Chimney questions

[JRM]

Telling someone to bow down to a company that works for you is bad advice.

Boy are you on a roll today. Your reading comprehension is usually better than this. An insurance policy is a contract. If you break said contract for any reason, the contract agreed to by you and your provider when the policy is enacted, they have the right to rescind coverage. Again.... This varies by insurance and state. Similar to flood insurance that most people dont know they dont have until they need it. The devil is in the details and you'd better know what your insurance allows for.
That's not bowing down to anyone Sean. That's just plain common sense, which you generally seem to have.

and the insurance companies must follow the same rules for coverage the same as any other heat source.

Wrong. Very wrong. Indoor wood stoves are a higher risk from the insurance co perspective compared to other heat sources for many reasons. Open flames, possible CO, lack of maintenance that can lead to fires. IMPROPER INSTALLATION. Generally you are looking at an increase in premium to mitigate the increased risk the ins co is assuming. You won't see them increasing your premium for installing a heat pump right? Different requirements.

You can talk to them all you want, at the end of the day, they cannot deny coverage, all or in part because you heat your house with wood.

More really bad information. There is no law stating what ins must cover when it comes to wood stoves aside from whatever they have agreed to cover in writing. And as a homeowner you better know what your agreement is with your ins provider. Sticking your head in the sand and hoping you never have a claim or expecting that they will cover it because "they work for you" will not get you far in life.

 

[sean donato]

Boy are you on a roll today. Your reading comprehension is usually better than this. An insurance policy is a contract. If you break said contract for any reason, the contract agreed to by you and your provider when the policy is enacted, they have the right to rescind coverage. Again.... This varies by insurance and state. Similar to flood insurance that most people dont know they dont have until they need it. The devil is in the details and you'd better know what your insurance allows for.
That's not bowing down to anyone Sean. That's just plain common sense, which you generally seem to have.




Wrong. Very wrong. Indoor wood stoves are a higher risk from the insurance co perspective compared to other heat sources for many reasons. Open flames, possible CO, lack of maintenance that can lead to fires. IMPROPER INSTALLATION. Generally you are looking at an increase in premium to mitigate the increased risk the ins co is assuming. You won't see them increasing your premium for installing a heat pump right? Different requirements.



More really bad information. There is no law stating what ins must cover when it comes to wood stoves aside from whatever they have agreed to cover in writing. And as a homeowner you better know what your agreement is with your ins provider. Sticking your head in the sand and hoping you never have a claim or expecting that they will cover it because "they work for you" will not get you far in life.

I know exactly what my insurance policy says, what it covers, doesn't cover. Just like you should, or anyone else should. Most don't. As with any "contract" both sides reach an acceptable agreement, for an acceptable amount of money.
Only a fool bows to them. They absolutely work for you, you don't work for them. Insurance is one of the largest legal scams, I'm not a fan of being scammed, and that's exactly what the job of the insurance company is, take your money and cover you for as little as they can if something happens. But we have these things called laws, which stipulate quite a lot about building codes etc. Under fair trade and business laws you cannot be denied coverage if you meet or exceed all federal, state, and local building requirements. It's basically that simple.
Unlike most, I've had this battle. Best advise isn't to kiss your insurance companies rear end. Get informed of your building codes, and governing laws by someone that knows them. Its not stuffing your head in the sand or whatever pithy term you want to call it.
oh, I guess I should mention, my house is heated with a UL listed, epa approved solid fuel furnace. Not a "wood stove." That was the first error the insurance company made when we initially bought the house. Get educated, by people that know the laws, not the people that want to take your money and screw you over.

 

[woodfarmer]

They are a bunch of educated idiots, and most have zero clue what they are talking about. All the issues I had with them during the replacement of my old masonry chimney, and them telling me I had to use class A triple wall insulated chimney or replace with traditional masonry chimney was total bs, as I found out later when I had a certified chimney inspector come out to check over everything after the installation was complete.
You'd be much better served to just get a professional out, that does it for a living vs going off the insurance companies idiot that has zero clue.

Well I’m one of those insurance company idiots! Been an inspector for over 22 years and I’ve seen it all. Your comment is like me saying all homeowners are idiots!
There are good and bad in every industry. From the number of poor installs I’ve seen over the years, hire a professional. In Canada they are required to be WETT certified.

PS that stainless chimney in the prior post is a chimney, not a stovepipe ffs!

 

[sean donato]

Well I’m one of those insurance company idiots! Been an inspector for over 22 years and I’ve seen it all. Your comment is like me saying all homeowners are idiots!
There are good and bad in every industry. From the number of poor installs I’ve seen over the years, hire a professional. In Canada they are required to be WETT certified.

PS that stainless chimney in the prior post is a chimney, not a stovepipe ffs!

very true, I shouldn't make blanket statements like that. I apologize to you. This is a very specific topic that has cost me a lot of time and money and caused a lot of frustration over the years. I have never had good experiences with insurance companies, or their agents or "inspectors." Especially when it comes to houses. I wish there was some law requiring formal training, or at minimum them being required to use a local licened inspector. That's not the case. I ended up, having to get my own inspectors, consult with an attorney, the county, and township officials and fight to get insurance on my place. At the end of it all, I ended up with insurance coverage, a rider for the furnace(with a provision for by-yearly inspections and copies of the report sent to the insurance company) , and an umbrella policy to cover the out buildings, since the normal policy doesn't actually cover much of anything outside of the house. It was all very eye opening, and would have been a lot less frustrating if I had been told to get my own inspectors upfront and do my homework before relying in the insurance companies people, whom turned out to be totally unreliable, and lack knowledge of the very thing they were supposed to be insuring.
Yeah, I know that's why I tried to clarify that with the pertinent sections of the nfpa. Definatly a chimney as per their definitions.

 

[JRM]

Only a fool bows to them.

I don't know why your so stuck on this. Nobody ever said anything of the sorts despite you repeating this mantra.
Question. what would you have done if your ins required a licensed installer? Would you have "bowed down?" Show them whose boss and Do it yourself anyway? Or more smartly move on to another company? (Sound familiar?) I said that many posts ago. You have this strong arm mentality yet you still did exactly what your ins required of you including an inspection which by your own account still met code. So? That is all I said from the beginning. Make sure you are on the same page. No need to take the conversation places it doesn't need to be.

Here is another scenario for you. Almost 2 years ago our son went into the Service. Wife called our auto ins the week after he left to have him removed. Answer? As long as his mailing address is same as ours he is required to be on our policy. My wife said he will only be home maybe 2-3 weeks a year tops, we will call when he comes home to put him back on. Ins co reiterated it is our policy every licensed driver with same mailing is covered. The agent then proceeded to leave a note on our account about the whole situation. This went up the ladder, we got a copy of their policy for insuring family in the AS, and that was that. We've never ditched an ins co so quick. But here is the kicker, the next place we called had the same policy. Thankfully as we learned from shopping around most companies offer a reduced rate or a non operator status for military members. But not all. And whatever their policy is, and despite what you claim you will not strong arm anyone into changing their requirements to please you.

That's it, I'm out. Apologies to the OP for taking this thread in such a ridiculous direction.