I need to convince township to OK OWB

[redoakneck]

My township is in the process of re-writing the rules about outdoor buildings, codes and all that nit-pikin nosey neighbor stuff.
I have 6 acres, and a fireplace in my house already, but when I asked about outdoor wood boilers, one guy on 'the board' said they were outlawed, and one friend of mine on the board said there is nothing written on the books about them. The county has a list of regulations that are already written and they are reasonable.

I am going to the meeting 8-12-10 to present my case. I have not purchased an OWB yet. I have read about them, and see that there is phase I, and phase II models.

I know the EPA has their 2 cents opinion about them, but the way I see it, it is like the gun control laws, the laws do not deter the criminals.

I can build a small hot fire with minimal smoke in cheaper model and it would not smoke too much, or burn poor quality wood in a phase II and get a smokey fire.

Is there any guidelines or non-biased info on OWB??

How do I convince them to allow the OWB??

Again, it should be a heavy smoke fine, not a ban. I can build a smokey fire in my fireplace without a penalty, but can not have a cleaner OWB??

Please offer any info / advise regarding this matter.

Thanks,

R.O.N.

 

[Circle B MN]

Contact the manufaturer of the OWN you intend to install and tell them you need some literature regarding the matter. Check out Central Boilers website. They have what I believe is a clean burning guidelines page, as well as more information directed towards zoning commisions wanting to regulate OWB.

 

[redoakneck]

Thanks MNGuns!! Copied some of CB's info. Hope this works!

Tons of good wood down and an inefficient decorative fireplace isn't cutting the mustard.

Trade ignorance for intelligence, just make sure you know which is which.

R.O.N.

 

[hawken08]

check with Hawken energy they may write a letter in your behalf.
http://blog.hawkenenergy.com/2010/07/clearing-air-about-wood-heating.html

 

[blackdogon57]

If you have neighbors close by you should consider other options. Most owb's will smoke at times and you have no control over where the smoke goes. In my opinion OWB's only make sense in a truly rural area.

 

[redoakneck]

Thanks Hawk!

Blackdog, a lot of my neighbors use fireplaces and my nearest neighbor is 300 ft. up wind, down wind 1000ft. I too do not want to live in a smoke-filled hood, but with a hot fire and efficient OWB smoke should be minimal. Also getting the pipe up high should held help.

Heck, one of my neighbors burns trash and smokey stuff all the time. The township issues burn permits for outdoor fires no problem.

Truly rural? How many acres per house, 100-200??

Anyone out there have OWB that smokes more than an indoor fireplace chimney???


R.O.N.

 

[Taxmantoo]

How do I convince them to allow the OWB??

What do you mean, "allow"?
I thought you said there were no regulations against them?

Is there something in the building code that says you need a permit to install a furnace or boiler, and you're afraid that somebody will deny the permit based on the 'because I say so' rule?

 

[isaaccarlson]

If there are no regulations against it and you have/don't need a permit then put it in. They can't fine you for something that is not in the books.

 

[woodman6666]

This kind of crap drives me nuts. Buy it now put it in and let them try to make you take it out.

 

[isaaccarlson]

this kind of crap drives me nuts. Buy it now put it in and let them try to make you take it out.

+1 Once it is in they will have a harder time bullying you.

 

[Circle B MN]

It is easier to get forgiveness than it is to get permission.



Check your current regs, and if you are good to go, install.

 

[laynes69]

Where are you located in Ohio?

 

[leon]

a.What you are referring to is revising the town of "X" zoning laws with no one looking over their collective shoulders until it is approved without rebuttal by property owners.

The county and state in which you live regulates most if not all the zoning in the town you live in as a matter of precidence.

The town board member had no business saying this to you. He should have directed you to the town zoning officer and building code enforcement official, and if an appeal of the zoning laws regarding the installation of an outdoor boiler where there is no regulation for one a zoning variance request must be filed which is what you have done apparently and you are appearing to defend your request for a zoning variance.

You should have a real estate attorney present at this appeal meeting or submit a letter from the attorney regarding your request for a zoning variance as they are well versed in the towns zoning laws.


The use of the gun control laws is a poor defense regarding your desire to install and properly use and maintain an outdoor boiler as its not clear cut because of the 234 years of vagueness of the second ammendment and its implications and interpretations to this day.

You are simply attempting to use the system of zoning laws as they exist in town X and make a basic appeal to allow an outdoor boiler installation on your property to heat your home as a fireplace is a very poor way to provide heating for a primary residence unless you look at an epa approved stove insert or a russian stove installation which may be a better way to approach this with them.

Zoning laws are created to regulate growth, provide the ability to provide municipal services, eliminate the possibilty of endangering the public from a potential nuisance or poor design that may affect the properties and harm town residents if it is not properly regulated and overseen.

We lost two volunteer fire fighters north of here because glue laminated beams were used in new home construction and they fell through the floor and died in the homes basement- the glue lam beams were never approved in the construction of the tract homes either-did not help matters that the fool homeowner had an illegal paint locker in the basement.

about boilers in general;


just as an example I filled my boilers fire box half full of standard firebrick and reduced the size of the firebox and burn hot hard fires with wood and have no smoke because the draft is regulated by the size of the firebox as it was double the size before this and always had a poor burn.

The fire brick becomes a heat sink absorbing the heat and releasing it slowly and providing a very hot natural draft to aid in combustion for both wood and coal when I burn coal as well.




You should cancel your appearance as nothing will happen in your case as you are bringing no useable information in front of the zoning appeals board which must include:

1. brand
a. model
2. cost of installed system forr tax purposes( it may prevent the addition of sales tax with its installed value as it is a capital improvement)
3. require plumbing for code and survey for buried utilities
4. stack height with braced extensions if you have close neighbors-the stak should be as tall as the existing chimney for smoke dispersal.

5 letters of recommendation from your neighbors in regard to the zoning appeal for an outdoor boiler
6. location map for the placement of the OWBwith regard to set backs and clearances-If you buy a unit that burns coal too it will have less smoke.
7. copies of existing state zoning laws with regard to wood burning appliances with natural draft and forced draft.




If you were to request the variance to install a fireplace insert that is EPA approved you may not even have to go through the process.


If you purchase a boiler with a large gallon capacity and large firebox you can fill it with firebrick to two thirds its volume and have a small hot, hard fire and huge heat source after the fire is out for the large water volume and little smoke or no smoke if you also burn hard coal.

If the OWB dealer is honest with you he will tell you that your install may be a mistake as he would rather lose a sale than a customer.



And as long as you buy a boiler with boiler plate only in its construction you will have no need to remove the fire brick as is required for boilers with stainless steel and no grates as the ash reacts with the boiler walls made of stanless steel.

 

[redoakneck]

Leon, you are right on with the laws and my situation. I have talked to an attorney and as it stands the county regs would apply because the township has no current regs. I am trying to help the township establish the guidelines.

I need to check out the Russian fireplace idea.

I really appreciate all the input. This site is great!!!

I am in Hamilton county northwest of Cincinnati.


Pete

 

[oneoldbanjo]

Pete:

You are real close to where I live in KY, and if you want to come over and talk OWB units some day give me a ring and I will show you what I have installed. I have a neighbor with a fireplace or indoor wood furnace and they make more smoke than I do......their unit seems to smoke for hours and hours out their chimney. I have a Woodmaster 4400 and I build small fires with well seasoned wood, and I only get a small amount of smoke while making a new fire or when the blower comes back on after being off for a while. Probably 80% of the time my furnace is sitting in the smolder mode and making very little smoke, 15% of the time it is burning cleanly, and maybe 5% it is smoking with a new fire or at the start of a burn cycle. Like you I live hundreds of feet from my neighbors and they claim they have never smelled the smoke from my OWB.

I work in a small town and after having owned an OWB for 3 years I have come to the conclusion that an OWB is just fine for rural use - but they don't belong in town.