Falling pics 11/25/09

[Metals406]

Who told you that? 10,000? Umm, no.....

Beats me Ted, all that fancy-pants East side hardwood stuff is beyond my pay grade. :dunno:

All I know is the dude wasn't a straight faller, and logged private stuff that was all high-end. Stems that were worth a whole lot of cash.

I can imagine 2-3 bushel hardwoods of certain species are a cash cow, and others aren't.

 

[bitzer]

Nate- several hundred dollars a tree maybe, but not much more than that. Most timber around me averages 200bf per tree. Even at a buck a foot delivered and say a 600 bf cherry... Christ even a 2000bf red oak. The first log or two might, maybe make a number 1 and then less grade after that. Sheer size will loose some value. There is that sweet spot. Red oak number 1 delivered is like $700/m at my mill. The thing is I think there is a lot of smoke blown around about these hugely over priced trees. I know that some guys will top a walnut before dumping them. I just don't see if that is cost effective. Then again that's not the business I'm in. There is a select group of loggers out there dealing in numbers that I think are nuts.

 

[jrcat]

Here in western NY red oak is $1 per bf. Hard maple is $750/ thousand cherry is $1200/thousand. Veneer is doing ok. I guess some of the really nice cherry could fetch $7/foot. I am having a veneer sale on wednesday.

 

[tramp bushler]

I don't know why you consider yourself a misfit at 5'11 155. I'm basically the same size and have never wanted to be any bigger. People built like us can go at a run all day.

If I got down to 155 I would prolly need to be hospitalized. . Back in 94 I got down to the mid 170 s. I was a pretty serious going concern. I could still 1 hand a 394,36" .. but right now I would sure like to loose 65 or 70 lbs. . Keep the skookums but loose the fat. At 180 lbs I used to hand over hand up a 33, 1" chocker with wet muddy White Ox red band on. Now doing 1 chin up is more than I want to do. Nope, ya don't want t gain any weight.

 

[roberte]

If I got down to 155 I would prolly need to be hospitalized. . Back in 94 I got down to the mid 170 s. I was a pretty serious going concern. I could still 1 hand a 394,36" .. but right now I would sure like to loose 65 or 70 lbs. . Keep the skookums but loose the fat. At 180 lbs I used to hand over hand up a 33, 1" chocker with wet muddy White Ox red band on. Now doing 1 chin up is more than I want to do. Nope, ya don't want t gain any weight.

It was the 80s last time I saw 155. 5'9" , 226. I went to 270 before I stopped eating with a pitch fork. No you don't want to getting older and stay that big.

 

[HuskStihl]

It all depends. I have what you could call a bad habit of sawing under the lean. On slopes it puts my saw in front of me and not at my feet, I like sawing out infront of me a lot more than on the deck.
The way il do it is put in a face, making sure my far side,(pull side) is opened up proper, saw out the Kerf, then go around back. The first cut on the back is on the pull side, establishing my holding corner, that s, ets the stem in motion, then I just follow it through minding my gunning sight so as not to cut off my holding wood. Saw it up enough so as not to pull wood and gtfo of there!

Between you, Bitz, and the TB, I actually understand what y'all are talking about. Assuming a standard face falls at "zero," about how many degrees off zero can you move a tree away from its lean with a kerf Dutchman? Say minimal lean with no top issues.
If this makes no sense, I can try again. Thanks boys

 

[1270d]

Nate- several hundred dollars a tree maybe, but not much more than that. Most timber around me averages 200bf per tree. Even at a buck a foot delivered and say a 600 bf cherry... Christ even a 2000bf red oak. The first log or two might, maybe make a number 1 and then less grade after that. Sheer size will loose some value. There is that sweet spot. Red oak number 1 delivered is like $700/m at my mill. The thing is I think there is a lot of smoke blown around about these hugely over priced trees. I know that some guys will top a walnut before dumping them. I just don't see if that is cost effective. Then again that's not the business I'm in. There is a select group of loggers out there dealing in numbers that I think are nuts.

My father used to cut only birds eye in the winters. Some of the highest grade was close to fifty bucks a foot. Rare very rare. The highest value log sold in my home area is supposed to have been 13000dollars. So allowing for rumor growth, maybe it was 7500. Still an awful valuable log. I have never heard of anyone topping one of these trees or anything fancy like that. Knock em down, skid em out, and talk to the buyers before bucking.

 

[Metals406]

Nate- several hundred dollars a tree maybe, but not much more than that. Most timber around me averages 200bf per tree. Even at a buck a foot delivered and say a 600 bf cherry... Christ even a 2000bf red oak. The first log or two might, maybe make a number 1 and then less grade after that. Sheer size will loose some value. There is that sweet spot. Red oak number 1 delivered is like $700/m at my mill. The thing is I think there is a lot of smoke blown around about these hugely over priced trees. I know that some guys will top a walnut before dumping them. I just don't see if that is cost effective. Then again that's not the business I'm in. There is a select group of loggers out there dealing in numbers that I think are nuts.

It's my understanding these were possibly OG, on private land that were fancy hardwoods. Not regular stuff ya know?

And I think the 10k number was not in reference to one man getting paid that. . . We're talking from the woods to the end products.

This guy was the broker, harvester, and overseer for the milling. So, lets just say these were 5k stems -- still don't want to bust up any of those either.

But, I do know first hand, of a kid on here that posted a picture a couple years ago of a Cherry he blew up when it fell on the crotch and split from stem to stern -- and he made the comment that it was a very costly mistake.

 

[jrcat]

The tree service guy I worked for here in wny would go out and top red oaks for some loggers. Supposedly to keep the top from splitting the log when it contacted the ground. I have never seen it done for loggers personally..... just in tree service work.

 

[jrcat]

It's my understanding these were possibly OG, on private land that were fancy hardwoods. Not regular stuff ya know?

And I think the 10k number was not in reference to one man getting paid that. . . We're talking from the woods to the end products.

This guy was the broker, harvester, and overseer for the milling. So, lets just say these were 5k stems -- still don't want to bust up any of those either.

But, I do know first hand, of a kid on here that posted a picture a couple years ago of a Cherry he blew up when it fell on the crotch and split from stem to stern -- and he made the comment that it was a very costly mistake.

I had that happen with a red oak. When that top collapsed it split from the top down. I realize that I could have averted that by falling it in a better direction but the top went in 3 directions and I just did not have enough experience to know how to do it properly.

 

[twochains]

I had that happen with a red oak. When that top collapsed it split from the top down. I realize that I could have averted that by falling it in a better direction but the top went in 3 directions and I just did not have enough experience to know how to do it properly.

If I plan ahead of time and I see that one has a large top that could bust, I will leave a tree near by to roll off of. For me this helps slow the drop and when on fairly steep ground heavy tops have a tendency to have their own agenda. Rarely will you bust a top if it has rolled down another tree. JMO

 

[Keen]

It's my understanding these were possibly OG, on private land that were fancy hardwoods. Not regular stuff ya know?

And I think the 10k number was not in reference to one man getting paid that. . . We're talking from the woods to the end products.

This guy was the broker, harvester, and overseer for the milling. So, lets just say these were 5k stems -- still don't want to bust up any of those either.

But, I do know first hand, of a kid on here that posted a picture a couple years ago of a Cherry he blew up when it fell on the crotch and split from stem to stern -- and he made the comment that it was a very costly mistake.

Heres a pic of a white ash I cut it had 1500 ft before it crotched out at 30ft and I got a dollar a foot on the landing for it. Ash does not have much value right now with the borer getting it all, but the value came from its size. Its the biggest ash I've cut, let alone seen. It will be milled into slabs for table tops. So by the time its milled and the slabs are sold I figure it will be close to the 8k mark. The guy gets crazy money for his slabs. Its all about hitting the right nitch.

 

[jrcat]

If I plan ahead of time and I see that one has a large top that could bust, I will leave a tree near by to roll off of. For me this helps slow the drop and when on fairly steep ground heavy tops have a tendency to have their own agenda. Rarely will you bust a top if it has rolled down another tree. JMO

I had never given that any thought. I will remember that for the next one. Thanks

 

[jrcat]

Heres a pic of a white ash I cut it had 1500 ft before it crotched out at 30ft and I got a dollar a foot on the landing for it. Ash does not have much value right now with the borer getting it all, but the value came from its size. Its the biggest ash I've cut, let alone seen. It will be milled into slabs for table tops. So by the time its milled and the slabs are sold I figure it will be close to the 8k mark. The guy gets crazy money for his slabs. Its all about hitting the right nitch.

Im only getting 650/thousand on the ash but even if it has big hearts. I have about a half a load of ash scattered threw on my job right now. I dont think I am even going to cut it. I hear that veneer ash is only bringing $1.20 a foot right now and has to be snow white with absolutely no defects.

So with that being said you got almost veneer price for that which is awesome. With that big heart in it ..it would have brought little at the mill and no bat mill would have taken it either at least in my area. About the only other place around here that would have taken it is True Temper in Union City pa .... shovel handles. Im glad to see it get used for something other than handles and blocking.

 

[Keen]

Im only getting 650/thousand on the ash but even if it has big hearts. I have about a half a load of ash scattered threw on my job right now. I dont think I am even going to cut it. I hear that veneer ash is only bringing $1.20 a foot right now and has to be snow white with absolutely no defects.

So with that being said you got almost veneer price for that which is awesome. With that big heart in it ..it would have brought little at the mill and no bat mill would have taken it either at least in my area. About the only other place around here that would have taken it is True Temper in Union City pa .... shovel handles. Im glad to see it get used for something other than handles and blocking.

That's really good pricing compared to here on the ash. The bore hit so hard the market it flooded here, everybody is cutting it. Is the bore affecting you guys? We are lucky to get 300 a thous on grade. Veneer is 450 a thous on the landing with a big heart. Quarter heart can bring $1 a foot. In the last year I have sent 100s of cords of grade ash to the pallet mill:mad2:

 

[tramp bushler]

If I plan ahead of time and I see that one has a large top that could bust, I will leave a tree near by to roll off of. For me this helps slow the drop and when on fairly steep ground heavy tops have a tendency to have their own agenda. Rarely will you bust a top if it has rolled down another tree. JMO

In Southeast. We use hemlocks for that if we have a nice big spruce we.don't want to bust. We call them, disposable hemlocks.

 

[jrcat]

The ash borer has hit here but not to that extent yet.

 

[bitzer]

My father used to cut only birds eye in the winters. Some of the highest grade was close to fifty bucks a foot. Rare very rare. The highest value log sold in my home area is supposed to have been 13000dollars. So allowing for rumor growth, maybe it was 7500. Still an awful valuable log. I have never heard of anyone topping one of these trees or anything fancy like that. Knock em down, skid em out, and talk to the buyers before bucking.

Yep I forgot about birds eye and curly and all that other specialty stuff. You really have to have the right buyer for that and that market has got to be so small, but I'm sure its out there. To me its just nuts, but more power to em who get those high dollars.

 

[bitzer]

If I plan ahead of time and I see that one has a large top that could bust, I will leave a tree near by to roll off of. For me this helps slow the drop and when on fairly steep ground heavy tops have a tendency to have their own agenda. Rarely will you bust a top if it has rolled down another tree. JMO

The only problem with that can be you could hang it up making more of a pain for you or it rolls off bad and crotches out anyway. If you've got one set up to dump it into that usually helps. Sometimes there is not much you can do with the bigguns. Just dump em and hope for the best!

 

[Metals406]

Heres a pic of a white ash I cut it had 1500 ft before it crotched out at 30ft and I got a dollar a foot on the landing for it. Ash does not have much value right now with the borer getting it all, but the value came from its size. Its the biggest ash I've cut, let alone seen. It will be milled into slabs for table tops. So by the time its milled and the slabs are sold I figure it will be close to the 8k mark. The guy gets crazy money for his slabs. Its all about hitting the right nitch.

Yes! This is what I was saying. . . Total value of end product. If you're the broker -- you don't just think about a stem at the landing, you're thinking about it all the way through.

If the dude was in some fancy 2 bushel Walnut, I can imagine some end product prices around 20k.

But again, this is in HW country, and in a market I'm unfamiliar with. I was just going off of what my brother was telling me when he was back east visiting his wife's family. They went out to one of his jobs, and they walked around as he explained how he harvested, etc.