Dangers of Chainsaw's Chain Creeping, Spinning or Rotation at Idle

[SafetyNewbie]

Please share with the forum your experiences regarding the safety isues, dangers, etc. associated with the continuous spinning, creeping and\or rotation of the saw chain around the bar when the chainsaw engine is at idle (i.e. throttle trigger released). Also, please identify situations when the chainsaw operator is exposed to potential injuries\fatality from the continuous saw chain rotation such as after cut through from limbing, climbing through tree canopy, ....?

 

[matty f]

Tune the saw properley so you dont get chain creep ,usually this is a slight adjustment of the low jet and tighten the chain or if there is somthing wrong with your saw, you take it to the shop to get it fixed,saws should not have creeping chains!.
Always apply the chain brake when moving position and it should never happen!

 

[SRT-Tech]

double post

 

[SRT-Tech]

Please share with the forum your experiences regarding the safety isues, dangers, etc. associated with the continuous spinning, creeping and\or rotation of the saw chain around the bar when the chainsaw engine is at idle (i.e. throttle trigger released). Also, please identify situations when the chainsaw operator is exposed to potential injuries\fatality from the continuous saw chain rotation such as after cut through from limbing, climbing through tree canopy, ....?

anybody else thinks this sounds like the lawyer (NYstupgrinder) that was pressing for information on the Vermeer 252??? :deadhorse:

 

[matty f]

Dunno mate??? but thinking any one who cant sort out a creeping chain should not be using a saw SO MAYBE IT IS !:spam:

 

[911crash]

to many questions and looking to blame someone.

 

[SRT-Tech]

here is all his posts: http://www.arboristsite.com/search.php?searchid=925591

they guy is totally TROLLING for info...every post is carefully worded to seek answers......his writing style suggests experience as a survey (info) person....

 

[SafetyNewbie]

SRT and Matty,

I am not a lawyer, but an administrator with new responsibility for safety for those operating power tools in the field so what is wrong with asking questions from what I see is happening out in the field to improve safety operations? I agree that people need to be careful on what is posted, but by mining the gold and sharing lessons learned (powerful teaching tools) from others around the world we can all improve safety which is the goal for forums like arboristsite.com. Within my scope of safety is training, tool maintenance and repair, as well as tool replacement. My grandfather and father taught me just because people do things a certain way does not make it right as improvments can always be made - and safety operations should be reviewed periodically for areas of improvement to maintain productivity while maintaining safety. We all know its human nature to try and take short cuts (i.e. let saw running hanging off lanyard (sure hope brake is parked 100% of the time), ....) when tired or tasks are rushed, but with power tools like chainsaws these bad habits need to be discussed as to their dangers. Unforetunately and statistically, accidents do and will happen, but its administrators jobs, like mine, to protect its workforce as each operator is a valuable employee and asset to its employer - so training, training and more training with new live example of lessons learned around the world is valuable to keeping training fresh and interesting.

A creeping chain, decelerating rotating chain after cut through (10-15,000 RPM at full throttle so RPM at deceleration should be less, but still dangerous) and the like appear to me to be an accident just waiting to happen. So I am looking for lessons learned to pass along to others.

For example, from an administrative perspective does the operator handle creeping chain by tuning engine in the tree canopy (is this what you are suggesting) or wait till operator gets on the ground (which seems more practical and safer) - what are pros and cons from those with years of experience? :rockn:

 

[Gologit]

Most people who instruct others have some real world experience in what they're teaching. I applaud your wanting to learn more about saws but it's painfully obvious that you're lacking in any kind of hands on knowledge of your subject. Wouldn't it be better to have a professional (arborist, logger, saw shop operator, etc) teach this to your employees and you can learn along with them. Better this than just parroting some information gleaned from sources you have no way of validating the truth of. In the meantime, welcome to the site. Hang around, ask questions, use the search feature and read a lot of the posts concerning saws. In time you'll be able to seperate the good advice from the bad and do your employees a real fine job.

 

[DonnyO]

SRT and Matty,
For example, from an administrative perspective does the operator handle creeping chain by tuning engine in the tree canopy (is this what you are suggesting) or wait till operator gets on the ground (which seems more practical and safer) - what are pros and cons from those with years of experience? :rockn:

No, the operator handles creeping chain BEFORE entering the tree!:newbie:

 

[SafetyNewbie]

Most people who instruct others have some real world experience in what they're teaching. I applaud your wanting to learn more about saws .... In the meantime, welcome to the site. Hang around, ask questions, use the search feature and read a lot of the posts concerning saws. In time you'll be able to seperate the good advice from the bad and do your employees a real fine job.

Boboak, thanks for your positive feedback and encouragement - have read many posts, which indicates I have a ton to learn, but am eager to do so. There are others within the organization that will handle the detail training, for which they are very good at what they do as they have many years of hands on experience, as I am at a much higher level yet have overall responsibility for this area. Unfortunately in the business world you typically do not take a supervisor from the field and place them in the front office as the skill sets are different because in the front office job description is much broader than field activities such as asset and resource allocation; market, business and investment strategy, .... in addition to safety. So your advice to "hang around, ask questions .... seperate the good advice from the bad ...." is exactly what I am trying to do here as I hope to be able to bring to my staff (who will do the actual training) additional information that has been passed onto me by professional, highly experienced, and season field veterans from arboristsite.com.

So forum please fire away with valuable advise and tips (I call this mining for gold) for me and other readers regarding dangers of the chain still spinning after release of throttle trigger after completion of limbing, cut through, .....

 

[SafetyNewbie]

No, the operator handles creeping chain BEFORE entering the tree!:newbie:

Can creeping chain happen while operator is in the tree? If yes, what are some safety tips? :rockn:

Also, what are the dangers of the chain still rotating after releasing throttle trigger? Any and all please share your advice and stories (as Clint Eastwood's movie about good, bad and the ugly)

 

[Soul Assassin]

I have had chainsaws for no apparent reason, when pulling to start, idle too fast, spinning the chain. I had no finger on the trigger, nor was the trigger depressed. I was using proper starting technique, with the saw between my legs. Only once I had it happen while drop starting, I never drop started a chainsaw again. scary.

What do I know, I've got three red dots,lol.

BTW-if your chain is creeping, adjust the idle and chain tension.

 

[rmihalek]

Also, what are the dangers of the chain still rotating after releasing throttle trigger? Any and all please share your advice and stories (as Clint Eastwood's movie about good, bad and the ugly)

The danger of a chainsaw chain, whether it's rotating or not, is that it contains many sharpened metal edges called cutters. These cutters will cut you if you inadvertantly come in contact with them. If the chain is spinning, more of the cutters will contact you than if it was stationary, so the injury could be worse.

 

[SRT-Tech]

SRT and Matty,

I am not a lawyer, but an administrator with new responsibility for safety for those operating power tools in the field so what is wrong with asking questions from what I see is happening out in the field to improve safety operations? I agree that people need to be careful on what is posted, but by mining the gold and sharing lessons learned (powerful teaching tools) from others around the world we can all improve safety which is the goal for forums like arboristsite.com.

take a chainsaw safety course.

 

[DonnyO]

Can creeping chain happen while operator is in the tree? If yes, what are some safety tips? :rockn:

Send it down to qualified ground personnel for repair.

What do I know, I've got three red dots,lol.

Good to have you back.

BTW-if your chain is creeping, adjust the idle and chain tension.

Good call.

 

[Bermie]

Checking for chain creep is one of the operational safety checks every competent operator should carry out BEFORE using the saw for daily work.

Operational Safety Checks:
Start Saw
Warm up
Check for oil feed
Check function of chainbrake at full revs
Check for chain creep at idle
Turn off saw (checks operation of off switch)

If any of the above are not to spec, then field repairs/adjustments can be carried out as appropriate. If the problem is more than can be taken care of on site, put the saw away and use another one.

In reference to chain creep specifically, as others have said, it can one or a combination of the following: the idle is too high, the chain is slack, the carb adjustment is off or in rare cases the clutch springs are slack. Regardless, whenever the saw winds down to idle, the chainbrake should be applied when the operator removes on hand from the saw, needs to walk, or rests the saw on the ground while running.

One part of the operational safety of a chainsaw such as chain creep cannot be taken in isolation from the rest of the job of work. There are many things we do in combination, before, during and after work with our saws, our mode of work and our maintenance that ensures we go home with limbs intact and blood inside our bodies. You need the big picture to get a real understanding of this.

A small word of advice, please lose the 'much higher level' 'management' speak. I quote your post:

"There are others within the organization that will handle the detail training, for which they are very good at what they do as they have many years of hands on experience, as I am at a much higher level yet have overall responsibility for this area. Unfortunately in the business world you typically do not take a supervisor from the field and place them in the front office as the skill sets are different because in the front office job description is much broader than field activities such as asset and resource allocation; market, business and investment strategy, .... in addition to safety"

Suffice to know you are asking for information. Highly qualified professionals such as ourselves will help you more readily with our expertise as long as you don't talk down, which is what some of your talk is verging on. Many folks here run their own businesses, are teachers, researchers etc. who are well versed in - asset and resource allocation; market, business and investment strategy, .... in addition to safety.

Sorry if this last bit hits you sideways, it is a bit of a pet peeve of mine, good luck with your research.

 

[TimberJack_7]

So if you are not a lawyer, why are you so focused only on the spinning chain on a chainsaw after cuts, or at various points in the idle cycle? I don't buy your story about being some safety admin. You say you are in charge of tool maintenance, replacement, etc, yet you are laser beam focused on how fast the chain is spinning after a cut has been made. As someone said earlier, it is painfully obvious that you know nothing about chainsaws, and probably not much about power equipment in general. That smacks of a lawyer in my opinion. Who do you work for? What state are you in? Safety should be common sense. If I have a chain that is still spinning, I use this thing on my chainsaw called a chainbrake. If it is spinning because the carburetor may have gone slightly out of adjustment, I take it to a saw shop where they know what the hell they are doing and let them adjust the carb accordingly. Once again, common sense, but if the lawyers such as yourself.....I mean if the lawyers have their way, they will help the morons that should be dead according to Darwinism skip out on accepting responsibility for their stupidity. Meanwhile, the lawyers greedily pocket half of the settlement, and once again a perfectly functioning piece of machinery will be dumbed down just a little bit more.
Your style of writing even comes across as plastic and a little sanitary, kind of like the lawyer that was likely trying to build his case against whatever stumpgrinder manufacturer. How well you articulate.

Things that make me go Hmmmmmm.

 

[SRT-Tech]

Timberjack, that was beautiful

 

[ben14826]

I have had chainsaws for no apparent reason, when pulling to start, idle too fast, spinning the chain. I had no finger on the trigger, nor was the trigger depressed. I was using proper starting technique, with the saw between my legs. Only once I had it happen while drop starting, I never drop started a chainsaw again. scary.

What do I know, I've got three red dots,lol.

BTW-if your chain is creeping, adjust the idle and chain tension.

I would reccomend always starting the saw with the chainbrake engaged to prevent the chain from spinning on startup no matter how you start a saw.

What do the three red dots signify?

A chain that freely spins is too loose, and anyone who knows anything about a chainsaw should know this.

+1 on this guy sounding like the sleezeball lawyer nystupgrinder who is out to get vermeer. I wouldn't share any stories here about accidents relating to chainsaws as they may be used to line his pockets someday. I doubt if it's the same person, but sure seems similar to me.