Newbie To This Forum and Questions About Modifications

[apn73]

Hello All,
New to this forum, but not all that new to chainsaws. I've got a Stihl MS 361 that I bought new in '07 and use it to keep the family warm during the balmy New Hampshire winters. I cut 8-10 cords of green hardwood per year with it, plus the typical chores around a gentleman's farm. All in all pretty light use for this saw, after describing my plans of buying wood by the grapple load (full log truck load actually, straight rig) to the local Stihl dealer he recommended two saws, MS 310 and MS 361. I chose the ladder because I didn't want have to buy another one any time soon, 310 probably would have done the job just fine though. It has not given me a bit of trouble in the six years that I have owned it and it always shocks me how fast it will rip through 18" diameter oak, especially with a sharp chain.

It's good to know that the MS 361 is very popular on this forum and I have already picked up a lot of good info just browsing around. Although I have been around cars, trucks, boats and things that go all of my life, I really don't know very much about small engines, 2-stroke small engines in particular. As I've gotten more experience with my saw, my knowledge and confidence level has gone up some, research on tuning the carb got me here. I obviously am not using this saw to make a living with, and I am wondering how deeply I should get into the modifications that I see so many of you talking about. It really won't even be a "woods saw", just a firewood cutter and fence post shortener. My concerns with the modifications are reliability and safety, will I turn it into something that I wasn't bargaining for? Nothing wrong with more power, but the thing has to start and not give me any headaches. I'm thinking a muffler mod and tune, but is it worth doing for what I have described above? It also seems like more power and speed also equate to more kickback, but I may be wrong about that. What other mods do you recommend given what I've said.

I also have my Dad's McCulloch PM 310 from the early '80's and I've noticed that there is a sticky for them, be making use of that. It's sitting in a corner of the shop, in pieces, testament to my small engine skills. Poor thing, looks pretty sad, it actually was good running little saw.

Regards,

Adam.

 

[Stihlofadeal64]

Honestly from what I've read it sounds like you're happy with your saw. The model you chose and the way things turned out seem to be a dead ringer for me! If you want to muffler mod it -- that's fine, but if you're happy, I'd leave it just like it is. Otherwise, the next pack of oil you buy, make it synthetic and stay with the premium gas. Keep the filter clean and the fuel system running well. Don't be afraid to invest in a new fuel filter as a part of maintenance.

There are plenty of muffler mod threads here. (Since I've never modded a 361, I gladly defer to those who have). You'll have to retune your carb when you mod the muffler. You may want to invest in a hand held, wireless tachometer (if this is going to be something you're going forward with). It will help you make sure you get your saw tuned right on the high side. Once you open the muffler retuning the carb IS NOT an option, it is a MUST, otherwise you can toast your saw. Hope this helps, others will chime in soon. Happy Sawing!

 

[Mastermind]

The 361 is a great saw stock or modified.

 

[moody]

The 361 is a great saw stock or modified.

Honestly for Stihl the 361 is about as good as it gets. Don't get me wrong I own ported saws and have ported a few, just muffler mod thar saw. If you want a hot rod saw grab yourself another saw and send it to a builder. That 361 could bring decent money down the road, most are worth more untampered with.

 

[apn73]

Honestly for Stihl the 361 is about as good as it gets. Don't get me wrong I own ported saws and have ported a few, just muffler mod thar saw. If you want a hot rod saw grab yourself another saw and send it to a builder. That 361 could bring decent money down the road, most are worth more untampered with.

I didn't really think about the resale value of the saw down the road, probably because I know now that I would be a fool for selling it. I didn't realize how good a saw I got until well after the purchase, every once in a while I get thinking that I would like to step up to an MS 440 and then I remind myself that I currently have more saw than I really need. I'm not at all unhappy with the saw, but just thinking about the benefits of having a bit more ooomph through the thick stuff. I don't believe that I would ever open up the engine, just MM and tune. Thanks for the insights, appreciate it!

 

[apn73]

Otherwise, the next pack of oil you buy, make it synthetic and stay with the premium gas. Keep the filter clean and the fuel system running well. Don't be afraid to invest in a new fuel filter as a part of maintenance.

The saw has only seen 93 octane gas mixed with Stihl 2-cycle oil, but the standard orange bottles. That was something that my local dealer was adament about, he told me that he didn't care what I put in the chain oil tank, but he pleaded with me to only use Stihl brand mix in the gas tank, which I have done. Is there a benefit to using the synthetic mix oil? I hope I haven't done any damage by not using it! Do you recommend the Stihl brand synthetic or are using one of the boutique synthetics, like Amsoil or Klotz? Stick with 50:1 or use a different ratio? Thanks to all of you for your replys!

Adam.

 

[moody]

The saw has only seen 93 octane gas mixed with Stihl 2-cycle oil, but the standard orange bottles. That was something that my local dealer was adament about, he told me that he didn't care what I put in the chain oil tank, but he pleaded with me to only use Stihl brand mix in the gas tank, which I have done. Is there a benefit to using the synthetic mix oil? I hope I haven't done any damage by not using it! Do you recommend the Stihl brand synthetic or are using one of the boutique synthetics, like Amsoil or Klotz? Stick with 50:1 or use a different ratio? Thanks to all of you for your replys!

Adam.

I use 40:1 gives me the peace of mind that lubrication is happening. And Stihl makes a fine synthetic oil.

 

[Philip Wheelock]

The saw has only seen 93 octane gas mixed with Stihl 2-cycle oil, but the standard orange bottles. ... Is there a benefit to using the synthetic mix oil? I hope I haven't done any damage by not using it! Do you recommend the Stihl brand synthetic or are using one of the boutique synthetics, like Amsoil or Klotz? Stick with 50:1 or use a different ratio? Thanks to all of you for your replys!

First, welcome to AS! Tons of information here, especially by searching the archives. My local Stihl tech, who is factory-certified with all the bells and whistles, advised that the standard orange bottles of Stihl mix oil are perfectly adequate. I run Stihl Ultra synthetic because I believe it's a better oil and less prone to producing carbon, particularly since I have a Stihl 4-Mix brushcutter where carbon deposits and valves don't get along. Expensive stuff, though. My equipment is stock and I run 50:1 with no problems to date. Lots of folks run more oil in the mix, particularly with ported saws and big saws in continuous production.

Guess I'm a stock kind of guy; I'd keep the MS361 as-is if it were mine - it already has a high enough power/weight ratio for my purposes - 20 cords/yr. and I'd rather not deal with the re-tuning issues. If I wanted more power, I'd get a bigger saw, but that's just me. Others are of a mind to push the performance past stock; the higher the power/weight ratio, the better, particularly if you're cutting all day or are a professional sawyer and need to get the job done. If you're of that persuasion, there are many accomplices on AS who will give you good advice.

 

[apn73]

First, welcome to AS! Tons of information here, especially by searching the archives. My local Stihl tech, who is factory-certified with all the bells and whistles, advised that the standard orange bottles of Stihl mix oil are perfectly adequate. I run Stihl Ultra synthetic because I believe it's a better oil and less prone to producing carbon, particularly since I have a Stihl 4-Mix brushcutter where carbon deposits and valves don't get along. Expensive stuff, though. My equipment is stock and I run 50:1 with no problems to date. Lots of folks run more oil in the mix, particularly with ported saws and big saws in continuous production.

Guess I'm a stock kind of guy; I'd keep the MS361 as-is if it were mine - it already has a high enough power/weight ratio for my purposes - 20 cords/yr. If I wanted more power, I'd get a bigger saw, but that's just me. Others are of a mind to push the performance past stock; the higher the power/weight ratio, the better, particularly if you're cutting all day or are a professional sawyer. If you're of that persuasion, there are many accomplices on AS who will give you good advice.

Thanks Phil! I'm sure there are many others, but good to hear from someone local. I'm actually a Mainah, but marriage makes you do crazy things. Good to know about the 4-Mix. I have an FS 90 also and haven't had any problems in the 3-4 years that I've owned it, but thinking I will go back to the dealer and exchange my brick of orange for a brick of silver, which will also include some extra money from me.

Regards,

Adam.

 

[Frugalist]

The technician at my local saw shop said he can tell whether a saw has been run on the synthetic by how clean it is when he opens it up. I only use synthetic now and I would never run less than 50:1. The worse you can do by going heavier on the oil is to gum up the carb. Good luck and happy cutting!

 

[Stihl Livin]

I have a stock 361 and love it but I have ran a 036 and a 361 that both were ported and can say mine will not be stock much longer. :hmm3grin2orange:

 

[apn73]

The technician at my local saw shop said he can tell whether a saw has been run on the synthetic by how clean it is when he opens it up. I only use synthetic now and I would never run less than 50:1. The worse you can do by going heavier on the oil is to gum up the carb. Good luck and happy cutting!

You guys have sold me on the synthetic mix, but I'm struggling with the MM. The sensible, don't spend any more money than you need to, especially on something you need to stay reliable side of me is saying not to do it. The side of me that plays with fast cars is telling me that it's just a MM, no big deal, just making the stock engine move the air through it that it was actually designed to move:wink2: My wife is excellant at tempering that side of me. The BITOG side of me is telling me to use the Amsoil Saber Professional, but Stihl lube with the fuel stabilizer already in it is awfully convenient.

Thanks for your replys,

Adam.

 

[blsnelling]

Mod the muffler, trim the limiter cap on the H needle, replace the cap, and re-tune to 14,000 RPMs. It'll be just as reliable as it ever was, yet make more power.

 

[apn73]

Mod the muffler, trim the limiter cap on the H needle, replace the cap, and re-tune to 14,000 RPMs. It'll be just as reliable as it ever was, yet make more power.

I'm being tempted. So, do I hack up the muffle that's already on the saw or do I pick up a used one and hack it up? If I remember correctly there is some brazing involved?

 

[ROWDY]

I agree with Philip Wheelock and others. I travel 15 miles to the woods, cut and load for 3+ hours, drive home another 15 miles, Split the wood off the truck, then it gets ranked up. That's a figure of 6 to 8 hours a day playing with firewood. The last thing I want is, saw troubles and, using a screwdriver every 10 minutes to make my saw run better. That's why I'm just happy the way Stihl sold it to me, the way it is.
A note from that is, your saw does run cooler with a MM to have less heat and stress your piston ring. But what's a few bucks to simply re-ring a piston when its worn.

I do believe that any 2-cycle oil will lube your saw that it will not blow up anyway. But like others stated, your "burn-up" and "burn-out" rate is not the same like synthetics. I do the same as you do, 93 or sometimes 94 octane but use the Stihl Ultra oil. That alone is $6+ a gallon.

But really...Look for a used saw to make a hot rod with, and keep one perfect.

 

[1Alpha1]

I was just going by your thread title, and I was ready to make a long list of modifications that would benefit this forum.

But alas, I realized that you were talking about chainsaws.

 

[Adirondackstihl]

IMO.....stay away from Klotz. (R50 may be an exception).
Anything else is good to go!

 

[Moparmyway]

I would MM it and re-tune. You might need to adjust the tune, but thats just a 20 second screwdriver solution. I know dudes who re-adjust their carbs a few times each week without having a MM'd saw.

MMing it will be better for the saw as it will run cooler, cut quicker, and will not, by any means, overpower that saw !
Stihl made that saw with the power it should have, but the EPA has restricted the amount of pollutants a 2 cycle motor can produce, and Stihls response was to make smaller holes and more restrictive exhaust mufflers. If you do not MM it, then try to get a dual port muffler for it, and re-tune. Its really allmost the same thing, allowing the motor to exhale easier.

 

[apn73]

I agree with Philip Wheelock and others. I travel 15 miles to the woods, cut and load for 3+ hours, drive home another 15 miles, Split the wood off the truck, then it gets ranked up. That's a figure of 6 to 8 hours a day playing with firewood. The last thing I want is, saw troubles and, using a screwdriver every 10 minutes to make my saw run better. That's why I'm just happy the way Stihl sold it to me, the way it is.
A note from that is, your saw does run cooler with a MM to have less heat and stress your piston ring. But what's a few bucks to simply re-ring a piston when its worn.

I do believe that any 2-cycle oil will lube your saw that it will not blow up anyway. But like others stated, your "burn-up" and "burn-out" rate is not the same like synthetics. I do the same as you do, 93 or sometimes 94 octane but use the Stihl Ultra oil. That alone is $6+ a gallon.

But really...Look for a used saw to make a hot rod with, and keep one perfect.

....and this is the struggle. I'm seeing two factions within this forum, those who say leave as is, and those who say modify it. You've hit the nail on the head Rowdy; I have no interest in constantly having to re-tune the thing, especially since it runs so good already. But the other faction is saying that it will be just as reliable, or even more so, with the MM. I'm not going to rush to make a decision, almost done cutting up the current load anyway, won't really get to have any until next year if I decide to do it. I could get the next load this summer though Anyway, that sums up the dilemma.

Thanks for all the replies,

Adam.

 

[Philip Wheelock]

...I'm seeing two factions within this forum, those who say leave as is, and those who say modify it. ...I have no interest in constantly having to re-tune the thing, especially since it runs so good already. But the other faction is saying that it will be just as reliable, or even more so, with the MM...

I have no doubts that a proper MM and re-tune will not shorten the service life of a saw, and have seen no evidence that a properly-ported saw is any less reliable than stock. If you're torn at all, I would encourage you to go for the MM and re-tune. In my case, modifying my 50cc MS260 would still have still left me short of power for the size wood I needed to cut, so the solution was to get an MS440. A strong-running 60cc saw is another story.