Some sawing, logging and skidding pics and videos ......

[Slamm]

That thing looks good with a wrap handle on it. Thanks for sharing.

Wonder if the M-tronic version could suit my needs? I cut from 3,500 - 8,500'+ elevation here. Even higher if I go to NM or CO.

I went from Illinois to Elk hunt in Colorado 10,000-12,000 feet and then back and it would have been nice if the 361 had an M-Tronics on it, LOL. Yeah, I think it would be something you would like a lot. When modded, it will spank a nicely, yet modestly modded 460, as in 38% faster, just plain put to shame a stock 460 with Muffler Modd, and the modded 441 M-Tronics wasn't even broke in yet, as in not even close, LOL. I'm switching all my saws out to the M-Tronics and already sold the Big Bore 660 for starters and sold one of the Regular Modded 441's and working on selling the rest. Its just too smart of a system to not own if you make money with a saw, additionally, the second of the two that I have will have some other tricks done to it that will likely add an additional 20% onto the already aforementioned gains in modding it.

I like efficiency, and it is the epitome of it in the wood cutting world, that I live in with 28" bars and trees from 18"-60" DBH....................... in my opinion.

Put a 28" Lite Bar on it and there just isn't anything like it, a total work of art, LOL.

All of this is my opinion, but its backed up with good research and properly spent money and an open mind for finding what works to make me more money ..... easier.

Sam

 

[Slamm]

Finally, got around to taking some photos of one of the two Stihl Lite bars (28") that I have been using. After cutting with it for awhile, I noticed some weird ripples in it. No big deal I have two, so I just used the other saw for awhile. I figured the bar got hot and warped the aluminum insert or something, didn't really look at it too closely.

Well, now I have. This bar is genius and I figured out what happened, I think. The bar is hollow, as best as I can figure and is triple laminated or 2 laminates and one is milled out with ribs running down the middle. The inner core is just steel ribs and the outer sides are steel, no aluminum panels or inserts. This is genius, because the aluminum is 1/3 the weight of steel, but air is obviously much lighter, than either. The Stihl Lite bar has two steel sides and nothing in the middle, where as, the other brands of Light bars use aluminum and this isn't worth a hoot for strenght in bending applications, and isn't really all that light, when compared to simply "air".

That said, I had a tree sit on the bar very hard, to the point that I just cut the hinge and let them fall over backwards, in the process of that the bar's hollow area, had some insane pressure on it and that pushed the sides inward. As a result the ripples are pushed inward on both sides in the same places, there isn't any "thickening" of the bar, it only got thinner in the middle, as a result of the high amount of pressure, I never noticed any difference in its cutting speed or use. Upon further inspection I found that around the S in Stihl on one of the sides it was slightly bent, I put it in the vise and straightened it.

For the record, this bar and the other Stihl Lite bar have 92,000 bdft racked up between the two of them and they both look great. I have dressed the edges once, and flipped them once, I have ordered 2 more, and will do my level best to not have to use regular full weight steel bars in the future.

Sam

 

[Stihlman441]

Thanks for that report Sam i was talking to my Stihl dealer about these light bars and he tells me you can get a 25'' one in Ozz i was told the shortest one was 28'' anyway there ya go.

 

[young]

Thanks for that report Sam i was talking to my Stihl dealer about these light bars and he tells me you can get a 25'' one in Ozz i was told the shortest one was 28'' anyway there ya go.

currently they only come in 28, 32, 36 in both .050 and .063.

i really like my 28 on the 460.

 

[Slamm]

Thanks for that report Sam i was talking to my Stihl dealer about these light bars and he tells me you can get a 25'' one in Ozz i was told the shortest one was 28'' anyway there ya go.

Huh, as stated above, I'm pretty sure the only ones we can get are 28" and up.

I know this, I'd rather run a 28" Lite bar than a 20" regular, I don't know what the true weight is of each, but from feel alone that longer Lite bar is "lighter" and easier to manage and handier than a 441 with a 20" regular bar. Due to expense and using more chain, and possibility of hitting dirt a little more without holding the saw up, I'm not yet convinced to use it on the bucking-up saws, as I use 28" for felling and 20" for bucking up, I am contemplating it, LOL.

I like them so much, that I just got back several, normal weight rebuilt 28" bars (GB's and Stihl's) from Chainbar.com and I'm seriously just going to sell them, because I don't want them, as they don't represent the optimum tool that I could be using, where as, right now, that Lite bar does, by a long, long shot. At this point, the only CON, I can find with the bars is the expense, and if a person is in the position to make money with them, they will make you more of it. I can't remember what I can get a 28" ES for something like sub-$50 or something, where as, the Lite 28" is around $110 so at double the cost, I know I cut better and faster and with more enjoyment with those Lites bars, and like I said before I just have two and they dropped all and even bucked up a lot of it on this latest job and we're at 92,000 BDFT. The paint still looks great and I've only flipped them each once and deburred the rails once, thats it. John and I "think" the rails are harder, without my Rockwell tester I can't prove that, but the rails sure seem to hold up very well.

Have a good day, down there,

Sam

 

[Stihlman441]

I have some part numbers at home and i think the 28'' was about $168,will try and find them and i did say to him that as far as i know they only come in 28''32'' and 36'' but he thinks 25'' as well.
I was thinking of a 28'' for felling are they nose heavey on the 441s ?.
You use skip semi chisel chain and a 7 pin i assume.
Andrew

 

[Slamm]

I have some part numbers at home and i think the 28'' was about $168,will try and find them and i did say to him that as far as i know they only come in 28''32'' and 36'' but he thinks 25'' as well.
I was thinking of a 28'' for felling are they nose heavey on the 441s ?.
You use skip semi chisel chain and a 7 pin i assume.
Andrew

Yeah, they are nose heavy, but I'm use to it, I guess, never bothered me. I like that I can take a regular 28" 441 and stick it bar down on a log and it will stay, the short bars or this Lite bar, no way, they fall over on the powerhead side, LOL joking, I don't miss the weight at all.

Yes, I use "skip semi chisel chain and a 7 pin" on everything, modded 084 on down, just have never seen a noticeable speed difference in work conditions to justify a different setup or multiple setups.

Using 8 pins does spin the chain faster until that is offset by the RPM's go down due to loss of torque so that is a "win for cutting air" and a "lose for cutting wood", LOL.

Full Comp is a pain to sharpen and is maybe only 1 second faster in ideal cookie cutting, as per my youtube research. I think in work conditions, the full skip is faster more times than not due to you almost never stall out the saw, which means you have to restart it again, or in a felling cut you can't get the chain restarted after you stop it due to chip load and bite. So to me Zero work related benefits to running Full Comp over Semi-Chisel in either soft or hardwoods.

I hate Chisel chain with a passion, there is almost no aspect of it that I find is a PRO or benefit in normal, working conditions. Its only faster in clean cookie cutting, step into the world of firewood and logging with normally modest to really dirty wood and say bye bye to whatever 2 seconds that it was faster than semi-chisel in the cookie cutting. Also in our hardwood and likely yours, you just rip the sharp corners off, before the rest of the cutters gets dull, so you end up filing away half of the life of the chain due to simply "chip-outs" and not that it was dull from normal wood cutting. I have said it before, I admit that its an exaggeration, but I feel I get double the life out of a Stihl Semi-Chisel chain or said in a different way a Semi-Chisel will cut double the wood in its lifetime, before the teeth are completely filed off, than you will from Chisel chain.

My findings on it,

Sam

 

[Stihlman441]

Mmm interesting what you say there Sam.
I normally use Carlton (heaps cheaper than Stihl) full chisel on standing green Sugar gum which is nice and soft (for us anyway) with 20'' and 25'' and 8 pins on 460 and 660s.I do use semi chisel skip on 36'' bars in dry hard woods eg Redgum and even then dont last very long.But ya cant get Carlton skip here any longer and you could never get Stihl skip anyway,so i have a 100 foot roll and then thats it.
When im felling and blocking the clean green Sugar gum the full chisel will last about 3 tanks before a light tuchup is needed and thats a few mtrs of fire wood sorted out.I have worked out roughly a tank of fuel in the 460 is about 1 mtrs of blocked up wood.
I use 8 pin rims on both 460 with a 20'' and 660 with 25'' and full comp chisel chains in the green gum because these two says have the torque and balls to do this no probs.

Cheers

 

[deye223]

Mmm interesting what you say there Sam.
I normally use Carlton (heaps cheaper than Stihl) full chisel on standing green Sugar gum which is nice and soft (for us anyway) with 20'' and 25'' and 8 pins on 460 and 660s.I do use semi chisel skip on 36'' bars in dry hard woods eg Redgum and even then dont last very long.But ya cant get Carlton skip here any longer and you could never get Stihl skip anyway,so i have a 100 foot roll and then thats it.
When im felling and blocking the clean green Sugar gum the full chisel will last about 3 tanks before a light tuchup is needed and thats a few mtrs of fire wood sorted out.I have worked out roughly a tank of fuel in the 460 is about 1 mtrs of blocked up wood.
I use 8 pin rims on both 460 with a 20'' and 660 with 25'' and full comp chisel chains in the green gum because these two says have the torque and balls to do this no probs.

Cheers

hey andrew never had trouble geting stihl skip over here can't use anything else stringy is coverd in sand all the soil here is gray sand it's a bugger:msp_thumbsup:

 

[RiverRat2]

Thanks for that report Sam i was talking to my Stihl dealer about these light bars and he tells me you can get a 25'' one in Ozz i was told the shortest one was 28'' anyway there ya go.

My Shop just called I ordered a 28" light one Monday and I will pick it up tomorrow!!!!

 

[Slamm]

If there is anything that a person can say you will love and know its the truth, its that Lite bar.

When you put it on a 70cc saw its like there isn't even a bar on it, it will feel like you have a toy in your hands, that is no exageration. I haven't put it on a 660 yet, but I bet that would be super nice. I had a new clutch put on my 660 and should get it back this weekend, I want to cut for a day or so and see how that feels. I know you will really like it.

Sam

 

[s219]

This is an epic thread. Thanks for taking the time to photograph and narrate everything Sam -- I know that takes some effort, but it shows how much you enjoy the work. Well done all the way. I'd work with you any day.

 

[056kid]

If there is anything that a person can say you will love and know its the truth, its that Lite bar.

When you put it on a 70cc saw its like there isn't even a bar on it, it will feel like you have a toy in your hands, that is no exageration. I haven't put it on a 660 yet, but I bet that would be super nice. I had a new clutch put on my 660 and should get it back this weekend, I want to cut for a day or so and see how that feels. I know you will really like it.

Sam

You do custom fab work on equipment, yet you have someone else put a clutch on a saw for you? That is strange there.

 

[Metals406]

You do custom fab work on equipment, yet you have someone else put a clutch on a saw for you? That is strange there.

He probably don't have time, and it sure don't make him money. A lot of guys don't wrench their own saws. . . Don't mean they can't.

 

[056kid]

That's BS. swapping a clutch takes minutes. Last time I checked, a working saw does indeed make one money. .

 

[Stihlman441]

hey andrew never had trouble geting stihl skip over here can't use anything else stringy is coverd in sand all the soil here is gray sand it's a bugger:msp_thumbsup:[/QUO

So when ya say ya can get skip ? what are you using,where do ya get it and how much ?.

 

[Slamm]

056,
My god, you are an incensant little quirp. We were having problems getting a clutch that will hold it. This is why it got sent to Terry. The freaking crankshaft is brown and blue, that indicates a problem that I don't want to deal with, is that fine with you???? I will ask nicely, would you please remove your head from your rearend, and not post in this thread anymore, you provide very, very little by way of intelligence and that is before you start drinking, after that it really goes to heck.

By the way, I took the clutch off all by myself in these photos.

Sam

 

[056kid]

I'm not mad slamm. You might be cross, but not me.


see, happy! though I might be mad if I had to use my 660 to mine for coal. .

 

[NORMZILLA44]

Well said kid:msp_thumbup:

 

[Slamm]

Ah, good, its nice to see the troll has a buddy.

Sam