large oak prune advice

[jimmy shannon]

Hey guys,got a very big oak tree that appears to be in decent shape.A moderate amount of suckers and one limb high up shows some fungus,have not been up tree yet to see if there is more but none is visible from the ground beyond that.There are two lower limbs that extend out toward some lines that were hacked away,leaving an ugly mess of suckers and exposed wounds,not cut back to laterals or collars.My thoughts on these two limbs is to remove them.My approach thus far is to remove deadwood which is minimal, take out those two lower limbs,remove moderate sucker growth and thin out the crown.
There is also several large limbs that were lion tailed and have suckered some what.Theres also a handful of badly done cuts that are leaving suckered out stubs, cut those back to the collars obviously.The roof was recently remodeled and the trunk of the tree is just touching the gutter[will this get worse over time} this tree is easily six foot wide at base,will it continue to edge into the structure? im guessing yes. Not much to do there i guess till it cracks the roof. Lastly there are two cables that were placed poorly{in small limbs that will break off before they stop the main leaders from separating} there appears to be quite a bit of slack in the cables. The trunk diverges from a tight v crotch up into two large leaders. thoughts...suggestions.

thanks

 

[beastmaster]

Have any pictures? Most important thing about Oaks I believe is moderation. Most my experience is with Live oaks, and with them it doesn't hurt them to be full. Dead wooding and maybe some crown thinning if its really thick, same with the tips, Removing limbs that grow streight down can open up the interior and give some space under the tree. Big limbs over 8 or so inches more then likely won't heal if cut, even if its at the branch callor, allowing decay and rot to enter the main trunk, not to mention the lost of a food and storage sorce, this can effect the Oak, weaking it and causing it to sucker out.
If the large limbs to be removed are attached to the trunk, a controversial practice is to leave a long stub, cut off at a node. This can slow down or prevent decay from getting to the trunk, looks like crap, but if the trees health is importent can be a wise move.

 

[jimmy shannon]

Have any pictures? Most important thing about Oaks I believe is moderation. Most my experience is with Live oaks, and with them it doesn't hurt them to be full. Dead wooding and maybe some crown thinning if its really thick, same with the tips, Removing limbs that grow streight down can open up the interior and give some space under the tree. Big limbs over 8 or so inches more then likely won't heal if cut, even if its at the branch callor, allowing decay and rot to enter the main trunk, not to mention the lost of a food and storage sorce, this can effect the Oak, weaking it and causing it to sucker out.
If the large limbs to be removed are attached to the trunk, a controversial practice is to leave a long stub, cut off at a node. This can slow down or prevent decay from getting to the trunk, looks like crap, but if the trees health is importent can be a wise move.

I think its a red oak..im in cape cod mass here. I have never heard of that practice of cutting o a node..there are several of those cuts evident,which i attributed to unskilled pruning.Th owner is concerned about the thing falling on his restaurant.Ill get some pics today...thanks for the info.

 

[jimmy shannon]

I think its a red oak..im in cape cod mass here. I have never heard of that practice of cutting o a node..there are several of those cuts evident,which i attributed to unskilled pruning.Th owner is concerned about the thing falling on his restaurant.Ill get some pics today...thanks for the info.

trying to download some pics..

 

[jimmy shannon]

Have any pictures? Most important thing about Oaks I believe is moderation. Most my experience is with Live oaks, and with them it doesn't hurt them to be full. Dead wooding and maybe some crown thinning if its really thick, same with the tips, Removing limbs that grow streight down can open up the interior and give some space under the tree. Big limbs over 8 or so inches more then likely won't heal if cut, even if its at the branch callor, allowing decay and rot to enter the main trunk, not to mention the lost of a food and storage sorce, this can effect the Oak, weaking it and causing it to sucker out.
If the large limbs to be removed are attached to the trunk, a controversial practice is to leave a long stub, cut off at a node. This can slow down or prevent decay from getting to the trunk, looks like crap, but if the trees health is importent can be a wise move.

heres some pics

 

[beastmaster]

Looks like the line clearance guys have been cutting that tree back for decades. As ugly as them cuts look, the tree would really be off balanced if they were removed. The shorter ugly stubs have probably already healed(any of them rotten?)and cutting them back for artistic purposes would only open the wounds up again. I don't know the species of Oak tree that is, but it looks like it was lioned tailed at one time with all the interior growth removed and all the growth concentrated in the crown. I'm not to familiar with the red oak family.
That discoloration, is that wet wood leaking under the bark? I would inspect the root crown really well. I hate working on trees that have so many issues. You have to make a lot of judgement calls.
The tree I bet looks nice when its all leafed out. I would thin out some of the weaker growth in the crown and dead wood, that would probably thin it about right. selectively prune those headed off limbs that have growth on them, and remove any long stubs that are mostly dead, leaving the short stubs left from bad pruning practices that were over 4 in. thick.
That is just my arm chair opinion while Im sitting here in my favorite chair drinking coffee. Ultimately you have to make the calls. Nothing wrong with asking advice, but also don't hesitate to crack a book or google any questions you have. Experience isn't nothing without knowledge.

 

[jimmy shannon]

Looks like the line clearance guys have been cutting that tree back for decades. As ugly as them cuts look, the tree would really be off balanced if they were removed. The shorter ugly stubs have probably already healed(any of them rotten?)and cutting them back for artistic purposes would only open the wounds up again. I don't know the species of Oak tree that is, but it looks like it was lioned tailed at one time with all the interior growth removed and all the growth concentrated in the crown. I'm not to familiar with the red oak family.
That discoloration, is that wet wood leaking under the bark? I would inspect the root crown really well. I hate working on trees that have so many issues. You have to make a lot of judgement calls.
The tree I bet looks nice when its all leafed out. I would thin out some of the weaker growth in the crown and dead wood, that would probably thin it about right. selectively prune those headed off limbs that have growth on them, and remove any long stubs that are mostly dead, leaving the short stubs left from bad pruning practices that were over 4 in. thick.
That is just my arm chair opinion while Im sitting here in my favorite chair drinking coffee. Ultimately you have to make the calls. Nothing wrong with asking advice, but also don't hesitate to crack a book or google any questions you have. Experience isn't nothing without knowledge.

yea, i know,it has a lot of issues it seems to me which is why im researching before i move forward. I sent some pics to my old boss who is certified and more experienced than me when it comes to disease diagnosis.Maybe i should give him a price for removal as well.he seems real nervous about it damaging the building. i can already see the picket lines gathering in protest.Weve had three nasty storms this winter and the tree is totally unscathed.Its a tight v crotch on those leaders but theres two old cables up there. Thanks for the input,ill keep at it.

 

[jimmy shannon]

yea, i know,it has a lot of issues it seems to me which is why im researching before i move forward. I sent some pics to my old boss who is certified and more experienced than me when it comes to disease diagnosis.Maybe i should give him a price for removal as well.he seems real nervous about it damaging the building. i can already see the picket lines gathering in protest.Weve had three nasty storms this winter and the tree is totally unscathed.Its a tight v crotch on those leaders but theres two old cables up there. Thanks for the input,ill keep at it.

Here are some better pics with better light.....do you consider this tree an overt hazard in any way?

 

[beastmaster]

Here are some better pics with better light.....do you consider this tree an overt hazard in any way?

I think if it has lasted this long its not going to split anytime soon. I would be more concerned with the grade change around the tree, what's happening there? Were roots cut. The no# 1 thing that makes a tree a hazard is what it'll fall on if it did go. Looks like that home would be dust, and the high voltage would probably go too.
Make sure you inspect the root flair area and root system really well. Poor tree been abused a lot, wouldn't be surprising if it was in decline, also is that moss on the branches or something else?
I doubt its an overt hazard , but I would be guarded about giving an opinion that might come back and haunt you down the line.

 

[jimmy shannon]

I think if it has lasted this long its not going to split anytime soon. I would be more concerned with the grade change around the tree, what's happening there? Were roots cut. The no# 1 thing that makes a tree a hazard is what it'll fall on if it did go. Looks like that home would be dust, and the high voltage would probably go too.
Make sure you inspect the root flair area and root system really well. Poor tree been abused a lot, wouldn't be surprising if it was in decline, also is that moss on the branches or something else?
I doubt its an overt hazard , but I would be guarded about giving an opinion that might come back and haunt you down the line.

Its actually a high end french bakery and restaurant.I asked him about the construction that had been recently done and he assured me that the grade around the base was maintained and that saving the tree was a high priority. Its moss on the branches. Theres two cables up there,both appear fairly old.Perhaps replacement is in order.Thanks for the input,ive got my old boss coming down to take a look at it to. Trying to avoid the haunting scenario..thanks for the input.

 

[woodchuck357]

I love old trees and sometimes refuse to remove trees that are healthy, I know someone else will do it, but not me. That said, if that tree was that close to MY house, it would be taken down.

 

[buzz sawyer]

I love old trees and sometimes refuse to remove trees that are healthy, I know someone else will do it, but not me. That said, if that tree was that close to MY house, it would be taken down.

I'm inclined to agree. I can't believe the roots were not affected by the landscaping. If tree does survive, it's only going to get bigger and it looks like it's against the gutters now.

 

[jimmy shannon]

I'm inclined to agree. I can't believe the roots were not affected by the landscaping. If tree does survive, it's only going to get bigger and it looks like it's against the gutters now.

Yea its touching the gutters now.These gutters were installed less than six months ago and at the time i believe there was a bit of clearance. The guy absolutely wont take it down on my say so alone.He is committed to its future as am i. Im going to get bartlett to come give it a serious assessment and take it from there.Really want to cover myself on this one.Thanks for all the input.

 

[jimmy shannon]

Yea its touching the gutters now.These gutters were installed less than six months ago and at the time i believe there was a bit of clearance. The guy absolutely wont take it down on my say so alone.He is committed to its future as am i. Im going to get bartlett to come give it a serious assessment and take it from there.Really want to cover myself on this one.Thanks for all the input.

so heres an update on the large oak tree.I brought in bartlett to do an assessment to cover my ass. Found a nice hollow spot
near some included bark at the v crotch where the two main leaders begin. There sending some scrapings to a lab to check for some kind of disease. they recommended the removal of the large lower limb left,which i did.Lots of fun.all of it had to be lowered onto the roof,cut up and chunked down to avoid overloading the roof with weight. (pictures included}Spider leg came in handy for bringing the pieces down level,porta wrap made it a cinch to be gentle. They suggested two huge steel rods inserted at leader connection at base.Install drains in court yard to facilitate water penetration to root system and finally a fertilization. I took out major deadwood and tried to clean up the mess the electric company made. So thats it,shes lives to see another storm or two here on cape cod.

 

[peetar]

You covered your butt by having the third party assesment done.

That said, I was surprised that they signed off on that tree, in that spot, over a commercial building.

Others will hate you for spike climbing a live tree and rip you for lack of a hemet, but the experts recommended you make a 2ft. wound in the tree, and tying in and setting a rigging line created much less damage (with spikes).

 

[beastmaster]

You handled that pretty well. I'm assuming by your skill level and open desire to do what's best for the tree you only gaffed the branch you were removing. I think you'll go far in this business.

 

[jimmy shannon]

You covered your butt by having the third party assesment done.

That said, I was surprised that they signed off on that tree, in that spot, over a commercial building.

Others will hate you for spike climbing a live tree and rip you for lack of a hemet, but the experts recommended you make a 2ft. wound in the tree, and tying in and setting a rigging line created much less damage (with spikes).

I only spiked on the limb being removed. The idea behind the removal and creating the wound was to take weight of the already compromised included bark area at the base........helmuts in the mail.

 

[jimmy shannon]

You handled that pretty well. I'm assuming by your skill level and open desire to do what's best for the tree you only gaffed the branch you were removing. I think you'll go far in this business.

Of course..would never spike a standing tree. Alot has changed since i left.Im an old school blake and tautline climber. Im coming back after a long hiatus. Love the new gear thats on the market.The porta wrap is a phenomenal tool.Been experimenting with various climbing hitches. trying different eye to eyes with the hitch climber.seems to take alot of experimenting to get the right combo of line and prusik. Thanks for the input.

 

[Tree Pig]

Personally I would consider talking to them about cabling. The inclusion already showing some good amounts of wet wood. This is a good example of a valued tree worth putting the extra money into.

 

[jimmy shannon]

Personally I would consider talking to them about cabling. The inclusion already showing some good amounts of wet wood. This is a good example of a valued tree worth putting the extra money into.

Yes I neglected to mention.They also recommended two cables.all in all its about two grand worth of work.Well worth it.