evil looking little goon.............
PILTZ: Master HOT SAW builder (...not)
- Thread starter windthrown
- Start date
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That hurt Oly.
Well forget the long bar, I'm going to go play in the snow like a kid.lol
my experience, rim sprockets don't care if it's 3/8" or 3/8" lo pro. sprocket tips in bars will work with one or the other, not both.
I just tried these
Top : a PS chain in a standard 3/8 sprocket..seems like it would ride in it fine.
bottom : PM in a stihl picco 8T rim
fordf150
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http://www.arboristsite.com/community/threads/getting-serious-about-lo-pro.121746/
Awhile back i did some research on this subject and 3/8 sprocket nose will NOT work with LP chain however the rim sprocket WILL work. It doesnt line up perfectly and will cause some extra wear on the chain and rim. To my knowledge there is no LP rim for standard small spline. Stihl has it for their mini spline though.
Awhile back i did some research on this subject and 3/8 sprocket nose will NOT work with LP chain however the rim sprocket WILL work. It doesnt line up perfectly and will cause some extra wear on the chain and rim. To my knowledge there is no LP rim for standard small spline. Stihl has it for their mini spline though.
fordf150
ArboristSite.com Sponsor
lay the 2 rims on top of each other....the picco rim is slightly larger in diameter to account for the smaller chassis of the picco chain.
So you could run picco on a standard 3/8 setup you just need the proper bar is the conclusion ?
There is a lot of information on this in the thread that fordf150 referenced in Post #276, above. Used to be some very detailed photos that showed the fit issues clearly, although, some have been lost.
Philbert
http://www.arboristsite.com/community/threads/getting-serious-about-lo-pro.121746/
Philbert
http://www.arboristsite.com/community/threads/getting-serious-about-lo-pro.121746/
SS Sniper
Addicted to ArboristSite
So is anyone gonna send him a link to this thread? I think he'd cry haha
i doubt it. scammers don't cry. also, i haven't done the research yet but i suspect the cannon bars he's using are a response to millers for longer lo pro bars. logosol sells similar bars but the are costly. some of the suppositions in that thread are probably incorrect too, especially that lo pro can't cut faster than 3/8". i'll tell you from my experience that if you replace a 3/8" chain with a 3/8" lp you will gain cutting speed due to higher rpm. also, i'll debate that you can run lo pro with a 3/8" nose sprocket. my experience has been that lo pro chain will bind due to the drive links climbing up on the sprocket teeth. don't take my word for it try it yourself. if i have some time today, unlikely, i will make a vid of my jshred 525 running lo pro (with a lo pro nose sprocket on a 20" guide bar.)
It all makes sense the 3/8 picco would cut faster it has less to pull.
The joke of it to me is the saws he puts these 28" and 32" bars on , theres no way they oil it enough and the saws themselves obviously arent designed for it..would my ported 362c or 261 pull 28 or 32 with lo-pro chain ?..im gonna find out.
The joke of it to me is the saws he puts these 28" and 32" bars on , theres no way they oil it enough and the saws themselves obviously arent designed for it..would my ported 362c or 261 pull 28 or 32 with lo-pro chain ?..im gonna find out.
I'm going to go out on a limb here (no pun intended), and say that would depend somewhat on the saw. In other words, if the powerhead has the HP to pull a full sized 3/8 chain thought a particular log, it will cut faster with the larger teeth, because it is removing more wood with each 'bite'. If the saw bogs down, the smaller teeth might be a better choice.
Same thing applies to the way that people sharpen their chains. More 'hook' might lead to a 'self-feeding' experience with enough HP, but slower cutting, and more tearing, with a smaller powerhead.
In my opinion, it is matching the powerhead, sprocket, bar, and chain, that optimizes performance for a particular cutting situation.
Philbert
Philbert
i agree that it is removing more wood but that's because it's cutting a wider kerf which requires more btu/second. with a narrow kerf chain, like lo pro,you're removing less wood but cutting faster. also, it's easier to keep chain speed up where it belongs. these are all hyotheses supported by anecdotal rather than experimental data of course. there is a whole new class of chain called "narrow kerf." it's mostly .325" x .43. i've seen it on some small stihls and it supposedly requires 20% less hp. i'm not interested in it because i would have to spend another $350 for a roll. but i already keep a roll of lo pro for my top handles.
i agree about matching all components but when it comes to a 50cc saw, a size i seldom use, to me lo pro is an appropriate choice of chain. i'd use it with a 7 dl rim because that's what i use on all my saws, K.I.S.S. when i'm working, which is getting to be less often, i don't like to think about saws.
I use narrow kerf on a Husqvarna saw, because it came with it. Cuts fine for my use, but the bar is a bit more flexible, if that matters to the user.
My comments were meant in a general sense - lot of guys want to put 3/8 chain on a saw that came with .325, or put .404 chain on a saw that came with 3/8. It depends on if the saw has the power to pull the larger chain. If it doesn't, it will not cut faster. If it does, smaller chain might never keep up with the saw's potential. There are a few saws that might be 'on the cusp' - could run either chain. Sometimes that depends on the type of cutting: smaller branches might favor the smoother cutting of smaller pitch chain; bucking big logs might benefit from a slightly wider kerf.
JMHO
Philbert
My comments were meant in a general sense - lot of guys want to put 3/8 chain on a saw that came with .325, or put .404 chain on a saw that came with 3/8. It depends on if the saw has the power to pull the larger chain. If it doesn't, it will not cut faster. If it does, smaller chain might never keep up with the saw's potential. There are a few saws that might be 'on the cusp' - could run either chain. Sometimes that depends on the type of cutting: smaller branches might favor the smoother cutting of smaller pitch chain; bucking big logs might benefit from a slightly wider kerf.
JMHO
Philbert
windthrown
361 Junkie
The P series Picco rims fit the 024/026 clutch drums. I thought that was a small spline. I thought that the mini spline was for the 1123 series saws, which Stihl also has a rim and drum for now (my 211 will take one, and it fits the 1123 series saws as well). There are also Oregon drums and rims in various sizes, and they do not interchange with the Stihl ones. Its confusing
My 026 3/8 Picco rim is a larger diameter than my 026 3/8 std. rim. No slop. For the large Stihl saws, like 361, 440, etc. the chainsaw milling guys that I knew used the 3/8 spur sprocket drives for Picco and not a rim drive.
windthrown
361 Junkie
No one ever said that low profile does not cut faster than 3/8 standard here. I can and will say the opposite with my 026. I can also say that Picco ran faster than .325 on my 025 saws. The issue is running ridiculously long bars with Picco on smaller saws, as Piltz sells, and running Picco on large saws with long bars that can easily break that chain. Logosol USED to sell Stihl large format low profile bars in the US. No longer. I called them and asked. Stihl western region does not have them either, but there are some Stihl dealers that still have 16" 3003 Picco bars in stock in the Midwest and the eastern states. Baileys also lists them for a small fortune. No one in the states that I am aware of sells a large format 18" or 20" Stihl Picco bar. You may find one on Ebay. They can easily be bought in Europe and the UK though, along with Logosol bars.
As for 3/8 std. (or .325) vs. Picco chain speed, that is not the main reason that Picco/low profile cuts faster. The main reason that low profile cuts faster is that the kerf is narrower. You are cutting less wood, so it cuts faster. The chain speed will be higher because there is less drag.
Sounds like someone could make some money by selling a 3/8, low profile, replacement nose sprocket to fit other 0.050 gauge bars.
Philbert
Philbert
