There is not a single oil that has passed Jaso FC,FD and TCW3.
There are some that Pass TCW3 and FB.
Redmax two stroke oil for a reasonable price
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There are some that Pass TCW3 and FB.
Oregon makes one but I don't think they sell it in North America however it is rated TC and Jaso FD but not TCW3.
TC vs TCW3 is engine temperature, correct? Water cooled runs lower than air so more ash and soot?
Interesting at least to me is while looking this over I found several references to using TCW3 as a diesel fuel additive
It's not technically feasible to meet TCW3 and FD. Any FD oil will pass TC if it was still in use, which it isn't.
TCW3 oils are completely different in terms of additive package type, base oils, etc when compared to JASO FC/FD oils.
Husky77
ArboristSite Operative
Intresting to hear about it used as a diesel addative
Would you know why an oil that satisfied all criteria could not be made?
First I've heard of it myself
https://www.pureguard.com/small-engine-products/
This is the same company that makes 2 stroke for Stihl. Their Pure Guard house oil seems to indicate that it can be used for both outboard motors and chainsaws.
"Pure Guard Marine TC-W3 Engine Oil is a 2-cycle oil recommended for all engines that call for two stroke or outboard engine oil. TC-W3 is formulated for outboard motors, snowmobiles, ATV’s, chainsaws, mowers or for any equipment that requires TC-W3 or API TC. This product is certified by the NMMA."
So it would seem there is a manu making that claim.
Two stroke oil as a diesel additive has been done for years. I did it here until Oregon got a 5% biodiesel mandate, quieted down my mechanical diesel.
With a B5 mandate there's no point, the biodiesel has more lubricity than a reasonable amount of 2 stroke oil.
With a B5 mandate there's no point, the biodiesel has more lubricity than a reasonable amount of 2 stroke oil.
TC is an ancient two stroke oil standard. Crisco off the shelf in the grocery store might pass it. Straight 30w dino oil might pass it.
FC and FD are modern two stroke oil standards, an entirely different animal.
API says FD is obsolete being replaced by tc-w. TC is the only 2 letter "T" rating left.
https://www.oilspecifications.org/api_2t.php
The link I posted above says the oil will do both. Will it? IDK. All I know is what I read and a company that makes oil for Stihl wouldn't jeopardize its reputation by making claims it couldn't back up I think.
You're confusing TC and FC, they aren't the same.
TC is ancient API spec. FC/FD are current JASO specs. Look at the link in my signature.
I have been looking at oils since this thread started never giving them much thought. It seems several companies make 2 stroke oil they claim works in all motors including marine. Valvoline claims it for their Multi Purpose 2 stroke. Gets very in the weeds.
Yes, for starters TCW3 oils can't use detergents because they must be ashless. Detergents are mettalic based and form ash. They instead use dispersent technology, which isn't as effective and not effective at all at elevated ring belt temps.
In addition TCW3 oils use heavier base oils as outboards are under higher loads on average than other two strokes. These base oils don't burn clean in air cooled motors at lesser loads, which would cause failure on the Jaso smoke test at least and probaly the port blocking and deposit tests as well.
The other thing is that TCW3 oils use a high Flashpoint diluent in order to provide for reliable pumping through injection systems. These solvents often don't combust or partially combust in a two stroke, which causes smoke, deposit and smell issues.
They can claim what ever they want. It's doesn't make it so and it should be noted that some antiquated two strokes like Toro snowblower and lawnboy mowers spec the use of TCW3 oils.
Redmax/Husky specifically says to use only JASO FD oils.
The API hasn't had an active two stroke oil standard in over a decade.
No power equipment manufacturer specs a TCW3 oil for use.
And I suggest you read their claims carefully. What they claim is that their oil is OK to use in equipment calling for a TCW3 oil.
Why is it so hard to use the right stuff????
It's not hard and I'm not interested in using marine oil in my saws. I'm finding this interesting, though. Many here swear by Amsoil, do they have a rating? I also suggest back to you to read what is claimed in #115. Clearly says chainsaw. That seems to me to say that if someone ran out and all they had was that oil a few tanks would not destroy the equipment.
I'm also curious as to why you apparently know more about oil than the people who make it and are so invested in arguing over it. I'm just reposting what is on their sites. Both Pure Guard and Valvoline say the same thing and I ran across a couple of European oils that also say it.
It's impossible to meet Jaso FD and TC-W3 requirements and have the oil perform properly in both engines. Neither engine will die from running the wrong oil, but neither will give the best results. Oil manufacturers don't have to follow any standards for 2 strike oil, so why not sell something that kinda sorta work for everything? It's nothing like 4 stroke oil requirements.
It's been used for years, no real reason for it other then people fearing their old equipment will magically blow up from ulsd. Which it won't. Generally people have bought the cheapest oil they can get to dump in the tank, which happens to either not be rated, or be rated TC-W3.
I read the link you posted carefully. I think you need to do the same. It states after may be used in...where TCW3 oil is called for or some such verbiage.
"Pure Guard Marine TC-W3 Engine Oil is a 2-cycle oil recommended for all engines that call for two stroke or outboard engine oil. TC-W3 is formulated for outboard motors, snowmobiles, ATV’s, chainsaws, mowers or for any equipment that requires TC-W3 or API TC"
The problem is no OD power equipment mfg reccomends a TCW3 oil.
The problem is no OD power equipment mfg reccomends a TCW3 oil.
Tomos770
ArboristSite Guru
I think that this is the reason why there is TC/TCW3 confussion.....
https://www.oilspecifications.org/api_2t.php
https://www.oilspecifications.org/api_2t.php
