Lowering Deadfall, Seeking Advice, See Photos

[MtnHermit]

I need to lower this deadfall so I can continue to block it. It is supported by the vertical limb which I can now safely cut out of the fall zone.

What sequence of cuts will allow me to drop the log without binding the B&C? The limb is noticeably fractured where it joins the trunk, does that matter?

Thanks for any advice.

 

[Sport Faller]

It looks to me like the rocks are holding most of the weight of the log so I wouldn't think it would have much pressure on it at all, if it does then I'd just cut another block off the log and cut the big limb off when it's on the ground, remember, if it all possible stand above it so you have less of a chance of getting crunched if the log does break free and decide to stretch it legs a lil' bit (remember Jim's Dad in The Man From Snowy River..... don't be like that guy)

 

[Billy_Bob]

Good example of how you need to be sort of a "structural engineer" to figure out where these trees / logs are going to roll when you cut this or that!

I would stand at the end or the log (not on the downhill side as that looks to be where it might roll), then make a couple of cuts on that supporting limb near the ground allowing a few inches of limb to bend, then see what happens to the log - where it wants to go. (Sort of slowly release the energy in the log, like with a springpole.)

However I would do that with a long bar saw, where I could be back from the log a bit, not the short bar saw pictured!

It could go downhill to the left on the first picture. Or come towards you standing at the end. But if you just cut a little off the supporting limb near the ground, then most of that supporting limb will remain and keep it from moving very far.

You could also tie a rope to it and anchor it to something uphill if not sure where it will go.

Also I would wait for other people to come along and comment on what they would do. Then you can use the best suggestion(s).

 

[MtnHermit]

It looks to me like the rocks are holding most of the weight of the log so I wouldn't think it would have much pressure on it at all, if it does then I'd just cut another block off the log and cut the big limb off when it's on the ground, remember, if it all possible stand above it so you have less of a chance of getting crunched if the log does break free and decide to stretch it legs a lil' bit (remember Jim's Dad in The Man From Snowy River..... don't be like that guy)

Thanks for the reply. Photos can be deceiving.

There is nothing supporting that 20-foot trunk between the root and the vertical limb. To cut the last block, I had to stand on the pair of blocks you see the chainsaw on, not the most stable. In order to cut off another block, it would now be in top bind, which means a bottom up cut chest high or above, I'm not strong enough to do that. Besides it would but me in the fall zone, very dangerous. I have no idea where that big fella is going, certainly down and left.

Is it possible to just weaken and pop that vertical limb left?

Thanks

 

[Sport Faller]

Thanks for the reply. Photos can be deceiving.

There is nothing supporting that 20-foot trunk between the root and the vertical limb. To cut the last block, I had to stand on the pair of blocks you see the chainsaw on, not the most stable. In order to cut off another block, it would now be in top bind, which means a bottom up cut chest high or above, I'm not strong enough to do that. Besides it would but me in the fall zone, very dangerous. I have no idea where that big fella is going, certainly down and left.

Is it possible to just weaken and pop that vertical limb left?

Thanks

Damn, I read those pics all wrong, it looked like it was supported by rocks most of the way, in that case, I'd do like billy bob said and stand at the end and start weakening that supporting limb, and make damn sure I wasn't in the crunch zone when it decides to let loose and start swingin

 

[MtnHermit]

Damn, I read those pics all wrong, it looked like it was supported by rocks most of the way, in that case, I'd do like billy bob said and stand at the end and start weakening that supporting limb, and make damn sure I wasn't in the crunch zone when it decides to let loose and start swingin

That's exactly the advice I need. Please suggest a cut sequence.

Thanks

 

[Sport Faller]

That's exactly the advice I need. Please suggest a cut sequence.

Thanks

I'd go like Billy Bob and start slowly taking a little kerf out of the limb, go slow and read what it's doing each time you dig a little bit deeper, maybe kinda gnaw your way around the front and sides (all the while staying as far away as possible) like a beaver and sooner or later she'll go. If she starts to go back towards the rocks, take a little nip out of the front and vice versa

EDIT: I forgot to ask, is it close enough to the truck to get a cable on? if so, horse that ####er out of there and bob it up when it's not all loaded up

 

[MtnHermit]

Good example of how you need to be sort of a "structural engineer" to figure out where these trees / logs are going to roll when you cut this or that!

Totally agree, that's why I posted, hoping for a "been there, done that" reply.

As to the bar length, that's my "big" saw.

Thanks

 

[RandyMac]

take an axe to it

 

[MtnHermit]

I'd go like Billy Bob and start slowly taking a little kerf out of the limb, go slow and read what it's doing each time you dig a little bit deeper, maybe kinda gnaw your way around the front and sides (all the while staying as far away as possible) like a beaver and sooner or later she'll go. If she starts to go back towards the rocks, take a little nip out of the front and vice versa

Good analogy, those pesky little guys figured it out a million years ago.
That helped me more than anything.

EDIT: I forgot to ask, is it close enough to the truck to get a cable on? if so, horse that ####er out of there and bob it up when it's not all loaded up

1/4-mile. I'm tossing the blocks over a 30' cliff, will later drive below to haul them out. Took me a couple of years to figure out a drivable path. Before that I just looked and dreamed.

 

[Sport Faller]

Good analogy, those pesky little guys figured it out a million years ago.
That helped me more than anything.


1/4-mile. I'm tossing the blocks over a 30' cliff, will later drive below to haul them out. Took me a couple of years to figure out a drivable path. Before that I just looked and dreamed.

Damn, that's some firewoodin that'll put hair on your peaches
too bad you're not around here, I'd call in sick tomorrow and we'd go knock that muh ####er out

 

[slowp]

take an axe to it

This might be a good idea. If I understand correctly, you were trying to cut on it from THE DOWNHILL SIDE??

If so, you may want to start over on logs that are on flat ground, then move on to working on a hillside from the uphill side of the log, with a saw that can keep you in a safer place to stand.

 

[AT sawyer]

Unless I'm reading the pictures wrong, the trunk is (somewhat) supported by the fractured limb and you want to roll the tree down to a safer cutting position. Do you have enough room to insert a big handspike? Assuming you've already removed the crown and upper branches, there should be plenty of wood around to make a 15' pole and lever the whole thing into a safer spot. Plus, it will keep you well away from the downhill when it rolls.

 

[MtnHermit]

Damn, that's some firewoodin that'll put hair on your peaches
too bad you're not around here, I'd call in sick tomorrow and we'd go knock that muh ####er out

Because you clearly have the passion, thought you'd enjoy this one from today:

Different camera, different position, from lower. As you can see the cutting position gets progressively lower as the log gets higher. It's almost 8-feet to the top of the log now and getting higher fast.

I hiked the drivable path today, still 2" of snow, won't attempt until its dry, could be a couple of months.

 

[MtnHermit]

Unless I'm reading the pictures wrong, the trunk is (somewhat) supported by the fractured limb and you want to roll the tree down to a safer cutting position. Do you have enough room to insert a big handspike? Assuming you've already removed the crown and upper branches, there should be plenty of wood around to make a 15' pole and lever the whole thing into a safer spot. Plus, it will keep you well away from the downhill when it rolls.

This pic might explain better:

The large rock, far left, has a natural saddle prevented it from rolling. Besides the root is still wedged in the rock. Conceivably I could use a limb log, build a skid and cut the log free of the root and have it roll/slide to my working platform. Not sure I'm strong enough to get a sufficient limb into position.

My current plan is to drop the right side by weakening the vertical limb using Bigskyjake's beaver analogy. I'm confident I can be out of harms way doing that. At least it'll be lower and I can drop a block at a time. Shorter, lighter, more manageable with each block removed.

Don't know what a handspike is, do you know of a photo?

Thanks

 

[Gologit]

Do you plan on standing downhill from the log?

 

[Gologit]

Man, what did we ever do before the internet?

It was terrible! Some times we had to actually have somebody show us how to do something. If there wasn't an experienced person available sometimes we had to figure things out all by ourselves using nothing but native intelligence and common sense.

I do remember being told not to stand downhill from the cut, though. I think I was about three years old. Four maybe.

 

[bitzer]

Get above the log. Buck off the entire far side so the bar tip is pointing to the ground and the pistol grip is pointing to the sky as you are about halfway through the log. Cut top down now on the near side until it starts to bind (or not). This will tell you two things about the pressure on the log. If the far side kerf opens or closes and the near top kerf opens or closes will give you an idea of horizontal and vertical bind. Make the final cuts accordingly. You could also cripple that limb somewhat so when the chunk breaks loose the limb does too. You should be able to do it without a wedge, but a wedge will make it a lot easier for you. Don't stand on the down hill side.

 

[hammerlogging]

Apart from your obvious desire to continue bucking this thing up from tip to butt, I have to say that you may want to consider a drastically different approach, bucking the stem at a place where you have great footing and a great ability to spring away if it moves more or differently than expected. This couls be 10 or 15 feet down the stem. Sometimes falling timber I have to buck things I otherwise wouldn't just to make something like this situation do-able but safe enough to be possible- probably lots of us do. Then from this cut forward perhaps and hopefully the whole thing will move and settle in a way that makes this busted limb cut a no-brainer.

Thats part of where "#### the hookers" comes from- a stem that should have come out in one piece is cut in half so they're hooking a seperate 12 footer or something (ok in HW country).

 

[AT sawyer]

Don't know what a handspike is, do you know of a photo?

Thanks

Handspike is any long pole used to give you better leverage:

View attachment 213757

Another thing -- your tree appears to have a loose rootball and is laying across a couple big rocks. Watch out for pivot points, as they can swing that tree in an unexpected direction once you change the balance by removing crown end wood:
Forestry Accident: Bucked tree pivots, killing faller - YouTube