question for crane owners

[treevet]

It's nice you're able to borrow a bobcat from time to time. I bought one, and have found myself using it in ways I've never thought of. Not kidding it probably gets used 3 or 4times a week at this point solely because it's there. But yeah, at 95 an hour?? Keep renting. I'm buying a 28t this year but only because I'm getting it from a friend at a ridiculous price. It will pay for itself in a cpl months.

If you think you are going anywhere in the tree biz world...buy one...the earlier the better so it can steadily pay itself off. Start small and it will certainly pay itself off if you are in the right biz. I am on my 4th crane and already shopping another one. But a 25 ton to 30 tonner with a hundred foot plus of main bought at a reasonable price can make you a player. The crane network is a great place to shop (and dream).

If a big storm hits go rent one (not...you'll never find one).

 

[abidingdreams]

Say you need the crane 20 hours per week, 40 weeks out of the year. That is 800 hours per year. $45x800 = $36000 per year. Payments on $140,000 (6 years, 6.5%) are going to be about $2500 per month or $30,000 per year. Can you maintain, store, and insure it for $6K per year?

That is a great break down! But I doubt that it can be maintain and insured for less than 6k a year (if any crane owners would like to expound on that subject that would be superb). Although after the six years it would be thirty thousand of profit so it would be more than likely an investment for the future. I think that if we don't take the hard investments the returns wont be as great. And cranes, at least from what I have read, is dang near a life saver on those really compact and complicated jobs.

 

[dbl612]

That is a great break down! But I doubt that it can be maintain and insured for less than 6k a year (if any crane owners would like to expound on that subject that would be superb). Although after the six years it would be thirty thousand of profit so it would be more than likely an investment for the future. I think that if we don't take the hard investments the returns wont be as great. And cranes, at least from what I have read, is dang near a life saver on those really compact and complicated jobs.

beyond the ownership, maintenance. taxes.etc. your insurance costs will be approx 10-12% of your gross sales of crane work if you don't have any claims. (95/hr=yummy take the crane rental rate mark it up to your liking and take the profit to the bank)

 

[Welland]

Caution

Of course, there can be drawbacks:

Tree-trimming crane topples in Royal Oak - Daily Tribune

 

[Mikecutstrees]

Good thread, My insurance guy says if you only do tree work the ins cost is cheaper. This is due to the fact hat there very little value to what is being lifted. In their eyes no value.

Mike

 

[JohnH]

I dont own a crane but a buddy does. You need to keep it working making money. You have boom inspections and semi annaual vehicle inspections. All the replacement parts like cables, sensors and what not are very expensive. Plus you need to know what your doing so you dont flip it over. Thens theres insurance. Crane insurance for tree work is expensive.

He is correct. There is a LOT of maintenance on a crane. Parts a VERY expensive like he said. 95$ an hour is cheap. Keep renting because if you get slow your not paying for it. Break downs can take a long time to fix also. If you have something go wrong inside the boom it can take 3-6 weeks to get fixed.

 

[beastmaster]

I work for a company that has a knuckleboom crane. It a smaller one 60 ft max. Because it folds up out of the way the insurances are way cheaper, and its right under the size where you need to have a lic. to operate. The truck has a big dump bed and the booms right behind the cab, so it can be used for a lot of other things, Drawback is its capacity and reach aren't that great. There are many pluses and minuses.
I know he bought his for a contract to place boulders at the getty museum in los angels and paid it off in 3 weeks. Or so he say.

 

[treeclimber101]

It's nice you're able to borrow a bobcat from time to time. I bought one, and have found myself using it in ways I've never thought of. Not kidding it probably gets used 3 or 4times a week at this point solely because it's there. But yeah, at 95 an hour?? Keep renting. I'm buying a 28t this year but only because I'm getting it from a friend at a ridiculous price. It will pay for itself in a cpl months.

That's all I want a little guy just for picking trunks or loading wood , I mean if you get rip apart 50/60 trees with it that would be nice , I mean the guy I use had a 30 ton for almost 18 years and he did some crazy things with that little crane , he made enough money to buy a 50 with damn near cash , I like the little crane old oak just bought that thing is perfect for what I want .

 

[treeclimber101]

I will say though when the tree is done and all you have is a bit of breakout to cleanup and blow off the grass and landscape that is nice , working trees with a crane is pleasurable to say the very least .

 

[TreeAce]

IDK what you have for chipping and what you have for chip trucks but keep in mind if you own a 12 inch chipper (like me) then you cant keep up with what the crane is able to do. Meaning, for good production you need to be chipping those 12inch+ leads or limbs. the guys around me who run cranes with any size to em all have 18+ inch chippers with knuckle loaders. And they have at least two good size chip trucks. I have a great crane guy with a 28T and he treats me right. Just call ahead about 1-3 weeks and I am good to go. For me subbing is a no brainer

 

[treevet]

call ahead 1 to 3 weeks...ouch...all the hi dollah storm work is being done while you are waiting. the bigger crane sometimes means the further from the work you have to set up and driveway crushing is always a concern. Who pays for that? Better talk it over as mr. HO sure won't. I can boom leads out of a tree and boom over houses with mine and it is not that big. The next one I get will likely have an op cab like treetec's but I won't go way bigger.

I use my crane 3 to 5 days a week. Just fired my op 2 wks ago tho. Training a guy now. It ain't rocket science.

 

[treevet]

 

[a_lopa]

One thing to remember with buying all new bling equipment is that its going to COST to insure, especially over 10 pieces of equipment.

 

[treevet]

Nice site Lopa.

There is a guy round here that lists a bunch of cranes on his site as his and as rentals and doesn't own any. Must be ok with the crane co. owner but a bit dishonest and misleading imo.

None of these cranes are owned by this company and I have subbed with this co. occassionally over the past 30 years so I know these cranes. http://www.hendeltree.com/services/tree_services/crane_service.php

 

[treevet]

gotta admit that is a pretty cool logo...(map) we all contributed to opinions on it.

 

[dbl612]

Good thread, My insurance guy says if you only do tree work the ins cost is cheaper. This is due to the fact hat there very little value to what is being lifted. In their eyes no value.

Mike

gotta love it. your insurance company thinks that the hazards and risk assessment are less if you do tree work with a crane. of all crane activities the one with the most variables and unknowns. ralph nader must run their statistics department after they killed the corvair.

 

[treevet]

the old insurance company adage...Arb..."I haven't had an accident in years"...Insur. broker..."well, you are due for one then"...rate increase!

 

[TreeAce]

call ahead 1 to 3 weeks...ouch...all the hi dollah storm work is being done while you are waiting. the bigger crane sometimes means the further from the work you have to set up and driveway crushing is always a concern. Who pays for that? Better talk it over as mr. HO sure won't. I can boom leads out of a tree and boom over houses with mine and it is not that big. The next one I get will likely have an op cab like treetec's but I won't go way bigger.

I use my crane 3 to 5 days a week. Just fired my op 2 wks ago tho. Training a guy now. It ain't rocket science.

Storm work is different. A good storm changes the line up. Basically first call first served. I guess missing out on some of the "high dollar" storm work is just the price I pay for avoiding some of the issues with owning a crane. or should I say, having a crane in my possession. Cant say we have had many storms that amounted to much around here lately. Nothing since hurricane sandy. basically I am content (for now) with being the little guy doing hard to reach removals and trimming. I made good money for a couple weeks after Sandy blew through. Just clearing driveways, pulling hangers, and one big ole pine that fell into someones house with no way of reaching it with a crane. So for the crane jobs I typically do, 1-3 weeks lead time is fine. I will also say that doing removals with a crane is truly one of the things in life I enjoy most. It takes me to my happy place thats for sure.

 

[Adamgaspo]

cranes are fun! and help expedite large jobs. we rent a crane at least 3 times a month, the going rate is 95 dollars an hour plus 10% fuel charge which comes out to 105 an hour, plus a minimum of 6 hrs.
then on the other hand I am trying to convince my boss to purchase a crane because you get to bypass a lot of the hourly operational cost by owning.
IE almost all tree company's are already paying for liability insurance, maintenance charges on their fleet of trucks, hourly wages to their employees.
and then your able to charge a fair price to the customer for the crane since you are not dealing with a third party to provide you with the crane.
If the company I work for owned a crane we would be sending it our every day no matter what!
your are able to provide the customer with a better price point based on time alone when using a crane.
its the same logic as when you sell a job and use the bucket truck/ forrestry package.
less time on job+competitive rate to the customer= more money and time for the tree company.

ahhh what the hell do i know i just do the work.....

 

[treevet]

Storm work is different. A good storm changes the line up. Basically first call first served. I guess missing out on some of the "high dollar" storm work is just the price I pay for avoiding some of the issues with owning a crane. or should I say, having a crane in my possession. Cant say we have had many storms that amounted to much around here lately. Nothing since hurricane sandy. basically I am content (for now) with being the little guy doing hard to reach removals and trimming. I made good money for a couple weeks after Sandy blew through. Just clearing driveways, pulling hangers, and one big ole pine that fell into someones house with no way of reaching it with a crane. So for the crane jobs I typically do, 1-3 weeks lead time is fine. I will also say that doing removals with a crane is truly one of the things in life I enjoy most. It takes me to my happy place thats for sure.

You should acknowledge Alex Shigo with a footnote as the author of your signature quote. If not it is plagiarism.