Its baaaack...best new tool for climber training ever.

[jefflovstrom]

I have to admit that today while way up in a big oak doing pruning, dd wood and cutbacks, 2 different times I had both beaners at both attachment points cantilevered which was the reason the
zz was deep sixed. I am very aware of my gear and did not sit into the weight however I can see how someone would and I believe an instructor was bouncing into it when it broke.

I will probably ask to trade in my old ZZ once my new one arrives this week.

http://www.thefreedictionary.com/cantilever

You are a tough old dude, Dave. Be careful, I have not climbed (production) in 11 years. I have 6 seasoned climber's and 2 we are training, I have 6 groundies and 1 or 2 that might want to train to climb also.
I think they should (and will) learn old school first and progress as they learn. I find that some are just natural's and some are wanna-be's by starting them old school and then buddy up to one of our seasoned guy's and go from there.
Jeff

 

[treevet]

but Jeff...what is "old school"? Lack of slack tending? Just plain unnecessarily dangerous in this day and age. I feel the ZZ is the best set up for training with self slack tending. Relatively very uncomplicated and...275$....pocket change. I have probably trained a 100 guys to climb and polished way more than that with improved skills...this is the future. Rope on metal, less degradation and no worries of improper set up. The opposition to this is baffling like that of the Wraptor.

ps. new zz arrived last night from Treestuff

 

[The Real McCoy]

If you can't do a tautline or a blakes you probably shouldn't climb...

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[TreeAce]

I just picture some one calling themselves a climber when all they know how to do it is with a ZZ. Just doesnt make sense to me. I love the ZZ but if you cant tie a taughtline one handed then I dont feel that person should be climbing. I wouldnt have a newbie on a taughtline for long cuz the knot is out dated but its still a need to know.

 

[treevet]

why?

 

[treevet]

If you can't do a tautline or a blakes you probably shouldn't climb...

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why?

 

[The Real McCoy]

Like a safety net. A back up plan. Plus you don't need anything else just your rope and saddle. It's the bare minimum

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[treevet]

you have quite a few grammatical errors on your site. be glad to help. http://www.trmmaryland.com/tree-care

 

[Pelorus]

Mine arrived yesterday. Picked it up at Post Office and then went to UPS Store to bid adieu to it's sibling. Bon Voyage.
Spliced some 11.7 mm Arrowfrog for it - TreeStuff was out of stock on Blue Moon at time order was placed.

 

[treevet]

did you deal with Petzl or send it to the dealer?

 

[treevet]

I baled out 60' straight to the ground yesterday after a few cuts on the zz and it was easily as fast as any taughtline I ever tied and just as smooth stopping.

 

[Pelorus]

did you deal with Petzl or send it to the dealer?

Petzl.
Filled out their application, downloaded & printed off the documentation, and UPS did the rest.
Never even packaged it up (apart from original Petzl product box). UPS will look after that.

 

[The Real McCoy]

Absolutely. Which ones did you find? Spell check gets funny on me and my grammar isn't the best

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[kyle goddard]

Id like a zz for small prune jobs and crane work. All else id use my HH. I do.carry a hank of 10mm armor prus on a beiner for a taughtline. I only use it for a second tie in on the other end of my line.

 

[FanOFatherNash]

Get em a line with a spliced end, saddle and lanyard, handsaw and...http://www.treestuff.com/store/catalog.asp?category_id=161&item=9090

Send em up a easy climber after some training on pruning from the ground first. Watch em. Let em do harder and harder pruning jobs. No knots to learn, just learn to climb and position for cuts. Then move em up to rigging.

I thought best tool for climber was that nifty remote control , knuckle boom crane , mike poor has

 

[CanopyGorilla]

Yawn smilie...Wraptor.

Sorry, did you miss where I said "$100 cheaper"? the Wraptor is over $2,000 and I show up to a job site with my own gear. When I feel I am too old and slow to haul myself into a tree anymore I will invest, but until then I try to spend my money on things outside of work and let my climbing speak for itself. I'm not saying I'm the best climber in the world, just sayin I don't need the over priced wheel chair ramp yet.

 

[treevet]

It is a money maker for production...off topic...Wraptor...nothing less. It makes money ultimately, not costs money. I paid it off with a days profit.

See ya in a few days for your response

 

[CanopyGorilla]

It is a money maker for production...off topic...Wraptor...nothing less. It makes money ultimately, not costs money. I paid it off with a days profit.

See ya in a few days for your response

I'm Sure it is great. My point is that I buy my own climbing gear and I am an employee not an employer. I do everything I can to keep production moving and keep the big man happy, but if that means spending $2500 of my take home money to shave a few minutes off of his job time, no thanks. If you want to call him and convince him of the merits.....but he is a cheap bastard. Back to the ZZ. I would be more interested if it could be used SRT. I would use one if I had one, not saying its not a good tool. I would love to try it but for another $275 I will just stick with my HH that I am very happy with. My other point is that even if the ZZ is a good tool and a time saver people with little to no knowledge of how to tie knots shouldn't be all that high off the ground using any system.

 

[treevet]

I'm Sure it is great. My point is that I buy my own climbing gear and I am an employee not an employer. I do everything I can to keep production moving and keep the big man happy, but if that means spending $2500 of my take home money to shave a few minutes off of his job time, no thanks. If you want to call him and convince him of the merits.....but he is a cheap bastard. Back to the ZZ. I would be more interested if it could be used SRT. I would use one if I had one, not saying its not a good tool. I would love to try it but for another $275 I will just stick with my HH that I am very happy with. My other point is that even if the ZZ is a good tool and a time saver people with little to no knowledge of how to tie knots shouldn't be all that high off the ground using any system.

I just can't get on board with the SRT but I know it can be used (zz on srt) they just don't authorize it. With SRT my anchor line is always getting in the way at some point. I know it is in vogue like Blakes, then the seperate hitch cord, then the hitch climber set up and now to look contempory you have to say you fly SRT. SRT is fine for up but no advantage down even though they tout re directs ....when you redirect you then eliminate the high TIP that gave you an advantage to working the other part of the tree except where you redirected to. I think srt is very dangerous except in climbing contests where you are not using a chsaw etc and doing production work quickly.

 

[CanopyGorilla]

I just can't get on board with the SRT but I know it can be used (zz on srt) they just don't authorize it. With SRT my anchor line is always getting in the way at some point. I know it is in vogue like Blakes, then the seperate hitch cord, then the hitch climber set up and now to look contempory you have to say you fly SRT. SRT is fine for up but no advantage down even though they tout re directs ....when you redirect you then eliminate the high TIP that gave you an advantage to working the other part of the tree except where you redirected to. I think srt is very dangerous except in climbing contests where you are not using a chsaw etc and doing production work quickly.

I agree with some of your points. I only tend to use it when I have long climbs before I enter the canopy, like when I am deadwooding up a pine that has the first live branch at 60ft. 1 to 1 is more efficient than 2 to 1 for stuff like that. I always toss my flipline around the trunk before using my saw weather its SRT or Ddrt. I don't get the argument how SRT is more dangerous around a saw. If you cut your rope in either configuration you fall. Ddrt doesn't mean you have two ropes, it just means that your rope is doubled over, cut one side and your not tied in anymore. I guess it would take a smaller knick with more weight on one line, but a chainsaw will cut through either fairly efficiently. Thats why I tie in twice.