Mention backlog before going on estimate?

[TreeAce]

I am slammed with work (IMHO) at six weeks out. Last weekend I didnt get a job because of it. No biggie really except that I spent almost an hour at the guys house. Nice guy but not that nice cuz I got way better things to do with my very limited time. I also gave some estimates lately that when the HO asks me how soon i could be here n I tell them 4-6 weeks they looked at me like I was an idiot. Should I mention it BEFORE going on the estimate or will that just scare of people cuz it sounds bad? Or will it save me running around and wasting my time on people who think it will be done next week?

 

[Grace Tree]

Unless they start by telling me there's an emergency, usually tell them that I'm booked 3 or 4 weeks out right at the start of the conversation and so far, that's weeded out the ones that need it done yesterday. My wife had to break me of the habit of telling people I was 3 or 4 weeks behind instead of booked.
Phil

 

[Toddppm]

A biz consultant once mentioned going to every single call you get just for the face time and recognition. Even if a tiny job. I have a decent minimum bbut usually dont mention it as i will try to upsell a bigger job if possible.
if they start out sounding like theyre in a big hurry and sound like theyre willing to pay extra for faster service ill go. Otherwise ill tell them how long it will be.

If they sound wacky. Then they get the were backed up for months speech. But some of the wacky ones turn out to be huge jobs sonetimes

 

[802climber]

I think it sounds GOOD to be several weeks out as a small company because it shows that there is a lot of demand for your services in particular. It kinda tells the HO that give a #### they better sign the contract if they want You or else they will have to go with someone lesser than You. I have had HO take weeks to collect bids and end up going with me, and low and behold I was several MORE weeks out by the time they gave me the go ahead.

There is obviously a market for "instant" service but if you are trying to weed people out that will waste your time I think mentioning you are a few weeks out is a great idea. I think it makes them feel like I must be worth waiting for.

I also find it hilarious which customers are happy to wait, and which want it done yesterday. Actual situation often seems to defy logic.

 

[TreeAce]

I should have worded the "scares people" part differently. What I mean is more like it sounds discouraging. Like if you ask someone if they are willing to wait 5-6 weeks they just say no off the top of there head without really thinking it through. I didn't mean bad like it makes me or my company look bad.

 

[802climber]

I should have worded the "scares people" part differently. What I mean is more like it sounds discouraging. Like if you ask someone if they are willing to wait 5-6 weeks they just say no off the top of there head without really thinking it through. I didn't mean bad like it makes me or my company look bad.

Yeah I hear ya. I don't know how big of jobs you're bidding on, but maybe just telling them you're 2-3 weeks out but you can try to fit them in. So you don't make it sound too discouraging, but like there is a lot of demand for your services in particular. That might give them a good impression, if they think just a little bit.

Around here, I think the guys who show up same day, guns blazing seen too desperate.

 

[mikewhite85]

I once was looking for a doctor due to some minor health problem (don't even remember what it was!) but I called around and a lot of them were all booked out. I ended up finally finding one that could see me the same day. Long story short there was a reason why he wasn't booked out- he was an awful doctor and really kind of a shyster! The same can also apply to tree work. A good company is typically booked out a little ways.

It's not always the case but the guys who can do it tomorrow are often the guys who don't have a lot of work for a reason. That said, sometimes even the good guys get slow. I had a job or two not too long ago that I booked the next day. Right now I am out about a week and a half. Had a crazy lady in Bel Air I had bid on weeks ago called me yesterday and wanted me to do her job right away and asked if I could do it Saturday. I said no I spend time with my family on Saturdays. She told me it was an emergency and said I should make time for her. I told her my family is more important than her! She then asked if I could do it Sunday...

Was actually a good job but I hope she never calls back.

 

[imagineero]

Having more work than you can handle means you can target certain market segments and avoid others. Some customers are really just too painful to deal with, and those who are demanding are pretty close to the top of my list.

Being a tree worker is no different from being a builder, electrician or mechanic. They're all expert skills, and people hire them because of it. I can't imagine that a good builder would stand by and let a customer direct them on how and when a house was to be built or be micromanaged. Good builders are booked out years in advance sometimes. Demanding customers are often the kind that want to tell you exactly how the job is to be done, at a specific time etc... No thanks!

Since last year I do all my quoting on a saturday. It works out well for me and is economical both in time and fuel. Because of it, I can spend a little more time at each customers job demonstrating my skill. This means I can sell my jobs at a premium. I let my customers know what time I can be in their area, if they aren't happy with it or demand a certain time I let them know it can always be the following saturday. They are getting more than a quote - they're getting a short consultation. That's worth something, and I'm giving it out for free but they need to be flexible on the time.

I also tell them up front about our schedule, but give it a little twist;

"But I need my tree done as soon as possible!"
"is it an emergency?"
"well, not really, but I want it done quickly"
"I think you'll find that most good tree companies are booked out in advance. If you're happy with a low quality job there are some guys who can probably come today"
"........"

Shaun

 

[TimberMcPherson]

I just tell them we are very popular and there are companies that have less work on than we do but probably for good or not so good reason.

I generally get some patience from clients after that

 

[Iustinian]

I very much agree

We are booked through December and starting to fill appointments into January. We do bids two days a week, and work five days a week.

I also have a few pitches when it comes to timing of schedules when people start to complain:

I can offer a next week price or a put us on the schedule price; I explain that if they are willing to pay much more for urgency, then I have customers that will be willing to reschedule for a discount, which the I need it done right now customer will be paying for.

Also, there are are three important considerations in a service business: timing, price, and quality. It's very difficult to get all three, most of the time you have to be willing to choose 2 of the 3; i.e. we can give you the best quality and best price if you are willing to sacrifice a bit in the timing aspect; or we can give you the best quality and choice of timing if you are willing to pay more; most people are not willing to sacrifice in quality.

Also, I've been able to keep the urgency in maintenance pruning down by encouraging winter pruning; less stress/pruning shock to the tree, increased pest and disease control. Pruning during the growing season removes terminal buds and reduces apical dominance, increasing the likelihood that the tree will fill up with epicormic (sucker) growth, so winter pruning helps the trimming hold its aesthethic value longer, especially in species that are prone to sucker growth (ash, crabapple, etc.)

It does seem to defy logic, as the previous poster has said; I have a lady calling in about our recent ad, wanting low branches nearly teaching the ground to be trimmed immediately -- and I can tell the branches are like 5-7 years old; why the sudden rush? the only reason you called was because of the coupon pricing, not because the branches that have been there for years need trimmed today. lol

We've also tried to leave 2-4 days a month unscheduled for catch-up (weather, breakdowns, etc.) and urgent jobs -- that seems to help keep us from pulling our hair completely out as well.

 

[treeclimber101]

I don't put anything on for a Friday that way if it rains or we have something pop up of importance we have a day to make it work , but some of these backlogs you guys are talking about are amazing , I mean December , really ? My question is if your gonna book that far out my question is why and what's your strategy ? Because that just seems crazy to me , and I am not doubting you but do you work slow or what ? Or are the only guy in the area ?

 

[tree MDS]

Typically, If I get real busy, I just start working saturdays and sundays. Do my regular work during the week, and put any new jobs that can't wait on the weekends. That's just me though, I don't mind going 6 or 7 days if the work is there. I find days off more draining (lol) than treework.

 

[Toddppm]

We are booked through December and starting to fill appointments into January. We do bids two days a week, and work five days a week.

I also have a few pitches when it comes to timing of schedules when people start to complain:

I can offer a next week price or a put us on the schedule price; I explain that if they are willing to pay much more for urgency, then I have customers that will be willing to reschedule for a discount, which the I need it done right now customer will be paying for.

Also, there are are three important considerations in a service business: timing, price, and quality. It's very difficult to get all three, most of the time you have to be willing to choose 2 of the 3; i.e. we can give you the best quality and best price if you are willing to sacrifice a bit in the timing aspect; or we can give you the best quality and choice of timing if you are willing to pay more; most people are not willing to sacrifice in quality.

Also, I've been able to keep the urgency in maintenance pruning down by encouraging winter pruning; less stress/pruning shock to the tree, increased pest and disease control. Pruning during the growing season removes terminal buds and reduces apical dominance, increasing the likelihood that the tree will fill up with epicormic (sucker) growth, so winter pruning helps the trimming hold its aesthethic value longer, especially in species that are prone to sucker growth (ash, crabapple, etc.)

It does seem to defy logic, as the previous poster has said; I have a lady calling in about our recent ad, wanting low branches nearly teaching the ground to be trimmed immediately -- and I can tell the branches are like 5-7 years old; why the sudden rush? the only reason you called was because of the coupon pricing, not because the branches that have been there for years need trimmed today. lol

We've also tried to leave 2-4 days a month unscheduled for catch-up (weather, breakdowns, etc.) and urgent jobs -- that seems to help keep us from pulling our hair completely out as well.

Man, if you are consistently booked out that far it's time for another crew. I wish.

 

[OLD MAN GRINDER]

I allways bid the job first and then ask the customer how soon they need it done, if it
is urgent for a good reason i will try to work it in even if i have to work saturday,,,sunday
never,,,,most of the tree services i do stumps for are booked up for 2-3 months, they are
starting to catch up now as we are coming into the holiday season and things usually
slow down a little bit, sometimes they need a job done right away as it is holding up their
money, but that doesn't happen often, overall it has not been a big problem for me, i have
been booked up 4-6 wks out ever since april and no complaints....

Bob...

 

[TreeAce]

After doing estimates today i have 28 full days of work sold. i try to do jobs monday -friday and leave weekends for estimates and family. So that translates into 6 weeks of work in my mind. Anyway i think I am gonna just keep doing what i have been which is just do the estimates and mention it when the time comes. EXCEPT when there is a reason that i feel like I wanna mention it over the phone before I even go look at the job. I guess every call needs its own evaluation. Seems like today everybody i talked to was mostly concerned with price. Last week it was "If I hire you how soon will you be here?"

 

[Grace Tree]

If you get in a position where you need a lift again, let me know. I'm on the injured reserve list for a couple months but I could save you some $$ over a rental. I'm 60 miles from Avon Lake.
Phil

 

[Blakesmaster]

I don't put anything on for a Friday that way if it rains or we have something pop up of importance we have a day to make it work , but some of these backlogs you guys are talking about are amazing , I mean December , really ? My question is if your gonna book that far out my question is why and what's your strategy ? Because that just seems crazy to me , and I am not doubting you but do you work slow or what ? Or are the only guy in the area ?

Kinda what I was thinking. I know everyone's situation is different, but for me, if I'm booked out more than 3 weeks, I'm looking at buying more equipment, or hiring more help, whatever it takes. At the very least I bump my prices up. I can handle losing work because I cost too much, losing it cause I can't get to it in time is not even something that would cross my mind.

I guess if you're satisfied doing what you do, at the pace that you do it now, then by all means, add to that backlog. But if you want to grow, you gotta up your game. Just saying. Even adding something as cheap as a skid steer, a second chip truck, chipper, etc. could get that work done quicker. ####, I'd call that crazy midget treeslayer or another contract climber to run another crew.

 

[treeman75]

The last week or so the phone has been crazy. I have almost three weeks of work and picking up a job or two everyday. When I sell a job I tell them I will put it on the schedule and that is about three weeks, they dont say much most of the time. I am bring on an extra climber and ground guy until I get caught up, trying to make as much as I can before winter. I am scheduling work for the winter now too. If it is easy access and not too much snow we will work in the winter, otherwise I take a couple months off.

 

[treeclimber101]

Kinda what I was thinking. I know everyone's situation is different, but for me, if I'm booked out more than 3 weeks, I'm looking at buying more equipment, or hiring more help, whatever it takes. At the very least I bump my prices up. I can handle losing work because I cost too much, losing it cause I can't get to it in time is not even something that would cross my mind.

I guess if you're satisfied doing what you do, at the pace that you do it now, then by all means, add to that backlog. But if you want to grow, you gotta up your game. Just saying. Even adding something as cheap as a skid steer, a second chip truck, chipper, etc. could get that work done quicker. ####, I'd call that crazy midget treeslayer or another contract climber to run another crew.

All kidding aside I have a chance to buy back my old top kick 94 forestry with a 55 ft alc , best part is its got a new trans all new tires and has been repainted ! Basically my buddy bought it rebuild it and wants to sell it back for 2 thousand more then what he bought it for , it's a no brainier and it's got the 3126 cat with a 2 speed rear ! I dunno I just have such a different opinion about my future this year then last !

 

[TreeAce]

If you get in a position where you need a lift again, let me know. I'm on the injured reserve list for a couple months but I could save you some $$ over a rental. I'm 60 miles from Avon Lake.
Phil

Sorry to hear your not 100%. I will def keep you in mind. Do you have a chipper to rent? Mine has been acting funny. It cut out the other day and I thought I had it fixed but it cut out again today. I got a guy gonna take a look in the morning. I dread the thought of taking it out to Vermeer. Who knows how long they could have it. Hopefully the problem will be solved in the morning.