hand filing

[mike385]

I am by no means an arborist, but I am a professional faller. I have had to sharpen a chain at least five times on a really pain in that butt tree. Every time I sharpened it, I hit something else. I tried moving up the stump, down the stump, and everything in between. I finally just said the heck with it and got the skidder man to pull it over. It was a clearcut.
\
Anyway all I wanted to say is that it happens, not often but it happens.

 

[SCE1966]

Takes me about 6-7 minutes to sharpen a climbing saw with 14 inch bar. If there is an idle moment for the groundman I have them file the chains that need it. I dont take a chain off the saw if I can avoid it, we grind the chains that hit the dirt or hidden objects in the tree. Never seems to come back as sharp though. Doing removals I keep the chain touched up by hand.

 

[Gypo Logger]

One of the biggest things that is overlooked that would make an otherwise sharp cutting edge cut infinatly better, is to clean out the gullet.
Most filers gang up too much on the cutter itself.
Try cleaning the gullet out and you will double the ease with which your chain will cut, especially on half used chain. Chain with big gullets cuts just like chain with high rakers.
Most filers allow the gullet to get increasingly larger to where there is very limited chip clearance rendering the chain very ineffective.
The operator, in fustration pushes harder, cutting short the life of the chain, bar and saw, not to mention productivity and the feeling that you know what you're doing.
Don't be cheap about buying files. You can't have too many files.

John

 

[geofore]

gullet

Gypo,
Show them a pic side by side of a cutter that has been dogboned and one that has been sharpened but the gullet hasn't been removed. It'll give the new guys something to think about because I don't think they have a clue when you say clean out the gullet.

 

[Gypo Logger]

Gypo,
Show them a pic side by side of a cutter that has been dogboned and one that has been sharpened but the gullet hasn't been removed. It'll give the new guys something to think about because I don't think they have a clue when you say clean out the gullet.

Here's a pic that might help.
The one on the left has a huge gullet that should have been taken out progressively with regular filing. The one on the right has the gullet cleaned out.
John

 

[Tree Machine]

Gol Dang ! you take good photos, Gypo. That image there, is art. You are a frigggin 'mazing! That photo belongs in the Smithsonian.

 

[Tree Machine]

I mean, serious, just look at the photo, it totally gets what your point is. That picture is a full 1,000 words.

 

[geofore]

gullets2

Tree Machine, when you get done slobbering all over the screen back off a bit and let the new guys see it. That's exactly the pics I wanted to see. Round filed with gullet in place and square filed with gullet removed. Most homeowners, newbies and weekend warriors round file their chain, square or round, leaving the gullet in place. They don't know to remove it. Then they jump onboard and ask why their chains aren't cutting so good. They could have all their angles right and would have good cutting but for not removing the gullet.
Leaving the gullet in place pushes the chain cutter off the wood prematurely giving them a bad cutting cutter and they think they are sharpening correctly but they fail to remove the gullet as the cutters get worn back. Then they show up here asking, "What am I doing wrong?"
Who knows maybe Gypo has pics of the next item in chain sharpening. Rakers being lowered.
I'd say learning to square file square chain is an art. It takes a heck of a lot longer to learn. Thanks for the pics.

 

[wradman]

reply

Here's a pic that might help.
The one on the left has a huge gullet that should have been taken out progressively with regular filing. The one on the right has the gullet cleaned out.
John

good for competition
in the real world we don't have time for that
the biggest goalis gettting the teeth to cut even
i Have triangular files at $12 each
takes alot of time to make a pro chain
in the real world
make a nice small hook
rrakers not too low
gow like ****** hell
pictures to come in the next edition

 

[Ax-man]

Tree Machine , I think you need to get out a little more, little cabin fever setting in or what. It is just a picture of some cutters, settle down.

Larry

 

[Gypo Logger]

Glad you all like the pictures.
Thanks,
Rather than always trying to file the cutters edge when it may already be sharp, draw the file forward toward the raker with a bit of down pressure to make the gullet symetrical as in the following pictures.
This is round filed chisel and will be all you need to know for 99% of your cutting requirements, however, properly square filed or ground chisel bit chain is not much behind my race chain, although 1 sec is a long time at a race.
It takes alot less time to file correctly than it does haphazardly, so buy lots of files and watch your production and enjoyment of cutting go up 200%.
John

 

[Gypo Logger]

A bit out of focus, because there is very little depth of field when up so close, but it is to show the general shape of what I think the gullet should be.
John

 

[Gypo Logger]

Here's a 3/8 cutter straight off the square grinder and never been used yet.72CL
John

 

[Gypo Logger]

The inside of a round filed chisel cutter 33RS.
John

 

[Ax-man]

Gypo

Looks good, excellent to be honest with you. One question though, what angle are you filing ???? Looks like it has been filed straight across like rip chain is filed with a 10 degree angle. If you are filing straight across what is the advantage if any over the usual angles.

Larry

 

[Gypo Logger]

Larry, yes the above picture looks like it has a shallow top plate angle, but it's just an optical illusion, however, here's the top view.
I suppose the angle is about 25 degrees or slightly less. For general work, I think it's hard to say whether a 30 - 20 degree angle makes much difference, but I try to strive for 25 degrees on all cutters.
John

 

[Kneejerk Bombas]

Anyone who runs a full house chain on a saw with a 28" bar that may see problems, rocks, objects in res. trees, etc. is not the sharpest knife in the drawer, with all due respect.

Just to pick a nit, a full house chain is what you have if there are no tie straps, just cutters, drive links and drivers.
To obtain one, it would have to be home made, because chain manufacturers don't sell them.
A full house has right cutter, left cutter, right cutter...
A full complement has right cutter, blank (tie strap), left cutter, blank...
A semi-skip has right cutter, blank, left cutter, blank, blank, right cutter...
A full skip has right cutter, blank, blank, left cutter, blank, blank...

So I'm guessing what you meant is full complement, not full house.

 

[Tree Machine]

Thank you, Mike.

 

[DeanBrown3D]

Ever seen a double skip?:jawdrop:

 

[Ax-man]

Gypo,

Thanks for taking the second pic. That is one wicked looking cutter. To me that is as good as it can get. I have got to try a 25 angle to see if there is any difference.


That camera of yours is something else, it picks up as much detail if not maybe a little more than if you were looking at that cutter under a hand lens, then it is able to put it on film. Awesome

Thanks Mike for your info, that was helpful

Larry