Firewood Processor Questions

[fireemt799]

fireemt, not to sound like a broken record but I don't think processors are made for those kind of trees. Too much taper for a multi wedge to work well, unless it's a really easy quick on the fly height change wedge. I think the Australian vertical splitters are the best you will get. Chainsaw cutter that cuts the logs into rounds and then the vertical splitter to split them the size you want with a conveyor to load the splits. Aussie chopper, timber devil etc. I made my own 4 way 36" splitter for my owb and it can be a pain using different sized logs let alone the taper you have to deal with.

The problem with that is it is an added cost and no improvement over what I am currently doing. The wood beaver has a hydraulic adjustable wedge if I need it. My customers don't like small splits. I split most stuff in half and big stuff gets quartered. The only time I split smaller is for bundles. I might not get huge production out of a processor using juniper but getting half of what a machine is rated at is a huge increase for me. Loading a truck off the processor with the conveyor and having it split saves me well over 100 days a year. Juniper is never going to be easy to work with or as productive or profitable as other tree species but it's all I have to work with. I am looking at the processor as a stepping stone to increase production and profits that I can reinvest into more equipment. Once I can reach a high enough production I can work out a stewardship contract and use equipment but I need to be able to do a couple thousand acres a year and to make money off of the clearing I need to produce multiple products. Juniper treatments now are chaining, mastication or cut and leave and go for less than $100 an acre. If I can use all or at least most of that juniper going to waste it would be a good business.

 

[NSMaple1]

How will you get the logs, from where the tree is felled, to a processor?

 

[NSMaple1]

OK, I looked back a bit - maybe an ATV & a log arch? Lots of work using that to get 500 cords/year to a processor, considering the trees your working with.

Then there's the getting the logs, fed up & into the processor. Usually that needs another piece of gear for big volume.

Anyways, good luck, whatever you settle on.

 

[ChoppyChoppy]

Do you have any photos of what the logs look like, I think that would help explain.

What is it about a rubber belt that would work better than a chain? I'd be curious on the strength as well.

I've broken my trough chain and the drive chain a few times. Trough is 2080H, drive is 60H chain, all fairly good sized, tensile strength roughly in the 6-7 ton area.

Or better yet, call the guys building the machines and they'll help. I know for sure Blockbuster will build to your needs, although I'm not sure about a rubber feed belt.

 

[cantoo]

Valleywood some info here.

http://www.oldgrowthjuniper.com/page4.html
http://www.sustainablenorthwest.org...gon-juniper-mill-operates-on-hopes-and-dreams

 

[Sandhill Crane]

Cantoo: Great post...thanks.

 

[fireemt799]

Utah juniper has very thick hairy bark a couple inches thick. It jams up chain feeds really quick. Western juniper and Utah juniper are quite different. Western juniper is taller and straighter. The whole point of posting on here is to get opinions from people who have used the machines and their experiences. Manufacturers are trying to sell a product and I want unbiased opinions from real experience.

 

[ChoppyChoppy]

Sure, and I'm telling you that I'm happy with Blockbuster. I highly doubt anyone on here is cutting Juniper on a processor. It sounds like it's a fairly local thing to you, and there are only maybe a dozen people on here that I know of running processors, some don't post very often either.

 

[CentaurG2]

We have juniper around here. Trees grow very slowly and chip wicked hard. It is far more valuable as fence post than firewood.

To the OP: see if you can rent, borrow or steal one of these processors for a day or week to try it out. Worse case, see if you can lease a machine from the manufacture. What you are trying to do is so specialized it really is difficult to judge if a processor will help your production at all.

 

[kevin j]

So do you cut, split, and deliver with no need to stockpile and dry for a year? So processor wou
ld go right into the truck?

 

[fireemt799]

Yes I cut in old burns and old chainings where I can split and deliver as it is already dry. I also have a kiln I built to dry wood. I cut green in the spring and split it up and deliver that in the fall. With 110 degree temperatures and humidity in the single digits it dries really fast. And yes I check with a moisture meter on a fresh split to make sure it is under 20% mc

 

[Weesa20]

Yes I cut in old burns and old chainings where I can split and deliver as it is already dry. I also have a kiln I built to dry wood. I cut green in the spring and split it up and deliver that in the fall. With 110 degree temperatures and humidity in the single digits it dries really fast. And yes I check with a moisture meter on a fresh split to make sure it is under 20% mc

 

[shamusturbo]

Another processor owner chiming in....Production goes up and quality goes down. I'm not too sure about a processor in that "class". It's not doing any one operation that well. It's cutting the same speed as a chain saw, its splitting the same speed as a traditional splitter and is loading off a conveyor like any old conveyor.

We run a CRD loco 20. Like Valley said, $40-60k range to really put a dent in production. We can only get 3 cords an hour with straight, 30', perfectly clean, 14-16" pecker poles. That's with a machine that has a 5/6 second cycle time. Our biggest hold up is moving the split wood from a 32' conveyor. We can split up to the conveyor in a little less than an hour. It either needs loaded and moved, or pushed out of the way.

A skidsteer is 3x more valuable than a processor could ever be. IMO. Like Valley, we run 1 processor, 5 splitters, 7 trucks, 2 conveyors, 2 skidsteers. However, I buy the wood from pipelining companies (around $80-120/cord) and make firewood from there. We cut, split, season, deliver, and stack just over 300 cords a year. We only work weekends and an occasional weekday. Oh, and we are both in our 20's, 6'/240#, and in pretty good shape.

A processor is great but you need A LOT of support equipment. And we don't run it solo. It doesn't make sense. We usually wait for a third person to sort behind the splitter, before the conveyor. My brother is the better processor operator. I do the loading, some bucking, jamups, and off loading. My role is just as, if not more important than throwing the levers.

The only glaring difference I can see is species of wood. Like some have mentioned, I am also not familiar with Juniper. We are spoiled in this area and have the oaks, cherry, ash etc.....

Dragging wood to the machine in the woods would be insane here. Not possible, I'd say. I can't see a carpet belt lasting more than a few hundred hours either, no matter how hard the wood. The feed chains on my machine would devour any piece of bark.

 

[muddstopper]

We run a CRD loco 20. Like Valley said, $40-60k range to really put a dent in production. We can only get 3 cords an hour with straight, 30', perfectly clean, 14-16" pecker poles. That's with a machine that has a 5/6 second cycle time. Our biggest hold up is moving the split wood from a 32' conveyor. We can split up to the conveyor in a little less than an hour. It either needs loaded and moved, or pushed out of the way.

I have watched about every processor video there is. Folks make all kind of claims about production and cord per hr. What they dont tell you is that it takes about the same amount of time to process 16in dia wood as it would 24in dia wood. If your using a machine that is capable of processing large dia wood, you need to be processing that size wood to get anywhere close to the advertised rates. The minute you load a small dia log on the machine, your production rates are going to go down. According to theory, my processor build should be able to process about 30 cords per hr, but that is figureing processing 30in dia rounds, 30 inches long into 12 splits in one pass. I probably wont see very many 30 in dia rounds, nor will I be making 30in long splits, or very few. Processing the normal size firewood, I will be very happy if I can do 3 or 4 cordhr. All theory of course since the processor hasnt been completed and tested.

 

[Sandhill Crane]

shamusturbo: I really like your post because it gives a broader view of the process and what is involved.

I normally cut on a cut table, and had set aside some larger dia. logs that I cut up yesterday. The largest was 24". I got the TW-6 out and set it up to the conveyor. It was a bust. The machine was too low and the outfeed table inclined. Re-splitting was troublesome because of this. The splits on the table would slide back under the four-way when I removed a piece to resplit, and then the four-way could not be lowered. The result was pulling the machine out and just chunking up the rounds, then resplitting with the SS at the conveyor. It went surprisingly smooth that way in a fairly short amount of time, but was a way more handling. Today I'm feeling it after only a cord.

 

[fireemt799]

Another processor owner chiming in....Production goes up and quality goes down. I'm not too sure about a processor in that "class". It's not doing any one operation that well. It's cutting the same speed as a chain saw, its splitting the same speed as a traditional splitter and is loading off a conveyor like any old conveyor.

We run a CRD loco 20. Like Valley said, $40-60k range to really put a dent in production. We can only get 3 cords an hour with straight, 30', perfectly clean, 14-16" pecker poles. That's with a machine that has a 5/6 second cycle time. Our biggest hold up is moving the split wood from a 32' conveyor. We can split up to the conveyor in a little less than an hour. It either needs loaded and moved, or pushed out of the way.

A skidsteer is 3x more valuable than a processor could ever be. IMO. Like Valley, we run 1 processor, 5 splitters, 7 trucks, 2 conveyors, 2 skidsteers. However, I buy the wood from pipelining companies (around $80-120/cord) and make firewood from there. We cut, split, season, deliver, and stack just over 300 cords a year. We only work weekends and an occasional weekday. Oh, and we are both in our 20's, 6'/240#, and in pretty good shape.

A processor is great but you need A LOT of support equipment. And we don't run it solo. It doesn't make sense. We usually wait for a third person to sort behind the splitter, before the conveyor. My brother is the better processor operator. I do the loading, some bucking, jamups, and off loading. My role is just as, if not more important than throwing the levers.

The only glaring difference I can see is species of wood. Like some have mentioned, I am also not familiar with Juniper. We are spoiled in this area and have the oaks, cherry, ash etc.....

Dragging wood to the machine in the woods would be insane here. Not possible, I'd say. I can't see a carpet belt lasting more than a few hundred hours either, no matter how hard the wood. The feed chains on my machine would devour any piece of bark.

If I could use support equipment I would get a multitek or bigger processor like those mentioned and crank up production but I can't. I cut on blm land and I can't use any equipment on the land period. I have to stick to roads and dry washes. That's why I am attempting to get the wood beaver 18 bab depending on how the loan goes. Unfortunately I have paid off multiple commercial loans but they don't report to your credit so my score wasn't high enough to get a good lease rate. I do this full time as a living. I can cut trees into logs for a day or two and process for a day or two switching off. The wood beaver has been documented at a show producing over 5 cords in an hour. 2 cords an hour would be plenty for me and even if it is a little lower than that it still pencils out. It has a 12 foot conveyor attached to the machine that will dump the wood into a dump truck for me. I don't split my wood small most are only busted in half. With the log lift I can load logs on it without other equipment I can't run on public land. The saw and splitter have a 3.8 second cycle time with series hydraulics. My father is retired and wants something to do and I know a couple others who wouldn't mind a couple hundred hours of part time work a year. Everything I have researched the wood beaver is the best machine for the regulations I have to comply with. With the wood beaver I can show that juniper can be harvested and utilized on the scale that is needed for larger contracts here. That would open up a stewardship oportunity that would allow me to run equipment and a larger processor and boost production more. Getting production above 500 cords a year plus bundles and all that would be a good living. The more I deal with people not wanting to work decent and other problems the less I want to go for a large production with many employees. I am pursuing financing on the wood beaver and see how it goes from there. Only time will tell

 

[KiwiBro]

Any progress on this?

 

[fireemt799]

Waiting to find out on financing

 

[Weesa20]

Just got a wallenstein wp835. I know it is barely a processor but it is light years ahead of saw and splitter. No heavy equipment needed and will handle 22-24 diameter logs. Got a killer deal on it thanks to the weak Canadian dollar. Got the 6 way wedge and saw pivot. I use a logrite atv arch and Polaris ace to get logs to the landing. Works great for a low impact micro operation.

Weesa