sideband swarp notch

[littlejoetqt]

A coworker showed me the "Sideband Swarp Notch", as he called it. It involves cutting the heavy side of a tree with a good weight to one side, then using an upside-down(excuse my ignorance) notch in a portion of your first cut...then you work your back cut from the heavy side back. When properly executed, he can pull a tree with a good lean about 120 degrees. I haven't tried to pull one more than about 90, and never around anything. I think the principle that makes the tree swing is that the edge of your notch sits under the weight of the tree, and works as a balancing point. There's more to it than that, but I don't know how to say it. without a tree in front of me.

I'm probably not making sense, but does anyone have experience with this method? or perhaps under a different name?

P.S: I wouldn't recommend trying it, my explanation doesn't quite cover it.

 

[NCTREE]

Huh? take some pictures of the cuts and explain it a little better.

Sounds like a bunch of BS and dangerous but im always willing to listen.

 

[treemandan]

A coworker showed me the "Sideband Swarp Notch", as he called it. It involves cutting the heavy side of a tree with a good weight to one side, then using an upside-down(excuse my ignorance) notch in a portion of your first cut...then you work your back cut from the heavy side back. When properly executed, he can pull a tree with a good lean about 120 degrees. I haven't tried to pull one more than about 90, and never around anything. I think the principle that makes the tree swing is that the edge of your notch sits under the weight of the tree, and works as a balancing point. There's more to it than that, but I don't know how to say it. without a tree in front of me.

I'm probably not making sense, but does anyone have experience with this method? or perhaps under a different name?

P.S: I wouldn't recommend trying it, my explanation doesn't quite cover it.

Sounds like the norm but the proof is in the pie... that means if you are doing it you had better be doing it right and using the proper ingredients. Do you have a good spatula?


The upside down notch is called a ' Humbolt' and the rest sounds like you are pulling a leaning tree opposite its lean or you are using a 'Dutchman' of some degree.

 

[littlejoetqt]

I suppose my 'spatula' would be a ms660, if that's what you're asking. I'd like to take a video when the opportunity arises, but I doubt it'll be soon.

It is definitely dangerous, if you misjudge the weight, and misplace your humbolt notch, it'll break off when you get part of the way through your back cut. if you put your first cut on the wrong side according to the weight(try and pull it the wrong way), there's no telling where it will go.

I've never heard of a Dutchman, either. Please explain, if you will.

JSYK, I'm not trying to claim myself as being an expert. I'm young, and not real experienced, and I'm not too proud to admit it. Just thought I would share a trick that was passed down to me.

 

[randyg]

A coworker showed me the "Sideband Swarp Notch", as he called it.I'm probably not making sense, but does anyone have experience with this method? or perhaps under a different name?

P.S: I wouldn't recommend trying it, my explanation doesn't quite cover it.

You could search on the Forestry and Loggin Forum for dutchman, soft dutchman, sizwel, siswheel? Those timber fallers/fellers use what you are describing. These are some rather complicated felling cuts and most will admit that they don't ALWAYS work. Every tree is different, some have hidden surprises. And then there is the wind . . .

 

[NCTREE]

I suppose my 'spatula' would be a ms660, if that's what you're asking. I'd like to take a video when the opportunity arises, but I doubt it'll be soon.

It is definitely dangerous, if you misjudge the weight, and misplace your humbolt notch, it'll break off when you get part of the way through your back cut. if you put your first cut on the wrong side according to the weight(try and pull it the wrong way), there's no telling where it will go.

I've never heard of a Dutchman, either. Please explain, if you will.

JSYK, I'm not trying to claim myself as being an expert. I'm young, and not real experienced, and I'm not too proud to admit it. Just thought I would share a trick that was passed down to me.

you said it yourself it's dangerous so why gamble with your life. Making trick cuts like that with little experience is a ticking time bomb.

Their are much safer and more reliable methods for felling a tree with back and side leans. Try taking a chainsaw and felling safety class, you'll be surprise what you can do with a little bit of tried and tested practical knowledge.

 

[beastmaster]

Every sense I seen the soft Dutchman on you tube I have been trying to make it work. I try it on little easy take downs when I can. Once it worked and made a nice turn, but mostly they fall with the lean. Even if I master it, you can't trust it if life or property is at stake.
More then a few times I have seen a perfect falling cut in a easy to fall tree, do something unexpected, A knot, or some sap wood, rot, etc. can change its direction. Throw in things like not enough hinge or cutting though your holding wood and bad things can happen.
Trick cuts might have a time and place but don't ever count on it in a tricky situation. You can do a lot with a conventional cut using holding wood and wedges. That soft Dutchman cut is so cool though.

 

[littlejoetqt]

I youtube'd that Soft Dutchman cut....and the end result is exactly the same. Method is completely different I can't see myself trying it, though. I'm not that bold. Regarding dangerous, you're absolutely right. However, I may be exaggerating about how tricky the cut is. It's tricky for me, but so is felling a lot of trees that are cake for experienced cutters.

The post that mentioned trick cuts, rookies and is it worth your life kinda set hard with me. I thought about it at work today, and was more careful while cutting. No sideband swarp notches, either. The trees didn't suit the swarp notch, but I don't think I would have tried it if I could have. I really could benefit from a good class on cutting trees, my on-job training consisted of a once-over on notching, boring(plunge cutting i think is the proper name) and judging the weight of the tree. Lesson #2 was a saw and a patch of woods.

P.S: I may yet post a video on this, but I seldom cut a tree outside of work. No room for a camera in my chaps. Odds are, I won't find one suitable any time soon. I had one good one, a red maple fell in a storm last fall, leaving another one severely damaged. Too bad I'd never seen the cut back then. Thanks!

 

[treemandan]

Arborists and Dutchmen don't mix.

 

[Tminus]

There are two things I hate in this world:

Intolerance of others, and

The Dutch!

 

[flushcut]

Arborists and Dutchmen don't mix.

They have their place, a very very small place in the techniques we use. I have used them on occasion in non critical cuts just to play around in the woods. If there is any doubt climb it, chunk it, or put a pull rope up high.

 

[056kid]

Ohh the Side band! Anyone know what this little Appalachian jem looks like?

 

[woodchuck357]

I use various "swing" notches but with cable or rope to restrict the trees movement. The swing notch, for me, just lessens the strain on the lines.