Outdoor wood stoves

[bwalker]

Yes, that site is pretty biased and there info for the most part is very limited and outdated in regards to outside woodboilers.
BTW I took some pics of mine in use the other day. As soon as I download them I will post them to let every one see the relative amount of smoke or lack of they put out.

 

[bwalker]

Here are the pics I promised. The first one is of the furnace on cycle. By on cycle I mean that the forced draft blower is on and the fire is going full tilt. The next is after than fan has shut off and the boiler isnt getting any air. The third is after I stoked it up with, wet, semi rotted, and moldy maple, yellow birch and red oak. Its during this time that the furnace smokes the most. Most of the smoke is actually water vapor being boiled out of the wood and from the ice/snow frozen to it.
BTW The reason the wood I burnt this day is so nasty is because I made the mistake of leaving a tarp over it all summer. This wood was the remains of the stuff I cut during the fall of 03. I am not kidding in my description of this wood either. Alot off it had these cool looking mushrooms growing on it. Try bringing that stuff in your house to burn in your insert or try firing up a tarm with it,lol.

 

[ray benson]

Ben, what sized wood and how big a load does your furnace take? One of the website pics showed a forklift loading the furnace.
Ray

 

[bwalker]

I usually cut the wood into 24" rounds. Sometimes less depending on the size. I rarely split it unless I cant lift it.
As for what it takes to fill one. See the green wheelbarrow in one of the pics? It takes about 1 1/4-1 3/4 wheel barrow loads to fill it. Sometimes less and if its really cold(-30) it will take 2 loads per 24 hour period. It also depends on the quality And size of the wood. if you through barley liftable chunks of oak or maple in it might only take two or three pieces.

 

[ray benson]

I take it you rarely have to restart a fire. Just keep adding. I like idea of limited splitting. We probably spend as much time splitting at home as we do cutting. Plus the extra handling.

 

[bwalker]

I start the fire in October and it doesnt go out untill April.

 

[bwalker]

I doubt it, Dan. It doesnt get real cold here like it does in MN, but we do usually have snow on the ground from November to May. Like I said propane would cost me between 5 and $600 per month. I can get a winters worth of wood delivered for under quit a bit under $500 dropped in my yard. I cut all mine myself though, although when you figure the wear and tear on my vehicle, fuel for my truck and skidder, it doesnt save much over buying it.

 

[Johnboy]

Underground piping ideas or recomendations?? Man-o-man...I'm getting prices for pre-made/pre-insulated underground pipes. The pipe alone is going to cost a full year's propane bill. I need some at 1-1/4" and some 1".

Thanks in advance for any suggestions.
jb in bboo

 

[bwalker]

The pipe is expensive, but dont try to cut corners on it. I went with the insul seal type pipe, which is bascily a 4" pvc pipe surronded by 8-10" of foam insulation and encased in heavy plastic.
Many of the effiancy issues with wood boilers results from improper installations.

 

[Johnboy]

So did you still insulate the individual pipes within the insul-seal piping? Seems you'd want to wrap at least the supply to prevent the return from sapping it.

I need some 1-1/4 & some 1" pipe. Any ideas how much yours cost to install?

I'm also still not clear..is this stuff flexible or do you need elbows and such?

thx.
jb

 

[bwalker]

Both 1 1/4 pipes run inside the insul seal pipe. The insul seal is rigid so you do need elbows and such. As for cost of install, you have to figure you are goping to need a circ pump(oversize it), a heat exchanger(oversize it as well), some 1 1/4 pex pipe, misc fittings and supplies and your insulseal or the like. Depending on how far a way you plan to put your boiler I would think $1k would be a ballpark figure

 

[Johnboy]

Do you recall the price of the insul-seal pipe per foot? $1k would be a dream compared to the pricing I'm getting on pre-made piping. I'm going about 140 ft with the 1-1/4, then teeing off to the house(30 ft) and onto the Garage (70 ft). My pumps and such have already been sized by a pro (as has the pipe).

Doesn't seem to be any readily available pricing available on the net so I'llhave to chase down a dealer.

thanks again.
jb

 

[bwalker]

If i recall it was around $75 per 10' section. You better go with the largest diameter insul seal or simular you can get because you are going to lose a ton of heat with 24" of piping.

 

[pipeboy]

i was planning on getting 6" pvc at $2.75 per foot and adding two layers of 1" armaflex closed cell insulation ( $4 /foot) around my 1" pex ($1.25 foot) and then drilling holes every 3-4 feet in the top of the pvc to squirt in the great stuff expanding foam to further insulate inside. i figure it should run about....8-9 bucks a foot...not bad it sure beats the $12 per foot i got quoted on for the ecoflex system. and they'll only sell it to me in 100 or 500 ft rolls...and needless to say i'm about 140' from the house!!! i'm not exactly sure if it'll work...but that's what i'm going to try. so has anyone heard of the northwood outdoor boiler? i was just curious cause i have a freind that has one an he said it's kind of a father son shop up in NE corner of MN. he likes his and says it works great...it looked to me to be an internally round boiler styled after the classic...but it's priced about 2-3k less!

 

[pipeboy]

it's northland outdoor boilers not northwood!! sorry www.nowf.com

 

[bwalker]

In most cases you pay for what you get.
I would also advise against trying a do it yourself insulation job like that. The plumber that tied mine into my existing boiler relayed several horror stories of do yourself insulation jubs and their effect on efficiancy.

 

[Newfie]

i figure it should run about....8-9 bucks a foot...not bad it sure beats the $12 per foot i got quoted on for the ecoflex system. i'm not exactly sure if it'll work...but that's what i'm going to try.

Sounds like a real bargain if you're not even sure it will work or not.

 

[pipeboy]

come on boys have a little faith....besides, being a pipefitter, beleive me plumbers aren't the sharpest tools in the shed if you know what i mean!! i just saw on a website someone is making pex wrapped in 2 layers of that 1/4" thick reflective bubble wrap foam and run through some 4" flex drainaige tube...yeah...like you wouldn't have to mow the grass where than stuff runs out to the boiler all year!!!

 

[Johnboy]

$12 a foot for Ecoflex!!!?!?!?!? I'm getting quoted $20 for dual 1" and $25 for dual 1.25". Where are you getting the pricing???? Is that price for single or dual???

As for your homemade solution, I might suggest looking at standard black non-perforated drain tile available around here for under 15-CENTS a foot. It's more flexible...I mean it IS flexible. You'll have a bit of money in pvc connections if you go the pvc route so don't forget that when pricing. I don't really know of any advantages to using pvc over drain tile. If I could get ecoflex for $12 I'd do that.

After telling my suppliers that the total cost of my system was getting way too high they came up with the solution of using the drain tile and the closed-cell insulation. They suggest running each of the two lines in their own insulated drain tile. Then burying it as deep as possible in a 2-foot wide trench. Backfill is just enough to cover the pipes with about an inch or two of dirt. Then rip a bunch of 2" styrofoam sheets to 2-foot wide and lay in the trench over the pipes and then backfill that. They were very adamant(SP?) not to lay the styro right on or around the pipes since boiler temp water will disintegrate the styro.

If I go ahead with my install (still very much up in the air) that will be the method I use.

Good luck
jb

 

[ghitch75]

i can sell you a duel 1" for $10.50 a foot best stuff on the market 0 heat loss in a 150ft...don't use the styrofoam unless you can make it water tight in about 3 years you'll be digging it up and replacing it and you'll do nothing but heat the ground....you can lay this right on top of the ground with no loss....