Handloggers

[tramp bushler]

Aim and Launch ... They used Gilcrist jacks when the tree would get hung up on its way down the mountain . The perfect situation was for a place like Yes Bay where there is 50 plus fathoms of water right where the water touches the rock in many places ......... Sometimes the tree would jill poke into something and they would have to cut it off at the top end so it could take off again .. To get an understanding of this , a tree can lay up and down a pretty steep slope and stay there forever ....... They had to walk / climb around in these sometimes almost verticle v notches and limb the tree by hand , Seager Axes and misery whips ..... Then they had to off the top that was supporting the whole tree .... And right when everything took off they had to get in the clear as the tree rockets past them ..........
.
. This is all before , during and after WWII , even some before WWI .................Since there was no shortage of Sitka spruce 6-12 feet on the stump and sometimes over 200 feet tall , that was the target ........ Just packin the tools up the mountain to the tree would be more than a days work for most on here ...... Aparantly Handlogger Jackson was a bit over the top as the only guys who could work with him were his brothers in law , and often he worked alone .. .... . Fallin 10 ft spruce with a hand saw ,,, Alone ,,, 5 , 600 feet up a mountain , sometimes standing on a spring board with nothing but air under his board for 300 feet ....... Where the best spruce grows the ground is always really rugged and broken up ..... He had a pretty ingenious system set up for the empty end of the saw ...... He prefered to prospect for gold as that was alot easier than hand logging ....... It is really a must read book .... He did things like row a 22 or 24 ft dory UP the Unik river , alone . loaded down with tools and gear for a winters prospecting and trapping .. The Unik isn,t an easy river to row a dory up ... at all !!!! It isn,t a BS tale either as he was well known in Ketchikan ... A guy I worked for , Kevin Hack has the rifle he killed Old Groaner with .......

 

[coastalfaller]

Right on !!!! There have been several Excellent books written about loggin in BC ... One was ( Never Chop Your Rope ) .... One book I really enjoyed , I don,t know its name was a pirated copy of an unpublished book .. Another , that was in comic book format , or whatever its called , I still have around here somewhere . . Then there was one about A Frame logging , and a tug named the Ima Hogg ... It was a wood fired steam tug of not many horse power ... All these were from British Columbia and steam or wood tree steam loggin .....

The comic book one your talking about is "Now Your Logging" by Bus Griffiths, it really is a great read. Some others are "Timber" by Roderick Haig Brown & "From Horseshoes to Helicopters" by Ron (?) Coulson. The first two are fiction, but the last one is a collection of short stories from loggers on the BC Coast, written by a member of a prominent logging family. One particular story always pops into my head about a Dad who's son begged him to break him in falling. The Dad resisted, but finally relented and while working together had to deal with the worst thing anyone could imagine. Heartbreaking. There are lots of great stories in that book, it's hard to find though, been out of print since the late 80's I believe. Happy reading!

 

[bitzer]

Aim and Launch ... They used Gilcrist jacks when the tree would get hung up on its way down the mountain . The perfect situation was for a place like Yes Bay where there is 50 plus fathoms of water right where the water touches the rock in many places ......... Sometimes the tree would jill poke into something and they would have to cut it off at the top end so it could take off again .. To get an understanding of this , a tree can lay up and down a pretty steep slope and stay there forever ....... They had to walk / climb around in these sometimes almost verticle v notches and limb the tree by hand , Seager Axes and misery whips ..... Then they had to off the top that was supporting the whole tree .... And right when everything took off they had to get in the clear as the tree rockets past them ..........
.
. This is all before , during and after WWII , even some before WWI .................Since there was no shortage of Sitka spruce 6-12 feet on the stump and sometimes over 200 feet tall , that was the target ........ Just packin the tools up the mountain to the tree would be more than a days work for most on here ...... Aparantly Handlogger Jackson was a bit over the top as the only guys who could work with him were his brothers in law , and often he worked alone .. .... . Fallin 10 ft spruce with a hand saw ,,, Alone ,,, 5 , 600 feet up a mountain , sometimes standing on a spring board with nothing but air under his board for 300 feet ....... Where the best spruce grows the ground is always really rugged and broken up ..... He had a pretty ingenious system set up for the empty end of the saw ...... He prefered to prospect for gold as that was alot easier than hand logging ....... It is really a must read book .... He did things like row a 22 or 24 ft dory UP the Unik river , alone . loaded down with tools and gear for a winters prospecting and trapping .. The Unik isn,t an easy river to row a dory up ... at all !!!! It isn,t a BS tale either as he was well known in Ketchikan ... A guy I worked for , Kevin Hack has the rifle he killed Old Groaner with .......

Very cool! I'm gonna have to find that book! Thanks for the info.

As global warming goes, I have been on college campuses over the last five years. I go there as a student, but i wouldn't consider myself one. The people I go to school with and I have one thing in common, we go to school there. I work full time felling trees, excavating, whatever has to be done for my company. They can't pay well so I chose to go back to school. Global warming was hot several years ago. Everyone talked about it, scientific models of emissions cycles and chemical equations of lab simulation proabablitlities were rampant. I have a strong knowledge of global and cultural change from now to as far back as you wanna go. There are warming and cooling trends that the earth goes through naturally I would contest with my professors. Look at the age of the dinosaurs, then the ice ages. Where I am sitting right now it was covered in hundreds of feet of ice 10,000 years ago. I was always shot down and the great GORE and his crusaders were lifted high! In the past two years I have not even heard the phrase global warming uttered in class. Where did it go? Chemically speaking yes emissions in the air can lead to chemical processes resulting in changes in the pH of the oceans causing higher temperatures of water influencing climate, weather patterns and so on. That fact of the matter is, it would be extremely difficult to quantify that information and pinpoint it as "global warming." It is a theory and politicians love to ride on scare tactics as well as the media. They also like to ride the hunting is wrong train and I am sure the logging is wrong train. They like to be comfortable and not bothered with the human impact on the world when it is undeniable. The human impact is what has driven the logging industry and has made what hunting is today. In Wisconsin we have WAY too many deer. They are hit by cars constantly. Many people I know have hit them. It is because they have lots of food from our crops and we destroyed their natural predators. Now we must keep them in check or they will become over run. As far as logging goes are those anti-loggers framing their houses out of recycled materials instead of lumber, I doubt it. Wood is a renewable resource and it always has been an extremely important one throughout time. Like the others mentioned it is regulated and controlled and well thought out and above all necessary. Before a house is built does the excavated hole in the ground look pretty? No, but there is a benficial end to the means for those involved. I apologize for the rant, but I could go on forever on this one citing many examples along the way!

 

[joesawer]

Very cool! I'm gonna have to find that book! Thanks for the info.

As global warming goes, I have been on college campuses over the last five years. I go there as a student, but i wouldn't consider myself one. The people I go to school with and I have one thing in common, we go to school there. I work full time felling trees, excavating, whatever has to be done for my company. They can't pay well so I chose to go back to school. Global warming was hot several years ago. Everyone talked about it, scientific models of emissions cycles and chemical equations of lab simulation proabablitlities were rampant. I have a strong knowledge of global and cultural change from now to as far back as you wanna go. There are warming and cooling trends that the earth goes through naturally I would contest with my professors. Look at the age of the dinosaurs, then the ice ages. Where I am sitting right now it was covered in hundreds of feet of ice 10,000 years ago. I was always shot down and the great GORE and his crusaders were lifted high! In the past two years I have not even heard the phrase global warming uttered in class. Where did it go? Chemically speaking yes emissions in the air can lead to chemical processes resulting in changes in the pH of the oceans causing higher temperatures of water influencing climate, weather patterns and so on. That fact of the matter is, it would be extremely difficult to quantify that information and pinpoint it as "global warming." It is a theory and politicians love to ride on scare tactics as well as the media. They also like to ride the hunting is wrong train and I am sure the logging is wrong train. They like to be comfortable and not bothered with the human impact on the world when it is undeniable. The human impact is what has driven the logging industry and has made what hunting is today. In Wisconsin we have WAY too many deer. They are hit by cars constantly. Many people I know have hit them. It is because they have lots of food from our crops and we destroyed their natural predators. Now we must keep them in check or they will become over run. As far as logging goes are those anti-loggers framing their houses out of recycled materials instead of lumber, I doubt it. Wood is a renewable resource and it always has been an extremely important one throughout time. Like the others mentioned it is regulated and controlled and well thought out and above all necessary. Before a house is built does the excavated hole in the ground look pretty? No, but there is a benficial end to the means for those involved. I apologize for the rant, but I could go on forever on this one citing many examples along the way!

If you go back to the 70's the granola eaters where all convinced we where going to cause another ice age with pollution. Many of the same great scientists where providing their info.

 

[Burvol]

Thanks for the tip, ordered a signed copy. Should be a good winter read.

I'm not a logger, in fact, I'm one of those treehuggers that loggers love to hate, but I enjoy reading about outdoor adventures. I do enough personal woodcutting to admire loggers for their skills even though it's sometimes hard to admire the results of commercial logging for profit.

Mtngun,

Being a hand faller is the best job in the whole world. Part of my job is a political statement. Your damn right I stand behind every clearcut I have ever done, stood behind them and admired the view.

You should listen to Slowp. She is one of the most if not the most intelligent foresters on this site, or in SW WA at that. Do you sun worship as well?

 

[gallegosmike]

The one thing that get me about tree huggers/leaf kisser. Is that during the so called carbon cycle, young trees use vast amounts of CO2 to grow versus mature trees just piddling "sipping" CO2. The CO2 nazi's cry that CO2 is a green house gas that needs to be reduced, but do not cut down a tree! Heck, the billions of trees rotting in new mexico forests are putting out more CO2 then if was used for lumber or firewood. The decomposition of wood products in the US forest is huge. But the tree huggers are blind to it, doesnt fit in with their leftest ideology.
When LORD CHRISTOPER MONCKTON (former science adviser for the English Prime Minister Margaret Thatcher , gives a speech about modern green movent outlining the fact that is all about socialist ideology. And how to use the legal system to force change of fair usage of "ARE" forests. Watch this video (http://thepostnemail.wordpress.com/2009/10/26/lord-moncktons-speech-on-video/) Scary stuff!

 

[Jaredm]

Woodsmen of the west by martin Allrdale Grainger is another good book from about the same period about hand logging on the bc coast.

 

[woodchopper]

Thats the problem with them . They have to draw attention to themselves ...... This should be a good thread about Hand Logger Jackson , but this #### head thinks so much of himself he has to brag about it on a loggers forum ........... What a totally un class act .................
.
. People who work in the woods don,t love to hate pieces of #### like you ... Mostly we don,t understand how anyone can be so ignorant and rude .

Actually if you read what mtngun posted he DID mention that he ordered the book and admired the skills of loggers which is related to the subject of this thread. He only commented that he didn't like the aftermath of CERTAIN logging operations. Nowhere in his post did he condemn ALL logging or us who work in the industry. In fact if you read what he posted in a later post he's worked in this industry in the past and obviously knows more about the subject than you seem to want to give him credit for. Maybe his use of the word treehugger set you off but from reading what he later posted your anger might of been better off directed at someone who truly deserved it.
I can't believe many here can't fathom far more environmental legislation has been enacted because of hunters, fishermen, and river runners than all the Sierra Clubs and others combined. The environmental organizations only wish they had the clout and financial might that sportsmen have.
Back to the thread.....I intend to order the book. Sounds like a great read.

 

[tramp bushler]

typical response from someone from Masatwo####s

See Woodchopper , there ya go bein on the wrong side !!!!! You must not make a living in the brush .... The Sierra Club has a half dozen lawyers that live in Juneau . They stick their nose into everything a working man can do up here because they all are devoted to worshiping the earth .......... Weather its loggin or mining , building a road , drilling for oil ....................................................
Yes hunters ect can be a p.i.t.a . But the wicans are the worst ... The whole environmental movement is socialist driven ..........communist encouraged to bring America down .... You don,t see many liberals demonstrating in China or Russia against industrial projects ... They get dropped into the tailrace of a dam or just killed .... ........ What happened to T.T. and the bear that ate him was the perfect end to an environmentalist lier ........................ Why don,t you go try to operate a business that supplies your livelihood , Work your guts out at it and have some lazy useless pos come and file a lawsuit and put you and your way of life out of business ...... Then tell everyone how good it is to be (moderate )) My moto , loger clean and pave er flat ...!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!Kill all the competing predators !!!!

 

[tramp bushler]

Oh and you stupid pos ... You think oh what a fun READ .. Try actually living there and doing it ................ You prolly couldn,t make it up the cliff to the tree ....

 

[woodchopper]

See Woodchopper , there ya go bein on the wrong side !!!!! You must not make a living in the brush .... The Sierra Club has a half dozen lawyers that live in Juneau . They stick their nose into everything a working man can do up here because they all are devoted to worshiping the earth .......... Weather its loggin or mining , building a road , drilling for oil ....................................................
Yes hunters ect can be a p.i.t.a . But the wicans are the worst ... The whole environmental movement is socialist driven ..........communist encouraged to bring America down .... You don,t see many liberals demonstrating in China or Russia against industrial projects ... They get dropped into the tailrace of a dam or just killed .... ........ What happened to T.T. and the bear that ate him was the perfect end to an environmentalist lier ........................ Why don,t you go try to operate a business that supplies your livelihood , Work your guts out at it and have some lazy useless pos come and file a lawsuit and put you and your way of life out of business ...... Then tell everyone how good it is to be (moderate )) My moto , loger clean and pave er flat ...!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!Kill all the competing predators !!!!

Just in case your reading comprehension is a little off because whatever your drinking today I'll go a little slower so you can catch it this time. I DO work in the woods and stated so in my post. Go back and read what I said again. It's there in black and white.
I wish I could blame the environmental people but foreign {Canadian} competition and a down housing market are what are affecting logging jobs here in American. Anyone who understands business can tell you it has nothing to do with environmentalist. Not even close.

Oh and you stupid pos ... You think oh what a fun READ .. Try actually living there and doing it ................ You prolly couldn,t make it up the cliff to the tree ....

I guess my comment about your drinking wasn't out of line. Have another one brother. Calling someone a stupid POS on the internet really adds to your credibility.

 

[mtngun]

Getting back to the original subject ...... ....... I've finished reading Handloggers. It was a good winter read. Not the greatest ever Alaskan story (try On the Edge of Nowhere) but good.

However, if you're looking for lots of logging stories, it's not there. Only a couple of chapters discuss the handlogging business in any detail. The majority of the book is about living in the wilderness -- hiking, exploring, hunting, fishing, trapping, prospecting, and boating.

His style of logging is low-impact -- no machines, no roads, and no clearcuts. The only bad thing I can say about handlogging is that the best trees were cut first and the worst trees were left standing, a common practice in that day.

If you are looking for chainsaw stories, there are none, because Handlogger used an ax and a handsaw ! ! !

The book doesn't say whether Handlogger ever joined the Sierra Club, but it's clear that he loved the wilderness.

 

[tramp bushler]

Getting back to the original subject ...... ....... I've finished reading Handloggers. It was a good winter read. Not the greatest ever Alaskan story (try On the Edge of Nowhere) but good.

However, if you're looking for lots of logging stories, it's not there. Only a couple of chapters discuss the handlogging business in any detail. The majority of the book is about living in the wilderness -- hiking, exploring, hunting, fishing, trapping, prospecting, and boating.

His style of logging is low-impact -- no machines, no roads, and no clearcuts. The only bad thing I can say about handlogging is that the best trees were cut first and the worst trees were left standing, a common practice in that day.

If you are looking for chainsaw stories, there are none, because Handlogger used an ax and a handsaw ! ! !

The book doesn't say whether Handlogger ever joined the Sierra Club, but it's clear that he loved the wilderness.

.

. Now I know you are dumb as a post . I,ve met the author of edge of nowhere , and he wouldn,t make a pimple on Handloggers ass............... Good guy and all that . But not in Handloggers class ..

 

[tramp bushler]

Just in case your reading comprehension is a little off because whatever your drinking today I'll go a little slower so you can catch it this time. I DO work in the woods and stated so in my post. Go back and read what I said again. It's there in black and white.
I wish I could blame the environmental people but foreign {Canadian} competition and a down housing market are what are affecting logging jobs here in American. Anyone who understands business can tell you it has nothing to do with environmentalist. Not even close.

I guess my comment about your drinking wasn't out of line. Have another one brother. Calling someone a stupid POS on the internet really adds to your credibility.

.

. Oh , and jack ass , I don,t drink and write ... I,m a Timber Beast ... I really do think this way . If you were around me and you ran your mouth that way . Well , I wouldn,t use my mouth to do my talking !!!!!!!! .

 

[woodchopper]

.

. Oh , and jack ass , I don,t drink and write ... I,m a Timber Beast ... I really do think this way . If you were around me and you ran your mouth that way . Well , I wouldn,t use my mouth to do my talking !!!!!!!! .

I'd really be impressed if you could go back and repost something I said to prove I was wrong about your lack of reading comprehension.........anything. Because you can't back up your false comments like a man you try to insult me by calling me a jack ass. Laughable at best my friend.
Anyone that can't back up what they say can be a internet commando. Tough guys are a dime a dozen. If the day ever comes when you can post something that proves me wrong let me know. Don't worry.......I won't hold my breath.

 

[discounthunter]

.

. Oh , and jack ass , I don,t drink and write ... I,m a Timber Beast ... I really do think this way . If you were around me and you ran your mouth that way . Well , I wouldn,t use my mouth to do my talking !!!!!!!! .

chill out and eat another granola bar,how old are you 20?

 

[tramp bushler]

If I was such a pos that I was in massassassatwo####s or jauja . I would hope I would be smart enough to not run my mouth at an Alaskan Bushler ....Course beins ya,ll will never go any where where you can fall any real timber , or run a brown bear on foot , or hunt a pack of wolves . ya'll get your thrills running off at the mouth on the internet ......................
.
. If you don,t have anything interesting, fun , amusing or educational to say then just shut up ............... Do a little research on here you will find I,m one of the real deals ................Ya'll out east dumb asses on the other hand should have your own waiting around to implode forum ..
.
. Red state pinky finger (woods workers ) :spam::deadhorse::deadhorse::bringit::kilt:

 

[discounthunter]

i would think real"alaskan bushlers" wouldnt sit around spouting off in the internet.


any pictures of handlogging or picture books of handloggers?

 

[woodchopper]

i would think real"alaskan bushlers" wouldnt sit around spouting off in the internet.

If he really did work in the woods he'd know how much this down housing market and foreign competition was hurting logging jobs here in America. The fact that he'd rather hurl out insults instead of sticking to what's been said is rather telling. There's a big difference between a "Real Deal" and someone sitting in their parents cellar in their underwear insulting other posters.

 

[Gologit]

This ought to be worth watching. opcorn: