Sometimes you feel like a hack.......

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Oh, its gonna be like that now, huh? :D


Many variables abound, and this is all hypothetical based on how one is looking at the tree in their mind.
In other words, I really gotta see the tree.

I am assumming the tree stands alone, by itself. I would start my roping at the bottom working up until I decided it was too unsafe to proceed any farther. I would throw a monkeys fist to set my pull line and toss out the top. Then I would bomb the chunks, or rope them down.

If there are other trees close enough, I would probably do something different, using them in different ways.



Many of the times I use a crane not so much for the takedown but for the loading of the trunk/log.
 
If you had a wedge up there, then could you not have used it to "help" the ground get it down?

Pullies or carabiners and a sling to do a 3:1 tackle?

Wrap a tree and put a carabiner in the working end to to a 2:1?

As for the point of your thread, a ladder is a tool. It can be over used and misused often.

I know guys who over use prussick entry where a ladder would serve the purpose much faster.

Some take too much pride in certain aspects of the trade and become scoff at the "older" methods. I'll foot lock my tail if I need to get up to a 25 ft branch to start working.

If there is a ladder on the truck and there is a messy tree, I may use it and flipline my way up to a good TIP.

Work safe on a removal, and you cannot be a hack.
 
Originally posted by John Paul Sanborn
As for the point of your thread, a ladder is a tool. It can be over used and misused often.
I use a ladder on almost every tree and don't think I've overused it yet. It's ok to have pride in using gizmos to climb, unless they slow you down.:mad: If a ladder's faster it should be used, imo.

Underwood don't feel bad, I'm right behind you at 53 and 190# and I bodythrust everything. When my arms get sore I might try a gizmo.
Y'all are being too hard on glenn for climbing down to help pull the 50' trunk. If the wedges have bit in and the climber can see the thing's not wobblin too bad it sounds responsible enough.:rolleyes:
But YES gizmos to increase groundies pull, like a comealong, would be much better.
Ladders are Wonderful! Just think if they had just been invented--they'd be hyped as the greatest timesaver since the chainsaw!! :blob6:
 
1) Was it bucket-accessable?

2) Would you have access to one if it was?

Ladders are fine, when used in the right places.
 
Thanks for all the response to this. I always am open to new perspectives and this is the main reason for posting this thread. Before I even started this thread I knew there was the possibilty that this would get a bit nuts but so far its been objective and suprisingly reassuring at times.

Like they say, every tree and every location and every situation are never alike. I spent a lot of time thinking about this job today because it was so unique and different than the norm.

Thanks for the thumbs up on ladders I will use them more and be safe on them, they are a great tool. Someone coined the phrase" ladder high tree hack" and that left a picture in my mind. I guess I have taken that phrase much too seriously.

I checked my spikes this morning for sharpness. The profile is proper, the point is slightly dull but only to the point of not having the perfect crisp new tip that is perfect. Only at very close inspection do I find that the tip is not perfectly sharp. For lack of a better description , I`d say the points are a little sharper than the tip of a fine ball-point pen. I will start paying better attention to my gaffs and am considering doing a lght touch-up after every use.

Buckets and Cranes: Could have used these if two other healthy trees were removed and permission granted by neibor to drive across landscaping. A crane or a bucket would have been a cool tool if not for the accesabilty issues.

Now to talk about the very non-standard approach of climbing down after the face and back-cut. This was done with much thought and discussion between me and my groundie. We`ve worked together for over ten years and disscuss the details, dangers and expectations of every step of the job. He knows what I`m doing at all times and if we don`t agree on a certain step we find a better way.

This tree was lightning struck and very hard and brittle. While making face cuts and back cuts I would constantly watch the top and groundman for any signs that the tree was "settling" or "moving" Between all cuts I would ask the groundman what do you see? What do you feel through the Bull rope? The tree was hard and strong at this level , no cracks at this point and nothing making me fear that the tree was a "grenade" . After the cuts were made the top had not moved, not an inch...it hadn`t budged. This tree was clearly not going anywhere after I made the cuts. The tree was almost verticle with a very slight lean in the preferred direction of fall. But what I did question and my 2 areas of concern were widow makers from above and the hard dry brittle hinge wood and how it would perform its job of hinging rather than snapping durring tip-over. I did not want to be at hinge-level on this perticular tree. With my groundie on the rope and a wedge firmly knocked in the backcut, I was very comfortable climbing down that ladder in this particular situation. I would not attempted this in a green tree. I have never attempted this type of manauver before but in this situation it worked very well for us. In retrospect I should have had razor sharp spikes. That would have let me get up and drop a small top.

Maybe I`ll way overbid the next lightning struck, no bark , needle-free, rock hard, spruce stilagmite that comes my way. Or maybe not, It really wasn`t bad at all except for all the dull chains we made. This stuff was a chain killer.

:) Glenn
 
I'm surprised that no one has mentioned the fact that to fall a 50' "top" out of a 65' tree while standing in it is a very risky undertaking. Unless you are absolutely confident in predicting the breakage of hinge wood you have no guarantee that the butt won't kick back into you when the tip hits the ground first. With all the conifers we have around here it's a common way for inexperienced tree fellas to hurt themselves.

From what Glenn says imo he did the tree well. I sympathize with the "Harry Homeowner" feeling. I find that I usually suffer it most when I finally drag the ladder off the truck after 15min of trying to get my rope around the bottom limb of a hairy red cedar. Better just to get it down in the first place and save the embarrassment.
 
Another point I considered was that this tree was carrying much less weight in its top since it was without needles and its limbs were dry hard sticks, and sharp too. My purpose for climbing down was not to help the groundman because of lack of manpower but because I did not want to be close to the tree during tipover. I could invision literaly being skewered by a falling limb.

The pull line was set 10 feet from the top. It was 150 ft long and the angle was better than 45 degrees.

Glenn
 
Originally posted by TheTreeSpyder
My worry wouldn't be about how i looked (good thing!!), but about getting hurt if tree went early; then worry about "Harry Homeowner" getting hurt trying to duplicate roughly, what you are balancing as an art; and taking it that unordinary (for your strategies) direction.

i think standing in @ 15' and topping 50' sounds scary, let alone a crispy one, let alone crispy pine, let alone stopping the cut and climbing down the shaky crispy thing on ladder, after walking BackCut almost to failure on ladder, top teetering over my head, of something especially sounding more like something that wants to snap suddenly more and bend slowly less.

Then, if i thought that was the only way, whether planned or jsut stuck, hope noone with a ladder and saw would try to duplicate a one time, chancey calcualtion to get out of a bad spot after availing to all else (and swearing never again); becasue they thought it looked like a procedure well pulled off. Can't say that i've never had to pull something out like that, but always swore ne'er again as i re-viewed what coulda happened.

So, being seen with ladder, wouldn't bother me..... just the thought of injury.... is what i meant!

Orrrr something like that!
:alien:
 
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