Sudden loss of compression

[59Billy]

First the good news: my 066 arrived today. I opened the boexes, put it together, filled up the fuel tank and bar mix. It started pretty easily... enough to make me worry about compression.

Warmed it up, then started cutting some wood. After about 20 minutes, it died suddenly. When I went to restart, it had no compression at all.

I've already emailed the seller, but I want to pick the collective brain here. What could cause a sudden death like that? I'd rather fix it than send it back, so where should I start looking first?

 

[RiverRat2]

First the good news: my 066 arrived today. I opened the boexes, put it together, filled up the fuel tank and bar mix. It started pretty easily... enough to make me worry about compression.

Warmed it up, then started cutting some wood. After about 20 minutes, it died suddenly. When I went to restart, it had no compression at all.

I've already emailed the seller, but I want to pick the collective brain here. What could cause a sudden death like that? I'd rather fix it than send it back, so where should I start looking first?

No compression,,,, Make sure the cyl bolts are tight if so, check spark plug and De-compression valve,, make sure they are tight and holding

if all that is good Hmmm,,,,,,,,,, sounds like it could be stuck rings,, maybe,, but you will know when you get the muffler removed

Pull the Muffler and check the P/C for scoring,,,, U did mix up some fresh pre-mix w/fresh Gas,,,89 minimum octane or above @ the correct ratio of 50:1 right?????

 

[sugarbush]

pull plug see if piston is moving up/down, if ok pull muffler and check for scoring. how was it advertized?

 

[Tree Sling'r]

If it is scored there would be some resistance in the pull rope i.e. pieces of ring or piston.
I would suggest what RiverRat stated about checking stuff out as far as tightness.
Sounds like a spark plug backed out to me. If so, the cylinder may be stripped out and may need a heli-coil.
But, I have been wrong many times before, just my thoughts.

 

[59Billy]

No compression,,,, Make sure the cyl bolts are tight if so, check spark plug and De-compression valve,, make sure they are tight and holding

if all that is good Hmmm,,,,,,,,,, sounds like it could be stuck rings,, maybe,, but you will know when you get the muffler removed

Pull the Muffler and check the P/C for scoring,,,, U did mix up some fresh pre-mix w/fresh Gas,,,89 minimum octane or above @ the correct ratio of 50:1 right?????

Yep, gas was about 2 days old, 93 octane, 50:1 with Stihl Ultra.

Pulled the muffler, and p/c both scored.

pull plug see if piston is moving up/down, if ok pull muffler and check for scoring. how was it advertized?

The ad said "Every thing checked out with flying colors everything works as it should." and included a photo of a decent looking piston. Seller seems like a reputable seller, but what's the odds of a saw going bellyup just as it changes hands?

I was all excitedm, wanting to give it a test run so I could go give feedback. Testing consisted of a few crosscuts in ~12" oak, then about 3 feet of milling in similar oak. Not enough time to even overheat it or anything.

So now, I'm sorting out several questions.

1. How to get it going again.
2. How it happened.
3. What compensation, if any, I should expect from the seller.

#1 seems pretty obvious: piston and cylinder kit. Oh, joy.

#2 is partly for my own enlightenment, and to help answer #3. I mean, hey, stuff happens, and I want to be fair, but I don't wanna get burned, either.

Any suggestions or observations are welcomed.

 

[Tree Sling'r]

Was there is big difference in elevation between you and the seller? Is there anyway you may have received it or adjusted it too lean for your elevation?

 

[sugarbush]

if you havn't tampered with the carb put a notch on a screw driver and turn the jets closed, count the turn/turns.seller may have compensated for air leak.

 

[THALL10326]

First the good news: my 066 arrived today. I opened the boexes, put it together, filled up the fuel tank and bar mix. It started pretty easily... enough to make me worry about compression.

Warmed it up, then started cutting some wood. After about 20 minutes, it died suddenly. When I went to restart, it had no compression at all.

I've already emailed the seller, but I want to pick the collective brain here. What could cause a sudden death like that? I'd rather fix it than send it back, so where should I start looking first?

Hmmm not good. Yank the muffler and have a look see. If she has no compression at all something has happened in that cylinder, maybe something broke. If scored it should still have some compression. Regardless yank the muffler and get a light and look in there. I think you'll find the problem..

 

[59Billy]

if you havn't tampered with the carb put a notch on a screw driver and turn the jets closed, count the turn/turns.seller may have compensated for air leak.

Low speed was all the way clockwise, high was all the way ccw.

sugarbash: seller is at a slightly higher altitude than me.

Spark plus was tight, decomp is tight and works. The cylinder might not be all that bad, but the piston looks fried, at least to my non-expert eye. I couldn't get a legible pic of the cylinder.

 

[sugarbush]

the looks of that piston the cyl is shot also. best thing to do is talk to the seller. if thats all you run it, something wasn't right.

 

[sugarbush]

thall, what do you make of that carb setting?

 

[THALL10326]

Low speed was all the way clockwise, high was all the way ccw.

sugarbash: seller is at a slightly higher altitude than me.

Spark plus was tight, decomp is tight and works. The cylinder might not be all that bad, but the piston looks fried, at least to my non-expert eye. I couldn't get a legible pic of the cylinder.

Looking at that piston the problem of why it quit is obvious, she's cooked. If you decide to fix the cylinder make sure you find the fault that fried that piston or your new one will do the samething..

 

[Lakeside53]

"all the way CCW" on H likely means the prior owner has compensated for an airleak.

"all the way CC" on L??? Hmmm... shouldn't start unless it has flooding carb?

I suspect the prior owner has been in the carb and messed it up.


Altitude won't make a big difference unless we're talking 4000-5000 feet.

 

[THALL10326]

thall, what do you make of that carb setting?

Well if it has limter caps its within range. However the problem is, if it has caps, were they ever removed and put back. If so theres no telling how the carb was set when he got it. I for one would be having me a chat with the seller for it could well have been on its way out, fry wise, when he bought it. Thats not to say the seller knew but for 20 minutes of sawing she sure went kapoot fast. Sounds like a good deal gone bad to me. What was the price of that saw??

 

[Tree Sling'r]

Looks like it was an extremely clean cylinder as well. Don't know what you want, but I have had a few of the Bailey's 660 kits and they seem to be just fine.
Sure OEM is great, but I would rather keep the extra $200 in my pocket, when I can buy an aftermarket kit for just over $100.

 

[THALL10326]

"all the way CCW" on H likely means the prior owner has compensated for an airleak.

"all the way CC" on L??? Hmmm... shouldn't start unless it has flooding carb?

I suspect the prior owner has been in the carb and messed it up.


Altitude won't make a big difference unless we're talking 4000-5000 feet.

Samething I was thinking , if the low was turned all the way in the saw shouldn't have started. If it has caps though its anyone's guess.

 

[59Billy]

Hmmm not good. Yank the muffler and have a look see. If she has no compression at all something has happened in that cylinder, maybe something broke. If scored it should still have some compression. Regardless yank the muffler and get a light and look in there. I think you'll find the problem..

I have to correct myself there. Once I reset the compression release, it has a bit of compression, but not much at all. Don't have a tester handy.

 

[Lakeside53]

Oh yes... the limiter cap issue. Sorry, I assumed that it didn't have them, but Thall's right... it may if a late model 066.

 

[sugarbush]

I didn't think of the limiter caps either. but if thats all it was run he should contact the seller.

 

[THALL10326]

Oh yes... the limiter cap issue. Sorry, I assumed that it didn't have them, but Thall's right... it may..

Ya know Lake I read all these stories about saws bought off e-bay and it seems there are indeed some shady charactors selling stuff on there. Thats not to say this guy has been taken for a ride on that saw but it's a shame it only ran 20 minutes, I'd be T O Ticked. Hopefully they can work out something..