Charlie Coyote
ArboristSite Member
Hmmm. I was under the impression that they were, as Tinman mentioned that in his 590 video. Do I stand corrected? I can take that.
Echo Chainsaw Horsepower Data Needed
- Thread starter jpmoran
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timberwolf590
Izzy
They are in fact not the same jug and piston. Separate part numbers. I believe the port work is different on the two. 620 piston has 2 rings. For more info, I'd look into DynoJoe's vids on YT.
I was always under the impression that the 620 was factory ported, somewhat like the mcbrick 650
Hmmmmm, I thought my 590 was 2 ring..maybe not..I haven't looked in there in a good long while. It's about a 2013 model or so.
590 piston.
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Going from memory here as I haven't been in the IPL's for the CS-590, 600P and 620P they have different P/C's. Early 600P's also have a different P/C than the 590's. At some point in the production run they started using the same P/C for both.
The 620P/PW's have always used a different P/C, crank, coil, carb and muffler from what I can remember.
I have a very early 600P and it uses a different coil than the 590 (limited coil) and the later 620's. It's unlimited from what I can tell but not the same coil as the 620's.
A few years ago I outfitted my 600P with a 620P carburetor. Can't really tell if it helped much but it wasn't much more than a replacement 600P carb so why not put the larger carb on it.
Since I own all three, the 590, 600 and 620 I can tell anyone reading this that the 600 and 620 have more power, but it really isn't noticeable unless you put a 24 or 27" bar on them and start bucking up some pretty decent size logs. In the smaller tops left over from logging operations that I typically cut here they all do just fine and in most cases you have to look down to see which one you are running as they are very close in cutting performance......FWIW......
The 620P/PW's have always used a different P/C, crank, coil, carb and muffler from what I can remember.
I have a very early 600P and it uses a different coil than the 590 (limited coil) and the later 620's. It's unlimited from what I can tell but not the same coil as the 620's.
A few years ago I outfitted my 600P with a 620P carburetor. Can't really tell if it helped much but it wasn't much more than a replacement 600P carb so why not put the larger carb on it.
Since I own all three, the 590, 600 and 620 I can tell anyone reading this that the 600 and 620 have more power, but it really isn't noticeable unless you put a 24 or 27" bar on them and start bucking up some pretty decent size logs. In the smaller tops left over from logging operations that I typically cut here they all do just fine and in most cases you have to look down to see which one you are running as they are very close in cutting performance......FWIW......
JasonL37179
ArboristSite Lurker
Just noticed this thread while searching for other topics, and thought I’d throw in my 2 cents for those new to this stuff. I used to work for Echo as a MFG rep (also for Scag the same time), when they rolled out the CS-271T, 355T, 590, 620.
Forget the EPA site; it’s more trouble than it’s worth. Use the UK site to get hp ratings that correlate to U.S. market saws. Multiply 1.34 * kW to get HP
https://www.echo-tools.co.uk/
Every once in a while Echo would give us internal literature of their “ringer” models line the 620 and 355. It was always the same as UK/Euro models. If a UK has the same size CC engine as a U.S, model, it’s the same as offered here.
Also, Echo hired an engineer from Redmax in 2012, which is when they started getting more serious about HP, and quietly dropped Shindaiwa’s 4strokes. I helped one of my Echo Signature dealers who’s also Stihl Elite, start selling 590’s over the old Farm Boss 291 by 3:1. I gave him my demo saw to lend out to core customers, and it was a hit from day 1. Echo’s corporate liason even noticed.
We as reps use to ask Echo to start publishing HP claims to be more transparent. I hope they do, because they make quality equipment and have their niche. Being more transparent would only help them grow.
Jason
Forget the EPA site; it’s more trouble than it’s worth. Use the UK site to get hp ratings that correlate to U.S. market saws. Multiply 1.34 * kW to get HP
https://www.echo-tools.co.uk/
Every once in a while Echo would give us internal literature of their “ringer” models line the 620 and 355. It was always the same as UK/Euro models. If a UK has the same size CC engine as a U.S, model, it’s the same as offered here.
Also, Echo hired an engineer from Redmax in 2012, which is when they started getting more serious about HP, and quietly dropped Shindaiwa’s 4strokes. I helped one of my Echo Signature dealers who’s also Stihl Elite, start selling 590’s over the old Farm Boss 291 by 3:1. I gave him my demo saw to lend out to core customers, and it was a hit from day 1. Echo’s corporate liason even noticed.
We as reps use to ask Echo to start publishing HP claims to be more transparent. I hope they do, because they make quality equipment and have their niche. Being more transparent would only help them grow.
Jason
I've always had excellent luck with all my echo stuff since the early 90's dealer support has been good. Have you heard anything about the red armor mix staining the internals of the saw so they can use it as a warranty marker? Couple echo reps at a special invite event I attended I overheard them talking about that.
huskydave
Addicted to ArboristSite
You have to be careful, some saws were under rated and some were overrated from all the brands but mostly overrated.
I think I read the cs 590 was rated at 5hp. Seems to be in the ballpark but I'm no expert. It pulled a full comp chain on a 34" bar a few times and did really well.
cuttinstihl
ArboristSite Operative
The 590 in most sites I've seen was rated at or around 4hp. I honestly think the stated hp is underrated, another reason why I don't trust most paper specs. IME stock for stock it'll easily outcut a 261 (4hp) in all but the smallest wood where the 261 can rev high, outcut a 391 (4.4hp) pretty easily in all conditions, wipe the floor with a 290 (3.8hp) in all conditions, and outcut a 362 (4.7hp) with long bars or in big wood, the 362 is a touch faster in small wood. And a 400C (5.4hp) is a decent chunk faster than a muffler modded 590
JasonL37179
ArboristSite Lurker
Yes, Red Armor does leave a residue for dealers to determine if it was actually used to determine whether or not to honor warranty claims.
JasonL37179
ArboristSite Lurker
The 590 has always been 4.0hp. And for reference the 620 is 4.5, being slightly ported, and more ignition timing.
They can't force you to use red armor for the warranty period, or not honor warranty claims because you used another oil if the oil meets the specs which they require. Being a sales rep you should be familiar with the magnuson-moss act. Even so echo offers other good quality oils that are also fd rated and do not leave the distinct red residue the red armor does.
Thanks for the hp #'s
I was figuring it was more for the straight gassing of saws. I've never had issues with warranty work but I never smoked a saw yet.
JasonL37179
ArboristSite Lurker
True, but that doesn’t mean they can’t get away with it if they wanted. This is also common in the automotive world now. Like anything else, those laws only work if enough people are willing to sue MFG’s.
I agree with you though, just relaying the general mindset when I was working in the industry. A good dealer will still go to bat for you and do the right thing. Echo can only go off dealer descriptions and pictures sent online. It’s not worth Echo’s time to police every warranty claim, unless a high volume dealer submits an unusually high number of claims. It’s all a $’s game at the end of the day.
Jason
huskydave
Addicted to ArboristSite
some of them were over achievers for sure. New saw vs new saw will tell the tale with a 5 cut average on the same tree to rule out hitting knots and such. CS590 is a keeper.
cuttinstihl
ArboristSite Operative
Yeah I never got the chance to be that precise with my cutting tests, wish I did though. This was all just stuff that I noticed when cutting with friends or neighbors, fortunately they all have me sharpen their chains for them so their saws weren’t at a disadvantage next to mine.
Maybe I just got a good 590 lol, I don’t know how it’s consistently the same speed or faster than saws rated higher than it. There’s lots of factor that affect these things but the old Echo always feels stronger than it should be
huskydave
Addicted to ArboristSite
I really like a lot of the echo lines of equipment, I have a small 25cc trimmer I bought 20 years ago and it won't die. You pay a little more and get something decent and it lasts and is reliable and worth fixing if something does happen. I use their black fuel line, very good stuff. I would rather have a cs590 over say a rancher saw from Husky or Stihl to be honest. When I see them for sale cheap, I buy them and flip them a lot. Great bang for the buck.
