First time here, need advice

[mjs]

Hi guys,
I’m a homeowner from Croatia. Yearly I prepare from 20 to 40 cubic meters of firewood, everything from felling to splitting. My father and I always used to have three saws - currently I have a Stihl MS180, Husqvarna 555 (mark II?) and a Stihl 064. I also have a non-functioning Stihl 045AV.
Most (>90%) of the trees are oak (quercus cerris and robur) and Robinia paeudoacacia (what I believe you here call Black Locust), from 15 cm to 60-70 cm diameter.
My MS180 is very temperamental, mostly it works fine, but after a while stops working and is mostly done for the day (this after service).
The 555 is my workhorse, it can do anything but the 180 is lighter and 064 much faster when cutting big trees.
The 064 was at the “doctor” for a few months due to overheating, and although it functions now, the verdict is I should expect a similar failure in the near future - the piston got damaged.
What’s important to me is the confidence that I won’t have to get back home without anything being done because my saws decided they don’t want to work on this particular day.
What I wanted to ask is, what should I buy to replace the 180 and 064? Funds are not unlimited but I don’t mind paying more to have something that will last for 20-30 years with care.
Thanks

 

[FXJenkins]

The way I see it is a 31 cc saw, the 180, serves a different purpose than the 85 cc 064. These are two different tools. If you are asking for one saw to replace both it really can't be done unless you compromise on the upper end of the middle with a MS 400 (67 cc) or something in the 70 cc range. The only thing that will best that 064 is a 500i but I don't know if thats the best option for you in Coratia dep on tech support and such. Talking current "NIB" availibility here...Lots of used options out there of course but we all know what that can turn in to. Some opinions on here poopoo the 362 but at 2 lbs heavier than your 180, and 59 cc's, with a "25 ES light bar its hard to beat as an all day, all around, less than a grand *us$, work horse. A new stihl 462 with proper maint will last you 25 years...

 

[mjs]

The way I see it is a 31 cc saw, the 180, serves a different purpose than the 85 cc 064. These are two different tools. If you are asking for one saw to replace both it really can't be done unless you compromise on the upper end of the middle with a 460 or something in the 70 cc range. The only thing that will best that 064 is a 500i but I don't know if thats the best option for you in Coratia dep on tech support and such. Talking current "NIB" availibility here...Lots of used options out there of course but we all know what that turn in to.

To clarify, I’m looking for two *new* saws - a small one for limbing and a big one for big trees and fast cutting - I can save a lot of time using my 064 vs the 555.

 

[FXJenkins]

To clarify, I’m looking for two *new* saws - a small one for limbing and a big one for big trees and fast cutting - I can save a lot of time using my 064 vs the 555.

I should have welcomed you to the forum first, so tip of the hat. With that being said the professionals on here love their 261's as the small, limbing saw. For felling and bucking my other recommendations stand. But my philosophy is a little bit different. I run the exact same loop, 33RS 84 on all 3 of my "bigger" saws. One file, one spare chain, same length bar provides versatility with the big 3, which saves me time. And because the 362 is light enough to limb with, I'm not bending over, I don't need my smaller two saw unless I'm up in the tree or really doing light trimming. Its just a simple approach.

View attachment 1724704823961.jpeg

 

[lone wolf]

Ms 241 and MS 500I.

 

[FXJenkins]

Ms 241 and MS 500I.

What he said works too..

 

[mjs]

Ms 241 and MS 500I.

Yeah, this seems to fit the bill. What's the user recommended bar length for the 500i?
Also, what would be the husqvarna equivalents?

 

[lone wolf]

Yeah, this seems to fit the bill. What's the user recommended bar length for the 500i?
Also, what would be the husqvarna equivalents?

I like a 24 ,a 28 is fine also. IDK about the Huskys anymore.

 

[StihlsawuserMS361]

My 500I has a 25". This will be debated, just like oil threads! I'm 6'4", some say a longer bar is better. I think they get nose heavy past 28". When I buck, I use a backhoe to lift the logs, so I'm at waist high. Some say they are thirsty, but I don't think any more than my 361. Plus, with their speed in the cut, you cut more faster? I dunno, but I really like its power for felling large trees. Fast in, and faster out...less risk, for me anyways as I'm just a homeowner, not a pro

 

[lone wolf]

My 500I has a 25". This will be debated, just like oil threads! I'm 6'4", some say a longer bar is better. I think they get nose heavy past 28". When I buck, I use a backhoe to lift the logs, so I'm at waist high. Some say they are thirsty, but I don't think any more than my 361. Plus, with their speed in the cut, you cut more faster? I dunno, but I really like its power for felling large trees. Fast in, and faster out...less risk, for me anyways as I'm just a homeowner, not a pro

Take into consideration how long it takes to sharpen a shorter chain V a longer one, I hate sharpening chains in the middle of a fast-paced job, so the faster it's filed the better. This can be a real drag if what you are cutting dulls the chain every time you can, as in a stump with sand. Many times I FINISHED the cut on a nasty stump with my trusty 241C because if that chain gets rocked, it's fixed faster with less effort.

 

[fields_mj]

I'd recommend a good prograde 50cc saw like a 261 to replace the 180. I have an 024 and an 026. Based on my experience with both, I wouldn't bother with an MS241 unless the 261 just isn't in your budget. Even then, I'd try to find a good used 261 over the 241. It just has more capability.

As a replacement for the 064, the 500i is a good option, and so is a 441, and a 462. Based on your 60cm-70cm wood, I'd look at a 25" bar unless you want to cut without bending over. In that case, I'd go with at least a 28" bar and stick to at least 75cc on the saw.

Another option is to rebuild your 064. I'm in the process of doing so with mine now. A new OEM piston is around $100 USD from my local dealer. I have an air leak, and a new OEM gasket kit (includes oil seals for the bottom end, and all the gaskets for the top) is around $35USD, and the bearings are around $16 USD each. So $170 USD plus labor to install the new bearings and seals and you have a "like new" 064. The 064 is a heck of a saw for its age. FWIW, if the cylinder is shot on the 064, you can upgrade the piston and cylinder to the 066. I'm not sure what the cylinders cost, but an 066 piston was only $45 USD when I priced it last week.

 

[FXJenkins]

I'd recommend a good prograde 50cc saw like a 261 to replace the 180. I have an 024 and an 026. Based on my experience with both, I wouldn't bother with an MS241 unless the 261 just isn't in your budget. Even then, I'd try to find a good used 261 over the 241. It just has more capability.

As a replacement for the 064, the 500i is a good option, and so is a 441, and a 462. Based on your 60cm-70cm wood, I'd look at a 25" bar unless you want to cut without bending over. In that case, I'd go with at least a 28" bar and stick to at least 75cc on the saw.

Another option is to rebuild your 064. I'm in the process of doing so with mine now. A new OEM piston is around $100 USD from my local dealer. I have an air leak, and a new OEM gasket kit (includes oil seals for the bottom end, and all the gaskets for the top) is around $35USD, and the bearings are around $16 USD each. The 064 is a heck of a saw for its age.

 

[Mad3400]

I would say, go with a standard carb MS 261 & 661 if you're buying new.


Mad3400

 

[StihlsawuserMS361]

Another thought....I usually try to buy more than I think I'll need, because somewhere sometime down the road I'll need it

 

[lone wolf]

View attachment 1200526

Depends on how much money or work you are losing without a good saw.

 

[fields_mj]

Another thought....I usually try to buy more than I think I'll need, because somewhere sometime down the road I'll need it

If you really need something bigger than an 064, you're into an MS881 or an old 090. Either way, those are some BIG saws.

By the way, WELCOME TO THE BOARD!

I'd absolutely replace the 180 with a good pro-grade 50cc saw, but then I'd rebuild the 064 in the off season. Something like a 261 will still cut 70cm wood, it will just be a LOT slower so I'd limp through this season with the 064 in its current condition if you can. The 064 will pull a 36" bar with no problems if you ever needed it to. The the question becomes whether or not you need a 13 lb 65cc-75cc saw to go in-between them If you shop around, over time you might be able to find a good used 261 and a good used 441 or 460/461/462 for less than $1k combined.

New saws are nice, but I'm concerned that the electronics will make them more difficult to support over the course of the next 30 years where as its pretty straight forward to completely rebuild a 30 year old pro saw today. If I were making money at it, I'd buy new tools, no question asked. If I'm heating my house, I'm buying good used tools, and making sure that I have at least one extra whether that means having a 3 saw plan instead of a 2 saw plan, or having an extra 50cc saw, but that's just me.

 

[mjs]

If you really need something bigger than an 064, you're into an MS881 or an old 090. Either way, those are some BIG saws.

By the way, WELCOME TO THE BOARD!

I'd absolutely replace the 180 with a good pro-grade 50cc saw, but then I'd rebuild the 064 in the off season. Something like a 261 will still cut 70cm wood, it will just be a LOT slower so I'd limp through this season with the 064 in its current condition if you can. The 064 will pull a 36" bar with no problems if you ever needed it to. The the question becomes whether or not you need a 13 lb 65cc-75cc saw to go in-between them If you shop around, over time you might be able to find a good used 261 and a good used 441 or 460/461/462 for less than $1k combined.

New saws are nice, but I'm concerned that the electronics will make them more difficult to support over the course of the next 30 years where as its pretty straight forward to completely rebuild a 30 year old pro saw today. If I were making money at it, I'd buy new tools, no question asked. If I'm heating my house, I'm buying good used tools, and making sure that I have at least one extra whether that means having a 3 saw plan instead of a 2 saw plan, or having an extra 50cc saw, but that's just me.

Yeah, I’m a bit sentimental to stuff my father left me, so I was planning to keep the 064, no matter what the service man said. I’ll look for a new piston next year, and heat management will be easier when summer wanes.
The 180 is getting replaced first in any case because it’s only marginally useful now.
Are the c-m 261 unreliable now or is it due to expected availability issues?

 

[Mad3400]

Yeah, I’m a bit sentimental to stuff my father left me, so I was planning to keep the 064, no matter what the service man said. I’ll look for a new piston next year, and heat management will be easier when summer wanes.
The 180 is getting replaced first in any case because it’s only marginally useful now.
Are the c-m 261 unreliable now or is it due to expected availability issues?

I've had a few 261C's Stock & Ported, they are great, but I think that the Standard carb version would be better in your case.

Mad3400

 

[Mad Professor]

064 is worth fixing.

Pull the muffler and post a picture of the piston. If it has aluminum transfer running it will just make it worse, fast. Might just need the cylinder cleaned up, piston/rings/seals and any air leaks fixed.

 

[fields_mj]

Yeah, I’m a bit sentimental to stuff my father left me, so I was planning to keep the 064, no matter what the service man said. I’ll look for a new piston next year, and heat management will be easier when summer wanes.

If the 064 lost the piston because of too much heat, that's probably an air leak. Not sure how easy it is to get the tools in your part of the world, but in the US a vacuum tester is only about $25 on Amazon, and a sheet of rubber to block off the exhaust and intake is another $10. If you have an air leak, you'll probably loose another piston pretty quick. Go a little heavy on the 2 stroke oul when mixing your fuel, and tune your carb on the rich side to improve your chances, but these will only help a little with the symptoms, not the root cause. Id recommend getting a good 50cc saw asap (like now) so you can minimize how much you need the 064. Once you rebuild the 064, you shouldn't need another big saw, especially if you convert the top end to an 066. Put that money into a mid size saw (65-70cc) instead if you want another saw.