Sharpening Questions

[Philbert]

Diamond plated grinding wheels are not recommended for steel, chainsaw cutters. It can clog up those expensive ($100+) wheels.

Diamond abrasive bits for Dremel, Granberg, STIHL, Oregon, etc., rotary grinders are regularly used. They are consumable items, but typically hold their size and shape longer than aluminum oxide grinding bits, in the same use.

Philbert

 

[chainbrake]

...As mentioned, you do need to be mindful of the bits tendency to jump out of the cutter, and a drill might actually help with this, as it would give you more to hold onto to control the rotational force. ... Bad things come in threes, so you should be good on rocking chains for a while now.

Thank you for your thoughtful reply. I also have some air tools that could be really smooth for this type of work. Except for Dremels, I have no end of rotary tools: drills, saws, shapers, routers, hammer drills, lathes, grinders, more saws, more drills.... I'm mostly a building contractor who has a wood shop to support that business. I never thought I had time to get into small fancy woodworking/inlaying etc, so dremels just haven't been needed by me.

In two weeks, our son is coming home from Out West. He has begun shipping his belongings here. My wife and I have a chunk of forested land that is about 1.5 hours away from where we live. We have not touched the trees on that land for 17 years. It is due for some major thinning, and some harvesting. He is going to take-over/homestead that parcel. He owns 2 Dremels/attachments that I bought for him at garage sales. I am sure that one of those will be here for us to try while we build him a tiny house and cut in a bit of a roadway on what will be his new property.

An aside about NS woodlot ownership, taxes and transferring land to family members:
It would have been better to have transferred the deed to our son before covid. Real estate has gained value. Capital gains taxes when gifting land are the same as if you sell it outright. We definitely want to transfer it before he starts the homestead. As long as he stays off the grid, and the land is listed as private resource property, he should have low property taxes. Resource land is taxed at a much lower rate around here and capital gains are not assessed until land is sold unless the land is owned/operated as part of a business. We have kept our land out of our business for that reason. If he maintains that land as resource land or as his primary residence, he will never have to pay capital gains on it. If he builds a real house, he may wish to cut off a piece of that land for the residence and create a separate deed so that property taxes do not go sky-high for the whole parcel. Resource land is taxed much lower than residential land. These are things that all of us with woodlots might consider when we want our children to benefit from the work we have done to make their lives go better.

 

[epo]

Diamond plated grinding wheels are not recommended for steel, chainsaw cutters.

Diamond abrasive bits for Dremel, Granberg, STIHL, Oregon, etc., rotary grinders are regularly used.

Are you sure about this? Because Dremel, Granberg etc. claim that their bits are aluminum oxide based.

 

[chainbrake]

Another Dremel vs Drill thought:
my Dremels are 30,000 rpm (variable speed). Typical VSR drill is 3,000 - 4,000 rpm?

I love my Dremel tools. Started picking some up at garage sales, and leaving some set up with different bits / attachments for different uses.

Philbert

I have some air tools that have the right sized chucks and are fast; I can give those a go... and I can borrow a dremmel from my son to try it out.
Have you ever run coolant when you cut with the dremel? My drills and other metal cutting tools always last longer with cutting oil.

 

[Philbert]

Are you sure about this? Because Dremel, Granberg etc. claim that their bits are aluminum oxide based.

Yes, they are. OEM.

The diamond abrasive bits are aftermarket, sold for general use, and there is a wide variety of quality and price options.

Going back almost 20 years in this forum, and similar forums, you will find comments from members describing their use of them for sharpening saw chains.

For a while, there was also a vendor offering CBN/ABN coated bits, similar to the CBN grinding wheels.

If anybody can find those, somewhere, please share!

Philbert

 

[epo]

Yes, they are. OEM.

The diamond abrasive bits are aftermarket, sold for general use, and there is a wide variety of quality and price options.

Going back almost 20 years in this forum, and similar forums, you will find comments from members describing their use of them for sharpening saw chains.

I see. Personally, I do not recommend the diamond ones, because in my opinion the aluminum ones are much better. But it's also a matter of price...

 

[chainbrake]

Feel free to cast stones but I still use an Oregon file guide and the file called for by the chain manufacturer. I appreciate that it’s a plain vanilla solution, but I get acceptably results and I find it relaxing.

I appreciate that others get better results with either better skill or better equipment, but to me sharpening chains is similar to sweeping a floor or mowing the lawn. If you stay after it, the floor / lawn remains in control. As soon as you finish, the floor starts getting dirty the lawn starts growing or the chain starts getting dull. If you have a huge floor you can buy walk behind scrubbers if you have a

Maybe when you live another 30 years you will understand that hogging out the metal on a rocked chain might just aggravate arthritic thumbs. Part of the reason the joints have worn down is that I have "stayed after" things for 68 years. I have a whole shop's worth of tools to maintain, whatever is easiest and quickest is where I am at. Whatever gets me back into production with the least amount of effort is where I am coming from.

I don't even own a lawnmower - I live in the forest - that is one piece of equipment I removed from my life more than a decade ago. I take my dirty shoes off at the door - on go the slippers.

 

[epo]

For a while, there was also a vendor offering CBN/ABN coated bits, similar to the CBN grinding wheels.

If anybody can find those, somewhere, please share!

How about ceramic alumina, e.g. 3/16''?
https://www.mcmaster.com/products/abrasive-bits/high-performance-grinding-bits-for-metals/

 

[Sloughfoot]

May not be necessary with a grinder, but hand filing with a jig or free hand I started doing something I haven't seen on tutorials. Any more than a touch up, shape the tooth first with a flat file before sharpening. It makes $20 double bevel files last 5 times longer, should do the same with round files.

 

[Philbert]

Any more than a touch up, shape the tooth first with a flat file before sharpening. It makes $20 double bevel files last 5 times longer, should do the same with round files.

I’ve started seeing that posted in a few forums, over the last year, or so: hog away damaged metal, back to 30° (or whatever angle) with a basic, flat file. Then, profile the ‘C’ shape, and cutting bevels, with a standard, round file.

Makes a lot of sense to me.

Because I have a grinder, I just use that to ‘even up’ cutters and remove damage. But, great idea if using just files, for speed, as well as for extending the life of more expensive, specially files.

Philbert

 

[NSEric]

A loop hole for selling land cheaply to friends/family is to sell it for next to nothing then get the rest of your money in cash. This makes it so you only pay a tiny bit of capital gains.
If you're looking for a chain grinder in canada, get the princess auto oregon 420 knock off when it's on sale.
I bought a cheap 310 oregon knock off chain grinder a month or so ago off amazon, I had buyers remorse a week later when my buddy picked up the oregon 420 knock off from princess auto for only 40 bucks more, they're 120 on sale. The little plastic one is ok for my use but the next level up is way better. As you know everything cost about double in canada compared to the states.

 

[PV Hiker]

May not be necessary with a grinder, but hand filing with a jig or free hand I started doing something I haven't seen on tutorials. Any more than a touch up, shape the tooth first with a flat file before sharpening. It makes $20 double bevel files last 5 times longer, should do the same with round files.

I’ve started seeing that posted in a few forums, over the last year, or so: hog away damaged metal, back to 30° (or whatever angle) with a basic, flat file. Then, profile the ‘C’ shape, and cutting bevels, with a standard, round file.

Makes a lot of sense to me.

Because I have a grinder, I just use that to ‘even up’ cutters and remove damage. But, great idea if using just files, for speed, as well as for extending the life of more expensive, specially files.

Philbert

I have been doing that for a while now. Speeds up the work and saves time pushing a round file, and the life of a round file. Then use a progressive depth gauge plate to set depth gauge height for those teeth. A few short cutters don't bother me as the rest will catch up soon enough.

 

[chainbrake]

A loop hole for selling land cheaply to friends/family is to sell it for next to nothing then get the rest of your money in cash. This makes it so you only pay a tiny bit of capital gains.
If you're looking for a chain grinder in canada, get the princess auto oregon 420 knock off when it's on sale.
I bought a cheap 310 oregon knock off chain grinder a month or so ago off amazon, I had buyers remorse a week later when my buddy picked up the oregon 420 knock off from princess auto for only 40 bucks more, they're 120 on sale. The little plastic one is ok for my use but the next level up is way better. As you know everything cost about double in canada compared to the states.

I'll check out princess auto. I'm in Lunenburg County, so it is a bit of a drive. I have had them ship to me. It's how I got my 2-direction, wood splitter that works great, though the carburetor is a bit on the wimpy side.

 

[chainbrake]

A loop hole for selling land cheaply to friends/family is to sell it for next to nothing then get the rest of your money in cash. This makes it so you only pay a tiny bit of capital gains.
If you're looking for a chain grinder in canada, get the princess auto oregon 420 knock off when it's on sale.
I bought a cheap 310 oregon knock off chain grinder a month or so ago off amazon, I had buyers remorse a week later when my buddy picked up the oregon 420 knock off from princess auto for only 40 bucks more, they're 120 on sale. The little plastic one is ok for my use but the next level up is way better. As you know everything cost about double in canada compared to the states.

I read the reviews on the $70 one and it sounds like it will work if you take your time. The $170 one seems a great deal better. Is that the one that goes on sale for $120. I include a link:
https://www.princessauto.com/en/120v-bench-mount-chainsaw-chain-sharpener/product/PA0008601577

RE: capital gains, we are giving the land to him. The gift value has to be at the assessed value. We are talking with a local accountant to see the easiest way to give it to him so that our gift doesn't cost us too much. We are also giving a parcel on the South Shore to our daughter and her husband - it's a smaller parcel, but it is ocean access, so it's value has also climbed considerably. Same tax issue. We give them their land, they buy materials, and i help them build their houses - not a bad way to move into retirement for me and a good way for them to get on with their lives.

 

[chainbrake]

Damn that sucks! I missed that in your original post sorry, get ya a couple more chains and try to keep them out of the rocks! I'm in kentucky trust me I know about rocks. Sounds like a grinder best for you.

Yep, we live at the other end of the Appalachians, in Nova Scotia - same moss-covered rocks lurking, waiting to catch your saw. Plenty of ticks on the ground. Winter is over, so it's onto blackflies, mosquitos, deerflies, horseflies - frickin' flies! The deeper into spring/summer the bigger they get... but they do feed the birds and fish. When I eat a freshwater fish, I feel like I'm getting some of my DNA back from the blood donations I have made to the flies.

 

[NSEric]

I read the reviews on the $70 one and it sounds like it will work if you take your time. The $170 one seems a great deal better. Is that the one that goes on sale for $120. I include a link:
https://www.princessauto.com/en/120v-bench-mount-chainsaw-chain-sharpener/product/PA0008601577

RE: capital gains, we are giving the land to him. The gift value has to be at the assessed value. We are talking with a local accountant to see the easiest way to give it to him so that our gift doesn't cost us too much. We are also giving a parcel on the South Shore to our daughter and her husband - it's a smaller parcel, but it is ocean access, so it's value has also climbed considerably. Same tax issue. We give them their land, they buy materials, and i help them build their houses - not a bad way to move into retirement for me and a good way for them to get on with their lives.

That's the one.
It's a pretty good sharpener and cheaper than amazon or ebay. Of coarse if you can find a used one, that's the cheapest option.

My dead grand father got away with selling a cottage for a dollar to avoid capital gains tax. I dont agree with that tax at all, the govt is making a killing from people selling stuff they spent half their lives paying for.

 

[chainbrake]

That's the one.
It's a pretty good sharpener and cheaper than amazon or ebay. Of coarse if you can find a used one, that's the cheapest option.

My dead grand father got away with selling a cottage for a dollar to avoid capital gains tax. I dont agree with that tax at all, the govt is making a killing from people selling stuff they spent half their lives paying for.

I'll keep my eyes peeled for a sale.
Re: Capital gains. I am of two minds about it. I'm willing to pay my fair share, if everyone else is. The very wealthy often hide their wealth by tying it up in capital investments that generate money that they use to make more capital investments, and on and on. They continue to get richer off of investments while the rest of us make investments from wages/earnings that we earn from our labour. I believe in taxes. We get healthcare at half the cost of the Americans and we live 6 years longer on average. It costs a great deal of money to maintain roads and buildings etc. in Canada. Winters are fierce up here. Everything has to be paid for somehow. I do have difficulty with subsidies/loopholes for the already wealthy, and the tax brackets do not seem to progress in a fair manner for the middle/working class. That doesn't seem fair.

 

[Sloughfoot]

I have been doing that for a while now. Speeds up the work and saves time pushing a round file, and the life of a round file. Then use a progressive depth gauge plate to set depth gauge height for those teeth. A few short cutters don't bother me as the rest will catch up soon enough.

When I started square filing I'd also gotten into a batch of oak imbedded with miscellaneous bits of vintage hardware. Probably ruined 3 $25 double bevel files on 1 Stihl full skip chain before it dawned on me to take the damage out with the flat then sharpen.

 

[chainbrake]

"That's the one.
It's a pretty good sharpener and cheaper than amazon or ebay. Of coarse if you can find a used one, that's the cheapest option."

Well, I've been teaching my son to use a chainsaw. Last week, he learned that I was not joking about rocks on our property hiding just beneath the surface of the moss. To prove my point, a rock stole nearly half the life on the brand new 3/8 x 20" chain he was using on my 034.
I haven't yet bought the grinder from Princess Auto that NSEric was talking about, so I got out my calipers and a 4" angle grinder. Using the angle grinder and holding my mouth just right, in 10 minutes I was able to hog out the cutters to within .003" of each other. Ten minutes later, I had completed 4-8 passes with a round file to true things up. 4 licks with a flat file to put the rakers back to a not overly aggressive .025" and it cut like new. I kept the chain right on the saw for the whole process. Flipped the bar over after blowing the grinding dust out and off with the air hose... that saw was clean and working again half an hour after he brought it to me.