Filing after sharpening with the chain grinder

[user 122190]

Today I filed after using the grinder. Wicked sharp -- damn near factory new sharp. Seems that the file enhances the cutting edges after the grind sharpening.

I've been able to hand sharpen with a file, if the chain was not to bad. Of course, the bench grinder is the best way to restore a chain after rocking the chain. For me, it looks like some hand filing is going to be SOP for now on.

Anybody else experience this, or take this extra step to get the best cutting edge possible?

 

[HarleyT]

No.

 

[user 122190]

Give it a try. The grinders alone creates a straight face at the cutters top. Whereas the file creates a curved wave front with a sharper leading edge. Most of the work is done by the grinders and only a few easy strokes with the file creates the fine finish leading edge.

 

[Beetlejuice]

No.

Geeze Harley, don't beat around the bush.
I use my dremel grinder and then enhance the edge. Has worked great for me.

 

[HarleyT]

Give it a try. The grinders alone creates a straight face at the cutters top. Whereas the file creates a curved wave front with a sharper leading edge. Most of the work is done by the grinders and only a few easy strokes with the file creates the fine finish leading edge.

That depends on the file size and stroke, which is generally inconsistant.

Also if the one sharpening is using a cheapo grinder with a cheapo wheel, that is not dressed, then touching up with a file might improve things.

A lot of variables, but generally, a chain sharpened by a grinder, correctly, is hard to improve upon.
Usually because those that hand file, aren't very good at it.

But then, most folks that use a grinder, aren't very good at it either.

 

[user 122190]

Without a doubt most all peoples sharpening skills can be improved. I consider my sharpening skills to be above average, yet can be improved. I've been thinking about a 7/32 round ceramic or stone file to created a bleeding edge. It would be overkill, but for a race saw it would be a cool competitor.

That depends on the file size and stroke, which is generally inconsistant.

Also if the one sharpening is using a cheapo grinder with a cheapo wheel, that is not dressed, then touching up with a file might improve things.

A lot of variables, but generally, a chain sharpened by a grinder, correctly, is hard to improve upon.
Usually because those that hand file, aren't very good at it.

But then, most folks that use a grinder, aren't very good at it either.

 

[Beetlejuice]

That depends on the file size and stroke, which is generally inconsistant.

Also if the one sharpening is using a cheapo grinder with a cheapo wheel, that is not dressed, then touching up with a file might improve things.

A lot of variables, but generally, a chain sharpened by a grinder, correctly, is hard to improve upon.
Usually because those that hand file, aren't very good at it.

But then, most folks that use a grinder, aren't very good at it either.

Harley, I do agree that cheap, undressed wheels makes the job a chore. Speed also plays a role. And of course "tuning" the machine is vital. Me being an urban worm burner, I have the luxury of a quick fix and back to scaring the bugs.. I'll take more time with sharpening if out in virgin woods. Funny thing, the beer seems to taste better away from civilization. (SP)

 

[2broke2ride]

I am a big believer in hand filing. Mostly because i dont own a grinder and ive seen some terrible stuff come out of the shops around here.
That being said, i feel i am pretty decent at hand filing but i still cant get quite the cutting speed of a factory new chain.

 

[user 122190]

I bought a grinders after long frustrations with hand filing. Only recently have I tried hand filing again. I'm finally becoming a believer in hand filing. In the field cutting, it is a must have skill. I usually carry an extra chain, but even that doesn't replace the ability to put a hand filed edge on a chain.

I am a big believer in hand filing. Mostly because i dont own a grinder and ive seen some terrible stuff come out of the shops around here.
That being said, i feel i am pretty decent at hand filing but i still cant get quite the cutting speed of a factory new chain.

 

[Huskybill]

Unless the chain was cutting rocks or hit a pipe in a tree to the point I need to install chain repair kits then grind it all even I don’t use the grinder.

I hand file the ‘GULLET’ first then use the file n guide to sharpen the upper cutting edge of the tooth razor sharp.

No flame intended it’s how I do it.

 

[Philbert]

The grinders alone creates a straight face at the cutters top. Whereas the file creates a curved wave front with a sharper leading edge.

Not if you grind 'right'.

A round dressed grinding wheel will produce a similar, concave profile as a round file.

Files and wheels also come in different levels of coarseness. A fine tooth file will create a finer edge on a tooth ground with a coarse wheel. Not as big of a deal if using a finer grit wheel.




Philbert

 

[Philbert]

Only recently have I tried hand filing again. I'm finally becoming a believer in hand filing. In the field cutting, it is a must have skill. I usually carry an extra chain, but even that doesn't replace the ability to put a hand filed edge on a chain.

If you 'file as you grind; and grind as you file', it is not a big deal to go back and forth. If you grind your cutter edges flat (illustration above), it will take several strokes of the file just to establish the profile, before putting on a good edge.

Philbert

 

[user 122190]

That makes good sense. Not sure I've been able to achieve that. Even with glasses, the details are not seen. My post file work can be felt. I'll keep my eyes open for files with different coarse ratings.

Not if you grind 'right'.

A round dressed grinding wheel will produce a similar, concave profile as a round file.

Files and wheels also come in different levels of coarseness. A fine tooth file will create a finer edge on a tooth ground with a coarse wheel. Not as big of a deal if using a finer grit wheel.

View attachment 663469
View attachment 663468

Philbert

 

[Philbert]

I'll keep my eyes open for files with different coarse ratings.

Always tradeoffs: faster stock removal, smoother finish, life of the file, etc.

e.g. https://www.arboristsite.com/commun...e-brand-and-type-single-or-double-cut.175346/



http://www.nicholsontool.com/MagentoShare/media/documents/nicholson-guide-to-filing-2014.pdf

Philbert

 

[rngrchad]

I have NEVER needed to use a mechanical grinder on any chain I've ever owned. I've rocked chains and have always been able to file them out by hand...yeh I end up removing nearly 1/2 to 2/3'rds of the cutter but the same would have happened if I were to use a grinder. I do not see any need for mechanical chain grinding for 3/8 chain..... there is no way it's making the cutter any sharper than my hand filing is, and when I buy brand new chain, the first thing I do is hand file it. I mean, my hand, and a round file, nothing else. If people like grinding chain cool. Glad it works. I don't see it any better, and more often I see it worse than my personal handfiling jobs. I struggle with raker depth.... it took me years to realize taller rakers are better in most all situations for a work saw. Obviously my opinion but its based on experience. I don't time cut cookies so I have no experience what you guys are doing there.... an overly hungry chain that makes too big of chips with too low of rakers is a boggy pain in the A$$ when working in the woods.

 

[Huskybill]

I had just put a new .404” chisel chain on my 2100 with a 24” bar. I was doing a favor. I hit a galvanized pipe inside the large tree trunk. It took out 6 teeth. I had the Oregon repair kits. I replaced the bad teeth then ground all the teeth the same length. I saved the chain. That’s the only time I used the Oregon grinder.

 

[Philbert]

I have NEVER needed to use a mechanical grinder on any chain I've ever owned.

Funny: I have NEVER needed to hand file any chain I've owned . . . .

Seriously, there are lots of ways to sharpen; everyone has to find something that works for them. Seen a lot of chains totally screwed up with hand files and grinders. If people don't know what they are trying to achieve they will get poor results. If I am touching up up one chain in the field, a sharp file (and guide for me, thank you) can work. If I have a bunch of loops to process, a quality grinder is way more efficient for me.

Philbert

 

[Huskybill]

We still have to clean up the gullet. The gullet is chip clearance.

 

[rngrchad]

I

I had just put a new .404” chisel chain on my 2100 with a 24” bar. I was doing a favor. I hit a galvanized pipe inside the large tree trunk. It took out 6 teeth. I had the Oregon repair kits. I replaced the bad teeth then ground all the teeth the same length. I saved the chain. That’s the only time I used the Oregon grinder.

if I'm going above and beyond helping friends with a job requiring my chainsaws I tell them up front, "I love you man and I'm here to help with your trees as a buddy and don't want a dime but if my chain gets wiped out by a gutter nail or foreign object inside your trees I'll need you to cover the cost of a new chain if the damage is beyond d filing. Only once have I ever actually made someone I was helping pay for a chain and he was happy to.

 

[Huskitoter]

Do you guys find the round profile needs to be touched up sooner than the flat edge left by a grinder, vice versa, or no difference?