I witnessed it first hand and obvious to me (painfully) that the regular unleaded ethanol gas I bought at the local filling station had way more than the mandated (here in Michigan) percentage in it. One of the reasons why I went to canned fuel actually.

Motor fuel tankers went through a radical change about 20 years ago as well. They went from top load (via a lid )(manhole) on the top to bottom load and unload and they all have vapor recovery in them which you have to hook up to the vacuum setup at the loading rack. Where the vapors' go, I have no idea but they get sucked out of the tank anyway.

Least I didn't waste it. We have 2 flex fuel vehicles so it went in them... and again, flex fuel vehicles don't have any rubber fuel lines in the. all metal and maybe stainless (not sure), but for sure, no rubber. Never ran either on E85. I've heard the fuel mileage drops way off so I refrain from using it and it is available here.

 

[jellyroll]

One thing I always want everyone to understand again and that is, corn alcohol is always mixed with pure gasoline at the fueling rack and it's done on per tank truck basis, so if it says 10% ethanol on the pump, in reality it can be any percentage depending on who at the fuel rack is controlling the blending. I know people really don't believe that but it's true and I know personally because I pulled a tanker (gas and diesel) for a couple years so I witnessed it first hand and obvious to me (painfully) that the regular unleaded ethanol gas I bought at the local filling station had way more than the mandated (here in Michigan) percentage in it. One of the reasons why I went to canned fuel actually.

Motor fuel tankers went through a radical change about 20 years ago as well. They went from top load (via a lid )(manhole) on the top to bottom load and unload and they all have vapor recovery in them which you have to hook up to the vacuum setup at the loading rack. Where the vapors' go, I have no idea but they get sucked out of the tank anyway.

Least I didn't waste it. We have 2 flex fuel vehicles so it went in them... and again, flex fuel vehicles don't have any rubber fuel lines in the. all metal and maybe stainless (not sure), but for sure, no rubber. Never ran either on E85. I've heard the fuel mileage drops way off so I refrain from using it and it is available here.

I run ethanol free 87 in everything. My car and older truck doesn't like E15 it triggers the CEL.

 

[Breckinridge Elkins]

Another member brought up the fact that ethanol was introduced to replace MTBE, which was introduced to replace lead as an anti-knock additive. I would assume that anyone who drives a classic vehicle and seeks out E0 fuel is probably adding a bottled anti-knock treatment at every fill up.
Are there unforseen consequences to using E0 fuel in vehicles built in the post lead era?

 

[jellyroll]

Another member brought up the fact that ethanol was introduced to replace MTBE, which was introduced to replace lead as an anti-knock additive. I would assume that anyone who drives a classic vehicle and seeks out E0 fuel is probably adding a bottled anti-knock treatment at every fill up.
Are there unforseen consequences to using E0 fuel in vehicles built in the post lead era?

my car and truck runs fine on marathon / arco ethanol free if i use shell 87 e15 they don't run good. engine bucking and pinging.

 

[OM617YOTA]

Another member brought up the fact that ethanol was introduced to replace MTBE, which was introduced to replace lead as an anti-knock additive. I would assume that anyone who drives a classic vehicle and seeks out E0 fuel is probably adding a bottled anti-knock treatment at every fill up.
Are there unforseen consequences to using E0 fuel in vehicles built in the post lead era?

If you're talking E0 that someone buys at the pump, it'll be blended to hit it's octane number, without ethanol. 87 is 87, 93 is 93.

Folks who are being home alchemists and removing water themselves, they might need to make adjustments. Ethanol is about 109 octane on it's own, and 10% of the fuel being 109 octane gives a big boost to the remaining 90% dino squeezings. If I'm understanding the way it works right(never assured), and doing the math right(it's early and I'm only two sips into my caffeine), the remaining dino squeezings on their own would be 84.55 octane.

If you're going to de-ethanol on your own, better start with premium.

 

[Breckinridge Elkins]

I gotcha. I try to keep my fuel fresh by dumping it into the truck and refilling the cans with fresh E0 every few weeks. I have a 42 gallon tank so I figure it's getting diluted anyway.

 

[OM617YOTA]

I've gone a couple years on E0 and a double dose of Stabil, in airtight metal cans. No issues.

Rotating every few weeks, you'd be fine with E10. My truck sits longer than that with a full tank, and doesn't have issues.

 

[guym3]

good to see someone doing the same maths over octane reduction as me. i start with premium so probably ends up higher than needs to be once ethanol removed